# new wheels, too good to be true??/



## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

I have come across these wheelsets, to possibly be a raceday wheel instead of using my ultegra/cxp21 set. These are SOUL S2.0... They have claimed weights of 1400gr, are fully customizable and the guys have been great to work with so far. Finally, they just cost around 250... Please give me some reviews on these wheels, I am super interested as I had been looking at other sets like some easton circuits, easton vista, rolf vector comps, etc... but these look really good...


THanks!!


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## weiwentg (Feb 3, 2004)

moose8500 said:


> I have come across these wheelsets, to possibly be a raceday wheel instead of using my ultegra/cxp21 set. These are SOUL S2.0... They have claimed weights of 1400gr, are fully customizable and the guys have been great to work with so far. Finally, they just cost around 250... Please give me some reviews on these wheels, I am super interested as I had been looking at other sets like some easton circuits, easton vista, rolf vector comps, etc... but these look really good...
> 
> 
> THanks!!


these ones? http://www.togoparts.com/items/view_item.php?cid=26&bid=321&iid=4181
btw, togoparts is a Singapore website. at today's exchange rate, S$380 is around US$225ish. anyway, to get to your question, at that price, I would be very skeptical until I'd put the wheels on a scale. it's possible to build wheels that light - Am Classic 350s can weigh as little as 13xx grams, but it's going to be hard to build wheels that light for that cheap, if not impossible.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

moose8500 said:


> I have come across these wheelsets, to possibly be a raceday wheel instead of using my ultegra/cxp21 set. These are SOUL S2.0... They have claimed weights of 1400gr, are fully customizable and the guys have been great to work with so far. Finally, they just cost around 250... Please give me some reviews on these wheels, I am super interested as I had been looking at other sets like some easton circuits, easton vista, rolf vector comps, etc... but these look really good...
> 
> 
> THanks!!


*Strong-Light-Cheap * Pick two...

I'm not familar with this particular wheelset but the above advise has served me well for many years.....


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

weiwentg said:


> these ones? http://www.togoparts.com/items/view_item.php?cid=26&bid=321&iid=4181
> btw, togoparts is a Singapore website. at today's exchange rate, S$380 is around US$225ish. anyway, to get to your question, at that price, I would be very skeptical until I'd put the wheels on a scale. it's possible to build wheels that light - Am Classic 350s can weigh as little as 13xx grams, but it's going to be hard to build wheels that light for that cheap, if not impossible.


 Yea those are the ones... I really would love to get them on a scale, as they look super appealing on paper. I would be using these mostly as a light race-only wheelset, but they should be able to last more than one race... At that price, I may just take a chance on them. I don't really think I am THAT rough on equipment, so of course at that weight they won't be like some MTB downhill rims, but they should be good enough for road racing conditions.

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW I COULD POSSIBLY VERIFY THOSE WEIGHTS???


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

Aluminum rims, high spoke count, brass nipples and under 1400 grams? Impossible.


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Big Bad John said:


> Aluminum rims, high spoke count, brass nipples and under 1400 grams? Impossible.


 I'm so confused, over on this singapore biking forum they are really praised for their light weight, and durability/performance... They really say great things about them comparing them to krysium elites and such, though they cost hundreds less.... I am really considering these, despite the uncertainty, just as a race only wheels.


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## Mark McM (Jun 18, 2005)

Big Bad John said:


> Aluminum rims, high spoke count, brass nipples and under 1400 grams? Impossible.


Not at all. There are presently several aluminum clincher rims available that weigh less than 400 grams (Am. Classic 350, Nimble Spider, IRD Cadence, etc.), hubs that weigh less than 270 grams a pair (Am. Classic, Tune, Ringle Flea, etc.), and spokes that weigh less than 5 grams each (DT Revolution, Sapim X-Ray, etc.). Even with 32 spokes and brass nipples, it is very possible to build that weigh less than 1400 grams (I've got a two pairs with aluminum nipples that weigh about 1350 grams, and if you subsitituted brass nipples they'd still weigh less than 1400 grams).

Oh yeah - I've also got a pair of wheels with aluminum tubular rims (Saavedra Turbos) and 36 spokes that weigh about 1250 grams.


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## jmoryl (Sep 5, 2004)

Why don't you buy a pair and give us the lowdown? Here is some speculation: looking at some of the info from the Singapore site it mentions that Soul uses 'niobium' (more likely aluminum alloy containing niobium) rims on the 3.0 model. The only other 'niobium' rim I have heard of is the IRD Cadence, which is sourced in Asia by IRD, so perhaps there is a common maufacturer involved. These are pretty light rims; combine with some light hubs (not all that hard to make a cheap, light hub) and spokes and maybe.... Note that the weight is quoted without skewers.


