# Reynolds Assault carbon clincher issues...



## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

Has anyone had any problems with there Reynolds Assault Carbon Clincher's lately?? Our team has a pro deal with Fuji and several of my teammates including myself purchased the SL1 and it comes with the Reynolds Assault 46mm DV as well as SRAM Red, Ritchey WCS, etc. IT'S HOT!!. http://www.fujibikes.com/Road/CarbonSuperlight/SL-1-Shimano-(1).aspx Anyway I've got 2 teammates who both had overheating issues while descending. Both times the wheels completely warped and the carbon fiber cracked!! VERY DANGEROUS! 

Has anyone had this issue? I'm about to contact Reynolds about it...


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## zac (Aug 5, 2005)

No, not that issue. I just found the rear build to be sub-par. But I haven't driven them hard descending.

What pads? the Reynolds or were you using 3rd parties like SwissStop yellows?

Let us know with a followup post how Reynolds intends to handle this, please. From what I understand the Assault rims are the prior year DV46s. I haven't heard this issue happening to any of those. Bad batch? Change in design/build? Please keep us posted.

thanks
zac


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

Hi Zac,

Fuji delivers the bikes with SwissStop pads...That being said, the first incident happened with the SwissStops...so my teammate switched to the KOOL STOPS...Same thing happened, so it's definitely not the pads...

I agree I think its a bad batch of wheels...sub par carbon fiber.

I'm gonna contact them ASAP...I'll keep you posted.


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## jmess (Aug 24, 2006)

Any idea on how long before the brake problems appeared? Was it right away or after ?? miles of using the brakes really hard?


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

pretty much right away...the descents where technical as well as steep and it happened while breaking and when the rims started to heat up...


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## kyler2001 (Sep 8, 2005)

Very strange. I've used mine (w/Swiss Stop Yellows) in races all through the Italian Alps and have had no problems while descending (other than some squealing). No doubt something like that would be covered under warranty, but very scary/disturbing when it happens, twice. Let us know what Reynolds says...


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

I agree...very strange. I just shot them an email so I'll let you know what there response is...


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## s2ktaxi (Jul 11, 2006)

Friend of mine with Roval carbons just had the same thing happen a few weeks ago. after a long descent, the wheels just delaminated and fell apart when he stopped at the bottom.


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

He should definitely get a warranty replacement...that's not suppose to happen!


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

Yes, this has happened several times to friends of mine.

Reynolds wheels are fantastic, but carbon fiber wheels are not exactly the best choice for high-speed technical descents involving lots of braking.

One friend melted his at Everest Challenge.

Awesome wheels though.


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

WOW!! Thanks for the info...


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## master2129 (Mar 30, 2007)

FondriestFan said:


> Yes, this has happened several times to friends of mine.
> 
> Reynolds wheels are fantastic, but carbon fiber wheels are not exactly the best choice for high-speed technical descents involving lots of braking.
> 
> ...


I agree. They are great wheels. Descending on full carbon clinchers can be a bit scary. My wheelset doesn't get that hot. But also I rarely tap my brakes on a descent. I too am using Swissstop Yellow pads and they have been a really good pad for my wheelset. Keep us posted how Reynolds handles the situation.


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

No worries...I'll let you know what Reynolds has to say...


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

I had 2 sets of DV46C Assaults. The issues I experienced involved the braking surface warping on the front wheel of one of the wheels. Reynolds replaced the rim without issue. I also blew one spoke (twice) on the other front wheel. 

IMHO the weakest link in this wheelset are the hubs. They are heavy, noisy, clunky and need to be maintenanced often to keep them tuned. I even went to the expense of installing ceramic bearings to see if that might alleviate the issue. 

To anyone considering this wheelset, I'd recommend they step up to the UL's, they have upgraded DT Swiss 240 hubs and lighter/stronger uni-directional carbon rims. I have since sold both of the Reynolds Assault DV46C's and upgraded to 2 sets of Edge Composite 38c & 45c / American Classic / Sapim CX Ray blk. 

For approx. the same cost as the UL's, the Edge Comps are in a whole 'nother league.


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## slamy (Mar 15, 2004)

A guy I rode with yesterday had those rims and had two blow-outs. One off a steep descent, I think his tire got too hot, or that is what he said it was. Lucky for him it happened at the bottom of the descent because it would have been worse on the turns. After seeing that and reading this, there is no way I would buy those wheels.


