# I can't descend



## yesroh (May 30, 2004)

I've been riding seriously for about 25 years now. I started with a 40 pound, rusted Schwinn, after seven years got a Klein Performance, then a Klein Quantum, Trek 5200, Eddy Merckx Titanium...oh well, I'm up to a Kestrel Talon SL now. I was never a stellar descender and would usually get taken on the descents. I've lived in flat areas for about ten years now with brief visits to the mountains and it would take about three rides to start feeling a little comfortable on long descents. Since I've started getting into the ultralight bikes (my current bike is right at 16 pounds) it seems my descending has gotten even worse. I'm back in an area that has hills but it seems on every descent where my speed gets up over 30-35 miles an hour I get nervous now and my upper body even shakes sometimes. I can't even ride down some hills I rode as a teenager 20 years ago on my 40 pound Schwinn. I know the light bike is more twitchy and the aerodynamics make me accelerate so fast it feels like the bike is getting away from me. I've tried moving the seat back, forward, moved bars up and down but my upper body is just too nervous. I've been riding for a while and won state competitions but now I'm afraid to go down even small hills. Help!!!!


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## SkiRacer55 (Apr 29, 2005)

*First of all...*

...descending on a bike is like downhill ski racing...as a friend of mine said, if you're not a _little_ nervous, then you're crazy. I'm 57 and I don't descend like I used to because in ski racing, at least you get to fall on snow or a reasonble facsimile thereof. If you come unglued on a bike at 50 m. p. h. plus...well, you get a trip to McDonald's (also known as being an "over the bar blood donor"). 

Having said all that, here's some thoughts:

- You're gonna descend differently depending on the road conditions, traffic, light, wind, and so forth. I was watching the Tour de Suisse yesterday and the big boys were really rocking on the final descent...up to 90 kilometers/hour. But they were on Swiss roads (very good pavement, very well maintained) and there were no cars on the road except for support vehicles. There are places where you can let 'em buck, and other places where it's a good idea to get your money's worth out of your brakes.

- There's some good books/articles on technique, and I'm sure you can find some good words on the skills needed to descend well...and safely. Do a search of RBR and I'm sure you'll find all kinds of good stuff on the subject. What most people will tell you is:

1. Hands on the drops or maybe on the hoods...but definitely hands lightly on the brake levers at all times.

2. Get a gear you like (probably big) and don't change it, or don't change it much. There are going to be times (particularly on a rolling descent, where you go from steep to flat to steep) that you need to take a pull, and you don't want to be in a granny gear that'll spin you off the bike. 

3. Keep your package tucked up...chest down, knees in, elbows in, head up. This is not just more efficient aerodynamically, it'll keep you in better balance and prevent body parts getting yanked out into the slipstream...just like downhill racing. If you're not turning, feet in the same horizontal plane...everything relaxed...don't forget to breathe.

4. Turns on a bike are like turns on skis. Set up by going to the outside of the turn (steering), cut across the apex (pushing on the outside pedal), then let it run back to the outside. Outside foot down, and put some weight on it. Don't lean in or outside...you're aligned at the same angle as your bike and the whole thing is lined up against the contact point of your tires. 

5. Obviously, equipment matters, as in especially good brakes, good tires, and a chain in good condition...know what happens if your chain breaks?

- Hang out with some roadies who are good descenders. Watch them, ask questions, and shadow them (at a safe distance...you never want to wheelsuck on a serious descent). 

- Find some place that has a mellow hill (say, a place where you can get up to 35), no traffic, good road surface, and do a series of climbs and descents...trust me, it'll get better, and after a while, it'll be the most fun you've ever had with your clothes on...


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## yesroh (May 30, 2004)

SkiRacer55 said:


> ...descending on a bike is like downhill ski racing...as a friend of mine said, if you're not a _little_ nervous, then you're crazy. I'm 57 and I don't descend like I used to because in ski racing, at least you get to fall on snow or a reasonble facsimile thereof. If you come unglued on a bike at 50 m. p. h. plus...well, you get a trip to McDonald's (also known as being an "over the bar blood donor").
> 
> Having said all that, here's some thoughts:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the information. As I said before, I am a veteran at this cycling thing and it seems over the past three years I've lost my nerve. I could never descend with the best, but there were times I could take the mediocre. I've been up past 50 miles an hour on at least two occasions. Seems lately I'm very tense and I don't know how much of it is the lighter equipment, if some of it is a physical problem (inner ear imbalanace?) , and how much is my head. Seems I pull too much on the bars in high intensity efforts and lately it's not uncommon for me to sprint and then get the shakes when I settle back into the saddle. I think had I stayed in an area with good hills/mountains, this would not be a problem. I've been on some pretty long descents on the Blue Ridge Parkway. I agree...better than sex? Yes, probably so. And you can send pictures to your relatives!