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## domo (Apr 17, 2005)

*not worth the money...*

I have heard about those wheels and my fren from that part of the world had a soul 3.0 wheelset... the initial impression he had on them was very good but soon he experienced problems with the hubs... the rims, spokes and hubs, according to him, are very low-grade taiwanese oem parts and the hubs are a total letdown... they cant keep the water out and his bearings got gritty very soon... after he changed his bearings, the hubs just fell apart... apparently, he broke the engagement 'clutch/teeth?' in a sprint and was lucky not to kill himself due to the mechanical fault...


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

I think I may give them a shot, I've talked with some people who have used them and have good thoughts... Apparently they are the factory which makes a lot of AC rims and hubs...


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## omniviper (Sep 18, 2004)

let us know. these wheels look very appealing and i might get these and retire my performance titans


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## DancingJack (Sep 14, 2005)

Quoted By Domo:
"I have heard about those wheels and my fren from that part of the world had a soul 3.0 wheelset... the initial impression he had on them was very good but soon he experienced problems with the hubs... the rims, spokes and hubs, according to him, are very low-grade taiwanese oem parts and the hubs are a total letdown... they cant keep the water out and his bearings got gritty very soon... after he changed his bearings, the hubs just fell apart... apparently, he broke the engagement 'clutch/teeth?' in a sprint and was lucky not to kill himself due to the mechanical fault..."

Ow,really?Which race was it and where and when?Care to share a pic of it?I'm pretty curious.

I own a pair of Soul S3.0 and i've not sent it back even after 6 months of intensive riding.I've even rode on the S4.0CTT and the S2.0s without any problems.

And as for the parts,are u really sure they're made in Taiwan?No offence here but i really do think ur comments on Soul Products are pretty harsh even when u don't own a single product from them.


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## weiwentg (Feb 3, 2004)

DancingJack said:


> Quoted By Domo:
> "I have heard about those wheels and my fren from that part of the world had a soul 3.0 wheelset... the initial impression he had on them was very good but soon he experienced problems with the hubs... the rims, spokes and hubs, according to him, are very low-grade taiwanese oem parts and the hubs are a total letdown... they cant keep the water out and his bearings got gritty very soon... after he changed his bearings, the hubs just fell apart... apparently, he broke the engagement 'clutch/teeth?' in a sprint and was lucky not to kill himself due to the mechanical fault..."
> 
> Ow,really?Which race was it and where and when?Care to share a pic of it?I'm pretty curious.
> ...


it's just that they have a bit of a burden of proof, claiming to have a wheelset that weighs 1400g for US$250ish. with aluminum clincher rims and brass nipples, too. mark mcm correctly pointed out that it is quite possible to build a set of alloy clincher wheels at 1400g or less, but you usually can't do it that cheap without making some sacrifices. I'm curious, though, where'd you get your wheels?

for comparison, Mike Garcia in the US built me a deep-section, low spoke count set of wheels on Nb/aluminum rims he sources from Taiwan (same material as the Am Classic rims). 20/24 spokes, all alloy nipples, his own hubs (I believe they are made by Joytech in Taiwan), 1517g, $389, now up to $429 but that all includes shipping. he's renowned - notorious even - for his low prices, I don't think he has a big markup.


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## buffedupboy (Feb 6, 2003)

*This is not an ad*



domo said:


> I have heard about those wheels and my fren from that part of the world had a soul 3.0 wheelset... the initial impression he had on them was very good but soon he experienced problems with the hubs... the rims, spokes and hubs, according to him, are very low-grade taiwanese oem parts and the hubs are a total letdown... they cant keep the water out and his bearings got gritty very soon... after he changed his bearings, the hubs just fell apart... apparently, he broke the engagement 'clutch/teeth?' in a sprint and was lucky not to kill himself due to the mechanical fault...


I am the owner and founder of SOUL bikes. First off I would like to say that this is not an ad. I do not like posting in forums about my products generally because I feel it is a form of cheap advertising. 

However, the above comments are just absolutely demafatory to the point I see no other way but to defend my brand and the products that I produce. 

The wheels we build are assembled from parts made in taiwan, like most other bicycle parts you are aware/ unaware of. 

The wheels all come with SEALED bearings. Water doesn't get into SEALED bearings. NO ONE has ever sent or reported any broken clutch/teeth (?). NO ONE has ever been LUCKY NOT TO BE KILLED because of any of our products. You would think that if it ever happened I would be the first to hear of it, rather than some random friend of a friend of some random person on the internet. NO ONE has ever sent ANY of our wheels back to change the bearings. Even if they did, I wouldn't be able to because we don't carry spare bearings and they have to be fitted in the factory!

