# That is not a Cycloross bike, you are in the wrong forum.



## OnTheRivet

*That is not a Cyclocross bike, you are in the wrong forum.*

So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum. 

1. Triple crankset. 
2. Fenders. 
3. Disc Brakes
4. Racks
5. Flat Pedals
6. Tires larger than 34mm


----------



## old_fuji

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


What's wrong with a triple, flats, or 38mm tires?


----------



## OnTheRivet

old_fuji said:


> What's wrong with a triple, flats, or 38mm tires?


Nothing, but wouldn't you be better served asking questions about those types of things on a different forum?


----------



## jmoote

I'm in total agreement, except now we have to allow discussion of what is legal, so disc brakes are in and tires >33mm are out. Word is some of the big teams/sponsors have disc equipped bikes in the works, so like it or not we'll have to accept this as part of cross.

But yes, touring bikes, commuters, mtbs and their like are better discussed in other forums and do add to the clutter around here.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

agreed too.

My commuter/touring bike is built on a CycloCross frame, but it has a triple, racks, fenders, chainguards, flat pedals and bottle cages, Marathon tyres, then it is *NOT *a CycloCross bike. it is a *touring *bike.

My Cyclocross bike has a 46/38 crankset, SPD pedals, a set of 32c challenge fango tubulars and no bottle cages. that qualifies.


----------



## tamjam

Seriously? Wow, friendly crowd here. So, what, you have a "Cyclocross" bike that just sits in your garage during the 9 month long off-season? Take this, doosh. This is a cross bike that will be ridden 12 months/yr for the rest of its or my life, whichever comes first.


----------



## jmoote

tamjam said:


> So, what, you have a "Cyclocross" bike that just sits in your garage during the 9 month long off-season?


Close... after sitting around from January to March, I bring it out for a couple dirt road type races in the spring, then it sits for the majority of the summer until it's time to train for cross again. So not 9 months of sitting around... more like 6


----------



## OnTheRivet

tamjam said:


> Seriously? Wow, friendly crowd here. So, what, you have a "Cyclocross" bike that just sits in your garage during the 9 month long off-season? Take this, doosh. This is a cross bike that will be ridden 12 months/yr for the rest of its or my life, whichever comes first.


You know it's not "doosh" it's douche.........douche. Nice touring bike by the way.


----------



## 88 rex

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


>33 :thumbsup: 

At least you could get your rules right. 

It's a bike. Just ride it and enjoy it. Maybe you don't enjoy it anymore? 

Without the "pack fodder" showing up on their frankenbikes, who's going to provide your prize money? More is good.


----------



## OnTheRivet

88 rex said:


> >33 :thumbsup:
> 
> At least you could get your rules right.
> 
> It's a bike. Just ride it and enjoy it. Maybe you don't enjoy it anymore?
> 
> Without the "pack fodder" showing up on their frankenbikes, who's going to provide your prize money? More is good.



I'm all for people racing on whatever...I raced half a season on my MTB when I started, what's annoying is commuter/touring/MTB people complaining that "cyclocross" bikes should be able to accommodate discs, 48mm tires etc. Also, after 15 years of racing on the road and MTB, cyclocross is the only racing I do really enjoy anymore. I like it enough to actually go out training [shudder] and I hate training.


----------



## tamjam

OnTheRivet said:


> You know it's not "doosh" it's douche.........douche. Nice touring bike by the way.


So the Vanilla SSCX that was Sasha's personal race bike back in 2003 and I raced on last season doesn't count either, because it had discs? Dang, and here I thought I had bought a cross bike. And the Bianchi Roger I'll probably ride this year doesn't count either? Sheesh, I guess not, since it has discs, rack, mounts, and can fit a hella-wide tire (oops, maybe I spelled "hella" wrong. Whether I did it on purpose or not, I guess I'll leave that to OTR to decide). 

Last season this place was ok to hang out in, I learned a lot as a first-timer. This year, maybe not so much. It's worse than the 29er board on MTBR. And the Google Rivendell list. 

By the way, I've never seen a touring bike without rear rack mounts, doosh. Learn your bike categories.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

tamjam said:


> So the Vanilla SSCX that was Sasha's personal race bike back in 2003 and I raced on last season doesn't count either, because it had discs?


Sacha (with a "c" ) offers commuting, touring and "randonee" bikes. Maybe he was racing on one of those?


----------



## atpjunkie

*am I weird*

because I ride my cx bike year round???
and not commuting
we go out and do 'hot laps' which is basically friendly cx races or race like training


----------



## veloreality

you didnt say anything about drop bars!


----------



## weather

OnTheRivet said:


> I'm all for people racing on whatever...I raced half a season on my MTB when I started, what's annoying is commuter/touring/MTB people complaining that "cyclocross" bikes should be able to accommodate discs, 48mm tires etc. Also, after 15 years of racing on the road and MTB, cyclocross is the only racing I do really enjoy anymore. I like it enough to actually go out training [shudder] and I hate training.


there's a separate forum for racing, does that mean you should move there? forums here are not mutually exclusive.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

you are not getting OTR's point 

There is nothing wrong about CycloCross frames built into touring bikes. Au Contraire, they make excellent touring bikes, lighter and faster than traditional ones.

His point is that this forum is not about touring bikes, or about commuting. There is an special forum for that 

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/forumdisplay.php?f=76

This forum is about Cyclocross, a well defined cycling discipline, involving off-road riding, training and racing in parcours involving grass, sand, obstacles, trails, tarmac, snow, mud.

check it out here

http://www.uci.ch/templates/UCI/UCI5/layout.asp?MenuId=MTI1OTg&LangId=1

Not the same thing.


----------



## 88 rex

What if my commuting is my training? And I train on my CX bike, which has discs, which are now legal, and thus my bike qualifies as CX race bike, even though I commute on it. But I group road ride it too....so maybe it's a road bike? But I've had it on single track with mountain group rides....maybe it's a mountain bike in road bike clothing? My bike seems to only confuse the hoards of grouches on this forum who can't understand it's just a bike. The market has deemed it a CX bike, and fortunately for me, now qualifies as a true UCI level CX race bike. 


I think commuters should be forced to stop using canti's since they are purely a sign that you are a pseudo CX bike that is obviously in the wrong environment. 

Salsa Lover, I think the point you're also missing from OTR's OP is that he has included items which are legal.......disc brakes and triple cranksets. Also, he seems to think only "real racers" are allowed to express an opinion and somehow you have to meet his magical criteria to be involved in that elite group. Personally, I think anybody who can't bunny hop a barrier shouldn't be a "real racer." That's where I draw my line in the sand.


----------



## tamjam

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Sacha (with a "c" ) offers commuting, touring and "randonee" bikes. Maybe he was racing on one of those?


This one was pure cross, trust me, even with the discs.


----------



## kmanpfk

is that advertised wheel size or actual measured width?

many 32s are 34 or 35


----------



## crossracer

Geeze, my gt cross bike with the bolt on seat post rear rack and road tubulars cant come out and play here? Comeone, lets not get so uptight and bent out of shape over racks and disk brakes. I enjoy seeing the different bikes here, and alot of people get double duty out of thier rigs by commuting on them during the year.

If you have been doing any kind of cross racing over the years then you would know that cross racers like to make up thier own rules and follow their own trends. Cross racing and rigs are all about fun. So if someone turns up here with a rig with a triple, disks, fat tires and a rack but wants to talk about cross racing and says they race that rig then who am i to say "no, go away"???? 

My first year of cross racing in 1999 was on a full squishy mtn bike. And it was some of the best, most fun times ever. 

Bill


----------



## TurboTurtle

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


Wrong! CX racing is the one without the total a$$e$. Please post elsewhere. - TF


----------



## Rmanla

OTR is just plain "Sassy". With his "Sassy" catch phrase of you heard me. So Sassy!


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

88 rex said:


> What if my commuting is my training?


Would you post a thread about backpacks vs. panniers on the CX forum or the Commuting forum?



88 rex said:


> And I train on my CX bike, which has discs, which are now legal, and thus my bike qualifies as CX race bike, even though I commute on it.


Would you expect better info about disc brakes on the CX forum or the MTBR Brakes forum?



88 rex said:


> But I group road ride it too....so maybe it's a road bike?


So would you post a thread about group ride etiquette on the CX forum or the General forum?



88 rex said:


> But I've had it on single track with mountain group rides....maybe it's a mountain bike in road bike clothing?


CX forum or MTBR?

etc.


----------



## laffeaux

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


This is dumb.

So a CX bike can only be used for racing, can never be modified during the off season, needs to be build solely for one purpose, and only ridden 3 months out of the year?

What color do I need to paint it to make it a cyclocross bike? Does it need to be custom made to fit you too?


----------



## 88 rex

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Would you post a thread about backpacks vs. panniers on the CX forum or the Commuting forum?
> 
> Would you expect better info about disc brakes on the CX forum or the MTBR Brakes forum?
> 
> So would you post a thread about group ride etiquette on the CX forum or the General forum?
> 
> CX forum or MTBR?
> 
> etc.


None of the above while being all of the above. Who cares. I'll post what I want where I want to attain the desired info from the desired audience. 

Maybe we should have a brake forum. Would that not be the appropriate place to ask brake questions? How about a forum on the lost art of setting up Canti's. Afterall, canti's aren't really specific to CX bikes only. 

RBR and MTBR aren't the end all for answers and there are no referees here (despite what some may think) to dictate what should and must be. This is a public forum where we can all hate on each others bikes and piss each other off because our bar tape is the wrong color. Purely entertainment, and it never lets me down.:thumbsup:


----------



## 88 rex

laffeaux said:


> What color do I need to paint it to make it a cyclocross bike?


I vote that bike colors must be of Belgium origin. Otherwise, you just ain't trying.


----------



## adimiro

Don't forget to ban Salsa from sponsoring this forum and get that La Cruz disc only bicycle out of the top banner!!!


----------



## Dajianshan

When people feel threatened they seek to essentialize and define authenticity to "other" those they fear. This process of selective reductionism places the object on a simple dichotomy of "truth" and "falsehood" with the aim of mobilizing "political" (small "p") support behind a given agenda. 

I don't give a **** what you think is a "real" cyclocross bike.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

Dajianshan said:



> I don't give a **** what you think is a "real" cyclocross bike.


