# Looking to Buy New Road Bike $1500 Range



## jeepsouth

Hello, everyone.
I have posted a few times in the Buying a New Bike on a Budget thread.
I am a male, 54, in good shape from lot of running. I don't intend to race. I plan to do rides with a group or on my own of 20-60 miles, or more. My wife is also buying a bike and we plan to ride together often.

Here is where I am now after a lot of research and a lot of test rides:
1) Total Budget is $1800-$2000. But, that is for bike, pedals, shoes, clothing, etc. So, I'm looking in the $1500 range for a bike with $300+ for everything else. However, of course, the less I have to spend, all the better for me.
2) I've been impressed with the SRAM Apex gearing. With all of the hills in this area, I have found this group to be the best for me. Not a deal breaker though. 105 is the second choice.
3) I feel strongly about buying from (and cultivating a relationship with) a LBS.
4) I will get fitted.
5) I don't know much yet about the various wheels, BB, saddles, tires, hubs, spokes, stems, etc. So, I am asking for your help in recommending the best bike for the money from the list below. The list is in no particular order. The shops that offer the bikes are all about equal in my view. However, the Specialized shop does a much, much more detailed fitting (they said to plan for over an hour in the shop for the fitting, and an additional 45 minutes or so for test riding).

A) TREK 2.1 Apex
B) Felt Z85
C) Specialized Secteur Comp Apex Compact
D) Giant Defy 1
E) Cannondale Synapse 5 105

If you can recommend one bike over another, please give me the reasons for your choice. I am really trying to learn and I really appreciate any info you can offer.
Thanks.


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## Digger51

All five bikes are good. You will have a good solid bike with any of them.

It will come down to what feels best to you and what color paint you like. I am like you in that I like the SRAM equipment. However, Shimano has been around a long time and they have thier shifters dialed in pretty good. Do not let the Specialized shop "WOW" you with a long drwan out fitting. As long as the other shops do an actual fitting and do not "eyeball" it you should be fine. Also, you will need 50 to 100 miles after the fitting to see it you need adjustments. A few test rides in 45 minutes will not be sufficiant.

Know this going into it; in a year you will have grown and learned a ton of information that you do not know now, so the bike you get today will be the right bike for you today, but in a year or two may not be the right bike anymore. Do not worry about BB, cranks, stems, spokes and all that stuff right now. Get the stock bike and ride, ride more and then ride more. you will figure out what you like, do not like and what will work best for you in the long run. Right now you just need to get a bike you like and start riding.

One last thought; with Trek you will get Bontranger components, with Specialized you will get Specialized components. With Giant, Cannondale and Felt your will get 3rd party components. I think it is better to get the 3rd party componants rather than "house" brand components, but if you choose the Trek or Specialized you will have a good solid bike.


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## davelikestoplay

Giant has pretty much gone to inhouse components also.


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## jeepsouth

Thanks for your reply.
Not to over-simplify what you wrote (a lot of good advice and insight, by the way), but, if I am comfortable with all of the shops, and the fitting is more or less the same, then it is OK to buy based on price alone among the bikes I've listed. Right?
I know a lot factors into the purchase, but one of the things I wanted to know about all of those bikes was if they were all pretty much equal, within rough limits. For example, did one have some wheels I definitely would want to avoid, or did one have some other feature that was much heavier, less reliable, poorer quality, etc.
All of that leads me to the Felt Z85, which is from $120 to $300 less expensive than the others. Or, am I getting off track?
Thanks.


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## PJ352

Since I know from your previous posts that you've taken some time to do the upfront research on bikes that suite your intended uses (and even terrain), I'm pretty confident that your finalists fulfill your needs and fit well.

Using that as a starting point, I'll say that (IMO) you can lighten your load a little and not fret too much over items covered in your #5 (various wheels, BB, saddles, tires, hubs, spokes, stems). First off, in most price ranges, competition among makers dictates that those items will be comparable in quality. Also, if they ultimately aren't to your liking, except _maybe_ in the case of the BB's (more on that below) they're fairly easily swapped out - and wheels, tires, saddles and stems are commonly changed for a variety of reasons.

More important IMO, is the frameset, because to a large extent it dictates fit, handling and (to some extent) ride, so if one of the above felt a little better in any of those areas, it's a consideration, but (assuming pre-test ride fits were fairly basic) I'd temper that with the fact that you haven't had your initial fitting, after which that bike should feel a little better to you.

I'll break with the poster on the Specialized shop wowing you with their 'better' fit. Assuming the time allotted is used productively, that fit should be more thorough than what's generally considered to be a standard LBS fitting. Since fit is so important, I think there's real value in that and the results should reflect the fitters efforts. To be sure, once you've narrowed your choices further, you could ask for specifics on what each shops fit entails, then you'll know more.

On the topic of BB's, while there are differences and I'll share my views on them, it's more for an FYI purpose than in an effort to sway your decision, because I think there are more important aspects to this purchase than BB design differences alone. 

