# Best Wheels for Average Speed Rider



## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Hi everyone,

I want to ask for your opinions on what wheels will best suit me. I'm not asking for brand suggestions but instead wheel profile eg. shallow vs deep, aero vs non-aero.

My rolling speed (solo) is around 26-28kmh on flats. On steep climb is about 15-16kmh. I currently ride a Roubaix Sworks bike with Dura-Ace C35 wheels. I'm aware that these wheels are not the lightest. I think they're about 1600gr+ which is quiet heavy.

I never race. I only commute to work. I like doing century by the way but at a quiet slow steady speed - around 24kmh.

Therefore, which wheel profile will suit me? From what I've observed I think I will benefit most from light shallow wheel eg. Mavic R-Sys or Ksyrium Elites or Dura-ACe C24. Am I correct?

Thanks for your input.


Steve


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Oh and also, my normal route is most likely flats but there are some short climbs here and there. When I climb, the steepest gradient can be as high as 14%. When I commute to work, it's 60km in distance - return (to from work) - and I commute around 3-4 times a week and century ride on either Saturday or Sunday.

I don't think I can be any faster than 30kmh solo on flats since I don't specifically train to gain leg strength other than cycling to work. 

Therefore, which wheel profile will best suit me?


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## horvatht (Feb 27, 2012)

Reynolds Assaults have been a great wheel for me. I'm 52 and an average rider. I ride mostly ride flat with a hill once in a while. I like to descend and push the scare button and these wheels have never made me feel uncomfortable. I have even curbed these wheels hard and send them back to Reynolds and there was no damage and only paid shipping cost of 16 dollars. They relaxed and re laced the wheel. This curbing accident broke a carbon frame in three places. These wheels are fairly light and really seem bullet proof. I really like my wheels. 
Happy riding!


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

Since your riding mostly on the flats, I think you should look for a rim that is slightly deeper, maybe in the 40-50mm depth range. This should help when trying to maintain some sort of average speed. 
A shallower lighter rim would be suitable if you were climbing all the time, but since your trying to maintain that might not be the best choice.


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## Doolab (Feb 13, 2008)

How much do you weigh?

Also, most of the better clincher wheelsets will come in around 1450-1800g, so your C35 are right in the middle of the range, plus the DA hubs are second to none in smoothness and durability.

I doubt you'll gain anything by changing your wheelset as most other wheelsets will be a step lower than what you already have.

And from my experience, I have Dura Ace C50 (1660g) wheelset as well as Mavic Elites (1580g) and Mavic Equipe (1770g) wheels, and the DA C50 are hands down the faster, stiffer, and more aero wheelset than the Elites and Equipes, even when accounting for the ~100g weight advantage that the Elites enjoy, the stiffness of the C50 makes them very efficient when powering up inclines and I don't notice the additional weight.

If you're looking for a pure climber and want the lightest possible clincher wheelset, look at some that are in the 1200-1300g range, but you should know that a clincher wheelset at that weight class will probably have weak or soft rims and lack stiffness, or maybe you'll end up with a wheelset with more spokes to add to the stiffness of the wheelset but the increased number (and length) of spokes will add to the drag and rob you of power at speed.

There's no free lunch with wheelsets and almost every one out there is a compromise of sorts, but the Shimano Dura Ace wheelsets use top quality components and engineering to give you great performance that's hard to beat.

Good luck.


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

@Doolab: Mate thanks very much for your input. It's really-really valuable. I'm only 170cm and 74kg.

What's your thought on C24 vs C35? I have read a lot of excellent reviews on the C24.

Obviously as I've stated earlier, I'm not racing nor I will climb mountains and do any descends in that regard. What I'm looking for is a wheelset which allows me to climb 4-8% gradient for 1-3 minutes but also maintain steady speed.

Also, I live in Perth Western Australia and where I am riding normally which is alongside Swan river, yaw wind is just sooo strong. I need a wheelset that is steady enough on huge yaw. I read on an article somewhere that the deeper your wheel is, the more unbalanced it becomes when it's hit by yaw wind? Is that true? I actually personally feel that my C35 is not that stable when the yaw wind is strong.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

At those speeds there is no wheelset you can buy, of any depth of rim, that will provide any extra noticeable speed. I'm 3-4mph (5kph-ish) faster than you and I don't see a difference in my average speeds between 24mm deep rims (1410g wheelset weight) and 50mm deep ones (1570g wheelset weight).

