# Irate motorists – did I do something wrong?



## BostonG (Apr 13, 2010)

Yesterday I was on my way home from work on a busy 3 lane street in Boston. Although it is a busy street, I travel it almost every day so I know what to look for. I need to cut across the 3 lanes to get to a 4th left turning lane. If the traffic is too much I’ll usually pull over to the curb and walk my bike across, then get back on and continue on my way. Yesterday was fine so I cut across without a problem and took my place in line behind an unusually large number of cars waiting for the left turn arrow. There were about 20 cars in front of me and a bunch that accumulated behind me. Directly behind me was a large van. The left turn arrow was very fast. 1st arrow – 5 cars are able to make it, 2nd arrow another 5 cars are able to make it, 3rd arrow another 5 cars. By the 3rd arrow I pretty much knew that I wasn’t going to make the light so I did not ride up fast to the motorist in front of me, I instead took a bit of time - but it did not matter one bit because I knew we would not make that 3rd light. We were all upset because it was taking so long. After not making the 3rd arrow, the guy in the van behind me began yelling obscenities and cursing. He then stopped short behind me and rode up very close, and I mean very close up next to my rear tire. So close in fact that his bumper very lightly touched. I moved up a few inches and got a bit nervous. I heard him yelling and saying something like “if I miss this f!*& light again I’ll run right through!” I am sure it was directed towards me. He may have gotten more upset because I did not ride up fast to the motorist in front of me, but again, it would not have mattered. I could not get out of his way because there were 3 lanes of cars zipping by me on my right and subway tracks on my left. I suppose I could have gotten up on the stones near the subway tracks on the left and let him go by but then I would have been stuck. Should I have done something different? This guy was a complete ass (obviously) but he was in a large van and I knew his state of mind was unstable so there was really nothing I could do but pedal hard when the light turned so that he didn’t hit me, which seemed like a real possibility if we missed that light again. I haven’t been riding for years, but still for a good amount of time and this was the first time I got really anxious and scared about what a motorist would do on purpose. What would you have done?


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

You didn't do anything wrong. This type of person isn't going to listen to reason and escalating the confrontation isn't wise. The only thing I might have done differently (especially if he made contact with the bike) would be to take down the license number and file a police report. Yelling is one thing, making intentional contact is a whole other thing. JMHO.


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## Allez Rouge (Jan 1, 1970)

Yes, you did do something wrong. You, gasp, dared to ride your bicycle on "his" roads. 

When his bumper touched my rear tire I would have taken out my cell phone and held it up and said, "If you do that again, I'm dialing 9-1-1. Believe it. Are we clear?"

/+1 on getting his plate number.


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## Slim Again Soon (Oct 25, 2005)

First come, first served -- you got there ahead of him, he's supposed to get in line and deal with it, not threaten to mash those ahead of him.

You kept your cool ... that's hard to do but the best thing.

You handled all of this very well.


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## Keeping up with Junior (Feb 27, 2003)

*Game On*



BostonG said:


> ...So close in fact that his bumper very lightly touched...
> ...I got really anxious and scared about what a motorist would do on purpose. What would you have done?


Contact equals game on and all my options are available to defend my life and property from someone threatening harm to me. Personally I will not tolerate threats on my life. Plenty of ideas in a recent thread so peruse those and decide what you are willing to do.

You did what most cyclist would do when someone threatens their life, slink away in fear.


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## BostonG (Apr 13, 2010)

Thanks. I did manage to get his plate # - just wasn't completely sure what to do with it. I was going to post it on my local yahoo bike group and thought about getting it to the fuzz too. The cell phone thing may have been a good idea but it was inside my bag on the back of the bike, and my emotions were a tangle of fear and anger so I just wanted to get out of there without escalation. I am actually kind of proud of myself keeping control - my piss and vinegar meter definitely rose. I just remembered that after shouting a bunch of different things he actually said "If I don't make the f''n light again, I'll push you right through."Thanks for helping to jar my memory, I think I will file a report.


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

Keeping up with Junior said:


> Contact equals game on and all my options are available to defend my life and property from someone threatening harm to me. Personally I will not tolerate threats on my life. Plenty of ideas in a recent thread so peruse those and decide what you are willing to do.
> 
> You did what most cyclist would do when someone threatens their life, slink away in fear.


Oh, BTW Rambo, Floyd called...he wants his testosterone back...


