# Tarmac Pro Disc



## MXRacer986 (Mar 6, 2014)

Anyone have the di2 pro disc yet? Thinking of replacing my Wilier Zero7 with one. 
Love to hear reviews and actual weight (56).


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## apn (Mar 1, 2012)

Love the Tarmac and went shopping the di2/disc versions until I learned about the f*d up chainline solution.

While I can understand the design purity of not wanting to extend the chainstays to maintain the same frame geometry for rim/disc frames, I hate the idea of being locked into custom (Roval) wheels, or more specifically hubs.

Due to short chainstays f*ing up the chainline on the disc frames, Spesh created a custom hub that moves the cassette inward 5mm. *Now you're locked in*.

Preliminary reading suggests Cervelo did something equally frustrating on their R3 disc; using a custom FSA chainset to solve the problem at the front-end of the chain.


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## TricrossRich (Mar 26, 2014)

apn said:


> Love the Tarmac and went shopping the di2/disc versions until I learned about the f*d up chainline solution.
> 
> While I can understand the design purity of not wanting to extend the chainstays to maintain the same frame geometry for rim/disc frames, I hate the idea of being locked into custom (Roval) wheels, or more specifically hubs.
> 
> ...


Exactly... this is why I don't think anyone should buy a disc brake road bike yet. There is no consensus on standards and I don't think there will be until the pros are allowed to race them. Obviously, I know that they were allowed to race them on a limited basis starting in September but that was strictly for testing. I had a disc brake road bike, a Specialized Tricross and I loved the braking and some of the advantages the system offered. It was great in adverse conditions... but it also had some minor annoyances and problems. Most of those problems were, IMO, results of using a retrofitted MTB set up... As of yet, there is no true road bike disc brake system that has been developed.. but rather stuff that has been taken form MTB tech and modified or fabled to work. The manufacturers won't spend the money and time to do this until they can use and exploit that tech at the highest level, but the UCI doesn't want to approve disc brakes for full use until those problems are solved, so we really have a case of what came first, the chicken or the egg.


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## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

Yup, they really screwed up on that one.

Spec was ignorant enough to think that the whole industry would follow their lead. They came up with their own SCS hub design/dimensions and put it up to compete against Shimano's 142x12 thru axle standard. Guess who won? Not Spec.

They made the SCS "standard" available to everyone and did their best to actually push it. They tried their very best to get other manufacturers on board but it looks like nobody likes Spec. They all decided to go with the Shimano standard instead. My vote is because it's, you know, a MUCH better standard for road disc brakes.

So now Spec is out in the cold by themselves. They created this proprietary system and hoped everyone else would follow suit and make them look like an industry leader. Instead they just look like the clowns that they are. And in the end the real loser is the one who chooses to buy their bike.


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## MXRacer986 (Mar 6, 2014)

I am not a huge fan of the brand as "everyone" has a Tarmac, but from the research i have done this is a really good bike/design Unless they are being "paid" to give such good reviews.

As far as the brake technology not being road specific, I am not concerned about that at this time. When they develope a "road" specific version I will buy again.
This is one reason for looking at the Pro rather than the SWorks.

Can't race with it yet, again not an issue as I don't race anymore. 

Rear hub being non-standard isn't an issue to me as the only additional wheelset I would want is a climbing set similar to the Enve 2.2. I am sure I could find a Specialized hub or just buy a complete rear wheel for the hub. Sell the rim to recoup some cash. The front hub is standard.

So if you have a Tarmac Pro disc di2, I would love to hear how you like it
Thanks 
Brian


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## TricrossRich (Mar 26, 2014)

MXRacer986 said:


> I am not a huge fan of the brand as "everyone" has a Tarmac, but from the research i have done this is a really good bike/design Unless they are being "paid" to give such good reviews.


I do agree that the new Tarmac is a great bike... Almost all of the magazines have reviewed it as such and several of the people I ride with that have picked one up have said the same thing. It is a Fantastic all-around bike.



MXRacer986 said:


> As far as the brake technology not being road specific, I am not concerned about that at this time. When they develope a "road" specific version I will buy again.
> This is one reason for looking at the Pro rather than the SWorks.
> 
> Can't race with it yet, again not an issue as I don't race anymore.


