# Switching to a longer stem



## supraholic (Oct 10, 2010)

Does a 20 mm increase in stem lenght seems drastic? I recently lost more weight and would like a more aero position on the handle bars and drops plus my knees hits the handle bars while on the hoods sprinting or while my hands are on top neer the center.

I would appreciate anyones advice.

Thanks to all!


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## Kuma601 (Jan 22, 2004)

It can be but if it is comfortable for you then the change is fine.


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## supraholic (Oct 10, 2010)

Kuma601 said:


> It can be but if it is comfortable for you then the change is fine.


If I can get in a more aero position and have less drag...maybe beign more efficient will equal to less energy spent thus I guess making if more comfortable?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

supraholic said:


> Does a 20 mm increase in stem lenght seems drastic? I recently lost more weight and would like a more aero position on the handle bars and drops plus my knees hits the handle bars while on the hoods sprinting or while my hands are on top neer the center.
> I would appreciate anyones advice.


That increase doesn't seem drastic to me. Last season I went from 100mm to 140 on the suggestion of my Physiotherapist. While I was waiting for the stems to arrive (for two bikes; mailorder) and as a trial beforehand, she had me doing a drill to get ready for the increase. This is what I did for about three weeks -


Rotated my pelvis forward to give a flatter back (it felt like I was hyperextending it).
Bend my elbows (forearms level with ground as much as possible).
Move my grip forward on the hoods when cruising. I went from one finger in front of the hood to three.

When the stems arrived I installed them and felt no difference in position as I'd been moving my hands forward slowly over the weeks. In fact, I got so used to riding with a couple of fingers past the levers, I *still* did it after I installed the stems. Now if I grip the hoods with all 4 fingers it feels weird and I usually only do it when out of the saddle.

Some people might say "If you can use a 140mm stem then your frame's TT is too short". That's not the case as it's a 55.5cm TT for my 5' 8" body. I was more upright before and now I'm much lower and aero.

But your comment "my knees hits the handle bars while on the hoods sprinting or while my hands are on top near the center" has me concerned. I would wonder if your frame isn't much too small for you and a longer stem isn't the proper fix for this.


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## supraholic (Oct 10, 2010)

Mike T. said:


> That increase doesn't seem drastic to me. Last season I went from 100mm to 140 on the suggestion of my Physiotherapist. While I was waiting for the stems to arrive (for two bikes; mailorder) and as a trial beforehand, she had me doing a drill to get ready for the increase. This is what I did for about three weeks -
> 
> 
> Rotated my pelvis forward to give a flatter back (it felt like I was hyperextending it).
> ...


I'm 5'5" and when my knees hit the top bar when I'm leaning forward. This might be a positioning issue but regardless, the stem might need to be longer. 

Thank you for the pre-swap conditioning pointers!


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

I have 140 stems on my bikes. I'm tall, but have shortish legs & a long torso. I need the length even with a 59 - 60 top tube.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Well, I'm going to be the naysayer, kind of.

20mm is quite a lot when it's stem extension being changed.

Doesn't mean it's too much, necessarily. But it's a lot. If I were considering it, I'd buy a stem from my local used shop, or an inexpensive one from my LBS. Since I'm a cheapskate, I'd keep it, but one could also replace it with something more expensive.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Well, I'm going to be the naysayer, kind of.
> 20mm is quite a lot when it's stem extension being changed.
> Doesn't mean it's too much, necessarily. But it's a lot.


Try this - look at a ruler and look at 2cm. That's 3/4". Now go ride and move the hands 2cm forward on the brake hoods. All that changed was the angle of your upper arm to forearm. Ride like this for 5 minutes. It will feel no different than you were 5 minutes before.


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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

Adding 20mm would feel drastic to me. And if I was hitting my knees on my handle bars I'd need something drastic.


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## Trouble (Apr 3, 2004)

2 cm is a lot. It will stretch you out more, changing the angle of your arm/torso and possibly the handling of your bike.


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## Special Eyes (Feb 2, 2011)

I just bought a 130, moving from a 110. I'm 6' and long armed. I like stretching out. If it doesn't feel right after a few rides ,I'll switch back. No risk, no gain.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

I agree that a change of 2cm longer or shorter will feel very significant.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

I've been going to a bike salvage store buying different length stems to experiment with them. 

I just put the factory stem back on (The longest of three) after trying two different lengths. 

