# SpeedPlay Specific 4 Bolt Pattern Road Shoes



## Schneiderguy (Jan 9, 2005)

Is there any really noticeable difference in performance in these shoes vs the three hole with adapter plate and shims? By performance I mean transfer of power (would be great to check them against a power meter) or efficiency. The selection of 4 bolt shoes are limited and generally expensive.


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

Without the adapter, your shoe will obviously be ~5mm closer to the spindle. What is that worth to you? No that big of a deal for me.


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## vagabondcyclist (Apr 2, 2011)

Speedplay specific shoes make it easier to adjust the cleats and potentially have a better (flatter) surface for the cleats to mount on making clip in and out more fluid.


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## B05 (Jul 31, 2011)

Speedplay specific shoes are overpriced like F. No idea why the vast majority of them are more expensive than the 3 bolt ones. 

Does it have something to do with rights,trademarks, etc because they have to use the "Speedplay" name when they market the shoe? That's the only reason I could think of.


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## mikerp (Jul 24, 2011)

B05 said:


> Speedplay specific shoes are overpriced like F. No idea why the vast majority of them are more expensive than the 3 bolt ones.
> 
> Does it have something to do with rights,trademarks, etc because they have to use the "Speedplay" name when they market the shoe? That's the only reason I could think of.


Not sure which shoes you are looking at:
Sidi Ergo 3 - same price each version
Sidi Wire - same price each version
The shoe has a smaller market and less color choice, but offers more adjustable (aft), and no adapter to deal with.


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## carlislegeorge (Mar 28, 2004)

After having tried a couple pairs of shoes with speedplay specific soles, my conclusion - nice, but not my primary criteria for selecting a shoe...


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## Schneiderguy (Jan 9, 2005)

carlislegeorge said:


> After having tried a couple pairs of shoes with speedplay specific soles, my conclusion - nice, but not my primary criteria for selecting a shoe...


Thanks for the reply. This is useful information.


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## phoehn9111 (May 11, 2005)

I have been using the DMT Prisma2 this year. Lowered my stack height
6mm. Due to the fact that I am using a wedge in my left cleat, this has
really been a life saver for me, not having the "block on the pedals" feeling.
They are pricey, however and the boa is a little bit fragile but overall a vast
improvement over my old spd-sl shoes.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

phoehn9111 said:


> I have been using the DMT Prisma2 this year. Lowered my stack height
> 6mm. Due to the fact that I am using a wedge in my left cleat, this has
> really been a life saver for me, not having the "block on the pedals" feeling.
> They are pricey, however and the boa is a little bit fragile but overall a vast
> improvement over my old spd-sl shoes.


yup, same here and will NEVER rides with speedplay pedals without Speedplay shoes.


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## Schneiderguy (Jan 9, 2005)

phoehn9111 said:


> I have been using the DMT Prisma2 this year. Lowered my stack height
> 6mm. Due to the fact that I am using a wedge in my left cleat, this has
> really been a life saver for me, not having the "block on the pedals" feeling.
> They are pricey, however and the boa is a little bit fragile but overall a vast
> improvement over my old spd-sl shoes.


Thanks. That DMT as well as the cheaper one without the fancy laceup system and the Sidi Ergo 3 Speedplay were what I thinking about. The Prisma 2 and Sidi are around $350 and the cheaper DMT $250. My left knee flops all over the place and I've ordered what was calle the LeWedge. This got me considering the speedplay specific shoes. But there are limited choices and no "bargin" sales and was wondering if just sales puffing or if riders really noticed a difference.


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## tantra (Jan 8, 2008)

The reduction in weight and stack height with Speedplay shoes is a definite benefit. Consider the DMT Radial shoe. The are MUCH lighter than Sidi's, less expensive, and super comfortable. I wear the same size DMT as Sidi.


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## Schneiderguy (Jan 9, 2005)

I can see this is going to cost me money. Don't know if I would be any faster, but certain I would be taller, thinner, younger and better looking if I had carbon sole, 4 bolt pattern!


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## mann2 (Oct 16, 2012)

Schneiderguy said:


> Is there any really noticeable difference in performance in these shoes vs the three hole with adapter plate and shims? By performance I mean transfer of power (would be great to check them against a power meter) or efficiency. The selection of 4 bolt shoes are limited and generally expensive.


your shoe+cleat weight would be a bit lighter because you wont be using some shims and adapters, and as mentioned your stack height would be much lower. if you're a hardcore SP user, by all means go for it.


