# Newbie First Bike



## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

Hi, I've ridden an old hybrid for ages, but I'd like to get into cycling properly. I'm a 16 year old male, and I have a high level of fitness as I am into long distance running, and enjoy cycling, so I thought I'd get into it more seriously. I am looking to spend about £250 on a road bike (I'm going to buy a new one, as I don't know what to look for with a second hand bike). I don't want to spend loads of money, as I am still growing (slowly) so I wouldn't want to outgrow a bike. 

Could you suggest a good bike for me? 

Is there any other info that would help come to a decision?

cheers,
Ben:thumbsup:


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## Mailmover (Mar 29, 2011)

I would first begin by, going to your Local Bike Shop and check their Bulletin Board, if they have one, for Bikes for sale. And, I would chat with the employees and owner about which bike would be best for you and if they knew of anyone wanting to sell a bike in your price range. Do your research before buying, ask if you can take it to your Bike Shop for them to look at and test ride each bike!


MM


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## RagbraiNewB (May 21, 2008)

I did the Hybrid-to-Road Bike transition, couldn't believe the performance gains on long rides. I went to a low level aluminum frame bike with carbon forks, seatpost and rear stays. That gave me a pretty good value for the money. 

That said, for 250 pounds, I think you are going to be frustrated by what is available as a new bike in a bike shop. I think everyone is going to tell you to get a second hand bike, preferably from someone who thought he was going to become a cyclist, bought a decent bike, and then never rode it. And if you do get a carboniferous bike, make sure you have a good mechanic check it out for you. It will be worth the money to be extra sure it hasn't been crashed before.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

Thanks for the replies. TBH, I'm probably not going to be allowed to buy a second hand bike (my parents don't like buying things second hand). I have found the carrera virtuoso at halfords, is it any good? I know it's not going to be great, but at 16 I don't think I need an amazing bike, and I'm not allowed to buy a really good one second hand.

what do you think?

cheers,
Ben


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## RagbraiNewB (May 21, 2008)

We don't have Halford's over here in the US of A, but I gather from a google search that this is a house brand bike for a major sporting goods retailer. My guess from the little info on it is that it's a perfectly all right bike that will get you from point A to point B. (Over and over on this website riders far more experienced than myself say that the rider is a far more important performance variable than the bike.)

Like all cyclists, you'll benefit from finding a short series of classes on how to maintain and do basic repairs on your machine. One review I read of the Carrera Virtuoso said that after a year or two the owner upgraded some of the components because the original equipment wasn't very durable, and if when the time comes you are able to do that yourself, you'll save a lot of money.


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## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

Ben M said:


> Thanks for the replies. TBH, I'm probably not going to be allowed to buy a second hand bike (my parents don't like buying things second hand). I have found the carrera virtuoso at halfords, is it any good? I know it's not going to be great, but at 16 I don't think I need an amazing bike, and I'm not allowed to buy a really good one second hand.
> what do you think?
> cheers,
> Ben


You don't say why your parents don't like buying things second-hand, but maybe they have a general impression that one can't rely on the condition of used articles. You might try to persuade them that bicycles are a bit different from most articles; and indeed they are. A bicycle can be maintained, and have parts replaced, very easily. It's easy for a bike-shop mechanic, or an experienced cyclist, to quickly evaluate the condition of a bicycle and almost every part of it. This is quite different form a car, for example.

The bottom line is that a used bicycle can be purchased with considerable confidence if one takes a little care, and it can last a long time. There are plenty of people on this board who ride thousands of miles a year on bicycles that are 10, 20, even 30 years old, with worn parts replaced as required.

If you spend your 250 pounds on a 5-year-old bicycle, you will get a far better machine than the same money will buy new. It won't necessarily be "amazing," but it will be a bike you can grow with as a rider, if you stick with the sport. 

You seem to be an articulate young man. Perhaps you can apply some persuasive power to your parents. A bunch of mostly American cyclists on the internet might be of assistance (but then again, perhaps not ;-)


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

Sorry, I forgot you were in the USA. Yeah, the carrera range is Halfords own brand (halfords sells loads of vehicle related stuff). 

My dad knows what he's doing with a lot of these sorts of things, as he restores motorbikes, so he'll give me a hand and I'll make sure I read up on how to look after and upgrade the bike.

