# BMC and Radioshack out?



## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

So does this news: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703691804575255410855321120.html?mod=rss_whats_news_us

mean that BMC and Radioshack risk being kicked out of the pro peleton? Where does that leave Cadel? (Radioshack is self-explanatory, BMC because the damning allegation towards Rihs)

Lots of changes coming up in the pro cycling field for sure!


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## joker70 (Dec 10, 2005)

I respect Floyd coming clean and revealing his doping but "outing" everyone else just seems like sour grapes. (I do believe that they are all doped to the gills) 

It will be interesting to see what, if anything, will happen next. Floyd may get portrayed as another Greg LeMond.


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## Sojourneyman (Jun 22, 2007)

joker70 said:


> It will be interesting to see what, if anything, will happen next. Floyd may get portrayed as another Greg LeMond.


That's how I see it. Not that I think what he's saying is false, but that it's who it's coming from and how he says it. Saying it through email is a rather undignified way of doing it, and while it's interesting to see him finally admit, doing so and trying to drag people down with him, some of the biggest names in the sport no less, is completely undignified.


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## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

*What about changes in the pro peleton?*

I'd like to keep this discussion focused on what is likely to happen to the composition of the pro peleton -- discussions re. individual riders doping will get this thread moved to the doping forum and this story has some real potential for repercusions on the playing field.

So does Rihs and Bruynel getting named mean that their respective squads are at risk of getting booted from the peleton? Whatr will that mean for riders who, as of yet, have not been named in the allegations? e.g. Evans and Leipheimer?


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## 4Peaks (Apr 20, 2010)

philippec said:


> I'd like to keep this discussion focused on what is likely to happen to the composition of the pro peleton -- discussions re. individual riders doping will get this thread moved to the doping forum and this story has some real potential for repercusions on the playing field.
> 
> So does Rihs and Bruynel getting named mean that their respective squads are at risk of getting booted from the peleton? Whatr will that mean for riders who, as of yet, have not been named in the allegations? e.g. Evans and *Leipheimer?*



You should read the WSJ article again.


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## cheddarlove (Oct 17, 2005)

From what I understand, Floyd lost everything. Others have lost nothing and gained quite a bit. Bitter and angry, he's another rider saying that dope tests are a joke. I know I'm laughing!  Hohum...same ol' same ol'...


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## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

oops!


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

This is another one of those he said/he said situations. I don't think anything will come of it.


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## sokudo (Dec 22, 2007)

moving to the doping forum in 5..4..3..2..1


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## MG537 (Jul 25, 2006)

philippec said:


> I'd like to keep this discussion focused on what is likely to happen to the composition of the pro peleton -- discussions re. individual riders doping will get this thread moved to the doping forum and this story has some real potential for repercusions on the playing field.
> 
> So does Rihs and Bruynel getting named mean that their respective squads are at risk of getting booted from the peleton? Whatr will that mean for riders who, as of yet, have not been named in the allegations? e.g. Evans and Leipheimer?


Ever since the removal of Patrice Clerc from the ASO, nothing will happen or business as usual if you prefer. The "new" ASO has sided with money/sponsors/ratings. Wouldn't be surprised to see Vino, Basso et al racing this summer. And Floyd's revelations will either be ignored or dismissed as rants of a madman.


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## farm (Jul 10, 2008)

Can't believe this is still here. Anyways, Landis has to know he's in for a major lawsuit. He does say that Kristin was there when he picked up EPO, so perhaps she will be involved.

I actually thought there was a chance he would do this at the outset -- I'm sure he's furious that he's done nothing unusual and is made a pariah while others make millions and bask in glory. What an ugly business.

The thing that makes me saddest is that these are undeniably talented people who work incredibly hard, and this stuff tarnishes all of their accomplishments.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

farm said:


> The thing that makes me saddest is that these are undeniably talented people who work incredibly hard, and this stuff tarnishes all of their accomplishments.


No it doesn't, the only ones who accomplished anything were doing the same thing. There, in all great probability, were no clean riders who accomplished anything between the early 90's and at least 2005 if not to the present day.


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## farm (Jul 10, 2008)

Dwaynebarry said:


> No it doesn't, the only ones who accomplished anything were doing the same thing. There, in all great probability, were no clean riders who accomplished anything between the early 90's and at least 2005 if not to the present day.


The fact that they were all doping doesn't tarnish their accomplishments?

I think we agree on the extent of the doping, but disagree on the above.


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## kiwisimon (Oct 30, 2002)

joker70 said:


> Floyd may get portrayed as another Greg LeMond.


