# 2011 Athena groupset



## amicus (Mar 2, 2007)

I would be interested in some commentary regarding a critique of this group on the 'cyclingnews' website and in particular the following comments which I quote here:

"There’s no getting around the fact that 11-speed is more finicky to precise adjustment than Campy’s previous 10-speed groups and much more testy than Shimano or SRAM’s offerings, with the latter seeming the most robust in our experience. After our experiences on the road — the group requires weekly fine-tuning and attention to stay in top working condition"

The entire article, of which this is only a small part, can be found at the following URL

http://italiancyclingjournal.blogspot.com/2010/08/review-campagnolo-athena-goddess-of.html

I find this hard to believe after using Campy for so many years


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*info...*

Without reading the whole article, I can tell you some facts. All bikes require some initial readjustment of the RD cable tension as the cables "seat-in" and the tension drops a little. After a week or so, you should be done with adjustments for a long time.

The new ultrashift levers are sensitive to cable friction and some frames have cable routings that just don't work well with the ultrashift levers. Excessive friction can cause hesitation on shifts to smaller cogs. Some riders might think that the cable tension needs reducing, when it does not, and then later figure out the the tension reduction fouled up the shifts to larger cogs. You can't fix a cable friction problem with a tension adjustment. You could go back and forth forever and never solve the problem, if you don't understand it.

All that said, the only downside to the 2011 Athena group is the dumbed down shifters. I'd pay extra to upgrade the shifters to Chorus.


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## amicus (Mar 2, 2007)

C-40 said:


> All that said, the only downside to the 2011 Athena group is the dumbed down shifters. I'd pay extra to upgrade the shifters to Chorus.


Thanks for the feed back C-40, I'm actually thinking of getting the 'Record' group next year and I'm assuming from your comments that this problem would apply to the upper level groups as well or am I reading you wrong. I always found 10 speed a piece of cake and was hoping this would apply to 11 speed as well.

I've worked on Campy for over 25 years and still mount all my own groups but obviously things do change over time. It's over 10 years that since I've wrenched professionally, so I do appreciate your expertise with Campagnolo.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*more...*

I converted all three of my bikes over to 11 speed when it first came out. Other than being careful with the cable installation and using low friction cable housing, it's no different to maintain than 10 speed.


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## amicus (Mar 2, 2007)

C-40 said:


> I converted all three of my bikes over to 11 speed when it first came out. Other than being careful with the cable installation and using low friction cable housing, it's no different to maintain than 10 speed.


Thank you, you've reassured me


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## charlieboy (Sep 10, 2003)

*power torque / ultra torque*

Any views as to whether the new for 2011 powertorque system may have any inherent inferiorities to the 'established' ultratorque system for the crankset?

I'm looking at Athena 11 and wondering whether to get NOS 2010 Athena with ultratorque or 2011 with powertorque 

(ultra torque = two stub axles and hirth joint, power torque = one stub axle )


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*info...*

From what I can tell, the system will still use a wave washer for bearing preload. That should mean the the BB width will still be critical and the left crankarm will be positioned by a shoulder on the left side of the spindle. That should work OK, since the left crankarm fixing bolt can then be tightened with enough torque to insure that it stays in place.


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## charlieboy (Sep 10, 2003)

C-40 said:


> From what I can tell, the system will still use a wave washer for bearing preload. That should mean the the BB width will still be critical and the left crankarm will be positioned by a shoulder on the left side of the spindle. That should work OK, since the left crankarm fixing bolt can then be tightened with enough torque to insure that it stays in place.


Given that powertorque was developed to allow 'more affordable' cranksets (so Campy says), other than snob value, is ultra torque likely to still be a superior bb system to powertorque? I know it's early but let's speculate!

FWIW I'm a long time Campy user (never had anything else on my road bikes) so this isn't a shoot Campy thread!


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## Drew Eckhardt (Nov 11, 2009)

amicus said:


> I would be interested in some commentary regarding a critique of this group on the 'cyclingnews' website


The brifters are crap which bring back the still-born Escape limitations.

