# Hutchinson Tubeless review



## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

is here:
http://reviews.roadbikereview.com/blog/hutchinson-piranha-cx-tubeless-ready-tire-review/

It's done by Jeremy Kimmel who posts here as jmkimmel. He's from Norcal and was recently seen at a local event chasing Jacque-Maynes and Overend.

Please leave comments on the review.

fc


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## Andrea138 (Mar 10, 2008)

Cool!


BTW- what is the "‘Belgian’ method" for gluing tubulars? I'm somewhat of a CX noob.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

Andrea138 said:


> Cool!
> 
> 
> BTW- what is the "‘Belgian’ method" for gluing tubulars? I'm somewhat of a CX noob.


I was wondering the same thing. I'm guessing a lot of glue and Belgian ale is involved.

fc


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

"Belgian method" is tape plus glue.

Great article. Very thought-provoking.


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## Andrea138 (Mar 10, 2008)

Wow, and I thought that just tape was hard to remove...


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

Andrea138 said:


> Wow, and I thought that just tape was hard to remove...


A top guy in our local series rolled a taped (not glued) tubular on turn one of our season opener. He had the pleasure of running the first two-thirds of the course.

Remember, folks are running as low as 22 PSI, low pressure is the raison d'etre for cross tubulars. So you depend more on the glue to keep the tire on than with road or track tires.


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## tomk96 (Sep 24, 2007)

cool. i was looking for more info on tubeless.


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## FTM (Feb 4, 2005)

I'm in agreement with the reviewer. I've got the Piranhas on my training/backup wheel set and they are great for that, but I certainly wouldn't trade them in for my Griffos on race day.


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Remember though- Hutchinson is French for "sucky". As the numerous (every third item it seems like) clearance Hutchinson tires on Chainlove attest. 

Tubeless may be an ok idea, but Hutchinson-- pass.


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## OnTheRivet (Sep 3, 2004)

Coolhand said:


> Remember though- Hutchinson is French for "sucky". As the numerous (every third item it seems like) clearance Hutchinson tires on Chainlove attest.
> 
> Tubeless may be an ok idea, but Hutchinson-- pass.


What? I've been racing MTB's on Hutchinson Pythons for years. After trying tons of other tires I still come back to the Python, the best XC race tire ever made.


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## jroden (Jun 15, 2004)

Getting that tape + glue off a rim is the 7 circles of hell. I had some used rims that had been used with the tape and glue method and the center section was so built that I couldn't seal the edges, so I had to strip that crap off with furniture stripper over a period of a week. I've been happy with the globs-o-glue method lately.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

I added a video of the push pin test on the tire.

FYI, the tire was installed with Fast Air Sealant. The Fast Air is supposed to be used for installation and field repairs. It works good, albeit a little expensive at $12 each. It's been three months so I'll have to check if there's any fluid left in the tire.

So the tire doesn't pinch flat. Now it doesn't puncture flat. the ride and reliability is A+. Meh... not bad.

fc

http://reviews.roadbikereview.com/blog/hutchinson-piranha-cx-tubeless-ready-tire-review/


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## Kuna (Oct 14, 2002)

*Francois*

I see that you are running the Bulldogs on your sweet Steelman. What kind of clearance do you have at the chainstay? Do you have a photo? Thanks!


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

Kuna said:


> I see that you are running the Bulldogs on your sweet Steelman. What kind of clearance do you have at the chainstay? Do you have a photo? Thanks!


1mm each side. It's a close shave. I should have photos later.

fc


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## jroden (Jun 15, 2004)

francois said:


> 1mm each side. It's a close shave. I should have photos later.
> 
> fc


I have about a quarter inch on my hot tubes, those are very wide and tall tires. They are maybe a little excessive for race day, but are nice to train on for sure.


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## jmeerse (Nov 12, 2004)

I've got the Hutchinson tubeless Bulldogs on a set of Dura-Ace tubeless wheels that I've been riding for a couple weeks now. This afternoon when I was ripping through a corner (off camber, short grass and dirt), the front tire burped air, resulting in the expected crash. There was plenty of dirt and grass between the sidewall and the rim, and air continued to leak until I pulled it all out. I was running about 33 psi in the front, apparently a bit too low (I'm 150 lbs, and usually run my front tubular at about 28 psi and a front clincher at 33 psi). I had run them successfully at 40 psi during practice the previous week, but wanted to see if I could go lower to smooth out some of the bumps.