Our products are very new to the market, we are now going through the whole random abusing from competitors period because of their popularity, so forgive me if I'm being overly defensive. We get one of these almost every week now on Singapore's forums and I wouldn't be suprised if it indeed came from the same person. 

I have record of all tensions of all spokes of all wheels that are built. I do it because I'm anal. I do it because that's what I expect someone who builds my wheels to do, I do it because that's how I build my own wheels.

3 wheels have been sent back to us with broken spokes. 1 was from corrosion and binding between the aluminium nipples and spokes, all changed and serviced. The rear driveside spokes were snapping because we didn't prep the spokes on the rear driveside. 1 had a broken spoke from a crash, changed no extra cost. 1 had a similar problem and was also crashed, again changed with no charge. All these wheels remained true even with the broken spoke and the customers were able to ride to the shop to change spokes.

Another wheel has been sent back to us because it was squeeking from getting ridden too many times in the rain. NO one has ever sent a wheel back to us to change any F'ink bearings! And again, we don't have ANY BEARINGS to change!

We have e-mail, skype, IM and phone number, I am more than welcome to answer any of your questions personally about any of our products.

All our wheels are built with aluminium nipples except for rear driveside which are built with brass nipples. How do we get the S2.0 to that weight? 410g rims, 90g front hub, 280g rear hub, 28 double butted spokes, combination of aluminium and brass nipples. You do the maths. The S2.0 are not niobium enhanced aluminium rims. They are bog standard aluminium rims. You can build a 1.4kg wheels using Mavic OP rims, DA hubs and double butted spokes as one poster has mentioned.

Why are they so cheap? They are priced low because that is the margin I am comfortable with for now. Of course, with time and reputation, the price will inevitably increase. Chances are coinciding with making them readily available in the States and thus open to a higher tax system. I don't pay anyone to ride our wheels, you don't see any banners floating on any forums. 

If there are any other questions about our products, please continue to ask and I will attempt to answer all of them with time.

Regards


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Great response... I personally never really listen to any of the countless posters which ALWAYS come up on every single product criticising and unflinchingly call a perhaps-great item crap... This really looks like a solid company, one of the few left in the industry among magura, titec, crankbros, sidi, king, but those people really do take an astronomical margin. I for one, don't enjoy being robbed.


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## fstweels (Sep 14, 2005)

*Soul quality first hand*

I ride Soul. I bought a custom Progeny bike at Xmas, with all the carbon & campy trimmings, including the S3.0 Wheels. I ride about 300km per week across - Singapore and Malaysia;am 6foot2inches, lanky Canadian, and weigh 78kg (minus the post ride intake of beer, naturally). Firstly, I love my bike and cannot complain (and has proved itself worthy in all my high output race days); secondly - the S3.0 wheels are superb value for money. Dunno what the fuss it about. Try - then post.
Anyway, thats my first hand experience. I highly recommend them.

Olivier.
Canadian Beavers Rule.


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## HAL9000 (May 1, 2002)

fstweels said:


> ...
> Canadian Beavers Rule.


 I love Canadian women too!


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## cyclevt (Aug 6, 2004)

*Mike Garcia @ Odds and Endos*

Builds great wheels. I got a set from him about 18 months ago. 

Rims: Velocity Fusion
Hubs: Speedcific (his brand)
Spokes: F: 24, Bladed, radial / R: 28 radial, bladed non-drive, 2x round drive
weight: ~1480 pr
Price: $280 shipped

I weigh 175 and don't really abuse them..... except for the occational RR track crossing.

One issue was that recently, the rear hub developed a little (<1mm) side-to-side play. I fixed this by tightening the 2.5mm set screw on the drive-side end collar. Problem solved.

Love me wheels!


PS- I'm not a shill for Mike, just a satisfied customer looking to spead the joy.


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## geraldatwork (Jul 15, 2005)

buffedupboy said:


> I am the owner and founder of SOUL bikes. First off I would like to say that this is not an ad. I do not like posting in forums about my products generally because I feel it is a form of cheap advertising.
> 
> However, the above comments are just absolutely demafatory to the point I see no other way but to defend my brand and the products that I produce.
> 
> ...


I appreciate when someone stands up for their product with pride. Question. I'm 215 pounds and generally ride on smooth roads, with an occasional pothole. Would your wheels be well suited for me. I'm currently riding Shamino R-550's. They are nice and roll well but weigh about 1850 gms. That is about a pound more.


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## buffedupboy (Feb 6, 2003)

*They should be fine*

Just so long as you don't abuse them. I'm about 200lbs when not racing and they've held up just fine. But 200lbs riding on smooth roads, standing while going over humps is one thing, 200lbs seated hitting potholes is another....

