# Stage 4 spoiler



## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

Gilbert didn't have it. Evans! with Conti almost nipping him at the line.


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## PJay (May 28, 2004)

*ac?*

ok, why is AC trying to head-butt up there with the sprinters?

everyone got the same finish time today.


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## harlond (May 30, 2005)

PJay said:


> ok, why is AC trying to head-butt up there with the sprinters?
> 
> everyone got the same finish time today.


The only sprinter up there was Thor--big props to him--and AC likes to win.

I'm writing off the chances of any alleged GC contender who wasn't able to stay with Thor up this hill.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

PJay said:


> ok, why is AC trying to head-butt up there with the sprinters?
> 
> everyone got the same finish time today.


He took 8 seconds back on Andy (not sure about other contenders.) Could be construed as a success there, or it could be seen as a dismal failure that he was unable to ride away from guys like Hushovd.


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## jwcurry83 (Jun 21, 2010)

PJay said:


> ok, why is AC trying to head-butt up there with the sprinters?
> 
> everyone got the same finish time today.


I was thinking the same thing... that move he made was for face-time IMO, he had absolutely nothing to gain from it (with the exception of maybe some confidence). I understand fighting for the stage win and everything, but not when you are trying to save yourself to make some big moves in the mountains.


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## harlond (May 30, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> He took 8 seconds back on Andy (not sure about other contenders.) Could be construed as a success there, or it could be seen as a dismal failure that he was unable to ride away from guys like Hushovd.


Seconds count, and no way it's a failure of any kind when he took time back from Wiggins, ASchleck, Basso, Leipheimer, Gesink. Much bigger failure for the guys that couldn't hang with Thor than the guy who put time into them.


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## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

PJay said:


> ok, why is AC trying to head-butt up there with the sprinters?
> 
> everyone got the same finish time today.


What race are you watching? No sprinters except Thor, not to mention a few small time gaps.


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## 88 rex (Mar 18, 2008)

harlond said:


> Seconds count, and no way it's a failure of any kind when he took time back from Wiggins, ASchleck, Basso, Leipheimer, Gesink. Much bigger failure for the guys that couldn't hang with Thor than the guy who put time into them.


Agreed. Evans seems to be his biggest threat now, and it is fun to watch some big names battle it out like that. I enjoy watching Evans race because he seems to always want to race to win. It was nice to see Conti try the same thing.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

harlond said:


> Seconds count, and no way it's a failure of any kind when he took time back from Wiggins, ASchleck, Basso, Leipheimer, Gesink. Much bigger failure for the guys that couldn't hang with Thor than the guy who put time into them.


True, I see the angle you're coming from.

I'd still imagine that it is a little disconcerting that the supposed best climber in the world can't shake Hushovd on a steep climb like that.


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## serpico7 (Jul 11, 2006)

robdamanii said:


> I'd still imagine that it is a little disconcerting that the supposed best climber in the world can't shake Hushovd on a steep climb like that.


Looked at another way, it's a little disconcerting when a sprinter is able to drop a bunch of GC contenders on a climb and keep up with the supposed best climber in the world. I'm not saying Thor is on anything. I'm just sayin.


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## PJay (May 28, 2004)

*40th place = 8 sec back.*



Jwiffle said:


> What race are you watching? No sprinters except Thor, not to mention a few small time gaps.


40th place = 8 sec back.

I understand the sprinters all wanting to be up front. I understand that Cadel actually has a mathematical change of being GC.

It seems like AC blew energy, and came out looking lousy.

Of course, maybe AC is trying to prompt other GC contenders into making a move early. Who knows. If Andy is forced to start working now, my guess is that that would favor AC.


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## nayr497 (Nov 8, 2008)

Anyone got a video link for the final 5k?

That was awesome!


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## MG537 (Jul 25, 2006)

robdamanii said:


> True, I see the angle you're coming from.
> 
> I'd still imagine that it is a little disconcerting that the supposed best climber in the world can't shake Hushovd on a steep climb like that.


Please don't confuse 1.7km climbs like the mur de Bretagne with the high Alps and/or Pyrenees. 
Climbs like today's, are commonplace during the spring classics that Thor competes in and yes some of those climbs are even cobbled. (Gent-Wevelgem, E3 Prijs, Tour of Flanders). Some may be even steeper (Koppenberg) or longer(Oude Kwaremont, muur-kapelmuur or the kruisberg).


