# Clip Ins Versus Cleats



## LauraM (Oct 27, 2010)

I have yet to wear anything other then regular tennis shoes cycling. I am going to upgrade soon from my Schwinn to a nicer road bike and have been contemplating getting clip in pedals, or not. What is the difference between clip in shoes and cleats? Pros? Cons? Thanks for any information you can provide!


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## Creakyknees (Sep 21, 2003)

Flat pedals are fine for a lot of uses; I think most people are pushed into cleats before they actually "need" them.








Pro: wear any shoes, simple, easy.
Con: feet can slip / move around when pedaling fast or in wet conditions. 

When you say "clip in pedals" I think you might mean "toe clips and straps" 








These are the older style of attaching your feet to the pedals. The main benefit is stability - your feet won't slip off the front, or re-position themselves while you're pedaling. If the straps are cinched tight, you can use them to help put more power down, but that's a marginal exercise at best with sneakers.
Pro: more stability than flats. Can wear about any shoes (sneakers etc)
Con: difficult to flip them over and get your foot in, especially while wobbling away from a stop. Not all that great for racing / high efforts.

Cleated shoes / pedals are what most roadies use; the kind that click in via various spring-loaded cleats (originally inspired by ski bindings).








There are many different brands and styles, most incompatible with each other. 
Pro: integrated shoe/pedal system snaps in securely
Con: higher cost, still tricky to get started with, almost useless unless you have the matching shoes on. Most are not to be walked in very far.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

Creaky gave a good summary. Back when dinosaurs roamed the earth almost all riders used the "clips & straps" system in his 2nd picture. Riders who rode a lot, or raced wore cycling shoes with metal cleats nailed to the bottom of their shoes. The cleats had a groove cut in them that fit the back edge of the pedal. Fastening the foot to the pedal gave a stable platform for the foot as well as providing maximum efficiency & power.

When starting out the rider would have to flip the pedal up with his toe, insert his foot into the strap, click down so the cleat engaged the rear edge of the pedal, then tighten the strap. At every stop the rider would have to bend over and reach down to loosen the strap, then take his foot out. This was pretty hard to do during quick or emergency stops.

In the mid 70s a French company, Look, invented the first "clipless" pedal system. This did away with the metal toe clips & the nail on cleats. IMO it was a *HUGE*advantage over the old clips & straps system. The straps sometimes cut into the top of the foot, and the toe clips could cut into the toe of the shoes & cause pain to your toes. The clipless systems eliminated these discomforts. Cleats are now screwed on to the bottom of the shoes and are easily adjustable both fore and aft as well as side to side by the owner. Modern clipless pedals also allow for side to side movement of the foot while pedaling to prevent knee injuries from misaligned cleats. This feature is called "float". It's very easy to disengage from the pedals. All the rider needs to to is kick a the heel to the outside & the foot is instantly freed. 

There are many different "clipless" systems sold today. Most of them will fit any cycling specific shoe. Look, Shimano, Speedplay, Campagnolo are a few of the more popular brands. They're all good & each system has its fans. IMO clipless pedal systems in one of the most important advancements to bicycling in the last 50 years.


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## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

I can't expect anyone NOT to be hesitant or skeptical of clipless pedals, as I was myself. After all, the upstroke shouldn't count for too much so what's the big deal? Big deal in question is a firmer, less-squishy downstroke, the ability to utilize different muscles for brief "breaks". Yes, big jump in cost from the usual platforms, over what is atm a bunch of words for you until you try it.

I've only played with two brands (Crank Brothers and Shimano) so far, but I'd say that nay system is relatively easy to adapt to. Only time I fell with cleats was when I was off the bike, foolishly playing basketball right off my ride. ha.

So from one previously unsure user to another: it's a very worthwhile try.


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## LauraM (Oct 27, 2010)

Thanks for the info! Much appreciated. Still not sure what I want to do but at least I am better informed now.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

It's probably stating the obvious, but anyway: consider that going back and forth between regular pedals and clipless isn't that big a deal. If you keep your regular pedals and are just a little handy, you could even do it yourself as long as have a good ($20 or so) pedal wrench. It's not like getting clipless pedals has you condemned to clipless riding forever...


