# A Warranty Replacement Story



## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

Less than 1 month. 300 (or there about) miles. I loved my 2009 Team Carbon/Red 58cm Tarmac Comp. Just before a ride on Thursday evening I noticed what I believe to be some 'gunk' on the non-drive side chain stay. My wife brought a rag and I began to wipe. I realized that it wasn't just gunk.

Upon closer inspection I could tell that the carbon on the upper and inside section of the stay was damaged to say the least. I'd say the damaged area was no larger than 1.5" in overall length, and ran at an angle. Strangely, the paint was pretty much intact. Mostly looked like it was split/bubbled up, but not scuffed or marred from an impact. I honestly can't recall any sort of bump, rock, impact, etc... in my few rides that could have caused any damage, let alone something to this extent. I'm no materials expert, but it was obvious that it shouldn't be ridden. I immediately called the LBS (Bicycle Center in Salt Lake City). I asked for Chad, the manager who'd helped me out with the purchase of both my and subsequently my wife's carbon road bikes. Chad wasn't in, but whoever answered was willing to help. I explained the situation. They quickly shuffled me off to the owner. I explained the situation. This bike has been babied like you can't believe. Never dropped a curb, never really impacted with anything. Just some average rides. I did my best to keep it wiped down, and always handled the thing like it was an egg shell (though they spent hours convincing me that the carbon frame was extremely durable). I can't imagine that my weight (181lb) was an issue?

The owner was shocked. He'd never heard of this sort of thing, but was willing to have a look at it. I placed the bike into my car and drove to the store. Upon arrival the sales staff grabbed the bike to take a look. Right away they starting claiming that it could only be damage (my fault). No frame would fail like that. That sort of thing. I made it clear that I was an honest person that had no intention of stealing or deceiving them. If I had done anything that could have in any way caused any damage at all, I'd be more willing to accept fault, but I simply hadn't. The next step was a review at the local Specialized distribution center, scheduled for the next day. I spent the night bracing myself for the worst, but hoping for the best (and most fair outcome). 

I got the call late Thursday afternoon. It was the owner, and he asked if I how I was feeling. Next, he explained that they still had no idea what could have caused it, but after he "twisted their arms" they were willing to do me a favor. They were sending a 2010 Tarmac Comp in White/Carbon, they'd move my parts over and have it ready by Saturday at the latest. I confirmed the frame/color so I could check it out online. 2010. White/Carbon. OK, not my favorite finish... but close to mine and better than the other 2010 Comp finish. I'll accept. 

Fast forward to Friday evening. A call from the owner again. The frame had come in early. Come on down. I arrived about 6:00. Nobody greeted me for about 10 minutes (helping other customers. After what I'd call an awkward amount of time the owner asked if I wanted to see it. Sure! He went into the back and came forth with what was obviously not the bike we'd discussed. Now here's where I'm confused. It is an all white (with red accents) Tarmac Comp. He claimed it was a 2009 (more on this later). I was immediately struck with the thought that I would never want a white bike. Just not my style. To make matters worse, it looked like a bit of a "Frankenstein" because of my silver cables, and black/dark 105 group. Also, black seat post and stem. Just not the crisp/clean look that anyone that had paid anywhere near this would hope for. 

Now some disclaimer: I know that compared to this forum and likely the road cycling world at large this isn't an expensive bike. For me, it is. And we bought 2 $2k range bikes within weeks, plus a pedals, shoes, cages, etc... Not the kind of money that I'm willing to invest and only be somewhat happy. I LOVED my old Tarmac. This is a nice bike, but I don't appreciate the look at all. 

Now I'm left feeling like I don't have an LBS that is truly my ally. Left feeling like Specialized, or the LBS might be pulling some kind of fast one. And left wondering why I can't find any record of this bike in the Specialized archive. No all white Tarmac Comps that I could find for any year? I'm also left wondering why he didn't set my expectations appropriately in the beginning? Or why he didn't call me when this "2009" oddball frame came when he expected the 2010 White/Carbon?

