# who owns a Dogma 65.1?



## Donn12

I am considering this or a Cervelo R5. If you own one and can help me I would appreciate it. 
What build and how much does it weigh? I think it will be 1.5 lbs heavier and a few thousand more. I have looked at all the color combos available and wow! this bike is gorgeous. The custom build tool either doesn't work or doesn't allow for too may choices. Can you get lighter lettering ? Some show "Pinarello" etc just out lined, some bight white. Red/Black shows both. is this customizable? The most bars look nice but how do they feel? any other build advice?
Thank you


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## Michael15

I believe I replied to another post asking about the 65.1. First things first, if you are trying to save some $ then the Pinarello probably is not the bike for you. I came from a R3 SL to the 65.1. I went with the cement gray, white and black. I think the # for the color code is 765? My bike has the Campy EPS, Campy Shamul clinchers, 3T carbon stem/bars, lizard skin wrap, speedplay ti pedals and a Fizik seat. I'm still demo'n the seat so it may not be the seat I end up with. My bike has the outlining lettering on outside of the down tubes. I'm seriously considering some Bora Ultra 2's! I know they are overpriced, heavy, etc but I've caught the Campy fever!!!

I did demo a few 65.1's with the Most bar/stems. Honestly I couldn't notice much difference from the 3T combo. I wrap my bars pretty close to the stem so I wasn't concerned about how the bars look. The Most setup can make the bike look fantastic!

The ride is pure joy! I just turned 50yrs old(the 65.1 was my bdaypresent)and this bike makes me feel 20yrs younger! I made the mistake of demo'n all eps bikes...wow the system is flawless and after my demo rides there was no way I was going back to the mechanical. I know the 65.1 is not the lightest bike out there but the stiffness and power transfer sure make it feel like a lightweight bike. I've set several PR's with the bike and the majority of the segments have been climbs. I've gotten the courage to tackle several 15-20% inclines. I have not weighed the bike yet. Good luck!


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## Donn12

Thanks for the reply. The white/grey/black looks great! I will try to demo one without Super Record EPS!


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## Juzzy004

I recently purchased a BoB (Black on Black) 65.1, colour code 746, prior to Christmas. Words can't describe how good this frame is. As Michael pointed out, it's not a frame for those looking to save pennies and isn't the lightest on the market, but it handles amazingly. I've clocked up 150km on it so far (not even broken in yet!) and couldn't be happier.
Build includes Shimano Dura Ace Di2 7970, Mavic Cosmic Carbone SLE's, Zipp SL145 & Contour SL SS bars, Prologo Nago Evo Nack saddle, Prologo Skin Touch tape & K-Edge Garmin 800 mount. Everything is black.
The bike complete comes in at 7.2kg, which the wheels contribute to a lot. Tubs on this would bring that down to about 6.8kg. Looking at Zipp Firecrest 404's.
Best of luck with your potential purchase.


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## bmorgan4

Just got my new Pinarello Think 2. Built with the new Sram Red (with Quarq) and with my 404 Firecrest Tubies it weighs in right at 16lb. It is a 59.5 frame, so a little on the larger size. I was hoping it would be a little lighter, but not complaints it looks like a beast! I also opted for the 3T stem and bars, been using them foreverand couldn't bring myself to make the swap.
View attachment 274403
View attachment 274404


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## Cinelli 82220

^ Never seen a Dogma that big before. Wow.


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## Sisbud

Just bought a dogma 65.1 in 854 color size 51.5.
Total build weighted in at 6.4 kg including pedals and bottle cage.
Not really a weight weenie but nothing compares to the ride that dogma provides


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## Spark

Great looking machine Bmorgan4, 16lbs isn't too bad at all for a frame that size.


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## Donn12

Bmorgan, I was tempted to doubt your frame size but the 59.5 has a headtube 35mm taller than the 57.5.
16 lbs is not bad at all for a frame that big. How much do the zipps weigh?


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## Donn12

Slsbud, gorgeous bike! What part of the world are you in? I don't see that color combo anywhere How about some build details?


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## bmorgan4

Spark said:


> Great looking machine Bmorgan4, 16lbs isn't too bad at all for a frame that size.


Thanks! It's the same size frame Wiggins rode at the tour, he is an inch taller than me but a little more flexible.


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## bmorgan4

Same size Wiggins rode this year... so hopefully you have!


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## bmorgan4

View attachment 274424
The Zipps with the new Red cassette/skewers/glue/tangente tires weigh 2163 grams/4.77 lbs. Wheels bare weigh in at 1310 grams. I was really torn between the 57.5 and 59.5. I ride a 58 Cervelo S2 as well, and the Dogma is HUGE compared to it. My reasoning was stack height, I have to run 27mm spacers and a +6 120mm stem on my cervelo (I have issues with my hips if I have a large amount of saddle to bar drop). On the Pinarello as shown I can run 10-15mm spacers, and a -6 120mm stem for the same setup. This is my road racing setup, for crits I can drop the stem down a little further. To me, going with the slightly larger frame so I dont have to run a positive rise stem and a ton of spacers was worth it. I do have bike envy for smaller people I must admit, weight + looks. Keep in mind without the Quarq crank the build would weigh 15.5 lbs. I wasn't able to weigh the frame before it was built, but looking at the numbers it weighs almost exactly what my s2 frame weighs which is incredible because the Dogma is so much more beefy!