If we sold you wheels, the tension would be higher, the ride will be a little harsher, and the S3.0 rims will probably crack in about 3 years of 5K miles per year from the repeated higher loads. The S2.0 rims would stand more pounding and last longer.


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## weiwentg (Feb 3, 2004)

could we get a website, btw?

I don't mean to defame you or your product. but if Mavic can claim that their $1k Ksyrium ES wheelset weighs 1485g, and people have weighed it at 1530 (http://weightweenies.starbike.com/listings/components.php?type=roadwheels), or the that 2003 Ksyriums are supposed to weigh 1530g but actually weigh over 1600g (and cost $800), you'd better be ready for some skepticism. don't get defensive, post pictures of your wheels on a scale and I will believe you. Ritchey and Hed are guilty of the same offenses, btw.


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## team_sheepshead (Jan 17, 2003)

I am confused. Where are these wheels available? Directly from the company in Singapore? Or is there a distributor in the U.S.A? Who services them?

How does the company handle warranties and repairs? Does a rider have to ship the wheels to Singapore? I recently had a problem with my 5-month-old Rolf Prima Vigor. I could not fix it and my LBS could not fix it. I ended up having to send the wheel back to Rolf in Oregon. They treated me well and shipped it back right away, but I was still without a wheel for a week.

I am having a similar problem with a wheel from Mike Garcia. I had to jump a curb to avoid a crash in a crit, and I knocked the wheel out of true. I have trued it twice and it wont' stay in true. Now I have to ship it back to Florida, because I don't trust anyone but me and Mike Garcia to work on his wheels. It's a PITA, but it is what I have to do. I cannot imagine shipping a wheel from the U.S.A. to Singapore if I have a problem.


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## bahueh (May 11, 2004)

*my LBS mechanic..*



weiwentg said:


> could we get a website, btw?
> 
> I don't mean to defame you or your product. but if Mavic can claim that their $1k Ksyrium ES wheelset weighs 1485g, and people have weighed it at 1530 (http://weightweenies.starbike.com/listings/components.php?type=roadwheels), or the that 2003 Ksyriums are supposed to weigh 1530g but actually weigh over 1600g (and cost $800), you'd better be ready for some skepticism. don't get defensive, post pictures of your wheels on a scale and I will believe you. Ritchey and Hed are guilty of the same offenses, btw.



has weighed Ksyrium SL's at over 1700 grams for 800$. that's ridiculous and blatant false advertising. I'm a believer in small wheel manufacturers if they stand behind their product and deliver what is claimed, unlike large corporations such as Mavic, Hed, Bontrager, etc.
Neuvation, which does advertise on this site, is among the best small companies out there...now if Neugent would only sponsor me for saying that.


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## buffedupboy (Feb 6, 2003)

weiwentg said:


> could we get a website, btw?
> 
> I don't mean to defame you or your product. but if Mavic can claim that their $1k Ksyrium ES wheelset weighs 1485g, and people have weighed it at 1530 (http://weightweenies.starbike.com/listings/components.php?type=roadwheels), or the that 2003 Ksyriums are supposed to weigh 1530g but actually weigh over 1600g (and cost $800), you'd better be ready for some skepticism. don't get defensive, post pictures of your wheels on a scale and I will believe you. Ritchey and Hed are guilty of the same offenses, btw.


Hi guys,

Sorry it took so long, I've been really busy as of late with some personal matters and also working out next year's lineup.

I promised myself that I wouldn't jump through hoops but I couldn't resist. Here are the breakdown of weights:

1) Rims- 415g each
2) Front Hub- 88g
3) Rear Hub- 276g
4) Drive Side spokes + Brass nipples- 78g
5) Non Drive Side spokes + Alu nipples- 66g
6) Front spokes + Alu nipples- 116g

Total- 1454g (1.454kg/pair), sorry I'm 54g out.

The pictures of components on the scale is at http://www.bikesoul.com/gallery/Misc. Note that I used a 500g max weighing scale for trading purposes (didn't trust digital and couldn't find a more reliable scale).


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## buffedupboy (Feb 6, 2003)

*Hi sheep*



team_sheepshead said:


> I am confused. Where are these wheels available? Directly from the company in Singapore? Or is there a distributor in the U.S.A? Who services them?


Unfortunately as explained to some other customers, we are not ready to launch our products for overseas markets. They will come directly from Singapore. There is no distributor in the USA as of yet although we are working on that. So customers buy our wheels at their own risk wholewide. We will provide as much customer service as possible in the meantime and will send replacement parts if our products are faulty.



> How does the company handle warranties and repairs? Does a rider have to ship the wheels to Singapore? I recently had a problem with my 5-month-old Rolf Prima Vigor. I could not fix it and my LBS could not fix it. I ended up having to send the wheel back to Rolf in Oregon. They treated me well and shipped it back right away, but I was still without a wheel for a week.


