# Landis added to Bahati Foundation roster



## Andrea138 (Mar 10, 2008)

Check it out: http://www.bahatifoundation.org/pro-cycling-team/


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Very interesting


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## Creakyknees (Sep 21, 2003)

Good for Floyd. Very happy for him, I suspect he'll do well now.


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## campyluke (Mar 2, 2010)

I think his team can do some major damage in some races. He picked some very strong riders and Landis just helps the team. I'm pulling for them BIG time!


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## Mootsie (Feb 4, 2004)

Yes, all good. Time for him to move on to the next chapter in his life.


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## Zipp0 (Aug 19, 2008)

I hope this helps Floyd regain his focus and move forward with things, instead of sideways, or backwards. I know there are lots of Floyd haters, but I'm pulling for the guy.


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## chuckice (Aug 25, 2004)

Teaching kids whiskey, hacking and dope early on. Sweet.


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## Zipp0 (Aug 19, 2008)

chuckice said:


> Teaching kids whiskey, hacking and dope early on. Sweet.


Teaching kids that life can smash you in the face, and you can get back up and live to fight another day. 

I swear, some people won't be happy until this man puts a gun in his mouth. He has served his suspension like many, many before him, and now he has every right to move forward with his life.


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## Andrea138 (Mar 10, 2008)

Yep. If he can overcome demons and make the best of it, then I envy him :thumbsup:


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## jlgoodin78 (Dec 13, 2007)

*Agreed*



Zipp0 said:


> Teaching kids that life can smash you in the face, and you can get back up and live to fight another day.
> 
> I swear, some people won't be happy until this man puts a gun in his mouth. He has served his suspension like many, many before him, and now he has every right to move forward with his life.


I absolutely, 100% agree. The dead horse of Floyd hating has been beaten for long enough. He made big mistakes and paid the price. It's just too easy for others to act as if they've never made any mistakes of their own and instead beat down someone who has. Sounds like Floyd has done the best he can to move on and put it past him, and hopefully others start to do the same. I wish him the best of luck.


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## Marcos_E (Dec 16, 2007)

Pff. Landis, who CARES?

Josh Berry, now THAT's the story. He's a former classmate, so I'm a bit of a mark.:thumbsup:


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## alexb618 (Aug 24, 2006)

Zipp0 said:


> Teaching kids that life can smash you in the face, and you can get back up and live to fight another day.
> 
> I swear, some people won't be happy until this man puts a gun in his mouth. He has served his suspension like many, many before him, and now he has every right to move forward with his life.


'some people' wont be happy until this man just admits he f'd up and cheated, like 'many, many before him'

come clean, admit what you did, stop the lies, then maybe you can move on and start to rebuild your reputation within the cycling community


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## rocco (Apr 30, 2005)

I far rather see Landis being a part of this cause than doing the Rock thing.


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## OnTheRivet (Sep 3, 2004)

alexb618 said:


> 'some people' wont be happy until this man just admits he f'd up and cheated, like 'many, many before him'
> 
> come clean, admit what you did, stop the lies, then maybe you can move on and start to rebuild your reputation within the cycling community



Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

Zipp0 said:


> Teaching kids that life can smash you in the face, and you can get back up and live to fight another day.
> 
> I swear, some people won't be happy until this man puts a gun in his mouth. He has served his suspension like many, many before him, and now he has every right to move forward with his life.


Yeah, there are some people who just can't stand that even legitimate disinterested scientists question his 'guilt.' I think it unsettles them that he may have been wronged- because it would have been an awful big wrong, and the only way to assuage those feelings is to align themselves with the most powerful side and convince themselves it's absolute truth. It's the way totalitarianism and fundamentalism work. (There could just be some plain old jealousy in there, too. My guess is dope or no dope, artificial hip or not, Floyd can smoke every Floyd hater out there.)


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## JSR (Feb 27, 2006)

OnTheRivet said:


> Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't


d minus 10, 9, 8, 7...


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## chuckice (Aug 25, 2004)

Adversity..."I cheated...no wait, the man is out to get me. Why don't people want the best for me?" Lol!


