# Palin's 25 Million Dollar gravel road is finished.



## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Alaska now has a Road to Nowhere going to what would have been the Bridge to Nowhere.

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's transportation department has completed a $25 million gravel road leading to the site of a bridge that Palin, as John McCain's vice presidential candidate, now boasts that she stopped, so as to save taxpayers money. The road was built with federal tax dollars.

Ketchikan Mayor Bob Weinstein said the 3.2-mile road will be useful for road races, hunters and possibly future development. But with no bridge to serve it, that's probably about it.

"I think it will be good for recreational things like a 5K and a 10K," Weinstein said. "And instead of people walking through brush, it may be used for hunting in the area."

Palin repeatedly tells campaign crowds she said "thanks but no thanks" to Washington when it came up with $400 million for a bridge linking Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport. In fact, she turned against the bridge only after it became a national symbol of wasteful spending and Washington had backed off financing the project.


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## Creakyknees (Sep 21, 2003)

Yep. Good think Obama never voted for any federal funding for his district.


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## Campag12 (Jul 31, 2008)

Yes, building roads for American citizens is wasteful while spending 700 billion dollars to bail out Wall Street is not! I'm sure there's that evasive "trickle down" benefits of saving WS. However, as an average American citizen I'd much prefer some "visible" change over mental change (yes, all that change we can believe in" bull$h!) BTW, where do we get the money? Just print out new paper notes? Wouldn't that cause inflation?



MR_GRUMPY said:


> Alaska now has a Road to Nowhere going to what would have been the Bridge to Nowhere.
> 
> Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's transportation department has completed a $25 million gravel road leading to the site of a bridge that Palin, as John McCain's vice presidential candidate, now boasts that she stopped, so as to save taxpayers money. The road was built with federal tax dollars.
> 
> ...


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## JoeDaddio (Sep 3, 2005)

I sure do wish that my city had a 3 mile gravel road in the middle of nowhere.


joe


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## Fredke (Dec 10, 2004)

JoeDaddio said:


> I sure do wish that my city had a 3 mile gravel road in the middle of nowhere.


I thought your city had about eleventy million freeways in the middle of nowhere.


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## thatsmybush (Mar 12, 2002)

Creakyknees said:


> Yep. Good think Obama never voted for any federal funding for his district.


That sure absolves Palin from being a shill and a liar. Oh wait...no it doesn't

My bad.


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## JoeDaddio (Sep 3, 2005)

Fredke said:


> I thought your city had about eleventy million freeways in the middle of nowhere.



That's just about right, but the fact that they're jam packed nearly 24/7 leads me to believe that they actually lead somewhere.

But just think of all the sweet burnouts I could do on my bike on a _gravel_ road?


joe


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## Campag12 (Jul 31, 2008)

If I infer correctly, both sides of the road are pristine wilderness. Wouldn't that add significantly to quality of life for Alaska residents? You can now hunt for your own food during winter food shortage. My dad's friend used to live in a small town Alaska (don't remember name) and he had to order "food" on the web cause it's so damn expensive and inconvenient to obtain in Alaska.



JoeDaddio said:


> I sure do wish that my city had a 3 mile gravel road in the middle of nowhere.
> 
> 
> joe


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## JoeDaddio (Sep 3, 2005)

Campag12 said:


> If I infer correctly, both sides of the road are pristine wilderness. Wouldn't that add significantly to quality of life for Alaska residents? You can now hunt for your own food during winter food shortage. My dad's friend used to live in a small town Alaska (don't remember name) and he had to order "food" on the web cause it's so damn expensive and inconvenient to obtain in Alaska.



So... no one could hunt there without the road before? 


joe


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

That's 3.2 miles to you.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> Alaska now has a Road to Nowhere going to what would have been the Bridge to Nowhere.
> 
> Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's transportation department has completed a $25 million gravel road leading to the site of a bridge that Palin, as John McCain's vice presidential candidate, now boasts that she stopped, so as to save taxpayers money. The road was built with federal tax dollars.
> 
> ...



Srsly, WHAT pork contractor bills $25m for 3.2 miles of gravel road? Am I missing something here? HTF does a crappy gravel road cost that much?


