# Ksyrium SL $699 worth it



## live2veg (Aug 24, 2009)

I have stock Ksyrium equipe today and was looking for a lighter set...would lose 290g in this upgrade. I need an everyday type wheel (climbing, flats, etc.) ..thx


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

Have you considered a custom option? You could save money when compared to the Ksyrium SL while still getting a wheel that is lighter, stiffer, more aerodynamic, and has much better power transfer.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

What Roland @ Zen said. You'd get sensibly priced, easily available spokes too.


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## live2veg (Aug 24, 2009)

Thanks for the replies. I hear go custom a lot...but like a lot of folks probably don't know enough to pick out individual components. I'd figure the SL normally goes for ~1K and 30% off might be worth jumping in....
Any suggestions on custom wheel specs?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

live2veg said:


> Thanks for the replies. I hear go custom a lot...but like a lot of folks probably don't know enough to pick out individual components. I'd figure the SL normally goes for ~1K and 30% off might be worth jumping in....
> Any suggestions on custom wheel specs?


Anything is better than K-word wheels - Kinlin/White Industries from Zen. DT-240 or DuraAce hubs with your choice of rims and spokes from BWW. Anything.


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

live2veg said:


> I'd figure the SL normally goes for ~1K and 30% off might be worth jumping in....


You're still spending an extra $300 on the name. That's a sad waste of money. Go custom, or get a set of Zen, Neuvation, Rol, BWW, Soul etc.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

The aversion on this board to Ksyriums, especially at the prices that they can now be found at, is ridiculous. I have many different sets of wheels, carbon including three pairs of carbon (66mm T, 46mm C, low profile T), OP laced 3x to DT 240s, Zipp 101, Ksyrium Elites, and Ksyrium SL2's and just recently a new pair of Ksyrium SuperLights. The Ksyrium is a strong capable wheel and that can be raced and abused.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

What can we say if you can't see it? This has been done a thousand times -

Too heavy for the price. 
Exaggerated weights.
Replacement spokes too expensive and hard to get.
Ditto rims.
The most un-aero boutique wheel.
Crappy rear hub.

Anything is better. They'd be ok at $299 tops. And that's a stretch. $225 would be perfect. I can find you way better for $350.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Mike T. said:


> What can we say if you can't see it? This has been done a thousand times -
> 
> Too heavy for the price.
> Exaggerated weights.
> ...


Spent much time on them?


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

ewitz said:


> Spent much time on them?



I did. I rode them from 2002 to 2004, pretty much exclusively. They worked- never broke a spoke or anything like that, but once I switched over to some handbuilts, I realized how much more you can get for your money.

I have no idea about reliability on their wheels anymore, but yeah, even though I'm not much of a fan of Rol wheels, I'd purchase a set of those before I plunked down any money on a set of ksyriums (any level)-- you'd still be getting a much better value for your money (and a lot better customer service if anything did go wrong).


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

I think they are a good deal at $600. They are basically a bullet proof set. I don't know why I keep selling mine. Well, I do. I sold my 1st set to get some new hoops and I ended up with the Premium SLs. I just sold these to by brother-in-law to offset some nice Reynolds Carbon clinchers.

Let me tell you about a guy I ride with. I call him Mongo to a select few. He does not even know I call him that. Well, Mongo is actually a compliment. He is 275 pounds and looks like a linebacker on a bike. He is fricking HUGE!!!. The guy is also a power x2 masher. He and I were riding this moring on a break away and we finished together. I let him do the last mile effort doing 27 mph on a 60 mile smash fest. BTW I save over 100 watts behind the guy...it awesome drafting off of him.

Anyway I digress. He and I are talking about what wheels he rides which are currently some AC 58mm carbon clinchers. He said he really like them. But I gotta ask what about spokes, you break them? All the time, he says about the AC's but he really likes them anyway. We get itno why a deep dish wheel is good for him due to strength and stiffness. I ask him if ever rode Cosmic Carbones. He said yeah I ripped the spokes out of the rim....not good but he still liked them too. We get into the Kyserium SLs to which he said these are bullet proof. I never broke any spokes on these. Damn, I think, I just sold mine again.

Moral of the story. Don't listen to anyone who says Mavic Ks are crap. They ain't and for $600 they are well worth the $. At 700 we are getting into diminishing returns IMO but still a quality wheel. Down side to the K's is that they are not very aero. Other than that you can beat the snot out of them for a long time.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)




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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

I think the countless 'go custom' posts are equally if not more so considered spam posts. Not that I disagree but please, this anti Mavic crap is tantamount to the Trek bashing mumbo jumbo. The real issue is that Mavics retail is way out of touch....hmmm kinda like some of the custom carbons too.