The C'Dale uses a BB30 design which some see as having an edge in stiffness and weight, but IMO the weight difference is minimal and stiffness, subjective. Going against it, is the fact that it's an FSA, which (in previous models) hasn't been know for longevity/ durability, but those weren't BB30 designs. On the plus side, this model uses a triple crankset, which has gearing comparable to the Apex models. 

The Giant uses Shimano's R series crankset, so it shares their Hollowtech technology which is highly regarded in the industry. IMO, this is the best crankset/ BB of the bunch, but (again) I wouldn't base my purchasing decision on it, alone. The Spec and Trek both use SRAM's S150 crankset and powerspline BB. It's basically a variation of Shimano's previous generation Octalink technology, so while not state of the art, I haven't heard or read anything negative about the design. Lastly, the Felt uses FSA's Vero with a square taper BB similar to Shimano's Octalink in that they're both cartridge type BB's, but the later isn't square taper. If I had to offer an opinion, I'd place this as a last choice among all the others in the areas of performance/ reliability. Still, if the Felt were a clear first choice, I don't think I'd walk away from it simply because of the BB. 

HTH...


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Since I know from your previous posts that you've taken some time to do the upfront research on bikes that suite your intended uses (and even terrain), I'm pretty confident that your finalists fulfill your needs and fit well.
> 
> Using that as a starting point, I'll say that (IMO) you can lighten your load a little and not fret too much over items covered in your #5 (various wheels, BB, saddles, tires, hubs, spokes, stems). First off, in most price ranges, competition among makers dictates that those items will be comparable in quality. Also, if they ultimately aren't to your liking, except _maybe_ in the case of the BB's (more on that below) they're fairly easily swapped out - and wheels, tires, saddles and stems are commonly changed for a variety of reasons.
> 
> More important IMO, is the frameset, because to a large extent it dictates fit, handling and (to some extent) ride, so if one of the above felt a little better in any of those areas, it's a consideration, but (assuming pre-test ride fits were fairly basic) I'd temper that with the fact that you haven't had your initial fitting, after which that bike should feel a little better to you.
> 
> I'll break with the poster on the Specialized shop wowing you with their 'better' fit. Assuming the time allotted is used productively, that fit should be more thorough than what's generally considered to be a standard LBS fitting. Since fit is so important, I think there's real value in that and the results should reflect the fitters efforts. To be sure, once you've narrowed your choices further, you could ask for specifics on what each shops fit entails, then you'll know more.
> 
> On the topic of BB's, while there are differences and I'll share my views on them, it's more for an FYI purpose than in an effort to sway your decision, because I think there are more important aspects to this purchase than BB design differences alone.
> 
> The C'Dale uses a BB30 design which some see as having an edge in stiffness and weight, but IMO the weight difference is minimal and stiffness, subjective. Going against it, is the fact that it's an FSA, which (in previous models) hasn't been know for longevity/ durability, but those weren't BB30 designs. On the plus side, this model uses a triple crankset, which has gearing comparable to the Apex models.
> 
> The Giant uses Shimano's R series crankset, so it shares their Hollowtech technology which is highly regarded in the industry. IMO, this is the best crankset/ BB of the bunch, but (again) I wouldn't base my purchasing decision on it, alone. The Spec and Trek both use SRAM's S150 crankset and powerspline BB. It's basically a variation of Shimano's previous generation Octalink technology, so while not state of the art, I haven't heard or read anything negative about the design. Lastly, the Felt uses FSA's Vero with a square taper BB similar to Shimano's Octalink in that they're both cartridge type BB's, but the later isn't square taper. If I had to offer an opinion, I'd place this as a last choice among all the others in the areas of performance/ reliability. Still, if the Felt were a clear first choice, I don't think I'd walk away from it simply because of the BB.
> 
> HTH...



Thanks, PJ. Good to hear from you again. As usual, your insight is very valuable.
Thanks for the BB info. I did not know any of that stuff.
All off the shops offer some level of fitting, though some stress it more than others. The Specialized shop seems to be far out front in this area, though. I do need to do a little digging on this subject with a couple of the other shops.
Of the bikes I test-rode, the Cannondale Synapse felt the best right off of the shop floor. The Felt, Giant and Specialized were all about the same (felt good), while the Trek was the least comfortable. I know this can be tweaked during the fitting process.
The Felt is not my "clear first choice"; the Synapse is, but not to the extent of eliminating the others. It just felt the best right off the bat. 
My question is: If I can save $250 (not an insignificant amount) by choosing the Felt over the Synapse, is that a good move? Am I getting similar quality (maybe not, based on your BB info), similar reliability, similar weight, etc?
Thanks.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> The Felt is not my "clear first choice"; the Synapse is, but not to the extent of eliminating the others. It just felt the best right off the bat.
> My question is: If I can save $250 (not an insignificant amount) by choosing the Felt over the Synapse, is that a good move? Am I getting similar quality (maybe not, based on your BB info), similar reliability, similar weight, etc?
> Thanks.


