# Do I need more spokes? I'm 200lbs



## bicyclemech1 (Mar 29, 2009)

I'm riding 2004(??) Ritchey WCS DS wheels.
16/20 spokes
Rear rebuilt with wheelsmith bladed spokes and both wheels re-laced with brass nipples.
Spokes are tensioned on the high side of spec using a wheelsmith tensometer.

they hold true and feel pretty solid, but at 200lbs and pushing it in the corners, might I be better off on wheels with more spokes at the same weight? (just over 1600g)
TIA
Gregory.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

I sold hubs to a guy who build up a 24/28 spoke wheelset at 1385 grams. For a wheelset using so fewer spokes to weigh half a pound more seems counter productive.

The really low spoke setup doesnt make a ton of sense to me. Its going to require a heavier, stiffer, less compliant rim. Its not going to transfer power as well. You're probably real close to the mechanical limit of those wheels. 

Need? Eh, maybe not. Im your weight too and I ditched my 20 spoke front wheel as a confidence issue. Its just not enough material to instill confidence in me.


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## valleycyclist (Nov 1, 2009)

bicyclemech1 said:


> I'm riding 2004(??) Ritchey WCS DS wheels.
> 16/20 spokes
> Rear rebuilt with wheelsmith bladed spokes and both wheels re-laced with brass nipples.
> Spokes are tensioned on the high side of spec using a wheelsmith tensometer.
> ...


I agree with TomH. At 200lbs a 24/28 or 28/32 spoke wheelset is a better choice. But It depends on the rims you use. You can get a 1500 gram 28/32 wheelset fairly easily. If your current wheelset is not giving you any problems you don't need a new set. Did you rebuild them for a special reason, or just to have more confidence in them?

My favorite wheelset is my 1850 gram 32 spoke Shimano 105 hub/Velocity A23 rims. They may not look the fastest, but when it comes to performing downhill, I fly past everyone. So weight and aerodynamics are not everything. Depending on the level you want to ride, a solid 32 spoke wheelset may also be an option.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

edit.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

I just picked up a set of A23's today. They look good, seem solid and well made. I measured 444-445 grams per rim, so they're on par for the segment. 

After my experience with tiagra hubs (with dura-ace bearings and polished cones), ill be using only tiagra hubs, or dura ace hubs when it comes to shimano. Theres too many similarities between tiagra and ultegra, even sharing the same seals, but a tiagra set runs you 50 bucks (or 60 with dura-ace bearings). same weight too, within a few grams.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

bicyclemech1 said:


> .......wheels........16/20 spokes......Do I need more spokes? I'm 200lbs?


Let me answer your question Gregory with a thought-provoking question - Just what weight of rider are they designed to support? If those wheels are ok for 200lb people to use, what wheels would it be ok for a 100 ~ 150lb person to use? 



> .....at 200lbs......might I be better off on wheels with more spokes at the same weight? (just over 1600g).


Let me ask another question. Have you ever considered what would happen if you broke one of those spokes while on a ride? The less spokes a wheel has, the more work is done by each of those spokes and the more effect each one has on wheel integrity.

I have a set of wheels that contain 16 more spokes (24/28) than your wheels but weigh almost 200 grams less. So your wheels, in an effort to put strength and support back into a wheel lacking in spokes, does so with a beefy rim.

Low spoke wheels were initially designed for pro level racers to eke the maximum performance out of their equipment and themselves. When they race, they have following cars bristling with spare bikes and wheels and none of those racers come close to weighing 200lbs either. But in the quest for sales, the parts makers decided to convince Joe Rider that he couldn't live without these visually stimulating wheels. Now there are whole generations of new recreational & leisure riders who don't know any better. They assume the spoke numbers foisted on them are the ok. They have no idea of the warm fuzzy feeling brought on by using sensible 32/32 spoke wheels and the certainty that they will finish a ride while actually *riding* that bike.


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## hppy4u (Sep 15, 2002)

The one thing most people seem to forget is that there are always two sides to every story. My anectodal experience is with a set of Mavic Ksyrium SSC SLs, Campy Eurus, custom aluminum wheels (Kinlin XR300/24F + 28R, White Industries hubs, DT comp spokes radial F + 2X R) and custom carbon clinchers (EDGE 68/24F + 28R, White Industries hubs, DT comp spokes radial F+2X rear). I weigh between 195-210 lbs depending on the time of year and am a recently retired track bike sprinter as a reference...ie. love to mash gears!

