# Dilemna: What to do with an early 90's Colnago



## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

I bought an early 90's Colnago last fall. It's a Team Buckler paint scheme with Columbus SLX tubing. It has a mix of Campy parts, some C Record. These parts aren't original, though. The bike originally came with a mix of Suntour parts as that's what the team used. I mention all this because I'm trying to decide what to do with it. The bars are old school narrow Cinelli's and I'm not in love with the downtube shifters. I do love the frame, though. So the question is what do I do? Do I modernize it all or do I just change the bars to something more comfortable? The only other issue is that it's 7 speed so the spacing at the rear dropouts limits what I can do in terms of fully upgrading the gruppo. 

Thoughts?


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## davcruz (Oct 9, 2007)

Spread the rear triangle and put modern 10/11 speed Campy on it!


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## latman (Apr 24, 2004)

find some 8speed ergo levers and whatever else parts you need , the steel rear will easily and safely spread from 126mm to 130 (assuming it is 126mm now)


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## vettracer (Jan 12, 2011)

davcruz said:


> Spread the rear triangle and put modern 10/11 speed Campy on it!


Yep, silver Athena 11 would be great on that frame. Slide in some wider bars while you are at it.

Don't worry about the rear spacing if it is early 90's it is probably already 128 or 130mm. Even if it is 126mm, a 10/11 speed rear hub will slide right in. Or if you want to, it is about 10 min to cold set to 130mm.


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## zoikz (Sep 5, 2003)

That is a beautiful bike. Personally I'd keep the bike as close to the period as you can. Hit the vintage parts bin, check around e-bay, find the right sized bars, bar con shifters etc...


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

zoikz said:


> That is a beautiful bike. Personally I'd keep the bike as close to the period as you can. Hit the vintage parts bin, check around e-bay, find the right sized bars, bar con shifters etc...


A major HUGE plus 1. That bicycle is a gem and a highly prized vintage ride. 

Don't bastardize it by spreading the rear dropout and other mods to it just to modenize it. Keep it as original as you can. If you don't appreciate the bike for it's vintageness then sell it to someone who will appreciate it. I have several classic cars, and my mindset is always on retaining the car's originality, I also have some vintage (Japanese, nothing as good as your Colnago) that I also keep original as possible.

There are some minor mods that can be done, like swapping the bars, but keep the original bars. Anything you make a mod to keep the original parts so it can be easily put back the way it was. And spreading the dropout is not going to be able to be put back once it's done, and there has been instances when someone attempted to spread the dropouts they broke the frame.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

I might be tempted to look for the vintage Suntour and build it fully original if you can.

In recent memory there were full Suntour groups selling on eBay--and selling the Campy would probably finance it easily. Here's and indexed Sprint 9000 on the 'Bay that was one step down from the Superbe/Superbe Pro for $279 although you would still need to add a crank and brakeset.

If you wanted something a little more intuitive to use, get Suntour barcons.

Agree with the idea to save things like the bars in case you wanted to go backwards.

But if it is going to be a rider and not a garage queen, I'd put whatever equipment on it that makes you wake up in the morning and want to ride it. It is not a truly rare bike (although it is in lovely shape), so it is not like the angels will weep if you adapt it to your purposes and make it a daily driver. (Spreading the DOs as has been said is no biggie and doesn't cause permanent harm...)


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## Ecrevisse (Sep 27, 2011)

You can keep the rear spacing 126, using a 7 speed cassette or freewheel with Campy 8 speed Ergo. It works very well.


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## pmf (Feb 23, 2004)

It's a bike, not a 57 Thunderbird. I'd vote for modernizing it. Do you really want to ride a bike with down tube shifters? Campy Athena comes in all silver and looks awesome on a steel bike frame. I know from personal experience.


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## Fivethumbs (Jul 26, 2005)

Since it already has parts that aren't original you can't really ruin the value by changing it further. Also, many people forget that when Shimano introduced 8 speed Dura Ace in 130mm spacing, it was designed to be retrofitted into 126mm frames by simply sliding the axle into the dropouts and forcing them to move 2mm on each side. That means you don't have to cold set the frame to accommodate a newer group. I would put on whatever will get you to get the most enjoyment out of it whether it's having a collectible piece to look at or a regular rider.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

While it may not be a 58 T-Bird it still has classic value just at a lower dollar point then a T-bird.

I've used downtube shifters for over 40 years and still do, it's not issue, in fact there use to be people that raced using downtube shifters...I'm not kidding, and in the pro racing world too! I know the old down tube shifters being used in racing bit may shock one or two of you younger bucks. 

