# Vittoria Randonneur vs Armadillo vs Gatorskin?



## SixThree (Aug 28, 2012)

Hi all, thanks in advance for your comments. I just ordered a Windsor Fens from BD and would like to replace the tires right from the get go, since I've read mostly negatives about the Michelins they come with. And I understand I may want to replace the wheels as well, but that expense will have to wait a bit.)

I'd prefer to go wider to a 700c-28 as I plan mostly long road rides (and no races) so speed is not a desire but durability is most important.

I've read RBR and other forum posts about some tires, but wondered how these three specific tires would compare against each other. Or if you have another suggestion.

1. Vittoria Randonneur (reflective sides) -- decent price about 30 bucks +/- with puncture resistance.

2. Specialized Armadillos -- about 50 bucks online. People said they're heavy but are they heavier than the Randonneurs?

3. Continental Gatorskin -- about 70 bucks and up. Is this even made in a 28?

Would love to hear your opinions and stories. And let's be respectful of others' opinions. Thanks!


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

Of all the flat resistance tires, imo, the Gatorskins ride the best. You sacrifice some ride quality but the Ultra Gatorskins are a nice balance. Look at probikekit or ribble to save money.


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## mr_132 (Apr 26, 2009)

I can only talk about Gatorskins and on my different bikes I have them in 25/28/32c . The 28c's on my hybrid have been great and I can only think of one puncture I've had on them (which I think may have been a pinch flat due to me hurrying out and not checking tyre pressure). Loads of life in them.

As bigbill said above, look for PBK to have a sale, you can get them much cheaper. I would double check you can get the 28c's to fit on you new bike (they probably will), as there are some bikes (such as my road bike) that can only fit <25c.

All the best


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## SixThree (Aug 28, 2012)

I found a pair of Vittoria Randonneur 700/28's with side reflective on ebay for 29.99 ea. with free shipping. Seemed like a good deal. I'll post some feedback about them after I get them. 

Others please feel free to chime in with your experiences with these three brands of tires. Thanks!


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## dcgriz (Feb 13, 2011)

Between the Specialized Armadillos and the Conti Gatorskins I prefer the Gatorskins if durability is the choice criterion. My preference for winter, rough road riding goes to Conti GP 4S which is a training tire with performance similar to a racing tire. They both could be had from the UK online stores for about $40US ea.


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## Crawf (Oct 21, 2010)

Have used all 3...
-Gator's, the fastest of the 3, ok puncture protection, but very overrated in that respect, I'd opt for GP4000's instead.
-Rando's, best puncture protection easily, but you pay for it, not the best rolling resistance and you will feel it.
-Armadillo's, just don't bother, the worst tyres I have ever installed onto any wheel.


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## tuffguy1500 (Jul 17, 2008)

Having also used all three:

The Armadillo was easily the worst for me- it would slip out on me during super steep climbs in wet conditions, and around here, that's a no-go. 

Rando's- Meh. the sidewall was cool, but they rolled like pancake batter through sand. I rode them for over a year with just one flat. 

Gators- best of the three, i switched from the randonneur and a schwalbe marathon combo to the gatorskins and immediately felt the difference in effort i put in to go fast. Rolled the best out of the three, but they're far from the suppleness of my Zipp Tangente tubies or gp4k clinchers.

So basically, what Crawf said...


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## SixThree (Aug 28, 2012)

*Randonneurs follow up*

The pair of Randonneurs I ordered from ebay arrived yesterday. 30 bucks each with free shipping. I got 700x28s as I'm 6'3" and 220lbs (and dropping) and I want to do some long tours. Not into racing.

The Michelin 700x23 slicks and cheapo tubes that came with my BD Windsor Fens, like so many others have posted about stock wheels and tires, were pretty lame. Two flats in two days. One was a staple. Not like a heavy duty roofing staple. Like one you'd put in a tiny personal stapler or pull off of some tiny packaging. Went right through the Michelin, which when I took it off I discovered was little more than rubber coated canvas. Really flimsy, but I expected that as I bought the Fens mainly for the Shimano 105 components and not the tires, and even adding the cost of replacing them puts me $ ahead of buying a brandie from an LBS, and I couldn't afford a bike with 105s from any LBS near me.

