# Does "Women's Specific" do it for you?



## il sogno

I'll admit the only time I've ridden Women's Specific bikes was about 8-10 years ago when they first came out. I thought they were heavy and it was like the companies that were making them weren't even aware that there were women who might want a nice, light, performance oriented bike. 

Have any of you ridden any of the modern ones? What say you? Good bikes or heavy and cumbersome?


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## eddy

I've never ridden a women's specific bike, and I'm not likely to in the next few years. 

Perhaps, by the time I can afford one, they'll be jus' righ'!


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## vonteity

I have a long torso and long arms, so I've never even bothered trying one. I doubt they would fit me.


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## HokieRider

i have a cannondale femme frame and it fits well. that said, I've never ridden a properly sized mens (or non women specific) road bike. my mtn bike wasn't women specific and it felt great, so who knows.


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## il sogno

HokieRider said:


> i have a cannondale femme frame and it fits well. that said, I've never ridden a properly sized mens (or non women specific) road bike. my mtn bike wasn't women specific and it felt great, so who knows.


Did you get it recently? I'm curious cause I was at a LBS last month and it looks as if some companies are getting serious about making good women's specific bikes.


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## HokieRider

i got it last year. i really like it. they actually don't make it anymore...its a R500 Femme and they only make the synapse and one called the optimo now. its a great bike. But if you're like Von and have a long torso, I can see how it wouldn't work. I'm pretty average sized in the torso and arms, so there ya go....


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## 32and3cross

il sogno said:


> Did you get it recently? I'm curious cause I was at a LBS last month and it looks as if some companies are getting serious about making good women's specific bikes.


At interbike this year there seeemed to be several companies that were making really nice womens specific stuff and specking it out with good componets (never coudl under stand the WS bikes that get spec-ed with 44cm deep drop bars). Orbea Scott Bianchi and Specalized are the ones that really stood out in my mind. Specalized was sort of top of the heap with the lightest WS frame and really high end componets. Its slowly passing the idea that WS stuff should be second rate gear.


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## uzziefly

I know Trek makes some nice ones... That said, I don't know anyone who rides it other then this one girl in Lady Lurkers if I'm not wrong..


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## 32and3cross

Actually my wifes teammate rode a Trek WS frame and although the build quality seemed as nice as any of the trek bikes I thought the geometry was bad. Short wheel base so it was too twitchy and too steep in its angles. After we got her set up on a team frame (not WS) she commented on how much more stable it felt.


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## il sogno

vonteity said:


> I have a long torso and long arms, so I've never even bothered trying one. I doubt they would fit me.


I'm long legged, shorter torso and arms. 

Long sleeve jerseys cover up my hands.


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## il sogno

32and3cross said:


> At interbike this year there seeemed to be several companies that were making really nice womens specific stuff and specking it out with good componets (never coudl under stand the WS bikes that get spec-ed with 44cm deep drop bars). Orbea Scott Bianchi and Specalized are the ones that really stood out in my mind. Specalized was sort of top of the heap with the lightest WS frame and really high end componets. Its slowly passing the idea that WS stuff should be second rate gear.


I was at my LBS last month and the guy there was telling me about Interbike and specifically about the WS Orbea. I was very impressed. Orbea is making the WS frame lighter than the men's Orca. 

I'm hoping that the LBS will build one of these up when they get their shipment in so I'll be able to test ride it. If it's good, ulp! maybe I might put my current bike out to pasture and get one.


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## il sogno

32and3cross said:


> Actually my wifes teammate rode a Trek WS frame and although the build quality seemed as nice as any of the trek bikes I thought the geometry was bad. Short wheel base so it was too twitchy and too steep in its angles. After we got her set up on a team frame (not WS) she commented on how much more stable it felt.


In year 2000 I test rode some Treks. The standard sizes went down to 50cm. I ride a 49cm standard so the bikes were a little too big for me. This was when I tried their WS bikes. Like you said, angles too steep and all of them outfitted with low end components.

I went out and bought my compact frame Colnago that year.


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## HokieRider

my 'dale is a 50, but i know they make them in a 48...possibly smaller


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## SJCzar

I took a new Trek Madone 5.9 WSD out for a long demo ride last month. The Trek woman spent quite a bit of time setting the fit up for me. She watched me ride a little and then made a few more adjustments. It was a cold and rainy afternoon but I did not want to get off that bike. I ended up spending at least 45 minutes on it and really enjoyed the ride. 

