# Sticky  Buying Your First Bike on a Budget.



## QuiQuaeQuod

This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


----------



## JayTee

1. How much do I need to spend? There's no right answer here, just like there isn't a right answer to "how much does a house/car/jacket cost?" That being said, if you are on a budget, don't fear. The entry level stuff in the road bike world (usually Shimano Sora components on an aluminum frame) is durable and will give you many seasons of happy riding. If you really take to it, you'll find yourself lusting for more and better within 1-2 seasons, or if you are a very casual 1,000 miles per year rider or less, that entry level steed could last you a decade. Just take care of it.

2. How do I know if it fits? You'll get the same lecture over and over about the importance of fit, and people aren't lying. A too big or too small roadbike will truly take the joy out of riding. There are several good websites for bike sizing advice, including www.wrenchscience.com but for the true new rider, there's little to beat going to the local bike shop and spending a good amount of time with a knowledgeable salesperson. 

3. Can I get a better deal by buying used? Well, of course. The used bike market is notoriously soft, and that means that a used 2005 bike, for example, can cost 1/3 to 1/2 less than it did new on the floor. That $700 you want to spend can get you much more bang for the buck. But if you don't know what you are doing, you may wind up with a bike that doesn't fit, or has been crashed, has outdated components, yadda yadda. Unless you either know what you are doing or have a local friend to help, there's really value in getting your first road bike at the LBS. You'll get fit assistance, accessories discounts, and probably some complimentary service and adjustments. You'll have a relationship with someone to answer your questions, etc. 

4. Is Trek/Giant/Jamis/Motobecane, etc. any good? Look, don't PANIC over whether to buy the Trek 1000 or the Giant OCR3, or whatever. Bikes at a similar price point, especially in the budget range, are so similar that anyone who tries to tell you that one "sucks" and another is "so smooth" is blowing smoke. They might fit a little different with changes in geometry, just like jeans from different companies. In that respect, one may fit better than another. But to pretend there's a qualitative difference is pretty silly. 

Those are my preliminary thoughts for now!


----------



## MB1

*It ain't the bike, it is the shop.*



dr hoo said:


> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


If you don't know what you are doing find a shop that you like (or a shop where you like the employees). There is so little difference from brand to brand at similar prices until you are well over $1000 that the bike hardly matters. What does matter is the help you will get deciding on which of the many bikes and sizes available is right for you plus the service that you will get for free after the purchase.

Don't p-off the guys in the shop and you will get amazing service in the first months of ownership while you figure out what end is up. After a few months a 6-pack for the boys in the shop every so often will go a long way towards cementing a good relationship and pay you back many times over in "good guy" discounts and freebies. Doughnuts or home made treats work well too.....

MB1
A shop rat for over 30 years now

BTW if at all possible visit shops on weekdays or when the weather is bad. No matter what you do, how cute you may be or how much you are going to spend you just aren't going to get good service on a busy spring or summer weekend.


----------



## Run1stBike2nd

*Nothing too profound, but...*

1. When setting your budget for a new bike, always set aside a few hundred bucks for accessories such as helmet, tubes, patch kit, seat bag, etc. 1 flat tire 9 miles from home was all it took for me to learn my lesson.

2. It's all about the fit! Make sure your LBS employees take the time to fit you properly or find a new shop. If you don't ask for help with the fit, some shops won't bother with it. You will not want to ride an ill-fitting bike. Fit is overlooked by many 1st time bike buyers (myself included, but I lucked into 1 that fits well). Most 1st timers are more interested in a specific brand or color of bike. I'm astonished by how many folks I've seen in recent weeks riding the local recreational trails on "trail ready bikes" (Hybrids equipped w/ a handlebar mirror) that the LBS is pushing with either their knees pointing almost straight out to each side (seat too low), or their hips swaying dramatically with each pedal stroke (seat too high). The LBS employees could easily make the proper adjustments, but the people buying the bikes don't know any better.

Happy Buying and even Happier Riding!


----------



## funknuggets

I agree. If you are driven to RBR to ask such questions, then Im going to assume some general lack of knowledge. Its nothing bad, but there is a reason you are here on the beginners forum. MB1s advice is spot on. From shop to shop from Giant to Trek to Fuji, etc... all of the bikes at a certain price point will be pretty equal. All of the $799 bikes will have Sora, or Tiagra... or whatever comes on those types of bikes. But all of them will be about the same. The geometry will be different, though. As this will likely be a significant investment for you (otherwise you wouldn't be taking so much time investigating it)... then the shop is a good answer. Not only can they help you with fit, they will also often offer free maintenance for 3,6,12 months... or more... for routine stuff. Thats important if you aren't that good of a wrench. As you ride your bike more, it will get sloppy as you get cable stretch and wear, and thus this becomes more and more important. Bikes arent a science... but Ive seen experienced racers really screw up their drivetrains in a real short amount of time.

So... listen to MB1, listen to Kerry, listen to Bikeben... and there are others. But get you a bike that you are proud of and want to ride. Don't settle, cause you will be sorry... and upgrades are often more expensive than buying in a packaged bike so sometimes buying a little up, saves you money.


----------



## venus

Go to a bike shop & figure out what size you need & leave. Go to ebay & drill down to sports, cycling, road bikes & parts, complete bikes & frames. Click in your size range & look for a major brand with Shimano 105 at about 2 years old. This may take some patients but you can find a virtually new bike for half price. Buy it & ride it for a while till you figure out the details of what you really want. Sell it on ebay & move up.


----------



## MB1

*Then don't ever expect or ask to get any service at that shop.*



venus said:


> Go to a bike shop & figure out what size you need & leave. Go to ebay & drill down to sports, cycling, road bikes & parts, complete bikes & frames. Click in your size range & look for a major brand with Shimano 105 at about 2 years old. This may take some patients but you can find a virtually new bike for half price. Buy it & ride it for a while till you figure out the details of what you really want. Sell it on ebay & move up.


You think the guys in the shop don't know what is going on?

That 2 year old bike is going to need some service and adjustment to actually fit correctly.

I hope there at least 2 shops in your town.


----------



## venus

MB1 said:


> You think the guys in the shop don't know what is going on?
> 
> That 2 year old bike is going to need some service and adjustment to actually fit correctly.
> 
> I hope there at least 2 shops in your town.


Ok, you own a local bike shop. Dude, this is a SHAKEDOWN BIKE. Fitting a bike to a beginner can be done by seat for/aft & height. Not much else to it on your basic road bike. Getting a 105 road bike almost new on ebay for half price is the way to go. Fitting is all so much s*** that one figures out relitive to their unique issues on their own if they have half a brain.
You are a shop owner & will be ready when they want something all new. Keep your rep up & help the newbe w/ his ebay purchase bike. Developing a relationship is half the score. How else can local bike shops compete with internet sales?


----------



## QuiQuaeQuod

Actually, someone buying a first bike is VERY likely to need a GREAT relationship with a shop. When 500-600 will give you a solid ride, why not get in good with a shop? The free service and the help and advice will be more than worth it.

I bought our previous bikes at a garage sale, and a shop. Both were lightly used and cheap. They lasted us for 8 years. But then I don't need a shop, because I have been working on bikes for more years than that. 

First bike, get it at a local bike shop. Without question. That is my advice to 99% of people.


----------



## MB1

*LOL, of course not and I never would.*



venus said:


> Ok, you own a local bike shop.


 OTOH I have worked in all parts of the industry for more than 30 years (just 1 day a week now  ).

Old joke; "Tony, do you know how to make a small fortune in the bike business?" 

"Sure Mark, start with a large fortune." 


Truth hurts.


----------



## mbakercad

I had been mountain biking on and off for 7 years when I decided to give road biking a try. I was already looking at high end rigs but I knew I should try it out first so I set off looking for a used bike. I found an entry level Giant bike for $350. I loved it. After 2 years of riding I upgraded to a new bike and sold the Giant. I got $325 out of it and done nothing but clean the chain.


----------



## venus

MB1 said:


> OTOH I have worked in all parts of the industry for more than 30 years (just 1 day a week now  ).
> 
> Old joke; "Tony, do you know how to make a small fortune in the bike business?"
> 
> "Sure Mark, start with a large fortune."
> 
> 
> Truth hurts.


Hey, I was thinking of working for next to nothin at a local shop on weekends during Dec to build bikes & maybe learn how to tune an old Campy Record in exchange. Rebuilding a bottom bracket may not be rocket science but I respect the "touch" & little details learned w/ time.


----------



## QuiQuaeQuod

Here's the advice I usually give people when they ask me. And being the kind of guy I am I normally start by asking questions.

"What kind of riding do you want to do"?

Let's assume the answer indicates a road bike. In other words, is a road bike of some flavor right for you? Think about it. 

"How much do you want to spend"?

If you don't have gear, set aside at least $100 and better $200 for a helmet, shorts, and other accessories. For the bike itself, I say $500-600 US will get you a new road bike at a shop that will let you ride hard for 2 years. And remember, $730 dollars is a dollar a day for 2 years. Assuming you keep the chain clean and lubed and replace it once, you can put 10,000 miles on that bike, though that would trash it out unless you did more maintenance. For reference, if you ride 1000 miles your first year you will find yourself in a lot better shape.

Personally, I spent a grand on my latest bike, even though I could have spent more if I wanted to. I would have liked to have spent 3 grand sure, but really, it's just a bike. That other 2k will give me a lot of better returns elsewhere.

After price, I tell people to go to shops and test ride. Test the bike and interview (casually) the shop. A good shop is needed for newbies (unless you have a lot of years MTBing, in which case you are probably a good jackleg mechanic).

When riding, your position should have your torso at somewhere close to 45 degrees to the ground when on the hoods (top of brake levers). You will ride there a lot. And yes, you can use the brakes with your hands there.

Adjust the saddle. With the bike held upright by someone else, and you holding the bars and sitting in riding position, put one pedal down at "6 O'clock". Your heel should scrape it lightly when you swing your leg. When you put the ball of your foot on the pedal, your knee will bend to what will eventually be close to the perfect extension. It is not that yet. Lower the saddle a half inch (or a centimeter), and measure when you do to make sure you lower all the saddles on all the test rides the same amount.

If you really want to be sure, make sure the saddle is in the middle of the rails on each bike too. 

If you do all that, you will not only be in close to a perfect riding position, but better able to judge the BIKE, and not the effect of your position on the bike. Pick the bike that feels best from the shop that you felt the most comfortable with in terms of service. 

It's that simple 

That is what I tell people when they ask me.


----------



## collectorvelo

*Ebay*

more and more brand new products are being sold on EBAY

and Ebay is even coming out with EbayExpress that is all new items with only buy it now prices

You can find Brand new Road bikes on Ebay for under $300 almost all the time


----------



## QuiQuaeQuod

collectorvelo said:


> You can find Brand new Road bikes on Ebay for under $300 almost all the time


Yes, and they will work, but I would not suggest going that cheap unless you are really strapped for cash.

Besides, building a relationship with a shop is a very good thing for a new rider who does not know the first thing about wrenching on a bicycle.


----------



## JayTee

dr hoo said:


> Yes, and they will work, but I would not suggest going that cheap unless you are really strapped for cash.
> 
> Besides, building a relationship with a shop is a very good thing for a new rider who does not know the first thing about wrenching on a bicycle.



And by the time you pay for the shipping and the local bike build, you've spent an additional $100 on something that adds nothing to the quality of the bike. Reasonable minds can differ, but buying a no-name bike on eBay is not the approach I'd recommend to a new cyclist, even one with budget constraints. 

I do think that eBay is a terrific resource, and have twice bought bikes on eBay, but just not that weird no-name new stuff that's spec'd with all kinds of components you've never heard of, etc.


----------



## gadget

I did all of what was mentioned above. I shopped the LBS, Ebay, Craigslist etc...

I visited the LBS 3 seperate times and each time they fit me into a different bike. It always seemed to be the one they had the most of for like 400 more than I wanted to spend.

Yes I got some decent info about fit, but they always had me around $1200 which was past my budget for a 1st bike. 

I decided to narrow the field to the best bike with the following features: Carbon Fork, 105 & Tiagra combo........That was it period!!!

I found a 2006 Specialized Allez Sport or something with the gear I wanted for $600


----------



## bahueh

*what are you talking about?*



venus said:


> Ok, you own a local bike shop. Dude, this is a SHAKEDOWN BIKE. Fitting a bike to a beginner can be done by seat for/aft & height. Not much else to it on your basic road bike. Getting a 105 road bike almost new on ebay for half price is the way to go. Fitting is all so much s*** that one figures out relitive to their unique issues on their own if they have half a brain.
> You are a shop owner & will be ready when they want something all new. Keep your rep up & help the newbe w/ his ebay purchase bike. Developing a relationship is half the score. How else can local bike shops compete with internet sales?



if you think the only adjustments to a road bike are contained in the seat post...you need a bike SHAKEDOWN (whateve that means). Adjustments come in the form of stem length, bar drop, stem angle, shifter placement, seat height, seat distance fore/aft, crank length, pedal rise, seat angle, and Im' sure there are some others I'm forgetting...

sure, you can do all that yourself..but it requires parts and a bit of knowledge about what is what...and where to put it.


----------



## Breakfast

One of my favorite bikes was the cheapest to put together, it's a fixed gear. I have many geared bikes and yet my advice is to spend lots of money to help the economy and get the absolute best you can afford with your cash AND credit. Never buy a bike with compromises like cheap components. Aim for the fences!

You won't appreciate a middle of the road bike when you desire the top end. You've got to own a nice bike in order to learn to love a basic inexpensive fixed or singlespeed. I guess when you really know the difference you find you love cycling more than the bike. Then, you'll find you enjoy the feel more than the looks.


----------



## 633

dr hoo said:


> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


Boy, I think a lot of the posts on here about the value of buying your first bike at an LBS are living in some ideal fantasy world that rarely exists in reality. Yes, there are helpful shop employees out there, but there are also a lot of unhelpful ones who mainly want to sell a newbie whatever they can convince him he needs. And even the helpful ones who aren't trying to do that rarely have any kind of serious training in bike fit. 

Average LBS "fit" experience:

"Here, this one looks like it's about your size. Throw a leg over that and let's see if the clearance is right. Yep, looks good. This one fits."

I frequent several different LBSes, and even at the best one in the area, I often hear the floor guys give advice that makes me shudder. These guys are basically retail sales clerks with a little bit of knowledge of bicycles, just like the kid at Circuit City is a retail sales clerk with a little bit of knowledge of appliances.

Best thing a newbie can do is use a good online fit calculator, buy a $300 bike on eBay, ride it for a year or two until they figure out what they really want, build a relationship with an LBS by paying for service when they need it, and then once they've ridden for a while and their body has adjusted to riding, go spend the coin for a professional fit session and a better-quality bike.

If you really think you need an LBS experience, ask for the manager or assistant manager to help you. At least they're pretty likely to know what they're doing.


----------



## Edgecrusher

*Two more low cost bikes*

Here are links to two more - $400 dollar bicycles that would be great
to test the waters for a new road cyclist. No tax, $39 bucks for shipping. 

:thumbsup: 


http://www.pricepoint.com/detail/14297-018_PIARB5-3-Parts-47-Bikes/Piave-Poggio-Road-Bike.htm


http://www.pricepoint.com/detail/14296-018_CYKRB5-3-Parts-47-Bikes/Cytek-Road-Bike.htm


----------



## CFBlue

There seems to be some debate on wether a new cyclist can buy a bike over the internet and get what they need. I hope I can shed some light on the subject.

I started riding again a few years ago after about 8 years off the bike. I started to improve my health, and because I remembered how much I used to enjoy it. I had a crappy old bike sitting around from when I was younger, and I started with that. After some time I decided that I needed more bike. I was on a seriously tight budget, so I thought I could buy a bike one component at a time and save money. This was after looking around several bike shops and getting some sticker shock. Surely I could do better on my own. I know how bikes work, after all, I'm an engineer. I do all of my own car repairs, and I used to maintain my bike. I don't need a bike shop.

I ordered parts, and finally put together a bike. I clamped the CF seat post too tight, and had to replace it. I didn't like the saddle I bought, and had to buy another one. I rode on tires that were too narrow for a long time. I bought a computer that won't fit on the oversized handlebars that I was using. I made quite a few mistakes, but I learned. My bike isn't the lightest thing going, but neither am I. I ended up putting together a full Ultegra bike for about $1500. I didn't beat the bike shop's price by anything significant, and I had to have them install the head set, bottom bracket, and trim the steer tube.

The things I did right were to have a hefty wheel set built. I have been very happy with my wheels. I do like having Ultegra, but 105 would work just fine for me. When I have to replace this bike I will probably go that route. The price of the bike that I thought I could beat was $850. I missed that by a long shot. Did I get a better bike? Maybe. But my bike could fit better too.

If I had it to do over again, I would find a good bike shop. One that I am comfortable with. I would find one that has good mechanics, and I would spend some time getting to know them, and making sure they know what I want. Then I would get them to build a bike for me if I couldn't find one they have in stock that would do the trick. I would go with Shimano 105 components, but only because Campy is pricy in my opinion.


----------



## collectorvelo

*No-Name?*



jtolleson said:


> And by the time you pay for the shipping and the local bike build, you've spent an additional $100 on something that adds nothing to the quality of the bike. Reasonable minds can differ, but buying a no-name bike on eBay is not the approach I'd recommend to a new cyclist, even one with budget constraints.
> 
> I do think that eBay is a terrific resource, and have twice bought bikes on eBay, but just not that weird no-name new stuff that's spec'd with all kinds of components you've never heard of, etc.



There are probably 200 brands of bikes sold in the USA right now -- most coming out of the exact same factories in Taiwan and China

Which are 'no-name' brands? What criteria defines a no-name brand?

If the brand is not one of the top 10 selling brands - is it no name?
If the brand has no dealer within 100 miles of you - is it no name?
If the brand has been around for less than 25 years - is it no name?

'no-name' brand is a non-sense term with no clear definition
bikes have specs
specs are easy to understand
value is easy to evaluate


----------



## tamu

Big Bad John said:


> Surely I could do better on my own. I know how bikes work, after all, I'm an engineer. I do all of my own car repairs, and I used to maintain my bike. I don't need a bike shop.
> 
> I ordered parts, and finally put together a bike. I clamped the CF seat post too tight, and had to replace it. I didn't like the saddle I bought, and had to buy another one. I rode on tires that were too narrow for a long time. I bought a computer that won't fit on the oversized handlebars that I was using. I made quite a few mistakes, but I learned.


doing some research would help alot.. also being carful..

i goto the bike shop near me and use their tools.. i swap out my bottom brackets and stuff..

(i wonder if by install a headset you meant press in the cups?) because with some common sense not long after i got into biking i built a complete bike up for my girlfriend from nothing.. 

i built wheels, installed fork/headset, cranks, casset, deraileur and adjusted it, bars, stem.. 

about the only thing i didnt do was cut the fork and install the star but.. i got a fork off another bike.. 

if you are clever enough, you can do these things yourself.. and even if you dont know, there are online guides.. or just go in the shop and ask!

i think the hardest thing to figure out on a bike is the deraileurs.. and after a 20 second explination that went something like "the screws set the limits, how far out and how far in the deraileur will go. make sure you cannot shift into the spokes. adjust the cable slack so the chain fits on the cogs well"
i could magically do it myself


get the frame, off of those demensions, get steat post and fork.. stem off of the fork, bars off of the stem..

dont be afraid to put on parts from other bikes to make this one rideable .. you dont have to get everything at once..


----------



## spyro

Here is a best of both worlds approch my friend used to get a great road bike put together, and it would work well for a noob.

Go to lbs at the end of the season, find a good deal on a bike that fits, get all that fit help ect. Buy said entry level bike for 500$ or so. Ride said bike all you want, while at the same time shop around for new parts, upgrades ect. Before long you have a great bike with nice components. Added bonus for getting those people looking at your bike and dismissing it because it is a cheep frame then putting it on the scale and having it weigh the same or less than their 2000$ bike 

Seriously it gives you the advantage of having a bike, having a good relationship with your LBS and in the end having good solid components.


----------



## NeedhamDave

*what are the real tradeoffs in going cheaper*

I don't have the answers...just hoping someone will post a response...

I know the shimano spec line; i.e. ultegra, 105, tiagra, sora...but what does it really mean for a newbie? Went looking for a road bike for my wife last night and, at one shop, seemed like the entry level option they wanted to offer was the Trek 1500 for around $1200 or so. Another shop had a Raleigh Supercourse for 999. The Raleigh has 105 chainring and ultegra cassette. It seems a good deal. But I've already bought into this whole name-game of quality and I don't really know what it means for my wife. (In fairness to the first shop, I started off by saying I wanted a 105 component bike; second shop, I said budget 600-1000.)

We got home and had the "Why should anyone have to pay $1000 for a bike?" conversation. I don't want to pressure her into getting the 105/Ultegra bike, but I also don't want to "cheap out" and get some clunky thing that constantly needs adjustment and is a POS.

So, what really matters; i.e. what does 105 buy you over Tiagra or something else?

Is it component weight? That doesn't matter for our purposes.

Is it durability? OK, but does that mean the parts last longer (not so relevent if you plan to ride 1000 miles a year) or does it mean the parts need a lot of adjustment and tweaking to keep the shifting smooth? I don't want to have my wife riding a bike that I have to do maintenence on every week before we go for a ride.

It helps to start with a budget, I know, and our budget was essentially "under 1000." So, big suprise, we found a bike for $999. But now I am thinking our budget should really be more like $600. So, once you go there, what exactly are the tradeoffs?


----------



## QuiQuaeQuod

NeedhamDave said:


> I don't have the answers...just hoping someone will post a response...



The short answer that I usually give is that 105 will keep you happy if you become a "serious" cyclist, lower levels may not. 105 will shift a bit better, feel a bit nicer, and work overall slightly better. 105 is usually considered the lowest "raceable" level.

I am a serious cyclist in that I ride road, mtb, and commute, and to be honest I bought a road bike with lower than 105 and it works fine for me. (campy mirage, not shimano, but the quality jumps are similar.) On the trail with MTB components I think it makes a lot more difference, on the road, not so much. With my mirage components, the biggest thing I dislike is the plastic shift levers. I wish they were metal. But this is the second year, and it doesn't take much to keep it running and shifting smooth. Other than an issue with the rear wheel, but my wife has the same wheels and her's has had no problems. I'm just hard on rear wheels.

Our bikes work fine. And for 1000 miles a year, the 600-800 range bikes will get you 3 years before you have to replace anything other than _maybe_ tires. You can easily get many, many more years out of them without doing more than routine things like chain, bottom bracket, and hubs.

You might regret it, but only if you go out and feel up or ride more expensive bikes.

That being said, I suggest you take your wife out and have her ride the bikes at the price points. Then let her decide. If she can't tell the difference, don't pay the money. If she can, and cares about the difference, spend it. If she is happy, she will be more likely to ride it.


----------



## Gears4brains

Maybe getting a used but good condition bicycle will save you some $$$
got great deals on ebay(watch out for scams) and in selling ads(iwanta) got me a bianchi eros 2002 bought for 400, retail new $1100 (around 600 on ebay) and the guy included a shirt ($50), pants, shimano shoes($99),cannondale gloves (25),computer,some more colthing and a crappy helmet...it was a steal


----------



## justsomeguy3116

dr hoo said:


> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


Read some reviews and ride all the bikes! I think the winner in the Bicycling mag beginner bike comparo was the Trek 1000, if you want a less agressive bike but won't want to ride a Pilot (who does), try the Lemond Etape. Same bike as the Trek, but less aggressive riding position.


----------



## Insight Driver

I don't want to debate the merits and pitfalls of online sales. I do want, to, however, point out some factors that a new person interested in getting a bike should think about. Although a bike is mechanically simple, not everyone wants to fix their own bike. I even know some experienced road people that take a flat to an LBS to fix. Unless you have had some experience with adjusting a bike for proper shifting and such, the empirical approach can get things really screwed up. Leaving a stem too loose, or trying to force the left pedal on in the wrong direction can cross-thread and ruin a crank. A new person would not have the experience in inspection to see if a bike had a safety flaw in it.

At a bike shop where you find conscientious personnel you benefit from their experience. Bike shops do vary so it does take some due diligence on a person to visit different shops to find the better ones. Some people don't have the choices a person living in a metropolitan area would have. Any adjustment problems a new bike may have can be fixed by the shop for free. A bike bought off E-Bay can be taken to a shop for adjustment, but it will cost extra and labor rates may be steeper than a person would think is fair.

A new bike has a warranty. Flaws happen, that's life. At least with a major brand bought at a local bike shop you can get it fixed or replaced.

All new bikes have cable stretch. Gears and brakes go out of adjustment. All shops offer a free tune-up of a new bike for the first six months or a year.

Do understand that there are good $650 bikes in local bike shops. They will try to up-sell you so you, as a consumer, must stick to your guns. A good salesman knows when to back off.

Proper fit is more than adjusting seat setback and height. Especially with a new rider, most bikes have top tube lengths longer than optimum for them. Such is the market, most bikes have a racing geometry. For this reason a good bike shop will also change your stem and rise to get the handlebars higher than a racer would have it. Because people vary in fitness it's better to set a new rider with a more upright position than a racer would have. 

A person just getting into biking again after a long hiatus may need the help that only experience can give. When you aren't spending a lot of money, it makes more sense to rely on the experience of a good bike shop. There are good ones and bad ones out there, so look for a good one.

If you are mechanically inclined, and obviously web-connected, there are a lot of online resources for wrenching a bike and for setting a bike up for proper fit. Do take the time to read up and research. Download and print out the manuals for the components on your bike. Check forums for issues with certain brands of components and typical set-up problems. If you don't know much about fit, find a good online fit calculator and have someone help measure you up. As long as you know the approximate size of frame that fits, you can dial one in that is slightly small or large. But then, again, because geometry varies, you don't know if you need slightly small or large until you ride enough to get a sense for that. So, the bottom line, as I see it, is that an inexperienced person is ill-advised to by a bike online to save money, the pitfalls are too numerous and deep.


----------



## sekaijin

I think there is a sensible middle ground between buying at the LBS and buying on eBay: buy a used bike locally, off craigslist or other local online classifieds, and then get it serviced at the LBS (possibly even the seller's LBS).

Check the local listings daily for freebies, deals, and swaps, on bikes and on parts/accessories. It can pay off big, if you are patient and disciplined about when to pounce and when to pass.

Unlike eBay: 1) you can try before you buy; 2) no shipping; 3) no scams.

Saves a lot of money compared with buying at the LBS or even eBay. Bring the bike in for service and you still build an LBS relationship. Ask the seller where they bought and serviced the bike, and bring it back there.

Most first-time bike buyers won’t be doing complex maintenance and repairs themselves right away, just the easier stuff at first.

The biggest challenge in buying used is fit, but then that’s always an issue with a first bike. You learn what fits from how your first bike does not exactly. Then you do better selecting your 2nd bike. 

This strategy works great especially if you are willing to ride old stuff (which sounds better if you call it “vintage steel”). It also helps if you have an LBS where they are into older bikes. 

It’s working for me, with help from Zinn’s bike maintenance book and RBR.


----------



## HardCharger

*Research is very important...*

I'm new to higher-end road bikes, but not to bikes in general. Lucky for me I learned how to build, adjust & maintain bikes from my Grandfather many years ago. 

Now I know most folks don't or won't have that type of background so here's my take.

When I was an avid mtn bike rider from '87 to '94, I did lots of research before plunking down my hard earned cash for each ride as I progressed in that sport. Remember, this was before the www(dot)world. So what I did was go to the local bikes shops, ride the floor models & ask questions, lots of questions. A bike is just like any other purchase, it can be made on whim or it can be a careful exercise in comparisons. I picked up as many brochures as I could to compare apples to apples & apples to oranges, meaning bikes out of my price range both above & below. This way I could browse the bikes' specs at home without the pressure of commission driven sales folks telling what they "think" I should get. 

This is not to take away the expertise that can only be found by talking to an experienced & knowledgable professional, it's just removing the hard sell element by not being so focused or rushed on the "purchase." But if you find a bike that suits you right from the get go & fits the budget by all means consider buying it! Sometimes this works great.

My latest purchase to replace my (now sold) 20-year old Trek 310 Elance road bike was through the web but I bought & picked it up locally. But again, I had a bike that I could reference back to for sizing & fit so I took my time & I checked the manufacturer's web sites to get the specs on the bikes I was looking at in cyberspace. I also read the many reviews posted here as well. All this paid huge dividends for me. I was able to get (& then fit) a nearly new $1,100 bike ('05 Felt F70) for less than $700! And the bike was originally listed for sale at $750. But by doing research, I learned a few important things that helped me with negotiating a better deal. The price I paid ended up being almost 40% off the MSRP!

Granted, this way may not be the best approach for a beginner to purchase their first bike, but if you do your homework by visiting the LBS, test riding bikes that interest you & by browsing online you can come up with the right bike, with the right specs for your intended use & you can be armed with the knowledge of what it should cost.

Hope this helps...


----------



## seattlesyclist

*Giant vs. Raleigh vs. Redline*

I've been looking at the specs for various bikes, and am trying to educate myself before I fork out the dough. Sorry for the length of this post, but I am a relative newbie when it comes to bikes (riding for 9 months) and I am getting totally hooked on it.

I am looking for a good-weather commuter bike that also works on the road--I want to ride the 210-mile Seattle to Portland event in the summer. I ride 12-27 miles each way to work, and have several rolling hills with 10-15 degree grade. My LBS, which has been incredibly helpful with advice and freeby minor adjustments on my Trek 720 MultiTrack, carries Giant, Raleigh and Redline; I looked at Jake the Snake but can't handle the optic green.

*1. Carbon Fork. *The Raleigh Rx 1.0 has a full carbon fork, while the Giant OCR 1 & 2, the Raleigh Cadent 2.0 and the Redline Conquest Pro have carbon with an aluminum steerer, and the Redline Conquest has an aluminum fork with disc tabs.

I've read the thread about carbon forks and safety, but I cannot tell what the performance difference is and whether it is worth considering as a factor.

2. All of the bikes have a Shimano 105 rear derailleur. As for the rest of the components, the Giant OCR 1and Redline Conquest Pro have primarily Shimano 105 while the others are primarily Shimano Tiagra with an occasional 105 thrown in.

For my riding needs, is there enough of a difference between the Tiagra and 105 that I should spend the extra money?

3. For commuting up and down hills (10-15 degree grade), how many chainrings would I need? The Giant OCR 1 & 2, and the Raleigh Cadent 2.0 have 3 chainrings, while the Raleigh Rx 1.0, and the Redline Conquest and Conquest Pro have only two. Since I tend to chicken out at around 35-40 mph downhill, I really need something suited for climbing hills and riding flats rather than for downhill speed.

Would 2 chainrings be enough?


----------



## John Nelson

seattlesyclist: This thread is a list of general advice. For specific advice on your situation, I suggest you start your own thread. That way we won't pollute this thread. See you soon in another thread.


----------



## seattlesyclist

Good suggestion. Will do.


----------



## Stang37

*Bought my first bike this week- a Newbies experience*

So, I was looking to up my fitness riding over burning my legs out in the first 20 minutes aboard my mountain bike and started the search for a road bike. There really was no aerobic work being done here and I have not been a hardcore rider. I was pushing a Haro V3 with street slicks, but, of course, the gearing wasn't made for high speeds on flattop. Thus began my inexperienced search for a road bike. I initially thought an urban/hybrid Marin would do the trick, but quickly found I might wish to go full on into road, so I researched other options. 

Initially I checked the LBS, but am always leery of answers from salesmen as well as inflated prices so I went to Ebay. Generally, I knew my frame size and was recommended initially to get a medium frame. I knew I could beat the LBS price through Ebay ( and I could have) but I was never sold on getting the fit right for myself. I looked at the Motobecane Record and an Ironhorse, each with decent(?) components, but in reading reviews noticed that there was some question about the Motobecane name and heritage and few reviews on Ironhorse. So, I started to research the preferred components and let that be my guide. It appeared that Sora was looked upon with disdain, but Tiagra is acceptable so I began there. I narrowed my search to Trek, Fuji and Giant (all offered by LBS's) given the reputation and commonality. I aimed for the Tiagra equipped OCR and Newest lines of bikes. I decided I was not knowledgeable enough to purchase through Ebay and ran the risk of quickly becoming upset with my choice due to my competitive spirit.

I chose to go and see one of the LBS's I had visited. My second visit entailed good personal service to find the correct framesize. As I said, one of the LBS's put me in a medium, but my legs were fully extended from the seat to pedal when we tried an OCR 2. So we tried a small instead. Much more comfortable and surely the right decision had already been made about going to the LBS. At this point I made another appointment to tailor a fit and purchase the right bike. I changed my appt 3 times in single day, but the owner still met me at 7 AM on a Wednesday to fit me. We spent 1.5 hrs dialing in the shoes, seat heat and position, stem placement, etc. The owner had me ride in place for 15-20 minutes to ensure a 'temporary' proper fit as we tweaked here and there and practiced mount and dismount with the clips. Turns out he noticed a run of poor Shimano clips and replaced mine with better Cannondales (free) as my right shoe would not clip in. I purchased the expected amount of extra gear (tube, patches, inflater, tools, bottle cage, shoes, mid level computer) with a 10-15% discount from the owner. I began this search looking in the $500 range, but recognized that my taste, desire and research could better spend my money where I truly wanted it so I accepted a greater investment. 

I ended up purchasing a 2006 OCR 1 with the 105 suite stock. I was immediately impressed with the ride which was made sweeter by the riding plan the LBS owner prescribed for me. He encouraged me to evaluate some points on my bike as I rode and asked me to return after a few hundred miles to readjust the riding position as I gained confidence and experience. Good for business of course, but I felt like I was appreciated and not expected to figure out future adjustments on my own. In the end, I did spend more ($1300 total), but I feel I will reap the benefits as my riding progresses. I also got some decent discounts and feel assured I will receive the same personalized service with each visit. I also learned a few things about fit that I would have missed or gotten wrong by choosing Ebay. That's my experience.


----------



## jeanes

I've just got into cycling about a year ago and have been using my mountain bike for most of my cycling needs. I'm thinking of upgrading to a good value road bike,but tossing up between trek 1000 or giant ocr 3? Any recomendations


----------



## gallorody

*My first Road Bike*

I finally bought my first road bike. I've been mountain biking for about six years, but ever since I moved to San Diego, CA I've been riding on the road more and more. I thought the only logical thing to do was to buy a road bike. 
A week ago last friday I bought a 2004 Trek 5000 in mint condition for $900.

Do you think I got a good deal. I think I did, what do you think?

Here are the Specs;

FRAMESET:
FRAME: OCLV 120 Carbon
FORK: Carbon with alloy steerer 

WHEELS:
WHEELS: Bontrager Race
TIRES: Bontrager Race Lite, 700x23c 

DRIVETRAIN:
SHIFTERS: Shimano Ultegra
FRONT DERAILLEUR: Shimano 105
REAR DERAILLEUR: Shimano Ultegra
CRANKSET: Shimano Ultegra 53/39
CASSETTE: Shimano HG-70 12-25, 9 speed
PEDALS: N/A 

COMPONENTS:
SADDLE: was upgraded, but I don't remember the brand. 
SEATPOST: Bontrager Race Carbon
HANDLEBARS: Bontrager Race Lite
STEM: Bontrager Race Lite, 31.8, 7 degree
HEADSET: Cane Creek C-1
BRAKESET: Shimano 105


----------



## gallorody

*My new first road bike*

I finally bought my first road bike. I've been mountain biking for about six years, but ever since I moved to San Diego, CA I've been riding on the road more and more. I thought the only logical thing to do was to buy a road bike. 
A week ago last friday I bought a 2004 Trek 5000 in mint condition for $900.

Do you think I got a good deal. I think I did, what do you think?

Here are the Specs;

FRAMESET:
FRAME: OCLV 120 Carbon
FORK: Carbon with alloy steerer 

WHEELS:
WHEELS: Bontrager Race
TIRES: Bontrager Race Lite, 700x23c 

DRIVETRAIN:
SHIFTERS: Shimano Ultegra
FRONT DERAILLEUR: Shimano 105
REAR DERAILLEUR: Shimano Ultegra
CRANKSET: Shimano Ultegra 53/39
CASSETTE: Shimano HG-70 12-25, 9 speed
PEDALS: N/A 

COMPONENTS:
SADDLE: was upgraded, but I don't remember the brand. 
SEATPOST: Bontrager Race Carbon
HANDLEBARS: Bontrager Race Lite
STEM: Bontrager Race Lite, 31.8, 7 degree
HEADSET: Cane Creek C-1
BRAKESET: Shimano 105 

View attachment 80565


----------



## bornfred

*LBS gone*

the LBS closed in my town, shortly after I bought my first "good bike" at a sporting goods store (cheap). I've been ashamed ever since. But mostly I miss the shop.My next bike will come from lbs in the next town and I hope for a better fit.


----------



## Alx

Are roadies not that mechanically inclined? Why is adjusting your gears and brakes such a hard thing to do? It isn't and I think anyone who purchases a bike that requires you to do such things only helps you as a rider so you know exactly what every component does and its limit.
I just purchased my first road bike as well, online from bikesdirect and I didn't spend the $600+ prices being quoted here to get a "good" beginner's bike. Its not really about how much you spend on your first bike but rather how well you take care of it.


----------



## scwolf

As a newbie going through the experience right now, I can tell you a few pitfalls I did not plan for:
1. Too much "research" causing me to spend more than I originally expected, because after reading way too many reviews on this site and others you start adding to your budget, justifying the that you need 105 instead of Tiagra.

2. Who knew helmets, shoes, shorts, gloves, socks, and a jersey would add up to another $200?? Not to mention that most new riders DO NOT LIKE those wierd narrow race seats that come standard even on budget wannabe racers - so that's another $50-70 to replace the seat, but a LBS will replace for free some of their in house items (mine did) if you like something of similar value better.

3. Unlike internet sales where there are no return policies if "used", a LBS will normally give you a 1-2 week exchange policy if they didn't get the fit right (mine is giving me 60 days to try out as many sizes/models as I need to until they get it down).

4. I originally intended to buy used on Ebay, then new from Ebay retailers, then used "top notch" brands on Ebay, and then I realized that I didn't have enough experience with geometry to project what I can expect from the handling of a bike just by looking at the dimensions of the bike. I'm not a young guy anymore, and the last thing I wanted to do was be stuck with a Cannondale racer that would shake my fillings loose when I wanted a long distance rider. The good news is if you want a racer, they are a dime a dozen as that appears to be the geometry du jour. 

My needs required the assistance of a helpful LBS, despite all my internet research and hope to save money.


----------



## rkb

Hello- Lots of good info, but what about the different types of road bikes (geo). I'm a mountain biker who has invested a fair amount in a bike (santa cruz) and I'm am getting the bug to hit the road. I am not scared of making an reasonable investment (2000-3000 clams), but where do I begin. It seems that in road biking as in mtn biking everyone has an opinion, whats the best ever for one is the biggest POS for another. I am not interested in racing a tri, just going out there and spinning for a few hours and not get hit by a car.


----------



## scwolf

rkb,

The best advice I can give, and this is what I learned over the last several months of hunting for my "perfect bike" in the $2k-3k range, is to go to as many LBS with the largest selection of bikes as possible. They will all give you test rides, and their personal favorites from their selected brands. The good news for you is that because you are not a serious racer, you don't need the cutting edge aggressive geometry to squeeze every last inch of performance out of your bike. You can go with a little more relaxed, but still fast, geometry, which appears to be trendy at the moment. Two of those types of bikes I've enjoyed testing have been: Bianchi 928 C2C and Specialized Roubaix. There are also small makers like Gunnar, Heron, Waterford and Rivendell who have similar models.


----------



## dank1423

I want to start riding and i dont have the thousand bucks to get a bike from a shop... i dont know anything about what makes a good bike and what i should be looking for in a good bike... iv e been looking around and i found a Motobecane Super Mirage for $340 on ebay shipped, and the specs are: 

Frame is full Dura Forte Chrome Moly - including the sloping chrown fork ~ other specs are Aluminum quick release hubs, Alex Aluminum rims, 24-speed Shimano Sora der with Triple Alloy crank, Shimano Sora STI shifters (brakes and shifters built into the same lever ), Maxxis high pressure tires, M-wings aluminum handlebar & seatpost, with a great comfortable seat and Aluminum road pedals with Toe Clips and straps.... 

is any of that good or is it bottom of the line crap, again i know nothing about biking but i want to get inot it so any input on this bike would be greatly appreciated


----------



## scwolf

If your price range is sub-$500, then you at least need to be properly fitted to the right sized bike. Go to any number of online sites for a general idea of what bike "size" you are, and from there you can either get new "cheapo" or used 90's era but higher quality bike from Ebay/Craigslist.

Refrain from buying a bike immediately (buyer's remorse) and spend a lot of time reading all the review and old posts on these and other bicycle forums to be informed about what sort of road bikes are out there, geometry, riding styles, and then you can be an informed buyer. It may take a few weeks, but it will be worth it in the end.

Shimano Sora is indeed bottom of the line, but not necessarily "crap", however, if you are going to take this bike "racing" or serious group riding, then the Sora will not last very long. You would have to upgrade some of your drivetrain/shifting components to 105, and that alone costs $200-$300.

But if all you're doing is looking for a good time on leisurely rides like the guys on beach cruisers, then you won't notice the lowe end componentry.


----------



## iherald

Here are my thoughts. I ride a lot. I bought my first 'good' mountain bike from a friend for a good price, and my first 'good' road bike from a store. I will say that after having been riding both for a while, the store one was a better buy. It just fits me a lot better.

When I was at the store, the bike that was the proper size for my height felt too stretched out, so they switched out the stem and I was cooking. I also got a discount on a lot of accessories I needed.

I have never bought a bike on Ebay, so I can't comment on that. I have bought a used bike on Craigslist, and I was pretty happy with it. That said, I still had problems with it (stuck stem, 27 inch tires versus 700c that I had laying around, etc). 

All that is to say, that for me, for the first bike, I'd buy from a store. Most stores have a 12 or 18 month free service plan, which is useful for the average rider. If only to try and fix the problems that you caused your self trying to take the bike apart (been there, done that!)


----------



## BLMcKee

*Newbie needs advice*

Okay, I know a lot of you dont like the ebay option from reading this thread, but I am just wanting to give this a try, if I like it, I may spend a lot of money on a bike later on. Right now I just want something to get me by. So let me know what you guys think of this bike on ebay. It is 199 plus 39 shipping, and im about 5'9". Thanks for the help.





THIS IS A BRAND NEW 2007 DAWES LIGHTNING SPORT ROAD BIKE


DAWES is a super brand that I have sold thousands of; and you can find info on the excellent quality of Dawes bicycles in my feedbacks or in a google search.

JUST IN > 2007 VERSION OF MY BIGGEST SELLING BIKE! I HAVE OVER 2000 HAPPY CUSTOMERS RIDING THIS BIKE. EXCELLENT DEAL THAT I ALWAYS SELL OUT OF QUICKLY.

You can also visit www.dawescyclesusa.com

DAWES LIGHTNING SPORT has a list price of $495 and I can sell them for just $199 plus $39 shipping in the Continental USA. {must be made for via PAYPAL - I have no other way to collect funds}

FEATURES OF THIS BIKE ARE EXCELLENT:

Full Chrome-moly Dura-Forte Frame and fork; with Alex Aluminum rims, Shimano 2200 14-speed der's with stem indexed shifters, Maxxis 130 PSI 700c tires, quick release wheels front and rear, aluminum alloy hubs, SHIMANOaluminum crank, Aluminum alloy pedals including toe clips with straps, aluminum stem, aluminum handlebar, aluminum seatpost, ProMax aluminum side-pull brakes and levers, plus a very nice Velo Road bike seat.

THIS LISTING IS MEDIUM - 56cm MEASURED CENTER TO TOP - and RIDERS 5'8" TO 5'11" WOULD FEEL COMFORTABLE ON THIS SIZE [BUT I AM ALSO LISTING THE OTHER SIZES] STANDOVER HEIGHT IS 31 INCHES

Please check my feedback - I am very quick to ship and like making customers happy. 

I am sorry the pictures are not better; but this is a very nice looking bike and rides really great.

DO NOT BE FOOLED BY THE LOW PRICE! THIS IS A GREAT BIKE:: FUN - COMFORTABLE - FAST - and DURABLE. Nothing comes close at this price. . {this is great BIKE SHOP QUALITY BIKE - not a WalMart level bike!}

Buyer pays the $39 shipping and handlingin the 48 connected states; and must pay with PAYPAL. 

I feel if you are just wanting to get started in road cycling, this bike is a great place to start. It is brand new and the color is SILVER or RED { PLEASE TELL ME WHICH COLOR YOU WANT WHEN YOU PAY}


----------



## rkb

Well all I did it- I just ordered a shiny new Bianchi 928 C2C Ultegra as my first roadbike. After spending most of my time dodging cedar trees and boulders on my Santa Cruz Heckler I am looking forward to going fast on the open road. RB review member SCWOLF recommended the 928 to me, I tested it out and fell in love. Thanks to everyone for their input.


----------



## Alx

BLMcKee said:


> Okay, I know a lot of you dont like the ebay option from reading this thread, but I am just wanting to give this a try, if I like it, I may spend a lot of money on a bike later on. Right now I just want something to get me by. So let me know what you guys think of this bike on ebay. It is 199 plus 39 shipping, and im about 5'9". Thanks for the help.


That looks like bikesdirect.com ebay listing. I bought my recent bike from them and couldn't be happier, the bike got shipped super-fast and its exactly what the description was. I know I didn't purchase a rare italian made bike but first off i'm new to the sport, second i'm not gonna race or enter any triathlons so it fits me just well, and also most of these manufacturers get their frames built in the same factories in Taiwan. The higher price just usually goes towards higher-end components and more established name brands. 

As far as durability in the sora components, that what my bike has and it shifts just as well as all the other high price bikes I looked at. I don't see how they won't last as long as the higher end components since they're usually installed on bikes that are gonna be used for recreational use anyways.

If you're just starting get what you can afford now and ride it till the wheels fall off so to speak. If you ride so many miles that you wear it out then you're really into the sport and buying a higher-end bike won't seem like such a commitment after all.


----------



## Kung Fu Felice

Congrats on the 928! I have a C2C as well and I absolutely love the ride. I don't plan on racing, just training hard, so the feel is perfect for me. I honestly believe the 928 C2C is the sleeper frame of 2007. It's more laid back geometry excludes it from most serious conversations, but for people who want a great road bike that's comfortable and are considering the Pilot and Roubaix, they have to also give the C2C a spin. 

And best of all? The cool metal badge that says "made in italy". Not that it implies this bike is in any way better than the ones from the Far East, but rather, it just pulls at my sense of heritage: an Italian legend made in Italy. Most of the other Bianchi models on the US website (models not labeled "reparto corse" or not on the European Bianchi site) are made in in the far east - no biggy, but still, something is lost.


----------



## ethebull

*Get some good advice*

And carefully weigh the risk/reward of buying from places like bikesdirect. 

This tread has basically two camps. Those who favor a LBS vs. those who prefer internet stores or eBay, with a dash of buy used advice. Sad to read so many comments about poorly trained clerks staffing your LBS. Perhaps I am spoiled living in a sprawling metropolitan area with 100 shops to choose from with-in an hour's drive. That level of competition tends to weed out the bs pretenders.

To get the best service, visit shops on a week day when it's less busy. Talk to a few of the staff and get a sense of their passion and knowledge. A good store will take on and exude a certain personality. Look for a comfortable fit - not of a bike, but of the vibe of the store. Visit several stores. Even if you decide to go e-biz, a top shelf LBS can be a great source of information, camaraderie, ride hook-ups,... my local favorite has potluck socials and an on staff home brewer who brings his mini kegs :thumbsup: The best deals are offered in the fall, winter, and early spring on the previous year models.

Well maybe your selection of LBS's didn't measure up. The notion of saving 20-40% at internet.biz cannot be ignored. You are savvy about doing your homework and money can be saved. 

Best sizing guide/chart:

http://davesbikeblog.blogspot.com/2006/02/different-thought-on-frame-sizing.html
http://www.prodigalchild.net/MoultonFrameSizeChart.pdf

Keep in mind the lowest priced outlets offer the least flexibility. You’ll pay for a complete bike as is. Some of your initial savings will be eroded by purchasing the right stem, tires, saddle, etc. Better outfits like Colorado Cyclist, offer an extensive menu of choices. You might save 10 or 20% through them.

What if you don’t like your new bike? Check the return / exchange policy. Most e-biz companies offer no return/exchange once ridden. Many local bike shops have the same policy or very strict limits. Others are very flexible so it’s important to ask.

I would only recommend going ebay, used, or e-biz if you are comfortable with most basic repairs and adjustments. Can you true and retention a wheel? New bikes tend need this after a few hundred hard miles. Are you able to identify a trashed worn-out drive-train that’s been carefully scrubbed clean? If you are an all thumbs type, stick to the LBS, but have them show you how to repair a flat. 

New cyclists often evolve into very self sufficient knowledgeable gearheads. Where do you fall on the bell curve?


----------



## ksjack

*Never online!*

Don't ever buy a bike from someone you can't punch in the face.


----------



## dsilver668

Honestly I have been wondering about what to do. I am trying not to get caught up in all the hype, and I have been looking and researching and sizing. I am a fix it kinda guy. I rebuilt the heads on my moms 68 Mustang, I built the kitchen in my house, redid the bathroom, put shelving in the garage, well you get the idea... 
I love the SRAM Grouppo. I know there were a few issues with brakes and the BB needs tightening after a couple of weeks but I like the shifters better than Shamino STI or Champy. I was drooling over the Specialized Tarmac S-Works SRAM Force bike it it costs WAY TO MUCH!!!! Anyway I was also looking at the Pedal force QS2 with SRAM Rival GROUPPO. It comes out to around $2,200 USD with speedplay x5 pedels. The closest thing I could find with similar components was around $4,400, but you also have to build it or have it buit. What I would like to do is find a bike shop that will let me play intern and learn, but I like projects like that..


----------



## thedips

ksjack said:


> Don't ever buy a bike from someone you can't punch in the face.


hahahhaha +1 :thumbsup:


----------



## Muaythaibike

You guys are a little crazy. Build a relationship with the LBS? The LBS is just like any other business in your local area... They should service you the same way if you are loyal to them or get in and get sized and then buy over the internet. At the end of the day it is all about money and service. If yiu dont get the service to need just ask for the manager. Much of their profits comes from service and not sales.


----------



## HannahG

I just wanted to really thank everyone who put in some great advice on this thread (funknuggets, MB1, dr hoo, etc). With your tips, as well as the great staff at the LBS, I found the perfect bike for me It may not be the fanciest, but it's exactly what fits my skill and price level (we high schoolers don't exactly have that much extra $$)
Thanks!


----------



## schwinnfan4ever

from my "previous experences" with bikes bought on places like -ebay- and -amazon- it soon became obvouse that money spent on bikes at internet sites are not worth the time, effort, or thought that is put into buying a new bike from them. instead I would suggest and even get on my ->knee's<- and beg you not to waste your time on webpages like those but instead buy from your local bike shop because even as some has said not all bike shop retailers are interested in your fit but in your cash that is why i suggest visting fourms like these and other webpages to gather information on your desired bike,fit, ect. before going to a shop and be sure to double check or even triple check all the information you obtain because alot of websites have alot of faulse information. I ended up buying two brand new bikes from mainstreet bike(ky) shop and found that by see'ing what you buy before hand can help you decide if the fit, performance, and componates are what you are looking for and it can also help you decide what kind of riding you are wanting to do weither it is a mountain bike, road bike, or hybrid.


----------



## bikesdirect

schwinnfan4ever said:


> from my "previous experences" with bikes bought on places like -ebay- and -amazon- it soon became obvouse that money spent on bikes at internet sites are not worth the time, effort, or thought that is put into buying a new bike from them. instead I would suggest and even get on my ->knee's<- and beg you not to waste your time on webpages like those but instead buy from your local bike shop because even as some has said not all bike shop retailers are interested in your fit but in your cash that is why i suggest visting fourms like these and other webpages to gather information on your desired bike,fit, ect. before going to a shop and be sure to double check or even triple check all the information you obtain because alot of websites have alot of faulse information. I ended up buying two brand new bikes from mainstreet bike(ky) shop and found that by see'ing what you buy before hand can help you decide if the fit, performance, and componates are what you are looking for and it can also help you decide what kind of riding you are wanting to do weither it is a mountain bike, road bike, or hybrid.



This is very bad advise; and it will become more clear how bad this advise is as time goes by.

Thousands of people are buying bikes and other items online and saving tons of money. And you do not need to be some type of expert in order to figure out what to buy, what size you need, or how to setup. It is insulting to tell someone that if they are a beginning cyclist that they are not smart enough to figure things out.

Our average customer is much more educated than the average bike shop employee. And all are smart enough to do a little research.

In 2009 mode year; prices are increasing by about 20%. This will put entry road bikes at $800 to $900 with Shimano 2200 basic parts. Many new riders will skip road biking if they have to start at $1000 for bike, tax, and helmet. Lots will try out road bikes if they can get a nice new road bike at $400 or $500. 

We have sold thousands of road bikes at under $500 and customers love them. And why not; they are the same as bikes in shops that are running $800 or more. Many of our buyers at this level end up commuting or even doing cross country tours. The bikes hold up fine.

Some people want to support LBS - I understand that. But it is wrong to suggest people can not get good quality bikes at good prices on-line. Plus no one beleives statements like that. 

Comsumers need choices
Choices in products
Choices in sellers
Choices in price & service
I LIKE CHOICES


----------



## IndianMillsBoy

This forum seems to be winding down, but wait....I need some advice!

I am looking for my first decent road bike, something I can grow in to over a few years. My experience prior to this, briefly, was mostly MTBing. I had Mongoose chromo, that I raced NORBA beginner/sport in NH/VT and later upgraded to a mid level GT with a manitou fork, lighter, but still triple butted chromo, with Shimano STI. I've had the GT for close to 10 yrs now and it's still a nice bike, mostly used to carry my youngest son in a toddler bike seat. 

I am 6'2/3(think I am shrinking), and about 208lbs on a weight decline (goal around 200lbs), with a 34" inseam. I started riding an 80s Schwinn varsity, I believe a 56cm frame @ 38lbs, which is definitely too small no matter what I extended. Then I got a Kent, GMC/Denail, the largest they made, but that might be too big. It's not _that_ comfortable. I cramp up after 12-15miles and feel comfort, riding on my heels to stretch my legs. Not to mention every other gear clicks, grinds, or whines so I have to move to one before or after. The Denali measures at least 61-63cm and weighs 30lbs even-7005 Alum frame w/ chromo fork-Shimano SIS (looks racy, anyway). 

I intend to ride at least 2K miles a year if not more. My short term goals is to be able to keep up with my childhood friends, who weren't ever superior to me off the road, but now seem to have an edge, as they all ride Bianchi 928 C2C, or Tirenno Razza, all 4 of them have full carbon bikes. It's frustrating even on a casual ride, it's difficult to keep up over the long haul. When I ride alone, I only whiz by folks over 60 and most others whiz by me. The Denali has Shimano SIS derailleurs and I agree I could be in better shape, but I am in pretty decent shape now. I also run, rollerblade, and weight train. 

I really want to spend $700. I could stretch it for the right bike. I also wanted to buy something built in the US, pref from a LBS, which seems almost impossible at this price point. Here's my current options:
1. LBS chain in NJ - '09 Cannondale CAAD 9 6 Triple (58cm) - weighs 21lbs, full aluminum, Carbon fork with alum steerer, Carb wrapped seat post, the rest "Optimo" alum frame with full Tiagra incl cranks - $800. I believe still made in US. 
2. LBS-Mom and Pop Generalist store - '07 Raleigh Grand Prix (59cm)(UK/China?) - Hydro alum frame with Easton Carb fork, carb wrapped post, 105 front, Ultegra rear - Shimano R500 wheels-Truativ Elita or GXP cranks- not sure on weight yet, but told 20 - $870
3. LBS chain - '08 Fuji Roubaix (60/61cm)(US/Taiwan) - Alum frame with Carbon rear stays, carb blades fork-alum steerer, cromo crown, carb wrapped post - Tiagra up front with 105 in rear - Tiagra cranks - told about 20-21lbs - $775 w/ clipless pedals. 
3A. LBS Generalist - Trek 1.2 - I believe full Sora, maybe some Tiagra, aluminum with carbon fork. Weight - low 20s. $700 even. Folks tell me the name is still worth respecting.
4. Longshot suggestion - Save up and go for Motobecane Immortal Pro, full carbon, for $1300. 
4A. " " - Tommasso - Advanced Race for $1100
5. One of my 928 C2C friends thinks I should suck it up, maybe get clipless pedals, my bike tuned and wait a year/save money (if anyone is married out there, you know your window to buy a bike is a small one-who knows what next year will bring) I've only put about 500 miles on this bike so far, but lately I've been riding alot more. He's concerned I won't notice a big difference in a $700 bike and will be disappointed. 
6. I thought "used" but I don't have time in my life to tinker with a bike as much as I used to. I used to tinker when I was single, but there's not much time for that now. 
7. I want to read the size manuals out there for sure. To date, every bike shop has told me something different when it comes to size. 58/59/ up to 61. I am thinking 58/59 for more maneuvrability. Then again, I have pinched nerve/slightly herniated disk in my L2 vertebrae, which leaves my left quad partially numb and irritated at times, as well as my lower back. Some say I need a relaxed frame/geometry and more carbon. I can tell you I want performance first and I'll "grit" out any pain I endure. I've been doing it for 7 years now. By the way, I am a young (sometimes seems old) 35 yo. 

Thanks for the help in advance.


----------



## Peanya

Your current bike is uncomfortable because it hasn't been fit - for $800, you can get the Corvus AL at BD online, and get it fit at a LBS. Please make a new post if you have any questions. Going to a LBS is ideal, as they can size, fit, and let you test ride before you buy. 
All the above bikes you mentioned are imported these days. All the frames come from either Taiwan or China nowadays...


----------



## reddawg317

*looking for a new bike*

I am looking to buy a new bike for my wife. she has not rode a bike in over 15 years. I am not looking for anything fancy. something that will handle 5-10 miles a day, 2-3 times a week.

i saw some bicycles for 200 or so, but was told that they weren't any good. friends told me to buy a bike from costco / bjs warehouses, but they seemed cheap. what are your thoughts?


----------



## Getoutandride

ok ill warm you all i read the first page and stopped, im already prepared to perform my little rant

Ebay - ok yes you will find items cheaper but
1) it could be a scam they may not even arrive to you
2) they most likely wont fit you well
3) they could have been crashed ect ect
4) they could be fakes 
5) you have to pay for servicing (most LBS's will give atleast a free 1st service) 
6) when you buy from a shop they look after you price wise with clothing, lights ect
7)WARRANTY ebay leaves you with a nasty hole in your wallet should anything go wrong
8) loyalty, sometimes supporting local business is just the done thing

with a shop you get
1) your number one asset WARRANTY this is a priceless playing card 
2) free service (at least the 1st if not more)
3) swapping of parts you dont like
4) they will do good deals if you buy their products 
5) fit out its not as easy as seatpost, using me for example - my old roadie came in stock, during fitout all these parts were changed, handlebars, stem, seat and tires now you add up the cost of all those parts up and see how much that ebay bike is actually costing....then compare that cost to the retail price of the shop bike because they will swap the new bits over from yours free of charge oh and also add the extra servicing costs on top also


----------



## gsutton

bahueh said:


> if you think the only adjustments to a road bike are contained in the seat post...you need a bike SHAKEDOWN (whateve that means). Adjustments come in the form of stem length, bar drop, stem angle, shifter placement, seat height, seat distance fore/aft, crank length, pedal rise, seat angle, and Im' sure there are some others I'm forgetting...
> 
> sure, you can do all that yourself..but it requires parts and a bit of knowledge about what is what...and where to put it.



OK. Just my 2 cents. I am also a beginner/returnee. I have 2 bike shops where I live. Terrible selection, only Giant Defy's and MTB's, I went bike shopping a few weeks ago in NYC and visited around 5 good LBS's who were out of my size (56) and waiting for 2009 models to arrive in Nov. At which time the season would have been over. I wanted a TREK 2.1, BUT realy fell in love with the Madone 4.5 except the price was out of my range. I could not get the TREK 2.1 anywhere. So I went on-line to Bikesdirect and purchased the Motobacane Immortal Pro (set up like a Madone) for a fraction of the price. So I can afford to get the FIT at the LBS, This bike is beautiful/Carbon/105-Ultegra and weighs 19lbs. It does have cheaper rims/tires I think, Shimano/ Kenda. Took 4 days via UPS.

I understand LBS's need to make a profit and I felt bad for my local one who tried to sell me the Giant Defy 3 which I just did not like. Also I beleive the markup is well over 100% according to a friend of mine who used to work in an LBS. Most of the good bikes are made in Taiwan by only a few manufacturers to different specs. I took a chance and received a great bike ON-LINE. Just be very happy with whatever you get!


----------



## gsutton

To be safe and comfortable you are also going to have quite a few other initial expenses like shoes, helmet, tools, bags and clothes. Expect to pay and additional $300+ for all of that.


----------



## gtbassett

Hey I'm looking to get my first roadbike for commuting, I'm currently looking at single speed roadbikes. I don't really know anything about bikes in general, I've been looking a schwinns on the assumption that they're kind of a tried and true brand. The cutter looks nice at 300 but I'm wondering if it's worth it? Should I go for the Madison or look at different brands all together, I would prefer to keep it under 500 considering that I'm very tight on cash. Any help would be much appreciated.


----------



## austincrx

I just recently built my first bike, from parts and things off ebay, as well as other places. If I could have done it again, I would have just bought a bike for a discount (at the end of the season for instance). It's guaranteed to be right, and if anything isn't, the store you bought it from should take care of it for free, or close to free! Whereas if you build your own bike, you only have yourself to blame, which could be good or bad.


----------



## nathanm

Buy on craigslist. If you are just getting into cycling, it is totally OK to buy used, it will save you a lot of cash. I bought my first bike on craiglist, and when i was ready to upgrade, I just resold it on Craigslist (for more than I originally paid for it).


----------



## gtbassett

That's what I ended up doing. I bought a Specialized Sequoia Elite for 250, hardly ridden. I also ended up fixing up an old peugeot I found and turning it into a single speed for 35 bucks, best 35 bucks I ever spent.


----------



## comfort biker

If you live in an area that has a heavy cycling culture, than I would definitely check out Craig's list. You could get a great bike for a much lower cost. With the way things are in the economy right now, you could probably score a killer deal at a local bike store or online as well... My nephew's bike was purchased on Craig's list (he's 7) and it worked perfectly for him. It was scratched, but definitely road worthy.


----------



## Kleh

If you bought a bike online and your LBS treats you any different than if you had bought from them, they don't deserve your business. I'd rather go 20 miles out of my way than have to put up with a business that won't offer advice or service to someone who didn't buy from them. At a good bike shop there are 0 advantages to buying a bike from them when it comes to service, unless you think a basic $25 fit for free is an advantage.

Warranty issues are just about the only advantage you have to going local, as start-up issues are usually taken care of pretty quick, instead of having to RMA your bike back to the buyer.

This "LBS relationship" line is simply making excuses for poor business. Anyone with any sort of knowledge in managing or running a business should know this. Riders spending their first 5 minutes in your shop should get the same service, advice, and prices as someone who's been in your shop for 10 years, because anyone who knows anything knows that someone isn't spending time in your shop for 10 years because they're looking for more discounts. LBS comes down to customer service. Friendly, informative, and helpful. If you compare 90% of the accessories they carry, you'll find them cheaper by at least 40% online.

Fund-raiser rides, components, tools, and services are all worthwhile investments to spend on an LBS, and it's how they make their money, so don't be fooled by anyone who tells you that you need to support your local LBS by buying bikes/accessories from them at inflated costs.


----------



## DC12

Interestingly, I benefited from doing both (ebay and LBS). I was ready to buy a bike from the LBS but as it was a bike that had a frame that hadn't sold for 4 years, I thought I could deal on it. The day I went in to make the deal, I went on Ebay to do some research and found the exact same bike on sale (listed by the same LBS) for 500 less on "buy it now". There was no reserve and when you take into account the money they pay out to ebay and paypal it is even less. I made the deal based on their opening acceptable bid which was 500 less than the "buy it now". I was ultimately happier to buy it from a LBS. Doing homework sometimes pays off!


----------



## dekey

*Great First Bike at Sears*

www.sears.com is offering a great deal on a beginners Road Bike. It's a Schwinn Signia and it's on sale for $169.99. This may not be as good as a Trek or Giant, but it sure costs a lot less. This appears to be an excellent entry level bike. Great way to make sure you are going to like the sport before spending $1000's of dollars.


----------



## emoney

For what it's worth....here's what I did. Wife and I decided at 44, it was time to get in shape for real this time. I have bad wheels (ankles), so running is not an option for me and I really don't enjoy going to the gym (even though we have one in our subdivision). So, we turned to cycling. I found, at a pawn shop, a used Fuji Newest 3.0, 2006, that looked like crap, but rode well and everything worked. So, for $125.00 I bought it. Got my wife a similar type bike, also at a pawn shop. 

Next, after a couple of weeks of making sure, we purchased the accessories; road bike shoes, clipless pedals, bike shorts, helmets, gloves, water bottles, etc. These items were all transferrable, should we move up in bikes.

Lastly, after about 6 weeks of continual riding, with long range plans for future rides, (and becoming a RBR member-learned a lot here), we KNEW that cycling was for us, and we both purchased new road bikes that we knew we would be happy with for years to come. My wife is the simple one, she got a new Redline road bike w/Sram components, and I ordered, and had built a Look frame w/Shimano components.

As a side note, in the middle of this process, we established a relationship with a local LBS, from which my wife purchased her bike and I paid them to assemble mine. (total spent to date is about $1000.00 for both). So now, we have the best of both worlds. We weren't out anything if we hated this sport (i knew I could resell both bikes for what we had in them), AND, we found a LBS that we trust and will use for all future cycle related items (assuming we can't find it on the 'net for less....lol).

This path worked for us, and I hope it helps someone else. Regardless of what you do, I can say this, I am extremely glad we found cycling (or visa versa) and wish it was something we had been doing together 20 years ago. Good luck to all!


----------



## ps249

I bought my first hybrid on a budget. I have been into mountain biking for the past 16 years and it got to the point I was riding on the rail trails 95% of the time so I finally took the plunge and bought a Giant FCR3 on sale for $550. 3 years ago I bought the most expensive hard tail mountain bike I could find at the time (Specialized rock hopper comp 2006). I had all the bells and whistles like an air shock and the best paint job and the Deore shifting components. I paid almost $900 in all and I was to afraid to take it on the trails after spending so much. I relaized later I bought it mostly for show to ride on the rail trails. It was more bike than what I needed and I realised I could have gotten by on a brand new $400 mountain bike. I always got a sore ass from riding it 20 miles at a time. It was very durable and flawless shifting. I never used the shocks (I think I only inflated them once). I was such a rail trail rider I wanted to go further and faster. Finally I sold it for $400 on craigslist and went down to my local bike shop. I told the salesman I ride 95% on pavement (rail trail) and he immediately directed me to the hybrid bikes. I think there were only 8 hanging from the ceiling ranging in price from $550 to $1,400 (I seen Treks, Fisher, Cannondale and Giant). He sized me up and tool the cheapest bike down and I went over it tooth and nail.I added a wireless computer and the total cost me $630 out the door. I put almost 40 miles on it in 2 days and I cannot beleive the difference! Much more comfortable ride and faster. I had to struggle to hit 15 MPH on the mountain bike. Now I can hit 16 MPH with no problem. I am breaking all my old records that I held with the mountain bikes that I have owned in the past. I am now a roadie for life! Goodbye mountain bikes!


----------



## Guest

when buying your first bike lets say u buy one used. Make sure that the teeth on the cassette are all there and arent worn down from riding, and make sure that the chain isnt stretched. other than that different parts work better than others just depends on how much money your willing to spend on them, and picking on bike may also depend on your taste in color and style.


----------



## LOUISSSSS

ps249 said:


> I bought my first hybrid on a budget. I have been into mountain biking for the past 16 years and it got to the point I was riding on the rail trails 95% of the time so I finally took the plunge and bought a Giant FCR3 on sale for $550. 3 years ago I bought the most expensive hard tail mountain bike I could find at the time (Specialized rock hopper comp 2006). I had all the bells and whistles like an air shock and the best paint job and the Deore shifting components. I paid almost $900 in all and I was to afraid to take it on the trails after spending so much. I relaized later I bought it mostly for show to ride on the rail trails. It was more bike than what I needed and I realised I could have gotten by on a brand new $400 mountain bike. I always got a sore ass from riding it 20 miles at a time. It was very durable and flawless shifting. I never used the shocks (I think I only inflated them once). I was such a rail trail rider I wanted to go further and faster. Finally I sold it for $400 on craigslist and went down to my local bike shop. I told the salesman I ride 95% on pavement (rail trail) and he immediately directed me to the hybrid bikes. I think there were only 8 hanging from the ceiling ranging in price from $550 to $1,400 (I seen Treks, Fisher, Cannondale and Giant). He sized me up and tool the cheapest bike down and I went over it tooth and nail.I added a wireless computer and the total cost me $630 out the door. I put almost 40 miles on it in 2 days and I cannot beleive the difference! Much more comfortable ride and faster.* I had to struggle to hit 15 MPH on the mountain bike. Now I can hit 16 MPH with no problem. I am breaking all my old records that I held with the mountain bikes that I have owned in the past. I am now a roadie for life! Goodbye mountain bikes!*


uh... a mountain bike is for riding on... mountains. are you mad at your mountain bike because it is slower than your road bike? lol...

and 1 mph more on a road bike over a mountain bike on pavement isn't a big improvement...


----------



## micycle mike

i can ride 18-20mph on flat ground paved roads on my 02 rockhopper mtn bike.
i got huge strong legs though.
haven't got to ride my new (to me) 1970 road bike yet, just around the block a few times. so i have no idea what my flat ground cruising speed is on it yet. i'm sure it will be about the same.

buying your first bike on a budget:
get the best bike you can afford. also get the best bike for the kind of riding you plan on doing.
my father used to tell me "always use the right tool for the job and always buy the best tools you can afford"

if a flat bar hybrid bike is the correct bike for what you need then buy one of them. you do not need an expensive racing bike if you are only using the bike to ride 10 miles a day to work/school

buy used!!! unless...
you don't know how to work on bikes
you don't know how to tell if something just needs to be adjusted or if it is broken
you don't know if a bike fits

if you need a bike shop mechanic to do ANY adjustments on your bike for you then you should spend the little extra and buy from a bike shop.
some bike shops will have used bikes, if you have a tight budget then you should walk in and tell them how much you have to spend.

do not buy a bike from a department store.
even if the $100 hybrid bike at walmart seems like a good deal. you can buy a much better bike used for not much more money.

example: my 02 specialized rockhopper mtn bike cost me $100 on craigs list. it cost this much because the rear derailleur needed to be replaced. (wouldn't shift) when i got to the guys house i realized it just needed to be adjusted. 

of course if you don't know anything about bikes then you shouldn't buy used, but that is even more reason not to buy a bike from a department store.

oh and just cause the stand over height is correct doesn't mean the bike fits you.


----------



## BeepBeepZipTang

I joined the cycling world back in July2009. Im a very beginner. Bought this 1996 Cannondale SR600 with friction gears. Tuned it up at at my LBS and for me it rides like the wind. Bought it cheap as chiken soup. In fact the gear I needed to ride like a proper roadie cost more than the bike....... since then I upgraded slightly and bought a 2010 Caad9. Wow, what a diffrence in weight and ride... I still think, while being in this sport five minutes ago, If you can pull this 1996 throwback for miles my next bike will be a rocket....
and how true it was.
Problem now is I cant shake the upgrade disease...as well as riding in sub zero temps in NYC.


----------



## LMWEL

I've bought two brand new bikes in the past six months and my best advice is .....TEST RIDE!!!!! alot. Pick any bike,ride it for a while,change bikes ,ride,change shops,ride,go back,ride again. Point is, whatever feels best is best... for you. Side note, just ordered a 2009 Giant Defy 2 . Should be here in 3 days. CAN'T WAIT!!!


----------



## easyridernyc

i would advise first, develop a budget, mostly for the bike, then a separate, smaller budget for tax, shoes, helmet, clothes, accessories, etc. get the bike first, worry about the other shyt later, one paycheck at a time, whatever. for a road bike a good twelve to fourteen hundred should do it. i know, that's a lot of bread, but the problem is if you pay less, especially these days, you're gonna get less, as in shimano sora, as opposed to shimano 105. you used to be able to get 105 for a thousand, but not anymore. now its basically fourteen hundred and up, and depending on the company, the fourteen will still only get you tiagra. that's one thing i've noticed over the past several years as i have been road biking, prices are definitely going up. and dont think because you pay for 2300, or sora or tiagra, you get 105. you dont. you get 2300, sora, or tiagra, what you pay for. the base level professional set is 105, that's where i think you aim for a price.

which leads to point number two. shop and compare, especially online. and that breaks down into a number of major categories, one, the company, or manufacturers' websites, i.e. trek, specialized, cannondale, giant, felt, etc, then, local and/or regional retailers (bike shops and sellers), and then one or two review sites, like rbr. the main thing, at least at first, is identifying the bikes in your price range on the different company sites. fast, easy, and fun, plus you learn 101 about components when you spec the bikes out on line, as in who gives what for what (for example, specialized allez for 800 bucks with 2300shifters, vs 900 dollar cannondale 8 shimano 2300, vs 800 dollar giant defy 3,shim 2300 vs allez sport with sora/tiagra for 900, like that. then check out the reviews on those bikes, again online, there are others out there who will give you an honest opinion on their purchases. then get off your butt. go to the local shops and see what the bikes look like in person. you'll start to gravitate towards a few. then start getting feedback from the local lbs guys. then go ahead and start with a few test rides.

if you're like me, then soon the twelve is gonna try to morph up into 14, 15, or 16, but like i say, for a 105, you should be able to get in under 14. plus, and this is the last thing, there are always deals, in shops and online. i dont want to tell you how much i saved on my felt, it was a lot, and all because i bought a previous year model at the beginning of the next product model year. all it took was a little diligence and paying close attention. so look around, talk to the sellers, let them know what you want and how much you can spend. if they like you and realize youre cool and thinking about what you're doing, they'll realize, as many retailers today do, that there's a good chance that you might find your shyt, even if its another brand of bike, at another shop, or even worse, for them, online. then, as i say, if they like you, rather than lose you, your fine ass real time athletic self, not to mention your potential thousands of dollars worth of business, they might hook you up. maybe with that bike in your size sitting in the back of the shop that they have been meaning to offload for a few months now at the end of a season. hmmmm....

it happens that way sometimes. the main thing is have fun. set up a budget, look around. when its right, trust me. you'll know it.


----------



## LMWEL

easyridernyc said:


> i would advise first, develop a budget. for a road bike a good twelve to fourteen hundred should do it
> 
> DUDE! YOURE a SNOB !! I just spent $800+ on a Giant with the sora-tiagra package. Does that make me a lesser cyclist than you.? Sure I have to come out of the drops to shift sometimes but I still have my extra $600 and I'm riding every day and loving it!!!
> Give the OP a break. If he finds a bike by a reputable manufacturer like the ones you named and it feels GREAT when he rides it and he can afford it, it's PERFECT ,regardless of what a snob like you says about his components.


----------



## micycle mike

a beginner on a budget doesn't need to worry about what shifting components he has. 

buy the most expensive bike you can *afford* that fits your *needs*
you don't need top of the line stuff if you are on a budget. you don't need middle of the line stuff either. 



> the base level professional set is 105, that's where i think you aim for a price.


why would someone buying their *first* bike on a *budget* need to worry about professional stuff?


----------



## LMWEL

I'm with you Mike. My 2009 Giant Defy 2 has Sora shifters and rides like a dream. Better yet I don't regret the price. It's my first road bike in 25 years and I couldn't be happier.


----------



## martywoodman

*Research pays off*

When I decided to get back into cycling, I checked out many books from my local library. Great info about nutrition, training and GEAR. I wanted to buy used from Craigslist, but every time I found a bike I liked, it was snatched right up. I had read enough about bike fit to buy BikesDirect and have never regretted it!: I purchased an entry level road bike with Sora shifters and rode 2,111 miles last year. Sora is not crap! I joined a club and no one "looks down" on my gear, they are instead amazed by what I paid for my sweet ride!:thumbsup: Youtube has great videos on derailleur adjustment, wheel truing, etc... I DO support my LBS by buying accessories, but knowledge is power- you don't have to be a mechanic (and I am definitely NOT) to make these adjustments and do a proper fitting! Good luck and God Bless!


----------



## LMWEL

Marty, That's a sweet ride. I know you're loving it. It's 11:00 pm here and I'm looking at my bike in my living room wishing I were riding.


----------



## sobebike

*Seriously*

I've been riding a low end Walmart road bike for 1400 miles in Miami, and must admit that I have trouble keeping up (especially on uphills) with other Miami riders (and I'm in great shape) that bike weight about 35 lbs. So I'm now looking to upgrade to Aluminum with Carbon fork. Here's my dilema: Trek, Giant, Felt=$800+ with Sora components. THEN I FIND THIS: 
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=5751042
WITH 105 Components! ... 20 lbs Carbon fork
...Don't lecture me on LBS service , fitting etc. My LBS treats me with respect, fits, tunes and repairs my bike. So please, I challenge you to find a similar bike even close to the $499 Walmart price!


----------



## PJ352

sobebike said:


> I've been riding a low end Walmart road bike for 1400 miles in Miami, and must admit that I have trouble keeping up (especially on uphills) with other Miami riders (and I'm in great shape) that bike weight about 35 lbs. So I'm now looking to upgrade to Aluminum with Carbon fork. Here's my dilema: Trek, Giant, Felt=$800+ with Sora components. THEN I FIND THIS:
> http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=5751042
> WITH 105 Components! ... 20 lbs Carbon fork
> ...*Don't lecture me on LBS service , fitting etc. My LBS treats me with respect, fits, tunes and repairs my bike. *So please, I challenge you to find a similar bike even close to the $499 Walmart price!


You have two things working for you here. One, a LBS that'll do all that you describe and two, a bike that fits that you can use to compare to subsequent purchases. BUT, if you didn't have a proper sized bike in your posession and you guessed wrong on sizing, your LBS would be hard pressed to make it fit, but that's what they'd have to do. Or, you'd return it for one that fit. 

Most noobs don't already have a bike and some don't have LBS's so willing to work on bikes not purchased from them, so getting sized/ fitted correctly is a problem. for them, working through a LBS is best.


----------



## sobebike

PJ352 said:


> You have two things working for you here. One, a LBS that'll do all that you describe and two, a bike that fits that you can use to compare to subsequent purchases. BUT, if you didn't have a proper sized bike in your posession and you guessed wrong on sizing, your LBS would be hard pressed to make it fit, but that's what they'd have to do. Or, you'd return it for one that fit.
> 
> Most noobs don't already have a bike and some don't have LBS's so willing to work on bikes not purchased from them, so getting sized/ fitted correctly is a problem. for them, working through a LBS is best.


 Excellent advice! I'm 5'9 and average build / inseam etc, so I would get the medium , then adjust the seat & handlebar. 

Im wondering if the hardcore road cyclists are not giving Walmart their respect, just as nobody thought Walmart was gonna become the worlds largest seller of high end HDTV / plazma / flatscreen TVs, and over the past 4-5 years they have caused Circuit City and their competitors to go out of business, maybe our high-end road biking future will be to "save money . live better"!


----------



## micycle mike

the only problem i see with that bike is the quality.
i'd be worried about the frame/fork cracking. what is the warranty on that bike?
one of the reviews said there was no warranty card or any way to contact the manufacturer
also i'd make sure that you have the lbs do a really good "one over" and make sure everything is installed correct, lubed correct.

i have a beach cruiser that i bought used, it was ridden 2 miles before i got it. the previous owner won it at a work raffle. they bought the bike at walmart. it's a huffy cranbrook.
when i got the bike the head set was dangerously loose, the cranks wouldn't spin easy (you could feel the bearings)
when i took off the cranks to swap out the 44t chainwheel with a 36t there was no grease on the bottom bracket bearings. took apart the headset and there was no grease there either.
so i ended up taking the whole bike apart and putting it back together properly.

you might want to check out bikes direct, you won't find a 105 bike for $500, but you will find a better quality bike (in my opinion) for just a little more money

also remember the walmart bike doesn't have pedals


----------



## landrover1970

*My First Road Bike*

Here is my first road bike....which I still ride today....remember this...fit before finish...I bought this 72 Colnago super new, didn't know much about Colnagos in 72, but it fit me well and after all these years, i am sure glad that I went with a bike that fit me well. I guess I made the right choice and I am still in love with this Colnago today....no back problems and knee problems at all..... fit before finish...of course you have to like the looks as well.....happy trails!!!


----------



## easyridernyc

LMWEL

mind your f ucking mouth.

from the op...

This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


----------



## LOUISSSSS

easyridernyc said:


> LMWEL
> 
> mind your f ucking mouth.


Doesn't look like LMWEL said anything wrong. except make a response to you, did u get offended by that?

i just got my first "road bike", well kinda. a Tricross Singlecross + 700x23 tires. tires stiff and smooth. 

this is coming from my mtb rides, so anything will prob be stiff and smooth!
if requested, i can post pics here, or someone can find my thread


----------



## LMWEL

easyridernyc said:


> LMWEL
> 
> mind your f ucking mouth.
> 
> from the op...
> 
> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


Just checked out your profile... Both of YOUR bikes have " Full 105s ". Well La Tee Da... If the snob fits....


----------



## sobebike

*Corsa road bike*

The Corsa road bike discussion and review is happenning at another forum, take a look:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=172249


----------



## thechriswebb

I work as a mechanic in a bike shop, so of course I am in total favor of supporting your local LBS and taking advantage of the resources there. Often, that can be the difference in your experience buying your first bike. 

However,

There seems to be an assumption here that all LBS's are bicycle Meccas filled with wise, hardworking sages filled with the knowledge and desire to make your bicycle buying experience perfect. You walk in the door and a friendly employee greets you, shakes your hand, and asks how they can assist you. There is a dusty picture of the shop owner posing with Greg Lemond in 1990, and an autographed photo of Ernesto Colnago that he acquired while touring his factory in Italy. You can see a guy in the back diligently hand-building wheels, and the shop owner's pretty daughter (this is an independent, family owned business) is in the corner explaining to someone how clipless pedals work. You tell the friendly employee what you are looking for, and after listening intently he goes over a selection of bikes that might be right for you. You indicate one that you like, and the employee offers to give you a professional fit. You accept and he walks you over to the shop's high speed fit machine where he spends as much time with you as he needs to get it right. You are then set up with the bike that you chose in the right size, and he takes you outside to show you how the shifting works and you go on a test ride. You come back, tell him that you love the bike, and he takes you inside and helps you pick out the rest of the gear that you need. After you pay for everything, he gives you his card with his name on it and tells you to come in any time you have trouble and ask for him. You have full support, a warranty, and a purchase that you are very happy with. You supported an independent business operated by a honest, hardworking family, and somewhere out there a crooked, corrupt CEO of a soul-less business that imports cheap, plastic bikes that he sells on the internet, made by five year old kidnapped orphans in China that work 27 hours a day while chained to the benches in the sweatshop that get paid in bags of rice, just went out of business because you bought a bike from a LBS and not him. 

That is unfortunately not how this often works.....

I remember the first time I went to a LBS to buy a bike. I had been riding a road bike for a while, but it was an old, steel 10 speed with 27" wheels and downtube shifters. I decided that it was time to buy a modern bike, so into the LBS I went. I walked in, didn't see an employee anywhere, and walked around for a bit looking at the bikes. After a bit, I went to the counter and talked to the guy that was sitting there reading a book. I told him that I was in the market to buy a new road bike and that I needed some help. He asked me how much money I had to spend, I told him, and he got up and walked to the rack. He eyed me up and down for a second, and then pulled a bike off the rack. He handed it to me without adjusting the seat or anything and told me to go ride a couple of laps in the parking lot to see if I liked it. I took the bike outside and realized that I had no idea how to operate STI shifting. I peeked back in the store and asked him if he could come out and help me. He came out and I told him what was wrong. He suppressed a chuckle, surprised by my stupidity, and proceeded to talk to me like I was 4 years old and explain how the shifting worked. I rode a couple of laps, decided that I did like the bike, and stepped off in front of him. He asked me if I liked it, I told him I did, and he asked me if I planned on paying in full today or if I needed to finance it. I told him that I needed some time to think about it, and he told me that I really needed to buy it TODAY because they had an end of season sale running and it would cost $200 more if I didn't buy it now. I told him I would think about it, and I left the shop and never went back. I ended up buying a used Cannondale race bike (I was just getting into professional racing and Mario Cipollini was the thing at that time) for $500. I rode that bike through college until it got stolen, and I loved that bike with all of my soul.

Since then, I have had wonderful experiences with many LBS's, but do still have foul ones from time to time. As one who is employed in this business, I cannot discredit buying a used bike as a viable option for a first time buyer, and not every LBS is worth the cost of their service. I also got a MUCH nicer bike than I would have gotten at that LBS for significantly less money by buying used. 

If you buy used, just make sure to take your time and educate yourself about what you are buying. I did so and was confident that what I was buying was going to work well for me. DON'T buy used bike just because it is a good deal or because you like the brand. For someone who is willing to take the time to educate themselves a bit, you can save a lot of money getting a nice, used bike. Otherwise, you do need to use a LBS. Some people here are so far removed from what reality is for many people that they cannot understand that some people simply can not afford to buy a new bike from a bike shop, especially if they are just testing the waters and not sure that this is something they are going to get into. They are not necessarily snobs, they just cannot wrap their minds around the concept of how hard it is for many people to walk into a LBS and buy a bike. Some of those people would rather you not buy a bike at all than buy one from ebay or (heaven forbid) bikesdirect. I couldn't disagree more. If those are the options that make a decent bicycle accessible to you, then please use them. Just be smart and make sure you knwo what you are buying.


----------



## Mcaldwell18

*Help with a bike*

I need some help. I'm a mountain biker getting into road biking on the side and am looking for a bike. I found this one on Craigslist for $150. I'm most likely working out a trade of my old mtb frame (raleigh m7000) for the bike. But before I commit, I want to know what kind of bike it is, it says omega on it, but I know nothing about bikes. I have not looked at the bike yet, but the owner said everything except the front tire is in good shape. SO any help I can get on this I'd appreciate.


----------



## tprior

*Cannondale R500 Cad 2*

I am 48 years old beginner on a budget
and looking to buy my first road bike. I looking at a 1998 Cannondale R500 with a cad 2 advanced aluminum frame, 24 speed, carbon fork (slice Echelon). shannon RSX shifter, amd sjo,app 700x 25 tires/rims. Found it on craigs list. My local bike shop owner said it was in top shape. Rode well and fit good. He is asking $ 500. Shoes, helement. I am trying to verify the year. Numbers are J6 342 14483 02E58. Input appriciated.


----------



## PJ352

tprior said:


> I am 48 years old beginner on a budget
> and looking to buy my first road bike. I looking at a 1998 Cannondale R500 with a cad 2 advanced aluminum frame, 24 speed, carbon fork (slice Echelon). shannon RSX shifter, amd sjo,app 700x 25 tires/rims. Found it on craigs list. My local bike shop owner said it was in top shape. Rode well and fit good. He is asking $ 500. Shoes, helement. I am trying to verify the year. Numbers are J6 342 14483 02E58. Input appriciated.


I can't help with the serial number, but here's a pic with specs to use for comparison purposes.

http://www.bikepedia.com/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=1998&Brand=Cannondale&Model=R500&Type=bike

I wouldn't worry about the exact year too much. It's more important that the bike fits well and is mechanically sound.


----------



## PJ352

Mcaldwell18 said:


> I need some help. I'm a mountain biker getting into road biking on the side and am looking for a bike. I found this one on Craigslist for $150. I'm most likely working out a trade of my old mtb frame (raleigh m7000) for the bike. But before I commit, I want to know what kind of bike it is, it says omega on it, but I know nothing about bikes. I have not looked at the bike yet, but the owner said everything except the front tire is in good shape. SO any help I can get on this I'd appreciate.


Your images didn't load.


----------



## Roman-dude

*pay for tune up?*



bahueh said:


> Adjustments come in the form of stem length, bar drop, stem angle, shifter placement, seat height, seat distance fore/aft, crank length, pedal rise, seat angle, and Im' sure there are some others I'm forgetting...
> 
> sure, you can do all that yourself..but it requires parts and a bit of knowledge about what is what...and where to put it.


A question here, anything wrong with picking up a bike elsewhere and taking it to your LSB for an adj/tune up? obviously for a fee.. this way you save a few bucks on the bike, the shop gets to make a few on svc and both parties build a relationship.. 

on a slightly separate note, i'm potentially looking at a used Jamis Quest w/ 2.5k miles on it.. I'm guessing there should still be plenty of miles left on this ride, but would like to hear what you guys think. 

thx


----------



## PJ352

Roman-dude said:


> A question here, anything wrong with picking up a bike elsewhere and taking it to your LSB for an adj/tune up? obviously for a fee.. this way you save a few bucks on the bike, the shop gets to make a few on svc and both parties build a relationship..
> 
> on a slightly separate note, i'm potentially looking at a used Jamis Quest w/ 2.5k miles on it.. I'm guessing there should still be plenty of miles left on this ride, but would like to hear what you guys think.
> 
> thx


There's nothing wrong with the scenario you describe, but considering the importance of fit, I'd question where you got the bike you were bringing in for service, if not from this LBS.

Which leads into the second part of your post. The Jamis Quest is (IMO) an excellent choice (assumes this bike is in good shape, etc.), but for it to be the right choice for you, it has to meet your sizing requirements. If you've been riding awhile and know your requirements this is a non-issue, bit of it's a first bike, proceed with caution.


----------



## Roman-dude

PJ352 said:


> There's nothing wrong with the scenario you describe, but considering the importance of fit, I'd question where you got the bike you were bringing in for service, if not from this LBS.
> 
> Which leads into the second part of your post. The Jamis Quest is (IMO) an excellent choice (assumes this bike is in good shape, etc.), but for it to be the right choice for you, it has to meet your sizing requirements. If you've been riding awhile and know your requirements this is a non-issue, bit of it's a first bike, proceed with caution.


Thanks. Good point. I guess here are my considerations: 
1. I would be a recreational rider at best (but I do realize that fit is important). 
2. while not a LBS custom fit, I hope I should be ok for my purposes (using online calcs), 3. I'd rather get a $1000+ used bike for a 1/3 or a 1/4 of its price (and if it REALLY does not fit unload it back on craigslist with a small loss, if I have to), than buy a new $400-500 bike (which is more than my budget anyway, since I'm no hardcore cyclist..yet, anyway). 
4. Having a better one to start off (if it fits and I keep it) would allow me to upgrade its parts overtime if I really do get into it. 

How does that sound? thx


----------



## PJ352

Roman-dude said:


> Thanks. Good point. I guess here are my considerations:
> 1. I would be a recreational rider at best (but I do realize that fit is important).
> 2. while not a LBS custom fit, I hope I should be ok for my purposes (using online calcs), 3. I'd rather get a $1000+ used bike for a 1/3 or a 1/4 of its price (and if it REALLY does not fit unload it back on craigslist with a small loss, if I have to), than buy a new $400-500 bike (which is more than my budget anyway, since I'm no hardcore cyclist..yet, anyway).
> 4. Having a better one to start off (if it fits and I keep it) would allow me to upgrade its parts overtime if I really do get into it.
> 
> How does that sound? thx


A couple of thoughts...

Unless you're springing for a high end/ custom bike, most LBS's don't provide custom fits for the cost of a standard bike purchase. That would be an above and beyond charge. A standard fit would take 1/2-3/4 hr and, if purchased separately, may run you $50-$75. I think even though you're on a limited budget, going this route at your LBS may be worthwhile, because it'll pin down your sizing requirements. Also, IMO/E it'll better the results you'll get from the online fit calculators, because _at best_, they get you in a range that works for a given individual. From that range, you first have to be able to decipher bike geo, then choose a size based on their recommended ranges.

One thing to consider. Despite the fact that you're a recreational rider, a good fit will go a long way in keeping you on the bike and riding. Sure, you can resell an ill fitting bike, but besides losing some $$, it may dissuade you from continuing something you'd physically benefit from.

Believe me, you're not the first nor are you the last to want the most from your money, but the unique thing about bikes (as opposed to many other consumables) is that fit goes hand in hand with the purchase, and holds at least as much importance as the 'gear'.


----------



## CopperMtBiker

I shopped around a few bicycle shops in mid-season to buy up from a hybrid comfort bike to my first road bike in twenty years. I received $200 for my year-old $300 hybrid bike. I was offered 20% off on previous-year models at one dealer. I settled on 40% off on a previous-year, lightly-used demo Trek 1500 in the proper frame size, 60 cm, for my 6'2" height. I improved my commute time 30% and have been very happy with the weight and function for price. Comments on accessories:

I wear work clothes and a backpack, so avoided the costs of biking apparel. I wear one to three layers of fleece all year because I live at an altitude of 9,600 feet with cold nights. I padded my bike seat, rather than buying padded shorts. I like basket pedals rather than clip-ons. I bought North Face rain gear. I bought a perfectly water-repellant Spyder backpack cover that cost as much as my pack and was worth the price.

I bought two headlamps, since back-ups are essential on my midnight commutes 16 miles through a remote mountain pass. I like the Nite Rider, 15 watt, with a rechargeable battery pack mounted on the center bar. I also like the Cat Eye with four rechargeable AA cells. Lamps under $50 are rather worthless for riding, although I also carry two LED lights in my pack for emergency close work that were less than $20 each. I mounted a red flasher on my bike post and added another with duct tape to the back of a helmet, since I must ride the freeway shoulder of I-70 all winter when deep snow and avalanche danger close my bike path. 

I used my tire repair kit with CO2 cartridges five times in 1,000 miles before replacing my punctured Bontrager Race Lite tires with heavy-duty, thorn-resistant tires. The expense of Schwalbe Marathon Plus [rear] and Continental Gator [front] tires was absolutely worth the $100 that I spent. I have not had a flat during the past 1,000 miles.

I spent $100 on a durable pair of Salomon hiking shoes. I bought $160 Hotronic footbed electric toe warmers for below-zero commuting in winter. I covered my pedal baskets with felt toe covers attached with duct tape to reduce windchill on my feet. Obviously, my commuting conditions are more severe than for many people. I stay comfortable all year long.

My commuting hazards include hitting bears, marmots, porcupines, mountain goats, foxes, beavers dragging trees, elk, deer, coyotes. Also, there is some chance that I will be hit by avalanche, falling boulders, dropping deadfalls, or out-of-control vehicles on the freeway. However, I was only injured by one dog from the county animal shelter who was being led on a leash. The dog clamped onto my thigh and did not release until I pulled its jaws apart. The dog was euthanized.


----------



## easyridernyc

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1073180_-1_1511002_1511000_400306


i know i know maybe a little pricey

but a great first price at a superb price.


----------



## Midwest Playa

My Only Advice based on my experience is to make sure you speak with a Good Rep thats not out to make a quick buck, And if you can invest in a proper fitting i would definitely go for it. I spent $100 on a fitting and I am glad I did. No matter how much the bike cost, If it does not Fit You, You Are Not Going To Be a Happy Camper.

Midwest Playa .:thumbsup:


----------



## SolidSnake3

Hi everyone!

I noticed this thread hasn't been active in a few weeks but was wondering if anyone was still around to give a bit of advice for a new guy. I'm just sort of getting into bike riding and was given a 1980 Schwinn Le Tour that belonged to a friend of my parents. I have taken the bike to a few different LBS and so far so good. There is nothing wrong with it aside from needing some new brake pads. The bike is a little too big for me however, it feels comfortable riding it and I have no problems getting on or off but according to all 3 shops its a bit too large.

Anyhow I have about $300 or so that I can spend. For this amount I could get a new bike from bikes direct specifically:
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/windsor/clockwork.htm
or
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/mercier/kilott.htm
These two really appealed to me and was wondering what you guys thought

My other option is to put that money into the Le Tour. I'm considering taking all the gear stuff off the Le Tour and turning it into a single speed since I'm in the same gear the whole time and only use it for riding around the city and some slightly farther commuting. Once and a while I go on a longer ride for fun but other than that it's mostly just city transport. I would also get some new tires/frames to lose some weight and maybe new handle bars.

What do you guys think is the better option for my $300ish amount?

New bike from Bikes Direct or putting money into the Le Tour that is a bit too big but still comfortable and easy to ride?


----------



## easyridernyc

new is usually better, fewer hassles in maintenance, repairs etc. even if you dont get the best service contract with bd, at least you know the equipment is in good and original condition. those single speedsters look kinda sweet, three hundred bucks for either is a good deal, bro. i dont know how much it would really be worth trying to save a 1980 used schwinn le tour; if its not in mint i would probably go new, especially if the point is to get out, ride, and have fun--put the time and money into the old bike when you have it to spare....


----------



## Googly

*Only 5 feet tall*

Hi i'm looking to buy a road bike. As i'm only 5 feet tall.. are women's bike my only option?
WS Recommended Sizes 
Frame Size center-to-center:41 cm
Frame Size center-to-top:42 cm 
Overall Reach:62.00 cm 
Saddle Height:55.63 cm 
Handlebar Width:44 cm

Those are the figures i got from wrenchscience.com. The small frame is about 47cm isnt it?


----------



## Midwest Playa

Googly said:


> Hi i'm looking to buy a road bike. As i'm only 5 feet tall.. are women's bike my only option?
> WS Recommended Sizes
> Frame Size center-to-center:41 cm
> Frame Size center-to-top:42 cm
> Overall Reach:62.00 cm
> Saddle Height:55.63 cm
> Handlebar Width:44 cm
> 
> Those are the figures i got from wrenchscience.com. The small frame is about 47cm isnt it?



Parlee can custom build you a bike if money is not an option

http://www.parleecycles.com/


MidwestPlaya:thumbsup:


----------



## Cadent

This is totally arrogant of a true newbie posting to this thread, but even the ignorant have their story.

In a former life, I was a pretty fair photographer. Back in the film days. Newbie shooters would agonize over optimized f/stop for the focal length of the lens to minimize distortion, not realizing that the one _critical_ aspect was to GET THE SHOT! Granted, I was coming from a newspaper perspective, but dealing with people who focused on minutiae while missing the big picture always amazed me.

So, I now have my Raleigh Cadent FT3. Alum. frame, Tiagra components. No one rides Raleigh. No one posts about Raleigh. Have no idea where Raleigh ranks in the hierarchy of bikes. Really don't care. This is a nice bike for me, from a nice LBS, and I dealt with a nice owner, and I am having a nice time. 

This is a great learning bike. Yes, I may yearn for something else, but I started out with a Brownie Super 27 camera, and progressed to a Mamiya Sekor 1000 DTL, my dream camera at the time, and then to Leicas (used) and then to Nikons and needs demanded such. I figure the same with bikes. And I have enjoyed and cherished each and every camera, and I intend to enjoy each and every bike.

Don


----------



## josephr

Cadent said:


> This is totally arrogant of a true newbie posting to this thread, but even the ignorant have their story.
> 
> In a former life, I was a pretty fair photographer. Back in the film days. Newbie shooters would agonize over optimized f/stop for the focal length of the lens to minimize distortion, not realizing that the one _critical_ aspect was to GET THE SHOT! Granted, I was coming from a newspaper perspective, but dealing with people who focused on minutiae while missing the big picture always amazed me.
> 
> So, I now have my Raleigh Cadent FT3. Alum. frame, Tiagra components. No one rides Raleigh. No one posts about Raleigh. Have no idea where Raleigh ranks in the hierarchy of bikes. Really don't care. This is a nice bike for me, from a nice LBS, and I dealt with a nice owner, and I am having a nice time.
> 
> This is a great learning bike. Yes, I may yearn for something else, but I started out with a Brownie Super 27 camera, and progressed to a Mamiya Sekor 1000 DTL, my dream camera at the time, and then to Leicas (used) and then to Nikons and needs demanded such. I figure the same with bikes. And I have enjoyed and cherished each and every camera, and I intend to enjoy each and every bike.
> 
> Don



doesn't sound like you're ignorant to me...looks like you got a pretty smart deal on a nice new bike. The ignorance comes when people let themselves get caught up in all the hype and get something completely out of their league. I think we've all seen that one guy who hasn't ridden a bike since grade school and show's up at a club ride on a brand-new $2000 triathlon bike, with all the tri-style shoes, etc., and then starts puking 5 miles into it.


----------



## jeeper006

i got a new 2010 Specialized Allez sport today. Im going from a dept. store schwinn bike so the ride is AMAZING.

im 5'7 with short legs and a pretty normal torso length. I was stretched out on the schwinn, i got the 49cm allez and it fits perfect, we flipped the stem and slid the seat back a little and the fit is perfect. I usually do 16 mile rides, but today as soon as i got my bike i hit the road and didn't realize it but i went about 30 miles and never felt better. It was pretty awesome!!!


----------



## easyridernyc

there's nothing at all wrong with raleigh. they are originally an english company i think...i see a few of them here and there, the thing is, not only did they start out as a traditional and european manufacturer, but the domestic u.s. market may have changed a bit quicker than they were able to adapt, they lost a lot of f*kkin market share, man. with specialized, trek, cannnondale, giant, felt, jamis, and a number of other domestic companies or versions of domestic companies now competing for bike buying dollars, worldwide, its a tough to get the road, hybrid, comfort, kiddie mix right. pound for pound raleigh still manages to do o.k, just not out front on the u.s., or anyone else's high end road...

couple of years ago they made a push in domestic independent shops, but have since backed off. cadent was cool, but like i say, competition is tough. giant sells a lot of defy, good frame, good bike. same with specialized allez, trek 1 series etc. from what i see for '11 there's going to be a lot of emphasis on these kinds of bikes in the entry level market, both here and abroad. gold in them thar hills


----------



## dolomoto

-don't be embarrassed to buy a dept store bike (new or used) if you just plan on beating around the neighborhood and running errands. There is no shame in riding a $80 bicycle from Target as it's more important that you RIDE.

-Craigslist is littered with crappy (and a few nice) bikes at all price points. I picked up a mid-90's Trek 2300 in great condition for $300 and rode it 2500 miles in two years.

-a lighter/better/newer/nicer bike (of the same type, i.e. road bike vs road bike) will probably not make you faster. It may motivate you to ride farther/more often/with more comfort but you are not going to magically gain a couple of mph by going from a clapped out mid-90's Trek 2300 to a new $2000 bicycle (as my wife reminds me!)

-when looking for a LBS, be sure the folks ride. Here in Savannah, we are blessed with 4 bike shops. At 3 of them, the folks working there ride often and it shows. The fourth is a nice place and the owners are pleasant and helpful, but they don't ride much; how helpful do you think they may be in fitting and talking with expertise about road bikes?
(I took a friend by there, they sized him visually, pulled a bike off the rack with no adjustments and asked him to pedal around the very busy strip mall parking lot..we left after that).

-buy good gear, especially quality (about $40-60) bicycle shorts and a good helmet (a model that comes S,M,L,XL and has adjustments, iow not one size fits all). The rest of the stuff you can add later on.

-even if you don't ride at night, buy a nice (about ($30) flashing headlight (or strap a flashlight to the bars) and a nice strobing taillight and run them every time you ride.

-ask lots of questions. The only stupid question is one that is not asked. At one point, all of us knew nothing about bicycles.

-once you find an LBS that you like, spend your dollars there. Most will give a discount readily and value frequent customers (even if you're just buying a tube). I don't mind spending a few dollars more making sure that the LBS is around when I need them

-Ride. If you want to ride a bicycle better, then ride more often

YMMV.


----------



## mitchtaylorsbro

*First road bike, first century in 5 months!*

Hi all,

Looking for a little advice on purchasing my first road bike. I've ridden mountain bikes casually for 20 years (off and on, recently it's been mostly off). But I just signed on to do a Team in Training century in March 2011 and feel like I have to "get it right the first time." 

TnT coaches will provide some input on choosing a bike when the training rides start up in a few days, but I thought I'd get a head start here. 

About me: 5'8", currently 210 lb. (but hitting the gym and the bike trails 3X week since July), 29" inseam, size 8.5 feet. My stats do not match up with Dave Moulton's bike sizing chart, so what do I need to look for in a good road bike fit? Is there a certain relationship between body parts? I seen to remember a bike fitting class at REI said something about dropping a plumb line from your knee cap to your pedal, but that info was deleted from my brain years ago.

About the bike: I need a bike I can train on and complete this century ride without worrying about breakage--me or the bike  Beyond that, I hope to commute on it so outright performance is second to reliability and utility (fender and rack mounts, especially). Coming from the mountain bike realm, and being a fattie, I'd rather have heavier parts that I can count on. But the better components tend to be lighter anyway, which I believe is true in road and mtb parts. Psychologically, I like the comfort of knowing I have a granny gear, so I'm thinking a triple is important, but that could be my mtb background/bias.

About my budget: I figure I can afford $1500 for everything, but for budget purposes, think closer to $1700 because of the TnT discount I'll get. I already have a helmet, gloves, jerseys and shorts. Will need roadie shoes and winter gear like tights and a jacket.

So, any tips? I plan on doing the LBS thing because of TnT discount at one and, like I said, I need to get it right the first time. I don't have much time to be swapping parts to get a good fit. We'll be doing 40+ mile rides in about six weeks... yikes!

Thanks for any input,
MTB


----------



## Therewolf

So I understand that this is a road bike forum, however I was wondering if anyone could help me with some info on selecting a good mountain bike. I know much more about road bikes than I do mountain bikes and I don't want to buys something that 1. I really don't need or 2. is garbage because I was being too cheap.

I have been browsing a large variety of bikes. I know I want a full-suspension bike. I will not be racing. I simply want the bike for trail riding. Just for messing around and having something to do for fun. 

I have looked at bikes from Cannondale, Specialized, Giant and Trek, but it seems like the lower level options start at around $1500. I wasn't looking to spend too much because as I said, I won't be racing or competing. I just want something fun to do on the weekends on the side from all the road biking and training. 

I am pretty tall and currently ride a mens road bike so I don't feel I need a womens mountain bike. Any suggestions? I plan on going to my favorite local bike shop, but just wondering if anyone here has any suggestions first.


----------



## Shilo Rune 96

I'm thinking of buying a new bike. Well really this would be the first "real" bike I have had. Because in the past, I've only used cheap unreliable bikes or most recently a decent vintage knock-off bike I bought off Craigslist. That worked well until problems started occurring. So the time has come. I live in beautiful Portland, Oregon and biking here is so convenient, yet I have been taking it for granted. I would like to spend at most $600 for a bike that can get me to work (about 3 miles via city blocks and mostly a bike path along the river), can go on occasional trips, and trips to the grocery store etc. I really like the idea of an urban bike but I am having doubts at it only being a 1 speed. What's your opinion on this?


Shoot me some bikes that you think meet my criteria. 


Thank-you.


----------



## mitchtaylorsbro

Shilo Rune 96 said:


> I would like to spend at most $600 for a bike that can get me to work (about 3 miles via city blocks and mostly a bike path along the river), can go on occasional trips, and trips to the grocery store etc. I really like the idea of an urban bike but I am having doubts at it only being a 1 speed. What's your opinion on this?
> 
> 
> Shoot me some bikes that you think meet my criteria.
> 
> 
> Thank-you.


The last single-speed I rode was a beach cruiser back in the 80's, so I can't comment about the current crop. I prefer gears and am not afraid of doing a little maintenance.

That said, I think this is in your price range.

Novara Buzz Bike - 2011

Novara is REI's house brand. If you're an REI member, you can get 20% off during the members sale going on right now. 

Add a rear rack...

Planet Bike Eco Rack

and some panniers (aka saddlebags)...

Racktime DOUBLEit Panniers

...and you have an urban assault vehicle that's ideal for your commute and running simple errands. But if you don't have the basics (helmet, multi-tool, gloves, lock, floor pump, etc.), get those before getting the rack and saddlebags and just use a backpack to carry stuff.

HTH,
MTB


----------



## Shilo Rune 96

mitchtaylorsbro said:


> The last single-speed I rode was a beach cruiser back in the 80's, so I can't comment about the current crop. I prefer gears and am not afraid of doing a little maintenance.
> 
> That said, I think this is in your price range.
> 
> Novara Buzz Bike - 2011
> 
> Novara is REI's house brand. If you're an REI member, you can get 20% off during the members sale going on right now.
> 
> Add a rear rack...
> 
> Planet Bike Eco Rack
> 
> and some panniers (aka saddlebags)...
> 
> Racktime DOUBLEit Panniers
> 
> ...and you have an urban assault vehicle that's ideal for your commute and running simple errands. But if you don't have the basics (helmet, multi-tool, gloves, lock, floor pump, etc.), get those before getting the rack and saddlebags and just use a backpack to carry stuff.
> 
> HTH,
> MTB



Thanks for the suggestion, if I were to bump up my budget what would you suggest. Say to $1,000. I have been hearing good things about the Soho DLX from Trek and it seems like a neat bike. What is your take on it? 

http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/urban/soho/sohodlx/


----------



## mitchtaylorsbro

Shilo Rune 96 said:


> Thanks for the suggestion, if I were to bump up my budget what would you suggest. Say to $1,000. I have been hearing good things about the Soho DLX from Trek and it seems like a neat bike. What is your take on it?
> 
> http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/urban/soho/sohodlx/


That's pretty cool. Pricey, but you're paying a premium for the zero-maintenance belt drive and internally geared rear hub. You won't get a "chainring tattoo" and won't need degreaser and lube (and a supply of old t-shirts/rags). You'd just need the basics I mentioned above (helmet, etc.). 

But since I'm not afraid of a little maintenance (or a little grease), I'd save 50% and go with this:

Allant.

