# Synapse Carbon 4 riders & those interested



## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

What do you guys think of this bike? It is equiped with SRAM Rival, Aksium Wheels, and if i understand correctly (please correct me) Cannondale's BB30 {?}
Would you guys get this bike? or if not, what would you get in the $2200 price range?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

If I was looking for relaxed geometry, I would buy a Synapse and in that price range Synapse Carbon 4 is the way to go. 

Could you please shrink that photo now?


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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

That's an FSA crank.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

Hank Stamper said:


> That's an FSA crank.


Gossamer to be exact


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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> Gossamer to be exact


yup, and by the way OP I'm not just trying to be pedantic about your bike description. There's a big difference between force and gossamer so it's significant to what someone would think about the bike.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

What's so bad about the gossamer crank?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

Nobody said it was bad but you said that the crank was SRAM Force (higher end).


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

oh sorry!, i was thinking SRAM Rival Group a la CAAD9 4. 

How bad is the FSA Gossamer crank? and does it have the same BB30 system as the CAAD9 4?


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## milkbaby (Aug 14, 2009)

Google and you'll see a lot of people don't like the FSA Gossamer cranks. Interestingly though, there's this pic of George Hincapie's training bike:









And it looks like it's using MegaExo outboard bearing cups and is not BB30, ohh the horror!  

Why don't you just go test ride it, and if you like it more versus other similar bikes (uhhh, Specialized Roubaix, Giant Defy, Jamis Xenith Endura, maybe just off the toppamahead?) just get it and ride the crap out of it? People are waayy too obsessed about every detail on a bike, but in reality the more you ride it, probably the less you'll think about it! Every day you spend overthinking it is one more lost day that you could've been riding instead!


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

can i replace the gossamer BB30 crank with any road crank from jensonusa/PP? Or does it need to be BB30?

if i buy a crankset w/ BB, then the BB30 doesn't matter anymore right?


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

the synapse carbon 4 isn't availble at my lbs until may 21st (2 weeks)

What i'm trying to do is upgrade the crankset out of the box, so my lbs will give me a steep discount for letting him keep the stock crankset. 

Whats a decent upgrade crank?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> can i replace the gossamer BB30 crank with any road crank from jensonusa/PP? Or does it need to be BB30?
> 
> if i buy a crankset w/ BB, then the BB30 doesn't matter anymore right?


Nope. You'll at least need a BB30 adapter since the frame is made for BB30. Honestly, I would put some miles (a lot of miles) on the bike before worrying about replacing the crank. I have the Gossamer crank on my bike that I ride every day. It's probably not great but it works and I'll most likely keep using it until it breaks.


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## milkbaby (Aug 14, 2009)

Stock answer: ride the crankset until it breaks then worry about an upgrade? Or upgrade the rider first... 

I doubt your LBS will give you a "steep discount" for swapping out the stock crankset because this particular new bike take-off doesn't sell on eBay for a lot.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

i'm well aware of the stock answer, i hear it everyday from hypocrits who upgrade their bike parts before they break. 

What are some examples of some decent upgrades that are BB30 compatible?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> i'm well aware of the stock answer, i hear it everyday from hypocrits who upgrade their bike parts before they break.
> 
> What are some examples of some decent upgrades that are BB30 compatible?


Many manufracturers are starting to get on board with BB30. If I was to replace my crank, I would most likely just swap out the whole groupset with SRAM Force. It's more cost efficient that way (my LBS sells it for $1,000) than just getting the crankset. If you have money to burn then go for it (just be sure to get the BB30 version) or better yet just get a bike with the components you want to begin with. That's always a less expensive option than upgrading a brand new bike. Personally, because I'm still pretty much a newb, I like to start out with lower end components, use them for a while (get my money's worth) and then upgrade so that I can feel the difference between the low and and the higher end parts [or not in some cases]. My shifting with 105 is pretty much perfect now and I don't necessarily feel the need to upgrade the drivetrain so if I do, it's because I want to and not because I need to (unless, like I said, something breaks). There is a difference between "need" and "want". When you ask questions about upgrading components here, most often people will advise you based on the "need". You'll, of course, do whatever you "want". It doesn't make them hypocrites necessarily


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

I see, well everyone is on this forum because they want a nice bike. I want a nice bike and i also want nice parts.
My lbs quoted me $2050 for the Synapse Carbon 4, hows this price?

