# New Toy - Greg Lemond



## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

I picked up a new bike today and thought I'd share. I made quite the trek across the state to pick it up from a guy who quit biking in 98-99 and has retired so he's selling his bike stuff so he can move to the beach (lucky guy). As you can see it's not NOS minty fresh but I think it'll cleanup OK with some love. 

I've done a little research online and from what I can tell it's a 1990 made by Billato. I haven't found anything factual such as a catalog so if anyone has any info feel free to jump in. I'm actually interested to know what components it would have come with. The frame is TSX tubing, the components are Campy but I'm not 100% sure what series. The only real bummer is that the back wheel doesn't match, not even sure what it is. I texted the owner and he said he'd see if he still has the stock wheel, he wasn't sure what came on it since he said he has multiple wheelsets. The front is a Mavic Open 4 CD rim on a Record hub. 

I've gotta figure out a few things on it. The chrome chainstay needs some love, I can't tell yet if it's just tar/bugs/gunk or rust but I think it might be rust. As I said the rear wheel is a mismatch, and the front rim needs replaced. Also, the Concor seat is mega-comfy but it's pretty worn. Haven't decided yet if I want to try to put it back to period correct prettiness or just make it a good rider. What do you guys think?




































































































and my other beater


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

Nice find. Here is a link to a discussion about the same bike in 2005. Seemed to be some debate if it was specd with Mavic components or not. This picture shows the C-Record components that should have been stock. Sort of answers that debate six years later. Very nice find with some historical significance.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/retro-classic/greg-lemond-team-z-retro-classic-question-39538.html


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

You did good......I love Team Z frames


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

If you google Lemond Team-Z and look at the google images, you will see him and his team mates are riding the c-record bikes. The only images that show the mavic parts are the guy's bike from the Serotta forum who is positive he is right.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

Thanks man! I was reading that thread earlier and those are the exact same frame as mine but all three bikes have different component setups. That isn't really that surprising after reading of Lemond's bikes. They all seems to be built with nice parts but it's like he'd buy a couple hundred of these, a couple hundred of those and whatever was in stock at the time is what went on the frame that was on the building block (most likely the company giving him the best price at the time). Who knows though, it wouldn't be uncommon for a bike shop to swap out a groupset to adjust a price or make a customer happy, or maybe build a bare frame however a customer wanted it.


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## Big-foot (Dec 14, 2002)

The crank isn't C-Record. C-Record had the 5th chain-ring attachment boss built into the back of the crank arm. I think it's Chorus.


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

The cranks are Chorus, but the delta brakes and levers are definitely C Record.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

zacolnago said:


> The cranks are Chorus, but the delta brakes and levers are definitely C Record.


Thank you, that answers one of my questions. I didn't think it was Record but wasn't sure how to tell what it is. I assume it would have come with Record, so it must have been swapped out somewhere along the way. A lot can happen to a bike in 20 years. How do you determine what derailleurs they are? I don't see much of anything on them. I do notice that one shifter is slightly different than the other.


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

Great find. I agree that the crank is likely early Chorus. The LeMond/Mavic connection is his 1989 TdF win on a Bottechia that was Mavic equipped. The 1990 Z Team bikes were variously sourced and were Campy specced.

As to what was out there in the "consumer" market, again LeMonds from different times were sourced all over the place (even Calfee.) There really wasn't much consistency until the now defunct LeMond/Trek marriage (which, incidentally, ended like a lot of marriages - no shortage of rancor.)

I believe the difference in the shifters is that the right is Synchro


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

I asked the previous owner a little about where he bought it and he never gave the name of the shop but he did say he bought a bare frame and had them build it up. That would explain the Chorus crankset being there instead of Record. I think the plan for now is to clean it up real good and replace a few bits to make it ride better, but I'm not going to be terribly concerned with finding replacement parts that are correct down the the year.


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## High Gear (Mar 9, 2002)

Nice! The paint just screams the late 80's, early 90's. Super find!


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## TWB8s (Sep 18, 2003)

We sold a few of the TSX Lemond frames and maybe a pair of the Carbon versions. They were all frame and fork combos and the individual buying the bike determined the components. This was common practice back then. Most if not all european made frames came to us as frames whether they were from 10 Speed Drive, Ocshner, Torelli or where ever. Usually we'd build a bike with parts to allow for test drives and fitting. Usually they'd be the SL or 531 tubed frames and we'd put Athena or Chorus parts on since most people were buying at that price point. 

The only reasons I would change the Chorus crank is vanity or for the appropriate length.. I think it looks fine but it is your bike and your eye determines what you put on it. 

Nice find.


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## Peanya (Jun 12, 2008)

Very nice bike you have there! You can either keep the saddle that's on there, or simply buy a new Concor, as they're selling them again (very smart move)
Personally, I like silver wheels on older bikes, but it's a matter of personal preference. Gumwall tires are important tood.


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## merckxman (Jan 23, 2002)

What strikes me is how uninspired the FELT looks compared to the LeMond which is a great looking bike.


