# disappointed with ENO eccentric hub



## CFBlue

While the ENO eccentric fixed hub seems like a great idea, and the workmanship and materials appear to be top notch, in use it's driving me nuts. I've used it for a couple of weeks now, and every time I try to tighten down the axle bolts it seems like a big ordeal to get the position right, chain tension right, and then my brake pads barely touch the rim.

Here's the rub. The eccentric has 7.5 mm of offset, meaning that the attachment bolts swivel that much around the actual axle center, giving you the ability to adjust the chain tension by 15mm from full forward to full aft. With my current setup of a 42x17 gears, the eccentric ends up almost right at the 6 oclock position, which raises the rear ride height 7.5 mm, but also means that my brake pads barely contact the rim. I tried it at 12 oclock, but there the tire, only a 23mm, hits the brake bridge. Trying equivalent 39x16 gears, the position was exactly the same.

Worse, though, is that every time I go to tighten down the attachment bolts, the right bolt creeps down the drop out, throwing the axle out of alignment, because as I'm trying to rotate the eccentric for proper chain tension, the two objectives of position and tightening are fighting each other. Rotating the axle to get tension moves the bolt down, exacerbated by the torque and friction of bolt tightening. I lubed the heck out of the bolt/washer surfaces, but still not good.

I've even tried using a 3/4" open end wrench to firmly rotate the eccentric to get good chain tension, but still I have the problem of the bolt moving down the dropout while tightening. This is very frustrating, and this is while doing it all in my shop; I'm sure the first flat I get out on the road and then spend another 10 minutes screwing with this will really piss me off. Then, I'll likely get chain tension too high or too low, both of which are not good. Give me track ends with chain tug (I'm using a Surly on my Pista) and I can get chain tension perfect in 2 seconds flat every time.

I thought it might be better to have the axle positioned behind the bolt and more level with it, so I bought a 3/32nd's half link to lengthen the chain 1/2". Again, while good in theory, the reality sucked. The half link made a huge clunk sound and raised up off the cog teeth every time it came around. It just doesn't fit the teeth of the cog (3/32nd's, of course) very well. Junked that idea.

I really wished I had gone conventional track ends and fixed hub -- now that I've hacked all the derailleur and shifter cable braise-ons off my frame...

Based upon my experience, I'd not recommend the ENO eccentric hub. I know Sheldon Brown recommends it, and I'm sure it works well for him. I'm just having a real bear of a time with it, though.

So, can vertical dropouts be converted to track ends?

Doug


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## Spinfinity

*Thanks for sharing.*

I had thought of getting one. I'm going to have a look at the eccentric bottom bracket on our tandem and see if I can picture a way to use one of those. It would leave the ride height unchanged and takes a pretty good amount of slack on the tandem's long chain.


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## Auriaprottu

DougSloan said:


> So, can vertical dropouts be converted to track ends?
> 
> Doug


Yup. Spicer Cycles does it for $65.00 + shipping without any retouching. At least they do it on steel frames, anyhow. I'm not sure about the web address, but you can Yahoo "Spicer Bicycles" and find it.

EDIT: Try www.spicercycles.com


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## ErNestO_from_Wisconsin

*no problem for me*

The eccentric ENO is designed for fixies...fixies are not meant for a rear brake. I use it on my Surly Pacer and it smells so sweeeeeet not to have spent $$$ on a new frame. It works best on mountain bikes too, and yes, on a mtb you can use your brakes with no hassle.

A tip...looking from above, rear of the bike and a loose ENO, tighten the left more than the right first...then just tighten the right for safety's sake.
I explain a bit on the brake issue here: http://www.adventurefind.com/hbfk/eno3.html

Other than that, I really like the option that the ENO has given me. All my frames are now dedicated SS bikes.

As for the Surly, you can see I have only enough room for the wheel not touching the bridge between the chainstays...it's a project I am getting used to. I need to shorten the bars, but I love this bike and have ridden it more than my SS commuter mtb/cross bike here: http://www.adventurefind.com/bikes.html


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## popdan

*maybe I'm jaded but...*



DougSloan said:


> So, can vertical dropouts be converted to track ends?


unless you have some frame your uncle won the giro on and with his last words asked you to convert from campy 20 to fixed, just start from scratch. you can get a perfectly fine frame, with long do's off ebay for way less than the price of an eno or the price replacing the do's. 

bikes are bikes. steel is real. shut up and ride.

dave


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## ErNestO_from_Wisconsin

popdan said:


> bikes are bikes. steel is real. shut up and ride.
> 
> dave


AMEN!


