# Best climbing wheel??



## creekchub (Feb 7, 2009)

I have a pair if Mavic ksyrium sl right now, no complaints.. I guess I'm just bored and would like to try something different. Is 200g, and ceremic bearings a noticeable difference in wheels?

I'd like to stay @ the $1500 range if possible... Any advice? 

Thanks, Dave


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## danl1 (Jul 23, 2005)

creekchub said:


> I have a pair if Mavic ksyrium sl right now, no complaints.. I guess I'm just bored and would like to try something different. Is 200g, and ceremic bearings a noticeable difference in wheels?
> 
> I'd like to stay @ the $1500 range if possible... Any advice?
> 
> Thanks, Dave


Ceramic: No.

200g: Likely noticeable in feel, perhaps not in outcome. Weight is weight, and 200g is a pretty small fraction of total weight, which even straight up hill is a smaller portion of total workload than most imagine. So while by the math it will make some small difference, that difference will, practically speaking, be masked by all of the other things that can change day-to-day. That's not a reason not to "upgrade", just to say not to expect it to make a dramatic difference.

And, worth paying attention to aerodynamics. It's easy enough to chase a few grams and cost yourself more overall workload, even for 'climbing' wheels. 

Others may have specific suggestions, but in general, something like a low-profile carbon tubular sounds like the 'ideal' direction - unless your version of ideal doesn't include tubbies, which mine certainly does not.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

200 grams do make a slight difference for wheels

it's about rotational inertia with all things being equal (in terms of wheels)


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## xjbaylor (Dec 28, 2006)

creekchub said:


> I have a pair if Mavic ksyrium sl right now, no complaints.. I guess I'm just bored and would like to try something different. Is 200g, and ceremic bearings a noticeable difference in wheels?
> 
> I'd like to stay @ the $1500 range if possible... Any advice?
> 
> Thanks, Dave


Danl1 gave good advice, as usual, but we could still use more information. Weight and what area you live it would be a good start. Are you okay with the idea of carbon clinchers? Tubular wheels? Custom builds?

There are a lot of fantastic options out there, you just need to narrow down which of those is the best for you.


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## Fireform (Dec 15, 2005)

I just picked up a pair of Zipp 202 tubulars for $1200. Never had tires on them. I'd be looking for a deal like that.


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## creekchub (Feb 7, 2009)

Thanks guys! I live in western Pa.. So hills are a every ride occurrence, I weigh @ 190 lb. Still chasing that 10-15 lbs.  I would like to stick to clinchers, I guess I just look at the flats aspect, i guess now that I think about it, do you see more or less flats in tubular vs. Clinchers???


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## xjbaylor (Dec 28, 2006)

creekchub said:


> Thanks guys! I live in western Pa.. So hills are a every ride occurrence, I weigh @ 190 lb. Still chasing that 10-15 lbs.  I would like to stick to clinchers, I guess I just look at the flats aspect, i guess now that I think about it, do you see more or less flats in tubular vs. Clinchers???


Generally you will have fewer flats with tubulars, but more hassle if you do have one. If unsure, you should probably stick to clinchers.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

You can find great rims for about half the cost of a $1500 rims and still be within 25 grams per wheel of a more expensive rim.

My example is just that, an example, but here's a rim with fairly good aerodynamic profile yet light enough for climbing, the total weight and price includes skewers but not the cluster. See: CUSTOM WHEEL BUILDING PROGRAM you pick it we build it PROWHEELBUILDER This is simply a Kinlin set of rims with White Industry H2 and H3 hubs, laced with Sapim CX Ray spokes, with alloy nipples, laced in the front with 24 spoke in a 2 cross pattern and on the rear using 28 spokes and a 3 cross pattern. Total weight is 1461 grams and cost is $706 for the set not including shipping.

I'm sure someone else can come up with a better idea for rims, this was just the fast (and cheaper) route for me to do as an example.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

tubular = no worries about pinch flats

being around the 190 lb mark, many of the lower spoke count wheels won't be suitable. 

stronger wheels, are usually heavier. to get something lighter than the Kysrium SL will be a challenge


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## jnbrown (Dec 9, 2009)

Wheels don't do the climbing, your legs do.
Unless your wheels are heavy (yours are not) it probably won't make any difference.
Nothing wrong with wanting something new and maybe lighter but you should realize it won't make you go up hills faster.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

tednugent said:


> being around the 190 lb mark, many of the lower spoke count wheels won't be suitable.


