# where are the Tommy D haters?



## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

it's been a few hours since the Lombardia finish and no one's posted yet that Danielson came in last among those who finished. 94th - 16 minutes back.


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## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

Look at the only other Lombardia thread...


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## ProRoad (Oct 13, 2008)

at least he finished


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## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

ProRoad said:


> at least he finished


It's more than I could do.


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## Sojourneyman (Jun 22, 2007)

I was hoping he'd do well.


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## Mootsie (Feb 4, 2004)

He was Garmin's protected rider.... Ouch.


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## teffisk (Mar 24, 2006)

seriously tho. damn. 16 minutes. they should sack him like he sacked his own career.


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## jhamlin38 (Oct 29, 2005)

Danielson needs like two or three SOLID years with consistant top 5's and top 10's in LBL, Flanders, and some shorter, hilly stage races before he can hope to contend in a race like Lombardia. The fact that he was "the protected rider" shows that Vaughters knew his team was toast, and had only a remote chance of a result. TD has had a very tough couple years. I feel bad for the guy. But to "make it" in the pro peleton, you have to have grit, toughness, strong will, and GOOD luck. He may have the former, but certainly doesn't have the latter. If he didn't have bad luck, he wouldn't have any luck at all.
I just can't bash the guy. 
He should come back to the US, and I think he would be far more effective and win some US races.


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2008)

jhamlin38 said:


> Danielson needs like two or three SOLID years with consistant top 5's and top 10's in LBL, Flanders, and some shorter, hilly stage races before he can hope to contend in a race like Lombardia. .............


Danielson is now 30.

He doesn't have 2 or 3 years of development time.


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## jhamlin38 (Oct 29, 2005)

toomanybikes said:


> Danielson is now 30.
> 
> He doesn't have 2 or 3 years of development time.


I know that. Rather, that is what he should have had under his belt up to now, or in advance of being successful in any MAJOR classic. 

On the otherhand. Since he's raced so little over the past two years, He could string together a few years, being as "fresh" as he SHOULD BE. He seems like a "youngish" 30. What do you think?


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## Rosicky (Mar 30, 2005)

Well I have never seen Brajkovic in any of those races and he got second...


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2008)

jhamlin38 said:


> I know that. Rather, that is what he should have had under his belt up to now, or in advance of being successful in any MAJOR classic.
> 
> On the otherhand. Since he's raced so little over the past two years, He could string together a few years, being as "fresh" as he SHOULD BE. He seems like a "youngish" 30. What do you think?


I think he could spend the next 3 years getting kid glove treatment, sleeping in a Hyper-Baric chamber, carefully selected racing exposure, etc.

And still come in dead last.

He is one of the most over-hyped pros ever.


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## zmudshark (Jan 28, 2007)

toomanybikes said:


> I think he could spend the next 3 years getting kid glove treatment, sleeping in a Hyper-Baric chamber, carefully selected racing exposure, etc.
> 
> And still come in dead last.
> 
> He is one of the most over-hyped pros ever.


No, be honest. What do you _really_ think? :lol:


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## jhamlin38 (Oct 29, 2005)

Well I guess the OP did aske for the TD haters. And they're certainly here. 
After hearing his interviews, he sounds like, and seems like a pretty nice guy, that just aint tough enough to hack it in the europeleton. 
I hope he gets one more stab at riding full time in europe so he can realize his potential. Is he signed for next year? 
Perhaps he'd be better off with a spanish club like xacbeo or euskatel. They seem to stay away from more of the gritty hard classics and race the hilly, warmweathered spanish/portuguese semiclassics and such. 
I don't think I'd lay any money on td to contend in PR!


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## sbindra (Oct 18, 2004)

jhamlin38 said:


> Well I guess the OP did aske for the TD haters. And they're certainly here.
> After hearing his interviews, he sounds like, and seems like a pretty nice guy, that just aint tough enough to hack it in the europeleton.
> I hope he gets one more stab at riding full time in europe so he can realize his potential. Is he signed for next year?
> Perhaps he'd be better off with a spanish club like xacbeo or euskatel. They seem to stay away from more of the gritty hard classics and race the hilly, warmweathered spanish/portuguese semiclassics and such.
> I don't think I'd lay any money on td to contend in PR!