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## woodys737 (Dec 31, 2005)

mimason said:


> I think the countless 'go custom' posts are equally if not more so considered spam posts. Not that I disagree but please, this anti Mavic crap is tantamount to the Trek bashing mumbo jumbo. The real issue is that Mavics retail is way out of touch....hmmm kinda like some of the custom carbons too.


Not necessarily anti Mavic. Just anti K. Add me to the hater list. Ditto what mike T said above. Way overpriced imho. I do enjoy my overpriced Mavic Zxellium shoes and my overpriced Mavic jersey.:thumbsup:

Edit: oh and to the OP, I think $699 is not worth it. Maybe half that.


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

mimason said:


> I think the countless 'go custom' posts are equally if not more so considered spam posts. Not that I disagree but please, this anti Mavic crap is tantamount to the Trek bashing mumbo jumbo. The real issue is that Mavics retail is way out of touch....hmmm kinda like some of the custom carbons too.


Any company that makes (and worse yet re-makes) the R-SYS loses all credibility. I have always been a fan of Mavics mountain rims, but for some reason the quality just doesn't transfer over to the road.


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

Good point about R-SYS. I would not ride them if they were free. Also, as a former MTB rider I think my history with Mavic was good. I still have my old anodized Mavics on the classis hard tail Specialized S-Works M2.


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## estone2 (Sep 25, 2005)

Zen Cyclery said:


> Any company that makes (and worse yet re-makes) the R-SYS loses all credibility. I have always been a fan of Mavics mountain rims, but for some reason the quality just doesn't transfer over to the road.


I don't know about saying that. I'd say their boutique stuff doesn't transfer. But I've had amazing luck with OP's and CXP33's. My go-to training wheelset is a Mavic Cosmic Elite front wheel from maybe 2002 with a PT/CXP-33 rear. I trued it last week - first time I ever trued it in 5 years, or about 45,000 miles of abuse.

I'm very pleased with Mavic's rims, and with my Cosmic Elites. I'd buy them again, no question.


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## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

The 'go custom' posts are repetitive, but made with a point, and in respect to the fact the OP wasn't acting exclusive of anything beyond the Ksyriums.

Now if we were talking about whether or not the Ksyrium SL's are worth it, and not about what's better/ideal, I'd confidently go for it based on my experience with Mavic so far:

At the end of the day, my less aero, heavier Aksium (would've been a set if the rear survived a crash) has had me rolling, not demanding to be trued in the past 4-5 years under two owners, and doesn't have me looking at it as some kind of scapegoat to my riding performance. Similar can be said with my experience with a cheaper CXP22 build. 

Maybe if I was heavier, I'd have a less "inspired" experience. But as far as I see it, I'll strongly consider Mavic in the future. Works out for me. I'd personally find that price tag to go into expected trustworthines - not just the numbers game.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

ok now a direct answer

1. $700 is a right price for a new set of Mavic Ksyrium SLs
2. you would pay ~$400 for a used set.
3. the ksyriums are bomb proof unless you are one the heavy side
4. you could buy better factory wheels for that price and similar weight.

If you like them go for it.


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## dr4cats (Aug 8, 2010)

I ride on Mavic K's SL and I like them. 3200 troublefree miles, still true, no broken spokes...I only weigh 146 lbs at 5'11", B class rider with a little talent for climbing.

At $700, it is a good deal for a reliable wheel.

Personally, I work too many hours every week to have to deal with broken spokes and out of true fancy carbon custom wheels and place more emphasis on reliability and bulletproofness (if that is a real word).


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

Salsa_Lover said:


> ok now a direct answer
> 
> 1. $700 is a right price for a new set of Mavic Ksyrium SLs
> 2. you would pay ~$400 for a used set.
> ...


I agree with Salsalover. I rode the pair I had for over 10,000 miles. I bought them for $600 from performance and sold them for $500 on eBay three years later. I only replaced them because I got a great deal on Cosmic Carbones which are even more reliable. The wheels are damn good. They are worth the price you listed for sure. I would consider the $800 Carbones at Performance however with a 10% coupon. A little heavier but the roll great.


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## terbennett (Apr 1, 2006)

dr4cats said:


> Personally, I work too many hours every week to have to deal with broken spokes and out of true fancy carbon custom wheels and place more emphasis on reliability and bulletproofness (if that is a real word).