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## onespeedbiker (May 28, 2007)

russd32 said:


> Thank you, that answers one of my questions. I didn't think it was Record but wasn't sure how to tell what it is. I assume it would have come with Record, so it must have been swapped out somewhere along the way. A lot can happen to a bike in 20 years. How do you determine what derailleurs they are? I don't see much of anything on them. I do notice that one shifter is slightly different than the other.


Trying to piece together Campy components can be an art form; in your case most of the parts are 8 speed 1991-1994 Record (post C-Record). For instance, your rear derailleur looks to be a Chorus, but it is actually a late model (1991) Record. Not to hard to ID is the front derailleur is also Record. You can’t see the shifters, but that era Record had a barrel adjuster built into the right side. The seatpost and headset also look to be 1991 Record. Indeed the crank is C-Record Chorus, however this Chorus was held over until 1991. It’s very possible the original crank was damaged or another size was needed in a hurry. It was after that era (1995+), that ID became easier as the gruppo name was written on many of the parts.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

TWB8s said:


> We sold a few of the TSX Lemond frames and maybe a pair of the Carbon versions. They were all frame and fork combos and the individual buying the bike determined the components. This was common practice back then. Most if not all european made frames came to us as frames whether they were from 10 Speed Drive, Ocshner, Torelli or where ever. Usually we'd build a bike with parts to allow for test drives and fitting. Usually they'd be the SL or 531 tubed frames and we'd put Athena or Chorus parts on since most people were buying at that price point.
> 
> The only reasons I would change the Chorus crank is vanity or for the appropriate length.. I think it looks fine but it is your bike and your eye determines what you put on it.
> 
> Nice find.


That would explain the variety of setups out there. I don't think I'll worry about the cranks unless I come across a C-Record set cheap. I'd like to have them since they're sexy but I don't know if it would be worth the $$ to me. 



Peanya said:


> Very nice bike you have there! You can either keep the saddle that's on there, or simply buy a new Concor, as they're selling them again (very smart move)
> Personally, I like silver wheels on older bikes, but it's a matter of personal preference. Gumwall tires are important tood.


I saw that they are selling Concor's again, I may look into a white one someday. I'm torn on the wheels/gumwalls. I know they both fit the time period but I like the dark look. We'll see



merckxman said:


> What strikes me is how uninspired the FELT looks compared to the LeMond which is a great looking bike.


I know what you mean. The Felt is a blast to ride, it's fast and climbs like a mofo but it just doesn't scream "I'm totally effin' rad dude!!!!"


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

onespeedbiker said:


> Trying to piece together Campy components can be an art form; in your case most of the parts are 8 speed 1991-1994 Record (post C-Record). For instance, your rear derailleur looks to be a Chorus, but it is actually a late model (1991) Record. Not to hard to ID is the front derailleur is also Record. You can’t see the shifters, but that era Record had a barrel adjuster built into the right side. The seatpost and headset also look to be 1991 Record. Indeed the crank is C-Record Chorus, however this Chorus was held over until 1991. It’s very possible the original crank was damaged or another size was needed in a hurry. It was after that era (1995+), that ID became easier as the gruppo name was written on many of the parts.


Thanks man, that's good info to know. I have no clue how you can distinguish all that stuff but I'm glad someone can. I've never owned anything Campy and I've been looking at pictures online but all the parts look the same! haha

Just in looking around for some hubs or a wheelset is proving to be tricky. It appears that 7 speed stuff isn't all that common, as you mention. Luckily I heard from the previous owner again and he said he still have a bunch of wheels at his house. Next time he's back in the state he said he'd see what all he had to fit it. Since he's no longer into cycling hopefully I'll be able to buy another set from him.


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## onespeedbiker (May 28, 2007)

russd32 said:


> Thanks man, that's good info to know. I have no clue how you can distinguish all that stuff but I'm glad someone can. I've never owned anything Campy and I've been looking at pictures online but all the parts look the same! haha
> 
> Just in looking around for some hubs or a wheelset is proving to be tricky. It appears that 7 speed stuff isn't all that common, as you mention. Luckily I heard from the previous owner again and he said he still have a bunch of wheels at his house. Next time he's back in the state he said he'd see what all he had to fit it. Since he's no longer into cycling hopefully I'll be able to buy another set from him.


If your right shifter has a cable adjuster built in than you have 8 speed capability (measure the dropouts and see if it's 130mm). The Campagnolo Sychro system is complicated or simple depending on what you are trying to do with it. Inside the shifter is a color coded insert discussed here The Syncro Rainbow ~ tears for gears (you also should check the other pages referenced at the bottom of the page). The inserts were for compatibility with different derailleurs, speeds and freewheels. It turned out to be a colossal PITA and didn't work the well either. What is rarely talked about is what color insert was used for eight speeds. If you are running 7 speeds, you may have already be set up for 8 speeds, as the cog spacing is the same and all that is necessary is to adjust the derailleur wider for the 8th gear.


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## joco (Dec 7, 2010)

Awesome FIND!!


