# Is it counterintuitive endurance vs race?



## chucky gross (May 12, 2006)

So, is it counterintuitive to run an Endurance frame with the same saddle to bar drop as a race geometry?
It seems ridiculous to set up and endurance bike the same as your race bike.
Doesn't that defeat the entire purpose of the difference in geometry?


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## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

chucky gross said:


> So, is it counterintuitive to run an Endurance frame with the same saddle to bar drop as a race geometry?
> It seems ridiculous to set up and endurance bike the same as your race bike.
> Doesn't that defeat the entire purpose of the difference in geometry?


No.

Seems ridiculous because you've been sold a lie.

No.


Think about this for a second... What position do the folk who commute to work ride in? Upright. What position do ultra distance riders ride in? TT. What position do professional cyclist ride in for up to 8 hours a day? Low and long, much like TT but on a road bike.

The longer and harder you ride, the more aerodynamic your position needs to be. So for road cycling, we're right next to TT.

"Endurance" frames should have longer chainstays, lower bottom brackets, slacker head angles and larger tire clearance. They should fit you EXACTLY the same as your road bike. The real point of an "endurance" frame is to be very stable and to absorb road vibration. That's it. In reality it has nothing to do with your riding position. It's the industry's way of selling road bikes to Freds.


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## JSR (Feb 27, 2006)

MMsRepBike said:


> It's the industry's way of selling road bikes to Freds.


Hey, I resemble that remark!


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## Peter P. (Dec 30, 2006)

MMsRepBike said:


> No.
> 
> Seems ridiculous because you've been sold a lie...
> It's the industry's way of selling road bikes to Freds.


Funny, but true!

My buddy, who rode a Steelman Stage Race road (race) frame, was in the market for a new bike. He's good friends with the owner of the local shop, who persuaded my pal to buy a Trek Domane (endurance). In order to get the proper reach, he had to "size up" but still fell short in reach. With the tall headtube he had to use fewer stem spacers, and a rangy 140mm stem! But he was able to duplicate his Steelman's position and has no compliants. And oh yeah; he's fast on that thing.


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## Bee-an-key (May 5, 2007)

The big market since the Lance effect has been the older guy taking up the sport. Masters racing is keeping USA cycling alive while Junior riders are still few and far between. For most of the old men in Lycra the endurance geometry and higher head tube is probably the better bike for them. They want fast and racy but are not racing, throwing in spacers and up stems with little drop between saddle and bar. Add in the swinging saddle bag, the bento box, the handlebar end mirror and light set and you just killed the positive effects of the light weight aero frame. A good shop should steer their rider into the best bike for their style of riding, but the reach, leg length, etc. will still be the same.


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