# Hi - Another Newb Needing Purchase Advice



## fhsgolfer (Jul 22, 2013)

Hi everyone, I'm an avid runner and weight lifter but have dabbled in road biking before and now that I have some funds I'm looking to get into it with a good entry road bike. I want something that I can grow into and not have to replace in the first few years and I have narrowed my choices down to 2 (unless there are other suggestions). My budget is $800 or so but would go up to $1,000 if I like the bike enough. So which is the better choice:

1. 2007 Jamis Xenith Comp carbon (used) - comes with peddles, computer, etc. I know the concerns of buying carbon used but I'd get it checked out first. One owner says it was never laid down and barely ridden. $800. 
View attachment 284603


2. The Nashbar brand Carbon Road bike (I'd wait for a coupon so it would be around $800-$850). Nashbar Carbon Road Bike - Road Bikes


Thanks in advance!


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## Social Climber (Jan 16, 2013)

Have you test-ridden the Jamis? Frankly I don't think you should be buying a bike over the internet. You really need to test ride a few to determine what fits you best.


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## fhsgolfer (Jul 22, 2013)

Social Climber said:


> Have you test-ridden the Jamis? Frankly I don't think you should be buying a bike over the internet. You really need to test ride a few to determine what fits you best.



Sorry, forgot to mention its from Craigslist and I'll be test riding it out on Wednesday.


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## Zeet (Mar 24, 2013)

fhsgolfer said:


> Sorry, forgot to mention its from Craigslist and I'll be test riding it out on Wednesday.


IMHO, your cycling needs could also be met by the Schwinn Fastback Comp road bike from Nashbar. Also, the Nashbar option that you've presented us, would be better than the CL Jamis Xenith Comp, if it's a better fit. However, you won't be able to determine the fit until the Nashbar bike arrives. If it doesn't fit, it's gonna be a major hassle. It will be your dime that returns the bike for a replacement. At any rate...Good Luck! :thumbsup:


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## CMJTperry (Oct 23, 2012)

With 2014 bikes coming out, I would visit all your local shops and test ride several 2013's in the 1200 - 1400 price range and make a deal on one since new ones are coming out. I bought a Felt Z85 for under $1000 that was $1299.00. Plus you get to find one that fits you.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

There are number of brand new bikes that fit that price range and are exactly the kind of bike you are looking for. Here are a few (most are not carbon, but you probably need to step up to around $1500 if you want a carbon bike):

F85 - Felt Bicycles

Z95 - Felt Bicycles

Specialized Bicycle Components

Amazon.com: Diamondback 2012 Podium 5 Road Bike (Carbon/Red): Sports & Outdoors

SYNAPSE 7 SORA - Synapse Alloy - Performance Road - Road - Bikes - 2013

Wiggle Cycle | Road & Time Trial Bikes + Carbon frames (wiggle.com has a number of more affordable carbon bikes)

Happy hunting....


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

I should have mentioned that I also think test riding is really important, particualrly if you are just starting out. There is nothing wrong with starting out on alloy either. I test rode a Cannondale Caad 10 last week and it was impressive. I started with a Felt F85 and it was a good bike as well. I have heard really positive reviews for the Specialized Allez too. You can probably find out more about those bikes by googling reviews or checking out the specific manufacturer sections of RBR.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

The Nashbar looks like it could be solid as well, but I don't know anyone that has ever ridden one. The Giant Defy 5 is another option and you could probably get one new for around $700.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

CMJTperry said:


> With 2014 bikes coming out, I would *visit all your local shops and test ride several *2013's in the 1200 - 1400 price range and make a deal on one since new ones are coming out. I bought a Felt Z85 for under $1000 that was $1299.00. Plus you get to *find one that fits you*.


This. Because of the way CF can fail (internally) and requires special equipment to detect those failures, even if you bring a used CF bike to a LBS, they won't be able to guarantee it's defect free - a big gamble (and lost funds for you) if there's a problem.

Without taking appropriate steps to ensure you get sizing right, buying online is also a gamble, because even though most bikes are returnable (at your expense) you won't _know_ the bike doesn't fit till it's assembled and fit to you - both non-recuperable expenses.

