# Kuota KOM Evo vs. Wilier Cento Uno



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

I know some of you have seen the struggles I've been having deciding upon a new frameset. Just when I thought I had the situation figured out, a new wrench was thrown into the whole situation....

About a month ago I purchased a 2011 Wilier Cento Uno frameset in excellent condition at a very good price. I was very disappointed because the frameset ended up being slightly too large for me (Size L 55.5), and I currently have this frameset listed on eBay. 









So last week I won an auction for a 2012 Kuota KOM Evo frameset, and purchased a new DA7900 group as well. This frameset should be showing up today. 









THEN- Last night I received an email from another eBay seller who also has a Wilier Cento Uno listed, and noticed I mentioned that my frame was too large for me. His frameset is a size M (the size I need) and offered to "Swap" frames- as his brother really wanted his frameset but it was too small. 

At this point they will be costing me the same, but I need to decide which to keep and which to sell!

My riding: I do not race at all, but I ride pretty aggressively for pleasure (Avg around 19-21mph). My average rides are 30-50 miles every weekend, with the occasional group ride or charity/sport event. This is my only bike, so it also serves me to ride around town from time to time- so one of my concerns is the superlight (read: thin) Kuota frame not being very durable.

Any thoughts, input, or opinions are greatly appreciated!


----------



## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

you can never have enough bikes. do the swap and pick up a chorus 11 set. yes, go campy- i converted about 5 years ago and haven't looked back. only down side is that you'll swap out the da 7900 for campy too.  

then, after you have two carbns, you'll want a ti or two and steel or two, as well.


----------



## Tri Slow Poke (Jul 22, 2006)

Can you keep both?


----------



## Johnny Danger (Aug 24, 2012)

I've ridden both the Kuota KoM and the Wilier Cento extensively. The Wilier is by far a more sophisticated and advanced frame than the Kuota .


----------



## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

Yeah you're totally winning if you're in a position to have both.

Of course you can't keep the Wilier guy waiting, but if you at least could have him hold off for until you get a test ride out of the KOM Evo, you'll be exploiting your options to the fullest.

Really hard to judge. If I recall, you said the KOM is coming from someone who professionally maintained the frame and it was just "slightly used". Sounds so easy to just take that, then sell your Wilier because the other seller is a bigger question mark - although I doubt he's come anywhere close to thrashing such a frame.


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

I really wish keeping both was an option! Unfortunately I'm lucky to have one or the other (my girlfriend still can't believe what I'm paying)

The Kuota showed up yesterday and is a beautiful bike. Side by side with my Wilier frameset there are qualities about each that I really like. Ultimately I would love to ride both and decide but I'm not sure there's any way for me to do that. 

Also, I just found out that the Wilier that the guy has is set up for Di2 not mechanical, so I would have to have it modified and it would have external cabling (which isn't the worst considering all the known issues with the Cento cable routing).


----------



## AtomicMoose (Aug 15, 2012)

Its a shame you cannot test ride them both and then decide! :mad2:

I don't have any experience with either of these frames, but I will say that aesthetically, I like the Wilier better. I like the lines, I like the color design.

Stupid stuff aside, does either geo fit your riding style better than the other?


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

The geometry is actually very similar between them (head tube identical, TT within 2mm). The KOM is much lighter and designed for hills, of which I have none in Florida. That said it still supposed to be very still and reasonably comfortable. 

The Di2 setup may kill the Wilier option altogether though as I'm not sure how difficult it is to add cable stops to a carbon frame?


----------



## bruno_h2 (Sep 12, 2012)

Aesthetically, I'll stick with the kuota chassis... I don't like the curved top tube, seat & chain stays like the ones in this wilier model... If it was the new cento 1 sr with all that straight tubes... But of course the ride quality is much more important, this kind of things doesn't matter at all...


----------



## Italianrider76 (May 13, 2005)

The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit. I'd stick with the KOM.


----------



## esldude (Jan 3, 2009)

Beauty in the eye of the beholder and all......but

I think the Willier is about twice as good looking at the Kuota.

The good thing is both are so good, picking the one you like the looks of is probably as good as any other reason.


----------



## moskowe (Mar 14, 2011)

"The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit" 
Since when exactly ? I know a lot of people aren't fond of Wilier's engineering, but as far as I recall Kuotas are just crappy cookie-cutter frames. I'd love to hear of a pro objectively giving a Kuota frame some compliments. 

Personally, I think comparing the two frames is like comparing a Ford Mustang and a Murcielago. You just know one of them is a wannabe. I would chose a Cento Uno over 10 Kuota KOMs.


