# Just received my Ebay carbon frame...pic heavy thread



## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

I just received my Ebay frame from seller bicycle_999 and I thought I'd post up pictures of everything. I purchased the 52cm Kuota Kredo style frame with seatpost, handlebar, wavy fork, and seatpost clamp for $410 shipped. I contacted the seller directly through ebay to make an offer for this package which is quite a bit cheaper than they list it on their auctions when you factor in the shipping costs. I paid via Paypal on May12th so the shipping from Taiwan (8 days total) was pretty damn quick. I haven't had time to give it a real detailed look since I had it delivered to my office, but I did take some pics of everything to give folks an idea of what you might expect. Sorry some of the pics are a little crappy. Hard to take great photos in the office when I'm supposed to be working.

Other than a few cosmetic blemishes here and there everything seems pretty satisfactory I've never owned a carbon frame so I don't know how this would stack up against some others. I'm planning to build this up with SRAM Rival and possibly a Soul 3.0 wheelset. Anyway, thought some detailed photos might help if any of you are on the fence about one of these framesets.

Box as it was delivered by USPS. Surprisingly light considering everything inside.


















This hole in the box had me a little worried, but turns out everything inside was fine.




























I went with the 42cm handlebar. I'm not even sure I will use these when I build it up.































































Just a little bit of crustiness inside the seatpost.


















Bottom bracket...



























Riveted cable guides on the downtube.



























There was a little funk going on with the weave near the headtube.









Some cosmetic issues on one of the seatstays.


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## Mel Erickson (Feb 3, 2004)

MercuryMan76 said:


> I just received my Ebay frame from seller bicycle_999 and I thought I'd post up pictures of everything. I purchased the 52cm Kuota Kredo style frame with seatpost, handlebar, wavy fork, and seatpost clamp for $410 shipped. I contacted the seller directly through ebay to make an offer for this package which is quite a bit cheaper than they list it on their auctions when you factor in the shipping costs. I paid via Paypal on May12th so the shipping from Taiwan (8 days total) was pretty damn quick. I haven't had time to give it a real detailed look since I had it delivered to my office, but I did take some pics of everything to give folks an idea of what you might expect. Sorry some of the pics are a little crappy. Hard to take great photos in the office when I'm supposed to be working.
> 
> Other than a few cosmetic blemishes here and there everything seems pretty satisfactory I've never owned a carbon frame so I don't know how this would stack up against some others. I'm planning to build this up with SRAM Rival and possibly a Soul 3.0 wheelset. Anyway, thought some detailed photos might help if any of you are on the fence about one of these framesets.
> 
> ...


Nice shoes.


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## rydog9991 (Jul 15, 2008)

Mel Erickson said:


> Nice shoes.



Dang, you beat me to it.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Let us know how it works out for you several thousand miles down the road. What I worry about with buying a no-name frame is that it might split in half on me while I am riding it, I'll suffer extensive injury, and there will be absolutely nobody to go after in a product defect case. That is one of the big problems with internet sales. If you get screwed, how do you even think of recovering.


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## dougrocky123 (Apr 12, 2006)

*Thanks for pics*

I've been thinking of doing the same build for sometime. Did you come across any good deals on a Rival group?


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

Hahaha, I love these shoes. Cole Haan Drydens.



rydog9991 said:


> Dang, you beat me to it.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

I've been searching high and low for the cheapest price on an '09 Rival groupset. Right now the best price I think would be to do the Ebay thing using the live.com cashback. Right now the cashback is only at 8% so I'm hoping it will go up sometime soon. At 8% you'd be paying about $625-650 from Ebay. 

There's a member over on bikeforums.net "psimet2001" that will sell the groupset for $655 as well but I don't know what he charges for shipping.



dougrocky123 said:


> I've been thinking of doing the same build for sometime. Did you come across any good deals on a Rival group?