Also down tube and bar end shifters are more reliable and way cheaper to fix or replace then briftors. The cost of just the brake/shift levers alone for a pair of Athena's are about $250 plus another $180 for the calipers. While of course the original Suntour Superbe, if it was Superbe, could cost more if found new, but only about $100 more. But your buying originality and the Suntour stuff would last far longer. If the bike came with Cyclone then the cost would be about half of Athena.

I like the Campy Athena skeleton group, I think the silver in this looks great and it's less expensive then upper models that look like crap (that's just my opinion folks, settle down), in that black carbon mess that everyone is making today. So if you do decide to modernize it, I agree that the Athena group in silver would be the best looking for that bike and be more dependable then Shimano, as well as being less costly to repair due to small parts available to fix broken stuff with whereas with Shimano you have to buy a new complete part which would cost a lot.

As far as the bike not already having original parts that can be rectified by finding the parts on E-bay as one poster suggested. These parts come up all the time on E-bay and a lot of the times it's brand new stuff that never got sold when part(s) came onto the market originally, you just have to be watching and waiting for someone with a good seller track record to come along.

There's a also a method of bidding on E-bay if you haven't done it before that helps, not prevent, but helps to keep the bid you want to pay to happen more in your favor.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

It's a very nice frame. It's not really "vintage," though. I mean, it's less than 20 years old. 3 or 4 years later they would have put Ergopower on it. I vote for replacing the drivetrain with modern. You don't need new brake calipers. You will need a new rear hub (I think).

Or just ride it. Though you seem not to like dt shifters.

I'd probably make it a fixed-gear ;-0 

But whatever you do, keep that beautiful quill stem.


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## pmf (Feb 23, 2004)

froze said:


> I've used downtube shifters for over 40 years and still do, it's not issue, in fact there use to be people that raced using downtube shifters...I'm not kidding, and in the pro racing world too! I know the old down tube shifters being used in racing bit may shock one or two of you younger bucks.
> 
> .


I'm probably an older buck than you. I recall when indexed shifting came out and what an improvement that seemed to be -- except to some folks that claimed it took the "art" out of shifting. 

I do agree that all the black carbon space age components these days are butt ugly. And this is coming from a guy who was riding a monocoque carbon bike in the early 1990's. I sure took crap from the "steel is real" crowd about my "plastic" bike. I'm all for innovation, but I think bikes should be things of beauty too. Increasingly, at least to me, they're not.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Go modern. I agree with the Athena group idea.


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## psycleridr (Jul 21, 2005)

I vote vintage as well. You want a modern cookie cutter bike then go get one. Not many classic frames left out there in good condition and besides we all know there is a ton of overlap in gear ratios.


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

Great input. Thanks, I appreciate the thoughts. I took a ride during lunch and visited Velo Classique here in VA. They have a small shop packed with some beautiful vintage bikes and a huge wealth of knowledge. I'm still deciding what to do, but I'll post an update and some pics when I make a move.

http://www.veloclassique.com/


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

UPDATE: I've decided to keep it mostly as is. I'm changing the brakes from Super Record to Athena so they'll at least match the C Record components a little better (aesthetics wise). Changing the bars for something a little wider, but same model Cinelli Giro's. And finally, doing away with the hideous bar tape and cable housings. I'll post pics once it's done.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

pmf said:


> I'm probably an older buck than you. I recall when indexed shifting came out and what an improvement that seemed to be -- except to some folks that claimed it took the "art" out of shifting.
> 
> I do agree that all the black carbon space age components these days are butt ugly. And this is coming from a guy who was riding a monocoque carbon bike in the early 1990's. I sure took crap from the "steel is real" crowd about my "plastic" bike. I'm all for innovation, but I think bikes should be things of beauty too. Increasingly, at least to me, they're not.


I have no problem with innovation, as long as it lasts a long time, doesn't look like crap, and it doesn't cost an arm and leg to get it. These CF components are not any lighter the the old aluminum components that had back in the day. Huret still holds the record for the lightest weight rear derailleur ever made in a factory made line and none of the main manufactures have come close to that...yet. So what did carbon fiber used on components gain us? Expense and easier to damage product, that's what it gained us.

Personally I don't like CF bike frames either, I'll never buy one. Please forum folks don't rage on me, this is just a personal opinion. Take a gander at the web sites on my sig line for some of the reasons why, not to mention the toxic materials it takes to make these products. I like steel, including CroMo and stainless, and I like titanium, those are the only metal frame materials I'll buy.

