# 2016 speculation on AR bike updates



## GRC5

I am still saving pennies for a new bike (Felt ar2) and want to make it count. Any thoughts on what, if any, updates Felt will do their ar line for next year?


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## cobra_kai

Considering the AR had a major update in 2014 I doubt there will be drastic frame changes. Probably standard evolutionary improvements to the layup to improve weight, stiffness, compliance slightly. Maybe some minor spec changes to components.

I've got my eye on the AR1 frameset as a serious contender to replace my '06 Roubaix with a racier frame.


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## lagoonakin

Since I just purchased an '14 AR DI2 :thumbsup: I hope they don't make significant changes anytime soon :cryin:


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## cooleshal

While I also just bought an AR FRD this year as well, i think for 2016 you will see direct mount front rim brakes, with a disc brake versions also appearing 2016/17


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## Hyder

2015 Felt AR2 DI2 here.. Came off of a 2011 Cervelo S3.. I love my AR2, +1 would recommend..


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## Superdave3T

cooleshal said:


> While I also just bought an AR FRD this year as well, i think for 2016 you will see direct mount front rim brakes, with a disc brake versions also appearing 2016/17


We won't do direct mount front brakes because it really doesn't make sense from an engineering perspective. Why add a 2nd point of reinforcement needed at the fork crown? The center mount design already has the steerer materials added for structure. Adding two bosses on either side will just result in a heavier less compliant fork. The only "benefit" is the ability to use Shimano's proprietary front brake. I think this is not a worthy trade off.

-SD


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## implicitD

I just googled 2016 felt AR and found the international site listing 2016 early release models: Aero - Felt Bicycles 

Looks like very small changes in components here and there and new (IMO improved) paint schemes. Of course this is the international version so the small changes might be different in the USA release but I imagine this is the extent of any changes we'll see in the US version. Pricing isn't listed though I imagine it will be similar to 2015. The Shimano groupsets are SO inexpensive these days that Felt might be able to drop pricing a tad but these bikes are already priced really well.

Not sure if it's better to buy now or wait. I do like the paint on those 2016 international versions but that could be different on the US ones as well.


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## lagoonakin

Looks like the A3 drew the short straw for '16  It will probably be popular with Oklahoma St. fans


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## cobra_kai

I like the blue accents on the international AR2. From what I see the biggest changes are switching to different handlebars on some models and changing the tires to conti gp4000s. So yeah definitely not huge changes.


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## FeltF75rider

Aluminum AR. Will that come to the states.


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## Superdave3T

implicitD said:


> I just googled 2016 felt AR and found the international site listing 2016 early release models: Aero - Felt Bicycles
> 
> Looks like very small changes in components here and there and new (IMO improved) paint schemes. Of course this is the international version so the small changes might be different in the USA release but I imagine this is the extent of any changes we'll see in the US version. Pricing isn't listed though I imagine it will be similar to 2015. The Shimano groupsets are SO inexpensive these days that Felt might be able to drop pricing a tad but these bikes are already priced really well.
> 
> Not sure if it's better to buy now or wait. I do like the paint on those 2016 international versions but that could be different on the US ones as well.


The USA and International colors and specifications will be shared.
All AR models are upgraded with Conti GP4000II s tires, even the 105 equipped AR5 gets these $80 tire upgrades!
-SD


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## Superdave3T

lagoonakin said:


> Looks like the A3 drew the short straw for '16  It will probably be popular with Oklahoma St. fans


And 
Syracuse Orangemen fans
Miami Hurricanes fans
University of Tennessee fans
University of Florida fans
Auburn University fans
University of Texas fans
Princeton University fans
Oregon State fans
Illinois fans
Dutch fans
Chevy fans
etc
etc
etc


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## Superdave3T

cobra_kai said:


> I like the blue accents on the international AR2. From what I see the biggest changes are switching to different handlebars on some models and changing the tires to conti gp4000s. So yeah definitely not huge changes.


and the AR1
-SD


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## cobra_kai

Felt 2016 road line-up revealed - BikeRadar

Not a whole lot of new information, although the 'living line' philosophy is interesting.


