# Racing and perceived 'SandBaggery'



## CHUM (Nov 4, 2005)

OK.....i'm a fairly experienced endurance and XC MTB racer.....for XC I race at the Sport level and for bigger endurance venues i generally land in the 'open' category (midpack for all....dammit)..

I've been riding a cross rig for years...and want to try out the race scene...so here's my situation:

1. had a kid 6 months ago so i am in 'beginner' shape at best...ugh
2. i do however know how to handle crowded starts, technical aspects...etc...
3. i have never raced cross before

is it wrong to jump in beginner?....or should i just get eaten alive in sport (cat 2) for a while?

opinions por favor


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## lithuania (Dec 22, 2007)

do you first race in the beginner field. If you do really well do your next race in a higher field.


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## tetter (Jun 28, 2008)

CHUM said:


> OK.....i'm a fairly experienced endurance and XC MTB racer.....for XC I race at the Sport level and for bigger endurance venues i generally land in the 'open' category (midpack for all....dammit)..
> 
> I've been riding a cross rig for years...and want to try out the race scene...so here's my situation:
> 
> ...


go beginner seeing how it is your first cross' race and cross' is different from mtb racing in many ways. if you kill every one in the class for the next race bump up a class. if any one acuses you of sandbaggery just tell them it was your first race and you did better then expected.


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## vanjr (Sep 15, 2005)

tetter said:


> go beginner seeing how it is your first cross' race and cross' is different from mtb racing in many ways. if you kill every one in the class for the next race bump up a class. if any one acuses you of sandbaggery just tell them it was your first race and you did better then expected.


Agree with the above, but if/when U are accused of sand bagging say "roadbike review forum responders told me too"


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Sandbagging in a class where first prize maybe your choice of a tire or pair of wool socks (always take the socks btw) isn't really an issue for your first race- if you crush it, move up.


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## sashax (Aug 9, 2005)

Nick, I think you'd be OK in Cs for a race or two, but as soon as you figure out what you're doing, you'll want to step up to Bs. 

You coming to CCCX?


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## jroden (Jun 15, 2004)

we have numeric categories on our licenses now, why is this still an issue?


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## Josh Patterson (Apr 29, 2007)

lithuania said:


> do you first race in the beginner field. If you do really well do your next race in a higher field.



Agreed, get your feet wet in beginner. Let us know how your race goes!

Cheers, 

Josh


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## surfamtn (Aug 28, 2006)

Sounds like you are a Cat 2 (or sport, B or whatever nomenclature). End of discussion. 

A racer with a Cat 2 license that has never raced cyclocross is...well... still a cat 2 racer. Is your ego really gonna benefit from riding 10 or 20 places higher while riding BELOW your typical level? 
Agreed, you are not maliciously "sand bagging", but by default you still would be. The fact that you even pose this question shows that you are carrying guild about downgrading yourself, but you hope that answers here will mitigate that guilt. 

Your progression to "a good cat whatever cross racer" will not be any faster by riding down a category.


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## tomk96 (Sep 24, 2007)

surfamtn said:


> Sounds like you are a Cat 2 (or sport, B or whatever nomenclature). End of discussion.
> 
> A racer with a Cat 2 license that has never raced cyclocross is...well... still a cat 2 racer. Is your ego really gonna benefit from riding 10 or 20 places higher while riding BELOW your typical level?


Actually, no. the licenses aren't the same. cross has 1-4, xc mtb has 1-3. I'm pretty sure you can get upgraded in XC by just submitting a request and not really needing a reason. i don't think he can start out in anything other than 4, C's or maybe masters if he's old enough.

to the OP, it's fine to race the 4's or C's for your first race. not sure you really have any other options. if you have a USA cycling license, whether for mtn biking or road, it will have your category for 'cross listed on there. it's possible they may have changed the defaults for cross when they changed the categories for XC. if you get a day-of license, i think you can only race 4's or masters/open type categories.

have fun and good luck. you can always request to get upgraded later.