My lbs also quoted me $250 to upgrade the FSA Gossamer crank to SRAM Force. He gets to keep stock FSA Crank. Is that a bad?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

The Synapse Carbon 4 is a very nice bike the way it is.
More than 15% off the MSRP is rather good. I would probably try to get it down to $2K. Just mention that the 2011 models should be available in the next couple months and perhaps you'll just wait for one of those. See what they say.
$250 for a Force crankset is a pretty good price so it the choice is up to you. Just keep in mind that there will always be better components out there unless you spend the money and get the top of the line ...and even then, something better [or preceived to be better] will come out next year and you might want it. Good luck either way. Be sure to post pics of your bike once you have it. I'm sure you'll be happy with the Synapse Carbon 4 regardless of the crank it comes with.


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## adamssss (Mar 22, 2010)

dude just ride it till it falls off (might be a while) then upgrade when you need to


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

adamssss said:


> dude just ride it till it falls off (might be a while) then upgrade when you need to


such a generic reply. if that were the case, then there wouldn't be any posts for upgrade bike parts, there wouldn't be a Jenson or a PP, there wouldn't be a forum: If people didn't upgrade their bikes.

the Force crank @ $250; how decent is that deal? i see some online shops have it for $200, would that be the 2009 model?


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

Lol...why don't you ride a bike with a Force crank and then one with a Gossamer crank...if you can't tell the difference then save you money and keep the Gossamer.

If you want to "upgrade" to the Force for the sake of it...then by all means do it. In the end its your money...do as you please.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

AvantDale said:


> Lol...why don't you ride a bike with a Force crank and then one with a Gossamer crank...if you can't tell the difference then save you money and keep the Gossamer.
> 
> If you want to "upgrade" to the Force for the sake of it...then by all means do it. In the end its your money...do as you please.


Chances are that the bike with the Force crank will also have a higher end frame, wheels and everything else for that matter so even if there is noticeable difference in the cranks, the two bikes will have a completely different feel to them.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> Chances are that the bike with the Force crank will also have a higher end frame, wheels and everything else for that matter so even if there is noticeable difference in the cranks, the two bikes will have a completely different feel to them.


exactly, i did test ride a 9-4, but its a completely different ride to start off with.


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## jayhawk261 (Apr 17, 2009)

I just rode my Synapse Carbon 4 today and I can tell you that the Gossamer cranks are a big step up for me over what was on my Specialized Allez. I'll be happy riding on them.

As far as upgrading parts, there are a lot of guys that will upgrade because they can or have money to spend. At the level I'm at, I have no need to spend the additional money upgrading parts. Truthfully, I'll most likely never have a problem with these. If I thought I needed higher end parts, I'd have bought the next level up in the bike series. I'd say ride it and enjoy it. Get used to it before you go changing things. You can listen to others all day long, but if it works for you, that's all that counts.


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## adamssss (Mar 22, 2010)

ok so lets start at $2050 for the carbon 4... add 200 for the force crank that sums up to $2250.

If you had so much money burning a hole in your wallet that you wanted to upgrade right out the box, why not just pick up the carbon 3?? I'm guessing at a few hundred more you would get almost full ultegras, better wheel set (carbon/alloy) just to name a few.


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

The CAAD9 5 comes with a Gossamer crank...the 4 comes with the Force. If you want to nit pick about the wheels...swap the 9-4 wheels onto the 9-5...I'm sure the bike shop won't mind.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> exactly, i did test ride a 9-4, but its a completely different ride to start off with.


Go with the Force crank. You'll always keep thinking about it if you don't.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> Go with the Force crank. You'll always keep thinking about it if you don't.


you know me pretty well. if it doesn't seem worth it for [the rest of] you because you dont care about cranks, of course its going to be worth $0 to upgrade cranks. What i'm going to do is check out how much the step up to the synapse carbon 3 is going to be with the SLK crank, if its not much more i MAY jump for it but i may not. 

Is there any other BB30 compatbile cranks that i should be comparing other than the FORCE and the SLK?

BTW, i ordered these pedals for it: Wellgo WR-1 Black ~200g/pair


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

I would not put platform pedals on that pretty bike but that's just me 
It looks like you already got a bunch of responses regarding cranks in the mech. forum.