Focusing on fit and feel first, the fact that the Synapse felt the best may not be insignificant, so I suggest narrowing the field, then re-test riding your finalists after tweaks to fit. While I agree that $250 is not insignificant, thinking long term I think you'll come to appreciate a bike that fits and feels right to you, so determining just which bike that is, is IMO the goal. If the Felt ends up a close second, you may have some thinking to do.

To answer your question, all the bikes (including the Felt) are quality bikes of comparable quality. Felt generally offers a lot of bike for the money, so I'm not surprised that they're undercutting the others on price. It's a solid package they're offering here, so I wouldn't fret over quality/ reliability, but the crankset/ BB is (IMO) the weakest link (as they say).


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## new2rd

Don't get blinded by the light of "must get a good fitting". For most of us, a good fitting is getting a bike that fits. Making sure the frame is the correct size and that the seat is adjusted properly means that you will be able to ride pain free. "Must get a good fitting" means that the seat might need to go back 1 cm and the seat raised 5 mm to get 10 extra watts of peak power. What I'm getting at is that people change. What might be a perfect fit right now, might be different 6 months down the line when your flexibility increases or you lose 4 lbs. The "super" fitting methods changes stem angles, lengths, handbar widths, seat angle, etc... There's a lot that can be changed, but doesn't need to be at least at first. If a shop is willing to let you test ride a bunch of bikes, put you on one and do some measurements for reach and seat position, that's probably all you need.

I'm sure some others can chime in about this. I've heard about some fittings taking hours to complete, but for a new rider is that needed?


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## jpaschal01

so it really sounds like from the 5 bikes you've ridden, you have narrowed your list to 3 for different reasongs:
1. Cannondale Synapse 5 105 - best initial feel when test riding
2. Felt Z85 - best price
3. Specialized Secteur Comp Apex Compact - potential for the best fitting

You may prefer to replace one of those with the Giant instead based upon your own criteria, but it definitely sounds like you have put the Trek in 5th position. 

Now you have to decide what your most important factors are. 

When I was doing my search 5 months ago, I was in a similar position. At the end of the day, I went with the Felt Z85 because I like the feel of it the best, it was the best price, and I loved the look of the bike. Looks matter - for me I needed something I was going to be excited to ride. I'm overweight and wanted something to excite me to excercise. And on that note - there is no way the 16/20 spoke count wheels on that Cannondale would have been a good idea for me. 

Your decision criteria will be completely different than mine. Have fun with it.


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## PJ352

new2rd said:


> Don't get blinded by the light of "must get a good fitting". For most of us, a good fitting is getting a bike that fits. *Making sure the frame is the correct size and that the seat is adjusted properly means that you will be able to ride pain free.* "Must get a good fitting" means that the seat might need to go back 1 cm and the seat raised 5 mm to get 10 extra watts of peak power. What I'm getting at is that people change. What might be a perfect fit right now, might be different 6 months down the line when your flexibility increases or you lose 4 lbs. The "super" fitting methods changes stem angles, lengths, handbar widths, seat angle, etc... There's a lot that can be changed, but doesn't need to be at least at first. If a shop is willing to let you test ride a bunch of bikes, put you on one and do some measurements for reach and seat position, that's probably all you need.
> 
> I'm sure some others can chime in about this. I've heard about some fittings taking hours to complete, but for a new rider is that needed?


Taken at face value, some of what you offer generally holds true, but the bold statement does not, and ignores some key fit parameters. Namely, a riders reach/ drop requirements.

As far as a riders fit changing/ evolving as saddle time builds and fitness/ flexibility improves, that's pretty near a certainty with almost all riders, but that doesn't mean that a _better_ starting point/ initial fit holds no value. It does, because IMO/E in that interim period a given rider is more apt to ride in relative comfort (thus, efficiently), and might need those tweaks later, rather then sooner. 

Re: your 'super' fitting methods, assuming you mean a pro fit, there's much more to it than that. For example, checks for both excessive knee frontal plane motion and leg length discrepancies (and possibly employing shims/ wedges for correction) are just two points that someone taking a more casual approach to a fitting would likely miss. And these are fairly common issues among cyclists. 

Does everyone need an in depth fitting? Certainly not. But if the OP happens to settle on a favorite bike at a shop providing a near pro fitting, IMO there's extra value in that. And judging from the never ending fit related threads going here on RBR, many cyclists would do well to adapt this mindset.

End mini-rant.


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## new2rd

PJ352,

Good points. I wasn't trying to disrespect any "pro" fitters out there or try to diminish the need, just trying to save some people some time and money for those beginners that might not need it. I would hate to see someone (a beginner), spend $400-500 on handlebars/stem because of reach/drop being off just a cm or so. For any type of fitting, I would hope that the LBS doesn't let someone purchase a bike that will leave them hurting due to a bad fit. I'm a beginner and I've done small adjustments during my first couple years, but my orginal fit was perfect for me at the time. The orginal fit was "good enough" to get me hooked on road cycling and leaves me happy with my original purchase/decision. 