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

BostonG said:


> Thanks. I did manage to get his plate # - just wasn't completely sure what to do with it. I was going to post it on my local yahoo bike group and thought about getting it to the fuzz too. The cell phone thing may have been a good idea but it was inside my bag on the back of the bike, and my emotions were a tangle of fear and anger so I just wanted to get out of there without escalation. I am actually kind of proud of myself keeping control - my piss and vinegar meter definitely rose. I just remembered that after shouting a bunch of different things he actually said "If I don't make the f''n light again, I'll push you right through."Thanks for helping to jar my memory, I think I will file a report.


Keep us posted with what happens.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

I'm suprised your rear wheel didn't go out of true from the contact. I try to ignore drivers who honk or yell out the window and that's usually the best way to go. If someone takes the time to stop and say something to me, my usual response is to say "if I'm breaking the law, call the police, I'll wait". Or I'll offer to call the police for them. Another defense for offensive drivers is to take your cell phone out and act like you're taking a picture of them. Two weeks ago I had a guy stop to yell at me about not using the bike path instead of the ten foot wide shoulder where I was riding. I pointed my camera free Blackberry at him and started narrative comments that he could hear. That made him drive away. 

On left turn lanes, I usually move up on the right when the light turns green and take the turn really wide.


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## saf-t (Sep 24, 2008)

Definitely call the BPD and file a report.


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## Keeping up with Junior (Feb 27, 2003)

*Options*

Strange how your mind immediately jumps to violence as the only option. There are many choices of how you can deal with someone threatening your life and each will vary with the situation and people involved. However, as I noted and you can confirm it in many similar threads, the OP did what most cyclist do.



Opus51569 said:


> Oh, BTW Rambo, Floyd called...he wants his testosterone back...


Floyd can have my testosterone when he pries it from my cold, dead fingers.



Opus51569 said:


> Keep us posted with what happens.


Let me save the OP the trouble. He will post on some cycling forums and all the cyclist will agree that it was a terrible thing that happened to him. Many will be proud that he sheepishly did what they perceive as the safe thing and let the bully in the car know that he can intimidate the kids in their shiny pants whenever he is frustrated while driving. Someone will post about carrying and the debate will take a sudden drift in another direction. The police will reluctantly make a report and then do nothing about it.


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## BostonG (Apr 13, 2010)

bigbill said:


> I'm suprised your rear wheel didn't go out of true from the contact.
> 
> On left turn lanes, I usually move up on the right when the light turns green and take the turn really wide.



The contact was very light. He stopped first then rode up slowly until he made light contact. Nothing hard enough for any damage at all, just enough to let me know he was breathing down my neck. 

I thought about riding up on the right but decided against it for 2 reasons:
1) there was a long line of cars I would have had to overtake and I was trying to be fair to them rather than blowing past them on their right
2) There was a safety issue - cars were passing me on my right (I was in a left turn lane) and the lanes are too narrow for comfort.

The one thing I could have done was overtake the line of cars at first before pulling into the lane because there weren't cars on my right wizzing by me yet. But again, the issue would have been fairness and also, it is possible someone waiting for the arrow could have decided to go straight instead and pulled out of the lane. I always have that issue - should I overtake the cars waiting for the left turn signal (and pull up next to the first car) or wait behind them in line?


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## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

I tend to keep a camera with me when I ride for just this sort of thing. Turn around, take the driver's picture & one of the license plate.

Cameras scare people.


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## Keeping up with Junior (Feb 27, 2003)

*Bumper Cars*



BostonG said:


> ...I always have that issue - should I overtake the cars waiting for the left turn signal (and pull up next to the first car) or wait behind them in line?


I like to use cars as shields when I go through intersections. Thus being on the right side of a car as we both make the left turn can sometimes provide me with some protection from other vehicles in the intersection. You need to be careful that your shield is not blocking you from being seen by other potential threats. This choice will vary a lot with traffic and road conditions so you always have to think. In this individual case with the potential for a a lefty going straight I think you made the right choice with waiting in line for your turn. Always consider all your options and choose the one that is safest for you in your particular situation.


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

Keeping up with Junior said:


> I like to use cars as shields when I go through intersections. Thus being on the right side of a car as we both make the left turn can sometimes provide me with some protection from other vehicles in the intersection. You need to be careful that your shield is not blocking you from being seen by other potential threats. This choice will vary a lot with traffic and road conditions so you always have to think. In this individual case with the potential for a a lefty going straight I think you made the right choice with waiting in line for your turn. Always consider all your options and choose the one that is safest for you in your particular situation.


You've gone from intimating that the O.P. is somehow a coward for not adopting an "it's on" attitude, to giving him advice that has the potential to get him killed.