I still enjoy reading your ride reports on the Commuting, Touring and Ride Reports forum


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

88 rex said:


> Maybe we should have a brake forum. Would that not be the appropriate place to ask brake questions? How about a forum on the lost art of setting up Canti's. Afterall, canti's aren't really specific to CX bikes only.


Disc info and canti set-up are in the sticky FAQ thread.


----------



## the pope

The essentialization of this thread will occur only after the essentialists finish lunch. That's just how it is with them.


----------



## d2p

Ahhh . . . The Essence.


----------



## beantownbiker

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


And the stereotypical roadie snobbery finally seeps into what used to be the more accepting cyclocross crowd. 

Here are some sample questions answered by the cyclocross forum "expert" moving forward:

Q: Can I participate in a cyclocross race with my mountain bike?
A: No, Cyclocross is a serious endeavor and we would not want to tarnish its pure elitism with your "triple, wide-tire equipped mountain bike". Please go back to running over hikers or whatever it is you mountain bikers do. 

Q: If I can fit wider tires on my road bike, can I use it in a cyclocross race?
A: No, it is a road bike, look at the damn forum title...cyclocross, spend some money and get yourself a proper bike before you compete in our sport, if you don't you'll just make us all look bad

Q: I'm new, how do I get into cyclocross?
A: You do not, your lack of talent and your inevitable crashing will ruin the "true" cyclocross bikes, you will just be lapped in your first race and really annoy me on my way to my 21st place.

Q: Disc brakes, can I use them
A: no, using them will result in cosmic embarrassment and possible sterility of those around you. This is a noble sport, using disc brakes would be like using a 2x4 in a boxing match.

Q: I just bought a surly cross-check, can I race it?
A: no, steel cyclocross bikes do not count unless they are custom made

Q: I have a triple, can I race cyclocross if I promise not to shift?
A: No, triple users are inevitably commuters, so at some point during the race, completely subconsciously, you will stick out your arm to signal a left turn and clothesline me on my way to my glorious 19th place finish.

Q: Are fenders allowed?
A: No, fenders indicate that you are the ultimate commuter and will, halfway through the race probably pull up next to the porta-potties, slip inside, change into a suit and then ruin my awesome race (top 20 for sure)

Q: I have a rack on my bike, will I be allowed to race?
A: Racks have a place and time, and a cyclocross race is not it. Racks place is women's chest and the proper time is "not while I'm just breaking into the top 20."
A cyclcross bike is like the male body, the best ones are ridden to a podium finish every weekend, the worst ones have a rack.

Q: Do I have to have clipless pedals?
A: Absolutely, without clipless pedals, your feet will probably slip off the pedal on the upstroke and your knee will hit your face, getting blood all over the place. I'm almost on the podium (i'm in the top 20), and I sure as hell don't want blood on my team kit when I'm standing up there.

Q: Can I bring a cowbell to a race?
A: Cyclocross is best appreciated when your are pretending to be European, preferably continental European. The boorish spectator in America goes cow-tipping the night before, steals some cowbells and proceeds to ruin my race. The proper spectator special orders belgian steel cowbells and drinks bottle grolsch while cheering me to my top 20 finish. 

Q: I'm a beginner. Whats the proper dismount technique, and how do I practice it?
A: Ride your triple, fat tire, fender and rack bike to a field. Get up a fair amount of speed and then grab your front brake, and swing your right leg back over the seat. Ride on your left pedal for a bit while you come almost to a full stop. When you are ready, swing your right leg forward and step down while twisting your left foot to release from the pedal (you are using clipless pedals right?). You now should be trotting beside your bicycle, slowly let go of the bike and come to a complete stop and watch as your bike rolls several more feet to a stop. Once it falls over, turn around and walk home because cyclocross is not for losers like you.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

tamjam said:


> This one was pure cross, trust me, even with the discs.


Gah! The top tube! :nonod:


----------



## Salsa_Lover

@beantownbiker

That was actually very good, I LOLed hard ( specially liked the place for Racks )

Don't take me wrong. I have nothing against the people who post here or their bikes. I am all in favor.

Myself I commute on a Cyclocross frame turned into a all conditions commuter, and I absolutely love it, and is probably the bike that gets riden the most.

It is just a terminology thing.

When I come over this forum is to read about Cyclocross, it's special skills, techniques and equipment, races and results, 

It would be nice that people keep it like this and post most commuting/all terrain/all uses bikes on the Commuting/Touring forum.

It actually would be good, it would enrich it and render more interesting.

peace


----------



## laffeaux

Salsa_Lover said:


> It is just a terminology thing.
> 
> When I come over this forum is to read about Cyclocross, it's special skills, techniques and equipment, races and results,
> 
> It would be nice that people keep it like this and post most commuting/all terrain/all uses bikes on the Commuting/Touring forum.


It's about perspective though.

Last month I rode on pavement for about 18 miles to a trail head. I proceeded to ride on the dirt trails for 10-12 miles, and then returned home on pavement (again about 18 miles). I was riding for about 4 hours total, and used my CX bike. To me riding 36 miles of pavement on my mountain bike made little sense, and the other option was to drive to the trail head in my car which makes the least sense of all. Unfortunately my CX bike had 38mm tires on it, so I guess it's not a CX bike after all, but apparently a commuter or touring bike?

During race season, sure this is a good place to post results. But what do we post now? If I ride my "race" bike on the trails during the spring or summer with tires that are wider than the UCI regulations or with a fender to keep my dry, suddenly I'm a commuter? I don't buy it.


----------



## the mayor

@beantown....
Those aren't Belgian cow bells.....they are Swiss!
Because up until about 8 years ago....that is where all the big cross races were.

Man...there is a lot of jabber here for June. The cross forum will probably cause a server melt down by mid October.


----------



## C Cow

*Cylcocross Guy*

This is awesome! A true cyclocross forum, bout time. 

Now that this is fixed, I have two questions-

1. I rode my cross bike with my baggy mtb shorts on the other day. How do I resolve this conflict? Yes, I was seen by actual Mtbers and CXers. I was so embarrased! A roadie saw me too, I had no choice but to jump off the bike and hide in a ditch until all was clear. I'm still there, in the ditch. Fortunately, I have a strong wifi signal from a local business, since I had my laptop in my messenger bag. OOPS!!! It's not an official cyclocross messenger bag! Which messenger bag will be blessed as CX ready?

2. Where can I get cyclocross shoes? I keep searching, and all I find is mtb shoes. I'm so frustrated. Can you fix the big CX industry? You have the power to fix this forum, so you must be capable of some universal repair to our sport.

Oh, crap! I just found rack mounts on my CX bike, never mind my request for help, I guess I'll have to post my questions elsewhere. Sorry for taking your time, your lordship.

Moo


----------



## Coolhand

Current discs for cross racing = too heavy, still use cables.

Now a hydraulic disc (no cables) + DI2 shifting (no cables) and you are looking at actual racing advantages. Especially with the move to carbon wheelsets for most elite racers.

Moving the braking off the rims allows for even better (and more race durable) wheelsets.

The no 34c tires is typical UCI dumb. Then again the UCI courses are more watered down every year, does it matter?


----------



## Salsa_Lover

the mayor said:


> @beantown....
> Those aren't Belgian cow bells.....they are Swiss!
> Because up until about 8 years ago....that is where all the big cross races were.
> 
> Man...there is a lot of jabber here for June. The cross forum will probably cause a server melt down by mid October.


you're right Wetzikon is the name of the place... just 25km from where I live.

Even though current year's weather conditions make this "summer" look and feel like an autumn, rain and cold since april.... 11°C and rain yesterday WTF ? 

I should take my cross bike to the forest instead of being on the rain bike on the road.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

C Cow said:


> This is awesome! A true cyclocross forum, bout time.
> 
> Now that this is fixed, I have two questions-
> 
> 1. I rode my cross bike with my baggy mtb shorts on the other day. How do I resolve this conflict? Yes, I was seen by actual Mtbers and CXers. I was so embarrased! A roadie saw me too, I had no choice but to jump off the bike and hide in a ditch until all was clear. I'm still there, in the ditch. Fortunately, I have a strong wifi signal from a local business, since I had my laptop in my messenger bag. OOPS!!! It's not an official cyclocross messenger bag! Which messenger bag will be blessed as CX ready?


Rules #18 and #19

http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/

A winter weight skinsuit would do the job.



> 2. Where can I get cyclocross shoes? I keep searching, and all I find is mtb shoes. I'm so frustrated. Can you fix the big CX industry? You have the power to fix this forum, so you must be capable of some universal repair to our sport.


Sidi Spider

http://cyclingshoesonline.com/mount...ike-sidi-spider-srs-cyclocross-mountain-shoe/

or read this
http://www.cxmagazine.com/cyclocross-shoes-mid-range-review



> Oh, crap! I just found rack mounts on my CX bike, never mind my request for help, I guess I'll have to post my questions elsewhere. Sorry for taking your time, your lordship.
> 
> Moo


File them out.


----------



## J-K

I am with OnTheRivet.

Go visit a touring bike forum. Cyclocross is about racing, not about all the other things you can use cyclocross frames for (*).

(* Hanging your old frame that you raced to glorious results on your living room wall is an exception)


----------



## laffeaux

How about we move all of the racing discussion to the "racing" forum, all of the non-racing discussion to the "commuter" forum, and all of the brake discussion to MTBR.com and close this forum down.


----------



## crossracer

I am cutting and pasting the Q and A's so i can print them and put them up on the shop wall. They are great. THe best IMHO is the whole commuter putting his hand out to make a turn. That was classic 

Well said my friend well said. Cross should be for anyone and everyone. Bill


----------



## co2cycle

this conversation raises some interesting (albeit pointless) questions:

since almost all true cyclocross courses only exist for a few hours at a time, is racing the only way to truly do cyclocross?

is there some other term for riding in a cyclocross-ish manner when not racing? (and don't say "training") 

if not, should there be?

if cyclocross only includes racing, wouldn't a "real" cyclocross bike need to be one that's raced?

and, if a tree falls in the forest and it is 40cm high, does it constitute a barrier?