I feel like I have 4 options:

- Accept the all white frankenbike
- Work with the LBS to try and find a color that I'm more interested (the prospects sound limited)
- Demand a refund
- See if they'll work me some sort of deal on a 2010 Comp that I do "love"

Any experiences with Specialized warranty replacements that might give me additional insight? Are my expectations unreasonable? Should I try to circumvent the LBS and contact Specialized support directly? Is it possible that the 2010 bike did intact come in, and they tried to stick me with this oddball white frame from their own stock? Anyone know of an all white 2009 Tarmac Comp?

</rant>


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## rickyscuba (Jul 22, 2009)

Last week I had a similar problem like yours but definitively other ending. A happy one.
My 2009 Roubaix Comp develop a strange crack near the rear brake area. After the warranty protocol i received a call confirming the replacement. They will replace my team carbon frame with a white carbon and blue. I refuse the exchange and after a couple of mails Specialized agreed to send me a 2010 Roubaix SL2 Carbon Gray (raw) frame.

Of course I'm very happy with the replacement...

So, my advice is try to replace that frame, you don't have nothing to lose.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Do you know for certain it's an '09 and not a '10? I ask this because the color schemes change based on region, so you may find a matching bike sold in another country. I know that doesn't make it more attractive, but I think that's the way Spec sometimes fulfills warranty claims. It's what's available at the time.

I would go back to the shop and relay what you've posted here. Ask them to set something up with you and the rep (and the LBS owner, if he wishes) in an effort to resolve the situation. There's a corny but true saying that goes something like "if you don't ask, you don't get", so I suggest you maintain civility, make your feelings known and clearly state what you see as an acceptable resolution. Given Specs track record, I think the odds are in your favor.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

I appreciate the feedback. I'm quite sure that the white Tarmac is not a 2010 because it is labeled as having fact 6r carbon, where the 2010 comp moved to the fact 8r level.

I'll contact the LBS and ensure that they understand my feelings on the situation and request a conversation with the Specialized representative. That seems like the right thing to do, because in reality my beef is with Specialized and the LBS seems to be complicating things at best.

More to come...


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Unless they change specs by region, I agree that if the frame is labeled 6r, it's pre-'10. But I still wouldn't be surprised if that color scheme was offered outside the US.

I also agree that your LBS is falling a little short in this instance and (IMO) you'll need to take a pro-active approach towards a resolution.

I don't blame you for wanting a like replacement, but when I saw the bike I had to chuckle. My recent build was a LOT more orange than yours (posted in Custom Builders), so I actually like your color scheme. :thumbsup:


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

The bike looks good. You should be happy with it.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

PJ352 said:


> I actually like your color scheme. :thumbsup:


I get that I'm being a bit picky here. And it isn't that the white bike is the ugliest thing ever. More that I decided not to buy a used bike, or a discount bike online (bikes direct) so that I could get exactly what I wanted, and have the support of an LBS. Now that I need their help, part of me wishes I would have just gone the other route and saved some $$$.

You buy this, then it fails:









LBS tells you that Specialized is sending this:









Then without warning, you get something entirely different. Mismanaged expectations.


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## mjdwyer23 (Mar 18, 2009)

what are the first few digits of the frame's serial? That should answer your year Q.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

mjdwyer23 said:


> what are the first few digits of the frame's serial? That should answer your year Q.


WUD81265051D


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## RedRider93 (Jan 28, 2009)

If the new frame is 6r carbon and your old frame is 8r carbon then you were downgraded from a performance standpoint. I would go in there and explain this to the LBS and if they don't understand the problem ask to speak with the Specialized rep about the problem. Downgrades are not acceptable, get it fixed.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Pls don't take what I offered the wrong way. I simply stated that I liked the color, but you certainly don't have to, nor do I think you should 'settle'. Sometimes even reputable companies need to be prodded, and I think that's the case here.

RE: your BD comment. I think you chose the right path here.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

RedRider93 said:


> If the new frame is 6r carbon and your old frame is 8r carbon then you were downgraded from a performance standpoint. I would go in there and explain this to the LBS and if they don't understand the problem ask to speak with the Specialized rep about the problem. *Downgrades are not acceptable, get it fixed*.


+1. Succinctly put. :thumbsup:


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## sixate (Jul 6, 2009)

I'd be flaming pissed because it is a downgrade. Take the bike back to the LBS, and have them fix the situation. The white frame is ugly, but more important, it is a downgrade. You bought a 2010 model, and a replacement should not be an 09.


