# Supercampionissimo



## The_Kraken (Jul 28, 2009)

https://www.pistapalace.com/sc.html


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## iyeoh (Jan 6, 2005)

Its a very pretty bike. Gold isn't my color, except in jewelry, but I can see how it can be tastefully done on a bike.


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## ljfran2383 (Aug 27, 2009)

that bike is sex.


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## one80 (Feb 22, 2006)

That looks amazing! Glad we've finally seen some of the detailed shots too 

I was going to ask about the clover on the top tube, as it's not on other ones I've seen, but I see that's been answered on the PP.com page.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Awesome bike.

I really like the write up on your website, with possibly the exception of the last paragraph.

Edit to add: Now I am dying to see what you create as your new exclusive frame and I am dying to try and figure out who the manufacturer is going to be. Is the brand name going to be Pista Palace on the bike?


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## one80 (Feb 22, 2006)

Apparently the "Supercampionissimo" frame is for sale on Craigslist HERE. Tempting...


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

one80 said:


> Apparently the "Supercampionissimo" frame is for sale on Craigslist HERE. Tempting...


The signature does look identical, but the San Diego reference is missing. Wonder why he would take that off the frame and why the signature wasn't cleared over to protect it from erasure. How do you wash a bike with a signature like that on it.

Also, the add is a little misleading because it states this is the "bike" that Bettini rode, when it is merely the frame.

If a 48 sloping is too small, the seller must be a really small guy.

I do think somebody on this forum said they bought the frame or bike from Pista Palace, but I could be mistaken.


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## Jbartmc (Sep 14, 2007)

fabsroman said:


> The signature does look identical, but the San Diego reference is missing. Wonder why he would take that off the frame and why the signature wasn't cleared over to protect it from erasure. How do you wash a bike with a signature like that on it.
> 
> Also, the add is a little misleading because it states this is the "bike" that Bettini rode, when it is merely the frame.
> 
> ...


http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?p=2769898#post2769898

Good memory!


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Jbartmc said:


> http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?p=2769898#post2769898
> 
> Good memory!


Obviously, you have a better memory than me, or you are just as good with the forum search skills. LOL I didn't bother searching on it.

You would think that somebody that is going to buy Supercampionissimo would know what his/her correct size is, or that Justin would size them correctly.

I just wonder if that is the universal excuse for selling a frame when somebody just flat out doesn't like it. Yeah, I paid $5,000 for this frame, and it doesn't fit me right. Honestly, I think I would cry if that happened to me, but I am a cheap skate.


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## Jbartmc (Sep 14, 2007)

fabsroman said:


> Obviously, you have a better memory than me, or you are just as good with the forum search skills. LOL I didn't bother searching on it.
> 
> You would think that somebody that is going to buy Supercampionissimo would know what his/her correct size is, or that Justin would size them correctly.
> 
> I just wonder if that is the universal excuse for selling a frame when somebody just flat out doesn't like it. Yeah, I paid $5,000 for this frame, and it doesn't fit me right. Honestly, I think I would cry if that happened to me, but I am a cheap skate.


I had a recollection of the post as well, but did search the bike's name. I think you are right about the "reason" for the sale. I have an EPS, and it is a fantastic bike. Also, when I first purchased a bike from Pista Palace, the size issue was covered in detail. My measurements and my present bike measurements (seat height, reach, etc) were all requested and then a phone consult followed. Buyer's remorse on Craigslist? Perhaps.


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## Karbon Kev (Sep 7, 2009)

I would rather just get a new EPS in PR99, (which you can get now of course) instead of chasing one with Bettini's name on quite honestly. Wouldn't bother me in the slightest. 

He has put the price down to £3450 anyway, obviously can't sell it ...


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

Kraken, I find your sense of entitlement in regards to exclusive product a touch entertaining. You are a bike shop, not a massive distributor. And although I would not have thought it possible, I think you may be even more pretentious than our shop. That's saying something, cause we are pretty bad. Most of the lines we have are exclusive to us within 300-1000km. If a company sells to another local dealer we drop them. So I respect your decision to deal with Colnago in a way that will hurt them. But I also feel your buisness will be the one paying the final price, though I hope I'm wrong.
Good luck in the future.


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## kjmunc (Sep 19, 2005)

If PP truly is the self proclaimed "greatest bike shop on the planet", then why are you whoring out high end stuff on ebay under another name (the_just_dude)? 