I had hopes of using these to race with, but now I'll stick to tubulars. I don't think the Bulldogs are even as nice as a good clincher -- they're not very supple, and the cornering is just kind of so-so. Forced to choose, I'd go with a Mud2 or a Maxis Mimo before the Bulldog.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

francois said:


> 1mm each side. It's a close shave. I should have photos later.
> 
> fc


Photos


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## gollig (Nov 10, 2006)

I've been racing and training on Bulldogs with the Dura-ace tubeless wheels this year. I originally ran them at 35psi but started burping on my remounts (I'm 185lbs). At 45 psi, the tire would no longer burp, but then I lose the advantage of running lower pressures. Last week I added a stan's rim strip last week and haven't had any burping yet. We'll see how it goes this weekend.

I was hoping it would work out of the box, but no such luck. I've been fiddling with my tires all season.


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## kam (Sep 19, 2004)

gollig said:


> Last week I added a stan's rim strip last week and haven't had any burping yet. We'll see how it goes this weekend.


i believe stan's website recommends using the cx rim strips if you are racing or you will get burps.

i have a bulldog/piranha combo coming soon. i am mounting them ghetto tubeless with sealant to my dura-ace/aeroheads.

i will post pics and a quick review when i have some time on them.


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## Kuna (Oct 14, 2002)

*Hmm*

I am 165 pounds and have been able to run them at 32lbs with no burping issues. I know some guys on my team had burping issues and it turned out they did not properly setup the tires. When you mount the tires be sure to moisten the tire bead with soapy water, add stans or use the Hutchinson air can (adds sealant as it inflates) - you should inflate to the maixmum PSI listed on the tire or a few pounds above, you will hear a lot of poping as the bead is setting. Once inflated spin the wheel to spread the sealant; I let mine sit overnight at the maximum PSI, and then deflated to the pressure I wanted and no problems. Guys were dry mounting the tires and using stans, but only inflating the tire intially to 40 or so pounds, which prevented the tire bead from setting onto the rim. Just like tubulars, you need to take the time to set it up right.

Again, I am running the Dura Ace tubeless wheelset, you don't need stans strips for this wheelset.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

Good advice from everyone! 

On the issue of burping, the other factor to consider is riding on grass. It looks like that can put a lot more cornering stress on the tire compared to dirt/sand/mud.

Also wanted to remind folks to post user reviews. We barely have any and that's what this site is about.

Piranha:
http://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/wheels/tires-clincher/hutchinson/PRD_408486_2489crx.aspx

Bulldog
http://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/wheels/tires-clincher/hutchinson/PRD_408487_2489crx.aspx


fc


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## rensho (Aug 5, 2003)

I've found through 3 years of running tubeless on mtn and cx, when PSI is discussed, we need to also know via what gauge. 1 have 3 gauges. Silca reads 8psi too high at 30psi. Performance pump reads ~2-3 psi high. Topeak digital gauge reads dead on.

One person's 32psi is another person's 40psi...

I was denting a lot of rims a couple years ago running 28psi on my silca, on mtb.


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## jmkimmel (Jul 13, 2007)

Ahh...good point about variation in gauges. I use two old Specialized floor pumps. One of them reads ~2psi higher than the other at cross/mtb pressures, so I take that into account...but I dont' know how that translates to other people's pumps (O.P.P)

I'll have to pick me up one of those digital gauges...hmm.


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

Floor pump gauges are not to be trusted at low pressures.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*Belgian Method*



pretender said:


> "Belgian method" is tape plus glue.
> 
> Great article. Very thought-provoking.


is MASTIK TAPE and MASTIK glue

I use this method and have gotten 3 seasons out of 1 gluing and Istill needed tools to remove the tire, would blister your thumbs

NEVER use tufo tape, NEVER NEVER use it alone
Mastik tape is much thinner

1) after stretching tire apply thin layer of glue to each (tire and rim)
as rim gets tacky, apply mastik tape
allow to dry
2) apply second thin layer to tire,allow to dry
3) add third layer (thin) to tire as it is setting up, peel backing off tape
place some small,thin daps of glue around tape
mount tire


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## 1Fliprider (Nov 9, 2004)

*Dura Ace and Bulldogs*

I have been experimenting with this set up also. Agreed about the proper set up. I regularly go Mtn biking here in SoCal and have yet to burp. I'm 165lbs and have gone as low as 25psi though normally would ride at 35psi.

