# Lighten It Up - Wheels/Frame/Ideas



## Styles (Sep 22, 2013)

Sup Guys!!
I recently purchased a 2013 Jamis Nova Race (current specs below) and the bike has been great so far. It can pull some serious speeds on the downhills (haven't pushed it pass 90kmh) but is a bit sluggish on the uphills. This is where I need your help, advice and ideas.

I know the bike isn't the lightest kid on the block and maybe a cyclocross isn't meant to compete against these light full carbon road bikes, but I'm sure trying my best. I'm currently running it with stock Vittoria Cross XN 700 x 32c tires but switching to Continental GP 4000S which are on the mail. This should help a bit with some drag but I might still need to lighten it up to help with these uphills.

I am on a tight budget which limits my options (if I had tons to spare I would have bought the Super Nova Team from the get go lol) but I would like your suggestions as to what upgrades or modifications I can do to help a bit. Is a new light carbon frame the only way or should I go for some new wheels? If so, what wheels would you recommend that are worth the investment but won't break the bank?

Thanks, I look forward to hear what you guys come up with and any advices. 

*Specs:*


*Frame

*

7005 aluminum double-butted main frame, hydro-formed top tube
1 1/8-1.5" tapered head tube, PressFit 30 BB shell, 34.9mm seat tube, disc brake mounts, replaceable derailleur hanger, single eyelet


*Fork*


Jamis Cross, full carbon composite, 1.5" hollow formed crown, monocoque one-piece forming technology, integrated CNC'd cable cradles with post disc brake mounts, fender eyelets, carbon dropouts with stainless axle interfaces


*Headset*
FSA, integrated, sealed bearing, 1 1/8-1 1/2"


*Wheels*


Alex XC23 eyeleted disc specific rim, 32H, Formula alloy disc road hubs and 14g stainless steel spokes


*Tires*


Vittoria, Cross XN, 700 x 32c


*Derailleurs*


Shimano Tiagra RD-4600 GS rear and Tiagra FD-4600 front with 34.9mm alloy clamp


*Shiftlevers*


Shimano Tiagra ST-4600 Dual Control STI, 20-Speed


*Chain*


SRAM PC1031 w/Powerlock


*Cassette*

Shimano 10-Speed 12-30T


*Crankset*
FSA Omega compact double for PF30, 50/34T, 170mm (48/51) 172.5mm (54/56) 175mm (58/61)
*
BB Set
*

FSA PressFit 30
*
Pedals*


Shimano PD-M520 SPD

*Brakeset*


BB7 Mechanical cable actuated disc brake with 160mm G2 CleanSweep rotors and Tiagra ST-4600 brake levers


*Handlebar*


Ritchey Logic, 6061 aluminum, 31.8 x 400mm (48/51), 420mm (54/56), 440mm (58/61)


*Stem*
Ritchey Road, 3D forged 6061 alloy, 6° x 90mm (48/51), 100mm (54/56), 120mm (58/61)

*Seat Post*


Ritchey Road, 31.6 x 300mm, alloy clamp with cromo seat pin


*Saddle
*

Fizik Antares VS with K:ium Rails - 209g 


*Size*

54cm











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## gospastic (Nov 8, 2008)

Start with wheels. Every stock disc wheelset I've ever had has been north of 2000g. You can easily shave a pound with a new wheelset.


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

gospastic said:


> Start with wheels. Every stock disc wheelset I've ever had has been north of 2000g. You can easily shave a pound with a new wheelset.


Yes wheels. But good wheels aren't cheap. You can find bargains used but because of the disc brakes you have to be quite sure that the 29er wheelset will work for your purposes. NoTubes Iron Cross is one way to go. For road tires, they do NOT recommend road tubeless but just standard clincher + tube. For CX, there are a lot of tires alleged to work well tubeless.


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## Wookiebiker (Sep 5, 2005)

I have a Nova Race that I use as a commuter bike ... the reality is, it's not going to get a whole lot lighter with out spending serious $$$$, which would make buying a new bike cheaper.

With that said ... replace the wheels ... they are complete junk. I broke 4 rear spokes in the first 300 - 400 miles then rebuilt it with descent spokes and no problems with the stock wheels after that (they are a back up set now). The Stans Iron-Cross wheelset would be a good choice for a not too expensive replacement with a good, light wheelset.

