# Cervelo R3 vs. 2008 Trek Madonne



## ABRider

I am looking at these two bikes and wonder if anyone has ridden both? I think I know the answer I'll get posting in this forum but was wondering about the difference in the ride quality (vertical compliance especially) and weight. I know they are both stiff enough for someone who weighs 150 lbs. Any ride impressions?


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## PJ352

I'm 138 lbs and have ridden both. You're comparing two very different bikes and don't say what types of riding you do, but I can't think of a situation that I'd recommend the R3 over the Madone. 

Both bikes handle very well, but at 150 lbs, the R3 is going to give you a very stiff ride - very little compliance. The Madone is a much more refined ride that also is fast, climbs well and (to my way of thinking) is a much better all rounder kind of bike. 

Both offer limited lifetime warranties to original owners on the frames, Trek covers forks for 5 years and both cover finish and decals for one year. Wolf and Easton forks would not be covered under Cervelo's warranty.


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## ABRider

*R3 vs. Madone*

PJ352 thanks for the feedback. I live in Colorado so I plan to do a lot of climbing on the bike. Most of our rides are straight up and then straight down. So something light for climbing but also stable on the descents would be great. At 45 years of age, I'm also looking for a fair amount of comfort and vertical compliance. I will use the bike primarily for training for mountain bike racing, and I may do a few hillclimbs and road races as well. The 2008 Madone seems to be getting a lot of really good press especially regarding the comfort and stiffness factors. It seems it may be the best of both worlds. However, the R3 has been described as very stiff but also with a fairly high degree of comfort due to the minimalist seat stays. The best evaluation would be to take them both over the same rough roads and see how they do. I am willing to sacrifice a small degree of comfort for very light weight but not much. Thanks for the comparison.


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## PJ352

If you're looking for a degree of comfort, you may want to include the Cervelo RS (same as R3, but with a longer HT) and the Madone performance models (same geometry - longer HT). The ride characteristics will be the same as the R3 and Modone pro, you'll just be a tad more upright.


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## AZ Cruiser

AB Rider - Don't waste your money. The bike to get is a Look 595. I owned a R3 for about 7 months. I loved it. It was the best bike I had ever ridden in my 20 years of racing, until I rode a Look 595 Ultra. Man, what a sweet bike. The R3 doesn't even compare. The 595 is so much stiffer at the bottom bracket, stiffer laterally, but smother and more refined in the ride quality. The Cervelo and Treks are both good frames, but give the Look a thought. It's a little pricey but way worth it.


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## thelivo

Laterally stiffer but vertically more compliant? who'd have thought it


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## cocoboots

i found the 595 to be harsh compared to a R3. It felt like every bit of vibration ran up the mast into my backside. YMMV

The Look is a 5 yr warranty vs. limited lifetime warranties. I have not heard of a single Cervelo customer being refused a warranty replacement for a legitimate fork issue.

I would get a proper bike fit...test ride all bikes you can.....then make an informed decision.


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## 08Madone5.2

One word - MADONE. Enough said!


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## Sweet Milk

I rode both a Madone 5.2 and R3 w/ ultegra for about 100 miles each in varied terrain and decided for the Madone. Not only was the Madone cheaper for a comparable component spec, I just preferred it outright.

Both bikes are very good for climbing, but they are very different in nature. The Madone is more of a swiss army knife, it does many things well without truly exceling at one. Its comfort is excellent for me. Note that comfort is primarily a function of fit though. 

The R3 is certainly a harsher ride (at the same tire pressure) and, in my biased opinion, only excels when ridden very hard in hilly terrain. Note that the harshness can be addressed easily by lowering your tire pressure a tad.

I felt that the Madone handled high speed corners better than the R3, especially when I fitted both bikes with the same wheels for comparison (I am not a fan of the Bonrager Race lite wheels that come with the Madone). Note that cornering is strongly dependent on your weight distribution over the bike so your experience may vary.

If you like a lot of road feedback choose the R3, for more isolation (the Trek 'wooden feel') take the Madone (the new Madone is a lot livelier than the old model though)


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## mikeyp123

Sweet Milk said:


> I rode both a Madone 5.2 and R3 w/ ultegra for about 100 miles each in varied terrain and decided for the Madone. Not only was the Madone cheaper for a comparable component spec, I just preferred it outright.


How did they compare descending, taking high-speed corners.. which inspired more confidence? How about lateral stiffness.. which bike felt like it delivered the power more efficiently?


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## Sweet Milk

I definitely prefer the Madone for both descending and high speed corners. It feels just very solid and neutral to me in those circumstances; the R3 seems to be both more nervous and somewhat vague in its steering. Off course this is very much a function of how you are positioned on the bike so your experience may vary.

Both bikes are laterally stiff, the R3 more so than the Madone. However. I am a clydesdale and my strength is sprinting; The Madone is plenty stiff for me (feels comparable to a Cannondale CAAD 5 that I used to ride) and more importantly: it feels a lot more nimble in the sprint. Note that both the R3 and the Madone use different tube wall thicknesses for different size frames, so again your experience may vary.