Whatever you buy, make sure you love it and ride it  
MTB


----------



## Shilo Rune 96

mitchtaylorsbro said:


> That's pretty cool. Pricey, but you're paying a premium for the zero-maintenance belt drive and internally geared rear hub. You won't get a "chainring tattoo" and won't need degreaser and lube (and a supply of old t-shirts/rags). You'd just need the basics I mentioned above (helmet, etc.).
> 
> But since I'm not afraid of a little maintenance (or a little grease), I'd save 50% and go with this:
> 
> Allant.
> 
> Whatever you buy, make sure you love it and ride it
> MTB



Haha thanks. Since we've got the ball rolling.... How about this one:

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/bikes/model/escape/7374/44053/


----------



## mitchtaylorsbro

Bikes around the same price tend to be built to the same level of quality and performance. There may be little things that differentiate them, like that Giant has a bell and kickstand, but they're all basically in the same ball park. A $750 bike will have better components than a $500, but will you be able to tell? Maybe, maybe not. But if you don't go too far below $500 (MSRP), you'll find a good commuter/city bike. And if you're in Portland, you'll probably want fenders in case you get caught out in the rain.

The one thing that tends to be unique to every bike line is geometry, which tells you how a bike feels when you ride it and how it fits your body. So, my advice is to pick a price and go test ride some bikes. Wear the clothes you would probably wear when you ride it and see how they feel. And wear a helmet


----------



## Shilo Rune 96

mitchtaylorsbro said:


> Bikes around the same price tend to be built to the same level of quality and performance. There may be little things that differentiate them, like that Giant has a bell and kickstand, but they're all basically in the same ball park. A $750 bike will have better components than a $500, but will you be able to tell? Maybe, maybe not. But if you don't go too far below $500 (MSRP), you'll find a good commuter/city bike. And if you're in Portland, you'll probably want fenders in case you get caught out in the rain.
> 
> The one thing that tends to be unique to every bike line is geometry, which tells you how a bike feels when you ride it and how it fits your body. So, my advice is to pick a price and go test ride some bikes. Wear the clothes you would probably wear when you ride it and see how they feel. And wear a helmet


I bought the Giant Escape City!!! For $540 it seems like a great bike so far. The bike shop was great, they were so helpful. I went to this place called Bike n Hike here in Portland. I heard some feedback from someone about Giant, that most bike manufactures (including Trek) buy all their frames directly from Giant. They said you can get a better price buying an official Giant bike to offset the licenses costs. 

I do agree, most bikes are all about the same at that price point.

I rode the beast for two hours tonight and now I'm ready to crash. I named her Lucy.


----------



## mitchtaylorsbro

Shilo Rune 96 said:


> I bought the Giant Escape City!!! For $540 it seems like a great bike so far. The bike shop was great, they were so helpful. I went to this place called Bike n Hike here in Portland. I heard some feedback from someone about Giant, that most bike manufactures (including Trek) buy all their frames directly from Giant. They said you can get a better price buying an official Giant bike to offset the licenses costs.
> 
> I do agree, most bikes are all about the same at that price point.
> 
> I rode the beast for two hours tonight and now I'm ready to crash. I named her Lucy.


Congrats! Hope Lucy gives you many years of happiness. 

Keep the rubber side down,
MTB


----------



## gaspi101

JayTee said:


> 1. How much do I need to spend? There's no right answer here, just like there isn't a right answer to "how much does a house/car/jacket cost?" That being said, if you are on a budget, don't fear. The entry level stuff in the road bike world (usually Shimano Sora components on an aluminum frame) is durable and will give you many seasons of happy riding. If you really take to it, you'll find yourself lusting for more and better within 1-2 seasons, or if you are a very casual 1,000 miles per year rider or less, that entry level steed could last you a decade. Just take care of it.
> 
> 2. How do I know if it fits? You'll get the same lecture over and over about the importance of fit, and people aren't lying. A too big or too small roadbike will truly take the joy out of riding. There are several good websites for bike sizing advice, including www.wrenchscience.com but for the true new rider, there's little to beat going to the local bike shop and spending a good amount of time with a knowledgeable salesperson.
> 
> 3. Can I get a better deal by buying used? Well, of course. The used bike market is notoriously soft, and that means that a used 2005 bike, for example, can cost 1/3 to 1/2 less than it did new on the floor. That $700 you want to spend can get you much more bang for the buck. But if you don't know what you are doing, you may wind up with a bike that doesn't fit, or has been crashed, has outdated components, yadda yadda. Unless you either know what you are doing or have a local friend to help, there's really value in getting your first road bike at the LBS. You'll get fit assistance, accessories discounts, and probably some complimentary service and adjustments. You'll have a relationship with someone to answer your questions, etc.
> 
> 4. Is Trek/Giant/Jamis/Motobecane, etc. any good? Look, don't PANIC over whether to buy the Trek 1000 or the Giant OCR3, or whatever. Bikes at a similar price point, especially in the budget range, are so similar that anyone who tries to tell you that one "sucks" and another is "so smooth" is blowing smoke. They might fit a little different with changes in geometry, just like jeans from different companies. In that respect, one may fit better than another. But to pretend there's a qualitative difference is pretty silly.
> 
> Those are my preliminary thoughts for now!


Absolutely excellent advice. My first bike was a Trek 1000c (bought two months ago), bought at Craigslist for a little over $300.00--Excellent bike, Shimano Sora all around, which got the job done--No climbing in Miami. Did a 100+ mile ride with zero discomfort, and have only recently upgraded to a 2011 Specialized Roubaix Elite so I can keep up with those 19-21mph beasts. If I was not an impulsive and capricious nut, I would have been very happy with my Trek 1000c for a long long time.


----------



## mstatham15

Hey, I am an absolute newbie to road biking and I had a quick question regarding local bike stores that are being mentioned in this post. I live in Atlanta and there are a ton of lbs around as well as large outdoor stores like rei. i love rei and love their service. would rei's bike service/selection be suitable for purchasing a bike and would rei be considered a lbs?

thanks for the help


----------



## d1zzl3

Well, I finally joined the darkside and bought a roadbike. Found a Univega 7.6 Carbolite 54cm for $250.


----------



## Revolutionary Technique

Hey guys, another newbie here. I just crashed my Walmart bike and realized how much I loved riding the bike. In search of a new bike I stumbled upon these forums, and you guys just opened my eyes. I usually used the pacific mountain bike to make about 8-10 mile trips to and from the tennis courts. Now that I crashed the bike and can't ride anymore, I realized the joy and freedom of riding the bike.(my only means of transportation, since I just turned 17). I found this bike online after a couple days of researching. (www)roadbikeoutlet.com/0featured/vilano-tuono-21sp-shimano-road-bike.html... This is really stretching my budget, I mean my original budget was $170.......I have also found this bike on craigslist, which is cheaper but I cant tell whether its a hybrid or a mountain bike. annapolis.craigslist.org/bik/2403802160.html..... which bike should I buy. I will mostly be riding on paved roads in decent condition.


----------



## gaspi101

Revolutionary Technique said:


> Hey guys, another newbie here. I just crashed my Walmart bike and realized how much I loved riding the bike. In search of a new bike I stumbled upon these forums, and you guys just opened my eyes. I usually used the pacific mountain bike to make about 8-10 mile trips to and from the tennis courts. Now that I crashed the bike and can't ride anymore, I realized the joy and freedom of riding the bike.(my only means of transportation, since I just turned 17). I found this bike online after a couple days of researching. (www)roadbikeoutlet.com/0featured/vilano-tuono-21sp-shimano-road-bike.html... This is really stretching my budget, I mean my original budget was $170.......I have also found this bike on craigslist, which is cheaper but I cant tell whether its a hybrid or a mountain bike. annapolis.craigslist.org/bik/2403802160.html..... which bike should I buy. I will mostly be riding on paved roads in decent condition.


The first thing you need to know before choosing a bike is the kind. The first is a generic road bike and the second is what appears to be a mountain bike in completely unknown condition. If your budget is around $200, id buy a used road bike like a 2005 Trek 1000 or something like that.


----------



## Revolutionary Technique

gaspi101 said:


> The first thing you need to know before choosing a bike is the kind. The first is a generic road bike and the second is what appears to be a mountain bike in completely unknown condition. If your budget is around $200, id buy a used road bike like a 2005 Trek 1000 or something like that.


Thanks, I guess I have to be patient and keep searching for a good deal.


----------



## flynn69

Im not worrying about the budget. I want to buy a cannondale. Im just starting to tour and retiring from work...Please direct me. thank you..............


----------



## WashU

If you want to buy Cannondale, and you don't care about the budget, just head to the closet Cannondale dealer and ride bikes until you find the one you want! That seems much more fun and effective than reading advice from people online.


----------



## max354

Once you find a bike that you want and have test ridden it, always make sure to call many bike shops in your area, most of them wont be afraid to match prices.


----------



## farleyhanes

Great tips!


----------



## robbmorg

*new bicycling help*

I am new to all of this and i am looking to buy my first Bike would like to do some long distance riding like is on this web page www>>mariettarcc>>org[/url] I am looking at a gt transeo 4.0 2011 what i like is the straight handlebars and the biger tires is bike a good one help Robby


----------



## gaspi101

robbmorg said:


> I am new to all of this and i am looking to buy my first Bike would like to do some long distance riding like is on this web page www>>mariettarcc>>org[/url] I am looking at a gt transeo 4.0 2011 what i like is the straight handlebars and the biger tires is bike a good one help Robby


Robby--you need to use english sentences and at least try a little with the syntax. I don't know what you are asking. Are you asking for help finding a bike? Help finding a long distance ride? Tips on long distance riding? Be clear, my son.


----------



## austinklee

I am just getting interested in buying a road bike and I was hoping someone could give some advice on used/new bikes and whether (as I have heard from friends) I should stay away from <$1000 bikes.


----------



## gaspi101

austinklee said:


> I am just getting interested in buying a road bike and I was hoping someone could give some advice on used/new bikes and whether (as I have heard from friends) I should stay away from <$1000 bikes.


Wrong. Your first bike should absolutely be less than $1000. You don know whether you're going to stick with it, etc. And for someone that is brand spanking new to road riding, you absolutely will not tell the difference between a $2,000 bike and a good $700 bike. 

If you can afford a $700 bike, go to your LBS and buy any 2011 model in that price range. They will all be good. If your budget is less, read about frame cracks and other typical problems from use and go look for one used. Ride that fo at least a few months and once you find yourself riding 100+ miles per week, or once you are riding 3-5 times per week for several months, only then will trading up to a more experience bike make sense. 

I bought my first bike used on Craigslist, a 2005 Trek 1000c, which when new was $675. I would be happy riding it still were it not that I'm riding about 150 miles per week and wanted a shiny new toy. 

There are guys in my group that ride harder and a lit faster than me, and they do it on 15 year old bikes that now cost about $200.

Despite what others tell you, the difference between a $2000 bike and a $700 bike is not that great. Also, the difference between a $2000 bike and a $8000 bike is even less.


----------



## jlp1976

From my personal experience I would have to say NOT to by a Tuano. The bike is a beutiful alumunum frame but that's all that it has for nice parts. They used the cheapest derailleurs on the market. The rear derailleur cable snapped quickly and the front brake came with a broke peice. Also the brake levers had lettering that was half worn off making me believe it was a used part. And if you are a bigger guy the wheels won't take you. I went through 4 tubes and the bike has less than an hour on it. So now I am building the fame until I can afford a better one. That's just because I like to build things so it's more of a hobby/project bike now.


----------



## crazy cat lady

*How to buy a bike and a saddle*

I get asked this all the time. Here's my answer:

1) Try a BUNCH in your price range. Take the time to test many bikes. You will develop your taste over time and become educated about bikes. 2) Buy from a local shop that includes a thorough fit with purchase price. What a "fit" is: after you buy a bike, the shop schedules a time (generally 2 hours) to have you come to the shop with your bike. A staff member will have you get on the bike and they will make adjustments to "fit" it to you. This is VERY important to enjoying cycling in the long run. A poorly fitted bike can hurt you. Buying from a local shop mean if you have problems, you don't have to go far to get them fixed. Ask around for shops that have a good customer service reputation. Yelp sometimes has these. 4) Don't buy any bike because a friend/boyfriend/husband says you should. Get the one that fits YOU. Good luck!

What I own: Giant carbon OCR. After testing many bike, I decided I wanted a carbon one. The Giants were $1000 less than their competitors. They own their own factory so can keep costs down. Giants are sold at the Bicycle Trip. If you go, tell them I sent you!

P.S. Next: Buy a saddle that fits if the one that comes with your new bike does not. Pick a saddle by going to a shop that lets you try them out before purchase (not all do). Take your bike and one after another keep trying saddles by riding them around the block on your bike. I personally prefer Specialized. But that's my body. They have a cool system where you sit on a "butt o' meter" and it measures your sit bones. Then you choose the saddle that has those measurements. The Spokesman sells these.


----------



## andrew219

I have a question.
Is there any road bike that I can buy for around $150. I'm a 16 yr boy wanting to get into the sport of cycling by just riding around paved trails on a mountain nearby (about 10miles).


----------



## crazy cat lady

Garage sales, craigslist.org. Here in Santa Cruz: 1) Goodwill Bargain Barn 2) Bike Church has retrofitted used bikes. There may be some organization like that in your area. 3) Contact your local youth cycling club. Once you get a bike, look up on the web about how a bike should fit you. Then adjust accordingly. Good luck!


----------



## BeginnerCycling

andrew219 said:


> I have a question.
> Is there any road bike that I can buy for around $150. I'm a 16 yr boy wanting to get into the sport of cycling by just riding around paved trails on a mountain nearby (about 10miles).


I may draw fire from some of the bike snobs around, but when people state a budget I try to first quote something within their budget, so here's about the only geared road bike that I know of that fits your budget and has surprisingly decent consumer reviews: GMC Denali Road Bike

It also comes in a 24 inch size in case you need that size: 24 Inch Denali Bike

Hope this helps, happy riding!


----------



## gaspi101

BeginnerCycling said:


> I may draw fire from some of the bike snobs around, but when people state a budget I try to first quote something within their budget, so here's about the only geared road bike that I know of that fits your budget and has surprisingly decent consumer reviews: GMC Denali Road Bike
> 
> It also comes in a 24 inch size in case you need that size: 24 Inch Denali Bike
> 
> Hope this helps, happy riding!


No flame here! And for the budget, this is probably the best youre goimg to get, which is probably enough to keep you happy. One line in the description did make me laugh a little: "the high-performance 700c tires are up to the challenge of rigorous street racing.". Lol

Also, twist shifters?! Is that like on a mountain bike? In any event, for the price, i agree with you.


----------



## andrew219

Thanks guys!
I've read reviews about that bike and it has "twist shifters" which I googled and is on the top of the handle bar. How much would it cost (or is it possible) to get a different shifter that would be located near the brakes (on the drop down). Would a stem shifter work?

Also I found this bicycle which is a litter over my budget but is is better than the Denali Road Bike?: Victory Vision 700cc Road Bike ($179.00) I found it on Walmart.com but I'm not allowed to link anyyhing.


----------



## BeginnerCycling

Although twist shifters are unusual on a road bike, they would probably be fine -- perhaps slightly more convenient than the stem shifters on the Victory Vision, since most people spend a decent bit of time "on the tops", so your hand would be near the twist shifters. Of course, stem shifters work o.k. too (had them on an old Schwinn years ago). 

I don't know a lot about either bike, but between the two I'd probably stick with the Denali because of the slightly better review average and the sheer number of reviews give it added credibility (many companies have a few employees who post good reviews, so when I see 3 and a half stars with only 12 or 16 reviews with a spread of ratings, I kind of discount some of the better reviews). Plus, personally I think I'd like the twist shifters more than the stem shifters.


----------



## andrew219

Thanks!

But I saw this on craigslist, is it worth it? Or should I rather just buy the Denali because it's new and has warranty?


Mens White RALEIGH TECNIUM 12 SPD 400 Aluminum mainframe tube 6061-T8 Shimano light action gears Shiano SIS Shifters Sakae XS Crank Easy off front wheel water bottle holder


----------



## BeginnerCycling

Probably need more details on the bike -- including price, age, condition, pictures, etc. What city is it listed in Craigslist?


----------



## andrew219

Price - $110
and North Jersey > Search for "Raligh Tecnium", he spelled Technium wrong.
Two pictures included


----------



## NJBiker72

I have the Denali. I replaced it in less than a year but leave it in the basement on a trainer so as not wear my good bike out. 

The Denali is not bad. I did a 75 mile ride on it and made it to the top before my colleagues including one on a Pinarello. 

That said it weighs a ton. Tires are very thick and bulky. It shifts poorly. Grip shifters are much less efficient and dangerous than typical road bikes. 

It's really a hybrid with a road headset. 

Go and get a real roadbike instead.


----------



## andrew219

I don't have the money to get a "real" roadbike.


----------



## NJBiker72

andrew219 said:


> I don't have the money to get a "real" roadbike.


Then I would suggest used or buying a hybrid. 

You can get a Giant or Specialized hybrid for about the same. You could go to Dick's or Sports Authority and get a decent hybrid. 

The Denali is a hybrid with drop bars. That's it. 

If you really want one, I have one. Been ridden half a season on the road. Another season in the basement. 

You'll upgrade before you know it. At least with a real hybrid you will have a good bike to ride with the kids or casually. 

I used mine for rides because I did not want to spend the money on a real road bike. I spent it the next year on a Secteur. Under $1K.


----------



## aplcr0331

Note to self: Read bike forums...BEFORE...buying a bike. Well, I guess the only thing I can do now is to ride and hope it stays together for a while. 

Plus, HOLY **** this is an expensive sport/hobby/lifestyle.


----------



## gaspi101

aplcr0331 said:


> Note to self: Read bike forums...BEFORE...buying a bike. Well, I guess the only thing I can do now is to ride and hope it stays together for a while.
> 
> Plus, HOLY **** this is an expensive sport/hobby/lifestyle.


Oh, yes. Ive blown entire paychecks at my LBS. But you can buy used. And once you have the bike and the basic accessories, its a cheap (almost completely free) hobby. My first road bike was a 2005 Trek 1000c, which is a perfectly decent bike and could give you many seasons of happy riding. Gave it to my brother when I got my Roubaix. The Trek was more than $700 when new, bought for about $300 in perfect condition. Instead of buying a wallmart roadbike, I suggest you hit Craigslist. Great deals there.


----------



## gaspi101

aplcr0331 said:


> Note to self: Read bike forums...BEFORE...buying a bike. Well, I guess the only thing I can do now is to ride and hope it stays together for a while.
> 
> Plus, HOLY **** this is an expensive sport/hobby/lifestyle.


Also, a lot of people go bike crazy, and forget that your performance is 90% all you. If you have road bike tires and wheels, you'll probably be going the same speed as if you were riding in a $2,000.00 bike.

When I had my old Trek 1000, I used to murder by brother every single ride, who rode his friend's madone.


----------



## BeginnerCycling

andrew219 said:


> Price - $110
> and North Jersey > Search for "Raligh Tecnium", he spelled Technium wrong.
> Two pictures included


O.k. I looked at it. Hard to tell too much from the pictures or description. I'd probably ask him if it is in "ready to ride" condition -- does it shift to all gears, do the tires hold air, do the brakes work. Have tires, brakes or cables been replaced recently (not exactly sure, but the bike is probably 20 years old or so). If not you may need to do so -- even if they say "tires hold air" you probably need to replace them if they are not fairly new. Most importantly, you need to find out if it is the right size for you -- the right fit is important (and the one thing you can't really fix later).

There's also a Panasonic DX-1000 on the North Jersey Craigslist in your price range, though a little more. Note that it is a 20" frame, so probably for someone over 6 feet tall.

If the Technium has been kept in decent shape, I might go with it over the Panasonic and Denali as long as it fits you. Probably offer $80 to $100. Please let us know what you decide!


----------



## NJBiker72

aplcr0331 said:


> Note to self: Read bike forums...BEFORE...buying a bike. Well, I guess the only thing I can do now is to ride and hope it stays together for a while.
> 
> Plus, HOLY **** this is an expensive sport/hobby/lifestyle.


Well it can be but really you can get a very nice quality road bike for under 1K and after that well there is little cost. Unlike golf or skiing (my other hobbies) where you pay everytime you go.


----------



## MDMaine

*New Guy*

I have been reading through thread after thread, review after review. I am trying to make an educated decision on a road bike. I have test rode 4 bikes (Trek 2.1, Madone 3.1, Cannondale synapse alloy 5 and a CAAD 10) I am leaning towards the CAAD 10 Rival. I found this thread to be very helpful. My LBS has been very helpful as well in answering my questions. Thanks to everyone for posting their tidbits of advice it definitely has helped IMO.


----------



## NJBiker72

MDMaine said:


> I have been reading through thread after thread, review after review. I am trying to make an educated decision on a road bike. I have test rode 4 bikes (Trek 2.1, Madone 3.1, Cannondale synapse alloy 5 and a CAAD 10) I am leaning towards the CAAD 10 Rival. I found this thread to be very helpful. My LBS has been very helpful as well in answering my questions. Thanks to everyone for posting their tidbits of advice it definitely has helped IMO.


Not an expert but I would strongly suggest checking out Giant and Specialized as well. From my own experience and some others you may get a little more for your money. 

OTOH the ones you are looking at are very good as well. And if your LBS only carries those it may be worth it. 

FWIW, my Specialized had an issue with the front derailur. Took it into my LBS they asked how I was doing (knowing I was recovering from a crash). Looked over the bike, fixed the derailur answered a couple of questions. Gave me the bike back at no charge. 

Ok. I really like the Giants and Pinarellos and some other brands. But if it's one of those somewhere else or an S-Works from Jay's. I'm getting the S-Works.


----------



## MDMaine

NJBiker72 said:


> Not an expert but I would strongly suggest checking out Giant and Specialized as well. From my own experience and some others you may get a little more for your money.
> 
> OTOH the ones you are looking at are very good as well. And if your LBS only carries those it may be worth it.


They have a few used Specialized but nothing new. They have Cervelo, but that is a little too rich for my blood at this point in time. I will have to look around and see what other shops are near me. Thanks for the advice.


----------



## jagron11

Good tips on this thread. Thanks,


----------



## paco1961

Ok folks, I've been following. I'm relatively new but reasonably intelligent. I've been looking at the Windsor Fens at Bikesdirect for $700 with al frame, carbon fork, 105s etc. Seems like a great deal considering that at that price in local LBS I'm looking at bigger brands at 10-12 lbs heavier, bottom of the line components etc. Heading in the direction of the Fens 58 (I'm 6'1") and will deal with customizing the fit at one LBS that has some folks that seem bright and helpful - unfortunatley their bike line bottoms out at about $1400 which is way too much for me. Any comments?


----------



## NJBiker72

I've heard good things about BD. And I like bargains and buying on the net. Put it this way, my other hobby is golf. All my clubs were bought on line and built by myself after a basic class and some reading. 

That said I don't ride my driver 100 miles in traffic, bad weather and over mountains. 

I'd be nervous with the bike online (I did this with the Wally World bike initially and regretted it). 

But if you have been fit professionally and are comfortable that the LBS will support you as if you had bought it there, then go for it. 

I just know how often I have been in to my LBS for adjustments, tweaks and questions. Not to mention they offer local group rides which I would feel out of place on a BD or anything but one of theirs.


----------



## zekgb

Hello everyone, I'm a complete newbie who after a fair amount of research (including a ton of time on this site - thanks everyone!) decided to make a 1988 Vitus 979 with Shimano 600 components his first road bike. I purchased the bike off of CL from its original owner and while it's not in perfect shape cosmetically I feel like it was a pretty good value at $330. I will be going in for a fitting at my LBS next week an my biggest challenge is resisting the urge to start racking up the miles before I do so.


----------



## kokooner01

Hi, I need people who know about bikes to recommend the best bike out of the following three. I knoe almost nothing about bikes but its a learning curve. I am planning to buy it within a week or two so replies and the pros and cons would be amazing!! thank you

1) Marin Venezia $1100
2) Defy 3 Giant $950
3) Trek 1.2 $870


----------



## NJBiker72

kokooner01 said:


> Hi, I need people who know about bikes to recommend the best bike out of the following three. I knoe almost nothing about bikes but its a learning curve. I am planning to buy it within a week or two so replies and the pros and cons would be amazing!! thank you
> 
> 1) Marin Venezia $1100
> 2) Defy 3 Giant $950
> 3) Trek 1.2 $870


Try them and see what you like. Remember the shop selling matters too. 

But if I had to take one of those it would be the Giant.


----------



## fitnessRider

I have a budget of $400 and I have found these after doing a bit of googling. 

Vilano FORZA 4.0 $360 24lbs
Tommaso Tiempo $380 27lbs
Tommaso Imola $400 24lbs
GMC Denali Pro Road Bike	$299 27lbs
Giordano Libero 1.6 $380 24lbs
ToTo Maven $400

This is not an end all, just what I have found so far. Or would you suggest going used?


----------



## gaspi101

fitnessRider said:


> I have a budget of $400 and I have found these after doing a bit of googling.
> 
> Vilano FORZA 4.0 $360 24lbs
> Tommaso Tiempo $380 27lbs
> Tommaso Imola $400 24lbs
> GMC Denali Pro Road Bike	$299 27lbs
> Giordano Libero 1.6 $380 24lbs
> ToTo Maven $400
> 
> This is not an end all, just what I have found so far. Or would you suggest going used?


For that budget youre much better off buying a used bike with good components. You can get 2006-07 bike that cost $800 when new. If it's in good condition, it'll be worth it.


----------



## BeginnerCycling

kokooner01 said:


> Hi, I need people who know about bikes to recommend the best bike out of the following three. I knoe almost nothing about bikes but its a learning curve. I am planning to buy it within a week or two so replies and the pros and cons would be amazing!! thank you
> 
> 1) Marin Venezia $1100
> 2) Defy 3 Giant $950
> 3) Trek 1.2 $870


I used to have a Giant Defy 3, and it was a great beginner road bike. One possible advantage of the Trek 1.2 is that you can get it with a compact crank - which has some simplicity advanages over the triple crank on the Giant and the Marin. However, with the cassette (gears in the back) only going up to 26 teeth, you would not have quite as easy a time going up hill as you would on the Giant.


----------



## fitnessRider

*Used Bike*

Where are good places to buy a used bike after we know our size?


----------



## paco1961

craigs list and ebay are fine if you know what you are looking for. Also, I find that if you put the word out at your lbs, things gradually come out of the woodwork. Just can't be in a hurry to go either of these routes.


----------



## Thrasher007

First off, being that I'm new to RBR.com, I would like to take a second to say, "HI TO EVERYONE"! I'm new to the forums and road bike community. At this point i'm researching and learning bout road bike's, i'm not planing to become a professional rider. Instead, i'm more interested in the "fitness and recreation " aspect of riding.  Choosing a bike is really tough for me, being that I like many different bikes. I can honestly say the few bikes I'm drawn to are as follows: Giant tcr advance sl, Fuji sst 2, Ridley noah rs and Focus cayo!! Does anyone have any experience with any of these bike?


----------



## sherlock

Thrasher007 said:


> Choosing a bike is really tough for me, being that I like many different bikes. I can honestly say the few bikes I'm drawn to are as follows: Giant tcr advance sl, Fuji sst 2, Ridley noah rs and Focus cayo!! Does anyone have any experience with any of these bike?


What's your budget? Judging by those bikes, it seems to be around the $2.5k-$3.5k mark. If so, add the Felt F5 & Felt F4 to your list, as well as the Cannondale CAAD10 3 and CAAD10 2. The Felt's and CAAD10's have very good reputations.


----------



## Thrasher007

Well, for my first bike my budget is upward to $3,700.00 range. Thanks for the suggestions though!


----------



## sherlock

Thrasher007 said:


> Well, for my first bike my budget is upward to $3,700.00 range. Thanks for the suggestions though!


You really can't go that wrong with bikes in that price range. I'd definitely look at a Felt F4 or CAAD10 1 when you're out shopping. As one piece of advice, ride a few bikes and don't let a shop sucker you in. First bike + $3700 = easy sales target.


----------



## kneisly

*affordable bike.*

I just purchased the scattante cfr sport. I have about 400 miles on it at this point and I would recommend it to anyone! really great full carbon bike for 1100! (on sale at performance ) great starter bike.


----------



## hotpockets

*New to road cycling*

Thank you all for the advice in this thread. It helped out a lot. I look forward to picking my new bike up from the LBS in a few weeks.. I have been riding mountain bikes for over ten years and every year at this time I have the bug to get into road cycling. I found this site and started viewing all the threads that would help make my purchase less stressful. And then I found the podium girls thread but was not able to view all the pictures so I registered. Since then I have not been back to the podium girls thread. There is so much information on this forum. Once I get my bike and put some miles on it I will post how everything went. If anyone is in the Groton Connecticut area and wouldn't mind riding with a newbie, give me all call. 6192434003


----------



## wcipolli

I just got a sweet used bike off craigslist for $50 bucks! Of course after I bought it I found out New Haven has a bike collector and if you build two bikes from the parts the collect from abandoned bikes you can keep one of them! Really good around there because some Yalies just leave their bikes and buy new ones.


----------



## hotpockets

*bike collector*

That sounds cool. Is this bike collector place available to the public and where exactly is it located.


----------



## wcipolli

Last I heard it was in the New Haven Free Store, put it together and add .com (still no hyperlinks for me.) I did hear they are in the process of moving so I'm not sure where it currently is. I would call new haven if you can't find out through the website.


----------



## dreamwinner

i think performance bikes is a great place to start, being a complete noob myself, i found there prices especially attractive, and when u go in during one of their big sales, you save A LOT! My mind set is basically buy something that works and see if I like it in the long run, and man i am loving my bike


----------



## biker_on_a_budget

This thread is awesome! I actually started a blog specifically about this:

Biker on a Budget

As you can see from the blog, I've been cycling seriously for about a month now. I'm really looking forward to improving and using my blog to get others started. Suggestions are welcomed!


----------



## jones0

How old is the trek 1500 on ebay?

260838545554

worth it?


----------



## gaspi101

jones0 said:


> How old is the trek 1500 on ebay?
> 
> 260838545554
> 
> worth it?


Link. We're not gonna go search eBay for the item number....


----------



## jones0

gaspi101 said:


> Link. We're not gonna go search eBay for the item number....


I can't post links. It comes up if you put it in google.

Ta.


----------



## buster71

Used is a great way to go. I picked up a 2009 Jamis Ventura Comp today (w/ upgraded wheel set) for less than 1/2 the price of a comparable new ride from the LBS. The bike I got has only about 300 mi. on it and it looks practically new. A great way to dip your foot into the sport or get a bike to learn on and figure out what you REALLY want. Of course, you lose the LBS service, fitting, etc... but if you buy local you can test ride the bike for fit.


----------



## gaspi101

jones0 said:


> I can't post links. It comes up if you put it in google.
> 
> Ta.


I don't know how much bikes are in the UK, but a Trek 1500 was originally about $700.00 when new, and this one is new for about $500.00. If this is a 2010 or 2011 (did they make the 1500 then?), then I'd say ok. But 2009 and below, I'd say are worth more like in the 200 pound range. Also, this one has been seriously messed with in componentry and maybe even structural (according to the description). I wouldn't buy it. I'd be looking more at your newspaper or local garage sales (do they have those in the UK?).

Cheers!


----------



## Varaxis

I'm looking for a recommendation for a new commuter/beater road or hybrid bike for going to the store, school, and friends' houses. I'd like to find a bike around $350 +/- 300, new or used. I don't want anything fancy, since it's going to get beat up and sit outside locked up to bike racks, trees, etc. Being fast is a big plus. Being able to hop curbs and stuff is also a plus. Reliability and is tops though. Versatility is a good plus as well (rack braze-ons, fender mounts, water bottle mount, etc.). Lightweight or frame material is a toss-up... not sure what I prefer.

I'm 5'7" with a 29" inseam, so I think I'm between size 52-54cm. I prefer a road specific single speed bike or internal gear hub, though may consider a singlespeed mtn bike converted to road with balloon tires. I'm used to mtn bikes, but don't mind the road bike position with dropbars.

I live in SoCal, in a flat desert area in the valley with fairly wide roads, but weeds often grow into the shoulder and there are goathead-type thorns and also seeds from trees that are littered along the road and can get embedded into tires. Streets with parked cars and construction areas worry me, so I used to ride sidewalks in certain areas, but I've been hassled for that, so I kind of want a fast bike that can somewhat keep up with street traffic so I don't feel compelled to use the sidewalk. It doesn't rain much, but the bike will get wet (sweat, sprinklers, puddles from water run off from people washing stuff in their driveways, etc) and don't want to get road spray on my clothes.

So far, these bikes interest me:

Eastern Gran Royale Lurker $330+tax @ JensonUSA
Charge Plug Grinder $350 @ BonkTown
Charge Plug Freestyler $350 @ BonkTown
Swobo Sanchez $350 @ BonkTown

Not sure about Swobo's 120 OLD rear wheel spacing with a hub with a thread on freewheel (any downsides to wheel strength due to narrow spaced flanges? is this for better chainline?). Not really a fan of the Grinder colors, but I like Charge bikes' style in general. The Eastern looks like some fixie made for tricks. Haven't ridden any of 'em.

Not really dependent on a LBS, since I wrench for myself and know how to do almost all routine maintenance and remove/install/replace procedures, at least for mtn bikes, but figure it should all be in Zinn's book. This opens up pretty much anything from online shops, factory direct bikes, and used bikes for consideration. I just don't have the eye for quality reliable parts yet and would primarily like to absorb some wisdom from experienced folks here.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Blacktop

Like other have said and I did. I picked up a super clean used bike and was able to spend the difference between new and used on some real nice gear. Plus you save a bunch with depreciation and NO sales taxes. Win, Win


----------



## Emdee406

*My First Road bike...I'm in love.*

Well, I took the plunge and went for the best, least expensive bike I could find - a $700 Giant Defy 3. Beautiful, white and to me at least, light. 
Two months earlier, I had bought an Urban Hybrid from GT called the Traffic, a single speed machine to make myself work. Sadly after 27 miles my poor old knees, after 30 yrs of snowboarding/skateboarding etc decided to inflate to twice their normal size. My Physio insisted I go for a geared Road Bike to spare my knees!
I'm so glad I did...

Here are 10 things I have learned as a Newbie...
Road Bike Newbie - things I have learned.*

1) anytime you ride uphill or sprint, it will be into a headwind.*
2) after 12 miles today a part of my body I consider important, went completely numb...might need a saddle change or new cycle pants with decent padding!
3) all the stones and general road debris collects in the cycle lane.*
4) you know you're in Utah when you have to swerve to avoid roadkill ie Raccoons and today, a Deer.*
5) you know you picked the wrong direction for your 18 mile loop when you notice that every other Roadie is going the opposite way. This is further confirmed by observation no. 1).
6) unless you need extra protein from flying insects, breathe through the nose only.*
7) my feet ache because I'm not using clip-ins. Note to self, shoes and pedals on the Christmas list.*
8) your likelihood of a puncture rises exponentially according to your need to get back home for something important.*
9) you need to have a little masochistic streak to enjoy climbing hills. I live at altitude in a ski town, the last mile of my ride is the steepest part...wherever I go, the ride home is uphill.*
10) I LOVE IT!


----------



## tamahoney

I am in the market for my first ever road bike and I wanted to see if anyone had any advice. I have been looking around and found a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 ($699) and Felt F95 (as part of a "Rookie package" for about the same price). I guess the questions I have are:
1. Are those good starter bikes?
2. Between those two, which should I choose?
3. Are there other bikes I should be looking at (I have looked at the Cannondale CAAD 8, Specialized Allez Compact, and Trek 1.2)?
4. Any other advice as I prepare for my first trip to a bike shop?


----------



## gaspi101

Emdee406 said:


> Well, I took the plunge and went for the best, least expensive bike I could find - a $700 Giant Defy 3. Beautiful, white and to me at least, light.
> Two months earlier, I had bought an Urban Hybrid from GT called the Traffic, a single speed machine to make myself work. Sadly after 27 miles my poor old knees, after 30 yrs of snowboarding/skateboarding etc decided to inflate to twice their normal size. My Physio insisted I go for a geared Road Bike to spare my knees!
> I'm so glad I did...
> 
> Here are 10 things I have learned as a Newbie...
> Road Bike Newbie - things I have learned.*
> 
> 1) anytime you ride uphill or sprint, it will be into a headwind.*
> 2) after 12 miles today a part of my body I consider important, went completely numb...might need a saddle change or new cycle pants with decent padding!
> 3) all the stones and general road debris collects in the cycle lane.*
> 4) you know you're in Utah when you have to swerve to avoid roadkill ie Raccoons and today, a Deer.*
> 5) you know you picked the wrong direction for your 18 mile loop when you notice that every other Roadie is going the opposite way. This is further confirmed by observation no. 1).
> 6) unless you need extra protein from flying insects, breathe through the nose only.*
> 7) my feet ache because I'm not using clip-ins. Note to self, shoes and pedals on the Christmas list.*
> 8) your likelihood of a puncture rises exponentially according to your need to get back home for something important.*
> 9) you need to have a little masochistic streak to enjoy climbing hills. I live at altitude in a ski town, the last mile of my ride is the steepest part...wherever I go, the ride home is uphill.*
> 10) I LOVE IT!


Excellent post! The humor reminds me of Dave Barry. Thanks for the laughs, my friend.


----------



## Emdee406

gaspi101 said:


> Excellent post! The humor reminds me of Dave Barry. Thanks for the laughs, my friend.


You are very welcome! More observations to come...going on my 1st ever group ride on Monday...fingers crossed!


----------



## techrider

To really get into biking means to constantly improving your riding skills while also improving your gear. For the first bike going to a reputable shop where they will fit you and find a good match is a good way to go. As you ride you will start to get a feel for things like frame stiffness, how well the drive train work, etc.

For me it was clear after a certain point that you outgrow the LSB in terms of how much you learn and more importantly how much your budget can handle. If you are married, how much your spouse can handle your equipment budget.

That is how I ended up building my first road bike from scratch, totally custom fitted with my favorite parts for half the cost of store purchase. Another gripe about stores for me is that there is usually a long wait to get service. If you get good with a wrench you save time and money. :thumbsup:


----------



## mksmith713

gaspi101 said:


> Absolutely excellent advice. My first bike was a Trek 1000c (bought two months ago), bought at Craigslist for a little over $300.00--Excellent bike, Shimano Sora all around, which got the job done--No climbing in Miami. Did a 100+ mile ride with zero discomfort, and have only recently upgraded to a 2011 Specialized Roubaix Elite so I can keep up with those 19-21mph beasts. If I was not an impulsive and capricious nut, I would have been very happy with my Trek 1000c for a long long time.


WOW!!!!! 19-21 on a road bike is considered a beast? 
I'm a total newbie having just purchased my first bike a few weeks ago.
My budget wouldn't allow for a road bike so I settled for what THEY call a fitness bike.
Trek 7.3 fx.
It has 700c x 32 tires and I'm considering going with a thinner higher pressure tires to increase my speed (considering Trialthalons on this bike).
With the current tires and a nice cadence I'm averaging between 17 and 21 mph on fairly flat roads here in So. Fla.
I was curious if dropping to a 700c x 25 would increase my speed enough to justify the expense.
Any input would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Peter_leo

$700-800 is the base price range I would purchase a basic road bike for. Lower than that would be for a bike of less than adequate quality.


----------



## gaspi101

mksmith713 said:


> WOW!!!!! 19-21 on a road bike is considered a beast?
> I'm a total newbie having just purchased my first bike a few weeks ago.
> My budget wouldn't allow for a road bike so I settled for what THEY call a fitness bike.
> Trek 7.3 fx.
> It has 700c x 32 tires and I'm considering going with a thinner higher pressure tires to increase my speed (considering Trialthalons on this bike).
> With the current tires and a nice cadence I'm averaging between 17 and 21 mph on fairly flat roads here in So. Fla.
> I was curious if dropping to a 700c x 25 would increase my speed enough to justify the expense.
> Any input would be greatly appreciated.


19-21mph average, according to my cateye, but i guess that is including stops, traffic lights, etc.. Also, our rides aren't ever less than 60 miles. Most of the ride, we're doing 22-23. Maybe to you, that's not a lot, but to me, it is! I'm happy to say, I'm almost there...


----------



## sherlock

tamahoney said:


> I am in the market for my first ever road bike and I wanted to see if anyone had any advice. I have been looking around and found a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 ($699) and Felt F95 (as part of a "Rookie package" for about the same price). I guess the questions I have are:
> 1. Are those good starter bikes?
> 2. Between those two, which should I choose?
> 3. Are there other bikes I should be looking at (I have looked at the Cannondale CAAD 8, Specialized Allez Compact, and Trek 1.2)?
> 4. Any other advice as I prepare for my first trip to a bike shop?


The Felt is a good bike, but go ride them all (the Fuji, the Specialized and a CAAD8) before you even think of deciding. Try them for fit, for feel and also test the shops that sell them (good service, good advice, willing to spend time fitting you).


----------



## Emdee406

*Noob's first group ride.*



Emdee406 said:


> You are very welcome! More observations to come...going on my 1st ever group ride on Monday...fingers crossed!


Here is the ride report post #59
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/beginners-corner/negativity-snobery-cycling-world-255886.html


----------



## darek541

On a 500-600$ budget, im stuck in a loop. I am in desperate need of a new bike as my vintage fujis cassette/chain/derailleur are so worn it would be inadvantageous to replace them, and thus i am at a crossroads. I visited an LBS that deals exclusively in fuji, and a kind younger gentleman showed me the fuji newest 4, 2011 model if im not mistaken. The down tube shifters really turned me off but he offered it to me for 500$. Its on the 2200/2300s so the components are lowgrade. Its a great ride though, and really comfortable for a road bike. I was surprised at how light it was. 

On the other hand i have the infamous dirty dealers gravity liberty 2 for the same price. Now im more then tech savvy so assembly shouldnt be a problem, but should i take the risk and go for the liberty? It seems of a quality build, and the fit seems spot on. If any of you enthusiasts could take a look and compare the two and or give a personal opinion, i would really appreciate it. 

Since i doubt as a noobie i can post links, im just going to restate my conundrum. 

LBS bought fuji newest 4.0 @500$ vs. BD Gravity Liberty 2 @500$


----------



## sherlock

If you don't like downtube shifters, don't buy a bike with them. Either save some more cash, or buy the other option.

The problem with the latter is you don't know if it will fit well.


----------



## NJBiker72

You could look used too. Probably fare better. And lose less if you change your mind.


----------



## mvallejo

very helpful...


----------



## darek541

Ive also tried the raleigh revenio 1.0 but in all honesty, the fuji trumps all in terms of comfort. I simply enjoyed riding it. Im going to wait on a deal for the fuji newest 3.0. Thanks for your advice guys.


----------



## mjmi11er

i'm very interested in getting started in riding. in visiting the lbs i have noticed most low end bike are between 1300-1700 dollars. where better bikes are going between 2300-2700.

with this being my first bike but not knowing if i will be into riding long term (even though i think i will) what is everyone's thoughts behind the following idea... i would post a new thread but i don't have any posts yet so i have to tag on other folks threads first.

i found the al-2 road bike on the nashbar site. (sorry i can't post links either i guess until i get 10 posts).

i have searched and others have done nashbar builds. i would assume this would go along those lines. i would have no problem swapping out the seat or pedals if need be. i would even probably go to a lbs and pay to get fitted for a bike to ensure i order the correct size. my deal is i can't see paying near 2000 dollars when i could get this one for just over 700, maybe less at sale time. yeah, i'd have a few parts to put together but in the long run it's really a comparible bike right? 105 groupset, carbon forks, etc, etc.


----------



## NJBiker72

mjmi11er said:


> i'm very interested in getting started in riding. in visiting the lbs i have noticed most low end bike are between 1300-1700 dollars. where better bikes are going between 2300-2700.
> 
> with this being my first bike but not knowing if i will be into riding long term (even though i think i will) what is everyone's thoughts behind the following idea... i would post a new thread but i don't have any posts yet so i have to tag on other folks threads first.
> 
> i found the al-2 road bike on the nashbar site. (sorry i can't post links either i guess until i get 10 posts).
> 
> i have searched and others have done nashbar builds. i would assume this would go along those lines. i would have no problem swapping out the seat or pedals if need be. i would even probably go to a lbs and pay to get fitted for a bike to ensure i order the correct size. my deal is i can't see paying near 2000 dollars when i could get this one for just over 700, maybe less at sale time. yeah, i'd have a few parts to put together but in the long run it's really a comparible bike right? 105 groupset, carbon forks, etc, etc.


Getting fitted and ordering online will get you a frame size but unless you get the LBS to put it together, you are on your own for all the adjustments. And likely for any maintenance you need. 

It can be done. I got a cheap one online first, real cheap. But after I have been going with the same LBS. I trust them and if there are any problems I can trust them to help. 

You can get a decent bike from an LBS for under $1k. Not great but decent. I paid about $950 for my Secteur Sport. I just upgraded to a Tarmac from the same shop. Service was outstanding. Measured legs and learned my hips are off (probably from crashes so that was taken into account when setting up the bike.


----------



## darek541

If you guys could take a look at this posting and tell me if you think its worth it, i would appreciate it. I am deeply interested in this, but i have no experience in what to look for in a used bike other than the obvious wear and tear. Thanks in advance.

newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/2578795352.html


----------



## RickJP

...........


----------



## RickJP

darek541 said:


> If you guys could take a look at this posting and tell me if you think its worth it, i would appreciate it. I am deeply interested in this, but i have no experience in what to look for in a used bike other than the obvious wear and tear. Thanks in advance.
> 
> newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/2578795352.html


From the description alone, looks like the bike has been somewhat cannibalized, or poorly maintained, if not been in a few crashes. 

The Trek website states the 1200 has Tiagra front derailleur with 105 rear derailleur and Tiagra STI shifters. 

TrekBikes.com Bike Archive | 2006 1200

If you're willing to pay nearly $600 for a used bike, why not buy a new one from bikesdirect.com for about the same, if not less, with equal components? 

I bought my bike from a local LBS about 3 weeks ago, but not before researching what I wanted for about a month, at the expense of almost neglecting my wife. I ended up buying a 2011 Felt F85 with full 105 drive train and Micro.shift brake/shifter levers, for $875.00, plus pedals and tax; the bike I wanted was sold out on BD.com, the MB Super Strada with Sram Apex components. 

This is one of the several I initially considered at the BD website:

Save up to 60% off new Road Bikes - Motobecane Grand Record

BTW, I know I'm a newbie, but having researched road bikes for about 20 hrs per week for the last 6 - 7 weeks, I've not heard of Shimano Sora STI flight deck compatible shifters. I may be wrong, but I believe that's an accolade enjoyed by the Ultegra and Dura Ace levels.


----------



## GoBrown

darek541 said:


> On a 500-600$ budget, im stuck in a loop. I am in desperate need of a new bike as my vintage fujis cassette/chain/derailleur are so worn it would be inadvantageous to replace them, and thus i am at a crossroads. I visited an LBS that deals exclusively in fuji, and a kind younger gentleman showed me the fuji newest 4, 2011 model if im not mistaken. The down tube shifters really turned me off but he offered it to me for 500$. Its on the 2200/2300s so the components are lowgrade. Its a great ride though, and really comfortable for a road bike. I was surprised at how light it was.
> 
> On the other hand i have the infamous dirty dealers gravity liberty 2 for the same price. Now im more then tech savvy so assembly shouldnt be a problem, but should i take the risk and go for the liberty? It seems of a quality build, and the fit seems spot on. If any of you enthusiasts could take a look and compare the two and or give a personal opinion, i would really appreciate it.
> 
> Since i doubt as a noobie i can post links, im just going to restate my conundrum.
> 
> LBS bought fuji newest 4.0 @500$ vs. BD Gravity Liberty 2 @500$



I'm just now entering the road bike world and was in a similar situation where I didn't want to spend a ton on a road bike. In my case, I didn't want to spend a lot since I wanted to see how much I would like it compared to mountain biking.

I got lucky and the LBS had a closeout sale on a 2010 Fuji Roubaix 2.0, which was marked down on their website, but was not marked down in store. I was able to purchase the bike for $645 plus tax. I've held out for well over 6 months now shopping for a road bike. Good luck!


----------



## nattydoggie

*How do I know...*

how do I know what the dealer is selling me is the best bang for the buck. Being new, I have no idea about parts and such....


----------



## cmanbrazil

I am buying my next bike from an LBS because they are allowing me to trade in two bikes on my next purchase. One of the bikes I am trading in is a 2004 allez that I bought used on craigslist. I bought it in 2009 for 350 and got more than that on trade in. I am a huge supporter of craigslist, buying and selling on there all of the time. I have had very few experiences I didn't like.

At that time, I couldn't afford to buy a brand new allez for around $700, not to mention the original owner gave me his shoes, some clothes, pump, and an extra set of pedals. He was finished with triathlons and was moving to his next sport. 

I think buying from craigslist can be risky for some, and their are no warranties, but you can arrange for the seller to let you have the bike checked out at your expense at an LBS if you want. If the difference was only 100-150 I would'nt think twice and buy from an LBS. If I was an experienced rider and wanted a $5000 bike for $3000 then craigslist is the way to go. Their are a lot of guys with disposable incomes buying new bikes everyday and trying to unload their perfectly good used one on Craigslist. Craigslist takes patience, but if saving a nice chunk of change is important, then it can be an excellent way to go.

For a little more with much less risk, buying a new 2011 or 2010 from an LBS can save you as much as $500 on a $2000 bike. I looked at a brand new Jamis carbon 2010 for 1500, down supposedly from $2,000. 

When I test rode the Jamis it made me think about my Allez I let go. To me, the ride wasn't significantly different, and I wouldn't be able to tell until I got into shape and really put some miles on it. While I like to read the views of people who ride hundreds of miles a week, at the moment i am not riding one, and it will take me some time to get into shape to really enjoy the benefits that carbon brings to a bike. Carbon doesn't drive itself, you still need to power it with your body. 

My plan is to drop some weight this winter and start using my spin bike again so my body will adapt better to my new bike I have on layaway -for now a giant defy advanced composite 2.


----------



## NJBiker72

nattydoggie said:


> how do I know what the dealer is selling me is the best bang for the buck. Being new, I have no idea about parts and such....


1. Do lots of research first. Know the difference between Sora, Tiagra, 105 or Apex, Rival and Force. 
2. Research the bike companies and bike shops. 
3. Determine what you want. You may not know. My first real bike was a Secteur. Great entry level bike. Very comfortable. If I had done my research I'd probably have bought an Allez with Apex instead of the Secteur with Sora. And I may have saved the big upgrade for a couple of years. 
4. Find a shop you trust and is knowledgable. Better yet find two or three. 
I switched to a more aggressive geometry after hard questioning from a second shop. I still preferred my original one for fitting etc but it was the guy at the second shop that told me to look at the Super Six instead of the Synapse. That made me realize I should also look at the Tarmac instead of the Roubaix. Bottom line get more than one opinion and ask and answer questions.


----------



## RickJP

nattydoggie said:


> how do I know what the dealer is selling me is the best bang for the buck. Being new, I have no idea about parts and such....


I completely concur with NJBiker72's post. However, let me expand on it a bit.

I researched everything I could on entry level bikes; looked at a penumbra of websites and youtube videos and drew my own conclusions. Above all, I set myself a budget that I knew I would not exceed, as I knew I would have to buy a lot of cycling gear and accessories. I always look for the best for the least, but always remember that you get what you pay for. With that in mind, I looked only at what I knew I would buy, and not at what I knew I could not afford.

Then, I visited five (5) different local bike shops (LBS), and talked to the guys at each one. I learned a few things I couldn't learn from websites and videos; things about which is better; SPD or Look clipless pedals, or toe clipped pedals, or platform pedals; compact cranksets or triples, etc, etc, etc. I also became acquainted with the weight differences of 6061 and 7005 aluminum frames and full carbon frames, although I knew I would not buy a full carbon bike as my first bike, because I didn't want to spend that much money. I also test rode about 7 bikes before I was sure which geometry and size was best for me.

Finally, I knew I wanted either a Sram Apex or 105 drivetrain, and overall, a cool looking bike. 

I bought my Felt F85, which is about a 2 tier higher than a plain entry level bike, from an LBS located about 12 miles from my home, when there are 5others closer to my home. Simply put, they treated me best and in the words of Don Corleone, they made me an offer I could not refuse.

The most important factor is your budget. Dealers will try to sell you a $5,000.00 bike as your first bike and tell you why you really want to buy it. So, you have to stick to your guns. When you've researched it enough to learn the lingo well and communicate with the shop, then you'll be in a better position to get the best "bang for the buck."


----------



## cpltomcat

Well darn, I wish I'd read this thread a week ago...


----------



## gaspi101

cpltomcat said:


> Well darn, I wish I'd read this thread a week ago...


Oh no. Whatdya do....


----------



## cpltomcat

Haha I started a thread about it called 'Rate My Fail'


----------



## Zeke8762

*Thank you.*

I am new and every bit of information helps!


----------



## ruizl300

Im a newB. I have been riding a motobecane for about 6 months that my dad found, its in excellent condition. But i am too tall for it. Yesterday my frind brought me an old univega he had in his back yard. It rides decent the components work, its a good fit for me. I was wondering if there is an online retailer I can use to switch out some of the components like the rear derailleur and brakes


----------



## RickJP

ruizl300 said:


> Im a newB. I have been riding a motobecane for about 6 months that my dad found, its in excellent condition. But i am too tall for it. Yesterday my frind brought me an old univega he had in his back yard. It rides decent the components work, its a good fit for me. I was wondering if there is an online retailer I can use to switch out some of the components like the rear derailleur and brakes


Check out performancebike.com and nashbar.com


----------



## RickJP

There is also realcyclist.com


----------



## ruizl300

Thanks, I am just wondering. I build up this bike with modern components will it be expensive. Ive never built a bike up before. Im not a 100+ mile rider, I do 25miles or so once or twice a week. Im not looking for extremely top of the line parts but something that will hold up and be efficient for my use.


----------



## RickJP

ruizl300 said:


> Thanks, I am just wondering. I build up this bike with modern components will it be expensive. Ive never built a bike up before. Im not a 100+ mile rider, I do 25miles or so once or twice a week. Im not looking for extremely top of the line parts but something that will hold up and be efficient for my use.


That depends on a few things, the most important of which is your budget. Then you have to consider whether you ride in even/flat streets, or whether there will be a fair amount of climbing hills involved. Then you also have to consider what are the bike's own components and which of those you may be able to still use, and then how important it is for you to upgrade the components you want to upgrade, or whether upgrading them is really necessary. What if you have Shimano 105 or Ultegra on your bike now; why would you want to upgrade that if all you ride is 50 miles a week max? 

It's also not just the components; you'll have to think about replacing cables, and quite possible upgrading the shifters to a shifter/brake lever set up, if the shifters are not integrated with the brake levers. 

Usually, you will spend more money upgrading an existing bike than what you'll spend buying a new one with quite plausibly much better components than what you have in the old one. 

So, look at your budget, figure out what you must upgrade and what you merely want upgraded and why, and then make a decision. 

I bought my first bike in 30+ years just about a month ago. I wanted a bike with full Sram Apex components, but ended up buying one with a Shimano 105 drivetrain. If I wanted to upgrade my bike to full Sram Apex components (it would not really be an upgrade, but more of a swap; an upgrade would be to Sram Rival or Force), it will cost me about $200.00 less than what I paid for my bike. A true upgrade to Sram Rival or Force would run between $100.00 to $300.00 more than I paid for the bike.

So I'm sure you see why I don't upgrade.


----------



## ruizl300

RickJP said:


> That depends on a few things, the most important of which is your budget. Then you have to consider whether you ride in even/flat streets, or whether there will be a fair amount of climbing hills involved. Then you also have to consider what are the bike's own components and which of those you may be able to still use, and then how important it is for you to upgrade the components you want to upgrade, or whether upgrading them is really necessary. What if you have Shimano 105 or Ultegra on your bike now; why would you want to upgrade that if all you ride is 50 miles a week max?
> 
> It's also not just the components; you'll have to think about replacing cables, and quite possible upgrading the shifters to a shifter/brake lever set up, if the shifters are not integrated with the brake levers.
> 
> Usually, you will spend more money upgrading an existing bike than what you'll spend buying a new one with quite plausibly much better components than what you have in the old one.
> 
> So, look at your budget, figure out what you must upgrade and what you merely want upgraded and why, and then make a decision.
> 
> I bought my first bike in 30+ years just about a month ago. I wanted a bike with full Sram Apex components, but ended up buying one with a Shimano 105 drivetrain. If I wanted to upgrade my bike to full Sram Apex components (it would not really be an upgrade, but more of a swap; an upgrade would be to Sram Rival or Force), it will cost me about $200.00 less than what I paid for my bike. A true upgrade to Sram Rival or Force would run between $100.00 to $300.00 more than I paid for the bike.
> 
> So I'm sure you see why I don't upgrade.



Well i havent looked at what the bike currently has, but this Univega is old, so I just want it to be working in order. I know it needs a new rear derailer and brakes, clamps and all, and new tires. Im not concerned for hightech shifters. Just want to be ale to ride and have it change gears properly, and brake on time. Like I mentioned I ride 50miles a week max, not exactly looking for something to compete in. I would just like a working bike. I dont want to replace things with cheap stuff either but I would like it to last me a while. I have the money to buy a new bike, but Im trying this sport out and I dont want to invest in something I might not do for much longer. So far I like it, I finally got a road bike, I was doing 15miles uphill/downhill with a walmart comfort bike. Im new, I dont know much about this specific components and what is good for my use, I hope to learn alot here. And make this a life sport.


----------



## RickJP

ruizl300 said:


> Well i havent looked at what the bike currently has, but this Univega is old, so I just want it to be working in order. I know it needs a new rear derailer and brakes, clamps and all, and new tires. Im not concerned for hightech shifters. Just want to be ale to ride and have it change gears properly, and brake on time. Like I mentioned I ride 50miles a week max, not exactly looking for something to compete in. I would just like a working bike. I dont want to replace things with cheap stuff either but I would like it to last me a while. I have the money to buy a new bike, but Im trying this sport out and I dont want to invest in something I might not do for much longer. So far I like it, I finally got a road bike, I was doing 15miles uphill/downhill with a walmart comfort bike. Im new, I dont know much about this specific components and what is good for my use, I hope to learn alot here. And make this a life sport.


Well you're definitely getting started on the right pedal by doing your own due diligence. 

If I were you, I'd familiarize myself quite a bit more with what my bike has, what's out there and how it applies to what I want to do, then I'd go to a few local bike shops and see what they'd suggest. This way I would not be oblivious to the lingo and would be in a better position to understand what I may be told at the LBS and to know whether they're trying to sell me stuff I don't need to buy, or overpriced things.


----------



## ruizl300

Yes, thank you. I will do more research on my bike, test it out and see what i like and Dislike... maybe in the end im better off buying a new one or newer one. But like I said, I dont want to invest too much in something im just looking into.


----------



## ruizl300

I looked at the parts it has and it has Suntour components, except for rear derailleur. How do these sound?


----------



## wjb

Ok, I will be buying new. A Trek 2.1 with 105 components or a Specialized Roubaix with Tiagra components. Is it worth it to step up to a carbon bike even if the components are lower grade? I have heard the ride quality of bottom line carbon frames are not worth it. Of course I will ride myself and buy what feels right. Just looking for a little advice. Thanks


----------



## NJBiker72

wjb said:


> Ok, I will be buying new. A Trek 2.1 with 105 components or a Specialized Roubaix with Tiagra components. Is it worth it to step up to a carbon bike even if the components are lower grade? I have heard the ride quality of bottom line carbon frames are not worth it. Of course I will ride myself and buy what feels right. Just looking for a little advice. Thanks


My opinion. Go with the roubaix.
I went with a secteur to start. The carbon frame is a keeper and you can upgrade components later.

With the secteur it did nother seem worth it to upgrade the Sora parts.

That said test the bikes. Also test ride a tarmac or an Allez or a madone. What I found out is that despite not being a racer, I prefer a more aggressive geometry. I ended switching to a tarmac.

I'd also look at Sram components as i think you get more for your money. I have red on my bike but lower levels like apex are nice too.


----------



## ezrida

I love my Tarmac.


----------



## mharon47

My personal opinion is to stay away from SRAM, I dont like them. I worked in a shop for a camp for a couple weeks putting bikes back together, and of 6 bikes with SRAM components (Derailleur, 3 of those had bad parts that had broken and needed to be replaced altogether. there were also 5 bikes with shimano parts (Derailleur) and none of those were broken. The bikes with shimano derailleurs were also older.


----------



## Minnesnowtan

For those who are strapped for cash, are there any Bike Co-Ops near you?

These guys often get donated bikes that they (or you) fix up. Baltimore has "The Velocipede Project". If you want to fix up a bike, they have volunteers who can guide you.


----------



## NJBiker72

mharon47 said:


> My personal opinion is to stay away from SRAM, I dont like them. I worked in a shop for a camp for a couple weeks putting bikes back together, and of 6 bikes with SRAM components (Derailleur, 3 of those had bad parts that had broken and needed to be replaced altogether. there were also 5 bikes with shimano parts (Derailleur) and none of those were broken. The bikes with shimano derailleurs were also older.


Curious how dated this is. Many here have had good experience with Sram. Overall there quality seems to be better than Shimano especially for the entry level sets.


----------



## Minnesnowtan

mharon47 said:


> My personal opinion is to stay away from SRAM, I dont like them. I worked in a shop for a camp for a couple weeks putting bikes back together, and of 6 bikes with SRAM components (Derailleur, 3 of those had bad parts that had broken and needed to be replaced altogether. there were also 5 bikes with shimano parts (Derailleur) and none of those were broken. The bikes with shimano derailleurs were also older.


This fits with other experiences that I have heard about. Keep in mind that I have only heard this in relation to SRAMs cheaper lines, not Red or Force. 

Did anyone else notice how Apex showed up on many new bikes last year? What was Apex's claim to fame? That it was cheaper. Not better, cheaper. For all we know it was rebranded microshift, or Rival with lower quality control. But it was cheaper and something to hang on a frame long enough to get it out the door.

When I did find an Apex group for sale by itself, it was $100 cheaper than the equivalent Rival group.

Shimano owns a big market share because they earned it with innovation and quality. If you buy low end SRAM equipped bikes, you tell the industry that you are a sucker and want to be taken advantage of.


----------



## IFLUX23

Hello, this may not be the right thread, but there are hundreds of things I need to to ask and noobs can't make new threads.


By the way, I live in Japan and I am Japanese. Forgive me if my English sucks.


First of all, I want Cyclocross Bicycles. No, I have never bought "pricey" bicycles before and this is the first time actually buying it. I am still a college student and I do not have much money. So I came across "LGS-CX2" from Louis Garneau (sold only in Japan) and cost around $950. It's mainly Shimano Sora so I don't think there's too much problem for me to buy this for a newbie like me. I thought about getting the better version which has Shimano Tiagra, because they are more compatible with better parts if upgrading, but budget wise, I decided not to. It's not like I am willing to upgrade.

My use of Cyclocross Bike is for simply cycling around my town, going to school, 1 and a half week touring, and many many use. For this reason, I though Cyclocross Bike is my option because it is overall good in all aspect and they can turn into basically anything by changing parts (like you can turn them into road bikes by changing tires...of course road bike has V break so it's not gonna perform just as good but...doesn't really matter to me). And also, THEY LOOK COOL! It's not like I'm going to use my bike just for touring so looks really matters to me.


However, I did find problems. There are several problems.

1) It does not have eyelets neither in near the seatpost nor in the lower part. That means I can't mount a rack on this bicycle if I want to go for a week and a half touring.

2) The bicycle has IDX ALLOY seat post. I am not really sure if they are okay with using eyelet adapters so you could mechanically add rack on the bicycle.

3) I am not really sure how safe it is to use eyelet adapters on bicycle. Maximum weight that a rack can hold with eyelet adapters may go down significantly. It's not like I am going to have 30 kilos bags, but I am not really sure if it's safe.



Yes some people suggested I should just buy a touring bike. Honestly, I don't want to do that. Is there are way to deal with my babyish selfishness, or should I just forget it and buy a different bicycle? Like I said before, I live in Japan so if you suggest me a different bicycle, then it has to be sold in Japan.

Thanks. (Sorry if this is the wrong thread).


----------



## robertdingson

Or try Craigslist


----------



## robertdingson

Hi im new to the forum, im just curious what do you mean a bag?


----------



## fightingiris61

Deals can be had on Craigslist. Just keep looking. Got a 1yr old Madone for my daughter, full Ultegra, $900.


----------



## mchlmacdonald

i have an old 1984 schwinn high sierra bicycle that i would like to build into a commuter. i will also be starting to do long road rides on this bike as well. is it possible to adapt some road handlebars/shifters to this frame?


----------



## squiddy

Hi I'm new to the forum. I recently got my bike at a local bike shop. I asked him why prices were so high (I'm not that familiar with why bikes are so expensive), and he said "we're required by law to list the bikes full msrp--the price you'll pay is much less".

Seemed awefully weird to me.. Nevertheless I ended up buying a bike there for a pretty good price. $995 for a 2011 Trek Gary Fisher ION super. I test rode it and it felt great. I was very happy with the service, but I'm a bit perplexed about that first statement.


----------



## NJBiker72

squiddy said:


> Hi I'm new to the forum. I recently got my bike at a local bike shop. I asked him why prices were so high (I'm not that familiar with why bikes are so expensive), and he said "we're required by law to list the bikes full msrp--the price you'll pay is much less".
> 
> Seemed awefully weird to me.. Nevertheless I ended up buying a bike there for a pretty good price. $995 for a 2011 Trek Gary Fisher ION super. I test rode it and it felt great. I was very happy with the service, but I'm a bit perplexed about that first statement.


Companies don't want their products being advertised on blue light specials. 

But a lot of shops will give deals on products especially at the end of the year or prior year models. I got a nice discount on a Tarmac SL3 frame once the SL4 model came out.

Some of the pricing is marketing. Some of it is technology. A lot of that technology is finding ways to make the bike lighter. 

Personally having gone from a Walmart bike to an entry level bike and now to a high end bike, I believe there is a difference. Sure there is marketing and a mark-up, but no different from a high end car or anything else.


----------



## squiddy

that makes sense.. thanks for the explanation.


----------



## NJBiker72

squiddy said:


> that makes sense.. thanks for the explanation.


No problem. Just research it like you would a car purchase. But LBS employees are much nicer. IMO.


----------



## PJ352

Bet99ty00 said:


> *Go to a bike shop & figure out what size you need & leave*. Go to ebay & drill down to sports, cycling, road bikes & parts, complete bikes & frames. Click in your size range & look for a major brand with Shimano 105 at about 2 years old. This may take some patients but you can find a virtually new bike for half price. Buy it & ride it for a while till you figure out the details of what you really want. Sell it on ebay & move up.


IMO all 'round bad advice. First off, it's just uncool to use a LBS's inventory to determine sizing. On the plus side, because frame sizing is pretty arbitrary (ex: a 54cm frame seldom measures the same as another brands 54), someone following your method may very well end up with an ill fitting bike, so justice would be served.

If a buyer wants to purchase online, I suggest visiting their LBS, being upfront about their intentions and pay for a standard fitting. The geo of the test bike can then be compared to the online offerings. The closer the geo, the closer fit will be to the test bike. 

In addition to this method being far more reliable, it also allows the buyer to establish a relationship with their LBS, because even when purchasing online, there are a number of services (and accessories) they offer that the majority of riders avail themselves of.


----------



## Galun

wjb said:


> Ok, I will be buying new. A Trek 2.1 with 105 components or a Specialized Roubaix with Tiagra components. *Is it worth it to step up to a carbon bike even if the components are lower grade?* I have heard the ride quality of bottom line carbon frames are not worth it. Of course I will ride myself and buy what feels right. Just looking for a little advice. Thanks


I would go with carbon if your budget allows it. I made the mistake of buying an alum bike as my first bike because I wasn't sure whether I would like the sport. Within 3 weeks I was ready to buy a carbon bike.


----------



## gaspi101

Galun said:


> I would go with carbon if your budget allows it. I made the mistake of buying an alum bike as my first bike because I wasn't sure whether I would like the sport. Within 3 weeks I was ready to buy a carbon bike.


+1
The difference between 105 and Tiagra is not nearly as huge as aluminium to carbon. Also, the Roubaix rides like a dream.


----------



## NJBiker72

Galun said:


> I would go with carbon if your budget allows it. I made the mistake of buying an alum bike as my first bike because I wasn't sure whether I would like the sport. Within 3 weeks I was ready to buy a carbon bike.


I agree with this. Bought a Secteur and a year and a half later upgraded to a Tarmac. Although the geometry and components were as much of a factor as carbon.


----------



## bwwROADBIKE

*Trek2.1 (105) vs Specialized Roubaix (Tiagra )*



wjb said:


> Ok, I will be buying new. A Trek 2.1 with 105 components or a Specialized Roubaix with Tiagra components. Is it worth it to step up to a carbon bike even if the components are lower grade? I have heard the ride quality of bottom line carbon frames are not worth it. Of course I will ride myself and buy what feels right. Just looking for a little advice. Thanks


Just to verify, there's a big jump in pricing between the 2 bikes:
Trek2.1 (2011) msrp is $1250
Roubaix Compact (2012 i think) msrp is $2000
A more fair comparison on the trek line would be the Madone 4.5 @ $2200 w/ mostly 105 drivetrain. Not saying you should get the trek over the Roubaix, but not a more "fair" comparison.

My view on this: figure out either price point or frame/component mix you're looking for, and then look at specialized, trek, cannondale, bianchi, other LBS carried lines and go teat ride at LBS what feels best. You're paying for: (1) frame, (2) drivetrain, (3) wheels, (4) Misc(seat, stem, bar, wrap)

For ~$1200-1400: alum, carbon fork, mostly 105, fair wheels
For ~$2000: alum, carbon fork, ultegra and a little better wheels
or for ~$2000: carbon frame and fork, tiagra or 105, fair wheels
For $2200-2500: carbon frame and fork, 105, a little better wheels
For $3500: carbon frame and fork, ultegra, better wheels yet(Mavic Ksyrium or Equippe)

or look for a deal:
Lightspeed Archon Ultegra for $2500 on sale
BMC SRAM Red on sale for $3500

Personally, when shopping for my wife, we didn't want to drop $2k on her first road bike, bought a Trek Lexa SLX (2.1 equiv) for ~$1275. If she needs better, we'll sell on CL and only lose $300-400 over 2 years.


----------



## gaspi101

bwwROADBIKE said:


> Just to verify, there's a big jump in pricing between the 2 bikes:
> Trek2.1 (2011) msrp is $1250
> Roubaix Compact (2012 i think) msrp is $2000
> A more fair comparison on the trek line would be the Madone 4.5 @ $2200 w/ mostly 105 drivetrain. Not saying you should get the trek over the Roubaix, but not a more "fair" comparison.
> 
> My view on this: figure out either price point or frame/component mix you're looking for, and then look at specialized, trek, cannondale, bianchi, other LBS carried lines and go teat ride at LBS what feels best. You're paying for: (1) frame, (2) drivetrain, (3) wheels, (4) Misc(seat, stem, bar, wrap)
> 
> For ~$1200-1400: alum, carbon fork, mostly 105, fair wheels
> For ~$2000: alum, carbon fork, ultegra and a little better wheels
> or for ~$2000: carbon frame and fork, tiagra or 105, fair wheels
> For $2200-2500: carbon frame and fork, 105, a little better wheels
> For $3500: carbon frame and fork, ultegra, better wheels yet(Mavic Ksyrium or Equippe)
> 
> or look for a deal:
> Lightspeed Archon Ultegra for $2500 on sale
> BMC SRAM Red on sale for $3500
> 
> Personally, when shopping for my wife, we didn't want to drop $2k on her first road bike, bought a Trek Lexa SLX (2.1 equiv) for ~$1275. If she needs better, we'll sell on CL and only lose $300-400 over 2 years.


Good writeup. Read and learn, people.


----------



## wjb

Thanks for all the advice. Ended up with a 2011 Madone 4.5 on closeout. Very happy with the carbon frame and the 105 drivetrain. Having my cake and eating it too :thumbsup: On the test rides I realized I could not do an alum frame if I wanted to get any distance rides in.


----------



## ahopki01

*Please help me choose my first road bike!*

So I have narrowed it down to two! Exciting in its own right! 

Here is what I will be using the bike for: general fitness and riding, duathalons, and triathalons (mostly sprints, maybe an olympic). My goal is to do a series of duos and tri in the first half of 2012, prior to training the NYC marathon in the 2nd half, and then train for the 2013 NYC Tri. My hope is that the bike will last me 3-5 years, and will allow me to continue to use it for some competitive fitness. 

Which bike is going to give me the best bang for my buck? 

Thanks in advance for your insight!


Vilano Forza 1.0

Frame	6061 Double Butted Aluminum
Fork	12K Carbon
Front Derailleur	Shimano Tiagra
Rear Derailleur	Shimano 105 9 Speed
Shifters	Shimano Tiagra
Crankset	FSA Vero 170mm (50,52,54cm) 172.5mm (56,58cm) 50/39/30T
Brakes	Promax Alloy
Wheelset	Alex R500 700c Doubled Walled CNC Machined Sides Black Anodized
Tires	Kenda 700c x 23c

--

Gravity Liberty 3

Frame	Gravity RSeries Aluminum, Engineered Hydroformed Top tube, Bi-Oval downtube, S-Bend seatstays, 2xH2O mounts, replaceable rear derailleur hanger
Fork	Gravity Aero-profile, Carbon Fiber Straightblade, 1.125 inch steerer 
Note: The Forks are BlackCarbon finish NOT Body colored
Crankset FSA Vero Aluminum arms, triple ring 50/39/30T
Bottom Bracket Sealed cartridge, square taper
Pedals	9/16th axle, Platform pedals included
Front Derailleur	
SHIMANO TIAGRA FD-4600 for 10 Speed

Rear Derailleur SHIMANO TIAGRA RD-4600 for 10 Speed (30 gears total)
Shifters	SHIMANO TIAGRA ST-4600 Triple for 10 Speed (30 gears total)
Cassette/Freewheel	
SHIMANO 4600 Cassette 12-30T for 10 Speed (30 gears total)

Chain SHIMANO for 10 Speed
Hubs	FORMULA aluminum, Black finish with Quick Release
Spokes	Stainless Steel
Rims	Alex R450, Double Wall aluminum with machined brake track
Tires	700x23C BLACK F/V MICHELIN DYNAMIC SPORT
Brakes	CStar SLR Aluminum Black finish
Brake Levers	SHIMANO TIAGRA ST-4600 Triple
Handlebar	Aluminum alloy black, 26.0mm
400MM(43-49CM), 420MM(50-54CM), 440MM(55-60CM)
Stem / Headset	
Aluminum alloy threadless, 1.125", 26.0mm clamp 
EXT:100MM(43-50CM), 120MM(53-60CM)

Cane Creek VP-A71 Labyrinth Sealed, Cage Ball Bearing


----------



## ahopki01

can anyone help me out?


----------



## gaspi101

ahopki01 said:


> can anyone help me out?


Sir, you asked which one gives you the most bang for the buck. You put the bang, but not the buck!


----------



## ahopki01

ha! What does that even mean!? lol


----------



## gaspi101

ahopki01 said:


> ha! What does that even mean!? lol


Sorry, I wasn't being funny. "Bang for the buck" refers to economy, or efficiency. So, I'm guessing you want to know which bike gives the most benefit per dollar. You gave the bike specs, but not how much the bikes cost. Make sense?


----------



## ahopki01

gaspi101 said:


> Sorry, I wasn't being funny. "Bang for the buck" refers to economy, or efficiency. So, I'm guessing you want to know which bike gives the most benefit per dollar. You gave the bike specs, but not how much the bikes cost. Make sense?


Oh my bad! Both are $600.


----------



## gaspi101

In that case, I'd go with the Vilano. At first blush, I would have said the Gravity, because the 10-speeds have a lot more compatibility, and the carbon fork in the Gravity will likely be of better construction. But the Vilano has a Shimano 105 RD, which isn't nothing. Pretty similar and great starter bikes, and if you're going to ride often, you'll probably outgrow them both in about a year. (!!!!) Enjoy!!


----------



## blue lotus

NJBiker72 said:


> 1. Do lots of research first. Know the difference between Sora, Tiagra, 105 or Apex, Rival and Force.
> 2. Research the bike companies and bike shops.
> 3. Determine what you want. You may not know. My first real bike was a Secteur. Great entry level bike. Very comfortable. If I had done my research I'd probably have bought an Allez with Apex instead of the Secteur with Sora. And I may have saved the big upgrade for a couple of years.
> 4. Find a shop you trust and is knowledgable. Better yet find two or three.
> I switched to a more aggressive geometry after hard questioning from a second shop. I still preferred my original one for fitting etc but it was the guy at the second shop that told me to look at the Super Six instead of the Synapse. That made me realize I should also look at the Tarmac instead of the Roubaix. Bottom line get more than one opinion and ask and answer questions.



I was given a $1K birthday gift certificate to a LBS with stores in the greater NYC area that is a dealer for Trek, Specialized, Bianchi, and Raleigh. I think my kids were jazzed that I rediscovered my 25 year old 10 speed Lotus and was doing some riding, alternating with singles tennis, and my kids thought a new (racing) bike would encourage me, at 60, to join a couple of the venerable bike riding clubs in the area, which offer lots of rides, in all different speed rates (tho distances are long). I really have never gone more than 150 miles cumulatively in the past 25 years, the Lotus was shelved because I have to drive to get to an area to ride in, but I'm willing to try to go on these road rides with the clubs. Everyone is telling me that there is such a thing as bike lust, that one day i will get a carbon, (the Madone 3.1 is on sale for 1600) and I won't regret that day....but for now, looks like all I can get for $1K is an entry level racing bike, or 2 hybrids (my wife and I could ride casually). But there are so many models made by each of the 4 manufacturers my LBS is a dealer for, I was told to just try out a ride, say, the Trek 1.5, the Specialized Allez Sport Compact, I don't know which Bianchi, and I don't know which Raleigh. Just want some carbon pieces on the aluminum frame....any thoughts /suggestions are welcome.


----------



## tjamscad

I bought my wife a rental that she used for an MS ride in Idhao. it probably saved me $200 and she had already riden it so there was no "well, it's but" it worked great renting before you buy is great


----------



## egger29

*First bike, aluminum or carbon ?*

Greeting everyone. the past 2 years I have done a couple Tri's a year, and for each race i rented a road bike. Now it is time to make a purchase.

My budget is about 1,500

Now the question is, should I get a good aluminum bike with carbon forks for that price, or I see some good deals on Jenson USA for a entry level carbon bike on sale for $1,400.

I did't think that I could afford a carbon frame, but some of the deals are to good to pass up.

So I am leaning towards the carbon frame.

any thoughts ?


----------



## bwwROADBIKE

egger29 said:


> Greeting everyone. the past 2 years I have done a couple Tri's a year, and for each race i rented a road bike. Now it is time to make a purchase.
> 
> My budget is about 1,500
> 
> Now the question is, should I get a good aluminum bike with carbon forks for that price, or I see some good deals on Jenson USA for a entry level carbon bike on sale for $1,400.
> 
> I did't think that I could afford a carbon frame, but some of the deals are to good to pass up.
> 
> So I am leaning towards the carbon frame.
> 
> any thoughts ?


CC has a 105 equipped BMC carbon bike for $1500 and weighs in at 17.7#. (no size 54cm avail)

2011 BMC Road Racer SL02/Shimano 105 Complete Bike - Competitive Cyclist 

there's deals out there, especially if you're willing to go internet.


----------



## PJ352

egger29 said:


> Greeting everyone. the past 2 years I have done a couple Tri's a year, and for each race i rented a road bike. Now it is time to make a purchase.
> 
> My budget is about 1,500
> 
> Now the question is, should I get a good aluminum bike with carbon forks for that price, or I see some good deals on Jenson USA for a entry level carbon bike on sale for $1,400.
> 
> I did't think that I could afford a carbon frame, but some of the deals are to good to pass up.
> 
> So I am leaning towards the carbon frame.
> 
> *any thoughts ?*


Unless you know your sizing requirements pretty well (and I don't mean "I rode a 54 and it felt good"), I suggest avoiding making this first purchase online, without a test ride or sight unseen. Frame material won't matter if the bike doesn't fit you well, and an ill fitting bike isn't a good deal, no matter the price, unless you're into the buying/ reselling business.

That said, in your price range, I'd suggest visiting some LBS's, discussing your intended uses, cycling experience and fitness, seeing what they suggest and head out for some test rides. I suspect that, given your price range, this means staying with an alu frame/ CF fork, but there are several good choices in that range.

Assuming your rental bike fit you well, a possible alternate method would be to use that bike as a baseline to use against the online bikes of interest. You'd need to know some specifics about the rental like year, make, model and frame size, along with having some knowledge of bike geometry and what the numbers mean, so some care must be taken to get this right.

Lastly, you might also want to add steel to your list. There are some nice steel offerings at (or a little above) your price range, and there are a fair number of steel advocates, so something else to consider.


----------



## NJBiker72

egger29 said:


> Greeting everyone. the past 2 years I have done a couple Tri's a year, and for each race i rented a road bike. Now it is time to make a purchase.
> 
> My budget is about 1,500
> 
> Now the question is, should I get a good aluminum bike with carbon forks for that price, or I see some good deals on Jenson USA for a entry level carbon bike on sale for $1,400.
> 
> I did't think that I could afford a carbon frame, but some of the deals are to good to pass up.
> 
> So I am leaning towards the carbon frame.
> 
> any thoughts ?


I would go to a reputable LBS or three and try lots of bikes. And buy from one of them. I definitely prefer carbon but would not buy online, at least not the first time, to get there. 

Fit is important. So is having a place to turn to for adjustments, mechanical help, just all around advice. Sure you could go to the store after but I think it is good to get that first experience. 

I might look for a closeout at this time of year, you may be able to get a good deal on a 2011 or even 2010 model. If so, get the carbon, the other components can be upgraded over time, and usually the components that come with low end carbon bikes are fine (unlike the low end aluminum bike components).


----------



## egger29

Thanks for the inputs guys. Just some background. I have rented a road bike 5 different times.

4 times they were a 60cm, and the other time it was a 58cm.

The brands were specialized and jamis.

The 60cm seemed to fit me the best.

I agree, the LBS would be the best plact to start, but some of the deals you can find online are just too hard to pass up.

I am leaning towards the carbon frame. I like the idea of upgrading parts over time if I want to. Still learning what components are better than others.


----------



## dukecrew09

Hello all,

I'm looking to get into cycling for the first time, and I have accumulated about $800 in REI giftcards, so I'm looking to buy a bike from there. I don't know a whole lot about the components, and the salesman there wasn't too helpful. The store nearby has a number of 2011 models on sale, but I'm not sure whether it's worth it to buy a $500-$600 model or to go a level up and buy one for about $900. The models/prices they have are as follows:

GT Series 3 ($890)
Marin Portofino ($640)
GT Series 4 ($660)
Novara Divano ($590)
Novara Strada ($900)
Cannondale Synapse 7 - 2012 model ($929)

Does anyone have any recommendations as far as what bike(s) might be best? I'd have to purchase pedals, etc in addition to the listed prices, and I'm not looking to spend too much beyond my gift cards, but I'm willing to pay a bit more if a bike is particularly good. Please let me know if there's any other information that would helpful, I really appreciate any advice!


----------



## cmanbrazil

My first road bike was a 2004 specialized allez I bought used on craigslist. I think the original owner upgraded some of the components to include a mix of ultegra and 105. It was a sweet bike I should have kept. I have upgraded to a giant defy advanced carbon bike. What I have learned is sizing and components are really important. the Raleigh Revenio 3.0 Bike - 2012 is 1200. I know its 300 more but make it a christmas gift to yourself. It has 105 components. Wherever you go make sure you get the size right first, and get the best components you can buy. 

With all of my advice, i have to remember how many people pass me on the trail on old steel bikes.You the engine are really more important. Also remember that you will need shorts or bibs as well.


----------



## NJBiker72

dukecrew09 said:


> Hello all,
> 
> I'm looking to get into cycling for the first time, and I have accumulated about $800 in REI giftcards, so I'm looking to buy a bike from there. I don't know a whole lot about the components, and the salesman there wasn't too helpful. The store nearby has a number of 2011 models on sale, but I'm not sure whether it's worth it to buy a $500-$600 model or to go a level up and buy one for about $900. The models/prices they have are as follows:
> 
> GT Series 3 ($890)
> Marin Portofino ($640)
> GT Series 4 ($660)
> Novara Divano ($590)
> Novara Strada ($900)
> Cannondale Synapse 7 - 2012 model ($929)
> 
> Does anyone have any recommendations as far as what bike(s) might be best? I'd have to purchase pedals, etc in addition to the listed prices, and I'm not looking to spend too much beyond my gift cards, but I'm willing to pay a bit more if a bike is particularly good. Please let me know if there's any other information that would helpful, I really appreciate any advice!


What are you looking for? The Synapse in general is a great bike if it is what you want. I am not particularly familiar with the others. 

The Synapse is a relaxed bike or a plush bike. Meaning it's geometry is a bit more relaxed than their CAAD or Super Six Series. I thought I wanted one (or a Roubaix) until I got on a Super Six. 

Quickly looking at that model it resembles my old Secteur. Base model bike. Kind of heavy. Good but low end components. I don't like Sora shifters. Looks like the Novaro has them too though.


----------



## blue lotus

I was given a $1K gift card to a LBS for a 60th bd, to complement my summer tennis games, and when on Friday my LBS asked what do I plan to use the bike for, my answer is basically I am not an experienced rider, I have gone maybe 25 miles in the past year on my 10 speed steel bike, I have to put the bike in the car in order to find a safe place to ride, I would like to ride with others, but these organized rides sponsored by these robust cycle clubs in this NYC suburban area think nothing of 35/45 mile rides, even for "D" rides, and I'm not sure if those rides aren't really races with everyone looking at their Cateye to outdo their performance the week before, and I'm not sure I have the fitness level or paceline experience to just jump into even a "D" ride for 30 miles...so, what if I buy a road bike, and I'm not interested in being a regular in these cycle club "Dplus" rides? What if I want the option to also use it for leisure riding, for a car substitute for going to the pharmacy to pick up some things on an errand...so many classifications of bikes, so little time.....

So, here's the further question/ story about trying to buy on a budget:: On Friday, the LBS showed me entry level road bikes, but for $1K or less, you must get Sora shifters, those little black buttons which are not accessible if you're holding on to the lower handlebar, and there was something annoying about those buttons for me. The Trek 1.5, which has Tiagra shifters, was on sale for less than $1K, but the H2 height, the forward lean for my six foot frame on the bike, riding around the back parking lot for some five minutes, caused me some lower back ache, perhaps I just didn't stretch out enough prior to taking a test ride. The Specialized Secteur Sport was about $760, it is a bit higher and was H3, but it had those darn Sora shifters, otherwise I liked it better than the Trek1.2....naturally, the LBS asked me to "try this one," and it shifted nicely, felt secure, but of course the "surprise" was that it was a Roubaix Apex Compact for $1600, and sure, entry level carbon fiber is nicer than the aluminum bikes, they do scream out "ride me!", but it was out of my price range, I still am not committed to doing any group rides...but now I understand why experienced riders covet and often purchase carbon fiber bikes...the Sora shifter bikes just didn't scream at me to say "ride me!"...I liked 'em, but it clearly was settling due to a price point...

So I left the LBS basically confused, I still don't get some of these classifications, such as "fitness bike" like the Trek FX series, or perhaps "comfort road bikes" like the higher Secteur....my wife, who joined me, meanwhile sees a cheapo mountain bike, a Raleigh Eva, starts to ride it, and says to me, that's the one for me, it's only $275, and it's easy to ride...no research, no nothing, she just wants to ride a bike....meanwhile, I'm struggling with all these issues like shifters and forward lean/fitting, and thinking, I am not a committed road bike guy, yet everyone seems to say get a road bike if you want to have the OPTION to participate in any of the cycle club rides....but who knows how much I'll like them.... Trek says the FX is their most popular bike, but I'm unclear what is a "touring" bike, a "comfort bike", a "fitness bike"...and then there's the category called "comfort road bikes' and "urban bikes" as well as cross bikes...

Which type (road? Hybrid? Comfort?) of bike enables you to perhaps do a "Dplus" road bike group ride from time to time, but also give you the opportunity to put the bike in the car, go up north some 15 miles, and ride with the wife on her cheapo mountain bike on some less traveled paved roads on on a Sunday afternoon? And also substitute for car transportation and just give me a chance to ride to the pharmacy, pick up a NY Times, a prescription, and come back home...

My LBS is a dealer for Specialized, Trek, Bianchi, and Raleigh...
Thanks for any thoughts/assistance, I missed Black Friday weekend sale prices, but it's clear I'm not clear on what I'm doing...

Blue Lotus in Connecticut


----------



## NJBiker72

blue lotus said:


> I was given a $1K gift card to a LBS for a 60th bd, to complement my summer tennis games, and when on Friday my LBS asked what do I plan to use the bike for, my answer is basically I am not an experienced rider, I have gone maybe 25 miles in the past year on my 10 speed steel bike, I have to put the bike in the car in order to find a safe place to ride, I would like to ride with others, but these organized rides sponsored by these robust cycle clubs in this NYC suburban area think nothing of 35/45 mile rides, even for "D" rides, and I'm not sure if those rides aren't really races with everyone looking at their Cateye to outdo their performance the week before, and I'm not sure I have the fitness level or paceline experience to just jump into even a "D" ride for 30 miles...so, what if I buy a road bike, and I'm not interested in being a regular in these cycle club "Dplus" rides? What if I want the option to also use it for leisure riding, for a car substitute for going to the pharmacy to pick up some things on an errand...so many classifications of bikes, so little time.....
> 
> So, here's the further question/ story about trying to buy on a budget:: On Friday, the LBS showed me entry level road bikes, but for $1K or less, you must get Sora shifters, those little black buttons which are not accessible if you're holding on to the lower handlebar, and there was something annoying about those buttons for me. The Trek 1.5, which has Tiagra shifters, was on sale for less than $1K, but the H2 height, the forward lean for my six foot frame on the bike, riding around the back parking lot for some five minutes, caused me some lower back ache, perhaps I just didn't stretch out enough prior to taking a test ride. The Specialized Secteur Sport was about $760, it is a bit higher and was H3, but it had those darn Sora shifters, otherwise I liked it better than the Trek1.2....naturally, the LBS asked me to "try this one," and it shifted nicely, felt secure, but of course the "surprise" was that it was a Roubaix Apex Compact for $1600, and sure, entry level carbon fiber is nicer than the aluminum bikes, they do scream out "ride me!", but it was out of my price range, I still am not committed to doing any group rides...but now I understand why experienced riders covet and often purchase carbon fiber bikes...the Sora shifter bikes just didn't scream at me to say "ride me!"...I liked 'em, but it clearly was settling due to a price point...
> 
> So I left the LBS basically confused, I still don't get some of these classifications, such as "fitness bike" like the Trek FX series, or perhaps "comfort road bikes" like the higher Secteur....my wife, who joined me, meanwhile sees a cheapo mountain bike, a Raleigh Eva, starts to ride it, and says to me, that's the one for me, it's only $275, and it's easy to ride...no research, no nothing, she just wants to ride a bike....meanwhile, I'm struggling with all these issues like shifters and forward lean/fitting, and thinking, I am not a committed road bike guy, yet everyone seems to say get a road bike if you want to have the OPTION to participate in any of the cycle club rides....but who knows how much I'll like them.... Trek says the FX is their most popular bike, but I'm unclear what is a "touring" bike, a "comfort bike", a "fitness bike"...and then there's the category called "comfort road bikes' and "urban bikes" as well as cross bikes...
> 
> Which type (road? Hybrid? Comfort?) of bike enables you to perhaps do a "Dplus" road bike group ride from time to time, but also give you the opportunity to put the bike in the car, go up north some 15 miles, and ride with the wife on her cheapo mountain bike on some less traveled paved roads on on a Sunday afternoon? And also substitute for car transportation and just give me a chance to ride to the pharmacy, pick up a NY Times, a prescription, and come back home...
> 
> My LBS is a dealer for Specialized, Trek, Bianchi, and Raleigh...
> Thanks for any thoughts/assistance, I missed Black Friday weekend sale prices, but it's clear I'm not clear on what I'm doing...
> 
> Blue Lotus in Connecticut


My first real road bike was a Secteur Sport. Great bike other than the Sora. I upgraded to a Tarmac for the carbon and Sram. The Secteur is now the winter bike. You might want to see what a Secteur with Apex would run 

You mentioned Nj. Plenty of good places to ride here. Go out a couple of times on your own. Most rides are not competitive though.


----------



## mpre53

NJBiker72 said:


> My first real road bike was a Secteur Sport. Great bike other than the Sora. I upgraded to a Tarmac for the carbon and Sram. The Secteur is now the winter bike. You might want to see what a Secteur with Apex would run
> 
> You mentioned Nj. Plenty of good places to ride here. Go out a couple of times on your own. Most rides are not competitive though.


The shop up the road has an Allez with Apex for $1250. A Secteur should run about the same.


----------



## blue lotus

Well, it was far from the points I raised in my original post above, but if you want Apex, (or 105) you'll pay more than $1000.....if you want the 2011 Secteur Elite Apex, some of the 2011s are discounted from the normal $1450 price....and the Allez Elite Apex, which has lower handlebars and more forward lean than the Secteur, that usually costs about $1300, some 2011 are on closeout. The Roubaix is the CF version of the Secteur, while the Tarmac is the CF version of the Allez. So, for a few hundred dollars more on some of these closeouts, you can go from the top aluminum to the sale price on 2011 entry level CF ($1550).....But all of this is not relevant to the questions I was posing above, such as being "stuck" with Sora pricing, and just what all these many many bike classifications mean in case you're not sure you're so dedicated to hundred or more miles a week of road biking,or you want to ride to complement another sport, and even put your racquet in a knapsack and bike over to the courts (don't need CF for that) ...as for riding alone, that is what I would do at first because of the long club rides here in Westchester and Connecticut, except I'm convinced it's more dangerous to be riding on the road alone, you will ride at a better pace and learn thing when with a group leader, and I don't know the first thing about changing tires in case of a flat, although I do have a cell phone to call my wife...meanwhile, I invite all responses to my post from earlier this afternoon...


----------



## NJBiker72

blue lotus said:


> Well, it was far from the points I raised in my original post above, but if you want Apex, (or 105) you'll pay more than $1000.....if you want the 2011 Secteur Elite Apex, some of the 2011s are discounted from the normal $1450 price....and the Allez Elite Apex, which has lower handlebars and more forward lean than the Secteur, that usually costs about $1300, some 2011 are on closeout. The Roubaix is the CF version of the Secteur, while the Tarmac is the CF version of the Allez. So, for a few hundred dollars more on some of these closeouts, you can go from the top aluminum to the sale price on 2011 entry level CF ($1550).....But all of this is not relevant to the questions I was posing above, such as being "stuck" with Sora pricing, and just what all these many many bike classifications mean in case you're not sure you're so dedicated to hundred or more miles a week of road biking,or you want to ride to complement another sport, and even put your racquet in a knapsack and bike over to the courts (don't need CF for that) ...as for riding alone, that is what I would do at first because of the long club rides here in Westchester and Connecticut, except I'm convinced it's more dangerous to be riding on the road alone, you will ride at a better pace and learn thing when with a group leader, and I don't know the first thing about changing tires in case of a flat, although I do have a cell phone to call my wife...meanwhile, I invite all responses to my post from earlier this afternoon...


Probably safer riding alone. Groups could cause crashes or peer pressure. Not a big difference Imo. 

Flats. Take the bike home. Change a couple of flats in your living room. You'll be fine. 

Stuck with Sora? Better than being stuck on foot.


----------



## century

Just love reading here and learning.


----------



## flannels

*yep*



> If you don't know what you are doing find a shop that you like (or a shop where you like the employees). There is so little difference from brand to brand at similar prices until you are well over $1000 that the bike hardly matters. What does matter is the help you will get deciding on which of the many bikes and sizes available is right for you plus the service that you will get for free after the purchase



well said


----------



## jeepsouth

Hello everyone.
I am new to the site and have already learned a lot. Thanks.
I am new to road cycling and am looking to buy a new bike. Budget is $2000 but, that is for bike, pedals, shoes, clothes, bag, tool kit, etc.
I definitely want to buy from a LBS and build a relationship. I am in Greenville, SC, and there a several good shops in the area. Most host weekend and other rides. I plan to do longer rides and am not interested in racing right now, so I am looking at "relaxed" geometry or "endurance" bikes.
With various sales and maybe looking at last year's models, I have settled on a Scott CR1 Comp, a Giant Defy Composite 2, or a Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. I rode a Felt Z5, which I loved but, it is a couple hundred over my budget. I am leaning toward the Cannondale simply because that shop is the closest to my home. But, I've ridden them all and really can't decide since they are so similar. Any advice on which to get?
Some personal info: Male, 54 years old, good shape (I run a lot). This area has some good bike trails and back roads to ride. Pretty hilly, though. One other thing: My wife is also getting a new bike and we plan to ride together a good bit. She fell in love with the Giant Avail Composite 2.


----------



## gaspi101

jeepsouth said:


> Hello everyone.
> I am new to the site and have already learned a lot. Thanks.
> I am new to road cycling and am looking to buy a new bike. Budget is $2000 but, that is for bike, pedals, shoes, clothes, bag, tool kit, etc.
> I definitely want to buy from a LBS and build a relationship. I am in Greenville, SC, and there a several good shops in the area. Most host weekend and other rides. I plan to do longer rides and am not interested in racing right now, so I am looking at "relaxed" geometry or "endurance" bikes.
> With various sales and maybe looking at last year's models, I have settled on a Scott CR1 Comp, a Giant Defy Composite 2, or a Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. I rode a Felt Z5, which I loved but, it is a couple hundred over my budget. I am leaning toward the Cannondale simply because that shop is the closest to my home. But, I've ridden them all and really can't decide since they are so similar. Any advice on which to get?
> Some personal info: Male, 54 years old, good shape (I run a lot). This area has some good bike trails and back roads to ride. Pretty hilly, though. One other thing: My wife is also getting a new bike and we plan to ride together a good bit. She fell in love with the Giant Avail Composite 2.


Welcome to the fold! $2,000.00 is a great budget for getting into road cycling. Based on what you've told us, I would suggest another bike: The 2011 Specialized Roubaix Elite Apex. This bike should be retailing for about $1,600.00 or so now (I bought mine for $2,100.00 in May). It has very relaxed geometry, and has been rated as one of the most comfortable bikes ever made. It has special technology to absorb shock but still remains stiff and compliant in the turns. Also, it comes stock with a compact crankset (34/50) and an 11-32 cassette (!!). With this set-up, you can climb walls all day long, and still have enough umph to cruise at 30mph (should you want to). Full carbon, and for the price, I'm not sure you can go wrong. Whatever you choose, hope you enjoy! It's always good to have another roadie in the mix.


----------



## NJBiker72

jeepsouth said:


> Hello everyone.
> I am new to the site and have already learned a lot. Thanks.
> I am new to road cycling and am looking to buy a new bike. Budget is $2000 but, that is for bike, pedals, shoes, clothes, bag, tool kit, etc.
> I definitely want to buy from a LBS and build a relationship. I am in Greenville, SC, and there a several good shops in the area. Most host weekend and other rides. I plan to do longer rides and am not interested in racing right now, so I am looking at "relaxed" geometry or "endurance" bikes.
> With various sales and maybe looking at last year's models, I have settled on a Scott CR1 Comp, a Giant Defy Composite 2, or a Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. I rode a Felt Z5, which I loved but, it is a couple hundred over my budget. I am leaning toward the Cannondale simply because that shop is the closest to my home. But, I've ridden them all and really can't decide since they are so similar. Any advice on which to get?
> Some personal info: Male, 54 years old, good shape (I run a lot). This area has some good bike trails and back roads to ride. Pretty hilly, though. One other thing: My wife is also getting a new bike and we plan to ride together a good bit. She fell in love with the Giant Avail Composite 2.


I'll second the comment above on the Roubaix. The Giant and Synapse are nice too. That said, just because you do not intend to race does not mean you want relaxed. It's all how it feels to you.

I started with a Secteur (aluminum Roubaix) and thought I would upgrade to a Roubaix or equivalent at some point. Well, went to a shop to test a Synapse and some others. After testing I told him they were nice but none wowed me. All very similar to the Secteur. He put meon a Super 6. I loved it. Almost bought it on the spot but then realized, I did not want relaxed. Tested a Madone and Tarmac. 

Went with the Tarmac. Love it. 

Make sure you test at least one racier bike to see if you really want relaxed.


----------



## jeepsouth

Thanks for the advice.
The shop that sells Specialized in this area was the first shop I visited. This was right at the beginning of my research and I didn't know what I was doing at the time. They put me on a Specialized Allez and I was not too impressed, mainly due to my posture on the bike, I think, now that I look back on it. We stopped by that shop on a busy Saturday morning, which was probably not the best time to do test-rides and such, as I have learned since. Plus, this shop is all the way across town from us. One thing that did impress me about the shop was the fact that they include a full fitting session with the purchase. Based on your advice, I am going to go back there an a weekday and give the Roubaix a look.
Thanks!!


----------



## PJ352

Since you may be broadening your search, I'll condense my thoughts down....

If you haven't already done so, test ride the bikes of interest out on the roads and for some duration. Parking lot rides tell little about how a bike rides, handles (or shifts) at speed, so you need to put them through their paces, so to speak.

Of the bikes you mentioned thus far, generally speaking, the Giant has the more relaxed geometry and the Scott the least. Essentially, the Scott is a race bike with a longer head tube. The C'dale splits the difference, which 'on paper' may have some benefits to some riders. The differences in ride/ handling will be subtle between the bikes, but differences do exist.

With some models having SRAM and others Shimano, there are notable differences in the way the brake/ shifter operate and most cyclists do have a preference (thus, my comment re: the importance of 'real' test rides). Since you mention hilly terrain, you may prefer Apex on the C'dale for its wider range. I don't like the gaps (in gearing) that it causes. but that's JMO. Also, the Giant has the previous generation Tiagra, so it's 9 speed versus 10 for the others.

Since fit is so important, the shop you choose is also pretty important. Ask some questions about exactly what the included bike fit entails. If one shop emphasizes fit more than another, that IMO/E matters. That's not to say you should buy a bike you don't like from them. Ideally, you'll find the right bike at the reputable shop.

I agree with the others comments re: test riding relaxed as well as race bikes. Test rides are free, and they're kinda fun, so why not. And yes, the Roubaix (and Tarmac) among some other makes/ models are all good options. 

One last thought on warranties. All the makes/ models you're considering are top shelf, quality bikes. But just as a FYI, Scott only offers a 5 year warranty on their frames IF you bring the bike in to a dealer for inspection yearly. If not, the warranty term drops to 3 years. Conversely, C'dale, Giant and Specialized (among many others) offer limited lifetime warranties. 

HTH...


----------



## RickJP

jeepsouth said:


> Hello everyone.
> I am new to the site and have already learned a lot. Thanks.
> I am new to road cycling and am looking to buy a new bike. Budget is $2000 but, that is for bike, pedals, shoes, clothes, bag, tool kit, etc.
> I definitely want to buy from a LBS and build a relationship. I am in Greenville, SC, and there a several good shops in the area. Most host weekend and other rides. I plan to do longer rides and am not interested in racing right now, so I am looking at "relaxed" geometry or "endurance" bikes.
> With various sales and maybe looking at last year's models, I have settled on a Scott CR1 Comp, a Giant Defy Composite 2, or a Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. I rode a Felt Z5, which I loved but, it is a couple hundred over my budget. I am leaning toward the Cannondale simply because that shop is the closest to my home. But, I've ridden them all and really can't decide since they are so similar. Any advice on which to get?
> Some personal info: Male, 54 years old, good shape (I run a lot). This area has some good bike trails and back roads to ride. Pretty hilly, though. One other thing: My wife is also getting a new bike and we plan to ride together a good bit. She fell in love with the Giant Avail Composite 2.


I agree the Robaix is a very good choice, but I wanted to ask you, since this is your first bike; must you have carbon? 

Granted; carbon is lighter. But, given that you already run a lot, IMHO, the 1 1/2 - 2 lb, or so weight difference between carbon and 7005 aluminum, may very well be quite negligible. 

I have a Felt F85, which weighs 19.4 lbs. It has the 105 drive train and the same 50/34 crankset as on the Roubaix, and a slightly less "relaxed," yet more "race" geometry than the Roubaix. And, the only advantage the Apex cassette has over the 105 cassette, is that Apex is an 11/32 vs. the 105 being an 11/25. Unless you'll be climbing steep hills (30degree incline), the difference should also be rather negligible for someone fit like you. 

Save your money. Take the difference and upgrade the wheels. The Roubaix Elite comes with the Mavic CXP22 wheels that weigh quite a bit. I bought a Boyd Vitesse wheelset, brand new from Boyd himself, for $545.00 with pads and shipping. After adding a pair of Conti GP4000S' and Conti supersonic tubes, the total for the wheels, tires, and tubes, was about $650.00. I shaved about 1 pound off the total weight of my bike after the upgrade. Not including the other accessories and clothing I've purchased, I have about $1700.00 into my bike (I upgraded the saddle to a Specialized Toupe + Expert), and I've done three metric century rides on it, and will be doing my first century in February, and my second in March. But, if you must have carbon, and are looking for an in-between geometry, check out the F5, if the bike shop where you test rode the Z5 has one. 

Just my .02


----------



## jeepsouth

RickJP said:


> I agree the Robaix is a very good choice, but I wanted to ask you, since this is your first bike; must you have carbon?
> 
> Granted; carbon is lighter. But, given that you already run a lot, IMHO, the 1 1/2 - 2 lb, or so weight difference between carbon and 7005 aluminum, may very well be quite negligible.
> 
> I have a Felt F85, which weighs 19.4 lbs. It has the 105 drive train and the same 50/34 crankset as on the Roubaix, and a slightly less "relaxed," yet more "race" geometry than the Roubaix. And, the only advantage the Apex cassette has over the 105 cassette, is that Apex is an 11/32 vs. the 105 being an 11/25. Unless you'll be climbing steep hills (30degree incline), the difference should also be rather negligible for someone fit like you.
> 
> Save your money. Take the difference and upgrade the wheels. The Roubaix Elite comes with the Mavic CXP22 wheels that weigh quite a bit. I bought a Boyd Vitesse wheelset, brand new from Boyd himself, for $545.00 with pads and shipping. After adding a pair of Conti GP4000S' and Conti supersonic tubes, the total for the wheels, tires, and tubes, was about $650.00. I shaved about 1 pound off the total weight of my bike after the upgrade. Not including the other accessories and clothing I've purchased, I have about $1700.00 into my bike (I upgraded the saddle to a Specialized Toupe + Expert), and I've done three metric century rides on it, and will be doing my first century in February, and my second in March. But, if you must have carbon, and are looking for an in-between geometry, check out the F5, if the bike shop where you test rode the Z5 has one.
> 
> Just my .02



Good advice. And, thanks.
I was looking at carbon for mainly 2 reasons: 1) From what I have read, carbon gives you a better ride. Important to me since I plan to do some long rides. 2) Some good carbon choices seem to fall in my price range and, like most everyone, I would like to get the most value for what I spend. But, I do not have to have carbon if as good, or better choices are available. That is why I am asking the opinion of you more-experienced folks.

The 11/32 vs. the 12/25 has caused me some concern, mainly due to lack of experience with either. We are at the base of the Blue Ridge Mtns., so the area is pretty hilly. That is what had me leaning toward the Apex 11X32. Maybe I need to do some more research.

I will take your advice and give the F85 a look. I'll also take a look at the alloy Synapse line.

Thanks for everyone's advice.


----------



## NJBiker72

jeepsouth said:


> Good advice. And, thanks.
> I was looking at carbon for mainly 2 reasons: 1) From what I have read, carbon gives you a better ride. Important to me since I plan to do some long rides. 2) Some good carbon choices seem to fall in my price range and, like most everyone, I would like to get the most value for what I spend. But, I do not have to have carbon if as good, or better choices are available. That is why I am asking the opinion of you more-experienced folks.
> 
> The 11/32 vs. the 12/25 has caused me some concern, mainly due to lack of experience with either. We are at the base of the Blue Ridge Mtns., so the area is pretty hilly. That is what had me leaning toward the Apex 11X32. Maybe I need to do some more research.
> 
> I will take your advice and give the F85 a look. I'll also take a look at the alloy Synapse line.
> 
> Thanks for everyone's advice.


IMHO, you have the right idea. Go frame instead of wheels. Much easier to upgrade wheels later if you choose. 

I like the idea of 11X32. I prefer to be able to spin and will sacrifice some speed going downhill for an easier climb, but you will not even be giving that up. The gears will just be spaced a bit more on the Apex I believe.


----------



## RickJP

jeepsouth said:


> Good advice. And, thanks.
> I was looking at carbon for mainly 2 reasons: 1) From what I have read, carbon gives you a better ride. Important to me since I plan to do some long rides. 2) Some good carbon choices seem to fall in my price range and, like most everyone, I would like to get the most value for what I spend. But, I do not have to have carbon if as good, or better choices are available. That is why I am asking the opinion of you more-experienced folks.
> 
> The 11/32 vs. the 12/25 has caused me some concern, mainly due to lack of experience with either. We are at the base of the Blue Ridge Mtns., so the area is pretty hilly. That is what had me leaning toward the Apex 11X32. Maybe I need to do some more research.
> 
> I will take your advice and give the F85 a look. I'll also take a look at the alloy Synapse line.
> 
> Thanks for everyone's advice.


Carbon is going to handle better. However, I'll share with you my experiece.

I bought my F85 in August this year. I test rode a Roubaix Elite, a Z6, an F5 and an F95 (my LBS ordered the F85). At that time I was just getting back into cycling (the last time I did was 30 years ago and my bike was an old, steel frame 10spd KIA). The main difference I noticed between the two was that the carbon bikes were quicker. I've not done long rides on a carbon bike, but I've ridden with guys that have, and do, and we both get to the end equally tired. I'm doing a metric tomorrow on my new wheels, so I'm expecting to see a tiiiiiiiiiiny bit of difference (I've already seen an improvement in my avg speed and lap time after the new wheels). 

That I will eventually get a carbon bike goes without saying, but I do not regret starting with a 7005 aluminum frame. I've learned the techniques of racing/endurance cycling on a bike that has forgiven a lot of my screw ups. 

