# Not cool - Colnago CLX broken headtube...



## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

This has really turned my stomach, and sadly, I probably will never purchase another Colnago. The headset reinforcement ring came out of the frame when the lower headset cup was removed (using the proper tools). It also took some carbon with it. Either I pay to have Calfee fix it, or it is very expensive wall art. I was so angry that I didn't do anything. No cursing, no yelling at it, no throwing tools, nothing.

Apparently, I need ten posts to post an image. Lame.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Post 7


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Post 8


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Post 9


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Post 10


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Now can I post an image?

Ugg, nevermind.


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## Dajianshan (Jul 15, 2007)

How about the warranty for a replacement frame?


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

I've been told there is only a two year warranty period. This is from the shop, which I respect, that sold me the frame.


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## Italianrider76 (May 13, 2005)

2 years??? Screw that for a joke....Colnago doesn't seem to stand behind its product.


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## ultraman6970 (Aug 1, 2010)

A lot of italian manufacturers give a warranty that is just uber ridiculous. Pinarello at some point was giving like 6 months, thought colnago was giving at least 3 years. BMC gives you like 5 in carbon frames. Chinese mainland copy frames are usually warrantied 1 year.

Next time pick a frame with integrated headset or even a semi integrated (never got a problem with them ever). I really don't trust regular pressed headsets in carbon frames because I thought that at some point the thing that happened to you could happen, wonder why they did not glued a full steel or Ti front tube instead of reinforcements rings.

Call calfee and see how much is to fix it, the guys doubt will charge you too much, Wonder if they can sleeve the whole front tube now, that should cure the problem right away forever. Cheaper than a new colnago, even u can resell it for good money.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

Hope you can get to the point where you can post pix. It might be something as simple to fix as epoxying it back.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

I sent an email to Calfee last night. I've had them do some simple work before and it was fantastic.

A three year warranty on a frame from a company who prides themselves on quality craftsmanship and their long heritage is just ridiculous.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

my suspicion is that most manufacturers would claim user error for a failure like that unless it was being worked on by an authorized dealer.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

These warranties are ridiculous. Colnago offers what, 2-3 years. Pinarello is selling their Dogma 2 electronic-ready frame for $6800 with a TWO year warranty. 

It's amazing that people actually find this acceptable.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

This is also the reason no one press fits headsets directly into carbon anymore. 

Sorry for your loss. Try Spyder composites for a less expensive repair.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Kontact - Thanks for the tip on Spyder. However, Calfee is just up the highway from me, so I'm going to stay local if possible.


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## thumper8888 (Apr 7, 2009)

calfee does great work, they can make it right if anyone can.


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## chiave04 (Jan 11, 2012)

are you sure that is a colnago failure? colnago doesn't work with cris king..
so sorry for your bike...


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

chiave04 - Thanks. The simple fact is that the aluminum sleeve should not have come out with the headset, especially since it was the first removal and has absolutely no other damage from crashing, dropping, etc. that would possibly loosen it.


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## JackDaniels (Oct 4, 2011)

I'd contact Colnago directly. Let them know you are the original owner, bought from a dealer, that you like their bikes and what happened to yours. Then if they don't offer you a replacement, you still have the option to 'probably never purchase another colnago'.


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## peabody (Oct 17, 2005)

Kontact said:


> This is also the reason no one press fits headsets directly into carbon anymore.
> 
> Sorry for your loss. Try Spyder composites for a less expensive repair.


they press fit bb's so whats your point:mad2:


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

JD - I sent an email to Colnago last night with the same photo, with all the info you suggested. It just is really disappointing since I had wanted a Colnago since I started racing at age 13. To me, they always had the aura of something amazing, almost mystical with the racing heritage.


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## Bridgestone (Sep 6, 2007)

Out of curiosity, why would you be removing what is generally considered a lifetime headset?


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## RJP Diver (Jul 2, 2010)

Give Spyder Composites a call/email as well. They just repaired a broken seat stay on my Cervelo R3 to "indistinguishable from new" condition - for 1/3rd the cost that Calfee quoted me.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

I wanted to use it on another frame that was getting more use and in need of a headset upgrade. Also, I was thinking of getting the more subtle Sotto Voce HS.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

peabody said:


> they press fit bb's so whats your point:mad2:


Not the same...


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

RJP - I thought better of it and sent them a RFI. Better to have multiple options!


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

I showed this to a co-worker, and he said "User error". Trek used to have the same issue.

The head tube has an alloy insert bonded into the frame. The headset is pressed into that insert. When you attempted to hammer out the headset, you probably placed the tool on the lip of the frame insert, not the headset (which is easy to do, since they are the same height). Then you hit that insert hard enough to break the epoxy bond.

After you get someone with the correct tool to separate the insert from the headset, you will probably be able to just bond it back in - as long as you can keep it straight in the head tube. You didn't necessarily damage the carbon head tube, but don't take my word on that.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

I find it annoying that people are so quick to judge, as your co-worker knows nothing about me and my bike knowledge.

I hear what you're saying about catching the lip though. I'll have to take a closer look at the inside of the headtube and at the insert tonight.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Seneb said:


> I find it annoying that people are so quick to judge, as your co-worker knows nothing about me and my bike knowledge.
> 
> I hear what you're saying about catching the lip though. I'll have to take a closer look at the inside of the headtube and at the insert tonight.


It isn't a "judgement" on your character. He's just seen this exact situation before, and that's what happened last time - to pro mechanics. You should be overjoyed that someone familiar with the situation chimed in before you knocked out the top one, too. I'm not sure why you're sour about it.

If you need to feel better about yourself, consider what a stupid design this is that doesn't leave a large and obvious difference between the insert and headset to prevent this from happening. It is Colnago and Trek's fault for designing something so stupid, but it was likely your hammer that caused it to come apart.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Kontact said:


> It isn't a "judgement" on your character. He's just seen this exact situation before, and that's what happened last time - to pro mechanics. You should be overjoyed that someone familiar with the situation chimed in before you knocked out the top one, too. I'm not sure why you're sour about it.
> 
> If you need to feel better about yourself, consider what a stupid design this is that doesn't leave a large and obvious difference between the insert and headset to prevent this from happening. It is Colnago and Trek's fault for designing something so stupid, but it was likely your hammer that caused it to come apart.


Sorry, I mistook how it was presented. My feelings are a bit raw about this.

As for the top one, it came out without a problem so I didn't expect a problem with the lower one. I agree that the design is pretty bad. I would have figured there would be a full length sleeve from top to bottom.


