# No Basso at the Ardennes Classics?



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

Cycling4all.com is reporting that Basso will not be allowed to start in the Ardennes Classics as planned (both ASO races, I believe).

Looks like no Tour unless he turns over his DNA.


----------



## B2 (Mar 12, 2002)

I think he's pretty much done. Cycling News is reporting:
"Tuesday morning, _La Gazzetta dello Sport_ reported that there is interest from a _Procura italiana_ (Italian public prosecutor, likely Bergamo anti-doping lawyer Cristina Rota) to have the bags of blood labelled 'Birillo' (allegedly Basso's dog's name) and with the number 2 brought from Madrid to Italy. It states that this transfer, like what was done in Jan Ullrich's case, could happen sometime in the coming week, where the prosecutor could then ask for a DNA sample from Basso...."

When you consider this (also from Cycling News):
"...Further, the weekly magazine noted telephone recordings collected by the Guardia Civil, one that said 'Birillo had arrived with Simoni at sixteen seconds', This would seem to refer to Giro d'Italia stage seven, won by Rik Verbrugghe, where Basso finished 16 seconds back with Gilberto Simoni, Davide Rebellin and Serguei Gonchar."

Looks like his choices are 1) Provide DNA only to confirm it's his blood or 2) Refuse to provide DNA. Either way he won't be racing for a while.

Obviously, the conclusions drawn are my own based on circumstantial evidence. He may be innocent, but if I was a betting man, I would say it's his blood in the Brillo bags.


----------



## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

I suspect Basso will no longer be a pro cyclist in just a few days (weeks?). Following on from Ulrich's blood being confirmed, I can think of a few riders who are probably quite pleased they left the sport when they did...

So... when will the national cycling federations start putting in place robust longitudnal blood and other physiological profiles to ensure that the pro peleton is as honest as it can be?

Also, who now will ride for Disco at the Giro ... and do you even care anymore?


----------



## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

philippec said:


> I suspect Basso will no longer be a pro cyclist in just a few days (weeks?). Following on from Ulrich's blood being confirmed, I can think of a few riders who are probably quite pleased they left the sport when they did...
> 
> So... when will the national cycling federations start putting in place robust longitudnal blood and other physiological profiles to ensure that the pro peleton is as honest as it can be?
> 
> Also, who now will ride for Disco at the Giro ... and do you even care anymore?


Maybe Contador, but yea, I don't really care about Disco.

Giro without Basso...My money's on Cunego in that case.


----------



## sbindra (Oct 18, 2004)

I do not think Basso was prevented from starting the race. I believe that Basso and Discovery have decided that he will not start. The Italians have reopened the investigation but to date, there have been no charges brought against him. I believe that he would be free to continue to race until formally suspended or charged for some doping offense. Discovery and cycling governing bodies likely want to avoid the embarrasement of continuing to have him race if he is going to be expelled shortly.


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

I hope Cunego does well and I'm sure Simoni will still give it his all and end up on the podium, once again. I think DiLuca could be in the running this year too, Cannondale bikes seem to work well at the Giro, they carried both Simoni and Cunego to victory there.


----------



## zosocane (Aug 29, 2004)

I agree, Basso's season is finished. Discovery -- in the midst of searching for a new sponsor -- can't take the risk of starting him if CONI wants to re-open the investigation. For the Giro, maybe Janez?

It will be fun to see Cunego and Simoni duke it out again.


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

sbindra said:


> I believe that he would be free to continue to race until formally suspended or charged for some doping offense.


Yes by the UCI he would be free to race, as all of the OP riders have been free to do. However ASO, which I'm pretty sure promotes both of the Ardenne's Classics, as well as the Tour, has said no OP riders in their races. So while it may be technically true Disco pulled him from the race, it looks like they were headed for a confrontation because ASO wasn't going to let him start.


----------



## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

It'd be nice for Basso to do what he can to clear his name. I know he can't really rpove a negative, but he can go a long ways towards that end. Ah, well. We may need to stick a fork in him because he might be done. 

I think the Disco Giro falls to Danielson maybe? Who knows. But I'm pulling for Cunego to win with a slow TT duel between him and Simoni near the end.


----------



## Jim Nazium (Feb 3, 2004)

Dwayne Barry said:


> Yes by the UCI he would be free to race, as all of the OP riders have been free to do. However ASO, which I'm pretty sure promotes both of the Ardenne's Classics, as well as the Tour, has said no OP riders in their races. So while it may be technically true Disco pulled him from the race, it looks like they were headed for a confrontation because ASO wasn't going to let him start.