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## Rashadabd

Has anyone found any pricing and spec information for the 2016 Felt AR bikes? Will the AR6 and AR15 be released in the U.S.?


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## Superdave3T

Rashadabd said:


> Has anyone found any pricing and spec information for the 2016 Felt AR bikes? Will the AR6 and AR15 be released in the U.S.?


You dealer should have this information. I don't expect changes for the US distribution channel. ~$2600 for AR5, $3500 for AR3.
AR6 and AR15 will not be purchased by the distributor for sale in the US.

-Dave


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## Rashadabd

SuperdaveFelt said:


> You dealer should have this information. I don't expect changes for the US distribution channel. ~$2600 for AR5, $3500 for AR3.
> AR6 and AR15 will not be purchased by the distributor for sale in the US.
> 
> -Dave


Got it, bummer, but I understand and appreciate the clarification.


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## Rashadabd

My finalist race bikes have been the Cannondale Caad12, Felt AR, Fuji Transonic, and Giant Propel Advanced. As I get more and more information about the specs, pricing, and what people that own the bikes think of them and combine that with my own experiences (owning and test riding), I am pretty close to settling on the AR (it's close between that, the Caad12, and the Propel, but I like the AR most). That being said, I really want/need to spend less than $2500 if I can (which will also help me justify passing on the cheaper Transonic, Caad12, and Propel Advanced 3). Do any of you (SD?) have any insight into where I might be able to get a 51cm 2014 or 2015 AR5 on closeout or even a prior year AR frameset at a cheaper price? I currently live in GA if that matters. PM me if you are more comfortable with that. Thanks.


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## Superdave3T

Rashadabd said:


> My finalist race bikes have been the Cannondale Caad12, Felt AR, Fuji Transonic, and Giant Propel Advanced. As I get more and more information about the specs, pricing, and what people that own the bikes think of them and combine that with my own experiences (owning and test riding), I am pretty close to settling on the AR (it's close between that, the Caad12, and the Propel, but I like the AR most). That being said, I really want/need to spend less than $2500 if I can (which will also help me justify passing on the cheaper Transonic, Caad12, and Propel Advanced 3). Do any of you (SD?) have any insight into where I might be able to get a 51cm 2014 or 2015 AR5 on closeout or even a prior year AR frameset at a cheaper price? I currently live in GA if that matters. PM me if you are more comfortable with that. Thanks.


Where in Georgia? There is a dealer locator on the USA website that will spit out a list of Felt Performance dealers within 10, 50, 100, etc... radius of your address. Now is the time to find a dealer with a 2014 or 2015 in stock as we've just introduced the 2016 version. There aren't many changes to the product so I wouldn't expect a huge discount but if you're willing to spend $2500 I'm betting you can get an AR5 and maintain that budget.

-Dave


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## Rashadabd

SuperdaveFelt said:


> Where in Georgia? There is a dealer locator on the USA website that will spit out a list of Felt Performance dealers within 10, 50, 100, etc... radius of your address. Now is the time to find a dealer with a 2014 or 2015 in stock as we've just introduced the 2016 version. There aren't many changes to the product so I wouldn't expect a huge discount but if you're willing to spend $2500 I'm betting you can get an AR5 and maintain that budget.
> 
> -Dave


Atlanta, I was hoping to pay a little less than the MSRP to make passing on the cheaper options a little more palatable.


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## Superdave3T

Rashadabd said:


> Atlanta, I was hoping to pay a little less than the MSRP to make passing on the cheaper options a little more palatable.


I can't speak to their prices but I would suggest Podium Multisport in Atlanta. Excellent shop. Matt Cole is the owner. 
If you can send me an email I can loop in Matt and our USA Sales department directly.

-SD

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## Rashadabd

SuperdaveFelt said:


> I can't speak to their prices but I would suggest Podium Multisport in Atlanta. Excellent shop. Matt Cole is the owner.
> If you can send me an email I can loop in Matt and our USA Sales department directly.
> 
> -SD
> 
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Thanks man, I actually checked them out for the first time a couple of months back. I really like the effort and energy they put into getting a customer's fit right. They have some cool fit equipment and seem like good people. I will send you an email tonight when I get off of work. If I am recalling things correctly, they had some weird policy about test rides though. Either they weren't allowed or you had to jump through hoops to take one or something, but I will work that part out if everything else lines up. Thanks again!