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## Sablotny (Aug 15, 2002)

Interesting. I was only daring enough to buy two carbon bottle cages from Taiwan for $24 or so shipped. I also saw some cosmetic flaws here and there in the top weave, but really nothing you'd notice if you weren't staring at the things closely. 500 miles later... they're cheap, light, cool cages. 

I wonder... can some third rate company actually design and build these molds and bikes? I have a feeling these are simply factory seconds from the same shops that make, er, 99% of all the carbon frames out there. In which case, it should be a killer deal.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Sablotny said:


> Interesting. I was only daring enough to buy two carbon bottle cages from Taiwan for $24 or so shipped. I also saw some cosmetic flaws here and there in the top weave, but really nothing you'd notice if you weren't staring at the things closely. 500 miles later... they're cheap, light, cool cages.
> 
> I wonder... can some third rate company actually design and build these molds and bikes? I have a feeling these are simply factory seconds from the same shops that make, er, 99% of all the carbon frames out there. In which case, it should be a killer deal.


Unless it happens to be a factory second for a significant defect. I've been thinking the same thing about the Cinelli Ram bars and seatpost that I bought from a Taiwan ebay seller. Cinelli even had a disclaimer on its website about the parts being sold on ebay.


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## masterbiker (Dec 13, 2007)

Enjoy the new bike, but you get what you pay for.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Oh boy! Another generic Taiwanese carbon frame.


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## Le Wrench (May 12, 2009)

ewitz said:


> Oh boy! Another generic Taiwanese carbon frame.


No better or worse than those European brands that get carbon frames from Taiwan, like the Merckx CHM. Colnago CLX riders seem just happy and dandy on their made in Taiwan frames.


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## Le Wrench (May 12, 2009)

Thanks for posting these pics!

Looking like these eBay carbon frames are becoming the Model T hotrod frames of this forum. 

Fun seeing all the various builds based on these frames.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

Le Wrench said:


> No better or worse than those European brands that get carbon frames from Taiwan, like the Merckx CHM. Colnago CLX riders seem just happy and dandy on their made in Taiwan frames.


Which is why I ride Look (fine it is Tunisian) and Time.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

Here's the thing...nobody cares



ewitz said:


> Which is why I ride Look (fine it is Tunisian) and Time.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

MercuryMan76 said:


> Here's the thing...nobody cares


Some people care and some people don't. Obviously, you don't.


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## dave2pvd (Oct 15, 2007)

ewitz said:


> Which is why I ride Look (fine it is Tunisian) and Time.


Because Tunisian can only be better than Taiwanese!

:biggrin5::biggrin5::biggrin5:


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## Sablotny (Aug 15, 2002)

ewitz said:


> Oh boy! Another generic Taiwanese carbon frame.


Yeah- slap some paint and logos on it and it could be - an "Italian" Pinarello, a "Canadian" Cervelo, or an "American" Specialized!


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

Good point. You are absolutely right...I don't particularly care what he/she rides. What I do care about is people that somehow feel the need to point out what they ride as if it will suddenly lend them some type of credibility on these forums. I'm not going to sit here and second guess my purchase because someone that owns a Look, or a Time, or a Pinarello, made a comment about my "generic Taiwanese bike". 

I ride what I ride because I want to, not because I'm concerned with what others will think about it. 




fabsroman said:


> Some people care and some people don't. Obviously, you don't.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

MercuryMan76 said:


> Good point. You are absolutely right...I don't particularly care what he/she rides. What I do care about is people that somehow feel the need to point out what they ride as if it will suddenly lend them some type of credibility on these forums. I'm not going to sit here and second guess my purchase because someone that owns a Look, or a Time, or a Pinarello, made a comment about my "generic Taiwanese bike".
> 
> I ride what I ride because I want to, not because I'm concerned with what others will think about it.


Well said, and I couldn't agree with you more. My only issue with a frame like that is what will happen if there is a catastrophic failure. With a no name frame, it is really hard to sue anybody. Since I have a wife and kids, I need to know that should the frame have a catastrophic failure and I die as a result, there will be some deep pockets to sue. Of course, there is also the life insurance, but hopefully your understand what I mean.

