# Cramping during races and hard training



## velorider

Hi, I've been riding and racing at lower amateur levels off and on since the late 80's with a 10 year hiatus from 92-01. Now last year I got the itch to start racing again and adjusted my training accordingly. I'm a Cat4 and I did 2 Cat3/4 races last year and was happy with my results - 15th and 17th with large fields. My problem is that every race, training race and long, hard training ride I battle cramps near the end. I had my first USAC race of the season last week and I finished 10th but it was a 4 lap, 27 mile circuit race and I started to feel twinges of a cramp in my calf on the second lap. The cramps got pretty bad in my calves on the last lap or I think my result would have been better. Temp was low 60's, I was hydrated so it's not dehydration. What can I do to keep from getting these cramps? On long training rides with the group I train with, I'm pretty much the fittest one and I still get the cramps and the guys I train with don't get them even when they're shot by the end of the ride. I need to find the cause of my cramps because, at 51, I'm giving myself only a couple of more seaons of real competition and I want to get to my highest level and the cramps are hindering my efforts. Thanks for any advice.


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## nightfend

Two kinds of cramps. One is from a lack of electrolytes: Calcium, Magnesium, Sodium, and Potassium. That's readily solved by drinking some type of electrolyte drink during your race. The second type of cramping comes from too much fatigue in the muscles. Basically you are going harder than your body is used to for too long a duration. Not much you can do about those cramps if they come on other than to back off a little and stretch on the bike. Sometimes that helps.

To combat the second type of muscle cramping, you will simply need to adapt your training by either doing training rides that are longer than you race (so your body is used to the distance), as well as training your muscles for the higher intensities.


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## CyclingVirtual

as above


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## froze

I had cramping issues for the first time when I moved to where the climate was hot and dry and nothing I did would stop it. So I went to an LBS in town and explained my problem and what I was doing for it, I was doing everything correctly but they said I probably needed more of something so they gave me a bottle of Stim-O-Stam, see: http://www.stimostam.com/ 

Then the sales guy said to start by taking one tab then ride, if the cramps return take two tabs on the 2nd ride etc. then take that dosage before every ride plus take one along on long rides of over 75 miles and take one about 2/3rd the way; continue that dosage for 3 weeks then cut back one tab. I got to 3 tabs and the cramps went away, after 3 weeks I cut it to 2 tabs and the cramps still stayed away.

Once I moved from that area I haven't had any problems with cramping and don't take the stuff anymore.

I'm not saying Stim-O-Stam is the only product that works, just saying it was the only product I bought and it worked without trying another product because it didn't work.

But before you buy stuff, try the things the other posters mentioned above because they don't cost anything to try, and if something works then great you don't need to spend money on something. But if you exhaust all the free to try advice and you got no relief then try Stim-O-Stam or some such product.


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## Mike T.

nightfend said:


> Two kinds of cramps. One is from a lack of electrolytes: Calcium, Magnesium, Sodium, and Potassium. That's readily solved by drinking some type of electrolyte drink during your race. The second type of cramping comes from too much fatigue in the muscles. Basically you are going harder than your body is used to for too long a duration. Not much you can do about those cramps if they come on other than to back off a little and stretch on the bike. Sometimes that helps.
> 
> To combat the second type of muscle cramping, you will simply need to adapt your training by either doing training rides that are longer than you race (so your body is used to the distance), as well as training your muscles for the higher intensities.


^^^^^ This x eleventy billion. I started with cramps back in '98 after 3 decades of never cramping. I could only get them on long hard rides when the intensity was pushed by other people. I couldn't make myself get them on solo rides.

I read tons of online material on cramping and they're caused by either of the above points by nightfend. I make damn sure I drink 1/4 bottle of home-brew electrolyte drink** every 15 minutes (I set my Garmin to beep at me) and ride Sportive rides at *my* pace. In the last one I didn't cramp - touch wood.

**Electrolite drink - 1/4 teaspoon of salt (for the sodium) and pinch of No-Salt (for the potassium) mixed in with my home-brew glucose powder drink (to which I'll add fructose powder to this year). Tums (for the calcium) have never helped me.


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## Sworker

I have horrible cramps when I ride, the 2nd type not the first. What kills me is that I get them long before i feel very tired or "noodle legs" as my riding partners claim them get. I have tried essentially everything although I am going to try Stim-O-Stam since I have not heard of that.

