# Road Rage and Dealing with Beligerant Motorists



## jparman (Apr 18, 2006)

:mad2: Long time discussed topic, and I apologize for beating this issue, but I just don't understand why we cannot all get along. 

My bud rides to work everyday during the summer. Today was no exception. As he was pulling up to a stop sign a motorist sped up past him and turned into the stop sign, angling his SUV into the curb so he could not progress forward. The man then got out of his car and proceeded threaten him and told him to keep his bike off of the road. From what I heard it sounded like the guy had a personal vendetta against cyclists.

What? :mad2: 

My bud is quite a bit bigger than I and looks far more intimidating. That is probably what prevented this instance from escalating. Had I been in this situation, effectively cornered, I have no idea what I would have done. But I can tell you that I am scared just thinking about it.

What are peoples problem? I do not see why we cannot share the road. What is more frightening is the fact that when we were conversating about the issue at work fellow employees that don't ride empathized with the driver and said that he probably shouldn't ride his bike to work. This is not a solution to the problem.

I hate living around a bunch of ********.


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## MB1 (Jan 27, 2004)

I hope he got the license plate and called the police.

BTW IME pulling out a camera (or a cell phone) and taking a few photos sure calms folks down in a hurry.


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## treebound (Oct 16, 2003)

:mad2:


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## CFBlue (Jun 28, 1999)

My brother and his riding partner called the police by cell phone when they were detained by an angry, murderous motorist. The dispatcher on the other end of the line told him as the incident was happening that they would not send out an officer until there was some actual, physical assault. They wouldn't help until one of them had been run over, punched, or in some way injured. The dispatcher refused to even listen to the license plate number.

I would still call, photograph, etc, just to scare the driver off, but don't expect much from cops apparently. I do suppose that the response varies by area.


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## treebound (Oct 16, 2003)

:mad2: .


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## joey1 (Jan 2, 2007)

MB1 said:


> BTW IME pulling out a camera (or a cell phone) and taking a few photos sure calms folks down in a hurry.


I've done this and the guy went from tough guy to pleading not to get the police involved. The gene pool around here is well below average. I just expect people to hate me out of pure ignorance and stupidity.

You have to learn to accept being a social outcast and a 2nd class citezen while on a bike and out on public roads. That or move to Belgium.


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## Henry Chinaski (Feb 3, 2004)

Carry a gun. 

Have you guys seen this video? ******** messing with yuppies in a Bimmer. Cracks me up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWF_J6XObJU


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## Fixed (May 12, 2005)

*disengage*

I think you can't engage, except for maybe the photo op, as MB1 suggested (I like that), for several reasons. 1) We can be run over easily; 2) Most of us are past the age in which getting into fights is acceptable; and 3) it's just not worth the mental anguish to give it any thought.

Yesterday on the way home, a pickup driver looked right at me and then pulled halfway out from a commercial parking lot to enter a lane of stopped cars, fully blocking the bike lane, and stopped. Sure, it hacked me off. But, I just jumped up on the sidewalk and sped around the back of the pickup, then jumped back down on the bike lane, and was a block away before he even started moving. No gestures or obscenities, even though fully warranted.

I think you have to treat these situations as a big "whatever," and just keep going. You can't "win." Someone pulls over and tries to engage, I'd just move on. Five minutes later they'll probably realize how stupid they looked.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

I do what MB1 says. I carry a camera and start taking pictures. I even pretended that my cell phone had a camera once. It doesn't. As soon as someone realizes that there will be evidence, most drivers will just say something else stupid and drive away with a big display of tire spinning. 

When I lived in Virginia Beach, I had a guy force me into the curb while looking out the back window of his truck and pointing to the sidewalk. There was quite a bit of traffic ahead so I caught up with him at a light. I verbally unloaded on him (I'm a sailor) which pretty much terrified the guy and then I rode next to him for the next mile in traffic telling him that I was following him home to kick his a$$. I didn't follow him home, but for about ten minutes in traffic he thought I would.


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## Fixed (May 12, 2005)

*hmm; funny, but not recommended*



Henry Chinaski said:


> Carry a gun.
> 
> Have you guys seen this video? ******** messing with yuppies in a Bimmer. Cracks me up.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWF_J6XObJU


That's one of those things that you like to see once in a while, but you don't ever want to be the one involved. Could have been ugly.