Most of my clothes are generic, and my car wouldn't impress a single person.


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## DaveG (Feb 4, 2004)

*why do you want to sue someone so badly?*



fabsroman said:


> Well said, and I couldn't agree with you more. My only issue with a frame like that is what will happen if there is a catastrophic failure. With a no name frame, it is really hard to sue anybody. Since I have a wife and kids, I need to know that should the frame have a catastrophic failure and I die as a result, there will be some deep pockets to sue. Of course, there is also the life insurance, but hopefully your understand what I mean.
> 
> Most of my clothes are generic, and my car wouldn't impress a single person.


Not getting hurt or killed is a good thing, but I am not sure I get much piece of mind thinking that there will be someone to sue. Cycling has some inherent risk to it beyond just the rare event of a catastrophic frame or fork failure. If you want to protect your family, insurance seems a safer way that just sueing deep pockets.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

DaveG said:


> Not getting hurt or killed is a good thing, but I am not sure I get much piece of mind thinking that there will be someone to sue. Cycling has some inherent risk to it beyond just the rare event of a catastrophic frame or fork failure. If you want to protect your family, insurance seems a safer way that just sueing deep pockets.


I'm an attorney/CPA. I always look at worst case scenarios (e.g., attorney) and I always try to project future costs (e.g., CPA). Personally, I would prefer that my frame never break and that I never get hurt from it breaking, versus actually suing somebody. Sometimes though, it just has to be done. I'm in the process of suing an air brush artist that will not refund my money to me and that will not take the paint off my bars and saddle. So, he will be getting sued shortly, as soon as I can find the time. The real reason we couldn't work this out short of a law suit is because when I called him to talk it over with him and try to have him repaint the parts, he called me a liar. That was the last straw. In this case, I would have preferred that my parts got painted the way I wanted them painted and that he had clear coated them correctly. As it is, I have close to $1,000 in parts sitting here and a C50 sitting in the garage waiting for bars/stem and saddle so I can ride it. Got the saddle today. Next, I'll be working on the bars and wheels.


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## euro-trash (May 1, 2004)

What do you estimate is the largest tire you can fit in the 'Onda' style fork? a 25mm? Thanks.


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## muscleendurance (Jan 11, 2009)

euro-trash said:


> What do you estimate is the largest tire you can fit in the 'Onda' style fork? a 25mm? Thanks.


and.......back on topic again


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## tom_h (May 6, 2008)

Sablotny said:


> Yeah- slap some paint and logos on it and it could be - an "Italian" Pinarello, a "Canadian" Cervelo, or an "American" Specialized!


Not likely. Not only is the exterior of better cosmetic quality, but the insides of Specialized CF frames are finished much better. This indicates a better "pride of workmanship" , more attention to detail, and probably better insitutionalized quality-control procedures.

Taiwan has some of the most advanced manufacturing capability and quality in the world: microchips, machinine tools, computer parts, etc.

They also have their share of cheap, crapola mfrs ... just like the USA, Italy, and so on. 

I'd rather have a good Taiwan product, than a crummy USA product.


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## tom_h (May 6, 2008)

fabsroman said:


> ... what will happen if there is a catastrophic failure. With a no name frame, it is really hard to sue anybody. Since I have a wife and kids, I need to know that should the frame have a catastrophic failure and I die as a result, there will be some deep pockets to sue. Of course, there is also the life insurance, but hopefully your understand what I mean...


It's best if frames don't ever fail. What good is winning a lawsuit if one is crippled, maimed, brain-damaged, or dead? 
Will winning a $5 Million lawsuit compensate anyone for for losing "quality of life"?