According to Campagnolo:

"The Athena(tm) controls employ Power-Shift(tm) technology, which enables multiple shifting (three gear cogs) upward and single shifting downward."


http://www.campagnolo.com/jsp/en/newsdetail/newsid_167_newscatid_3.jsp


You need pay for Chorus shifters or settle for Shimano.

The rest of it looks good, in shiny silver anodizing just like Tulio intended.


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## melusive (Sep 18, 2008)

I just got my Athena 11 built. I can upshift from 12 to 16cog on one swoop. That's 3 gears on the upshift. But on the down shift, I can jump 5 down. I have it for less than a week now and it does hesitate to jump into gear on the smaller cogs but I hope its all part of the settling and break in period.

Just got my Carrera frame restored. A little bit of the old and a bit of the new.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#!/photo.php?pid=357176&id=100000289531200


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## cathyandrob (Jun 15, 2006)

So can you get the whole set in alloy, including the brake levers?

I have sort of being waiting to see if they do, I have centaur all alloy but my 2010 Athena has those silly pretend carbon things.


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## LigonierA1 (Aug 12, 2005)

I'd like some one to address the function of the grouppo. As good as the other 11spd grouppo's save for the weight and shifter limitation? Seems a nice option for OEM spec, I presume that was the idea with lower mid range 11spd set up?


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## yongkun (Aug 9, 2010)

I am looking at getting a Athena, how much difference is there compared to the more expensive chorus? Haven't got any opportunity to try Athena, so any reviews?


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

yongkun said:


> I am looking at getting a Athena, how much difference is there compared to the more expensive chorus? Haven't got any opportunity to try Athena, so any reviews?


For 2011, 100g, and $500.
Chorus comes with a carbon bodied RD, the same cassette/chain. But the shifters are different. Athena will only be able to dump one gear at a time. And the Athena crank will be the new PowerTorque while Chorus remains UltraTorque.
For 2010 there are very few differences between the two groups.


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

Drew Eckhardt said:


> The brifters are crap which bring back the still-born Escape limitations.
> 
> According to Campagnolo:
> 
> ...


Sigh. Campy must REALLY not want me to buy Campy. 

Last year, I looked seriously at Athena, but was turned off by the (idiotic) 'AluCarbon' brake levers that didn't match the rest of the group.

This year, they're now giving you a choice... either accept the new borked Athena brifters, or move up to Chorus for the better ones but STILL be unable to get alloy finish.

Someone at Campy must just *hate* ppl who want to put together a retro-look bike with modern drivetrain components. :skep:

And no, I don't really want Centaur or Veloce.... 11-spd was the idea. 

/ though it looks like for 2011 even the 10spd groups might be lacking an alloy finish option for the shifters– painted black aluminum is what it looks like... not that I much care

Sigh.
.


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

Do this (maybe):

Buy 2010 Chorus and 2011 alloy Athena and swap the levers. Sell "real carbon" Athena levers on eBay for a premium over "fake carbon" Athena.

Or just get over the single shift issue. In theory, only on a very peaky hill would you really want to shift two cogs at once. After all, millions of Shimano users assimilate.

Or, get a wider spaced cassette where the bigger jumps make you less likely to want to make two shifts at once.


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## Drew Eckhardt (Nov 11, 2009)

ericjacobsen3 said:


> Or just get over the single shift issue. In theory, only on a very peaky hill would you really want to shift two cogs at once.


It's especially nice for shifting between rings, particularly for the large spreads between rings which have become popular and can be a frequent event in the wrong terrain on compact doubles. 

For example, I'm hauling my beer gut up a hill which drags me down to 14 MPH in 50x21 at which point I only have the cross-chained 23 cog left and opt for the next gear on the small ring which is 34x15, five cogs smaller. With Ergopower classic (like Cococola classic) I push both thumb buttons at the same time and am done with it.