If the wheels are faulty ( eg. spokes start breaking within a year of normal usage), we will send you replacement spokes FOC. Unfortunately that's the best we can do so far. It would not be very cost effective to send the wheel back to us to be serviced. All the parts on the wheel are readily available in your LBS anyways. eg, J-bend spokes and normal exposed nipples.



> I am having a similar problem with a wheel from Mike Garcia. I had to jump a curb to avoid a crash in a crit, and I knocked the wheel out of true. I have trued it twice and it wont' stay in true. Now I have to ship it back to Florida, because I don't trust anyone but me and Mike Garcia to work on his wheels. It's a PITA, but it is what I have to do. I cannot imagine shipping a wheel from the U.S.A. to Singapore if I have a problem.


Sadly that's going to be an ongoing problem if you decide to purchase a product from outside of the USA. However I am sure it would be no problem truing up a wheel at your LBS. We can send the spoke tension info to them if they indeed used one. From there on, there shouldn't be a problem getting the wheel back into shape. 

Regards


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## al0 (Jan 24, 2003)

buffedupboy said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Sorry it took so long, I've been really busy as of late with some personal matters and also working out next year's lineup.


Do you have any plans for alu (or niobium) wheels with higher profile rims (34-40mm)?


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

I would just like to say that I am about to order a set of the 2.0s, and the personal service by buffedupboy has been EXCELLENT... They have answer my every question, doubt, etc. and I truly feel confident riding on one of his handmade wheels. I prefer a handmade proven-1450 gr wheelset than a crappy machine built wheel that comes in at 1800....

Just my thoughts.


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## BenR (Dec 14, 2001)

*questions about other parts*



buffedupboy said:


> I am the owner and founder of SOUL bikes. First off I would like to say that this is not an ad. I do not like posting in forums about my products generally because I feel it is a form of cheap advertising.
> 
> However, the above comments are just absolutely demafatory to the point I see no other way but to defend my brand and the products that I produce.
> 
> ...



1. Are there any plans for a tubular wheelset? Yes, clinchers are almost as good, but when it comes to racing, that's what I still want to use. I understand if there isn't a market for them, but if you're ever going to make a tubular version of the S2, let me know.

2. In your opinion - how well does the 10 speed chain shift/last in comparison to campy?

Thanks


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## buffedupboy (Feb 6, 2003)

*Future*



BenR said:


> 1. Are there any plans for a tubular wheelset? Yes, clinchers are almost as good, but when it comes to racing, that's what I still want to use. I understand if there isn't a market for them, but if you're ever going to make a tubular version of the S2, let me know.
> 
> 2. In your opinion - how well does the 10 speed chain shift/last in comparison to campy?
> 
> Thanks


I totally agree about tubular being better than clinchers in ride characteristics and performance. We are launching the following products next year:

1) 50mm carbon tubulars- 1.6kg
2) 52mm carbon clinchers (alloy braking surface)- 1.8kg

We already have the 50mm tubulars in but they are still under testing. No plans to introduce a tubular S2. Firstly because they are not going to be that much lighter. Secondly for 2006, plans are to reduce the wheel weight even further to about 1.36kg. That's with a lighter rim and a lighter rear hub. Finally, it is a pain to stock tubular wheels because the demand is not there yet.

The 10sp chain we sell shifts the same as any other chain, but it doesn't last as long as campy.

In reply to the question of whether we will be launching a niobium rim about 34-40mm rim, short answer no. 34mm as you probably know is proprietory to American Classic. We have been searching hard for an alloy rim 40mm just like a Shamal but to no avail.


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## Pierre (Jan 29, 2004)

Reading this post out of curiosity, I have no plan on buying new wheels - currently using the AC350 (1330g) , a set of Hugi/open pros/Revs (1450g) and some Dura-Ace/CXP33 (1700+, they are very nice, I'm killing all the wheels I ride but these are still like new)

Well, I have no idea about these wheels and never heard about Soul before reading this post, but if that guy is really the owner/founder of the company, and it sounds like he is, this is really IMPRESSIVE - spending so much time posting on a bike forum, answering questions one by one, this is INCREDIBLE. He sounds very fair, not understating/overstating weights, quality, durability.

Pierre


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## jerman (Jan 28, 2005)

*Easton Tempest II... or????*

Anyone care to offer an opinion on a comparison between the Soul wheel, probably the S3.0, and an Easton Tempest II?
Thanks


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## ravenmore (Aug 12, 2004)

Wow - I'm a little impressed. If I wanted to buy a set where/how would I go about it? What's the big difference between the S2.0 and 3.0?


