# Rule on handlebar tape color



## tihsepa

Does anyone care?

I almost always run black or white. Is there any rule? Does it matter? I have heard to match the saddle but........

Thoughts?


----------



## rider9

Use what you want. Why would you "have" to follow someone else's rules?

I think it is a matter of taste. If you are eclectic, then nothing has to match and it can be done very tastefully.

If you like things to match, then do that. I know I am in the minority on this subject.


----------



## tihsepa

I am just wandering is all. Hell, i usually use either black or white. Thats all. Thinking about some 80's throwback splash tape or a dual color like Fizik or something.


----------



## rider9

I am in the process of building up a fixed gear bike and bought "natural" cork tape. My saddle is a light brown, so I did match them, sort of.

I bought a chrome stem, headset and handlebars are natural aluminum. The seat post is black. The rims and spokes are black. The crankset I bought has both black and natural aluminum.

Some people would shudder at my bike, but then it's my bike...

I was looking at the steel bike pictures last night and there was one bike that had black tape with red showing through the holes in the black. It looked really cool. The thread is located in the Frames section.


----------



## tuffguy1500

Bar tape shall match the saddle. Any other combo is also fine, since it's your bike. of the five bikes I own, all but one followed that rule, and it pained me deep inside.


----------



## locustfist

generally...who cares.

But as a designer for most applications it works well when the saddle and bars match or compliment each other.


----------



## terry b

These are the rules as I understand them:


Always black, but sometimes white or brown or blue. It takes a special bike to warrant blue however. White can go on some bikes but with the understanding that it will soon look like hell. Brown only on retro (leather) or an off-white bike.

Yellow or green (unless it's celeste on a Bianchi) are not allowed under any circumstances. 

Orange if >50% of the bike is orange.

Red if >95% of the bike is white and it has some red trim. If red, then only Fizik brick red is allowed.


----------



## terry b

tihsepa said:


> Got it. :thumbsup:


I just changed it. I had to go outside and see what I had done in order to not be a hypocrite.


----------



## Pitts Pilot

Here is the rule:

Handlebar tape shall be black.

(You can use other colors, but it won't look as good.)


----------



## tihsepa

terry b said:


> These are the rules as I understand them:
> 
> Always black, but sometimes white or brown or blue. It takes a special bike to warrant blue or brown however. White can go on some bikes but with the understanding that it will soon look like hell.
> 
> Red, yellow and green (unless it's celeste on a Bianchi) are not allowed under any circumstances.
> 
> Orange if >50% of the bike is orange.


Got it. :thumbsup:


----------



## 55x11

tihsepa said:


> Does anyone care?
> 
> I almost always run black or white. Is there any rule? Does it matter? I have heard to match the saddle but........
> 
> Thoughts?


I can't believe nobody brought up RULE #8:

Velominati

Rule #8 // Saddles, bars, and tires shall be carefully matched.
Valid options are:

Match the saddle to the bars and the tires to black; or
Match the bars to the color of the frame at the top of the head tube and the saddle to the color of the frame at the top of the seat tube and the tires to the color where they come closest to the frame; or
Match the saddle and the bars to the frame decals; or
Black, black, black


----------



## tihsepa

55x11 said:


> I can't believe nobody brought up RULE #8:
> 
> Velominati
> 
> Rule #8 // Saddles, bars, and tires shall be carefully matched.
> Valid options are:
> 
> Match the saddle to the bars and the tires to black; or
> Match the bars to the color of the frame at the top of the head tube and the saddle to the color of the frame at the top of the seat tube and the tires to the color where they come closest to the frame; or
> Match the saddle and the bars to the frame decals; or
> Black, black, black


There you have it then. 

Black it is. Or maybe white. :idea:


----------



## chemical_brother

Minty green fizik tape on drops, white saddle, white/chrome accented frameset. And a yellow Giant decal. Think a blue saddle is in order.

If you don't like the colors, don't look down!


----------



## DonDenver

Rule?! Express yourself.


----------



## Special Eyes

It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....


----------



## SlurpeeKing

I want to go camo for my next bar tape


----------



## cpark

tihsepa said:


> Does anyone care?
> 
> I almost always run black or white. Is there any rule? Does it matter? I have heard to match the saddle but........
> 
> Thoughts?