You might like how strong the Ksyriums SLs are but I've gone through two back wheels. I'm 6'3" 215 lbs. and these wheels are supposed to be bulletproof. Even if they were as durable as many claim, the fact still remains that they are hard to get parts for. I had to wait over a week for replacement spokes the first time. The second time took two weeks for a freakin hub to be delivered. My LBS even told me that they are good at standing behind their product but they tend to take longer than most to send replacement parts. Ksyriums are bling wheels that work for many but just as many have discovered the advantages to buying custom wheels vs. Ksyriums. With custom, you don't have to worry about proprietary parts and they are built to your wants and needs. Mavic is a good company and I am looking at purchasing a pair of CXP33 to go with my Velocity Deep Vs. Great wheels with spokes that can be replaced with off the shelf spokes at every bike shop.This can't be said for their Ksyrium lineup. Here's my take: Would I be making a wise decision travelling long distances on Ksyriums? If I couldn't be confident in them to do that, they don't deserve to be on my rigs.


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

terbennett said:


> The second time took two weeks for a freakin hub to be delivered.


It is going to take that long for any company to warranty a part. See how long it will take you to get a Shimano hub under warranty. First, shimano won't talk to you on the phone. Then you take it to the shop and they will have to take the wheel apart. Then, since shimano won't advance ship a warranty, it has to go to them, then come back. Now your shop can rebuild your wheel. Tell me that can get done in two weeks. It will be the same deal for 90% of wheel component manufacturers. If your local shop is kind enough to use off the shelf parts for your warranty, you have a great local shop. Component manufacturers are such a pain in the A$$ with warranties, most shops wait for the parts to come before doing any work.


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

I think that's a good deal. Not epic, but good. I've got just over 6K on mine. Trued a couple of times, but I've hit some pot holes too. 
They're a good wheel. 

Custom? Go order a set, wait for them to be built and get to you. Have an issue? Then send them back, and wait for them to fix them. Will you pay shipping several times? 

We know the price/weight of SL's. How about you custom guys post your prices/weights here too? Show us what you you'd do for him...


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## Weav (Jun 21, 2009)

Probably a good price on the Mavic, but I wouldn't touch it because I know I could do better with my $700. Mike T. has some good advice above. Zen can recommend a build tailored to your use and size for about that same money, go to his website or PM him (I guarantee you'll get top notch service and he has a good reputation for service after the sale). You could go with a Dura Ace build at BWW for about that same money. You could even go tubeless if you wanted from Shimano. Lots of choices.


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

maximum7 said:


> We know the price/weight of SL's. How about you custom guys post your prices/weights here too? Show us what you you'd do for him...


Here is a price/weight quote for a Ksyrium alternative


XR200/W.I./Cxrays: $589, 1344 grams


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Zen Cyclery said:


> XR200/W.I./Cxrays: $589, 1344 grams


And those have (approx) $75 rims and relatively inexpensive spokes - all easily available and anyone with 1/2-assed wheelbuilding ability can fix these wheels. What's not to love?


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Zen Cyclery said:


> Here is a price/weight quote for a Ksyrium alternative
> 
> 
> XR200/W.I./Cxrays: $589, 1344 grams


That's below the total sum of the manufacturers listed weights for the parts

390 x 2
252
97
225

And minus the required rim strips

plus

we do recommend higher spoke counts (i.e. 24 front, 28 rear) for riders over 55kg (120 lbs), and do not recommend them at all for riders over 85kg (190 lbs).


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

ewitz said:


> That's below the total sum of the manufacturers listed weights for the parts
> 
> 390 x 2
> 252
> ...


ewitz- My mistake. I believe I got that weight from a 20/24 setup w/ XR200s. Here is a more accurate weight (w/o) rim strips. 

1369 grams


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## Weav (Jun 21, 2009)

Go with an Elf front hub and shave another 30 grams or so.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

go custom !

bet be sure to read this first

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=216625


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

Salsa_Lover said:


> go custom !
> 
> bet be sure to read this first
> 
> http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=216625


There is just no pleasing you is there Salsa. You really think that one builder can possibly be a good representation of all builders? If so you should probably pull your head out of that deep, dark, stinky hole its stuck in and try to re-evaluate a little concept called "ignorant generalizations".


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## BruceG1 (Apr 6, 2010)

maximum7 said:


> we know the price/weight of SL's. How about you custom guys post your prices/weights here too? Show us what you you'd do for him...