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## pdainsworth (Jun 6, 2004)

I don't believe that Specialized's warranty states that your frame will be replaced with a same model year or newer frame, so I don't know that that complaint is valid. There is also no provision for color. However, if you went from an 8r to a 6r frame, you should not accept it. The frame should be of the same or better quality. If you don't have luck with your dealer, try a different one. I know we have processed warranty replacements for customers of other shops where the other shop has let them down.


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## Mosovich (Feb 3, 2004)

*I saw*

a Roubaix painted that color. It's a 2009 dealer paint sample... I was looking at pictures of Roubiax under Google images..


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## JimT (Jul 18, 2007)

Sorry to hear about the lack of support from your LBS, it makes people want to save a few bucks and by online when your LBS doesn't support you. 
I am in total agreement with you here. Take it back and see if they will work with you on what you really deserve.


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## cantride55 (Sep 19, 2008)

I agree with Jim T. I also feel that If I dropped money on a certain frame / colour combo I'd like to (maybe even expect) the same in a replacement or my approval regarding the replacement if that colour is not available. Reading the OP post, I'd feel that "they" were trying to solve the problem with as little effort as possible to satisfy the issue. Kinda like " we got your money, here's a bike now go away".
Reopen the conversation with the L.B.S., ask them to contact Spec. You may want to think about not riding the bike,take it back to the shop and leave it there or get in writing that this frame is to be used until an approved frame can be found. 
In short, cover your "saddle area" Good luck, sorry for the problem and I trust it will work out well for you.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

I spoke to Chad (manager) at Bicycle Center. I quickly explained that I wouldn't be able to accept this bike and would appreciate the opportunity to speak with the Specialized rep. He was friendly and agreed to pass a message along to the rep on Monday morning.

I haven't and don't plan on riding the white bike. I wouldn't want to risk damaging it and ending up stuck with it.

To clarify the situation for some that might have misunderstood the carbon downgrade situation... My original Tarmac was a 2009 FACT 6r Comp. The 2010 8r Comp came into play when the owner of the LBS originally stated that was the bike Specialized was sending. So when the 2009 FACT 6r "white" frame arrived, I wasn't upset about the year or carbon, as much as the color/finish. The potential "free upgrade" to the newer 2010 frame was a cool "gimmie", but not something I was set on. 

I've read all the stories about people going from Elite/Comps up to Experts or SLs due to frame replacements. I'd never refuse that situation, but I can honestly say that isn't my intention here. I'm not holding out to try and squeeze Specialized into a free upgrade that I don't deserve.

Honestly, thanks everyone for the suggestions and feedback. I feel good about the situation and I look forward to a positive conversation with the rep early next week. For now... off for a mtn bike ride. Thankfully I have great weather and another bike to keep me occupied.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Thanks for that clarification. I, for one, forgot the fact that you started out with an '09 6r Tarmac. 

Pls keep us updated. This could get interesting.


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

jordantbro said:


> I appreciate the feedback. I'm quite sure that the white Tarmac is not a 2010 because it is labeled as having fact 6r carbon, where the 2010 comp moved to the fact 8r level.
> 
> I'll contact the LBS and ensure that they understand my feelings on the situation and request a conversation with the Specialized representative. That seems like the right thing to do, because in reality my beef is with Specialized and the LBS seems to be complicating things at best.
> 
> More to come...


Very interesting color scheme. I wouldn't settle for it either. You do deserve to be satisfied with the replacement frame and your request(s) are not unreasonable. This really should be a no brainer.


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## sixate (Jul 6, 2009)

PJ352 said:


> Thanks for that clarification. I, for one, forgot the fact that you started out with an '09 6r Tarmac.


Same here, but you still received a color combo that you didn't agree to. I would still not be happy. Hopefully you get the situation taken care of.


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## SwiftSolo (Jun 7, 2008)

jordantbro said:


> I get that I'm being a bit picky here. And it isn't that the white bike is the ugliest thing ever. More that I decided not to buy a used bike, or a discount bike online (bikes direct) so that I could get exactly what I wanted, and have the support of an LBS. Now that I need their help, part of me wishes I would have just gone the other route and saved some $$$.
> 
> You buy this, then it fails:
> 
> ...