I have friction and index shifting bikes, just as you've had or maybe still have. The reason I went with Suntour Superbe friction back in 84 instead of Dura Ace or Record was because it was the fastest shifting and most positive shifting ever made up to that point. Later I got a Dura Ace SIS system, the weird thing is, it doesn't shift any faster then Superbe, only difference is the shifter clicks and it shifts whereas the friction has no click so you have to precisely know where to place the lever which occurs by instinct after you've practiced as much as I have, once that lever is in the right place it shifts just as fast as the SIS. So in my opinion all SIS did was make it a bit more idiot proof, it did nothing for the quickness of the shifting. 

Now Electronic shifting is indeed quicker and more positive then friction or SIS, but you have the potential problem of the battery dying leaving you without shifting capability, or a servo motor dying with the same result; and it's not only expensive to buy but it's even a lot more expensive to replace and repair. 

Most modern factory produce bikes, components and wheels are just butt ugly, there is no artistic form, just this silly but ugly industrial look emphasised with flat black paint and large bold gawdy graphics which I detest...again, just an opinion. A rare exception to a nice looking CF bike is the Celeste colored Bianchi Infinito Athena, there's just very little black crap on that bike. Bianchi seems to be the only company that has extremely limited the use of gawdy graphics and the use of flat black, and they make the bikes look more graceful. So most bikes today are not a thing of beauty as you've so accurately stated.

I have the same issue with modern cars too, their butt ugly, and cost a lot to repair.


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## zmudshark (Jan 28, 2007)

Sell it and buy a good bike


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## EhGiOeS (Mar 19, 2005)

What's the Columbus tubing sticker say? Frame looks like a C "90,s". Ed


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

EhGiOeS said:


> What's the Columbus tubing sticker say? Frame looks like a C "90,s". Ed


It's Columbus SLX and the frame is from about '91 from what I can gather.


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## kit352 (May 15, 2011)

My vote is for a combo approach. Mix old and new tech to get something you really like. 
+1 on trying to stay with the downtube shifters. I love mine and wouldnt want it any other way. I actually went from a modern bike to an 80's vintage as my main ride because it had so much character.


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## EhGiOeS (Mar 19, 2005)

The SLX would make it a Spiral Conic. Only made for a few years fairly rare and expensive. Was team Buckler European or US? Ed


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

EhGiOeS said:


> The SLX would make it a Spiral Conic. Only made for a few years fairly rare and expensive. Was team Buckler European or US? Ed


Team Buckler was Euro. It's the precursor to what would become Team Rabobank. They raced under Buckler (beer) sponsorship from about '90 - '92.


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## EhGiOeS (Mar 19, 2005)

newridr said:


> Team Buckler was Euro. It's the precursor to what would become Team Rabobank. They raced under Buckler (beer) sponsorship from about '90 - '92.


I'm no expert but I think the last year they made the Spiral Conic was 1991. Regardless
you got yourself a treasure. To my mind there are only two sublime bikes. Pre 1995
Colnagos and Eisentraut A's. Ed


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

EhGiOeS said:


> I'm no expert but I think the last year they made the Spiral Conic was 1991. Regardless
> you got yourself a treasure. To my mind there are only two sublime bikes. Pre 1995
> Colnagos and Eisentraut A's. Ed


Thank you very much. We're still getting acquainted, but it's been awfully fun to ride so far. I'm thinknig the wider bars that are going on and getting rid of the hideous yellow tape will make me enjoy it even more.


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## latman (Apr 24, 2004)

I disagree with kit352 , I think downtube shifters (and toe strap pedals ) are the worst things about vintage bikes and I would only leave them on "non riders"


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

latman said:


> I disagree with kit352 , I think downtube shifters (and toe strap pedals ) are the worst things about vintage bikes and I would only leave them on "non riders"


I have to disagree with this statement. Down Tube shifters were used for many more years then STI shiftiers even in the Pro level racing....imagine that! The pros had no problems racing using them, touring people that toured with heavy loads up and down steep mountain passes never had a problem using them, the people that have problem using them are the ones that were not raised on them so they don't know to control the bike well enough to use them!! Same is true with toe straps. It's pure nonsense being spoken by someone who never was raised in that era and have no idea what their talking about. 

All of my road bikes, except for one, have downtube shifters, and toe straps, and I ride those far more then the modern bike that has briftors.

