# Difference in handling: MTB vs. Roadie?



## Oracle7775 (Sep 16, 2009)

I'm yet another long-time mountain biker who is getting a road bike because certain life changes are keeping me away from the trails during the week (3rd child just born and moved to a new house that's a 1/2 hour drive from the closest trailhead). 

I've been happily tooling around the county roads in the big ring of my dual suspension MTB (an '04 Klein Palomino) at a 16 mph average all summer to keep my base conditioning up so that I've got the stamina when I get to the trails. However, the county I live in has an active roadie contingent, and I gotta tell ya, even though I'm not all that competitive of a person, I'm f-ing tired of those bastards blowing by me on a routine basis!

I know someone who knows someone who is a sales manager at Trek, so I'm getting an incredible deal on a new Trek 1.5. I'm looking forward to the speed, and you guys have won me over on getting a few pair of decent shorts. But I'll always be an MTB'er first, so I'll probably still wear my Camelback, (at least the smaller one), leave the visor on my helmet, carry ten pounds of tools and never shave anything but my face!  

As I sit around impatiently waiting for the new ride to get here, my one concern is the difference in handling between my mountain bike and a road bike. I haven't ridden a bike with drop handlebars or skinny tires for 20 years, and I'll honestly say I'm a little bit intimidated by the thought of going fast with so little rubber on the road and the narrower bars.

So, three questions: 1) is there really that big of a difference?; 2) if there is, is there a good method to approach the transition (other than the common sense of just go slow around corners and get used to it)?; and 3) does it mess anyone up when switching from one to the other on a regular basis (e.g. trails on the weekends and roadie during the week)? 

Thanks!


----------



## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

A couple of comments

1. You have to be more aware on a road bike.... That crack in the pavement or rock that you ride over on your mtn bike, could cause you to crash on your road bike..

2. You won't have any problem going back and forth between the two....You'll notice the steering is probably quicker on one of the bikes( not necessarily the road bike) but you'll adjust in the first few minutes of riding..

3. It's not harder riding a road bike...It's just different


----------



## suprcivic (Apr 10, 2009)

i find that during regular riding, keeping your hands on the brake hoods is the most stable spot. you won't have any problems with steering there. 

you shouldn't have any problem switching back and forth between mtb and road. the only thing i notice is that when i've been on my road bike for weeks or months without mountain biking, i lose my line on the trail (bump rocks i shouldn't have hit, etc).


----------



## icsloppl (Aug 25, 2009)

> So, three questions: 1) is there really that big of a difference?; 2) if there is, is there a good method to approach the transition (other than the common sense of just go slow around corners and get used to it)?; and 3) does it mess anyone up when switching from one to the other on a regular basis (e.g. trails on the weekends and roadie during the week)?


1. Yes. Your weight will generally be further forward on your road bike and it will turn in and transition into corners more quickly. You also need to be much more relaxed on a road bike to allow thebike to corner optimnally and avoid high speed stability issues.

2. You can set your reach and drop to the hoods to match your mountain bike. It will make it feel more natural. Also, use 25mm tires with significantly less than the maximum air pressure. If you're ~160 lbs., start with 90 front / 95 rear.

3. IMO they complement each other and the combination of body positions and utilizations keeps your body fresher than sticking with one. Lots of cross and mtb riders have become sucxcessful roadies and exhibit superior handling skills because of their background. Kind of like mini-cross training.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

icsloppl said:


> 1. Yes. Your weight will generally be further forward on your road bike and it will turn in and transition into corners more quickly. You also need to be much more relaxed on a road bike to allow thebike to corner optimnally and avoid high speed stability issues.
> 
> 2. You can set your reach and drop to the hoods to match your mountain bike. It will make it feel more natural. Also, use 25mm tires with significantly less than the maximum air pressure. If you're ~160 lbs., start with 90 front / 95 rear.
> 
> 3. IMO they complement each other and the combination of body positions and utilizations keeps your body fresher than sticking with one. *Lots of cross and mtb riders *have become sucxcessful roadies and *exhibit superior handling skills *because of their background. Kind of like mini-cross training.