----------



## 88 rex

crossracer said:


> I am cutting and pasting the Q and A's so i can print them and put them up on the shop wall. They are great. THe best IMHO is the whole commuter putting his hand out to make a turn. That was classic
> 
> Well said my friend well said. Cross should be for anyone and everyone. Bill



I laughed the whole time reading it. Reminded me of a race where I was walking/running up the run up next to a guy whom appeared to be new and his kids were heckling him the whole way up. Dude was deep in the red, but was laughing his butt off the whole way up. Yea, that was cool. That was racing the way it should be and that is what I enjoy. I don't think I recall at all what bike he had......didn't care. He was having some good old dirty fun.:thumbsup:


----------



## wunlap togo

co2cycle said:


> this conversation raises some interesting (albeit pointless) questions:
> 
> since almost all true cyclocross courses only exist for a few hours at a time, is racing the only way to truly do cyclocross?
> 
> is there some other term for riding in a cyclocross-ish manner when not racing? (and don't say "training")
> 
> if not, should there be?
> 
> if cyclocross only includes racing, wouldn't a "real" cyclocross bike need to be one that's raced?
> 
> and, if a tree falls in the forest and it is 40cm high, does it constitute a barrier?


#1 Yes

#2 Yes. It's called training (sorry). I can't imagine another reason why you'd go around and around a short loop, on and off road, in the winter, while periodically dismounting and remounting your bike AS HARD AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN for an hour. If others are involved, it's a cyclocross race. If you're alone, it's training for a cyclocross race. 

#3 No. If you are using your cyclocross bike for something other than cyclocross, you're just trail riding, road riding, commuting, whatever. Same as if you were doing those things on your BMX bike.

#4 No. Anyone is free to purchase a cyclocross bike and do with it as they wish. Just don't come on the cyclocross forum and get all surprised when people react badly to your questions regarding the best tires for an offroad century ride that you plan to do on your cyclocross bike. There are other forums where you will get very good advice about a question like that, but this is the cyclocross forum.

#5 If the tree falls in an area of a forest that has been or will be used for a cyclocross race, or if it falls on part of your training area, then it can be used as a barrier. Otherwise it's just a tree laying in your way to be negotiated in any fashion that you prefer, regardless of what type of bike that you're riding.


----------



## atpjunkie

*like so?*



88 rex said:


> I vote that bike colors must be of Belgium origin. Otherwise, you just ain't trying.


did I get this right?


----------



## 88 rex

atpjunkie said:


> did I get this right?


Good lord no!!! White bar tape AND saddle......total CX faux pas. The crank arms and seat post pass on color merits though:thumbsup:


----------



## 88 rex

wunlap togo said:


> #5 If the tree falls in an area of a forest that has been or will be used for a cyclocross race, or if it falls on part of your training area, then it can be used as a barrier. Otherwise it's just a tree laying in your way to be negotiated in any fashion that you prefer, regardless of what type of bike that you're riding.



Total fail!! It was a trick question. CX bikes aren't allowed in the forest.


----------



## wunlap togo

88 rex said:


> Total fail!! It was a trick question. CX bikes aren't allowed in the forest.


Hey, if you ask a stupid question you can expect a stupid answer...


----------



## 88 rex

wunlap togo said:


> Hey, if you ask a stupid question you can expect a stupid answer...


This thread is entertainingly stupid. 

For giggles, my bike was morphed from a fendered roadie tonight to a CX bike. Once I remove the 34c's for 31c's I can call it a CX Race bike.....and what a relief that will be. I can finally start posting serious posts on this CX race forum knowing that I have a full blown race bike.


----------



## wunlap togo

88 rex said:


> This thread is entertainingly stupid.
> 
> For giggles, my bike was morphed from a fendered roadie tonight to a CX bike. Once I remove the 34c's for 31c's I can call it a CX Race bike.....and what a relief that will be. I can finally start posting serious posts on this CX race forum knowing that I have a full blown race bike.


Agreed. It's a silly conversation, and it's june. What fun, I say!

The transmogrification of your cyclocross bike to full race mode should be more than a relief- It should make you quiver in anticipation of the coming season!

Just yesterday I hauled my cyclocross bike down off the hook and spent the day skylarking across hill and dale with a fine group of companions on it. It was quite a time and I really enjoyed feeling the trails with that bike, imagining it on the race course in a few months. I even managed to have a crash and remind myself that it's not a mountain bike, and you really can't go very fast on downhills with it (and so you know, the cantilever brakes were definitely not the problem).

I'm gleefully anticipating the day that I remove the seatbag, frame pump and water bottle cage and replace the training clinchers w/ the 12-27 for the tubular, 12-25 equipped racing wheels and then... THEN MY BLOOD WILL BEGIN TO BOIL!

Here was the ride we did, courtesy of my buddy Lee Slone:

http://www.strava.com/rides/122720


----------



## atpjunkie

*oh no*



88 rex said:


> Good lord no!!! White bar tape AND saddle......total CX faux pas. The crank arms and seat post pass on color merits though:thumbsup:


a TRUE cx racer, LIKE ALL TRUE BIKE RACERS always uses white tape and saddle
just have your mechanic clean and change as needed

since I'm my own mechanic...but seriously look, it is covered in mud 

and you can clean white cork tape

you failed to notice the brakes and headset as well :0)


----------



## atpjunkie

*and lord knows*



atpjunkie said:


> a TRUE cx racer, LIKE ALL TRUE BIKE RACERS always uses white tape and saddle
> just have your mechanic clean and change as needed
> 
> since I'm my own mechanic...but seriously look, it is covered in mud
> 
> and you can clean white cork tape
> 
> you failed to notice the brakes and headset as well :0)


I'd hate to be making the same faux pas as this guy


----------



## atpjunkie

*or this guy*

(sorry guys) what a bunch of losers


----------



## spookyload

To the OP. You might want to check yourself on the Disk Brakes. You are likely to get your feelings hurt with your opinion of them. If you kept up with you beloved sport, you would know the UCI approved them for use next year. I would imagine the real pros are going to jump on the chance to use a bike with good braking. So I am sure your "pure" setup will be changing as will most of the bikes on the high end that follow what the pros do like sheep. Here is the article:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/uci-allows-disc-brakes-for-cyclo-cross


----------



## Salsa_Lover

So this doesn't count ?





<p><a href="http://vimeo.com/11695455">Local trails ala cx</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user2018660">Andy Wardman</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>


----------



## hawss

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


I like it!!


----------



## Kram

That, my friend, brings tears to my eyes. I'll be back in 5....


----------



## 88 rex

atpjunkie said:


> (sorry guys) what a bunch of losers


Obviously posers on commuter wheels. True CX racers have deep dish carbon wheels.


----------



## OnTheRivet

spookyload said:


> To the OP. You might want to check yourself on the Disk Brakes. You are likely to get your feelings hurt with your opinion of them. If you kept up with you beloved sport, you would know the UCI approved them for use next year. I would imagine the real pros are going to jump on the chance to use a bike with good braking. So I am sure your "pure" setup will be changing as will most of the bikes on the high end that follow what the pros do like sheep. Here is the article:
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/uci-allows-disc-brakes-for-cyclo-cross


Wow, you're really on top of things genius. This whole thing started because of that rule change and the previous discussions regarding it. My post was mostly tongue in cheek but considering the idiots who got butt hurt from it I'm starting to think it's a good idea.

By the way, it must suck having to to tell your friends that your rad cyclocross bike is actually a Touring bike, the shame.


----------



## atpjunkie

*lovely*



Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/11695455">Local trails ala cx</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user2018660">Andy Wardman</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>


really great camera placement, beautiful angles. That was a joy to watch. The log stunt was cool but it would have been faster to portage it.


----------



## laffeaux

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


Very nice!!!


----------



## ®andyA

atpjunkie said:


> really great camera placement, beautiful angles. That was a joy to watch. The log stunt was cool but it would have been faster to portage it.


+1

Most definitely a joy to watch. Beautiful work by the "artist/rider".


----------



## atpjunkie

*the bike*



Kram said:


> That, my friend, brings tears to my eyes. I'll be back in 5....


the shots of all those Belgian Kits or both???

or just the mud?


----------



## wunlap togo

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


What a cool video! Those trails look so fun, perfect for the cross bike. That's not cyclocross though.


----------



## atpjunkie

*besides the log trick*



wunlap togo said:


> What a cool video! Those trails look so fun, perfect for the cross bike. That's not cyclocross though.


he looks like he's 'training'

the rest will all benefit him come race day

in fact I think more racers should trail ride as many come from roadie backgrounds and have awful dirt skills


----------



## wunlap togo

atpjunkie said:


> he looks like he's 'training'
> 
> the rest will all benefit him come race day
> 
> in fact I think more racers should trail ride as many come from roadie backgrounds and have awful dirt skills


You're right of course. I was just being a stickler and trying to emphasize my earlier point, and the point of the thread- let's not call every ride you do on a cyclocross bike "cyclocross". 

And you're also right about roadies and their awful skills; I've got the tegaderm on to prove it!


----------



## Salsa_Lover

wunlap togo said:


> What a cool video! Those trails look so fun, perfect for the cross bike. That's not cyclocross though.


Just like the trails where I train around here, we have a forest along the river that goes up to the hills, great fun and good training.

I don't like to do it during spring/summer though, the trails are mostly dry and rocky/dusty, during the autumn you have the fallen leaves on and the moist/mud and then the terrain is great, and many grass, snow and sand areas to train.


----------



## kmanpfk

wow!

this is the beauty of this sport and also maybe why the "Cyclcrsss" thread attracts riders of so many different interests. also get to the heart of this overheated discussion

if a technical question is allowed - what's the bike, setup, tires, pressure?

thanks.


----------



## weather

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


absolutely not. can't you see that any and all practical value attached to cyclocross skills is an insult to the sport? that any use of cyclocross skills outside a special fabricated course is sacrilege? the guy who made that video should be burned at the stake.


----------



## Kram

Initially, the bike. But now it's the whole package....


----------



## cullinsb

Hate to break the news, but I think this forum title is "cyclocross", not "cyclocross bike snobs". To make a stronger point, I sometimes wear a fluorescent Performance jacket, I raced CX for several years on a converted mountain bike with 26 x 1.5 tires, and I constantly encourage people to try "cyclocross" events on whatever bike they have (again, note the distinction between "cyclocross" and "cyclocross bike snob"). Hell, I've even been known to wear of my state CX championship jerseys while riding a Frankenbike during mellow group rides. Your attitude is in violation of Athlete Ego Ordinance #3 (read this link and you'll understand what that means: http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2010/apr/24/watch-out-athletic-egomaniacs-theres-a-new-in/).


----------



## pigpen

Video was great.
I wish my trails were that smooth. Mine are rock covered, huge bolder drops.
impossible to ride on a cyclocross bike.