After multiple surgeries on my abdomen years ago I have little core strength. After rediscovering cycling last June ('10) I started properly fitting myself to my bikes via info from this website, Peter White Cycling, Competitive Cyclist, etc. At first I thought that my factory stem was way too short so I bought a longer one. Through trial and error I'm finding that a more up-right sitting position is more comfortable than a more aerodynamic position. 


My point is; I experimented with different length stems and actually rode to get a feel how each one felt. Just like I'm doing with crank arm lengths; There's textbook knowledge and then there's experience. I've researched/read a ton and now I'm experiencing/experimenting.


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## Pieter (Oct 17, 2005)

I tried a 100mm stem, down from 120. The handling was affected (felt sharper) and I felt noticeably less stretched. 

Eventually I settled back for the longer stem, which was less of a compromise for open road riding. It just felt more comfortable, less 'constricting'.

I would consider the change to be quite noticeable if not radical. But strictly speaking both stems 'fiited' me all right.


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## SlowMover (Jun 6, 2010)

supraholic said:


> Does a 20 mm increase in stem lenght seems drastic? I recently lost more weight and would like a more aero position on the handle bars and drops plus my knees hits the handle bars while on the hoods sprinting or while my hands are on top neer the center.
> 
> I would appreciate anyones advice.
> 
> Thanks to all!


I believe this can be dependent on your particular morphology, but adding drop is not the only way to get more aero. Stretching out is equally effective in getting lower and my frontal profile is so close to that of my P3 time trial position it's scary. Now then it's not nearly as comfortable and I wouldn't want to hang out there for an hour, but can do so easily for 15 minutes stretches.


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Regardless of how the new stem "feels", you get the right stem length for your body, not for the handling of the bike. Unless the stem falls_ well _outside the normal 90-130 range, your handling is not going to so strange that you won't be able to comfortably ride the bike.

If you're riding on a bike with the stem too long or too short it is little different from wearing shoes that are too big or too small. Get the right size and adjust to it.


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## Trouble (Apr 3, 2004)

I can use either a 120 or 110, prefer the 120 for more stable handling (bike was built with 120 design) and a more stretched out feel, more engagement of the glutes/hammies.
Shorter stem puts me up more and allows more drop. I agree with Pieter, feels ??? quicker, twitchier, I do not like it coming down hills with any buffeting winds.

I do not agree with Mike T. That is not the same as a 2 cm longer stem, especially from a handling perspective. I can feel the difference between a 110 and 120, I just cannot ride a 130, 
I do not agree with rx-79g. Your handling will be effected, maybe not your comfort so much. 

CDA455 is doing it the right way, experiment.


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Trouble said:


> I can use either a 120 or 110, prefer the 120 for more stable handling (bike was built with 120 design) and a more stretched out feel, more engagement of the glutes/hammies.
> Shorter stem puts me up more and allows more drop. I agree with Pieter, feels ??? quicker, twitchier, I do not like it coming down hills with any buffeting winds.
> 
> I do not agree with Mike T. That is not the same as a 2 cm longer stem, especially from a handling perspective. I can feel the difference between a 110 and 120, I just cannot ride a 130,
> ...


I didn't say it wouldn't be effected. I said the effect is not going to produce problematic handling. In other words, the effect is unimportant, and shouldn't effect one's decision to fit the bike correctly.


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## Trouble (Apr 3, 2004)

rx-79g said:


> I didn't say it wouldn't be effected. I said the effect is not going to produce problematic handling. In other words, the effect is unimportant, and shouldn't effect one's decision to fit the bike correctly.


Semantics, it's the same thing and I think you know that, if not...


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Trouble said:


> Semantics, it's the same thing and I think you know that, if not...


The semantic argument is yours, not mine. If you're disagreeing with me, then you believe that the handling could be greatly and negatively affected by changing a few centimeters in the normal range. 

Do you?


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

The way the bike handles will not be affected in any meaningful way whether you lengthen or shorten the stem. This is because bikes don't steer by turning the handlebars, they steer by leaning over. If you're going 10 mph or faster and want to change direction you push forward on the bars in the direction you want to go. Push right to go right, push left to go left. If you watch a cyclist turn you'll notice that the bars hardly turn at all. This is true whether you have an 80mm stem or a 180mm stem.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Mr. Versatile said:


> The way the bike handles will not be affected in any meaningful way whether you lengthen or shorten the stem. This is because bikes don't steer by turning the handlebars, they steer by leaning over. If you're going 10 mph or faster and want to change direction you push forward on the bars in the direction you want to go. Push right to go right, push left to go left. If you watch a cyclist turn you'll notice that the bars hardly turn at all. This is true whether you have an 80mm stem or a 180mm stem.


