# Warning! Warning! Fred in the peloton, fred in the peloton



## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

".. Horner rides with a saddle bag, even when followed by the team car. And he carries a pump, strapped to said saddle bag. His seat tube bottle cage is filled with a spare tubular, just in case.

For another thing, Horner rides a taller head tube than Trek’s “pro” geometry that the company calls H1. ..."

Seriously, what's next, pro dork disks?

Pro Bike: Chris Horner's Trek Madone 6.9 SSL | Cyclingnews.com


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

looigi said:


> Seriously, what's next, pro dork disks?


Been done. Back when shifting wasn't so reliable, many pro bikes had those disks, like this 1948 Galletti. And I saw dork disks on a few bikes ridden in Paris-Roubaix back in the mid-1970s. Don't know about now.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Ah, the "Bartali" gear!

Love that piece on Horner's ride. 

It's has not been uncommon to use the largest cog as a dork disk in Roubaix by setting the limiting screw.


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## superjesus (Jul 26, 2010)

Good for Horner! 

I find it refreshing that a _real_ pro is willing to eschew the typical, stale "pro" snobbery.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Good way to meet the UCI weight requirement. Nothing more.


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## Longhair-NL (Mar 31, 2012)

looigi said:


> ".. Horner rides with a saddle bag, even when followed by the team car. And he carries a pump, strapped to said saddle bag. His seat tube bottle cage is filled with a spare tubular, just in case.
> 
> For another thing, Horner rides a taller head tube than Trek’s “pro” geometry that the company calls H1. ..."
> 
> ...


Apparently the guy is doing much better than you are since he is riding at a pro level and you are not.


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## T0mi (Mar 2, 2011)

robdamanii said:


> Good way to meet the UCI weight requirement. Nothing more.


Weight requirement are not enforced during training/recon rides.


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## gumbafish (Jan 11, 2011)

I obviously wouldn't carry that stuff if I had a car following me, but what is the deal with people being anti frame pump and saddle bag? I like riding, I don't like getting stranded if I get a flat, and I don't like putting a bunch of junk in my jersey. I was really surprised that so many people don't have pumps or saddle bags, just seems strange to me.


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## Andrew L (Apr 20, 2011)

superjesus said:


> Good for Horner!
> 
> I find it refreshing that a _real_ pro is willing to eschew the typical, stale "pro" snobbery.


x2!!!!!


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## lemonlime (Sep 24, 2003)

Doesn't he know he'll never be anything if he doesn't drink the pro-style kool aid?


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

T0mi said:


> Weight requirement are not enforced during training/recon rides.


Doh. Good catch. I didn't bother to read the article (just skimmed the quoted part.)



gumbafish said:


> I obviously wouldn't carry that stuff if I had a car following me, but what is the deal with people being anti frame pump and saddle bag? I like riding, I don't like getting stranded if I get a flat, and I don't like putting a bunch of junk in my jersey. I was really surprised that so many people don't have pumps or saddle bags, just seems strange to me.


Because saddle bags are as awful looking as truck nutz, and you can carry everything you need on the road in half a jersey pocket.

If you don't like putting stuff in your jersey pockets, why bother to have pockets then?


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## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> Doh. Good catch. I didn't bother to read the article (just skimmed the quoted part.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Pockets are for food and phones the 2 tubes and inflators go in the bag along with the multi tool with a chain tool.


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## Longhair-NL (Mar 31, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> Doh. Good catch. I didn't bother to read the article (just skimmed the quoted part.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The only way that a person is able to see their saddle bag while on the bike is if they are riding with their head up their ass...


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> Doh. Good catch. I didn't bother to read the article (just skimmed the quoted part.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


1/2 a pocket? Smartphone, 1 or 2 spare tubes, patch kit, multitool, folding hex key set, CO2 inflator and 2-3 carts is way more than I'd care to carry in my pockets. Especially on hot swealtering days.


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## jmoryl (Sep 5, 2004)

It's not nice to fall on tools in one's jersey pocket. Plus it leaves room if you see a nice bunch of asparagus for purchase (being spring and all).


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

I guess horner must have caved into The Rules


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## Chris-X (Aug 4, 2011)

*Clueless as usual.*



robdamanii said:


> Doh. Good catch. I didn't bother to read the article (just skimmed the quoted part.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Damn, I'd love to drop you on a full suspension mountain bike.

As someone else pointed out, it's not pleasant to land on your tools in a crash.

Talk about freds....caring what you or your saddle bag looks like? Yeah ok!


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## gumbafish (Jan 11, 2011)

Your jersey pockets must be bigger than mine. Tube, tire levers, multi tool, cell phone, and a pump take up more than half a pocket. If anything I keep my house key and food in my jersey pockets. Anyways not knocking either way, I just don't care to let what others find silly looking dictate what is most functional for me.


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## Mailmover (Mar 29, 2011)

Beings that he is an elder statesman of active Pros, he is allowed to be goofy.. he he he.. and he may have done this for laughs.

I have done too many walks back to the house while carrying my ride instead of the other way. So, I carry in my saddle bag, everything to repair a flat and make minor repairs elsewhere. In one pocket, another spare tube, inflator cartridge and a mini pump.


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## orange_julius (Jan 24, 2003)

looigi said:


> ".. Horner rides with a saddle bag, even when followed by the team car. And he carries a pump, strapped to said saddle bag. His seat tube bottle cage is filled with a spare tubular, just in case.
> 
> For another thing, Horner rides a taller head tube than Trek’s “pro” geometry that the company calls H1. ..."
> 
> ...


From what I've read about Horner, this is not too surprising. He's the consummate pro, always prepared for the worst. 

This reminds me of an interview of Oscar Freire a few years ago, in which he said he never had to carry tools nor spare tubes with him when he trains near his hometown. The reason? Everybody knows he's Oscar Freire, so he could always either bum a spare tube/tire or bum a ride home.


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## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

robdamanii said:


> Because saddle bags are as awful looking as truck nutz, and you can carry everything you need on the road in half a jersey pocket.


That is why I hang truck nutz from my saddle bag.


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## Jesse D Smith (Jun 11, 2005)

*He's cut down*

Just a pump and bag? He's really trimmed it down. 
He used to carry an entire spare bike and a spare _rider_, just in case.

(Here's an alternative explanation)
Chris Horner Gives Fallen Rider (and bike) a 2k Ride to the Finish


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

orange_julius said:


> This reminds me of an interview of Oscar Freire a few years ago, in which he said he never had to carry tools nor spare tubes with him when he trains near his hometown. The reason? Everybody knows he's Oscar Freire, so he could always either bum a spare tube/tire or bum a ride home.


The famous picture with a pump duct taped to his Colnago must have been taken some way from home then. 

Also: Cav uses mud guards in the winter. Just like the Coppis did.


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

gumbafish said:


> I obviously wouldn't carry that stuff if I had a car following me, but what is the deal with people being anti frame pump and saddle bag? I like riding, I don't like getting stranded if I get a flat, and I don't like putting a bunch of junk in my jersey. I was really surprised that so many people don't have pumps or saddle bags, just seems strange to me.


^This!


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## royta (May 24, 2008)

32and3cross said:


> Pockets are for food and phones the 2 tubes and inflators go in the bag along with the multi tool with a chain tool.





Longhair-NL said:


> The only way that a person is able to see their saddle bag while on the bike is if they are riding with their head up their ass...





Marc said:


> 1/2 a pocket? Smartphone, 1 or 2 spare tubes, patch kit, multitool, folding hex key set, CO2 inflator and 2-3 carts is way more than I'd care to carry in my pockets. Especially on hot swealtering days.



Exactly.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

Maybe, just maybe, he was uding a saddle bag because he wasn't being supported and he can change his own tube?


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

Dork Disc :lol:, I have never heard that before.


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

Well, as everyone on this forum remembers, I have said many time that there are quite few pro cyclists who ride with frame pumps, saddle bags and dork discs just to take a stand against poseurs. Some folks thought I was kidding. Right now they are obviously busy wiping the egg off their faces.

