# Former team physician of the US Postal team on Lance



## Stinky Hippie (Jul 19, 2002)

Dear Family, Friends, and Associates,

On Sunday, July 18 at 9:30 a.m. EST ESPN's "Outside the Lines" is 
devoting the program to the recently released French language book 
"L.A. Confidentiel: Les Secrets de Lance Armstrong". The book's 
authors, both well respected award-winning investigative journalists, 
make a very convincing (irrefutable?) case proving Lance Armstrong's 
use of illegal performance enhancing drugs.

In the book I am one of the sources in which I relate my experience 
of having been released as team physician of the US Postal team when 
I refused to be involved in doping the riders. I was interviewed for 
the ESPN story and the footage will likely be included. Mine is a 
very small part in the big story, but has and probably will again 
attract considerable heat from the Armstrong people.

Please realize that I find myself in this position due to my very 
certain belief that doping has penetrated and corrupted cycling to 
such a degree that I can no longer stay quiet. It is time for change 
and I'm prepared to do whatever I can to assist in the effort. The 
book will be out soon in English and I encourage all of you to read 
it and to do so with an open mind, without prejudice, and without the 
nationalistic attitude the Armstrong people would have you take.

The aspect of all this that bothers me the most is what Armstrong has 
done with the cancer community. I believe that he's shamelessly used 
his personal story as a marketing tool and as a smoke screen for his 
prior and continued use of doping substances. As the son of a cancer 
survivor and a physician who works with cancer patients on a daily 
basis, I find this completely unacceptable. I feel really badly 
about how this doping story effects the cancer community and regret 
that they've chosen to hitch their wagon to such an unethical 
character.

Perhaps I'm over reacting and little will come of this. We'll see.

Best wishes to all,

Prentice Steffan


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## |brake-out| (Feb 23, 2004)

*Hmm...*

So, I'm supposed to believe that a user with the name of "Stinky Hippie" is a doctor worthy of my attention ?

Quote from link in thread:

"Walsh includes interviews with an unnamed former Motorola teammate who suggests Armstrong actively sought EPO as far back as 1995. The article also includes comments by former U.S. Postal team physician Prentice Steffan, who left the team one year before Armstrong signed on. Steffan, now the team doctor for Mercury-Viatel, suggests that his departure from the Postal team was triggered by his refusal "to do all that could be done," to help his riders excel after a poor performance in the 1996 Tour of Switzerland."

You left before Armstrong signed on ? How could you even say that he's doped if you were never his doctor ? TROLL !


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

*Busted!*

Put an asterik on those 5 and soon to be 6 Tour wins.

1999 *
2000 *
2001 *
2002 *
2003 *
2004 *


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## Steve-O (Jan 28, 2004)

*His name's come up before...*



|brake-out| said:


> So, I'm supposed to believe that a user with the name of "Stinky Hippie" is a doctor worthy of my attention ?


Prentice Steffan goes back aways... 

http://www.velonews.com/race/tour2001/articles/1094.0.html


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

*Greg LeMond was right!*

Dammit! All to hell with this. I just saw a commercial on ESPN for their show "Outside the Lines", they got a clip of that stuff and the feature story is the even NEWER Armstrong drug allegations. This time from the former USPS physician you quoted.


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## svend (Jul 18, 2003)

*why just those??*



Ricky2 said:


> Put an asterik on those 5 and soon to be 6 Tour wins.
> 
> 1999 *
> 2000 *
> ...


Fair enough, then we better put an * next to every single victory all the way back. Until there is proof, and someone saying so with a potential ax to grind is no proof, then it is all innuendo. Doesn't anyone find it odd that all these accusations are just now reappearing with one week to go. Last I checked Lance was a US citizen and in this country one is innocent until PROVEN guilty. I hate ranting on as I'm not really a big fan of the guy but come on, where is the proof.


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## ElvisMerckx (Oct 11, 2002)

*A Response to Dr. Steffen*

Dear Family, Friends, and Associates,

On Sunday, July 18 at 9:30 a.m. EST ESPN's "Outside the Lines" is 
devoting the program to the recently released French language book 
"L.A. Confidentiel: Les Secrets de Lance Armstrong". The book's 
authors, both bottom-feeding, sensationalist, tabloid journalists, 
make a very weak case insinuating Lance Armstrong's 
use of illegal performance enhancing drugs.

In the book, Dr. Prentice Steffan is one of the sources who relates his bitterness
of having been released as team physician of the US Postal team. He is a 
very small man with a big tinfoil hat, and has, and probably will again, 
attracted considerable heat from reasonable, thinking people.

Please realize that he finds himself in this position due to his very 
misguided belief that doping has penetrated and corrupted cycling to 
such a degree that he can no longer resist the urge to profit from his own 
bitterness at having been fired by USPS. It is time to cash in 
and he’s prepared to do whatever he can to avenge his firing. The 
book will be out soon in English and he hopes suckers and the gullible 
will read it and to do so with prejudice, unsound mind, and with the 
anti-American attitude that is swelling in Europe.

The aspect of all this that bothers him the most is what Armstrong has 
done with the cancer community. He believes that Lance has shamelessly 
used his personal story to raise awareness and millions of dollars for research 
in the fight against cancer. As the son of a cancer survivor and a physician 
who works with cancer patients on a daily basis, he finds this completely 
unacceptable. If cancer is cured, Armstrong will have taken away another of 
his cash cows. He feels really badly about how Armstrong’s story affects the 
cancer community and regrets that cancer research is making progress due
to Armstrong’s involvement.

Perhaps he’s overreacting and little will come of this. We'll see. In the meantime, 
the rest of us are still waiting for PROOF before smearing Armstrong’s name, 
character, and contributions to society,

Best wishes to all,

Elvis Merckx


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## darkwing duck (May 18, 2004)

We might as well take every past Tour winner, Giro winner, Vuelta winner, Classics winner, hell, everybody and put an asterisk by their wins. They must be on drugs to go that fast. 

Why is is that nobody comes forward with this $hit in December?


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## |brake-out| (Feb 23, 2004)

*it'll be ok*

ya know, maybe he is doping with something undetectable. I certainly can't say....but don't you think that someone would have caught him by now ? From an ex-wife who hasn't said anything to numerous teammates that have left, surely someone could have brought him down if he were guilty. Personally I can't comprehend him doing that, think of what all he has to lose. All of his endorsements, respect from everyone, it just doesn't seem logical. And he wasn't all alone on the climb today, Basso was right there with him. So why isn't everyone accusing Basso ? Surely he's got to be a doper, because he put time into everyone.....If it ever came out that he was doped, pro cycling as a whole would suffer tremendously. It would be viewed even worse than the "all-drug" olympics that was on SNL one year. GO LANCE !


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## svend (Jul 18, 2003)

Well Done!


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

***



svend said:


> Fair enough, then we better put an * next to every single victory all the way back.


Nope. The criteria for asteriks as shown by the hate Barry Bonds gets over BALCO and their own doctor's allegations, is that you put the asterik up there when a doc admits to giving you drugs.

Therefore, Barry has no asteriks because Dr. Conte recently said no drugs where given to Barry. But Armstrong does get an asterik!