My regular bike is a Trek 2100 (regular - not WSD). I've had it for two seasons and put on around 2800 miles this year. I started experiencing some neck and shoulder aches by the end of summer. I felt so much more comfortable on the WSD, especially in the upper body. I test rode a regular Madone earlier in the summer (an 80 mile ride) and didn't find the difference between it and my regular bike to be as noticeable.

I am 5' 4" with a 30" inseam, so I may be more in the heighth range that they are targeting with their WSD's.


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## RubySue

I just purchased a Ruby S-works yesterday. I am 5'4" with a 28 inseam. My first bike was a Roubaix 52 cm that was too big but comfortable. I moved on to a Giant TCR1 which fit me height wise but the geometry was not comfortable. After a 2 hour fitting with a great LBS, I got the Ruby. It will be here in 2 weeks. They set me up on a Dolce which has the same Ruby geometry. No more back/neck pain. I can not wait!!!


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## il sogno

RubySue said:


> I just purchased a Ruby S-works yesterday. I am 5'4" with a 28 inseam. My first bike was a Roubaix 52 cm that was too big but comfortable. I moved on to a Giant TCR1 which fit me height wise but the geometry was not comfortable. After a 2 hour fitting with a great LBS, I got the Ruby. It will be here in 2 weeks. They set me up on a Dolce which has the same Ruby geometry. No more back/neck pain. I can not wait!!!


Ruby be sure to post back in here and let us know how this bike works out! :thumbsup:


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## whateveronfire

Since I'm fairly tall, I never even tried a woman's frame. I had my Trek 1200 set up in such a way that the LBS guy laughed when I looked at the LeMonds. 

"You've got that Trek set up like a LeMond." The minute I got on my Zurich, it was bike love at first ride. So, no WSD bikes for me.

In a semi-thread hijack move...
What about saddles? What saddles do you ride? I broke (dork move) the Terry Liberator that I have on my mtb. I replaced it with a Specialized Jett WSD which I think I loathe.

I like the San Marco Atola Gelaround (it's unisex) I have on my LeMond ok, but was thinking of going to a Brooks or getting another Terry. This may all belong in another thread...


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## JayTee

Try the Terry Butterfly. A little more race with less padding than the Liberator, but if you ride even 50 miles a week during the "season" it will be a kindness. Less friction and saddle breakdown, lighter weight.


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## indysteel

I ride a WS 50-cm steel Bianchi Eros Donna and have been pretty happy with it. I have short legs and a longer torso/arms so finding a bike that fit was a challenge, even among WS bikes. The Bianchi's geometry--at least in the 50 cm--isn't too "radical." I don't think it's particularly twitchy or unstable. I would be curious, however, to know how the smaller sizes ride and whether they present any toe-overlap issues. Like bikes in general, my opinion is that some WS bikes will ride and handle better than others. There are too many variables to conclude that WS bikes are either all good or all bad.

The WS industry has come a long way, but it still has a ways to go. Several companies that offer WS bikes, including Bianchi (at least for 2006), are under the mistaken impression that women will be content with entry-level components and low-end frames. That truly irritates me. To get the bike I wanted, I had to swamp out some of the Campy Mirage components that were standard on my bike for Veloce. I plan to do a little more tweaking next season (the Mirage brakes are just not cutting it). Some people would argue that I shouldn't upgrade parts on what it arguably not a high-end frame. I see their point, but these are often the same people who have their choice of bikes that come stocked with Chorus/Ultegra/Record/DA. That said, companies like Terry, Trek and Specialized are offering a more comprehensive range of WS bikes, and I'm encouraged to see that Orbea is making carbon, well-speced bikes for women. 

And as for saddles, I use a Terry Butterfly Tri-Gel with no complaints.

Kate


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## Keeping up with Junior

*WS lack components*



indysteel said:


> ...The WS industry has come a long way, but it still has a ways to go. Several companies that offer WS bikes, including Bianchi (at least for 2006), are under the mistaken impression that women will be content with entry-level components and low-end frames... ...stocked with Chorus/Ultegra/Record/DA...


My wife struggled finding a high end bike with an appropriate component group. Usually stopped at midlevel frames and component groups. Then on top of that the components came out of the regular parts bin. Sure there was a saddle with flowers on it but the stock handlebar was 44cm wide. While buying a built up bike is great price wise, she had to buy a frame and the pick and choose the groupo and components she needed.