Here's the biggest issue that I had with my disc brake bike... everytime I swapped wheels, I had to re-adjust the position of the caliper to prevent the caliper from rubbing on the rotor. IMO, this is the biggest pain in the butt because if you don't get it right, it rubs and makes a hum like a tuning fork. The tolerances between different wheel sets can be off by just 3 or 4mm and it will cause issues. I've spoken with friends that ride disc brake mountain bikes and none of them complain about this and the only conclusion we can come to is that when you're on a MTB, banging around in the woods, you don't notice those subtle noises as much as when you're on an otherwise completely silent road bike on an empty country road. 



MXRacer986 said:


> Rear hub being non-standard isn't an issue to me as the only additional wheelset I would want is a climbing set similar to the Enve 2.2. I am sure I could find a Specialized hub or just buy a complete rear wheel for the hub. Sell the rim to recoup some cash. The front hub is standard.
> 
> So if you have a Tarmac Pro disc di2, I would love to hear how you like it
> Thanks
> Brian


I don't think you can simply build up any wheel you want with the rear hub... if so, I don't see why people would be complaining so much and they are.... but if you love the bike go for it. I think disc brakes offer some great advantages and I really do think we'll see the pro peloton switching over to them. I just wouldn't be comfortable spending that kind of money on a bike that has tech that can literally change entirely in a season or 2. I'll wait until the questions are answered... As you said though, you're comfortable with that decision, so go for it... its a great bike, for sure.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

I have mixed feelings about buying a disc equipped bike right now. As staff from Giant pointed out a year or so ago the debate about what the disc brake axle standard will be is coming to an end and it's becoming pretty clear that 12mm thru axles will likely be what everyone goes with once the dust settles. Most major wheel manufacturers are already producing their disc wheelesets with 12mm thru axles. What that means for early Tarmac Disc adopters, I'm not sure. Maybe Specialized goes back in the lab and figures out a way to move to thru axles on the Tarmac like they have with the Crux, Roubaix, and Diverge. It seems like the simplest/best solution if you want to create abike that is compatible with other wheelesets. FWIW, I like the Norco Tactic Disc and the Focus Cayo Disc most out of what's out there in the race category right now, but more bikes are coming and I agree with Rich that it's probably best to wait another year or two before jumping in.


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## aqualelaki (Sep 5, 2011)

I have Zero 7 2015 and S-works Tarmac 2015 rim brake. It might not exactly the review you're looking for, but at least I can tell you about the handling and weight. I like Tarmac for handling. I feel comfortable on descend and stiffer than Zero 7. I race with Tarmac and ride my Zero 7 for an easy ride only. Zero 7 is lighter and climbing nicely and no doubt the frame is really nice looking. I'm not a big fan on disc brake with SCS. I own 2013 Roubaix disc brake (non SCS). It's my rain bike (I live in Seattle) so I'm thankful when it's rain but I don't feel itchy with the current disc brake technology. IMO and like others mention to wait for couple years for a mature technology. I would suggest that you go for test ride to see if you really like it and go from there.


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## Toz (Nov 25, 2015)

I’ve had one of these bikes for four months now, putting around 2,500 miles on it. Prior to this one, I was on a rim braked UDi2 road bike for four years. It was time to upgrade and consider which way to go. 

My two requirements for the new road bike were Di2 and disc brakes. Disc brakes were a given as I was always taking out my cable disc braked cyclo-cross bike with 105 as soon as there was any hint of rain, rather than my rim braked road bike. This was because I found using the rim brakes in the wet was often a case of wishing and hoping. Waiting a wheel revolution or three for the rims to clear was always a scary proposition under emergency braking conditions. Furthermore, I don’t race and never will. Hydraulic discs vs cable discs? Most manufacturers were going hydraulic, especially on their Di2 models, so there wasn’t much choice here. 

After test riding a few hydraulic disc UDi2 bikes, and being suitably impressed with hydraulic discs over cable discs, the Specialized came out on top. Maybe it was just that Specialized had race geometry, which I’m used to, compared to endurance geometry on the others. But it certainly felt like a much better ride.

I was happy to go with this bike and its limitations or restrictions, such as quick release skewers and the proprietary Roval wheels.

This is my first Tarmac, so many of the reasons I like it may be common to all Tarmac models.


