# Brake Pads



## TiCoyote (Jun 28, 2005)

I've seen some older posts, but Shimano has been releasing new pads, and I wanted to check in to see what people like.


----------



## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

I believe a very good trolling net can be made from used brake pads.

Seriously thought this topic has been covered until it's threadbare. 

Any OEM Shimano brake pad is going to be excellent, as well as SwissStop and KoolStop pads provided they are the correct pads for the rim material.


----------



## TiCoyote (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm not trolling. I just agonize over stupid details.


----------



## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

TiCoyote said:


> I'm not trolling. I just agonize over stupid details.


In that case, obsess about the proper definition of MUT. That seems to be of utmost importance for RBR discussions. 

That and disc brakes.


----------



## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

Well this looks like a Koolstop vs Shimano thing, so I'll give my input there.

I think the C3 came with the 10 speed systems and the C4 comes with the 11 speed systems, not positive though. Seeing how I only use 11 speed I will keep my comments to the C4 vs the Salmon Dura 2 from Koolstop.

I feel the Dura 2 and the C4 are quite far apart. I don't even really consider them a similar compound. Shimano is more like hard plastic and Koolstop is more like soft rubber.


Wear:

After every single ride with the Koolstop Dura 2 there is pad residue hanging out. Each front pad has a booger of used up pad material sticking out of the front and the two channels/grooves in the pad are pretty full of residual gunk. Because this stuff builds up literally after every ride I've stopped clearing it away, too much trouble. They wear really fast, fastest I've ever seen a caliper pad wear.

Shimano pads hardly seem to wear at all in comparison. There's never any boogers or build up of pad residue. The material is much harder and stiffer and lasts much longer. Many times longer than the Dura 2.

Modulation:

I took out used Shimano pads and installed new Dura 2 pads but moved the pads closer to the rim. The soft compound gives a noticeable amount of modulation not there before. When the pad tip first touches the rim to when it's fully engaged feels like a lot more travel than with Shimano. It's as if the softer compound makes you engage the brakes more. So not wanting to mess with the lever pull amount I moved the pads closer to the rim to compensate, worked out fine. There's more ability with the Dura 2 to very slightly brake and I find it harder to lock up a wheel.

Shimano, being a very hard compound, has very little modulation in comparison to the Dura 2. The compound offers about zero modulation and the toe in is about all there is. It's very easy to lock up a wheel with these pads and the modulation travel is short. They work strong and fast.


In the end I think it's a wash or personal preference. Dura 2 will be softer and better in the rain. They will give you more modulation and a bit more control but they will wear much, much faster. Shimano will last much longer, be a little stronger, have zero maintenance but you'll lose out on the modulation and wet performance of the Dura 2.

So personally I like the Shimano for dry conditions and if I rode in the wet or nasty stuff or if I wasn't as good at descending or if I was lacking in control I'd go for the Koolstop Dura 2. I'll put the Dura 2 on the front of the winter bike but everything else will be the Shimano.


----------



## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

Modulation usually refers to how lever force (not travel) relates braking force. Linear, with little zero offset, is usually deemed best. Lever travel is related to the squishiness of the braking system; flex in lever, elasticity of the cable, compressibility of housing, flex in caliper, compressibility of the pad material. Generally, less squish, firmer levers, is deemed desirable. Lever firmness and brake modulation are different and only loosely related braking characteristics.

Current pads are cork on CF and Swissstop Black on aluminum.


----------



## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

Koolstop salmon (is that what you meant by "pink"?). They work for me. I started using the predecessor made of the same compound, Scott Matthauser, over 40 years ago. Never had a problem with them, in dry or wet conditions, and they last fine in my experience.


----------



## TiCoyote (Jun 28, 2005)

I want to ask this a different way. I currently have the r55c4 pads on my bike. They're a year old, and they're getting stiff. They seem to make a scratching/grinding sound when I stop. I've tried cleaning them, but I'm afraid the rubber is just getting hard. I was going to place an order with Jenson, but they don't have the C4. Are they noticeably better than the C3? Or should I just get the KoolStop black pads. I don't think I want to switch to Salmon.


----------



## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

I would just sand the ones you have.

I don't think they "get hard." I know for a fact though that they get a glazed surface to them which is no good. So I guess the outside surface can get hard but I don't think the compound itself hardens up. I use a flat sheet of 120 grit sandpaper and just sand them until all of the glazing is gone. The glazing is the shiny surface that's really hard and smooth.