Although the author of the article needs to do more proofreading: "Another nod to Horner’s preference for comfort over the stereotypical pro look — 25cm tires". 25cm tires? Does he ride a swamp buggy of some sort?


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Everybody seems to forget that to be a Fred, the most important thing, is to be clueless.

Don't think that that applies here.

If I often went on 100 mile unsuported training rides, I might use a bag, also.....


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

It's so awesome to see a pro riding a bike that actually looks like something a human being rides. No insane stem length/slam or stupidly small bike.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> Pockets are for food and phones the 2 tubes and inflators go in the bag along with the multi tool with a chain tool.


1 tube, 2 CO2, inflator head, patch kit, small multi tool, 2 tire levers, KMC link, presta/schrader adapter all go in a small camera case which takes up half the center jersey pocket. 

Phone/cash/card goes in right pocket. Left pocket has gel flask.

If you need anything more than that, you're doing something wrong.




Longhair-NL said:


> Apparently the guy is doing much better than you are since he is riding at a pro level and you are not.


Still steamed about that bike path thread I see. 

Obviously he's a better rider than I. I'm sure he's a better rider than you too. Hell, he's a better rider than 95% of the peloton. What does that have to do with a butt ugly saddle bag?


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

robdamanii said:


> 1 tube, 2 CO2, inflator head, patch kit, small multi tool, 2 tire levers, KMC link, presta/schrader adapter all go in a small camera case which takes up half the center jersey pocket.


... which looks ridiculous in a center pocket of a typical light cycling jersey due to the fact that the fabric cannot properly support the weight of all that stuff. All that stuff goes into the saddle bag. That's what saddle bags are for.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

AndreyT said:


> ... which looks ridiculous in a center pocket of a typical light cycling jersey due to the fact that the fabric cannot properly support the weight of all that stuff. All that stuff goes into the saddle bag. That's what saddle bags are for.


BS. Your jersey must be made of tissue paper, especially considering I've had all that and a pair of bottles in pockets at the same time.

Horror....

The idea that saddle bags are required is blatantly incorrect, whether you like it or not.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

They ride what fits their body.
If it would slow them down, they wouldn't ride it.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

SolidSnake03 said:


> It's so awesome to see a pro riding a bike that actually looks like something a human being rides. No insane stem length/slam or stupidly small bike.


it's 'awesome'...? really?

why do think pros should look like 'normals'...?


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

AndreyT said:


> Well, as everyone on this forum remembers, I have said many time that there are quite few pro cyclists who ride with frame pumps, saddle bags and dork discs just to take a stand against poseurs. Some folks thought I was kidding. Right now they are obviously busy wiping the egg off their faces.


Are you talking about during races or training?


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

redlude97 said:


> Are you talking about during races or training?


I'm talking about showing up in public: the primary context our local fashion-minded pro-wannabees concern themselves with


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Jeebus. You arnt a gawd damn pro. Who cares what you look like. I could give a fawk about impressing another man in a lycra jumpsuit. 

And as far as being "pro" They could drop you and me on a rusty Huffy with a flat. 

Rant off.


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## Fireform (Dec 15, 2005)

Horner is my hero.


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## dougydee (Feb 15, 2005)

Here's what a couple of pros say about saddle bags during training.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

AndreyT said:


> ...there are quite few pro cyclists who ride with frame pumps, saddle bags and dork discs just to take a stand against poseurs.


if true, it's pretty pathetic that there are pros who are concerned with what recreational riders are doing.


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## mpre53 (Oct 25, 2011)

NUTT said:


> That is why I hang truck nutz from my saddle bag.


Those, and fuzzy dice from my bars.


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## Longhair-NL (Mar 31, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> 1 tube, 2 CO2, inflator head, patch kit, small multi tool, 2 tire levers, KMC link, presta/schrader adapter all go in a small camera case which takes up half the center jersey pocket.
> 
> Phone/cash/card goes in right pocket. Left pocket has gel flask.
> 
> ...


Still steamed about what other people think about you I see :thumbsup:


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## JapanDave (Mar 11, 2012)

And here I was concerned how I looked with a camera stuck on the top of my helmet!


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Longhair-NL said:


> Still steamed about what other people think about you I see :thumbsup:


Interesting assumption, but again incorrect, just like all your posts in the bike path thread. More likely that there's quite a few people here (yourself included) who are insecure with their use of bulky, ugly saddle bags and what others think about them.

If you didn't care, you wouldn't all be thumping your chest about how awesome they are.


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## JapanDave (Mar 11, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> Interesting assumption, but again incorrect, just like all your posts in the bike path thread. More likely that there's quite a few people here (yourself included) who are insecure with their use of bulky, ugly saddle bags and what others think about them.
> 
> If you didn't care, you wouldn't all be thumping your chest about how awesome they are.


Rob, you were not afraid to talk about the this topic when we met the other day and you let me take a pic of your bike. LOL


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## djwalker (Oct 3, 2009)

The main reason I carry stuff in a saddle bag is that it is always on the bike and I don't need to remember to bring it along. Otherwise, I would forget something on almost every ride.


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## Longhair-NL (Mar 31, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> Interesting assumption, but again incorrect, just like all your posts in the bike path thread. More likely that there's quite a few people here (yourself included) who are insecure with their use of bulky, ugly saddle bags and what others think about them.
> 
> If you didn't care, you wouldn't all be thumping your chest about how awesome they are.


What I do in the privacy of the bedroom is between me and your mother.


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

djwalker said:


> The main reason I carry stuff in a saddle bag is that it is always on the bike and I don't need to remember to bring it along. Otherwise, I would forget something on almost every ride.


Exactly!


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## RkFast (Dec 11, 2004)

robdamanii said:


> BS. Your jersey must be made of tissue paper, especially considering I've had all that and a pair of bottles in pockets at the same time.
> 
> Horror....
> 
> The idea that saddle bags are required is blatantly incorrect, whether you like it or not.


Why do you give a ****?


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

*moderators note*



Longhair-NL said:


> What I do in the privacy of the bedroom is between me and your mother.


Well, take the next week to think how that wasn't an appropriate response.


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

djwalker said:


> The main reason I carry stuff in a saddle bag is that it is always on the bike and I don't need to remember to bring it along. Otherwise, I would forget something on almost every ride.


If you keep everything that would go in a saddle bag(tube, patches, tyvek boot, 2 CO2 cannisters, inflator, schrader-presta adapter, multitool, single lever) in a ziplock, it would be pretty hard to forget it.


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## Fireform (Dec 15, 2005)

Pockets are for stuff you need while you're rolling. The saddle bag is for stuff you need when you aren't.


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

Fireform said:


> Pockets are for stuff you need while you're rolling. The saddle bag is for stuff you need when you aren't.


You need your keys/cell phone/id while rolling?


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

redlude97 said:


> You need your keys/cell phone/id while rolling?


If I want a bite to eat, yes I'll need the ID/CC so it goes in the pocket. Garage door opener goes in the pocket for convenience, as do cleat covers. Phone goes in the saddle bag., no place safer for a touchscreen smartphone on a bike.


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

Marc said:


> If I want a bite to eat, yes I'll need the ID/CC so it goes in the pocket. Garage door opener goes in the pocket for convenience, as do cleat covers. Phone goes in the saddle bag., no place safer for a touchscreen smartphone on a bike.


Neither the CC/ID or garage opener are needed while rolling though, they can be accessed once stopped and off the bike, so they should go in the saddle bag according to that statement made by fireform


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## trailrunner68 (Apr 23, 2011)

gumbafish said:


> I obviously wouldn't carry that stuff if I had a car following me, but what is the deal with people being anti frame pump and saddle bag? I like riding, I don't like getting stranded if I get a flat, and I don't like putting a bunch of junk in my jersey. I was really surprised that so many people don't have pumps or saddle bags, just seems strange to me.