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## RetroS (Jan 16, 2007)

One local series, MFG Seattle, has a very resonable approach to the Sandbagging topic. " Sandbagging will not be tolerated" and instructs if you have a question to simply match your age with your ability. In this vein I believe you would be hard pressed to call yourself a "beginner"


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## vwvoodoo (Sep 22, 2007)

Yes, but in the MFG series (which is brand new this year) I am racing as a 4 (theoretically the easiest "beginner" category) even though I am a Sport mtb racer. I never race on the road, hence the cat 4 classification on my USA Cycling license, but as a Sport mtb racer I ended up on the podium in the local Indie series. 
My first CX race this season was a 15th place finish (of 60). Don't tell me there's no sandbagging in the MFG series. I feel like I should probably be racing 3's, but don't think I'll upgrade until I'm much closer to the podium. I am an admitted sandbagger among sandbaggers, but I don't consider myself an offender until I win some races. 

To the OP, you should definitely get your feet wet in the "beginner" category (C or 4) - Just make sure you're not racing some sort of first timer division - you are not a "first timer" due to your experience on the mtb side of things. If you have some local training series or cross clinics, go to those to help gauge your ability level. They will often include mock races that will give you some idea of how well you ride compared to others.


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## p lo (Sep 26, 2002)

*b*

don't sandbag, doesn't sound like your a beginner to me?


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

I'm racing MFG as a Cat. 4 as well (mid-pack finish,) and raced sport in the Indie series. I think that, at least around here, the cyclocross scene is more competitive than the MTB scene. Cyclocross is a very different race with very different fitness demands than a two-hour MTB race. It's also very chic, which means huge fields. I think my favorite guideline for choosing a category is to stick with the lower one until your lap times are comparable to someone finishing mid-pack in the next one. Then move up, and discover it's harder when it runs longer, and repeat.

CHUM, I don't think you should worry about whether or not "beginner" is appropriate for you. If you finish in the top 10% or your lap times justify it, upgrade.


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## IKnowYouRider (Jul 1, 2003)

Race beginner...if that goes well jump into the 3/4 race (whatever the next category is).

I think there is a general misconception (especially among Mtb'ers...no offense) that MTB categories (Cat 1,2,3) have any correlation to the road or cyclocross. Should a road cat 1 do a beginner cross race...no, but they shouldn't necesarily be in the Elite race either. I don't know how competitive your region is but a sport mtb (cat 2?) will almost definitely get shelled in competitive P/1/2 cross race in the northeast...

wayne


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## lithuania (Dec 22, 2007)

last year a pro road racer was forced to do his first cross race as a cat 4 in my district.


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## zank (Aug 4, 2005)

a good sport (cat 2) level mountain bike racer will hold there own just fine in a 3/4 race in New England. It may vary a bit across the regions though. Cat 2 mtb and cat 2 cross are most certainly not the same around here.


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## the mayor (Jul 8, 2004)

zank said:


> a good sport (cat 2) level mountain bike racer will hold there own just fine in a 3/4 race in New England. It may vary a bit across the regions though. Cat 2 mtb and cat 2 cross are most certainly not the same around here.


Zank gets it....it varies by region.
And you may be forced to race 4 by local officials.
Race the Cat4 race...if you win by a big margin, be a man and have your results pulled so a real beginner can get the prize...and upgrade.


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## FatTireFred (Jan 31, 2005)

the mayor said:


> Zank gets it....it varies by region.
> And you may be forced to race 4 by local officials.
> Race the Cat4 race...if you win by a big margin, be a man and have your results pulled so a real beginner can get the prize...and upgrade.




maybe consult the official? that would nip any sandbag accusations


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## onrhodes (Feb 19, 2004)

I'll have to weigh in as try the cat. 4 race first. 
For a multitude of reasons, I am "only" a category 4 in cross (done less than 10 races in my life in cross) but I am a category 3 on the road for the past 15 years and a category 2 on the mtn bike for the past 15 years. 
Cross is a different beast than either road or mtn. I've known plenty of category 2 and 1 mtn bikers who have a hard time getting out of the 4's. Sure they are strong, but that doesn't always equate to results.
Same in the opposite direction. I know a local category 1 road/track racer who at one point had some national records on the track. He's a freaking awesome crit racer, but I can dust him in the woods.
So, in summary, just try the category 4 race. If you kill it, upgrade. However you may find that it takes a few races to get into the top end results.