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## Live Steam (Feb 4, 2004)

But he did vote for the bridge


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## QuiQuaeQuod (Jan 24, 2003)

Room 1201 said:


> Srsly, WHAT pork contractor bills $25m for 3.2 miles of gravel road? Am I missing something here? HTF does a crappy gravel road cost that much?


Maybe one of Palin's grade school friends owns a construction company?


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## BenWA (Aug 11, 2004)

Campag12 said:


> If I infer correctly, both sides of the road are pristine wilderness. Wouldn't that add significantly to quality of life for Alaska residents? You can now hunt for your own food during winter food shortage. My dad's friend used to live in a small town Alaska (don't remember name) and he had to order "food" on the web cause it's so damn expensive and inconvenient to obtain in Alaska.


Who needs a gravel road for hunting when you can just shoot animals from an airplane?


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## ampastoral (Oct 3, 2005)

Live Steam said:


> But he did vote for the bridge


is he continually asserting that he voted against it? i think he should...it seems to be working for her...."if i say it enough, it has to be true......right?"


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## BenWA (Aug 11, 2004)

Room 1201 said:


> Srsly, WHAT pork contractor bills $25m for 3.2 miles of gravel road? Am I missing something here? HTF does a crappy gravel road cost that much?


$25m for 3.2 miles of gravel road is not all that unreasonable, particularly in a relatively remote region. Weyerhauser and other timber companies routinely pay anywhere from $50,000-$100,000 per mile of logging road here in WA, depending on the terrain involved. Oh wait, that was $25 MILLION.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

BenWA said:


> $25m for 3.2 miles of gravel road is not all that unreasonable, particularly in a relatively remote region. Weyerhauser and other timber companies routinely pay anywhere from $50,000-$100,000 per mile of logging road here in WA, depending on the terrain involved. Oh wait, that was $25 MILLION.




Apparently, they are still wanting to build the bridges as the $25m gravel road is worthless without them


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## rufus (Feb 3, 2004)

What they need is some condo developer to come in and start building subdivisions along that road, Someone could make a fortune, especially if Sarah sells him the land dirt cheap.


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## JoeDaddio (Sep 3, 2005)

rufus said:


> What they need is some condo developer to come in and start building subdivisions along that road, Someone could make a fortune, especially if Sarah sells him the land dirt cheap.


Right? And name the community "Nowhere." Bingo!


joe


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## Campag12 (Jul 31, 2008)

if it's cheap enough, I wouldn't mind living there. 



JoeDaddio said:


> Right? And name the community "Nowhere." Bingo!
> 
> 
> joe


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

Campag12 said:


> if it's cheap enough, I wouldn't mind living there.



Sorry, pristine environment, near roads, very close to the coast, on an island, in/near forests.....mucho pricey.



Close to an airport...that should knock a little of the value off....


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

A) Maybe the road is made from gold gravel
B) Maybe Palin's hubby wanted a 3.2 mile snowmobile path, for the winter.

It would be interesting to see who got this 25 million......Very interesting.

Once you start planning a road, it is impossible to cancel it (once you've got the money)

How about a refund?


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Live Steam said:


> But he did vote for the bridge


And McCain was not present for the votes. He never really fought against the bridge funding. 

/ I think the bridge to nowhere should be built. 


From Factcheck.org
_
Summary
Republican presidential candidate John McCain cites three absurd-sounding examples of pork-barrel spending in a recent ad: a "bridge to nowhere," a study of the DNA of bears and a Woodstock museum.

McCain is known for fighting against earmarks, the other term lawmakers use for funding of pet projects back home. But he appears to have chosen these three because they're easy to mock, not because he had significant involvement in removing them from the budget.

* He never specifically went after the "bridge to nowhere," and he was absent for key votes on its funding.
* While he tried to cut money for several other projects in the same bill, he never proposed cutting the bear study and voted for the final bill containing it.
* He wasn't present for the most important votes on the Woodstock museum, including one on an amendment he co-sponsored to kill the earmark and divert some of the funds.
_


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## Andy69 (Jun 14, 2008)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> Alaska now has a Road to Nowhere going to what would have been the Bridge to Nowhere.
> 
> Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's transportation department has completed a $25 million gravel road leading to the site of a bridge that Palin, as John McCain's vice presidential candidate, now boasts that she stopped, so as to save taxpayers money. The road was built with federal tax dollars.
> 
> ...


