# Ultegra Di2 vs Dura ace Mechanical



## 1805078 (Sep 7, 2010)

It is time to upgrade to another groupset from my Ultegra 6700.

Thinking of either Ultegra Di2 OR Dura Ace Mechanical. 

Anyone prefer to comment on this problem I am faced with. 

Wouldn't mind a bit of a vote on the subject

cheers in advance


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

If youre already upgrading 6700 you're definitely upgrading just for the sake of upgrading so you should probably just go out and get Dura Ace electric so you don't have any more room to upgrade. Well, until a new DA electric comes out.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

Hopefully there will be lots of cheap Dura Ace Di2 on EBay when the 11 speed version comes out in a few months. I'm happy with mine and I'd like an extra set or two.


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## jnbrown (Dec 9, 2009)

I just got Ultegra Di2 and love it, way better than mechanical anything.
If your frame is not set up for internal wiring, then you might consider getting holes drilled in it to run the wires internal. That is what I did.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

DA Mechanical is a terrible choice now. It will be superseded very shortly.
DA Di2 is also a bad choice. The new technology lies with Ultegra Di2.

If you go Shimano, Ultegra Di2 is basically your only choice right now. That will change in a few months, so either postpone your decision or go Ui2.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

These thing are starting to change at the speed electronics, eg, cell phones, computers, Ipods, & versions of Windows. I can't help but think that the rapid changes in equipment are made for mainly 2 reasons. 1: because they can, and 2: new money from people who always have to have the latest and greatest,


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## gamara (May 20, 2002)

Mr. Versatile said:


> These thing are starting to change at the speed electronics, eg, cell phones, computers, Ipods, & versions of Windows. I can't help but think that the rapid changes in equipment are made for mainly 2 reasons. 1: because they can, and 2: new money from people who always have to have the latest and greatest,


Yes but unlike those things that are due to faster & newer processors, the main engine that drives a bike is still human powered. So no matter how much faster & smoother the new stuff shifts, its not going to make you go any faster than you already can.


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## teoteoteo (Sep 8, 2002)

Have had an Ultegra Electronic bike since October, liked it enough in the beginning, but then the rattle in the shifter showed up. I thought I could get past the gear dump but I can't. Have a SRAM Red Bike that I prefer to ride now. Aside from the the front shift, there is nothing the Ultegra Electronic does better.


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## aclinjury (Sep 12, 2011)

Cinelli 82220 said:


> *Hopefully there will be lots of cheap Dura Ace Di2 on EBay *when the 11 speed version comes out in a few months. I'm happy with mine and I'd like an extra set or two.


Don't count on it. Judging how people bid up the prices of thing like used carbon handlebars and used WH-7900 Dura Ace wheelset, I think it's safe to say DA Di2 ain't going to be cheap anytime soon. Maybe,,, maybe, you're find a good deal on DA 7900 group, but that's about it. Looking at the used DA 7800 cranks and shifters on Ebay, they ain't cheap and how long have these been out?


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## Cut.Aussie (Mar 19, 2011)

There is nothing to stop you from mixing groups, I have a brand new Cervelo RS with a mixed set. I use Dura Ace wheels, compact crank and cassette but have Ultegra Di2 which work well together.

Di2 is the future, be it 10 or 11 speed.


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## MMinSC (Nov 19, 2011)

Cinelli 82220 said:


> Hopefully there will be lots of cheap Dura Ace Di2 on EBay when the 11 speed version comes out in a few months. I'm happy with mine and I'd like an extra set or two.


Nor is it coming out in a few months. Only a few guys on Rabobank are riding it right now. Word from Taipei is that it will be fall at the very earliest.


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## MMinSC (Nov 19, 2011)

D/A 7900 mech can be had pretty cheaply right now. I just put together a group, including Rotor 3D cranks, for less than $1200.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

I had been considering Di2...maybe waiting for the new DA Di2, but am now planning on getting the new SRAM Red.


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## PoorCyclist (Oct 14, 2010)

If you take the brakeset and crankset out of the equation.
the DA7900 shifter and derailluers is currently cheaper than Ultegra Di2 by hundreds of dollars. Can't justify the cost of Di2 when it is actually heavier.