Some poseurs live in fear that someone might pick up their bike and think it weighs half a pound more than it does because there are necessary tools attached.


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## RkFast (Dec 11, 2004)

Im really trying to get my head around how a nice saddlebag neatly tucked under a saddle looks like hell, but three bulging pockets full of crap, including tools(!!) somehow does not.

To each his own. Like most crap we wear or do to enjoy cycling, its for utility, not for looks.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

bulging pockets ?

all I need for a ride fits here


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## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> 1 tube, 2 CO2, inflator head, patch kit, small multi tool, 2 tire levers, KMC link, presta/schrader adapter all go in a small camera case which takes up half the center jersey pocket.
> 
> Phone/cash/card goes in right pocket. Left pocket has gel flask.
> 
> If you need anything more than that, you're doing something wrong.


you can't fix a broken chain with no chain tool so you might as well leave the KMC link at home unless you actually carry a chain tool but I don't see that on you list.

I always carry two tubes because while a patch kit works fine for some flats its a bit harder to get those to stick when its cold and wet and you double flat miles from home where there is no cell phone coverage (pretty common on the cell phone coverage here in Norcal). I also carry a patch kit tho and a frame pump.Personally I think you kits is a bit light but if it fits your needs then that's ok.

So lest see I carry 2 tubes, 2 inflators with a inflator head, a 14 tip multi tool with a chain tool tire boots, a tire lever, at full size frame pump (in the back triangle). That all fits in a small bag under my saddle. it looks fine or rather I don't really care what it looks like I'm training and need to be able to get home or to work with out worring that I have the stuff I need.

If you don't like the way a bag looks feel free to carry that mess in your pocket that's fine with me. I don't think your doing it wrong because its not nessesary for me to judge you because I don't really care where you carry your stuff.


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

Salsa_Lover said:


> bulging pockets ?
> all I need for a ride fits here


Where's the spare tube?


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

Gosh, people are sure sensitive. What began as an "innocent" thread on what Horner carries on his bike turned into a name-calling fest.

Yikes!!!


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## 67caddy (Nov 4, 2009)

They say this cat Horner he's a bad mother...
SHUT YOUR MOUTH!!
'm talking' bout Horner
THEN WE CAN DIG IT!

He's a hard ridin' man
But no one understands him but his woman
CHRIS HORNER!!


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

Oxtox said:


> it's 'awesome'...? really?
> 
> why do think pros should look like 'normals'...?


*really don't want a long conversation about bike fit etc....*
However, it shows that this pro in particular isn't sheep-like in following the trend of slammed stems and tiny frames with seat posts to the sky. He is riding what actually seems to work best for his body opposed to what some social pressures or trends dictate. 

Case in point see Canc and Pruitt


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

AndreyT said:


> Where's the spare tube?


I carry my spare tubular on a bottle cage, and if I am riding clinchers I carry a tube on the pocket


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## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

I say f()ck all you pocket cartridge racer wannabes. Real men have a real trunk rack with a pump, tubes, tool, jacket, lunch, and a cold beer inside. I ain't going to share a single damn thing with you while you shiver your ass off at a top of a 10,000 foot pass eating your gels while I'm slamming down my roastbeef and turkey sandwich on rye with pepperjack and the perfect amount of chiles on there for good measure and finishing it off with a cold beer!

Note to Coolhand: Just joking, just joking, . .well except for the cold beer, and the sandwich. No one gets my sammie.


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## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

OH yeah, I ride 28's. That's right, 28's. So suck my long reach brakes!


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

Ridgetop said:


> I say f()ck all you pocket cartridge racer wannabes. Real men have a real trunk rack with a pump, tubes, tool, jacket, lunch, and a cold beer inside. I ain't going to share a single damn thing with you while you shiver your ass off at a top of a 10,000 foot pass eating your gels while I'm slamming down my roastbeef and turkey sandwich on rye with pepperjack and the perfect amount of chiles on there for good measure and finishing it off with a cold beer!
> 
> Note to Coolhand: Just joking, just joking, . .well except for the cold beer, and the sandwich. No one gets my sammie.


I'm terrified of what that sandwich might do to my insides during the course of a ride


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## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

SolidSnake03 said:


> I'm terrified of what that sandwich might do to my insides during the course of a ride


Been blessed with the ability to eat a half dead opossum and still ride another 50 miles five minutes later. I pretty much eat my way through rides! :thumbsup:


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## Dunbar (Aug 8, 2010)

So lycra is totally cool but cycling bags look uncool? Who the hell writes the rules?


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## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

Dunbar said:


> So lycra is totally cool but cycling bags look uncool? Who the hell writes the rules?


Lycra makes anyone look hot. Just ask her!


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> you can't fix a broken chain with no chain tool so you might as well leave the KMC link at home unless you actually carry a chain tool but I don't see that on you list.
> 
> I always carry two tubes because while a patch kit works fine for some flats its a bit harder to get those to stick when its cold and wet and you double flat miles from home where there is no cell phone coverage (pretty common on the cell phone coverage here in Norcal). I also carry a patch kit tho and a frame pump.Personally I think you kits is a bit light but if it fits your needs then that's ok.
> 
> ...


Chain tool is attached to the small multi-tool.

If I get double flats, I patch. If I get triple flats, I patch. I refuse to sit for 20 minutes pumping a frame pump like I'm rubbing one out on the side of the road. If something is that bad, I pick up the phone and dial. If I don't have reception, I walk until I have it.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

robdamanii said:


> I'm rubbing one out on the side of the road.


What if that was the objective?


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

tihsepa said:


> What if that was the objective?


Then beware of the guy in the pickup truck with the axe that asks if you need help.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Ah, the rules....

There are so many justifications for things: the leg shaving, the sunglasses over the helmet straps, etc... When it is all said and done, a lot of these rules are more of a matter of culture than anything. 

The thing with avoiding saddle bags ultimately derives from emulating the pros. The funny thing is, I see pros all the time on their own training rides with saddle bags and such. I personally find it irrational to put so much effort into trying to emulate the appearance of people who are being followed by support cars with all of their gear in them (who often ride with saddle bags themselves when not being followed by cars).

Is it possible for me to fit everything I need into my jersey pockets? Yes, of course it is _possible._ Lots of things are possible but I am less comfortable with all of that stuff back there. I carry a spare tube, 3 tire levers, a chain breaker, a patch kit, a multi tool, a frame pump, a cell phone, a cliff bar, and usually a sandwich or something else more substantial than gels for my long rides. Why should I stuff that stuff in my pockets if I feel more comfortable with it in a bag? It isn't even that ugly, no matter how much the rules say it is. The "it isn't necessary" argument doesn't work for me. I used to work with a woman outfitting people for kayak trips and she would never check back over her work (like double checking her knots to make sure boats were tied down properly, for example). I would call her on it and she would say things like "I know I did it right the first time; nobody should be messing their knots up. If you are having to check back over your work, you are doing something wrong." I guess that is some sort of statement of efficiency or something but just because something isn't 100% necessary in the most literal definition of the word doesn't mean that it is wrong to do anything more, especially if it serves any sort of purpose to do so. It isn't "necessary" to ride $10,000 wonderbikes but plenty of people here do because it makes them happy to do so. 

"If you need anything more than that, you're doing something wrong."

I am not doing anything wrong. I am riding my bicycle for hours at a time, comfortable as I wish to be, having incredible amounts of fun, with the security of knowing I can get back home if something goes wrong. I can stop and have a sandwich on the way if I want to because I haven't limited myself to gels simply because I don't want people to think I'm a fred because I'm riding with a saddle bag. If somebody somewhere hadn't arbitrarily decided that it was a cultural faux pas to ride with a saddle bag and if people weren't trying so hard to emulate pros being followed by support cars, no one would have any problem with riding with them because they do not really hurt anything at all. 

