# Rear derailer touching spokes



## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

I have an '06 Specialized Allez Sport Triple. When I start to climb and try to get onto my large cog on my cassette, my RD touches my spokes. I of course quickly shift back up. 

It has the original Tiagra group. Is this mearly an adjustment issue?

Also, my FD will not throw my chain onto the smallest gear on my crank.

Please advise.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

Sounds like a bent derailleur hanger. Does it look like this?









This explains how to fix it. If you're handy, you can do it without all the tools.
Park Tool Co. » ParkTool Blog » Rear Derailleur Hanger Alignment

Your front derailleur probably just needs adjustment.
Park Tool Co. » ParkTool Blog » Front Derailleur Adjustments


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

Oh man, this isn't good news then on my RD. I sure hope I can bend it back if it is bent.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> Oh man, this isn't good news then on my RD. I sure hope I can bend it back if it is bent.


If it's not bent too bad (and your derailleur isn't damaged) you can replace the hanger. THey're made to be removeable for this reason. Check your LBS, ebay, or online. They're not that expensive.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

It fell over today while stopped on a ride.


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## FBinNY (Jan 24, 2009)

Until such time as you can straighten or replace the hanger, either Do not ride the bike or adjust the inner limit to ensure that the RD cannot reach the spokes, and that the chain cannot shift beyond the innermost sprocket. 

So far you only have the recipe for disaster (expensive repair) but if you ride the bike there's a good chance you make it happen.

There are lots of tutorials on gear adjustment which will help, so don't ignore this problem. 

BTW- if you're clumsy and tend to drop the bike, drop it so it falls to the left. decades ago I got into the habit of always leaning up my bike with the right side toward the wall. I don't even think about this anymore, just do it automatically. Leaning right side to wall means the big fall, if it happens is on the left side.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

Ok, this bothered me all night! I could hardly sleep. So first thing this morning I ran out to the garage and checked it. It does not look bent at all. The hanger looks perfectly straight. I even cranked it with the bike hanging and it does not touch. Its not until you really crank with some serious force or if you actually push the derailer in a bit with your finger, does it touch. So, I'm thinking that its just out of adjustment. 

Shweeeewww, y'all had me worried!


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> Its not until you really crank with some serious force or if you actually push the derailer in a bit with your finger, does it touch. So, I'm thinking that its just out of adjustment.


If the hanger is in fact straight, slightly adjusting the inner limit screw ("L") will do the trick.

I always adjust the scew in (clockwise) until the shift from the next-to-the largest cog to the largest cog is beginning to get a little ragged or hard to do, then bring the screw back out just enough until the shift is clean again. This way I'm sure the derailleur is kept as far away from the spokes as possible. To confirm that all is well, I do the thumb-push test while turning the crank. .


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> Ok, this bothered me all night! I could hardly sleep. So first thing this morning I ran out to the garage and checked it. It does not look bent at all. The hanger looks perfectly straight. I even cranked it with the bike hanging and it does not touch. Its not until you really crank with some serious force or if you actually push the derailer in a bit with your finger, does it touch. So, I'm thinking that its just out of adjustment.
> 
> Shweeeewww, y'all had me worried!


Uh, not so fast. If it was ok before and not after it fell over its bent. Limit screws dont go out of adjustment. Sorry.


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

Do try to adjust the low derailleur adjustment screw ... guide pulley positioned directly in line with the largest sprocket. Then crank it to see if the cage will still hit ... esp on yr largest chainring as that is when you have the most tension and the tension pulley is lowest/furthest forward.

If it still hits, then could be:

- bent cage
- bent hanger

Even if it looks straight, would be good to uninstall the derailleur and hanger and have a good look at it. Lay the hanger flat on a flat surface to make sure ... good luck ...


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

tihsepa said:


> Uh, not so fast. If it was ok before and not after it fell over its bent. Limit screws dont go out of adjustment. Sorry.




I just bought the bike and only rode it twice and do not remember doing this. I do not think its bent. It looks perfectly straight.


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

There are instances I have seen where it looks straight on the bike, but when you take the hanger out and place on a flat surface, you can see it is not ... unfortunately ...

They are designed to bend just so that in the case of a fall, you will damage that hanger instead of your more expensive derailleur ...


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

Bummer. You guys are really trying to damper my Friday! Joking.

I'm taking it to the local bike co-op where I volunteer and will be taking carbon it tomorrow.

I'm hoping, because the glass is always half full, that it's just out of adjustment. Wish me luck!


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> I'm hoping, because the glass is always half full, that it's just out of adjustment. Wish me luck!


Why not give the adjustment a try then and see if the problem disappears? It's quickly done and free.