Non riders...hahahahahahahahahahaahhahahahahahahaha


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

froze said:


> I have to disagree with this statement. Down Tube shifters were used for many more years then STI shiftiers even in the Pro level racing....imagine that! The pros had no problems racing using them, touring people that toured with heavy loads up and down steep mountain passes never had a problem using them, the people that have problem using them are the ones that were not raised on them so they don't know to control the bike well enough to use them!! Same is true with toe straps. It's pure nonsense being spoken by someone who never was raised in that era and have no idea what their talking about.
> 
> All of my road bikes, except for one, have downtube shifters, and toe straps, and I ride those far more then the modern bike that has briftors.
> 
> Non riders...hahahahahahahahahahaahhahahahahahahaha


And I have to disagree with this statement. You seem to imply that simply because down tube shifters have been around longer than integrated shift/brake levers ( I refuse to call them "brifters") they are intrinsically better.

I was "raised" (started in the '70's) on down tube shifters (and toe clips and straps for that matter) and I will never, I repeat NEVER, go back. I have steel in my left elbow partially due to down tube shifters. Sure, on a pristine retro-ride it's cool. But for a bike I'll ride on a regular basis, I want Ergos's and clip-in pedals.

When I restored my late '80's Falcon, I was lucky enough to put together a first generation Campy Record Ti group (8s Ergo's) before the prices went through the roof on eBay. For my NOS early '90's Bertoni TSX, I built it with all alloy Centaur 10 - no black or carbon bits. Both of those bikes get ridden regularly.

Oh, and by the way. I think my 2008 Trek Madone 6.9 with lots of carbon bits is beautiful. It's a different era, just as the gorgeous 1961 Ferrari Formula One car would look completely out of place on a modern F1 grid.

I think the Brits came up with a term for people with attitudes like yours. Luddites, I believe.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Richard said:


> And I have to disagree with this statement. You seem to imply that simply because down tube shifters have been around longer than integrated shift/brake levers ( I refuse to call them "brifters") they are intrinsically better.
> 
> I was "raised" (started in the '70's) on down tube shifters (and toe clips and straps for that matter) and I will never, I repeat NEVER, go back. I have steel in my left elbow partially due to down tube shifters. Sure, on a pristine retro-ride it's cool. But for a bike I'll ride on a regular basis, I want Ergos's and clip-in pedals.
> 
> ...


Of course I'm going to disagree...what did you expect! Look, it's just all about opinions and neither of us are right or wrong. I happen to like the simplicity of friction systems and never had a problem with them, nor ever got metal in my elbow. I can ride either friction or integrated shift/brake levers as you call them, and I can ride either toe clips or clipless and I don't prefer one over the other in terms of operational, in terms of reliability, and cost to repair I prefer the simpler friction stuff.

I don't go around destroying labor saving mechanical stuff because I don't believe in them or think their the ruin of mankind, I have 8 bicycles from 84 to 07, and 5 cars from 58 to 98, and I work on all my bikes and all my cars so I don't think I'm even remotely anti mechanical!! But that was funny.


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

froze said:


> I have to disagree with this statement. Down Tube shifters were used for many more years then STI shiftiers even in the Pro level racing....imagine that! The pros had no problems racing using them, touring people that toured with heavy loads up and down steep mountain passes never had a problem using them, the people that have problem using them are the ones that were not raised on them so they don't know to control the bike well enough to use them!! Same is true with toe straps. It's pure nonsense being spoken by someone who never was raised in that era and have no idea what their talking about.
> 
> All of my road bikes, except for one, have downtube shifters, and toe straps, and I ride those far more then the modern bike that has briftors.
> 
> Non riders...hahahahahahahahahahaahhahahahahahahaha


I've got 7 bikes with downtube shifters and toeclip pedals and 7 with modern brifters. Yes, they are brifters. They are brake levers/shifters... brifters. People need to get over this.... I ride my vintage bikes as much as I ride my modern bikes. The reason you see such negative idiotic statements (on a retro-classic bike forum no less) about the vintage stuff is because it takes a bit of skill to make it work that is not needed now-a-days. So, it really is just their lack of skill that is driving it. I just finished two more vintage builds and yes, both have downtube shifters and toe clip pedals, Superbe Pro and DA 7700, not brifters and clipless pedals. I wouldn't have it any other way. I even have a bike I built up a few years ago with 10 speed DA 7800 series and I used downtube shifters on it and have never looked back. Hell of a lot better looking than a pair of clunky brifters! When I eventually get the time, I plan on removing some of the brifters I currently have and replacing with downtube shifters.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Quattro_Assi_07 said:


> I've got 7 bikes with downtube shifters and toeclip pedals and 7 with modern brifters. Yes, they are brifters. They are brake levers/shifters... brifters. People need to get over this.... I ride my vintage bikes as much as I ride my modern bikes. The reason you see such negative idiotic statements (on a retro-classic bike forum no less) about the vintage stuff is because it takes a bit of skill to make it work that is not needed now-a-days. So, it really is just their lack of skill that is driving it. I just finished two more vintage builds and yes, both have downtube shifters and toe clip pedals, Superbe Pro and DA 7700, not brifters and clipless pedals. I wouldn't have it any other way. I even have a bike I built up a few years ago with 10 speed DA 7800 series and I used downtube shifters on it and have never looked back. Hell of a lot better looking than a pair of clunky brifters! When I eventually get the time, I plan on removing some of the brifters I currently have and replacing with downtube shifters.


Exactly. Riding skills below Cat 3 level is becoming a lost art. Oops, that for sure will start a flame war. I know riders who are too scared to grab their water bottles while riding and drink from it, they have to stop! Most riders I know can't even ride without their hands on the bar. And these guys ride on bikes costing 4k to 7K. 

For that matter mechanical ability to work on ones own bike is slowly becoming a lost art; great now I started two fires. I've seen more and more riders as the years go by that can't even fix a simple flat! If you can't fix a flat stop riding and take up basket weaving. But today we have cell phones, so we get a flat and call our mommies to come get us and take us to a bike shop and pay someone to fix our flats. That's our society, and it's getting worse. I see people out riding on country roads, no seat bag to carry tools, nothing in their shirt pocket, no pump...what the hell are they thinking? Their tires are flat proof? They got cell phones? I'm almost to the point of not wanting to stop to help people with their flats, but I'm too freaking nice for my own good, so I use their flat as a teaching tool and I give them my tools to use while I talk them through it, and show them the tools they need to buy, sometimes that could take an hour out of when I could be riding. I learned how to flats on my bike when I was 8 years old from my 11 year old brother, now if a all thumbs 8 year old can learn to fix flats there's no reason an adult shouldn't be able to. Just sayin.

And that's why people don't like riding older bikes because their skill set is lower, plain and simple. Maybe that's the third fire I started.


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## Quattro_Assi_07 (Jan 13, 2006)

froze said:


> Exactly. Riding skills below Cat 3 level is becoming a lost art. Oops, that for sure will start a flame war. I know riders who are too scared to grab their water bottles while riding and drink from it, they have to stop! Most riders I know can't even ride without their hands on the bar. And these guys ride on bikes costing 4k to 7K.
> 
> For that matter mechanical ability to work on ones own bike is slowly becoming a lost art; great now I started two fires. I've seen more and more riders as the years go by that can't even fix a simple flat! If you can't fix a flat stop riding and take up basket weaving. But today we have cell phones, so we get a flat and call our mommies to come get us and take us to a bike shop and pay someone to fix our flats. That's our society, and it's getting worse. I see people out riding on country roads, no seat bag to carry tools, nothing in their shirt pocket, no pump...what the hell are they thinking? Their tires are flat proof? They got cell phones? I'm almost to the point of not wanting to stop to help people with their flats, but I'm too freaking nice for my own good, so I use their flat as a teaching tool and I give them my tools to use while I talk them through it, and show them the tools they need to buy, sometimes that could take an hour out of when I could be riding. I learned how to flats on my bike when I was 8 years old from my 11 year old brother, now if a all thumbs 8 year old can learn to fix flats there's no reason an adult shouldn't be able to. Just sayin.
> 
> And that's why people don't like riding older bikes because their skill set is lower, plain and simple. Maybe that's the third fire I started.


Amen, brother, amen. I've seen people riding bikes (CF wonders $$$$) try and grab their water bottle and nearly plow into the next rider, who isn't much better in their bike handling skills either. It is a lost art but sadly, most brifter users are convinced it is the only way to go for some reason. I have no doubt that it has dumbed down the bike riding populace to some degree buy hey, at least they are out riding, right? Just stay the hell away from me!


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## charlesincharge (May 16, 2012)

Keep it vintage!! you've got enough of the original parts to justify the hunt for the one's you're missing!


