# Need info for 2009+ Master X-Light frame for comparison



## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

I just received a Master X-Light frame that I bought off of e-bay. It was advertised as brand new. Problem is that it didn't come with the following:

1) cable guides for under the bottom bracket
2) barrel adjusters for the downtube
3) wheel alignment adjusters for the rear dropouts
4) steerer expander plug

Did you Master X-Light owners receive these items for your Master X-Light?

On ALL my other Colnago frames, they came with these items.

Further, it doesn't even look like there are threads in the guides for one of the barrel adjusters.

The bottom bracket also has a hole in it for the cable guide and then two diaganol cutouts in the bottom bracket for draining. Are these diaganol cutouts correct? I always though the bottom of the BB had Colnago engraved on it. Maybe times have changed.

Ultimately, I think I am going to return the frame because it was described as being in "perfect" condition and there is a paint chip just below the seatpost hole. Plus, I am worried that the barrel adjusters will not screw into the guides.


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## chaulk61 (Jan 20, 2009)

I realize that this is not an apples for apples comparison, but I bought a 2008 Primavera frame and barrel adjusters (they were not supplied) would not fit into the frame - so I just have the cables go directly into the stops. And I do not think that it came with a cable guide as that, if I recall correctly, came with the shifter set. I did get an expander plug/colnago stem cap.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

chaulk61 said:


> I realize that this is not an apples for apples comparison, but I bought a 2008 Primavera frame and barrel adjusters (they were not supplied) would not fit into the frame - so I just have the cables go directly into the stops. And I do not think that it came with a cable guide as that, if I recall correctly, came with the shifter set. I did get an expander plug/colnago stem cap.


Yep, the shifter sets usually have the cable guides in them, but every Colnago that I have bought brand new came with all that hardware. The Primavera is one of the Taiwan made frames, correct? Not that it matters, since both of my Artes, also Taiwan made frames, came with all the hardware.


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## Jbartmc (Sep 14, 2007)

My Master X Light had all the parts you mentioned were not included with yours. Best of luck!
Bart


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## chaulk61 (Jan 20, 2009)

I was just looking on Colnago's website and the Master is pictured with barrel adjusters - they are unlike others I have seen - you would think they should be supplied with the frame. The stops on the frame are different than the ones on the Primavera.
Yes, the Primavera is an aluminum frame made in Taiwan. Not available as a frame set, but I gather that Wiggle got there hands on a bunch of bikes and parted them out.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

The seller and I have really gotten into it good now. He swears the frame is brand new, yet there is the paint chip on the seat tube and there are scratches in the rear dropouts like somebody put a wheel into it. Granted, the rest of the frame looks pretty good, except for the non-drive side chainstay that has some paint blemishes on it and what looks like stripped barrel adjuster guides.

Of course, when I e-mailed him before the auction ended about any paint blemishes from the factory, because I didn't want one with paint blemishes, he told me the frame was "perfect". To say I am pissed, is an understatement. He wants me to eat all the shipping (i.e., $56), and he already has the frame relisted on ebay with the same description even though I have it sitting in my foyer trying to get an address out of him to return it to him. I guess this is what I get for trying to save $350 on ebay instead of ordering it from probikekit.

Regarding the missing items, he said they were never listed in the auction so I should not have assumed that I was getting them even though the frame was listed as NEW witha retail of $2,674. Silly me, on every other NEW Colnago that I have bought, I received all those items.

I offered to split the shipping with him on it, and he was adamant about me paying for ALL the shipping both ways. How can any decent seller expect for a buyer to pay for shipping both ways when the item is not as described. Heck, any decent seller would pay for the shipping both ways when something described as new isn't new.

I just finished taking some hi-res photos of the problem areas on the frame and will try to resize them later tonight and post them so you guys can give me your opinion.


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## Karbon Kev (Sep 7, 2009)

The perils of E-Bay fabs. Sorry to hear about this. look forward to the pics man ....


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## JeremyP (Apr 30, 2006)

bad luck fabs, i agree probikekit is the way to go for the master.


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## ctam (Apr 21, 2003)

In the ebay help section under buyer protection it says you will be reimbursed the cost of the item and the original shipping. If you think you can nail him with the paint chips and the stripped cable guides maybe you should file a dispute against the seller??

