# Pinarello dogma 65.1 geometry help



## Sisbud

Hi,

I would need help on getting the correct size for dogma 65.1
I am currently riding a supersix evo in the size 52, which have a top tube length of 53.5, seat tube angle of 74, head tube angle of 72.5, with a stack of 52.6.
The spacers are setup as 2.5 cm for the headset cap and 3 cm of spacers, which brings me to a total of 5.5 cm from the top of frame to the bottom of the stem.

The size that i am contemplating to get for the dogma 65.1 is size 51.5. This also have 53.5 cm top tube, but with 73.7 degree for seat tube angle and 72 degree for the headtube angle, with a stack of 52.7.

In a glance they look similar, but i am worried about whether i can get the same saddle to handlebar drop as my understanding is that the headset cap on the dogma is only 1.8 cm at best. With all the difference in the angles, even with 3 cm of spacers my position would be around 0.7 cm - 1 cm lower than on my supersix.

Could anyone help me and shine a light on whether my understanding is correct?

Thanks


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## Juzzy004

If you are contemplating spending $5K+ on a 65.1, why would you not undertake a professional fit first?? It's a no-brainer...


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## Sisbud

I already had my professional fit on the supersix, and i thought i would just like to transfer all those measurements onto my new frame


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## aureliajulia

Offhand I'd say those measurements are very close to my Quattro 51.5, but I agree with the fit. Why don't you bring this question to the person who did your fitting?


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## Cinelli 82220

Try one before you buy, don't go by charts. 
My first Dogma was too big, but lined up on paper. 

(Anyone want a 50cm Sky 60.1?)


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## aureliajulia

I think you should call around your city or state and find someone who can let you test-ride a variety of sizes. Spending that kind of $$ is worth the time and monetary expenditure. 

The only shop that carries Pinas anywhere near me is an hour away. They put me on a 50 that was already on the floor. I was a little leery of the place in general, and ended up driving 5 hours each way to a shop on the other side of the state. Went there twice. Once to be sized (ended up on a 51.5) so they could order the right bike for me. And once to pick up and fit. But I use an independent fitter/mechanic to take care of what I need here. And he also spent 2 hours adjusting fit. (In fact, I need to go back, even he is 80 miles from where I live). And my guy is also an engineer, and knows what he is doing.

I spent the night in a hotel both times, too. You can get good deals through places like Priceline.

This was a considerably better deal than buying the wrong sized bike. (Been there).


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## Sisbud

Good suggestion on asking my professional fitter. Will go and talk to him tomorrow.
As for test riding, cant do that in my area, as there are no lbs who stock pina for test rides around me.... That is the main reason why i cant do a test ride or even a professional fitting on a dogma.

On a dogma 2 i am pretty sure the 51.5 will fit me. It is just so annoying that pinarello come and change the head tube height on the 65.1....


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## Cinelli 82220

They only changed it by a few millimeters, a couple of spacers will make up any difference.


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## Spark

I am having the same issue with sizing choice. I have changed my original frame choice and decided to go with the Dogma 65.1. 

I appear to be right in the middle of a 565 & 575 top tube. I am 186cm tall with 89cm inseam and previously riding an SL3 56.5 with a 130cm stem (180cm headtube inc. 10mm spacer). I'm thinking the Dogma 565 HT= 165cm may be too larger drop from an 81cm saddle height? But the Dogma 575 HT= 179cm would be ok but may too long on the TT?

Opinions please? Anyone ride either of these sizes, if so what are your measurements and experience with Dogma sizing?

Thanks


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## Cinelli 82220

I think they shortened the seat tube length as well by a few mm. There's not as much above the top tube/seat tube junction. 
They come with plenty of spacers and a tall top cap though.


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## Juzzy004

If you're in between sizes with regard to the top tube, simply take that measurement into account when purchasing your stem.


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## Spark

Hi Juzzy

Thanks for your reply. I have read that Pinarello come up big so I was hoping some one with a similar frame could confirm if this is true. As I'm happy to run a 130 stem to achieve my fit.

The 59 frame (575) just seems like it would be too large but this may not be true with the Dogma frame.


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## Sisbud

Another thing to consider is the head tube length as well. Sometimes we dont consider saddle to handlebar drop


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## aureliajulia

Oops. Just pretend this is deleted.


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## Cinelli 82220

What threw me off was the hump in the top tube. Instead of a straight line it curves and is a bit higher than the top tube of a similar sized frame with a straight top tube. It will definitely affect your standover height.


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## Spark

I have now taken some measurements using my saddle height (SH=797mm) and the stack measurements listed by Pinarello and Specialized to achieve my drop for the 565TT Dogma 65.1 using a 120-130 stem at +6deg. 

