# Anyone switched from a Sequoia to Roubaix or Tarmac?



## cycledrum (Dec 18, 2005)

Got into road biking 2 months ago with a base model Sequoia which has been great for commuting to work and 'Moderate'pace rides (up to 16mph in flats). But when the heat gets turned up in climbing or fast pacing on 'Brisk' pace rides, the Sequoia seems to lack that extra edge I'm really hoping the Roubaix Expert or Tarmac Expert models can deliver.
(I know training is key, but the riders I see on brisk rides have pimped out bikes like - Orbea Onix, Trek 5500's, Madones, Colnago's, etc...

Comp or Expert Roubaix's haven't caught on around here in SF Bay Area. I don't see them on fast club rides. I've seen a Pro and S-works Roubaix though.

Anyone else made switch from Sequoia to Comp or Expert Roubaix? LBS strongly recommending Roubaix '06 Expert triple for me. That bike better be much more capable than Sequoia. Would cost about $2700 otd! 

LBS labels the Tarmac as a 'crit bike' (I guess that stands for short races?), but I'll test ride one eventually. Full size double probably won't suit me here in SF Bay Area. Very hilly. Tarmac with compact drive (50/36 front) and 12 -27 cassette seems suitable for a novice. 

Anyone switch Comp to Pro Tarmac from 53/39 to 50/36? How'd it go?

Long post


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## bc165 (Aug 5, 2003)

*Welcome to the forum*

I don't know about the Sequoia, but I've ridden a Roubaix Comp for the past 14 months and it's been a great bike. I live in Santa Rosa, so I agree that you would be well served by keeping some low gears for the norcal hills. I use a 50/36 with a 12/27 and it works perfectly for me, but I might not have said that in my first year of riding. You'll have lower gearing with a triple. I guess the decision depends on your strength and types of rides you'll be doing - i.e. how much time in the hills. The Roubaix will take everything you throw at it. It really is a great recreational bike that is used as a road racer by some, even some pros. Haven't ridden the Tarmac, so I can't comment on it. Ride them both and see which one puts the biggest smile on your face. They're both great bikes.

BTW - The bike will make some difference, but if you want to keep moving up to faster groups, there's no substitute for good training. Ride your bike 3+ days/week - commuting is great for conditioning - do intervals and keep attacking those mountains. You're in for a treat... there's a lot of great riding opportunities in the Bay Area!


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## cycledrum (Dec 18, 2005)

Hi, thanks for the reply. I'll keep pushing on the Sequoia, but I'm really looking forward to trying a carbon fiber framed bike. The Roubaix Comp or Expert is a definite consideration for next purchase.


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## Rushfan (Apr 20, 2003)

I just went from an Allez (same frame as yours) to a Roubaix. I was surprised but made a big (1mph) jump in my average speed on my normal route. I upgraded the wheels to Mavic Ksyrium Elites, but I don't really believe the bike made that big of a difference. The main reason I bought it was to improve long ride comfort, not my average speed.

I agree-ride more, you'll go faster.


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## GoSharks! (Oct 4, 2005)

I am looking into the Roubaix Expert triple as well. I am currently riding a Giant OCR1, which I really like, but I want something a bit more on the "plush" side. I am also in the Los Gatos/Saratoga area, and I find the triple very helpful. I am hoping by late January to have my new ride.


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## teddysaur (Dec 30, 2004)

I'm riding a Roubaix Pro now and I'm not sure if I like it or not after sitting on my friend's Trek 5500 bike(his bike fits me better). The head tube is really tall and I feel like a parachute at more than 20miles/hr. For long distance riding, it will help your head and back since it is more upright riding but going against strong headwind is a no-no.

I've to use extra long stem to allow me to bent lower at an expense of my palm on hood. On the road feel, surpisingly I like the felt better on my friend's Merlin xtralight. The good thing I like on the Roubaix is the stiffness but partly because I only weight 130pounds.


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## kayakado (Aug 23, 2004)

Not being able to hang in a pace line at 20mph is the rider - not the sequoia. I do it all the time.