My advice is to visit some shops, discuss your intended uses/ goals, price range and cycling experiences and have them suggest some brands/ models. Get sized/ fitted, then head out for test rides - out on the roads and for some duration. This IME is the best way to whittle the field and decide what's right for you. 

Lastly, test ride both race and relaxed geo bikes. The differences are subtle, but you may prefer one over the other.


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## fhsgolfer (Jul 22, 2013)

Thanks everyone for the advice thus far I will definitely go to my LBS and ride some in person before I buy first. What about this one (its $1,000 even after coupon code): Fuji SL-1 Comp LE Road Bike - Overweight Code F Restricted Is that one a good deal?


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> This. Because of the way CF can fail (internally) and requires special equipment to detect those failures, even if you bring a used CF bike to a LBS, they won't be able to guarantee it's defect free - a big gamble (and lost funds for you) if there's a problem.
> 
> Without taking appropriate steps to ensure you get sizing right, buying online is also a gamble, because even though most bikes are returnable (at your expense) you won't _know_ the bike doesn't fit till it's assembled and fit to you - both non-recuperable expenses.
> 
> ...


There's a fit calculator over on competitivecyclist.com if you decide you want to buy online (R&A Cycles has a similar thing and a number of people have used them and came away happy), but I agree that the first option should be to get into a shop and test ride a bike before you buy it. You get to test fit and the ride quality of the bike and ask questions that way.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

I don't know anyone who has ridden that particular Fuji, but lots of folks like their bikes and it seems like a completely reasonable option if you get the fit right and like it. That's a really good price for a carbon bike.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

fhsgolfer said:


> Thanks everyone for the advice thus far I will definitely go to my LBS and ride some in person before I buy first. What about this one (its $1,000 even after coupon code): Fuji SL-1 Comp LE Road Bike - Overweight Code F Restricted Is that one a good deal?


Can you test ride it before committing to the purchase? If not, I suggest taking it out of contention.

Re: a 'good deal'. The best deal is a bike that suites your intended uses, fits and you ride (because it's comfortable).


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Rashadabd said:


> There's a fit calculator over on competitivecyclist.com if you decide you want to buy online (R&A Cycles has a similar thing and *a number of people have used them and came away happy*)..


The vast minority, IME. Most come away more confused by fit calculators recommendations that they do enlightened by them. The _best_ they do is get a rider in a _range_ of sizes. A competent fitter can do better in about 5 minutes working one on one with someone.

A prime reason for patronizing your LBS's.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

It comes down to this my man. You can make a satisfactory bike purchase online, but it takes A LOT more work. You have to research the bike, try to find someone that has actually ridden one preferably to get their opinion, find a way to get the right fit (fit calculator &/or assistance from the retailer), and know or figure out a bunch about your own bike preferences including style of bike and set-up, etc.
It's time consuming and can be exhausting, but I understand that sometimes you have to do what you have to do because the budget is tight and you can't afford the prices at local shops. So, it's your money and I respect that you are primarily interested in carbon. It's why I tried to provide you (and others) with in shop and online options. At the end of the day though, what I think we are all trying to say is that it's much easier and "safer" to go into a few local shops and test some bikes.


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## fhsgolfer (Jul 22, 2013)

Ok, sounding like I should take a stronger look at the LBS. My only concern is my budget and getting my bang for the buck, because I don't have a ton of money. With the LBS, I pay tax and they have overhead so that factors in. What sub $1,000 bikes should I focus on at my LBS if I got that route?


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

fhsgolfer said:


> Ok, sounding like I should take a stronger look at the LBS. *My only concern is my budget and getting my bang for the buck*, because I don't have a ton of money. With the LBS, I pay tax and they have overhead so that factors in. What sub $1,000 bikes should I focus on at my LBS if I got that route?


Like most any purchase, it's all about priorities and compromises. Maybe you can get CF, upgraded shifters, etc. online versus LBS at your price point, but going the LBS route gets you much more in the way of support - sizing/ fit assistance, the ability to test ride bikes, warranty assistance, if needed. They're there to assist, where the online guys ship a bike in a box from a warehouse. End of story. And there are hidden costs to consider - final assembly, tuning, fit...

