# a decent crushed limestone trail bike.



## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

So I've got this 2008 Sirrus bike frame with carbon fork and carbon back end. I'd like to build it up into a decent crushed limestone trail bike. 

Where do I start? 

What's important? 

I'd like to end up with a flat bar, 21 or 24 speed, decent components, but not knock your socks off price. 

What can I use as a guide? A Bianchi Axis? 
Here's a pic


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

SRAM Rival ( you could use SRAM MTB shifters on a flat bar), 

Maybe even an SRAM 9 speed MTB mini group - shifters and derailleurs.

handbuilt 32 spoke wheels - DT Competitions - single butted - 3 cross build

Aluminium box section rims

I would personally go tubulars like the Vittoria Pave in a 27 - run them at about 80 to 85 PSI.

If you want clinchers - go with a nice squishy 28 like a Conti GP 4 Season - run them comfy - 85 to 90 lbs.

That will give you a gorgeous, comfy gravel cruiser.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Windermere,

That's exactly what I am looking for...

Thanks....

P.S. Any other suggestions?


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

Sorry - I just noticed the Canti bosses.

Get the Shimano canti brakes - they are cheap. They work like a charm and they are really easy to set up and adjust.

There are lots of more expensive options - but for what you want - get the Shimanos.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Windermere said:


> Sorry - I just noticed the Canti bosses.
> 
> Get the Shimano canti brakes - they are cheap. They work like a charm and they are really easy to set up and adjust.
> 
> There are lots of more expensive options - but for what you want - get the Shimanos.


Opps... okay, that's what I'll look for then...


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## m_s (Nov 20, 2007)

SRAM mountain shifters can't be used with road stuff with the exception of XX, which is $$$. I would go full SRAM mountain group or perhaps 9 speed shimano. Maybe look at an XT or LX trekking crankset, depending on your gearing needs.

I do think some sort of handbuilt 32 or 36 spoke wheel makes the most sense.


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## m_s (Nov 20, 2007)

Double post


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

m_s said:


> Jesus Christ


Can you suggest a 700C Mavic rim for the Sirrus? 

Thanks...


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

depending on whether you want clinchers or tubulars

Clincher - Mavic Open Pro

Tubular - Mavic Reflex


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

I think tubular... 

Is this what you meant...

http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=142

Is there a black rim that you could suggest? 

Thanks....


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

Those would work just fine.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Can you suggest a black rim? 

Thanks...


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Get this crankset in compact drive 110 bolt circle -
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=18393
It comes with 34/50 rings. If they're not right, try 39/46 - more like cyclocross gearing.
Use a DuraAce BB unit with it -
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=35354

That's what I have on my dirt road bike.


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

Kinlin TB-25

Velocity Pro Elite

Ambrosio Cronos FC ( My choice of these 3 - not black but dark grey)


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Mike T. said:


> Get this crankset in compact drive 110 bolt circle -
> http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=18393
> It comes with 34/50 rings. If they're not right, try 39/46 - more like cyclocross gearing.
> Use a DuraAce BB unit with it -
> ...


Ohhh yea... good information.. especially the BB. I didn't know where to start with that...


Thanks Mike!


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Windermere said:


> Kinlin TB-25
> 
> Velocity Pro Elite
> 
> Ambrosio Cronos FC ( My choice of these 3 - not black but dark grey)


http://www.wheelbuilder.com/store/velocity-pro-elite-tubular-wheelset.html looks good!!!

The Kinlin website didn't make much sense to me...

And I couldn't find the Ambrosio Cronos FC at all...


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

mikeschn said:


> I think tubular...
> 
> Is this what you meant...
> 
> ...


Tubulars for a rock trail bike?


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

California L33 said:


> Tubulars for a rock trail bike?


Why not? I really am not up to speed on this stuff... so please tell me what I should be using, and why I should be using it...

Thanks...


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## Guest (Feb 4, 2010)

California L33 said:


> Tubulars for a rock trail bike?


Yes, the best possible choice.

A wide range of higher volume tires available, little to no chance of pinch flatting and the ability to run them soft.

The only tire I will use on roads like that, for the last 3 decades or so.


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## SantaCruz (Mar 22, 2002)

The new wheel tech that might be appropriate for crushed limestone = tubeless clincher.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

If you go for Canti-Levers the Shimano BR-550 are great, cheap and nice.