I'm guessing rants like this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200473341996) are what cost you the privilege to sell Colnago. If I were Ernesto I wouldn't put up with your self-righteous rants either. He's spent a lifetime building a brand/lifestyle/aura, and you come along and try to sell it off at a steep discount and then spew vitriol at anyone who does the same. If you don't like their channel strategy, go create your own brand and let us know how that works out for you. 

Let's hope your new brand isn't built on the backs of someone else, but is something new and innovative.


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## moondog-dparky (Feb 8, 2005)

hello all,

i'm the guy selling the Bettini PR99. the very same one in the pics and that Bettini rode. i bought it from Pista Palace - at my request, Justin removed the San Diego reference in the signature, so all that remains is the signature.

yup, i screwed the pooch on the size. i used my own judgement on this, and not justin's. i did this as i own an '02 C40 in size 47.5cm. on paper, the geo's are nearly identical. but when the bike came together it just doesn't work. the bars are about 1.5 inches higher than my other bike, along with almost 2" more in length. stems are similar. some of this may be due to SR11 vs R10 on my old bike - the hoods are much longer and bigger on the new 11spd stuff. i have over 25,000 miles on my C40 and i really figured they would be identical - but they are not. ffwiw, my 47.5 rides bigger/longer in the top tube than my buddy's 54cm level TT C50. i think this 48s would fit a guy in the 5' 8" range, or maybe even taller. i am all torso and short legs so i like a very short ST.

either way, my mistake could be somebodys gain. yes - i'm selling it for a bargain to the first person to make me a reasonable offer. justin was kind enough to make an in-house offer, but i would prefer to sell it and start at ground zero. frame only, of course.

if you're interested please PM me and we can talk.

stephen


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## ComesAtime (Dec 27, 2009)

kjmunc said:


> If PP truly is the self proclaimed "greatest bike shop on the planet", then why are you whoring out high end stuff on ebay under another name (the_just_dude)?
> 
> I'm guessing rants like this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200473341996) are what cost you the privilege to sell Colnago. If I were Ernesto I wouldn't put up with your self-righteous rants either. He's spent a lifetime building a brand/lifestyle/aura, and you come along and try to sell it off at a steep discount and then spew vitriol at anyone who does the same. If you don't like their channel strategy, go create your own brand and let us know how that works out for you.
> 
> Let's hope your new brand isn't built on the backs of someone else, but is something new and innovative.


Well said...:thumbsup:


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

moondog-dparky said:


> hello all,
> 
> i'm the guy selling the Bettini PR99. the very same one in the pics and that Bettini rode. i bought it from Pista Palace - at my request, Justin removed the San Diego reference in the signature, so all that remains is the signature.
> 
> ...


I am just over 5' 8" and the 48 sloping would be at the small end of the frame sizes I would ride, but it would be doable. I ride a 53cm traditional frame and a 50 sloping. The 52 sloping would be on the larger end of the spectrum for me, but still probably doable.

Yeah, if you are riding a 47.5 cm traditional C40, I could have told you that the 48 sloping would not fit you because it is akin to a 52 traditional.

Sorry to hear about the mistake. Even if I was in the market for an EPS, it would probably be one in PR82. Right now though, no more carbon fiber frames for this guy.

Good luck selling it.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

kjmunc said:


> If PP truly is the self proclaimed "greatest bike shop on the planet", then why are you whoring out high end stuff on ebay under another name (the_just_dude)?
> 
> I'm guessing rants like this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200473341996) are what cost you the privilege to sell Colnago. If I were Ernesto I wouldn't put up with your self-righteous rants either. He's spent a lifetime building a brand/lifestyle/aura, and you come along and try to sell it off at a steep discount and then spew vitriol at anyone who does the same. If you don't like their channel strategy, go create your own brand and let us know how that works out for you.
> 
> Let's hope your new brand isn't built on the backs of someone else, but is something new and innovative.


I am going to come to the defense of Justin on this one. Late last year I was PMing back and forth with him about possibly getting an EPS in PR82 and he quoted me $5,500, which I thought was an upcharge for the "exclusive" paint scheme that he allegedly had. He informed me that it was the standard price for all Colnago EPSs that he was selling. A quick look at Wrench Science and some other US websites told me that he was telling the truth, because they were also around $5,500. However, a quick look at European websites still told me that it was cheaper to buy from Europe and have the frame shipped here, a lot cheaper. I was hemming and hawing about the purchase because I really wanted the PR82 and according to Justin, it was exclusive to Pista Palace. Obviously, that isn't the case since I can get it now from other overseas vendors.