Today I just received my cutom wheel build. Mavic Open Pro rims, 32 spoke DT Swiss spokes/nipples and Chris King Classic hubs. 
1653.8 grams, $753.00USD (add a little bit for exchange) and $112.75CDN for taxes. Ordered on August 20 and received Sept 28. Totaly acceptable as this was a bit faster than the stated turn around time. Also they were held up in customs for a few days which is not the builders issue. 
BTW I got them through Pro Wheel Builders in Las Vegas


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## DrJordon (Mar 23, 2009)

You guys kill me with the trashing of the R-SYS wheels. I've had a set for over 1000 hard miles hitting all sorts of pot holes without issue. Plus they look great!! I think I'll by another set when these go.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

DrJordon said:


> You guys kill me with the trashing of the R-SYS wheels. I've had a set for over 1000 hard miles hitting all sorts of pot holes without issue. Plus they look great!! I think I'll by another set when these go.


They trashed themselves. No-one had to do it for them.


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## josephjcole (Jun 1, 2009)

DrJordon said:


> You guys kill me with the trashing of the R-SYS wheels. I've had a set for over 1000 hard miles hitting all sorts of pot holes without issue. Plus they look great!! I think I'll by another set when these go.



Brave man! I imagine you could pick up your second set for pretty cheap right now on ebay!
Joe


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

imho the mavic k's are the benchmark for the industry. i have a pair i been jockeying between 2 bikes for a couple of years. i think they were new in 2003 as i got them when i got a use 03 trek 5600

this year i wanted a new set of wheels and wasn't sure if i would get something better (more aero) then the mavics. i think i was looking at a easton wheel set performance was selling but when i went to order they were out of stock.

i went with the neuvations and they been a descent training wheel set although there was a slight shimmy in the front hub that cannot be fixed.

for 600 mavic k is good value foe every day. if i am a racer, i probably want something more aero:thumbsup: 










the k's were on the trek above now on my giant here below


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

DrJordon said:


> You guys kill me with the trashing of the R-SYS wheels. I've had a set for over 1000 hard miles hitting all sorts of pot holes without issue. Plus they look great!! I think I'll by another set when these go.



Hey, if you're happy with them, enjoy it. All I know is after seeing all those pictures of all those exploded wheels I wouldn't go there. It's bad enough knowing everytime I go out I can end up as someone's hood ornament, why add that to the mix of risks?

Even if they didn't explode, I find the weight, aerodynamics and price point completely wrong (for me anyway).

but good luck with them-- if they do explode, can you post some pics?


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

Mdeth1313 said:


> but good luck with them-- if they do explode, can you post some pics?



Ahhh +1 for this. However, only post pics of the exploded wheel. Not the broken neck or multiple puncture wounds which will result


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

Lol...honestly...how long do you guys want to beat that dead horse?

Show me proof of an R-Sys failure since that Velo Snooze article...those pics are over a year old. Show me something new.

The R-Sys has been been used for all of 2010 in the Pro peloton...if there were failures...I'm pretty sure they would show up on the interwebz.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

Zen Cyclery said:


> Ahhh +1 for this. However, only post pics of *same *the exploded wheel. *again and again* Not the broken neck or multiple puncture wounds which will result


FTFY


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

AvantDale said:


> Lol...honestly...how long do you guys want to beat that dead horse?.


And if it was a total one-off, you're still game to chance #2 never happening?


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

Its always the same guys beating that same dead horse...


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

AvantDale said:


> Its always the same guys beating that same dead horse...



nah, I'm new to this, but I'm not really into beating the hypothetical dead animal. maybe if we were beating the exploded r-sys!


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Next year's version top of the line Ksyrium SR consists of the R-Sys rear and the Maxtal spoked front I don't think we've beat this one to death.

http://www.mavic.com/en/product/wheels/road-triathlon/wheels/Ksyrium-SR

Personally, I would happily ride/race these wheels with no concerns.


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## Alex_C (Aug 21, 2006)

*Back on track*

A little off track with the carbon explosion pic postings, let's get back on track.

I owned these wheels. 4k miles later I sold them. Should have kept them. I have a custom set with campy hubs, Reynolds DV46s and the mavics were good wheels. If they go down to 5xx I'll spring for a pair.

The Good - not heavy, looks and construction. I'm 188 lbs and never had an issue. I ride with someone else who is 215lbs and he got 8k mi out of the same wheelset before he had rear hub issues (that he was able to fix). Price. Can be sold on craigslist with very little loss.

The Bad - parts and it's a French company. Repairs take time. Parts can be challenging to find. They are about as aero as a brick.

