# Nashbar Touring Bike ver. 2.0



## undies

About two years ago I built up an errand/touring-style bike using a Nashbar touring frame. Overall I was pleased with the frame and found it quite serviceable through ~2000 miles, but I also learned that the 58cm frame was probably one size too small for me and I wanted to upgrade to a new bike at some point. 

My plan was to buy a Surly LHT frame in an appropriate size and build it up using some parts from my old Nashbar plus a few new parts. But then one fateful day last summer I visited Nashbar.com when they happened to have their touring frames on sale for just $140. Furthermore, they had a 20% off coupon active at the same time, giving a final cost of just $112. This was too good a deal to pass up so I ordered another one in the 61cm size. 

Over the next few months I proceeded to buy parts I wanted when I found them on sale, on ebay, or in the take-off bin at the LBS. Besides the frame, other key deals I found were the Deore LX 48-38-28 crank for $44, Dura-Ace bar ends for $50, and Radius cantis for $30. I added up the total cost of all the parts on this bike (minus the rack, fenders, computer, and light) and arrived at a total build cost of $905. Subtract from this the value of parts from my own spares bin or take-offs from my old bike (most notably the wheels, saddle, and pedals) and I spent $497 on new parts. I probably also spent another $100-125 on various shipping charges. My time is worthless so I won't put a dollar value on my labor  

One of the things I wasn't real happy with on my old bike was the cockpit which was built around 105 STI levers and an Easton EA30 bar. My son has a Centurion Super LeMans and I really liked its bar-ends and Randonneur bar, so I bought Dura-Ace bar-end shifters, a 45cm Nitto Randonneur bar, and Cane Creek SCR-5 levers. I only have a few miles on it but so far I absolutely love this bar. Combined with a high-rise stem (LBS take-off) every bar position feels a lot more comfortable, especially the flared drops. I used to ride mostly on the hoods but I think I will spend a lot more time on the drops now.

A more dubious choice was the Radius cantilever brakes. The LBS was blowing them out for $30 and I thought they looked cool so I took a chance. I found that they were very hard to adjust, and even with salmon Kool Stop pads they are only a slight functional improvement over the low-end Tektros I had previously. I know there are better cantis out there but I think I am close to giving up and just getting some wide-reach caliper brakes. 

As for the Nashbar frame itself, it definitely seems to fit me better. The new frame has the same pluses (nice paint, good geometry, plenty of braze-ons, amazing price) and minuses (no canti cable hangers, no pump peg, ugly welds) as my old frame. My next job will be to build up my old frame for my 15 y.o. son, for whom the 58cm size would be perfect right now.

How does my project stack up against a ready-to-ride bike from an LBS? A good comparison is the $1200 Cannondale T800, which is another aluminum-framed touring bike. Compared to the T800 my Nashbar specs out considerably higher, esp. considering my LX-level drivetrain and hand-built wheels. However I had the benefit of lessons learned from my first time around, and there truly is value in having a bike set up by a pro. The build-your-own route is not economically sensible IMO. Most people would be better off taking $1000 to the local LBS and buying a ready-to-ride Surly LHT or Jamis Aurora.


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## blackhat

that's a great looking bike, I don't think the welds are ugly at all.


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## JP

You know, I wonder if those Cane Creek levers have a slightly different pull ratio than other levers. I have them on a bike with Paul's neo-retros and touring cantis, and they just don't seem right. They both feel like the lever pulls the cable too fast, so the brake feels solid, but I need to squeeze very hard. And yes, I did everything I could with the cable length to adjust. Also with salmon Kool Stops. I wonder.


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## undies

blackhat said:


> that's a great looking bike, I don't think the welds are ugly at all.


Thanks, but if I provided close-ups of the welds I think you'd see what I'm talking about. 

They're not pretty but they work. And for $112 for frame+fork I can hardly complain.


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## undies

JP said:


> They both feel like the lever pulls the cable too fast, so the brake feels solid, but I need to squeeze very hard.


That's not the problem I have. My SCR-5s don't pull the lever fast enough. I don't think this is a problem with the levers but with the long, loopy straddle cable used by these Radius brakes. It has too much slack that can't be adjusted out. 

So... does anyone have a favorite long-reach caliper brake?


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## ispoke

*i'd like to know*



undies said:


> So... does anyone have a favorite long-reach caliper brake?


Good question. Here's a review of the Tektro/Silver LR caliper:
http://www.bikeman.com/content/view/1028/33/

I've read a bunch of subject comments for and against LR calipers. Most "for" say they work pretty well. Most "against" cite theoretical limitations due to the inherent compromise in mechanical advantage (MA) associated with the long arms. It would be great if someone did an objective performance review to compare regular and long reach with respect to level effort and force translated to the rims (a test for Mr. Heine?).

Have you considered a centerpull such as the Dia-Compe 750? You can buy a pair for $45 if you search online (Rivendell or many others). It also mounts on a centerbolt on the fork or rear stay...


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## StageHand

That's a pretty good project. A good functional bike, it looks like.

Couple of suggestions for the brakes: It looks like the straddle wire is pulling the arms at a wierd angle. To change that, remount the brake pads with the narrower washers closer to the rim, and retension the brake cable accordingly by moving the straddle wire carrier higher. This should allow the brake to make better use of the tension springs, resulting in better feel at the lever (faster engagement).


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## undies

Thanks for the brake suggestions folks! I will definitely experiment with those ideas.

As a matter of fact I have one of those Dia-compe center pull calipers on my trainer bike. I hardly ever need brakes in the living room so I may rob that part and give it a try. :thumbsup:


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## Val_Garou

undies said:


> So... does anyone have a favorite long-reach caliper brake?


Hey, you have a Nashbar frame. Why not get the complete collection? I've found the Nashbar long-reach calipers to be perfectly serviceable. And cheap.


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## Doggity

Not bad 'tall...looks nice. That Dimension riser stem...that's what I'll need. I like the bars level with the saddle. I also vote for the Nashbar long reach brakes.


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## Mr. Versatile

I'll also speak up for the Nashbar long reach dual pivot brakes. I had brand x sidepulls, and you may as well dragged your feet to stop. The Nashbar brakes are quite nice. I think I paid ~ $40 for a set. They work well. Not as good as my Record dual pivots, but they're pretty good.


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## undies

*Update*

It turns out that the Nashbar Touring Frame is not compatible with caliper brakes (including the Nashbar long-reach calipers). There is a threaded mounting hole on the seatstay bridge for a fender, but the hole is too small for a caliper mounting stud. 

I emailed Nashbar's product support and asked if they thought I could drill the hole out slightly to mount the caliper, and not surprisingly they said no. Says Nashbar Product Support:

"The Touring frame is intended for cantilever or linear pull brakes, not road calipers."

Darn. 

Although I wonder if they're just being over-cautious because they don't want me to drill a too-big hole, kill myself, and then sue them.


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## ispoke

*new choice in brake levers for V*



undies said:


> ..."The Touring frame is intended for cantilever or linear pull brakes, not road calipers."...


Cane Creek just came out with new road brake levers for drop bars and V-brakes. I just got a pair for my MTB that uses drop bars, but haven't yet installed them so no ride report yet:

http://www.canecreek.com/drop-v-brake-levers.html

So for $50 for the levers, plus $13/ea for Nashbar v-brakes (currently on sale -53%), your problem may be solved.

Gotta admit I'm looking forward to converting my MTB back to V-brakes from the cantis I was using. Cantis are OK, but now that I've used both styles I prefer the V's on an MTB where I'm not trying to 'go' for any particular look...


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## undies

I guess I should also mention that I fiddled with the Radius cantis some more and finally found a setup that works adequately. Now properly adjusted they seem to actually work pretty well. 

Major PITA to configure though.


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## 808Bike

*Updated Brake Setup*

Please post a new photo with your revised brake setup. 
Thanks.


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## tarwheel2

Sweet! Love that color. Funny, since I started bike commuting, I'm much more interested in bikes like yours than the latest unobtanium or carbon weight-weenie mobile.


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## daveIT

*Diy*



undies said:


> The build-your-own route is not economically sensible IMO. Most people would be better off taking $1000 to the local LBS and buying a ready-to-ride Surly LHT or Jamis Aurora.


Sure, but that's no fun!  

Nice ride!


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## meat tooth paste

ispoke said:


> Cane Creek just came out with new road brake levers for drop bars and V-brakes.


I recently installed those levers on my cross bike.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=122729


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## meat tooth paste

I like your Shimano Trekking cranks and mtn cassette combo. I converted my Octalink cranks to 48-36-26 rings, almost like yours. I find that the trekking chainrings are good for fast flats and long climbs.


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## undies

meat tooth paste said:


> I like your Shimano Trekking cranks and mtn cassette combo. I converted my Octalink cranks to 48-36-26 rings, almost like yours. I find that the trekking chainrings are good for fast flats and long climbs.


I am finding that I don't like the 36T middle ring as well as I liked the 38T ring on my previous crank (Nashbar trekking crank in 48-38-28). Two teeth doesn't sound like a huge difference but it makes the jump between the middle and large rings greater than I'd like. And suffice to say I haven't used the small ring at all except to test my derailleur adjustment. 

The Deore LX trekking crank is definitely lighter than the Nashbar trekking crank, and I like the chain guard for running errands in street clothes. But in retrospect I find the 48-36-26 gearing to be too low for a bike that is used 95% on pavement.


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## undies

meat tooth paste said:


> I recently installed those levers on my cross bike.


Looks like a nice setup!

I'm curious about the hood shape on the Cane Creek V-brake levers. Do you know how they compare to the Cane Creek SCR-5, or Shimano 105 brifters? I'm particularly curious about the width.


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## alanpo

*What's your inseam re your 58cm Nashbar touring frame?*

I was looking at the Nashbar touring frame too. 58cm? What's your inseam? I'm 6'0" w/ a 34" inseam and was wondering if the 58cm would be most suitable. LBS's seem to say that a 56cm is the right size but they do seem a bit small and like I'd have to 'strech' the seatpost height and stem length. (note: I had 32" in my original post..I was wrong!)


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## undies

I am 6'4" with a 33" inseam (long torso) and the 60cm fits me perfect. The 58cm was acceptable but obviously a tad small. My 15 y.o. son is riding the 58cm frame now and it fits him okay, but he'll probably outgrow it soon. He is 6' with a 34" inseam. 

56cm definitely sounds too small for you, but every frame is different.


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## alanpo

Your son is the same measurements as me after all. Actually, I just checked on a solid floor and I'm alittle over 34" inseam (maybe even more like 34.25") not 32". I think I previously measured on carpet. So *that* is why the 56cm frames seem too small...they are. I don't want a frame bigger than what I need, though, because I rode a 63cm for many years because I bought the bike when I was growing, but didn't grow anymore. So I keep a 58cm in mind.


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## barbedwire

ispoke said:


> Gotta admit I'm looking forward to converting my MTB back to V-brakes from the cantis I was using. Cantis are OK, but now that I've used both styles I prefer the V's on an MTB where I'm not trying to 'go' for any particular look...



Sorry for the dumb question guys, but I'm a little new to all this. Are V-brakes better than cantilevers? Which one is more powerful? Which is lighter? thanks


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## ispoke

*well...*



barbedwire said:


> Sorry for the dumb question guys, but I'm a little new to all this. Are V-brakes better than cantilevers? Which one is more powerful? Which is lighter? thanks


Since you quoted me, I'll just say it's a subjective preference I've developed over time. Others feel differently and I wouldn't call anyone right or wrong. I won't bother dusting off my engineering texts to try and justify one or the other. Anyway, the frame design is pushing me back to V's, as described below.

I think the biggest question for retrofits is whether or not a frame is designed for cantilevers. If you're using a suspension fork (for instance converting an MTB to commuter), they no longer come with canti cable hangers. I called Marzocchi and they used to sell an adapter but no longer. And on the rear, most MTB style frames assume a disc or V-brake mount and so they don't provide a center cable hanger. You can buy add-on cable hangers but you may find there's not enough gap between the seatpost bolt tabs to really make it work. YMMV.

As for performance, do a keyword search and I'm sure you'll read opinions and theoretical analyses galore.

As for weight, why does it matter? When it comes to selecting a brake type you feel is best for your bike, your brake levers, and your preferences, squabbling over a weight difference of perhaps a couple Oreo cookies is silly.


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## aesova

A late reply to this thread - I discovered it while building up a Nashbar touring bike of my own, of which I've included a few pictures.

View attachment 160835

View attachment 160836

View attachment 160838

View attachment 160837


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## Papa_Otter

Looking good, I came very close to getting one of those frames when they got down to $129 but just didn't have the parts laying around to complete it.

Very curious about your fork mounted light and mirror. Where did you find them? Or are they homemade?


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## lalahsghost

Why is your front quick release skewer mounted in what could be called the opposite direction? Not trolling, but wondering if you had a reason...?


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## aesova

lalahsghost said:


> Why is your front quick release skewer mounted in what could be called the opposite direction? Not trolling, but wondering if you had a reason...?


Haha no reason - The QR skewers were temporary, I've since replaced them with HubLox.

I guess I just put it in wrong.


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## aesova

Papa_Otter said:


> Looking good, I came very close to getting one of those frames when they got down to $129 but just didn't have the parts laying around to complete it.
> 
> Very curious about your fork mounted light and mirror. Where did you find them? Or are they homemade?


Thanks - I'm still swapping parts around trying to find the best setup - a few things have changed already since I snapped the photos.

The mirror comes from Rivendell. It attaches with a hoseclamp, so it really fits anywhere. I just found that the fork works best for me.

The light mount is made by Paul components. I actually have two of them on there now. They are $20 each, which might seem kind of pricey, but I really like having my lights at that level, and it frees up some space on my handlebars.