Likes:

The color scheme – matte black with white highlights under the top tube and on the fork and stays.
11-speed Di2 as opposed to 10-speed Di2 on my old bike
The mid-compact crankset is a nice change from the usual standard or compact offerings
The 11-speed Di2’s ability to go to a 32(?) cog on the back for some serious hill climbing
The saddle is very comfortable. I’ve never bought a saddle and always stayed with whatever came with the bike, but this saddle seems more comfortable than those on my other bikes.
The wheels – they look great – not too shallow, not too deep, no braking surface
The carbon cranks – they look great too
The wedge seat-post clamp – it looks almost like an integrated seat post, but is still fully adjustable
The way the hydraulic lines enter and exit the frame/fork/stay – all beautifully crafted
The neatness of the whole set up – very clean lines
The ride – it’s comfortably good on a variety of surfaces
The handling – wonderful through the corners and on the descents
But most of all……the hydraulic disc brakes. They’re a revelation! Possibly more of a revelation than Di2 was over mechanical shifting. So smooth and syrupy. So easy to use, wet or dry. One finger braking is no problem. The level of control (modulation) is amazing. They inspire confidence.


Dislikes:

Despite the supposed ability to cross-chain due to the cassette being set further inboard on the proprietary Roval rear wheel, I get pronounced chain-line noise when using the small chain-ring and small cog. The bike doesn’t like this combination at all. Running on the big chain-ring and big cog is ok though. I shouldn’t cross-chain anyway, so maybe this is not a valid complaint.

The lines of the bike could have been cleaner if the rear brake bridge was totally removed from between the seat-stays. However, this may still be a structural requirement.

The bike's lines could also have been cleaner if they’d used Shimano flat-mount hydraulic discs instead of the post-mounted ones. The new flat-mount discs probably weren’t available in time for the release of this bike.

Some creaking noises come from the rear end when putting down power going up hills in the big cog. Not sure of the cause – could be spokes, or rear hub.

I’ve already dropped this beautiful bike a couple of times. All my own fault. Not happy. :mad2:


But overall, the positives far outweigh the negatives, and it’s a bike I love to look at and love to ride.

My 54 weighs 18.2 lbs or 8.26kg. Being too lazy to strip it down and weigh it properly, this weight includes the good, light, soft Specialized tires being swapped out for heavier tires, Shimano SPD pedals (420g), bottle cages, wireless computer and GPS mount.


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## aclinjury (Sep 12, 2011)

TricrossRich said:


> Exactly... this is why I don't think anyone should buy a disc brake road bike yet. There is no consensus on standards and I don't think there will be until the pros are allowed to race them. Obviously, I know that they were allowed to race them on a limited basis starting in September but that was strictly for testing. I had a disc brake road bike, a Specialized Tricross and I loved the braking and some of the advantages the system offered. It was great in adverse conditions... but it also had some minor annoyances and problems. Most of those problems were, IMO, results of using a retrofitted MTB set up... As of yet, there is no true road bike disc brake system that has been developed.. but rather stuff that has been taken form MTB tech and modified or fabled to work. The manufacturers won't spend the money and time to do this until they can use and exploit that tech at the highest level, but the UCI doesn't want to approve disc brakes for full use until those problems are solved, so we really have a case of what came first, the chicken or the egg.


a great argument on holding off on buying disc bikes. Standards are too loose, and parts in the future for obsolote standards will be nonexistent. E.g., I see the 130mm rear disc brake wheels,, will be impossible to buy in a few years. Then one's hope that the rear wheel will last forever as finding a replacement wheel will be impossible.


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## SundayNiagara (Apr 17, 2014)

aclinjury said:


> a great argument on holding off on buying disc bikes. Standards are too loose, and parts in the future for obsolote standards will be nonexistent. E.g., I see the 130mm rear disc brake wheels,, will be impossible to buy in a few years. Then one's hope that the rear wheel will last forever as finding a replacement wheel will be impossible.


Like.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

aclinjury said:


> a great argument on holding off on buying disc bikes. Standards are too loose, and parts in the future for obsolote standards will be nonexistent. E.g., I see the 130mm rear disc brake wheels,, will be impossible to buy in a few years. Then one's hope that the rear wheel will last forever as finding a replacement wheel will be impossible.


I agree that it is probably best to hold off for another season or two, but I kind of doubt compatibility will be this big of an issue. There will be changes and improvements for sure, but _someone_ will make it their business to make parts that make whatever new developments/products are produced compatible with current bikes. There's money to be made there and some small company will capitalize on it (like Praxis, etc.). Moreover, I don't expect any major changes for at least a few years and by then, a lot of these early adopters will probably be ready to upgrade to a new bike anyway.

