# Look vs. Speedplay pedal ?



## RyanM (Jul 15, 2008)

I currently ride look keo max 2 pedals. They work fine for me but sometimes if I have to get going quick from a stop its hard to get into the pedal. Have been riding clipless a long time now and its only these look pedals that have ever given me an issue trying to clip in.

Would something like the speedplay pedals be easier to engage quickly?


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## ziscwg (Apr 19, 2010)

I just got speedplay zeros. 2 sided and you just stomp with your foot parallel to the ground and your in.

Love them


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## RyanM (Jul 15, 2008)

ziscwg said:


> I just got speedplay zeros. 2 sided and you just stomp with your foot parallel to the ground and your in.
> 
> Love them


Sounds much easier than my looks that you have to flip with your foot to make them the right direction and then get your cleat in properly for it to engage


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## jwp3476 (Jun 22, 2010)

+1 on the Speedplay pedals. The X series is the easiest to get into. The Zero series is only a little harder since the springs are stiffer.


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

I used to have the Shimano 105 pedals which are quite similar to the look in regards to single sided entry and now I'm riding some speedplay zero's. To be honest, the zero's are easier to get into with the just step down thing however the actual feel when clipped in is quite different. It's more a personal preference in regards to the feeling of being clipped in than just which is easier.

Personally, I felt better/more stable/more powerful when clipped into the 105's vs. the Speedplays especially when climbing out of the saddle.


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## Lou3000 (Aug 25, 2010)

I've been on Looks (Delta then Keo) for 12 years, and have always been intrigued by the thought of dual entry, but as someone with larger feet (46,12) I've always been concerned about the tiny contact patch.

Any comments from people who wear size 12-13?


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## Uprwstsdr (Jul 17, 2002)

Lou3000 said:


> I've been on Looks (Delta then Keo) for 12 years, and have always been intrigued by the thought of dual entry, but as someone with larger feet (46,12) I've always been concerned about the tiny contact patch.
> 
> Any comments from people who wear size 12-13?


Size 12 - I have used Speedplay's for 9 years without any issue. The entire cleat is considered the contact patch, so, according to SP, the area is actually larger than on Looks. 

Caveat, SP's are the only pedal I have ever used, so I have nothing to compare them to.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

I went from Shimano Ultegras to Zeros last year just because of pedal entry after a stop. They are easier to get into than the Ultegs but not 100% perfect. I do prefer the Zeros.


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## Sylint (Jul 27, 2009)

Lou3000 said:


> I've been on Looks (Delta then Keo) for 12 years, and have always been intrigued by the thought of dual entry, but as someone with larger feet (46,12) I've always been concerned about the tiny contact patch.
> 
> Any comments from people who wear size 12-13?


I'm a big guy with big feet. No issues at all. The weight is on the entire cleat, not the little pedal.


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## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

Ever have to clip in on a grade? Due to the double sided clip in you dont have to worry about missing the pedal and falling over. It still takes practice but not worrying about flipping the pedal over makes it easier.

I started out with Ultegra SPD pedals and i can't go back. For mtb I use crank brother pedals 4 sided entry...that's another story.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

RyanM said:


> Sounds much easier than my looks that you have to flip with your foot to make them the right direction and then get your cleat in properly for it to engage


Not really. I fin most of the Tim my speed play pedals always seem to default in the proper position. If not I just put my foot down and they cleats slip and lock into place. It does not have to be a complete stomp straight down. I don't ever have to look down to get it.

I also use these when teaching my Spinning classes. I get off the bike pretty frequently and almost never have to look down to engage. I left Speedplay pedals last year to try and go back to Look Keo pedals. I will never do that again.

I have tried basically most the popular road and MTB pedal systems. Speedplay is the best IMO for me and plenty of others. Nothing wrong with Shimano or LOOK. But I feel SP (Zeros) are superior. Now SP Frog MTB are nice, but prefer Crankbrothers on the MTB side. BLOWS AWAY SPD or LOOK.


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## quantum (Sep 17, 2009)

You original post stated you have only had this issue with the new Keos. I had noticed the same thing with mine as well. On the old Delta-style pedals, the back of the pedal always fell to the bottom, giving it a consistent position.