O.P., please do not ride on the right side of a car making a left hand turn. You run the risk of winding up in the driver's blind spot on the right side and if s/he swings wide you could easily find yourself either being hit or forced off the road. Stay behind the car in front of you and turn through the intersection just like any other vehicle.


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## bignose (Sep 15, 2005)

U lock + headlights.


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## YuriB (Mar 24, 2005)

NUTT said:


> I tend to keep a camera with me when I ride for just this sort of thing. Turn around, take the driver's picture & one of the license plate.
> 
> Cameras scare people.


+1 camera in on jersey pocket, cell in the other.


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## 2cflyr (Apr 9, 2002)

bignose said:


> U lock + headlights.


= more irate driver operating a ton+ weight vehicle. yup, there's a good idea.

make a report with the PD, and i dig the camera idea for the idiot and his license plate.


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## Loraura (Jun 30, 2008)

I never suggest pulling up beside stopped cars on their right. They are not looking for vehicles to appear there. Staying behind them like any other vehicle puts you where drivers expect vehicles to be.

I'm not sure what I would have done in your case. I'm sure my heart would have been racing and adrenaline pumping. I probably wouldn't have done the safe, sane, rational, legal thing, so I'll just stop there. Any advice I gave on that would be speculation, and possibly bad advice.


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## andulong (Nov 23, 2006)

If you get into a "fight" with a 2 ton vehicle you WILL lose on the road. You might win in court and your survivors can collect your winnings.


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## BostonG (Apr 13, 2010)

Well, I called and spoke to the PD and Boston apparently used to have a form for reporting these types of things. They referred me to an official statement that says:
“To complain about a driver who drove so as to endanger you, whether through extreme carelessness or malevolence, send a letter describing the incident with the license plate number to the Registry of Motor Vehicles "Office of Driver Control, PO Box 199150, Boston, MA 02119-9150.”
I’m sure glad I got that license plate #. It’s not like Motor Vehicles is going to go rip this guy from his house and spank him in the public square but It’ll make me feel better to just write and send the letter.
Thanks everyone for your posts, I always respect the opinions of more experienced cyclists (even you “Keeping Up With Junior”).


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## milkbaby (Aug 14, 2009)

Good for you BostonG! Maybe nothing will happen to that dangerous driver immediately, but your report will be evidence of his criminal behavoir that could be used in court against him in the future.

I like to carry my cell phone in an easily accesible place to video people, but luckily I haven't had to resort to that as my town is mostly cyclist friendly (or at least cyclist tolerant).


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## dahut (May 13, 2010)

Most auto pilots are unaware that bicycles are universally considered vehicles in the eye of the law. Molesting you is the same as doing so to a car and is grounds for enforcement. Chances are he would have treated a car in his way in the same manner, regardless. An @ss is [email protected], no matter where you find him.

The fact that you are a cyclist and he a van driver means YOU have to have the brains. The burden really is on you, not him. Being an enraged and self-righteous cyclist only excites you - it does little for anyone else. Escalating the confrontation with threats or violent outbursts will just as likely earn you the strongarm treatment, as much as anything you can bring down on him. Much depends on your sense of pious outrage. In short, getting mad and outraged feels good, but yields few profitable results.

First order of business is to stay out of his way and save your genitals. Then, if time allows, give your 30 second 'cycling law' speech to the guy. Expect nothing to come of it and the driver to ignore you. 
That's the normal reaction when people are corrected by others. 
Finally, ensure the driver that you have both the duty and the obligation to remand him to law enforcement if he persists in endangering you and others. 
Cellphones are great for that.

The best thing about an urban encounter is that it is slower and often face to face. 
Much can be accomplished if a cool head is maintained. 

By contrast, it beats impotently flipping off brainless drivers as they careen by at 55 mph, out on the highway.


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## mondayC (May 22, 2008)

BostonG said:


> in Boston.


I'm judgmental, but I think this was the the issue. That guy would have been a complete ass regardless.


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## UrbanPrimitive (Jun 14, 2009)

I'm with Dahut. This guy probably would have done the exact same thing if you were driving a car, _especially_ a small one, as he did with you on the bike. Of course the difference is that a little rubbing in a car means you're most likely scared that your car will get damaged, not that your head will get popped. Sounds to me like this guy has been practicing rage for a while. 

BigBill - I'm stealing your phone tactic. That made my day!