Mavic Ksyriums= these are the aluminum low spoke count 18F+20R wheels that were bought in 2002. I haven't had a single issue with these wheels and spent a lot of time both on road and off road with these.

Campy Eurus= had these for about 2 years with similar conditions as above (lots of on/off road excursions) and these were bullet proof as well. Sold because I hated the tire fit on these rims...all the tires I had were too tight which resulted in painful tube replacements.

Kinlin XR300s= got these last year based on the positive recommendations on this sight and wanted to find something that would be a good replacement for my Ksyriums. These seem to be relatively stiff wheels and just as fast as the Ksyriums. Mind you I had one broken spoke in the rear drive side within 2 months of ownership. Kind of frustrating when it happens 35 miles from home and more so when these are supposed to be bullet proof.

Edge 68s= I BROKE 4 spokes in the rear during the first 9 months of ownership! These were built by a reputable builder so I was confused by this experience and really frustrated when it happened since the 3 times it happened were when I was at least 16 miles away from home. The third time it happened two spokes broke so it was a gut wrenching ride home. The one comforting fact though was that in all the cases I never had to worry about the wheel coming extremely out of true. So the theories regarding being able to ride home on a broken spoke without worrying about brake rub are true! 

As an FYI the interesting thing about the Edge wheel experience is that the wheelbuilder recommended that I try DT Aerolites on the rear which resulted in a slightly less laterally stiff wheel but I haven't had a single issue with spoke breakage even after rebuilding the rear with a Powertap rear hub. 

My suggestion is buy a set of wheels with a solid background and don't be afraid of the low spoke count wheels from the wheelmaker giants like Mavic and Campy. I have had friends who have experienced spoke breakage on their wheels without the dreaded potato chip aftereffect occuring.


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## ZoSoSwiM (Mar 7, 2008)

I rode Campy Vento G3 wheels for well over 10,000 miles... When I started road cycling I weight over 230... The rear wheel only had 28 spokes I believe.. 

However.. I had to retire the rear wheel this past summer. Stress cracks around many of the eyelets. Not bad for my fat ass beating the hell out of them for 2 years while I lost weight.


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## bicyclemech1 (Mar 29, 2009)

Got the ritcheys dirt cheap. Immediately broke a nipple, conforming to reputation, and relaced with brass. Rear was relaced with the Wheelsmith spokes by previous owner, and probably sold because of unreliability. 

I'm leaning towards the A-23's. Laced 28h radial/3cross
Who has the best deal on the rims?


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

got mine from universal cycles for $105 for the pair, use "vip10" coupon for 10% off.


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## Ronman (Feb 12, 2007)

I'm about the same weight as you at 200~205 lbs. I have just over 10K miles on a set of Fulcrum Racing 1s (2-way fit and 1480 grams). Right at the 10K mile point I broke a drive side spoke on the rear wheel. Up to that point they were trouble free and dead true. Not bad for so many miles under my 200 lbs, and we ride some very rough roads. After replacing the spoke and trueing the wheel I've had no further issues. Spoke count is 18 front and 21 rear. I ran a pair of Dura Ace 7801s (16 front, 20 rear) for approximately 5k miles and only had to true the rear wheel once, with no other issues. I've also had wheels with 24 spokes that would break two or three spokes every season on the same roads. 
In my experience, and including the group I ride with (about 40 of us, and we have some big boys) I don't think it's the rim or spoke count that determine the durability of the wheel, it's how they are designed to work together. A stronger rim will flex less, putting less localized stress on any one spoke. Some big strong riders in our group use low spoke count wheels and have few if any problems. Some, but not all, with higher spoke counts have more problems. And it seems alloy rims have held up better than the c/f variety with the big boys, but c/f has done well with the lighter riders. It doesn't seem that more spokes are always the magic bullet, and if the rim is strong enough fewer spokes can be used (to a point, obviously). It seems the variable here is the quality of materials and design.
One thing not mentioned is wind resistance. Fewer spokes and deeper section wheels aren't only or necessarily an aesthetics issue. Using a heavier and deeper, but also stronger, rim with fewer spokes does make sense when factoring in the additional wind resistance of a higher spoke count wheel. If you're riding at speed or into a head or cross-wind, or if it's gusty, this is very noticeable. 
Ultimately it's your choice and you have to do what you think is safe. If you keep them it might be wise to monitor spoke tension, as a loose spoke may alert you to pending rim failure. Keep a watch on the eyelets for cracks, as this is where rims typically fail. If the wheels have been good to you and you want to keep them, (and the rims are still good) maybe just replace the spokes periodically as a safety precaution. This is certainly cheaper than buying/building a new wheelset.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

