# C59 Italia - Finally!



## 1Cebu

After 5 months of delay .... finally!









will have to test ride this one ..... more pics later


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## mtbbmet

We got our first two in @ the shop yesterday. 3 more still to come.


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## chuckice

It needs a matching matte black post.


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## nvrsetl

Very nice. Congrats! Post your review afterwards.


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## 1Cebu

Yep :blush2: ..................... unfortunately, what arrived was a glossy one :mad2: ..... i'm contemplating of bringing it over to a local artist to solve the problem  I do believe sending it back to the store is not a wise option ..... it may take another 5 months to be back


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## FrenchNago

*easy to do*

Gently sand off the paint and clear coat with 800 then 1000 grit water paper and have a matt finish sprayed on to protect the carbon....can even spray it on yourself with a rattle can and time (very light coat, two or three passes, let dry 4 hours or more in between each, always start spraying before the object and end after it)


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## pablotn

Very nice indeedy!

Pablo


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## joep721

1Cebu... congrats... Sweet bike!


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## iyeoh

If you are using Deda handlebars and stem, you can get a Deda Black Stick carbon seatpost. I think that is matt black carbon. At least its equivalent to non-shiny carbon. It certainly looked that way when I saw it up close.

Congratulations on that beautiful bike, BTW. DI2 as well. Enjoy.


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## 1Cebu

Rode it for 40 kms .... and raced it on our local Saturday morning crit .... and all I could say is ... GREAT!!!    Basically rode like the awesome EPS .... but noticeably the rear is stiffer. At any rate these are just initial impressions ............... will continue to ride more.  

Here's the complete build (Note: will be sanding-down the glossy parts and matte-finish it)


















parts to be refinished (matte) - top cap & 3T ARX LTD stem & 3T Ergonova LTD bars








Colnago carbon seatpost








Moro d'elite bottle cage










Other highlights:
303s on 23c tubs/DA 7900 stoppers with Zipp Tangente cork pads :thumbsup: 








DA compact cranks / Look Keo Blade Ti









Any and all criticisms will be appreciated.


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## nicensleazy

Very nice......looks great


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## ronderman

Just wishing I had mine - that looks great though. Dura Ace electric, right? All in all a really solid build, congrats.


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## rmfh

Great bike. I ordered one a few days ago. The only problem is I can't find a matching matte black stem and handlebar or an integrated handlebar. I asked Colnago to customize the integrated handlebar to match the colour of the bike, but they don't do that. If you have any suggestions, please let me know.


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## Clevor

rmfh said:


> Great bike. I ordered one a few days ago. The only problem is I can't find a matching matte black stem and handlebar or an integrated handlebar. I asked Colnago to customize the integrated handlebar to match the colour of the bike, but they don't do that. If you have any suggestions, please let me know.


If you really want to be picky . . .

That's the problem with a matte finish frame. As Iyeoh alluded to, the only line of components that ever came with a matte finish was the ole Deda line. In fact, I've collected most of the components, but not for the matte finish, but for the gorgeous 3K weave.

The Deda Mag seatpost had the matte finish and was actually one of the lightest 31.7 seatposts ever made, at 188 gms. Only problem is the magnesium head used to break under heavy riders. The Campione handlebar also came in matte finish (except for the counterfeit ones), but fetched a ridiculous $400 price, considering it was probably made in Taiwan.

The problem would be your crank anyway, as I presume you'd use a Campy, which is a glossy finish in worse yet, multidirectional carbon. As most carbon frames are 3K weave, doesn't match. I don't like the look and the 'wafer' arms of the Campy carbon cranks anyway (besides the price), so I put FSA Pro Team carbons on my Colnagos.

Now Deda did come out with a nice matte 3K crank, but it had a funky look - not for everyone. There's a couple on Ebay right now. I even bought the Deda water bottle holders, which are matte finish.

Funny thing though, is Deda never came out with a matte finish stem to match this line of stuff, which was all made in Taiwan. Most their stems at the time were aluminum. However they did make an $$$$ carbon stem in matte; I forget the name, but it has the squarish shaft. Nice 3K weave. They also made one version with flame decals on it. Hard to find now, though. I bought one of these (not the flame one) to go with my Campione bar.

Ouzo Pro also had a bunch of nice matte forks to match all of this stuff, both an Aero fork and a 43 mm rake.

IMO, this is also the problem with the Pinarello Prince from 2008 on: they switched to a micro carbon weave on the frames (7K?), so all the 3K stems, bars, and cranks on the market don't match, matte or glossy.