Mate,
I think you are correct in your disappointment. Bike color is a personal thing and the least they could do is replace it with something as similar as possible. I'm a little suspicious as this doesn't sound like something that Specialized would do!


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

SwiftSolo said:


> I'm a little suspicious as this doesn't sound like something that Specialized would do!


A part of me has wondered if the 2010 White/Carbon Comp frame did in fact arrive for me, but the LBS decided to add it to their inventory and try to appease me with this 2009. Either way, hopefully I'll make some progress tomorrow.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

I just got off the line with Specialized. Their support guy (didn't catch his name) was awesome! He made it clear that both warranty analysts that reviewed my frame came to the conclusion that it was a 100% "not to spec" warranty claim. This goes against the message that I recieved from the dealer. They claimed that Specialized had no idea how it had happened and that they had "twisted their arm" in order to get me a replacement.

On to the good news. The white bike was according to the Specialized support guy, a central European 2009 Tarmac Comp frame. The white color was the frame color they had built into their warranty replacement inventory. So essentially, worldwide, that is the color that would be available as a replacement for any 2009 Tarmac Comp, despite the color you had originally purchased. I explained that I just didn't like the color at all, and they understood. I had purchased a dark bike, and it makes sense that a totally white bike wouldn't match that style. Specialized is shipping a 2010 Tarmac Comp (FACT 8r) Charcoal/Carbon frame. While it isn't my ideal paint scheme, I really like it and feel like it will grow on me even more. I'm going to have them wrap the bars with black tape (mine is currently white and looking dirty already) and see if we can work a deal on a white to black Toupe seat swap. If not, I'll live with the white saddle. More over, I'm reallyexcited to ride again.

I'm guessing the bike will arrive at the LBS today or tomorrow. I'll returnthe white bike so that they can swap over the components. I'll post a picture once I have it.

I'm still left wondering why the LBS would have gone to the effort of claiming that the bike was damaged and then even after Specialized reviewed and determined that it was in fact a warranty claim, giving me the impression that they had to "twist their arm".

Either way, Specialized really does rock and I can't wait to get back on the road. Thanks again to everyone who gave me suggestions and encouragement in this thread. My result is confirmation that a positive, proactive approach was the best route to getting what was fair.


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

Nice work! I had a feeling Specialized would stand behind their warranty. I would find a different bike shop if I were you. It's pretty apparant that they didn't take you seriously.

Now, if I had the option, while I had the Specialized guy on the phone, I would have pushed a little harder for the white/black/red Tarmac. That is a sweet looking bike. Not that the bike that you're getting isn't but . . . . just sayin'.

Congratulations on working this out to your satisfaction!


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

By the way, the frame that your LBS got for you is the frame that was sold in Germany in 2009.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Great job! Ya done_ good_! :thumbsup:

It doesn't matter what we think of the 'new' bike (I like it), it's whether or not _you're_ happy and you seem to be. 

I agree that you might want to shop around for a new LBS. IMO what actually transpired is moot at this point because you're apt to never have full confidence in them in the future. 

Good luck with this 'last chapter' - and post pics when you've got the new ride. I've always been curious what the color scheme looks like in 3D.


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## Mosovich (Feb 3, 2004)

*Yeah..*

I'd move on to another shop and I think it will look pretty kicking what the white tape and saddle..


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

PJ352 said:


> Great job! Ya done_ good_! :thumbsup:
> 
> It doesn't matter what we think of the 'new' bike (I like it), it's whether or not _you're_ happy and you seem to be.
> 
> ...


I was kidding about the color of the bike.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

rosborn said:


> I was kidding about the color of the bike.


Oh, no worries. I wasn't even thinking of your comment when I posted.


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## gtpharr (Oct 6, 2008)

Great news. I really like that Charcoal/Carbon color, but have never seen one in person. I bet it looks nicer in person than on the web site.

I'm glad Spec took good care of you and I do understand your concern with your dealer. They blow smoke up your butt and try to make you feel like they are doing you some huge favor when they are actually doing nothing for you. Your dealer has blown their integrity with you and it will be difficult for you to fully trust them in the future.