Somehow the R3 just felt very inefficient to me at lower speeds, I am really not sure why. It seems like it only comes alive when you are pushing it really hard. This is off course entirely subjective, but I found it an off-putting quality.

Note that I put a different set of wheels on the Madone. The standard Bontrager set is rim heavy. Changing this really made the bike come alive.


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## MANTEIGA

Maaaadddddooooonnnnneeeeee!!!!!!!!


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## mobileops

Is this room full of crazy Sunday strollers? A Madone? Has anyone here ever really riden on an R3? I was on Trek's my entire life. Every generation. They were all great bikes. If its good enough for Lance, Alberto, Levi.....its good enough for me. 

BUT the R3 is maybe the bike of the century. The bike of all bikes. Not because its expensive, or flashy, or because Sastre won the tour on it. Its because its weight to stiffness ratio and sheer riding quality are unparallel. It climbs, sprints, has comfort, is priced reasonably well, looks awesome, feels awesome. Its the ultimate bike....

If you're going with a Madone with Red OCLV and Dura Ace 7900, you'll be getting a dam good bike, but you'll be spending more, and you'll be getting less. 

A young start up company which has become the envy of the cycling world, pretty much copied by everyone, couldn't be wrong. 

JB


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## Borti

I remember a Specialized cycling brochure from a few years ago that listed the bb stiffness of the main tarmac sl competitors. The only one Specialized listed as having a greater bb stiffness than their tarmac was indeed the R3, and it had beat everyone by a country mile. Pretty telling when a company places a competitors frame ABOVE their own flagship frame.


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## MERAKMAN

I tried out an R3 and it was just awsome. The acceleration was almost seamless and it was with out doubt the stiffness, most efficent frame I have tried, which means it puts the power down very well. I'm 14 stones (and not fat) and I couldn't budge the BB. Can't comment on a Madone but if it won the Tour, it must be s##t hot too...

R3 won the Paris Roubaix twice, so I would say the R3 to be a tough little sod for one day races, but maybe not as comfortable as the Madone, which is good for 3 weeks in the saddle...Good luck in your decision!


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## MANTEIGA

mobileops said:


> Is this room full of crazy Sunday strollers? A Madone? Has anyone here ever really riden on an R3? I was on Trek's my entire life. Every generation. They were all great bikes. If its good enough for Lance, Alberto, Levi.....its good enough for me.
> 
> BUT the R3 is maybe the bike of the century. The bike of all bikes. Not because its expensive, or flashy, or because Sastre won the tour on it. Its because its weight to stiffness ratio and sheer riding quality are unparallel. It climbs, sprints, has comfort, is priced reasonably well, looks awesome, feels awesome. Its the ultimate bike....
> 
> If you're going with a Madone with Red OCLV and Dura Ace 7900, you'll be getting a dam good bike, but you'll be spending more, and you'll be getting less.
> 
> A young start up company which has become the envy of the cycling world, pretty much copied by everyone, couldn't be wrong.
> 
> JB


:mad2: 
alberto was on a 5.2. that's black OCLV. the 6.9's were still in development.still kicked everyones ass. and yes. the best cyclist in the world does rides a madone. coming back to win another tour.that's..... let all count....8!! on a trek. :idea: 
go to youtube and search madone. then watch the national geographic spot on the "greatest bicycle in the world", 
then pack a lunch, cause you're going to be hungry when you wake up and come back to reality.:thumbsup:


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## mobileops

Alberto would kick your tail on a Raleigh. Lance would have won 7 tours on any major brand. If you guys like Trek so much, why not go enjoy that fantasy world of the "Greatest bike in the World" in the Trek forum.....National Geographic.....that's funny.... 

For every Madone review, there are 2-3x the Cervelo reviews which are equally impressive. 

I'm sure if Specialized win's this year's tour, you'll love Specialized. 

JB


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## MERAKMAN

mobileops said:


> Alberto would kick your tail on a Raleigh. Lance would have won 7 tours on any major brand. If you guys like Trek so much, why not go enjoy that fantasy world of the "Greatest bike in the World" in the Trek forum.....National Geographic.....that's funny....
> 
> For every Madone review, there are 2-3x the Cervelo reviews which are equally impressive.
> 
> I'm sure if Specialized win's this year's tour, you'll love Specialized.
> 
> JB


OOH! See this guys, someone's in a huff! If you read my thread I said I really liked the R3. I've never ridden the Trek so can't comment on it's ride, only that I know it's won a Tour with, as you say Alberto on it. It went up and down mountains and round France well enough, so it must be a good enough bike... Do you work for Cervelo, if so I understand (abit) why your so defensive about them?! If not then bugger off cos people are allowed their opinion and to choose to purchase what they want, as freely as they like!

Oh an I looooooove Specialized too..yeah baby!


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## Sweet Milk

FIGHT!! FIGHT!!

This is too funny! Lets all get our undies in a wad over what bike is better.


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## MERAKMAN

Sweet Milk said:


> FIGHT!! FIGHT!!
> 
> This is too funny! Lets all get our undies in a wad over what bike is better.