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## Diopena1 (Jul 21, 2011)

I picked up some Lake CX401's on Nashbar for $199 last christmas.... not bad for $499 speedplay specific shoes. I'm keeping my eyes peeled incase they go on sale again... LOL


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

*I have these and love them!

Lake CX236C Road Shoes - Speedplay Sole at wiggle.com*
<small style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102); font-family: Arial; font-weight: bold; text-align: left; ">
Your Wiggle price:</small>*$202.71

*
View attachment 279971​


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## carlislegeorge (Mar 28, 2004)

spookyload said:


> Without the adapter, your shoe will obviously be ~5mm closer to the spindle. What is that worth to you? No that big of a deal for me.





phoehn9111 said:


> I have been using the DMT Prisma2 this year. Lowered my stack height 6mm. Due to the fact that I am using a wedge in my left cleat, this has
> really been a life saver for me, not having the "block on the pedals" feeling. They are pricey, however and the boa is a little bit fragile but overall a vast improvement over my old spd-sl shoes.


I think this is definitely a benefit, especially if you're solving a leg length issue with the wedges, but in most cases it is typically closer to only 3mm reduced stack height (this is what Speedplay claims on its website), since SP-specific soles are slightly thicker in that area. The DMT website isn't specific, but the Competitive Cyclist review of the DMT Prisma referenced only a 3mm difference.


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## Rekless1 (Aug 23, 2012)

Its not a huge difference but if your very particular its noticeable and a number of ways. Not all pure performance. 

I've been running speedplays since the 80s and SP shoes since I first came across them. Ive had to go back on occasion and its a pretty hard thing to do. Once your used to it the contrast can be significant.

Anyways, I wouldn't dream of ever going back to a standard shoe and FTR, my carbon DMTs didn't cost me anymore than an equivalent shoe.


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## Schneiderguy (Jan 9, 2005)

Ordered the DMT Prisma from Competitive Cyclist. More than I wanted to spend but hopefully they will hold up for a number of years. Actually I hope I "hold up for a number of years"! Thanks for the comments.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

I used DMT Radial Speedplay for a couple of seasons.
Then I got myself a pair of Bont Vaypors, 3 hole. The Bonts gave lower stack height _with adapters_ than the DMTs. They are also a better fit due to the heat molding. 

Sorry for being too late to the party.


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## Rekless1 (Aug 23, 2012)

kbwh said:


> I used DMT Radial Speedplay for a couple of seasons.
> Then I got myself a pair of Bont Vaypors, 3 hole. The Bonts gave lower stack height _with adapters_ than the DMTs. They are also a better fit due to the heat molding.
> 
> Sorry for being too late to the party.


Wow, that's pretty interesting. DMT lists the stack height at the cleat mount, if I understand right, to be 3.5mm. 

"...at the critical cleat interface it is a wispy-thin 3.5 mm..."


The SP adapters are like 3mm all by itself. How are they accomplishing that with the Bonts?

+ Edit. Bonts are 3.6mm stack height plus 3mm adapter would have to put them are 6.6mm. I must not be reading something right.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

That's good work 

DMT may have changed the sole since mine. 

Maybe I'm talking about perceived stack. I could not get the cleats quite all the way back to where they should have been with the DMTs. 

I did have to lower my saddle 2 mm after getting the Bonts.


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## Squint (Jan 22, 2004)

Speedplay cleats require a flat mounting surface whereas the Look-style can accommodate a bit of curvature. I have two pairs of custom shoes that are Speedplay-specific and they way they achieve a flat surface is by starting with a curved sole and building up the area fore and aft of the cleat. If you examine the adapter carefully, you'll see that it does the same thing. Its thickness is at the front and rear where it needs to convert the curved sole to a flat surface but the center portion directly under the cleat is actually quite thin and adds very little to the actual stack height. I suspect most reduced stack height claims are really marketing fuzzy math based on the assumption that the adapter is a uniform ~4 mm thick. There's no free lunch in this game and to truly reduce stack height requires thinning out the sole beneath the cleat.


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## PN10 (Mar 31, 2021)

I have Bont Vaypor S, 4 hole. Its flat on bottom of shoe. I couldn't attach cleat directly to bottom because I feel the pedal digging into foot. Speedplay sent a baseplate but its very thin and no help. Any idea where to get a thicker flat 4 hole baseplate?


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