For a first (entry level) bike, I wouldn't segregate any brands. All the popular makes (Jamis, Felt, Specialized, Trek, Fuji, Giant - the list is long) all produce top quality bikes with strong warranties.

As important, is finding a shop that instills confidence, promotes the importance of fit and test ride - those reputable shops are what you want to focus on and patronize.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

All things being equal (you like the shop, the bike fits you and your goals, etc.), I really like the value you get from Felt, Giant, and Specialized. If I had to name one bike in the sub 1k category to strongly consider, I would say the Specialized Allez. Here are some folks raving about it around here:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/specialized/2013-specialized-allez-race-e5-ossb-300224.html

and others doing the same:

Specialized Allez Race 2014 - First Ride - BikeRadar

Specialized Bicycle Components


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

Here's another review:

Specialized Allez Race ? First Ride Review - BikeRadar


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

There are also a number of lists like this out there that might be helpful:

Best Road Bikes For Under $1,000: Our Top Picks For 2012 - BikeRadar


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

One last one on Specialized and their Allez:

Peloton


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## andione1983 (Jul 23, 2013)

I brought a merida Ride Lite 93 alu/carbon forks 
Very happy for $1100 down from 1400$ oz dollars.. Probably cheaper in usa


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Choosing and fitting a road bike is a lot like choosing and fitting a pair of running shoes. Both need to fit your style of moving in that context, your individual anatomy, and your size.

Ride a lot, buy your favorite. If you have to have the latest and most expensive shoes... raise your budget.  If you have "your" shoe that you now find online and have been running in for a couple years, your budget's fine. Either way, ride a lot of bikes and buy your favorite. Used from a shop is a good way to stretch a buck while keeping the ability to try a few bikes all at once.


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## andione1983 (Jul 23, 2013)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Choosing and fitting a road bike is a lot like choosing and fitting a pair of running shoes. Both need to fit your style of moving in that context, your individual anatomy, and your size.
> 
> Ride a lot, buy your favorite. If you have to have the latest and most expensive shoes... raise your budget.  If you have "your" shoe that you now find online and have been running in for a couple years, your budget's fine. Either way, ride a lot of bikes and buy your favorite. Used from a shop is a good way to stretch a buck while keeping the ability to try a few bikes all at once.


I pretty new to road bikes too... But from what I have seen in my short time... Correct me if I am wrong there seems to be alot of adjustment that can make any bike fit you well... Whether you adjust combinations of the seat, stem, drop bars, seat height, etc..? Does a frame really have much to do with it?


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

andione1983 said:


> I pretty new to road bikes too... But from what I have seen in my short time... Correct me if I am wrong there seems to be alot of adjustment that can make any bike fit you well... Whether you adjust combinations of the seat, stem, drop bars, seat height, etc..? Does a frame really have much to do with it?


You are absolutely on the right page. Many/most of us can fit more than one size bike and most bike manufacturers make a bike that can fit pretty much any body type. Given that, it all comes down to dialing in THE BEST fit for an individual rider. Seat post, saddle adjustments, and stem length & angle choice give you a lot of flexibility as do the addition or subtraction of spacers. I recently learned that both Felt and Specialized make adjustible stems as well (as does Look I believe). Argon 18 has an adjustable head tube length. So, at the end of the day, once you identify the correct bike size, you have some room and ways to tinker with things to get the right fit. The Retul and Guru fit systems (or any good fit session) can help an individual identify what they need if they can find a shop near them that is set up for it.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

andione1983 said:


> I pretty new to road bikes too... But from what I have seen in my short time... Correct me if I am wrong there seems to be alot of adjustment that can make any bike fit you well... Whether you adjust combinations of the seat, stem, drop bars, seat height, etc..? *Does a frame really have much to do with it?*


In a word, yes. A frame's geo dictates fit, handling and (to some extent), ride. 

But beyond that, before fit, comes sizing, so even allowing for adjustments to stem/ spacer/ saddle, you want to pick a frame with geo placing a rider in the correct position, f/r. From there, a fitters job is easy, making small adjustments (or tweaks) to fit. 