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## cycledrum (Dec 18, 2005)

I'm going to change my original post. Actually the Sequoia works pretty well when 'fast' groups are just cruising along (I don't have a computer on my bike, so I can't put cruising into numbers).

It's when the riding gets down and dirty climbing hills or riding hard into wind that the Sequoia seems to lack that edge that I'm hoping the Roubaix or Tarmac Experts can deliver on.


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## GoSharks! (Oct 4, 2005)

I would be curious on comments on purchasing the Roubaix for primarily "comfort with better than average speed." I like to ride for 2.5 to 4 hours at a time. I plan to ride in at least 2 Centuries in 2006. My favorite riding is around the Santa Cruz Mountains, and that's why I like the "triple", and long rides to the coast and up the peninsula. I am pushing 50 years of age, and speed is not a critical factor, but I am expecting better than average performance from the Roubaix.


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## critchie (Apr 27, 2004)

*Specialized Roubaix*

Hi Cycledrum,

First off, I sell Specialized bikes (thebicyclebarn.com). The Roubaix is a big step up from the Sequoia, especially when you are talking about the pricier models.

The edge you're talking about is the weight (you lose) and frame stiffness (you gain) when going to the Roubaix. The great part is the ride comfort gained in the deal. A 2005 Roubaix Pro or Comp is 25% stiffer at the BB, and torsionally, then a Trek Madone 5.9, yet its ride is more compliant. The Sequoia is not even close to the Roubaix.

Gearing is totally rider dependent. However, I would advise against the triple. If you need lower gearing, use a 50/34 instead of a 50/36. Triples are heavier and don't shift particularly well. Additionally, if you start with a 34t inner and find that after you get stronger a 36t is sufficient, the switch is easliy done. No such luck with the triple.

The Tarmac models have more traditional geometries, like the Trek 'teddysaur" references. Meaning, it puts you in a lower, racier position. That is OK if you are fairly flexible, but can be a drag depending on your age (often less flexible as this increases), goals relate to longer rides (rather than short, fast ones) or you are looking for the best trade-off of comfort and speed.

Feel free to contact me directly if you would like any additional input -- [email protected].

Cheers


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## critchie (Apr 27, 2004)

*Specialized Roubaix*

Hi Cycledrum,

First off, I sell Specialized bikes (thebicyclebarn.com). The Roubaix is a big step up from the Sequoia, especially when you are talking about the pricier models.

The edge you're talking about is the weight (you lose) and frame stiffness (you gain) when going to the Roubaix. The great part is the ride comfort gained in the deal. A 2005 Roubaix Pro or Comp is 25% stiffer at the BB, and torsionally, then a Trek Madone 5.9, yet its ride is more compliant. The Sequoia is not even close to the Roubaix.

Gearing is totally rider dependent. However, I would advise against the triple. If you need lower gearing, use a 50/34 instead of a 50/36. Triples are heavier and don't shift particularly well. Additionally, if you start with a 34t inner and find that after you get stronger a 36t is sufficient, the switch is easliy done. No such luck with the triple.

The Tarmac models have more traditional geometries, like the Trek 'teddysaur" references. Meaning, it puts you in a lower, racier position. That is OK if you are fairly flexible, but can be a drag depending on your age (often less flexible as this increases), goals relate to longer rides (rather than short, fast ones) or you are looking for the best trade-off of comfort and speed.

Feel free to contact me directly if you would like any additional input -- [email protected].

Cheers


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

*yes and no*

I owned 2005 Roubaix Comp 54cm for about 6 months and 1200 miles before it got stolen. I could not replace it (sold out completely!) and I had to settle on 2005 Trek Madone 5.9 some 6 months and 1400 miles ago as "second best thing". I also tried Bianchi 928 carbon and given its price I was not too impressed. Roubaix felt much better to me, on the road.