It would match perfectly a Shimano 105 5600 or an Ultegra 6600 group.

Get your wheels built with 32 spokes 3 cross and touring rims.

The Mavic A319 ( 19c) are great and as they are wider, your 28c ( or 35c) tyres will be rounder and the CantiLevers will give you a better braking power than a narrow rim like the Open Pro ( 15c )


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## gomango (Aug 30, 2006)

This is a simple solution, and not so expensive. 2003 Axis with:

105 hubs/Aerohead clinchers/Ritchey Speedmax's - They are super tough, light enough wheels that always work for me.










This is a go anywhere bike that I mainly use on fire roads, all-weather highways, light single tracks, and golf courses when no one is looking.


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## buck-50 (Sep 20, 2005)

It's a bike for crushed limestone paths fer christ's sake.

Drivetrain- simple and cheap. If yer crushed paths are anything like the ones I've seen, there aren't many actual hills. So you don't need a lot of gears. Go with a pre-built internal hub wheel. a 3 speed will probably give you all the gears you'll ever need.

Get a front wheel that mostly matches.

Crank? get something cheap and durable. You'll only need one chainring with the internal hub. Or go with some crazy full carbon crank.

Fenders. Wet crushed limestone makes a hell of a mess.

Good luck.


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## PeanutButterBreath (Dec 4, 2005)

You could go tubular if you want and I am sure that they would be great, but there are countless clincher options for CX and touring bikes that would work fine, cost less and give you more options and flexibility. I use tubulars for CX but probably wouldn't bother for dirt-road riding.

Just about any component group could handle the job, so you should start with any brand you prefer or price-point you want to hit.

Among canti brakes, Shimano's aren't particularly well regarded. I would suggest at the Tektro CR720 (with pads upgraded to Koolstops). If you are going to use flat bars, MTB levers and V-brakes are an easy option. Cantis can work great, but they can also be a hassle to set-up properly.


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## FatTireFred (Jan 31, 2005)

mikeschn said:


> Why not?





a set of (good) tubular wheels will be worth/cost more than that frame... without tires. that frame is that same as those on $500-600 complete bikes, right?


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## weltyed (Feb 6, 2004)

heck, i run tiagra shifters with lx rear and 105 front mechs. avid bb7 brakes and mavic a317 rims.it is a good crushed limestone trail bike. also use it to haul The Kids in teh bike trailer.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Well, I know it's a real slow start... but I got the tires for it.

















Next stop... wheels... probably Mavic CXP-22 or A319.

The tires say, "Mount only on hooked rims". What does that mean?


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## minstrie (Jun 13, 2005)

mikeschn said:


> The tires say, "Mount only on hooked rims". What does that mean?


Means mount them on rims for clinchers, the curled edge on those rims are "hooked." Don''t mount them (as if you could) on tubular rims.


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## arshak (Jun 13, 2005)

mikeschn said:


> Well, I know it's a real slow start... but I got the tires for it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Go with the A319. Like another poster previously said, they are wider and will not pinch flat and they are more comfortable than CXP22 which are narrower.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

arshak said:


> Go with the A319. Like another poster previously said, they are wider and will not pinch flat and they are more comfortable than CXP22 which are narrower.


Okay, I just ordered the A319's... Pictures next week!!!


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## SantaCruz (Mar 22, 2002)

I think Buck50 is right - crushed limestone paths can be messy in rain and dusty in dry, either way it is tough on chain/cogs/etc so simplicity is a good thing. For a multi-day tour, the ability to clean the drivetrain would be important. 

Old steel touring bikes (27" wheels) make GREAT limestone runners - must be the long chainstays or bigger tires.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Okay, here's where I am at so far...

I got the Mavic wheels on, new tubes and tires.. new carbon bar, carbon spacers, stem plug, etc... new cassette, new shifters...

Still need to swap out the seat, post, pedals, little stuff like that.


















































sorry the pics are not real clear tonight...


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

I got a chance to get out this evening with the built up Sirrus. It's a very comfortable ride. I'm running the tires with 40 PSI, and it still rolls reasonably fast, but it soaks up a lot of the noise. 

Whoever suggested the Mavic A319 was right... It's a good wheel for the job. And so are the tires...


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

This will be my last post on this bike, unless anyone has any comments or questions... 

I've been playing with the tire pressure, and this build looks to be very promising on the crushed limestone... 