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## colinr (Nov 20, 2006)

CHUM said:


> OK.....i'm a fairly experienced endurance and XC MTB racer.....for XC I race at the Sport level and for bigger endurance venues i generally land in the 'open' category (midpack for all....dammit)..
> 
> I've been riding a cross rig for years...and want to try out the race scene...so here's my situation:
> 
> ...


Sport/Cat 2 MTB corresponds to a cat 4 CX license in USAC. trying to ride as a Cat 2 CX racer with sport mtb fitness or worse would go very badly.

First race = beginner. If you crush it, move up.


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## CHUM (Nov 4, 2005)

sashax said:


> Nick, I think you'd be OK in Cs for a race or two, but as soon as you figure out what you're doing, you'll want to step up to Bs.
> 
> You coming to CCCX?


Hey Sasha!....ya....wanna get into at least a few CCCX races this season (new kid takes up loads of time )....

just need to get more intervals/time in on my rig.....and practice mounts/dismounts/runs/etc....

i'll try to head up for some DFL action too :thumbsup:


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## CHUM (Nov 4, 2005)

colinr said:


> Sport/Cat 2 MTB corresponds to a cat 4 CX license in USAC. trying to ride as a Cat 2 CX racer with sport mtb fitness or worse would go very badly.
> 
> First race = beginner. If you crush it, move up.


this sums it up pretty good :thumbsup: 

thanks!

ps - i honestly do not believe i will crush anything....well....maybe myself....ugh....


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## p lo (Sep 26, 2002)

*maybe i don't get that...*

I always thought the lowest catagory should be for new racers. it is intimidating enough to start bike racing, but imagine it being your first ever bike race and competing against guys who have raced for years or and have a bunch of race experience? i am not sure the leaves them feeling good about the experience? maybe they don't care? I don't remember?


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## colinr (Nov 20, 2006)

p lo said:


> I always thought the lowest catagory should be for new racers. it is intimidating enough to start bike racing, but imagine it being your first ever bike race and competing against guys who have raced for years or and have a bunch of race experience? i am not sure the leaves them feeling good about the experience? maybe they don't care? I don't remember?


Based on the numbers of people showing up at these things I would say most people are feeling good about their first experience.


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## C Cow (Oct 1, 2007)

*Sandbaggery*

If you have an annual USAC, your license will probably say CAT 4 for cross, unless you've done some upgrading. If you want to upgrade based on the conversion table below, then just contact USAC and get a new license issued with your "new" CX cat. The conversion table allows "CAT similarity" automatically, but it won't happen happen without your request.

CX category based on road or XC category
Road Cat----MTB XC Cat-------CX
------1----------------Pro------------1
-------2----------------1---------------2
--------3---------------2----------------3
--------4 or 5--------3----------------4

If you don't have an annual, then you can only race CAT 4 with a One Day License. If you are forced to seriously sandbag, be patient, with two wins you are automatically upgraded to the next CAT (depending on field size). The points system will do it also.

Race until you're "kicked up" a CAT, then do it again. Have fun, entertain the crowds, and enjoy the chance to be a beginner again. 

C Cow
nmcross.com


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## onrhodes (Feb 19, 2004)

p lo said:


> I always thought the lowest catagory should be for new racers. it is intimidating enough to start bike racing, but imagine it being your first ever bike race and competing against guys who have raced for years or and have a bunch of race experience? i am not sure the leaves them feeling good about the experience? maybe they don't care? I don't remember?


I gather from the original post by Chum that this is his first cross race ever. that implied beginner to me, which means he should start off as a cat. 4.
Experience in another cycling discipline does not exactly translate into success at another cycling discipline.