People who want to buy "cheap" should think twice about carbon fiber... if "cheap" is the priority, buy steel-frame, since cheap-steel will likely fail more gracefully than cheap-aluminum or cheap-CF.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

tom_h said:


> It's best if frames don't ever fail. What good is winning a lawsuit if one is crippled, maimed, brain-damaged, or dead?
> Will winning a $5 Million lawsuit compensate anyone for for losing "quality of life"?
> 
> People who want to buy "cheap" should think twice about carbon fiber... if "cheap" is the priority, buy steel-frame, since cheap-steel will likely fail more gracefully than cheap-aluminum or cheap-CF.


I agree 100%. I would prefer that my frames never fail. The point is that more established builders have a lot more to lose if they put out defective frames, versus a start up, no name frame builder that is selling stuff on ebay half a world away. These frames could be being built in somebody's kitchen for all we know, with absolutely no quality control.

Now, when you have a wife and kids, you would like to be reassured that should the carbon fiber or aluminum frame you are riding fail catastrophically, there is health insurance, life insurance, and a manufacturer to go after that is worth something.


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## BunnV (Sep 7, 2005)

tom_h said:


> People who want to buy "cheap" should think twice about carbon fiber... if "cheap" is the priority, buy steel-frame, since cheap-steel will likely fail more gracefully than cheap-aluminum or cheap-CF.


Or not... http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=456757


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## JuanVerde (Nov 21, 2005)

Le Wrench said:


> Thanks for posting these pics!
> 
> Looking like these eBay carbon frames are becoming the Model T hotrod frames of this forum.
> 
> Fun seeing all the various builds based on these frames.


I think LeWrench hit the nail on the head...these are the cheap mass produced hotrods of the bicycle industry.

Enjoy the ride Mercury - post some pics when you're done with the build


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

I haven't had a chance to begin building the bike up since I haven't ordered the wheelset and parts yet, but I threw my wheel from other bike in the fork to check the clearance and noticed that it was off-center. You can see from the pics that the gap between the wheel and inside wall of the fork is a little wider on the left hand side than the right. I don't know if this is much of a problem but I sent these pics to the seller to ask about it and see if I could exchange it or something. I don't particularly want to pay the shipping fees back to Taiwan though so we'll see what happens.

On another note, I certainly didn't mean for this thread to turn into a debate about the quality of these frames vs. the major brands out there. I simply posted wanted to post some detailed pics so that others who were considering buying a frame on ebay could get an idea of what to expect. I'm aware that there is a level of risk involved in purchasing a frame off ebay from an unknown seller but after reading through the other threads from others that have purchased these I felt it was a pretty safe bet. I don't own another carbon frame to compare this to, and as mentioned, haven't built it up yet so I haven't ridden it yet. I will say that the communication, shipping, etc. from the seller have all been fairly easy though. Not that this would help me at all if this thing snaps in half on a ride or anything like that. Let the buyer beware I guess.


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## raymonda (Jan 31, 2007)

I'm sure you have made sure that your front wheel is dished properly or that your quick release is tight and secure?


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## Italianrider76 (May 13, 2005)

Have you tried mounting the wheel the other way around? Does the same thing happen but on the opposite side? You've probably thought of this but it could very well be the wheel.


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## biketaviousmaximus (Dec 21, 2008)

I would just hit the drop out with a round file, it has happened to other guys. Just file it. I got my "Intense Fenix" copy today and the biddon cage screws on the seat tube are skewif..... I'll just fettle the biddon cages..

Rock on!


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## velomateo (Mar 7, 2009)

Mercuryman76 - I had a similar problem with the fork on my ebay frame, but I couldn't get the wheel in to the drop-out at all. I measured the good drop-out and then filed the bad one to the same dimension. The wheel now has even spacing on both sides.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

Good to know. I may just have to do the same thing. I emailed the seller - bicycle_999 - and sent the same pictures and received a response that he/they would forward them to the factory. I don't particularly want to have to ship this thing back for an exchange or anything.



velomateo said:


> Mercuryman76 - I had a similar problem with the fork on my ebay frame, but I couldn't get the wheel in to the drop-out at all. I measured the good drop-out and then filed the bad one to the same dimension. The wheel now has even spacing on both sides.