Best advise is keep yourself as hydrated as possible, take along a salt and potassium pill set with you and get some Magnesium and take that daily. These are harder to find than potassium, I got them on-line from this company called "Swanson". They have triple magnesium complex and really helps. That all said, sometimes you just cannot avoid having the cramps come on, so once you know your going to get them take some Hyland's Leg Cramp pills. They have them in a few forms, but the ones you want are quick dissolving tablets. I found those also at Swanson but you can find the regular ones and nightime ones at local stores like Rite Aid. 

I have (as some of the other posters here) battled cramps all of my life, even as a teenager during ski races and football games and my dad has the same issues. I now take the tablets at the very first sign of a cramp and I also take the regular Hyland leg cramp pills (these are made to be swallowed whole) about every 2 hours during century rides. But the quick dissolving ones can save your life if your about to get hit with a big cramp.

Another product I am meaning to try are called Crampeze, but if you look at the ingredients they are really just B6 and Magnesium....it is the Magnesium we mostly lack according to my friend who is a very shart phara.

Last thing, get some of the Margarita Shot Blocks from Cliff, they have 3X the sodium in them and say "cramp breakers" right on the sleeze. I also find these help...for me during any 100 mile ride I have to take all of these no matter how much I have trained, even finishing strong I will still battle cramps with over 5 hours of riding, but you can beat them down. 

Put in one good order to Swanson (that is what I do) to get 3-4 bottles of the quick dissolving tablets and a years supply of the Magnesium which I cannot find in CVS, Rite-Aid or Walgreens.


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## Gervase

in my research, the 4 things that cause cramp are 1 Dehydration (this is obviously the most important) , 2 electrolytes, so that as mentioned need to make sure you have enough and of course related and linked with hydration. 3..Stretching, Muscles need to be flexible and more they are the better your chances of NOT cramping. 4. the cold: obviously your aware of that from your post's. 
In fact I think your probably aware of all the stuff I just posted, but then again...perhaps it may remind you to focus a bit more no these factors. in no 4 is also the opposite we cramp in the heat, but this is more link with Dehydration. 
the new theory that I subscribe to is that the harder you push then obviously more lactates build up or accumulate in the muscle. the theory is that these Lactates cause the electrical impulses in the muscle to short circuit, & then the muscle fires on itself..Makes sense to me, and it only happens of course with the build up, or when you have been pushing hard or too your limits.
I have discovered that I can spin these cramps away. I only get them in long hard races, so that I will cramp past the 100km mark, when say doing a 160km ride, I might get them in the last 20km after racing hard for 140km. 
Being able to spin them away, seems to me to substantiate this theory. if I can clear the lactate from my legs by spinning, which I can, I am then able to push hard again. So i tend to believe that spinning also keeps my legs from getting lactate build up, or keep on top of it. 
I have done 4 day tours and never cramped, every day is a race. I made sure my cadence stayed in the 100 plus range, sitting around 105rpm. I noticed that on the fourth day I was leading the pack, feeling good, when others had obviously faded.
I do think though that conditioning is vital too, in that your body must be accustomed to going hard.


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## earlfoss

I have had good luck using Hammer's Endurolytes. Cramped up the first 2 races of the year, started using them along with my normal routine and they haven't bothered me since.


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## Andrew L

I cramped really bad today because we had a nasty headwind. Quads and hamstrings were both locking up. I think it was due to me pushing my legs harder than they've been pushed this year. Endurolytes seem to help usually.


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## stevesbike

exercise-induced cramping is most likely not caused by dehydration or electrolyte depletion. There is neither good empirical support for these models nor plausible physiological mechanisms for them. Exercise-induced cramping is most likely due to altered neuromuscular control. There's a good review on this: Cause of Exercise Associated Muscle Cramps (EAMC) — altered neuromuscular control, dehydration or electrolyte depletion?


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## Andrew L

stevesbike said:


> exercise-induced cramping is most likely not caused by dehydration or electrolyte depletion. There is neither good empirical support for these models nor plausible physiological mechanisms for them. Exercise-induced cramping is most likely due to altered neuromuscular control. There's a good review on this: Cause of Exercise Associated Muscle Cramps (EAMC) &#151; altered neuromuscular control, dehydration or electrolyte depletion?