My shop Rock & Road set me up. Lost air overnight in one tire. Shop told me to spin the tire (Stans inside) and pump to a high psi overnight. Has been fine ever since.

I love this set up for training but still race on tubs.


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## Summit_Rider (Aug 29, 2006)

*Tubeless on Mavic Ksyrium Equipe Rims ?*

I am interested in hearing feedback from those of you that are running Hutchinson Bulldogs / Piranha tires using a Stan's cyclocross kit on standard rims - not DA tubless rims. What tire pressures ( highest/ lowest) can you run ? Do you have problems with tires burping at low pressures, or the tire bead popping off at high pressures ? 

I use my cross bike for combination pavement/dirt road/trail rides- no CX races. I seem to get a lot of pinch flats unless I run my tube tires at 65psi ( I weigh about 155lbs. ) I am interested in going tubless to run lower pressures, and reduce pinch flats. I would really appreciate hearing from other riders on how well these tires work on non-Dura Ace rims. 

Thanks in advance !


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## FTM (Feb 4, 2005)

I'm not using DA rims, I have Kinlin rims and am using just Stan's spoke tape with Stan's removable core stem - no rim strip. Haven't had any issues with running pressures as low as 28 front and 34 rear (I'm 150lbs) even though I have bottomed out on roots and rocks occasionally.


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## cyclocross808 (Dec 5, 2005)

hey summit rider, if you're going to do that conversion, you don't really need to use the hutchinson tires. that tire's bead is designed to work well with the shimano wheels, but for conversions, many tires work well. you can read more about other tubeless setups (and which tires work well) here .

Cyclocross Magazine's Issue 4, mailing now, takes a deeper look at tubeless options, following up josh patterson's overview in Issue 3. We played with both Shimano/Hutchinson setups and Stans/Raven/Normal Clincher setups and found some interesting results at low pressure.


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## FTM (Feb 4, 2005)

I wouldn't go that far. The Hutch tubeless sidewalls and bead are much stronger which will benefit any tubeless setup. I've blown the bead on Mich Jets and on the Maxxis Raze (which work well as tubeless) I can feel the sidewall fold and torque at the pressures with which I can comfortably ride the Hutchs.


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## DRLski (Apr 26, 2003)

atpjunkie said:


> is MASTIK TAPE and MASTIK glue
> 
> I use this method and have gotten 3 seasons out of 1 gluing and Istill needed tools to remove the tire, would blister your thumbs
> 
> ...


How long between these steps usually? Also, with step 1, I assume apply mastik tape to both tire and rim?


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## cyclocross808 (Dec 5, 2005)

the carbon tubeless bead was really designed to not stretch under high pressures for road applications, and you don't have that issue with the low pressures of 'cross. 

the sidewall flexibility is a separate issue - just like a typhoon vs. a typhoon flying doctor, or a 290 tpi vs 220 tpi tire, you can have different sidewall stiffness. one can argue that a stiffer sidewall can handle lower pressures but another can argue that in that case, it actually takes a lower psi to offer the same suppleness that results in lower rolling resistance on bumpy terrain (see our Under Pressure article in issue 3). 

the jet and raze are also narrower tires, which would also help explain why they might start to squirm at higher pressures than the hutchinson.

good luck!


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## iJaz (Oct 26, 2005)

Does anybody know a Euro webshop that sells Hutchinson Bulldog Tubeless for a decent price?


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## FTM (Feb 4, 2005)

cyclocross808 said:


> the carbon tubeless bead was really designed to not stretch under high pressures for road applications, and you don't have that issue with the low pressures of 'cross.
> 
> the sidewall flexibility is a separate issue - just like a typhoon vs. a typhoon flying doctor, or a 290 tpi vs 220 tpi tire, you can have different sidewall stiffness. one can argue that a stiffer sidewall can handle lower pressures but another can argue that in that case, it actually takes a lower psi to offer the same suppleness that results in lower rolling resistance on bumpy terrain (see our Under Pressure article in issue 3).
> 
> ...