*


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## rendus (Jul 1, 2004)

How many times has Bonds been tested?

I forget.....

oh yeah, once I believe.

and they won't release the results...I wonder why????

prolly has something to do with his head growing two hat sizes.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

|brake-out| said:


> ya know, maybe he is doping with something undetectable. I certainly can't say....but don't you think that someone would have caught him by now ? From an ex-wife who hasn't said anything to numerous teammates that have left, surely someone could have brought him down if he were guilty. GO LANCE!


OK, you obviously haven't been following this story very long. Former teamates have added to the dope allegations. Stephen Swart, is the latest along with some guys that go back to the US National team days. Physiotherapists and recently a former USPS team physician who is on ESPN's special this Sunday 7-8-04 that speaks of Armstrong's past drug use. So, you said that by now you would someone would've said something by now. Ehem! Hello!


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## rendus (Jul 1, 2004)

> Dr. Prentice Steffen, U.S. Postal's former team doctor, says he was dumped after the 1996 season -- just before Armstrong joined up, and soon after Steffen had rebuffed two riders who approached him with what Steffen regarded as an appeal that the team use performance-enhancing drugs.


He's a fine source for allegations....

"he was dumped after the 1996 season -- just before Armstrong joined up"

"*with what Steffen regarded* as an appeal that the team use performance-enhancing drugs"

My cousin's brother's uncle said Lance was using drugs...so it must be true. 

and as a counterpoint to the allegations Mr.Swart, I give you the testimony of Mr. Brian Smith:


> Smith had personal experience with how the team dealt with suspicious test results:
> 
> "But the day before the race I was called into a room with Jim Ochowicz and Hennie Kuiper, the team directors, and Massimo Testa, the team doctor, and told that I couldn’t race. They said that my blood tests had shown a testosterone level of zero, which meant either that my body had stopped producing it, or that I’d been getting it artificially. I had stubble, so I was obviously getting it from somewhere.
> "It was made very clear to me that Motorola was a massive sponsor, and that they condemned any association with drugs. I had no idea what had happened, but a second test cleared me and I was able to start racing. But it showed me the team was clean. I saw nothing untoward in the year I was there, and that included riding the Giro d’Italia.


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

*This is becoming more of a farce every day.*

It's becoming harder to believe that Lance is telling the truth. First, there were the tests and teamates, then the book and the physiotherapist who says she made the drug deliveries. And now a former team physician?! I just think its highly unlikely that ALL of these people are somehow involved in some secret plot to get money. Man, the cards are totally stacked against Lance.

Geez! First finding out there was no such thing as Santa Claus. And now, perhaps the biggest sports fraud in history.


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## svend (Jul 18, 2003)

Ricky2 said:


> Nope. The criteria for asteriks as shown by the hate Barry Bonds gets over BALCO and their own doctor's allegations, is that you put the asterik up there when a doc admits to giving you drugs.
> 
> Therefore, Barry has no asteriks because Dr. Conte recently said no drugs where given to Barry. But Armstrong does get an asterik!
> 
> *


Oh, OK, Conte says he didn't give drugs to Bonds so that means Bonds is clean. I feel much better now knowing that his HR record won't have an *. Oh, by the way, how many times has Barry been tested???? An answer has yet to be given.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

Manhattan said:


> It's becoming harder to believe that Lance is telling the truth. First, there were the tests and teamates, then the book and the physiotherapist who says she made the drug deliveries. And now a former team physician?! I just think its highly unlikely that ALL of these people are somehow involved in some secret plot to get money. Man, the cards are totally stacked against Lance.
> 
> Geez! First finding out there was no such thing as Santa Claus. And now, perhaps the biggest sports fraud in history.



One thing is sure. There will be a LOT of questions after ESPN broadcasts the Outside the Lines Show this Sunday. Someone's got some explaining to do!


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## rendus (Jul 1, 2004)

Hey, I'm asking the questions .today....and haven't gotten an answer yet. You keep repeating the same _sources_ like a mantra.

what _were_ Bond's test results?


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## russw19 (Nov 27, 2002)

svend said:


> Doesn't anyone find it odd that all these accusations are just now reappearing with one week to go. Last I checked Lance was a US citizen and in this country one is innocent until PROVEN guilty.



I am not jumping in on either side here, but I wanted to point out two things that seem to be overlooked in your post. 

First off, this is nowhere near the first we are hearing of this. This has been going on for YEARS now. Someone else asked why we don't hear about this in December. We do. And we have for the past 3 or 4 years. It's just that the people who don't want to even consider this as a possibility only tend to hear it in July when they are paying attention to the sport. But this is not a new issue. 

Second, the innocent until proven guilty works for a court of law... it unfortunately isn't true for the court of conscious or morality. Look at the OJ case... half the people in the country are 100% convinced he is guilty of two murders, but he was aquitted in a court of law. Public opinion and the legal system don't always follow each other.


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## russw19 (Nov 27, 2002)

svend said:


> Oh, OK, Conte says he didn't give drugs to Bonds so that means Bonds is clean. I feel much better now knowing that his HR record won't have an *. Oh, by the way, how many times has Barry been tested???? An answer has yet to be given.



WHOA!!!! Hold up! Weren't you the same guy that just a couple posts ago pulled the ol' "innocent until proven guilty" claim about Armstrong? Barry is an American and he plays his sport in America. Why the sudden change in attitude? 

I replied to your first post before I read this one. I wasn't jumping in on either side before, but now I have to ask why you can talk out both sides of you mouth here? Why is there a tone of suspicion in your post when you talk of Barry Bonds, but yet you seem to imply Lance is clean because he hasn't been proven guilty???? What am I missing here?


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## |brake-out| (Feb 23, 2004)

*keep on trollin' brotha*



Ricky2 said:


> OK, you obviously haven't been following this story very long. Former teamates have added to the dope allegations. Stephen Swart, is the latest along with some guys that go back to the US National team days. Physiotherapists and recently a former USPS team physician who is on ESPN's special this Sunday 7-8-04 that speaks of Armstrong's past drug use. So, you said that by now you would someone would've said something by now. Ehem! Hello!


No, I think that I said that someone could have brought him down by now, and no one has. All there has been is a lot of allegations by people who really want to see their name in the papers. If he is FOUND guilty then the public and the press will have their way with him, but to just try and bring him down because he's genetically better just isn't right.


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## Icefrk13 (Jul 2, 2004)

*Just Wondering*

 Does this mean that since Jan lost by a mere 61 sec, last year he was using. I get it he staged a crash in the last TT to cover his use. He may, he may not. But what I see is that all pro cyclists must be. As for Barry Bonds, it seems that same witch-hunt. When ever a record is going to be broke that person is obviously cheating the system some how. Look back at the Mark Maguire. (I know he was using Creatine and it was approved at the time)

Matt


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## ringroadwarrior (Dec 8, 2002)

*Well said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*



ElvisMerckx said:


> Dear Family, Friends, and Associates,
> 
> On Sunday, July 18 at 9:30 a.m. EST ESPN's "Outside the Lines" is
> devoting the program to the recently released French language book
> ...


nmnmnmnmnmnmnmnmn


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## Live Steam (Feb 4, 2004)

*He left the team before LA was a member!*



> Walsh includes interviews with an unnamed former Motorola teammate who suggests Armstrong actively sought EPO as far back as 1995. The article also includes comments by former U.S. Postal team physician Prentice Steffan, who left the team one year before Armstrong signed on. Steffan, now the team doctor for Mercury-Viatel, suggests that his departure from the Postal team was triggered by his refusal "to do all that could be done," to help his riders excel after a poor performance in the 1996 Tour of Switzerland.


http://www.velonews.com/race/tour2001/articles/1094.0.html

The above article is from 2001 Velonews.

