# Campagnolo Chorus vs SRAM Force



## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

I am looking at 2 bikes and one has Campagnolo Chorus and the other has SRAM Force.

Is there a big difference in quality/performance between the two?


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

lucky13 said:


> I am looking at 2 bikes and one has Campagnolo Chorus and the other has SRAM Force.
> 
> Is there a big difference in quality/performance between the two?


Why not ride them both and decide for yourself?

Beyond that advice, do a search of these threads for discussions about these group sets. There are dozens and dozens of comments already.


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

Anacdotally, Campy will last longer.

They both perform well but the difference in ergonomics and the way you shift is significant (to some, like me). Neither is better or worse per se but it's definitley subject to personal preference so you need to try to know which ergonomics and technique you prefer.

Are these two bike the same frame and wheels? Group set matters but wouldn't be first on my list of what seperates two bikes.


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## colnagoG60 (Jun 27, 2013)

Jay Strongbow said:


> ...They both perform well but the difference in ergonomics and the way you shift is significant (to some, like me). Neither is better or worse per se but it's definitley subject to personal preference so you need to try to know which ergonomics and technique you prefer...


^x2

I have/had both (albeit Force 10sp, SRAM Red-10sp as well), and while "performance" was/is great with both, I ultimately stayed with Campy (born/raised). I missed too many shifts with SRAM's double tap, as I'm just more accostomed to the shifting "method" with Campy. 

If it matters, I don't believe that you can "Double-dump" with Force, nor shift 4-5 gears "in one swipe" with Force, as you can with Chorus.


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## bikerector (Oct 31, 2012)

I think the overall performance of both are good. The function is different based on the ergos and the thumb button vs paddle shifters, which is the biggest and most important difference IMO. I raced with chorus last year and loved it with the exception of sprinting at the end of a race where you are downshifting a lot from the drops. It was too easy to drop too many gears too fast with the thumb button... but that made the shifters great, to me, for any other time on the bike and I really enjoyed the ability to fly across the cassette in rolling terrain where you're using a lot of gears. Nice for cx as well where you're always changing gears (if they're still working).

I'm back on sram this year for racing, the only reason I like it more is because of sprint shifting and it's cheaper. We're running sram rival 22 on the team bikes since it has pretty much all of the function as force and red and almost half the cost in regards to the bikes it was equipped on. Cheaper to replace parts in the event of a crash too.

Also to note, some of the newer campy levers, the ones that only downshift one cog at a time, adopted the EPS style thumb button. I'm in love with the feel of that as the extra few mm drop of the button makes it a lot easier to reach from the drops. I don't think this is available for the chorus and up shifters since it wouldn't allow the multi-cog dump with the thumb shifter. I'm considering athena for my next personal bike simply because of that, and I can't afford EPS.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

bikerector said:


> I think the overall performance of both are good. The function is different based on the ergos and the thumb button vs paddle shifters, which is the biggest and most important difference IMO. I raced with chorus last year and loved it with the exception of sprinting at the end of a race where you are downshifting a lot from the drops. It was too easy to drop too many gears too fast with the thumb button... but that made the shifters great, to me, for any other time on the bike and I really enjoyed the ability to fly across the cassette in rolling terrain where you're using a lot of gears. Nice for cx as well where you're always changing gears (if they're still working).
> 
> I'm back on sram this year for racing, the only reason I like it more is because of sprint shifting and it's cheaper. We're running sram rival 22 on the team bikes since it has pretty much all of the function as force and red and almost half the cost in regards to the bikes it was equipped on. Cheaper to replace parts in the event of a crash too.
> 
> Also to note, some of the newer campy levers, the ones that only downshift one cog at a time, adopted the EPS style thumb button. I'm in love with the feel of that as the extra few mm drop of the button makes it a lot easier to reach from the drops. I don't think this is available for the chorus and up shifters since it wouldn't allow the multi-cog dump with the thumb shifter. I'm considering athena for my next personal bike simply because of that, and I can't afford EPS.


Heh, I always wondered who it was that wanted the 2015 gimped "powershift"ers with the low thumb toggles...and actually thought it was a good thing.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

lucky13 said:


> I am looking at 2 bikes and one has Campagnolo Chorus and the other has SRAM Force.
> 
> Is there a big difference in quality/performance between the two?


I can't believe no one has asked this before...crazy!