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## carlhulit (Nov 5, 2005)

I started out as a 4 in cross 2 years ago due to licensing issues, rode off the front and upgraded to 3s for the next race, the officials in cross will be happy to upgrade you if you dempnstrate ability. That said a sport class mtber should start out in the 4s/Cs field in cross at least how the seattle series is set up, as that is where they will be competitive. If you were an expert mtber than 3s/Bs would be reasonable to start in. I currently race expert mtb competitively and cat 2/As cross towards the back. The issue here is cross has grown enough there needs to be a true beginner field, which could be created by seperating the 1/2s into 2 fields and forcing upgrades to make the 4s a beginener class, but thats not how it is now, so unless you are an expert/open on the mtb or a cat 1/2 on the road its reasonable to start out in the 4s


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## single1x1 (Mar 26, 2005)

Just race in the SS cat with the cat 3's, should be enough to kick anyones butt. Though the last MFG race had several usual cat 1&2 racers bringing out their SS rides for the SS race, 45 starters- holy crap!. I did my first Cross race back in 02' I think and just went into the SS race with the cat 3 racers, one SS mt bike race and some Bmx racing in my background back then. I'm glad I had the extra time in the SS/cat 3 race. When I occasionally try a geared race I go with cat 3 as well, and get heckeled by my usual SS comp on the start line with gears. When I raced SS mt bikes in the 07 season and had a SS expert or SS sport option I chose the expert option. Maybe try only one race in the cat 4 race, but really I think you really want the extra time of the cat 3 race, why pay for 30 minutes when you can get 45-50 minutes instead?


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## ZenNMotion (May 28, 2004)

Field limits are becoming more of an issue every year, especially in the Cat 4 races. It definitely isn't nice to take up a place in a lower category that closes out, locking out a beginner from even participating. Beginners are often the last to register, not knowing the scene, questions about licenses, race schedule, and sometimes just the jitters until the last minute "am I ready to race". The beginners should be able to compete and measure themselves against beginners, the first races can be intimidating enough without worrying about "staying out of the way" or getting lapped by dudes whose egos can't handle a lower place number in a higher category. For the sport to grow the beginner categories need to be beginner friendly. If you have any bike racing experience at all, mtb, road track, bmx etc you have no business in the beginner categories. If you've got a season behind you and you're still doing 4's unless you're off the back, then WTF?- step up. If you can hit mid-pack in the beginners, step up and do yourself a favor to get better faster (faster better?) and everyone else and stay out of the 4's. And all the BS about "learning how to win" in the 4s before moving up doesn't apply to cross- there is little or no strategy you'll learn about winning in the 4's, it's just an excuse to be a sandbaggin jackass. ATMO. Cross season must have started, my first sandbagging rant!


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## onrhodes (Feb 19, 2004)

ZenNMotion said:


> Field limits are becoming more of an issue every year, especially in the Cat 4 races. It definitely isn't nice to take up a place in a lower category that closes out, locking out a beginner from even participating. Beginners are often the last to register, not knowing the scene, questions about licenses, race schedule, and sometimes just the jitters until the last minute "am I ready to race". The beginners should be able to compete and measure themselves against beginners, the first races can be intimidating enough without worrying about "staying out of the way" or getting lapped by dudes whose egos can't handle a lower place number in a higher category. For the sport to grow the beginner categories need to be beginner friendly. If you have any bike racing experience at all, mtb, road track, bmx etc you have no business in the beginner categories. If you've got a season behind you and you're still doing 4's unless you're off the back, then WTF?- step up. If you can hit mid-pack in the beginners, step up and do yourself a favor to get better faster (faster better?) and everyone else and stay out of the 4's. And all the BS about "learning how to win" in the 4s before moving up doesn't apply to cross- there is little or no strategy you'll learn about winning in the 4's, it's just an excuse to be a sandbaggin jackass. ATMO. Cross season must have started, my first sandbagging rant!


I completely disagree. If his license says category 4, then he should be racing in the category 4 field. Plain and simple. He implies he has never done a cross race before, which also puts him in the beginner field. If you tossed him in with say the category 3 racers, he could potentially be in over his head, and then you end up losing some one to cross, just like your scenario indicates.
If he does his first ever cross race and kills everyone, then he knows to move up. He states that he is a sport level mtn biker. It's not like he is category 1 on the road or mtn jumping into the category 4 field at a cross race.
If you wait until the last minute to sign up for a race that is your own fault if it closes out.