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## brewster

Nice looking rig. I'm curious as to what "posts" you have screwed into your fork rack mount? I've been thinking about something similar as being a good place to mount some secondary lights on either side of the fork as you have. I run a NiteRider HID on the bars with it's own mount and would like to get as much stuff off the bars as possible.

brewster


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## rodar y rodar

Pretty cool, Aesova. You`ve got some unusual bits on there with definite honorable mention to the fork mounted mirror- I like it.

Getting off topic- does anybody know what happened to Undies?


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## lancezneighbor

Very nice build up, Aesova. I really like the fork mounted accesories. Nice aesthetics too.


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## Creakyknees

Late tip for the OP - if the aesthetics don't offend you, you can use a zip-tie to make a pump peg. Just tie it around the head tube such that the "zip" part is where a pump peg would be, and clamp it down tight. Trim the excess and you have a removable pump peg.


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## Kolossal

daveIT said:


> Sure, but that's no fun!
> 
> Nice ride!


+1


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## aesova

brewster said:


> Nice looking rig. I'm curious as to what "posts" you have screwed into your fork rack mount? I've been thinking about something similar as being a good place to mount some secondary lights on either side of the fork as you have. I run a NiteRider HID on the bars with it's own mount and would like to get as much stuff off the bars as possible.
> 
> brewster


Thanks for the comments. The bike has already changed a bit since I snapped the photos with the addition of a stem from Velo Orange and a honey Brooks B17- maybe I'll upload new photos soon.

The fork light mount is from Paul Components: http://www.paulcomp.com/ginolightmount.html

At $20 they are on the expensive side for something so small, but I've really been happy with both its quality and the location of the light. I plan on getting another for the other side soon.

I have seen people make some pretty nice DIY versions using headset caps and such, if you're so inclined.


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## brewster

aesova said:


> At $20 they are on the expensive side.......I have seen people make some pretty nice DIY versions using headset caps.


Thanks for the tip. That is a little expensive for one, but I have to admit, that execution is super elegant and would be ultra sturdy and come in black. I have two Fenix LD20 tactical lights and 2 TwoFish lockblocks that would fit on those just perfectly and be very low profile. I might have to bite the bullet and get some of these after seeing yours in action.

brewster


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## holy cromoly

Reviving this thread because I have question for those who have his frame...

I like everyone's build in this thread.

Do these frames have a taller bottom bracket height like CX bikes?
I just ordered a 56cm because I ride a 56 road bike.

Mine was $119 before shipping with the latest coupon code.


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## Squidward

holy cromoly, I don't believe that the bottom bracket is all that high like a cyclocross frame. It sure seems to be lower like on my other road bikes.

I just put one of these frames together to use as a commuter. I actually bought a smaller frame than I should have (50cm while I normally ride a 52cm CTT road bike) but it seems to be working out as far as size is concerned. I actually measured it to be sure that I did, in fact, get a 50cm and not the 52cm size. At this size I'm getting serious toe overlap.

I cut out half inch wide by two feet long strips of SOLAS reflective tape and placed these on the main frame tubes. I cut wider but shorter strips to be placed on the chainstays which works as a chainstay protector on the drive side. Smaller strips cover the lower end of the seatstays as well. I also put a large patch of reflective tape on the head tube since there isn't a badge or logo there. I built this bike up mostly with parts I had laying around or from my previous (failed) attempt at an inexpensive commuter bike so I didn't spend all that much money in the past month to get this bike put together.

I ran into a few problems with this bike: it was mentioned that there isn't a rear brake cable stop for use with cantilever brakes and I wanted to use a set of old Deore XT cantilevers I had laying around. I ended up machining one out of a piece of scrap aluminum that I had that attaches to the seat post clamp.

The Tiagra front derailleur that I used, combined with a compact double crankset, means that the front derailleur clamp wants to be right where they put the lower seat tube water bottle boss. I had to grind down the boss to get the front derailleur to sit where it needs to be. I then had to jerry rig the water bottle cage to work with this configuration. Here is a picture of what I mean before I ground down that mount. I'll post more pictures tomorrow.


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## holy cromoly

Thx for the reply Squidward.

I'll keep an eye out for the problem spots you mentioned.

Looking forward to the pics.


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## saf-t

Some nice builds here! I just grabbed one of these frames too, to build up a new bike for Mrs. saf-t. Actually pretty nice, considering the price, and the welds aren't too bad, IMO. That's interesting about he issue with the derailleur mounting spot- I'll have to see what happens with mine- I'd thought about putting a compact crank on, but may end up just using her old triple instead...


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## holy cromoly

My frame is still on the way, but from the looks of the photos posted the welds are typical and similar to mountain bike frames. 

My build will be a blend of remaining spare parts that I couldn't sell off on eBay. The unwanted parts will be Voltron'd into a my little commuter/errand bike with a khaki pannier from Basil.


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## Squidward

saf-t said:


> That's interesting about he issue with the derailleur mounting spot- I'll have to see what happens with mine- I'd thought about putting a compact crank on, but may end up just using her old triple instead...


A 52 or even 53T big ring wouldn't make all that much of a difference, really. When you install a compact crank you usually drop the FD down about 4-5mm. I needed to drop the FD about 8mm with this setup. Also, remember that this isn't a racing bike so lower gears are preferred. The gearing I'm running is actually a 50/34 compact double up front and a 13-30 7-speed cassette in the rear (it's actually a 12-25 8-speed cassette with the 12T cog removed and the two largest cogs replaced with a 26 and 30T cogs from another cassette). This means that I will be using the large ring more often but it also means that I don't have a 12 or even a 11T rear cog taking up space on my cassette since I would rarely use them.


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## Squidward

Here are my pictures.


























Here's what the reflective tape looks like after dark:

























Here's the two pictures showing the front derailleur issue:

















Here's the rear brake cable stop:









Assorted photos:

















Yes, I made my own top cap because I was being cheap and I needed to kill some time. I used a chrome-moly mountain bike front fork with a BMX V-brake on the front because I want to eventually use a disc brake front fork on this bike with an Avid BB-7 road disc brake setup that I already have. I also have a rear rim with a ceramic brake track that I want to use on this bike. I need to build both wheels, first. The fork has a lot less trail than the Nashbar fork, which probably accounts for the toe overlap issue I mentioned earlier.

Anyone want to run disc brakes on this bike? I came up with a design for a rear disc brake mount in my head that I was going to incorporate into this build but decided to keep the rear cantilevers since I already have a ceramic rim for the rear wheel. I just need ceramic brake pads.


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## ryball

aesova said:


> The mirror comes from Rivendell. It attaches with a hoseclamp, so it really fits anywhere. I just found that the fork works best for me.
> 
> The light mount is made by Paul components. I actually have two of them on there now. They are $20 each, which might seem kind of pricey, but I really like having my lights at that level, and it frees up some space on my handlebars.


That mirror mounting idea is totally awesome. I am going to steal that as I have been COMPLETELY unsatisfied with various handlebar mounting options.

I use the shorter version of this to mount a secondary light - http://www.rei.com/product/738721


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## saf-t

Squidward said:


> Here are my pictures.


Nice to see that I'm not the only person with reflective tape all over his commuter.....  :thumbsup:


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## holy cromoly

Squidward:

Nice build! Mine will some similar parts to your's, most noted will be the FMF v-brakes that I have in my parts bin from my old cross bike. Forte seatpost too.

By the looks of your build, you have long legs and a short torso/arms? I am the opposite, My 56cm frame will have a low seatpost because of my short legs but a long stem for my gorilla arms.

Good idea with the reflective tape, that and the super brite Planet Bike tail blinker will definitely keep you safe.

As for the disc brake, A2Z makes a rear disc caliper adapter for non disc frames here:
https://www.a2zcomponents.com/OLD-web/Adapter/adap01.htm


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## Squidward

holy cromoly said:


> Squidward:
> 
> By the looks of your build, you have long legs and a short torso/arms? I am the opposite, My 56cm frame will have a low seatpost because of my short legs but a long stem for my gorilla arms.
> 
> As for the disc brake, A2Z makes a rear disc caliper adapter for non disc frames here:


Actually, no, I'm quite normally proportioned. That handlebar is wide with a long reach, longer than anything else I have. I originally intended to use a 120mm stem with this bike, which would have given me the 630mm TT + stem length that is on my other bikes but when I tried it with a 90mm stem the reach was crazy long. I then compared it to my other bikes and the reach to the hoods was about an inch longer than any other bike I have so I swapped the 90mm stem for the one I had put onto my growing nephew's bike and that's the stem in the photos. The reach to the tops is shorter than anything else I have but the reach to the hoods is about right. When I compared my spare Ritchey Logic handlebar to this one it has roughly 20mm less reach.

The disc adapter I had in mind actually braces on to the top edge of the drop-out as well as both the chain and seat stays, thus spreading the braking forces out over a larger area, which may prevent things from breaking. It'll also not require that you remove the rear QR to remove the rear wheel. I've pretty much decided to keep the cantilever rear brake on this bike, though, so I will not be making one of them unless someone here wants one.


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## Squidward

saf-t said:


> Nice to see that I'm not the only person with reflective tape all over his commuter.....  :thumbsup:


Yeah, I'd rather be seen than anything else. As an added benefit, when my buddy saw the bike he remarked that it was the ugliest thing he's seen on two wheels. That's exactly what I wanted to hear since this should cause potential thieves to look the other way.


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## Squidward

Just an update:
I got tired of the front tire overlap so I installed the fork that came with the frame. I still have overlap but it isn't as much as it was with the other fork. This involved installing a front cantilever brake onto this bike. The rear cantilever had better stopping power than the front V-brake did anyway so this was a better solution. I made some mounts to allow me to mount the front lights onto the fork but I didn't like the brighter light mounted that low because of the shadow of the front wheel but, also, because the light then has to be pointed horizontally to get the throw I wanted, which would blind on-coming drivers. Back on the bars they go! This also resolved the potential issue of the battery pack swinging over and into the spokes as I had to mount the battery pack onto the fork itself due to the short cable between the head and the pack.

I'll post pictures of this later today.


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## rodar y rodar

We`re going to need a moderator tp change the title of this thread to "NTB versions 2.0 through 3.6"

Squidward, I dig the chainrings on yours- what are they?


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## Squidward

They're FSA.

Here are the pictures, as promised. I made the light mount thing by cutting down some Delrin I had laying around to fit inside the cut off steerer tube. I then cut down the steerer tube section to fit the light.

The Cateye headlight is completely useless compared to the Niterider Minewt Mini-USB and doesn't contribute any to lighting when I use them together but this is my fall-back should I forget to charge the Mini-USB and it dies in the middle of my ride.


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## hepcatbent

Great thread! 

Well, I too drank the Nashbar touring frame cool-aid a couple of weeks ago. I had a Trek Millennia HT frame with 26" wheels that I'd built up a couple of years ago with all XT NOS or used that I'd found... but the frame was waaaay too small... so I briefly considered a Tom Teesdale custom frameset and fork for about $1300 or the Nashbar frameset and fork for $119. Hmmm...

So, I got a set of $99 Alex 700c built 36 spoke wheels with Deore hubs from bicyclewheelwarehouse.com, some $12 Nashbar clones of Schwalbe Marathons and a Cane Creek S3 headset. A $10.99 FSA micro adjust seatpost with a set of butterfly trekking bars, both from Nashbar, and some XTR brake and shifting cables and gray housing I picked up from a guy on Craigslist... and the bike building commenced. I (mostly) finished it yesterday. I need to re-tape the bars, and I've got a bunch of 5mm steerer tube spacers that I need to replace with four or five 20mm... but other than that, it's done. I'm 6'5" tall, and I really could have used a 62cm frame, but 60cm was as big as they go. I left the steerer tube uncut, and it's _really_ comfortable for me with a 100mm stem and the trekking bars. A Trek CRZ+ saddle makes the ride.

After only about 6 miles on it, I'm _really _impressed! I'll try to get some photos up tomorrow.


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## Squidward

Yes, please, post some pictures of your bike! We want to see it! 

I'm now thinking about getting a long cage RD and going with a 32 or 34T large rear cog. Currently, it has a 28T large rear cog and it doesn't seem to have low enough gearing if I'm going to be carrying a load up the hills around here.


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## hepcatbent

Ok, as promised... a couple of shots of my build-up. It's probably not as elegant as the other builds here, but it works for me. I stole the idea of low-mounting the light, and I'm trying it out... that cateye light I use primarily as a flashing light as I seldom ride much after dark, but I may mount a brighter handlebar light too. This morning, I also changed off the plain old black tape I had on the bars from the last frame I had them on.

Here's a link to the larger Flickr set:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/sets/72157622376726238/

and the set of the 17.5" frame donor Trek I built last year that most of the drivetrain parts came from...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/sets/72157606200684891/

and as long as I'm posting links to photos... if you're interested in seeing bikes... here's the link to my Flickr "bike collection" of bikes I have or have had over the past few years...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/collections/72157621959068439/

So... without further ado...


----------



## hepcatbent

And I've already done some mods... moved the tire pump behind the seat tube into the rear triangle, added a third bottle cage and bottle, and added a much needed second headlight to the handlebar. Just used it tonight... the cateye 3 LED headlight flashing on the fork, plus the 7 LED headlight on a steady beam on the handlebar really worked well... and got the attention of car drivers.

After just 10 miles, I can really tell that this bike is smooth... it's a very comfortable ride.


----------



## Squidward

That handlebar is crazy, but I like it! Nice bike!


----------



## hepcatbent

Squidward said:


> That handlebar is crazy, but I like it! Nice bike!


Thanks. The more I ride it the better I like it. It seems to fit me better than any bike I've had since I was a kid, and that was a long, long time ago.