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## Easyup (Feb 26, 2012)

I love the look of classics like your bike and so would love to see you keep it as stock as practicable. That said on my 87 Dave Scott Master Ironman I am looking to convert to bifters, Campy 10 speed for my Shimano 8 speed). It is obviously index now which I have no problem with nor do I mind friction which I grew up on in the 60s and 70s. It's just that as I have aged safety has become more and more important to me and the roads I ride much more crowded to the point that I feel more secure and prepared for junk on the road and the bone headed stunts by cars, pedestrians and other bikes with both hands on the bars as much of the time as possible. I want to get back to taking the Ironman out at least once a week.


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## JaeP (Mar 12, 2002)

I have a vintage 'Nag as well (mostly C-Record with tubulars). It's a daily rider and not a garage queen (I like that term). 

Brifters are nice if you race but a bit overkill if you ride. One advantage down tube shifters has over brifters is that they are 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10 speed compatible.

I modernized my 'Nag just a little. I got a clincher wheelset (fixing toobs is a pain) and clipless pedals. It's harder to find shoes that accept old style cleats. Here's a before and after pics.


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## newridr (Mar 7, 2003)

*Update*

Here it is back from Velo Classique with new/old Athena brakes and updated levers. I also did away with the yellow bar tape and cable housings which just weren't to my taste. The levers with integrated brake cables cleans it up a bit and brings it more in line with the period and the Athena brakes at least match the aesthetic of the C Record a bit more than the old Super Record brakes did.


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## zoikz (Sep 5, 2003)

froze said:


> Exactly. Riding skills below Cat 3 level is becoming a lost art. Oops, that for sure will start a flame war. I know riders who are too scared to grab their water bottles while riding and drink from it, they have to stop! Most riders I know can't even ride without their hands on the bar. And these guys ride on bikes costing 4k to 7K.
> 
> For that matter mechanical ability to work on ones own bike is slowly becoming a lost art; great now I started two fires. I've seen more and more riders as the years go by that can't even fix a simple flat! If you can't fix a flat stop riding and take up basket weaving. But today we have cell phones, so we get a flat and call our mommies to come get us and take us to a bike shop and pay someone to fix our flats. That's our society, and it's getting worse. I see people out riding on country roads, no seat bag to carry tools, nothing in their shirt pocket, no pump...what the hell are they thinking? Their tires are flat proof? They got cell phones? I'm almost to the point of not wanting to stop to help people with their flats, but I'm too freaking nice for my own good, so I use their flat as a teaching tool and I give them my tools to use while I talk them through it, and show them the tools they need to buy, sometimes that could take an hour out of when I could be riding. I learned how to flats on my bike when I was 8 years old from my 11 year old brother, now if a all thumbs 8 year old can learn to fix flats there's no reason an adult shouldn't be able to. Just sayin.
> 
> And that's why people don't like riding older bikes because their skill set is lower, plain and simple. Maybe that's the third fire I started.



And another thing!....
You may be getting a bit overly nostalgic. It wasn't that great back then, and it's not that bad now.
I think the "non-rider" statement got folks fired up. And it's totally incorrect. In fact it's probably the opposite. If you have a bike with down-tube shifters and toe straps, and are riding it, chances are you made a choice to use those systems and have a bit of experience in the saddle. 
A cool story; Couple months back I was having dinner with a pro. He's a good kid and podiumed at his countries most recent nationals...so a great, great rider. He told this amazing story about how his dad showed him how to race bikes. He raced old school steel bike, with downtube shifters, tubulars. He repaired his own tubulars, even learning how to do the different base-stitching. His dad really gave him an old school cycling education from training, bike maintainance, tactics etc.. before he went on to get his advanced degree from coaches, the peloton etc... When he retires he swears he's selling all his carbon bikes, and getting a steel bike with downtube shifters.
There is something about riding those bikes. Kinda like a vintage sports car. May not be as fast and easy to drive...but a hell of a lot of fun.


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## High Gear (Mar 9, 2002)

davcruz said:


> Spread the rear triangle and put modern 10/11 speed Campy on it!


I seconed that!


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## strathconaman (Jul 3, 2003)

JaeP said:


> I have a vintage 'Nag as well (mostly C-Record with tubulars). It's a daily rider and not a garage queen (I like that term).
> 
> Brifters are nice if you race but a bit overkill if you ride. One advantage down tube shifters has over brifters is that they are 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10 speed compatible.
> 
> I modernized my 'Nag just a little. I got a clincher wheelset (fixing toobs is a pain) and clipless pedals. It's harder to find shoes that accept old style cleats. Here's a before and after pics.


What's the air like up there?


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