He never worked with LA. Actually he never worked with any of the current team as it is composed including Johan Brunyeel <sp>! It seems to me the guy may have an axe to grind or is looking to somehow capitalize on this.


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## wongsifu_mk (Mar 5, 2002)

*Hey, if it's on ESPN, it must be true!*

Zzzzzzzzzz......


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## svend (Jul 18, 2003)

russw19 said:


> WHOA!!!! Hold up! Weren't you the same guy that just a couple posts ago pulled the ol' "innocent until proven guilty" claim about Armstrong? Barry is an American and he plays his sport in America. Why the sudden change in attitude?
> 
> I replied to your first post before I read this one. I wasn't jumping in on either side before, but now I have to ask why you can talk out both sides of you mouth here? Why is there a tone of suspicion in your post when you talk of Barry Bonds, but yet you seem to imply Lance is clean because he hasn't been proven guilty???? What am I missing here?


Same guy and more than a just tone of suspicion. Barry is linked to the biggest doping ring to surface in a long time, BALCO. But since MLB had no history of testing until just recently there is no way to know if he was clean....Question? Why won't the MLB make public their tests? How often have the players been tested over the last 6 years? Of the x% that did test postive, hence the clause that kicked in calling for more testing, no names have been made public and no sanctions have been handed down for those that did. If Barry had been tested 1/100 the times LA has, then fair enough, but he HAS NOT. Lance has been tested/been under investigation continually since 2000 and yet, except for a bunch of innuendo, jack squat has come of it. No change in attitude pal, just the facts. Lance has been tested, Barry hasn't. Lance could've beat the system, Barry never had to.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*Balco*

in the Balco and (insert one of a number famous athletes here) case they have records showing either name or initial and doasge or dosage initial. these would be considered 'evidence' though circumstantial and specious at best. I'm sure we'll never get to the bottom as MLB will try to bury this before it gets to the feds. anyhow it is evidence and until proven of guilt, no I'm not going to asterix either Bonds or Armstrong. In Lances case no records have been produced, even these 'doctors' whose testimony is heresay and possibly jaded by outside motivation is worthless in court. he's (LA) never failed a drug test so he has that over a number of fellow competitors. so all this is is rumor mongering at best.


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## Bocephus Jones (Feb 3, 2004)

Manhattan said:


> It's becoming harder to believe that Lance is telling the truth. First, there were the tests and teamates, then the book and the physiotherapist who says she made the drug deliveries. And now a former team physician?! I just think its highly unlikely that ALL of these people are somehow involved in some secret plot to get money. Man, the cards are totally stacked against Lance.
> 
> Geez! First finding out there was no such thing as Santa Claus. And now, perhaps the biggest sports fraud in history.


I love how people convict Armstrong based on hearsay. Let's see the evidence! If you have none then shut up about it and quit smearing his name. How would you like it to be subject to a smear campaign if you were innocent? .


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## CU155 (Mar 19, 2004)

*to all the accusers out there*

when someone has something of substance to say I'll listen and feel sad....until then stfu haters!


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## asmith (Jun 26, 2004)

I think we need a Doping forum so all of the Lance haters have a place to post their baseless accusations against Lance. That way I don't have to sift through that crap while reading the discussions about the race.

Andrew


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*so if he wasn't with the team after 96*

this guys testimony is more sh!te than the sh!te i thought it earlier.


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## Bulldozer (Jul 31, 2003)

asmith said:


> I think we need a Doping forum so all of the Lance haters have a place to post their baseless accusations against Lance. That way I don't have to sift through that crap while reading the discussions about the race.
> 
> Andrew


Werd.


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## Live Steam (Feb 4, 2004)

That's probably correct. He never had any contact with LA. His word really means nothing.


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## carbonfred (May 26, 2004)

*explain these things*

If Lance is doping, what happened last year? Forgot to take as much?

If Lance is doping, how come none of the *many* riders formerly on USPS have not come forward. That list includes Kevin Livingston, Tyler Hamiltion, Roberto Heras, Tom Boonen, Christian Vandevelde, and Levi Leipheimer. 

True that riders have take epo and evaded drug tests, but they didn't get by investigations. That includes Rumsas and David Millar. Lance has passed all drug tests and a 2 year investigation by a French govt. that didn't like him turned up nothing.


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## Live Steam (Feb 4, 2004)

Hey I'm with you man. If you haven't been able to tell from my posts, I'm with you man. I don't think LA is doping. That was pretty much my point. This doctor never worked with LA or the team as it is now. What could he possibly know? He seems like someone trying to capitalize on something. He gets a TV nterview and more exposure. I'm not sure what good it will do him, but people are strage and will say or do things they normally wouldn't when put in the limelight. Clinton has a propensity for this. He tells tails that can be easily disproven, like seeing churches burn when he was growing up. It never happened. Why did he say it? Who the heck knows! :O)


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

*Barry vs. Armstrong: Presumption of Guilt vs. Innocence*

Nobody directly affiliated with Barry has stated that Barry's on the juice. However, numerous people that ARE directly affiliated with Armstrong says he's dope. So, why the double standard? Why is Barry presumed guilty and Armstrong is presumerd innocent?

FYI, non-baseball followers:
Obviously you guys don't follow baseball that much. The BALCO incident is totally being changed on this forum. Dr. Conte, one of the BALCO founders is NOT linked to Barry Bonds and has recently stated as such. Barry's former trainer WAS linked to Dr. Conte. On the other hand, Lance Armstrong himself is linked to Dr. Ferrari. Just pointing out that Armstrong has stronger ties to dope doctors than Barry, so if anything Armstrong should be getting the asteriks, not Barry.

And for the two guys who keep saying, "duh, we should suspect everybody that has good performances starting with today's stage winner." Uhh, come on! That's weak! It's not just the fact that a win is a win, but the fact that now everybody and their momma that was once directly affiliated with Armstrong has raised these doping allegations.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*as I said*

I'm not about to convict either. but this affiliation thing you keep bringing up is nonsense. all these 'affiliated' people have other motivations besides seeking the truth so their testimony especially this new guy whose 'affiliation' is off by 3 yeras or so. re: all the Balco, Dr Conte stuff, again, this info was uncovered in an investigation not a witch hunt created by disgruntled employees. I'm not passing judgement on either but you keep bringing them up together anf they are Apples and Oranges. But yes I think both LA and Barry are innocent until PROVEN guilty.


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

Yeah, but the thing is most of the Lance camp will NEVER believe that he could've ever done anything wrong. But in their eyes, Marion Jones, Barry Bonds and all the other sports stars are drugged up. It is a double standard. Maybe its a black/white thing. Maybe its a cycling/other spot thing. I don't know, but it's obvious that there is that presumption of guilt put on these other athletes that Lance is off-limits too.