So does this bike sound good for me? I can't seem to find any other bikes of a similar price, are there any others I should be looking at?

cheers,
Ben


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

JCavilia said:


> You don't say why your parents don't like buying things second-hand, but maybe they have a general impression that one can't rely on the condition of used articles. You might try to persuade them that bicycles are a bit different from most articles; and indeed they are. A bicycle can be maintained, and have parts replaced, very easily. It's easy for a bike-shop mechanic, or an experienced cyclist, to quickly evaluate the condition of a bicycle and almost every part of it. This is quite different form a car, for example.
> 
> The bottom line is that a used bicycle can be purchased with considerable confidence if one takes a little care, and it can last a long time. There are plenty of people on this board who ride thousands of miles a year on bicycles that are 10, 20, even 30 years old, with worn parts replaced as required.
> 
> ...


Sorry, I missed your reply.

My parents seem to be of the opinion that everybody is out to rip you off. If I ever mention getting something second hand they assume the person is only selling it in the first place because it is broken. 

I often try to persuade my parents, but often without result, as they are very stubborn. I finally got them to make an ebay account and a paypal account, which was the biggest achievement. I've looked on ebay, and there seem to be a lot of bikes locally for sale. The problem is that I don't really know much about them and what I'm looking for. Are there any basic things that I should look for in a bike?

Also, how would I go about getting a bike looked over by a bike shop? Could I let them check it out before I buy it, and is it very costly to do so?

I do like the idea of getting a used bike, as I see what you mean about it being better quality. Where are the best places to look for used bikes?

cheers,
Ben


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## mvallejo (Aug 31, 2011)

I also will not buy a used bike. I made the mistake once, checked it out and the thing worked well... but turned out to be a complete piece of garbage and waste of money. It was more my fault for not fully inspecting the bike and lack of knowledge of my purchase.

I always buy my bikes new. Buying new, you know the product will do what its supposed to and do it well. It has not depreciated yet and will have a longer life span, plus you get the benefits your LBS offers. 

That said, I agree that at 250 GBP (~410$), you really wont be able to find anything great to buy new. I'm not sure what Halfords is, but if it is a large chain sporting good store, I'd stay away from it. Like I said, I'm not sure about it, but I know the sports stores here don't sell good bikes. However, it it is a bike chain store, like Performance Cycling (USA chain store), then I'd have a little more faith.

I think a semi-used road bike is probably the best route for obtaining a bike in that price range. Good luck!


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## mvallejo (Aug 31, 2011)

I looked up Halford's, and it does seem like a decent chain store to go to for bikes. It seems somewhat like Tri-Sports or a Performance cycle we have here. I also saw the Carrera Virtuouso you mentioned. It looks like it could be a nice entry level bike. The componentry isn't great, and I'm not sure about a steel fork, but if you want to buy new in that price range, it might be decent.


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## Roam (Sep 14, 2011)

I'm planning on buying a used bike...any tips?


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## ezrida (Aug 20, 2011)

ride the bike and make sure it fits, take it to a lbs for an inspection if at all possible, especially if it's carbon fiber. Ride safe


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## ncc80brian (Jul 30, 2011)

If it's your first bike I would go to Performance and find a clearance bike for a good deal. But maybe go to lbs first to discuss fit.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

I think I'll go and have a look at the virtuoso. It should cost £380, so I think it'll be good enough for what I want.

cheers,
Ben


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## ldp205 (Sep 13, 2011)

Hello.
I'm also looking to transition from hybrid to (first) road bike. I live in Israel, so prices and model availability maybe a bit different here.
The feel of a road bike is so different it is a bit hard to understand the philosophy of seeing which one feels the best. I ride a hybrid and/or mtb regularly and the road bikes I've tried feel really different. Do I need to rent before I buy?
Anyway - assuming I don't (I'll leave it to the experts to let me know) - I was looking at a 2010 Specialized Allez Triple yesterday at my LBS. Unused (seems odd to say "new" about a 2010 model).
As far as people selling their bikes (i.e. used bikes) I saw/spoke to sellers of a used 2005 Trek 1000 (Shimano) - for %60 of the price of the Specialized - or for %70 of the new bike a 2005/6 (owner wasn't sure) Pinarello Angliru (Mirage). 
What do the experts say about the choices and new vs. used? LBS vs. private sale?
The money makes a difference but I could scrape together the amount for the new bike - I would just want to be sure that it is obviously the best way to go.
TIA.