So, I would use your body weight to be the criteria of what wheels you buy and seeing as you left out this most important piece of info..................

Maybe your goal, seeing as you commute and aren't particularly concerned about training to go faster, should be to get a set of wheels that is reliable (meaning - sufficient numbers of spokes and rim strength for your weight)


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Mike,

Any particular wheels you would recommend or should I just stick with the C35?


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## Doolab (Feb 13, 2008)

Your C35 is the best option for a go fast wheelset if you have any concerns about getting blown sideways by the wind on deeper wheels. But FWIW, I weigh 75kg and don't feel any more blown around on my C50 than I do on my Elites. So take internet opinions for what they are...

Now if you're looking for a beater set to reduce the wear and tear on your C35s, then any budget wheelset will do, but they will probably all feel inferior to what you currently ride...

If I were in your position, I'd stick with your setup and work at becoming a stronger rider with better riding technique, interval training, and increased base miles.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

stevepeter83 said:


> Mike,
> Any particular wheels you would recommend or should I just stick with the C35?


I think these guys are doing an ok job of suggesting stuff. Now that you have posted your weight, almost any wheelset would be ok for you.

As you commute, look for stuff that isn't silly light or silly numbers of spokes. 18/20 spokes might "look" fancy but if you can't get to work because you broke a spoke then what use are they? Or "unobtanium" spokes - straight spokes (not j-bend) that are proprietary to the wheelset are much harder to get and cost much more. 24/28 spoked wheels will give you peace of mind and they won't slow you down and j-bend spokes are available at any bike shop - and cheap too.


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## simonaway427 (Jul 12, 2010)

The wheels you have are just fine and upgrading won't change anything.


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## Jay Strongbow (May 8, 2010)

50mm and 1200-1300 gram wheels to commute on? Are you guys serious?

OP, for commuting and casual centuries all you need to care about is reliability. seeing as though you already own the DA wheels you may as well see how they stand up (good would be my guess).


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Jay,

Yes they are very-very good. I've done 6000km with it and still as strong as new.

Alrighty, thanks everyone for the input. I'll just stay with them then. I just thought that if I upgrade to a lighter wheel like R-Sys SL, I can climb a little bit better.

I think I remembered when I owned the Ksyrium Elites, the climbs were a little bit easier but it may all be due to the wind strength at that time and most importantly, my legs 


Cheers,
Steve


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

stevepeter83 said:


> @Doolab: Mate thanks very much for your input. It's really-really valuable. I'm only 170cm and 74kg.
> 
> What's your thought on C24 vs C35? I have read a lot of excellent reviews on the C24.
> 
> ...


That's one of the drawbacks when you have a deeper depth rim, crosswinds pushing on the face of the wheel, which affects "stability". 

the C24 is a great choice nonetheless... not as "aero" in the straight line as the C35, but the reduced depth will help with the crosswinds. Also, being that it has a metal braking track, you have more options for pads --- which can come in handy for your commuting needs. Might have proprietary spokes, with its spoke hole drilling on one one side of the rim though, but, if you venture into tubeless... you have that option, as there are no spoke holes to cover. Also, the way it is drilled, it is a stronger rim, so, it gets away with less spokes (which also helps with the crosswind). Same thing can be said with Mavic Kysrium Elites (though Mavics uses sealed cartridge bearings)


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## Chris-X (Aug 4, 2011)

*c'mon man!*



stevepeter83 said:


> Jay,
> 
> Yes they are very-very good. I've done 6000km with it and still as strong as new.
> 
> ...


Shimano Dura-Ace Wheels C35mm Clincher 7900 | Pair - F&R - Carbon

$1,200 wheels on sale? And you're using them for commuting? You can get an excellent commuting bike for that much.

I'm riding a $40 ebay, synergy o/c rim I laced, and trued on the bike, to a 12? year old Daytona hub, with 28mm pos tires and tire liners, and it really doesn't matter much. I hold my speed better because they're so heavy.. Some of you guys could actually sell a person "upgraded" wheels from what he has with a straight face? 

Stick with what you have for the next 5 years unless you like throwing away money...


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## Doolab (Feb 13, 2008)

Chris-X said:


> Shimano Dura-Ace Wheels C35mm Clincher 7900 | Pair - F&R - Carbon
> 
> $1,200 wheels on sale? And you're using them for commuting? You can get an excellent commuting bike for that much.
> 
> ...