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## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> True, I see the angle you're coming from.
> 
> I'd still imagine that it is a little disconcerting that the supposed best climber in the world can't shake Hushovd on a steep climb like that.


The profile put the climb at 6.9%. And less than 2km. So not really that steep, and due to the short length, I could see a motivated Thor keeping up. Thor has also gotten better at the climbs the last few years.

Remember when Thor took that long solo breakaway in the mountains to gain the points? He still finished a long time ahead of cav and the other sprinters, even after he was spit out the back of the peloton.

Now, a higher elevation, with an 8+% grade for 15+km, he'd drop off pretty quick. That's when the real climbers really come out to play.


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## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

Dispite the arguments that Conti should be sitting in and trying to save energy it was nice to see him try something today. He shut it down pretty fast when he saw he wasn't making big gains over everyone and then decided to try for the win (or at least thats the way I read it). I do think Conti gaining 8 seconds is worth something as he only had to accerate to do it, he did not sit at the front very long with Lotto and others coming to the front to drive the split. Andy should have been able to cover that with ease he was well positioned (right on Contis wheel) but didn't. It may mean nothing but I find it a bit telling, its likely only going to encourge Conti to attack him more.

Evans was brillant esp after having to come back from a mechanical and having the pressure of everyone predicting he could win/take the jersey, to pull it off (well the win anyway) will keep his team modivated to keep working. 

Big props to Thor to hang in there its more his sort of climb but still...

So far the tour has been great to watch I'm glad to see at least two of the GC favs out there duking it out for wins/time rather than a bunch of sitting in. Time will tell if that was the right move or not but for now it makes for great racing.


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## PJay (May 28, 2004)

*thanks.*



32and3cross said:


> Dispite the arguments that Conti should be sitting in and trying to save energy it was nice to see him try something today. He shut it down pretty fast when he saw he wasn't making big gains over everyone and then decided to try for the win (or at least thats the way I read it). I do think Conti gaining 8 seconds is worth something as he only had to accerate to do it, he did not sit at the front very long with Lotto and others coming to the front to drive the split. Andy should have been able to cover that with ease he was well positioned (right on Contis wheel) but didn't. It may mean nothing but I find it a bit telling, its likely only going to encourge Conti to attack him more.
> 
> Evans was brillant esp after having to come back from a mechanical and having the pressure of everyone predicting he could win/take the jersey, to pull it off (well the win anyway) will keep his team modivated to keep working.
> 
> ...


this helps figure it out. here at work, i am not watching, just following the chat-twitter coverage.


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## jswilson64 (May 20, 2008)

Funny comment from Velo News: 

Apparently more riders than Contador can drop Horner...


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Jwiffle said:


> The profile put the climb at 6.9%. And less than 2km. So not really that steep, and due to the short length, I could see a motivated Thor keeping up. Thor has also gotten better at the climbs the last few years.
> 
> Remember when Thor took that long solo breakaway in the mountains to gain the points? He still finished a long time ahead of cav and the other sprinters, even after he was spit out the back of the peloton.
> 
> Now, a higher elevation, with an 8+% grade for 15+km, he'd drop off pretty quick. That's when the real climbers really come out to play.


Not debating that Thor won't drop like a stone in the high mountains. I'm still surprised that he hung on through the supposed 10% or greater sections, and finished with the best in the race. 

Just doesn't seem characteristic of AC to look the way he did today, and not surprising to me that Andy was nowhere to be found.

Actually, today kind of reminded me of Cadel's win last year in Fleche.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

jswilson64 said:


> Funny comment from Velo News:
> 
> Apparently more riders than Contador can drop Horner...


Interviewed after the race Horner said he punctured and had to bust a gut to get back to the group just as they hit the climb. He was in with Wiggins, Andy, et al and just didn't have the legs to bridge up.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

I'm actually going to give conti some kudos here. This was the sort of climb that is for the strong men and he was the only pure climber that stuck it out to the end with the strong men. I am not a contador fan but I enjoyed watching him have to grit his teeth and really fight for it. Consider that everyone had Gilbert taken for granted as the winner today and conti finished ahead of him.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

As far as Chris horner goes, he had a flat and in an interview I heard him say that he took some time off and did not expect to be in super form during the first week of the race. He expects to peak in the last week, during the big mountain stages.


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## biobanker (Jun 11, 2009)

I cant remember the last time I saw so much pain on ACs face. To see him fight so hard (which is great) and still come up short, frankly, seems new. It was just weeks ago that he was playing with everyone at the Giro.