On another note, when I test rode bikes when I was new to the road. I noticed obvious differences between makes and models. I went into the store thinking that I wanted a Trek, but the Trek was my least favorite. I would find it hard to believe that there's not a noticeable difference between the Cannondale, Felt, and Specialized. I suggest test riding and paying attention to all aspects (something like comfort, agility, and stiffness). Don't focus on the seat, most are crap.


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## Tommy Walker

My advice is totally against your budget and the 5 great bikes you selected. See if you can find a Cervelo RS on discount with a 105 compact for you and your wife. As a maater of fact Cervelo has a deal right now where they are giving $2,000 off two bikes, I don't know all the details, but that may be close to your budget.

OK, here is my explanation, I have an RS and love it. I am also 54 years old, I don't really race, but love very long rides. After my long rides I feel absolutly no pain, I mean no pain. I attribute that to the great fitting I got, the carbon frame and the relaxed geometry of the Cervelo. There might be other bikes out there that can offer the same geometry, but I can tell you for sure I enjoy every moment on my RS. I have friends who have Pinerello's, Giant Defy's,Trek's, Cannondale's and Fuji's and when we do long rides they are crying, cramping and cussing. We are all 54 years old. Many of the are in better shape that I am, one even does (and trains for) tri's (he tries).

Now why get your wife an RS as well, I just bought my wife an Trek Lexa SL. I would have bought her any bike she wanted. The only thing she cared about was the frame color. It's a decent bike, but we rode the Colonial Parkway in Williamsburg and it has this corrigated surface, she said she really felt the bumps, me I didn't feel a thing.

Have fun in your search, try to test ride as much as possible. I also did a side by side comparison of the components. I found most bikes cost generally the same, price difference was whetehr you have full Ultegra, FSA cranks, wheels, etc; you kind of get what you pay for.


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## PJ352

new2rd said:


> PJ352,
> Good points. I wasn't trying to disrespect any "pro" fitters out there or try to diminish the need, just trying to save some people some time and money for those beginners that might not need it. I would hate to see someone (a beginner), spend $400-500 on handlebars/stem because of reach/drop being off just a cm or so. For any type of fitting, I would hope that the LBS doesn't let someone purchase a bike that will leave them hurting due to a bad fit. I'm a beginner and I've done small adjustments during my first couple years, but my orginal fit was perfect for me at the time. The orginal fit was "good enough" to get me hooked on road cycling and leaves me happy with my original purchase/decision.


No worries. I wasn't _really_ ranting at you or anyone else. I was simply offering some 'between the lines' details that I thought you left out. 

I agree that no one should pay extra for stem swaps (and some shops DO charge), which leads me back to there being a value in shops that take fitting more seriously. While there's no guarantee, I would hope such shops wouldn't charge for what I consider to be part of an initial bike set up.

I also agree (and acknowledged) that most riders would do ok with a standard bike fit. But in the case of the OP, there's a chance that one shop goes a step or two better, so IMO that tilts the scales a little. Not to the point of disregarding the other bikes of interest, as long as those shops are reputable and provide a reasonable (vague term, I know) fit. 


new2rd said:


> On another note, when I test rode bikes when I was new to the road. I noticed obvious differences between makes and models. I went into the store thinking that I wanted a Trek, but the Trek was my least favorite. I would find it hard to believe that there's not a noticeable difference between the Cannondale, Felt, and Specialized. I suggest test riding and paying attention to all aspects (something like comfort, agility, and stiffness). Don't focus on the seat, most are crap.


FWIW, I agree on your suggestion re: test rides. JMO and experience, but not all OE seats are crap. I liked my Spec Toupe's saddle enough to buy a second for my 'good' bike. Gotta ride them for awhile, then decide, but even here proper fit plays a role in determining saddle comfort.


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## Digger51

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for your reply.
> Not to over-simplify what you wrote (a lot of good advice and insight, by the way), but, if I am comfortable with all of the shops, and the fitting is more or less the same, then it is OK to buy based on price alone among the bikes I've listed. Right?
> I know a lot factors into the purchase, but one of the things I wanted to know about all of those bikes was if they were all pretty much equal, within rough limits. For example, did one have some wheels I definitely would want to avoid, or did one have some other feature that was much heavier, less reliable, poorer quality, etc.
> All of that leads me to the Felt Z85, which is from $120 to $300 less expensive than the others. Or, am I getting off track?
> Thanks.


You are correct and I would most likely get the Felt also.