I confess that the bar is a little eccentric. It's really comfortable tho... and gives a lot more hand positions than a straight or drop bars. The bar gives just a little more upright riding position for my aging neck. A full crouch isn't as comfortable as it used to be. 

I don't care for either bar-end or downtube shifters after having a number of each over the years. The M750s work well on the trekking bar, and I like that I never have to move my hands off the bar or brakes to shift in traffic. I really like this vintage XT M750 shift/brake combo. I've got the later model XT M760 combo shift/brake on my Hepcat and I just don't like them as well.


----------



## Squidward

Hmm, I think I may be having a problem with this bike. The other night I tried, for the first time, riding this bike no-handed and the bike was all over the place. It would not track at all. Quite scary. The other fork that I had on there has a shorter axle-to-crown and less rake than the fork that came with the frame does and I rode no-handed with that setup just fine. I had also noticed that the bike is now a lot less stable when JRA with this fork. It'll just seem to pick its own line at times so that, if I'm not paying attention to it, it looks like I'm a drunk riding my bike down the road. The frame is a 50 cm and I know that they have to play games with the geometry to make a frame this size, but, this is actually kind of scary. A touring frame is supposed to have stable handling, right? The longer axle-to-crown should have slackened the HTA, increasing the trail, but the slightly longer trail dimension of the fork should have compensated for it and all should be good. Could it be that the HTA is now so slack that the front end just wants to flop over to either side, trail be damned?

I'm going to try to get the Mosso aluminum disc brake fork for it sooner, rather than later, to see how it affects the handling of this bike. Dang it, I need to build a new disc-specific front wheel, now.


----------



## ispoke

*wheel flop*



Squidward said:


> ...A touring frame is supposed to have stable handling, right?


Dude - I suggest you read up on wheel flop factor ("f" measured in millimeters). Bicycle Quarterly has published plenty of discussion. You can use this calculator to model your bike with different forks/geometries:

http://www.kogswell.com/geo.php

Keep in mind the OD of the tire (for the calculator) is the actual outside diameter of the tire without rider or luggage weight.

Generally speaking, many touring bikes are built with significant front wheel flop in order to compensate for the reduction in steering control attributed with carrying too much weight on the rear of the bike (80/20 rear-to-front instead of 50/50 or 40/60).

By the time you take into account that 50cm frames are built around compromises, it's not surprising that the handling is less than perfect. The only way to avoid geometry compromises on small frames is to choose a smaller wheel diameter such as 650b or 26".

YMMV.


----------



## hepcatbent

*Finished...*

Ok... last post I promise... I was heavily influenced by aesova's build-up. The aesthetics of the satin silver components on his bike is just perfect. I decided to borrow not only his fork mount light idea, but I also really liked the SKS fenders... and he was kind enough to provide his source.

So... I ordered several more items, mostly cosmetic... the 5mm steerer tube spacer stack I used wasn't pleasing, and I just wasn't happy with the black fenders. I wanted matching bottles... and a couple of other odds-n-ends. The bike now sports a forged Burley two-wheel trailer hitch for my Burley trailers, for example.

So... without taking up more space, here's a shot of the finished bike. 










If you're interested, there are several more shots with the new 'stuff' on it (along with the original build-up shots) here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/sets/72157622376726238/


----------



## Squidward

Squidward said:


> Hmm, I think I may be having a problem with this bike....


I think I found the problem. The rear wheel was not dished properly. It sits about 1/8" too far towards the NDS. I need to fire my mechanic/wheelbuilder but I would only be firing myself. I'll fix it this coming weekend.


----------



## transplant

*Here's a returned one*

http://www.nashbar.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10053_10052_506161_-1_201352__201348


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## wetzk

*With the traditional Garage door backdrop*

Here are a few shots of mine. It's my grocery getter/early morning exercise ride bike. I have a Nomad trailer I use at times when we go for more than a couple bags. I have 2 1 watt LED lights up front, at night one's flashing and the other is steady and a 1/2 watt LED tail light. And reflector tape all over it. 
You should see the looks I get from the " real bicyclist" when they see it.
I just swapped the tires and rims from a Surly LTH as I wanted the fancy Mavics for touring.


----------



## wetzk

*Almost forgot why I originally came here to post.*

I had a few scratches and paint chips on the frame and found Duplicolor NG-GM-518 was a very close match. And if anybody is curious that's a stem mounted upside down with a piece of handlebar in it that the lights and burgerbell are mounted on.


----------



## hepcatbent

wetzk said:


> I had a few scratches and paint chips on the frame and found Duplicolor NG-GM-518 was a very close match. And if anybody is curious that's a stem mounted upside down with a piece of handlebar in it that the lights and burgerbell are mounted on.


Wow! That's ingenious. As a matter of fact, after looking at the photos, I _was_ going to ask how you did that! What a cool way to add a little extra real estate for 'stuff'. Thanks for sharing that!


----------



## Fai Mao

barbedwire said:


> Sorry for the dumb question guys, but I'm a little new to all this. Are V-brakes better than cantilevers? Which one is more powerful? Which is lighter? thanks



They weigh about the same.

As to better that depends
They stop more or less the same. There is no difference in the stiffness, mechanical advantage or braking ability. Indeed, when they first appeared the manufacturers even stated as much in advertisements. 

Each have advantages and disadvantages.

Cantilevers are far more adjustable because you can adjust the straddle wire which changes the mechanical advantage and makes the brake engage faster or slower. This allows you to use them with a wider variety of levers and rim widths. The deal is you have to be willing to play around with them sometimes to get them work on with certain road levers.

Some riders frame makers (Grant Petersen for example) say cantilever calipers are easier to get to fit around racks and fenders but I've not had problems with either type in this area but it certainly looks like cantilever's give more clearance. Both seem to sometimes have heel clearance issues on some frames. 

V-Brakes are better brakes if you have a suspended frame or non-standard cable routing. If you bottom out a suspension you could effectively change the adjustment of straddle wire for a moment which changed the brake performance. Also in such situations the straddle wire could come loose and you'd be in deep trouble. That is, I think the real reason for V-brakes. V-Brakes are much more fool-proof and maybe law-suit proof, assuming your levers are compatible. The straddle wire (Noodle) does not come loose if you bottom out your suspension and will not cause you to loose your braking ability or send you over the bars if it happens on the front wheel.. That is not a minor detail. Indeed, if you ride a suspended MTB without disc brakes you should use V-Brakes. The other advantage, if you can a call it that, of a V-Brake is that they don't need cable stops.

So, on a non-suspended bike, it might come down to what you like. 

Hope that helps


----------



## Squidward

V-brakes are a lot easier to set up than cantilevers. The problem with cantilevers is that it is too easy to set them up incorrectly so they don't stop well on most bikes out there on the road that have them. If set up properly they stop very well, some will say that they stop better than V-brakes. Most tandems run cantilevers or disc brakes, rarely do you see them using V-brakes, probably because of the issue of finding drop-bar compatible V-brake compatible levers, but, still, you don't see them all too often on a tandem.

When selecting cantilevers I would go with either wide or medium profile brakes. Low profile cantis seem to have a narrower range for getting them to work well.


----------



## andleo

my take on it, my first complete bike build my first drop bar road bike

xt 36h hubs deore rear derailleur 105 front. Microshift sti 9 speed levers, deore 48/36/26 crank, cane creek cr5 ( I think) cantis. Salsa bell lap bar can creek cross levers sks fenders.
28c front, 32 c armadillo tires.

I have a cannondale 29er that I normaly ride, typicly only ride on dirt but with winter coming I wanted something to ride on the road

this is my first time on a bike with sub 2.0" tires it feels odd the handling is different and of course the braking isn't the same - I rode for the first time today for 15 ish min then got on the cannondale, I almost went over the bar when I had to come to a stop. It is really nice to be able to coast and its really easy to pedal

I have a 46cm bar do they make them any wider? im used to a 29" flat bar and I have pretty wide shoulders


----------



## Fai Mao

If you want awider bar look at a Mustache bar. Several companies make them. They can be an aquired taste to ride on but are wide and look really cool


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## hepcatbent

Nicely done! 

Roger


----------



## m_s

The narrower bar is an adjustment. When I get on a bike with even wide drops or mustache bars from my mountain bike, it takes a few minutes to acclimate but then I'm fine. You don't want a bar that's too wide, as you may get too splayed out and wind could be a pain. 

But there are also dirt drops, if you want to try something even wider. Salsa has a new one called the woodchipper, I think.


----------



## andleo

I rode it for 4ish miles today stem is deff to long (It was an extra) so I ordered a shorter one. I acclimated to the width of the bar but my hands don't like the flare (my palms near instantly get cold and numb, I will wait and see when the new stem comes.

I cannot get over how easy it is to pedal, im thinking about putting a smaller/lighter rear tire on my mountain bike, the tires I have on it now weigh 800g each


----------



## andleo

proper pic


----------



## holy cromoly

*Adding mine to the mix...*

Finally getting around to adding my pics to this fun thread of Nashbar Tourers.

Built mine up as an all-rounder for commuting, coffee and weekend fireroad rides.

I had some spare parts laying around, sorted them out and realized I had enough to put a frankenstein bike together.


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## hepcatbent

That's a pretty hot Frankenbike! Well done! And it's a 29'er? Very inventive!

Roger


----------



## aesova

That's gorgeous! I love the bars. Kind of has a Pashley look about it, with a bit of Klunkerz spirit.


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## hepcatbent

These things are SO much fun... I've been playing "components" on mine since I built it... I've added a Nashbar small front rack, and I just ordered the small bag/panniers that they made for it. It's normally $34 and they had it on sale this weekend for $14. I'm building up my old Trek Millennia HT frame for a friend, and needed some parts, so I ordered the bag too. I also went the second stem route on the steerer tube for light mounting, and mounted both lights, my cycle computer (I'd had it on the stem, but the angle made it hard to read) and added a Myrricle MTB mirror to the bike. The trekking bars make it difficult to mount the mirror, and although I'm used to helmet mounted mirrors, I really prefer a bike-mounted mirror. I used a 12" long 5/8" ID dark grey PVC riser and cut the threads off for the (roughtly 10") mounting bar, and used an old handlebar plug for the open end.

After the new bag arrives, I'll post another shot or two of the setup.


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## holy cromoly

aesova said:


> That's gorgeous! I love the bars. Kind of has a Pashley look about it, with a bit of Klunkerz spirit.


Thx aesova.
It did end up looking like a Pashley. I have some creme color tires coming in soon, same one on the Pashley Guv'nor (Schwable Delta Cruiser).


----------



## holy cromoly

Thx Roger.
I originally had some 32c tires on it. Then remember that I had these semi-slick 29er tires from my mtb bike. Took a look at the fork and rear stays, and it appeared to be wide enough and thought why not?


----------



## holy cromoly

The versatility of these frames do make them fun to tinker with.

I've got some 700x35c cream color Schwable Delta Cruiser tires on the way. It's gonna have the looks of a Pashley with the versatility of a big wheel version of a Bridgestone X0.

How are you liking those trekking handlebars? I fiddle with them at REI on their adventure bike. Seems like the slight flex is ideal and adds comfort.


----------



## hepcatbent

holy cromoly said:


> The versatility of these frames do make them fun to tinker with.
> 
> I've got some 700x35c cream color Schwable Delta Cruiser tires on the way. It's gonna have the looks of a Pashley with the versatility of a big wheel version of a Bridgestone X0.
> 
> How are you liking those trekking handlebars? I fiddle with them at REI on their adventure bike. Seems like the slight flex is ideal and adds comfort.


Those cream colored tires are gonna just SCREAM "Pashley"! :thumbsup:

I really like the trekking bars. I've never noticed any flex, though, and I've really put them through their paces on an '08 police Trek I ride at work... I get lots of positive comments on them too; they're just something kind of out of the ordinary.

Roger


----------



## andleo

still working on getting the bike setup

it developed a shimmy in the front fork when braking so I toed the pads but lost a good deal of braking power, I am using cane creek sx5 canti's

I can flex the fork when stationary by leaning on the bike as well

my question is, is this normal (fork flex) I weigh 290 lbs, should I look into getting a stronger front fork?


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## hepcatbent

290 lbs leaning on a fork will make it flex. That's a LOT of weight on one end of a bike. Setting the toe on the pads shouldn't affect braking power. I don't know what the weight these frames can handle without a problem, but at your weight, I'd be checking any frame regularly for cracks just to be on the safe side.


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## hepcatbent

*I lied.*

I said last time I wouldn't post any more photos... well I was browsing at one of our LBS, and found that Bontrager has come out with a new seat line... the SSR. And I had to try it. And I liked it! So... that necessitated some changes... new bar tape... new bottles... And since I posted the last photo, I "borrowed" the second stem idea. I used a Bontrager 130mm stem and an old seat post I had lying around for the extra bar. I may yet cut it down, but it works VERY well as a mirror mount for a Myrricle mountain bike mirror. I also added a Nashbar front rack and bag (about $12 each) and store my rain gear, multi-tool and a couple of velo caps in it. So far, so good! I also added a Pletscher two-legged kickstand... a great addition!

So... here's the new look:


----------



## andybaran

These are really some great looking bikes! 

How are you guys figuring out what size you need? I've been riding a 54cm Trek 1500 for the past few years and am looking to build this up as a commuter so as to stop beating the hell out of it. From what I can tell the 1500 fits well but is a bit long for me. I've already had to get shorter cranks and should probably get a shorter stem. So I measured my inseam, multiplied by .65 and ended up with 53cm. Am I screwing myself over by ordering a 52CM frame?