I mentioned it to the guys at the LBS during a checkup. The issue was gone with I got the bike back - not sure what they did. You may want to look into it before changing out pedals and cleats.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

quantum said:


> You original post stated you have only had this issue with the new Keos. I had noticed the same thing with mine as well. On the old Delta-style pedals, the back of the pedal always fell to the bottom, giving it a consistent position.
> 
> I mentioned it to the guys at the LBS during a checkup. The issue was gone with I got the bike back - not sure what they did. You may want to look into it before changing out pedals and cleats.


My Keo pedals did the same thing as the delta. Maybe the new Keo MAX does not.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

quantum said:


> You original post stated you have only had this issue with the new Keos. I had noticed the same thing with mine as well. On the old Delta-style pedals, the back of the pedal always fell to the bottom, giving it a consistent position.
> 
> I mentioned it to the guys at the LBS during a checkup. The issue was gone with I got the bike back - not sure what they did. You may want to look into it before changing out pedals and cleats.


This.

Changing pedal systems due to an intermittent issue that is not well understood is hasty and expensive. OP, before investing lots of money deduce the nature of this issue. Could it be cleat wear? IIRC, from my Delta-style Look days, as the cleats wore out they got harder to clip in to.


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## brentley (Jul 20, 2008)

Marc said:


> This.
> 
> Changing pedal systems due to an intermittent issue that is not well understood is hasty and expensive. OP, before investing lots of money deduce the nature of this issue. Could it be cleat wear? IIRC, from my Delta-style Look days, as the cleats wore out they got harder to clip in to.


And if you are thinking of speedplays you really really want to test ride them on the road for a while before you buy. Ask you dealer if they have any demo pedals for you to test with as there is a real difference between the feel of the Look/Shimano cleat setup and the speedplay cleat setup. I ride speedplays myself but they took a bit of getting used to.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Changed over from toe clips and double straps, to Look delta's back in 1988.
Still using Look delta. (on three bikes) 
Very easy to get into.


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## RyanM (Jul 15, 2008)

Thanks for input and suggestions. Will have my pedals looked at and if that doesn't clear issue see if I can demo some SP's to see if like them or not


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

There was an issue some time back with these pedals not hanging right because of a sticky seal. For a while, Look fixed it under warranty. But I'm not sure if they still do. Anyhow, here's the procedure to unstick them if yours don't rotate down properly.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=255802


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## aluminum (May 6, 2011)

Look keo pedals are very unique in the fact that they are top heavy. if you ever notice when you clip out the pedal hangs sideways and theres a reason for that. so when your ready to clip in again you just drag your cleat against the pedal until its upright and clip back in. its allot harder to explain but once you understand how they are ment to work its x10 easier


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## decoboy (Aug 9, 2011)

*Keo Max hang angle is just very wrong*

I bought a pair of Keo Max 2 for my new bike, thought I'd lost the plot - constant miss cue on entry... had 10 yeas plus experience of a pair of very early Looks on my old bike so I should have known the drill. So I compared them - ouch! the new Keo lean backwards at about minus 25-30 deg, the old ones about 5-10. This is not a sticky seal issue - they just aren't balanced correctly I think Look has got it way wrong, if the pedal hangs vertical ( or a touch forwards) this would be the optimum - but 30 deg backwards?? No way could this make it easy to enter. I did a test adding a small piece of lead - this brought it back to about -10, much much better. How could they get it so wrong? Cleat entry is an important safety issue.


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## RyanM (Jul 15, 2008)

I found my problem. The new keo cleats are the grip cleats to help with walking on the cleats. This was the problem. They are so hard to engage b/c of the added grip rubber on the bottoms. I switched my cleats to the regular ones and have had no issues. 
Problem solved.


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

decoboy said:


> I bought a pair of Keo Max 2 for my new bike, thought I'd lost the plot - constant miss cue on entry... had 10 yeas plus experience of a pair of very early Looks on my old bike so I should have known the drill. So I compared them - ouch! the new Keo lean backwards at about minus 25-30 deg, the old ones about 5-10. This is not a sticky seal issue - they just aren't balanced correctly I think Look has got it way wrong, if the pedal hangs vertical ( or a touch forwards) this would be the optimum - but 30 deg backwards?? No way could this make it easy to enter. I did a test adding a small piece of lead - this brought it back to about -10, much much better. How could they get it so wrong? Cleat entry is an important safety issue.


The 2 Max I had did the same thing regarding the hang angle. To me the way they hang backwards a bit seems almost counter-intuitive. I think it would be better/smoother for a vertical or forward tilt like you mentioned.