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

Thanks man! I took it out for a little ride yesterday after very little maintenance and overall it rode really well. The main issue as of now is the front rim. It's pretty much trashed, if you get on the brakes hard you feel thump thump thump like a warped rotor on a car. Other than that it was great, after I shot a little triflow on the derailleurs and shifters, and adjusted the rear cable a little they worked like a champ and was super smooth. I can't wait to see how it rides once it's all been gone through. 

Oh yeah, but Deltas don't stop worth a crap. Maybe the pad are hard or they just need adjusted. I came into a corner hot and almost took a grassy detour. haha

I might ride it a little here and there but I'm going to start accumulating some bits and pieces to blow it apart for a full cleaning, lube, new cables, bar tape, some polishing, maybe a seat. I'll post some pics once that starts.


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## roost812 (Aug 24, 2011)

looks good, should turn out great..


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## Fivethumbs (Jul 26, 2005)

My Bottecchia came with Deltas. They stopped like crap when brand new.


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## Andy69 (Jun 14, 2008)

sweet bike.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

Fivethumbs said:


> My Bottecchia came with Deltas. They stopped like crap when brand new.


Sounds like mine are working exactly how they're supposed to!


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

It's done! Still have a few little things to clean up. Need to get the little ferrule thingy for the rear cable. Once I get that I'm going to replace the inner shifter cables and I'll solder the ends so they're all nice and pretty. Other than that she's done. Can't wait to put some more miles on it!


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## BLUE BOY (May 19, 2005)

I think you did a really good job with it. Well done.


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## EMR (Apr 5, 2002)

Looks great! Would a set of Scott Drop-in bars be period correct for this one?


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## BLUE BOY (May 19, 2005)

EMR said:


> Looks great! Would a set of Scott Drop-in bars be period correct for this one?


I believe so but hopefully he won't be able to find any.
Imo, he's got it dialed in at this point.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

EMR said:


> Looks great! Would a set of Scott Drop-in bars be period correct for this one?


Thanks guys! Scott Drop-In bars would be period correct and they'd be what Greg would have ridden but I decided against trying to track down a set since I'm actually going to ride it and I don't think I'd care for them.


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## High Gear (Mar 9, 2002)

Fantastic job Russ. I'll always have a special place in my heart for those late 80's colors, the time I started get heavy into cycling.


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## High Gear (Mar 9, 2002)

*Hears a pic of my new retro toy.*

I know at least a few % of you must ride mountain too.


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## bikerjulio (Jan 19, 2010)

Not sure which iteration of Deltas the OP has. I have used both early and late versions. The early ones I'd agree, don't work too well. My late versions work just fine. Obviously they have to be set up correctly & have decent pads. I'm using modern holders & pads with mine.

If they look like this, they are early version:










and these are late version:


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## raymonda (Jan 31, 2007)

What a sweet ride and a piece of history! I think there is a NOS team "Z" team jersey on ebay to match your ride. 

You should really get a lot of looks on club rides with this one. Ride it on sunny days and don't you dare take it out in the rain!


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## raymonda (Jan 31, 2007)

bikerjulio said:


> Not sure which iteration of Deltas the OP has. I have used both early and late versions. The early ones I'd agree, don't work too well. My late versions work just fine. Obviously they have to be set up correctly & have decent pads. I'm using modern holders & pads with mine.
> 
> If they look like this, they are early version:
> 
> ...


I see! Give me a lever long enough and I can move the world!


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

Mine are the later version but they have the 3 pivots like the first ones instead of the 5 pivots. They don't stop too bad, not quite as good as a modern brake but they'll bring you to a stop.


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## zacolnago (Feb 15, 2006)

Just perfect!


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## todayilearned (Sep 28, 2011)

Wow, it looks great.

What saddle is that?


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## nickillus (May 3, 2006)

That is a great looking bike! Enjoy.


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## bushpig (Jun 24, 2006)

Cool bike. Cool build. I'd really like to find one of those in my size one day.


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## russd32 (Aug 25, 2011)

todayilearned said:


> Wow, it looks great.
> 
> What saddle is that?


Thanks again guys. The saddle is a San China Regal. I might buy a nicer saddle for it one of these days if I find a Regal, Concor, or Flite in white for a good price. But, it's not going to get a ton of miles put on it so honestly this one will probably be fine. Buying the real deal would mainly be for bling factor.


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## Andy STi (Sep 13, 2009)

Looks great. Love the white Regal and tape. Record hubs with Open 4CDs = Nice!!


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## didittelove (Jan 4, 2012)

I disagree about previous ID of crank... I think that's a 1993 Athena. '91 Chorus spider arms are more curved (conical?) while 91 athena are just like that (flattish).

Also from the last pic rear hub isn't 90s record.


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## OperaLover (Jan 20, 2002)

Stunning!


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## EWT (Jul 3, 2011)

What other brands did Ten Speed Drive import? I still have an old Tommasso I raced on in the mid 80s and they also brought over Guerciotti in that same era which looked like a Tommasso with a different paint scheme (or maybe vice versa).


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