I think you're right. Even if DNA tests prove it's his blood in the bags, that only proves that he took some blood out, not that he put any back in, so technically he wouldn't have been found in violation of any anti-doping rules. However, it makes it pretty obvious to everyone what he was doing, so he may find himself without a pro cintract pretty soon.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Will the gates of TDF Disco team leader open for Levi ??? !!!


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

Pablo said:


> It'd be nice for Basso to do what he can to clear his name. I know he can't really rpove a negative, but he can go a long ways towards that end. Ah, well. We may need to stick a fork in him because he might be done.
> 
> I think the Disco Giro falls to Danielson maybe? Who knows. But I'm pulling for Cunego to win with a slow TT duel between him and Simoni near the end.


Cunego is getting much better in TT nowadays...


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

Jim Nazium said:


> I think you're right. Even if DNA tests prove it's his blood in the bags, that only proves that he took some blood out, not that he put any back in, so technically he wouldn't have been found in violation of any anti-doping rules. However, it makes it pretty obvious to everyone what he was doing, so he may find himself without a pro cintract pretty soon.


One would assume if he tried to continue racing, the Italian Cycling Federation would be forced to open a formal doping investigation against him, and find that he doped and suspend him for 2 years.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

NO Basso!!! Agghhhh.....it only means one thing.....no more Elisa


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*Bruyneel*

Monday morning he would not even mention Basso. He only re-iterated that Levi was the only leader that had been officially designated. He's going to keep his mouth shut....like he should.


----------



## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

dagger said:


> NO Basso!!! Agghhhh.....it only means one thing.....no more Elisa


 Now THAT is a tragedy! so, so sad.....


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

And its offical

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/apr07/apr24news3


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

dagger said:


> Monday morning he would not even mention Basso.


That seemed like an early bad sign. If this follows SOP. Basso will be thrown to the wolves while Bruyneel, etc. get to act sanctimonious and pretend they were clueless and really believed Basso was clean.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

32and3cross said:


> And its offical
> 
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/apr07/apr24news3


Looks like LEVI !!!!! I am not saying he can win TDF I just want an American to cheer for.Next year Floyd.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

dagger said:


> NO Basso!!! Agghhhh.....it only means one thing.....no more Elisa


Toyota United & Cycling.tv girls could help your loss :thumbsup:


----------



## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

Elisa was overrated and Cunego is underrated in time trials.


----------



## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

Wasn't it Scott Daubert who looked into Basso's eyes and saw that he was innocent?

LMAO.


----------



## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

Pablo said:


> Elisa was overrated and Cunego is underrated in time trials.


Right on.


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

Gibo must have a smile when he thinks back to the day he commented that Basso was not human or something after a mountain stage win in the Giro. Can this also mean that Basso could lose his Giro title? If his treatment started in 2004...


----------



## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

I think he said Basso was an "extraterrestrial," but not as in "he out of this world!" 

It might be hard to prove doping retroactively.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Dan Gerous said:


> Gibo must have a smile when he thinks back to the day he commented that Basso was not human or something after a mountain stage win in the Giro. Can this also mean that Basso could lose his Giro title? If his treatment started in 2004...


Gibo spoke of Basso "He is a Extra Terrestrial."


----------



## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

one day gatorade and sports drinks might be ban as well?? since gatorade and other sports drink are " not " natural water... as for TDF: it's two-man show, Valverde and Vino and may be Kloeden might sneak in if he doesn't crashed out. regardless sad day for team disco and us american cycling fans.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

z ken said:


> one day gatorade and sports drinks might be ban as well?? since gatorade and other sports drink are " not " natural water... as for TDF: it's two-man show, Valverde and Vino and may be Kloeden might sneak in if he doesn't crashed out. regardless sad day for team disco and us american cycling fans.


Happy Day for Levi fans.:thumbsup:


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*but..*



Dwayne Barry said:


> That seemed like an early bad sign. If this follows SOP. Basso will be thrown to the wolves while Bruyneel, etc. get to act sanctimonious and pretend they were clueless and really believed Basso was clean.


they can just say "Oh well....it was worth a try", by which I mean it was a low cost gamble...at least worth a shot....and it kept another team from signing him just in case he is/was clean.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*B S....fill in the blanks*



z ken said:


> sad day for team disco and us american cycling fans.


Sad??....that's just stupid(not you...just the stupid statement). Sad for the Italians. Disco still has one of the best teams. Ever heard of Contador, Leipheimer....et al. 

The only sadness for americans is Floyd....NOT Disco. Besides since when did Basso become an american?