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## rmfh

I'll have a chat with my local dealer to see whether the Deda campione handlebar is still available in a matte finish. I checked their site but can't find anything about the finish.
The stem you are referring to is the Deda Forza.
Since I have to wait a couple of month for the frame, I haven't decided yet on the group. The best option in my opinion is the Dura Ace DI2 group.

Thanks


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## FrenchNago

One thing......the tubes..........why not opencorsa cx, schwalbe ht or veloflex all three spank the living daylights out of the Zipps.........

other than that: BRAVO  we'll be looking out for the mat black finish......especially on the stem and seat post (personally i wouldn't touch the bars they are taped anyway )


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## Clevor

rmfh said:


> I'll have a chat with my local dealer to see whether the Deda campione handlebar is still available in a matte finish. I checked their site but can't find anything about the finish.
> The stem you are referring to is the Deda Forza.
> Since I have to wait a couple of month for the frame, I haven't decided yet on the group. The best option in my opinion is the Dura Ace DI2 group.
> 
> Thanks


Here is a picture of a Forza stem (sans the gaudy flame decals) and Deda water bottle holders.

I guess the Campione bar is still available but prices are pretty ridiculous considering the bar is made in the Far East. Deda is doing a Cinelli here. It's priced as high as $569! Cheapest place is Ribble Cycles but still $268. But isn't it just the thing for a $5,500 frame?

Performance sold a Forte matte seatpost that is basically a Deda Blackstick, but they discontinued it. Your best bet is finding a Blackstick on Ebay. They are pretty common used. There are really no high end options here, except sanding down the gloss of a seatpost of your choice. The Forte seatpost was actually a tad lighter than the Blackstick and at 185 gms, is the lightest 31.7 seatpost I own.


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## rmfh

Clevor said:


> Here is a picture of a Forza stem (sans the gaudy flame decals) and Deda water bottle holders.
> 
> I guess the Campione bar is still available but prices are pretty ridiculous considering the bar is made in the Far East. Deda is doing a Cinelli here. It's priced as high as $569! Cheapest place is Ribble Cycles but still $268. But isn't it just the thing for a $5,500 frame?
> 
> Performance sold a Forte matte seatpost that is basically a Deda Blackstick, but they discontinued it. Your best bet is finding a Blackstick on Ebay. They are pretty common used. There are really no high end options here, except sanding down the gloss of a seatpost of your choice. The Forte seatpost was actually a tad lighter than the Blackstick and at 185 gms, is the lightest 31.7 seatpost I own.


Thanks, but I decided to order a colnago integrated handlebar (as far as I know it is actually a FSA Plasma) and have it redone (sanded and sprayed) by BCP Specialpaint. http://www.specialpaintwork.nl/fotos_full_ref.asp?img=Frame.jpg&cat=TheoBos


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## 1Cebu

WOW!!! The stem is to die for.


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## iyeoh

Deda Forza matt carbon stem is available..except please remove those damn stickers
http://www.totalcycling.com/index.php/product/dedaforza.html?action=currency&id=USD

Deda Campione matt carbon bars
http://www.glorycycles.com/decacarobar.html
http://www.amazon.com/Deda-Campione-Road-Bicycle-Handlebars/dp/B000YBBYDW but price is a rip off

Deda Black Stick matt carbon seatpost
http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=5300
http://www.wekeepyoucycling.com/en/p-377-deda-blackstick-carbon-seatpost.aspx

So, the matt carbon stuff is still available... at a price...


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## rmfh

iyeoh said:


> So, the matt carbon stuff is still available... at a price...


I agree, great stem but it's a 2004 model.


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## Clevor

rmfh said:


> I agree, great stem but it's a 2004 model.


I'm pretty sure that ad from TotalCycling is wrong. Those stems are NOS, as note the limited sizing. Deda isn't making them anymore. I got my stem in 2005, and at the time, there was a choice of plain or with flame decals. They've showed up every so often on Ebay since then, but the plain matte is hard to find these days.

The stem might actually have been made in Italy, since I've never seen (Far East) knockoffs of it. Mine is in 130 mm, which is what I use on Colnagos, and there is a lot of nice, 3K real estate on it. Still don't think the price is justified, though.


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## Pirx

1Cebu said:


> Any and all criticisms will be appreciated.


Ahrrghh, you did it: Defaced that Italian beauty with that fugly Shimano stuff! :mad2: Didn't they tell you that anything but Campy is illegal on such a bike?