Something I am discovering as I use my Speedplays more is that they just feel different when clipped in compared to Look or Shimano. It's hard to describe but when riding with the Looks it felt like I was pushing down on a bigger area almost like a board. The Speedplays feel more like I'm just moving my feet in a circle. The sensation of being clipped in with Speedplay is different. I almost feel more "powerful" when climbing or sprinting in Look's.

Anyone else notice this difference in feeling when clipped in? Different sensation almost?


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## JSWhaler (Nov 25, 2009)

I wear a size 13, but 14 in cycling shoes. I used Look pedals for a long time, after an accident I switched to speedplay zeros. I love em and they're easy to get into, as others have stated about just pushing down and you pop in. This is my 4th season with the zeros.


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## cxl98904 (Apr 30, 2010)

they are very easy to get in, going from look type pedals it takes a bit to get used to the float. I've had them for about 20yrs never gone to another type


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## decoboy (Aug 9, 2011)

*Good pitn about the Keo 'grip' cleats*

Hi RyanM, Thanks for the info, I'd started to wonder about the grip pads too. I'll get a pair of the regulars and see if it helps.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

The Look Keo Max are lighter and have less mass on the rear of the pedal so the pedal doesn't hang naturally in the insert position like the Look deltas or Shimanos do.

It is kind of annoying but you get used to it after a while.

Maybe try a bit of lead tape on the rear end, like the ones used to weight tennis rackets before buying new pedals?


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## RoadChaser (Jul 29, 2011)

went from zeros to shimanos and back to zeros and sold the shimanos


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## warimono (Aug 12, 2011)

My first clipless pedals were speedplay roads and the float is interesting and I liked them. I switched to SPD's and mountain shoes so I could actually walk when I got somewhere and they work great. Less backwards tap dancy, and I guess I am not at a level where the road only ones make a difference.

The cleat seems to be even larger than most for the speedplays which would be my biggest complaint.


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## bdaghisallo1 (Sep 25, 2007)

I often why so many folks put so much weight into how easy a pedal is to clip into. On any given ride, how much time is spent trying to clip in versus pedalling? Surely the function of a pedal/cleat combo should be top priority, no? Perhaps I am specially talented, but I have never had an issue clipping into a pedal quickly with any pedal system I have used, and I have tried just about every pedal outside of Crank Bros and Campy Profits.


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

have a read of this:

ROAD PEDALS – WHICH ARE BEST? » Bike Fit » Steve Hogg's Bike Fitting Website

IMO Speedplay Zero is the best road pedal on the market today, provided you buy the aluminium fore/aft extenders (Speedplay part 13330) instead of using standard plastic baseplates which dont give enough cleat aft travel..... These days on-line shops sell all Speedplay parts you will need - cleat covers, extenders, shims, long/short pedal spindles and BFS wedges too.....


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

bdaghisallo1 said:


> I often why so many folks put so much weight into how easy a pedal is to clip into. On any given ride, how much time is spent trying to clip in versus pedalling? Surely the function of a pedal/cleat combo should be top priority, no? Perhaps I am specially talented, but I have never had an issue clipping into a pedal quickly with any pedal system I have used, and I have tried just about every pedal outside of Crank Bros and Campy Profits.


It's not really about time spent clipping in compared to actually being engaged and pedaling along, it's about the simplicity and effectiveness of getting into the pedals. On a given ride in my State/city I have to unclip/clip in about 5-8 times to get out of the city due to stop lights/traffic. Some of these are uphill at least on the way out of town which are quite tricky for me with traditional 1-sided entry pedals. Tough for me to kick the pedal over and clip in while focusing on getting going up the hill with one leg while also quickly crossing the road.

Also, it seems to be that Speedplay has the simplicity advantage in regards to clipping in with no real downside. The only difference is a different "feeling" when clipped in compared to one sided pedals.


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## SteveInNJ (Aug 14, 2011)

Speedplay X/2s...also great if you have any knee issues (like me)


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## Kuma601 (Jan 22, 2004)

Unlike the cleats with Look, Shmano, if you torque down on the Speedplay metal plate assembly, it is a sure bet the clip will bind and make entrance-exit more challenging. Do it a bit loose it will move. I've been riding mine now for ~4 years. Last week, I started getting some knee tenderness. Looking at the base plates, one had shifted .5mm. My fault for not torquing it properly. I'm not new to these and I service-remove the assembly each winter to clean and inspect for wear. These are not set-forget like Look cleats and replace when worn. 