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## redmasi (Jul 14, 2010)

Good info here! :thumbsup: 

The only thing I might add (especially w/ winter coming on), is to check out your gym's spinning equipment. First, spinning is a great fun... Second, the pedals on most spinning bikes have the 'toe clips' on one side of the pedal, and (at least at my gym) Shimano SPD clip-in on the other side of the pedal. 

This gives you chance to try out both, and if you go with SPD clip-ins, you can get lots of 'clip-in' and 'clip-out' practice on the stationary spinning bike, so you feel comfortable on the road (which can be intimidating at first). If you like that idea, consider SPD mountain bike shoes, instead of SPD road bike shoes. Mountain bike shoes are designed to be walked in like regular shoes (check out the bottom of the two shoes in the pic above). 

Then.... Clip-in and go for a ride... clip-out and walk into your favorite coffee shop for a break... PLUS wear the same shoes into the gym and clip-in to your spinning bike. :thumbsup:


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

redmasi said:


> Good info here! :thumbsup:
> 
> The only thing I might add (especially w/ winter coming on), is to check out your gym's spinning equipment. First, spinning is a great fun... Second, the pedals on most spinning bikes have the 'toe clips' on one side of the pedal, and (at least at my gym) Shimano SPD clip-in on the other side of the pedal.
> 
> ...


So as not to confuse the OP, Shimano's SPD system uses recessed (2 bolt or 4 bolt using an adapter plate) cleats and although they are commonly used on road bikes, are (at least IMO) primarily considered a mtn bike pedal system. Non-recessed (3 bolt) cleats are referred to as Shimano SPD-SL, LOOK compatible (to name but two, but there are others). These are strictly road bike pedal systems. 

As has been noted, th advantage to SPD's (recessed) is that the shoes are easier to walk in and (generally) clip in either side of the pedal. The road pedal systems (non-recessed) are usually one sided pedal systems and are more difficult to walk in.

Here's a link with some additional info, but IMO it's slightly biased:
http://www.caree.org/bike101cliplesspedals.htm


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## redmasi (Jul 14, 2010)

PJ352 said:


> So as not to confuse the OP, Shimano's SPD system uses recessed (4 bolt) cleats and although they are commonly used on road bikes, are (at least IMO) primarily considered a mtn bike pedal system. Non-recessed (3 bolt) cleats are referred to as Shimano SPD-SL, LOOK compatible (to name but two, but there are others). These are strictly road bike pedal systems.
> 
> As has been noted, th advantage to SPD's (recessed) is that the shoes are easier to walk in and (generally) clip in either side of the pedal. The road pedal systems (non-recessed) are usually one sided pedal systems and are more difficult to walk in.
> 
> ...


Absolutely correct and thanks for that! :thumbsup: 

Just as a side... As far as shoe styles go, I will say that several of the SPD-compatible shoes that I see women wearing in my spinning class are really quite attractive. (no further comment  )


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

redmasi said:


> Absolutely correct and thanks for that! :thumbsup:
> 
> Just as a side... As far as shoe styles go, I will say that several of the SPD-compatible shoes that I see women wearing in my spinning class are really quite attractive. (no further comment  )


I've since edited my post because I confused myself.  

SPD's are actually 2 bolt systems, with 4 bolts being employed with the use of an adapter plate (ex: Speedplay's).


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## mitchtaylorsbro (Oct 25, 2010)

LauraM said:


> Thanks for the info! Much appreciated. Still not sure what I want to do but at least I am better informed now.


My transition went: flat pedals and sneakers --> toe clips and cycling shoes (which gave me a stiffer sole and the option to add cleats if I wanted to) --> clipless pedals and mountain bike shoes/cleats. 

I can only remember two falls caused by my inability to click out of the pedal in time. Neither caused any injury (well the one that happened at the busy intersection kinda hurt my pride). 

One way to avoid these minor falls is to plan your stops farther in advance than usual. This gives you a few extra feet to disengage your shoe from the pedal before you absolutely have to put your foot down. Once you've practiced the "escape motion" a few dozen times, it becomes automatic. Of course, I just jinxed myself and will have a cleat-related accident on my next ride... but oh well.