"A stronger rim will flex less" a strong rim with less spokes will have to also weight more increasing the rotational weight. a 32 spoked wheel will have a lighter rim, less rotational weight while being able to carry the same load. so the real question becomes why do you want a heavier rim when a lighter one will do the same thing?


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## Ronman (Feb 12, 2007)

Not necessarily. Which wheel/rim weights are we comparing? I hear this argument frequently but never with documented weights included. I've already given mine; 200~205 lb rider, 1480 gram wheelset, 18 front 21 rear spoke count, and one broken spoke at the 10,000 mile mark. Until then no issues whatsoever, and none since, not even out of true. That, to me, is a very durable wheelset, particularly considering my weight and the roads we ride. And it's a factory wheel. 
Many of the high-spoke wheels/rims I've considered for custom wheel builds are not really what I would call "light". A deeper wheel isn't necessarily a heavier wheel. Again, this gets back to using quality materials, a good design and light-weight extrusions (or fabrication if c/f). And even if a rim is heavier I don't know that the marginal increase in rotational weight is relevent to the riders we are discussing here, the big boys with presumably the strongest legs. I've seen some 200 pound guys hammer the sprints in our club rides with 30~60mm deep wheels, while the guys with the low profile, uber-light climbing wheels and wheels with lots of spokes were left in their wake. I'm not attributing this to the wheels, but the reciprocating weight of the wheels obviously didn't alter the outcome of the sprint. And again, if we are making a blanket statement that lower spoke count wheels are always going to experience a higher percentage of broken spokes than a wheel with more spokes, well, I just haven't seen it in our group and we have lots of high mileage riders, countless varieties of wheels, rider weights, etc., plus I've never seen evidence to support that statement. We had one very strong rider who weighed 230lbs and runs c/f deep section wheels. He did have to run a higher spoke count with the c/f wheels than with his aluminum/alloy wheels, but this was because he was pulling the spokes through the eyelets of the rims, not due to broken spokes. His aluminum/alloy wheels remain 18/21 spoke count and trouble free. 
If we go with your premise that deeper wheels 'have' to be heavier, the "why" remains relevent and I've already mentioned in my earlier reply. It's about aerodynamics, and a deeper, low spoke count wheel, even if heavier, will be more aero than a wheel with a higher spoke count. Wind resistance is far more detrimental to speed as compared to a few hundred grams of extra recirpocating weight, so for efficiency the more aero wheel makes sense. Even at club-ride speeds the wind drag is noticeable on a high spoke wheel when compared to a lower spoke count. 
I see the appeal of custom wheels and I've had a set myself, but it just isn't accurate to say custom wheels and/or more spokes are 'always' better, stronger or safer. There are some very nice, durable factory wheels out there with less than 24/32 spokes, and big guys are riding them with no issues. I think it comes down to doing good research and using what you feel safe with, and if that means running high spoke count wheels then that's what you do.


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## medimond (Apr 26, 2009)

hppy4u said:


> Edge 68s= I BROKE 4 spokes in the rear during the first 9 months of ownership! These were built by a reputable builder so I was confused by this experience and really frustrated when it happened since the 3 times it happened were when I was at least 16 miles away from home. The third time it happened two spokes broke so it was a gut wrenching ride home. The one comforting fact though was that in all the cases I never had to worry about the wheel coming extremely out of true. So the theories regarding being able to ride home on a broken spoke without worrying about brake rub are true! .


So when that first initial spoke failed, did you just replace that one spoke? Wouldn't riding home on a broken spoke(s) be detrimental on the remaining spokes, as they have to pick-up the extra load caused by the failed spoke. Following this, the increase in load would then reduce the overall fatigue life of those spokes. To me it seems to reason to replace at least the adjacent spokes after such an event.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

the bicyle wheelware house, the blackset race wheelset uses 389 gram rims. their pure race wheelset uses 425 gram rims, 24 front 28 rear spokes, probably kinlin xr200 and xr270 rims. Mavic Krysium rims are probably 465 at their lightest version. anything in the 30mm depth range is heavier. why save spoke weight when saving rim weight is more effective?