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## alexb618 (Aug 24, 2006)

OnTheRivet said:


> Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't


sarchasm
sar·chasm ('sär-"ka-z&m) : The giant gulf (chasm) between what is said and the person who doesn't get it.


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## OldEndicottHiway (Jul 16, 2007)

Andrea138 said:


> Yep. *If he can overcome demons and make the best of it, *then I envy him :thumbsup:



Yup.

:thumbsup:


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## CabDoctor (Jun 11, 2005)

OnTheRivet said:


> Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't


That was mean, you should apologize.


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## jlandry (Jan 12, 2007)

Way to get Andrea's thread sent to hell. Classy.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

I hope he DIES!!!!!!! I HAET HIM!


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## mulkdog45 (Apr 5, 2006)

I hope he does great....go Floyd :thumbsup:


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## blackhat (Jan 2, 2003)

alexb618 said:


> 'some people' wont be happy until this man just admits he f'd up and cheated, like 'many, many before him'
> 
> come clean, admit what you did, stop the lies, then maybe you can move on and start to rebuild your reputation within the cycling community



There's no requirement for allocution. He served his time, lost his jersey and generally paid his debt. If he can ride fast he should have a job.
All the better that it's not with a d-baggy team like rock.


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

*Moderator's Note*



OnTheRivet said:


> Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't


What part of _keep the doping stuff in the appropriate forum_ is so confusing to you? For the borderline personal attack, the profanity and the hijack consider this your warning. Also nice sarcasm detector fail. 

- for everyone else. I have a dream that one day I won't end up having to move EVERY Landis thread. Can you help me with that dream?


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## blackhat (Jan 2, 2003)

spade2you said:


> I hope he DIES!!!!!!! I HAET HIM!


brilliant, you've turned into a parody.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

California L33 said:


> My guess is dope or no dope, artificial hip or not, Floyd can smoke every Floyd hater out there.


They say adversity can bring out the best in some people, leaving aside the question of whether he doped or not, it's pretty clear in this case that adversity brought out the worse in Landis. He doesn't appear to be a "good" person. I don't hate him but I see very little that is admirable or even likable about him. Just because he rides a bike fast doesn't absolve him of being a decent human being.


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## rocco (Apr 30, 2005)

blackhat said:


> There's no requirement for allocution. He served his time, lost his jersey and generally paid his debt. If he can ride fast he should have a job.
> All the better that it's not with a d-baggy team like rock.



On this we totally agree including the closing emphases on d-bag rock.


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## rocco (Apr 30, 2005)

OnTheRivet said:


> Says the guy with the Lance Armstrong hero worship sig. Armstrong DOPED, you're a ****ing idiot if you think he didn't



Classy hijack all the way there, thanks a lot.


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## jlandry (Jan 12, 2007)

Maybe I can overcome my cheeseburger addiction. Lawwwwd help meh!


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## Zipp0 (Aug 19, 2008)

Coolhand said:


> - for everyone else. I have a dream that one day I won't end up having to move EVERY Landis thread. Can you help me with that dream?


How can we help? Instead of moving an entire thread that was started obviously without any reference to doping, delete the post of the offender or move the post instead of the thread. Just about any thread in Pro Cycling could devolve into doping talk very easily.

Contador winning a race? Obviously he is doping.
Armstrong? Doper with undetectible methods
Any Race anywhere - Only a doper can win that race against all the other dopers

So why not just delete or move the offending post. Thread about doping - OK move them.....


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

Dwaynebarry said:


> They say adversity can bring out the best in some people, leaving aside the question of whether he doped or not, it's pretty clear in this case that adversity brought out the worse in Landis. He doesn't appear to be a "good" person. I don't hate him but I see very little that is admirable or even likable about him. Just because he rides a bike fast doesn't absolve him of being a decent human being.


I don't know what he's done other than continually proclaim his innocence. If guilty, then you're right, he's not a nice guy. If innocent, what would you have him do? Admit guilt for 'the good of cycling'? And it is a bit off point. One of the beauties of this sport is that you're judged by how fast you go. You don't get style points. You don't get personality points.


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

Zipp0 said:


> How can we help? Instead of moving an entire thread that was started obviously without any reference to doping, delete the post of the offender or move the post instead of the thread. Just about any thread in Pro Cycling could devolve into doping talk very easily.
> 
> Contador winning a race? Obviously he is doping.
> Armstrong? Doper with undetectible methods
> ...