And, one thing's for certain. You will, perhaps sooner rather than later, upgrade components on your bike. IMHO, the two most important upgrades are saddle and wheels, and when it comes to the latter, you'll find that a wheel upgrade may very well cost you as much, if not more, than you paid for the bike. Unless, of course, you go with a Boyd Wheelset, which are high quality wheels at a very affordable price (carbon aero wheelsets for 1K?) Boyd Cycling - High Performance Wheels You Can Afford

Whatever you choose, believe me, your knees will thank you for choosing cycling over running.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Since you may be broadening your search, I'll condense my thoughts down....
> 
> If you haven't already done so, test ride the bikes of interest out on the roads and for some duration. Parking lot rides tell little about how a bike rides, handles (or shifts) at speed, so you need to put them through their paces, so to speak.
> 
> Of the bikes you mentioned thus far, generally speaking, the Giant has the more relaxed geometry and the Scott the least. Essentially, the Scott is a race bike with a longer head tube. The C'dale splits the difference, which 'on paper' may have some benefits to some riders. The differences in ride/ handling will be subtle between the bikes, but differences do exist.
> 
> With some models having SRAM and others Shimano, there are notable differences in the way the brake/ shifter operate and most cyclists do have a preference (thus, my comment re: the importance of 'real' test rides). Since you mention hilly terrain, you may prefer Apex on the C'dale for its wider range. I don't like the gaps (in gearing) that it causes. but that's JMO. Also, the Giant has the previous generation Tiagra, so it's 9 speed versus 10 for the others.
> 
> Since fit is so important, the shop you choose is also pretty important. Ask some questions about exactly what the included bike fit entails. If one shop emphasizes fit more than another, that IMO/E matters. That's not to say you should buy a bike you don't like from them. Ideally, you'll find the right bike at the reputable shop.
> 
> I agree with the others comments re: test riding relaxed as well as race bikes. Test rides are free, and they're kinda fun, so why not. And yes, the Roubaix (and Tarmac) among some other makes/ models are all good options.
> 
> One last thought on warranties. All the makes/ models you're considering are top shelf, quality bikes. But just as a FYI, Scott only offers a 5 year warranty on their frames IF you bring the bike in to a dealer for inspection yearly. If not, the warranty term drops to 3 years. Conversely, C'dale, Giant and Specialized (among many others) offer limited lifetime warranties.
> 
> HTH...




Thanks for your input. Especially on fitting and warranties.

When I've asked about fitting at the various LBS's I've visited, I've gotten a broad range of answers. The Specialized dealer said a 45 min to 1 hr. fitting session comes with every bike they sell. Includes switching stems, etc. I visited this shop very early in my research and plan to go back there again now that I have more info. At another shop, I was told that they would fit the bike to me, and if they needed to switch out a stem, "they weren't very expensive". Also, some shops offer lifetime minor tune-ups, some offer 5-years worth, and some offer 1 tune up after the break-in period.

I plan to research my purchase another month or so before buying. So, thanks for the advice so far and I will add additional posts as I learn more.

I plan to take a look at some aluminum alloy frame/carbon fork bikes this weekend. I'm still leaning toward the 11X32 apex, for now.

Thanks!!


----------



## RickJP

NJBiker72 said:


> IMHO, you have the right idea. Go frame instead of wheels. Much easier to upgrade wheels later if you choose.
> 
> I like the idea of 11X32. I prefer to be able to spin and will sacrifice some speed going downhill for an easier climb, but you will not even be giving that up. The gears will just be spaced a bit more on the Apex I believe.


The gearing between the Sram 1050 (11/32) and the 105 CS5700 (11/25) is:

Sram 1050 11/32 cassette

11, 12, 13, 15, 17, 19, 22, 25, 28, 32

Shimano 105 CS5700 cassette

11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19, 21, 23, 25

Clearly the Sram is more for [steep] hills than for flats. We don't have many "hills" in South Florida, other than some high overpasses here and there. I go over a 28 foot overpass on my usual 12 1/2 mile morning ride with no problem, and with little or no downshifting, with my 105 cassette. 

When I bought my Felt, I came extremely close to buying a MB Super Strada from BD. I'm glad I didn't. I don't think I would have liked the gearing on the Apex cassette.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for your input. Especially on fitting and warranties.
> 
> When I've asked about fitting at the various LBS's I've visited, I've gotten a broad range of answers. The Specialized dealer said a 45 min to 1 hr. fitting session comes with every bike they sell. Includes switching stems, etc. I visited this shop very early in my research and plan to go back there again now that I have more info. At another shop, I was told that they would fit the bike to me, and if they needed to switch out a stem, "they weren't very expensive". Also, some shops offer lifetime minor tune-ups, some offer 5-years worth, and some offer 1 tune up after the break-in period.
> 
> *I plan to research my purchase another month or so before buying. * So, thanks for the advice so far and I will add additional posts as I learn more.
> 
> I plan to take a look at some aluminum alloy frame/carbon fork bikes this weekend. I'm still leaning toward the 11X32 apex, for now.
> 
> Thanks!!


Kudo's to you for taking some time to gather opinions, assimilate the info, taking your time to make the right decision _for you_. That's important, because (for a myriad of reasons) my 'right decision' might very well not be yours.

As a follow up, a couple of thoughts.

A 45 minute to one hour fitting is on the above average side, but I'd still ask some pointed questions about what it entails. The LBS's that give vague answers (IMO/E) do so because they (or the person doing the fitting) may not be all that experienced. But rather than make assumptions, I'd ask at those shops as well.

JMO, but I wouldn't base a buying decision on free tuneups for a year or five. They basically consist of making a couple of minor adjustments (no parts replacement) and any reputable shop will perform them within a month or two (during the break-in period) of purchasing the bike. After that, minor maintenance (cleaning/ lubing the drivetrain) is needed, but that's something you can start doing yourself. 

Re: the alu/ CF debate, IME and all else being equal (tire size, construction, PSI, wheelsets) a CF frame will quell road buzz better than aluminum, and on the longer rides (I think) would be appreciated. Since _handling_ (and to some extent,_ ride_) is dictated primarily by geometry, bikes like the Spec Allez (alu) and Tarmac (CF) will _handle_ the same - assuming fit is the same.

Similar to my earlier post, my advice is to ride a number of bikes, both CF and alu. I tend to place a priority on a frameset, because that's the heart of the bike, with all the rest bolting to it, and (generally) the frameset outlasts everything else. 

Last thought on gearing. Since you're new to this and you don't really know your requirements yet, it might be wise to err on the side of caution and initially go with lower gearing. It can always be changed/ altered and you may find that in the first season or two a 34/ 32 combo keeps your cadence up on the climbs, which is important.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Kudo's to you for taking some time to gather opinions, assimilate the info, taking your time to make the right decision _for you_. That's important, because (for a myriad of reasons) my 'right decision' might very well not be yours.
> 
> As a follow up, a couple of thoughts.
> 
> A 45 minute to one hour fitting is on the above average side, but I'd still ask some pointed questions about what it entails. The LBS's that give vague answers (IMO/E) do so because they (or the person doing the fitting) may not be all that experienced. But rather than make assumptions, I'd ask at those shops as well.
> 
> JMO, but I wouldn't base a buying decision on free tuneups for a year or five. They basically consist of making a couple of minor adjustments (no parts replacement) and any reputable shop will perform them within a month or two (during the break-in period) of purchasing the bike. After that, minor maintenance (cleaning/ lubing the drivetrain) is needed, but that's something you can start doing yourself.
> 
> Re: the alu/ CF debate, IME and all else being equal (tire size, construction, PSI, wheelsets) a CF frame will quell road buzz better than aluminum, and on the longer rides (I think) would be appreciated. Since _handling_ (and to some extent,_ ride_) is dictated primarily by geometry, bikes like the Spec Allez (alu) and Tarmac (CF) will _handle_ the same - assuming fit is the same.
> 
> Similar to my earlier post, my advice is to ride a number of bikes, both CF and alu. I tend to place a priority on a frameset, because that's the heart of the bike, with all the rest bolting to it, and (generally) the frameset outlasts everything else.
> 
> Last thought on gearing. Since you're new to this and you don't really know your requirements yet, it might be wise to err on the side of caution and initially go with lower gearing. It can always be changed/ altered and you may find that in the first season or two a 34/ 32 combo keeps your cadence up on the climbs, which is important.




Wow! Everyone is offering such useful advice. This is even better than what I had hoped for. Thanks!!!!!

As for where I am right now....I'm still leaning toward CF, although I'm not married to it. I will take a look at some aluminum ones in the coming weeks and I remain open on this issue. Plus, although my budget is $2000, it would be nice to come in a good bit below that.

Also, I'm still leaning toward the 11X32 gearing. As I said, I do a good bit of running and, if pedaling up the hills around here is anything like running up them, I will need all the help I can get. I agree with you on erring on the side of caution.

I still have a lot to learn and I look forward to hearing everyone's input. This is helping me more than you know. Thanks.

Bottom line right now is, IF I HAD TO BUY NOW, I would get the Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. But, this probably will change. Any opinions?


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Bottom line right now is, IF I HAD TO BUY NOW, I would get the Cannondale Synapse Carbon 6 Apex. But, this probably will change. Any opinions?


Bike shopping comes down to two fundamentals: 1) once defined, finding makes/ models that suite your intended uses, and 2) fit. If the C'dale suites your purposes (and from what you've offered, I think it does) and fits, rides and handles the way you like, I think it's a fine choice. Since the onus of getting fit right is on the LBS, their fitters level of expertise matters, so having confidence in the bike shop matters as well. 

I know you're talking hypothetically, but before you committed to the purchase I would strongly advise that you set up an appointment to visit the shop, get sized (if needed)/ fitted to the C'dale and head out for a test ride - out on the roads and for some duration.

During the test ride, focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling - placement of controls and how they operate. If needed, go back and have tweaks to fit and go out for another ride. If you get that 'fits like a glove' feeling, you may have found your bike, because IME it doesn't get much better than that. 

Once you get a few test rides in and want to update your experiences, you may want to consider starting a new thread here. Posts tend to get buried in the sticky's, whereas 'stand alone' threads may get a little more exposure.

Good luck!!


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Bike shopping comes down to two fundamentals: 1) once defined, finding makes/ models that suite your intended uses, and 2) fit. If the C'dale suites your purposes (and from what you've offered, I think it does) and fits, rides and handles the way you like, I think it's a fine choice. Since the onus of getting fit right is on the LBS, their fitters level of expertise matters, so having confidence in the bike shop matters as well.
> 
> I know you're talking hypothetically, but before you committed to the purchase I would strongly advise that you set up an appointment to visit the shop, get sized (if needed)/ fitted to the C'dale and head out for a test ride - out on the roads and for some duration.
> 
> During the test ride, focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling - placement of controls and how they operate. If needed, go back and have tweaks to fit and go out for another ride. If you get that 'fits like a glove' feeling, you may have found your bike, because IME it doesn't get much better than that.
> 
> Once you get a few test rides in and want to update your experiences, you may want to consider starting a new thread here. Posts tend to get buried in the sticky's, whereas 'stand alone' threads may get a little more exposure.
> 
> Good luck!!


Thanks for the advice. You've offered some good suggestions.

There are a couple of reasons that I would buy the Cannondale if I was purchasing today. Many of these reasons go along with what you have suggested. 

First, the Synapse I rode seemed to fit me really well right from the start. There is a residential neighborhood behind the shop which has some pretty good hills. I rode the bike for about 15 mins. up and down those hills, took some corners at speed, etc. Although I agree that I need more time on the bike, it was a pretty thorough test-ride.

Other reasons for leaning toward the Cannondale Synapse at this time are: 1) The LBS has been in business for a long time and has a good reputation. 2) The shop has a good website with a lot of information on local routes, group rides, etc. 3) The shop is within riding-distance of my home. 4) From my limited experience and from what I have read and learned, Cannondale seems to be a reputable and well-respected company that makes quality products. 5) I like the SRAM components and the double-tap shifters.

However, I am still in the research phase of purchasing a new bike. I'm just leaning toward the Cannondale Synapse for now and the LBS is a great influence on that decision. I will take your advice and spend some more time at the shop and ask some questions, especially about the fitting process.

I'll also take your advice on starting a new thread after I do some more test-riding. I'm pretty new at forum sites as well as being new to road cycling.

Thanks.


----------



## PJ352

IMO you've offered sound reasoning for placing the Synapse at the top of your list. I think your plan to research further is a good one, but considering this bike suites your intended uses, fits well and has gearing that (likely) will meet your needs, I also feel confident in saying you wouldn't go wrong with the C'dale. However, in this market segment/ price range there are other good (albeit different) choices. 

Nothing wrong with posting to a sticky. I just offered an opinion on how you might get a little more exposure, thus feedback. 

If/ when possible, keep us updated on your progress and with any questions/ comments/ concerns you may have. I think others can learn from your buying experiences.


----------



## jeepsouth

Interesting day today.

First, my wife and I went on a 18-20 mile ride on a local rail trail. I have a Giant Sedona comfort bike and she has a Diamondback Mtn. bike, currently. Then, we went to the Specialized shop I mentioned earlier.

Armed with the knowledge you fine folks have provided, along with what I've learned through my research, I was much more "tuned in" during my 2 test-rides and I asked much better and more pointed questions.

First, after the test rides (even near-downtown, Greenville, SC, is hilly) I am more convinced than ever that I need the 11X32 gearing as opposed to the 12X25 or 12X28. I really paid a lot of attention to that today and have made up my mind on that one area.

I test-rode a 2011 Specialized Secteur with Tiagra components today. The bike fit great, but the Tiagra was unimpressive. Thanks to you all, I was judging with a much more critical eye today. The Tiagra just seemed clunky and unresponsive. Meanwhile, my wife was on a 2011 Specialized Dolce with Shimano 2300 components. The bike was a 51, and she was not comfortable.

Next, my wife was placed on a 2012 Specialized Dolce, 54, with Apex. First things first, this was definitely the correct size for her. It fit her like a glove. Second, although she has not been part of this research I have been doing, she commented on how much easier the hills were with the Apex components. Sort of verified the need for that gearing for me.

Meanwhile, I was on a 2012 Roubaix with Rival components, size 58. We had gone about 20 feet when I told my wife I was in love. This bike felt like it just wanted to go and I was just holding it back. This bike was perfect in every way. If it had not been $2750, I would have bought it on the spot. Just a perfect bike. They put me on that one because they did not have anything with Apex in my size and I wanted to experience the SRAM gearing. I want to ride a Secteur with the Apex package, hoping to get that "feeling" again.

Today has sort of re-set my thinking on my quest for the right bike for me. First, I'm sure I want/need the 11X32 gearing. Second, I want to find out what was so right about the Roubaix. Was it the fit? Was it the carbon? Was it the Rival components? From my understanding, the Secteur has the same geometry as the Roubaix, it is just aluminium with a carbon fork. I want to test-ride a Secteur with Apex components to find out ($1500 range). The LBS said to check back after the first of the year and they may have some. I'll let you know.

Lastly, I asked a lot of questions at this shop about fitting. They include a very thorough fitting with every bike purchase (1 hour or more on average, they said), including swapping out certain parts without charge if the needed part is in stock. They also cover instructions on operation of the bike, maintenance, etc. Plus, they want you to go out and ride for an hour or more (they have a route with hills, etc. planned out) and then come back for more adjustments. Seems very thorough to me.

As usual, I welcome any opinions/advice.


----------



## PJ352

Working from the bottom of your post up, I have to say I'm impressed with the LBS's attention to fit. Sounds like a top shelf shop and considering the importance of getting fit right, a big plus IMO. I especially like that they promote riding for an hour, then returning for tweaks to fit. It's likely that won't be the last time you'll need small adjustments made, but it does show attention to the details. 

Re: the Secteur versus Roubaix, you're correct that the geo of the bikes is identical, so if they fit differently (and assuming the same frame size) it's possible that stems were previously swapped and/ or angles set differently to accommodate other test riders. That would all be sorted out with the fitting, but as far as how you felt on the Roubaix versus the Secteur, it's very possible that the higher end bike just felt better to you. 

As I've offered previously, all else being equal, CF does tend to quell road buzz better than aluminum, and with a combination of the gearing being lower on the Roubaix and the bike itself weighing less, it would accelerate a little quicker, making it feel more agile.

Re: gearing and components, it seems you've decided on SRAM and either Apex or Rival, which is certainly demonstrating progress. 

You're learning as you go, which is a good thing. But you're also learning that (as with most things), the more you pay, the more you get. That doesn't _always_ hold true but in this case, maybe.


----------



## NJBiker72

jeepsouth said:


> Interesting day today.
> 
> First, my wife and I went on a 18-20 mile ride on a local rail trail. I have a Giant Sedona comfort bike and she has a Diamondback Mtn. bike, currently. Then, we went to the Specialized shop I mentioned earlier.
> 
> Armed with the knowledge you fine folks have provided, along with what I've learned through my research, I was much more "tuned in" during my 2 test-rides and I asked much better and more pointed questions.
> 
> First, after the test rides (even near-downtown, Greenville, SC, is hilly) I am more convinced than ever that I need the 11X32 gearing as opposed to the 12X25 or 12X28. I really paid a lot of attention to that today and have made up my mind on that one area.
> 
> I test-rode a 2011 Specialized Secteur with Tiagra components today. The bike fit great, but the Tiagra was unimpressive. Thanks to you all, I was judging with a much more critical eye today. The Tiagra just seemed clunky and unresponsive. Meanwhile, my wife was on a 2011 Specialized Dolce with Shimano 2300 components. The bike was a 51, and she was not comfortable.
> 
> Next, my wife was placed on a 2012 Specialized Dolce, 54, with Apex. First things first, this was definitely the correct size for her. It fit her like a glove. Second, although she has not been part of this research I have been doing, she commented on how much easier the hills were with the Apex components. Sort of verified the need for that gearing for me.
> 
> Meanwhile, I was on a 2012 Roubaix with Rival components, size 58. We had gone about 20 feet when I told my wife I was in love. This bike felt like it just wanted to go and I was just holding it back. This bike was perfect in every way. If it had not been $2750, I would have bought it on the spot. Just a perfect bike. They put me on that one because they did not have anything with Apex in my size and I wanted to experience the SRAM gearing. I want to ride a Secteur with the Apex package, hoping to get that "feeling" again.
> 
> Today has sort of re-set my thinking on my quest for the right bike for me. First, I'm sure I want/need the 11X32 gearing. Second, I want to find out what was so right about the Roubaix. Was it the fit? Was it the carbon? Was it the Rival components? From my understanding, the Secteur has the same geometry as the Roubaix, it is just aluminium with a carbon fork. I want to test-ride a Secteur with Apex components to find out ($1500 range). The LBS said to check back after the first of the year and they may have some. I'll let you know.
> 
> Lastly, I asked a lot of questions at this shop about fitting. They include a very thorough fitting with every bike purchase (1 hour or more on average, they said), including swapping out certain parts without charge if the needed part is in stock. They also cover instructions on operation of the bike, maintenance, etc. Plus, they want you to go out and ride for an hour or more (they have a route with hills, etc. planned out) and then come back for more adjustments. Seems very thorough to me.
> 
> As usual, I welcome any opinions/advice.



Sounds like they did a nice job. On the shifting, I tested a variety of systems. I ended up with Sram Red (in part because it was on the bike I liked and the next step down was Ultegra). I tried Apex on a different bike and I liked it, but it was definitely a little harder to shift than the Red or even the Ultegra. For the money, I would have no problem with the Apex, but just my opinion, the shifting is a little less smooth. That said it is a world better than the Tiagra or Sora, or even the 105, again, my opinion.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Working from the bottom of your post up, I have to say I'm impressed with the LBS's attention to fit. Sounds like a top shelf shop and considering the importance of getting fit right, a big plus IMO. I especially like that they promote riding for an hour, then returning for tweaks to fit. It's likely that won't be the last time you'll need small adjustments made, but it does show attention to the details.
> 
> Re: the Secteur versus Roubaix, you're correct that the geo of the bikes is identical, so if they fit differently (and assuming the same frame size) it's possible that stems were previously swapped and/ or angles set differently to accommodate other test riders. That would all be sorted out with the fitting, but as far as how you felt on the Roubaix versus the Secteur, it's very possible that the higher end bike just felt better to you.
> 
> As I've offered previously, all else being equal, CF does tend to quell road buzz better than aluminum, and with a combination of the gearing being lower on the Roubaix and the bike itself weighing less, it would accelerate a little quicker, making it feel more agile.
> 
> Re: gearing and components, it seems you've decided on SRAM and either Apex or Rival, which is certainly demonstrating progress.
> 
> You're learning as you go, which is a good thing. But you're also learning that (as with most things), the more you pay, the more you get. That doesn't _always_ hold true but in this case, maybe.



Thanks for the feedback.

The Secteur I rode initially felt great fit-wise. I was just not at all impressed with the Tiagra. Not smooth at all. The Rival on the Roubaix was much smoother shifting and, again, overall that bike was just perfect. I am really looking forward to testing the Secteur with the Apex.

Like you, I was very impressed with the attention to fitting at that shop. I need to ask some fitting questions at other shops in the area but, what they do at this shop seems to be extraordinary by a good margin. That attention to detail would be important to every one, but even more so to a beginner like me, I think.

I have a few days off this week and plan to visit the Cannondale shop and the Felt folks again. I'll let you know how it goes.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for the feedback.
> 
> The Secteur I rode initially felt great fit-wise. * I was just not at all impressed with the Tiagra. Not smooth at all. The Rival on the Roubaix was much smoother shifting *and, again, overall that bike was just perfect. I am really looking forward to testing the Secteur with the Apex.
> 
> Like you, I was very impressed with the attention to fitting at that shop. I need to ask some fitting questions at other shops in the area but, what they do at this shop seems to be extraordinary by a good margin. That attention to detail would be important to every one, but even more so to a beginner like me, I think.
> 
> I have a few days off this week and plan to visit the Cannondale shop and the Felt folks again. I'll let you know how it goes.


A couple of thoughts re: your comments on Tiagra versus Rival. While there certainly is value in test riding bikes, it's important to segregate out the important facets from the less than important ones. In the case of shifting, their could be a number of reasons why one bike shifts better than another, from a simple adjustment to setup issues. To those less knowledgeable mechanically, these 'problems' reflect poorly on the component group itself - in some instances, that's misleading.

As an example, when I test rode my now 'go to' bike back in '08, it dropped the chain shifting both from the outer ring to inner and inner ring to outer. The rear shifting was noisy and hesitant. I loved the way the bike fit, rode and handled, and recognized these issues as relatively minor. I bought the bike and it now has in excess of 12k miles on it - it's a 105 equipped bike and shifts slightly better than my Ultegra equipped bike. The moral of the story is that if you find a bike you really like but the shifting doesn't seem up to par, communicate that to the shop. There's a good chance it can be remedied.

I'm not trying to talk you into (or out of) anything here. I'm simply sharing an experience that may provide you with some knowledge to differentiate the important from the less so on test rides. Also, just as a FYI, the current version of Tiagra is now 10 speed and can accommodate a rear cog of 30 teeth, but Shimano specs are consistently conservative, so it's likely it'll accommodate gearing on a par with Apex. Again, not trying to sway your opinions, just provide info.

I agree that the shops attention to fit details would likely benefit new and experienced riders alike. I wish more shops would do the same....

Good luck at the other shops. It'll be interesting to read updates on your progress.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> A couple of thoughts re: your comments on Tiagra versus Rival. While there certainly is value in test riding bikes, it's important to segregate out the important facets from the less than important ones. In the case of shifting, their could be a number of reasons why one bike shifts better than another, from a simple adjustment to setup issues. To those less knowledgeable mechanically, these 'problems' reflect poorly on the component group itself - in some instances, that's misleading.
> 
> As an example, when I test rode my now 'go to' bike back in '08, it dropped the chain shifting both from the outer ring to inner and inner ring to outer. The rear shifting was noisy and hesitant. I loved the way the bike fit, rode and handled, and recognized these issues as relatively minor. I bought the bike and it now has in excess of 12k miles on it - it's a 105 equipped bike and shifts slightly better than my Ultegra equipped bike. The moral of the story is that if you find a bike you really like but the shifting doesn't seem up to par, communicate that to the shop. There's a good chance it can be remedied.
> 
> I'm not trying to talk you into (or out of) anything here. I'm simply sharing an experience that may provide you with some knowledge to differentiate the important from the less so on test rides. Also, just as a FYI, the current version of Tiagra is now 10 speed and can accommodate a rear cog of 30 teeth, but Shimano specs are consistently conservative, so it's likely it'll accommodate gearing on a par with Apex. Again, not trying to sway your opinions, just provide info.
> 
> I agree that the shops attention to fit details would likely benefit new and experienced riders alike. I wish more shops would do the same....
> 
> Good luck at the other shops. It'll be interesting to read updates on your progress.



Good information. I will keep what you said in mind on future test-rides.
Thanks.


----------



## myjplp

blue lotus,

I feel your pain man. I was in a similar situation recently. It is definitely not an easy process buying a bike but a fun one. 

I went shopping for a bike in the hundreds of dollars range to go riding with my 4-yearold daughter. I ended up falling in love with and buying a $2K+ road bike. I can still use this to ride with my daughter but ultimately I bought the bike that I really enjoyed riding and liked the best that I could still afford.

Regarding riding with the groups, I knew that I would enjoy riding this bike on my own even if I decide not to ride with the groups around where I live.

Hope that was somewhat helpful. 



blue lotus said:


> I was given a $1K gift card to a LBS for a 60th bd, to complement my summer tennis games, and when on Friday my LBS asked what do I plan to use the bike for, my answer is basically I am not an experienced rider, I have gone maybe 25 miles in the past year on my 10 speed steel bike, I have to put the bike in the car in order to find a safe place to ride, I would like to ride with others, but these organized rides sponsored by these robust cycle clubs in this NYC suburban area think nothing of 35/45 mile rides, even for "D" rides, and I'm not sure if those rides aren't really races with everyone looking at their Cateye to outdo their performance the week before, and I'm not sure I have the fitness level or paceline experience to just jump into even a "D" ride for 30 miles...so, what if I buy a road bike, and I'm not interested in being a regular in these cycle club "Dplus" rides? What if I want the option to also use it for leisure riding, for a car substitute for going to the pharmacy to pick up some things on an errand...so many classifications of bikes, so little time.....
> 
> So, here's the further question/ story about trying to buy on a budget:: On Friday, the LBS showed me entry level road bikes, but for $1K or less, you must get Sora shifters, those little black buttons which are not accessible if you're holding on to the lower handlebar, and there was something annoying about those buttons for me. The Trek 1.5, which has Tiagra shifters, was on sale for less than $1K, but the H2 height, the forward lean for my six foot frame on the bike, riding around the back parking lot for some five minutes, caused me some lower back ache, perhaps I just didn't stretch out enough prior to taking a test ride. The Specialized Secteur Sport was about $760, it is a bit higher and was H3, but it had those darn Sora shifters, otherwise I liked it better than the Trek1.2....naturally, the LBS asked me to "try this one," and it shifted nicely, felt secure, but of course the "surprise" was that it was a Roubaix Apex Compact for $1600, and sure, entry level carbon fiber is nicer than the aluminum bikes, they do scream out "ride me!", but it was out of my price range, I still am not committed to doing any group rides...but now I understand why experienced riders covet and often purchase carbon fiber bikes...the Sora shifter bikes just didn't scream at me to say "ride me!"...I liked 'em, but it clearly was settling due to a price point...
> 
> So I left the LBS basically confused, I still don't get some of these classifications, such as "fitness bike" like the Trek FX series, or perhaps "comfort road bikes" like the higher Secteur....my wife, who joined me, meanwhile sees a cheapo mountain bike, a Raleigh Eva, starts to ride it, and says to me, that's the one for me, it's only $275, and it's easy to ride...no research, no nothing, she just wants to ride a bike....meanwhile, I'm struggling with all these issues like shifters and forward lean/fitting, and thinking, I am not a committed road bike guy, yet everyone seems to say get a road bike if you want to have the OPTION to participate in any of the cycle club rides....but who knows how much I'll like them.... Trek says the FX is their most popular bike, but I'm unclear what is a "touring" bike, a "comfort bike", a "fitness bike"...and then there's the category called "comfort road bikes' and "urban bikes" as well as cross bikes...
> 
> Which type (road? Hybrid? Comfort?) of bike enables you to perhaps do a "Dplus" road bike group ride from time to time, but also give you the opportunity to put the bike in the car, go up north some 15 miles, and ride with the wife on her cheapo mountain bike on some less traveled paved roads on on a Sunday afternoon? And also substitute for car transportation and just give me a chance to ride to the pharmacy, pick up a NY Times, a prescription, and come back home...
> 
> My LBS is a dealer for Specialized, Trek, Bianchi, and Raleigh...
> Thanks for any thoughts/assistance, I missed Black Friday weekend sale prices, but it's clear I'm not clear on what I'm doing...
> 
> Blue Lotus in Connecticut


----------



## Anthony3

Just bought a new specialized allez elite today.


----------



## gaspi101

Anthony3 said:


> Just bought a new specialized allez elite today.


Congrats! How do you like it?


----------



## jeepsouth

NJBiker72 said:


> Sounds like they did a nice job. On the shifting, I tested a variety of systems. I ended up with Sram Red (in part because it was on the bike I liked and the next step down was Ultegra). I tried Apex on a different bike and I liked it, but it was definitely a little harder to shift than the Red or even the Ultegra. For the money, I would have no problem with the Apex, but just my opinion, the shifting is a little less smooth. That said it is a world better than the Tiagra or Sora, or even the 105, again, my opinion.



Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas.
Brief update on my research into buying a new road bike: I had planned to test-ride some bikes earlier in the week, but we had steady rain for 3 days. Then, yesterday, I had to have a medical procedure done (nothing serious, but it has laid me up for a few days). So, I'll try to get back at it next week.
Meanwhile, I hope everyone has a great Christmas!!! If you come up with any more suggestions or advice for me, please let me know.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas.
> Brief update on my research into buying a new road bike: I had planned to test-ride some bikes earlier in the week, but we had steady rain for 3 days. Then, yesterday, I had to have a medical procedure done (nothing serious, but it has laid me up for a few days). So, I'll try to get back at it next week.
> Meanwhile, I hope everyone has a great Christmas!!! If you come up with any more suggestions or advice for me, please let me know.


Merry Christmas to you as well.

My only advice is to get well and get yer butt out to test ride some bikes!! :thumbsup:


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Merry Christmas to you as well.
> 
> My only advice is to get well and get yer butt out to test ride some bikes!! :thumbsup:




Thanks, PJ. You've been a big help so far. Hope you had a great Christmas.

I had an adverse reaction to some of the medication I was given and that has knocked me back a few more days. My wife and I spent all day Christmas day in the emergency room (bummer!!!) Still, this is nothing serious and I'll be up and around as usual soon, hopefully by this weekend. Thanks for the well-wishes. It will probably be after New Year's Day before I can get back on a bike and I'll post some more then.

Thanks again for all of your help and advice.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks, PJ. You've been a big help so far. Hope you had a great Christmas.
> 
> I had an adverse reaction to some of the medication I was given and that has knocked me back a few more days. My wife and I spent all day Christmas day in the emergency room (bummer!!!) Still, this is nothing serious and I'll be up and around as usual soon, hopefully by this weekend. Thanks for the well-wishes. It will probably be after New Year's Day before I can get back on a bike and I'll post some more then.
> 
> Thanks again for all of your help and advice.


You're welcome.

Sorry to read about your misfortune. Take care and hopefully you'll be back on your feet and test riding some bikes soon!


----------



## Porschefan

*2006 Trek Pilot 5.2--good first bike? Value?*

I'm kind of looking for a good deal on a used road bike. I'm a newbie cyclist and have a nice mountain bike, but I'm thinking about getting a road bike also. I ran across a 2006 Trek Pilot that seems to be in good condition, with a claimed 200-miles total.

I'm older and not in great physical shape and from what I've read the Pilots have a little more relaxed/comfort geo and that sounds like it would be a plus.

Asking price is $1,100 and I don't want to pay that much, unless that's a no-brainer value and I could re-sell the bike easily if it turns out that I don't like the bike or road riding, for whatever reason.

What think ye?


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> I'm kind of looking for a good deal on a used road bike. I'm a newbie cyclist and have a nice mountain bike, but I'm thinking about getting a road bike also. I ran across a 2006 Trek Pilot that seems to be in good condition, with a claimed 200-miles total.
> 
> I'm older and not in great physical shape and from what I've read the Pilots have a little more relaxed/comfort geo and that sounds like it would be a plus.
> 
> Asking price is $1,100 and I don't want to pay that much, unless that's a no-brainer value and I could re-sell the bike easily if it turns out that I don't like the bike or road riding, for whatever reason.
> 
> What think ye?


There were ~10 Trek Pilot models made in '06, ranging in price from ~$800 to ~$4,700. Given that the seller is asking $1,100 it's _relatively_ safe to assume it's not the first or second base models, but it would be good if you could narrow it down some - preferably to the specific model.


----------



## Porschefan

PJ352 said:


> There were ~10 Trek Pilot models made in '06, ranging in price from ~$800 to ~$4,700. Given that the seller is asking $1,100 it's _relatively_ safe to assume it's not the first or second base models, but it would be good if you could narrow it down some - preferably to the specific model.


I didn't know there were so many models. The listing has this one as a "Trek Pilot 5.2."

Text of the ad:

"_*I am selling a full carbon 2006 model 56 cm Trek Pilot 5.2 road bike in blue. The bike is all stock, exactly as pictured and with the specs listed here: [link is omitted since I don't have enough posts to insert images or links]. This is essentially a Madone 5.2 with the more relaxed, non-race geometry and various other comfort features. It has been ridden perhaps 200 miles and never raced or crashed. There is one minor cosmetic blemish in the paint on the top tube, likely from a move, not from a drop or crash. Eggbeater pedals can stay with the bike. Originally retailed for $3200, asking $1100 or best offer.*_

So it appears to be one of the higher-end, carbon-framed models. There's a picture of it in the archive section of the Trek website and Bikepedia also lists it....but, as noted, I can't put links in here yet. The specs say it's mostly "Ultegra"-level components, which, I am told are somewhat akin to the "XT" level in mountain bike equipment.

Hope this makes it clearer.


----------



## MikeS123

I was just in the same boat as you. That doesn't sound like a bad bike, but if you are new to road biking like I am, there are several new and good bikes you can buy at a LBS for the same price and they will fit you, provide a free tuneup, and have a lifetime warranty on the frame. I wanted one with a relaxed geometry too, and I ended up going with the Felt Z85 and got it for $950. (check out my thread under Look KG381). I am happy I went this route knowing the bike fits me properly and I have a warranty. Also, the newer components, even if they are not "high end" are usually better than the high end older models (sort of a trickle down affect as explained to me by my LBS).


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> I didn't know there were so many models. The listing has this one as a "Trek Pilot 5.2."
> 
> Text of the ad:
> 
> "_*I am selling a full carbon 2006 model 56 cm Trek Pilot 5.2 road bike in blue. The bike is all stock, exactly as pictured and with the specs listed here: [link is omitted since I don't have enough posts to insert images or links]. This is essentially a Madone 5.2 with the more relaxed, non-race geometry and various other comfort features. It has been ridden perhaps 200 miles and never raced or crashed. There is one minor cosmetic blemish in the paint on the top tube, likely from a move, not from a drop or crash. Eggbeater pedals can stay with the bike. Originally retailed for $3200, asking $1100 or best offer.*_
> 
> So it appears to be one of the higher-end, carbon-framed models. There's a picture of it in the archive section of the Trek website and Bikepedia also lists it....but, as noted, I can't put links in here yet. The specs say it's mostly "Ultegra"-level components, which, I am told are somewhat akin to the "XT" level in mountain bike equipment.
> 
> Hope this makes it clearer.


I'll tell you upfront that I never recommend that someone buy a used CF bike, because warranties aren't transferable and because of the unique way CF can hide defects (internally) that cannot be seen without special equipment. Others (and you) may feel differently or think the price makes the risk worthwhile, but I don't.

The other negative to this bike is the wheelset. Paired spokes aren't the most durable design, but compounding that is the fact the the earlier Bonty's had problems with cracking rims, around the spoke holes. They've since abandoned the paired spoke design and presumably corrected the rim defect, but the same holds true here - no warranty, so in the event of problems, you'll be on your own to repair or replace the wheelset.

On the plus side, if the bike has only been ridden a couple of hundred miles, the components are in like new condition and should provide you with years of relatively trouble free service. Ultegra is Shimano's upper end road group, second only to Dura-Ace, so... a reliable, well performing groupset. 

Below is a pic of what I think is the bike you're considering. If you decide to check it out, be sure to test ride it for correct sizing, because while small adjustments can be made to tweak fit, larger adjustments (even when possible) don't result in optimal fit.

Also, check out the flaw in the top tube the seller mentions. If it's a surface scratch, it's cosmetic. If it's a gouge, it could affect the top tubes strength.
BikePedia - 2006 Trek Pilot 5.2 Complete Bicycle


----------



## RickJP

Porchefan, I have to concur with PJ's advise. Another contingency to consider, however, and this is directly related to what he considers a plus side, is how the bike has been stored during the last 5 years, assuming, of course, the owner bought it new. 

If the bike has only been riden 200 miles in 5 years, you're talking about a bike that barely has been riden 40 miles a year. Chances are this lack of riding may also involve a lack of maintenance. And, if the bike has been stored in a garage or worse yet, a shed, it's more likely than not that the strength of the CF, regardless of whether the blemish is cosmetic, has been compromised. Further, you also have to consider that while wheel and crankset bearings are sealed, dust particles and other hazards may have worked its way into the hubs, the headset, or the crankset, and most definitely the cables and brake housings. 

A bike is not a car insofar as a depreciation factor due to high mileage is concerned. IMHO, I'd rather buy a used bike with higher miles because it's been riden and well maintained, from a trusted source, than one that has sat idle for years and left to deteriorate on its own, due to lack of use, especially from someone I do not know. 



Just my .02.


----------



## Porschefan

RickJP said:


> A bike is not a car insofar as a depreciation factor due to high mileage is concerned. IMHO, I'd rather buy a used bike with higher miles because it's been riden and well maintained, from a trusted source, than one that has sat idle for years and left to deteriorate on its own, due to lack of use, especially from someone I do not know.
> 
> Just my .02.


Thanks for the input. Even with cars, "condition is everything" applies. Funny how mechanical/physical objects (including human bodies!) tend to "fall apart" when not used and taken care of.


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> Thanks for the input. Even with cars, "condition is everything" applies. Funny how mechanical/physical objects (including human bodies!) tend to "fall apart" when not used and taken care of.


FWIW I think Rick brings up some good points related to buying used. If you check this bike out, it's mechanical state may be evident, but if not, you could ask that it be checked over by a LBS. They might charge and they won't find hidden flaws, but they will find the more obvious ones and tell you if the bike is worth the asking price in your area (markets do vary by region). _However_, given that it's CF, I think a better option would be to buy new from your LBS. 

As far as your comment re: human bodies. IMO we're really very similar to machines. They ultimately wear out, but we can (hopefully) prolong the process with proper care.


----------



## NJBiker72

RickJP said:


> A bike is not a car insofar as a depreciation factor due to high mileage is concerned. IMHO, I'd rather buy a used bike with higher miles because it's been riden and well maintained, from a trusted source, than one that has sat idle for years and left to deteriorate on its own, due to lack of use, especially from someone I do not know.
> 
> 
> 
> Just my .02.


Part of the reason is when you get a used bike you don't have to get an engine with tons of mileage.


----------



## TheStudent

Hello Everyone,

I just recently created an account here and am seeking advice regarding purchasing my very first road bike. I apologize if I am intruding on this thread, but having a new account, I wasn't able to create my own. Anyways, I will greatly appreciate any input you can provide me...

The fact of the matter is, I know very little about biking and won't hesitate to admit it. There's still more research and time I need to put in, but I know I am off to the right start after coming across this forum. I am currently looking for a 54-56cm frame to commute to and from school (about 4 mi round trip) and an occasional 10-15mi casual ride on weekends. Here's the problem: I am a broke college student and my budget is $300 so I'm aware my options are limited.

I have gone to my LBS and it was of little help to me. They sold only new bikes that were out of my price range and the guy basically said I would have little luck finding a decent one for that type of money. Clearly I am not going to settle with that answer. I have been scavenging ebay and craigslist lately and came across a good amount of road bikes I can afford, but this is where I can use the help. I am not knowledgeable enough to separate the good from the bad, and would hate to get ripped off as would anyone. 

Here's what I came up with: (note the space within http)

*- 2007 KHS FIite220*: $295 / MSRP: $469

ht tp://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t169/forthedairy/Rob/Picture266-1.jpg

*- Raliegh m300 all aluminum*: $220 / MSRP: Can't find this model online

ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5T05X55R43na3m23ldbcbb3f800c99df61942.jpg

*- Schwinn Ultra Road Bike*: $250 / MSRP: $779.99 *seems a bit high on bikepedia

ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5Ie5Ga5Jd3G63J33l2bcs35c23db1e08c1f2c.jpg

I also came across a nice listing on ebay found below. I am not interested in the fixed gears:

ht tp://stores.ebay.com/SPRTYMAMA-BIKE-SHOP

So that's everything I have guys. Is it a safe assumption that all of these bikes are near the same quality for their asking price, and if so, what should my expectations be? Sorry for the huge posting but I just want my first purchase to be the right one! Thanks in advance


----------



## NJBiker72

TheStudent said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I just recently created an account here and am seeking advice regarding purchasing my very first road bike. I apologize if I am intruding on this thread, but having a new account, I wasn't able to create my own. Anyways, I will greatly appreciate any input you can provide me...
> 
> The fact of the matter is, I know very little about biking and won't hesitate to admit it. There's still more research and time I need to put in, but I know I am off to the right start after coming across this forum. I am currently looking for a 54-56cm frame to commute to and from school (about 4 mi round trip) and an occasional 10-15mi casual ride on weekends. Here's the problem: I am a broke college student and my budget is $300 so I'm aware my options are limited.
> 
> I have gone to my LBS and it was of little help to me. They sold only new bikes that were out of my price range and the guy basically said I would have little luck finding a decent one for that type of money. Clearly I am not going to settle with that answer. I have been scavenging ebay and craigslist lately and came across a good amount of road bikes I can afford, but this is where I can use the help. I am not knowledgeable enough to separate the good from the bad, and would hate to get ripped off as would anyone.
> 
> Here's what I came up with: (note the space within http)
> 
> *- 2007 KHS FIite220*: $295 / MSRP: $469
> 
> ht tp://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t169/forthedairy/Rob/Picture266-1.jpg
> 
> *- Raliegh m300 all aluminum*: $220 / MSRP: Can't find this model online
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5T05X55R43na3m23ldbcbb3f800c99df61942.jpg
> 
> *- Schwinn Ultra Road Bike*: $250 / MSRP: $779.99 *seems a bit high on bikepedia
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5Ie5Ga5Jd3G63J33l2bcs35c23db1e08c1f2c.jpg
> 
> I also came across a nice listing on ebay found below. I am not interested in the fixed gears:
> 
> ht tp://stores.ebay.com/SPRTYMAMA-BIKE-SHOP
> 
> So that's everything I have guys. Is it a safe assumption that all of these bikes are near the same quality for their asking price, and if so, what should my expectations be? Sorry for the huge posting but I just want my first purchase to be the right one! Thanks in advance


First thing is fit. I would try another local shop and do some test rides to make sure the bike fits. 
For the price you are looking for and what you are looking to do, i would get a hybrid. 

You might even be able to get one at Dick's or someplace like that. 

Out of the names you mentioned, Raleigh is probably the best but that's just a quick impression without being able to check the links now.


----------



## RickJP

TheStudent said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I just recently created an account here and am seeking advice regarding purchasing my very first road bike. I apologize if I am intruding on this thread, but having a new account, I wasn't able to create my own. Anyways, I will greatly appreciate any input you can provide me...
> 
> The fact of the matter is, I know very little about biking and won't hesitate to admit it. There's still more research and time I need to put in, but I know I am off to the right start after coming across this forum. I am currently looking for a 54-56cm frame to commute to and from school (about 4 mi round trip) and an occasional 10-15mi casual ride on weekends. Here's the problem: I am a broke college student and my budget is $300 so I'm aware my options are limited.
> 
> I have gone to my LBS and it was of little help to me. They sold only new bikes that were out of my price range and the guy basically said I would have little luck finding a decent one for that type of money. Clearly I am not going to settle with that answer. I have been scavenging ebay and craigslist lately and came across a good amount of road bikes I can afford, but this is where I can use the help. I am not knowledgeable enough to separate the good from the bad, and would hate to get ripped off as would anyone.
> 
> Here's what I came up with: (note the space within http)
> 
> *- 2007 KHS FIite220*: $295 / MSRP: $469
> 
> ht tp://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t169/forthedairy/Rob/Picture266-1.jpg
> 
> *- Raliegh m300 all aluminum*: $220 / MSRP: Can't find this model online
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5T05X55R43na3m23ldbcbb3f800c99df61942.jpg
> 
> *- Schwinn Ultra Road Bike*: $250 / MSRP: $779.99 *seems a bit high on bikepedia
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5Ie5Ga5Jd3G63J33l2bcs35c23db1e08c1f2c.jpg
> 
> I also came across a nice listing on ebay found below. I am not interested in the fixed gears:
> 
> ht tp://stores.ebay.com/SPRTYMAMA-BIKE-SHOP
> 
> So that's everything I have guys. Is it a safe assumption that all of these bikes are near the same quality for their asking price, and if so, what should my expectations be? Sorry for the huge posting but I just want my first purchase to be the right one! Thanks in advance


Hey TS. Welcome to roadbike review. I suppose the first question I can ask you is this; what is/are your planned use(s) for the bike? If you're looking to just use it to commute and move around in college (I did when in flight school), quite frankly, either will do. 

However, if you're looking to do more, such as racing, or long rides, then you'd have to look at each bike and determine how it best fits the purpose for which you want it. Also, you'd want to look into size, because it does matter. The other factor to consider is the geometry. Of course, most paramount is your budget. Question is; do you have a firm budget, or is there any "wiggling" room? If the latter, then you can do more intelligent shopping.

At any rate, do consider this; when you buy a used anything, you don't exactly know what it is you're getting, and very seldom are sellers 100% forthcoming on all issues, especially negative.

If you're really looking for something inexpensive, and neither brand name components, nor high quality frames are a concern, look check out Save Up To 60% Off Road Bikes, Bicycles, Mountain Bikes and Bicycles with Bikesdirect.com, New with full warranties. You're bound to find exactly what you want, for the price you're willing to pay.

Ask away. There's plenty of people here with lots of knowledge who can guide you well. They guided me. 

RJP


----------



## PJ352

TheStudent said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I just recently created an account here and am seeking advice regarding purchasing my very first road bike. I apologize if I am intruding on this thread, but having a new account, I wasn't able to create my own. Anyways, I will greatly appreciate any input you can provide me...
> 
> The fact of the matter is, I know very little about biking and won't hesitate to admit it. There's still more research and time I need to put in, but I know I am off to the right start after coming across this forum. I am currently looking for a 54-56cm frame to commute to and from school (about 4 mi round trip) and an occasional 10-15mi casual ride on weekends. Here's the problem: I am a broke college student and my budget is $300 so I'm aware my options are limited.
> 
> I have gone to my LBS and it was of little help to me. They sold only new bikes that were out of my price range and the guy basically said I would have little luck finding a decent one for that type of money. Clearly I am not going to settle with that answer. I have been scavenging ebay and craigslist lately and came across a good amount of road bikes I can afford, but this is where I can use the help. I am not knowledgeable enough to separate the good from the bad, and would hate to get ripped off as would anyone.
> 
> Here's what I came up with: (note the space within http)
> 
> *- 2007 KHS FIite220*: $295 / MSRP: $469
> 
> ht tp://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t169/forthedairy/Rob/Picture266-1.jpg
> 
> *- Raliegh m300 all aluminum*: $220 / MSRP: Can't find this model online
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5T05X55R43na3m23ldbcbb3f800c99df61942.jpg
> 
> *- Schwinn Ultra Road Bike*: $250 / MSRP: $779.99 *seems a bit high on bikepedia
> 
> ht tp://images.craigslist.org/5Ie5Ga5Jd3G63J33l2bcs35c23db1e08c1f2c.jpg
> 
> I also came across a nice listing on ebay found below. I am not interested in the fixed gears:
> 
> ht tp://stores.ebay.com/SPRTYMAMA-BIKE-SHOP
> 
> So that's everything I have guys. Is it a safe assumption that all of these bikes are near the same quality for their asking price, and if so, what should my expectations be? Sorry for the huge posting but I just want my first purchase to be the right one! Thanks in advance


When shopping for a bike, there are two primary considerations (within price range). Intended uses, and fit. Since you've already defined your intended uses (short commutes/ 10-15 mile weekend rides), either a hybrid or drop bar bike will suite them, but given your price range you may want to focus on a hybrid.

I say this because 1) they're generally cheaper than drop bar bikes, and 2) they're somewhat easier to fit, but fit still matters. The drawback to going with a hybrid is that if you become a more serious cyclist, wanting to travel longer distances, drop bar bikes offer the advantage of being able to change hand positions. And while it seems counter intuitive, a slightly more aggressive rider position is (generally speaking) better tolerated on longer rides.

That said, I think being new to biking and not knowing much in the way of fit/ bike mechanics, it's to your advantage to shop locally, focusing on new. This gives you the option to test ride the bikes, get a warranty and (depending on the store) get some level of fit assistance. If you go with a hybrid, with a few test rides and some fit assistance, you should be able to whittle your choices to the bike or bikes that feel best. Most noobs don't think they'll be able to tell a decent bike fit, but humans are able to recognize comfort and pain. Just make sure you give each bike a chance, so ride each - out on the roads and for some length of time.

As far as where to buy, that would depend on your locale, I think Rei's, Dick's or better yet, a LBS carrying moderately priced brands like Raleigh are decent choices. 

Last thought. Given that you're pretty much flying blind here, I'd advise against buying online. The _only_ advantage is price, but there are a number of pitfalls and hidden costs associated with going that route. Even members here that are generally happy with their purchases will tell you that final assembly, tuning, fit adjustments all have to be done by a LBS (for a fee) or by the buyer, so you'd need to set aside some of your budget beyond the initial cost, and the results may not be ideal (wrong size purchased/ fit issues...) Even in your price range, I think you have better options.

HTH...


----------



## RickJP

TheStudent said:


> I am currently looking for a 54-56cm frame to commute to and from school (about 4 mi round trip) and an occasional 10-15mi casual ride on weekends.


Wow! I sure did miss that.


----------



## bluedevilbike

*Newbie and advice for first bike*

Hi there.

I am new to cycling. I have been wanting to get started for a couple of years now.

It is a long story, but I recently picked up a Serotta Meivici. It is a couple of years old, but it fits me perfectly. I am trying to decide if I should keep it. It feels like too nice a bike for someone who can barely clip his petals in.

I am considering trying to sell it on ebay or craigslist and then buying more of a beginner bike.

What do you think?


----------



## PJ352

bluedevilbike said:


> Hi there.
> 
> I am new to cycling. I have been wanting to get started for a couple of years now.
> 
> It is a long story, but I recently picked up a Serotta Meivici. It is a couple of years old, but it fits me perfectly. I am trying to decide if I should keep it. It feels like too nice a bike for someone who can barely clip his petals in.
> 
> I am considering trying to sell it on ebay or craigslist and then buying more of a beginner bike.
> 
> What do you think?


Since you purchased the bike I'm assuming it suites your intended purposes, you can afford it and (as you say) it 'fits perfectly', so I don't see it being 'too nice' as a reason to sell it. Even if you break even, you're left trying to find a suitable replacement that fits as well. Seems a step (or two) back, IMO. 

Serotta's are nice bikes and a bike that fits perfectly is a real find, so rather than give this one up my suggestion is to challenge yourself to be a worthy rider (ok, a shade melodramatic ) But ultimately bikes are tools, so go ride it, practice clipping/ unclipping and appreciate it for the fine machine that it is.


----------



## RickJP

bluedevilbike said:


> Hi there.
> 
> I am new to cycling. I have been wanting to get started for a couple of years now.
> 
> It is a long story, but I recently picked up a Serotta Meivici. It is a couple of years old, but it fits me perfectly. I am trying to decide if I should keep it. It feels like too nice a bike for someone who can barely clip his petals in.
> 
> I am considering trying to sell it on ebay or craigslist and then buying more of a beginner bike.
> 
> What do you think?


As always, PJ gives you an objective, and true feedback. I, on the other hand, will be happy to trade you my Felt F85 for your Serotta. It's only 4 months old and has 800 miles on it. 

Does that tell you anything?

Happy New Year to all!


----------



## myjplp

Wow! That's a nice bike. I'm a beginner as well but I would love to ride as nice a bike as yours I recently bought a Felt Z5 and that's a really really nice bike compared to what I was looking to buy starting out

However, if you're too self conscious about riding this bike and that's making you reluctant to go out riding, then your decision to sell and get another bike that gets you out there riding might be a reasonable one. You can always get another Serotta when you feel like you're ready for it down the road.


----------



## Force951

I'm looking to start riding again since i used to be on my bike all the time when i was younger. I'm looking at a road bike since that's what i enjoyed most when i used to ride. That and i hated the last cruiser i used. Since it has been so long i don't want to invest 1k+ and have it just end up collecting dust in the corner. So i am looking at under $600. 

I took a quick look at my lbs since bikes are on sale and they had a few between $500 and $600. Mostly Fuji and Scattante.

I wasn't sure if that is good enough to keep, or if i should just find something on CL or cheap at walmart/target/costco to get my feet wet then put more money into something later in the year.


----------



## RickJP

Can you buy a car at Walmart/Target/Costco? Then, you shouldn't buy a bike there either. 

Fuji and Scattante are both good brands. Get as much as you want for as little as possible and be ready to compromise. Research what is best, what is completely entry level and what's median, and then decide what you must have and on what you can compromise. 

Research component. Research warranties. Research sizes and fit. Did I mention research?

Then post your decisions.

Good luck!


----------



## NJBiker72

Force951 said:


> I'm looking to start riding again since i used to be on my bike all the time when i was younger. I'm looking at a road bike since that's what i enjoyed most when i used to ride. That and i hated the last cruiser i used. Since it has been so long i don't want to invest 1k+ and have it just end up collecting dust in the corner. So i am looking at under $600.
> 
> I took a quick look at my lbs since bikes are on sale and they had a few between $500 and $600. Mostly Fuji and Scattante.
> 
> I wasn't sure if that is good enough to keep, or if i should just find something on CL or cheap at walmart/target/costco to get my feet wet then put more money into something later in the year.


Don't go Walmart. I did and upgraded within a year to an entry level and finally less than 2 years later to what I really wanted. Waste of money. But . . .

- I learned what I really wanted and did not want.
- I've got a winter bike and a bike for the trainer, so my good one does not get subjected to those things.


----------



## PJ352

Force951 said:


> I'm looking to start riding again since i used to be on my bike all the time when i was younger. I'm looking at a road bike since that's what i enjoyed most when i used to ride. That and i hated the last cruiser i used. Since it has been so long i don't want to invest 1k+ and have it just end up collecting dust in the corner. So i am looking at under $600.
> 
> I took a quick look at my lbs since bikes are on sale and they had a few between $500 and $600. Mostly Fuji and Scattante.
> 
> I wasn't sure if that is good enough to keep, or if i should just find something on CL or cheap at walmart/target/costco to get my feet wet then put more money into something later in the year.


If your LBS has bikes of interest in your price range I think buying from them is a far better option than dept. store bikes. The bikes are of better quality (thus, hold their value better if you do decide cycling isn't for you) and you'll get sizing/ fitting assistance along with the ability to test ride before buying. Many also offer post-purchase services like tune ups and tweaks to fit, along with warranty assistance, if needed. 

Since you mentioned Scattante, I'm assuming (at least) one of your shops is Performance, If so, depending on who's running the store and doing the fitting, their reputation seems spotty, but IMO it still beats the alternative, and they have a liberal return policy.

CL or used in general is chancy for those unfamiliar with bikes (and IMO many are over priced), so I'd advise you to bring someone along that knows bikes if you decide to go with that option.


----------



## RickJP

NJBiker72 said:


> Don't go Walmart. I did and upgraded within a year to an entry level and finally less than 2 years later to what I really wanted. Waste of money. But . . .
> 
> - I learned what I really wanted and did not want.
> - I've got a winter bike and a bike for the trainer, so my good one does not get subjected to those things.


I also went to Walmart. I returned the bike I bought there within 7 days. 15 days later, I bought my F85. I think next year I'll upgrade to either a Roubaix or an F3, or an AR5.


----------



## new2rd

Jeep,

Hope you made it back out and on the saddle. Your experience so far sounds like mine a couple years ago. I went into it not knowing if I would like Shimano or SRAM, but figured I would start on an aluminum. I test rode a bunch of bikes. We don't have many hills over here, but the roads can be a bit rough so my focus was on road feel. It was obvious from the start that I liked the SRAM double tap shifting over the Shimano Ultegra. I eventually test rode one of the mechanic's Roubaix which had Ultegra, but I was using it more to feel the road differece between the Aluminum and Carbon Fiber. I noticed a difference even though I didn't want to... I went it there feeling that a new rider wouldn't notice a substantial difference, but that went out the door after 30 feet. 
So, I ended up ordering a Roubaix Apex (the LBS at the time never even seen the Apex group, but I had no obligation to buy, so what the heck). 
My advice: Know what you are getting into. I have bad knee's and knew that road cycling was my only choice, but I still didn't know that I would get hooked. Because of that, I bought the model at the lower price point knowing that I could sway out the wheels and other parts, but the frame would still be good. Now it's two years later and I still love my bike and this past summer I did upgrade the wheels. For what it's worth. I've compared the shifting on Apex to Force and they feel the same to me. Apex is a good group and the shifting is very good.


----------



## Force951

PJ352 said:


> Since you mentioned Scattante, I'm assuming (at least) one of your shops is Performance, If so, depending on who's running the store and doing the fitting, their reputation seems spotty, but IMO it still beats the alternative, and they have a liberal return policy.
> 
> CL or used in general is chancy for those unfamiliar with bikes (and IMO many are over priced), so I'd advise you to bring someone along that knows bikes if you decide to go with that option.


The closest one is a Performance, but if that's the case i may see what else is in the area. There are 3-4 other options near work if i need to do that instead. My brother in law used to be a manager at a bike shop but its been about 10 years since he worked there. Also its hard to get him since he works graveyard shifts.


----------



## martywoodman

*consider bikesdirect*

I really like my Windsor Wellington 3.0 from bikesdirect.com. for under $400. I now have over 7,000 miles on it in 3 years. I've used it for club rides, centuries, light touring and commuting. A real good all-around entry level ride. Ya gotta know how to get the right size, however! good luck!


----------



## gaspi101

Agreed. Do NOT buy in Kmart, Costco, etc. buy only from an LBS or CL (if you have to). Get one from the LBS--you will find that a crappy bike feels like a crappy bike and may turn you off from riding altogether.


----------



## PJ352

Force951 said:


> The closest one is a Performance, but if that's the case i may see what else is in the area. There are 3-4 other options near work if i need to do that instead. My brother in law used to be a manager at a bike shop but its been about 10 years since he worked there. Also its hard to get him since he works graveyard shifts.


I don't think it would hurt to check out your local Performance shop - you might just have a good one. But check out the other LBS's as well, because the more you talk with folks and the more bikes you ride, the better educated you'll be to make a purchasing decision. I always say, test rides are free, fun and can be a learning experience, so take advantage of that option.

RE: buying online, I advise against it for the reason Marty mentions - ya gotta know how to get the right size. IME most noobs need an LBS's help with that and it's too important to get wrong. Also, your price range offers better options.


----------



## Raleigh Reliant

check your local craigslist!


----------



## mmntm

I'd like to piggy back on the last newbs question, being a newb meself. I've been lurking around a lot of these threads, and so have convinced myself that I'm fairly informed. I'm going to buy my first roadbike from a LBS, but that doesn't mean I didn't call around to all of them (I live in St Louis - there are a lot) to find out who had the best deals.

I'm doing the half iron man in August and want a bike that I can go the distance in. I'll be putting some serious mileage on it this summer (century rides, etc.) so I need a bike that will feel like a second home and not break down out in the boonies. I've narrowed it down to two bikes, based on price and other specs that seemed important:


2010 Specialized Allez Double ($450)



2011 Fuji Roubaix 3.0 ($650)


I REALLY want the FUJI, but I think that's in large part based off of how sleek it looks. The major hang up is this, at least for me: do I want to save a couple hundred and live with 2300's or spend 650 and have Soras. I know neither are anything special, but both prices are right where I want to be and feel I'm getting a good deal either way. 

Mind sharing some of that surplus of opions my way?


----------



## NJBiker72

mmntm said:


> I'd like to piggy back on the last newbs question, being a newb meself. I've been lurking around a lot of these threads, and so have convinced myself that I'm fairly informed. I'm going to buy my first roadbike from a LBS, but that doesn't mean I didn't call around to all of them (I live in St Louis - there are a lot) to find out who had the best deals.
> 
> I'm doing the half iron man in August and want a bike that I can go the distance in. I'll be putting some serious mileage on it this summer (century rides, etc.) so I need a bike that will feel like a second home and not break down out in the boonies. I've narrowed it down to two bikes, based on price and other specs that seemed important:
> 
> 
> 2010 Specialized Allez Double ($450)
> 
> 
> 
> 2011 Fuji Roubaix 3.0 ($650)
> 
> 
> I REALLY want the FUJI, but I think that's in large part based off of how sleek it looks. The major hang up is this, at least for me: do I want to save a couple hundred and live with 2300's or spend 650 and have Soras. I know neither are anything special, but both prices are right where I want to be and feel I'm getting a good deal either way.
> 
> Mind sharing some of that surplus of opions my way?



The Allez is an aluminum Tarmac. Nice frame. Can't believe it is that inexpensive.

Sora's are not good. Not sure how bad 2300's are but hate to think they would make that big of a difference.


----------



## mmntm

2300's are suppose to be a small step down from the Sora. The 2300 also has 8 gears instead of the Sora's 9. 

I was pretty well set on the FUJI until I called up the last shop and they had this bike for SO cheap. To be honest, it makes me a bit suspicious because everything else in their shop is a bit overpriced...


----------



## PJ352

mmntm said:


> 2300's are suppose to be a small step down from the Sora. The 2300 also has 8 gears instead of the Sora's 9.
> 
> I was pretty well set on the FUJI until I called up the last shop and they had this bike for SO cheap. To be honest, it makes me a bit suspicious because everything else in their shop is a bit overpriced...


You outline intended uses pretty well, but don't mentioned test rides. If you haven't yet visited the shops, been sized/ fitted and test ridden the bikes, that's the place to start. Researching is fine (and smart), but ultimately we _ride_ bikes, so IMO/E fit and feel are more important, long term. 

That said, a couple of things re: the specs. Depending on your fitness and terrain, the Allez being 8 speed and having a standard double crankset (53/39) may be at a slight disadvantage to the Fuji, which is equipped with a compact crankset (50/34) and 9 speed. Conversely, if you live (and plan on riding in) relatively flat terrain, these differences probably won't matter much.

Re: the differences between 2300 and Sora, save for the 8-9 speed difference, they're more alike than dissimilar. From a performance/ reliability standpoint, either are fine, but both employ a thumb tab used to shift to the inner ring up front and the next smaller cog at the rear. Ergonomically, it's difficult to operate this tab when riding in the drops, but being an entry level group and given the fact that most riders favored hand position is on the hoods, this isn't a deal breaker for most.


----------



## mmntm

Thanks PJ352, sounds pretty reasonable. You're right - I haven't test road either bikes, I plan on doing just that early next week. This week, St Louis got hit by a decent amount of ice and snow, so it wasn't really possible to go to the stores and take the bike for a spin outside...

I guess I also want a bike that will retain a decent amount of its value over time, in case I want to sell it and upgrade to a higher end bike in the next couple of years. From this standpoint, I think the FUJI is best. 

I'll probably do what you suggested and ride both bikes as objectively as I can, then go with the best fit for me. Thanks a lot for your input; this forum is really excellent about volunteering help!


----------



## PJ352

mmntm said:


> Thanks PJ352, sounds pretty reasonable. You're right - I haven't test road either bikes, I plan on doing just that early next week. This week, St Louis got hit by a decent amount of ice and snow, so it wasn't really possible to go to the stores and take the bike for a spin outside...
> 
> I guess I also want a bike that will retain a decent amount of its value over time, in case I want to sell it and upgrade to a higher end bike in the next couple of years. From this standpoint, I think the FUJI is best.
> 
> I'll probably do what you suggested and ride both bikes as objectively as I can, then go with the best fit for me. Thanks a lot for your input; this forum is really excellent about volunteering help!


Used bikes are a lot like used cars in that they don't hold their value too well. If you're reasonably sure you'll be upgrading to a more expensive bike in a couple of years, either stick to your current budget (minimizing your loss) or hedge your bet that you'll love road riding and consider going for that 'next' bike now.

A third option (and possibly the best) would be to go with a bike in your current price range, ride it for a couple of seasons, then upgrade, keeping your first as a trainer/ commuter/ rain bike.

Re: brands that hold their value, JMO but I wouldn't say that Fuji's hold their value _better_ than Specialized or any of the other top brands. 

Once your weather clears, consider branching out some and test riding more brands/ models. Test rides can be both fun and revealing (and they're free!), so avail yourself of that option.


----------



## Force951

I went around to some LBS in my area and eventually purchased a Giant Escape 2. For where i am right now i thought it was the best value and in a year or 2 i can get a road bike if i am still riding.


----------



## brokermac

I spent $650 on a used Specialized Alez with Ultegra gruppo. My friends said that was a good deal. Is it?


----------



## NJBiker72

brokermac said:


> I spent $650 on a used Specialized Alez with Ultegra gruppo. My friends said that was a good deal. Is it?


Assuming it is relatively recent and in good shape it is a fantastic deal. Ultra is not cheap and Allen are good bikes.


----------



## NJBiker72

cptcoolman said:


> is a trek madone 4.7 going too big for a beginner?


Depends on if you know what you want. If you do and can afford it, then no. You are better off buying what you want now rather than upgrading in a year.

On the other hand if after riding for a year you decide you want a racier/plusher/more Aero build then you will be out a good deal more than if you got an entry level bike.


----------



## jaewannabe

i'm a newbie who wants to get my first real road bike and am looking for some help. i'm a clyde, 6'4" 240ish, and am always breaking bikes and bike parts. i would like to say that my budget would allow myself to purchase a new bike but it won't so i'm looking at diving in with a used bike.

i don't ever plan on racing or doing any centuries but would like to have a decent bike for hill climbing and local group rides. my main purpose of a road bike is exercise, i'm getting too old to run, 1 hour rides during the week with maybe a longer one occasionally.


----------



## PJ352

jaewannabe said:


> i'm a newbie who wants to get my first real road bike and am looking for some help. i'm a clyde, 6'4" 240ish, and am always breaking bikes and bike parts. i would like to say that my budget would allow myself to purchase a new bike but it won't so i'm looking at diving in with a used bike.
> 
> i don't ever plan on racing or doing any centuries but would like to have a decent bike for hill climbing and local group rides. my main purpose of a road bike is exercise, i'm getting too old to run, 1 hour rides during the week with maybe a longer one occasionally.


If you're going to only do shorter, fitness rides (~20, maybe 30 miles, max) and you're restricted financially, a hybrid might be a cheaper and suitable option. 

OTOH if you see yourself stretching out the miles at some point, a drop bar bike (which allows for more hand positions) would be the better bet.

As far as where to buy, that depends on your region. If you're in an area where LBS's sell used, that's a good option because you'll get some sizing/ fit assistance and some level of support post-purchase. Otherwise, your local Craigslist (or similar) is worth a look.

What's your price range, accessories (helmet, etc.) included?

EDIT: At ~240 lbs., I'm not sure why you'd always be breaking bikes and parts, but focusing on sturdy wheelsets (32 spoke count minimum, 36 count preferable) is pretty much a requirement.


----------



## jaewannabe

PJ352 said:


> If you're going to only do shorter, fitness rides (~20, maybe 30 miles, max) and you're restricted financially, a hybrid might be a cheaper and suitable option.
> 
> OTOH if you see yourself stretching out the miles at some point, a drop bar bike (which allows for more hand positions) would be the better bet.
> 
> As far as where to buy, that depends on your region. If you're in an area where LBS's sell used, that's a good option because you'll get some sizing/ fit assistance and some level of support post-purchase. Otherwise, your local Craigslist (or similar) is worth a look.
> 
> What's your price range, accessories (helmet, etc.) included?
> 
> EDIT: At ~240 lbs., I'm not sure why you'd always be breaking bikes and parts, but focusing on sturdy wheelsets (32 spoke count minimum, 36 count preferable) is pretty much a requirement.


I'm looking at 500-750 to spend, closer to the 500 would be better. I ride with the owner of the LBS all the time, wish i could always support him but i can't afford a new bike right now. he will help me with the fit even if i don't buy from him. 

I should have been specific, I break parts on my mountain bike all the time because the combination of my weight and my riding style don't always mix good and i worry about entry level bikes not holding up, i'm hard on my off road wheels and never owning a real road bike i'm worried about how my weight will affect road bikes designed for 160 lb riders.


----------



## PJ352

jaewannabe said:


> I'm looking at 500-750 to spend, closer to the 500 would be better. I ride with the owner of the LBS all the time, wish i could always support him but i can't afford a new bike right now. he will help me with the fit even if i don't buy from him.
> 
> I should have been specific, I break parts on my mountain bike all the time because the combination of my weight and my riding style don't always mix good and i worry about entry level bikes not holding up, i'm hard on my off road wheels and never owning a real road bike i'm worried about how my weight will affect road bikes designed for 160 lb riders.


I'm surprised that there aren't any new LBS offerings at the upper end of your budget ($750), but that's somewhat dependent on your region and if there are any previous model year closeouts (in your size) available.

It's a big plus having your LBS owner as a resource. I suggest coercing him into assisting in the bike buying process, because it's important to get sizing right, or the fitting won't go well. Being a MTB'er, you might be somewhat familiar with the mechanical side of bikes, but (IMO) the fit of drop bar road bikes varies enough that he can help with that.

Points taken re: your track record on breaking MTB related parts, and riding style/ weight do matter, but even at the higher end of CF frames weight limits are in the 240 lb. range, and (ironically) the lower end framesets are generally _more_ durable, with no weight limits. With bike frames, more material usually translates into higher durability.

That given, I think as long as you stay away from light weight CF posts, bars and stems, your primary concern for road riding is (as I previously mentioned) the wheelsets. Again, your LBS buddy can assist. But the same holds true of wheelsets as frames. High bling/ low weight/ spoke count wheelsets are fine for lighter riders, but at 200+ you want to look for 32 (preferably 36) spoke count wheelsets with heavier rims, which are generally offered as OE on complete bikes.


----------



## jaewannabe

PJ352 said:


> I'm surprised that there aren't any new LBS offerings at the upper end of your budget ($750), but that's somewhat dependent on your region and if there are any previous model year closeouts (in your size) available.
> 
> It's a big plus having your LBS owner as a resource. I suggest coercing him into assisting in the bike buying process, because it's important to get sizing right, or the fitting won't go well. Being a MTB'er, you might be somewhat familiar with the mechanical side of bikes, but (IMO) the fit of drop bar road bikes varies enough that he can help with that.
> 
> Points taken re: your track record on breaking MTB related parts, and riding style/ weight do matter, but even at the higher end of CF frames weight limits are in the 240 lb. range, and (ironically) the lower end framesets are generally _more_ durable, with no weight limits. With bike frames, more material usually translates into higher durability.
> 
> That given, I think as long as you stay away from light weight CF posts, bars and stems, your primary concern for road riding is (as I previously mentioned) the wheelsets. Again, your LBS buddy can assist. But the same holds true of wheelsets as frames. High bling/ low weight/ spoke count wheelsets are fine for lighter riders, but at 200+ you want to look for 32 (preferably 36) spoke count wheelsets with heavier rims, which are generally offered as OE on complete bikes.


there are some close outs available now but finding one in an xl size is the challenge. i will gleam some info from LBS and see what he tells me to do. i test rode a bike that besides the carbon fork had carbon seat stays, should i stay away from those?


----------



## PJ352

jaewannabe said:


> there are some close outs available now but finding one in an xl size is the challenge. i will gleam some info from LBS and see what he tells me to do. i test rode a bike that besides the carbon fork had carbon seat stays, should i stay away from those?


Nothing wrong with a CF fork, but (all things considered) I'd stay with a straight aluminum or steel frame. Mixed materials frames like the one you mentioned are bonded at the CF/ alu joints, so with no warranty and (IMO) no real benefit, it's not worth the risk.

And yes, sizing is tough for short as well as tall riders. Just a guess and very generally speaking, you'll be around the ~61cm frame size, depending on proportions.


----------



## radagascar

Wish I would have read some of this before making my first purchase. I did some homework before I bought the bike off of Ebay. Hopefully I got a good deal >.<


----------



## SolitaryRider

jaewannabe said:


> i'm a newbie who wants to get my first real road bike and am looking for some help. i'm a clyde, 6'4" 240ish, and am always breaking bikes and bike parts. i would like to say that my budget would allow myself to purchase a new bike but it won't so i'm looking at diving in with a used bike.
> 
> i don't ever plan on racing or doing any centuries but would like to have a decent bike for hill climbing and local group rides. my main purpose of a road bike is exercise, i'm getting too old to run, 1 hour rides during the week with maybe a longer one occasionally.


Have you considered getting a mail-order bike from Bikesdirect.com? On your budget, you can get quite a nice bike there. CL is iffy at best- depending on where you live. Some people get great deals...but unless you live in a very big city, the chances of fidning a good bike at a reasonable price and IN YOUR SIZE, are like finding a needle in a haystack.

With Bikesdirect, if you are willing to do a little leg-work (using an on-line fitment calculator and taking measurements- and reading the BD sizing charts), and can do minimal assembly/adjustment of the bike...you'll get a great deal.

I was in the same position you are in- a clyde, looking for an entry level bike to get my feet wet, and the local CL sucks, as I live in a rural area with few cyclists- I bought a $300 bike from BD- all aluminum- 25 lbs.( Road Bikes, Roadbikes - Mercier Galaxy AL ) -and I couldn't be happier with it. It's pretty much identical to a $700 Fuji. The bike is holding up great for me (currently down to 208 lbs- but was 220 when I started) on these rural roads....including some use on chip-seal/gravel/dirt....and once i assembled it and adjusted it when I first got it, I haven't had to touch it since. IMO, BD offers the best value for one's money...and is the only option for getting a decent NEW bike cheaply. 

[I am not connected with BD in any way...just a very satisfied customer- and next year when I am ready for a "good bike", I will be buying it from them (Got my eye on a couple of Motobecane LeChampions and Centuries already!)]


----------



## bgmiller

Getting ready buy my first road bike, have been looking at the DB Podium 3. What do you guys think about this bike?


----------



## PJ352

bgmiller said:


> Getting ready buy my first road bike, have been looking at the DB Podium 3. What do you guys think about this bike?


Never rode one, but the specs on the Podium are very good, especially for a first time buyer. Save for the brakes and crankset, full Shimano 105. 

Beyond the specs, make sure the bike fits and rides/ handles the way you like. The geometry is pretty consistent with race bikes, so being a first bike you'll have an acclimation period to become accustomed to the road riding position and the way the bike handles, but sizing and fit still come first.

On that topic, you don't say where you'd be purchasing from, but I recommend first being sized at a reputable LBS, even if you plan on purchasing elsewhere. There may be a nominal fee, but this method betters the odds of getting sizing right, because IME those charts and calculators do more to mislead and confuse than assist. Speaking of which, according to the DB sizing chart, I'd ride a M (54) and that's not correct, so proceed with caution...


----------



## bgmiller

Budget isnt a huge issue but i am currently stationed in Japan so a LBS fitting isnt going to be the easiest thing to find out here. I am going to a different base this weekend that has lots of road bikes for sale so i can test someout. PJ i am about 5' 11" with a 32 inseam if that would help with sizing.


----------



## bgmiller

Budget isnt a huge issue but i am currently stationed in Japan so a LBS fitting isnt going to be the easiest thing to find out here. I am going to a different base this weekend that has lots of road bikes for sale so i can test someout. PJ i am about 5' 11" with a 32 inseam if that would help with sizing.


----------



## NJBiker72

bgmiller said:


> Budget isnt a huge issue but i am currently stationed in Japan so a LBS fitting isnt going to be the easiest thing to find out here. I am going to a different base this weekend that has lots of road bikes for sale so i can test someout. PJ i am about 5' 11" with a 32 inseam if that would help with sizing.


A lot of it is also torso and arms. Not just legs but you have to be comfortable leaning over the handlebars.


----------



## PJ352

bgmiller said:


> Budget isnt a huge issue but i am currently stationed in Japan so a LBS fitting isnt going to be the easiest thing to find out here. I am going to a different base this weekend that has lots of road bikes for sale so i can test someout. PJ i am about 5' 11" with a 32 inseam if that would help with sizing.


As NJBiker mentioned, proportions, fitness and flexibility (among other factors) matter in sizing. I've seen riders your height riding 52cm's thru ~56's, so I think your best bet is to wait till you get to that base and test ride some bikes. 

If you're settled on the DB Podium, once you find that test bike that you're comfortable with, note the year, make, model and frame size, then compare its geometry to the Podiums. The closer the numbers, the closer fit will be to that of the test bike. At that point, if you have any questions/ concerns, either update this thread or start a new one and we can assist.

Just as a FYI, not to confuse, but be aware that you can't just compare different brands/ models using frame size alone. In some brands/ models I'd go with a 47, in others a 54, so (as stated) once a baseline is established, let the geo numbers be your guide.

HTH's and stay safe, wherever you are... :thumbsup:


----------



## SolitaryRider

Here is a good bike size calculator, BGMiller:

Fit Calculator - Competitive Cyclist

This one is very thorough, and is probably more thorough than half the LBS's out there (A lot of LBS's only give a very nominal fitting...or just plain don't know what they're doing)


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> Here is a good bike size calculator, BGMiller:
> 
> Fit Calculator - Competitive Cyclist
> 
> This one is very thorough, and is probably more thorough than half the LBS's out there (A lot of LBS's only give a very nominal fitting...or just plain don't know what they're doing)


LBS's (or any other business, for that matter) that don't know what they're doing aren't reputable and shouldn't be patronized. But fact is, many shops offer a standard fitting with bike purchases, and that suffices for most people just getting into road riding.

IMO, the problem with online calculators is that they only 'know' the values inputted. And even when that's done correctly, the _best_ they'll do is offer a _range_ of fit parameters that generally fall within two frame sizes, serving to confuse rather than pin down sizing requirements, leaving the buyer to (still) guess at a frame size.

Conversely, a knowledgeable fitter working one on one with a cyclist, discussing their cycling background, fitness, flexibility, anatomical issues (if any) and (once sized) seeing them positioned on a bike before and after test rides (tweaking fit as needed) IME is a far superior method. 

While I'm sure being stationed in Japan poses some unique challenges, since the Japanese ride bikes and have bike shops, the option to be fit should be available, and that would be my suggested method.


----------



## SolitaryRider

PJ352 said:


> IMO, the problem with online calculators is that they only 'know' the values inputted. And even when that's done correctly, the _best_ they'll do is offer a _range_ of fit parameters that generally fall within two frame sizes, serving to confuse rather than pin down sizing requirements, leaving the buyer to (still) guess at a frame size.


That is very true- especially if you happen to be right on the cusp between two sizes. In my case, between the calculator's recommendation and the sizing chart on the website I bought from both pretty much putting me at the same size, I figured I stood a good chance of getting a good fit- and I did indeed get a bike that fits like a glove- but I was cognizant of the fact that that might not have been the case- and was prepared to possibly have to return or sell the first bike. 

I'd say between that calculator and the seller's/manufacturer's sizing chart, one stands a pretty good chance of getting a correct fit, with a little care- and I'd say, if uncertain or right on the cusp between two sizes, go with the smaller one- and I'd imagine in 95% of the cases, it'll work out just fine. Agree?


----------



## bgmiller

Thanks for all the advise spoke with one of the guys I work with, his wife is Japanese he said she would go with me to a bike shop to get a fitting done. Not dead set on the Podium I have ridden the DB MTB for a long time and really liked them. The base I am going to this weekend have Cannondale, and from what I hear some Felt bikes so I am going to look at those also.


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> I'd say between that calculator and the seller's/manufacturer's sizing chart, one stands a pretty good chance of getting a correct fit, with a little care- and I'd say, if uncertain or right on the cusp between two sizes, go with the smaller one- and I'd imagine in 95% of the cases, it'll work out just fine. *Agree?*


I really can't agree with you on that. Because 1) I seldom see two frame sizes working equally well for a rider, due to differences in reach and bar drop, 2) by providing the user with a _range_ of sizes, I see an inherent 'flaw' in those calculators, so I can't see where using them as a 'baseline' (more accurately a _vague_ baseline, given the ranges offered) together with what I see as an inaccurate sizing chart will result in a buyer making a reliable sizing decision.

I'll agree that they may get lucky, but (as you say) it's best to be prepared to either return the bike for another size (up or down, depending on fit) or resell. The really sad scenario is when a well intentioned noob gives up on the sport because it hurts to ride, so IMO anything that betters the odds of getting sizing and fit right is worthwhile.


----------



## PJ352

bgmiller said:


> Thanks for all the advise spoke with one of the guys I work with, his wife is Japanese he said she would go with me to a bike shop to get a fitting done. Not dead set on the Podium I have ridden the DB MTB for a long time and really liked them. The base I am going to this weekend have Cannondale, and from what I hear some Felt bikes so I am going to look at those also.


That's a good plan. C'dale and Felt are both top name brands, but DB has a good rep as well.

When you're test riding the bikes, keep in mind that pinning down sizing requirements comes_ before_ fit, so the better the bike feels 'out of the box' (as we say) the better the fitting will go. Hopefully there will be company reps (or similar) available to assist.

And if you decide on the DB, you can still revert back to my post comparing the geo of a well fitting test bike with the DB's.


----------



## tazzmacd

Hi I am just starting my research for a new bike, first road bike in a very long time. Been riding an old Mountain bike but it is not as comforable to ride on the road nor as pleasent so I don't ride it. So my budget is about 1500-2000 cdn. At this time most of my riding will be to first get back into shape. I have lost 35 lbs so far but need to loose another 20-30 more lbs before I am happen. Eventually I want to start doing longer rides working my way up to some century rides.

The I have checked out the bikes at the local LBS to see what is available, one sells Giants only, they have either the Defy Composite or the TCR Composite in my price range right now, they have some specials on. The other store sells Specialized, Cannondale or Trek. If the weather allows I hope to take a couple out for a test ride in the coming weeks. My question is for endurance riding and to get into shape what models should I look at? I have been doing some research but want to get opinions on what bikes to look at to narrow down my options some.


----------



## PJ352

tazzmacd said:


> Hi I am just starting my research for a new bike, first road bike in a very long time. Been riding an old Mountain bike but it is not as comforable to ride on the road nor as pleasent so I don't ride it. So my budget is about 1500-2000 cdn. At this time most of my riding will be to first get back into shape. I have lost 35 lbs so far but need to loose another 20-30 more lbs before I am happen. Eventually I want to start doing longer rides working my way up to some century rides.
> 
> The I have checked out the bikes at the local LBS to see what is available, one sells Giants only, they have either the Defy Composite or the TCR Composite in my price range right now, they have some specials on. The other store sells Specialized, Cannondale or Trek. If the weather allows I hope to take a couple out for a test ride in the coming weeks. My question is for endurance riding and to get into shape what models should I look at? I have been doing some research but want to get opinions on what bikes to look at to narrow down my options some.


Since you mentioned both the Giant Defy and TCR, along with longer term goals of endurance rides, I suggest considering both relaxed and race models in the brands available to you.

Generally speaking, race geo bikes have a shorter wheelbase for quicker handling/ steering and shorter head tubes, allowing for a more aggressive rider position. Conversely, relaxed geo bikes have slightly longer wheelbases for more predictable handling and taller head tubes for a more upright riding position. In real world riding conditions the differences are fairly subtle, but I suggest test riding both, then deciding which you prefer.

Being in the US, I'm not all that familiar with pricing up your way, so I'll suggest some models in the brands you list that should be close to your price range. I've categorized them (race/ relaxed), but not by groupset. Both SRAM and Shimano have their fans, so (as I summarize below), test ride and decide which you prefer. 

In no particular order:
Trek 2.1 - with taller head tubes and higher trail, I'd say this bike leans towards relaxed, but has a shorter wheelbase which splits the difference.

Specialized Secteur - Modeled after their Roubaix, this is a relaxed geo bike.

Specialized Allez - Modeled after their Tarmac, this is a race geo bike.

Giant TCR - Similar to the Trek, it has a somewhat taller head tube, but IMO leans towards race.

Giant Defy - Relaxed geo. 

Cannondale CAAD 8 - Except for the slightly taller head tube, has race geo.

Cannondale Synapse - Geo close to that of the Specialized Roubaix/ Secteur, a relaxed geo bike.

IMO the best way to whittle your choices is to visit the LBS's, get sized/ fitted and head out on the roads for test rides. Focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, SRAM /Shimano control placement/ operation and decide from there. It helps to ask the LBS's to check tire pressures and (as near as possible) equalize them so that differences don't influence your decision.

Lastly, discuss you fitness goals and the terrain you'll be riding with the LBS's. Most bikes in this category come equipped with compact (50/34) cranksets, but some also offer triples - and rear gearing varies as well. Given that you're looking to do longer rides (and even if you weren't), you'll want gearing tailored to your needs.


----------



## tazzmacd

Thanks for the reply, that is exactly what I was hoping for. Gives me an idea on where to start and what to look at. 

Now the fun begins, really looking forward to getting back into it. I told my wife I will no wbe one of the guys on the road to our house that she curses at. Her reply, I won't run you off the road, at least I will try.....Love ya Honey. 

At least she will try .


----------



## jman0000

*ha*



MB1 said:


> OTOH I have worked in all parts of the industry for more than 30 years (just 1 day a week now  ).
> 
> Old joke; "Tony, do you know how to make a small fortune in the bike business?"
> 
> "Sure Mark, start with a large fortune."
> 
> 
> Truth hurts.


LOL, I can tell you and I would get along if you were my mechanic :thumbsup:


----------



## caspian

*Looking to Switch from Running to Biking- Ideas?*

I've biked recreationally, but since I got a stress fracture running, I've been think about toning down my running and beginning to bike more, and I am looking to my first road bike. My biker friends insist that Treks are way over priced, but I've ridden a friends 1.2 and liked it a lot. What do you guys think about the Trek 1.2 vs the Scott Speedster s50 and the Cannondale Synapse Sora as far as good beginner bikes? Any ideas? Thanks


----------



## PJ352

caspian said:


> I've biked recreationally, but since I got a stress fracture running, I've been think about toning down my running and beginning to bike more, and I am looking to my first road bike. My biker friends insist that Treks are way over priced, but I've ridden a friends 1.2 and liked it a lot. What do you guys think about the Trek 1.2 vs the Scott Speedster s50 and the Cannondale Synapse Sora as far as good beginner bikes? Any ideas? Thanks


At the upper end of their range, I'm not a huge Trek fan, but in your price range I think the 1 and 2 series bikes are fine choices.

That said, a bike has to meet two requirements; one being that it'll suite your intended purposes, the other - suiting your anatomy (as in, fit). My standard advice; visit some shops, get sized./ fitted to the bikes of interest and head out (on the roads and for some duration) for some test rides. Focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, along with control placement and function. Beforehand, based on tire size, road conditions and total rider weight, ask the shop to check tire pressures. To some extent, this will equalize the differences in ride qualities of the bikes. 

Just as a FYI, during test rides, IMO/E it's best to focus more on the fit, ride and handling aspects, because if a bike shifts less than optimally off the shops floor, it's likely a small/ minor adjustment, so don't walk away from a perfectly fine bike on that basis alone.

Re: the geo of the bikes, the Trek and Scott are more similar than different, with the Scott leaning slightly more towards race geo, but the differences are minor. The C'dale falls into the relaxed geo category, which means the bike will handle slightly slower (some call it predictable) and the taller head tube puts the rider in a slightly more upright position compared to the Trek or Scott. If I had to further categorize them, I'd say the Scott is the most aggressive, the Trek follows and the Synapse is the relaxed choice. So, ride and decide which you prefer, keeping in mind that adjustments to stem/ spacers can (to a point) alter saddle to bar drop.

Re: the specs, the C'dale and Trek are similar in that they basically offer Sora's 9 speed drive train. The C'dale offers a triple crankset while the Trek uses a compact. The Scott uses Shimano's 2300 drive train which is a step below Sora and 8 speed. Like the C'dale, that bike is spec'd with a triple.

Best thing to do re: gearing is to discuss your fitness and the terrain you'll be riding with your LBS. You said you've dome some recreational riding, so those experiences might help you decide which option might work best for you.

FWIW, there are some other makes/ models that might be worth a look. If you're interested, post other offerings at your LBS's and we'll advise further.


----------



## Randonneur*

I would suggest an old steel bike. I purchased my first complete vintage bike on ebay and love it. I bought on 84 trek 520. These older bikes are solid and usually have room for fenders, eyelets for racks and they're so much more stylish than a new bike


----------



## broxxor

I'm kind of in this same boat. Hopefully I'll be able to make a decent decision - although I'm on a killer budget...


----------



## alien4fish

wow really great advice here


----------



## alien4fish

Hi Everyone, This is a GREAT thread I am a mountain biker (Giant Yukon hard tail) from MBTR.com and have been doing more street riding than trail as of late and I want to purchase a road bike So I told my self I would take 2 weeks researching, riding asking questions, visiting as many LBS's as possible. And snooping Here LOL
I have been doing my due dillegence in researching my 1st New entry level road bike(under 1000 bucks) and have been to all the local shops here in San Diego(Escondido) and it really does seem to be comparing apples and apples.......
so, I need a little help
1. Giant Defy 5 2012 al frame, Al fork, shimano Sora derailer 699.00 but I can it for 650.00
test rode it felt good, good accel but a bit on the heavy side.
2. the Fuji 3.0 2011 roubiex al frame, Carbon fork, Shimano Sora 599.00( I think it was) rode it felt good too very responsive smooth shifting very comfortable. 949 was the origanl price bTW 
3.Specialized Sectuer 2011 al frame, carbon fork Shimano tiagra 847.00 rode it very comfortable smooth shifting but a few hundy more to the price.
So i guess out of these three.......Im leaning twards the Specialized Sectuer but its out of my self imposed budget
BUT I liked the Fuji smooth shifting, comfortable and the price point was nice too 
Is the Specialized that much better of a bike than Fuji?
And also I was thinking would it be better to get the Specialized Allez 2200 2300Shimano which really bottom of the barrel from what I understand. if thats what most people end up getting anyway?
Sorry for such a long post. Thanks K


----------



## kson

A great source of info for newbie like me.


----------



## PJ352

alien4fish said:


> Hi Everyone, This is a GREAT thread I am a mountain biker (Giant Yukon hard tail) from MBTR.com and have been doing more street riding than trail as of late and I want to purchase a road bike So I told my self I would take 2 weeks researching, riding asking questions, visiting as many LBS's as possible. And snooping Here LOL
> I have been doing my due dillegence in researching my 1st New entry level road bike(under 1000 bucks) and have been to all the local shops here in San Diego(Escondido) and it really does seem to be comparing apples and apples.......
> so, I need a little help
> 1. Giant Defy 5 2012 al frame, Al fork, shimano Sora derailer 699.00 but I can it for 650.00
> test rode it felt good, good accel but a bit on the heavy side.
> 2. the Fuji 3.0 2011 roubiex al frame, Carbon fork, Shimano Sora 599.00( I think it was) rode it felt good too very responsive smooth shifting very comfortable. 949 was the origanl price bTW
> 3.Specialized Sectuer 2011 al frame, carbon fork Shimano tiagra 847.00 rode it very comfortable smooth shifting but a few hundy more to the price.
> So i guess out of these three.......Im leaning twards the Specialized Sectuer but its out of my self imposed budget
> BUT I liked the Fuji smooth shifting, comfortable and the price point was nice too
> Is the Specialized that much better of a bike than Fuji?
> And also I was thinking would it be better to get the Specialized Allez 2200 2300Shimano which really bottom of the barrel from what I understand. if thats what most people end up getting anyway?
> Sorry for such a long post. Thanks K


Since you're working with LBS's and getting sizing/ fitting assistance, then test riding the bikes, I'll sidestep the all important "fit matters most" segment and give you a quick dissertation on 2300/ Sora/ Tiagra groups. 2300 is 8 speed and uses a thumb tab to shift to the smaller rear cog and front chainring. 

Ergonomically, operating the tab is only a problem when riding in the drops, which many noobs and experienced riders alike _don't_ do, preferring the hoods and tops. Sora retains the thumb tab and adds a rear cog for 9 speed. Tiagra (also 9 speed for 2011) adds an inner lever (in place of the thumb tab) for easier shifting when in the drops. 

Since this is your first bike and you liked one of the models in your price range, I suggest staying in your budget. This will give you time to develop your riding skills, decide what you prefer in a road bike and plan for the future. And despite what many will tell you, 'buying up' now isn't going to prevent you from wanting to upgrade at some point. If you stick with road riding, you'll want to do that anyway, so start saving your pennies now. 

HTH...


----------



## alien4fish

Excellent point and thank you for the response. With that being said and given the time to actually sit and give some thought to NEEDS vs Wants the Fuji is comming out on top. And dont get me wrong I think that Specialized is fine bike but when it comes right down to it you are buying the same comps group on diff. frames and you are paying for the name and frame. I would preffer to to buy something and then have the extra money to go twards a Cateye wireless and an LED head lamp.
Also i am keeping a sharp eye out on Criagslist too but i have not yet been able to find "my diamond" it seems like every bike on there is either to big or to small  im a 54 med..... so if any one here is looking to sell one pm me


----------



## cyclintruckin

alien4fish said:


> Excellent point and thank you for the response. With that being said and given the time to actually sit and give some thought to NEEDS vs Wants the Fuji is comming out on top. And dont get me wrong I think that Specialized is fine bike but when it comes right down to it you are buying the same comps group on diff. frames and you are paying for the name and frame. I would preffer to to buy something and then have the extra money to go twards a Cateye wireless and an LED head lamp.
> Also i am keeping a sharp eye out on Criagslist too but i have not yet been able to find "my diamond" it seems like every bike on there is either to big or to small  im a 54 med..... so if any one here is looking to sell one pm me


Funny how the world works, I am 6'3" and all I see for sale used are mediums. As far as first bike advice while I am a newbie and over 40 now. grrrr lol. I have gone the hybrid route and have upgraded the Scott commuter with a few goodies to make my road bike transistion easier I hope. I do get funny looks riding it with full road gear on.  Idk if what I am doing is a good idea or not, I will let ya know when I save enough money for a real roady.


----------



## pittpanthers

Hello all,
I've been lurking for about a month now (loving this thread) and I am brand new to road biking other than that. I would like to set a budget at around $600 to $700 but that seems to be pretty hard to do if I want to get state of art (or close to it) options. I have been to a couple of LBS and there I have test ridden a tarmac (in place of the allez, because they didnt have my size and wanted me to feel the geo) and a caad 10. Both of these bikes had 105. I realize both of those are out of my price range but every LBS around my area seems only to have higher end bikes.

I am 5'11", 175lbs pretty in shape and am mainly looking for a bike to supplement my normal workouts (gym, run, hiking, basketball, etc). I don't really have a need for the lightest components or frames as I just want a change-up to my normal routine. Also, I live in Arizona, thus not many hills for me so number of gears isn't a big deal to me as well.

First, I couldn't really tell any difference between the two bikes I tested. I am wondering at what point I will even begin to feel a difference between bikes (regarding geo) if at all, during this initial buy process. If that's the case, why shouldn't I save almost $600-700 and get a bike with similar parts online (bikesdirect/jensonusa), then have the LBS build/fit me to that bike. Furthermore, how do I go about comparing these online bikes to the bikes I test in regard to geo? More specifically, which measurements are the "go to's" when comparing bike geo to bike geo? 

Second, I realize that whatever bike I get I will probably have for a long time, but it seems like even if I splurge and get something in the $1500 range, I will probably want to upgrade regardless if I get into the sport even more. Thus, would it be better for me to just stick with sora/tiagra on model in my range? I could even get something in the $300-400 range online for these types of components? 

It seems as though every shop I have been in they keep pushing me away from sora/tiagra and say that I'm way better off getting 105 or comparable sram on a bike. 

I apologize if that is rambling, but I think that about sums up what I need help with. If you need any more details let me know. And thank you in advance for the advice.


----------



## NJBiker72

I'm torn. I went real cheap first time and replaced it quickly with a real road bike but even then as my cycling developed I realized I wanted something more. So maybe going better initially would have saved me or cost me money. 

Not sure but now I have a winter bike and a trainer bike.


----------



## PJ352

pittpanthers said:


> Hello all,
> I've been lurking for about a month now (loving this thread) and I am brand new to road biking other than that. I would like to set a budget at around $600 to $700 but that seems to be pretty hard to do if I want to get state of art (or close to it) options. I have been to a couple of LBS and there I have test ridden a tarmac (in place of the allez, because they didnt have my size and wanted me to feel the geo) and a caad 10. Both of these bikes had 105. I realize both of those are out of my price range but every LBS around my area seems only to have higher end bikes.
> 
> I am 5'11", 175lbs pretty in shape and am mainly looking for a bike to supplement my normal workouts (gym, run, hiking, basketball, etc). I don't really have a need for the lightest components or frames as I just want a change-up to my normal routine. Also, I live in Arizona, thus not many hills for me so number of gears isn't a big deal to me as well.
> 
> First, I couldn't really tell any difference between the two bikes I tested. I am wondering at what point I will even begin to feel a difference between bikes (regarding geo) if at all, during this initial buy process. If that's the case, why shouldn't I save almost $600-700 and get a bike with similar parts online (bikesdirect/jensonusa), then have the LBS build/fit me to that bike. Furthermore, how do I go about comparing these online bikes to the bikes I test in regard to geo? More specifically, which measurements are the "go to's" when comparing bike geo to bike geo?
> 
> Second, I realize that whatever bike I get I will probably have for a long time, but it seems like even if I splurge and get something in the $1500 range, I will probably want to upgrade regardless if I get into the sport even more. Thus, would it be better for me to just stick with sora/tiagra on model in my range? I could even get something in the $300-400 range online for these types of components?
> 
> It seems as though every shop I have been in they keep pushing me away from sora/tiagra and say that I'm way better off getting 105 or comparable sram on a bike.
> 
> I apologize if that is rambling, but I think that about sums up what I need help with. If you need any more details let me know. And thank you in advance for the advice.


First off, I think you'd be better served getting a first bike from your LBS. There, you'll get sized/ fitted, be able to test ride bikes of interest and avail yourself of post purchase services like tune ups, tweaks to fit, group rides, discounts on accessories... so they'll be a valuable resource to you. 

Remember too, that many of the services mentioned are going to cost you if you buy online, then bring the bike in a box to your LBS for final assembly, tuning and fit. Also, one potential pitfall to buying online is guessing wrong on sizing. Then the only options are to either make due with a less than optimal fitting bike (because you can't get a good fit on an ill sized bike), or return it (paying shipping) and reorder. 

Re: your intended uses/ budget, I disagree with your LBS's on avoiding Sora or Tiagra and opting for 105. For recreational riders, either Sora or Tiagra is fine. Once set up/ adjusted correctly, both function well and are durable. The main disadvantage with Sora is that it employs a thumb tab to shift to smaller rings/ cogs and it's difficult to operate while riding in the drops. Many noobs and experienced riders alike don't do much riding in the drops, so it's a non-issue for many. Something to consider...

To answer your fit related questions, the main geo numbers to be concerned with are effective top tube and head tube length. Assuming moderate stem length/ angle setups, these numbers will dictate a riders reach and saddle to bar drop. If you decide to go the online route, you'd need to find out the frame size of either the Tarmac or CAAD that you rode (whichever fit better, if any) comparing that geo to online bike geo charts. The closer the numbers, the closer fit will be to those test bikes. 

This method should give you some assurance that you'll get sizing right, but you still should consider the hidden costs of going this route. When you add the aforementioned costs to the online purchase price I think you'll find that the gap in savings narrows between online and your LBS. 

HTH...


----------



## mediocrerevolution

*Is this bike a good deal?*

I know some money will need to be spent fixing it up, but I'm looking to get into road biking but do not have a lot spend and am in no need of fancy composite frames. I know road biking on a budget you typically need to find an older bike. Just curious if $200 sounds about right for such a bike.

here is the posting:

I have a 1983 vintage Schwinn Varsity. I think it is a 54 cm frame, meant for people maybe 5'6 plus or minus. It is mostly stock, with a few things updated. The frame is not its original color, and was painted green. The rear rim is more recent and has been painted red. The seat is also new and very nice, I would have kept it but it doesn't fit my new bike! Selling because I bought a newer better bike. It is a 10-speed, with downtube shifter that work nicely. It is a Shimano 600 SIS, with indexed shifting (clicks into place for each gear). The rear tire is flat, but I know where you get a used tire and get it installed for very cheap.


----------



## NJBiker72

mediocrerevolution said:


> I know some money will need to be spent fixing it up, but I'm looking to get into road biking but do not have a lot spend and am in no need of fancy composite frames. I know road biking on a budget you typically need to find an older bike. Just curious if $200 sounds about right for such a bike.
> 
> here is the posting:
> 
> I have a 1983 vintage Schwinn Varsity. I think it is a 54 cm frame, meant for people maybe 5'6 plus or minus. It is mostly stock, with a few things updated. The frame is not its original color, and was painted green. The rear rim is more recent and has been painted red. The seat is also new and very nice, I would have kept it but it doesn't fit my new bike! Selling because I bought a newer better bike. It is a 10-speed, with downtube shifter that work nicely. It is a Shimano 600 SIS, with indexed shifting (clicks into place for each gear). The rear tire is flat, but I know where you get a used tire and get it installed for very cheap.


Not sure that is such a good idea. 

Main thing I would hesitate is with downtube shifters. It think you would quickly want to upgrade that. 
If 200 is your max you May need to settle for that but i bet there is something a little newer.


----------



## PJ352

mediocrerevolution said:


> I know some money will need to be spent fixing it up, but I'm looking to get into road biking but do not have a lot spend and am in no need of fancy composite frames. I know road biking on a budget you typically need to find an older bike. Just curious if $200 sounds about right for such a bike.
> 
> here is the posting:
> 
> I have a 1983 vintage Schwinn Varsity. I think it is a 54 cm frame, meant for people maybe 5'6 plus or minus. It is mostly stock, with a few things updated. The frame is not its original color, and was painted green. The rear rim is more recent and has been painted red. The seat is also new and very nice, I would have kept it but it doesn't fit my new bike! Selling because I bought a newer better bike. It is a 10-speed, with downtube shifter that work nicely. It is a Shimano 600 SIS, with indexed shifting (clicks into place for each gear). The rear tire is flat, but I know where you get a used tire and get it installed for very cheap.


I don't hold Schwinn's of that vintage in high regard, so my opinions may be biased, but I wouldn't give them $200 for the bike. IMO the best part of it are the 600 components, but given its age it's basically a ride 'as is' bike, because (except for the tire repair) upgrade costs could exceed the bikes worth. 

As a fair price,_ if it's in good overall condition_ I'd probably go ~$75 - $100 (tops).

BTW, generally speaking and depending on proportions/ flexibility, a rider ~5' 7" would ride a 51-52cm bike, so you may want to consider that.


----------



## zachg1017

*Compact vs Double crankset*

Im wanting to get into road and Im getting ready to order my bike and im being told i should get a compact over a double....anyone know the pros and cons of these and why I should get compact?


----------



## NJBiker72

zachg1017 said:


> Im wanting to get into road and Im getting ready to order my bike and im being told i should get a compact over a double....anyone know the pros and cons of these and why I should get compact?


Compacts make climbing easier. But they will not be quite as fast on flats and downhills. 

Depends on your conditioning and the terrain where you live. 

I am a good climber but i prefer the compact.


----------



## SolitaryRider

I really don't understand why triples can't have a wider gear range. 24 speeds....and lowest gear isn't low enough (Hard getting up the steeper hills) and high gear...well, I run out of gear before I run out of power.......

There's no reason for this......the gears are spaced too closely- Unless I am climbing a hill, I generally leave the rear in a middle gear, and basically just shift the front as needed- I don't need micro-spaqced gears- I need a broader range, with a higher high and lower low.

I'd be willing to bet, if I did the math, that a lot of the gears on my bike are redundant.

That's the first thing I want when I get a better bike- broader gear range. (Second thing is better shifters. These Shimano STI 2300's with their 90-degree swing to shift, are ridiculous!)


----------



## new2rd

A compact is a double, but the compact double 50x34 helps with climbing, but you can run out of gears if u plan on racing. Look up Sheldon Browns gear calculator to get an idea. 
Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Gear Calculator
As an example, the difference at 100 RPMs between a 52x11 and 50x12 is 4.4 mph. Since I don't plan on pedaling much in the mid to high 30 MPH range I'm happy running a compact crankset (50x34) with a 12-26 cassette. There's more gears in the middle range that I like to use. 
Summed up, the main advantage of compact is to get up steeper hills without mashing, but the small disadvantage is top speed.


----------



## alien4fish

cyclintruckin said:


> Funny how the world works, I am 6'3" and all I see for sale used are mediums. As far as first bike advice while I am a newbie and over 40 now. grrrr lol. I have gone the hybrid route and have upgraded the Scott commuter with a few goodies to make my road bike transistion easier I hope. I do get funny looks riding it with full road gear on.  Idk if what I am doing is a good idea or not, I will let ya know when I save enough money for a real roady.


I know huh? thats how it goes I guess, And just wait till have the bike sitting your living room, a bike just like yours in the right size will suddenly appear on CL in your size for half the price Well my Bike just came in to Performance bike. I Think they are going to assemble it tommarow and I will get fit and pick it up on Friday. I cant wait its going to be so much fun:thumbsup:
Oh and heres my current bike.....


----------



## Ronann

Found plenty of sound advice on here, thanks guys.


----------



## tazzmacd

After much reading, a couple of test rides and more research I have just ordered by Giant Defy Comp 1 bike. Going to pick it up later this week. Looking forward to doing some serious riding this summer on the new bike. Also bought a trainer so I can start riding to get the legs in shape some while I wait for some warmer weather. 

of course with the temp out ther enow I almost wish I had it now instead of later


----------



## Squrkey

Great thread, I am looking at the motobecane immortal spirit. This thread has me convinced it is probably to much bike for a beginner.

Will I look less stupid getting dropped on a lesser ride?


----------



## PJ352

Squrkey said:


> Great thread, I am looking at the motobecane immortal spirit. This thread has me convinced it is probably to much bike for a beginner.
> 
> Will I look less stupid getting dropped on a lesser ride?


IMO you'll look 'less stupid' riding a bike that fits you well. So I suggest avoiding the online route for a first bike, visiting a LBS, getting sized/ fitted, do some test rides and decide from there.


----------



## SolitaryRider

PJ352 said:


> IMO you'll look 'less stupid' riding a bike that fits you well. So I suggest avoiding the online route for a first bike, visiting a LBS, getting sized/ fitted, do some test rides and decide from there.


I don't get this. The guy is looking at saving well over a THOUSAND dollars by going the mail-order route....why not recommend that he merely use a good online fitment calculator? In conjunction with that and the bike's geometry chart/seller's siz recommendation, he'll get a bike that fits. 

Worse case scenario, tell him to go to an LBS and pay for a fitting (Well..really a "sizing"- i.e. take some measurements..let him try a few bikes in the size they determine...- bet most places wouild do that for $50. Even if it cost him $100- considering what he'd get in a bike at an LBS for $2K vs. the Immortal Spirit.....sheesh! No contest!)

The bike he'd get from an LBS for the same price as the Immortal Spirit, wouldn't even be in the same class! I mean, C'mon...it's not rocket science- just take the pertinent measurements....and VIOLA[sic]! What more would the LBS do? Heck, from what I've seen/heard, it seems that half the LBS's out there don't even knoiw what they're doing when it comes to fitment.

I think, one look at what he'd get at the LBS for the same money, and he'll be running out of there! 

I think this calculator is as thorough as what they'd do at any LBS:
Fit Calculator - Competitive Cyclist

Probably more thorough than what they'd do at 90% of the shops. The only hard part might be if you're on the cusp between two sizes- as I was- but in that case, go with the smaller one, as there's always room to adjust up.....

Think about it: Your way (LBS), that fitting, in reality is going to cost the guy $1000 or more- or mean years of riding an inferior-quality bike, when he could be riding an awesome bike, AND saving a LOT of money at the same time. (And having an awesome bike will mean more time in the saddle and more enjoyment! vs. a lesser quality bike from the LBS....with which he'
d likely be disappointed after looking at the Spirit...and either have his enjoyment dampened....or have to end up buying another bike in no time......


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> *I don't get this*. The guy is looking at saving well over a THOUSAND dollars by going the mail-order route....why not recommend that he merely use a good online fitment calculator? In conjunction with that and the bike's geometry chart/seller's siz recommendation, he'll get a bike that fits.
> 
> Worse case scenario, tell him to go to an LBS and pay for a fitting (Well..really a "sizing"- i.e. take some measurements..let him try a few bikes in the size they determine...- bet most places wouild do that for $50. Even if it cost him $100- considering what he'd get in a bike at an LBS for $2K vs. the Immortal Spirit.....sheesh! No contest!)
> 
> The bike he'd get from an LBS for the same price as the Immortal Spirit, wouldn't even be in the same class! I mean, C'mon...it's not rocket science- just take the pertinent measurements....and VIOLA[sic]! What more would the LBS do? Heck, from what I've seen/heard, it seems that half the LBS's out there don't even knoiw what they're doing when it comes to fitment.
> 
> I think, one look at what he'd get at the LBS for the same money, and he'll be running out of there!
> 
> I think this calculator is as thorough as what they'd do at any LBS:
> Fit Calculator - Competitive Cyclist
> 
> Probably more thorough than what they'd do at 90% of the shops. The only hard part might be if you're on the cusp between two sizes- as I was- but in that case, go with the smaller one, as there's always room to adjust up.....
> 
> Think about it: Your way (LBS), that fitting, in reality is going to cost the guy $1000 or more- or mean years of riding an inferior-quality bike, when he could be riding an awesome bike, AND saving a LOT of money at the same time. (And having an awesome bike will mean more time in the saddle and more enjoyment! vs. a lesser quality bike from the LBS....with which he'
> d likely be disappointed after looking at the Spirit...and either have his enjoyment dampened....or have to end up buying another bike in no time......