 Nope, I don't think anyone cares..


----------



## DonDenver

Special Eyes said:


>


I just hope the fine posing done for the picture is not lost by by some of the viewers. Great shot. Oh, and ride that yellow tape till it fades away...


----------



## scblack

DonDenver said:


> I just hope the fine posing done for the picture is not lost by by some of the viewers. Great shot. Oh, and ride that yellow tape till it fades away...


Very very nice looking bike.

Except:
Bikes are normally taken from the drivetrain side.
Chain is normally shown on the big chainring - (shows how soft you are riding in the little ring).
Straighten the front wheel, if the bars are turned it looks off.

These are hardly a rule, but I reckon bikes look better if photographed that way.


And to Special Eyes: I just maybe (maybe) think a red bar tape could go well on that bike. Set the red tape off with the red highlights on the seat. A nice gloss red tape. Just a thought.


----------



## Special Eyes

Thanks, guys.

I don't want to hijack this thread and make it about MY bike, but I'll reply to your comments. I am a serious photographer (see my site), but made this with a point & shoot. It is one in a series of the bike from all sides. I just quickly grabbed this one to post here because it showed the bartape better. True, drive side images do show more stuff, but I didn't know the rule!! I'm looking at another seat for it with no red parts to keep the bike yellow/black. The Zipp decals have been removed since. I am not a 'fashion before function' person, but with this bike you can't avoid the fashion statement. I live on a hill, so when I get home, it's in the small chainring. I don't think that really matters. If I was doing a studio shoot, it would be all about details, and then I'd be spending hours on it. I'd rather be riding on it for hours.

see:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/specialized/new-bumble-bee-build-271756.html


----------



## Marc

terry b said:


> These are the rules as I understand them:
> 
> 
> Always black, but sometimes white or brown or blue. It takes a special bike to warrant blue however. White can go on some bikes but with the understanding that it will soon look like hell. Brown only on retro (leather) or an off-white bike.
> 
> Yellow or green (unless it's celeste on a Bianchi) are not allowed under any circumstances.
> 
> Orange if >50% of the bike is orange.
> 
> Red if >95% of the bike is white and it has some red trim. If red, then only Fizik brick red is allowed.



So when is honey-colored Brooks allowed?


----------



## Oxtox

contemplating splash bar tape...? just say NO.

Splash Horror


----------



## GrayBlack

Get whatever color you think will look good on your bike. I don't think the bar tape police will come after you.


----------



## velodog

As long as the saddle's black and black shorts are being worn to match the saddle, I don't think it matters what the color of the handlebar tape is.


----------



## Ventruck

I went from black, to dark silver, to bright silver, to white...then I said **** it and went black again. It's kinda hard to go wrong with black.

Some other colors will look hawt on occasion, but they wear out on the eyes sooner or later. Black doesn't really do that imo. I sometimes tell myself "_____ would look pretty cool, but black tape doesn't necessarily look bad at all" and leave it at that.


----------



## nismo73

Is this like matching your shoes with your belt?


----------



## old_fuji

Meh...IDGAF. My first old road bike was blue Fuji, that I found some nice Bontrager tape that closely matched the paintjob. The second bike I bought was a red-and-gold Corsaro...The paint was a really cool kinda candy-apple metalflake paintjob, that the bright red bar tape I bought clashed horridly with. My current whip is a British Racing Green Nashbar frame, with mostly black components, so the white bar tape really looks nice with the black-and-white saddle I have.


----------



## maxfrm

Pick any color you like, if you want a change from the normal classic colors of black & white then just do it. You can always change it back. Just enjoy what you purchase and use it.


----------



## carlislegeorge

nismo73 said:


> Is this like matching your shoes with your belt?


...nope, more like socks to pants...


----------



## Bullvine

Special Eyes said:


> It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....


Amazing 
How come it dosn't fall over?


----------



## sadisticnoob

i'm running red tape


----------



## OldZaskar

Special Eyes said:


> It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....


When return the borrowed seat, will you use a yellow one? 

(cool "balance" shot)


----------



## mfuchs

carlislegeorge said:


> ...nope, more like socks to pants...


carpet and drapes?


----------



## Retro Grouch

mfuchs said:


> carpet and drapes?


