# Voekler thoughts (spoiler)



## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

So, huge crash happens and the peloton waits for the crash victims to catch back. Result of this is a new yellow jersey because they obviously aren't going to wait or didn't get the word. Break time balloons back up. Should sportsmanship in the peloton be expected in a break away again?


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## Doctor Who (Feb 22, 2005)

A breakaway is immune to the issues of the peloton.


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## erj549 (Jul 26, 2008)

spookyload said:


> So, huge crash happens and the peloton waits for the crash victims to catch back. Result of this is a new yellow jersey because they obviously aren't going to wait or didn't get the word. Break time balloons back up. Should sportsmanship in the peloton be expected in a break away again?


No way. The break is the break. It's trying to get away from the peloton. What happens in the peloton stays in the peloton. They made a conscious choice in the peloton to sit up and wait, knowing yellow would likely be lost. That was a very sporting thing to do, but you can't then expect to radio the break and tell them to wait up too.


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## MerlinAma (Oct 11, 2005)

The breakaway sat up briefly after their incident too.


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

Let me add that I totally respect Voekler. He is a work horse and a great rider for France to rally behind.


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## MerlinAma (Oct 11, 2005)

Did Voekler do ALL the work in the breakaway?


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

MerlinAma said:


> Did Voekler do ALL the work in the breakaway?


All? 'Course not. He did a majority of it IIRC, even before the crash that took out Hoogerland over 60% of it.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*part of the hopes*

of a breakaway is that stuff happens to the peloton that slows them
you don't want anyone hurt
you just want them to slow


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## SeeVee (Sep 25, 2005)

spookyload said:


> Let me add that I totally respect Voekler. He is a work horse and a great rider for France to rally behind.


I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out. 

Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


It is the Tour de FRANCE. Who was the last French rider they French have been able to rally behind. It is THE national race for them, and Europeans in general are very proud of their national products. To wear the yellow jersey for a day for a Frenchman is a childhood dream.


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## dougydee (Feb 15, 2005)

spookyload said:


> To wear the yellow jersey for a day for a Frenchman is a childhood dream.


And one that will have them treated like royalty for life throughout their country.


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## Lazy Spinner (Aug 30, 2009)

He earned it fairly and has every reason to revel in it. He's now a national hero. What happened behind him in the peloton is of no consequence.


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## runningdud (Mar 17, 2005)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


don't understand why that makes you sick. 
i remember tv bravely and heroically defending yellow back in '04 for 10 days or so despite la's attempts. he's certainly worked hard in the following yrs and today he was rewarded with regaining maillot jaune. heck, if it woulda been me, i'd likely be bawling on that podium, ala cav last yr. 
chapeau to tv. hoping he can defend for several days as last time but that was 7 yrs ago.


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## atimido (Jun 17, 2009)

SeeVee said:


> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


Your comment shows your newbness. Find a copy of the 2004 Tour to watch, and maybe you'll get a better understanding of who Voeckler is. There is more to cycling than Lance Armstrong...


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## moabbiker (Sep 11, 2002)

He earned it and media reporting he has a swollen ankle resulting from the bouncing around due to the maniac driver mowing down riders.


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## Lou3000 (Aug 25, 2010)

Why the hate? Congrats to Voeckler. He caught a bit of a break with the peleton's problems, but the break is the break. 

Also, I've always liked Voeckler, as the other poster said, he valiantly defended the yellow jersey as a young rider. 

Finally, 2:45 is a good bit of time, I know that he may not have the legs in the mountains, but just finishing with the peleton for the rest of the race would keep him close.


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## GScot (Feb 7, 2005)

I do not keep up with everything off season but I believe credit is also due TV for his team even existing this year. Seems they were about to fold without a sponsor and TV was already moving to another French team, when a sponsor came in they insisted on having TV in the team and for the good of French cycling all parties worked out a deal. TV has to be a good man to work something like without it becoming a lawsuit fest or name calling pissing match.


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## fringale37 (Feb 6, 2005)

That was a real bike race today, you could actually see how tired all 3 riders were in the breakaway kudos to TV for getting the yellow jersey....he is my new Jens Voigt.


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## cinelliguy (Jan 4, 2011)

Are you kidding me? Really?

Congrats to Voeckler!!!


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## pedalruns (Dec 18, 2002)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.



Voeckler is one of my favorite riders.... I was in France for the 2004 event and watched him hold on to yellow and fight for ten stages when no one thought he could hold it for long.... since 2004 he has been the French champion several times, he always attacks, and is a great cyclist in his own right... For me I enjoy seeing the other riders (not just the main GC guys) fight for the stages... just to win a stage is a major feet. 

SeeVee there is alot more to the TDF than just the winner. 

I think one of my new favorite riders is Johnny Hoogerland... wow... you won't see any football players doing that!


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## Tschai (Jun 19, 2003)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


Your comments give the strong impression that you know very little about pro-cycling and the TdF. TV is a very, very special rider. 95% of pro-cyclists will never be a threat to the GC.