You and I fundamentally disagree on where priorities lie, so I'm not at all surprised that you don't 'get' my post. 

I didn't recommend an online calculator because IMO/E they do more harm than good, serving to confuse noobs rather than assist. At best, they offer a range of fit parameters based only on numbers inputted. Buyers then have to decipher the recommendations using geo charts that they likely don't understand very well. 

Conversely, working one on one with a customer, a knowledgeable fitter discusses any physical issues, sees the person on the bike (ideally static _and_ dynamic), assesses fitness/ flexibility and tweaks fit to suite the rider. Sure, just like any other business, there are good and not so good, so part of the bike buying process should be to shop for reputable LBS's_ along_ with bikes. Not rewarding (irresponsible, IMO) businesses that take no part in the sizing process.

One point I do agree with is the method you outlined where a prospective buyer pays for a LBS sizing, then uses the test bikes geo to compare with online offerings. I've suggested this method many times in the past and may have done so with this poster had they followed up with more info, but opted to make a point re: his looking stupid comment. 

Continuing...
Because you don't see the value in an optimal fit, you think a rider will be 'disappointed' riding an 'inferior' LBS bike, but IME what dissuades people from staying with the sport is (in part) riding an ill fitting bike, because no one likes discomfort and it certainly isn't going to translate into performance.

It all comes down to where someone places a priority. I've ridden bikes sized wrong with less than an optimal fit, but had 'upgraded' components and I've ridden bikes that fit like a glove with lesser components. I'll take the latter any day, because a good fit betters the odds of riding in relative comfort, which in turn translates into performance. Upgraded shifters don't.

I suspect you haven't yet put in the saddle time required to experience what I call the 'loose link' in your fit is going to feel like. With time, it's likely you will.


----------



## NJBiker72

PJ352 said:


> You and I fundamentally disagree on where priorities lie, so I'm not at all surprised that you don't 'get' my post.
> 
> I didn't recommend an online calculator because IMO/E they do more harm than good, serving to confuse noobs rather than assist. At best, they offer a range of fit parameters based only on numbers inputted. Buyers then have to decipher the recommendations using geo charts that they likely don't understand very well.
> 
> Conversely, working one on one with a customer, a knowledgeable fitter discusses any physical issues, sees the person on the bike (ideally static _and_ dynamic), assesses fitness/ flexibility and tweaks fit to suite the rider. Sure, just like any other business, there are good and not so good, so part of the bike buying process should be to shop for reputable LBS's_ along_ with bikes. Not rewarding (irresponsible, IMO) businesses that take no part in the sizing process.
> 
> One point I do agree with is the method you outlined where a prospective buyer pays for a LBS sizing, then uses the test bikes geo to compare with online offerings. I've suggested this method many times in the past and may have done so with this poster had they followed up with more info, but opted to make a point re: his looking stupid comment.
> 
> Continuing...
> Because you don't see the value in an optimal fit, you think a rider will be 'disappointed' riding an 'inferior' LBS bike, but IME what dissuades people from staying with the sport is (in part) riding an ill fitting bike, because no one likes discomfort and it certainly isn't going to translate into performance.
> 
> It all comes down to where someone places a priority. I've ridden bikes sized wrong with less than an optimal fit, but had 'upgraded' components and I've ridden bikes that fit like a glove with lesser components. I'll take the latter any day, because a good fit betters the odds of riding in relative comfort, which in turn translates into performance. Upgraded shifters don't.
> 
> I suspect you haven't yet put in the saddle time required to experience what I call the 'loose link' in your fit is going to feel like. With time, it's likely you will.


Agree fully. My LBS noticed a difference in my pedal stroke that required a little tweaking.

Would I have been fine without that? Sure, but it is better to get it right. Plus the on-line route leaves you setting up yourself and servicing yourself. Ok, if you are a bike pro but ideal for a noob.


----------



## SolitaryRider

Thanks for the response, PJ. I do greatly respect your opinion- and almost always defer to you- not just because i am a noob...but because what you say usually makes a LOT of sense.

I Do see the value in a good fit. I'm not trying to down-play a good fit in any way...but i do think that with the help of one of the good online calculators, one can get the proper size bike.....and just need to make some adjustments (seat height/fore-aft adjustment; stem length/height/angle) to get an optimal fit- which, can also be done for a fee at an LBS, or by one's self, if they are willing to do some research. 

I also agree that a lesser bike with a good fit is to be preferred over a better bike with a poor fit.....but in the situation being discussed here, with a little effort, the guy can have both- an awesome bike AND a good fit- just as long as he is aware of what needs to be taken care of before ordering.

If he is anything like me, after seeing what that same $1999 will buy at an LBS, he's likely going to order the Immortal Spirit- as I know i sure would- so I'd think it better to make him aware of the importance of fit AND how he can accomplish getting such a fit with a mail-order bike, rather than discouraging him from getting a mail-order bike. No? (It's just the way I know I'd be looking at it, if I were in his position)


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> Thanks for the response, PJ. I do greatly respect your opinion- and almost always defer to you- not just because i am a noob...but because what you say usually makes a LOT of sense.


Thanks for the thoughts.  



SolitaryRider said:


> I Do see the value in a good fit. I'm not trying to down-play a good fit in any way...but* i do think that with the help of one of the good online calculators,* one can get the proper size bike.....and just need to make some adjustments (seat height/fore-aft adjustment; stem length/height/angle) to get an optimal* fit-* *which, can also be done* for a fee at an LBS, or *by one's self, if they are willing to do some research*.


The bold statement points up our differing views on ensuring a proper fit. To me, the phrase 'good online calculator' is an oxymoron, because for the reasons I previously noted, _there are no good online calculators_. 

I also think you're glossing over some of the fit issues riders (new and experienced alike) can face and their sometimes elusive remedies, which oftentimes are counter intuitive. So reading/ researching (again) may confuse more than help, with the result being the rider needing a full fitting to get back to square one. Conversely, with a knowledgeable fitters assistance, odds are many of the more common problems can be avoided. 



SolitaryRider said:


> I also agree that a lesser bike with a good fit is to be preferred over a better bike with a poor fit.....but in the situation being discussed here, with a little effort, the guy can have both- an awesome bike AND a good fit- just as long as he is aware of what needs to be taken care of before ordering.


I kinda-sorta agree with this. As I mentioned in my other post, I think the method you described (getting sized by the LBS, then comparing the geo of the test bike to online bikes) betters the odds of getting sizing, then fit right. But it still leaves the buyer committing to a purchase before test riding (or even seeing) the bike. So, I'll agree that it's doable, but it's not the ideal. Also, the online route leaves the buyer to either fit him/ herself or pay the LBS for the service, which incurs added costs. 



SolitaryRider said:


> If he is anything like me, after seeing what that same $1999 will buy at an LBS, he's likely going to order the Immortal Spirit- as I know i sure would- so I'd think it better to make him aware of the importance of fit AND how he can accomplish getting such a fit with a mail-order bike, rather than discouraging him from getting a mail-order bike. No? (It's just the way I know I'd be looking at it, if I were in his position)


Point taken, and since I'm a firm believer in this forum and the wealth of knowledge/ experience it offers, I agree that varied opinions are generally a good thing, serving to educate buyers. 

That said, my response was aligned with what I see as the_ best _option for the poster (and most others in a similar position). That being, buying from an LBS, build a relationship with them and (with their value added services) have a pleasant purchasing experience.

Is it the only method? Certainly not. But IME as long as the prospective buyer is armed with info re: what to look for (and look out for), buying from a reputable LBS goes a long way in ensuring they get the bike that's right for them.


----------



## SolitaryRider

PJ352 said:


> Thanks for the thoughts.
> 
> 
> But it still leaves the buyer committing to a purchase before test riding (or even seeing) the bike. .


That's something that I "sorta-kinda" agree with too- It wasn't such an issue for myself- admittedly, because I bought a very cheap bike....but it does become a much more serious issue when spending $2K- as the great deal could easily turn into a great loss! 

But, I temper that with: Had I had the chance to test-ride my bike before buying, I'm sure that I would have thought that the reach was too far on it. As it turns out though, after getting used to the bike...it's perfectly fine. 

So I kind of question the value of a test ride....as I think one can often not tell all that much, just riding a bike once for a few miles- good or bad- unless, perhaps, they are an experienced rider. Since we are talking noobs here, I don't think the test ride actually gives much feedback- even for such things as comfort and feel and handling- as those perceptions will likely change with some experience and with getting used to the bike or just being on a bike. Eh?

Cars and trucks are more my area of expertise. Even with them, and even with a very experienced and knowledgeable mechanic- you just don't get the whole story on a test-drive. You miss a lot of things that become much more obvious after you've spent some time with the vehicle; You exaggerate some things which seem to be potential problems, which may indeed to turn out to be non-problems after all. I'd always recommend a test-drive before buying any car....but i have bought vehicles without, where the deal was so good that I couldn't go wrong and circumstances prevented a tst-drive (like the vehicle being 1000 miles away). So I'd say that the value one is getting, does have some bearing on the issue- not you want a bad-fitting bike under any circumstances- but as we've discussed, there are ways to make mail-order a 99.9% sure bet.

Thinking about it, really, how many people on here who have order nice bikes from BD and jensen and the others, have complained about a bad fit?Seems like a lot of people have been buying these bikes, and having very good experiences- I don't think I've read of even one horror story in 6 months or so that I've been on this forum......

(And I don't think you and I are as far apart on this issue as we make each other out to be!  )


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> That's something that I "sorta-kinda" agree with too- It wasn't such an issue for myself- admittedly, because I bought a very cheap bike....but it does become a much more serious issue when spending $2K- as the great deal could easily turn into a great loss!
> 
> But, I temper that with: Had I had the chance to test-ride my bike before buying, I'm sure that I would have thought that the reach was too far on it. As it turns out though, after getting used to the bike...it's perfectly fine.
> 
> So I kind of question the value of a test ride....as I think one can often not tell all that much, just riding a bike once for a few miles- good or bad- unless, perhaps, they are an experienced rider. Since we are talking noobs here, I don't think the test ride actually gives much feedback- even for such things as comfort and feel and handling- as those perceptions will likely change with some experience and with getting used to the bike or just being on a bike. Eh?
> 
> Cars and trucks are more my area of expertise. Even with them, and even with a very experienced and knowledgeable mechanic- you just don't get the whole story on a test-drive. You miss a lot of things that become much more obvious after you've spent some time with the vehicle; You exaggerate some things which seem to be potential problems, which may indeed to turn out to be non-problems after all. I'd always recommend a test-drive before buying any car....but i have bought vehicles without, where the deal was so good that I couldn't go wrong and circumstances prevented a tst-drive (like the vehicle being 1000 miles away). So I'd say that the value one is getting, does have some bearing on the issue- not you want a bad-fitting bike under any circumstances- but as we've discussed, there are ways to make mail-order a 99.9% sure bet.
> 
> Thinking about it, really, how many people on here who have order nice bikes from BD and jensen and the others, have complained about a bad fit?Seems like a lot of people have been buying these bikes, and having very good experiences- I don't think I've read of even one horror story in 6 months or so that I've been on this forum......
> 
> (And I don't think you and I are as far apart on this issue as we make each other out to be!  )


Test rides mean different things to different people, but I meant it in the context of getting a feel for how differing geometries ride and handle differently. Also, for many noobs, experiencing the differences between a relaxed geo bike and race bike is IMO/E important. 

As important as sizing/ fit is and should be considered during test rides, IMO the onus to get both right is on the LBS, not the buyer (as it is with online purchases), so... not the _primary _purpose of the test ride. Nor is comfort, because it's uncommon to test ride a bike for the time duration needed to make that assessment. And since most LBS's don't do a 'real' fitting until the purchaser has at least narrowed their choices, they'd be assessing comfort/ fit in their initial states. Not a good baseline for comparison - at least until the field is narrowed._ Then_ the focus should shift more to fit/ comfort. 

Re: your car/ truck/ bike analogies, IME I have to own both a new car and new bike for about a year before I can make a final assessment of either. BUT... that doesn't mean test drives/ rides didn't have any value. They did for me, because they allowed me to sift through the field, narrowing my choices from there. 

With an online bike purchase, there are no test rides and no basis for comparison, so in my view the buyer isn't making an educated purchasing decision - at least not pre-purchase. But then, the sole purpose for buying online is to save money, so the compromises that go with that decision are (by default) accepted.

Re: your statement about buyers not complaining about the fit of their online purchases, all I can say is that you may be drawing the wrong conclusions. Human nature being what it is, how many consumers do you know that would fess up and offer that (in retrospect) their purchase was a poor choice. IMO it's more likely the bike (or name that product) gathers dust in a shed, garage or basement until it's given away or sold. Or, the bike doesn't fit well, the buyer knows no better, and lives with it. Lots of possibilities.

Lastly, yeah, we _are_ that far apart on some aspects of this issue. But this being a forum, we both have the opportunity to offer opposing viewpoints and let the member body add their input and/ or decide for themselves. And that's as it should be. :thumbsup:


----------



## Illinois Rec Rider

How important is a triple up front for noobs riding in mostly flat areas? My LBS likes the Kona Jake for me in part because of the triple (since I'm just starting out and hoping to use the bike for a century ride someday). However, riding in Illinois, we don't have much in the way of long steep climbs. I'm just wondering what the opinions of the more experienced riders are.


----------



## PJ352

Illinois Rec Rider said:


> How important is a triple up front for noobs riding in mostly flat areas? My LBS likes the Kona Jake for me in part because of the triple (since I'm just starting out and hoping to use the bike for a century ride someday). However, riding in Illinois, we don't have much in the way of long steep climbs. I'm just wondering what the opinions of the more experienced riders are.


Since gearing needs to match a riders fitness level and terrain, let's begin at the beginning. What type of riding are you looking to do. The Jake is a nice cyclocross bike, but is meant for more diverse types of terrain than just (paved) road riding. For example, the description on their site states "_the Jake is able to ride everything from pothole-ridden sub-Saharan highways to gravel commuter paths to mud-riddled cross courses"._ 

If that describes your intended uses, then it's a fine choice. If not, then you might want to clarify your uses with that shop or try another.


----------



## NJBiker72

Illinois Rec Rider said:


> How important is a triple up front for noobs riding in mostly flat areas? My LBS likes the Kona Jake for me in part because of the triple (since I'm just starting out and hoping to use the bike for a century ride someday). However, riding in Illinois, we don't have much in the way of long steep climbs. I'm just wondering what the opinions of the more experienced riders are.


If you are on flats mostly I would not want a triple.


----------



## JPinJC

Hello all. I'm new to biking and to the forum but in the same situation so I thought I would join the discussion. I'm looking for a $1000-$1500 bike with an aluminum frame and composite fork.

I'm caught up on this thread and I value the LBS but so far the local ones don't agree. The Cannondale dealer said I was more of a 54 and the Jamis/Bianchi dealer said I'm definitely a 56. I was admittedly uncomfortable (weight on hands/wrists) on the 56 Cannondale. I'm 6' and 200lbs, I have 33" T-rex arms.

Everyone seems to like all of the bikes which makes the decision difficult. I was quite comfortable sitting on the Jamis but the dealer doesn't offer a demo. The Cannondale was less comfortable but they offer demo time, and that indoor simulator the bike clips into. 

During research, I came across the Boardman Road Team which looks like an excellent value. Are there any gripes with this bike itself?

All friendly advice is quite welcome and I'm anxious for my first ride. 3 knee surgeries and 70% meniscus on one side put an end to impact sports but not my competitive nature.


----------



## NJBiker72

JPinJC said:


> Hello all. I'm new to biking and to the forum but in the same situation so I thought I would join the discussion. I'm looking for a $1000-$1500 bike with an aluminum frame and composite fork.
> 
> I'm caught up on this thread and I value the LBS but so far the local ones don't agree. The Cannondale dealer said I was more of a 54 and the Jamis/Bianchi dealer said I'm definitely a 56. I was admittedly uncomfortable (weight on hands/wrists) on the 56 Cannondale. I'm 6' and 200lbs, I have 33" T-rex arms.
> 
> Everyone seems to like all of the bikes which makes the decision difficult. I was quite comfortable sitting on the Jamis but the dealer doesn't offer a demo. The Cannondale was less comfortable but they offer demo time, and that indoor simulator the bike clips into.
> 
> During research, I came across the Boardman Road Team which looks like an excellent value. Are there any gripes with this bike itself?
> 
> All friendly advice is quite welcome and I'm anxious for my first ride. 3 knee surgeries and 70% meniscus on one side put an end to impact sports but not my competitive nature.


If the shop does not offer a test ride, go elsewhere. 

Different bikes may fit differently. I am about your size but with long arms and am on a 56 but everyone is different. Try a few more dealers. The time is well spent.


----------



## tlg

JPinJC said:


> I'm caught up on this thread and I value the LBS but so far the local ones don't agree. The Cannondale dealer said I was more of a 54 and the Jamis/Bianchi dealer said I'm definitely a 56. I was admittedly uncomfortable (weight on hands/wrists) on the 56 Cannondale.


 Don't worry about that. There is no industry standard to bike sizes. They are all over the place. A 54 in one brand could easily be a 52-56 in another brand. Ask the LBS to provide you the bike geometry. They SHOULD have it. If not, it's on all the bike websites.

This is what the geometry looks like for a 2012 Caad8. 
https://cdn.cannondale.com/catalog/product/c/1/c12-geo-caad8_25.gif

Every bike in every brand will be slightly different.
What matters more is that the bike fits and is comfortable. So you need to try them out.


----------



## PJ352

JPinJC said:


> Hello all. I'm new to biking and to the forum but in the same situation so I thought I would join the discussion. I'm looking for a $1000-$1500 bike with an aluminum frame and composite fork.
> 
> I'm caught up on this thread and I value the LBS but so far the local ones don't agree. The Cannondale dealer said I was more of a 54 and the Jamis/Bianchi dealer said I'm definitely a 56. I was admittedly uncomfortable (weight on hands/wrists) on the 56 Cannondale. I'm 6' and 200lbs, I have 33" T-rex arms.
> 
> Everyone seems to like all of the bikes which makes the decision difficult. I was quite comfortable sitting on the Jamis but the dealer doesn't offer a demo. The Cannondale was less comfortable but they offer demo time, and that indoor simulator the bike clips into.
> 
> During research, I came across the Boardman Road Team which looks like an excellent value. Are there any gripes with this bike itself?
> 
> All friendly advice is quite welcome and I'm anxious for my first ride. *3 knee surgeries and 70% meniscus on one side *put an end to impact sports but not my competitive nature.


Here's my take and advice on your situation.

First off, one of the reasons prospective cyclists seek out reputable LBS's is to avail themselves of the value added services they offer. Specifically, advice on brands/ models that would best suite the customers intended uses and price range, sizing/ fit assistance for bikes of interest, test rides, final assembly, tuning, tweaks to initial fit along with post purchase services (warranty assistance, if needed), tweaks to fit, discounts on accessories, adjustments to drivetrain.

That said (and as was mentioned) if a shop doesn't allow test rides, walk... and tell them why. The reputable shops will not only accommodate your wishes, they'll tell you that you should test ride bikes, to expose yourself to the fit/ feel, ride and handling of different models. 

Re: the sizing issue, again, as was stated, there are no industry standards for measuring to determine frame size, so it's essentially a number affixed to a frame. While it's certainly a plus to educate yourself in matters of bike geometry/ fit, truth is it takes quite a lot of time/ experience to really 'get it', so educate yourself, play an active role in the bike fitting process, but remember that the onus of getting sizing/ fit right is on the LBS, not you. They need your input to tell them how you're feeling on the bike, but let them guide you - and don't sweat the number on the frames.

Lastly, be sure to tell any of the LBS fitters about your injuries/ surgeries. Given your history, proper bike set up is all the more critical. Speaking of which, if that Boardman is mail order, I'd strongly advise against it (or any other online purchase) with your unique anatomical issues. Shop for reputable shops along with shopping for bikes. Long term, I think you'll be glad you did.


----------



## mjcz5853

*Orbea Aqua*

Great advise here. I was thinking about buying an Orbea Aqua. Would this be a good bike to transition to from a hybrid or is there a better manufacturer? I know when your talking $1,000 range there's not much difference.


----------



## Nerdsftw

Has anyone here mentioned bikesdirect or getting a fixie yet?


----------



## vibusta

Thanks for this thread!


----------



## newbieannie

*Buying my 1st Road Bike*

I started back with cycling in November and was given a used Giant Hybrid. It has been great but I'm thinking that what I really need is a Road Bike. Does anyone have an opinion on a 2007 Cannondale Synapse Feminine? Since I am new to this site, I'm not able to post the Craig's List link. 

Thanks


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> I started back with cycling in November and was given a used Giant Hybrid. It has been great but I'm thinking that what I really need is a Road Bike. Does anyone have an opinion on a 2007 Cannondale Synapse Feminine? Since I am new to this site, I'm not able to post the Craig's List link.
> 
> Thanks


Since you're asking an opinion on a used bike, besides a pic we'd really need to more about its overall condition, any known repair requirements, how it was used/ stored...

You can't link, but you can cut and paste the text of the ad for us to read. Also, call the seller and ask some questions similar to what I stated here. You can ask the frame size, but coming from a hybrid it'll just be 'ball parking'. 

Alternately, bring along someone knowledgeable of bikes (and ideally, fit) and go check out/ ride the bike, then let us know your impressions.


----------



## tlg

newbieannie said:


> Does anyone have an opinion on a 2007 Cannondale Synapse Feminine? Since I am new to this site, I'm not able to post the Craig's List link.


Could you post what CL region you're in? We could then look it up.
What's the price?
Do you know which Synapse model it is?

Synapse Feminine 3
Synapse Feminine 4
Synapse Feminine Carbon 1
Synapse Feminine Carbon 2 Double
Synapse Feminine Carbon 2 Triple
Synapse Feminine Carbon 3 Double
Synapse Feminine Carbon 3 Triple


----------



## newbieannie

I went to a LBS and got their opinion of frame size and types of bikes. He told me that a 50cm (women) or 48cm (men) would be good. They offered to check over any used bike that I was interested in and to give me a ball park to offer the seller. 

I test drove a road bike from another ad last night. It was too big for me (prior to getting measured at the LBS), had some rust and the gears were difficult to shift. Obviously, it wasn't a good deal but I can definitely tell that I will feel a major difference between a road bike and my 35 pound hybrid. I was also impressed with the tighter turning radius of the bike compared to my hybrid. A benefit that no one had told me about. Several of the guys on my group rides have been telling me that I will be lightning fast once I get my road bike and nail down my cadence (another new goal to master after I get more details on what it is exactly). Some of these guys go really fast. They use this ride to prepare for the long distance rides in the fall.

Ad posting...

Full specifications from link to a website:


Bicycle Type	Road race & triathlon
MSRP (new)	$1,099.00
Weight	Unspecified
Sizes	47cm, 50cm, 53cm, 56cm
Colors	Blue, Red
Item ID	95980

Frame & Fork
Frame Construction	TIG-welded
Frame Tubing Material	Aluminum
Fork Brand & Model	Cannondale S.A.V.E. Ultra Feminine
Fork Material	Carbon, aero crown
Rear Shock	Unspecified

Components
Component Group	Shimano mix
Brakeset	Cannondale C3 brakes, Shimano 105 STI Dual Control w/reach adjust levers
Shift Levers	Shimano 105 STI Dual Control w/reach adjust
Front Derailleur	Shimano Tiagra
Rear Derailleur	Shimano 105
Crankset	TruVativ Touro 3.0, 30/42/52 teeth
Pedals	Not included
Bottom Bracket	Shimano BB-UN26
BB Shell Width	Unspecified
Rear Cogs	9-speed, 12 - 26 teeth
Chain	Shimano 9 speed
Seatpost	Cannondale C2 Carbon-wrapped
Saddle	Selle Royal Dardo Women's
Handlebar	ITM Elle
Handlebar Extensions	Unspecified
Handlebar Stem	Cannondale C4
Headset	1 1/8" threadless FSA integrated

Wheels
Hubs	Cannondale Earth
Rims	Mach1 CFX
Tires	700 x 23c Maxxis Fuse
Spoke Brand	DT Champion stainless steel, Wheelset
Spoke Nipples	Unspecified

Owner's comments...
This is the thoroughbred racing horse of bicycles. It is fast, light, and responsive, and has no patience for when I get scared and want to go slowly down a hill or around a curve. Like a high-spirited horse, this bike only wants to go. It has high end Shimano components, and is perfectly capable of stopping, it just prefers to go all out. The owner had this to say in her email back to me..."The bike is definitely fast. I did my first sprint triathlon and passed many people on the bike portion, which I know couldn't of been due to my superior bike fitness or skill-- because I'm not bike skilled in any way." Her and her husband are moving to Guam this summer and see shipping the bike to the jungle.

I believe it's a 50cm size, not suitable for riders over 5'5".

I have asked to see the bike tonight. If it is a good fit and rides/shifts well, I'll bring one of my buddies and ask to take it to a LBS for a check.


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> I went to a LBS and got their opinion of frame size and types of bikes. He told me that a 50cm (women) or 48cm (men) would be good. They offered to check over any used bike that I was interested in and to give me a ball park to offer the seller.
> 
> I believe it's a 50cm size, not suitable for riders over 5'5".
> 
> I have asked to see the bike tonight. If it is a good fit and rides/shifts well, I'll bring one of my buddies and ask to take it to a LBS for a check.


Overall, you have a good plan, so go with it.

One word of caution re: the LBS's sizing recommendations. There are no industry standards for determining frame sizes, so if your LBS was sizing you to a Synapse - same bikes geo, just different model years - that's ok. But if they sized you to a different brand/ model, be aware that your sizing requirements may be different on the Synapse. You'll get a sense for that when you test ride it. 

And by all means, assuming the seller is willing, take your LBS up on the offer to check the bike out. Ask that they assess sizing as well.


----------



## newbieannie

Thanks. They tested me on a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 and a generic frame road bike. They also suggested a Scattante R-570, GT Series 1. The seller lists bike as not suitable for riders over 5'5" and I'm between that & 5'6". So we will have to see.


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> Thanks. They tested me on a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 and a generic frame road bike. They also suggested a Scattante R-570, GT Series 1. The seller lists bike as not suitable for riders over 5'5" and I'm between that & 5'6". So *we will have to see.*


The shop is likely reputable and is trying to assist, but considering the bikes they used to recommend sizing, I suggest you take a wait and see attitude re: the Synapse. 

As I mentioned, ideally, bring someone along that knows bike fit as well as the mechanical side.

Good luck and let us know how you made out.


----------



## tlg

newbieannie said:


> The seller lists bike as not suitable for riders over 5'5" and I'm between that & 5'6". So we will have to see.


What price is the seller asking?

The bike is the Synapse Feminine 4. BikePedia - 2007 Cannondale Synapse Feminine 4 Complete Bicycle
It's a good entry level bike (assuming it's in good condition). As far as the owners comments, take them with a grain of salt. Everything he said is completely subjective. To be honest, he sounds like a used car salesman. 

A 50cm is about the right size for you, but as PJ352 mentioned not all bike sizes are equivalent. The seller saying that the bike is not suitable for riders over 5'5" is wrong. It's a ballpark, not a hard rule. All frames are different and peoples arms, legs, etc are different.

Ask the seller approx how many miles it has on it. And figure what ever he says will be a low estimate. If it's thousands of miles, you should worry about the condition/wear of the drivetrain. If you take it to an LBS, it's something you'd want them to check.


----------



## newbieannie

They are asking $500. BikePedia has it at $1099 retail. But let's be honest here. It is a 5 year old bike. 

I've looked at a few online bike measurements sites and some recommend 50cm and others 53cm. The LBS had me in a 50cm and 51cm depending on the bike. That shows how much I know. I thought they only came in even increments. I did try a 54cm and it was a bit tall. I might have injured something if I had to get off in a quick movement. I understand about arms, legs & torso's altering the perfect bike. My mom and I are the same height and she has a very short torso, mine is average to long. My ex-husband had short legs but was my height.


----------



## tlg

newbieannie said:


> They are asking $500. BikePedia has it at $1099 retail. But let's be honest here. It is a 5 year old bike.


He likely didn't pay MSRP. $500 is a fair price if it's in excellent condition. (50% of bikepedia MSRP is kinda the ave. for used bikes on craigslist) 
From there, if there are any nicks, scratches, dings, worn brake pads, etc, haggle down the price.



> I've looked at a few online bike measurements sites and some recommend 50cm and others 53cm. The LBS had me in a 50cm and 51cm depending on the bike. That shows how much I know.


You're no more confused than ANY one else on bike size!



> I thought they only came in even increments.


All dependant on the brand. To make it even worse, some go by S,M,L. And a M is one brand measures different than a M in another. :mad2:


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> They are asking $500. BikePedia has it at $1099 retail. But let's be honest here. It is a 5 year old bike.
> 
> I've looked at a few online bike measurements sites and some recommend 50cm and others 53cm. The LBS had me in a 50cm and 51cm depending on the bike. That shows how much I know. I thought they only came in even increments. I did try a 54cm and it was a bit tall. I might have injured something if I had to get off in a quick movement. I understand about arms, legs & torso's altering the perfect bike. My mom and I are the same height and she has a very short torso, mine is average to long. My ex-husband had short legs but was my height.


Considering the bike is 5 model years old, with a mix of Shimano (9 speed) 105 and Tiagra, IMO it's priced high, but most CL bikes are. _How much less_ I'd offer would depend on what needed to be put into the bike.

Re: sizing, it's not so much about height or inseam as it is about proportions, fitness and flexibility. To ease your confusion, I suggest you stop using online 'measurement' sites (they'll mislead more than help), stop thinking in terms of frame size (arbitrary numbers) and start thinking in terms of reach and saddle to bar drop requirements.

Bottom line here, if your overall assessment of the bike after the test ride is positive, ask that your LBS check the bike out - and assess your fit on it. No offense meant, but aside from how you feel on a bike, you need assistance to determine sizing/ fit requirements.


----------



## newbieannie

Thanks PJ. I've never been a very flexible person and have lower back issues. I'm on my way over to kick the tires. A fellow liker suggested that I offer $400 and settle for $450. But that will depend on what LBS has to say about it.

Oh, BTW, I just love love your profile pic. A very beautiful/handsome dog and always makes me smile when I see one of your posts.


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> Thanks PJ. I've never been a very flexible person and have lower back issues. I'm on my way over to kick the tires. A fellow liker suggested that I offer $400 and settle for $450. But that will depend on what LBS has to say about it.
> 
> Oh, BTW, I just love love your profile pic. A very beautiful/handsome dog and always makes me smile when I see one of your posts.


Good luck, and thanks for the thoughts on my Aussie. She's a great dog.


----------



## newbieannie

She looks like a great dog. 

Test drove the bike. You might be right about the size being a bit small. We had to raise the seat up a couple of inches. I didn't think about raising the handle bars too. I haven't ridden on a bike with drop down handle bars in several decades. I found it very uncomfortable on the hands. After I left, I had the thought that maybe the handle bars were too low and that is what was making it so uncomfortable. I rode a bike that was a bit too tall yesterday and didn't have the wrist problem. Thinking of going to a local retailer of this type of bike to get their opinion of sizing. What say you guys? 

The bike looked like it had never been ridden. She said that she has maybe ridden it 100 miles. She bought it for a triathlon but mostly trained in spinning classes.


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> She looks like a great dog.
> 
> Test drove the bike. You might be right about the size being a bit small. We had to raise the seat up a couple of inches. I didn't think about raising the handle bars too. I haven't ridden on a bike with drop down handle bars in several decades. I found it very uncomfortable on the hands. After I left, I had the thought that maybe the handle bars were too low and that is what was making it so uncomfortable. I rode a bike that was a bit too tall yesterday and didn't have the wrist problem. Thinking of going to a local retailer of this type of bike to get their opinion of sizing. What say you guys?
> 
> The bike looked like it had never been ridden. She said that she has maybe ridden it 100 miles. She bought it for a triathlon but mostly trained in spinning classes.


Since we're uncertain that this particular bike is sized correctly for you and you haven't been fitted, there could be a number of reasons for the wrist problem, but IMO/E incorrect f/r weight distribution (too much frontal weight) is likely the cause. The possible remedies range from fore/ aft/ tilt saddle adjustments to bar reach/ drop adjustments. Most likely a combination of them. 

Given the fact that you have no current bike that could serve as a baseline for comparison, along with your anatomical issues, I suggest seeking out a reputable fitter and opting for a standard fitting (about $50-$75). 

Depending on the fitters recommendations, the Synapse may or may not be a viable option, but assuming you'll continue to look for used bikes, you'll compare the geo of bikes of interest to that of the test bike. The closer the numbers (not the frame size), the closer your fit will be to that of the test bike. This method will improve your odds of getting a correctly sized bike, after which you can (hopefully) seek out that same fitter to dial in your fit on the new bike. Any questions or concerns you have interpreting the numbers can be answered either here or by a knowledgeable fitter.

Based on a comment you made on bar height adjustment, I though I'd offer a FYI. Manufacturers no longer use quill stems, so any adjustments to bars entails changing stem length, angle and/ or spacers and pre-loading the headset bearings. Not difficult, but also not for the uninitiated.


----------



## newbieannie

No wonder LBS's are offering lifetime adjustments with new bikes.


----------



## PJ352

newbieannie said:


> No wonder LBS's are offering lifetime adjustments with new bikes.


That usually refers to drivetrain adjustments, but most reputable LBS's will tweak fit, post-purchase.

But re: fit, it's very important to get fit dialed in on drop bar bikes. Doing so betters the odds of riding in relative comfort which (in turn) equates to riding efficiently. Conversely, an ill fitting bike will likely not be ridden much. 

Consider the steps you now take to ensure you get fit right an investment in your biking future _and_ in your new bike.


----------



## ontheroad

Hi,

I am a new in road biking. Also new to the forum. I have been reading the posts. I have a question about "the right fit" as I hear that all the time from friends who are enthusiasts. I have been to my LBS many times and was fitted with a specialized ruby in 48 cm. It felt good, except the price tag was too high for me considering I am just starting out. With fitting, how would you know if the bike's too stiff for you? And also how would you know its the right fit? Is it just based on how the ride feels? I know the bar needs to be about 1-2 inches from when you're standing over it, the seat needs to be adjusted where your legs are still flexed but not too much, and the torso part to the handle bars needs to be at a comfortable distance. On another note, I am looking at well-made CF bikes since I plan to do races in the future. What do you all think about a 2006 Orbea Opal? I found a slightly used (less than 100mi) one locally with these specs: No signs of damage, the frame looks like brand new. The size is 48 cm which is right for me. I test drove it yesterday and it feels good. I think the size feels good for me. This would be my first road bike, which I'll be keeping for awhile. Any advice on picking the right one for me, and what you think about this opal in terms of value and performance would be greatly appreciated.	

Size: 48 cm
•	Frameset: Orbea Opal Carbon Fiber frame & fork
•	Wheelset: Shimano Ultegra (Brand New)
•	Tires: Hutchinson Fusion comp(Brand New)
•	Transmission: Shimano Ultegra 9 Speed FF & RR Derailleurs, Shimano 105 Brakeset, Shimano Ultegra Shifters(whole set less than 50 miles)
•	Crankset: Truvative Triple Crankset (30, 39, 52)
•	Saddle: Womens Specialized BG 143mm
•	Stem: FSA OS115 120mm -- 17 deg Aluminum w/ Carbon fiber clamp
•	Headset: FSA Carbon Fiber
•	Seatpost: Carbon Fiber FSA SLK(Brand New)
•	Bottom Bracket: Truvative Hollowtech
•	Bar: FSA Aluminum - 31.8 @ 380mm width(Brand New)
Notes: Bikes is immaculate and super light. No accidents. Finish is pristine.


----------



## PJ352

ontheroad said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am a new in road biking. Also new to the forum. I have been reading the posts. I have a question about "the right fit" as I hear that all the time from friends who are enthusiasts. I have been to my LBS many times and was fitted with a specialized ruby in 48 cm. It felt good, except the price tag was too high for me considering I am just starting out. With fitting, how would you know if the bike's too stiff for you? And also how would you know its the right fit? Is it just based on how the ride feels? I know the bar needs to be about 1-2 inches from when you're standing over it, the seat needs to be adjusted where your legs are still flexed but not too much, and the torso part to the handle bars needs to be at a comfortable distance. On another note, I am looking at well-made CF bikes since I plan to do races in the future. What do you all think about a 2006 Orbea Opal? I found a slightly used (less than 100mi) one locally with these specs: No signs of damage, the frame looks like brand new. The size is 48 cm which is right for me. I test drove it yesterday and it feels good. I think the size feels good for me. This would be my first road bike, which I'll be keeping for awhile. Any advice on picking the right one for me, and what you think about this opal in terms of value and performance would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Size: 48 cm
> •	Frameset: Orbea Opal Carbon Fiber frame & fork
> •	Wheelset: Shimano Ultegra (Brand New)
> •	Tires: Hutchinson Fusion comp(Brand New)
> •	Transmission: Shimano Ultegra 9 Speed FF & RR Derailleurs, Shimano 105 Brakeset, Shimano Ultegra Shifters(whole set less than 50 miles)
> •	Crankset: Truvative Triple Crankset (30, 39, 52)
> •	Saddle: Womens Specialized BG 143mm
> •	Stem: FSA OS115 120mm -- 17 deg Aluminum w/ Carbon fiber clamp
> •	Headset: FSA Carbon Fiber
> •	Seatpost: Carbon Fiber FSA SLK(Brand New)
> •	Bottom Bracket: Truvative Hollowtech
> •	Bar: FSA Aluminum - 31.8 @ 380mm width(Brand New)
> Notes: Bikes is immaculate and super light. No accidents. Finish is pristine.


Answering your questions.... A bikes stiffness isn't fit related. It's a (largely) subjective evaluation of how a bike rides and feels as you apply power, or force. As an example, what you may categorize as stiff, I may describe as efficient power transfer - or a rigid ride. 

As far as knowing the right fit, being able to consistently ride in relative comfort would IMO/E be a good indicator. Options to attain it vary, but (again, IMO/E) it's generally best to have either your LBS or a knowledgeable fitter assist with sizing, then fitting, because sizing has to be right before a fitting can be right. This basically answers the rest of your questions/ comments, because odds are against a noob sizing/ fitting themselves and have the end result be optimal, especially if you're looking to race in the future.

And speaking of racing, unless you can afford to either replace or repair a CF bike in the event of crash damage, I'd advise against racing CF. You'd be better served by getting a lower priced aluminum frame and racing that. They're generally cheaper, so cheaper to replace. CF, is not.

Re: the Opal. If riding it felt good to you, sizing is probably right and with a standard fitting, it might be a decent choice, fit-wise. Sight unseen, I can't really offer an assessment of the bike, but their description has a few errors. For one, Truvativ and Hollowtech are offered by two different companies, so something isn't right there. They don't say what model the saddle is, and in '06 Shimano Ultegra was 10 speed, so I suspect either some components were swapped to/ from this bike in anticipation of selling it or the model year is older than they're saying. All things considered, I'd proceed with caution on this one. 

Here's Bikepedia's description:
BikePedia - 2006 Orbea Opal Ultegra 10 Complete Bicycle


----------



## ontheroad

PJ352,

Your thoughts are highly appreciated. Regarding the Opal, the seller said he bought the CF frame and built the bike from a cannondale MTB thus the components might be altered. Based on your experience, how much would you think the value fo this bike be? I can send you pics. Thanks!


----------



## zadig

*Tomasso tiempo vs fuji roubaix 3.0*

Hi every one. 

I've been thinking of getting a road bike for so long and saving money for that matter. I am on a tight budget and cannot consider higher end bikes although they are a joy to ride. I started with comparing schwin katana and tommaso tiempo and read on this forum that the tiempo is the better choice. 

I took the advice and went to my local bike store to see if I could get any discount on the bikes they have. I truly want to buy the bike from a store but don't have the money to. The only bike with comparable price to tiempo is the fuji roubaix 3.0. I've tried the fuji and feels good, tried different sizes and all the staff was very helpful. I don't like the buttons for gears but that's ok i guess. I haven't had the chance to try the tiempo, and I would want to get your opinion on this. How bad the tiempo is going to be compared to the roubaix 

Thanks


----------



## Miles42

This is a great thread. I am about to buy my first road bike and the information here is really helpful. I have been riding a converted MB for some time and also had a Cannondale hybrid.


----------



## PJ352

ontheroad said:


> PJ352,
> 
> Your thoughts are highly appreciated. Regarding the Opal, the seller said he bought the CF frame and built the bike from a cannondale MTB thus the components might be altered. Based on your experience, how much would you think the value fo this bike be? I can send you pics. Thanks!


Sorry for the delay in responding, but I just saw your post.

In all honesty, I don't think the seller is being honest with you. None of the components on the Opal are mtb components. They're a mix of older and low/ mid-point road components. It's not unusual for someone to build up a frame (prepping it for sale) using spare parts the have on hand that they no longer want/ need.

My gut says take a pass on this one. 

Hope this helps....


----------



## CGAJ

Greetings, folks! I'm admittedly a complete newbie to biking in general, but have always wanted to take it up when I was finally able to afford something I really like. I think it's been three years since my initial urge, and I'm proud and happy to say that I finally purchased my first road bike -- a 2012 Specialized Allez Compact -- nothing too crazy, but something I'm 100% happy with.

Now here's my query:

The bike has been my only purchase, so where do I go from here? I've read an essentials thread, and suspect that my first necessities are a kit (bag, extra tube, multi-tool, patches, tire wrench), and a helmet.

I'm not too concerned about racing, so can I just wait a bit more to buy my cleats/pedal set? I'm worried, because after the bike purchase, I have roughly around $140 left to spend on gear.


----------



## NJBiker72

@ cgaj.

Nice purchase. My first real road bike was the secteur sport compact. Think i would have preferred the Allez and know a few guys with them. 

To your question. If you have only 140 left skip pedals for now assuming you have decent sneakers with relatively hard soles. Tuck your laces in though. You do not want them getting caught in the gears. 

Get a helmet, saddle bag, bike shorts, jerseys and spare tube, o2 inflator and mini tool. Learn how to use them. 

None of these have to be expensive and to save money you can get them all online or at a big box store. 

Helmets do not have to be expensive but make sure it fits. Even a bell from target will protect your head. Just weigh more. Personally use low end Specialized. It saved my life at least once. 

Jerseys are great because of pockets in the back. To save money you could wear a tight shirt and fanny pack but I would prefer a jersey. Check out www.pricepoint .com for cheap clothes if you don't mind the look. 

Oh and gloves. Again cheap is ok. Just want some padding for Tue hands and maybe a slight layer for when you go down.


----------



## tlg

CGAJ said:


> The bike has been my only purchase, so where do I go from here? I've read an essentials thread, and suspect that my first necessities are a kit (bag, extra tube, multi-tool, patches, tire wrench), and a helmet.


 Congrats on the new bike. With the exception of a pump/co2 inflator, you've listed the essentials. Those are all important to have to save you a long walk home. You don't "need" anything else to ride your bike and have fun.



> I'm not too concerned about racing, so can I just wait a bit more to buy my cleats/pedal set? I'm worried, because after the bike purchase, I have roughly around $140 left to spend on gear.


Cycling shorts and cleats/pedals are the next thing you will REALLY appreciate having. Get the shorts first with your leftover money. Any ride over a few miles and you'll want to have them. 
If you have enough left over go for the cleats/pedals, and if not, work on saving up for them and enjoy your bike in the meantime.

After that, NJBiker72 listed some other "essentials" that you'll eventually like to have.


----------



## PJ352

CGAJ said:


> Greetings, folks! I'm admittedly a complete newbie to biking in general, but have always wanted to take it up when I was finally able to afford something I really like. I think it's been three years since my initial urge, and I'm proud and happy to say that I finally purchased my first road bike -- a 2012 Specialized Allez Compact -- nothing too crazy, but something I'm 100% happy with.
> 
> Now here's my query:
> 
> The bike has been my only purchase, so where do I go from here? I've read an essentials thread, and suspect that my first necessities are a kit (bag, extra tube, multi-tool, patches, tire wrench), and a helmet.
> 
> I'm not too concerned about racing, so can I just wait a bit more to buy my cleats/pedal set? I'm worried, because after the bike purchase, I have roughly around $140 left to spend on gear.


Congrats on the new bike... _nice_ choice!! :thumbsup:

Off the top of my head, here's my order of priorities...

1) Helmet/ Road ID - or some sort of ID - both #1.
2) Saddle bag with spare tube, patch kit, tire levers, latex gloves/ paper towels/ rag, mini-pump and/ or CO2, muti-tool - then learn how to use them/ change tubes/ repair flats.
3) Padded bike shorts. Performance bike has Centuries for ~$30.
4) Gloves.
5) Jersey. Performance Classic - ~$25.

Somewhere down the road:
1) Computer with cadence. Ex: Cateye Astrale 8 (~$30) 
2) Clipless pedals/ shoes - mtb or road, depending on needs/ preferences.
3) Lights - if needed


----------



## CGAJ

Wow, thanks for the replies, everyone! This is going to sound completely newbie, but what do you guys typically wear/use underneath your jersey and shorts?


----------



## tlg

CGAJ said:


> This is going to sound completely newbie, but what do you guys typically wear/use underneath your jersey and shorts?


Cycling shorts are made to be worn with nothing under them. They have padding which is meant to sit on your bare rear end. Wearing layers/underware under them can lead to chaffing. 

Cycling jerseys are kinda the same way. They're made to breath and wick sweat away from your skin. On cool days I'll wear arm sleeves (which can easily be removed). Or perhaps an underarmour shirt if it's really cool.


----------



## CGAJ

Awesome, thanks a ton! I'll post pictures of my first haul just to be sure I didn't miss anything.


----------



## PJ352

tlg said:


> Cycling shorts are made to be worn with nothing under them. They have padding which is meant to sit on your bare rear end. Wearing layers/underware under them can lead to chaffing.
> 
> Cycling jerseys are kinda the same way. They're made to breath and wick sweat away from your skin. On cool days I'll wear arm sleeves (which can easily be removed). Or perhaps an underarmour shirt if it's really cool.


I do similarly. Above ~ 65 degrees cycling shorts and short sleeved jersey do me fine. As temps drop and depending on just how much, I'll add tights, a long sleeved jersey, thin t-shirt or thermal under the jersey. I add full fingered gloves, a skull cap, wool socks and shoe covers as temps approach ~35 degrees - and that's about my limit for outdoor rides.

For longer rides that start off cool, a good rule of thumb is to dress in layers. Ex: arm/ leg warmers that can be shed and thrown in jersey pockets as the temps rise.


----------



## erintomatoes

Good advice here. I think that I'm going to tier my budget - first 'wave' will be on a good mountain bike...the second will be to mod it with couplers so I can travel with it!

..unless if I find a nice folding bike that can handle the trails for under $600! It sounds like creeping around CL, kijiji and ebay are the way to go


----------



## Squrkey

tlg said:


> Cycling shorts are made to be worn with nothing under them. They have padding which is meant to sit on your bare rear end. Wearing layers/underware under them can lead to chaffing.
> 
> Cycling jerseys are kinda the same way. They're made to breath and wick sweat away from your skin. On cool days I'll wear arm sleeves (which can easily be removed). Or perhaps an underarmour shirt if it's really cool.


Great advice, I wish I had asked last week, I still got Monkey Butt.


----------



## Squrkey

Anyone have recommendations on creams and stuff to prevent chaffing etc.?


----------



## tlg

Squrkey said:


> Anyone have recommendations on creams and stuff to prevent chaffing etc.?


I generally don't have chaffing problems. On a few occasions I've used diaper rash cream before and/or after. Works good and cheap. If its good enough for a babies butt its good enogh for mine.


----------



## PJ352

Squrkey said:


> Anyone have recommendations on *creams and stuff to prevent chaffing *etc.?


Based on my experiences, talking to others and reading posts here on RBR, most don't use creams or similar to _prevent _chaffing. They use those types of products 'as needed'.

Wearing well designed, well fitting cycling attire goes a long way in prevention, but to answer your question, along with tlg's suggestion, some swear by Vaseline. Much cheaper than Butt Butter.


----------



## tatatirot

hello everyone,
i am still looking to purchase my first road bike, my fitness level is beginner i am 35 years old.. can i just buy the cheapest aluminum bike frame for the moment use it for a year until my fitness level improve or buy the aluminum frame with tiagra/105 components as my 1st road bike.how long is 
my goal is to join group rides and maybe sometime enter a race.
thanks and hoping for your input guys.


----------



## SolitaryRider

Hmmmm....all this talk about attire has me wondering: As a noob, thus far I've only been wearing regular everyday street shorts and a day-glo T-shirt from Tractor Supply.... Doing +/-10 mile rides 5 days a week, with no problems.... I'm planning on getting some real bike shorts and a jersey or two, mainly just for looks....but I'm wondering if doing so will make me even more comfortable...or if it will create problems that don't currently exist?(Ya know, kinda like "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!")

And to CGAJ: In case you haven't figured it out yet (and the others seemed to have overlooked it- perhaps because it is too obvious) make a water bottle and water bottle cage your VERY first purchase! I forgot to take my bottle with me yesterday...what a difference! I had to cut my ride short. Even just a few sips of water makes a huge difference- especially on a hot day. I got insulated Camelback bottles on Ebay for c. $11, and cheap aluminum (but nice-looking) cages....and they are absolutely the most indispensable and best accessories I've bought!


----------



## NJBiker72

SolitaryRider said:


> Hmmmm....all this talk about attire has me wondering: As a noob, thus far I've only been wearing regular everyday street shorts and a day-glo T-shirt from Tractor Supply.... Doing +/-10 mile rides 5 days a week, with no problems.... I'm planning on getting some real bike shorts and a jersey or two, mainly just for looks....but I'm wondering if doing so will make me even more comfortable...or if it will create problems that don't currently exist?(Ya know, kinda like "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!")
> 
> And to CGAJ: In case you haven't figured it out yet (and the others seemed to have overlooked it- perhaps because it is too obvious) make a water bottle and water bottle cage your VERY first purchase! I forgot to take my bottle with me yesterday...what a difference! I had to cut my ride short. Even just a few sips of water makes a huge difference- especially on a hot day. I got insulated Camelback bottles on Ebay for c. $11, and cheap aluminum (but nice-looking) cages....and they are absolutely the most indispensable and best accessories I've bought!


10 miles probably does not require shorts but can't hurt. Jerseys are more convenience IMO. It is nice to have pockets on the back.


----------



## newbieannie

Friends suggested riding shorts when I bought the road bike. The padding is in the shorts and not the seat. I couldn't imagine riding my Fuji Road bike without them. Of course, the only ones that fit right were the really expensive ones.


----------



## PJ352

tatatirot said:


> hello everyone,
> i am still looking to purchase my first road bike, my fitness level is beginner i am 35 years old.. can i just buy the cheapest aluminum bike frame for the moment use it for a year until my fitness level improve or buy the aluminum frame with tiagra/105 components as my 1st road bike.how long is
> my goal is to join group rides and maybe sometime enter a race.
> thanks and hoping for your input guys.


There are advantages and disadvantages to either course, but IMO you should first focus on buying where you'll get sizing/ fit assistance - a reputable LBS. Fit is _always_ important, but given that you're a beginner, are 35 and looking to do longer rides and possibly race, it's even more important that you get it right.

To start the process, I suggest visiting some LBS's, discussing your price range, intended uses and get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest. Test ride a few (out on the roads) to get a feel for the fit, ride and handling. If it turns out that you can afford a slightly upgraded bike over another, as long as you stay with the sport (and no one can predict that), I think you'll be happy with your decision. 

Bottom line, though. I'd rather ride a well fitting bike with downgraded components over an ill fitting bike with upgraded components, so take that for what it's worth. 

HTH....


----------



## SolitaryRider

NJBiker72 said:


> 10 miles probably does not require shorts but can't hurt. Jerseys are more convenience IMO. It is nice to have pockets on the back.


Now I'm often doing 15 miles, and I don't know if it's the heat and humidity that recently arrived or what...but I'm feeling the beginnings of a little chafing on my chooch- guess it might be time for those shorts..... (A few weeks ago, during a cold spell, I made the mistake of riding in denim jeans....that was not a good idea!)


----------



## NJBiker72

SolitaryRider said:


> Now I'm often doing 15 miles, and I don't know if it's the heat and humidity that recently arrived or what...but I'm feeling the beginnings of a little chafing on my chooch- guess it might be time for those shorts..... (A few weeks ago, during a cold spell, I made the mistake of riding in denim jeans....that was not a good idea!)


Shorts don't have to cost much and what you like is personal. IOW, what I like may not be your choice.

But for what it's worth, my favorites are Descente. Look for them online at a discount. 

Canari is also good and reasonably priced. Usually available at Sports Authority or on line. I am not a fan of Performance.


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> *Now I'm often doing 15 miles*, and I don't know if it's the heat and humidity that recently arrived or what...but I'm feeling the beginnings of a little chafing on my chooch- guess it might be time for those shorts..... (A few weeks ago, during a cold spell, I made the mistake of riding in denim jeans....that was not a good idea!)


Good for you! :thumbsup:

Re: the chaffing, do a search on *bicycle butt butter* and you'll get hits on a few different items. Rather than pay the price for specific use products, some here just use Vaseline, apparently with good results.

Re: the shorts, I agree with NJBiker72 that they don't have to cost a lot. Finding your 'personal fit' is key. 

FWIW, I just started wearing Performance Century shorts, but it's too early to tell. I suspect they're ok for shorter rides, but maybe not so ok for longer ones.

EDIT: I just noticed where you mentioned getting insulated Camelbak bottles. Great product, IMHO.


----------



## tlg

PJ352 said:


> Rather than pay the price for specific use products, some here just use Vaseline, apparently with good results.


Diaper rash cream is another option.



> FWIW, I just started wearing Performance Century shorts, but it's too early to tell. I suspect they're ok for shorter rides, but maybe not so ok for longer ones.


I've used various Performnace shorts. All have good quality. Their chamois is as good as other much more expensive brands. They're ok for shorter rides. 
But my personal favorite is the Performance Century Gel II Shorts. OMG these are awesome! The gel pad doesn't compress over time like chamois pads. My first pair is 2yrs old. I bought a 2nd pair last year. The pad looked identical even after a year of use. I'll probably get a 3rd pair shortly.


----------



## 2fun

I'm looking at buying a road bike myself. Just took a MTN bike on a 20 mile ride with friends who have nice road bikes. I couldn't believe how badly my legs were cramping up at the end of that ride! 

Doesn't help that I hadn't sat on a bike in over three years either!


----------



## 2fun

Also, I'm 6'1"

I know the right way to know what size bike for me is to get fitted, but what size frame should I be looking at as a general rule??

Thanks!


----------



## PJ352

2fun said:


> Also, I'm 6'1"
> 
> *I know the right way to know what size bike for me is to get fitted*, but what size frame should I be looking at as a general rule??
> 
> Thanks!


There are no industry standards for measuring to determine frame sizes, rendering the number affixed to a frame essentially arbitrary. One brands 56 is anothers 58, so you had it right the first time. Visit LBS's, discuss your price range, intended uses and let them recommend some makes models. Once sized/ fitted to them, head out on test rides to compare fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there.

BTW, I've seen riders around your height riding anything from a 54 to a 58cm+, so (again) don't place too much importance on that number.


----------



## tlg

2fun said:


> Just took a MTN bike on a 20 mile ride with friends who have nice road bikes. I couldn't believe how badly my legs were cramping up at the end of that ride!


For $25 you could put a set of road tires on your MTB. You'll be AMAZED at how much faster you'll go. 
Forté Metro-K Road and MTB Tires - Mountain Bike Tires


----------



## SolitaryRider

2fun said:


> Also, I'm 6'1"
> 
> I know the right way to know what size bike for me is to get fitted, but what size frame should I be looking at as a general rule??
> 
> Thanks!


Use this Fit Calculator - Competitive Cyclist in conjunction with the manufacturer's frame geometry charts.




PJ352 said:


> Rather than pay the price for specific use products, some here just use Vaseline, apparently with good results.
> 
> .


I never thought at any point in my life I would have to say "I need vaseline for my ass"..... But I'd definitely try the vaseline first. (Luckily the chafing hasn't progressed....but instead seems to be goping away, so it likely won't even be an issue)

And yes, gotta love these Camelbak bottles! Without a doubt, they have been the best accessory, bar none!


----------



## Saiello1234

*Advice?*

I'm looking to purchase a new, first bike for myself. I intend to ride the bike on the road and on a 'greenway' which is close to our house. The greenway is a combination boardwalk and concrete with possibly some hard packed trails. I'd also like to occasionally attach a trailer to the bike for my 2yr old daughter. And, I'd also like to possibly ride the bike in a sprint triathlon. 

So far I've looked at:
1). Scott Metrix 40
2). Marin Muirwoods
3). Giant Escape 2

The most comfortable has been the Giant, but I'm just not sure I'm buying the best possible bike. I think the kind of bike I'm looking at is best because of the different ways in which I plan on riding it. But, are the options above some good options for the type of bike and a price around $400-600?

Any advice would be great...


----------



## NJBiker72

Saiello1234 said:


> I'm looking to purchase a new, first bike for myself. I intend to ride the bike on the road and on a 'greenway' which is close to our house. The greenway is a combination boardwalk and concrete with possibly some hard packed trails. I'd also like to occasionally attach a trailer to the bike for my 2yr old daughter. And, I'd also like to possibly ride the bike in a sprint triathlon.
> 
> So far I've looked at:
> 1). Scott Metrix 40
> 2). Marin Muirwoods
> 3). Giant Escape 2
> 
> The most comfortable has been the Giant, but I'm just not sure I'm buying the best possible bike. I think the kind of bike I'm looking at is best because of the different ways in which I plan on riding it. But, are the options above some good options for the type of bike and a price around $400-600?
> 
> Any advice would be great...


Not familiar with those models but all good companies. I do like Giant in particular abduction think they tend to be good values. Among my bikes is an old Giant Sedona which I ride with the kids. That's it though. The rest of the rides are on road bikes. 

So that is my question to you? How much of each of those things fo you plan on doing? 

You can fit wider tires on some road bikes for riding on a boardwalk. And you can put two sided clipless pedals on a road bike for riding with kids/family/beach. 

It may cost more but May be worth it if you are doing a lot of road riding.


----------



## SolitaryRider

As a noob with a road bike, I find these road bikes to be quite versatile. Lots of dirt/gravel roads where I live- and while my 25mm tires may not be ideal for such surfaces...with a little care, I have no problem. I got a road bike because I do the majority of my riding on paved roads- and these bikes really shine for that..... My modus operandi was to get the type of bike that is best suited to the tyupe of riding I'd be doing most. Bikes (or just about anything else) that try to be suitable for all things...are usually really good at nothing. Get a bike that will do the one thing that you'll be doing the most...really well.


----------



## PedalFasterJonathan

SolitaryRider said:


> Lots of dirt/gravel roads where I live- and while my 25mm tires may not be ideal for such surfaces...with a little care, I have no problem.


If you have the clearance, you can fit cyclocross tires on your road bike and they are even more stable on and off road.


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> As a noob with a road bike, I find these road bikes to be quite versatile. Lots of dirt/gravel roads where I live- and while my 25mm tires may not be ideal for such surfaces...with a little care, I have no problem. I got a road bike because I do the majority of my riding on paved roads- and these bikes really shine for that..... My modus operandi was to* get the type of bike that is best suited to the tyupe of riding I'd be doing most. Bikes (or just about anything else) that try to be suitable for all things...are usually really good at nothing. Get a bike that will do the one thing that you'll be doing the most...really well.*


Good advice, IMHO.



PedalFasterJonathan said:


> *If you have the clearance*, you can fit cyclocross tires on your road bike and they are even more stable on and off road.


With most road bikes, that's a BIG 'IF'. IME most have clearance for up to ~25c's, no more.

But beyond that, whether a tire is more 'stable' in certain conditions depends on a number of factors other than size - mainly tread design/ intended use. As SR noted, when something's suitable for all things, it's usually really good at nothing. So IMO/E it's best to choose/ set up a bike for the riders _primary_ uses, thus avoiding the unnecessary compromises.


----------



## tysonwl

*Help!*

Hi everyone!

I am looking to buy the bike described below for around 400 dollars. I am super new to this so I am not really sure how to assess a bike like this. I am 6'2 so I think the 23 inch frame should be good but other than that I have no idea if this bike is worth the money or not. Any help would be very much appreciated. Thank you. 

Wheels are COSMIC PRO MAVIC; Rubber is new: 700x23 Race Lite B with Hard Case Triple Puncture Protection; Gears are Shimano Integra. The 23" frame is a Columbus; The bike weighs 10kg; Foot cleats are LOOK PP237; 2 front gears and 9 rear gears.


----------



## cyclintruckin

This is a good thread to keep alive. I know I still have lots to learn, but to some up a new ride is to determine what type of riding you are going to be doing 80% of the time. While even myself thinks it would be cool to have a full on road bike it is probably not my best choice. The great thing about cycling is you can buy one bike and thru the great sum of aftermarket parts build into something completely different. While some make think this is silly, It can make sense. Just like building anything start with a good foundation, game plan your build. What do you like about your ride ? What don't you like ? Some components can be upgraded easily and affordably. IE: Stems, Bars, Seatpost, even Carbon forks can be gotten relatively cheap on ebay or amazon, shop around ! I know for some only the best most expensive will do and that is great if you can afford it. The important thing is to get a good reliable ride and well........RIDE !


----------



## PJ352

cyclintruckin said:


> This is a good thread to keep alive. I know I still have lots to learn, but to some up a new ride is to determine what type of riding you are going to be doing 80% of the time. While even myself thinks it would be cool to have a full on road bike it is probably not my best choice. *The great thing about cycling is you can buy one bike and thru the great sum of aftermarket parts build into something completely different. While some make think this is silly, It can make sense. *Just like building anything start with a good foundation, game plan your build. What do you like about your ride ? What don't you like ? Some components can be upgraded easily and affordably. IE: Stems, Bars, Seatpost, even Carbon forks can be gotten relatively cheap on ebay or amazon, shop around ! I know for some only the best most expensive will do and that is great if you can afford it. The important thing is to get a good reliable ride and well........RIDE !


Depending on how you mean "build into something completely different", your plan could either make sense or be silly.

For example, some hybrids make decent drop bar conversions, some don't. Depends on the geo, mostly. So if someone were to say they liked riding the roads but wanted to convert their hybrid to a drop bar bike, the results (mainly handling) may not be all they hoped for, and the conversion investment pretty much lost. 

OTOH, if someone were to buy a 6-7 year old, good quality entry level bike and wanted to upgrade portions of it to better tailor it to their needs (gearing/ drivetrain, being one example), as long as they kept the bike awhile or were able to transfer the parts to a new bike (reinstalling the old) that may be a worthwhile venture. BUT... I don't see this last scenario as transforming a bike into something completely different. 

If one is looking to upgrade fairly soon after purchasing, they're generally better off buying THAT bike to begin with, hedging their bet that they'll stay with the sport (assuming they're noobs). Bikes lose about 1/3 their value when they leave the LBS and most upgrades don't appreciably raise the price of the bike at resale.


----------



## SolitaryRider

PJ352 said:


> . Bikes loose about 1/3 their value when they leave the LBS and most upgrades don't appreciably raise the price of the bike at resale.


And not to mention that often one can buy a complete quality bike for what they'd pay for just a few components, separately.


----------



## piwakit

Ok- I think I have read throught the majority of this thread and have selected two bikes- and just wanted your opnions- I have learned a ton here and there are a lot of really knowledgable people posting so I thought id take the plunge and just ask...

I have not ridden a bike in over 20 years... My last bike was a panasonic 10speed- so you get the idea of how long ago that was- I used to love riding and would love to capture the glory days of my former passion. I am waayyy out of shape and was hoping this would help jump start me back to a fitness routine. (doing something for fun versus going to the gym) 

I am training for my first triathalon in over 20 years as well. so I am really prompted to buy a bike for training- although im not sure I will fall in love with the sport of Triathalons, I will want to use the bike for tooling around town, and just getting out in nature.. 

I went to bikes direct and researched the heck out of bikes- but Im not quite sure I want to put it together or know what size to get... so I have kind of ruled out online or even craigslist due to not knowing fitting and not knowing if its in good shape or not... it would cost me $75 for a good fit locally, and not sure how much a tune up would be- So I have decided to got to a LBS and have them do that all rolled into the price of the bike..

I first went to Cycle Spectrum (the same owners who own Bikesdirect) and although I didn't get a warm fuzzy They do sizing and maintenence for the life of the bike, he recomended a Motebecane record: 

Frame Kinesis Double Butted 7K Series Aluminum, 2xH2O mounts, replaceable rear derailleur hanger 
Fork Kinesis StraightBlade 12K CARBON Fiber 1.125 inch steerer 
Crankset FSA Vero Aluminum arms, triple ring 52/42/30T 
Bottom Bracket Sealed cartridge, square taper 
Pedals Platform pedals included
(Clipless pedals Not Included. Want some? Go to BikeIsland.com - Bicycle Parts, Accessories and Clothing at Affordable Prices with Free Shipping[/url], they have free shipping) 
Front Derailleur Shimano Triple FD2203 
Rear Derailleur Shimano Sora 3400 8 speed (24 gears total) 
Shifters Shimano Triple 2203 STI 8 speed (24 gears total) 
(integrated w/ brake levers) 
Cassette/Freewheel Cassette 12-28T or 12-25T (no choice) 8 speed (24 gears total) 
Chain KMC IG 8spd 
Hubs Skye Systeme aluminum, Black finish with Quick Release 
Spokes Stainless Steel 
Rims Alex DA22 Double Wall aluminum with machined brake track 
Tires Continental UltraSport 700c, presta valve tubes 
Brakes Tektro R530 Aluminum black finish 
Brake Levers Shimano 2203 (integrated with shift levers) 
Handlebar Skye Systeme Aluminum alloy black, 26.0mm 
Stem Skye Systeme Aluminum alloy threadless, 1.125", 26.0mm clamp 
Tape/Grip Black cork 
Saddle Skye Systeme Racing 
Seat Post Skye Systeme Aluminum alloy Micro Adjust 27.2mm 
Seat Clamp Machined Aluminum Alloy with bolt 
Sizes 48cm, 50 cm, 52 cm, 54cm, 56 cm, 58 cm, 60cm, 62cm, 64cm 
These size just like Trek and Fuji road bikes - center of bb to top of seat tube. 

I also went to 3 other LBSs and the other one that DID give me a warm fuzzy and has free sizing and adjustments for 6 months is: Giant Women's Escape 1

Specification Description 
Frame Giant ALUXX aluminum 
Fork Aluminum 
Rims/Wheels Giant aluminum 
Hubs Aluminum 
Spokes Stainless-steel 
Tires Giant S-X2 w/puncture protection, 700 x 32c 
Crankset Shimano 
Chainwheel 48/38/28 
Front Derailleur Shimano 
Rear Derailleur SRAM X4 
Rear Cogs SRAM PG830, 8-speed: 11-32 
Shifters SRAM X4 trigger 
Handlebars Giant Sport 
Stem Giant Sport 
Brake Levers Tektro 3-finger 
Brakes Aluminum, linear-pull 
Pedals Resin platform 
Saddle Giant Sport Women's, multi-density 
Seat Post Giant Sport 

These are both around $500 - honestly I would love to spend less, but I want a decent bike in case I get really into it. Ive also thought about just getting denali as a test bike to see if ill even like it again- but I want a decent bike to ride and am afraid if I get a heavy bike Ill hate it... I am open to any other suggestions as well. Thoughts?


----------



## PedalFasterJonathan

piwakit said:


> Thoughts?


The Motobecane has drop bars, the Giant looks to have flat bars; which you prefer? If you don't know, test ride some at shops...

Is the Motobecane even available? It's shown as sold one on bikesdirect website...?

I say get the Motobecane, they are typically better deals and this seems to be the case here too.

Double-check that the shop actually does do maint for the life of the bike (what is their definition of "life of the bike" and "maintenance", are we talking yearly tune-ups or also smaller things like oiling the chain and changing flats?). This could be a great deal for someone like yourself who is not familiar with wrenching on bikes and can save you a bit of money in the long run.


----------



## piwakit

Actually - I like the flat bar options which is why I am drawn to the giant- but will learn to live with the road bike handle bars. 

I am not sure which year the motobecane is- I do know they had plenty in stock. and I had asked about the service - and they said yes tune ups etc... for the life of the bike... It just seems to good to be true... the website says: We offer FREE SERVICE FOR LIFE ON EVERY SINGLE BICYCLE WE SELL! 
This can save you hundreds of dollars throughout the life of your bicycle.

The bike shop itself has had bad reviews on Yelp- about the guys there being jerks, but im never sure if it is a bunch a few disgruntled people. I didn't get the warm fuzzy there- but the deal seems really really good....


----------



## DnnyLLama

*Fuji Newest 1.0*

What's everyone's thought's about this bike?

Seems like a descent entry level bike. Please do share

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1094284_-1___


----------



## PJ352

deleted.. posted in error.


----------



## PJ352

PedalFasterJonathan said:


> *Double-check that the shop actually does...* are we talking yearly tune-ups or also smaller things like oiling the chain and *changing flats?*).


IMO depending on your LBS to repair flats is ludicrous. Anyone that rides a bike should know how to repair a flat.


----------



## PJ352

piwakit said:


> Actually - I like the flat bar options which is why I am drawn to the giant- but will learn to live with the road bike handle bars.
> 
> I am not sure which year the motobecane is- I do know they had plenty in stock. and I had asked about the service - and they said yes tune ups etc... for the life of the bike... It just seems to good to be true... the website says: We offer FREE SERVICE FOR LIFE ON EVERY SINGLE BICYCLE WE SELL!
> This can save you hundreds of dollars throughout the life of your bicycle.
> 
> The bike shop itself has had bad reviews on Yelp- about the guys there being jerks, but im never sure if it is a bunch a few disgruntled people. I didn't get the warm fuzzy there- but the deal seems really really good....


IMO/E the two most important things to keep in mind are getting a bike that suites your intended uses and getting sizing right. During this process, shopping for shops you like and want to deal with should be near the top of the list, because they'll assist you with those two critical points - and more.

As far as the 'best deal', I suggest looking at the bigger picture, considering not only specific bikes of interest/ price, but also the value added services reputable shops offer. Long term, I think you'll be happy to have chosen a shop that you can depend on.

Lastly, you may be trying a little too hard to like the shop you don't, to justify the purchase. Chances are, if you (and others, apparently) don't like dealing with them now, that feeling will grow with time and you'll be looking for a better shop.


----------



## tatatirot

got my giant SCR2.. an entry level road bike! thanking you guys for all the info!!!


----------



## Josh P

Hi everyone. I am a newb road rider. I used to MTB avidly but I got out of it after a while and started using it for a commuter. Eventually I quit doing that but I want to start back up again with a dedicated road bike. I have been reading around on here trying to learn as much as I can. I went to the LBS and they only had two brands. Cannondale and Raleigh. The Cannondale was a Synapse 5 and they wanted 1300 for it. That's out of my price range which is somewhat negotiable but I would like to stay around 7-800. On the local CL there is a 2010 Scott S3 for 750 OBO and it is my size (56 cm). Would this bike make for a good beginning road bike? I saw where someone suggested asking the seller to meet you at a LBS to see if it will fit. As far as the requirements of the bike go my commute is 9.4 miles each way but I will also use the bike to go for longer stuff and hopefull some day decent distances.


----------



## PJ352

Josh P said:


> Hi everyone. I am a newb road rider. I used to MTB avidly but I got out of it after a while and started using it for a commuter. Eventually I quit doing that but I want to start back up again with a dedicated road bike. I have been reading around on here trying to learn as much as I can. I went to the LBS and they only had two brands. Cannondale and Raleigh. The Cannondale was a Synapse 5 and they wanted 1300 for it. That's out of my price range which is somewhat negotiable but I would like to stay around 7-800. *On the local CL there is a 2010 Scott S3 for 750 OBO and it is my size (56 cm). Would this bike make for a good beginning road bike? I saw where someone suggested asking the seller to meet you at a LBS to see if it will fit.* As far as the requirements of the bike go my commute is 9.4 miles each way but I will also use the bike to go for longer stuff and hopefull some day decent distances.


I could be mistaken, but I think the correct model designation is Scott Speedster S30. 

Good idea asking the seller to bring it to the LBS of your choice, both to assess mechanical condition as well as fit. There may be a nominal fee, but IMO it's worthwhile given this sizable investment. 

If the LBS is ok with sizing and overall mechanical condition (and assuming I have the model right), I think once fit is tweaked for you, the bike will meet your intended uses.

Just curious why you aren't pursuing Raleighs?


----------



## Josh P

PJ352 said:


> I could be mistaken, but I think the correct model designation is Scott Speedster S30.
> 
> Good idea asking the seller to bring it to the LBS of your choice, both to assess mechanical condition as well as fit. There may be a nominal fee, but IMO it's worthwhile given this sizable investment.
> 
> If the LBS is ok with sizing and overall mechanical condition (and assuming I have the model right), I think once fit is tweaked for you, the bike will meet your intended uses.
> 
> Just curious why you aren't pursuing Raleighs?


No good reason really.Should I be? How do they compare with the other offerings? I had a couple of their MTB offerings over the years and they were decent low to mid level stuff.
You are right on the Scott being a Speedster S30. Thanks for the reply.


----------



## PJ352

Josh P said:


> *No good reason really.Should I be?* How do they compare with the other offerings? I had a couple of their MTB offerings over the years and they were decent low to mid level stuff.
> You are right on the Scott being a Speedster S30. Thanks for the reply.


If some Raleigh's of interest are in your price range I would say yes. Nice bikes in their respective price ranges. And there are some advantages in buying new - namely getting sizing/ fit assistance from the shop along with a warranty. Many offer discounts on accessories and post purchase tuning/ fit assistance.

That's not to say the Scott (or another used bike) isn't a possibility, but used means many unknowns, like the history of the bike (hard use/ crashes), mechanical condition, etc.


----------



## Josh P

PJ352 said:


> If some Raleigh's of interest are in your price range I would say yes. Nice bikes in their respective price ranges. And there are some advantages in buying new - namely getting sizing/ fit assistance from the shop along with a warranty. Many offer discounts on accessories and post purchase tuning/ fit assistance.
> 
> That's not to say the Scott (or another used bike) isn't a possibility, but used means many unknowns, like the history of the bike (hard use/ crashes), mechanical condition, etc.


I will check them out thanks
Edit: I originally thought of trying to get the best frame I could afford and then upgrading components when I get better at cycling. Is this the way to go or should I just buy a bike at a certain level and trade it for something better later?


----------



## firstbike

Please help
I saw one TREK JETTA 18in trek vw limited edition w 21spd alum bike. Is this good for commute. I am new to bike commute.


----------



## tlg

firstbike said:


> Please help
> I saw one TREK JETTA 18in trek vw limited edition w 21spd alum bike. Is this good for commute. I am new to bike commute.


What's the sell price?
What's the condition?
What kind of commute do you plan on doing?

Does it look like this?
Small Trek campus hybrid w blackburn commute rack
Rare TREK 7005 vw Limited Edition 21" Mountain Bike | eBay


----------



## firstbike

sell price is 275.
Need to see the bike tis weekend. But yes the ad you mentioned is the one.
16 mile commute every day.
Please suggest any good bike. I am willing to spend about 350$.


----------



## tlg

firstbike said:


> sell price is 275.
> Need to see the bike tis weekend. But yes the ad you mentioned is the one.
> 16 mile commute every day.
> Please suggest any good bike. I am willing to spend about 350$.


First off, that bike is a mountain/hybrid bike. Not particularly best for a road commute but would suffice for a short 16mi commute (round trip?). Notice in those two links I sent, one bike has slick road tires. The other has knobby off road tires. Which does the bike you're interested in have? You'd really want road tires for a commute. So if they're not included, figure you're going to want to invest in some new tires.

That bike is 13yrs old so it's kinda up there in age and out dated. I think $275 is too much. If it's in very good condition $150-$200.
The "VW limited edition" is really meaningless. They're available all over the internet. It was a marketing gimic VW and Trek had in 1999. Buy a VW and get a free bike. And it wasn't a high end bike they were giving away.


----------



## stachattack

great thread


----------



## TexBs

The following adage will always hold true; Your dream bike will always go on sale, or become available on Craigslist, the week after you settled and bought your second choice.


----------



## kybrad

Hello, I am looking to buy my first bike and found one on Craigs List that I like, but can't find much info on it. He says it is a 2008 Airborne, I think it is older. He is asking $550, I think it is worth $250 tops. Does any one have some advice about this bike? Thanks.

This is my first post so it won't let me add link or image, but bike is on CL in Charleston SC under *Airborne 56 cm Road Bike Dura Ace/Ultegra - $550 (West Ashley)*


----------



## PJ352

kybrad said:


> Hello, I am looking to buy my first bike and found one on Craigs List that I like, but can't find much info on it. He says it is a 2008 Airborne, I think it is older. He is asking $550, I think it is worth $250 tops. Does any one have some advice about this bike? Thanks.
> 
> This is my first post so it won't let me add link or image, but bike is on CL in Charleston SC under *Airborne 56 cm Road Bike Dura Ace/Ultegra - $550 (West Ashley)*


I don't know much about Airbornes, but it looks to be a well maintained bike. You're right that it's older and I don't think you're too far off on price. 

As is the case of most sellers, they accentuate the positives and sidestep potential negatives. In other words, I wouldn't be surprised if those shifters hadn't seem a fair amount of use. When the time came, replacement cost (even at the Sora level) would add another ~50% to your investment. 

I'd say check it out (ideally bringing someone along that knew both bike mechanics and fit), test ride it and go from there. Play in any bearing assemblies (hubs/ crankset/ headset) means either wear or an adjustment is needed.

Lastly, but most importantly, you want the most for your money, but if the bike doesn't fit, it's not a good value. So make sure it fits/ feels good on the test ride. That goes for any bike - new or used.


----------



## kybrad

Thanks PJ. Unfortunately the guy is sticking at $500 so it looks I'm still searching.


----------



## PJ352

kybrad said:


> Thanks PJ. Unfortunately the guy is sticking at $500 so it looks I'm still searching.


That's ok. There are a lot of bikes out there.


----------



## pete210

reading all these with great interest. I am in the market, and about all I've done is settle on 'road' vs hybrid, finally. The lead contender for my dollars as it stands is a Fuji Roubaix with 105 all 'round that will run about $1K new. Carbon fork, I don't remember what wheels/brakes it has, and I'm honestly not sure how much it matters since it'll be a while before I'm good enough to realize any benefit from upgrading. I did ride a few different bikes, and the 105-equipped ones felt better on shifting. I have ridden a few different sizes, and at least in Fuji, 54 seems to be the best fit. Looked at Trek, but with the same 105's it was $450 more. Aside from fit, which I've gotten the message about, any other considerations, in order of importance, to consider? Budget is $1K, but can be stretched, somewhat. In terms of specs, (which are just numbers on paper, I know), the Fuji seems to be best bang for buck so far....TIA


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> reading all these with great interest. I am in the market, and about all I've done is settle on 'road' vs hybrid, finally. The lead contender for my dollars as it stands is a Fuji Roubaix with 105 all 'round that will run about $1K new. Carbon fork, I don't remember what wheels/brakes it has, and I'm honestly not sure how much it matters since it'll be a while before I'm good enough to realize any benefit from upgrading. I did ride a few different bikes, and the 105-equipped ones felt better on shifting. I have ridden a few different sizes, and at least in Fuji, 54 seems to be the best fit. Looked at Trek, but with the same 105's it was $450 more. Aside from fit, which I've gotten the message about, any other considerations, in order of importance, to consider? Budget is $1K, but can be stretched, somewhat. In terms of specs, (which are just numbers on paper, I know), the Fuji seems to be best bang for buck so far....TIA


Seems to me you're doing things right. Considering the importance of fit, test riding bikes of interest and whittling the field. 

If you aren't already doing so, shop for shops along with bikes, because a good shop is a valuable resource - now and in the future. 

The only other consideration I can think of is gearing, which should match your fitness and terrain. When in doubt, opt for a triple crankset and if you ever need to 'tweak' to your needs, you can do so at the rear, with a different cassette. Next best would be a compact crankset, usually 50/34.

As to budget, I think you're in a good range for a first bike. Given the price of the Fuji, I'm assuming you're dealing with a Performance shop. If so, I have no firsthand experience, but they seem to have a rep that some are better than others. So, I'd refer back to the "shop for shops" advice.


----------



## pete210

I did start at a Performance shop, and they had good options in the flat bar category, but the Roubaix I found was at a local indy shop. Interestingly, the nomenclature wasn't the same as on Fuji's site for current bikes, they have 1.0, 2.0, or 3.0, so maybe it's an old model? The sales guy looked at the $1200 price tag and said they could probably do $1K as well, so maybe a year or so NOS? I don't care about that, though. 
Interesting that you mention a 3 ring front...i thought that was frowned on? The sales guy told me that although it would help in early stages of getting in shape, it would become redundant quickly.


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> I did start at a Performance shop, and they had good options in the flat bar category, but the Roubaix I found was at a local indy shop. Interestingly, the nomenclature wasn't the same as on Fuji's site for current bikes, they have 1.0, 2.0, or 3.0, so maybe it's an old model? The sales guy looked at the $1200 price tag and said they could probably do $1K as well, so maybe a year or so NOS? I don't care about that, though.
> Interesting that you mention a 3 ring front...i thought that was frowned on? The sales guy told me that although it would help in early stages of getting in shape, it would become redundant quickly.


Without knowing more about the bike, I can't really comment on the year. Besides the all important fit issue, I think the bottom line is if it's priced right and you get a warranty, the year doesn't really matter - as long as you're going to keep the bike a few years.

Triples have their proponents and dissenters. I think the best way to approach the gearing question is objectively, using fitness and terrain as the main criteria. If that means a triple would best suite your needs, so be it. If not (as I mentioned) a compact is a compromise. 

I don't agree that a triples gearing will become redundant, but I do think as your fitness improves there's a chance you'll use the lowest gears less. But at least in the early stages of building fitness, they'll be there if/ when needed.

All that aside, I'd be interested to know if the LBS had a triple in the model your interested in. If not, this may be a case of the sales person offering a perceived disadvantage of a product they don't have.

Just to clarify, I'm not pushing the triple. What I'm saying is that you gearing should match your fitness/ terrain. Not 6 months or a year from now, but now. So I suggest proceeding accordingly.

To decide for yourself, the best method might be to test ride bikes on the roads you'll be riding. If, when climbing, you're in the inner ring of a triple and the largest rear cog, that might be an indication that a triple is for you.


----------



## pete210

That was my original thinking,- I'm out of shape, and there are hills, so granny-gears would be a plus. I'm not seeing much offered in the bikes/budget with a triple crank, but would that be an opportunity to tinker? I do love tinkering, or is it a case of compromise on the 105 frt/rr/shifter combo to get something with the triple crank, or would a compact 2 wheel get me close enough? It's just math, right? Ratios? Or keep searching for a bike that is equipped as I want? I don't know enough about how the industry works to know if the setup I want is an option. It seems triple cranks only come on slightly lower end bikes from what I've seen so far?

BTW, I REALLY appreciate the time you're taking to guide me!


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> That was my original thinking,- I'm out of shape, and there are hills, so granny-gears would be a plus. I'm not seeing much offered in the bikes/budget with a triple crank, but would that be an opportunity to tinker? I do love tinkering, or is it a case of compromise on the 105 frt/rr/shifter combo to get something with the triple crank, or would a compact 2 wheel get me close enough? It's just math, right? Ratios? Or keep searching for a bike that is equipped as I want? I don't know enough about how the industry works to know if the setup I want is an option. It seems triple cranks only come on slightly lower end bikes from what I've seen so far?
> 
> BTW, I REALLY appreciate the time you're taking to guide me!


I agree that there's a move towards compact cranks with all but lower end bikes. My opinion, it's due in part because of the stigma attached to triples (hard to adjust/ granny gears), but I'm of the mind that they do have their place. My SO's hybrid is equipped with one and I think in the 4 years she's had it, I've adjusted it twice. Both times requiring very minor adjustments.

As far as tinkering, yes, going with a compact and moving to a triple gives you that opportunity. Trouble is it'll also give you the opportunity to spend a fair amount of money doing so, because you'll need a new left shifter, front and rear derailleurs and longer chain. All in all, not worth the trouble/ expense.

But to answer your question, it comes down to math, ratios and gear inches. Still, getting to those needed ratios/ gear inches is done mechanically via chainrings/ cogs.

If a triple is something you're hellbent on, I'm sure continuing your search will yield results. As an alternative, you could search out bikes with compact cranksets (usually 50/34) and wider rear gearing, with a low gear ~28-30T. This gets you a compromise with slightly wider ratios between gears which some riders like, others don't, because it can change a riders cadence (I call it rhythm) too much.


----------



## pete210

It's hard for me to hellbent on anything with as little as I know, but I am of two minds - a triple would seem to give me more options, but would I 'really' need those options? Ponder-time.

The LBS answered my email about why that bike wasn't listed in US Fuji catalogs - it was originally intended for Australia, but didn't go there, He said it is set up as a Roubaix 1.0, except Alex wheels and brakes instead of Oval on the US 1.0. Not exactly a problem, I wouldn't think. I'm liking the deal, I just need to finalize my preferences on triple or compact, and put the rest of the cash together - oh, and ride it again in my size - the one they had together was a little small, and I rode the Roubaix 1.0 priced $500 higher in the size I liked, and liked it.

I read the clipless-101 link you posted elsewhere - Am I ok waiting on pedals/shoes a few months, or is that going to hamper my riding a lot - and what does 'float' mean, I didn't see that explained in the thread.


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> It's hard for me to hellbent on anything with as little as I know, but I am of two minds - a triple would seem to give me more options, but would I 'really' need those options? Ponder-time.
> 
> The LBS answered my email about why that bike wasn't listed in US Fuji catalogs - it was originally intended for Australia, but didn't go there, He said it is set up as a Roubaix 1.0, except Alex wheels and brakes instead of Oval on the US 1.0. Not exactly a problem, I wouldn't think. I'm liking the deal, I just need to finalize my preferences on triple or compact, and put the rest of the cash together - oh, and ride it again in my size - the one they had together was a little small, and I rode the Roubaix 1.0 priced $500 higher in the size I liked, and liked it.
> 
> I read the clipless-101 link you posted elsewhere - Am I ok waiting on pedals/shoes a few months, or is that going to hamper my riding a lot - and what does 'float' mean, I didn't see that explained in the thread.


Re: the triple versus compact quandary, the triple offers a lower low (thus, more options), so is there if you need it. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the best way to answer the question of whether or not you NEED the option would be to test ride a bike on the roads you'll be traversing. Note the lowest gear combo you used and that'll provide the answer - at least given your present state of fitness.

Don't fret over waiting to go clipless. There are some benefits to going clipless, but building some base miles and developing the motor (you) will reap greater benefits, so give yourself some time to acclimate to road riding and learn some bike handling skills. When that time comes to go clipless, work with a reputable shop, because cleat set up is an integral part of bike fit, so you want to get it right. 

Pedal float describes the slight side to side (left/ right) heel movement many cleats allow. Many riders feel that it's an advantage during the pedal stroke, but not all like it. It also provides some forgiveness or latitude in cleat set up. 

Bottom line, generally speaking, it's a useful feature and seems to help prevent some knee issues.

Re: your correspondence with the bike shop and the Roubaix... make sure you're sized/ fitted to the bike of interest and test ride it (out on the roads) before committing to the purchase. Fit trumps all else, so it's an understatement to say you need the bike to fit well.


----------



## SolitaryRider

I couldn't live without a triple! ...and I still wish I had a few lower gears. [Very hilly here]


----------



## pete210

Hmm...ok, so now I need to see if I can ride it on the roads around my neighborhood to see if it has enough granny-gears....the key being to be able to keep by legs moving at a good clip to save my knees, right?


----------



## MadonnaSurprise

hey good advise everyone! I'm new to cycling and am about to get my first bike. Any thoughts on a 2001 Trek 2300? saw a good deal for one ($400) on craigslist


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> Hmm...ok, so now I need to see if I can ride it on the roads around my neighborhood to see if it has enough granny-gears....*the key being to be able to keep by legs moving at a good clip to save my knees, right?*


The bold statement nails it. It points up the reason behind getting a good (gearing) match for your fitness/ terrain. Speaking of which, after you get your bike, go find a computer with cadence function. Wired versions like the Cateye Astrale 8 go for around $30.

BTW, you want to change the wording in your post from " ride it on the roads" to "climb the hills"..


----------



## pete210

From my garage door, I can barely ride anywhere BUT up! Everything is hilly. Nothing long or extreme, but definitely not Florida-flat! That will be the only way to know if I need a triple, though. 

You've been really helpful, but now I'm gonna stretch your talents...How to tell the wife she's gonna haveta wait on those hardwood floors, (and the new couch, kitchen remodel.....) I need a bike... :idea:


----------



## Phenomrider007

Hey you all, I finally dropped a deposit on my first road bike! I went in my (NSLB) NOT SO LOCAL BIKE SHOP with a budget just under 3 grand. I wanted a GIANT road bike with a carbon fiber frame and fork, so the model that made the most sinse was GIANT'S low end TCR COMPOSITE road bike. The bike is a 2012 model, red/black/white frame color, cat eye wireless computer, combination of Ultegra & 105 components, carbon fiber cages, saddle tire flat kit and Ultegra clip in peddles. I don't pick up this beauty till AUGUST!


----------



## NJBiker72

SolitaryRider said:


> I couldn't live without a triple! ...and I still wish I had a few lower gears. [Very hilly here]


I did like the option of the triple but when i got a better bike i did not miss it. 

That said one advantage of a triple for a beginner is less shifting upfront. The middle ring provides a relatively wide range of options on its own.


----------



## NJBiker72

Phenomrider007 said:


> Hey you all, I finally dropped a deposit on my first road bike! I went in my (NSLB) NOT SO LOCAL BIKE SHOP with a budget just under 3 grand. I wanted a GIANT road bike with a carbon fiber frame and fork, so the model that made the most sinse was GIANT'S low end TCR COMPOSITE road bike. The bike is a 2012 model, red/black/white frame color, cat eye wireless computer, combination of Ultegra & 105 components, carbon fiber cages, saddle tire flat kit and Ultegra clip in peddles. I don't pick up this beauty till AUGUST!


Why such a long wait??


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> From my garage door, I can barely ride anywhere BUT up! Everything is hilly. Nothing long or extreme, but definitely not Florida-flat! That will be the only way to know if I need a triple, though.
> 
> *You've been really helpful, but now I'm gonna stretch your talents...How to tell the wife she's gonna haveta wait on those hardwood floors, (and the new couch, kitchen remodel.....) I need a bike...* :idea:


Nice try, but I'm not taking the bait. You're on your own with this one....


----------



## hansey13

*Help a newbie out!*

Im buying my first road bike and I need someone to tell me the truth im tired of people trying to sell me on stuff I might not need, im between a couple of bikes, 
#1. 2010 Felt F95 Garmin Edition. Felt super-light 7005 aluminum with carbon forks and seat post. Upraded with Sram spex double-tap components $875
#2 2005 KHS Flite 2000 Dura Ace Flight Deck shifters and brake levers, Dura Ace rear and front deraileur. Ultegra brakes front and rear. FSA carbon cranks. Velomax Circuit Wheelset. $750
#3 2012 Specialized Allez apex mid compact, or any other allez if you dont think sram is worth the extra $$$ trying to stay under $1500 what do you think?
any other suggestions maybe, im 20 yrs old and 6'1-6'2 i was told by my lbs like a 58cm frame
i will be commuting 32 miles round trip on the bike all on paved path most days of the week (weather permitting) , and the occasional cruse with the girlfriend 
thank you!


----------



## NJBiker72

hansey13 said:


> Im buying my first road bike and I need someone to tell me the truth im tired of people trying to sell me on stuff I might not need, im between a couple of bikes,
> #1. 2010 Felt F95 Garmin Edition. Felt super-light 7005 aluminum with carbon forks and seat post. Upraded with Sram spex double-tap components $875
> #2 2005 KHS Flite 2000 Dura Ace Flight Deck shifters and brake levers, Dura Ace rear and front deraileur. Ultegra brakes front and rear. FSA carbon cranks. Velomax Circuit Wheelset. $750
> #3 2012 Specialized Allez apex mid compact, or any other allez if you dont think sram is worth the extra $$$ trying to stay under $1500 what do you think?
> any other suggestions maybe, im 20 yrs old and 6'1-6'2 i was told by my lbs like a 58cm frame
> i will be commuting 32 miles round trip on the bike all on paved path most days of the week (weather permitting) , and the occasional cruse with the girlfriend
> thank you!


Not familiar with Khs but the other two are great and the components on the Khs sound very good at a glance. 

I am biased as I have a Tarmac with Sram Red. It was supposed to come with a mid compact but i had them switch it to a compact. I live by a lot of hills and do not race. Riding on paths and casually you might prefer the same. That said the tarmac climbed better than anything else for me even when tested with the mid. 

I prefer Sram to shimano but that is personal preference. What group is on the allez? 

Overall it is about fit, but if I had to pick on line, I would go with the allez.


----------



## PJ352

hansey13 said:


> Im buying my first road bike and I need someone to tell me the truth im tired of people trying to sell me on stuff I might not need, im between a couple of bikes,
> #1. 2010 Felt F95 Garmin Edition. Felt super-light 7005 aluminum with carbon forks and seat post. Upraded with Sram spex double-tap components $875
> #2 2005 KHS Flite 2000 Dura Ace Flight Deck shifters and brake levers, Dura Ace rear and front deraileur. Ultegra brakes front and rear. FSA carbon cranks. Velomax Circuit Wheelset. $750
> #3 2012 Specialized Allez apex mid compact, or any other allez if you dont think sram is worth the extra $$$ trying to stay under $1500 what do you think?
> any other suggestions maybe, im 20 yrs old and 6'1-6'2 i was told by my lbs like a 58cm frame
> i will be commuting 32 miles round trip on the bike all on paved path most days of the week (weather permitting) , and the occasional cruse with the girlfriend
> thank you!


You don't say much about your cycling background/ experiences, but generally speaking, the bikes listed will suite your intended purposes. If you're open to a slightly more upright riding position and slightly slower (more predictable) steering, you may want to add a couple of relaxed geo bikes to your list. Examples being the Giant Defy and Specialized Secteur, among others.

Even considering the upgrades, I think the Felt is overpriced. New, the MSRP is ~1k, so discounted you are closing in on the $875 and you get a warranty and value added services LBS's provide. When buying used, sellers oftentimes use the term 'upgrades' 1) rather loosely and 2) to justify the price. In reality, they're sometimes spare parts swapped to the bike prepping it for sale, but beyond that they're installed at the sellers discretion and generally don't add much to the value of the bike. 

Between it's age and the fact that it has a materials mixed frame (CF stays bonded to alu) I wouldn't consider the KHS. In the unlikely event of frame (bonding) problems there's no warranty, but more importantly, the shifters already have 7 years of use behind them. With time, STI's wear, aren't repairable, nor are they cheap. And if you decided to replace them with a downgraded model to limit cost, it kind of negates going with a DA bike in the first place.

As with most things, what costs more brings some advantages, and that's where the Allez (or any new bike) enters. You'll get sizing/ fit assistance, a warranty, most likely post-purchase services like tuneups/ tweaks to fit, along with discounted accessories. 

If going for the Allex Apex model is a stretch, I'd strongly suggest taking a look at the Tiagra equipped model. It's a new 10 speed version this year that's modeled after Shimano's 5600 105 group, which was excellent. JMO, but I've ridden both of these back to back and preferred Tiagra, but both groups perform well and should prove durable. The main difference is with shifting technique, so ride both, then decide which you prefer.

Lastly, with drop bar bikes, fit is key, so given your sizable investment, I suggest staying with LBS's - and patronizing those that place importance on both test rides and getting fit right.


----------



## pete210

PJ352 said:


> Nice try, but I'm not taking the bait. You're on your own with this one....



Figured I was pushing it. Seriously, she's happy for me to get a bike, and is just happy I'll be getting exercise. Besides I have brownie points in the bag already. 

Interesting point about the middle ring of the triple offering more versatility, NJBiker72.The LBS with the bike I'm looking at closes right about when I'd get there after work, so Saturday I may pursue the option of riding it on roads like around my house. They are located right across the street from a Greenway where lots of people ride, so maybe I can find hills equivalent to my neighborhood. I'm hopeful the compact will give me all I need, honestly, because the bike itself satisfies my need-for-a-deal, high level components, and budget. Finding a triple with everything else I like is gonna bump me up a lot. I've looked on CL, but not seen much, although I'm not opposed to used, I'm leary.

PJ352, I like the dog, btw


----------



## NJBiker72

pete210 said:


> Figured I was pushing it. Seriously, she's happy for me to get a bike, and is just happy I'll be getting exercise. Besides I have brownie points in the bag already.
> 
> Interesting point about the middle ring of the triple offering more versatility, NJBiker72.The LBS with the bike I'm looking at closes right about when I'd get there after work, so Saturday I may pursue the option of riding it on roads like around my house. They are located right across the street from a Greenway where lots of people ride, so maybe I can find hills equivalent to my neighborhood. I'm hopeful the compact will give me all I need, honestly, because the bike itself satisfies my need-for-a-deal, high level components, and budget. Finding a triple with everything else I like is gonna bump me up a lot. I've looked on CL, but not seen much, although I'm not opposed to used, I'm leary.
> 
> PJ352, I like the dog, btw


Triples probably would not cost you much more. I know a few year ago when I got a Secteur the shop would have sold me a triple at the same price as the compact I ended up with. Usually triples are not available on high end bikes (you may get laughed at - ignore them).


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> Figured I was pushing it. Seriously, she's happy for me to get a bike, and is just happy I'll be getting exercise. Besides I have brownie points in the bag already.
> 
> Interesting point about the middle ring of the triple offering more versatility, NJBiker72.The LBS with the bike I'm looking at closes right about when I'd get there after work, so Saturday I may pursue the option of riding it on roads like around my house. They are located right across the street from a Greenway where lots of people ride, so maybe I can find hills equivalent to my neighborhood. I'm hopeful the compact will give me all I need, honestly, because the bike itself satisfies my need-for-a-deal, high level components, and budget. Finding a triple with everything else I like is gonna bump me up a lot. I've looked on CL, but not seen much, although I'm not opposed to used, I'm leary.
> 
> PJ352, I like the dog, btw


Sounds like your wife has her priorities in order, so kudos to her. :thumbsup:

I think your plan to find some hills in your area and ride the Fuji is a good one, but maybe consider taking a step back and looking a little closer at the bike, it's specs and how it stacks up against some others. I'm not suggesting it's a bad choice by any means, but we never did hone in on just what year/ model it is. 

In the back of my mind, I'm thinking there are some Apex/ Tiagra equipped bikes in your price range that have lower gearing - one with a mid-compact and another with a compact. Where the difference is, is at the rear, going as low as 32T cogs (versus the Fuji's ~25T). And honestly, while 105 is a great groupset, Apex and Tiagra will easily suite your needs. But if you do decide to branch out a little, you have to test ride the bikes, then decide on your preferences.

Thanks for the comment re: my Aussie. She's a great dog, albeit slightly neurotic at times.


----------



## pete210

oops, thought I'd updated on that. The LBS answered my email to say :

The Roubaix you are talking about is not in the current Fuji catalog for North American distribution. These were destined for the Australian market and didn't go there so Fuji offered them at a special cost to us and allowed us to hit a more attractive price point. So yes, when they are gone the price point will not be as attractive for a similar build. We did two size runs on this bike. Fuji is currently out of stock in their Philadelphia warehouse but still show inventory out West. It is hard to say how long they will last.

It is the same build as the Roubaix 1.0 that is the current 2012 model year except it has a different wheelset (Alex instead of Oval) and an FSA crank instead of an Oval crank. FSA is making the Oval crank anyway.

Does that make sense? I must admit, I'm a little hung up on the higher end components from the standpoint of always preferring to have the best I can afford. To get them on any other bikes have been pushing me up to $1500-1600.00. It is new, so warranty is there, and the shop has a good rep for service/help. The only thing to finalize is compact-v-triple on the front. The first bike I rode at a different shop was with 105, then I tried a couple with Tiagra's, and they just didn't feel as good. I have read what you said about not worrying too much about that since it's likely just an adjustment, but it does stick in the head somewhat...Also, I'm not finding many other brands - there's a big Trek store I visited, but that just pushed me more towards the Fuji. I haven't located a Specialized, Giant, or Cannondale dealer in my area yet...they seem to be the brands most often touted here in my end of the market. Trek did mention that they offer different lengths in the...hmm...'head tube?' - where the stem goes - that alters geometry, which sounded interesting, though.

I have a black lab that has us 'owned', and my wife's cocker spaniel (he was here before you and might be after you!!) is 16 and VERY neurotic!!! Good dogs are da-bomb.


----------



## PJ352

Now that I read the info your LBS provided re: the Roubaix, it sounds familiar, so I may have just forgotten you posted it or didn't follow up by checking Fuji's site. Sorry 'bout that.

As long as the Fuji fits and feels good to you, I think your logic for pursuing it is sound. I was merely offering an option to branch out and try different brands/ models.

IME minor shifting issues are very common on test bikes - to the point of being surprised when one shifts smoothly. You'd never have purchased one of my current bikes, because on the test ride the rear missed shifts, was noisy/ rough and the front over shifted to both inner and outer rings. It's now my best shifting bike. 

I checked out the Fuji and according to the specs, the bike has a compact (50/34) crankset and a 28T rear cog. Depending on your fitness/ terrain, the 30/ 28 combo _could_ be low enough to suite your needs. As we've mentioned, the one way to find out is to ride the hills in your area, then you'll know. 

If you find that it isn't quite low enough, if you like the bike well enough, you can discuss the cost of swapping to a triple. given the price of this bike compared to the competition you've referred to, it may end up a viable option, but that's getting a little ahead of things.

Back in the late 80's I also had a cocker. Made my Aussie look normal, so I guess I'm making progress.


----------



## pete210

<gasp> - something slipped your mind, with all the threads you're following and answering?? 

I love to have options, and then narrow them down, this is a case where what I'm thinking is the right option came along early in the process. I do wish it already had a triple, and I am thinking about making a swap anyway....of course another option that would likely be cheaper would be get a bike with a triple and upgrade the rear to 105 for <$100.00? If I need to? Does that automatically necessitate changing the cassette and/or shifter? I know changing the crankset means changing the shifter....

I know, just thinking out loud - until I can get back to the shop, get on the correct sized one, and find some hills I won't know...hopefully Saturday...

Yes, you made progress! Our Lab is definitely 'my' dog, the cocker is hers. Big proponent of Blue Buffalo, too, btw...


----------



## DeusAstra

*Entry level roadbike for new rider help*

Recently I went to my LBS looking to get into purchasing a road bike. I've been riding a Specialized Rockhopper for the past couple of years or so recreationally. Anyways, at the shop they just had a recent trade in on a Trek 1.1 (it also fits me perfectly) and the owner of the shop was offering 450 or so for it. The bike looked as if it had mabye less than a 100 miles on it. Should I purchase it despite it being used or should i purchase a new 1.5 for 1100 or a 1.2 for 870. My budget is at max 1100.


----------



## PJ352

DeusAstra said:


> Recently I went to my LBS looking to get into purchasing a road bike. I've been riding a Specialized Rockhopper for the past couple of years or so recreationally. Anyways, at the shop they just had a recent trade in on a Trek 1.1 (it also fits me perfectly) and the owner of the shop was offering 450 or so for it. The bike looked as if it had mabye less than a 100 miles on it. Should I purchase it despite it being used or should i purchase a new 1.5 for 1100 or a 1.2 for 870. My budget is at max 1100.


You don't say what year the 1.1 is, but if it's 1-2 years old, if you're ok with losing the warranty it might be worth consideration. I think it's priced a little high, but that's pretty common when buying through a dealer. If you're interested, try to get the price lowered a little and ask about a 30 day warranty.

I don't think the 1.2 offers much more for the difference in price, so second choice (IMO) would be the 1.5. Doing so, you move up to Tiagra 10 speed.

Depending on how serious you're going to be and how much saddle time you're looking at, for a first road bike the 1.1 might suite you fine - at least short term. OTOH if you feel that you've already taken steps towards getting more serious about road riding and can afford the difference, then the 1.5 would get you wider gearing and refined shifting. Features you may be happier with over the longer term.


----------



## pete210

pete210 said:


> <gasp> - something slipped your mind, with all the threads you're following and answering??
> 
> I love to have options, and then narrow them down, this is a case where what I'm thinking is the right option came along early in the process. I do wish it already had a triple, and I am thinking about making a swap anyway....of course another option that would likely be cheaper would be get a bike with a triple and upgrade the rear to 105 for <$100.00? If I need to? Does that automatically necessitate changing the cassette and/or shifter? I know changing the crankset means changing the shifter....
> 
> I know, just thinking out loud - until I can get back to the shop, get on the correct sized one, and find some hills I won't know...hopefully Saturday...
> 
> Yes, you made progress! Our Lab is definitely 'my' dog, the cocker is hers. Big proponent of Blue Buffalo, too, btw...


Ok, well I found an option on BD - 2012 Motobecane Vent Noir - Tiagra front triple 50/39/30, 105 rear with Tiagra 12-30 cassette, Ritchie bar, Vuelta wheelset, Tektra R520 brakes. $800.00
Oh, Carbon fork, aluminum frame

Thoughts?


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> Ok, well I found an option on BD - 2012 Motobecane Vent Noir - Tiagra front triple 50/39/30, 105 rear with Tiagra 12-30 cassette, Ritchie bar, Vuelta wheelset, Tektra R520 brakes. $800.00
> Oh, Carbon fork, aluminum frame
> 
> Thoughts?


No offense meant, but for a first bike and considering your level of knowledge thus far, I'd advise against an online purchase. 

Think about what you learned test riding the bikes you have; why you liked some better than others and what you didn't like about some. All that is bypassed when you order online and then you just have to hope you like what you get. Otherwise, you return it (at your cost), ride it because you own it, let it sit and gather dust, or resell it. And it's likely to not get the interest or price of a better known brand.

Honestly, in an effort to make an educated purchasing decision, I think it's great to explore many options, but I think you're placing too much importance on 105 level componentry. Going back to your previous post, upgrading the rear is pretty much pointless, because you'll never experience any difference. 

And just as a FYI, at the front (crankset) it's not necessary to upgrade cranksets with the rest of a drivetrain. In fact, you can run 8 or 9 speed cranksets with 10 speed drivetrains, without issue. So you could conceivably decide on the Fuji, then swap to a 9 speed triple (generally cheaper than 10 speeds), but (similar to a 10 speed crankset swap) that would also require a new left shifter, FD and RD.


----------



## pete210

PJ352 said:


> No offense meant, but for a first bike and considering your level of knowledge thus far, I'd advise against an online purchase.
> 
> Think about what you learned test riding the bikes you have; why you liked some better than others and what you didn't like about some. All that is bypassed when you order online and then you just have to hope you like what you get. Otherwise, you return it (at your cost), ride it because you own it, let it sit and gather dust, or resell it. And it's likely to not get the interest or price of a better known brand.
> 
> Honestly, in an effort to make an educated purchasing decision, I think it's great to explore many options, but I think you're placing too much importance on 105 level componentry. Going back to your previous post, upgrading the rear is pretty much pointless, because you'll never experience any difference.
> 
> And just as a FYI, at the front (crankset) it's not necessary to upgrade cranksets with the rest of a drivetrain. In fact, you can run 8 or 9 speed cranksets with 10 speed drivetrains, without issue. So you could conceivably decide on the Fuji, then swap to a 9 speed triple (generally cheaper than 10 speeds), but (similar to a 10 speed crankset swap) that would also require a new left shifter, FD and RD.


No offense taken, it had occurred to me as well. I do 'get' the value of being able to test things out in an LBS.

I was actually surprised because of seeing higher-level components in a triple front, because nothing I've seen locally has that. I do take your point about not fixating on the level of componentry. It all comes back to my desire for bang-for-buck.

OK, scratch that then...


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> No offense taken, it had occurred to me as well. I do 'get' the value of being able to test things out in an LBS.
> 
> I was actually surprised because of seeing higher-level components in a triple front, because nothing I've seen locally has that. I do take your point about not fixating on the level of componentry. *It all comes back to my desire for bang-for-buck*.
> 
> OK, scratch that then...


You're not alone in wanting the most value for money spent. When it comes to bikes, trick is to balance that with the reality that we _ride_ bikes, and the longer we ride, the more that loosest link in our fit will rear its ugly head. 

So, will DuraAce shifters or Ultegra derailleurs make our neck, back or knees not hurt? Obviously not. Point is, the long list of LBS services _do_ have value and in fairness to the shops we should be willing to pay a little to get those services - _especially_ sizing and fit assistance. Thus, the advice to shop for shops along with bikes. 

From what you've described thus far, your Fuji shop sounds pretty good. I think as this unfolds and if you stick to wanting the Fuji, they'll work with you on making things right. That, in essence, is what a relationship with an LBS is all about. As you know, you'll get nothing like that shopping online.


----------



## Phenomrider007

NJBiker72 said:


> Why such a long wait??


I won't be able to swing the the cash for the remaining balance till then!!!


----------



## hansey13

*Update*

Now i like the 2011 felt f75 with 105 as well, buying your first road bike is hard! this process sucks! i just want a bike


----------



## PJ352

hansey13 said:


> Now i like the 2011 felt f75 with 105 as well, buying your first road bike is hard! this process sucks! i just want a bike


Getting the right bike is worth the wait. Take your time and work through the process (it can actually be fun) and when you start doing those longer rides you'll be glad you have a well fitting bike.