----------



## hepcatbent

andybaran said:


> These are really some great looking bikes!
> 
> How are you guys figuring out what size you need? So I measured my inseam, multiplied by .65 and ended up with 53cm. Am I screwing myself over by ordering a 52CM frame?


Andy, that's one of the great gambles one takes when buying a VERY inexpensive frame mail order... and all you can do is take your best guess and run with it. Nashbar doesn't provide a geometry chart per se, but this is about as close as it comes:



> Frame Size (C/T) 50 52 54 56 58 60
> Top Tube Length 51cm 52cm 54cm 56cm 59cm 61cm
> Head Tube Length 125mm 125mm 135mm 135mm 145mm 155mm
> Head Tube Angle 72 72 72 72 72 72
> Seat Tube Angle 73 73 73 73 73 73
> Chainstay Length 45.5cm 45.5cm 45.5cm 45.5cm 45.5cm 45.5cm
> Wheelbase 101cm 101cm 103cm 105cm 108cm 109cm


I probably could have/should have gotten a 62 cm, but my 60 (with the stem/handlebar/seat post/crank combo I have) fits me very well, and it was just the luck of the draw. I guess I'd measure the Trek, and if you like the dimensions, get the frame size that is closest to it. 

One point to pay attention to... Surly doesn't make the LHT with 700c wheels smaller than 56cm... 54cm and smaller all use a 26" wheelset... something to do with the geometry of small frames and larger wheels. There's a couple of earlier posts in this thread about that very issue. If you can live with that, then you should be good... let us know what you build up!


----------



## andybaran

Well, we'll see about the fit nothing to do now than wait till I get it built up and out for a ride  I'm pretty confident it'll workout.

I'm sure I missed something but I looked back through all the posts in this thread and didn't see any mention of the Surly LHT and/or wheelset size. You said "If you can live with that" I don't know what I'll be living with  Can you elaborate? Will I need to put 26" wheels on this frame? Is just going to be a pain to work with 700c wheels and this frame? Thanks!


----------



## hepcatbent

Squidward was having tire overlap and stability issues on his 50 cm frame with 700c wheels, and ispoke made an interesting post about "wheel flop" and how it affects small frames.

Interesting stuff I'd never either thought or read about before.


----------



## andybaran

Ah ok. Frankly, I had no idea what wheel flop, trail or fork rage are but now it makes sense. Man this cycling stuff is great. I just learned a LOT about trail, fork rake, etc. For anyone else who might come across this and also be confused....

Read this first: Good Explanation of trail and fork rake

Now read a good thread about wheel flop: http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-304544.html

Thanks again hep! I will make sure to post pictures here once it's all built up


----------



## hepcatbent

andybaran said:


> Well, we'll see about the fit nothing to do now than wait till I get it built up and out for a ride  I'm pretty confident it'll workout.
> 
> Will I need to put 26" wheels on this frame? Is just going to be a pain to work with 700c wheels and this frame? Thanks!


Oh... and just to be clear, all sizes of this frame are apparently set up for 700c wheels... no 26" choice there.


----------



## andleo

one of the things I noticed about this frame when I compared it to other touring frames is the headtube is fairly short, I used ~60mm of spacers on mine

I had pretty bad front brake shudder on mine but im heavy, I ordered a fork mounted cable stop for the front hopefully that will cure it.

eventually I want to replace the frame, I am really liking the soma saga but comming from mountain biking I really want a salsa fargo, riding something like the continental divide really appeals to me. If that does happen I plan on doing what cromoly did and use this frame for fireroad cruising.


----------



## andleo

I m thinking about replacing the fork on this bike, the nashbar one has a good deal of flex, I was looking at the surly LHT fork seeing how it is steel. Would that fork be stiffer or should I go with a straight fork? I have a few inches of toe/wheel clearance


----------



## holy cromoly

andleo said:


> I m thinking about replacing the fork on this bike, the nashbar one has a good deal of flex, I was looking at the surly LHT fork seeing how it is steel. Would that fork be stiffer or should I go with a straight fork? I have a few inches of toe/wheel clearance


I am not sure if the Surly fork is significantly stiffer than the stock Nashbar fork.

Are you noticing negative ride quality/performance due to the flex?


----------



## andleo

holy cromoly said:


> I am not sure if the Surly fork is significantly stiffer than the stock Nashbar fork.
> 
> Are you noticing negative ride quality/performance due to the flex?


not really but isn't the fork aluminum? Im pretty heavy and I don't know if I would trust aluminum to stand up to flexing like that, along with an aluminum steerer tube


----------



## wetzk

My fork is aluminum ( or some non magnetic metal ) and at 190 Lbs I've noticed flex also.
Normally aluminums designed to minimize flex as it fatigues quickly so I wonder how long before one of us has a problem? I'm going to start looking at replacing the fork as its the only thing that I'm concerned about. I also have a LTH and the fork is a good fit for the nashbike.


----------



## undies

It's great to see this thread still going! Here we are with NBT 1.0 and NBT 2.0 in Astoria last summer.


----------



## andleo

wetzk said:


> My fork is aluminum ( or some non magnetic metal ) and at 190 Lbs I've noticed flex also.
> Normally aluminums designed to minimize flex as it fatigues quickly so I wonder how long before one of us has a problem? I'm going to start looking at replacing the fork as its the only thing that I'm concerned about. I also have a LTH and the fork is a good fit for the nashbike.


the frame is great, only downside is the top tube seems long (but this gives more standover as well) and the headtube is short (at least on mine, 58cm)


----------



## hepcatbent

Ok... time for major mod #1... I went to the swap meet in Madison WI last month and picked up a Cane Creek Thudbuster for $50 and an Alfine hub and shifter new in the box for $250... so I've ordered a new rim and spokes... and I'll try the Alfine with my XT crankset and see what it's like... I'll post again with photos when I get everything together.


----------



## bacoes

Nashbar has this frameset on sale right now for $75 plus a 10% off code. Bumms me out because I ordered on last week at the higher price.


----------



## andleo

bacoes said:


> Nashbar has this frameset on sale right now for $75 plus a 10% off code. Bumms me out because I ordered on last week at the higher price.


when I ordered mine they didn't have the 60cm in stock, they still don't.


----------



## AlanKHG

I'm a poor student type looking to go cross-country this summer, and I'm looking pretty strongly in this direction, especially because I have access to cheap parts at the local bike coop. Is there anything that should dissuade me from this?


----------



## saf-t

AlanKHG said:


> I'm a poor student type looking to go cross-country this summer, and I'm looking pretty strongly in this direction, especially because I have access to cheap parts at the local bike coop. Is there anything that should dissuade me from this?


Nope.


----------



## bacoes

Mine came today. I'm pretty impressed with the quality. I used to work for a small bike company that imported cheap Ti and AL frames from China and this is better than what we used to get in. Head tube and BB were both faced. Not only were the BB threads clean, so too were all the bosses. Well packed. Great value for $100


----------



## mondayC

Mine now


----------



## rcnute

mondayC said:


> Mine now


Nice score.


----------



## Spudzie

I alos purchesed this frame an am building it up as a commuter...

I'm thinking strongly about using V-brakes on this frame..Can someone give me a little 411 on this. Do i need special V's like bmx V's???

This is my first 700cc bike build...


----------



## hepcatbent

Spudzie said:


> I alos purchesed this frame an am building it up as a commuter...
> 
> I'm thinking strongly about using V-brakes on this frame..Can someone give me a little 411 on this. Do i need special V's like bmx V's???
> 
> This is my first 700cc bike build...


Nope... any standard V-brake setup will work... the key is getting brake levers that are appropriate for your handlebars that will do v-brakes.

I used all XT on my build. You can use cantis but they'll need to have mounts installed on the headset and seat post. V-brakes don't need anything extra, and I've been pleased with the performance of the v-brakes on mine.


----------



## bacoes

I'm also going to be setting mine up with Vs (hopefully will be delivered today), Supposedly, mini-v will work with any canti lever including drop levers. I've never had much luck with them in practice. Plus, mini-vs won't leave you enough room to put fenders on. If you are planning on running drops (or moustache for that matter), you'll need to find a set of Tektro RL520 levers. They pull enough cable for Vs or discs for that matter.


----------



## wetzk

*Looks like I'll be needing a new fork.*

Did not have to wait to see if the aluminum was going to be a problem down the road. Mr thief broke into our garage while we were on vacation and tried to steal a couple bikes.
I have huge heavy duty chains running through all of them and I can see where he tried but gave up breaking through the lock. So he tried to steal a couple wheels. 
First he tried unscrewing the pitlocks, I can see the evidence. Then he tried knocking them off. Then he apparently thought he could break the forks?? He pounded on one side of the nashbar fork and must have given up. 
So who makes a good fork that has 44 to 45 mm rake and 425mm axle to crown?
I thought I could use a Surly LHT fork but it is shorter and gives the bike a Manx look and is squirrelly.
Oh and I get to start over collecting tools as he did manage to haul a lot of them off .


----------



## saf-t

I'm running standard Vs with travel agents (built this as a rain/early spring bike so fenders are a must) and they've been just fine.


----------



## andleo

wetzk said:


> Did not have to wait to see if the aluminum was going to be a problem down the road. Mr thief broke into our garage while we were on vacation and tried to steal a couple bikes.
> I have huge heavy duty chains running through all of them and I can see where he tried but gave up breaking through the lock. So he tried to steal a couple wheels.
> First he tried unscrewing the pitlocks, I can see the evidence. Then he tried knocking them off. Then he apparently thought he could break the forks?? He pounded on one side of the nashbar fork and must have given up.
> So who makes a good fork that has 44 to 45 mm rake and 425mm axle to crown?
> I thought I could use a Surly LHT fork but it is shorter and gives the bike a Manx look and is squirrelly.
> Oh and I get to start over collecting tools as he did manage to haul a lot of them off .



I was thinking about the kona p2 fork before I think its 390 though, the problem I had was a fork would run $70 ish and the frame and fork together where $100

nashbar only has size 54, 56 and 58 now could they be coming out with a new model?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

*Need canti brake advice*

I am building a tourer on the Nashbar frame.

I would like to use cantilever brakes since I will be using 105 brifters which are incompatible with V-brakes.

I'm putting together an order with Niagara; and I'm having trouble identifying a suitable rear brake cable guide. Which one are you using? How is it attached? Where is the barrel adjuster? Here are some candidates:

http://www.niagaracycle.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=cable+hanger&x=0&y=0

For the front brake cable guide I'm planning on using this--OK?:
http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=431338

For the cantilever brakes, they all look the same to me--Any recommendations? More candidates:
http://www.niagaracycle.com/index.php?cPath=93_211

Appreciate any help!


----------



## saf-t

These work just fine with Vs and my Ultegra brifters.....


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

Thank you--I've seen those and consider them a last resort--I really want cantis and I'm sure there's one of those cable hangers that will do the job just fine; but I need it identified for me by someone who is familiar with the idiosyncracies of the Nash frame.


----------



## bacoes

I think your best bet is the dimension cable hanger with angle adjustment for the rear. You are still going to have a funny angle coming off of the cable stop, but maybe you can play with the angle a bit and get it to run smooth. Barring that, maybe check with some shops to see if they have any old binder bolt cable stops that have more drop. 

For the front, I'd go with the Origin8 with the barrel adjuster. I like having some level of cable adjustability whenever I set up cantis.

As far as wide vs low profile canti arms, I always heard wide arms were easier to set up.


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

Here's another adjustable one I just found: It looks like it offers a little more

http://www.bikeman.com/BR1236i.html...utm_medium=GoogleBase&utm_campaign=GoogleBase

On second thought, maybe it's just a different shot of the same one, although this one is labeled Dia-compe


----------



## andleo

for a cable hanger I am using (rear) http://surlybikes.com/parts/cable_hanger/

for the front I tried a steerer one but had bad bad brake shudder a crown one fixed that I think I got it from the place you linked but on amazon, can't find it now however.

for canti's I am using http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=1326 for the rear, very poor power however on the front I have http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAKE-CALIPER-T...Cycling_Parts_Accessories?hash=item4cee2e0326 very good power and decent modulation


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

andleo said:


> for a cable hanger I am using (rear) http://surlybikes.com/parts/cable_hanger/
> 
> for the front I tried a steerer one but had bad bad brake shudder a crown one fixed that I think I got it from the place you linked but on amazon, can't find it now however.
> 
> for canti's I am using http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=1326 for the rear, very poor power however on the front I have http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAKE-CALIPER-T...Cycling_Parts_Accessories?hash=item4cee2e0326 very good power and decent modulation


For the front, are you saying that you had to install one of those headsets that has the cable hanger built in? Otherwise I don't know what "a crown one" is . . . I'm thinking I will use the kind of hanger with a strong clamp "a la Sheldon" and not bother with spacers, just install my stem up above wherever I want it.

Hey, also, please reassure me that this is what I need to put on the downtube:
http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=403285

It says there's an adjuster on the right side--If there's no adjuster on the left side, how do you adjust the cable for your front derailleur?

Thanks for your help!


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

andleo said:


> for canti's I am using http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=1326 for the rear, very poor power


I'm sure you've given this a lot of thought--why do you think your rear brake has very poor power? I mean mechanically they're all about the same, So is it a problem with the cable routing, do you think?


----------



## andleo

ClarkinHawaii said:


> I'm sure you've given this a lot of thought--why do you think your rear brake has very poor power? I mean mechanically they're all about the same, So is it a problem with the cable routing, do you think?



they are not the same geometry wise the cane creek is like \||/ and the tektro is more like -||- . The cane creek ( I think its actually a rebadged tektro onyx) comes with a fixed yoke while the 720 has an adjustable. I don't think its a cable routing issue.


