# Does Anyone in US Own a Dogma K?



## bikerneil (Nov 3, 2007)

I have my heart set on a Dogma K, but it appears the only way to purchase one is to get it from a European supplier or fly to Europe and buy it and bring it home.

My question: Does anyone in the States own one? If so, I would be interested to hear how you purchased it.

I am 52 with some history of lower back problems. My Look 595 is set up for comfortable riding and I am consistently able to ride 200+ miles per week with no issues. My bike is now five years old and I am in market for a new bike. The idea of owning a Pinarello, that is also built for comfortable grand fondo style, long rides really intrigues me. I am in no hurry.

Thanks!!


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## shoegazer (Nov 2, 2007)

I have a Team Sky Kobh that I ordered when it was introduced. My LBS, AllStar in Raleigh, ordered it from Gita in Charlotte and I had it within the week. Gita Cycling Gear - Bike Parts Accessories and Apparel


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## bikerneil (Nov 3, 2007)

I am actually looking for the Dogma K, not the Kobh.

The Dogma K is shown on the Pinarello website. It's slightly different than the Kobh, but Gita is not allowed to sell it in the US . 

My understanding is Gita is sitting on large stock of old Kobh's, and they know if they sell the Dogma K's, they wil never be able to get rid of the Kobh's.

People like me eventually will just move to another manufacturer, and then they will have lost the opportunity to sell either. I understand (but don't like) their strategy.

Thanks.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

Bellatisport dot com in Switzerland is your best bet for Dogma K.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

Dogma K is the same thing as the Kobh, just re-branded. They don't want to bring it to the US market because they have a glut of Kobhs and nobody would buy them if they had the Dogma K instead.


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## aroadbike4u (Jan 27, 2013)

bikerneil said:


> I am actually looking for the Dogma K, not the Kobh.
> 
> The Dogma K is shown on the Pinarello website. It's slightly different than the Kobh, but Gita is not allowed to sell it in the US .
> 
> ...




Neil, I've been digging around for a while and still don't have any real definitive answers about the differences, if any, between the KOBH and DK. I was under the assumption that they were exactly the same, it's just that the KOBH didn't sell well and Pin wants to jump start marketing by utilizing the Dogma name. 

The carbon is the same, the angles are the same, the wheelbase is the same. However, there _might_ be differences in seat tube length. I've seen one geometry chart that showed a shorter seat tube, but that could be attributed to whether it was measured center to top or not. In fact, clicking on the KOBH geomtry chart on the Pinarello website takes you directly to the Dogma K. I could call our Pinarello rep and try to get a straight answer on Monday, but as of yet, I really can't find a good reason to go through the hassle of sourcing a DogK when the KOBH can be had.

BTW - we can also order directly from Pinarello Italy, and occasionally this is done to get special European color schemes, but it takes months.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

Wrench Science has the DogmaK on their site.

Give them a call.


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## bikerneil (Nov 3, 2007)

Cinelli: I called and emailed Wrench Science - they don't have the Dogma K......

Aroadbike4u: thanks for your detailed answer. At this point, I am in a holding pattern until I can make a decision. I'm in no hurry, as my current bike is just fine. This purchase falls clearly in to the category of a discretionary purchase (want not need). I may still try to see if the Dogma 65.1 Think can be fit to acceptable riding position for me. That would be the best of all worlds - I could get color I want, better fit for electronic DI, lighter, etc. The question is: can it be built to allow me to ride with no back issues. I will eventually stop in your shop again and have you look at my current Look 595 set-up.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

bikerneil said:


> Cinelli: I called and emailed Wrench Science - they don't have the Dogma K......


Sorry for leading you astray.
It's on their website: Pinarello Dogma K Carbon 60.1 2012 For Sale Framesets Geometry Weight


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## Yerma (Jul 5, 2011)

*Rokh would be better for low back problems*

The Kobh and Dogma K are exactly the same. However even though the Rokh is slightly heavier it would be a better choice for low back problems. The DogK has the same short head tube that the Dogma uses so the stem height will be lower with the same amount of spacers. In my size the difference would be 25mm worth of spacers. 



bikerneil said:


> I have my heart set on a Dogma K, but it appears the only way to purchase one is to get it from a European supplier or fly to Europe and buy it and bring it home.
> 
> My question: Does anyone in the States own one? If so, I would be interested to hear how you purchased it.
> 
> ...


