# Lug work, I would kill for



## ttug (May 14, 2004)

I googles Hetchins bikes as a saw one earlier today, this is a close sample of the lug work I saw. This is ALL OVER the bike


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## PRB (Jun 15, 2002)

Hetchins.....:23: No one does lugs like they do IMO.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*too ornate for me*

I'm into working mans lugs

but that's just a preference

check Brian Bayliss for fancy Lugs. I have seen this bike in person

http://www.classicrendezvous.com/USA/Baylis/Baylis_green_Hellenic.htm


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## Scooper (Mar 4, 2007)

This is a bit over the top for me, too. It sure shows off the lug carver's (Dave Wages) skills, though.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

atpjunkie said:


> I'm into working mans lugs
> 
> but that's just a preference


My preference too! :thumbsup:


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## cinelliguy (Jan 4, 2011)

Here is elegant lugwork that is a bit more simple. I think both take quite a bit of file control and skill.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

cinelliguy said:


> Here is elegant lugwork that is a bit more simple. I think both take quite a bit of file control and skill.


Very nice! :thumbsup:


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## Scooper (Mar 4, 2007)

cinelliguy said:


> Here is elegant lugwork that is a bit more simple. I think both take quite a bit of file control and skill.


I agree. Waterford used Henry James investment cast lugs on eighties Paramounts, and there's a lot to be said for simple functionality that's well executed.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

Columbine's are pretty cool

<img src=https://4.bp.blogspot.com/_ITptP6GAt1E/SLDnYbzU12I/AAAAAAAABLI/ckdVjjFTeVQ/s400/Columbine3.jpg>

<img src=https://www.columbinecycle.com/images/photos/earth_to_sky.jpg>


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*oh yeah*



Bocephus Jones II said:


> Columbine's are pretty cool
> 
> <img src=https://4.bp.blogspot.com/_ITptP6GAt1E/SLDnYbzU12I/AAAAAAAABLI/ckdVjjFTeVQ/s400/Columbine3.jpg>
> 
> <img src=https://www.columbinecycle.com/images/photos/earth_to_sky.jpg>


They are possibly the closest to Hetchins in the US IMO. Rivendale has a few nice ones but, in all honesty, I would almost be afraid to ride a bike like that. It just borders on art and one wreck could trash it


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## jd3 (Oct 8, 2004)

keep your eyes on reports from the NAHBS this weekend. I'm sure you'll see some fine lugwork.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*already on it*



jd3 said:


> keep your eyes on reports from the NAHBS this weekend. I'm sure you'll see some fine lugwork.



Nice stuff so far, nothing eye popping YET


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## Scooper (Mar 4, 2007)

I'm leaving for NAHBS in Austin tomorrow, and am joing a 28 mile group ride Saturday morning leaving from 3rd and Trinity next to the convention center at 8:00. I'll spend the afternoon at the show. Dave Wages (Ellis Cycles) won "Best in Show" at last year's NAHBS in Richmond, and will be displaying one of his frames without paint in Austin.

I plan to take lots of pictures.


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## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

I wouldn't want to have to clean those after a dirty ride.


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## jd3 (Oct 8, 2004)

Pablo said:


> I wouldn't want to have to clean those after a dirty ride.


I don't think I'd take those on a dirty ride.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

ttug said:


> They are possibly the closest to Hetchins in the US IMO. Rivendale has a few nice ones but, in all honesty, I would almost be afraid to ride a bike like that. It just borders on art and one wreck could trash it


Agree...those things are art. I'd be scared to take them out of the driveway.


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## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

jd3 said:


> I don't think I'd take those on a dirty ride.


... which pretty much sums up why I wouldn't really go out of my way to get such a bike


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## moschika (Feb 1, 2004)

i love ornate, practically over-the-top lugs. though my favorite hetchins lug design is the Experto Crede. 
though i've always like this classic look too. 









Art Stump had some of the sweetest lugs too.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*oh man*

I just googled a current Hetchins FRAME price...anyone have ~4 grand?


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

I have a 99 Hetchins Magnum Opus. WIll post some pictures later, just need to charge the camera's battery.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*impressive!*



zacolnago said:


> I have a 99 Hetchins Magnum Opus. WIll post some pictures later, just need to charge the camera's battery.


Can you, provide a ballpark as to what that set you back? I was pricing frames out of morbid curiosity...WOW, and as to the 99, TOTALLY incredible work


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## Reynolds531 (Nov 8, 2002)

I like lug work but I love smooth, flowing fillet brazed frames.

Maybe because I grew up on electroforged and then fillet brazed Schwinns, lugs look a little clunky to me.

Kirk is a master.


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

ttug said:


> Can you, provide a ballpark as to what that set you back? I was pricing frames out of morbid curiosity...WOW, and as to the 99, TOTALLY incredible work


I'm very fortunate to say the bike cost me nothing. My uncle had the frame custom built for him. A few years ago he was diagnosed with Parkinsons and he gave me the bike as a gift since he could no longer ride.

He told me the frameset cost him 1000 GBP back then.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*understood*



zacolnago said:


> I'm very fortunate to say the bike cost me nothing. My uncle had the frame custom built for him. A few years ago he was diagnosed with Parkinsons and he gave me the bike as a gift since he could no longer ride.
> 
> He told me the frameset cost him 1000 GBP back then.