As a long time dedicated roadie I'm hopeful your opening "IMO" also applies to the bolded 'claim'. :wink5:


----------



## gegarrenton (Jul 10, 2009)

PJ352 said:


> As a long time dedicated roadie I'm hopeful your opening "IMO" also applies to the bolded 'claim'. :wink5:


I can't speak for him, but I would say, not really an IMO. There is a definite superiority in bike handling among the mtb and cross riders when compared to roadies, in the general sense. There are obviously exceptions, especially when comparing the top of one field to the bottom of the other.

The first thing that stood out when I started on the road was how awful the average roadies handling skills were. The good guys are really good, but the guys in the middle are waaay below average. Weight transfer is a foreign concept too apparently.

EDIT: With your experience though PJ, I think you are probably an excellent bike handler! :thumbsup:


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

gegarrenton said:


> I can't speak for him, but I would say, not really an IMO. There is a definite superiority in bike handling among the mtb and cross riders when compared to roadies, in the general sense. There are obviously exceptions, especially when comparing the top of one field to the bottom of the other.
> 
> The first thing that stood out when I started on the road was how awful the average roadies handling skills were. The good guys are really good, but the guys in the middle are waaay below average. Weight transfer is a foreign concept too apparently.
> 
> EDIT: With your experience though PJ, I think you are probably an excellent bike handler! :thumbsup:


My point is that icsloppl's (and now your) statements are opinions, with no basis in fact. Simply experiences/ perceptions that have now become your 'facts'.

I certainly would agree that being exposed to differing terrain requiring specific handling skills offers some advantages, but that doesn't just apply to cross or mtn biking. The same could be said for a roadie navigating a technical descent in excess of 50+ MPH. He's building expeience on the road while the off roader is building experience there. (see links below)

That given, IMO what you're _really _saying is that with more specialized experience comes improved handling skills, but while you apply it only one way (mtn/ cross to the road) I offer that it also goes the other way (road to mtn/ cross). There's not a harder/ easier, just different.

But both are just theories, thus the need for IMO, IMO, of course.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRxia2XSpt8&feature=related

And in the interest of fair play:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0ZouxxfoFo&NR=1&feature=fvwp


----------



## gegarrenton (Jul 10, 2009)

PJ352 said:


> My point is that icsloppl's (and now your) statements are opinions, with no basis in fact. Simply experiences/ perceptions that have now become your 'facts'.
> 
> I certainly would agree that being exposed to differing terrain requiring specific handling skills offers some advantages, but that doesn't just apply to cross or mtn biking. The same could be said for a roadie navigating a technical descent in excess of 50+ MPH. He's building expeience on the road while the off roader is building experience there. (see links below)
> 
> ...


All valid points PJ, and I respect your opinion. Things definitely go both ways, but I think the gross sum of handling skills are considerably skewed to the technical side therefore I still feel that overall handling is definitely biased towards mtb/crosser's, but it is most certainly my perception. 

Plus 50mph downhills happen in both.


----------



## Oracle7775 (Sep 16, 2009)

suprcivic said:


> i find that during regular riding, keeping your hands on the brake hoods is the most stable spot. you won't have any problems with steering there.
> 
> you shouldn't have any problem switching back and forth between mtb and road. the only thing i notice is that when i've been on my road bike for weeks or months without mountain biking, i* lose my line on the trail (bump rocks i shouldn't have hit, etc*).


That's why I have the full-suspension Klein--don't have to worry about the rocks cause I can just go right over them!


----------



## Oracle7775 (Sep 16, 2009)

gegarrenton said:


> All valid points PJ, and I respect your opinion. Things definitely go both ways, but I think the gross sum of handling skills are considerably skewed to the technical side therefore I still feel that overall handling is definitely biased towards mtb/crosser's, but it is most certainly my perception.
> 
> *Plus 50mph downhills happen in both.*



I don't doubt that they exist, but I live in Wisconsin. I have yet to find a downhill section of singletrack where I can hit 35 (at least not on my 28 lb FS rig), much less fifty!