----------



## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

>Gets critical over inaccurate statement.



moskowe said:


> "The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit"
> Since when exactly ? I know a lot of people aren't fond of Wilier's engineering, but as far as I recall Kuotas are just crappy cookie-cutter frames. I'd love to hear of a pro objectively giving a Kuota frame some compliments.
> 
> Personally, I think comparing the two frames is like comparing a Ford Mustang and a Murcielago. You just know one of them is a wannabe. I would chose a Cento Uno over 10 Kuota KOMs.



>Uses pretentious judgement and illustrates highly subjective images.


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

bruno_h2 said:


> Aesthetically, I'll stick with the kuota chassis... I don't like the curved top tube, seat & chain stays like the ones in this wilier model... If it was the new cento 1 sr with all that straight tubes... But of course the ride quality is much more important, this kind of things doesn't matter at all...


I go back and forth about which I like better aesthetically. I do not like the look of sloping top tubes (look like girls bikes to me), of which the Wilier is slightly sloping. I do like the rear swingarm design though, and the look of the ISP. 

I think the KOM just looks mean. Straightforward. 

It's interesting that you mention the new Cento SR, which seems to have chainstays closer to those on the KOM. The KOM was a completely new design in 2011, whereas the Cento Uno was designed in like 2008.


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

moskowe said:


> "The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit"
> Since when exactly ? I know a lot of people aren't fond of Wilier's engineering, but as far as I recall Kuotas are just crappy cookie-cutter frames. I'd love to hear of a pro objectively giving a Kuota frame some compliments.
> 
> Personally, I think comparing the two frames is like comparing a Ford Mustang and a Murcielago. You just know one of them is a wannabe. I would chose a Cento Uno over 10 Kuota KOMs.


Show me evidence of the the Kuota's being a "cookie cutter" frame? I've heard 2 different people claim this now, but have never seen any replica/counterfeit/chinese frame that looked anything like the KOM. It has a massive downtube, and crazy oversized Bottom Bracket area. Not to mention it is a Uni-Directional High Modulus carbon frame that weighs 900 grams and stands up to the rigors of the Paris-Roubaix.

I'm not saying it's better or worse than the Wilier, and I would certainly concede that the Wilier has more "prestige", but I don't think you could call the Kuota KOM Evo "crappy", "cookie-cutter", or a "Ford Mustang" of bikes.... and I own both for the record.


----------



## moskowe (Mar 14, 2011)

"It has a massive downtube"
Like every bike designed in the past 5 years.
"it has a crazy oversized BB area" 
That's a decade old design. 
"Uni-Directional, High Modulus, laterally stiff yet vertically compliant"
Everyone has something to say about their carbon layup.
And really, 900 grams is pretty average by today's standards. That's exactly what I'm saying, technologically the KOM has no big thing going for it. Plenty of teams use the same bike for Roubaix and other events, so that doesn't mean a lot either.

Like I said, a lot of people aren't fond of the engineering behind Wilier, and I'm not too sure I'd buy one either, but Wilier has a more solid reputation, more experience, and is one of the more "boutique" brands. The Cento Uno SL is outrageously expensive, and a large part of what you pay for the bike is style.
Kuota follows a mass-market approach, sells their bikes pretty cheap, and definitely doesn't have the same reputation. Maybe they're not "crappy" but they're definitely cookie-cutter frames. There is nothing in a Kuota that makes it stand out from a giant, a cannondale or a Specialized. And those brands at least have their names going for them. Hence the comparison between a mustang and a murcielago. 

For the same price, similar groupset, there is no doubt in my mind which one I would choose. Of course if the Kuota came out to be significantly cheaper, I'd consider it. But imo, it comes down to the difference between an "elite" frame, with a reputation, and a less noticeable one.(though maybe not necessarily less good, I have ridden a Kuota but never a Cento 1)

EDIT: my bad for thinking this was comparing an SL to a KOM. I'd still keep the regular Cento 1 against the KOM, mainly because I found the KOM's ride to be really meh, and like I said, pretty boring frame.


----------



## Italianrider76 (May 13, 2005)

moskowe said:


> "The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit"
> Since when exactly ? I know a lot of people aren't fond of Wilier's engineering, but as far as I recall Kuotas are just crappy cookie-cutter frames. I'd love to hear of a pro objectively giving a Kuota frame some compliments.
> 
> Personally, I think comparing the two frames is like comparing a Ford Mustang and a Murcielago. You just know one of them is a wannabe. I would chose a Cento Uno over 10 Kuota KOMs.


Yeah but the Cento Uno isn't Wilier's top level frame. The Cento Uno SL would be a fairer comparison to the KOM. The Wilier frames are just as crappy cookie cutter frames as the Kuotas not that either are really crappy, just using your words man. To say that Wilier is more of a boutique brand is plain nonsense. Sure, the company has history but it has changed ownership since and like all manufacturers, their frames are all made in the far east, not that there is anything wrong with that it's just not that boutique.