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## BenR (Dec 14, 2001)

*probably rim weight*



ravenmore said:


> Wow - I'm a little impressed. If I wanted to buy a set where/how would I go about it? What's the big difference between the S2.0 and 3.0?


I think it's the rim weight and build differences for training vs. racing. You can see for yourself at www.bikesoul.com


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

BenR said:


> I think it's the rim weight and build differences for training vs. racing. You can see for yourself at www.bikesoul.com


 Actually, as I understand it, the 3.0 is a tiny bit heavier, but has a slightly deeper rim, and bladed spokes. However, the rim is slightly more fragile. THe 2.0 is lighter, has more spokes (stiffer) and a standard alloy light rim (pretty stiff).... They are both recommended for both training and racing.


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## Swift65 (Oct 6, 2005)

I was just browsing their site. The S2.0 is definately a shallower rim and has no weight limit. Looks to be similar to the American Classic rim. I must say that I am also intriqued by these wheels. I am also skeptical of their durability. I have been riding on a set of Cane Creek Aerohead's for about 6k miles now. They weigh in at about 1650 grams and have been ok. I did crash last year and knock them out of true (bent 1 spoke) but had them trued and they still perform well. My only gripe is that I don't think the rear hub spins as smoothly as it should. I'm not knocking Cane Creek, I think they are a great company and have great customer service. I bought these wheels new for around $280 and have never regreted it. I figured at that price I couldn't go wrong, which is what I'm thinking right now about the Soul wheels. I would like a slightly lighter wheel that would hold up, which is why the Soul wheels interest me. Does anyone have an idea how much shipping to the US would be. I have been looking at Bontrager Race x lites and rolf vigor's, but really don't want to drop $700 plus on a set of wheels that can be wasted with one good crash. I guess my point would be that I think most bike wheels are overpriced because we pay for advertising and race team salaries. Sounds like these guys don't have those extra expenses yet and therefore are willing to sell their product at a more realistic price and still make a couple bucks. I'll keep an eye on the soul's and see what people are saying about them. Let's hear more from those that have em!!!


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## omniviper (Sep 18, 2004)

any experience with the souls yet? im just about to order the s2.0


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## ravenmore (Aug 12, 2004)

I was going to order some myself, after chatting with Sean on IM. Got hit with some unexpected bills this month though so I'm going to have to wait just a bit. I'm looking forward to giving them a whirl.

Sean said he is using a new hub now that is a bit lighter, and also a little more expensive.


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

I ordered my S2.0, they should be here next week. Will post pics to wait up....


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## omniviper (Sep 18, 2004)

okay. ill wait. how muchy did it cost you in the end?


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Like 290 shipped, shipping is pricey from singapore


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## omniviper (Sep 18, 2004)

moose, were still waiting for updates


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Hey omni, sorry, its that I have a particularly tedious shipping situation. Shipping to the US (miami, was 10 days), however, I live in the Dominican Republic, so it was then subeequently freighted to me through my own means, not by Soul... He offered, but I just have my own way of shipping, its the only way I can know stuff will arrive safe and cheaply...

They will be here Friday at 2:15! I am soooo anxious.... I will be posting a bunch of pics as soon as they arrive...

The service and overall purchase with sean was great, he was really helpful. I just had to be a little patient as I waited for the hubs for the 2.0, I hope it's worth it!

Great ordering experience, can't wait for the product.


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## omniviper (Sep 18, 2004)

if everything goes right, ill help you blaze a trail on these, on the west coast this time. im tired of going for the same old wheels. time for a new one


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Cool, we'll have to see about getting together to ride, as I live all the way in the Dominican Republic. However, I certainly do want to visit the West Coast....


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

OK, they're HERE, omni, check this post:


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## kk4df (Aug 5, 2006)

Dave Hickey said:


> *Strong-Light-Cheap * Pick two...


Yea. And if you want any to the extreme, pick one.


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## ravenmore (Aug 12, 2004)

wow - year old thread resurected....


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## curlybike (Jan 23, 2002)

*Thanks pal*



ravenmore said:


> wow - year old thread resurected....


Why did you do that?


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## blandin (Jan 9, 2005)

Here's my set of S2.0's I received this week, making the waking of this thread a little more timely.

I was very excited to open the package from Bike Soul for the first look at my 1300 gram wheelset, their current claimed weight for the S2.0's. The wheels are very nice looking, appear to be very well made and are nicely finished. After the first look inspection I put them on the gram scale and reality set it . . . they weigh 1420 grams. The front is 620 grams and the rear is 800. I have written to Sean and attached a picture showing him what they weigh and asking him if I got last year's model, that was advertised at 1400 grams. Oh well, at the price, and as nice as they look, I am most likely still going to be happy.