Granted one has to inspect Look pedals to insure good spring function. So some maintenance is necessary but so long as you fit them to your needs, you'll be good. .


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

Kuma601 said:


> Unlike the cleats with Look, Shmano, if you torque down on the Speedplay metal plate assembly, it is a sure bet the clip will bind and make entrance-exit more challenging. Do it a bit loose it will move. I've been riding mine now for ~4 years. Last week, I started getting some knee tenderness. Looking at the base plates, one had shifted .5mm. My fault for not torquing it properly. I'm not new to these and I service-remove the assembly each winter to clean and inspect for wear. These are not set-forget like Look cleats and replace when worn.
> 
> Granted one has to inspect Look pedals to insure good spring function. So some maintenance is necessary but so long as you fit them to your needs, you'll be good. .


Wll Speedplay recommends greasing the cleats ever 2-3 rides IIRC.


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## excelerator (Jun 4, 2009)

*Brake stands?*

I too was frustrated with clipping in the Keo. They don't "automaticaly" sit at rest with the front elevated. I really like the Keos though and the security I feel when clipped. I've never felt that on the Speedplays. I've gotten really good at not clipping out at stop lights however!


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

excelerator said:


> I too was frustrated with clipping in the Keo. They don't "automaticaly" sit at rest with the front elevated. I really like the Keos though and the security I feel when clipped. I've never felt that on the Speedplays. I've gotten really good at not clipping out at stop lights however!


The security is I think the feeling I'm trying to convey regarding the different sensation of Speedplay vs. Look/Shimano regarding being clipped in. It's not that I feel like I'm going to "jump out" of my Speedplays or anything like however, it does feel a bit like I'm not actually clipped in. 

With the Look/Shimano there is no question you are clipped in, I feel more like part of a machine almost in comparison to Speedplay which seems more "human"/nature. 

Anyone know if the Keo Classic's or the Keo Blade's have the same hanging issue that the 2 Max have?


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## Kuma601 (Jan 22, 2004)

Marc said:


> Wll Speedplay recommends greasing the cleats ever 2-3 rides IIRC.


Yes, there is periodic lubrication required for the Speedplay cleats. My regular routine is about every 400 miles or so. End of the season I take the plates off to clean the clip and shroud of accumulated waxy lubricant and road grime.


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## dracula (Mar 9, 2010)

RyanM said:


> I currently ride look keo max 2 pedals. They work fine for me but sometimes if I have to get going quick from a stop its hard to get into the pedal. Have been riding clipless a long time now and its only these look pedals that have ever given me an issue trying to clip in.
> 
> Would something like the speedplay pedals be easier to engage quickly?


I had a similar problem with the Look Keo (not Max) and missed cue a lot. 

However, the Mavic pedals work quite well for me and it often only takes 1 attempt to get in when starting off from a red light.

Also my brother changed from Look to Mavic and noticed the easy 'get in'.

However, the ****ing Mavic pedals wear fast (the composite material inset is crap) and after one year (even on new cleats) it now starts creaking like hell.

Caveat: the cleats have either 7 or 0 degree float. 7 is a lot but one get used to.


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## SteveInNJ (Aug 14, 2011)

Speedplay X2s, hands down (or zeros). Dual sided, high quality and durable. I have some knee issues but never on the bike.

I lube the cleats with a couple of drops of my chain lube about once every two weeks (I ride every day, 150-200 miles per week). If I ride in the rain I just lube the cleats before the next ride. I never have issues clipping in.


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## decoboy (Aug 9, 2011)

Reporting back on my mods to the Keo Max, Firstly I ground down the rubber 'grips' on the cleat, this made a significant improvement, although they are of course a bit slipperier to walk in. The other was to use a small weight to bring the pedal closer to vertical, it's now at about 10 deg rather than 30 deg backwards. This combo works way better, I have since replaced the grip cleats with the 'standard' cleats - these have Teflon friction pads which are probably superior. BTW, I had to go flash and used a piece of tungsten carbide (almost as heavy as lead). It was an old solid carbide grinding bit about 1/4' in diameter and just the right length to fit near the spring without fouling anything. Anyway - suddenly I have a 75% first hit getting my foot in. Sure it doesn't matter when your racing, but training in traffic , takeoff in a bunch, uphill starts etc - easy, reliable entry is a very important factor.


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