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

moskowe said:


> "It has a massive downtube"
> Like every bike designed in the past 5 years.
> "it has a crazy oversized BB area"
> That's a decade old design.
> ...


So what does "cookie cutter" mean to you? Is every bike that's not some radical new design a "cookie" from the same mold? "Technologically it has no big thing going for it"- yet it incorporates all the latest technologies..... You act like every year they're making leaps in bike designs....

Tell me what about the Cento Uno makes it any different from the others you mention? Asymmetric design? The KOM has it, along with an asymmetric UD carbon layup. Oversized bottom bracket? The KOM is even more robust. Integrated dropouts? KOM has them. ISP? Not really a big deal to me....

You act like this is a rebranded Chinese mold....I understand it's made in China (as are ALL frames any more), but the design is backed by a lot of R&D and real world testing. It's still a high-end (see: Tour quality) frame that has competed in (and won) some very big races over the past few years. 

Again, I'm not saying it's better/worse than the Wilier- but I think you're being a little unrealistic in what you're saying (really? it's the Ford Mustang of bikes at $6k?)


----------



## AtomicMoose (Aug 15, 2012)

Wow todd... who knew this would start such a firestorm? 

I think the fact that you bought the group set already and it will not (natively) fit the Wilier is probably all the decision you need to make, really.

Sell off the Cento and build up that KOM and enjoy a great ride.


----------



## moskowe (Mar 14, 2011)

You have your opinion and I have mine. Every brand has a distinctive sign that makes them special. Whether it be emphasis on technology, aero, style, whatever you call it, the top model has something that sets them apart.
What sets the KOM apart ? Nothing. In MY opinion, it's a boring frame. Sure, it has an oversized BB, "special" carbon layup, bells and whistles, but nothing makes it unique. Cervelo have their aero, Spech have their weird top tube, and all the Italian brands are just that, the italian brands. Kuota has none of that. And the KOM really doesn't ride that impressively either, for a $6000 bike. Which is why for that amount of money, I would never, ever buy one. Same as I wouldn't buy a Focus, for example.
The comparison with Mustang hails from the similarities between Kuota and Ford, brands which sell their products at low prices and have this one model that's priced more expensive and which is supposed to evocate "performance" and "style." If you're gonna pay that much for a bike, you might as well get the real deal.

That's the way I see it. I'm sure that owning both bikes, you have a very different opinion, and based on ride quality for both bikes as opposed to just one. I've also had several friends who do material engineering tell me that Wilier's carbon construction is scary bad, so I'm not sure I'd buy a Wilier either. But based on what the Kuota looks and rides like, I wouldn't get one. I do think that it's a cookie cutter frame.


----------



## toddious (Dec 14, 2011)

umm.... Kuota IS an Italian brand....


----------



## AtomicMoose (Aug 15, 2012)

I'm a little stuck on this "cookie cutter" phrase that keeps getting used. Wouldn't any production frame technically be cookie cutter? I mean, these frames are not custom work. The manufactures make 100's, maybe 1000's of them.

Does this somehow make a nice frame less desirable? Maybe for some who require uniqueness in their machines. But those folks also have the money to pay for being unique. For the rest of the commoners, we all buy cookie cutter frames I guess.


----------



## Tri Slow Poke (Jul 22, 2006)

I guess the point is due to circumstance beyond a manufacturer's control somewhat (i.e. UCI standards), most mass produced bikes out now are "cookie cutter". Very little distinguishes them expect paint. Same factories. Same marketing slogans. Same carbon lay up. Same weights. What DOES separate them are marketing and/or how an individual "feels" when riding them. Someone wants to pay a premium for the name on the down tube. Why would I have a problem with that?


----------



## Mambac (Sep 18, 2012)

I'd go Kuota


----------



## badge118 (Dec 26, 2002)

Italianrider76 said:


> The KOM has more cred on the pro tour circuit. I'd stick with the KOM.


A little late to the party but I am PRAYING this was sarcasm. A 1-2 at the world championships, a win at Lombaria, stage wins at the Dauphine, Giro, and Basque Country. Green jersey TdF, overall Giro, 2nd place Fleche Wallone and Tour D Suisse. Stage wins in all the GTs. Basically one bike that has won some of the most Challenging one day and stage races, flats and climbs, where many companies will have a sprint bike a climbers bike and a cobble bike. 

Full disclosure. I owned a Kuota Kharma. It was a good bike, probably the best bang for the buck bike I ever owned and I liked it quite a lot but to say it has the palmares (read cred) of the Cento Uno? Nope.


----------