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## MB1 (Jan 27, 2004)

*You gotta remember that I am usually riding with my wife when this stuff happens.*



Fixed said:


> I think you can't engage, except for maybe the photo op, as MB1 suggested (I like that.........


I don't know why but most of the craziness seems to happen in the evening commute and that is when Miss M and I are riding together. I am not about to back away if someone is threatening my wife (who isn't about to back down from a fool either).

Anyway over time I have admitted to myself that it is useless to debate or argue with a fool (all that results is they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience).

Just pull out the camera and start hitting the shutter button and everything quickly calms down. (One of these days I will have to turn the camera on :blush2: and post some of the resulting images  ).

MB1
Peace through superior pixel power!
:thumbsup:


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## Fixed (May 12, 2005)

*of course*



MB1 said:


> I am not about to back away if someone is threatening my wife (who isn't about to back down from a fool either).


Of course, Lancelot, you have to defend the lady (and yourself). ;-) 

But, as Miyagi say, "Best way no get hit is no be there."


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## filtersweep (Feb 4, 2004)

I have done that, and the police would not do anything. The phone cam is an interesting idea, however.



MB1 said:


> I hope he got the license plate and called the police.
> 
> BTW IME pulling out a camera (or a cell phone) and taking a few photos sure calms folks down in a hurry.


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## Kalrog (Aug 17, 2006)

MB1 said:


> MB1
> Peace through superior pixel power!
> :thumbsup:


I gotta remember that one!


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## slowrider (Mar 12, 2004)

Be prepared for the idiots when gas hits 3 bucks again this summer. The higher the price of gas, the more people want to vent their anger at people on bikes. I had a jerk that would yell at me almost everytime I road home. He was always going in the opposite direction, but would lean out of the window to yell something that I could not understand at 60mph. Jerk. 



Fixed said:


> Of course, Lancelot, you have to defend the lady (and yourself). ;-)
> 
> But, as Miyagi say, "Best way no get hit is no be there."


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## Henry Chinaski (Feb 3, 2004)

Fixed said:


> That's one of those things that you like to see once in a while, but you don't ever want to be the one involved. Could have been ugly.


Agreed.


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## M.J. (Jan 28, 2004)

funny - staged?


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## lancezneighbor (May 4, 2002)

MB1 said:


> I hope he got the license plate and called the police.
> 
> BTW IME pulling out a camera (or a cell phone) and taking a few photos sure calms folks down in a hurry.


GREAT advice! I'm going to start keeping my cell phone more accessible. I've done something similar with dogs for years. Any time a dog starts to chase me (when I'm walkin or running) I just bend down to the ground. ALL dogs think I'm going for a rock and turn around. It has never failed. I think the cell phone/camera thing will work just as well with people. Just pull it out and they will turn around. 

Thanks for the idea.


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## joey1 (Jan 2, 2007)

lancezneighbor said:


> Any time a dog starts to chase me (when I'm walkin or running) I just bend down to the ground. ALL dogs think I'm going for a rock and turn around. It has never failed.


Squirting a water bottle in a dogs face always works for me.


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## Fixed (May 12, 2005)

*key words*



Big Bad John said:


> My brother and his riding partner called the police by cell phone when they were detained by an angry, murderous motorist. The dispatcher on the other end of the line told him as the incident was happening that they would not send out an officer until there was some actual, physical assault. They wouldn't help until one of them had been run over, punched, or in some way injured. The dispatcher refused to even listen to the license plate number.
> 
> I would still call, photograph, etc, just to scare the driver off, but don't expect much from cops apparently. I do suppose that the response varies by area.


It would probably work better if you describe the bad guys as Arab terrorists (or is that passe now?). ;-)


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## Chain (Dec 28, 2006)

A lot of the phones nowdays also have video with sound. I would think that may come in handy also.

It's almost time to ride home. If I get any pictures, I'll share!


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## RHRoop (Nov 1, 2006)

*If you feel threatened*

tell them you think you saw a weapon if 911 or the Dispatcher is not willing to take your compaint. If the driver made you feel threatened with their vehicle that is assault and the police have an obligation to assist you.

If you are a resident of the town then call the sheriff, mayor or your elected representative and complain. It helps if you have some political affiliation and vote (which I'm sure you do).

If you still don't get any satisfaction and it really matters to you sue them. That will get their attention and probably a change in policy as well. Chances are they will at least take YOUR calls if not those of other cyclists.


