# Reports on FP Due and FP Team?



## AJ88V (Nov 14, 2012)

Hi folks - Trying to get some intel on the FP Due and the FP Team. They are both (sort of) in my price range as 2012 leftovers. My current bike (Litespeed M3) is very nice, but I made the mistake of riding someone's 2008 Paris and now I really want a Pinarello for ride, speed, and responsiveness. Any ride reports would be appreciated. Thank you.


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## jwl325 (Feb 3, 2010)

Hi AJ, and welcome. 

I didn't want to be the first to respond here, as I'm a Pina rookie myself, and I know there are many here more knowledgeable than I...but FWIW, I'll share my opinion. 

I can identify with your impulse to "shop up", LOL...I recently decided to treat myself to a Pina, and the shopping experience quickly escalated from a used bike to an FPQ. 

In my humble (and admittedly rookie) opinion, the Due is a very nice bike for the money. In my case, I was looking to upgrade the available groups along with delving in to the CF world. 

If the "FP Team" you're referencing is the Competitive model, it certainly seems like a very nice package--from what I read of the specs, it sounds almost identical to the FPQ in terms of CF quality, available grouppo, etc., but at a great discounted price.

Good luck with your choice!


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## AJ88V (Nov 14, 2012)

Thanks, JW. Indeed it is the FP Team from Competitive that has caught my eye, but my son is not sure if that is asymmetric or not and he thinks the asymmetric is a big deal. I saw both a 2013 Due (Shimano 105) and a 2012 Quattro at the LBS. The Quattro was clearly out of my price range there, but the Due was not. 

The Due cheaper online with SRAM is a much better deal than the LBS, plus year doesn't matter to me. The Quattro at the LBS was definitely out of my $-range, but the FP Team at Competitive is under $2600 *and it's in RED* (love the RED!) 

There are two big things I love riding my son's '08 Paris: (1) isolation from road shock - not so much the big stuff, but all the little ripples and cracks in the pavement; and (2) the thing just goes - I must be 2 mph faster on that bike - really! - and when you stomp on it, it just moves out in a way that my fairly responsive Litespeed just does not. I didn't think there could be so much difference between bikes, but there is! I also love his Campy Chorus and shifting 5 gears in a swipe either direction, but that's not gonna happen at my price point. 

FWIW, I'm in my 50's and typical rides are 25 to 60 miles at a modest pace, and a few longer rides per year. Not trying to set the world on fire, but I dearly love my son's Pina. Maybe I should just steal it.

Or, I could make him pay for his own college, and then I could afford a new Dogma! With electrics! I'm liking this idea!


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## martinrm (Jul 30, 2012)

AJ88V said:


> Thanks, JW. Indeed it is the FP Team from Competitive that has caught my eye, but my son is not sure if that is asymmetric or not and he thinks the asymmetric is a big deal. I saw both a 2013 Due (Shimano 105) and a 2012 Quattro at the LBS. The Quattro was clearly out of my price range there, but the Due was not.
> 
> The Due cheaper online with SRAM is a much better deal than the LBS, plus year doesn't matter to me. The Quattro at the LBS was definitely out of my $-range, but the FP Team at Competitive is under $2600 *and it's in RED* (love the RED!)
> 
> ...


Well i have to say i agree with most of your points, but the last one obviously. I think schools an investment into a child's future and is far more important than materialistic items. I can sympathize with you when you say that your sons pina is a hoot to ride, because i absolutely love riding mine (honestly i cannot wait to go riding on the weekends) however; i bet you envy riding his in the first place. 

You realize that you are going to have to get your wife a pina too . . . thats how it works with these things. 

IMO, I think the Team is a better bike. The team looks to be asymmetric however there is no branding on the bike. There is a difference between the asymmetric systems used on the team compared to that of the dogma or paris. Meaning different parts of the frames are asymmetric. According to the youtube video produced by competitive cyclist, the teams fork, chain stays, and downtube are all asymmetric. However on the paris and dogma, the toptube and head tube are also asymmetric. Nevertheless you will still feel extremely balanced on this bike. The team uses higher grade carbon, so your going to get the stiffness and responsiveness that your look for. Keep in mind both the Due and the Team have 12k Weaves, so you will feel a difference in stiffness there. Again better group set with the team than the due and you get that fancy dogma paint job. 

Im sure what ever you end up getting you will enjoy. 

I would suggust taking a look at the geometries of the bike and compare that to the paris, its up to you if you want a racier or relaxed feel. Compare the head tube angles, and lengths. Pinarello Geometry - Competitive Cyclist


Source: Pinarello FP Team Ultegra Shimano 6700 - YouTube


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## aureliajulia (May 25, 2009)

The 2 you mention have a less dense carbon layup, and are entry-level bikes. Especially the FP Team. The geometry on the FP Team is designed for beginners according to Pina website. (I think that's where I read that).