190 pounds is not all that much, racing wheels are rated for around 165 pound limit, but standard training and street wheels generally are rated for 200 to 220 depending on manufacture. But you are correct though, because the more one weighs the more spokes that should be on a wheel. The Kinlin's I suggested can have as many as 32 spokes per rim, go to the web site to see. Aero profile wheels do not need as many spokes as a non-aero wheel. Having said that I still wouldn't ride on a 16 spoke aero wheel and I weigh 160, I just don't think that low spoke count wheels are good thing to use on city streets and county roads on a daily basis.


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## bikerjohn64 (Feb 9, 2012)

jnbrown said:


> Wheels don't do the climbing, your legs do.
> Unless your wheels are heavy (yours are not) it probably won't make any difference.
> Nothing wrong with wanting something new and maybe lighter but you should realize it won't make you go up hills faster.


+1^
Your SL's are very nice wheels; stiff and durable. 
Trying to knock off 200 grams in wheels are easy with your budget. 
However; here is the kicker. Where is that 200 gram savings coming from? 
Ideally you would want to it to come off from the outer most perimeter. Tires, tubes, rim and nipples. 
Weight savings in hub, axle and skewers mean very little once the bike is up to speed. 
So unless you know exactly how and where the wheelsets are lighter its a hard call.


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

Considering your body weight, I think you will find it difficult to find another wheelset that is 200 grams lighter than Ksyrium SL's and still hold up to a 190lb. rider AND be under $1500. Ksyriums weigh about 1480 grams, so we are talking a 1200 gram wheelset. Not going to happen.


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## itsjon (Nov 4, 2005)

I recently switched to Fulcrum Racing Zeros from Ksyrium SLs, the Fulcrums seem to transmit a little less road buzz and I don't notice any difference on a technical downhill. Not a lot of difference though.


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

nightfend said:


> Ksyriums weigh about 1480 grams, so we are talking a 1200 gram wheelset. Not going to happen.


I think it would actually be pretty doable. Extralite SX hubs laced to XR200s in a 20/28 count would be sub 1200.


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## ergott (Feb 26, 2006)

I wouldn't recommend that for a 190lb rider. The XR200s are pretty soft in my opinion.

I will go ahead and tell the OP that his wheels don't weigh 1480g like previously mentioned. They weigh more like 1600g or more.
Weight Weenies - Road Wheels

You can do better and in your budget. Just don't expect to suddenly drop you mates that you could barely hang on to before the upgrade.

All the talk about "climbing" wheels. What percentage of your riding time is spent on steep climbs?


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

ergott said:


> I will go ahead and tell the OP that his wheels don't weigh 1480g like previously mentioned. They weigh more like 1600g or more.


Uh, no. The SL's they show in that chart are the REALLY old ones. The new SL's are basically slightly updated Ksyrium ES's and they weigh less than 1500 grams.


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## ergott (Feb 26, 2006)

Even the Ksyrium ES that were weighed there are over 1500 (1529g). That's an improvement, but Mavic is notorious for lower claimed than actual weights. I'll believe they are under 1500g when I see them on a scale. I did a search online and found nothing on recent wheels. I do remember a period when their rims were cracking prematurely and the rim weights went up a bit.

Lots of companies do it so I'm not just calling out Mavic.


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

No doubt wheel weight varies. Hey I'm not a fan of Ksyriums really. In any case, I'm fairly sure his wheelset is in the 1500 gram range. Also, there are no rimstrips with Ksyriums, which helps a little.

In any case, my original point stands. I don't think the OP is going to find a 1200 gram wheelset for $1500 that will be made for his weight.

Even a top quality build like a 20/28 kinlin 270 wheelset with cx-rays and something like Tune or Elf/Orc hubs would still be in the 1300-1400 gram range.

To get a superlight wheel build, he would need to go with carbon rims, and that gets pricey.


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## ergott (Feb 26, 2006)

nightfend said:


> Even a top quality build like a 20/28 kinlin 270 wheelset with cx-rays and something like Tune or Elf/Orc hubs would still be in the 1300-1400 gram range.
> 
> To get a superlight wheel build, he would need to go with carbon rims, and that gets pricey.


I agree completely.


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## ericm979 (Jun 26, 2005)

nightfend said:


> To get a superlight wheel build, he would need to go with carbon rims, and that gets pricey.