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## Lachapr

SD 

There will be no changes made to the AR1 Frameset (between 2015 & 2016), right? I'm in the market and was debating if I was going to hold off for the '16 to be released - the specs on the international website appear to be the same.

Thanks in advance,

Ryan


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## Superdave3T

Lachapr said:


> SD
> 
> There will be no changes made to the AR1 Frameset (between 2015 & 2016), right? I'm in the market and was debating if I was going to hold off for the '16 to be released - the specs on the international website appear to be the same.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Ryan


Ryan,
Just color change for the AR1 and AR2 and the AR1 gets outfitted as a complete bike as an option i/o just a frameset.
-SD


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## Superdave3T

more here:

Felt World Headquarters Tour and Road Bike lineup for 2016 | Road Bike News, Reviews, and Photos

-SD


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## cobra_kai

Very cool article, thanks for sharing!


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## cwoo86

SuperdaveFelt said:


> more here:
> 
> Felt World Headquarters Tour and Road Bike lineup for 2016 | Road Bike News, Reviews, and Photos
> 
> -SD


SD,

In the article, I saw that the 2016 AR FRD already has the Pioneer Dual Leg Crank power meter already equipped. I was under the assumption that due to the Shimano Direct Mount rear brake, we wouldn't be able to fit the left crank sensor unit as with the Stages power meter. Was a different rear brake used?


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## jpaschal01

The AR is a great bike. Had an 2015 AR1 built up with Ultegra Di2 this spring and am loving it. Here are a couple of the build pictures the shop took.


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## cobra_kai

Awesome build! Trying not to drool...

Any idea what the final weight was?


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## tranzformer

Current AR is only two years old at this point, 2016 will be their third year of production. Still too early too see the frame completrly changed and new molds. I am sure they are working on a new one behind the scenes, but that is still a few years out depending on how they view the market and their sales. 

My guess is the first thing you might see is Felt maybe releases a Devoux road aero bar. Zipp, 3T, Enve , Cervelo and others all have their own models. Felt might decide to make their own and have it help integrate things more nicely on the front end. Not sure they could make the front as clean as the new Madone 9 or new Venge. 

The other thing I could maybe see is a Bayonet 4 type fork for the AR to hide the front brake. just not sure Felt would want to make it more complex and harder to wrench on as a result. Will be interesting to see. The current AR is pretty close to being perfect as is.


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## jpaschal01

cobra_kai said:


> Awesome build! Trying not to drool...
> 
> Any idea what the final weight was?


Never weighed it. I'm too big myself to worry about the weight of the bike.


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## cobra_kai

The Felt site has been updated:
Aero - Felt Bicycles

Definitely digging the return of a little bit of color to the paint job.

I see that the AR FRD comes with a pioneer power meter but is using the eecycleworks brakes, is the frame compatible when using shimano direct mount brakes?


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## jpaschal01

cobra_kai said:


> The Felt site has been updated:
> Aero - Felt Bicycles
> 
> Definitely digging the return of a little bit of color to the paint job.
> 
> I see that the AR FRD comes with a pioneer power meter but is using the eecycleworks brakes, is the frame compatible when using shimano direct mount brakes?


I have the 2015 AR with the Shimano direct mount brake. The 2016 frame is supposed to be identical.


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## cobra_kai

jpaschal01 said:


> I have the 2015 AR with the Shimano direct mount brake. The 2016 frame is supposed to be identical.


With the pioneer power meter?


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## jpaschal01

cobra_kai said:


> With the pioneer power meter?


No. But from my understanding the pioneer power meter is installed in the spider on the drive side. If it also has a part that attaches to the crank arm on the non-drive side, then there could be a clearance issue. That is where the incompatibility of the Stages power meter is with the Shimano direct mount brake on the AR frame.