----------



## dankilling

pigpen said:


> Video was great.
> I wish my trails were that smooth. Mine are rock covered, huge bolder drops.
> impossible to ride on a cyclocross bike.


Don't be so sure....
http://www.youtube.com/v/5z1fSpZNXhU&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0&hd=1


----------



## Doctor Who

atpjunkie said:


> because I ride my cx bike year round???
> and not commuting
> we go out and do 'hot laps' which is basically friendly cx races or race like training


This. I've wondered why CX isn't a year-round discipline, though it seems like it's heading that way -- I think it's possible to race CX in every month somewhere in the States from August to March. 

I rode my CX bike today on my commute in. I did some run-up action but mostly kept it tempo. Man, I can't wait. 

Cross starts in three months -- it's time to dust these things off if you haven't already.


----------



## ernestolube

Your mom is my cyclocross bike. And she rides it single speed.


----------



## 88 rex

weather said:


> the guy who made that video should be burned at the stake.


Stakes should only be used to mark courses. Any other use would be a CX violation.


----------



## spookyload

OnTheRivet said:


> By the way, it must suck having to to tell your friends that your rad cyclocross bike is actually a Touring bike, the shame.


Before you start tossing your insults around, check yourself. I raced the US nationals cyclocross in 1986, so my background goes just a bit deeper than your I would guess. I think your odd sarcasm and attack on folks here is a little out of taste. Take it to the lounge if you want to be more enlightened than anyone else. I guess folks come to the cyclocross forum for real help, not your sarcastic attempt to be funny while putting folks down. Shall we compare penis lengths now?


----------



## |brake-out|

cullinsb said:


> http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2010/apr/24/watch-out-athletic-egomaniacs-theres-a-new-in/).


nice article minus the jeebus reference....


----------



## kiatkiat

dankilling said:


> Don't be so sure....
> http://www.youtube.com/v/5z1fSpZNXhU&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0&hd=1


That guy is trial bike champion.


----------



## wunlap togo

|brake-out| said:


> nice article minus the jeebus reference....


Agreed.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

The guy in the Video just realised his is not a "real" CX bike


----------



## Dajianshan

So... if you are considering buying a bike and may or may not race cyclocross, do you come to the Cyclocross Forum to ask questions considering the bike hasn't been ridden yet and its destiny as a CX bike or a non CX bike has not been determined and it is therefore technically not a cyclocross bike? How should these matters be discussed and in which forum? Once it has been raced, then can it move from The Forum of the Misfit Bikes to the Cyclocross Forum or does it need to first accrue enough points? Once the components are raced in a CX race then, and not before, can they be addressed in the CX Forum as real CX components... and until then they go to the... components that could b, but are not cyclocross components or is there another category?


----------



## atpjunkie

*I gotta get*



Kram said:


> Initially, the bike. But now it's the whole package....


mah Hup on


----------



## atpjunkie

*all I know*



kmanpfk said:


> wow!
> 
> this is the beauty of this sport and also maybe why the "Cyclcrsss" thread attracts riders of so many different interests. also get to the heart of this overheated discussion
> 
> if a technical question is allowed - what's the bike, setup, tires, pressure?
> 
> thanks.


is it is the new CF version of the Ibis Hakkalugi

he is a member of Velo Club Moulin in Scotland and is a Ranger/ Trail manager


----------



## OnTheRivet

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


That was totally fake, probably CG because....

1. He was stopping with cantilevers on singletrack and we KNOW that's not possible.
2. He was riding something other than steel which surely means it couldn't have been real. 
3. He was on a Carbon Ibis and we all know carbon fiber explodes when exposed to the elements.


----------



## Carl Hungus

The smug meter is redlining in this thread. 

If you don't want to read threads about subjects you don't deem relevant, don't click on them.


----------



## c-lo

love this thread. I use mine to commute on and have even been known to throw on some clip on fenders on those cold wet, icy, snowy days when I take it out on the road.


----------



## Coolhand

OnTheRivet said:


> That was totally fake, probably CG because....
> 
> 
> 3. He was on a Carbon Ibis and we all know carbon fiber explodes when exposed to the elements.


It explodes in the box, and you are left with carbon bits and a grouppo.


----------



## the mayor

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/11695455">Local trails ala cx</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user2018660">Andy Wardman</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>


Man...if this video doesn't make you stop cyber arguing and sniveling and make you go out and ride...there is NO hope for you !


----------



## Salsa_Lover

can't wait for the Autumn 

in the meantime I am riding on the road everyday is possible


----------



## Kuna

*Nice Thread*

Let’s take this a step further for those that seem to be the elite traditionalist in this thread, unless you have raced or race in a UCI rated race, your description of what equipment a cyclocross build should consist of is just a snobocross opinion; like the original poster gave an equipment check list. In all non-UCI categories you can race whatever you want, with whatever tire size, disc brakes, v-brakes, toe clips, commuter, or MTB, there really are no regulations other then course setup. USA cycling bases "cyclocross racing" on course description and time, not by the type of bike you are riding – which is the REAL topic of this thread. Only the UCI has specific regulations on the type of bike you must use, so unless you are a UCI license holder your definition of a cyclocross bike build is made up by you, trying to replicate a pro’s ride. However you will find most pros are not snobs toward the new guys, they are usually eager to help teach and answer questions. 


I think some guys in here need to lay off sniffing the tubular glue until at least the end of August. Don’t ruin cyclocross; it’s what XC mountain bike racing used to be. Enjoy the ride and don’t be lame.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

Kuna said:


> Don’t ruin cyclocross; it’s what XC mountain bike racing used to be. Enjoy the ride and don’t be lame.


Maybe the problem is that XC racers ruined XC and now they are trying to "fix" CX in the same way.


----------



## spookyload

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Maybe the problem is that XC racers ruined XC and now they are trying to "fix" CX in the same way.


hmmm....very valid point. I quit racing xc because I was tire of guys forcing passes for seventh place and causing crashes. That race t-shirt and five year old tire that was the seventh place prize must have brought way too many braggin rights.


----------



## Kuna

*Yeah*



PeanutButterBreath said:


> Maybe the problem is that XC racers ruined XC and now they are trying to "fix" CX in the same way.


Could be; used to be fun atmosphere and encouraged all levels of fitness to come out and have fun. A good title to a blog and I think it is on Facebook - F.A.R.C.A. - Federation Against Ridiculously Competitive Amateurs - a good reminder that if you aren’t a paid pro, then this is a hobby that is supposed to be fun.


----------



## estone2

Disk brakes were allowed on all categories below 1-2 last year, IIRC. They're now allowed for 1-2 also. Disk brakes can be on a race rig. Sorry, play again


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

Kuna said:


> Could be; used to be fun atmosphere and encouraged all levels of fitness to come out and have fun. A good title to a blog and I think it is on Facebook - F.A.R.C.A. - Federation Against Ridiculously Competitive Amateurs - a good reminder that if you aren’t a paid pro, then this is a hobby that is supposed to be fun.


I was thinking more along the lines of an obsession with having the latest/greatest/lightest and generally "racing" as a pretext for spending money on gear, especially gear that purports to supplant skill. So yeah, with the bestest disc brakes, suspension, lightweight frames etc. MTB racing is more "accessible", but in fact the skill hurdles have been replaced with financial hurdles.

If CX is still fun, then what's the problem with being a CX traditionalist?


----------



## Kuna

PeanutButterBreath said:


> I was thinking more along the lines of an obsession with having the latest/greatest/lightest and generally "racing" as a pretext for spending money on gear, especially gear that purports to supplant skill. So yeah, with the bestest disc brakes, suspension, lightweight frames etc. MTB racing is more "accessible", but in fact the skill hurdles have been replaced with financial hurdles.
> 
> If CX is still fun, then what's the problem with being a CX traditionalist?


No, you know better then that - you can only buy so much speed (light weight bike) and skill, the rest has to come from practice and training. We all know of guys that don't have the best stuff and can ride like the wind. Nothing is wrong with tradition, but it does get old when it is smacked around here as the "true" and only way to do cyclocross.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

Kuna said:


> No, you know better then that - you can only buy so much speed (light weight bike) and skill, the rest has to come from practice and training. We all know of guys that don't have the best stuff and can ride like the wind.


You can't buy speed, but plenty of people think you can buy cred.



Kuna said:


> Nothing is wrong with tradition, but it does get old when it is smacked around here as the "true" and only way to do cyclocross.


Still not sure why someone would want to innovate, but be concerned about the opinions of traditionalists. Don't they make a carbon fiber widget for that by now?


----------



## 88 rex

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Still not sure why someone would want to innovate, but be concerned about the opinions of traditionalists.


I think its more that traditionalists are concerned about the innovators. If all CX racers were as whiney as the "traditionalists" on this forum then going to a CX race would truly suck all the fun out of the sport. Fortunately, I know that the whiners are truly a minority, and even the guys who are not a fan of discs typically don't care all that much what someone else is riding. I'm pretty sure if we lined up together we would get along just fine.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

This thread went from a fair request to right terminology and better forum placement to a silly jokes / snobbery thread.....

Just ride the bike, on races, trail or wherever you want.


----------



## Coolhand

Salsa_Lover said:


> This thread went from a fair request to right terminology and better forum placement to a silly jokes / snobbery thread.....


Mission Accomplished!


----------



## Dajianshan

*That's not a Cyclocross bike... This is a Cyclocross bike!*

How I see this thread:


----------



## Coolhand

A guy who more "cross" than any of us weighs in:



> The change is exciting to Stu Thorne, owner of cyclocrossworld.com and director and mechanic for the Cannondale-Cyclocrossworld.com team.
> 
> “Technically, I think it would be kind of cool,” Thorne said. “I’d like to work with someone to make a tidy little hydraulic disc brake for ‘cross.”
> 
> Thorne said the weight penalty could be minor and the brakes could be an advantage in some conditions. The use of discs in cyclocross also could lead to the development of brakes that would have road bike applications.
> 
> Read more: http://velonews.competitor.com/2010...barriers-ban-wider-tires_122744#ixzz0rlnQdHc8


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

> Thorne said the weight penalty could be minor. . .


EuroX Mags weight 103g per wheel. Super-light rotors alone are in the 80-90g range, IIRC.


----------



## 88 rex

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Super-light rotors alone are in the 80-90g range, IIRC.