The Paris has 50K carbon, and no flex. It's very very responsive. Much more so than the Due (I did test a Due), but, of course, pricey.

The Due has asymmetrical fork and stays, nothing else, the Paris is asymmetrical throughout. 

Might I suggest the Quattro? It's made from the same molds as the Paris, but a less expensive (but still very stiff) carbon. You should be able to get a SRAM Force/Rival setup for around 3 grand. I believe I've seen it for 2800.00 online in a couple of places. I know that's more than the others. But, the carbon is 30 K, much better than the other 2, and the geometry and design are (I think) identical or very close to the Paris. I have a 2012 Quattro, and tested the Due. No comparison. The components, frame set, and wheels on the Quattro are all much higher than the Due. I believe the FP team is lower than the Due. The Quattro is responsive, smooth, and corners like it's on rails. Also very stiff with no flex. Incredibly close to the Paris, but far cheaper.

If you can't find a way to get the Quattro, and have to have one of the others, fine. Personally, I'd find a way, or wait until next year's sale and save for it. Maybe open a club account or some such, and wait until you can afford it. The price difference is minimal considering the difference in what you get.


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## martinrm (Jul 30, 2012)

aureliajulia said:


> The 2 you mention have a less dense carbon layup, and are entry-level bikes. Especially the FP Team. The geometry on the FP Team is designed for beginners according to Pina website. (I think that's where I read that).
> 
> The Paris has 50K carbon, and no flex. It's very very responsive. Much more so than the Due (I did test a Due), but, of course, pricey.
> 
> ...


Uhm, the FP Quattro uses the same carbon weave as he FP Team , both are 30HM12k - And no, the FP team is above the Due. Another thing i would like to contest is that you call the geometry of the FP Team relaxed, well in fact the head tube is the same height as both the paris and dogma, and. . . the sloping downtube angles are the same. Where the bike differs from the quattro is the asymmetry in the frame. Still i wouldn't say the team is entry level, it has an aggressive geometry and fairly stiff.

Needless to say, the Quattro does have the upper hand because it uses the same mold as the paris, only with a different carbon. Practically the same bike but at a much cheaper price. A little bit of research does confirm that the going price of the quattro is about 3k. However at the price point i would still give it to the Team.


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## aureliajulia (May 25, 2009)

martinrm said:


> Uhm, the FP Quattro uses the same carbon weave as he FP Team , both are 30HM12k - And no the FP team is above the Due. You are right about the geometry though, the FP Team is more relaxed than the quattro. . . meaning the quattro is a real race bike.Still i wouldn't say the team is entry level, it has an aggressive geometry and fairly stiff.


Okay, hadn't seen the team in person, only read about it.

But I did ride the Due, seemed very cheaply made by comparison. For the money, not really worth it. 

(Let me google a bit for the prices I mentioned.

Edit: here it is for just under $2800.00.


The white/red/black is gorgeous. 

My opinion is if you are looking for the ride you found on the Paris, you are going to be very disappointed in the Due and FP Team. And I think by 'entry level' you have to consider that this is a Pina, they mean compared to their racing bikes. But I did read that the team was designed for someone just getting into cycling, and I believe that came from Pina. You (OP) sound like an experienced cyclist, so probably won't be happy on it. Certainly wouldn't spend 2.5 grand for it in hopes of finding something similar to the Paris.


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## jwl325 (Feb 3, 2010)

Maybe you should offer to buy your son's Paris and help him get a Dogma! 

Was just looking over the Team again...I'm guessing there are some geometry differences (maybe the comparison link above would list them), but just looking at the pics, it looks to me almost like an earlier FPQ bike (external cabling). The LBS over here had a 2011 FPQ in the shop that appears very similar to the Competitive Cyclist Team. Unfortunately, it wasn't in my size, so I wound up buying a 2012 (well, unfortunately isn't the right word, but you know what I mean--I could have saved a few bucks).

Just guessing on my part, but given the Team uses the same 30HM/12K CF, do you think maybe the Teams are pre-2012 FPQ frames refinished as a special run for CC? Maybe one of the more Pina-smart folks here might know? 

On a related note, I seem to recall a discussion here recently by someone else buying a CC Pina, and they mentioned that they can occasionally deal on their listed price over the phone...sorry I don't have a link handy to the discussion at the moment.


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## AJ88V (Nov 14, 2012)

This is all been very helpful, folks. I really appreciate the conversation.