Oh wait, they have:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/campagnolo-record-vs-sram-force-22-a-344133.html

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/campy-shimano-sram-265069.html

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/sram-force-campy-athena-shimano-ultegra-267392.html

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/red-record-drivetrain-decision-help-opinion-270717.html

Not the _exact_ same comparison, but it doesn't matter...functionally they're the same.


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## colnagoG60 (Jun 27, 2013)

bikerector said:


> ...Also to note, some of the newer campy levers, the ones that only downshift one cog at a time, adopted the EPS style thumb button. I'm in love with the feel of that as the extra few mm drop of the button makes it a lot easier to reach from the drops. I don't think this is available for the chorus and up shifters since it wouldn't allow the multi-cog dump with the thumb shifter. I'm considering athena for my next personal bike simply because of that, and I can't afford EPS.


I just put Athena on my old bike...didn't like the lower thumb shifters. First time I rode in the drops (which is typically rare, mostly ride the hoods) I then realized the reason for the change. The 90deg levers (on my Chorus) seem more "secure", but the "dropped" levers do seem more logical when down in it. Though to me, it always seems like there will not be enough lever travel to make the shift.

I mostly just appreciate the added control of the Athena shifting, which is more like the Red group I had, in that its harder to over shoot the gear you want, by being able to more accurately shift one gear at a time.


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## DaveG (Feb 4, 2004)

colnagoG60 said:


> I just put Athena on my old bike...didn't like the lower thumb shifters. First time I rode in the drops (which is typically rare, mostly ride the hoods) I then realized the reason for the change. The 90deg levers (on my Chorus) seem more "secure", but the "dropped" levers do seem more logical when down in it. Though to me, it always seems like there will not be enough lever travel to make the shift.
> 
> I mostly just appreciate the added control of the Athena shifting, which is more like the Red group I had, in that its harder to over shoot the gear you want, by being able to more accurately shift one gear at a time.


I have Athena on my newest bike and older Ergo Centaur and Veloce on 3 other bikes. I do like the smaller shifter button on the Athena but I miss the ability to shift multiple gears at a time like with Ergo. The action on the Athena is much less stiff. I don't over-shift with the Ergo buttons because the action is much stiffer and there is a much more noticeable "click" at each gear. FYI, I went with Athena because I wanted the Al levers on my steel bike


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## SPlKE (Sep 10, 2007)

colnagoG60 said:


> ^x2
> 
> I have/had both (albeit Force 10sp, SRAM Red-10sp as well), and while "performance" was/is great with both, I ultimately stayed with Campy (born/raised). I missed too many shifts with SRAM's double tap, as I'm just more accostomed to the shifting "method" with Campy.
> 
> If it matters, I don't believe that you can "Double-dump" with Force, nor shift 4-5 gears "in one swipe" with Force, as you can with Chorus.


+3


@cxwrench -- do you know if there's a thread about waving while riding a 53/39?


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

Here's an ergonomic feature that I have found very useful: lever reach adjustment.

SRAM and Shimano have this. Campy does not. I rode Campy for nearly 20 years, and always struggled with lever reach in the drops. I even resorted to the epoxy tweak.

If lever reach is an issue, then adjustable lever SRAM is the way to go.


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## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

I thing I am going with the bike that has the Campy Chorus 11 spd.

It doesn't come with a wheelset as I am buying from a friend.

I have a newer Ultegra 6800 wheelset with 10 spd cassette for my Shimano component road bike.

Is there any way this wheelset will work with the Campy Chorus 11 spd drive train?


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

If the wheelset is newer as mentioned and you have a 10 speed on it you should have a spacer as well. Remove the spacer and use an 11 speed "shimano type" cassette. 11 is 11.


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## davcruz (Oct 9, 2007)

mikerp said:


> If the wheelset is newer as mentioned and you have a 10 speed on it you should have a spacer as well. Remove the spacer and use an 11 speed "shimano type" cassette. 11 is 11.


mikerp, I have not researched 11 speed too much but am now. This is a fact; 11 speed Shimano cassette will shift perfectly with Campag shifters/RD? I also have 6800 wheelset but thinking of Campag 11 speed group for a nice steel Duell I just bought.


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

Straight from the Man.
Drivetrain compatibility hidden in plain sight - VeloNews.com


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

mikerp said:


> Straight from the Man.
> Drivetrain compatibility hidden in plain sight - VeloNews.com


Needs updated, Campy changed their derailleur pull ratios for 2015 (breaking compatibility with prior Campy groups)...Although maybe I'll be surprised and things would still just work.