Thanks man. I could only find a summary of the article because I had to pay for the full article. Here's a link for others that are interested.

http://www.injuryexplained.com/cramp.html


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## olr1

More on the subject here:

The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part I

The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part III

The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part IV

The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part V

Unfortunately, the idea that cramp = lack of electrolytes is so deeply ingrained in both sports and popular culture, that it will take a while for us to stop 'treating' it with expensive salty drinks...


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## froze

Electrolytes: Understanding Replacement Options
Muscle Cramp - OrthoInfo - AAOS
Pickle Juice
Muscle Cramps Causes, Cramping Prevention, Treatment Information - MedicineNet (several parts)
Treating and Preventing Muscle Cramps during Exercise


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## Andrew L

olr1 said:


> More on the subject here:
> 
> The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part I
> 
> The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part III
> 
> The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part IV
> 
> The Science of Sport: Muscle Cramps: Part V
> 
> Unfortunately, the idea that cramp = lack of electrolytes is so deeply ingrained in both sports and popular culture, that it will take a while for us to stop 'treating' it with expensive salty drinks...


Good stuff! I guess I just need to train harder


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## velocanman

Train like you race and add electrolytes. Your drink may not provide enough. I like Hammer Endurolytes bit some nutritionists say salt is enough. Endurolytes have helped me in many races when others dropped out.


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## Sworker

I just did the Sequoia Century in Palo Alto, CA last weekend. I finally got very exacting about the dosage and regular use of my supplement battery. I put a package together in a little ziplock bag for 6 doses that included in each
2 Salt Tablets
1 Magnesium
1 Potassium
2 Sport Legs
1 (or 2) Hylands Cramping Pills

I put 6 of these together and I had only one small cramp that I quickly got rid of with a Hylands quick acting tablet. This is the first time I have finished a century without one really bad cramp the whole time. I have was trained more then adquately for this ride and I finished fast, finding the right mix of these was key. I plan to add the Hammer Electrolytes to my combo for the Death Ride, where cramps cost me the 5th and final pass last year. I rode with a guy who had a stash of those and I liked them. First time using salt tabs and they for sure made a difference.

FYI, anything under 70 miles or 6k of climbing I don't need really any of these, it is that over 70 miles and more climbing I need these. I also used 3 sleeves of Margarita Shot Blocks which you can really feel on the long climbs.


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## froze

Sworker said:


> I just did the Sequoia Century in Palo Alto, CA last weekend. I finally got very exacting about the dosage and regular use of my supplement battery. I put a package together in a little ziplock bag for 6 doses that included in each
> 2 Salt Tablets
> 1 Magnesium
> 1 Potassium
> 2 Sport Legs
> 1 (or 2) Hylands Cramping Pills
> 
> I also used 3 sleeves of Margarita Shot Blocks which you can really feel on the long climbs.


You sound like a pro or darn near close to being one, congrats on getting there.

I have questions about your doses of stuff you take. Why are you taking a magnesium tab in addition to more mag in the Sports Legs? And the Potassium too? Too much of this stuff can lead to some serious problems. Not sure how many mg's your taking but you should consult a doctor to find out if your taking too much, because this stuff can effect your heart in negative ways. 

The highlands is just quinine which has been used for years to treat various illnesses, but it does have some side effects including ear ringing, dizziness, nausea, headaches, blurry vision, hives, bleeding due to blood clutting failure. But obviously your taking a low enough dosage those side effects won't be problems. I guess my concern here would be more towards the slowing of the clutting, if you have a bike accident and are bleeding you may not clot as fast as you would normally which could cause an excess of blood loss, or it you have to go into surgery and you have uncontrolled bleeding. It's the same reason doctors request that you don't take aspirin type of meds 30 days before surgery.

Personally I don't, and never got into all the weird stuff when I use to race except for a 1/2 a cup of coffee before a race, and on long races I filled a GU bottle with coffee.


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## Sworker

This isn't weird stuff, the mag and potassium are both low dosage tablets each one is 99 megs which is 3% of the dailyi allotment. I use the Mag since that is a one missing from many products. If I remember correctly each tablet is 5% of the daily. The sports legs are not anything that has a big effect and has only minimal cumulative effects.

The Hylands with Quinine is certainly not anything that is dangerous, I spoke at length with the owner of the LBS's father who is a Ph.D. Pharmacist about those and the whole package. Given the levels of sweat and energy spent there is little or no dangerous effects.