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## dc.cyclocross (Oct 5, 2007)

lithuania said:


> last year a pro road racer was forced to do his first cross race as a cat 4 in my district.


aren't you in MABRA? what do you mean 'forced'?

the usa cycling rules say that you can get an automatic upgrade to bring your CX category up to your mtb or road level... so all the racer had to do was get the proper category on his/her license.

https://www.usacycling.org/forms/USAC_rulebook-1.pdf

I know that a couple of the local superfast roadies that were doing CX at lower categories last year were upgraded for them from 4 (or 3) to 1 immediately after they did one race.

promoters and officials WANT people to upgrade and race elite, so it would be very strange that they would make a pro race in cat 4

-marc


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## dc.cyclocross (Oct 5, 2007)

the mayor said:


> Zank gets it....it varies by region.
> And you may be forced to race 4 by local officials.
> Race the Cat4 race...if you win by a big margin, be a man and have your results pulled so a real beginner can get the prize...and upgrade.


nobody should be forced to race cat 4 according to USA cycling rules.

see here:

1D5. Cyclocross Conversion
Cyclocross categories may also be upgraded by conversion from a rider’s earned road or cross country category. If during the season, a rider upgrades his or her road category or XC category, the cyclocross category can be upgraded to match
the road or XC category shown below by request of the rider or by request of the administrator.

racing cat 4 sounds like a no-win situation to me. try 3 and do your best- I bet you do fine.


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## CouchingTiger (Mar 5, 2007)

Zank is 100% correct. A Cat2 MTB racer != Cat2 cross or Cat2 road racer. For instance, I'm a Cat1 MTB racing Pro/Cat1 Open class (poorly), Cat2 cross racing Elite Masters and some A races at smaller events and a Cat3 on the road. A Cat2 MTB is a Cat4 cross by default I believe and a Cat1 MTB is a Cat3 cross. I think that is a pretty accurate starting point.

Mike



zank said:


> a good sport (cat 2) level mountain bike racer will hold there own just fine in a 3/4 race in New England. It may vary a bit across the regions though. Cat 2 mtb and cat 2 cross are most certainly not the same around here.


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## lithuania (Dec 22, 2007)

dc.cyclocross said:


> aren't you in MABRA? what do you mean 'forced'?
> 
> the usa cycling rules say that you can get an automatic upgrade to bring your CX category up to your mtb or road level... so all the racer had to do was get the proper category on his/her license.
> 
> ...


yep im mabra and im talking about last years kelley acres. my understanding was the officials at that race wouldnt let him race above what his license stated even though everyone knew it would be a joke to see him in that race. now thats just what i heard while watching the race and immediately after. i didnt care enough to investigate any further.


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## c-lo (Sep 30, 2008)

3rd cross race, first race on a new hand so I'm doing cat 4 on sunday. depending on how I do I'll upgrade the next.


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## dc.cyclocross (Oct 5, 2007)

lithuania said:


> yep im mabra and im talking about last years kelley acres. my understanding was the officials at that race wouldnt let him race above what his license stated even though everyone knew it would be a joke to see him in that race. now thats just what i heard while watching the race and immediately after. i didnt care enough to investigate any further.


well, maybe not on race day...or with those particular officials

a couple days later when the mabra officials heard the story, he was upgraded to cat 1 in about 10 minutes.

that race was true sandbagging, although if he wasn't allowed to choose another category it's not his fault. although at the time it looked like a pattern since his team-mate similarly dominated the 3 race at dccx the year prior. btw, the racer in question got 2nd yesterday at charm city elite masters- a good example that it doesn't take long for a really good roadie to pick up cx....


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## lithuania (Dec 22, 2007)

oh yeah i know how he did yesterday. i also remember his team mates race at your race 2 years ago. 

i thought it was lame that the dude at kelley acres didnt at least choose to race the 3/4 race.


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## rs3o (Jan 22, 2004)

The more I think about this, the more irritated I get. So I didn't race Reston this past weekend because of an injury but I did pit for a friend of mine who eventually did a top ten in the cat 4 race. While watching the race, it was amazing to see how the eventual first and second place finishers rocketed off the front pretty quickly and built up an amazing gap. Just made me wonder.