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## il sogno

*Me too*



indysteel said:


> I ride a WS 50-cm steel Bianchi Eros Donna and have been pretty happy with it. I have short legs and a longer torso/arms so finding a bike that fit was a challenge, even among WS bikes. The Bianchi's geometry--at least in the 50 cm--isn't too "radical." I don't think it's particularly twitchy or unstable. I would be curious, however, to know how the smaller sizes ride and whether they present any toe-overlap issues. Like bikes in general, my opinion is that some WS bikes will ride and handle better than others. There are too many variables to conclude that WS bikes are either all good or all bad.
> 
> The WS industry has come a long way, but it still has a ways to go. Several companies that offer WS bikes, including Bianchi (at least for 2006), are under the mistaken impression that women will be content with entry-level components and low-end frames. That truly irritates me. To get the bike I wanted, I had to swamp out some of the Campy Mirage components that were standard on my bike for Veloce. I plan to do a little more tweaking next season (the Mirage brakes are just not cutting it). Some people would argue that I shouldn't upgrade parts on what it arguably not a high-end frame. I see their point, but these are often the same people who have their choice of bikes that come stocked with Chorus/Ultegra/Record/DA. That said, companies like Terry, Trek and Specialized are offering a more comprehensive range of WS bikes, and I'm encouraged to see that Orbea is making carbon, well-speced bikes for women.
> 
> And as for saddles, I use a Terry Butterfly Tri-Gel with no complaints.
> 
> Kate


My old lugged steel frame from 1984 - a 49 cm Pogliaghi - used to have toe overlap when I rode with toe clips. that old bike sure was a quick handling bike. it was a bit twitchy riding at slow speeds but the faster you went, the more stable it became. it was a real blast riding that bike. all of my crashes on that bike were at low speed. 

the toe overlap on the poghi was never much of a problem when i was riding. and that issue went away when i switched to clipless pedals in the early '90s. 

my colnago is a 48 cm compact frame. it fits me perfectly. no toe overlap and not twitchy at all. it inspires confidence at all speeds. handling wise it is very much composed. knock wood - in 6 years have never crashed that bike. performance wise, it will do whatever you ask of it. 

i totally hear ya in regards to the low end components. i am very interested in the Orbea and if i get one i think i will do the puchase the way i did the colnago purchase. i would buy the frame and tell the lbs what components i want on it (probably campy chorus).


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## zeytin

My first "adult" road bike (as in not the pink department store bike my parents gave me or the hand-me-downs from my older brothers) was a small rider specific. It was a Jamis with the 650 front and 700 rear, Reynolds 631. While I like the bike I had issues with toe overlap and felt liked I was going over the bars at any time. 
I am much more comfortable on my "too big" Trek Postal. (it's 54 cm and I'm 5'2")


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## RubySue

ok, I just picked up my s-works Ruby! all I can say so far is wow! I'll take pics tomorrow...


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## tailwind28

I'm 5'6" with normal limbs. I have ridden a WS 50cm synaspe and HATED it. I felt too compressed. I ride a 50cm cannondale system 6 and went for a professional fitting and was told the bike was a perfect size for me. I think the WS bikes are great for smaller women under 5'4" who do not feel comfortable on a man's road bike.


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## il sogno

tailwind28 said:


> I'm 5'6" with normal limbs. I have ridden a WS 50cm synaspe and HATED it. I felt too compressed. I ride a 50cm cannondale system 6 and went for a professional fitting and was told the bike was a perfect size for me. I think the WS bikes are great for smaller women under 5'4" who do not feel comfortable on a man's road bike.


Me too. I have felt crowded or compressed on some of the WS bikes I have test ridden. I'm 5'4".


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## tailwind28

Next thing we need to share are women's saddles! What's comfortable?


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## JayTee

see the women's saddles thread about half a page down... and feel free to post your favorite there, too!


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## 7rider

il sogno said:


> I'll admit the only time I've ridden Women's Specific bikes was about 8-10 years ago when they first came out. I thought they were heavy and it was like the companies that were making them weren't even aware that there were women who might want a nice, light, performance oriented bike.
> 
> Have any of you ridden any of the modern ones? What say you? Good bikes or heavy and cumbersome?


I find many companies "women's" bikes insulting.
They put lower end components on them, paint them pink, and throw them out the door at inflated prices.

When I dream, my next bike will be a fully custom ride - Regina-specific, so the whole issue of "women's specific" will be irrelevant.


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## il sogno

Regina said:


> I find many companies "women's" bikes insulting.
> They put lower end components on them, paint them pink, and throw them out the door at inflated prices.


No kidding. My husband and I were just talking yesterday about how patronizing it is for companies to paint their women's bikes pink. I wouldn't be caught dead on a pink bike. And like you said, they put the cheesiest components on them. 

