# Smart cassette chice ...



## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

In interested in the opinions of riders along the Front Range regarding the best choice for a cassette on the new bike I'm picking up next week.

The bike has a SRAM Apex group with a 12/26 cassette. I'm a little concerned that the stock cassette won't have low enough gearing for my present ability and the climbs I'll be faced with. Although I plan on giving those stock gears a good try over the next couple months, there's a possibility I'll be changing cassettes.

The question is what would be the most sensible choice? A 11/28 or 11/32 would be the likely next step, but not having tons of money to sink into a new cassette making the best choice right off the bat is the best plan. So, what are your thoughts on what would be the best choice if a new cassette is needed?

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.


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## scott h (Apr 26, 2008)

I would recommend an 11/26. You will want the 11 going down hill. You will be fine with the 26 if you have a 39 small chain ring.


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## cycocross (Dec 11, 2011)

Are you riding 6% highway grades or 14% County road grades? or just the rollers along the front range?
I would say 12-28 for highway trips. 12-32 for steeper climbs.(no excuses for not apexing any hill) 11 gear is good for pushing down a long hill but it wears faster and sram won't replace just that gear. This is advice for the recreational rider that plans on being older one day. If you want to keep up with roadies you will need the 11 gear.

Pay attention to what gears you like with your current cassette and see if that (those) gears are available with your options.


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## rcharrette (Mar 27, 2007)

What's on the front, compact (50/34) or standard (39/53)? I would assume it's compact and in that case I'd go 11-28 that should get you up and down anything on the Front Range.


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## taralon (Sep 1, 2011)

I've got the compact 50/34 on the front and the 11-32 rear on an apex setup. I plan on actually switching this out for a 12-32 in the future. The 34-32 will let you spin up anything, I've only actually not made it to the top of a hill in it once, and that was more because I decided it wasn't worth the time rather than being too much effort. On the other hand in the spread of gears I spend the most time in (50 front, 13-19 range on the rear) the spreads between shifts are a little too much and I'd like to have them closer together. I seem to always be in a situation where one is a little too easy, and shifting to the next smaller cog is a jump that's just a bit too hard.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

rcharrette said:


> What's on the front, compact (50/34) or standard (39/53)? I would assume it's compact and in that case I'd go 11-28 that should get you up and down anything on the Front Range.


The crankset is the 50/34.


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## DonDenver (May 30, 2007)

Yes... 11-28 in the front range or Vail Pass or Deer Creek city view climb or Loveland Pass or Keystone to Montezuma or riding a metric century loop around the platte and cherry creek flat trail of greater Denver or whatever. Keep riding with that 50/34 11-28 and get stronger to then find how you'll trim off some cogs and/ or grow the teeth of your front rings to get tighter spacing and speed with your new legs and lungs of steel. :thumbsup:


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

DonDenver said:


> Yes... 11-28 in the front range or Vail Pass or Deer Creek city view climb or Loveland Pass or Keystone to Montezuma or riding a metric century loop around the platte and cherry creek flat trail of greater Denver or whatever. Keep riding with that 50/34 11-28 and get stronger to then find how you'll trim off some cogs and/ or grow the teeth of your front rings to get tighter spacing and speed with your new legs and lungs of steel. :thumbsup:


@DonD I don't have the 11-28 ...... yet, although I find myself leaning that way in the event that a change is needed.

legs and lungs of steel? THAT would be awesome, especially at my age and after having smoked for over 30 years. I quit smoking about 2 years ago and the C-V strength is returning steadily - that's the biggest reason I got back in the saddle. I'm looking forward to see just what I can accomplish this spring/summer. I've got an ok hill right out my front door to get started and a couple decent climbs close to home including what looks like a killer hill on the backside of Loretto Heights on Lowell (between Hampden and Yale).

I've got a ways to go before I try some of the climbs you mention, but I'll get there soon enough.


