# Problems With Six13?



## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

Hi,

I was planning to get a Six13 5 (or 3) but a friend of mine tried to dissuade me. He told me about problems with the connection between the aluminum and carbon connections getting loose.

Upon my friend's suggestion, I tried the Scott CR1. I also got to try a Cervelo Soloist Team. I actually liked the Cervelo more. But now I'm still wondering if I should still stick to the six13, as I've tested it 3 times (albeit on just rides around the block or a small park) and it felt the most natural of the bikes I've tried. (The Cervelo's comes in second place.)

The bike shop sales guy seemed to be biased to the Cervelo. He said he raced on six13's but he told me the same problem that happens around the alu-carbon point of connection...


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## Hokiesean24 (Jun 21, 2008)

Mine is brand new, with only 15 miles or so on it, so I hope this isnt true. I haven't heard anything about it before. So far, I love mine!!!!

Although, I did just realize that my Six13 5 calls for Shimano wheels, I am 99% sure I have Mavics though. I will have to determine which ones, I hope its an upgrade!!! Being a newb, I would have NO idea!


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

Hokiesean24 said:


> Although, I did just realize that my Six13 5 calls for Shimano wheels, I am 99% sure I have Mavics though. I will have to determine which ones, I hope its an upgrade!!! Being a newb, I would have NO idea!


I've heard that the Mavics (Aksiums, right?) are roughly equivalent to the Shimanos. Actually, the Aksiums are spec'd on the higher model, so maybe you're in better shape. But I've only read forums and reviews and I'm a newbie like you...


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## Hokiesean24 (Jun 21, 2008)

Haha, thanks! I looked at the same, I see the Mavics are on the Six13 3 and Six13 1. Aksiums and Kyriums (sp?). I will have to look and see which ones I got...


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## stwok (Mar 15, 2007)

mhcarlos said:


> Hi,
> 
> I was planning to get a Six13 5 (or 3) but a friend of mine tried to dissuade me. He told me about problems with the connection between the aluminum and carbon connections getting loose.


That was a problem with the 2005 model with 3 tubes of carbon. Do a search, there were enough threads about it!


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

stwok said:


> That was a problem with the 2005 model with 3 tubes of carbon. Do a search, there were enough threads about it!


I've been looking into it. But what about the 2007 and 2008 models? Maybe it's too early to tell for 2008 though. Thanks!


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## LeDomestique (Jan 17, 2007)

Six 13s sold like hot cakes for the past few years. If there were real problems (not the odd one) you'd read about it everywhere.


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

The frame carry a lifetime warrenty beside Cannondale would upgrade you to Super Six if they are phasing out Six13 next year.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

I see. Good points. Thanks!


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## jimbonnet (May 9, 2005)

Ive got ~6000 miles on a 2006 six13 that I got in November last year. Its running fine for me.


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## onebaduce (May 23, 2008)

I've got 400 miles+ and counting on my 5 week old 08 six13 6 (patriot blue the faster color) I'm a big guy and have been pounding the shite out of it and it loves it. The frame is great.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

Great. Thanks guys!


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## zosocane (Aug 29, 2004)

I have 15,000 miles on my Six13 with a couple of crashes mixed in. The Six13 frame is doing perfectly well.


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## Hokiesean24 (Jun 21, 2008)

Just to update: My Six13 5 was ordered last Monday, came in on Wednesday and we assembled it on Thursday. I just went and verified, it did come with Mavic Aksium Race wheels vs the Shimano WH-RS-10 wheels that were specified on the bike. I have no idea as to whether or not they are any better, but the are the specified wheels on the Six 13 3.


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

Wow that was fast Cannondale must have plenty in stock.


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## gibson00 (Aug 7, 2006)

I've owned two 2006 Six13 frames, put a few thousand km's on each, no problems whatsoever. They are really great frames that were Cdale's top of the line just a couple of years ago. And their weight is pretty damn close to their current top frames.


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## velomonkey (Jul 8, 2003)

I have the 2006 six 13 and I just got a 2008 System Six and might be selling the System Six as I like the ride of the six 13 better. I put about 5k miles per year on this bike and it has been nothing but stellar. If something does happen to the frame, and I doubt it will, CDale has some of the best warranty in the industry. I plan on using this bike for another five years or so and riding all winter long. If something happens, new bike, if not, then the overall price on the bike is very low.

you will be nothing but happy with this frame. BTW, I am 6'3" and 190 pounds, so I put some stress on these things and CDales just hold up. I had a trek on year and could flex that thing any direction I wanted to.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

gibson00, velomonkey -- thanks for the feedback! I think I'll take another six13 for a spin again. 

