# deciding between sram apex and shimano 105/tiagra



## spectastic (Sep 4, 2012)

*SRAM Apex and Shimano 105*

First of all, how different is tiagra 4600 and 105 5700?

Second of all, does anyone have any experience with Gravity's RSeries road frames with the tapered top tube?

Third: how does 105 compare with apex in terms of weight, performance, and durability of non-consumables such as FD, RD, chain rings.



I know about the different shifting mechanisms, the louder shifting noises on the sram, and greater range in the Apex cassette. I'm just hoping someone would provide some new info that I haven't read about yet.


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## hir0 (Aug 16, 2012)

spectastic said:


> , and sram sounds like the way to go for me due to its ergonomic adv over shimano.


It's not that much of a difference IMHO. you still make the same basic movements with your hands.


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## mandvm (May 6, 2012)

I just bought a 2012 Specialized Secteur with Apex.I had considered other bikes, notably the Felt Z85 with Shimano 105, but there's lots of hills where I live, and I liked the 11-32 cassette on the Apex for hill climbing. If you're riding the flats, the 105 may have a slight edge. Sorry, I can't comment on the longevity - don't think anyone can, really, since Apex was only introduced recently.


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## spectastic (Sep 4, 2012)

I think I know everything I need to know about both 105 and apex at this point. I guess I was just posting just to have reassurance. My instincts are already telling me to go with apex. now it's just a matter of time of waiting for a sweet deal from BikesDirect. . .

I've had to look up the solutions manual from an Arabic forum so I can finish my engineering homework... bikes has been a huge distraction for me lately. Sometimes I wonder if I would be happier choosing a easier career choice.


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## clayfree (Jun 20, 2012)

spectastic said:


> First of all, how different is tiagra 4600 and 105 5700?
> 
> Second of all, does anyone have any experience with Gravity's RSeries road frames with the tapered top tube?
> 
> ...


Hi spectastic,
My wife has that Gravity with Apex and it's been a great bike. It requires a little tuning out of the box but has been very smooth and reliable. While the Sram is louder in the shifting it's a very positive click. Also the Apex has fully concealed cables out of the shifters so it's a much cleaner look(unlike the 105/Tiagra). With all that said I went with the 105/Tiagra and it's performed really well for me also. I do like the idea of pure gruppo so I think the Apex is a good deal.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

spectastic said:


> First of all, how different is tiagra 4600 and 105 5700?
> 
> Second of all, does anyone have any experience with Gravity's RSeries road frames with the tapered top tube?
> 
> ...


Boils down to whether you like SRAM's DoubleTap or not.

SRAM's Apex is also available in WiFLi... another benefit if you see a lot of hills


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## gte105u (Aug 12, 2012)

I love my Apex groupset. I find I have plenty of gears for both uphill and down. Double Tap is very intuitive once you get used to it. It can have a long reach though so is not always the easiest to push all the way from the drop. But you can adjust the positions of the levers if it is an issue. Zero loss is really nice as well. Overall I am really happy with went with it.


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## CAD10 (Jul 15, 2012)

I have Apex on the cross bike and 105 on my road bike.....hands down Apex is better. Actually switching my road bike over to Sram slowly.


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## champamoore (Jul 30, 2012)

clayfree said:


> Hi spectastic,
> My wife has that Gravity with Apex and it's been a great bike. It requires a little tuning out of the box but has been very smooth and reliable. While the Sram is louder in the shifting it's a very positive click. Also the Apex has fully concealed cables out of the shifters so it's a much cleaner look(unlike the 105/Tiagra). With all that said I went with the 105/Tiagra and it's performed really well for me also. I do like the idea of pure gruppo so I think the Apex is a good deal.


105 (5700series) has the cables on the bar, unlike Tiagra and 105 (5600 series). I've been very happy with my 105 5600 series. And the 5700 series is even better.

Go try both the SRAM and the Shimano gruppos out at a shop nearby. You might fall in love and support your LBS against your "better" plans. Listen to your heart. ;] Might want to make sure the bike includes the crank from the same series vs some cheap FSA set. It will make a difference, if you are riding very much, very quickly.