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## cycocross (Dec 11, 2011)

Samadhi said:


> @DonD I don't have the 11-28 ...... yet, although I find myself leaning that way in the event that a change is needed.
> 
> legs and lungs of steel? THAT would be awesome, especially at my age and after having smoked for over 30 years. I quit smoking about 2 years ago and the C-V strength is returning steadily - that's the biggest reason I got back in the saddle. I'm looking forward to see just what I can accomplish this spring/summer. I've got an ok hill right out my front door to get started and a couple decent climbs close to home including what looks like a killer hill on the backside of Loretto Heights on Lowell (between Hampden and Yale).
> 
> I've got a ways to go before I try some of the climbs you mention, but I'll get there soon enough.


Hope I'm not rude by pegging you squarely in the recreational rider category. There's nothing wrong with foregoing the powertap, HR monitor and Garmin for a zippy ride around Wash Park. 
​The 11 gear is nice to have if you want to pedal downhill yes, but you lose the 16 and the 21 gear and those are gears you would use more often getting around the Metro. If you want iron legs then climbing with the 28 gear will get you there while the 32 gear will get you there still sitting in the saddle.
If Lorreto Heights is the biggest hill you'll climb or descend then enjoy the aerotuck practice and wait for the 12 gear to work again. FWIW I have the compact 11/28 and hit 57 mph on the hogbacks using the 13 gear. I only ride in the mountains and I rarely find myself using the 11 gear. I just can't see losing two mid-range gears to get one I sometimes use going down a super long hill.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

cycocross said:


> Hope I'm not rude by pegging you squarely in the recreational rider category.


Yep you have me pegged in that regard. Zero interest in competetive cycling except for turning around the embarrassing condition I'm in currently with the only people NOT passing me are those on foot . I'd like to change that, otherwise I'm just in it for the fun and fitness.




> If Lorreto Heights is the biggest hill you'll climb or descend then enjoy the aerotuck practice and wait for the 12 gear to work again. FWIW I have the compact 11/28 and hit 57 mph on the hogbacks using the 13 gear. I only ride in the mountains and I rarely find myself using the 11 gear. I just can't see losing two mid-range gears to get one I sometimes use going down a super long hill.


Loretto Heights is just the beginning, I'll be moving on to more "mountainous" terrain soon enough. I don't want to get half-way up Deer Creek and not be able to continue. Loretto heights is steep enough to be challenging and a good workout to prep for longer/more difficult climbs in the mountains.

Interesting perspective on the gearing though and one I hadn't thought of. If I don't need an 11 gear and the 12 will take me as fast as I might want/need to go, it might be wise to not consider that gearing option in favor of what be a more usefull set of gears.


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## taralon (Sep 1, 2011)

I'd definitely suggest the 12-32 over the 11-32 for sure. The spacing on the 12-32 is just better in the mid to small cogs and the spacing on the large cogs are the same. 

12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19, 21, 24, 32 vs:
11, 12, 13, 15, 17, 19, 22, 25, 28, 32

I personally find the jump for 13 to 15 annoying as is the leap from 15 to 17. The 17-19 jump isn't nearly as bad, but the 19 to 22 kinda is as is the 22-25 and 25-28. The 32 on the 12-32 is positioned more as a bailout gear whereas on the 11-32 they try to position it as an integral step, but it really just makes everything from 13 up spaced odd doing it that way.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

Y'know, I've gotten a buch of good, solid info & advice from this thread. Seems to be a prevailing pattern on this site.

I haven't spent any appreciable time on a road bike in 40 years and I find it amazing how much I don't, but need to know. These forums have been very, very helpful. It's nice to be able to ask what I think might be Clueless Noob Questions, and then not get treated like a complete idiot. It's also cool to be able to discuss issues like this one in an enviorment that ensures that I get input from people in this area. I wouldn't discount the advice of someone from Iowa, but the advice of someone who has ridden the same climbs I'm aiming for is even better.

Thanx to all!


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

taralon said:


> I'd definitely suggest the 12-32 over the 11-32 for sure. The spacing on the 12-32 is just better in the mid to small cogs and the spacing on the large cogs are the same.
> 
> 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19, 21, 24, 32 vs:
> 11, 12, 13, 15, 17, 19, 22, 25, 28, 32
> ...


@taralon ...

So, you're saying that on the 12/32 cassette the 32 gear is more like the granny low on a mtn bike setup? It is a big jump, for sure - 8 teeth instead of 4 on the 11/32. So it would be treated as a last resort in the case when you've run out of gear or strength to complete a climb in the higher gears.