Try googling Robert Byrd, if you want to talk about pork


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Try googling Robert Byrd, if you want to talk about pork

Did he ever have the guts to try to run for national office??????


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## Andy69 (Jun 14, 2008)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> Try googling Robert Byrd, if you want to talk about pork
> 
> Did he ever have the guts to try to run for national office??????


Uh, he was a U.S. Senator, that's not a national office? In any case, what the hell difference does it make?

The Titanic is going down, and you guys are fighting over the arrangement of the deck chairs. It would almost be funny if it weren't so pathetic.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

If you look at a map (thank you google) it looks as if the bridge was to connect Ketchikan to gravinas Island in order to give better access to it from the town. I would assume that there is currently a ferry serving that purpose and it would therefore seem they might actually have a need for a road. Construction costs may be similar to south Louisiana where they have to excavate and then drive pilings to support the structure which might explain the high cost of the priject.


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## thatsmybush (Mar 12, 2002)

It sounds like a pretty nice out and back 10k...at least until you get eaten by a Grizzly Bear.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

thatsmybush said:


> It sounds like a pretty nice out and back 10k...at least until you get eaten by a Grizzly Bear.


Always run with a slower friend when in bear country.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

He did a great job of pulling in the cash for West Virginia.
If he ran for an office that depended on votes from people from other states (National Office), he would have been crucified for his money grubbing ways......(not counting his early membership in the Klan. This sort of thing doesn't cost you votes in his home state)


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

I think that there were 50 people in that town..........

It would have been cheaper to buy the town a Helicopter and paid for a pilot to live there.

50 people......What a joke.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*50 people*



MR_GRUMPY said:


> I think that there were 50 people in that town..........
> 
> It would have been cheaper to buy the town a Helicopter and paid for a pilot to live there.
> 
> 50 people......What a joke.


that's half a million per capita

or $8 million a mile

for gravel

Palin....thanks,but no thanks


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Palin should serve time for this.


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## rufus (Feb 3, 2004)

Andy69 said:


> Try googling Robert Byrd, if you want to talk about pork


To be fair, I don't think Robert Byrd is out there proclaiming himself the earmark killer.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> I think that there were 50 people in that town..........
> 
> It would have been cheaper to buy the town a Helicopter and paid for a pilot to live there.
> 
> 50 people......What a joke.


Ketchikan is somewhat larger than that and the road appears to connect the city to the airport which serves the city.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Palin repeatedly tells campaign crowds she said "thanks but no thanks" to Washington when it came up with $400 million for a bridge linking Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport. In fact, she turned against the bridge only after it became a national symbol of wasteful spending and Washington had backed off financing the project.


Ketchikan was fine without the road. The road was to connect Ketchikan to a bridge to an island with a town of 50 people that had an airport.
That's more than $8 million per person.......


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> Palin repeatedly tells campaign crowds she said "thanks but no thanks" to Washington when it came up with $400 million for a bridge linking Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport. In fact, she turned against the bridge only after it became a national symbol of wasteful spending and Washington had backed off financing the project.
> 
> 
> Ketchikan was fine without the road. The road was to connect Ketchikan to a bridge to an island with a town of 50 people that had an airport.
> That's more than $8 million per person.......


Now I'm not an Alaska native so I'm guessing from looking at the map of the area but it appears to be a large airport, it's labled an international airport. There is probably a lot of traffic coming in from hunters and tourists, maybe even some business interests outside those catagories. There doesn't appear to be another airport nearby so I would think it serves the city of Ketchikan and I have no idea what other road may have served their needs. This could well be justified, even without the bridge, if the road connects to the ferry landing and the traffic is high or even moderate. It would be a regional system and even the relatively low population of Ketchican, by lower 48 standards, may not reflect the total population serviced by the airport.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

An international, or even a regional airport on an Island where the only people to run it come from a town of 50??????
I hardly think so.....

Why would there be a large airport on a island that needs a 400 million dollar bridge to connect to the mainland.
Sounds pretty fishy to me................................


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

\


MR_GRUMPY said:


> An international, or even a regional airport on an Island where the only people to run it come from a town of 50??????
> I hardly think so.....
> 
> Why would there be a large airport on a island that needs a 400 million dollar bridge to connect to the mainland.
> Sounds pretty fishy to me................................