If it brings you joy and makes your rides more enjoyable to avoid saddle bags and carry everything in your pockets, that is absolutely fine but PLEASE do not say that I'm doing something _wrong_ because I choose to be more comfortable and put my gear in a tiny little bag that fits under my saddle. That is a very limited and arbitrary way to judge how "right" or "wrong" someone's riding is, especially considering that professional cyclists who don't have anything to prove do it all of the time.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

If you want to carry your lunch on a ride, use a musette


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## SolidSnake03 (Jun 22, 2011)

or your jersey pockets oh wait....there stuffed with all the crap that could be in your saddle bag


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

SolidSnake03 said:


> or your jersey pockets oh wait....there stuffed with all the crap that could be in your saddle bag


Or you could just put your sandwich and coke in the pocket anyway. There's plenty of room when you actually bother to pare down all the useless junk you keep in the saddle bag.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

thechriswebb said:


> The thing with avoiding saddle bags ultimately derives from emulating the pros. .


well, that was a bunch of wasted keystrokes to pointlessly pontificate on a false premise...

I don't care what the pros do, honestly.

I put necessities in a ziploc and carry it in a pocket because (pay attention now) it's more FUNCTIONAL than a seat bag. contents are much more easily accessed than digging out stuff from a bag.

also, this method doesn't require switching bags between bikes or having redundant sets of tools for separate bags and it's far more economical than a bag.

logical approaches appeal to me.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Oxtox said:


> well, that was a bunch of wasted keystrokes to pointlessly pontificate on a false premise...
> 
> I don't care what the pros do, honestly.
> 
> ...


Yup...This is correct.


----------



## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

did too

did not

did too

did not

did too

did not

Did Too

Did Not

Did Too!

Did Not!

DID TOO

DID NOT

DID TOO!

DID NOT!

DID TOO!!!!!

DID NOT!!!!

CAUSE I SAID!

NO, CAUSE I SAID!


----------



## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Oxtox said:


> well, that was a bunch of wasted keystrokes to pointlessly pontificate on a false premise...
> 
> I don't care what the pros do, honestly.
> 
> ...




If that feels more functional to you that is fine. I keep my food and phone in my jersey pockets so that I can access them quickly. If I'm fixing a flat, I don't feel like I have to get to them that quickly so I keep my tools in a saddle bag. 

Like I said before, I am more comfortable without those things in my jersey. I like to have a couple of things there quickly accessible but not the other things. I'm not carrying any extra crap that doesn't make my ride more enjoyable to me. I'm a very logical fella myself. Even if it doesn't make sense to you, that little bit more comfortable that I am without a tube, sandwich, and tools in my pockets for a long ride makes it worth it to me to have that little bag under my saddle that doesn't bother me one bit. You like to stuff all of your gear into your jersey pockets and I like to put mine in a saddle bag. I don't feel at all hostile towards your method; I just don't like somebody saying that I am doing something wrong because I ride the way that makes me happy.


----------



## Dunbar (Aug 8, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> Yup...This is correct.


So earlier in this thread, when you said that saddle bags are ugly, that has no bearing on your decision to avoid them? Let's be honest, that's why most spandex clad roadies eschew seat bags.

I personally don't want to feel blunt metal objects, keys, tire levers and other misc crap resting on my lower back for hours at a time when I can stuff them in a seat bag and forget about them.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Dunbar said:


> So earlier in this thread, when you said that saddle bags are ugly, that has no bearing on your decision to avoid them? Let's be honest, that's why most spandex clad roadies eschew seat bags.
> 
> I personally don't want to feel blunt metal objects, keys, tire levers and other misc crap resting on my lower back for hours at a time when I can stuff them in a seat bag and forget about them.


They ARE ugly, along with overly non-functional. Who the hell wants to get off their bike to dig around in a cavernous bag dangling from your saddle like a stallion's coinpurse in order to fish out a gel, sandwich, coke, keys, phone, etc etc.

If you can't deal with a set of keys or a phone touching your back, you need to HTFU that thin skin of yours. Or pack all your stuff into a sock or small camera pouch to make it all neat and tidy. Voila, problem solved, saddle bag avoided.


----------



## Dunbar (Aug 8, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> If you can't deal with a set of keys or a phone touching your back, you need to HTFU that thin skin of yours. Or pack all your stuff into a sock or small camera pouch to make it all neat and tidy. Voila, problem solved, saddle bag avoided.


Right, because a brick sized container resting on my back would be that much more comfortable. Snacks in the jersey pocket make a certain amount of sense and aren't heavy or uncomfortable. If I get a flat and need to change a tube (or make a call) I'm not too concerned about losing an extra 30 seconds fishing through my seat bag. At least you're being somewhat honest about the vanity aspect of not using them though...


----------



## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

I have to carry a saddle bag full of tools and whatnots because my jersey pockets are stuffed with all the photos of RobDomanii I keep on hand for HTFU inspiration.


----------



## gumbafish (Jan 11, 2011)

Why do you care so much about where other people put their stuff? You don't like them fine, if you think they work fine. To me it makes more sense to use a bag, I don't understand getting all riled up over it. 

*Sorry I forgot this is the internet, the preceding statement is probably too logical.


----------



## willieboy (Nov 27, 2010)

Fireform said:


> Pockets are for stuff you need while you're rolling. The saddle bag is for stuff you need when you aren't.


+1. Couldn't agree more.


----------



## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

AndreyT said:


> Where's the spare tube?



View attachment 257246


All you need fits in one hand


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Aindreas said:


> I have to carry a saddle bag full of tools and whatnots because my jersey pockets are stuffed with all the photos of RobDomanii I keep on hand for HTFU inspiration.


Do you still have those nudes on the bearskin rug that I sent you?


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

gumbafish said:


> Why do you care so much about where other people put their stuff? You don't like them fine, if you think they work fine. To me it makes more sense to use a bag, I don't understand getting all riled up over it.
> 
> *Sorry I forgot this is the internet, the preceding statement is probably too logical.


Maybe ask the OP that; after all he's the one who posted claiming "dude, we're cool for using a saddle bag because Horner uses one too! That's proof that we're acceptable!" 



Dunbar said:


> Right, because a brick sized container resting on my back would be that much more comfortable. Snacks in the jersey pocket make a certain amount of sense and aren't heavy or uncomfortable. If I get a flat and need to change a tube (or make a call) I'm not too concerned about losing an extra 30 seconds fishing through my seat bag. At least you're being somewhat honest about the vanity aspect of not using them though...


Again, if you're carrying so much crap that you have something the size of a brick in your pocket, you're doing it wrong. 

I can't figure out why that's so hard to understand....


----------



## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

robdamanii said:


> Good way to meet the UCI weight requirement. Nothing more.


The weight has to be a permanant fixture on the bike. A seat bag doesn't cut it.

Getting back to the childish back and forth what it comes down to is the perennial style vs. practicality argument. It is not more practical to keep stuff in your jersey pockets that will only be used when you stop (example fix a flat), it is of course less "fred like" to not have a seat bag however. 

Thing was it wasn't too many years ago wearing a helmet was considered fred like. Now if you are NOT wearing a helmet you are considered a potential organ donor. Times and standards change. I simply laugh my butt off when a bunch of people set themselves up as style mods when really all they are doing is emulating their impression of a pro image. Since they are pros there is a term for this. Call me a fred for having my spare tubular tire and C02 in my tubi seat bag if you must. I call you a poseur so we are even .


----------



## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

robdamanii said:


> Maybe ask the OP that; after all he's the one who posted claiming "dude, we're cool for using a saddle bag because Horner uses one too! That's proof that we're acceptable!"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or you are riding tubulars, just sayin


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

badge118 said:


> Or you are riding tubulars, just sayin


I carry even less when I ride tubulars. And I still carry it in my pocket.

A saddle bag is STILL useless.

Frankly, if people want to have a giant ballbag under their saddle, then that's their business. The BS of "dude, we're cool because Horner does the same thing" is utterly ridiculous.


----------



## RkFast (Dec 11, 2004)

badge118 said:


> Call me a fred for having my spare tubular tire and C02 in my tubi seat bag if you must. I call you a poseur so we are even .