If that's the case, does anyone make cruly dark brown with hints of grey handlebar tape?


----------



## Touch0Gray

Special Eyes said:


> Thanks, guys.
> 
> I don't want to hijack this thread and make it about MY bike, but I'll reply to your comments. I am a serious photographer (see my site), but made this with a point & shoot. It is one in a series of the bike from all sides. I just quickly grabbed this one to post here because it showed the bartape better. True, drive side images do show more stuff, but I didn't know the rule!! I'm looking at another seat for it with no red parts to keep the bike yellow/black. The Zipp decals have been removed since. I am not a 'fashion before function' person, but with this bike you can't avoid the fashion statement. I live on a hill, so when I get home, it's in the small chainring. I don't think that really matters. If I was doing a studio shoot, it would be all about details, and then I'd be spending hours on it. I'd rather be riding on it for hours.
> 
> see:
> https://forums.roadbikereview.com/specialized/new-bumble-bee-build-271756.html


Copy cat..... lol MY BUMBLEBEE!

.

















https://forums.roadbikereview.com/lounge/i-would-like-present-you-269450.html


all but one of my bikes has black tape because my work just pounds a dark polish into my hands and any other color gets gross immediately


----------



## EHietpas

I have been debating this as well. I'm thinking something kind of LOUD in color so that when biking either Duathlon's or Triathlons your bike is easier to pick out on the rack. :23:


----------



## glockaxis

Special Eyes said:


> It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....


Beautiful! I'd keep the yellow on till it looks used and worn then rotate it with black just for a change.


----------



## CheapTrek

tihsepa said:


> Does anyone care?
> 
> I almost always run black or white. Is there any rule? Does it matter? I have heard to match the saddle but........
> 
> Thoughts?


I absolutely refuse to wrap my bars in anything other than black until someone markets Formica Boomerang tape.










Cheers.


----------



## LavenderLightning

I had the original white leather tape on my Technium for 8 years, along with a white saddle. As they both got worn out, I switched to a more comfy black saddle. The yellow and black splash tape was actually supposed to be a gag gift for my friend who has a bright yellow bike. I thought it would look cool on mine, so there ya go. Yeah it may clash with the lavender and mauve frame, but I like it. Besides, it does kind of match the saddle and even the cable housing haha


----------



## Special Eyes

NIce bike, Touch0Gray! You have the right idea of just the two colors.

I used a thin wood dowel rod to prop the bike in that position and then cloned out the rod in photoshop. No smoke and mirrors!


----------



## qatarbhoy

Touch0Gray said:


> Copy cat..... lol MY BUMBLEBEE!


There can be only one...



EHietpas said:


> I have been debating this as well. I'm thinking something kind of LOUD in color so that when biking either Duathlon's or Triathlons your bike is easier to pick out on the rack. :23:


Just another reason why one should avoid duathlons and triathlons.

I agree with an earlier poster that Splash tape is an abomination. However, I'm happy to see other people misguidedly use horrible bar tapes, because it makes my bicycle look even better by comparison. :thumbsup:


----------



## Special Eyes

qatarbhoy said:


> There can be only one...


But, alas, there are two here! Probably more out there.


----------



## Touch0Gray

Special Eyes said:


> But, alas, there are two here! Probably more out there.


I must insist that you paint your bike I was FIRST....lol

Btw I like your bike....except for that yellow tape!

I am going to order yellow hemp to finish the ends one of these days on mine.....just because. The black hemp is so boring!


----------



## DonDenver

Special Eyes said:


> Thanks, guys.
> 
> . The Zipp decals have been removed since. ]


SE, ^that^ is one strong and confident move. Impressive sir.


----------



## Polyhedron

I've got a Jamis in Blue and White. Thinking of changing the bars to the Zipp VukaSprint with just a little tape from the brake levers down. Match the Blue?


----------



## Mr. Versatile

Special Eyes, I gotta say that's one hell of *great* looking bike. Just 1 suggestion...keep the yellow tape.


----------



## Kupkake

pretty big white fan, I'll change it to keep it clean..

Tho I do have a black saddle in the mail


----------



## scblack

tuffguy1500 said:


> Bar tape shall match the saddle. Any other combo is also fine, since it's your bike. of the five bikes I own, all but one followed that rule, and it pained me deep inside.


