# Purchased BWW Blackset Race 11



## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Just pulled the trigger on a pair of BWW's Blackset Race 11's. <1500 grams!

Take care of em' Pat! My old wheelset is now trainer bound.

Let the review begin in 3 to 5 days. 










UPDATE : OWNERSHIP DAY 1

Packaging - Great.
Communication - Great.
Trueness/tension sound test - Seemingly Perfect
Mounting of tires was no problem, no levers needed.
Hub pawl is quieter than my older (2000) 105 hub pawl, and that thing was QUIET. Don't know what everyone is complaining about atm but it is quiet as of now.
Stickers came off easy.
Free bottle.

Of course, it's pouring rain for the next three days, so I'll be pinkin' it up until I can get out on these.

Did not weigh anything as I do not have a scale, but I'm coming from older CXP21 32h on 105 hubs and the difference is noticeable. I've seen other owners weight their wheels and BWW's statements are very accurate.

I will update this as I put the miles on them.

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## ChuckDiesel (Apr 16, 2011)

Anxious to hear your thoughts. I'm in the market for a new set to replace my 2200g CXP22s. These are a good light but still affordable option. I've heard good things about their mountain bike wheels but I've never read any reviews about the road wheels. Keep us posted.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

ChuckDiesel said:


> I've never read any reviews about the road wheels.


There are some here on this forum and on their own forum plus 8 reviews on their website's Blackset Race page.


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## phoehn9111 (May 11, 2005)

Have had them for two years, very satisfied, just got a new set for my A bike with the podium
build. To me, the 28\24, value oriented, reliable and still relatively lightweight wheelset is 
optimal for someone like me who isn't particularly interested in the intracacies of building
custom stuff and just wants to ride the bike.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

I ordered mine last week and hopefully they have been shipped. Can't wait.


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## twin001 (Jul 24, 2011)

I've had a set for about 2000 miles. Very light and strong. My only problem is that the spokes don't want to stay tight. I have to true them about every 3 or 4 rides. They are now my backup / trainer set.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

twin001 said:


> IMy only problem is that the spokes don't want to stay tight. I have to true them about every 3 or 4 rides.


What do you weigh and what condition are the roads you use? My BWW BSR have never been touched and they're starting their third year.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

twin001 said:


> I've had a set for about 2000 miles. Very light and strong. My only problem is that the spokes don't want to stay tight. I have to true them about every 3 or 4 rides. They are now my backup / trainer set.


Hmmm, I don't like the sound of that.


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## twin001 (Jul 24, 2011)

I weight 170lbs, roads are average (some smooth, some rough). It's mainly the rear wheel that needs to be true. A few of the spokes just don't want to stay tight. I've been thinking about using some light-duty loctite on them.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

twin001 said:


> I weight 170lbs, roads are average (some smooth, some rough). It's mainly the rear wheel that needs to be true. A few of the spokes just don't want to stay tight. I've been thinking about using some light-duty loctite on them.


You're my weight and your roads are similar. My wheels, as I said before, remain true and untouched. If I may make two suggestions -

1. Check very closely and carefully for cracks around the rim spoke holes.
2. Have the wheel de-tensioned, re-tensioned, trued and the ultimate in stress relief and tension equalization applied by someone who is a true expert on this (all the info is on my site). Repeated truing might have the tensions all out of whack. Thread locker is not a cure but a crutch for a wheel that really needs some expert TLC. 

There is nothing inherently wrong with Blackset Race to cause this to happen. It could be a poor build from the get-go (rare for BWW) or it could be because of ongoing truings.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Hey don't hijack my thread yah moreons!



I need my new wheelset like yesterday, the trainer is driving me nuts. Can't eat. Can't sleep.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

iheartbenben said:


> Hey don't hijack my thread yah moreons!
> I need my new wheelset like yesterday, the trainer is driving me nuts. Can't eat. Can't sleep.


If you don't get off our arses we'll start posting pics of our BSR wheels. That'll fix ya. BTW - do you keep peering thru the curtains every 5 minutes yet? You will.


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## twin001 (Jul 24, 2011)

Mike T. said:


> You're my weight and your roads are similar. My wheels, as I said before, remain true and untouched. If I may make two suggestions -
> 
> 1. Check very closely and carefully for cracks around the rim spoke holes.
> 2. Have the wheel de-tensioned, re-tensioned, trued and the ultimate in stress relief and tension equalization applied by someone who is a true expert on this (all the info is on my site). Repeated truing might have the tensions all out of whack. Thread locker is not a cure but a crutch for a wheel that really needs some expert TLC.
> ...


Sorry for the thread hijack! 