Do you think my reasoning is sound for going with the larger frame? I'm still a little nervous, big decision when dropping that much $$ on a frame. Wiggins rode the same frame size which made me feel a little better, although he is an inch taller than me and was running no spacers with a 130mm stem if I recall correctly. I'm still within the return period if any of you have any feedback I am all ears! 

PS - Here is the bike with my HED Belgium wheels built up with White Ind Hubs adn 25mm Evo Corsa CX tires. This wheelset is right at 1 lb heavier than the tubies, and I couldn't be happier with them! You can also see my S2 behind it for comparison.
View attachment 274424


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## bmorgan4

View attachment 274425


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## bmorgan4

Wow, that is light! What components/bar/stem/wheels are you running? You can see mine above at a beefy 16lbs!


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## Sisbud

Hi, 

I am from indonesia.
The color code for the frame is 854. It is actually a limited edition color to commemorate wiggins victory in TdF last year.

This is my build list:

Frameset - Pinarello Dogma 65.1 Think 2 854 size 51.5
Handlebar - Climax Compact Handlebar 42x10 (Custom Painted)
Seatpost - Pinarello Most Carbon Seatpost
Saddle - Specialized S-Works Toupe 143mm Black
Handlebar Tape - Fizik Handlebar Tape Black Soft Touch
Bottom Bracket - SRAM GXP Ceramic Bottom Bracket Italian (Painted)
Crankset - Sram Red Exogram Compact Crankset (Custom Painted)
Chainring - Osymetric 52/38
Cable - Nokon Cable System Black
Shifter - Dura Ace 7900 Shifter
Front Derailleur - Dura Ace 7900 Front Derailleur
Rear Derailleur - Dura Ace 7900 Rear Derailleur
Cassette - Dura Ace 7900 11-28
Chain - Dura Ace 7900 Chain
Chain Catcher - K-Edge Chain Catcher
Brakeset - Dura Ace 7900 Brakeset
Wheelset - Mavic Cosmic Carbone Ultimate
Tire - Continental Competition
Skewer - Tune DC14
Pedal - Speedplay Stainless Black 
Bottle Cage - Arundel Mandible Matt Oil Slick

This is just a temporary group until my 7970 Di2 parts arrive.


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## Sisbud

Reupload the images as the first one was not done properly


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## Donn12

Bmorgan how tall are you?


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## Spark

My build was started today, I can't wait to have it finished! Some amazing 65.1's above
View attachment 274446


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## tcao

Sisbud, that color is fantastic. I am looking for one in same size as yours. may i ask how tall are you? Thanks.


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## Sisbud

tcao said:


> Sisbud, that color is fantastic. I am looking for one in same size as yours. may i ask how tall are you? Thanks.


Hi tcao,

I am 5'11" however my inseam is only 31". Moreover i dont have a flexible back


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## tcao

Sisbud,

thanks for the info. I am 5'8 with inseam of 31. I think i will check out size 51.5 and also 50. One of those should fit me nicely. Thanks again for the quick reply. enjoy your bike.


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## Sisbud

Either size should fit you nicely i think. Most importantly is the saddle to handlebar drop that you can handle i think. I can only have 4.5 cm and that is why i opt for 51.5.


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## Spark

2013 Sizes for reference:
View attachment 274465


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## bmorgan4

Donn12 said:


> Bmorgan how tall are you?


I am 6"2.


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## Spark

What do you use to clean and protect your mat finish Dogma's?


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## Donn12

bmorgan4 said:


> I am 6"2.


Bmorgan how does it feel? At 6'3" you are probably right on for the 59.5. I was surprised by how much the headtube changes from size to size but you definitely need what feels good as opposed to what looks a certain way. The internet is pretty funny - people post pics of incredible bikes and then they get bombarded with a bunch of posts advising them to slam the stem.


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## Juzzy004

Spark said:


> What do you use to clean and protect your mat finish Dogma's?


Nothing other than a soft, damp cloth. Use water ONLY. Comes up sparkling every time.


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## Spark

Great, thanks Juzzy004. Some people seem to be using glass cleaner. It seems odd not being able to protect it with wax but less labour intensive I guess, I hope the finish lasts!