In the end I replaced my wheels with a nice hand-built set composed of: H Son Plus Archetype rims, DB 14/15 Sapim spokes, White Industries hubs and 28c Conti Gatorskin tires. A great wheelset that should be a fair amount lighter, but in the end only took about 1oz off the weight ... however it does feel much more secure/solid and the bike feels like it accelerates/climbs better now.

The crank is a "PIG" ... By switching out to a Praxis PF BB30 adapter and putting on a spare 105 crank I had, I dropped nearly 1/2 a pound. It also eliminated a "LOT" of annoying creaking from the bottom bracket! The silence is "Golden" and worth the upgrade alone 

Beyond those two items ... seat post, saddle, bar, stem, etc. are all areas with heavy components, but you won't get huge benefits from replacing them with lighter parts (though stock saddles tend to weight a lot).

I'm guessing frame and fork wise ... the fork is very heavy, though still a little flexy. I good fork would likely drop 1/2 a pound off the bike, add some stiffness ... but would be $$$$.

Overall ... stick with replacing wheels and replace the crank/bottom bracket ... other than that, leave it alone, enjoy the bike ... or buy a better bike that starts with a lighter frame/fork.


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## Randy99CL (Mar 27, 2013)

Wheels and tires will definitely make the biggest difference.

The combo on my entry-level Trek was really heavy with Formula Hubs, 32 straight spokes and 550g tires, 130g tubes.
I upgraded with Easton 29ers with 25mm Vittoria tires and took off three pounds. My new wheels alone weigh 1628g.

If you can buy from Nashbar they have the Stan's ZTR Alpha 340 wheelset for $399. Listed weight is 1520g; that is amazingly light.
Stan's No-Tubes ZTR Alpha 340 Disc Road Wheelset - Road Bike Wheels / Wheelsets


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## spdntrxi (Jul 25, 2013)

On my wifes' bike I've changed..(2013 Ruby Comp Compact)

1. Alloy bar/stem to integrated bar stem in carbon.. didn't weigh
2. Seatpost... carbon to another carbon.. didn't weigh.. probably similar
3. Wheels.. DT Axis 3.0 w/Tiagra Cass to Fusee SLX23 with ultregra cass. Dropped more then a pound+
4. Tires.. specialized esporta ? to Continential 4000s 700x25 didn't weigh but 4000s are way lighter.

Bike was 19.1 lbs and now is 17.06 pounds with cages, computer mounts etc. Bike still has a heavy seat ~300g gel type, looking to get a women specific type under 200g,so that will bring it below 17 for sure. She's kinda a new roadie, so platform pedels are still on it too..so light clipless will eventually cut even more. Ultimate goal in bring this down to low 16's and I think it's within reach.


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## demonrider (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm in a similar place, and will be starting with the wheels. Fortunately I have a decent wheelset from a previous build, just have to upgrade the hubs and it should be less than 1600g. After that I want to upgrade the seatpost and stem, handlebars are already being swapped tomorrow. That should get the bike to a decent weight, somewhere around 17.5-18lb is fine by me. (for an alloy framed bike)


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## Styles (Sep 22, 2013)

Thanks for the quick reply guys, truly appreciate it. Below are the independent replies to your posts.



gospastic said:


> Start with wheels. Every stock disc wheelset I've ever had has been north of 2000g. You can easily shave a pound with a new wheelset.


That's what I'm hoping .



pretender said:


> Yes wheels. But good wheels aren't cheap. You can find bargains used but because of the disc brakes you have to be quite sure that the 29er wheelset will work for your purposes. NoTubes Iron Cross is one way to go. For road tires, they do NOT recommend road tubeless but just standard clincher + tube. For CX, there are a lot of tires alleged to work well tubeless.


Yeah I imagined they would not be cheap but trying to find out what's the best deal around and what you guys recommend. I looked up your suggestion but my Grand Prix 4000S tires already on their way so a clincher type rim is what I'm looking for. Do they make the Iron Cross in clinchers? Any other suggestions at a reasonable price?