Is the Felt new/ used? Private sale or LBS? Did you ride it?


----------



## hansey13

the 2011 felt is new from a LBS its $1300
the 2010 felt with sram apex is used for $800
2012 specialized allez apex or 105???


----------



## PJ352

hansey13 said:


> the 2011 felt is new from a LBS its $1300
> the 2010 felt with sram apex is used for $800
> 2012 specialized allez apex or 105???


Sounds like the price on the used Felt came down a bit, but I still think it's over priced.

With the new Felt you'll get a warranty and LBS services. Same goes for the Allez's. I still think you should give the Tiagra equipped Allez a try - along with some relaxed geo bikes like the Spec Secteur and Giant Defy. 

Bottom line, test ride, then decide.


----------



## chantal

new to road biking, checking out bikes, was told i would need 58 cm frame, am 5'11 and 200 lbs female...... any input on this entrylevel bike 2011 Fuji Newest 1.0 Road Bike


----------



## chantal

*new to the sport ...need bike input*

new to road biking, checking out bikes, was told i would need 58 cm frame, am 5'11 and 200 lbs female...... any input on this entrylevel bike 2011 Fuji Newest 1.0 Road Bike


----------



## PJ352

chantal said:


> new to road biking, checking out bikes, was told i would need 58 cm frame, am 5'11 and 200 lbs female...... any input on this entrylevel bike 2011 Fuji Newest 1.0 Road Bike


You don't mention intended uses (recreational/ fitness/ charity/ endurance rides), but if it fits well and you like the ride/ handling it'll make a fine entry level bike. If you haven't already done so, be sure to test ride it before deciding.

Being new to road bikes it might also be to your advantage to branch out and ride some other brands/ models, just to be exposed to different offerings.


----------



## DnnyLLama

chantal said:


> new to road biking, checking out bikes, was told i would need 58 cm frame, am 5'11 and 200 lbs female...... any input on this entrylevel bike 2011 Fuji Newest 1.0 Road Bike


I actually considered buying that bike , test drove it and was in the main running... For the price and components it is not a bad deal.

I did a lot of research like yourself and I read a lot of complaints about the crank.

You should know its a more upright bike which is not so "race" inspired, more for easy riding and commuting.

I myself went with a Fuji Cross comp, which was the same price on clearance with better components all around and dual breaks FTW!!!

Lastly, you should check out performancebikeshop.com, they are doing a %30 cash back this weekend, which is a steal if you ask me. They have that bike and reviews online.


----------



## PJ352

DnnyLLama said:


> I actually considered buying that bike , test drove it and was in the main running... For the price and components it is not a bad deal.
> 
> I did a lot of research like yourself and I read a lot of complaints about the crank.
> 
> *You should know its a more upright bike which is not so "race" inspired, more for easy riding and commuting.*
> 
> I myself went with a Fuji Cross comp, which was the same price on clearance with better components all around and dual breaks FTW!!!
> 
> Lastly, you should check out performancebikeshop.com, they are doing a %30 cash back this weekend, which is a steal if you ask me. They have that bike and reviews online.


re: the 'race' inspired comment, I don't agree. The head tube lengths are consistent with race bikes, but the adjustable stem does allow for more or less saddle to bar drop, depending on rider preferences. I would classify this bike as 'race'.

The crankset quality is consistent with bikes in this general price range.


----------



## ollie900

Thanks


----------



## ollie900

sorry need 5 posts


----------



## ollie900

number 3...


----------



## ollie900

penultimate


----------



## ollie900

and five


----------



## pete210

PJ352 said:


> You're not alone in wanting the most value for money spent. When it comes to bikes, trick is to balance that with the reality that we _ride_ bikes, and the longer we ride, the more that loosest link in our fit will rear its ugly head.
> 
> So, will DuraAce shifters or Ultegra derailleurs make our neck, back or knees not hurt? Obviously not. Point is, the long list of LBS services _do_ have value and in fairness to the shops we should be willing to pay a little to get those services - _especially_ sizing and fit assistance. Thus, the advice to shop for shops along with bikes.
> 
> From what you've described thus far, your Fuji shop sounds pretty good. I think as this unfolds and if you stick to wanting the Fuji, they'll work with you on making things right. That, in essence, is what a relationship with an LBS is all about. As you know, you'll get nothing like that shopping online.


Tried 2 other LBS's yesterday..well, not quite so local, but I wanted to see C'dale, Giant, Specialized, since I hear so much about them here. The 1st was a good shop. They set up a 56 and 54 size and the guy even rode around with me to see how I looked riding. End result, he said I could go with either, but probably the 54 would be better for control - more weight over the front wheel. The bike felt good, but pushing up to $1350. Synapse 5. The next shop was useless. All the guy wanted to do was talk about how much he knew, how bad everything was that didn't come from his shop. Since I'm in sales too, it was a total turn off, and I don't care if their bikes were 1/2 price I wouldn't buy from them. Hopefully next weekend is when I get to get whatever I'm going to. Anyone out there have a reason for me to spend $150.00 or more on the C'dale over the Fuji? Both have 105's front/rr/shifters. I suspect the Fuji could be more than $150.00 cheaper, but that's at sticker. The C'dale shop were high on the rear triangle of their frame being shaped in a way that would provide more flex/comfort. Hype or real? Anyone know?


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> Tried 2 other LBS's yesterday..well, not quite so local, but I wanted to see C'dale, Giant, Specialized, since I hear so much about them here. The 1st was a good shop. They set up a 56 and 54 size and the guy even rode around with me to see how I looked riding. End result, he said I could go with either, but probably the 54 would be better for control - more weight over the front wheel. The bike felt good, but pushing up to $1350. Synapse 5. The next shop was useless. All the guy wanted to do was talk about how much he knew, how bad everything was that didn't come from his shop. Since I'm in sales too, it was a total turn off, and I don't care if their bikes were 1/2 price I wouldn't buy from them. Hopefully next weekend is when I get to get whatever I'm going to. Anyone out there have a reason for me to spend $150.00 or more on the C'dale over the Fuji? Both have 105's front/rr/shifters. I suspect the Fuji could be more than $150.00 cheaper, but that's at sticker. The C'dale shop were high on the rear triangle of their frame being shaped in a way that would provide more flex/comfort. Hype or real? Anyone know?


No one said this was going to be ALL fun, but you are learning.... 

Keeping in mind that the Synapse leans towards relaxed geo and the Roubaix's race, if both the C'dale and Fuji fit well and you like the ride/ handling equally well, the extra ~$150 comes down to preferring C'dale or the C'dale shop. If not and you're comfortable dealing with the Fuji shop, then you're probably not gaining/ losing much. I do think the fact that the fitter rode with you to assess your fit is a positive for that shop.

I think C'dale calls their rear triangle SAVE. Similar to Specialized Zertz inserts, there are believers and skeptics, but as far as your asking if anyone 'knows' if they're hype or real, since it would take an independent, controlled test to answer that, I don't think anyone will be able to provide you with factual info. Subjective ('feel') yes. Factual, no.

In reality, the entire discussion of ride quality is subjective, with many believing that tire construction, size and PSI have more effect on ride than frame materials alone. Even a bikes geometry can affect ride.

My advice is to focus on the tangibles... things you can make an assessment of. Control function, placement, how _you_ think the bikes ride (under comparable conditions and with equalized tire pressures), because these are things that you'll experience whenever you ride. These, _and_ the all important fit.


----------



## eschmunk

Hi all. Name is Erich. Looking at purchasing my first road bike pretty soon. Look forward to getting to know some of you guys and getting your opinions.


----------



## pete210

PJ352 said:


> No one said this was going to be ALL fun, but you are learning....
> 
> Keeping in mind that the Synapse leans towards relaxed geo and the Roubaix's race, if both the C'dale and Fuji fit well and you like the ride/ handling equally well, the extra ~$150 comes down to preferring C'dale or the C'dale shop. If not and you're comfortable dealing with the Fuji shop, then you're probably not gaining/ losing much. I do think the fact that the fitter rode with you to assess your fit is a positive for that shop.
> 
> I think C'dale calls their rear triangle SAVE. Similar to Specialized Zertz inserts, there are believers and skeptics, but as far as your asking if anyone 'knows' if they're hype or real, since it would take an independent, controlled test to answer that, I don't think anyone will be able to provide you with factual info. Subjective ('feel') yes. Factual, no.
> 
> In reality, the entire discussion of ride quality is subjective, with many believing that tire construction, size and PSI have more effect on ride than frame materials alone. Even a bikes geometry can affect ride.
> 
> My advice is to focus on the tangibles... things you can make an assessment of. Control function, placement, how _you_ think the bikes ride (under comparable conditions and with equalized tire pressures), because these are things that you'll experience whenever you ride. These, _and_ the all important fit.


Yeah, I'll try to do as close to back-to-back as I can on a ride this weekend, but the shops are 45 minutes apart, so comparisons of ride are tough. I'll take what I 'learned' at the C'dale shop, and if the Fuji shop matches up, I'll go that way. I tend to agree that differences of frame design are going to negligible for me. As long as the visible quality (welds etc) is good, warranty is the same, components are the same, I'll pocket the change....errrr....use the left over for the other stuff I'll need..


----------



## Josh P

I have continued to look at bikes at my local LBS but with my budget it is slim pickings. I found a 2010 Fuji Roubaix 3.0 locally on craigslist and asked the owner to meet me at a bike shop to have it fitted. It is $450 obo. Does that seem like a decent deal? Is the frame a good frame that would make a suitable frame to upgrade the components on later? Thanks in advance.


----------



## PJ352

Josh P said:


> I have continued to look at bikes at my local LBS but with my budget it is slim pickings. I found a 2010 Fuji Roubaix 3.0 locally on craigslist and asked the owner to meet me at a bike shop to have it fitted. It is $450 obo. Does that seem like a decent deal? Is the frame a good frame that would make a suitable frame to upgrade the components on later? Thanks in advance.


Without more info, we're not going to be able to provide reliable feedback on the value of that Roubaix, but below is a link to the specs and original MSRP ($900). You can compare the specs to the sellers bike.

If the seller agrees to bring the bike to your LBS for sizing/ fit assessment, ask that they assess it mechanically as well. 

http://2010.fujibikes.com/Road/Performance/Roubaix-3-0.aspx


----------



## Josh P

PJ352 said:


> Without more info, we're not going to be able to provide reliable feedback on the value of that Roubaix, but below is a link to the specs and original MSRP ($900). You can compare the specs to the sellers bike.
> 
> If the seller agrees to bring the bike to your LBS for sizing/ fit assessment, ask that they assess it mechanically as well.
> 
> Yeah I checked out what I could about the specs of the bike I was just wondering if anyone could tell me if the frame is any good. Is it something I could upgrade components on later and have a decent bike? The owner claims to have paid $80 to have it tuned up a couple months ago as well as $20 for a new chain. Seems like it might be a decent deal but as you said I would ask the bike shop to inspect it.


----------



## PJ352

Josh P said:


> Yeah I checked out what I could about the specs of the bike* I was just wondering if anyone could tell me if the frame is any good. Is it something I could upgrade components on later and have a decent bike? *The owner claims to have paid $80 to have it tuned up a couple months ago as well as $20 for a new chain. Seems like it might be a decent deal but as you said I would ask the bike shop to inspect it.


It's the same frameset as the Fuji Roubaix 1.0, so if Fuji saw fit to upgrade the frameset, you can as well. 

With used bikes, the concerns are more with the life the bike has led, its current condition and if it's worth the asking price. This, of course, assumes sizing and fit are right, because if they aren't nothing else matters, so it's good you're asking that the LBS assess that.


----------



## qwksti

thanks for posting the info. great thread.


----------



## Josh P

Thanks for the advice. Very helpful


----------



## Porschefan

Hi,

I've been subscribed to this thread for a few months now, trying to absorb what I can about what to look for in a first road bike. I'm fortunate to have a pretty nice mountain bike, but really am pretty much a novice rider. I've been thinking about keeping my eyes peeled for a nice beginner's road bike if one should show up on the local Craigslist or somewhere.

With that said, this one appeared in the last day or two and caught my eye. It's an "*Motobecane Immortal Force*" (I guess I should buy it because of the name alone!) I know Motobecane is BikesDirect and they are a little overblown on their claims about "retail price" and "our price," etc. 

(I tried to post the link, but I don't have 10 posts yet...and I'm not going to run up a total just to post!) Here's the text of the ad:

*2008 Motobecane Immortal Force Road Bike for sale (54cm)

Full Carbon
Full Shimano Ultegra

Well kept with relatively few miles

Must sell due to move

Spare parts including helmet, spare tubes, tire fixing equipment,...*

------------------------------------------

$800 is probably as much I want to spend on a first road bike, and I'd like to find a hell of a deal even at that price. What do the wiser heads here think about following up on this one?

TIA for any input.


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> Hi,
> 
> I've been subscribed to this thread for a few months now, trying to absorb what I can about what to look for in a first road bike. I have a mountain bike, but am pretty much a novice rider at that, but I've been thinking about keeping my eyes peeled for a nice beginner's road bike if one should show up on the local Craigslist or somewhere.
> 
> With that said, this one appeared in the last day or two and caught my eye. It's a (I guess I should buy it because of the name alone!) I know Motobecane is BikesDirect and they are a little overblown on their claims about "retail price" and "our price," etc.
> 
> (I tried to post the link, but I don't have 10 posts yet...and I'm not going to run up a total just to post!) Here's the text of the ad:
> 
> *2008 Motobecane Immortal Force Road Bike for sale (54cm)
> 
> Full Carbon
> Full Shimano Ultegra
> 
> Well kept with relatively few miles
> 
> Must sell due to move
> 
> Spare parts including helmet, spare tubes, tire fixing equipment,...*
> 
> 
> $800 is probably as much I want to spend on a first road bike, and I'd like to find a hell of a deal even at that price. What do the wiser heads here think about following up on this one?
> 
> TIA for any input.


Buying used you get no warranty, and because CF frames can suffer flaws/ defects that are undetected to the naked eye, I never recommend buying used CF. I suggest staying with steel or aluminum unless buying new.

That said, if you're hellbent on pursuing this bike, go check it out/ test ride it (preferably with someone who know bike mechanics and fit). Even if all the pieces came together, I suggest asking the seller to have the bikes mechanical condition (as well as sizing and fit) assessed at a reputable LBS. 

Remember, that "hell of a deal" isn't going to be if the bike doesn't fit you well or has a frame problem (expensive to repair).


----------



## chinsky

I'm not quite new to road biking but it has been long enough that this seems to be the best place to put myself. I need some advice on a new bike and am looking at a few options. The short version of the story is I want nirvana - good fit, great quality, good hill climbing, excellent speed in the flats, comfortable and a one-and-done purchase to last me for many years (with good care).

The long version is that I have been away from serious riding for a long time, am now pushing 50 with 70 year old knees and am a little overweight and a little out-of-shape and need to fix that. I have two riding locales - one in a very hilly area and one in flat farm country. I have one bike for each locale but could move the new one to the hills for fall and spring. In the flat land, I own a 80s vintage Peugeot 12 spd that I'm not willing to put any more money into having ridden much better, newer bikes. For the hills, I own a 2006 Sirrus Comp that I bought to try to achieve nirvana once before but it hasn't worked perfectly. It is great for a short ride or for riding with my family as the head's-up position allows me to easily keep tabs on the kids. I thought it would be more comfortable than a road bike but for longer rides it is not. I've made some grip/bar end changes to make the most of it and it is now okay but I would not want another flat bar road bike to replace the Peugeot. Importantly (at least to me) the gearing is an 11-26 9 speed with 30/42/52 chain rings. The 30/26 combo is just barely tolerable on the knees in tough climbs. But, in the flats, I still have the strength to make pretty good use of the 52/11 speed - something I like very much. (I also like the 28 tires as feeling a bit surer footed given a bit less agility than when I was younger.)

For the flat lands, I can still handle the higher gearing of the Peugeot traditional road bike but I would like I bike I can bring home for spring/fall to use in lieu of the Sirrus. So gearing is important to me. And, as I mentioned earlier, I want something of quality and durability. I'm somewhat flexible on budget but don't feel a compelling need to part with more than I have to in order to get a good training bike that will, if I do my part, keep up with young guys and last me a good long time. I can still comfortably handle tradition road geometry thought being a tad more upright is nice.

Here's what I've found;
Rocky Mountain Oxygen 30 2011 $600 OTD from Jenson USA (not enough posts to include links). This is a mostly tiagra equipped triple and for $30 more I could swap the 12-25 for an 11-28 which gets me close to the top end of the Sirrus and actually offers a bit more help on the low end. I'd be buying online so fit is not certain but I’ll find something with comparable geometry to at least sit upon.

Trek 1.5. Tiagra equipped 20 speed compact road for ~$900 OTD and I could try it out. The 12-30 cassette should be fine for climbing but I lose some of the speed in the flats or I could swap the cassette but lose some hill climbing. By the time I pay for that, I’m close to the Diamondback below so I guess I’m really asking if there is some reason to pick Trek over other brands. This one is my least favorite. 

The next two would both be a step up. Both are mostly ultegra and after a cassette change for the former or a local build for the latter would cost the same at just shy of $1200.

Diamondback Podium 4 2011 from Jenson USA. This has the advantage of being able to go to the local Dicks store and tryout the fit.

Motobecane Sprint 2011 from Bikes Direct. I bought my wife's Fuji Absolute 2 from BD and had a good experience dealing with them and my LBS for a full tune, inspection wheel truing etc. I am a bit hesitant because of fit concerns and the concern that BD and Motobecane don't really have the depth of backing that a national brand will have if problems arise. I was fine with her bike because it won’t see as much use and was a “name” brand for which I could find a local dealer if I have a warranty issue.

I know there are lots of other options but for a number of reasons, including available inventory and aesthetics, this is the short list. It seems to me that the Oxygen is a lot of bike for the money and should serve me well for a long time and, with a very minor change, offers some good gearing for my needs. Are the ultegra bikes really worth spending twice as much? If so, the Moto seems to offer a good package for my needs but is there a benefit to sticking to a national brand? Am I placing too much emphasis on the gearing and does it really matter if I have a road compact or road triple? 

I really appreciate all the help you have offered so freely and any advice you can give.


----------



## PJ352

chinsky said:


> I'm not quite new to road biking but it has been long enough that this seems to be the best place to put myself. I need some advice on a new bike and am looking at a few options. The short version of the story is I want nirvana - good fit, great quality, good hill climbing, excellent speed in the flats, comfortable and a one-and-done purchase to last me for many years (with good care).
> 
> The long version is that I have been away from serious riding for a long time, am now pushing 50 with 70 year old knees and am a little overweight and a little out-of-shape and need to fix that. I have two riding locales - one in a very hilly area and one in flat farm country. I have one bike for each locale but could move the new one to the hills for fall and spring. In the flat land, I own a 80s vintage Peugeot 12 spd that I'm not willing to put any more money into having ridden much better, newer bikes. For the hills, I own a 2006 Sirrus Comp that I bought to try to achieve nirvana once before but it hasn't worked perfectly. It is great for a short ride or for riding with my family as the head's-up position allows me to easily keep tabs on the kids. I thought it would be more comfortable than a road bike but for longer rides it is not. I've made some grip/bar end changes to make the most of it and it is now okay but I would not want another flat bar road bike to replace the Peugeot. Importantly (at least to me) the gearing is an 11-26 9 speed with 30/42/52 chain rings. The 30/26 combo is just barely tolerable on the knees in tough climbs. But, in the flats, I still have the strength to make pretty good use of the 52/11 speed - something I like very much. (I also like the 28 tires as feeling a bit surer footed given a bit less agility than when I was younger.)
> 
> For the flat lands, I can still handle the higher gearing of the Peugeot traditional road bike but I would like I bike I can bring home for spring/fall to use in lieu of the Sirrus. So gearing is important to me. And, as I mentioned earlier, I want something of quality and durability. I'm somewhat flexible on budget but don't feel a compelling need to part with more than I have to in order to get a good training bike that will, if I do my part, keep up with young guys and last me a good long time. I can still comfortably handle tradition road geometry thought being a tad more upright is nice.
> 
> Here's what I've found;
> Rocky Mountain Oxygen 30 2011 $600 OTD from Jenson USA (not enough posts to include links). This is a mostly tiagra equipped triple and for $30 more I could swap the 12-25 for an 11-28 which gets me close to the top end of the Sirrus and actually offers a bit more help on the low end. I'd be buying online so fit is not certain but I’ll find something with comparable geometry to at least sit upon.
> 
> Trek 1.5. Tiagra equipped 20 speed compact road for ~$900 OTD and I could try it out. The 12-30 cassette should be fine for climbing but I lose some of the speed in the flats or I could swap the cassette but lose some hill climbing. By the time I pay for that, I’m close to the Diamondback below so I guess I’m really asking if there is some reason to pick Trek over other brands. This one is my least favorite.
> 
> The next two would both be a step up. Both are mostly ultegra and after a cassette change for the former or a local build for the latter would cost the same at just shy of $1200.
> 
> Diamondback Podium 4 2011 from Jenson USA. This has the advantage of being able to go to the local Dicks store and tryout the fit.
> 
> Motobecane Sprint 2011 from Bikes Direct. I bought my wife's Fuji Absolute 2 from BD and had a good experience dealing with them and my LBS for a full tune, inspection wheel truing etc. I am a bit hesitant because of fit concerns and the concern that BD and Motobecane don't really have the depth of backing that a national brand will have if problems arise. I was fine with her bike because it won’t see as much use and was a “name” brand for which I could find a local dealer if I have a warranty issue.
> 
> I know there are lots of other options but for a number of reasons, including available inventory and aesthetics, this is the short list. It seems to me that the Oxygen is a lot of bike for the money and should serve me well for a long time and, with a very minor change, offers some good gearing for my needs. Are the ultegra bikes really worth spending twice as much? If so, the Moto seems to offer a good package for my needs but is there a benefit to sticking to a national brand? Am I placing too much emphasis on the gearing and does it really matter if I have a road compact or road triple?
> 
> I really appreciate all the help you have offered so freely and any advice you can give.


From what you're offering here, I think it's apparent that you have enough cycling experience to know pretty much what you want/ need, down to the gearing. Where you depend on others is with wrenching and (I'm guessing) fit.

If I'm on track thus far, my advice is to first take steps to pin down your sizing requirements. Once you have those numbers, you can compare them to bikes of interest with the goal of getting close, so that only minor tweaks to fit will be necessary. Question is, how do you 'get there'.

LBS's size and fit as a part of the bike buying process, so going that route takes care of the fit issue. If you're looking to buy online, my advice is to visit a reputable LBS, be upfront about your intention to buy online (but will tap them as a resource for final assembly, tuning, fit) and ask for a standard fitting. It may cost you ~$50, but considering that's the cost of return shipping on a bike you guessed wrong on, it's worth the price.

Once you get the fitting, note the year, make, model, frame size of the test bike and compare the geo numbers (not the frame size) to the geo charts of the online bike(s) of interest. The closer the numbers, the closer fit will be to that of the test bike. 

Taking a step back, the need for the emphasis on fit is real. Drop bar bikes are trickier to fit than flat bar bikes, and given what you've offered about your knees and possible preference for a more upright riding position, I think a level of comfort is important to you. Since a good fit equates to comfort (and efficiency on the bike), it's important to get it right.

Re: the bikes, given your overall criteria, I think the Rocky Mountain is the frontrunner for online offerings. For the price, the specs are solid and the slightly taller head tube should fulfill your 'comfort' criteria. 'As is', gearing comes close to meeting your needs, and (as you say) you could always opt for a cassette with a larger rear cog or two. You'd also have to add a couple of links to your chain, but your LBS would do that as a part of the cassette install. 

Bottom line (as I see it), take steps to get your sizing requirements pinned down, then start comparing the geo of bikes of interest, but (as I mentioned) LBS's include much of what you need as part of the purchase price, and you won't need to pay them for final assembly, tuning and fit, as you will when going the online route. So, some things to consider.


----------



## chinsky

Thanks for the feedback. I have a good rapport with the local shop as I bought and was fit for the Sirrus there and have gotten several of the kids bikes from them. As their business has grown and the founder is less active, service is off a bit and they seem to push product a bit more, but I'm sure they'll spend some time with me for a reasonable sum. For $85 they basically re-built my wife's Fuji and stand behind their work. But even after I factor in the fitting and free basic tune-up they don't have anything close in price to what I'm finding on line and keeping the kids in bikes has to come from one of my pockets. 

Thanks.


----------



## PJ352

chinsky said:


> Thanks for the feedback. I have a good rapport with the local shop as I bought and was fit for the Sirrus there and have gotten several of the kids bikes from them. As their business has grown and the founder is less active, service is off a bit and they seem to push product a bit more, but I'm sure they'll spend some time with me for a reasonable sum. For $85 they basically re-built my wife's Fuji and stand behind their work. But even after I factor in the fitting and free basic tune-up they don't have anything close in price to what I'm finding on line and keeping the kids in bikes has to come from one of my pockets.
> 
> Thanks.


Sure, these are all things to consider. If they're the only shop in town, going the online route might make the most sense - or you weigh the option of traveling to semi-local bike shops. 

But (as you can tell) I place a premium on getting sizing, then fit right, so if your LBS is knowledgeable in that regard and you trust their wrenching skills, IMO they're still a good resource.


----------



## DanielMM

Looking into buying my first bike finally, budget is not a huge issue but it's more of what kind of bike should I get to fit my needs and should I start cheap and upgrade later or just get the goods from the start like life has taught me many times. Definitely been digging for hours on info and advice and it's so frustrating!


----------



## NJBiker72

DanielMM said:


> Looking into buying my first bike finally, budget is not a huge issue but it's more of what kind of bike should I get to fit my needs and should I start cheap and upgrade later or just get the goods from the start like life has taught me many times. Definitely been digging for hours on info and advice and it's so frustrating!


I am of the opinion to buy a solid entry level bike, not wally world type, and ride it for a couple of years until you know what you really want. 

Then save the old bike as a winter/rain bike. 

I started the wally world route and soon upgraded to a good entry level bike, specialized secteur. If I had gone big time then i would have gotten a Roubaix.

After a couple of years riding the secteur I realized I wanted something more aggressive and ended up with a Tarmac. 

Had i bought the Roubaix initially I would have been no happier than with the secteur. And the secteur makes a great winter bike.


----------



## tlg

DanielMM said:


> Looking into buying my first bike finally, budget is not a huge issue but it's more of what kind of bike should I get to fit my needs and should I start cheap and upgrade later or just get the goods from the start like life has taught me many times.


It would help if you explain what your needs/wants are. What's your purpose for riding? How often do you plan to ride? How far? Any certain goals? etc etc.

If you really aren't sure how into cycling you are or aren't very commited, then cheap is probably the way to go. But if it's something you know you want to do and are the type to stick with things, then it's really best to get the best bike you can afford at the time. Buying cheap and upgrading almost always costs MUCH more.


----------



## Josh P

Thank you to everyone who gave advice. After visiting a few more LBSs I found one that really took the time to answer a lot of questions. I told him that I was looking at bikes on CL as well as new and he happily agreed to fit me on anything I was considering. I ended up purchasing the Fuji Roubaix 3.0 that I mentioned earlier in this thread but I only paid $350 for it. Since it is in good mechanical shape and fit me well I feel I found a good bike for my needs at a reasonable price. I took it for a short ride yesterday and really loved it. Thanks again to all who helped.


----------



## PJ352

Josh P said:


> Thank you to everyone who gave advice. After visiting a few more LBSs I found one that really took the time to answer a lot of questions. I told him that I was looking at bikes on CL as well as new and he happily agreed to fit me on anything I was considering. I ended up purchasing the Fuji Roubaix 3.0 that I mentioned earlier in this thread but I only paid $350 for it. Since it is in good mechanical shape and fit me well I feel I found a good bike for my needs at a reasonable price. I took it for a short ride yesterday and really loved it. Thanks again to all who helped.


Glad it worked out for you. Can't get much better than finding a bike you love and a reputable shop to help along the way. I'm sure you'll find ways to support them in the future.

Enjoy your bike, and post pics when you're able.


----------



## Porschefan

PJ352 said:


> Buying used you get no warranty, and because CF frames can suffer flaws/ defects that are undetected to the naked eye, I never recommend buying used CF. I suggest staying with steel or aluminum unless buying new.
> 
> That said, if you're hellbent on pursuing this bike, go check it out/ test ride it (preferably with someone who know bike mechanics and fit). Even if all the pieces came together, I suggest asking the seller to have the bikes mechanical condition (as well as sizing and fit) assessed at a reputable LBS.
> 
> Remember, that "hell of a deal" isn't going to be if the bike doesn't fit you well or has a frame problem (expensive to repair).


Hi PJ352,

Thanks for the response. I am a novice but I've been through at least SOME of the mistakes in shopping for a mountain bike. I bought a pretty nice Giant Reign 1 (2008) from the local Craigslist, that didn't fit well at all. Luckily I was able to re-sell it for what I had into it. Ended up with a Yeti ASR5 bought on close out from the local Yeti dealer and that bike is fine--I really like it and am happy.

My thought in posting here is to find out whether a particular bike that shows up has any known problems; is or isn't suitable for a novice rider--i.e., suited more for comfort than racing, for example; is a good or REALLY good value for the $$.

Before I actually buy anything used I plan on having it inspected for condition and fit by an LBS that I totally trust.

The "Immortal Force" (!) struck me as possibly being a good to very good deal IF it were in top shape and IF it fits.

Another bike that interested me, but seems to have disappeared off Craigslist was a Bianchi Via Narone fabricated in "Alu-Carbon". It had nice components and a very reasonable price, but that's a construction technique that might be even more problematic than carbon.

Anyway, thanks for your response and for your obviously generous contributions to this site. It's very helpful to novices.


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> My thought in posting here is to find out whether a particular bike that shows up has any known problems; is or isn't suitable for a novice rider--i.e., suited more for comfort than racing, for example; is a good or REALLY good value for the $$.


Shopping around never hurts, because prices can vary (by LBS, region, etc.), but the market is highly competitive, so what really matters is finding the right bike for the rider, based on intended use, goals, cycling experiences, fitness/ flexibility, personal preferences - among other factors. 

That's why it's important to shop for shops along with shopping for bikes. The better shops will take the time to discuss pertinent factors with you, offer some bikes of interest within your price range, size/ fit you and have to take a few test rides - out on the roads.

As far as comfort versus race, that too would be something to discuss with your LBS. A race bike (like a Specialized Allez) will suite some riders while a more relaxed geo bike (like the Giant Defy) will suite others. IMO/E test rides are the best way to sort this out and determine your preferences.

Re: known problems, they crop up from time to time, but when you buy new you have a warranty as a fallback. But generally speaking, problems in the industry are fewer in number and scope than in years past.



Porschefan said:


> Before I actually buy anything used I plan on having it inspected for condition and fit by an LBS that I totally trust.


That's an excellent plan. If a seller balks at agreeing to this, I'd advise you to look elsewhere.



Porschefan said:


> The "Immortal Force" (!) struck me as possibly being a good to very good deal IF it were in top shape and IF it fits.


The problem with buying used CF is you'll never really know if the frame is in 'top shape'. And there's no good way out if it isn't. 



Porschefan said:


> Another bike that interested me, but seems to have disappeared off Craigslist was a Bianchi Via Narone fabricated in "Alu-Carbon". It had nice components and a very reasonable price, but *that's a construction technique that might be even more problematic than carbon.*


I completely agree with the bold statement. Bonding alu/ CF adds another element to be concerned with. As I mentioned earlier, problems in the industry have subsided, but when you buy used you're buying older technology, so similar to my viewpoints on buying CF frames, the same would apply here. 

FWIW the more recent Bianchi Via Nirone's have full alu frames - a better bet when buying used.


----------



## TCJ

So I have a Fuji sports 10 frame with some parts and I am planning on building the rest of it. I am pretty inexperienced with this stuff. When i am buying components for it, are there any sizing requirements that I need to be aware of. I don't want to pick out any parts that aren't compatible with my frame.
Thanks


----------



## PJ352

TCJ said:


> So I have a Fuji sports 10 frame with some parts and I am planning on building the rest of it. I am pretty inexperienced with this stuff. When i am buying components for it, are there any sizing requirements that I need to be aware of. I don't want to pick out any parts that aren't compatible with my frame.
> Thanks


If I'm not mistaken, the frame is circa mid-70's, so depending on specifically what parts you'll need you may run into compatibility issues with more current offerings. But with some patience and initiative to hunt down older parts, I think you'll do ok on the build.

You may want to post this in the Retro-classic forum. Some members that frequent that area may be more familiar with that frame and better able to assist.


----------



## eftz

Hey everyone. I am completely new to this so bare with me 
I'M looking at buying my first road bike and cant seem to find what I'M looking for. A buddy of mine is telling me get a cheap/decent bike to train on and then sell and upgrade later down the road. Since this is my first time ever buying a road bike, what can I find less than $450(if possible)? Also, I'M 5'8, I'M thinking a 54cm would be perfect, yah?

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!


----------



## NJBiker72

eftz said:


> Hey everyone. I am completely new to this so bare with me
> I'M looking at buying my first road bike and cant seem to find what I'M looking for. A buddy of mine is telling me get a cheap/decent bike to train on and then sell and upgrade later down the road. Since this is my first time ever buying a road bike, what can I find less than $450(if possible)? Also, I'M 5'8, I'M thinking a 54cm would be perfect, yah?
> 
> Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!


Personally that's good advice but double the initial investment and train for minimum of two years. 

More than that we need more info. Primarily like fitness level/intended use. 

Find a local bike shop or three. Tell them what you told us and try out a few bikes. Make your decision based both on the bike and the shop.


----------



## PJ352

eftz said:


> Hey everyone. I am completely new to this so bare with me
> I'M looking at buying my first road bike and cant seem to find what I'M looking for. A buddy of mine is telling me get a cheap/decent bike to train on and then sell and upgrade later down the road. Since this is my first time ever buying a road bike, what can I find less than $450(if possible)? Also, I'M 5'8, I'M thinking a 54cm would be perfect, yah?
> 
> Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!


If you're serious about staying at or near your budget, my first (and I think your best) option would be to find a reputable LBS selling used bikes. That will get you some sizing/ fitting assistance and possibly a 30 day warranty. 

Second choice is a private party sale (CL or similar), but I'd keep it local so that you can test ride the bike to assess fit. Ideally, bring someone along that know bike mechanics and fit, but if not, you could ask the seller to bring the bike to your LBS for assessment on both. Since you're new to this, I would strongly advise you to seek out a knowledgeable second opinion before committing to a purchase.

Re: fit, it's important to get it right. Since one brands 52cm frame is anothers 47, don't let the number on a frame be your guide. It's the geometry of the bike that matters, and that's where test rides and others assistance comes into play.

All that said, I agree with NJBiker72 that doubling your budget gets you some tangible gains in the way of a warranty and some assurance that your new bike will serve you well for years to come - along with sizing/ fit assistance. But, if fitness/ training are your goals, buying used (with care) or new will both get you there.


----------



## pete210

pete210 said:


> Yeah, I'll try to do as close to back-to-back as I can on a ride this weekend, but the shops are 45 minutes apart, so comparisons of ride are tough. I'll take what I 'learned' at the C'dale shop, and if the Fuji shop matches up, I'll go that way. I tend to agree that differences of frame design are going to negligible for me. As long as the visible quality (welds etc) is good, warranty is the same, components are the same, I'll pocket the change....errrr....use the left over for the other stuff I'll need..


Pulled the trigger on the Fuji on Saturday. Back to back rides on the 54 and 56, tweaking, angle checks on the trainer, and finally getting off the wallet to pay for it....the 54 felt better to me in some ways, the 56 in other ways. My angles were perfect on the 54, but the subjective feel was slightly better on the 56. Bike, jersey, gloves, helmet, and tax for $1140.00. A little more than I'd hoped, but I shouldn't need to upgrade for a llooonnnggg time. Thanks for all the input and guidance!!


----------



## PJ352

pete210 said:


> Pulled the trigger on the Fuji on Saturday. Back to back rides on the 54 and 56, tweaking, angle checks on the trainer, and finally getting off the wallet to pay for it....the 54 felt better to me in some ways, the 56 in other ways. My angles were perfect on the 54, but the subjective feel was slightly better on the 56. Bike, jersey, gloves, helmet, and tax for $1140.00. A little more than I'd hoped, but I shouldn't need to upgrade for a llooonnnggg time. Thanks for all the input and guidance!!


Congrats! FWIW, I think you went through the bike buying process in the right ways; taking your time, asking questions along the way, checking out other shops/ bikes, test riding, and (ultimately) settling on a reputable shop and the bike that felt the best - along with being a decent value. 

From your description, the Fuji shop took some time to get your fit right, so kudos to them on that score. They'll likely be a good resource for you in the future as well.

Now all that's left is to get out, ride and build some saddle time. Well, that and post pics, of course! :thumbsup:


----------



## Phenomrider007

Nice going...good luck with your new steed!!!!


----------



## eftz

Thanks nj and pj for your help. Doubling my budget would help, but Im used to used to starting small first then going bigger in the future. I'll definitrly look at my LBS. I'll go from there and come back with further questions.


----------



## NJBiker72

eftz said:


> Thanks nj and pj for your help. Doubling my budget would help, but Im used to used to starting small first then going bigger in the future. I'll definitrly look at my LBS. I'll go from there and come back with further questions.


Your welcome. My doubling the budget was not to get a high end bike but to get a solid entry level bike. Maybe you can do that at $750, but tough to go much below that for a new road bike.


----------



## gaspi101

NJBiker72 said:


> Your welcome. My doubling the budget was not to get a high end bike but to get a solid entry level bike. Maybe you can do that at $750, but tough to go much below that for a new road bike.


Don't know, brother--I just bought my little brother a 2012 Giant Defy with Shimano 2300 at $629. I was surprised at how smooth it shifted, being that it's the entry-level shimano component group (I guess a step below Sora). That's a really well-made bike and a great starter. Also, the 2012 Trek 1.(something) was also selling for the same price--both butted aluminum but looked great and rode solid.


----------



## NJBiker72

gaspi101 said:


> Don't know, brother--I just bought my little brother a 2012 Giant Defy with Shimano 2300 at $629. I was surprised at how smooth it shifted, being that it's the entry-level shimano component group (I guess a step below Sora). That's a really well-made bike and a great starter. Also, the 2012 Trek 1.(something) was also selling for the same price--both butted aluminum but looked great and rode solid.


That's a great deal on the Giant. Even if the components are not too good.


----------



## eftz

how are those bikes? Looks like I can get a brand new Defy 5 for $600-700.


----------



## PJ352

eftz said:


> how are those bikes? Looks like I can get a brand new Defy 5 for $600-700.


Definitely worth a look... and a test ride. Defy are nice bikes and IMO a good choice for an entry level buyer. Just make sure the bike fits well and ride/ handling is to your liking. 

Don't fret over component groups. To a large extent, as you go up the model line the main differences are nicer finishes, lighter weight and a level of refinement. When set up/ adjusted properly, they all function well and will prove durable.


----------



## eftz

Ill take a look. I did find a 2008 Jamis Ventura Comp road bike for $400. Says Shimano components, Sora/Tiagra mix. San Marco Ischia Saddle with less than 500 miles. Is this a reasonable price? I heard great things about Jamis


----------



## PJ352

eftz said:


> Ill take a look. I did find a 2008 Jamis Ventura Comp road bike for $400. Says Shimano components, Sora/Tiagra mix. San Marco Ischia Saddle with less than 500 miles. Is this a reasonable price? I heard great things about Jamis


They're nice bikes, but even with low miles it's still 4 years old with an original MSRP of $750, so at $400 I think it's over priced. 

Here are the specs:
BikePedia - 2008 Jamis Ventura Comp Complete Bicycle

If you're interested, go check it out and test ride it. But remember, no matter the price, if it doesn't fit well, it's no bargain. 

I suggest having any bike of interest assessed mechanically and for fit before committing to a purchase.


----------



## gaspi101

eftz said:


> how are those bikes? Looks like I can get a brand new Defy 5 for $600-700.


That's the one, the Defy 5. Truth to tell, the bike looks like a $1,500 bike, with the aero designed frameset. I rode it a few miles and was very surprised at how stiff and responsive the ride was. The brakes are good, although I would obviously not descent the French Alps at 100kph on them. For an entry level road bike, I'm not sure it gets better than this bike. Solid frame, solid geometry, well designed and put together, and with quality components and materials. Sounds like I work for Giant, huh? Haha, no and I'm a Specialized guy myself. But at this price range, I'm not sure there's anything better.


----------



## tlg

eftz said:


> Ill take a look. I did find a 2008 Jamis Ventura Comp road bike for $400. Says Shimano components, Sora/Tiagra mix. San Marco Ischia Saddle with less than 500 miles. Is this a reasonable price? I heard great things about Jamis


Personally, anytime someone says a bike has "x" number of miles, I take it to mean double that. 


PJ352 said:


> They're nice bikes, but even with low miles it's still 4 years old with an original MSRP of $750, so at $400 I think it's over priced.


 Agreed. The going rate for used bikes over 1-2yrs old is almost always 50% of MSRP. And less if the bike is not in excellent condition.


----------



## Porschefan

gaspi101 said:


> That's the one, the Defy 5. Truth to tell, the bike looks like a $1,500 bike, with the aero designed frameset. I rode it a few miles and was very surprised at how stiff and responsive the ride was. The brakes are good, although I would obviously not descent the French Alps at 100kph on them. For an entry level road bike, I'm not sure it gets better than this bike. Solid frame, solid geometry, well designed and put together, and with quality components and materials. Sounds like I work for Giant, huh? Haha, no and I'm a Specialized guy myself. But at this price range, I'm not sure there's anything better.


See at Giant's website:

*HERE*

That certainly is a nice-LOOKING bike. If anyone has more real-world feedback on it, I'll be watching this thread for it. $700, brand-new. I did read somewhere that it is not the same frame as the higher-level Defy's, but still......

The site description also seems to indicate that it's built more for comfort than speed--any feedback?


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> See at Giant's website:
> 
> *HERE*
> 
> That certainly is a nice-LOOKING bike. If anyone has more real-world feedback on it, I'll be watching this thread for it. $700, brand-new. * I did read somewhere that it is not the same frame as the higher-level Defy's*, but still......
> 
> The site description also seems to indicate that it's built more for comfort than speed--any feedback?


According to the specs, the frame is shared through the Defy line - up to the ~$1400 model. What changes is the fork - alu on the lower end model, CF/ alu at the higher end.

Relaxed geo bikes are intended to meet the needs of most recreational riders. Meaning, most don't race or have the need for substantial saddle to bar drop, thus the taller head tubes. The chainstays, fork rake and resultant stretched wheelbase also lend themselves to a more comfortable ride with more predictable steering and handling. 

As far as their capabilities to go fast, that lies with the 'motor' (the rider). If you follow the pro circuit, you know that the Paris-Roubaix is consistently won by cyclists riding 'endurance'/ relaxed geo bikes. So make no mistake, they're fast, race-worthy bikes.


----------



## Porschefan

PJ352 said:


> According to the specs, the frame is shared through the Defy line - up to the ~$1400 model. What changes is the fork - alu on the lower end model, CF/ alu at the higher end.
> 
> Relaxed geo bikes are intended to meet the needs of most recreational riders. Meaning, most don't race or have the need for substantial saddle to bar drop, thus the taller head tubes. The chainstays, fork rake and resultant stretched wheelbase also lend themselves to a more comfortable ride with more predictable steering and handling.
> 
> As far as their capabilities to go fast, that lies with the 'motor' (the rider). If you follow the pro circuit, you know that the Paris-Roubaix is consistently won by cyclists riding 'endurance'/ relaxed geo bikes. So make no mistake, they're fast, race-worthy bikes.


I'm sure it's plenty fast for someone like me.... My favorite LBS sells Giant, so I'll check on these next time I'm there.


----------



## 768Q

Bought my first real bike recently on CL, great place to search out a ride, bought my like new Diamondback Insight there for $150 and will be getting a full road bike soon! Good Luck all!


----------



## fwd_cow

*Beginner Again...*

35 years ago as a young teen through early 20's I rode 3-4000 miles per year with gear...tent, pack, food, on Schwinn LeTours. Marrige, kids, jobs, the usual put the kibosh to that. Now at 52 I decided to get back into it. I am amazed by the build/weight/smoothness of these new bikes. I purchased a $500.00 Vilano (Chinese) with carbon forks, 17.5 lbs. I used several size/fit calculators online and tuned every aspect and I must say the bike fits very well, very comfortable. As a re-beginner, I wasn't about to spend more than that until I knew I really wanted to do this. Well 3 months into it and I'm already looking to move up to real quality. What an addictive blast! I forgot how enjoyable road biking can be. I am averaging 70 miles per week, don't care about the speed but I do know it has increased dramatically without trying. My area is very hilly so its 4 mph up and 40 mph down. I assume it averages out.
What I have found is that these bliss-ninny bikers are incredibly rude and obnoxious (I live in a very tourist/wealthy vacation area). A week ago I was riding and went by several riders, each sporting probably 5 grand each of bike and gear. They laughed at me---blabbing on about my cheap bike, ect. What a bunch of pompous idiots. 
If that happens to any of you don't be discouraged.


----------



## PJ352

fwd_cow said:


> 35 years ago as a young teen through early 20's I rode 3-4000 miles per year with gear...tent, pack, food, on Schwinn LeTours. Marrige, kids, jobs, the usual put the kibosh to that. Now at 52 I decided to get back into it. I am amazed by the build/weight/smoothness of these new bikes. I purchased a $500.00 Vilano (Chinese) with carbon forks, 17.5 lbs. I used several size/fit calculators online and tuned every aspect and I must say the bike fits very well, very comfortable. As a re-beginner, I wasn't about to spend more than that until I knew I really wanted to do this. Well 3 months into it and I'm already looking to move up to real quality. What an addictive blast! I forgot how enjoyable road biking can be. I am averaging 70 miles per week, don't care about the speed but I do know it has increased dramatically without trying. My area is very hilly so its 4 mph up and 40 mph down. I assume it averages out.
> What I have found is that these bliss-ninny bikers are incredibly rude and obnoxious (I live in a very tourist/wealthy vacation area). A week ago I was riding and went by several riders, each sporting probably 5 grand each of bike and gear. They laughed at me---blabbing on about my cheap bike, ect. What a bunch of pompous idiots.
> If that happens to any of you don't be discouraged.


Glad you decided to (re)join us (cyclists). 

FWIW one of my bikes ran somewhere around $4,500 and if I see other riders, I smile and give a nod with nary a concern for their 'gear'. As you know (thankfully), not all are like the bunch you encountered.


----------



## fwd_cow

Yes I meant to add that those uppity folks are the exception, not the rule. Thanks, glad to be back...I'll be out of work in an hour and on my bike. Great addiction!


----------



## [email protected]

I'm a newbie to Road biking and new to Roadbike review forum so pls excuse me if I'm not doing this right.

Hello Everyone!

I have a budget of $2000 for my first Road bike and I am exactly 5' feet in height. Can you give me tips, advice and recommendation on the brand name and size of bike to purchase?


----------



## PJ352

[email protected] said:


> I'm a newbie to Road biking and new to Roadbike review forum so pls excuse me if I'm not doing this right.
> 
> Hello Everyone!
> 
> I have a budget of $2000 for my first Road bike and I am exactly 5' feet in height. Can you give me tips, advice and recommendation on the brand name and size of bike to purchase?


First off, welcome to RBR. Second, even though you state your height as 5', rather than assume (and given your ID) please specify your gender. It'll affect some responses re: bike geometry/ options. 

Also, does your budget include the bike, accessories (helmet, apparel, pedals, saddle bag, etc.) or is that just for the complete bike.

Till we know a little more, some general advice. The two main criteria to consider when shopping for a bike are intended uses (recreational/ fitness rides, endurance/ charity rides, touring, competition) and fit. Once intended uses are defined, visit some LBS's in your area, discuss your price range, those uses/ goals, cycling experiences (if any) fitness and let the shop recommend some brands/ models. From there, get sized/ fitted and head out (on the roads) for test rides, focusing on fit/ feel, ride and handling. Once the field is narrowed, your decision should be a relatively easy one.

Along with shopping for a bike, shop for shops. Just as you use test rides to narrow your choices for bikes, use the LBS visits to whittle your choice for a preferred shop. The reputable LBS's will emphasize the importance of getting sizing/ fit right, and urge you to test ride the bikes of interest. Ideally, the bike you prefer is at the shop you prefer, but that's not always the case and a decision has to be made on what (and where) to buy.

BTW, don't look to the internet for sizing advice. Frame sizes vary by brand/ model, so giving you a number will only serve to confuse. Leave that to the fitter at the LBS, who'll see you, assess your proportions/ fitness and work one on one with you during the fit process.


----------



## bdjohnson121

Avid mountain biker looking to buy my first road bike. I'm a pretty big guy 6' 3" 225, and am looking for a road bike to improve my fitness. I have a budget of about $1000. I'm pretty good with a wrench and maintain all of my own mountain bikes so I am fairly comfortable purchasing online. I know this is a fairly redundant post as I'm sure there are several others just like me. Looking to be steered in the correct direction. I think I would prefer ordering online as the deals are better, but I know that fit is a bigger issue with road bikes than it is with mountain bikes.


----------



## jnslance

*Newbie Looking for Recommended LBS*

Hello All,

So as cliche' as I'm sure this is at this point I'm a completely green interested potential rider. I know absolutely nothing in the way of riding, however I've done enough reading on here to at least determine that the general consensus is that I should make my way over to an LBS to establish a good relationship and get proper fitting. That being said I was hoping someone on here could perhaps steer me in the direction (no pun intended) of a reputable Bike Shop? (Miami/South Florida area). 

Thanks alot and looking forward to riding soon!

Lance


----------



## PJ352

jnslance said:


> Hello All,
> 
> So as cliche' as I'm sure this is at this point I'm a completely green interested potential rider. I know absolutely nothing in the way of riding, however I've done enough reading on here to at least determine that the general consensus is that* I should make my way over to an LBS to establish a good relationship and get proper fitting*. That being said I was hoping someone on here could perhaps steer me in the direction (no pun intended) of a reputable Bike Shop? (Miami/South Florida area).
> 
> Thanks alot and looking forward to riding soon!
> 
> Lance


Good plan! :thumbsup:

As far as finding reputable shops in your area, you could 1) boost your post count, then start a thread in the regional section of the forum, or 2) since you've already done some upfront reading/ research, hunt out the reputable shops yourself. The latter gives you the advantage of picking the shop yourself, since you'll be the one utilizing their services. 

Once you know the ground rules, it's pretty easy identifying the better shops, because they:
- ask for input on your intended uses/ goals, cycling background, fitness, price range. In other words, show an interest in you/ motivation in assisting in the bike buying process.
- emphasize the importance of fit, urging you to test ride the bikes of interest (out on the roads), sizing/ fitting you to them beforehand.
- get feedback on riding impressions, answering any questions you may have. 

These are really the fundamentals of a good shop. Anything else (group rides, discounts on accessories, post-purchase tune-ups) are icing on the cake, so to speak.

Folks think identifying a good shop is difficult, but once you find one, you'll know it. They instill confidence and make the purchasing process fun.


----------



## jnslance

*Looking at purchasing used Specialized*



gaspi101 said:


> Absolutely excellent advice. My first bike was a Trek 1000c (bought two months ago), bought at Craigslist for a little over $300.00--Excellent bike, Shimano Sora all around, which got the job done--No climbing in Miami. Did a 100+ mile ride with zero discomfort, and have only recently upgraded to a 2011 Specialized Roubaix Elite so I can keep up with those 19-21mph beasts. If I was not an impulsive and capricious nut, I would have been very happy with my Trek 1000c for a long long time.


Hello, I'm looking at purchasing a used Specialized Allez. My question is when you purchased your Trek, How did you handle getting Fitted for the bike?


----------



## comfortflyer

If you are in Canada, you should be checking out kijiji.ca. Please let me know of other good source for used bikes in Ontario.


----------



## PJ352

jnslance said:


> Hello, I'm looking at purchasing a used Specialized Allez. My question is when you purchased your Trek, How did you handle getting Fitted for the bike?


If you're looking to buy used, ask the seller to bring the bike to a LBS of your choice to have it mechanically assessed. While there, you can also ask them to assess sizing for you and if you decide to purchase it, opt to have the LBS do a standard fitting. Most run about $50 +/- some.


----------



## jnslance

PJ352 said:


> If you're looking to buy used, ask the seller to bring the bike to a LBS of your choice to have it mechanically assessed. While there, you can also ask them to assess sizing for you and if you decide to purchase it, opt to have the LBS do a standard fitting. Most run about $50 +/- some.


An LBS won't be offended because I'm asking them to inspect and fit me for a bike that I didn't purchase with them will they?


----------



## PJ352

jnslance said:


> An LBS won't be offended because I'm asking them to inspect and fit me for a bike that I didn't purchase with them will they?


Not if they're smart. You're a prospective customer. Remember, there are a number of purchases that come after the bike purchase itself. Helmet, shoes, pedals, apparel, saddle bag, flat repair kits, tools, tuning/ maintenance... so when you consider that potential for earning your business, they should be receptive to fitting you (which they'll also make $$ on). 

And if they're not receptive to the idea, go to another shop.


----------



## jnslance

*Used Allez for sale*



jnslance said:


> An LBS won't be offended because I'm asking them to inspect and fit me for a bike that I didn't purchase with them will they?


So A 2002 Specialized Allez A1 is available on Craigslist for $325. I'm thinking I can get him down to $300. What do you guys think? Here's the link: 

http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/bik/3112360016.html


----------



## madflava54

Based on what I have read from these forums, it does not appear to be a great deal. It's 10 years old with components that aren't manufactured as well as the "higher end" components. You won't be sure how well the guy maintained his bike. The seller does seem to really be emphasizing those Dura-Ace brakes though. Being a newbie rider myself, I don't feel comfortable buying use and have been shopping around for a bike. I've tried out a Trek 1.1, Felt Z95?, Fuji Roubaix 1.0 and 2.0, Fuji Newest 1.0, Jamis Ventura, Giant Defy 2, and Specialized Allez. None of these bikes really stuck out more than another, and I might just go with the Roubaix 2.0 cause of price. 

Sorry. Long reply and not sure if that helps. Not sure why I am replying since I know very little.


----------



## PJ352

madflava54 said:


> Based on what I have read from these forums, it does not appear to be a great deal. It's 10 years old with components that aren't manufactured as well as the "higher end" components. You won't be sure how well the guy maintained his bike. The seller does seem to really be emphasizing those Dura-Ace brakes though. Being a newbie rider myself, I don't feel comfortable buying use and have been shopping around for a bike. I've tried out a Trek 1.1, Felt Z95?, Fuji Roubaix 1.0 and 2.0, Fuji Newest 1.0, Jamis Ventura, Giant Defy 2, and Specialized Allez. None of these bikes really stuck out more than another, and I might just go with the Roubaix 2.0 cause of price.
> 
> Sorry. Long reply and not sure if that helps. *Not sure why I am replying since I know very little.*


Actually, you've provided some solid info here. Good luck in your hunt for that new bike.


----------



## polywannacraker

*question*

I'm about to buy my first bike from this guy on ebay. It's a used Felt z6 for about $900... I think its a good price it goes new for 1600 (all entry level components sora and Tiagra)... However I'm very skeptical... after doing some research i found this same Felt bike from a dealer in Indonesia who sells them for $800 brand new. Of course we all know this is a scam and they are most likely imitation felt with some fake stickers. My question is: how do i know this guy on ebay isn't selling me one of this fake bikes? how can i check if the serial number is legit?

Thanks for your help guys =)


----------



## PJ352

polywannacraker said:


> I'm about to buy my first bike from this guy on ebay. It's a used Felt z6 for about $900... I think its a good price it goes new for 1600 (all entry level components sora and Tiagra)... However I'm very skeptical... after doing some research i found this same Felt bike from a dealer in Indonesia who sells them for $800 brand new. Of course we all know this is a scam and they are most likely imitation felt with some fake stickers. *My question is: how do i know this guy on ebay isn't selling me one of this fake bikes? how can i check if the serial number is legit?*
> 
> Thanks for your help guys =)


Unless you get the serial number from the seller and ask Felt to verify it, you don't know.

But beyond that, there's more to be concerned about here. This being a used bike you'll get no warranty, and being a CF frameset upon visual inspection still have no way of knowing that the frame is without flaws. To do that, there's a specific type of ultra sound used - a process not normally available to us or even most LBS's.

BTW, I don't know what year this Felt is, but according to the specs, there are no Sora components, so (to avoid unpleasant surprises) be sure to check the OE specs against the sellers. Oftentimes they'll install spare parts (sometimes calling them 'upgrades') to ready bikes for sale. 

My advice is to keep your shopping local - preferably at LBS's selling used. That way, you get to look the bike over, test ride it, get some sizing/ fit assistance and maybe get a 30 day warranty.


----------



## silenceforus

alien4fish said:


> I know huh? thats how it goes I guess, And just wait till have the bike sitting your living room, a bike just like yours in the right size will suddenly appear on CL in your size for half the price Well my Bike just came in to Performance bike. I Think they are going to assemble it tommarow and I will get fit and pick it up on Friday. I cant wait its going to be so much fun:thumbsup:
> Oh and heres my current bike.....


Good to know Performance is a decent choice. I'm considering either a Scattante or a Fuji... can't decide


----------



## gaspi101

polywannacraker said:


> I'm about to buy my first bike from this guy on ebay. It's a used Felt z6 for about $900... I think its a good price it goes new for 1600 (all entry level components sora and Tiagra)... However I'm very skeptical... after doing some research i found this same Felt bike from a dealer in Indonesia who sells them for $800 brand new. Of course we all know this is a scam and they are most likely imitation felt with some fake stickers. My question is: how do i know this guy on ebay isn't selling me one of this fake bikes? how can i check if the serial number is legit?
> 
> Thanks for your help guys =)


Don't buy the bike. That's a lot of money to throw away, and the chances you're doing that here are huge. If you're goingto buy a bike for $900 with Tiagra components, take a look at Giant and Trek's 2012 models at your local LBS--you can get one of these for about $700, and you'll be guaranteed to get a good bike that fits you. Again, going for an eBay. Ike for $900 is a bad idea, particularly in this case.


----------



## Lkheat11

I'm assuming you mean the 2010 Z6. I just purchased one a few months back. Very good bike. It does use Sora - Front Derailleur:	Shimano Sora braze-on, double
I bought mine for $1099.99 brand new from a authorized Felt LBS about 3 months ago with 2 years free adjustments. So 900.00 does seem to be fair but I do agree with PJ that not having Felt back it up if something goes wrong is worrisome.. Even though it has entry components that eventually I will upgrade, I am happy with the bike. Had a lot of compliments on the bike as well, looks sharp.


----------



## polywannacraker

Thanks for your advise. I've been going to all LBS around my area and all of them offer the same thing: Very entry level components on a decent aluminum frame for about $800. The next step up goes for over a thousand. 
Now the million dollar question is: risk it with a much better bike (used) for $900? or go very entry level/low components for the same price. 
Keep in mind this is gonna be my first road bike and I have to buy all the extras such as helmet, pedals, shoes etc...


----------



## gaspi101

polywannacraker said:


> Thanks for your advise. I've been going to all LBS around my area and all of them offer the same thing: Very entry level components on a decent aluminum frame for about $800. The next step up goes for over a thousand.
> Now the million dollar question is: risk it with a much better bike (used) for $900? or go very entry level/low components for the same price.
> Keep in mind this is gonna be my first road bike and I have to buy all the extras such as helmet, pedals, shoes etc...


At the end of the day, you want to buy your first bike from an actual shop, which will size you on the bike as well as do refittings and stand behind their bikes. Being properly fitted on a road bike is extremely important. You can be riding a $10,000 badly fitted and the bike will be worthless to you. And the chance of getting a lemon over eBay are ginormous. The Felt you're looking at is pretty much the same as most other entry-level roadbikes on the $600-$800 level. By the way, of your LBS's cheapest road bike is in the $800's, go to another LBS because that one is ripping you off. You can get a Trek 1.2 or a Giant Defy 4 for $640.00 right now. Both great bikes to begin riding with. 

Bottom line: eBay for first bike not a great idea. Go to a good LBS instead. 

Cheers!


----------



## PJ352

polywannacraker said:


> Thanks for your advise. I've been going to all LBS around my area and all of them offer the same thing: Very entry level components on a decent aluminum frame for about $800. The next step up goes for over a thousand.
> *Now the million dollar question is: risk it with a much better bike (used) for $900? or go very entry level/low components for the same price. *
> Keep in mind this is gonna be my first road bike and I have to buy all the extras such as helmet, pedals, shoes etc...


It's your money, so ultimately that's a question you'll need to answer. 

Remember, besides the standard risks of buying used (sight unseen) this is a full CF frameset, so IMO the risks are greater. And while you're inference seems to be that you should buy used because you need other cycling gear, it could easily be rationalized that this being your first road bike, you need the value added services a reputable LBS provides (for reasons detailed by gaspi101). And with some shopping around, you're apt to pay no more.

Good luck, whatever you decide.


----------



## G7w7

Help for a newbie?
Hello everyone, I am a newbie, except that I rode a crappy hybrid for commuting to high school for 5 years, back in India. Now want to buy a road bike and try it out. So, don't want to spend too much and finding in the end that this is not my thing. 
My motivation is to do some exercise and have some fun  and might start commuting on the bike. 

My budget is around 500-600 bucks for the bike and 100-200 for the accessories. Can you guys help me buy a bike? I know bikesDirect.com is a cheap place to buy bikes.. do you recommend me buying one from there? I am willing to pay a LBS for fitting. Any inputs will be greatly appreciated!
One of the bikes I liked on the site was GTR 5 series that they were selling for 500$.
I somehow have a weakness for white bikes 

Please suggest!


----------



## G7w7

Also, I visited a LBS and the guy said a 54 would fit me. except that a Fuji 53 was not too comfortable as the guy said the bar connecting handle and frame was too long for Fujis.
I am 5'9.5" tall and 165 lbs.


----------



## PJ352

G7w7 said:


> Help for a newbie?
> Hello everyone, I am a newbie, except that I rode a crappy hybrid for commuting to high school for 5 years, back in India. Now want to buy a road bike and try it out. So, don't want to spend too much and finding in the end that this is not my thing.
> My motivation is to do some exercise and have some fun  and might start commuting on the bike.
> 
> My budget is around 500-600 bucks for the bike and 100-200 for the accessories. Can you guys help me buy a bike?* I know bikesDirect.com is a cheap place to buy bikes.. do you recommend me buying one from there? I am willing to pay a LBS for fitting. *Any inputs will be greatly appreciated!
> One of the bikes I liked on the site was GTR 5 series that they were selling for 500$.
> I somehow have a weakness for white bikes
> 
> Please suggest!


Without doing some upfront work to pin down sizing requirements, the problem with the uninitiated buying online is that they're essentially guessing at what size to buy. Compounding this is the fact that one brands 54 is anothers 56.. or 52 which might partly explain why that 53 Fuji didn't feel quite right.

If you want to buy online, I suggest taking ~$50 of your funds, finding a reputable LBS and get a standard fitting. Bring the geometry chart for the GTR 5 series with you and explain your intentions to the fitter. Once the fitting is done, the fitter will hopefully help you pick the frame size that most closely matches that of the test bike. Going through this process will better your odds of getting the right size bike. Once that's accomplished and you get your bike, a fitting should go relatively smoothly. 

BTW, re: your comment that you'll pay an LBS for a fitting. That's fine, but to have a fitting work, you need to have the right size bike. Guess wrong on sizing, and a fitting will require unnecessary compromises and probably never feel quite right... like the Fuji.

As an alternate plan, consider checking out LBS's in your area selling used bikes. Going this route gets you some sizing/ fitting assistance, a chance to test ride the bikes beforehand and possibly a 30 day warranty.


----------



## Royale81

Hello, newbie here, looking to do the non regular route of building my own bike as im reasoably mechanically inclined, also a friend owns an LBS and is more than happy to help with questions. 

Having said all that, I plan to ride an event in 3 months. It's a 100km ride and i've never rode this distance previously. It's not particularly hilly, definitely no mountain climbs. Just the everyday tarmac road. 

Based on that what would you guys recommend as a good reliable and easy to use groupset? Something that fits within say $500-$600 max?


----------



## PJ352

Royale81 said:


> Hello, newbie here, looking to do the non regular route of building my own bike as im reasoably mechanically inclined, also a friend owns an LBS and is more than happy to help with questions.
> 
> Having said all that, I plan to ride an event in 3 months. It's a 100km ride and i've never rode this distance previously. It's not particularly hilly, definitely no mountain climbs. Just the everyday tarmac road.
> 
> Based on that what would you guys recommend as a good reliable and easy to use groupset? Something that fits within say $500-$600 max?


What does the $500-$600 price range represent? Frame, fork, wheels, groupset.... in other words, the completed bike? Or is that just for the groupset? Need more info.

Just a fyi; unless you have parts lying around, it'll almost always cost more to build up a bike than buying one complete. Complicating things further, you'll basically be guessing at sizing, unless there's a comparable, built up frame you can test ride.


----------



## eftz

Hey guys, I just wanted to say thanks for helping me buy my first road bike. A 2004 Trek 1500 on CL. BUT I feel like I made a mistake in size. So, I got questions..

The bike has no markings indicating the size, so according to my measurements, it is a 52cm. When I went to go check it out and test ride it, everything felt find. I have about an inch or less clearing the top tube(stand over height I believe?). After buying it, I rode on it a couple times and felt good about it UNTIL I took a decent sharp turn. When I started pedaling and turning at the same time, my front foot would sometimes graze the front tire. Did I make a bad decision? If I went to a 54cm, wouldn't I not be able to stand over the top tube?

Any help would be awesome, thanks!


----------



## Royale81

PJ352 said:


> What does the $500-$600 price range represent? Frame, fork, wheels, groupset.... in other words, the completed bike? Or is that just for the groupset? Need more info.
> 
> Just a fyi; unless you have parts lying around, it'll almost always cost more to build up a bike than buying one complete. Complicating things further, you'll basically be guessing at sizing, unless there's a comparable, built up frame you can test ride.


No parts lying around  The price indicated was for the groupset only. 

I just find something attractive about building my own parts bin special. 

As for sizing i am stopping by the shop to test out a few bikes to see what I like. I suppose I could ask my friend these similar questions but thought i'd go in with a bit of a ball park first in terms of components.

As you might be able to tell, part of this is the mechanical side of things, not just the riding side of it which is a healthy by-product.


----------



## TattooedMtBiker

Just skimmed the first couple page...can't wait to sink my teeth into this thread.


----------



## G7w7

PJ352 said:


> Without doing some upfront work to pin down sizing requirements, the problem with the uninitiated buying online is that they're essentially guessing at what size to buy. Compounding this is the fact that one brands 54 is anothers 56.. or 52 which might partly explain why that 53 Fuji didn't feel quite right.
> 
> If you want to buy online, I suggest taking ~$50 of your funds, finding a reputable LBS and get a standard fitting. Bring the geometry chart for the GTR 5 series with you and explain your intentions to the fitter. Once the fitting is done, the fitter will hopefully help you pick the frame size that most closely matches that of the test bike. Going through this process will better your odds of getting the right size bike. Once that's accomplished and you get your bike, a fitting should go relatively smoothly.
> 
> BTW, re: your comment that you'll pay an LBS for a fitting. That's fine, but to have a fitting work, you need to have the right size bike. Guess wrong on sizing, and a fitting will require unnecessary compromises and probably never feel quite right... like the Fuji.
> 
> As an alternate plan, consider checking out LBS's in your area selling used bikes. Going this route gets you some sizing/ fitting assistance, a chance to test ride the bikes beforehand and possibly a 30 day warranty.


Thanks PJ352 for your response, this is definitely very helpful!
Standard fitting was something I was not aware of. Will do that and share results here on the thread. 

Another question about the bike I am looking at, it has got Shimano derailleures and microshift shifters. I think I heard both should be of same brand.. is that a red flag?

link to bike: www .bikesdirect. com/products/gt/gtr_series5.htm


----------



## PJ352

G7w7 said:


> Thanks PJ352 for your response, this is definitely very helpful!
> Standard fitting was something I was not aware of. Will do that and share results here on the thread.
> 
> Another question about the bike I am looking at, it has got Shimano derailleures and microshift shifters. I think I heard both should be of same brand.. is that a red flag?
> 
> link to bike: www .bikesdirect. com/products/gt/gtr_series5.htm


No red flag. Shifters and der's don't have to be the same brand. They have to be compatible (and these are).


----------



## PJ352

Royale81 said:


> No parts lying around  The price indicated was for the groupset only.
> 
> I just find something attractive about building my own parts bin special.
> 
> As for sizing i am stopping by the shop to test out a few bikes to see what I like. I suppose I could ask my friend these similar questions but thought i'd go in with a bit of a ball park first in terms of components.
> 
> As you might be able to tell, part of this is the mechanical side of things, not just the riding side of it which is a healthy by-product.


Gotcha. That price range should get you Shimano's new 10 speed Tiagra groupset or SRAM's Apex. Both function well and will prove durable, so IMO it comes down to preference for feel (ergonomics) and shifting methods. If your friend owns an LBS, it should be no problem test riding both and deciding on a preference.


----------



## G7w7

PJ352 said:


> No red flag. Shifters and der's don't have to be the same brand. They have to be compatible (and these are).


ok, great.. may i request you to look at the parts and see if something is alarmingly bad. again, i am a beginner.. so good/bad will be dependent on this fact

Frame -> NEW Hydroformed /6061 Aluminum Frame w/ Forged Dropouts. 1 1/8" Head Tube.
Fork -> New Gt Road Design W/ F.O.C. Carbon Blades And 6061 Aluminum 1 1/8" Steerer
Derailleurs -> Shimano 2300 front / Shimano 2300 rear
Shifters -> Microshift R82 forged dual control 8-speed
Brake Calipers / Levers -> RC 462 Dual Pivot / Microshift
Hubs -> Formula Sealed Mechanism, alloy 32 Hole w/QR
Rims -> Jalco DRX 4000 with CNC sidewall 28 Hole Front 32 Hole Rear Spokes: Stainless 15 gauge Straight
Crank BottomBracket -> FSA Tempo Compact, 50/34 / FSA Sealed Cartridge Square Taper
Cassette/Chain -> Sun Race HG, 8-speed / KMC HG-40, 8-speed
Saddle -> GTw Bio Morphic Dual Density
Seatpost -> GT 2 bolt alloy road, 31.6x300mm
Stem GT design 3D forged 6061, 4 bolt face plate

Handlebars -> GT design Shallow drop road
Pedals -> VP Lo Profile Nylon with Clip / Strap
Tires/Tubes Schwalbe Lugano, 700x23c / Presta valve tubes


----------



## PJ352

G7w7 said:


> ok, great.. may i request you to look at the parts and see if something is alarmingly bad. again, i am a beginner.. so good/bad will be dependent on this fact
> 
> Frame -> NEW Hydroformed /6061 Aluminum Frame w/ Forged Dropouts. 1 1/8" Head Tube.
> Fork -> New Gt Road Design W/ F.O.C. Carbon Blades And 6061 Aluminum 1 1/8" Steerer
> Derailleurs -> Shimano 2300 front / Shimano 2300 rear
> Shifters -> Microshift R82 forged dual control 8-speed
> Brake Calipers / Levers -> RC 462 Dual Pivot / Microshift
> Hubs -> Formula Sealed Mechanism, alloy 32 Hole w/QR
> Rims -> Jalco DRX 4000 with CNC sidewall 28 Hole Front 32 Hole Rear Spokes: Stainless 15 gauge Straight
> Crank BottomBracket -> FSA Tempo Compact, 50/34 / FSA Sealed Cartridge Square Taper
> Cassette/Chain -> Sun Race HG, 8-speed / KMC HG-40, 8-speed
> Saddle -> GTw Bio Morphic Dual Density
> Seatpost -> GT 2 bolt alloy road, 31.6x300mm
> Stem GT design 3D forged 6061, 4 bolt face plate
> 
> Handlebars -> GT design Shallow drop road
> Pedals -> VP Lo Profile Nylon with Clip / Strap
> Tires/Tubes Schwalbe Lugano, 700x23c / Presta valve tubes


There's nothing alarmingly bad. The bike is spec'd well for it's price point, so IMO it's competitively priced. 

More important is to get sizing right, so I suggest following my previous advice and take the steps I outlined to ensure getting that right. The rest will fall into place.


----------



## jamesmoody

*Fit?*

Greeting everyone!

Brand new member and brand new cyclist. I just purchased my first road bike this weekend, and I really wish I'd come and read some of these posts first!!

Now I'm concerned that I might have made a mistake. First a little backgroud:

I live in Miami, and given the terrain my friends suggested that I purchase a road bike. Being a complete beginner I (stupidly) decided to get the absoulte cheapest bike I could find. I should have known better as I've learned this lesson from other hobbies: buying the cheapest possible will almost always leave you instantly dissatisifed. 

Sure enough, I got a beat up $60 road bike from some guys garage, and on my very first ride the derailleur bent and shot through the back spokes. Took it to my local bike shop, and was told that I needed a new derailleur, new chain, new back wheel, and a new front wheel because unbeknownst to me that was dented beyond repair.

So I decided to put that bike in the dumpster. Long story short, lesson learned. Kind of. Being the impatient person that I am I decided to only make half of the same mistake and went back to craiglist, and spent $400 on a much nicer road bike. Took it to the bike shop and the guy said it was a good deal, good components, and everything was working fine. 

So that's a step in the right direction. But now I've been reading a lot of posts about how "fit" is one of the most important things in buying a bike. Unfortunately that is not something that I know anything about, nor did I consider. Now I'm worried that I've wasted $400 in the same dumb way I wasted $60.

Before I got the bike I looked at a sizing chart online. I'm about 5'9'' and a half, and it seemed that 54-56cm was the right size. This bike was 54, and I thought that's all i needed to know.

But now I'm wondering, what else goes into a proper "fit?" I know seat hight and handlebar height is part of it as well. Assuming I have the correct size frame, are other aspects of "fit" things that can be adjusted? If so, I'm happy to spend the money at a a shop to get the bike properly adjusted. I'm just worried that when it comes to "fit" that I've bought a bike that will never fit correctly.

Any help from the more experienced riders would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!


----------



## PJ352

jamesmoody said:


> ... I've been reading a lot of posts about how "fit" is one of the most important things in buying a bike. Unfortunately that is not something that I know anything about, nor did I consider. Now I'm worried that I've wasted $400 in the same dumb way I wasted $60.
> 
> Before I got the bike I looked at a sizing chart online. I'm about 5'9'' and a half, and it seemed that 54-56cm was the right size. This bike was 54, and I thought that's all i needed to know.
> 
> But now I'm wondering, what else goes into a proper "fit?" I know seat hight and handlebar height is part of it as well. Assuming I have the correct size frame, are other aspects of "fit" things that can be adjusted? If so, I'm happy to spend the money at a a shop to get the bike properly adjusted. I'm just worried that when it comes to "fit" that I've bought a bike that will never fit correctly.
> 
> Any help from the more experienced riders would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!


Sorry to read about your past mistakes, but if it's any consolation:
1) many of use made them, and
2) your post shows that you now have a good, basic understanding of the importance of sizing and that it has to be right to get a good fit. 

Progress. 

My advice is to bring your bike to a reputable LBS/ fitter and have them assess sizing. If it's deemed 'correct', schedule a fitting and all should go well from there. If not, you're faced with the choice of either making the best of a fitting or reselling the bike.

Taking a step back to answer your questions, the main geo parameters to focus on are effective top tube (plays a part in reach) and head tube length (plays a part in saddle to bar drop). These are the basics, and from there adjustments are made to saddle (height, fore/ aft, tilt) stem (length and angle) and spacer setup. 

Without getting into too much detail, the goal is to get a riders f/r weight distribution right and get reach and drop in an appropriate range given the riders anatomy, fitness/ flexibility, riding experiences, personal preferences and style of riding. With your input, a fitter will consider these aspects during the fit process. Test rides and tweaks usually come after the initial (static) fit. 

HTH's...


----------



## jamesmoody

PJ352 said:


> Sorry to read about your past mistakes, but if it's any consolation:
> 1) many of use made them, and
> 2) your post shows that you now have a good, basic understanding of the importance of sizing and that it has to be right to get a good fit.
> 
> Progress.
> 
> My advice is to bring your bike to a reputable LBS/ fitter and have them assess sizing. If it's deemed 'correct', schedule a fitting and all should go well from there. If not, you're faced with the choice of either making the best of a fitting or reselling the bike.
> 
> Taking a step back to answer your questions, the main geo parameters to focus on are effective top tube (plays a part in reach) and head tube length (plays a part in saddle to bar drop). These are the basics, and from there adjustments are made to saddle (height, fore/ aft, tilt) stem (length and angle) and spacer setup.
> 
> Without getting into too much detail, the goal is to get a riders f/r weight distribution right and get reach and drop in an appropriate range given the riders anatomy, fitness/ flexibility, riding experiences, personal preferences and style of riding. With your input, a fitter will consider these aspects during the fit process. Test rides and tweaks usually come after the initial (static) fit.
> 
> HTH's...


Thanks for the advice! I'm going to ride over to my local shop after work. Hopefully I lucked out and got something I can work with!


----------



## G7w7

PJ352 said:


> There's nothing alarmingly bad. The bike is spec'd well for it's price point, so IMO it's competitively priced.
> 
> More important is to get sizing right, so I suggest following my previous advice and take the steps I outlined to ensure getting that right. The rest will fall into place.



cool! Thanks PJ352 again for replying. 
Going to a LBS for standard fitting this Thursday. will post the results here.


----------



## PJ352

G7w7 said:


> cool! Thanks PJ352 again for replying.
> Going to a LBS for standard fitting this Thursday. will post the results here.


Please do (and good luck).


----------



## PJ352

jamesmoody said:


> Thanks for the advice! I'm going to ride over to my local shop after work. Hopefully I lucked out and got something I can work with!


If possible, update us with their findings.


----------



## blakslee720

I bougt my first bike a few months ago on craigslist after my reasonably nice mountain bike was stolen. Not wanting to spend much at all I found a tidy 1987 peugeot monaco for $80. The only downside is that it doesn't have a front derallieur. My rides are around 18 miles with an average speed of 14.5 miles an hour, whcih I know is nothing to shout about but I am far from being in shape so i'm happy with that rate for now. Now that i've been riding for a bit, i'm starting tto have the itch for a nicer, modern bike


----------



## soufiz

Budget issues -- Redline Metro SPORT vs CLASSIC ???

I'm a newbie to bikes. Looking for a commuter/exercise bike that can handle 'tougher' terrain, hills, and less sensitive/aggressive than road bikes. My choices came down to these two ( redline metro sport vs the classic). I rode the sport and really liked it. I was pointed to the classic as a better option by the sells-man. Both were originally out of my price range. Now the classic feels a very high for me. Plus the orange is not really inconspicuous, which isnt my style.

How much is the difference between the two, and is the price for the upgrade really worth it, long-term?

thanks


----------



## aguydude

great advice guys, thanks!


----------



## G7w7

PJ352 said:


> Please do (and good luck).


an update.. got all done and bought Windsor Fens from bikes direct for 700. can't wait for it to ship..meanwhile will be buying the clothing today or tomorrow. 

The pedals it has are 'Road Clipless compatible with two bolt/spd sole shoes (not "spd-sl")' . Can anyone help me look for corresponding shoes?


----------



## PJ352

G7w7 said:


> an update.. got all done and bought Windsor Fens from bikes direct for 700. can't wait for it to ship..meanwhile will be buying the clothing today or tomorrow.
> 
> The pedals it has are 'Road Clipless compatible with two bolt/spd sole shoes (not "spd-sl")' . Can anyone help me look for corresponding shoes?


It's best to try shoes on (for comfort/ fit) before you buy, so I suggest visiting your LBS, telling them you need 2 bolt, SPD compatible shoes and go from there.

How'd the fitting go? Did the fitter assist with sizing you to a Windsor Fens?


----------



## AythanNyah09

I appreciate this thread. A bit long to read but good info here.


----------



## AythanNyah09

I would appreciate any help on ideas.

Me: Im a 40+ guy, 6'0" 250lbs. Big guy... Im purchasing a bike to get the weight down because I cant run due to my knees. I have decent cardio (due to Jiu Jitsu) but its time to get the weight down for the kiddos. Budget all together is probably 3k... if thats really needed? My overall goal is to commute to work a couple times a week (10m one way) and take a group ride on the weekends. Whether it be with coworkers or one of the local groups. (No clue how far... Ill assume <50m?)

Today I had intentions of purchasing a Bianchi Infinito (Ultegra). I did a test ride today and I found that I can feel a lot of the "ground roughness" while on the bike. Yes, the bike looks nice and feels comfortable but I thought the idea of a CF frame was to feel less road. Whats up with that? 

The LBS also recommended me a Bianchi Vigorelli. Steel bike with SRAM Apex. He mentioned if I was willing to purchase "multiple bikes (one for commute and other for weekend) in the future." Once I get my bike legs in check. I felt a lot less road and it was a very comfortable bike. I liked it a lot and it was twice as less as the Infinito. Which is a good thing on anyones budget! I also prefer the way SRAM shifts versus using the whole brake like the Shimano. I was wondering if thats common that a Steel bike is a smoother ride than a CF? I thought it was other way around?

Then I tried a Torelli. Even smoother bike. Steel. Price is only $100 above Vigorelli and Campy Veloce system. Which i liked the most out of all three.

My question is Torelli? Never heard of it until today. Is there something equivalent or recommended for the same price range? $2100 Are there any recommendations for "big guy riders" to start with or is it just a buy the best bike i can afford?


----------



## zuul99

Maybe common sense but i would NEVER buy a used carbon bike


----------



## new2rd

zuul99 said:


> Maybe common sense but i would NEVER buy a used carbon bike


Huh? Do you ride a carbon fiber bike? If so, isn't that a used CF bike? I recently sold a perfectly fine CF bike and the buyer was able to get a 1 1/2 yr old bike for half the price of a new one.


----------



## G7w7

PJ352 said:


> It's best to try shoes on (for comfort/ fit) before you buy, so I suggest visiting your LBS, telling them you need 2 bolt, SPD compatible shoes and go from there.
> 
> How'd the fitting go? Did the fitter assist with sizing you to a Windsor Fens?


Thanks PJ352 for your help. :thumbsup:

yes, the fitting was good, i took the dimensions for this bike with me... he said windsor fens is pretty close and the rest we will do it once bike has arrived. 

Also, I went to REI and got Shimano R087 shoes from them. I tried a few pairs and liked this one. This is compatible with both SPD n SPD-SL.

The bike will come tomorrow, so stay tuned for more newbie questions from me


----------



## NJBiker72

new2rd said:


> Huh? Do you ride a carbon fiber bike? If so, isn't that a used CF bike? I recently sold a perfectly fine CF bike and the buyer was able to get a 1 1/2 yr old bike for half the price of a new one.


How many times did you crash it? 

. . .


How is the buyer supposed to know that unless the seller discloses it. 

At the very least, it should be checked by a shop.


----------



## PJ352

NJBiker72 said:


> How many times did you crash it?
> 
> . . .
> 
> 
> How is the buyer supposed to know that unless the seller discloses it.
> 
> *At the very least, it should be checked by a shop.*


...and even then CF damage can go unnoticed. If it's internal, it takes a specific type of ultrasound test to 'see' it. Not an option for most bike shops. 

I'm with zuul99. Used CF = no warranty = big risk. In the case of buying used, alu and steel are far better options, IMO.


----------



## Porschefan

*2001 Lemond Buenos Aires for $500?*

This bike appeared on the local Craigslist and piqued my interest a bit, so I thought I'd see if there were any feedback on it here.

Here's the link to CL ad: 

*Lemond Buenos Aires*

And here's the link to the bike at Bikepedia: 

*2001 Lemond Buenos Aires*

Seller responded to my email saying that he believes he bought it in 2001, so it's pretty old. Components are Shimano 105. Wheels are Mavic Kyserium Equipes and are only two years old (per seller).

The frame is Reynolds 853 steel, which seems to have a lot of (nostalgic?) appeal for some, but what do I know? I kinda' like the yellow frame too ;-).

I'm wondering how something like this older bike might compare to a new Giant Defy--the $700-800 models? And how suitable it might be. At $500 it's definitely within budget.

I understand the standard warnings about getting the bike checked out and see if it fits, so I'm looking for comments that assume it's in good mechanical condition and fits.

TIA for any feedback.


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> This bike appeared on the local Craigslist and piqued my interest a bit, so I thought I'd see if there were any feedback on it here.
> 
> Here's the link to CL ad:
> 
> *Lemond Buenos Aires*
> 
> And here's the link to the bike at Bikepedia:
> 
> *2001 Lemond Buenos Aires*
> 
> Seller responded to my email saying that he believes he bought it in 2001, so it's pretty old. Components are Shimano 105. Wheels are Mavic Kyserium Equipes and are only two years old (per seller).
> 
> The frame is Reynolds 853 steel, which seems to have a lot of (nostalgic?) appeal for some, but what do I know? I kinda' like the yellow frame too ;-).
> 
> I'm wondering how something like this older bike might compare to a new Giant Defy--the $700-800 models? And how suitable it might be. At $500 it's definitely within budget.
> 
> I understand the standard warnings about getting the bike checked out and see if it fits, so I'm looking for comments that assume it's in good mechanical condition and fits.
> 
> TIA for any feedback.


In the interest of full disclosure, I'll offer three things upfront. 1) I've never owned a Lemond. 2) I like Lemonds and 3) I like steel bikes.

That said, as long as there's little or no internal or external rust, a 10 year old steel frame doesn't bother me much. They don't fatigue the same as aluminum frames, so (in relatively dry climates) could easily last 40+ years. But it's in your best interest to check the frame over for any signs of damage/ crashes, etc.

Re: the components (mainly the shifters) age/ use does matter. Depending on general condition, they _may_ need to be flushed and relubed. At the worst, they'll need to be replaced at some point in time. Assuming they're original (9 speed), if replacement were required, you're options would be to replace them with either Tiagra 4500, Sora or Microshifts. 

I'm not raising a red flag on the shifters, just making you aware that the most expensive part may (at some point) need to be replaced, and when that times comes, what your options would be. 

Understanding the warnings to get the bike assessed for mechanical condition and fit, if you think it's close to being sized correctly for you, I suggest checking it out. Look it over, check that the bearing assemblies run smooth (steering, hubs, bottom bracket) and test ride the bike. 

If something doesn't feel right mechanically or the bike is obviously too large or too small, move on. If it all falls into place, ask that the seller accompany you to the LBS for assessment. They should be able to provide an estimate of any repairs along with its overall worth.

HTH....


----------



## beartownrd

hi everyone. I've been riding a specialized cross trail sport 2011 for over a year now. average 40-100 might a week on local trails. I've been itching for a smoother, faster ride esp now that I'm riding more on the road. so I've been looking at road bikes. my lbs i know has the allez. my question is as a first bike and not really knowing much about road bikes, what model of the allez should I be looking at? I can spend up to a thousand. but will I see any difference between the compact and sport?


----------



## NJBiker72

Not an earth shattering difference but price is not that different either is it? I had a secteur sport which had a few benefits from the compact model. But looking at the specs it seems the biggest differences are shifters and wheels. 

If you can go up to the apex model i might look at that. I was not crazy about Sora.


----------



## PJ352

beartownrd said:


> hi everyone. I've been riding a specialized cross trail sport 2011 for over a year now. average 40-100 might a week on local trails. I've been itching for a smoother, faster ride esp now that I'm riding more on the road. so I've been looking at road bikes. my lbs i know has the allez. my question is as a first bike and not really knowing much about road bikes, what model of the allez should I be looking at? I can spend up to a thousand. but *will I see any difference between the compact and sport?*


They're essentially the same bike and there's no real functional differences between 2300 and Sora shifters. 

It's arguable, but the one difference that may matter in real world terms is the Sport adds a rear cog (9 speed) versus The base models 8 speed 2300.


----------



## new2rd

I would recommend checking out the mid compact apex.. It's a little pricier, but u may like the SRAM shifting and a little better aluminum frame


----------



## Porschefan

PJ352 said:


> In the interest of full disclosure, I'll offer three things upfront. 1) I've never owned a Lemond. 2) I like Lemonds and 3) I like steel bikes.
> 
> That said, as long as there's little or no internal or external rust, a 10 year old steel frame doesn't bother me much. They don't fatigue the same as aluminum frames, so (in relatively dry climates) could easily last 40+ years. But it's in your best interest to check the frame over for any signs of damage/ crashes, etc.
> 
> Re: the components (mainly the shifters) age/ use does matter. Depending on general condition, they _may_ need to be flushed and relubed. At the worst, they'll need to be replaced at some point in time. Assuming they're original (9 speed), if replacement were required, you're options would be to replace them with either Tiagra 4500, Sora or Microshifts.
> 
> I'm not raising a red flag on the shifters, just making you aware that the most expensive part may (at some point) need to be replaced, and when that times comes, what your options would be.
> 
> Understanding the warnings to get the bike assessed for mechanical condition and fit, if you think it's close to being sized correctly for you, I suggest checking it out. Look it over, check that the bearing assemblies run smooth (steering, hubs, bottom bracket) and test ride the bike.
> 
> If something doesn't feel right mechanically or the bike is obviously too large or too small, move on. If it all falls into place, ask that the seller accompany you to the LBS for assessment. They should be able to provide an estimate of any repairs along with its overall worth.
> 
> HTH....


Thanks for the info PJ. I did a bit of Googling and came across this interesting blog from the owner of a 2001 Lemond Buenos Aires. He certainly seems enthusiastic about it and I plan to go and take a look at it in person. I'm not up on bike sizes, but my mountain bike is a Yeti ASR5 size Large, which is 19"--in what dimension, I'm not sure. An acquaintance who has a lot of road bike experience told me that I should be looking at 56 cm bikes--again, I'm not sure which dimension this applies to. I'm 6' tall with a pretty short inseam--30-31". The bike in question is 57 mm and the charts I've looked indicate that there's at least a good chance this would fit me.

I also found a link, probably leftover from the now-defunct Lemond bicyle website, which describes the Lemond geometry as being quite different from "normal," at least for that time period. From reading the description I got that the seat tube angle positions the rider a bit behind the bottom bracket for better balance and to comply with the theory that pushing pedals from a bit behind is better. It also mentions that the top tubes are longer, which, to me, indicates being stretched forward more. This seems to contradict the idea, as stated at the site, that this is a bike made for comfort over longer rides, which is something that I am definitely looking for. I'm pretty out-of-shape since I broke three ribs mountain biking last fall and kind of fell off the fitness wagon. I'm thinking that a road bike might be helpful for overall fitness training and just be fun to own. (I want to get back to my mountain bike too, but I'm bit leery about any more crashes!)

Note: I can't re-locate the link with more specific geo numbers, but the point it made was that Lemond bikes in general have a different setup and feel than most.

Waiting to hear back from seller about getting together and I can see it in person.


----------



## ckpetrone

SO much info I am lost


----------



## ckpetrone

Looking to get a new bike myself here soon


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> Thanks for the info PJ. I did a bit of Googling and came across this interesting blog from the owner of a 2001 Lemond Buenos Aires. He certainly seems enthusiastic about it and I plan to go and take a look at it in person. I'm not up on bike sizes, but my mountain bike is a Yeti ASR5 size Large, which is 19"--in what dimension, I'm not sure. An acquaintance who has a lot of road bike experience told me that I should be looking at 56 cm bikes--again, I'm not sure which dimension this applies to. I'm 6' tall with a pretty short inseam--30-31". The bike in question is 57 mm and the charts I've looked indicate that there's at least a good chance this would fit me.
> 
> I also found a link, probably leftover from the now-defunct Lemond bicyle website, which describes the Lemond geometry as being quite different from "normal," at least for that time period. From reading the description I got that the seat tube angle positions the rider a bit behind the bottom bracket for better balance and to comply with the theory that pushing pedals from a bit behind is better. It also mentions that the top tubes are longer, which, to me, indicates being stretched forward more. This seems to contradict the idea, as stated at the site, that this is a bike made for comfort over longer rides, which is something that I am definitely looking for. I'm pretty out-of-shape since I broke three ribs mountain biking last fall and kind of fell off the fitness wagon. I'm thinking that a road bike might be helpful for overall fitness training and just be fun to own. (I want to get back to my mountain bike too, but I'm bit leery about any more crashes!)
> 
> Note: I can't re-locate the link with more specific geo numbers, but the point it made was that Lemond bikes in general have a different setup and feel than most.
> 
> Waiting to hear back from seller about getting together and I can see it in person.


Sorry about your misfortune. If it's any consolation, us roadies have crashes too. I was laid up for ~7 weeks a couple of years ago after I broke my collarbone. Considering I made it through about 26 years of riding before I broke a bone, I guess I'm not doing too bad.  

I'll offer two thoughts on sizing. First, don't carry over your mtn biking sizing/ fit/ philosophy to road bikes. They differ enough in enough ways that doing so will almost certainly mislead you, so best bet is to work with a reputable LBS on getting properly fitted to the bike you ultimately settle on - after they've verified that sizing was correct.

Second, even though you'll get a second opinion from a shop, for your own knowledge, rather than focus on frame sizes, focus on key geometry numbers (mainly, effective top tube and head tube lengths). Reason being, since manufacturers measure differently to determine frame sizes, those numbers tend to be fairly arbitrary. 

Re: Lemonds being different in some way, IMO that tends to be overstated. It's true that Lemond used slacker seat tube angles which necessitated longer top tubes, but once saddle setback was adjusted, reach was essentially equalized with bikes having steeper ST angles. I do agree, however that setting saddles aft slightly (behind KOPS) offers not only a potential advantage of making more power, but also better f/r weight distribution.

As far as a comfortable ride is concerned, besides those slacker ST angles, there are other facets of a bikes geometry that lend themselves to that. Longer chainstays, slacker head tube angles and more fork rake all work to stretch wheelbase, which generally results in a more comfortable ride. While the Lemonds don't employ all of those facets, they do employ some, and tailoring tire size/ pressures (based on rider weight, road conditions) will also help to smooth the ride.

Assuming your stated inseam is your cycling inseam, I think the 57cm Lemonds standover may be a little tall for you. Some argue that standover is of minimal importance, but I'm of the opinion that (ideally) the ability to straddle a bike is a plus. I still think you should go check the bike out, because when you wear your cycling shoes the 808mm standover may be acceptable - or if it's fairly tall, it may not bother you.

For reference, I've added a link below with the 2001 Lemonds geometry. Scroll down to Reynolds Steel.
Lemond Bikes > Geometry

One last thing. If you decide to check the bike out, be aware that the paired spoke wheels aren't known for their durability. As we've discussed, have any bike checked over by a reputable LBS, but that wheelset is something to be aware of.


----------



## northamericas

*i wish i knew about this!*

I just bought my first bike and am sick feeling it was the worst purchase ever. I was looking for a commuter bike that would be a good fit. I am 6'4. I saw a posting for a 26" frame bike. It was way over my budget but i got impulsive, thinking it was a perfect find. I rode it once and do not really like it. Shifters are down low which is tricky. And I got really sore.
The guy really sold me. He seemed very passionate that it is a top quality bike with the best parts, despite being 40 years old. I paid $700 for it. Can someone please tell me how much they think it is worth? The seller told me it has lots of collector value. I think I paid way too much for a bike that is old and not too practical.

26" Carlton Giro d'Italia; Reynolds 531 Manganese/Moly tubing; Campagnolo Record changers; Zeuss crankset with 54:45 chainring; Titanium rear cassette (28:24:20:17 :14 : 13); 1" alloy rims with Campag Wide Flange hubs & brakes; Suspension seat post; good condition, hand-built in 70 or 71.


----------



## PJ352

northamericas said:


> I just bought my first bike and am sick feeling it was the worst purchase ever. I was looking for a commuter bike that would be a good fit. I am 6'4. I saw a posting for a 26" frame bike. It was way over my budget but i got impulsive, thinking it was a perfect find. I rode it once and do not really like it. Shifters are down low which is tricky. And I got really sore.
> The guy really sold me. He seemed very passionate that it is a top quality bike with the best parts, despite being 40 years old. I paid $700 for it. Can someone please tell me how much they think it is worth? The seller told me it has lots of collector value. I think I paid way too much for a bike that is old and not too practical.
> 
> 26" Carlton Giro d'Italia; Reynolds 531 Manganese/Moly tubing; Campagnolo Record changers; Zeuss crankset with 54:45 chainring; Titanium rear cassette (28:24:20:17 :14 : 13); 1" alloy rims with Campag Wide Flange hubs & brakes; Suspension seat post; good condition, hand-built in 70 or 71.


If you want a better idea of the value of your bike, consider posting (with pics) in the retro-classic forum.


----------



## northamericas

PJ352 said:


> If you want a better idea of the value of your bike, consider posting (with pics) in the retro-classic forum.


Thanks. Will do. Here are some pics. Think it is worth much?


----------



## PJ352

Hard to tell from the pics, but the bike looks to be in great shape.

Re: price, I'm no expert on bikes of this caliber from this era, but I don't think you did as bad as you think. Whether the bike fits your anatomy or your intended uses is another matter.


----------



## Porschefan

PJ352 said:


> Sorry about your misfortune. If it's any consolation, us roadies have crashes too. I was laid up for ~7 weeks a couple of years ago after I broke my collarbone. Considering I made it through about 26 years of riding before I broke a bone, I guess I'm not doing too bad.


Pretty good safety record  When I get riding again I'm definitely going to dial it back some. That's one of the reasons I'm interested in a beginner's road bike. Seems like a lot easier to hop on the bike and just get some good exercise in--which I need!



> I'll offer two thoughts on sizing. First, don't carry over your mtn biking sizing/ fit/ philosophy to road bikes. They differ enough in enough ways that doing so will almost certainly mislead you, so best bet is to work with a reputable LBS on getting properly fitted to the bike you ultimately settle on - after they've verified that sizing was correct.
> 
> Second, even though you'll get a second opinion from a shop, for your own knowledge, rather than focus on frame sizes, focus on key geometry numbers (mainly, effective top tube and head tube lengths). Reason being, since manufacturers measure differently to determine frame sizes, those numbers tend to be fairly arbitrary.
> 
> Re: Lemonds being different in some way, IMO that tends to be overstated. It's true that Lemond used slacker seat tube angles which necessitated longer top tubes, but once saddle setback was adjusted, reach was essentially equalized with bikes having steeper ST angles. I do agree, however that setting saddles aft slightly (behind KOPS) offers not only a potential advantage of making more power, but also better f/r weight distribution.
> 
> As far as a comfortable ride is concerned, besides those slacker ST angles, there are other facets of a bikes geometry that lend themselves to that. Longer chainstays, slacker head tube angles and more fork rake all work to stretch wheelbase, which generally results in a more comfortable ride. While the Lemonds don't employ all of those facets, they do employ some, and tailoring tire size/ pressures (based on rider weight, road conditions) will also help to smooth the ride.
> 
> Assuming your stated inseam is your cycling inseam, I think the 57cm Lemonds standover may be a little tall for you. Some argue that standover is of minimal importance, but I'm of the opinion that (ideally) the ability to straddle a bike is a plus. I still think you should go check the bike out, because when you wear your cycling shoes the 808mm standover may be acceptable - or if it's fairly tall, it may not bother you.
> 
> For reference, I've added a link below with the 2001 Lemonds geometry. Scroll down to Reynolds Steel.
> Lemond Bikes > Geometry
> 
> One last thing. If you decide to check the bike out, be aware that the paired spoke wheels aren't known for their durability. As we've discussed, have any bike checked over by a reputable LBS, but that wheelset is something to be aware of.


Thanks again for the info and advice. I was at my LBS yesterday and asked them what size(s) I should be looking at in used bikes. We didn't do any kind of fitting, but the owner of the shop took a look and said 57cm. I immediately contacted the seller to arrange a visit, but was told the bike had been promised to someone else. All my research had gotten me really stoked on the idea of the Buenos Aires--nice 853 "Select" frame, etc. For $500 I might have had a serviceable bike that also had a bit of a 'cool' factor! I have dibs if the deal falls through, but I'm back to watching the CL ads. Funny, I haven't seen too many 57cm frames--most seem to be 56 or 58.


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> Thanks again for the info and advice. I was at my LBS yesterday and asked them what size(s) I should be looking at in used bikes. We didn't do any kind of fitting, but the owner of the shop took a look and said 57cm. I immediately contacted the seller to arrange a visit, but was told the bike had been promised to someone else. All my research had gotten me really stoked on the idea of the Buenos Aires--nice 853 "Select" frame, etc. For $500 I might have had a serviceable bike that also had a bit of a 'cool' factor! I have dibs if the deal falls through, but I'm back to watching the CL ads. *Funny, I haven't seen too many 57cm frames--most seem to be 56 or 58.*


The problem with settling on a specific number as a reference to 'my frame size' is.... the methods for measuring to determine sizes varies by manufacturer. As one example, there are some models of Rocky mtn's and Fuji's where I'd take a 47cm, because they base fram size on seat tube length. Other brands/ models I vary between 52's and 54's. 

Point being, don't take too much stock in that number. Once your baseline (for sizing) was established, the geo numbers would be what you'd use for comparison purposes.

Sorry that the Lemond might not work out. Fortunately, there are other perfectly fine bikes out there for sale, so.... patience.


----------



## Porschefan

*2008 Bianchi Nirone 7 on local CL*

Another candidate submitted for opinions, reviews from anyone inclined to share. Full description and 5 pix located *here:*

_*Pro's*_: 

Budget OK and sounds like seller might be amenable to something less--~$6-700?

Fairly new--2008 model.

Seems to have some nice components--Ultegra RD; 105 FD; Ultegra brakes and shifters. 

In the ballpark size-wise.


*Con's:*

I have a feeling that the carbon/aluminum combination might be something that one should just walk away from on principle--but I dunno. The specs say the CF is "high-modulus," which seems to translate to expensive in newer bikes anyway.

Wheels and tires seem to be both cheap and original (Bikepedia specs)

It's about 75 miles away, so going to take a look requires more commitment than the bike might warrant.

I hate the color , but realize that is hardly the most important consideration.

Bike retailed for about $1,700 when new, which means it was never a really high-end bike. That's a bit of a puzzlement, because the component spec seems pretty good.

From a purely subject and aesthetic point of view, this bike at $700 doesn't get me as enthusiastic as the 2001 Lemond--but I really have no rational basis for that evaluation--just the way it is. Googling around hasn't led me to any real enthusiastic comments or owners of this bike, while the Lemond Buenos Aires had some really strong support from owners.

I'm not in any particular hurry but I'd like to keep picking up bits of knowledge so when the right bike comes along I won't hesitate to pull the trigger. So, TIA for any insights.

P.S.: What, exactly, is meant by a "compact" frame? I thought that it referred to a 2x9 or 10 drive-train, but apparently not.


----------



## PJ352

To answer your question, compact geo simply means the bike has a sloping (as opposed to horizontal) top tube. Beyond aesthetics, this design offers some advantage to those needing a somewhat longer top tube but lower standover, so the design allows for a little more flexibility on sizing up one frame size, possibly getting the cyclist the potential benefit of a slightly taller head tube (less saddle to bar drop).

FWIW, I'm not a big fan of mixed materials frames, because along with the concerns about bonding issues, you're still buying a used CF bike with no warranty. I'd prefer straight alu to alu/ CF or full CF when buying used. Of course, steel is another (good) option.

Re: pricing, given that the bike is going on 5 years old and probably sold for a street price of around $1500, I think it's somewhat overpriced. OTOH, prices do vary by region, and given that Santa Fe's what I'd consider a 'high rent district', the bike may be competitively priced. The seller certainly is playing up the acronyms/ techno jargon, but it's understandable. He wants to sell the bike. ; )

I suggest going with your gut on this one. If it fits you and your intended uses, it's a fine bike. But if it's not floating your boat for whatever reason, hold off till one comes along that does. It'll happen, just not as soon as you might like.

HTH....


----------



## smileysjs

Hello, I'm new here. Looking to buy my husband a road bike for his birthday coming up. I thik he may eventually want to race with it. My budget is $1,000 and under. I went to two bike shops today and this is what they recommended:
Felt F85 $999.95
Felt Z95 $ 949.95
Giant Defy 2 $1159.95
Cannondale Quick 5 $580.00
Cannondale Caad 8 6 $1220.00
Fuji Roubaix 3.0 $869.99
Both shops offer free tuneups for a year. I think I read somewhere that if we join a bike club we get 10% off at the bike shops. I don't know if that can be used towards a bike or just the accessories though. What do you think? Have anything else in mind?


----------



## beartownrd

hey guys. i posted a few threads back about buying my first road bike. since then i did a 50 mile ride on my hybrid (specialized crosstrail sport) and test rode a trek 1.1 and spec. allez compact (both sub $800). i need some opinions on my dilemma.

do i pursue an entry level road bike purchase or spring for something mid level? i plan on maybe joining a bike club and doing more 50 mile rides and possibly even a 100 mile road in a years time or more. i want an alu. frame (don't really need CF at this point in my cycling career) but i don't know, being the novice that i am, if i will appreciate the difference in components (105/tiagra/etc). i plan on riding 3-5x a week, the most being 150mi a week (the very most). is the better option to buy an entry level, get to know the bike over a year's time or so, then go back and test ride more mid/upper level bikes? to go back with some real experience?


----------



## PJ352

smileysjs said:


> Hello, I'm new here. Looking to buy my husband a road bike for his birthday coming up. I thik he may eventually want to race with it. My budget is $1,000 and under. I went to two bike shops today and this is what they recommended:
> Felt F85 $999.95
> Felt Z95 $ 949.95
> Giant Defy 2 $1159.95
> Cannondale Quick 5 $580.00
> Cannondale Caad 8 6 $1220.00
> Fuji Roubaix 3.0 $869.99
> Both shops offer free tuneups for a year. I think I read somewhere that if we join a bike club we get 10% off at the bike shops. I don't know if that can be used towards a bike or just the accessories though. What do you think? Have anything else in mind?


There are two fundamentals to buying a road bike that make buying as a gift a bad idea - one is fit and the other is buying from a shop that the cyclist prefers.

If this is a gift, take hubby along to chat with the folks about his intended uses, goals, cycling experiences (if any), get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest and head out on the roads for test rides. he should focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there. 

If you planned on doing all of this anyway, that's good. If OTOH you were looking to surprise him with a bike you/ we picked out, please don't do that.

BTW, your list of bikes ranges from hybrid, to relaxed/ race geometry drop bar bikes, and while they're all fine bikes in their own right, not all will suite your husband's intended uses and anatomy equally well.

HTH...


----------



## PJ352

beartownrd said:


> hey guys. i posted a few threads back about buying my first road bike. since then i did a 50 mile ride on my hybrid (specialized crosstrail sport) and test rode a trek 1.1 and spec. allez compact (both sub $800). i need some opinions on my dilemma.
> 
> do i pursue an entry level road bike purchase or spring for something mid level? i plan on maybe joining a bike club and doing more 50 mile rides and possibly even a 100 mile road in a years time or more. i want an alu. frame (don't really need CF at this point in my cycling career) but i don't know, being the novice that i am, if i will appreciate the difference in components (105/tiagra/etc). i plan on riding 3-5x a week, the most being 150mi a week (the very most). is the better option to buy an entry level, get to know the bike over a year's time or so, then go back and test ride more mid/upper level bikes? to go back with some real experience?


For anyone new to road riding, I almost always recommend staying at the lower end of their price range. You don't really know where you'll go with the sport and staying with it for any length of time you'll most certainly buy up to a second/ nicer bike. If not, you'll sell this one and lose less than you would had you paid for a mid-level bike.

As far as your intended uses, even Shimano's entry level groups (2300/ Sora) will suite them. For real world riding you'll want to tailor your gearing to your fitness and terrain. That'll mean more to you day to day than moving up to the mid- level groups.

Last, but not least are the shops and bike fit. Along with choosing a bike, choose the shop that emphasizes the importance of fit, promotes test rides and you feel most comfortable working with, because they'll remain a valuable resource for you, post purchase.


----------



## new2rd

I say test as many as possible. If you notice differences, then it's a question of comfort, performance, and cost. Get what you can afford. I would say that if you plan on riding 4 times a week, want to ride with a group, and consider yourself competitive, then I would lean towards a better bike. With that said, I started off with a entry level Roubaix $2000 and I was hooked. I ended up getting exactly what I wanted about 4000 miles later. It's a tough call, but at least with a $1000 bike you can go crazy later and not be out too much money. I love upgrading, so it was hard for me just to use what I had.


----------



## Porschefan

*2003 Litespeed Antares on CL for $750*

Back with another candidate from the local CL.

Original price on this bike was around $2,500, so back in 2003 it was a mid-priced bike. I like the look of the bike, but sizing might be problematic--or not. I still haven't gone to the LBS and paid for a formal fitting, but I may soon have to do that. I did read through the sizing recommendations of Andrew Severn (here), and I tried the book-in-crotch measurement. I'm not totally certain I've gotten it right, but I think my bike inseam is about 32-33," which seems to be a bit short for a 56-57 cm frame. I also found some old reviews of this bike and one owner mentioned that the head tube is really short and required spacers and tweaking to get it up enough for a more relaxed ride. So I have to nail down my theoretical size range and little more exactly.

I think this is also a "composite" bike in the sense that the rear triangle is CF-based (like my Yeti, which has a CF rear triangle, which I've broken once already!).

Still it seems to have top-flight components and might be worth a trip across town to get a feel for how it fits. Another key question on this bike (and others that show) up, is whether I'd really be getting much, if anything better than a new $800 bike such as the Giant Defy 0.


EDIT: Just heard back from the seller on sizing question: "I'm 5'10" 145lbs and the Litespeed is a bit cramped for me. You would definately feel more comfortable on a 57cm frame. Thanks for the interest, I'm sure you'll find a suitable bike."

Onward and upward....



(I'm starting to wonder whether I should be posting these ongoing questions to the "Beginners Forum" or whether this is the most appropriate place.)