Also keep in mind that a bent derailleur hanger is quickly and esily replaced. The frustration some people experience with with hangers is that can't find one to fit their bike. With your bike, shouldn't be a problem at all.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

tihsepa said:


> Uh, not so fast. If it was ok before and not after it fell over its bent. Limit screws dont go out of adjustment. Sorry.





Drummerboy1975 said:


> It fell over today while stopped on a ride.





Drummerboy1975 said:


> I just bought the bike and only rode it twice and do not remember doing this. I do not think its bent. It looks perfectly straight.


tihsepa is correct. It doesn't matter that you just bought the bike. You said it fell over today. All evidence (bike falling over and derailleur pushing into spokes) screams that something is bent. 



FBinNY said:


> BTW- if you're clumsy and tend to drop the bike, drop it so it falls to the left. decades ago I got into the habit of always leaning up my bike with the right side toward the wall.


Not just if you're clumsy. It's just the safest way to treat your bike. Someone else could always knock it over.
Same thing applies if you're laying your bike down in the grass. It should always go on its left side.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

As you can see, when your derailleur is in the top cog, there should be PLENTY of room between it and your spokes. If it were straight, there's no way an adjustment would cause it to rub the spokes. You'd be jumping off the cassette before the derailleur touched the spokes. The spokes are angled away from the hub.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

So I wonder of maybe my RD is bent as well?

If something is bent its from the previous owner, in that I watched it fall but was too far to stop it. When it landed it hit the pedal. 

Either way, I'll get it taken care of tomorrow.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> So I wonder of maybe my RD is bent as well?


Not likely. There's not much to bend on the derailleur. It would typically break before bending. This is the purpose of the derailleur hanger. It's meant to bend to protect the derailleur.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

tlg said:


> Not likely. There's not much to bend on the derailleur. It would typically break before bending. This is the purpose of the derailleur hanger. It's meant to bend to protect the derailleur.


Oh ok, well that's good news then. Thanks.


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## PoorCyclist (Oct 14, 2010)

Hi, I had a bike fell over not even a crash and although it didn't put anything into the spokes, it was unable to shift into the smallest cog, at that point I knew it was bent. Visually it looked lightly off but it was hard to tell. I brought it to the LBS and paid them $20 to use the alignment tool and they corrected it no problem since. 
I know most people just replace the hanger but I didn't want to bother tracking down when the LBS didn't say I need to.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

tlg said:


> As you can see, when your derailleur is in the top cog, there should be PLENTY of room between it and your spokes. If it were straight, there's no way an adjustment would cause it to rub the spokes. You'd be jumping off the cassette before the derailleur touched the spokes. The spokes are angled away from the hub.


Theres only one problem with the picture. The chain isn't on the biggest gear which is closest to the wheel. I would like to see how close it is when all the way over.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> Theres only one problem with the picture. The chain isn't on the biggest gear which is closest to the wheel. I would like to see how close it is when all the way over.


Basically like this..


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## redondoaveb (Jan 16, 2011)

Drummerboy1975 said:


> Theres only one problem with the picture. The chain isn't on the biggest gear which is closest to the wheel. I would like to see how close it is when all the way over.


I can adjust my Red RD with the chain on the big cog over enough that the cage would hit the spokes. When my RD is adjusted properly, the cage sits about 2mm off the spokes. 

I would just take the bike to your LBS. They'll put an alignment tool on your derailleur hanger and check to see if the hanger is bent. If so, they'll straighten it. Takes just a few minutes. Not a big deal. If it's bent so bad that it needs to be replaced (very doubtful), they should be able to order one and install it in a few minutes also.

I'm sure most of us have been in your position before. Easy fix!


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

Yea I'm hoping its not bent and an adjustment will do, but if not no biggie.

Either way, we will have an answer tomorrow and I will let everyone know.


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## Drummerboy1975 (Mar 14, 2012)

The verdict is in- it just needed adjusting. Been riding it this morning and we are good to go.


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## Roy G. Biv (Feb 16, 2013)

I'm having the same problem, but the derailleur hanger doesn't seem bent. Here is a photo:
View attachment 275688


Maybe the wheel is not properly dished? Any suggestions are welcome. Thank you!


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## FBinNY (Jan 24, 2009)

The derailleur hanger is 100% absolutely, positively bent inward*. You can clearly see that the cage is more inboard at the bottom, and there's an angle between the plane of the cage and that of the cassette.

Odds are that the bicycle was dropped on the right side so the upper body struck the ground and pushed the hanger in. DO NOT RIDE THE BIKE AT ALL UNTIL THIS IS FIXED lest the RD snag a spoke wrecking itself, and possibly the hanger and wheel.

*or the other possibility, and looking again at the photo, is that the RD is cross threaded in the hanger so the upper pivot bolt isn't at right angles to the RD. This has the same effect as a bent hanger, and if the threads are good, the hanger can be bent outward to compensate, since it's the bolt's alignment that counts. Otherwise replace the hanger.