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## cobra_kai

jpaschal01 said:


> No. But from my understanding the pioneer power meter is installed in the spider on the drive side. If it also has a part that attaches to the crank arm on the non-drive side, then there could be a clearance issue. That is where the incompatibility of the Stages power meter is with the Shimano direct mount brake on the AR frame.


The pioneer meter has pods on both crank arms. I suspect it will be an issue which is why the frd uses the eecycleworks brakes.

The part on the spider is just the processor/communications unit.


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## tranzformer

So the 2016 AR FRD is $500 cheaper than the 2015 AR FRD and you get a 'free' power meter with the 2016? Not to mention getting the Zipp 404 Firestrike wheels with the 2016 rather than the Zipp 404 Firecrest with the 2015. Guess it would kind stink to have bought the 2015 AR FRD a few weeks ago and found out that....


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## cobra_kai

The eecycleworks brake upgrade as well, MSRP $630. The price drop might be in response to the release of the new Madone and Venge.


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## tranzformer

cobra_kai said:


> The eecycleworks brake upgrade as well, MSRP $630. The price drop might be in response to the release of the new Madone and Venge.


Forgot about the brake upgrade as well. 

It is a $1,200 upgrade for the wheels. ~$400 brake upgrade. ~$1400 power meter. And it is $500 cheaper to boot! Nice job SuperDave on specing the 2016 AR FRD. Nice upgrade for those buying one this year.


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## Superdave3T

cobra_kai said:


> The Felt site has been updated:
> Aero - Felt Bicycles
> 
> Definitely digging the return of a little bit of color to the paint job.
> 
> I see that the AR FRD comes with a pioneer power meter but is using the eecycleworks brakes, is the frame compatible when using shimano direct mount brakes?


The AR frames use the Shimano Direct Mount standard on the rear. We use the eecycleworks brakes on the FRD bike because they are incredible, include an adjuster and Q/R and have ample clearance for the Pioneer and Stages PM. The frame can use a Shimano rear brake but not with the aforementioned inboard mounted crank-based PM.
-SD


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## Superdave3T

tranzformer said:


> Forgot about the brake upgrade as well.
> 
> It is a $1,200 upgrade for the wheels. ~$400 brake upgrade. ~$1400 power meter. And it is $500 cheaper to boot! Nice job SuperDave on specing the 2016 AR FRD. Nice upgrade for those buying one this year.


The bike _should be_ $15,000. I'm guessing in the USA the price will be corrected. $12,500 is an impossibly low price for that spec.
I don't set prices, I just compile the bits to make the bikes.
-SD


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## cobra_kai

Well I plunked down a $500 deposit for an AR1 frameset after test riding an ar5 for a while and loving it. It's supposed to get in mid october to early november time frame according to the LBS. Can't wait!


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## Superdave3T

cobra_kai said:


> Well I plunked down a $500 deposit for an AR1 frameset after test riding an ar5 for a while and loving it. It's supposed to get in mid october to early november time frame according to the LBS. Can't wait!


What size are you getting? How are you building it up?
-SD


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## cobra_kai

Hi SD, I will be getting size 58. I haven't made all of the component decisions yet, but what I know is a 3T cockpit (ergonova and arx team), 6800 mechanical, and Fizik Antares saddle, all of which I already have except for the stem. I will be putting a power meter on it, right now I'm leaning towards a power2max crank unit but I'll be waiting until after interbike to see if there are any developments. I am still working through wheel options.


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## OutAndBack

SuperdaveFelt said:


> The AR frames use the Shimano Direct Mount standard on the rear. We use the eecycleworks brakes on the FRD bike because they are incredible, include an adjuster and Q/R and have ample clearance for the Pioneer and Stages PM. The frame can use a Shimano rear brake but not with the aforementioned inboard mounted crank-based PM.
> -SD


Is there another brake besides the eecycleworks that you know of that allows for a Pioneer PM on the 2016 AR FRD Frameset?

And do you know if the 4iiii power meters have the same issues with the DM Dura-Ace rear brake?


