# Michelin Pro3 Race vs Vittoria Open Corsa CX



## cavinsoo (Apr 2, 2008)

*Michelin Pro3 Race vs Vittoria Open Corsa Evo CX*

Has anyone tried both of these tires? I need to get a new set of tires and would really love to try both. But I can't have both. I just need to pick one. I don't care how much they cost. I just want to know which one is more comfortable, and faster. Puncture resistance may not be that important to me. The roads that I ride on are very clean.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

cavinsoo said:


> Has anyone tried both of these tires? I need to get a new set of tires and would really love to try both. But I can't have both. I just need to pick one. I don't care how much they cost. I just want to know which one is more comfortable, and faster. Puncture resistance may not be that important to me. The roads that I ride on are very clean.


Evo CX is a bit more supple, but the Pro 3 is faster with a bit more punture protection.

I use both and it's a bit of a toss up. Right now I am riding the Pro 3 more.
Then again I love the CX line in clincher and tubular form.

if you like a tire with that very fien tread, then go Evo CX. Smooth Pro 3.
Bit more RR? Pro 3
More supple and slighty smoother tire, Evo CX.

French or Italian? 

I will say the pro3 is about the best clincher I have tired yet, besides the CX. It's 1a and 1b for me.


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## terzo rene (Mar 23, 2002)

Pro3 and that's tough for an italophile to say. Ultimately I don't like the way CX behave in corners, they are a little unpredictable and break loose without warning too often. Something a recent Tour test also noted.


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## Travis (Oct 14, 2005)

gotta agree with DB, I think the CX's ride more comfortable and just seem to track better than the P3R's. I am riding the P3Rs right now and they are fine and I haven't had a flat as of yet. The CX's cut very easily, I am lucky to get 1K out of them before they start looking bad enough I change them.
When I started riding the P3R's I first found them kind of squirrly feeling and I thought they were going to be a major let down coming off the CX's that I loved. But they settled in and ride fine now.


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## eldarko (Oct 27, 2007)

Does anyone have pics of the red/grey/black tires on their bike??


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## kacomess (Jun 7, 2008)

*For what it's worth...*

I had a pair of Michelin Pro 3 tires mounted on Campagnolo Scirocco rims on my Z3c. The effort to place them was significant. I rode them about 200 miles before a piece of glass sliced the rear tire open, leaving a 4mm through-and-through gash. I ordered a replacement and, despite two hours of concentrated effort, was simply unable to mount the tire on those rims or on Bontrager Race Lites. While the ride was good, durability is substandard and at least one of these is either defective or so damn tight it's not worth the trouble. I'm going back to Vittoria Diamante Pro.


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## 99trek5200 (Jan 26, 2007)

kacomess said:


> I had a pair of Michelin Pro 3 tires mounted on Campagnolo Scirocco rims on my Z3c. The effort to place them was significant. I rode them about 200 miles before a piece of glass sliced the rear tire open, leaving a 4mm through-and-through gash. I ordered a replacement and, despite two hours of concentrated effort, was simply unable to mount the tire on those rims or on Bontrager Race Lites. While the ride was good, durability is substandard and at least one of these is either defective or so damn tight it's not worth the trouble. I'm going back to Vittoria Diamante Pro.


Why do you say durability is substandard? Running over glass will cut most any tire.


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## master2129 (Mar 30, 2007)

I actually use both tires pretty consistently. I have the Vittora's on my Powertap wheelset and they have been great training tires. I have over 1700 miles on them and 2 seasons without a flat. 

I currently race on the Michelin Pro3's and absolutely love them. They spin up really fast and I can maintain an very resepctable avg speed at tempo with very little perceived exhaustion. For me its a toss up. I like them both very much and have never flatted on them yet.


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## kacomess (Jun 7, 2008)

*Durability*

I made the comment on durability of the tire relative to the claims made for it in this regard (see, for example, the test reports on rouesartisanales.com), not necessarily relative to other tires in it's class. The low thread/sq-in count and lack of a Kevlar or similar puncture resistant belt made me a bit apprehensive about the tire for routine use, but I'm going to try again, anyhow. I am still frustrated by the immense difficulty required to place the Pro 3 on Campy rims, especially in comparison to Vittoria tires.