Love seeing Thor stick with him on a grade.....

Kloden just 10 sec back! Seems like it is anyone's race still.


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## Topher (Jun 5, 2005)

nayr497 said:


> Anyone got a video link for the final 5k?
> 
> That was awesome!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOs1yw0MwnQ

Haven't seen it in English yet.


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## nayr497 (Nov 8, 2008)

Wow...thanks, Topher! That just made my day.

True about ****ador, he did stick it out for a finish that doesn't really suit his style. And he did finish ahead of Phil Gil.

Great racing today. Tons to consider as we move on...


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## OldEndicottHiway (Jul 16, 2007)

32and3cross said:


> Dispite the arguments that Conti should be sitting in and trying to save energy it was nice to see him try something today. He shut it down pretty fast when he saw he wasn't making big gains over everyone and then decided to try for the win (or at least thats the way I read it). I do think Conti gaining 8 seconds is worth something as he only had to accerate to do it, he did not sit at the front very long with Lotto and others coming to the front to drive the split. Andy should have been able to cover that with ease he was well positioned (right on Contis wheel) but didn't. It may mean nothing but I find it a bit telling, its likely only going to encourge Conti to attack him more.
> 
> *Evans was brillant esp after having to come back from a mechanical and having the pressure of everyone predicting he could win/take the jersey, to pull it off (well the win anyway) will keep his team modivated to keep working. *
> 
> ...



Bingo. So happy for Evans. This makes two guys in two consecutive days to get their first ever TdF stage wins. Pretty neat. 

And I think those that pointed out this was not a climb necessarily suited to Contador's climbing, are right. Not sure anyone will hang with him once they get to the long mountain climbs. 

It's been a really fun and surprising race so far.


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## Len J (Jan 28, 2004)

OldEndicottHiway said:


> Bingo. So happy for Evans. This makes two guys in two consecutive days to get their first ever TdF stage wins. Pretty neat.
> 
> And I think those that pointed out this was not a climb necessarily suited to Contador's climbing, are right. Not sure anyone will hang with him once they get to the long mountain climbs.
> 
> It's been a really fun and surprising race so far.


I agree wait .......... until the 6th climb of of a 6 climb day in the third week of the tour and we will see who can hang with who.

I'm also glad to see Evans win a stage........But if he stays true to form, he will have one bad day.....let's hope it doesn't hurt him too bad.

I'd love to have heard Andy's comments.

Len


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Yes, the stage was awesome. I am really enjoying this tdf already. I really like the intermediate sprints now too; much more exciting.


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## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

I think this comment from the Cyclingnews story (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/evans-masters-mur-de-bretagne) about todays stage says alot about Evans.

"Teammate Marcus Burghardt, a rider who could have ridden for himself today, paid tribute to his leader's qualities at the finish.

"He's a good leader and someone I like working for. I'm here for him and my objectives come secondary." "

I have always liked the guy but agree that a few years ago he seemed to just be too brittle and edgy (I know some people who were on T-mobil with him and said that, at that point, he was hard to work with). Looks like he decided to change his approach on alot of fronts, its takes some real self evaluation and determination to do that and it appears to be paying off well for him, he been pretty brillant the last two years.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)




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## 55x11 (Apr 24, 2006)

PJay said:


> 40th place = 8 sec back.
> 
> I understand the sprinters all wanting to be up front. I understand that Cadel actually has a mathematical change of being GC.
> 
> ...


he almost won the stage (which would be a major blow, at least psychologically) and gained time, even though not that much. But it's not like we are facing mountain stages back to back next few days, and it's not like he burned all of the matches for the next 3 weeks.


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## AdamM (Jul 9, 2008)

> I'm actually going to give conti some kudos here. This was the sort of climb that is for the strong men and he was the only pure climber that stuck it out to the end with the strong men. I am not a contador fan but I enjoyed watching him have to grit his teeth and really fight for it. Consider that everyone had Gilbert taken for granted as the winner today and conti finished ahead of him.


I agree. I think Contador will be encouraged by the results today. He easily gapped the climbers and almost won a stage that was perfect set up for the big wattage guys.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

AdamM said:


> I agree. I think Contador will be encouraged by the results today. He easily gapped the climbers and almost won a stage that was perfect set up for the big wattage guys.


I wouldn't say easily. He was either hurting pretty badly or he was doing a pretty good job acting.