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

gtpharr said:


> I'm glad Spec took good care of you and I do understand your concern with your dealer. They blow smoke up your butt and try to make you feel like they are doing you some huge favor when they are actually doing nothing for you.


I agree that sounds like shenanigans on the dealer's part. 

I wonder where that "blowing smoke up your arse" saying came from. Is that supposed to be a good thing? I can't say I've been tempted to try it.


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## ZoSoSwiM (Mar 7, 2008)

Warranty replacement can sometimes be a hassle but if you're patient it works out... KHS has replaced 2 frames for me with pretty much no question. Of course my bike shop helped a little.

Both mountain bike frames broke in the same exact place.. top of seat tube/ top tube junction. My first frame replacement was newer and a step up.. When I broke that frame it was replaced with the newest model and many steps up... Basically my frame went from cheap to expensive. Now I'm riding a great mountain bike and it only cost me a little bit of money to get different headsets and such to work.

Glad Specialized helped you out!


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## gtpharr (Oct 6, 2008)

fallzboater said:


> I agree that sounds like shenanigans on the dealer's part.
> 
> I wonder where that "blowing smoke up your arse" saying came from. Is that supposed to be a good thing? I can't say I've been tempted to try it.


Google is your friend:

The phrase "blowing smoke", meaning to deceive and/or distract, has been around for years. The "up ones arse" part is a fairly new addition. The origin of the "blowing smoke" part is from stage magic, where magicians use smoke to hide their actions or to distract the audience. So if your actions were meant to distract or deceive, you were said to be blowing smoke. Of course, anyone who studies American slang knows that pretty much any phrase can be improved by adding a reference to someones arse, so I suppose it's inevitable the that is where the smoke would eventually be blown.


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## rushton32 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Sounds fishy*

Your story is very interesting. I hate to hear about anyone having problems with their ride but I have a couple of questions. You said you put the bike in your car to take it back to the shop, is this how you transport it? Is it in your car or trunk? I ask this because I have never seen a rear stay get damaged unless it was impacted. I have seen bb areas and seat stay joints but not right in the middle of the stay as descibed. Please correct me if I have the area wrong. Sounds like something hit it like maybe your trunk lid if you carry it in your trunk. just throwing out ideas. Hard to say with not seeing the damage. It would be interesting to get the dealers side of the story to see what they have to say about this situation.


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## MaddSkillz (Mar 13, 2007)

Glad you were able to come to an agreement on the replacement bike! Specialized is typically known for their great warranty/customer service but sometimes the LBS can screw that all up.


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## moogle (Jan 29, 2007)

gtpharr said:


> Google is your friend:
> 
> The phrase "blowing smoke", meaning to deceive and/or distract, has been around for years. The "up ones arse" part is a fairly new addition. The origin of the "blowing smoke" part is from stage magic, where magicians use smoke to hide their actions or to distract the audience. So if your actions were meant to distract or deceive, you were said to be blowing smoke. Of course, anyone who studies American slang knows that pretty much any phrase can be improved by adding a reference to someones arse, so I suppose it's inevitable the that is where the smoke would eventually be blown.


Actually:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobacco_smoke_enema

More than you ever wanted to know..


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

rushton32 said:


> You said you put the bike in your car to take it back to the shop, is this how you transport it? Is it in your car or trunk?


Nope, that was really just a euphemism. I have a Subaru with full Yakima racks.



rushton32 said:


> It would be interesting to get the dealers side of the story to see what they have to say about this situation.


If I hadn't already wasted enough time with them, I'd be curious to hear the justification of their twisted logic too. Call them. They'll know exactly who you're talking about if you say "Tarmac, Jordan". I can't imagine they've been dealing with any other Jordan's on a Tarmac replacement this week. http://www.bicyclecenter.com/

@ rushton32, I notice that you're from Salt Lake City and ride a Specialized bike as well. Have you had any personal experience with Bicycle Center?



rushton32 said:


> I have seen bb areas and seat stay joints but not right in the middle of the stay as descibed.


If you re-read my original post, you'll find that while I did describe both the general area and type of damage, I didn't specify that it was in the middle of the stay (though in reality it was). Leads me to believe that it is possible that you might have seen or heard about my situation outside of this thread? Especially considering the fact that you're the only one of the many people who took the time to reply to this thread, that had a negative message in your reply. 