KAC


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## steel515 (Sep 6, 2004)

Does today's Open Corsa CX 23mm measure 23mm?
My old Open cx appears 22mm. 

To the person asking for comparison (in my limited experience) I think Open CX is better straight line/training and Pro Race better for corners/racing.
Both of these better than Rubino/Diamante pro, rating 2/5. http://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/wheels/tires-clincher/vittoria/PRD_291971_2489crx.aspx#reviews


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## Roadplay (Jan 2, 2007)

Check out this months Bicycling mag. They have a comparative write-up on four tires; Pro3, Vittoria Pro Light, GP 4000 and Bontrager Race X Lite. Maybe you can find the write-up on their web site, I'm not sure if it works that way.


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## thinkcooper (Jan 5, 2005)

We have a detailed review of the Michelin Pro 3 here on RBR.


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## Bertrand (Feb 1, 2005)

When I bought a used set of wheels they had Open Corsas mounted on them. Supposedly, they had about 500 miles on them, which I judged to be accurate, based on the condition of the wheels and the honesty of the seller. 

On my first ride I had four flats in 15 km. I came home and threw them in the garbage. And I like Vittoria tires. I've ridden Diamante Pro Lights and Rubino Pros, and I've found them both way more durable than the Open Corsas. The Rubinos are very durable and the Diamantes were less durable, but had a great feel.


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## filtersweep (Feb 4, 2004)

Four flats in 15 km? Well, that certainly settles it. So I will counter with my Open Corsas with thousands of kilometers on them--- and never a flat (true), thereby canceling out your negative opinion.  I like Open Corsas---- view them as a durable Veloflex Pave.

Please keep in mind that every used wheel set has only 500 miles on it.



 Bertrand said:


> When I bought a used set of wheels they had Open Corsas mounted on them. Supposedly, they had about 500 miles on them, which I judged to be accurate, based on the condition of the wheels and the honesty of the seller.
> 
> On my first ride I had four flats in 15 km. I came home and threw them in the garbage. And I like Vittoria tires. I've ridden Diamante Pro Lights and Rubino Pros, and I've found them both way more durable than the Open Corsas. The Rubinos are very durable and the Diamantes were less durable, but had a great feel.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

rode both tires. The Vittoria's were the smoother riding. The Michelins were cheaper. the Michelins seemed like they needed to be warmed up before they would quiet down. Both can be had from Probikekit.com The Vittoria Diamante pro lights are cheaper, have 220 tpi, just as durable and weigh less, better tire.


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## lawrence (May 17, 2005)

I have the Vittoria Corsa EVO CX and they ride great, very fast, but wear wear wear fast. Did I tell you that they wear fast! Not great for puncture resistance either. I put a heavy duty tube in them and when they are worn out, they are gone out of my life permanently.

I have the Michelin Pro Race 2 and though not high wearing tires, they wear much much better than the Corsas and are better for puncture resistance.


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## plpete (Oct 21, 2008)

here is a pic of my red/grey/black tires


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## desmo13 (Jun 28, 2006)

I must be doing something way wrong... Conti's, Pro3's.. all of them.. flats all the time.
Maybe because I live where the urbania head a head on collision with green acres. But nails, sheetrock screws, glass, thorns... deposits from the daily fender benders... someone in our group has a flat every ride, if not every other ride.

And to be on topic, I ordered my new bike, and going to try the Vittorias this time.


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## akrafty1 (Apr 10, 2006)

I run the Vittoria Corsas, smooooooth as butta! I have not had any flats but they are gonna happen no matter what tire you run. I think flats are more a product of how and where you ride than what tire you run.

They were a pain to mount when new but now everything has broken in and I am in love. Now I want a set of Paves for my rain wheels...


