# 2009 Pinarello Prince "real life" photos



## Sacke

Hi, 

I just ordered the Pinarello Prince BoB (Black on Black) and I have to wait 8-10 weeks before getting it. 

*So if you guys are sitting on real life pictures of 2009 Princes, please post them here! (It would be especially interested in pictures takes outdoors, to see what they look like in their natural habit, away from halogen spotlight halo's at exhibitions) *

I was planning on getting custom paint job, but after seeing the immense differences that the colors in the pictures and colors in reality had, I got too paranoid to get a color match that might not be as nice as one would expect. 

Several persons that had seen the Prince BoB in reality, said that it was the most beautiful bike that they had seen in a while. The Devil color looked ok, but I guess a majority of the frame is painted dark grey, not naked carbon, as one might presume... 

So I ordered the pitch black Prince Bob. I should have it in about 8-10 weeks... Keeping my fingers crossed that it is as beautiful as I've heard. 

It's the first time I buy a bike without seeing it in reality first... a bit nervous because of that. 

Here is a picture a borrowed from weightweenies... It is the most realistic picture I have found so far online.


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## T-Dog

I dont understand why people like this colour so much. Its awful! Its just a plain black frame with no varyation. I would get either the Fire, Blanco or Spain versions. All are bright and beautiful. Its all about indivdual preference I guess. My all time favorite was the old black and pink Team Telekoms they used to do.


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## rhauft

I've read the BoB looks amazing in natural lighting. I have an 08 Team Ltd currently. I was told by my distr. that the Devil will not be available in the US until January. Fire (red) & BoB are available now so I will be deciding between these two some time this week when I actually get to see them at Interbike in Vegas. Good luck, Rob


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## Sacke

*Mr. Rhauft*



rhauft said:


> I've read the BoB looks amazing in natural lighting. I have an 08 Team Ltd currently. I was told by my distr. that the Devil will not be available in the US until January. Fire (red) & BoB are available now so I will be deciding between these two some time this week when I actually get to see them at Interbike in Vegas. Good luck, Rob


Hi Rhauft. 

I have big respect for your taste and I really look forward to hearing your comments about the two bikes when you have seen them in reality. 

The Devil looks good in the pictures, but from what I understood, the base color is not black, but dark gray, which might look a bit cheap. I had the 08 Team Ltd and really loved to be able to see the perfectly weaved carbon in the black areas. 

A fellow rider down here in France had seen the 09 Princes at an expo in France and was praising the BoB as the most beautiful bike out there. 

I have already put aside a pair of LEW wheels due to their shiny black on matte black logo. A perfect match with the BoB. The wheels have a red Tune hub and black spokes. 

The BoB seems to be a perfect base for some serious detail-styling that is like soft whispers. Soft whispers in Italian, while you can feel the warm breath on your neck and the goosebumps cover the body. 

I don't know how many hours I have spent staring at pictures of the different paint-schemes, but I just always end up with the same conclusion. The Fire is the safe choice, the Devil is the obvious choice (based on pictures, but prone to disappoint), but the BoB is the sophisticated choice. The connoisseurs choice because it has beauty and subtlety and is the most surprising color in the Pinarello line for 2009. 

I have been trying to imagine the bike based on pitch black Scotts, Orbeas... you name it... The only thing is that no other producer (except for Massoni) had the balls to not even outline the letters. 

I think choosing the BoB represents confidence as well. Seriously... this might be vain and stupid, but one of the things I consider seriously when buying an extremely expensive frame, is the cool factor. Will the frame be noticed? 

I suppose, with the BoB, Pinarello has tried, and succeeded to create what so many others have tried before... An all black frame that really looks good! Not just like a carbon frame that a weight weenie pulled off the decals to save 4,7 grams.

I could go on forever with the analysis, but I really do look forward to hearing your opinion, and if in any way possible, seeing more pictures. 

If you have the chance to take pictures from other angles than drive side profile, it would be much appreciated. Whatever angle that you feel compliments the bike's design in the best possible way. 

I can still change my order... so I really would appreciate your input. Basically, whatever you get, I am prone to get...


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## T-Dog

Sacke said:


> Hi Rhauft.
> 
> I have big respect for your taste and I really look forward to hearing your comments about the two bikes when you have seen them in reality.
> 
> The Devil looks good in the pictures, but from what I understood, the base color is not black, but dark gray, which might look a bit cheap. I had the 08 Team Ltd and really loved to be able to see the perfectly weaved carbon in the black areas.
> 
> A fellow rider down here in France had seen the 09 Princes at an expo in France and was praising the BoB as the most beautiful bike out there.
> 
> I have already put aside a pair of LEW wheels due to their shiny black on matte black logo. A perfect match with the BoB. The wheels have a red Tune hub and black spokes.
> 
> The BoB seems to be a perfect base for some serious detail-styling that is like soft whispers. Soft whispers in Italian, while you can feel the warm breath on your neck and the goosebumps cover the body.
> 
> I don't know how many hours I have spent staring at pictures of the different paint-schemes, but I just always end up with the same conclusion. The Fire is the safe choice, the Devil is the obvious choice (based on pictures, but prone to disappoint), but the BoB is the sophisticated choice. The connoisseurs choice because it has beauty and subtlety and is the most surprising color in the Pinarello line for 2009.
> 
> I have been trying to imagine the bike based on pitch black Scotts, Orbeas... you name it... The only thing is that no other producer (except for Massoni) had the balls to not even outline the letters.
> 
> I think choosing the BoB represents confidence as well. Seriously... this might be vain and stupid, but one of the things I consider seriously when buying an extremely expensive frame, is the cool factor. Will the frame be noticed?
> 
> I suppose, with the BoB, Pinarello has tried, and succeeded to create what so many others have tried before... An all black frame that really looks good! Not just like a carbon frame that a weight weenie pulled off the decals to save 4,7 grams.
> 
> I could go on forever with the analysis, but I really do look forward to hearing your opinion, and if in any way possible, seeing more pictures.
> 
> If you have the chance to take pictures from other angles than drive side profile, it would be much appreciated. Whatever angle that you feel compliments the bike's design in the best possible way.
> 
> I can still change my order... so I really would appreciate your input. Basically, whatever you get, I am prone to get...


Are you for real??? You cant be serious??? The Bob is a plain Black bike. Boring, bogan and ugly with no beauty. Yuk, yuk, yuk. No bling factor at all. What next? Shimano aaarrrgggghhh!


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## Sacke

T-Dog said:


> Are you for real??? You cant be serious??? The Bob is a plain Black bike. Boring, bogan and ugly with no beauty. Yuk, yuk, yuk. No bling factor at all. What next? Shimano aaarrrgggghhh!