160 AiRotors are about 80g, and the 140's are about 68g. And they are reasonably priced at $25 per rotor. 

I've never used a 140 front and I'm just wondering if 140 front would be adequate enough.


----------



## OnTheRivet

Dajianshan said:


> How I see this thread:


Now that's funny.


----------



## jmoote

88 rex said:


> 160 AiRotors are about 80g, and the 140's are about 68g. And they are reasonably priced at $25 per rotor.
> 
> I've never used a 140 front and I'm just wondering if 140 front would be adequate enough.


I'd be more worried about 140s being _too much_ on either end. Remember it's a 33mm tire you have to work with - there's only so much traction. 160 front / 140 rear is plenty for 2.2" mtb tires...


----------



## the mayor

jmoote said:


> I'd be more worried about 140s being _too much_ on either end. Remember it's a 33mm tire you have to work with - there's only so much traction. 160 front / 140 rear is plenty for 2.2" mtb tires...


BINGO!
The disc Cannondale cross bike I had had 160 rotors....and they could over power the tires. Add in the poor modulation of the brakes back then...
What ever....the light frames aren't available yet.
the light brakes aren't available yet.
And there is going to be the mounting/rotor size/rear spacing fubar.
But when it all get's worked out...I'm cashing in my 401K for 2 new frames, a bunch of wheels and 2 DI3 hydro disc groupos...and pray I don't live past 60.


----------



## 88 rex

jmoote said:


> I'd be more worried about 140s being _too much_ on either end. Remember it's a 33mm tire you have to work with - there's only so much traction. 160 front / 140 rear is plenty for 2.2" mtb tires...



I have 160's f/r on my CX bike and no problems with road or CX tires.


----------



## Todd_H

Salsa_Lover said:


> This thread went from a fair request to right terminology and better forum placement to a silly jokes / snobbery thread.....
> 
> Just ride the bike, on races, trail or wherever you want.



Good point, but sometimes there is confusion between questions regarding "best options for CX", and what is good for CX racing and it hard to differentiate the intent of the OP. It doesn't bother me and I usually just ignore posts not pertaining to CX racing since this is my main interest. It's not hard.

CX on this forum is big enough for a CX_racing sub forum I think.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

maybe we need 3 subforums


General Cyclocross discussion
Cyclocross Equipement/Wrenching
Cyclocross Racing/Pro Racing discussion

Like this all what is related with "real" cyclocross racing go on the right forum, all what is related with frames/forks/cantis/disks etc go on the Equipement forum and the rest on the general forum.

can't that be done ?


----------



## Dajianshan

That seems pretty complicated. 

I know this may sound crazy, but what if people use editorial control and don't respond to threads that don't interest them or apply to them? I don't see how a question on a tire for road and dirt will infect other threads and make the racing bikes perform worse.


----------



## deuxdiesel

I feel really bad for the OP having to pour through each and every thread to see if there is any mention on rack braze-ons, triple cranks or even the possibility of a tire more than 35 mm. Certainly I should have my (few) medals removed because I made the podium in "C's" using a 38 mm front once, and a mountain cassette another time. We need to be diligent to make sure we are looking ever forward towards smooth courses that require no dismounting so that these road bikes with canti brakes that are sold as 'cross bikes can have every advantage. At the same time, we need to make sure nobody on a 'cross bike ever races in a MTB race and podiums. Oh yeah, did that too...

LIGHTEN UP, FRANCIS.


----------



## OnTheRivet

deuxdiesel said:


> I feel really bad for the OP having to pour through each and every thread to see if there is any mention on rack braze-ons, triple cranks or even the possibility of a tire more than 35 mm. Certainly I should have my (few) medals removed because I made the podium in "C's" using a 38 mm front once, and a mountain cassette another time. We need to be diligent to make sure we are looking ever forward towards smooth courses that require no dismounting so that these road bikes with canti brakes that are sold as 'cross bikes can have every advantage. At the same time, we need to make sure nobody on a 'cross bike ever races in a MTB race and podiums. Oh yeah, did that too...
> 
> LIGHTEN UP, FRANCIS.



If you have "podiumed" more than once in C's, a class reserved for begginners you are a sandbagger. Sack up and race the appropriate class.


----------



## wunlap togo

deuxdiesel said:


> We need to be diligent to make sure we are looking ever forward towards smooth courses that require no dismounting so that these road bikes with canti brakes that are sold as 'cross bikes can have every advantage.


Strong brakes don't make you faster at dismounts. You may see some aspects of cx racing change as a result of new braking technology, but the racer's pace through the barriers will not be affected.


----------



## plodderslusk

I am 53 and will probably never race CX, one reason (beside age) being that there are no CX races in my country. I love riding my "CX"-type bike on forestroads and some singletrack.
It is great to ride on almost carfree fireroads and the CX is quite a bit faster than my mountainbike and I like sitting more or less like I sit on my roadbikes. Please let there be room in this subforum for both the strict Cyclocross racing crowd and us who see the CX-bike as a great tool for commuting, training and having a blast outdoors.


----------



## Crank-a-Roo

Not all mountain bikers race and why can't people use a 'cross bike other than racing.


----------



## BadBoyNY

atpjunkie said:


> really great camera placement, beautiful angles. That was a joy to watch. The log stunt was cool but it would have been faster to portage it.


Excellent video and great riding.


----------



## willtsmith_nwi

jmoote said:


> I'm in total agreement, except now we have to allow discussion of what is legal, so disc brakes are in and tires >33mm are out. Word is some of the big teams/sponsors have disc equipped bikes in the works, so like it or not we'll have to accept this as part of cross.
> 
> But yes, touring bikes, commuters, mtbs and their like are better discussed in other forums and do add to the clutter around here.


Moot is true since this only applies to Cat1/2 racers and only for UCI sanctioned events. Maybe a CX racing forum will satisfy your segregationist needs.


----------



## willtsmith_nwi

co2cycle said:


> since almost all true cyclocross courses only exist for a few hours at a time, is racing the only way to truly do cyclocross?
> 
> is there some other term for riding in a cyclocross-ish manner when not racing? (and don't say "training")


Amen brother. There are cyclocrossing and cyclocross racing. The idea that CX racer running over 2x12s define a segment of cycling is ridiculous. The idea behind a CX bike is a road bike that can do light duty off road tasks. It's about versatility and practicality. 

The enthusiast racers have been and will ALWAYS be a minority of cyclists in ANY discipline.


----------



## OnTheRivet

willtsmith_nwi said:


> Amen brother. There are cyclocrossing and cyclocross racing. The idea that CX racer running over 2x12s define a segment of cycling is ridiculous. The idea behind a CX bike is a road bike that can do light duty off road tasks. It's about versatility and practicality.
> 
> The enthusiast racers have been and will ALWAYS be a minority of cyclists in ANY discipline.


Wait, what? "Cyclocrossing" are you serious, hehehehehehe. Cyclocross started as a form of racing, period. It is and will remain the reason for cyclocross bikes. You can adapt the bikes for other stuff but that certainly isn't "cyclocross".


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

willtsmith_nwi said:


> Amen brother. There are cyclocrossing and cyclocross racing. The idea that CX racer running over 2x12s define a segment of cycling is ridiculous. The idea behind a CX bike is a road bike that can do light duty off road tasks. It's about versatility and practicality.


That's a genuine tour-de-force of wrongness you pulled off there.


----------



## old_fuji

So...if I wanted to ask a question about building up a touring frame into a cyclocross bike, where should I ask?


----------



## PaleAleYum

old_fuji said:


> So...if I wanted to ask a question about building up a touring frame into a cyclocross bike, where should I ask?



Simple.

The wheels and tires forum. But since you are here, I'll save you the time of reposting your question. 

I'd throw a couple of Michelin Mud 2s on the 'ol Rivendell. Then you'd have a first class cyclocrosser bicycle, whatever that term means.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

old_fuji said:


> So...if I wanted to ask a question about building up a touring frame into a cyclocross bike, where should I ask?


If into a cyclocross bike, the cyclocross forum. As opposed to, for example, questions about credit card touring on a Colnago Cross Prestige, which can be better answered in the touring forum.


----------



## DLMKA

It's kind of funny that the Salsa La Cruz is being advertised above this thread. 
"Steel. Disc only. Cross."


----------



## Salsa_Lover

BTW that add keeps poping up but the La Cruz has been discontinued long ago... even the link on the banner is invalid


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

Salsa_Lover said:


> BTW that add keeps poping up but the La Cruz has been discontinued long ago... even the link on the banner is invalid


I think I have seen the La Cruz mentioned due to the irony of that banner ad at least as often as I have heard it mentioned for any other reason.


----------



## davidka

OnTheRivet said:


> Wait, what? "Cyclocrossing" are you serious, hehehehehehe. Cyclocross started as a form of racing, period. It is and will remain the reason for cyclocross bikes. You can adapt the bikes for other stuff but that certainly isn't "cyclocross".


 Most cyclocross bikes sold are never raced, nor were they purchased with the intention of being raced. I bet if you could find out how many CX bikes are sold per year it would eclipse the number of yearly USCF CX licenses issued a few times over.


----------



## OnTheRivet

davidka said:


> Most cyclocross bikes sold are never raced, nor were they purchased with the intention of being raced. I bet if you could find out how many CX bikes are sold per year it would eclipse the number of yearly USCF CX licenses issued a few times over.


Which goes back to my original statement. When is a cyclocross bike not a cyclocross bike? When it's actually a commuter/drop bar 29er/touring bike. Maybe it's manufacturers fault for labeling anything with 700c wheels, drop bars and knobbies a cyclocross bike. I honestly don't care what people ride but it's amusing to hear the commuter/touring/fireroad crowd come on this forum and complain that manufacturers should make their "cyclocross" bikes with disc brake and rack mounts and the ability to fit 45mm tires. The reality is that people that don't race just like to say they have a cyclocross bike because of the association, almost always telling their friends "ya, I'm going to race it this year" when in fact they never do...you can't imagine how many times I've heard this and I don't give a **** if people race, heck I go through periods when I think racing is stupid (mostly when I'm sucking). Admit it, saying you have a cyclocross bike is so much cooler than saying "dude check out my sweet new commuter/touring bike." By the way, building up a new carbon race bike this season and converting my old one into a sweet commuter bike........where's that forum again? :thumbsup:


----------



## Dajianshan

A steak knife ain't a steak knife until you cut steak with it. A running shoe is just a shoe until you run in it... forbid if you run in your loafers.