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## backinthesaddle (Nov 22, 2006)

Guys who b*tch about a tire because they get several flats in a short span with the same tire should be b*tching about themselves, as it's an operator error. Either the rim strip is junk or the tube was pinched slightly when installing the tire after a flat or there's a burr on the rim. 
I've ridden all of the tires discussed in this thread and have gotten the LEAST amount of flats on Open Corsas. The tpi is 290 (320 now) for pete's sake. That means the carcass is woven TIGHTER than a lower tpi tire and therefore won't let stuff through. It also means that the tire is more supple and should roll right over road debris.
The Vitts are far better riding, turning and feeling than all of the tires discussed here, bar the Veloflex Paves. Mich PR3s are horrible. They ride like crap, they wash in hard turns and they are baloney skin thin. Mich PR2 and Conti GP4000S are very similar and are good for training tires. I've been through three sets of OC CX tires since April...and used the same two latex tubes...since APRIL! That's right! Zero flats on the Vitts in almost 8000 miles...!!!!!
Sometimes I wonder if people air their tires up before every ride. If your tires are at 75 pounds and your run over a big rock or shard of glass, you are going to get a flat a lot of the time, period.
Air your tires, check them for any damage once a week or so and check your rims for any issues. I love it when folks show up for a ride and I see a cut in their tire with visible tube winking at me. You get a flat with sh*t and I'm leaving you out in the country.


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## busaguy (Nov 15, 2008)

plpete said:


> here is a pic of my red/grey/black tires


gotta say that your bike is just not nice but super nice,what is polska in the pic mean?


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## busaguy (Nov 15, 2008)

should evaluate tires on performance only excluding flats as alot of riders are careless as far as ridin over lots of crap in the street


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## ProRoad (Oct 13, 2008)

I race on corsa cx exclusively, track and road. they feel amazing.. so soft and smooth.

Lately I have flatted so much on them that I train on the michelin Pro race and now I dont flat as much..
B


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## steel515 (Sep 6, 2004)

*pr3 vs open corsa*



ProRoad said:


> I race on corsa cx exclusively, track and road. they feel amazing.. so soft and smooth.
> 
> Lately I have flatted so much on them that I train on the michelin Pro race and now I dont flat as much..
> B


I don't think a fair comparison as I think pro races can be found cheaper and they are different design (internal& external).


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## jmlapoint (Sep 4, 2008)

I use the Michelin Pro3Race.
They roll well, and corner nicely.
Seem to be very durable on clean roads, and minimal flats using regular butyl tubes.


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## heathb (Nov 1, 2008)

Forget either of those tires. I've used them both and while they work well enough if you want to get a tire that will wear well and race well than go with Continental Grand Prix 4000S the all black tires. They are usually a little more expensive. 

As far as I'm concered the 4000S is one of the best clincher race tires on the market.


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## smokey0066 (Mar 6, 2006)

I used gp4000s last season.. i just picked up a set of pro3 race. boy am i excited for the spring..


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## plpete (Oct 21, 2008)

busaguy said:


> gotta say that your bike is just not nice but super nice,what is polska in the pic mean?


Thank you for the compliment on the bike  I dont see the word polska anywhere in the picture but i think you might be referring to the file name or link to my photobucket. Polska means Poland (where im from) and its part of my username.

As for the tires I haven't put on any miles on them since its freezing cold here in PA but i think as long as you are careful while riding and keep the tires inflated properly flats should not be a problem. I rode a whole season on specialized mondo tires that came with the bike without one flat and that includes riding on small gravel when connecting trails.


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## RotatingShifts (Nov 12, 2006)

filtersweep said:


> Four flats in 15 km? Well, that certainly settles it.


There are many reasons why a given tire could have that many flats in such a short time, including:

1. The tube caught between the tire and rim.
2. The offending glass or staple or whatever remaining in the tire.
3. The debris on the road especially offensive and numerous,
4. etc, etc, etc.

This tire wouldn't sell for $0.15 if it flatted that often.


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## Oldteen (Sep 7, 2005)

Gotta agree that 4 flats in 15k is weird. Even for a relatively delicate tire like the Open Corsa. OTOH- no question in my mind that not all tires have same durability, even with same rider, pressure, & road conditions. More durable tires reduce, but do not eliminate, the chance for flats. It's all about finding your preferred balance in a tire (e.g. smoothness, rolling resistance, cornering, durability, treadwear, cost).


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## hanover (Jan 10, 2009)

According to http://www.biketechreview.com/tires/images/AFM_tire_testing_rev8.pdf, the Pro2 has a slightly lower Crr than the CX, and the Pro3 should have an even lower Crr. Howerver, this is on a smooth roller. With the CX's higher TPI, it's likely a wash on an typical road surface, unless you're lucky enough to ride on fresh blacktop all the time.