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

Marc said:


> Needs updated, Campy changed their derailleur pull ratios for 2015 (breaking compatibility with prior Campy groups)...Although maybe I'll be surprised and things would still just work.


The question at hand (and in the article) is can you swap out wheels with 11 speed cassettes between groups.
Campy didn't change their cassette with the 2015 groups, as stated and 11 speed cassette is and 11 speed cassette, thus you can interchange 11 speed wheels between systems (with minor adjustment).


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## davcruz (Oct 9, 2007)

mikerp said:


> Straight from the Man.
> Drivetrain compatibility hidden in plain sight - VeloNews.com


Thanks mikerp! Now I feel comfortable if I decide to setup my new frame with Campag Athena 11 and I can run my brand new 6800 wheel set. Awesome!


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## David Loving (Jun 13, 2008)

If it is between Campagnolo and any other set, always go with Campy. You'll never go wrong.


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## aureliajulia (May 25, 2009)

Campy Campy Campy.

You will seriously regret SRAM. Well, I do, I got Force on my PInarello. Big mistake. I had to change the front chainring a year in because it was defective, and the group has never shifted all that well. My old Shimano 105 on my old Cannondale was 100% better. So is the 105 on my CAADX. I'd say Campy even if it weren't Chorus 11, but a lower level group. Chorus is great. I've tried it, and it's highly recommended by a lot of cyclists I know. I intend to rebuild my bike with it as soon as financially realistic.


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

Your welcome.
BTW I have Athena, Chorus, Record, and some Super Record (11)
So my vote is Campy


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

David Loving said:


> If it is between Campagnolo and any other set, always go with Campy. You'll never go wrong.





aureliajulia said:


> Campy Campy Campy.
> 
> You will seriously regret SRAM. Well, I do, I got Force on my PInarello. Big mistake. I had to change the front chainring a year in because it was defective, and the group has never shifted all that well. My old Shimano 105 on my old Cannondale was 100% better. So is the 105 on my CAADX. I'd say Campy even if it weren't Chorus 11, but a lower level group. Chorus is great. I've tried it, and it's highly recommended by a lot of cyclists I know. I intend to rebuild my bike with it as soon as financially realistic.


You 2 have literally no idea what you're talking about. ALL drivetrains will work if set up correctly. Shimano, great. SRAM, great. Campy, great. Microshift, pretty darn good. It really sucks when you make blanket statements based on your own experience only...there are thousands and thousands of riders that have drivetrains from companies not based in Italy that work just fine. Qualify your statements of experience or don't post crap. I actually have a Campy bike in my work stand right now that doesn't shift worth a sh*t...but I'm not gonna slam Campy and say Shimano is the only way to, I'm going to set up the Campy bike so it works correctly. If you can't tell posts like yours fairly piss me off. 

/rant


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

cxwrench said:


> You 2 have literally no idea what you're talking about. ALL drivetrains will work if set up correctly. Shimano, great. SRAM, great. Campy, great. Microshift, pretty darn good. It really sucks when you make blanket statements based on your own experience only...there are thousands and thousands of riders that have drivetrains from companies not based in Italy that work just fine. Qualify your statements of experience or don't post crap. I actually have a Campy bike in my work stand right now that doesn't shift worth a sh*t...but I'm not gonna slam Campy and say Shimano is the only way to, I'm going to set up the Campy bike so it works correctly. If you can't tell posts like yours fairly piss me off.
> 
> /rant


Yup...all these groups will run fine, unless something is seriously out of tolerance on the frame it is fit on...or something gets dropped and damaged, or your housing is seriously mucked up internally. That being said they all have their idiot moments of design, like Campy's "Powertorque" crank system that requires a proprietary crank puller that costs as much as the crankset itself. Could also question the ultra-torque system's engineered inability to deal with much variance in BB shell width.

The difference between Campy, Shimano, and SRAM is what shifter action and ergonomics you like most.


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## Roland44 (Mar 21, 2013)

David Loving said:


> If it is between Campagnolo and any other set, always go with Campy. You'll never go wrong.


+1 for Campy


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

lucky13 said:


> Is there a big difference in quality/performance between the two?


The first question and the first answer here is: do you prefer DoubleTap single-lever shifting (SRAM) or "classic" two-lever shifting (Capagnolo)?