If I ever get a chance to go to Italy again, I am going to have to make sure I save up for a Colnago fund because according to my cousin over there, we are getting raped here in the US. Just comparing websites between the US and Europe, you can see we are getting raped. It might even be cheaper to buy a Colnago in Australia than it is to buy one in the US.

Now, also look at this from Justin's perspective. He worked on the PR99 paint scheme and thought it was going to be an exclusive to Pista Palace. Then, he wakes up one morning to see if on ProBikeKit for $3,800 and he has to sell it at $5,500 just to keep the doors open. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be too happy about Colnago taking the paint scheme you thought up, telling you it was going to be your exclusive paint scheme, and then a couple months later releasing the scheme to other vendors. Of course, I don't know all the facts, but if Justin is this bent out of shape over the matter, I am pretty sure he has a reason to be. When a shop is only selling Colnago and Time, and no other frames, it isn't all that easy for the shop to drop one of the frames it carries.

The reason for the "whoring" of the frames is the same reason Veltec *****d them out last year. A friend of mine got an ST01 EP for $3,100 back in September. Another guy got a C50 in Georgetown for $3,100. Me, I felt like an arse since I had paid $3,150 for my C50 from Europe. Thought I was getting a great deal until Veltec had its blowout sale.

As I have been saying, I have some serious issues with Colnago's business practices. I was telling that to Justin while he was singing Colnago's praises. Now, he is a little bit more jaded than I am toward Colnago. Thing is, my stupid self is going to buy my dream Colnago, a Master X-light in PR82 come August. After that, I am going to sit back and see if Colnago actually builds something or comes up with a paint job that actually interests me enough to buy another one of its frames. Of course, I am also thinking about getting one of Colnago's fixie frames, but I hate the paint job offered on it for that kind of money.


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## one80 (Feb 22, 2006)

fabsroman said:


> It might even be cheaper to buy a Colnago in Australia than it is to buy one in the US.


Sadly, no. The retail on an EPS *frame* down here in Oz is nearly $9000 (approx US$7500), or if you get a build with Record and Eurus wheels you're looking at close to US$11500


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

one80 said:


> Sadly, no. The retail on an EPS *frame* down here in Oz is nearly $9000 (approx US$7500), or if you get a build with Record and Eurus wheels you're looking at close to US$11500


I thought the US prices on a C50 at $4,400 were nuts, but $5,500 for a frame, that is completely insane. I can buy one of Beretta's premier target shotguns with a ton of engraving on it for $5,500 and that is the cost of the entire gun, not just the frame. It is just really, really, really, tough to fathom dropping $5,500 on a bike frame. I can barely live with the $3,000 amount that I dropped on the C50. I built my Cristallo up for $5,400, but I went with somewhat cheap rims. I cannot fathom $11,500 for a bike unless it is a motorcycle or a serious collectors item that will appreciate in value.


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## meccio (Sep 29, 2005)

the price I paid for my PRZA EPS in October 2009, with seat post, was 2850 Euro. This in Milan, Italy.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

meccio said:


> the price I paid for my PRZA EPS in October 2009, with seat post, was 2850 Euro. This in Milan, Italy.


That translates to $3,450 (US) with today's conversion rate. Now, compare that to $5,500 for the same exact frame in the US. I might as well go to Italy, buy these frames, bring them back to the US, and sell them out of my garage. Wholesale in Italy must be super cheap. I'd only need a $1,000 markup on each frame and I would still be able to beat ALL the US retailers and make a pretty decent living. Who knows, if we buy the 5.7 acre lot we are looking at and I get to build my dream garage for my cars and bikes, I very well might just do this. It would be nice to take a trip or two to Italy every year and write it off as a business expense. I could even buy the frames retail in Italy, pay the 5% duty on them, and they would still only be $3,650 (US). I could sell them for $4,650 in the US and still beat most retailers. Imagine what the difference must be wholesale. I'd make a killing.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

fabsroman said:


> That translates to $3,450 (US) with today's conversion rate. Now, compare that to $5,500 for the same exact frame in the US. I might as well go to Italy, buy these frames, bring them back to the US, and sell them out of my garage. Wholesale in Italy must be super cheap. I'd only need a $1,000 markup on each frame and I would still be able to beat ALL the US retailers and make a pretty decent living. Who knows, if we buy the 5.7 acre lot we are looking at and I get to build my dream garage for my cars and bikes, I very well might just do this. It would be nice to take a trip or two to Italy every year and write it off as a business expense. I could even buy the frames retail in Italy, pay the 5% duty on them, and they would still only be $3,650 (US). I could sell them for $4,650 in the US and still beat most retailers. Imagine what the difference must be wholesale. I'd make a killing.


