# Michelin Pro4 Verdict After 4 Months



## Pitts Pilot (Dec 5, 2011)

I've ridden the GP4000s since they started making them - mostly in a 23, but more recently in a 25mm. At Christmas, I put on some Pro4 Service Course 25mm. I wrote some lengthy first impressions:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/ge...ourse-25mm-first-ride-impressions-278266.html

Now I've got about 1000 miles and 140,000 feet of climbing/descending on them (lots of rain) and I'm converted. I liked them a touch better than the GP4000s from the beginning, so what remained to be seen was durability and straight line traction on very steep, wet roads.

The front looks pretty much new. The rear is just a touch squared off with, unbelievably, no cuts at all. I would normally expect to see 3-4 good slices at this point on a new pair of Contis on the roads I ride. Super-long life isn't a priority for me, so as long as they avoid flats, which they are convincing me they will, then I'm fine from a durability standpoint. The sidewalls and logo clean up nicely and still look sharp.

I might give a very slight advantage in perceived traction while climbing to the GP4000s, but have no real way to confirm this and it's slight enough in my mind to be outweighed by what I like in the Pro4. The only straightline slips I've gotten were on wet, silly-steep stuff (>20%) or situations where GP4000s does the same thing - like moss or getting on the rear brake too hard.

On my HED C2 (23mm) rims, they measure a whopping 29mm. Those with tight clearance take note. I may consider trying a Pro4 Comp in a 23mm up front and hoping it measures 25 for a titchy aero benifit, but maybe not, as I REALLY like the additional confidence I'm feeling on blazing descents. I think this is due to the width, however, and not the switch from GP4000s to Pro4. The Conti in a 25mm is also really confidence inspiring on descents.

Both great tires - but I predict that I'm now on the Pro4 for a LONG time. My buddy just put a set on a couple weeks ago and he keeps saying what I have for the last few months. "Damn! I love these tires." - Definitely worth a try.


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## early one (Jul 20, 2010)

Are you still running "87psi rear and 82 front".


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## framesti (Jan 26, 2009)

have you compared with pro race 3?


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## tarwheel2 (Jul 7, 2005)

Thanks for the update. Do you know how wide the Mich Pro4 25s are when running on rims like Open Pros? I used to be a diehard Michelin fan but but quit using them with the Pro3 version, switching to Conti GP 4000s and 4 Seasons. However, one of the things I always liked about Michelins was the wider profile. My Michi Pro2 25s were a whopping 27-28 mm wide on Open Pro rims, and always liked the way the Michelins rode.

One of the things I dislike about Conti tires is that they all seem to run narrower than the advertised width. My Conti GP 4 Season 28s only measure about 26 mm wide on Open Pros, and their 25s run about 24 mm wide. I've had the same issue with Vittoria Rubinos.


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## cwdzoot (Oct 16, 2005)

framesti said:


> have you compared with pro race 3?


I found the Pro4 to be a better tire in quite a few ways to the Pro3. I have a detailed review here Glory Cycles Product Reviews: Michelin Pro 4 Service Course Clincher Review

Pro4 seems to not ride as hard and feels better in the wet for sure.


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## Dg designs (Jun 24, 2012)

Did my first ride today on the Pro4 SC 25's. First the technicals. One weighed 224, one 229, not very close to the 215 on the box but whatever. Trying to get past the weight weenie thing. As far as the width goes i had been running GP4000s 25s which mounted up at right about 26 mm on my Spinergy wheels. I found just the opposite of what i have been reading in that the Pro4 was only at 25.5. Now on to the subjective stuff. I was doing a ride i have never done today so not really pushing. I did feel more connected to the road and the ride was smoother even at a slightly higher pressure. i normally go 90/95 but bumped it up a bit since they were narrower and i was paranoid. Ill back it off as i get more time on the tires. Only question mark is the wear. I got about 1500 out of the Contis but never rotated them so the back was badly flattened out. Wont be making that mistake with these. Over all very impressed though. BY the way also easy to mount, no levers needed.



tarwheel2 said:


> Thanks for the update. Do you know how wide the Mich Pro4 25s are when running on rims like Open Pros? I used to be a diehard Michelin fan but but quit using them with the Pro3 version, switching to Conti GP 4000s and 4 Seasons. However, one of the things I always liked about Michelins was the wider profile. My Michi Pro2 25s were a whopping 27-28 mm wide on Open Pro rims, and always liked the way the Michelins rode.
> 
> One of the things I dislike about Conti tires is that they all seem to run narrower than the advertised width. My Conti GP 4 Season 28s only measure about 26 mm wide on Open Pros, and their 25s run about 24 mm wide. I've had the same issue with Vittoria Rubinos.


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## AndyMc2006 (Oct 27, 2006)

I rode the pro 25 mm and i liked but they got to many flats so after about 1500 mi I switched to the endurance and they were great. I am 6 ft 4" 255lbs so I go through tires fast. I bought a new bike and it came with an upgrade to Vittoria Rubino Pro Slick, only 2 rides, I like that I can inflate these 25's up to 130 psi, although so far only rode at 120.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

Dg designs said:


> ..Pro4 SC 25's. First the technicals. One weighed 224, one 229, not very close to the 215 on the box but whatever. .. I got about 1500 out of the Contis but never rotated them so the back was badly flattened out. Wont be making that mistake with these. ...


Data point: I have two 23mm Pro 4s that I weighed and they're 205 gm each. Don't know what the advertised weight is.

As far as rotating tires, my suggestion would be to wear out the rear, move the front tire to the rear and put a new one on the front. That keeps the best rubber on the front where it is arguably most critical.


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## Kumachan (Jan 15, 2013)

Used to ride Pro3, now using Pro4. 
4 feels a little bit harder but overall I am loving these tires; The love started straight from Pro3  Continental on another bike are not even close in means of rolling although are very strong and durable.


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## Typetwelve (Jul 1, 2012)

I rode Pro 4 SC all last summer...call it luck but no flats. I loved the ride, ran a 23mm on a 23mm wheel and I found the comfort level to be top notch. Often ran them at 90psi (175lb rider) and they were great. I swap wheelsets and my other set has Conti GP4000s on it...really, I can't tell little difference between the two.


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## Newnan3 (Jul 8, 2011)

I switched from the Conti GP4000s to the Pro4 SC a few months ago. They do ride a little bit smoother IMO. I see what people mean when they say the Contis feel "dead." 

Ill be sticking with the Pro4s for now and going with the Contis in the winter.


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## dton13 (Jul 15, 2013)

Can anyone comment on the actual width of the Pro4 SC 23mm on a narrow rim? I've seen a lot of comments on how the 25's run very wide (>27mm) but nothing on the 23. Do they run true to size or closer to an actual 25?

Thanks!


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## phoehn9111 (May 11, 2005)

I have a Pro4 Service COMP which I am going to use on my front
to test when the Pro4 Svc wears out. They are supposed to be
7% less rolling resistance. More expensive, but if it holds up I will
try one on the rear. Hey, I need all the help I can get.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

IMO, the only tire better than the Pro 4 is the Vittoria Open Corsa EVO CX but it's expensive and wears quickly so the Pro 4 wins.


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## metalheart (Sep 3, 2010)

I bought the Pro 4 Service Course in 25mm in January. I have only ridden about 2k so far and I have had 4 different flats. Previously I have used Conti 4000s and in 7k miles last year I had one flat from a pile of glass I ran through. the ride of the Pro 4's are nice, but they are not the tire for me. I may try the Schwable One or just return to the Contis.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

What caused those 4 flats?


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## metalheart (Sep 3, 2010)

looigi said:


> What caused those 4 flats?


All four were punctures from road debris. The tires seem to have more cuts from riding the same roads, but then road debris varies with the season. Maybe it is just bad timing, but I am going to try other tires and see what happens. They do ride nicely.....