Probably does have something to do with fishing. here, look at the map.

http://maps.google.com/

I'm sorry, you;ll have to type in ketchikan ak


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## JoeDaddio (Sep 3, 2005)

rufus said:


> To be fair, I don't think Robert Byrd is out there proclaiming himself the earmark killer.



Funny how that point escapes so many people.

Also: not all earmarks are created equal. I'm not making that remark in defense of Byrd, just in defense of the purpose of earmarks.


joe


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

rufus said:


> To be fair, I don't think Robert Byrd is out there proclaiming himself the earmark killer.


Right. He's not lying to the American people about his support for the earmark.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Snakebit said:


> Now I'm not an Alaska native so I'm guessing from looking at the map of the area but it appears to be a large airport, it's labled an international airport. There is probably a lot of traffic coming in from hunters and tourists, maybe even some business interests outside those catagories. There doesn't appear to be another airport nearby so I would think it serves the city of Ketchikan and I have no idea what other road may have served their needs. This could well be justified, even without the bridge, if the road connects to the ferry landing and the traffic is high or even moderate. It would be a regional system and even the relatively low population of Ketchican, by lower 48 standards, may not reflect the total population serviced by the airport.


I don't mind if they build the road or the bridge. I'm all for earmarks. I think they are a way for small communities to get infrastructure that they might not otherwise be able to afford. 

What I don't like is the outrageous price of this dirt road. What I also don't like is Palin lying about her being the earmark queen of the north. If you're gonna ask for earmarks, fine. She's turned around and is waving her finger at everybody else like a reformed drunk.


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## bahueh (May 11, 2004)

*I can tell you've never been to Alaska...*



Campag12 said:


> If I infer correctly, both sides of the road are pristine wilderness. Wouldn't that add significantly to quality of life for Alaska residents? You can now hunt for your own food during winter food shortage. My dad's friend used to live in a small town Alaska (don't remember name) and he had to order "food" on the web cause it's so damn expensive and inconvenient to obtain in Alaska.


it is somewhat more expensive...not too much worse than the lower 48.
I was there about 3 weeks ago...but I didn't witness a shortage of grocery stores anywhere..
those who live in/around the bush choose so and know the logistics of that decision...
but generally those folks aren't hooked up to the "web" and don't have addresses...


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

il sogno said:


> I don't mind if they build the road or the bridge. I'm all for earmarks. I think they are a way for small communities to get infrastructure that they might not otherwise be able to afford.
> 
> What I don't like is the outrageous price of this dirt road. What I also don't like is Palin lying about her being the earmark queen of the north. If you're gonna ask for earmarks, fine. She's turned around and is waving her finger at everybody else like a reformed drunk.


If you look at the map it appears to be a bit more than just a dirt road to a ferry dock, it appears to be the main artery across the town of Ketchikan. The cost may sound outrageous in the lower 48 and may indeed be outrageous up there as well, but it is also true that high labor and material costs in the outback and actual engineering problems may make it within reason. We've already had this hypocracy argument with Obama as the center piece and I thought you guys said it's just politics and besides, everybody is doing it?


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

The friggin' town (Ketchican, that is) has a population of 7370. When you figure in $400 million, that's over $54,000 per person............Screw that.
Alaska has lots of money, why don't they build the bridge themselves????????????


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> The friggin' town (Ketchican, that is) has a population of 7370. When you figure in $400 million, that's over $54,000 per person............Screw that.
> Alaska has lots of money, why don't they build the bridge themselves????????????


I thought this was about 25 million for a road, they didn't build the bridge. this is a regional project, it serves a huge region, not just the population of Ketchikan. I grew up in a town of about 20,000 but it was the shopping and shipping hub for a huge region, as is Ketchikan and this airport.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

The built the friggin' road, they just stole the $400 million.

How many people live in the 'burbs of that "city".......Ha.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> The built the friggin' road, they just stole the $400 million.
> 
> How many people live in the 'burbs of that "city".......Ha.


You're just grumpy. Get over it.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Since you like helping "the little guy" out, maybe we can earmark that same $54,275 per person to build something useful for the people of Chicago and the near 'burbs. Since the popluation of the area is 5.3 million, we should be well able to build a bridge over Lake Michigan with the 2.86 Trillion alloted. ($54,275 X 5.3 million people)


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## Turtleherder (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> Ketchikan is somewhat larger than that and the road appears to connect the city to the airport which serves the city.