/thread.


----------



## RkFast (Dec 11, 2004)

Robbie posts this on his blog:

_"I’m all for self expression, and I’m all for people riding their bikes. If people need some kind of eccentric bike to motivate them to get out and pedal, then good for them."_

Yet, here he is going nuts about saddle bags and the "right" way to carry stuff.

He's either trolling or a hypocrite. Probably a bit of both. 

I hope hes not doing the NY Gran Fondo this weekend. All those people in the same jerseys would make him schitt.


----------



## Love Commander (Aug 20, 2009)

badge118 said:


> Call me a fred for having my spare tubular tire and C02 in my tubi seat bag if you must. I call you a poseur so we are even .


No comment on the actual content of this thread, since I have no horse in this silly, silly race. But I just wanted to commend you for the proper use of the terms "fred" and "poseur", the definitions of which have been getting mangled on the 'nets by the lazy and weak of mind. If we have no solid delineation between these two types of cyclist, then how will others know who we are making fun of?


----------



## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

robdamanii said:


> I carry even less when I ride tubulars. And I still carry it in my pocket.
> 
> A saddle bag is STILL useless.
> 
> Frankly, if people want to have a giant ballbag under their saddle, then that's their business. The BS of "dude, we're cool because Horner does the same thing" is utterly ridiculous.


Yes because when you are doing 100 mile self supported rides using mapped out Fire House and Ambulance stations as water sources you can fit all your consumeables, sealant, co2, mini pump, tool etc. in your pockets. Some of us are not talking about our thursday night epeen expanding 20 mile long hammer fest. 

I also didn't see anyone say "hey we are cool". I think they said "hey look there is a pro that is a normal guy." The inexplicably hostile tone to the photo in question is so indicative of a poseur subculture it's pretty astounding really.


----------



## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> Do you still have those nudes on the bearskin rug that I sent you?


Yes. But they're getting a bit "worn". Please send moar.


----------



## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

Also, who gives a flying **** if you have a seat bag or not? It's not like we're talking about whether you should ride with worn out tires or a cracked seat post. Just ride the damn bike.


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

Im sure Ostrich Man has so semi insulting response about what Im carry is wrong and how perfect he is but really I can be bother to find it, so what ever Im going to stick with my saddle bag.

BTW, the whole "if you carry a saddle bag your doing wrong" mindset is frankly weird. I have no issue if you wish to carry the stuff you think you need in in you pockets but I don't and I can't quite figure out why that bothers people or why they think they are right (their not) or why Im wrong (Im not) but I do think the desire to define it like so vemenatly shows some insecurity.

And repeating Im right over and over isn't really convincing argument.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> Im sure Ostrich Man has so semi insulting response about what Im carry is wrong and how perfect he is but really I can be bother to find it, so what ever Im going to stick with my saddle bag.
> 
> BTW, the whole "if you carry a saddle bag your doing wrong" mindset is frankly weird. I have no issue if you wish to carry the stuff you think you need in in you pockets but I don't and I can't quite figure out why that bothers people or why they think they are right (their not) or why Im wrong (Im not) but I do think *the desire to define it like so vemenatly shows some insecurity.*
> 
> And repeating Im right over and over isn't really convincing argument.


Actually, I find it more entertaining that people need to defend their use of a saddle bag, especially by commenting that pros occasionally use them. 

Who's the insecure one when you need to post an article about a pro using a saddle bag and frame pump to make yourself feel better?


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

RkFast said:


> Robbie posts this on his blog:
> 
> _"I’m all for self expression, and I’m all for people riding their bikes. If people need some kind of eccentric bike to motivate them to get out and pedal, then good for them."_
> 
> ...


Nope, I'm not.

The kit is hideous and why would I pay to ride roads that I can ride any given weekend?

FYI: a saddle bag is not self expression, it's excessive foolishness. You don't need that much crap on ANY ride.


----------



## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

Actually the only reason I got involved was when I saw the comment "you are doing it wrong". That has to me one of the single most arrogant, self centered and elitist statements I had seen in a long time. Hell this thread started as an attack on the use of the thing "fred alert!" Jeezus, to try and even pretend such an OP would not engender a defensive reaction is pretty much evidence that you are getting cheap jollies trolling the forum.


----------



## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

kbwh said:


> Ah, the "Bartali" gear!
> 
> Love that piece on Horner's ride.
> 
> It's has not been uncommon to use the largest cog as a dork disk in Roubaix by setting the limiting screw.


The Bartali gear ON a Celeste bike!

This whole saddle bag vs. jersey pocket debate seems silly, at best. People have different needs and if a saddle bag helps, more power to them.

Personally, I prefer to let my gregarios carry all I need for a ride, including my mid-ride meal along with several bottles of chianti.

But seriously...

I use a a small SCICON bag that I can easily move from one bike to the other hence avoiding having to buy duplicate tools, etc. i carry two spare tubes, a Lezyne multitool and the built-in tire lever. The rest of the stuff goes in my pockets.

Now IF you want to argue about something, let's talk about the freds with speakers mounted on their handlebars who listen to music during a group ride. Nothing ruins a Sunday morning ride like the fred blasting the Beastie Boys on his bike speakers while rolling through the countryside.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

badge118 said:


> Actually the only reason I got involved was when I saw the comment "you are doing it wrong". That has to me one of the single most *arrogant, self centered and elitist statements I had seen in a long time.* Hell this thread started as an attack on the use of the thing "fred alert!" Jeezus, to try and even pretend such an OP would not engender a defensive reaction is pretty much evidence that you are getting cheap jollies trolling the forum.


Why thank you. I'm glad you noticed. 

Now go burn your saddlebag. You'll thank me for it.


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> Actually, I find it more entertaining that people need to defend their use of a saddle bag, especially by commenting that pros occasionally use them.
> 
> Who's the insecure one when you need to post an article about a pro using a saddle bag and frame pump to make yourself feel better?


Except I didn't post that and I never cited a pro's use of it. I also never told you you were wrong.

I def think your the insecure one.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

bottecchia_eja said:


> The Bartali gear ON a Celeste bike!
> 
> This whole saddle bag vs. jersey pocket debate seems silly, at best. People have different needs and if a saddle bag helps, more power to them.
> 
> ...


Sadly, with Adam Yauch's death, people will be blasting Beastie Boys "tributes" everywhere. I suggest removing the batteries from their gizmo at the coffee stop and toss them in the nearest sewer.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> Except I didn't post that and I never cited a pro's use of it. I also never told you you were wrong.
> 
> I def think your the insecure one.


If you're not insecure, why do you find the need to defend your use of a saddle nutsack?


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> You don't need that much crap on ANY ride.


At least two rides I can think of where I used everything I listed I carry.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> At least two rides I can think of where I used everything I listed I carry.


Two out of what...10,000? 

That's why I carry a phone: for exceptional circumstances. I'd rather not tote along my entire toolbox on every ride "just in case" and I'm not giving out tubes, patches, etc to random strangers on the road. No need to carry 5 pounds of crap in a saddle bag.


----------



## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

So having firmly established that saddle bags are like truck nuts. Are handle bars baskets permitted? Or wedge packs wedged into bottle cages? How about streamers?


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Marc said:


> So having firmly established that saddle bags are like truck nuts. Are handle bars baskets permitted? Or wedge packs wedged into bottle cages? How about streamers?


Baskets are non aero. Bottle cages are for bottles. Streamers are fine if they're pink.


----------



## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> Baskets are non aero. Bottle cages are for bottles. Streamers are fine if they're pink.


But if there are two cages, and you're only using one? Surely an empty bottle cage is less aero than a wedge jammed in it. I don't think The Rules cover this problem.


----------



## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

robdamanii said:


> Baskets are non aero. .


as are stuffed pockets.


----------



## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

den bakker said:


> as are stuffed pockets.


On the front or the back?


----------



## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Marc said:


> On the front or the back?


wait, was the spare tube between his moobs? that might actually improve the aerodynamics.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Marc said:


> On the front or the back?


