# Perpetuem spoilage questions



## dekindy (Jul 7, 2006)

I am well aware of the spoilage issue with Perpetuem but have been unable to search and find an answer to these specific questions.

Does mixing Perpertuem into a batter or paste delay spoilage as compared to a multi-hour bottle mixd for 2 or 3 hours?
Does a thicker concentration in a multi-hour delay spoilage as compated to an hour bottle?

Is it possible to mix Perpetuem and Hammergel into a paste? Does this delay spoilage or actually prevent spoilage becaue water is not used?


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## coachstevo (Sep 11, 2009)

i've used perpeteum all last year, and never had an issue with spoilage - i mix a 3 hour bottle, as with two water bottles that's about the extent i can ride (on climbing days) without a refill.
i rode in frickin' hot weather a bunch and no issues.

I do carry little snack bags of mix for refills...


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## chuckice (Aug 25, 2004)

I've never had it spoil on 8-12hr hot rides but I can definitely say that warm/hot perpetuem is disgusting. I've switched to the perpetuem chewables...much better + no mixing required.


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## cyclesport45 (Dec 10, 2007)

Make a bottle only half full with Perpetuem (at appropriate concentration for length of ride) the night before. Freeze it. Just before riding, fill the bottle with more Perpetuem (also at appropriate concentration). It will be very cold, and not disgusting.

For my fast centuries, I make my first bottle like this, and my second bottle gets filled, then frozen. Cold perpetuem for 5 or 6 hours!

Going to try the Solids this summer.


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

Yeah, it takes a really long time to spoil. You can improve the flavor by adding some stevia.

The Perpetuem Solids are not "chewables". They're more like "break them a bit with teeth, then suck on them". If you try to fully chew them, they're going to be big, dry, and tough to finish.


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## EMB145 Driver (Aug 17, 2006)

If you call Hammer, they will tell you to use it within 12 hours of mixing it. I mix mine thick, like pancake batter and put it in a soft flask. Often, I mix several at a time and toss them all in the freezer to use as needed. The stuff will last as long as fish, steak, or anything else in the freezer. IMO, it's much easier to eat it thick in the summer, than to try and drink it.


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## cowboygrrl (May 28, 2011)

Check the Hammer website. The answer is there. Yes it spoils. I think they recommend tossing after 4-5 hours, maybe less with heat. I used Perpetuem for a 100 mile kayak race last year in 93º F heat. I used multi-hour bottles. I believe I mixed a 4-hour bottle max. My crew had a fresh bottle at checkpoints or on a bike you can put the appropriate amount of powder in a bottle and add water when needed. I have a 112k race this July. It will be hot. I'm starting with a mixed bottle and taking an unmixed bottle on the bike with me. Yes you can make a paste but I've never used it that way.


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

I did two 200k rides this week and used Perpetuem Solids; they were great in the heat! Far better than liquid Perpetuem would have been.


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## cowboygrrl (May 28, 2011)

pmt said:


> I did two 200k rides this week and used Perpetuem Solids; they were great in the heat! Far better than liquid Perpetuem would have been.


I've been thinking of trying these. What flavor did you use?


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

*Perpetuem Solids*



cowboygrrl said:


> I've been thinking of trying these. What flavor did you use?


Strawberry. Be sure you know how to use them!


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## Stumpjumper FSR (Aug 6, 2006)

pmt said:


> I did two 200k rides this week and used Perpetuem Solids; they were great in the heat! Far better than liquid Perpetuem would have been.


Was it difficult to eat these while riding your bike? 
How many did you use per hour and did you use any gels or heed?


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

*Perpetuem Solids*



Stumpjumper FSR said:


> Was it difficult to eat these while riding your bike?
> How many did you use per hour and did you use any gels or heed?


Easy to eat on the bike; I also use both Hammer Gel and HEED. I guess about two per hour; with the other stuff I have plenty of calorie intake.


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## Killroy (Feb 9, 2006)

I have tested Perpetuem Solids on a couple 8 hour + rides and have found they they work a lot better for me than mixing multi-hour bottle.

They are chalky, but I like them with a swig of water.


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## velocanman (Jul 15, 2011)

Another HUGE thumbs up for Perpetuem solids. I switched to them as soon as them came out. I ordered the tub because it seemed like an obvious good idea. They are a little "chalky" and then chewy once wet, but I guess this is what it takes to keep them together without spoiling. 

Much easier to use than a multi-hour bottle or packet of mix. I carry two flip-top tubes with me for century rides. One serving is three tablets so it takes more than you think. But since I also drink Hammer or whatever is available on the century and some real food, I can get by with 2-3 solids per hour.


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## Killroy (Feb 9, 2006)

I use 3 solids per hour which is about 100 calories per hour for my 140 lb. I find that I can regulate my calories a lot better this way. Funny thing is that the solids taste a lot better all day long, while multi-hour bottles start to taste like fuel to me. Yuck.


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## ChazMan428 (Oct 29, 2008)

*Perpetuem spoilage*

I can't speak to mixing it into a paste, but I've mixed 2 gallons of the stuff on a Thursday night, kept it cold, and it was fine in my SAG for a self-sagged 160-miler in the heat on that Saturday. Keep in mind I've always had fresh, cold bottles.

For centuries I've started with 4 bottles on the bike, two of them frozen, and when I got to the last two, they were thawed and cold, no spoilage. But yes, if it gets warm, YUCK!!

Yes, Stevia helps for the Orange flavor. Also, according to Hammer, 2 scoops per 24 oz of water is the perfect osmolality mix, i.e., water to mix ratio for proper absorption. Why they don't put this on the site, I'll never know.


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