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## spectastic (Sep 4, 2012)

yea, I'm mainly looking at bikesdirect, and I'm perfectly ok with buying a bike without testing it beforehand. I've bought bikes of various sizes on CL, and they've all worked out with customization. IMO, buying a bike is not that different than a tennis racket. There's this thing called "honey moon period" where the bike might feel like the best thing in the world. But a while after that, that feeling disappears. From what I hear, kind of like a marriage. 

I've also read that apex cassette and chains are not as good as shimano because they were designed for lighter weight. In addition, the groupsets on BD bikes mostly exclude the cranks and brakes. The ones I'm looking at right now all have triple chain rings up front, which I don't like. The last time I actually used the FD for shifting was probably middle school or something... But as the crank/cassette/chain combination wears with time, I can upgrade them to shimano/sram parts for an extra $100.


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

I have been riding Specialized TriCross Elite with SRAM Apex since November 2011. In the recent month it has developed a chain suck problem when switching from big chainring to small chainring in the front (50/34 with KMC chain). This has already killed two SRAM front derailleurs: the original Apex and the replacement Force.

Since neither the chainring nor the chain are worn, the problem might have been caused by chain rub on the 50 (the first incident happened when I was crosschained, while in the second one I was not). My LBS polished the inner surface of the 50 and also made some adjustments to the FD cable tension. I'll see whether the problem will reappear.

This, of course, is not necessarily caused by the group (depending on what you include into the group).


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## philoanna (Dec 2, 2007)

I have over 3000 miles on my 2011 Salsa Vaya. No problems what-so-ever. 
I don't think you'll go wrong with either however.


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## spectastic (Sep 4, 2012)

AndreyT said:


> I have been riding Specialized TriCross Elite with SRAM Apex since November 2011. In the recent month it has developed a chain suck problem when switching from big chainring to small chainring in the front (50/34 with KMC chain). This has already killed two SRAM front derailleurs: the original Apex and the replacement Force.
> 
> Since neither the chainring nor the chain are worn, the problem might have been caused by chain rub on the 50 (the first incident happened when I was crosschained, while in the second one I was not). My LBS polished the inner surface of the 50 and also made some adjustments to the FD cable tension. I'll see whether the problem will reappear.
> 
> This, of course, is not necessarily caused by the group (depending on what you include into the group).


did you ever figure out why it happened? was the FD not setup correctly (eg. bent crooked), or maybe the shifter wasn't properly indexed. I guess I'm not quite sure what your problem was. Was it chain rub against FD, or was it the chain getting caught between crank and FD thereby damaging the FD?


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

spectastic said:


> did you ever figure out why it happened? was the FD not setup correctly (eg. bent crooked), or maybe the shifter wasn't properly indexed. I guess I'm not quite sure what your problem was. Was it chain rub against FD, or was it the chain getting caught between crank and FD thereby damaging the FD?


No, there was no chain rub against FD in normal riding. And the crank was not involved at all.

What happened was this: when shifting from 50 to 34 in front, the chain would not disengage from the bottom of the 34 (or maybe from the bottom of both 34 and 50). The chain would rise up with the chainrings past the chainstay (leaving a scratch on the chainstay) and then all the way up to the FD. At that point if would meet with the top portion of the chain and the FD cage, and together they would get forced into the FD cage. In both cases I was spinning the pedals pretty quickly, so the clumped up chain got rammed into the FD cage with quite a bit of force, completely disfiguring the cage (spreading the sides apart and bending it in other ways). In both cases it happened on the incline, but the chain was not loaded: I performed the switch at the point where the bike was still moving under its own inertia, i.e. the chain was not loaded at all.

All these are symptoms of classic downshifting chain-suck (J LEVY | BikeTechArticles | Chain-Suck). However, neither my chainrings nor the chain are worn. Both are cleaned and lubricated periodically.

So, I have no idea what exactly caused this. The mechanic at my LBS said that there were some rough spots on the inner side of my big chainring, which could have caused it to pick up the rubbing chain (when crosschained) an carry it up into the FD. However, it is not clear whether these rough spots are the reason or a mere consequence of the incident. They filed them down just in case. Also, they said that my FD cable was slightly overtensioned, although I don't know how it could have contributed.

I rode the bike today, first time with yet another new SRAM Force in front, paying close attention to frontal downshifts. But so far it was working fine.


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