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## dynamic_e (Jun 29, 2008)

tom_h said:


> It's best if frames don't ever fail. What good is winning a lawsuit if one is crippled, maimed, brain-damaged, or dead?
> Will winning a $5 Million lawsuit compensate anyone for for losing "quality of life"?
> 
> People who want to buy "cheap" should think twice about carbon fiber... if "cheap" is the priority, buy steel-frame, since cheap-steel will likely fail more gracefully than cheap-aluminum or cheap-CF.


Only thing is there are stories of other catastrophic carbon failures from major names like Orbea and what not. One to my knowledge resulted in death. I'm not sure if the family is pursuing legal action or not. Carbon failure is not limited to ebay specials.


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## Rickk (Jun 27, 2007)

*Any updates on the fork and your build?*

Thanks 



> Good to know. I may just have to do the same thing. I emailed the seller - bicycle_999 - and sent the same pictures and received a response that he/they would forward them to the factory. I don't particularly want to have to ship this thing back for an exchange or anything.


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## emoney (May 9, 2009)

For the record, I ride a Look, made in France carbon frame bike, (which I love almost as much as my wife), and suprisingly enough, I've had to repair the frame because one of the tubes separated at the headpost. Doesn't matter who makes it, anything man-made has the potential to break; period.
Secondly, build that thing man so we can see it in it's full glory. 1 question:
Are you going to add some form of graphics or anything?
Just curious


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## DrSmile (Jul 22, 2006)

emoney said:


> For the record, I ride a Look, made in France carbon frame bike, (which I love almost as much as my wife), and suprisingly enough, I've had to repair the frame because one of the tubes separated at the headpost.


That would be the last frame I bought from the company, no matter who they are.


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## single~minded (May 11, 2009)

Also make sure there is no clear coat in the drop out....mine had some so i trimed it out with a exacto knife...problem solved :thumbsup: 



MercuryMan76 said:


> I haven't had a chance to begin building the bike up since I haven't ordered the wheelset and parts yet, but I threw my wheel from other bike in the fork to check the clearance and noticed that it was off-center. You can see from the pics that the gap between the wheel and inside wall of the fork is a little wider on the left hand side than the right. I don't know if this is much of a problem but I sent these pics to the seller to ask about it and see if I could exchange it or something. I don't particularly want to pay the shipping fees back to Taiwan though so we'll see what happens.
> 
> On another note, I certainly didn't mean for this thread to turn into a debate about the quality of these frames vs. the major brands out there. I simply posted wanted to post some detailed pics so that others who were considering buying a frame on ebay could get an idea of what to expect. I'm aware that there is a level of risk involved in purchasing a frame off ebay from an unknown seller but after reading through the other threads from others that have purchased these I felt it was a pretty safe bet. I don't own another carbon frame to compare this to, and as mentioned, haven't built it up yet so I haven't ridden it yet. I will say that the communication, shipping, etc. from the seller have all been fairly easy though. Not that this would help me at all if this thing snaps in half on a ride or anything like that. Let the buyer beware I guess.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

I tell you what, there is all kinds of weird stuff in the seattube. It's like a weird cellophane clear paper stuff that is stuck to the tube itself. I wasn't able to get it all cleared out.

I'm just about ready to start building her up though. Got some decals made up and just picked up my wheels from the builder today...1400 gram wheelset. And I'll be slapping on the SRAM Rival in the next few days.

Will post some pics soon.



single~minded said:


> Also make sure there is no clear coat in the drop out....mine had some so i trimed it out with a exacto knife...problem solved :thumbsup:


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## PlatyPius (Feb 1, 2009)

MercuryMan76 said:


> I tell you what, there is *all kinds of weird stuff in the seattube. It's like a weird cellophane clear paper stuff that is stuck to the tube itself.* I wasn't able to get it all cleared out.
> 
> I'm just about ready to start building her up though. Got some decals made up and just picked up my wheels from the builder today...1400 gram wheelset. And I'll be slapping on the SRAM Rival in the next few days.
> 
> Will post some pics soon.