----------



## OnTheRivet

Dajianshan said:


> A steak knife ain't a steak knife until you cut steak with it. A running shoe is just a shoe until you run in it... forbid if you run in your loafers.


Nope, but don't go on a running forum and complain that your $150.00 racing flats suck as work shoes and that Nike needs to add more material to make them stop better on the shop floor.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

OnTheRivet said:


> By the way, building up a new carbon race bike this season and converting my old one into a sweet commuter bike........where's that forum again? :thumbsup:


post pics.... ( put them on the right forum, off course )


----------



## Dajianshan

Don't post here until after your first race. Prior to your first race it is just a corbon commuter.


----------



## Coolhand

Dajianshan said:


> Don't post here until after your first race. Prior to your first race it is just a corbon commuter.


Cyclocross = racing.
Cyclocross *bikes* = good at lots of stuff. 

The lower end cross bikes tend to be do it all bikes (fender and rack mounts, ect), while the top end is pure racing goodness.


----------



## Dajianshan

:thumbsup:


----------



## jeffl_

PaleAleYum said:


> Simple.
> Michelin Mud 2s on the 'ol Rivendell. Then you'd have a first class cyclocrosser bicycle, whatever that term means.


yep.


----------



## physasst

OnTheRivet said:


> Wow, you're really on top of things genius. This whole thing started because of that rule change and the previous discussions regarding it. My post was mostly tongue in cheek but considering the idiots who got butt hurt from it I'm starting to think it's a good idea.
> 
> By the way, it must suck having to to tell your friends that your rad cyclocross bike is actually a Touring bike, the shame.



Anyone who uses the term "rad" in a conversation loses their man card forever.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

"Rad" means "wheel" in German and Fah*rad* is a bicycle.... 

"rád" means "likeing" in Czech and "mam *rád*" means "I like"

so in a nutshell *rad *evokes *I like bycicles *to me


----------



## willtsmith_nwi

Dajianshan said:


> A steak knife ain't a steak knife until you cut steak with it. A running shoe is just a shoe until you run in it... forbid if you run in your loafers.


Yes but when you run on it without racing, it's still a running shoe. When I Cross-Check through trails, it's a CX bike ... even though I ride through trails on 35c slicks with fenders. And ... lots of people ride CX in Combat Boots ... errr ... mountain bikes.


----------



## willtsmith_nwi

PeanutButterBreath said:


> That's a genuine tour-de-force of wrongness you pulled off there.


Well, then why don't you tell us what Cyclocross racing is about? Or is it just as meaningless as your position?


----------



## physasst

Salsa_Lover said:


> "Rad" means "wheel" in German and Fah*rad* is a bicycle....
> 
> "rád" means "likeing" in Czech and "mam *rád*" means "I like"
> 
> so in a nutshell *rad *evokes *I like bycicles *to me



Well, it just makes me think of that horrific movie from the 80's...

Which I liked when I was 14, which was at that time....just an outdated term...Sounds silly coming from an adult.


----------



## terry b

Is this a cyclocross bike or not? They told me it was when I ordered it. It says "Psychlo" on the top tube, I assumed that was some sort of play on "cyclo." I need validation, I hope I'm not riding the wrong kind of bike.


----------



## deuxdiesel

You are in the wrong forum because your bike is dressed to tour with all that stuff including the frame pump. No "real" cyclo-crosser would ever put that junk on their steed. Go over to the touring section, poseur.

See how bad that sounds? Original CX bikes were cobbled together from other bikes to provide off-season training rigs for Euro roadies, but the prevailing belief that it's only a true 'crosser if it's purpose built as such makes me ill. Your bike is sweet, and like a true 'cross bike, it will be able to serve many purposes, from touring, to commuting, to the occasional crit, and of course CX races. 

You are in the correct forum- it's all about the motor, not the bike.


----------



## PeanutButterBreath

terry b said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike or not? They told me it was when I ordered it. It says "Psychlo" on the top tube, I assumed that was some sort of play on "cyclo." I need validation, I hope I'm not riding the wrong kind of bike.


Take it up with Moots:



> *A true classic cross design* with no feature left out. Over the hears our cross design has been *refined through field testing by the best racers* in the world in the worst of *race conditions*; rain, snow, sleet and plenty of MUD! These conditions demand the best in equipment and design. *From top to bottom this rig has only high level cross racing in its mind.* Ample chain ring and tire clearance are a must, responsive handling and acceleration are a premium. All are nailed to perfection with the Psyclo X. Whether on your shoulder or under pedal, the Psychlo X delivers in the best. . . and worst of conditions.


http://moots.com/?#/product/bicycles/road_+_speciality/psychlo-x/

Emphasis added, no references to commuting, touring or crit racing intentionally removed.

Use it for whatever you like to use it for. If that includes CX, tell us about it on the CX forum.

FWIW, I would also be interested in stories of people racing CX on Vittoria Open Corsa EVO *CX* tires, especially while riding a Colnago *CX*-1


----------



## terry b

deuxdiesel said:


> You are in the wrong forum because your bike is dressed to tour with all that stuff including the frame pump. No "real" cyclo-crosser would ever put that junk on their steed. Go over to the touring section, poseur.
> 
> See how bad that sounds? Original CX bikes were cobbled together from other bikes to provide off-season training rigs for Euro roadies, but the prevailing belief that it's only a true 'crosser if it's purpose built as such makes me ill. Your bike is sweet, and like a true 'cross bike, it will be able to serve many purposes, from touring, to commuting, to the occasional crit, and of course CX races.
> 
> You are in the correct forum- it's all about the motor, not the bike.


Phew - your first paragraph had me really depressed because while those Communiting/Touring folks like my ride reports, they said they don't want to see any more pictures of that cross bike of mine. And then you welcome me with open arms - I appreciate that.


----------



## terry b

PeanutButterBreath said:


> Use it for whatever you like to use it for. If that includes CX, tell us about it on the CX forum.


It's rarely without a solid coat of mud, I ride some pretty crappy roads over here. Here's my riding buddy Dermot on a typical descent.


----------



## OnTheRivet

terry b said:


> It's rarely without a solid coat of mud, I ride some pretty crappy roads over here. Here's my riding buddy Dermot on a typical descent.


Why is he walking?


----------



## terry b

OnTheRivet said:


> Why is he walking?


Because where I am standing to take the shot is a field of unrideable boulders.


----------



## moschika

but i like my 35's.


----------



## drejr1

Now not only is it UCI legal, but now actually available!!!!
AND in Ti!
http://www.lynskeyperformance.com/a/pages/promotional-specials/cooper-cx-complete.php


----------



## OnTheRivet

drejr1 said:


> Now not only is it UCI legal, but now actually available!!!!
> AND in Ti!
> http://www.lynskeyperformance.com/a/pages/promotional-specials/cooper-cx-complete.php



Hate to break it to you people were making Disc cross frames way before you guys....and in Ti. When someone wins an elite race on one of your frames then I'll be impressed, until then it's just another overpriced commuter frame.


----------



## il sogno

Salsa_Lover said:


> So this doesn't count ?


I like the dog in the background.


----------



## davidka

OnTheRivet said:


> When someone wins an elite race on one of your frames then I'll be impressed, until then it's just another overpriced commuter frame.


Because a frame is completely worthless until it wins an elite race?


----------



## OnTheRivet

davidka said:


> Because a frame is completely worthless until it wins an elite race?



Well, isn't that what he was implying with the UCI legal stuff, because that's what the rule change is about, disc brakes allowed in UCI elites?


----------



## Quattro_Assi_07

Dajianshan said:


> That seems pretty complicated.
> 
> I know this may sound crazy, but what if people use editorial control and don't respond to threads that don't interest them or apply to them? I don't see how a question on a tire for road and dirt will infect other threads and make the racing bikes perform worse.


+1 ...starting to sound like high school all over again.


----------



## perttime

You must also ban sloping top tubes here!

edit:
missed a few pages of this thread before posting...


----------



## Dion

terry b said:


> It's rarely without a solid coat of mud, I ride some pretty crappy roads over here. Here's my riding buddy Dermot on a typical descent.


That's rideable!

I would like to corrupt this thread with my rigid drop-bar 29'er FTW.


----------



## umarth

OnTheRivet said:


> Wait, what? "Cyclocrossing" are you serious, hehehehehehe. Cyclocross started as a form of racing, period. It is and will remain the reason for cyclocross bikes. You can adapt the bikes for other stuff but that certainly isn't "cyclocross".


Cyclocross started as a form of training. Because it was fun and it worked well for developing fitness, it evolved into organized racing. So I at least agree that cyclocross (unfortunately) is tied to racing.

Sucks though, because I have this bike (admittedly, an old touring frame, but I don't have a ton of scratch) with cantis, dirt drop that I only use for 20-30 mile loops once or twice a week that have fireroads, singletrack and pavement. Now I don't know what to call it.


----------



## dlighthall

Are we having fun yet? Maybe we should all be out training instead! 
Did anyone mention that discs have been ok'd by the UCI for cross? Those bastards! In addition to my racing Ridley that is a real cross bike, I have a Voodoo Wahoo that came with a 50/40/30 touring triple (bad spec Voodoo!) because I was not planning on racing it but riding on mountain trails and roads. I went with SRAM XO and flat bars, and switched out the crappy Avid Shorties for Avid V brakes. I run 45 c tires sometimes and 30 c others, depending on the course. I call it my mountain cross bike and I was wondering if maybe there were enough other iconoclasts like me to start a Mountain Cross forum. Or maybe a Wimpy Rigid 29er forum?


----------



## Slonie

terry b said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike or not? They told me it was when I ordered it. It says "Psychlo" on the top tube, I assumed that was some sort of play on "cyclo." I need validation, I hope I'm not riding the wrong kind of bike.


Definitely not... I mean, a true race rig doesn't have bottle cage bosses. I guess you'll have to try again...

(Just kidding, obviously, sweet bike and sorry to everyone for contributing to the continuation of this thread!)


----------



## Killroy

You forgot *Flat Bar*! ...

My *Cross Bike* has both a flat bar AND disc brakes. 

Soon disc brakes will be the norm for CX, just like they are in CX Mountian Bike racing.


----------



## misterdangerpants

Dion said:


> I would like to corrupt this thread with my rigid drop-bar 29'er FTW.