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## Cinelli 82220

...(delete)


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## Donn12

View attachment 274755
View attachment 274755
I pulled the trigger today. I got the Super Record EPS w/ titanium cranks, 3T bar and stem, specialized toupe+ saddle and look carbon blade pedals. After a couple of rides I realized how much I like SR EPS. Once I get the fit dialed in I am probably going to get the Most carbon stem and bar combo unit. The only thing I am undecided about is the wheels. I am torn between Zipp 303s and Campy Shamal Ultras. Right now it has demo 303s but I think I am leaning towards the Shamals so I will try them out soon.

The ride of this beast is incredible. It is like an AMG Mercedes in the fact that it is very fast and solid. Handling wise is is like a ferrari - very agile and turns like it is on rails.


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## Spark

I think the Shamal Ultra's will pair well with your new frame and awesome groupset. I also liked the look of the 202's from earlier photo's what made you choose 303 as you wheels options seem very different?


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## bmorgan4

Donn12 said:


> Bmorgan how does it feel? At 6'3" you are probably right on for the 59.5. I was surprised by how much the headtube changes from size to size but you definitely need what feels good as opposed to what looks a certain way. The internet is pretty funny - people post pics of incredible bikes and then they get bombarded with a bunch of posts advising them to slam the stem.


Donn12 - Feels great so far. I totally agree on the slammed stem comment. I have had 4 bike fits in my life, and my most recent was by a guy in Indiana who is a Biomechanics PhD as well as a CAT1 cyclist, and uses his University facility to perform very extensive bike fits. My physical therapist was also in attendance (he gets his bike fits from this guy also), and it was the first bike fit which they did not slam my stem down and throw on a 140 stem. The fit was based on my flexibility, hip ROM etc, which is why I went to buy this frame in the first place (my S2 58cm geometry did not favor where they wanted to put me). Now I can actually use my drops, and when riding in a paceline I am very comfortable and powerful. All the feet falling asleep (as well as other things) disappeared as well. I just have to get over how big the bike looks, and not judging my lack of saddle to bar drop! I am a CAT2 cyclist and I've been racing 4 years now, and I can't believe I am just now getting comfortable on my fit. He also pointed out that Mark Cav rides a mere 90mm saddle to bar drop, less that an inch! That made me feel a little better. Net, I am happy with my decision. Thanks for the feedback! 

For reference, Jeff Frame is the name of the guy who did my fit and his website is biovelofit.com. I would highly recommend him if you are in the area, I drove 2 hours to see him and it was well worth it. He spent over 4 hours with me.


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## springs

bmorgan4 said:


> He also pointed out that Mark Cav rides a mere 90mm saddle to bar drop, less that an inch!


90mm is about 3.5 inches.


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## bmorgan4

springs said:


> 90mm is about 3.5 inches.


Yes, good call. What I was thinking is that my vertical to stem drop is 1 inch greater than Cav's, albeait I am 6'2 and he is tiny. Thanks for catching that. Still not a ton of drop considering.


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## Donn12

The 303s are demo wheels. I am deciding between the Shamals and 303s.


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## Cinelli 82220

Re Mark Cavendish, the Sky mechs mentioned he actually moves his position around quite a bit, seat up and down a few cms and changes stem lengths, depending on the course and how he feels on a given day.


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## bmorgan4

Cinelli 82220 said:


> Re Mark Cavendish, the Sky mechs mentioned he actually moves his position around quite a bit, seat up and down a few cms and changes stem lengths, depending on the course and how he feels on a given day.


Really? Where did you read this? I find it hard to believe that anybody would change saddle height based on "how they feel". I could kind of see this with handlebar position, but not saddle height. Would be interested to hear more.


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## aroadbike4u

Donn12 said:


> The 303s are demo wheels. I am deciding between the Shamals and 303s.


I'm riding a 65.1 with Shamals, and one advantage is you can run them tubeless. I have some Hutchinsons on there now, and it really makes the ride more supple.


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## shoegazer

I recall watching the interview Cinelli is talking about on a Team Sky tech video, perhaps on their website or app, last year.


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## Cinelli 82220

bmorgan4 said:


> Really?


Team Sky website, interview with Gary Blem, who has worked on on Cavendish's bikes for three years.

"He knows that it's supposed to be a bit of a stupid move to drop your saddle one and a half centimetres before a 200km stage but he seems to work through that and still get the victories"

Team Sky | Pro Cycling | Performance | Inside Mark Cavendish's bike


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## crewman

I have a 55cm Pinarello Gran fondo model from last years event. It's full EPS super record, Campy Shamal ultras, Talon Most bar. I've also ot a Dogma 60.1 in a 55cm as well and do notice the shorter head tube on the new model. 

View attachment 274892


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## LouisVuitton

View attachment 275005


I just got my Dogma BOB 65.1 frame delivered today. It's a size 57.5 and weighs in at 1,670g and 245g for the seatpost.


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## Donn12

Louis how does the weight compare to the 60? It looks very nice. I never saw a BoB in person and I could not tell from pics how much is glossy vs matte.