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/buyer-protection.html


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

ctam said:


> In the ebay help section under buyer protection it says you will be reimbursed the cost of the item and the original shipping. If you think you can nail him with the paint chips and the stripped cable guides maybe you should file a dispute against the seller??
> 
> http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/buyer-protection.html


Thanks for the info. I filed a dispute with paypal last night, but it looks like we are going to work this out and I am going to ship it back to him tomorrow. This entire dispute is over splitting the shipping cost. Personally, I have no idea why I should ever have to pay shipping on an item not as described, but I was willing to split it when I first e-mailed him about it. E-bay/paypal even requires that the shipping be split. All of this arguing and headache for $28 worth of shipping. My wife says that I sometimes do a lot more work just because of my principles, and I guess this is one of those cases. Anyway, it looks like he is amenable to refunding my entire purchase price plus shipping and I have to eat the shipping back to him, which I am fine with. I am somewhat reasonable most of the time. Eating the entire cost of shipping was just a lot to swallow for me.

I'm sure most people would just put some touchup on this chip and live with the paint imperfection, the screwed up barrel adjuster guides, and the lack of hardware, but I am picky when it comes to my bikes, cars, and guns/bows. I'd rather pay extra for a brand new one, than get one that is almost new yet advertised as brand new.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Karbon Kev said:


> The perils of E-Bay fabs. Sorry to hear about this. look forward to the pics man ....


Here are the pics. Tomorrow it is off to UPS to send it back to him as I take a video of me putting it in the box, attaching the label to it, handing it to the lady/man behind the counter, and getting their name as a witness that I shipped the frame back.

So, what do you guys think, new or used, and would that drive side barrel adjuster mount give me trouble compared to the left side one with the threads actually in it.

I have a lot more high res pics, but I still need to draft a couple letters tonight before hitting the sack (i.e., I don't feel like taking the time to resize them and post them on here).


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## Clevor (Sep 8, 2005)

Actually the one faulty barrel adjuster in question simply looks like it was never tapped (threaded) in the first place! I'm wondering whether it was a defective adjuster which the factory installed unwittingly. It could be fixed by buying the right tap and threading it yourself.

On Ebay, be wary of some of the sellers in Hong Kong or China. This guy Tonglolo ripped me off by never refunding me when I returned some items. This sleazebag is still selling on the HK Ebay. But a majority of the sellers from there are OK.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Clevor said:


> Actually the one faulty barrel adjuster in question simply looks like it was never tapped (threaded) in the first place! I'm wondering whether it was a defective adjuster which the factory installed unwittingly. It could be fixed by buying the right tap and threading it yourself.
> 
> On Ebay, be wary of some of the sellers in Hong Kong or China. This guy Tonglolo ripped me off by never refunding me when I returned some items. This sleazebag is still selling on the HK Ebay. But a majority of the sellers from there are OK.


If it wasn't for all the missing hardware and having to tap the right side barrel adjuster braze on, I would have kept the frame. However, why should I have to deal with all those headaches when I buy a "new" frame.

I got ripped off on e-bay at the beginning of the year from a guy in China. Luckily, it was only for $26 for the 16gb micro SD card I bought from him. The day after I had used "Buy It Now" and paid for the item, e-bay canceled the auction. However, me and 26 other people had already bought and paid for the item. I immediately disputed the claim that day and told him that I would drop the dispute if the item ever made it to me. Well, I got the item about a month later; however, it was a 2gb card that had been marked as a 16gb card. The SanDisk label didn't look quite right either on the adapter or the card since they were both crooked. Anyway, I found out about the capacity problem right away when I tried to copy 8gb of music to the card. I changed the dispute to "item not as described" and paypal required that I return the card to him. Based upon principle, I spent the $12 in postage to return the card. The USPS never returned a "delivered" response for the tracking number so paypal disallowed my claim. Talk about a bunch of BS since they already knew the guy was selling crap since they took down his auction and canceled all his other auctions and I could no longer find him as a seller on e-bay. So, I was out $38 from that transaction. Lesson learned.

Bought some aquarium plants from a seller in Hong Kong. They were shipped to me in a small envelope and the plants were wrapped in a little plastic bag. They were smashed flat and they had turned brown by the time they got to me. The seller had a lot of feedback and seemed to be doing well sales wise, so in return for me promising not to leave negative feedback they refunded my money after I sent them pictures of the plant. At first, they wanted me to wait a month to see if the plant grew back. Yeah, right.