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


You're joking, right? Opportunist... really?? Did you even watch the stage? :mad2:


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## Allez Rouge (Jan 1, 1970)

fringale37 said:


> That was a real bike race today, you could actually see how tired all 3 riders were in the breakaway kudos to TV for getting the yellow jersey....he is my new Jens Voigt.


^^^^This. Superb stage, superb result. TV's yellow jersey is well-deserved.


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## lemonlime (Sep 24, 2003)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


I suppose you only support bona fide CG contenders?

I would argue ALL pros are opportunists, btw.


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## ocean-ro (Nov 23, 2009)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


If it make you sick,switch to baseball channel. A lot more chewing and spiting there.


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## johnlh (Sep 12, 2008)

pedalruns said:


> Voeckler is one of my favorite riders.... I was in France for the 2004 event and watched him hold on to yellow and fight for ten stages when no one thought he could hold it for long.... since 2004 he has been the French champion several times, he always attacks, and is a great cyclist in his own right... For me I enjoy seeing the other riders (not just the main GC guys) fight for the stages... just to win a stage is a major feet.
> 
> SeeVee there is alot more to the TDF than just the winner.
> 
> I think one of my new favorite riders is Johnny Hoogerland... wow... you won't see any football players doing that!


Heart and courage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUXL7XkVi7c


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## dingrr (May 31, 2010)

dougydee said:


> And one that will have them treated like royalty for life throughout their country.


Deservedly so. Well done!


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## SeeVee (Sep 25, 2005)

runningdud said:


> don't understand why that makes you sick.
> i remember tv bravely and heroically defending yellow back in '04 for 10 days or so despite la's attempts. he's certainly worked hard in the following yrs and today he was rewarded with regaining maillot jaune. heck, if it woulda been me, i'd likely be bawling on that podium, ala cav last yr.
> chapeau to tv. hoping he can defend for several days as last time but that was 7 yrs ago.


You cant call that a "defense." He posed a threat to no one for the GC. The eventual GC winner, LA, took the jersey in due time and never looked back. 

In the NFL, they call it "trash time." Kinda like your team getting smashed 49 to 0 in the fourth quarter and you score a TD on third team defense and then spike the ball and do an end zone dance.


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## SeeVee (Sep 25, 2005)

atimido said:


> Your comment shows your newbness. Find a copy of the 2004 Tour to watch, and maybe you'll get a better understanding of who Voeckler is. There is more to cycling than Lance Armstrong...



Puh-leese. I've been following TdF's for the better part of a quarter century. 

Take your own advice, " There is more to cycling than Lance Armstrong.?


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## SeeVee (Sep 25, 2005)

Tschai said:


> Your comments give the strong impression that you know very little about pro-cycling and the TdF. TV is a very, very special rider. 95% of pro-cyclists will never be a threat to the GC.


Your comments give the impression you know little about me. 

See my above post. 

Do you think if any of the contenders felt threatened by his antics they would let him go? He is a non-issue in the fight for a GC.


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## wibly wobly (Apr 23, 2009)

Way to piss on someones accomplishment. Leading that race at any stage is a huge deal for most pro riders.


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## SeeVee (Sep 25, 2005)

I still dont get all the love for the guy. No one defending TV would state that if AC, or LL, CE or Vino went in that break, the peleton wouldnt shut down that break before it started. 

The only reason he was allowed to go is because he is not a threat to the overall GC. The peleton said a collective, "Go ahead, Frenchie. We arent worried about you so we wont chase you down." 

They felt so non-threatned by him that even today the whole freaking peleton say up to wait for all the crash victims rejoin. 

Anyone think for a second that the peloton could not have chased him down if they wanted?


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## Creakyknees (Sep 21, 2003)

Whatever, hater. Let's see you rip off 100 miles across those roads while holding off the entire Tour de France peloton.


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## nims (Jul 7, 2009)

Thomas Voeckler did show some impressive bike handling skills there. I can't believe he didn't get wiped out when Flecha banged into him. He's probably the the best if not top 3 best French rider right now. If he doesn't take yellow today, the French could have had to wait until next year for any excitement like this. It's good for the tour when the home country gets some glory. He rode like crazy even after the peleton started accelerating under Garmin. Casar was dead tired at the line there even after doing 0 work in the last minutes. Just shows how hard Voeckler was riding. 

Aside from that, I was just sad that Thor lost the jersey when no one stepped up to help Garmin pull Voeclker back I found it pretty sad and was hoping that Voeckler would put a good 5-6 min on the GC guys for doing nothing. Thor gave up his yellow jersey for sportsmanship. I really like that guy.


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## Sylint (Jul 27, 2009)

SeeVee said:


> I still dont get all the love for the guy. No one defending TV would state that if AC, or LL, CE or Vino went in that break, the peleton wouldnt shut down that break before it started.
> 
> The only reason he was allowed to go is because he is not a threat to the overall GC. The peleton said a collective, "Go ahead, Frenchie. We arent worried about you so we wont chase you down."
> 
> ...


No one's expecting him to hold it til Paris, but to say he didn't earn it today just shows your ignorance of the sport.