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## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

Perhaps another thing to consider is what type of biking you will mostly be doing. I use toe-clips and straps on my road bike because I commute with it a lot, make many short trips (1-5 miles), and need to walk around and perambulate in street shoes at multiple points along and at the end of my rides. 

So I would say:
short trips and urban commuting = toe clips
fitness, racing, long rides = clipless

Also, pedals are very easily removed from cranks. 2 different pedal-types could be an option.


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## LauraM (Oct 27, 2010)

So I bought myself a TREK 1.1 today and it came with the strap kind of pedal. A little tricky at stops but I think I am getting the hang of it quickly. Thanks for all of the good information!


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## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

Sweet. I hear those are pretty nice bikes, except for the saddle. If the seat is uncomfortable, replace it; don't give up on road bike entirely! Have fun!

(BTW. Strap kind of pedal = toeclips)


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

LauraM said:


> So I bought myself a TREK 1.1 today and it came with the strap kind of pedal. A little tricky at stops but I think I am getting the hang of it quickly. Thanks for all of the good information!


Welcome to the world of road riding and congrats on the new bike. _Nice_ choice!! :thumbsup: 

You'll get the hang of toe clips w/ straps in no time at all. Just keep the straps adjusted properly for the shoes you're wearing (not loose, not tight), plan ahead for stops and keep practicing entry/ exit. 

Once you've got that down pat, on to the next (clipless!) step.


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## mitchtaylorsbro (Oct 25, 2010)

Congrats on the new bike!


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## qatarbhoy (Aug 17, 2009)

Off-topic-ish, but don't be too hasty to swap the saddle if you find it overly hard or uncomfortable at first. I have the Bontrager R on my 2.1 and once I got the bike fit adjusted (took a few weeks of tweaks) and got the fore-aft position and the nose tilt of the saddle where I needed it, it was fine.


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## Aindreas (Sep 1, 2010)

qatarbhoy said:


> Off-topic-ish, but don't be too hasty to swap the saddle if you find it overly hard or uncomfortable at first. I have the Bontrager R on my 2.1 and once I got the bike fit adjusted (took a few weeks of tweaks) and got the fore-aft position and the nose tilt of the saddle where I needed it, it was fine.


Thanks. Guess I forgot to mention the intermediate steps of bike-fit and getting yer ischial tuberosities saddle-accustomed.  

However, the reviews I've read of the bike were near-unanimous in calling the saddle uncomfortable.


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## kykr13 (Apr 12, 2008)

Aindreas said:


> Perhaps another thing to consider is what type of biking you will mostly be doing.


This. Road clipless (like Shimano SPD-SL) is great for riding, but if you want to walk more than 50' while you're out it's probably the wrong system. It's all compromises, but I've done some decently-long rides with Crank Bros MTB pedals and had no problem.

I will say that I have started to hate my 2.1's saddle again and it's getting replaced, probably with a Fizik Aliante. But give it some time before you do this; if you're new to riding most of what you're feeling is just getting used to doing it.


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## LO lefty (Nov 1, 2008)

I just feel uneasy with the whole clipless thing, and I enjoyed the clips on my venerable '72 Motobecane. Now I use Power Grips with my Bacchetta, and like them, too. 

Is there really that much of a performance upgrade by switching to clipless? Seems like a lot of expense if not. Maybe it's just where I live, but it strikes me that most of the riders I see clipped in on aren't getting all that much out of it, if you don't count the status-seeking part of it.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

LO lefty said:


> Is there really that much of a performance upgrade by switching to clipless?


No, if by 'performance' you mean 'power' or 'speed.' But that's not really the point of clipless pedals. There's a great deal of satisfaction in feeling truly connected to your bike, able to control it much better than you would with your feet just resting on platform pedals. There's also more safety at high cadences, especially if it's wet outside, the speeds are high and the road is bumpy. And for what it's worth: PowerGrips do connect the rider pretty well, so no real need for you to go clipless. But I have to tell you that after riding with clips and straps for many years, NOT having something touch the tops of my shoes while still being connected felt heavenly to me.  