----------



## andleo

ClarkinHawaii said:


> For the front, are you saying that you had to install one of those headsets that has the cable hanger built in? Otherwise I don't know what "a crown one" is . . . I'm thinking I will use the kind of hanger with a strong clamp "a la Sheldon" and not bother with spacers, just install my stem up above wherever I want it.
> 
> Hey, also, please reassure me that this is what I need to put on the downtube:
> http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=403285
> 
> It says there's an adjuster on the right side--If there's no adjuster on the left side, how do you adjust the cable for your front derailleur?
> 
> Thanks for your help!


found it in my order history.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000C14HNS/ref=oss_product
it mounts on the fork arch. you will need an inline adjuster as well


----------



## hepcatbent

ClarkinHawaii said:


> Hey, also, please reassure me that this is what I need to put on the downtube:
> http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=403285
> 
> It says there's an adjuster on the right side--If there's no adjuster on the left side, how do you adjust the cable for your front derailleur?
> 
> Thanks for your help!


The downtube cable stops I bought are exactly like this... and they both adjust, but are not symmetrical. The right side looks like this one, the left, though, has a "wing" looking affair that does the adusting. I'm using XT shift/brake combo tho... and there are plenty of other adjustment points... so I haven't worried about these.

Roger


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

Thanks, Fellas!


----------



## mondayC

The massively beefy fork of the Nashbar is too big for the rack mounts on the (lightly) used Blackburn FL-1 front rack I just bought. The beefiness of the area near the dropouts seems to be interfering as well. Any smart ideas, RBR? 
Pic is how it is supposed to mount:


----------



## andleo

I used a longer bolt and nuts as spacers


----------



## old_fuji

What wheels is everybody running on their NBT? Has anybody had any issues with axles bending due to the unconventional spacing on the rear?


----------



## bacoes

Uhhhh, mine's 130 o.l.d. Flea market find Aksium dropped right in.


----------



## UnivegaRVR

I have a 135mm rear hub and have had no problems at all I don't think there is any need to worry about axle stress it's a 2.5mm difference.


----------



## mike047

I have a Nashbar touring frame that I have begun to piece together.

I have most of the parts and have resolved all my issues except one.

I want to use this bar;
http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/HB275D01-Easton+Deltaforce+Al+Aluminum+Bar+09.aspx

and levers similar to these;
http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/BL309A00-Tektro+Tenera+Linear+Pull+Brake+Levers.aspx

I am using "V" brakes and need long pull levers.

The issue is that the bar is 24mm and the levers are 22mm.
I have been unable to find any long pull levers that will fit this bar except a couple of sets that are for road bikes.

Anyone know where I can get 24mm levers to fit?


----------



## UnivegaRVR

I think that maybe a hard find. Simple put I don't think they make lever in that size. 
-That being said I have been able to fit 22mm levers on 24 mm bars but I wasn't able to get them screw back back in.
-If your main concern is using direct pull brakes several manufacturers make mini-v brakes that work without long pull levers. (Although the do not offer much tire or fender clearance)
-You could buy problem solvers travel agent that increases the amount of cable pull and allows you to use what ever lever you want (maybe use these with reverse brakes)

Good luck!


----------



## saf-t

The travel agents work very well- I have them because I have STI levers on drop bars and am running v-brakes.


----------



## old_fuji

Does anybody have the BB shell dimensions for the NTB?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

old_fuji said:


> Does anybody have the BB shell dimensions for the NTB?


It's standard--68mm from left to right across the shell. English threaded--something like 33mm shell diameter. Axle length would vary with your application.


----------



## holy cromoly

I've had my Nashbar for almost a year now.

Will write my long term report in the next couple weeks. Pics will come follow. Mine has had commuter duty and is dressed up like an path racer ala Pashley Guv'nor style.

There was a question about the rear running a 135mm hub. After one year, my XT 135mm disc hub has been problem free and the frame is just fine. I've had 132.5mm spaced rear frames before and it's never been a problem, steel and alum.

Checked Nashbar recently and was surprised to see these frames sold out. Kudos to Nashbar for a useful product that is wallet friendly.


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

holy cromoly said:


> and is dressed up like an path racer ala Pashley Guv'nor style.


I like the look--already have the cream-colored tires.

I'm a little confused about the handlebars. Apparently there are different makers/versions of the Northroad bar, with different dimensions and the ability to accommodate different shifters, brake levers, etc.

I'm committed to canti brakes and shimano 10-speed. I was going to use the bar-end shifters (already have) in the bar ends, but then I saw a guy who did that and they stuck out to the sides too far. Now thinking about the Paul Thumbies positioned as you have your shifter.

Based on your experience, which Northroad bar would you recommend, and which (short pull) mtb brake levers to fit that bar? I'm sure the Nitto is the nicest bar, but I haven't yet been shown a reason why I should spend that kind of money ($85) when Niagara has look-alikes for $13 (Sunlite-alloy) and $9 (Pyramid-steel), etc.

Also there are factors that are impossible to gauge from pictures, like amount of drop, etc. Also I want grips like you have.

I got the Brooks springer saddle in dark green for $45 new, although I would have preferred the "honey"--but I guess they all turn dark in the end.

What do you think about the bars?


----------



## old_fuji

Really random question...
Are the headtube and bottom bracket shell faced? Mine looks like these two areas are pretty clean (and unpainted).

Also, clarkinhawaii...How does the green brooks saddle look on the bike? Got pics to post?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

old_fuji said:


> Really random question...
> Are the headtube and bottom bracket shell faced? Mine looks like these two areas are pretty clean (and unpainted).
> 
> Also, clarkinhawaii...How does the green brooks saddle look on the bike? Got pics to post?


HT and BB are nice--no additional work needed.

Dark Green saddle doesn't look any better than a black one, really. I now wish I had not gotten it as the thing weighs a ton and the "suspension" springs are unyielding. Maybe for a clyde, but for my 150 lbs it's like sitting on a pine board nailed to the seatpost. And I soaked it in mineral oil first, ala Sheldon. Well, I realize there are 2 different issues here that I should be treating separately. The pine-board leather will allegedly become more forgiving with use. The springs, on the other hand, are just useless dead weight.

No camera = no pics


----------



## hepcatbent

I lied again. After I bought the Alfine hub and wheel, I rode the bike with it's all XT components. I just couldn't bring myself to take the XT off... it SO smooth... <sigh> I LOVE the Thudbuster tho! 

I've been toying with components and have it just about set up exactly the way I want it. I'm planning on taking it on RAGBRAI this year, and have my week's pass... but due to other committments, I won't be able to make it the first two days. I've decided to self-support with my Burley Nomad, and I've been fiddling with components and accessories to get it "just right". I've got a LeZyne HVG frame pump that's in at my LBS that I need to go pick up and get mounted along with a couple of new "touring" tires instead of my street slicks... and then I'll post a couple more photos of the bike decked out for the road. I haven't had it out much yet, but I'm waiting for my OCLV-frame roadie crowd friends to decry the weight and accoutrement! It'll be hilarious! 

I had to buy new camping 'stuff' for RAGBRAI this year... my sleeping bags weighed 20 lbs, my tent was a 1979 vintage Eureka Timberline 2, and my "kitchen" was 1992 aluminum stuff... damn, I'm getting old! I've got the trailer loaded up with my camping equipment all ready to go... I wanted to figure out how it would all fit. And to my pleasure, it fits very nicely, and balances much better than full loaded panniers. 



hepcatbent said:


> Ok... time for major mod #1... I went to the swap meet in Madison WI last month and picked up a Cane Creek Thudbuster for $50 and an Alfine hub and shifter new in the box for $250... so I've ordered a new rim and spokes... and I'll try the Alfine with my XT crankset and see what it's like... I'll post again with photos when I get everything together.


----------



## hepcatbent

*ready to tour*

Here's the Nashbar in it's final incarnation ready to hit the road... finally. I've tweaked a lot of things... mostly accessory kinds of things. The bike itself hasn't changed much from the initial build. With the trailer attached, I've got five taillights... and two headlights. Both headlights flash in daylight, the larger of the two I use for illumination, the second stays on flash even at night.

In the couple of short rides I've taken with the trailer, I've noticed a very interesting difference. I haven't been "buzzed" by a car once. It happens all the time with the bike alone, but towing the trailer, every car that has passed has waited until it was safe, and then used the entire passing lane to get around me, even though I ride in the right tire track, close to the fog line. There must be something different about the the psychology of seeing the trailer.

Here's a link to my flickr page with the bike in its various versions on the way to where it is today. There are also some closeups of my final double-stem cockpit setup and some other detail shots.

Anyway... here's how it looks for my planned summer outings:

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4611595832/" title="Nashbar Touring Bike with Burley Nomad trailer by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm2.static.flickr.com/1187/4611595832_b575171c62_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="Nashbar Touring Bike with Burley Nomad trailer" /></a>

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4610988635/" title="Nashbar Touring Bike by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm2.static.flickr.com/1004/4610988635_aa2fd6acbf_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="Nashbar Touring Bike" /></a>

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4610995177/" title="Nashbar Touring Bike with Burley Nomad trailer by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm4.static.flickr.com/3333/4610995177_5d20310348_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="Nashbar Touring Bike with Burley Nomad trailer" /></a>

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4611607368/" title="Front of bike by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm2.static.flickr.com/1244/4611607368_768bfa0334_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="Front of bike" /></a>


----------



## holy cromoly

*Latest photo*

It's been a solid ride. My daily commuter, errand and weekend 50 mile+ solo bike.


----------



## JP

holy cromoly said:


> It's been a solid ride. My daily commuter, errand and weekend 50 mile+ solo bike.


Cool!


----------



## holy cromoly

ClarkinHawaii said:


> What do you think about the bars?


I like the bars alot. The sweep angle is easy on the wrists. At the same time, steering still feels fast and snappy. 

They are made by Wald, but I do not know what model it is. I've had them in my attic for years and pulled them down for this build.

All these Northroad style bars are similar. One thing to note is the usable grip/lever/shifter length of the bar. Some of these bars don't have enough room for shfiter and brake lever.


----------



## bacoes

Did anyone find a FD that works with a mountain 43-32-22 crankset without modification? I'm changing mine into a trailer hauler and would like to lower my gear range.


----------



## hepcatbent

Any of the standard mountain FDs will work. I used a standard Shimano FD-M760 XT top swing, dual pull front derailleur on mine... IIRC, the seatpost tube is 31.8mm, but the derailleur comes with all the necessary shims. I have an FC-M752 octalink crankset with 44-32-22 chainrings.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4122604073/sizes/l/in/set-72157622376726238/


----------



## mike047

bacoes said:


> Did anyone find a FD that works with a mountain 43-32-22 crankset without modification? I'm changing mine into a trailer hauler and would like to lower my gear range.


M770, top swing, low mount will work.


----------



## JimT

I am loving the bikes everyone here has put together. I am thinking about putting a Pashley Guv'ner look-alike. 
Unfortunately I have Zero bike building experience. Has anyone blogged their build or anything so I can kind of cheat off them...

Thanks in Advance..

JimT


----------



## UnivegaRVR

I thought about blogging my build but I got to into it and never took pictures of the process. Building up a frame isn't that difficult you just need the right tools. 
Websites I found useful

www.parktool.com/repair/ 
Has repair and installation guides with pictures for just about any bike part

http://bicycletutor.com/
Repair and maintenance site with videos (very helpful)

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/glossary.html
Great reference guide

Most of the tools you will need aren't too expensive except for a headset press. However you can make one yourself 
http://www.bikecommuters.com/2007/09/29/homemade-headset-installation-tools/

Hope that helps plus I'm sure anyone on this forum or the mechanics forum would be happy to answer any questions that may arise.


----------



## JimT

Thanks for the info, now I just have to find a suitable frame, it seems Nashbar doesn't carry the touring frame anymore. 

Thanks again 
Jimt


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

EDIT: I changed my mind about this, Got rid of the uncomfortable Brooks saddle, put on the Selle SMP saddle from my road bike, and have been riding the Nash every day. It has grown on me--Considering the 30 pounds of accessories I have mounted on it, no other frame is going to feel any better in any respect that I can think of. Keeper.

Good resale on the Brooks saddle--i paid $48, sold for $75 within hours of Craigslisting. Other prospective buyers turned away disappointed. And that's in small market-just this one island of Oahu.
..........................................................................................................................

I'm thinking seriously about getting rid of my Nash touring frame, size 54. It is essentially brand new (less than 300 miles, certainly).

I got it a few months ago on sale for $99, plus shipping brought it to $125 as I recall. I also have all the little stuff like GREEN Brooks springer saddle, Easton seatpost, brake cable hangers seatpost binder, etc.

Time to start on another project bike.

Send me a message if you're interested.


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

SOLD SOLD SOLD SOLD SOLD



GREEN Brooks B67 like new. Send me a message.









I'll throw in the special little wrench you need for adjusting


----------



## old_fuji

ClarkinHawaii said:


> I'm thinking seriously about getting rid of my Nash touring frame, size 54. It is essentially brand new (less than 300 miles, certainly).
> 
> I got it a few months ago on sale for $99, plus shipping brought it to $125 as I recall. I also have all the little stuff like GREEN Brooks springer saddle, Easton seatpost, brake cable hangers seatpost binder, etc.
> 
> Time to start on another project bike.
> 
> Send me a message if you're interested.


Any reason why you're getting rid of it?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

It's a horrible, rotten bike and i hate everything about it and only a fool would buy it.

Just kidding. It's (literally) perfect, but how much touring can I do on a small island? Plus it takes up space in a tiny high-rise apartment. Plus now that I've got it perfected, I want to move on to another challenge (can you say generic Chinese carbon).

Building/working on bikes has become my main hobby. I'm like a doctor with a patient in perfect health (the Nash). Time to get that one out the door and introduce a new source of interest.