That's the bladder from the moulding process.....


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## Dklein (Nov 25, 2008)

MercuryMan76 said:


> I tell you what, there is all kinds of weird stuff in the seattube. It's like a weird cellophane clear paper stuff that is stuck to the tube itself. I wasn't able to get it all cleared out.
> 
> I'm just about ready to start building her up though. Got some decals made up and just picked up my wheels from the builder today...1400 gram wheelset. And I'll be slapping on the SRAM Rival in the next few days.
> 
> Will post some pics soon.


I've been talking with Mercury Man offline and we are both building similar bikes although mine is probably gonna be heavier. I just sought his advice since I have no idea what I'm doing.... I'll post some pics here too if that's ok.

But, I do know a little about carbon and that cellophane is used a release agent from the mold. I built a 6' carbon / kevlar tiller extension for my sailboat and that's what I used.

I hope this image doesn't blow up!! I got a feeling it will.


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## Eisentraut (Sep 18, 2008)

I've worked with carbon fiber for many years now and I'm willing to bet that 99.99% of every carbon frame that is going to be painted has some cosmetic flaws in the top layer of carbon. It takes huge labor hours to make a naked carbon bike flawless because of the carbon shifting once the vacuum / autoclave pressure is applied. If every frame had to be flawless there might only be a handfull of bikes on the road.
The clear stuff that you see is probably from a bag that is inflated inside the tube for compaction to the mold. Because it's plastic and non bondable they wouldn't bother using release on it but rather it gets snagged on the schmutz that oozes out on the inside. Were not talking really high tech here.


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## single~minded (May 11, 2009)

Eisentraut said:


> I've worked with carbon fiber for many years now and I'm willing to bet that 99.99% of every carbon frame that is going to be painted has some cosmetic flaws in the top layer of carbon. It takes huge labor hours to make a naked carbon bike flawless because of the carbon shifting once the vacuum / autoclave pressure is applied. If every frame had to be flawless there might only be a handfull of bikes on the road.
> The clear stuff that you see is probably from a bag that is inflated inside the tube for compaction to the mold. Because it's plastic and non bondable they wouldn't bother using release on it but rather it gets snagged on the schmutz that oozes out on the inside. Were not talking really high tech here.


Yup......even my Orbea Opal had that plastic bag stuff in it...but then it camd from Taiwan also


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

emoney said:


> For the record, I ride a Look, made in France carbon frame bike, (which I love almost as much as my wife), and suprisingly enough, I've had to repair the frame because one of the tubes separated at the headpost. Doesn't matter who makes it, anything man-made has the potential to break; period.
> Secondly, build that thing man so we can see it in it's full glory. 1 question:
> Are you going to add some form of graphics or anything?
> Just curious


I've been trying to get this thing together but just haven't had much time the past couple weeks. Should finish it up this week. I had some stickers printed up that I slapped on there to add some color to the darth vader look.



















Will post a few more when she's all dressed up and ready to party.


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## wagonman01 (Jan 16, 2009)

That looks pretty pimp. What bar tape color you thinking? Been considering the same path myself.

I do bike work at a local bike co-op and I've built up (and ridden) quite a few older 1950's and 1960's roadies that creak and flex under load, and they hold up pretty well at +35 mph downhill. I've also hand-laid CF for large model rockets, replacement car parts and testing purposes, I wouldn't doubt this frame would stand up to some abuse. I'm sure the brand name snobs feel like they're on the high road by playing it safe, I just personally find it amusing to read their justifications.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

wagonman01 said:


> That looks pretty pimp. What bar tape color you thinking? Been considering the same path myself.
> 
> I do bike work at a local bike co-op and I've built up (and ridden) quite a few older 1950's and 1960's roadies that creak and flex under load, and they hold up pretty well at +35 mph downhill. I've also hand-laid CF for large model rockets, replacement car parts and testing purposes, I wouldn't doubt this frame would stand up to some abuse. I'm sure the brand name snobs feel like they're on the high road by playing it safe, I just personally find it amusing to read their justifications.


