# 585 fitting yet again...



## texass4 (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok, now it's my turn for sizing help. After about 6 months of frame shopping and comparisons, I have decided to get a 585, but am not quite sure which size would suit my needs the best. First, the numbers:

Me: 5' 10" height with approx. 33 inseam. Proportional body shape for the most part.

My current everyday rig is a Trek 2100 with a 100mm stem. I'm unsure at the moment how many spacers I have, but i'd say about 3-4cm. Here are the frame specs:
Head angle = 73.8
Seat angle = 73.5
Eff TT = 56
Headtube = 14.1
____
From the BB to the middle of the saddle (along the seat tube) = 73cm
From the tip of the saddle to the middle of the bar = 53cm.
From the ground to the middle of the bar = 93cm.

I feel like this bike fits me OK. However, my limited skill in judging frame geometry tells me that it's probably about as long as I would want to go without the saddle being too far forward and running a very short stem.

The 585 is close in every frame dimension listed above. In the same order, here are those numbers for reference: 73, 73.75, 56, 15.6.

Also, I followed this thread where the OP is roughly the same size as me, maybe a half inch shorter. The recommendations there were for him to get a Medium frame, but he mentioned that he wanted a very aggressive fit. I hardly ever race anymore, but ride between 150-200 miles a week and still enjoy joining in weekly hammerfests and training rides with some of the local groups. I don't really want excessive bar drop, but am in good shape and am fairly flexible, so I don't need to be bolt upright either.

The only local Look dealer has just one Large 585. They don't allow test rides of any distance outside the parking lot, and are not terribly interested in pre-purchase fitting, so I want to be well-informed before making my decision. They say that this bike will fit well, but I'm sort of wondering if the Medium might be a little better for me. I'm wondering if the steeper STA and taller HT will make this frame effectively longer than what I currently have.

If it helps, another shop measured me about a year ago, and recommended a 56cm CAAD8 or Trek frame, while another "eyeballed" me on a 54cm Madone. I tend to think, primarily on vertical height alone, that the Madone would give me way too much bar drop.

Is there any other information that would be helpful? Any advice would be sincerely appreciated.


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## rmadore (Apr 29, 2007)

*Owner of a large 585*

Texass...

I was one of the posters in that thread - I just received my large two weeks ago and had the same concerns you did. i ride the same miles you do. i have the same inseam as you and i am 5' 11". my large 585 came with 1.5 cm of spacers on the head tube originally. i removed them as i felt too high up front and now am running without spacers. I just measured mine as it is now without spacers - floor to top of the bar is 92 cm. I have a 110 stem and my saddle tip to center of the bar is 55 cm - but i have the seat set a bit back on the rails - almost as far back as it will go - so you'll be able to get the saddle tip to 53 cm. the saddle i have is a selle italia trans am (28 cm long) - i mention this because it may be a cm or 2 longer than a saddle you might consider. 
I have the seat at 73.5 cm BB to seat top. I can say that this is comfortable to me now - but i do like a bit of a drop - the look HT is a bit on the tall side compared to a fonsdriest that i had been riding - hence no spacers - my guess is that compared to the trek geometry the front end may feel a bit "big" to you initially. let me know if you want any more measurements or details.......
good luck and post a pic when you get it!


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## zhmontana (Aug 16, 2004)

i am 5'10" ~33" cycling inseam and just purchased a 55cm look. I have a 76.5cm BB to seat top and a 100mm stem and 3cm of spacers. My other ride is a 58cm trek madone and as set up the fit is identical.


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## CaseLawZ28 (Jul 14, 2005)

I was the OP in that thread. FYI - my inseam is 1.25 inches longer than yours and I'm shorter than you. Don't use me as gospel for yourself. There was someone else who posted in that thread who had the same height and inseam as you - don't know about the rest of their measurements though.


