# Frank Shleck failed doping test - the end of RadioShack Nissan Trek?



## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/18/s...leck-fails-doping-test-at-tour-de-france.html

How can RadioShack Nissan Trek continue to exist after all these controversies?

Is it safe to assume Andy is/was doping to? Denis Menchov 2010 tdf winner?


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## apn (Mar 1, 2012)

OK, but why is this a police matter?

Per;


> Schleck had gone to the Pau police station of his own accord to cooperate with authorities. Maertens said the rider knew the police would probably be coming for him.


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## Kodi Crescent (Aug 3, 2011)

WOW!


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

apn said:


> OK, but why is this a police matter?
> 
> Per;


Yeah I was wondering the same.


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## jorgy (Oct 21, 2005)

mtnroadie said:


> Yeah I was wondering the same.


Pretty sure doping is a criminal offense in France.


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## flyrunride (May 2, 2012)

Yup, if I remember right doping is a criminal offense in France. He might get the orange jersey though...


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## David Loving (Jun 13, 2008)

maybe he gets the black and white striped jersey - I don't know the fashion trend in French jails...


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

In before the move  !


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

apn said:


> OK, but why is this a police matter?
> 
> Per;


I think it has something to do with sporting fraud.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

I figure RSNT was going to be toast with or without the Frank doping positive. 

I also think Bruyneel's career is over and it would have been even w/o Frank's positive.


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## SwiftSolo (Jun 7, 2008)

He apparently took a diuretic. There are three types and you can see from the side effects why he would want to take them.

*

Diuretics (also called water pills) are used to treat high blood pressure, glaucoma and retention of fluid known as edema. Diuretics works by helping your body release sodium, an electrolyte. The kidneys are forced to excrete large amounts of sodium in the urine. There are three types of diuretics: thiazide diuretics, such as Diuril (generic: chlorothiazide) and Zaroxolyn (generic: metolazone); potassium-sparing diuretics, such as Midamor (generic: amiloride) and Inspra (generic: eplerenone); and loop diuretics, such as Burnex (generic: bumetanide) and Lasix (generic: furosemide).
Thiazide Diuretics

Thiazide diuretics may produce a variety of serious and non-serious side effects, but the effects are relatively rare and you may experience none of them. If you do, consult a medical professional immediately. Serious side effects include rapid heartbeat; pain in the chest; blurred vision; chills, diarrhea; difficulties with breathing, swallowing or urination; vomiting; or stools containing blood; fever; indigestion; nosebleeds; nausea; trembling; abnormal weakness; bleeding; bruising; or tiredness, bad breath, seizures, spinning sensations, confusion or constipation. Non-serious and temporary side effects that do not require help from a doctor include skin scales or cracks, lowered libido, impotence, spasms in the muscles, decreases in body heat and thinning or loss of hair.
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Potassium-Sparing Diuretics

Potassium-sparring diuretics can induce some temporary or serious side effects during use. Temporary side effects, such as diarrhea, loss of weight, appetite changes, lowered libido, belching, impotence, loss of hearing, indigestion, double vision, abnormal perception of colors, ear noises, stomach pressure, insomnia or tunnel vision among others, do not require medical attention and will disappear by themselves as you continue to take the drug. Serious side effects, such as confusion, irregular heartbeat, hallucinations, vomiting, coma, irritability, fever, headaches and seizures should be mentioned to your doctor immediately.
Loop Diuretics

Loop diuretics also may cause serious or temporary side effects from usage. Those of the serious type include fast and excessive loss of weight, breathing problems, swallowing problems, abnormal bruising, noises in the ears (such as ringing), uncommon bleeding, hearing loss and a skin rash that is severe and may include skin peeling. Temporary side effects include cramps in the muscles, diarrhea, weakness throughout the body, vomiting, dizziness, lightheadedness, thirstiness and nausea.

Read* more: Diuretic Side Effects | LIVESTRONG.COM




mtnroadie said:


> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/18/s...leck-fails-doping-test-at-tour-de-france.html
> 
> How can RadioShack Nissan Trek continue to exist after all these controversies?
> 
> Is it safe to assume Andy is/was doping to? Denis Menchov 2010 tdf winner?


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

mtnroadie said:


> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/18/s...leck-fails-doping-test-at-tour-de-france.html
> 
> How can RadioShack Nissan Trek continue to exist after all these controversies?
> 
> Is it safe to assume Andy is/was doping to? Denis Menchov 2010 tdf winner?


Testing showed that he had a substance in his body that while not specifically banned was enough for him to retire from the TDF. I understand he will have another test soon and that will be the definitive one. Safe to say? In fairness, the process isn't complete and judgement should be reserved till then.