Hardly, Lemond has more than anything been vindicated by these allegations and I seem to recall him winning three TDFs with no one ever accusing him of being juiced. Totally different scenarios.


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## weltyed (Feb 6, 2004)

this is news because:
1) finally admits he did it
2) closest person to LA/JB to name him, product, and dates
3) amercian confessing
4) will he have to reimburse those who donated to his "fairness fund"
*5) pulls kristen into this*
6) pulls the organizing body into this by claiming they accepted hush money

i think the only REAL news is pulling his former wife into the fold. if they can get her to talk...

as far as what does this do to todays peleton? nothing.
the timing makes me wonder if he worked with the canadian guy and he is trying to beat the reports.


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## ghost6 (Sep 4, 2009)

I'm not too familiar with pro cycling rules. But the title of this thread is surprising. Can Landis' confession and accusation really cause current teams to be kicked out? If so, how can Landis' accusations cause any real changes within, for example, team Radio Shack?


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## MaddSkillz (Mar 13, 2007)

I'm still trying to figure out why someone would believe teams would be booted from the pro-peloton based on accusations? 

Is that even reasonable to consider? I don't think so.


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## MaddSkillz (Mar 13, 2007)

ghost6 said:


> I'm not too familiar with pro cycling rules. But the title of this thread is surprising. Can Landis' confession and accusation really cause current teams to be kicked out? If so, how can Landis' accusations cause any real changes within, for example, team Radio Shack?


Exactly... I just posted the same thing prior to reading your post.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

MaddSkillz said:


> I'm still trying to figure out why someone would believe teams would be booted from the pro-peloton based on accusations?
> 
> Is that even reasonable to consider? I don't think so.


Why would anyone believe Floyd is a better question. Before opening his mouth he had cred, at least for being consistent. Now he has none.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

No, unless there is documented proof, no.

Sure, its ASO dance, but without proof and just throwing teams out at will is not good for the sport or a way to get French Riders to win  (just a joke).

Really, you just can throw teams out on rumors form a convicted liar!

Floyd's "revelations" are nothing new and nothing that's been said in the past.


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## ghost6 (Sep 4, 2009)

MaddSkillz said:


> I'm still trying to figure out why someone would believe teams would be booted from the pro-peloton based on accusations?
> 
> Is that even reasonable to consider? I don't think so.


Maybe if Landis' accusation leads to an official investigation which definitively concludes that others are guilty, then booting from the pro-peloton may begin. The chances of such a painstaking event ever happening are astronomical, I would guess. Who is going to suddenly listen to a guy who has been lying for four years, and now that someone really pissed him off, he decided to start accusing others of doping? He should've said all of this in 2006. More importantly, how will Landis prove his accusations? It's crazy how so many apparently believe his accusations.


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## El Guapo (Dec 10, 2002)

Kristin talk? About Lance? Doubt it. With his legal team there was probably a VERY strong non-disclosure clause as part of the divorce settlement. Tinfoil hat theory, I know. But I would not be surprised one bit. He held all the cards in those proceedings.

As for Floyd...even if he was telling the truth, he's so tainted his credibility over the past few years that no one will believe him. TH was/is the same way. I won't be surprised if in the next few years Floyd perfects the phrase "would you like fries with your order?"


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## rocco (Apr 30, 2005)

Marc said:


> Why would anyone believe Floyd is a better question. Before opening his mouth he had cred, at least for being consistent. Now he has none.



This is the final phase of his implosion. 

Washed up - Check... Broke - Check... Zero cred - Check... Widely hated - Check... Prolly soon completely unemployable - Check... Will prolly be sued by various parties - Check... Will prolly own lots of money back to people that he gained through fraud/false pretenses - Check.

I'd say he should be on suicide watch.


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## eyebob (Feb 3, 2004)

The ASO can invite anyone they like to ride their races, they are not held to any level of the law. If they feel it will be bad for their product (TdF and other races) they will not invite certain teams.....but at this point, who's left? Liquigas? Nope, BMC? Nope RS? Nope. Garmin? Nope. I can't say that I'd have that much interest in the race without those teams there.


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## mohair_chair (Oct 3, 2002)

I don't think ASO has ever kicked anyone out just based on one person's accusations. There has always been some sort of physical evidence, even if it didn't stand up later. Let's face it, on the credibility scale, Floyd is pretty low. So unless Floyd produces the goods, denials will be issued by all involved and nothing will happen. Like most things he has done since he was busted, he bungled this one. If he has the smoking gun, he needs to produce it. Preferably while it is still smoking.


