# Just got my Continental 4000s



## Wicked2006 (Jul 9, 2005)

I've read good things about these tires. I have them on my SRAM s40's right now. Big ride tomorrow sometime. Can't wait to put them to the test. 

Anyone else here using them? Do you like them? Let me know? Thanks!


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

Only tires I ever ride, racing or training! Not the greatest durability, but very grippy in the wet and dry, smooth ride, very cut/puncture resistant.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Only about half the site. :wink5:

For me, they're a great compromise among ride feel, wear life, and puncture protection. Too expensive for the commuter, though.


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## pagey (Oct 30, 2009)

Only tires I will use. I go with 25mm at 90psi on my S2 - love em!


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## natedg200202 (Sep 2, 2008)

I'm riding tubeless now, but the last set of 4000s that I had made it to 3,800 miles, the most I have ever gotten from a set of tires.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

after using GatorSkins for several years, tried the 4000S.

much better road feel, same mileage (~3K+), and good-to-excellent cut-resistance.

I did get one tire that had some sidewall tears in the first 100 miles...but could have just been from a bad batch.

just watch PBK for discount specials and they're fairly affordable.


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## 95zpro (Mar 28, 2010)

So far I have put about 500 miles on mine and you could not even tell they have been rolling for that long; no visible wear, cuts or anything else of that nature. Overall I would say one of the best tires I have used so far.


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## Wicked2006 (Jul 9, 2005)

This time I bought my pair from my LBS. Next time I'll order them from PBK. I just like to help out the LBS. So far I like them.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

i ordered some 25c earlier this week. should be here by tomorrow.


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## Tachymetres (Apr 18, 2004)

Used them for a few months until the rear tire rolled off the rim in a turn and put me on the pavement. Never again. Pro Race 3 for training and Vittoria Open Corsa CX for racing.


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## asianarnold1 (Mar 23, 2004)

2.5seasons. 6000mi. 1 pinch flat (big pothole, snake bite, under inflated). 105psi front / 110psi rear. 
yeah, i'm due for another set.


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## Defy3Guy (Mar 31, 2012)

Noob here. Just took off 25c Gatorskins and mounted GP4000 23c's. I'm 235 pounds and ride weekends usually 40-60 miles. Some commuting during the week. (unpredictable Ohio weather) Should I have mounted the 25c's? I'm looking for comfort.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Defy3Guy said:


> Noob here. Just took off 25c Gatorskins and mounted GP4000 23c's. I'm 235 pounds and ride weekends usually 40-60 miles. Some commuting during the week. (unpredictable Ohio weather) Should I have mounted the 25c's? I'm looking for comfort.


Yep, you should have.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Defy3Guy said:


> Noob here. Just took off 25c Gatorskins and mounted GP4000 23c's. I'm 235 pounds and ride weekends usually 40-60 miles. Some commuting during the week. (unpredictable Ohio weather) Should I have mounted the 25c's? I'm looking for comfort.


or 28mm. bigger tire=more air volume=lower pressure=more comfort. 25mm at minimum for a guy your size, with comfort as the goal.


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## harrypy (Dec 30, 2011)

Take away three zeros for mine - I use the 4 Season tires (25) and love them for general road use.


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## natedg200202 (Sep 2, 2008)

Tachymetres said:


> Used them for a few months until the rear tire rolled off the rim in a turn and put me on the pavement. Never again. Pro Race 3 for training and Vittoria Open Corsa CX for racing.


That's hard to imagine given Continental's very tight fit.


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## Hoibb (Apr 7, 2012)

Used Contis for years. All around good tire for me. Then on a trip to Fla, the guys there turned me on to Vredsteins. Pumping those up to 120-130 (I'm not a weight weenie) and what a diff. Puncture resist. I don't mind a hard ride but these things are bullet proof. Contis though are very nice.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Tachymetres said:


> Used them for a few months until the rear tire rolled off the rim in a turn and put me on the pavement. Never again. Pro Race 3 for training and Vittoria Open Corsa CX for racing.


something isn't right about this. why would the tire stay on for 'a few months' then roll? either the tire became damaged or it wasn't inflated to proper pressure. i really doubt it was the tires fault.


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## 2Slo4U (Feb 12, 2005)

Tachymetres said:


> Used them for a few months until the rear tire rolled off the rim in a turn and put me on the pavement. Never again. Pro Race 3 for training and Vittoria Open Corsa CX for racing.


What rim are you using? I got a flat the other day on my Zipp 101's. I went to pull the tube out of the tire and once I had the tube out, the tire fell right off the rim


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## Roadone (Jun 18, 2011)

Tachymetres said:


> Used them for a few months until the rear tire rolled off the rim in a turn and put me on the pavement. Never again. Pro Race 3 for training and Vittoria Open Corsa CX for racing.




OMG this just freaked me out! I just put a set of 4000s on my Trek and when I started filling up the front tire about at 90psi my tire blew off the rim and blew out my new continental tube! the tube had about a 4 inch tear from the blow out. Sounded like I shot a gun off in the room.