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## Peter P. (Dec 30, 2006)

I can't believe you're complaining about a 3 year warranty. If you didn't know what the warranty was at the time of purchase, then you were a poor consumer.

Now the question is; would you have purchased the Colnago regardless of the warranty?

I agree; 3 years is lame, but when you shop for a frame, you should be considering the warranty as well, then buy accordingly.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Thanks for the advice, Peter. I'll be sure to put that in my pocket for later.

Just to clarify, I was told 2 years.


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## penn_rider (Jul 11, 2009)

Seneb said:


> Thanks for the advice, Peter. I'll be sure to put that in my pocket for later.
> 
> Just to clarify, I was told 2 years.


I would still buy a Colnago...


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## TimV (Mar 20, 2007)

Seneb said:


>


It looks like the I.D. of that sleeve could have been larger to leave more of step to press out the headset cup. They probably left it thicker for added reinforcement. As for a full length sleeve, that would add weight.

The good news is, that looks like a pretty easy repair. You'll want to clean up the carbon inside the head tube. You could reuse the aluminum insert or turn a new one. Then just epoxy it back in. You might need a fixture to ensure concentricity with the upper bore. All pretty straight-forward stuff.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

FWIW - Calfee quoted me $100-200 to fix it and they won't have to touch the paint.


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## raymonda (Jan 31, 2007)

Consider this a blessing.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

Colnago -- the decline continues...


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

foto said:


> Colnago -- the decline continues...


You know, I'm no Colnago fan, but I don't understand your statement in the context of this thread.


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## Dajianshan (Jul 15, 2007)

I like Colnago well enough, and most products are prone to have an occasional unit with a problem. As we clamor for lighter and lighter bikes that the pros use for a season or less, manufacturers are naturally going to be less willing to extend a warranty beyond the expected limits of engineering. I don't think Colnago is in decline as much as I think the consumer has unrealistic expectations for the product.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

Well, it used to be a high end marquee that produced the finest frames. Now its just a high end marquee. So, fine. How about,

Colnago -- merely a shadow of its former self


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

I mean seriously. I'd say colnago peaked in the late 90s and whenever the c40 came out, that was their last really relevant bike. From there, they just became increasingly gimmicky and weird. Remember that one year, not too long ago, they put a B-stay on the Master X-Light, and stopped producing an all steel frame?

A company grasping for ideas. They were real innovators, but I think they are done pushing envelopes.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

The CLX is the frame made in Taiwan to sell to the masses, it is sold on big surface department sports shops here.

Certainly not representative of what Colnago is about. IMHO

Those saying Colnago is on decline have maybe not ridden one of the high end frames made in Italy. 

And to the OP sorry about your frame but as it was noted it seems like user error, but yes it is stoopid to use an insert the same length as the chris king cylinder, those taiwanese contractors should have known better. However I think chris king uses longer cylinders than many other headset makers.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

foto said:


> I mean seriously. I'd say colnago peaked in the late 90s and whenever the c40 came out, that was their last really relevant bike. From there, they just became increasingly gimmicky and weird. Remember that one year, not too long ago, they put a B-stay on the Master X-Light, and stopped producing an all steel frame?
> 
> A company grasping for ideas. They were real innovators, but I think they are done pushing envelopes.


The '80s was when you'd find Colnagos with unmitered tubes sometimes under the lugs.

The '90s was when all their Ti bikes broke.

Colnago still makes an all steel frame.

This particular bike didn't fail because of normal use.


Colnago has always been a gimmicky brand with its funny tube shapes and silly paint jobs. Some people like 'em, and that's fine - but I don't buy this golden age stuff. Maybe in the '60s or '70s.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

Dajianshan said:


> I like Colnago well enough, and most products are prone to have an occasional unit with a problem. As we clamor for lighter and lighter bikes that the pros use for a season or less, manufacturers are naturally going to be less willing to extend a warranty beyond the expected limits of engineering. I don't think Colnago is in decline as much as I think the consumer has unrealistic expectations for the product.


Actually, I quite disagree with you. If you look at Colnago and Pinarello, both make relatively heavy frames. The Dogma2 weighs in at over 1200 grams. The C59 Italia is no uber-lightweight either. Yet both have 2-year warranties, the worst in the business.

By comparison, the lightweight frame manufacturers, BMC, Cannondale, etc. have longer warranties. Orbea has a lifetime warranty.

Colnago is certainly not in decline. Their C59, by virtually all accounts, is an absolute winner.


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## MisterMike (Aug 12, 2004)

Seneb said:


> FWIW - Calfee quoted me $100-200 to fix it and they won't have to touch the paint.


I'd jump on that in a second. Especially if, as you say, "they are just up the highway" so you don't even have to ship the frame. I've certainly made more expensive mistakes (car stuff) in my time. Don't beat yourself up too much.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

MisterMike said:


> I'd jump on that in a second. Especially if, as you say, "they are just up the highway" so you don't even have to ship the frame. I've certainly made more expensive mistakes (car stuff) in my time. Don't beat yourself up too much.


Ha, I've made my share of car mistakes as well. I'll probably drive it up to Calfee on my next day off. Spyder Composites told me the repair "would be under $200." Since Calfee is closer and I have used them before, I'm going to have them fix this.

Thanks, everyone, for letting me vent about this.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

Colnago doesn't need longer warranties because it is a cult brand. A longer warranty is a way for other companies to add value to their frames and signal their quality. It's all marketing decisions. Besides, how many manufacturing defects don't reveal themselves in the first 2 years of use?


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## j.knight (Dec 14, 2005)

It is a bummer that you broke your head tube, but I don't think the warranty issue is relevant, as this was probably not a warranty issue to begin with.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

stevesbike said:


> Colnago doesn't need longer warranties because it is a cult brand. A longer warranty is a way for other companies to add value to their frames and signal their quality. It's all marketing decisions. Besides, how many manufacturing defects don't reveal themselves in the first 2 years of use?


Galvanic corrosion.


Either way, lifetime warranties were an industry standard until recently, and most high end, but popular brands still use them. This isn't like when Hyundai was starting out, this is a reduction in service and expectations.


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## trailrunner68 (Apr 23, 2011)

Seneb said:


> FWIW - Calfee quoted me $100-200 to fix it and they won't have to touch the paint.


The integrity of the head tube looks fine. You could glue the insert back in yourself. What is Calfee going to do here that you cannot?


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## peabody (Oct 17, 2005)

Kontact said:


> Galvanic corrosion.
> 
> 
> QUOTE]
> ...