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## kyler2001 (Sep 8, 2005)

slamy said:


> A guy I rode with yesterday had those rims and had two blow-outs. One off a steep decent, I think his tire got too hot, or that is what he said it was. Lucky for him it happened at the bottom of the descent because it would have been worse on the turns. After seeing that and reading this, there is no way I would buy those wheels.


This could happen with *any* rim with a carbon braking surface...could be that some people just don't know how to manipulate their brakes while descending with carbon rims. Like I said, I've used mine in the mountains without a problem. 

OTOH, my hubs are not noisy either and at 1508 grams (Reynolds advertises them at 1525 grams) I don't find the hubs to add that much weight to the wheelset. Would DT 240's make a better/lighter wheelset? Of course...I'd take a pair of Edge 45c with Sapim CX-Ray's and Tune hubs for $1,000 anyday, *but for the money*, my experience with the Reynolds KT hubs have been good. For the price, you'll be hard pressed to find a better full carbon clincher wheelset with the same level of customer service Reynolds offers. That's my plug:thumbsup:


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## ericm979 (Jun 26, 2005)

FondriestFan said:


> Yes, this has happened several times to friends of mine.
> 
> Reynolds wheels are fantastic, but carbon fiber wheels are not exactly the best choice for high-speed technical descents involving lots of braking.
> 
> One friend melted his at Everest Challenge.



Really? I am suprised since the descents there are not very technical.


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

ericm979 said:


> Really? I am suprised since the descents there are not very technical.


You must not have been going fast enough.


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

kyler2001 said:


> This could happen with *any* rim with a carbon braking surface...could be that some people just don't know how to manipulate their brakes while descending with carbon rims. Like I said, I've used mine in the mountains without a problem.
> 
> OTOH, my hubs are not noisy either and at 1508 grams (Reynolds advertises them at 1525 grams) I don't find the hubs to add that much weight to the wheelset. Would DT 240's make a better/lighter wheelset? Of course...I'd take a pair of Edge 45c with Sapim CX-Ray's and Tune hubs for $1,000 anyday, *but for the money*, my experience with the Reynolds KT hubs have been good. For the price, you'll be hard pressed to find a better full carbon clincher wheelset with the same level of customer service Reynolds offers. That's my plug:thumbsup:


Q) How many miles do you have on your DV46C Assaults?
Agreed, this could happen to *any* carbon braking surfaced wheel but we are focused on the DV46C Assaults and there appears to be a growing number of similar complaints concerning warping & over-heating. Easy to blame it on OE... You a lawyer? If so, Reynolds can use you  

I never had any of these issues with my Zipp 404T's or my Bora Ultra's and I'm definitely not having any of these problems with my Edge Comps.
Agreed, the DV46C's are a bargain at $1K. Can't touch that price point for a "decent" carbon clincher. This is my point; You get what you pay for in wheelsets of any design or material. IMHO, you need to pay more to get more from a high end carbon wheelset and these wheels are problematic due to the fact that Reynolds cut too many corners to reach that price point, including mid-grade composites and generic Taiwanese hubs. 
Why else would they have released the DV46C UL shortly there after?

Advise to all who use these wheels daily: *Keep An Eye On Them *
Not on my race bike, especially where I live/ride. NorCal/Bay Area. 
YMMV, but what do I know...? Masters Cat 2, 30+ years of road racing.


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## ericm979 (Jun 26, 2005)

FondriestFan said:


> You must not have been going fast enough.


I wasn't trying to insult you or your friend, so there is no need to get defensive.

I am genuinely puzzled that someone would have brake heat related problems, since EC's descents require very little braking.


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

ericm979 said:


> I wasn't trying to insult you or your friend, so there is no need to get defensive.
> 
> I am genuinely puzzled that someone would have brake heat related problems, since EC's descents require very little braking.


Ah, sorry, I omitted the winky. I was only kidding around. I'm no Salvoldelli when I'm descending by any stretch of the imagination, so I don't have much to defend anyway!

The last descent (second day) required some braking to negotiate those turns at speed. I assume that's what did it. It was pretty amazing to see that happen though.