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

Yeah. So far, the 4s seem significantly better than the 3s with respect to tread rubber getting cuts and flatting. I wore out 8 Pro3s and damaged 2 beyond repair. Most flats were due to small sharp shards that got stuck in the rubber and worked their way through the cords and tubes over many rotations. One year I'd have a ton of flats and the next hardly any. A lot of statistical fluctuation.


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## Bill2 (Oct 14, 2007)

I put a Pro 4 Endurance on the rear late last summer and it still looks nearly new despite my abuse (lots of rock and gravel roads). Last weekend I finally put the matching Pro 4 Endur on the front. So far these are much better than Axial Pros, Pro 3, Lithions.


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## tapirosaur (May 19, 2011)

my 2014 Pro4 Service Course 700 x25 tires lasted officially 2100 miles. Actually the rear tire is still working fine and probably has another 500-1000 miles of tread left on it, but the front tire which has even more tread left has had one big sidewall cut and one big puncture in the middle of the tread. I booted the puncture but booting the sidewall didn't work because the gash was 3-4mm long. FYI - the 25mm runs even wider if you have wide profile rims, I have the HED Ardennes Plus and the tires measured a whopping 30mm using calipers! They barely fit my frame. If you ride on good roads, I highly recommend these tires, really good grip and very comfy. I ran around 78/80 psi on them since I only weight 60kg. But I ride on some pretty rough roads around here so I'm going to switch to the Conti 4000S II, hopefully the vectran sidewall will do better against cuts and sharp objects


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## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

I've ridden 4000s and now 4000sII for years. 

I picked up a pair of Service Course Pro4's on sale for $50.

I can't tell the difference, strangely enough. So far I have about 2200 miles on the Pro4's. They feel and perform exactly like my 4000s's as far as I can tell. 

Both 23's.

(I feel faster on the Pro4's, but I'm guessing that's in my head)

So overall I'm very pleasantly surprised and others in my shop are taking notice. 
(they all ride conti.)


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## upstateSC-rider (Aug 21, 2004)

tapirosaur said:


> my 2014 Pro4 Service Course 700 x25 tires lasted officially 2100 miles. Actually the rear tire is still working fine and probably has another 500-1000 miles of tread left on it, but the front tire which has even more tread left has had one big sidewall cut and one big puncture in the middle of the tread. I booted the puncture but booting the sidewall didn't work because the gash was 3-4mm long. FYI - the 25mm runs even wider if you have wide profile rims,* I have the HED Ardennes Plus and the tires measured a whopping 30mm using calipers!* They barely fit my frame. If you ride on good roads, I highly recommend these tires, really good grip and very comfy. I ran around 78/80 psi on them since I only weight 60kg. But I ride on some pretty rough roads around here so I'm going to switch to the Conti 4000S II, hopefully the vectran sidewall will do better against cuts and sharp objects


That is seriously wide, I would've guessed 27 or so. I wanted to try the Endurance 25's on my Advanced TCR...better not.


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## morgan1819 (Nov 22, 2005)

My 25c Michelin Pro 4 Race measure 29mm on a Pacenti SL23 rim. (23mm rim). It just fits on the back of my Scott CR1 Pro... 

Really good all around tire, after 600 miles of use. Construction quality is very good, and wear seems really good so far, especially for a tire with the 'race' designation. Rides better than any tire I've used, other than the paper thin Vitt Corsa Evo Pro/Veloflex Master/etc., style tire.


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## farva (Jun 24, 2005)

morgan1819 said:


> My 25c Michelin Pro 4 Race measure 29mm on a Pacenti SL23 rim. (23mm rim). It just fits on the back of my Scott CR1 Pro... .


What type of brakes are you running? How close in height is the tire to the brake arch? I wanted to run 28's (Hutchinson Sectors) on my bike & they fit fine laterally, but they were too tall for my sram force brake arch, leaving only a business card space gap. I later found out this setup doesn't work when you run over small road debris & it gets hung up in the gap. Hoping these "fatty" 25's maybe the ticket instead. 

alternately if you can tell me the combined height of inflated tire plus rim section I could extrapolate from there. Thanks


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## Scar (Sep 13, 2014)

dton13 said:


> Can anyone comment on the actual width of the Pro4 SC 23mm on a narrow rim? I've seen a lot of comments on how the 25's run very wide (>27mm) but nothing on the 23. Do they run true to size or closer to an actual 25?
> 
> Thanks!