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## cxwrench (Nov 9, 2004)

i was kinda thinking that same thing. i'll even give you some JB weld...


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

peabody said:


> Kontact said:
> 
> 
> > Galvanic corrosion.
> ...


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

Ok, point taken about branding, I guess colnago has always been a little goofy, especially considering their frames cost more than my car.

And about galvanic corrosion, Aluminum + Carbon fiber = Bad idea in general.

This is one of the explicit reasons the 787 is made of like composities and like 40%_titanium_ by weight. It certainly isn't because the geeks at Boeing wanted an upgrade in ride quality...


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

Two and three year warranties seem realistic to me. All of these companies that purport to have "lifetime" warranties rarely will actually service a claim that is over a few years old. Seen several examples over the years where the lifetime warranties were refused as general wear and tear. One person had a rear dropout break on their lifetime Lightspeed Ti bike with no warranty. Another had an older Cannondale CAAD8 be refused service when the seatstay cracked. It is very easy to make an excuse up to refute a lifetime warranty claim.


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## trailrunner68 (Apr 23, 2011)

nightfend said:


> Two and three year warranties seem realistic to me. All of these companies that purport to have "lifetime" warranties rarely will actually service a claim that is over a few years old. Seen several examples over the years where the lifetime warranties were refused as general wear and tear. One person had a rear dropout break on their lifetime Lightspeed Ti bike with no warranty. Another had an older Cannondale CAAD8 be refused service when the seatstay cracked. It is very easy to make an excuse up to refute a lifetime warranty claim.


Lifetime warranty does not mean lifetime of the buyer. It means expected lifetime of the product.

Euro companies often offer the length of warranty required by law, which I understand to be two years. For American companies a "lifetime warranty" is basically a marketing scheme.


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## RavenClaw (Jan 30, 2012)

I never really liked Colnago. I know too many cyclists who have had similar issues with Colnago frames. Its a company that relies on its reputation to sell frames but they have had quality control issues for a while now.

Another issue is that carbon frame builders are in a race to shave as much weight as they can. The lighter the frame, the better it sells. This is good up to a point but after a certain point the integrity of frame is compromised.

If you really like the frame then have Calfee repair it or better yet by a Calfee replacement frame. Calfee makes great carbon frames.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

nightfend said:


> Two and three year warranties seem realistic to me. All of these companies that purport to have "lifetime" warranties rarely will actually service a claim that is over a few years old. Seen several examples over the years where the lifetime warranties were refused as general wear and tear. One person had a rear dropout break on their lifetime Lightspeed Ti bike with no warranty. Another had an older Cannondale CAAD8 be refused service when the seatstay cracked. It is very easy to make an excuse up to refute a lifetime warranty claim.


I have seen plenty of old bikes with lifetime warranties honored. We have a customer who's 10 year old Lemond is getting replaced with a Trek, even. The handful of bad warranty service stories you hear doesn't reflect the basic nature of a lifetime warranty to the original purchaser.


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## Camilo (Jun 23, 2007)

MisterMike said:


> I'd jump on that in a second. Especially if, as you say, "they are just up the highway" so you don't even have to ship the frame. I've certainly made more expensive mistakes (car stuff) in my time. Don't beat yourself up too much.


$200 ain't chump change, but if I could resolve a mistake* with $200, I would be happy. I've made many mistakes of that magnitude.

*I happen to think that even thought OP probably knew what he was doing and pretty much removed the cup properly, the damage was probably user error. User error almost totally caused by a totally "gotcha" crappy design, one that is only predictable after a person makes the mistake once, but user error nonetheless. 

I also think there's nothing unreasonable with a 2 to 3 year manufacturing defect warranty on a bicycle frame especially if it's clear up front. But that's just me.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

trailrunner68 said:


> The integrity of the head tube looks fine. You could glue the insert back in yourself. What is Calfee going to do here that you cannot?


They're going to make sure it is properly aligned and stays put. I seriously would not enjoy to have that fail while descending.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Camilo said:


> I happen to think that even thought OP probably knew what he was doing and pretty much removed the cup properly, the damage was probably user error. User error almost totally caused by a totally "gotcha" crappy design, one that is only predictable after a person makes the mistake once, but user error nonetheless.


How is one supposed to approach the removal of a headset cup? Maybe there should be a tool similar to Park's giant headset race removal tool. Something that pushes it off instead of smacking it off. Probably would cause damage since there is no space between the cup and headtube.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but don't think there is a good solution for a crappy design.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

cxwrench said:


> i was kinda thinking that same thing. i'll even give you some JB weld...


Bingo.....I wouldn't hesitate to repair that myself.....


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

I thought about doing this DIY, but if it isn't secure the fork loads could tear the bottom of the head tube open.

A percussive tool is just fine for headsets, since there isn't anything good to press against. But the best remover would have a lip to keep it on the cup...

...or have the frames designed properly to avoid this problem entirely. Colnago always seems like a slow learner when it comes to composite design. Nice riding bikes, though.


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## nightfend (Mar 15, 2009)

Seneb said:


> They're going to make sure it is properly aligned and stays put. I seriously would not enjoy to have that fail while descending.


To be honest, the stem will hold everything together even if the bottom headset came loose again after re-gluing it. So I don't think you'd have a catastrophic failure or anything like that. Most you would get would probably be an irritating rattle or creak.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

stevesbike said:


> Besides, how many manufacturing defects don't reveal themselves in the first 2 years of use?


How many? Do tell us your findings.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

trailrunner68 said:


> Lifetime warranty does not mean lifetime of the buyer. It means expected lifetime of the product.
> 
> Euro companies often offer the length of warranty required by law, which I understand to be two years. For American companies a "lifetime warranty" is basically a marketing scheme.


Time and Orbea offer lifetime warranty. I believe Cyfac does too. Some brands stand by their product. Some apparently have good reason not to.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

nightfend said:


> To be honest, the stem will hold everything together even if the bottom headset came loose again after re-gluing it. So I don't think you'd have a catastrophic failure or anything like that. Most you would get would probably be an irritating rattle or creak.


The head tube on this bike is a composite of aluminum and carbon fiber. If the glue doesn't take, it is no longer a composite, but just a very thin carbon tube holding an aluminum ring. 

Are you going to pay for the frame if that situation cracks his headtube, or his hospital bills? Do you have any experience that makes your advice any better than a guess?