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## kbhenze (Apr 12, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> I would not put platform pedals on that pretty bike but that's just me
> It looks like you already got a bunch of responses regarding cranks in the mech. forum.



Your wanting to up grade the cranks, but you put platform pedals on it....There is a joke here somewhere


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

nope, i'll be in a heavy urban environment, i dont have time to clip/unclip at every intersection (when i'm riding around my neighborhood.)


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## milkbaby (Aug 14, 2009)

Read this: http://www.bikesportmichigan.com/reviews/crank.shtml

_After all the money we spent and time exerted I think this proves something we already knew: Components don't mean much.The differences between them are often so small they won't influence your performance. Having a stem 1 cm. too long, the wrong seat tube angle on your frame for your measurements or a saddle height off by 7mm would make a much more tangible difference in performance and comfort than the differences we discovered between any of these cranks._

Now those pedals on the other hand... :eek6:


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

malanb said:


> this is a joke.. or just BS.. come on! you are buyin a synapse bla bla want to do some upgrades and you are going to put some pedals??? better buy yourself a commuter..


nah i'm pretty serious about those pedals, 100g/ea, and enough grip for riding w/o toe clips. 

still thinking about the crank though. and i already have a commuter.


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

You worried about stiffness of a crank...but run platforms? Am I missing something??


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## Devastator (May 11, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> nah i'm pretty serious about those pedals, 100g/ea, and enough grip for riding w/o toe clips.
> 
> still thinking about the crank though. and i already have a commuter.


You shouldnt put platforms on that bike. Man up, I ride my Supersix with sandals and have speedplays. I admit it sorta looks like I stole my bike when I have jeans, tshirt and sandals on, but then I get, "thats a full carbon bike!?" from a lot of people so maybe not.. You dont need platforms.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

Devastator said:


> You shouldnt put platforms on that bike. Man up, I ride my Supersix with sandals and have speedplays. I admit it sorta looks like I stole my bike when I have jeans, tshirt and sandals on, but then I get, "thats a full carbon bike!?" from a lot of people so maybe not.. You dont need platforms.


you guys are right, i'll throw my platforms on my track bike and get me some clipless, 

i like the LOOK Keo Classic pedals, are those any good? Or some speedplay pedals, which would you recommend? for $100-125
What shoes are compatible with them?


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## malanb (Oct 26, 2009)

keo's are ok., and you still can ride them with normal shoes, the platform is big enough.:thumbsup: i got keo carbon and keo max2 , get the keos with metal plate on the surface. all carbon keo's surface wear with the cleat kind of fast.


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## Devastator (May 11, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> you guys are right, i'll throw my platforms on my track bike and get me some clipless,
> 
> i like the LOOK Keo Classic pedals, are those any good? Or some speedplay pedals, which would you recommend? for $100-125
> What shoes are compatible with them?


Id love to help you, but the only pedal I have experience with is Speedplay X2s which are Stainless Steel. They work for me very well, I liked that they had a lot of float initally, but now it doesnt make much of adifference. I never get hotspots. The pedals are small but the they fit the cleat which is larger and distributes the force from the pedal. The X1s might be around 100ish. As for shoes I have Sidi Genius 5. Dont cheap out on your shoes make sure you get something comfortable, otherwise youll never wana ride which in a way could be smarters cause if you never ride youll save a ton of money.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

What Shoes are compatible with the look and which are compatible with the speedplay pedals?


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## malanb (Oct 26, 2009)

any brand. I dont like sidi personally, they dont fit good, too narrow for me. but there are tons of shoes. sidi, time, dmt , bonts. diadora, this re all excellnt shoes.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

Now, are the speedplays better to use or the look classics better to use


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## malanb (Oct 26, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> Now, are the speedplays better to use or the look classics better to use


 both are excellent, just depends on your likes. I ve been using look since 90's
but got friends using speedplays I have tried them, they feel good too.
but if you are going to ride with out bike shoes, now and then speed play pedals are really small and hard to use with normal shoes.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

This makes me feel like LOUISSSSS might be just yanking our chain with his posts. A track bike and a commutter? (also a MTB, I think). He's asking supern00b questions but already has a bunch of bikes? Something aint right with these posts.


