# Brooks saddles



## Newnan3

I did a search but didnt turn up anything. 

I did my first 200km brevet this weekend and sit bones were killing me after 80 or so miles. My current saddle is a Specialized Romin expert which seems to be the correct width for my sit bones.

After that last painful 40 miles I was contemplating a Brooks. 

Whats the main difference tween the Swift and the Swallow? Also, who prefers the B17 over those two?

Oh and does anyone have an opinion on the Brooks with the cutouts?


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## aureliajulia

What is the outside distance of your sit bones? Take that measurement and add 20 mm to account for the metal cantle plate (avoid sitting on that thing), that is the minimum width you need. So if your outside distance is 130, you need a min of a 150 mm Brooks. (Don't use center to center in this case).

A B-17 is 170 mm, so max 150 mm outside distance sit bones. The Swallow is 153 mm, so the max your outside should be is 133 mm. The Swift is 152 mm, so no greater than 132 mm outside distance to avoid sitting on metal. 

The B-17 N for narrow is around 150 mm, if memory serves...you get the idea.

Avoid the S or 'short' models. Very short rails, can't adjust fore and aft as much. Those were originally designed for women wearing long skirts in the late 19th century to avoid the nose getting in the way of clothing. 

But, they do work for some people.


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## Newnan3

Thanks, I wasnt sure how the Brooks were sized. 

Is the main difference tween the swift and swallow the 1mm width difference? 

In what situation would someone prefer a B17 vs a swift or swallow?


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## bob.satan

I have the B17 on my Seven road bike and on my GT mountain bike.

I am big (line backer sized or front row size depending on where you are) and i ofund the swallow and the swift way too small, they were basically racing saddles

you will have to ride the brooks in, it takes a couple of hundred km's to get the leather to shape to you, but once it is, it is like an old lounge chair


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## giro_man

It has been a few years since I used Brooks saddles and have since sold the ones that I had. You have received good information about the widths of the various saddles. Ultimately, Brooks saddles are like any other saddle. It is a personal choice. You may or may not like it. I found Brooks saddles to be satisfactory but over time I changed my riding position from being somewhat upright to a much more aggressive position. The nose of all Brooks saddles are very hard because the tightening device for the leather cover is located under the nose of the saddle. The hardness of the nose of the saddle affects those who slide forward on the saddle or who bend their perineum into the nose of the saddle. 

I had both a B-17 and a Swallow. To me, the B-17 is like a Fizik Aliante because of the hammock shape. It is a one-position saddle. It is for riders who don't change their position or move around in the saddle. Bob.satan refers to the Swallow as a racing saddle. That is a good description. To me, it is like a Fizik Arione. You can move around on it and slide forward but be aware of the hardness of the nose.


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## Newnan3

Rep to you guys for the replies ! 

It looks like I might have to give one a try...Im leaning towards the Swift as i think itll work for me. 

But giro_man what did you move onto since the brooks didnt work for you?


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## Kristatos

I never really thought about it but giro-man's comments resonate completely with my experience with the Swallow and Fizik Aliante. 

One difference is the Brooks polished leather I find makes it easier to slide around on the saddle - for me this is not a benefit during long rides. The synthetic cover on the Fizik keeps me planted a little better. I actually like the Brooks better on my mountain bike as I constantly am moving around on the saddle while traversing rocks, etc. and that's where my Brooks ended up after I switched to the Aliante carbon for my road bikes.


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## UrbanPrimitive

Newnan3 said:


> Whats the main difference tween the Swift and the Swallow?


All else being equal, there's nothing equal about these two saddles. If you look at the leather it is evident that every aspect of the design is different. The different shapes give the saddles different characteristics in terms of stiffness, support, width, break in period, et cetera. They are both, according to Brooks, racing saddles. For Brooks that means no springs under the saddle and shapes designed to accommodate a forward tilt of the pelvis. This is in contrast to their Trekking and City ranges that have much flatter and broader designs.

Brooks Swift
View attachment 274278


Brooks Swallow
View attachment 274280


It should be noted that not all Swallows have the stitching detail present on this one. I believe that was a limited production run. In addition to all the obvious design changes between the two models they also use different weights of leather. The Swallow uses a slightly thinner leather. It is cut from a different part of the shoulder. The Swift uses the same leather weight as the B-17, though both the skirt shape and contouring are different.

In answer to your question, what's different between them? Everything.


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## Newnan3

Thanks for the input. Im probably more confused than ever about which one I should try. 

I noticed that performance bike only has the B17 but it has the regular and narrow version. 

I think I'd like the racier version. 

Are they swift and swallow any less comfy than say a B17?


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## Newnan3

And what about the Team Pro model? 