It's one thing to DIY a derailleur braze on, but a head tube failure can kill a rider. Pounding the insert out of its bond with the frame is of a little more consequence than screwing the top off a jelly jar.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> The head tube on this bike is a composite of aluminum and carbon fiber. If the glue doesn't take, it is no longer a composite, but just a very thin carbon tube holding an aluminum ring.
> 
> Are you going to pay for the frame if that situation cracks his headtube, or his hospital bills? Do you have any experience that makes your advice any better than a guess?
> 
> It's one thing to DIY a derailleur braze on, but a head tube failure can kill a rider. Pounding the insert out of its bond with the frame is of a little more consequence than screwing the top off a jelly jar.


I agree that is wrong to say the OP should repair it himself without knowing his experience however all Calfee or others are going to do is clean, condition(which may or may not include a layer of carbon) and epoxy it back in place... 

It should not be attempted by someone that doesn't have experience with epoxies and composite materials but that doesn't mean it can't be a home repair by an experience person........


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Dave Hickey said:


> I agree that is wrong to say the OP should repair it himself without knowing his experience however all Calfee or others are going to do is clean, condition(which may or may not include a layer of carbon) and epoxy it back in place...
> 
> It should not be attempted by someone that doesn't have experience with epoxies and composite materials but that doesn't mean it can't be a home repair by an experience person........


Dave,

Calfee is going to clean,* inspect*, condition and epoxy *with a jig*. 

I'm competent to glue two things to each other, but I don't think anyone here can determine what banging the insert out did to the carbon laminate, or has a tool for keeping the insert parallel while the glue sets.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

Once those fibers start to tear, it just goes from there. I could imagine the headtube separating from the frame. Or the front of the head tube splitting open and the steerer tube tearing right out the front.

I have a pretty active imagination, but I wouldn't ride that frame


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## ultraman6970 (Aug 1, 2010)

Op, just send it to calfee is the best you can do, Would be good to ask him about a longer sleeve too.

I agree with the poster that said why it failed. After seeing the broken piece I'm sure he was right, the piece that was hammered was the sleeve not the cup.

Good luck with the fix.


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

Question: did you insert the removal tool from the bottom or from the top?


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*which is why*



PaxRomana said:


> These warranties are ridiculous. Colnago offers what, 2-3 years. Pinarello is selling their Dogma 2 electronic-ready frame for $6800 with a TWO year warranty.
> 
> It's amazing that people actually find this acceptable.


saying the ridiculous mark up on CF frames from big name mfrs is for their warranties

at 6 grand you are talking 2 grand a year for 'insurance' the other $800 for the bike

how many other bikes could be bought for that kind of coin?


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> Galvanic corrosion.
> 
> 
> Either way, lifetime warranties were an industry standard until recently, and most high end, but popular brands still use them. This isn't like when Hyundai was starting out, this is a reduction in service and expectations.


Lifetime warranties are worth about as much as 2 or 3 or 5 year warranties. Good luck getting a lifetime warranty out of Litespeed. Or Trek. Or Kestrel. Or Aegis. If your lucky enough the frame manufacturer is still be in business under the original ownership (see how Litespeed gets out their lifetime warranty) the lifetime warranty might pay off. Even then, unless you can prove without a shadow of a doubt that the damage was because of initial fabrication errors, don't expect a new frame from any of those that offer a lifetime warranty.* Most if not all lifetime warranties cite that they are valid for manufacturing defects. Normal wear and tear is not covered. 
*
*The Lifetime thing has been a marketing gimmick from the beginning.* Change the name of your company, even if the main folks running the company doesn't change, and voila- no more lifetime for you!!

*EDIT* OOOPS! Didn't realize that another poster basically said the *same thing*.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Ride-Fly said:


> Lifetime warranties are worth about as much as 2 or 3 or 5 year warranties. Good luck getting a lifetime warranty out of Litespeed. Or Trek. Or Kestrel. Or Aegis. If your lucky enough the frame manufacturer is still be in business under the original ownership (see how Litespeed gets out their lifetime warranty) the lifetime warranty might pay off. Even then, unless you can prove without a shadow of a doubt that the damage was because of initial fabrication errors, don't expect a new frame from any of those that offer a lifetime warranty.* Most if not all lifetime warranties cite that they are valid for manufacturing defects. Normal wear and tear is not covered.
> *
> *The Lifetime thing has been a marketing gimmick from the beginning.* Change the name of your company, even if the main folks running the company doesn't change, and voila- no more lifetime for you!!
> 
> *EDIT* OOOPS! Didn't realize that another poster basically said the *same thing*.


Right now, Trek is replacing a cracked 10 year old Lemond frame for one of our regular customers. The reality of that certainly is at odds with your theory.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

penn_rider said:


> I would still buy a Colnago...


I would still buy my Moots. ;-)


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> Right now, Trek is replacing a cracked 10 year old Lemond frame for one of our regular customers. The reality of that certainly is at odds with your theory.


Good for that guy. 

I've also read of incidents where Trek wouldn't replace a frame that had a cracked chainstays. 

Maybe Trek is replacing Lemonds because they're afraid Greg will sue them for disparaging his name if they didn't?? 

Like I said, good luck getting a new frame from Litespeed. Or Trek (odds may be better, but I wouldn't hold my breath). Or Kestrel. Or Aegis. The list could go on and on.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

darwinosx said:


> I would still buy my Moots. ;-)


I would still buy my Colnagos! 

I would still buy a Moots! (don't have one but would love one)


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Ride-Fly said:


> Good for that guy.
> 
> I've also read of incidents where Trek wouldn't replace a frame that had a cracked chainstays.
> 
> ...


Good for a lot of guys. How many warranties have you personally been turned down on?

I think you are probably the victim of bike forum statistics, where only bad things happen. In the real world, most warranties are taken care of - for the very few bicycles that ever need them.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> Good for a lot of guys. How many warranties have you personally been turned down on?
> 
> I think you are probably the victim of bike forum statistics, where only bad things happen. In the real world, most warranties are taken care of - for the very few bicycles that ever need them.


Me personally? I've never had to warranty a frame. Guess I've been pretty lucky.

From what I've seen, bike forums talk about the good just about as much as the bad. There are plenty of stories of Look covering warranties that expired or weren't original owners. Cannondales and Giants, I've heard of mostly good warranty service and a few occasions of bad too, so it isn't that only the bad that is brought to light. My point is, with Aegis, and Kestrel, and especially Litespeed, you would be hard pressed to find the good stories. I am glad to hear that trek has been honoring their lifetime warranties.