Unless he also goes to tubulars, carbon rims won't be lighter than aluminium rims. The lightest carbon clinchers I have seen are in the 385g range. Stans 340 rims are lighter than that. Or were- and the new ones are still in that range. 


The OP is not going to be beating his buddies that were dropping him up the climbs even if his wheels weighed 0 grams. There's just not that much difference in a set of wheels compared to body + bike weight. And of course you're not beating anyone up a climb if you're stuck at the bottom with a broken wheel.


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## ergott (Feb 26, 2006)

ericm979 said:


> Unless he also goes to tubulars, carbon rims won't be lighter than aluminium rims. The lightest carbon clinchers I have seen are in the 385g range. Stans 340 rims are lighter than that. Or were- and the new ones are still in that range.


There's a world of difference between a 385g carbon clincher and a 385g alloy clincher. Corima Winium clincher is stated at 390g (don't know actual). I'd be much more inclined to build something for a 190lb rider with those than with alloy rims of that weight.


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## stoked (Aug 6, 2004)

what do you guys recommend for a 160lbs rider as climbing alloy brake surface clincher wheels? I am doing an event with 62000 ft of climbing in the Alps and thinking of getting a new wheelset. 7900 c24 CL OEM is at top of my list which is around $800 now. Currently I have 2 carbon clincher wheelsets. I am a good descender with MTB background but I am worried about a rainy day or overheating the sidewalls on carbons during many 10+ mile descents with hairpins.


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## slegros (Sep 22, 2009)

stoked said:


> what do you guys recommend for a 160lbs rider as climbing alloy brake surface clincher wheels? I am doing an event with 62000 ft of climbing in the Alps and thinking of getting a new wheelset. 7900 c24 CL OEM is at top of my list which is around $800 now. Currently I have 2 carbon clincher wheelsets. I am a good descender with MTB background but I am worried about a rainy day or overheating the sidewalls on carbons during many 10+ mile descents with hairpins.


I do a lot of hillclimbs here in Japan, and encounter the exact conditions you mention: long descents in the rain. To add to it they often pace you down with a motorbike forcing you to ride your brakes all the way down.....

The Dura-Ace C24s are a great choice, and many here use them for hillclimbs.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

stoked said:


> what do you guys recommend for a 160lbs rider as climbing alloy brake surface clincher wheels? I am doing an event with 62000 ft of climbing in the Alps and thinking of getting a new wheelset. 7900 c24 CL OEM is at top of my list which is around $800 now. Currently I have 2 carbon clincher wheelsets. I am a good descender with MTB background but I am worried about a rainy day or overheating the sidewalls on carbons during many 10+ mile descents with hairpins.


Go back and read post #8 that's what I would recommend, of course there are other alternatives just as good, but price, weight, wheel quality, and aerodynamics are there on that one wheel.


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

The Dura-Ace are nice wheels, especially at your weight.


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## stoked (Aug 6, 2004)

froze said:


> Go back and read post #8 that's what I would recommend, of course there are other alternatives just as good, but price, weight, wheel quality, and aerodynamics are there on that one wheel.


Thnx for the recommendation. I looked at 22mm XR200 and they are listed at 385g. 30mm xr300 are listed as 465g. I think C24 rims are around 385g.16 spoke c24 front wheel will be more aero than 24spoke xr200. I am not considering xr300 due to extra rotational weight of 160g on most outer part of the wheel where weight savings count. 

I have a nice wheelset (Carbonsports Lightweight IIIC) but in the rain braking is very scary on a 10%+ descent even compared to my reynolds carbon clinchers. They also howl on a 4 mile dry mountain descent from heat.


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## gordy748 (Feb 11, 2007)

I'm 175 lbs and my good wheels are carbon tubbies, Easton EC90 slx with 20/ 24 spokes and DT240 hubs. Reckon they're less than 1,300 grams and they hold me up with no problems.


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## c_h_i_n_a_m_a_n (Mar 3, 2012)

stoked said:


> ... I looked at 22mm XR200 and they are listed at 385g. 30mm xr300 are listed as 465g. I think C24 rims are around 385g.16 spoke c24 front wheel will be more aero than 24spoke xr200. I am not considering xr300 due to extra rotational weight of 160g on most outer part of the wheel where weight savings count ...


Have a look at the XR19W. About 400 - 415g depending on the no of holes. 24 or 28.


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