After doing some internet research, it appears that the first place finisher is a cat 2 roadie who happened to be wearing a kit which was not the same as the team he races for on the road. Now, I may be wrong about the whole thing and I've got the wrong guy, but it looks like a cat 2 roadie donned an old skinsuit to race the beginner race and stomped the field. According to crossresults.com, it was his only CX race of the year, but should elite road racers be in the beginner race? Even if he is technically a CX cat 4, he could have done the 2/3/4 race and probably would have done well. Looks like sandbaggery to me.

The second place finisher is a cat 3 road racer and probably would have done just fine in the 2/3/4 race as well, but it's not as blatant a case of sandbagging to me.

Why is this important? I guess it's not. After all, we're just a bunch of euro-weenie-wannabe dorks riding bikes around in muddy circles. I just wonder, even if you're fine with what you've done, how you tell your spouse/kids/parents/teammates/whoever that you won a beginner race when you know damn well you had no business being in that race.


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## Undecided (Apr 2, 2007)

rs3o said:


> Why is this important? I guess it's not. After all, we're just a bunch of euro-weenie-wannabe dorks riding bikes around in muddy circles. I just wonder, even if you're fine with what you've done, how you tell your spouse/kids/parents/teammates/whoever that you won a beginner race when you know damn well you had no business being in that race.


But if it was his first cross race, how could he have known whether he had any business being in that race? If he'd never done it before, how could he know how much his fitness would contribute (vs. skills)? It's very possible that the story he told his whoever wasn't boastful, but was more like "I was nervous about not having any skills, but I'm not going to develop them unless I race with some fitter guys next time."


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## Bianchi67 (Oct 16, 2005)

I raced four cat4 races (first-timer this year) in the mid atlantic area. Two of the four races were won by the same guy. He also won a third race, had a 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. Both wins when I was there, he had half a lap lead by the finish and lapped plenty of riders. The winners of my other two races both had multiple podium finishes.

It doesn't bother me personally. I know I still won't win. I'm not even going to finish in the top half. I'm just out there to have some fun. But when some of the other beginners I raced with's only goal was to not get lapped kinda blows.


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## pacificaslim (Sep 10, 2008)

About the only problem I can see with "sandbagging," is it prevents people from moving up as fast as they would have if that racer wasn't in their race and distorts the measurement of their progress (i.e., they really are better than all the other 4s but didn't get the winning points because a 2 was in the race). But complaining about not winning is strange!

Is there really any glory in winning a race only because all the people better than you weren't allowed to enter your race? Being proud of winning an age class is one thing, but why even worry about who wins a 4, 3, or 2 race? They only won because all the better riders weren't in their race. Unless you're in the top race, it ought to be just for fun and personal goals.


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## Crack Monkey (Apr 19, 2007)

pacificaslim said:


> ... distorts the measurement of their progress (i.e., they really are better than all the other 4s but didn't get the winning points because a 2 was in the race). But complaining about not winning is strange!
> 
> ... They only won because all the better riders weren't in their race. Unless you're in the top race, it ought to be just for fun and personal goals.


While I see what you are saying, I'm not sure I agree. Like you said in the first paragraph, sandbagging distorts people's perception of their progress. A lot of guys don't want to upgrade because they can't get a top-10 (or even a top-20) in 4 - when in reality, that whole group should probably upgrade.

And then there's the whole issue of new racers getting stomped by a semi-pro. Unlike some other sports (running, tri come to mind), we don't have age-group racing (other than two broad Masters categories). If you're a 34 year old new Cat4 racer, getting stomped by a 28 year old Cat2 is really lame.


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## Undecided (Apr 2, 2007)

Crack Monkey said:


> And then there's the whole issue of new racers getting stomped by a semi-pro. Unlike some other sports (running, tri come to mind), we don't have age-group racing (other than two broad Masters categories). If you're a 34 year old new Cat4 racer, getting stomped by a 28 year old Cat2 is really lame.


Meh. I consider those age-group things pretty lame.


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## pacificaslim (Sep 10, 2008)

I don't know. I figure that "I'm the fastest guy over 45," sounds a lot better than, "I'm the fastest guy except all the other guys who are too fast and have graduated from my racing category." Or to put it another way, "He's fast for an old guy," sounds better than "He's fast for a cat 4."