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

rhauft said:


> Q) How many miles do you have on your DV46C Assaults?
> Agreed, this could happen to *any* carbon braking surfaced wheel but we are focused on the DV46C Assaults and there appears to be a growing number of similar complaints concerning warping & over-heating. Easy to blame it on OE... You a lawyer? If so, Reynolds can use you
> 
> I never had any of these issues with my Zipp 404T's or my Bora Ultra's and I'm definitely not having any of these problems with my Edge Comps.
> ...


The OP was referring to the Assaults not the DV46C. Those retail for over $2k.

Generic Taiwanese hubs? What does that have to do with the carbon problems? 

Mid-grade composites? What exactly does that mean?

You're citing 404 Tubulars and Bora tubulars. The OP is talking about Clinchers. As I'm sure you know, given your 30+ years of experience in racing, there are significant differences in rim construction for clinchers vs. tubulars. So, let's stick to comparing clinchers vs. clinchers, before someone starts bringing up all the rim breakage problems on the 404s.

And 404 clinchers are not full carbon so those aren't even an issue.


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## kyler2001 (Sep 8, 2005)

rhauft said:


> Q) How many miles do you have on your DV46C Assaults?
> Agreed, this could happen to *any* carbon braking surfaced wheel but we are focused on the DV46C Assaults and there appears to be a growing number of similar complaints concerning warping & over-heating. Easy to blame it on OE... You a lawyer? If so, Reynolds can use you
> 
> I never had any of these issues with my Zipp 404T's or my Bora Ultra's and I'm definitely not having any of these problems with my Edge Comps.
> ...


A) About 6,000 miles...racing and training. Not one broken spoke or having to true or adjust the hubs.

Lawyer? Not hardly, but I've not heard of Reynolds needing any (i.e. them being swamped with lawsuits). Why the question in the first place? I'm not doubting anybody's experience but just expressing my own. No need to get uptight. 

A growing number of similar complaints? Again,overheating can happen on any carbon braking surface and there are plenty of posts from users rolling tubulars, melting glue, blowouts on clinchers, etc. on any number of different rims so take that for what it's worth. This is from wheelbuilder.com about carbon rims in general: _"Carbon braking surfaces require special brake pads, do not stop as well in wet weather, a*nd are more sensitive to overheating under heavy braking conditions*."_ Everybody knows carbon braking surfaces are delicate and prone to overheating. As well, this is the first thread I've read of the Assault's warping from excess heat, so if you want to call an isolated incident or two a growing number to be concerned about...then fine. There are plenty of threads about Zipp rim failures, so each company has an issue from time to time (wether it's a bad production run, design flaw, etc.).

Cut corners? In my opinion they havn't used sub par materials. Are there better wheels in their line? Of course. Many companies offer different products at different price points but that does not mean they function that much less. I'm sure Valverde could win a race on a Pinerello FP3 (lower quality frame from Pinarello) but there is a higher quality frame that he uses (Prince). Many great products come out of Taiwan these days (race frames, wheels, etc.) so throwing the country name out there doesn't justify them being bad. I will keep an eye on my wheels just as I do my tires, frame drivetrain, etc.

Cat 2? No need to flex your muscles. It's great that after 30 years you're still at it but get away from those American crits and come to Europe and road race along side of me that feature ex-pros...

I really don't like to have threads turn sour so that will be my peace and I hope those 2 riders the OP mentioned get the issue sorted out and how Reynolds dealt with the problem gets posted.


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

touchy, touchy...

In regards to the Reynolds Assaults: It's not just a couple of isolated cases. CycleSports www.cyclesportsonline.com a local high end bike shop here in Northern California is a huge Reynolds dealer. They also sell Mavic, Hed, Edge, Campy, Shimano etc. They are one of the biggest Reynolds dealers in the US. I have had numerous conversations with the owner who is a long time personal friend of mine. He also happens to be the Owner of the HealthNet / Team Ouch racing team. They have had *DOZENS OF WARRANTY CLAIMS ON REYNOLDS ASSAULT DV46C WHEELSETS.* The majority of those claims are due to de-lamination and warpage of the braking surface and also some hub issues. Don't take my word for it, call them your self and ask them: www.cyclesportsonline.com 