Good enough points to let me concede, wondering if I should put the Raze back on - I think I liked them better than the Piranhas.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

cyclocross808 said:


> the carbon tubeless bead was really designed to not stretch under high pressures for road applications, and you don't have that issue with the low pressures of 'cross.
> 
> good luck!


It's still an issue. Not everyone rides cross tires at 30 psi. Over 50 psi, beads stretch and they can blow off the rim.

There's two other issues:
- One is the quality/shape of the bead and the rim to bead mating. The Hutchinsons have a big, rectangular shaped bead and it mates with a compatible rim with a lot of surface area.

- The other issue is fit. You want a tire and wheel that fit together in a very firm/snug manner. This makes it easier to inflate and it prevents blowing off and burping.

So there exist rim/tire tubeless conversions out there that work but you have to be very careful with them if you go that route. The best is if someone you trust does the homework/experimentation for you and you can learn from them.

The worst is you try a combination that is impossible to inflate and when you get it pumped up, it burps or blows off the rim at high speed pavement.

Tread carefully and.... buy a compressor.

fc


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## jmoote (Nov 29, 2007)

francois said:


> It's still an issue. Not everyone rides cross tires at 30 psi. Over 50 psi, beads stretch and they can blow off the rim.


Not everyone rides at 30 psi, but nobody needs to run 50+ either. Even the heaviest rider will be happy with about 40 in a tire as big as the Hutchinsons (i.e. myself at 190 - I can run 35-40 comfortably).


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## PeanutButterBreath (Dec 4, 2005)

*Hmm.*



cyclocross808 said:


> the carbon tubeless bead was really designed to not stretch under high pressures for road applications, and you don't have that issue with the low pressures of 'cross.





notubes.com said:


> When standard tires are mounted tubeless more strain is put on the bead. The above listed tires are known to have weaker beads. Which can cause the bead to severely stretch or snap. http://www.notubes.com/support_tire.php


I consider any non-endorsed-by-manufacturer combination to be a potential ticking time-bomb, not to be trifled with by anyone not aware of the risk they are taking on. Shimano's "serious injury or death" boilerplate comes to mind. Corporate CYA? Maybe. Worth it? Not to me.


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## ss-jimbo (Aug 3, 2006)

I hate that manufacturers do up a tubeless version of a tire then drop the non-tubeless. I have no problem with tubes, and don't want to put them in a heavy, stiff walled tire, that's nearly impossible to get on/off the rim (a big problem for my wife when she rides alone). I tried some tubeless ready tires (because that's what the shop had in the model I wanted) and it was a cursing and swearing episode trying to get them on. I immediately returned them. I believe the non-tubeless Bulldogs have been discontinued, though there seems to be a couple of internet retailers that still have them. This is unfortunate, because they are great tires.


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## jmoote (Nov 29, 2007)

Even using tubes, I don't like a tire that I can throw on the rim from across the room. Tight beads give me more confidence in a clincher especially for cross (and mtb).


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## cyclocross808 (Dec 5, 2005)

jmoote said:


> Even using tubes, I don't like a tire that I can throw on the rim from across the room. Tight beads give me more confidence in a clincher especially for cross (and mtb).


jmoote,

curious - have you had a loose bead come off during riding before? i haven't...just wondering if that's been an issue before, or whether it's just something that gives you more confidence?


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## jmoote (Nov 29, 2007)

cyclocross808 said:


> curious - have you had a loose bead come off during riding before? i haven't...just wondering if that's been an issue before, or whether it's just something that gives you more confidence?


I've rolled the bead enough to end up with grass stuck between it and the rim, though it was not catastrophic. My point was that I'd rather a tight bead that takes some work to get on and off than to have any doubt - it's not like I have to change tires in a race.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

cyclocross808 said:


> jmoote,
> 
> curious - have you had a loose bead come off during riding before? i haven't...just wondering if that's been an issue before, or whether it's just something that gives you more confidence?