Dear T-Dog, 

We all know that you prefer team replica bikes... You preferred the 08' Team Ltd edition until Caisse d'Epargne started to use the red one, and it started "growing on you". 

We also know that you are a conventional kind of guy that got a bit disturbed when rhauft put a black saddle and red bar-tape on his Prince. 

I would never expect you to like the black Prince, since it is not likely to be the team replica, and so far has been mostly displayed with a black saddle and black bar-tape. 

However, it is always nice to have a bit of a discussion about taste and your opinion is always welcome.


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## T-Dog

Sacke said:


> Dear T-Dog,
> 
> We all know that you prefer team replica bikes... You preferred the 08' Team Ltd edition until Caisse d'Epargne started to use the red one, and it started "growing on you".
> 
> We also know that you are a conventional kind of guy that got a bit disturbed when rhauft put a black saddle and red bar-tape on his Prince.
> 
> I would never expect you to like the black Prince, since it is not likely to be the team replica, and so far has been mostly displayed with a black saddle and black bar-tape.
> 
> However, it is always nice to have a bit of a discussion about taste and your opinion is always welcome.



Well researched and very true. I am quite impressed.

At the end of the day I love bikes that are colourful or just stand out. I'm all show and no go. I started with the black and yellow Once Giant, then went to the Pinarello Team Telekom (all time favorite) now the current Pinarello Team and Spain bikes

I just cant get my head around a plain black bike.


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## Fuhgetaboudit

*Pinarello Black-on-Black*

While I have the '08 Team Caisse d'epargne color, I find the "BoB" strangely attractive. What I would love to see is a few more photo's of this frame in the sunlight as I feel that will set off the carbon much more. Any chance??

Pinarello frames are like lovely lady's..... they all look exceptionally good, it just depends upon which one you would like to go home with. nuff said.


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## Sacke

This is the first non-driveside picture that I have found so far... I think it looks more and more promising, the more pictures are showing up. 

It almost looks like a pencil colored shimmering dark grey on matte black. Very nice.


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## Arnoud

I was at the annual bieshow in the Netherlands last weekend: BikeMotion and even though I first was more attracked to afresh looking bike like the Prince of Spain, I preferred the BOB after all. I'll try to post some pictures I made.


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## Arnoud

http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Mijn_albums/Paginas/BikeMotion.html

http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Laatste_import.html

The easy way! Scroll through the pictures and you will see various Pina's!


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## Thom_y

Arnoud said:


> http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Mijn_albums/Paginas/BikeMotion.html
> 
> http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Laatste_import.html
> 
> The easy way! Scroll through the pictures and you will see various Pina's!


what did the acid green look like up close in person ??? I am trying to decide on the green vs. blue vs. white... although BoB looks sweet.


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## Arnoud

I liked the Green one. A bit Kermit the Frog, but I prferred it above the White. Acid green is i person more bright than on the homepage. Blue looked great as well.


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## the Inbred

the BoB is one of the best looking frames I've seen. it's stealth...B2-ish. there is no gray...it is black on black.



















i'll be building a 2nd one for a customer next week (his 2nd warranty Prince. Fun.)


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## Arnoud

I have a BOB at home as well. Will be building it with Campa Super Record. Thinking about what to take as stem and bars. May be 3T (to keep it Italian) but I do like the shape of Syntace bars (which I am using on other biks).


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## Corsaire

I've seen the BOB Pinarello Prince, and yes it's beautiful, I guess if James Bond would shoot a scene on a bike, that would be the black on black Prince.  

But having said that it's a BORING black, they could've done a better job. I would rather have the colorful one, but definitely not the spaniard version, too loud.

Corsaire


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## MERAKMAN

the Inbred said:


> the BoB is one of the best looking frames I've seen. it's stealth...B2-ish. there is no gray...it is black on black.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i'll be building a 2nd one for a customer next week (his 2nd warranty Prince. Fun.)


Hi Great pics, what does it say on the Made in ##### sticker on the seat tube? I can't quite make it out..thanks


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## hoehnt

man....such a beautiful bike, but black?


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## Hagakure

That black prince is tits!


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## ultimobici

MERAKMAN said:


> Hi Great pics, what does it say on the Made in ##### sticker on the seat tube? I can't quite make it out..thanks


Taiwan!


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## MERAKMAN

ultimobici said:


> Taiwan!



Woo Hoo! Bullseye! I respect that Pinarello are now admitting thats where their frames are made. RESPECT! I hope other, so called Italian frame makers, will follow suit too, its only fair on the customer that they do..


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## Sacke

*2009 Pinarello Prince "fire"*

Well, 

The Pinarello finally arrived. The d*** Cyril made it to the store before me and snatched the frame. Otherwise I would have bought it. Well, I am quite well equipped since I had the chance to buy his "old" Colnago EPS.


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## edwardthelocal

Nice to see someone has a 'complete' bike to ride  im still waiting for my black prince frame to arrive sine the 8th of oct lol. I notice some Bora ultra twos in the pics, how do they ride? I have the same with Dugast Paris R silks, one glued and one taped (had a nightmare with the glue!!!). The two bikes Colnago and Prince look the dogs b*******.


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## Sacke

edwardthelocal said:


> Nice to see someone has a 'complete' bike to ride  im still waiting for my black prince frame to arrive sine the 8th of oct lol. I notice some Bora ultra twos in the pics, how do they ride? I have the same with Dugast Paris R silks, one glued and one taped (had a nightmare with the glue!!!). The two bikes Colnago and Prince look the dogs b*******.


The Prince was ordered in the beginning of September, and we live just 500 miles from the Pinarello factory... Be prepared to wait a little bit more. 

I have been satisfied with the Bora twos. I tried some Zipp 303's with 21mm tubulars, but I felt a bit unsafe on them.

The Boras with 22mm Conti Competition tubulars feels as safe as 23mm clinchers, only quicker.  

If you haven't used the wheels yet, you will probably think that the wheels are noisy during the first ride(s). 
After the first long ride, take off the protective caps on the side of the wheels, tighten the axle 3/4 of a turn, put the cap back on and go out and ride. You will notice that the noise has disappeared. If it reoccurs, just slightly tighten the axle again. 

The noisyness is due to the ceramic bearrings settling in the cups. Completely normal, and it has happened to everyone I know that bought the Bora Ultra twos.


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## MERAKMAN

Hi Sacke

Congratulations on your new bike! How does the Prince compared to the EPS? Both very similiarly priced frames, so wondered if you were you choose just one to have forever, which would it be?:idea:


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## Sacke

MERAKMAN said:


> Hi Sacke
> 
> Congratulations on your new bike! How does the Prince compared to the EPS? Both very similiarly priced frames, so wondered if you were you choose just one to have forever, which would it be?:idea:


Hi Merakman,

Thanks.  I have only had one single chance to ride the Colnago, and based on the initial experience, the Colnago is not as agressive. It can be ridden with a sense of worthyness, while the Prince is asking for constant whipping.