The difference between these two shifting ergonomics is massive (in terms of _ergonomics_ specifically, not in terms of performance), which means that until you answer this question, no other qestions (or answers) will make any sense. Of course, if you never tried both, then you will not be able to answer this question until you actually try.

Trying to ask it on the Internet will only fetch you a barrage of facepalmingly useless "I'm-a-teen-from-Facebook-generation"-grade comments, like "+1" and "^^^This".

And no, there's no objective difference in quality or performance between SRAM and Capagnolo.


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## Guod (Jun 9, 2011)

Whichever one you think is cooler. Make sure all the people you ride with are impressed by it too. If they look down their noses at it, that also means they secretly like it. Just make sure no one is indifferent.

Then you'll know you got the best group. Buy an SRM while you're at it too.

(This actually is the correct way to decide a bike build. There are no other factors as all component groups are pretty equal and it's mostly how much you want to spend/your bike to be lightweight.)


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## Keoki (Feb 13, 2012)

If you get the Campy make sure you know about the FD trim when you're crossed chained. I learned this couple months ago. =)


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## mrcreosote (Sep 9, 2010)

The one thing you can do with Campy Ultrashift you can't do with any other lever - Ride with your hands on the bar tops, reach out with a finger on your right hand, hit the button and change up a gear without having to shift your hand to the hoods.


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## Drew Eckhardt (Nov 11, 2009)

lucky13 said:


> I am looking at 2 bikes and one has Campagnolo Chorus and the other has SRAM Force.
> 
> Is there a big difference in quality/performance between the two?


Enormous.

Chorus will shift five cogs smaller per lever actuation, so if you run out of cogs on your big ring getting to the next one is a pair of thumb shoves. SRAM does not, so with a compact crank and tight cassette it's CLICK-release-click-release-click-release-click-release-click-release.

Chorus will run a triple crank, so if you end up with a bit of middle age spread you can have tight and low gears to run the same cassette in mountains and flat ground. SRAM will not.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Drew Eckhardt said:


> Enormous.
> 
> Chorus will *shift five cogs smaller per lever actuation*, so if you run out of cogs on your big ring getting to the next one is a pair of thumb shoves. SRAM does not, so with a compact crank and tight cassette it's CLICK-release-click-release-click-release-click-release-click-release.
> 
> Chorus will run a triple crank, so if you end up with a bit of middle age spread you can have tight and low gears to run the same cassette in mountains and flat ground. SRAM will not.


Not to beat this idiotic thread to death, but when is this actually all that important? You can't do it w/ Shimano either. It doesn't seem to keep any racers from winning any of those Grand Tour things.


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

cxwrench said:


> Not to beat this idiotic thread to death, but when is this [multiple downshifts] actually all that important?


As a former Campy owner, I found this feature to be pretty nifty, but in practical terms it wasn't important...and in fact it led to more than a few dropped and jammed chains is I shifted the front derailleur to soon after a rear derailleur multi-shift.


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## Drew Eckhardt (Nov 11, 2009)

cxwrench said:


> Not to beat this idiotic thread to death, but when is this actually all that important?


When riding a compact crank where front shifts are more frequent and there's a bigger ratio difference in the rings to compensate for.

With no one paying me to ride I'm unwilling to accept a less than optimal riding experience involving things like less functionality than we had with down-tube shifters or two tooth gaps in my cassettes before the 19 cog.



> You can't do it w/ Shimano either. It doesn't seem to keep any racers from winning any of those Grand Tour things.


Driving around the speed limit a new BMW doesn't get you where you're going any faster than a 20 year old Honda Accord, although the experience is a lot more pleasant.


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## ziscwg (Apr 19, 2010)

aureliajulia said:


> Campy Campy Campy.
> 
> You will seriously regret SRAM. Well, I do, I got Force on my PInarello. Big mistake. I had to change the front chainring a year in because it was defective, and the group has never shifted all that well. My old Shimano 105 on my old Cannondale was 100% better. So is the 105 on my CAADX. I'd say Campy even if it weren't Chorus 11, but a lower level group. Chorus is great. I've tried it, and it's highly recommended by a lot of cyclists I know. I intend to rebuild my bike with it as soon as financially realistic.