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## trobriand (Apr 2, 2009)

Great ending. I was surprised that Contador tried for the stage win, I figured he'd slide across the line within that group since he wasn't able to pull away. I love seeing GC guys go for a stage win.

I was counting on Cadel Evans to win, but wanting to see what Thor had me going out of my way to tune in. I can't wait to see how long he can hold the yellow.


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## 55x11 (Apr 24, 2006)

nayr497 said:


> Anyone got a video link for the final 5k?
> 
> That was awesome!


 http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/43642222#43642222


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## dougydee (Feb 15, 2005)

It was a great win by BMC today. They seem to have come together as a good team working in the same direction. It was great to hear Cadel full of praise for big Marcus and George, his team backed him in for the win and he delivered.
Fingers crossed Cadel doesn't have "that" bad day.


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## Creakyknees (Sep 21, 2003)

when's the last time you saw Levi pulling a face like this?


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## ohvrolla (Aug 2, 2009)

thechriswebb said:


> I'm actually going to give conti some kudos here. This was the sort of climb that is for the strong men and he was the only pure climber that stuck it out to the end with the strong men. I am not a contador fan but I enjoyed watching him have to grit his teeth and really fight for it. Consider that everyone had Gilbert taken for granted as the winner today and conti finished ahead of him.


What about JVDB? I see him more as climber than strong man. Short climb but a lot of effort and pain on those faces today.


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Creakyknees said:


> when's the last time you saw Levi pulling a face like this?



The same day I saw a similar look on contador's face for the first time.


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## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

I don't think there's much to be read about AC's attack. IMO, just looked like he went with the flow of already being near the front, expected that pack to stay as it was, and gave it a last-second go against Evans - who I'm still glad took a win  I also don't think we should start thinking AC is lookin' beat. He's not that savvy of a sprinter. Only thing I'd make out at most is he wasn't necessarily dominant.

But what I will read into is AC looking at Evans long before they were the front runners of that pack. Wonder what was he was thinking there...


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

That was one hell of a stage. Regardless of who I am rooting for or against, I felt respect for all of the guys battling their way up the wall. No, it wasn't a h.c. climb but I saw some wicked pain on the faces of some people who don't normally show it. Good battle.


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## Chainstay (Mar 13, 2004)

thechriswebb said:


> I'm actually going to give conti some kudos here. This was the sort of climb that is for the strong men and he was the only pure climber that stuck it out to the end with the strong men. I am not a contador fan but I enjoyed watching him have to grit his teeth and really fight for it. Consider that everyone had Gilbert taken for granted as the winner today and conti finished ahead of him.


And it was Conti's first attack that seemed to take the starch out of Gilbert. He could only follow when the next attack came from Evans.

The Omega boys lit all the birthday candles but Philip didn't have the wind today


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## thechriswebb (Nov 21, 2008)

Chainstay said:


> And it was Conti's first attack that seemed to take the starch out of Gilbert. He could only follow when the next attack came from Evans.
> 
> The Omega boys lit all the birthday candles but Philip didn't have the wind today


Gilbert can't blame his loss on a lack of team support.


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## moabbiker (Sep 11, 2002)

Gilbert simply looked tired. Grand tours just not his kind of thing. Would've easily swallowed everyone up if he had fresh legs, but that's just not the case here.

Bert did a good attempt to shake up the race. The climb was too short for him to get away from the GC guys, although note that Andy was not in the group. I'd highly be suspect of Andy's condition when he can't keep up on something like this. Should've been glued to Bert's wheel if was in perfect shape.

Evans did great, but he's put down so much energy the past few days. Similar story to last year's Giro where he peaked too early then flopped hard on the bigger climbs. I'm afraid the same may hold true here. Nothing wrong with his strategy as he's never been a consistent high mountain climber to begin with so capitalizing on early stage wins is the way to go.

For the GC Podium, I'd say Van den Broeck is a real danger for 2nd place. This guy is running really strong.


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## ocean-ro (Nov 23, 2009)

Most of the climbers are still recovering after TTT.I think A.Schleck burned more matches then any GC contenders in stage2. Good job for Contador testing his rivals.We can`t accuse him for trying to win a stage in TDF,right?
Thor was awesome!


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## Ridin'Sorra (Sep 7, 2004)

Maybe Andy didn't see Contador gaining any much from this stunt and hence didn't attack... why show his cards so early. He's leading over Conty.


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## datruuz (May 24, 2011)

Anyone know of a good live stream link?


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