# That crazy Zabriskie



## harlond (May 30, 2005)

He's riding the Tour without eating meat or dairy.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304314404576414124184873028.html

He has been going pretty good this year.


----------



## litespeedchick (Sep 9, 2003)

This fascinates me, because I always feel like I'm not getting enough protein even I though I am an equal opportunity feeder.

If you click on the link in that article to an earlier WSJ article about a vegan NFL player, you'll see they have something in common: they both have added a few servings a week of fish (and chicken ). Apparently full-out vegan doesn't quite cut it.


----------



## nate (Jun 20, 2004)

The fact that he (or the team) has a chiropractor doing blood tests and recommending a specific diet just goes to show that a lot of the preparation in cycling is less evidence-based than you might expect. Judging from what was written in the article, it's probably the ELISA/ACT Testing listed on Quackwatch.

You know what they call "alternative medicine" that works? "Medicine."


----------



## rubbersoul (Mar 1, 2010)

Its been tried before, Robert Millar..British cyclist of the late '80s. Zabriskie won't factor into the GC at all IMHO. I like the crazy dude and all, but....


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

You know, I'm getting more and more tired of hearing about Garmin's antics as of late. Getting tired of seeing the fat head of Vaughters too...


----------



## mtrider05 (Aug 8, 2009)

robdamanii said:


> You know, I'm getting more and more tired of hearing about Garmin's antics as of late. Getting tired of seeing the fat head of Vaughters too...


Agreed, whole lotta talk, minimal results.


----------



## DZfan14 (Jul 6, 2009)

Yeah. They won 4-5 races this month. DZ is having his best year in a while. He's bigger and stronger on this diet, actually wins TTs. 

Sometimes I think Garmin's haters just leave the blinkers on and don't pay attention.


----------



## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

mtrider05 said:


> Agreed, whole lotta talk, minimal results.


Wait, but they won Paris-Roubaix.


----------



## DZfan14 (Jul 6, 2009)

il sogno said:


> Wait, but they won Paris-Roubaix.



LOL that too.

But according to some that doesn't count because Thor refused to help Cancellara win by chasing down a break that two of his mates were in. Nothing like sports and politics to cause people to make irrational claims.


----------



## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

nate said:


> Judging from what was written in the article, it's probably the ELISA/ACT Testing listed on Quackwatch.


I disagree.

"He told Zabriskie that he could try the diet, so long as he took regular blood tests to monitor his level of ferritin, the protein that stores iron."

Pretty standard blood test AFAIK.


----------



## heathb (Nov 1, 2008)

I was vegan for a couple of years and it can work as long as you eat a large variety of foods high in plant protein. 

However I stopped and now eat lots of salmon and egg whites with very few yolks. I still eat a whole foods diet and avoid processing and my meat selection is limited to the above and I never eat any dairy. 

Too hard to keep my energy and strength up especially this time of year when my protein needs go way up from the extra hours on the bike. No way in the world would I want to try to recover from a 3 week GT with no animal protein as the hunger for meat seems to really strike me soon after a race and I'm not doing anything comparable to those guys.


----------



## nate (Jun 20, 2004)

pretender said:


> I disagree.
> 
> "He told Zabriskie that he could try the diet, so long as he took regular blood tests to monitor his level of ferritin, the protein that stores iron."
> 
> Pretty standard blood test AFAIK.


That clearly is not the same blood test that got him on the diet.



> ...at the beginning of last season, his team's chiropractor gave him a blood test that screened his sensitivity to certain types of foods. The chiropractor, Matt Rabin, told Zabriskie he had the highest sensitivity to food on the team. Another blood test showed Zabriskie had the highest inflammation of his muscles.


----------



## jswilson64 (May 20, 2008)

Hahaha - I work as an insurance fraud analyst, and the blood test for food allergies is one of the most quackish things out there (in my own personal opinion). None of the big health insurance companies will pay for it, and many doctors question its validity. It's mostly a profit center for the doctors that do it. Garmin, powered by quack science.

Again, in my own opinion (in case you're reading, boss).


----------



## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

nate said:


> That clearly is not the same blood test that got him on the diet.


Oh, my bad. Thx.