Here's another combo - bar tape matches front end frame paint colour. This looks great I think:


----------



## icecom

I have a white and it gets dirty quickly.


----------



## ClancyO

I had 'splash' tape (white, gray, black) on my old aluminum lightspeed and it looked great. The 'factory' tape was a zebra-strip:


----------



## qatarbhoy

ClancyO said:


> I had 'splash' tape (white, gray, black) on my old aluminum lightspeed and *I thought* it looked great. The 'factory' tape was a zebra-strip:


FIFY. :thumbsup:


----------



## DIRT BOY

DonDenver said:


> I just hope the fine posing done for the picture is not lost by by some of the viewers. Great shot. Oh, and ride that yellow tape till it fades away...


saddle does not match.


----------



## Special Eyes

DIRT BOY said:


> saddle does not match.


Oh, but it will soon!


----------



## rubbersoul

glockaxis said:


> beautiful! I'd keep the yellow on till it looks used and worn then rotate it with black just for a change.


poseur


----------



## xxl

I only have one rule about bar tape: the right side color must match the left side color.


----------



## xrayjay

I heard clear tape is coming on strong this year.


----------



## Special Eyes

rubbersoul said:


> poseur


I love it when you speak to me in French....Oooh la la.


----------



## reidcc

I have stock white tape on my bars and it matches my seat... however- I don't see the white staying white for very long before it starts looking real old and dirty. I was thinking Black Bar Tape. I see there is now a bright green tape to match my green- but me thinks that would be too loud!!!

Chris


----------



## socal-k

Should match the seat- change the seat


----------



## vagabondcyclist

reidcc said:


> I have stock white tape on my bars and it matches my seat... however- I don't see the white staying white for very long before it starts looking real old and dirty. I was thinking Black Bar Tape. I see there is now a bright green tape to match my green- but me thinks that would be too loud!!!
> 
> Chris


You could go with blue to match the strip of blue on the top tube.


----------



## velodog

I've got the Fizik apple green bar tape on my bike(black) and you sure know which way it's pointed.
If you want to stick with white tape give the Fizik a try, it stays clean. I'm going on my 2nd season with the green and it still looks good and I had pink on before that and it made a season and a half and still looked good, but I just wanted a change of scenery.
I've got the red fizik on another bike and it's looking at better than 2yrs., almost 3. It doesn't see the use that the other bike does though.


----------



## old_fuji

I had a bugger of a time putting on Fizik tape...it didn't stretch sufficiently to wrap around the anatomic bumps on my handlebar, like Planet Bike or Bontrager tape does.


----------



## Cyclin Dan

Too many yellow bikes!










I (obviously) prefer the black bar tape. I did think about yellow for a second though...


----------



## hmto

3 pages and still going?
I say split it top and bottom, use 2 colours and be done with it.


----------



## scblack

old_fuji said:


> I had a bugger of a time putting on Fizik tape...it didn't stretch sufficiently to wrap around the anatomic bumps on my handlebar, like Planet Bike or Bontrager tape does.


I found it to be fine. I have Cinelli Neo Morphe handlebars, which have a LOT of curves and anatomic sections. The Fizik tape was not easy by any means, it did need to be pulled/stretched over the difficult sections, but stretched sufficiently to do a damn good job.

I don't see mayself using any other bar tape soon.


----------



## Chuckroast

Always white, classic old school look.


----------



## Tripleblack

To the owner of the yellow Specialized on page 1:


How the hell did you get your bike to stand up like that? Did someone let it go while you snapped a quick pick then just grabbed it again or what? lol...


----------



## Touch0Gray

Special Eyes said:


> NIce bike, Touch0Gray! You have the right idea of just the two colors.
> 
> I used a thin wood dowel rod to prop the bike in that position and then cloned out the rod in photoshop. No smoke and mirrors!





Tripleblack said:


> To the owner of the yellow Specialized on page 1:
> 
> 
> How the hell did you get your bike to stand up like that? Did someone let it go while you snapped a quick pick then just grabbed it again or what? lol...


Special Eyes.....is a witch!!!!! BURN HIM......


and the moral of this story is...NEVER believe ANYTHING you see in a picture!