And Russ is right. Just because you don't test positive for anything automatically mean that you are clean. Hell, in all your USCF races, how many times did you ever even pee into a cup?! And you think that all the Cat 1s and stuff are free from guilt? Man, Millar was just busted. He never tested positive. Virenque, Pantani, Manzano. etc. The ways around the tests are sooooo easy now. YOU CANNOT TEST FOR EPO! Period! Why do you think they test the hematocrit?!

The allegations are not new, but when a former team physician (USPS, Motorola, Nat'l Team, who cares), when a former team physician says something, then that is _serious stuff_. The man would not risk his own private practice for nothing. He has literally nothing to gain. No book sales. NADA! ZILCH! How long are you going to keep closing your eyes before you want to find out the real truth! Man, Greg was villified yesterday for speaking out! Why? Because the 'Lance is god camp' doesn't want to hear all sides of the story.


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## NeedSpeed (Mar 12, 2002)

*Lemond vs. Lance: It's getting nuclear*

This Lance vs. Lemond thing is getting ugly. Check out these excepts from OTL to be broadcast on Sunday. They showed clips on the 6 p.m. ET SportsCenter, so I missed it already here in the Midwest. This is going to get much, much uglier. How long before the media tries to get Kristin or Kevin Livingston to say something about Lance and doping.

Plus, remember the rift between Lance/Postal and Cedric Vasseur (who's got problems of his own in this regard)? He apparently flipped off Le Boss and his name has been mud in the peleton ever since. I wonder if he will be next to come out with allegations.

Read this:Â*


ESPN.com

A decade before the emergence of Lance Armstrong, Greg Lemond rose to prominence as America's first mainstream cyclist.


Lemond burst onto the national scene with his victory at the Tour de France in 1986, becoming the first American to win cycling's most prestigious event. Almost killed in a hunting accident a year later, Lemond recovered to return to cycling and, in 1989, grabbed the Tour de France's most dramtic win, when he used a blistering final-day ride to overtake France's Laurent Fignon to win the event by eight seconds -- the closest finish ever. Lemond cemented his status in the cycling world when he repeated as champ in 1990.


Now, as Armstrong is threatening to claim his record sixth straight Tour de France title, Lemond speaks with ESPN's Outside the Lines (segments airing Friday on SportsCenter at 6 p.m. ET and in its entirety Sunday at 9:30 a.m. ET) in his first public interview since his 2001 statements questioning Armstrong's relationship with a controversial Italian doctor now on trial for doping.


"If [Armstrong's] clean, it's the greatest comeback. And if he's not, then it's the greatest fraud," Lemond said.


Lemond also discussed the aftermath of his 2001 statements, including receiving an angry phone call from Armstrong. In the call, Lemond claims that Armstrong said that doping was rampant in cycling and threatened to spread rumors that Lemond doped as a rider.


"He basically said 'I could find 10 people that will say you took EPO'," Lemond said. "He basically said 'you know, come on, everybody's done it,' basically kind of like 'hey everybody, EPO's fairly common.' "


Lemond also claims that Armstrong's camp threatened his business interests.


"The week after, I got multiple people that were on Lance ... Lance's camp, basically saying 'you better be quiet,' and I was quiet for three years," Lemond said. "I have a business ... I have bikes that are sold ... and I was told that my sales might not be doing too well if ... just the publicity, the negative publicity."


Reached in France, Armstrong expressed regret about Lemond's assertions.


"Greg's comments are unfortunate because Greg was an idol of mine, but was an idol of everybody in this race," he said. ... This isn't the first time. It's been four years that the shots have been lobbed across the Atlantic when we are over here trying to do good work. We've proven time in and time out that we were clean."


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## drewski711 (Apr 8, 2004)

Is ESPN showing this before or after they give him his ESPY for male athlete of the year and does he get a couple of "***'s" next to his ESPY?


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

*Greg was right.*

And another thing. Who's to say that Armstrong isn't still consulting with Dr. Ferrari? Jesus Manzano detailed couple months ago how drug use has gotten WORSE, not better, and how easy it is to beat the system. Manzano said that a rider could be doped for years on EPO without ever testing positive.

I was once a big supporter of Lance Armstrong, but all these allegations add up. Its equally ridiculous that people want to dismiss EVERYTHING anybody has to say if it has to do with Lance and drugs. From old teamates Greg Strock, Stephen Swart, and others, to the USPS team physiotherapist (whom people on this board called b*itch), to a former team physician with Motorola, USPS, whatever. Man NO WAY all these people are covertly tied into some devious plan to destroy cycling. No way.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*EPO use*

would be silly at this point. altitude chambers (which are legal) can be used to achieve the same effect. there are other ways to boost your RBC including the famous centrifuge techniqued used by the US in the Olympics. if these methods are used and the hematocrit level is below 50 is there a foul? if a rider uses epo to acheive this and is under 50 is there a foul? (only if the boosting agent is detected) so I think any rider with means (read $$) is either lazy or stupid to risk detection when they could use 'legal' (read : not making ethical comments) methods to do so


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## Live Steam (Feb 4, 2004)

Wow! After those statements I would like to be Lemonds lawyer. He should be working a lot of overtime defending his client from slander and numerous other charges. He has alleged criminal activity, aside from the doping. This could get interesting :O) I really have lost all respect for Lemond after reading your post. The dpoing charges were bad. The allegations of reprisal are even worse.


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## The Human G-Nome (Aug 26, 2002)

atpjunkie said:


> would be silly at this point. altitude chambers (which are legal) can be used to achieve the same effect. there are other ways to boost your RBC including the famous centrifuge techniqued used by the US in the Olympics. if these methods are used and the hematocrit level is below 50 is there a foul? if a rider uses epo to acheive this and is under 50 is there a foul? (only if the boosting agent is detected) so I think any rider with means (read $$) is either lazy or stupid to risk detection when they could use 'legal' (read : not making ethical comments) methods to do so


Yes, you can test for EPO and that's by measuring the hematocrit level. Cunego is one of the few riders out there who gets a "pass" since he has a "naturally high" hematocrit level. Armstrong's blood levels have always tested in range. Doesn't that tell you something? If his successes were based on taking EPO, then doesn't it stand to reason that without EPO he would have less success? And seeing that he is the most tested athlete on the planet and he is always clean then it stands to reason that he is not taking EPO as he wouldn't pass his blood test. How does this not add up for people? If you're on EPO then you fail blood tests. 

As for Lemond, he bases his assertions on nothing but hearsay. Have you ever heard that guy at a conference in person? He does nothing buy bash other riders. In fact, he still hasn't gotten over bashing Hinault. His main reasoning for LA's doping is his own accident. He says "I was never the same rider after my accident so Armstrong can't be either." Get it? His "scientific research" is based on comparing how his body repsonded to tradgedy in relation to LA. That's all he has. 