Amen! I don't know why there's a separate doping forum. To shield those with delicate sensibilities who want to discuss the pure aspects of the sport? Maybe not every pro takes dope, but most of the doping discussions will involve pros. 

The idea that anyone will separate Landis from doping? Believe him or doubt him, if Landis is mentioned, doping will be, too. Maybe we should have a Nazi thread without mentioning the holocaust, or a Hiroshima thread without mentioning A-bombs? It seems unlikely.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

California L33 said:


> I don't know what he's done other than continually proclaim his innocence. If guilty, then you're right, he's not a nice guy. If innocent, what would you have him do? Admit guilt for 'the good of cycling'? And it is a bit off point. One of the beauties of this sport is that you're judged by how fast you go. You don't get style points. You don't get personality points.


I don't equate doping with any sort of slight on one's character. It's pretty clear to me doping was part and parcel of cycling at the time and was in essence expected of a professional. Almost no one was cheating because everyone was doing it.

You really don't know about how Landis behaved toward Lemond?

He's not just proclaiming his innocence, he continues to be dishonest and disingenuous when he talks about the case. His tweets, again, reveal a not-so-great person.

You really believe that because someone rides a bike fast, that is a judge of their charactor and their worth as a person?


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

I'm really irritated that this thread got moved. I thought about posting some encouragement to everyone to try to keep it in pro cycling, but I was afraid that I would just encourage such discussion if I mentioned it. Anyway, I guess I knew this thread would go south as soon as I saw it; makes me sad..... 

I hope Floyd is able to pick himself up and get on with his life. He served his suspension; there's no need to burn him at the stake.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

Dwaynebarry said:


> You really don't know about how Landis behaved toward Lemond?


Lemond was trying to put the nail in his coffin. How would YOU have behaved towards Lemond in that scenario? 

...besides, I don't think Trek was terribly nice to Lemond recently..........


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## Andrea138 (Mar 10, 2008)

Damnit!!!!!!!


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## alexb618 (Aug 24, 2006)

Dwaynebarry said:


> I don't equate doping with any sort of slight on one's character.


LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL


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## iliveonnitro (Feb 19, 2006)

Andrea138 said:


> Damnit!!!!!!!


It's OK. It wasn't your fault.


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

thechriswebb said:


> I'm really irritated that this thread got moved. I thought about posting some encouragement to everyone to try to keep it in pro cycling, but I was afraid that I would just encourage such discussion if I mentioned it. Anyway, I guess I knew this thread would go south as soon as I saw it; makes me sad.....
> 
> I hope Floyd is able to pick himself up and get on with his life. He served his suspension; there's no need to burn him at the stake.


What difference does it make where it is?


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## blackhat (Jan 2, 2003)

spade2you said:


> Lemond was trying to put the nail in his coffin. How would YOU have behaved towards Lemond in that scenario?
> 
> ...besides, I don't think Trek was terribly nice to Lemond recently..........


seriously, the fact that Lemond was giving generic depositional testimony about modern day doping justifies to you the repulsive actions of FL & his associates? I just don't believe that if you look at it with a sober and non emotional mindset you can reach that conclusion. It's a completely asymmetric response.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

spade2you said:


> Lemond was trying to put the nail in his coffin. How would YOU have behaved towards Lemond in that scenario?
> 
> ...besides, I don't think Trek was terribly nice to Lemond recently..........


I wouldn't have done anything, certainly nothing as ethically reprehensible as what Landis did.

Look Lemond is a egocentric douchebag who unnecessarily inserts himself into situations but that doesn't excuse Landis in the least. Furthermore, his actions, statements, etc. around the case as a whole have been less than admirable, the Lemond incident is just the most obvious sign of someone who lacks an ethical compass.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

alexb618 said:


> LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL


You have to keep in mind when this was. The worst Landis can be accused of his continueing to play by the old rules when a cultural shift in the attitude towards doping in the peloton was occuring.

I remain cynical, but I think today you could argue that a doper is cheating his fellow racers before ~2005 forget about it. No professional rider was cheating a fellow competitor (or at least 99%) of them by doping.