Lately I've been daydreaming of a custom steel Kirk frame. One with the curved seat stays like this one.


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## snapdragen

*But I like pink bikes.......*


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## Touch0Gray

please forgive my "intrusion" here, but the topic caught my attention....but I am confused as to the WSD at all. I am a 5' 5" man, long legs and arms short torso.....(31 in-seam and my knuckles drag on the ground..(well not really but I have a wingspan proportional to the in-seam)..) I test rode maybe 15 bikes before I found one that had the corresponding geometry to mine. The way I understand it the only way to tell the difference betwixt a male skeleton and female is the pelvic structure. I don't understand how this would relate to the top tube to seat tube to down tube and head tube ratio?
Are these bikes just specifically designed for shorter riders?
I am confused, can anyone short of an engineer for a bike co. explain?

BTW.....a pink bike is fine if you like pink...(all of the women in my life (3 daughters and wife)are red-heads or strawberry blonde and should not get near pink).... and low end components are fine if that is all you want.....(or can afford)

I am going to ask my neighbor about this too, he is an engineer for Trek ( Not the pink thing, I doubt they discuss that with the engineers)


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## il sogno

Touch0Gray said:


> please forgive my "intrusion" here, but the topic caught my attention....but I am confused as to the WSD at all. I am a 5' 5" man, long legs and arms short torso.....(31 in-seam and my knuckles drag on the ground..(well not really but I have a wingspan proportional to the in-seam)..) I test rode maybe 15 bikes before I found one that had the corresponding geometry to mine. The way I understand it the only way to tell the difference betwixt a male skeleton and female is the pelvic structure. I don't understand how this would relate to the top tube to seat tube to down tube and head tube ratio?
> Are these bikes just specifically designed for shorter riders?
> I am confused, can anyone short of an engineer for a bike co. explain?
> 
> BTW.....a pink bike is fine if you like pink...(all of the women in my life (3 daughters and wife)are red-heads or strawberry blonde and should not get near pink).... and low end components are fine if that is all you want.....(or can afford)
> 
> I am going to ask my neighbor about this too, he is an engineer for Trek ( Not the pink thing, I doubt they discuss that with the engineers)


In general women tend to be long legged and short torso-ed. They say we have a lower center or gravity too, whatever that means.


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## il sogno

snapdragen said:


> *But I like pink bikes.......*


I knew someone would bust me for that!  
But you don't have a pink bike, do you?


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## Sadlebred

Nope. WSD and "normal" bikes don't do it for me. All of my main rides are custom frames. 2 Deans (one road, one cyclocross bike) and a Kelly mtb.


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## snapdragen

il sogno said:


> I knew someone would bust me for that!
> But you don't have a pink bike, do you?


No - she's a lovely Indigo Blue. Unlike _some_ people, I only have one bike 

I think this one is pretty....


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## SadieKate

What's wrong with PANK? The boys at my LBS have said they'd ride my bike. 

OK, I also have lots of other non-pink bikes. I have never ridden WSD and I'm 5'4", long legs and arms, short torso. I just buy components that fit me. I also like to party with snap. What does that say about me?


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## snapdragen

SadieKate said:


> I also like to party with snap. What does that say about me?


It says you have a very refined taste in friends.......


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## il sogno

I shoulda known this would happen. Pink bike-o-mania! Aarrgh! :incazzato:


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## il sogno

snapdragen said:


> No - she's a lovely Indigo Blue. Unlike _some_ people, I only have one bike


You should go post in the BF&F forum where Len J, Phat&Slow Velo, Terry B and Physasst are all going on and on about the new frames they either want, or just snagged off of ebay.


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## snapdragen

Pink! It's the new black!


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## Sadlebred

SadieKate said:


> W
> 
> OK, I also have lots of other non-pink bikes. I have never ridden WSD and I'm 5'4", long legs and arms, short torso. I just buy components that fit me. I also like to party with snap. What does that say about me?


OHMIGOSH! I love your pink Knobbie X!!! I love my Kelly mtb!


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## madvax

il sogno said:


> I'll admit the only time I've ridden Women's Specific bikes was about 8-10 years ago when they first came out. I thought they were heavy and it was like the companies that were making them weren't even aware that there were women who might want a nice, light, performance oriented bike.
> 
> Have any of you ridden any of the modern ones? What say you? Good bikes or heavy and cumbersome?


My wife recently purchased a Giant OCR Composite w. We did a lot of searching, both Women specific and regular models, and she immediately fell in love with the Giant.