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## Wookiebiker (Sep 5, 2005)

mohair_chair said:


> Let's face it, on the credibility scale, Floyd is pretty low. So unless Floyd produces the goods, denials will be issued by all involved and nothing will happen. Like most things he has done since he was busted, he bungled this one. If he has the smoking gun, he needs to produce it. Preferably while it is still smoking.


The same could be said for Jose Canseco in baseball...however, what he said turned out to be quite true.

If you want to find out about dopers...go to a doper...it's pretty simple because they are the ones who know who else is doing it.

I'd venture to say Floyd is spot on with his accusations....even though he will be discredited by everybody.

I've always held the premis that everybody in the pro peloton is doping on one level or another (same goes for other sports aside from cycling). That doesn't stop me from watching because I love to see "Super Human" performances and don't want to see something I can drive an hour or two to watch in a P/1/2 local stage race.


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## g29er (Mar 28, 2009)

Whats surprising to me is that unlike other cyclists who were caught, Landis spent so much time and effort trying to prove his innocence. The defense fund, the book that alot of people bought, all the public speaking engagements,its crazy. The way he smiled at everyone and lied right to our faces. 
He knew he was losing money,so he might as well try to make money on his false defense. 

Landis could have taken his lumps and gone back to winning races and redeeming himself. 
Instead,he chose to waste 4 years lying to everyone and spending millions of his and OTHER people's money on his "defense"

If anything, he should charged with fraud...


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## rook (Apr 5, 2009)

I don't think the UCI would kick out two teams like that. The reaction from UCI President, Pat McQuaid, regarding Landis says it all. Apparently, McQuaid does not and will not investigate allegations of doping. Why would he? The UCI is corrupt and he prefers to keep it that way.


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## Argentius (Aug 26, 2004)

*I doubt*

the ASO would non-invite the ex-tour winner, and the world champion's team, based on an accusation, if they allow Astana, among others, to start.

I think until corroborating evidence is brought along with these accusations, there will be little change.


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## LostViking (Jul 18, 2008)

Landis - a doper and a lier. Even if the things he is saying now are true, how can anyone believe him? 

Lance - No Lance Fan-boy am I, but he truly is in a no-win situation here. There have been lots of rumours around Lance, but no proof - no eyewitnesses either. Now we have a "witness" - but he is about as un-trustworthy as they come - but isn't that often the case? You use other criminals to incriminate eachother - boy scouts don't do the trick.
If Lance is innocent of these accusations, then Landis is beyond reproach. If he is guilty - will we ever really know without physical evidence or an admission? In any event, unless more credible sources step forward...innocent until proven guilty.


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## Zipp0 (Aug 19, 2008)

g29er said:


> Instead,he chose to waste 4 years lying to everyone and spending millions of his and OTHER people's money on his "defense"
> 
> If anything, he should charged with fraud...


He still claims that he did NOT do synthetic testosterone before that stage of the TDF. So, when defending himself against that charge, in his mind, he was innocent.

Sure, he was doing other things (like everone else) but not testosterone.

Not sure if I believe that, but that seems to be the jist of it.


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## Jason1500 (Apr 1, 2008)

So...a disgraced cyclist, who now admits to doping, but just not at the 2006 TdF Is now the gospel of truth with these accusations against his former teammates?


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## ti-triodes (Aug 14, 2006)

Jason1500 said:


> So...a disgraced cyclist, who now admits to doping, but just not at the 2006 TdF Is now the gospel of truth with these accusations against his former teammates?



All the Lance haters will grasp at any straw they can.


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## pigpen (Sep 28, 2005)

Argentius said:


> the ASO would non-invite the ex-tour winner, and the world champion's team, based on an accusation, if they allow Astana, among others, to start.
> 
> I think until corroborating evidence is brought along with these accusations, there will be little change.


Yet they did just that a couple of years ago with Astana.


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## rook (Apr 5, 2009)

LostViking said:


> Landis - a doper and a lier. Even if the things he is saying now are true, how can anyone believe him?
> 
> Lance - No Lance Fan-boy am I, but he truly is in a no-win situation here. There have been lots of rumours around Lance, but no proof - no eyewitnesses either. Now we have a "witness" - but he is about as un-trustworthy as they come - but isn't that often the case? You use other criminals to incriminate eachother - boy scouts don't do the trick.
> If Lance is innocent of these accusations, then Landis is beyond reproach. If he is guilty - will we ever really know without physical evidence or an admission? In any event, unless more credible sources step forward...innocent until proven guilty.



Actually, there have been other former Armstrong teammates that have spoken and alleged Armstrong's EPO use. Stephen Swart for one. And Vaughters. How about Frankie Andreu? Add Floyd to the list. Possibly others will also step forth now if interviewed. Tyler?


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