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## Superdave3T

OutAndBack said:


> Is there another brake besides the eecycleworks that you know of that allows for a Pioneer PM on the 2016 AR FRD Frameset? And do you know if the 4iiii power meters have the same issues with the DM Dura-Ace rear brake?


Yes, Tektro, TRP, FSA, if you're clever with minor fabrication the Bontrager fits, too.
-SD

p.s. no idea on the 4iiii.


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## Rashadabd

SuperdaveFelt said:


> Yes, Tektro, TRP, FSA, if you're clever with minor fabrication the Bontrager fits, too.
> -SD
> 
> p.s. no idea on the 4iiii.


SD,

Do you know if anyone has tried the new Rotor crank based PM with the AR? I am interested in it and would love to make sure there are no issues before making decisions and investing money.

Power for the Oval: Rotor INpower - Peloton Magazine


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## Superdave3T

Rashadabd said:


> SD,
> 
> Do you know if anyone has tried the new Rotor crank based PM with the AR? I am interested in it and would love to make sure there are no issues before making decisions and investing money.
> 
> Power for the Oval: Rotor INpower - Peloton Magazine




Yes, my colleague Scott runs the InPower Rotor Flow crankset and an Ultegra rear brake.
-SD


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## cobra_kai

Any reason you are interested in the Rotor, which is left only, over a power2max which lets you use the same cranksets but gives dual leg power? Is it just to use oval rings?


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## Rashadabd

SuperdaveFelt said:


> Yes, my colleague Scott runs the InPower Rotor Flow crankset and an Ultegra rear brake.
> -SD


Excellent, thanks.


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## Rashadabd

cobra_kai said:


> Any reason you are interested in the Rotor, which is left only, over a power2max which lets you use the same cranksets but gives dual leg power? Is it just to use oval rings?


No, I had Q Rings on my Cervelo R3 and probably wouldn't get them again to be honest. I really just prefer Rotor really, but I actually haven't looked closely at the Power2max unit. I will take a look. Thank you for the recommendation.


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## OutAndBack

SuperdaveFelt said:


> p.s. no idea on the 4iiii.


More info on the 4iiii pods:

The PRECISION power meter occupies 24mm of space along the crank arm, and is approximately the thickness of a AAA battery. It can be positioned anywhere along the crank arm, so long as the location is at least 40mm from the pedal spindle and doesn't cover the inspection hole (usually covered with a small sticker).

Based on that description would they fit?

Thanks!


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## B05

I can confirm that the 4iiii fits with the Felt AR. I ride a 2015 AR3. 

Here's someone from their CS explaining the clearance:



> The 40mm from the pedal spindle prevents you from being able to install the power meter on the far end of the crank arm. The inspection hole on the other hand, is close to the crank spindle, so it prevents you from being able to install very close to the bottom bracket. Any position between those two points, however, is fine. By the other side of the brake, I don't mean on the other side of the bike, what I mean, is that since the PRECISION pod is actually quite small (it only occupies 24mm of space along the crank arm), maybe you can find a position on the crank arm either in front of the brake, or behind the brake - so within the allowable range, but where it won't touch the brake.


Mine is installed in between the BB and the brake and it doesn't touch at all (I still have a good 1cm before it touches the caliper). I ride a size 48 and run a 165mm crank. If I can make it work then people who use longer crank arms shouldn't worry at all. I can 100% confirm that if you run a 160mm> crank it won't work. 

If you guys want to make sure ask them to send a dummy pod and try to fit it in yourself.

As for the PM - it works well. I haven't seen any crazy readings and such. I like on how it only adds less than 50g on your frame and it's very discreet.


Now I'm just wondering if my LBS owes me a Felt shirt because I have 2 Felt bikes and I felt like I didn't get any love from the brand at all


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## cobra_kai

That is very good news, that makes the 4iii the first crank pod power meter that fits with shimano direct mount brakes. I would definitely be interested in the upcoming two sided version, but unfortunately according to dcrainmaker's recent article about them it won't be until 'early 2016' which probably means mid 2016 in reality.


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## OutAndBack

Is the 2016 Felt AR FRD frameset is available right now? Or later this fall?


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