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## bmorgan4

LouisVuitton said:


> View attachment 275005
> 
> 
> I just got my Dogma BOB 65.1 frame delivered today. It's a size 57.5 and weighs in at 1,670g and 245g for the seatpost.


Sweet looking frame. I have similar in size 59.5. Was a little surprised how much my build weighed, was unable to weight the frame seperately. This makes sense now. How do they get away advertising 920 grams for a sz. 52? Are you including the BB in that weight?


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## Spark

Great looking frame Louis, what are you going to build it with?

Mine came in at 15.6lbs which I'm quite pleased with, it's a size 560.

View attachment 275037
View attachment 275038


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## Worf

View attachment 275183


Mine is Kosher, only Italian components. Well...French pedals..


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## campagnoloneutron

OK a couple of things. 
First you keep comparing your frame to Wiggo size as reference. ...and its not just height but leg length that matters too. He has a 56cm as Pinarello marks the frame, head tube is 165mm, 177.5mm cranks seat height 82cm. (see photo of Wiggo bike attached) I believe your frame is bigger for sure, a 59.5 size? see size chart from Pinarello (column CC is how they refer to frame size). I added it to this post. check your head tube length and compare to chart is perhaps the easiest item to measure and see which one you have. 
Second. You are you. Fit to you and your needs as you are trying to do.

I do understand your reasoning for the frame size that you outline and the Cervelo in the background illustrates this well. One thing that seems not right would be the saddle position on the Pina. Looks rammed forward on the rails. This might indicate that the frame has more setback than you need. Larger frame has more setback.
The 59.5 Pina has 180mm setback and head tube 215mm
the 57.5 Pina has 168mm setback and head tube 179mm 
the 56 Pina has 164mm setback and head tube 165mm
...the next size frame smaller than what you have is likely better in this regard.
BUT at the front end, the bar and stem area ... as you say, in order to have the saddle to bar height number and be in your comfort zone you would have to run more spacers and perhaps the stem flipped as the Cervelo. In this case its a compromise I guess. Any chance to ride a one size smaller Pina for a bit to test things? I think you might be happier on that. Difficult to assess fit from distance but based on what I am seeing in the photos and some deduction that is my input. Personally I would run the smaller frame (and go with the extra spacers/ 27-30 mm of spacers is certainly not extreme) but its about you and your comfort.
What size of cranks do you run? whats your present seat height in cm from center of BB to top of saddle?
As reference I ride the 56cm size Pina and I am 6-0 tall and long legs. 175mm cranks, 79cm seat height (center BB to top of saddle) and 14cm saddle to bar drop but again thats me, I have a lot of flexibility.

Hope this helps a bit. 
View attachment 275204

View attachment 275213


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## Donn12

View attachment 275229
View attachment 275229


My new cassette came in and I decided on Zipp 303s with Ultremo ZX tires. A close second was the Shamals and I also like the looks of the Mavic R-sys SLR. The 303s seem to be very good at everything, especially over 20 mph. 
I got the black logos but I am thinking about removing all of the Zipp logos. I think it looks a little busy. What do you guys think?


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## springs

Keep 'em.


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## Spark

I think the 303's look great, it would be nice to see a picture of the whole bike with the new wheels to see how the decals look.


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## taylorttc

Im onto my second 65.1.. the first one was written off a couple of weeks ago in a quite a tumble.
Here is the new one almost ready for pick up..Swapping the Most Talon for Deda Bar and stem
I cannot tell you how amazing the Dogma is! The little extra weight has no crossed my mind once!

View attachment 275237


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## Donn12

View attachment 275257
View attachment 275248


the new photo posting system needs a little sorting out!


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## h4nc0

I am ordering mine next week finally! Been told that the wait will be about two months. Can't wait!


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## Donn12

bmorgan4 said:


> Sweet looking frame. I have similar in size 59.5. Was a little surprised how much my build weighed, was unable to weight the frame seperately. This makes sense now. How do they get away advertising 920 grams for a sz. 52? Are you including the BB in that weight?


Does that weight include the fork? if so its right on. The Dogma I bought was only .75 lbs heavier than the same size R5 I demoed. The Dogma had SR EPS, and the Cervelo had Dura Ace 9000. Same 202 wheels and look pedals for both.


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## Donn12

h4nco, what color and build?