Dogma (565 TT & 391 reach): Median saddle hight 794mm, less handlebar height (inc 20mm spacer) 679mm, Drop from the saddle the bars would be 115mm.

Dogma (575 TT & 397 reach): Median saddle hight 794mm, less handlebar height (inc 10mm spacer) 674mm, Drop from the saddle the bars would be 120mm.

If this is the correct method to measure the drop I would only be able to use a 100-110 stem on the larger of the two bikes and as stated the stand over is much larger on the bigger frame.
*my previous SL3 Tarmac had a drop of 129mm which felt too much when riding in the drops.


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## shearwater

I am 5'-9.5" (176.5cm) tall. 31" (78.74cm) inseam. My 65.1 is a 53 frame with 100mm stem.Ride all day and a great compact size for climbing


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## Spark

Hi Shearwater,

Thank you for your input. I have finally made my mind up over the two sizes. 

Dogma 560 (565 TT) and a 130 should be just right. Drop should be a more than managble 106mm.

I will post a picture when it's been built (early Febuary by the time everything's in place I expect). 

Happy New Year!


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## Donn12

what color combo did you pick? they have some gorgeous combinations available!


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## Spark

I decided to go for 852 Black/white.


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## h4nc0

Hey guys,

As I posted on another Dogma thread, I've placed an order for size 51.5. I am 5'8" with inseam of 32.3" Does this size sound alright for me? LBS recommended 515 but I am wondering if it could be a bit too small. 

Thanks!


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## Spark

What are your existing frame measurements:

BB-top of saddle
TT 
Reach
Stack
Stem length & angle


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## shearwater

51.5 sounds just on your limit. OK if you are a sprinter I guess


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## Sisbud

What is your preferred saddle to handlebar drop?
I ride a 51.5 with a saddle height of 69.5 and the drop is around 4.5 cm with 3 cm worth of spacers.
With your inseam length, i would guess you are going to have a saddle height of around 72.5 and therefore you would have a 7.5 cm drop.
If you think this is too aggressive then you should get a bigger size. If not, stick with 51.5


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## h4nc0

hi,

I am currently riding 54 Specialized Tarmac. I've talked to two different fitting people and both suggested 515 to me, so I will go with 515. Thanks all!


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## Spark

Tarmac 54 - reach: 387mm. Stack: 543mm. 

Dogma 65.1 515 - reach: 374mm. Stack: 520mm. 

Take these measurements into consideration if you are already using stackers and a positive stem.

If your Tarmac fits your well I would be looking at the Dogma 65.1 - 530 or if you are using stackers even the 545. Check that you are happy with the geometry before you make you final decision.

Hope this helps.


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## h4nc0

Spark said:


> Tarmac 54 - reach: 387mm. Stack: 543mm.
> 
> Dogma 65.1 515 - reach: 374mm. Stack: 520mm.
> 
> Take these measurements into consideration if you are already using stackers and a positive stem.
> 
> If your Tarmac fits your well I would be looking at the Dogma 65.1 - 530 or if you are using stackers even the 545. Check that you are happy with the geometry before you make you final decision.
> 
> Hope this helps.


It's strange. I thought 530 was better fit but both fitters, LBS, and even the Pinarello importer suggest 515 for me. @[email protected]


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## shearwater

Dogma sizes still seem to confuse people.As someone said earlier,if you are spending a few grand on a bike go and try it!!!
View attachment 275695


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## Spark

Tarmac 54 - reach: 387mm. Stack: 543mm. 

Dogma 65.1 545 - reach: 386mm. Stack: 542mm.

The 545 is pretty much spot on for you unless your Tarmac is too big if so then take the 530 the 515 seems too bigger gap?

Good luck with your choice.


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## LouisVuitton

For Pinarello Dogma sizing, the frames run larger than what you see listed. I.e, I normally ride a 58cm on a Specialized Tarmac or 58cm on a Cannondale, so the size that fits me is a 57.5cm on a Pinarello. 

If you ride a 52cm on a Supersix Evo, then the right size Pinarello for you is the 51.5


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## dr.baig

The frames are designed on traditional geometry. so IF you have ever rode an old steel frame you will find pinarello geometry very close to that. Considering most companies use sloping top tubes with contemporary geometry these days, Pinarellos run bigger in comparison. However if you compare them to old frames there isnt much difference. That is what i think anyway.

So if you have a recent frame (compact frame), yes! the pinarellos will run big because of the compact geometries top tubes are advertised as effective top tube (ett) length not actual top tube (att) length. Where as pinarello is actual top tube length. So in essence ett 565 does not equal att 565 because the ett will be shorter if you measured it length wise in comparison with att.

I hope this makes sense.


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