I figured it was a bad tube so I used the oem trek tube and reinstalled the tire and it was fine. I replaced both front and back tires on the bike with the GP4000s and made a tremendous improvement. So did my tire blow off my rim at 90psi because of a bad tube or a tire issue ( Bontrager Race L rims). I always triple check things when installing tires so I don't feel I installed the tire incorrectly. Have not had any issues riding so far but Tachymetres freaked me out. I like to fly around corners and a tire coming off the rim gives me chills thinking about it. I do fill my tires at 120psi every time I ride.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Roadone said:


> OMG this just freaked me out! I just put a set of 4000s on my Trek and when I started filling up the front tire about at 90psi my tire blew off the rim and blew out my new continental tube! the tube had about a 4 inch tear from the blow out. Sounded like I shot a gun off in the room.
> 
> I figured it was a bad tube so I used the oem trek tube and reinstalled the tire and it was fine. I replaced both front and back tires on the bike with the GP4000s and made a tremendous improvement. So did my tire blow off my rim at 90psi because of a bad tube or a tire issue ( Bontrager Race L rims). I always triple check things when installing tires so I don't feel I installed the tire incorrectly. Have not had any issues riding so far but Tachymetres freaked me out. I like to fly around corners and a tire coming off the rim gives me chills thinking about it. I do fill my tires at 120psi every time I ride.


your tire blew off the rim because you installed it improperly. you pinched the tube between the rim and the tire. when a tube explodes like that it's either because you did the install wrong, or there is a big hole in your tire somewhere (sidewall, probably).
and...
120psi is WAYYYYY too much pressure. if you NEED that much pressure to avoid pinch flats, you need bigger tires.


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## bikerjohn64 (Feb 9, 2012)

cxwrench said:


> your tire blew off the rim because you installed it improperly. you pinched the tube between the rim and the tire. when a tube explodes like that it's either because you did the install wrong, or there is a big hole in your tire somewhere (sidewall, probably).
> and...
> 120psi is WAYYYYY too much pressure. if you NEED that much pressure to avoid pinch flats, you need bigger tires.


+1 for this ^^^

I have two sets of rims and they both run on 4000s. I've gone through 3 sets and totally loved them from the start. 

I used to be a huge Vittoria Open Corso fan but just could not justify the cost per mileage wear. They would be perfect for race wheels but I found them to wear too quickly and prone to small cuts. 

The Conti were very sticky from first install and they corner like on rails. It must be the chilli compound. The wear is excellent and by far the best $/mile tires I have used so far. I've bought some from my LBS and Ribbles for as low as $39/tire. 

I will give the 25mm tires a try next.


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## Roadone (Jun 18, 2011)

cxwrench said:


> your tire blew off the rim because you installed it improperly. you pinched the tube between the rim and the tire. when a tube explodes like that it's either because you did the install wrong, or there is a big hole in your tire somewhere (sidewall, probably).
> and...
> 120psi is WAYYYYY too much pressure. if you NEED that much pressure to avoid pinch flats, you need bigger tires.



Some where I read stated that Continental recommends inflating to the PSI listed on the tire which is 120psi on my GP4000s 25c's so that's what I do. I weigh 210lb and rides great for me so I would see no reason to under inflate these tires. But yeah I probably did not have the tube right in the tire when setting them up the first time. So Tachymetres must of had a rare fluke for his tire rolling off the rim. I know I have never heard of that happing before.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

There's something a little harder that's supposed to be the real target. I ran into 15% deformation of the tire. 120psi could be pretty appropriate for you, at your size, but for a smaller rider it would be pretty rough.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

cxwrench said:


> or 28mm. bigger tire=more air volume=lower pressure=more comfort. 25mm at minimum for a guy your size, with comfort as the goal.


Most people would be better off with 25's.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

cxwrench said:


> 120psi is WAYYYYY too much pressure. if you NEED that much pressure to avoid pinch flats, you need bigger tires.


Not if you are a big boy it's not. In fact Continental recommends up to 120.

http://www.conti-online.com/generat...ce/racetyres/grand_prix_4000S/gp4000S_en.html


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## NJBiker72 (Jul 9, 2011)

darwinosx said:


> Not if you are a big boy it's not. In fact Continental recommends up to 120.
> 
> http://www.conti-online.com/generat...ce/racetyres/grand_prix_4000S/gp4000S_en.html


Exactly. If you are around 200 or more you need the pressure.


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## Tachymetres (Apr 18, 2004)

cxwrench said:


> something isn't right about this. why would the tire stay on for 'a few months' then roll? either the tire became damaged or it wasn't inflated to proper pressure. i really doubt it was the tires fault.


Can't say for certain if it was the tires fault. But I can say that even if the pressure had dropped due to something I picked up on the road, the tire should not have separated from the rim as there was still plenty of air in the tube. I've gotten many flats over the last 25 years of riding and racing and always have had early warning of reduced pressure by the tire squirming or bouncing. Low pressure causes a tire to squirm or slide in a turn, not separate from the rim. I've even ridden several miles on a flat Pro Race 3 when my spare tube failed and the tire stayed on the rim. The only variable that I can control in the future is the choice of tires and I've made my choice.


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## Tachymetres (Apr 18, 2004)

2Slo4U said:


> What rim are you using? I got a flat the other day on my Zipp 101's. I went to pull the tube out of the tire and once I had the tube out, the tire fell right off the rim


2011 Mavic Ksyrium Elites


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## Wicked2006 (Jul 9, 2005)

Update on my new 4000s...These tires are super fast and handle the road excellent. This is my 1st time using the 4000s tires. I'm amazed big time on how well they handle. Great tires no doubt!!


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## Roadone (Jun 18, 2011)

I like them too ALOT! I wonder how they will stack up to the new Michelin Pro 4's


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Tachymetres said:


> Can't say for certain if it was the tires fault. But I can say that even if the pressure had dropped due to something I picked up on the road, the tire should not have separated from the rim as there was still plenty of air in the tube. I've gotten many flats over the last 25 years of riding and racing and always have had early warning of reduced pressure by the tire squirming or bouncing. Low pressure causes a tire to squirm or slide in a turn, not separate from the rim. I've even ridden several miles on a flat Pro Race 3 when my spare tube failed and the tire stayed on the rim. The only variable that I can control in the future is the choice of tires and I've made my choice.


ok, this is very different than your first post. you said 'the tire rolled off the rim in a turn', not that there was any pressure loss preceding the tire coming off the rim.