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## bmorgan4

campagnoloneutron said:


> OK a couple of things.
> First you keep comparing your frame to Wiggo size as reference. ...and its not just height but leg length that matters too. He has a 56cm as Pinarello marks the frame, head tube is 165mm, 177.5mm cranks seat height 82cm. (see photo of Wiggo bike attached) I believe your frame is bigger for sure, a 59.5 size? see size chart from Pinarello (column CC is how they refer to frame size). I added it to this post. check your head tube length and compare to chart is perhaps the easiest item to measure and see which one you have.
> Second. You are you. Fit to you and your needs as you are trying to do.
> 
> I do understand your reasoning for the frame size that you outline and the Cervelo in the background illustrates this well. One thing that seems not right would be the saddle position on the Pina. Looks rammed forward on the rails. This might indicate that the frame has more setback than you need. Larger frame has more setback.
> The 59.5 Pina has 180mm setback and head tube 215mm
> the 57.5 Pina has 168mm setback and head tube 179mm
> the 56 Pina has 164mm setback and head tube 165mm
> ...the next size frame smaller than what you have is likely better in this regard.
> BUT at the front end, the bar and stem area ... as you say, in order to have the saddle to bar height number and be in your comfort zone you would have to run more spacers and perhaps the stem flipped as the Cervelo. In this case its a compromise I guess. Any chance to ride a one size smaller Pina for a bit to test things? I think you might be happier on that. Difficult to assess fit from distance but based on what I am seeing in the photos and some deduction that is my input. Personally I would run the smaller frame (and go with the extra spacers/ 27-30 mm of spacers is certainly not extreme) but its about you and your comfort.
> What size of cranks do you run? whats your present seat height in cm from center of BB to top of saddle?
> As reference I ride the 56cm size Pina and I am 6-0 tall and long legs. 175mm cranks, 79cm seat height (center BB to top of saddle) and 14cm saddle to bar drop but again thats me, I have a lot of flexibility.
> 
> Hope this helps a bit.
> View attachment 275204
> 
> View attachment 275213



Thanks for the info. Very helpful, and thanks for taking the time to respond with such depth. You are spot on, I have noticed the saddle is slammed forward also and that has been bothering me. Although looking at the 57.5, the saddle would still be slammed forward correct because the seat stay angle is almost the same so the extra saddle height on the smaller frame would put the saddle post in the same spot relative to the BB. That may be hard to understand...but the way I see it the setback should be measured from where your saddle is not where the top tube is for a direct comparison. And the only thing that will change this is the angle "A". 

For some reason, I also have a very large issue with running an inverted stem and spacers. I think it destroys the handling of the bike. Do you think the saddle being forward is bad for bike handling? The way I see it I am more forward so that isnt necessarily a bad thing. But when I realized my drop was much too extreme on my cervelo and I added all the spacers and flipped the stem the handling went to crap. I don't mind the larger frame size, sure it is a little heavier but I am a pretty powerful rider and have been riding cat1/2/3 for a while and not worried about it to be honest. The 57.5 does look a little more sleek, but again not with all the spacers.

Anyways, thanks again for the words of wisdom. I ordered from competitive cyclist and they have NQA returns (i asked when ordering bc i knew i was gambling on the size), so I could have my LBS tear it down and have CC send me the 57.5 should I choose to. A lot of work, but if it is the right move then so be it. Or maybe I should just have one of each


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## h4nc0

Donn12 said:


> h4nco, what color and build?


I am getting the matte black with yellow, color code 854, with Shimano 9000 mechanical. Probably going to use Mavic R-SYS SL for the time being, but I am looking forward to get Lightweight Meilenstein (gen 4) clincher in the summer.


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## bmorgan4

campagnoloneutron said:


> OK a couple of things.
> First you keep comparing your frame to Wiggo size as reference. ...and its not just height but leg length that matters too. He has a 56cm as Pinarello marks the frame, head tube is 165mm, 177.5mm cranks seat height 82cm. (see photo of Wiggo bike attached) I believe your frame is bigger for sure, a 59.5 size? see size chart from Pinarello (column CC is how they refer to frame size). I added it to this post. check your head tube length and compare to chart is perhaps the easiest item to measure and see which one you have.
> Second. You are you. Fit to you and your needs as you are trying to do.
> 
> I do understand your reasoning for the frame size that you outline and the Cervelo in the background illustrates this well. One thing that seems not right would be the saddle position on the Pina. Looks rammed forward on the rails. This might indicate that the frame has more setback than you need. Larger frame has more setback.
> The 59.5 Pina has 180mm setback and head tube 215mm
> the 57.5 Pina has 168mm setback and head tube 179mm
> the 56 Pina has 164mm setback and head tube 165mm
> ...the next size frame smaller than what you have is likely better in this regard.
> BUT at the front end, the bar and stem area ... as you say, in order to have the saddle to bar height number and be in your comfort zone you would have to run more spacers and perhaps the stem flipped as the Cervelo. In this case its a compromise I guess. Any chance to ride a one size smaller Pina for a bit to test things? I think you might be happier on that. Difficult to assess fit from distance but based on what I am seeing in the photos and some deduction that is my input. Personally I would run the smaller frame (and go with the extra spacers/ 27-30 mm of spacers is certainly not extreme) but its about you and your comfort.
> What size of cranks do you run? whats your present seat height in cm from center of BB to top of saddle?
> As reference I ride the 56cm size Pina and I am 6-0 tall and long legs. 175mm cranks, 79cm seat height (center BB to top of saddle) and 14cm saddle to bar drop but again thats me, I have a lot of flexibility.
> 
> Hope this helps a bit.
> View attachment 275204
> 
> View attachment 275213


BTW, my saddle to BB measurement is 81cm, and I like to run a saddle to bar drop between 7-11 depending on crit/RR. I can currently run my 59.5 frame with no spacers comfortably which I like. If I was on the 57.5 I would need to throw in 28mm of spacers to get to that same spot (or of course an inverted stem). I think I could handle running the 57.5 frame with 20mm of spacers, which wouldn't be a terrible lot. What do you guys think? Weight is not a consideration here, it is which frame would perform better under me. Is it more important to have slightly less saddle setback or size up the frame so you can drop the stem for front end stiffness??