If I had to choose only one, I think I would take the Colnago. Knowing that I am very unlikely to have the same bike for more than 6 months, I would go for the Pinarello. 

Actually, I don't even know. The Colnago is in many ways better looking in reality than the Pinarello, while the Pinarello definitely is more attention drawing by design. 

I think the answer to your question would be Colnago.


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## MERAKMAN

Sacke said:


> Hi Merakman,
> 
> Thanks.  I have only had one single chance to ride the Colnago, and based on the initial experience, the Colnago is not as agressive. It can be ridden with a sense of worthyness, while the Prince is asking for constant whipping.
> 
> If I had to choose only one, I think I would take the Colnago. Knowing that I am very unlikely to have the same bike for more than 6 months, I would go for the Pinarello.
> 
> Actually, I don't even know. The Colnago is in many ways better looking in reality than the Pinarello, while the Pinarello definitely is more attention drawing by design.
> 
> I think the answer to your question would be Colnago.


Hi Sacke

Thank you for you reply. When you say the Colnago can be ridden with a sense of worthiness, how do you mean? 

So it sounds from what your saying that the Prince wants to go, go, go all the time and feels fast, real fast? 

Out of the two, which is the most exciting to ride? Which do you get butterflys in the stomach over more before riding; the sense of longing to go out and ride for the hell of it?


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## Sacke

MERAKMAN said:


> Hi Sacke
> 
> Thank you for you reply. When you say the Colnago can be ridden with a sense of worthiness, how do you mean?
> 
> So it sounds from what your saying that the Prince wants to go, go, go all the time and feels fast, real fast?
> 
> Out of the two, which is the most exciting to ride? Which do you get butterflys in the stomach over more before riding; the sense of longing to go out and ride for the hell of it?


Hi, 

What I mean by saying that the Colnago can be ridden with a sense of worthiness, is basically to say that it is ok to ride the Colnago slower, and still both look and feel good about it. 

The Pinarello does want to go fast, all the time. When you are on the bike, it feels like a waste of time to do anythine else except pedalling your ass off. 

Regarding butterflys and longing to get out, the Pinarello might be just a notch more desirable. I don't know why, but when I had my Pinarello Prince '08, at a couple of occasions, I got out of bed in the middle of the night, went into the office where the bike was standing, looked at it for a while and went back to bed. 

The Colnago doesn't evoke that kind of irrational behaviour. It is a wonderfully safe and capable bike that won't slow down any rider, but it is more of a sensible choice. You know it will never punish you, and it will never let you down. I would almost expect the Pinarello to dump me if a better rider came along... it wants to be the best in a completely different way. 

I like the fact that Alejandro Valverde rides a Pinarello. I don't know if it is true, but I heard that he won all of the first 40 amateur races that he participated in. A total "in your face" statement from a cyclist. Who can say they won the 40!!! first competitions they participated in? 

The Colnago is like Erik Zabel. A loyal hard worker that is top 5 race after race, good results on a regular basis. A good rider, but a courteous one. Not arrogant or in any other way different from the mass either. His name is always up there, but he never makes a fuzz about it. That is what the Colnago is like.


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## Arnoud

http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Mijn_albums/Paginas/Princelijk.html

My BOB stands under the Christmas tree!


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## Sacke

Arnoud said:


> http://web.me.com/arnoud3ss/Fietspagina/Mijn_albums/Paginas/Princelijk.html
> 
> My BOB stands under the Christmas tree!


I can only imagine how Merry your Christmas is!!!


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## MERAKMAN

Sacke said:


> Hi,
> 
> What I mean by saying that the Colnago can be ridden with a sense of worthiness, is basically to say that it is ok to ride the Colnago slower, and still both look and feel good about it.
> 
> The Pinarello does want to go fast, all the time. When you are on the bike, it feels like a waste of time to do anythine else except pedalling your ass off.
> 
> Regarding butterflys and longing to get out, the Pinarello might be just a notch more desirable. I don't know why, but when I had my Pinarello Prince '08, at a couple of occasions, I got out of bed in the middle of the night, went into the office where the bike was standing, looked at it for a while and went back to bed.
> 
> The Colnago doesn't evoke that kind of irrational behaviour. It is a wonderfully safe and capable bike that won't slow down any rider, but it is more of a sensible choice. You know it will never punish you, and it will never let you down. I would almost expect the Pinarello to dump me if a better rider came along... it wants to be the best in a completely different way.
> 
> I like the fact that Alejandro Valverde rides a Pinarello. I don't know if it is true, but I heard that he won all of the first 40 amateur races that he participated in. A total "in your face" statement from a cyclist. Who can say they won the 40!!! first competitions they participated in?
> 
> The Colnago is like Erik Zabel. A loyal hard worker that is top 5 race after race, good results on a regular basis. A good rider, but a courteous one. Not arrogant or in any other way different from the mass either. His name is always up there, but he never makes a fuzz about it. That is what the Colnago is like.



Thanks, I love your analogys also. 

Two very different frames then? Though what bike would you take for your regular weekend blast, over your favorite route, on a Spring/Summers day for 2-3 hours?

Also (and very important for me) which frame between the two, descents the steepest (bumpiest) hills the best, in the most confident way and feels the most secure? 

BTW the best descenting bike I ever rode till now was a Giant TCR Advanced 07 model. Could have light a cigarette going down hill if I smoked, it was that secure feeling...Want something to equal or better that


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## Sacke

MERAKMAN said:


> Thanks, I love your analogys also.
> 
> Two very different frames then? Though what bike would you take for your regular weekend blast, over your favorite route, on a Spring/Summers day for 2-3 hours?
> 
> Also (and very important for me) which frame between the two, descents the steepest (bumpiest) hills the best, in the most confident way and feels the most secure?
> 
> BTW the best descenting bike I ever rode till now was a Giant TCR Advanced 07 model. Could have light a cigarette going down hill if I smoked, it was that secure feeling...Want something to equal or better that


I will have to get back to you concerning that later. Both bikes are marvellous descenders and are able to take just about anything thrown at them. 

On Friday I am going out for a ride with Cyril again, this getting a good chance to compare a bit more. The Prince is one of the steadiest bikes on the market. The Colnago C50 was before the Prince my reference of a steady descender... The EPS is stiffer and racier than the C50 so the comparison is likely to be a draw. 

I will get back to the issue later.


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## MERAKMAN

Sacke said:


> I will have to get back to you concerning that later. Both bikes are marvellous descenders and are able to take just about anything thrown at them.
> 
> On Friday I am going out for a ride with Cyril again, this getting a good chance to compare a bit more. The Prince is one of the steadiest bikes on the market. The Colnago C50 was before the Prince my reference of a steady descender... The EPS is stiffer and racier than the C50 so the comparison is likely to be a draw.
> 
> I will get back to the issue later.