Just for you, I measured both my Pro3s on one bike and Pro4s on the other bike. With the tires pumped to 110 psi these were the results:

Pro3 on a Dura Ace 7850 rim = 24.5 mm wide
Pro4 on a Mavic Ksyrium SR rim = 25 mm wide

Measurements taken with a Swiss made (non-digital) micrometer. Hope this helps.


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## Scar (Sep 13, 2014)

I have been riding 23mm Michelin ProRace service course tires since the ProRace 2. Overall the ride has been excellent and I have had exactly one flat on the road in those years. They don’t cut easily, are good in the wet and have decent service life (1500-1700 miles for the rear tire). They have always been my favorite bike tire.

Except I won’t be buying any more of them.

Starting with the Pro3s I began to get cracks, not road cuts, all around the tire. On most of the Pro3s they were small cracks, annoying but I put up with them for the ride quality. But the last couple of pair I put on were cracking within the first two weeks and quickly got worse. They work well but look awful. The latest Pro3 on the front wheel quickly developed a narrow split in the exact middle of the tread that is now almost completely around the entire tire. It sometimes catches tiny bits of gravel that I have to stop and brush off. These are the red sidewall tires, which I have been using on that particular bike since 2008 when I bought the first set of Pro3s that my shop got in. 

On my other bike I have been running black Pro4s. They are cracking also, although not as badly. On my wife’s oldest bike, which she rides only occasionally, are a pair of made-in-France Pro2s. Not one single crack anywhere on those tires even though they are several years old. The Pro2s that I used in the past on my bikes were also made in France and never cracked. My Pro3s and 4s are made in Thailand and every one develops cracks shortly after putting them in service. Michelin seems to have some quality issue at their manufacturing facility in Thailand. 

 Sad, since the ProRace has been my favorite tire for years. But when my current stash is gone they won’t be replaced.


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## bas (Jul 30, 2004)

metalheart said:


> I bought the Pro 4 Service Course in 25mm in January. I have only ridden about 2k so far and I have had 4 different flats. Previously I have used Conti 4000s and in 7k miles last year I had one flat from a pile of glass I ran through. the ride of the Pro 4's are nice, but they are not the tire for me. I may try the Schwable One or just return to the Contis.



I too have had very poor luck and keep flatting with these damn things, I'm so over there. Never had a problem like this with PR2. PR3 was close. But these PR4's are a flat nightmare.

I'm done with them.


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## BacDoc (Aug 1, 2011)

Scar said:


> I have been riding 23mm Michelin ProRace service course tires since the ProRace 2. Overall the ride has been excellent and I have had exactly one flat on the road in those years. They don’t cut easily, are good in the wet and have decent service life (1500-1700 miles for the rear tire). They have always been my favorite bike tire.
> 
> Except I won’t be buying any more of them.
> 
> ...


I know exactly what you are talking about! Last couple Michelin Pro tires started to show those cracks all over sidewalls. Rode the rear until really squared off and didn’t seem to affect ride or performance but very disturbing.


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## Finx (Oct 19, 2017)

BacDoc said:


> I know exactly what you are talking about! Last couple Michelin Pro tires started to show those cracks all over sidewalls. Rode the rear until really squared off and didn’t seem to affect ride or performance but very disturbing.


You do realize that the post you responded to is 5 years old dont you?


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## No Time Toulouse (Sep 7, 2016)

Finx said:


> You do realize that the post you responded to is 5 years old dont you?


In that case, I'll bet that they are even more cracked now....


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## BacDoc (Aug 1, 2011)

Finx said:


> You do realize that the post you responded to is 5 years old dont you?


Never even looked at the date of that post! Saw the thread, read some replies and his post was exactly what I noticed about Pro 4 tires that I used to run. 5 year old post so Michelin Pro 9 out now? 😎


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