Red bar tape all the way.


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

So the bike is about 99% complete. Just need to fine tune the derailleurs but I'm just too tired to do that tonight. Once I get it out on the road I'm going to play around with the sizing so I can get a proper fit. Here's a few shots of the nearly complete project...I've dubbed it The Rising Son.




























I've lost track of how much this entire build cost but I think it was in the neighborhood of $1500 total. My build looks something like this:

Ebay carbon frame, seatpost, handlebar, fork, headset, cages
Sram Rival groupset - SRAM PG-1070 cassette
KMC DX10 chain
Race Face Cadence 100mm stem
Kinlin XR-270s laced with Sapim Laser spokes to Formula RB-68/RB-210 hubs - 20/24 lacing pattern
Continental Grand Prix GP4000S
Crank Brothers Candy pedals

I don't know the exact weight yet. I'll get it up on a scale soon. Wheelset was custom built and came out to 1400 grams exactly.


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## athletic91 (May 28, 2009)

im guessing around 7,5kg for mercury man


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

that stem faceplate looks a bit scary to me on a carbon bar...


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## Hammerhands (Aug 19, 2009)

I am new to carbon frames. How do they fail? Has anyone ever sene one fail? Or heard first hand of a sudden, catastrophic failure not caused by a crash? I have not. 

I would think that if the frame were to be weakened by cracks or delamination, then it would creak and squeak before it suddenly broke in half. A quick google search confirms that this is a typical failure mode.


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## PlatyPius (Feb 1, 2009)

"I am new to carbon frames." 
Sure ya are.
"How do they fail?"
Same way that any other frame fails - poor build quality, material failure, or - one that only applies to carbon - putting too much lateral force on the frame.
"Has anyone ever sene(sic) one fail?"
Yes.
"Or heard first hand of a sudden, catastrophic failure not caused by a crash?"
Yes. 
"I have not."
Of course not! You just said you were new to carbon frames. Ergo, they just popped into existence in your world recently. 

"I would think that if the frame were to be weakened by cracks or delamination, then it would creak and squeak before it suddenly broke in half."
Well yeah....if it cracked first. It doesn't always do that, though. Sometimes it just breaks in half.

"A quick google search confirms that this is a typical failure mode."
And a quick Google search shows that chicks-with-dicks are apparently very common...


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Hammerhands said:


> I am new to carbon frames. How do they fail? Has anyone ever sene one fail? Or heard first hand of a sudden, catastrophic failure not caused by a crash? I have not.
> 
> I would think that if the frame were to be weakened by cracks or delamination, then it would creak and squeak before it suddenly broke in half. A quick google search confirms that this is a typical failure mode.


Here you go. A thread showing pics and giving descriptions of two Pinarellos that failed.

Forgot to add the link:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=158543&highlight=pinarello+failure


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## Salsa_Lover (Jul 6, 2008)

You can say whatever you want, but simply I can't 

Those frames are so ugly only their mothers could love them


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## PlatyPius (Feb 1, 2009)

Salsa_Lover said:


> You can say whatever you want, but simply I can't
> 
> Those frames are so ugly only their mothers could love them


I've always liked Pinarello, but I agree.... they're heinously ugly.


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## PatricioP14 (Aug 10, 2007)

*My carbon frame*

After having considered one of these carbon frames for 9 months, I've finally done it, and to much satisfaction, I might add.  

























And after the custom decaling and build:









The frame is a 58cm. I was weary when I ordered it, but no longer have any doubts about its quality. I've put about 300 miles on it so far, and raced it twice: one road race on 2/27 and a crit on 2/28. The bike handles like a dream and is every bit as stiff as my old Aluminum frame was. 