What are the odds? Someone from Salt Lake City. New to the forum. Rides Specialized. Thinks my bike was damaged. Knew it was in the center of the stay. To quote you: "Sounds fishy". In any event, I couldn't care less what Bicycle Center or rushton32 have to say. Specialized made it clear. Not to spec. It was reviewed independently by two of their warranty specialists. I mean no disrespect, but I'm going to side with their opinion over yours.


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

jordantbro said:


> If you re-read my original post, you'll find that while I did describe both the general area and type of damage, I didn't specify that it was in the middle of the stay (though in reality it was). Leads me to believe that it is possible that you might have seen or heard about my situation outside of this thread? Especially considering the fact that you're the only one of the many people who took the time to reply to this thread, that had a negative message in your reply.
> 
> What are the odds? Someone from Salt Lake City. New to the forum. Rides Specialized. Thinks my bike was damaged. Knew it was in the center of the stay. To quote you: "Sounds fishy". In any event, I couldn't care less what Bicycle Center or rushton32 have to say. Specialized made it clear. Not to spec. It was reviewed independently by two of their warranty specialists. I mean no disrespect, but I'm going to side with their opinion over yours.


Yeah, that does sound fishy. Rushton32 has some pretty detailed information that you did not specify at any point in the thread. Hmm, perhaps Rushton32 works at the bike shop or is the owner or manager. Enquiring minds want to know.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

rushton32 said:


> Your story is very interesting. I hate to hear about anyone having problems with their ride but I have a couple of questions. You said you put the bike in your car to take it back to the shop, is this how you transport it? Is it in your car or trunk? I ask this because* I have never seen a rear stay get damaged unless it was impacted*. I have seen bb areas and seat stay joints but not right in the middle of the stay as descibed. Please correct me if I have the area wrong. *Sounds like something hit it like maybe your trunk lid if you carry it in your trunk.* just throwing out ideas. Hard to say with not seeing the damage. It would be interesting to get the dealers side of the story to see what they have to say about this situation.


So you're saying that Specialized agrees to replace frames that are impacted/ damaged in that or a similar manner?? Cool!! My Tarmac's an '08 and I'd just _love_ a new one. Where DID I leave that hammer.......


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## rushton32 (Oct 31, 2007)

*some insight*

Wow seems like a couple of people on here are pretty quick to jump to conclusions. Jordanbo, I am glad you came to terms with Specialized. I actually live in Vegas but when I joined this site I lived in SLC. I do ride Specialized which in my opinion, which you said you do not care about, is the best brand out there. I think you do too because it sounds like you received an upgraded frame. The reason I like to get more info about things like this is because I work in a shop here and deal with warranty issues time to time. As an employee we ask basic questions to get a better understanding, which was all I was doing. With warranty's, most are good and painless but some can be bad if people get their emotions involved. I hope your shop treats you right and you do the same. Have fun on the new bike.


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

rushton32 said:


> Wow seems like a couple of people on here are pretty quick to jump to conclusions. Jordanbo, I am glad you came to terms with Specialized. I actually live in Vegas but when I joined this site I lived in SLC. I do ride Specialized which in my opinion, which you said you do not care about, is the best brand out there. I think you do too because it sounds like you received an upgraded frame. The reason I like to get more info about things like this is because I work in a shop here and deal with warranty issues time to time. As an employee we ask basic questions to get a better understanding, which was all I was doing. With warranty's, most are good and painless but some can be bad if people get their emotions involved. I hope your shop treats you right and you do the same. Have fun on the new bike.


Interesting, though, that you knew exactly where the frame issue was on Jordanbro's bike. Hmmmm.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

rushton32 said:


> I do ride Specialized which in my opinion, which you said you do not care about, is the best brand out there. I think you do too because it sounds like you received an upgraded frame.