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## DrRoebuck (May 10, 2004)

RHRoop said:


> tell them you think you saw a weapon if 911 or the Dispatcher is not willing to take your compaint. If the driver made you feel threatened with their vehicle that is assault and the police have an obligation to assist you.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

(Sorry.)


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## rcnute (Dec 21, 2004)

Show you are angrier, crazier and more belligerent.


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## mandovoodoo (Aug 27, 2005)

This seems terrible to me. We get treated very nicely around here, mostly. 

1. If you're cornered, that's civil assault and perhaps false imprisonment - can't back a bike up and you're being restrained from free movement. 

2. I like the "think he has a weapon in the car" thing.

3. While behaving unreasonably is soooooo easy (I've done it - broken glass, ripped off mirror, ripped off aerial, probably $5K in body damage), being the one behaving reasonably seems to be a great advantage in disputes. 

4. Investigation can usually determine whose car it is. If a minor is driving, the parents are generally happy to remedy things. I've arranged for that. If an adult, then generally $50 of investigation can get the employer. A polite and dignified letter requesting to know whether the culprit was driving on company business at the time will go a long way towards building an idiot's internal controls. Companies don't like being responsible for damages. Someone who will hassle others on their own time will likely do it on company time, too.

An example in a different context: I got a bogus trademark/copyright infringement email from a young lady attempting to squat on a brand I carry. From her work address. I fired a nice letter off addressed to the general counsel of that company asking why they were involving me in a dispute that should have been brought against an importer rather than a retailer etc etc. Everything I could think of, and listing counterclaims I would bring if they proceeded with this ill advised course of action. Of course, the company had no idea what was going on. Just misuse of email. She lost her job instantly and I got an apology from the company. Private solutions work quite well.

Finding out the idiot's insurance company via investigation works nicely, too. Simply send a narrative of the event and suggest they might not wish to insure this type of future felon will do wonders. 

And anonymous letters to the spouse indicating "he's at it again" will bring pressure at home.

Just don't lie. The truth is always a defense to defamation claims.

5. If you can get witnesses, then visit the DA's office and insist the DA move against the thug.

6. If you're really in danger often, change a route or be prepared to go armed and able to defend yourself. Going armed is a very demanding thing. I'm licensed to do so, I've defended myself with a firearm, and I don't regularly go armed, especially when cycling. Simply too demanding, risky, etc. for me. Easy to think that's an answer, but I've been on both ends of weapons and didn't find it very fun at all. 

Great video, too. Don't get suckered down a back road or double-teamed by two cars! Reminds me of the fellow I used to ride with who lost his temper (very unusual) after having his ass slapped by an idiot in a car. I suspect the idiots in the car still recall that incident - his big arm went in through car window, moved around fast for 30 seconds, and came out again. Car didn't move. Crying from car. I kept riding!


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## singlecross (Nov 1, 2006)

FixedI think you have to treat these situations as a big "whatever said:


> Ding!Ding!Ding! Good answer. Most times these people want a respose, I don't indulge them.
> 
> singlecross


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## StillRiding (Sep 16, 2006)

If you're going to ride on public roads, you're going to get hassled by motorists. There's a small but significant number of selfish, immature, hostile, mentally-deficient, physically impaired, frustrated, inebriated, (add your adjective) people out there, and the odds are good that you'll encounter at least one on any given day. I average about two. They pass with inches to spare, shout, honk, cut you off, throw things, and in the worst case display weapons and threaten to use them. The best thing you can do is just develop a thick skin, ride very defensively and get away from any situation as quickly as possible. Engaging in confrontation is just a dangerous macho game that accomplishes nothing and could end up getting you injured or killed. I wouldn't even stop to take pictures. It just may piss off some mentally unstable individual with a gun.

Of course I never follow my own advice. Just today my wife and I were passed by a car full of teenagers who honked and screamed at just the right moment to startle the crap out of us. Unfortunately for them, we caught up at a light about a half mile later. By then they had forgotten the whole incident and were busy discussing the latest American Idol. The passenger side window was down and I rolled up, stuck my head in and gave my best imitation of of a gorilla on crack. I'm sure at least one of them had to go home and change pants. The look on their faces was priceless. To add insult to injury, my wife rode up after me and sweetly informed them that it really isn't nice to yell and honk at cyclists.


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