I kinda wish I can test ride all three bikes on my short list (CR1, Soloist Team and six13) in one bikeshop.


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## gibson00 (Aug 7, 2006)

mhcarlos said:


> gibson00, velomonkey -- thanks for the feedback! I think I'll take another six13 for a spin again.
> 
> I kinda wish I can test ride all three bikes on my short list (CR1, Soloist Team and six13) in one bikeshop.


I can't speak to the CR1, but I personally wouldn't choose the Soloist team (we're talking the aluminum frame, yes?). The ones I've seen are rattly, not super light, and kind of plain looking paint. Plus the geometry doesn't work for everyone, whereas Cdale and Scott have a more standard geometry.


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

Can you provide in details in which way Six13 is better than System Six ? Thx


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## greg44 (Feb 15, 2008)

I've got a six13 with 2500 miles on it and it is just like new. It replaced a Scott speedster which was aluminum with carbon seat stays and a cr1 fork. The geometry of the speedster is the same as the cr1. I can tell you getting off the six 13 and getting back on the scott, you can tell night and day difference in the riding position. The Six13 is much more aggressive and handles better. The Scott is more laid back and feels more like a touring bike. I vote for the six13...I love mine. She's taken me through 2 centurys and 1 road race. Also hang some light wheels on her and put a good compact crank on and she is a billy goat in the mountains.


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

Please remembered that Cannondale founder is now with Scott, no wonder some of the design is very similar to Cannondale.


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## velomonkey (Jul 8, 2003)

zamboni said:


> Can you provide in details in which way Six13 is better than System Six ? Thx


Well, I am not saying the six 13 is better or worse than the system six. However, here is why I am keeping my six 13 over my system six

1. BB30 is the future, no doubt, the carbon cranks are crap, though and aftermarket C'Dal cranks are way too much money. I'll stick with my Dura Ace cranks and unless I am wrong I can not find any 177.5 BB30 cranks

2. The forks are a wash. I got back to watching LeMond et al descend in the rain and corner at over 30mph on steel bikes with 1' headtubes and quill stems. Do we really need the fork to be that stiff? The thing is visually unappealing.

3. I liked the 2cm slope of the six 13, the system six geometry isn't like that and truth be told I am not sure why. There is hardly any slope, perhaps 1cm. 

As my six 13 is a 2006 and my system six is a 2008 I will keep the six 13 since I can get more for the system six. Not sure how much better, though, as I am having some issues getting this one sold. I really do like the system six, stiff as anything and a very refined ride. The six 13 came in great colors, rides great and is an all around great frame.


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## mylesofsmyles (Mar 20, 2007)

Separating at the co-molded joint between the aluminum and carbon fiber...I don't think so! The Six13 has been in production for a while now, and as far as I've heard, there have been no problems of the sort. I know Cannondale to be reliable brand, with high quality standards and not to continue production on a frame that is known to fail.

Having spent a significant amount of time at a reputable Cannondale dealer, I can say I have never heard of this happening. The Six13 is an amazing bike and I would hope you don't dismiss it due to your friend's theory. Co-molding is a process that has been reliably used for over a decade...I think Trek was doing it in the 80's, maybe 90's. There is nothing questionable or quirky about the Six13. Was your friend's comment supported by actual facts and news of this happening or is this a theory born from ignorance?

Another interesting bit of information...for 2008, Cannondale refreshed the Six13 design ever so slightly. Check one out, compared to the earlier ones...the top tube and down tube are a little different...the frame is torsionally stiffer. I would imagine Cannondale would have invested significant money to refresh the Six13 project, only if they trusted their ability to co-mold aluminum and carbon.

You said it yourself, the Cannondale Six13 felt best of the bikes you rode...go with your instincts on this one. Besides, its got a lifetime warranty!


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

FSA will release their BB30 crank sets soon then you can upgrade without paying much for Cannondale Si alum crank.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

Hey guys, since there are rumors that the six13 line will be discontinued for 2009, is that a good thing or a bad thing in terms of buying the 2008 model?


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## mylesofsmyles (Mar 20, 2007)

mhcarlos said:


> Hey guys, since there are rumors that the six13 line will be discontinued for 2009, is that a good thing or a bad thing in terms of buying the 2008 model?


I'd say a great thing...it is going to be way stiffer and faster than the 2009; I guess the 2009 one is lighter though!