Custom is nice, but only if you know what you want from your wheels. 

I'd recommend them for everyday wheels.


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

> Today I just received my cutom wheel build. Mavic Open Pro rims, 32 spoke DT Swiss spokes/nipples and Chris King Classic hubs.
> 1653.8 grams, $753.00USD (add a little bit for exchange) and $112.75CDN for taxes. Ordered on August 20 and received Sept 28.


Ahhh, so this is the lighter and cheaper custom route that everybody raves about. 

Let's see Mavic - $699 at 1485 grams vs. Custom $753+$112= $865.. and 1653 grams. (Not to mention using Mavic rims either) Hmm. Looks like your custom is cheaper and lighter by using what kind of math?


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## DonDenver (May 30, 2007)

Zen Cyclery said:


> Ahhh +1 for this. However, only post pics of the exploded wheel. *Not the broken neck or multiple puncture wounds which will result*


^ Posting something like this FUD bomb completely discounts anything you’ve posted or will post on this forum with me. End. 


To the OP…the K-SL’s at sub $700 is a good price for this daily multiuse wheel that will add value to your ride and serve your growing skills and developing strength. Certainly if you have the time and inclination; go boutique whereas incremental gains meet your subjective criteria.


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

maximum7 said:


> Ahhh, so this is the lighter and cheaper custom route that everybody raves about.
> 
> Let's see Mavic - $699 at 1485 grams vs. Custom $753+$112= $865.. and 1653 grams. (Not to mention using Mavic rims either) Hmm. Looks like your custom is cheaper and lighter by using what kind of math?



depends on what you're going for-- chris king hubs are nice, but expensive as all hell and not that light. anyone know what ksyriums ACTUALLY weigh? When I rode them in 2002-2003 the claimed weight was around 1500g, they were over that by about 150g.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Mdeth1313 said:


> anyone know what ksyriums ACTUALLY weigh?


The front comes in at 630 grams and the rear at 815 grams. That adds up to 1445 grams, compared with Mavic’s claimed 1485 grams for a 2010 Ksyrium SL pair, and lighter than Mavic’s claimed 1470 grams for the K10s

from:

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010...m-k10-limited-edition-wheels-and-tires_109902


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

When comparing weight remember the Mavics don't need rim strips.


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## cski (Mar 11, 2010)

Salsa_Lover said:


> ok now a direct answer
> 
> 1. $700 is a right price for a new set of Mavic Ksyrium SLs
> 2. you would pay ~$400 for a used set.
> ...


By your reckoning, what would be "the heavy side" ? Also, what is the manufacturer rec' d maximum weight ?


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

how much does a $600 wheel set cost? the op was look to speed $600 on a wheel set, a recent post showed 2011 krysium SL at twice that (but where the aero-nesh)









the neuvations w/hutch training tire performed well this morning on very wet roads, one draw backs to the krysiums are very rigid and my ride is very bumpy, i really enjoy these neuvations and for $200 i should have no problem getting 2 years out of them and deciding if my next wheel set w/be campy or shimano:thumbsup:


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

cski said:


> By your reckoning, what would be "the heavy side" ? Also, what is the manufacturer rec' d maximum weight ?


I have been as light as 150lbs and as heavy as 190lbs on them without issues 

my normal weight is 170lbs


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

> anyone know what ksyriums ACTUALLY weigh?


Competitive Cyclist "actually" weighs most of their products. They had them at 1485g's. 
Off their site now due to the newer versions.


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

my neuvations came in at 1750, my wrench said some one he knows keeps popping spokes. with the mavics sl the op is talking about, i been on ride and a big guy over 200 lbs, popped a spoke. my mavics are nearly 8 years old, i weight 163, down from 195 lbs when i got into cycling 4 years ago, never popped a spoke, but front wheel is starting to shake when i go downhill about 40 mph. i was in the same boat as the o.p. but having 7 years old mavics, i think the easton sl 90 is worth looking at, for about $40 bux more then the op has allocated.



> Wheel size 700C
> Weight 700C - Front: 646 g, Rear 886 g, Pair: 1532 g


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## terbennett (Apr 1, 2006)

spookyload said:


> It is going to take that long for any company to warranty a part. See how long it will take you to get a Shimano hub under warranty. First, shimano won't talk to you on the phone. Then you take it to the shop and they will have to take the wheel apart. Then, since shimano won't advance ship a warranty, it has to go to them, then come back. Now your shop can rebuild your wheel. Tell me that can get done in two weeks. It will be the same deal for 90% of wheel component manufacturers. If your local shop is kind enough to use off the shelf parts for your warranty, you have a great local shop. Component manufacturers are such a pain in the A$$ with warranties, most shops wait for the parts to come before doing any work.


