# new old frame



## 1speed (Mar 31, 2006)

Hi!
I found two new old frames, one is a kg451 and the other a kg461 for good price, respective in their rank. I’m not sure witch one I should chose. There are big differences between both, geometry and tubing. So, I guess the ride is different as well. What I’m looking for is an all around bike for long and performance ride. I don’t race, but serious training, and group ridding. I have a low budget, that's why I'm not looking the 500 serie. I read the 461 is for heavier rider, I weight 152 pounds. Am I too light for it, or it’s not an issue. Size of both frame are 51, but tube is longer on the 451. The 461 is slopped. 
Anyway, If you have any comments, they are welcome. Actually, I ride an old steel Marinoni with 6 gears, ...kind of vintage. It’s ok and fun to ride, but there are limits with it. 

Thanks.


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## vivaxc (May 1, 2007)

*Frame help*

hey 1speed,
I just purched a KG461 a little over a week ago. So far I have found it to be a very nice ride. It is smooth, yet powerful. I am 140 pounds and have not found it to be any trouble in manouvering or in general. I have found it to be excellent on long rides because it is so smooth and I would also say that it performs very well. I cannot say anything about the KG451, but I know that I am more than happy with my bikes ride. Good luck with your puchase.


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## 1speed (Mar 31, 2006)

Hi Vivaxc!

That’s interesting, is it too much to ask how much you paid for your frame? Just to compare if I have a good deal. The 461 I found is $1500 CAD including our famous Canadian taxes, that must be someting like $1300 USD. I found a new campy centaur 2006 too put on. That should be a good ride.  
Just the wheels so far, Campy Vento....don't know them


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## vivaxc (May 1, 2007)

Hey 1speed,
I puchased my bike off ebay. I got the KG461 frame with full campy chorus compenentry, rolf sestriere wheels, carbon headset, and carbon seat for $1600 USD. It was very slightly used, but still in amazing condition. I am not 100% on this, but I belive that the KG461 frame retails around $1500 USD. You will not be disappointed with your purchase though. Hope this helps and good luck with your search.


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## Fr Ted Crilly (Feb 7, 2002)

I got a new KG451 frame and fork for a bargain price last year and built it up with all Chorus components and DT Swiss/Speedcific wheels and I'm very pleased with what I ended up with. Now, the only other bike I've ridden for more than a few miles is a steel Bianchi Veloce so I don't have a lot to compare it to, but the Look is streets ahead on all counts. It's lighter, stiffer and soaks up bumps better I think than the Bianchi. After a recent 130 mile ride on the Look I felt far better than I ever did after 100 miles on the Bianchi, (perhaps I'm in better shape now than a couple of years ago).

One area where it is very clearly better is descending. I'm far more comfortable cornering now and as a result am faster, (and subsequently there is a bigger smile on my face). There is a little BB flex on the Look, (and I'm no heavyweight), but less than on the Bianchi. Perhaps the Bianchi is showing it's age, (about 15,000 miles and all original parts except for the chain, cassette & headset), but getting onto the Look on a Saturday morning after a week commuting on the Bianchi, it feels like a rocket in comparison. I love it and would ride it to work everyday but I like to keep that "new bike excitement" that I still get every Saturday morning, more than a year after bulding it up.


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## wheelsonfire (Feb 18, 2007)

I've got a 461 built up with a centaur drivetrain and proton wheels . . . I love it. It's not as light as some of the 2007 bikes out there but it's still respectable. Smooth ride, climbs well and descends with manners. (Was riding a Cannondale CAAD5 before) You won't regret it. Let us know how you do!


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