That's not right. The City of Ketchikan is seperated by a 1/4 mile wide strait, as in water, from the airport which is on Gravina island. The gravel road in question is on the island with the airport, where 50 people live. Here's a cut and paste quote:

GRAVINA ISLAND, ALASKA -- The 3.2-mile-long partially paved "road to nowhere" meanders from a small international airport on Gravina Island, home to 50 people, ending in a cul-de-sac close to a beach.

How about a picture from last April of the not yet completed road?


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Maybe it's so expensive because they covered the ground with pork, before grading the gravel.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Snakebit said:


> If you look at the map it appears to be a bit more than just a dirt road to a ferry dock, it appears to be the main artery across the town of Ketchikan. The cost may sound outrageous in the lower 48 and may indeed be outrageous up there as well, but it is also true that high labor and material costs in the outback and actual engineering problems may make it within reason. We've already had this hypocracy argument with Obama as the center piece and I thought you guys said it's just politics and besides, everybody is doing it?


Snake, this is not on that map. My understanding of this road is that it goes south from the airport and would have connected to Ketchikan via Pennock island. 

It's not the main artery through Ketchikan.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

Turtleherder said:


> That's not right. The City of Ketchikan is seperated by a 1/4 mile wide strait, as in water, from the airport which is on Gravina island. The gravel road in question is on the island with the airport, where 50 people live. Here's a cut and paste quote:
> 
> GRAVINA ISLAND, ALASKA -- The 3.2-mile-long partially paved "road to nowhere" meanders from a small international airport on Gravina Island, home to 50 people, ending in a cul-de-sac close to a beach.
> 
> How about a picture from last April of the not yet completed road?


Of course it's separated by a straight, as in water, why else would they have needed or wanted a bridge? It is still the regional airport with the rather grandios tag of international airport. How much traffic does it handle and from where. How do the poeple reach the mainland after they land and deplane? Ferry or chopper? What ar3e the future plans and the stateed reason for the road? Bridge ain't dead yet? How about a link to the article so we can look at the overall information about the project? Not that I don't trust you.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Here's a map of the Road to Nowhere. This is from the Los Angeles Times.




.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Bridge ain't dead yet?

They already "stole" the money for the bridge. Are they going to want more?
For $400 million, couldn't we just kill everybody in that town. Then they wouldn't need an airport.........(How much didn't the friggin' airport cost, and who paid for it???????)


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

il sogno said:


> Here's a map of the Road to Nowhere. This is from the Los Angeles Times.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This from wiki with some numbers.

"According to the Alaska Department of Transportation & Public Facilities, the project's goal was to "provide better service to the airport and allow for development of large tracts of land on the island".[3]

A ferry runs to the island every 30 minutes during most of the year, except during the May–September peak tourist season, when it runs every 15 minutes. It charges $5 per adult, with free same-day return, and $6 per automobile each way (as of 2008[update]).[4]

According to USA Today, the bridge was to have been nearly as long as the Golden Gate Bridge and taller than the Brooklyn Bridge.[5] The bridge would cross the Tongass Narrows, part of Alaska's Inside Passage, so the bridge was designed to be tall enough to accommodate ship traffic, including the Alaska Marine Highway and the cruise ships which frequent Alaskan waters during the summer.

Ketchikan's airport is the second largest in Southeast Alaska, after Juneau International Airport, handling over 200,000 passengers a year, while the ferry shuttled 350,000 people in the same time period (as of December 2006[update]).[6] In comparison, the Golden Gate Bridge carried more than 43,000,000 vehicles in 2006, or about 118,000 vehicles each day.[7]"

From your map it would seem the road was to connect the airport to the proposed bridge and I just missed my guess. The only road shown on the google map was the main road in Ketchikan to the ferry landing. The question is when did they start this road in relation to canceling the bridge project and how far along were they when it was canceled. Maybe it was way deep into it and just maybe the bridge ain't as dead as it seems. It would also seem that it may serve a few more than 50 people during the year.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

$54,000 would buy lots of ferry trips.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Snakebit said:


> From your map it would seem the road was to connect the airport to the proposed bridge and I just missed my guess. The only road shown on the google map was the main road in Ketchikan to the ferry landing. The question is when did they start this road in relation to canceling the bridge project and how far along were they when it was canceled. Maybe it was way deep into it and just maybe the bridge ain't as dead as it seems. It would also seem that it may serve a few more than 50 people during the year.