Actually the time I mentioned didn't include building time- only time to get the part shipped to the shop. BTW, I wouldn't buy any proprietary spoked wheelset regardless of the maker. According to my LBS, I was just lucky in both cases. They usually take double that. I wouldn't be surprised if you are right about component manufacturers being a PITA with warrantees. This is why proprietary components don't seem that practical to me.


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## bds3 (Aug 10, 2009)

Mike T. said:


> What can we say if you can't see it? This has been done a thousand times -
> 
> Too heavy for the price.
> Exaggerated weights.
> ...


This isn't some challenge or something... what can you find that's better for 350 bucks? I am looking to upgrade and at 350 I would probably buy them.


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## bds3 (Aug 10, 2009)

Like, please provide a link.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

bds3 said:


> This isn't some challenge or something... what can you find that's better for 350 bucks? I am looking to upgrade and at 350 I would probably buy them.


Right here on this page. See BWW's ad to the right? You get a nickel change too and free shipping. Your money even goes to sponsor this forum.


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

I see that for $145 more you can shave nearly 100 grams with the CX-Rays. Max weight 195 lbs.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=34


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Mike T. said:


> http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=34


Does the word shill mean anything to you?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

ewitz said:


> Does the word shill mean anything to you?


Does the sentence "I've been around here for thirteen years using my own money, time, effort to provide websites, answer thousands of e-mails and PMs to help others with their wheels and not making a penny off it" mean anything to you?


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Mike T. said:


> Does the sentence "I've been around here for thirteen years using my own money, time, effort to provide websites, answer thousands of e-mails and PMs to help others with their wheels and not making a penny off it" mean anything to you?


all with a very pronounced bias?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

ewitz said:


> all with a very pronounced bias?


I give out the info that I think is in the best interest of the Question Asker. Always have; always will. It's not my fault if the same questions keep coming up time & time again. As I'm inexhaustible and dedicated to helping others with Wheels my answer won't change until I have, IMO, a better one. It's a good job you didn't know me in the eight years of my Magura Cult website days. You would have freaked.

But don't worry, I won't hunt you down or stalk you so that I might have a chance to label you as a Hypocrite.


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

Mike T. said:


> But don't worry, I won't hunt you down or stalk you so that I might have a chance to label you as a Hypocrite.



pwned


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## Weav (Jun 21, 2009)

oh snap


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

I'd bet I know who is the BWW owner ( or has bought options on it ) .....


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## skyliner1004 (May 9, 2010)

Salsa_Lover said:


> I'd bet I know who is the BWW owner ( or has bought options on it ) .....


nope, Mike has nothing. I hate working for free, but he must love it. Everyone always gets what they pay for. He speaks as though the BWW wheels are the ones that fit everyone's bill up until you get past the $1000 retail wheels. BWW uses generic hubs and rims, are none aero (no, you can't tell the difference between how SUCK the aerodynamics of the Krysium/Aksium wheels are & the BWW blackset wheels) 

Hes been called on his bias more than just this time.


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## bent steel (Dec 28, 2007)

Salsa_Lover said:


> I'd bet I know who is the BWW owner ( or has bought options on it ) .....


In the same light, how's your Shimano stock working out? Just as some hand built comments are predictable, so are some of the pre-built comments on this forum. Most people paying attention will decide what they want.

I still have my Ksyrium ES's, which have been bullet proof, aside from the cheap bushing in the hubshell. I'll probably build a set of wheels for myself in the next year, but they'll be more expensive than K's, and also more expensive than the excellent Shimano wheels, which I'd consider if I didn't run Campy.

I do wonder what the rear K wheel going to plastic spokes on the NDS will do for durability and Mavic brand equity? I still wouldn't touch those spokes, even with sponsor money.


