# Van Dessel Bikes...



## mklien (Dec 30, 2007)

I do not see much talk about this "boutique brand." Looks like they have some nice frames, especially the solstice...anybody use them or have any comments about them?

thanks


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## FatTireFred (Jan 31, 2005)

van dessel is a "boutique brand"??? I thought they just rebadged stuff


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## mklien (Dec 30, 2007)

rebadge stuff? What do you mean?


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## Lazyrider (Sep 15, 2004)

*The RIVET is a nice looking bike and actually I correct myself*

that the frameset is reasonably priced at $1600 assuming you can get it on sale for 1/2 price, lol
the complete bike price on their websites seem high though. This isn't to start another one of "those" thread arguments but is simply the truth. If they were truly "boutique" The Rivet is beautiful looking though. But they do quote a frame weight of 900 grams but for a 47cm. WTF is that?





FatTireFred said:


> van dessel is a "boutique brand"??? I thought they just rebadged stuff


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## threesportsinone (Mar 27, 2007)

They buy plain black carbon frames from some warehouse and put their logo on it. That's what it means anyways, whether or not Van Dessel does it I don't know. 

I've always been a fan of the Country Road Bob


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## Lifelover (Jul 8, 2004)

threesportsinone said:


> They buy plain black carbon frames from some warehouse and put their logo on it. That's what it means anyways, whether or not Van Dessel does it I don't know.
> 
> I've always been a fan of the Country Road Bob


Like you I don't know for sure but I had assumed that Van Dessel at very least has some input in the design of the frames they sell. However, I don't consider them a "boutique brand".

I would consider a Boutique brand to be a company like Aegis that makes frames in house but doesn't offer custom sizes.


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## lampshade (Jul 18, 2002)

threesportsinone said:


> They buy plain black carbon frames from some warehouse and put their logo on it. That's what it means anyways, whether or not Van Dessel does it I don't know.
> 
> I've always been a fan of the Country Road Bob


CRB and the Gin and Trombones are cool rides.


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## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

This brand always reminds me of "Von Dutch," the uppidy clothes brand, for some reason.


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## mklien (Dec 30, 2007)

*response from Van Dessel...*

this is what I received from their cust. service incase someone was interested. 

"We design all the frames ourselves. In the past, for the full carbon
fiber frames, we have purchased carbon tubing from companies like
Dedacciai, which does impose limits on our design because the tubing has
a set length. Currently, we have grown to a level where we can afford
our own carbon molds and no longer do that. All the frames that are
aluminum or a combination of aluminum and carbon fiber have always been
100 percent our own design."


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## Lifelover (Jul 8, 2004)

mklien said:


> this is what I received from their cust. service incase someone was interested.
> 
> "We design all the frames ourselves. In the past, for the full carbon
> fiber frames, we have purchased carbon tubing from companies like
> ...


That is interesting and provides some insight to the industry. I suspect a company like Van Dessel does the design and than invests in the specific mold(s). They contract to a company like ADK and allow them to use the Molds. Since Van Dessel owns the molds, ADK can't make bikes to sell to other people using the mold.


What we see with the Pedal Force and BD offerings are bikes made by a company like ADK using ADK owned molds. This allows them to be sold to anybody for rebadging. 


Someone flag down the guy with the Mongoose, there is an outside chance he might understand the concept.


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## DM.Aelis (Jun 19, 2007)

Lifelover said:


> That is interesting and provides some insight to the industry. I suspect a company like Van Dessel does the design and than invests in the specific mold(s). They contract to a company like ADK and allow them to use the Molds. Since Van Dessel owns the molds, ADK can't make bikes to sell to other people using the mold.
> 
> 
> What we see with the Pedal Force and BD offerings are bikes made by a company like ADK using ADK owned molds. This allows them to be sold to anybody for rebadging.
> ...


Run for cover!


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## javahound10 (Mar 13, 2007)

I've got a Van Dessel Hellafaster (aluminum race bike). I don't know much about their carbon offerings, but mine is a sweet ride-- stiff, fast, corners like crazy. It's not a comfort frame but is going to be a great crit/circuit race bike, which is what I was looking for, and a decent part-time TT bike as well. Also has great style-- simple and clean.

Also have a Drag Strip Courage frame for the track-- going to build that up soon. I'll say both frames are solid and utilitarian-- not super fancy, but very solid.

Sam


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## blackhat (Jan 2, 2003)

*van dessel*

I rode a van dessel country road bob as a winter bike for a couple years. definitely not a rebadged anything, 100% unique. For an aluminum frame it was failry smooth. nice enough welds, good looking bike. they've grown as a company and changed the CRB since then but they seem to be on the right track.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

Lifelover said:


> That is interesting and provides some insight to the industry. I suspect a company like Van Dessel does the design and than invests in the specific mold(s). They contract to a company like ADK and allow them to use the Molds. Since Van Dessel owns the molds, ADK can't make bikes to sell to other people using the mold.
> 
> 
> What we see with the Pedal Force and BD offerings are bikes made by a company like ADK using ADK owned molds. This allows them to be sold to anybody for rebadging.
> ...


I'd say that's the case--that the company who owns the brand actually owns the molds-- more often than some might want to admit. Still, that's an awefully complicated situation to distill down into a shrill rant..........