And as for the book, doesn't it tell you something when the only team doctor they can conjure up is one that wasn't even part of the team when LA and Bruyneel were there? That was the best they could do? If anything, it makes their argument look worse then if they had just not included him at all. Also, the amount of participants in this grand conspiracy is absolutely staggering. You mean to say ALL of LA's former teammates, ALL his helpers, ALL those close to him are in on the massive coverup? That adds up for people? These authors belong on the Art Bell Show and not on the front page of major newspapers and websites. The author's reputations are hardly spotless and they are known sensationalists. 

After all this, i'm still not sure whether he had doped, but there is certainly compelling evidence that he hasn't.


----------



## mgp (Feb 3, 2004)

This is getting so silly...  

Let's see, Manzano was doping out his ears. That's why he was winning everything.

Ullrich beat Lance in a time trial last year by almost 2 minutes. He must have been doping.

Mayo crushed everyone on L'Alpe Duez last year. He must have been doping.

Lance had to tell Heras to slow down in 2001. Heras must have been doping.

Tyler finished the TDF in 4th place with a broken collarbone. He must have been doping.

Tyler beat Lance by over a minute in the Ventoux time trial in the Dauphine. He must have been double-doping.

Mayo beat Lance by 2 minutes in the Ventoux time trial in the Dauphine. He must have been double-dog-doping.

David Millar was doping. That's why he was winning everything.

Lemond came back after a shotgun blast to the chest to win the TDF twice. And the Worlds. His first comeback involved gaining nearly a minute over Fignon in a 15 mile ITT against all odds. He doesn't believe in miracles, so he must have been doping.

Sorry for the stream of consciousness, but I had to crack a beer before getting on the web tonight.


----------



## thatsmybush (Mar 12, 2002)

Live Steam said:


> Hey I'm with you man. If you haven't been able to tell from my posts, I'm with you man. I don't think LA is doping. That was pretty much my point. This doctor never worked with LA or the team as it is now. What could he possibly know? He seems like someone trying to capitalize on something. He gets a TV nterview and more exposure. I'm not sure what good it will do him, but people are strage and will say or do things they normally wouldn't when put in the limelight. Clinton has a propensity for this. He tells tails that can be easily disproven, like seeing churches burn when he was growing up. It never happened. Why did he say it? Who the heck knows! :O)


STEAM you ROCK!!! You managed to slip a "C" word into a thread about Balco, Bonds, Armstrong and Lemond. Not only that you made it seem natural, obviously the work of a true artist. TAKE A BOW! 

/not sarcasm, duly impressed.


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## Fogdweller (Mar 26, 2004)

*Ho hum...*

If someone comes up with some proof or he finally admits to using EPO or some other enhancer, I'll despise him then. Until such time, I'll just go on not really caring about him one way or another.


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## Lazywriter (Mar 8, 2002)

*Human G Nome is the voice of REASON*

well said and you are correct about the tests and dead on about Greg Lemond being a whining bi$%ch







The Human G-Nome said:


> Yes, you can test for EPO and that's by measuring the hematocrit level. Cunego is one of the few riders out there who gets a "pass" since he has a "naturally high" hematocrit level. Armstrong's blood levels have always tested in range. Doesn't that tell you something? If his successes were based on taking EPO, then doesn't it stand to reason that without EPO he would have less success? And seeing that he is the most tested athlete on the planet and he is always clean then it stands to reason that he is not taking EPO as he wouldn't pass his blood test. How does this not add up for people? If you're on EPO then you fail blood tests.
> 
> As for Lemond, he bases his assertions on nothing but hearsay. Have you ever heard that guy at a conference in person? He does nothing buy bash other riders. In fact, he still hasn't gotten over bashing Hinault. His main reasoning for LA's doping is his own accident. He says "I was never the same rider after my accident so Armstrong can't be either." Get it? His "scientific research" is based on comparing how his body repsonded to tradgedy in relation to LA. That's all he has.
> 
> ...


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## The Human G-Nome (Aug 26, 2002)

Fogdweller said:


> If someone comes up with some proof or he finally admits to using EPO or some other enhancer, I'll despise him then. Until such time, I'll just go on not really caring about him one way or another.


In 2000, test results revealed that 45% of the peloton was doped with something or other. With hematocrit and hemoglobin testing, EPO is now easier to spot though and it is very doubtful that LA is taking EPO. First of all, he would fail his blood tests which means the UCI would then be taking urine samples which can further detect the presence of synthetic indicators of EPO use. In fact, LA has succumbed to these tests innumerable times and they have ALWAYS come up negative for EPO. If LA is doping, it is much more likely that he is taking something like perfluorocarbon emulsions, stabilized hemoglobin, or recombinant hemoglobin. These are much more difficult to detect and won't show up so readily with current testing.

I work at a transplant center and we prescribe EPO (ie, procrit) to our patient population with Kidney failure to elevate their hematocrit levels to normal levels. Our patients receive injections up to 3 times a week and elevated levels are seen within 2 weeks. However, if EPO were administered to someone who otherwise didn't need it, you would of course see elevated blood levels and out of range results which would last up to weeks long. If anyone is doping with EPO then it should be raising their EPO 3 to 4% and it will show up on tests. If they aren't doping, then it won't. The drug testing in the last couple years is actually quite strict and if anyone is doping, chances are it's not EPO. 

From a fan's perspective, it stands to reason that if a rider is riding VERY inconsistently (ie, inhuman one moment and mortal the next), maybe you can couple this with previous suspicians and start to wonder. Hasn't LA been the most consistent performer in the Tour for years? Isn't he also the most tested athlete? Personally, the EPO accusations dont' add up for me.


----------



## Lazywriter (Mar 8, 2002)

*People are idiots, I work in health care as well and a lot of my*

geriatric patients are on Procrit and I know first hand how a single injection can affect the blood levels. Most of the people here are reacting on a very gossipy level and are simply ignorant to the science behind it all. With Lance's history of cancer, I find it hard to believe that he would subject himself to the dangers of using EPO as it can thicken his blood and cause instant death. People need to understand the science rather than just spout off tidbits of gossip. G Nome knows of what he speaks and has more credibility in his posts than Lemond has with his conjecture.





The Human G-Nome said:


> In 2000, test results revealed that 45% of the peloton was doped with something or other. With hematocrit and hemoglobin testing, EPO is now easier to spot though and it is very doubtful that LA is taking EPO. First of all, he would fail his blood tests which means the UCI would then be taking urine samples which can further detect the presence of synthetic indicators of EPO use. In fact, LA has succumbed to these tests innumerable times and they have ALWAYS come up negative for EPO. If LA is doping, it is much more likely that he is taking something like perfluorocarbon emulsions, stabilized hemoglobin, or recombinant hemoglobin. These are much more difficult to detect and won't show up so readily with current testing.
> 
> I work at a transplant center and we prescribe EPO (ie, procrit) to our patient population with Kidney failure to elevate their hematocrit levels to normal levels. Our patients receive injections up to 3 times a week and elevated levels are seen within 2 weeks. However, if EPO were administered to someone who otherwise didn't need it, you would of course see elevated blood levels and out of range results which would last up to weeks long. If anyone is doping with EPO then it should be raising their EPO 3 to 4% and it will show up on tests. If they aren't doping, then it won't. The drug testing in the last couple years is actually quite strict and if anyone is doping, chances are it's not EPO.
> 
> From a fan's perspective, it stands to reason that if a rider is riding VERY inconsistently (ie, inhuman one moment and mortal the next), maybe you can couple this with previous suspicians and start to wonder. Hasn't LA been the most consistent performer in the Tour for years? Isn't he also the most tested athlete? Personally, the EPO accusations dont' add up for me.