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## Devastator (May 11, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> This makes me feel like LOUISSSSS might be just yanking our chain with his posts. A track bike and a commutter? (also a MTB, I think). He's asking supern00b questions but already has a bunch of bikes? Something aint right with these posts.


Esp the look vs speedplays qustion, pretty much everyone will tell you they rather ride look pedal with reg shoes. Im probably the only guy who rides speedplays with sandals on. I love crusiing on my, wait I mean I loved cruising on my old Super, new Super is everybit as good as I thought it would be.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

nope i'm not cracking on you guys, i do have a MTB, and i also have a SS/FG tricross Singlecross. i just dont know much about road bike stuff, hence the questions. The tricross is my commuter bike. 

So u guys think the LOOK pedals are easier to use with road shoes and also with sneakers?
Are LOOK Classics or Speedplay Light pedals easier to clip in/out of?


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

i think i'm set on the LOOK Keo 2 MAX pedals. i'll look for shoes later. I can get these for $133 shipped. 

What do you guys think of these pedals? are they easy to get in/out of?


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## malanb (Oct 26, 2009)

keo 2 are good. and have a metal plate making them more durable. just lower the spring tension to the minimum, you migt fall down the first time gettin out of ur pedal, just practice some place, with no traffic, and clip out before total stop, you will get used to it fast. and you will then readjust tension.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

What shoes can i get with these Look Keo 2 max pedals? do they need to be specific to LOOK 3 bolt? or any shoe with 3 bolt pattern will work?


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

If i can get a LOOK 566 w/ Ultregra's down the list for $2400, is it a no brainer to upgrade to that (LOOK 566) bike?
I can get the Synapse Carbon 4 for $2050


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## milkbaby (Aug 14, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> If i can get a LOOK 566 w/ Ultregra's down the list for $2400, is it a no brainer to upgrade to that (LOOK 566) bike?
> I can get the Synapse Carbon 4 for $2050


Probably not a "no brainer"... Rival and Ultegra are probably pretty close in weight and function from what people say. I think Look bikes are pretty cool because the decals scream "LOOK" which is appealing to my perverse sense of humor... BUT Look only offers a 5 year warranty versus Cannondale's lifetime warranty.

Why not ride the 2 bikes and stop asking so many questions? :idea:


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## Loraura (Jun 30, 2008)

I've tried to respond to this thread twice. Both times, I just can't find the words.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

sorry guys, i ended up getting the 2009 look 566 w/ ultegras instead.
the look is much less common than a cannondale and the price jump for ultegras was only $350.
https://www.sunandski.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=7722024310915&Show=TechSpecs












Loraura said:


> I've tried to respond to this thread twice. Both times, I just can't find the words.


are all your 1000 posts this retarded?


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> are all your 1000 posts this retarded?


It's kind of ironic that you'd call someone's posts retarded.


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> It's kind of ironic that you'd call someone's posts retarded.


it adds no useful content to the thread. its unrelated to the OP. similar to some stupid **** you'd say


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

LOUISSSSS said:


> it adds no useful content to the thread. its unrelated to the OP. similar to some stupid **** you'd say


I'm glad you feel that your inane postings add useful content to [any] thread. YOU WIN!!!


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

ph0enix said:


> I'm glad you feel that your inane postings add useful content to [any] thread. YOU WIN!!!


i know.


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## yetimoo (Nov 28, 2009)

I have a Synapse 5 and swapped out a pile of parts before leaving the shop. The only thing that bothers me about this bike is the FSA gossamer crank. I have tightened the crank bolt to the max torque and it still opens up after about 70k. Sounds like the frame is breaking everytime the pedals are go round. I have to ride with a 10mm Allen key in my pocket just in case the crank feels like falling off. Love the BB30!! and the frame!!
Moo


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## LOUISSSSS (Dec 14, 2009)

yetimoo said:


> I have a Synapse 5 and swapped out a pile of parts before leaving the shop. The only thing that bothers me about this bike is the FSA gossamer crank. I have tightened the crank bolt to the max torque and it still opens up after about 70k. Sounds like the frame is breaking everytime the pedals are go round. I have to ride with a 10mm Allen key in my pocket just in case the crank feels like falling off. Love the BB30!! and the frame!!
> Moo



is that a carbon 5? 

and why dont u bring it back to your lbs to have them fix/replace it under warranty?


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