Parkinsons aint great for riding,its been 2 years for me and I am back on the bike again. Recovery is a pain in the balls for certain, but, the new meds are rather promising, although, they tend to leave you feeling a tad shattered after a long work day/end with a workout. My grandfather was untreated and lived in a rural area, its not pleasant for certain knowing that the meds just a few decaes later are so much better. My greatest and latest bike find was getting a 73/4 Bob Jackson from my neighbor as he was rolling it to the heap. This will be a restoration project, and the lugs are enjoyable, but, they are invisible compared to Hetchins

As to Hetchins frames, some of their frames are literally museum quality pieces for certain. A stage 3 lugged Magnus, is just, cool. I saw a beat up Hetchins on e bay for ONLY 679 US, but, this thing was JUST the frame and from the late 50's.

There is a literally A hetchins society and they actually have a serial number database. These are rather serious folks from what I can tell. They even have their own frame condition standard. 

Post pics wehen you are able, that model has a fascination for me as you can tell ;-)


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## Lotophage (Feb 19, 2011)

cinelliguy said:


> Here is elegant lugwork that is a bit more simple. I think both take quite a bit of file control and skill.


Wow- who's the builder?


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## moschika (Feb 1, 2004)

Reynolds531 said:


> I like lug work but I love smooth, flowing fillet brazed frames.


comparable option imo. i too love fillet brazed frames. i have 2 curtlos(road,mtb) and 1 sycip(mtb) all fillet brazed. when i first got into cycling in the mid-80's, mtb-ing specifically, ritchey's were the shizzle and really developed that aesthetic for me. a friend got one and we would just run our fingers along the smoothness of the joints.


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## moschika (Feb 1, 2004)

if you're patient, you might find a vintage hetchins frameset come up on ebay. they tend to sell for about $1000 or complete bikes around $2k depending on condition and year.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*that would be luck*



moschika said:


> if you're patient, you might find a vintage hetchins frameset come up on ebay. they tend to sell for about $1000 or complete bikes around $2k depending on condition and year.


Started at 700, now above 2 grand


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## cinelliguy (Jan 4, 2011)

moschika said:


> comparable option imo. i too love fillet brazed frames. i have 2 curtlos(road,mtb) and 1 sycip(mtb) all fillet brazed. when i first got into cycling in the mid-80's, mtb-ing specifically, ritchey's were the shizzle and really developed that aesthetic for me. a friend got one and we would just run our fingers along the smoothness of the joints.


Done well, they are all art/skill in their own way. Always to be appreciated by the steel is real crowd.


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

ttug said:


> Post pics wehen you are able, that model has a fascination for me as you can tell ;-)


Here you go. Pics aren't studio quality but you can see the detail on the frame. The bike has a typical steel ride, and I cant feel the effects of the curvy stays. I've read that they were meant to add stiffness, but I think they were just a design feature.

My uncle had a 9 speed Veloce groupset on the bike, so I swapped that out with an older 7400 groupset. I still feel I should go for an older look on the groupset, maybe Super Record with non aero levers, even though the frame is a more modern 1999.


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

I'm also a fillet brazed fan Here's pics of my 1992 Moser Ax leader. Was tempted to go with Campag Record but the GAN Gatorade team specced their bikes with Dura Ace when they won the world champs and the Giro in 91.

I struggled with the lighting in these pics, so excuse the quality. Must invest in a decent camera.


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## ttug (May 14, 2004)

*pahse 2 or 3 lugs COOOOL*



zacolnago said:


> Here you go. Pics aren't studio quality but you can see the detail on the frame. The bike has a typical steel ride, and I cant feel the effects of the curvy stays. I've read that they were meant to add stiffness, but I think they were just a design feature.
> 
> My uncle had a 9 speed Veloce groupset on the bike, so I swapped that out with an older 7400 groupset. I still feel I should go for an older look on the groupset, maybe Super Record with non aero levers, even though the frame is a more modern 1999.


VERY impressive. I think those are phase 3 lugs, not 100% certain. The Moser is fantastic on another level, just phenomenal.....

If you never ride the Hetchins, at least get it to a museum, wow.


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## cinelliguy (Jan 4, 2011)

Agreed, both are sweet rides. Love them both.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

The bike here, is a great example of what I consider to be "great lug work":

https://picasaweb.google.com/stevewages/090817_gordon?feat=flashalbum#5380099313565116706


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## Scooper (Mar 4, 2007)

frpax said:


> The bike here, is a great example of what I consider to be "great lug work":
> 
> https://picasaweb.google.com/stevewages/090817_gordon?feat=flashalbum#5380099313565116706


That's a Dave Wages (Ellis Cycles) built bike, and as far as I'm concerned he's as good as they get. He brazed my 953 Waterford RS-22.

I just got back from NAHBS, and was really impressed by the lugwork on Dave Anderson's 953 frames. I wasn't using a tripod, so some of these look a little fuzzy (sorry). The blue and brushed stainless bike won the "President's Choice" award.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Scooper said:


> That's a Dave Wages (Ellis Cycles) built bike, and as far as I'm concerned he's as good as they get. He brazed my 953 Waterford RS-22.
> 
> I just got back from NAHBS, and was really impressed by the lugwork on Dave Anderson's 953 frames. I wasn't using a tripod, so some of these look a little fuzzy (sorry). The blue and brushed stainless bike won the "President's Choice" award.


Those are sure nice!

As for Dave Wages (Ellis) frames, I also really like his Dr. Tea frame that won last years Best of Show.


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