Randy99CL said:


> Wheels and tires will definitely make the biggest difference.
> 
> The combo on my entry-level Trek was really heavy with Formula Hubs, 32 straight spokes and 550g tires, 130g tubes.
> I upgraded with Easton 29ers with 25mm Vittoria tires and took off three pounds. My new wheels alone weigh 1628g.
> ...


Thanks for the suggestion and link, but I want to stick with clinchers as my tires already on their way and want the simplicity of tubes. Any other suggestions or ideas for an awesome deal like the one you recommended? Thanks .



spdntrxi said:


> On my wifes' bike I've changed..(2013 Ruby Comp Compact)
> 
> 1. Alloy bar/stem to integrated bar stem in carbon.. didn't weigh
> 2. Seatpost... carbon to another carbon.. didn't weigh.. probably similar
> ...


I can switch my seat post to carbon as I've found some good deals online but didn't think it makes such a big difference as my current seat post isn't really that heavy to begin with. I looked up the Fusee SLX23 and while these are clinchers, they a bit steep in price. At a $600+ price range, I could be talking about a new frame here. As for the tires, yep GP 4000S already on their way, will let you know how they work out. Thanks .



demonrider said:


> I'm in a similar place, and will be starting with the wheels. Fortunately I have a decent wheelset from a previous build, just have to upgrade the hubs and it should be less than 1600g. After that I want to upgrade the seatpost and stem, handlebars are already being swapped tomorrow. That should get the bike to a decent weight, somewhere around 17.5-18lb is fine by me. (for an alloy framed bike)


If I could drop it to even a flat 20Lb's I would be stoked lol. It seems everyone agrees the wheels are the biggest factor and first thing I should upgrade. Now if I could figure out which wheels to get at an affordable price.



Wookiebiker said:


> I have a Nova Race that I use as a commuter bike ... the reality is, it's not going to get a whole lot lighter with out spending serious $$$$, which would make buying a new bike cheaper.
> 
> With that said ... replace the wheels ... they are complete junk. I broke 4 rear spokes in the first 300 - 400 miles then rebuilt it with descent spokes and no problems with the stock wheels after that (they are a back up set now). The Stans Iron-Cross wheelset would be a good choice for a not too expensive replacement with a good, light wheelset.
> 
> ...



Ouch that hurts, your commuter is my race bike lol. I had the same problem with the crankset, had to open it up, clean up the little lube it had in there and put some Phil Grease, no more creaking sound so far. I didn't think about replacing the crankcase, actually thought it was good quality but I guess I was wrong lol. You recommend a 105 crank case? Any other suggestions? As for wheels, same as I have mentioned above what do you recommend that are not tubeless but clinchers to go with my GP 4000S on their way?

I switched out my saddle already as I put on the specs, and have an Fizik Antares VS which is only 209 grams. 

Once again thanks for all the replies and can't wait to see your new suggestions and ideas.


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## spdntrxi (Jul 25, 2013)

There is a set of fusee on eBay at 250... I got mine for 265 in great shape..


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

Styles said:


> I looked up your suggestion but my Grand Prix 4000S tires already on their way so a clincher type rim is what I'm looking for. Do they make the Iron Cross in clinchers?


The Iron Cross is a clincher rim. AFAIK you could run any road clincher 23mm or wider on them. I would double-check with their customer service before buying a set, but I'm 95% certain that road clinchers work fine on them, as long as they are NOT road tubeless.

I realize all this clincher/tubeless/tubular stuff is a bit confusing.


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## Wookiebiker (Sep 5, 2005)

Styles said:


> Ouch that hurts, your commuter is my race bike lol. I had the same problem with the crankset, had to open it up, clean up the little lube it had in there and put some Phil Grease, no more creaking sound so far. I didn't think about replacing the crankcase, actually thought it was good quality but I guess I was wrong lol. You recommend a 105 crank case? Any other suggestions? As for wheels, same as I have mentioned above what do you recommend that are not tubeless but clinchers to go with my GP 4000S on their way?


Taking out the BB and re-greasing will stop the creaking ... For a while ... however, it will return! It's a curse with "Press Fit" bottom bracket cups. I used the Praxis adapter, which converts it to a Shimano BB (which means you need to run a Shimano crank or Shimano "Compatible" crank with the Praxis adapter).