The Vittoria Randonneurs went onto my Alex DA22 wheels (stock with the BD bike) without much effort. The rear tire needed a little nudging with a tire lever, I think mostly because I replaced the rear tube with a 700x28 Slime and it was a bit thicker tube that required a bit of massaging to avoid pinching. The front tire went on very quickly with only my hands. I know a lot of other posters have complained about these tires being too stiff to get onto their wheels, but in my case I had no problems.

These tires have an angled tread on them. Various forum posts here and elsewhere gave conflicting advice about which direction to point the tread. I went to the Vittoria site and they clearly noted that the "arrow point" of the tread should face the direction of travel (forward) to help channel water away from under the tires. This is kind of funny since the treads are only about 2mm deep and don't think they could channel much more than wet spit. But the edges have some gripping tread and I like that.

For anyone curious as I was about how to mount these, the tread pattern should be as follows:

\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \
Forward-->>
/ / / / / / / / / / /

Filled to 85psi and ready to mount. They're a bit snug on the Windsor frame (as I understand, same frame on the Fens, Knight, 3.0, 2.0, etc.) While running the stock 23s on this new bike there was no awareness of the minor wheel wobble. But once I put the 28s on, it was clear that the front wheel was not true, as it rubbed against the carbon fork in one spot.

About 15 minutes of tinkering with my spoke wrench and I was able to true up the wheel pretty well (I don't have a truing stand or caliper, just eyeballing it, and if it don't rub the fork, that's close enough for now.) :thumbsup:

I did a short test ride last night and am very pleased with these tires. I didn't notice any loss of speed, although fully assessing that will have to wait until I make a longer ride and actually measure the speed and effort. My legs will tell me if they're slower.

These tires look nice, grip well (on dry pavement only so far) and have softened the ride noticeably over the slick Michelin 23s, as would be expected. I'm really looking forward to the main reason I bought them -- no more flats! (Well, obviously, and hopefully, at least fewer flats.)

After riding these for awhile I will post a follow up. For now, based only on my first impressions, I'm happy with these tires.

Thanks to all who posted their experiences and advice and helped me make my purchase decision.


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

I don't know what you've read about Michelins, but the Krylions I've had have been extremely durable. All brands are going to have better and worse models in their line-up.


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## SixThree (Aug 28, 2012)

Opus51569 said:


> I don't know what you've read about Michelins, but the Krylions I've had have been extremely durable. All brands are going to have better and worse models in their line-up.


Absolutely I'm not ragging on Michelin. I know they make good tires (and dang expensive ones for my car -- over 200 bucks each!) Just that BD, as some other mfgrs, slap on the cheap model tires on their bikes to keep costs down.

Thanks for the response.


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## aclinjury (Sep 12, 2011)

Opus51569 said:


> I don't know what you've read about Michelins, but the Krylions I've had have been extremely durable. All brands are going to have better and worse models in their line-up.


Krylions have been extreme resilient for me too. It's an endurance tire with high carbon content. Very durable.

However, the Krylion is a pain in the ass to mount on Shimano DA 7900 wheelset... now most tires are hard to mount on the DA 7900 set, but the Krylions were even harder. You'll need a strong lever to mount. But once mounted, it's all good. BTW, Michelin has discontinued the Krylion line; the replacement line is the Pro4 Endurance.


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## taralon (Sep 1, 2011)

The Armadillos are slick when first installed. I believe that this is due to the release agent they apply to the moulds during production. After a couple hundred miles of wear they don't have any traction issues that I can see, but then again I don't race or ride like I do so YMMV. As far as puncture resistance goes, I am to the point of having to replace the rear now (casing is showing) and I've had a single puncture flat in the time I've had them on. That was from some random builder staples I ran over on the road by some construction. Wear wise they've got about ~5000 miles on the rear and the front, if I leave it on the front the front still has about 3k left in it probably. 

I'm planning on going with an armadillo again for the rear, but I think I'm going to scrub/wash it down or sandpaper it to get the slickness off of it before installing.