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## PruneJuice (Oct 21, 2010)

So, according to SeeVee there should be no stage wins, no race jerseys, no sprints, and all that the other riders on the team should do is help there GC contender?

Heck, lets do away with flat stages or rolling stages like today - lets only have l'alpe d'huez, an ITT, and the celebration roll into Paris.

That'd make for a great event! We wouldn't have to be distracted by pretend riders like Tommy Voeckler!












BTW: I loved watching this stage. I love seeing TV race, always shows so much heart. And seeing Hoogerland fight to the end to get his KOM jersey was totally inspiring. Sanchez winning was almost a side story with all that!


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

What I like about TV is that he has remade himself as a real competitor.

In 2004, he was riding on heart, instinct and shear guts--too young to know what a freaking fairy tale it was, but with all that youthful exuberance that took him way past his limits.

Now he has to ride like a mortal--and like Thor, has had to refashion himself into a real bike racer--older, heavier, no freaking unstoppable flood of energy that you have when you are as young as he was in 2004 (look at Teejay in his break and you see it again)---and yet he could seize his chance, dig deep and make it happen.

There aren't many in the bunch who can do that--GC contenders or not.

Chapeau, TV!


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## erj549 (Jul 26, 2008)

SeeVee said:


> I dont understand this train of thought. He is an opportunist, nothing more, nothing less. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would not have been allowed to go up the road. If he was a threat to take the GC, he would have been chewed up and spit out.
> 
> Watching him jump up and down on the podium like a giddy school girl made me sick.


Damn you and your awesome yellow jersey, Thomas Voeckler!!!! Damn you for celebrating an accomplishment that most cyclists can only dream of!!!! [shakes fist in the air at Tommy Voeckler across the ocean]


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

SeeVee said:


> I still dont get all the love for the guy. No one defending TV would state that if AC, or LL, CE or Vino went in that break, the peleton wouldnt shut down that break before it started.
> 
> The only reason he was allowed to go is because he is not a threat to the overall GC. The peleton said a collective, "Go ahead, Frenchie. We arent worried about you so we wont chase you down."
> 
> ...



So. What.

Of the 198 starters, there are maybe 6 or 7 true contenders. Does this mean they should never allow a break to go if it is of no threat to the final GC? Why not just flip a coin to see who wins the final GC then? 

This is racing. Why is he happy? He's wearing the leader's jersey in the biggest race in the world. If you're so bothered by the fact that he's moved by leading his national tour, then change the channel until the last stage into Paris. Leave the thrills and excitement of the race to those of us who don't have our head stuck up our butt, and don't enjoy trolling a forum, crapping all over an impressive cyclist's accomplishment.


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## erj549 (Jul 26, 2008)

pedalruns said:


> I think one of my new favorite riders is Johnny Hoogerland... wow... you won't see any football players doing that!


I hear that. Hoogerland's been going balls to the wall all week, and then he gets freakin' owned in the face by a barbed wire fence and then tells the fence to STFU and gets back on his bike and grabs his well-deserved polka dots. That guy's made of some tough stuff. Next time I'm dying on a hill I'll ask myself, "what would Hoogerland do?" and then I'll just HTFU and get on with it.


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## T0mi (Mar 2, 2011)

SeeVee said:


> I still dont get all the love for the guy. No one defending TV would state that if AC, or LL, CE or Vino went in that break, the peleton wouldnt shut down that break before it started.


_I still don't get all the love for Alberto Contador or Cadel Evans, or any GC contender they would be trashed by Mark Cavendish in a massive flat sprint._


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## Dynastar (Jun 8, 2007)

SeeVee said:


> You cant call that a "defense." He posed a threat to no one for the GC. The eventual GC winner, LA, took the jersey in due time and never looked back.
> 
> In the NFL, they call it "trash time." Kinda like your team getting smashed 49 to 0 in the fourth quarter and you score a TD on third team defense and then spike the ball and do an end zone dance.


Sure TV is not going to win, but why watch the Tour at all. Cav is not going to win either, so in your eyes he is a shitty rider?

To use your own NFL reference If the 3rd string QB comes off the bench to win the game, was that not a good game and a great performance - even his team does not go to the Superbowl?

What about the receiver that has a great catch, but loses the game? You don't have to win the whole thing to be heroic.


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## dana109 (May 1, 2009)

I don't understand the hate. 

He might not have won with enough margin over Thor if there wasn't a crash in the peleton. He might won by a larger margin and hold onto the jersey longer if there wasn't a crash in the break. That's bike racing. A bit of luck is involved. 

I really don't understand that hate. I remember a few years back when I finished my first novice/cat5 race I was in so much pain and suffered so much just to finish mid pack that I promised myself i would never disrespect anyone who was able to finish a bike race. 

The domestiques who finish a few hours down on the leaders deserve huge amounts of respect. And so does anyone who suffer enough to snatch a day of glory.


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## MAS-SD (Jun 14, 2008)

Voeckler embodies what the sport is all about. Aggressive attacking and see if it works. His open style breaks the predictability that has made the tour a little boring in past years. Nobody saw this coming. Regardless of how he got yellow.


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