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## ciclisto (Nov 8, 2005)

presently owning two Colnagos a C-50 and a CLX 2.0 both of which are stellar bikes if fact I enjoy riding the CLX more than the C 50 right now.. it is smooth climbs very well and is stiff. The two frames are heavier than some like my 850 gram ISAAC Sonic but the Colnagos ride like no other and are special.. the fit and finish on the CLX is great and the OP only had a problem when he went and fussed with a perfectly working bike --left alone he would still be riding it..why pound on a expensive carbon head tube to save a $100 headset and then have to put one in again. A person wrecking his own bike is not a slam on Ernesto Colnago.. And as for the warranty if you wanted a life time one you should have bought a Time or Trek, then we would have seen how fast these two companies would have warrantied a frame you messed up. Colnago has a two year warranty and they tell you so in the paper work you get when you buy it. Buyer beware !! they feel any defects will show in that time,,, I really do not think they are ripping anyone off. I have ridden just about all high end frames and still like these as they fit me well and I like the ride provided.. Trek madones are nice and although Pinarello ride very well I am not partial to the esthetics.
Bottom line one screw up on your part does not make the Company going down hill.
I suggest you ride a CX-1 or M-10 and confirm your opinion.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

ciclisto said:


> presently owning two Colnagos a C-50 and a CLX 2.0 both of which are stellar bikes if fact I enjoy riding the CLX more than the C 50 right now.. it is smooth climbs very well and is stiff. The two frames are heavier than some like my 850 gram ISAAC Sonic but the Colnagos ride like no other and are special.. the fit and finish on the CLX is great and the OP only had a problem when he went and fussed with a perfectly working bike --left alone he would still be riding it..why pound on a expensive carbon head tube to save a $100 headset and then have to put one in again. A person wrecking his own bike is not a slam on Ernesto Colnago.. And as for the warranty if you wanted a life time one you should have bought a Time or Trek, then we would have seen how fast these two companies would have warrantied a frame you messed up. Colnago has a two year warranty and they tell you so in the paper work you get when you buy it. Buyer beware !! they feel any defects will show in that time,,, I really do not think they are ripping anyone off. I have ridden just about all high end frames and still like these as they fit me well and I like the ride provided.. Trek madones are nice and although Pinarello ride very well I am not partial to the esthetics.
> Bottom line one screw up on your part does not make the Company going down hill.
> I suggest you ride a CX-1 or M-10 and confirm your opinion.


Well now, that seems a bit harsh. Truth be told, I was never very impressed with the CLX. It's my choice if I want to use the King headset on another bike, and it is a part that is made to be removable. It didn't cross my mind that the frame might get damaged. I posted the damage to vent my frustration and hopefully prevent someone else from having the same outcome. Sure, the blame is ultimately mine since I was the one holding the tools, but it's pretty obvious that the sleeve design wasn't thought through very well. And I did not slam Ernesto. Stay on track, eh.

Also, you must not have purchased a King headset in a while. Lowest retail price I've seen lately is $125.


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## gordy748 (Feb 11, 2007)

I currently ride a Colnago. A CT1. Absolutely LOVE it. Also owned a Master Olympic and a C-40 in my time. Love, love, love those bikes.

But Colnago's in a serious decline. First they outsource most of their frames to Taiwan, then they stop selling art decor frames, now I see they're offering commuter bikes. Cracker what?

I'm still in the market for a Master frame. I'm just sticking to eBay.


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## ciclisto (Nov 8, 2005)

Chris king headsets on ebay for $50.- $79 bucks and you are correct it is your choice to attempt to remove a working part and suffer any problems that may incur. If indeed you misjudged how this was installed and hammered out the retainer with the part then you should backtrack and amend your opinion of the frame maker. the warranty and its length is not of issue here is it.


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## Tanin (Feb 4, 2008)

ciclisto said:


> .. And as for the warranty if you wanted a life time one you should have bought a Time or Trek, then we would have seen how fast these two companies would have warrantied a frame you messed up. .


Had a warranty issue with one of my Time frames and although the end result was in my favor, I didn't see a replaced frame for 15+ months. 

To the OP, regardless of the details your situation is a bummer. Sorry


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Next time get a integrated headset? hell with that, next time get a steel or TI bike then the integrated headset or not will still last forever.

Personally due to the price of the bike, I would have Calfee fix it, they do great work, and pay extra to have any paint damaged by the repair fixed to look like original.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Ride-Fly said:


> Me personally? I've never had to warranty a frame. Guess I've been pretty lucky.


That isn't luck, it's normal.

I recommend reading the internet less and spending more time with actual cyclists or around bike shops. Reality and forum reality are a little different.


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## foto (Feb 7, 2005)

Oh, by the way, I have owned a Colnago. It was a nice bike for sure, but come on, they (used to be) hideously overpriced. Really, is a new Master X-Light frameset really the best you can do for $2300? Although I guess these days their price point is right in line with most top end production stuff from the big names.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

ciclisto said:


> you should backtrack and amend your opinion of the frame maker.


I didn't bash Colnago. I only said that I probably won't buy another one. Most likely I will go with either a Calfee or Rock Lobster for my next road frame. I have a custom RL track bike that is the best and most beautiful frame I have ever owned.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> That isn't luck, it's normal.
> 
> I recommend reading the internet less and spending more time with actual cyclists or around bike shops. Reality and forum reality are a little different.


Ok, buddy. Whatever you say. 

Why TF would I want to hang out at bike shops? You know, you spout off a lot with your infinite wisdom.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Ride-Fly - Totally off topic... It took two years for your DEAN frame???


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

Ride-Fly said:


> Ok, buddy. Whatever you say.
> 
> Why TF would I want to hang out at bike shops? You know, you spout off a lot with your infinite wisdom.


I "spout off" a lot from experience. I go back over 20 years in this industry. Many people appreciate talking to someone who actually has the background and skills to intelligently discuss bike stuff.

But if you prefer whatever you're working off of, so be it.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Kontact said:


> I "spout off" a lot from experience. I go back over 20 years in this industry. Many people appreciate talking to someone who actually has the background and skills to intelligently discuss bike stuff.
> 
> But if you prefer whatever you're working off of, so be it.


exactly.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Seneb said:


> Ride-Fly - Totally off topic... It took two years for your DEAN frame???


yep, it took over two years for Dean to deliver my frame. The story goes... John the owner of Dean auctioned a frame for his son's school charity. The winner of that auction got tired of the delays and so sold the rights to the frame (with John's blessing) on the local craigslist. I happened to be the unfortunate bloke that bought the rights. Because it was an "auction" bike, Dean kept sliding my frame to the back of the que. After 1.5 yrs time, I started to raise some hell with him and so he finally delivered. 