Yes, prices on high end roadbike wheelsets will surely defy common logic and challenge one's sanity.

But if you look at highend wheelsets in terms of paying for excellence in engineering, top quality materials, and compensation to artisan builders with years of experience, then these high prices start becoming more palatable, assuming you can afford to pay for such exuberant luxuries or are a racer looking for that last 1-2% of performance gain.

Otherwise, the average cyclist can stick with midrange wheelset offerings and do well enough and never worry about any of this.


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## Chris-X (Aug 4, 2011)

*From someone who gets gear for free....*



Doolab said:


> Yes, prices on high end roadbike wheelsets will surely defy common logic and challenge one's sanity.
> 
> But if you look at highend wheelsets in terms of paying for excellence in engineering, top quality materials, and compensation to artisan builders with years of experience, then these high prices start becoming more palatable, assuming you can afford to pay for such exuberant luxuries or are a racer looking for that last 1-2% of performance gain.
> 
> Otherwise, the average cyclist can stick with midrange wheelset offerings and do well enough and never worry about any of this.


Shotgun PEZ: Training With Lance!

• 7:32-7:50 - Dave readies the follow vehicle for a long day. *In the back a few sets of Bontrager training wheelsets with 25mm tires and traditional spokes*, along with food, bottles, and all of the clothing needed for a day in the saddle. A few minutes later Lance makes his way down from the main house dressed in LIVESTRONG cycling clothes and ready for the day. 

• 8:00 - Occasional training partner and long time friend John "College" Korioth arrives and the jawing begins. It will be a theme throughout the day, but it starts over a wheelset. *It seems a certain someone doesn't approve of John's choice of lighter wheels and tires so the boss goes to the garage to make sure John has a set he can use just like the set on the boss's bike*. :thumbsup:

Sky service course

https://cdn.mos.bikeradar.com/images/news/2011/03/30/1301494020352-kmq94utjwngq-670-70.jpg


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Saving money*



stevepeter83 said:


> Any particular wheels you would recommend or should I just stick with the C35?


Consider the price. Many factory wheels are significantly over-priced compared to the standard 32 spoke, 3X, with the rims and hubs of your choice. With that build you get ease of repair, super durablity, and at your riding speed all the performance you need or could want. Factory wheels often use proprietary parts and a few years down the road you find yourself unable to get replacement spokes, etc.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Kerry Irons said:


> Consider the price. Many factory wheels are significantly over-priced compared to the standard 32 spoke, 3X, with the rims and hubs of your choice. With that build you get ease of repair, super durablity, and at your riding speed all the performance you need or could want. Factory wheels often use proprietary parts and a few years down the road you find yourself unable to get replacement spokes, etc.


^^^This, x eleventy freakin' billion. OP, go get some OpenPro rims, DT Comp spokes (or Sapim Race) and the Shimano hub you can afford - 105, Ultegra, DuraAce - and never look back.


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## PSC (Mar 10, 2004)

100% agree. If you are not racing get a wheel that is durable. 32/3x with good hubs and never look back. I pass guy's on climbs all the time with nice/highend bikes/wheels all the time, on my 25 pound SS with wheels that are well over 2200 grams. I am by no means a really good rider, but it does give me satisfation to pass guys on $3000+ bikes and I am on a "heavy SS". To me a bike is a tool that you should enjoy and the less hassles the better. Let the Pros worry about there equipment, as they make a living off it. I just want my stuff to work when I need it too. Sorry for the rant.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

1600 grams is not that heavy. Sure you can get lighter wheels, some of the lighter ones weigh in around 1450 grms, so your only going to lose 75 grams per wheel, so if your just an average rider 75 grms per wheel won't make you an above average rider, but it will make you poorer and not feel a difference in performance. And your not a racer so what's the reason for lighter wheels? bragging rights to your cycling friends?

Also if your riding mostly on city streets or rough roads you don't want a low spoke wheel.

