# Scott Foil Frame Update coming soon?



## octave

hey everyone!

i am currently looking at a 2013 Scott Foil 40, planning to strip the components and build the frame up with some choice bits.

so, a short preface, followed by questions:

the Foil frame was released in 2011, if I am not mistaken. since then, has it been updated? if it has not been updated, it is due for an update soon, probably, right? with an imminent update in the works, would it be silly to go for a 2013 Foil frame?

thanks!!

o


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## dje31

If I had to guess, I'd say 2016, if it's carrying forward. Not sure if the aero-road thing has run its course or is still a selling point.


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## octave

yeah, a user in the bikes, frames, forks forum (where i also posted this message) said that 2016 would be the year it was updated.

personally, the aero-road thing is still a selling point! i like the idea of being a bit more slippery without going full aero. full aero looks a bit too tt bike and i think tt bikes are uuuugly.


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## SauronHimself

Aero frames simply look better, so I think they will be around for a long time.


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## MMsRepBike

I don't know if it is the "Foil" but I can promise you that Scott has a new aero road bike coming out this season. They've already sent out the invites to the press for it's release.


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## Stoneman

Well I wish they'd hurry and show us the goods. I'm ready for a new road bike and I'm waiting to be wow'd with the latest and greatest.


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## dje31

Unless they do an early release like they did with new Addict CX, it probably won't be official until the 2016 Scott dealer meeting reveal, usually in June / July.


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## dje31

Rumor has it that the first reveal of Foil 2.0 will be on the 13th of this week...stay tuned!

"...its debut will be at the Tour de Suisse on June 13th..."


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## MMsRepBike




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## tranzformer




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## Stoneman

I like everything I see except the rear brake placement. The new Madone 9 may be the winner!


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## robdamanii

Stoneman said:


> I like everything I see except the rear brake placement. The new Madone 9 may be the winner!


Not a fan of that brake either. But it's similar to the Solace, and I know a number of folks riding them with no issues whatsoever.


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## Rashadabd

dje31 said:


> Rumor has it that the first reveal of Foil 2.0 will be on the 13th of this week...stay tuned!
> 
> "...its debut will be at the Tour de Suisse on June 13th..."


Aren't they supposed to be doing a release for this today sometime?


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## MMsRepBike

It's being ridden right now. It looks pretty good I guess.


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## Rashadabd

Nothing Earth shattering, but at least someone other than us is talking about it. 

Is Scott set to launch a new Foil aero road bike? | road.cc


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## Rashadabd

Rashadabd said:


> Nothing Earth shattering, but at least someone other than us is talking about it.
> 
> Is Scott set to launch a new Foil aero road bike? | road.cc


Here's more (actually lots more on almost every bike coming out): http://youtu.be/CorqJ2QdBp8


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## Rashadabd

It has been officially released:

First-look review: 2016 Scott Foil | CyclingTips

I personally really like the look, not sold on the rear brake placement though. I really do appreciate that the provided the new technology at cheaper price points though:

First-look review: 2016 Scott Foil | CyclingTips


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## MMsRepBike

If it wasn't for the rear brake, I'd really like it. But alas, I can't stand brakes placed there, I've hated it since the first time it was done. Overall very nice though. Quite nice looking and I'm sure it performs the bees knees.


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## 9W9W

What I don't understand is.... you dialed the compliance down to Addict levels.... https://images.cyclingtips.com.au/content/uploads/2015/06/compliance.jpg

The addict shares the same geometry, so you're really overlapping these two models prettty prettty pretty close. 

I'm a bigger guy, so long thin proprietary seat posts aren't a favorite. I do love this bike, and yes I appreciate the tech and frame trickling down to lower price points. unlike the new venge which is available at the top shelf level only.


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## Rashadabd

9W9W said:


> What I don't understand is.... you dialed the compliance down to Addict levels.... https://images.cyclingtips.com.au/content/uploads/2015/06/compliance.jpg
> 
> The addict shares the same geometry, so you're really overlapping these two models prettty prettty pretty close.
> 
> I'm a bigger guy, so long thin proprietary seat posts aren't a favorite. I do love this bike, and yes I appreciate the tech and frame trickling down to lower price points. unlike the new venge which is available at the top shelf level only.


That's the future, all arounders will be a bit more aero and aero will be a bit lighter and more comfortable. It does create more overlap, but I think they sell more bikes in the end.


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## Rashadabd

More on the new Foil from GCN: 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e19jH--bnc&sns=em


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## nsfbr

Rashadabd said:


> More on the new Foil from GCN:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e19jH--bnc&sns=em


I get way too much enjoyment from GCN. I think they are hilarious. Beautiful bike. I hope some of that trickles down to my price range as I'm not going to drop that much into my next ride.


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## Rashadabd

More new videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJUPGyikqc8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFa2v4DIcqQ


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## Rashadabd

nsfbr said:


> I get way too much enjoyment from GCN. I think they are hilarious. Beautiful bike. I hope some of that trickles down to my price range as I'm not going to drop that much into my next ride.


Agreed, I love me some GCN. They seem like my kind of guys (goofy). I pretty much expect the Foil pricing to be really close to the new Addict pricing from last year. We'll see though.