Thanks again, you've wet my appetite for both frames and seeing Arnoud's Prince Bob under the tree like that...Wow!

I look forward to your riding impressions after your ride on Friday. Have a safe ride.

I wish you all a very Merry Christmas


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## jpaine

Here are my pics...just got this for Xmas and taking it for the first ride in 1.5 hours. The black one was my second choice...very nice looking too.


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## Sacke

MERAKMAN said:


> Thanks again, you've wet my appetite for both frames and seeing Arnoud's Prince Bob under the tree like that...Wow!
> 
> I look forward to your riding impressions after your ride on Friday. Have a safe ride.
> 
> I wish you all a very Merry Christmas


I am smiling, or rather smirking, as I am writing this post. 

I haven't quite internalized the fact yet, and I am indeed still expecting unexpected turns in the story.

The owner of the Pinarello called me a few hours ago, and apparently his appetite for changing bikes wasn't satisfied when he switched to the Pinarello 8 days ago. Now he wants to switch back to the Colnago. 

I think he rode 4 times with the Pinarello. I have only been out once!!! with the Colnago. I installed the 11-speed cranks on the 23rd, and haven't had the time to try them out yet.

Tomorrow... tomorrow we are switching frames. I will indeed become a proud owner of a 2009 Pinarello Prince, and I am over the moon about it! 

The Colnago EPS has been growing on me during the last few days, and the fact that it is so desirable to Cyril is making me almost confused. Should I have accepted his proposal or not? 

Well, I better not get too caught up by the same "lust for envy" and realize that just having the opportunity to own the Pinarello Prince is a tremendous priviledge. 

I will post fresh pictures when my parts have found their way over to the Prince frame.


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## Sacke

jpaine said:


> Here are my pics...just got this for Xmas and taking it for the first ride in 1.5 hours. The black one was my second choice...very nice looking too.


That is beautiful. My wife is more concerned with the "balance" of spendings, as she feels she should be entitled to spend as much on clothes and beauty products, as I am spending on bikes. However, if that was the case we would be ruined...


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## Guest

Sacke said:


> My wife is more concerned with the "balance" of spendings, as she feels she should be entitled to spend as much on clothes and beauty products, as I am spending on bikes.


That's just crazy talk there, good luck.:thumbsup:


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## MERAKMAN

Sacke said:


> I am smiling, or rather smirking, as I am writing this post.
> 
> I haven't quite internalized the fact yet, and I am indeed still expecting unexpected turns in the story.
> 
> The owner of the Pinarello called me a few hours ago, and apparently his appetite for changing bikes wasn't satisfied when he switched to the Pinarello 8 days ago. Now he wants to switch back to the Colnago.
> 
> I think he rode 4 times with the Pinarello. I have only been out once!!! with the Colnago. I installed the 11-speed cranks on the 23rd, and haven't had the time to try them out yet.
> 
> Tomorrow... tomorrow we are switching frames. I will indeed become a proud owner of a 2009 Pinarello Prince, and I am over the moon about it!
> 
> The Colnago EPS has been growing on me during the last few days, and the fact that it is so desirable to Cyril is making me almost confused. Should I have accepted his proposal or not?
> 
> Well, I better not get too caught up by the same "lust for envy" and realize that just having the opportunity to own the Pinarello Prince is a tremendous priviledge.
> 
> I will post fresh pictures when my parts have found their way over to the Prince frame.



Well have a great ride and please let me know which bike you prefer. I love the looks of the EPS and the traditional lugs build of the frame; but I also love the look of the futuristic Prince too. Its like choosing between a Ferrari or Lamborghini! Both utterly desirable and superb machines. Take care and good luck with your choices.


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## Sacke

*2009 Pinarello Prince, 53cm, color "Fire"*

I am very happy about having swapped the EPS for the Prince. Like going from speeding in Lexus on a highway to driving a fullbread Formula 1 car. Maybe not the most comfortable ride, especially with 8 bars in the tubulars, but fast!


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## Sacke

*PS. Where is rhauft? *


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## tjjm36m3

Those Campagnolo Boras look much better on a red Prince than the Lightweights does. Good decision on the swap, I too would rather be riding the prince.


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## gfoley

I know that black is tough to take photos of -- the light just glares something aweful. Hey, I like the frame, it's beefy-looking and tight! I too have a black frame Pin, and you can check out my video on YOUTUBE at the folling link: http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=lrfEnDrUmDw

It is the Dogma FPX 2008 Black/White scheme. Mind you, you'll have to pardon the part-blurry footage of the slide presentation, for youtube just beat it to hell and back, but at least you can see the Dog. Take care, and enjoy the prince -- we're both damned lucky to own these machines, for I am thankful every time I ride it....


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## Sacke

New pictures


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## rhauft

*hey!*



Sacke said:


> *PS. Where is rhauft? *


I'm drooling all over my keyboard while I admire your smoking hot new Prince!
Sadly, I'm still waiting for my 09 Prince to arrive... Maybe January they say... 
In the mean time I'm forced to settle for my 08 Ltd team issue... 
Enjoy that gorgeous ride Sacke and a happy new year to all.
Where were those pics taken?


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## MERAKMAN

rhauft said:


> I'm drooling all over my keyboard while I admire your smoking hot new Prince!
> Sadly, I'm still waiting for my 09 Prince to arrive... Maybe January they say...
> In the mean time I'm forced to settle for my 08 Ltd team issue...
> Enjoy that gorgeous ride Sacke and a happy new year to all.
> Where were those pics taken?



Hi Is there any difference between the '08 Prince frame and the '09 Prince?


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## rhauft

MERAKMAN said:


> Hi Is there any difference between the '08 Prince frame and the '09 Prince?


The 09 has a removable rear derailleur hanger and so it is presumably slightly heavier than the 08.
Updated colors & graphics.
Price hike: (frame & fork) 08 MSRP $5K, 09 MSRP $5.5K :blush2:


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## Sacke

rhauft said:


> The 09 has a removable rear derailleur hanger and so it is presumably slightly heavier than the 08.
> Updated colors & graphics.
> Price hike: (frame & fork) 08 MSRP $5K, 09 MSRP $5.5K :blush2:


Rhauft! Long time, no activity here on the forum?... Did you get your Prince?


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## Sacke

rhauft said:


> I'm drooling all over my keyboard while I admire your smoking hot new Prince!
> Sadly, I'm still waiting for my 09 Prince to arrive... Maybe January they say...
> In the mean time I'm forced to settle for my 08 Ltd team issue...
> Enjoy that gorgeous ride Sacke and a happy new year to all.
> Where were those pics taken?