Euskatel hires Basque riders - only exception is Samuel Sanchez and he is from Asturias (on the northern coast of Spain on the Atlantic side very close to the Basque country).


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## jorgy (Oct 21, 2005)

Danielson has been a big whiner this season. Complained about not being selected for the tour even though it was painfully clear he would have been mostly dead weight, blah, blah, blah.

Before this year I kinda felt bad for the guy, but now I generally dislike him.


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## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

no one is talking about him cause its over he shoudl come back to the ststes and try and win redlands which I some how doubt he could do any more.


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## Susan Walker (Mar 21, 2008)

Rosicky said:


> Well I have never seen Brajkovic in any of those races and he got second...


He seemed to think he got first: http://www.cyclingnews.com/photos/2...oct08/lombardia08/bettiniphoto_0031364_1_full


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## Sprocket - Matt (Sep 13, 2005)

Not a Hater... But I hate seeing him down that far...


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## agm2 (Sep 18, 2008)

Well none of the GC riders did that well in Lombardia, truthfully. It was a rather dismal performance from them all. They were all spent and it showed. TD finished atleast, and now it's off to the off-season to get ready for next year


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## bruin11 (May 21, 2004)

Susan Walker said:


> He seemed to think he got first: http://www.cyclingnews.com/photos/2...oct08/lombardia08/bettiniphoto_0031364_1_full


He would have zipped up if he thought he was going to win


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

Tommy D is a GC rider now?


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

agm2 said:


> Well none of the GC riders did that well in Lombardia, truthfully. It was a rather dismal performance from them all. They were all spent and it showed. TD finished atleast, and now it's off to the off-season to get ready for next year


And here I thought than in order to be a GC rider you at least had to start a grand tour during the year.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

den bakker said:


> And here I thought than in order to be a GC rider you at least had to start a grand tour during the year.


And finish one in the top ten within the last two years. Or finish one out of the top ten in the last two years. Or even make it past stage one of a grand tour in the last two years.

Overhyped.


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## agm2 (Sep 18, 2008)

Sorry guys, I meant Garmin Chipotle riders. I guess I've been hanging out on their site to much and forgot that GC could mean something else.


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## Susan Walker (Mar 21, 2008)

bruin11 said:


> He would have zipped up if he thought he was going to win


Not in a close 2-up sprint with the group closing. Anyway, I'm sure he did know he was second. Sort of a breakthrough performance, he's allowed to be happy.


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## jhamlin38 (Oct 29, 2005)

I agree that he knew he wasn't winning, but was jubilant about getting second. I'm sure while the final kilometers were flying by, his ds (bruyneel) updated how far Cunego was. I think its great for a young guy to celebrate a good result.


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## coop (Jun 8, 2008)

Is the rider that everybody loves to hate about to become a free agent? Velonews will have more on Monday, but does anybody have any speculation?


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## levels1069 (Jun 9, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> no one is talking about him cause its over he shoudl come back to the ststes and try and win redlands which I some how doubt he could do any more.


Pfffft, he wouldn't have a chance at Redlands. Especially considering that Peter Stetina is the new young phenom that Garmin is developing into their GC guy. 

TD cracked under the 'next lance armstrong' pressure that everyone put on him, I don't think any of the legit pros ever thought he was anything to behold. Rather, the public perception during the search for the next Lance pointed collectively to him and he just crumbled. On top of that, he is a huge gigantic cry baby who can't stay healthy for the life of himself. I can name 20 riders who would better fulfill a spot on the Garmin team than TD.


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## Mootsie (Feb 4, 2004)

Everything said by TD and Vaugthers up to this point is that he is signed for next year with Garmin unless there is a recent change.