----------



## PJ352

Porschefan said:


> *I still haven't gone to the LBS and paid for a formal fitting, but I may soon have to do that.* I did read through the sizing recommendations of Andrew Severn (here), and I tried the book-in-crotch measurement.
> (I'm starting to wonder whether I should be posting these ongoing questions to the "Beginners Forum" or whether this is the most appropriate place.)


I think you should take your own advice and go have a fitting done. Otherwise, you'll continue to shoot in the dark (so to speak) on pinning down your sizing requirements - and even knowing your cycling inseam won't get your there.

Just make sure when you get a fitting that you note the year, make, model and framesize of the test bike. Not because frame size matters so much, but all that info will give you a point of reference to the geo chart and from there you can compare the geo of bikes of interest. The goal will be to get as close a match as possible.

FWIW I disagree more than agree with that authors sizing guidelines/ recommendations. I think he's far too concerned with cycling inseam and not concerned enough with the other (more important) facets of fit, like reach (only a casual mention of effective top tube), drop, how a riders fitness/ flexibility and past experiences can affect fit... all in all far from the best sizing/ fit advice I've read.

Re: where you're posting, you should have enough posts to start a thread in beginner's. Once that's done, you can always update it with your progress on the bike hunt and with any questions you have along the way.


----------



## cyclintruckin

egger29 said:


> Greeting everyone. the past 2 years I have done a couple Tri's a year, and for each race i rented a road bike. Now it is time to make a purchase.
> 
> My budget is about 1,500
> 
> Now the question is, should I get a good aluminum bike with carbon forks for that price, or I see some good deals on Jenson USA for a entry level carbon bike on sale for $1,400.
> 
> I did't think that I could afford a carbon frame, but some of the deals are to good to pass up.
> 
> So I am leaning towards the carbon frame.
> 
> any thoughts ?


Found this for you at 2012 Nytro Tri Package - Nytro Multisport, The kestrel is supposed to be a great bike for the money.

<a href="https://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y277/bcsinflight/?action=view&current=NYT-KIT-TRI10_800w.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="https://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y277/bcsinflight/NYT-KIT-TRI10_800w.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Description

Gear up for your next race with the world’s best selling tri package featuring the Kestrel Talon Tri 105. Our most affordable race ready package.Top performance at an entry-level price. Featuring Kestrel Talon Tri triathlon bike built with shimano 105 / DA / Oval groupset. 

Tri Package includes:

Kestrel Talon 105 Triathlon / Time Trial Bike (see specs below)
Blue Seventy Fusion Fullsuit Wetsuit - Men's or Women's
Men's 2XU ActiveTri Singlet or Women's Zoot Endurance Tri Top
Men's 2XU Active or Women's Zoot Endurance Tri Short
Shimano TR31 Tri Shoes
Shimano R540 Pedal/Cleats
Bell Lumen Helmet
Nytro Transition Bag
Nytro Water Bottle
Nytro Water Bottle Cage
Nytro Hybrid Race Belt
Nytro Bike Fit - Shop customers only

Now includes:

FREE Shipping*
1 Month FREE Online Coaching with Breakaway-Training.com

Retail value of the Tri Package $3,540! Save $1,540!

*Ground shipping in continental U.S.
Configure


----------



## smileysjs

PJ352 said:


> There are two fundamentals to buying a road bike that make buying as a gift a bad idea - one is fit and the other is buying from a shop that the cyclist prefers.
> 
> If this is a gift, take hubby along to chat with the folks about his intended uses, goals, cycling experiences (if any), get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest and head out on the roads for test rides. he should focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there.
> 
> If you planned on doing all of this anyway, that's good. If OTOH you were looking to surprise him with a bike you/ we picked out, please don't do that.
> 
> BTW, your list of bikes ranges from hybrid, to relaxed/ race geometry drop bar bikes, and while they're all fine bikes in their own right, not all will suite your husband's intended uses and anatomy equally well.
> 
> HTH...


Which of those bikes would you recommend for his needs? I get that he needs to be fitted but I want to narrow down what we're looking at.


----------



## PJ352

smileysjs said:


> Which of those bikes would you recommend for his needs? I get that he needs to be fitted but I want to narrow down what we're looking at.


Since you mentioned that your husband may want to race, I'll make an assumption that he'll also be doing fitness/ training rides.

If so, any aluminum framed drop bar bike with appropriate gearing for his fitness level and terrain will work. IMO that would mean the C'dale Quick is deleted from your list - all the others are contenders, with some being race geo and other relaxed. His preference would depend primarily on fit, his fitness level/ flexibility and preference for riding position (less aggressive/ more aggressive) and test rides (out on the roads) should sort that out.

You probably want a more black and white answer to your question, but really, all the bikes are of fine quality, so it comes down to which bike best suites his intended uses (which would likely mean more than one) and which fits/ feels the best to ride (could also be more than one) and gearing (something to discuss with the LBS's). From there, he'd whittle down the choices based on favored shop/ location, color availability, price..... 

HTH...


----------



## hotflash

digit!


----------



## fltekdiver

Hi everyone, 1st post here

I got out of road biking in 2007, which at the time I had a Trek Discovery 58cm road bike

I plan on using the bike to ride 3-4 times a week for exercise, and a 60 mile ride about once every 3 months when they have them around here

I'm 5'9" , 195lbs

I tired several bikes around here at local stores, and all though the store sold me a 58cm in 2007, I was told today I'm between a 56cm and 58cm ?

I'm looking to spend around $1K, and was hoping to get into a CF frame, or forks etc for better comfort. Also trying to stay in a 105 gear set etc or a good gear set

I went onto bikesdirect.com , but allot of them are outta stock

Any suggestions on a good bike to get back into the sport?

I live in Florida, flat hot roads 

Thanks for the help


----------



## CycoBob

Fitekdiver, I'm 5'10" and I ride a 54cm, and if it were any bigger, it'd be too big for me. The geometry of the particular bike can make a difference, as well as the type of bike, but 56-58cm for an average road bike sounds too big for someone who's 5'9". LBS may just be saying that, because that's what they have in stock, or are stale models that they are tryin to move. Don't trust most LBS's; do your own research. I'm sure others here will be along to help you out, soon.


----------



## fltekdiver

The last bike , they sold me a 58cm, and allot of people back then said the bike looked to big for me

Is their a website to measure myself ?

Also, what bike would you guys recommend ? Trek 2.1 or 2.3 or something?


----------



## chompychomps

fltekdiver said:


> The last bike , they sold me a 58cm, and allot of people back then said the bike looked to big for me
> 
> Is their a website to measure myself ?
> 
> Also, what bike would you guys recommend ? Trek 2.1 or 2.3 or something?


You can get a fit using the fit calculator from this website

http://www.competitivecyclist.com/fit-calculator/


----------



## fltekdiver

chompychomps said:


> You can get a fit using the fit calculator from this website
> 
> http://www.competitivecyclist.com/fit-calculator/


Link dont work?


----------



## chompychomps

fltekdiver said:


> Link dont work?


http://www.competitivecyclist.com/za/CCY?PAGE=FIT_CALCULATOR_INTRO


----------



## Porschefan

fltekdiver said:


> Link dont work?


Try *THIS ONE*.


----------



## fltekdiver

Ok, so once I have the measurements, what do they mean?

*Inseam = 33*1/2"
Trunk= 23"
Elbow bent = 11"
Arm = 25*1/2"
Thigh = 25*1/2"
Lower Leg = 20*1/2"
Sternal Notch = 56*1/2"
Total height is 5'-8-1/2"*


----------



## chompychomps

You should get the fittings, eddy fit, french fit and competitive fit. Basically, the most important measurement is the top tube length, that would most likely determine the frame size. 

If you are getting a bike from a lbs, you should ask them to give you a proper fitting as it would be more accurate and that since different bikes have different geometry, it would be good to try the bike out yourself!


----------



## fltekdiver

Thanks, can a Triathlon Bike be used for road biking? I love the looks of them

Whats the difference between a Triathlon Bike & road bike?


----------



## CycoBob

Fitekdiver, are you a female? Or perhaps you mis-measured? That is a HUGE inseam for a 5'9 male! 

If that is a correct measurement, it would mean that the top-tube of a 56 or 58 would be TOTALLY out of your ballpark. Not even remotely close! 

It would also mean that you LBS is "fitting" you just based on standover height/inseam and nothing else; and they don't know what they are doing.


----------



## fltekdiver

*Sorry, measured the top of the level  I'm 31" Inseam*


----------



## PJ352

chompychomps said:


> *Buy from a lbs*, you should ask them to give you a proper fitting as it would be more accurate and that since different bikes have different geometry, it would be good to try the bike out yourself!


@ fltekdiver, my advice:
- forget ALL online fit calculators. They not only will tell you little to nothing, they'll confuse and mislead you.
- Unless tri's make up the bulk of your intended uses, forget tri bikes because their geo moves the riders weight forward, they don't handle well and will prove uncomfortable for recreational road riding. As long as they fit you well and suite your intended uses, the Trek series 2's (among others) are fine choices.
- Last, but not least take the (edited) advice above.


----------



## fltekdiver

Thanks, I'll go down their tomorrow and get fitted for the measurments, I think it's like $60 

I'll try some out, then shop their prices and on-line and see what the best price is


----------



## PJ352

fltekdiver said:


> Thanks, I'll go down their tomorrow and get fitted for the measurments, I think it's like $60
> 
> I'll try some out, then shop their prices and on-line and see what the best price is


Online is usually the 'better' price, but keep in mind that you're essentially buying a bike in a box, so you'll be responsible for final assembly, tuning, fittings and any component swaps (usually stems) needed during it. Most likely, you'll be tapping your LBS for all or some of these services, which closes the gap on what you save by buying online. 

During your visits, you may want to discuss what the shops charge for the services I listed. I think It'll give you a better idea of the _real_ cost of buying online.


----------



## CycoBob

Ah! 31" is more like it. That's what I am, too. A 52-54cm will work for you. 52 or 53 would probably be ideal. You'll notice a huge difference (improvement in comfort) after riding a 58!


----------



## PJ352

CycoBob said:


> Ah! 31" is more like it. That's what I am, too. A 52-54cm will work for you. 52 or 53 would probably be ideal. You'll notice a huge difference (improvement in comfort) after riding a 58!


I agree that a traditionally sized 58cm bike is likely too large for him, but determining sizing is more than about height and inseam alone. How a rider is proportioned, their fitness/ flexibility, cycling experiences, preferences (among other factors) can all influence sizing. 

Beyond that, since there are no industry standards for measuring to determine frame size, the number is pretty much arbitrary, making the geo _numbers_ (mainly effective top tube and head tube length) better reference points. 

FWIW, I've seen cyclists ~5' 9" riding anything from a 52 to a 56, so it's best to have a reputable LBS fitter determine sizing.


----------



## CycoBob

PJ352 said:


> I agree that a traditionally sized 58cm bike is likely too large for him, but determining sizing is more than about height and inseam alone. How a rider is proportioned, their fitness/ flexibility, cycling experiences, preferences (among other factors) can all influence sizing.
> 
> Beyond that, since there are no industry standards for measuring to determine frame size, the number is pretty much arbitrary, making the geo _numbers_ (mainly effective top tube and head tube length) better reference points.
> 
> FWIW, I've seen cyclists ~5' 9" riding anything from a 52 to a 56, so it's best to have a reputable LBS fitter determine sizing.


Yep! Just test-riding the different sizes will probably be a real eye-opener for him too! Some people prefer a little larger bike within their range...and some a little smaller.


----------



## Timh37

How much bucks should a Bianchi Via Nirone 7 C2C, except for the brakes fully ultegra montage, with a basic Shimano wheelset be worth? Owner says it endured 2000km and that it was made in 2009. The price when it was new was around 1200€. I still have to check how it fits and if there are any damaged parts. I am searching for my first bike to start cycling with rerecreatively. I am doubting wether to buy a used bike without too much knowledge or going to a shop and getting a bike there with probably worse groups.


----------



## PJ352

Timh37 said:


> How much bucks should a Bianchi Via Nirone 7 C2C, except for the brakes fully ultegra montage, with a basic Shimano wheelset be worth? Owner says it endured 2000km and that it was made in 2009. The price when it was new was around 1200€. I still have to check how it fits and if there are any damaged parts. I am searching for my first bike to start cycling with rerecreatively.* I am doubting wether to buy a used bike without too much knowledge or going to a shop and getting a bike there with probably worse groups.*


There are two main things to consider when buying your first road bike. First is that it meets your intended purposes and second is that it fits well. All else (including groupsets) is secondary in importance. 

Since you're new to all of this, I recommend visiting your LBS, discussing your intended uses/ goals, price range and have them recommend some bikes. From there, get sized/ fitted and head out on the roads for test rides. Focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there. Because of what we call 'value added services' that reputable LBS's offer, this IMO/E is the best way to buy a first road bike. 

If you do decide to go used, before committing to the purchase and after checking the bike over for obvious damage/ problems/ test riding to determine that it's even _close _in fit, I strongly suggest asking the seller to bring the bike to your LBS for mechanical and fit assessment. 

If you follow this route the LBS will probably give you a better idea of the Bianchi's value than we could, sight unseen.


----------



## Timh37

PJ352 said:


> There are two main things to consider when buying your first road bike. First is that it meets your intended purposes and second is that it fits well. All else (including groupsets) is secondary in importance.
> 
> Since you're new to all of this, I recommend visiting your LBS, discussing your intended uses/ goals, price range and have them recommend some bikes. From there, get sized/ fitted and head out on the roads for test rides. Focus on fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there. Because of what we call 'value added services' that reputable LBS's offer, this IMO/E is the best way to buy a first road bike.
> 
> If you do decide to go used, before committing to the purchase and after checking the bike over for obvious damage/ problems/ test riding to determine that it's even _close _in fit, I strongly suggest asking the seller to bring the bike to your LBS for mechanical and fit assessment.
> 
> If you follow this route the LBS will probably give you a better idea of the Bianchi's value than we could, sight unseen.


Thank you very much for the reply. According to your post I should see a LBS which is a smart idea. I'm a bit worried about the qualityof a bike that a LBS would sell me for the budget I have(700€ + -). If I end up riding with a bike with all kinds of parts that I will need to replace in the near future it will only take more of my money. Is the difference between different groups for example really big or is it not that important for starters? In that case I indeed feel a lot saver with buying at my LBS.


----------



## PJ352

Timh37 said:


> Thank you very much for the reply. According to your post I should see a LBS which is a smart idea. I'm a bit worried about the qualityof a bike that a LBS would sell me for the budget I have(700€ + -). If I end up riding with a bike with all kinds of parts that I will need to replace in the near future it will only take more of my money. Is the difference between different groups for example really big or is it not that important for starters? In that case I indeed feel a lot saver with buying at my LBS.


The lower end/ entry level groupsets offered by (as one example) Shimano function well and are durable once set up/ adjusted properly - but that holds true for the upper end groupsets as well. As you go up model lines, where you see the most difference is in slightly nicer finishes and slightly lower weight, but that's about all.

Also, new bikes come with a warranty (and used don't), so in the unlikely event something did need replacing in the first year, it would be covered under warranty. And along with sizing/ fitting assistance, most LBS's offer post purchase services like tweaks to your fit and tune ups, which you'd pay extra for buying used.

All told, I think you'd be better off buying new from your LBS for this first purchase. I can't say what your budget will get you in the way of an entry level road bike, but first step is to start visiting LBS's.


----------



## fltekdiver

Thank you all for your help ! 

Went to the LBS today, actualley 3 of them, spent allot of time in them, and ended up with a 
Trek 2.3 2012 model ! 

They ended up fitting me to a 56cm Trek 2.3

Just did my first 35 min ride tonight, and love the bike!

Thanks all for your help !


----------



## PJ352

fltekdiver said:


> Thank you all for your help !
> 
> Went to the LBS today, actualley 3 of them, spent allot of time in them, and ended up with a
> Trek 2.3 2012 model !
> 
> They ended up fitting me to a 56cm Trek 2.3
> 
> Just did my first 35 min ride tonight, and love the bike!
> 
> Thanks all for your help !


Wow, posted, visited 3 LBS's and purchased a bike all inside of two days!! Took me ~2 1/2 years to decide on a bike! 

Seriously, congrats on your new bike. The Trek 2 series are nice bikes and I think you'll be happy with your purchase. Solid choice.

Post pics when you take some time out from riding.


----------



## fltekdiver

Sure will! Thanks again for everyones help !

I'm very excited

It was close, as the bike came out to $2K with the helmet, shoes, clipless pedals, shorts, etc, no computer yet

They had a Madon 3.1 Carbon for $80 more, or the Madon 4.5 for $2K, so I kept going back and forth, then deceided to stay withen a budget of $2K

I started out a few days ago thinking I could do it for $1K, but I wanted the Shirmano 105 driveset, etc, and I really liked the colors of the 2.3, its sexy!


----------



## Steelhead3686

*Customizing First Road Bike*

I recently bought a 1985 Trek 400 Series road bike. It is the first road bike I have owned, and I bought it of a coworker for $100 because it was just collecting dust. 

I am currently trying to customize it to a red,white, and blue theme. Everything on it is stock right now. 

Here is what I have bought to install so far: Blue Dia Compe BRS 101 dual pivot calipers, Profile Design red, white, blue bar tape, red Bushwhacker Cimmaron Red pannier, new cables with white housing.

I am planning on buying a blue headset. Either Chris King 2Nut Threaded Headset or IRD Technoglide. 

I will most likely buy a blue stem as well but I'm having trouble finding them in 110mm. I have found a couple at 80mm which I could live with. Any suggestions on where I might find a longer blue stem?

Having a lot of trouble finding new levers. I want some combination of blue, white, or silver. Style is not a big deal non-aero or aero is fine. The bike has downspout shifters so the lever shifters are unnecessary. I am looking for some combination where the hoods are blue or white and the lever blade is blue or silver. If there is a company out there that makes something like this or very close and a white or blood hood cover could be added I would appreciate.

P.S. I know Origin-8 makes or made white levers with black hoods but I can't find any online and I don't know if there is some aftermarket hood cover that would fit them.


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

Try using qbike.com to search for any components you are looking for. It will list all online stores according to price point. As to downspout shifters, you can easily convert it to the lever shifter by installing an adapter after uninstall the downspout shifters. It only takes a few minutes.


----------



## Steelhead3686

I may convert the shifter down the road. I will see how the downspout shifters suite me and if I find they are too much of a hassle I will switch them out. Thank you for the advise.


----------



## Richd748

New to cycling and Did not want to spend alot until I know I will continue this routinely/frequently. Looking at 2012 GT GTR 4.0. I have read some reviews on this bike but was wondering if any one had further input / experience with this bike. Plan on doing the hotter n hell 100 mile in two weeks and future rides. Before any reply on going out and doing this ride, I did 75 miles the past two years on my mountain bike.


----------



## Richd748

New to cycling and Did not want to spend alot until I know I will continue this routinely/frequently. Looking at 2012 GT GTR 4.0. I have read some reviews on this bike but was wondering if any one had further input / experience with this bike. Plan on doing the hotter n hell 100 mile in two weeks and future rides. Before any reply on going out and doing this ride, I did 75 miles the past two years on my mountain bike.


----------



## Richd748

*******


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

What are you asking exactly? Opinion on the GTR or doing a century ride?


----------



## Richd748

Thoughts about the GT GTR 4.0 as a first ride.


----------



## PJ352

Richd748 said:


> Thoughts about the GT GTR 4.0 as a first ride.


It's a race bike, so if it suites your intended purposes and fits your anatomy, it's a fine choice. 

Tell us a little about your cycling experiences, your intended uses/ goals, where you saw the bike, if you've been sized/ fitted and taken a test ride and maybe we can off advice better tailored to your needs and budget.


----------



## usn.mustanger

Awesome thread, thanks for all the help for noobs!


----------



## divot23

Hi guys i will apologise in advance for my newbie questions. Im getting into cycling a little more seriously now and am looking to by a road bike upto 1000. I have looked at a 2nd hand but never Merida 904 2011. AL fram, CF forks, Shimano 105 running gears he wants $800. As i have read its important to be fitted to your bike so is buying a 2nd hand bike like this a bad idea for your first?? 

Thanks for any help in advance.


----------



## PJ352

divot23 said:


> Hi guys i will apologise in advance for my newbie questions. Im getting into cycling a little more seriously now and am looking to by a road bike upto 1000. I have looked at a 2nd hand but never Merida 904 2011. AL fram, CF forks, Shimano 105 running gears he wants $800. *As i have read its important to be fitted to your bike so is buying a 2nd hand bike like this a bad idea for your first??*
> 
> Thanks for any help in advance.


It's not necessarily a bad idea to buy used for a first bike, as long as you take steps to safeguard that sizing is right before committing to the purchase. Remember, _sizing_ has to be right for a _fitting_ to go well.

To do this, I suggest asking the seller to bring the bike to your LBS for mechanical and sizing assessment. While there, (and assuming it's mechanically sound and fits you) they can also advise you on the bikes value, because it tends to vary by region.

All the above assumes a bike of interest will suite your intended uses (ex: road bikes - paved surfaces/ CX bikes paved and light off-roading). 

HTH, and good luck!


----------



## MissNewbie

I am a total beginner looking into buying a road bike. I don't have a bike shop (with the exception of a runners shop that actually knows as much about biking as the salesman at walmart) for about 100 miles from my hometown and it is really not very popular in my area. Anyone that I know who bikes is a transplant from another area and does most of their own tune ups and repairs or drives thier bike the 100 miles to the nearest good bike shop. 

I have looked up a lot of information on getting the right fit for me but does anyone have any suggestions on where I could find (online or any suggestion at all) a used or very cheap bike. I would love to get into the sport but considering it is so unpopular in my area I would hate to spend a great deal in a bike only to use it very little. Ideally I would like to spend less than $500 (would love to find something in the 300-400 range) on my first bike until I see if it is a sport I will stick with. I have also looked into doing some sprint tri's.

If I were to buy a more expensive bike (say around $800) and find that I do not enjoy the sport is there usually a pretty good chance I can sell the bike for near what I paid for it or does the resale price drop dramatically after buying a bike? 

I need some help weighing my options and any suggestions are greatly appreciated!


----------



## NJBiker72

MissNewbie said:


> I am a total beginner looking into buying a road bike. I don't have a bike shop (with the exception of a runners shop that actually knows as much about biking as the salesman at walmart) for about 100 miles from my hometown and it is really not very popular in my area. Anyone that I know who bikes is a transplant from another area and does most of their own tune ups and repairs or drives thier bike the 100 miles to the nearest good bike shop.
> 
> I have looked up a lot of information on getting the right fit for me but does anyone have any suggestions on where I could find (online or any suggestion at all) a used or very cheap bike. I would love to get into the sport but considering it is so unpopular in my area I would hate to spend a great deal in a bike only to use it very little. Ideally I would like to spend less than $500 (would love to find something in the 300-400 range) on my first bike until I see if it is a sport I will stick with. I have also looked into doing some sprint tri's.
> 
> If I were to buy a more expensive bike (say around $800) and find that I do not enjoy the sport is there usually a pretty good chance I can sell the bike for near what I paid for it or does the resale price drop dramatically after buying a bike?
> 
> I need some help weighing my options and any suggestions are greatly appreciated!


I think if you read this thread you will see everyone telling you to buy local and get fitted, but that sounds like it may not be a realistic option for you (although 100 miles once to avoid buying the wrong bike might be worth it).

If you are handy, check out www.bikesdirect.com. I would not use them but they get good reviews and a lot of people like them. Plenty of other on-line places. I like Jenson USA but have never bought a bike from them. Same goes for www.pricepoint.com. 

Most sites have on-line fit calculators. Try several.


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

Have you try looking on craigslist? You might be able to find a preowned bike at a reasonable price. Just make sure the fit is good. As NJbiker suggest, you can also purchase a new bike online. You can find some great deal. Go to the Hot Deal forum for info.


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

Not necessary especially with the internet. People sell their bikes on this forum using the classified all the time. Another option is to sell on craigslist or ebay. As for resale on LBS bike, you are wrong on that especially if the components on the bike is mid-range to higher-range. Also, the frame material has alot to do with resale value. For example, aluminum frame will likely command less than a carbon frame. The popularity of certain models will also command a higher resale reprice. As much as I don't like buying from LBS, they do offer fitting and other services that a online shop can't. Example, good customer service if you are spending alot on a bike.


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

Again, depends on the model. If it's a popular model with great reviews, people would be willing for fork it out. On the other hand, if you are buying an unknown/unheard of brand, your chances are slim.


----------



## PJ352

CycoBob said:


> I'm in the same boat as you, MissNewbie.
> 
> I bought this 4 months ago:
> Road Bikes, Roadbikes - Mercier Galaxy SC3 Aluminum Road bikes
> 
> Love it! It was easy to put together (a child could do it) and it rides great- never a problem. To get similar at a bike shop, you'd probably have to spend between $800-$1000. *Fitting shouldn'
> t be a big deal, as there are big steps between the sizes-* so it would only be critical if you are right on the cusp of two sizes...otherwise, simply take the recommendation on their chart (Might want to email them, and see if the recs are different for women). Lots of other good bikes on their site, too, for under $500- and they have women's bikes also.
> 
> Great thing is, my experience with buying stuff like this (as opposed to paying retail at a shop) is that you can usually sell them for very close to what you paid for them- whereas a bike from a shop takes a big hit in depreciation as soon as it leaves the shop (Especially in areas like ours, where there aren't other bikers, and people would have to travel)


Re: that bold statement, Besides blurring the lines of sizng and fitting, I'd draw exactly the opposite conclusion that you do. Large gaps in frame sizes complicate fitting a rider, because the odds increase that sizing will be off enough to require compromises to fit.

Re: the higher resale value of BD bikes, IMO that's highly unlikely. Most potential buyers with even a casual interest in cycling have heard of Trek, Giant, Specialized and some other bigger names. Bikes Direct hardly can claim the same level of recognition, so most buyers will hedge on spending more for an unknown commodity. 

As far as a child performing final assembly, while it's an amusing comment, I know adults that can't turn a screw without stripping it, so no, you can't know that everyone receiving a bike in a box can assemble it to a level safe to ride. Even BD recognizes this recommends that buyers have an LBS assemble their bikes. And that's just one of many hidden expenses of buying online. 

OP: I agree with NJBiker72. Taking the 100 mile ride to a bike shop to avail yourself of their services would IMO/E be worth the time. While it's understandable to want to limit your investment until you know you'll stay with the sport, there's a good chance you won't stay with it riding an ill fitting bike. That given, my advice is to take steps to get fit right, then you'll be more apt to enjoy your time riding.


----------



## jerryused

*First bike*

Make sure its comfortable and the colors you like.


----------



## jerryused

*Lbs*

Sorry for being such a beginner but what does LBS stand for?


Any road bike that costs more than 750 dollars as far as I'm concerned should be a good bike.
Make sure it fits and the ride is comfortable. Hate to see you hitting your knees on the handle bars.


----------



## NJBiker72

jerryused said:


> Sorry for being such a beginner but what does LBS stand for?
> 
> 
> Any road bike that costs more than 750 dollars as far as I'm concerned should be a good bike.
> Make sure it fits and the ride is comfortable. Hate to see you hitting your knees on the handle bars.


Local Bike Shop

$750 will get you a reliable entry level bike. Not much more. 

Depends on your thoughts if that is a "good" bike.


----------



## AliciaJS

*Carbon frame, or no?*

First off, thank you all for all of the information as it has been most helpful.

After thoroughly perusing this thread I finally went to a couple LBS today. I am brand new to this sport and have been very tentative in jumping in because it all seems to be very overwhelming. Looking to purchase a bike for fitness purposes and possibly to commute to work. I live in a mountainous region and will be climbing my fair share of hills. I am trying to keep my budget <$800 just to keep the hubs satisfied, but could definitely afford a more expensive bike if it is truly justified. 

Here is what I tested today:
2012 Felt z100
2012 GT Series 5 Road Bike

I really liked both of them, but am leaning towards the Felt. I know this is long winded, but after talking to the salesman about my intended uses he strongly recommended I upgrade to the 2012 Felt ZW6. His reason being the full carbon frame because he believes I will want to upgrade in less than a year. However, it is double my budget and I am concerned about the carbon frame being "fragile" in a sense. So my question is-- is it really going to make that big of a difference in the feel or is he just trying to up-sell me?


----------



## RoadrunnerLXXI

Carbon frames are MUCH lighter than aluminum frame. They are stiffer than the aluminum frame, but some still flex a bit. I have ridden 2 different carbon frame and they are NOT fragile. Unless you crash, this shouldn't be a concern. Just like any bike, you should test ride it so you know how it feel.

As for his comment on upgrading, it doesn't sounds like you want to since it for commuting only. Thus you already know the answer. Unless you plan on doing so group ride, club ride or you just want to ride for fitness.


----------



## jerryused

I looked up the ZW6 and that isn't expensive for carbon. When aluminum hit the scene everybody was worried about the same you are with carbon.


If you have the money buy what will make you happy or else take up running.


----------



## PJ352

AliciaJS said:


> First off, thank you all for all of the information as it has been most helpful.
> 
> After thoroughly perusing this thread I finally went to a couple LBS today. I am brand new to this sport and have been very tentative in jumping in because it all seems to be very overwhelming. Looking to purchase a bike for fitness purposes and possibly to commute to work. I live in a mountainous region and will be climbing my fair share of hills. I am trying to keep my budget <$800 just to keep the hubs satisfied, but could definitely afford a more expensive bike if it is truly justified.
> 
> Here is what I tested today:
> 2012 Felt z100
> 2012 GT Series 5 Road Bike
> 
> *I really liked both of them, but am leaning towards the Felt. I know this is long winded, but after talking to the salesman about my intended uses he strongly recommended I upgrade to the 2012 Felt ZW6.* His reason being the full carbon frame because he believes I will want to upgrade in less than a year. However, it is double my budget and I am concerned about the carbon frame being "fragile" in a sense. So my question is-- is it really going to make that big of a difference in the feel or is he just trying to up-sell me?


Assuming both bikes suite your intended purposes, I'd be more concerned with the fit/ geo differences between the Z100 and ZW6 than the differences in frame materials. You don't say what frame size you test rode in the Z100, but reach on the WSD bike is noticeably shorter (and frame sizes are limited), so assuming a good fit on the Z100, if you do opt for the ZW6, make sure it fits.

BTW, I disagree with the poster stating that CF is much lighter than aluminum. That's not a given, and as an example, a C'dale CAAD 10 or Specialized Allez can weight a couple of lbs. less than a current lower end CF framed bike. Same goes for stiffness. A variety of factors influence that (tubing selection/ diameters, CF layup, etc.), so you can easily have a CF frameset that's more flexy than an alu frameset.

Since you want to stay within budget, this is your first road bike, you like the Z100, and the Z series will allow running a slightly wider tire (smooths the ride), my advice is to stay with your 1st choice unless there's a compelling reason not to (better fit being one good example).


----------



## AliciaJS

Thanks so much for the insight all! I didn't actually ride the ZW6 so I don't know about the fit, but I was on the 54 cm frame of the Z100. After looking at the geometries, I don't think that a women's variety would even fit me. I have decided to stick to my guns on budget. I am going to go back and ride both the GT and the Felt and just solidify my decision. It's just so hard to know when to "splurge" when you're getting into something new, so I really appreciate the advice and information. 

Thanks again for all of your help!


----------



## cyanca

I see what some of you are sayin that the entry level bikes are pretty much the same carbon forks aluminum frame. I'm looking to buy my first road bike after years of mountain biking an racing bmx I am looking to spend around 1500 am I still in the same boat of everything being pretty much the same like at this price can one blow another model away or just still maybe a different feel from the fit an some different components


----------



## joey cee

Im sorry if i sound redundant here but im looking for help on my first road bike...
I currently ride Mtb and i want to get into Road. i dont want to spend more than $1000 but i believe that inorder to get a carbon fork and atleast shimano 105's set....that i will have to spend at least $1500....?????

Im 5.3 and about 190 lbs...i want to loos wieght so i should be back at 160 in a few months...
any recomendations as to what bike to look at and try out...???


----------



## PJ352

joey cee said:


> Im sorry if i sound redundant here but im looking for help on my first road bike...
> I currently ride Mtb and i want to get into Road. i dont want to spend more than $1000 but i believe that inorder to get a carbon fork and atleast shimano 105's set....that i will have to spend at least $1500....?????
> 
> Im 5.3 and about 190 lbs...i want to loos wieght so i should be back at 160 in a few months...
> any recomendations as to what bike to look at and try out...???


Just a guess, but generally speaking you're probably going to require something in a 47-49cm frame size. Depending on how you're proportioned, WSD bikes may be worth a look, but best bet is to visit some LBS's, discuss your intended uses/ goals and price range, get sized/ fitted and test ride some of their offerings. 

In your price you'll get a decent bike with decent specs, so before focusing on any particular brands/ models or specs, I'd focus on getting a bike that fits well and feels good to ride. That IMO is the most important part.


----------



## joshuashih1

great stuff here


----------



## joey cee

ok so i currently ride mtb... i am looking to get into road and i dont know where to start...
so far i have read that shimano 105's are a good starter set....and obviously a carbon fork....
i wanted to keep my budget around $1000 and i know that trek, specialized and felt have bike in that range....but i was open to suggestions to particular brands and specific models....???

i am a male,about 5.4, 180 lbs and a leg length of 29 inches...
what i want to accomplish is get fit and spend alot of time on the bike with long trips everytime...
roughly about 25 mile trips...

i would really appreciate any and all help...
i live in chandler arizona if that helps.


----------



## PJ352

joey cee said:


> ok so i currently ride mtb... i am looking to get into road and i dont know where to start...
> so far i have read that shimano 105's are a good starter set....and obviously a carbon fork....
> i wanted to keep my budget around $1000 and i know that trek, specialized and felt have bike in that range....but i was open to suggestions to particular brands and specific models....???
> 
> i am a male,about 5.4, 180 lbs and a leg length of 29 inches...
> what i want to accomplish is get fit and spend alot of time on the bike with long trips everytime...
> roughly about 25 mile trips...
> 
> i would really appreciate any and all help...
> i live in chandler arizona if that helps.


Before focusing on any one brand or model, my advice is to visit some LBS's, discuss your cycling experiences, fitness/ flexibility, intended uses/ goals, price range) and let them recommend some bikes that suite your needs and budget. 

Once you're sized/ fitted, head out on the roads for test rides, focusing on fit/ feel, control placement and feel. This, IME is the best way to determine preferences and whittle the field.

Re: 105 components, while it's a fine groupset, in your price range you're more likely to find Shimano Sora, Tiagra or SRAM's Apex. All are fine groups for recreational riders, so don't discount any before test riding bikes so equipped.


----------



## joey cee

yes i meant to write $1500 for the price range...


i did visit a LBS and tried out a couple...but i figured i would still ask here for expert advice....


----------



## PJ352

joey cee said:


> yes i meant to write $1500 for the price range...
> 
> 
> i did visit a LBS and tried out a couple...but i figured i would still ask here for expert advice....


Not sure how 'expert' my advice is, but it's based on my experiences.

Even with your $1,500 price range, I'll stand by my previous advice re: groupsets. Honestly, don't get too caught up in 'having' to have 105. There are plenty of guys that race Tiagra and do quite well. The new 10 speed version is modeled after the previous 105 groupset, and IMO it offers a lot of performance for the price. Sora is new for 2013 as well and SRAM's Apex is highly regarded, so you have some good options.. 

Also, discuss the terrain you'll be riding with the LBS's, because you want to match gearing with your fitness/ terrain.


----------



## optify

*would like a shiny new roadbike - who can blame me *

Sorry for the long post, I was trying to follow the recommendation on this forum: "Tell us a little about your cycling experiences, your intended uses/ goals, where you saw the bike, if you've been sized/ fitted and taken a test ride and maybe we can off advice better tailored to your needs and budget."

Experience
Recreational biking; 1-2 charity rides of 30-75 miles/yr. This year, added regular 15m loops in the local park and 1x 40 miles on a popular route. I don't keep up with the bike club guys unless I push. I’m 5'10, 172 lbs. My current bike is a Cross/Trekking bike, 7005 aluminum with suspension fork locked out, suspension in the seat post (OK but a bit bouncy, don't need that again), complete Deore 9 speed, and my favorite on the bike: Magura HS11 hydraulic brakes. 
I'd like something snappier for 15-20+ mile loops in the park for exercise, and take part in other longer charity rides of 50+ miles. I might join a local club for some group rides in the area. I see no racing on the horizon for me. I thought in the $1000-$1500 range I would find something. 

I have ridden: CAAD 10 105, CAAD 10 4 Rival, Giant Defy , Synapse Carbon Apex , Synapse Alloy 5 w/ 105, Orbea Aqua 2011 with Tiagra
First try at the bigger shop was Giant Defy w/105 (top tube felt too long) and Synapse Carbon w/Apex (bike shop put me on it, out of my price range and don't want carbon - yet).

At my LBS, I followed the same 10 min. route down the block, and back again, trying acceleration & shifting, hard braking and weaving to feel balance.
First time I went to my LBS, I rode Synapse 5, CAAD 10 5, and Orbea Aqua. The Orbea was the first bike I took for a second spin on that route because I was having fun. But I dislike that I spend $1100 for last year's Tiagra 9 speed, and heavier 7005 aluminum bike. The Synapse felt sluggish, but maybe just because it was the 1st. Easy to say I liked the CAAD 10.
Second time, I rode the two CAAD 10s to determine if I want 105 or SRAM. I walked away determined I prefer SRAM. 
Pro SRAM:
-	Hoods distribute the pressure better; I got slight a small blister on the 105 hoods (not wearing gloves but an observation nonetheless). 
-	Reach brake handles better - but that may be adjustable, I don't know.
-	Feels surer in finding the gears whereas with Shimano I sometimes mis-shift, i.e. gear doesn't shift or shifts 1 gear too many.
-	You can downshift while braking on SRAM.

Pro 105: front derailleur shifts much smoother and faster, a lot of effort necessary on SRAM, comparatively.
Overall 105 shifts very smooth, a very good feeling. Could I live with it? Absolutely - I do wonder if SRAM warrants the extra $250-$300 on the CAAD 4.

Shops and reviews yell CAAD 10 - best bike now! I liked the acceleration, balance is good, I feel comfortable on it - although it feels like I need to up my own game to keep up with the bike in terms of power and control of the bike. The resale value, should I want sth different, may hold up nicely for this popular, well-reviewed bike.
Orbea: how much is that bike really worth - and will I get upgrade-itis very soon? I do have a soft spot for Orbea because it's different; the Orbea is now putting out a 2013 Aqua with Apex and Shimano R500 for $1450 MSRP, but same 7005 frame. Is it worth it vs. CAAD10 105/Rival?

For now I ignore the Giant which isn't available at the LBS (should I though, since the Defys won several Editor's Choice in Bicycling mag?) I have not tried any Specialized, must I try the Allez w/ Apex, and maybe the Secteur? Must I try Giant again? Or CAAD 8 - even if not available with SRAM now, maybe the best option for a 2012 with Tiagra for ~$1000 as a first bike?

This year’s Century made me wonder how much bike I really need: people on $2500+ had fun, as did many on cheaper bikes, incl. the ones I'm looking at. You could 'waste' several hundred $$ on too much bike.

Sorry again for the long post but hope better than back/forth
Thanks for your advice


----------



## PJ352

optify said:


> Sorry for the long post, I was trying to follow the recommendation on this forum: "Tell us a little about your cycling experiences, your intended uses/ goals, where you saw the bike, if you've been sized/ fitted and taken a test ride and maybe we can off advice better tailored to your needs and budget."
> 
> Experience
> Recreational biking; 1-2 charity rides of 30-75 miles/yr. This year, added regular 15m loops in the local park and 1x 40 miles on a popular route. I don't keep up with the bike club guys unless I push. I’m 5'10, 172 lbs. My current bike is a Cross/Trekking bike, 7005 aluminum with suspension fork locked out, suspension in the seat post (OK but a bit bouncy, don't need that again), complete Deore 9 speed, and my favorite on the bike: Magura HS11 hydraulic brakes.
> I'd like something snappier for 15-20+ mile loops in the park for exercise, and take part in other longer charity rides of 50+ miles. I might join a local club for some group rides in the area. I see no racing on the horizon for me. I thought in the $1000-$1500 range I would find something.
> 
> I have ridden: CAAD 10 105, CAAD 10 4 Rival, Giant Defy , Synapse Carbon Apex , Synapse Alloy 5 w/ 105, Orbea Aqua 2011 with Tiagra
> First try at the bigger shop was Giant Defy w/105 (top tube felt too long) and Synapse Carbon w/Apex (bike shop put me on it, out of my price range and don't want carbon - yet).
> 
> At my LBS, I followed the same 10 min. route down the block, and back again, trying acceleration & shifting, hard braking and weaving to feel balance.
> First time I went to my LBS, I rode Synapse 5, CAAD 10 5, and Orbea Aqua. The Orbea was the first bike I took for a second spin on that route because I was having fun. But I dislike that I spend $1100 for last year's Tiagra 9 speed, and heavier 7005 aluminum bike. The Synapse felt sluggish, but maybe just because it was the 1st. Easy to say I liked the CAAD 10.
> Second time, I rode the two CAAD 10s to determine if I want 105 or SRAM. I walked away determined I prefer SRAM.
> Pro SRAM:
> -	Hoods distribute the pressure better; I got slight a small blister on the 105 hoods (not wearing gloves but an observation nonetheless).
> -	Reach brake handles better - but that may be adjustable, I don't know.
> -	Feels surer in finding the gears whereas with Shimano I sometimes mis-shift, i.e. gear doesn't shift or shifts 1 gear too many.
> -	You can downshift while braking on SRAM.
> 
> Pro 105: front derailleur shifts much smoother and faster, a lot of effort necessary on SRAM, comparatively.
> Overall 105 shifts very smooth, a very good feeling. Could I live with it? Absolutely - I do wonder if SRAM warrants the extra $250-$300 on the CAAD 4.
> 
> Shops and reviews yell CAAD 10 - best bike now! I liked the acceleration, balance is good, I feel comfortable on it - although it feels like I need to up my own game to keep up with the bike in terms of power and control of the bike. The resale value, should I want sth different, may hold up nicely for this popular, well-reviewed bike.
> Orbea: how much is that bike really worth - and will I get upgrade-itis very soon? I do have a soft spot for Orbea because it's different; the Orbea is now putting out a 2013 Aqua with Apex and Shimano R500 for $1450 MSRP, but same 7005 frame. Is it worth it vs. CAAD10 105/Rival?
> 
> For now I ignore the Giant which isn't available at the LBS (should I though, since the Defys won several Editor's Choice in Bicycling mag?) I have not tried any Specialized, must I try the Allez w/ Apex, and maybe the Secteur? Must I try Giant again? Or CAAD 8 - even if not available with SRAM now, maybe the best option for a 2012 with Tiagra for ~$1000 as a first bike?
> 
> This year’s Century made me wonder how much bike I really need: people on $2500+ had fun, as did many on cheaper bikes, incl. the ones I'm looking at. You could 'waste' several hundred $$ on too much bike.
> 
> Sorry again for the long post but hope better than back/forth
> Thanks for your advice


Considering your intended uses and the fact that this is your first road bike, I suggest staying at the lower end of your price range. Reasons being, 1) it'll take you awhile to gain some experience to determine just what your ideal bike might be, and 2) even at this stage, it's apparent that you kinda, sorta have preferences of bikes/ groupsets, but then second guess yourself.

Not to complicate things further, but it would be good for you to branch out some and test ride a few more bikes. If necessary, drive a bit to find that Giant Defy in your size - or a Specialized Secteur. Not because either are inherently better than some you've mentioned, but maybe after a test ride you'll think one is, and that's the point of test rides - to help you determine your preferences and whittle the field.

One thought about your test rides.. my advice is to get off the sidewalk and the straight line rides and venture out on the roads. Find some twisty roads, climbs/ descents. The point is that test rides should emulate the road riding you'll be doing with this bike, so put them through their paces. 

BTW, re: groupsets and how well they function on test rides, I advise you to take that with a grain of salt. It's seldom that all the bikes on a dealers floor are tuned to perfection, so you may be misled into thinking one groupset shifts better than another, when it's likely that both shift fine, once set up/ tuned correctly. If I told you how my current 'go to' bike shifted on my test ride, you'd ask me why I bought it. The answer being that I liked the important aspects (fit/ feel, ride, handling and control placement) and knew the poor shifting was likely easily fixed, and it was.

Last, but not least, shop for shops along with shopping for bikes. The ones that emphasize the importance of test rides and getting fit right get extra points. IMO. 

HTH's, and if you have any other questions/ comments update here and we'll try to assist further.


----------



## kurtsy

I'm currently in the market for my first road bike and was hoping to enlist the help of you all in determining exactly the value of a fit.

Basically, I have the opportunity to buy a low KMs (less than 100) Ultegra CAAD10 on craigslist/kijiji for the same price as a Rival CAAD10 at my LBS, both are 2012. I've never been fitted beyond standing on that machine they have at bike stores and pulling that metal piece up into my crotch (that contraption told me I am a 56). I expect, however, there is more to a fitting at a 'pro' shop than simply finding a frame that fits (stem/seatpost/saddle position I'm assuming?).

I suppose my question for you all is, which would be a better use of my money? Downgrading the components a bit and getting a bike that for sure fits me perfectly, or pony up for the ultegra bike and attempting to go it alone.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## NJBiker72

kurtsy said:


> I'm currently in the market for my first road bike and was hoping to enlist the help of you all in determining exactly the value of a fit.
> 
> Basically, I have the opportunity to buy a low KMs (less than 100) Ultegra CAAD10 on craigslist/kijiji for the same price as a Rival CAAD10 at my LBS, both are 2012. I've never been fitted beyond standing on that machine they have at bike stores and pulling that metal piece up into my crotch (that contraption told me I am a 56). I expect, however, there is more to a fitting at a 'pro' shop than simply finding a frame that fits (stem/seatpost/saddle position I'm assuming?).
> 
> I suppose my question for you all is, which would be a better use of my money? Downgrading the components a bit and getting a bike that for sure fits me perfectly, or pony up for the ultegra bike and attempting to go it alone.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


IMO, the fit. The "downgrade" in components is minimal. Some, myself included, would argue non-existent. In fact, I believe Rival is about 200 g lighter than Ultegra.That may be dated though.


----------



## Staxed

Apparently I can't start any new threads at all until I have 5 posts, so I guess this is the best place to ask this until I can do so.

What do I need to budget for other than the bike when I am first getting started? I'm looking at getting a complete bikes (not building my own or anything). Are there anything, like seats, pedals, etc that I need to think about replacing right off the bat?

I see people talking about clipless, etc...I have no clue what any of the terms mean. (a term sticky in this forum might be a good idea for us newbies...)


----------



## PJ352

NJBiker72 said:


> IMO, the fit. The "downgrade" in components is minimal. Some, myself included, would argue non-existent. In fact, I believe Rival is about 200 g lighter than Ultegra.That may be dated though.


I'll second this. Seek out a reputable shop that'll take the time to discuss your intended uses/ goals, cycling experiences (if any), fitness/ flexibility, price range, then size/ fit you to any bikes of interest. From there, head out on the roads, focusing on fit/ feel, ride and handling, whittling the field from there.

Once set up/ tuned correctly, even the lower level road groups perform and function well, but more to the point, even a higher end group isn't going to make a bad bike fit comfortable.

As we often say here, fit matters most, so take the steps above to ensure you get that right.


----------



## PJ352

Staxed said:


> Apparently I can't start any new threads at all until I have 5 posts, so I guess this is the best place to ask this until I can do so.
> 
> What do I need to budget for other than the bike when I am first getting started? I'm looking at getting a complete bikes (not building my own or anything). Are there anything, like seats, pedals, etc that I need to think about replacing right off the bat?
> 
> I see people talking about clipless, etc...I have no clue what any of the terms mean. (a term sticky in this forum might be a good idea for us newbies...)


Here's a glossary of bicycle related definitions:
http://sheldonbrown.com/glossary.html

On a decent quality/ entry level bike, you shouldn't have to replace anything right off the bat. Reputable LBS's will size/ fit you to the bike and the pedals provided will do until you decide on the type of pedal system you want.

More info here:
http://www.caree.org/bike101cliplesspedals.htm

Here's a list of things I consider essential:

Helmet
Padded bike shorts/ bibs

Wedge saddle bag - medium (Topeak/ Specialized are two good brands)
Tire levers
Spare tube
Patch kit
Innovations Ultraflate Plus CO2 inflator
2-3 12-16g unthreaded carts (I get the 12g's by the box at Walmart)
Multitool w/ chain breaker

Not essential, but nice to have:
Jersey
Gloves

And in the saddle bag:
Rag/ paper towels
Latex gloves
A second tube, if it'll fit. And some members have suggested individual packets of waterless soap (Gojo, or similar).


----------



## Staxed

PJ352 said:


> Here's a glossary of bicycle related definitions:
> 
> On a decent quality/ entry level bike, you shouldn't have to replace anything right off the bat. Reputable LBS's will size/ fit you to the bike and the pedals provided will do until you decide on the type of pedal system you want.
> 
> More info here:
> 
> Here's a list of things I consider essential:
> 
> Helmet
> Padded bike shorts/ bibs
> 
> Wedge saddle bag - medium (Topeak/ Specialized are two good brands)
> Tire levers
> Spare tube
> Patch kit
> Innovations Ultraflate Plus CO2 inflator
> 2-3 12-16g unthreaded carts (I get the 12g's by the box at Walmart)
> Multitool w/ chain breaker
> 
> Not essential, but nice to have:
> Jersey
> Gloves
> 
> And in the saddle bag:
> Rag/ paper towels
> Latex gloves
> A second tube, if it'll fit. And some members have suggested individual packets of waterless soap (Gojo, or similar).


Exactly the kind of information I was looking for! Really appreciate the quick response. I'm actually getting ready to head out the door to go talk to a local Bike Shop. Not buying anything yet, just trying to get prepared and work out a budget to get me started.

Thanks again!


----------



## NJBiker72

Staxed said:


> Exactly the kind of information I was looking for! Really appreciate the quick response. I'm actually getting ready to head out the door to go talk to a local Bike Shop. Not buying anything yet, just trying to get prepared and work out a budget to get me started.
> 
> Thanks again!


PJ usually offers good advice. I think he hit everything. 

Go to more than one shop if you can. Ride a few bikes and slightly different types too if you are not sure what you want. IMO, the type of bike and the shop are more important than the brand.


----------



## PJ352

Staxed said:


> Exactly the kind of information I was looking for! Really appreciate the quick response. * I'm actually getting ready to head out the door to go talk to a local Bike Shop*. Not buying anything yet, just trying to get prepared and work out a budget to get me started.
> 
> Thanks again!


Then I'll refer you to my advice to kurtsy, because I think it'll apply. Good luck, and let us know how it goes.


----------



## artthurrr

i just got a trek 2100 for my first bike


----------



## tomsimons

Hey all,

I would start a new thread on this but I don't have enough posts.

Currently, I'm riding a 10-year old Raleigh mountain bike that I have had tuned up and replaced the tires with smooth roadie-type rubber. It was free, but after logging about 200 miles in the past 3 weeks, I've come to the conclusion that it doesn't fit worth a damn and that there is something sufficiently wrong with the shifting mechanism that I'm not super comfortable riding it. I have the means to upgrade to a real road bike and I think it's time to start thinking about what to buy.

I've read a lot over the past month. I'm planning on going to an LBS to get fitted and also to listen to some suggestions as to what I should be looking at. However I want to be armed with some info, if you'll all be so kind as to help me.

I was browsing the LBS website and I saw a listing for a 2012 Trek Madone 4.7 for $1,750. After calling them to see about the bike, I discovered that the listing was an error, but not before I did a ton of research on the bike and really started lusting over it. I'm fairly certain that even buying a Trek 1.1 would give me a significant performance/comfort boost over my current ride, but I'm starting to think that a more significant upgrade would be worthwhile. This way I can avoid the upgrade game in 6 months or whatever.

Is a bike like the 4.7 a silly purchase for a newb? Ignoring the "are you actually going to keep riding it?" question for a moment, does it make sense for a newbie to go for a bike with such advanced components?

For more color, I plan on riding around 50 miles per week with long rides on the weekends (30+ miles) and a long charity run every few months (50-100 miles). It's almost entirely road cycling and there are plenty of nasty hills that I love climbing (my tank mountain bike notwithstanding).

If it is, would you say that $2,699 is a good price for such a bike? TIA!


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I would start a new thread on this but I don't have enough posts.
> 
> Currently, I'm riding a 10-year old Raleigh mountain bike that I have had tuned up and replaced the tires with smooth roadie-type rubber. It was free, but after logging about 200 miles in the past 3 weeks, I've come to the conclusion that it doesn't fit worth a damn and that there is something sufficiently wrong with the shifting mechanism that I'm not super comfortable riding it. I have the means to upgrade to a real road bike and I think it's time to start thinking about what to buy.
> 
> I've read a lot over the past month. I'm planning on going to an LBS to get fitted and also to listen to some suggestions as to what I should be looking at. However I want to be armed with some info, if you'll all be so kind as to help me.
> 
> I was browsing the LBS website and I saw a listing for a 2012 Trek Madone 4.7 for $1,750. After calling them to see about the bike, I discovered that the listing was an error, but not before I did a ton of research on the bike and really started lusting over it. I'm fairly certain that even buying a Trek 1.1 would give me a significant performance/comfort boost over my current ride, but I'm starting to think that a more significant upgrade would be worthwhile. This way I can avoid the upgrade game in 6 months or whatever.
> 
> Is a bike like the 4.7 a silly purchase for a newb? Ignoring the "are you actually going to keep riding it?" question for a moment, does it make sense for a newbie to go for a bike with such advanced components?
> 
> For more color, I plan on riding around 50 miles per week with long rides on the weekends (30+ miles) and a long charity run every few months (50-100 miles). It's almost entirely road cycling and there are plenty of nasty hills that I love climbing (my tank mountain bike notwithstanding).
> 
> If it is, would you say that $2,699 is a good price for such a bike? TIA!


Given your intended uses and track record (keeping bikes 10 years), I suggest dropping your budget some. Doing so will obviously save you some money to use on helmets, shoes, pedals, etc., and as long as you buy the bike that suites those intended uses, lower priced brand/ model will easily meet your needs - for years to come.

Next suggestion is to branch out a little and test ride some other brands and models. Treks are nice bikes, but so are a lot of others, so don't pigeonhole yourself by only considering one brand. Exposing yourself to others (thru test rides) will help you determine your preferences for fit, ride, handling and control placement. Then you'll whittle the field. Shop for shops as well as bikes, because they'll be a resource to you, post-purchase. 

At the end of this process, you may very well end up with a Trek, but at least then it'll be an educated purchasing decision. Not _just_ based on price, pictures or specs.


----------



## tomsimons

Argh double post. Sorry


----------



## tomsimons

Thanks for talking me back from the ledge! I have to say that it's tough to sort all of this stuff out. If you look in this thread, the overriding theme is to get yourself set up at minimum cost and then reevaluate after a year or so. However other threads preach the virtues of certain equipment sets and not wasting time or money on lower quality bikes only to upgrade later on. 

There are two shops local to me that I like and each is a trek dealer (though they have small selections by other manufacturers) so while I'm not personally married to trek, I was just focusing there because it will be the easiest catalog to pick through (the whole spectrum will be available). 

I'll look around some more and test shops/bikes out since I'm in no particular hurry. However I'd like to just ask one more specific question. Should I focus on the absolute base model that if offered by several manufacturers or look a little bit up the scale? To use trek as an example once again, would it be best to look at the 1.1 or 1.5? Should I look for a minimum 10 gear setup? I believe the 1.1 only has 8. 

Thanks!


----------



## NJBiker72

tomsimons said:


> Thanks for talking me back from the ledge! I have to say that it's tough to sort all of this stuff out. If you look in this thread, the overriding theme is to get yourself set up at minimum cost and then reevaluate after a year or so. However other threads preach the virtues of certain equipment sets and not wasting time or money on lower quality bikes only to upgrade later on.
> 
> There are two shops local to me that I like and each is a trek dealer (though they have small selections by other manufacturers) so while I'm not personally married to trek, I was just focusing there because it will be the easiest catalog to pick through (the whole spectrum will be available).
> 
> I'll look around some more and test shops/bikes out since I'm in no particular hurry. However I'd like to just ask one more specific question. Should I focus on the absolute base model that if offered by several manufacturers or look a little bit up the scale? To use trek as an example once again, would it be best to look at the 1.1 or 1.5? Should I look for a minimum 10 gear setup? I believe the 1.1 only has 8.
> 
> Thanks!


Personally I might look up the line a bit if you can. 

There is a difference. 

This is from someone who started with a $350 bike. It worked. I toasted a friend on a 5k bike on t with lots of training and very careful shifting and handling. 

I upgraded to an entry level bike. But still hated the shifting and really wanted something which I then deemed as faster. I would now call more responsive. 

Eventually ended up with a Tarmac Pro. 

I don't think I would have gotten to this point without the secteur to show me what i did not want. On the other hand, if i had thoroughly tested bikes initially I could see myself being satisfied with a $1500 or Allez with Apex.


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> Thanks for talking me back from the ledge! I have to say that it's tough to sort all of this stuff out. If you look in this thread, the overriding theme is to get yourself set up at minimum cost and then reevaluate after a year or so. However *other threads preach the virtues of certain equipment sets and not wasting time or money on lower quality bikes only to upgrade later on*.


My opinion - that's because some cyclists (but it applies to other sports as well) focus on the 'gear' aspect of the sport as the key to improving, rather than using the bike as a tool and improving the 'motor' (the rider). 

Get the bike that suites your intended purposes/ goals and it'll serve you well for years and thousands of miles. 



tomsimons said:


> There are two shops local to me that I like and each is a trek dealer (though they have small selections by other manufacturers) so while I'm not personally married to trek, I was just focusing there because it will be the easiest catalog to pick through (the whole spectrum will be available).


Understandable, but this is an appreciable investment that you're apt to have for 'awhile' spending hours riding it. Expose yourself to what else is out there, then make an educated decision. 



tomsimons said:


> I'll look around some more and test shops/bikes out since I'm in no particular hurry. However I'd like to just ask one more specific question. Should I focus on the absolute base model that if offered by several manufacturers or look a little bit up the scale? To use trek as an example once again, would it be best to look at the 1.1 or 1.5? Should I look for a minimum 10 gear setup? I believe the 1.1 only has 8.
> 
> Thanks!


My advise stays the same - ride both - in a few brands/ models. That will give you the exposure you need to 'see' the differences. Some may matter to you, others, not so much. 

Re: the number of speeds, IMO/E it's not so much the number that matters, it's more matching the right gears to the riders fitness/ terrain. 

For example, if you live in hilly terrain and I equip your 10 speed bike with what's called a standard double crankset and 'tall' gearing at the rear, you're apt to struggle on the climbs. Conversely, if I equip your 8 speed bike with a triple crankset and lower gearing at the rear, you'll probably do better on the climbs and fine on the flats. So, it's all about tailoring the gearing, not the number of them. 

During your jaunts to the shops and test rides, some things to keep in mind..

- pay attention to the shops that take their time discussing your intended uses/ goals, cycling experiences, fitness/ flexibility, price range, place an emphasis on the importance of fit and encourage test rides - out on the roads and for some duration. These are the better/ more reputable shops, IME.

- all the bikes on a dealers floor are seldom set up/ tuned perfectly, so missed shifts/ thrown chains are fairly common. Point being, if you like the way controls function but shifting isn't as quick/ crisp as 'that other bike', take it with a grain of salt, because odds are a minor adjustment will fix that.

- variances in tire size/ pressure affect ride quality, so note the sizes on the bikes you test ride (most will be 23c or 25c) and ask the dealer to check the pressures beforehand. Ideally, they would be set primarily based on rider weight. Keeping track of these things will tell you why (to a large extent) one bike is riding smoother/ rougher than another and you'll be less likely to be mislead.

Lastly, don't be bashful about asking questions here and updating us on your visits to shops. There are a number of folks with lots of experience willing to help you through this process. By then you might even have enough posts to start your own thread!! :thumbsup:


----------



## tomsimons

Thank you all for the advice! Checked out two shops this week and had a few test rides. One shop seemed to be clearly better than the other. Both stressed fit but one was more scientific about it and just felt more confidence inspiring.

So, I tried out the Felt Z85 and F75 and the Trek 1.5, 2.1 Madone, and 3.1 Madone. Still going to "sleep on it" but I'm leaning towards the 3.1. I really liked the feel of the carbon fiber and the Apex component set. Also since it is a '12 model its been marked down to $1,699.

Thoughts on price there?


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> Thank you all for the advice! Checked out two shops this week and had a few test rides. One shop seemed to be clearly better than the other. Both stressed fit but one was more scientific about it and just felt more confidence inspiring.
> 
> So, I tried out the Felt Z85 and F75 and the Trek 1.5, 2.1 Madone, and 3.1 Madone. Still going to "sleep on it" but *I'm leaning towards the 3.1. I really liked the feel of the carbon fiber and the Apex component set. Also since it is a '12 model its been marked down to $1,699.
> 
> Thoughts on price there?*


Prices can vary by region, but in my area 15% off would be considered a good deal, but not a great deal for a NOS bike.

Also, I'm not seeing where the Apex groupset is offered on the Madone 3.1. It's spec'd with an Apex crankset, but the rest is a Shimano 105/ Tiagra mix.


----------



## tomsimons

I guess I need more posts to put up a link, but in 2012, I believe the 3.1 was available with an Apex group and a Tiagra group.

from bikepedia: 

Components
Component Group 
Brakeset	Alloy dual pivot
Shift Levers	SRAM Apex DoubleTap 10spd
Front Derailleur	SRAM Apex
Rear Derailleur	SRAM Apex
Crankset	SRAM Apex Compact 50/34t
Pedals	not included
Bottom Bracket	SRAM Press Fit

That was more or less my feeling about the price as well, but it is really difficult for me to know for sure. For context, the Z85 was $1,399 and the '12 1.5 was $999 (actually the best deal off of MSRP actually).

One more question... if I end up taking the plunge with one of these bikes, I will need to buy some pedals. Any reason not to get the cheapest Shimano pedals that they have available? I have NO idea what I'm doing in this arena.


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> I guess I need more posts to put up a link, but in 2012, I believe the 3.1 was available with an Apex group and a Tiagra group.
> 
> from bikepedia:
> 
> Components
> Component Group
> Brakeset	Alloy dual pivot
> Shift Levers	SRAM Apex DoubleTap 10spd
> Front Derailleur	SRAM Apex
> Rear Derailleur	SRAM Apex
> Crankset	SRAM Apex Compact 50/34t
> Pedals	not included
> Bottom Bracket	SRAM Press Fit
> 
> That was more or less my feeling about the price as well, but it is really difficult for me to know for sure. For context, the Z85 was $1,399 and the '12 1.5 was $999 (actually the best deal off of MSRP actually).


Yes, that appears to be the case:
BikePedia - 2012 Trek Madone 3.1 Apex Complete Bicycle

Re: price, while we all want the most for our money, I wouldn't be unduly influenced by a couple of hundred dollars or a 5% difference in discounted price. You're probably going to have the bike awhile, so get the one that fits and feels the best to you from the shop you like the best. If it's the Madone w /Apex , I say go for it.


----------



## tomsimons

Cool. Thanks so much for allowing me to bounce these ideas off of you. I think we're on the same page, but it always feels good to hear it from someone else as well.

BTW I edited my last post with a question on pedals. It may seem stupid to buy a nice bike and then put crappy pedals on it, but aside from weight, I can't tell an obvious reason to go high end.


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> Cool. Thanks so much for allowing me to bounce these ideas off of you. I think we're on the same page, but it always feels good to hear it from someone else as well.
> 
> BTW I edited my last post with a question on pedals. It may seem stupid to buy a nice bike and then put crappy pedals on it, but aside from weight, I can't tell an obvious reason to go high end.


My advice is to wait on the pedals till you've talked to some folks (here and at your LBS) about the advantages of road versus mtn, decided on your priorities, then base your decision on them.

Also, I don't know your road riding experiences, but if you're new to this take some time to acclimate to the ride/ handling of your new bike, learning about the shoe/ pedal offerings in the interim, then spring for clipless.

But to answer your question, there's nothing at all wrong with going with lower end pedals. Just don't skimp on the shoes - a well designed, well fitting shoe matters.

Some info on pedal systems:
Bike 101-Clipless Pedals


----------



## tomsimons

So it wouldn't be a total travesty to go in there, buy this great road bike and toss some black platform pedals on there just to sort of get by for a while? I'm totally cool with that idea, but I figure I'm eventually going to be moving to clipless pedals 

My experience is somewhat limited. I've only been at it for a few months, but I've totally gotten the bug. I'm usually out 2-4 nights a week for rides of around 15 miles during the week and then going up to 35-40 on the weekends. I've gotten a great feel for my old mountain bike that I'm using now, but I want something more responsive and with a different riding position. The super-upright position that I have on my bike now (which is really too small for me) is not great past 15 miles or so.


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> So it wouldn't be a total travesty to go in there, buy this great road bike and toss some black platform pedals on there just to sort of get by for a while? I'm totally cool with that idea, but I figure I'm eventually going to be moving to clipless pedals
> 
> My experience is somewhat limited. I've only been at it for a few months, but I've totally gotten the bug. I'm usually out 2-4 nights a week for rides of around 15 miles during the week and then going up to 35-40 on the weekends. I've gotten a great feel for my old mountain bike that I'm using now, but I want something more responsive and with a different riding position. The super-upright position that I have on my bike now (which is really too small for me) is not great past 15 miles or so.


lol.. no, not a total travesty. If some arrogant roadie gives you 'the look', just smile and wave as you pass by. :wink5:

I went back and saw where you were riding a 10 year old, ill fitting mtn bike. I think you'll enjoy your new road bike.


----------



## Charl55es

Good luck in your hunt for that new bike.


----------



## dreadful

Hello I've been lurking for a while and decided to make a post. I"m hoping to get some suggestions on which bike to get from Bikes Direct or someplace similar. I'm wanting a cross bike for commuting and exercise if a road bikes a better option I would be find getting that instead. I did have a budget of around $1200 but, my dog got sick so the budget has dropped to $500 or so. The cheaper I can keep it the better. I've decided that I'm fine learning to do my own adjustment and tuning since the cheapest cross bike at my LBS is $1000 and the bike posting on Craigslist in my area have been useless. I don't need the bike to be the best just one I can use for now. Since it's likely to get bumped by a wheelchair or two by accident unless I keep it outside. All I want from a bike is for it to be somewhat tough, last a year or two with upkeep, be decent at climbing hills, and would like for it to have dropbars, but they are not a must. Any suggestion or advice would be much appreciated.

TL;DR I would like to get a cross or road bike for commuting and exercise from bikes direct or someplace similar. That's around $500, somewhat tough, decent at climbing hills, and would prefer dropbars.


----------



## PJ352

dreadful said:


> Hello I've been lurking for a while and decided to make a post. I"m hoping to get some suggestions on which bike to get from Bikes Direct or someplace similar. I'm wanting a cross bike for commuting and exercise if a road bikes a better option I would be find getting that instead. I did have a budget of around $1200 but, my dog got sick so the budget has dropped to $500 or so. The cheaper I can keep it the better. I've decided that I'm fine learning to do my own adjustment and tuning since the cheapest cross bike at my LBS is $1000 and the bike posting on Craigslist in my area have been useless. I don't need the bike to be the best just one I can use for now. Since it's likely to get bumped by a wheelchair or two by accident unless I keep it outside. All I want from a bike is for it to be somewhat tough, last a year or two with upkeep, be decent at climbing hills, and would like for it to have dropbars, but they are not a must. Any suggestion or advice would be much appreciated.
> 
> TL;DR I would like to get a cross or road bike for commuting and exercise from bikes direct or someplace similar. That's around $500, somewhat tough, decent at climbing hills, and would prefer dropbars.


Given your intended uses and price range, I would suggest finding a LBS selling used. This option gets you some sizing/ fit assistance, the ability to test ride bikes along with a level of post purchase services.

If that's not a viable option for you, next best (IMO/E) is to visit a reputable LBS, be upfront about your situation and intent to buy online and get a standard fitting. It might eat into your budget by ~$50, but their assistance will better your odds of getting a correctly sized bike. It'll also get you started in building a relationship with them, which (until you're up to speed on wrenching and fit) you'll likely need.

As far as which is best for you (CX versus road bike), I would say that if you're certain you'll only ride paved surfaces, go with a road bike, because that's what they're designed for and they tend to weigh a little less. OTOH, if you're considering some light off-roading, a CX offers a good compromise.

Re: a bike being a decent climber, that's really up to the rider, but the proper gearing will definitely help. So if your going to ride in hilly terrain, choose a bike with lower gearing - generally a triple or compact crankset with low rear gearing.


----------



## dreadful

Thanks for the replies, Also the dogs seems fine so far she's on meds for the next two weeks for a uti then she has a follow-up.


----------



## PJ352

dreadful said:


> Thanks for the replies, Also the dogs seems fine so far she's on meds for the next two weeks for a uti then she has a follow-up.


Kudos to you for being a responsible pet owner. As you can see from my avatar, it's important to me.


----------



## tomsimons

Update... went to one more semi-LBS and found an even better environment. They were stressing fit before I even told them what I was looking for. Rode a 2013 Madone 3.1 and I was instantly in love. It may seem superficial, but I liked the black paint more than the blue and white of the 2012. Gave it to me with a 10% discount off of MSRP, a free fitting, and free service for the life of the bike. 

Took it out for 34 miles yesterday... awesome!

Thanks so much for all of the help!


----------



## PJ352

tomsimons said:


> Update... went to one more semi-LBS and found an even better environment. They were stressing fit before I even told them what I was looking for. Rode a 2013 Madone 3.1 and I was instantly in love. It may seem superficial, but I liked the black paint more than the blue and white of the 2012. Gave it to me with a 10% discount off of MSRP, a free fitting, and free service for the life of the bike.
> 
> Took it out for 34 miles yesterday... awesome!
> 
> Thanks so much for all of the help!


Great! Congrats! 

BUT... we wanna see pics! :yesnod:


----------



## tomsimons

I'm working on it 

Probably will have some pics next weekend when I take it out for an easy 75-mile charity ride!


----------



## Liz

PJ352 said:


> Not if they're smart. You're a prospective customer. Remember, there are a number of purchases that come after the bike purchase itself. Helmet, shoes, pedals, apparel, saddle bag, flat repair kits, tools, tuning/ maintenance... so when you consider that potential for earning your business, they should be receptive to fitting you (which they'll also make $$ on).
> 
> And if they're not receptive to the idea, go to another shop.


I learned the hard way about all the purchases that come after......meaning I went way over my budget.

However, I was lucky to have a dealer that gave me more than a few good deals.

Liz


----------



## tomsimons

As promised... a pic or two of my new ride. It's got about 150 miles on it now... many more to come!


----------



## PJ352

Nice bike! Enjoy, and ride safe!


----------



## aw2pp

If anyone still watches this thread...

My wife and I are upgrading from 10 year old Fuji hybrids into our first, entry-level road bikes. We have shopped the shops, as you say here, and narrowed down to one shop in particular. Not because it is the closest (although it is), not because it has either the best bikes or best prices (it doesn't, not by a long shot), but because we like the people who work there. Pure and simple.

Unfortunately, they are more of a higher-end shop, carrying Merckx, Seven, and Cysco. We want to get out of the store with two bikes plus accessories for under $3k, so our hand is forced to Giant, the LBS house brand. We see enough of them around, the bikes must do the job. 

We're large people, so they had to take a couple of days to build some bikes for us to try. (Apparently everyone who rides bicycles is 5'8" or less.) Headed there tomorrow to take some turns up and down the block on a couple of Defy models and maybe a TCR or two.


----------



## NJBiker72

aw2pp said:


> If anyone still watches this thread...
> 
> My wife and I are upgrading from 10 year old Fuji hybrids into our first, entry-level road bikes. We have shopped the shops, as you say here, and narrowed down to one shop in particular. Not because it is the closest (although it is), not because it has either the best bikes or best prices (it doesn't, not by a long shot), but because we like the people who work there. Pure and simple.
> 
> Unfortunately, they are more of a higher-end shop, carrying Merckx, Seven, and Cysco. We want to get out of the store with two bikes plus accessories for under $3k, so our hand is forced to Giant, the LBS house brand. We see enough of them around, the bikes must do the job.
> 
> We're large people, so they had to take a couple of days to build some bikes for us to try. (Apparently everyone who rides bicycles is 5'8" or less.) Headed there tomorrow to take some turns up and down the block on a couple of Defy models and maybe a TCR or two.



Sounds like you are approaching this correctly. 

FWIW, Giant is not a house brand. They are a major player. Might not spend as much on advertising as Trek, Spec, or Canondale, but excellent bikes. Figure out if you want racier or relaxed geo and that will decide between the TCR and the Defy.


----------



## aw2pp

I should have been clearer... by house brand, I don't mean to suggest that I thought they brand the bikes themselves. Rather, my hunch is that for every Merckx, Seven, or Cysco they sell, they probably sell 20 or 30 Giants. So the store is dominated by the Giant presence.

Looking forward to the rides tomorrow. Read another thread that has made me question whether the $250 difference between the Defy 2 and Defy 1 is worth it. $250 buys you an upgraded frame, wheels (which are still pretty bottom-barrell on the Defy 1, from what I understand) and 105 versus Tiagra group. I would ask the opinions of those here, but really, the important thing is whether we notice a difference. And if so, what's that worth.

I may go with the Defy 2 for both of us, and spend the $500 savings on wheels.


----------



## PJ352

aw2pp said:


> If anyone still watches this thread...
> 
> My wife and I are upgrading from 10 year old Fuji hybrids into our first, entry-level road bikes. We have shopped the shops, as you say here, and narrowed down to one shop in particular. Not because it is the closest (although it is), not because it has either the best bikes or best prices (it doesn't, not by a long shot), but because we like the people who work there. Pure and simple.
> 
> Unfortunately, they are more of a higher-end shop, carrying Merckx, Seven, and Cysco. We want to get out of the store with two bikes plus accessories for under $3k, so our hand is forced to Giant, the LBS house brand. We see enough of them around, the bikes must do the job.
> 
> We're large people, so they had to take a couple of days to build some bikes for us to try. (Apparently everyone who rides bicycles is 5'8" or less.) Headed there tomorrow to take some turns up and down the block on a couple of Defy models and maybe a TCR or two.


I'm one of those advocating shopping for shops along with bikes, but in this instance I'll offer that if the Giants work for both of you, that's great. But if not, don't feel that you have to limit yourself to this shop and that brand. In other words, temper good advice with your circumstances, so take this one step at a time and go from there. 

It's important to have a shop you like, but it's equally important to like the bike you end up with, so if you have to go with your second choice in a LBS to get not just more options, but a better option, I suggest being open to that.

Good luck, and keep us posted on your progress.


----------



## aw2pp

Good point. We visited four other shops and chose this one, based on the breadth of their offerings and how they treated us. Frankly, it wasn't close; they were the only LBS we visited that didn't leave us with the feeling that we were an intrusion. Quite the opposite... we learned a great deal in talking with them, and look forward to returning.

That said, if the bikes don't work for us, it doesn't matter how much we like them over the other shops in town.


----------



## PJ352

aw2pp said:


> Good point. We visited four other shops and chose this one, based on the breadth of their offerings and how they treated us. Frankly, it wasn't close; they were the only LBS we visited that didn't leave us with the feeling that we were an intrusion. Quite the opposite... we learned a great deal in talking with them, and look forward to returning.
> 
> That said, if the bikes don't work for us, it doesn't matter how much we like them over the other shops in town.


What you've offered above means a great deal and (IMO) weighs heavily in favor of the shop you're now dealing with.

Ideally, the Giants will work for you and your wife. If not, I would consider expanding the search to semi-LBS's. Hopefully, you won't have to 'go there'. :thumbsup:


----------



## Rocky_Road

I was offered a 2012 trek 2.3 that fit me for $1150. I wanted it so bad! But I've never boughten a road bike so I was struggling to find the motivation to buy it. I can still get it for that price, but I need advice.. 

I've ridden a couple bikes now. The lowest entry Giant bike, didn't like it very much. The Felt Z85, was awesome, comfortable, and fast! but it's too expensive and after riding a Trek 1.5 later, I found the trek 1.5 to feel better than the felt and that trek was less expensive. The trek 1.5 was $1150 at the store it was at. 
So today I check out the local Trek bike store in hopes of riding the 2013 Trek 1.1. They only had a 60cm in stock and I'm a 57-58 so it was no good to try. Instead, I tried the Trek 2.1 and then the 2.3. The 2.1 was for $1104, while the 2.3 he offered $1150! I don't know, any suggestions? I should really try and ride a 1.1. It's all more than what I wanted to pay, but maybe it's worth it?


I really want to get into road biking. The bike will be used for commuting to school (I live in Boulder, CO, there are a lot of nice bikes around so this one isn't going to stand out like crazy. Nonetheless, I have the 5lb new york faghettaboutit lock.) Also, going to get groceries to fit in my backpack. Beyond that, I may try biking to Fort Collins at some point which is a 62 mile ride if not more


----------



## PJ352

Rocky_Road said:


> I was offered a 2012 trek 2.3 that fit me for $1150. I wanted it so bad! But I've never boughten a road bike so I was struggling to find the motivation to buy it. I can still get it for that price, but I need advice..
> 
> I've ridden a couple bikes now. The lowest entry Giant bike, didn't like it very much. The Felt Z85, was awesome, comfortable, and fast! but it's too expensive and after riding a Trek 1.5 later, I found the trek 1.5 to feel better than the felt and that trek was less expensive. The trek 1.5 was $1150 at the store it was at.
> So today I check out the local Trek bike store in hopes of riding the 2013 Trek 1.1. They only had a 60cm in stock and I'm a 57-58 so it was no good to try. Instead, I tried the Trek 2.1 and then the 2.3. The 2.1 was for $1104, while the 2.3 he offered $1150! I don't know, any suggestions? I should really try and ride a 1.1. It's all more than what I wanted to pay, but maybe it's worth it?
> 
> 
> I really want to get into road biking. The bike will be used for commuting to school (I live in Boulder, CO, there are a lot of nice bikes around so this one isn't going to stand out like crazy. Nonetheless, I have the 5lb new york faghettaboutit lock.) Also, going to get groceries to fit in my backpack. Beyond that, I may try biking to Fort Collins at some point which is a 62 mile ride if not more


First and foremost, make sure whatever you decide on fits and feels good.

That said, if I'm following you correctly, the Trek 1.5 is priced the same as a 2012 Trek 2.3, and the 2.1 is within $50 of that. If that's correct, I'd say it's a no brainer going with the 2.3 - as long as it's the best fitting/ feeling bike you've ridden. 

However, I'll offer upfront that I didn't compare the specs by model year, so you might want to do some side by side comparisons before deciding.

EDIT: Another caveat would be to advise caution re: buying a new bike and using it as a commuter, leaving it unattended at school for 'a period of time'. Might want to consider buying a less expensive 'nice' bike for evening/ weekend rides and go with a beater for the commutes.


----------



## Rocky_Road

PJ352 said:


> First and foremost, make sure whatever you decide on fits and feels good.
> 
> That said, if I'm following you correctly, the Trek 1.5 is priced the same as a 2012 Trek 2.3, and the 2.1 is within $50 of that. If that's correct, I'd say it's a no brainer going with the 2.3 - as long as it's the best fitting/ feeling bike you've ridden.
> 
> However, I'll offer upfront that I didn't compare the specs by model year, so you might want to do some side by side comparisons before deciding.
> 
> EDIT: Another caveat would be to advise caution re: buying a new bike and using it as a commuter, leaving it unattended at school for 'a period of time'. Might want to consider buying a less expensive 'nice' bike for evening/ weekend rides and go with a beater for the commutes.


You got it, that's how the prices ended up working out. I did get to ride the 2.1 and the 2.3, both felt good. Although I sort of feel like the 2.3 wasn't as comfortable? Can't say for sure on the quick <5 minute rides. Also, I liked the paint job of the 2.1 more, but that shouldn't really be a factor with deciding on a bike I imagine  The 2.3 vs the 2.1 has "better" wheels, a carbon seat post, and a compact derailer on the crank. Other than that, the components are the same. It seemed like a heck of a deal to me and felt bad turning it down. 


So I suppose there really isn't much to gain from asking is there? Sounds like the best way for me to find out what bike is best is to simply ride the bike, and find what feels the best. Although, you're right about having a beater.. I see a lot of nice ones on campus but a lot more beaters. In the end, if it does get stolen I'm out the $1000+ )=

Well, I'll try and find the trek 1.1 in a 58cm and see how it feels since that isn't such an expensive bike. Otherwise, I'll look to craigslist unless that 2.3 ergs me back for another ride. Thank you for your advice!


----------



## PJ352

Rocky_Road said:


> You got it, that's how the prices ended up working out. I did get to ride the 2.1 and the 2.3, both felt good. Although I sort of feel like the 2.3 wasn't as comfortable? Can't say for sure on the quick <5 minute rides. Also, I liked the paint job of the 2.1 more, but that shouldn't really be a factor with deciding on a bike I imagine  The 2.3 vs the 2.1 has "better" wheels, a carbon seat post, and a compact derailer on the crank. Other than that, the components are the same. It seemed like a heck of a deal to me and felt bad turning it down.
> 
> 
> So I suppose there really isn't much to gain from asking is there? *Sounds like the best way for me to find out what bike is best is to simply ride the bike, and find what feels the best. * Although, you're right about having a beater.. I see a lot of nice ones on campus but a lot more beaters. In the end, if it does get stolen I'm out the $1000+ )=
> 
> Well, I'll try and find the trek 1.1 in a 58cm and see how it feels since that isn't such an expensive bike. Otherwise, I'll look to craigslist unless that 2.3 ergs me back for another ride. Thank you for your advice!


There's a lot of truth to that bold statement. IME as long as they're out on the roads for some duration, test rides are about the best way to decide on which bike fits and feels the best. 

Of course, as you pointed out, initial fit can sometimes mislead, as was the case of your offering that the 2.1 was more comfortable than the 2.3. The geo is the same on both, so I attribute that to the fitting (or lack thereof) that you got at one of the shops, pre-ride.

Now that you know the Trek's geo works for you, it might not be a bad idea to seek out a late model used bike, preferably from a LBS carrying used. But no matter the route you take, keep the hunt local so that you can check out and test ride bikes of interest.


----------



## yot

*chinese carbon frames*



QuiQuaeQuod said:


> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


Please can anyone tell me ,wich off the many carbon frames vendors in china has an exact replica off the well known comercial brands,does any of this chinese bikes looks exactly the same to pass as the real ones ,thanks a lot to the person who can help me with this , bye .


----------



## aw2pp

My update (trying to keep a long story short). the LBS that was selling Giants didn't have the bikes ready as promised the other day. So instead of trying the bikes we wanted, I rode a Defy 3, and my wife rode some sort of $2600 Carbon bike that I, she, and the LBS salesperson all knew would be too small. "Come back tomorrow, and we'll have the Defy 1 built out for you." I rode it today, and feel like I could live with it, but the shop came down a notch in the process. They won't even do a complete fitting for us... that costs extra. We really like the people we are working with, but are disappointed by the service and responsiveness.


This leaves us with one of the shops that we felt dismissed by earlier in the process. And as much as I wanted something unique as my first bike (BMC, Neuvation, Focus, Merckx) it looks like I am going to end up with a plain old Trek Madone 2.1. (Not really a Madone, but that's what they call it.) Rode it, loved it, and the LBS has delivered on every promise they've made to us so far. They are making some adjustments to a 1.5 for my wife, and if she likes it when we return Friday, we'll be new Trek owners.

Heaven help us.


----------



## cobra5514

Not really like a 2.1? Is it on a series frame that started out as a 2.1, but has a bunch of random components put on it?


----------



## PJ352

yot said:


> Please can anyone tell me ,wich off the many carbon frames vendors in china has an exact replica off the well known comercial brands,does any of this chinese bikes looks exactly the same to pass as the real ones ,thanks a lot to the person who can help me with this , bye .


I think this would be a better place to pose that question:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/bi...-thread-ebay-direct-version-6-0-a-272806.html


----------



## PJ352

aw2pp said:


> My update (trying to keep a long story short). the LBS that was selling Giants didn't have the bikes ready as promised the other day. So instead of trying the bikes we wanted, I rode a Defy 3, and my wife rode some sort of $2600 Carbon bike that I, she, and the LBS salesperson all knew would be too small. "Come back tomorrow, and we'll have the Defy 1 built out for you." I rode it today, and feel like I could live with it, but the shop came down a notch in the process. They won't even do a complete fitting for us... that costs extra. We really like the people we are working with, but are disappointed by the service and responsiveness.
> 
> 
> This leaves us with one of the shops that we felt dismissed by earlier in the process. And as much as I wanted something unique as my first bike (BMC, Neuvation, Focus, Merckx) it looks like I am going to end up with a plain old Trek Madone 2.1. (Not really a Madone, but that's what they call it.) Rode it, loved it, and the LBS has delivered on every promise they've made to us so far. They are making some adjustments to a 1.5 for my wife, and if she likes it when we return Friday, we'll be new Trek owners.
> 
> Heaven help us.


From your description/ experience, my opinion is that the first shop is primarily a pro shop catering to cyclists seeking custom. high end equipment. Nothing at all wrong with that, but (making an assumption here) they feel the need to charge for a fitting because of the lower profit margin. 

Bottom line, I'd think long and hard about buying a bike "I could live with".

Re: the second shop, oftentimes one customer experience can be less than memorable for a variety of reasons. A busy day with minimal staff, an employee that's less than thrilled with working that day 0 the list is endless. 

That said, if on the second trip you're treated cordially, asked some questions re: intended use/ goals and price range, encouraged to test ride a couple of bikes and (in general) seeing some motivation, I'd cut the LBS some slack. As you stated, they delivered on every promise thus far.

Re: the Madone not really being a Madone, I get what you're saying and tend to agree, but... it's all marketing. :wink5: FWIW, I think Treks 2 series are as good as the Giant Defy's, but first and foremost, the bike has got to fit and feel right to you, or you won't want to ride it much.

As time allows, keep us updated, and good lu8ck Friday!


----------



## Randolfo

Been reading these logs for awhile. I tend to over research things. But I have been to several LBSs. Some of them have been very good, and others irritating. I walk in looking at all the pretty new bikes lined up with care. A salesperson usually saunters over to ask if he/she could be of assistance. I say I am looking for a new bike. This prompts a smile from the salesperson. What kind of riding do you want to do? It is at this point that the relationship is either made, or broken. I am thinking I would like a touring bike. They usually eye me up and down seeing me for the fat hairy man I have become, and then they either take me to a road racing ready bike, or they take me to anything they have that can carry me and some gear. 

If they direct me to their line of racers, they have lost me. If they talk to me about buying a touring bike, I will come back and ask about price. I honestly had one salesman say, 'Why do you want a touring bike? You are working and cannot take a month off to ride across the country or anything." One fellow said, "Touring bike? Just hang your gear off a road bike. Anything will do." When I mention I might like to try randonneuring one day, some of them have replied with a "What?"

Well, I have narrowed the search down. First is the KHS TR 101. This will be sold from a local bike shop for a good price. 

The second is the Jamis Aurora. Nice bike, and the shop I would buy this one from actually did not judge me. Probably because they are nice guy hipsters and I too sport too much hair. 

The third is the Novara Randonee. This one presents a larger problem since REI has not embraced the region I live in and it is about a hour away. 

I know the LBS fans would tell me to go with either the Jamis, or KHS. They come with the feel good stuff you get when you purchase a bike from a local person. The Novara is a nice bike for the price, but not so local. 

I have considered the bikes direct/nashbar route as well. I have considered the Surly LHT as well. 

Any thoughts on the three bikes I mentioned on my short list.


----------



## PJ352

Randolfo said:


> Been reading these logs for awhile. I tend to over research things. But I have been to several LBSs. Some of them have been very good, and others irritating. I walk in looking at all the pretty new bikes lined up with care. A salesperson usually saunters over to ask if he/she could be of assistance. I say I am looking for a new bike. This prompts a smile from the salesperson. What kind of riding do you want to do? It is at this point that the relationship is either made, or broken. I am thinking I would like a touring bike. They usually eye me up and down seeing me for the fat hairy man I have become, and then they either take me to a road racing ready bike, or they take me to anything they have that can carry me and some gear.
> 
> If they direct me to their line of racers, they have lost me. If they talk to me about buying a touring bike, I will come back and ask about price. I honestly had one salesman say, 'Why do you want a touring bike? You are working and cannot take a month off to ride across the country or anything." One fellow said, "Touring bike? Just hang your gear off a road bike. Anything will do." When I mention I might like to try randonneuring one day, some of them have replied with a "What?"
> 
> Well, I have narrowed the search down. First is the KHS TR 101. This will be sold from a local bike shop for a good price.
> 
> The second is the Jamis Aurora. Nice bike, and the shop I would buy this one from actually did not judge me. Probably because they are nice guy hipsters and I too sport too much hair.
> 
> The third is the Novara Randonee. This one presents a larger problem since REI has not embraced the region I live in and it is about a hour away.
> 
> I know the LBS fans would tell me to go with either the Jamis, or KHS. They come with the feel good stuff you get when you purchase a bike from a local person. The Novara is a nice bike for the price, but not so local.
> 
> I have considered the bikes direct/nashbar route as well. I have considered the Surly LHT as well.
> 
> Any thoughts on the three bikes I mentioned on my short list.


Nothing you're offering re: the LBS's surprises me. Right or wrong, generally speaking, touring bikes don't represent their mainstream, thus the attitudes you've encountered.

I think any of the bikes you've mentioned suite a tourers needs, but you haven't offered anything in the way of your cycling background, experiences, (general) intended uses/ goals, fitness/ flexibility and any other background info you care to provide.

Going on the assumption that you're new to adult cycling, I'd recommend buying local from a LBS. This, incidentally, would include REI. The reason I say this is because getting sizing/ fit right is very important with drop bar road bikes, so keeping the search local brings the advantages of working one on one with a LBS/ fitter, getting sizing/ fit assistance and the ability to test ride some bikes.

Conversely, buying online brings with it many pitfalls. Guessing on sizing, possibly having to pay your LBS for final assembly, tuning and fit assistance (assuming you got sizing right). Either way, you'll likely be tapping your LBS as a resource for post purchase assistance for choosing accessories, many offering discounts with a bike purchase. Big picture/ long term, I doubt you'd save much going the online route.


----------



## Rocky_Road

What do you guys think if I could get a 2004 Giant TCR composite for 500 bucks? If it rides well and feels comfortable that is. I've test rode a bunch of bikes at various LBS and every bike that was 58cm they said fit. In fact none of them really seemed to do much other than use a 58cm and adjust the seat, even the certified Trek store. 

Anyway, 500 for it?

Here's the description:



> XL frame
> components:
> 
> mavic open pro wheels
> shimano ultegra crank and brakes
> rictchey pro stem
> thompson elite seat post
> shimano 105 derailleur
> shimano sora flight deck triple shifters (8 speed)
> 
> 
> I inherited this bike and, not knowing much, took it to the Giant dealer to ask about it. they said it looked built up from a frame using older (but still of good quality) parts. they suggested new tires and a tune-up


----------



## PJ352

Rocky_Road said:


> What do you guys think if I could get a 2004 Giant TCR composite for 500 bucks? If it rides well and feels comfortable that is. I've test rode a bunch of bikes at various LBS and every bike that was 58cm they said fit. In fact none of them really seemed to do much other than use a 58cm and adjust the seat, even the certified Trek store.
> 
> Anyway, 500 for it?
> 
> Here's the description:


Since CF frames can fail differently than alu or steel, I advise caution on buying used with no warranty. It takes special equipment to 'see' internal damage/ defects sustained and if repairs are needed, they can be costly. All things considered, I think it's far safer to stay with straight alu or steel frames when buying used.

On the LBS 'fittings', it's possible that the brands/ models you're checking out match your your body type well, so only require tweaks to fit. That's not a bad thing, and in an earlier post you mentioned the Treks 'feeling good'. Really, that's what a fitting is all about - feeling comfortable and efficient on the bike.


----------



## rlee96

This isn't much of advice, more of an experience i have had with buying my first road bike. 
i went to my local bike shop and asked for an entry level bike and gave them my price range, they told me they would have a sale soon and that the bike i wanted would be $500 off!! so i waited and got my bike down from $1000 at $500! 
so maybe just just ask your bike shops if they're planning to have a sale soon or anything ?

hope i helped!


----------



## PJ352

rlee96 said:


> *This isn't much of advice*, more of an experience i have had with buying my first road bike.
> i went to my local bike shop and asked for an entry level bike and gave them my price range, they told me they would have a sale soon and that the bike i wanted would be $500 off!! so i waited and got my bike down from $1000 at $500!
> so maybe just just ask your bike shops if they're planning to have a sale soon or anything ?
> 
> hope i helped!


Actually, it's very good advice! Buying used from a LBS has the advantage of getting a level of sizing/ fitting assistance and the ability to test ride the bike(s) of interest. The bikes are generally checked over/ adjusted tuned prior to sale and some shops will include 30 day warranties. All in all, a safer bet than going with a private seller.


----------



## aw2pp

*The deed is done*

Here are our new bikes. 

Mine is the red 2.1 on the left.

Hers is the 1.5 on the right.


----------



## PJ352

Nice! Ride often and ride safe! :thumbsup:


----------



## Rocky_Road

Very cool! I like the paint job on that red one.

I'm pulling my hair out trying to figure out what to get.. There's so many darn options, and so many ways to upgrade with just another $100, or then another 100, and so on. I dropped the craigslist pursuit. Just too sketchy and weird making private deal with so much cash. How do you guys do it? I admire your decision making skills


----------



## PJ352

Rocky_Road said:


> Very cool! I like the paint job on that red one.
> 
> I'm pulling my hair out trying to figure out what to get.. There's so many darn options, and so many ways to upgrade with just another $100, or then another 100, and so on. I dropped the craigslist pursuit. Just too sketchy and weird making private deal with so much cash. How do you guys do it? I admire your decision making skills


Not everyone's a fan of CL. I'm not, but because it's local and the buyer can see/ test ride the bikes, I'd go that route before going with e-bay (or similar).

Ideally, go with a LBS, getting the value added services and a warranty. You pay more, but you get more and the risks are minimized. 

As far as raising the ante $100 and another $100, I advise against it for a first bike. Stay as low as you can while still getting the features you value most, and will help you better enjoy your time on the bike. IME that generally comes down to a bike that suites your intended uses/ goals, fits well and rides/ handles the way you like.


----------



## TXRR

Thanks for the information......looking forward to learning a lot more from this forum.


----------



## aw2pp

Rocky_Road said:


> How do you guys do it? I admire your decision making skills


20% of it was what I read here and elsewhere on the Internet. And about 99% of that was "go to the shops, talk to the people, then ride".

At that point, a very complicated decision slowly became surprisingly clear. YMMV, but probably not by much.


----------



## Rocky_Road

aw2pp said:


> 20% of it was what I read here and elsewhere on the Internet. And about 99% of that was "go to the shops, talk to the people, then ride".
> 
> At that point, a very complicated decision slowly became surprisingly clear. YMMV, but probably not by much.


I've been doin that mostly. Got a few bikes I really like. Need to try the trek 1.1 still, I think I am going to do that tomorrow.

I think my biggest dilemma is, what do I want the bike for? I have a 1.5 mile rather steep up-hill commute to campus. Then around town for various things but even those are pretty close. Possibly some recreation rides too. With that in mind, a bike beyond the 1.1 level isn't going to make a difference. However I have always had it in my mind that I want to try bikeing from Boulder to Fort Collins (62 miles approximately) One way trip, then back a few days later. In that case, I would greatly benefit from a more expensive bike like the trek 2.3 or felt z85. (Fit takes priority) Another factor too, thiefs. It's not a huge worry here. I've seen numerous carbon fiber framed bikes but nonetheless it's still probably not the greatest idea parking a new nice bike even with a 5lb lock. 

I'm going to consider these idea's for a few days more. Finally sold my old motor bike so I have the funds to come to a decision. Thanks for your guy's help so far, I'm sure it can be exhausting giving advice to new folks all the time 


edit: Even typing this out helps a lot, gets my thoughts more in order.


----------



## Flanders20

Those are my preliminary thoughts for now!


----------



## .je

I have a 1.1 and it's pretty OK good for just about everything, If your 62 mile trip is only once, maybe twice a year, there isn't any point in a more expensive bike unless you have extra money lying around that you dont want to see again. 
If your 1.5 mile commute is very steep and you're not in good bike shape, the 25 tooth cog might be hard for you to ride, even if you are young like that. 
IME guys in college/university who don't have much free money will spend it to impress people, don't worry what you see around campus.


----------



## Randolfo

*Reply to PJ352*

PJ352, 

I do appreciate the reply. I recognize that touring bikes are not the mainstream, which is obivous to me by looking at many websites, web posts, and going to LBS. I know sales people have a job to do, and they have to sell stock. I do not take it personal. But if I tell you, I am interested in buying a touring bike, and tell you its intended purpose and you are a Giant as well as a Surly dealer, why would you try to get me on a race bike? It seems to me, the Surly is money in your pocket too. That is the problem with talking to enthusiasts. They often cannot imagine someone not wanting to do what they do. After all, they love it. I guess this is why I was shown multiple race bikes, a mountain bike, and a cyclo-cross bike in several different locations. 

My intended use, would be for some light touring. I cannot venture too far from home. I would like to try some randonneuring, and it is possible that I might get to commute by bike in the future. Final use, to shed some poundage, which any bike can help with that. It seems to me that all bikes are "fitness bikes". 

I probably will not purchase the bike online, although I am not against Bikes Direct. A friend of mine used them and was quite please, but then again, he is experienced, while I have not seriously rode since high school. I am 46.


----------



## PJ352

Randolfo said:


> PJ352,
> 
> I do appreciate the reply. I recognize that touring bikes are not the mainstream, which is obivous to me by looking at many websites, web posts, and going to LBS. I know sales people have a job to do, and they have to sell stock. I do not take it personal. But if I tell you, I am interested in buying a touring bike, and tell you its intended purpose and you are a Giant as well as a Surly dealer, why would you try to get me on a race bike? It seems to me, the Surly is money in your pocket too. That is the problem with talking to enthusiasts. They often cannot imagine someone not wanting to do what they do. After all, they love it. I guess this is why I was shown multiple race bikes, a mountain bike, and a cyclo-cross bike in several different locations.
> 
> My intended use, would be for some light touring. I cannot venture too far from home. I would like to try some randonneuring, and it is possible that I might get to commute by bike in the future. Final use, to shed some poundage, which any bike can help with that. It seems to me that all bikes are "fitness bikes".
> 
> I probably will not purchase the bike online, although I am not against Bikes Direct. A friend of mine used them and was quite please, but then again, he is experienced, while I have not seriously rode since high school. I am 46.


As I mentioned previously, nothing you're offering in the way of LBS employee attitudes surprises me, but 1) they aren't the better shops (or more accurately, not the best representatives of them) and 2) that's not a reason to go the online route and support those who'll do_ less_ for you. I'm not suggesting this applies to you, but rather, illustrating a point. 

FWIW I agree with your logic. A Surly dealer makes money on that sale just as they would a Giant, although the profit margin on the Giant may be higher and/ or they need to meet a sales quota. Not a rationalization for them to push a race bike, but a possible reason for doing so. 

Because you're inexperienced and this is your first road bike, my advice is for you to seek out a shop that will listen to you and show some motivation to accommodate your needs. Sometimes, this will mean traveling some, or that an experienced employee will offer an alternate viewpoint, but I agree that it shouldn't mean you mention touring and are shown race bikes.

And just as a FYI, most any LBS can order a Surly, so if you think that's the bike for you, consider that. The shop can size you and once the bike arrives, perform the final assembly and fit you. 

Re: buying online, I see it as a viable option for cyclists who know and understand bike geo, what the numbers mean and what their fit requirements are. I'm not talking about someone saying "I ride a 54", because that simply shows they_ don't_ understand sizing. I'm talking about the rider that says I'm comfortable with a effective top tube of ~530mm's, head tube of ~130mm's and a 100 mm/ 6 degree stem with 25mm of spacers. This is just an example, not to be taken literally.


----------



## Randolfo

*Reply to PJ352*



PJ352 said:


> As I mentioned previously, nothing you're offering in the way of LBS employee attitudes surprises me, but 1) they aren't the better shops (or more accurately, not the best representatives of them) and 2) that's not a reason to go the online route and support those who'll do_ less_ for you. I'm not suggesting this applies to you, but rather, illustrating a point.
> 
> FWIW I agree with your logic. A Surly dealer makes money on that sale just as they would a Giant, although the profit margin on the Giant may be higher and/ or they need to meet a sales quota. Not a rationalization for them to push a race bike, but a possible reason for doing so.
> 
> Because you're inexperienced and this is your first road bike, my advice is for you to seek out a shop that will listen to you and show some motivation to accommodate your needs. Sometimes, this will mean traveling some, or that an experienced employee will offer an alternate viewpoint, but I agree that it shouldn't mean you mention touring and are shown race bikes.
> 
> And just as a FYI, most any LBS can order a Surly, so if you think that's the bike for you, consider that. The shop can size you and once the bike arrives, perform the final assembly and fit you.
> 
> Re: buying online, I see it as a viable option for cyclists who know and understand bike geo, what the numbers mean and what their fit requirements are. I'm not talking about someone saying "I ride a 54", because that simply shows they_ don't_ understand sizing. I'm talking about the rider that says I'm comfortable with a effective top tube of ~530mm's, head tube of ~130mm's and a 100 mm/ 6 degree stem with 25mm of spacers. This is just an example, not to be taken literally.


I appreciate your reply. So, I can add Surly to the list, which I have. What I like about the others is they come a little more complete and ready to go. I know Surly makes a get product, but I think all the bikes above are decent bikes. I need to get to a REI and see that Novara.


----------



## PJ352

Randolfo said:


> I appreciate your reply. So, I can add Surly to the list, which I have. What I like about the others is they come a little more complete and ready to go. I know Surly makes a get product, but I think all the bikes above are decent bikes. I need to get to a REI and see that Novara.


Just to clarify, I'm not discounting any of the bikes you've mentioned. Just offering a scenario that includes the Surly.

You might want to look at Kona and Jamis as well. I think you'll find some decent offerings from both.


----------



## JoePAz

Rocky_Road said:


> Very cool! I like the paint job on that red one.
> 
> I'm pulling my hair out trying to figure out what to get.. There's so many darn options, and so many ways to upgrade with just another $100, or then another 100, and so on. I dropped the craigslist pursuit. Just too sketchy and weird making private deal with so much cash. How do you guys do it? I admire your decision making skills


In my case I was looking for bike on a very tight budget. New bikes were over my price range for the solid ones leaving on the very cheapest bikes. Since I have been mtn biking for years I felt like I would not be happy with super cheap bike. So that pretty much left used as the only way to go. 

I started on craigslist and had a couple bikes lined up, but deals fell through due flaky sellers. I contact my fellow local MTBers on mtbr.com and asked about used bike shops. I got some leads to shops, but did not find any good bikes. Then I got lucky. I had a guy in mtbr.com PM me about selling his road bike. What I wanted a was semi modern bike with 105 or better parts. Semi modern in that it was less than 10 years old and had shifters on the bars and 1 1/8 threadless headset. I did not want to deal with old quill stems and downtube shifters. Tough when you have only $400 to spend. So the guy offered up a 2001 trek 5200. He boughr this from his brother in law who I assume bought it new. Asking price $500. A little more than I wanted to spend, but entirely acceptable. The bike is full carbon frame/fork/seatsays and had Ultegra group on it. Really it was alot of bike for the money with the downside being that it was old. Now I do my own work on my mtb bike so age by itself did not scare me. Also since it was being sold by another bike enthusaist I figured it would be in reasonably good shape. So later that day I we found a place to meet up. He did not give me frame size, but he said he was 5'8" and I am 5'7". So close enough to give it a look. I looked and liked. The frame size was pretty good. So for better or worse I gave him the cash and was on my way. 

I got the bike home and since then have been doing minor tweaks on fit. Adjusting the bar angle, seat position and my last change was a longer stem. I figured that the frame was a 52 and a little on the small side. I might have been better on a 54, but when you buy used there are limitations. So moving fom the 90 mm stem to the 110 seems have make it all come together. Now you could say that because I need to change the stem the ETT was too short on the 52. Maybe so, but my reasearch shows that the 54 had a longer ETT and a longer stem (110). So that infact may have been too long and required me to get a 100 stem. Classic half a dozen of one and 6 of another. 

Now the really bottomline is that this my first road bike. I came in with limited budget because I did not want to spend alot of money on bike that I might only ride a few times. For me road biking is an experiment. I don't know how I will use it. Thoughts are to use it for exercise and base mile training for mtn biking. Just yesterday I got home changed and jumped on the bike and rode for 55 minutes. Wife and daughter were still not home I went back out and did another 6 miles or so. So prefect for creating a easy way to get miles in during the middle of the week. Most of my mtn rides are 2-3 hrs and 15 min drive to the trail head. If I like road biking I may look into longer rides or may just keep it for quick local rides. I may do a triathalon and this bike will let me do that. If I really get into this I will then consider a newer bike with a perfect fit that match to how I intend to ride. 

For now I am happy doing in on the cheap and not expecting perfection.


----------



## Randolfo

*Reply to PJ352*



PJ352 said:


> Just to clarify, I'm not discounting any of the bikes you've mentioned. Just offering a scenario that includes the Surly.
> 
> You might want to look at Kona and Jamis as well. I think you'll find some decent offerings from both.



The Jamis Aurora is on my short list as well. The three bikes I am considering are the KHS TR101, the Jamis Aurora, and the Novara Randonee. Maybe the Surly too.


----------



## Rocky_Road

Great news! I finally bought a road bike! It's a specialzied S-works M4. It's a super cool bike, comfortable, and very fast. I can't wait to ride it next! I'm gonna post more details with pictures in a thread, I would love some tips. Especially on how to tune the front ultegra derailer.


----------



## Josie

*A Beginners Tale*

I am a beginner road biker who would like to share with any beginner road biker my trials of finding a new bike that fits in hopes that you will avoid some of the mistakes I recently made.

The short answer: If you have never been fit correctly on a road bike before and want to ride long distances it is totally worth it to buy a new bike and get a professional fit at the shop. You will save lots of time and hassle and spend more time riding and being happy. 

You can get good deal later on a used bike later when you know what you need and are looking for. You can't know until you ride for some time and know what a good fit feels like. A low end bike that fits well is way better than a high end bike that does not.

As a disclaimer I am an athlete and while a beginner in road biking I have taken to it quickly and was looking for a bike that would be comfortable and hold up for riding 50- 100 miles a week in a mountainous region. I have a weakness for paying attention to gear quality details. My other weakness is thinking that I could figure out what I needed on my own and beat the new sales system.

I got into biking when I started on a used bike frame that was given to me at a generous price by a friend but ultimately was to small and became uncomfortable. So I began looking for another used bike.

I had major sticker shock when I looked at new bikes so I tried to go the used bike route. I spent weeks talking to guys at bike shops and reading online about gear and fit.

When I was ready I went to a local used bike dealer. I was really clear that I did not know what good fit really felt like so I needed help with that. They gave me a casaul "eye ball fit" I got a great deal on a great bike. Then I road it and it was clear it did not fit. I got pain in my neck and upper back after 30 miles. Bummer!

I ended up at a new bike shop that fit me professionally to a new bike. I am happy and can now just spend time riding rather than trying to jockey for a higher end bike at a low price that does not really fit.

The second post on this forum posted in '06 has the best advice. I wish I had read it earlier!


----------



## ijuf

QuiQuaeQuod said:


> This is a thread to advise people on buying their first road bike on a budget... no matter what that budget is. Post some advice that would be useful for people when they are starting the process. Post criteria for deciding between two bikes. Post anything you think EVERY first time road bike buyer should know before plunking down her or his cash and taking the leap.


My first road bike on a budget was a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 at Performance Bikes. I think Fuji consistently marks down prices, so you are sure to always find a bike between $500-$700 in the Fuji line but at the same time get a fairly decent component group like Shimano 105. During special sale, these can be even further marked down to as low as $350.

When I first bought the Fuji, I knew nothing about the technicalities of road bikes, except probably the most visible ones - thin tires (usually 23-25mm wide), slick tread, drop bars, and a clearly distinct geometry with an almost level top tube (which is the classic design, something that is sadly being violated these days with the fad of "compact" frames). The bike salesman pointed out the difference between aluminum and carbon, but of course, my budget only allowed me aluminum. And then there is also the question of pedals. I had platform pedals for several months until I decided to try clip-in pedals. Learning to use the clip-in pedals also indicates how serious you want to get about cycling.

I think Aluminum or steel is a good start for a beginner. You should observe your riding habits and preferences. Do you only use it for commuting? Would you like to do riding for fitness and exercise? How serious are you about a cycling lifestyle? Do you have a desire to go on long rides and train systematically for the long haul? Do you want to participate in charity rides or "tours" and maybe even professional races?

If you're only mostly biking for commute, your basic aluminum or steel road bike will go a long way to satisfy your needs. Get a bike fitting done, and just be regularly cleaning and maintaining the bike, and you will be a happy bike commuter for years. There are also some touring bikes that can be used as commuter bikes because they have rack mounts that can be useful in grocery shopping, if you are so inclined. 

If you get more serious, then you should start reading a lot. Gathering information from articles and people on forums is how I went about it. You should be paying close attention to the different bike makers out there, and spend time getting to know the differences between their bike categories. One common distinction bike companies make is between a pro race bike and an endurance bike. You should learn about the different terms used to describe a road bike geometry. You should read about frame materials, and components of the drive train system like front and rear derailleurs, cassette, chain rings, etc. 

It's only after you have ridden in at least a charity ride where people tend to be amateur racers, that you can gauge your abilities, your bike's abilities and where you see yourself in regards to bikes and biking. But I would recommend riding at least a year before jumping on the bandwagon to get a new bike that you think would match your new-found enthusiasm. 

Custom bikes are becoming more popular now that there are more frame builders offering custom geometries, and also that people are recognizing the value in a custom fit. However, this comes at an extra cost. 