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## onebaduce (May 23, 2008)

??? why would it be a bad thing? Lifetime frame warranty still applies. if you test rode it and like it go for it. couldn;t be happier with mine. that's a rumor anyway so who knows


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## kneejerk (Feb 2, 2007)

I have heard a lot of rummors about Aluminum and Carbon bonding problems. I have seen what looks like corrosion develop on joints of these materials. If they can make glues to keep the Space Shuttle together I think there shouldn't be any problem with a properly assembled Cannondale frame. Plus, don't they have a lifetime defect warranty!?


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

For the value which is a great deal when this frame introduced back in 05 MSRP was over $2K, and 09 model has not been release yet.


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## Canecreekfreak (Jul 7, 2005)

I've got 1800 miles on my 2008 Six13, no problems yet. It's a fantastic bike.


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## LigonierA1 (Aug 12, 2005)

The issue with a carbon/aluminum bond is galvanic corrosion. It IS a very real issue though bicycles are well precidented by Bell and Sikorsky and it's such a common occurence in the velo world anymore-easy to surmize that this problem has been "cyphered". 

Additionally, no company does more testing to improve product than Cannondale. The recent generation Six13s are *fantastic* frames. I've got 1000 miles on a Six13 that cost me nothing so I'm not invested in thinking it's a great ride. It is however, a great ride........


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## funhog1 (Jan 26, 2003)

If you can get your hands on a Six 13 I'd say go for it. But know that bicycles are like ice creams....everyone has their "own" favorite flavor. 

(right now mine is the Sys 6 if it was lighter..the nude/raw finish reminds me of a Bugatti Veyron Pur Sang)

My personal bias for the Six 13 is that it (perhaps along with the Sys Six) is perhaps the last remnant of the Montgomery/BikeQ companies product management and design philosophy. 

On occasion I've wondered if the "new" carb/alu and carb "Six" for '09 resulted from the following conversation with a Pegasus/Dorel Corporation bean counter:

"Uh...hey how can we make the six 13 more profitible?"

"Uh I know, we'll take the Chinese made rear triangles from the super six, weld together an Optimo-esque front alu triangle take a synapse-esque front carbon triangle..and then glue them together all in China...

"Uh...m k, sounds good"

OR

"Uh the US factory is overwhelmed with the demand for making Super Six's, Six 13's, CAAD9's, System Sixes and all the other USA made alu bikes"

"Oh no worries that's no big deal we'll just cancel USA production of Six 13 & Sys 6, since it's easier and cheaper to make those "kinds" of bikes overseas". 

"Deal?"

"Deal"


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

funhog1 said:


> If you can get your hands on a Six 13 I'd say go for it. But know that bicycles are like ice creams....everyone has their "own" favorite flavor.


Hey funhog1 -- since you seem to be connected to an LBS, would an '07 Six13 be a good deal and should I not wait for the full-carbon '09 Six? I might be able to get one my size (the Team 3). For some reason I like the one I rode more than a couple of Six13 5's that I got to try. The '07 Six13 seemed smoother...


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## funhog1 (Jan 26, 2003)

*Harmonic Convergeance*

Right on. Yeah Mhcarlos, right on. That's awesome. Testing bikes like you've been...indeed that is my bias. 

Since there will always be non-summative production variances that are hard to quantify all things being equal ... go with what your gut tells you. If that '07 ride has the right vibe, the right fit and right ride.... My choice would be to grab it.


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## zamboni (Sep 11, 2003)

According to the catalog the 09 Six carbon is made in Taiwan but if you can get the right size then go for it.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

funhog1 said:


> Right on. Yeah Mhcarlos, right on. That's awesome. Testing bikes like you've been...indeed that is my bias.
> 
> Since there will always be non-summative production variances that are hard to quantify all things being equal ... go with what your gut tells you. If that '07 ride has the right vibe, the right fit and right ride.... My choice would be to grab it.


Thanks funhog1. A friend of mine, a very experienced cyclist, kept sending me suggestions and I had some fun testing bikes whenever I could find the time. This wasn't too often -- and that was why I found it hard to compare one bike to a previous one I tested. But the Six13 -- and actually the System 6 and the Synapse -- stood out. So I'm just guessing my body fits Cannondales more than other bikes. I'll see the bike again tomorrow and hopefully all goes well.


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## mhcarlos (May 21, 2008)

zamboni said:


> According to the catalog the 09 Six carbon is made in Taiwan but if you can get the right size then go for it.


Hey zamboni, you mean get the right size in the Six13 or the '09 Six Carbon? 

Just curious, but is it a significant that a frame is made in Taiwan or is it just a personal thing for most people? I know the Synapses are made in Taiwan and I found a couple that I rode (the entry level ones) pretty nice.


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