As for me, the only time you'll ever see me lined up for a criterium is if its attached to a multi-stage race. I am a 'road racer'. Here in northern california, where I live in the SF Bay Area, everything here is vertical. I leave my driveway and hit a 18% wall. A typical local ride here equates to for every 10 miles/1000 feet of climbing and descending. All things considered, my Reynolds held up well, but I was very careful with them. I only trained on them and never raced on them for that reason. The road races here are very hilly with technical descents so I opted for my 404T's. A wheelset I swore by for the last two seasons. This season, I switched to Edge Composite clinchers, mostly due to recommendations from my fellow racers and my friends at Cycle Sports. YMMV


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

Not that I really care, but the Assaults have had excellent reviews on RBR. You'd think with DOZENS of warranty claims as another poster claims, you'd see worse reviews than 4.9 out of 5. Not that I'm questioning anyone's credibility, I'm just offering up the evidence readily available.

http://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/wheels/wheelsets/reynolds/PRD_418671_2490crx.aspx

As I said, I have the DV46C, not the Assault, and other than a broken spoke, no problems.

I've ridden the Attacks (same hubs) for a year with zero problems. 

404s are nice as well, but again, those are tubulars, whereas the Assaults are full carbon clinchers. 

Competitive Cyclist also did a review of Reynolds carbon wheels, which refutes another poster's claims about "midgrade carbon".

http://www.competitivecyclist.com/z...ODUCT.ID=4630&CATEGORY.ID=1994&MODE=&TFC=TRUE


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

*caveat emptor*

Let the buyer beware.

Feelings mutual FF :ciappa:


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## FondriestFan (May 19, 2005)

rhauft said:


> Let the buyer beware.
> 
> Feelings mutual FF :ciappa:


Sorry, didn't mean to hurt your feelings, whoever you are. Your Zipp 404's are really nice too. Hope you feel better now.


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## Spear Legweak (Mar 27, 2006)

The reviews dont lie. Theyre a good wheel nuff said!
http://www.testrider.com/fly.aspx?layout=player&video=55


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## zac (Aug 5, 2005)

Wow, guys we are all in the same boat here. There are obviously some issues. I haven't cooked my Assaults yet, and hope I don't, obviously. But it appears that something is going on. 

I seriously hope there is nothing wrong with them design wise.

Maybe it would help if anyone with this issue could post specifics:

Such as
What year Assault: 2009
What brake pads/brakes: SwissStop yellows (KoolStop, Reynolds OEMs, Zipps) for Shimano DA 7900
toed/or flush pads: essentially flush (I use a folded over dollar bill to set the rear out from the rim)
if toed how much: (less than 1mm, less than 0.5mm, less than a folded over dollar bill)
Do you keep the scrim strips clean: yes
Do they squeal: yes (when cold temps less than 45° or so and under moderate to hard braking conditions)

I am wondering if toeing the pads exerts excessive pressure on the brake surface. It would seem to me that the scrim strips would let the pads run cooler, as it chews away the pad and the heat, but maybe I am wrong on that one.

Concurrently, I have seen some guys who have way too much toe on their pads and it makes me wonder if that eventually causes rim damage. After all, under hard braking the entire pad will contact the rim, and the forward part of the pad will really be crushing that surface, which is essentially the thin clincher tire hook extension of the rim, so not much ability to shed heat.

zac


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## rhauft (Aug 8, 2006)

*Done Here*



lawrencen said:


> Has anyone had any problems with there Reynolds Assault Carbon Clincher's lately??... Anyway I've got 2 teammates who both had overheating issues while descending. Both times the wheels completely warped and the carbon fiber cracked!! VERY DANGEROUS!
> Has anyone had this issue? I'm about to contact Reynolds about it...


I responded to this from the OP, backed up my experience with references from one of the biggest Reynolds dealers in the US along with my own road cred. Accept it, deny it, or take it for what its worth. Asked, answered, out.


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## scubad (Jun 22, 2004)

I have a pair of MV32's and a pair of SDV66's. Both clinchers. I haven't had a problem with either one. In fact my MV's have even hit a bumper of a car who intentially stopped in front of me. Slammed on his brakes and went onto his trunk. He drove off and never heard if the cops caught him. But I'm a big guy and it was a good hit. Wheel stayed true and no ill effects. have over 3000 miles on them since then. I would say it's almost bulletproof.