Mike, 
thanks for the response. The tensions may be all out of whack. The BWW wheelset has been excellent so far. Very light, spin great, and they look amazing! 

I did notice this happened immediately after I was crashed into at a crit race. The wheel was sent to my LBS to be trued, since then I noticed the spokes would get loose. Maybe that is the issue there. 

To the OP, you will be happy with your purchase!


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

twin001 said:


> Sorry for the thread hijack!


Aww he'll be ok once he gets his wheels. He's just feeling jealous. 



> thanks for the response. The tensions may be all out of whack........I did notice this happened immediately after I was crashed into at a crit race. The wheel was sent to my LBS to be trued, since then I noticed the spokes would get loose. Maybe that is the issue there.


Ahh haaaa! If the rim was bent, even just a little bit, and the spoke tension was used to pull it back into true then spoke tensions will be way out of whack. This will then lead to the possibility of nipples unscrewing and/or spoke breakage due to fatigue in due course.

Here's the test - do the pluck/ping thing as outlined on my page. Only compare spokes on the same side of the (rear) wheel. The tones should be quite even. If you can get a fair rendition of the intro to "Stairway" out of them then spoke tension has been used to pull it straight. Bent rim = junk.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Mike T. said:


> If you don't get off our arses we'll start posting pics of our BSR wheels


Me.
Asses.


NEVAR.

Is it Friday yet?


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

_'I did notice this happened immediately after I was crashed into at a crit race. The wheel was sent to my LBS to be trued, since then I noticed the spokes would get loose. Maybe that is the issue there"

Perhaps this might have been mentioned in the beginning._


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

FreeRojo said:


> Perhaps this might have been mentioned in the beginning.


Errr......yeah. Taken as it was first stated anyone would think that the insinuation was faulty product from the seller. Then we get to hear what is the real probable cause. But those comments stay on the internet forever - doing their damage.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

I can't take it. Start posting shots of your wheels.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

iheartbenben said:


> I can't take it. Start posting shots of your wheels.


I'd be afraid that you'd get too excited if you saw the whole thing so here's just a little bit. I hope someone's holding you down -


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## gregnash (Jun 30, 2011)

LOL...

Mike T - do you think those would hold up to 190# guy beating on them on nasty hill climbs for road and cyclocross in the N NV high desert?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

gregnash said:


> LOL...
> Mike T - do you think those would hold up to 190# guy beating on them on nasty hill climbs for road and cyclocross in the N NV high desert?


Hmmm, maybe but why risk it for a few grams? Look at their slightly heavier rim, listed for "220lbs or less" and about 30g more per rim -

Road - Riders 220 or less - Pure Race SuperLight 700c - Bicycle Wheel Warehouse


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## gregnash (Jun 30, 2011)

yeah is kinda what I was thinking.. I am still debating on whether I want to spend the money on "parts" and tools to build my own set or just pay for a set. Budget will be pretty low (like $300-$400 max) so most of the BWW offerings will fit in there well but then I could build myself a set of Kinlin/BHS/Sapim wheels for a little less than $300 but just with my own time involved.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

gregnash said:


> yeah is kinda what I was thinking.. I am still debating on whether I want to spend the money on "parts" and tools to build my own set or just pay for a set. Budget will be pretty low (like $300-$400 max) so most of the BWW offerings will fit in there well but then I could build myself a set of Kinlin/BHS/Sapim wheels for a little less than $300 but just with my own time involved.


Yep Brandon's BHS Kinlin 270 rim would be very similar to the BWW Superlight 27mm rim. It's a toss up of whether you want to, or can do it yourself.


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## gregnash (Jun 30, 2011)

Ok so here is a question for you guys that are getting new wheels (sorry for the thread hijack). I live in northern NV in an area that has LOTS of wind this time of year (well most of the year). Most of my commutes home have 15-20mph+ winds and they make it not so fun to ride in. Will I be better off with a more "aero" rim (i.e. something 23mm or deeper) vs the 21x19 rim I currently run (Alex AT450) or would I experience more "turbulence".


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

The deeper a rim is, the more susceptible it will be to crosswinds.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Mike T. said:


> I'd be afraid that you'd get too excited if you saw the whole thing so here's just a little bit. I hope someone's holding you down -


Your deck's wood is in need of treatment, sir.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

iheartbenben said:


> Your deck's wood is in need of treatment, sir.


That there is genuine white cedar and I just lets it weather.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

gregnash said:


> Ok so here is a question for you guys that are getting new wheels (sorry for the thread hijack). I live in northern NV in an area that has LOTS of wind this time of year (well most of the year). Most of my commutes home have 15-20mph+ winds and they make it not so fun to ride in. Will I be better off with a more "aero" rim (i.e. something 23mm or deeper) vs the 21x19 rim I currently run (Alex AT450) or would I experience more "turbulence".