I asked the question originally, because I wanted to confirm my gut feeling that there's likely a different set of handling skills necessary on a road bike than a mountain bike. I would imagine that, while there may be some overlap, there are certain skills that are exclusive to one or the other. Obviously, on a road bike you aren't taking downhill hairpin switchbacks over loose/slippery rocks and roots at speed, and I can't imagine ever having to crank the bars on a road bike as far as you need to on the trail. 

Like someone said above, the principle of weight transfer has got to be just as important on both, but in different ways. Weight transfer on an MTB to get around those tight corners can be a violent affair. I'm always throwing my body around to get around obstacles, get the right line, go around tight turns, slow down/speed up, keep the bike level, etc. On the road, I would imagine that your weight transfer would need to be far more fluid and subtle to take corners at high speed.

What about shifting? The best mountain bikers (and I don't claim to be one of them) are always five shifts ahead on tight singletrack, meaning that they've planned out their shifting strategy to match the upcoming visible terrain. On a mountain bike, you can find yourself shifting up and down, front and rear, multiple times inside of a quarter mile. How is road shifting the same/different? 

This is a fun discussion, let's keep it going!


----------



## electech (Aug 7, 2009)

As far as shifting goes, the road bike will require less than what you are used to on the MTB. Typically, if you have the compact (double) ring up front, you will stay in the big most of the time and just work the rear gears. Climbing, you will generally drop to the small in front and work the rear gears. Now, if you are like me and trying to get your road legs, you might be working the gears just as much as the MTB!!!!


----------



## icsloppl (Aug 25, 2009)

Oracle7775 said:


> I don't doubt that they exist, but I live in Wisconsin. I have yet to find a downhill section of singletrack where I can hit 35 (at least not on my 28 lb FS rig), much less fifty!
> 
> I asked the question originally, because I wanted to confirm my gut feeling that there's likely a different set of handling skills necessary on a road bike than a mountain bike. I would imagine that, while there may be some overlap, there are certain skills that are exclusive to one or the other. Obviously, on a road bike you aren't taking downhill hairpin switchbacks over loose/slippery rocks and roots at speed, and I can't imagine ever having to crank the bars on a road bike as far as you need to on the trail.
> 
> ...



Example: In Colorado Springs, I lived between Garden of the Gods ( a steep and twisting road) and Palmer Park (a fairly technical / dry / rocky mountain bike trail area)

If I went on a ride in Palmer Park with a MTB rider who successfully negotiates the technical loop trail, then ride over to GoftheG's on road bikes, I'd have little reason to worry about their ability to safely complete the ride.

OTOH if an accomplished road rider (with little MTB experience) and i rode GoftheG and then attempted Palmer Park, the best that i'd hope they would be smart enough to walk the more difficult sections. If they attempted to ride the whole thing, they'd likely be injured at some level.

The skill level needed to ride safely on any paved road vs. moderate to difficult off-road terrain is completely different. The skills one needs, particularly weight tranfer and the ability to see, plot, and negiotiate optimal lines, are far more critical and difficult for the MTB rider.

OP - IMO the biggest differences between mountain and road skill applications:

Weight transfer. Generally in mounain biking you get your weight back when negotiating technical terrain to allow your front wheel to maintain your intended line. On the road, the same technique will make your front wheel wash out, which is generally painful.

Tension. While staying loose on the bike is always a good thing, it's critical on a road bike. A difference between good and bad road bike handlers is the ability to allow the bike to "do the work". Try this with your new ride. Find a downhill turn, and take it at moderate speed while gripping the bars as firmly as you can. Then do it again while gripping as lightly as you might with a pencil.


----------



## C130 (Oct 10, 2008)

I have only had a road bike for a year but after riding the road bike I can't get comfortable on the mountain bike for some reason. It feels small to me after riding the road bike. I am 6 ft., mountain bike is a large Cannondale Rush and the road bike is a 58 cm SuperSix. My 8 year old son did his first mountain bike race last weekend, 10.25 miles. I did the men's Cat 3, 40-49 just for the fun of it and my legs about killed me, feels nothing like the road bike and I feel like I am using completely different leg muscles. Any suggestions? I ride the road bike about 30 miles a day, 3-4 times a week, sometimes I do more, around 200 miles a week. I am going to do some adjustments on the mountain bike this weekend.