There are many good wheelsets out there, some are crazy expensive and others not so bad. Personally I think one of the best for the money and a compromise between real light wheels for climbing and deep dish wheels for down hill speed and flats (assuming no wind) is the Kinlin XR270 rims combined with White Industries H2 front and H3 rear hubs, Sapim CX ray spokes (24 on front and 28 on rear), and alloy nipples, laced two cross front and three cross rear. Your total weight including skewers but not gear cluster would be 1,481 grams and set you back $706 for the wheelset plus shipping from ProWheelBuilder.com This is a far cry cheaper then some of the wheels others mentioned that cost over $1000 and weigh more. See: CUSTOM WHEEL BUILDING PROGRAM you pick it we build it PROWHEELBUILDER

Just a thought. But personally, I don't see the reason behind getting the wheels if the one you have still work.


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Hi everyone,

Thanks very much for all the input. Obviously for me this comes down to "want" vs "need".

I was also thinking of custom wheel but I've never had any experience in doing so. What's the process involved? I'm still new to all these things. I went to a custom built wheel website once and it asked me for selection of spokes, bearings, etc which I had no idea at all.

Can you help me, please?

I was also looking at American Classic Magnesium Clincher. I just happened to stumble across them. It's 1108gr only but I'm not sure what their quality is like. Price is also not cheap...$1599 USD...

The C24 was on special...AUD$800 for a set from Wiggle I think which is excellent.

As I said previously, this is "want" vs "need". Given that my legs get stronger in the future, I would love to get a set that would help me to go faster 

Also, what's involved with owning a Tubular tyre? Is it too difficult to change, etc if I get a puncture during commuting?


Thanks so much,
Steve


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

Wheels wont help you go faster, thats the thing. They'll feel like the spin up faster, but you really wont be going anywhere any quicker. 

the AC mag clinchers are disposable wheels, they wont last.


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Aha kewl. Thanks for the info.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

stevepeter83 said:


> Hi everyone,
> Thanks very much for all the input. Obviously for me this comes down to "want" vs "need".
> I was also thinking of custom wheel but I've never had any experience in doing so. What's the process involved? I'm still new to all these things. I went to a custom built wheel website once and it asked me for selection of spokes, bearings, etc which I had no idea at all.
> Can you help me, please?
> ...


This is getting more & more bizarre. You commute. You ride at recreational speeds at best. You have a DuraAce set of wheels already. You have no idea what the terms mean when ordering custom wheels. You know nothing about tubulars, their benefits (or lack of) and their operation. But you're willing to dump huge amounts of money on something that will provide you with no tangible benefit (like speed) and now you're considering an 1100 gram wheelset (which is OMFG light for a clincher set)

You have already got and incredible set of wheels (apart from their {IMO} stupid spokes) and you're hoping for what? You're not even looking for extra speed as most unrealistic wheel-shoppers are. Oh wait, you are, you just said "I would love to get a set that would help me to go faster" and then qualified that with a winkey-face. I'm glad you included that.

If the need to spend money is overwhelming, just buy anything. Just *anything*. At least you defined *that* criteria.


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Mike,

I think I can conclude that my wheels are sufficient for what I'm doing now. However, if you can help me in explaining tubular and custom wheelsets that would be awesome, too.

I may not be as expert or as strong as you (yet) but who knows in the future, as I'm going more into it, I'll be a stronger rider and one day I'll benefit from these wheels. Therefore, your help is much appreciated.


Thanks,
Steve


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

There must be reams of information on the internet about tubular tires and their comparisons to clinchers. I'll summarize it in a few words, from my experience of 24 years of using them - they will not provide any benefit to you and they will be much harder to live with than clinchers. Unless you're a top racer they are not worth considering.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

stevepeter83 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Thanks very much for all the input. Obviously for me this comes down to "want" vs "need".
> 
> ...



Most of these sites are designed to make you upgrade and buy something more expensive then you need. Ceramic bearings confuse most people, it has a certain lure to it that sounds like wonder material, but it's not. I have a set of Suntour Superbe hubs that have been well cared for over the years and they have over 160,000 miles on the bearings...steel bearings! and they seemingly will spin forever. If you get decent hubs in the mid range price area like White Industries (just an example, not the only ones) with steel bearings there is no reason why they can't last the life of the bike if cared for. 

But there are some items worth considering if you can afford it, like Sapim CX-Ray spokes, these oval shaped spokes do slice the wind better then regular round spokes. If price is too much then use DT Competition spokes, their lighter then normal spokes and a bit stronger then Revolution, but you could use Revolution on the front and shouldn't have any problems.