----------



## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

atpjunkie said:


> would be silly at this point. altitude chambers (which are legal) can be used to achieve the same effect. there are other ways to boost your RBC including the famous centrifuge techniqued used by the US in the Olympics. if these methods are used and the hematocrit level is below 50 is there a foul? if a rider uses epo to acheive this and is under 50 is there a foul? (only if the boosting agent is detected) so I think any rider with means (read $$) is either lazy or stupid to risk detection when they could use 'legal' (read : not making ethical comments) methods to do so



OMG! Dude you need to tell David Millar and every pro cyclist out there that Hyperbaric chambers have been around for yeeears and are way better than EPO! Yeah, that's the ticket.


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

*Dr. Ferrari says EPO is safe.*



Lazywriter said:


> geriatric patients are on Procrit and I know first hand how a single injection can affect the blood levels. Most of the people here are reacting on a very gossipy level and are simply ignorant to the science behind it all. With Lance's history of cancer, I find it hard to believe that he would subject himself to the dangers of using EPO as it can thicken his blood and cause instant death. People need to understand the science rather than just spout off tidbits of gossip. G Nome knows of what he speaks and has more credibility in his posts than Lemond has with his conjecture.



OK, working in Health Care, doesn't make you an expert on EPO. Otherwise you'd be a doctor. And if you were a doctor who REALLY knew the intricacies of EPO, then your name would be Dr. Michelle Ferrari. Didn't Dr. Ferrari get nailed by the Italian police for provided EPO, HGH, and other drugs to cycling teams? Oops. I guess that is a point that the fans of Lance Armstrong's club like to leave out, since Armstrong has had multiple consultations with the good EPO doc.


----------



## Lazywriter (Mar 8, 2002)

*What flawed logic you got there*

Regardless of what you may think, there is no evidence of Lance doping other than people like you who want to believe he is. He is tested constantly and he is clean. How ignorant are you to keep wanting to find something wrong. Sounds like a lynch mob that wants to find something wrong and accepts no other explanation. Kinda like the Iraq debacle. Bush wanted any evidence to justify his actions and wouldn't stop until he was satisfied. Kinda like the way you are thinking. Your logic is seriously flawed and you have no credibility because you are incredibly biased so you should e quiet.





Manhattan said:


> OK, working in Health Care, doesn't make you an expert on EPO. Otherwise you'd be a doctor. And if you were a doctor who REALLY knew the intricacies of EPO, then your name would be Dr. Michelle Ferrari. Didn't Dr. Ferrari get nailed by the Italian police for provided EPO, HGH, and other drugs to cycling teams? Oops. I guess that is a point that the fans of Lance Armstrong's club like to leave out, since Armstrong has had multiple consultations with the good EPO doc.


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

*Passing a test doesn't mean you didn't cheat!*



Lazywriter said:


> He is tested constantly and he is clean. How ignorant are you to keep wanting to find something wrong.



How long have you been following this story? Countless riders have tested negative that have been busted and admitted to doping. Virenque, Pantani, Manzano, Millar, hell all the Festina boys, etc.. So answer that. How long have you followed this story? Did you realize that there have been riders such as these that not only passed the tests, but also were found guilty and admitted to doping? Hello? Well?

Like others have said, the tests are no where near foolproof. With regular bloodtests, you can check to see it an athlete is going too close to going over the legal limit. And you can back off the EPO meds. Simple as that. Yeah, yeah, you have to factor in clearance times and half-lifes and other crap, but its just a question of can you do the math.


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## mgp (Feb 3, 2004)

Oh man, Ricky the "scientist" imparts his knowledge again. Instead of sleeping through your "Biology for Acountants" class in college, you really should have paid attention.


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## BuenosAires (Apr 3, 2004)

*What's funny to me.......*

Is why, when the French Government did a 2 year investigation into the doping allegations against Armstrong and US Postal, none of these "scores"(about 3) of people came out with these statements? They turned over every stone and found nothing. NOTHING!


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

Credible evidence? I never said it was evidence, but you cannot overlook what ALL of these people are saying.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

*Bloodwork*

Anybody can walk down to their local doctor or clinic and get a bloodtest to see what their hematocrit is. Anybody! This isn't secret society stuff. The comments that this type of testing and whatever isn't available is just pure bull. Do this. GO to the doc, ask him for a regular bloodtest. A hematocrit profile is easily obtainable! Geez!


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## MaRider (Mar 21, 2002)

Manhattan said:


> And another thing. Who's to say that Armstrong isn't still consulting with Dr. Ferrari?


Dr. Ferrari is a regular contributor on www.cyclingnews.com.

I am a regular reader of www.cyclingnews.com

Therefore, I have a long-standing relationship with Dr. Ferrari - in fact by virtue of reading his articles on training, I am consulting with Dr. Ferrari (I even emailed cyclingnews.com with a training question once).

Ergo, I am a doper, guilty by association. 

Beeauuuutiful!


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## Duane Gran (Feb 3, 2004)

It would be polite of you, Stinky, to respond to some of the rebuttals you have seen here. I personally find it opportunistic that this stuff is being drug out during the tour. If there is any evidence, it will surface in a court room. I don't intend to purchase a book of innuendo and accusations to make up my mind about the matter.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

Live Steam said:


> http://www.velonews.com/race/tour2001/articles/1094.0.html
> 
> The above article is from 2001 Velonews.
> 
> He never worked with LA. Actually he never worked with any of the current team as it is composed including Johan Brunyeel <sp>! It seems to me the guy may have an axe to grind or is looking to somehow capitalize on this.



Dude, you didn't even read the page link that you posted?!?! The article is about Dr. Michele Ferrari, not Prentice Steffan who WAS a former team physician.


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## Spoiler (Jul 6, 2002)

Manhattan said:


> Yeah, but the thing is most of the Lance camp will NEVER believe that he could've ever done anything wrong. But in their eyes, Marion Jones, Barry Bonds and all the other sports stars are drugged up. It is a double standard. Maybe its a black/white thing. Maybe its a cycling/other spot thing. I don't know, but it's obvious that there is that presumption of guilt put on these other athletes that Lance is off-limits too.
> 
> And Russ is right. Just because you don't test positive for anything automatically mean that you are clean. Hell, in all your USCF races, how many times did you ever even pee into a cup?! And you think that all the Cat 1s and stuff are free from guilt? Man, Millar was just busted. He never tested positive. Virenque, Pantani, Manzano. etc. The ways around the tests are sooooo easy now. YOU CANNOT TEST FOR EPO! Period! Why do you think they test the hematocrit?!
> 
> The allegations are not new, but when a former team physician (USPS, Motorola, Nat'l Team, who cares), when a former team physician says something, then that is _serious stuff_. The man would not risk his own private practice for nothing. He has literally nothing to gain. No book sales. NADA! ZILCH! How long are you going to keep closing your eyes before you want to find out the real truth! Man, Greg was villified yesterday for speaking out! Why? Because the 'Lance is god camp' doesn't want to hear all sides of the story.