I went from an upturned 100mm stem to a level 140mm one and didn't feel any difference in handling not did I expect any. As you say, we steer, at normal riding speeds by leaning. Heck we can steer even without hands on handlebars and I doubt that the bike can tell whether its bars are dangling off the front of a 100mm stem or one 2 - 4cm longer. Heck my *thumb* is over 2cm wide!


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Mr. Versatile said:


> The way the bike handles will not be affected in any meaningful way whether you lengthen or shorten the stem. This is because bikes don't steer by turning the handlebars, they steer by leaning over. If you're going 10 mph or faster and want to change direction you push forward on the bars in the direction you want to go. Push right to go right, push left to go left. If you watch a cyclist turn you'll notice that the bars hardly turn at all. This is true whether you have an 80mm stem or a 180mm stem.


This argument is at best inaccurate, and not useful. If you were correct it wouldn't matter what the HTA, rake or anything else was, either.

Bicycles begin turns with a countersteer into a lean, and maintain and adjust that turn with more steering inputs. The stem is a lever arm that helps determine the resistance to turning the bar off center, just as head tube angle does. 

If the stem gets too short, the handling definitely gets strange, for instance.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

rx-79g said:


> If the stem gets too short, the handling definitely gets strange, for instance.


No it doesn't. Not for me anyway. I can move my hands > 20cm forward and backward between being in the rearmost position on the tops and forward on hoods without upsetting handling. I can ride fine putting both hands overlapping the center of the bar or all they way out on the ends of the drops. I can ride with one hand anywhere on the stem or bars. I can steer fine pushing anywhere on the bars with just my finger tips.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

looigi said:


> No it doesn't. Not for me anyway. I can move my hands > 20cm forward and backward between being in the rearmost position on the tops and forward on hoods without upsetting handling. I can ride fine putting both hands overlapping the center of the bar or all they way out on the ends of the drops. I can ride with one hand anywhere on the stem or bars. I can steer fine pushing anywhere on the bars with just my finger tips.


Last night I was riding the rollers and thinking of this thread. I've posted here 2x that last year I went from a 100mm stem to a 130. So last night I went from my hands sticking out front of the hoods as far as I could get them and still be able to hold onto the hoods (tip of the hood stuck into the heel of my hand) to holding onto the bars right next to the stem with just fingertips. All that changed was the angle of my upper arm to my forearm. My nose didn't rise, my back angle didn't change. That's a 8-1/2" difference in hand position; light years more than the 2cm some people are arguing over. Even though riding rollers is about as precise as you're ever going to need to steer (even more than the 50 degree velodrome I ride) my handling didn't change one iota. If it did, my reflexes are more than capable of accommodating the change without skies falling. And I can't think of anywhere where handling input would make more of a difference than on rollers if it was ever going to happen.


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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

rx-79g said:


> This argument is at best inaccurate, and not useful. If you were correct it wouldn't matter what the HTA, rake or anything else was, either.
> 
> Bicycles begin turns with a countersteer into a lean, and maintain and adjust that turn with more steering inputs. The stem is a lever arm that helps determine the resistance to turning the bar off center, just as head tube angle does.
> 
> If the stem gets too short, the handling definitely gets strange, for instance.


I agree but I think it's due to weight distribution not how the stem acts as a lever.

I definitely notice the difference between my regular riding postion and moving my hands towards my body (thus straigtening my back and putting less weight on the front). It's just a little more twitchy. I'm talking way more than 20mm here but just to say I notice a change in stearing behavior moving back & forth.


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Hank Stamper said:


> I agree but I think it's due to weight distribution not how the stem acts as a lever.
> 
> I definitely notice the difference between my regular riding postion and moving my hands towards my body (thus straigtening my back and putting less weight on the front). It's just a little more twitchy. I'm talking way more than 20mm here but just to say I notice a change in stearing behavior moving back & forth.


It could certainly be both. Steering angles use weight to resist moving off centerline. Decreasing the weight on the front is the same as making the steering angle steeper.

Stem's are levers - they can't help having a say in the amount of force necessary to turn the bar. But that doesn't mean that the change in force is important.