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## rdubbz (Sep 23, 2008)

darwinosx said:


> Not if you are a big boy it's not. In fact Continental recommends up to 120.
> 
> Continental Bicycle -Grand Prix 4000 S


they recommend 110psi in the link you posted. 120 is the max.


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## Wicked2006 (Jul 9, 2005)

rdubbz said:


> they recommend 110psi in the link you posted. 120 is the max.


Thanks for pointing this out!


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## Dajianshan (Jul 15, 2007)

They're the only tires I use. I prefer 25c, but I can never find them, so 23c for me.


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## nscott1463 (Apr 10, 2012)

Another Noob here (relatively), I am looking to put some GP's on my set of 2011 Aeolus 5.0's (tubulars) and not sure what size to use. I ride 25-50 miles 3-4x a week. Race 56 mile distances (Half Irons). I'll be training on my 5.0s here and there as my Trek SC 7.2 came with bontrager race's and they're heavy and slow. Any advice? Thanks all!


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Because I'm procrastinating, I looked at the manufacturer's web site for you.
http://media.bontrager.com/images/features/201108_aeolus/bontrager_aeolus_d3_wheels.pdf
pg. 29

They don't say anything about 23 vs. 25, although they do design the rim to work with a 23. If you want to use Contis, you don't get a lot of choice anyway, though - 19mm or 22mm. I'd probably go with the 22s - a little heavier, but close to the design spec of the rim, and they should have lower rolling resistance. I think the GP 4000 tubular is only in 22mm. Making the decision even easier.


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## charlox5 (Jan 31, 2011)

i'd been saving a set of 23's for a while, but now that i'm making the switch to 25's, i guess i'll have to wait a little longer to try them.

i wasn't that impressed with the Conti Force/Attack combo--but i'm willing to give 4000s in 25 a shot sometime down the line.


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## nscott1463 (Apr 10, 2012)

Thanks for the info!! Do you have any other suggestions then for something similar to the 4000s?


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

LOL. Nope. No tubulars for me, and if I did, they'd be for 'cross or track racing, not an outdoor TT. I'm sure somebody who knows wtf he's talking about with specific products will chime in, though.

If you ride with a team, see if you have a line on anything.


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## JosephTroppo (Mar 13, 2012)

I've just switched out of curiosity my 4000s tires to vredestein fortezza trip comp tires.
Must say that the first impressions are promising. Very steady feel, great cornering and no complaints in the what. I'd put them next to the 4000s in quality. Curious how many km they will hold up..


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

I had one of those. I could swear I wore it out faster than my GP4000s, but that was before my records got good enough to quantify it.


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## JosephTroppo (Mar 13, 2012)

Too bad you're unable to quantify it.. After all they are a bit cheaper so that could justify it.


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## Sworker (Jul 22, 2010)

I switched from Mich Pro 3's about a year ago. I did have one fail me but overall the best tires. However, you people that get 3k out of them, I cannot. I live on the California Coastside south of San Fran and with our roads and my weight (210) I only get 800-1000 out of rear tires. I switched to the 4 season conti GP's for the rear of my Tarmac (regular training bike) but still run chili's on the roubaix for long rides. I think these are best tires, I have run Vittorios, Michelins and others and while the Pro 3's roll better the GP Chili's are much more stable to corner and in anything wet...plus the Pro 3's only last 500 miles where I ride.


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## TallCoolOne (Jan 18, 2010)

Just did about 70 miles in the rain and/or very wet roads. I think the GP 4000s rides better in wet weather than in dry. They tend to get a little bouncy on rough terrrain. They rode like a dream today on wet roads.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

rdubbz said:


> they recommend 110psi in the link you posted. 120 is the max.


Uh yeah...I said up to 120. Up. To. Which doesn't change anything I said but still confirms you were wrong to say his pressure was too high.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

TallCoolOne said:


> Just did about 70 miles in the rain and/or very wet roads. I think the GP 4000s rides better in wet weather than in dry. They tend to get a little bouncy on rough terrrain. They rode like a dream today on wet roads.


Try a little less pressure.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

Been riding the 4000s in a 25 for a few weeks now. For the last couple years I rode Four Seasons. One set in 25 once set in 28.
The 4000s has noticeably better road feel and stickier in turns. I'm in Phoenix so its pretty dry here. 
I'm a convert. A 28 option would be nice though.


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## rider9 (May 27, 2011)

darwinosx said:


> Not if you are a big boy it's not. In fact Continental recommends up to 120.
> 
> http://www.conti-online.com/generat...ce/racetyres/grand_prix_4000S/gp4000S_en.html


Maximum pressure of 120 psi does not equal "recommends"

I rarely put more than 100 psi in my tires and I am a big boy (230 #).


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

What is so hard to understand about "up to"? I didn't say 120. I said up to 120. I'm 260 and use 110. For many years I ran 120.


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## bent steel (Dec 28, 2007)

darwinosx said:


> For many years I ran 120.


For many years, folks thought the earth was flat. The earlier statement that running 120 psi is too much holds true, provided the bike can fit larger tires. I'm 185 pounds and can run 23's at high pressure, but find 25's at 85/90 ride much better and provide a noticeable amount of comfort. I used to ride 20's at 130 psi, but I'll never go back to that. My commie has 28's at 70/80 and those feel great.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

You must really be desperate to be right. Continental says up to 120. Continental. The company that makes the tire.
I am much bigger than you. If I rode at 85-90 I would be getting pinch flats every time I rode. This is why CONTINENTAL says UP TO 120.