"But in their eyes, Marion Jones, Barry Bonds and all the other sports stars are drugged up."
Wrong. Show me where Lance's camp have accused these athletes of anything. You can't, so your last statement is completely make up by you. You're assuming the Lance camp thinks as irrationally as you do. 

"Hell, in all your USCF races, how many times did you ever even pee into a cup?! " 
Maybe I'm a bit thick, but what in the hell does this have to do with Lance, and how does this support your fantasy? 

"The allegations are not new, but when a former team physician (USPS, Motorola, Nat'l Team, who cares), when a former team physician says something, then that is _serious stuff_.

What did they say? Did you read the book? 

"it's obvious that there is that presumption of guilt put on these other athletes that Lance is off-limits too."

Off limits? How many times have Marion, Barry and others been found NOT GUILTY by French courts after investigations? How many times have Marion and Barry been tested compared to Lance? How many reporters are digging though Marion and Barry's garbage and hotel rooms? How many rumor books have been written about Marion and Barry?
You call this "off-limits"? 

I can only conclude that you believe Lance is guilty because he's winning. If he had finished 50th the last six years, you'd never raise a question. So WINNING is the only added factor convinceing you he's a doper. Lemond must have been doping to come back from surgery to win. Or is there an established limit to how many Tours EPO will win you? If you win three, you did it on your own. If you win five, you're a doper?


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## Jaybo (Mar 5, 2002)

*He is using drugs! No doubt....*



Stinky Hippie said:


> Dear Family, Friends, and Associates,
> 
> On Sunday, July 18 at 9:30 a.m. EST ESPN's "Outside the Lines" is
> devoting the program to the recently released French language book
> ...


He is using drugs! I would bet my house on it. What riders do at the Tour is freakish, and I don't believe they can do it without some help--at least at the times they are doing. I believe all the top riders are doing some sort of drugs. They just know how to hide it. 

Jaybo


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## supercrank (Feb 20, 2004)

*thoughts on EPO and Armstrong*

1) EPO testing immediately pre- and post-race is useless. The average red blood cell lives for about 120 days in the circulation, so any athlete who isn't a complete moron is going to stop injecting EPO weeks before competition.

2) The urine test uses electrophoresis to directly test for recombinant EPO but is limited by the relatively short half-life of EPO (approx 4-15 hrs). This results in a test which is good for 2-3 days, at best.

3) The blood tests utilize two different statistical models (ON and OFF) which take into account hemoglobin level, reticulocyte count, EPO level and serum transferrin receptor level. These values are then used to calculate scores which can be used to determine whether or not an athlete is currently using EPO or has recently used EPO. Unfortunately, as with any diagnostic test, you trade off test sensitivity for false-
positivity-- in order to maintain an acceptably low false positive rate (1 in 1000), sensitivity drops to approx 40-50% at 25 days after cessation of usage.

4) Living/training at altitude affects all of the above parameters in a manner identical to using exogenous EPO. Thus, the ON/OFF scores of athletes who live at altitude must be adjusted to avoid a higher false positive rate. The particulars in terms of degree of adjustment in relationship to the altitude and timing of living at altitude are not known.

conclusion: detecting EPO abuse is fraught with uncertainty-- it seems that the current system of testing has enough holes to allow a well-educated abuser to escape undetected.

That being said, I'll believe Armstrong is innocent until definitve proof to the contrary appears. As others have mentioned, the burden of proof is on the accusers in this case, as Lance has no way of proving his innocence. Personally, given his almost limitless resources and well-documented usage of an altitude tent, I believe that Lance is certainly capable of being able to level the playing field against dopers by exploiting every available legal method of improving performance.


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## Lifelover (Jul 8, 2004)

*? 4 Ricky2 and Manhatten*

What would it take for you to be convinced that LA is clean.

There are a number of things that could happen to convince those of us that now beleave he is clean that he is using. Confession, testing positive, being caught with some ot it, etc.

Is there anything that would convince you he is clean?

Negitive proof is impossible.

Which of you is the pedophile and which of you sells crack?


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## FatSlowGuy (Jul 17, 2004)

Jaybo,

Just because us regular riders will never reach that level of amazing, does not make it impossible. These guys train hard for it, there whole being is dedicated to it. If we could all do it there would be no point to any of it. I am sure there are things that you can do that others find amazing.


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## rendus (Jul 1, 2004)

Well the ESPN Outside the Lines episode about LA:confidential aired last night.....what kind of firestorm did it generate?


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## Trek_envy (Jun 15, 2004)

*Apparently.....*



rendus said:


> Well the ESPN Outside the Lines episode about LA:confidential aired last night.....what kind of firestorm did it generate?


Not much....


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

rendus said:


> Well the ESPN Outside the Lines episode about LA:confidential aired last night.....what kind of firestorm did it generate?



Plenty. Lots of new material. One thing that goes unpublished until ESPN aired it was the bad blood between Armstrong and Lemond. People on here assume that Lemond is bringing up this stuff and that he's started the beef with Armstrong. Not the case at all. Greg, admitted himself that he was critical of Dr. Ferrari long before Armstrong had even consulted with Dr. Ferrari. It was Armstrong who first called Greg and threatening him to shut up about Dr. Ferrari. That's how all this bad **** occurred. It was Lance being confrontational, not Lemond! And this is long before Greg had ever said anything about Armstrong. Its total bullshit. What Lance did was dispicable and the making Greg out to be a villain by the Lance Club members is wrong! Greg is right to stand up to him and not take the abusive late night threating legal action calls from Lance. Lance is waaaay more of a prick than the Lance Fan Club wants to admit. What a jerkoff Armstrong is!  The Lance Fan Club had the TV turned off last night because they could care less about the truth and finding out what really happened.


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## rendus (Jul 1, 2004)

bah!

so much for substantive information

I could care less about the Greg-Lance verbal feud.


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## TechniKal (Feb 26, 2004)

Stinky Hippie said:


> Dear Family, Friends, and Associates,
> 
> On Sunday, July 18 at 9:30 a.m. EST ESPN's "Outside the Lines" is
> devoting the program to the recently released French language book
> ...


What I find most interesting about this letter is that the doctor would mis-spell his own name. It's 'SteffEn' not 'SteffAn'.

http://www.teamhealthnet.com/team/prenticesteffen.html

Makes the entire letter suspect.

There's enough conjecture surrounding Lance and drug use that folks shouldn't have to resort to making up statements.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

TechniKal said:


> What I find most interesting about this letter is that the doctor would mis-spell his own name. It's 'SteffEn' not 'SteffAn'.
> 
> http://www.teamhealthnet.com/team/prenticesteffen.html
> 
> ...




YOU spelled it wrong. The man himself did not!


