# Frankie Andreu?????



## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

His comments tonight on Versus about the Tour and the doping are quite hypocritical. Didn't he admit to the very thing that he seems frustrated with?


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

Just curious, what was he saying tonight?


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## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

Andreu said, when he found out about Ras this morning, "I threw up my hands and said what are we going to do now. I was kinda fed up and at the same time I didn't even care about the end result of the tour."


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## gray8110 (Dec 11, 2001)

dwwheels said:


> His comments tonight on Versus about the Tour and the doping are quite hypocritical. Didn't he admit to the very thing that he seems frustrated with?


It's only hypocritical in the same way that David Millar is for being so vocal and saying the same things.

It is possible to change your ways. Andreu seems to be genuine in his love for the sport and his hopes that it can be a clean sport.


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## barbedwire (Dec 3, 2005)

People that bag on Andreu just want to discredit him because he spoke out against a former teammate. This is you, the domestique. This is your teammate on drugs. 7 times. Any questions?


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## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

dwwheels said:


> His comments tonight on Versus about the Tour and the doping are quite hypocritical. Didn't he admit to the very thing that he seems frustrated with?


Don't people get it?

Prior to the last couple of years it was almost certainly the case that a rider had to dope to keep their job. Meaning either in terms of getting results or because of expectations from the team management.

It appears at least the general attitude toward doping from many riders, teams, organizers and maybe even the UCI has and is in the process of changing.

If the criteria to be against modern day doping is to be totally "clean" then almost any person who's been involved in cycling more than maybe 4 or 5 years is almost certainly a hypocrite.


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## Tschai (Jun 19, 2003)

dwwheels said:


> His comments tonight on Versus about the Tour and the doping are quite hypocritical. Didn't he admit to the very thing that he seems frustrated with?


Life is hypocritical. I never really understood why so many people focus on it. If being hypocritical was so worng, we could never change our minds or perspectives. Life lessons would be meaningless. Living would be without nuance. 

However, as a cycling announcer/commentator/interviewer, he sucks anus balls.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

dwwheels said:


> His comments tonight on Versus about the Tour and the doping are quite hypocritical. Didn't he admit to the very thing that he seems frustrated with?


He is an awful sports announcer. Just because you were a cyclist doesn't make you a good announcer. I hate his voice.


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## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

I get the whole thing. My problem with Frankie is he could not have looked anymore uncomfortable. I doubt anyone held a gun to his head to make him appear on the Versus segment to give his opinion on doping. I am frankly tired of hearing these rehabilitated ("born agains") dopers like Andreu, Millar, etc. tell us how frustrated they are, but willingly cheated and now want us to listen to their gospel. I know people can change and I am far from perfect, but pass the offering plate elsewhere because I am not buying Frankie's sermon.


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## asgelle (Apr 21, 2003)

dwwheels said:


> ... but willingly cheated ...


How do you know any of these riders state of mind or motivation? Are you in personal contact with them?


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## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

asgelle said:


> How do you know any of these riders *state of mind* or *motivation*? Are you in personal contact with them?


Motivation.......Money & Fame.
State of Mind.....I am a cheater, but everyone should believe me now.

Willingly cheated.......I don't believe Frankie ever stated the needle was inserted at gunpoint, but he is a self admitted cheater and is he believable at this point. 

As far as personal contact with cheaters goes, I would prefer to distance myself from self destructive behavior.


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## asgelle (Apr 21, 2003)

dwwheels said:


> As far as personal contact with cheaters goes, I would prefer to distance myself from self destructive behavior.


In other words, you don't know them at all and have no idea what pressures they're under and what their motivations are; trying to pass off your fictions as fact.


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## Fredke (Dec 10, 2004)

asgelle said:


> How do you know any of these riders state of mind or motivation? Are you in personal contact with them?


Millar, Zabel, Rijs, Jakche, and Basso all did tell the press that they doped by their own decision.


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## terzo rene (Mar 23, 2002)

Dang it! My life is severely lacking in nuance! It's been more of one long fish slapping dance so far.