The team has denied all knowledge, which isn't surprising. That may be so. However, I think the team should be held as accountable as the rider. They should know what their riders are doing training-wise. Not knowing demonstrates a lack of commitment and a level of ignorance, perhaps willful, that shouldn't be allowed. So, if Schleck goes down on this, so should the team.

It may not come to that. The teams sponsors may simply pull the plug and the team will fold regardless. Two of the team's stars are pretty much done for now. They certainly have no hope left for TDF and it's questionable that the team will be able to produce any results that will satisfy their sponsors. I'd say Radio Shack / Nissan is a spent force, but I could be wrong.


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## davidka (Dec 12, 2001)

Samadhi said:


> The team has denied all knowledge, which isn't surprising. That may be so. However, I think the team should be held as accountable as the rider. They should know what their riders are doing training-wise. Not knowing demonstrates a lack of commitment and a level of ignorance, perhaps willful, that shouldn't be allowed. So, if Schleck goes down on this, so should the team.


You can't hold a group responsible for the actions of an individual without proof that the group had knowledge. We've been down that road. It ends with all the sponsors leaving and the sport ending.


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## Doctor Falsetti (Sep 24, 2010)

They were already dead. This is just another nail


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## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

SwiftSolo said:


> _...Serious side effects include rapid heartbeat; pain in the chest; blurred vision; chills, *diarrhea...*_


not to be overly insensitive but LOL if he just blew out a big one during a stage.


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## Lazy Spinner (Aug 30, 2009)

RSNT is done. No star power, mediocre results, Flavio Becca's tax problems, riders not getting pay checks, Bruyneel, and now this. The sad thing is that Horner's career may end with the team and Matthew Busche may have a tough time catching on with a ProTour team next season.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

davidka said:


> You can't hold a group responsible for the actions of an individual without proof that the group had knowledge. We've been down that road. It ends with all the sponsors leaving and the sport ending.


Of course you can hold the team responsible.

Just because they say they have no knowledge doesn't mean it's true. If they have no knowledge then they are clueless about what the members of their team are doing and on that basis alone should be slapped around by both the sanctioning body and the media. Didn't somebody say the team doc was involved in a doping scandal surrounding Rabo a while back?

And as far as the sponsors go, hell, they could be in on the deal too.

If the sport is as corrupt as it seems to be maybe it should end.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

SwiftSolo said:


> Read[/I][/B] more: Diuretic Side Effects | LIVESTRONG.COM


Cracks me up that you got this from Livestrong.com


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

Ventruck said:


> not to be overly insensitive but LOL if he just blew out a big one during a stage.


Have we ever had any Uta Pippig moments in cycling?:yikes:


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## danl1 (Jul 23, 2005)

:aureola:


mtnroadie said:


> Have we ever had any Uta Pippig moments in cycling?:yikes:


Um, that would be a Greg Lemond moment in these parts. During his first Tour win.

But I'm sure that was from eating snails at dinner, not an unintended side effect of any doping/masking. He never did that. Of course not. Every winner before and since, but not him.


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## thighmaster (Feb 2, 2006)

Well there goes the crowd that says "these schleck boys are clean". Just find me a clean one, anyone.


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## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

thighmaster said:


> Well there goes the crowd that says "these schleck boys are clean". Just find me a clean one, anyone.


I didn't know these crowds existed. Christ, Frank got caught sending money to Fuentes a couple of years ago.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

I find it pretty damn funny that Frank got pegged...I mean look at his lack of results in the TdF. Presuming he doesn't get a ban, he should probably hire a new doctor.


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## davidka (Dec 12, 2001)

Samadhi said:


> Of course you can hold the team responsible.
> 
> Just because they say they have no knowledge doesn't mean it's true. If they have no knowledge then they are clueless about what the members of their team are doing and on that basis alone should be slapped around by both the sanctioning body and the media. Didn't somebody say the team doc was involved in a doping scandal surrounding Rabo a while back?
> 
> ...


 The riders don't live on a compound with their staff and all of their team mates. They live all over the world for the most part, alone. The teams only come together at training camps and at races so the teams cannot monitor the riders to the standard you suggest. Riders are individually responsible for what goes into their bodies. If a team falls under suspicion for providing riders with illegal substances then investigate that but you can't throw a team out because of one rider peeing hot without proof that they contributed to it.


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## Samadhi (Nov 1, 2011)

thighmaster said:


> Well there goes the crowd that says "these schleck boys are clean". Just find me a clean one, anyone.


Is there one?


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

Marc said:


> I find it pretty damn funny that Frank got pegged...I mean look at his lack of results in the TdF. Presuming he doesn't get a ban, he should probably hire a new doctor.