Yes!! We can all meet on the playing fields 4pm ok?:thumbsup:


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## zac

Definitely ride them both, and choose what you like the best. They are both top-of-the-line thoroughbreds, with significant heritage behind their names. The R3 is the stiffer frame and offers a somewhat harsher ride. The Madone despite the comfort does alot of things great. I like you, am 45 and like a bit more comfort. For that I chose the Madone. I don't think you would/could go wrong with either.

zac

EDIT: just noticed that this is an old post...to the OP what did you decide to get, and are you happy with it?


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## MANTEIGA

mobileops said:


> Alberto would kick your tail on a Raleigh. Lance would have won 7 tours on any major brand. If you guys like Trek so much, why not go enjoy that fantasy world of the "Greatest bike in the World" in the Trek forum.....National Geographic.....that's funny....
> 
> For every Madone review, there are 2-3x the Cervelo reviews which are equally impressive.
> 
> I'm sure if Specialized win's this year's tour, you'll love Specialized.
> 
> JB


Why so angry.... WOW, calm down.
Truth hurts huh!?


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## mobileops

I'm not angry. Just proud. 

If any of you guys are ever in NYC, we can go for a ride. Maybe I'll let you ride a dream machine. 

JB


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## MANTEIGA

lol. anytime brother.


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## ksanbon

Exciting forum!

Questions:
1. Does Cervelo and Trek supply their teams with stock frames?
2. If a frame is that much better, how many pros would settle for something less?
3. Because we're all different, aren't we going to want and need different things?
4. Didn't someone we've all heard of say "It's not about the bike."?
5. Why do we always need to be right?

I, for one, love the fact that we have so many choices from some great framebuilders. Let's be happy that we're involved in such a great activity and save the energy to fight more important issues.

Life is a journey.....enjoy the ride (old Nissan ad campaign)


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## Sweet Milk

Although some of the questions seem rhetorical I'll answer anyway

1) Nowadays they do
2) It used to be common for pros to use re-badged frames. With the use of highly recognizable shaped tubing on modern frames this is now rarely done. For TT frames it is still pretty common.
3) Yes, that is why there is no bike that is absolutely the best; there are just bikes that best fit your needs.
4) Yes, but a bike that wont fit you or is otherwise uncomfortable, or makes you think will make you slow, will alter your performance. For criteriums I would go as far as saying that the bike does make a difference because it will affect how well you can corner.
5) You're wrong!


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## ksanbon

1. Thanks for the info. Is Specialized the only one that makes special frames for the top pros?
2. Considering the stakes, I'm not sure that CSC or Astana would settle for second-rated frames.
3. Yes!
4. I might be wrong, but I don't think that was what he was referring to.
5. Ouch! Please allow me to humbly rephrase the question - Why do so many of us feel the need to be right so often?


Life is a journey.....enjoy the ride


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## gambo2166

I think you should look at the Giant TCR Advanced SL. Lighter stiffer and way more compliant then both the trek and the cervelo and yes iv owned and ridding both..


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## MERAKMAN

mobileops said:


> I'm not angry. Just proud.
> 
> If any of you guys are ever in NYC, we can go for a ride. Maybe I'll let you ride a dream machine.
> 
> JB



Cool! I'm not an angry man either, just a mad British man  Come on Bristish guys we can be a bit crazy ourselves sometimes...?? Helped win a war or two..

Ok, I appreciate your drift (an American saying?) and return the offer with a ride on an Italian stallion dream machine in London...


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## JurgenMaas

Sweet Milk said:


> Somehow the R3 just felt very inefficient to me at lower speeds, I am really not sure why. It seems like it only comes alive when you are pushing it really hard.


I think you may have hit on something.

In my (limited) experience, that's true of all Cervélos. The Soloist Team and even the more relaxed RS seemed kinda "is that all there is??" when cruising.

But, mercy, do they ever come alive at speed! You're then compelled to keep riding hard and fast to do 'em justice. (You don't want to let the Cervélo down!)

(The taller top tube of the RS, by the way, might be the way to go if you're considering the Performance fit of the Madone.)


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## BassNBrew

New R3 just arrived. I had tried the Cervelo SLC and Serotta HSG from multi day test and was coming off a Motobecane. The HSG had the best comfort of any bike I've been on. that said their geometry just didn't fit. For 20 miles it was the best bike ever, after that I couldn't get off of it soon enough. The SLC was an impressive machine but the cable rattle was more than I could stand. The test ride was enough to know that I wanted a Cervelo. The R3 is by far the most reponsive bike. Hands down the best acceleration. Seemed very stiff but the ride wasn't harsh. I'm coming off surgery so it has been put to a full test yet. Just have a 40 miler with 4500 ft of climbing under my belt. I like the way it handled climbs. At 220 lbs climbing is never fun for me, but the R3 might just change that. The adjustment nut on the front caliper was sheared in two pieces so i was getting a strange vibration on descents. Even so it left the Motobecane in the dust on descents. Can't wait to get back into sharp and put it to a full test.

I have a Trek TT bike. My biggest issue with Trek is that the compenents are junk. Cervelo seems to have a better component package for the price but junk wheels on the lower end stock models. Given that most of us are going to use different wheels I almost consider them a throw away and would rather see the mfg. put the cash into the components.


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