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## stalter (Dec 9, 2005)

Interesting, I would like to see what he has to say about that...

Stalter


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## Ligero (Oct 21, 2005)

buffedupboy said:


> The wheels all come with SEALED bearings. Water doesn't get into SEALED bearings.


Do you really believe that water cannot get into sealed bearings? 


P.S. This was not meant to make your wheels look bad because the wheels you are selling are pretty good for the price you sell them for.


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## dhbrown26 (Dec 24, 2006)

I am looking for opinions on and a site to buy either of two wheelsets:

Soul 3.0

Xero Tarmac xpl-1

Any experience or opinions appreciated

dhbrown26


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## tonymacias (Jul 20, 2007)

I needed to replace my wheelset and being a novice started a deep dive into wheels. It amazes me, the amount of information and details, (specifications, interoperability concerns between bike and different components, etc...) that is needed to make the correct decision. Weight, Durability and Cost, oh my...

I have a Giant OCR1 with XERO XR-3 wheelset. I was considering upgrading to the XERO XR-1 (~ $220 plus shipping) until I found this tread yesterday. The XR-1 has the same spoke count as the XR-3s (16/20) and has some good reviews on this forum. 

After following this tread about the Soul S 2.0 and S 3.0, and reading the comments from Buffedupboy (owner/founder of the company). I was beginning to sway over to the Souls over the XEROs. I read the information on their web site last night and decided to send an email to their support/sales email address. I expected to receive a response sometime Monday morning. I had a response waiting for me before I came to work this morning (Friday) and if MOOSE8500 is correct in his comments that Sean is Buffedupboy, then my questions and concerns were responded to by the founder/owner. Amazing pre-sales support.

I've decided to purchase the Soul S 3.0s but now have to give up riding for the next 5-6 weeks as the 3.0s are out of stock for the next 3 weeks. Hate to get back into the van on the best weeks of the summer and again contribute to global warming. I may decide to chance riding on the old wheel which has the loose free-hub (unless my wife stops me .

For those of you that may be interested in the Soul Wheelsets, here is how well the pre-sales support answered my concerns....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hi Tony,

Answers below:


I bought my Giant OCR1 last year when I turned 50 and have over 2,400 miles (3,862 Km) on it. The bike came with XERO XR-3, with 30mm deep rims. I need to replace the rear wheel because of a defect in the free hub (LBS said it was un-repairable).

Congratulations on you taking up cycling, it is indeed a great sport. I doubt anything is un-repairable in this world, maybe it's just not worth the hassle.

I have read many forum postings about your wheelsets, including the ones from your founder/owner (Sean aka Buffedupboy at RoadbikeReview.com). I am very interested in your products but am unsure what my bike should use.

I am interested in the Soul S 2.0 (I think stronger due to additional spoke count and some what sexier). Is the stronger assumption correct?

The S2.0 is generally a stronger wheelset because of the additional spokes; however the rim is not as strong as the S3.0s. So at the end of the day, it's really a tossup. I find the S2.0s sexier though but I don't know why.

I primarily use my bike for commuting to work (about 26 miles or 42 Km round trip) but do takes some weekend rides into the hills. 3 months during the winter it rains a lot in the San Francisco, California bay area. The XERO have been able to handle the daily work out (with a 16/20 spoke count), although I have had problems with loosing bearing grease or getting road grit in the grease during the rainy months. I try to baby the bike and I wash it regularly, oiling the chain, derailers and cable housings a couple of times a week during the wet months.

Some additional Questions:

Can you predict how your seal bearings will hold up to daily commuting (3 months in the rain)? Approximately, how long would you expect them to be trouble free with this type of use? Your web site says "Bearings are replaceable." If the bearings do require replacement, can the LBS do the replacement or will I need to send the wheels back to you? 

It's a little hard to predict bearing life; it rains a heck-load more in Singapore than where you are, so far the wheels have been fine. The LBS can do the replacements, however it's most likely a question of whether they are willing.

My bike has long reach brake calipers. I thought it was because the XERO XR-3 had 30mm rims but I’ve been told that the wheel diameter has nothing to do with the long reach brake calipers. The XERO XR-3 has a 700c diameter. Should I care about the long reach brake calipers when choosing new wheelsets? What diameter are your S 2.0 and S 3.0 wheelsets? If I went with the Soul S 2.0, would I need to replace the "long reach" calipers with new shorter reach brakes?

The long reach calipers are used because of your frame, not the wheels. They are traditionally speced when the frame can be used with fenders. All our road wheelsets are 700C. Most likely not.

A co-worker that has been riding for many years cautioned me that I need to get the proper sized wheelset to fit the openings of the front and rear fork. Do I need to take some measurement of the openings and provide them to you to get the proper front and rear hub length size?