I've read elsewhere that in an ideal situation you'd want to climb with a gear or two in reserve. With that and what you wrote, I should be aiming to be able to climb with the 21 or 24 gear, leaving the 32 for when-all-else-fails?


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## DonDenver (May 30, 2007)

S:

So glad to read you quit smoking and are on a (excuse the pun) road to great health and wellness! I share a similar journey beginning years ago. Actually I was in the best physical condition of my life due to cycling and top line nutrition on the date of my accident, a fire, which consumed my body to the point walking again would be a great stretch. 

Not only did I beat that doctor's initial goal but ended up completing the Deer Creek Challenge Century course (12725' vertical gain) 10 months to the day of my accident in just under 8 hours. Today, 17 months since accident, I'm even fitter and more resilient than the day of accident owed largely due to cycling and my wife and friends who share the same passion.

I say all this as I admire your return to the sport and think you have the confidence to know that there are no right or wrong answers to gears used but rather understanding you'll work towards your best gearing after some miles and experience.

For me, I do like the 11 on the short side as it does provide some power to pedal when on those 6 to 10 percent descents when also dealing with x wind in our mountain region...helping to feather those exits and entry into turns. Of course so much depends on the power you like to generate, your profile into wind and drag etc., etc...

All personal preference and other comments also correct...for each of us. For you...?


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## cycocross (Dec 11, 2011)

One last more thing, Loretto Heights and Ruby Hill are as steep a hill as I've seen in "the mountains" use these hills to judge what you might need/want for climbing. 
You also might want to get an extra back wheel to have both the 11 and 12 gear. You'll still be faced with this same dilemma in deciding the lower gears, but a quick wheel change and you're ready for bear.
(getting the same wheel you have will eliminate minor adjustments & Measure the chain for the largest cog you'll use, if they're different.)


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

cycocross said:


> One last more thing, Loretto Heights and Ruby Hill are as steep a hill as I've seen in "the mountains" use these hills to judge what you might need/want for climbing.


VERY cool! I recently started using a 10-mile loop from my house that includes both Loretto Heights and Ruby Hill and uses the Bear Creek and Mary Carter trails. I was hoping these might be good to train on and gauge progress for future rides up in the mountains.

_Interesting side note for non-Denver readers: Ruby Hill was where the local KKK would have their meetings/cross burning in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Today it's a city park where children, many of them Latinos, play. Fitting Irony._ 

But I digress.




> You also might want to get an extra back wheel to have both the 11 and 12 gear. You'll still be faced with this same dilemma in deciding the lower gears, but a quick wheel change and you're ready for bear.


I've thought about a second wheelset, but not for improved gearing choices. But that's not a bad idea. I think there are things I need more than a second set of wheels and getting the idea past She Who Must Be Obeyed would be difficult ("You need a second WHAT?"). I was thinking about putting that on the wish list for the next Veloswap.



> (getting the same wheel you have will eliminate minor adjustments & Measure the chain for the largest cog you'll use, if they're different.)


Good to know. The new bike comes with Mavic Aksium wheels. They're not the most expensive wheels on the planet ($250 - $300 new) so getting a second pair wouldn't break the bank (or over tax the patience of She who Holds The Pursestrings Tightly). Good advice though. Thanx tons.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

DonDenver said:


> So glad to read you quit smoking


Thanks! I'm pretty happy with the smoking cessation too. Feel tons better. Wasn't easy, but wasn't impossible. I had a lot of support.



> and are on a (excuse the pun) road to great health and wellness!


Well, maybe not. I have cancer and while it's not real agressive, it's still a malignancy and that will always mean that great health is something I had many years ago. I feel fine. No chemo or radiation. Yet. My Dr. demanded I step up on what health I have left. The cycling came out of that. 



> I share a similar journey beginning years ago. Actually I was in the best physical condition of my life due to cycling and top line nutrition on the date of my accident, a fire, which consumed my body to the point walking again would be a great stretch.
> 
> Not only did I beat that doctor's initial goal but ended up completing the Deer Creek Challenge Century course (12725' vertical gain) 10 months to the day of my accident in just under 8 hours. Today, 17 months since accident, I'm even fitter and more resilient than the day of accident owed largely due to cycling and my wife and friends who share the same passion.