----------



## JimT

ClarkinHawaii-Message sent, but I think it may be a little too big for me. My standover is about 27", If it works I would be interested in whatever you have that may come with it. 

Thanks 
Jim


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

JimT said:


> ClarkinHawaii-Message sent, but I think it may be a little too big for me. My standover is about 27", If it works I would be interested in whatever you have that may come with it.
> 
> Thanks
> Jim


Jim, there's just no way it would work for you--standover height is 31+ inches. Maybe folks with smaller sizes will post their standover heights so you can get some idea what to get.


----------



## Squidward

I'm glad to see that there's still interest in these frames. I used mine for commuting all last fall but haven't used it since because I've changed jobs and now work swing shift and cannot ride the distance (30 miles each way). I might give it to my nephew who has mentioned wanting to commute by bike to work but we are both out of shape and committing to this is a difficult decision for both of us (me giving him the bike and him actually riding it to work).


----------



## old_fuji

wut?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

Does anybody know the seat tube angle of this frame? Or did anybody keep the descriptive material from Nashbar?

This frame has me sitting further behind the bb than my road bike, and I prefer this position better. So in shopping for a frame like it, I should quote the ST angle, right?


----------



## hepcatbent

ClarkinHawaii said:


> Does anybody know the seat tube angle of this frame? Or did anybody keep the descriptive material from Nashbar?
> 
> This frame has me sitting further behind the bb than my road bike, and I prefer this position better. So in shopping for a frame like it, I should quote the ST angle, right?


It's 73*... I copied it from the Nashbar site and pasted it here:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showpost.php?p=2523177&postcount=88

Good luck!


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

hepcatbent said:


> It's 73*... I copied it from the Nashbar site and pasted it here:
> 
> http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showpost.php?p=2523177&postcount=88
> 
> Good luck!


Excellent, Thanks!


----------



## williaty

Does anyone know the standover height of a 56cm on something like 700x38 or 700x40 tires?


----------



## UnivegaRVR

Mine measures about 32 1/4" measured from the ground to the middle of the top tube with 40mm tires.


----------



## JimT

UnivegaRVR said:


> Mine measures about 32 1/4" measured from the ground to the middle of the top tube with 40mm tires.



So can I assume that a 50" standover is about 28"???

Also can I use the components off my 07 Madone SL (all ultegra/dura ace) on the nashbar frame?

Thanks in advance
Jim


----------



## hepcatbent

JimT said:


> So can I assume that a 50" standover is about 28"???
> 
> Also can I use the components off my 07 Madone SL (all ultegra/dura ace) on the nashbar frame?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> Jim


I don't know about the standover height on a 50 cm... mine is a 60cm... but to address your question about your components; your components from your Madone should _mostly _work probably with the exception of your road brakes. I don't know if they can be adapted or not... the frame is set up for V-brakes, but there have been a number of folks who have used cantis... but you have to supply cable hangers. That would also probably dictate a different set of brake levers if you can't use your roadie brake set. You'd have to check the headset size, as well as the stem and so forth... but the crankset (the BB is a 68mm on the Nashbar), axles, cassette, wheels and derailleurs should work. The front derailleur may be a little dicey because of the bottle cage braze-on location on the Nashbar frame... some front derailleurs don't work as well as others... a low mount, top swing works best. If yours is something else, you'll probably not want to use it. Of course the seat post compatibility is determined by the size of the seat tubes. 

One last thing, some of the folks here have reported that 700c wheels have some toe overlap on the small frames...


----------



## JimT

hepcatbent said:


> I don't know about the standover height on a 50 cm... mine is a 60cm... but to address your question about your components; your components from your Madone should _mostly _work probably with the exception of your road brakes. I don't know if they can be adapted or not... the frame is set up for V-brakes, but there have been a number of folks who have used cantis... but you have to supply cable hangers. That would also probably dictate a different set of brake levers if you can't use your roadie brake set. You'd have to check the headset size, as well as the stem and so forth... but the crankset (the BB is a 68mm on the Nashbar), axles, cassette, wheels and derailleurs should work. The front derailleur may be a little dicey because of the bottle cage braze-on location on the Nashbar frame... some front derailleurs don't work as well as others... a low mount, top swing works best. If yours is something else, you'll probably not want to use it. Of course the seat post compatibility is determined by the size of the seat tubes.
> 
> One last thing, some of the folks here have reported that 700c wheels have some toe overlap on the small frames...


Thanks for the info Hepcatbent, that really helps me see a little of what I am in for on this project. I starting to think to think this may rin a little more than the $500.00 budget I was hoping to use. Well that is if my 27" inseam can fit over a 50cm frame!!!

Jimt


----------



## JamesBond001

*stem angle and length?*

deleting post


----------



## hepcatbent

The Nashbar tourning frame is once again available from Nashbar on sale at $99, regularly $199 in two cm increments from 50cm to 60 cm.. The fork is now sold separately now on sale for $34 reguarly $69. It has been missing from their website for some time now... it's good to see that they're still offering it. It's an amazing value at $133 for a frame and fork.


----------



## mmorast

*Been waiting to say this...*

My frame and fork arrive Saturday and the build begins. Well the 1.0 version. 

Looking forward to be able to post some photos when along the way.

Monte


----------



## JimT

Congrats and good luck with it. My Version 1 was completed today. I just swapped most of the items from my old Madone. I just have to order silver fenders, lights, panniers, bottle cages and I am sure there will be more. My build came out to 22 lbs which I guess isn't too bad as a starting point. 

Edited to add: 
Well here it is, pretty naked right now and I will have to change wheels once I start carrying anything heavy but it is the newest addition to the stable....


----------



## hepcatbent

VERY nice, Jim! I presume that the cantis were NOT from your Madone?  How did the FD work out for you? At 22 lbs... I don't think you can complain much... frankly on a touring frame, the weight of the bike itself is probably the _least _of your concerns...


----------



## JimT

hepcatbent said:


> VERY nice, Jim! I presume that the cantis were NOT from your Madone?  How did the FD work out for you? At 22 lbs... I don't think you can complain much... frankly on a touring frame, the weight of the bike itself is probably the _least _of your concerns...


Thanks Hepcatbent, I had to put the clamp in between the bottle cage but it will work just fine. I am not so sure how I like those cantis, they will take some getting used to but right now I am really happy with the bike.


----------



## old_fuji

JimT said:


> Thanks Hepcatbent, I had to put the clamp in between the bottle cage but it will work just fine. I am not so sure how I like those cantis, they will take some getting used to but right now I am really happy with the bike.


Ha, I had to do that with my 105 FD.


----------



## shmig

I've been working on a Nashbar Touring frame for quite some time using parts from a 90's Specialized Allez I wrecked. It's also my first build, so I'm learning a lot the hard way. My biggest problem has been with the FD on a triple crank. I started with a Shimano 105, which seems to either hit the downtube or not stretch enough to shift to the top gear, depending on BB length.

I then picked up a Shimano Sora. The Sugino crank I'm using recommends a 113mm BB for a 45mm chainline, which matches the specs of the Sora FD, but still hits the downtube. I'm going to get a 118mm BB and see how that works out.

Is there a standard amount you should add to the BB length for oversized tubing or something? Any suggested BB lengths for this touring frame?


----------



## hepcatbent

shmig said:


> I've been working on a Nashbar Touring frame for quite some time using parts from a 90's Specialized Allez I wrecked. It's also my first build, so I'm learning a lot the hard way. My biggest problem has been with the FD on a triple crank. I started with a Shimano 105, which seems to either hit the downtube or not stretch enough to shift to the top gear, depending on BB length.
> 
> I then picked up a Shimano Sora. The Sugino crank I'm using recommends a 113mm BB for a 45mm chainline, which matches the specs of the Sora FD, but still hits the downtube. I'm going to get a 118mm BB and see how that works out.
> 
> Is there a standard amount you should add to the BB length for oversized tubing or something? Any suggested BB lengths for this touring frame?


The width of the bottom bracket spindle is dependent on the crankset. Each crankset has it's own set of specs for a 68mm bottom bracket housing. Shimano has a chart for all their specs for each of their cranksets depending on the BB width. You can check the Sugino specs on the Sheldon Brown website here.


----------



## shmig

Thank you for your help hepcatbent. I've checked Sheldon Brown's site. It lacks chainline info. Sugino's website says 113mm BBshould give more than 47.5 chainline: http://www.suginoltd.co.jp/english/product_crank_xd2_english.htm

And Shimano suggests a 45mm chainline for the FD: http://www.suginoltd.co.jp/english/product_crank_xd2_english.htm

Following these specs I should be fine with a 113mm BB, but the FD still hits the seat tube. My thoughts are these specs are for a 27.2mm seat tube, and that I should be treating the Nashbar Touring frame with a seat tube of 31.8 more like a MTB with a chainline closer to 50mm. I was hoping someone might have tackled all this before me and could suggest what length BB they used with x FD and y crank.


----------



## hepcatbent

I didn't worry about the chainline... I was more concerned about the crank clearance against the bottom bracket housing. I used all XT and a 113 spindle using the M-752 crank. I haven't measured my chainline. As a practical matter, using a MTB triple on a 9 speed cassette the chainline measurement just isn't that critical.


----------



## Spudzie

I finially got my nashbar touring bike finished an i love  it. It will be my main commutter.


----------



## hepcatbent

Nicely done!


----------



## hepcatbent

Here's what my build looks like in its current incarnation... after a bunch of accessory changeouts...

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4898663514/" title="P8166949 by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4099/4898663514_b572bf1658.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="P8166949" /></a>

There are more detail photos and the info on the build here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/sets/72157622376726238/


----------



## andleo

I picked up the new steel fork. its better than the aluminum one that came with the frame, double eyelets and no goober welds at the crown


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

After being caught in the rain at the top of a 3-mile hill, I decided I definitely needed better braking, so i put on a carbon Winwood Muddy fork and Avid BB7 disc brake in the front. Frankly the ride doesn't seem any gentler (with 35mm tires), but the braking is certainly more confident.

I believe Nashbar sells a carbon fork (their brand) with disc mounts for about half the price I paid for the Winwood,


----------



## Jesse D Smith

andleo said:


> I picked up the new steel fork. its better than the aluminum one that came with the frame, double eyelets and no goober welds at the crown


Can you measure the distance from the center of the dropouts to the bottom of the crown? One of the latest reviews of the fork said they had shortened it. This might be a deal killer for me since I run 32mm Schwalbe tires with fenders.


----------



## andleo

Jesse D Smith said:


> Can you measure the distance from the center of the dropouts to the bottom of the crown? One of the latest reviews of the fork said they had shortened it. This might be a deal killer for me since I run 32mm Schwalbe tires with fenders.


measured both the alu one was 37cm and the steel is 36cm
I moved all my parts to the nashbar cross frame but I plan on running 35mm tires I am pretty sure they will fit


----------



## Jesse D Smith

andleo said:


> measured both the alu one was 37cm and the steel is 36cm
> I moved all my parts to the nashbar cross frame but I plan on running 35mm tires I am pretty sure they will fit


Thanks. Gonna be damn close.


----------



## wetzk

1cm,, I have clearance with 37MM tires for the fender with the stock fork. Now wondering if I will be able to use the fork with fenders. Should know by next Tuesday when my order arrives. I'll have the wheel on it and start measuring. If not I'll have to see if it's worth shipping back or just gifting it away.



andleo said:


> measured both the alu one was 37cm and the steel is 36cm
> I moved all my parts to the nashbar cross frame but I plan on running 35mm tires I am pretty sure they will fit


----------



## wetzk

I installed the new fork today. No difference on the top, same amount of spacers. On the bottom, it fits after playing with it. I use 37MM Continental Contact tires and SKS 50MM fenders. I had to shorten the fender struts a small amount and cut a small area out of each side of the fender so it fits high enough to clear. The brakes mounted back in the same spot with no adjusting needed and the front rack needed minimal adjusting to make it work.
I ended up with 1/2 inch of clearance under the fender.
I'll stash the original fork in the attic in case I ever need a replacement.
So you can use up to a 37mm tire with fenders. Past that the gap is getting to tight.


----------



## Jesse D Smith

wetzk said:


> I installed the new fork today. No difference on the top, same amount of spacers. On the bottom, it fits after playing with it. I use 37MM Continental Contact tires and SKS 50MM fenders. I had to shorten the fender struts a small amount and cut a small area out of each side of the fender so it fits high enough to clear. The brakes mounted back in the same spot with no adjusting needed and the front rack needed minimal adjusting to make it work.
> I ended up with 1/2 inch of clearance under the fender.
> I'll stash the original fork in the attic in case I ever need a replacement.
> So you can use up to a 37mm tire with fenders. Past that the gap is getting to tight.


My fork came in today. No problem with 32 mm Marathon Supremes and Planet Bike Cascadia fenders.


----------



## bacoes

*I think mine's finally finished*

It took me a few months of playing around with different parts, but this seems to be it.

56cm frame/alloy fork
Green King HS
Salsa stem
Specialized compact drops
Cinelli cotton tape with shellac
Tektro RL520 V levers
Tektro v brakes
Suntour Command 6spd shifters, modified for pure friction
Orbea carbon seatpost/Arionne saddle
Raceface Cadence c-set 50/35
Campy Victory FD
XTR Rapidrise RD
Forte 9spd cassette (11-32)
Maddux F40 wheelset
Serfas Seca tires
<img src="https://a.imageshack.us/img340/3886/1005218m.jpg" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/><br/>By <a target="_new" href="https://profile.imageshack.us/user/bacoes">bacoes</a> at 2010-09-02
<img src="https://a.imageshack.us/img823/778/command.jpg" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/><br/>By <a target="_new" href="https://profile.imageshack.us/user/bacoes">bacoes</a> at 2010-09-02

<img src="https://a.imageshack.us/img823/1270/barf.jpg" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/><br/>By <a target="_new" href="https://profile.imageshack.us/user/bacoes">bacoes</a> at 2010-09-02

All together I have around $250 in it plus parts laying around. It's rapidly becoming my goto bike. The Command shifters are the final piece to the puzzle. I had an old set of barcons on, but I found these and went for it. The ergonomics aren't "perfect", but pretty close.