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## lookrider (Dec 3, 2006)

dwwheels said:


> Motivation.......Money & Fame.
> State of Mind.....I am a cheater, but everyone should believe me now..


You ever cheated? at anything? lied? you're completely pure?




dwwheels said:


> Willingly cheated.......I don't believe Frankie ever stated the needle was inserted at gunpoint, but he is a self admitted cheater and is he believable at this point..


Ever had you job threatened? Experienced any dilemmas? Unless you're a "stoic philosopher" for whom dilemmas don't exist, I'll bet you have.



dwwheels said:


> As far as personal contact with cheaters goes, I would prefer to distance myself from self destructive behavior.


Some consider taking a moral stand, with very little chance of being believed, to be self destructive behavior. So he doesn't succumb to the needle, he's out of a job.

Yes, LA won 7 times. Now the price is that he is being discredited. The more info we get, the more it appears he was a drug cheat. Was it worth it. For me it wouldn't be. I'm a delivery boy for Fedex for 14 years. I'm very tired of my job, and that job is threatened on a fairly regular basis. Would I change places with LA. Absolutely not.

Even though I'm guilty of many transgressions, I want to believe in the truth. LA appears to want to silence the truth. He and all the people around him have a tragic existence. 

The softest pillow is a clear conscience.


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## lookrider (Dec 3, 2006)

Fredke said:


> Millar, Zabel, Rijs, Jakche, and Basso all did tell the press that they doped by their own decision.


Yes, that's called taking responsibility or abiding by the omerta.

You're delving into philosophy, what makes us human and seperates us from animals.

BF Skinner said that Responsibility is a myth.

WB Yeats wrote, "In dreams begins responsibility."

"No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible."
Stanislaw Jerzy Lec


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## bonkmiester (Sep 23, 2005)

terzo rene said:


> Dang it! My life is severely lacking in nuance! It's been more of *one long fish slapping dance* so far.


...the nuance could be in the fish...

...say slapped by a walleye or a rainbow trout...


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## Dawgdodger (Jun 10, 2006)

Robbie Ventura is another one who is worthless,,, suprised they brought him back given his association with Floyd.


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## pedalruns (Dec 18, 2002)

dwwheels said:


> Motivation.......Money & Fame.
> State of Mind.....I am a cheater, but everyone should believe me now.
> 
> Willingly cheated.......I don't believe Frankie ever stated the needle was inserted at gunpoint, but he is a self admitted cheater and is he believable at this point.
> ...



PLEASE....... your post makes me sick.... 


Oh and Discovery/US Postal is so good... and pure.... how could Frankie do such a thing....


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Andreu was a lying cheater and NEVER admitted it until his wife dragged him into that disaster. 

Even then his admissions were totally self-serving and VERY Basso-ish. 

IMHO, he probably doped as much as Basso. Only even with the needle, he still was a mediocre rider who was quickly supplanted by George H then Lance in both popularity and earnings- a fact which had to drive him and his wife mad. 

The only thing worse then cheating is cheating and still not being very good. 

Deserves to work at Burger King, not cycling.


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## Guest (Jul 30, 2007)

lookrider said:


> Ever had you job threatened? Experienced any dilemmas? Unless you're a "stoic philosopher" for whom dilemmas don't exist, I'll bet you have.


Bottom line is that doping is fraud, deceiving the public and cheating.

Procyling is not a charity for the 'almost good enough' to retain or get nice job as a domestique because they have no other skills. If a cyclist is not cutting the mustard, then tough, it is supposed to be a hard sport with a high standard, anything else just degrades it, so do not give me the 'they just did EPO to keep their job' nonsense.

We have civil and criminal laws to stop people lying and cheating. Society depends upon trust and people acting honestly most of the time. So why should Pro-cycling get a pass?


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## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

Coolhand said:


> IMHO, he probably doped as much as Basso.


Well his wife seems pretty insistent that he just took EPO because it was necessary and that he wasn't on a full-blown program like Lance, Basso and other big riders.