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## bent steel (Dec 28, 2007)

darwinosx said:


> You must really be desperate to be right. Continental says up to 120. Continental. The company that makes the tire.
> I am much bigger than you. If I rode at 85-90 I would be getting pinch flats every time I rode. This is why CONTINENTAL says UP TO 120.


I really don't care, and it was my first post on the subject. All I was trying to clarify was what CX Wrench was getting at, from my perspective. My car will do 155, I suppose I should drive home at that speed just because some dude in Germany said it could. It came on Continentals that are speed limited to 186 mph, but I'll just trust that they're correct on that too.

Simple point remains that a 28 at 90 - 100 psi will be more comfortable than a 25 at 120, regardless of whether it will handle that pressure, with the earlier caveat that not all frames will hold 28's or even 25's.


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## Roadone (Jun 18, 2011)

120psi is not too much for me, I like it. Bike runs great with higher tire pressure and rolls quicker with less resistance. I like fast and I'm more then comfortable at that pressure, plus I'm in recommended tire and wheel ratings. I do at times drop to 110psi but never below that and really do not notice much difference in rolling speed between the two pressures I use.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Roadone said:


> 120psi is not too much for me, I like it. Bike runs great with higher tire pressure and rolls quicker with less resistance. I like fast and I'm more then comfortable at that pressure, plus I'm in recommended tire and wheel ratings. I do at times drop to 110psi but never below that and really do not notice much difference in rolling speed between the two pressures I use.


More pressure dosent make a tire faster.


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## Roadone (Jun 18, 2011)

less rolling resistance


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## redlude97 (Jun 29, 2010)

Roadone said:


> less rolling resistance


Not always


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Fine with me if everyone else uses too much pressure. Hopefully they do it on race days too.


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

Two things I keep noticing, nobody has mentioned using different tires sizes on front and back, and too many people are only looking at rated pressure. People keep saying if you are over 200 pounds go to 25c's... I agree, on the rear wheel only. I weight 220 pounds, and using the tire drop chart and assuming bike weight of 20 pounds and a 60/40 weight distribution that only puts me at about 96 psi in the front with 23c's, which I normally just round up to 100 psi. I currently have conti 4000s 23c's on both wheels because I didn't know what I was doing when I bought them, and have to run the rear 135 psi according to the tire drop chart. Being an engineer, I'm perfectly okay with utilizing some of there 2x safety factor, and this doesn't worry me too much, but I do wish I bought a 25c for the rear. With this set up, the tires feel fast, and decently comfortable. For those other people in the same ball park weight range, I would recommend the 23c in the front and 25c in the back, it should put both tires in the 90-100 psi range which should maintain good rolling resistance and comfort.


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## NJBiker72 (Jul 9, 2011)

jiznake said:


> Two things I keep noticing, nobody has mentioned using different tires sizes on front and back, and too many people are only looking at rated pressure. People keep saying if you are over 200 pounds go to 25c's... I agree, on the rear wheel only. I weight 220 pounds, and using the tire drop chart and assuming bike weight of 20 pounds and a 60/40 weight distribution that only puts me at about 96 psi in the front with 23c's, which I normally just round up to 100 psi. I currently have conti 4000s 23c's on both wheels because I didn't know what I was doing when I bought them, and have to run the rear 135 psi according to the tire drop chart. Being an engineer, I'm perfectly okay with utilizing some of there 2x safety factor, and this doesn't worry me too much, but I do wish I bought a 25c for the rear. With this set up, the tires feel fast, and decently comfortable. For those other people in the same ball park weight range, I would recommend the 23c in the front and 25c in the back, it should put both tires in the 90-100 psi range which should maintain good rolling resistance and comfort.


I think I may try something similar in the future. I recently switched out an S-Works Turbo in the rear for an old Maxxis Refuse. Both 23s officially but the Maxxis is wider and tougher. With the S-Works still in the front the handling feels good and the Maxxis feels more sturdy in the back. Once I wear out these tires I may consider going to a durable 25 in the rear with a racier 23 in the front.


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

For those who don't know, here you can find an article on proper tire pressure, along with the chart with proper tire inflation by size (my nomenclature of tire drop chart might have been a bit off).


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## Margal (Mar 8, 2012)

I just bought contis 25and23s for $230 including $115 parking ticket. I think this set up makes sense. I weigh 160lb now. Should I run 90/100psi?


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Try lower.

I'm at 170 lb right now and do 80 and 95 in 23mm tires.

Or just use one of the charts as a starting point.


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

Margal said:


> I just bought contis 25and23s for $230 including $115 parking ticket. I think this set up makes sense. I weigh 160lb now. Should I run 90/100psi?


I think from the chart you are around 75 psi in the front and 80-85 in the back.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

Defy3Guy said:


> Noob here. Just took off 25c Gatorskins and mounted GP4000 23c's. I'm 235 pounds and ride weekends usually 40-60 miles. Some commuting during the week. (unpredictable Ohio weather) Should I have mounted the 25c's? I'm looking for comfort.


You definitely should go with 25's. So should most people really but bigger people for sure.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

blew off my gp 4000s 25mm over the weekend. i was running it at 120 psi on a fulcrum 6 rear wheel with 28 spokes. the tire had less than 400 miles on it.

i was riding 19mph downhill on a roughish road. i weight 220 lbs. I ride light IMHO and don't take a lot of risks...especially on roads i've never descended.

i'm still trying to figure out if it was an error on my part due to pressure too high or a possible tire defect or crappy wheel.

either way i need a new tire, rear wheel, and skin on my arms and ass.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

Well that sucks. Wouldn't think it was the pressure since Conti recommends up to 120 psi. That looks like some serious damage to the tire. I've used Conti 25's for years and never had any issues but thats not really helpful.


