# Where the bike telemetry vids at?



## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

Cool, nice to see someone else posting a video! That's a lot of Watts down University Ave. You need a GPS to get the map working of course.

I'm working on the dashboard layout right now. Sometime early in the New Year there will be a new version with a lot more flexibility for the screen display.


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

So ukbloke set us up with his bike telemetry program a couple of weeks ago. Anyone have any vids to share? I just got around to figuring out how to do this in quicktime. Here's the initial attempt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2PAeM0uEPo

Not a particularly good video (no Sun, fixie is the only bike I have where bike and powertap work at the moment) but I did like how traffic worked out that day motivationally speaking. It's also something other than ukbloke going up or down a mountain, not that we don't enjoy those


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

Thanks, one of these days I'll make it to middlefield before pulling the plug. It's really those couple of seconds at 450+ that zap me. Probably a yellow at the right moment on a good day will get me there.

Sorry for not showing off the full features of your software. I need to relace my wireless pt (which will let me use my edge 705). I didn't know it had offsets so I chopped the vid and power file up before I made the overlay. Playing with the offsets first to see how things match up and then chopping the video will be how I make the next one. I can do a writeup for you on how to do this in quicktime pro if you need it. Now that I know how to do it, adding the overlay probably takes less than a minute. This is probably still a big barrier to the uninitiated though.


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

dwgranda said:


> Sorry for not showing off the full features of your software. I need to relace my wireless pt (which will let me use my edge 705). I didn't know it had offsets so I chopped the vid and power file up before I made the overlay. Playing with the offsets first to see how things match up and then chopping the video will be how I make the next one. I can do a writeup for you on how to do this in quicktime pro if you need it. Now that I know how to do it, adding the overlay probably takes less than a minute. This is probably still a big barrier to the uninitiated though.


Understood. It sounds like you figured it all out without reading the instructions though!I recommend using the lap button to delineate the activity segments of interest, and then there are some simple techniques for getting a good sync between video and data as described on the web site. Maybe there will be some magic that can be done here to "auto-sync" some day. The thing that I rely on is that anyone who has bought a video camera and has a video editing suite has to have some knowledge in this area or desire to learn - working with video is non trivial in the first place.

A short write-up for Quicktime Pro would be really helpful. I'd like to add that content to the web site if that is OK with you. I can't test all suites and knowing the names of things, the settings to use and the buttons to push really helps other users.


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

ukbloke said:


> Understood. It sounds like you figured it all out without reading the instructions though!



Internet. Biking. Video. GPS. Power data. How many chicks do you think are going to be using this to read the instructions? 

Of course you can include the writeup on your website. If I get around to doing it, I also have Avid and Premier Pro. But I imagine most people who have those already know how to do this exercise.

I remember a discussion we had about syncing the data with ergo mode trainers. Even not syncing it was cool. I was watching my video this morning on the trainer and it made the time go by much faster.

Here's a cheap marketing suggestion. Of course if you hang out there during the summer, most people are going to prefer to ride outside.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgLLcgCfeQI


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

dwgranda said:


> Internet. Biking. Video. GPS. Power data.


Yes, I already realize that my target market demographic is nerd^5!


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

dwgranda said:


> Here's a cheap marketing suggestion. Of course if you hang out there during the summer, most people are going to prefer to ride outside.


Ha - thanks for the free advertising! I'll remember to use your for all my voice overs.

By the way, I think you need to point the camera down a little bit on your videos.


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## Dr_John (Oct 11, 2005)

> Yes, I already realize that my target market demographic is nerd^5!


 You need a team kit. I'm in. :thumbsup:


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

Dr_John said:


> You need a team kit. I'm in. :thumbsup:


Ha, actually we do have a T-shirt. But since they are hand-made by me and my 5 year old, we are not ready for mass production yet!


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## Zen_Turtle (Aug 19, 2010)

Completely forgot about this. I have the setup, just need to try it.

Is that power in the telemetry estimated or measured? Impressive.


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

Zen_Turtle said:


> Is that power in the telemetry estimated or measured? Impressive.


I'm not sure if your question was for me or ukbloke. His software takes the power data I provide which is coming from my powertap. I thought it was pretty cool how he does the gear ratio (presumably from speed and cadence). I don't have a cadence sensor on this bike, just the virtual cadence from the powertap, but because it's a fixed gear the cadence and speed will track like they are supposed to and you see the gear ratio reflect that with maybe a few dips because of rounding/data error.