If you look at the ebay link there is an invoice at the bottom showing what PP was paying for an EPS frame. If he was selling them for $5500, he was making $3600/frame. Hardly just squeeking by. Granted, that is less than half what we pay for EPS frames that we sell for $5500. Not sure if that was a clear out price on the invoice or not. I know that even when Veltec was blowing stuff out it was not that cheap. So is he just jaded now that he's forced to only make $1200/frame now that the are on PBK? Well, $1200 is more than we ever make on an EPS. Welcome to the world of online competitors PP. The industry has been dealing with them for a long time.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

After making a few phone calls and emailing a few people, I can say this. OP's business practices reek of doucheitude. That's all I have to say about this.


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## JeremyP (Apr 30, 2006)

the current eps on ebay is one from veltec? they were clearing them out at 1.8k, now that was a deal


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

JeremyP said:


> the current eps on ebay is one from veltec? they were clearing them out at 1.8k, now that was a deal


IIRC the EP was $1800, the EPS's were still $2800. I had to think long and hard about it cause I wanted one bad. Ended up getting a CX-1 as it was what I could afford. That still cost me $1780 once I paid shipping/duty/GST/brokerage.


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## pvflyer (Oct 15, 2009)

Belissima, well done mate luv the gold&white :thumbsup: :thumbsup: .
One eye catcher that is for sure.

You look at your bike and one just want to ride it.


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## iyeoh (Jan 6, 2005)

Like I have always said.. $2,800 to $3,200 retail for an EPS in non-Japan Asia. That's notthe discounted price. Cheaper if you speak Chinese. And you even get a whole Ultegra group free if you sweet talk the shop owner. Only suckers pay US prices, even those on Ebay. I have heard of folks rolling complete EPS bikes (obviously with crap components) out of the shop for lessthan US$3,500.


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## JeremyP (Apr 30, 2006)

wonder what an EPS would look like in PRBK, seems the Aussie Distributor is taking it up a notch ;-)


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## gregbme (Aug 6, 2009)

*Pista Palace builds*

Hey guys, word of caution regards fitting the current crop of stems such as Deda Zero 100.
Looks slick with the top cap sitting on the stem, but if you check the inside of these babies there is a dangerous lack of steerer tube contact with the EPS cap fitted due to the dishing underneath. Much better to fit a 5mm spacer under the top cap. Provides the stem with maximum steerer tube clamping area. Not trying to teach my grandmother to suck eggs, but a lot of people try to emulate your fine examples of bike exotica.
My own PR99 EPS has this setup with white Deda stem and it still looks the goods.
Fantastic ride.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

gregbme said:


> Hey guys, word of caution regards fitting the current crop of stems such as Deda Zero 100.
> Looks slick with the top cap sitting on the stem, but if you check the inside of these babies there is a dangerous lack of steerer tube contact with the EPS cap fitted due to the dishing underneath. Much better to fit a 5mm spacer under the top cap. Provides the stem with maximum steerer tube clamping area. Not trying to teach my grandmother to suck eggs, but a lot of people try to emulate your fine examples of bike exotica.
> My own PR99 EPS has this setup with white Deda stem and it still looks the goods.
> Fantastic ride.


Good point. The reason for the 5 mm spacer and additional steerer tube above the stem is to prevent stress on the very edge of the top of the steerer tube which can cause it to crack. Trek talks about this in its installation instructions. I don't know if Colnago does the same. That additional 5 mm ensures that there isn't pressure applied to the very leading edge of the steerer tube.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

JeremyP said:


> wonder what an EPS would look like in PRBK, seems the Aussie Distributor is taking it up a notch ;-)


This frame here is a Master, not an EPS. Note the chrome head tube lugs, the chrome fork, and the chrome stays. Since the steerer tube is steel, the 5mm spacer on top of the stem isn't needed because steel steerer tubes can handle a lot more pressure from the stem than carbon steerer tubes.


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