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*Millar*

would rather hang at sea level (Biarritz) go to discos and hump supermodels then spend the necessary time to do 'chamber work'. If you could 'see' beyond your anger tinted glasses the whole point is there are 'legal' ways to boost your blood and with all the investigations, etc.. a SMART and disciplined person would take that route. Millar has shown he has to be as dumb as a post to still be 'holding' while his team and himself are under investigation. The reality is EPO and it's new versions is the lazy persons 'out'. EPO (like most testoserone replacements) presence in the body causes the body to shut down or drastically reduce 'natural' EPO/RBC production. This is what leads to as Pantani's ex called EPO addiction as well as Marco's Hematocrit level going from 60 to the teens while he was in the hospital and 'magically' bouncing back afer he went under his team doctors.
my guess is Millar is/was an abuser and now 'needs' it which is what leads to such stupid/risky behavior accompanied by his whiny playboy laziness it all adds up.
Furthermore with so many other 'disgruntled employees' ie.. Roberto Heras, why hasn't he/they spilled any beans? it must be the entire team is Doped as this weekend they seemed to be the only ones able to maintain the pace. somehow with all this supposed systematic
doping they all seem to avoid conviction. nothing turns up in raids or tests so what are they just more sneaky than the boys of Festina? If so are you saying that American's and American backed teams are just smarter than their European competitors? 
As I've stated a zillion times I'm no LA superfan but all you haters are turning me that way.
when there's PROOF let's talk but since I'm sure your Cycling Idol is minutes down and crushed psychologically you have nothing but bile to spew.
If you don't have anything 'nice' to say, STFU.


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## Bocephus Jones (Feb 3, 2004)

atpjunkie said:


> would rather hang at sea level (Biarritz) go to discos and hump supermodels...


You say that like there's something wrong with it? Wouldn't we all want to do that?


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## TechniKal (Feb 26, 2004)

Ricky2 said:


> YOU spelled it wrong. The man himself did not!



Umm - yeah. I spelled it wrong. His current employer spelled it wrong, too:

http://www.teamhealthnet.com/team/prenticesteffen.html

Oo- look! He spells it wrong in his publications!

http://www.insidetri.com/train/tips/articles/1578.0.html

On no! It's spelled wrong at his own website!:

http://www.pdssportsmed.com/

Oh my - Sports Illustrated spelled it wrong as well!

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_game/alexander_wolff/news/2001/07/19/wolff_viewpoint/

It's even spelled wrong in 'LA Confidential', and we all know those authors don't make any mistakes...

http://www.supercycling.co.za/default(a).asp?var=3784&id=117966&des=article&cl=&scat=supercycling/bicycling&print=

So, the only place it's spelled right is in this post on this board. Maybe he changed his name an entered the witness protection program because he's afraid of reprecutions from the Lance mafia? It's funny how any posting online implicating Lance is factual, but anything that's questionable is bunk. You're more fanatical than the Lancophiles on this board.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

TechniKal said:


> Umm - yeah. I spelled it wrong. His current employer spelled it wrong, too:
> http://www.teamhealthnet.com/team/prenticesteffen.html
> Oo- look! He spells it wrong in his publications!
> http://www.insidetri.com/train/tips/articles/1578.0.html
> ...



You spelled his name wrong again. None of those other places did.


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## TechniKal (Feb 26, 2004)

Ricky2 said:


> You spelled his name wrong again. None of those other places did.


read the original post in this thread. The letter is signed 'Prentice Steffan' - not 'Prentice Steffen'. I haven't spelled his name anywhere.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

TechniKal said:


> read the original post in this thread. The letter is signed 'Prentice Steffan' - not 'Prentice Steffen'. I haven't spelled his name anywhere.



EXACTLY! Thanks for proving my point. You call that cut-and-paste text job a letter?  And it is not even signed! It has a name on there, but that is hardly a signature. Only a true Lance Fan Club Member would claim that! Somebody copied it or it was cut and pasted.


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## Marcus75 (Feb 17, 2004)

Manhattan said:


> It's becoming harder to believe that Lance is telling the truth. First, there were the tests and teamates, then the book and the physiotherapist who says she made the drug deliveries. And now a former team physician?! I just think its highly unlikely that ALL of these people are somehow involved in some secret plot to get money. Man, the cards are totally stacked against Lance.
> 
> This same type of accusations surfaced at the recall election of the California Governor. Weeks before the election, Los Angeles Times (VERY LIBERAL PAPER) published articles accusing Arnold of harassing women years ago obviously in a attempt to derail his election bid. Of course the democrats (opposition) jumped on this issue without really questioning the merit of the articles. The rest you know what happened. To this day they haven't found any merit to these allegations.
> 
> My point is this seem sensational or just out of jealously! GO LANCE!!!


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## Marcus75 (Feb 17, 2004)

These are all jadded former associates who have an axe to grind with Lance and their purpose is to persuade gullible people like yourself! WHERE ARE THE FACTS?


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## TechniKal (Feb 26, 2004)

Ricky2 said:


> EXACTLY! Thanks for proving my point. You call that cut-and-paste text job a letter?  And it is not even signed! It has a name on there, but that is hardly a signature. Only a true Lance Fan Club Member would claim that! Somebody copied it or it was cut and pasted.


But you believe the parts of it that support your argument, no? Those parts were obviously copied accurately, yet the signature line was not.

I think there's a lot of evidence out there than Lance has doped. I think this letter is bunk, though. And, again, I think you're more jaded and blind in your convictions than any of the Lance fans that have posted. You lose any credibility with your arguments bacause of that.


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## Ricky2 (Apr 7, 2004)

TechniKal said:


> But you believe the parts of it that support your argument, no? Those parts were obviously copied accurately, yet the signature line was not.
> 
> I think there's a lot of evidence out there than Lance has doped. I think this letter is bunk, though. And, again, I think you're more jaded and blind in your convictions than any of the Lance fans that have posted. You lose any credibility with your arguments bacause of that.



OK, so NOW you admit that it finally wasn't a signature.  Do some homework. Then come back with something useful. Have you even tried Yahoo or Google to search for this? If, you did you would've found it instead of pretending that, "oh my god people, look he mispelled his name."  Weak, very weak. Pay up. Your Lance Club membership fees are due.


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## 97 Teran (Feb 17, 2004)

*A little poem*

My oh my
The trolls they are
voracious
in July


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## TechniKal (Feb 26, 2004)

Ricky2 said:


> OK, so NOW you admit that it finally wasn't a signature.  Do some homework. Then come back with something useful. Have you even tried Yahoo or Google to search for this? If, you did you would've found it instead of pretending that, "oh my god people, look he mispelled his name."  Weak, very weak. Pay up. Your Lance Club membership fees are due.


No credibility, no logic. You are a troll.


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## theFE (Jul 10, 2004)

I loved the 4th grade. Glad we can still take a few classes time and again.


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## danielc (Oct 24, 2002)

*My 2 cents*

I'm a real huge Lance fan. But i have to admit that after watching the ESPN brief with Lemond and all, reading stuff on the web, i have some doubts if Lance has always been drug free. Who know's..maybe in his younger days (pre-cancer) he was involved in doping but is clean now..I don't know. I just cannot believe that there is a conspiracy from independent sources trying to take him down with false allegations. 
For one thing, I think that Lemond might have doped hence the reason why he's so adamant that Lance is too. Nobody is perfect, and as a fan, I would just like to learn the truth and have things out in the open. 
At the same time though, i fear it may never come to that since Lance is such a huge global marketing icon and whenever a lot of money is involved, things sort of 'dissappear'. Does 
Does anyone know if that book will even be published in the US?


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