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## Zen_Turtle (Aug 19, 2010)

dwgranda said:


> I'm not sure if your question was for me or ukbloke. His software takes the power data I provide which is coming from my powertap. I thought it was pretty cool how he does the gear ratio (presumably from speed and cadence). I don't have a cadence sensor on this bike, just the virtual cadence from the powertap, but because it's a fixed gear the cadence and speed will track like they are supposed to and you see the gear ratio reflect that with maybe a few dips because of rounding/data error.


Well you answered it. I don't have a power meter, but some software or sites like Strava can estimate it based on the other telemetry, such as speed, acceleration and elevation change.
Wondering if Bike-Telelmetry had that capability.

BTW a writeup/howto with Quicktime Pro would be awesome...


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

Zen_Turtle said:


> Wondering if Bike-Telelmetry had that capability.


Bike Telemetry has capability too, but it isn't ready for prime time. I've been testing it by looking at the "physics" number versus the actual PowerTap number on the screen. I was hoping that the delta between them would tell me something interesting. However, both numbers are so stochastic that this didn't make any sense and I disabled the feature for now. I can bring it back as a "virtual power" statistic, but users will need to be aware of the limitations of this approach. If you could calculate it reliably we wouldn't have to buy these expensive power meters (and before anyone mentions it, I know about iBike, and also Chung-on-a-stick for that matter).


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

dwgranda said:


> I'm not sure if your question was for me or ukbloke. His software takes the power data I provide which is coming from my powertap. I thought it was pretty cool how he does the gear ratio (presumably from speed and cadence). I don't have a cadence sensor on this bike, just the virtual cadence from the powertap, but because it's a fixed gear the cadence and speed will track like they are supposed to and you see the gear ratio reflect that with maybe a few dips because of rounding/data error.


If you configure the "Bike" menu correctly for a fixed gear, I can guarantee that Bike Telemetry will calculate the right gear ratio 100% of the time!!


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

The numbers aren't close even on the climbs? I think it's hopeless for the flats because of the aero component, especially around here. One needs only see something like this (look at speed 1st half vs 2nd half):

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/38638142


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## ukbloke (Sep 1, 2007)

I completely agree that aero is the biggest problem without some kind of sensor, and even then it is not easy. I wouldn't attempt to do any magic for that. Strava has virtual power, probably using the same math that I would use, and their numbers aren't credible most of the time.

On the climbs it should be good enough, once one dials in the right amount of smoothing. Certainly over the entire length of a "well-behaved" hill, it can be accurate down to less than 5%. The smoothing is necessary to smooth out the data from the barometric altimeter (by far the biggest Wattage component on a climb of course) which tends to jump around a bit even with the latest Garmins. A 4 foot gain versus a 5 foot gain is a 25% difference in power. After the averaging you will inevitably lose the stochastic nature of power which was the thing that I was trying compare at the time (for other reasons).


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

Yeah for the telemetry display it's probably a problem. I notice I get pretty consistent elevation readings with the 705 from bottom to top of a climb. But the inbetween stuff and matching that with speed at a particular point which will have an error from the GPS speed component as well, and I imagine you start approaching a random number generator.


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## Zen_Turtle (Aug 19, 2010)

*Ok, here's my attempt*

Warning: MTB content!!  
Thanks to Apple this was much easier than I thought.
Used QT7 Pro and took me just a few minutes. I had to figure out the transparency settings and not sure how I made them work.
The arrow in the map seems to be pointing in the wrong direction. there is less than 100ft elevation change, but it would have been nice if the elevation profile was scaled accordingly.
Other than that I think I want to play more with this on my CX bike, which also has cadence detector.
Amazed how high my HR was, but I think is more the excitement than the effort...  

I think i missed the sync by a few seconds, haven't figured out how to re-sync it in QT7.


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## dwgranda (Sep 8, 2009)

Awesome video! Very nice scenery.

Off the top of my head, the procedure I used in QT pro was.

1.)Open recorded video
2.) Open image sequence (Under file menu) and source the first picture that you got from Bike Telemetry pro. I don't know if this automatically opens up a new player but that's how I had it arranged
3.)"Select all" and "copy" the image sequence video that it made.
4.)Go to the player that has the recorded video. "Select all" then go to "edit->add selection and scale". It's going to look like the telemetry images with your recorded video blacked out.
5.)Got to "window->Show movie properties" Select the last item in the video list which I believe is the properties for the image sequence vid. There is a pull down that you need to select, I believe it is "tranparency" and select "straight alpha". Now your video should look like the ones we've made.
6.) Export the video (from file menu). Save will not work in merging the two.

I was going to say your vid looks a lot like when I visited Zion, then I saw the description on youtube


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