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

aroadbike4u said:


> Neil, I've been digging around for a while and still don't have any real definitive answers about the differences, if any, between the KOBH and DK. I was under the assumption that they were exactly the same, it's just that the KOBH didn't sell well and Pin wants to jump start marketing by utilizing the Dogma name.
> 
> The carbon is the same, the angles are the same, the wheelbase is the same. However, there _might_ be differences in seat tube length. I've seen one geometry chart that showed a shorter seat tube, but that could be attributed to whether it was measured center to top or not. In fact, clicking on the KOBH geomtry chart on the Pinarello website takes you directly to the Dogma K. I could call our Pinarello rep and try to get a straight answer on Monday, but as of yet, I really can't find a good reason to go through the hassle of sourcing a DogK when the KOBH can be had.
> 
> BTW - we can also order directly from Pinarello Italy, and occasionally this is done to get special European color schemes, but it takes months.


The only real difference between the Dogma K and the Kobh are in teh bottom bracket where the Dogma K gets a new press-fit bottom bracket. It might also be a little stiffer and lighter if it is using the 65.1 carbon instead of the 60.1. It has slightly more reserved and mellower handling than the regular Dogma 65.1 Think 2 and a more comfortable rear end.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

DogmaK is still a stiff race bike, don't be misled by the curved seatstays and longer wheelbase. Those are more for stability than comfort.
Rokh is the bike to get if you want comfort. It looks like a DogmaK but has much different material and is very pleasant to ride.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

The Rokh is also marketed as being significantly heavier (1200+ grams vs 950+ grams for the Dogma K). My understanding is that both are likely heavier than advertised though.


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## Rokh On (Oct 30, 2011)

Rashadabd said:


> The Rokh is also marketed as being significantly heavier (1200+ grams vs 950+ grams for the Dogma K). My understanding is that both are likely heavier than advertised though.


My Rokh weighs 16.25 and my Dogma weighs 14.4. Your mileage may vary depending on your components. 

In general I agree that for most they might find the Rokh to be a more comfortable easier ride. It is definitely a very stable platform. I love mine and it provides a great solid ride. It climbs well and really shines descending. Very stable. I have rode it on multi day 100+ mile rides all over CO with no complaints. I will say this though. Not to take away from the Rokh and I'm sure it's just my mood of a given day but there have been times when I think the "relaxed" position drives me nuts and I wish I was in the more aggressive position of the Dogma.

OP I have no experience with Look so I cannot say if you would be happy on a Rokh. Maybe there is a lbs close that carries Pinarello and you can ride a Rokh for a weekend and see what you think.

The Dogma K is 60HM1K. The head tube has already been covered.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

Rokh On said:


> My Rokh weighs 16.25 and my Dogma weighs 14.4. Your mileage may vary depending on your components.
> 
> In general I agree that for most they might find the Rokh to be a more comfortable easier ride. It is definitely a very stable platform. I love mine and it provides a great solid ride. It climbs well and really shines descending. Very stable. I have rode it on multi day 100+ mile rides all over CO with no complaints. I will say this though. Not to take away from the Rokh and I'm sure it's just my mood of a given day but there have been times when I think the "relaxed" position drives me nuts and I wish I was in the more aggressive position of the Dogma.
> 
> ...


Thank you for posting the actual weights of the bikes. 16.25 lbs really isn't that bad. My size 51 2012 Cervelo R3 was pretty close to that with Sram Force and Zipp 101s. For what it's worth, I like the slightly taller headtube actually. It allows me to slam the stem, rotate the handlebars forward a tad bit and still remain really comfortable in the drops (which in turn is more aggressive for me). I have been pretty much sold on getting a Wilier Cento 1 SR, but the three things that have me rethinking it some and starting to consider a Rokh are the lower headtube that Cento 1 SR has, the integrated seat post it has which I'm not a huge fan of and the fact that I can get a complete Rokh with 11-speed Ultegra cheaper than a 2014 Cento 1 SR frameset. The financial reality of my wife and I both starting new businesses is weighing on my mind a bit I guess.


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## NYC_CAAD (May 4, 2011)

I can vouch for Wrench Science. The gentleman is full of knowledge. Chen is top notch in my book! 



Cinelli 82220 said:


> Wrench Science has the DogmaK on their site.
> 
> Give them a call.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

NYC_CAAD said:


> I can vouch for Wrench Science. The gentleman is full of knowledge. Chen is top notch in my book!


R&A Cycles now carries them (and Felt, Lemond, etc. as well)


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