Here are the final pics...


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

Great looking bike! My wife has that same bike with conventional road brakes and she loves it. It is hard to tell from your photos but are those SRAM road components on your bike? If so, I did the same thing that you have done, creating a flat bar road bike with my BMC CX02 using a SRAM Force/Red 10 speed road group. I absolutely love my double-tap flat bar shifters. I use it as my daily commuter. My roads are extremely rough so I went with large Specialized CX Borough tires (45mm). For their large size, they are very light weight and roll nicely on the slick center section but can actually do just fine if I want to take it off road. They replaced a set of Contis that just weren't big enough to get the job done. Your tires look as large as well. Can I ask you what size of Conti tires you went with and how much do they weigh? 

Have fun on it! :thumbsup: 

James




mikeschn said:


> This will be my last post on this bike, unless anyone has any comments or questions...
> 
> I've been playing with the tire pressure, and this build looks to be very promising on the crushed limestone...
> 
> Here are the final pics...


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Quattro_Assi_07 said:


> Great looking bike! My wife has that same bike with conventional road brakes and she loves it. It is hard to tell from your photos but are those SRAM road components on your bike? If so, I did the same thing that you have done, creating a flat bar road bike with my BMC CX02 using a SRAM Force/Red 10 speed road group. I absolutely love my double-tap flat bar shifters. I use it as my daily commuter. My roads are extremely rough so I went with large Specialized CX Borough tires (45mm). For their large size, they are very light weight and roll nicely on the slick center section but can actually do just fine if I want to take it off road. They replaced a set of Contis that just weren't big enough to get the job done. Your tires look as large as well. Can I ask you what size of Conti tires you went with and how much do they weigh?
> 
> Have fun on it! :thumbsup:
> 
> James


I'm surprised you got such large tires on your bike. I didn't look real close, but it didn't seem they would fit. Looking again, I see there is room for them...




















The Conti Travel Contacts I have on there are 37 x 700C. According to the web they weigh 660 grams. It's heavier than I am use to, but the comfort is worth it!!!

Mike


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

mikeschn said:


> I'm surprised you got such large tires on your bike. I didn't look real close, but it didn't seem they would fit. Looking again, I see there is room for them...
> The Conti Travel Contacts I have on there are 37 x 700C. According to the web they weigh 660 grams. It's heavier than I am use to, but the comfort is worth it!!!
> 
> Mike


Looks like you have plenty of room for larger tires, don't know if you need them as bad as I do. My roads really suck but when you want to ride as bad as I do, you'll do whatever it takes...

Here are shots of my tire clearance:

front...















back...
















the bike...









On my narrow rims the 45s actually measure 43mm. Specialized lists the tire's weight at 425grams. Probably when I get this bike back home, I'll swap out these Specialized tires for the original 32mm Sport Contact Contis.


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Good looking build... I looks like you just barely got those tires into the front fork! But I'll bet that's a good comfortable ride. 

Is your front fork Carbon fiber? That would add a lot of comfort. How about changing out your handlebars to carbon? That would be really plush! 

:thumbsup: 

Mike...


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

mikeschn said:


> Good looking build... I looks like you just barely got those tires into the front fork! But I'll bet that's a good comfortable ride.
> 
> Is your front fork Carbon fiber? That would add a lot of comfort. How about changing out your handlebars to carbon? That would be really plush!
> 
> ...


Hi Mike,

The photos are deceiving, there is plenty of room. So much so that I can run full fenders when it is raining. The fork is the top of the line Easton full carbon CX fork. I also have Ritchey carbon bars and stem and yes, it is very plush.










I have taken it off-road (nothing technical) and kept up with my buddy on his carbon hardtail mtb. All-in-all, it is a very fun ride. 

Best,

James


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Quattro_Assi_07 said:


> Hi Mike,
> 
> The photos are deceiving, there is plenty of room. So much so that I can run full fenders when it is raining. The fork is the top of the line Easton full carbon CX fork. I also have Ritchey carbon bars and stem and yes, it is very plush.
> 
> ...


I have the exact same handlebars on mine... Yep, it's really plush... 

It's been crappy weather the past few day, but it's supposed to get nicer out soon... (supposedly tomorrow). If it does I'll get out a get a pic for you. 

Did you ever try the Sammy Slick tires on your bike? Made by Schwalbe... 