Palin coulda canceled it but didn't. And now she's railing against politicians wasting taxpayer money. She's a hypocrite.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

MR_GRUMPY said:


> Since you like helping "the little guy" out, maybe we can earmark that same $54,275 per person to build something useful for the people of Chicago and the near 'burbs. Since the popluation of the area is 5.3 million, we should be well able to build a bridge over Lake Michigan with the 2.86 Trillion alloted. ($54,275 X 5.3 million people)


These numbers better reflect the people served by the bridge/road/ferry:

"Ketchikan's airport is the second largest in Southeast Alaska, after Juneau International Airport, handling over 200,000 passengers a year, while the ferry shuttled 350,000 people in the same time period (as of December 2006[update]).[6] In comparison, the Golden Gate Bridge carried more than 43,000,000 vehicles in 2006, or about 118,000 vehicles each day.[7]"

How many people per day did the Golden Gate carry the year it was built?


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## Turtleherder (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> Of course it's separated by a straight, as in water, why else would they have needed or wanted a bridge? It is still the regional airport with the rather grandios tag of international airport. How much traffic does it handle and from where. How do the poeple reach the mainland after they land and deplane? Ferry or chopper? What ar3e the future plans and the stateed reason for the road? Bridge ain't dead yet? How about a link to the article so we can look at the overall information about the project? Not that I don't trust you.


Here's the link

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-na-bridge19-2008sep19,0,5316609.story

Thanks Snake for always defending the indefensible. Hell, even the Mayor of Ketchikan didn't want it.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

Turtleherder said:


> Here's the link
> 
> http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-na-bridge19-2008sep19,0,5316609.story
> 
> Thanks Snake for always defending the indefensible. Hell, even the Mayor of Ketchikan didn't want it.


What does this part mean? 

"........."bridge to nowhere." Alaskan officials thought federal money would pay for the bridge, but Gov. Sarah Palin killed the project after it was ridiculed and Congress rescinded the money. Plans for the road moved forward anyway."


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Forget the bridge. can we scam 2.86 Trillion for new expressways, that will be used by millions of drivers............Better yet, how about bike expressways, so I can ride to work.


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## Turtleherder (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> What does this part mean?
> 
> "........."bridge to nowhere." Alaskan officials thought federal money would pay for the bridge, but Gov. Sarah Palin killed the project after it was ridiculed and Congress rescinded the money. Plans for the road moved forward anyway."



It means Palin "killed" the bridge after congress pulled the money, but she built the road anyway with the money that was left. Big grand gesture there, stopping a project that someone else already stopped. But what the hell, don't give the money back, build the road to it anyway. 

And to be fair I thought about what the regional need for the airport was so I looked up the stats. You are going to have to trust me on this I don't have the link. For 2007 the airport at Ketchikan enplaned 222,249 people. I thought that was a fairly large number till I looked up some other numbers. The "international" airport in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, for 2007, enplaned 531,256 people.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

Where did all these 222,000 people go, in a town of 7,000????????

Is the town all Hookers and Casino's?????????


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

Turtleherder said:


> It means Palin "killed" the bridge after congress pulled the money, but she built the road anyway with the money that was left. Big grand gesture there, stopping a project that someone else already stopped. But what the hell, don't give the money back, build the road to it anyway.
> 
> And to be fair I thought about what the regional need for the airport was so I looked up the stats. You are going to have to trust me on this I don't have the link. For 2007 the airport at Ketchikan enplaned 222,249 people. I thought that was a fairly large number till I looked up some other numbers. The "international" airport in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, for 2007, enplaned 531,256 people.


The airport handled 200,000 but the ferry carried an additional 150,000 passengers. If congress rescinded the money, why do we keep hearing about the $400,000.00 boondoggle? also, if it was rescinded, where did the money for the road come from?