The OCR Composite w has exactly the same frame as the regular OCR Composite, but the Women Specific Model comes with a narrower handlebar, a woman's saddle, and shorter reach brifters. The bike comes equipped with Ultegra and Mavic Aksium wheels. 

I have also had a chance to ride her bike and find that it is very smooth and comfortable. It also climbs well and the frame strikes a good balance between stiffness and comfort. I can't find any penalties with this bike in regards to being Women's specific.


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## tailwind28

if any of your gals want a custom bike in steel, check out jonnycycles.com or google jonny cycles. he make some beautiful frames - fixed and road.


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## RHRoop

*Did I read that right?*



il sogno said:


> In general women tend to be long legged and short torso-ed. They say we have a lower center or gravity too, whatever that means.


How can women have longer legs and a lower center of gravity? Picture an SUV and a sports car. Which has taller "legs"? Which has a lower center of gravity?

Very interesting thread by the way. In the process of building up a bike for my wife. Many manufacturers who market womens specific bikes don't actually have different frames. Typically just a different saddle (for a wider pelvis), a different stem and narrower handlebars. Some companies such as Trek do offer frames with different geometry. 

Getting the right fit has nothing to do with buying a "women's" bike but going to a reputable shop that will take the time to measure you and swap things like seats, stems and handlebars until you have the right bike.

The feedback on seats was very interesting.

Do many women use different size cranks? 172.5 mm is the "standard" size that most bikes come with. Since, women on average are a bit shorter than men and proportionally have shorter legs does it make sense ot use a shorter crank?


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## Mark McM

*Longer legs - not*



RHRoop said:


> How can women have longer legs and a lower center of gravity?


You're right, that does seem to be a contradiction. But that's because only one of these statements is true - women have lower centers of gravity, but they don't have longer legs than men.

The idea that women have longer legs may be either be an optical illusion or cultural stereotype, but the reality is that the average ratio of leg length to torso length is just about the same for men and women. Between individuals of both sexes there are large variations in leg/torso ratios, but when comparing populations of men and women, the averages are about the same.

Of course, there are many other differences between men and women (viva la difference!) that can affect bike fit. Here are three in particular that affect how women fit on and ride bikes:

- On average, women have shorter arms and smaller hands (proportional to height) than men. This obviously affects reach to the handlebars.

- On average, women have proportionately less upper body muscle (and strength) than men. This tends to lower a women's center of gravity, and also affects how much weight a women can comfortably support on her arms.

- Women's pelvises are shaped differently, are wider, and have a more forward tilt than men's. Obviously, this means that men and women tend to sit on the saddle differently. In particular, the greater forward tilt of the pelvis can make rolling the pelvis forward (to achieve a lower, more stretched out position) more difficult for some women.

These are the primary reasons that women tend to prefer a shorter reach to the handlebars than men - not because of differences in ratios of leg/torso length.


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## Spinfinity

*Pink is also the old pink.*



snapdragen said:


> Pink! It's the new black!


My wife, 5'9", 145 pounds of tempered steel and sex appeal rides a 1984, pink Pinarello. It's a 54cm bike that a local shop was kind of stuck with and she got a great deal on it. She's gone on some damned long rides and bulked up a few pounds to place in Clyesdale or Athena triathlons. The woman ain't girlie!

About 5 years ago the Cannondale girls in our club teased her about her "pretty, pink, Italian bike" so she tried a bunch of newer and lighter bikes, but none of them felt like "her bike". Next time out she put the hammer down, dropped 'em all and rode with the old boys. 

At the end of the season we got the stays spread, updated to indexing, and had JP Weigle repaint it just as pink as it ever was. She still rides that bike with skill, pride and stlye. We look forward to the day when people will be judged, not by the color of their bikes, but by the character and skill of the rider!


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## KayTee

Now THAT'S the way to ride a pink bike! Good for your wife! There's nothing I love more than dusting some (well, not all  of the big boys on my 1990 lugged steel, Barbie's Playbike-colored winter bike!


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## mofoust

If I were to ride a pink bike, this would definitely be it!

When I was looking for my bike, I turned my nose up at the WS bikes and bought a men's bike (Specialized). The pastel colors didn't appeal to me (the frosty blues and purples...ahh) and I wasn't entirely convinced (or clear) about the geometric differences- I think I just wanted to hang with the boys! I did opt for a softer seat, though. I have a friend who bought a Specialized Ruby (WS) and she LOVES it (it's as light as a feather- with wheels).

