# Campagnolo Torx



## Eyorerox (Feb 19, 2008)

Why have Campag changed from Hex to Torx for my new group set?
anyone have any idea?


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## orange_julius (Jan 24, 2003)

Eyorerox said:


> Why have Campag changed from Hex to Torx for my new group set?
> anyone have any idea?


To give you a hard time?

More seriously though, Torx is more reliable than Hex, it's harder to mess things up (e.g., strip them) due to mis-alignment of the driver. Torx has twice as many surfaces, and at a better angle to the force, than Hex.


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## PlatyPius (Feb 1, 2009)

orange_julius said:


> To give you a hard time?
> 
> More seriously though, Torx is more reliable than Hex, it's harder to mess things up (e.g., strip them) due to mis-alignment of the driver. Torx has twice as many surfaces, and at a better angle to the force, than Hex.


^ This.

Hex/Allen fasteners are too easy to round out. The bad thing, of course, is that there are no ball-end Torx tools so you can get at difficult bolts.


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## natedg200202 (Sep 2, 2008)

I think it is so they can use aluminum fasteners (weight savings and cost savings compared to Ti) in certain applications with less worry of the user stripping / rounding the head. 

I like them - I have a much more confident feeling tightening a torx fastener, even in soft aluminum.


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## OperaLover (Jan 20, 2002)

*So far all I have needed is TORX 25*

At least they are consistent. Frankly I like the TORX. Engagement of the tool in the bolt is very positive.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

You have given too much rep in the last 24 hours. Please try again later.


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

When they assemble ther components, if they use power drivers, the strength improvement of the TORX head is also useful.


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## Kristatos (Jan 10, 2008)

Just get a p-handle T-25 and you'll be set. The 3-Torx Y-wrench works great except installing/removing hoods where the extra length of the long side of the p-wrench makes it easier.


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## Eyorerox (Feb 19, 2008)

T30 for chainring bolts


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

The thing is that in many cases, the fasteners used on bikes are button heads or other even less common small head shapes. What this means is that often the socket size is even smaller than a normal socket head cap screw (where the head is cylindrical). The progression in tear-out resistance of the screw head is probably something like this (weakest to strongest): blade, Phillips, hex, star, Torx.


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## droptarotter (Nov 22, 2004)

The main reason companies go to Torx over any other fastener is tooling.
The making of a Torx fastener is not as hard on the tooling, the toolking bits do not wear out as fast.

When a company is making thousands of fasteners, tool bit replacement does become a cost concern..........once again the end user gets an inferior design due to cost savings.

Cheers


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## natedg200202 (Sep 2, 2008)

Dropt, the torx head is a superior fastener in that it offers greater resistance to cam-out compared to Philips and somewhat to hex. Yes, this increases the lifespan of the fastener and tool. 

I don't know where you are drawing the conclusion that this is cost saving (torx is more expensive) or inferior (it isn't).


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

natedg200202 said:


> Dropt, the torx head is a superior fastener in that it offers greater resistance to cam-out compared to Philips and somewhat to hex. Yes, this increases the lifespan of the fastener and tool.
> 
> I don't know where you are drawing the conclusion that this is cost saving (torx is more expensive) or inferior (it isn't).


Guess he didn't read my previous post either...


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## droptarotter (Nov 22, 2004)

Yeah, I read all the posts........

nate.......the Torx is a cost saving to the manufacturer, in that their tooling will last longer.

Maybe inferior was not the right word.......I think it comes down to me hating the bloody things.........I still prefer an allen head......at least you can get the Bondhus type tool to work with them. Not so critical on bicycles, but the Bondhus tool sure comes in handy on cars/motorcycles.
I also find the Torx harder to judge what size tool to use......or maybe that comes down to my old eyes??

Flatty........yep, I read your post and I agree with your tear out resistance list...........once again..........I guess it comes down to me hating the bloody Torx!

Cheers


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## flatlander_48 (Nov 16, 2005)

Well, hate it if you want, but it is a stronger solution. Remember that bicycles use a lot of small fasteners. It is VERY easy to overpower them. My guess that the increased strength is why Campagnolo uses them. If you strip the head out, it would be tough to extract the screw. In many cases, the holes are counterbored so there is no way that you can grab the head. Even if you could grab the head, it's not difficult to break it off. Then you're REALLY screwed (so to speak...).

From what I remember, Torx bits are still more expensive that hex bits. If you are assembling lots of products, you would pay slightly more for the bits, but as drop++++ said you would be able to do more fasteners before you worn out the bit. Probably the price of the bits is inconsequential. The major difference would likely be the amount of downtime for replacements.


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## natedg200202 (Sep 2, 2008)

droptarotter said:


> .......the Torx is a cost saving to the manufacturer, in that their tooling will last longer.


When you say "the manufacturer" are you talking about Campagnolo? I'm not seeing the cost savings. The torx fastener that they are providing cost more. The tool cost more. I don't think tooling cost (the cost of the torx head drivers they use at the factory to assemble?) add up to a large difference for torx vs allen as far as longevity. 

Are you just regurgitating what you read on Wikipedia?


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