----------



## Lifelover (Jul 8, 2004)

If you are a reasonably accomplished MTBer you will have no problems adjusting to the handling of a road bike.

The opposite is not necessarily true.

The close quarters riding might not be comfortable at first but you will adapt to it quickly.

Another difference is that most roadies think their bikes are much more delicate than they actually are while many MTBers think theirs are indestructible.


----------



## xcroder (Sep 13, 2009)

i too started on mtn bikes. i can go from one to the other with no problem. the road bike will improve you mtn bike skills, it has mine. when your not as tired you can focus on the trail better. i use to have back soreness while on the mtn but now its gone. i guess the road strengthens you for both.


----------



## yourideit (Mar 25, 2009)

when all is said and done, a bike is a bike. it sounds like you have the skills and the desire to ride road so go have some fun.

i'm a mtbr by nature. i just recently got back into road riding. i also ride a "dirt road bike" and a townie grocery getter fixed thing. a bike is a bike and i feel that knowing each of the bikes' personalities helps me be an overall better rider. period. 

here is a few things that i found on my first few road rides;

i wore my little camelbak at first. i don't any more. two water bottles is enough. you can carry all the "tools" you need in your seat bag and in your jersey. it also lowers your center of gravity. i carry the full garage of tools on my mtb still because i tend to break stuff when i am out in the woods. if you make sure your roadie is good to go before the ride, they shouldn't break down very often. flats aside.

my one helmet is my helmet. it has a visor. it helps keep the sun out of my eyes.

shorts and a jersey are not gay. i found road is all about being comfortable on the bike and logging miles. i don't like flapping shorts or shirts.

the first time i spun out 53x11 on the roadie it honestly scared the hell out of me. that's really fast on a 18lb steel bike with skinny tires! the thing with road is to trust your bike. that means proper maintenance. if you know the bike is good to go, then it is good to go. i think you would be wise to go with 25mm tires. it will provide a little more cush factor.
the faster you go, the more relaxed you should be. counterintuitive yes, but true. let the bike do the work and go along for the ride. poor position on the bike and a death grip on the bars adds to possible speed wobble. look ahead, pick lines, hold em. know where you want to be before you get there. the 'weight transfer' IS much more fluid and should happen naturally for you. cars tend to cut sharp corners and that tosses gravel out onto the road. allways watch for gravel while cornering!

my mtb has a mix of xo and xt. my roadie has chorus 11. my cross thing has a mix of da/ultegra/fsa. the fixie is, well, fixed. your trek will come with ultegra i imagine? ultegra is the xt of road and all of these are top of the line and will work that way if maintained. i like my bikes so i never force shifts. know the gear you should be in before you need it. you know how this all works. don't ever use both shifters at the same time because this is bad joojoo and the karma man will come see you. i tend to keep a higher, more consistant cadence on the road. i last longer that way. therefore, i shift way more on the road and mash more in the mountains. well, i mash mountain roadie roads as well and my friends hate me cuz i drop them more times than not. thanks xc mountain biking :thumbsup: 

i wear tight shorts in the woods and have hairy legs and a full beard while on the road. everybody hates me and i like it that way. now go have fun on your new toy.


----------



## nomit (Jul 13, 2009)

> So, three questions: 1) is there really that big of a difference?; 2) if there is, is there a good method to approach the transition (other than the common sense of just go slow around corners and get used to it)?; and 3) does it mess anyone up when switching from one to the other on a regular basis (e.g. trails on the weekends and roadie during the week)?


1, 2 & 3) don't worry about it. yea, it feels different...but only for the first minute or two, and then it feels natural and the other one feels different. after riding road for awhile, my 23lb XC bike feels like a tank with giant wheels. after riding my mt bike for awhile....the road bike feels twitchy and a little unstable for the first block.

there's no way around it. but your mind/body adjusts very quickly.


----------



## singlespeedbuss (Aug 6, 2009)

1)No. 2) flow around turns like a formula 1 car. 3)No. Your mountain bike fitness will improve greatly because of the spinning you do on the road. Clean shave`n legs seem weird until you lose some skin in a crash and the scabs and hair are stuck together. Makes a little less uncomfortable in the healing process.


----------