That's a rolled up tube sock, not a tube.


----------



## MarkS (Feb 3, 2004)

Ridgetop said:


> Been blessed with the ability to eat a half dead opossum and still ride another 50 miles five minutes later. I pretty much eat my way through rides! :thumbsup:


But, can you eat a fully stuffed 1000+ calorie Chipotle burrito and then ride another 50 (or even 30 miles)? I made that mistake last year. :cryin: I generally am blessed with the same ability you have to eat through a ride, But, I do have my limits. 

BTW: We don't eat opossum in these parts, but I am told that muskrat is a specialty of the Eastern Shore of Maryland.


----------



## Sylint (Jul 27, 2009)

redlude97 said:


> I guess horner must have caved into The Rules


or you failed to read the article and realized it was about how he trains not races.


----------



## Andrew L (Apr 20, 2011)

This is a funny thread  I personally ride with a saddlebag and have even run out of tubes and co2 cartridges on a ride (my BIL got 2 flats back to back and his mini-pump broke). It's rare that I ever need it but it was frustrating to have to cut our ride short because we didn't have enough extras and only rode 9 miles  I prefer to be prepared so I can keep riding. Also, I don't see how y'all have room for tubes, co2, etc in your jerseys. My right pocket is for my phone and keys, middle is for 3rd water bottle (I live in Texas so its hot and I drink a ton) and the left is for snacks.


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> If you're not insecure, why do you find the need to defend your use of a saddle nutsack?


Actually Im not defending it. Nor am I insisting you have to use it. Nor am I telling you your wrong or making silly claims about much the stuff in your pockets weight (5 pounds in my saddle bag really?).

I can't tell if you act this way because you enjoy (trying) to make people mad or if its because you really are deluded enough to think you can make a definitive ruling on what is entire subject. Either way I pity you seems like a tiring (for you and those around you) way to be.


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> Actually Im not defending it. Nor am I insisting you have to use it. Nor am I telling you your wrong or making silly claims about much the stuff in your pockets weight (5 pounds in my saddle bag really?).
> 
> I can't tell if you act this way because you enjoy (trying) to make people mad or if its because you really are deluded enough to think you can make a definitive ruling on what is entire subject. Either way I pity you seems like a tiring (for you and those around you) way to be.


Says the guy who's repeatedly taking the bait. 

Again, if you didn't care about your use of a silly saddle bag, why are you defending it so vehemently?


----------



## Andrew L (Apr 20, 2011)

I will concede that it looks much better to not have a saddlebag but they are more functional for me. To each his own.


----------



## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> Sadly, with Adam Yauch's death, people will be blasting Beastie Boys "tributes" everywhere. I suggest removing the batteries from their gizmo at the coffee stop and toss them in the nearest sewer.



Disposing of the batteries won't work, Mr. fred carries spares in a huge saddle bag. :mad2:

I am thinking that my only hope is to sacrfice my vintage Silca pump and pull a Cinzano-team maneuver as illustrated in Breaking Away. 

Maybe then we will have some peace and quiet in our next ride. :thumbsup:


----------



## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

bottecchia_eja said:


> Disposing of the batteries won't work, Mr. fred carries spares in a huge saddle bag. :mad2:
> 
> I am thinking that my only hope is to sacrfice my vintage Silca pump and pull a Cinzano-team maneuver as illustrated in Breaking Away.
> 
> Maybe then we will have some peace and quiet in our next ride. :thumbsup:


Dude, don't sacrifice the Silca. Go buy a cheap-o at the LBS for said Cinzano-esque maneuver.


----------



## Love Commander (Aug 20, 2009)

Saddlebags for me 'cause when I stash my Hotpockets in my jersey, all the hot grease runs down my back, which sounds sexy, but isn't in reality.


----------



## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

This thread is already into its sixth page, and we still haven't discussed one of the primary load-bearing pillars of non-Freddism: shaving the legs. Does Horner shave?


----------



## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

wim said:


> Been done. Back when shifting wasn't so reliable, many pro bikes had those disks, like this 1948 Galletti. And I saw dork disks on a few bikes ridden in Paris-Roubaix back in the mid-1970s. Don't know about now.


It looks like the lower level is there for shifting. What's the upper lever for?

*Edit:* Oh, I got it! The rear end has no pulleys to pick up the slack in the chain. So the rider had to move the rear axle back and forth simultaneously with shifting cogs. The longer lever is a QR of sorts, but it is supposed to be used on the run (!). I'm not sure about the precise procedure though...


----------



## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> Dude, don't sacrifice the Silca. Go buy a cheap-o at the LBS for said Cinzano-esque maneuver.



Good advice! :thumbsup:


----------



## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

Acceptable?


----------



## uncreative (Sep 28, 2011)

i wouldn't ride with someone who doesn't have a saddlebag and a pump. it says a lot of things about a rider, none of them good.


----------



## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

uncreative said:


> i wouldn't ride with someone who doesn't have a saddlebag and a pump. it says a lot of things about a rider, none of them good.


hear that....?

it's the sound of people not giving a crap about who you'll ride with.


----------



## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

MarkS said:


> But, can you eat a fully stuffed 1000+ calorie Chipotle burrito and then ride another 50 (or even 30 miles)? I made that mistake last year. :cryin: I generally am blessed with the same ability you have to eat through a ride, But, I do have my limits.
> 
> BTW: We don't eat opossum in these parts, but I am told that muskrat is a specialty of the Eastern Shore of Maryland.


Mark, look at my newest ride report. That's only 1/2 the sandwich and the coke isn't in the picture. And yes, I ate everything but the two water bottles and still climbed Luther ten minutes later! :thumbsup:


----------



## Magsdad (Jun 29, 2005)

You're all doing it wrong.


----------



## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

It's all about pockets man. Pockets are heaven, 
pockets are neat,
pockets are better than a bag under your seat.

Pockets are sexy,
Pockets are great,
Pockets hold everything you'll need to cross the whole state!

Bags are for Freds,
Bags ruin your ride,
Bags should never be on your seat’s underside!

Bags are for losers,
Bags are boat anchors,
Bags should only be on bikes ridden by wankers!

Pockets hold jackets, food, tools, and more,
Pockets hold all that you will ever need,
Pockets guarantee that you will succeed!

Yes, pockets are super,
Until that day,
When you run into two flats, your cylinder fails, and your start to pray!

For why or why did you not bring that bag,
With two tubes, two cylinders,
To get you out of this snag!

But a cell phone you have,
Deep in your pocket’s great store,
Too bad you’re a 100 miles from a cell tower or more!

No problem you scream,
I’ll just wait for the next person with a pocket,
Too bad they just passed you like a rocket!

So now that you stand all alone,
In a frightful mood,
Just sit and realize that you are screwed!

So cry if you want,
Scream if you’d like,
But for God’s sake, just get out there and ride you f^ckin’ bike!


Thank you, thank you. I'll be all night. And for a modest fee I can do a show at your club.


----------



## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

Magsdad said:


> You're all doing it wrong.


Taking turns on that thing on a downhill would be a biotch.


----------



## Andrew L (Apr 20, 2011)

Ridgetop said:


> It's all about pockets man. Pockets are heaven,
> pockets are neat,
> pockets are better than a bag under your seat.
> 
> ...


That's great!


----------



## snapdragen (Jan 28, 2004)

Andrew L said:


> That's great!


Indeed.


----------



## Andrew L (Apr 20, 2011)

snapdragen said:


> Indeed.


Wow! That looks like a backpack...


----------



## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

Snap uses a saddle bag = discussion over.


----------



## superjesus (Jul 26, 2010)

snapdragen said:


> Indeed.


I want that bag. It's beautiful! :thumbsup:


----------



## davelikestoplay (May 27, 2010)

The internet: Where agreeing to disagree goes to die


----------



## Magsdad (Jun 29, 2005)

Aindreas said:


> Snap uses a saddle bag = discussion over.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Aindreas again.


