# 03 zurich, 04 buenos aires, or 05 sarthe?



## howling.fantods (Jan 25, 2005)

Hi folks, thanks in advance for any advice folks might have.

I'm about to buy my first "real" roadie. I've been haunting my LBS's, obsessively searching websites for info on bikes and so on. I'm considering some other bikes besides these lemonds at one of my lbs's, but these in particular are attractive.

They all ride well (pretty much indistinguishable on my test rides -- again, this is my first "real" roadie), and seem to have pretty much the same kind of fit, even though the buenos has a sloping top tube. They all seem to fit my style of riding, i think. But I really can't decide how to choose between the three.

The zurich has full 9sp ultegra, bontrager race-lite wheels, race-lite carbon forks -- and the full 853 steel frame.

The buenos has mostly ultegra with some 105, bontrager select wheels, race carbon forks -- and the new in 2004 steel/carbon spline frame.

The sarthe has full veloce, race-lite wheels, race forks (so kind of in between the zurich and the buenos, in terms of wheels and forks) -- and a new ox platinum frame.

So what do folks think? They're all selling for around $1500 or so at bike shops around me. Fit and everything else being equal, which of these three bikes give the most bang for the buck?


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

*3 choices*



howling.fantods said:


> Hi folks, thanks in advance for any advice folks might have.
> 
> I'm about to buy my first "real" roadie. I've been haunting my LBS's, obsessively searching websites for info on bikes and so on. I'm considering some other bikes besides these lemonds at one of my lbs's, but these in particular are attractive.
> 
> ...


The buenos might be the best deal, realitive new frame and mostly ultegra. the Zurich might be the most race worthy but the frame is the oldest. my favorite would be the Zurich


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## iamandy (Jun 20, 2003)

the zurich isnt that great of a deal for $1500, its two years old! the 2004 BA is a the best frame of the bunch but it has the worst components, but the Sarthe looks the nicest, campy equipped and has nice wheels. the sarthe steel is basically identical to the reynolds. I would say if you can get the Zurich for $1200 or so buy it. but dont pay that much for a bike that is 2 years old and with a 9 speed ultegra group set thats outdated anyway. my 2 cents.


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## Indyfan (Mar 30, 2004)

*I like them all, but...*

Of those the 2 that would really be a struggle would be the Zurich and the Sarthe. My favorite is the Sarthe with the color (similar to The Cannibal's in the '70's) and the Campy parts (notice the difference in the shifting. I like the spine frames a lot. Both material combinations (Steel and TI with carbon) ride really nicely. But there's something about a carbon/metal frame mix that has always bothered me. 

I currently live in an area (Albuquerque) with a couple of major gov't labs (Sandia and Los Alamos) that do a lot of materials research (askide from what they're both best known for - lasers, nuclear, chemical, etc.) and some of the engineers and scientists come in to the shop from time to time. They typically will stay away from a "mixed material" bike frame, even something as simple as a chainstay. They'll go with full carbon or full metal (generally steel or TI) They always talk about how they've seen too many failures near the joint bteween the carbon and the metal. Granted, they're probably talking about much greater amounts of force and many more stress cycles than a bike frame will ever see, but it's interesting to see what they choose in bikes. Since there's a lifetime warrantee on all the frames, it's not really that big a deal anyway.

I wouldn't worry about the 9spd Ultegra comonents on the '03 Zurich. That's a great bike and overall package, and you'll be able to find parts to keep it running for a few years anyway. The all steel LeMond bikes have great riding frames, and that's one of the reasons they had to bring back the "classic" all-steel frame bikes this year.

Bottom line, ride the bikes and make that be the deciding factor. On a well made steel frame like the ones you've listed, component groups can come and go in the life span of that frame. You can always update the bike in the future.

Spin freely,
Bob


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## howling.fantods (Jan 25, 2005)

Thanks for the feedback so far. I like the looks of the sarthe too, it just looks very classic. If I were going to buy just on looks, the sarthe would be the definite winner in my book.

It sounds like you work in a shop Indyfan? do you agree with iamandy that $1500 is too much for a 03 zurich?


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

*zurich, buenos aires, sarthe*



howling.fantods said:


> Thanks for the feedback so far. I like the looks of the sarthe too, it just looks very classic. If I were going to buy just on looks, the sarthe would be the definite winner in my book.
> 
> It sounds like you work in a shop Indyfan? do you agree with iamandy that $1500 is too much for a 03 zurich?


if you look at the geometry charts from the lemond site, the zurich and buenos aires have 15mm of extended head tubes while the sarthe does not. keep this in mind when your sizing bikes, you may have to go to larger frame on the sarthe to avoid the dreaded 2 inches+ of stem that we debate on this board frequently. this may not be an issue if you don't mind riser stems, but you mentioned appreciation for the classic look.


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## Indyfan (Mar 30, 2004)

*Yeah, we're a LeMond dealer.*



howling.fantods said:


> Thanks for the feedback so far. I like the looks of the sarthe too, it just looks very classic. If I were going to buy just on looks, the sarthe would be the definite winner in my book.
> 
> It sounds like you work in a shop Indyfan? do you agree with iamandy that $1500 is too much for a 03 zurich?


Sorry for the delay, lately I don't get much web time on the weekends. 

I would say that, if it's a new bike - the shop just still has it around from '03, it would probably be a "fair" price. Not a bargain, but I wouldn't say you'd be getting a bad deal. I think they were about $1900 MSRP, and (again - I think) we were selling them for about $1700, in season. We don't usually have many leftovers from road bikes, so our late or previous season road bikes don't get marked down much. Maybe $200-$300 from our in season pricing, depending on the model. If it was a sales dog, yes it would get marked down more. But the Zurich has never been a dog for us, except maybe a Greyhound. The only Zurich we've had left over from the previous season was the women's specific 53 from '03 with that "pink" paint job - not a popular color.

Since it's about the same price as the Sarthe (we're selling the Sarthe for $1500), I'd probably go with the Sarthe. But I'm partial to Campy.

Bob


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## Muffinhugger (Feb 4, 2005)

*Carbon is for failures*

Just kidding....

Anyways, i just got my first real road bike as well and it is incidentally a LeMond Sarthe. It was a pure impulse buy based on the color, but my gut reaction paid off. The ride quality compared to, say, an all aluminum bike is just so much more smooth and laid back. 

I have also loved the Campy parts on it as well. The feel is far more solid than Shimano, however the cable routing coming out of the shifter is awful. Not that you can tell or anything.

The only complaint is the Bontrager crank. The Truvativ-made chainrings blow goats. I have gotten my chain stuck in between the rings due to the soft metal and deflection. The Chainline is a little off, but can be fixed easily with the washers and the ease of outboard bearing cranks. 

Only other issue is that the Sarthe is going to be a little noodly and deflect when you are putting serious torque on it, but i assure you the non-prostate rattling ride of the steel is worth it. 

And lastly, steel is just plain sexier. I mean look at that thing, it has character and class not found in carbon. 

And there you have it.


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