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## scrublover

i'm with ernesto on this one. no problems at all getting the right tension, or having things slipping while adjusting. 

the only slippage i had at all was during my initial few rides- figuring out just how much i had to tighten it down so as to not have slippage. golden now, for a few months! 

maybe it's somehting with the frame, too. i'd be willing to bet it'd be more prone to slippage with alu frames. can't really say why, just sorta seems like it would. 

long live ENO!


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## CFBlue

*follow up*

I installed a star washer next to the drop out, and this helped hold it in place while tightening. Didn't solve the other problems, but at least it's something.

Also, I think the design could be improved by making the part of the bolt washer thing that goes inside the drop out slot squared off to mate with the slot instead of round. Then, it could not turn and creep as it's tightened.

Doug




DougSloan said:


> While the ENO eccentric fixed hub seems like a great idea, and the workmanship and materials appear to be top notch, in use it's driving me nuts. I've used it for a couple of weeks now, and every time I try to tighten down the axle bolts it seems like a big ordeal to get the position right, chain tension right, and then my brake pads barely touch the rim.
> 
> Here's the rub. The eccentric has 7.5 mm of offset, meaning that the attachment bolts swivel that much around the actual axle center, giving you the ability to adjust the chain tension by 15mm from full forward to full aft. With my current setup of a 42x17 gears, the eccentric ends up almost right at the 6 oclock position, which raises the rear ride height 7.5 mm, but also means that my brake pads barely contact the rim. I tried it at 12 oclock, but there the tire, only a 23mm, hits the brake bridge. Trying equivalent 39x16 gears, the position was exactly the same.
> 
> Worse, though, is that every time I go to tighten down the attachment bolts, the right bolt creeps down the drop out, throwing the axle out of alignment, because as I'm trying to rotate the eccentric for proper chain tension, the two objectives of position and tightening are fighting each other. Rotating the axle to get tension moves the bolt down, exacerbated by the torque and friction of bolt tightening. I lubed the heck out of the bolt/washer surfaces, but still not good.
> 
> I've even tried using a 3/4" open end wrench to firmly rotate the eccentric to get good chain tension, but still I have the problem of the bolt moving down the dropout while tightening. This is very frustrating, and this is while doing it all in my shop; I'm sure the first flat I get out on the road and then spend another 10 minutes screwing with this will really piss me off. Then, I'll likely get chain tension too high or too low, both of which are not good. Give me track ends with chain tug (I'm using a Surly on my Pista) and I can get chain tension perfect in 2 seconds flat every time.
> 
> I thought it might be better to have the axle positioned behind the bolt and more level with it, so I bought a 3/32nd's half link to lengthen the chain 1/2". Again, while good in theory, the reality sucked. The half link made a huge clunk sound and raised up off the cog teeth every time it came around. It just doesn't fit the teeth of the cog (3/32nd's, of course) very well. Junked that idea.
> 
> I really wished I had gone conventional track ends and fixed hub -- now that I've hacked all the derailleur and shifter cable braise-ons off my frame...
> 
> Based upon my experience, I'd not recommend the ENO eccentric hub. I know Sheldon Brown recommends it, and I'm sure it works well for him. I'm just having a real bear of a time with it, though.
> 
> So, can vertical dropouts be converted to track ends?
> 
> Doug


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## joe friday

the very nature of a fixed gear drivetrain is much less foregiving in all respects.

it's amazing what passes for acceptable if the chain has a spring involved to 
assist it "al la derailleur" systems.

another thing maybe the tendancy of the hub to persecute those who haven't 
responded to Joe Fridays previous questions about 3d mapping software...


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## itsdoable

My ENO eccentric fixie on a steel frame works flawlessly, and sets up very easy, no slip, no creep, bolts tighten up cleanly. It gets pretty abused by me.
<img src="https://gallery.consumerreview.com/webcrossing/images/deKerf_eno.jpg">
I don't run a rear brake, so I don't have those alingment issues. Check your dropout alignment, if your axle is creeping when you tighten the bolt, it often means your dropout is slightly out of alignment.
<img src="https://www.parktool.com/images/repair_help/FFG19.jpg">

Cheers,

Tom


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