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## Chucky

I'm not a huge fan of the look so far, the compressed rear triangle makes the seat post look way too long. I do like the front wheel tucked closer to the down tube though. I own a Scott Solace and 2015 Foil the bottom mounted rear brake of the Solace has never given me problems but there is definitely a significant difference in braking power compared to the traditional rear brake location of my Foil as well as my Litespeed. The Solace locates the brakes below because they use very thin seat stays for compliance that can't accommodate brake forces; I don't understand why they would do that on the new Foil. The Solace is more of a "comfort" performance bike while the Foil is a pure race machine; you'd think Scott would have put/kept the best performing brakes on the Foil.
Also noticed quite a few of the IAM Cycling and Orica Greededge pro riders have chosen to ride the "old" Foil in the TDF; partly due to availability but some prefer the old version. I wonder if Scott ends up keeping the old frame as well. Anybody heard anything about this?


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## nsfbr

Chucky said:


> I'm not a huge fan of the look so far, the compressed rear triangle makes the seat post look way too long. I do like the front wheel tucked closer to the down tube though. I own a Scott Solace and 2015 Foil the bottom mounted rear brake of the Solace has never given me problems but there is definitely a significant difference in braking power compared to the traditional rear brake location of my Foil as well as my Litespeed. The Solace locates the brakes below because they use very thin seat stays for compliance that can't accommodate brake forces; I don't understand why they would do that on the new Foil. The Solace is more of a "comfort" performance bike while the Foil is a pure race machine; you'd think Scott would have put/kept the best performing brakes on the Foil.
> Also noticed quite a few of the IAM Cycling and Orica Greededge pro riders have chosen to ride the "old" Foil in the TDF; partly due to availability but some prefer the old version. I wonder if Scott ends up keeping the old frame as well. Anybody heard anything about this?


Two questions: I can't even imagine that a rear brake's stopping power would be the limiting factor for apply braking force to the road from the back wheel. Nor can I see how the location would impact that. Could you explain why you think that this is the case?

Re the TDF, my understanding is that Scott only made a total of 5 or 6 new Foils available to the teams that are using Scott. So availability would be the only reason for those using the old one. Are you actually aware of anyone who has said they prefer the 2015 to the new one or was this just conjecture?

I think the point of the new Foil is to take what they've learned from the Solace as well as marginal aero improvements and incorporate them into the Foil update, which was coming regardless. Time is what seems to drive frame updates, the rest is just deciding what to do when it is that time. I personally love the older design in terms of appearance, which is all that matters as I'm not going to be buying either any time soon. A Solace perhaps, but I'm no racer.


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## Chucky

nsfbr said:


> Two questions: I can't even imagine that a rear brake's stopping power would be the limiting factor for apply braking force to the road from the back wheel. Nor can I see how the location would impact that. Could you explain why you think that this is the case?
> 
> Re the TDF, my understanding is that Scott only made a total of 5 or 6 new Foils available to the teams that are using Scott. So availability would be the only reason for those using the old one. Are you actually aware of anyone who has said they prefer the 2015 to the new one or was this just conjecture?
> 
> I think the point of the new Foil is to take what they've learned from the Solace as well as marginal aero improvements and incorporate them into the Foil update, which was coming regardless. Time is what seems to drive frame updates, the rest is just deciding what to do when it is that time. I personally love the older design in terms of appearance, which is all that matters as I'm not going to be buying either any time soon. A Solace perhaps, but I'm no racer.


I own both the Solace and Foil and it definitely makes a difference; with both my carbon wheels and carbon specific pads as well as with the aluminum Syncros wheels and regular pads it came with. I cannot lock up the rear wheel of my Solace with either setup. I'm 6' 170 lbs; I can stop more quickly with traditional rear brake location on my Foil and Litespeed. The Solace came with a Shimano 105 rear brake (everything else was Ultegra) I upgraded to Ultegra hoping to improve braking; it did not have much affect; I've even had LBS replace the cable and tune them; still no improvement. It's not dangerous just not as effective. I would suggest you go to LBS and ride both the Solace and Foil and see for yourself.
Just speculation on the new Foil choice by pro riders; some of the team leaders are on the old frame if they are really that limited you'd think the team leaders would get them first; also after the stage 3 crash they were taking both versions off the cars to replace broken bikes and one Orica Greenedge rider is clearly seen getting off of an old Foil and onto a new one.


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## nsfbr

Thanks. So now I would defer to you on both things. I still don't get the why on the brakes though. I mean, there doesn't seem to be any direct reason for lower clamping force as a result of the placement. Color me confused.I fully intend to ride the Solace before I'd buy it. I can't imagine owning a Foil though so I'd probably not take up my LBS' time by riding it.


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## Chucky

I don't get it either. One guy at LBS told me that it might be because the cable is longer and I'm not used to the feel and there will be more stretching with a longer cable; I didn't really believe this at the time.
Foil is a great bike; I had the Solace first but always loved the look and reputation of the Foil but was afraid it would be too harsh a ride. Had a chance to pick up a 2015 Foil 10 frame at a good price and I am completely impressed with it and surprised its not as harsh a ride as I thought and I'm comfortable with the more aggressive positioning, Solace is more upright and relaxed


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