At this point, it's a trade-off between your real need, how much you can spend, and how much you are getting into the cycling lifestyle.


----------



## PJ352

ijuf said:


> ... a clearly distinct geometry with an almost level top tube (which is the classic design, something that is sadly being violated these days with the fad of "compact" frames).


Might be your opinion, but as written, the statement is arguable. 

Aesthetics aside, compact geo offers riders proportioned shorter legs/ longer torso the ability to size up, increasing reach via a longer effective top tube and minimizing drop via a proportionally taller head tube while still maintaining adequate stand over clearance. Something that's possible with traditional geo (horizontal top tubes), but with the requisite loss of stand over clearance - an unnecessary compromise. 

I don't see compact geo as a fad. I see it as an enhancement that allows a better fit for a broader segment of the cycling population.


----------



## blacksox

*Please Help- Newbie*

Im between two Bikes: Jamis Xenith Comp and Scott CR1 Comp. I can get both for the same price.

Both have a Carbon Frame

The jamis Carbon frame is a little heavier than the scott (2lbs) But the jamis has 105 components whereas the scott has Tiagra. 

My question is this: Which is more important Lighter Frame or Better components?


----------



## NJBiker72

blacksox said:


> Im between two Bikes: Jamis Xenith Comp and Scott CR1 Comp. I can get both for the same price.
> 
> Both have a Carbon Frame
> 
> The jamis Carbon frame is a little heavier than the scott (2lbs) But the jamis has 105 components whereas the scott has Tiagra.
> 
> My question is this: Which is more important Lighter Frame or Better components?


If they felt the same when riding, I would go with the better components all else being equal. But that is just my opinion. 2 lbs is surprisingly much especially when the heavier bike has lighter components. Are you sure the comparison is apples to apples?


----------



## Idsticky

I am a newbie road biker, 1st post. Buying my first carbon road bike coming from a steel Motobecane Mirage form the 70's, time for a new bike want it to be under 2k, buying new. In any case, test rode the Robaix sport compact with 105/Tiagra components cost $1,900 and Trek Domane 4.5 with 105/Ultegra components cost $2,700, Trek Domane 4.0 is $2,200 (version I can afford). Only difference I could really tell was the shifting with Ultegra was superior and the cost difference. But the grey/black Specialized vs, white/black Trek to me was all Specialized, love that look. I am not a racer but 30-50 miler weight loss stay fit rider, who may get up to doing a century 1-2 times a year. What are your thoughts? I found the difference between the two for entry bikes was very similar and cost difference for Ultegra too expensive. I would probably go for the 4.0 if I went Trek, my LBS just didn't have one for me to test ride yet.


----------



## PJ352

blacksox said:


> Im between two Bikes: Jamis Xenith Comp and Scott CR1 Comp. I can get both for the same price.
> 
> Both have a Carbon Frame
> 
> The jamis Carbon frame is a little heavier than the scott (2lbs) But the jamis has 105 components whereas the scott has Tiagra.
> 
> My question is this: Which is more important Lighter Frame or Better components?


Unless both of these bikes have been weighed on a calibrated digital bike scale (as opposed to a bath scale) I'd take that claimed weight difference with a grain of salt.

Beyond that, if there really is a 2 lb. weight difference between the two, all else being equal (mainly, gearing and fit) you won't see any performance difference between them.

Re: components, I think pre 2012 Tiagra (9 speed) will suite most recreational riders (some race it), but the new Tiagra 4600 (10 speed) is (IMO/E) on a par with Shimano's previous generation 105, so I see no tangible reason to go with the Jamis based on component group alone.


----------



## PJ352

Idsticky said:


> I am a newbie road biker, 1st post. Buying my first carbon road bike coming from a steel Motobecane Mirage form the 70's, time for a new bike want it to be under 2k, buying new. In any case, test rode the Robaix sport compact with 105/Tiagra components cost $1,900 and Trek Domane 4.5 with 105/Ultegra components cost $2,700, Trek Domane 4.0 is $2,200 (version I can afford). Only difference I could really tell was the shifting with Ultegra was superior and the cost difference. But the grey/black Specialized vs, white/black Trek to me was all Specialized, love that look. I am not a racer but 30-50 miler weight loss stay fit rider, who may get up to doing a century 1-2 times a year. What are your thoughts? I found the difference between the two for entry bikes was very similar and cost difference for Ultegra too expensive. I would probably go for the 4.0 if I went Trek, my LBS just didn't have one for me to test ride yet.


I don't think you should put too much stock in one bike shifting better than another during a test ride. Reason being, it's near impossible for LBS's to keep all the bikes in their inventory optimally tuned. 

It's likely what you experienced was a less than ideally set up/ tuned Roubaix, so if you're interested in that bike I suggest going back to the LBS, voicing your concerns and asking that, prior to a second test ride, their wrench take some time to tune the drivetrain. 

BTW, truth be told, as you go up the groupset model lines, the main differences are a level of refinement, slightly better finishes and slightly lower weight. When set up/ tuned correctly, most any groupset performs well and proves durable.


----------



## Idsticky

Thanks for that insight, must have been the case, the differnce was very noticeable between bikes shifting smoothness. I will definitely get the LBS to sharpen the knife with the shifting for my next test ride. Funny, I don't want a white bike, never thought that would matter. I have not seen much comparison between the entry model Specialized Roubaix Compact and new Trek Domane 4.0 bikes. I know Trek is going after that market. The 5.0 & 6.0 bikes are just out my price range and I would think out of many beginner riders. I do want a new carbon bike and the Roubaix Sport Compact looks like the deal.


----------



## PJ352

Idsticky said:


> Thanks for that insight, must have been the case, the differnce was very noticeable between bikes shifting smoothness. I will definitely get the LBS to sharpen the knife with the shifting for my next test ride. Funny, I don't want a white bike, never thought that would matter. I have not seen much comparison between the entry model Specialized Roubaix Compact and new Trek Domane 4.0 bikes. I know Trek is going after that market. The 5.0 & 6.0 bikes are just out my price range and I would think out of many beginner riders. I do want a new carbon bike and the Roubaix Sport Compact looks like the deal.


If I told you how my current 'go to' bike shifted during my test ride, you'd ask me why I bought it. It's now my best shifting bike.

Domane being new, there won't be much in the way of user reviews for awhile. But you're right, Trek is going after the endurance market segment. Not just Roubaix (which, IMO is the standard bearer), but others as well, like the C'dale Synapse.

Your being new to this, my advice is to stay at the lower end of your price range. It actually gets you a lot of bike for the money and (as with most any product line) as you go up, diminishing returns sets in.

Also, this bike will give you some idea of what you'd want in that 'next' bike.


----------



## vickan240sx

Thanks for all the info. Really looking forward to buying my first bike.


----------



## blakslee720

*Craigslist*

I bought my first and second bikes used on craigslist for pretty good prices. My first was an 87 Peugeot Motobecane for $80 and I loved it right up until I crashed it and bent the frame to hell. I'm fine now but it took a while to get back on the horse. My second bike (which I still have) is a 2000 Trek 1000 and it came with aero bars, seat post bag and hand pump. I actually traded the guy an Ipad for it. It is a huge improvement over my Peugeot, much lighter and faster. The wheels that it came with (vuelta airline 2) aren't that great. They come out of true very easily it seems and I'm currently looking for new ones. The moral of the story I guess is, I don't think I'll ever buy a new bike because the used prices seem to be so good, even on carbon bikes.


----------



## Budajez19

*Mom and Pop vs. Chain*

I am new to the sport and I have spent the last week and a half or so researching bikes and components. I have basically realized that for the most part the only difference between makes are the frames and that every company basically has all the same components so it is really just a matter of preference. I have visited all of the LBS's in my area and have noticed there are some to stay away from and others that gave me great advice. There is a LBS about 1 mile from my house that really only sells Trek, seem to be really nice bikes and the sales man has offered me what seems like a pretty good deal (other shops sell the same bike for about $200 more) on a 2012 Trek 2.1 Apex (SRAM Components) model. Today I visited Performance Bike shop and well the customer service could have been better but I did find a bike (Fuji Roubaix 1.0 w/ Ultegra components) that was really nice granted it was about $200 more than I want to put out right now but the components were an upgrade from the trek. Basically what I am asking is, is it more beneficial to establish the relationship with the local business or is it better to go to the chain that would probably be easier to get parts and possibly cheaper because they buy in bulk? If anyone has any experiences with Performance Bicycle (good or bad) please share them with me. Thanks and sorry for the long post.


----------



## Josie

Hi Budajez,

Is it true that Performance sells bike parts cheaper than an LBS?

If you plan on doing regular rides 30miles or over, I think its really important to get a good fit on the bike so I would go with the shop that has someone who knows how to fit you to the right size bike, seat height and handle bar length. Remember you don't need the "top shelf" for you first bike just a good fit.

LBS usually have people who have experience riding and are trained to fit you properly. Since my 18 year old cousin who has never ridden a road bike in his life got a job at Performance my understanding is that not everyone at their shops will really know about riding, but they get trained to talk like they know about riding and bikes.

Good Luck!


----------



## PJ352

Budajez19 said:


> Basically what I am asking is, is it more beneficial to establish the relationship with the local business or is it better to go to the chain that would probably be easier to get parts and possibly cheaper because they buy in bulk? If anyone has any experiences with Performance Bicycle (good or bad) please share them with me. Thanks and sorry for the long post.


We have no Performance shops in my area, so I have no firsthand experiences with them, but judging from a number of posts on this board, I'd assess their rep as 'spotty', where customer service/ knowledge vary by store. Hopefully a member with more experience will post theirs. 

You don't say what the price difference is between the two bikes, but the geo is very similar, so fit and handling should be as well. 

To answer your question re: chains versus LBS, as with most anything, there are compromises. So while it's true that you may spend a little more at a LBS, the level of fit assistance, knowledge and overall customer service is apt to be higher, and that (to some) justifies the price difference. 

Being new to cycling, my opinion is that you'll benefit from that higher level of service - particularly in the areas of bike fit. This, of course, assumes you'll choose a reputable LBS.


----------



## Budajez19

Thanks for the reply. The 2.1 is $1032 before tax and the Fuji is $1299 before tax, so a little more than $200 separate the two. I have received a little feed back about Performance Bicycle and it isn't too positive so I think I will go with the small business. I have since second guessed myself on spending the $1032 and rather going with the 2013 1.2 for $800 after a 10% discount. The smaller LBS offers a buy back program that if I return the bike within 1 year then they will give me 75% of the purchase price back towards an upgrade (has to be twice as much). So I think I will do that and get the lesser bike at the start, get used to riding and then next year splurge on an upgrade. What do you think?


----------



## PJ352

Budajez19 said:


> Thanks for the reply. The 2.1 is $1032 before tax and the Fuji is $1299 before tax, so a little more than $200 separate the two. I have received a little feed back about Performance Bicycle and it isn't too positive so I think I will go with the small business. I have since second guessed myself on spending the $1032 and rather going with the 2013 1.2 for $800 after a 10% discount. The smaller LBS offers a buy back program that if I return the bike within 1 year then they will give me 75% of the purchase price back towards an upgrade (has to be twice as much). So I think I will do that and get the lesser bike at the start, get used to riding and then next year splurge on an upgrade. * What do you think?*


I think that's a fine plan. This being your first bike, staying at the lower end of your budget, patronizing your LBS and saving some money is an all 'round win for you.

Assuming it meets your intended uses (mainly, recreational/ fitness rides), the 2013 Trek 1.5 is a very nice first bike. I've test ridden a Sora equipped bike and IMO the new version is a noticeable improvement over the old, so I think it'll more than suite your needs. 

Overall, I think the 1.5 is capable of growing with your abilities, so while that buy back program is a nice perk, I'd take some time to enjoy this bike and log some miles. As you do, you'll decide what you want in that 'next' bike (there's almost always a 'next' bike).

Good luck, and update with any questions/ comments you may have.


----------



## NJBiker72

Budajez19 said:


> Thanks for the reply. The 2.1 is $1032 before tax and the Fuji is $1299 before tax, so a little more than $200 separate the two. I have received a little feed back about Performance Bicycle and it isn't too positive so I think I will go with the small business. I have since second guessed myself on spending the $1032 and rather going with the 2013 1.2 for $800 after a 10% discount. The smaller LBS offers a buy back program that if I return the bike within 1 year then they will give me 75% of the purchase price back towards an upgrade (has to be twice as much). So I think I will do that and get the lesser bike at the start, get used to riding and then next year splurge on an upgrade. What do you think?


I think that is a fantastic plan. I went from a cheap box store bike to an entry level bike to a high quality bike in 3 years after I took up this sport. And I learned what I wanted with the early bikes but still.


----------



## PJ352

Bu1ko2ws5ki said:


> Hello, I'm looking at purchasing a used Specialized Allez.


Your images didn't load - probably because you don't yet have enough posts to link.

I tried to cut/ paste the URL's but wasn't successful.

Tell us about the bike.. where you saw it (private seller/ LBS), the year/ specific model, general condition, did you test ride it? If so, did it fit and ride well? Asking price?


----------



## pavena

Cool thread.


----------



## jumbolaw

What are thoughts on upgrading a crappy used bike? I know most will say to save money and just buy something new, but that's not an option. I'd be thinking about upgrading the Fuji Arcadia (equusbicycle.com/bike/fuji/images/components3.jpg)


----------



## MissNewbie

Anyone know how to find the year a bike was made?


----------



## PJ352

jumbolaw said:


> What are thoughts on upgrading a crappy used bike? I know most will say to save money and just buy something new, but that's not an option. I'd be thinking about upgrading the Fuji Arcadia (equusbicycle.com/bike/fuji/images/components3.jpg)


If it were my bike and buying another wasn't an option, I'd replace/ repair components with like parts to keep it on the road and relatively reliable. 

The words 'upgrade' and 'crappy' in the same sentence IMO indicate that you might be wasting your money - and that says nothing of potential compatibility issues, which could raise the cost of upgrading.


----------



## PJ352

MissNewbie said:


> Anyone know how to find the year a bike was made?


If the manufacturer is still in business, you could contact them with the serial number. That generally contains model year info and more.

Or, if possible, post pics and as much info as you know and a member here may be able to help.


----------



## MissNewbie

PJ352 said:


> If the manufacturer is still in business, you could contact them with the serial number. That generally contains model year info and more.
> 
> Or, if possible, post pics and as much info as you know and a member here may be able to help.


Thanks. It is one that I am looking at buying as a starter bike to see if biking is something I would enjoy. Is there a particular thread that you would suggest? 

Estimated to be between 2006-2009
54 cm Specialized Allez
Shimano components and petals
Claims to have carbon fiber fork
Claims to have aprox 150 miles total
Claims to have no wrecks, cracks, dents or scratches, and all parts in good condition

About what would you say this bike is worth? 

I was interested in the year out of curiosity but basically I was wondering if it was a good buy? Our closest LBS to where I live is about 80 miles away. (With the exception to one running shop that happens to sell bikes....it's very rural out here and few riders). 

View attachment 268833
View attachment 268834
View attachment 268835


Any help would be great. Thanks.


----------



## NJBiker72

MissNewbie said:


> Thanks. It is one that I am looking at buying as a starter bike to see if biking is something I would enjoy. Is there a particular thread that you would suggest?
> 
> Estimated to be between 2006-2009
> 54 cm Specialized Allez
> Shimano components and petals
> Claims to have carbon fiber fork
> Claims to have aprox 150 miles total
> Claims to have no wrecks, cracks, dents or scratches, and all parts in good condition
> 
> About what would you say this bike is worth?
> 
> I was interested in the year out of curiosity but basically I was wondering if it was a good buy? Our closest LBS to where I live is about 80 miles away. (With the exception to one running shop that happens to sell bikes....it's very rural out here and few riders).
> 
> View attachment 268833
> View attachment 268834
> View attachment 268835
> 
> 
> Any help would be great. Thanks.


I can't tell you the year (I bet someone here can). One factor in determining the price would be what level of Shimano components and pedals. They do not look like Sora, so that is a plus. You should probably ask that question though.


----------



## MissNewbie

NJBiker72 said:


> I can't tell you the year (I bet someone here can). One factor in determining the price would be what level of Shimano components and pedals. They do not look like Sora, so that is a plus. You should probably ask that question though.


Thanks. In another pic I have I see they are tigra.


----------



## speedcat

Great thread! I say buy a bike you like with components that are reliable is all you need. I started out with a crappy bike nothing fancy an old Raleigh, but I put shimano 105 components onto it, which isn't fancy, but basic and reliable. Made a whole lot of difference, and had that for 10 years, and opened me up to a world I would have never exposed myself to otherwise.

Good luck!


----------



## Donn2ie

I would have been very happy with my Trek 1000c for a long long time.


----------



## Ed38

*Looking to get a good beginner road*

So my question is what would be a good beginners bike for Colorado Springs, CO. I am interested in cyclocross because of the terrain here but I don't mind straight road bike. My funds are limited any suggestions on what would work. I'm about 67.5" tall with a 30" inseam. I am also looking for group or someone to ride and get into the sport actively.


----------



## Ed38

*Colorado Springs, CO*

So my question is what would be a good beginners bike for Colorado Springs, CO. I am interested in cyclocross because of the terrain here but I don't mind straight road bike. My funds are limited any suggestions on what would work. I'm about 67.5" tall with a 30" inseam. I am also looking for group or someone to ride and get into the sport actively.


----------



## PJ352

Ed38 said:


> So my question is what would be a good beginners bike for Colorado Springs, CO. I am interested in cyclocross because of the terrain here but I don't mind straight road bike. My funds are limited any suggestions on what would work. I'm about 67.5" tall with a 30" inseam. I am also looking for group or someone to ride and get into the sport actively.


Depends on your price range, but if possible, I suggest visiting some LBS's, discussing your intended uses/ goals, cycling experiences (if any), current fitness level and test riding both cyclocross and relaxed/ race geo bikes. 

I'm not intimately familiar with Colorado Springs, but have visited. Considering the pro's train there, unless you're in above average physical condition and have some cycling experience, I suggest considering a bike with either a triple crankset or (at minimum) compact with low gearing at the rear 11-32 (or similar).


----------



## Ed38

Thanks


----------



## __Wanderer__

Hi Everyone,

I am looking to purchase my first road bike that I can take offroad as well. So I was looking at cyclocross bikes and have narrowed down my options to the:
1. Fuji Cross 2.1
2. Kona Jake the Snake

Unfortunately, where I stay the LBSs don't normally allow test rides. Also, most LBSs here stock MTBs primarily and road bikes are rare but they can procure a road bike if I am going to buy it. While their willingness to procure it for me is very heartening, what really worries me is the problem of bike fit, given that I am in a situation where I am committing to a bike that I haven't ridden on or performed a fit on. Any idea how I can circumvent this problem? 

Thanks for reading.


----------



## PJ352

__Wanderer__ said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I am looking to purchase my first road bike that I can take offroad as well. So I was looking at cyclocross bikes and have narrowed down my options to the:
> 1. Fuji Cross 2.1
> 2. Kona Jake the Snake
> 
> Unfortunately, where I stay the LBSs don't normally allow test rides. Also, most LBSs here stock MTBs primarily and road bikes are rare but they can procure a road bike if I am going to buy it. While their willingness to procure it for me is very heartening, what really worries me is the problem of bike fit, given that I am in a situation where I am committing to a bike that I haven't ridden on or performed a fit on. Any idea how I can circumvent this problem?
> 
> Thanks for reading.


First off, reputable LBS not only _allow_ test rides, they _encourage _them, because they recognize the value in riding bikes for one of the very reasons you mentioned... assessing fit. But those rides are also important for you to compare bikes of interest in ride, handling and control placement/ function. So you're right to hedge on moving forward on this. 

As far as committing to a purchase without every seeing or sitting on a bike to assess fit, the onus isn't (or at least, shouldn't be) on the buyer, it should be on the LBS, because that's one of the services you're paying for. That said, it should be understood that IF you were to commit to a purchase, it would be with the understanding that if the bike didn't fit, you'd have the option to either ask that they reorder another size or get a refund on your deposit.

Personally, I wouldn't consider patronizing a shop that didn't allow test rides. If possible, seek out one that does, because (IMO) that shop subscribes to the correct philosophy towards a bike purchase.


----------



## mercdeking

*Just got my bike*

Well I got my bike 2 days ago and have taken my first ride the other day.

I adjusted the brakes and finished the assembling the day before that.

I already know that I have to adjust the front derailleur because at the highest gear the chain rubs. But otherwise the bike shifts super smooth, guess going from a walmart bike to a bike with a decent components really shows you the differences in quality.

All the other gear levels shift smooth and nicely.

Time to watch some youtube video's on adjusting a front derailleur.

Also I picked the correct top tube height, but the ride is definitely on the aggressive side but that's fine. Just had to adjust the seat height so my knees didn't feel so cramped on the drops and slid it back.

Going to try out a longer 12mile ride after work tomorrow. Did 3 of those on my walmart schwinn before I realized I was wasting my time with a bike that had some serious issues assembly and component quality. But it did show me that I was going to continue riding and needed something nicer.

I shelled out $587 dollars after some tough searching.

Its a GT GTR series 3.0 
Tiagra components, chose the Small, I was expecting a 50cm but it was 49cm so somewhere I did not look at my specs well enough. But I'm 5'8" with a short legs and a long torso. /hence the small cm size and moving my seat back.


----------



## PJ352

mercdeking said:


> Its a GT GTR series 3.0
> Tiagra components, chose the Small, I was expecting a 50cm but it was 49cm so somewhere I did not look at my specs well enough. But I'm 5'8" with a short legs and a long torso. /hence the small cm size and moving my seat back.


Looking at the geometry for that model, GT sizes them by XS, S, M... Unless you got a women's model, the XS with an effective top tube of 525mm's is the equivalent of many 50cm bikes. 

Given your proportions, you might want to consider having a LBS fitter assess your fit on the bike. Moving the seat back to compensate for short reach _could_ move you too far back affecting f/r weight distribution and change your knee over pedal position.

Depending on how far off the sizing is (IF it is), dictates whether it'll affect he bikes handling and your performance on it. A knowledgeable fitter could easily assess that and whether a S (~52cm) would be a better fit.


----------



## cpj38

*frame first*

try to get the best frame you can. In 12 months you will want to upgrade, so if you have a good frame you can upgrade wheels. If you have Shimano 105 groupset you wont need to upgrade them.


----------



## Franco_10

Good advise, thanks


----------



## lloydbraun

This is pretty good stuff. I'm in the process of buying my 1st bike. Helpful advice here.


----------



## rich_ji08

Hey I'm a newbie here looking to purchase my first road bike. I'm thinking about getting the 2013 Madone 2.3 or the 2013 Madone 2.1. The difference is Shimano 105 breaks, carbon seat post, and $300. Which one should I pick? Thanks


----------



## PJ352

rich_ji08 said:


> Hey I'm a newbie here looking to purchase my first road bike. I'm thinking about getting the 2013 Madone 2.3 or the 2013 Madone 2.1. The difference is Shimano 105 breaks, carbon seat post, and $300. Which one should I pick? Thanks


Assuming the Madones suite your intended purposes (basically, recreational road riding) and given this is your first road bike, I suggest saving the $300 for accessories and going with the 2.1. The differences aren't going to get you much (if anything) in the way of performance, so not worth the extra money.

Another potential advantage of going with the 2.1 is that it's offered in both a compact and triple crankset, so depending on your fitness/ terrain) something to discuss with your LBS.


----------



## Lampchop

This is a really good set of advice, thanks everyone!


----------



## rich_ji08

PJ352 said:


> Assuming the Madones suite your intended purposes (basically, recreational road riding) and given this is your first road bike, I suggest saving the $300 for accessories and going with the 2.1. The differences aren't going to get you much (if anything) in the way of performance, so not worth the extra money.
> 
> Another potential advantage of going with the 2.1 is that it's offered in both a compact and triple crankset, so depending on your fitness/ terrain) something to discuss with your LBS.


Thank you!


----------



## jbep

I just ordered a GMC denali new for $180and it is on its way. My friend just told she can sell me her used fuji bike for $250 it costed her about $1,500 and supposedly used it for about 5 trips. What should I do? What would be a better deal?


----------



## NJBiker72

jbep said:


> I just ordered a GMC denali new for $180and it is on its way. My friend just told she can sell me her used fuji bike for $250 it costed her about $1,500 and supposedly used it for about 5 trips. What should I do? What would be a better deal?


If her bike fits cancel it. The Denali is not a road bike. It is a hybrid with drop bars.

Not the worst thing in the world. It sits just fine on my trainer and would not make a horrible winter/rain bike, but without knowing anything about the Fuji, take the Fuji.


----------



## jbep

NJBiker72 said:


> If her bike fits cancel it. The Denali is not a road bike. It is a hybrid with drop bars.
> 
> Not the worst thing in the world. It sits just fine on my trainer and would not make a horrible winter/rain bike, but without knowing anything about the Fuji, take the Fuji.


Thank you NJ biker72 for your good advice. I will go and see it today. I am also more inclined to get the Fuji. It sounds like a good deal.


----------



## jbep

Thanks


----------



## jbep

*Fuji 2.0 accident*

One more question. My friend told me she had one accident on her fuji 2.0 bike. And you can see the scratch in the right hand of the fork. Is that going to affect the bike performance?


----------



## NJBiker72

jbep said:


> One more question. My friend told me she had one accident on her fuji 2.0 bike. And you can see the scratch in the right hand of the fork. Is that going to affect the bike performance?


Not likely but you should probably take it to a shop to look it over and tune it up anyway. Also it is a good idea to get fitted.


----------



## jbep

NJBiker72 said:


> Not likely but you should probably take it to a shop to look it over and tune it up anyway. Also it is a good idea to get fitted.


Thank you so much. You always reply so fast. And I meant right handlebar not fork. sorry.


----------



## NJBiker72

jbep said:


> Thank you so much. You always reply so fast. And I meant right handlebar not fork. sorry.


Happy to share some of the knowledge learned here and from experience. I crashed my aluminum bike twice. Barely a scratch.


----------



## craig_d

Hi all - relatively new here. I bought a cheap mountain bike a few months ago to see if I would enjoy riding as much as I did when I was younger. My original plan was to use it for rides around the neighborhood and a few local bike paths.

I quickly realized that I LOVE cycling, and swapped out the knobby tires for more road friendly ones. I've gone from 3 mile rides when I first got it to 32 miles last weekend, and a HUGE desire to upgrade to a solid dependable road bike.

Having 3 kids and several other expensive hobbies I am absolutely on a budget ($500-$800) and have been researching for probably 2 months.

My problem now is (being a busienss analyst by profession) I think I've over-analyzed, read too much, and have allowed my budget to sway to close to the high end (and over).

I started looking at Performances house brand "Scattante" as they have 2 different bikes for $499 - the 330 and 340. I've also looked at Specialized Allez for $769. (Of course I've looked at several Fujis, Felts, GTs as well). My issue now is they all have the Sora groupset and shifters, my opinion based on everythign I've read is to avoid anything lower than Tiagra.

I want to get something I'm going to be happy with for several years. I don't want to feel like I have to upgrade next year.

I hate the idea of spending $500 this year, and deciding that I should have spent $900 - then being out a total of $1400 in a year or 2.

Any reccomendations on a biek would be appreciated. I plan on doing about 50 miles a week, with some longer group / charitry rides throughout the year.


----------



## PJ352

craig_d said:


> Hi all - relatively new here. I bought a cheap mountain bike a few months ago to see if I would enjoy riding as much as I did when I was younger. My original plan was to use it for rides around the neighborhood and a few local bike paths.
> 
> I quickly realized that I LOVE cycling, and swapped out the knobby tires for more road friendly ones. I've gone from 3 mile rides when I first got it to 32 miles last weekend, and a HUGE desire to upgrade to a solid dependable road bike.
> 
> Having 3 kids and several other expensive hobbies I am absolutely on a budget ($500-$800) and have been researching for probably 2 months.
> 
> My problem now is (being a busienss analyst by profession) I think I've over-analyzed, read too much, and have allowed my budget to sway to close to the high end (and over).
> 
> I started looking at Performances house brand "Scattante" as they have 2 different bikes for $499 - the 330 and 340. I've also looked at Specialized Allez for $769. (Of course I've looked at several Fujis, Felts, GTs as well). My issue now is they all have the Sora groupset and shifters, my opinion based on everythign I've read is to avoid anything lower than Tiagra.
> 
> I want to get something I'm going to be happy with for several years. I don't want to feel like I have to upgrade next year.
> 
> I hate the idea of spending $500 this year, and deciding that I should have spent $900 - then being out a total of $1400 in a year or 2.
> 
> Any reccomendations on a biek would be appreciated. I plan on doing about 50 miles a week, with some longer group / charitry rides throughout the year.


Your budget is going to require some time and patience on your part, but you have a couple of decent options.

First and foremost, is fit. So I would advise against buying online or in a manner that dictates no fitting/ test ride before committing to the purchase. 

That said, one option would be to seek out a reputable LBS selling used bikes. You'll get a level of sizing/ fitting assistance and some offer a short term warranty (~30 day).

Another option is to get sized/ fitted at your LBS and take that data (year, make, model and frame size of the test bike) and compare its geo to other bikes of interest. The closer the geo numbers, the closer fit will be to the test bike. There may be a nominal charge for this service, but it beats playing a guessing game on sizing/ fit, which could ultimately cost more.

Last (and best, IMO) option is to buy new from your LBS. It'll cost a little more, but you'll get the sizing/ fit assistance you need along with assistance in narrowing the range of bikes that might best suite your intended uses and goals. Plus, most offer post purchase services like tweaks to fit and discounts on accessories.

Because you're new to road riding, I suggest test riding both race and relaxed geo drop bar bikes. Depending on your fitness/ flexibility and preferences, you may prefer one over the other. Test rides help to sort that out.

EDIT: Re: groupsets, for 2013 Shimano has upgraded its Sora shifters, so my advice is to consider that groupset. Again, (within your budget) test rides will help you decide what you like best. And gearing should be considered as well - matching a riders fitness/ terrain.


----------



## craig_d

Buying new from a LBS is the only option for me. My local stores don't sell used bikes, and I like the "after the purchase support" from a shop. Performance's lifetime adjustments seems to be a great deal (as I've had my mountain bike in a few times already). I agree the new Sora is nicer than the old, but the bikes in my price range all seem tohave the old. I'd have to step up to the next level of Specialized Allez to get the new Sora.


----------



## NJBiker72

craig_d said:


> Buying new from a LBS is the only option for me. My local stores don't sell used bikes, and I like the "after the purchase support" from a shop. Performance's lifetime adjustments seems to be a great deal (as I've had my mountain bike in a few times already). I agree the new Sora is nicer than the old, but the bikes in my price range all seem tohave the old. I'd have to step up to the next level of Specialized Allez to get the new Sora.


I hated the old Sora on my Secteur. But since it has been relegated to a winter bike it is not so bad. I greatly prefer Sram but if it is not in your budget, its not. If tuned right Sora works. 

Not crazy about Performance as opposed to an lbs but it might be a good stepping stone on your budget. When you eventually upgrade you can keep the old bike for winter, rain, trainer, gravel whatever.


----------



## PJ352

craig_d said:


> Buying new from a LBS is the only option for me. My local stores don't sell used bikes, and I like the "after the purchase support" from a shop. Performance's lifetime adjustments seems to be a great deal (as I've had my mountain bike in a few times already). I agree the new Sora is nicer than the old, but the bikes in my price range all seem tohave the old. I'd have to step up to the next level of Specialized Allez to get the new Sora.


Then your best bet probably is Performance bike. Their rep is spotty - some shops ok, other not so ok - but they seem to offer very competitive prices on Fuji's (as one example). 

The reality is, when on a budget, trade-offs have to be made. I know everyone wants the most for their money, but with bikes part of getting that is getting fit right, and IME reputable LBS's are more apt to do that.

Personally, I'd go with downgraded shifters and a bike that fit well over upgraded shifters and a so-so fit.


----------



## craig_d

Thanks guys - I appreciate the opinions and insight.

I guess I'm fortunate to have a good staff at my local Performance store. They have 1 tech in aprticular that has always taken the time to talk, get toknow me, what / how / where I'm riding, and always makes sure my mountain bike is in pristine condition.

I like that when I walk in there's at least 3 employees that say hello by name.

I went back in yestersay with a clear head and open opinions. The tech just mentioned helped me compare a few bikes, and we decided the Scatante 330 was the best geometry for my build (short legs, long torso, lots of extra padding around the middle) - it was a little more "bent over" then I wanted so he is swapping out the stem for a shorter one for me and making some general adjustments to fit me better so I can test ride it again today to get a better feel for the bike.


----------



## PJ352

craig_d said:


> Thanks guys - I appreciate the opinions and insight.
> 
> I guess I'm fortunate to have a good staff at my local Performance store. They have 1 tech in aprticular that has always taken the time to talk, get toknow me, what / how / where I'm riding, and always makes sure my mountain bike is in pristine condition.
> 
> I like that when I walk in there's at least 3 employees that say hello by name.
> 
> I went back in yestersay with a clear head and open opinions. The tech just mentioned helped me compare a few bikes, and we decided the Scatante 330 was the best geometry for my build (short legs, long torso, lots of extra padding around the middle) - it was a little more "bent over" then I wanted so he is swapping out the stem for a shorter one for me and making some general adjustments to fit me better so I can test ride it again today to get a better feel for the bike.


All indications are that you're in good hands. Let us know how the test ride goes....


----------



## NJBiker72

Agree with pj. It really is all about the staff. Seen both at performance but then again when the great staff left my lbs to open their own that place went downhill.


----------



## craig_d

Went in for the test ride yesterday, the bike was nice, but I have an issue with the tendon between my thumb and forefinger that the hood on the Sora shifter irritated. They made a few adjustments which made it better, but not good.

I decided (at the wife's urging no less) to go ahead and get the bike I originally wanted - a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 - it was the "Performance Exclusive" version so it came with Tiagra components, an Oval seat, and (I believe) Oval wheelset.

Test ride was smoothe and fun, handles well, and feels much more solid then the Scattante. I ended up short on time so I will go back for a fitting and to pick it up tonight. We already know I need the shorter stem, so they're swapping it out for a 90mm, and installing the pedals and computer today before I go back in.

Already having riding buddies set up for it's innaugural rides this weekend.


----------



## NJBiker72

craig_d said:


> Went in for the test ride yesterday, the bike was nice, but I have an issue with the tendon between my thumb and forefinger that the hood on the Sora shifter irritated. They made a few adjustments which made it better, but not good.
> 
> I decided (at the wife's urging no less) to go ahead and get the bike I originally wanted - a Fuji Roubaix 3.0 - it was the "Performance Exclusive" version so it came with Tiagra components, an Oval seat, and (I believe) Oval wheelset.
> 
> Test ride was smoothe and fun, handles well, and feels much more solid then the Scattante. I ended up short on time so I will go back for a fitting and to pick it up tonight. We already know I need the shorter stem, so they're swapping it out for a 90mm, and installing the pedals and computer today before I go back in.
> 
> Already having riding buddies set up for it's innaugural rides this weekend.


Congratulations. An uncomfortable bike is never a good buy. Enjoy.


----------



## PJ352

craig_d said:


> Went in for the test ride yesterday, the bike was nice, but...


Congrats! I think your experience points up the importance of test rides.

Re: the Sora shifters, it's possible that an adjustment to the bar (tilt) and/ or shifter placement could have at least minimized your hand discomfort, but you also mention other areas of preference for the Fuji, so all's well that ends well (as they say). No denying it's a nice entry level bike. 

If you're so inclined, post pics and riding impressions. And BTW, kudos to your wife for supporting you on this. :thumbsup:


----------



## Haagis58

Tell riders you know that you are looking to purchase a bike and tell them your intended budget and what you'll be using the bike for. I told a friend of mine I wanted to start building my first road bike and a few weeks later he found a great frame at a price I could afford so I picked it up. Since I am new to road biking, I don't have nearly the network that experienced riders have. Leverage friends who have the passion for riding.


----------



## cwadamson

I am looking at getting my first road bike soon. I was thinking about buy a frame and starting there. I know a weld shop that can weld aluminum very well. With that said i was think if i can find a really cheap frame that just has some minor damage and needs some welding that would be a good start?


----------



## PJ352

cwadamson said:


> I am looking at getting my first road bike soon. I was thinking about buy a frame and starting there. I know a weld shop that can weld aluminum very well. With that said i was think if i can find a really cheap frame that just has some minor damage and needs some welding that would be a good start?


Not trying to be snarky, but I don't think a frame that needs welding can be categorized as having some minor damage. I would consider that major damage, likely indicating a defect or crash, and probably needing alignment after the repairs were done.

Even if you could get through this part of the process inexpensively, building a bike 'frame up' is generally more expensive than buying a complete bike. Not dissimilar to cars, they're sometimes worth more in parts.

My advice would be to find a good, used bike, ideally at your LBS, because there you'll get some assistance on sizing/ fit and possibly a 30 day warranty.


----------



## cwadamson

Ok so i have given up on the damaged frame now. I have found a Caad 9 with tiagra components. It was bought in 2009 and rode 4 times. How much should i pay something like that?


----------



## PJ352

cwadamson said:


> Ok so i have given up on the damaged frame now. I have found a Caad 9 with tiagra components. It was bought in 2009 and rode 4 times. How much should i pay something like that?


Ridden 4 times only tells part of the story. How the bike was stored, where (the environment) among other factors will play a part in determining value. And those values vary by region and supply/ demand. 

Best (general) estimate I can offer is if the bike is in very good to excellent condition, somewhere between 50-60% of original price would be ballpark, or starting price.

Beyond that, when buying used from a private seller, make sure the bike fits well. If you're unsure, ask to bring it to a reputable LBS and have fit (along with mechanical condition) assessed. They may also be able to provide a value estimate as well.


----------



## Belljor12

Anyone have any thoughts on the 2013 felt z95?


----------



## PJ352

Belljor12 said:


> Anyone have any thoughts on the 2013 felt z95?


Felt offers top quality bikes and a strong warranty. IMO, the Z series geo leans towards relaxed/ endurance (versus race), which offers slightly slower handling and a slightly more upright riding position - both good things to those new to road riding.

That said, make sure the bike suites your intended uses/ goals and the geo fits you well. A reputable shop will guide you in those decisions, so shop for shops along with bikes.


----------



## Belljor12

This would be my first road bike. I am looking to get into the sport without breaking the bank, but also want to be able to keep the bike for a year or so before needing to upgrade.


----------



## Belljor12

This would be my first road bike. I am looking to get into the sport without breaking the bank, but also want to be able to keep the bike for a year or so before needing to upgrade. I also looked at specialized, but the store kept trying to upswell me outside of my budget. The LBS selling felt seemed more personable to me. Reading through this thread the store seems to be the deciding factor.


----------



## PJ352

Belljor12 said:


> This would be my first road bike. I am looking to get into the sport without breaking the bank, but also want to be able to keep the bike for a year or so before needing to upgrade. I also looked at specialized, but the store kept trying to upswell me outside of my budget. The LBS selling felt seemed more personable to me. Reading through this thread the store seems to be the deciding factor.


A reputable LBS makes a big difference in the buying process. If you feel comfortable with the Felt shop and they emphasize the importance of fit/ test rides, they're likely a fine choice.

Re: the Z95, as long as you're looking to do adult fitness road riding (basically, recreational riding), I think the bike suites your purpose. The new Sora shifters are an improvement over the previous model and I think as a package, the Z95 is fully capable of growing with you. You can easily get a couple (plus) years out of it before _needing _to upgrade. _Wanting_ to, that's another story. :wink5:


----------



## Mavtek

Good tips guys! Thanks, post count 1 more.


----------



## matty1

is sora better then tiagra ?


----------



## PJ352

matty1 said:


> is sora better then tiagra ?


When setup and tuned correctly, both will meet most recreational rides needs, but as model lines go, Tiagra is one up from Sora. Also, currently, Sora is 9 speed and Tiagra, 10.

Both have recently seen improvements, but IMO/E Tiagra is now on a par with the previous gen 105 (5600), which was (and is) a great groupset.


----------



## Belljor12

*Do you lose anything going for a womens bike over a gender neutral bike?*

I am wanting to get into road cycling, mostly for recreation with a century in the future and maybe a sprint triathlon. First off I wanted to say thank you to all the people posting on these forums, I have learned a lot. I do have one question though. I have decided on the cannondale synapse with the 105 groupset. The LBS says that I will fit on both the 56 cm gender neutral and the 56cm womens bike. I like the womens colors better, so my question is, do I lose anything as far as power, handling, features etc by going with the womens bike over the gender neutral?

Thank you for any advice.


----------



## PJ352

Belljor12 said:


> I am wanting to get into road cycling, mostly for recreation with a century in the future and maybe a sprint triathlon. First off I wanted to say thank you to all the people posting on these forums, I have learned a lot. I do have one question though. I have decided on the cannondale synapse with the 105 groupset. The LBS says that I will fit on both the 56 cm gender neutral and the 56cm womens bike. I like the womens colors better, so my question is, do I lose anything as far as power, handling, features etc by going with the womens bike over the gender neutral?
> 
> Thank you for any advice.


As long as both bikes fit you the same, you'll lose nothing. That said, because most WSD bikes have shorter reach and a more upright riding position, odds are the standard and WSD geometry won't fit you exactly the same, at least not 'out of the box'. Check the geo of both 56's and you'll see that reach is less and stack, more on the WSD model.

My advice is to have the LBS dial in your fit on both, ride them back to back, then decide which feels best.


----------



## Belljor12

PJ352 said:


> As long as both bikes fit you the same, you'll lose nothing. That said, because most WSD bikes have shorter reach and a more upright riding position, odds are the standard and WSD geometry won't fit you exactly the same, at least not 'out of the box'. Check the geo of both 56's and you'll see that reach is less and stack, more on the WSD model.
> 
> My advice is to have the LBS dial in your fit on both, ride them back to back, then decide which feels best.


Thank you, I will ask them to set them both up for me.


----------



## mnicko

*First time buyer*

Hey there,

I've been an avid mountain biker for a long time but recently found myself wanting to try my hand on the road. Only problem being I have no idea what I should be looking for in my first road bike. Preferably something that is durable and good at attacking inclines due to the nature of my surroundings in England. Budget being around £500-£600. I feel I ought to go into the LBS with some knowledge of what I'm looking for instead of blindly following what a seller is trying to sell me.


----------



## PJ352

mnicko said:


> Hey there,
> 
> I've been an avid mountain biker for a long time but recently found myself wanting to try my hand on the road. Only problem being I have no idea what I should be looking for in my first road bike. Preferably something that is durable and good at attacking inclines due to the nature of my surroundings in England. Budget being around £500-£600. I feel I ought to go into the LBS with some knowledge of what I'm looking for instead of blindly following what a seller is trying to sell me.


Your LBS's should be familiar with the terrain in your locale, but (generally speaking) bikes in this price range will have compact cranksets (50/34). The rear cogs will likely be in the 11-28 range, but can be swapped out for something more suitable, if need be.

Ask about both relaxed and race geo bikes. Coming from mtn biking you may prefer the slightly more upright riding position of the relaxed geo bikes, but test ride both before deciding. 

Lastly, shop for shops along with bikes, because you want to pick the shop you trust to provide good service, both before and after the sale.


----------



## Phlerb

A lot of information to digest. Thanks for a good evening's read.


----------



## mnicko

I went back to the shop I bought my mountain bike from and they we're very useful! The girl who was helping me was very knowledgeable and allowed me to test a multitude of bikes, explaining the differences between them can only take me so far so actually being able to experience the ride was much more effective! Thank you for your advice, I felt more prepared when I went in with some basic idea of what would be good for me. To top it off, I can get a huge discount due to their 'bike to work' scheme! Thank you


----------



## PJ352

mnicko said:


> I went back to the shop I bought my mountain bike from and they we're very useful! The girl who was helping me was very knowledgeable and allowed me to test a multitude of bikes, explaining the differences between them can only take me so far so actually being able to experience the ride was much more effective! Thank you for your advice, I felt more prepared when I went in with some basic idea of what would be good for me. To top it off, I can get a huge discount due to their 'bike to work' scheme! Thank you


Glad it's working out for you. Your right, looking at pics and reading specs only get a buyer so far (and sometimes fully confused). Back to back test rides cut through all that because you experience what feels right.

I think your mtn biking background helps and will continue to help as you sort through the final choices.


----------



## uberculture

Another obnoxious anxious noob... I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on a Felt F90 upgraded to a full Shimano 105 group for $500... sounds like a good deal to me (assuming it fits and nothing's egregiously wrong)... am I about to make a huge mistake?


----------



## PJ352

uberculture said:


> Another obnoxious anxious noob... I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on a Felt F90 upgraded to a full Shimano 105 group for $500... sounds like a good deal to me (assuming it fits and nothing's egregiously wrong)... am I about to make a huge mistake?


Without knowing more about the bike and its condition, can't comment on the price, but as long as it suites you intended uses and fits well, the F90 is a nice bike. 

That said, I ride a race bike and still find Felt's F series to be aggressive, so make sure it's the type of bike you want to live with for awhile.


----------



## Minnesotar6

Planning to buy a new bike this weekend! My first bike in 20 years! thinking about picking a cannondale hybrid/fitness bike


----------



## PJ352

Minnesotar6 said:


> Planning to buy a new bike this weekend! My first bike in 20 years! thinking about picking a cannondale hybrid/fitness bike


As long as a hybrid suites your intended purposes and goals, it's a fine choice. Reason I say this is, because they offer limited hand positions they're ok for more casual rides (up to say, one hour), but for longer/ endurance type riding, consider a drop bar road bike.

Best advice I can offer is to visit some LBS's, discuss your intended uses/ goals, budget, cycling experiences, fitness level and let them suggest some possible candidates. IMO getting a bike that suites your needs and fits well is more important than brand or model.


----------



## Minnesotar6

Thanks for the advice! the Main reason for the bike is to pull my 1 year old daugther around in a burley.


----------



## PJ352

Minnesotar6 said:


> Thanks for the advice! the Main reason for the bike is to pull my 1 year old daugther around in a burley.


If you think that'll be the limit of your cycling, the hybrid will do. OTOH, if you think you'll end up doing more serious fitness/ recreational riding, a drop bar bike is the better choice.


----------



## Minnesotar6

PJ352 said:


> If you think that'll be the limit of your cycling, the hybrid will do. OTOH, if you think you'll end up doing more serious fitness/ recreational riding, a drop bar bike is the better choice.



I'm actually very frustrated with my bike search. When I decided to look for a bike it was to tow my daugther around in a burley. I was told a hybrid would be best for that. Heres the 2 Hybrids I started to look at.
QUICK SL3
When I finally saw the bikes in person I fell in love with
QUICK CARBON 2

Then I was told 2k was way to much to spend if it wasnt a drop bar! will it be much harder to tow my daughter around in a burley on a drop bar? Will i have to get 2 bikes?


----------



## PJ352

Minnesotar6 said:


> I'm actually very frustrated with my bike search. When I decided to look for a bike it was to tow my daugther around in a burley. I was told a hybrid would be best for that. Heres the 2 Hybrids I started to look at.
> QUICK SL3
> When I finally saw the bikes in person I fell in love with
> QUICK CARBON 2
> 
> Then I was told 2k was way to much to spend if it wasnt a drop bar! will it be much harder to tow my daughter around in a burley on a drop bar? Will i have to get 2 bikes?


For the reasons I mentioned, hybrids will limit you as a cyclist if ever you choose to do more than JRA (just ride around) with your daughter in tow. I think this is why the LBS employee told you that in the 2k price range you should consider a drop bar bike. 

Before spending any money, my advice is to think about your short term/ long term intended uses. If you think you'll stay with an occasional jaunt around the neighborhood with your daughter, I think the Quick SL3 is more than up to the task. For more serious use, I tend to agree with the LBS that (considering a hybrids limited use) 2k is better spent on a drop bar bike.

No need for two bikes. Just get the one _right_ bike for your uses.


----------



## mdf26

Great information from everyone!  Thank you from a noob!


----------



## dgrif499

jensonusa.com had some good bike deals when I was buying some accessories on their site.


----------



## rjay2140

Hi everyone,

First post ever. I was not sure if I should start a thread asking for which bikes I should look into buying so I thought I'll ask here. My budget is around 250. I live in Las Vegas and will use this bike to ride around the neighborhood, parks, and with friends. Recreational uses but also for health since I want to improve my cardio. Any suggestions? i have no bike knowledge and wanted some advice before I dump money. I have no concerns over buying locally or online (i've looked at bikesdirect since I heard that was a good place)

thanks!


----------



## cyclintruckin

Been awhile since I have posted anything in the forums here. But I couldn't resist this deal, I finally found my new steed on CL in my size. A 2010 Masi Alare 60cm with a Cateye double wireless puter, even though the components are sora/tiagra mix they work great to me. The original asking price was $550.00, I sent the guy a text " I have $350.00 cash in hand" and he replied Ok ! I will post some pics of it later when I get my new tires and wheels on it. As good of a deal it was all I can do is look at it, since I herniated/bulging disc in my back last month.


----------



## PJ352

rjay2140 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> First post ever. I was not sure if I should start a thread asking for which bikes I should look into buying so I thought I'll ask here. My budget is around 250. I live in Las Vegas and will use this bike to ride around the neighborhood, parks, and with friends. Recreational uses but also for health since I want to improve my cardio. Any suggestions? i have no bike knowledge and wanted some advice before I dump money. I have no concerns over buying locally or online (i've looked at bikesdirect since I heard that was a good place)
> 
> thanks!


Given that this is your first bike and your budget is ~$250, IMO your best option is to try to find a used bike locally. This gives you the opportunity to test ride the bike(s) before committing to a purchase, which (in addition to guessing on sizing) you'd have to do buying online.

Be sure to check your LBS's for any used offerings. For your intended uses, a hybrid may well suite you, and they're generally cheaper than drop bar road bikes.

HTH, and let us know how your search goes...


----------



## rjay2140

Thanks PJ352

I did not know LBS might carry used bikes. I'm scared of buying used from craigslist when it comes to things I have no knowledge of but I'll be able to trust a brick store better.

Will update in a week I hope, as my only free day is Sunday.


----------



## PJ352

rjay2140 said:


> Thanks PJ352
> 
> I did not know LBS might carry used bikes. I'm scared of buying used from craigslist when it comes to things I have no knowledge of but I'll be able to trust a brick store better.
> 
> Will update in a week I hope, as my only free day is Sunday.


I agree that buying from CL poses risks. What you may want to consider is asking the seller to bring the bike of interest to a LBS for mechanical and sizing assessment. Some will do this free of charge (but not all), so you have to weigh the risks (of not having a bike assessed) with keeping more of the $250 for the purchase. 

Not all LBS's carry used bikes, but some do, so I thought I'd offer that as an option. The bikes tend to cost more there, but you get some perks for the added cost, like sizing/ fit assistance and possibly a 30 day warranty.

Good luck!!


----------



## beartownrd

So it's almost the season here. I've had the mindset for the last couple months to stay around 1k for a bike + pedals. Then comes along a friend who says to not invest in an entry level bike, save a bit more, and spring for a bike around the 2k range. I love biking and enjoy entering casual events (50 mile rides, hope to do a century some day) but do I need a CF frame or 105 componentry? Such as this?

There aren't a ton of hills where I live but they do exist so a lighter bike could be something to invest in.. I only own a hybrid and am eager to begin this new experience but it appears I've become indecisive now. As a beginner and newb to road bikes, how quickly am I going to want better components if I ride 50+ mpw?

Would I regret purchasing say a CAAD8 with 2300 components? Cause that's what I've been eyeing a bit and my friend says to get this.


----------



## PJ352

beartownrd said:


> So it's almost the season here. I've had the mindset for the last couple months to stay around 1k for a bike + pedals. Then comes along a friend who says to not invest in an entry level bike, save a bit more, and spring for a bike around the 2k range. I love biking and enjoy entering casual events (50 mile rides, hope to do a century some day) but do I need a CF frame or 105 componentry? Such as this?
> 
> There aren't a ton of hills where I live but they do exist so a lighter bike could be something to invest in.. I only own a hybrid and am eager to begin this new experience but it appears I've become indecisive now. As a beginner and newb to road bikes, how quickly am I going to want better components if I ride 50+ mpw?
> 
> Would I regret purchasing say a CAAD8 with 2300 components? Cause that's what I've been eyeing a bit and my friend says to get this.


From your post I'm guessing you're new to drop bar bikes, but not biking. In which case, _where_ you buy becomes important, because IMO/E getting fitted to drop bar bikes is a little more involved than hybrids. I suggest shopping for shops along with bikes and find a reputable LBS that you trust to fit you well.

Beyond the fit concerns, consider splitting the difference between an entry level bike and the CAAD10 w/ 105 you linked to. Maybe a CAAD8 with Tiagra (or similar), which I think would suite your needs for the foreseeable future.

To answer your question, no one really _needs_ CF or 105, but many aspire to both. Recreational riders _needs_ will be met with bikes in the $1,200 +/- range.


----------



## beartownrd

PJ352 said:


> From your post I'm guessing you're new to drop bar bikes, but not biking. In which case, _where_ you buy becomes important, because IMO/E getting fitted to drop bar bikes is a little more involved than hybrids. I suggest shopping for shops along with bikes and find a reputable LBS that you trust to fit you well.
> 
> Beyond the fit concerns, consider splitting the difference between an entry level bike and the CAAD10 w/ 105 you linked to. Maybe a CAAD8 with Tiagra (or similar), which I think would suite your needs for the foreseeable future.
> 
> To answer your question, no one really _needs_ CF or 105, but many aspire to both. Recreational riders _needs_ will be met with bikes in the $1,200 +/- range.


You are exactly right -- I am not new to biking but am to drop bar bikes. Thank you very much for taking the time to respond to my concerns. I'll definitely test ride Tiagra component bicycles this Saturday within my budget.


----------



## PJ352

beartownrd said:


> You are exactly right -- I am not new to biking but am to drop bar bikes. Thank you very much for taking the time to respond to my concerns. I'll definitely test ride Tiagra component bicycles this Saturday within my budget.


Glad to help. I think you'll be impressed with the current (10 speed) Tiagra group.

Good luck, and be sure to post updates if we can assist further... or just to share your experiences.


----------



## southerncali710

*need advice on buying a bike*



PJ352 said:


> Glad to help. I think you'll be impressed with the current (10 speed) Tiagra group.
> 
> Good luck, and be sure to post updates if we can assist further... or just to share your experiences.


I was wondering if i could get some advice on getting a road bike on a $250 budget i found i a gary fisher marlin miuntain bike for $250 on craigslist or would i be able to get a bike for $250 at a local bike shop?


----------



## PJ352

southerncali710 said:


> I was wondering if i could get some advice on getting a road bike on a $250 budget i found i a gary fisher marlin miuntain bike for $250 on craigslist or would i be able to get a bike for $250 at a local bike shop?


If you're keeping to paved roads, I suggest getting a road bike which is designed to traverse paved surfaces. That's not to say a mtb can't do the same, but it's not their forte.

As far as _where_ to buy, realistically, your budget will limit you. I suggest trying LBS's (for used) in your area and as a second option, a private seller (CL, or similar).

If the used GF is the best you can find, assuming it fits and is in decent condition, consider putting slicks (or tires with minimal tread) on it for road use.


----------



## beartownrd

Just wanted to report back that I finally purchased a bike!

Decided that a straight road bike may not be 100% for me so I rode some cyclo cross bikes.

Purchased a 2012 Raleigh RX 1.0 for $1199 'out the door' sale price. The bike feels great and although I was hesitant going with SRAM I've quickly adapted to it from my Shimano experience. Going to go back in a couple of weeks to get a tune up and purchase some entry level clip pedals and shoes.


----------



## PJ352

beartownrd said:


> Just wanted to report back that I finally purchased a bike!
> 
> Decided that a straight road bike may not be 100% for me so I rode some cyclo cross bikes.
> 
> Purchased a 2012 Raleigh RX 1.0 for $1199 'out the door' sale price. The bike feels great and although I was hesitant going with SRAM I've quickly adapted to it from my Shimano experience. Going to go back in a couple of weeks to get a tune up and purchase some entry level clip pedals and shoes.


Nice! Congrats! I'd say you've found yourself a pretty versatile bike. The OE tires look to be good all-rounders, but if you find yourself staying more to paved surfaces, you can opt for some slightly narrower Gatorskins (or similar).

Enjoy!!


----------



## BBoneCloneMN

That's one hell of a bike to start with, but your friend is right: If you're already going 50 miles and know you enjoy riding, you're through the discovery phase that most people talk about. 

I've only been riding a year, but I dove straight in to a century ride last summer and now I'm really regretting going the timid/cheap route. I bought a bike on Craigslist and it was the right bike for the money at the time, but with old Sora components and a, frankly, incorrect size, I really wish I'd just gone to the bike shop and done it the right way. 

I was worried I'd have a $1500 bike I don't ride sitting next to the guitar I never learned to play. In the effort to avoid that, I ended up having to explain to my wife that the $400 bike I bought 8 months ago isn't the right one. That's no fun either.

That said, when I look at my next bike, I am being very honest about my ability and goals. Carbon would be nice, but for my budget, it's a luxury. 105 sounds like where it's at, but if you dig deeper, you'll see glowing reviews of modern Tiagra components. No doubt that CAAD 10 will be a sweet bike that doesn't disappoint, but you could get into a $1300 bike and still be very happy - with money left over for gear, which you'll immediately start wanting as your love of sport takes you out in the cold, the rain, the dark, etc.


----------



## Cvoss1

I'm new to road bikes. I have a 1996 trek MTb and want something lightweight for city commuting. My commute is 2 miles rt and I'm a fair weather rider. Looking for something to commute in the city and enjoy longer weekend rides for exercise but no racing. Found a 2012 felt zw95 for $850 with mixed parts including tiagra, micro shifters and carbon fork. Seems comfortable but a little rigid on bumpy roads. Is this a good deal/bike or should I consider something with better components? Any thoughts/suggestions?


----------



## PJ352

Cvoss1 said:


> I'm new to road bikes. I have a 1996 trek MTb and want something lightweight for city commuting. My commute is 2 miles rt and I'm a fair weather rider. Looking for something to commute in the city and enjoy longer weekend rides for exercise but no racing. Found a 2012 felt zw95 for $850 with mixed parts including tiagra, micro shifters and carbon fork. Seems comfortable but a little rigid on bumpy roads. Is this a good deal/bike or should I consider something with better components? Any thoughts/suggestions?


Coming from mtb'ing, most any road bike is going to feel rigid, but as you log miles, you'll become accustomed. Going with a wider tire (25c?) and tailoring tire pressures to your weight will help as well.

Re: the ZW95, I believe it's a WSD bike, so as long as it fits, it's a fine choice. Not knowing if it's NOS, the original MSRP or if it's used, can't give you an opinion on the price.


----------



## Cvoss1

PJ352 said:


> Coming from mtb'ing, most any road bike is going to feel rigid, but as you log miles, you'll become accustomed. Going with a wider tire (25c?) and tailoring tire pressures to your weight will help as well.
> 
> Re: the ZW95, I believe it's a WSD bike, so as long as it fits, it's a fine choice. Not knowing if it's NOS, the original MSRP or if it's used, can't give you an opinion on the price.



Yes it's a WSD brand new and fit seems good. It's definitely a different feelfrom the mountain bike. Yes it's a 25c tire. Original MSRP seems to be around $899 on line but the lbs had it for $949.


----------



## PJ352

Cvoss1 said:


> Yes it's a WSD brand new and fit seems good. It's definitely a different feelfrom the mountain bike. Yes it's a 25c tire. Original MSRP seems to be around $899 on line but the lbs had it for $949.


Assuming you took the bike out on the roads for a 'real' test ride, except for the price, it sounds like a good choice for you. 

Re: pricing, generally speaking, LBS's discount year old models more than $50. Although, smaller shops have less room to negotiate. I'd try for $100 off, at least.


----------



## sbwrites

Hi! I'm new to this site, and have read most of this thread because I'm buying my first new road bike in decades. From reading, I realize that my first step should be to go to a local bike store, get fitted for a bike, and start riding different models. But, I'd like to have some idea what I'm seeking before I walk into a shop because I'm a bit overwhelmed. Having read a lot (while knowing next to nothing about bikes), I do have a few comments and questions.

1. My last bike was a Peugeot road bike that I bought over 30 years ago, and unfortunately sold. But I loved riding it.

2. I'm mostly planning on riding for recreation and fitness unless I love biking, and decide to do more. I'm 63 years old. In my prime, my longest ride was about 200 miles. I plan on riding 3-5 miles daily to start with, but could easily get up to ten miles or more if I love it.

3. I live in Los Angeles, and there's a lot of traffic here. So, I plan on riding on bike paths or around a local park where there are a fair number of hills. I'm thinking it might also be fun to join a newbie bike club.

4. I'm thinking I'd like to spend about between $500-750, but can go a little higher if there's a huge difference. 

5. I don't care about brand names. I want the best bike for the money. Having said that: These are the bikes that seem to be the best choice for the kind of riding I think I'm going to do (and are in my price range). But I'd like feedback, and any other suggestions before I start my bike store quest.

Trek FX
Trek 1.1
Jamis Coda Sport (This is listed as a recreation bike, and has flat handlebars, but is within my price range and got good reviews.)
There are also a number of Giant bikes in my price range, and one Specialized bike. 

Also, despite what I said about Craigslist, there is one listing that intrigues me, because I could never afford it if it weren't used. 
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/bik/3729498069.

Thanks for any info you provide!


----------



## PJ352

sbwrites said:


> Hi! I'm new to this site, and have read most of this thread because I'm buying my first new road bike in decades. From reading, I realize that my first step should be to go to a local bike store, get fitted for a bike, and start riding different models. But, I'd like to have some idea what I'm seeking before I walk into a shop because I'm a bit overwhelmed. Having read a lot (while knowing next to nothing about bikes), I do have a few comments and questions.
> 
> 1. My last bike was a Peugeot road bike that I bought over 30 years ago, and unfortunately sold. But I loved riding it.
> 
> 2. I'm mostly planning on riding for recreation and fitness unless I love biking, and decide to do more. I'm 63 years old. In my prime, my longest ride was about 200 miles. I plan on riding 3-5 miles daily to start with, but could easily get up to ten miles or more if I love it.
> 
> 3. I live in Los Angeles, and there's a lot of traffic here. So, I plan on riding on bike paths or around a local park where there are a fair number of hills. I'm thinking it might also be fun to join a newbie bike club.
> 
> 4. I'm thinking I'd like to spend about between $500-750, but can go a little higher if there's a huge difference.
> 
> 5. I don't care about brand names. I want the best bike for the money. Having said that: These are the bikes that seem to be the best choice for the kind of riding I think I'm going to do (and are in my price range). But I'd like feedback, and any other suggestions before I start my bike store quest.
> 
> Trek FX
> Trek 1.1
> Jamis Coda Sport (This is listed as a recreation bike, and has flat handlebars, but is within my price range and got good reviews.)
> There are also a number of Giant bikes in my price range, and one Specialized bike.
> 
> Also, despite what I said about Craigslist, there is one listing that intrigues me, because I could never afford it if it weren't used.
> http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/bik/3729498069.
> 
> Thanks for any info you provide!


If you've read through this thread, besides the importance of getting fit right, you probably also picked up on the importance of matching the bike to the intended uses. 

I bring this up because you mention the Trek FX and Jamis Coda, which are both hybrids, while the Trek 1.1 is a drop bar road bike.

The advantages of hybrids are that they're a little cheaper than drop bar bikes and a little easier to fit. The downside is that because of their limited hand positions, they can limit a riders growth into the sport. So, if you end up riding more than your 10 miles, you may start wishing for a drop bar bike. OTOH, for your (current) stated intended uses, a hybrid would suite them.

The lower end of your price range would get you a decent hybrid, while the upper end will get you a decent drop bar bike. This assumes buying new.

Speaking of which, buying new from a LBS provides some value added services... sizing/ fit assistance, tuning, a warranty and post purchase services (tweaks to fit) and warranty assistance.

Buying used gets you none of that, so the risks are higher, but either way, I suggest you test ride a few bikes and decide from there.


----------



## fitnessRider

beartownrd said:


> So it's almost the season here. I've had the mindset for the last couple months to stay around 1k for a bike + pedals. Then comes along a friend who says to not invest in an entry level bike, save a bit more, and spring for a bike around the 2k range. I love biking and enjoy entering casual events (50 mile rides, hope to do a century some day) but do I need a CF frame or 105 componentry? Such as this?
> 
> There aren't a ton of hills where I live but they do exist so a lighter bike could be something to invest in.. I only own a hybrid and am eager to begin this new experience but it appears I've become indecisive now. As a beginner and newb to road bikes, how quickly am I going to want better components if I ride 50+ mpw?
> 
> Would I regret purchasing say a CAAD8 with 2300 components? Cause that's what I've been eyeing a bit and my friend says to get this.




I spent $350 on a Giordano Libero 1.6 new online, upgraded about $50 worth of parts, Pedals, tires, brakes, and was very happy. For my entry level bike with 2300 shimano components. 

An it has been over a year, and I don't regret my purchase, I ride with a club, and have since upgraded other parts. with my eyes on the, stem, bars. I looked at your bike, and mine now weighs 21 lbs according to the lbs with everything on it except the full water bottles, and I spent about $500 total.


----------



## fitnessRider

Tammy609 said:


> Actually, someone buying a first bike is VERY likely to need a GREAT relationship with a shop. When 500-600 will give you a solid ride, why not get in good with a shop?


Through the club rides I know the mechanic at a shop. He does all the labor for both of my full cleaning an tuneups. The cheapest bike at all the nearby shops was $999 for entry level road bikes, sora equiped bikes. None of these shops sell used either, that was beyond my budget. Out of the 5 shops 3 also charge to fit and help you select the bike. One place was $70, the other two were under $20. That left, Walmart, target and the Internet. Craigslist only had kids bikes, and tricycles. 

Those were the reasons why. One guy at a shop leveled with me and said, unless I had 1,200.00 I was pretty much priced out of road bikes at a shop, an that I should look at the hybrids for 399


----------



## PJ352

fitnessRider said:


> Through the club rides I know the mechanic at a shop. He does all the labor for both of my full cleaning an tuneups. The cheapest bike at all the nearby shops was $999 for entry level road bikes, sora equiped bikes. None of these shops sell used either, that was beyond my budget. Out of the 5 shops 3 also charge to fit and help you select the bike. One place was $70, the other two were under $20. That left, Walmart, target and the Internet. Craigslist only had kids bikes, and tricycles.
> 
> Those were the reasons why. One guy at a shop leveled with me and said, unless I had 1,200.00 I was pretty much priced out of road bikes at a shop, an that I should look at the hybrids for 399


Thankfully, none of this represents my experiences with bike shops. 

I don't know what brand/ model of Sora equipped bike(s) would go for ~$1k, because Specialized, Trek, Giant and many others sell theirs for around $750 (MSRP) and 10% discounts are common. 

And speaking of common, the above info is readily available on manufacturers websites, so someone offering that you'd need at least $1,200 for a road bike is obviously not credible. 

Lastly, no one I've ever heard of charges for assisting with bike selection or a standard fitting with a bike purchase.


----------



## sbwrites

A belated thanks for your response. I guess I wasn't clear in my post. I was looking for a drop bar road bike, and I must have gotten confused about including hybrids because all of this is so new to me. In answer to your question, I'm not yet sure what my intended usage will be. 

But, I took your advice, and went to my LBS, and tried a Trek Lexa S, a Specialized Dolce Elite Compact (2012), and a Felt ZW100. They were all more money than I had intended to spend, but I wanted to try them out to see if I felt they were worth going over my budget. Oddly enough, I wasn't sold on any of them. And despite what the LBS guy said about the components of the Specialized being so much better than the Felt, I liked the Felt best, the Specialized second best, and the Trek the least.

I planned on going to a few other local stores, when I finally found my size bike-- a 2011 51 cm Scattante W330-- for sale on Craigslist for $350. I spent hours researching the brand, the bike, and Performance bikes online, and there were so many naysayers about the brand and the store that I almost cancelled my appointment to ride it.

Lucky I didn't. Not only was it in pristine condition (the woman had only ridden it three times), but I just loved riding it. So...I am now the proud owner of a beautiful bike that is extraordinarily comfortable for me. It shifts well, brakes well, and other than the seat, I couldn't ask for anything more. 

Buying at this price enabled me to feel that I got a bang for my buck, that it's okay if I figure out my intended usage as I continue to ride, and that if I ultimately want a better bike with different components, I can still live with the resale value, whatever it is. In the meantime, I'm out riding every day, and having the time of my life...as I slowly get back in shape.


----------



## NJBiker72

sbwrites said:


> A belated thanks for your response. I guess I wasn't clear in my post. I was looking for a drop bar road bike, and I must have gotten confused about including hybrids because all of this is so new to me. In answer to your question, I'm not yet sure what my intended usage will be.
> 
> But, I took your advice, and went to my LBS, and tried a Trek Lexa S, a Specialized Dolce Elite Compact (2012), and a Felt ZW100. They were all more money than I had intended to spend, but I wanted to try them out to see if I felt they were worth going over my budget. Oddly enough, I wasn't sold on any of them. And despite what the LBS guy said about the components of the Specialized being so much better than the Felt, I liked the Felt best, the Specialized second best, and the Trek the least.
> 
> I planned on going to a few other local stores, when I finally found my size bike-- a 2011 51 cm Scattante W330-- for sale on Craigslist for $350. I spent hours researching the brand, the bike, and Performance bikes online, and there were so many naysayers about the brand and the store that I almost cancelled my appointment to ride it.
> 
> Lucky I didn't. Not only was it in pristine condition (the woman had only ridden it three times), but I just loved riding it. So...I am now the proud owner of a beautiful bike that is extraordinarily comfortable for me. It shifts well, brakes well, and other than the seat, I couldn't ask for anything more.
> 
> Buying at this price enabled me to feel that I got a bang for my buck, that it's okay if I figure out my intended usage as I continue to ride, and that if I ultimately want a better bike with different components, I can still live with the resale value, whatever it is. In the meantime, I'm out riding every day, and having the time of my life...as I slowly get back in shape.


That is great. And it does sound like a good deal. You May want to get fit eventually but not a bad way to start.


----------



## PJ352

sbwrites said:


> A belated thanks for your response. I guess I wasn't clear in my post. I was looking for a drop bar road bike...
> 
> Buying at this price enabled me to feel that I got a bang for my buck, that it's okay if I figure out my intended usage as I continue to ride, and that if I ultimately want a better bike with different components, I can still live with the resale value, whatever it is. In the meantime, I'm out riding every day, and having the time of my life...as I slowly get back in shape.


No worries. 

All's well that ends well (as they say). You're quite right that staying with your budget, buying a bike that you love to ride (and are riding every day) and sorting out your intended uses is a fine path to take. 

You may well find that how you're now riding IS your intended use, and this bike will stay with you for some time to come.

Welcome to the wonderful world of road riding. Glad to have you with us. :wink5:


----------



## ride247365

I've recently returned to riding after a 20 year hiatus. I have a Trek Shift 2 that I absolutely love and plan to keep. I've discovered over the last 3 months that I like riding both trails and roads but when riding roads I want a bike better suited to riding roads. I recently completed a 25 mile ride and have plans to do a century. All that said, I found an add for a 2010 Cannondale CAAD9 6 for $750. I looked at reviews and was able to determine the bike MSRPd for $1150. It's 58cm and I'm 6'. It has all the stock components except tires and appears to be in excellent shape. Is it worth the asking price?


----------



## PJ352

ride247365 said:


> I've recently returned to riding after a 20 year hiatus. I have a Trek Shift 2 that I absolutely love and plan to keep. I've discovered over the last 3 months that I like riding both trails and roads but when riding roads I want a bike better suited to riding roads. I recently completed a 25 mile ride and have plans to do a century. All that said, I found an add for a 2010 Cannondale CAAD9 6 for $750. I looked at reviews and was able to determine the bike MSRPd for $1150. It's 58cm and I'm 6'. It has all the stock components except tires and appears to be in excellent shape. Is it worth the asking price?


Used bike prices vary by region and are based as much on perception/ opinion as anything else, but (IMO) assuming very good mechanical condition and considering the bike is 3 model years old, around the 50% mark is fair - putting it in the $550-$600 range.

It's likely over priced at $750, but if the seller is flexible, that bridge between $750 "asking" and my estimate could be narrowed. Remember too, it's likely he didn't pay MSRP, so he's trying to minimize any loss. 

That aside, you have to test ride the bike to assess both fit and mechanical condition. Best to ask the seller to bring it to your LBS for both assessments and to get an opinion of the bikes value.


----------



## ride247365

PJ352,
Excellent advice. I was thinking it may be over priced but didn't know by how much. I love the idea of asking the seller to bring it to my lbs for fit/test/value estimate. Thanks


----------



## PJ352

ride247365 said:


> PJ352,
> Excellent advice. I was thinking it may be over priced but didn't know by how much. I love the idea of asking the seller to bring it to my lbs for fit/test/value estimate. Thanks


You're welcome. For whatever reason, IME most sellers overprice their bikes. 

Bringing the bike to your LBS for overall assessment may cost you a little, but it may also save you from making an expensive mistake.

Good luck and let us know if we can assist further.


----------



## Lmh617

Hello, brand new to the site and cycling as well. Need some advice on purchasing my first road bike. I haven't owned a bike since I was a teenager and that was a box bike so bare with me haha. 

Ive done a lot of research online and visited 3 LBS, 2 of which I'd do business with. After talking to the guys there and reading online, I've pretty much narrowed down to 2 bikes in my budget. I think they're really 2 different bikes so I'm turning here for help, advice etc. 

These are the 2 bikes I'm considering:

2013 fuji sportif 1.7
Fuji Bikes | ROAD | ENDURANCE | SPORTIF 1.7 C

and 

2012 torker inter urban 
TORKER BICYCLES / COMMUTE / 2012 INTERURBAN

so, how do I plan on riding? I plan to ride 2/3 times a week to start, probably 10-20 mile rides on paved roads. Not going to be doing MUcH city riding, more suburban roads but in populated areas. Again, I haven't ridden regularly in over 15 years. I've taken up spin classes 4 times a week for the last 2 months and I'm itching to get on a bike and do it for real. I rode a friend of a friend's fuji high end road bike a few weeks ago and fell in love. I understand these are both very entry level bikes. 

I just don't want to drop a ton of money to get started. I still need a helmet, want to get new clip less shoes and pedals, lock, air pump etc. I can't break the bank. If I love it, which I think I will, I can upgrade or get a new bike next year or 2 years down the road. 

I guess I'm wondering which would be the better choice for me and which bike is the better value and fit. I got a chance to ride the torker on Saturday at a lbs and liked it. It was a beautiful day and I was excited so I'm sure that played a role. I went to another lbs and the owner recommended the fuji. He only had 2 built and both were too small. He said he'd build my size (54) early this coming week and call me to come ride it. Thought that was cool. 

Oh, the fuji is $639 (highest end of budget) and the torker is $540(maybe a few bucks less says the manager). 

About me, I'm a 33 yr old that getting back in shape, I've lost 80+ lbs in the last 2.5 years running and cross training, and want a new outlet for exercise with less impact on my knees. No physical problems yet, but I've heard and read cycling is an excellent cross train for runners. 

Anyways sorry such a long write up, but I figured give as much info as possible. Thanks for reading this and hopefully giving your feedback.


----------



## PJ352

Lmh617 said:


> Hello, brand new to the site and cycling as well. Need some advice on purchasing my first road bike. I haven't owned a bike since I was a teenager and that was a box bike so bare with me haha.
> 
> Ive done a lot of research online and visited 3 LBS, 2 of which I'd do business with. After talking to the guys there and reading online, I've pretty much narrowed down to 2 bikes in my budget. I think they're really 2 different bikes so I'm turning here for help, advice etc.
> 
> These are the 2 bikes I'm considering:
> 
> 2013 fuji sportif 1.7
> Fuji Bikes | ROAD | ENDURANCE | SPORTIF 1.7 C
> 
> and
> 
> 2012 torker inter urban
> TORKER BICYCLES / COMMUTE / 2012 INTERURBAN
> 
> so, how do I plan on riding? I plan to ride 2/3 times a week to start, probably 10-20 mile rides on paved roads. Not going to be doing MUcH city riding, more suburban roads but in populated areas. Again, I haven't ridden regularly in over 15 years. I've taken up spin classes 4 times a week for the last 2 months and I'm itching to get on a bike and do it for real. I rode a friend of a friend's fuji high end road bike a few weeks ago and fell in love. I understand these are both very entry level bikes.
> 
> I just don't want to drop a ton of money to get started. I still need a helmet, want to get new clip less shoes and pedals, lock, air pump etc. I can't break the bank. If I love it, which I think I will, I can upgrade or get a new bike next year or 2 years down the road.
> 
> I guess I'm wondering which would be the better choice for me and which bike is the better value and fit. I got a chance to ride the torker on Saturday at a lbs and liked it. It was a beautiful day and I was excited so I'm sure that played a role. I went to another lbs and the owner recommended the fuji. He only had 2 built and both were too small. He said he'd build my size (54) early this coming week and call me to come ride it. Thought that was cool.
> 
> Oh, the fuji is $639 (highest end of budget) and the torker is $540(maybe a few bucks less says the manager).
> 
> About me, I'm a 33 yr old that getting back in shape, I've lost 80+ lbs in the last 2.5 years running and cross training, and want a new outlet for exercise with less impact on my knees. No physical problems yet, but I've heard and read cycling is an excellent cross train for runners.
> 
> Anyways sorry such a long write up, but I figured give as much info as possible. Thanks for reading this and hopefully giving your feedback.


Let me say upfront kudos to you for your very significant weight loss and determination to improve your fitness. Great job! :thumbsup:

I'd definitely take the offer from the LBS manager to ride the Fuji (the more test rides, the better). But ultimately, I'd suggest going with the bike that fits/ feels best (hopefully) at the shop you like best. This being your first bike, the support a good LBS provides matters more than the differences between the bikes.

Speaking of differences, the main ones (IMO) are that the Torker is steel (Chromoly), so with that comes a slight weight disadvantage. On the plus side, many prefer the ride of steel (over alu), and this is why I said the more bikes you test ride, the better. Helps to sort out your preferences and whittle the field - albeit of two bikes.

Two other specs to consider are that 1) the Torker will likely take slightly wider tires than the Fuji (28c is standard), and 2) it's 8 speed, versus the Fuji's 7. If ever the time comes to upgrade the drivetrain, it would be easier (and cheaper) to accomplish on the Torker. 

Hope this helps. If you think of any other questions, update and we'll advise from there.


----------



## jadebalam

*Another 1st timer*

First of all Kudos to all of you for your patience with us new riders. You are running an awesome board.

I am about to turn the double nickel, 55, and started commuting to work on a bike in order to reestablish a healthy life. Currently I make the round trip commute of 16.5 miles twice a week on a Trek 3500 series mountain bike, and have been going for longer rides on weekends. After pulling a 30 miler last weekend, I am bit with the idea of doing a 100. I am loving it, but the 37 lbs Trek is not what I need. So I want to get a road bike to start pushing myself farther.

After testing a number of bikes this weekend, it became pretty obvious to me that my initial plans to go for an entry level aluminium - carbon fork bike with a Shimano 2300 series would need to be revised. So now I am looking at the Sora/Tiagra set.

I am considering the *Felt z95*, but in my web shopping I have come across bikes like the

GT GTR Series 4
Gt GTR Series 3
Novara Divano
Novara Zealo
Diamondback Podium 2
and
Diamondback Podium 3

I have head that disc breaks may require more maintenance for a marginal gain.
I do not know how good the Diamondback fabrication is, and the same goes for GTs and Novaras

Any suggestions, observations, and tips to narrow down the choices would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers


----------



## PJ352

jadebalam said:


> ... I want to get a road bike to start pushing myself farther.
> 
> After testing a number of bikes this weekend, it became pretty obvious to me that my initial plans to go for an entry level aluminium - carbon fork bike with a Shimano 2300 series would need to be revised. So now I am looking at the Sora/Tiagra set.
> 
> I am considering the *Felt z95*, but in my web shopping I have come across bikes like the
> 
> GT GTR Series 4
> Gt GTR Series 3
> Novara Divano
> Novara Zealo
> Diamondback Podium 2
> and
> Diamondback Podium 3
> 
> I have head that disc breaks may require more maintenance for a marginal gain.
> I do not know how good the Diamondback fabrication is, and the same goes for GTs and Novaras
> 
> Any suggestions, observations, and tips to narrow down the choices would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Cheers


"Web shopping"/ researching specs is fine to a point, but as you discovered doing test rides, you learn as much about what you don't want as you do. It takes those test rides to find that out, not looking at spec sheets.

I don't know where the bikes listed are being sold, but this being your first road bike and because of the value added services LBS's provide, I suggest staying with them, even if it means traveling some distance to expand your brand/ model options.

Re: disc brakes, IMO, if you're staying to paved roads, I'd stay with dual pivots. They're lighter, tend to be cheaper and (with decent pads) pretty efficient. Additionally, discs add about 1/2 lb. and while I'm not a WW, all things considered (mainly, lack of payback), I see no reason to take that weight penalty. 

Conversely, if you see yourself venturing off road, they offer some benefits, but if that's the case, I'd say you should be looking at cyclocross bikes. 

HTH...


----------



## jadebalam

Totally on the using the LBS. Could not have learned as much in such a short period of time.

All these bikes are available through my local REI, and the Felt through an LBS a few blocks away from my office.

Any insight on the GT brand and the Diamondbacks?


----------



## PJ352

jadebalam said:


> Totally on the using the LBS. Could not have learned as much in such a short period of time.
> 
> All these bikes are available through my local REI, and the Felt through an LBS a few blocks away from my office.
> 
> Any insight on the GT brand and the Diamondbacks?


All the brands you mentioned are reputable and carry a decent warranty. It's more important to match the bike and geometry with your intended uses and anatomy.

I didn't look at all the models, but I believe some have a more relaxed geo than others. This generally means a more upright rider position and more predictable steering/ handling. 

Conversely, the Felt 'F' series is a race bike, so I suggest test riding both relaxed/ race, then deciding which you prefer. They also have a 'Z' series, if you're interested...


----------



## Craig in WI

Hi everyone! Craig from WI. I haven't ridden in years. I used to ride Trek rigid framed mtn bikes. Now I am going to focus on road/fitness and riding with my kids. I joined this forum to pic people's brains and see what others are riding and saying about various bikes. I was looking at KHS and Motobecane flat bar road bikes online. But, I read some bad reviews about mtbc. Within 30 seconds on this site, I saw several of you riding them. Can't be all bad.

I look forward to all of your insight and enthusiasm. Any advise is welcome. Thanks and keep riding.


----------



## PJ352

Craig in WI said:


> Hi everyone! Craig from WI. I haven't ridden in years. I used to ride Trek rigid framed mtn bikes. Now I am going to focus on road/fitness and riding with my kids. I joined this forum to pic people's brains and see what others are riding and saying about various bikes. I was looking at KHS and Motobecane flat bar road bikes online. But, I read some bad reviews about mtbc. Within 30 seconds on this site, I saw several of you riding them. Can't be all bad.
> 
> I look forward to all of your insight and enthusiasm. Any advise is welcome. Thanks and keep riding.


To start, I wouldn't get too hung up on brands/ models. Rather, pin down your intended uses (ex: paved surfaces/ fire trails/ gravel, casual rides/ fast training rides/ endurance/ charity rides), goals (short and long term), budget (bike and accessories) and go from there.

If you keep with shorter, more casual rides with no intention of getting into anything more serious, a flat bar hybrid will do you fine. Conversely, if that's a short term goal but you're looking for improved fitness/ longer rides in the future, then consider a drop bar bike. 

Either way, a good fit is going to go a long way in keeping you on the bike and riding, so be sure to take the steps necessary to get that right - usually, that means getting sizing/ fit assistance from a reputable LBS.


----------



## aaron83

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum and new to road biking. I ate it really hard on a mountain bike recently and decided it really isn't practical at all for fitness. And my butt ends up hurting and sore for a week so can't see myself going mt. riding everyday. Anyways, I have not a speck of clue of what to look for in a road bike. I decided if I could find a 2012 gt gtr series 2 at a clearance sale price I would but couldn't so I ended up getting a 2013 gt gtr series 5 at $519, msrp I believe was $780. The bike is on its way to the store from wearhouse and will be assembled this week. Any thoughts on this ride? Keep in mind that I have no idea what a high end road bike feels like and wasn't going to spoil myself to a better ride unless the price was right. The gtr comes with carbon forks while other competing entry level bike like specialized allez compact priced at $700 doesn't but has a slightly better components. Also the bike shop is going to fit me for seat height, fore, and aft. Is there anything else I should ask for? Like lifetime frame warranty and lifetime adjustments?


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> I ended up getting a 2013 gt gtr series 5.
> 
> Also the bike shop is going to fit me for seat height, fore, and aft. Is there anything else I should ask for? Like lifetime frame warranty and lifetime adjustments?


Nice first bike. I hope you love riding it! 

That's good that you're getting some assistance with fit. After the fitter has done the initial setup, go for a test ride to see how it feels. If something doesn't feel quite right, tell them so they can make the appropriate adjustments.

It may be necessary to return for tweaks to fit after you've logged some saddle time. Don't be afraid to have them make those adjustments as well. It's important for you to be comfortable on the bike.

Like Trek, Specialized, Giant and a few others. GT bikes have a limited lifetime warranty, but you could always ask the shop about tuneups/ adjustments. Better yet, see if they offer classes in basic maintenance and learn to do these things yourself. 

That said, if you learn nothing else, learn how to repair flats, because you're bound to get a few.


----------



## ventismith

I'm looking at buying my first road bike after a 5-10 year hiatus from any biking. I had looked at the Galaxy Avenue C on bikesdirect.com, but after reading forum posts from different sites it looks like the recommendation is to buy from a LBS for the first bike. I was, however, wanting to keep my budget at sub-$500 and all the local shops in my area that have a web presence are showing bikes in the $1k or more range.

I'd be mainly using it for commuting to and from work (roughly 7 miles each way) 4-5 days a week for the better part of the year (somewhere between 5-10k miles a year total). The terrain would be mostly flat paved surfaces and in a suburban environment.

Any advice as to what bike to get would be appreciated, thanks.


----------



## PJ352

ventismith said:


> I'm looking at buying my first road bike after a 5-10 year hiatus from any biking. I had looked at the Galaxy Avenue C on bikesdirect.com, but after reading forum posts from different sites it looks like the recommendation is to buy from a LBS for the first bike. I was, however, wanting to keep my budget at sub-$500 and all the local shops in my area that have a web presence are showing bikes in the $1k or more range.
> 
> I'd be mainly using it for commuting to and from work (roughly 7 miles each way) 4-5 days a week for the better part of the year (somewhere between 5-10k miles a year total). The terrain would be mostly flat paved surfaces and in a suburban environment.
> 
> Any advice as to what bike to get would be appreciated, thanks.


Because getting sizing, then fit right is so important, I agree that a first road bike should be purchased from a reputable LBS. 

I'm not sure why you're thinking a shop has to have web presence, but I suggest visiting some shops in your area, discussing your intended uses/ goals and budget, and let them suggest some options. 

Next, comes sizing/ fitting and test rides. Those rides (IMO/E) will help you determine your preferences and whittle the field from there. 

You will pay more at LBS's than online, but you'll get a bike delivered to you that's been assembled, tuned and fitted to you, versus getting a bike in a box that requires that you (or the LBS) do those things. And LBS's will charge for them, and rightfully so.

Hope this helps. If this plan faulters for some reason, update and we'll provide some alternatives.


----------



## ventismith

PJ352 said:


> I'm not sure why you're thinking a shop has to have web presence, but I suggest visiting some shops in your area, discussing your intended uses/ goals and budget, and let them suggest some options.


It doesn't "need" one, but it does help when trying to find out prices, etc without actually going to the shop. There's actually a few different shops in my area and was trying to narrow down my choices.


----------



## PJ352

ventismith said:


> It doesn't "need" one, but it does help when trying to find out prices, etc without actually going to the shop. There's actually a few different shops in my area and was trying to narrow down my choices.


Understood. Internet research/ shopping is fine.. to a point. But biking is 'hands on', and (like so many) it's a competitive market. That said, I think you're apt to learn more, quicker about the important aspects of bike buying by visiting the shops and talking to the folks there. 

The purchase is as much about service (pre/ post purchase) as it is about buying the bike. Ideally, you'll find your favorite bike at your favorite shop.


----------



## cyclintruckin

Sub $500.00 is tough, but with your stated main use maybe a flat bar commuter maybe your best choice. If the flat bar fits your criteria then you may want to check with "Dicks Sporting goods" the carry Diamond back bikes. You should be able to find one there in your budget and they have shop guy's that can handle basic problems.

I was in your situation a few years ago and I got lucky and found a LBS that actually didn't mind me only wanting to spend $400.00, There were a bunch that wouldn't even talk to me. If they act your $500.00 is not good enough for them, then don't let them have any money from you. I was in a unique situation that I travel all over the country and I shopped and called for months to various shops all over before finding 1 that was happy to get my $400.00. Shout out to Cycle Cave in Albuquerque, NM.


----------



## aaron83

@pj352,

Was wondering if I'm going feel like I'm dying on a hill climb with an 8 speed? Some road bikes like the Fuji Sportif 1.7 come with only 7 speed so I figure 8 speed can get me started. I'll be riding on a road that is 8miles of slight incline one way and very scenic route but there is a major road/street with its own bike lane that has many extreme ups and downs. Is it costly to upgrade to a 9 or 10 speed later on?

Thanks for the advice on classes. I ended up checking out YouTube and there are videos of tuning the brake and gears. I rather work on my own bike as I do with my car. I end up appreciating it more and feel one with it.

After the initial seat fitting, I might have to make the fine adjustments on my own. The bike shop isn't local. Hope YouTube or this forum can help on these fine adjustments.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> @pj352,
> 
> Was wondering if I'm going feel like I'm dying on a hill climb with an 8 speed? Some road bikes like the Fuji Sportif 1.7 come with only 7 speed so I figure 8 speed can get me started. I'll be riding on a road that is 8miles of slight incline one way and very scenic route but there is a major road/street with its own bike lane that has many extreme ups and downs. Is it costly to upgrade to a 9 or 10 speed later on?


IMO the _correct_ gear ranges for your fitness/ terrain matter more than the number of gears. What more gears generally gets you are smaller gaps/ closer ratios between cogs, but that won't mean much if the range of gears is wrong for you/ your terrain. 

That said, I'd suggest going with 8 speed over 7, because it's easier to upgrade from there and your staving off obsolescence. That's not to say 7 speed is out of the question for some on tight budgets, but 8 is a better starting point. 

Even at that, it is expensive to upgrade from 8 to 9 or 9 to 10 speeds, with the bulk of the expense being in the shifters. My opinion is that, drivetrains being wearable items, get some miles logged with the OE gear, then upgrade as things (primarily, shifters) wear. But again, the correct gearing matters more than sheer numbers.



aaron83 said:


> Thanks for the advice on classes. I ended up checking out YouTube and there are videos of tuning the brake and gears. I rather work on my own bike as I do with my car. I end up appreciating it more and feel one with it.


Back in the early 90's I had a bad experience with a shop doing a tune up on my bike. From then on, I decided I was going to do all my own wrenching. Still doing it to this day and have never regretted it. I agree that doing so gives that intimate knowledge of the bike. And that helps diagnose/ solve problems when they arise.



aaron83 said:


> After the initial seat fitting, I might have to make the fine adjustments on my own. The bike shop isn't local. Hope YouTube or this forum can help on these fine adjustments.


Try it and see how you fare, but I put bike fit in a whole different category versus wrenching. It takes a level of knowledge and finesse to make fine adjustments - and to know just what adjustment to make given your discomfort or goal. It doesn't hurt to try, but if you find yourself still hurting _after_ you try, first consider finding a reputable fitter, or post here and we'll do our best to advise.


----------



## aaron83

Just got my gt gtr series 5 and I ordered a medium frame and when I got home, found that its a small 53.5cm frame. I'm 5'9" ish and inseams are 32inch. The bike is very aggressive. Don't know if I should return it for a medium which was promised to me. I can stand over it with about an inch gap and that's how they said a bike should be measured. I might be just trippin and the bike is probably a perfect fit. The bike itself may be just a real aggressive frame and as lean forward the bike feels small. Any thoughts guys?


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> Just got my gt gtr series 5 and I ordered a medium frame and when I got home, found that its a small 53.5cm frame. I'm 5'9" ish and inseams are 32inch. The bike is very aggressive. Don't know if I should return it for a medium which was promised to me. I can stand over it with about an inch gap and that's how they said a bike should be measured. I might be just trippin and the bike is probably a perfect fit. The bike itself may be just a real aggressive frame and as lean forward the bike feels small. Any thoughts guys?


I have more questions than answers on this one. Did the LBS take any steps to determine what size GT you required? If so, why did you end up getting a small? The bottom line here is that the onus isn't on you to get sizing right, it's on the LBS. 

In this instance, I think there are indications that they aren't up to the task. For example, stand over tells next to nothing about how a bike will fit. Effective top tube length and head tube length do. 

I'll offer two things. First, you should return to the LBS and voice your concerns. Ask why you weren't provided a medium if that's what they said you required. If their answer indicates that a medium isn't available, be suspicious that they settled on the small to make the sale. 

Second, while it's not impossible for someone 5'9" to require an effective top tube of 535mm's, it is unusual. Problem is, you're losing 2cm's in heat tube length going with the small, so saddle to bar drop is likely more than you'd be comfortable with.

I'd go back and ask that they sort this sizing thing out. It's their job, and one of the reasons you patronize LBS's.


----------



## aaron83

I was told that it was a medium, got home, road on it for 5 miles or so felt small, was leaning over like one of those triathlon bikes, checked the frame and saw it was a size small. Now have to make another 90 minute round trip to the bike shop. I guess partly my fault for not double checking the frame myself, although I did ask if it was a medium and was told yes. After this transaction I don't think I'll go buy another bike from them ever even though their prices are low. If I could return, I would but they only offer exchange on used bikes even if its only 5 miles so. Next time I'll go to a local place and pay the premium for better service. Anyone reading this, watch out for City Grounds bike shop in Long Beach, CA.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> I was told that it was a medium, got home, road on it for 5 miles or so felt small, was leaning over like one of those triathlon bikes, checked the frame and saw it was a size small. Now have to make another 90 minute round trip to the bike shop. I guess partly my fault for not double checking the frame myself, although I did ask if it was a medium and was told yes. After this transaction I don't think I'll go buy another bike from them ever even though their prices are low. If I could return, I would but they only offer exchange on used bikes even if its only 5 miles so. Next time I'll go to a local place and pay the premium for better service. Anyone reading this, watch out for City Grounds bike shop in Long Beach, CA.


Sorry you had a bad experience. I still think the shop should deliver what was promised (a medium frame). First, ask politely and if they are unwilling to right their wrong, consider small claims court. Before doing so, make your intentions known. The shop may 'rethink' their position.

BTW, reputable shops won't let a customer leave their shop until everyone's satisfied a bike fits. They should at least resize you and determine your requirements.


----------



## aaron83

I'm currently on my way for the exchange. They're still insisting that the small frame size 53.5 is the right size but I'm going to show them gt's sizing chart which recommends someone 5'9" should start with a medium or maybe a large. Medium is 54.5 and large is 56.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> I'm currently on my way for the exchange. They're still insisting that the small frame size 53.5 is the right size but I'm going to show them gt's sizing chart which recommends someone 5'9" should start with a medium or maybe a large. Medium is 54.5 and large is 56.


Those sizing charts are generic, so don't really fit the needs of everyone. It's not out of the question that a 535mm ETT will suite your anatomy, but at 5' 9", you'd need to be proportioned long legs/ short torso for that to hold true. When determining sizing requirements proportions are more important than height or inseam alone - as is flexibility.

That aside, why (and when) did your requirements change from medium to small. I'd press them to see if the medium is still available. I'm thinking this bike is last years model and M isn't available.

No matter the size, press them to make this right and size/ fit you right.


----------



## aaron83

They didn't have the size. Was a computer error. I ended getting the series 4 which is 9 speed with sora derailleur. Don't know if that makes a big difference from the 8 speed 2300 derailleur?


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> They didn't have the size. Was a computer error. I ended getting the series 4 which is 9 speed with sora derailleur. Don't know if that makes a big difference from the 8 speed 2300 derailleur?


The new Sora 9 speed is a step up from 2300. 

I'm confused on your sizing comment, though.


----------



## aaron83

They didn't have medium size in series 5. I ended up paying more for the series 4 in medium.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> They didn't have medium size in series 5. I ended up paying more for the series 4 in medium.


I think you need to have a discussion with the shop manager/ owner and convey that you opted for the more expensive model to get a medium, were told that was going to be provided and it wasn't. 

This shop needs to step up and fix this in a manner you're comfortable with and (more importantly) getting you on a correctly sized bike - whatever it may be.


----------



## aaron83

I think I'm set. Just took the bike for a spin and feels roomier. The 535mm small frame felt so compact. The 545mm medium frame feels just right. Can't believe a 10mm difference in size has a such a huge impact on the rider's body. Its too bad its 97 degrees F outside right now. Want to go on a journey.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> I think I'm set. Just took the bike for a spin and feels roomier. The 535mm small frame felt so compact. The 545mm medium frame feels just right. Can't believe a 10mm difference in size has a such a huge impact on the rider's body. Its too bad its 97 degrees F outside right now. Want to go on a journey.


Glad you got this resolved. As far as fit is concerned, 1cm is huge, and even a few mm's can make a discernable difference. 

I'd ride at 97 degrees, but can understand why some wouldn't.


----------



## cyclintruckin

aaron83 said:


> Just got my gt gtr series 5 and I ordered a medium frame and when I got home, found that its a small 53.5cm frame. I'm 5'9" ish and inseams are 32inch. The bike is very aggressive. Don't know if I should return it for a medium which was promised to me. I can stand over it with about an inch gap and that's how they said a bike should be measured. * I might be just trippin and the bike is probably a perfect fit*. The bike itself may be just a real aggressive frame and as lean forward the bike feels small. Any thoughts guys?



I seriously hope like hell the shop did not say that! If so your a better man than I am, I would have thrown the bike thru their window lmao who's "trippin now?"


----------



## Julian97

*Noob Questions*

First of all I would just like to say hi and thanks. This thread has helped me a lot deciding on a few things. Just as a noob though, I would still like to clear a few things up.
I live in Melbourne, Victoria, in Australia and I know that this is a mostly US forum but it is too good to pass on and I believe it's all relevant.
As for LBS vs Online, there is no doubt in my mind as to going for an LBS since this is my first ever road bike. I am only 16 so I don't have much experience but I have a mountain bikeand enjoy mountain biking. I have also been on some short rides on my brothers old road bike that is "my size"ish but I can tell isn't right even to the point that I get pain, so I already know the importance of fit.
I would be using my road bike to ride to school 3 times a week (12 km round trip) and longer rides on the weekend with some friends, maybe some charity rides too. There aren't any massive hills on my way to school but there is the opportunity to go for hills if I want.
As for an LBS, luckily for me there is a massive riding culture where I love so I have plenty to choose from. As of yet I haven't visited any so far only gone through their websites. I was mainly looking at these brands: Trek, Merida, Jamis, Apollo and possibly Felt. As I am a student my budget is around $1000, bike and accessories (keeping in mind that because I'm in Australia prices are about 150-200 dollars more expensive  ) any advice on bikes in that range would be awesome. 

Just some other things:
Because I have so many bike shops I would like to narrow the field a bit. What sort of pointed questions should I ask, like about fitting and extras and stuff like that.
What sort of money do I need to save to get all the necessary accessories and what do you think are the major ones I need.
What is the difference between relaxed and race geos and which do you think would be more suited to me.
What crankset would I need and what is the difference between compact, triple and normal.
Other than that I think I am ok, next step is to go to some shops. Just again, thanks so much for keeping this thread alive, any and all help is welcome. TIA and sorry for the long winded post.​


----------



## PJ352

Julian97 said:


> Just some other things:
> Because I have so many bike shops I would like to narrow the field a bit. What sort of pointed questions should I ask, like about fitting and extras and stuff like that.
> What sort of money do I need to save to get all the necessary accessories and what do you think are the major ones I need.
> What is the difference between relaxed and race geos and which do you think would be more suited to me.
> What crankset would I need and what is the difference between compact, triple and normal.
> Other than that I think I am ok, next step is to go to some shops. Just again, thanks so much for keeping this thread alive, any and all help is welcome. TIA and sorry for the long winded post.


Because your first two paragraphs provided background info, your budget, info re: your terrain an intended uses, I've whittled your post down 'a bit', but will address those things along with the remainder.

Much of what you're asking will either be answered as you visit shops or test ride bikes. Since we don't know you and have never seen you on a bike, some, we can't answer. 

Re: the brands, except for the Apollo (which I'm unfamiliar with) all offer perfectly acceptable models in your price range. Trek has the 1 series, Felt the F (race) and Z (relaxed) series, Jamis has the Ventura line. Merida I only know from their association with Specialized, but they're a well respected company, so worth checking out, IMO.

Re: the Apollo's, be careful of their sizing. As an example, their XS is the rough equivalent of Trek and Specialized 52cm, which points up the importance of working with a reputable shop and test riding bikes of interest.

As to your questions.... as you visit the shops, ask them to describe the fit process. There should be some level of detail provided and an estimate of time. IMO, the more emphasis shops put on the importance of fit and test rides, the better.

For two reasons, I can't pin down an amount of money you'll need for essentials. First, there's a wide array of products offered in most any area, and second, your prices aren't going to be the same as my country (US). That said, if you're on a budget, go with a moderately priced helmet (or use your MTB helmet for now), stay with platform pedals and get a saddle bag, tube, patch kit, etc. and tools to repair flats. Cycling apparel is nice to have (especially padded shorts), so when you get a little extra money...

Simply put, race geo offers the rider a more aero position and slightly quicker steering/ handling. Relaxed, a more upright position and slightly slower (some say predictable) steering/ handling. Which you'd prefer will be determined by a number of factors, so use the test rides to answer the question.

Re: cranksets, generally speaking, triples are three rings up front (~50/40/30T), compacts are doubles (50/34T) and standards are also double, but with ~53/39T rings. Which is best for you will primarily be dictated by your fitness level and terrain. From what you've offered, I think a compact is a good compromise and will likely be the one offered on most of the models you'd consider.

HTH...


----------



## PJ352

@Julian97, another thing to consider is that at age 16 you're likely still growing. Might want to give some thought to lowering your budget or going with a good, used bike. Less of a loss if you have to resell in 1-2 years.


----------



## Zeet

Hi there Julian... Also, don't rule out hybrids! Hybrids are generally about a couple hundred dollars cheaper than road bikes with drop handlebars. My favorite hybrids, are in the Jamis Coda Series. A hybrid would be just perfect for your daily commute. OTOH, keeping your MTB and swapping out the tires with some slicks and perhaps a rigid fork might be another option too. Well, at least for a couple more years, until you're all grown up! :thumbsup:


----------



## Julian97

Thanks @PJ352 and @Zeet, both very helpful and fast replies. I'm sure many of my LBS's sell a decent range of used and hybrid bikes so next step is to go hunting in the next few weeks. I will post back my findings.
p.s I do love my MTB but as you said I am growing and its just getting too small


----------



## PJ352

Julian97 said:


> Thanks @PJ352 and @Zeet, both very helpful and fast replies. I'm sure many of my LBS's sell a decent range of used and hybrid bikes so next step is to go hunting in the next few weeks. I will post back my findings.
> p.s I do love my MTB but as you said I am growing and its just getting too small


Just keep in mind that hybrids are fairly limited in their scope. Meaning, their appeal diminishes when the rides lengthen in duration.

Drop bar bikes allow for varying hand positions, and when changing hand positions, pelvic angle also tilts slightly, all in all making a drop bar road bike more comfortable for the long haul. It's really their forte.

I'm not saying you shouldn't consider a decent, used hybrid for your commutes and short term, but long term, I'd suggest a drop bar bike.

Good luck in your travels/ test rides and by all means, update us on your progress.


----------



## Zeet

Additionally, for a greater number of hand positions on a hybrid, you can always install bar ends.
View attachment 283380


----------



## Zeet

To make a standard road bike more commuter friendly, you could just add cross lever brakes.
View attachment 283381


----------



## joshuao

Hi everyone, i plan on buying my first road bike, and my budget is around $500 max. ive checked around 10 lbs's around me and most of them dont have any road bikes around my price range. i've also looked all over craigslist and i will not be buying used, not even a question anymore. one lbs had a giant escape for $525 and that was the most reasonable priced bike. the other alternative is buying online and i've really considered it. ive checked several bikes on bikesdirect and was wondering if its really a good deal like they market it. and these were the two choices i picked. Save Up to 60% Off Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S and Road Bikes - Windsor Wellington 3.0 Web Sale Prices. i plan on riding 10-20+ miles a day, but i want to ride longer and see what the longest i can ride by the end of summer.


----------



## joshuao

Hi everyone, i plan on buying my first road bike, and my budget is around $500 max. ive checked around 10 lbs's around me and most of them dont have any road bikes around my price range. i've also looked all over craigslist and i will not be buying used, not even a question anymore. one lbs had a giant escape for $525 and that was the most reasonable priced bike. the other alternative is buying online and i've really considered it. ive checked several bikes on bikesdirect and was wondering if its really a good deal like they market it. and these were the two choices i picked. Save Up to 60% Off Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S and Road Bikes - Windsor Wellington 3.0 Web Sale Prices. i plan on riding 10-20+ miles a day, but i want to ride longer and see what the longest i can ride by the end of summer.


----------



## NJBiker72

joshuao said:


> Hi everyone, i plan on buying my first road bike, and my budget is around $500 max. ive checked around 10 lbs's around me and most of them dont have any road bikes around my price range. i've also looked all over craigslist and i will not be buying used, not even a question anymore. one lbs had a giant escape for $525 and that was the most reasonable priced bike. the other alternative is buying online and i've really considered it. ive checked several bikes on bikesdirect and was wondering if its really a good deal like they market it. and these were the two choices i picked. Save Up to 60% Off Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S and Road Bikes - Windsor Wellington 3.0 Web Sale Prices. i plan on riding 10-20+ miles a day, but i want to ride longer and see what the longest i can ride by the end of summer.


It is a good deal if you are mechanically inclined to build it yourself and you are lucky enough to buy one that fits you. 

Otherwise it is money down the toilet. 

But 500 is very low for a road bike so that might be your best bet. I bought a GMC Denali from Wally World when I was starting and broke. It worked. I rode it up to 75 miles on a ride that summer. Got laughed at a bit but trained hard enough that I finished the ride strobger than those guys that laughed at me. 

Now it sits on my trainer. Even though I know it does not fit and is a heavy piece of junk, it served a purpose and still does. 

Overall if you need a bike now and can't afford to get a good one, I might even suggest that ultra cheap route. Less money down the drain if it does not work.


----------



## Zeet

I say, remain patient and vigilant about monitoring your local Craigslist. Look for an old 80's or 90's chromoly steel road bike frame. Something should surface before August. OTOH, there is another online option, that you might also want to consider. The bike is called the Schwinn Slicker. Its frame is made of chromoly steel and its components are quite decent. It's a 9 speed (not a 27 speed, but a real 9 speed) with no front derailleur. However, it does have a 105 rear derailleur. IME, this bike is just perfect for your current cycling needs. Since you're buying online anyway, you might as well get the biggest bang for your buck....Right? The Schwinn Slicker can later be upgraded to a full 27 speed, if you like. However, most likely, this 9 speeder will hold its own, just like it is, for a very long time! www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product_10053_10052_560658_-1__202339


----------



## Zeet

joshuao said:


> Hi everyone, i plan on buying my first road bike, and my budget is around $500 max. ive checked around 10 lbs's around me and most of them dont have any road bikes around my price range. i've also looked all over craigslist and i will not be buying used, not even a question anymore. one lbs had a giant escape for $525 and that was the most reasonable priced bike. the other alternative is buying online and i've really considered it. ive checked several bikes on bikesdirect and was wondering if its really a good deal like they market it. and these were the two choices i picked. Save Up to 60% Off Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S and Road Bikes - Windsor Wellington 3.0 Web Sale Prices. i plan on riding 10-20+ miles a day, but i want to ride longer and see what the longest i can ride by the end of summer.


In addition to further considering your Craigslist options, I would also urge you to continue researching your hybrid options, as well. The Giant Escape 3 sells for just over $420. The Jamis Coda can be had for a little over $540. If you are going to seriously consider an online purchase, at least exhaust your sizing efforts, by calling the company's customer service department for advice about ordering the correct sized bike. Follow their instructions to the letter. Your bike will arrive 90% complete already. The following will instruct you concerning the completion of the build of your bike: www.bikesdirect.com/instructionhelp.htm


----------



## Zeet

Julian97 said:


> Thanks @PJ352 and @Zeet, both very helpful and fast replies. I'm sure many of my LBS's sell a decent range of used and hybrid bikes so next step is to go hunting in the next few weeks. I will post back my findings.
> p.s I do love my MTB but as you said I am growing and its just getting too small


I say, if your daily commute is less than 20 miles, a hybrid with barends should be just fine. Europeans do it all the time! OTOH, if you're more into speed, racing, and endurance cycling, then a road bike with drop handlebars is what you want. The longer the distance, the more you'll crave drop handlebars.


----------



## Julian97

Zeet said:


> I say, if your daily commute is less than 20 miles, a hybrid with barends should be just fine. Europeans do it all the time! OTOH, if you're more into speed, racing, and endurance cycling, then a road bike with drop handlebars is what you want. The longer the distance, the more you'll crave drop handlebars.


Yes, my commute is short but even from riding my brothers ill fitting drop bar, I know that I would love a drop bar more and consequently ride more often and for longer.