:thumbsup: 

I'm going to see how this feels next season (my Igleheart 953 650B SS):

View attachment 226819


----------



## Opus51569

misterdangerpants said:


> :thumbsup:
> 
> I'm going to see how this feels next season (my Igleheart 953 650B SS):
> 
> View attachment 226819


I'm certainly no expert, but I think you're going to find it hard to ride without a chain and at least one cog in back...


----------



## misterdangerpants

Opus51569 said:


> I'm certainly no expert, but I think you're going to find it hard to ride without a chain and at least one cog in back...


....or brakes!


----------



## Johnson

*Good luck with that, Sparky*

I come to the Cyclocross forum more to learn about cyclocross _bikes_, and all of their various models and uses, than to read about cyclocross _racing_. Commuting, touring, off-road etc., their versatility is very interesting and I'm always looking to learn more. This has been a good place for that, and if y'all keep posting, I'll keep reading.

Far as I'm concerned, racing is just one aspect of the Cyclocross forum, and one I tend to ignore. For now at least.


----------



## kalare

Johnson said:


> I come to the Cyclocross forum more to learn about cyclocross _bikes_, and all of their various models and uses, than to read about cyclocross _racing_. Commuting, touring, off-road etc., their versatility is very interesting and I'm always looking to learn more. This has been a good place for that, and if y'all keep posting, I'll keep reading.
> 
> Far as I'm concerned, racing is just one aspect of the Cyclocross forum, and one I tend to ignore. For now at least.



Yep...the title of the sub-forum does not read "cyclocross racing". That's like saying over at MTBR in the 29er forum, we should only be talking about 29ers that are racing...seems a little dumb don't you think? Language and terms, like anything else, evolve, whether you like it or not. "Cyclocross" has come to mean all bikes that fit within a certain catagory, and it just so happens to include most of the things in the list at the beginning of this thread. Telling people they should be posting in commuter or touring sub-forums is not going to help anyone out. Perhaps these people ride on the dirt 70% of the time...commuters and tourers do not do this, as such they'll get the most help (from at least the helpful members) in the cyclocross forum. Seriously...like someone said earlier, it definately seems like some people are turning cross into the elitist group that many road cyclists fall into. 

Oh well. I'll just go have some more fun in the disc brake thread. I hope it gets larger and drags on with more examples of pro level bikes with discs on them. 

And give it enough time, CX with disc bike will hit the podium, again, whever you like it or not.


----------



## d2p

From merriam-webster.com online dictionary – 

Definition of CYCLO-CROSS
: the sport of racing bicycles over rough terrain that usually requires carrying the bicycle over obstacles 
Origin of CYCLO-CROSS
French, from cyclo + cross-country (from English) 
First Known Use: 1953


----------



## kalare

d2p said:


> From merriam-webster.com online dictionary –
> 
> Definition of CYCLO-CROSS
> : the sport of racing bicycles over rough terrain that usually requires carrying the bicycle over obstacles
> Origin of CYCLO-CROSS
> French, from cyclo + cross-country (from English)
> First Known Use: 1953



You are absolutely correct, that is what's in the dictionary...which is why i said it has "come to mean". In any case, if you want to take it by the book, then NOBODY should have any problems if people start coming in here talking about using MTB's for cross racing...and I seriously doubt that the same people complaining about discs and fat tires will want this either. As I said above...seems to be turning into a snobby sport, exactly what cyclocross wasn't in the first place. 

I can very easily go into the downhill section on MTBR and talk about any bike I want to throw down a hill, whether it be a tiny hill a giant one, a hardtail or full squish...and nobody will tell me, "that'd not a DH bike, get outta here". 

Instead of complaining about people muddling up "your" forums, why not just not read the posts, move on, and be very glad that the sport of cyclocross has gotten more people excited about our common interest...cycling.


----------



## Pablo

d2p said:


> From merriam-webster.com online dictionary –
> 
> Definition of CYCLO-CROSS
> : the sport of racing bicycles over rough terrain that usually requires carrying the bicycle over obstacles
> Origin of CYCLO-CROSS
> French, from cyclo + cross-country (from English)
> First Known Use: 1953


So the Merriam-Webster.com online dictionary, a general massive publication, is the authority to define a niche sport? Interesting, especially since my understanding is that cross predates 1953.


----------



## 88 rex

Pablo said:


> So the Merriam-Webster.com online dictionary, a general massive publication, is the authority to define a niche sport? Interesting, especially since my understanding is that cross predates 1953.



My understanding from the online M-W entry is that 1953 is the claimed first use of the term cyclo-cross, not the sport itself. I have no idea on it's accuracy. Was CX called something else? Steeplechase? It was a steeple to steeple type event.


----------



## Salsa_Lover

Cycloross ?


----------



## BearSquirrel

Johnson said:


> I come to the Cyclocross forum more to learn about cyclocross _bikes_, and all of their various models and uses, than to read about cyclocross _racing_. Commuting, touring, off-road etc., their versatility is very interesting and I'm always looking to learn more. This has been a good place for that, and if y'all keep posting, I'll keep reading.
> 
> Far as I'm concerned, racing is just one aspect of the Cyclocross forum, and one I tend to ignore. For now at least.


Good for you. Instead of berating others for not sharing your narrow view, why not just read what you're interested in and move on.

There are plenty of CX races in the US that allow the US that allow "UCI Mountain Bikes" to be raced in lower categories. So by your definition, the amateurs here should be talking about their MTBs for cyclocross racing. I got news for you, there will always be more folks fiddling on the margins with multi-function equipment than those with expensive/dedicated special purpose equipment.

Of course as others have pointed out, discs are now UCI legal in all categories. Though they have ratched down on tires (which is a disappointment to me). But in those MTB classes, you can still rock 45c tires, on frankensteads or run a monster-cross bike.

Maybe we should lobby for a sub-forum for you, "Jerkweed, elitist, CX racers". Either that or make another forum for road/off-road hybrids without snobby jerkweed CX racers.


----------



## d2p

dont you feel a bit silly calling people "jerkweed"? 

you should.


----------



## Killroy

I love to hate bike snobery that is not inline with my bike snobery. 

Whine all you want. Its the internet.

EX

"Sun glass frames go outside the helmet straps."


----------



## Johnson

BearSquirrel said:


> Good for you. Instead of berating others for not sharing your narrow view, why not just read what you're interested in and move on.
> 
> There are plenty of CX races in the US that allow the US that allow "UCI Mountain Bikes" to be raced in lower categories. So by your definition, the amateurs here should be talking about their MTBs for cyclocross racing. I got news for you, there will always be more folks fiddling on the margins with multi-function equipment than those with expensive/dedicated special purpose equipment.
> 
> Of course as others have pointed out, discs are now UCI legal in all categories. Though they have ratched down on tires (which is a disappointment to me). But in those MTB classes, you can still rock 45c tires, on frankensteads or run a monster-cross bike.
> 
> Maybe we should lobby for a sub-forum for you, "Jerkweed, elitist, CX racers". Either that or make another forum for road/off-road hybrids without snobby jerkweed CX racers.


Is this about my post, or the OP's? Just curious.


----------



## OnTheRivet

Peanut butter sandwich......wait, what?


----------



## PaleAleYum

Johnson said:


> Is this about my post, or the OP's?


All internet pissing contests regarding cx should be settled with the appropriate venue. 

Whether that be by pinning on a number for a cx race, the local Wed AM worlds, or the dirt pathway on your way to work each day. 


Seems like some folks are more interested in polemics than bikes.


----------



## d2p

interestingly enough "polemic" is the name of a new model from Ridley . . .


----------



## Maximus_XXIV

But does it have disc brakes?


----------



## Ol' Dirty Biker

This isn't a Cyclocross bike (yet):


----------



## raganwald

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


I sympathize with what you're trying to accomplish, which is to suggest that discussion about cyclocross bikes belongs in the cyclocross forum, and discussion of commuters, MTBs, tourers, hipster fixes, and whatever else belongs elsewhere.

However...

Cyclocross is defined by more than just its bicycle regulations, it's also defined by the race rules. If someone is riding an MTB at a citizen's race, he may have questions about pedals that shed mud after a run-up, or the correct scissor technique for dismounting. These are cyclocross questions.

Come to think of it, if said MTB rider is using flat pedals, he may have barrier bunny-hop secrets to share. I say encourage him to participate in the forums!


----------



## krisdrum

By far my favorite RBR thread. It is just hysterical to read the pantybunching going down on both sides of the fence and the ire Rivet created. I'm sure he is sitting at home laughing his @ss off, I know I am.


----------



## tamjam

Just sayin'

click


----------



## vaultbrad

Cyclocross bike?


----------



## OnTheRivet

vaultbrad said:


> Cyclocross bike?


Your frame is too big for you.


----------



## vaultbrad

Why do you say that? Sincerely curious. Since it doesn't make sense for me at the moment to have a pure racing machine, I wanted a bike that would be comfortable for any riding I wanted to do and decided on the 62 after much deliberation and research. I was under the impression that when traditionally shaped(level top tube) frames were the right size, the rider would have a fist or a little more(obviously varying from rider to rider) of seatpost above the top tube. My saddle was a bit too low at the time of the pic, but not too much. I've got four or five inches of standover clearance, but don't have very long arms for my height. Feel pretty comfortable on the 62.


----------



## DarkSaturn

Mine clearly isn't a CX bike (disc brakes and flat pedals)










It's a Canadian commuter bike, which has similar functional requirements to a CX bike.


----------



## Kram

Oh, I wuff this thread....


----------



## davidka

vaultbrad said:


> Why do you say that? Sincerely curious. Since it doesn't make sense for me at the moment to have a pure racing machine, I wanted a bike that would be comfortable for any riding I wanted to do and decided on the 62 after much deliberation and research. I was under the impression that when traditionally shaped(level top tube) frames were the right size, the rider would have a fist or a little more(obviously varying from rider to rider) of seatpost above the top tube. My saddle was a bit too low at the time of the pic, but not too much. I've got four or five inches of standover clearance, but don't have very long arms for my height. Feel pretty comfortable on the 62.


The only "odd" thing I see is the very short stem. Road/Cross geometry bikes can get a little wierd with really short stems due to the front wheel not being weighted adequately. It's a really cool looking bike, looks like it'd be a lot of fun to ride.