With Brand X or New Campagnolo (for Pepsi drinkers) it's click click click click click on the right side.



> After all, millions of Shimano users assimilate.


Eighteen years of Campagnolo owners are used to better.


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

Drew summed it up nicely.

Sure hope Campy gets it together before I do up my custom bike... maybe a year from now.
.


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

Good points. I use my small chainring so rarely with all the big 11 speed cogs in my merely rolling terrain that I forget a shift to the small ring requires four or five rear shifts (duh). 

As Campy used to say indexing is for people who do not know how to shift. Friction shifting can move as many cogs as you like. You need Nuovo Record.


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

ericjacobsen3 said:


> As Campy used to say indexing is for people who do not know how to shift. Friction shifting can move as many cogs as you like. You need Nuovo Record.


So, you'd advocate that Campy bork the Chorus, Record, and Super Record shifters as they did the Athena ones? After all, it doesn't matter anyway, since friction does that one thing better. :idea:

Interesting argument and business plan. Why oh why is Campy not using you as a consultant? 
.


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

SystemShock said:


> So, you'd advocate that Campy bork the Chorus, Record, and Super Record shifters as they did the Athena ones? After all, it doesn't matter anyway, since friction does that one thing better. :idea:
> 
> Interesting argument and business plan. Why oh why is Campy not using you as a consultant?
> .


I wasn't serious, just referencing Campy's arrogant mid-80's response just before indexing almost put them out of business. I have been racing 28 years and "haven't known how to shift since 1986 when I first started using indexing." Mostly ride Chorus now but just for fun though I do about 20% of my riding on Nuovo Record.


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

ericjacobsen3 said:


> I wasn't serious, just referencing Campy's arrogant mid-80's response just before indexing almost put them out of business. I have been racing 28 years and "haven't known how to shift since 1986 when I first started using indexing." Mostly ride Chorus now but just for fun though I do about 20% of my riding on Nuovo Record.


Understood. And sry about the sarcasm... I'm just very used to everything becoming a heated debate here @ RBR. :skep:

Btw, one of my current bikes is friction, and I'll likely always have one of those around.
.


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## wvucyclist (Sep 6, 2007)

For the record, I really like the escape mech. I've ridden record, chorus, centaur (for at least a whole season each on a primary bike), and I always had the problem of getting too many gears on an upshift. I'm never in a high pressure situation that requires that extra half second to move my thumb down and back up several times, though I have been in sprints, where I want one gear, and I get two, so it costs me more time to shift back up. In a sprint, getting the right gear is vital, not as much when cresting the top of a hill.
I'm dumbfounded by people who claim that is why they run campy on the road, but they run something other than gripshift on the mountain bike. In MTB it's more often where you hit the situation of a drastic change in attitude and need the opposite end of the cassette in a hurry, and GS is the only shifter that is capable of it. 
I'm wondering how much of the dislike of the escape is dislike of change in the classic campy configuration, and how many people have ridden it for a while, and hard. No hate intended, you can ride what you want, as long as it's made in italy.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

C-40 said:


> I converted all three of my bikes over to 11 speed when it first came out. Other than being careful with the cable installation and using low friction cable housing, it's no different to maintain than 10 speed.


Which gear cables do you use on your 11s, C-40? Have you found some that perform better than the Campagnolo Ultra?


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

WVUcyclist - I never could understand why MTB gripshift has largely gone by the wayside. I just liked it in general, though I agree the single click is one disadvantage of triggers.

Escape worked OK for me too. Since I use the little ring rarely, I have to admit I too accidentally get too clicks as often as I want more than one. Overall I still prefer the multiple clicks but it isn't too big a deal either way to me.

I wonder if there is some sort of tab that can be filed off to get the multi clicks in 2011 Athena and below. Someone has to get daring and order a $95 set from Shiny.


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## wvucyclist (Sep 6, 2007)

I don't think it'd be that simple to change as filing a tab. I looked at the internals, and at a glance they're shimano like, totally different than what campy usually runs.


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