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## bigmig19 (Jun 27, 2008)

I got it!!!! All we have to do is *mention* something about PROFESSIONAL CYCLING and this will get moved to that forum.......right? Why doesnt it work both ways.
Also, i thought it was "T minus 10, 9, 8" not "D minus 10, 9, 8"?
I too root for Floyd, god.......what if he is innocent?


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

California L33 said:


> What difference does it make where it is?



The difference lies in the subject material. This was supposed to be a thread about Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation Cycling Team, and it turned into another "crucify him!" Floyd-fest. Before long, Lance Armstrong was drug into the mix, and the conversation had nothing to do with Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation.  If you want to talk about how the world would be a better place if Floyd Landis would drive his car off of a cliff (with Lance in the passenger seat) then talk about it in one of the other 500 or so threads dedicated to verbally bashing those two people. 

Generally speaking, it is just rude. If I were Andrea, I would be pissed that my thread about an interesting topic got hijacked and sent to detention b/c of the irrelevant babbling that bubbled up around it. :mad2:


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## Zipp0 (Aug 19, 2008)

bigmig19 said:


> I got it!!!! All we have to do is *mention* something about PROFESSIONAL CYCLING and this will get moved to that forum.......right? Why doesnt it work both ways.
> Also, i thought it was "T minus 10, 9, 8" not "D minus 10, 9, 8"?
> I too root for Floyd, god.......what if he is innocent?


I took that to mean "Doping Forum in 10....9....8...."


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## Big-foot (Dec 14, 2002)

*If all the other Grand Tour contenders rode off a cliff....*



Dwaynebarry said:


> I remain cynical, but I think today you could argue that a doper is cheating his fellow racers before ~2005 forget about it. No professional rider was cheating a fellow competitor (or at least 99%) of them by doping.


Ohhh, the "all-the-other-kids-were-doing-it!" defense.


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

thechriswebb said:


> The difference lies in the subject material. This was supposed to be a thread about Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation Cycling Team, and it turned into another "crucify him!" Floyd-fest. Before long, Lance Armstrong was drug into the mix, and the conversation had nothing to do with Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation.  If you want to talk about how the world would be a better place if Floyd Landis would drive his car off of a cliff (with Lance in the passenger seat) then talk about it in one of the other 500 or so threads dedicated to verbally bashing those two people.
> 
> Generally speaking, it is just rude. If I were Andrea, I would be pissed that my thread about an interesting topic got hijacked and sent to detention b/c of the irrelevant babbling that bubbled up around it. :mad2:


It's the doping forum, not detention. Talk about Floyd's new team all you want. Maybe there is so little to say besides 'good for him, good luck' that this thread would be 10 posts if it didn't go off track.

I can see how this used to be a scary place but almost no one comes to this forum anymore.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

okay .


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## bigmig19 (Jun 27, 2008)

Zipp0 said:


> I took that to mean "Doping Forum in 10....9....8...."


Woops right over my head.
I think the reason why folks dont like somethin' getting sent to DF is that maybe less people will see it there, or read it, when in fact in may be about something quite interesting!
Good Example: I recall last year when Tyler Hamilton won the national championship in an AMAZING race, winning by less than a millimeter at the line, beating all of Team Garmin by himself. Both myself, and I think someone else posted it in Pro Cycling, and just the mention of the words "Tyler Hamilton" got it sent to no mans land! It was a really cool story i thought, and a race with so many angles but it just went away. Thats my opinion as to why the move sometimes annoys people. Something interesting ends up wasted due to one word.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

blackhat said:


> seriously, the fact that Lemond was giving generic depositional testimony about modern day doping justifies to you the repulsive actions of FL & his associates? I just don't believe that if you look at it with a sober and non emotional mindset you can reach that conclusion. It's a completely asymmetric response.


Let's just say that there are some Lemond stories that never made it into the public eye between him and Landis. There's a lot more to it than the deposition. In no way do I represent Landis, but know a few people who were "in the know". 

I know this will get the basic, knee jerk reaction, but probably can't divulge too much since the info was told to me by a friend and I'm probably not supposed to know most of it.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

Big-foot said:


> Ohhh, the "all-the-other-kids-were-doing-it!" defense.