----------



## 8toes

This is one of the problems with this sport....too many "rules."Just use what you want to use and everyone else be damned.


----------



## saf-t

*Wwjd?*


----------



## reidcc

I got NO problem with Yellow bikes!!! My first road bike was a Yellow Schwinn Continental from back in early 70's. I paid my LBS $10 a week when I bought that- it was a lot for a 14 yr old kid back then.

Come to think of it- it had yellow bar tape as well- although there was no such thing as padded tape then.

Chris


Cyclin Dan said:


> Too many yellow bikes!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I (obviously) prefer the black bar tape. I did think about yellow for a second though...


----------



## kbwh

reidcc said:


> I have stock white tape on my bars and it matches my seat... however- I don't see the white staying white for very long before it starts looking real old and dirty. I was thinking Black Bar Tape. I see there is now a bright green tape to match my green- but me thinks that would be too loud!!!
> 
> Chris


A blue that picked up the top tube could work.


----------



## tyfelmingham

Red makes you go faster duh!


----------



## Ripton

Special Eyes said:


> It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....


Wow, a tour winner posting on here? What's it like amongst the plebs?


----------



## tihsepa

Ripton said:


> Wow, a tour winner posting on here? What's it like amongst the plebs?


What?


----------



## bmc41fish

i ride a 09 blue cannondale but i have orange lizard skin handle bat tape


----------



## Special Eyes

Ripton said:


> Wow, a tour winner posting on here? What's it like amongst the plebs?


What???


----------



## oldnewbie52

*Like the yellow*

Think the yellow tape looks great, Special Eyes.
But yeah, rule 15a, paragraph 7: Bike can only be 
photographed from drivetrain side. All others shall 
be considered null and void.


----------



## MarvinK

Special Eyes said:


>


The bike looks awesome, in general, but that black and red seat looks severely out of place. Even plain black would be better. If the highlight color was yellow instead of red, it would look look good. I think plain black seat and plain black tape would look best. Seriously... if you're going to put yellow SRAM Red on the bike, at least get a matching seat (or one that doesn't stick out like a sore thumb).




scblack said:


> Here's another combo - bar tape matches front end frame paint colour. This looks great I think.


The Cinelli works much better because, like scblack said, it goes with the frame. If there were any Red anywhere on the back half of that yellow Specialized, it might look fine too.




I think in most cases, though, the saddle and tape should match. Typically it looks best if they match the frame logo colors. If you want white, consider Lizard Skin DSP tape or Fizik so you can actually keep it clean. Personally, I like the Fizik logo tape with matching saddle. Here's my tape (saddle is white, so are most logos):


----------



## FlandersFields

Special Eyes said:


> It could match your frame! Not sure how much longer I'll keep this tape, black is on the way.....



Awesome bike!! I hope you have the legs to match that machine. :thumbsup:


----------



## Touch0Gray

FlandersFields said:


> Awesome bike!! I hope you have the legs to match that machine. :thumbsup:


so...what color legs go with yellow and black?????


----------



## FlandersFields

Touch0Gray said:


> so...what color legs go with yellow and black?????


In Flemmish we say: "You sure put on your funnypants this morning."


----------



## Touch0Gray

FlandersFields said:


> Awesome bike!! I hope you have the legs to match that machine. :thumbsup:





FlandersFields said:


> In Flemmish we say: "You sure put on your funnypants this morning."


Considering, this is a thread originated specifically dedicated to matching colors, I could only assume the post was in reference to color. Otherwise is it some kind of misplaced modifier of sorts!......LOL
I never interpret posts, I must take them literally. English has basic rules to eliminate confusion. I am confused enough about enough things to try to conform to standards..... (and my humor is not always funny)


----------



## MarvinK

Touch0Gray said:


> so...what color legs go with yellow and black?????


I think tan legs likely would look best.... plus they'd help cover up that out-of-place seat!


----------



## Special Eyes

FlandersFields said:


> Awesome bike!! I hope you have the legs to match that machine. :thumbsup:


Of course not, I'm 60 yrs old! But, still a serious rider (no competing).

OK, OK, the seat is now all black, and tape is still yellow, but will be black someday when the yellow stuff gets too ratty. The ZIPP decals on the wheels have been removed to get rid of the annoying white.