----------



## Gripped (Nov 27, 2002)

nate said:


> You know what they call "alternative medicine" that works? "Medicine."


Tim Minchin, FTW!


----------



## mtrider05 (Aug 8, 2009)

il sogno said:


> Wait, but they won Paris-Roubaix.


Talking more about the Tour rather than overall, should have specified, they did well in the Spring classics, obviously.


----------



## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

I can live with the occasional vegetarian meal, but no WAY I could give up dairy.


----------



## 88 rex (Mar 18, 2008)

jswilson64 said:


> Hahaha - I work as an insurance fraud analyst, and the blood test for food allergies is one of the most quackish things out there (in my own personal opinion). None of the big health insurance companies will pay for it, and many doctors question its validity. It's mostly a profit center for the doctors that do it. Garmin, powered by quack science.
> 
> Again, in my own opinion (in case you're reading, boss).


What makes it quackish?


----------



## heathb (Nov 1, 2008)

Jwiffle said:


> I can live with the occasional vegetarian meal, but no WAY I could give up dairy.


As far as milks there's almond, coconut, rice, flaxseed all tastes excellent with the right brand. 

I got the dairy out of my diet because I have asthma and I noticed my lungs are freer according to my higher peak flow meter readings when i cut dairy out.


----------



## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

heathb said:


> As far as milks there's almond, coconut, rice, flaxseed all tastes excellent with the right brand.
> 
> I got the dairy out of my diet because I have asthma and I noticed my lungs are freer according to my higher peak flow meter readings when i cut dairy out.


I understand why people do give up dairy, I'm just thankful I don't have any problems with it. I drink tons of milk, eat a lot of cheese, and just love ice cream. I couldn't imagine not having any of that.


----------



## jswilson64 (May 20, 2008)

88 rex said:


> What makes it quackish?


Way too much to go into here in much detail. See this link (also in a previous post in this thread). My guess would be that Dave Z's chiropractor did an ALCAT or a LEAP test. In general, many of these tests haven't been properly vetted (i.e., at least one double-blind study that shows the test is more effective than placebo) and are often marketed by the test provider/inventor as a way for a doctor to increase their revenue. In addition many of the doctors that provide these tests also sell vitamin and herbal supplements to their patients to "cure" the problem.

Once again, this is my own opinion (although it is shared by many others with many more initials after their names).


----------



## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*well not really a vegan*



litespeedchick said:


> This fascinates me, because I always feel like I'm not getting enough protein even I though I am an equal opportunity feeder.
> 
> If you click on the link in that article to an earlier WSJ article about a vegan NFL player, you'll see they have something in common: they both have added a few servings a week of fish (and chicken ). Apparently full-out vegan doesn't quite cut it.


if you are eating fish and chicken
hell you ain't even a veggie
last I checked them two items is meat


----------



## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

heathb said:


> As far as milks there's almond, coconut, rice, flaxseed all tastes excellent with the right brand.


sure and all have as much in common with milk as a wank does to sex.


----------



## gh1 (Jun 7, 2008)

nate said:


> The fact that he (or the team) has a chiropractor doing blood tests and recommending a specific diet just goes to show that a lot of the preparation in cycling is less evidence-based than you might expect. Judging from what was written in the article, it's probably the ELISA/ACT Testing listed on Quackwatch.
> 
> You know what they call "alternative medicine" that works? "Medicine."


Spoken like someone who has never been sick. If I relied on traditional medicine, I would have been dead long ago.


----------



## 88 rex (Mar 18, 2008)

jswilson64 said:


> Way too much to go into here in much detail. See this link (also in a previous post in this thread). My guess would be that Dave Z's chiropractor did an ALCAT or a LEAP test. In general, many of these tests haven't been properly vetted (i.e., at least one double-blind study that shows the test is more effective than placebo) and are often marketed by the test provider/inventor as a way for a doctor to increase their revenue. In addition many of the doctors that provide these tests also sell vitamin and herbal supplements to their patients to "cure" the problem.
> 
> Once again, this is my own opinion (although it is shared by many others with many more initials after their names).



That's some seriuosly old data. Not one reference was newer than 1999, although I see the article was updated in 2011. 