As for cranks ... as I said, the 105 is around 6oz - 8oz lighter than the stock crank. You can find a used one online for pretty cheap, but I wouldn't limit myself to that crank if I were upgrading and looking at used cranks. You can probably find a year or two old Dura Ace for about the price of a new 105 crank (just look for one with cross gearing if possible).

Also ... as mentioned already ... the Stan's wheels are all "Clincher" rims, they are tubless (not tubular) so you can run clincher tires. With the IronCross wheelset, it's a wider rim which is why they don't recommend road tubless tires on it, just Cross tubless tires (with sealant). The 340 and 400 wheelsets are a bit narrower than the IronCross and will work with any clincher tire (with tube or tubeless set up's).


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## Randy99CL (Mar 27, 2013)

Styles said:


> Thanks for the suggestion and link, but I want to stick with clinchers as my tires already on their way and want the simplicity of tubes.


Those Alpha 340s are clinchers and already setup for tubeless tires. Naturally, you can use tubes also.


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## demonrider (Jul 18, 2012)

Styles said:


> If I could drop it to even a flat 20Lb's I would be stoked lol. It seems everyone agrees the wheels are the biggest factor and first thing I should upgrade. Now if I could figure out which wheels to get at an affordable price.


I went and weighed my X-Bow at the LBS today, it is 23.8lb with full 105+CX50 crank, TRP Spyre alloy brakeset with 160mm rotors and a fizik arione saddle. Everything else is stock, that includes wheels, bars, stem and seatpost. 

Wheelset upgrade should remove at least 1.5lb. Another lb+ is going to drop with bar and stem upgrade. 200g reduction after seatpost upgrade. Finally, if I have cash left over by the end of next month, I might replace the fork as well, I might go with Whisky, if not the LBS can easily get me X-Fire disc fork for not too bad a price. So yeah, I was exaggerating the 17lb figure; if I can get it to 18lb, I'm happy.

For wheels I'm going to use Velocity Blunt SL rims, they are cheap, tough and light at 420g (claimed). They are also 25mm wide, which I really like. For hubs, I'm not sure whether to go with Hope or Novatec. Hope will be heavier by some 60g but they are known for their quality and robustness. Novatec is the light, cheaper but non-blingy solution.


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## weiwentg (Feb 3, 2004)

I used to play the weight weenie game. It was fun. It also consumed a lot of $$ and time and it left me not really very much faster. Right now, I ride a steel frame and fork (the Gunnar Crosshairs in the 2013/14 bike thread). It hasn't slowed me down.

Get new wheels. Get wheels as expensive as you can afford but not insane. Something like White Industries hubs laced to H+Son Archetypes. And then leave it at that. The bike's spec is perfectly OK otherwise, and after upgrading the wheels you are at the point of diminishing returns weight vs dollar wise. Go lift some weights to cross train instead.


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## demonrider (Jul 18, 2012)

Oh I'm not trying to be a weight weenie, if I was I'd have gone with a X-Night frame instead of an inherently heavier alloy X-Bow. I am simply setting it up the way I'd want it set up. I've settled on Thomson stem/seatpost combo, fizik Arione saddle, 3T rotundo bars and the nicest wheelset I can afford for any bike I buy; just default behaviour now. I keep the original components around when/if I decide to sell the bike, put the stuff back on and call it stock when it's craigslist time.


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## tsunayoshi (Dec 3, 2009)

November Bicycles will do a 23mm clincher wheelset with disc hubs (assuming your frame has 135mm rear spacing). Less than $600 shipped w/ their standard disc hubs (Novatecs), and will probably come out around 1650gr. 28/28 2x for cross should be plenty sturdy (it works for mtb wheels...)

November Bicycles: Race smart. - FSW 23 Alloy Clinchers

My 1st bike was a Kona JTS, came with a tank set of Mavic Asksiums...swapped for Williams CX tubulars and dropped over a 1 pound. I now run November FSWCX (built with Major Tom tubulars), mine weigh 1485gr naked.

I would swap the crank next, you could knock close to 200gr off going to SRAM Force or similar. That's close to 1/2 lb.


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