Side bar- I know tons of aspects to frame sizing- but are there any 5'6 ladies out there on a 49cm frame? hmmm.


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## SJCzar

Ok, you want to talk girly pink bikes, I guess mine definitely falls into that category.

I ordered the frame and had a friend build up the rest. I do agree that stock WSD bikes don't offer enough high end components.

I'm 5'4" with a 30" inseam and the bike is a 51. The comfort difference for me from my old ride to this one is very noticeable. I've never experienced any neck or shoulder pain since the switch. 












She may look like a "Barbie bike" but nothing beats the look on the young guys faces when a "40-something" old lady on a pink bike passes them by on the hill climbs.


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## il sogno

SJCzar said:


> She may look like a "Barbie bike" but nothing beats the look on the young guys faces when a "40-something" old lady on a pink bike passes them by on the hill climbs.


LOL, yes for me I'd have to be able to beat guys to the top of the hill to ride a pink bike. And that ain't happening right now. :blush2: 

/I've developed an appreciation for modern women's specific bikes. They've come a long way in the last few years.


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## rand132

This is interesting, my wife thought the same. So we bought an OCR 3 Small, even on the so called mens, the parts were adjustable to suit her needs.


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## kermit

*Not for me*

I am 5'8, 130 lbs., with long limbs. I have a normal Specialized Roubaix comp. and after getting a pro fit, it fits me perfectly. The cool thing about WSB is they help get more people into cycling. Don't think you have to buy one because you are a woman, but if you are petite it's probably going to fit you better. It's all about options, and of course color. If you HAVE to have a pink bike, then there's your answer. For the record, I am not a pink bike rider.


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## lamazion

I just gave my wife a womens LeMond for her birthday. She tried a ton of bikes, both mens and womens, before going with the LeMond. There is very little difference between the Mens and womens 49cm in the LeMonds. The mens had a slightly longer top tube. The big difference was the front end. She loved the short reach shifters and the smaller bars on the womens.


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## Sandlynx

" RubySue
Cyclist

user gallery 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2

I just purchased a Ruby S-works yesterday. I am 5'4" with a 28 inseam. My first bike was a Roubaix 52 cm that was too big but comfortable. I moved on to a Giant TCR1 which fit me height wise but the geometry was not comfortable. After a 2 hour fitting with a great LBS, I got the Ruby. It will be here in 2 weeks. They set me up on a Dolce which has the same Ruby geometry. No more back/neck pain. I can not wait!!!"

Hey, thanks for the info. I've been looking at a Volce (Bianchi), and according to what you say, it should fit me just fine. 
I have a Bianche, Ocelot, MTB, and it's a perfect fit. I don't think it's considered truly women specific, but a sticker near the bottom bracket says "Designed by Chicks", so the ladies had an inflence in its geometry. I can ride this bike all day on any terrain and still have something left. So, a Dolce would probably work just great for me. But, the Dolce isn't listed as WS. Just DB She, DB Elle, and Eros Donna are listed as WS. 
I'm 5'2" with a stand-over height of 28 inches. I'm currently riding a Trek 720 which is really too small for me, but I wanted to try a hybrid/road bike to see if I might like serious road-riding and probably touring. But, the 720 I found to be too slow on the road, especially when trying to keep up with other riders who are "hammers". The geometry on this bike just isn't right for me. I'm just all scrunched up on it! I can't power-it-up and fly like I can the Bianchi which fits. 
About saddles: I've tried Specialized WS, and it's ok. But the real winner for me is Nashbar WS racing saddle. I can ride this all day. 
I've also noticed that WS bicycles have cheapy componets, and I have had to upgrade nearly every bicycle I've bought so that I can have the quick respose I want and the confidence that something isn't going to break at any moment. 
I think the boys still need to learn a little more respect for the seriousness of lady riders. 
Sandlynx


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## il sogno

Sandlynx said:


> I think the boys still need to learn a little more respect for the seriousness of lady riders.
> Sandlynx


Yep. Build it and we will come.


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## MayGirl

Not for me either. 
Had a Specialized WSD and it was too compact (and I have fairly short arms, small hands, and pretty evenly proportioned legs to torso at just shy of 5'6"...only discrepancy is that, it seems, I have fairly long femurs). It would've been fine if I wanted a bike to slowly lolligag through a park for a half hour, but, well, I didn't. I totally got sucked into the WSD thing (it was my first road bike) as it seemed to make sense but later (when I knew more about bikes in general) also felt fairly insulted at the generally poor stock components (105, crappy Alex wheels, only came in triple crank) compared to the equivalent non-WSD bike (which had ultegra, better but not great wheels, etc.).
I switched to a Specialized E5 (soooo sweet) and race (few points shy of Cat 2) now -- there would've been no way I could've progressed in my training as I have on that first bike no matter how much we switched out/flipped the stem, swapped components, etc. The fit was never going to be aggressive enough.