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

IMHO, I don't think you were running the pressure too high unless it was 120 psi at 30°F and and it was 120°F outside. The pressure is pretty much dead on where it should be from that tire drop chart, and within the max tire pressure. Beyond that, hard to say what would cause that.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

it was caused by the tube being pinched between wheel and tire. The rip is post-blowout and comes from braking without air pressure. The other way this can happen is if the tire is loose fitting on the rim and you run high pressure. Too bad to hear you went down - clinchers are nasty with blowouts at speed (been there done that).


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## NJBiker72 (Jul 9, 2011)

stevesbike said:


> it was caused by the tube being pinched between wheel and tire. The rip is post-blowout and comes from braking without air pressure. The other way this can happen is if the tire is loose fitting on the rim and you run high pressure. Too bad to hear you went down - clinchers are nasty with blowouts at speed (been there done that).


Wouldn't that happen before 400 miles?


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## zender (Jun 20, 2009)

stevesbike said:


> it was caused by the tube being pinched between wheel and tire. The rip is post-blowout and comes from braking without air pressure. The other way this can happen is if the tire is loose fitting on the rim and you run high pressure. Too bad to hear you went down - clinchers are nasty with blowouts at speed (been there done that).


This was the first thought I had too. But, the times I've had a tube blow a tire off the rim from pinching, it happens during or immediately after inflation. You think braking, and therefore heating the rim, can put a tiny amount of pinched tube over the brink and blow off like that on a descent?


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

zender said:


> This was the first thought I had too. But, the times I've had a tube blow a tire off the rim from pinching, it happens during or immediately after inflation. You think braking, and therefore heating the rim, can put a tiny amount of pinched tube over the brink and blow off like that on a descent?



thanks for the replies guys. it's been informative.

the tube was also blown to smithereens. it was installed on wednesday night and ridden 22 miles with lots of climbs and fast descents.


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## NJBiker72 (Jul 9, 2011)

jct78 said:


> thanks for the replies guys. it's been informative.
> 
> the tube was also blown to smithereens. it was installed on wednesday night and ridden 22 miles with lots of climbs and fast descents.


Similar happened to me. But it was a rear and it blew right AFTER a steep decent. I had ridden maybe 20 miles the day after installing. Thought I may have over inflated ina rush though too. Probably a pinch though.


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

It sure seems like I read a lot about these magic mystery sidewall blowouts with the Contis more than any other tire. After reading about one story and seeing pictures I checked mine and found a pea- sized bulge in the sidwall of my tire. That tire went straight to the trash. Have not bought these tires since and just dont trust them. 
I'm currently loving my Schwalbe Duranos and Vittoria Rubinos in 25s.
You're luck may vary.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

here's a schwalbe ultremo with the same failure (this one from heating on a descent) and tube blowing.


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## Sworker (Jul 22, 2010)

I personally love the Conti Black Chili GP4000's but I also have now had two major blow outs with them. One for sure was a complete failure of the tire with a seam giving way, thank god I was on a flat surface and just cruising. The second one happened on a decent and according to the LBS was an object that created it, not a failure. However, I was unable to find anything in the tire when we changed the tube, I had to use a patch to get me home safe and sound.

I have them on both my bikes, I have also run many of them until the wear hole was flat without anything ever happening and I like these tires alot, but once the current batch I have are used up I am going to try to figure out something new to run. I like the Michelin Pro 3's (I haven't tried the Pro 4s) but where I live the pavement is so unforgiving that a rear Michelin only lasts me 500 miles at best and which point it is gashed up beyond repair. I ran Vitorrios for a long time but those tend to have rear tire flat-topping. I am a bigger guy (210) and started to run 25's in the back.

I wish I could say I trusted the Conti's 100% but my confidence in them is slipping.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

Sworker said:


> I wish I could say I trusted the Conti's 100% but my confidence in them is slipping.


Indeed.

I contacted their US rep via email and he basically said...sypathetically: "shat happens, here's a new tire/tube on us."


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## Sworker (Jul 22, 2010)

I got the first pair replaced by warranty, I have my LBS showing it to the rep and will try to RMA it for me. If she refuses I asked for the tire back, maybe you can give me the US Reps name and I will go VFR direct to them.


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## hamsey (Aug 16, 2010)

Had a similar problem after replacing my front tire. Tube was pinched, did not notice it until 28 miles into the ride. Thankfully someone stopped for a pee break and I was looking down and saw the tire bead popped off the rim about a 1/3 of the way around (just before a big descent). Got it back on and continued the ride. I check my tires now ever ride at some point during the ride. Definitely operator error.


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## NJBiker72 (Jul 9, 2011)

hamsey said:


> Had a similar problem after replacing my front tire. Tube was pinched, did not notice it until 28 miles into the ride. Thankfully someone stopped for a pee break and I was looking down and saw the tire bead popped off the rim about a 1/3 of the way around (just before a big descent). Got it back on and continued the ride. I check my tires now ever ride at some point during the ride. Definitely operator error.


How can you see this? Not mechanically inclined at all. Thought you would need to remove the tire to check this?


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

jct78 said:


> i'm still trying to figure out if it was an error on my part due to pressure too high or a possible tire defect or crappy wheel.


Probable tube installation error. 

Other possibilities include:

Brake pads hitting the tire sidewall (not uncommon). 
Tire too loose on rim.


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

Sworker said:


> I personally love the Conti Black Chili GP4000's but I also have now had two major blow outs with them. One for sure was a complete failure of the tire with a seam giving way, thank god I was on a flat surface and just cruising.


A seam giving way? If it was a cut in the sidewall next to the bead, that is nearly always caused by brake pads contacting the tire. Most rims these days have a very small brake track and it's tough to get the adjustment perfect.