Maybe as a fraud analyst you should investigate the Quackwatch for fruadulant reporting?

http://www.questdiagnostics.com/hcp/topics/immunocap/immunocap.html
http://www.questdiagnostics.com/destinationhealth/immunocap.html
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/77096.php


----------



## nate (Jun 20, 2004)

88 rex said:


> That's some seriuosly old data. Not one reference was newer than 1999, although I see the article was updated in 2011.
> 
> Maybe as a fraud analyst you should investigate the Quackwatch for fruadulant reporting?
> 
> ...


Is the ImmunoCAP a different test? Is it supported by trials and studies? It looks like it is prescribed by physicians instead of chiropractors, which is a big difference. Even if it is accepted by physicians, if there is not backing evidence then I would be skeptical.

I'm not sure why anyone would rely on a chiropractor for allergy diagnoses.


----------



## Hollywood (Jan 16, 2003)

gh1 said:


> Spoken like someone who has never been sick. If I relied on traditional medicine, I would have been dead long ago.


Thanks - I'm in your court as well. Coincidentally, I had the same blood test done as the team, discovered during my phone interview with DZ. I approached him at the Tour of CA and mentioned that I would like a quick interview on being a Pro athlete on a vegan diet. He agreed but was off quickly to France, so the interview was done over the phone.

I applaud him for trying different approaches to "optimum" performance. If he fails miserably at the Tour, then he'll leave with first-hand knowledge and change his diet accordingly, I am sure. 

If you're frustrated with poor health and recurring symptoms and your PPO Doc sees you for 4.5 minutes and scribbles out several Rx's for steroids, then you *may* get frustrated and look to other options. Like me. 

What's the argument? Keep eating whatever the hell you want and never quite figure out why you couldn't lose weight / get stronger / not get sick so often / etc. ? I'm not sold on the claims that the only food-allergy symptoms are as extreme as swollen lips, restricted breathing, etc. But that's IMO of course, based on my path of experimenting.

Good luck DZ!

Jeff 
non-vegan


// My test was a IgG Food Antibody Asessment, done by Genova Diagnostics in Asheville, NC (Google away!!!!!!)


----------



## 88 rex (Mar 18, 2008)

nate said:


> Is the ImmunoCAP a different test? Is it supported by trials and studies? It looks like it is prescribed by physicians instead of chiropractors, which is a big difference. Even if it is accepted by physicians, if there is not backing evidence then I would be skeptical.
> 
> I'm not sure why anyone would rely on a chiropractor for allergy diagnoses.


I don't have the specific trials or studies that you're looking for (and I believe there are many), but our hospital sends all our stuff to Quest for Allergen testing. I'm not a Dr., just a lab guy, but our Docs seem to be satisfied. I'm not familiar with chiropractors and their ordering habits or interpretations of results. If I had serious concerns about allergens, I don't think a chiropractor would have even been on my list of people to see. 

These seemed like a good read via google.

http://www.labbiomedic.com/docs/ImmunoCAP_spec.pdf
http://allergynotes.blogspot.com/search/label/ImmunoCAP
http://www.questdiagnostics.com/hcp/intguide/jsp/showintguidepage.jsp?fn=TS_ImmunoCapIgE.htm
http://www.redorbit.com/news/health..._crosssectional_allergy_study_ever/index.html

Dr. Q&A: http://isitallergy.com/blog/category/immunocap/


----------



## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*any time I hear*



nate said:


> The fact that he (or the team) has a chiropractor doing blood tests and recommending a specific diet just goes to show that a lot of the preparation in cycling is less evidence-based than you might expect. Judging from what was written in the article, it's probably the ELISA/ACT Testing listed on Quackwatch.
> 
> You know what they call "alternative medicine" that works? "Medicine."


"Chiropractor" and "ordering tests" my quack meter goes on alert


----------



## jorgy (Oct 21, 2005)

gh1 said:


> Spoken like someone who has never been sick. If I relied on traditional medicine, I would have been dead long ago.


I've been life-threatening sick. And I'll take science-based medicine over CAM flim-flam any day of the week.


----------



## Hollywood (Jan 16, 2003)

mtrider05 said:


> Agreed, whole lotta talk, minimal results.


Iknowright?


----------

