# Needle marks from doping



## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

How do they hide the needle marks? Seriously.. Someone asked me this the other day and I had no idea.


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## ZoSoSwiM (Mar 7, 2008)

Between the toes baby!


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

For EPO, it's a small subcutaneous injection given in a small area of adipose tissue. No big needles, no veins, etc.


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## jorgy (Oct 21, 2005)

I wonder about brusing from IVs for the blood doping. Having been poked and prodded a lot over the last few months, I can't believe some visible markings of some sort would show up occasionally.

For example, nurses told me it was hard to find a vein on me. Special nurses who do nothing but poke people all day would sometimes have trouble. They'd hit a vein and then lose it. And I'd end up with a big ol' bruise.

People make blood doping sound so easy, but I can't imagine letting a buddy try and hit a vein on me, a la Landis' story about him and Levi.


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

spade2you said:


> For EPO, it's a small subcutaneous injection given in a small area of adipose tissue. No big needles, no veins, etc.


What about the transfusions of oxygenated blood. Easy to hide also?


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## sa7nt (Jun 28, 2010)

jorgy said:


> I wonder about brusing from IVs for the blood doping. Having been poked and prodded a lot over the last few months, I can't believe some visible markings of some sort would show up occasionally.
> 
> For example, nurses told me it was hard to find a vein on me. Special nurses who do nothing but poke people all day would sometimes have trouble. They'd hit a vein and then lose it. And I'd end up with a big ol' bruise.
> 
> People make blood doping sound so easy, but I can't imagine letting a buddy try and hit a vein on me, a la Landis' story about him and Levi.


Your nurses suck or you're just one of those people with hidden veins. I used to be the same way until I started lifting weights. Getting an IV in and out isn't that difficult for someone who is practiced. When I was in the military, I used to give myself and my buddies IVs prior to long road marches to stay hydrated.


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## jorgy (Oct 21, 2005)

sa7nt said:


> Your nurses suck or you're just one of those people with hidden veins. I used to be the same way until I started lifting weights. Getting an IV in and out isn't that difficult for someone who is practiced. When I was in the military, I used to give myself and my buddies IVs prior to long road marches to stay hydrated.


Mmkay.I guess the country's top cancer center keeps an army of "infusion team" nurses just for the heck of it.


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## sa7nt (Jun 28, 2010)

There's an option in that quote up there. You may have smaller veins that are hard to find. Or your nurses may have issues inserting IVs. Basic IV insertion is not difficult at all. "Infusion" nurses are simply certified to administer IVs. They are no more special than any other RN out there except they pased a test and are legally allowed to stick you. That doesn't make them necessarily adept at sticking a catheter into a vein without tearing or collapsing the vein.


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## txzen (Apr 6, 2005)

Well, up until 2008, they were allowed to take in IV fluids, so there was no real reason to hide the bruise from an infusion.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

rydbyk said:


> What about the transfusions of oxygenated blood. Easy to hide also?


Not as easy to hide, but not terribly necessary with EPO around.


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## rubbersoul (Mar 1, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> What about the transfusions of oxygenated blood. Easy to hide also?


long black socks!
________
DEPAKOTE SETTLEMENTS


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

txzen said:


> Well, up until 2008, they were allowed to take in IV fluids, so there was no real reason to hide the bruise from an infusion.


Blood draws would probably leave the same kind of mark as an infusion, depending on the quality of the phlebotomist.


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## iliveonnitro (Feb 19, 2006)

tattoos.


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## gregario (Nov 19, 2001)

*needle marks*



rydbyk said:


> How do they hide the needle marks? Seriously.. Someone asked me this the other day and I had no idea.


Make-up.

Emma O'Reilly, Lance Armstrong's former masseuse, claimed she provided him with make-up to hide the needle marks.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

gregario said:


> Make-up.
> 
> Emma O'Reilly, Lance Armstrong's former masseuse, claimed she provided him with make-up to hide the needle marks.


Interesting idea, but I can't see it staying on when they start to sweat.


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

iliveonnitro said:


> tattoos.


I suppose that's one way to do it, generally the antecubital vein is the easiest to utilize when you're dealing with decent amounts of fluid. Hand veins are ok, but not as good. I don't really see many riders with tattoos in areas that I'd want to use to hide it. Sure, there are plenty of access points, but you start to need a really talented nurse to pull it off.


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## slamy (Mar 15, 2004)

actually don't use the needle. You can just drink the blood.


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## peter.hardie (May 31, 2006)

Don't these guys regularly get glucose water IV's after hard stages in the heat in order to rehydrate? If that's the case then I'd think they'd have a huge number of needle marks regardless.


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## mtbbmet (Apr 2, 2005)

peter.hardie said:


> Don't these guys regularly get glucose water IV's after hard stages in the heat in order to rehydrate? If that's the case then I'd think they'd have a huge number of needle marks regardless.


Nope, IV's were banned a few years back.
Working in healthcare I can say 90% of people will bruise from an IV, give or take 5% either way. Some, roughly 20%, see very heavy bruising even from a good IV insertion.


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## rockstar2083 (Aug 30, 2005)

Central line


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## spade2you (May 12, 2009)

rockstar2083 said:


> Central line


...ermmmmmm, I know I'm not the only health care professional here, but hopefully you're joking. Your basic PICC or external central line would put the riders at risk for infection. A med port would work better in this respect, but somehow surgery and a permanent lump under the skin would show up eventually.


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## Big-foot (Dec 14, 2002)

rydbyk said:


> How do they hide the needle marks? Seriously.. Someone asked me this the other day and I had no idea.


Ask Emma O'Reilly...


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## elcameron (Aug 10, 2002)

rubbersoul said:


> long black socks!


Funny!


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