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

dagger said:


> Sad??....that's just stupid(not you...just the stupid statement). Sad for the Italians. Disco still has one of the best teams. Ever heard of Contador, Leipheimer....et al.
> 
> The only sadness for americans is Floyd....NOT Disco. Besides since when did Basso become an american?


Considering Disco is in the midst of trying to sign and new sponsor it is sad because there is no way this is going to help them.


----------



## mquetel (Apr 2, 2006)

dagger said:


> Sad??....that's just stupid(not you...just the stupid statement). Sad for the Italians. Disco still has one of the best teams. Ever heard of Contador, Leipheimer....et al.
> 
> The only sadness for americans is Floyd....NOT Disco. Besides since when did Basso become an american?


Isn't Contador potentially in jeapordy with the whole Puerto affair also?


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

z ken said:


> as for TDF: it's two-man show, Valverde and Vino and may be Kloeden might sneak in if he doesn't crashed out. regardless sad day for team disco and us american cycling fans.


I think Kloeden will help Vino this year, he is a too nice guy and always plays down his chances and seem to be much less motivated than the 2007 Vino who is putting all his focus on winning the Tour and said it's this year or never. Kloeden as more time ahead of him. To me, Vino is the most likely winner of the Tour this year, more so than Valverde who said he is not focusing on the Tour... and may be implicated in Puerto still (he didn't exactly helped himself with his comments about it today)... Vino, helped by Kloeden, Kessler, Andrej Kashechkin is much more dangerous than Valverde and his team...


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*ohhhh yeah....*



mquetel said:


> Isn't Contador potentially in jeapordy with the whole Puerto affair also?


I forgot about that. also Allan Davis and Sergio Paulinho were among. But! I don't think all the implicated riders had blood that was seized and those will get by.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*Sponsor deal is done*



32and3cross said:


> Considering Disco is in the midst of trying to sing and new sponsor it is sad because there is no way this is going to help them.


Deal is already signed and they are waiting for the TDF to get the most publicity out of the announcement.(my speculation)

But....Disco is not going to be damaged at all by this. Basso wasn't on the team when he was allegedly doping and they acted prudently when the investigation was re-opened.


----------



## 32and3cross (Feb 28, 2005)

dagger said:


> Deal is already signed and they are waiting for the TDF to get the most publicity out of the announcement.(my speculation)
> 
> But....Disco is not going to be damaged at all by this. Basso wasn't on the team when he was allegedly doping and they acted prudently when the investigation was re-opened.


I would imgen your correct. 

I would also suspect that Disco had a clause in Basso contact that let them get out of paying him very much if he could not race so they got Basso off the market and prolly do not have pay much and they can disassociate themselfs from him.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Dont leave out Levi and Discovery Team. Vino is his worst enemy. He is strong but has not shown any smarts. I dont think he knows how to use the team properly. Levi needs to change game plan a little. Levi has the best climbing team, smartest TDF director and staff.Levi has a fighters look that I have never seen in him before.I think he wants to win and has many of the tools to do so.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Dan Gerous said:


> I think Kloeden will help Vino this year, he is a too nice guy and always plays down his chances and seem to be much less motivated than the 2007 Vino who is putting all his focus on winning the Tour and said it's this year or never. Kloeden as more time ahead of him. To me, Vino is the most likely winner of the Tour this year, more so than Valverde who said he is not focusing on the Tour... and may be implicated in Puerto still (he didn't exactly helped himself with his comments about it today)... Vino, helped by Kloeden, Kessler, Andrej Kashechkin is much more dangerous than Valverde and his team...


 I think Kloden deep down will fight Vino they still have that Euro T-Mobile macho inner team battle mentality.


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

Can Levi last 3 weeks? I'm not so sure.

Don't forget that Vino was on T-Mobile before, worst team ever for tactics. Astana seems better in that regard and they showed it well in last year's Vuelta with Vino and Kashechkin pounding the rest of the field. Should be an interesting Tour, even without Basso, Ullrich and Landis...


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

Vino is almost the team boss/owner, I think he will be the leader but they wont tell officially so others won't know who to control at first...


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*I agree*



sevencycle said:


> Levi has a fighters look that I have never seen in him before.I think he wants to win and has many of the tools to do so.


He is going to have the motivation of:
1. A team that knows how to win
2. Great riding talent backing him up
3. Directeur extraordinaire
4. Personal desire to make history
5. Realization that now is his best chance.
6. Confidence based on his performance so far.

But, Vino is in the same boat.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*I don't know you anymore*



Einstruzende said:


> Right on.


LOL....you've changed since Lance retired.


----------



## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

contador and levi are both NOT Ameican, atleast not born in america so shouldn't consider pure american, imo.