----------



## dphoenix (Nov 11, 2007)

looigi said:


> ".. Horner rides with a saddle bag, even when followed by the team car. And he carries a pump, strapped to said saddle bag. His seat tube bottle cage is filled with a spare tubular, just in case.
> 
> For another thing, Horner rides a taller head tube than Trek’s “pro” geometry that the company calls H1. ..."
> 
> ...


I bet that Fred will out ride you.


----------



## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Marc said:


> Acceptable?


That's cheating! ;-D


----------



## Fireform (Dec 15, 2005)

No saddlebag, no phone, no spares no food = poseur who never rides alone and can be counted on to bum whatever he needs from me.


----------



## xjbaylor (Dec 28, 2006)

uncreative said:


> i wouldn't ride with someone who doesn't have a saddlebag and a pump. it says a lot of things about a rider, none of them good.


Amazing that you can use the absence of a saddle bag to judge the character of a rider so quickly. I don't have a saddle bag on my bike right now, but I have all the tools and spares that I need, plenty of food, a cell phone (so that I can call someone not so quick to judge me if I am actually in need) and no reason to bum anything off of you. I happen to have used both and prefer the jersey pocket approach.

Based on your post and twisted logic people could make some pretty negative assumptions about those who _do_ ride with a saddlebag. 

Luckily, most cyclists judge others based on things that stand up to at least minimal scrutiny.


----------



## Local Hero (Jul 8, 2010)

Hah. This is a hilarious debate. 

I use a saddle bag on longer or more relaxed rides. 
I have three different bags (and tools/tubes) for three different bikes. 
The bag could easily be carried in my jersey pocket. 
I've also used a small pouch in my pocket. 

But why worry? 

Style? 
Either pass me or go F yourself if you're worried about my style. 



I don't use the saddle bags for hammerfests or races. 
In races I even take off one of my bottle cages. 
This is more psychological than anything.


----------



## Local Hero (Jul 8, 2010)

redlude97 said:


> I guess horner must have caved into The Rules


Is that EPO-Boost™ in his right hand?


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## xjbaylor (Dec 28, 2006)

Ridgetop said:


>


1. Your saddle isn't level
2. That bike looks amazing
3. Can I just have a bite of your sammich?


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## Ridgetop (Mar 1, 2005)

xjbaylor said:


> 1. Your saddle isn't level
> 2. That bike looks amazing
> 3. Can I just have a bite of your sammich?


Stupid Aliante Seat is more comfortable for me with the nose up. Go figure! 

I like this bike much better than my plastic wonder bike. Even if it is six pounds heavier overall.

No one gets a bite of my sammich!!


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## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> They ride what fits their body.
> If it would slow them down, they wouldn't ride it.


According to Nick Legan over at velonews (previously a mechanic for Garmin and Radioshack), many pros do run slammed stems because it's "cool" rather than it because it really fits their body.


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## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

Pretty much. Same thing goes for tires, riding narrow aero wheels on the front and wide on the back when their are no cross winds etc. People want to "look pro" even if the "look" actually hurts performance.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

I don't mind what methods of carrying their stuff anyone uses. I personally use a small saddle bag and my jersey pockets. Saddle bag is not much longer/wider than my iPhone, and about 2.5 inches tall. I keep 2 CO2 cartridges, the inflator head, spare tube, tire levers, multitool and a few other small things in it. In my jersey I keep my phone/money in a ziplock just incase, and my cliff bars and/or gels and fig newtons in the other 2 pockets. 

Since I use something, it is therefore useful to me, regardless of what other possible methods exist. 

When I see another cyclist, I'm too busy just give a little wave or head nod to notice things like bags or brand of bike etc.

*edit* as a side note, sometimes when I snowboard, I carry a small Dakine backpack that fits a few extra layers, bit of food etc and a Platypus bladder. Sometimes I don't use it. could cram most of the stuff in my board jacket pockets, but don't feel the need to stuff all the pockets full.


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## mpre53 (Oct 25, 2011)

redlude97 said:


> I guess horner must have caved into The Rules


The dude in the Bissell kit didn't (check out sunglass paddle arms under helmet straps).


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## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

I never understood sunglass arms over straps. If they fit your helmet they should be under. What schlub wants to have to take their glasses off them put them back on to take off your helmet.

I get the cats doing it when their sunglass sponsor's design doesn't get along with their helmet sponsor's design. Beyond that though it is fffing retarded.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

badge118 said:


> I never understood sunglass arms over straps. If they fit your helmet they should be under. What schlub wants to have to take their glasses off them put them back on to take off your helmet.
> 
> I get the cats doing it when their sunglass sponsor's design doesn't get along with their helmet sponsor's design. Beyond that though it is fffing retarded.


My helmet straps sit flush with my temples so I've always worn my glasses over the arms even before I knew it was a 'rule'. Plus I put my helmet on and then don't take it off until I'm back home after my ride, it has never been a hindrance having to take off my glasses first. How often are you taking off your helmet?


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## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

Mine always fit flush as well. I make a point of making sure my straps are always "proper" because I fit the helmets for the kids in the program I run the same way...good example and all of that.

That said I have never had an issue getting sunglasses to fit underneath. Then again I always pick sunglasses that work with the helmets I am wearing. As for how often I remove my helmet, how is that even relevant? From a purely practical stand point even if i is only at the end of a ride or a water stop (I tend to do ling rides where I need to stop for water at least once) what makes more sense... sunglasses off> helmet off> sunglasses back on> sunglasses off> helmet on> sunglasses off... or... helmet off>helmet on?

Just saying


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

GabooN85 said:


> How often are you taking off your helmet?


My glasses are prescription so I'm taking my helmet off quite a bit more often than the glasses. 
So prescription glasses wear, Rule 1...glasses worn under helmet straps.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

Was just curious, wasn't sure if people were taking off their helmet multiple times during a long ride. Mine tends to stay on. I don't care how other people wear their helmet and glasses, was just wondering where the 'glasses over the straps' being negative stance was coming from or being a 'schlub' for doing so.


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## willieboy (Nov 27, 2010)

My helmet rarely comes off until I'm home but my glasses may come off for a multitude of reasons so I wear them outside of my straps. It's more comfortable do me.


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

GabooN85 said:


> Was just curious, wasn't sure if people were taking off their helmet multiple times during a long ride. Mine tends to stay on. I don't care how other people wear their helmet and glasses, was just wondering where the 'glasses over the straps' being negative stance was coming from or being a 'schlub' for doing so.


Glasses on then helmet on. Seems pretty straightforward stuff to me.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

Next topic: Toilet paper (over or under)?


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

ph0enix said:


> Next topic: Toilet paper (over or under)?


Over of course...that's how the pros do it. 

Next question?


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## superjesus (Jul 26, 2010)

ph0enix said:


> Next topic: Toilet paper (over or under)?


What are you trying to do to this thread? This isn't PO!


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

bottecchia_eja said:


> Glasses on then helmet on. Seems pretty straightforward stuff to me.


Not sure how that is a direct response to what I said. You guys are acting like I don't understand the logistics of how it works. I was just wondering why the negativity towards the opposite way of doing it.


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## ph0enix (Aug 12, 2009)

bottecchia_eja said:


> Over of course...that's how the pros do it.


Agreed!


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Helmet on, glasses on. 

Glasses come off and get stuck in helmet vents frequently. NFW am I going to fumble with shoving them under helmet straps.


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## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

GabooN85 said:


> Not sure how that is a direct response to what I said. You guys are acting like I don't understand the logistics of how it works. I was just wondering why the negativity towards the opposite way of doing it.


I don't think anyone has an issue with the act. Heck I used to have to do it when I wore Oakley Half Jackets. The problem some of us have is when people say they do it because "it's pro." The context for "pro" they use is not simply they are emulating a hero, rather more in the slang context of "right" or "better." Heck the origin of this thread was about what was "pro" in the later, as much as the former, context.