Weight distribution on road bike is oftentimes overlooked, but very important to get handling right. It also negates the need for what I call unnecessary compromises to fit (short/ long stems, extreme angles, no setback posts).

So yes, you want to find the bike with not only the correct sizing, but the correct geo based on intended use and a riders anatomy.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> In a word, yes. A frame's geo dictates fit, handling and (to some extent), ride.
> 
> But beyond that, before fit, comes sizing, so even allowing for adjustments to stem/ spacer/ saddle, you want to pick a frame with geo placing a rider in the correct position, f/r. From there, a fitters job is easy, making small adjustments (or tweaks) to fit.
> 
> ...


I agree for the most part, but would only add that a "endurance" geometry bike can be set up fairly agressively if need be and a "race" geometry bike can be set up fairly relaxed if need be by a good fitter. It may not be the "best" way to go, but it can be done. Furthermore, the line between "race" and "endurance" geometry has been blurring in the last 12 months as bike manufacturers are now producing bikes that fall somewhere in the middle (mostly for the pros to use in the Spring Classics and for amateurs to use in gran fondos/sportives). Team Europecar was on Colnago's latest entry to this field during the TdF. A number of people are arguing that these "endurance race" geometry bikes are probably the best fit for the scores of riders that crave long distances, but also want stiffness, speed and handling. 

Finally, the cool thing about fit systems like Guru, is that the equipment used tells you precisely how many spacers, etc. you need to fit comfortably on a number of bikes and brands. One of the shops out my way has it and it's pretty cool to see. 

http://www.gurucycling.com/


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Rashadabd said:


> I agree for the most part, but would only add that "endurance" geometry bike can be set up fairly agressively if need be and a "race" geometry bike can be set up fairly relaxed if need be by a good fitter...


Correct, and I didn't say otherwise. I think you read into what I offered in my post, but suffice to say I agree with this statement. There's nothing at all wrong with adjusting saddle to bar drop to meet a riders needs. 

What I was referring to was someone picking a frame that's too large or too small, necessitating that they run (as examples) 70mm stems or 140's, respectively because that messes up f/r weight distribution and in turn, handling. Same for HT lengths. Ex: too short necessitates the need to run extreme stem angle/ spacer setups (thus the reference to unnecessary compromises to fit).



Rashadabd said:


> Finally, the cool thing about fit systems like Guru, is that the equipment used tells you precisily how many spacers, etc. you need to fit comfortably on a number of bikes and brands. One of the shops out my way has it and it's pretty cool to see.
> 
> http://www.gurucycling.com/


Agree with this as well. Generally speaking, given relatively normal proportions/ flexibility, an individual can fit on a number of makes/ models, but not all. And once reach/ drop requirements are established, deviations (in geo) should be small so that corresponding fit adjustments are small. 

IMO/E fit systems are useful tools. Online calculators, not so much. :wink5:


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> Correct, and I didn't say otherwise. I think you read into what I offered in my post, but suffice to say I agree with this statement. There's nothing at all wrong with adjusting saddle to bar drop to meet a riders needs.
> 
> What I was referring to was someone picking a frame that's too large or too small, necessitating that they run (as examples) 70mm stems or 140's, respectively because that messes up f/r weight distribution and in turn, handling. Same for HT lengths. Ex: too short necessitates the need to run extreme stem angle/ spacer setups (thus the reference to unnecessary compromises to fit).
> 
> ...


Fair enough. :thumbsup: However, since you bring it up, let's be fair and acknowledge that a number of people (many on different threads in RBR even) have successfully purchased bikes online and/or from Asia. Fit calculators are not a replacement for a full fit and bike set-up session, but can be used (with homework and/or assistance from the retailer) to identify the correct bike size. The same arguments against that reality have ineffectively been made about Zappos and Amazon, etc. before it became clear that their system is working. Like those companies, the reality is that Competitive Cyclist, R&A Cycles, Wiggle.com, Colorado Cyclist, Glory Cycles, etc. have had success for years in helping people identify a bike that fits them. If it wasn't working, they wouldn't be as big as they are. I concede it's probably not the "best" way to select a bike for most people (because you miss out on the opportunity to test ride and have someone look at you on the bike), but folks face different challenges and for some online shopping can really work and may be their best option. I know, for instance, that with R&A you can send them your measurements and they work with you to identify the appropriate size. Bike Doctor and Competitive Cyclist will do the same I believe. Different strokes for different folks I say and there probably isn't just one "right way" to buy a bike (or do most things).