This ain't exactly roid's and cocaine, just normal stuff. I have neve experienced any side effects whatsoever from anything. Now if you had the seriously strong Potassium pills for sure the heart could suffer, that is whyI use the lower dosage pills. And, I cut the crap out of my inner calf on my chain ring during the last right when my left pedal blew out and it clotted up just fine 

If you dont have cramping issues like Froze your good, but I do and i can tell you any small side effect that the anti-cramping pills and the rest of the regiment might have are a small price to pay to avoid a cramp where I am essentially a cripple when they hit.


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## Andrew L

Sworker said:


> I just did the Sequoia Century in Palo Alto, CA last weekend. I finally got very exacting about the dosage and regular use of my supplement battery. I put a package together in a little ziplock bag for 6 doses that included in each
> 2 Salt Tablets
> 1 Magnesium
> 1 Potassium
> 2 Sport Legs
> 1 (or 2) Hylands Cramping Pills
> 
> I put 6 of these together and I had only one small cramp that I quickly got rid of with a Hylands quick acting tablet. This is the first time I have finished a century without one really bad cramp the whole time. I have was trained more then adquately for this ride and I finished fast, finding the right mix of these was key. I plan to add the Hammer Electrolytes to my combo for the Death Ride, where cramps cost me the 5th and final pass last year. I rode with a guy who had a stash of those and I liked them. First time using salt tabs and they for sure made a difference.
> 
> FYI, anything under 70 miles or 6k of climbing I don't need really any of these, it is that over 70 miles and more climbing I need these. I also used 3 sleeves of Margarita Shot Blocks which you can really feel on the long climbs.


Hmm, sounds very interesting. I think I might give your cocktail a try, thanks for the tip!


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## froze

Sworker said:


> This isn't weird stuff, the mag and potassium are both low dosage tablets each one is 99 megs which is 3% of the dailyi allotment. . If I remember correctly each tablet is 5% of the daily. The sports legs are not anything that has a big effect and has only minimal cumulative effects.
> 
> The Hylands with Quinine is certainly not anything that is dangerous, I spoke at length with the owner of the LBS's father who is a Ph.D. Pharmacist about those and the whole package. Given the levels of sweat and energy spent there is little or no dangerous effects.
> .


I'm glad your not taking cocaine or roids for your cycling thrills!!! One thing about taking that stuff is if you did cramp not sure if you would remember cramping!

I use to have cramping when I lived in the Mojave Desert area of California, before and after leaving there I never had it again. When I did cramped I found cheaper alternatives then what your doing and they worked fine, not sure if they would work for you but maybe worth looking into since they contain similar dosages of the same thing. 

First off Gatorade at full strength will provide 150mg of sodium and 40mg of Potassium, I drank that just over full strength before a ride and 50% diluted during a ride. Then the thing that helped with the cramps was a product that a RAAM race captain told me about called Stim O Stam that has 82.5mg of Potassium, 300mg of phosphorus, and 90.9mg of vitamin C (not sure what the C would do) per 3 tabs. Then there's another product found commonly on the market including Walmart called Emergen-C that the same RAAM race captain mentioned, this has a variety of vitamins plus 38mg of phosphorus, 60mg of magnesium, and 200mg of potassium, and 60mg of sodium per packet.

What the captain told me was to drink a full glass of Emergen-C about 3 to 2 1/2 hours before a ride and then drink a glass of Gatorade about an hour before the ride and take a Stim-O-Stam with it. Ride and see if the cramps return, if they did take 2 Stim-o-Stams before the next ride and retest, then 3 if they return. Once I got to the point where the cramps went away I would continue with that dosage for 3 weeks then cut the Stim-O Stam by 1 tab and see if they return, if they don't return after 3 weeks to reduce to just one and see what happens. Then on long rides take one Stim-O-Stam about 1/2 way through the ride. My cramping needed 3 of the Stim-O-Stams but after 6 weeks I got down to just one.

Not saying you need to do what I mentioned above, it's just a cheaper alternative that worked very well for me, and it worked well for the RAAM team captain and his team that lived and trained in the same area I did.


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## Sworker

My issue is I cannot stand green Gatorade traditional at full strenght and I hate the taste of it. I will for sure throw up if i drink that stuff. I use Zipp Fizz which is a high concentrate of electrolytes but not alot of salt or sugar. Thus I add the Cliff Shot Blocks for the sugar.