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## jeepsouth

jpaschal01 said:


> so it really sounds like from the 5 bikes you've ridden, you have narrowed your list to 3 for different reasongs:
> 1. Cannondale Synapse 5 105 - best initial feel when test riding
> 2. Felt Z85 - best price
> 3. Specialized Secteur Comp Apex Compact - potential for the best fitting
> 
> You may prefer to replace one of those with the Giant instead based upon your own criteria, but it definitely sounds like you have put the Trek in 5th position.
> 
> Now you have to decide what your most important factors are.
> 
> When I was doing my search 5 months ago, I was in a similar position. At the end of the day, I went with the Felt Z85 because I like the feel of it the best, it was the best price, and I loved the look of the bike. Looks matter - for me I needed something I was going to be excited to ride. I'm overweight and wanted something to excite me to excercise. And on that note - there is no way the 16/20 spoke count wheels on that Cannondale would have been a good idea for me.
> 
> Your decision criteria will be completely different than mine. Have fun with it.



Thanks for your reply.
You pretty much nailed it.
I am leaning toward the Cannondale because it felt the best right from the start, and because the LBS is the closest to my home, an easy bike ride away. I did like the feel of the Felt and the price is attractive. The Specialized is on the list because of the LBS and the fact that it has SRAM Apex, which I have been impressed with. However, that LBS is all the way on the other side of Greenville (SC) from me. The Giant was fine, but nothing really stood out, and the Trek was OK, too. It just had the worst fit for me right off of the LBS floor. The big plus (at least for me) with the Trek was the SRAM Apex, and I am sure that the fit could be improved.
As for other matters, while I want something that looks nice, I'm not overly hung up on the looks and paint schemes. This may be due to the fact that they all looked pretty good to me. I think the various brands have each put out out a pretty attractive product, each in it's own way. I'm not saying this aspect is not a consideration; just that I could go with any of the ones I've listed as far as appearance goes.
Assuming I could find my fit on any of the bikes, I was really just wondering if anything stood out that would move one to the top of the list, or could eliminate one from consideration. Possibly something that I don't know about like wheel weight, durability, performance, or the BB issue PJ discussed. From the responses you nice folks are providing, it appears that there are no major issues, just a few minor considerations. I suspected that would be the case looking at well-known, national brands in this price range.
This brings me back, then, to the LBS service and fit issues. This is an area where I need to do some more research since I don't have all of the info on all of the shops. 
Thanks for all of the advice and the discussion on fitting. You are all helping a lot. Keep it coming.
I will check the Cervelo, also. Thanks for the heads-up on that.
Thanks.
:thumbsup:


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## PJ352

jpaschal01 said:


> And on that note - *there is no way the 16/20 spoke count wheels on that Cannondale would have been a good idea for me*.
> 
> Your decision criteria will be completely different than mine. Have fun with it.


Good catch. Depending on the OP's weight range, this may or may not apply, but something to be aware of.


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## milkbaby

Tommy Walker said:


> My advice is totally against your budget and the 5 great bikes you selected. See if you can find a Cervelo RS on discount with a 105 compact for you and your wife. As a maater of fact Cervelo has a deal right now where they are giving $2,000 off two bikes, I don't know all the details, but that may be close to your budget.
> 
> OK, here is my explanation, I have an RS and love it. I am also 54 years old, I don't really race, but love very long rides. After my long rides I feel absolutly no pain, I mean no pain. I attribute that to the great fitting I got, the carbon frame and the relaxed geometry of the Cervelo. There might be other bikes out there that can offer the same geometry, but I can tell you for sure I enjoy every moment on my RS. I have friends who have Pinerello's, Giant Defy's,Trek's, Cannondale's and Fuji's and when we do long rides they are crying, cramping and cussing. We are all 54 years old. Many of the are in better shape that I am, one even does (and trains for) tri's (he tries).


So the "best" bike for the OP is the same one that YOU own? 

I'm sure there are plenty of people older than you who do not ride a Cervelo RS for long rides as much as you do without any pain whatsoever too. In fact, I've ridden with some of them, so I know that for a fact...


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## bwwROADBIKE

Cervelo RS is $2600ea. By two, you save $2k, so $1600ea if you and your wife both buy one. I'm know Shimano better, but moving up to SRAM Rival might be worth the extra $? Sale Ends Jan31, although I don't see on their website right now?

It'd be worth adding to your list of bikes to try out. I'm not sure any "better equipped" than Cannondale w/ 105?

Bikes - Squoval Road Bikes - RS - Prices & Specs


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## jeepsouth

bwwROADBIKE said:


> Cervelo RS is $2600ea. By two, you save $2k, so $1600ea if you and your wife both buy one. I'm know Shimano better, but moving up to SRAM Rival might be worth the extra $? Sale Ends Jan31, although I don't see on their website right now?
> 
> It'd be worth adding to your list of bikes to try out. I'm not sure any "better equipped" than Cannondale w/ 105?
> 
> Bikes - Squoval Road Bikes - RS - Prices & Specs




I've visited the Cervelo website. Looks pretty interesting, especially with the Rival group. I will check the shop in the area that carries Cervelo tomorrow. Thanks for pointing this deal out.