Regarding saddles -- when just riding as a beginner I used a Terry Butterfly which was comfy and okay. But it's way too cushioned for me (made me bounce when doing hard efforts). I switched to a Specialized Alias saddle and love it. It's very hard but breaks in rather quickly. I tried the Jett (the "women's" version of the Alias) and it was awful for me. When I returned it to the specialized rep for my team he actually mentioned how they were hoping to redesign it. 

It's all a very personal thing. It's takes time (and, sadly, mooola) to figure it all out.


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## Sandlynx

May Girl,
Thanks for your reply and info. 
I just bought a not-women's-specific Raleigh road bike, and I'll report back on how I like it. I should be getting it Saturday. 
They are all entry level components, but I've learned how to upgrade to the high-level components I prefer, myself, in my little bike shop, so I don't spend a small fortune having a bike-shop do the upgrades. 
I put the WS Specialized saddle on my MTB bike, and it's OK there. On a road bike; not a chance; too much leg interference for me. The wider, so-called, WS saddles, give me nerve compression, so I have go with the skinny saddles.


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## MayGirl

Awesome Sandlynx, hopefully it'll be great!
I hear ya on the skinny saddles -- the Alias is pancake flat and you can get it in different widths. 
Now, if only I could get over this burnout and actually get back on my bike...
Have fun!


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## Sandlynx

May Girl,
I'll have to check out the Alias. 
Burnout! Time to take a break. Go do something completely different and unrelated, and when you come back, you'll be even better.


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## VaughnA

My wife (5'1") had a 47 WSD trek with 650C wheels for about a year and could never get comfortable on it. We found a 47CM Basso with 700C wheels, not WSD and longer TT than the trek. She is finally comfortable on a road bike and wouldn't get rid of the Basso for anything. For her WSD didn't make any difference. She does have a WSD mountain bike (Santa Cruz Julianna) but I think the reason that it works isn't WSD it is just that it is small enough for her. The only WSD component she uses is a terry damselfly saddle.


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## Sandlynx

VaughnA,
Thanks for the input. 
I just picked-up my Raleigh road bike today, which is not WS, and has a longer top tube than WS's, and apparently that's what fits me too, like your wife, not the shorter WS top tubes. 
I have only so far done a very short road test, and I love it already! It fits. But, the toe clips and straps have to go. I'm putting on SPD pedals this afternoon. On this bike, the toe clips (like someone asked about earlier) do interfere with the front wheel. However, I prefer the clipless pedals anyway. 
The saddle, which does not have the WS cutout with gel, just a racing saddle with a slight depression down the center, is surprisingly comfortable, and I usually prefer the saddles with the center cut-outs. We'll see just how comfortable it really is on a 50 mile ride. That's the acid test.


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## Sacha

I ride a WSD. 
At 5-1, I didn't have a lot of options when looking for a sub-46 cm CF frame with a max 50cm top tube (according to my Serotta fitter) and still keep 700cm tires.

I tested Cervelo, Orbea, Look, Giant, Litespeed, you name it. I was willing to throw money at them and no one could help me. The only manufacturer that made a stock frame in my size was Specialized, which I am now convinced does more for/with WSD than anyone else out there. 

(My finished bike is a 44cm SWorks Ruby/Record/Fulcrum. She rides like a dream) :thumbsup:


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## il sogno

Sacha said:


> I was willing to throw money at them and no one could help me.


LOL, I hear ya on that one. Take my money...please!



Sacha said:


> (My finished bike is a 44cm SWorks Ruby/Record/Fulcrum. She rides like a dream) :thumbsup:


Please post a pic.


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## Sacha

Sandlynx said:


> I've also noticed that WS bicycles have cheapy componets... I think the boys still need to learn a little more respect for the seriousness of lady riders.
> Sandlynx


+1,000,000. I went to look at Bianchi's WSD selection and was very disappointed. And I found few other manufacturers offering stock Campy. Orbea's Diva was the only WSD bike I found that came equipped with Chorus or Record.