Mikey


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*I don't like the sound*

of off-road
and plush due to carbon bars and stem
remember you have no suspension absorbing the vertical loads from bumps
that is all going to the bars, and somewhat the stem
make sure your stem is tightened to proper mfr spec'd tightness


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## Ibashii (Oct 23, 2002)

atpjunkie said:


> of off-road
> and plush due to carbon bars and stem
> remember you have no suspension absorbing the vertical loads from bumps
> that is all going to the bars, and somewhat the stem
> make sure your stem is tightened to proper mfr spec'd tightness


yeah...I flinched a bit at this too when I saw it. I'm no expert on this subject, but aren't carbon stems and flatbars for mtb's conceived with the idea of suspension to eat up much of the vertical load?

I stick with burly alu on my 'flat bar road bike' or whatever you want to call it...but maybe I'm being too careful.


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

*Huh?*



Ibashii said:


> yeah...I flinched a bit at this too when I saw it. I'm no expert on this subject, but aren't carbon stems and flatbars for mtb's conceived with the idea of suspension to eat up much of the vertical load?
> 
> I stick with burly alu on my 'flat bar road bike' or whatever you want to call it...but maybe I'm being too careful.


I said "nothing technical". I have dedicated mtbs for that, both with and without suspension. This is the first that I have heard that "carbon stems and flatbars for mtbs were conceived with the idea of suspension". My buddy's carbon hardtail is a Fisher Superfly 29er with ridgid 9Niner fork and Extralite carbon bars. Only on RBR...


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

mikeschn said:


> I have the exact same handlebars on mine... Yep, it's really plush...
> 
> It's been crappy weather the past few day, but it's supposed to get nicer out soon... (supposedly tomorrow). If it does I'll get out a get a pic for you.
> 
> ...


Hi Mikey,

Yes, I looked at the Sammy Slicks but they actually had more center tread than I was looking for. I wanted a slick that would see about 80% on-road usage. Also, I couldn't find any of the Sammys larger than 35mm. The Boroughs XC are 45mm but only weigh about 75 grams more. That's a very small weight penalty for a much larger tire and the extra comfort it affords me.

Have a great ride and enjoy the set-up you've got. That what this is all about, right? :thumbsup:


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Quattro_Assi_07 said:


> Hi Mikey,
> 
> Yes, I looked at the Sammy Slicks but they actually had more center tread than I was looking for. I wanted a slick that would see about 80% on-road usage. Also, I couldn't find any of the Sammys larger than 35mm. The Boroughs XC are 45mm but only weigh about 75 grams more. That's a very small weight penalty for a much larger tire and the extra comfort it affords me.
> 
> Have a great ride and enjoy the set-up you've got. That what this is all about, right? :thumbsup:


Opps, 

The weather got nice, 62 degrees, so I hit the local trail. There were some wet spots, but all in all, the trails dried up nicely, They were a little rough though. 

Meanwhile I forgot to take pics... opps. Sorry. It's too dark out now for pics. But I'll make it a high priority for tomorrow. 

Mikey

P.S. I didn't realize Sammy slicks were so narrow. :-(

P.P.S. I have those Borough XC tires on my Specialized Crosstrail...


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Okay, here's the pic I promised... 










Mikey


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Quattro_Assi_07, 

What are those red brake pad you are running on that BMC? 

Mikey


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

atpjunkie said:


> of off-road
> and plush due to carbon bars and stem
> remember you have no suspension absorbing the vertical loads from bumps
> that is all going to the bars, and somewhat the stem
> make sure your stem is tightened to proper mfr spec'd tightness


Thanks for the "advice" but I have been riding and wrenching since the early 80s. I think I know what I doing by now. I don't have the sheer volumn of posts as you but I don't spend every waking moment at my computer. I am out riding.


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

mikeschn said:


> Quattro_Assi_07,
> 
> What are those red brake pad you are running on that BMC?
> 
> Mikey


Hi Mikey,

The red pads are Ritchey Logic for wet and dry conditions. It is a transitional pad for me right now. We'll have a week of rain followed by a week of sand and dust storms, followed by more rain. As soon as we get out of this cycle and get consistantly dry, I'll change over to the black Ritchey (dry conditions) pads.

Best,

James


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## mikeschn (May 8, 2008)

Thanks James... 

Mikey!


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