# Assos Goomah Frameset?



## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

Any one know what the deal is with this Assos branded frame? 

Assos Goomah G731 Frameset - Excel Sports

Is it as good as their bibs, or hype like their bibs?


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## Charlie the Unicorn (Jan 8, 2013)

Like anything else they make- I wouldn't pay full price and it's probably no better than the umpteen other framesets out there you can get for much less.


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## pmf (Feb 23, 2004)

Assos = hype? Really. 

What do they know about making bikes? Surely these are stamped out in some factory in China right after they do a run of Specialized and right before they make the Fujis. Its a real cool name though. I'm holding out for a Nike frame myself.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

Amazing how many people will offer their 'expertise' when they know nothing about bike manufacturing or Assos' involvement in it. For one, Assos produced the first carbon fiber frame way back in 1976. This frame is their design with a number of their partners. I've seen one in person - it's a beautiful frame. The only weakness was an integrated seatpost on earlier versions, which they've now redesigned (except it's still a proprietary post). 




pmf said:


> Assos = hype? Really.
> 
> What do they know about making bikes? Surely these are stamped out in some factory in China right after they do a run of Specialized and right before they make the Fujis. Its a real cool name though. I'm holding out for a Nike frame myself.


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

Frame is made in Taiwan. 

Nothing special about this frame. Just like a zillion others.


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

PaxRomana said:


> Frame is made in Taiwan.
> 
> Nothing special about this frame. Just like a zillion others.


First of all......great. That's where the carbon expertise is.

What's your experience with/knowledge of the frame that has led you to this conclusion?


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

Jay Strongbow said:


> First of all......great. That's where the carbon expertise is.
> 
> What's your experience with/knowledge of the frame that has led you to this conclusion?


First of all, you're wrong. That's not where "all the carbon expertise is." Maybe you can inform Time, Cyfac, Carbonsports, THM, Enve, and many other companies who manufacture in-house of your theory.

Knowledge of the frame: It's a frame made by a partnership with Assos (a clothing manufacturer) with a company called Goomah S.A.. Big name in cycling right there. The latter just outsourced production to Asia, just like tons of companies such as Stradalli, etc. 

Just another generic frame hoping to leverage a name.


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

PaxRomana said:


> First of all, you're wrong. That's not where "all the carbon expertise is." Maybe you can inform Time, Cyfac, Carbonsports, THM, Enve, and many other companies who manufacture in-house of your theory.


If you're going to quote what I said, try quoting what I said. I didn't say it was 'all' there.

Knowing who makes a frame doesn't say anything about to me. Have you actually ridden the frame or know something pertinent about it?


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## PaxRomana (Jan 16, 2012)

Jay Strongbow said:


> If you're going to quote what I said, try quoting what I said. I didn't say it was 'all' there.
> 
> Knowing who makes a frame doesn't say anything about to me. Have you actually ridden the frame or know something pertinent about it?


When you say THE carbon expertise is there, it implies more than some, as in all of it. Otherwise were you just saying that some carbon expertise exists in Taiwan? Well, no kidding. 

Knowing who makes a frame says a lot to me. If you say, here's a frame made by Time vs. here's a frame made by some unnamed factory in Asia, that tells me quite a bit, actually. I don't have to ride every single frame to draw some reasonable conclusions about a frame. I can do that based on available information, such as who makes it, how much experience do they have, where is it made, how is it made.

This looks like your average run of the mill monocoque frame. As expected, it quickly found itself on the blowout rack.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

you implied the frame was 'nothing special' 'like a zillion others' because it was made in Taiwan. That's a meaningless assertion. Almost all top end frames are made in Taiwan (to manufacturer spec). Some of the carbon manufacturing partners are leaders in carbon manufacturing R&D as well - AIM developed the anti-wrinkle process used in Pinarello and other frames, for example. The Assos frame isn't more similar to Taiwan frames because its made in the same country. Companies choose Taiwanese manufacturing partners because they have high quality standards (and more are leaving for mainland China because it's cheaper).

FWIW, I've never met a serious racer who preferred their Time frame over a Taiwanese one - I know of one US national champion who sold his Time frame as fast as he could. Tom Boonen lost some races due to his Time frame auto-shifting under load.






PaxRomana said:


> When you say THE carbon expertise is there, it implies more than some, as in all of it. Otherwise were you just saying that some carbon expertise exists in Taiwan? Well, no kidding.
> 
> Knowing who makes a frame says a lot to me. If you say, here's a frame made by Time vs. here's a frame made by some unnamed factory in Asia, that tells me quite a bit, actually. I don't have to ride every single frame to draw some reasonable conclusions about a frame. I can do that based on available information, such as who makes it, how much experience do they have, where is it made, how is it made.
> 
> This looks like your average run of the mill monocoque frame. As expected, it quickly found itself on the blowout rack.