Xodus is my custom bike name I came up with (pronounced, "Exodus"). It's nice having a one-of-a-kind bike. It got passed around an entire opposing racing team this past weekend with ooh's awes and drools....

.... And frowns when they picked it up and all said, "This is so much lighter than my Cannondale."

:thumbsup: 

Patrick
Subaru-University of Kentucky Collegiate Cycling Team


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## fazzman (Mar 12, 2008)

Cool build but not a fan of all the decals. Is the seat post backwards?


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## PatricioP14 (Aug 10, 2007)

fazzman said:


> Cool build but not a fan of all the decals. Is the seat post backwards?


Nah, it's a forward seatpost. I have a short femur relative to my tibia. And the saddle isn't actually tilted. The bike has a sloping top tube so while it hangs level, it actually isn't.

Patrick


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

PatricioP14 said:


> Nah, it's a forward seatpost. I have a short femur relative to my tibia. And the saddle isn't actually tilted. The bike has a sloping top tube so while it hangs level, it actually isn't.
> 
> Patrick


It's a matter of taste, but I'd get rid of all the decals except the one that says, 'Decal Kits.'


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## zion rasta (Aug 15, 2004)

*Dude!*



fabsroman said:


> I'm an attorney/CPA. I always look at worst case scenarios (e.g., attorney) and I always try to project future costs (e.g., CPA). Personally, I would prefer that my frame never break and that I never get hurt from it breaking, versus actually suing somebody. Sometimes though, it just has to be done. I'm in the process of suing an air brush artist that will not refund my money to me and that will not take the paint off my bars and saddle. So, he will be getting sued shortly, as soon as I can find the time. The real reason we couldn't work this out short of a law suit is because when I called him to talk it over with him and try to have him repaint the parts, he called me a liar. That was the last straw. In this case, I would have preferred that my parts got painted the way I wanted them painted and that he had clear coated them correctly. As it is, I have close to $1,000 in parts sitting here and a C50 sitting in the garage waiting for bars/stem and saddle so I can ride it. Got the saddle today. Next, I'll be working on the bars and wheels.


Oh wait a tick, you are a freaking attorney, you can afford a whole bike :idea:


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## MercuryMan76 (Apr 17, 2009)

PatricioP14...dude, keep your decals. In my opinion, it's cool that you came up with something genuine rather than trying to plaster some big name brand decals on the frame like some others have done.


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## JaeP (Mar 12, 2002)

PatricioP14 said:


> After having considered one of these carbon frames for 9 months, I've finally done it, and to much satisfaction, I might add.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


How tall are you? I've been thinking about these frames as well but the largest is a 58cm. I normally ride a 60cm but I did notice that the headtube length of the carbon fiber frame is "taller" than all of the 60cm frames I have.


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## st3v3 (Jul 25, 2009)

I'm with the good build, rough seatpost and decals club.


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## StillRiding (Sep 16, 2006)

fabsroman said:


> Let us know how it works out for you several thousand miles down the road. What I worry about with buying a no-name frame is that it might split in half on me while I am riding it, I'll suffer extensive injury, and there will be absolutely nobody to go after in a product defect case. That is one of the big problems with internet sales. If you get screwed, how do you even think of recovering.


So let me get this straight. You base your purchasing decisions on who's easiest to sue? 

No wonder the American economy is going to crap.


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## biketaviousmaximus (Dec 21, 2008)

skyliner1004 said:


> OP, after a year or so, how has your bike been? Other people with asian generic carbon frames, how are you loving them?


Not being a 'hater' but I sold mine after a couple of months as I found it to be WAY to flexi. I had read that a new fork would fix it, but when racing at 65km ph in a bunch, I just didn't have confidence in the bike.

I think they are a fabulous 'entry' beginners bike, but sorry mine just didn't compare to my BMC Pro machine I currently ride...:thumbsup:


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