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## Fogdweller (Mar 26, 2004)

My experience has not been favorable. I bought a bike with a pair (Ksyrium ES) and had to have the wheels rebuilt. The previous owner, a pro, had trained on them for a whole year and the breaking surfaces were badly cupped. No problem... they'll be fresh wheels. That cost me about $400 at cost but they were new, the only thing salvaged were the hub shells. Rode them two years (sundays only) and was underwhelmed by their harsh ride, drift in cross winds and how the bike would skip and jump on descents when it should have been tracking on the road. Eventually, the rear rim cracked at many of the spoke heads so I figured it was a good jumping off point. Shipped back to Mavic a second time and this time is was $300 at cost to rebuild the rear only. Got it back and sold the pair for $550. Pretty poor return overall with lack luster performance.
Since then I've had a friend break a spoke on the rear (Ksyrium SSC, also a recent rebuild) that left him stranded and calling home. We couldn't get the wheel to pass through the frame it was so bent from the tension release. Another commuter friend broke a spoke on a high miles front wheel that his shop is quoting him $300 for a rebuild on. I gave him a wheel to ride since cash is tight. Seems like what little servicing that is possible on these wheels is done by Mavic at great expense. No more factory wheels for me.


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

> pwned


Hardly. 
More like out of control crap talk. As well as your little cheer. Which is completely unbecoming for a posting business owner to be getting caught up in.


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

*ssc*

with all do respect it seems odd the misfortune you and your peers have w/the mavic sl Ksyrium SSC

i myself tend to breaks things often but have a 2003 Ksyrium SSC and work fine, front wobble a little down hill over 40 mph

i had a mtb wheel hand built for me (mavic rim) and the guy used an odd ball hub and would not fit my fork, i forked out 700 dolla to buy new fork

if you a big guy and you hammer hard, you gonna have issues w/wheel set,


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

bent steel said:


> In the same light, how's your Shimano stock working out?


going up :thumbsup: 

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/snapshot/snapshot.asp?ticker=7309:JP

I am just a satisfied customer BTW


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

One thing I'm starting to learn about RBR. If you post against someone's opinion, they'll fight you to the ends of the earth (or forum). I guess the bottom line is the person asking will do what they want anyway.

I'm sure most people around here would tell me I wasted my money building up a super light bike and buying a set of carbon tubulars that weigh less than 1kg when I don't race, and I use them as everyday wheels.

That's great- if I cared what they thought I wouldn't have done it. It's not their money I'm "wasting", as far as I'm concerned it was money well spent. 

If someone wants to ride the "Ford Pinto" of bicycle wheels (r-sys), hey, have fun with that. I don't care, it's all good. As long as it's not my money. 

It is kind of fun to see how far these things can go, as long as no one is showing up at your door with a baseball bat! 

Flame on!:aureola:


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

At 200lbs, i put a few hundred miles on my 20 spoke neuvation front, over nasty CA bay area streets, pot holes, rough gravel, and general abuse, with 23-25c tires.. and i tuned it up once (which was probably not even necessary). 

I paid 100 bucks for the wheel. The whole set would have been 300. Mavics K-wheels SHOULD hold up, their top end set is within grams of a bargain priced budget wheelset that holds up to heavy riders on poor roads. That doesnt say much for them.

Good wheels dont break, and theres lots of good wheels out there for a fraction of the price of mavics. What do people think they're getting from the nearly 3x they're spending on k's? Its certainly not weight, the scales dont lie. Its certainly not durability, the rest of us dont seem to be busting well built wheels..


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## tyjacks (Oct 21, 2006)

Which is a stiffer/stronger wheel, the 2010 Mavic Ksyrium SL Premium or the 2010 Fulcrum Racing Zero. I weigh 235lbs, came across a good deal for both sets.


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

Get the Zeros.


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## tyjacks (Oct 21, 2006)

Thanks....


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## skyliner1004 (May 9, 2010)

tyjacks said:


> Which is a stiffer/stronger wheel, the 2010 Mavic Ksyrium SL Premium or the 2010 Fulcrum Racing Zero. I weigh 235lbs, came across a good deal for both sets.


definitely the fulcrum 0's


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## been200mph (May 28, 2004)

For just over $700 get some that are sub-1400g, have no weight limitation, and a bulletproof hub. Oh, and they ride damn well.


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## scottdill (Apr 26, 2007)

I was looking to get rid of my stock race x lite wheels and maybe do a ksyerium sl set up. What would you have in the same ballpark?

I have a 2010 gary fisher cronus ultimate. The stock wheels really stink btw.


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## skyliner1004 (May 9, 2010)

^^ why dont you make your own thread? unless you're interested in the ksyrium SL's... which are mediocre wheels at best.


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## been200mph (May 28, 2004)

skyliner1004 said:


> ^^ why dont you make your own thread? unless you're interested in the ksyrium SL's... which are mediocre wheels at best.


:17: Whaaaaa, whaaaaaa. I don't ride crap wheels. On either bike. But thanks for your concern anyhow. Guess that's why you have 2x the number of posts I do and have been here a whopping 5 months, lol.