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## pedalruns (Dec 18, 2002)

the_rydster said:


> Bottom line is that doping is fraud, deceiving the public and cheating.
> 
> Procyling is not a charity for the 'almost good enough' to retain or get nice job as a domestique because they have no other skills. If a cyclist is not cutting the mustard, then tough, it is supposed to be a hard sport with a high standard, anything else just degrades it, so do not give me the 'they just did EPO to keep their job' nonsense.
> 
> We have civil and criminal laws to stop people lying and cheating. Society depends upon trust and people acting honestly most of the time. So why should Pro-cycling get a pass?


This is not just a one guy here and one guy there not cutting the mustard problem taking PED's, it is the whole culture of the sport that has gotton out of hand.. 

IMO.... Frankie Andreau has tried to do something about the HUGE problem..... People talking about him speaking for his own benifit... is bs, his coming out and talking about what goes on in the peloton has just about ruined his life... more need to talk like Frankie and not hide the truth...


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## barbedwire (Dec 3, 2005)

*Armstrong can stick it*

Frankie is a good guy. Lance, not so. And cycling is riddled with dopers and liers. Bravo to Andreu for stepping up and doing something to clean up the sport. I mean, he could've went with the status quo and kept the code of doping silence that permeates all of the peloton. That's not the right thing to do, and I'm giving him props for taking a stand against doping. Armstrong can stick it.


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

barbedwire said:


> Frankie is a good guy. Lance, not so. And cycling is riddled with dopers and liers. Bravo to Andreu for stepping up and doing something to clean up the sport. I mean, he could've went with the status quo and kept the code of doping silence that permeates all of the peloton. That's not the right thing to do, and I'm giving him props for taking a stand against doping. Armstrong can stick it.


You mean Armstrong has not taken a stance on doping? Where have you been the last 5 years, barbie?


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

wipeout said:


> You mean Armstrong has not taken a stance on doping? Where have you been the last 5 years, barbie?


I don't know about you but I have been following cycling for the last 5....make that 25 years, and I hear nothing from Lance about doping. I just hear him saying we need to believe in miracles, see him chasing down riders who want a clean sport or out his doping doctor.


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Dwayne Barry said:


> Well his wife seems pretty insistent that he just took EPO because it was necessary and that he wasn't on a full-blown program like Lance, Basso and other big riders.


Yeah, denial isn't just a river in Egypt. She married a doper, a guy who didn't do much on the bike, and not much (other then get fired as a director for a domestic team for not showing up) off of it.

Big George and Armstrong got the wins, money and glory that he and his wife seem to think he deserved. Then to top it off, it turns out the only cheater she _actually_ knew about was her husband. Classy.


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

Coolhand said:


> Yeah, denial isn't just a river in Egypt. She married a doper, a guy who didn't do much on the bike, and not much (other then get fired as a director for a domestic team for not showing up) off of it.
> 
> Big George and Armstrong got the wins, money and glory that he and his wife seem to think he deserved. Then to top it off, it turns out the only cheater she _actually_ knew about was her husband. Classy.



Wow, spectacularly uninformed post. If you call finishing 9 tours "Not doing much on the bike" The what is? If you call a guy who used EPO once to get ready for the tour a doper then what do you call a guy who tested positive 6 times for EPO, as well as Cortisone, and used a convicted doping doctor like Ferrari?

Frankie was fired because of his SCA testimony, not for his pre-excused absence....at a small race his team dominated. The "Not showing up" excuse was just a smoke screen.

Please give us some proof as to how Betsy seems to think her husband should have more glory? I never heard anything remotely close to this invented position.

If you comb thru cycling, asking pros, mechanics, ex-pros, people that actually know the the Andreus you will have a very difficult time finding anyone, not named Lance or Johann, to talk badly of them.


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## Tschai (Jun 19, 2003)

bigpinkt said:


> If you comb thru cycling, asking pros, mechanics, ex-pros, people that actually know the the Andreus you will have a very difficult time finding anyone, not named Lance or Johann, to talk badly of them.


Have they seen the Versus coverage? Watch that and they may have something bad to say.


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

pedalruns said:


> IMO.... Frankie Andreau has tried to do something about the HUGE problem..... People talking about him speaking for his own benifit... is bs, his coming out and_* talking about what goes on in the peloton has just about ruined his life*_... more need to talk like Frankie and not hide the truth...