I am really shying away from the FP Due. Too bad, because that's the one I can most afford. Don't we all suffer through this rationalization crap?!



martinrm said:


> Well i have to say i agree with most of your points, but the last one obviously. I think schools an investment into a child's future and is far more important than materialistic items. I can sympathize with you when you say that your sons pina is a hoot to ride, because i absolutely love riding mine (honestly i cannot wait to go riding on the weekends) however; i bet you envy riding his in the first place.





jwl325 said:


> Maybe you should offer to buy your son's Paris and help him get a Dogma!


My son is a great kid and I am very proud of him, but why am I going bankrupt paying for college so he can spend all his money on bicycles I can't afford? Still, college is a worthy investment, so maybe I should just make him pay his own car insurance? Saving $1200 a year on that would be enough to pop me up to a Quattro. Good idea? 



jwl325 said:


> Was just looking over the Team again...I'm guessing there are some geometry differences (maybe the comparison link above would list them), but just looking at the pics, it looks to me almost like an earlier FPQ bike (external cabling). <snip> Just guessing on my part, but given the Team uses the same 30HM/12K CF, do you think maybe the Teams are pre-2012 FPQ frames refinished as a special run for CC? Maybe one of the more Pina-smart folks here might know?


You might be right. The FP Team really looks a lot like the Quattro, not identical, but very similar in geometry details plus the same carbon fiber.

The Team gives me some pause, however, as the chainrings are listed as 53/39, which is pretty tall for an old guy like me on the hills, and even if I do strengthen up a bit, my wife would never keep up with me, leaving me without my riding buddy. I found a 34T small ring listed for the Ultegra FC-6750 listed on Amazon, so maybe that could be swapped in to give me a little more hill climbing ability. I might call CC and ask what they think.



aureliajulia said:


> Okay, hadn't seen the team in person, only read about it.
> 
> But I did ride the Due, seemed very cheaply made by comparison. For the money, not really worth it.
> 
> ...


That looks VERY attractive, and I agree about the RED. Almost all my toys are red when I get a choice. (But the $5.99 shipping will probably kill the deal. LOL!) Would prefer CC based on reputation and their warranty, so this might make a good bargaining position. Then again, Glory is offering it in RED and the best CC has is the White/Silver.

Thanks again, guys!


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## jwl325 (Feb 3, 2010)

AJ88, don't know if you're still on the fence, but I just got an email from CC mentioning a 1-day sale on select bikes/frames, and the Pina Team is included. FYI....

Pina Team on sale


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## AJ88V (Nov 14, 2012)

jwl325 said:


> AJ88, don't know if you're still on the fence, but I just got an email from CC mentioning a 1-day sale on select bikes/frames, and the Pina Team is included. FYI....


Bill - I was just about to start a new thread asking for the differences between the 2011 and the 2012 Paris models. I found a 2011 Paris frame in my size and jhave figured out a way to build it up with SRAM Force for a total around $3700 total. I was waiting for my Pina-riding son - home for Thanksgiving - to wake up and talk me into pulling the trigger. 

Now you show me that FP Team on sale and I can save a whole ton of cash with that bike. I might even swap over my SRAM Rival shifters from the Litespeed if I don't like the Shimano stuff. 

Damn, just when I thought I had it figured out!

*********

Afternoon update - Had that FP Team loaded in my cart and was about to pull the trigger when my son mentioned that the Team is ranked below the Due on the Pina website. Just for grins, I looked at the Pina site to see what they said about the Team and when we clicked the Team geometry, it says "FP Team/Uno" so, *the FP Team is a Pinarello Uno frame with a slightly better carbon fiber.*

Still looking......


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## jwl325 (Feb 3, 2010)

Interesting AJ...I thought the Uno was an Al bike....


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## martinrm (Jul 30, 2012)

There are both carbon and al versions of the FP Uno. The carbon Uno uses, 24HMUnidirectional Carbon

Source: 
CICLI PINARELLO S.p.A.
CICLI PINARELLO S.p.A.


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## AJ88V (Nov 14, 2012)

martinrm said:


> There are both carbon and al versions of the FP Uno. The carbon Uno uses, 24HMUnidirectional Carbon


Thanks, Martin. This is right. It's interesting that the Pina site says the 23HMU carbin is superior to the carbon the FP Team.


> The FPUNO Carbon incorporates the same technologies as the FPTEAM but uses a superior carbon structure thanks to the 24HMUD (unidirectional carbon).
> ONDA rear triangle and fork with conical steer tube (1 1/8" top, 1 ½" bottom) 7 sloping sizes to ensure a perfect fit.


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## jwl325 (Feb 3, 2010)

martinrm said:


> There are both carbon and al versions of the FP Uno. The carbon Uno uses, 24HMUnidirectional Carbon
> 
> Source:
> CICLI PINARELLO S.p.A.
> CICLI PINARELLO S.p.A.


Thanks Martin! That clears that question up. My 2012 paper catalog here in Italy only shows the Uno as a an Al frame.

Bill


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