Outstanding! The Velominati should take a lesson from that. Rule #5? Harden the [email protected]#$ up? What you did was Hard, man. Very Hard. 



> I say all this as I admire your return to the sport and think you have the confidence to know that there are no right or wrong answers to gears used but rather understanding you'll work towards your best gearing after some miles and experience.


:blush2:

I hope so. As I posted earlier, I think threads like this one are very helpful. What I've gotten is a lot of different things to consider on gearing - different ways to look at it. 

Extremly valuable info.


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## taralon (Sep 1, 2011)

In a way yes it is like the granny. But in combination with a compact front the 24 isn't bad at all to climb in. Then again, it might just come down to what you want to do riding wise. I find I ride in the 13-19 range on my 11-32 95% of the time. That said, 95% of the time I'm not satisfied with the cassette. The 5% I am out of that range, about half of it is in the 11-13 range and the other 2.5% is in the 19-28 range, and only when I'm in the 11-13 range does the spacing feel ok. My opinion of things might change if I was less than a 25 mile ride from the nearest mountain to climb, or if I could hold an average speed of better than 20 mph in the flats solo, but I'm not and I can't. 

Besides cassettes in comparison to all the other gear, and new wheels etc, are fairly inexpensive (especially if you keep your eye open on craigslist) and easy to change out yourself. If you find you're strong enough a climber to not need the 32 cog then $30-50 will get you something with a better range for your riding style. 



Samadhi said:


> @taralon ...
> 
> So, you're saying that on the 12/32 cassette the 32 gear is more like the granny low on a mtn bike setup? It is a big jump, for sure - 8 teeth instead of 4 on the 11/32. So it would be treated as a last resort in the case when you've run out of gear or strength to complete a climb in the higher gears.
> 
> I've read elsewhere that in an ideal situation you'd want to climb with a gear or two in reserve. With that and what you wrote, I should be aiming to be able to climb with the 21 or 24 gear, leaving the 32 for when-all-else-fails?


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## Sgt_Lobo (Feb 15, 2012)

This is a great thread! I live in the same area and will be getting a new bike soon. I too was wondering what gear ratio would be the best for climbing. My current bike has a 50/34 up front and a 12/27 in the rear, and I sometimes find myself wishing I had 1 more easier gear to drop into. Now, after reading this, I think I'l look for a 12/32. The only thing that worries me though is the jump from 24 to 32, seems like there should be an extra gear in there...


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## sinister_designs (Aug 26, 2011)

I have yet to try it but I have gone from a 50/36 ..11/25 to a 50/34 .. 12/27 and hoping it is a bit more forgiving along the front range.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

sinister_designs said:


> I have yet to try it but I have gone from a 50/36 ..11/25 to a 50/34 .. 12/27 and hoping it is a bit more forgiving along the front range.


@sinister

If you get out this weekend with that new set of gears, could you affer a little report on how it works?

I'm getting my new bike tomorrow (50/34 & 12/26) and will take it over Ruby Hill a time or two over the weekend and will report in with impressions.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

Well, I brought the new bike home and went out for rides Saturday and Sunday.

As it turns out the bike came with a 12/25 cassette and not the 12/26. Not what was advertised, but just couldn't bring myself to raise a big stink about it.

Not bad, actually, but after taking Ruby Hill a couple times, I'm pretty sure lower gearing will be needed eventually. 

I'm thinking the 12/28 or the 11/28 will have to do. I got my bike at a Performance shop and the mechanics at two of their stores advised that to go to any cassette with gearing that low as a 32 would require the long-cage rear delraileur if I want to stay with SRAM. If that's true, I don't want to spend the money for a new derailleur. Besides, after riding the 25, I'm pretty sure the 28 will be just fine. Hell, the 25 may be ok. I'll give it a couple months to see how it goes.


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## sinister_designs (Aug 26, 2011)

I did end up going for a small ride and the new cassette and front ring were nice, I could even go to a 28 on the back if I needed for bigger rides but it was perfect for me.
Yeah I think a 28 is the largest you can do without changing the rear to a long cage.


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