Disclaimer-My wild-azz speculation:

I wonder if UCI is picky at who they expose as positive. 


Just a day or two previous Frank complained of The Tour being boring.

I thought that was a little interesting. :shrugs:


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## jlandry (Jan 12, 2007)

cda 455 said:


> Disclaimer-My wild-azz speculation:
> 
> I wonder if UCI is picky at who they expose as positive.
> 
> ...


"We'll show him... we'll destroy his career."


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## Bullvine (Sep 9, 2009)

Why is the doping forum & the pro race forum separate when they are one and the same?
They all dope except for maybe Evans this year. Some just dope better then others.

Care to make any bets on if brother Andy dopes?
Who finished 3rd in the TDF two years ago anyhow?

1st Alberto nope
2nd Andy nope
3rd ????

I bet the guy who came in around 48th actually won the 2010 tour.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

Bullvine said:


> Why is the doping forum & the pro race forum separate when they are one and the same?
> They all dope except for maybe Evans this year. Some just dope better then others.
> 
> Care to make any bets on if brother Andy dopes?
> ...


:lol:


In a sad way  .


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## trailrunner68 (Apr 23, 2011)

Bullvine said:


> Why is the doping forum & the pro race forum separate when they are one and the same?
> They all dope except for maybe Evans this year. Some just dope better then others.
> 
> Care to make any bets on if brother Andy dopes?
> ...


Pretty much all cycling forums are like this. The reason is that back in the day, even a few years ago, there were actually people who believed that Armstrong was clean. They threw fits when people pointed out the obvious. Forums became a series of neverending flame wars. The easy solution was to consign all doping discussion to a separate forum.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

trailrunner68 said:


> Pretty much all cycling forums are like this. The reason is that back in the day, even a few years ago, there were actually people who believed that Armstrong was clean. They threw fits when people pointed out the obvious. Forums became a series of neverending flame wars. The easy solution was to consign all doping discussion to a separate forum.



Ah, thanks for 'net historical perspective!


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

Bullvine said:


> Why is the doping forum & the pro race forum separate when they are one and the same?
> They all dope except for maybe Evans this year. Some just dope better then others.
> 
> Care to make any bets on if brother Andy dopes?
> ...


Thats why I said "Denis Menchov 2010 tdf winner?"

Honestly they are all doping, its truly hard to believe anyone can ride on that level for 100+miles a day nearly 25 days in a row.

As for the UCI cherry picking who they catch doping... absolutely agreed. All of these doping cases have internal politics written all over them. If we only knew everything there is to know about the pro circuit I am convinced we would see that it is all a sham no less corrupt than politics around the world.

It all comes down to good old human greed. 

Voeckler is clean, right tell me another one. He had a really good rest day, hmmmmm sure I believe you. France's hero my @$$. Those stinky cheese snail eaters would never allow for their cherished/pathetic national heroes get called out. Heaven forbid calling out Pier Rolland for being a total douche, or Europcar team as a whole for that matter.

Now poor Frankee is crying about being poisoned. If that is the case Franko you know who dun it and you better start blowing that whistle real hard. 

Its about time someone blew the whole lid and just came out and said it…. We ALL dope. None of you dopes would have the races you have to watch now if we did not dope. 

I say make all doping legal for one season and see what happens, steroids, bovine growth accelerators, adrenaline glad extract, what ever you want… we can call it Gladiators of the Tour de France. Good luck surviving the red eye road-roid rage of guys like Griepel, Cancelera and Hushovd.

:idea:Oh and each team member will be allowed one weapon of their choose but only one either defensive or offensive. That way you have to depend on team mates to have or not have your back. The really fast climbers can just carry a bag of barundanga to save weight and blow into their opponents face while passing them.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

mtnroadie said:


> I say make all doping legal for one season and see what happens, steroids, bovine growth accelerators, adrenaline glad extract, what ever you want… we can call it Gladiators of the Tour de France. Good luck surviving the red eye road-roid rage of guys like Griepel, Cancelera and Hushovd.



Purely for academic's, that would be interesting.

Would we see a big difference  ??? 



My only guess is that we would see a couple of real heart attacks in the peleton.


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

cda 455 said:


> Purely for academic's, that would be interesting.
> 
> Would we see a big difference  ???
> 
> ...


Yeah your probably right, but it would be fun to watch whoes heart is fit enough to handle the junk.


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## cda 455 (Aug 9, 2010)

mtnroadie said:


> Yeah your probably right, but it would be fun to watch whoes heart is fit enough to handle the junk.



Didn't a retired rider of 30 Y.O. tagging along with a team die at the beginning of The Tour?


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