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## fhsgolfer (Jul 22, 2013)

Update - I test rode the Jamis from my first post and it fits well. It's been stored indoors, only ridden twice, and everything looks like its working properly. Owner will not go below $800. Is that a fair price for the bike? I'll be taking it to LBS for a tune, etc if I buy it just FYI. 

Here's specs: http://www.bikepedia.com/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2007&Brand=Jamis&Model=Xenith Comp&Type=bike

View attachment 284697


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## Zeet (Mar 24, 2013)

fhsgolfer said:


> Update - I test rode the Jamis from my first post and it fits well. It's been stored indoors, only ridden twice, and everything looks like its working properly. Owner will not go below $800. Is that a fair price for the bike? I'll be taking it to LBS for a tune, etc if I buy it just FYI.
> 
> Here's specs: http://www.bikepedia.com/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2007&Brand=Jamis&Model=Xenith Comp&Type=bike
> 
> View attachment 284697


The price is fair enough (perhaps not).... However, price is not the problem. The problem lies in the fact that this is a used carbon fiber bike being purchased from a complete stranger. You know nothing about the seller or his bike. Carbon fiber bikes are notorious for concealing structural damage. Cycling on a previously crashed CF bike can prove to be a very dangerous venture. Many cyclists who have been involved in previous crashes, might feel reluctant about fully disclosing any information related to their previously crashed CF bikes. Therefore, to cut their losses, they go on Craigslist in order to unload their CF liabilities. Therefore, I would strongly suggest that you proceed very cautiously with this new venture into the world of used CF. However, OTOH, if everything proves square, I would then say that you're about to make a very good deal!....At this point, it's a crap shoot!


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

Zeet said:


> The price is more than fair. However, price is not the problem. The problem lies in the fact that this is a used carbon fiber bike being purchased from a complete stranger. You know nothing about the seller or his bike. Carbon fiber bikes are notorious for concealing structural damage. Cycling on a previously crashed CF bike can prove to be a very dangerous venture. Many cyclists who have been involved in previous crashes, might feel reluctant about fully disclosing any information related their previously crashed CF bikes. Therefore, to cut their losses, they go on Craigslist in order to unload their CF liabilities. Therefore, I would strongly suggest that you proceed very cautiously with this new venture into the world of used CF. However, OTOH, if everything proves square, I would then say that you're about to make a very good deal!....At this point, it's a crap shoot!


I agree, you would be taking a pretty big risk. It could turn out to be a great move or a complete nightmare. It has to be your call at this point, but, for the record, I still don't see what you would be sacrificing by taking the same amount of money and buying a brand new bike like a Specialized Allez with a pro fit and a warranty. They have like three versions of that bike for $1000 and under (one is less than this used bike) and people that own them rave about them. I also posted a link a few days ago to a review of a number of bikes for under $1000 that would provide the same benefits. If you love the Jamis though, you have to do what you think is best since it is your money.


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## DrAstro (Jul 24, 2013)

Being a beginner too, I know its easy to be caught up in getting a carbon bike. I think at this stage, its best to stick with a nicer aluminum than to risk a used carbon. I'd encourage you to look at the Giant Defy line of bikes too. They're well reviewed and at the shops around here they come in priced a little below comparable Specialized, Trek, Cannondale, Felt, Bianchi, etc. bikes.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

I'll stay with my previous advice re: purchasing used CF and add that (IMO) roughly 50% off a six year old (soon to be seven) is far from a fair deal. 

Sellers typically look at what a comparable new bike costs and price their used bike accordingly, forgetting technological advances and the fact that they offer no warranty.

As was stated, you can get a good, new bike from your LBS with a warranty and value added services (sizing/ fit assistance, etc.). Sometimes, bang for the buck is in those services.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Rashadabd said:


> there probably isn't just one "right way" to buy a bike.