I have heard of Stimm-o-stam but have never seen it...but would give it a try. I also have Emergen-C thanks for that tip. But the combo I put together is for sure not expensive and I have never experienced any psychotropic effects from taking these. 

Thanks again for you advise, you have no idea how big of an issue cramping is for me. I literally cramped in every century I did (7 of them) until this last Sunday when I used the full regiment and I didn't have one!! And I was never at all psychologically impaired from any of these substances.

I will add pre-ride Emergency-C and take a look at Stimm Stam


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## Andy Pancroft

Been racing for 30 years! All this Hammer and other product nonsense is a bit much and can get pretty spendy. First, quick replacement for electrolyte deficiency is pickle juice - old and reliable fix!! Aside from that, find yourself a good Full Spectrum Mineral supplemental!!


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## Gervase

Phys Ed: Can Pickle Juice Stop Muscle Cramps? - NYTimes.com
This is about a study on the effectiveness of pickle juice. Obviously it works, but I think that like the man says being well conditioned is best, & as mentioned u can cramp even when you know you have plenty of electrolytes, so I don't think thats the whole answer. 
I am more convinced its to do with lactate salt build ups


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## pedalruns

Andrew L said:


> Thanks man. I could only find a summary of the article because I had to pay for the full article. Here's a link for others that are interested.
> 
> http://www.injuryexplained.com/cramp.html


Thanks for posting this.. I've been riding for years and have always had to fight cramping.. This is exactly what happens to me. A slow warm-up helps me and the fitter the better, but still... This last weekend on a ride I went out way to fast but backed off before I was in the red and still ended up cramping before mile 10.. even though I felt good, but my legs said otherwise. It is also getting worse with age!


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## froze

pedalruns said:


> Thanks for posting this.. I've been riding for years and have always had to fight cramping.. This is exactly what happens to me. A slow warm-up helps me and the fitter the better, but still... This last weekend on a ride I went out way to fast but backed off before I was in the red and still ended up cramping before mile 10.. even though I felt good, but my legs said otherwise. It is also getting worse with age!


I read that site, but my experiences were different. The site claims hot humid climates brings it on, in my case hot dry climate brought it on, I have no problems in hot humid climates. I'm older now then when I cramped, and I was in better shape when I cramped then I am now. I was stretching when I was cramping because I was told to do that to prevent them but cramped anyways, I no longer stretch and I don't cramp.

I guess I'm from Mars.


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## Sworker

Dude, you have been RACING for 30 years. I started road biking in 2008. I cramped as a teenager skiing, I cramped when I was 12 playing 12 innings at catcher. It is just the way my body is wired, I am not alone. I wish I hadn't hung up my bike when I turned 16, at least I started Mountain biking again in 1991, but cramps are the bane of my existence. I train as much as I can (I have 3k in this year already) but I know when I do a big climbing century no matter what I do, I will cramp. I tried basics and cramped, I worked my way up to my current regiment over 3 years of trrying to do century rides without the pain and frankly horror of cramping. Last year at the Death Ride in Lake Tahoe it took my chances of 5 passes away from me, so I just do it. Totally worth the .50 cents the natural pills cost me.


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## froze

I believe Sworker is right, some people are wired differently. I had friends who cramped a lot and others who didn't and we all did the same stuff. Not sure what caused my rash of cramping when I moved to the Mojave Desert area of Calif, was told it was due to heat and dryness, took some actions and eventually found the secret, once I moved from there cramping stopped and haven't taken anything to prevent them since.


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## pedalruns

froze said:


> I read that site, but my experiences were different. The site claims hot humid climates brings it on, in my case hot dry climate brought it on, I have no problems in hot humid climates. I'm older now then when I cramped, and I was in better shape when I cramped then I am now. I was stretching when I was cramping because I was told to do that to prevent them but cramped anyways, I no longer stretch and I don't cramp.
> 
> I guess I'm from Mars.


What I got from it.. was hard efforts caused muscle to become fatigued and then fire differently causing the cramps.. and it was more prone to be in hot and humind conditions.. I think everyone is 'wired' differently and different things work or don't work.... but for me it is good to hear these reasons and not that you are just dehydrated like everyone says.


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