Some things are questionable like brass vs alloy nipples, brass will last longer and will take repeated tensioning without rounding off unlike alloy; but with todays deeper dished wheels truing is rare, so I think a person can get away with using alloy nipples and not be worried too much about them rounding off since you'll rarely touch them; however if you use box rims and/or plan on touring, or have rough roads, then I would only use brass nips. 

You can get very light weight wheels like the ones you mentioned, and probably if you looked long and hard enough find something even lighter but at what cost financially? And at what cost of reliability? Those ultralight weight wheels should not be used on the street.

There also a decent wheelset that's inexpensive on sale now at Nashbar that got high reviews, see: Vuelta Corsa Slr Road Wheelset - Bike Wheels / Rims / Wheel Accessories


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## wblas3271 (May 12, 2012)

stevepeter83 said:


> Mike,
> 
> I think I can conclude that my wheels are sufficient for what I'm doing now. However, if you can help me in explaining tubular and custom wheelsets that would be awesome, too.
> 
> ...


Your heart is in the right place but I feel you have the wrong mentality regarding equipment. You will never, ever, ever be held back by a set of dura ace wheels.


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## Chris-X (Aug 4, 2011)

froze said:


> Most of these sites are designed to make you upgrade and buy something more expensive then you need. Ceramic bearings confuse most people, it has a certain lure to it that sounds like wonder material, but it's not. I have a set of Suntour Superbe hubs that have been well cared for over the years and they have over 160,000 miles on the bearings...steel bearings! and they seemingly will spin forever. If you get decent hubs in the mid range price area like White Industries (just an example, not the only ones) with steel bearings there is no reason why they can't last the life of the bike if cared for.
> 
> But there are some items worth considering if you can afford it, like Sapim CX-Ray spokes, these oval shaped spokes do slice the wind better then regular round spokes. If price is too much then use DT Competition spokes, their lighter then normal spokes and a bit stronger then Revolution, but you could use Revolution on the front and shouldn't have any problems.
> 
> ...


The whole thread is kind of strange. The O/P is riding Shimano C35's. I'm assuming they are the same one's or similiar, maybe clinchers vs tubulars Sky is riding?

To me, the functionality of brass nipples is essential as I do ride box section rims over occasionally very rough roads, oftentimes in the rain. 

The O/P could basically get open pro's with 105 hubs for less than $250 US and not be sacrificing anything performance wise while getting an extremely durable wheel. The only other considerations are cosmetic. Call me crazy but why spend 5 x that much...for commuting???? Get 2 sets of durable wheels, continue to ride the great wheels you currently have, and spend the rest on apparel for the engine. It's always nice to have comfortable clothing.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Chris-X said:


> The whole thread is kind of strange. The O/P is riding Shimano C35's. I'm assuming they are the same one's or similiar, maybe clinchers vs tubulars Sky is riding?
> 
> To me, the functionality of brass nipples is essential as I do ride box section rims over occasionally very rough roads, oftentimes in the rain.
> 
> The O/P could basically get open pro's with 105 hubs for less than $250 US and not be sacrificing anything performance wise while getting an extremely durable wheel. The only other considerations are cosmetic. Call me crazy but why spend 5 x that much...for commuting???? Get 2 sets of durable wheels, continue to ride the great wheels you currently have, and spend the rest on apparel for the engine. It's always nice to have comfortable clothing.


What's confusing? Your right, brass nips are more functional then alloy, and when used with box rims or rims used for touring (which are generally box), rims used on rough roads or off roads, low spoke count rims, will need more frequent truing then aero rims. 

The only reason I replied the way I did was because the OP wanted something lighter, don't ask me why, ask him! So I responded to that supposed need. Do I agree? no, I actually agree with you, but that's not what he wanted. So my response was for a strong rim that would hold up to commuting and still be lighter then what he had and fast enough for club rides or fast training rides, and maybe even give him so bling he may be secretly wanting. I was just suggesting another option.


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## Chris-X (Aug 4, 2011)

froze said:


> What's confusing? Your right, brass nips are more functional then alloy, and when used with box rims or rims used for touring (which are generally box), rims used on rough roads or off roads, low spoke count rims, will need more frequent truing then aero rims.
> 
> The only reason I replied the way I did was because the OP wanted something lighter, don't ask me why, ask him! So I responded to that supposed need. Do I agree? no, I actually agree with you, but that's not what he wanted. So my response was for a strong rim that would hold up to commuting and still be lighter then what he had and fast enough for club rides or fast training rides, and maybe even give him so bling he may be secretly wanting. I was just suggesting another option.