They also play a role in the geometry of steering, like the short or reversed stem problem. But that's a different issue, really.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

rx-79g said:


> This argument is at best inaccurate, and not useful. If you were correct it wouldn't matter what the HTA, rake or anything else was, either.
> 
> Bicycles begin turns with a countersteer into a lean, and maintain and adjust that turn with more steering inputs. The stem is a lever arm that helps determine the resistance to turning the bar off center, just as head tube angle does.
> 
> If the stem gets too short, the handling definitely gets strange, for instance.


:hand: Not quite true, Grasshopper. The stem may be a lever, but it hardly moves at all when riding at speeds above 8-10 mph. The HTA, fork rake, wheel base can make a significant difference in the way the bike reacts to pressure on the stem. If you're going 20 mph & encounter a 90* or greater turn the stem won't move more than a few millimeters. The rest of the frame geometry takes over from there. If you could fuse the headset on a bike so the stem & bars wouldnt move at all, you could still make it turn. 

I'm sticking by my original statement: The length of the stem doesn't affect bike handling in any meaningful way.


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## carbonconvert (Apr 12, 2009)

*Stem Length*

You will get endless opinions on this subject. Find your most comfortable position stretched 
out and go with the longer stem w/short reach bars. You will get the most stiffness in the 
front end this way as opposed to short stem-long reach bar. 20mm is not a significant length
if you size the bar/stem combo this way.


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Mr. Versatile said:


> :hand: Not quite true, Grasshopper. The stem may be a lever, but it hardly moves at all when riding at speeds above 8-10 mph. The HTA, fork rake, wheel base can make a significant difference in the way the bike reacts to pressure on the stem. If you're going 20 mph & encounter a 90* or greater turn the stem won't move more than a few millimeters. The rest of the frame geometry takes over from there. If you could fuse the headset on a bike so the stem & bars wouldnt move at all, you could still make it turn.
> 
> I'm sticking by my original statement: The length of the stem doesn't affect bike handling in any meaningful way.


I'll give you $20 if you could ride a bike with the headset locked out so there is no steering.

After your crash, you will discover that the front wheel is not straight when you are leaned over in a turn. That's why trail numbers are important at different speeds. If the front wheel wasn't turned when leaned over, trail would be meaningless in stabilizing the bike in a turn.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

rx-79g said:


> I'll give you $20 if you could ride a bike with the headset locked out so there is no steering.
> 
> After your crash, you will discover that the front wheel is not straight when you are leaned over in a turn. That's why trail numbers are important at different speeds. If the front wheel wasn't turned when leaned over, trail would be meaningless in stabilizing the bike in a turn.


You will lose the bet because you didn't mention anything about turning  !



Of course; Your point well taken.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

rx-79g said:


> I'll give you $20 if you could ride a bike with the headset locked out so there is no steering.
> 
> After your crash, you will discover that the front wheel is not straight when you are leaned over in a turn. That's why trail numbers are important at different speeds. If the front wheel wasn't turned when leaned over, trail would be meaningless in stabilizing the bike in a turn.


My fault. You are correct. I shouldn't have said, "If you could fuse the headset on a bike so the stem & bars wouldn't move at all, you could still make it turn" The truth is, depending on speed & the turn radius the front wheel turns only a couple of centimeters in most cases. That requires such a small input of force that for all practical purposes the stem length has no effect on the bike's handling.


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## rx-79g (Sep 14, 2010)

Mr. Versatile said:


> My fault. You are correct. I shouldn't have said, "If you could fuse the headset on a bike so the stem & bars wouldn't move at all, you could still make it turn" The truth is, depending on speed & the turn radius the front wheel turns only a couple of centimeters in most cases. That requires such a small input of force that for all practical purposes the stem length has no effect on the bike's handling.


And I'd agree. Stem lengths in the normal range make no _practical_ difference. But humans are sensitive enough that you could conceivably_ feel _a difference, but that difference just isn't important.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

rx-79g said:


> And I'd agree. Stem lengths in the normal range make no _practical_ difference. But humans are sensitive enough that you could conceivably_ feel _a difference, but that difference just isn't important.


I think that sums it up well. To put it another way, stem length affects handling (I know I can feel it), but it's a difference that a rider can easily adjust to. And it is a far smaller effect than changes in basic front-end geometry: head angle, rake, trail. Also, those other factors affect handling even when riding no-hands. Stem and bar specs obviously have no effect there.