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## junior1210 (May 2, 2013)

I'd just like to know what about that frame is worth $2k+ as opposed to any of the other 30 odd "halo" bike frames out there besides the name/history of Assos?


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

PaxRomana said:


> Knowing who makes a frame says a lot to me. If you say, here's a frame made by Time vs. here's a frame made by some unnamed factory in Asia, that tells me quite a bit, actually. I don't have to ride every single frame to draw some reasonable conclusions about a frame. I can do that based on available information, such as who makes it, how much experience do they have, where is it made, how is it made.
> 
> This looks like your average run of the mill monocoque frame. As expected, it quickly found itself on the blowout rack.


Here's the deal. A friend of mine mentioned to me he is considering this frame because he knows someone at Assos who can help him out. I figure if there was any info to be passed on from here, I would. But before telling him blah blah I wanted to know if you actually knew anything or jumped to a conclustion based on meaningless information. I now have my answer to that.

And by the way, although the Time I tried out felt pretty nice, there is no way in heck I'd choose a Time over a Storck (not even close) which I believe is made in Taiwan by an unnamed factory.


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## pmf (Feb 23, 2004)

Jay Strongbow said:


> Here's the deal. A friend of mine mentioned to me he is considering this frame because he knows someone at Assos who can help him out. I figure if there was any info to be passed on from here, I would. But before telling him blah blah I wanted to know if you actually knew anything or jumped to a conclustion based on meaningless information. I now have my answer to that.
> 
> And by the way, although the Time I tried out felt pretty nice, there is no way in heck I'd choose a Time over a Storck (not even close) which I believe is made in Taiwan by an unnamed factory.


Seems like you knew the answers to all the questions before you posted. 

Surely there's lots of expertise making carbon fiber bikes in China and Taiwan. I guess what I and some others around here feel is that so many bike companies don't make bikes anymore, they just hire a Chinese firm to make them and put their decals on them, so how is one really much different from another? All most bike companies manufacture anymore are marketing campaigns and press releases. Its just an economic reality like any other business, but its kind of sad. If I were going to buy a Chinese carbon bike, I'd look at either what Neuvation sells, or maybe Performance Scattante. At least you're not paying for the marketing or the hype. As far as what the pros ride, who cares. They ride what they get paid to ride.


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## LookDave (Sep 29, 2007)

So, all the back and forth about most bike companies having frames manufactured in Asia doesn't get at the original question - anybody know anything about THIS frame? 

Over the years I've owned two Look frames, both manufactured in their factory in Tunisia then finished in France. They did not ride the same, although manufactured in the same country for the same bike company. So if someone asks about another Look frame I've never ridden, telling that person that Look's frame factory is in Tunisia doesn't answer the question.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

This reflects a fundamental misunderstanding of the manufacturer role - companies like Specialized etc are design houses. They do the R&D, and spec the frame and own the molds etc. The manufacturer makes the frame according to those specs. If anything, this is just the logical extension of comparative advantage. The manufacturer has more expertise and leverages economies of scale. The result is a superior manufacturing process, not an inferior one. 

I don't know why there's such a misconception about this process and the idea that the frames are somehow generic as a result. Lots of major industries (like athletic shoes, electronics) use the same model. 



pmf said:


> Seems like you knew the answers to all the questions before you posted.
> 
> Surely there's lots of expertise making carbon fiber bikes in China and Taiwan. I guess what I and some others around here feel is that so many bike companies don't make bikes anymore, they just hire a Chinese firm to make them and put their decals on them, so how is one really much different from another? All most bike companies manufacture anymore are marketing campaigns and press releases. Its just an economic reality like any other business, but its kind of sad. If I were going to buy a Chinese carbon bike, I'd look at either what Neuvation sells, or maybe Performance Scattante. At least you're not paying for the marketing or the hype. As far as what the pros ride, who cares. They ride what they get paid to ride.


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## ultimobici (Jul 16, 2005)

Funny thing is Assos were one of the original innovators in Carbon. 1976.


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## BigPoser (Jan 11, 2013)

So does anyone actually have any real world experience with this frame? Looking at possibly getting one and would love some real feedback.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Well. It's the G733 now.

I don't know much about this new one either.


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## tvad (Aug 31, 2003)

kbwh said:


> Well. It's the G733 now.
> 
> I don't know much about this new one either.


Info on the G.733.