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## bwwROADBIKE

jeepsouth said:


> I've visited the Cervelo website. Looks pretty interesting, especially with the Rival group. I will check the shop in the area that carries Cervelo tomorrow. Thanks for pointing this deal out.


As a value guy, the thing I really like about the Cervelo is if you go to sell it in 2-3 years if you decide to upgrade, you should get almost all of your money back out of it. "3 yr old $2600 Cervelo for $1500" will sell on craigslist.

Like everyone else stated, fit should be #1 concern.

(I ride an older Cannondale CAAD8, but am tempted to jump into the cervelo based on the sale).


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## PJ352

bwwROADBIKE said:


> As a value guy, the thing I really like about the Cervelo is if you go to sell it in 2-3 years if you decide to upgrade, you should get almost all of your money back out of it. "3 yr old $2600 Cervelo for $1500" will sell on craigslist.
> 
> Like everyone else stated, *fit should be #1 concern*.
> 
> (I ride an older Cannondale CAAD8, but am tempted to jump into the cervelo based on the sale).


I agree that the Cervelo deal is worth checking out, but am skeptical that they'll fit both the OP _and_ his wife well. One out of two, maybe. Two out of two (with the second being female and likely proportioned differently), not so likely, but we'll see....


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> I agree that the Cervelo deal is worth checking out, but am skeptical that they'll fit both the OP _and_ his wife well. One out of two, maybe. Two out of two (with the second being female and likely proportioned differently), not so likely, but we'll see....



I was unable to meet the requirements of the Cervelo deal. The bikes had to be from in-store stock and the store had nothing in the size I needed, for one thing. Also, my wife was not planing to spend that much for her bike. Also, coming out of Christmas and a recent illness, financially-speaking we are not really ready to pull the trigger quite yet. Originally, we had planned to purchase in late Feb. If all had worked out great with the Cervelo, we would have made it happen somehow, but things just didn't fall into place.
Anyway, thanks for the advice and the heads-up on the Cervelo. I appreciate all of your great suggestions and advice.
Also, there has been some discussion about my size and weight. If it helps with your suggestions....I am a 54 year old male, 6'0", 195 lbs (large frame; used to be a football running-back back in the day). I am in good physical shape. I run a lot. I am training for a March 10k race now, and will go into training for a marathon about a month after the 10k. Hope that helps.


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## Tommy Walker

jeepsouth said:


> I was unable to meet the requirements of the Cervelo deal. The bikes had to be from in-store stock and the store had nothing in the size I needed, for one thing. Also, my wife was not planing to spend that much for her bike. Also, coming out of Christmas and a recent illness, financially-speaking we are not really ready to pull the trigger quite yet. Originally, we had planned to purchase in late Feb. If all had worked out great with the Cervelo, we would have made it happen somehow, but things just didn't fall into place.
> Anyway, thanks for the advice and the heads-up on the Cervelo. I appreciate all of your great suggestions and advice.
> Also, there has been some discussion about my size and weight. If it helps with your suggestions....I am a 54 year old male, 6'0", 195 lbs (large frame; used to be a football running-back back in the day). I am in good physical shape. I run a lot. I am training for a March 10k race now, and will go into training for a marathon about a month after the 10k. Hope that helps.


Too bad about the Cervelo deal, but as was suggested, test ride as much as possible


----------



## Cedric

I just went through this, and looked at almost all the bikes you are considering. I recommend going with what your gut tells you, and what's most comfortable out of the gates. I was SO close to getting the Synapse alloy 105, but ended up splurging on a closeout Specialized elite apex for $1800. I like it a lot, but justified it in "needing" (wanting/lusting after/etc.) the carbon frame. In hindsight, I probably would have been just as happy with the synapse and even happier with an extra $450 in my wallet. FWIW, accessories/clothing can quickly add up to more than $300. It's a disease... 

The synapse is a great bike. My brother ended up with one of those, and it has a really sweet ride. You liked it the best out of the gate, and the LBS you want to cultivate a relationship with is only a bike ride away. Seems straightforward. That being said, they're all good bikes. Go with your gut, get fitted, and get riding! 


Best,
Christopher


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> ... there has been some discussion about my size and weight. If it helps with your suggestions....I am a 54 year old male, 6'0", 195 lbs (large frame; used to be a football running-back back in the day). I am in good physical shape. I run a lot. I am training for a March 10k race now, and will go into training for a marathon about a month after the 10k. Hope that helps.


Sorry the Cervelo deal didn't work out, but I think you have a number of other good options. 

Re: your above 'stats', given your previous bike list, the only thing that I think you need to watch are low spoke count wheelsets like the RS-10's on the C'dale. For durability, you might want to stay with (at minimum) 24/ 28h (f/r) rims and consider 25c tires. If the Synapse ends up being your favored ride, ask the LBS about a wheelset swap. It's done fairly frequently and shouldn't be a showstopper. 

FWIW, your weight doesn't preclude you from riding even the lightest CF framesets and components (namely, seat posts), so no worries there.