Don't get the wrong idea, I'm not saying I don't care about any opinion you offer. Just that I don't see the value in posting a reply that you still think it was my fault after Specialized said it clearly wasn't. What is your goal, should I reject the warranty frame because some dude read a post and thinks it was my fault? My love for Specialized hasn't got anything to do with the "upgraded frame" I will receive. In fact, if they called me today and offered me the identical replacement to my first Comp, I'd take it over the 2010 in a heartbeat. Especially compared to other situations I've found online, this "upgrade" is negligible. I own a car full of Specialized gear. 3 bikes, helmets, shoes, gloves, cages, bottles, pumps, jerseys, the works. My loyalty is pretty deep and has been for quite some time. I've also been involved in multiple people's bike purchases and suffice to say, they're riding Specialized too.

It strikes me that you and my local LBS have the same gut reaction, that it must be my fault. I think that speaks volumes about a problem within Specialized's dealer network (since you work at a shop too). See, the problem as I see it is that bike shops don't offer anything but service. That is really their only value add. I can get the exact same bike from any shop, so all I want from the LBS is help when I need it. Unfortunately for Specialized, they can't closely control the customer experience, because it is dictated almost entirely by the shops. A good shop might give a great experience, where another might give a terrible one (again selling the same products at virtually the same price). 

The Specialized agent I spoke with made it clear, the bike shop has absolutely no say when it comes to warranty claims. So if that is the case, it strikes me that it is in the bike shops best interest to shut their mouths. That way, they aren't picking sides and the dispute stays between the bike owner and the manufacturer. In cases where Specialized denies the claim, the LBS can still maintain their position as an ally to the customer. "We're so sorry about your bike, unfortunately this is out of our hands. We'd love to work a deal with you on a new frame." If Specialized does (like in my case) deem that the frame should be replaced under warranty, the LBS looks golden because they facilitated the communication, etc... 

That said, I just can't see why there is any value for the LBS to stick their nose into the warranty claim process. They have no say and they can only end up on the short end of the stick, where they lose a customer's return business because of a poor experience. In an industry that is arguably in decline (due to online sales and off brand bikes at significant discount) I'd be doing anything I could to retain and foster existing customers. What you as a shop employee must understand is that a frame failure is exceedingly frustrating for any customer. But having the shop tell you that it "must have been your fault" because they've "never seen this before" only adds insult to injury. Not to mention the fact that, again, it isn't up to the shop.


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## tkelson (Jan 13, 2008)

i've been interested in this thread since it started because i own a new specialized and live in slc. it seems to me though that it is very easy to jump to the conclusion that you were wronged by the shop when we have only heard your version of the story. we are also only hearing your version of what the specialized rep said, not his. i know from many experiences that there are always two sides to every story and the truth usually lies some place between the two. sometimes how problems are approached yield very different outcomes. i'm glad you recieved the outcome you wanted, but it is at the expense of the reputation of what seems to be a good shop. i didn't buy my bike from them, but i have walked through on occasion. they seem to be very friendly people that are very knowlegable about bikes. i'm not saying you didn't deserve a new bike, just that one sided stories are usally just that.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

tkelson makes valid points. I won't belabor any of my points here, but I can say that I don't stand to benefit from deceiving this forum. I isn't my intention to influence anyone in terms of using or not using this shop. These experiences are my own, and I totally agree that these situations vary case by case. Bicycle Center gave me good deals on multiple bikes. They are obviously knowledgeable, and I don't doubt that they're a good shop overall. They gave my XC a great tune up, it honestly rides better than ever.

I don't doubt that they''ll see more of my money in time.


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## JimT (Jul 18, 2007)

I've been following it as well due to a crash I had a few weeks ago, I thought it was cracked but it was just deep scratches with the decals flaking off (I think). I sent pics to the shop where I bought it and I should find out what the verdict is tomorrow. I am keeping my fingers crossed. BTW this is an 07 Madone so it's different situation from yours but it will say something about customer service and there was great advice on how to deal with them. Hopefully I will have a decent outcome like you did. 

Thanks 
Jim


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

JimT said:


> I've been following it as well due to a crash I had a few weeks ago, I thought it was cracked but it was just deep scratches with the decals flaking off (I think). I sent pics to the shop where I bought it and I should find out what the verdict is tomorrow. I am keeping my fingers crossed. BTW this is an 07 Madone so it's different situation from yours but it will say something about customer service and there was great advice on how to deal with them. Hopefully I will have a decent outcome like you did.
> 
> Thanks
> Jim


Just keep in mind that crashes aren't covered under a warranty. Trek does, however offer a crash replacement policy, so you may be offered an upgrade for a nominal charge, relatively speaking. You may already be aware of all this, so just a FYI...