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## Spark

Sounds good and they are worth the wait. Please post some pictures when it's ready.


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## Michael15

h4nc0 said:


> I am getting the matte black with yellow, color code 854, with Shimano 9000 mechanical. Probably going to use Mavic R-SYS SL for the time being, but I am looking forward to get Lightweight Meilenstein (gen 4) clincher in the summer.


Oh my! I'm drooling over some Lightweight Meilenstein clinchers.... My wife would SHOOT me!:thumbsup:


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## h4nc0

Michael15 said:


> Oh my! I'm drooling over some Lightweight Meilenstein clinchers.... My wife would SHOOT me!:thumbsup:


I am looking for some feedback on the newer Gen 4 clincher set. It seems not many people have them yet. I've seen some bad reports of their Gen 3 clinchers, so I am a bit worried.


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## Spark

h4nc0 said:


> I am looking for some feedback on the newer Gen 4 clincher set. It seems not many people have them yet. I've seen some bad reports of their Gen 3 clinchers, so I am a bit worried.


I think you will struggle to find many opinions as they are so new. I'm sure any issues from the previous set have been ironed out and carbon sports have a crash replacement scheme for an extra 10%. 

I had the gen3 tubular, they were super stiff and looked amazing. My only criticisms are they did not seem to hold speed well 24mph+ on the flat and I was always a little worried about the spokes when transporting the bike. If I buy another set it will be the clincher version, if you can try and demo a set as most dealers will have a demo available.


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## LouisVuitton

Donn12 said:


> Louis how does the weight compare to the 60? It looks very nice. I never saw a BoB in person and I could not tell from pics how much is glossy vs matte.


I kept record of all the weights of the same size Dogma frames. I originally purchased a 2012 Dogma 2 frame but returned it when I was told that the 65.1 were available for orders.

2010 Pinarello Dogma 60.1
57.5cm
Frame & Fork: 1,890g
Seatpost: 350g
Total: 2,240g

2012 Pinarello Dogma 2 
57.5cm
Frame: 1,250g
Fork: 475g
Seatpost: 240g
Total: 2,005g

2013 Pinarello Dogma 65.1
57.5cm
Frame: 1,670g
Seatpost: 245g
Total: 1,915g


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## h4nc0

Just ordered mine today in size 515. I am 177cm tall with inseam of 82cm. Sounds alright? ^^


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## Sisbud

I wanted to change my groupset from mechanical onto di2 on my dogma 65.1
However, i dont seem able to find the bottom bracket cover that acts as the battery mount as well.
Is it supplied along with the frame? Or do i need to buy it separately? Thanks


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## Juzzy004

If your frame is genuine, you should have already received the bracket in question when you purchased it.
If you bought the bike build complete from a LBS and did not receive this part, go back to them.
Stores like Gita and Glory Cycles can supply these parts when you provide a serial number of the frame.


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## think2

*bmorgan: Nice Bike!*



bmorgan4 said:


> BTW, my saddle to BB measurement is 81cm, and I like to run a saddle to bar drop between 7-11 depending on crit/RR. I can currently run my 59.5 frame with no spacers comfortably which I like. If I was on the 57.5 I would need to throw in 28mm of spacers to get to that same spot (or of course an inverted stem). I think I could handle running the 57.5 frame with 20mm of spacers, which wouldn't be a terrible lot. What do you guys think? Weight is not a consideration here, it is which frame would perform better under me. Is it more important to have slightly less saddle setback or size up the frame so you can drop the stem for front end stiffness??


 I had a 58 cm, H2 Madone 6.2 with a + 6 stem and all the spacers plus the bar was rotated slightly up. It was too small for me I would get tendonitis on the fronts of my knees because I couldn't raise the seat high enough. I'm 6'2.5 and I just purchase a 59.5 think2. I have a 35.25" inseam and very flexible. I was considering endurance, especialy on century rides. Rode a 61 cm Roubaix rental on a century in April and it was great for endurance.


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## h4nc0

Just got mine yesterday. Color code 854 in size 515. 

View attachment 281399


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## h4nc0

sorry fixed the image link.


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## Donn12

H4nco - that bike is gorgeous. Is that 9070? Did you consider campy? I think the wheels look PERFECT !


