# Your Diet: Vegan, CTFU, Meat-o-Saurus, Etc...



## PoorInRichfield (Nov 30, 2013)

I'm curious about what all of you eat... especially if you compete. In the past few years, I've been doing considerable research on health and diets and I'm wondering if there's a conflict between eating to be competitive vs eating for general health.

For example, I understand that if you train and race a lot, you'll need a lot of carbs as fuel. However, for the average Joe like me that spends 40+ hours a week sitting at a desk with an office job, a high-carb diet isn't a great idea. Through experimentation, I found that if I eat too many carbs and don't burn them off, my triglyceride levels are very high (not good). Reducing my consumed carbs brought them back down again (although I still crave high carb foods!)

One dietary lifestyle I particularly question is the "CTFU" diet... i.e., Durianrider's "carb the @#$#@ up" diet. While I can understand his reasoning behind eating tons of fruit to you have energy, is that a good diet plan to be competitive or is a vegan or high fat diet better for competition and general health?

The following video, which I find hilarious, mocks Durian Rider's "diet"... I'm adding it here for chuckles...


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## jrider05 (Aug 19, 2015)

I think all of this is interesting and you could probably debate this until we are dead and we still would never get a clear cut answer as to what is best. There is research to prove all of the above is good for you in some way whether its an all meat diet or the complete opposite, the vegan diet. 

Personally I can crave carbs while Im just sitting on the couch in the evening, And I have craved fat and protein in the form of unseasoned chicken breast while on long fondo but fairly intense style rides. Which is the complete opposite compared to the studies and research I come across. 

I believe whether you only exercise at a very moderate but healthy speed or you exercise with excess volume and intensity we can very easily over indulge with Carbs. In other words, carbs are good for fuel whether you go on 1hr low intensity runs or rides or whether you're fueling for 3 hr plus endeavors but no matter which way we exercise we can very easily put too many carbs in the system. And if you favor more low intensity stuff then those too many carbs are going to show faster on the outside in the form of body composition and also internally in the form of what you have experienced. And carbs are addicting as far as im concerned. We need them I believe but we really WANT and NEED THEM sometimes way more than the body actually needs them no matter our intensity levels. 

I think you have to put yourself in a sort of uncomfortable space mentally and physically to adapt yourself to not want or expect a lower level of carberation. Like after an activity when you are home and the hunger sets in, you really have to be on top of how much you are actually consuming in the form of carbs to be aware of not overindulging. 

For me, I have upped the volume and tempo of my weekly ride schedule the past several months. And I have naturally craved more food and combine that with adding more carbs on the actual ride which I wasn't doing in the past I have consumed more carb and calories than before and I have actually gained a few more pounds because of it. I'm ok with this for right now but its an absolute real world scenario I have experienced that I do crave those carbs and without paying attention to the details of how many you are actually ingesting you can very easily over due it. And I think that's what the general public does more times than not and combine that with not doing giving the body " ENDURANCE " work through the weeks of life your external and internal body pays for it by over diluting it with carbs. 

So yeah, back to your initial question, " is there a conflict between eating to be competitive and eating for health, I think it is more about not actually knowing how much we are eating no matter what our effort level is rather than it being any sort of conflict.


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## PoorInRichfield (Nov 30, 2013)

jrider05 said:


> I think all of this is interesting and you could probably debate this until we are dead and we still would never get a clear cut answer as to what is best.


Agreed. I'm not looking to find "the truth" as it certainly varies from person to person. I just wonder if nutrition for being highly competitive might not be the best for one's long term health(?) The more I learn about professional sports in general, the more I'm finding that training to win-at-all-costs might be in conflict with what's actually good for the athlete.

On my own personal health journey, I found that just because I'm not fat doesn't mean I'm healthy internally. I've been a slender cyclist my whole life (currently 45 years old) and it wasn't until I started getting blood tests due to work related health insurance requirements that I discovered I had some health issues largely caused by my dietary lifestyle. High blood sugar was the first thing I became concerned about and have addressed. High triglycerides was the next. I still struggle with blood pressure issues with little success in lowering that no matter what I do. 



jrider05 said:


> I think it is more about not actually knowing how much we are eating no matter what our effort level is rather than it being any sort of conflict.