This a good builder I met at NAHBS. He had a very loose tire, got it on the rim and it slipped off while he was riding on the road. It is a crushing injury and has made me wary of very loose tires on rims.

http://yipsanbicycles.blogspot.com/2008/05/its-been-long.html

fc


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## artnshel (Jun 29, 2004)

I'm running a Piranha tubeless on an Easton Vista rim with a homemade rimstrip consisting of strapping tape, a 24" presta tube cut into a strip with the valve and stans. The tire isn't marked as tubeless but is super tight on the rim.

I'm 170 and find I lose air even at 40psi however 45 Psi seems solid for me. Would a tubeless rim help prevent burping or just make the initial seal easier? 

I did need a compressor to get the tire to seal.

I may try a Mud 2 or Raze tubeless and see how it works.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

artnshel said:


> I'm running a Piranha tubeless on an Easton Vista rim with a homemade rimstrip consisting of strapping tape, a 24" presta tube cut into a strip with the valve and stans. The tire isn't marked as tubeless but is super tight on the rim.
> 
> I'm 170 and find I lose air even at 40psi however 45 Psi seems solid for me. *Would a tubeless rim help prevent burping* or just make the initial seal easier?
> ...


But of course! The Tubeless road standard means the big is bigger, stronger and the rectangular shape mates with a matching rim. Also, the fit is dialed too.

fc


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## artnshel (Jun 29, 2004)

Thanks Fc

Now we need a list of tubeless rims and wheels. Here's what I'm aware of:
Stans ZTR rim $85 - 410grams (32 hole only and it's wide)
Dura Ace 7850 $1000 - 1514grams
09 Campy Eurus $1000? - 1550g (aero rim)
09 Fulcrum 1 $1000? - 1550g


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## ShuffleSpade (Aug 13, 2006)

Hey Francois, What are you using as valve stems when using Ksyrium Elites to make them tubeless compatible?


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## stwok (Mar 15, 2007)

Summit_Rider said:


> I use my cross bike for combination pavement/dirt road/trail rides- no CX races. I seem to get a lot of pinch flats unless I run my tube tires at 65psi ( I weigh about 155lbs. ) I am interested in going tubless to run lower pressures, and reduce pinch flats. I would really appreciate hearing from other riders on how well these tires work on non-Dura Ace rims.
> 
> Thanks in advance !


I'm using my Cross bike in the same manner. For the 30 some years I've been using baby powder to coat the inside of the tire and also placing the deflated tube in a bag with powder and shaking until it's covered. The powder acts as a dry lubricant and prevents pinch flats. It sounds like you are using enough air pressure for weight. Give it a try!


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## racerdave (Dec 1, 2007)

artnshel said:


> I'm running a Piranha tubeless on an Easton Vista rim with a homemade rimstrip consisting of strapping tape, a 24" presta tube cut into a strip with the valve and stans. The tire isn't marked as tubeless but is super tight on the rim.
> 
> I'm 170 and find I lose air even at 40psi however 45 Psi seems solid for me. Would a tubeless rim help prevent burping or just make the initial seal easier?
> 
> ...


You're running what's called "ghetto tubeless." I find the ghetto setups to be less about the tire than the rim/tube interface. On my 29er, my ghetto setup is far more likely to burp with any tire than my Stan's rim. Even when tires fit "tightly" with the ghetto setup, they're far more likely to burp.

The Stan's rim just seals far better at low pressures than the ghetto setup does. The 355s are nice rims for a cross setup (though narrow for a 29er). I ran too low a pressure on my Stan's front rim and rolled a tire off the bead on an extreme move on my 29er (pulling the front over a log when hitting the bottom of a depression at the same time) and it seated with just a MTB frame pump. I aired it up and rode off. My ghetto setups always took a compressor to seat. 

Stan's rims are really nice for tubeless setups -- and I use them with conventional tires.


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

what happened to the post about the race 29er rims? those look awesome! maybe someone let the cat out of the bag a little too early.


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## FTM (Feb 4, 2005)

NickBarbieri said:


> what happened to the post about the race 29er rims? those look awesome! maybe someone let the cat out of the bag a little too early.


It's in another thread


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

im an idiot


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

ShuffleSpade said:


> Hey Francois, What are you using as valve stems when using Ksyrium Elites to make them tubeless compatible?