/w


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## terbennett (Apr 1, 2006)

There is a big difference with clipless pedals. No need to feel unconfident with them. If you go into it with an open mind, you'll catch on very quickly. I was racing back when clipless pedals really started getting attention- in the mid to late 80's. It was great trying them out and after two rides, I had adapted to them. Seriously, there is a major difference in performace with them. The shoes are stiffer to help transfer power and I like the idea that I no longer have a strap wrapped around my shoes to keep me in place. Once you start riding with clipless and get used to it, you'll never go back. BTW, if you're starting out, I would recommend a larger platform pedal like the Look KEO. Shimano's another nice option to start out with. Both are easy to clip into and easy to release when you need to. Speedplay is also a great pedal and it's two sided so you can enter the pedal from both sides. The platform is a little small however.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

LO lefty said:


> I just feel uneasy with the whole clipless thing, and I enjoyed the clips on my venerable '72 Motobecane. Now I use Power Grips with my Bacchetta, and like them, too.
> 
> Is there really that much of a performance upgrade by switching to clipless? Seems like a lot of expense if not. Maybe it's just where I live, but it strikes me that most of the riders I see clipped in on aren't getting all that much out of it, if you don't count the status-seeking part of it.


Interesting points. I didn't have a lot of problems with clips and straps, either, but when I first got a set of Looks about 20 years ago it was an immediate improvement. Although many folks are, like you, made uneasy by clipless, the reality is the opposite, paradoxical as that may seem. If you wore cycling shoes with cleats, and tightened the straps down, you had to reach down with your hand to loosen the buckle to get out. Clipless eliminates that extra step, so you actually can get out more readily

I've not used Powergrips, but I've heard good things, and they seem like a good design.

Re the performance upgrade, one question: what sort of shoes do you wear? If you haven't ridden with rigid-soled cycling shoes, you really are missing a performance (or at least long-ride comfort) upgrade.

Wim is right that most of the improvement comes from having the positive connection. Spinning high cadences with power, and jumping up to pedal standing when necessary, are far less secure if you're not well connected. Of course, you can get that with straps (including Powergrips) too.


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## laffeaux (Dec 12, 2001)

LO lefty said:


> I just feel uneasy with the whole clipless thing, and I enjoyed the clips on my venerable '72 Motobecane. Now I use Power Grips with my Bacchetta, and like them, too.


Compared to top-clips and Power Grips clipless is:
- by far easier to get your foot into
- significantly easier to get your foot out of
- do not clip the ground when they are flipped upside down
- do not require you to look down to figure out why you can't seem to get your foot in the cage
- never require you to reach down to tighten or loosen them
- your foot does not slid around accidentally

The only disadvantages to clipless is:
- cost
- if you want to clip in, you need to be wearing special shoe.

I've riding clipless since 1995 - before that I was using toe straps. It's completely second nature to get in and out of them. Getting out requires no more thought than stepping off of a platform pedal, and getting into them is just as easy. On my commuter I ride flat pedals since I don't wear biking shoes. However, I won't go back to toe-straps because to me they're so much of a pain when compared to clipless or platform pedals.


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## LauraM (Oct 27, 2010)

qatarbhoy said:


> Off-topic-ish, but don't be too hasty to swap the saddle if you find it overly hard or uncomfortable at first. I have the Bontrager R on my 2.1 and once I got the bike fit adjusted (took a few weeks of tweaks) and got the fore-aft position and the nose tilt of the saddle where I needed it, it was fine.



Yeah I had a few painful rides before I had everything in the perfect positioning. Thanks for posting this because my first thought was that I needed a new saddle. Now it is great!


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## LauraM (Oct 27, 2010)

*Clipless it is!*

I didn't last very long in the clip and strap kind of pedal. Bought a pair of Bontrager cycling shoes today, cleats and clipless pedals. So far I don't think they are that difficult. I didn't eat any pavement and love the feeling of being connected to the bike. I would definitely recommend clipless to people once they are comfortable riding a bike. And can I just say I don't think I will ever understand why so many cycling shoes are white! I went with black. At least they match all my winter riding gear.

View attachment 218790


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

Good for you. Once you get fitted, the comfort and efficiency will blow your mind.


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## Mr. Versatile (Nov 24, 2005)

Black shoes = :thumbsup: I have large feet & if I wore white shoes they'd look so prominent you'd have to look hard to notice I was on a bike. 

Oh, wait! Maybe I should have called that a shoe set. :-D


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