I sand my brake pads often for I rely upon them to be very predictable. The majority of my braking is done at quite high speeds for short amounts of time right before a turn. I like predictability and when they get all glazed I don't get that. So I keep that from happening by sanding them every month or so.

The sanding does make a mess, producing some really fine black residue, but it doesn't really take much of the pad away, certainly not enough to have to adjust them in more or anything. Just take very outside off, just the glazing.


----------



## DrSmile (Jul 22, 2006)

No Campy love I see. As my sig suggests Campy sells Shimano fit pads.


----------



## Blue CheeseHead (Jul 14, 2008)

TiCoyote said:


> I don't think I want to switch to Salmon.


Just switch to salmon and be done. I am with JCavilia. They have worn fine for me, even the newer Dura 2 pads. They work just fine in the dry and perhaps the best in the wet.


----------



## Roland44 (Mar 21, 2013)

TiCoyote said:


> I've seen some older posts, but Shimano has been releasing new pads, and I wanted to check in to see what people like.


Kool Stop Pink FTW!


----------



## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

TiCoyote said:


> I want to ask this a different way. I currently have the r55c4 pads on my bike. They're a year old, and they're getting stiff. They seem to make a scratching/grinding sound when I stop. I've tried cleaning them, but I'm afraid the rubber is just getting hard. I was going to place an order with Jenson, but they don't have the C4. Are they noticeably better than the C3? Or should I just get the KoolStop black pads. I don't think I want to switch to Salmon.


No, they're not getting stiff. Brake pads don't get stiff in a year. In a decade, maybe, but not in a year. You just need to pick out the bits of aluminum and grit that have become imbedded in your pads and then maybe scuff up the contact surface with some sandpaper.


----------



## TiCoyote (Jun 28, 2005)

Thanks for the replies. This is all good advice.


----------



## Pirx (Aug 9, 2009)

DrSmile said:


> No Campy love I see. As my sig suggests Campy sells Shimano fit pads.


Yep, pretty pointless poll. No Swissstop mentioned, either. So there's Shimano, Koolstop, or "other"? Give me a brake, err, break!


----------



## mfdemicco (Nov 8, 2002)

I used the Kool Stop salmon pads and was a bit underwhelmed. They wore fast and squealed. I had to remove them from the front brakes because my brake shoes didn't allow toe in and I had to get rid of the squeal. They seemed to have a bit more braking power than the Shimano pads. I'm now trying the Kool Stop black pads. They have a bit more braking power than the Shimano pads. However, on my mountain bike I was using this compound on the rear brake and the rim braking surface had a lot of black on it. I was using Aztec pads on the front and the rim was clean. Hmmm...


----------



## jason124 (Jul 25, 2006)

Kerry Irons said:


> No, they're not getting stiff. Brake pads don't get stiff in a year. In a decade, maybe, but not in a year. You just need to pick out the bits of aluminum and grit that have become imbedded in your pads and then maybe scuff up the contact surface with some sandpaper.


On the subject of old stiff brake pads, I picked up a 1995 Diamondback Vertex that sat in a garage for... at least 15 years. The pads are probably still original with minimal wear. I know its cheap insurance to replace them, but just out of curiosity, are they salvageable? 

Another question: does using harder brake pads wear the rim faster? On my commuter, I have the same brakes but every now and then, they will catch debris and make an awful scraping sound. Was thinking about switching to KoolStops to negate the issue, but if it is a softer compound, sounds like it may pick up more debris.


----------



## ericm979 (Jun 26, 2005)

20 year old pads will be hard. Hard pads won't brake as well.

My favorite dry weather pad for aluminium rims is the SwissStop Black Prince. The made-by-SwissStop Sram pads are cheaper but not quite the same. DA pads are fine. 

For wet, KoolStop salmon. But boy do they wear fast!


----------



## TmB123 (Feb 8, 2013)

ericm979 said:


> My favorite dry weather pad for aluminium rims is the SwissStop Black Prince.


the Swissstop Black Prince pads are designed for carbon wheels - obviously they will work to a degree on Alu, but not really what they are meant for.


----------



## Pedro S (Mar 28, 2011)

SwissStop Flash Pro BXP


----------