IMO, especially for the uninitiated and whenever possible, there _is_ a method that betters the odds of success. 

That's to find a reputable LBS, discuss intended uses/ goals, budget, cycling experiences, get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest and head out on test rides - out on the roads and of some duration.

All the other methods/ variables you mentioned present pitfalls that (without taking proper steps) can result in a less than optimal purchasing experience. 

You hear more about the ones that work. The ones that don't have bikes sitting gathering dust in garages - or being sold on CL.


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## Zeet (Mar 24, 2013)

Zeet said:


> The price is fair enough (perhaps not).... However, price is not the problem. The problem lies in the fact that this is a used carbon fiber bike being purchased from a complete stranger. You know nothing about the seller or his bike. Carbon fiber bikes are notorious for concealing structural damage. Cycling on a previously crashed CF bike can prove to be a very dangerous venture. Many cyclists who have been involved in previous crashes, might feel reluctant about fully disclosing any information related to their previously crashed CF bikes. Therefore, to cut their losses, they go on Craigslist in order to unload their CF liabilities. Therefore, I would strongly suggest that you proceed very cautiously with this new venture into the world of used CF. However, OTOH, if everything proves square, I would then say that you're about to make a very good deal!....At this point, it's a crap shoot!


PJ might have a pretty good point with regards to the seller's current price on that 2007 Xenith Comp...


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

The reach on a road bike is not as malleable as it would seem. IME, an 80 mm stem is short enough to correlate with me not putting enough weight over the front wheel. I've come to think it's more about front-center distance, but reach is one that people are familiar with.

Head angle on a bicycle has an influence on handling feel. So does chainstay length.

Some riders will have a very hard time finding a seatpost to get their saddles in the right place on some bikes. Some riders will have a hard time getting their bars in the right place with some head tube lengths.

I finally gave up my too-big road bike and switched to one that's probably not as nice on paper, but I have to say I'm a lot happier having a bike with the right weight distribution for me when I ride it. Being able to have both "my" reach and good handling trump everything else. I'm very glad I demoed before buying my new mountain bike, too, even though I had to spend a few hundred more to get the size I ended up wanting.


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## andione1983 (Jul 23, 2013)

What is the big hype with carbon... Do they really have that much of an advantage over aluminium (i know I'm only doing 25-30klm a day) i can do around 26-28 klms per hour.. Would you get much more speed out of a carbon to be that noticeable for a newbie? My personal opinion is i think if an aluminium frame is heavier... Why not work on building up your strength for longer rides.. Pushing more weight... Then eventually down the track when you do get a carbon you will notice the difference on longer runs.. Dunno.. Just throwing my thoughts in again. (that's basically where I am at..)


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

andione1983 said:


> What is the big hype with carbon...


Carbons claim to fame is it's ability to dampen road buzz. On longer rides and/ or over the rough stuff, it'll serve to keep a rider fresher, longer. 

But you have a point re: weight. IME, a difference of 2-3 lbs. makes no difference at all in performance. What does, is improving the 'motor' (us). Ironically, more weight will contribute to that process because we're working harder to keep the momentum going - especially in headwinds/ climbs.


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## andione1983 (Jul 23, 2013)

Another thing I am thinking too... My main reason taking up biking is to loose some weight.. I was 108kgs. Now just under 100kgs..so every kg I drop will make it less for me to push.. So another reason to keep riding the bike I have.. As the weight loss will be me  I plan on dropping to around 90kgs..so another 10kgs off will be a heck of a difference


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## tddeangelo (Jun 28, 2013)

I bought a carbon bike, but not specifically BECAUSE it's carbon. I bought it because when I rode several bikes, that bike was the one that I just loved. It was comfortable, yet responsive to what I am able to do with it, noticeably moreso than others I compared it to. I kept trying bikes to find one that was NOT carbon that I liked as much, and I couldn't do it. Nothing lit me up the same way, lol. 

And, I have to agree with advice I was given here....whatever bike makes you want to get out there and ride it, that's the one to get. Carbon, aluminum, whatever....if you are just anxious to get on it and go, that's the one to get. The $5000 carbon bike that sits idle is useless.


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