After those folks in Ceder Rapids deplaned, how far did they have to swim to get to town? Numbers aside, the airport in Ketchikan is an important part of the regional economy and without it, the region would suffer. I don't know how I feel about that bridge, it isn't the first of it's kind. When I was in Louisiana in the late 60's, there was a bridge to nowhere that crossed the Mississippi, big sucker that was built by the Governor purportedly to get home without taking the ferry. I think the hiway construction caught up with it though and it's actually functional today as was always intended. I think a great deal of political BS is taking place about this particular project that is neither fair or entirely true. That does happen. All I have heard so far is the critics, I'd like to hear the other side of the story before I make a judgement on it.


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## Turtleherder (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> The airport handled 200,000 but the ferry carried an additional 150,000 passengers. If congress rescinded the money, why do we keep hearing about the $400,000.00 boondoggle? also, if it was rescinded, where did the money for the road come from?
> 
> After those folks in Ceder Rapids deplaned, how far did they have to swim to get to town? Numbers aside, the airport in Ketchikan is an important part of the regional economy and without it, the region would suffer. I don't know how I feel about that bridge, it isn't the first of it's kind. When I was in Louisiana in the late 60's, there was a bridge to nowhere that crossed the Mississippi, big sucker that was built by the Governor purportedly to get home without taking the ferry. I think the hiway construction caught up with it though and it's actually functional today as was always intended. I think a great deal of political BS is taking place about this particular project that is neither fair or entirely true. That does happen. All I have heard so far is the critics, I'd like to hear the other side of the story before I make a judgement on it.



Again, the road does not go to the pickup point for the ferry. The road is of no use at this time. The larger question is why are the tax payers of the other 49 states paying for a road or bridge to serve an area that already has service by the ferry? And the even larger question is why is Palin flat out lying about her role in the bridge project and why is she trying to portray herself as against earmarks when she had a useless road built on our dime?


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## rufus (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> just maybe the bridge ain't as dead as it seems.


It has to be. Queen Sarah says she killed it. 

Is she lying?


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

Turtleherder said:


> Again, the road does not go to the pickup point for the ferry. The road is of no use at this time. The larger question is why are the tax payers of the other 49 states paying for a road or bridge to serve an area that already has service by the ferry? And the even larger question is why is Palin flat out lying about her role in the bridge project and why is she trying to portray herself as against earmarks when she had a useless road built on our dime?


There are a number of distortions about the bridge thing, one of which is how much money was allocated and used. Unless I misunderstand the term rescinded, Congress canceled that contract and allotment. Still, it's one of the things that has made Grumpy so grumpy, that "stolen' 400M that it would seem are not stolen at all. Maybe the funds for the road were not from that allocation either, maybe the State was building the road in anticipation of the bridge and finished it. Maybe it wasn't your dime. Does your State receive any federal money for Highway construction and repair?


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

After further review, thanks wiki, it seems that the funds were allocated to alaska and the stipulation that they be directed to the bridge was removed. That would seem to mean that the dough was theirs to spend unless there is some long standing rule that all funds with no real reason are refunded to the fed, in which case, who do dat? Sarah spent 'em like a good little belly dancer would. I have no idea why she built that road but I never have understood how women think anyhow. Probably made perfect sense to her and that's good enough for me.


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## Turtleherder (Feb 3, 2004)

Snakebit said:


> After further review, thanks wiki, it seems that the funds were allocated to alaska and the stipulation that they be directed to the bridge was removed. That would seem to mean that the dough was theirs to spend unless there is some long standing rule that all funds with no real reason are refunded to the fed, in which case, who do dat? Sarah spent 'em like a good little belly dancer would. I have no idea why she built that road but I never have understood how women think anyhow. Probably made perfect sense to her and that's good enough for me.



Except you don't go shooting your mouth off about "thanks, but no thanks" and then keep the money. And you don't run on a ticket of opposing ear marks and pork spending, least you be called a lying hypocrite.


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## Snakebit (Mar 18, 2002)

Turtleherder said:


> Except you don't go shooting your mouth off about "thanks, but no thanks" and then keep the money. And you don't run on a ticket of opposing ear marks and pork spending, least you be called a lying hypocrite.


You can't use that term in this race, it ihas already been established that it's ok for Obama and that clears the way for all of them. I like Sarah's story better than yours anyway.


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## MR_GRUMPY (Aug 21, 2002)

"why is Palin flat out lying about her role in the bridge project"


Do you even have to ask?

If Palin told Pubs that her crap was butter.....(you know the rest)


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