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## dcorn (Sep 1, 2011)

PoorCyclist said:


> If you take the brakeset and crankset out of the equation.
> the DA7900 shifter and derailluers is currently cheaper than Ultegra Di2 by hundreds of dollars. Can't justify the cost of Di2 when it is actually heavier.


I'd rather have perfect, smooth shifting every time I push the button than sacrifice function for a few grams. Sure, get light bars, stem, wheels, etc, but get a drivetrain that works. You don't see many people saying "I'll just stick with the Red FD because it's lighter, even though the titanium cage makes my shifting suck".

Plus the new Di2 is supposed to be compatible with Ui2, meaning you can upgrade to the E-Ultegra now and if you really need less weight or 11 speeds, get the Di2 RD when it's released.


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

Mr. Versatile said:


> These thing are starting to change at the speed electronics, eg, cell phones, computers, Ipods, & versions of Windows. I can't help but think that the rapid changes in equipment are made for mainly 2 reasons. 1: because they can, and 2: new money from people who always have to have the latest and greatest,


Doesn't reconcile with the fact that Campagnolo has been working on their EPS system for 20 years. They could have introduced a workable system 6 years ago until they discovered a water intrusion problem. After they fixed that, they made the decision to develop and release 11sp before releasing EPS. So, as far as cycles shortening, I'd say it is too early to tell...


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## Cut.Aussie (Mar 19, 2011)

This is why I like Di2 technology.


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## terbennett (Apr 1, 2006)

gamara said:


> Yes but unlike those things that are due to faster & newer processors, the main engine that drives a bike is still human powered. So no matter how much faster & smoother the new stuff shifts, its not going to make you go any faster than you already can.


True but that just makes cycling equipment even more ridiculous. This stuff isn't made to make you a better rider, it's main purpose is to sell. Marketing is a powerful thing. No matter what you do to Ultegra, it will always be perceived as a step down from Dura Ace. any advantage it has will be gone by next model year. That was proven back when SLR brake system came out back in the 80's. Shimano introduced it on the 105 group and it was a better system than 600 (now Ultegra) and Dura Ace had to offer at the time. It didn't deter 600 or Dura Ace people from wanting 600 or Dura Ace brakes. Mr. Versatile is right. This stuff is to sell to people who have to have the latest and greatest ( the last part is debatable). Which brings up another question: How connected to your bike are you if the drivetrain does the work for you? Maybe SRAM is on to something after all.


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

terbennett said:


> True but that just makes cycling equipment even more ridiculous. This stuff isn't made to make you a better rider, it's main purpose is to sell. Marketing is a powerful thing. No matter what you do to Ultegra, it will always be perceived as a step down from Dura Ace. any advantage it has will be gone by next model year. That was proven back when SLR brake system came out back in the 80's. Shimano introduced it on the 105 group and it was a better system than 600 (now Ultegra) and Dura Ace had to offer at the time. It didn't deter 600 or Dura Ace people from wanting 600 or Dura Ace brakes. Mr. Versatile is right. This stuff is to sell to people who have to have the latest and greatest ( the last part is debatable). Which brings up another question: *How connected to your bike are you if the drivetrain does the work for you?* Maybe SRAM is on to something after all.


Apply that logic to your car and tell me if it has power steering, power brakes, automatic transmission, power windows, etc.

To me, these kinds of discussions have dubious value. A bicycle is a machine after all. Some machines are sophisticated; some are not. If something less sophisticated suits you, by all means that's what you should have. On the other had, if some have a liking for a higher level of sophistication, how is it a problem for you? We don't drive Model T's any more, we don't sit around listening to a radio that is as big as a refrigerator, the vast majority of us don't wear heavy long wool overcoats and the vast majority of us don't have outhouses any more. In their day, all these things were State of the Art. But, the World moves on; progress is made.


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## dcorn (Sep 1, 2011)

flatlander_48 said:


> Campagnolo has been working on their EPS system for 20 years.


I don't believe this for a second. 

Lexus took 10 years to develop the LF-A, and even that is a lifetime in car years. And it's a super high-tech car...

Plus, think about available cycling technology in 1992. And the size of devices like cell phones and computers. Now imagine putting that stuff on a bike.