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## Ronman (Feb 12, 2007)

So now we've saved what, 40 grams per wheel when compared to the Kryriums? Again, that's not going to be noticed by the rider or affect the outcome of a ride or sprint. Why save spoke weight? Again, fewer spokes mean a more aero wheelset, and wind drag, particularly at the wheels, is much more detrimental to speed than weight, particularly when we are talking 100 grams or less. 
I'm curious, why do you think saving rim weight is more effective? Effective at what?


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

Ronman said:


> So now we've saved what, 40 grams per wheel when compared to the Kryriums? Again, that's not going to be noticed by the rider or affect the outcome of a ride or sprint. Why save spoke weight? Again, fewer spokes mean a more aero wheelset, and wind drag, particularly at the wheels, is much more detrimental to speed than weight, particularly when we are talking 100 grams or less.
> I'm curious, why do you think saving rim weight is more effective? Effective at what?



have a different opinion about fewer spoke aero benefits. suspect you'll notice the weight at rim more than the improve aero dymanics from removing spokes and increasing rim weight. The profiles of a krysiums and xr200 xr270 are similar so their aero differences are minimum. run a set of Vittoria Zaffiro Pro tires and then run a pair of Vittoria prolights, about 50grams difference in weight. suspect you'll think the prolights will be snappier. 

did this experiment , several sets of AC sprint 350s, one set had sapim bladed spokes, 2nd set has revolutions and DB14s, sprint 350 rims and another ac sprint 350 hubs, revolutions spokes and velocity aerohead rims (425-435 grams) all had vittoria prolights tires 55 gram tubes or i swapped them on the wheelset i was testing. best performing were the ones with the sprint 350 rims, very little difference between bladed and non-bladed wheelsets. I'll take a lower weight rim anytime.


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## Ronman (Feb 12, 2007)

I disagree, and so does everyone I know who has run both types of wheels. 
Why are you using a Ksyrium as your sample wheel? You are comparing a Ksyrium to your chosen wheelsets, and it is widely known (and discussed on this forum quite often, too) that Ksyriums are not an aero wheel at all. I've owned a set and can tell you they catch lots of wind. I can also tell you that other wheels with the same or similar spoke count are much more aero. And trust me, you don't need a wind tunnel or gauge to measure the differences. It's that obvious, particularly when there is a head or cross wind. 
The difference is the flat spokes of the Ksyriums. The spokes are like huge fan blades. Of the wheels I mentioned earlier, I can tell you the big difference is the much narrower profile of the spokes. That was the only significant difference, as the spoke count was identical or slightly higher. They all weigh within 100 grams of one another, but the Fulcrums and Dura Ace roll so much smoother and carry speed with noticeably less effort. I even sampled an older set of Fulcrums that had a similar spoke profile to the Ksyriums, the same spoke count and even the same hubs as my current Fulcrums, and weighed essentially the same. The difference in the wind was noticeabe. The only difference between the wheels was the width of the spokes. 
Maybe there is little difference between the spokes you used in your experiment because, like I've found in my wheel samples, once a spoke is under a certain size the profile becomes essentially a non-issue. Add another 8 to 10 spokes to the wheel and you're adding surface area and wind drag. 
And to say that a lighter wheel will roll faster than a heavier wheel just doesn't make sense. Even if it weighed significantly more, once up to speed it's all the same to keep it moving. To even feel the difference when accelerating, the weight would have to be much more than what we are discussing here. I've done my own experiments with this and it's just true. 
You are comparing different tires like the only difference is weight. I've tried tires that were within a few grams of one another and found significant differences in how they roll. I've tried tires that were nearly 50 grams apart and found very little difference. The biggest difference was the composition of the tire and how they were constructed. 

Anyway, I respect your opinion cmg and I'm sure you're excellent at what you do with wheels. I respect that, really. It's just that my own experience, and that of many riding friends, isn't entirely consistant with what you are saying. And we do agree on one thing. All things being equal, or close to it anyway, I'll take a lighter wheel every time.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

Whats the term, moment of inertia? Weight further out from the center of a spinning object is harder to accelerate or decelerate.. The rim and tire is the worst place for weight, the hub is the best.