I didn't mean for that to be directed at you but I did reply that way. Yeah, I agree with you.

What I was confused about is that the O/P has some very "pro" competition level wheels he's using for commuting and looking for a lighter, faster, set. 

I don't get it. It just seems to me that unless one is competing, use training wheels and save the race day wheels for a day before pre race shakedown, and race day.


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

The DA wheels you have arent just sufficient, they're a very excellent high end set of wheels. Its kinda like looking for a nicer watch when you're wearing a rolex.


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Kewl kewl. Thanks very much everyone. The posts have helped me so much.

The Dura-Ace wheels came with the bike that I purchased last year and I've kept using them since. 


Steve


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## arevuar (Jul 16, 2012)

:thumbsup: DA


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## stevepeter83 (Apr 8, 2012)

Hi guys,

FYI I still bought the Mavic R-SYS SL wheelset. I can't help myself 

Anyway, you are all right. I don't get any speed advantage. In fact I actually ride slower on the R-SYS. What I like about it though is the comfort.

I've written a blog article about it, just in case you're interested, please go to Road Bike Wheelsets and Tires Review: Mavic R-SYS SL 2012.


Cheers,
Steve


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## TomH (Oct 6, 2008)

Your new wheels are less aerodynamic and less durable. If anything goes wrong with them, they're not cheap to repair either. Good luck.

Not trying to poop on your new purchase, but just a heads up. You might be in for a ride with those, and its not necessarily a faster ride.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

stevepeter83 said:


> Hi guys,
> FYI I still bought the Mavic R-SYS SL wheelset. I can't help myself
> Anyway, you are all right. I don't get any speed advantage. In fact I actually ride slower on the R-SYS. What I like about it though is the comfort.
> I've written a blog article about it, just in case you're interested, please go to Road Bike Wheelsets and Tires Review: Mavic R-SYS SL 2012.
> ...


I'm sure we're all happy that you and these wheels found each other and that you'll both be happy for ever more.


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## PowerGoat (Jul 2, 2012)

Steve, I'll buy your C35's from you for $300, then you can buy the Mavic Open Pro's with 105 hubs for under $250. Then you'll have what you want and will also be ahead $50!


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## wildboar (Nov 27, 2008)

How about trade me straight up the C35's for some old 36 hole Mavic Mach 2 tubulars in the basement, I guarantee they will spin all day long at 20+mph average on the flats... at least when I last rode them they did.


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## echo7 (Sep 7, 2010)

Congratulations on your new purchase. Thats money well wasted (just kidding)..
Im sure your friends will be impressed..


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## dracula (Mar 9, 2010)

stevepeter83 said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> FYI I still bought the Mavic R-SYS SL wheelset. I can't help myself
> 
> ...


Maybe I overlooked it in your review but what tyres are you riding on? You emphasised the comfortable ride on the Mavics R-SYS. What is your tyre pressure? And what tyres and pressure did you use by riding the Shimanos C35?

What do you exaclty mean by riding slower on the R-SYS? Don't forget you are quite new to cycling and depending on the season and your individual training situation there will be days when you are gonna fly and days stuck in hell.


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

Wow, the OP is one interesting dude. 
And he ends up buying some R-SYS? LOL! 
I'm almost tempted to think Troll.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

T K said:


> Wow, the OP is one interesting dude.
> And he ends up buying some R-SYS? LOL!
> I'm almost tempted to think Troll.



Now you brought trouble down on you. This troll, err I mean OP isn't even anyway near as bad as the another OP here who was going on a 206 mile one day race, not ride, race, so obviously he's raced before, but wanted to know if he should replace his tubes before the race. I mentioned he was a poser and a whole bunch of people attacked me. I'm glad it's your turn now!!


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## wildboar (Nov 27, 2008)

I think it's obvious at this point, if the OP wants to see a real improvement in speed he needs to step up to a Colnago C59 or Pinarello Dogma 2 (not the 1 that was much slower) and don't even think about getting anything made from steel those are waaay too slow.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

wildboar said:


> I think it's obvious at this point, if the OP wants to see a real improvement in speed he needs to step up to a Colnago C59 or Pinarello Dogma 2 (not the 1 that was much slower) and don't even think about getting anything made from steel those are waaay too slow.