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## MMinSC (Nov 19, 2011)

Wow...glad I didn't buy Ultegra Di2 now. That front derailleur looks like a meatbrick. As Charles Barkley would say... "Turrable...just turrable..."


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

dcorn said:


> *I don't believe this for a second. *
> 
> *Lexus took 10 years to develop the LF-A, and even that is a lifetime in car years. And it's a super high-tech car...*
> 
> Plus, think about available cycling technology in 1992. And the size of devices like cell phones and computers. Now imagine putting that stuff on a bike.


You will need to recalibrate your yardstick. Campagnolo is a relatively small company. In 2005, 75% of Shimano's $1.4 billion net sales came from bicycle components (approximately $1 billion). By contrast, Campagnolo is about a $150,000,000 a year company. Shimano, and as you mentioned Toyota, can afford to throw cubic money and cubic people at a project. Campagnolo cannot afford to do that. When they invest in new developments, they have to get it right because they have no excess margin to allow for failures in the market place.

Anyway, the story is here:

Campagnolo EPS / DISCOVER EPS


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## bdaghisallo1 (Sep 25, 2007)

CutAussie,

Your chain is on backwards. The side of the chain that has the inner plates slotted should face the NDS of the bike.


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## tantra (Jan 8, 2008)

bdaghisallo1 said:


> CutAussie,
> 
> Your chain is on backwards. The side of the chain that has the inner plates slotted should face the NDS of the bike.


Unless its a KMC chain.


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## JapanDave (Mar 11, 2012)

bdaghisallo1 said:


> CutAussie,
> 
> Your chain is on backwards. The side of the chain that has the inner plates slotted should face the NDS of the bike.


I believe they are just random pics off the net. But, maybe you could track down the owner and let him know, I am sure he would appreciate it.

So missing a shift doesn't slow anyone down?


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

gamara said:


> Yes but unlike those things that are due to faster & newer processors, the main engine that drives a bike is still human powered. So no matter how much faster & smoother the new stuff shifts, its not going to make you go any faster than you already can.


Yep! Couldn't have said it better.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

2013 Red ships at the end of March.

Lighter than mech DA and will be current for a few years.


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

PaxRomana said:


> DA Mechanical is a terrible choice now. It will be superseded very shortly.
> DA Di2 is also a bad choice. The new technology lies with Ultegra Di2.
> 
> If you go Shimano, Ultegra Di2 is basically your only choice right now. That will change in a few months, so either postpone your decision or go Ui2.


Do you mean 11 speed? 

View attachment 253145


but if you need a drivetrain now then what can you do ... even if if it has to be Ultegra/Dura-Ace mechanical that is (not if Di2 or Ui2 becomes lighter than their respective counterparts) ... I am only going to be recreational so instead of 11 speed I will only have 10?


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n said:


> Do you mean 11 speed?
> 
> but if you need a drivetrain now then what can you do ... even if if it has to be Ultegra/Dura-Ace mechanical that is (not if Di2 or Ui2 becomes lighter than their respective counterparts) ... I am only going to be recreational so instead of 11 speed I will only have 10?


If you need a drivetrain now, buy whatever is on the market. I suggest Ultegra Di2.


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

What is the weight penalty between Ultegra Di2 and Dura-Ace? Just not keen with the idea that I need a battery to change my gears ...


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n said:


> What is the weight penalty between Ultegra Di2 and Dura-Ace? Just not keen with the idea that I need a battery to change my gears ...


From Here: http://forums.roadbikereview.com/3748166-post91.html


The Velo 2012 Bicycle Buyer's Guide came out recently. Leonard Zinn wrote a piece about Di2 and EPS.

He also included the following weight chart:

Super Record (mechanical) - 1895g
SRAM Red - 1933g
Dura-Ace 7900 (mechanical) - 2052g
Super Record EPS - 2098g
Record EPS - 2184g
Dura-Ace Di2 - 2219g
Ultegra Di2 - 2482g

The only piece missing is:
Athena EPS - 2452g


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

flatlander_48 said:


> ...
> Super Record (mechanical) - 1895g
> SRAM Red - 1933g
> Dura-Ace 7900 (mechanical) - 2052g
> ...


Cheers for that ... :thumbsup: ... difference between Ultegra Di2 and Dura-Ace, 400g??? ...


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