I completely missed this response earlier... 

The pictures, outdoor ones, are taken by the "Arena" (Les Arenes) in Nimes, France. The indoor pictures, surprise surprise, are taken in our flat in Nimes, France.  

You are up for a treat rhauft! The colors on the 2009 are really radiant compared to the 08. It is impossible to catch in a picture, but the bike really shines among other bikes on group rides. The only other 2009 bike that jumps in your eyes in the same way is the Time RXR Ulteam. My LBS has delivered three of them so far, and 2 others are expecting deliveries in February. I suppose I will get to be the only one with a '09 Prince for a while. 

I am still fine tuning my riding position, but I had almost forgotten the joy of the Prince. Hills that I used to climb at 22-23km/h with i.e. the Extreme C are going at 25-26km/h with the Prince. My physical condition hasn't improved that much, so it must be the Prince + Bora combination.


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## proy

Happy early birthday to me


----------



## Sacke

proy said:


> Happy early birthday to me


Beautiful bike! 

I really appreciate the fact that in the forums, here & weightweenies, a lot of different color combinations have started to pop up. 

Last year it was 99% Caisse D'Epargne team color, and thats it... This year, the variety of different colors chosen by riders is much larger. 

It warms my heart.  

Could you take some outdoor pictures of the bike? The colors always look a little bit different in natural light.


----------



## Thom_y

Sacke said:


> I really appreciate the fact that in the forums, here & weightweenies, a lot of different color combinations have started to pop up.
> 
> Last year it was 99% Caisse D'Epargne team color, and thats it... This year, the variety of different colors chosen by riders is much larger.


Not my Christmas gift, but a beautiful change to the usual white/black/red or red, P.O.S. or BOB:

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/oNfD9r0_exBvtgzm_eYT7Q?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh6.ggpht.com/_SVlWLhF4dVg/SWin2_HCouI/AAAAAAAAAy4/cht-MOUxOFE/s800/not_my_gift.jpg" /></a>


----------



## proy

A few more pics...


----------



## Sacke

Fantastic! 

The color-scheme is enormously underestimated. It looks absolutely faboulous!


----------



## proy

Sacke said:


> Fantastic!
> 
> The color-scheme is enormously underestimated. It looks absolutely faboulous!



Thanks. The royal blue really does vary a lot depending on the nature and intensity of ambient light. The one consistent thing is that it always looks good. 

And yes, I do keep staring at it at home.

BTW, your color scheme is not too shabby either.:thumbsup:


----------



## MERAKMAN

proy said:


> Thanks. The royal blue really does vary a lot depending on the nature and intensity of ambient light. The one consistent thing is that it always looks good.
> 
> And yes, I do keep staring at it at home.
> 
> BTW, your color scheme is not too shabby either.:thumbsup:



Love that colour scheme, is that the Golden Gate bridge in the back ground? Bike looks as impressive as the bridge...


----------



## proy

MERAKMAN said:


> Love that colour scheme, is that the Golden Gate bridge in the back ground? Bike looks as impressive as the bridge...


Yes. Golden Gate bridge in the background. It was nearly 70 degrees over the weekend. Pretty good winter weather for breaking her in.


----------



## tjjm36m3

Hey Sacke, what is that metal clamp right above the BB? Doesn't look like the front derailleur clamp, maybe some kind of dog fang to prevent the chain from dropping into the BB? I couldn't seem to find one that would fit on the prince.


----------



## Sacke

tjjm36m3 said:


> Hey Sacke, what is that metal clamp right above the BB? Doesn't look like the front derailleur clamp, maybe some kind of dog fang to prevent the chain from dropping into the BB? I couldn't seem to find one that would fit on the prince.


Hi, 

It is actually just the derailleur clamp... temporary installment until a proper clamp arrives. 

I think it was taken from a Passoni-frame, or an old Wilier. In any case, heavy & ugly!


----------



## jwisan

JPAINE and SACKE. BORA on the prince looks really nice. Just wondering, are you guys using the bike strictly for racing, club rides, or training. I myself wanted to get one of those beautiful wheel but very hesitant because of the durability. Can you guys give me some advice on the durability?


----------



## edwardthelocal

*Just arrived !!! *

At last, my Prince Stealth arrived. As you can see its without its Super Record bits.

Threw on the wheels just to get an idea..............


----------



## jwisan

Edwardthe local, Why everyone putting bora on their prince? Is it strong enough to withstand club ride-once a week kind of thing, sometimes uneven road surface w podholes?


----------



## edwardthelocal

Hi jwisan, there is a pdf file i came across that scientifically tests a number of wheels (all the usual weight weenie ones with special spokes and extra stuff in with the carbon mix- sure you know which ones i mean) they were subjected to loads of tests, and although bora twos are not the lightest at approx 1300g the side forces needed to bend them towards each fork blade were much greater than others, so not much flex in the boras, bomb-proof i have heard mentioned. If you want super light things get buy the obvious, but if you want something i hope will be a bit more forgiving on rought roads, then boras for me. Anyone else like to add or put me right on this please do  

If i come upon the test again i will post the link


----------



## jwisan

I want something durable! I heard carbon aero is not that strong. So I'm thinking of getting the shamal for the durability. Also those carbon wheel will be affected when there is cross wind? Advice please!


----------



## edwardthelocal

Came across this

http://www.trigearreview.com/forms/Article.aspx?REVID=519

i havent ridden my boras on anything yet so i cant say how they are. Some people will swear by Lews, Lightweights, zipps etc etc, all are excellent wheels judging by the reviews and forums, depends what you want to use them for and the kind of rider you are i suppose. I got my ultra twos for a great price, half the cost of some lightweight obermeyer 3's so i am happy happy. I'm no 'contador' so im sure they will be better wheels than i am a rider.

Ask a few of the guys above how their wheels are, one classy looking red prince has boras on it. All the people on here are cool, and i'm sure will answer any questions you may have.


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## edwardthelocal

If you can put on your professor head here is a good read, remember the bit about how heavy the rider is, i am 80kg so need stiff wheels (no schmolke TLO handlebars for me as i think they have a 70kg limit)

http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-15441821.html


Anyone know of some good light bars? ? ? ?

http://translate.google.co.uk/trans...refox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&hs=mk0 

i have the send rate carbon lite ones although they only weigh 197g

i have no idea what they are like, thus may change them for something else..........


----------



## Sacke

jwisan said:


> I want something durable! I heard carbon aero is not that strong. So I'm thinking of getting the shamal for the durability. Also those carbon wheel will be affected when there is cross wind? Advice please!