I'm using normal Stans valves and since Mavic rim valve holes are so big, I put in a rubber washer (plumbers section at the hardware) to fill the gap.

fc


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

francois,
are you using a stans cx rimstrip on your ksyriums or just the road valves? If you are using a cx rimstrip, did you put any velox tape under the strip to build up the center cavity? I am getting ready to convert my ksyriums to tubeless with either the bulldogs or the stans tire. Thanks


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## rensho (Aug 5, 2003)

The Ksyriums only have 1 hole, the valve stem. No need for any strips or tape.

I used a cut up innertube folder a couple times with a hole in it. Put the Stans valve through that and use it as a washer because the hole in the rim is too big.

Stans also sells a larger grommet valve stem that you can cut down to work with the Ksyrium.

Someone should measure the diameter of the Ksryium and see if it is smaller than a true tubeless rim like the DA 7850. My Ksyriums have worked for over 1 year running regular tires as tubeless, but always wonder if they are less than optimal.


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

rensho said:


> The Ksyriums only have 1 hole, the valve stem. No need for any strips or tape.
> 
> I used a cut up innertube folder a couple times with a hole in it. Put the Stans valve through that and use it as a washer because the hole in the rim is too big.


I realize that they _can_ be run tubeless without a strip or tape, but it seems like you could run lower pressure with a strip without worrying about burping.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

NickBarbieri said:


> I realize that they _can_ be run tubeless without a strip or tape, but it seems like you could run lower pressure with a strip without worrying about burping.


I'm not running with a rim strip or tape. It really has no effect on burping. I think it makes initial inflation easier in some tire/rim combos.

Burping is really dependent on the rim to tire bead interface. Hutchinson Tubeless has a big, rectangular bead and compatible wheels like Shimano have a matching bead as well.

2008+ Mavic Ksyriums have a matching bead as well and seem to have been designed for Hutchinson Tubeless. Rumors are they were working towards compatibility but pulled out at the last moment, possibly because of installation difficulty. 

So I'm using Ksyriums and they work flawlessly both on road and cross. They do not leak more than tubes and I had it down to 28 psi at the last race with grass.

fc


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

rensho said:


> The Ksyriums only have 1 hole, the valve stem. No need for any strips or tape.
> 
> I used a cut up innertube folder a couple times with a hole in it. Put the Stans valve through that and use it as a washer because the hole in the rim is too big.
> 
> ...


Agreed!

You're running a normal tire tubeless? What kind? You're talking cross tires, right? Not road...

fc


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

That sounds promising. The only thing is that I have some older ksyrium ssc sl's, so i'm assuming the rim bead is a little different.


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## Francis Cebedo (Aug 1, 2001)

NickBarbieri said:


> That sounds promising. The only thing is that I have some older ksyrium ssc sl's, so i'm assuming the rim bead is a little different.


Look at this photo... from a post above.
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=145316&stc=1&d=1225000331

You can see the rim on my wheels.

fc


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

It's kind of hard to tell but I do think mine are a little different.


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## rensho (Aug 5, 2003)

francois said:


> Agreed!
> 
> You're running a normal tire tubeless? What kind? You're talking cross tires, right? Not road...
> 
> fc


I'm running Maxxis and Michelin Mud2 right now. The Mud2 are great, and about 1mm smaller than Bulldogs. I have a pair of Bulldogs that are going on next.

I haven't burped a cx tire yet.


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## NickBarbieri (Jul 24, 2007)

rensho said:


> I'm running Maxxis and Michelin Mud2 right now. The Mud2 are great, and about 1mm smaller than Bulldogs. I have a pair of Bulldogs that are going on next.


which year ksyriums do you have?


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## Chonut (Mar 29, 2005)

francois said:


> So I'm using Ksyriums and they work flawlessly both on road and cross. They do not leak more than tubes and I had it down to 28 psi at the last race with grass.
> 
> fc


FC,

For road tubeless what tires have you tried and what do you think of them?

Thanks!


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## rensho (Aug 5, 2003)

NickBarbieri said:


> which year ksyriums do you have?



I have 2007 ES Ksyriums.


AFAIK, the only road tubeless tires available are the Hutchinson tires.


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## 7HVN (Sep 20, 2005)

Anybody know if the Ksyrium SSC SL will work well with Hutchinson Fusion 2 Tubeless tires?
Basically will older Ksyrium's work or just the newer ones


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