And you're right about the locked-headset test: it's been tried; you can't ride a bike that way. Even if you just want to go straight, it's almost impossible to balance the bike without the ability to turn the steerer to get the wheels back under the center of mass when the bike is falling to the side. The steering geometry lets you do that automatically and unconsciously, even hands-free, but you're making steering inputs all the time.

The invention of a 2-wheeler with the front wheel mounted on a steerable fork was the key breakthrough in the development of the bicycle as we know it. Patented by Georg von Drais in 1815, the "Draisine" or velocipede had no pedals (rider just pushed with his feet), but it's the first machine we'd recognize as a bike.


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## batura (Jan 4, 2012)

I have a new BMC with 110 mm stem. However, I am going to switch 140 mm as the top tube is too short for me. Does anybody know whether the handling differ a lot? It should be, because as the distance between the handlebar and the steerer tube increases, the sensitivity at the handlebar must be increased as well. Any comments?

Batura


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

batura said:


> I have a new BMC with 110 mm stem. However, I am going to switch 140 mm as the top tube is too short for me. Does anybody know whether the handling differ a lot? It should be, because as the distance between the handlebar and the steerer tube increases, the sensitivity at the handlebar must be increased as well. Any comments?
> Batura


I went from 100mm to 130 and didn't notice any difference in steering response.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Funny we never get these questions when people consider changing bars to one with longer reach.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

kbwh said:


> Funny we never get these questions when people consider changing bars to one with longer reach.


Yes, and there is a big difference in bars' reaches - probably as much as normal stem swaps. And as I found out this year, there is about 1.5cm difference between Ultegra 10-spd shifter hoods as DuraAce 9-spd.


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## velocanman (Jul 15, 2011)

A 20 mm increase in length is significant but it depends on what you are starting with.

If you are riding a 120 and going to 140, I would start looking for a new frame. Yes, a lot of pros run 140 but that's because they ride a frame 1-2 sizes too small so it is lighter and stiffer.

If you are going from a 100 to a 120 you might actually prefer the feel. It will definitely affect the steering. In the case of a longer stem it will slow down the steering rate, all other factors being constant.

Since you mentioned you are getting jammed up on the drops, this is indeed an indication you need a longer stem and/or larger frame. Please note that increasing handlebar rise can also increase the distance from your knees to your elbows. You might want to try experimenting with rise along with the longer stem.

For road bikes, my recommendation is to get comfortable first, then worry about efficiency and aerodynamics. If you can't hold the position for more than 2 minutes the aero advantages will never be gained.


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## redclaybrigade (Jan 3, 2012)

This might be a relevant comment...not sure. After I had bought a new frame and had swapped all my old components from the broken frame over to it, everything felt fine except when I would get out of the saddle while climbing. Then I could feel the bike bog down in front. I discovered the reason was that I hadn't been attentive to the TT length of the new frame. It was 56.5 vs. around 59 for the old frame. I was getting too much over the front wheel. Yeah, I know you're supposed avoid coming forward, but rising straight off the saddle felt unnatural to me. I pushed the seat back and put on a shorter stem, which might seem weird, but it was the best way I could think of to avoid that feeling and it worked. Stupid mistake in buying on my part, I know, but perhaps something to keep in mind when you go to extend the stem.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

I change my stems 20-40 mm based on time of year, the ride I am doing, and my mood.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

batura said:


> I have a new BMC with 110 mm stem. However, I am going to switch 140 mm as the top tube is too short for me. Does anybody know whether the handling differ a lot? It should be, because as the distance between the handlebar and the steerer tube increases, the sensitivity at the handlebar must be increased as well. Any comments?
> 
> Batura


Did you read this old thread to which you appended your question? There was a broad consensus that the difference in handling is small and easily adapted to. Pretty much everyone's experience agrees with this.

My road bike has a 130 mm stem. My fixed-gear, which I built on an old frame with a longer top tube, has a 100 mm stem to give me the reach I want. I switch between them all the time. The handling is different, and I feel it when I switch. After about a block, I have adapted to the slightly different steering inputs required, and I don't think about it again the rest of the ride.

No big deal.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

JCavilia said:


> Did you read this old thread to which you appended your question? There was a broad consensus that the difference in handling is small and easily adapted to. Pretty much everyone's experience agrees with this.
> 
> My road bike has a 130 mm stem. My fixed-gear, which I built on an old frame with a longer top tube, has a 100 mm stem to give me the reach I want. I switch between them all the time. The handling is different, and I feel it when I switch. After about a block, I have adapted to the slightly different steering inputs required, and I don't think about it again the rest of the ride.
> 
> No big deal.