In the past year, I've cut down radically on how much food I stuff in my pie-hole. Despite being slender, I'd often eat the equivalent of about two meals in one sitting just because I could... because my taste buds just wanted more food even though I was long past being full. I went on a week long fast a few months ago and one thing I learned from that is that I have been a total slave to my taste buds... food is pleasurable and that's primarily why I eat it. After feeling relatively good after a week of no food, I realized that I didn't really need to eat as much as I did to get the same benefits.


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## jrider05 (Aug 19, 2015)

PoorInRichfield said:


> Agreed. I'm not looking to find "the truth" as it certainly varies from person to person. I just wonder if nutrition for being highly competitive might not be the best for one's long term health(?) The more I learn about professional sports in general, the more I'm finding that training to win-at-all-costs might be in conflict with what's actually good for the athlete.


I agree with this as well. Yes, the higher up the latter you get competitively the more you must sacrifice to do so, including eating specific ways that may not be as healthy as just sticking to a moderate exercise and eating lifestyle. Absolutely agree. 



PoorInRichfield said:


> On my own personal health journey, I found that just because I'm not fat doesn't mean I'm healthy internally. I've been a slender cyclist my whole life (currently 45 years old) and it wasn't until I started getting blood tests due to work related health insurance requirements that I discovered I had some health issues largely caused by my dietary lifestyle. High blood sugar was the first thing I became concerned about and have addressed. High triglycerides was the next. I still struggle with blood pressure issues with little success in lowering that no matter what I do.
> 
> 
> In the past year, I've cut down radically on how much food I stuff in my pie-hole. Despite being slender, I'd often eat the equivalent of about two meals in one sitting just because I could... because my taste buds just wanted more food even though I was long past being full. I went on a week long fast a few months ago and one thing I learned from that is that I have been a total slave to my taste buds... food is pleasurable and that's primarily why I eat it. After feeling relatively good after a week of no food, I realized that I didn't really need to eat as much as I did to get the same benefits.


For sure. Slender and unhealthy can be an outcome too. I too get yearly blood work through work and that has allowed me to keep tabs on my levels the past few years. I also have had high triglycerides. 

I also thought about getting more routine blood work done. Have you ever heard of Stan Efferding? I love this guy. Weight lifter - strong man and body builder. With a WEALTH of nutrition knowledge that you can take in no matter what sport you are into. He often touts how for a straight 10 YEARS was getting blood work done MONTHLY to constantly keep track of where he was internally. He also talks about how eating for competition is NOT exactly healthy for standard living. Now, eating for weight lifting is a little different than for cycling or endurance, BUT IS IT?? 

Search up his youtube videos Rhinos Rants, where he talks for about 10 minutes on various nutritional topics while casually walking or driving his vehicle. Easy to absorb his info.

All of this stuff is interesting for me personally at this stage in life, and Im not even close to an exert, I just like acquiring info on a pace I can actually maintain the knowledge of which is probably slower than a lot of other people but I guess all I can say is with certainty is too much of anything isnt good for any of us, carbs or no carbs. The fact that we can have too much water is basically all I need to know that no matter what we can probably always eek out a small amount more of performance gain from something but we will never know for certain that it came from an extra carb, skipping a carb or getting 15 minutes more sleep for 3 weeks straight that allowed us to feel a little better. But it has been fun listing and learning some of this stuff. 

What is your workout lifestyle like? Are you currently worried about your blood sugar levels? 

Basic knowledge says running, walking or riding as much as you can possible do in one session and then within a week at a heart rate level of say 65-75% of your MAX HR along with as minimal carbs as you can handle would get your blood sugar and triglycerides down some. I know there can be more to it than that but this is just a random discussion on the internet with minimal background knowledge.


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## PoorInRichfield (Nov 30, 2013)

jrider05 said:


> What is your workout lifestyle like? Are you currently worried about your blood sugar levels?