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## JimT (Jul 18, 2007)

Your right PJ, they said it should be in the neighborhood of $7-800.00 and I am not sure if that would include swapping my old components over to the new frameset or not but it is still a bargain. I just hope either I really like it or I can sell it for a decent price and put it towards something I would like better. 

JimT


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

JimT said:


> Your right PJ, they said it should be in the neighborhood of $7-800.00 and I am not sure if that would include swapping my old components over to the new frameset or not but it is still a bargain. I just hope either I really like it or* I can sell it for a decent price and put it towards something I would like better. *
> JimT


Well, seeing as you're a Trek owner hanging out in the Spec forum, I have only one thought.

Tarmac.


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## JimT (Jul 18, 2007)

LOL, that white carbon in post #6 really caught my eye!


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## green814 (Feb 24, 2008)

Jordan,

Glad to hear everything worked out for you, BUT there is 1 major flaw with this thread!

You need to update your signature to a 2010 Tarmac!  

Sweet ride!

Chris


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

green814 said:


> You need to update your signature to a 2010 Tarmac!


Unfortunately, I still don't have the new bike. I'm just waiting for the call now, hopefully within the next few hours.


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## green814 (Feb 24, 2008)

jordantbro said:


> Unfortunately, I still don't have the new bike. I'm just waiting for the call now, hopefully within the next few hours.


Well, hopefully your weather this w/e will be better than we are suppose to have today & tomorrow here in Mid-Mi! 

Have a fun maiden voyage!

Chris


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

What a great day. 100% perfect weather. I got the new frame, and honestly I really like it. MUCH better in person, the pictures on the Specialized site just doesn't do the color scheme justice. 

After we picked her up we went straight over to City Creek Canyon, which turned out to be our favorite ride so far this year.

Here are a few pictures:


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## rosborn (May 10, 2009)

Oh . . . . I like it! Definitely much better looking in your pictures than on the Specialized website. That matte finish is really nice. I'm happy that the situation was resolved in your favor. Thanks for sharing the pictures!


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Nice pics! :thumbsup:

I agree that the color scheme is much better looking than on the website. Probably even moreso in person.

I'd be interested in your riding impressions, because I have a 6r Tarmac. Just curious if you'll notice any differences between your '09 and this 8r frameset.


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## jordantbro (Mar 9, 2010)

PJ352 said:


> I'd be interested in your riding impressions, because I have a 6r Tarmac. Just curious if you'll notice any differences between your '09 and this 8r frameset.


It is really hard to say. The bike does feel really great. But part of that might be due to a few things that don't have anything to do with the frame. My fitness level has really increased, so rides feel better and better overall. 2nd, would be the fact that the bike is really in tune now. They have essentially trued the bike 3 times, and I've tweaked my position to near perfection.

It does feel very stiff, especially in the BB. The head tube, down tube and BB are just beefy in general.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jordantbro said:


> It is really hard to say. The bike does feel really great. But part of that might be due to a few things that don't have anything to do with the frame. My fitness level has really increased, so rides feel better and better overall. 2nd, would be the fact that the bike is really in tune now. They have essentially trued the bike 3 times, and I've tweaked my position to near perfection.
> 
> It does feel very stiff, especially in the BB. The head tube, down tube and BB are just beefy in general.


If you're like me, it'll take some saddle time to hone in on any subtle differences in ride/ handling there may be. And there's always a chance there aren't any. No matter, because I think you ended up with a great bike and a good outcome to this 'story'.


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## green814 (Feb 24, 2008)

Looks GREAT!

Glad to hear all worked out.

Chris


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## sixate (Jul 6, 2009)

Good to hear you were taken care of. Now get a black saddle. :thumbsup:


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## rcekstrom (Oct 4, 2008)

I like the color and am also glad the waranty worked in your favor. I have heard many good things about Specs customer service which was a major factor in my decision when i bought a bike from them.

That LBS on the other hand did not seems to have your best interests in mind. Is there another Spec authorized dealer near you.


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