----------



## echo77 (Mar 12, 2007)

Are you sure? I believe Levi was born in Montana.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

z ken said:


> contador and levi are both NOT Ameican, atleast not born in america so shouldn't consider pure american, imo.


What???? Levi is as American as apple pie... you commie


----------



## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

Levi's from Utah, you punks.

 

If Valverde rides this Tour, it'll be a joke.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

z ken said:


> contador and levi are both NOT Ameican, atleast not born in america so shouldn't consider pure american, imo.


and the Tour de France is in Asia.


----------



## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

philippec said:


> when will the national cycling federations start putting in place robust longitudnal blood and other physiological profiles to ensure that the pro peleton is as honest as it can be?
> 
> ... and do you even care anymore?


Once again, the ASO has shown that it is the real power behind cycling. If the big three stick together and demand it, the UCI and National Federations will tow the line. The UCI want's a clean sport but without standing on any (important) toes and the National Federations want to get ahead with fingers crossed there aren't any negative headlines down the line. Neither approach will work.

Whoever wins the Giro will be a "revelation" Like some 90kg bull climbing with the best on "guts and determination" or some 50kg climber taking the TT because he has the "Maglia Rosa" on his sholders.

Unfortunately I'm not sure if I do care anymore.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*Yup*



FondriestFan said:


> Levi's from Utah, you punks.
> 
> 
> 
> If Valverde rides this Tour, it'll be a joke.


The name Leipheimer throws them off. Yes in America(US) you can have a weird last name and still be an American.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

FondriestFan said:


> Levi's from Utah, you punks.
> 
> 
> 
> If Valverde rides this Tour, it'll be a joke.


 What do you mean with Valverde statement. If you think he will dominate thats a joke.


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

sevencycle said:


> What do you mean with Valverde statement. If you think he will dominate thats a joke.


Valverde basically didn't say he didn't dope, he said he didn't get caught doping.

I still think Vino will give Valverde, or anyone else, a good run for their money and end up beating them...


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Dan Gerous said:


> Valverde basically didn't say he didn't dope, he said he didn't get caught doping.
> 
> I still think Vino will give Valverde, or anyone else, a good run for their money and end up beating them...


Valverde is awsome. He is not a TDF winner as I see it. Like Vino he does not have a TDF winning team either.


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*Really?*



sevencycle said:


> Like Vino he does not have a TDF winning team either.


Because:
Vinokourov
Kloden
Savoldelli
Kessler
Joachim 
Kashechkin

Are serious riders don't you think?


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

Astana, if they work as a team, will be the most dangerous team in the tour. And if someone can attack, it's Vino!


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

dagger said:


> Because:
> Vinokourov
> Kloden
> Savoldelli
> ...


How many TDF team wins do each of these riders have.(1 for El Falco kinda). Vino/Kloden together made it much easier for Lance to win.A strong bunch of riders doesnt win the Tour.It takes alot more than that.


----------



## Dan Gerous (Mar 28, 2005)

sevencycle said:


> How many TDF team wins do each of these riders have.(1 for El Falco kinda). Vino/Kloden together made it much easier for Lance to win.A strong bunch of riders doesnt win the Tour.It takes alot more than that.


Yes but they are not directed by the clowns at T-Mobile anymore. Look at how they worked at the Vuelta last year... Vino won and Kashechkin finished 3rd if I recall. Of course the Tour and the Vuelta are different but still, first GT for the team and they manage to win and get 3rd...


----------



## dagger (Jul 22, 2004)

*And*



Dan Gerous said:


> Yes but they are not directed by the clowns at T-Mobile anymore. Look at how they worked at the Vuelta last year... Vino won and Kashechkin finished 3rd if I recall. Of course the Tour and the Vuelta are different but still.


I am sure that Vino is running a tight ship and that he made it quite clear that he wants to win the TDF when each rider signed their contract with him.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

Dan Gerous said:


> Yes but they are not directed by the clowns at T-Mobile anymore. Look at how they worked at the Vuelta last year... Vino won and Kashechkin finished 3rd if I recall. Of course the Tour and the Vuelta are different but still, first GT for the team and they manage to win and get 3rd...


"T-Mobile Clowns"...I totally agree. The "Clowns" screwed Ullrich's chances to ever beat Armstrong. Vino is gifted and is one of my favorite riders but I still think he is a old school racer. If Disco had Vino...end of story Vino would win.


----------



## sevencycle (Apr 23, 2006)

dagger said:


> I am sure that Vino is running a tight ship and that he made it quite clear that he wants to win the TDF when each rider signed their contract with him.


Sure but does he know how to do it. I guess time will tell.A lot more variables without LA in the picture.


----------