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

stevesbike said:


> here's a schwalbe ultremo with the same failure (this one from heating on a descent) and tube blowing.


A tube won't blow unless the "container" fails.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

rruff said:


> Probable tube installation error.
> 
> Other possibilities include:
> 
> ...


it's possible, but i'm pretty meticulous with my machines. the whole bike was new and running flawlessly. the 4000 wasn't what i'd consider loose on the rim, but i could easily remove/install without a lever.

live and learn i guess.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

NJBiker72 said:


> How can you see this? Not mechanically inclined at all. Thought you would need to remove the tire to check this?


Put a little air in your tube before you install it. Not much, just so it's got some shape.

Inflate your tire about halfway and stop. Inspect the bead. Usually if your tube is pinched between the rim and the tire, you can actually see it somewhere. If the tube's sticking out or the tire's not seated right, let some air out and fix it.

Inflate the rest of the way and go ride.


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## zender (Jun 20, 2009)

jct78 said:


> the 4000 wasn't what i'd consider loose on the rim, but i could easily [bold]remove[/bold]/install without a lever.
> 
> live and learn i guess.


Wait, that doesn't compute. Being able to *remove* a clincher tire without at least one lever sounds loose to me.


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## bvber (Apr 23, 2011)

zender said:


> Wait, that doesn't compute. Being able to *remove* a clincher tire without at least one lever sounds loose to me.


I was wondering about that too. GP4000S is notorious for tight fit and need tool/s to remove and install.


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## Sworker (Jul 22, 2010)

That wasn't the issue with mine, they were professionally installed at the LBS and the first one failed completely on the seam. But I believe your right that these tires seem more prone to pinch flats than others and you have to check them out completely. i usually gas them up nearly to 100 pounds, than let all the air out and check the fit one more time before calling them done.


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

"Professionally installed"... are you sure about that? 

What "seam" are you speaking of?

"Pinch flats" are when you hit something hard enough that you bottom out the tire on the rim and cut the tube. Catching the tire under the bead... and then getting an explosion... doesn't have a name AFAIK.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

zender said:


> Wait, that doesn't compute. Being able to *remove* a clincher tire without at least one lever sounds loose to me.


the initial install was tight, but after that i was able to break the bead off by using my hands only. 

i don't think i've run into a road tire that i've needed levers on although my experience is limited to panaracer, michelin, conti, and spesh only.

mtb tires though...i've had plenty of wrestling matches and the busted levers to show for it...


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## Eric_H (Feb 5, 2004)

rruff said:


> Catching the tire under the bead... and then getting an explosion... doesn't have a name AFAIK.


I think it could be called "User Error".


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## jpatkinson (Jun 10, 2007)

I just wanted to add my love for the Conti 4000s tire. I bought the 25 version. I have only a couple hundred miles on mine (no flats, yet). I think I have them over-inflated (based on what I am learning here). I have been cycling on and off for over thirty years and these are by far the best tires I have ever ridden: they stick to the road like glue and they feel supple (even @ 115 PSI). I have them on a new bike, so I can't isolate how much I love the tires compared to others on this frame -- but I can't imagine being happier with them.


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## Sworker (Jul 22, 2010)

Yes, the guys that work on my bikes are master mechanics. If they can repair a broken shift lever on a Campy Record 10 shifter I think I can safely say that my tires were professionally installed. My last two coti failures were failures of the seams in the tires. Tnat said I logged over 6k miles in the last 18 months all on the conti gp4000s and had only those two failures and 1 pinch flat and one object puncture....that is not bad.

As for changing a road tire without a lever, wow. I can do it with only 1 lever but I sure need tnat one.


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## jct78 (Dec 12, 2011)

jpatkinson said:


> I just wanted to add my love for the Conti 4000s tire. I bought the 25 version. I have only a couple hundred miles on mine (no flats, yet). I think I have them over-inflated (based on what I am learning here). I have been cycling on and off for over thirty years and these are by far the best tires I have ever ridden: they stick to the road like glue and they feel supple (even @ 115 PSI). I have them on a new bike, so I can't isolate how much I love the tires compared to others on this frame -- but I can't imagine being happier with them.


how much do you weigh and what kind of road surface do you normally ride?


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## Eric_H (Feb 5, 2004)

Just want to add that I have pretty good luck over the years with Conti tires and the GP4000 especially. I find it is the best blend of performance, flat resistance, and mileage compared to Michelin PR3, Vredestein Fortezza TriComp, or Vittoria Open CX.

Regarding the failures described here, I'll suggest three things for any clincher tire/user combo:

1) On install, verify there is no tube underneath the bead before inflation. When mounting new tires, I install and pump up to about 50 or 60 PSI, then deflate and check under the bead. The area of concern is usually where the last bit of tire is stretched over the rim, if the fit is super tight it is easy to pinch the tube under tire bead. And just because a shop installed the tube does not mean they did not pinch it. It can happen, even a self-professed expert like myself, I did manage to do it once last year when I mounted a Vittoria CX in a big hurry on a Reynolds carbon rear wheel (tight fit, rush job, tube popped out about 1.5 km from my house).

2) If one manages to hit an object hard enough to flat via pinch-flat, take the time and inspect the tire closely at the bead. There is the possibility the impact has damaged the bead as well. And if the flat is a sudden flat at a decent rate of speed, but not an impact, there is also the possibility the bead can be damaged by riding on the flat tire long enough to stop safely. Again, inspect.