You've done a fair amount of test riding and narrowed your choices to relaxed geo bikes, so you can be reasonably sure that all can be configured to suite your flexibility.


----------



## tipstall

A little off topic, (I did a search and found nothing).

Does your LBS offer test rides on the rode or the trainer? Mine seemed to imply trainer only. As I'm trying to figure out what I want I didn't push it. BTW this is my second bike I will have bought from them.


----------



## PJ352

tipstall said:


> A little off topic, (I did a search and found nothing).
> 
> Does your LBS offer test rides on the rode or the trainer? Mine seemed to imply trainer only. As I'm trying to figure out what I want I didn't push it. BTW this is my second bike I will have bought from them.


IMO any bike shop that doesn't allow test rides (out on the roads and for some duration) doesn't recognize their importance in assessing fit, feel, ride and handling - or doesn't care to provide this essential service to a prospective buyer. 

I'd move on... and make sure they knew why. The better shops not only allow test rides, but encourage them.


----------



## flatsix911

Forget the LBS ... take a look online for the best value :thumbsup:
SHIMANO Dura-Ace 7900, 20Spd Road Bike 2012 Gravity Team $1,199

Advanced 20Spd, AL Frame, Carbon Aero Fork, Vuelta ZeroLite PRO Wheels

Save up to 60% off new Road Bikes - Gravity Team


----------



## jeepsouth

tipstall said:


> A little off topic, (I did a search and found nothing).
> 
> Does your LBS offer test rides on the rode or the trainer? Mine seemed to imply trainer only. As I'm trying to figure out what I want I didn't push it. BTW this is my second bike I will have bought from them.



All of the LBS's I've visited allow, and even encourage, thorough test-rides. They have all directed me to nearby quiet streets and neighborhoods (with hills) and said to take as long as I would like. I was up front with all of them, saying I was in the early research stage and was not ready to buy that day. Each one was very helpful with advice and info and all invited me back for longer test-rides when I had narrowed my search a bit. Of course, they all tried to sell me a bike that day, in spite of my explaining that I was just in the research phase. But, I have no problem at all with that. They're in the business to sell bikes and I would have done the same.

Re: the Gravity bikes........I've seen these online (along with many others, such as Gavin, Vilano, etc.), but I can find few, or no reviews or, in some cases, any good company info. The bikes look good, components seem fine, but I am hesitant to make such a big purchase "in the dark", so to speak. Also, what about fit, test-rides, etc.? How do the LBS's feel about someone bringing in a bike they bought online for initial fit and set-up, tuning, etc.? At my current level of expertise, I would have to take any bike I ordered online down to a LBS as soon as I unpacked it. Is that a good way to initialize a good, long-term relationship with an LBS?

I will say this, of all the inexpensive bikes I've seen online, the Sette bikes pique my interest most of all. Does anyone have any info on them?

Bottom line is that I am not seriously considering purchasing a low-priced bike, sight-unseen, from an online outfit at this point. In fact, I rejected that option early on in my research. Should I re-visit that?


----------



## josephr

jeepsouth said:


> My wife is also buying a bike and we plan to ride together often.QUOTE]
> 
> 
> 
> let us know how that works out....


----------



## savagemann

By the time you factor in extra expenses into a bike purchased online, it ends up being much less of a great deal.
First, assembly and adjustment. 50-80bux maybe more.
Fitting. 60-150 or more depending on how in depth the fitting is and if bars,stem,seatpost, saddle etc need to be changed.
Follow up adjustments and tune ups. Sky is the limit here.
A lot of shops offer some level of tune included with the bike purchase. Most worth their salt will also do some sort of fitting for.you.
Online purchases can yield some good deals, but imo it is best to purchase a bike in store. You'll build a much better relationship with the shop and the whole experience will feel more personalized.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Re: the Gravity bikes........I've seen these online (along with many others, such as Gavin, Vilano, etc.), but I can find few, or no reviews or, in some cases, any good company info. The bikes look good, components seem fine, but* I am hesitant to make such a big purchase "in the dark", so to speak. Also, what about fit, test-rides, etc.? How do the LBS's feel about someone bringing in a bike they bought online for initial fit and set-up, tuning, etc.? At my current level of expertise, I would have to take any bike I ordered online down to a LBS as soon as I unpacked it. Is that a good way to initialize a good, long-term relationship with an LBS?*
> 
> I will say this, of all the inexpensive bikes I've seen online, the Sette bikes pique my interest most of all. Does anyone have any info on them?
> 
> Bottom line is that* I am not seriously considering purchasing* a low-priced bike, sight-unseen, *from an online outfit* at this point. In fact, I rejected that option early on in my research. *Should I re-visit that?*


For the reasons you and savagemann mentioned (and a few others), I advise against an online purchase.. at least for a first bike.

As both of you say, there are several hidden costs - one of which being guessing wrong on sizing. And considering that there's a variance in geo (thus fit) between the same sizes of differing brands (and sometimes models),that's a possibility. If you do guess wrong, depending on how 'off' the geo is, the fitting at the LBS may not go so well, leaving you with the choice of 'making due', or sending the bike back - paying shipping costs.