I would post this in general or training.

For what it's worth, I live in S Texas with constant coast winds from 10-25mph any given day, and I chose the Blackset 11's rim over a deeper profile.

However even the pure tour wheel isn't _that_ deep.


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## littlewing6283 (Sep 15, 2009)

Max depth I would ride in windy conditions. My 60mm rims can be downright frightening when the crosswinds are gusting


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## gregnash (Jun 30, 2011)

Mike T. said:


> The deeper a rim is, the more susceptible it will be to crosswinds.


LOL... and I am riding 19mmx21mm, I would be blown over with anything deeper!


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Pat no e-mail back today. No tracky shippy # I sad.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

iheartbenben said:


> Pat no e-mail back today. No tracky shippy # I sad.


Well the good thing is that you then know it's no good wasting time peering thru the curtains for the brown santa then.  Every dark cloud has a silver lining.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Mike T. said:


> Well the good thing is that you then know it's no good wasting time peering thru the curtains for the *brown santa* then.  Every dark cloud has a silver lining.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

iheartbenben said:


>


The frikkin brown santa wears brown pants & shirt; it ain't the color of his skin. But then you already knew that.


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## gitter18 (May 28, 2011)

I purchased a set of Blackset Race 11 in the Race build in late February and I could not be happier. They are as advertised, 1486 grams with rim strips. They were packaged very well and true from the box. I was tempted to upgrade to Podium series but Pat advised against it... that speaks volumes in my opinion. I had my wheels in 2 weeks from the time I ordered them; so far after 200 miles no issues. Finally, the tires Michelin Pro 3 Race mounted very easily... From my standpoint order with confidence from BWW!!


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

Ordered on March 13, completed on March 19 and still waiting eagerly and patiently on March 28.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

Does anyone know who ships their wheels?


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

FreeRojo said:


> Ordered on March 13, completed on March 19 and still waiting eagerly and patiently on March 28.


Pat called, issue with UPS scan, they are on the way already. My wheels that is.
:thumbsup::thumbsup:


I am really too excited over my schwag.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

They just ARRIVED!


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## gregnash (Jun 30, 2011)

Sweet post some pics and weights if you can prior to mounting.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

FreeRojo said:


> They just ARRIVED!


NO FAIR. Moar pics.

Mine are slated for Monday. : (


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

The UPS guy pulls up right to my studio door and starts laughing as he hands me 2 oversize boxes, "Is there anything in them?". The Conti 4000 23's went on them real easy (well, easier) than when I put them on the old wheel set originally, but they still came off the old set kinda hard too. I tape and put the front tire together and stick it on the front and spin it, looks fine so I turned around to work on the rear wheel for a few minutes. I reached behind me for a rag and to my amazement, the wheel was still spinning  So I am cleaning the cogs. Can't wait to try them out.


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

Why are there no pics?


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## Racersir (Jan 13, 2012)

post some pics


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Baulderdash!


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## D0rk (Jan 4, 2012)

Another cry for pictures. I'm tossing a coin between these and some November FSW's.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

iheartbenben said:


> Just pulled the trigger on a pair of BWW's Blackset Race 11's. <1500 grams!
> 
> Take care of em' Pat! My old wheelset is now trainer bound.
> 
> ...


Bump.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

Day 3 : In love with my wheels. They have 70 miles on them now. They roll amazingly, everything so quiet, not one ping at all. Light? Yeah, I could tell I lost weight in the wheels on the climbs. They do spin up a little faster than my old CXP21's.

Very happy with them.

Will update in a month or two and see how they are doing.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

Wheels feel great!

BWWPat-Did you get my private message?


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## scryan (Jan 24, 2011)

So I just bought a set of these!

Well... a week ago. Order is still sitting at Processing.
Are these wheels built once you order? I must say their status updates don't offer much info as it basically goes from "Maybe we received your payment, maybe not..." to "Shipped"

Not too worried yet, just want my new toy  Curious what typical was/what to expect.


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## FreeRojo (Apr 21, 2008)

scryan said:


> So I just bought a set of these!
> 
> Well... a week ago. Order is still sitting at Processing.
> Are these wheels built once you order? I must say their status updates don't offer much info as it basically goes from "Maybe we received your payment, maybe not..." to "Shipped"
> ...


They are legit and you'll get them fairly shortly. The waiting is hard.


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## D0rk (Jan 4, 2012)

scryan said:


> So I just bought a set of these!
> 
> Well... a week ago. Order is still sitting at Processing.
> Are these wheels built once you order? I must say their status updates don't offer much info as it basically goes from "Maybe we received your payment, maybe not..." to "Shipped"
> ...