This only applies to older frames which had rear spacings of 126mm. Now, standard road frames have 130mm rear spacings.

I read that your wheelsets are trued for either everyday training or racing. If so, would commuting be the same as everyday training?

Yes

Big Question... based on the description of how I use my bike (commuting, distance, weather, etc...), which wheelset model (Soul S 2.0 or Soul S 3.0) would you recommend? And why?

It's really a question of what you intend to achieve with the wheelset as opposed to what I would recommend for your daily use. Generally I would say that the S3.0 is more durable, the hub is of a more robust quality but heavier. The S2.0 is a more delicate wheel but it climbs really well and it spins up like nothing is there. 

I have a Shimano 10 speed cassette. Once the model is determined, how do I place my order? What is the total product cost, in US dollars, including shipping to San Jose, California, USA (zip code 95124)? How soon can I get the wheelset?

We will send you a paypal invoice, and then after it is paid, we will ship the wheels. There are two methods of shipping. The longer 2 week service cost around 55USD, and the faster 2-6 day service cost around 95USD. We recommend the latter as it has proven to be more reliable and there is a tracking service. Note that the S3.0s is currently out of stock for another 3 weeks or so.
At the end of the day, I can't really recommend which way to go. All I can advise is decide whether you want a really lightweight wheelset which may be slightly less durable or a more aerodynamic, but heavier set of wheels. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask away.

Regards
Sean

Thank you in advance for tolerating all my novice questions. 
Tony Macias


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

please post a ride report after you get about 200 miles on them.


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## Kwantani (Sep 26, 2002)

numerous posting/ride reports on Soul wheels been posted on this forum already:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/search.php?searchid=1292477

see my reports on the new Soul 2.0 (v3?).
I've close to 500+ miles on them., wheels still in excellent shape, stiff and light. If you don't spend major dough and want a decent set of climbing wheels, soul 2.0 fits the bill. BTW, I weight 140, so I'm easy on equipment.
If you want more aero, soul 3.0 will do the job.


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## tonymacias (Jul 20, 2007)

Thanks Kwantani, 

I went to the ride reports on Soul wheels link and it keeps getting an error. Can you re-enter it? Thanks...


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## Kwantani (Sep 26, 2002)

try this:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=93800&highlight=soul



tonymacias said:


> Thanks Kwantani,
> 
> I went to the ride reports on Soul wheels link and it keeps getting an error. Can you re-enter it? Thanks...


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## tonymacias (Jul 20, 2007)

I said earlier that I started my wheelset search because the LBS said my rear wheel has a free hub defect that was unrepairable. 

As I said, I've decided to purchase the Soul S 3.0s but now had to give up riding for the next 5-6 weeks as the 3.0s are out of stock for the next 3 weeks. I really didn't want to start driving again so I took my Wheel across the mountain to a Bike shop in Santa Cruz. I trust the manager of the service department there. He told me that from what he saw, he doubts that the wheel was even taken apart. He did have to replace the free hub but it is now back in working order. I am still going to order the Souls and use my old XERO XR-3s as my winter riding wheels. Yoohoo... I am back on the road.

Side note: I am not sure the rules about giving bad reps on LBS but I had a sour feeling about them when after they said the wheel was unrepairable, they followed with the replacement price for the XR-3 way over the cost of a full wheelset of the XERO more expensive set, then saying I should replace my wheelset with a more reliable that they could sell me at a very good price (which again was way over what that set sold for). 

Lost some ride time but learned more about bikes and found the SOULs so I guess all I loss was sleep and gas going to Santa Cruz....


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## tete de la tour (Oct 26, 2006)

I have bee looking for some climbing training wheels. I live in dry desert, I would be interested in a set of the 1400 g wheelset if i could have them with Zero labels. is this possible? is it only stickers? if so how much for shipping to socal? for the 2.0's? anyone?


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

Hey guys, just to let anyone knaw that was interested, I'm selling the wheels on ebay. They're basically in mint condition, been used little and well taken care of. Selling because haven't been riding in a while...


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## team_sheepshead (Jan 17, 2003)

moose8500 said:


> Hey guys, just to let anyone knaw that was interested, I'm selling the wheels on ebay. They're basically in mint condition, been used little and well taken care of. Selling because haven't been riding in a while...


So how did the wheels treat you while you were using them? Post a review, pls.


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## moose8500 (Jun 18, 2005)

team_sheepshead said:


> So how did the wheels treat you while you were using them? Post a review, pls.


The wheels were great, I used them pretty much just for races with a CH aero disc cover over the rear. I had no problems with trueness, a couple of tuneups here and there but no hops or pings. I am selling them because in college I had no room for both my bikes and have decided to stick with MTB for a while until I can fit them both...


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