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## SkiRacer55 (Apr 29, 2005)

*You'll get there...*

...I agree, the new bikes are definitely spooky at first. I have a 2002 Litespeed Tuscany and a 2004 Trek 5000, both light and very quick handling. My first descent road bike was probably like yours. I think it was a steel Fuji and I doubt it weighed much under 27 pounds and took about a half a block to get a long radius turn done. I could ride no hands down hills with my eyes closed, is what it felt like, and never worry about having the thing go ballistic. My new stuff is definitely a Porsche, and you have to drive it...it'll go where you point it, but if you ain't got the reins, that pony'll buck you right off. 

I'd say just keep working on your general handling skills in a mellow, safe environment and the whole thing will come back to you. Also remember...this is _your_ biking, not somebody else's  . If going down big hills isn't fun any more, then don't go down big hills...


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## johngfoster (Jan 14, 2005)

*Balance*

The newer bikes tend to be more "maneuverable", which means "squirly" when traveling fast. When I first started descending in a tuck, I was trying to steer the bike with the handle-bars and found it to be very sensitive and got worse the faster I went. When I placed my hands up by the stem it seemed to make this even worse. However, I have found that if I relax (yeah right!) and forget about trying to steer with my hands, and instead steer with my body by leaning (like riding without hands on the bars--"look Mom no hands"), the bike suddenly settles down and is quite controllable, and I can maintain an aero tuck with confidence. Hope this helps some.


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## yesroh (May 30, 2004)

johngfoster said:


> The newer bikes tend to be more "maneuverable", which means "squirly" when traveling fast. When I first started descending in a tuck, I was trying to steer the bike with the handle-bars and found it to be very sensitive and got worse the faster I went. When I placed my hands up by the stem it seemed to make this even worse. However, I have found that if I relax (yeah right!) and forget about trying to steer with my hands, and instead steer with my body by leaning (like riding without hands on the bars--"look Mom no hands"), the bike suddenly settles down and is quite controllable, and I can maintain an aero tuck with confidence. Hope this helps some.


Thanks for the information. I've gotten rid of my Rolff Sestriere wheels (ultra-light) and replaced them with some Mavic Cosmos, which are about 340 grams heavier with low profile rims. I can already tell the bike seems better on the downhills. I think I've spooked myself so much that it may take a while for me to get my nerve back, but knowing I have some wind-stable wheels helps a lot. They have round spokes too, and only 24 on the front wheel, so they should be more stable even than my old 32 spoke conventional wheels. 
I have never ridden no-hands on a good bicycle...even my first Klein Performance (they don't make that frame anymore) had to be steered and it had very heavy wheels although back then it weighed under 21 pounds. But my old Schwinn Collegiate Sport, that 40 pounder...I once went for six miles without holding on. I'm a little nervous, too, having a $3000 bicycle, that I don't want to crash the thing just to prove I can ride with no hands. 
Back in 2001 I manged to take off a jacket and stuff it in my back pocket while descending. I'm pretty proud of that. Other than that, I'm a whimp.


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## LugNut (Sep 6, 2005)

Glad the wheels have helped some. I was in a really nasty, 32+ mph crash a couple of years ago, and I was all nerves descending until recently. Mind you, I am still cautious -- as we all should be -- but I actually enjoy descending now. A lot of it has to do w/repetition. I live in CO, so half of my riding is downhill. I also have found that my new steel bike w/custom geometry (better steering angles, lower BB drop) has helped enormously. Now, I don't have to make those little adjustments going into sharp corners. It's like I just sit on the bike and "GO." The bike never feels wobbly w/high- or low-speed cornering. My previous bike was a Litespeed Ultimate w/a high BB drop, very short chainstays, different angles all around. I thought it was the bomb, but now I know what it should really feel like to go downhill and not have to "work" so much. I also had a Colnago C-40. That didn't work for me, either.


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## carver (Aug 15, 2002)

*Simple things....*

I have found to be the most helpful for descending, which may be the most stressful of situations on a bike, except descending in a pack, but that's another deal. First, much like like skiing at high speed your bike will go where your eyes go. And, realx the eyes. Of course, I am assuming you are in the drops and comfortable in the drops, especially shoulders, neck and arms. Second, a light touch on the bars is crucial (ie: no death grips and no loclout of the elbows). Third, relax the legs and feet, be firm but relaxed, this relaxes the back and shoulders.

Even the most experienced riders get out of their long time sweet spot due to physical conditioning or injuries, bike changes, an accident, or whatever. These are simple things, subtle sometimes, maybe obvious maybe not. 

I live in CO and spend 75% of my ride time in the mountains and foothills where I love the descents but respect them too.

Cheers ---


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## single track mind (May 26, 2005)

Belly on the seat, ass on the wheel, try to avoid gravel.


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