# New Zipp 404 FC or Reynolds Aero 58



## tuck (Oct 4, 2011)

I've been riding a set of 2012 Zipp 404 FC, Clinchers, for the last couple of years. I ride the poop out of them and have them in the shop how...having the alloy nipples changed out fro brasss, as well has having new hub bearings installed, etc. 

While the the shop has them, I'm riding a set of demo Reynolds Aeros, 58/72. I can tell a noticeable difference in the stiffness of the rear wheel thanks, I'm assuming, to the double laced pattern on both sides of the hub. My 404s are only laced on the non-drive side. I'm not sure if it's because of this design in itself or what, but I have no problem making the 404s flex...and it drives me nuts. While riding the Reynolds over the last week, I've felt a lot better...maybe it's just in my head...about the power being transferred to the ground.

The new Zipps have a similiar lace pattern on their new hubs. I like the look and so on of the Zipps better than the Reynolds and as that's what I've been riding for the last couple of years, I would like to stay with them. But, as I haven't rode the new ones yet, I'm unsure what to do. I really am tired of the flex in the other 404s.

Has anyone tried the new 404s? Compared the Zipps to the Reynolds?

Bueller?


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

If you're only interested in the Zipp or Reynolds, then based on your experience with the Zipp wheels, I'd try the Reynolds wheels. Reynolds dealers offer a no obligation demo, which makes trying the Reynolds wheels easy and risk free.

If a 20/24 spoke count build suits your weight (you don't mention your weight which would be helpful to know), and you don't need wheels quite as deep sectioned as the Zipp 404 then out check these November Rail 52 as an alternative. Better hubs than the Zipp 404 (and equal to the Reynolds with DT Swiss 240 internals). Less expensive than either. Built in the USA. Recommended rider weight limit of 225 lbs.


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## Notvintage (May 19, 2013)

tvad said:


> . . . Built in the USA. Recommended rider weight limit of 225 lbs.


Build in the USA of Chinese parts less the spokes.


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

Notvintage said:


> Build in the USA of Chinese parts less the spokes.


If you're going to continue to preach your Sinophobia, then be certain your facts are correct. In this case, they are incorrect.

The hubs used in the November Rail wheels are manufactured by White Industries in Petaluma, CA USA.


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## Local Hero (Jul 8, 2010)

I've also found that older zipps are a little flexy. I get brake rub in the rear. My thought was that it was the hub and not the spokes. It's actually very difficult to make those big carbon hoops flex. (And, all else being equal, a deeper dish wheel should flex less.) That said, newer zipps may not have this issue.


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## tuck (Oct 4, 2011)

TKs tvad. I'll look at those.

Weight is holding between 174 and 181...depending on how many donuts force me to eat them.


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## robt57 (Jul 23, 2011)

Local Hero said:


> I've also found that older zipps are a little flexy. I get brake rub in the rear. My thought was that it was the hub and not the spokes. It's actually very difficult to make those big carbon hoops flex. (And, all else being equal, a deeper dish wheel should flex less.) That said, newer zipps may not have this issue.



Stiffer wheel rub before flexier wheels, do the research. Stiff wants to stay in plane with itself and 180^ of the ground will move more than the flexier wheel...


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## November Dave (Dec 7, 2011)

There is a higher content of made in China parts in the Reynolds wheels then ours. Our rims are made in Taiwan, Reynolds does most of their production in China.

Just wanted to clear up that bit of misinformation.


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

November Dave said:


> There is a higher content of made in China parts in the Reynolds wheels then ours. Our rims are made in Taiwan, *Reynolds does most of their production in China.*
> 
> Just wanted to clear up that bit of misinformation.


.........with carbon made in the US. (unless that's since changed)


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## November Dave (Dec 7, 2011)

I don't know. The carbon used in ours is Japanese.


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## Diopena1 (Jul 21, 2011)

I vote for the November Rail 52's... have had mine for a while, and they put up with my abuse- No problem!
Even after barreling down some hills at 40+mph, the rim brake contact points didn't even get that hot. The new hubs are an awesome value<- I may send mine in for an upgrade later on.


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## deviousalex (Aug 18, 2010)

Local Hero said:


> I've also found that older zipps are a little flexy. I get brake rub in the rear. My thought was that it was the hub and not the spokes. It's actually very difficult to make those big carbon hoops flex. (And, all else being equal, a deeper dish wheel should flex less.) That said, newer zipps may not have this issue.


Debunking Wheel Stiffness - Slowtwitch.com



> As you climb on an aluminum rim and rock the bike back and forth, the bottom half of the rim tends to follow the road. The rim bows to comply with your pedaling. The top half of the rim tends to stay relatively straight between the brake pads. If someone’s wheel does NOT rub their brakes, they often assume it’s because the wheel is stiff – or perhaps that the wheel and frame are both stiff. In reality, it’s likely that the rim is not very stiff, regardless of anything else.


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## Roland44 (Mar 21, 2013)

deviousalex said:


> Debunking Wheel Stiffness - Slowtwitch.com


Very informative article, good share.


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## willstylez (Sep 15, 2011)

Perhaps check out the 2015 Campagnolo Bora 35 / 50 Ultra clinchers. I picked up the 35 versions, at the end of August, and have over 500 miles on them thus far. I'm 6'4" & roughly 190lbs. Excellent wheels. Very stiff. Superb braking (haven't tried them in wet conditions yet). Phenomenal Campy bearings!


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