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## ooboohabanero (Nov 4, 2009)

why do i see folks in cat 4 races who blow us real beginners out of the water...then take a sip of water and move on to the next race and still place high?

i already (still) suck (relatively), but if these same folks who race on carbon bikes and look like veterans of the circuit keep doing this next season, then what chance do i have other than become one of them (eventually)?

an elite roadie ought to know he'll do JUST fine in a cat 4 race since (aside from the technical aspects of cross) stamina, speed and power are definitely the big +s in cx


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## Magdaddy (Feb 23, 2007)

*different area's, different rules?*

to qualify for Masters category here in New York(most USA cycling-NYCROSS events anyway)-you had to be a Cat3. Although it was my first cross season, I upgraded using past destination and mtb race experience. As a 48 year old guy, I had absolutely no interest in competing against guys half my age in the Cat3/4 races.

I was a solid mid field finisher for most of the races. Yea I struggled on the shorter true power courses-got lapped about half of the time. However, I always printed out the race results, and studied the finishers around me. I gauged how well I did week to week, on the guys I was racing with week to week.

I learned my strengths, as well as my weaknesses, and a few tactics also. I know I'll do better next year-because this was after all a learning year.

I'll be more aggressive passing...and especially re-passing. Many times I'd get passed, either in class or by the group starting behind-only to have the rider hold me up thru the techy twisty stuff. Every second counts, and losing time behind them, only made me more vulnerable to the nexst rider back. I'll work on my running-dismount sooner on run-ups...especially when they are congested on the opening lap-and always carry my bike. No more "rolling" the bike up a run up, just creates balance and traction issues IMHO.

I learned alot this year, here's looikng forward to next season.


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## ooboohabanero (Nov 4, 2009)

*this is still so right on*:thumbsup: 



ZenNMotion said:


> *Field limits are becoming more of an issue every year, especially in the Cat 4 races. It definitely isn't nice to take up a place in a lower category that closes out, locking out a beginner from even participating. Beginners are often the last to register, not knowing the scene, questions about licenses, race schedule, and sometimes just the jitters until the last minute "am I ready to race". The beginners should be able to compete and measure themselves against beginners, the first races can be intimidating enough without worrying about "staying out of the way" or getting lapped by dudes whose egos can't handle a lower place number in a higher category. For the sport to grow the beginner categories need to be beginner friendly. If you have any bike racing experience at all, mtb, road track, bmx etc you have no business in the beginner categories. If you've got a season behind you and you're still doing 4's unless you're off the back, then WTF?- step up. If you can hit mid-pack in the beginners, step up and do yourself a favor to get better faster (faster better?) and everyone else and stay out of the 4's. And all the BS about "learning how to win" in the 4s before moving up doesn't apply to cross- there is little or no strategy you'll learn about winning in the 4's, it's just an excuse to be a sandbaggin jackass. ATMO. Cross season must have started, my first sandbagging rant!*


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## GearDaddy (Apr 1, 2004)

I wish we could go back to A, B, C, etc. self-selected racing. IMO the categorization system gives people excuses to race in a class where they don't "belong". When I started CX racing 6 years ago I started in the B race and managed to finish in the top 20. I occasionally did an A race, but would typically get lapped, but not finish last. So, the B race seemed right for me. Pretty simple. I didn't need to look at a piece of paper or get some official approval from anybody. It worked fine. Sure people would complain about sandbaggers, but in truth I think true sandbagging is not that common nor any big deal. If you care about being the fastest guy around, then the A race is all that matters - right? If someones smoking it in the B race, there was no excuse for them to not just do the A race instead.


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## velociped jones (Mar 21, 2005)

Magdaddy said:


> Many times I'd get passed, either in class or by the group starting behind-only to have the rider hold me up thru the techy twisty stuff.


 hee, hee. that's one of my tricks.


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## lithuania (Dec 22, 2007)

I think it sucks that the guy who won the reston C race is a cat 2 or 1 that has some really sick results on the road but I wont really complain until he does another C race. 

Better form would have been to do the 3/4 race as his first but I find it hard to really rip a guy who does his very first cross race in the beginner field.


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## ooboohabanero (Nov 4, 2009)

i would like to see a study about sandbaggers and see what percentage of them take ******, etc...there must be a correlation


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