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## al0 (Jan 24, 2003)

Conti 4000S or 4000(black), they beat hands down both models mentioned by you in every catgegory - rolling resistance, cornering grip - dry and wet and so on. According to test by German TOUR-magazine (August 2008).


cavinsoo said:


> Has anyone tried both of these tires? I need to get a new set of tires and would really love to try both. But I can't have both. I just need to pick one. I don't care how much they cost. I just want to know which one is more comfortable, and faster. Puncture resistance may not be that important to me. The roads that I ride on are very clean.


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## hanover (Jan 10, 2009)

al0 said:


> Conti 4000S or 4000(black), they beat hands down both models mentioned by you in every catgegory - rolling resistance, cornering grip - dry and wet and so on. According to test by German TOUR-magazine (August 2008).


According to the link I posted, the Conti has nearly the highest rolling resistence, much higher than either of the two tires the OP asked about. Do you have a link to the German article? I'd like to read it.


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## al0 (Jan 24, 2003)

And according to tests by TOUR magazine (2008/08) that I have mentioned by following conditions - 85 kg rider, 7.5 bar pressure, 35 kph, 104 g butyl tube, measurment in the lab - rolling resistance is for

GrandPrix 4000S 34.1 watt
Pro3 Race 39.1 watt
Cornering speed (wet, 12.5 m radius, on road by test rider)

GrandPrix 4000S 36.9 kph
Pro3 Race 31.7 kph
Sorry, I was wrong Open Corsa was not in this test set, it was tested somewhat year earlier (along with Pro2 Race), I do not have results on hands right now, but it as well has lost to GP 4000S.



hanover said:


> According to http://www.biketechreview.com/tires/images/AFM_tire_testing_rev8.pdf, the lower Crr. Howerver, this is on a smooth roller. With the CX's higher TPI, it's likely a wash on an typical road surface, unless you're lucky enough to ride on fresh blacktop all the time.


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## backinthesaddle (Nov 22, 2006)

Hmmm...
A German mag touting the benefits of a German made product over those from France and Italy...go figure...


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## ciclisto (Nov 8, 2005)

*used both*

use open corsas for years and like them but had lots of flats but now (this year) hvaen't had any. Tried the Michelin pro3 and they are nice tires very light and a little slicker than the corsas but also smooth tread. I like them both but if I had to give one up I would stick with the Corsa they ride great and weight only a little more. A very good alternative is the Vittoria Diamante Pro they are cheaper have more tread and ride the same.


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## ciclisto (Nov 8, 2005)

*New Mavic Elites 09*

The new Elites are supposed to be only 1540 grms which only slightly heavier than than the ES Etc. I would like to upgrade to these as I am looking for new lighter wheels, I was looling at R-SYS but nix that(recall) anyone have an opinion on these or used them? As always info appreciated. Also info on where to get a good price. Must be the "09 though, the older ones not interested.


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## al0 (Jan 24, 2003)

Unfounded - they publish tire tests regularly and GP4000 was a 1st Conti tire rated high, in all previous tests non-German tires have won. And BTW other German tires was tested as well (Schwalbe) and never was rated exceptionally high.

So their testing looks rather unbiased. 



backinthesaddle said:


> Hmmm...
> A German mag touting the benefits of a German made product over those from France and Italy...go figure...


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## hanover (Jan 10, 2009)

OK, I guess it comes down to whether you believe TOUR or biketechreivew.com, since the results are directly opposite each other.


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## backinthesaddle (Nov 22, 2006)

al0 said:


> Unfounded - they publish tire tests regularly and GP4000 was a 1st Conti tire rated high, in all previous tests non-German tires have won. And BTW other German tires was tested as well (Schwalbe) and never was rated exceptionally high.
> 
> So their testing looks rather unbiased.


Really...
Do you not think that Conti advertises with Tour magazine? Do you think that, even if the tires had the same Crr, Conti would want their newest and 'best' tire to come out on top of the test?

C'mon...the only way to get unbiased testing from a magazine is to stop that magazine from accepting ad revenue from the very products they are testing. And that just ain't gonna happen...


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