3) Always verify brake pad position when changing wheelsets. The differences in brake track width and rim cross-section width can make it easy enough for the pad to get into the sidewall if one is not careful. Pad alignment is important for those who do a lot of riding in the rain as more grit is held on the pads and as the pads wear down they start to contact the rim in different position (due to the differences in movement on a dual-pivot caliper). If a pad is set on the verge of being too high when it is new, once it is half-worn it may actually start to rub the tire sidewall unless adjusted.


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## jpatkinson (Jun 10, 2007)

jct78 said:


> how much do you weigh and what kind of road surface do you normally ride?


I weigh 175#, the bike is 20#, and I ride asphalt/concrete (San Francisco and Marin County, mostly). I would guess 50% of my typical ride is new pavement, 50% pretty rough old pavement.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

rruff said:


> A tube won't blow unless the "container" fails.


the increase in pressure in a tube due to heating (big issue for carbon clinchers) can cause a loose fitting tire to blow - this is one reason why Zipp took so long to come out with full carbon clinchers according to their technical director. More generally, a clincher blowout at speed - not necessarily blowing off rim but a rapid defaltion - can cause the tire to rip under braking. 

The Conti 4000s is probably the best quality control clincher made. One of the advantages of being made in Germany. New tire runs are particularly prone to have manufacturing issues. The new Pro4 has a lot of quality control issues.


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## hamsey (Aug 16, 2010)

NJ,
While we were stopped I happened to look down ans saw the tire coming off the rim. More cautious when I install a tube now.


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## Loogs (May 3, 2012)

Just got a set I ordered on eBay for $98.00. Good or bad ? Anyway, I wanted to go from 23's to 25's and I'm so glad I did. These tires feel Great. I don't have any real mileage on them yet to speak of but judging from what everyone else is saying, they'll last me a while.


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## bikerjohn64 (Feb 9, 2012)

Loogs said:


> Just got a set I ordered on eBay for $98.00. Good or bad ? Anyway, I wanted to go from 23's to 25's and I'm so glad I did. These tires feel Great. I don't have any real mileage on them yet to speak of but judging from what everyone else is saying, they'll last me a while.


Ribbles has them for $37 each right now.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

Pro Bike has twin packs for $87.69.
http://www.probikekit.com/us/continental-gp4000s-road-tyre-twinpack.html


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## Loogs (May 3, 2012)

bikerjohn64 said:


> Ribbles has them for $37 each right now.


Don't know what that is but like I said, I got 25's. I didn't want 23's and I could only find them on eBay. I got free shipping so I think I did well.


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## bojangles31 (Nov 1, 2011)

Great Choice in Tires!!

I live in an area where the roads are not maintained all the time, leading to bumps cracks and what not. They are by far the most comfortable tires i have owned and ridden on. I've got about 500 miles or so on them, and they are super grippy wet or dry, (states above).

Helpful hint, I usually keep them above 90psi, at 173lbs, 5'9" i would get snake bite flats all the time.

This could also be because of my weight and lack of pressure. Hope it helps, for what its worth.


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## irishdb (May 25, 2012)

4000s = GREAT tire!!


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## joelia2526 (May 7, 2012)

Very new to this, but I notice my ride is very uncomfortable over any bumps. Was thinking of changing out my tires and psi. I'm around 200lbs, and I'm riding a Giant Defy 2, stock rims and tires at 120psi, as instructed by LBS. From what I read, it sounds like a good way to go would be 23 on the front, and 25 on the back, drop psi to around 100-100? Can somebody confirm? Thanks!


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## SteveV0983 (Dec 9, 2008)

joelia,

No matter if you switch to 25 or not, lower your pressure to 100-105. If you want the most comfort, especially in your hands, go to 25s front and back. Either way, regardless of your weight, running them a 120 will be much harsher and any little bit of debris you hit will have a good chance of causing a flat.
Running 23s at 120 gives you a very "tall" tire which compresses very little. The resulting "footprint" of this tire is very narrow (side to side) but very long (front to back) which makes for a much greater contact area with the road than if you ran a wider tire at a lower pressure. The result of this narrower but longer contact patch is more rolling resistance and a harsher ride.
The 25 at 100 gives you a wider (side to side) but shorter (front to back) contact patch which results in less rolling resistance.
All that being said, I have honestly never seen so many cases of complete sidewall failure as I have about GP4000s on these or other forums. I have desperately wanted to try their 25s, but don't trust them. I weigh 180 and have been riding for over 26 years and have never had a sidewall failure. Over the last 10 years I have run either Michelin Krylions or Vredestein Fortezza TriComps and have never had these problems. Even though I would love to try these tires in a 25, I cannot see giving up the TriComps because they have performed flawlessly. If only Vredestein made 25s........


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

Pretty weird. I'm a relatively big guy (205ish) and have run nothing by GP4000 (and their predecessors) in 700x23 for about 10 years and many thousands of miles. The only side-wall failures I can recall were due to hitting large rocks at an oblique angle once or twice. OTOH, I generally don't run them until they're completely worn out either and I suppose the roads in Colorado are, on average, better than many places.


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## joelia2526 (May 7, 2012)

Thanks for the advice Steve, will be slapping on some 25's this week and trying them out!


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## Pitts Pilot (Dec 5, 2011)

The sidewall thing just keeps popping up and amazes me as well. There must have been a bad batch or two at some point that soured a few people forever. I think most of the troubles I've read about were quite a while ago and a thing of the past. Myself, I switched to the GP4000s right when it came out and haven't ridden anything else since - mostly in 23, but one set of 25's. I have nothing but good things to say about this tire.

(BUT - I did just throw on some Pro4 in 25mm and I like them A LOT. Don't know about wear yet, but I think I'm switching.)