Information and communications from them when I bought an MTB wheelset from them a few months ago was minimal. You have nothing to fear though.


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## BWWpat (Dec 17, 2009)

If you private message me here with the email you registered with I can find out what stage they are on, Im building quite a few sets and I cant tell which one is yours.

Sorry if I am a little slow with communication, I am just extremely swamped.


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## scryan (Jan 24, 2011)

FreeRojo said:


> They are legit and you'll get them fairly shortly. The waiting is hard.


lol. I know they are legit  Seen enough good reviews that I am not too worried... just curious. Haven't even tried contacting them yet... I just knew this thread was here so I figured I'd let them work and check in here.




BWWpat said:


> If you private message me here with the email you registered with I can find out what stage they are on, Im building quite a few sets and I cant tell which one is yours.
> 
> Sorry if I am a little slow with communication, I am just extremely swamped.


No worries. Like I said I haven't sent an email or anything... Was just curious how long orders usually take, figured there would be at least some wait with them being built... I'll shoot you a PM right now though, thanks.
Definitely can say your too slow with communications if you got back to me BEFORE I even tried to reach you


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## HEMIjer (Oct 18, 2008)

I ordered Pure Superlights couple days ago figured i could be patient reading this thread is making me impatient though. One question though for Pat or someone with experience on his whesls. Will i have to get these retensioned though after a couple rides?

I ask because my last set of custom built wheels (for 29er MTB ended up going back ot the builders for rebuild wasnt BWW).


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## vettracer (Jan 12, 2011)

HEMIjer said:


> I ordered Pure Superlights couple days ago figured i could be patient reading this thread is making me impatient though. One question though for Pat or someone with experience on his whesls. Will i have to get these retensioned though after a couple rides?
> 
> I ask because my last set of custom built wheels (for 29er MTB ended up going back ot the builders for rebuild wasnt BWW).


They should be fine. I have over 2K on my BWW wheels, have not touched them and they are still perfectly true.


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## iheartbenben (Mar 18, 2011)

200-300 mile update. (200ish road miles, 100ish on the trainer)

Number of unknown objects forcibly hit? 1 per 20 miles.

Number of times almost sent over bars due to improved braking? Twice.

Top Speed? 62mph.

Top Speed hitting 4 inch gap at bottom of bridge descent? 62mph. :thumbsup:

I hit what I still think was a rail road tie on it's side Tuesday. Wheels are true and round still, not one ping has been heard. Couldn't be happier.


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## Vitamin G (Aug 3, 2007)

I've had a set on my Lynskey Cooper for 700 miles or so now. Had to true the front wheel once after hitting a manhole cover, but otherwise they have been worry free. I did have some rubbing on the brakes while standing climbing once, but after adjusting the pads that has gone away. I am 140 lbs and generally a smooth rider. 

I took half of the stickers off because I think they look better that way. Left each wheel with just one sticker per side.

For the money I am happy and would buy them again. Much lighter and roll better than the Shimano entry level wheels that came on the bike. Not the stiffest wheelset, but it could be the Easton EC70 fork that makes the front seem a little vague rather than the wheel.


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## Dropped (Jan 22, 2003)

Bought a set of Pure/Open Pros from BWW a few weeks ago. Loved them so much I just bought a set for my wife. Only have a few rides on them but they arrived perfectly true and remain so.


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## Madone58 (Jul 2, 2012)

Thread revival. For those of you using these...how do you like them? I'm thinking about getting a set.


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## Vitamin G (Aug 3, 2007)

Madone58 said:


> Thread revival. For those of you using these...how do you like them? I'm thinking about getting a set.


I'm less enamored with the wheels now than I was back in May... I have a feeling that I would prefer a stiffer wheelset, but I am not sure until I have the opportunity to try something out. This is for descending only. 

For climbing and riding on the flats, I really like them, but what goes up must come down. I would look also at the Ultegra wheelset, there have been specials on that wheelset lately, although it is 100+ grams heavier if that makes a difference.


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## Andy STi (Sep 13, 2009)

My rear wheel is being loosened and retensioned right now at the LBS. The wheel kept coming out of true from a couple of spokes loosening up. Instead of trying to true it all the time I decided to have the whole thing lossened and brought back up to tension. Having my shop do it is cheaper than sending the wheel back for possible warranty work. Nice wheels overall but you may still have some issues withi them.


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## HEMIjer (Oct 18, 2008)

My Pure Superlights have been great, lighter and stiffer than older shimano wheels been through 2 centuries and they seem to be good all around and climbing wheels.

Note they did creak (or maybe ping were noisy) for the first 100+ miles but theat stopped eventauly and they are in good shape still, no need to true or retension.


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