What? Ruined his life? If he wants to stay in the cycling/media world (he has stated this is his goal) then his gig on VS is about as good as he can ever get. VS promotes him as some imperical authority on all things professional. He is pretty close to the top of his industry esp. for his age(media cycing), and I don't think his stance has hurt him professionaly in the least.

Personally, it wasn't the whistle blowing that hurt him, it was the doping itself that about ruined his life. As others have said, his wife just about left him unless he spilled the beans. Now, he might have lost a few riding partners over his actions, but hell, that happens all the time.


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## mikeman (Sep 17, 2005)

bigpinkt said:


> Wow, spectacularly uninformed post. If you call finishing 9 tours "Not doing much on the bike" The what is? If you call a guy who used EPO once to get ready for the tour a doper then what do you call a guy who tested positive 6 times for EPO, as well as Cortisone, and used a convicted doping doctor like Ferrari?
> 
> Frankie was fired because of his SCA testimony, not for his pre-excused absence....at a small race his team dominated. The "Not showing up" excuse was just a smoke screen.
> 
> ...


Well put. 

Anyone who does not see through that smokescreen, probably does not think there is anything evil in Lance's zipped lips motion to Ullrich upon coming back to the peloton following his adventure with Simeoni. Not much needs to be understood other than Lance was played by the rules of omerta. Lance made sure Andreu got fired, for spitting into the soup as they say. Lance tried to do the same to Lemond. Both Lemond and Andreu are vilified by those with heads firmly up their arses, who continue to worship at the altar of St. Lance. Right, right, he never tested positive. Sure, and your dog ate your homework. Nice have a nice day and go have another glass of this nice Kool Aid, the holy sacrament in the worship of St. Lance.


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## yanksphan (May 18, 2005)

Some pretty self righteous comments here...


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## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

lookrider said:


> You ever cheated? at anything? lied? you're completely pure?



I know I am not "completely pure", but I doubt anyone is. I have taken the occasional company ink pen home, added an additional unauthorized 5-10 minutes to my lunch break, called in sick on a sunny 80 degree day, etc. The usual stuff that I would rank up there with EPO and deceiving your sponsors who are paying you millions for being deceitful. 

Also I am not writing books about my shortcomings/dishonesty and trying to profit off the sales of such books. How about Frankie donating the money from the book sales/interviews to the testing labs to fight the doping problem like LA did.:thumbsup:


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

dwwheels said:


> I know I am not "completely pure", but I doubt anyone is. I have taken the occasional company ink pen home, added an additional unauthorized 5-10 minutes to my lunch break, called in sick on a sunny 80 degree day, etc. The usual stuff that I would rank up there with EPO and deceiving your sponsors who are paying you millions for being deceitful.
> 
> Also I am not writing books about my shortcomings/dishonesty and trying to profit off the sales of such books. How about Frankie donating the money from the book sales/interviews to the testing labs to fight the doping problem like LA did.:thumbsup:


Pretty heavy accusations, you are saying that Frankie got paid for interviews and a book.....where is this book as you seem to be the only person to have read it? You also seem to be the only person with inside knowledge of Frankie getting paid for interviews, perhaps you could share more with us about how Frankie has turned this into a giant money making opportunity.


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

Pretty simple stuff:

1. Make up allegations of Lance doping.
2. ...?
3. Profit!


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## akod (Feb 18, 2007)

*Why the beef?*



barbedwire said:


> Frankie is a good guy. Lance, not so. And cycling is riddled with dopers and liers. Bravo to Andreu for stepping up and doing something to clean up the sport. I mean, he could've went with the status quo and kept the code of doping silence that permeates all of the peloton. That's not the right thing to do, and I'm giving him props for taking a stand against doping. Armstrong can stick it.