----------



## wetzk

Your fenders are 45mm aren't they? If so yes they would fit fine without any rework. The 50mm fenders required the same trick used with the real wide SKS fenders on some other bikes, cutting away the part that touches the forks. I removed about 1 3/4 mm of material from each side of the 50mm SKS fender and shaped it to fit the forks, So the steel fork is slightly narrower as well as being slightly shorter.




Jesse D Smith said:


> My fork came in today. No problem with 32 mm Marathon Supremes and Planet Bike Cascadia fenders.


----------



## wetzk

For those wondering why the steel fork.
My first Nashbike frame was destroyed in an accident so I picked up a new one during the final sellout and moved what I could over to it. I was not real happy with the alloy fork as I could see movement on rough roads. I know what happens to aluminum when it is flexed and suspected it might be a failure point. So when these popped up and dropped to $38 and on top of that 20% off I decided to try one.
The ride is harsher over rough patches of ground, the steel fork does not give as much as the alloy one did. But no harsher than my LHT so I'm happy. My original fork had cracks up near the weld but that may have been crash related. It and the replacement alloy fork should have been very stiff for a material subject to fatigue failure, I wonder if that's why they now sell the double butted frame minus the fork and sell a steel fork as an accessory?


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

Since I've replaced my stock aluminum fork with carbon, I should probably get rid of the stock fork. It's UNCUT, so you can size it to suit you. 

Currently has crown race from new FSA "The Pig" headset installed. Remainder of brand new "Pig" also available--still in the box.

Currently has new Tektra 720 cantilever brake installed, if you want that. 

Probably 200-500 actual miles on the fork, crown race, and brake. PM me if you want it.


----------



## SilentAssassin

Squidward said:


> Yeah, I'd rather be seen than anything else. As an added benefit, when my buddy saw the bike he remarked that it was the ugliest thing he's seen on two wheels. That's exactly what I wanted to hear since this should cause potential thieves to look the other way.


That's a good idea. I bought a cheap netted reflective vest myself on ebay. Should do the job.


----------



## andleo

take 2 
A month ago or so I picked up some nitto albatross bars and cork grips when I stopped by Rivendell bikes. School stated a month ago as well so I haven't had time to work on it much

I rode it around the block today and it rides great but I don't know if the brooks is the saddle for me


----------



## mpoertner

I love this thread, thanks to everyone who's contributed. I just got my Nashbar Touring Frame and I'm planning my build. I'm taking my time and looking for cheap deals and using some old parts I got lying around. I ordered the Nashbar Disc/V-Brake Road Fork and want to try disc brake up front. I'm a pretty big guy at 280lbs and with a loaded touring bike I'd like to get all the stopping power I can. Anyone see issues with using dics in front and v-brake in back?

I have some old 9 speed Shimano Ultegra road shifters I want to use. I understand I may be able to use a Tiagra front derailleur on the crank I picked out but if I use a MTB cassette do I need an MTB rear derailleur and will that work with the road shifters?


----------



## andleo

mpoertner said:


> I love this thread, thanks to everyone who's contributed. I just got my Nashbar Touring Frame and I'm planning my build. I'm taking my time and looking for cheap deals and using some old parts I got lying around. I ordered the Nashbar Disc/V-Brake Road Fork and want to try disc brake up front. I'm a pretty big guy at 280lbs and with a loaded touring bike I'd like to get all the stopping power I can. Anyone see issues with using dics in front and v-brake in back?
> 
> I have some old 9 speed Shimano Ultegra road shifters I want to use. I understand I may be able to use a Tiagra front derailleur on the crank I picked out but if I use a MTB cassette do I need an MTB rear derailleur and will that work with the road shifters?


I am using a mountain cassette with the touring frame and my nashbar cx frame. Both have deore rear derailleur, touring has barcons and cx has 9 speed sti's both work great.

as for brakes sti road levers require short pull brakes, v brakes are long pull so a travel agent will need to be used. Mini-v's are an option as well but they require the pads to be really close to the rim when used with sti levers. Discs would work well for touring but I find the biggest hassle with rim brakes is keeping the arms centered (they seem to change all the time on me).

I weigh ~300lbs myself and the v brakes on the touring frame that I just put together work very well. I had cantis on it before and regardless of setup the braking was poor from the hoods.


----------



## mpoertner

andleo said:


> I am using a mountain cassette with the touring frame and my nashbar cx frame. Both have deore rear derailleur, touring has barcons and cx has 9 speed sti's both work great.
> 
> as for brakes sti road levers require short pull brakes, v brakes are long pull so a travel agent will need to be used. Mini-v's are an option as well but they require the pads to be really close to the rim when used with sti levers. Discs would work well for touring but I find the biggest hassle with rim brakes is keeping the arms centered (they seem to change all the time on me).
> 
> I weigh ~300lbs myself and the v brakes on the touring frame that I just put together work very well. I had cantis on it before and regardless of setup the braking was poor from the hoods.


Thanks andleo. 

I don't understand the mechanics behind the shifters but it sounds like at least some people have gotten the mountain rear derailleurs to work with STI shifters its just the front derailleurs that don't?

I realize I'll have to do some tinkering with the short pull brake levers. I was more concerned with having too little braking power in back and flying over my handlebars with an abrupt stop. As far as I can tell there is no way to mount a rear disc brake caliper on this frame?


----------



## old_fuji

Anybody got a picture of their rear brake setup? Putting my bike together (finally...ugh), I feel like I'm missing a piece.


----------



## andleo

old_fuji said:


> Anybody got a picture of their rear brake setup? Putting my bike together (finally...ugh), I feel like I'm missing a piece.


if you are running cantis you need a hanger


----------



## hepcatbent

It's been fun!

After a year with the Nashbar frame, and getting it _exactly_ the way I want it, it will be going to my son in Portland to live in the bike culture there. I've found that apparently the disks in my upper back and neck don't like diamond frame bike riding any more. I get some pretty nasty pain and spasms after about an hour on the bike. This summer I got a deal on a Greenspeed GTO touring trike, and now have three Greenspeeds in the stable... I've already sold some of my two-wheeled fleet, and have just a couple more to go, but my son got to ride the Nashbar when we met this summer on the east coast (I took it along) and he really wants it. I'm pleased it'll be staying in the family.

You guys have a ball with your Nashbar frames!


----------



## old_fuji

andleo said:


> if you are running cantis you need a hanger


Yep, I tracked one down at the LBS, in their junk drawer. Turns out a guy on page 3 or 4 had the exact same hanger for the rear brake.

I'm nearly done with my build...gotta tighten down some loose ends, then she'll be road worthy!


----------



## old_fuji

Finally.

Whew.

The Nashbar Budget/Touring/Cyclocross/Commuter/Dirt-roadie/Good LBS Appreciation/Screw the bad LBS bike

105 groupset, Ritchey tires, C'dale stem, Bontrager RL saddle, USE suspension seatpost, some cool little Origin8 pedals, and old Shimano LX Canties. Oh yeah, and the stickers of the cool bike shops that have sold parts to me and helped me on my build.

Rides like a brick :thumbsup:


----------



## mpoertner

*Front Derailuer Positioning*

Hey there, 

Well, it's starting to look a bit like a bike!










Having a problem though. Same problem Squidward had towards the beginning of this thread. The front derailleur clamp wants to be right where the bottom bottle cage brazon is.










I'm using a FSA 28-38-48T Mtb Crankset with a Shimano 105 front derailleur. I'd like to avoid grinding down the brazon - Does anyone know of a better component combination to use to avoid this and still let me use my Ultegra brifters?

Any input would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

mpoertner said:


> Hey there,
> 
> Well, it's starting to look a bit like a bike!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Having a problem though. Same problem Squidward had towards the beginning of this thread. The front derailleur clamp wants to be right where the bottom bottle cage brazon is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm using a FSA 28-38-48T Mtb Crankset with a Shimano 105 front derailleur. I'd like to avoid grinding down the brazon - Does anyone know of a better component combination to use to avoid this and still let me use my Ultegra brifters?
> 
> Any input would be greatly appreciated!


I used one of this style:









allows you to install clamp on frame missing obstructions and then finegle FD up and dopwn in that groove. I found a cheap one on ebay. Requires a braze-on FD.

Also, for the rear canti brake cable hanger, the Surly one that looks like a giant safety pin turned out to be the least bad of the available choices--but they all suck.


----------



## old_fuji

Can you install a bottle cage over top of the derailleur?


----------



## mpoertner

ClarkinHawaii said:


> I used one of this style:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> allows you to install clamp on frame missing obstructions and then finegle FD up and dopwn in that groove. I found a cheap one on ebay. Requires a braze-on FD.
> 
> Also, for the rear canti brake cable hanger, the Surly one that looks like a giant safety pin turned out to be the least bad of the available choices--but they all suck.


Oh, now I like that! Might let me do what I want without having to maim the frame in case I want to change components later. Thanks!


----------



## UnivegaRVR

I had the same problem what you need is a top swing derailleur (more common on mountain bikes) this kind of derailleur will place the clamp below the braze on while still being able to clear the chain rings. Page #3 post #13 has pictures of a top swing derailleur on this frame. However I was unwilling to buy a new derailleur instead of grinding down the brazeon a just placed a bit of old inner tube around it and mounted the clamp as normal. That has worked for me for some time.


----------



## mpoertner

UnivegaRVR said:


> I had the same problem what you need is a top swing derailleur (more common on mountain bikes) this kind of derailleur will place the clamp below the braze on while still being able to clear the chain rings. Page #3 post #13 has pictures of a top swing derailleur on this frame. However I was unwilling to buy a new derailleur instead of grinding down the brazeon a just placed a bit of old inner tube around it and mounted the clamp as normal. That has worked for me for some time.


Will a top swing derailleur work with STI shifters? I might try the old inner tube trick except I don't think the clamp will catch if the diameter is any wider.


----------



## andleo

I just filled down the bottle boss and used a zip tie to hold the cage


----------



## ClarkinHawaii

old_fuji said:


> Can you install a bottle cage over top of the derailleur?


The Topeak bottle cages I use have plenty of clearance to fit over the FD clamp; but to be sure, you would need to see how the back of your bottle cage is shaped. You need something like this, perhaps:


----------



## mpoertner

I ended up filing a groove into the derailleur clamp. That let me mount the derailleur over the brazon without hacking the frame. So I'm thinking I should be able to use a zip tie to secure the bottom of the bottle cage like previously mentioned.

Thanks Everyone!


----------



## thorpej

Squidward said:


> I ran into a few problems with this bike: it was mentioned that there isn't a rear brake cable stop for use with cantilever brakes and I wanted to use a set of old Deore XT cantilevers I had laying around. I ended up machining one out of a piece of scrap aluminum that I had that attaches to the seat post clamp.
> 
> The Tiagra front derailleur that I used, combined with a compact double crankset, means that the front derailleur clamp wants to be right where they put the lower seat tube water bottle boss. I had to grind down the boss to get the front derailleur to sit where it needs to be. I then had to jerry rig the water bottle cage to work with this configuration. Here is a picture of what I mean before I ground down that mount. I'll post more pictures tomorrow.


I just built up one of these frames (2010 model) for a Christmas gift for my wife. Overall, I'm very happy with the quality / fit / finish of this frame. I ordered a size 50.

The rear cable stop was easy -- seat clamp-mounted stop. Nashbar even sells 'em.

The front derailleur problem was slightly more annoying, but was solvable... I picked up a Shimano braze-on->clamp adapter and scavenged the FD-5600 from my '85 C'dale SR500. The clamp sits directly above the bottom bottle boss and leaves a nice 2mm clearance for the compact double on the bike. No vertical play like you'd normally have with a braze-on FD, but the geometry of the clamp adapter is just good enough to make it work. Now I have an excuse to put an Ultegra front derailleur on the C'dale to match the RD-6600 on the rear 

All in all, I think this is a pretty sweet bike, and a great deal. I picked up the frame for $99, plus $149 for a Ritchey carbon CX fork. No problems with the build at all, other than the derailleur issue, which was easily solved.


----------



## iqcraig

I built up a Nashbar frame this spring as my commuter, but I also do some touring with it in the summer and some winter group rides. I live in Chicago and commute 20 miles (there and back) each day. I would estimate I have around 3500-4000 miles on this bike and I love it. This frame is an unbelievable value. Go get one!

Size 56 frame (Rider size 5'11", 165 lbs)
Nashbar Aluminum Touring Fork
Cane Creek S3 headset
Velocity Dyad 36h laced to 105 Rear Hub and Tiagra Front hub
Michelin City 32mm summer tires (not pictured)
Nokian Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm
Nashbar Canti Brakes
Tektro R200A Levers
Dura Ace 10 speed barcons
Dura Ace FD
105 RD
FSA Gossamer 36/46, 172.5 
Salsa Bell Lap Bars
Tubus Ergo front rack
Generic rear rack (salvaged from beater bike)
Planet Bike Fenders
Brooks B17 Standard
Lots of lights (main lights are Niterider Mininewt 250 cordless in front and Cherrybomb rear)
Arkel T-28 Bags (not pictured)

Build notes:

The FD was a direct hit on the lower bottle braze-on. I filed it down and used a zip tie to hold the top of the bottle cage. Bottle brazes on the downtube were not centered on the tube, but i just mounted the cage and bent it inward so the bottle isnt off to one side. Not a big deal considering the extreme low cost of this frameset. Lower stem with light bar was drilled and tapped for use as the cable stop for the front canti brakes. 