Too many choices...


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## aureliajulia

Wallbikes has a 6 month return policy.


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## Kurious Oranj

I have B17 on 3 bikes and a Swift on one (the folder bike) and I have used them all for centuries or longer rides. I prefer the B17 as I feel it takes a shorter time to break them in (for me they are comfortable right out of the box). The Swift ended up being fine but only after several hundred miles of butt pain. On one of my rides I got caught in torrential rain and after that the Swift softened up and became much better (a method not approved by Brooks of England...).


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## UrbanPrimitive

I ride Brooks Professional. It has more similarities to the B-17 model than the B-15 (Swallow) does. The Professional has more curvature to the cantle plate, like the Swift, than the B-17 or Swallow.

The general advice with buying a Brooks saddle is this: It should be comfortable right out of the box. It should be stiff, but not painful. If the saddle hurts it isn't the right shape for you. The saddles should progress from comfortable but stiff to luxurious, not from painful to tolerable.

Lots of people have had great success with Wallbikes for checking out saddles. You can also check out the Velocipede Saddle Swap-o-Roo. I don't have much advice for how to find the right one. I got lucky on my first shot with the Professional.


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## Newnan3

Does anyone have experience with the Brooks saddles with the cutout? Like the B17 Imperial...

Or are they unnecessary with the Brooks?


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## Newnan3

I ended up ordering the swift....Hopefully my @ss agrees with my purchase.

Thanks to everybody for the input


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## Tugs

One more vote for Brooks, although maybe too late.

I have a B17 Std on my mountain bike. As commented above, the extra width (175) gives lots of room to move around.

On my road/Serotta Nova, touring/Novara Safari, and tandem/Burley, I have either the Team Pro Classic or Team Pro Chrome. Both models are 160s. The main difference in the Pros is the small or large rivets. 

I prefer the larger primarily because I wear tri shorts with minimal pad/chamois and they ride over the larger rivets more smoothly. The same goes for my wool and micro fleece winter tights.

Have done centurys and multi-day touring with no issues, at all.

Have never had a problem with sag or distortion due to weather.

Despite Brooks' detailed care instructions, have never done anything to any of the saddles (one is over 30 years old), except to wash with saddle soap on the rare occasion when some mud gets packed up on the underside.

Totally agree with initial fit comment. It should be comfortable right out of the box. If it fits, over time/miles, it will become an old friend that welcomes you home whether you're racing, touring, or just toodleing around the neighborhood.


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## Stuballz

Newnan3 said:


> I ended up ordering the swift....Hopefully my @ss agrees with my purchase.
> 
> Thanks to everybody for the input


How's it been? I got B17's on everything and i've thought of putting a swift on my new rig.


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## Newnan3

Stuballz said:


> How's it been? I got B17's on everything and i've thought of putting a swift on my new rig.


Well I went ahead and ordered a B17 because Im not sure the Swift is what my butt likes. But it may not be completely broken in yet. 

Im doing a 200km brevet tomorrow so that'll be the true test. Thus far i havent done anything longer than 2 hrs on the swift. 

It does seem to be getting slightly softer with each use. I plan on assessing the situation after some time though.


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## Newnan3

Well my brevet got cut short because one of the riders crashed and broke his derailleur hanger. I felt a little discomfort in my hips but i didnt notice my sit bones afterwards so maybe im good. 

At this point the seat feels pretty good for hr rides on the rollers where i remain seated for the entire time. 

My specialized romin expert felt pretty good for up to 70 or so miles so im gonna have to a full on 200 km to really assess the situation.


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## atpjunkie

I ride a professional on my commuter. I ponder a B17


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## tihsepa

atpjunkie said:


> I ride a professional on my commuter. I ponder a B17


They are way different. I have a B17 on my mountain bike and run Team Professionals on the road bikes. They fit completely different but both are comfortable.


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## KensBikes

One way to look at is, the B17 is for riders who like the drop bars even with or above the saddle height. As your saddle to bar drop increases, your pelvis tilts forward, sit bone width narrows (distance between the pressure points decreases), and you want a narrower racing type of saddle.

Should assess your sit-bone width in your expected riding position on that bike.


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## Woyteck Morajko

I have 6 bikes with b17, so I have some experience . yes, I am large with wide sitbones, so I followed brooks' recommendation and chose b17. I had no problems with comfort from day one, BUT, I started riding them early in year, thus was able to increase mileage gradually. have also used proofhide 3-4 times a year. I don't know if this is coincidence, but black saddles seem to break in faster than brown ones. anybody else experience this? also, over 2 years I've had to use the front bolt to take up some slack. overall, couldn't be happier with comfort. and I ride unpadded cotton shorts. call me team hardass


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