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## iyeoh

Pirx said:


> Ahrrghh, you did it: Defaced that Italian beauty with that fugly Shimano stuff! :mad2: Didn't they tell you that anything but Campy is illegal on such a bike?


Damn.. I thought I held the franchise for being harsh... you take the cake.


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## Salsa_Lover

philosophic moral of the day :

there is always an obnoxier fish


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## 1Cebu

Pirx said:


> Ahrrghh, you did it: Defaced that Italian beauty with that fugly Shimano stuff! :mad2: Didn't they tell you that anything but Campy is illegal on such a bike?


thought so too ...... but when Señor Ernesto decided to build a Di2 specific frameset ..... then it led me to thinking :wink: ......... and voila!!! ...... i've seen the light :aureola: 

at any rate ....... to prove that I was once a purist :blush2: .... my EPS (this is the first generation ..... so this could still pass off as 100% Italian made  ) is in SR11 ..... peace


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## Clevor

1Cebu said:


> thought so too ...... but when Señor Ernesto decided to build a Di2 specific frameset ..... then it led me to thinking :wink: ......... and voila!!! ...... i've seen the light :aureola:
> 
> at any rate ....... to prove that I was once a purist :blush2: .... my EPS (this is the first generation ..... so this could still pass off as 100% Italian made  ) is in SR11 ..... peace
> QUOTE]
> 
> Errr, not really. That's why this whole Italian-made business is pointless, moot. Man, that pic is soooo big you can even see the chainrings on that $500-600 Campy crank no longer says 'Made in Italy', as do all the Campy cranks I got - 'cause I bought them before 2004.
> 
> Plus the Fulcrum stuff are made in Taiwan or China, I believe.
> 
> As has been brought up on this forum back then, only Campy Record stuff in 2004 was 100% made in Italy, as Chorus stuff contained parts made in Romania. Chainrings on all cranks since then are probably Romanian made. I believe Campy is now building a factory in Taiwan or China - presumably for non-Fulcrum stuff - so it's gonna get worse.
> 
> Maybe I could come closest to building an all Italian bike with my 2005 C50: I got 10-spd Record stuff I bought in 2004. The hardest part of the puzzle is the crank, but I have a 2003 Record crank which was the first carbon crank Campy made. Only thing is a brand-new specimen complete with box is quite a collectible these days, so I don't know I'd want to install it. I got a Campy seatpost I bought at the time, Fizik Arione saddle, and Deda Forza/Mag 00 stem (both of which were probably made in Italy). The only suspect item is the Campione bar which Paolo Bettini used to race on, but that would fool a lot of people :smilewinkgrin:. The wheelset are Campy Boras bought in 2004.
> 
> Due to having to install the crank, don't think I'd do this build anyway. Instead I have two other builds for this C50 with the World Champ paint job: the WC theme (using all Ritchey components with the WC decal :thumbsup, or the matte finish theme with Deda matte finish components.
> 
> Nothing's 100% made in Italy anymore :nono:; not Deda, not Cinelli, so give it up, folks! If you really want Italian made, buy a pair of shoes.


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## tmluk

I so agree with you. Buying Campagnolo, Deda, 3TTT and others are in name and spirit only. I still buy Campagnolo but fully aware the country of origin is probably some where outside Italy. Therefore, it is very encouraging to see the EPS and C59 are still assembled and painted(?) in Cambiago, eventhough the raw materials are non-Italian. Unlike the good old days of Masters where the making of the tubings (Columbus), dropouts (Campagnolo) and brazing are all done in Italy.


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## Pirx

1Cebu said:


> thought so too ...... but when Señor Ernesto decided to build a Di2 specific frameset ..... then it led me to thinking :wink: ......... and voila!!! ...... i've seen the light


Yeah, I know: The masters have turned to the dark side, too. What has this world come to?  



1Cebu said:


> at any rate ....... to prove that I was once a purist :blush2: .... my EPS (this is the first generation ..... so this could still pass off as 100% Italian made  ) is in SR11 ..... peace


Ah, don't worry, I was just kidding. Actually, the idea to equip a bike with DI2 to get a clean build, with next to no extraneous wires and stuff, as in this thread, does have some appeal. I just decided that I am going to wait for Campy's electric group until I go there...


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## Salsa_Lover

It is *Signore *Ernesto BTW


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## pablotn

Pirx said:


> Ahrrghh, you did it: Defaced that Italian beauty with that fugly Shimano stuff! :mad2: Didn't they tell you that anything but Campy is illegal on such a bike?