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/gm0_qit8RZ11N-IDVoHH-w-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh6.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0jjLlQfpI/AAAAAAAAEDg/rFzOVvwkmA0/s800/IMG_2616.jpg" height="533" width="800" /></a>

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/5KZxKcG7-LtilNb9Ju9pSw-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh4.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0jll74lzI/AAAAAAAAEC4/KmQy3A_RN4s/s800/IMG_2617.jpg" height="533" width="800" /></a>

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/XZ2pFZK1Nm0t4KA2GMfPWA-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh3.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0johgT1wI/AAAAAAAAEC8/E91zOMPJ6a0/s800/IMG_2618.jpg" height="800" width="533" /></a>

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/RD5V0zdI8EnpQeozlQWlRQ-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh5.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0jrQrG6XI/AAAAAAAAEDA/PgeIlX75fYs/s800/IMG_2619.jpg" height="800" width="533" /></a>

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/XToLctMqkwCshpZ2QE0ooA-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh6.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0jtle-lQI/AAAAAAAAEDE/pEj1NWGWCkA/s800/IMG_2620.jpg" height="533" width="800" /></a>

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/f3nfj-lE7-dXQZVVgJpjqw-EgjT3jK1jtRYF-6MLDsI?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh6.ggpht.com/_BgrF7ftC3zc/TR0jvmgy83I/AAAAAAAAEDM/qX3bKscEH_s/s800/IMG_2621.jpg" height="533" width="800" /></a>


----------



## JesseTate91

I hate to pull up an old thread, but what size BB are you guys using 113, or 118?
Specifically those of you with sugino triple cranks.


----------



## old_fuji

JesseTate91 said:


> I hate to pull up an old thread, but what size BB are you guys using 113, or 118?
> Specifically those of you with sugino triple cranks.


I've got a 113...but I'm running a Shimano 105 double. However, with how close my small chainring is to the chainstay, I'd err on the side of caution and go with a wider BB.


----------



## JesseTate91

Thanks a lot! That's what I gathered from the little amounts of information I could find. I just wish shimano had something in between 113 and 118.


----------



## JesseTate91

Shimano does make a 115mm BB! There just wasn't one in stock at the vendor where I was looking. So would 115 be what you guys recommend? I have a sugino XD600, and a deore 11-34 cassette.


----------



## Cyclist69

Wow! There are some cool touring rigs in this thread and you guy's have some awesome ideas.


----------



## sindlero

*Hello and a question*



undies said:


> About two years ago I built up an errand/touring-style bike using a Nashbar touring frame. Overall I was pleased with the frame and found it quite serviceable through ~2000 miles, but I also learned that the 58cm frame was probably one size too small for me and I wanted to upgrade to a new bike at some point.
> 
> My plan was to buy a Surly LHT frame in an appropriate size and build it up using some parts from my old Nashbar plus a few new parts. But then one fateful day last summer I visited Nashbar.com when they happened to have their touring frames on sale for just $140. Furthermore, they had a 20% off coupon active at the same time, giving a final cost of just $112. This was too good a deal to pass up so I ordered another one in the 61cm size.
> 
> Over the next few months I proceeded to buy parts I wanted when I found them on sale, on ebay, or in the take-off bin at the LBS. Besides the frame, other key deals I found were the Deore LX 48-38-28 crank for $44, Dura-Ace bar ends for $50, and Radius cantis for $30. I added up the total cost of all the parts on this bike (minus the rack, fenders, computer, and light) and arrived at a total build cost of $905. Subtract from this the value of parts from my own spares bin or take-offs from my old bike (most notably the wheels, saddle, and pedals) and I spent $497 on new parts. I probably also spent another $100-125 on various shipping charges. My time is worthless so I won't put a dollar value on my labor
> 
> One of the things I wasn't real happy with on my old bike was the cockpit which was built around 105 STI levers and an Easton EA30 bar. My son has a Centurion Super LeMans and I really liked its bar-ends and Randonneur bar, so I bought Dura-Ace bar-end shifters, a 45cm Nitto Randonneur bar, and Cane Creek SCR-5 levers. I only have a few miles on it but so far I absolutely love this bar. Combined with a high-rise stem (LBS take-off) every bar position feels a lot more comfortable, especially the flared drops. I used to ride mostly on the hoods but I think I will spend a lot more time on the drops now.
> 
> A more dubious choice was the Radius cantilever brakes. The LBS was blowing them out for $30 and I thought they looked cool so I took a chance. I found that they were very hard to adjust, and even with salmon Kool Stop pads they are only a slight functional improvement over the low-end Tektros I had previously. I know there are better cantis out there but I think I am close to giving up and just getting some wide-reach caliper brakes.
> 
> As for the Nashbar frame itself, it definitely seems to fit me better. The new frame has the same pluses (nice paint, good geometry, plenty of braze-ons, amazing price) and minuses (no canti cable hangers, no pump peg, ugly welds) as my old frame. My next job will be to build up my old frame for my 15 y.o. son, for whom the 58cm size would be perfect right now.
> 
> How does my project stack up against a ready-to-ride bike from an LBS? A good comparison is the $1200 Cannondale T800, which is another aluminum-framed touring bike. Compared to the T800 my Nashbar specs out considerably higher, esp. considering my LX-level drivetrain and hand-built wheels. However I had the benefit of lessons learned from my first time around, and there truly is value in having a bike set up by a pro. The build-your-own route is not economically sensible IMO. Most people would be better off taking $1000 to the local LBS and buying a ready-to-ride Surly LHT or Jamis Aurora.


Beautiful job on your build-up---of course, I'm a Philadelphia Eagles fan, so I like green.
You mentioned that the 58 cm was a bit small for you. I'm 6' and am wondering about my frame size. I just went through the zinncycles road fit calculator and am still scratching my head. I'm thinking of getting a fitting at a bike shop, but wonder if these measurements would translate into a bike build-up. I'd appreciate your feedback. I'm just getting back into riding after a many year layoff. Thanks. Owen


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## abdacadabra

Just about to finish my nashbar touring... will post pics when it's done.

I had a question for people who had built it up in the past. On my frame, the down tube shifter bosses were not attached at all - they basically just fell out easily, and were at the least certainly not welded in place. I called Nashbar and they told me to loctite them in place. I'm looking at the bosses though, and they appear to be threaded on the inside on the side that goes into the frame. Is it possible to basically put a threaded rod through the frame and have them tighten eachother to the frame? Or did everyone use some glue? Thanks for any tips.


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## wetzk

I screwed a set of Cable Housing Stop Adapters into mine and never touched them again other than for a minor adjustment once. I guess you could loctite them, but unless you are using them to mount the actual shifters they should be fine.



abdacadabra said:


> Just about to finish my nashbar touring... will post pics when it's done.
> 
> I had a question for people who had built it up in the past. On my frame, the down tube shifter bosses were not attached at all - they basically just fell out easily, and were at the least certainly not welded in place. I called Nashbar and they told me to loctite them in place. I'm looking at the bosses though, and they appear to be threaded on the inside on the side that goes into the frame. Is it possible to basically put a threaded rod through the frame and have them tighten eachother to the frame? Or did everyone use some glue? Thanks for any tips.


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## abdacadabra

wetzk said:


> I screwed a set of Cable Housing Stop Adapters into mine and never touched them again other than for a minor adjustment once. I guess you could loctite them, but unless you are using them to mount the actual shifters they should be fine.


Well, the issue is that they aren't attached to the frame at all - so without either loctite or some other way of keeping the bosses in place, the down tube cable stop adapters just fall right out... I am going to try using a threaded rod, because it seems like it was meant to be that way.


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## wetzk

There should have been a piece of threadstock inside the frame that the 2 bosses screw into. Then you screw the cable stop adapters into the bosses. Turn your frame over and see if you hear a rattle as you are missing a part..


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## abdacadabra

wetzk said:


> There should have been a piece of threadstock inside the frame that the 2 bosses screw into. Then you screw the cable stop adapters into the bosses. Turn your frame over and see if you hear a rattle as you are missing a part..


Must be missing it... dang, wonder where that could have gone. Can you post a photo of what it looked like? Better yet, can you tell me where I could find one (can I just get a threaded rod from the hardware store)?


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## steveeboy

ooops, put this in the wrong thread... here goes:

alright, had a wreck on my 1987 st-400 cannondale which was set up as a commuter--kids, make sure those fenders aren't too close to your front tire or you will suffer a rather disastrous ejection sooner or later. mine resulted in a dislocated sternoclavicular joint AND WEAR A HELMET!

Anyways, hard to find a fork for the 'dale since it is a 63cm with a massive head tube and it needs a 27" fork with 9.75" of steerer tube and that's pretty tough these days.

So, I decided to order up one of these nashbar touring framesets and rebuild my commuter with some minor tweaks--bigger tires, more fender clearance, porteur style front rack, better lights.

frame arrived today and unfortunately I will need to send it back.

I ride a 58.5cm top tube and a typically a 60cm seat tube frame--or a bit larger in the case of the wrecked 'dale.

I ordered the 58cm nashbar frame since it had a 59cm top tube. The info available made it seem like this would be right in line with my st-400 top tube as well as the top tube on my r3000si racing bike.

well, that thing came today and while it was longer in the top tube it was shorter in the seat tube than expected.

With 700x28mm Paselas I am guess the standover was only 32-32.5 or so. Way shorter than the 60cm 'dale racing bike I have or the 63cm st-400.

Now, the top tube is certainly longer, but I am gonna return for a 60cm and just run a shorter stem on it and maybe push the seat forward a tad. I am going to run a riser bar or a touring/commuter swept back riser bar so this should help too...

I have been looking at pics of this bike all over the web and from what I see lots of people are riding them very small, so much seat post showing and like 10 spacers on the stem.

Maybe it's just me, but that don't seem right.

I am guessing that the Surly LHT has the long head tube to make up for this???

In any case, I hope the 60cm works out. The deal here is too good to pass up. The frame seemed very nice, felt pretty light, and I think it will build up real nice.

To sum up:
I am like 6' 1.5"
I have a 33 inch inseam or so...
I always ride a 58.5cm top tube with a 60-63cm seat tube with very little seat post showing...

Despite the top tube being slightly longer on the nashbar, the 58cm model seemed a bit short and thus the advice to size down one size wasn't right for me...

Building up this frame would have meant a very short frame with lots of seat post showing and a handlebar up on a ton of spacers (which I don't like aesthetically or otherwise)


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## ryguy135

What has everyone been using as a downtube cable stop? I just got one of these frames to use as my training bike (I'm a Cat 1 XC mtb racer and my trusty 1973 Motobecane that has been doing this job is shot). I've found the shimano STI downtube cable stops but don't know if I need the flat, concave, or convex models. 

universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=16733]Universal Cycles -- Shimano STI Downtube Cable Stop and Adjuster

FWIW, I'm doing a SRAM Rival build with a set of Ultegra/Mavic A719's for Kansas's abundance of gravel roads and a set of Bontragers RL wheels for the trainer/occasional road. Going with Mini-V's because I hate canti's. Found a local guy that's selling me the full Rival drivetrain, both sets of wheels, stem, bar, seatpost, literally everything for $450. SCORE!


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## steveeboy

if you search you will find that most people recommend flat for bigger tube ALU bikes and concave for steel. I just looked at mine and took one off and it is most definitely FLAT. But I think maybe concave would work too since there is room between the shifter boss and the down tube? But FLAT works for sure, that is what I am running right now. 

Also, see if you can scrounge these parts from your LBS or another rider. Since most bikes have brazed on stops now, the bolt on ones are cheaper in shops and more easily found used. All of a sudden they are just laying around a lot of places and paying full price plus shipping from internets doesn't make sense. There are several used sets on ebay right now...

--and if you can, get the ones with the lever for the rear adjustment. You don't need it much but it is handy if your derailleur is a bit out of whack. With that lever you can just adjust it a notch or two until you can actually adjust the derailleur at home when not on a ride (but at 35$ new vs 16$ for the non lever version it ain't worth it to pay for it if new.)

best of luck with the frame, I have been using mine as a commuter/cargo bike for @ 1 year now and I really like it...


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## old_fuji

steveeboy said:


> if you search you will find that most people recommend flat for bigger tube ALU bikes and concave for steel. I just looked at mine and took one off and it is most definitely FLAT. But I think concave would work too since there is room between the shifter boss and the down tube.
> 
> Also, see if you can scrounge these parts from LBS or another rider. Since most bikes have brazed on stops now, the bolt on ones are cheaper in shops and more easily found used...
> 
> best of luck with the frame, I have been using mine as a commuter/cargo bike for @ 1 year now and I really like it...


Yep, mine are concave. I bought some 105 cable stops online for some obscene price, $20 or something, then went to the shop and scored some fo' free.


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## ryguy135

Sweet thanks for the help guys. I can take my mountain bike apart, bleed the brakes and rebuild the fork no problem, but some of this roadie stuff (brake cables!?! what are those!?!?) is new to me!


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## ryguy135

steveeboy said:


> --and if you can, get the ones with the lever for the rear adjustment. You don't need it much but it is handy if your derailleur is a bit out of whack. With that lever you can just adjust it a notch or two until you can actually adjust the derailleur at home when not on a ride (but at 35$ new vs 16$ for the non lever version it ain't worth it to pay for it if new.)
> it...


Checked my LBS, they didn't have any, so I'll be ordering them. What's the difference between the one's on the Universal site that have the lever vs the barrell nut? Never seen the lever design before. Thanks!


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