So first and foremost - Roubaix carbon is a great and comfortable ride. No flex but I am only 66kg (~145lbs). I have zero hesitation in recommending it. A buy! It is a bit slower steering than Madone due to more relaxed geometry but this only makes a diference in criteriums, not on open road or climbs. It has a taller head tube so you can sit more upright or remove all spacers and point your stem low if you prefer. I would take Roubaix over Tarmac any day for open road and climbs (but not for crits).

But I wish to clear up some myths. Trek Madone 5.9 (2005+) ride quality is on par with Roubaix Comp carbon, IMO. I was surprized. The only big difference is sharper steering and more spacers required than most other sloping top tube frames due to short head tube. Apart from that Madone is just another great carbon horse for winning races as would be Roubaix too and many others. Madone is not dead feeling but it is more traditional looking. This is purely form and not a question of function. If you can not tolerate at least 2 inches (40-50mm) of saddle to bar drop then may will find Madone may look odd with flipped-up stem and 40-50mm of spacers. If this dos not worry you or you are ok with 2+ inch saddle-to-handlebar drop then Madone should be on your short list. As long as it fits *you well*.


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## cycledrum (Dec 18, 2005)

This thread is awesome. Thanks everybody.

For me, Madone's are quite pricey. $3k + tax for base model '06 Madone 5.2. Ouch! 

Last week I went into my LBS all excited about the Roubaix Comp, Experts with compact double cranks (50/36, with 27 on rear cassette). Darn salesguy pooh, poohed those drives saying 'those are all new this year, they are not proven, the 53/39 double has been the standard for umpteen years, blah, blah, so with a Roubaix, you should get the triple drive'. Sounds fishy. 

I'd try a 50/34 with no hesitation. Easy to switch rings. Thanks critchie for the invite!


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## teddysaur (Dec 30, 2004)

I think another thing to consider is the distance you travelled every ride and your flexibility.

As for me, I'm still able to touch my toes and 95% of my rides are less than 80km per ride. Therefore, a crit bike will fit me better.

If I were to go for a century, I would believe Roubaix will save me in the last hour on the bike.

So tempting to get a new frame!!! ARGH! MUST RESIST THE TEMPTATION and SAVE MY POCKET!!!


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## MDGColorado (Nov 9, 2004)

critchie said:


> Triples are heavier and don't shift particularly well.


Heavier? Yeah, by a teeny chainring and 5 bolts. 

Front shifting is mainly chainring dependent. All the Shimano triples I know of shift great, whereas the one FSA triple I've used is a little slow. However, I do agree that a compact triple is a good solution. I'd get 48/34 if you could get it. The stock 53/12 is useless gear.

I've had my Roubaix for about a year and put over 2200 miles on it. It rides great, but my 25 year old steel frame rides just as well.


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## Rushfan (Apr 20, 2003)

cycledrum said:


> This thread is awesome. Thanks everybody.
> 
> For me, Madone's are quite pricey. $3k + tax for base model '06 Madone 5.2. Ouch!
> 
> ...


I have to agree that triples in general don't shift as well as doubles. BS on the compacts. There's a significant cost involved changing a bike on the floor from a triple to a double, so that could be why he's steering you towards the triple if he doesn't have a double in stock. As for me, I went with the triple-I have a bad knee and am willing to trade the shifting problems that might develop over the risk of jacking up my knee. I need that comfort. As for the weight difference, once I lose 20 lbs., I might notice the difference, but probably not.


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## critchie (Apr 27, 2004)

Rushfan said:


> I have to agree that triples in general don't shift as well as doubles. BS on the compacts. There's a significant cost involved changing a bike on the floor from a triple to a double, so that could be why he's steering you towards the triple if he doesn't have a double in stock. As for me, I went with the triple-I have a bad knee and am willing to trade the shifting problems that might develop over the risk of jacking up my knee. I need that comfort. As for the weight difference, once I lose 20 lbs., I might notice the difference, but probably not.


There is no cost if the bike comes in a compact double, and the Roubaix does come in a compact double. If he is trying to sell you something because that's what he has in stock, leave the store and don't ever go back. I have a store and i don't do that crap -- my store is in PA so i'm not trying to sell a bike here, i'm giving advice.