Assos does everything well. Details are of the utmost importance to this company. I suspect the frame is outstanding...regardless of it's country of manufacture.


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## BigPoser (Jan 11, 2013)

tvad said:


> Info on the G.733.
> 
> Assos does everything well. Details are of the utmost importance to this company. I suspect the frame is outstanding...regardless of it's country of manufacture.



As long as the quality is up to par, I actually don't mind where it's made. Might be able to pick up a practically brand new G.731 for a killer price so I'm trying to find out what I can.


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## ruckus (Apr 1, 2014)

Jay Strongbow said:


> First of all......great. That's where the carbon expertise is.


lulz, carbon expertise and cycling. Carbon expertise is in automotive and aerospace. Shaping tubes for cycling, on a dual triangle based geometry that's been around for a hundred years. That's some expertise. Those Chinese can't possibly be as good as the Taiwanese. Chinese are too dumb and incompetent.

Especially when these carbon "expertise" are layering prepreg sheets, and don't make carbon. They aren't experts in carbon, maybe they are experts in layering sheets in a mold. Japan has carbon experts, Toray, Mistubishi..

The fluid motion software and use of wind tunnels wasn't developed by the cycling industry. The understanding of fluid motion and aerodynamics wasn't developed by cycling industry either. Current cycling industry that brag about their R&D and engineering, that's a joke.

Big tubes and oversized BB make bikes stiffer. Wow, that's amazing. Tubes thinned in some areas to allow for some flex/compliance, shocking. Aero bikes using airfoils. My mind has been blown. I am stunned. They are truly experts of carbon and bicycle engineering.


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## Notvintage (May 19, 2013)

Jay Strongbow said:


> First of all......great. That's where the carbon expertise is.


With their aerospace background I'd say France is. Taiwan is IMO simply cheap labor making cookie cutter bikes for pennies on the dollar, hyped and then heavily marketed (see Pinarello).


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## Notvintage (May 19, 2013)

stevesbike said:


> Tom Boonen lost some races due to his Time frame auto-shifting under load.


Wow! You had strain gauge data showing that? LOL. . "Top end frames. ." translation. . Heavily marketed and sold for 10X cost to make, to suckers who buy the fake "made in Italy" sticker because painting and assembly. Like P.T Barnum said. . "There's a sucker born every minuet."


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

Notvintage said:


> With their aerospace background I'd say France is. Taiwan is IMO simply cheap labor making cookie cutter bikes for pennies on the dollar, hyped and then heavily marketed (see Pinarello).


Out of context much? I'm pretty sure the Assos Goomah is a bike frame but I suppose if the OP is looking for a Space Shuttle that's good to know.

Do you actually type this every time or did you set up an auto-reply so say cookie cutter blah blah everytime Asia or an Asian country is mentioned?

The terms coookie cutter is accurate though. Have you ever made cookies? I have and know that using a cutter is much more efficent and results in a more precise and consistant cookie. I don't see the point in paying extra for inefficiencies but if they are able to fit your wants and needs that's great.


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## Winn (Feb 15, 2013)

Notvintage said:


> P.T Barnum said. . "There's a sucker born every minuet."


I didn't know PT Barnum was into baroque dancing. So I guess now that minuets have diminished in popularity there are fewer suckers...


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

LOL yourself. If you followed the sport more closely, you would know that this was a major issue when Boonen raced on Time bikes. Here you go, a cyclingnews story from 2006: 

First Edition Cycling News for March 25, 2006
Stronger bike for Boonen

Tom Boonen is to ride the E3 Prijs with a sturdier frame, reports Sportwereld.be. The brute strength of the Quick.Step rider in the sprints has seen him have several mishaps with his gearing. Thus, Quick.Step'sme supplier Time is beefing things up for Tornado Tom, just in case.



Notvintage said:


> Wow! You had strain gauge data showing that? LOL. . "Top end frames. ." translation. . Heavily marketed and sold for 10X cost to make, to suckers who buy the fake "made in Italy" sticker because painting and assembly. Like P.T Barnum said. . "There's a sucker born every minuet."


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

Notvintage said:


> Like P.T Barnum said. . "There's a sucker born every minuet."


There's a sucker born every minute - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## berserk87 (Jul 24, 2014)

BigPoser said:


> So does anyone actually have any real world experience with this frame? Looking at possibly getting one and would love some real feedback.


Since no one else can seem to do it, I'll bite: I have no real world experience with this frame. Not the answer you were seeking, but an answer, nonetheless.

I think that the lack of direct answers over the past year would imply that none of us have any street-level knowledge of this rig.


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