It's a nice frame- Dean does some great work- on par with Seven, Moots, Serotta IMHO, but I would never recommend them to anyone. There are too many other great Ti builders with great customer service. My next Ti frame will be a Moots, Eriksen, or a Seven. Or maybe I'll go local and get a Vertigo. Sean Chaney the owner of Vertigo is local and is a great dude. He does beautiful work too.

Hope you get your CLX fixed and you enjoy the ride. I personally LOVE the way Colnagos ride. They are by far and away my favorite handling bikes I've ridden.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Wow, crazy story. Sucks you had to raise hell to get it. I had a Dean quill stem for a while that was gorgeous. I kept it around just because I liked it so much even though I wasn't using it. A buddy of mine has a Moots that I want to steal.

The CLX is getting fixed, but I doubt it will be ridden again by me. I am really leaning toward a custom steel frame. I would love to try a ti frame, but don't know anyone with one my size and don't want to blindly dive into one because of the price.


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## Ride-Fly (Mar 27, 2002)

Seneb said:


> Wow, crazy story. Sucks you had to raise hell to get it. I had a Dean quill stem for a while that was gorgeous. I kept it around just because I liked it so much even though I wasn't using it. A buddy of mine has a Moots that I want to steal.
> 
> The CLX is getting fixed, but I doubt it will be ridden again by me. I am really leaning toward a custom steel frame. I would love to try a ti frame, but don't know anyone with one my size and don't want to blindly dive into one because of the price.


that's too bad you are giving up on the Nag. 

But I know the allure of steel. My Mondonico is probably the best riding bike I've ever had. That's not to say, it is the first one that I pull down when I ride with the saturday hammerfest.  My Ext C or C40 get that nod. I'm done collecting carbon bikes- don't really have a lust for anything else to add to my stable, except maybe a Parlee or Crumpton. But I would love to add about a dozen more steel steeds!!!

If you haven't discovered Velocipede Salon yet, check them out for leads on custom steel options. Zanconato, Desalvo, Gaulzetti, Spectrum, Hampsten, Kirk, Strong, etc. All with great product and service. Also, do some research on the builders you want to stay away from. Some recent posts regarding Desperado, Paul Taylor, and Curt Goodrich. 

Good luck and have fun in your search bubba!!


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

Thanks, Ride-Fly. However, if I go custom steel, it will be a Rock Lobster. He's local and built me a track frame back in 2000. I've seen photos of some of the builders you mentioned, and they are nice!


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

PaxRomana said:


> How many? Do tell us your findings.


Anyone with manufacturing experience knows about the bathtub curve of product failure.
Read some of Deming's writings on quality control and manufacturing tolerances.


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## jtompilot (Mar 31, 2002)

foto said:


> Oh, by the way, I have owned a Colnago. It was a nice bike for sure, but come on, they (used to be) hideously overpriced. Really, is a new Master X-Light frameset really the best you can do for $2300? Although I guess these days their price point is right in line with most top end production stuff from the big names.


The US prices are more like $3200


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

Kontact said:


> Right now, Trek is replacing a cracked 10 year old Lemond frame for one of our regular customers. The reality of that certainly is at odds with your theory.


I'll second that. I've seen Trek warranty stuff that I wouldn't. A while back they warrantied a pre-Trek Klein that cracked at the seat-tube/down-tube junction. By and large, on warranty issues (both frames and Trek/Bontrager parts), Trek is far better to deal with than any of our other suppliers.


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## ericTheHalf (Apr 5, 2008)

I didn't read every post, so if this has been covered please forgive me.

Seneb, you could have Calfee build you a bike. His warranty is 25 years. I have a Calfee that was built in '92 and I got in 1996. After a couple of years one of the dropouts became debonded from the chainstay. Craig fix it without hesitation. He also changed the attachment of the bottle cage and barrel adjuster mounts because he was attaching them differently than he did in '92. I've had that bike since 1996 and I've got more years of warranty left than new carbon fiber bikes have to start.

Not that there is anything wrong with a Lobster. I've always wanted one of those.


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## skill3 (Feb 18, 2012)

Colnago has never had a decent warranty program. I would put pressure on the company you bought it from. Be nice and cool, and it may pay off. Good luck!


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## jasonbakersd (Feb 19, 2012)

Sorry to hear the Colnago story. If you're going steel, get an old Master X-Light frame, great ride and tradition. I just sent my CT-1 up to Calfee as I have a crack in the rear seat stay.

Good luck with your next project.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

skill3 - I called and chatted with the owner. He is a nice guy, but there is nothing he can do because of the warranty. He did say he would give me a good deal on a new one if I wanted to go that route.

jasonbakersd - I'm heading to Calfee tomorrow to drop off the frame to be fixed. I'm considering having them strip the frame of all paint and decals except for the Colnago on the downtube and club on the seatstay and give it a clear coat. Depends on cost though. I have always loved the Master, but feel more comfortable on a frame with a bit of slope to the top tube, but I'd like to find one to test ride. I'll keep an eye out for your CT-1 tomorrow!


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Seneb said:


> skill3 - I called and chatted with the owner. He is a nice guy, but there is nothing he can do because of the warranty. He did say he would give me a good deal on a new one if I wanted to go that route.
> 
> jasonbakersd - I'm heading to Calfee tomorrow to drop off the frame to be fixed. I'm considering having them strip the frame of all paint and decals except for the Colnago on the downtube and club on the seatstay and give it a clear coat. Depends on cost though. I have always loved the Master, but feel more comfortable on a frame with a bit of slope to the top tube, but I'd like to find one to test ride. I'll keep an eye out for your CT-1 tomorrow!


Calfee can repaint the repaired section of the bike to match the old paint exactly...if that's what you want. It would never look like it was repaired if you do that, otherwise stripping the paint will show the repair vividly.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

froze said:


> Calfee can repaint the repaired section of the bike to match the old paint exactly...if that's what you want. It would never look like it was repaired if you do that, otherwise stripping the paint will show the repair vividly.


Yup, I had them repair a cracked seat tube on another frame some years back and the quality was phenomenal. They think this repair won't need the paint to be disturbed. I'm thinking of the change just because I'm not fond of the color scheme.


