# SR11 BB Wave Washer Issue



## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

Question for Campagnolophiles:
I've got 2011 SR11 (ti) on my Dogma which I built up myself last December. 
After several hundred flawless miles, she started making a ticking noise in the drivetrain.
After a long process of elimination, I pulled the cranks. I discovered that I had installed wave washers on both sides of the bb cups. I pulled the drive side one out and Bingo! no more ticking noise. My question is: what would it harm to delete the wave washer entirely from either side? I have tried this and the cranks seem to spin smoother. 
Please advise. TIA


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## FrenchNago (Jan 1, 2011)

rhauft said:


> Question for Campagnolophiles:
> I've got 2011 SR11 (ti) on my Dogma which I built up myself last December.
> After several hundred flawless miles, she started making a ticking noise in the drivetrain.
> After a long process of elimination, I pulled the cranks. I discovered that I had installed wave washers on both sides of the bb cups. I pulled the drive side one out and Bingo! no more ticking noise. My question is: what would it harm to delete the wave washer entirely from either side? I have tried this and the cranks seem to spin smoother.
> Please advise. TIA


the wave washer is meant to account for slight discrepancies in BB width you are normaly supposed to put one in not two............


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## bikerjulio (Jan 19, 2010)

FrenchNago said:


> the wave washer is meant to account for slight discrepancies in BB width you are normaly supposed to put one in not two............


one - on the left hand side only.

it's also worth checking out the BB shell dimensions prior to installation.

instructions are here:

http://www.campagnolo.com/repository/documenti/en/TECHNICAL%20MANUAL%202011.pdf


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

Yes thanks, I understand that. So are there any dire consequences if you delete them all together?


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## Pirx (Aug 9, 2009)

rhauft said:


> So are there any dire consequences if you delete them all together?


Yes, there are. Most likely you'll be left with axial play of your spindle which will result in creaking and possibly clicking noises and, over time, will ruin the bearing seats. The other possibility is that you'll overload the bearings (that's if you replace the wave washer with a couple of plane washers to eliminate axial play), which will ruin your bearings. There's a reason they have developed that wave washer.


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

Pirx said:


> Yes, there are. Most likely you'll be left with axial play of your spindle which will result in creaking and possibly clicking noises and, over time, will ruin the bearing seats. The other possibility is that you'll overload the bearings (that's if you replace the wave washer with a couple of plane washers to eliminate axial play), which will ruin your bearings. There's a reason they have developed that wave washer.


Good to know. Thanks for the help.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*info...*

Here's my response to someone who asked about leaving out the retaining clip. It also addresses the wave washer. If the crank was used that long with bearings improperly preloaded, don't be surprised if you experience early bearing failure. Where'd you get the extra wave washer - only one comes with each pair of bearing cups? Reading the instructions is usually helpful.

The retaining clip has nothing to due with safety or ease of installation, it is a vital part of the crank's function. 

The retaining clip must be used. If it's not, that would explain the poor bearing life, creaks and cup wear that some users report.

The wave washer on the left side pushes the whole assembly to the left, which holds the right side bearing tight against the inside face of the cup. The amount of force is on the 20-60 pound range, depending in the amount of squash. The clip makes it impossible for the right side bearing to move to the right by more than about .2mm. If the clip is not in place, there is nothing to keep the crank from moving to the right and completely squashing the wave washer. The wave washer has a very limited amount of travel, as required to maintain the designed range of preload on the bearings. The wave washer is about 3mm in height, and made of steel that's about .6mm thick. Subtract the allowed 1.6mm variation in BB width and you only have .8mm left. Not all of that .8mm is useable movement, since the wave washer should never be completely squashed.


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## rubbersoul (Mar 1, 2010)

lots of emerging issues with SR it seems


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

*thanks C-40*

Thats a very concise, complete explanation and exactly the info I was seeking. 
The extra wave washer must have come from one of my other builds as I have several bb cup spares.

*Update*: My 2011 SR11/ti is now spec'd properly and working smoothly, quietly as new.


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

rubbersoul said:


> lots of emerging issues with SR it seems


Not here, as this was a self inflicted wound. Spec'd properly, I have no issues whats so ever with my (2) SR11 bikes.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*well...*



rubbersoul said:


> lots of emerging issues with SR it seems


The issue is quite often a failure to read the instructions or the user deciding to leave off vital components. The ultratorque design works fine, if the installation instruction are followed. Some people had no way to measure their BB shell width, and didn't face the BB shell faces, so they just skip those steps and hope for the best. 

Campy did have a bad mistake in their instructions when ultratorque first came out. They suggested using purple loctite with "hand tightening" of the bearing cups as an alternative to the normal method of greasing the threads and torqueing to 35Nm. That would never work unless the factory applied thread locking material was first removed. Some cups may require 15Nm of torque just to overcome the resistance of the thread locker. Hand tightening would be impossible.


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## ultraman6970 (Aug 1, 2010)

Only one washer, clip must be Installed. If you have another problem like a nocking sound or if you pull the crank and the crank moves just add a second washer, that will keep it under control. But so far from what I've noticed the new generation of cups (record) are tiny wider than previous years, maybe to help to the issue.


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

*Madone?*

So how does a Madone w/ integrated cuos get away w/o a clip? Tighter tolerances?


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## Pirx (Aug 9, 2009)

rubbersoul said:


> lots of emerging issues with SR it seems


What gives you that idea?


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## Pirx (Aug 9, 2009)

ericjacobsen3 said:


> So how does a Madone w/ integrated cuos get away w/o a clip? Tighter tolerances?


The "integrated" cups are using a pressed-in adapter, that uses the exact same clip as the standard cups.


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## ericjacobsen3 (Apr 27, 2007)

Pirx said:


> The "integrated" cups are using a pressed-in adapter, that uses the exact same clip as the standard cups.


Pirx, I don't have press-in cups. I think you are thinking of BB30. I have BB86 or whatever it is that has the cups as part of the carbon. The seal rings bond in place and have no holes for a clip.

I can only assume tighter tolerances have kept the sky from falling on me the last year and a half (though I do get a creak on rare occasion).


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## Tommasini (Apr 24, 2002)

*He's a flamer*



rubbersoul said:


> lots of emerging issues with SR it seems


He rides Shimano - he's a flamer trying to disrupt things

So to really have something to feel good about he should have started his own thread......


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