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## orange_julius (Jan 24, 2003)

BostonG said:


> Well, I called and spoke to the PD and Boston apparently used to have a form for reporting these types of things. They referred me to an official statement that says:
> “To complain about a driver who drove so as to endanger you, whether through extreme carelessness or malevolence, send a letter describing the incident with the license plate number to the Registry of Motor Vehicles "Office of Driver Control, PO Box 199150, Boston, MA 02119-9150.”
> I’m sure glad I got that license plate #. It’s not like Motor Vehicles is going to go rip this guy from his house and spank him in the public square but It’ll make me feel better to just write and send the letter.
> Thanks everyone for your posts, I always respect the opinions of more experienced cyclists (even you “Keeping Up With Junior”).


I was told by a Boston cop and an Arlington cop that there is an online form somewhere for reporting dangerous motorists. One of them said that it could be on the Mass RMV website. But I have not been able to find it. If you have better luck, let us know. 

More convenient than writing to the RMV by snail mail ....

FWIW, I think you did the right thing. Was it on Comm Ave?


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## medimond (Apr 26, 2009)

Honestly you did the right thing. Document the event and report it, that's according to my buddy who's a cop. That guy was a hot head and nothing you could say would change his mind, as his mind was already made up! 

Oh ... if I had a commute that required multiple light rotations I don't think that I'd be the happiest person.


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## Fredrico (Jun 15, 2002)

*Bingo!*



BostonG said:


> ...The one thing I could have done was overtake the line of cars at first before pulling into the lane because there weren't cars on my right wizzing by me yet. But again, the issue would have been fairness and also, it is possible someone waiting for the arrow could have decided to go straight instead and pulled out of the lane. I always have that issue - should I overtake the cars waiting for the left turn signal (and pull up next to the first car) or wait behind them in line?


To hell with "fairness." You're on a bicycle, taking up two feet of road, not in their way, really. They can pass especially on left turns without problems.

I always go right to the front of a line of cars in a left turn lane. Sure watch like a hawk for some fool to pull over in front of you, but go to the front and park yourself off the right bumper of the first car waiting to turn. When the left turn arrows goes green, give this car a wide path, so you don't hold up the line.

Your mistake, forgive me, was acting like a car. In that case, you should have glued right up to the car in front of you, not held back with the truck right behind you. I would have honked too, even if you were driving a car! :lol:


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## UrbanPrimitive (Jun 14, 2009)

Fredrico said:


> I always go right to the front of a line of cars in a left turn lane.


Where I ride, that's illegal, flat out. I operate on the "same rules, same rights" ideology. I figure I can't ride like the rules don't apply to me without accepting that drivers are going to assume that rights don't apply to me either. But that's just my two bits.


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## Fixed (May 12, 2005)

*nothing wrong*

No, you did nothing wrong. You are entitled to be everywhere a car is, except for freeways and keeping right (with exceptions, like left turns). 

Even with that in mind, on my commute routes, I try to look for routes that have safer or more convenient left turn opportunities. If I have a choice, I'll pick a two lane slower road to turn left from, rather than the 6 lane with 50 mph speed limit. 

My priorities for bike riding are always 1. Safe, 2. Legal, 3. Courteous, and 4. Fast, in that order. So, main goal, no matter what, is to be safe. 

If there is a very long line of cars waiting to turn left in a left turn lane, if there are wide lanes with room between the left turning cars and the cars in the through lane, I sometimes will pull up to the front in between the two lanes. I'm more likely to do so if there are dual left turn arrows, when the through lanes will not be moving at the same time. Part of my reasoning is that if I am 10 cars back turning left, the cars around me might be going close to 25 mph by the time they even get up to the intersection, and also they likely will be impatient and trying to make the light. I don't want to be in front of someone in that situation, not keeping up, or risk being run over from behind by someone going that fast, not paying attention, or wanting to run the light. I especially don't want to be smashed in between two cars if the one behind me doesn't stop in time. So, although there is some risk to doing so, I sometimes think it is better to move to the right and start off at the green with the lead cars. Just pull up far enough that the lead car can see you and knows you are there.


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## Keeping up with Junior (Feb 27, 2003)

*Cloverleaf?*



Fixed said:


> My priorities for bike riding are always 1. Safe, 2. Legal, 3. Courteous, and 4. Fast, in that order. So, main goal, no matter what, is to be safe.


Good to see a thinking rider.



BostonG said:


> Yesterday I was on my way home from work on a busy 3 lane street in Boston. Although it is a busy street, I travel it almost every day so I know what to look for. I need to cut across the 3 lanes to get to a 4th left turning lane...