Now, the shop I bought them from doesn't carry them anymore. They have had quite a few wheels delaminate due to hard braking. The problem appears to exist. I'm a tad worried about over cooking a descent and have problems.

Has anyone heard of a similiar problem with Edge wheels? 

I would like to have some more peace of mind but I absolutely love my MV's. Best wheel that I have ridden.


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## jmess (Aug 24, 2006)

lawrencen said:


> No worries...I'll let you know what Reynolds has to say...


So what happened with the wheels?


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## rruff (Feb 28, 2006)

kyler2001 said:


> Everybody knows carbon braking surfaces are delicate and prone to overheating.


More precisely, carbon has very poor thermal conductivity, so the braking energy makes the brake tracks and pads super hot. Braking performance suffers and the pads melt. Usually the pads will melt before the rim does, which will limit the temperature you can achieve. There could have been a batch of Assaults made with substandard materials.


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## Net-Knight1 (Feb 7, 2010)

Hi, 

are there any Updates on Reynolds Assault braking issues ???


Net.


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

Yes...I've actually been testing for Reynolds, not only a brand new brake pad but a new carbon fiber lay up. The pads are excellent! Great modulation, decent braking power, zero squeaking, good for both carbon and aluminum. Totally rivals swiss stop pros...The wheel I'm still testing but so far so good.


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## Net-Knight1 (Feb 7, 2010)

No Probs with Carbon surface??


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

If you've read my post you'll see that we've had issues with the carbon surface and I just mentioned that I've been testing for Reynolds. That's what I've been testing. I've had 3 set's fail so far and I'm on my 4th with the new lay up...I'll say it again. so far so good but I'll certainly keep you posted. Have you had issues??


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## Belgiancx (Oct 29, 2010)

*Reynolds update*

So how are the Assaults going? I assume you are saying that the 2010 models have solved and corrected this problem? Is this correct? 2011 models have a new braking surface but I can't wait. 

Per another poster who said he rides in CA and 1000ft elevation every 10 miles, that's nothing. I ride MV32T and DV46T in the CO MOUNTAINS and they are sweet, but try 7000 feet in 28 miles (mt. Evans) or 13,0000 in 100 miles (Deer Creek Challenge). I love my Reynolds Tubies but want a clincher now and this post has me worried. Would love an update here for lawrencen..........


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

They Finally got the lay up right and have been performing perfectly ever since. I've beat the crap out of them since my last post so I think your OK. My recommendation would really be to go with the Easton EC90 carbon clincher though. I've had a set for the past season and they're SWEET!! No issues what so ever...The only complaint is the rear hub. Bearing issues, which they repaired and they now perform brilliantly.


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## IAmSpecialized (Jul 16, 2008)

lawrencen said:


> My recommendation would really be to go with the Easton EC90 carbon clincher though. I've had a set for the past season and they're SWEET!! No issues what so ever...The only complaint is the rear hub. Bearing issues, which they repaired and they now perform brilliantly.



Agreed the EC90SL cc's are one sweet wheelset. The other thing you can do to take care of the rear hub with the EC90SL carbon clincher is to ship the wheel to Ron Ruff to have a Powertap laced to it. Mine arrived back from Ron today.


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## lawrencen (Mar 25, 2009)

Really??? Thanks for the info!!


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## IAmSpecialized (Jul 16, 2008)

Sh


lawrencen said:


> Really??? Thanks for the info!!


Yes, really.  I will be posting a thread soon under the wheels and tires section of the forum. Keep your eye out over the next day or so. Pics will be included.


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## seans (Dec 6, 2011)

*Reynolds Assault carbon - spoke failure*

I've had the 2010 Assault wheelset on my Scott CR1 bike for past 12 months.

Initially, only negative was noisy creeks from wheels, intermittently after gear-change or under pressure.

However, in august I broke a front spoke & thereafter broke 2 more on separate occasions. Then had the wheel rebuilt last month (6 more spokes changed). Then last week broke another spoke ! 

I don't beleive it is due to heat issues, as I've never felt high temps from the rim, but the Australian distributor is now asking if I had the correct break-pads as they say the wheel has heat damaged & must be REPLACED !  
I think it's a faulty carbon wheel, as my rear one has given me no problems.

As it was imported from USA, I now have warranty issues, so will need to send it back to US.

Sean
Brisbane, AUS


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