----------



## Zeet

*Beginners on a Budget*

After concluding that your budget is too limited for the standard new road bike, there are several alternative options available to many beginners that they either may, or may not be aware. The very first thing to consider is the fact that there are quite a few bicycle co-ops near large urban centers that many new cyclist can use as a base to get started. Some beginners without much financial means, do have access to either old bicycles, or old bicycle frames that will fit them, if repaired or rebuilt. The co-ops will definitely assist any cyclist with the rebuilding of any bike (if at all possible). Also, there are a few brand new hybrids available that cost less than $400 when purchased at a local bike shop. For some reason, when a bike has drop handlebars, the price of the bike usually increases by over $150. Hybrids, make great commuters, due to the fact that most require that the cyclist sit upright, where traffic can be better viewed. Therefore, if your commute is twenty miles or less, a hybrid should be just fine. Also, most hybrids also come with rack and fender mounts, whereas most road bikes don't. Next, each cyclist has to evaluate his or her needs as a cyclist. I mean actually consider the purpose of your bike. Determine where your bike will primarily be used and upon what type of terrain. You don't want to buy a road bike, if you live within a mountainous region with only a few paved roads. OTOH, it really wouldn't be wise to purchase a fully suspended MTB, if you live in a flat city where all the streets are paved and properly maintained. In this case, a single speed will be just perfect for a beginner cyclist on a budget. "Why?", you say! Because single speeds generally cost less, require less maintenance, and are very efficient machines on flat terrains. I think most college students on a budget would fare quite well on a single speed. Well, that is, unless they attend the University of San Francisco!  You don't want to cycle on a single speed where there are hills!


----------



## aaron83

@Julian97,

I was in your situation not too long ago. I considered craigslist, used from lbs, and even 2012 models but came to the same conclusion, just couldn't find a bike that fit. I did however found a 2013 model GT GTR Series 5 that fit but due to some circumstances and I didn't want to wait, got a 2013 GT GTR Series 4 instead. I also did consider buying online and have my lbs build it for me but that was for a different model series 2 which still would've costed me 900. I'm pretty sure if you wait a month or so, you'll find that 2013 models going on sale at a decent price. I also did research on brands of entry level road bikes and they all seem to come with entry level components so. One thing that GT's entry bike msrp 780 offered was carbon forks vs what I wanted was Speciallized Allez Compact Msrp 780 which came with alluminum forks. Hope this helps. The gt gtr series 5 can be bought for 520 @ citygrounds.com


----------



## Julian97

Thanks for the advice @aaron83 I guess the waiting game begins then. Lucky I am in no hurry!


----------



## aaron83

@all,

Seems like entry level road bikes aren't smooth at shifting because all the components are from different brands. Any thoughts on this? And dang, went on ride shooting for 15-20 miles round trip but had to turn around only after about 5 miles making it only about 10 miles round trip because it was pretty windy and my brake started rubbing against the rims. The bike shop that put together my bike did a horrible job, I think.


----------



## PJ352

aaron83 said:


> @all,
> 
> Seems like entry level road bikes aren't smooth at shifting because all the components are from different brands. Any thoughts on this? And dang, went on ride shooting for 15-20 miles round trip but had to turn around only after about 5 miles making it only about 10 miles round trip because it was pretty windy and my brake started rubbing against the rims. The bike shop that put together my bike did a horrible job, I think.


It's pretty much a given that (similar to most any product) some components perform better than others. That said, it's entirely possible that your bike hasn't been set up, tuned and delivered in optimal condition.

I'd cut your LBS some slack on the brake caliper going off center, though. It's a very easy fix, and something you can easily do; firmly grip the brake and recenter the pads. 

Also, depending on how many miles you've logged, new bikes do need slight adjustments, usually to the front/ rear derailleur cable tension and wheels trued. Don't be bashful about having your LBS perform these services, ideally showing you so you can do them yourself.


----------



## jread2006

Hello,
I am new to this forum, and cycling in general. To be honest, I know diddly squat about cycling, hence why I just joined. I was wondering though, and this may come off as a dumb question but... I just saw a bike on another one of the threads a bit ago - a Specialized Secteur Elite Compact - and I fell in love with the look of it. Now, I know looks aren't everything when it comes to a bike. Could someone give me some feedback on that particular one? I seen online that it goes for around $1100 brand new. Is that a good price? One of my friends asked me to look into the components it uses. I don't really understand what that means... Help!


----------



## Zeet

jread2006 said:


> Hello,
> I am new to this forum, and cycling in general. To be honest, I know diddly squat about cycling, hence why I just joined. I was wondering though, and this may come off as a dumb question but... I just saw a bike on another one of the threads a bit ago - a Specialized Secteur Elite Compact - and I fell in love with the look of it. Now, I know looks aren't everything when it comes to a bike. Could someone give me some feedback on that particular one? I seen online that it goes for around $1100 brand new. Is that a good price? One of my friends asked me to look into the components it uses. I don't really understand what that means... Help!


The Secteur Elite Compact is a great bike! That's especially so at the entry level point. Everyone should be so lucky...It has a Tiagra gruppo, which is above fair in my opinion. The MSRP is $1200. Therefore, $100 off in the middle of the summer, at the height of cycling season, is more than fair, insofar as I'm concerned.


----------



## PJ352

jread2006 said:


> Hello,
> I am new to this forum, and cycling in general. To be honest, I know diddly squat about cycling, hence why I just joined. I was wondering though, and this may come off as a dumb question but... I just saw a bike on another one of the threads a bit ago - a Specialized Secteur Elite Compact - and I fell in love with the look of it. Now, I know looks aren't everything when it comes to a bike. Could someone give me some feedback on that particular one? I seen online that it goes for around $1100 brand new. Is that a good price? One of my friends asked me to look into the components it uses. I don't really understand what that means... Help!


To learn more from actual owners, view the thread at the link below. If you have any questions, since they're likely related to the Secteur, posting in that forum may be better.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/specialized/no-love-secteur-i-love-my-new-2011-comp-232710.html


----------



## jread2006

Ok, thanks for your help!


----------



## Zeet

jread2006 said:


> Ok, thanks for your help!


There is another road bike that is near the same current price point, as the Secteur. I would urge you to take a look a the GT Corsa 1.0. I really do like it! I also like the award-winning Giant Defy 2, as well...Ride many bikes! Test ride as many as you can, before you pull the trigger. It would be a shame to buy a bike that's less comfortable than another, that just might cost even less cash.


----------



## aavlee

Having a hard time deciding between the 2.

Argon 18 Krytpon. Full 105 build including cassette and crankset. Carbon seat post. Better wheels that still need upgrading. (Mavic Aksium) ~1200g frame (Medium Frame). $2600

Norco Tactic 3. 105 with fsa crankset and tiagra cassette. Aluminium seat post. Internal cables. Crappier wheels that need upgrading. (Shimano WH-R501-30-A) ~950g frame. $2100

Both bikes ride pretty similar during the test rides. The Krypton felt like it shifted a lot smoother, not sure if its because of the 105 crankset/cassette/chain or because it was just tuned better. Power transfer also felt better (more surge) on the Krypton but that might also be because it was the first full carbon bike I've tried. I test drove size 48 (XS frame) in the Krypton which felt a bit better than the Tactic 51. Both shops said I could I more or less could bit both sizes.

The main advantage the Tactic has is the price point and value. Lighter frame, small things like internal cables. I could save the $500 dollars for the wheel upgrade in the future. That being said I think because of the full 105 build on the Krypton, after a wheel upgrade I would be set for a longer time.

The service was also much better at the Krypton shop, I feel much more confident in their fitting and service on the bike which accounts for a small amount.

I don't have the weight of the full Krypton bike, but the Tactic with my pedals came to 19.5 pounds. I would imagine the Krypton is pretty close though.

Any ideas?


----------



## PJ352

aavlee said:


> Having a hard time deciding between the 2.
> 
> Argon 18 Krytpon. Full 105 build including cassette and crankset. Carbon seat post. Better wheels that still need upgrading. (Mavic Aksium) ~1200g frame (Medium Frame). $2600
> 
> Norco Tactic 3. 105 with fsa crankset and tiagra cassette. Aluminium seat post. Internal cables. Crappier wheels that need upgrading. (Shimano WH-R501-30-A) ~950g frame. $2100
> 
> Both bikes ride pretty similar during the test rides. The Krypton felt like it shifted a lot smoother, not sure if its because of the 105 crankset/cassette/chain or because it was just tuned better. Power transfer also felt better (more surge) on the Krypton but that might also be because it was the first full carbon bike I've tried. I test drove size 48 (XS frame) in the Krypton which felt a bit better than the Tactic 51. Both shops said I could I more or less could bit both sizes.
> 
> The main advantage the Tactic has is the price point and value. Lighter frame, small things like internal cables. I could save the $500 dollars for the wheel upgrade in the future. That being said I think because of the full 105 build on the Krypton, after a wheel upgrade I would be set for a longer time.
> 
> The service was also much better at the Krypton shop, I feel much more confident in their fitting and service on the bike which accounts for a small amount.
> 
> I don't have the weight of the full Krypton bike, but the Tactic with my pedals came to 19.5 pounds. I would imagine the Krypton is pretty close though.
> 
> Any ideas?


Don't get too hung up on the minutia of the specs. Most any OE wheelsets are heavy and not on a par with the quality of the frameset. Same goes for most cranksets. 

Re: weight differences, 250g's (or so) is negligible and won't make a difference performance-wise. Better to focus on how the bikes fit/ feel, ride and handle. 

Your confidence (or lack thereof) in the shops is going to matter long term, so pay heed to what your gut is telling you.

Re: shifting quality, there could be a number of reasons for variations. The biggest factor is generally the quality of the installation and setup, but if you decide on a bike that doesn't shift all that well, make your concerns known and ask that the bike be tuned _prior to_ your committing to the purchase. 

You don't want to make a purchase based on a promise that the bike will be tuned after the sale.


----------



## lockpick

Hola! I need a few suggestions on what bike to buy. If you cannot be bothered to read much, skip to technical part of my wishes, but if you want to know details read the next part as well!

~~ About ~~
I'm not new to biking, but I've ridden hardtails all my life. My average is about 3k-5k kms per year, a big part of it being one long trip I make with my sleek hybrid bike every year for a couple of weeks. Those of you who have done some heavy milage with mountain bikes know that kind of distance per year is not the easiest! Anyway, I've decided to get myself a slightly-above-entry-level racing bike. I've read a good amount of reviews and browsed this forum for a bit, but the market is so swarmed I'm really confused what to buy. I respect every opinion!
~~

~~Looking for (Techs):~~
Budget: 900-1200 EUR (with deviations if I fall in love 
Gear: Sora - Tiagra (I've read a lot and most people claim there is little difference, however local forums say you should buy nothing less than 105)
Weight: not over 9kg (this is quite important for me. I will be climbing_ a lot_.)
Frame: any, please give me your opinions for carbon at this price range
Frame size: 63 (62-64) - I am 193 cm tall, 6' 3.7"
Brand: even though I trust known brands more, I can be convinced into unknown as well

I have absolutely *no* need to wear brands or good gear to show my status (NONE!); I want nothing posh and have no reservations in buying anything.

All-in-all I want a light bike with less emphasis on "aggressiveness", and I can probably endure something that is "not so comfortable".


----------



## Zeet

lockpick said:


> Hola! I need a few suggestions on what bike to buy. If you cannot be bothered to read much, skip to technical part of my wishes, but if you want to know details read the next part as well!
> 
> ~~ About ~~
> I'm not new to biking, but I've ridden hardtails all my life. My average is about 3k-5k kms per year, a big part of it being one long trip I make with my sleek hybrid bike every year for a couple of weeks. Those of you who have done some heavy milage with mountain bikes know that kind of distance per year is not the easiest! Anyway, I've decided to get myself a slightly-above-entry-level racing bike. I've read a good amount of reviews and browsed this forum for a bit, but the market is so swarmed I'm really confused what to buy. I respect every opinion!
> ~~
> 
> ~~Looking for (Techs):~~
> Budget: 900-1200 EUR (with deviations if I fall in love
> Gear: Sora - Tiagra (I've read a lot and most people claim there is little difference, however local forums say you should buy nothing less than 105)
> Weight: not over 9kg (this is quite important for me. I will be climbing_ a lot_.)
> Frame: any, please give me your opinions for carbon at this price range
> Frame size: 63 (62-64) - I am 193 cm tall, 6' 3.7"
> Brand: even though I trust known brands more, I can be convinced into unknown as well
> 
> I have absolutely *no* need to wear brands or good gear to show my status (NONE!); I want nothing posh and have no reservations in buying anything.
> 
> All-in-all I want a light bike with less emphasis on "aggressiveness", and I can probably endure something that is "not so comfortable".


My first choice would be the GT Corsa 1.0. However, I would also seriously recommend the Giant Defy Series. It would appear that your interest would be focused primarily upon either the Defy 1 or the Defy 2.


----------



## PJ352

lockpick said:


> Hola! I need a few suggestions on what bike to buy. If you cannot be bothered to read much, skip to technical part of my wishes, but if you want to know details read the next part as well!
> 
> ~~ About ~~
> I'm not new to biking, but I've ridden hardtails all my life. My average is about 3k-5k kms per year, a big part of it being one long trip I make with my sleek hybrid bike every year for a couple of weeks. Those of you who have done some heavy milage with mountain bikes know that kind of distance per year is not the easiest! Anyway, I've decided to get myself a slightly-above-entry-level racing bike. I've read a good amount of reviews and browsed this forum for a bit, but the market is so swarmed I'm really confused what to buy. I respect every opinion!
> ~~
> 
> ~~Looking for (Techs):~~
> Budget: 900-1200 EUR (with deviations if I fall in love
> Gear: Sora - Tiagra (I've read a lot and most people claim there is little difference, however local forums say you should buy nothing less than 105)
> Weight: not over 9kg (this is quite important for me. I will be climbing_ a lot_.)
> Frame: any, please give me your opinions for carbon at this price range
> Frame size: 63 (62-64) - I am 193 cm tall, 6' 3.7"
> Brand: even though I trust known brands more, I can be convinced into unknown as well
> 
> I have absolutely *no* need to wear brands or good gear to show my status (NONE!); I want nothing posh and have no reservations in buying anything.
> 
> All-in-all I want a light bike with less emphasis on "aggressiveness", and I can probably endure something that is "not so comfortable".


Unless my math skills are off, I see a couple of potential problems with your budget versus bike specs - mainly, weight and frame material.

In the (roughly) 1,500 USD range, you can get a very nice entry level bike, but it won't be CF nor will it weigh under 20 lbs. At least not purchasing from LBS's similar to what are here in the US. 

But honestly, I don't think either are biggies. Nothing at all wrong with alu or steel frames/ CF forks, with alu (on average) weighing ~22 lbs and steel a little more. IME, a couple of pounds makes little to no difference, performance-wise. Mine is the same on both my 16.4 and 19.2 lb. bikes.

Re: groupsets, I'll disagree that 9 speed Sora (3500) and Tiagra (4600) are similar. Sora is a very acceptable lower end groupset that will suite most rec riders needs, but Tiagra adds a cog (10 speed) and a level of refinement (actually, on a par with Shimano's previous 105 version). I don't see a good reason for most to go above Tiagra. More important to get gearing right, given a riders fitness level/ terrain.


----------



## NJBiker72

lockpick said:


> Hola! I need a few suggestions on what bike to buy. If you cannot be bothered to read much, skip to technical part of my wishes, but if you want to know details read the next part as well!
> 
> ~~ About ~~
> I'm not new to biking, but I've ridden hardtails all my life. My average is about 3k-5k kms per year, a big part of it being one long trip I make with my sleek hybrid bike every year for a couple of weeks. Those of you who have done some heavy milage with mountain bikes know that kind of distance per year is not the easiest! Anyway, I've decided to get myself a slightly-above-entry-level racing bike. I've read a good amount of reviews and browsed this forum for a bit, but the market is so swarmed I'm really confused what to buy. I respect every opinion!
> ~~
> 
> ~~Looking for (Techs):~~
> Budget: 900-1200 EUR (with deviations if I fall in love
> Gear: Sora - Tiagra (I've read a lot and most people claim there is little difference, however local forums say you should buy nothing less than 105)
> Weight: not over 9kg (this is quite important for me. I will be climbing_ a lot_.)
> Frame: any, please give me your opinions for carbon at this price range
> Frame size: 63 (62-64) - I am 193 cm tall, 6' 3.7"
> Brand: even though I trust known brands more, I can be convinced into unknown as well
> 
> I have absolutely *no* need to wear brands or good gear to show my status (NONE!); I want nothing posh and have no reservations in buying anything.
> 
> All-in-all I want a light bike with less emphasis on "aggressiveness", and I can probably endure something that is "not so comfortable".


You have some interesting requirements. As has been said everywhere here, test test test. 

What is confusing is that you state you do not care if it is aggressive or comfortable. If you wanted one or the other I would say look to either a race bike geo (Tarmac) or relaxed (Roubaix) in ome line of bikes. 

You also want lightweight entry level carbon. Entry level carbon tends to be slightly heavier. 

That said if I was looking for what yyou described I might look at a Trek Madone. I personally found their lower end Madone to be not too aggressive but not too relaxed. Not what I wanted but seemed like a great all around bike. 

Also if you want entry level components and climb a lot I think Apex is a great groupset. But again just my opinion.


----------



## aaron83

@lockpick,

If I were in your situation, I would spend the extra cash and get that bike. You know which bike I'm talking about. The one that you want, carbon fiber w/ full Shimano 105 groupset. With the amount of experience you've got and riding you'll do in a year, I wouldn't settle for anything less. Entry level bikes are for someone like me, the last time I bought a bike was 20 years ago and now I'm 29 trying recover my health. FYI, I got myself a GT GTR series 4. I love it. My first road racing bike and I was not going spoil myself to all the bells and whistles when I wasn't sure how committed I was going to be to the sport.


----------



## lockpick

okay, thanks guys, I will consider your advice.


----------



## DakotaEvelyn

This is a good place for a Beginner,thank you.


----------



## expressfaith

I am writing my experience here in hope that it might help someone new.

I am not a pro, please correct me if I am wrong. I just started Road Bike few months back (currently do 50 miles avg per week) and previously rode a cheap Mongoose bike (cheap components sucked big time in my experience).

After lot of research and talking to some of my friend (experience cyclist), came to a conclusion of not getting tempted for all "carbon" frame and fancy pro level stuff. I focused on the components (DERAILLEURS, Crankshaft, brakes and SHIFT LEVERS). Try to go as best possible with Shimano or SRAM components for your budget.

Bike Size plays a huge role. - 54 cm frame fits perfect for a person like me 5' 8", when compared to 58 cm frame, reason why I stress this is. you might be "tempted" to buy off of craigslist or ebay - you will have to know what size you are dealing with and what components that come with it.

Long story short, I ride this Specialize Allez Apex Compact and loving it. Specialized Bicycle Components


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Hello all. 

Looking at buying my first road bike. I'm wanting to get a road bike because personally I don't like to run and would rather bike for my cardio. I'd probably put about 20 miles a week to start on it then bump up my rides as I got accustom to it.

The other day I went to a LBS shop that was a Trek dealer. The guy there sized me at a 54cm bike and showed me a Trek Domane for about $1,300 I believe and then a Trek 1.2 for I think $999? Don't quote me on the prices.

Now being that it is my first bike I really don't want to spend that much for an entry/beginner bike just in case I don't enjoy biking as much as I think I will.

Is there any others you guys would recommend or a different approach to take? I've read about buying used and if you don't know much about bikes (like me) it could be a bad decision. 

The Domane was beautiful though just a bit pricy imo. I've been researching, browsing and searching the internet and have come across a bunch of bikes that I like. I'd be riding on actual roads maybe a paved bike path around reservior once in a blue moon.

Any input would be great. Thanks in advance.


----------



## aaron83

Roachclass

Check out the gt gtr 5. I too was in the same predicament. Didn't want to spend over a grand on a road bike when I wasn't sure if I would be dedicated. Also as a beginner I wasn't going to spoil myself to all that good stuff; carbon fiber frame, etc. The gtr 2013 are in sale. Ally frame w/ carbon fork. I also read on the www that gt is probably the most under rated in raod bikes and better known for their BMX and mountain bikes.


----------



## NJBiker72

ROACHCLASS said:


> Hello all.
> 
> Looking at buying my first road bike. I'm wanting to get a road bike because personally I don't like to run and would rather bike for my cardio. I'd probably put about 20 miles a week to start on it then bump up my rides as I got accustom to it.
> 
> The other day I went to a LBS shop that was a Trek dealer. The guy there sized me at a 54cm bike and showed me a Trek Domane for about $1,300 I believe and then a Trek 1.2 for I think $999? Don't quote me on the prices.
> 
> Now being that it is my first bike I really don't want to spend that much for an entry/beginner bike just in case I don't enjoy biking as much as I think I will.
> 
> Is there any others you guys would recommend or a different approach to take? I've read about buying used and if you don't know much about bikes (like me) it could be a bad decision.
> 
> The Domane was beautiful though just a bit pricy imo. I've been researching, browsing and searching the internet and have come across a bunch of bikes that I like. I'd be riding on actual roads maybe a paved bike path around reservior once in a blue moon.
> 
> Any input would be great. Thanks in advance.


Those should have been two good contrasts. Which felt better? Shop around. This is a goood time to get sales on 2013 bikes.


----------



## PJ352

ROACHCLASS said:


> Hello all.
> 
> Looking at buying my first road bike. I'm wanting to get a road bike because personally I don't like to run and would rather bike for my cardio. I'd probably put about 20 miles a week to start on it then bump up my rides as I got accustom to it.
> 
> The other day I went to a LBS shop that was a Trek dealer. The guy there sized me at a 54cm bike and showed me a Trek Domane for about $1,300 I believe and then a Trek 1.2 for I think $999? Don't quote me on the prices.
> 
> Now being that it is my first bike I really don't want to spend that much for an entry/beginner bike just in case I don't enjoy biking as much as I think I will.
> 
> Is there any others you guys would recommend or a different approach to take? I've read about buying used and if you don't know much about bikes (like me) it could be a bad decision.
> 
> The Domane was beautiful though just a bit pricy imo. I've been researching, browsing and searching the internet and have come across a bunch of bikes that I like. I'd be riding on actual roads maybe a paved bike path around reservior once in a blue moon.
> 
> Any input would be great. Thanks in advance.


For a variety of reasons, I think working with a reputable LBS for a first bike purchase is the best option. The Trek 1.2 retails for just over $900, so with a (pretty standard) 10% discount, you should be able to get it for around $800. But if that's above your comfort level, ask about used bikes (some LBS's carry them), visit other shops and look at some hybrids. 

The advantage of hybrids is they cost less, are somewhat easier to fit, but the downside is they are more limited in use than drop bar road bikes - primarily because of the lack of changeable hand positions. If you stay with your 20 miles a week, a hybrid will do you fine, but if you grow with the sport, you'll soon outgrown it.

Problem with buying used from a private seller are 1) most bikes are over priced, 2) you're on your own with sizing/ fit and mechanical assessment (or pay an LBS to assist). Also, you lose a warranty. 

As with anything, there are compromises, but I think if you branch out to different brands and shop around some more, you'll find a new, entry level bike that won't break the bank. Besides Trek, Specialized, Giant, Jamis (and many more) offer them....


----------



## ROACHCLASS

PJ352 said:


> For a variety of reasons, I think working with a reputable LBS for a first bike purchase is the best option. The Trek 1.2 retails for just over $900, so with a (pretty standard) 10% discount, you should be able to get it for around $800. But if that's above your comfort level, ask about used bikes (some LBS's carry them), visit other shops and look at some hybrids.
> 
> The advantage of hybrids is they cost less, are somewhat easier to fit, but the downside is they are more limited in use than drop bar road bikes - primarily because of the lack of changeable hand positions. If you stay with your 20 miles a week, a hybrid will do you fine, but if you grow with the sport, you'll soon outgrown it.
> 
> Problem with buying used from a private seller are 1) most bikes are over priced, 2) you're on your own with sizing/ fit and mechanical assessment (or pay an LBS to assist). Also, you lose a warranty.
> 
> As with anything, there are compromises, but I think if you branch out to different brands and shop around some more, you'll find a new, entry level bike that won't break the bank. Besides Trek, Specialized, Giant, Jamis (and many more) offer them....


Well I think 20 miles a week is just to start then I'll up the bar a little each week or whatever I feel comfortable at.

Is there any other bikes you would recommend? Minus the two I mentioned.

Thanks for the post, good bit of info.

Edit: This is the shop I went to..

BEACON Cycling & Fitness Bike Shops in Northfield & Freehold,NJ featuring TREK Gary Fisher Electra Raleigh Mirra Haro Bicycles

Noticed the Raleighs seem decently priced. What about one of them for a beginner?

I know there are other brands I want something that is middle of the pack to start off. Not top of the line but not something "just to get by" with.


----------



## Zeet

Checkout the Scott Speedster 40, the Giant Defy 5, and the Jamis Satellite Sport.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Thanks for the replies guys. Checked out the Jamis Satellite Sport, 2013 GTR 5, Giant Defy 5, and Scott Speedster and all seem more in my price range.

Out of those what would be the best investment? Or would it be better to spend the extra $200-$300 and get a Felt, Cannondale or Trek?

Plus, I have to find something that applies to my eye..because If I don't like the way it looks, I won't want to ride it. Looking for something mostly all black or black and another color like white/gray etc.


----------



## PJ352

ROACHCLASS said:


> Thanks for the replies guys. Checked out the Jamis Satellite Sport, 2013 GTR 5, Giant Defy 5, and Scott Speedster and all seem more in my price range.
> 
> Out of those *what would be the best investment?* Or would it be better to spend the extra $200-$300 and get a Felt, Cannondale or Trek?


The best investment is the bike that fits and feels the best to you, because that's the one you'll most likely ride more.

The best way to determine just which bike that is, is to visit some shops, get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest and head out on test rides. Get out on the roads, because parking lot rides tell you little about how bikes ride and handle.

Really, this is a very competitive market, so differences in specs between brands will be minor. Besides, all the brands mentioned are high quality and offer strong warranties.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

PJ352 said:


> The best investment is the bike that fits and feels the best to you, because that's the one you'll most likely ride more.
> 
> The best way to determine just which bike that is, is to visit some shops, get sized/ fitted to bikes of interest and head out on test rides. Get out on the roads, because parking lot rides tell you little about how bikes ride and handle.
> 
> Really, this is a very competitive market, so differences in specs between brands will be minor. Besides, all the brands mentioned are high quality and offer strong warranties.


Understood. I'm just trying to figure out which few bikes I should lean towards more then go out and test ride them and see which feels the best to be the deciding factor.


----------



## Zeet

ROACHCLASS said:


> Thanks for the replies guys. Checked out the Jamis Satellite Sport, 2013 GTR 5, Giant Defy 5, and Scott Speedster and all seem more in my price range.
> 
> Out of those what would be the best investment? Or would it be better to spend the extra $200-$300 and get a Felt, Cannondale or Trek?
> 
> Plus, I have to find something that applies to my eye..because If I don't like the way it looks, I won't want to ride it. Looking for something mostly all black or black and another color like white/gray etc.


At first, just go to all of the local bike shops that you can and test ride as many bikes that you can, within your price range. Do this for just about two or three weeks, especially on the weekends. Take notes, as to which bikes feel the best when ridden. Write down the name of the model, the brand name, the color, and the year, along with the notes on the ride. Ask to test ride endurance styled road bikes in your size. Once you've settled on the bike choices that you've selected based upon comfort level, then choose the one that appeals to you the most, visually speaking.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Thank you for all your input guys. Going to another LBS today to check out some other bikes mentioned here.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Think I'm going with a 2013 Trek 1.2. I can get it for about $800 with fitting session included all from LBS. I can get it for that price because the newer models come in and the 2013s are discounted. 

Sound like a good price?


----------



## PJ352

ROACHCLASS said:


> Think I'm going with a 2013 Trek 1.2. I can get it for about $800 with fitting session included all from LBS. I can get it for that price because the newer models come in and the 2013s are discounted.
> 
> Sound like a good price?


That's a shade under 15% off. A good price by most any measure. 

Just make sure the bike suites your intended uses, fits you well and you like the ride/ handling.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Picking up/getting fitted on my 2013 Trek 1.2 tomorrow for $829 :thumbsup:


----------



## PJ352

ROACHCLASS said:


> Picking up/getting fitted on my 2013 Trek 1.2 tomorrow for $829 :thumbsup:


Excellent.. congrats!! Post some pics when you get a chance.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Took it for a quick spin around the block, love it. Can't wait to take an actual ride..F having work at 3 :mad2:


----------



## PJ352

Nice! Enjoy! :thumbsup:


----------



## PJ352

Laura669 said:


> Go to a bike shop & figure out what size you need & leave.


For more than one reason, bad advice. Since there are no standards for measuring to determine frame size, your method could well mislead. 

And ironically, if everyone did the same, there'd be no shops left. Then folks would be complaining when they needed support and found none.


----------



## onemoreshot

This is my first post. I have been reviewing threads for a couple weeks. I am also in the market for a new bike. In my early twenties I road alot but have only road with the family and kids for the past 15 to 20 years. I turned 50 this year and need to get in shape. I would love to go to the LBS and be able to try out the bikes. I have been to many to interact with them to see which ones seem to be engaging. I am 6' 4" 195 lbs and none of the bike shops have bikes that are my size. At times, I think that a relaxed farme like the Cannondale Synapse or Specialized Roubaix would suit me best. However, I don't want to end up later on wishing that I had gone with a more race oriented geometry. Any ideas on how I can get a feel for what each bike would feel like? I have a budget up to about $2,200.


----------



## Zeet

onemoreshot said:


> This is my first post. I have been reviewing threads for a couple weeks. I am also in the market for a new bike. In my early twenties I road alot but have only road with the family and kids for the past 15 to 20 years. I turned 50 this year and need to get in shape. I would love to go to the LBS and be able to try out the bikes. I have been to many to interact with them to see which ones seem to be engaging. I am 6' 4" 195 lbs and none of the bike shops have bikes that are my size. At times, I think that a relaxed farme like the Cannondale Synapse or Specialized Roubaix would suit me best. However, I don't want to end up later on wishing that I had gone with a more race oriented geometry. Any ideas on how I can get a feel for what each bike would feel like? I have a budget up to about $2,200.


Follow your heart! For us older guys, a relaxed geometry usually does suit us best! :thumbsup: I would recommend a either a Jamis Bosanova, or a GT Corsa 1.0...


----------



## PJ352

onemoreshot said:


> This is my first post. I have been reviewing threads for a couple weeks. I am also in the market for a new bike. In my early twenties I road alot but have only road with the family and kids for the past 15 to 20 years. I turned 50 this year and need to get in shape. I would love to go to the LBS and be able to try out the bikes. I have been to many to interact with them to see which ones seem to be engaging. I am 6' 4" 195 lbs and none of the bike shops have bikes that are my size. At times, I think that a relaxed farme like the Cannondale Synapse or Specialized Roubaix would suit me best. However, I don't want to end up later on wishing that I had gone with a more race oriented geometry. Any ideas on how I can get a feel for what each bike would feel like? I have a budget up to about $2,200.


When dealing with small to medium sized shops, it's sometimes tough to find a bike sized at the extremes, because (understandably) the shops don't want to be stuck with them. 

I would check around and see if any shops are willing to order a bike giving you the option of refusal, with either a refund or credit towards another brand or model.

At your height, you may have a limited range of choices, because not all brands/ models are offered to suite riders your around height. So the reality may be that you have to compromise - not in sizing/ fit, but availability. 

Re: race versus relaxed, ideally, ride both. But keep in mind that plenty of relaxed geo bikes win pro circuit races, so they won't hold you back.


----------



## Tinaann

I have been trying to read these threads and all I can say is I am thoroughly overwhelmed! When I was a kid, my parents bought us bikes without too much thought and we rode them. I'm not saying you guys are wrong- just that this is way more complicated that I ever thought it was! So the amount of information I can handle at this point is go to a LBS and ask questions and get fitted. Got it. Unfortunately the closest place for me to buy a bike is Walmart and that is 20 miles away and across state lines. However, it sounds like it's worth the road trip to go further to a real bike store. Ok. Got that, too. So, I guess at this point, there are no questions to ask- except one: I have growing boys. They are 10 and 12 years old. Can I assume that purchasing bikes for them is the same as buying clothes- a little too big so they grow into them, or have the bike store refit their bikes at every growth spurt?


----------



## PJ352

Tinaann said:


> I have growing boys. They are 10 and 12 years old. Can I assume that purchasing bikes for them is the same as buying clothes- a little too big so they grow into them, or have the bike store refit their bikes at every growth spurt?


Not to confuse you further but you size someone to a bike, then fit them to it. In other words, frame size is first determined, then the person is fitted to it, by making adjustments to saddle, stem, spacers.... so if your boys were correctly sized to bikes, then fitted, the grew 'some', the bikes probably wouldn't be the correct size for them. 

The scenario above isn't catastrophic and you're right, your kids fit could be tweaked, but given that they're going to be growing for awhile, it may be better to minimize your (relatively short term) investment and opt for either good used bikes from LBS's or private sellers, co-op bikes (if there's a co-op in your area) and lastly, dept store bikes. 

The last suggestion is the last resort, because they aren't going to be quality offerings, you won't get much sizing assistance and the bikes will basically be throw aways when your kids are through with them.

Hope this helps, but post updates if you have any questions/ comments.


----------



## PJ352

Amanda679 said:


> Go to a bike shop & figure out what size you need & leave.


Let's see now... I take a 47cm in some Rocky Mountains, an XS in some Ridley's, a 52 in some Specialized, A 54 in some Treks, M in some Fuji's....

Seems to me sizing is somewhat arbitrary, so if I follow your advice may well be misled.


----------



## Tinaann

Actually you cleared up an area where I was apparently confused! Thanks. I am glad to not be too worried about fitting the boys just right because I have such a tiny budget that there is no way I could keep up with them, especially with puberty right around the corner! I'm short (5'2") but the boys will likely be tall. They have full brothers who, as legal adults, are 5'8"- 6'2" so even though my 12-year-old is 5'4", he still has a long way to go. After my car is fixed (AGAIN) I will make a trip to the FABS (Far Away Bike Shop) and find out what I need for myself and can get for them. Thanks. You have been most helpful!


----------



## thokata

Hi guys, I'm a new member and I need some advice on choosing my first road bike. I've been driven some mountain bikes for years and I like biking a lot.

I'm 5'6'' tall, and my budget is <=$500. I saw this deal on craglist and it seemed to be a good one. Advice from you guys will help me a lot. Thanks!

52.5cm Marin Venezia Road bike


----------



## PJ352

thokata said:


> Hi guys, I'm a new member and I need some advice on choosing my first road bike. I've been driven some mountain bikes for years and I like biking a lot.
> 
> I'm 5'6'' tall, and my budget is <=$500. I saw this deal on craglist and it seemed to be a good one. Advice from you guys will help me a lot. Thanks!
> 
> 52.5cm Marin Venezia Road bike


The bike originally MSRP'd for $1,000, so IMO considering it's now 4+ years old, $490 is high. Not unusual for CL bikes.

Still, it's a solid package and if in good to VG condition would probably be worth around $350-$400, but prices vary some by region. 

I couldn't find the geo chart for the bike, but at 5'6", it's going to be in the ballpark, size-wise.

If you're interested, take a look (and test ride) and go from there. Might want to ask the seller to bring the bike to a reputable LBS for mechanical/ sizing assessment before committing to the purchase.


----------



## thokata

PJ352 said:


> The bike originally MSRP'd for $1,000, so IMO considering it's now 4+ years old, $490 is high. Not unusual for CL bikes.
> 
> Still, it's a solid package and if in good to VG condition would probably be worth around $350-$400, but prices vary some by region.
> 
> I couldn't find the geo chart for the bike, but at 5'6", it's going to be in the ballpark, size-wise.
> 
> If you're interested, take a look (and test ride) and go from there. Might want to ask the seller to bring the bike to a reputable LBS for mechanical/ sizing assessment before committing to the purchase.


wow, very quick advice, and very useful too. Thanks a lot PJ352. Bargaining to <=$400 while keep searching might be what I should do now. With that much money for a used bike, going to a LBS b4 buying is a wise thing to do too.


----------



## terry.bettendorf

I'm new to the forum and though I typically mountain bike or cycle for recreation, would like to get into road biking. I find the speed, fitness association and ability to cover longer distances with road biking as points of attraction. I have mentally been going back and forth between touring bikes and endurance road bikes over the past months, finding it difficult to find a true utilitarian type bike that "does it all". I have since come to the conclusion that I will be doing my self a service my trying to fulfill my most important needs with the style of back that delivers on those the best, meaning I will have to choose one or the other. 

I consequently narrowed my search down to road bikes with endurance oriented geometries, such as the Giant Defy, Specialized Secteur / Roubaix, Jamis Ventura, etc. The next decision was to ensure the component group set would be adequate for entry level introduction and have a little room to grow with me as I build up my fitness and proficiency. To this end, I set a goal of going no lower than a Tiagra set, with the 105 being a stretch. In this type of configuration, I know I will be spending at least $800, and would definitely spend an extra $150-$200 for a custom fitting. I am also set on buying a used bike with low miles in good condition. 

I have been scanning craigslist in my local area for some time now, and have yet to find a steal on a Defy or Roubaix, which would be most desirable. However, I recently came across a 2013 Jamis Ventura Sport with less than 100 miles on it, in showroom condition, being offered for $400. 

My real budget is $1,300, but I'm highly value oriented. 

1. Is this a decent bike for the $400 price? 
2. Am I shooting myself in the proverbial foot by buying an entry level road bike for $400 and setting myself up for disappointment? 

Thanks so much in advance for taking the time to read and respond! Looking forward to your input and advice.


----------



## PJ352

terry.bettendorf said:


> I'm new to the forum and though I typically mountain bike or cycle for recreation, would like to get into road biking. I find the speed, fitness association and ability to cover longer distances with road biking as points of attraction. I have mentally been going back and forth between touring bikes and endurance road bikes over the past months, finding it difficult to find a true utilitarian type bike that "does it all". I have since come to the conclusion that I will be doing my self a service my trying to fulfill my most important needs with the style of back that delivers on those the best, meaning I will have to choose one or the other.
> 
> I consequently narrowed my search down to road bikes with endurance oriented geometries, such as the Giant Defy, Specialized Secteur / Roubaix, Jamis Ventura, etc. The next decision was to ensure the component group set would be adequate for entry level introduction and have a little room to grow with me as I build up my fitness and proficiency. To this end, I set a goal of going no lower than a Tiagra set, with the 105 being a stretch. In this type of configuration, I know I will be spending at least $800, and would definitely spend an extra $150-$200 for a custom fitting. I am also set on buying a used bike with low miles in good condition.
> 
> I have been scanning craigslist in my local area for some time now, and have yet to find a steal on a Defy or Roubaix, which would be most desirable. However, I recently came across a 2013 Jamis Ventura Sport with less than 100 miles on it, in showroom condition, being offered for $400.
> 
> My real budget is $1,300, but I'm highly value oriented.
> 
> 1. Is this a decent bike for the $400 price?
> 2. Am I shooting myself in the proverbial foot by buying an entry level road bike for $400 and setting myself up for disappointment?
> 
> Thanks so much in advance for taking the time to read and respond! Looking forward to your input and advice.


Generally speaking, I think you're taking a very smart approach to this, first prioritizing the facets of intended uses, then deciding on a groupset that'll satisfy your needs. 

One point re: fitting that (I think) needs clarification is that before you can be properly fitted to a bike, it has to be sized correctly. So if you decide to buy used from a private seller and without LBS support/ guidance, you have to be careful to get sizing right. 

Most important would be to test ride any bikes of interest, whittling the field based on fit and feel. It can get a little tricky because the bikes aren't fitted specifically to you, but bikes that are sized wrong will likely just feel wrong during your test ride (cramped or stretch cockpits). 

Might be worth your while to shop used at your LBS's. That way, you'll get some sizing/ fit assistance and still save some money on a bike. Speaking of which, while it's always a plus to get value with every purchase, try to take the same methodical approach to sizing and fit as you have done with the type of bike and groupset. If a bike isn't comfortable to ride, you won't ride it, and it'll be no deal no matter the price paid. 

As far as the Ventura, without seeing the bike and knowing more about it, it's near impossible to tell you if it's a good deal. If it fits and is in very good condition, the price is within reason. Just keep in mind that the groupset is two level below Tiagra and 8 speed.


----------



## thokata

I'm considering this offer tomorrow. I asked the owner to go to a LBS with me to check, adjust fitting and take some ride test. Hope to have some advice from you guys.
Road Bike Package


----------



## PJ352

thokata said:


> I'm considering this offer tomorrow. I asked the owner to go to a LBS with me to check, adjust fitting and take some ride test. Hope to have some advice from you guys.
> Road Bike Package


It's a bad pic and without knowing the model year hard to say, but considering a 2012 Newest 1.0 MSRP'd for around $750, I'd say this bike is overpriced. Like many other private sellers, he's likely trying to recoup some money spent on accessories. 

Still, if the bike fits comfortably and you're interested in it after looking it over and test riding, I think it's a good idea to have a LBS assess it mechanically, for fit and ballpark the value.

BTW, I wouldn't buy or wear a used helmet, but that's just me.


----------



## jadebalam

PJ352 said:


> BTW, I wouldn't buy or wear a used helmet, but that's just me.


I concur on this. There are a number of reasons why the helmet protective layers could have been compromised, without it being obvious on the outer shell. I follow the same rule for bicycle AND motorcycle helmets.


----------



## thokata

PJ352 said:


> It's a bad pic and without knowing the model year hard to say, but considering a 2012 Newest 1.0 MSRP'd for around $750, I'd say this bike is overpriced. Like many other private sellers, he's likely trying to recoup some money spent on accessories.
> 
> Still, if the bike fits comfortably and you're interested in it after looking it over and test riding, I think it's a good idea to have a LBS assess it mechanically, for fit and ballpark the value.
> 
> BTW, I wouldn't buy or wear a used helmet, but that's just me.


Thanks, I myself already have 2 helmets so I may skip that one haha. It remains to be seen after the test ride and hearing what the LBS guys say. Otherwise this may be my last attempt to buy on CL, I will just go to a LBS and get a new one then.


----------



## Skwirl

Alx said:


> That looks like bikesdirect.com ebay listing. I bought my recent bike from them and couldn't be happier, the bike got shipped super-fast and its exactly what the description was. I know I didn't purchase a rare italian made bike but first off i'm new to the sport, second i'm not gonna race or enter any triathlons so it fits me just well, and also most of these manufacturers get their frames built in the same factories in Taiwan. The higher price just usually goes towards higher-end components and more established name brands.
> 
> As far as durability in the sora components, that what my bike has and it shifts just as well as all the other high price bikes I looked at. I don't see how they won't last as long as the higher end components since they're usually installed on bikes that are gonna be used for recreational use anyways.
> 
> If you're just starting get what you can afford now and ride it till the wheels fall off so to speak. If you ride so many miles that you wear it out then you're really into the sport and buying a higher-end bike won't seem like such a commitment after all.


After about a week of research, i've been appalled at some of the users in this community; I think it's really more the cancer of the internet really, but you would expect a unified sport community to be better.
That being said, this is probably some of the better advice i've seen. Thank you 

No offense to the other well meaning experienced riders here. I had some great help when I posted questions, It's just the terrible few that seem to drag everyone down. It irritates me, and I can't help but read in disbelief at some of these people. It's more self importance, than helping people or contributing...
Worst part is; They don't even see the problem :/

anyway, I've decided on the Avenue Gravity C from BD for my first purchase. I've been training on a garage sale schwinn that i've tuned from garbage to a decent bike, but all in all, my first thought was that it simply won't do for any kind of race (I top out at 17mph)
I'll post again when it comes in, and I can put some miles on it. Hopefully i'll have some experience I can share with the forum


----------



## NJBiker72

Skwirl said:


> After about a week of research, i've been appalled at some of the users in this community; I think it's really more the cancer of the internet really, but you would expect a unified sport community to be better.
> That being said, this is probably some of the better advice i've seen. Thank you
> 
> No offense to the other well meaning experienced riders here. I had some great help when I posted questions, It's just the terrible few that seem to drag everyone down. It irritates me, and I can't help but read in disbelief at some of these people. It's more self importance, than helping people or contributing...
> Worst part is; They don't even see the problem :/
> 
> anyway, I've decided on the Avenue Gravity C from BD for my first purchase. I've been training on a garage sale schwinn that i've tuned from garbage to a decent bike, but all in all, my first thought was that it simply won't do for any kind of race (I top out at 17mph)
> I'll post again when it comes in, and I can put some miles on it. Hopefully i'll have some experience I can share with the forum


Good luck with your purchase. People here mean well. We do not always agree and we wish the best for you. It will likely work out or you won't get really into the sport. I feel I can speak for the others when we say that we hope it works out. 

I bought my first road bike over the net. It now stays on my trainer. A bit small and not good quality but it was cheap and it got me through a long charity ride that motivated me to do more and buy a good bike (and then another).


----------



## Skwirl

Thanks 
I'm a poor college student, hence the garage sale bike, but I'm doing a triathlon soon so I figured I needed something a little better to help me get my bike leg closer to my target time. The past week of researching Craigslist, web retailers, and multiple bike forums was kind of frustrating. But everyone seems to agree on a few key points;
1. Get a bike that fits
2. Some suck, some are good. Brand name has little to do with this. People will argue that to death, but those are usually the trolls in the bunch. The good advice came down to functionality on what you can afford.
3. sti shifters; They are a bit safer for racing, and shimano mid grade components will be fine. I figure the sora will be just fine for me.

I look at it this way; If I can't be competitive with what I can get, I have no business trying to /race/ in the first place. Someone pointed out that Armstrong raced on stock bikes. Those arguing the big ticket bikes for beginners probably think that the bike makes the rider. Then, when the beginner shows up at the race, they will laugh at the newbie saying they have more bike than they can handle. There's just no winning with those guys! I was almost convinced that I had to buy the $700 bike with what the experienced guys wanted me to have, instead of the $400 bike with everything I need, and I still have food to eat for the month. Not to mention I still want to buy decent bike shorts or a tri suit.

Just figured I would put my recent buying experiences here. I figure some noobs like me might get a little scared to make a decision, like I was. Finally I just went for it, and I think I will be just fine.
Thanks, by the way, to the people here that gave me some great advice and taught me a little bit along the way


----------



## NJBiker72

Skwirl said:


> Thanks
> I'm a poor college student, hence the garage sale bike, but I'm doing a triathlon soon so I figured I needed something a little better to help me get my bike leg closer to my target time. The past week of researching Craigslist, web retailers, and multiple bike forums was kind of frustrating. But everyone seems to agree on a few key points;
> 1. Get a bike that fits
> 2. Some suck, some are good. Brand name has little to do with this. People will argue that to death, but those are usually the trolls in the bunch. The good advice came down to functionality on what you can afford.
> 3. sti shifters; They are a bit safer for racing, and shimano mid grade components will be fine. I figure the sora will be just fine for me.
> 
> I look at it this way; If I can't be competitive with what I can get, I have no business trying to /race/ in the first place. Someone pointed out that Armstrong raced on stock bikes. Those arguing the big ticket bikes for beginners probably think that the bike makes the rider. Then, when the beginner shows up at the race, they will laugh at the newbie saying they have more bike than they can handle. There's just no winning with those guys! I was almost convinced that I had to buy the $700 bike with what the experienced guys wanted me to have, instead of the $400 bike with everything I need, and I still have food to eat for the month. Not to mention I still want to buy decent bike shorts or a tri suit.
> 
> Just figured I would put my recent buying experiences here. I figure some noobs like me might get a little scared to make a decision, like I was. Finally I just went for it, and I think I will be just fine.
> Thanks, by the way, to the people here that gave me some great advice and taught me a little bit along the way


No problem. I think fit is crucial as you pointed out, which is a key issue with on line.

But just a quick note, if you are buying the bike to do triathlons, have you considered a tri bike? I would think you could get a similar quality for similar price?


----------



## Skwirl

NJBiker72 said:


> No problem. I think fit is crucial as you pointed out, which is a key issue with on line.
> 
> But just a quick note, if you are buying the bike to do triathlons, have you considered a tri bike? I would think you could get a similar quality for similar price?


I did look at tri bikes, and in my post about the more expensive bike, it was a tri bike I was actually referring to that I almost bought. They tend to be way more expensive than road bikes, and it is extremely difficult to find a used one in my area. 

The bike I had just bought seems to have all the bare basics i'll need for a decent racer, so I can't complain. It's within my means, and it will at least carry me until I can save up for one of those beast machines that are out there. Plus with more experience I will be able to better able make an informed purchase decision based on personal experience (opposed to second hand knowledge) when the big bucks are on the line.

Besides, it's just my first triathlon. I'm almost sure to be racing for middle of the pack at best, and I don't think the comfort of a gear shifter is going to affect me at my current level. My goal is to finish the Olympic distance at ~3 hours.
Not really competitive i think, but who knows? I might do better than I thought. Won't know til after the race is over


----------



## NJBiker72

Skwirl said:


> I did look at tri bikes, and in my post about the more expensive bike, it was a tri bike I was actually referring to that I almost bought. They tend to be way more expensive than road bikes, and it is extremely difficult to find a used one in my area.
> 
> The bike I had just bought seems to have all the bare basics i'll need for a decent racer, so I can't complain. It's within my means, and it will at least carry me until I can save up for one of those beast machines that are out there. Plus with more experience I will be able to better able make an informed purchase decision based on personal experience (opposed to second hand knowledge) when the big bucks are on the line.
> 
> Besides, it's just my first triathlon. I'm almost sure to be racing for middle of the pack at best, and I don't think the comfort of a gear shifter is going to affect me at my current level. My goal is to finish the Olympic distance at ~3 hours.
> Not really competitive i think, but who knows? I might do better than I thought. Won't know til after the race is over


I think your reasoning is fairly sound and the bike looks slightly better than the one I bought on line to start with. Even my second bike was not really what Imended up wanting. So saving money now is good. This bike can be used later for rain, gravel grinding, trainer duties, and general fragile carbon bike is in shop days. 

See how you like it. But don't get offended when people try to help.


----------



## vineland

Hi all,

I'm looking to upgrade from a great old 1980's road bike that has got me seriously hooked on the sport. I have a budget ceiling of $1500(CDN), and am trying to figure out the best bang for my buck. It seems like an awkward time to look though as there are deals on some 2013s.. though not many sizes left.. and while some companies have put out their 2014s, a lot are yet to come.

I test rode a 2014 Felt 75 this morning after a quick fitting by my lbs. I really liked the aggressive positioning, as it is very similar to my old bike in comparison to something like a Cannondale Synapse.

I feel, based on the other companies' 2013 specs, the '14 Felt 75 is great value for money (full shimano 105, carbon fork & seat post).. but it's hard to tell before the other brands put out their specs for next year.
F75 - Felt Bicycles

My question is, is the Felt F75 designed more for flat criterium racing than touring? It's fitted with a 10-speed 11-25T cassette, has more twitchy handling from what I've read, and the aggressive positioning. 

This isn't to say that I want a bike with a higher head tube that'll position me upright - or maybe I do? 20min test-rides are a lot different than 4-hour rides in the country, and I'd hate to set myself up for too much pain.

The other bikes I'm considering are the Scott 20, or Specialized Allez (though the gruppo doesn't seem as good on the Allez?). CAAD 8 would be in the running, but my local Cannondale dealer doesn't seem to stock anything between a Synapse and CAAD 10!

And while having a good lbs isn't the most critical piece, the one that carries Felt has been head and shoulders above the rest in service. The girl took her time to fit me, really describe the bike, and strongly encouraged me to go around town and try as many as possible - I could tell they'd treat me well even though I'd be buying their most entry-level bike.

I'm pretty eager to buy.. but with a month, maybe a month and a half of riding weather left, should I just wait until spring?

Thanks!


----------



## PJ352

vineland said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm looking to upgrade from a great old 1980's road bike that has got me seriously hooked on the sport. I have a budget ceiling of $1500(CDN), and am trying to figure out the best bang for my buck. It seems like an awkward time to look though as there are deals on some 2013s.. though not many sizes left.. and while some companies have put out their 2014s, a lot are yet to come.
> 
> I test rode a 2014 Felt 75 this morning after a quick fitting by my lbs. I really liked the aggressive positioning, as it is very similar to my old bike in comparison to something like a Cannondale Synapse.
> 
> I feel, based on the other companies' 2013 specs, the '14 Felt 75 is great value for money (full shimano 105, carbon fork & seat post).. but it's hard to tell before the other brands put out their specs for next year.
> F75 - Felt Bicycles
> 
> My question is, is the Felt F75 designed more for flat criterium racing than touring? It's fitted with a 10-speed 11-25T cassette, has more twitchy handling from what I've read, and the aggressive positioning.
> 
> This isn't to say that I want a bike with a higher head tube that'll position me upright - or maybe I do? 20min test-rides are a lot different than 4-hour rides in the country, and I'd hate to set myself up for too much pain.
> 
> The other bikes I'm considering are the Scott 20, or Specialized Allez (though the gruppo doesn't seem as good on the Allez?). CAAD 8 would be in the running, but my local Cannondale dealer doesn't seem to stock anything between a Synapse and CAAD 10!
> 
> And while having a good lbs isn't the most critical piece, the one that carries Felt has been head and shoulders above the rest in service. The girl took her time to fit me, really describe the bike, and strongly encouraged me to go around town and try as many as possible - I could tell they'd treat me well even though I'd be buying their most entry-level bike.
> 
> I'm pretty eager to buy.. but with a month, maybe a month and a half of riding weather left, should I just wait until spring?
> 
> Thanks!


To answer your question, Felt's "F" series are race bikes, so are meant for... racing. That doesn't mean it's a prerequisite for buying/ riding one. I have two (Tarmacs) and don't race.

Only you can decide if that's the type of bike that best suites your needs and anatomy. Before committing to a purchase, ride some others, like the Felt "Z" series, Giant's Defy, C'dales Synapse, then go back and ride the Felt again.

These test rides will help you decide your preferences and whittle the field. Just make sure the rides are done out on the roads, and for some duration.

Re: having a good shop, don't underestimate its value, both pre and post purchase. That shop sounds top notch, and I wish there were more around like it. Keep that in mind as you search out the 'best' bike, and good luck!


----------



## vineland

Hmm, I don't think they had any "Z" series bikes - the shop is set up as a triathlon/racing shop, which would make sense. I appreciate the comment about the "F" series being racing bikes, I wasn't entirely sure if that were the case.

I've tried the Defy and Synapse and didn't really like them as much - for various reasons, but mainly the upright seating position. Would it be fair to compare the Z series to these, and the F series to a CAAD10 or Allez Sport?

I'm really interested in getting a ride on a Scott 20, but the shops that stock them are currently completely out (and silly as it is, I'm not keen on the 2014 pure white paint job!).

I think I will end up waiting until all the 2014s are in so I can try and see as many as possible, rather than running out and buying the Felt because it's available now. Hopefully the other shops will match the service of Speedtheory once they actually have the stock in.

Cheers for the comments!


----------



## GalaxySeeker.13

Hey Guys,


New member here. Read through a couple of threads. Nice vibe. I appreciate that. So, this bike search is now entering the fall, and I'm starting to doubt whether it's actually in the cards for me. The CL market here in NY is pretty jacked. When I started, it was an unfocused mess. I just knew that I wanted a classic road bike, after getting hooked on an orange Motobecane Nomade ($75). And because I'm on a budget I kept searching for a better deal. I missed too many good ones to count. Funny thing is, I missed out on the two bikes I've decided to hold out for. After reading info on both and checking bike forum threads for feedback, it's either going to be a Raleigh Super Course or Dawes Galaxy. As I'm sure many of you know the NY CL bike market is hot. I came across both of those bikes, in the same week no less, for $150. After kicking my butt for those missed opportunities, I bought a '78 Raleigh Super Grand Prix. Although it turned out to be too big, It helped me realize that settling would not make me happy. While I liked the SGP, it didn't compare to the above mentioned two. My question is this. What is the likelihood of either popping up again & for similar prices (Aren't prices supposed to be going down? I've seen Raleigh Record's for $240)? From what I've read, both bikes seem on par with each other (The Galaxies' aesthetics give it an edge for me). I'm checking out an SC on ebay now, but in the 6 days remaining, it's sure to blow past my budget. Any thoughts? Can anyone relate on when they were searching for their first bike? 


Thanks in advance.

I've been keeping a photo journal of what I've responded to, checked out or missed. Here's what peaked my interest in riding and the two whose memory slays me:


----------



## cyclintruckin

GalaxySeeker.13 said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> 
> New member here. Read through a couple of threads. Nice vibe. I appreciate that. So, this bike search is now entering the fall, and I'm starting to doubt whether it's actually in the cards for me. The CL market here in NY is pretty jacked. When I started, it was an unfocused mess. I just knew that I wanted a classic road bike, after getting hooked on an orange Motobecane Nomade ($75). And because I'm on a budget I kept searching for a better deal. I missed too many good ones to count. Funny thing is, I missed out on the two bikes I've decided to hold out for. After reading info on both and checking bike forum threads for feedback, it's either going to be a Raleigh Super Course or Dawes Galaxy. As I'm sure many of you know the NY CL bike market is hot. I came across both of those bikes, in the same week no less, for $150. After kicking my butt for those missed opportunities, I bought a '78 Raleigh Super Grand Prix. Although it turned out to be too big, It helped me realize that settling would not make me happy. While I liked the SGP, it didn't compare to the above mentioned two. My question is this. What is the likelihood of either popping up again & for similar prices (Aren't prices supposed to be going down? I've seen Raleigh Record's for $240)? From what I've read, both bikes seem on par with each other (The Galaxies' aesthetics give it an edge for me). I'm checking out an SC on ebay now, but in the 6 days remaining, it's sure to blow past my budget. Any thoughts? Can anyone relate on when they were searching for their first bike?
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> I've been keeping a photo journal of what I've responded to, checked out or missed. Here's what peaked my interest in riding and the two whose memory slays me:
> 
> View attachment 286633
> View attachment 286630
> View attachment 286631



Looking to kick it old school I see. :thumbsup: The green Raleigh Super Course looks like it would have been a good bet. If it is still up I would give it a serious look.


----------



## ROACHCLASS

Most importantly is making sure the bike fits you..


----------



## GalaxySeeker.13

cyclintruckin said:


> Looking to kick it old school I see. :thumbsup: The green Raleigh Super Course looks like it would have been a good bet. If it is still up I would give it a serious look.


I definitely am looking to kick it old school. My first bike was out of HS, a '96 green GT Terra FS. Bought new from the local LBS. I remember thinking/feeling that it felt stiff. Unfortunately I never got a chance to break it in, as it was stolen. So, I figure I'd go the broken in route this time. Plus I really like the idea of continuing someones journey. I wish the Raleigh SC was still available.


----------



## huber

I currently work in a small office where I am the only one who does not ride. It is slowly becoming like a CEO who does not play golf. I am looking to join the party. 2 out of the 3 guys I will be riding with are semi competitive riders and the 3rd is no slouch. 

I am a competitive rower and regularly run half marathons, so I have a lot of leg strength / endurance and am used to competing at a high level, though cycling will be completely new to me. All of this is to say that I dont intend to just be a weekend warrior, but I probably will wont be winning any races (though I'll try). I dont need a high end bike, only one that will not hold me back, and allow me to have fun. Oh yeah and my wife will kill me if I have to break the bank.

I have read a lot of great info in these forums that date back several years. How much changes from year to year with each new model that comes out? I live in New England so the riding season is quickly coming to an end, but I figured there might be some good deals now as result. 

Am i better off buying now even if i dont get to ride until the spring, or waiting?
How much does the componentry really make a difference?
Is there a baseline? (ie nothing lower than Sora, or 2300, or 105)
Difference between a road bike and and endurance road bike? I see things about seating position, but what does it really mean?

Thanks in advance. I look forward to being a part of this community.


----------



## tlg

huber said:


> Am i better off buying now even if i dont get to ride until the spring, or waiting?


 I'd start your shopping process now. You might find some end of season clearance deals.



> How much does the componentry really make a difference?
> Is there a baseline? (ie nothing lower than Sora, or 2300, *Tiagra *, 105, *Ultegra*)


You won't notice much difference between any two corresponding components. What you will see is a difference when you jump 2-3 levels. Because typically as you go up the scale you're also getting better frames and better wheels.

If you really intend on serious riding and potentially racing, I'd shoot for something in the 105 range with Tiagra being the lower limit. Below that the component quality goes down and the weight goes up. Sora and 2300 are more geared towards the weekend warriors.



> Difference between a *performance *road bike and and endurance road bike? I see things about seating position, but what does it really mean?


 A performance bike has more of a race geometry. Handlebars are lower. More aerodynamic. And endurance bike you're a little more upright and the bars are higher. Easier on the arms, neck, and back. 
You'll really have to try both and see which you prefer.


----------



## NJBiker72

huber said:


> I currently work in a small office where I am the only one who does not ride. It is slowly becoming like a CEO who does not play golf. I am looking to join the party. 2 out of the 3 guys I will be riding with are semi competitive riders and the 3rd is no slouch.
> 
> I am a competitive rower and regularly run half marathons, so I have a lot of leg strength / endurance and am used to competing at a high level, though cycling will be completely new to me. All of this is to say that I dont intend to just be a weekend warrior, but I probably will wont be winning any races (though I'll try). I dont need a high end bike, only one that will not hold me back, and allow me to have fun. Oh yeah and my wife will kill me if I have to break the bank.
> 
> I have read a lot of great info in these forums that date back several years. How much changes from year to year with each new model that comes out? I live in New England so the riding season is quickly coming to an end, but I figured there might be some good deals now as result.
> 
> Am i better off buying now even if i dont get to ride until the spring, or waiting?
> How much does the componentry really make a difference?
> Is there a baseline? (ie nothing lower than Sora, or 2300, or 105)
> Difference between a road bike and and endurance road bike? I see things about seating position, but what does it really mean?
> 
> Thanks in advance. I look forward to being a part of this community.


Welcome!

I agree with tlg. Start shopping now. Winter riding is fun too. Try lots of bikes.

I would not break the bank on the first bike but get something good enough. I went through a couple of lower end bikes before getting what I really wanted, but without the lower end bikes, I would not have known what I wanted.

I thought endurance or plush or relaxed geo, because I wasn't going to win any races and am not some young kid. But after a couple of years I realized I did want a racier bike. 

So on the endurance vs. race question. Ride a couple of sister makes. In other words, if you go to a Specialized shop, ride a Secteur and an Allez back to back. Same set up, but different geo. A Giant shop? TCR vs. Defy. Canondale? CAAD v. Synapse.

That should let you know which you want. FWIW, I have never ridden longer than 80 miles on my endurance bike (Secteur) where as my "race" bike has done 3 centuries this year. 

Bottom level for components? Anything SRAM is fine IMO. Shimano? Not a big fan of the old Sora, but have heard the new is better and even the old works. I have Sora on my Secteur. Greatly prefer SRAM Red, but not a fair comparison.


----------



## PJ352

I agree with the advice you've been given thus far. I'd start out shopping for shops along with shopping for bikes and (ideally) buying your favorite bike from your favorite shop. Look for shops that promote the importance of fit and test rides - out on the roads.

Also agree to try both race and relaxed geo bikes. IMO the differences are more in handling than rider position - they can (to a point) be equalized - but steering/ handling will be a tad slower (some say more predictable) than a race bike.

I always tell people new to the sport to stay at the lower end of their budget (assumes a 'sufficient' range to get a decent bike). First, you really don't know if it'll be your thing, and second, even if you do stay with it, you'll need some saddle time/ experience to know what you want in that next bike.

Re: components, for most recreational riders, anything at the Shimano Tiagra/ SRAM Apex level will do you fine. More importantly, make sure gearing matches your terrain and fitness level. 

Lastly, if you want to start riding, start shopping now. You're at the tail end of the model year (closeout time) and being relatively close to you (upstate NY), I've ridden into December, so not sure the riding season is coming to an end. They do sell winter riding gear, ya know?? :wink5:


----------



## huber

Thanks for the quick feedback. I went to my LBS this afternoon and tried out a few of the bikes (Trek 1.1 an Specialized Allez) I will be sure to check out a few more shops and rides. 

The bikes i rode had generic plastic pedals, which got me thinking...
In addition to the bike, what peripheral items will I need?
I know I will need a helmet, pump, computer,pedals, maybe shoes, etc.
What other things should i be thinking about?
Any recommendations?


----------



## cyclintruckin

May also want to check out some Cyclocross bikes, that way you can run the fatter knobbier tires for winter commuting and get another set of wheels/tires for straight road riding. I know so many options gets a little mind numbing. Component wise shoot for Shimano 105, Sram Apex, or Campagnolo Athena.


----------



## NJBiker72

You need a helmet, spare tube, mini tool, floor pump, micro pump or co2 inflator. You will want a jersey, cycling shorts, saddle bag, a computer, and eventually shoes and pedals. I would start with regular shoes and the cheap platform pedals until you get comfortable. 

None of those things are expensive but they do add up.


----------



## huber

NJBiker72 said:


> You need a helmet, spare tube, mini tool, floor pump, micro pump or co2 inflator. You will want a jersey, cycling shorts, saddle bag, a computer, and eventually shoes and pedals. I would start with regular shoes and the cheap platform pedals until you get comfortable.
> 
> None of those things are expensive but they do add up.


Thanks for the advice. I definitely would have missed at least one of those things. As far as computers go, does anyone use their smartphone? I used to run with a GPS watch but over the last few years have scrapped it in favor of my iPhone. I assume that there are apps/attachments that make this a viable option.


----------



## NJBiker72

huber said:


> Thanks for the advice. I definitely would have missed at least one of those things. As far as computers go, does anyone use their smartphone? I used to run with a GPS watch but over the last few years have scrapped it in favor of my iPhone. I assume that there are apps/attachments that make this a viable option.



I use a CatEye Double Wireless but recently starting using my Android phone with Strava running in my jersey pocket for a GPS record afterwards. I will probably eventually get a Garmin, just have not pulled the trigger yet. 

Two negatives to just using the phone IMO. 
1. Battery Life. Even without the screen on, the battery will be a close call on a century. I carry an extra battery and split my last century in two on Strava to account for this.
2. Mounting. Every solid mount for the phones looks clumsy and big. IMO. My cateye is tiny. The Garmins are a little bigger but not huge. I put a mount on once, looked at it and sat it back down.


----------



## huber

Thanks for the feedback everyone. This week I will be pulling the trigger on a Specialized Allez Elite 2013. After riding many bikes I narrowed it down to the Allez and a Trek 1.5. After taking each out on longer back to back rides it was amazing how much better the frame of the Allez felt. I am super excited to get out on the road and start looking miles before the winter hits. 

Reading these forums has been a fantastic education.


----------



## PJ352

huber said:


> Thanks for the feedback everyone. This week I will be pulling the trigger on a Specialized Allez Elite 2013. After riding many bikes I narrowed it down to the Allez and a Trek 1.5. After taking each out on longer back to back rides it was amazing how much better the frame of the Allez felt. I am super excited to get out on the road and start looking miles before the winter hits.
> 
> Reading these forums has been a fantastic education.


Congrats! _Nice_ choice!! :thumbsup:


----------



## STRAIGHTDROP

New to road biking, in fact I've never rode one. I have MTB'd frequently in the past, often times 40-50 miles/week with LOTS of climbing (I was living in Nepal, the Himalayas are tough but incredible). I just love to be on two wheels, and since I've moved from Nepal to Uruguay it is nearly all flat here so I've got no real use for my MTB -- which brings me here.

I don't know where to start for entry-level components (cassette, crank, etc.) or for an entry level bike for that matter. I don't want a cheap bike that's going to barely last me a year, and I don't need the 'Cadillac' to keep up with the Jones'. I do not have access to shops where I can go and test ride bikes to see which fits best (which blows) and I will have to ship whatever it is I end up finding to me. I will ultimately be using this bike to both train for and compete in triathlons. Some quick points to help your suggestions along:

-~$1500 budget
-First road bike ever, but will likely ride it hard (there's a joke in there somewhere)
-not scared of an aggressive framed bike, not too good for the alternative
-plan to ride it until the wheels fall off before upgrading
-looking to purchase within this next week
-'recreational racer'

I'm looking to get the most bang for my buck (who isn't right?)

Open to any and all suggestions, thank you for taking the time. Can't wait to get started!


----------



## NJBiker72

STRAIGHTDROP said:


> New to road biking, in fact I've never rode one. I have MTB'd frequently in the past, often times 40-50 miles/week with LOTS of climbing (I was living in Nepal, the Himalayas are tough but incredible). I just love to be on two wheels, and since I've moved from Nepal to Uruguay it is nearly all flat here so I've got no real use for my MTB -- which brings me here.
> 
> I don't know where to start for entry-level components (cassette, crank, etc.) or for an entry level bike for that matter. I don't want a cheap bike that's going to barely last me a year, and I don't need the 'Cadillac' to keep up with the Jones'. I do not have access to shops where I can go and test ride bikes to see which fits best (which blows) and I will have to ship whatever it is I end up finding to me. I will ultimately be using this bike to both train for and compete in triathlons. Some quick points to help your suggestions along:
> 
> -~$1500 budget
> -First road bike ever, but will likely ride it hard (there's a joke in there somewhere)
> -not scared of an aggressive framed bike, not too good for the alternative
> -plan to ride it until the wheels fall off before upgrading
> -looking to purchase within this next week
> -'recreational racer'
> 
> I'm looking to get the most bang for my buck (who isn't right?)
> 
> Open to any and all suggestions, thank you for taking the time. Can't wait to get started!


Well this goes against my usual advice of getting fit and trying different things. 

But given your circumstances, I might look at bikesdirect.com, jensonusa.com, pricepoint.com and nashbar.com. All are reputable. 

I would also consider a tri bike. You won't find any real cheap but might find some in your range. I say this because you say aggressive is not a problem, you want to do tri's, its flat by you and given your trouble getting to an LBS I am guessing group rides will not be an option. 

Be careful though with bikesdirect. Their entry level tri bikes are really cheap road bikes with clip ons.


----------



## PJ352

Given your circumstances (mainly, no LBS's in your area), I'd suggest 1) lowering your budget and 2) taking any steps you can to determine your fit requirements. Compounding this problem is the fact that tri bikes fit differently than drop bar road bikes, so I also suggest reading up n the topic (see link below).

As far as where to buy, a few have already been mentioned and I think are pretty representative of what's out there. 

Lastly, be sure that your stated uses are what you really want to use this bike for. Being your first, you may be glamorizing competing in tri's, then find it's not your thing .For this reason, I'd stay with more traditional geo and get a drop bar road bike fitted with aero bars, just in case...

Tri Bike Fit


----------



## SMiller

I am new to this forum and wanna thank everyone on here for there opinion as it is very useful to beginner's like myself. 

I am thinking about buying my first bike, and was wondering if a cannondale synapse 7 sora is a good first choice. One of the reasons I am asking is, after all the reading I have done it would seem sora components are not looked upon very favorably on here. I will be dealing with a reputable lbs, but am a person who believes in getting alot of opinions. The other bike I am considering is a specialized allez sport ( also sora components). Are there others bikes I should consider around this price range?? I do have a giant, scott, trek, and cervelo dealers close by too.


----------



## PJ352

SMiller said:


> I am new to this forum and wanna thank everyone on here for there opinion as it is very useful to beginner's like myself.
> 
> I am thinking about buying my first bike, and was wondering if a cannondale synapse 7 sora is a good first choice. One of the reasons I am asking is, after all the reading I have done it would seem sora components are not looked upon very favorably on here. I will be dealing with a reputable lbs, but am a person who believes in getting alot of opinions. The other bike I am considering is a specialized allez sport ( also sora components). Are there others bikes I should consider around this price range?? I do have a giant, scott, trek, and cervelo dealers close by too.


It's always a good idea to shop around, get sized/ fitted to some bikes in your price range and head out (on the roads) for test rides, whittling your choices from there. 

As for Sora, I wouldn't fret about it. A plus would be if it's the updated model with inner/ outer shift levers, but even the previous iteration performed well as long as it was installed, tuned correctly.


----------



## SMiller

Thank you very much for the reply and the information. I do plan to test ride several bikes as i slowly begin to narrow my choices.


----------



## gte

SMiller said:


> One of the reasons I am asking is, after all the reading I have done it would seem sora components are not looked upon very favorably on here.


This forum has many racers and seasoned riders so it's understandable that they are not impressed by an entry level groupo. Don't let this make you think that Sora is junk though. My bike has Sora and I've done over 1600 km on it already. I'm absolutely satisfied with Sora except for the thumb shifters which are not impressive but still ok.


----------



## NJBiker72

SMiller said:


> I am new to this forum and wanna thank everyone on here for there opinion as it is very useful to beginner's like myself.
> 
> I am thinking about buying my first bike, and was wondering if a cannondale synapse 7 sora is a good first choice. One of the reasons I am asking is, after all the reading I have done it would seem sora components are not looked upon very favorably on here. I will be dealing with a reputable lbs, but am a person who believes in getting alot of opinions. The other bike I am considering is a specialized allez sport ( also sora components). Are there others bikes I should consider around this price range?? I do have a giant, scott, trek, and cervelo dealers close by too.


Sora is not great but workable as long as properly tuned. Both are good but very different bikes. If you like the Synapse look at the Specialized Secteur. If you prefer the Allez look at the Cannondale CAAD line.

If you can find a bike you like with Apex shifting I would greatly prefer that to Sora, but not theend of the world.


----------



## SMiller

Njbiker- thanks for the info, I would prefer a endurance bike so I will definitly look at the Secteur.


----------



## NJBiker72

SMiller said:


> Njbiker- thanks for the info, I would prefer a endurance bike so I will definitly look at the Secteur.


No problem. If you have a Giant retailer around, check out the Defy as well.


----------



## Aerowrx

Hello everybody. I'm totally new to the forum and cycling in general.

I'm looking to buy my first road bike. My primary usage was just for it to be a fitness thing and I also live in a pretty hilly area (San Dimas). Seems to have a lot of competitive cyclists in this area.

I was considering just a <$300 bike at first. However, I'm starting to want to join a local cycling club and maybe even get into some entry level racing stuff. Should I just save up and dump more money into this and invest on getting a more expensive bike $600-1000? Also what would you guys recommend? I have a local Incycle shop around here.


----------



## PJ352

Aerowrx said:


> Hello everybody. I'm totally new to the forum and cycling in general.
> 
> I'm looking to buy my first road bike. My primary usage was just for it to be a fitness thing and I also live in a pretty hilly area (San Dimas). Seems to have a lot of competitive cyclists in this area.
> 
> I was considering just a <$300 bike at first. However, I'm starting to want to join a local cycling club and maybe even get into some entry level racing stuff. Should I just save up and dump more money into this and invest on getting a more expensive bike $600-1000? Also what would you guys recommend? I have a local Incycle shop around here.


My advice is to take this one step at a time. First, get the best bike (both in fit and mechanically) you can find and work on building fitness. Depending on how fit you now are will dictate just how long it takes you to become sufficiently fit to do group rides, which entails working on bike handling skills. This, in turn, will help you with entry level racing, if you decide to pursue that.

Unless a bike has a fairly major mechanical issue or doesn't fit well, it's not likely the bike will hold you back in building fitness or group riding - or even entry level racing. So I'd stay with your budget, go find a decent bike and go ride. If you decide this sport is for you, you'll end up wanting another bike, no matter what you spend now.


----------



## Aerowrx

PJ352 said:


> My advice is to take this one step at a time. First, get the best bike (both in fit and mechanically) you can find and work on building fitness. Depending on how fit you now are will dictate just how long it takes you to become sufficiently fit to do group rides, which entails working on bike handling skills. This, in turn, will help you with entry level racing, if you decide to pursue that.
> 
> Unless a bike has a fairly major mechanical issue or doesn't fit well, it's not likely the bike will hold you back in building fitness or group riding - or even entry level racing. So I'd stay with your budget, go find a decent bike and go ride. If you decide this sport is for you, you'll end up wanting another bike, no matter what you spend now.


Just for some background info, I run around 2 miles every other day right now but I'd like to increase endurance and do a low impact exercise like biking. My gf's step dad does bike marathons etc. I ride with them every weekend around the beach. However, I wanted to get my own bike and a more serious bike.

Problem is every one has a different definition of an "entry level" bike which can go all the way up to $1500-$2000.


----------



## NJBiker72

Aerowrx said:


> Just for some background info, I run around 2 miles every other day right now but I'd like to increase endurance and do a low impact exercise like biking. My gf's step dad does bike marathons etc. I ride with them every weekend around the beach. However, I wanted to get my own bike and a more serious bike.
> 
> Problem is every one has a different definition of an "entry level" bike which can go all the way up to $1500-$2000.


I look at entry as around 900 to 1000. For a road bike. Now a hybrid or fitness bike can be much cheaper. You can find things on sale. But basically you want an aluminum frame, drop bars, minimum Sora components. Probably find something like that for a little under 900. Maybe a Specialized Allez or Secteur, base models. Other brands have similar but am not as familiar. My first real road bike was a Secteur Sport for 910 IIRC. 

Good bike. Ended up upgrading a year and a half later after I really got to know what I wanted.


----------



## PJ352

Aerowrx said:


> Just for some background info, I run around 2 miles every other day right now but I'd like to increase endurance and do a low impact exercise like biking. My gf's step dad does bike marathons etc. I ride with them every weekend around the beach. However, I wanted to get my own bike and a more serious bike.
> 
> Problem is every one has a different definition of an "entry level" bike which can go all the way up to $1500-$2000.


I wouldn't fret over descriptors people pin on bikes. It doesn't much matter what you call it, just focus on intended uses, fit and appropriate gearing given your terrain and level of fitness.

Most any groupset will fulfill your needs, but as you go up the model lines you'll experience higher levels of refinement, less weight and improved finish. None of which markedly affects performance - but fit will, so be sure to get that right. 

That's not to say that if you can afford it, not to increase your budget 'some', but I wouldn't break the bank over a first bike. It's more important to get one that fulfills your needs, and somewhere in the future when you have more experience, get that nicer bike.


----------



## Aerowrx

NJBiker72 said:


> I look at entry as around 900 to 1000. For a road bike. Now a hybrid or fitness bike can be much cheaper. You can find things on sale. But basically you want an aluminum frame, drop bars, minimum Sora components. Probably find something like that for a little under 900. Maybe a Specialized Allez or Secteur, base models. Other brands have similar but am not as familiar. My first real road bike was a Secteur Sport for 910 IIRC.
> 
> Good bike. Ended up upgrading a year and a half later after I really got to know what I wanted.


What about a Cannondale CAAD8 Sora or Fuji SL 3.0? Both are in the same price range.


----------



## PJ352

The one that fits best. Go ride (both), then decide.


----------



## NJBiker72

Aerowrx said:


> What about a Cannondale CAAD8 Sora or Fuji SL 3.0? Both are in the same price range.


Sure. I am not as familiar with them but Canondale has a good reputation. As does Giant, Trek, Felt, Jamis and a number of others. Really at the low end I think the Allez and the Felt (forget the model) are probably my two favorites.


----------



## mathewright

I just want to know what is the best bike for *beginner in my budget*


----------



## mk8901

Hello,

I'm new to the sport and am looking around and found these bikes. Would these bikes be a good purchase? TIA!

52 cm Devinci Road bike

http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/bik/4262272890.html

51cm Peugeot road bike


----------



## PJ352

mk8901 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm new to the sport and am looking around and found these bikes. Would these bikes be a good purchase? TIA!
> 
> 52 cm Devinci Road bike
> 
> http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/bik/4262272890.html
> 
> 51cm Peugeot road bike


Best bet is to go check them out and (if they're sized correctly for you) test ride them out on the roads. Test out shifting, braking and any signs of loose or worn BB assemblies (headset, crankset, wheel hubs).

Sans rust, I prefer the Peugeot, but only because it's steel. Honestly, in this price range, if the bikes operate as intended and fit, they're ok deals. As always. bargain down.


----------



## jimenaruiz

I really appreciate threads such as this one, and all of the information, feedback, and help everyone has offered. I am very new to riding and have absolutely no idea what I am doing basically. I have been doing various types of cardio for years, but I really want to branch out and try something a little bit different. I have around $700 that I can spend on a bike and I want to make sure I know what I am looking for before I walk into any store. I don't want to blow the money and hate riding the bike.


----------



## daletron3030

hm, seems like no one has posted here in almost a year.... -.-

so i been wanting to get into biking for some time now.. and i finally have some mediocre funds to do so. i used to BMX race as a kid.. and now as a 30yr old adult, i have become damn out of shape and have recently kicked a 10 yr smoking habit that i would like to turn around for the better. hence i want to get into road biking for fun... and to get into shape (my job requires me to sit down at the computer for 8 to 9 hrs everyday).

i've been doing so much research.. which i do whenever i get into anything.. but this road biking thing has got me so confused.. i don't think i'll ever be able to grasp it lol.

basically i have a $600 to $700 budget. $800 at most... which i would prefer not to reach. but everywhere I read.. it seems like i have to spend so much more.. which is just way out of my budget. if i really get into this, i'll craigslist it buy something better.

so for now i just want a good entry level bike for $600-$800. from my research.. i want something of "relaxed" geometry.

*List of bikes I've compiled that seem to meet what i'm looking for:*
Windsor Touring
Giant Defy 5
Felt Z5
Specialized Secteur
Raleigh Revenio
Cannondale Synapse
Trek Madone


I'm planning to go to a few LBS's .. but I would like to have a brand and model in mind when going in... 

if anyone can maybe rank them.. or tell me if any of those are not good.. or of course can add any other suggestions.. that would be great.

thank you so much


----------



## PJ352

In comparable price ranges, there are more similarities than differences between brands/ models, so visit some shops, discuss your intended uses, budget and let them recommend some bikes they feel will fulfill your needs. 

While visiting the shops, assess their willingness to assist, the importance of getting fit right and promoting test rides. Most reputable shops will work to keep you close to your budget. 

For a first bike, I'd recommend against buying online. LBS's offer valuable services to first time buyers like sizing/ fitting assistance, test rides, warranty assistance (if needed) and post purchase services (tune ups, maintenance classes), so something to consider.


----------



## daletron3030

thanks PJ352 for the response.


----------



## fishboy316

Hello all! Glad to be here. I have very recently bought and started to ride a cannondale lefty mtb. Here in Maryland the winters can be rather wet so am looking at road bikes to fill the void at these times. I live about .5miles from the B&A bike trail(rails to trails). It is all paved so could be a good filler. Been looking at used bikes but at the asking price of some of the used I might as well throw a few more bucks at it and buy new I think. Will probably go to the same lbs I got the cannondale at and start looking. 
If I was to buy used what do you all think of real old such as 80's and 90's bikes? Some of them look like they have never been ridden . Folks do ask a lot for some of em though. Will more than likley end up in the new market though. Must be careful though! when I started looking for my mtb the budget was $600. When I finished I blew the budget by $1100 on my lefty! found when you start riding the Nice bikes you realise why they are more!LOL Will try to find a good 2013 model. Guess just kinda introducing myself.


----------



## MarciD

We love our trek verve 3s and yes they are good! We debated on upgrading our bikes, knowing we ride a lot, but talking to our bike store, the sales person wasn't even convinced we needed to do that. We invested on a complete tune up so to speak, got new chains, ' sprockets(s) in the back and everything adjusted . Runs like new. We bought them 1 1/2 yrs ago. We don't race or go on long weekend bike rides. 12 to 15 miles, two to three times a week on st petersburg Florida trails is perfect for our Trek Verve 3!! You should consider them, if that's the type of riding you do!!!
PS we spent about $600.00 for each bike!!!!


----------



## TeenieBopper

Hello All,


I'm looking at purchasing a bike in the near future and I was hoping to get some advice. Assume I know nothing (because I don't).


The primary purpose for this bike is going to be fitness, however, I'll be using it to commute to school and work (about 3 miles each way). I'm looking at getting a road bike. One of my concerns was wearing a backpack while riding one to school. This has been assuaged somewhat after reading a couple message board posts and seeing a guy riding down the street today while wearing a backpack. That being said, I still wouldn't mind more opinions on the matter.


Another thing that concerns me is bike durability. When I was talking to a guy at the LBS, he was saying that a entry or mid level bike was designed to be ridden about three times a week and last about 10 years. He expressed concern at my plan to use the bike for commuting whenever the weather is nice and using it for exercise. He said that mid level bikes weren't designed for that and wouldn't last as long. Can I still expect 5-6 years with proper maintenance?


Since I'll also be using my bike for commuting to school, that involves leaving it outside while I'm in class. Will it be okay being exposed to the elements? Related, is there such a thing as getting insurance against stealing?


There are the bikes I'm looking at. I'm ordering online because that's about the only way I can get a bike in my price range. I know there are concerns with sizing, but I'm an average sized male, so I'm willing to take that risk. I've ranked the bikes in order of preference. Is there any compelling reason to choose one over the other?


2015 HASA R4 Road Bike Shimano 2400 24 Speed


Giordano Libero


Vilano Shadow


Tommaso Imola Road Bike (Sport Alu)

Thanks in advance for the help!


----------



## NJBiker72

TeenieBopper said:


> Hello All,
> 
> 
> I'm looking at purchasing a bike in the near future and I was hoping to get some advice. Assume I know nothing (because I don't).
> 
> 
> The primary purpose for this bike is going to be fitness, however, I'll be using it to commute to school and work (about 3 miles each way). I'm looking at getting a road bike. One of my concerns was wearing a backpack while riding one to school. This has been assuaged somewhat after reading a couple message board posts and seeing a guy riding down the street today while wearing a backpack. That being said, I still wouldn't mind more opinions on the matter.
> 
> 
> Another thing that concerns me is bike durability. When I was talking to a guy at the LBS, he was saying that a entry or mid level bike was designed to be ridden about three times a week and last about 10 years. He expressed concern at my plan to use the bike for commuting whenever the weather is nice and using it for exercise. He said that mid level bikes weren't designed for that and wouldn't last as long. Can I still expect 5-6 years with proper maintenance?
> 
> 
> Since I'll also be using my bike for commuting to school, that involves leaving it outside while I'm in class. Will it be okay being exposed to the elements? Related, is there such a thing as getting insurance against stealing?
> 
> 
> There are the bikes I'm looking at. I'm ordering online because that's about the only way I can get a bike in my price range. I know there are concerns with sizing, but I'm an average sized male, so I'm willing to take that risk. I've ranked the bikes in order of preference. Is there any compelling reason to choose one over the other?
> 
> 
> 2015 HASA R4 Road Bike Shimano 2400 24 Speed
> 
> 
> Giordano Libero
> 
> 
> Vilano Shadow
> 
> 
> Tommaso Imola Road Bike (Sport Alu)
> 
> Thanks in advance for the help!


Ok. First find a new LBS. No reason an entry level bike cannot last as long as a high end one. The frame probably longer. Aluminum is more durable than carbon. 

Leaving a bike out in the elements means you should clean the bike after. A bit of a pain but that's life.


----------



## FollowTheTrainCJ

Thinking of getting a new road bike, anyone have experience with either of these bikes? 

2015 HASA R4 Road Bike Shimano 2400 24 Speedhttp://www.amazon.com/2015-HASA-Road-Shimano-Speed/dp/B00D3XSFFS/ref=zg_bs_3405201_10

vs 

Diamondback Bicycles 2014 Century 1 Road Bike with 700c Wheels




Amazon.com : Diamondback Bicycles 2014 Century 1 Road Bike with 700c Wheels : Sports & Outdoors


----------



## josiecolehalifax

Hello! I am new (obviously) and am hoping to get some advice on what bike to buy for both myself and my husband. 
Right now we are looking at getting used bikes on kijiji, so our options are fairly limited. 
For myself, there is a 2010 giant avail 1 and a 2012 trek 1.1. The giant is 650, and the trek is asking 500. Are these fair prices, and which would be a better choice?

Next, my husband has the choice of a trek 1500 (2008 i believe and $600), a trek 1.5 (2012 and $850) and a massi triathlon bike (about a 2010 and asking $500). He will be riding to and from work, which is about 20k a day. We will also be taking weekend rides. Would a triathlon bike be a bad choice? Are these fair prices? Which would be the best choice?

Finally, is there any way for me to be sure that they haven't switched out the groupsets on the bikes? For the avail, I am not overly convinced that it's actually the model she is telling me it is. She says its the giant avail 1, which would have the shamano 105 shifters, but I don't think she knows what she is talking about as she was very reluctant to tell me the model number and her ad is very vague. Any suggestions?

Thanks so much, 
Josie


----------



## PJ352

josiecolehalifax said:


> Hello! I am new (obviously) and am hoping to get some advice on what bike to buy for both myself and my husband.
> Right now we are looking at getting used bikes on kijiji, so our options are fairly limited.
> For myself, there is a 2010 giant avail 1 and a 2012 trek 1.1. The giant is 650, and the trek is asking 500. Are these fair prices, and which would be a better choice?
> 
> Next, my husband has the choice of a trek 1500 (2008 i believe and $600), a trek 1.5 (2012 and $850) and a massi triathlon bike (about a 2010 and asking $500). He will be riding to and from work, which is about 20k a day. We will also be taking weekend rides. Would a triathlon bike be a bad choice? Are these fair prices? Which would be the best choice?
> 
> Finally, is there any way for me to be sure that they haven't switched out the groupsets on the bikes? For the avail, I am not overly convinced that it's actually the model she is telling me it is. She says its the giant avail 1, which would have the shamano 105 shifters, but I don't think she knows what she is talking about as she was very reluctant to tell me the model number and her ad is very vague. Any suggestions?
> 
> Thanks so much,
> Josie


It's not at all unusual for people to not know what they're selling. Sometimes they don't know the size, and seldom the model year, yet they oftentimes overprice the bike.

Best bet is to go to your LBS, get sized/ fitted to a bike and use the geo of the test bike as a basis to shop for a used bike. This will better the odds of getting sizing right. You'll still need an LBS's assistance with dialing in fit, so this is a good way to build a relationship with them. 

Also, ask about used bikes while there. The advantage to buying used from a LBS is that you'll usually get some sort of warranty and the bike will have been gone over by their mechanics. Buying used, you're on your own, so I suggest before committing to a purchase, ask the seller to take the bike to your LBS to get checked out. There may be nominal charges for this and the fitting, but it gets you some assurance you're getting a solid, correctly sized bike.

Lastly, No, a tri bike isn't a good choice for rec riding or commuting. It places the rider more forward and in a more aero position and is a special use bike. Only purchase one if you're actually interested in TT's/ tri's.


----------



## josiecolehalifax

Thanks so much - that's a great idea. 

As for the models and prices though, any advice?

Best, 
J


----------



## PJ352

josiecolehalifax said:


> Thanks so much - that's a great idea.
> 
> As for the models and prices though, any advice?
> 
> Best,
> J


Used bike prices vary by region and depending on use/ condition, so sight unseen I really can't offer you any reliable advice on that. Best bet is to have your LBS appraise the bike while they're checking fit and mechanical condition. They'll see it and know the pricing in your area.

Re: brands/ models, it's a very competitive market, so in each segment they're all fairly equal. Differences will be primarily in the contact points (pedals, saddle, bars/ shifters). That's why test rides are important. Even noobs can tell when something doesn't feel quite right.

If you do go with a private seller, continue to press them for information, then check Bikepedia.com or the vendors websites for specs. For used bikes, look for something entitled "Archived" for older models.


----------



## legolas24

Hi. I am a beginner trying to get my first road bike. I am a poor student with a budget of 250-300$
Which Bikes would you suggest out of these.
2015 Dawes Lightning Sport AL
or 
Schwinn Men's Prelude


----------



## BlaugranaMD

As a general question shopping for used bikes, assuming both are in equivalently good shape, would you rather have an early 90's bike with 105 components or early 2000's with Tiagra?


----------



## PJ352

BlaugranaMD said:


> As a general question shopping for used bikes, assuming both are in equivalently good shape, would you rather have an early 90's bike with 105 components or early 2000's with Tiagra?


I'd rather have the one that fit and felt the best, because that trumps pretty much everything else. But if both were relatively equal in that regard, I'd go with the newer bike.

Newer Tiagra is as good as (or better than) older 105, and (generally speaking) newer components are less likely to fail/ need replacing.


----------



## safarinick

*Which Bike should I choose?*

New to road biking and have narrowed it down in my price range to 2 different bikes. Any advice on which one to go with?

#1 Motobecane Mirage SL
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/road_bikes/mirage_sl.htm

#2 Mercier Galexy AL 2014
Road Bikes, Roadbikes - 2014 Mercier Galaxy AL

I'm 6'4" and about 190lbs. This will be used primarily for commuting and the occasional longer ride 20-40 miles. 

Any advise will needed as this is my first bike and don't know a whole lot about all the technical aspects.

Also is there a cheaper place to buy one of these bikes?

Thanks.


----------



## ColaJacket

safarinick said:


> New to road biking and have narrowed it down in my price range to 2 different bikes. Any advice on which one to go with?
> 
> #1 Motobecane Mirage SL
> http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/road_bikes/mirage_sl.htm
> 
> #2 Mercier Galexy AL 2014
> Road Bikes, Roadbikes - 2014 Mercier Galaxy AL
> 
> I'm 6'4" and about 190lbs. This will be used primarily for commuting and the occasional longer ride 20-40 miles.
> 
> Any advise will needed as this is my first bike and don't know a whole lot about all the technical aspects.
> 
> Also is there a cheaper place to buy one of these bikes?
> 
> Thanks.


Some questions to think about for a newbie buying new.

1. Do I know exactly what size fits me? Seat Tube, Top Tube, Stem Height, etc. Different brands will have different geometries. Unless you know some of these things to withing a mm or two, you'll want to road test a bike with that exact frame to be sure that it will fit. If the bike doesn't fit, you'll either have to send it back for another bike (and shipping it back will cost you money), or you won't ride it. 

2. How willing and knowledgeable are you on putting a bike together and doing bike maintenance? If you need a LBS to put the bike together for you, then that could be another $100 right there. And if you need adjustments from the LBS, they'll charge you for that. If you buy from the LBS, putting the bike together and adjustments are going to be free.

Unless you're absolutely sure on these things.

Now, if you're coming from mountain biking, you may be more knowledgeable on these item than where I was a month ago. To me, it was worth the $100-$200 to buy from a LBS (Performance Bikes). I would recommend Performance Bikes to you, but it looks like the closest one to you is in Ann Arbor, so it really isn't a LBS. 

Both bikes are 8-speed in the rear, which probably means mostly Claris (or older Sora). You should be able to find something comparable at a LBS for ~ $600.

BD will often have the least expensive bikes, buy you may end up paying more for putting it together and maintenance, if you're not planning on doing that yourself. 

At least go to some LBS's in your area, see what they have and road test some bikes. That will at least give you a baseline on what kind of geometry you want on the bike. 

GH


----------



## safarinick

Thanks for the input. My dad is a big biker and said he would help me put it together. I was planning on going to a shop to get sized regardless of whether I buy online or in store. Was just wondering if either of these stand out as being a better buy for the money.


----------



## ColaJacket

safarinick said:


> Thanks for the input. My dad is a big biker and said he would help me put it together. I was planning on going to a shop to get sized regardless of whether I buy online or in store. Was just wondering if either of these stand out as being a better buy for the money.


It looks like the big differences are these:

1. Motobecane has better shifters: Shimano CLARIS ST-2400 STI 8 Speed Shifter, which look better than the Mercier's Shimano STI ST2303. The big difference it looks like is that the ST2303 has thumb shifters for down shifting, where the ST-2400 has a second lever for shifting. With the thumb shifters, it's very hard to use that shifter from the drops. 

2. Mercier had a triple front crank as opposed to the Motobecane's double crank. That might help for commuting.

3. Mercier has rear rack mounts which might be helpful for commuting. 

If you're going to primarily be commuting, the Mercier might be a little better. If you could get the Mercier with the ST-2400 STI shifters, then that would be the best combination. There's not a big difference between the two. You have to decide which of these 3 are most important to you. 

GH


----------



## vegbikergirl

Hi all! I am looking into buying my first road bike, so I went down to my LBS and asked the guys there what I should get. We looked at a few (I stress few because my budget is only around $600). 

I want to get into road biking for exercise, but not racing. I probably won't buy clip-less pedals and some of the other more "intense" things until later. I was thinking a bike, helmet, good pair of sneakers, saddle bag w/ repair kit, and water bottle holder would be sufficient for now... thoughts?

One was the *SE Royale 16*. It was an aluminum bike, but they had replace the front fork with a carbon one. I haven't been able to find many review on this bike or brand, except for ones that complain that it did not come pre-assembled when ordering it from amazon. Does anyone know anything about this brand or model? This bike was also significantly cheaper, so if there is reason enough to try it out, that'd be great!

The others were Treks. The *Lexa* and the *1.1*. They all looked pretty similar to me, so is there a significant difference between a Trek vs a SE, or these models? Is there something different altogether that I should consider?

Thank you for any time/advice!!


----------



## ColaJacket

vegbikergirl said:


> Hi all! I am looking into buying my first road bike, so I went down to my LBS and asked the guys there what I should get. We looked at a few (I stress few because my budget is only around $600).
> 
> I want to get into road biking for exercise, but not racing. I probably won't buy clip-less pedals and some of the other more "intense" things until later. I was thinking a bike, helmet, good pair of sneakers, saddle bag w/ repair kit, and water bottle holder would be sufficient for now... thoughts?
> 
> One was the *SE Royale 16*. It was an aluminum bike, but they had replace the front fork with a carbon one. I haven't been able to find many review on this bike or brand, except for ones that complain that it did not come pre-assembled when ordering it from amazon. Does anyone know anything about this brand or model? This bike was also significantly cheaper, so if there is reason enough to try it out, that'd be great!
> 
> The others were Treks. The *Lexa* and the *1.1*. They all looked pretty similar to me, so is there a significant difference between a Trek vs a SE, or these models? Is there something different altogether that I should consider?
> 
> Thank you for any time/advice!!


We don't know where you live, so we can't really suggest anything too specific. If you live near a Performance Bike, then you should probably check them out, as they tend to have bikes in your price range. 

I'd check out other LBS's in your area, and test ride bikes in your price range. Sometimes you might have to test ride a bike that is a little out of your price range, but the LBS can order one with the same frame, but a groupset that is not as good. In your price range, if you get a bike with Shimano, you'll probably be looking at the Shimano Claris groupset (maybe the Sora groupset on a previous year's model). The Shimano Tourney is considered to be pretty inferior to the Claris groupset, so you should probably avoid them. The SE Royale 16 looks like it has Claris, so it would be a decent bike in your price range.

Remember that fit is very important, and if the bike doesn't fit, then it's not a good deal. I also recommend going to several LBS's because that lets you try different brands, and each brand has a slightly different geometry, and one brand's geometry may fit you better than another brand's geometry. Also, by going to several different LBS's, it helps you compare one bike's fit to another bike's fit. And some LBS's may try to put you on a bike that doesn't quite fit, because they want to move the bike. By trying several LBS's, you should be able to figure out if the bike doesn't quite fit, by comparing it to a variety of other bikes. 

GH


----------



## nick779

ColaJacket said:


> We don't know where you live, so we can't really suggest anything too specific. If you live near a Performance Bike, then you should probably check them out, as they tend to have bikes in your price range.
> 
> I'd check out other LBS's in your area, and test ride bikes in your price range. Sometimes you might have to test ride a bike that is a little out of your price range, but the LBS can order one with the same frame, but a groupset that is not as good. In your price range, if you get a bike with Shimano, you'll probably be looking at the Shimano Claris groupset (maybe the Sora groupset on a previous year's model). The Shimano Tourney is considered to be pretty inferior to the Claris groupset, so you should probably avoid them. The SE Royale 16 looks like it has Claris, so it would be a decent bike in your price range.
> 
> Remember that fit is very important, and if the bike doesn't fit, then it's not a good deal. I also recommend going to several LBS's because that lets you try different brands, and each brand has a slightly different geometry, and one brand's geometry may fit you better than another brand's geometry. Also, by going to several different LBS's, it helps you compare one bike's fit to another bike's fit. And some LBS's may try to put you on a bike that doesn't quite fit, because they want to move the bike. By trying several LBS's, you should be able to figure out if the bike doesn't quite fit, by comparing it to a variety of other bikes.
> 
> GH



Definitely get a bike that fits, you dont want to invest in something that will cause you aches and pains. Bear in mind that there are several road geometries (race, Endurance, cyclocross, TT) and they all fit slightly different. For instance im a 58cm on an enduro geometry, but on a race frame im more comfortable on a 56.

Also, dont let Claris discourage you. I rode a '15 Specialized Allez with Claris 2400, and despite being an entry level gruppo I thoroughly enjoyed it. 8 speed has been perfected so theres much less tinkering and adjusting youll have to do. I wouldnt go with A050 (Tourney) though, thats a little too low end.


----------



## blackfrancois

i've been flipping '70s and '80s vintage steel, and this is what i usually look for:

- nice original paint
- chromoly butted frame or better
- 3-piece cotterless cranks
- on frame rear derailleur hanger
- all aluminum components, especially rims
- down tube or bar end shifters.

if it has all that stuff, i consider it at least mid-level ... so it's worth fully refubishing and riding it.


----------



## smokinbikes

I bought my bike at goodwill. I spent more getting a match set of wheels.
Now it's so sweet.


----------



## PJ352

Beautiful... congrats and ride safe.


----------



## Duglas777

Thanks everyone,I found out many intresting things!


----------



## BikeLayne

The Nashbar aluminum 105 road bike is going to be $630.00 on the 17th. It comes with a lifetime warranty. Unlike other warranties out there this one will give you a full refund for the rest of your life. That's the Nashbar promise. . If the 17th is to soon then just buy it on any of the 25% off sales for $675.00.


----------



## stogies4life

Great tips here!


----------



## Singlebiker

Thanks for sharing this with us. I bought an entry level bike and when I saw a higher end bike I felt that I need to upgrade my bike lol and forget to buy the essentials such as helmet, gloves, lights, bike lock, and I have been looking into go pro for to record my long rides. 

Last week I tried to borrow from https://www.adoramarentals.com/p-~gphero7k/GOPRO-HERO7-12MP-4K-CAMERA-KIT and the video quality is fine or should I go for lights and helmet.


----------



## Fredrico

Singlebiker said:


> Thanks for sharing this with us. I bought an entry level bike and when I saw a higher end bike I felt that I need to upgrade my bike lol and forget to buy the essentials such as helmet, gloves, lights, bike lock, and I have been looking into go pro for to record my long rides.
> 
> Last week I tried to borrow from https://www.adoramarentals.com/p-~gphero7k/GOPRO-HERO7-12MP-4K-CAMERA-KIT and the video quality is fine or should I go for lights and helmet.


Are you serious?

Lights and helmet, Singlebiker! You've got the whole world ahead of you in 3 D, smellorama, and surround sound. Take it all in at 15 mph, knowing sooner or later you're going to fall and hit your head. :yesnod: Don't leave home without a helmet.:nono: 

A little flashing tail light will also come in handy this time of year, so cars don't hit you. At night unlit bicycles are invisible until they're in the headlights and by then it may be too late.


----------



## slowflow

Newbie buying a new bike. Need help

I have been using a hard tail mountain bike with 26x2.1 knobby wheels (no one at home using it) for the past 2 months now. Problem is that I’m too tall for a frame size 15. Now that I am getting the hang of it and having fun, I would like to purchase my first bicycle. My daily route is only in the city. Im doing about 30 kilometers a day and improving. Question now is, do I get a road bike or a gravel bike with not so wide tires? I mentioned gravel bike because after doing some research and asking friends, they are all pointing towards a gravel bike for its versatility. 

My budget is around $1,000. Would appreciate some suggestions. 

Additional info, I will also be riding with friends in the future who do long rides (100 kilometers). All road. 

Thanks in advance.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## SWF

Hey folks, Scott here. I’m looking to get into the sport. I live near Knoxville East TN. What would be a good bike shop or two near my location that I could visit, check out the bikes, meet good shop folks and purchase a bike. I’m looking to spend up to approximately $1500,00 on a bike. Thank you.


----------



## Lombard

SWF said:


> Hey folks, Scott here. I’m looking to get into the sport. I live near Knoxville East TN. What would be a good bike shop or two near my location that I could visit, check out the bikes, meet good shop folks and purchase a bike. I’m looking to spend up to approximately $1500,00 on a bike. Thank you.


Hi Scott and welcome! You can get a pretty good alloy bike for $1,500. A good carbon bike would bring you up to at least $2,000.

As far is which shops are good, keep in mind this is a global forum and chances of finding someone here in your area with experience with those shops is slim. The best way to find a good shop is to ask people in a local bike club or even to check ratings on Google Maps. Then go visit shops and test ride different bikes. A good shop will be patient with you and let you test ride bikes. They will also give you a good fitting once you have chosen your bike - that being putting you and your new bike on a trainer, watch you pedal and make adjustments to dial in your fit just right.

Lastly, don't get hung up on brand. There are many great brands out there. It is better that you like the feel and ride of the bike and that it fits you just right. A bike that doesn't fit is a recipe for repetitive use injury and then you will lose interest in the sport. A positive experience will make it a sport you will love.

Good luck!


----------



## Souke-Cycling

Hi everyone, it is hard for me to read 56 pages posts, so I will just jump to my question. 
I like road bikes, especially after I am now selling road bike apparels. The more cyclists I meet, the more I want to ride myself.  So I am also deciding to buy my own a bicycle. And I did some research as well. Now I got several questions:
1. There aren't too many bike shops local, most are Giant, and most of the bikes are MTB ones,. so not too much road bike choice. 
2. My budget is within 1500USD. I know I can find some great ones if I live USA, or other countries, but in China, most of the outside brands are just like doubled price. So I suppose the 1500USD I can buy will just like the one you purchased like 1000USD in your local. Sad thing.  
3. There are many other Chinese brands, very very cheap, but I don't want to try them out, haha~
4. I do visit some LBS, and I had a great experience with one store, but it is actually too far away from where I live. The store owner is very nice and professional, and I like their brands they offer: Cannondale, Willer, Merida, etc. But there aren't too much entry levels,  and most of their bikes are beyond my budget. The more you look at the bikes, the more you want to invest yourself an expensive one. Haha! But I don't know if I can really ride that often, if I could keep on doing the thing. 

Anyway, I plan to get my first buy in like 2~3 month time, (since usually it will cost a long time to wait for the stock here) so hopefully I will get it and soon I can also show my riding experience here with you.


----------



## PBL450

That’s a good budget. You will get a nice bike in that price range. Don’t forget the essentials you will need, floor pump, extra tubes, C02... And a good set of shorts and a jersey. Oh wait... You have that covered!!! 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Lombard

PBL450 said:


> That’s a good budget. You will get a nice bike in that price range. Don’t forget the essentials you will need, floor pump, extra tubes, C02... And a good set of shorts and a jersey. Oh wait... You have that covered!!!


And don't forget - a good helmet.


----------



## Fredrico

Souke-Cycling said:


> Hi everyone, it is hard for me to read 56 pages posts, so I will just jump to my question.
> I like road bikes, especially after I am now selling road bike apparels. The more cyclists I meet, the more I want to ride myself.  So I am also deciding to buy my own a bicycle. And I did some research as well. Now I got several questions:
> 1. There aren't too many bike shops local, most are Giant, and most of the bikes are MTB ones,. so not too much road bike choice.
> 2. My budget is within 1500USD. I know I can find some great ones if I live USA, or other countries, but in China, most of the outside brands are just like doubled price. So I suppose the 1500USD I can buy will just like the one you purchased like 1000USD in your local. Sad thing.
> 3. There are many other Chinese brands, very very cheap, but I don't want to try them out, haha~
> 4. I do visit some LBS, and I had a great experience with one store, but it is actually too far away from where I live. The store owner is very nice and professional, and I like their brands they offer: Cannondale, Willer, Merida, etc. But there aren't too much entry levels,  and most of their bikes are beyond my budget. The more you look at the bikes, the more you want to invest yourself an expensive one. Haha! But I don't know if I can really ride that often, if I could keep on doing the thing.
> 
> Anyway, I plan to get my first buy in like 2~3 month time, (since usually it will cost a long time to wait for the stock here) so hopefully I will get it and soon I can also show my riding experience here with you.


Buy local. Check the grapevine, read the opinions, and you'll find something well worth the cost. Shimano 104 equipped bikes should be available in China for less price than in the US market, IMO. My Indian friend has had good luck with Chinese carbon frames. He's done 2 custom orders direct from the frame maker with no issues. Find your size online and buy used for half the price. No need to wait for something brand new. Bikes last much longer than cars, as far as things that go wrong with them, so age isn't nearly as important. 

Just remember, whatever bike you choose probably won't be the last. You have to start somewhere! Get set up, ride for a year or two, and you'll learn much better what your dream bike might be. Wilier, Cannondale, Merida are all possibilities that you will surely enjoy. There are many more choices. Have fun.

If I were looking to get started, I'd most likely choose a gravel bike for its versatility. i'd look for rear rack strut/fender eyelets and relaxed frame geometry, like parallel 73 degree angles, for comfort and directional stability.


----------



## Souke-Cycling

PBL450 said:


> That’s a good budget. You will get a nice bike in that price range. Don’t forget the essentials you will need, floor pump, extra tubes, C02... And a good set of shorts and a jersey. Oh wait... You have that covered!!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Thank you PBL450, I plan to talk with the store owner and see what will be suitable for me first, and then maybe whatever I want might wait for the stock for several months, lol. Hope I am lucky to have something available soon. 
And yess, advantages of me, I have the cycling clothing, haha! 😀


----------



## Souke-Cycling

Lombard said:


> And don't forget - a good helmet.


Thank you Lombard, haha! Yess, yess, and so many accessories to think about as wel.


----------



## Souke-Cycling

Fredrico said:


> Buy local. Check the grapevine, read the opinions, and you'll find something well worth the cost. Shimano 104 equipped bikes should be available in China for less price than in the US market, IMO. My Indian friend has had good luck with Chinese carbon frames. He's done 2 custom orders direct from the frame maker with no issues. Find your size online and buy used for half the price. No need to wait for something brand new. Bikes last much longer than cars, as far as things that go wrong with them, so age isn't nearly as important.
> 
> Just remember, whatever bike you choose probably won't be the last. You have to start somewhere! Get set up, ride for a year or two, and you'll learn much better what your dream bike might be. Wilier, Cannondale, Merida are all possibilities that you will surely enjoy. There are many more choices. Have fun.
> 
> If I were looking to get started, I'd most likely choose a gravel bike for its versatility. i'd look for rear rack strut/fender eyelets and relaxed frame geometry, like parallel 73 degree angles, for comfort and directional stability.


I am planning the Gravel bikes also


----------