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## h4nc0

Donn12 said:


> H4nco - that bike is gorgeous. Is that 9070? Did you consider campy? I think the wheels look PERFECT !


Thanks! Yeah, it's 9070. I did consider Campy, but went with Shimano since it's cheaper and newer. I got the Lightweight Meilenstein tubulars instead of clinchers after much consideration.


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## Donn12

Is the battery in the seat post or behind the chain ring? I actually began wanting 9070 and when my LBS got a bike in to remove for me they did not think the bat would go in the seat post. It already had EPS installed so they helped me a little on the price and I left it on.


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## h4nc0

Donn12 said:


> Is the battery in the seat post or behind the chain ring? I actually began wanting 9070 and when my LBS got a bike in to remove for me they did not think the bat would go in the seat post. It already had EPS installed so they helped me a little on the price and I left it on.


Yes, the battery is in the seat post.


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## Cinelli 82220

h4nc0 said:


> Yes, the battery is in the seat post.


Do you glue it inside the post? I want to try putting mine there.


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## h4nc0

Cinelli 82220 said:


> Do you glue it inside the post? I want to try putting mine there.


sorry no idea. my lbs did the work.


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## Donn12

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/bikes-frames-forks/cervelo-r5-what-others-consider-291503.html

I was a little turned off by the exposed cables on the R5. To me internal routing looks so clean by comparison. The matte color on the R5 is more of a grey than I had hoped for and the red accents on the bike clashed with the red accents on the bar stem and seat post. None of this really mattered when I demo'd both bikes. I loved the R5 when I rode it 5 miles. I then took the Dogma out and decided to get it after about 4 feet. The thing feels incredible. much more solid and stable than the R5. the R5 felt a little fragile by comparison. I was very apprehensive when I went back to the LBS though because I expected the Dogma to weigh almost 2 lbs more. instead a 58cm DA9000 R5 w 202s and demo look pedals came in at 14.7 and the 57.5 dogma w 202s and SR EPS came in at 15.4. I was going to get the dogma anyway based on how great it felt but I was afraid the weight would be so much of a difference it would always bother me. Be sure not to demo a bike with EPS because you will be ruined. My plan was sram red and my old wheels....Plus or minus 7k. after a 40 mile demo I ended up having to have eps and zipp 303s


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## Cinelli 82220

^ Very much my experience. I tried an R5, it was good but felt almost brittle or jittery.
The Dogma is smooth like butter.
Weight is no big deal to me.


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## gapple88

Mine... Giro italia colors in gloss.... SR11 mechanical group set and deda stem n bar.

At the LBS









After the first wet ride.... I removed the rim decals....








Enjoy...


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## Juzzy004

Gee - I really liked it with the Bora decals! Beautiful frame though. Enjoy your rides.


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## antihero77

Beauty gapple. I have the giro dogma2. I like the dogma2 scheme a bit better. Does not say pinarello on it. And I find the dogma 2 is a bit more plush of a ride then the 65.1. 
But yours is beautiful


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## Donn12

In my humble opinion it looks much better without the wheel decals. the lettering on these bikes is a little loud and I think the bold lettering on the wheels has a little too much going on.


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## GogglesPizano

Nice Ride, just got mine last week. D-ace Di2 with C35's
View attachment 283728


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## gapple88

I must admit I wanted to keep the decals but it look way too busy....

I started with a black / neon green prince in 2007 and proceeded to 2011 CDE dogma (holy trinity of bike colors)

This current color scheme is my favorite. The ride is the best of both prince and the dogma....if I may describe it as such.....

My other bike is a trek madone 6.9 Spartacus project one.... The 65.1 wins...


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## Rider07

gapple88 said:


> I must admit I wanted to keep the decals but it look way too busy....
> 
> I started with a black / neon green prince in 2007 and proceeded to 2011 CDE dogma (holy trinity of bike colors)
> 
> This current color scheme is my favorite. The ride is the best of both prince and the dogma....if I may describe it as such.....
> 
> My other bike is a trek madone 6.9 Spartacus project one.... The 65.1 wins...



OK, setting myself up to be slaughtered;
I have a 2010 6.9 H2 Trek, Dura Ace and Bontrager Aolus 5’s, and a 2013 Dogma Think 2, Record electric and same wheels as the Trek.
They are both great bikes. I find the Trek way more enjoyable on long rides. Seems to absorb the bumps better. The Dogma was my dream bike. I really do like it but it is harsh. I have done a few centuries on it and would have preferred the Trek. I have now set the Trek up for climbing- I am in Europe working all summer with plenty of hills in the area, and the Dogma is set up for home- flat south Florida, mostly group rides.
The Dogma is an unbelievable bike-no regrets. Both are better than I deserve.