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## andresmuro (Dec 11, 2007)

Seneb said:


> This has really turned my stomach, and sadly, I probably will never purchase another Colnago. The headset reinforcement ring came out of the frame when the lower headset cup was removed (using the proper tools). It also took some carbon with it. Either I pay to have Calfee fix it, or it is very expensive wall art. I was so angry that I didn't do anything. No cursing, no yelling at it, no throwing tools, nothing.
> 
> Apparently, I need ten posts to post an image. Lame.


Time to get a chinese frame. You'll pay about $450. You'll get about the same support as colnago, in other words, almost nothing. There is a thread here with over 5000 posts and people seem to be very happy with these frames. The worst thing that cah happen to you is that the frame breaks. You'll be out a tenth of the cost of a colnago frame. 

Interestingly enough, colnago was the brand to go in the late 70s and early 80s because they made a cheap product. A colnago steel frame was probably the cheapest italian frame that you could buy and a lot of teams from all over the world would use them because they handled nice and were so inexpensive. 

So, colnago started to put their money into advertising, and little by little the frames became one of the most expensive italian frames. This was not because their quality improved, but because they used pretty, paints, although of terrible quality; and they sponsored a lot of pro teams. They also had one of the worst warranties possible. While most builders used to give you a lifetime guarantee on a steal frame, colnago would only give you a 2 year guarantee. 

Custom frame makers have always said that a japanese frame made with tange 1 or prestige tubing had much higher standards of build and finish than italian frames. But although better, nobody would be caught dead ridding a $150 centurion frame, if they could get a $600 italian frame of poorer quality.


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## a_avery007 (Jul 1, 2008)

yeah those Cinelli's, Pin'a, Gios's etc are just pieces of trash compared to those nishikis, centurions etc.

no wonder we still see many Italian frames still around from the 70-80's..

puleeze, Colnago's are still great frames, and if the OP had not tried to remove a CK headeset without the proper tools, nor putting in a CK headset in the first place, we would not be having this thread..


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## andresmuro (Dec 11, 2007)

a_avery007 said:


> yeah those Cinelli's, Pin'a, Gios's etc are just pieces of trash compared to those nishikis, centurions etc.
> 
> no wonder we still see many Italian frames still around from the 70-80's..
> 
> puleeze, Colnago's are still great frames, and if the OP had not tried to remove a CK headeset without the proper tools, nor putting in a CK headset in the first place, we would not be having this thread..


Not saying that they are pieces of crap. Im saying that they are overpriced. In relationship to Japanese frames and they are popular because they were used by pro, and not because of superior quality. 

Any top custom builder who works with steel will tell you this. I love cinellis and would love to own Lugged cinelli slx or tsx. Aesthetically, I think that they are unsurpassable. However, in terms of quality and finish and performance, they are no better than a Specialized allez lugged steel frame, a 660 Trek, a Centurion with Tange prestige, etc. 

In fact, If I get a cinelli frame, I would have to prep the frame before I can assemble it. OTOH, any of the Japanese, or the Trek frames, would come ready to build, with headset and BB fully faced, and perfectly aligned. And the paint quality would be better and last longer. 

While Italian frames have been used in the Tour extensively, gaining a popular following in the US, Japanese frames, or components, such as shimano and suntour were not used in the european racing circuit even though they had excellent performance and finish. 

But Japanese made frames have been used extensively in the Kerin races in Japan by these monster sprinters that would break cranksets and handelbars regularly. 

American and japanese frames and components only saw a sudden increase in cost, along with French components, when they started to be used in the Tours. it was not because their quality increased all of a sudden, but because we became more global. 

If you don't believe this, try to contact a top steel builder like Richard Sachs, Serotta, Georg Georgenson, Bruce Gordon, etc. In fact, when the popular frames were built with Columbus SL and SLX, they were already building with Tange, True Temper, Ishiwata, of equal quality but a lot more reasonably priced. 

Nowadays, you can get this:

Lugged Steel Bikes | Commuting | Commuter Bikes | Motobecane Gran Premio PRO, made in taiwan. 

Try to compare this with a Steel Colnago or Cinelli. If you think that the Cinelli or Colnago is better in quality or performance, you are dreaming.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

andresmuro said:


> Not saying that they are pieces of crap. Im saying that they are overpriced. In relationship to Japanese frames and they are popular because they were used by pro, and not because of superior quality.
> 
> Any top custom builder who works with steel will tell you this. I love cinellis and would love to own Lugged cinelli slx or tsx. Aesthetically, I think that they are unsurpassable. However, in terms of quality and finish and performance, they are no better than a Specialized allez lugged steel frame, a 660 Trek, a Centurion with Tange prestige, etc.
> 
> ...


A bike frame isn't just a place to hang parts. The cheap Chinese stuff is fine, a Giant is better and Colnago is justifiably priced and compared to the best frames.

This whole idea of "overpriced" is pretty ridiculous - virtually all bicycles are overpriced. There is no fundamental value in bicycles, just perceived value. If the public buys Colnagos, then their perceived value is identical to their price, regardless of what you think about it.

I have been critical of Colnago in the past, but they are just another expensive brand in a sea of expensive bikes. They have their failings, but those failings don't seem to have anything to do with performance or people's enjoyment of their bikes.


I understand Nashbar will sell you an aluminum road frame of reasonable quality for $100. You should jump on this - it is the only reasonably priced new road bike in existence, and should last forever.


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## a_avery007 (Jul 1, 2008)

*not so fast*

Lugged Steel Bikes | Commuting | Commuter Bikes | Motobecane Gran Premio PRO, made in taiwan. 

Try to compare this with a Steel Colnago or Cinelli. If you think that the Cinelli or Colnago is better in quality or performance, you are dreaming.[/QUOTE]

Motobecane; surely you jest.

Can get a Gunnar or other US builder to build me a frame with oversized tubing, True Temper, Dedaccia, Columbus or other for close that price, built to my preferences, ALL, and ride forever...
not even in the same league mate...

ride what you like just ride.....


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

andresmuro said:


> If you don't believe this, try to contact a top steel builder like Richard Sachs, Serotta, Georg Georgenson, Bruce Gordon, etc. In fact, when the popular frames were built with Columbus SL and SLX, they were already building with Tange, True Temper, Ishiwata, of equal quality but a lot more reasonably priced


Mr Sachs seems to be building with Columbus at the moment. 



> If you think that the Cinelli or Colnago is better in quality or performance, you are dreaming.


Uhhh, yeah right.