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## ldp205 (Sep 13, 2011)

After reading through more of the posts in the Beginner's Corner, including (from JayTree):
[...]
3. Can I get a better deal by buying used? Well, of course. The used bike market is notoriously soft, and that means that a used 2005 bike, for example, can cost 1/3 to 1/2 less than it did new on the floor. That $700 you want to spend can get you much more bang for the buck. But if you don't know what you are doing, you may wind up with a bike that doesn't fit, or has been crashed, has outdated components, yadda yadda. Unless you either know what you are doing or have a local friend to help, there's really value in getting your first road bike at the LBS. You'll get fit assistance, accessories discounts, and probably some complimentary service and adjustments. You'll have a relationship with someone to answer your questions, etc. 
[...]

I decided, since I don't "know what I'm doing" to go with the new bike.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

ldp205 said:


> After reading through more of the posts in the Beginner's Corner, including (from JayTree):
> [...]
> 3. Can I get a better deal by buying used? Well, of course. The used bike market is notoriously soft, and that means that a used 2005 bike, for example, can cost 1/3 to 1/2 less than it did new on the floor. That $700 you want to spend can get you much more bang for the buck. But if you don't know what you are doing, you may wind up with a bike that doesn't fit, or has been crashed, has outdated components, yadda yadda. Unless you either know what you are doing or have a local friend to help,* there's really value in getting your first road bike at the LBS. You'll get fit assistance, accessories discounts, and probably some complimentary service and adjustments. You'll have a relationship with someone to answer your questions*, etc.
> [...]
> ...


...and to the above, I'd add that you'll get a manufacturers warranty and assistance from your LBS in processing it if/ when needed. 

But it's still important to shop for (reputable) shops along with shopping for a new bike. Pick out shops that ask questions about your price range, cycling history and intended uses, listen to your responses and offer some suggestions. The better shops also recognize the importance of getting sizing/ fit right along with test rides (out on the roads), so ask questions about the process.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

I've found a shop that sells the python rx4 racer. Is this any better than the carrera virtuoso? Which would you go for?

cheers,
Ben


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> I've found a shop that sells the python rx4 racer. Is this any better than the carrera virtuoso? Which would you go for?
> 
> cheers,
> Ben


Looks to me like the Carrera only comes on two sizes (and the Python, four), so I strongly advise getting set up on both bikes and taking test rides before deciding. With such gaps in sizing, they're apt to fit ok or not at all, and even at this price point, fit still matters.

Beyond that, taking a quick look, the Carrera uses Shimano STI shifters and has a 16 speed drivetrain and a compact (50/34) crankset, while the Python has a 14 speed and standard (52/42) double, with shifters at the stem.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> Looks to me like the Carrera only comes on two sizes (and the Python, four), so I strongly advise getting set up on both bikes and taking test rides before deciding. With such gaps in sizing, they're apt to fit ok or not at all, and even at this price point, fit still matters.
> 
> Beyond that, taking a quick look, the Carrera uses Shimano STI shifters and has a 16 speed drivetrain and a compact (50/34) crankset, while the Python has a 14 speed and standard (52/42) double, with shifters at the stem.


Thanks. TBH, I don't know a great deal about what things are best in a bike. Which looks best to you? On the carrera are the shifters on the brakes?


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

I've just read about STI shifters and I've found that they are on the brakes which I've read is good.

Does the carrera look better over all than the python?

I'm 5' 8", so I think the medium will be the right size, but obviously I'll try it out. I don't know if halfords let you test ride their bikes or not though.

cheers,
Ben


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> Thanks. TBH, I don't know a great deal about what things are best in a bike. *Which looks best to you? *On the carrera are the shifters on the brakes?


The one that fits _you_ best.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> I've just read about STI shifters and I've found that they are on the brakes which I've read is good.
> 
> Does the carrera look better over all than the python?
> 
> ...


Overall, integrated shifter/ brakes have an advantage over the stem mounted shifters.

According to their website, the Carrera medium equates to a 54cm. If that's measured the same as traditional 54cm bikes are, then it _might_ work. But that's a guess and dependent on a number of factors I don't know.

If they don't normally allow test rides, push the issue. If it comes down to making a sale (or not) they could be persuaded. It's important that you test ride any bike before purchasing, especially considering the gaps in sizing.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

Thanks. I'll have a look at the carrera in halfords and ask if I can test ride it. :thumbsup:


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

I was looking on the internet with a mate today who is into biking, and he showed me a bike. It's the 2010 model of the Dawes sportif for £350.