Well, different stem lengths between bikes with the same overall reach, maybe. But handling on the same bike with a 30mm stem difference will be pretty noticeable. That is going to shift more weight onto the front wheel, and it can loosen up the arms and shoulders if you are too cramped. Both of those things will make leaning the bike over a lot easier.

However, I think the whole sensitive steering input thing is bogus. Nobody actually steers a bike by turning the handlebars, you steer a bike by leaning it over. Unless you are a total spazz.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

foto said:


> However, I think the whole sensitive steering input thing is bogus. Nobody actually steers a bike by turning the handlebars, you steer a bike by leaning it over. Unless you are a total spazz.


Yeah, but you lean it over by turning the handlebar (the other way). And you control the lean,and therefore the radius of the turn, by adjusting the bar turn. Even if you don't realize that's what you're doing.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

After seeing this thread resurface, I may never buy a bigger bike than 52cm again.  If I have trouble, it's with getting the reach short enough.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

JCavilia said:


> Yeah, but you lean it over by turning the handlebar (the other way). And you control the lean,and therefore the radius of the turn, by adjusting the bar turn. Even if you don't realize that's what you're doing.


Agreed, but I don't believe that is contributing anything to steering sensitivity. I am of the _firm_ belief that having the room to maneuver around your cockpit to stay loose and relaxed is what lets a person rail corners.

I will not be convinced otherwise.


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## LinoD (Sep 16, 2010)

*big fan of longer stem...*

I felt like when i slammed my stem, and went to a 120 from a 90... the entire bike changed. Better Handling, more comfort on the saddle, arms now have a natural break. Feel really comfy in the drops... the big plus for me was, i like to do much of my climbing out of the saddle, pushing the handle bars away from me with the longer, dropped stem gives me the ability to adjust position (knee clearance) when dancing on the peddles.


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## VAMurph (Aug 28, 2010)

My experience. I had a 100mm on my 58 carbon bike and felt too stretched out, particularly on fast downhills...didn't feel as though the bike was under me. I also felt as though most of my weight was on the hoods during normal upright riding and not more balanced, seat, pedals and hoods. I also noticed I was riding on the narrow part of the saddle too much (ouch) while upright. 

So I bought some inexpensive stems, $10 each from Neuvation on sale in 90 mm and 80 mm lengths and tried them out. I didn't adjust my seat fore/aft as I had felt comfortable while in the saddle and on the pedals. The 90 mm stem felt good but not perfect. I felt I could adjust the seat position but really didn't want to. The 80 mm worked best..felt equally over the bike and handling was quite different than the either the 90 mm or 100 mm. Let me just say that I feel fully in control of the bike now on those fast downhills. Next step is to now buy the stem I want perferably something lighter than these temporary ones.

Conclusion:
How the bike feels with even 10 mm of change is specific to the owner/user and what the owner is looking for in terms of a comfortable riding position.


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## batura (Jan 4, 2012)

Is it possible to purchase an Easton EA90 140mm (10 degree) stem? It is produced for pro racing teams such as BMC, but I am not sure if it is available for sale.


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## ZoSoSwiM (Mar 7, 2008)

My friend just went to a longer stem... Says he's more comfortable. I'm debating on doing the same.. Maybe even trying wider bars too.


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## hrumpole (Jun 17, 2008)

Reading this, I've been thinking as well. Thanks to losing a couple of lbs, and some mobility work, I now feel like I want to stretch out more on the bike and get lower. Does this mean I need a longer stem, or will simply increasing drop (e.g., change stem angle down) accomplish the same thing?


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

foto said:


> Agreed, but I don't believe that is contributing anything to steering sensitivity. I am of the _firm_ belief that having the room to maneuver around your cockpit to stay loose and relaxed is what lets a person rail corners.
> 
> I will not be convinced otherwise.


I have no idea what you mean by any of that, so I guess I am in full agreement


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

hrumpole said:


> Reading this, I've been thinking as well. Thanks to losing a couple of lbs, and some mobility work, I now feel like I want to stretch out more on the bike and get lower. Does this mean I need a longer stem, or will simply increasing drop (e.g., change stem angle down) accomplish the same thing?


They do similar, but still different things. You can flip your stem for free, but a longer one costs $10-$100+ and a trip to your LBS or some time spent waiting.


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## oliver79 (Aug 11, 2009)

Removing spacers and increasing the drop will also give you a longer reach.


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