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## skyliner1004 (May 9, 2010)

been200mph said:


> :17: Whaaaaa, whaaaaaa. I don't ride crap wheels. On either bike. But thanks for your concern anyhow. Guess that's why you have 2x the number of posts I do and have been here a whopping 5 months, lol.


what? i wasn't responding to you. 

i'm glad u can read number? ....? lol guess some people have less computer time at work than others. u sell fruits?


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## been200mph (May 28, 2004)

skyliner1004 said:


> what? i wasn't responding to you.
> 
> i'm glad u can read number? ....? lol guess some people have less computer time at work than others. u sell fruits?


You're right. I can "read number" if that means read numbers? Generally I'm a very productive person. At work leading a profit-making service department... and at my own side business. And at home. Do I sell fruits? No, I just read posts by them at times. I guess when someone posts immediately following MY post and "arrows" a reply at MY post it gets MY attention. Next time just use that productive time you have to spend making your post reply to the correct person. Got to go now so have a great day. :ciappa:


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

I second been200mph post !


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## ohvrolla (Aug 2, 2009)

Wow, if I was to find out over half the members on this forum are under the age of 20 I wouldn't be surprised.


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## been200mph (May 28, 2004)

ohvrolla said:


> Wow, if I was to find out over half the members on this forum are under the age of 20 I wouldn't be surprised.


Oh, you said age. At first I thought you said IQ. Well, either may be correct.  

ps... I help defy the odds being 2.5x that age. IQ? That's questionable. :smilewinkgrin:


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

DrJordon said:


> You guys kill me with the trashing of the R-SYS wheels. I've had a set for over 1000 hard miles hitting all sorts of pot holes without issue. Plus they look great!! I think I'll by another set when these go.


1000 miles??!!??


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## ohvrolla (Aug 2, 2009)

been200mph said:


> Oh, you said age. At first I thought you said IQ. Well, either may be correct.
> 
> ps... I help defy the odds being 2.5x that age. IQ? That's questionable. :smilewinkgrin:


Haha, you might be on to something. I've got a few other hobbies/interests and frequent other forums, and I'm ashamed to say that cycling forums seem to have some of the biggest babies masquerading as grown men that I've ever seen. I mean I see cooler people who aren't snobbish on car forums, and we're talking roughly 18-25 year olds.


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## live2veg (Aug 24, 2009)

Thanks for all the feedback (which i read them all). I decided to go w/ the Shimano 7850 CL wheelset. They cost a little more but from everything I read appears just as light if not lighter, as stiff w/o the stiff ride and a smoother hub. I'll let everyone know once I switch out my Mavic Equipe with the new DA. Losing ~ 400grams!


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## skyliner1004 (May 9, 2010)

for everyone riding the DA SL/CL wheels, how much do u weigh, and how long have u had the wheels for?


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

Good luck with your new wheel set. It seems a 600 dolla wheel set cost a thousand now asays but I guess 1k do not buy much these days. At a club tt last week 2 faster riders had americab classic 600 dolla wheel set now cost 1k. But the guy who always wins rides cosmic carbone. Just the other day on bonktown for 1k dolla. I need campy for my tcr advanced


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## frankie_t51 (Oct 25, 2010)

I wouldnt take what people say too seriously. I have noticed when it comes to wheels you need to find a dealer that lets you demo their wheels. Find somewhere that demo's these wheels and ride them to decide for yourself. 

If you would have asked "someone wants to pay me $5k a year to ride these wheels" Someone would find something negative to say about it. So take it with a grain of salt and decide for yourself. Ask the seller if you could take them on a ride to test them out, if they are solid wheels and he isnt trying to sell you crap he shouldnt have a problem with your testing them.


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## Weav (Jun 21, 2009)

Lance could win your club tt on a set of fulcrum 7's and a 1985 steel frame towing an anchor behind with his eyes shut. Winning races is not about the bike or the wheels, it's about the rider.


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## jkmacman (Feb 6, 2009)

if you want the shimano dura ace wh 7850 sl tubeless there on bonktown now for $549. i never bought from them yet, but i see the hutch training for $14.99 tires i have on my trek and neuvations. the neuvation and hutch hold 110 lbs as the bonty rims would blow out tubes over 100 lbs as there are two pressures listed on the side of this tire. i love the combo for winter training set up neuvations ($200) + 15 each hutch tire 1985 steel frame optional although i have kits from retro velo, my back likes carbon


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