----------



## pretender

davidka said:


> The only "odd" thing I see is the very short stem. Road/Cross geometry bikes can get a little wierd with really short stems due to the front wheel not being weighted adequately. It's a really cool looking bike, looks like it'd be a lot of fun to ride.


With dirtdrops you're meant to be in the hooks most of the time, plenty far forward in this case. The bike looks like a good fit to me.


----------



## AndrwSwitch

Bumping this thread.

Because sometimes, I'm "that guy" too.


----------



## perttime

Anyway, who cares if it is a cyclocross bike or not?

... unless you are running a race and had to read the rule book ...


----------



## deuxdiesel

OnTheRivet is probably disgruntled, having been beat by a MTB at a cross race. I know when I got beat by several, my thought was "I should train harder" not "they should ban those bikes".


----------



## gregnash

LOL.. as a new-comer here this has been a fun/interesting thread to read..


----------



## Gus90

Are those official rules for cx bikes or just an opinion?


----------



## Gus90

I'll post a pic of my modified cannondale bad boy once i have enough posts for these crazy forum rules. Why 10 posts. Guess I have to think of 10 things to post before getting to the good stuff.


----------



## C Cow

*Thread That Won't Die*

Amazing, this is still going? When I read the first entries 5 years ago, it was entertaining. Some insecure participants, some smart humorists, some people who can spell, and many of us laughing at your expense.

Cyclocross is a sport that evolved from non-cx bikes (of course there weren't any cx bikes, the sport was new!). The bikes evolved from personal performance ideas. What bikes were around back then? Road bikes. The evolution began with what was available, to the people who decided this sport was fun. 

We, CXers, owe our appreciation to those brave souls who tried something different. But now, with this thread, a non-dreamer and "its" definition of what we should ride has pissed all over those that braved ridicule by starting the sport. 

"Viva la Conformity"? He11 no! Ride whatever you want to ride, be yourself, be the person who starts a new bike sport!

Now, where's my old banana seat schwinn?

Moo!


----------



## Magsdad

Gus90 said:


> Guess I have to think of 10 things to post before getting to the good stuff.


That's what the lounge is for! 

(Beware PO)


----------



## perttime

C Cow said:


> What bikes were around back then? Road bikes. The evolution began with what was available, to the people who decided this sport was fun.


Road bikes weren't quite the same back then either. 

My father in law was a strong road and track racer some decades ago. They used to do training rides on their road bikes ... often on dirt roads and even forest trails.


----------



## AndrwSwitch

My experience of this forum is that it's people using 'cross bikes for commuting that people object to, while it's quite welcoming of people using touring bikes for 'cross.

Really, who needs $1500+ worth of race hardware to get to work??


----------



## C Cow

AndrwSwitch said:


> Really, who needs $1500+ worth of race hardware to get to work??


..................................
Who really needs $1500+ worth of race hardware to race cx?

Moo?


----------



## PaleAleYum

C Cow said:


> ..................................
> Who really needs $1500+ worth of race hardware to race cx?
> 
> Moo?


I'll bite and say I do.

But that includes two bikes, race fees, gas, beer and a long list of IOUs to the wife for a long season.


----------



## AndrwSwitch

Actually my 'cross rig is well under $1500, even with post-purchase additions and replacements.

But it makes more sense to me to spend a lot on a competition bike. I can't shift my commuter bike while sprinting or climbing out of the saddle. OMG, it's not like I need to be able to respond to attacks. If I ever put in the work to get myself out of Cat. 4, I might think about bolting some more money to the 'cross rig. Certainly the bike I race semi-seriously, my MTB, has acquired a few tuning parts of the years.


----------



## MarvinK

Disc brakes were only illegal for elite UCI races... was this forum only for elite racers? Are the rest of us just fortunate enough that the UCI has embraced technology even faster than some of these forum members?


----------



## d2p

ol Rivet lit the flame that keepz on burning


----------



## tarwheel2

Is this a cyclocross bike?


----------



## perttime

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


Whatever...

it looks like it could be a good size for me. Is it for sale?


----------



## AndrwSwitch

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


Just strip the extra crap off it and go racing. 

I think half my 'cross-racing teammates have fenders and bottle cages on their 'cross bikes during the rest of the season.


----------



## JeffS

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


Rhetorical question I'm assuming, as we all know the answer, even without the mirror.


----------



## OnTheRivet

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


What bike are you refering to, the blue one, or the second bike you have in that seatbag?


----------



## tarwheel2

Not for sale. It's a 56 cm Salsa Casseroll that's my main commuter bike. Photo taken while riding on the New River Trail, VA.

My question was in jest but not entirely rhetorical as the Casseroll seems like it could be used as a cross bike since it has canti brakes and can handle larger tires. But I have no plans to CX race, so it is rhetorical in that sense.


----------



## pretender

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


Cross bikes don't run cables under the top tube.


----------



## RoadSwag

ontherivet said:


> what bike are you refering to, the blue one, or the second bike you have in that seatbag?


... Lol


----------



## tihsepa

tarwheel2 said:


> Is this a cyclocross bike?


Uh, no. It's a damn nice touring bike though.


----------



## turbogrover

deuxdiesel said:


> OnTheRivet is probably disgruntled, having been beat by a MTB at a cross race. I know when I got beat by several, my thought was "I should train harder" not "they should ban those bikes".


No, you just don't get the point of this thread.
Think of how this forum "should" be used.


----------



## 88 rex

turbogrover said:


> No, you just don't get the point of this thread.
> Think of how this forum "should" be used.


Was the point of the thread to show how "friendly" cross folks really are? How "care free" they can be and how they aren't snobby roadies?

From experience, I've met lots of great folks at all disciplines of cycling. This forum most certainly doesn't reflect what I've encountered in real life. People on here are just pissy and grumpy if you aren't riding a bike just like them.


----------



## perttime

88 rex said:


> From experience, I've met lots of great folks at all disciplines of cycling. This forum most certainly doesn't reflect what I've encountered in real life. People on here are just pissy and grumpy if you aren't riding a bike just like them.


True, it is much easier to be pissy and grumpy on the interwebs, not to speak about how easy it is to misunderstand the other guy and escalate things when you are just typing on a keyboard, instead of chatting face to face. 

That is the Curse of the Internet.


----------



## turbogrover

perttime said:


> True, it is much easier to be pissy and grumpy on the interwebs, not to speak about how easy it is to misunderstand the other guy and escalate things when you are just typing on a keyboard, instead of chatting face to face.
> 
> That is the Curse of the Internet.


Absolutely! :thumbsup:

Now if people would learn that they would get better responses from posting questions in the appropriate forum, maybe *They* wouldn't be so pissy about the responses they *DO* recieve from this forum.


----------



## 88 rex

turbogrover said:


> Absolutely! :thumbsup:
> 
> Now if people would learn that they would get better responses from posting questions in the appropriate forum, maybe *They* wouldn't be so pissy about the responses they *DO* recieve from this forum.


Folks are more than welcome to exercise their right to ignore threads and posts that they don't find of interest.


----------



## turbogrover

88 rex said:


> Folks are more than welcome to exercise their right to ignore threads and posts that they don't find of interest.


And I do that as well. But if there are enough threads started that should be posted elsewhere, it pushes the relevant threads away where you cant see them any longer. That leads to re-posts, and more clutter, etc...
I don't see the big deal in asking to keep the cx forum for cx specific questions. It seems like a logical no-brainer to me.

If someone posts a pic of their touring bike,and asks what he should do to make it more cx-race worthy, I'm sure he would get a worthwhile response, since it is indeed a cx specific question, for example.

There are better forums available for questions about how to tune your disc brakes, the best flat pedals, or fitting fenders.

If you want to race cx with flat bars, fat tires, fenders, and flat pedals, that's your problem, lol! :thumbsup:


----------



## 55x11

OnTheRivet said:


> So to just round up this little love fest, if your bike has any of the following it's NOT a Cyclocross bike, you should be in the Commuter, Touring, guys who wear fluorescent Performance jackets forum or over at the 29'er forum on MTBR. And while your frame may have started out as a proper Cyclocross frame the ignominy of having this crap draped on it is too much and it needs to hide it's shame in another forum.
> 
> 1. Triple crankset.
> 2. Fenders.
> 3. Disc Brakes
> 4. Racks
> 5. Flat Pedals
> 6. Tires larger than 34mm


Rivet, UCI rules say up to 35mm.
For example, check out this noob's cycclocross, err, I mean, "commuter" bike with 700x35 tyres:
www.cyclingnews.com presents Pro Team Tech 2004

Also, disk brakes are now in:
Eurobike 2011: Disc Brakes For Cyclo-cross Taking Off | Cyclingnews.com


----------



## JeffS

55x11 said:


> Rivet, UCI rules say up to 35mm.


Try again.

http://www.usacycling.org/forms/uci/Cyclo-crossRulesModifications.pdf


----------



## ZoomBoy

Unfortunately that photo of Kabush's bike is almost 7 years old. For 2011 UCI says 33mm max. Nice try though....


----------



## elewis

*Stumpjumper Frankencross*

Built out of spare parts from my garage and my 20 year old 
Stumpjumper.


----------



## d2p

you know what happened to the original frankenstein monster dont you?


----------



## jwcurry83

Eurobike 2011: Disc Brakes For Cyclo-cross Taking Off | Cyclingnews.com

OP was definitely picked on as a kid and thus feels the need to omit others from his special club


----------



## deuxdiesel

elewis, your bike is so homely it is beautiful. Enjoy the crap out of it. I hope it thoroughly offends OP.


----------



## 55x11

JeffS said:


> Try again.
> 
> http://www.usacycling.org/forms/uci/Cyclo-crossRulesModifications.pdf


I stand corrected - I guess the UCI keep changing the rules, as a few years ago a lot of riders raced on 35s. Regardless, there are many 700x35 tires that are clearly designed and manufactured specifically for cyclocross, and I bet you wouldn't be able to tell 35mm from 34mm if I showed you a photo of my bike.

I hope original post was an attempt at humor by Rivet, because otherwise it has an element of dooshery (my bike is better than yours type elitism).

I hope you are not a defender of dooshery, are you?


----------



## elewis

*Homely bike*

I have decided to call my bike OP in tribute.


----------



## JeffS

55x11 said:


> I hope you are not a defender of dooshery, are you?



I'm not sure how you'd define dooshery, but I would guess that misinformation and name-calling could qualify - in which case, no... I'm content to call people on their dooshery.


----------

