# Training with stronger/fitter/faster riders



## comsense (Feb 24, 2005)

I have had two spins with a group of riders who are far stronger/fitter than I am. I can last about 2 hours with them and then let them go - they do another 2 hours or so at their pace and I go another 2 hours at my endurance pace. During the time I ride with them I see my heart rate go as high as I'd see it when racing.This is for periods varying from single minutes to 15 -20 minutes at a time. Recovery takes at least 24 hours - I can ride at endurance pace next day but efforts hurt like hell.
My question is: Is this training benefical or damaging?


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## bill (Feb 5, 2004)

unless you are extremely disciplined and know exactly what you are doing, either for yourself or through a knowledgeable coach, riding with your betters is the fastest and best way to improve.
make sure you get rest. if a little more rest helps you to last with those fellows for the third or fourth hour, you probably would benefit more. and watch mental burnout from going too hard on the days you aren't riding with those dudes.
the progression:
omg. can't see. want to throw up. dropped.
omg. can't see. want to throw up. all I can do to sit in.
omg. can't see. want to throw up. can barely take every other pull.
omg. can't see. want to throw up. all I could do to take my pulls.
omg. can't see. want to throw up. going with him on that hill took all that I had.
omg. can't see. want to throw up. but I made them chase, didn't I?


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## Guest (Jan 28, 2009)

Certainly beneficial, riding with your betters if a great way to get faster, its also one reason why really strong riders motorpace, faster riders are hard to come by at that level.

Its also an opportunity to learn from experienced riders and benefit from their knowledge.

Just don't over do it, you're probably never going to recover riding with people much faster than you even when they are going easy. But if after 24 hours you can hop back on for an easy spin then the effort is probably of reasonable level. Doesn't mean you need to do it everyday or even every weekend.


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## capt_phun (Jun 14, 2004)

Definitely ride with stronger riders. If you are not training with a power meter by yourself, it is easy to ease up when riding solo, & your gains take a lot longer. By riding with stronger riders, it keeps you honest & you have to dig deep, thereby making you stronger in the long run.


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## function (Jun 20, 2008)

Riding with the stronger riders is always going to be a better training effect than riding with your peers and sitting in comfortably. I'd personally try and fit it in at least once a week making sure to be rested before the ride. One other big advantage is that it really hardens you mentally, you'll be going deeper than you thought was possible, then just when you think it's unbearable you'll have to dig even further! Good times.


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## comsense (Feb 24, 2005)

Thanks for the replies. I couldn't make up my mind whether it was harmful or not.
Being older ( and having come back over 5 years from surgery) now I am more cautious - so I appreciate the advise everyone.


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## wfrogge (Mar 5, 2007)

This is the best way to train long as you balance these hard days with easier ones.


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## CyclingVirtual (Apr 10, 2008)

if you can last 2 hours then you are doing well to their standard already.

It will just be a bit more base training and longer rides and maybe consider if it fuel related as well.


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## muscleendurance (Jan 11, 2009)

bill said:


> unless you are extremely disciplined and know exactly what you are doing, either for yourself or through a knowledgeable coach, riding with your betters is the fastest and best way to improve.
> make sure you get rest. if a little more rest helps you to last with those fellows for the third or fourth hour, you probably would benefit more. and watch mental burnout from going too hard on the days you aren't riding with those dudes.
> the progression:
> omg. can't see. want to throw up. dropped.
> ...



again +1 bill, very good advice here newbie! - follow it wisely


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

Take heed on the well rested advise. I popped off a hard ride after 25 miles the other day that I usually am one of several inflicting the pain on others. I went too hard after two TT's during the week. My body said rest but my buddy said come on....big mistake. BONK! Now I have to take a few day off and do some spin only rides.


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## muscleendurance (Jan 11, 2009)

If you do race, AND your doing these 2 V hard rides as well then it probably would burn you out after a while, especially if you didnt rest enough between these rides and any races.


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## 88 rex (Mar 18, 2008)

2 hours at A group pace = GOOD!


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