So, no more purchases from Asia for me. Had pretty good luck with 3 other "new" frames that I bought off of e-bay, but they were all sub $1,000 frames and 2 came from bike shops. Now, I am a little hesitant to buy anything significant on e-bay anymore. This Colnago Master might be the most expensive thing I have ever bought on e-bay and look at my headache here. It was easier buying my Cristallo and C50 from Switzerland than it was buying this Master. As soon as I get the refund, I'm going to buy the Master from somebody in Europe.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

So, I return the frame and the seller issues me an e-check refund via paypal, except that the e-check bounces. Utterly amazing.


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## Clevor (Sep 8, 2005)

fabsroman said:


> So, I return the frame and the seller issues me an e-check refund via paypal, except that the e-check bounces. Utterly amazing.


That is a common problem. I filed a dispute about some RDRAM for my computer which didn't work. I had to file a PayPal dispute and they ruled in my favor. The scumbag who sold me the memory never refunded me and disappeared from Ebay. A lot of these cretins sell for a few months and then disappear. PayPal is a joke sometimes and they never got me my money back. 

In my case, it was $110, but you are being screwed for much more. Good luck with PayPal; they can be a bit impotent in moments like this. They can get you your money back if the seller is honest. In many cases, they aren't.


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## ctam (Apr 21, 2003)

Another stupid thing with paypal is that you might not get all your money back even if they rule in your favor!! I bought a frame from a guy here on RBR and used paypal. Long story short - the frame never showed up, filed a dispute, won the dispute....but only recovered about 90% of my money because the seller did not have the full amount of funds in his account. You'd think paypal would eat the remaining 10% as part of their protection policy...no such luck.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

ctam said:


> Another stupid thing with paypal is that you might not get all your money back even if they rule in your favor!! I bought a frame from a guy here on RBR and used paypal. Long story short - the frame never showed up, filed a dispute, won the dispute....but only recovered about 90% of my money because the seller did not have the full amount of funds in his account. You'd think paypal would eat the remaining 10% as part of their protection policy...no such luck.


What, paypal doesn't refund money if the seller doesn't have the funds in his/her account? I had no idea that was the case. What kind of guarantee is that?

Ultimately, I am giving the guy until Friday to make the check good before I dispute the issue with my credit card company. About $950 was on the credit card and $700 from my paypal funds. It might end up being extra work for me, but I know where the guy lives (which isn't too far from my in-laws in Florida), works, and that he races as a Cat 2 in Florida. I'll have to file a lawsuit in Maryland and serve him in Florida, but I am hoping it doesn't get that far and that everything turns out alright by Friday.

The more I use paypal and e-bay, the more I dislike it, especially for higher dollar items. Based upon my experience in December/January/February, you can bet I will never buy anything from an overseas e-bay vendor again. Probably will not buy anymore high dollar items from e-bay vendors in the US either unless they live really close to me.

If this really gets out of control, the next time I visit my in-laws I will just file a complaint with the police in that county. I am sure this would fall under the category of fraud and possibly the passing of a bad check, even though it was an e-check.

This entire ordeal has been a huge waste of my time.


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## Clevor (Sep 8, 2005)

As for Ebay, all you got is 45 days to file a dispute (same with PayPal). After that, you are sh_t up the creek! If the seller doesn't give you your money back, or beyond that date, Ebay sends you a canned letter which says this:

"There are also a few other options that you can check out:

-- File a complaint with the Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3). 
The IC3 reviews complaints, and then sends information to the 
appropriate local, state, or federal agency. To file a complaint, go to:

http://www.ic3.gov 

-- File a mail fraud complaint. 
If your item or payment was sent through U.S. mail, you can file a mail 
fraud complaint at: 
https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/forms/MailFraudComplaint.aspx 

-- Contact the police. 
Contact the police in your area as well as the area where the seller is 
located. To find local law enforcement offices, go to: 
http://www.usacops.com 

We'd be glad to help the police with their investigations. If they need 
information, have them contact us:
http://pages.ebay.com/securitycenter/law_enforcement.html

If you need further assistance, please don't hesitate to reply to this 
email and let us know.

Sincerely,
Gilda

eBay Customer Support"

Contact the police, eh?  

And as if the U.S. Post office will get on it right away! :lol: It took me 2.5 years to get my money back on a damage claim I filed with them.


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