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

Steve, I don't see why so quick to dismiss the 23/25 combo. You have less weight on the front tire, therefore you can run it at lower pressure (if they are the same size), or the same pressure at the same size. If you look at the charts at his weight, the 23/25 combo puts him almost perfectly at the ideal weight on each tire for running at 100psi.


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## jiznake (Jan 24, 2012)

IMHO, given your weight, you are pretty much ideal for the 25/23 combo. I'm about 210 right now, and have 23s, and my front is perfect at 100 psi, but I have to over inflate the rear to about 130, if I was running 25/23 I could run around 100/100. Although even at 130 psi these tires run pretty well. Also, you don't have a "tall" tire at 120 psi if you weight enough to compress it. Which you do. Your tire contact area times your tire pressure is going to equal the weight on the tire, always, simple physics.


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

SteveV0983 said:


> All that being said, I have honestly never seen so many cases of complete sidewall failure as I have about GP4000s on these or other forums.


They are very popular (for good reason) so you will hear more of everything. I'm still going on the theory that any cuts parallel to the bead are from brake pads contacting the tire. I certainly haven't had a problem bombing down gravel roads.


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## AM999 (Jan 22, 2007)

tihsepa said:


> More pressure dosent make a tire faster.


On a smooth surface more pressure results in a reduction of Crr and a faster rolling tire. On a real road with surface bumps Crr decreases with increasing pressure until a pressure is reached when the tire begins to "bounce" resulting in increasing effective Crr with increasing pressure.


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## SteveV0983 (Dec 9, 2008)

jiznake said:


> Steve, I don't see why so quick to dismiss the 23/25 combo.


Actually, I think this is also a good option (forgot to mention that in my post). My only thought on that was that if in fact 25s give a more comfortable ride, I would also want those in the front since I would assume it would be more comfortable on your hands. Maybe less road buzz, but I don't know since I haven't tried them yet. Maybe someone who has tried 25s in the front can give their feedback on how they feel on the hands.


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## royta (May 24, 2008)

I weigh 156 nekkidd, so I'm probably 160 with kit and shoes. I run the 4000 in black in the 23 size, not the 4000S. The 4000 in black still uses the black chile compound. I rotate front to rear every 250 to 300 miles. Due to where I live, I do a lot of climbing. 8% type stuff. With climbing comes fast descents. 40+ MPH is very common with my fastest at 53. The tire does develop a flat tread down the center, probably from all the climbing. I've been running 105 up front and 110 in the rear. Because of this thread, I'm going to try a lower pressure. These tires seem to roll well. Yesterday on a solo ride, I averaged 21.0 MPH on a 46 mile mile ride which consisted mostly of rollers, but two climbs thrown in too (1450 total elevation gain).


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## mikeyp123 (Mar 9, 2007)

Roadone said:


> less rolling resistance


Not true.


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

SteveV0983 said:


> Actually, I think this is also a good option (forgot to mention that in my post). My only thought on that was that if in fact 25s give a more comfortable ride, I would also want those in the front since I would assume it would be more comfortable on your hands. Maybe less road buzz, but I don't know since I haven't tried them yet. Maybe someone who has tried 25s in the front can give their feedback on how they feel on the hands.


I just brought some Bontrager handlebar dampeners Friday from a local bike shop. The mechanic told me about it when I mentioned the bar tape on my S2 didn't offer enough cushion or shock vibration. I didn't think twice and brought them since I have a tennis racquet dampener which really work. It's only $10 so it's worth it to dampen the road buzz.


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

Reading this thread, methinks too many people rely on charts and rules. I weigh around 205, run 700x23 GP4000s at 110 psi front and back. Ride quality is fine and I've think I've had one pinch flat in two years (huge hole that I didn't see in time).


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Useful for roughing in tire pressure. If I can choose between having a starting point that's probably close to "my" pressure and no starting point, it's a pretty easy decision.

I agree, people should still play around with it and see what happens.


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## OhLuckyMan (Sep 11, 2011)

I've had some similar experiences with the 4000s tires that some of the other posters have had.

First off, I love the tires. I replaced the Swalbe Lugano tires that were standard kit on my bike (Cannondale C6 Synapse) to prepare for my first long ride - 180km around Lake Geneva. I have about 400km on them now and they still look new. 25c is the best size for anything but racing and they handled my weight -97kg - and the ruts in the French roads flawlessly.
However, I too had a blowout on the front after pumping the tires to the max - 120 psi. Fortunately the tire was not damaged and I put in a new Botranger Race X tube, inflated to 110 and have had no issues since.

So, in conclusion. Buy the tires, they're great. Don't inflate them to the Max pressure and use 25c instead of 23's unless you are racing flat out. This whole discussion of 23 vs 25mm tyres is just about to get a whole lot more interesting. Check out the new BMC Gran Fondo - their bike build for the Paves of Paris-Rubaix and for slightly more comfortable long distance riding. It is designed to run on 28mm tyres!
Happy riding
OLM


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## BillyWayne (Aug 1, 2011)

I have the 4000s 23s. I run them at around 105psi on 23mm wide rims. I had a tri race last weekend and the weather was 52 degrees and raining. During my post race review I realized that I had no issues with the tires. I had a car pass me and blow out a tire just as he was passing. I got a bit nervous and started fearing having to repair a flat out there while I was shivering. But the grip was excellent and I will race these tires again.


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## easyridernyc (Jan 10, 2008)

*gators*

i run gatorskins slightly different profile than the 4000's, but they are sweet, no doubt. bombproof and solid rollin...4000's next


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## Dunbar (Aug 8, 2010)

darwinosx said:


> Pro Bike has twin packs for $87.69.
> http://www.probikekit.com/us/continental-gp4000s-road-tyre-twinpack.html


Use coupon code bicycling10 and they're $78.92 per pair with free shipping from the UK.


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