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## Pandito (Sep 15, 2012)

I've ridden on all three tyres, here are my thoughts on each of them:

Gatorskin- pros: best training tyres you can find in the market, bulletproof, rolls nicelu, decent weight. cons: very expensive, not the lightest race tyre you can find, not suitable for tricks and skid,

rando- pros: one of the best commuting tyres you can find,grippy, bulletproof, wear-proof, skid-proof
cons:heavy, high rolling resistance

armadillo- pros: cant think of one, mediocre in every way
cons: hard to fit on,slippery, priced way over its performance


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## MikeBiker (Mar 9, 2003)

I've been using Gatorskins for a few years and they solved my flatting problems. I haven't noticed any difference in ride from the other tires that I used to use.


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## clalor (May 29, 2010)

I ordered a set of 700x28 Randonneurs recently. If you're looking for a true 28mm tire, skip them. They're closer to a 24mm tire. They measured just over 24mm on an Open Pro rim and just over 25mm on a HED C2 rim. They're getting returned. I've heard the 700x32 version is closer to 29mm, but don't feel like taking the chance.


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## SixThree (Aug 28, 2012)

clalor said:


> I ordered a set of 700x28 Randonneurs recently. If you're looking for a true 28mm tire, skip them. They're closer to a 24mm tire. They measured just over 24mm on an Open Pro rim and just over 25mm on a HED C2 rim. They're getting returned. I've heard the 700x32 version is closer to 29mm, but don't feel like taking the chance.


Interesting. My Randonneurs barely fit in the forks of my Windsor Fens. I had to really true up the wheels to keep them from rubbing. I measured them and they're spot on 28mm. If I had it to do over I might have ordered the 700x25s.

On the plus side, they clearly soften the ride a bit over the stock 23 slicks that came with my bike. On the down side, they are slower. 

Slower is okay with me for the most part, as I'm not into racing but want to tour more and I don't care much about speed. But I probably won't be able to keep up with any group riders unless I put in double effort. In fact, the other day I was passed on the bike path by a kind of fat guy riding 23 slicks, and I had a heckuva time just keeping up with him for about a mile. I finally passed him, but after about a minute it felt like I was pedaling in mud and he breezed by me again. :sad:

*Are there any really fast, puncture-proof tires out there?*


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## mattotoole (Jan 3, 2008)

SixThree said:


> *Are there any really fast, puncture-proof tires out there?*


Some have been mentioned -- Conti 4000s; Michelin Krylion Carbon, or Pro4 Endurance as it's being called now. They won't be puncture proof but pretty puncture resistant, and still well into the "race tire" range of rolling resistance. 

Unfortunately, the things that make a tire puncture proof -- thick rubber, Vectran belts, etc. -- also make them slow.

Check the rolling resistance spreadsheets that get posted here periodically. Some tires, like the above, with pretty good reps for puncture resistance, perform very well in RR too.


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## clalor (May 29, 2010)

SixThree said:


> Interesting. My Randonneurs barely fit in the forks of my Windsor Fens. I had to really true up the wheels to keep them from rubbing. I measured them and they're spot on 28mm. If I had it to do over I might have ordered the 700x25s.


I was pretty surprised by it too. The tires even had the correct size molded into the sidewall of the tire.

I replaced them with a set of Ruffy Tuffy, which measure out much wider than the Randos. However, I haven't had a chance to ride them yet.


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## Villareal27 (Sep 27, 2012)

Others please feel free to chime in with your experiences with these three brands of tires.


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## BlackIce619 (Sep 14, 2012)

I purchased a set of foldable Gatorskin's 700x23. So far I have close to 300 miles on them and they have been working perfectly fine. I have been in some rough roads and rode over glass that I couldnt avoid on accident. I grinded my teeth as I went over it and came out perfectly fine...


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## bike-md (Dec 6, 2011)

I just installed a pair of Rando's on my commuter (26x1.5", its a converted MTB)

I can't comment on rolling resistance or compare them to any of the other ones listed, but compared to the WTB mountain bike tires they replaced, they were fantastic. 

Just by looking at them, they appear to be thick and will do well in terms of "flat-proofness"...we will see as the miles rack up.

I do really like the reflective strip in low light situation, especially when you don't have your lights on.


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