Sad when a fella shares his newly built ride with his padres and you end up getting this dipshit dribble. Is this what it is going to come to everytime someone posts their build. Incredible.....

Not a damn thing wrong with the gruppo or component choices.

Beautiful machine, and enjoy the ride.

pablo


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## nicensleazy

Love the fulcrum wheels on the EPS....good looking bike...you must be please


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## chuckice

Colnago really should offer a post, stem/bar with a matte finish if they're going to offer a matte frame...

And while we're at it Campy should offer some matte cranks.


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## Jbartmc

pablotn said:


> Sad when a fella shares his newly built ride with his padres and you end up getting this dipshit dribble. Is this what it is going to come to everytime someone posts their build. Incredible.....
> 
> Not a damn thing wrong with the gruppo or component choices.
> 
> Beautiful machine, and enjoy the ride.
> 
> pablo


No more civility on RBR, it appears. While I prefer Campagnolo on my bikes, I realize that some people prefer Shimano. It is fine to express an opinion, but your point about mean-spirited posts is true.


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## Pirx

pablotn said:


> Sad when a fella shares his newly built ride with his padres and you end up getting this dipshit dribble. Is this what it is going to come to everytime someone posts their build. Incredible.....


Hey nitwit, why don't you read the thread you are posting to. In this particular case, my post above yours might have been helpful. Sheesh...


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## 1Cebu

Taking FrenchNago's advise, I did some D.I.Y. work on the glossy bits (save the hbars) .... and here's the result -


























with her playmate


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## FrenchNago

*Stunning*

Wow Wow Wow..........nice race stable.....one for every other day  ......and a mountain bike for the rainy days!!!


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## ronderman

1Cebu - can I ask - can you give a quick rundown of the EPS as compared to the C59 and dura ace electric compared to Record? It would be good to hear - i myself am going EPS or EPQ with 2011 record.


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## Salsa_Lover

looks great. 

maybe you can also render matte the carbon saddle rails ?


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## 1Cebu

ronderman said:


> 1Cebu - can I ask - can you give a quick rundown of the EPS as compared to the C59 and dura ace electric compared to Record? It would be good to hear - i myself am going EPS or EPQ with 2011 record.


EPS and C59 basically have the same ride characteristics ..... fast, stiff and stable (great for reeling in breakaways - or attempting to do one - on flat to rolling terrain) .... also both are exceptionally confident in fast and twisting descents. I could sense that the C59 is a tad stiffer on the rear.

Di2 outshifts the SR11 (first generation). 

The SR11, once finetuned shifts like butter. It often needs to be finetuned however. Our local bike geek/mechanic attributes this to cable stretching (or housing compression) and due to the tight tolerances of the 11 gear cogset - the tuning easily is affected. Di2 stays on true and very easy to adjust and finetuned (in case you need to - i.e., changing wheels).

That's my few cents worth.


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## iyeoh

What happened to your Cervelo R3SL? Knowing you, you probably have that too with it's separate DI2 and Zipp 303 or something insane like a Lightweight Ventoux.


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## Pirx

1Cebu said:


> It often needs to be finetuned however. Our local bike geek/mechanic attributes this to cable stretching (or housing compression) and due to the tight tolerances of the 11 gear cogset - the tuning easily is affected.


See, that kind of comment I have never understood. But then I never let anybody touch my bike's mechanics, ever.  

Seriously, I have set up my SR11 once, two seasons ago (you can tell that I also think that the idea of completely replacing all cables once a year is nonsense, by the way) and I never had to touch it since. Well, alright, at the end of last year I did figure that a drop of oil in the shifters' mechanics wouldn't hurt, but that was it. Mind you, all that this was about was the shifting feeling a bit rough, with the resistance in the shifting levers themselves becoming slightly uneven. Otherwise, at least for me, there's no cables "stretching", and no housings "compressing", either. No idea what people are doing, or why they feel the need to "finetune" things.


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## 1Cebu

iyeoh said:


> What happened to your Cervelo R3SL? Knowing you, you probably have that too with it's separate DI2 and Zipp 303 or something insane like a Lightweight Ventoux.


hahaha ........

after 3 months trying to emulate Carlos Sastre in our boondocks .......... i had to accept the fact that i could never be a climber  .............. and inasmuch as I don't really feel comfortable with it hammering in the flats, or zooming down the hills, decided to sell the frameset to a buddy. The Di2 and the 303s are from the R3SL build. Just purchased a pricey internal wiring kit for the Di2.


