# Newbie Advice needed - Raleigh vs Fuji



## Brew

Hi,

I am looking at choosing between two bicycles, after looking at the various bike shops here in town. The candidates are (essentially the same price):

Raleigh Detour 4.0 or 4.5

Fuji Crosstown 2.0

Me: I am 55, about 200 pounds, have lost 55 pounds over the last year, trying to get down another 25. The primary point of the bike is another form of exercise; I am getting pretty bored with swimming and elliptical. I have an old 10 speed, but it causes pain in my back and palms. I am looking for something more comfortable, will ride about 45 minutes or so in general. Mostly riding pavement, although there is a cinder canal path nearby that is popular.

I like these two bikes because they have the seat shock (don't know that I care about the front shock), and 8 speed trigger shifter (I don't like the feel of the twist style shifter). Since I am just getting into it, I don't want to get carried away and spend too much money for something I will probably ride 2-3 times per week.

So, I am looking for opinions/experiences with these.

Thanks,
Brew


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## CleavesF

Hey Brew, Welcome to the forums. 

it sounds like you have a nice routine, but just because your old 10 spd doesn't feel comfortable doesn't mean it can't be without a few adjustments. Unless the geometry feels too aggressive, I'd mess around with the bike fit first before buying a new one.

If you really want a new bike, especially for comfort, hybrids are comfy because of their upright position. Personally, I'd go with the Raleigh for the Shimano stuff. Suntour isn't bad either, but I'm just not a big fan. 

If you can explain what hurts more specifically, lower or upper back, etc... many people here will be able to help you with your old bike fit just in case you don't want to drop $ on a new bike.
________
Honda rc164


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## wim

*Poor choice, you deserve better.*



> _So, I am looking for opinions/experiences with these.Thanks, Brew_


The bikes you listed are designed so that they can be ridden without involving any muscles other than the ones in the leg. What these bikes do is force you into a bolt-upright seating position, with no muscular effort needed to support your upper body. But in such a position, all vibration and shock travels straight up into the already compressed rider's spine. The seat post shock absorber is a feeble attempt to solve this problem.

The people who design these bikes also believe that a rider should be able to put both feet flat on the ground at stops. To make this possible, they slacken frame angles to put the rider far behind the bottom bracket. Pedaling a bike like that is a bit like doing knee bends with your upper body leaning slightly backwards—try it sometimes to see how even a major effort generates not much power.

You're motivated to lose weight and get fit, so I think you deserve better than one of these so-called city bikes. My suggestion is to get a bike that has you leaning slightly forward, allowing you to exercise the muscles in your back, shoulders and arms along with you leg muscles. On a bike like that, you could ride much longer distances in comfort, and at fitness efforts. The inexpensive Fuji hybrid at the link is just one example. I know it has twist-grip shifters, but the discomfort of twisting would be nothing compared to the pain you'd feel after riding a so-called city bike 10 miles at a fitness pace.  

http://fujibikes.com/2008/bikes.asp?id=473


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## Brew

*More info*

OK, here is some more info/thoughts.

The old bike is probably pretty sad. It is literally about 50 years old; I bought it used 30 years ago. The back wheel is kind of bent, the brakes always have trouble closing right (they are pulled by cables, but the cables work through a V-type of cable at the brake). The friction shifter is down on the lower tube, so I have to reach down around my knees to jiggle it. I also think it is too small, since I seem to have the seat set way high to allow appropriate extension of my legs (I haven't actually measured it). I would clearly need to buy new tires and inner tubes, it has sat flat for several years now. Seems like it would cost a significant amount to replace shifter and brakes...

Being bent over that much, my back ends up sore. Even when I was younger I didn't have great flexibility That much weight on my hands also ends up bruising my palms fairly badly. I would guess I could futz with the setup a bit to help alleviate this, but in the end it seems to make sense to just start over.

In regards to wim's comments: I have also been thinking along similar lines, that I should maybe look at what I will call a "performance hybrid" (the flat black handlebar, a longer stretch to the handlebars, narrower seat). However, the ones I have seen locally have been significantly more expensive, and seem to have the "parts setup" equivalent to the lower priced "regular hybrids". I.e., 7 speeds, twist shifter for 70% cost increase. Also, I was told at one store that the "performance hybrid" would not be good for riding on the gravel/cinder trails because the tires are thinner/narrower and more likely to get cut. I am unclear whether this is true, other stores seemed to have no issue with putting that style on the trails. 

I was thinking that as I became accustomed to the regular hybrid bike, I could adjust the stem so it is lower and flatter, rather than the standard "high" position, and have the equivalent riding position. Is this thinking flawed? 

While I eagerly await more sage advice, I will pursue the "performance hybrid" some more. Also, I will see if a store will let me adjust a regular hybrid like this...

Thanks,
Brew


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## wim

Brew said:


> I was thinking that as I became accustomed to the regular hybrid bike, I could adjust the stem so it is lower and flatter, rather than the standard "high" position, and have the equivalent riding position. Is this thinking flawed?


Not flawed. As a matter of fact, this is sort of what I was thinking when I posted the link to the $360 Fuji Absolute 4.0 hybrid.

As to the "thinner/narrower tires getting cut," keep in mind that a particular rim will safely accept tires of different widths. The limiter is frame clearance and brake clearance. Ask someone knowledgeable at the shop "what is the widest tire this bike will accept?" and make them prove their answer should you decide to buy a set of wider tires for your new bike. Then again, I can't imagine any hybrid, performance or not, coming with tires that can't handle a dirt- or cinder path.