Before getting the Bora Ultra two:s, I tried some other carbon wheels as well. The closest equivalent to Bora was a pair of Zipp 303:s. 
The Zipp-experience was followed by a desire to go back to low profile aluminum clinchers. Most likely because of 21mm tubulars that didn't provide the same "safe" feeling as the 23mm clinchers. 
The Boras are a different story. I have the Continental Competition 22mm tubulars on them, and the "safe" feeling in corners and fast speeds is never lacking. 

When it comes to durability, I have seen a couple of examples of LEW wheels breaking, and Zipp just isn't as sexy as Bora. 

Cross winds haven't bothered me much. Of course you feel the wind, but it doesn't bother much. The wheels might not be the lightest, but the "bulletproofness" of the wheels is uncontestable. I have hit a few pot holes and rough speed bumps, but it doesn't seem like I have anything to worry about. 

I use the wheels as my only pair of wheels on the Prince, and when it rains or the roads are wet, I use a different bike with a pair of cheap alu clinchers. I don't doubt the durability of the Bora, but I just don't want to get my braking surface scratched by sand + moisture. 

Weightweenies might never use Boras, but they are IMHO excellent for daily use. Besides, why spend so much on wheels that only get used for selected races? 
If you really worry about cross winds and weight, get the Hyperons which no doubt are marvelous wheels as well.


----------



## T-Dog

I'm 96KG and was riding on my Bora's 6 days a week. I have crashed on them, ridden in to gutters on them and smashed them into potholes and they have not broken or gone out of alignment one bit. These wheels are seriously awesome. 
As for good bars I use the MOst one piece bars and absolutley love them.


----------



## rhauft

*edwardthelocal:*

Bella Bicicletta! Love the nero, can't wait to see pix of it complete.
I have an 09 red (fire) Prince on order but I almost caved and opted for the stealth myself as I was getting impatient that the red was taking forever to arrive. I just got the call I've been waiting six months for and the red is in the mail!

*Bora durability:*
I've had my Bora's for 1.5 years. They are not my every day wheels. I've used them for road races and crits and they are one of the smoothest riding wheels I've ever owned. They are beautifully engineered and flawlessly finished. As I said, they are not my every day wheels, not that they couldn't be used every day. I reserve mine for special occasions. I use my Reynolds DT46 clinchers for most training rides and a pair of 'bomb proof' open pros (32h, 3X) for nasty weather. HTH


----------



## edwardthelocal

I ordered mine straight from the shop in Treviso beginning of Oct, it took 15 weeks but was well worth the wait! Just waiting for some alloy bowties for my speedplays, schmolke bar ends and ahead cap, and aliens 2 skewers ( all of which should save approx 145g off the weight) not forgetting the carbon fibre water bottle cage bolts ha ha, then I might be able to do my Carlos Sastre impression down the road. The weather in the uk is Naf here at the minute so here's hoping for some sunshine.


----------



## speedsterveloce

One of the nicest stealth schemes i've seen.


----------



## T-Dog

edwardthelocal said:


> I ordered mine straight from the shop in Treviso beginning of Oct, it took 15 weeks but was well worth the wait! Just waiting for some alloy bowties for my speedplays, schmolke bar ends and ahead cap, and aliens 2 skewers ( all of which should save approx 145g off the weight) not forgetting the carbon fibre water bottle cage bolts ha ha, then I might be able to do my Carlos Sastre impression down the road. The weather in the uk is Naf here at the minute so here's hoping for some sunshine.


You should be in Melbourne this week its going to be 41 degrees (105 in the old Measurement) for the next 5 days straight!


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## nicensleazy

I just don't know which bike to go for out of the Colnago EPS or Pinarello Paris. I have had long test rides on both and I just love both of them. What do you think guys??


----------



## edwardthelocal

*Just about there*

Just had my black prince biult, went for a short ride to check the stem height seat etc etc.

heres a few pics..............


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## nicensleazy

Looks lovely!


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## proy

Very nice.

Are they the Most Talon handlebars? If so, why have you taped so far in?


----------



## edwardthelocal

the bars are Jazz Cycletech light 195g from belgium. Bought from my clubs shop. The mechanic taped em up during the build, but they are quite comfy on the top grips.

As you can see the fork tube needs slicing!

http://www.jazz-cycletech.be/


www.interbike.co.uk


----------



## simplyhankk

nice...that's such a nice bike. looks like it's made of $$$$ signs  jk but congrats!


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## crewman

*08 Fondo Prince*

I was lucky enough to get an invite for the Gran Fondo Pinarello in Italy and have the use of a Prince. So, I have a chance to purchase this bike and use it for this years race season. The unfortunate thing about the bike was the SRAM gearing. It seems all the fondo bikes (350 of them) were suppose to have Campy 11 speed, but Campy bailed out at the last minute because they were having manufacturing difficulties. So, Fausto had to scramble and get alternative gearing.
All the bikes that were issued to North Americans got SRAM Red and rest got either Durace 7800 or Campy 10 speed. Now I am a die hard Campy fan and well found the SRAM not to bad after I got used to it. I had no problems with it through the whole 200KM race. 
One problem has arised are the wheels. They are Mavic R SyS system. As you can tell my front wheel is missing and has been sent in for recall. So, I think I will run the Fulcrum's for the season for now.

So, one question I have is does anybody really race there Prince?.


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## nicensleazy

Yeah, my friend does and I thashed him on my Paris!


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## rhauft

nicensleazy said:


> Yeah, my friend does and I thashed him on my Paris!


Dude enough with the Prince bashing. Tell you what, bring your Paris and your nuclear powered Colnago to Cali. You pick the road. :ihih:


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## simplyhankk

rhauft said:


> Dude enough with the Prince bashing. Tell you what, bring your Paris and your nuclear powered Colnago to Cali. You pick the road. :ihih:



hahhahaha! nice one. how about this one: 









which is the ToC riders going to experience today..


----------



## rhauft

simplyhankk said:


> hahhahaha! nice one. how about this one:
> which is the ToC riders going to experience today..


Gonna be a killer stage today. No doubt we got some hills here in Cali. But it aint about the bike. 
I leave my driveway and I'm on a 17% hill. It's just pure weightlifting.


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## nicensleazy

rhauft said:


> Dude enough with the Prince bashing. Tell you what, bring your Paris and your nuclear powered Colnago to Cali. You pick the road. :ihih:



Wow......go and have a lye down in a dark room. Prince bashing, you are sadly mistaken! The Prince is indeed a lovely frame. But my friend, at the end of the day, it doesn't all depend on a frame, it depends on the beans in your legs! Now, if you want to wind your neck in, fine. Otherwise, come over to the UK with your Prince and I'll whip your arse with my Paris! In fact, I'll take you on with an old Pinarello steel frame! Now...........go and get a life muppet!