As for yourself, you didn't need a triple because of your knee. You needed a bike with certain gearing and that could just have easily have been a compact if the shop you use had the right bike in stock, and was open to new thinking -- which many are not.

As for the weight, it's a chainring, bolts, larger front derailleur and long cage rear derailleur. However, the big thing is the enhanced shifting associated with a double.

Cheers


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## cycledrum (Dec 18, 2005)

Critchie, the LBS salesguy is not bent to sell me a floor model. I'm almost 6' 3" tall and LBS only has a Roubaix Elite in XXL which I'm not interested in.

The two guys that own the LBS are pretty cool, not pushy and usually very helpful. They've been in biz for a long time in Fremont. You won't find high-end stuff like S-works in their shop. I go to Palo Alto bike shops near Stanford University to see those bikes in a store.

It appears all race bikes and high-end bikes have double drives on 'em. Thanks for the info about fast shifting. I'm looking for high performance. I always do. Hey, I ride a Honda CBR600RR too.


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## Rushfan (Apr 20, 2003)

critchie said:


> There is no cost if the bike comes in a compact double, and the Roubaix does come in a compact double. If he is trying to sell you something because that's what he has in stock, leave the store and don't ever go back. I have a store and i don't do that crap -- my store is in PA so i'm not trying to sell a bike here, i'm giving advice.
> 
> As for yourself, you didn't need a triple because of your knee. You needed a bike with certain gearing and that could just have easily have been a compact if the shop you use had the right bike in stock, and was open to new thinking -- which many are not.
> 
> ...


I did try a compact double-just didn't like it. But I can't argue your points.


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## crumjack (Sep 11, 2005)

Regarding compact doubles, I read that Basso and other CSC riders used FSA compacts in the last TdF for the mountain stages. Granted if something goes wrong with the crank they have a stash of them in the car but for me thats a compelling argument that its more than some new gimmick. Also, campy and shimano are releasing compacts this year.

I went with an Allez Elite Triple to be on the safe side. My regular rides are flat but have plans to tackle some more hilly rides (maybe even head out of state for some mountains) so its there if I need it. The crank is an FSA Gossamer. It shifts just fine from the middle to big ring. I've shifted from the small ring to the middle once (tooling around the neighborhood with my son) and it was a little rough but probably because I had it on the biggest cog in the back. If I were buying today, I would probably go with the compact just because it means a simpler drivetrain.

Just my two cents on the matter. Sorry can't help you too much on frame choice!


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## Boardmill (Oct 15, 2005)

I live in the East Bay and own a Roubaix and I think it is an excellent bike. The Expert is the way to go for your budget. It would definitely be a significant upgrade over your Sequoia. I have the 2006 Expert in a triple and I think it shifts great. The new Ultegra shifts much better then the last generation did in my opinion, especially the triple.

I think out of the box all the components are good. I changed the stem and seatpost to Thomson and the seat to an Arione but I like all the other components including the Ultegra wheelset.

I bought this for rides from 60 to 110 miles. I tried a number of frames before deciding on the Roubaix and I don't have an ounce of regret.

BTW, if you run 175 cranks I would trade my Triple setup (2006 Expert components for 2006 Expert components) for a Compact Double. All my components are as new. I offer this up if your LBS has a compact double in stock and can cut you a better deal or if you want to buy the Compact Double and try it, you could still trade it to me for a triple. 

I like the triple and it will work better for some people, but my other bike has the compact double and I am much more used to that gearing. Making this change is not something I'm desperate to do, but I would if someone in the area wanted to do it. I have all he tools and I am a good wrench. 

So far as deciding on whether to Triple or not I would look at how strong you are, your cadence, and where you are going to be riding. I personally would not decide against a triple for ego reasons. It all comes down to what range of gears you use most often. You can check out Sheldon Brown's gear calculator to see what you are getting or losing with both.

Go with the Roubaix, you won't regret it.


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