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## CleavesF

In addition to wim's comments, my best friend bought a bike to do Chicago's bike the ride with me annually... and he ended up by a C30 hybrid. I can tell you know he wishes he bought a more aggressive geometry as I can even pass him up on my MTB with slicks. 

I understand you want to cross train with the bicycle, but remember sometimes the funnest part is also going fast and passing people. At least it is for me. 

Also, if you could post a picture of your old bike... the thing might be really beat to hell, but if it's a nice frame, you could either sell it for a good price, or rebuild it especially if it's a vintage race model. Even if it doesn't fit you it could actually be worth a lot more than you think.
________
Buy vapolution


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## Brew

*New thoughts*

OK, I have moved up a bit in price and looked at a new set of candidates. These are (I guess) more "performance" or "fitness" hybrids. Riding them, I find they feel more natural; with the previous models, I found myself trying to lean forward all the time, and the fatter saddles were uncomfortable.

So, now I am looking for opinions on the following models. They are kind of in order of my initial preference, although that order seems to change moment to moment...

Jamis Coda $475
http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Jamis&Model=Coda&Type=bike 

Trek 7.2 FX $460
http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/Q...x?Year=2008&Brand=Trek&Model=7.2+FX&Type=bike

Gary Fisher Wingra $460
http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Gary+Fisher&Model=Wingra&Type=bike

Raleigh FT1
http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Raleigh&Model=Cadent+FT1&Type=bike

Specialized Globe $440
http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Specialized&Model=Globe&Type=bike


I welcome any comments!

Thanks,
Brew


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## CleavesF

Well I'm biased. The Raleigh Cadent's geometry is pretty aggressive for a "comfort bike". I race on mine. 

Anyways, They all look good except the specialized, those cranks look ghetto.
________
Box vaporizers


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## tsteahr

*Coda - Jack of all trades, Master of none...*



Brew said:


> OK, I have moved up a bit in price and looked at a new set of candidates. These are (I guess) more "performance" or "fitness" hybrids. Riding them, I find they feel more natural; with the previous models, I found myself trying to lean forward all the time, and the fatter saddles were uncomfortable.
> 
> So, now I am looking for opinions on the following models. They are kind of in order of my initial preference, although that order seems to change moment to moment...
> 
> Jamis Coda $475
> http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Jamis&Model=Coda&Type=bike
> 
> Trek 7.2 FX $460
> http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/Q...x?Year=2008&Brand=Trek&Model=7.2+FX&Type=bike
> 
> Gary Fisher Wingra $460
> http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Gary+Fisher&Model=Wingra&Type=bike
> 
> Raleigh FT1
> http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Raleigh&Model=Cadent+FT1&Type=bike
> 
> Specialized Globe $440
> http://www.bikealog.com/BikePedia/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=2008&Brand=Specialized&Model=Globe&Type=bike
> 
> 
> I welcome any comments!
> 
> Thanks,
> Brew


Brew,

My wife has a 2001 Coda. It is very similar to the new Coda Comp. The components on her bike are a little higher spec then the Coda you are looking at, but the frame and fork are the same. Her bike had a MSRP around $800. It is a very versatile bike that can be ridden on both paved and dirt roads. It is an excellent bike to take on vacation where you can go exploring areas you have never been and be able to check out any dirt road or even a bit of not-to-technical trail riding. It is perfect for cinder trails and Rails-to-Trails paths. However, therein lies the problem. It is not road bike and it's not a mountain bike so it's not really ideal for either.

My wife has found that for rides longer than about 15 miles she wishes she had a real road bike. The upright position and flat handlebars are a real issue for longer rides. Her biggest complaint is with the flat handlebar you only have one position for your hands. The other issue she has is a vibration that comes through the handlebar and results in sore elbows after about 45 minutes. I can't say if this is just related to the Coda or if it would be an issue with all of these performance hybrids. I have ridden the Coda as well and I have also noticed getting sore elbows. The wrists and hands are no problem as you don't have much weight on them, but for reasons I don't understand there is a vibration that goes straight to the elbows.

My wife has asked me to look into swapping the flat bars for a road bar, but by the time you replace the shifters and recable everything, she would rather spend a little more and just get a real road bike. Then keep the Coda as-is for vacations and trips to Block Island, RI.

For reference, my wife is not a hard core rider. She rides between 150 and 200 miles a season. She used to ride more when the bike was new but she has become a little frustrated with the Coda. I am a little more experienced rider (between 4k and 5k miles a year) and I agree with my wife's assessments.

My honest suggestion would be to look at a bike with a road handlebar. Regardless of what bike you get, have a professional fit done. It is possible your back and hand pain is due to improper fit. I can't convey how dramatic the improvement in comfort a proper fitting can make.

Perhaps a cyclecross bike might be the best solution if you are looking for somthing you can ride on both pavement and cinder paths?

Similar to what others have already mentioned, my wife feels she is always trying to lean forward to gain some efficiency. She also feels she is fighting the wind with the upright seating position.

It seems to me (and my wife) the hybrid is really for fairly relaxed, casual riding. Best for rides where your heart rate does not really go much over what you get on a brisk walk. Yes, you can ride hard, but the bike is not really set up ideally for that.

Don't sell yourself to short. Riding 2-3 times a week is Great. You will build fitness and endurance quite rapidly on consistent rides a few times a week. If you said you were going to ride 2-3 times a month, then the hybrid is fine. 2-3 times a week you deserve something better (road bike, cross bike). It will be more fun and more comfortable in the long run.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, I just felt I should share our experiences with the hybrid we have.

Cheers


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