----------



## MarvinK

Cool... I bet it looks *GREAT* now. Gonna post a new picture?


----------



## Zombie John

I have a black/whit/silver Cannondale Synapse that came with white tape and a white saddle. I tjust put bright green on it. I plan to put a black saddle on the bike to at least be a bit more complimentary, but I think of bright bar tape colors (done tastefully) as an 'F you.'

If everything matches BUT the tape and the tape is an obnoxious color like green/orange then I think it's a statement.


----------



## EvilGreg

Oxtox said:


> contemplating splash bar tape...? just say NO.
> 
> Splash Horror



Actually, I like splash bar tape. :yesnod:


----------



## velodog

What about finishing tape? Should it be black, white, is it 'sposed to match something on the bike. And what about finishing by whipping with cord, or is that reserved for leather bar tape?

Myself, I've used black, green, red, white, yellow and I think blue, always tying in with something or another on the bike from handlebar tape to the color of the lettering, shux the green was used to match the s SwissStop brake pads I use.

But that's all changed now. I found a full roll of orange tape and decided that it would be used as my finishing tape until it's used up.
It's good to have a reason to do things.


----------



## quikrick1

Finishing tape should be fun. I used black with a small strip of yellow. BTW the saddle on this bike is black with yellow trim.


----------



## Haraldsson

I am considering using red or black handlebar tape. I will propably be using white tape to finish it off with.
What colors would you have gone for, based by looking at my bike?

Thanks
Haraldsson


----------



## Touch0Gray

Red tape with black tires


----------



## Oxtox

Haraldsson said:


> I am considering using red or black handlebar tape. I will propably be using white tape to finish it off with.
> What colors would you have gone for, based by looking at my bike?


might as well go with blue to match the rear tire....


----------



## Shegens

chemical_brother said:


> Minty green fizik tape on drops, white saddle, white/chrome accented frameset. And a yellow Giant decal. Think a blue saddle is in order.
> 
> If you don't like the colors, don't look down!


My granddaughter wants me to put lime green tape on her handlebars to match the decals on the frame. Haven't done it yet.


----------



## Haraldsson

You are realizing that it is the Tacx tyre that is mounted on the rear wheel of the bike?

Anyway... red handlebar tape with white tape to finish it of with would look good?


----------



## .je

Once you have the tape... what colours then for the _streamers_? 
View attachment 288960







I suggest red, blue, white with your colour scheme.


----------



## velodog

I would suggest yellow tape.

Put red bar tape on it and it'll look like just about every other black bike with red trim out there.


----------



## Touch0Gray

Shegens said:


> My granddaughter wants me to put lime green tape on her handlebars to match the decals on the frame. Haven't done it yet.


get on it man......chop, chop!


----------



## Shegens

.je said:


> Once you have the tape... what colours then for the _streamers_?
> View attachment 288960
> View attachment 288961
> 
> I suggest red, blue, white with your colour scheme.


I loved those things when I was a kid.  The granddaughter is 18 though so I think even she has outgrown them.


----------



## Shegens

Touch0Gray said:


> get on it man......chop, chop!


Have to find some first. My bike shop wouldn't be caught dead selling lime green handlebar tape. I'll look on Amazon. They'll sell anything.


----------



## velodog

Shegens said:


> Have to find some first. My bike shop wouldn't be caught dead selling lime green handlebar tape. I'll look on Amazon. They'll sell anything.


Fizik apple green.

? SUPERLIGHT Apple Green

I've got it on one of my bikes and I quite like it.


----------



## Shegens

velodog said:


> Fizik apple green.
> 
> ? SUPERLIGHT Apple Green
> 
> I've got it on one of my bikes and I quite like it.


That's is pretty! I'll show it to her. I think she will like it. Her bike has some fluorescent green decals and it looks like it will match. I looked in a couple of bike shops but didn't find any. I wasn't even sure they made it in bright green.


----------



## MXL

oldnewbie52 said:


> Think the yellow tape looks great, Special Eyes.
> But yeah, rule 15a, paragraph 7: Bike can only be
> photographed from drivetrain side. All others shall
> be considered null and void.


True, but that only applies to bikes adorned with Campy, all others must be photographed from the left side because nobody wants to see shimano or Sram. :-D


----------