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## Lazyrider (Sep 15, 2004)

*Slice it, dice it any way you want, this is still*

a Taiwanese/Chinese made carbon frame like all the rest no matter who own the molds. That Rivet has a nice paint job but it is not unique or original in design. It is a straight forward race frame. As far as my Mongoose, I couldn't care less who owns the mold or designed it. It is a quality Taiwanese made frame that I paid appropriately for and those who got the Pedal Force did even better as far as value. This Van Dessel is nothing special and for their retail price quotes with Dura Ace, they are laughable. 



Forrest Root said:


> I'd say that's the case--that the company who owns the brand actually owns the molds-- more often than some might want to admit. Still, that's an awefully complicated situation to distill down into a shrill rant..........


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## dmar836 (Nov 17, 2007)

We are to the point where few marques actually "make" their own frames. Trek dealers have even developed the quote, "Yeah, but Trek *owns* their overseas factory." It's just the world today - blame the American worker I guess...... for not settling for $100/mo. Few GM, Ford, or Toyota parts are made at GM, Ford, or Toyota factories (perhaps ones they keep in business though) yet they are branded as such and can be ordered from a dealer as such. My neighbor showed me two "Genuine Harley" dress-up parts he bought at the Harley dealer. One was from China and the other from Taiwan "rebadged" as Harley! 
It's a dissappointing situation for those of us who want to be brand loyal for a defensible reason but this argument will no longer be the hill to die on. This goes back to the lightweight racer era (60s-70s) though a US-finished and badged bike brazed in Italy sounds almost acceptable.
For now, we have to agree to add $1K - $2K just to put our favorite name on there or cut out the middle man and buy a Pedal Force! Sad IMO


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## laffeaux (Dec 12, 2001)

dmar836 said:


> It's just the world today - blame the American worker I guess...... for not settling for $100/mo.


I don't know, I'd put more of the blame on the consumer. The discussion above talked about a $1600 frame. For that much money, you can get a handmade frame custom fit to the rider.

Consumers have the choice of a great handmade frame, or a run of the mill carbon frame for the same price, and most choose the "carbon wonder bike" and don't even know that other options exist.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

laffeaux said:


> I don't know, I'd put more of the blame on the consumer. The discussion above talked about a $1600 frame. For that much money, you can get a handmade frame custom fit to the rider.
> 
> Consumers have the choice of a great handmade frame, or a run of the mill carbon frame for the same price, and most choose the "carbon wonder bike" and don't even know that other options exist.


Or maybe they just don't care to or need to have a custom frame. I had a custom frame. It didn't do anything that any of the other frames I had did. It had cool lugs, but that only mattered when washing the bike or looking at when it was in the house. On the road I didn't even think about lugs.

Custom is only one option of several, and how good of an option it is can only be determined by a given rider's needs and desires.


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## master2129 (Mar 30, 2007)

Forrest Root said:


> Or maybe they just don't care to or need to have a custom frame. I had a custom frame. It didn't do anything that any of the other frames I had did. It had cool lugs, but that only mattered when washing the bike or looking at when it was in the house. On the road I didn't even think about lugs.
> 
> Custom is only one option of several, and how good of an option it is can only be determined by a given rider's needs and desires.


I couldn't agree more with you on this Forrest. :thumbsup:


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

Van Dessel supports grass roots cycling - they sponsor local teams back east and used to be the bike sponsor of Colavita before it got too big and went with Felt and then Jamis. I have one of their Campitellos (the old race frame of Colavita) and it's a very nice alu/carbon blend that served me well through a few race seasons and is now doing bad weather duty.


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## knucklesandwich (Feb 23, 2007)

I've had my Hole Shot for almost a year now and have been extremely happy with it. Lighter and snappier than my Kona Jake, the guys are local to where I grew up, and I was able to get it built up with Rival for less than pretty much any other SRAM equipped cross bikes in the same range.


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## shayne (Aug 4, 2005)

I'll using this TT frame this season. It's been bolted to the trainer all winter, looking forward to trying it on the road soon.


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## dekindy (Jul 7, 2006)

http://testrider.com/fly.aspx?layout=player&video=70

Somebody thinks they make good bikes and is talking about them.


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## master2129 (Mar 30, 2007)

shayne said:


> I'll using this TT frame this season. It's been bolted to the trainer all winter, looking forward to trying it on the road soon.


What a great looking machine. How do you like your Edge Wheelset? I am looking forward to getting a set myself. They have a new 46mm coming out this spring.


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## shayne (Aug 4, 2005)

master2129 said:


> What a great looking machine. How do you like your Edge Wheelset? I am looking forward to getting a set myself. They have a new 46mm coming out this spring.


Thanks, 
I like the way it looks too, hopefully it's fast. I've only TT'd on a ghetto rigged roadbike in the past.

The Edge rims are great so far. Built them up with pretty high tensions as recommended by Edge. Only got in about 300 miles last fall, but so far so good. Front is built with 24 spokes and will double on our tandem for a couple of TT's. Edge said that we could go with 18 spokes at out 270 lb tean weight, but I chickened out and went with 24.


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## master2129 (Mar 30, 2007)

shayne said:


> Thanks,
> I like the way it looks too, hopefully it's fast. I've only TT'd on a ghetto rigged roadbike in the past.
> 
> The Edge rims are great so far. Built them up with pretty high tensions as recommended by Edge. Only got in about 300 miles last fall, but so far so good. Front is built with 24 spokes and will double on our tandem for a couple of TT's. Edge said that we could go with 18 spokes at out 270 lb tean weight, but I chickened out and went with 24.


Keep us posted on the ride quality of the frame. Good luck this season.


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