<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o> 
<o></o>
<o></o>
Ok - I've been reading this silently and have to ask...<o></o>
<o></o>

Do you know personally know Frankie Andreau? Do you personally know Lance Armstrong?<o></o>
<o></o>

If not, then why say "Armstrong can stick it"? Stick what and why? Because you've done all the analysis to say that he is absolutely 10000% guilty of everything? He's not my hero or anything like it but I also can say that I know a few folks who know him and that he trained and trained and trained - focused on winning only the Tour (which everyone bagged on him for) and did so more meticulously than anyone in recent memory. You don't think Eddy and Hinault doped? You know they did and you don't seem to care.<o></o>
<o></o>
The man was almost dead - he fake that too? His doctor's must have made that whole thing up in some elaborate scheme?

A person that went through chemo and radiation therapy would mess with their system by taking drugs or transfusing blood? The math just doesn't add up. <o></o>
<o></o>

I'm sure they never really landed on the moon either - I saw the film with O.J. and James Brolin - I KNOW the truth.
<o></o> 
<o></o>
Stop finger-pointing and fix our sport with real solutions!!!


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## Guest (Jul 31, 2007)

SilasCL said:


> Pretty simple stuff:
> 
> 1. Make up allegations of Lance doping.
> 2. ...?
> 3. Profit!


By that logic all investigative journalism must be pedaling lies?


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

SilasCL said:


> Pretty simple stuff:
> 
> 1. Make up allegations of Lance doping.
> 2. ...?
> 3. Profit!


Please use this formula to explain how Frankie profited?


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

You know it was a joke, right?

Here's the scenario someone has set up:

Frankie, former pro cyclist, has little notable going for him except for his former job as a pro cyclist. This gives him instant credibility as a DS, announcer, or in the future maybe heading up a coaching business or as a sales guy for some kind of cycling product. Now, with that in mind, he's decided that he's not happy with the really nice setup he has, and instead will tell Walsh that Lance doped (anonymously mind you) undoubtedly for the huge paycheck Walsh will write him. When the SCA trial comes around and Walsh puts the Andreus into contact with the right people, Frankie doesn't want to testify, but his wife does. Undoubtedly she is being paid big bucks for this testimony...right? Oh, and according to her, Frankie didn't want her to testify, but she did it anyways.

How is getting blacklisted helping Frankie's career? Or making him large sums of money?

That's a pretty untenable theory.


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## SilasCL (Jun 14, 2004)

Oh jeez, you guys gotta watch more south park, or catch up on your lame internet memes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underpants_Gnomes#The_Gnomes


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## dwwheels (Feb 28, 2007)

bigpinkt said:


> Pretty heavy accusations, you are saying that Frankie got paid for interviews and a book.....where is this book as you seem to be the only person to have read it? You also seem to be the only person with inside knowledge of Frankie getting paid for interviews, perhaps you could share more with us about how Frankie has turned this into a giant money making opportunity.


Obviously you didn't take the 'Thumbs Up' as sarcasm, but the second portion of my post was a joke about people capitalizing on deceitful practices by writing a book, giving interviews for profit or donating to random drug testing labs (hence the LA reference). PM me bigpinkt, I would like to introduce you to a small, upstart, no-obligation company called Amway (giant money making opportunity).:thumbsup:


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## fishtaco (Mar 28, 2007)

*Listens to these and make your decision about Betsy Andreu, Lemond and Walsh...*

Here are some links to recent interviews of Betsy Andreu, Walsh and Lemond. They are very revealing and it is hard to come up with a good motive for why they would make this stuff up.

Andreu - http://www.competitorradio.com/details.php?show=154

Walsh - http://www.competitorradio.com/details.php?show=150

Lemond - http://www.competitorradio.com/details.php?show=21


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## 23mjm (Apr 9, 2007)

Sometimes in life what is more important is not what you did yesterday but what you do today and tomorrow!!!

What also surprises me is all of you who do not believe you can learn from your mistakes or all of you choir boy who never did anything wrong. I know I have made mistake and learned from those mistakes. 

I believe those who have doped in the past, admitted it, and moved on to be clean riders.


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## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

sorry if I missed the sarcasm

To answer the other question, I do know Betsy. The idea that she is lying is insane. I am sure that anyone who has spoken to or met her even briefly will quickly figure out she is not one to make things up, nor one to be pushed around.


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