Since you are traveling this route daily I think you need to explore some alternatives to this nightmare intersection. Perhaps create your own version of a cloverleaf like when getting onto an interstate.

Assuming you are heading south and then turning left to head east would this work for you? Perhaps instead of cutting across three lanes of traffic to make a left turn you can instead stay in the right lane and continue through the intersection heading south. As soon as you are through the intersection turn right onto the sidewalk at the southwest corner of the intersection. Get off your bike or jump the curb and get in the right lane of the eastbound road you ultimately want to be on. Then you can head straight through the intersection (eastbound) on the road you ultimately want to be on. This assumes the light to go straight through (eastbound) is much longer than the left hand turn light you currently sit through several cycles of.

You will have to think about what works for you based on the intersection and traffic conditions. Use Fixed's priorities with an emphasis on number 1.


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## Fredrico (Jun 15, 2002)

*How parsimonious are your cops?*



UrbanPrimitive said:


> Where I ride, that's illegal, flat out. I operate on the "same rules, same rights" ideology. I figure I can't ride like the rules don't apply to me without accepting that drivers are going to assume that rights don't apply to me either. But that's just my two bits.


In LA, DC, NVA, MD, and ETX, whether it's technically legal or not, the cops have never flagged me for doing this. I've also never been honked or yelled at, unless I'm right in front of the lead car, blocking his way. In gridlock, when no cars are moving, I'll even go up the left side of the lane, and if room runs out, switch over to the right side, or vice versa.

Why ride a bike, and not take advantage of the fact you have plenty of roadway, and the cars don't? :shocked: Respect? Nobody cares! You're not a car. Just don't get in their way, don't interrupt their flow, and everyone's happy. :biggrin5:


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## Fai Mao (Nov 3, 2008)

Turn lanes are always problematic. I have on occasion made three rights (In Hong Kong three lefts) rather than going across traffic or pulled into a corner parking lot and used it like a jug handle. That way I don't have move across lanes of traffic. That is illegal for an automobile but make sense for a bike. It is always easier for me to deal with cars that are moving in a straight line, especially in heavy traffic. 

Another trick that works here is to use the tram tracks on HK Island. Cars are generally not allow on them; the downside being that the trams travel really slow.

Semi-off topic.

I have found that the worst incidents like this happen in the places that are suppose to be the most "Bike Friendly" I almost never had any problem in Houston or Hong Kong but was nearly killed in Austin once by a person with a "Save the Earth" bumper sticker on the back of their automobile and run off the road several times. I had fewer problems with red-necks in pickups, especially in rural areas than I did with mothers in mini-vans


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## seth586 (May 13, 2010)

Something similar happened to a friend of mine. An aggressive pickup driver tailgated the cyclist, blew his horn, passed in front of the cyclist, and then slammed on his brakes, and my friend couldn't stop in time...running in to the rear bumper. The guy got out of the truck and started yelling at my friend. At the time he was by himself, but took note of the license plate and made a report. The police couldn't do anything about it, they said it would turn in to a "he said, she said" argument. If someone else witnessed the event, or if it was on camera, that would make things completely different. 

Does anyone make simple "security" cameras that you could mount to the bike? You know how cheap these flash memory cameras are these days...just a low-power device that records the past 15 minutes, and you can stop after an incident... maybe I just started a business idea for someone! It takes a good 15 seconds after something happens to take a pic with a phone...


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## iconicflux (Jun 11, 2010)

In the case of a pickup driver that jams brakes and causes an accident, seems to me that if they did that and then exited their vehicle, you'd be within your rights to mace them as you'd have a legitimate fear for your life.

A better idea though is to file an accident report and make their insurance company pay up. A couple of those on their record and they couldn't afford to drive.


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## Gnarly 928 (Nov 19, 2005)

Don't start a fistfight wearing cleats. Don't use your Colnago as a club. Don't ride in Boston?


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## moreair (Aug 22, 2008)

In Ohio you can write to the BMV and get the name and address of the plate owner, It would be fun to get his name and address and write a childish letter to him once a month for two or three years. However, do not let on that you the writer are a cyclist. This is one way to turn this into something fun.

No police report. It will solve nothing and he will have access to your name through public records.

I would for sure try to find another route home. This intersection sounds crazy.


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## iconicflux (Jun 11, 2010)

A lot of people are more seriously hurt by taking chunks out of their pocket books than they are via a physical altercation. I say, hit them where it hurts so they'll think twice about it the next time.


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