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## the genie

I did Palomar yesterday a day before the TOC, on the Prince. Yes, ultimately is the rider and not the bike, but men, it is great to do it on the Prince. 

sleazy...
I've been so curious about your Paris, almost jealous! Would you post some pictures for all of us to enjoy?
Please?


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## rhauft

nicensleazy said:


> Wow......go and have a lye down in a dark room. Prince bashing, you are sadly mistaken! The Prince is indeed a lovely frame. But my friend, at the end of the day, it doesn't all depend on a frame, it depends on the beans in your legs! Now, if you want to wind your neck in, fine. Otherwise, come over to the UK with your Prince and I'll whip your arse with my Paris! In fact, I'll take you on with an old Pinarello steel frame! Now...........go and get a life muppet!


All hat no cattle. Talk is cheap and you are a bore. Take your Cat 5 smack over to the Colnago thread, POSUER :ciappa:


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## edwardthelocal

eh up like! What happened to the friendly pinarello owners club?

Im off to the peak district soon, where my pin will no doubt kick me off going up winnatts pass and speed off without me lol


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## nicensleazy

rhauft said:


> All hat no cattle. Talk is cheap and you are a bore. Take your Cat 5 smack over to the Colnago thread, POSUER :ciappa:



To coin your term, Dude you really are talking out of your arse. I might be many things, but I'm most certainly not a Posuer, I'll leave that to the like of you! I guess you are one of these blokes that just rides around on his Prince saying, look at me as you pop down to your local shops! You mention Prince bashing. I have never said anything bad about the frame, it is a lovely frame. In fact I have owned Pinarello's for many years. Now, stop polishing your bike and your ego and go and get some miles in!


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## rhauft

*Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn*

Well at least you're not still crowing about how much faster your bike is than all your buddies. 
When you start threads stating how "over the moon" you are about your Paris... How much faster it is than your buddies Prince etc... 
Then your next post is: *Pinarello Paris for sale*  
Further investigation shows that you're now "over the moon" for your new Colnago and how much "speeeeeeeeeed" it has compared to blah blah blah... 
That kind of BS is going to get you in trouble around here. You sound like a neophite troll. 
News Flash sleazy: This is the Pinarello section. Post pix of your Paris here. Post your sales in the classified forum.
We're really excited to here how much faster your next Willier is than everything else preceeding it...


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## nicensleazy

Mate................you are just full of hot air. Yeah, there speaks a guy who PM's me wanting to buy my Paris! I see tons of guys like you at the various cycle tea stops. Full of blah on their top of the range bikes, but no beans!


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## rhauft

Absolutely I want your Paris! It would make a very nice rain bike.


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## nicensleazy

Anyone reading your comments could only come to one decision - COCK!

You seem to want to take over this thread with bullshit, so be my guest! I'll leave you to it.


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## rhauft

Wattle on back over to the Colnago section Mr beans... they miss you


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## the genie

wait! wait! Don't go yet! Where are the pictures of the Paris?!!
...pretty please?


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## simplyhankk

haha i wanna see some prince pics too cmon dudes


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## iridepinarello

Here are a few of mine, and my son's...


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## rhauft

crewman said:


> So, one question I have is does anybody really race there Prince?.


Lucky you! To answer your Q. Yes, people do. At least I do here in Northern California. Masters Cat 2 on a 09 Pinarello Prince / Sram Red.


----------



## Battlestar Galactica

proy said:


> Happy early birthday to me


nice color. what size is it? and what are your measurements?


----------



## Fuhgetaboudit

*Congrats to you!*

PROY,

CONGRATS on a Beautiful Prince! I love seeing all the various color schemes and each is unique in its compliment to the beauty of a Pinarello Prince! This one's definitely a keeper!

all the best!!


----------



## adodsk

*Bob*

some quick (poor quality) shots - need to get the steerer cut....... and some more miles ridden!


----------



## DEADRE

*PRINCE Bob Color Way Is The Only Way*

View attachment 169719


T-Dog said:


> Are you for real??? You cant be serious??? The Bob is a plain Black bike. Boring, bogan and ugly with no beauty. Yuk, yuk, yuk. No bling factor at all. What next? Shimano aaarrrgggghhh!


2 weeks ago i decided to buy a 2009 prince and the colors that looked striking on pictures were DEVIL, FIRE and BOB. The FIRE really looks good on pic and that was the obvious choice and have seen one up close as well. So to really decide was to see all 3 color ways in person, apparently they did not have the DEVIL color, so i was left with the BOB and FIRE. From a far the FIRE looks great, but then you think to yourself on the long run, color coordination base on parts and paint chips. Then i looked at the BOB real close, there are dull clear coat parts and there are high gloss clear coat parts, then you think about the same thing color coordination base on parts and paint chips, black frame that's easy to coordinate, let's be honest here how many bikes have you seen out there that the parts that they used were all high end but you got a part here and there that the color scheme is just killing the ART? Paint chips just take a sharpe marker and done. But hands down looking at the 2 color scheme up in the wall 1 below the other, the BOB was the obvious choice, i was there for a while hypnotize thinking that in a few weeks I'm going to have one.
This is the frame that i have order last week and the bikeshop took a pic for me just to show me that size, color and quality is all that is agreed upon.


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## nicensleazy

Congrats, a lovely bike.


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## John Martin

Nice Bikes !!!! These are the best colors for the Pinarello. The Bob are not just a Pina signature! Very Nice! BELLA!:thumbsup:


----------



## soupdragon

*buying a pinarello in italy*

hi guys , only my second post ,has anybody brought a pina from the shop in treviso ? am off to that part of italy soon. any help would i would be most grateful .


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## nicensleazy

Yes, if you search you will find a few members who have bought. Also, do a google search


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## rhauft

soupdragon said:


> hi guys , only my second post ,has anybody brought a pina from the shop in treviso ? am off to that part of italy soon. any help would i would be most grateful .


I bought a Prince back in 2001 from the shop, one of Jan Ulrich's back-ups from the Giro that year. A very memorable experience, even got to chat with Nani. Prior to that I also was fitted at the factory for team bikes back in the late 90's, by Fausto - Very cool! I'm planning a trip back to Treviso next spring/summer during the Giro. A can't miss stop over for any fans of the brand.


----------



## rjar99

*My new FP7*

A pic's of my new FP7, I love this bike! The guy in the pic is from Pinarello in Treviso, he set me up on the bike. Buying a bike straight from Pinarello in Treviso turned out to be a great experience. Although late July and early August is more difficult because they are busy with their Gran Fondo and the factory closes for a bit in August. I went hoping to get an FP3 and was overjoyed to get my FP7. But I almost came home empty handed and needed to get to Treviso two days in a row, defenitely worth it!


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## nicensleazy

I can see why you have a big smile on your face!