EDIT: I recently rode with a club called the Beverly Hills Social Climbers (great name, eh?) and there were four other women, all very close to me in size, about 5'0"-5'3". One rides an Orbea, the other three ride 44 or 48 Rubys. Obviously, there is a market out there for smaller, high-end bicycles, one that manufacturers have mostly ignored. _(And yes, we probably did look like The Midget Peloton.)_  



il sogno said:


> Please post a pic.


Here ya go. Testing the Zeros...


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## Sandlynx

Campy Girl



user gallery 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 40 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandlynx
I've also noticed that WS bicycles have cheapy componets... I think the boys still need to learn a little more respect for the seriousness of lady riders. 
Sandlynx

+1,000,000. I went to look at Bianchi's WSD selection and was very disappointed. And I found few other manufacturers offering stock Campy. Orbea's Diva was the only WSD bike I found that came equipped with Chorus or Record.
------
Reply: 


Sacha (Campy Girl) and all,
Part of the problem seems to me to be that most women don't know one component from another. You can ask them something as simple as "What size tires, and type, are you running?", and they simply know nothing about it. (Their partner takes care of all of that.) Well, when the bicycle salesperson sees someone like this coming, they'll sell them anything (especially at end-of-year sales) and tell them it fits! :mad2: Honestly, most women don't know the difference. This is why the the girl- techies who are picky about performance and quality of parts are having problems getting quality bikes. The sales folks think they can throw anything at us and we'll take it without any (informed) complaints. 
The local bicycle store I buy from knows that as soon as I get out the door, I'm going to upgrade all the components. ( I'm sure they wish I'd buy all those components from them, but it takes them too long to get orders through. Plus, they're really not used to ordering high-quality parts for their customers. Most people do, according to the guy I deal with, take what comes in the box and never look back. Lately, though, they've gotten better about getting orders through faster. They are very aware of WS quality components problem, but they too have to take what the manufacturers offer them, which isn't what Sacha and others of us are looking for. I too was disappointed in the current Bianchi WS offerings. Thus, the Raleigh road bike. I don't want something that looks like the neck of swan in the middle (Pretty, but not functional -- with it's structural weaknesses), but a solid diamond frame that can take a beating. I guess they think girls are not "bike beaters"! 
So, I guess it comes down to expect to pay for custom built with a high-dollar price tag, or accept floor quality stuff and rebuild yourself. 
I got lucky and WS just isn't necessary for my build, and I can ride a standard-production bicycle. I road tested the Raleigh I just bought, and it fits me perfectly, including the saddle(!). When I can do a 30 mile ride and get off the bike without leg, neck, or back pain, feeling I can easily do another 30, the bike fits! :aureola: 
Apparently, WS isn't for me. I'll make exception for the saddles. The center cut-out is really necessary, especially in the sustained aero position.


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## il sogno

Sacha said:


> Here ya go. Testing the Zeros...


Nice...:thumbsup:


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## thinkcooper

Mrs. Thinkcooper just wrapped a review of the Ruby Expert. Link here to the story.


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## SCBianchista

I'm 5'6 with average limbs, but small hands--I ride a 2006 Bianchi Reparto Corse 50cm WS and I love it. I test rode many a bike before I got this one--the only one I liked better was a WS Trek way above my price range. I have zero complaints and I really love this bike--handles everything I throw at it. I have upgraded some of the components, and I needed to shim the brake levers a little but it fits like a glove now. I did trade out the original Bianchi seat for a Terry CrMo and that took the pressure off the "Candy"---Personally, I think you just have to go with the one that feels like Love at First Ride--you know when the fit is right. It is a rare deal to not need any adjustments or trades--every Body is different--a good professional fit and a knowledgable dealer goes a long way towards Rider satisfaction.


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## Cross Chained

I realise this thread is sort of old, but I have a women's bike and I like it a lot. A 2008 Giant OCR A0 W, to be exact. It's a carbon/aluminum with unmarked Ultegra components and pretty light. I thought it was a good value for the money (the MSRP is $1900, but I only paid $1650, I think.) I really disliked all the men's bikes I tried because the reach was just too long. The women's bikes worked much better for me. A lot of the other bikes I tried out did not have very great components (most of them had Tiagra or 105) and most were aluminum frames and were quite heavy. 

As for pink bikes... well, I like pink and if I ever find a pink bike someday that I like, I will probably get it.


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## banjobiker

*Ride WSD but may try guy's bike ...*

I bought my first road bike a few months ago - a women's specific design Giant OCR. I'm at the point now where I'm starting to look at better bikes - an OCR composite with great components. However, the women's 2009 Giants come in such weird colors that I'm looking at the men's versions. I may just go with a guy's bike next time!


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