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## andrew.wetdog (Apr 14, 2007)

I am 5' 10.25" with an inseam of 32.75". I purchased a Large 565 (same geometry as 585). I would have got the Medium with a longer stem if I wanted a very racy position with a lot of drop to handlebars. The Large 565 is great for me (no racing) and still has plenty drop to the bars. Currently using 2 cm of spacers.


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## h20dog73 (Aug 24, 2007)

I tracked down this thread because I'm looking at a 585 or 565 by the end of this season. I'm 70.5in and ride pretty much the same geometry as rmadore. My initial thought was an XL, since it has basically the same horz. TT as my Trek (58cm). However, the "real world" numbers off of rmadore's L are nearly the same as my Trek. Glad I checked here first. By the way Wetdog, what does the scale say when you put your 565 on it?


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## andrew.wetdog (Apr 14, 2007)

The bathroom scale tells me ~17# or a little over. I wish I had more accurate measurement tool, maybe next time I go the LBS. I figure the only way to get my bike lighter would be a higher-end wheelset.


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## h20dog73 (Aug 24, 2007)

...they look pretty high end to me. 17#'s works for me. Since I've got your undivided attention, what is your bar height off the ground? Seat tip to bar? BB to top of seat?


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## andrew.wetdog (Apr 14, 2007)

h20dog73 said:


> ...they look pretty high end to me. 17#'s works for me. Since I've got your undivided attention, what is your bar height off the ground? Seat tip to bar? BB to top of seat?


My measurements...
ground to bar center: 89cm 
seat tip to bar center: 54cm
seat top to center BB: 76cm 

I like the fit but am not an expert on the matter. This is my first serious road bike which I've had for about a month and after over 300 miles the fit feels great for my recreational purposes. My knowledge base for frame sizing came from about 10 different LBS visits and countless hours of internet surfing about road bikes and sizing. The scirocco wheels are relatively light and not cheap. The higher-end wheelsets I was refering to would be the $1000 variety which I can't afford and don't deserve.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*comparison...*

To get the bar height you want with a typical 84 degree stem, you'll need a total head tube length, with the headset and spacers, of 210mm. The 55cm (size L) would require 40mm of spacer to get that length. 30mm is generally considered the maximum (and what comes with the frame). To get the extra height you need, you could flip an 84 degree stem to 96 degree and only use 2cm of spacer.

The reach on the 55cm would only be a few millimeters longer, due to the slightly steeper STA.

FWIW, a 53cm distance from the saddle tip to center of bars is quite short for your height. I'm riding a 51cm 585 with a 110mm stem and I've got the same saddle tip center of bars dimension. I'm only 5'-6" tall, with long legs (73cm saddle height) and a short torso.

I rarely rely on anyone's posting of inseam for frame sizing. An 84cm cycling inseam (not pants inseam) would be pretty short for your height. An actual saddle height would be more helpful. I'd be surprised if it was only 74cm (approximate for a 84cm inseam).


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## texass4 (Oct 13, 2005)

C-40 said:


> To get the bar height you want with a typical 84 degree stem, you'll need a total head tube length, with the headset and spacers, of 210mm. The 55cm (size L) would require 40mm of spacer to get that length. 30mm is generally considered the maximum (and what comes with the frame). To get the extra height you need, you could flip an 84 degree stem to 96 degree and only use 2cm of spacer.
> 
> The reach on the 55cm would only be a few millimeters longer, due to the slightly steeper STA.
> 
> ...


I'll have to double check and see that I measured the seat-tip of bar length correctly when I get home, but this looks promising. I think I may be able to make this frame fit quite well after all. I honestly wouldn't mind a little extra drop on the tops and hoods, but when I'm low, I feel right about at the limit of where I would like to be. My current bars have a 145mm drop, so maybe I could just swap to a set of shallow drop Newton bars to compensate for the difference.

This also leads me to suspect that I could possible open up more stem/bar/spacer options on the slightly shorter and taller Optimum geometry that has been hinted at around here for the past few weeks. 

Hmm...intriguing. Thanks much to all for the advice. I'll be sure to post pics when I make a decision.


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