As shown by wind tests of the low spoke count K's, low spoke count definitely doesnt always mean more aero.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

picked the Mavic K's because it's the wheelset i'm familar with but the wheelset by Origin 8's are similar, around 1550-1600 grams. same thing in terms of rim weight.

it's a simple experiment, moment of inertia. take a discarded inner tube cut out the valve, slice it down the middle, place a working inner tube inside the sliced tube, place inside your current tire, both front and back wheels. it will be tight. You have just added 70 grams of additional weight at the rim. go ride. ride it on your middle of the week evening route. Do it several times. then remove sliced inner tube and repeat procedure. if you notice the difference, the quest for the lightest rim begins. if you don't then i'm wrong and will never be able to convince you. 

This what drove the development of carbon rim wheelsets, a lighter rim in a deeper section that has aero benefits. a lighter than aluminum rim with a deeper section can handle more stress so fewer spokes are needed. 

this is what is driving the current tubeless rim development. lighter at the rim because you can eliminate the inner tube altoghter. pinched flat reduction isn't the only benefit. 

use to do the slice inner tube thing for thorn protection. now i'm on/testing a set of tubular easton ec90ls's with 260 gram tires and digging it. started to look into the lighter rimed ec90slx's as a result. once you get under the 260gram tubular tire weight the price shoots up. the search is always ongoing. it's a sickness.


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Rotational moment of inertia*



TomH said:


> Whats the term, moment of inertia? Weight further out from the center of a spinning object is harder to accelerate or decelerate.. The rim and tire is the worst place for weight, the hub is the best.


True, but what most people (and all marketing departments) fail to recognize is that the difference in the amount of energy required to spin up a light rim/tire and a heavy rim/tire is tiny. Once they are up to speed, where the weight is located means nothing. And unless you are braking to slow down, the heavier rim/tire wheel returns all the stored energy by virtue of the slower deceleration. 

The rotational inertia issue is way overblown.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

You kinda discredited two really big points.. acceleration and deceleration. Not too many of us ride in conditions where those two factors arent important. I dont know how people say you wont feel weight climbing.. slogging up a hill with 2100 gram wheels and heavy tires is rough.


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Majorly*



TomH said:


> You kinda discredited two really big points.. acceleration and deceleration. Not too many of us ride in conditions where those two factors arent important. I dont know how people say you wont feel weight climbing.. slogging up a hill with 2100 gram wheels and heavy tires is rough.


I'm assuming you're responding to my post? (It would be a lot clearer if you hit the reply button under my post rather than the reply button under the original post).

My point is that people over rate where the weight is on the bike. If two bikes weigh the same, then whether the weight is in the rims/tires or the frame makes a small difference in acceleration/deceleration and ZERO difference when climbing.

People also over rate the impact of weight on climbing speed. A bike that weighs an extra kilogram (2.2 lbs) will slow you down about 0.1 mph (0.16 km/hr) on a 6% grade. That's major if you're racing at the top level of the sport, and pretty meaningless for the rest of us. You'd be 500 feet behind (38 seconds) after an hour of climbing.


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## AJL (Jul 9, 2009)

Kerry Irons said:


> I'm assuming you're responding to my post? (It would be a lot clearer if you hit the reply button under my post rather than the reply button under the original post).
> 
> My point is that people over rate where the weight is on the bike. If two bikes weigh the same, then whether the weight is in the rims/tires or the frame makes a small difference in acceleration/deceleration and ZERO difference when climbing.
> 
> People also over rate the impact of weight on climbing speed. A bike that weighs an extra kilogram (2.2 lbs) will slow you down about 0.1 mph (0.16 km/hr) on a 6% grade. That's major if you're racing at the top level of the sport, and pretty meaningless for the rest of us. You'd be 500 feet behind (38 seconds) after an hour of climbing.


And sadly, it's become and industry trend to put low spoke count wheels on bikes because "that's what the pros use".


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

AJL said:


> And sadly, it's become and industry trend to put low spoke count wheels on bikes because "that's what the pros use".


And every one of them are under 170lbs.