Steel too slow? if weight is the issue then you don't know about the Rodriquez Outlaw all steel frame bike that fully equipped weighs 14 pounds; see: Custom Bicycles from Rodriguez - R+E Cycles - Home of Rodriguez Custom bikes, Women's Bicycles, Tandem Bicycles, and Accessories. rodriguez custom bicycles women's bicycles tandem bicycles This is among the lightest weight production bikes you can buy regardless of material.


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

There is no way anything steel is as fast as anything carbon. They make jets and speed boats out of carbon. Tanks and dump trucks out of steel. If steel was faster they'd make jets out of it. So that proves that.


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## looigi (Nov 24, 2010)

Here's an anecdotal counterexample.

Bell X-2 “Starbuster”: 5th fastest jet aircraft in the world, nearly achieving Mach 3. A specialized type of research aircraft created by the United States of America ...made of stainless steel and copper nickel alloy.


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

looigi said:


> Here's an anecdotal counterexample.
> 
> Bell X-2 “Starbuster”: 5th fastest jet aircraft in the world, nearly achieving Mach 3. A specialized type of research aircraft created by the United States of America ...made of stainless steel and copper nickel alloy.


See you just proved my point. Only the 5th fastest jet.
Fastest bikes are as follows.
1) carbon
2) aluminum with carbon stays and forks.
3) aluminum
4) Ti
5) Steel
See, no matter how you slice it, steel is just slower.
My average speed drops at least 5mph when I ride my steel bike on the same roads. If I put my carbon wheels on I can gain 2mph.:thumbsup:
If you must get steel, Italian steel is fastest.


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## joshuashih1 (Sep 8, 2012)

this is great


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## dcgriz (Feb 13, 2011)

T K said:


> If you must get steel, Italian steel is fastest.


Yes but only when they are chasing you.....


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

T K said:


> See you just proved my point. Only the 5th fastest jet.
> Fastest bikes are as follows.
> 1) carbon
> 2) aluminum with carbon stays and forks.
> ...


Red painted steel is faster then any other painted steel.
I like TI bikes, if someone is shooting at me I just use it as a shield.
The fastest aircraft in the world...at least publicized, is the X43, it flies at about 7,000 miles an hour, and it's made of carbon carbon, which is a carbon fiber reinforcement in a matrix of graphite which puts it into the ceramic family. So there you have it, make a bike frame out that material and your average speed will double over carbon fiber.


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## SteveOz1 (Sep 5, 2012)

"red painted steel is faster than any other painted steel":lol:


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

My research shows that Celeste steel is fastest.


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## dgeesaman (Jun 9, 2010)

looigi said:


> Here's an anecdotal counterexample.
> 
> Bell X-2 “Starbuster”: 5th fastest jet aircraft in the world, nearly achieving Mach 3. A specialized type of research aircraft created by the United States of America ...made of stainless steel and copper nickel alloy.


LOL. Basing your bicycle materials on a supersonic jet might be worthwhile if you intend to run your bike inside of an operating autoclave:

http://www.geekologie.com/2012/04/pentagons-mach-20-jet-failed-after-its-s.php


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## r_mutt (Aug 8, 2007)

So basically, if someone doesn't race, they should stick to 32 spoke box section wheels, because they're not worthy. 

The OP should buy whatever wheels he wants and if it makes him feel faster even if he's not, great. You lot should go stuff it!


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## wildboar (Nov 27, 2008)

r_mutt said:


> So basically, if someone doesn't race, they should stick to 32 spoke box section wheels, because they're not worthy.


No, you are missing the point. It has been scientifically proven in this post that anything made from carbon is fastest. So from now on, there is only 1 viable answer to every wheel question: R-Sys.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

I can't wait for those carbon carbon ceramic wheels to come out on the market.


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## T K (Feb 11, 2009)

r_mutt said:


> So basically, if someone doesn't race, they should stick to 32 spoke box section wheels, because they're not worthy.


Don't think anyone here ever said anything of the sort. So I don't know where you came up with that.
But, for his use, or any use for that matter, the R-Sys wheels are about the worst possible choice one could make. Unless of course one is willing to pay a high price for what one thinks "looks" good. The performance or durability gain certainly is not there. In that case he is more than welcome to spend his money how he chooses.


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