I never regret my SRAM Force.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

Drew Eckhardt said:


> When riding a compact crank where front shifts are more frequent and there's a bigger ratio difference in the rings to compensate for.
> 
> With no one paying me to ride I'm unwilling to accept a less than optimal riding experience involving things like less functionality than we had with down-tube shifters or two tooth gaps in my cassettes before the 19 cog.
> 
> ...


Apples and llamas much?


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## AndreyT (Dec 1, 2011)

Drew Eckhardt said:


> Driving around the speed limit a new BMW doesn't get you where you're going any faster than a 20 year old Honda Accord, although the experience is a lot more pleasant.


In the Accord, that is.


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## aureliajulia (May 25, 2009)

cxwrench said:


> You 2 have literally no idea what you're talking about. ALL drivetrains will work if set up correctly. Shimano, great. SRAM, great. Campy, great. Microshift, pretty darn good. It really sucks when you make blanket statements based on your own experience only...there are thousands and thousands of riders that have drivetrains from companies not based in Italy that work just fine. Qualify your statements of experience or don't post crap. I actually have a Campy bike in my work stand right now that doesn't shift worth a sh*t...but I'm not gonna slam Campy and say Shimano is the only way to, I'm going to set up the Campy bike so it works correctly. If you can't tell posts like yours fairly piss me off.
> 
> /rant



I've had that group adjusted over and over since I bought it in 2012. Both at bikes shops, and by my riding 'buddies' who work on their own bikes. I also had to replace the front large chain ring after about a year because the teeth actually wore out and several broke. I live at sea-level, and the crankset does not get used as aggressively in this terrain as in the mountain. I try to spin more than anything. But, it's STILL a toss-up every time I shift in front whether it will work. The group is a piece of crap. 

But then, so is your post. 

Go be pissed off if you want. 

Childish.


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

aureliajulia said:


> I've had that group adjusted over and over since I bought it in 2012. Both at bikes shops, and by my riding 'buddies' who work on their own bikes. I also had to replace the front large chain ring after about a year because the teeth actually wore out and several broke. I live at sea-level, and the crankset does not get used as aggressively in this terrain as in the mountain. I try to spin more than anything. But, it's STILL a toss-up every time I shift in front whether it will work. The group is a piece of crap.
> 
> But then, so is your post.
> 
> ...


I'm telling you that SRAM works fine when it's properly adjusted. I've worked w/ it for longer than pretty much anyone as I worked for the team that rode pre-production stuff in '06. Been trained by SRAM. Worked neutral for SRAM. Force works. It's not completely out of the question that everyone that has touched your bike doesn't know what they're doing. I fix other people's screw up every damn day. I have more experience working on bikes that you can even imagine.

You...on the other hand...have your own personal experience. With your bike. And only your bike. Who do you think knows more about SRAM? 

You 'broke' chainring teeth? If you did you're one of the only people in the world to do that. Why don't you show us some photos? My money says they're not broken. I'd love to have a crack at working on your bike, I have no doubt it would shift just fine after I got finished w/ it. And again, qualify your feelings as 'your own personal experience' when you make posts like this. You can't tell me that you haven't seen many more people have SRAM groups that work perfectly than those w/ apparently non-functioning parts. Why haven't you ever asked your shop to contact SRAM? They have the best CS in the business by far. Why should I think your 'riding buddies' have a clue about working on bikes? Might as well be the guy at the coffee shop.


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## Pirx (Aug 9, 2009)

Keoki said:


> If you get the Campy make sure you know about the FD trim when you're crossed chained.


I have never needed it on my SR11. Runs fine fully cross-chained either way, without trimming.


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## ziscwg (Apr 19, 2010)

Drew Eckhardt said:


> Enormous.
> 
> Chorus will shift five cogs smaller per lever actuation, so if you run out of cogs on your big ring getting to the next one is a pair of thumb shoves. SRAM does not, so with a compact crank and tight cassette it's CLICK-release-click-release-click-release-click-release-click-release.
> 
> Chorus will run a triple crank, so if you end up with a bit of middle age spread you can have tight and low gears to run the same cassette in mountains and flat ground. SRAM will not.





cxwrench said:


> Not to beat this idiotic thread to death, but when is this actually all that important? You can't do it w/ Shimano either. It doesn't seem to keep any racers from winning any of those Grand Tour things.


In mtb, this large shift matters. However, on my road rig, I can't think of a time I *needed *to drop 5 cogs on the cassette in an instant.


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