It is aluminium, has a 3K carbon radius blade fork and 24 speed shimano gears.

What do you think?


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> I was looking on the internet with a mate today who is into biking, and he showed me a bike. It's the 2010 model of the Dawes sportif for £350.
> 
> It is aluminium, has a 3K carbon radius blade fork and 24 speed shimano gears.
> 
> What do you think?


This being your first road bike and not knowing your sizing requirements, I think you should avoid buying online and visit the shops that will offer a level of sizing/ fitting assistance along with test rides. 

If your friend wants to accompany you, I think that would be of value, because even though s/he can't tell you how you feel on a bike, they can tell you if you look comfortable. 

My advice is to stop sitting at the computer looking at bikes and go_ ride_ some!! :thumbsup:


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

With regard to bike sizing, isn't the sizing guide on dawes' website accurate? And if it isn't exactly right then couldn't I adjust the seat and bars?

Looking at the dawes sportif it looks a lot better than the carrera virtuoso, and I'd like to get a better quality bike.

cheers,
Ben


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> With regard to bike sizing, isn't the sizing guide on dawes' website accurate? And if it isn't exactly right then couldn't I adjust the seat and bars?
> 
> Looking at the dawes sportif it looks a lot better than the carrera virtuoso, and I'd like to get a better quality bike.
> 
> ...


I can't assess the sizing guide because I've never used it, ordered one of their bikes based on it and assessed the fit. 

I _can_ tell you that there method of determining cycling inseam is incorrect and won't result in a proper measurement, but given the method and the fact that their sizing has 3cm gaps, I don't think accuracy is their goal. 

That bike only comes in three sizes, starting with a 54cm. If you're 5' 8" and of average proportions the 54 _might_ work, but you won't know until it arrives, you assemble it, then start the fitting process. Then you have to decide if it's a keeper or going back (at your expense). 

To answer your question, if a bikes geometry strays enough from correct (for a given rider), adjustments to saddle and bars isn't going to get you a good fit. Also, to be honest, I don't think you know enough about bike fit to do this yourself.

You're just starting out here (and still growing), so for the time being my advice is to focus on test riding some bikes and getting a reliable 'starter bike' that fits well. There's a good chance that if you stay with road riding in a couple of years you'll be looking for that 'next' bike. By then you'll better know what you want, what fit preferences you have and maybe some knowledge of bike geo, so that might be the time to consider an online offering. For now (to repeat), I suggest staying with bikes that are local to you and can (at least) be test ridden.


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## Ben M (Sep 13, 2011)

Would it be possible to gain enough knowledge of bike geo to make the right decision as to frame size? I really like the Dawes, and it should cost 2 x as much as the carrera and I think it'd be a shame to miss the Dawes. They only sell it in the 57cm and 60cm frame, so if I bought the 57cm frame and it didn't fit I'd soon grow into it. 

Do you know of any good sites that I can research bike geo?

And would it be a good idea to test ride some different bikes to get an idea of what size I'll need?

cheers,
Ben

cheers,
Ben


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Ben M said:


> Would it be possible to gain enough knowledge of bike geo to make the right decision as to frame size? I really like the Dawes, and it should cost 2 x as much as the carrera and I think it'd be a shame to miss the Dawes. They only sell it in the 57cm and 60cm frame, so if I bought the 57cm frame and it didn't fit I'd soon grow into it.
> 
> Do you know of any good sites that I can research bike geo?
> 
> ...


It takes time and experience to learn about bike geometry, so a crash course isn't going to work. Also, at sixteen, you can't predict that you'll grow into a 57cm frame. You may still grow some, but it's also possible that you won't and the 57 will _always_ be too large for you, making it not such a great deal.

Yes, as I've suggested, it's a good idea to test ride some bikes to get a sense for what feels right, but the intent should be to buy from one of these retailers, not use their inventory to test sizing then purchase online. That's just not cool, IMHO. Besides, there's a good chance it wouldn't work, because measuring to determine frame size varies between brands, so the Dawes 57cm bike may be another brands 55 or 58, so riding them would only serve to mislead you.

Go visit some shops local to you, get their assistance in picking out bikes in your price range, get sized/ fitted, test ride some and buy the one that fits/ feels best.


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