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## andresmuro (Dec 11, 2007)

Kontact said:


> A bike frame isn't just a place to hang parts. The cheap Chinese stuff is fine, a Giant is better and Colnago is justifiably priced and compared to the best frames.
> 
> This whole idea of "overpriced" is pretty ridiculous - virtually all bicycles are overpriced. There is no fundamental value in bicycles, just perceived value. If the public buys Colnagos, then their perceived value is identical to their price, regardless of what you think about it.
> 
> ...


I don't have anything against expensive frames. The majority of my riding partners ride them and are very happy with them. My point is that people seem to think that if they pay ten times as much for a bike they will get something that much better in terms of strength, durability, performance, weight, etc. Sad part is that this is not necessarily the case. In fact, when their frames break, like the OP, they find that their $8,000 investment was not as durable and did not have reasonable support. 

A lot of what you get with a brand name frame is LBS support as well as their recommendations that the product that they sell is awesome. For people with no knowledge on how to take care of a bike, etc. That is the way to go. Particularly with brands like Trek, Cannondale, Gunnar, etc that give you good customer support.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

andresmuro said:


> I don't have anything against expensive frames. The majority of my riding partners ride them and are very happy with them. My point is that people seem to think that if they pay ten times as much for a bike they will get something that much better in terms of strength, durability, performance, weight, etc. Sad part is that this is not necessarily the case. In fact, when their frames break, like the OP, they find that their $8,000 investment was not as durable and did not have reasonable support.
> 
> A lot of what you get with a brand name frame is LBS support as well as their recommendations that the product that they sell is awesome. For people with no knowledge on how to take care of a bike, etc. That is the way to go. Particularly with brands like Trek, Cannondale, Gunnar, etc that give you good customer support.


Nope, you're still not getting it.

Nicer bikes aren't more durable - that isn't the measure of a great bicycle. There are subtleties to better bikes that people are willing to pay for, even if the percentage amount of upcharge isn't proportional to the increase in price. That's true of everything - cars, pens, watches, health food, bottled water.

Once again, the OPs bike has nothing to do with this. It was broken with a hammer.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

So, here is a slight update to this fun little situation. I dropped the frameset at Calfee last Monday and they quoted me $100-200 to fix it. I got a call later that day saying they wanted to have Craig Calfee look at it because it might need more work than they thought. Today I received an email with a new quote of $450! Apparently they want to machine a new full length sleeve which would also require paint work. I asked if they could just ship it back to me, they said yes for $95 ($50 inspection + $45 shipping). I was unaware of the $50 inspection fee. I guess I should have asked but did not assume that I would be taking the bike back unfixed. It will cost me less in gas to pick it up in person, so I'm going to do that. Over the weekend I was at The Spokesman in Santa Cruz for a fitting and was talking with Wade about what happened. He seemed pretty confident in bonding it back in at the shop since they have done it before, which some of you suggested. Ugg.


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## darwinosx (Oct 12, 2010)

PaxRomana said:


> These warranties are ridiculous. Colnago offers what, 2-3 years. Pinarello is selling their Dogma 2 electronic-ready frame for $6800 with a TWO year warranty.
> 
> It's amazing that people actually find this acceptable.


Especially for a chinese made frame. Of course they do minor finishing work in Italy so they can slap a made in Italy sticker on it.


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## lbkwak (Feb 22, 2012)

ciclisto said:


> Chris king headsets on ebay for $50.- $79 bucks and you are correct it is your choice to attempt to remove a working part and suffer any problems that may incur. If indeed you misjudged how this was installed and hammered out the retainer with the part then you should backtrack and amend your opinion of the frame maker. the warranty and its length is not of issue here is it.


Really? I haven't seen any under 110. Why don't you show me where I can get CK headset for that price?


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Seneb said:


> So, here is a slight update to this fun little situation. I dropped the frameset at Calfee last Monday and they quoted me $100-200 to fix it. I got a call later that day saying they wanted to have Craig Calfee look at it because it might need more work than they thought. Today I received an email with a new quote of $450! Apparently they want to machine a new full length sleeve which would also require paint work. I asked if they could just ship it back to me, they said yes for $95 ($50 inspection + $45 shipping). I was unaware of the $50 inspection fee. I guess I should have asked but did not assume that I would be taking the bike back unfixed. It will cost me less in gas to pick it up in person, so I'm going to do that. Over the weekend I was at The Spokesman in Santa Cruz for a fitting and was talking with Wade about what happened. He seemed pretty confident in bonding it back in at the shop since they have done it before, which some of you suggested. Ugg.


The $50 inspection fee is plainly written on their web site. Even for $450 that's not bad, a new frame will easily cost a lot more then that. You could take the option of not getting it painted and save the repaint cost.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

froze said:


> The $50 inspection fee is plainly written on their web site. Even for $450 that's not bad, a new frame will easily cost a lot more then that. You could take the option of not getting it painted and save the repaint cost.


FWIW, I totally understand about the fee. However, it was not mentioned in our email exchanges and when I did look for it on the website I only found it on the PDF repair request form. Maybe I missed is elsewhere.

If I were in love with the frame and wanted to keep it, I would do it. However, I don't like the frame and am planning on buying something else anyway. The paint would have to be done or else there would be an awkward looking black carbon section on the headtube. They would only paint the affected area, not the entire frame. Not really much of an option.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Seneb said:


> FWIW, I totally understand about the fee. However, it was not mentioned in our email exchanges and when I did look for it on the website I only found it on the PDF repair request form. Maybe I missed is elsewhere.
> 
> If I were in love with the frame and wanted to keep it, I would do it. However, I don't like the frame and am planning on buying something else anyway. The paint would have to be done or else there would be an awkward looking black carbon section on the headtube. They would only paint the affected area, not the entire frame. Not really much of an option.


Ok, I understand. Now another question. Are you going to buy a new bare frame and fork and put all the components from the bad bike onto it, or buy a new fully equipped bike? If a new fully equipped bike could you resell the old bike repaired for more money then the cost of the repair? Or would you be able to sell the components and make as much as a fully repaired bike?

Just thoughtful questions you probably already considered I'm sure.


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## Soundtallica (Sep 24, 2011)

Stuff happens. The best bet is to argue with Colnago.


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## Seneb (Sep 29, 2009)

a_avery007 said:


> yeah those Cinelli's, Pin'a, Gios's etc are just pieces of trash compared to those nishikis, centurions etc.
> 
> no wonder we still see many Italian frames still around from the 70-80's..
> 
> puleeze, Colnago's are still great frames, and if the OP had not tried to remove a CK headeset without the proper tools, nor putting in a CK headset in the first place, we would not be having this thread..


You obviously did not read my posts. What do you think the "proper tools" would be?


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