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## Donn12

Rider07 said:


> OK, setting myself up to be slaughtered;
> I have a 2010 6.9 H2 Trek, Dura Ace and Bontrager Aolus 5’s, and a 2013 Dogma Think 2, Record electric and same wheels as the Trek.
> They are both great bikes. I find the Trek way more enjoyable on long rides. Seems to absorb the bumps better. The Dogma was my dream bike. I really do like it but it is harsh. I have done a few centuries on it and would have preferred the Trek. I have now set the Trek up for climbing- I am in Europe working all summer with plenty of hills in the area, and the Dogma is set up for home- flat south Florida, mostly group rides.
> The Dogma is an unbelievable bike-no regrets. Both are better than I deserve.


I dont think you will get slaughtered...a H2 trek should be more comfy. the dogma is a race bike which happens to be very comfortable. the new Dogma K coming out in 2014 will be a little bit of both


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## gapple88

Rider07 said:


> OK, setting myself up to be slaughtered;
> I have a 2010 6.9 H2 Trek, Dura Ace and Bontrager Aolus 5’s, and a 2013 Dogma Think 2, Record electric and same wheels as the Trek.
> They are both great bikes. I find the Trek way more enjoyable on long rides. Seems to absorb the bumps better. The Dogma was my dream bike. I really do like it but it is harsh. I have done a few centuries on it and would have preferred the Trek. I have now set the Trek up for climbing- I am in Europe working all summer with plenty of hills in the area, and the Dogma is set up for home- flat south Florida, mostly group rides.
> The Dogma is an unbelievable bike-no regrets. Both are better than I deserve.


I tend to agree with you....


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## T-Dog

I had one and sold it. Way to heavy and not a great ride. I bought a Giant TCR Sl Advanced and I love it. Its the bike I have ever ridden. 

If you don't believe me check my history and you will see I've had a Dogma, A Prince of Spain, Prince SL and a F413. I was Pinarello through and through but believe it or not Giant is a much better bike.


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## Donn12

T-Dog said:


> I had one and sold it. Way to heavy and not a great ride. I bought a Giant TCR Sl Advanced and I love it. Its the bike I have ever ridden.
> 
> If you don't believe me check my history and you will see I've had a Dogma, A Prince of Spain, Prince SL and a F413. I was Pinarello through and through but believe it or not Giant is a much better bike.


I have read good things about giant but I have not seen any I thought looked very good. My impression of them is they sell a bunch of blue and black bikes with white letters to mostly older heavier guys starting out. That might be way off but its what I usually see. My LBS doesn't stock giant and I dont usually see them in articles about 'super bikes' etc
I went in for a Cervelo R5 and was told "its a good bike if you are okay with zero aesthetic appeal". it was parked next to a dogma 65.1 and an s-works venge and it looked like a base model Mustang parked next to a ferrari and a lambo! I bought the dogma because of how it rode but the looks are a big bonus.


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## Cinelli 82220

I seriously am wondering how much difference the weight makes. The two first finishers on Mount Ventoux were both on Dogma 65's. Ahead of the superlight SL4 and Madone. Surely if the Dogma was such a heavy beast it would be a big disadvantage to the riders. 

I also wonder if someone could tell the difference between a 15 pound bike and a 16 pound bike, either by picking them up or riding.


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## antihero77

I can actually respond to you Cinelli. I have a Dogma2 and a brand new sl4 sworks.
Sworks is a lighter bike. I was blown away when I purchased this bike even started a thread to sell my dogma2. Well that was very premature. The Sworks is much lighter then the dogma2. Fells like a climbers bike. But when I get back on the dogma just feels like a super stiff TT bike. The dogma is just such a wicked beast of a bike so hence it is not for sale any more. What does 1 pound of weight diff mean between both bikes NOTHING. when you are 160 pounds you still have to carry 160 plus 15 or 16 poundfs up a hill which translate to no diff. I can understand quintana who is riding a 49 and weighs 125 pounds. He propels up those mountains so easy why? Because no one else has the stiffness to weight as a Dogma.


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## bensinep

gapple88 said:


> I must admit I wanted to keep the decals but it look way too busy....
> 
> I started with a black / neon green prince in 2007 and proceeded to 2011 CDE dogma (holy trinity of bike colors)
> 
> This current color scheme is my favorite. The ride is the best of both prince and the dogma....if I may describe it as such.....
> 
> My other bike is a trek madone 6.9 Spartacus project one.... The 65.1 wins...


+1 on the CDE livery. Best looking bike I've ever seen. The bass-boat red sparkle was awesome. I'd love to add a CDE Dogma 60.1 to my stable. The Dogma 2 and 65.1 patterns just don't do it for me. Pinarello's painting peaked with the original Dogma (of course if I could find myself one of those red-yellow Prince of Spain Princes, I'd jump on that as well.


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## karhu

*new dogma 65.1 frame question*

Does anybody have experience building new Dogma 65.1 with SR EPS? Campagnolo manual requires Bb chasing and facing. Is it typically a case with Dogma's BB?


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## Cinelli 82220

Don't chase or face the BB. It should be fine as delivered.


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