I try to ride my bike or do some kind of cardio exercise 3 or more times a week, alternating with upper body works outs (push ups, pull ups, etc.) When I ride my bike, I prefer to go at a good clip for no other reason than I don't feel like I rode my bike unless I went fast ut:

My blood sugar levels years ago got me concerned about Type 2 diabetes... no one wants that. As such, I learned that my diet was not as healthy as I thought it was and have since radically reduced sugar intake and changed my diet for the better (largely thanks to my wife that knows a lot about healthy eating). 

What's got me more interested in health and nutrition are two things:

1. Things seem to be falling apart the older I get... I'd like to slow that process as much as possible.

2. I work in the IT industry (computer programmer) and I really need my brain to stay sharp so I can compete with the young whippersnappers. Granted, I should care about my brain health just for the sake of having a happy brain, but it's really my career choice that has kicked this interest into high gear.

In my research, it seems like sugar (and high amounts of carbs) is the root of many evils. Assuming that to be true, that got me wondering if the traditional "eat a lot of pasta before a big ride" (or CTFU) is a good idea for one's overall health, or is this just a way to carbo-load for a bike ride and health-be-damned. In addition, I just happen to love pasta, so why stop at eating pasta before a big ride when I can eat it all the time!?!?! Hence the high triglycerides


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## Srode (Aug 19, 2012)

I eat high protein low carb in rest weeks and the carbs I do eat are mostly high GI like oats and whole grains etc. I do eat more carbs than normal the night before and the morning of a hard ride/workout. Strategically timed carbs and calories.


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## jrider05 (Aug 19, 2015)

PoorInRichfield said:


> I try to ride my bike or do some kind of cardio exercise 3 or more times a week, alternating with upper body works outs (push ups, pull ups, etc.) When I ride my bike, I prefer to go at a good clip for no other reason than I don't feel like I rode my bike unless I went fast ut:



Well, you and I have a pretty similar lifestyle. 

And a vegan diet can still be pretty high in carbs. 

There are signs and studies and examples of outgoing healthy people living this life as vegans, sans the vegan cyclist. And there are signs and studies and examples of people living this life with more of a mixed bag of eating habits but I think both examples utilize CARBS for energy. 

I agree with the research you have found, sugar and carbs being the root of the necessary food evil. And just like the training philosophy of " train at just the right amount of volume and intensity for you to get an adaptation and dont over do it, we should strive to eat the EXACT amount of CARB intake as not to dilute the body with sugars and carbs and over do it. 

I dont know your life history of exercise but I am also of the belief that the longer you have been active through out your life the more durable your body and mind is at getting away with eating a little more junk but still being able to perform at a good level. Not saying that's the best thing to do but athletes get away with eating pretty bad all the time while still performing well.

In your case, you are showing that sugars and carbs are reeking havoc on you. In that case yeah, why not focus at eliminating some more of that while still trying to maintain your weekly activity schedule. And give yourself some time to adapt to it. You may experience light headedness for a while by stepping down the carb intake but that's the uncomfortable space you may need to be in for a while until your body and mind adapt. And scratch a few sentences earlier, You may even have to back off on activity while you try and adapt to less carbs. 

Try eliminating some carbs, but give some time to adapt. I think thats a problem too, millions of people are changing up lifefstyle choices all the time and then sharing their experiences but never realizing they actually didn't gave it enough time to really see if the body has adapted a certain way and they write it off as not working out and go on to just absorbing too many carbs again. Its almost like our baseline standard of living is muffing down " this amount of carbs " daily. And we will hint and try this or that but never give it enough time to go through the uncomfortable stage and we end up back at carb and sugar baseline which is in essence more carbs than the body needs but we are just adapted to it. And if you work out and do some endurance activities we can get away with having too many carbs than needed and still getting away with it but like youre seeing, this may catch up to you and you see it on blood tests.

You have to suffer Richfield! You have to stare at that big computer screen of yours all day and suffer through the workday by eating nothing but Almonds and seaweed. And while you're a bit lightheaded, start doing those pushups.

On a serious note, my wife is into natural supplements. I don't know specifics but she finds benefits in them. I advocate for them too but I'm still pretty new for knowledge on all of the options available. There may be some things that can help your levels in that realm too.


What a Friday. take care.


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