When people try to rationalize it people get bent. "My straps are flush". So are mine but I wear either Smith Pivlocks or Rudy's that fit with flush straps so what's your point? "How often do you take you helmet off"? Again what's your point? Just say "hey I think it's cool" or "I like my oakley's and the arms don't work" and people would have no issues me thinks.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

glasses over straps.

there's a similar argument in diving...mask under hood or over...I'm an 'under'...

so, go figure that one out.

there's an excellent reason for each method I use.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

badge118 said:


> I don't think anyone has an issue with the act. Heck I used to have to do it when I wore Oakley Half Jackets. The problem some of us have is when people say they do it because "it's pro." The context for "pro" they use is not simply they are emulating a hero, rather more in the slang context of "right" or "better." Heck the origin of this thread was about what was "pro" in the later, as much as the former, context.
> 
> When people try to rationalize it people get bent. "My straps are flush". So are mine but I wear either Smith Pivlocks or Rudy's that fit with flush straps so what's your point? "How often do you take you helmet off"? Again what's your point? Just say "hey I think it's cool" or "I like my oakley's and the arms don't work" and people would have no issues me thinks.


yeah I see what you are saying now. I had tried to make it understood that I was doing it before being 'in the know' about rules. I just have a cheaper Giro helmet and until I recently got some Radars (had issues with glasses constantly moving down my nose all the time) I had been just using department store cheap pairs of glasses. With the Radars now and the wide part of the hinge, not sure I could wear them under the straps if I wanted. 

I agree that people shouldn't do something because it is pro (unless perhaps there is good reason pros do it?). I for one use a saddle bag  Any pros riding an all aluminum bike?


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Several Vacansoleil riders were on aluminum at Paris-Roubaix.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

robdamanii said:


> Glasses come off and get stuck in helmet vents frequently. NFW am I going to fumble with shoving them under helmet straps.


For me, I find the opposite. The temples tend to slip under the straps automatically and it takes additional care to get them over the straps. And I prefer the glasses over the straps because there's a bit more wind noise with the straps held out by the glasses.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

looigi said:


> For me, I find the opposite. The temples tend to slip under the straps automatically and it takes additional care to get them over the straps. And I prefer the glasses over the straps because there's a bit more wind noise with the straps held out by the glasses.


I never thought of the wind noise from the straps being over the frames (probably because I never do that.) I also have a narrower face, so the arms naturally slip over the straps well.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

kbwh said:


> Several Vacansoleil riders were on aluminum at Paris-Roubaix.


Really? I was kidding since I have a lower end all aluminium bike. Why would they have used aluminum?


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

GabooN85 said:


> Really? I was kidding since I have a lower end all aluminium bike. Why would they have used aluminum?


The "pavee" are hard on carbon frames. Bianchi supplied the team with their Impulso model, the Impulso is Bianchi's hight-tech aluminum bike.


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

GabooN85 said:


> Not sure how that is a direct response to what I said. You guys are acting like I don't understand the logistics of how it works. I was just wondering why the negativity towards the opposite way of doing it.


Not really a response per se. Just adding to the silliness that has become of this over vs. under, saddle bag vs. jersey pocket debate.

Peace out!


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## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

I'd been using a seat bag since I started road cycling a couple of years ago. It was just how I'd done things and at first it made sense: I started out without a jersey, then had a couple of low end jerseys with poorly designed pockets, so tools, tubes, and food went in the seat bag. Then I got a better jersey and food, keys, and phone went there, but the seat bag was "necessary" to hold my tools.

But then I got to thinking a couple of days ago, after reading this thread: Rob is usually right about these things. Is that seat bag really useful? So I culled a couple of redundant and/or never used tools from my on-the-bike collection, ditched the seat bag, and just used my jersey pockets.

And lo and behold, all my stuffs fit neatly into my jersey pockets with room to spare. Even on long rides when I carry two tubes or pack arm warmers for later. It wasn't uncomfortable or nothing...it just made it far easier to access stuff. Especially after I swapped out the stock saddle for a Selle Italia Flite, which just doesn't seem designed to work with a seat bag.

I haven't lost any functionality, and I look and feel more streamlined and efficient. Plus my bike looks cooler. Which really shouldn't be a factor, I suppose, but it is neat to have a slick-looking bike.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

bottecchia_eja said:


> The "pavee" are hard on carbon frames. Bianchi supplied the team with their Impulso model, the Impulso is Bianchi's hight-tech aluminum bike.


Tell that to the rest of the peloton who used carbon frames and carbon tubular wheels.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Do what works for you and makes you happy. Don't call other people "wrong" who do things differently, especially if it doesn't affect you. Ignore other people who say that you are "wrong" if you are doing what works for you.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

thechriswebb said:


> Do what works for you and makes you happy. *Don't call other people "wrong" who do things differently, especially if it doesn't affect you.* Ignore other people who say that you are "wrong" if you are doing what works for you.


If we all did that, there would be nothing to discuss in PO at all.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

bottecchia_eja said:


> The "pavee" are hard on carbon frames. Bianchi supplied the team with their Impulso model, the Impulso is Bianchi's hight-tech aluminum bike.


Based on the fundamental properties of the materials, that seems backward.


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## GabooN85 (Mar 7, 2012)

Yeah I thought Carbon would be better at soaking up the bumps? I should loan out my all aluminum Jamis to Boonen next year


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## BeginnerCycling (Jun 4, 2011)

bottecchia_eja said:


> Not really a response per se. Just adding to the silliness that has become of this over vs. under, saddle bag vs. jersey pocket debate.


I thought everyone knew all that stuff belongs in your hydration backpack!


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## bottecchia_eja (Jul 18, 2010)

looigi said:


> Based on the fundamental properties of the materials, that seems backward.


Do a Google search on "broken carbon frames Paris-roubaix."

I have a friend who lives in France. Every year he rideson of the "l'etape" from the TdF. For those rides he uses his carbon Scott. He also rides Paris-Roubaix, he won't take his carbon bike for that, instead he uses his old aluminum bike.


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## PCCharger (Feb 28, 2011)

Ridgetop said:


> Lycra makes anyone look hot. Just ask her!


Gator fans Jorts and Lycra is all they know.


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## Handbrake (May 29, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> If we all did that, there would be nothing to discuss in PO at all.


We've obviously hit upon a subject that touches your nerve.



robdamanii said:


> saddle bags are as awful looking as truck nutz
> 
> I refuse to sit for 20 minutes pumping a frame pump like I'm rubbing one out on the side of the road
> 
> ...


Feel free to continue to use the thread as your couch, much cheaper than a real one.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Handbrake said:


> We've obviously hit upon a subject that touches your nerve.
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to continue to use the thread as your couch, much cheaper than a real one.


Howdy sock, how are you?


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## Handbrake (May 29, 2012)

No, just a quick study. Though the subject matter is quite obvious.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Handbrake said:


> No, just a quick study. Though the subject matter is quite obvious.


It sure is quite obvious. I have an opinion that saddle bags are hideous, worthless accessories and people who use them are silly. 

Got a problem with that?


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## Handbrake (May 29, 2012)

robdamanii said:


> It sure is quite obvious. I have an opinion that saddle bags are hideous, worthless accessories and people who use them are silly.
> 
> Got a problem with that?


Not at all, though I'm curious about your plans if I do.

You don't think 5 references to male genetalia, in a thread about an entirely unrelated subject, suggest some other cause for your distaste? One would maybe be understandable given the goofy nature of the thread, but your thoughts drifted there 5 different times.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Handbrake said:


> Not at all, though I'm curious about your plans if I do.
> 
> You don't think 5 references to male genetalia, in a thread about an entirely unrelated subject, suggest some other cause for your distaste? One would maybe be understandable given the goofy nature of the thread, but your thoughts drifted there 5 different times.


The comparison to truck-nutz is too easy to pass up.


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## Fireform (Dec 15, 2005)

In the event I fall, I don't want to land on a pump, CO2 cartridge, or tire lever, let alone both. Plus it's a good place to hang my flasher.


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