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## 1Cebu

Pirx said:


> See, that kind of comment I have never understood. But then I never let anybody touch my bike's mechanics, ever.
> 
> Seriously, I have set up my SR11 once, two seasons ago (you can tell that I also think that the idea of completely replacing all cables once a year is nonsense, by the way) and I never had to touch it since. Well, alright, at the end of last year I did figure that a drop of oil in the shifters' mechanics wouldn't hurt, but that was it. Mind you, all that this was about was the shifting feeling a bit rough, with the resistance in the shifting levers themselves becoming slightly uneven. Otherwise, at least for me, there's no cables "stretching", and no housings "compressing", either. No idea what people are doing, or why they feel the need to "finetune" things.



Can't understand it myself at first (especially that this is not the case for my Record 10 - a plug and play type of gruppo) ...... but the shifting suffers terribly (skipping, hesitant and, even, ghost shifting) after just a few rides. We had to redo the cable layout .... clean and lubed it, it got a little better but still you need to finetune it once in a while to remove any chain rubbing (on the next gear) after several rides. As I've said, this is not the case for the Record 10 or for the Di2. Maybe, we were not able to install the SR11 spot on. By the way, our lbs (a distributor of Campagnolo) admitted that they received several complaints of similar nature from the first gen SR11 users. Most of the complaints were addressed by replacing the stock cables with Gore cables.


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## FrenchNago

1Cebu said:


> hahaha ........
> 
> after 3 months trying to emulate Carlos Sastre in our boondocks .......... i had to accept the fact that i could never be a climber


OOOOOh so you bought a C59 to emulate A Charteau........I see    (you need to change the paint scheme the )


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## iyeoh

Now you need an M10 with SRAM Red, and you would then conquer the world of Colnago!


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## Pirx

1Cebu said:


> but the shifting suffers terribly (skipping, hesitant and, even, ghost shifting) after just a few rides. We had to redo the cable layout .... clean and lubed it, it got a little better but still you need to finetune it once in a while to remove any chain rubbing (on the next gear) after several rides.


Hmm, that's really strange. So yours is not a case of somebody endlessly fiddling with things because he feels the shifts aren't just quite "snappy" enough, you seem to have good reason to re-adjust things. Mysterious, to say the least. What I have heard , though, is that some people have no end of issues in cases where the cable routing is dicey, so that they have excessive amounts of friction, often in connection with internal routing. 

Like I said, I swear that I have been riding my SR11 for thousands of miles without ever touching any of the adjustments of my group, neither front nor rear. Actually, I have _never_ touched the front derailleur adjustments after the initial setup, ever. I had to re-adjust the rear when I went to a new set of wheels, but that's it. No chain rubbing ever, anywhere...


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## SamG

Not perfectly matte and not Italian, but pretty light, subtle and good looking is the Thomson X2 stem on a matte frame:










It is also available in 17degrees, which really complements a frame with traditional geometry.


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## Barsuk

1Cebu said:


> thought so too ...... but when Señor Ernesto decided to build a Di2 specific frameset ..... then it led me to thinking :wink: ......... and voila!!! ...... i've seen the light :aureola:
> 
> at any rate ....... to prove that I was once a purist :blush2: .... my EPS (this is the first generation ..... so this could still pass off as 100% Italian made  ) is in SR11 ..... peace


Don't believe all the components are 100% Made in Italy.


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## Barsuk

Yep...you are 100% correct. Made in Italy will mean that some parts are from Italy or it may have been put together there, but Italian law dictates that 100% Made in Italy stamping means NO IMPORTATION from anywhere.

As far as the problem with deteriorating quality issues, we have actively been searching for American companies who are starting to made superior products again. Rotor and ee cycle come to mind for cranks and brakes that are superior to Campy Super Record parts in fit, finish and performance.


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## Barsuk

rmfh said:


> Great bike. I ordered one a few days ago. The only problem is I can't find a matching matte black stem and handlebar or an integrated handlebar. I asked Colnago to customize the integrated handlebar to match the colour of the bike, but they don't do that. If you have any suggestions, please let me know.


Yes...there is a store called welcome to twohubs cycling boutique - 877.480.2453 in Lake Forrest, Ca. They do all custom paint that even the main manufactures are envious of. Go there to get details on how to complete your dream build!


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## MXL

iyeoh said:


> Damn.. I thought I held the franchise for being harsh... you take the cake.


AMEN!!! An arrest warrant shall be issued!!! And if the Shimano components weren't bad enough, someone let it out of the factory in primer. :-(


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