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

You think Tom is looking for a job?



_Tom Danielson – former teammate at Discovery

"This is such good news for the sport and especially for cycling in the US. I rode the Tour of California and the Tour of Georgia with Lance in 2005 and the crowds that guy brings in are just incredible. So if he comes back and races Georgia and California again then it will be fantastic. It's going to inspire so many people out there to get into the sport of cycling for the first time and to get back out on their bike like he has.

"Lance never did anything half-assed so if he's going to come back you can bet that he's going to aim for the very top. When I was racing with him he was just awesome. Still, the guy has nothing to prove, especially in my eyes. I don't think there will be any problem with Contador and Armstrong on the same team. Those guys at Astana are just so professional, so I'm sure that they'll settle everything. If anything if could just make them even stronger, with Lance, Contador and Levi all able to go for the overall. _


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## Digger28 (Oct 9, 2008)

bigpinkt said:


> You think Tom is looking for a job?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


One would think he missed being on a team with Lance and Bruyneel...:mad2:


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## moonmoth (Nov 8, 2008)

Mootsie said:


> Everything said by TD and Vaugthers up to this point is that he is signed for next year with Garmin unless there is a recent change.


And to solidify this, JV just said today that he will be TD's personal coach this upcoming year. If TD cannot make the Garmin Tour 2009 roster with this type of backing, he'll have to change teams to get into the Tour. It won't be easy because Garmin is stacked with riders, and I figure that there is only wildcard spot at most. JV has already indicated that Cozza and Farrar should be on the team this year; add up the other givens: Vande Velde, Millar, Zabriskie, Wiggins, and Tuft, plus he's gotta try to honor the efforts of Pate, Frischkorn, and Lowe from this year's Tour, and I think Dan Martin will be in the competition too. TD's advantage, if he stays physically and mentally healthy, is that he is Grand Tour-proven and can stay with CVV in the hills, for most of the way.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

At this point, with the team stacked the way it is, I don't think Tommy has a hope in hell of making the Tour team. I don't think that JV will subject Martin to the pressures of the Tour at his age. He'll put him in the Giro or Vuelta first. JV is going to have at least 12 guys strong enough to be usefull at the Tour, and TD will be #13.


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## moonmoth (Nov 8, 2008)

mtbbmet said:


> I don't think that JV will subject Martin to the pressures of the Tour at his age. He'll put him in the Giro or Vuelta first. JV is going to have at least 12 guys strong enough to be usefull at the Tour, and TD will be #13.


I tend to agree with you about Martin but I've seen some hints in the last month or two that DM is being readied for the Tour. We'll see. JV wants to win time trials (team and individual) which is fine but that leaves CVV alone in the mountains. It's clear that it's unrealistic to expect Millar to keep CVV company in the clouds, and given that, he's only got a few options: Martin, a healthy TD, Lowe (if he continues to improve), and perhaps Tom Peterson. I guess we can't forget that Zabriskie rode well for Andy Schleck in last year's Giro. Of all those, TD has most European altitude experience and accomplishments. We'll see if he can get his head on straight in 2009.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

You seem to be forgetting the last guy that CVV had in the mountains last year. Hesjedal. I would imagine that he will be back on the team before Lowe because Ryder was able to stick out the climbs for longer that Lowe. It was Hesjedal that helped limit CVV's loses to less than 3 minutes after he crashed in the final week.


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## moonmoth (Nov 8, 2008)

mtbbmet said:


> You seem to be forgetting the last guy that CVV had in the mountains last year. Hesjedal.


Mountain bikers everywhere agree with you!

Yes, you're right -- Ryder will certainly be in the hunt for a slot on the TdF squad, as well. It's going to be hard to keep him and Pate off the team, Dean too, given the experience they have with two Grand Tours under their belt for the team. Backstedt, um, no, because he doesn't appear to be able to finish stage races anymore. Certainly, one or two of these guys will be injured or out of form by selection time but it's going to be a hard decision.


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