The reason I say hold off for a season or two is that the pros begin racing discs this upcoming season; that will lead to an official standard for thru axles and wheels and more incentive for companies to create disc compatible products. As pro teams switch over to discs, more wheels, calipers, component groups, and other technology will be produced. We will see whether teams go all the way disc or whether they just reserve it for bikes used for the cobbled classics and stages that have those same elements. It's happening and it's going to be clear what to buy in a little bit. I would wait for that clarity, but it's still not a horrible idea to jump in now, unless you race. Lots of people have them now and love them from what I hear.

Disc brakes to be allowed in WorldTour races from January, can be used in amateur ranks in 2017 | CyclingTips

Bend in the Road: Road disc axle shuffle - BikeRadar USA


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## MXRacer986 (Mar 6, 2014)

*aqualelaki *- I am not a fan of the 2015 Zero7.It flexes too much when descending thru switchbacks. It’s a great climbing and all day bike. I just did a 3 day, 300 mile/28K GF on it and it was wonderful….a bit sketchy on some of the descents though! My 2014 Zero 7 was a much betterframe, not as pretty to look at, but MUCH better frame! 
*Toz* – thanks for the review, it is appreciated.

I am either gong to buy the Disc Pro or S WORKS (frameset/wheelset)sometime first qtr. There will always be reasons not to adopt a new technology. Ithought Di2 wasn’t worth the extra money, but now I would never go back to mechanical. All the reasons to wait have some merit, but if there is a “standard” set in the next few years… justanother reason to buy a new bike!

I come from a motocross background so disc brakes just seem to be a no brainier to me. This is just my opion, but I think the UCI’s decsion to allow dics in 2016 will force teams to pick their posion due to wheel logistics. I also belive that this will drive technology/standards and the majority of “high end” race bikes will come standard with dics withinthe next few years. The technology isnt going away… again just a motocross guy giving his opion. Don’t hate.

*My reasons: 
*Better brake modulation – I drag my brakes (front/rear) through turns when I decend and dics will make _my technigue_ more confidence inspiring. This technique comes from racing motocorss as you tend to drag the front brake in ruts to keep the bike down (leaned over). 

One set of wheels – I ride in the mtns on a regualr basis and changing wheelsets will be eliminated. And I do ride carbons on some loops in North GA but I am not gong to down the backside of Hog Pen with carbons, not even withmy Enve set.

I think disc look pretty bad ass on a road bike! Again just a motocross guy that isnt a traditonist
Brian


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## tyrich88 (Jul 12, 2013)

TricrossRich said:


> Here's the biggest issue that I had with my disc brake bike... everytime I swapped wheels, I had to re-adjust the position of the caliper to prevent the caliper from rubbing on the rotor. IMO, this is the biggest pain in the butt because if you don't get it right, it rubs and makes a hum like a tuning fork. The tolerances between different wheel sets can be off by just 3 or 4mm and it will cause issues. I've spoken with friends that ride disc brake mountain bikes and none of them complain about this and the only conclusion we can come to is that when you're on a MTB, banging around in the woods, you don't notice those subtle noises as much as when you're on an otherwise completely silent road bike on an empty country road.


Just to reply to this from a mountain biking stand point. If a disc is rubbing, it's noticeable... VERY noticeable. I ride my mountain bike in road bike settings almost as much as I do my road bike, as I do a lot of endurance and pace training on it. But even when I'm on the dirt doing XC race training, a rubbing disc is noticeable. And in this instance, I think there is absolutely no reason that the tarmac should be looked down on, or the road disc set ups at all. Comparing them to mountain bike setups would actually be a complement to them as some of the higher end mountain set ups are nothing short of phenomenal.
Road wheels for rim and disc brakes are going to have the same issues. With rim brakes you'll need to adjust for wider or narrower rims, with disc you'll have to adjust for different hubs... this issue is only resolved when someone runs multiples of the same product. For example, either set of my carbon roval mountain bike wheels fits into my Epic frame without issue, no rubbing, AT ALL.

So the issue of swapping wheelsets really shouldn't bother most... especially with the wheelsets that come on the pro disc tarmac. Thats a light, high end carbon wheelset that performs very well. 

I am excited to see where disc road bikes are going. I think the advancements are phenomenal and I can't wait to get a disc road bike because I have had far fewer issues with disc than I have rim brakes. 

I do see the concerns with proprietary systems though. It would be nice if everyone would agree on something so every wheel works on every frame...
Specialized did that with the 142+ on mountain bikes as well... BUT the difference there is it will still fit the 142 standard wheels. 

Maybe they will work towards that on the road as well... fingers crossed.


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