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## Roy G. Biv (Feb 16, 2013)

Thank you for your answer, FBinNY. I can't say for sure if the bicycle was dropped because I bought it second-hand and now I'm fixing it, but seems quite probable, please see picture below. I thought it wasn't bent because I disassembled the hanger and put it on a table and the hanger seemed straight, but I'm going to review it again.

The pivot bolt seems to be properly threaded into the hanger, but I add a picture because I'm not a competent bicycle mechanic. Thank you for your time and knowledge!

View attachment 275693
View attachment 275694


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Roy G. Biv said:


> I'm having the same problem, but the derailleur hanger doesn't seem bent. Here is a photo:
> View attachment 275688
> 
> 
> *Maybe the wheel is not properly dished*? Any suggestions are welcome. Thank you!


that's even easier to spot than a bent hanger. open the q/r and make sure the wheel is all the way in the dropouts. is the wheel centered in the frame?


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## Roy G. Biv (Feb 16, 2013)

Thank you for your reply, cxwrench. Yes, the wheel is centered in the frame. Last night I made sure the rear wheel is all the way in the dropouts.


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## FBinNY (Jan 24, 2009)

Yes, the thread looks OK, so it's a bent hanger. What counts isn't the hanger itself, but that the axis of the upper pivot bolt is parallel with the axle. Since the cage is a distance below the bolt, it only takes a small angle to create a problem. There's a tool made for straightening the hanger, but it's pricey. I suggest you see if there's a bike co-op in town where you can do this yourself using their tool, or pay them a nominal fee foe the job.

Otherwise you can do a down and dirt job, by sticking a 6mm allen key in the upper pivot bolt, grab the RD and wrench together, and gently, but firmly bend the hanger up and out until the cage seems to be vertical (when the wheel is vertical). This is how it's done for on-the-road emergency repairs, and is only as accurate as your eye, but will at least get you rolling.


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## Roy G. Biv (Feb 16, 2013)

FBinNY said:


> Yes, the thread looks OK, so it's a bent hanger. * What counts isn't the hanger itself, but that the axis of the upper pivot bolt is parallel with the axle.*


That's the point I was missing! I helped my poor eyeballing abilities with a caliper and the angle is wrong. I will try to align it and then post results here, pics included, so maybe would be useful for future readers.

Thank you again, FBinNY.


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## stevoo (Oct 26, 2011)

For the enthusiast who may have multiple bikes or rides offroad where a fall on the Deraileur side is fairly common I suggest buying the Park deraileur hanger tool. It is cheap an effective. It is used to not only check alignment but doubles as the lever to straighten the hanger right then. Once you have one you will wonder how you got along without it. Even brand new bikes, brand new hangers need to be checked when installed on the frame. Trust me on this. Many ghost shifting issues can also be solved by checking alignment. The eyeball method is great for a quick trail fix for the day but the tool gets it perfect.

If you are really cost effective and have cycling friends then split the cost and share the tool. I consider it a necessary part of a simple home tool kit.


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## Roy G. Biv (Feb 16, 2013)

After reading some information in the Internet about the dangers of trying to align the hanger mounted in an aluminum (mine) or composite frame, I tried a different approach: I disassembled the hanger and put it in the vise. Then, using an adjustable wrench, I straightened it, well, more than straight it, I bent it to the right side to prevent the RD to be caught between the spokes.

The tools:
View attachment 275984


The result:
View attachment 275985


A tool for the hanger, as stevoo says, sure it is very useful, and one day I'll buy one or built it myself using a hub axle, the two nuts and a bar of metal or wood. But, thinking about it, maybe this tool is only for steel frames? If the builders make the hanger replaceable, is not intended to replace it when it blends? Seems aluminum has unpredictable responses to bending forces.

Thanks to everybody who is posting in this thread!


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Roy G. Biv said:


> After reading some information in the Internet about the dangers of trying to align the hanger mounted in an aluminum (mine) or composite frame, I tried a different approach: I disassembled the hanger and put it in the vise. Then, using an adjustable wrench, I straightened it, well, more than straight it, I bent it to the right side to prevent the RD to be caught between the spokes.
> 
> 
> A tool for the hanger, as stevoo says, sure it is very useful, and one day I'll buy one or built it myself using a hub axle, the two nuts and a bar of metal or wood. But, thinking about, maybe this tool is only for steel frames? If the builders makes the hanger replaceable, is not intended to replace it when it blends? Seems aluminum has unpredictable responses to bending forces.
> ...


you should either buy or make the tool because 9 of 10 new hangers (as well as new frames) need to be aligned. they're pretty much never straight out of the box.


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## Dave Cutter (Sep 26, 2012)

......


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