----------



## John Martin

MERAKMAN said:


> Woo Hoo! Bullseye! I respect that Pinarello are now admitting thats where their frames are made. RESPECT! I hope other, so called Italian frame makers, will follow suit too, its only fair on the customer that they do..


It says, MADE IN ITALY, not Taiwan. But went to Torayca related sites...Carbon Composites are made in Taiwan. These are then shipped to Italy for Assembly and painting.

No Carbon frame is made in the Eirope or US.


----------



## MERAKMAN

John Martin said:


> It says, MADE IN ITALY, not Taiwan. But went to Torayca related sites...Carbon Composites are made in Taiwan. These are then shipped to Italy for Assembly and painting.
> 
> No Carbon frame is made in the Eirope or US.


Yes I should imagine so..apart from Parlees made in USA and Colnago's carbon EPS (although I'm not 100 percent sure Colnagos are ) De Rosa's older model Idol to name another. Maybe some others too.


----------



## nicensleazy

*The making of the Colnago EPS*

http://insider.bikeradar.com/colnago/video/that-famous-colnago-paint-quality-in-detail/


----------



## MERAKMAN

With respect, the video doesn't actually show the construction of the frame, only the final finishing and painting. Though I'd love to believe they are made in Italy and I would love to be a potential purchaser..it would be easy to show a few EPS's being made in Italy and then have the rest of the production made in Taiwan or where ever..What do you think? Thanks for the video, it was interesting.


----------



## MERAKMAN

With respect, the video doesn't actually show the construction of the frame, only the final finishing and painting. Though I'd love to believe they are made in Italy and I would love to be a potential purchaser..it would be easy to show a few EPS's being made in Italy and then have the rest of the production made in Taiwan or where ever..What do you think?


----------



## nicensleazy

If you look down the side, you will see other chapers including making the frame at the Colnago factory. I'm please Colnago launched these videos as it puts to bed the myth about them not being made in Italy! I can't speak for Pinarello


----------



## rhauft

John Martin said:


> No Carbon frame is made in the Eirope or US.


High end Treks are still made in Waterloo Wisconsin, Calfee's are made in Watsonville California, High end Looks still made in France as are Time's... All are lugged c/f.

So, what you should have said is no Monocoque carbon frame is made in Europe or US.


----------



## spas

*Happy B-Day to Me*

I just got my 40th birthday present a few months yearly  

2009 Fire Prince with full Campy Super Record with the Parlee Carbon Front clamp. I love those Talon Bars!!! The bike weighs in at 14.8 pounds with the pedals and water bottles!!!!


----------



## MERAKMAN

rhauft said:


> High end Treks are still made in Waterloo Wisconsin, Calfee's are made in Watsonville California, High end Looks still made in France as are Time's... All are lugged c/f.
> 
> So, what you should have said is no Monocoque carbon frame is made in Europe or US.


What was the last monocoque frame made in Europe/USA? I recall the Cristallo was made by ATR for Colnago in Italy, but production ceased due to high build costs.Trying to think of others...?


----------



## rhauft

MERAKMAN said:


> What was the last monocoque frame made in Europe/USA? I recall the Cristallo was made by ATR for Colnago in Italy, but production ceased due to high build costs.Trying to think of others...?


My source (Gita, US Distributor) claims the Colnago Cristallo to be another fine product from Taiwan. Personally, I wouldn't want my monocoque frame made anywhere else. Taiwan is the epicenter in carbon monocoque engineering, design and inovation. That's why Pinarello et al have partnered with them to design and manufacter the state of the art in monocoque technology.


----------



## MERAKMAN

rhauft said:


> My source (Gita, US Distributor) claims the Colnago Cristallo to be another fine product from Taiwan. Personally, I wouldn't want my monocoque frame made anywhere else. Taiwan is the epicenter in carbon monocoque engineering, design and inovation. That's why Pinarello et al have partnered with them to design and manufacter the state of the art in monocoque technology.


Blimey! What frames are made outside Taiwan/China/Far East?


----------



## nicensleazy

Funny, when I look back at my old Paris frame, whilst it was a great performer, the carbon finish wasn't that great. The weave appered uneven in places. I think its much improved on the Prince.


----------



## rhauft

MERAKMAN said:


> Blimey! What frames are made outside Taiwan/China/Far East?


Hi-end lugged and fillet brazed steel, hi-end titanium, hi-end lugged c/f could still be made in Europe/USA. If it's monocoque c/f, you can pretty much bank on that it was manufactered somewhere in Asia. Italian design + Japanese materials + Chinese labor = world economey


----------



## MERAKMAN

rhauft said:


> Hi-end lugged and fillet brazed steel, hi-end titanium, hi-end lugged c/f could still be made in Europe/USA. If it's monocoque c/f, you can pretty much bank on that it was manufactered somewhere in Asia. Italian design + Japanese materials + Chinese labor = world economey


So do you think the following frames could be made in Italy still?

De Rosa Neo Primato, Corum, Titanio
Pinarello Dogma Magnesium
Colnago EPS, Masterlight


----------



## rhauft

MERAKMAN said:


> So do you think the following frames could be made in Italy still?
> 
> De Rosa Neo Primato, Corum, Titanio
> Pinarello Dogma Magnesium
> Colnago EPS, Masterlight


Best guess:
De Rosa Neo Primato = Italy
Corum = Italy
Titanio = IIRC this frame is made by Lightspeed in USA
Pinarello Dogma Mag = Italy (c/f stays & fork = Taiwan)
Colnago EPS = Italy (c/f tubes laid up in Asia)


----------



## nicensleazy

This subject has been flogged to death on so many forums. Is it or isn't it? I see Colnago made the step of filming the making of the EPS at the Colnago factory in Italy. Do Pinarello have any footage of the Prince being made or is that made in the far east??


----------



## rhauft

nicensleazy said:


> This subject has been flogged to death on so many forums. Is it or isn't it? I see Colnago made the step of filming the making of the EPS at the Colnago factory in Italy. Do Pinarello have any footage of the Prince being made or is that made in the far east??


 Clearly you missed the point of this conversation. No one is in dispute as to where monocoque carbon Pinorellos are manufactered, no one, except maybe you


----------



## merckxman

If I were to purchase a De Rosa the Titanio would be at the top of my list. Made in Italy and made by Doriano De Rosa. The Italian magazine CT had a 28 photo feature of a Titanio frame being made (http://italiancyclingjournal.blogspot.com/2008/01/ct-review-january-2008.html)



MERAKMAN said:


> So do you think the following frames could be made in Italy still?
> 
> De Rosa Neo Primato, Corum, Titanio
> Pinarello Dogma Magnesium
> Colnago EPS, Masterlight


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## gibalon

I see there are no acid prince's out there; At least not that much as other colors. I guess that's the color to go with and make a difference since all are pretty nice though.


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