Not really the same thing since in this case EVERYONE was in on the "sin" except naive fans.

The cyclists clearly did not consider it cheating and they afterall were the ones who were directly affected by it.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

Dwaynebarry said:


> I wouldn't have done anything, certainly nothing as ethically reprehensible as what Landis did.
> 
> Look Lemond is a egocentric douchebag who unnecessarily inserts himself into situations but that doesn't excuse Landis in the least. Furthermore, his actions, statements, etc. around the case as a whole have been less than admirable, the Lemond incident is just the most obvious sign of someone who lacks an ethical compass.


It was a bluff of desperation. It got called. Far from ethical, although might have worked on someone who didn't thrive on the stuff Lemond enjoys.


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## alexb618 (Aug 24, 2006)

i am surprised that bahati, of all people (given the mission of his foundation), has recruited a cheat in denial with a reasonably serious arrest warrant as an 'ambassador' for his team


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

spade2you said:


> Let's just say that there are some Lemond stories that never made it into the public eye between him and Landis. There's a lot more to it than the deposition. In no way do I represent Landis, but know a few people who were "in the know".
> 
> I know this will get the basic, knee jerk reaction, but probably can't divulge too much since the info was told to me by a friend and I'm probably not supposed to know most of it.


Yeah...you know a guy...right.

Just curious, but how would a cat 5 racer in Nebraska have the inside information on Landis and Lemond???


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

SilasCL said:


> Yeah...you know a guy...right.
> 
> Just curious, but how would a cat 5 racer in Nebraska have the inside information on Landis and Lemond???


Just know a guy involved with professional cycling. Who and which team(s)? That's for me to know....and me to know. I thought about being nice and giving a hint, but wouldn't be too difficult to find the guy to someone very savvy, which I'd never do to a friend. 

I'm glad everyone thinks we're just a state full of cows. 

Yeah, seems flimsy, but most people claiming to know stuff can cite as much as they want and still be BSing ya. 

Subsequetly and by coincidence, I once hung out with Floyd's bodyguard. Nice guy. I didn't bring up Floyd since he probably hears all sorts of stuff all the time.


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## bandoulu (Nov 1, 2004)

alexb618 said:


> i am surprised that bahati, of all people (given the mission of his foundation), has recruited a cheat in denial with a reasonably serious arrest warrant as an 'ambassador' for his team



I kind of see it the same way.
Plus the way he tried to twist Greg Lemond was really out of order. Not really a great "character roll model" for the kids... just guess this kind of goes to show what really is going on... its all about $$$$$$$$$


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

thechriswebb said:


> The difference lies in the subject material. This was supposed to be a thread about Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation Cycling Team, and it turned into another "crucify him!" Floyd-fest. Before long, Lance Armstrong was drug into the mix, and the conversation had nothing to do with Floyd Landis joining the Bahati Foundation.  If you want to talk about how the world would be a better place if Floyd Landis would drive his car off of a cliff (with Lance in the passenger seat) then talk about it in one of the other 500 or so threads dedicated to verbally bashing those two people.
> 
> Generally speaking, it is just rude. If I were Andrea, I would be pissed that my thread about an interesting topic got hijacked and sent to detention b/c of the irrelevant babbling that bubbled up around it. :mad2:


I'm actually one of the few people who can't make up my mind about Floyd. What I can say is I think the ruling against him was politically motivated and that there's reasonable doubt about whether he took drugs, so by that measure, I'm a Floyd supporter- Lance, too. (It's not that I'm not suspicious of super human performances, but I don't need to get hit by a train to know a railroad when I see one.) I don't think the Doping Forum is a 'lesser' forum than the Pro Cycling forum, and I'm just not certain you can have a discussion about Floyd, now or in the near future, for better or worse, without discussing the 600 lbs. testosterone enhanced gorilla in the corner. 

I do think it's kind if ridiculous to have a separate Doping Forum, and to move any thread with a hint of doping into it as if into a dirty corner, but that's just my opinion.


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## eyebob (Feb 3, 2004)

*Bahati also just signed Nathan O'Neill*

Another guy that served a suspension for doping. Those two together area formitable TT combo.

bt


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