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## hppy4u (Sep 15, 2002)

medimond said:


> So when that first initial spoke failed, did you just replace that one spoke? Wouldn't riding home on a broken spoke(s) be detrimental on the remaining spokes, as they have to pick-up the extra load caused by the failed spoke. Following this, the increase in load would then reduce the overall fatigue life of those spokes. To me it seems to reason to replace at least the adjacent spokes after such an event.



The interesting thing is that it wasn't the adjacent spokes that broke. I don't know if the wheel was just made from a defective batch or not but I had all the spokes replaced with DT aerolites (2X DS and 2X NDS). After the experience I have added ~500 miles with the new spokes and Powertap hub (which should yield a slightly flexier wheel) without any issues. Sometimes logic from the layman's perspective just doesn't apply...my post was just giving a real life devil's advocate perspective. My low spoke count wheels have actually proven to be much more reliable than the high end quality build wheels that everybody proposes in almost knee jerk fashion. 

To be perfectly honest I love building custom wheels for fun (next project will be WI hubs with the new Kinlin XR-380 rims) but I still enjoy riding Mavic wheels because I think they seem to be better engineered for the mass market. If you think about it most of your typical custom builds still need to rely on 2 or 3 spoke options which always seem to be the achilles heel of most of the wheel complaints on these forums...ie. my spokes broke etc.


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## terbennett (Apr 1, 2006)

Mike T. said:


> Low spoke wheels were initially designed for pro level racers to eke the maximum performance out of their equipment and themselves. When they race, they have following cars bristling with spare bikes and wheels and none of those racers come close to weighing 200lbs either. But in the quest for sales, the parts makers decided to convince Joe Rider that he couldn't live without these visually stimulating wheels. Now there are whole generations of new recreational & leisure riders who don't know any better. They assume the spoke numbers foisted on them are the ok. They have no idea of the warm fuzzy feeling brought on by using sensible 32/32 spoke wheels and the certainty that they will finish a ride while actually *riding* that bike.


+1.... Words of wisdom!!!! :thumbsup:


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## masont (Feb 6, 2010)

TomH said:


> You kinda discredited two really big points.. acceleration and deceleration. Not too many of us ride in conditions where those two factors arent important. I dont know how people say you wont feel weight climbing.. slogging up a hill with 2100 gram wheels and heavy tires is rough.


Yes, almost as bad as slugging up a hill with a full water bottle


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## jet sanchEz (Nov 28, 2005)

I am 190lbs and have some nice Dura Ace 36 hole hubs, what is a nice rim that I could build these up with? With 36 holes they will probably be bombproof anyways but I would like to hear some opinions on a good solid but light 36 hole rim.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

jet sanchEz said:


> I am 190lbs and have some nice Dura Ace 36 hole hubs, what is a nice rim that I could build these up with? With 36 holes they will probably be bombproof anyways but I would like to hear some opinions on a good solid but light 36 hole rim.


CPX33 or Open Sport. Open Sports are box shaped rims that replaced the MA40. You can get Velocity rims with just about any number of spoke holes.


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Durability?*



jet sanchEz said:


> I am 190lbs and have some nice Dura Ace 36 hole hubs, what is a nice rim that I could build these up with? With 36 holes they will probably be bombproof anyways but I would like to hear some opinions on a good solid but light 36 hole rim.


At your weight, you would probably be OK with Velocity Aerohead or MAVIC OpenPro since you have 36 spoke hubs. If you want a REALLY durable wheel, step it up to Velocity DeepV or MAVIC CXP33. Comparable Kinlin rims get good comments as well.


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## valleycyclist (Nov 1, 2009)

jet sanchEz said:


> I am 190lbs and have some nice Dura Ace 36 hole hubs, what is a nice rim that I could build these up with? With 36 holes they will probably be bombproof anyways but I would like to hear some opinions on a good solid but light 36 hole rim.


I was also thinking Velocity rims such as Aerohead or Fusion. You can also try A23 if they come in 36 holes. Ambrosio Excelight is another option if you can find them.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

jet sanchEz said:


> I am 190lbs and have some nice Dura Ace 36 hole hubs, what is a nice rim that I could build these up with? With 36 holes they will probably be bombproof anyways but I would like to hear some opinions on a good solid but light 36 hole rim.



the KINLIN xr-300 comes in 36 holes, 30mm depth, 465 gram build a stout set of wheels.


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