Also, along with next to no sizing/ fitting assistance, there are no test rides and you'll likely pay for final assembly, tuning and (already mentioned) any component swaps needed during the fitting.

Another potential complication to your buying online is that you're also buying for your wife, so the potential for pitfalls doubles. Conversely, buying from an LBS (assuming both bikes are purchased at the same one) you're likely to have some leverage on pricing/ packaging because of a two bike sale. 

Buying online works for cyclists well versed in bike mechanics and fit. Others in need of the value added services reputable LBS's offer are IMO/E better served buying local.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> For the reasons you and savagemann mentioned (and a few others), I advise against an online purchase.. at least for a first bike.
> 
> As both of you say, there are several hidden costs - one of which being guessing wrong on sizing. And considering that there's a variance in geo (thus fit) between the same sizes of differing brands (and sometimes models),that's a possibility. If you do guess wrong, depending on how 'off' the geo is, the fitting at the LBS may not go so well, leaving you with the choice of 'making due', or sending the bike back - paying shipping costs.
> 
> Also, along with next to no sizing/ fitting assistance, there are no test rides and you'll likely pay for final assembly, tuning and (already mentioned) any component swaps needed during the fitting.
> 
> Another potential complication to your buying online is that you're also buying for your wife, so the potential for pitfalls doubles. Conversely, buying from an LBS (assuming both bikes are purchased at the same one) you're likely to have some leverage on pricing/ packaging because of a two bike sale.
> 
> Buying online works for cyclists well versed in bike mechanics and fit. Others in need of the value added services reputable LBS's offer are IMO/E better served buying local.




Thanks. That sort of reinforces my opinions on purchasing online. As I said, I rejected that option early on.

You bring up a good point about my wife and I purchasing from one LBS at the same time, and maybe being able to negotiate a better deal. That is not something I had considered, and we had been sort of setting aside money each on our own toward the bikes. Together, we will consider what you have mentioned and possibly change our tactics slightly. She has a few favorites of her own so far: Giant Avail, Felt ZW75, Specialized Dolce, to name a few.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks. That sort of reinforces my opinions on purchasing online. As I said, I rejected that option early on.
> 
> You bring up a good point about my wife and I purchasing from one LBS at the same time, and maybe being able to negotiate a better deal. That is not something I had considered, and we had been sort of setting aside money each on our own toward the bikes. Together, we will consider what you have mentioned and possibly change our tactics slightly. She has a few favorites of her own so far: *Giant Avail, Felt ZW75, Specialized Dolce*, to name a few.


Similar to your 'finalists', all high quality bikes from some of the top manufacturers with strong warranties. As long as the chosen bike suites your wifes intended purposes, fits well and rides/ handles the way she likes, IMO she can't go far wrong with any.


----------



## terbennett

Digger51 said:


> You are correct and I would most likely get the Felt also.


+1......:thumbsup:


----------



## josephr

savagemann said:


> By the time you factor in extra expenses into a bike purchased online, it ends up being much less of a great deal.
> First, assembly and adjustment. 50-80bux maybe more.
> Fitting. 60-150 or more depending on how in depth the fitting is and if bars,stem,seatpost, saddle etc need to be changed.
> Follow up adjustments and tune ups. Sky is the limit here.
> A lot of shops offer some level of tune included with the bike purchase. Most worth their salt will also do some sort of fitting for.you.
> Online purchases can yield some good deals, but imo it is best to purchase a bike in store. You'll build a much better relationship with the shop and the whole experience will feel more personalized.


+1000 --- why whenever does someone post on here about which bike to get, there's some (insert your own deragatory pronoun here) to suggest to a new buyer to buy a bike-in-a-box that no newbie has any business trying to put together???

Is there a moderator around here and if so, can we make take a vote for a rule to the effect of "no online purchase reccomendations for newbies." 

Joe


----------



## Tommy Walker

PJ352 said:


> Sorry the Cervelo deal didn't work out, but I think you have a number of other good options.
> 
> Re: your above 'stats', given your previous bike list, *the only thing that I think you need to watch are low spoke count wheelsets like the RS-10's* on the C'dale. For durability, you might want to stay with (at minimum) 24/ 28h (f/r) rims and consider 25c tires. If the Synapse ends up being your favored ride, ask the LBS about a wheelset swap. It's done fairly frequently and shouldn't be a showstopper.
> 
> You've done a fair amount of test riding and narrowed your choices to relaxed geo bikes, so you can be reasonably sure that all can be configured to suite your flexibility.


*1, if they are RS10's see if you can trade up. My shop actually gave me $300 credit for them and I was able to trade them for a $580 set of Ultegra wheels, so I paid $280 more for a great upgrade.


----------



## jeepsouth

Another bike has entered the picture. I went to test-ride a 2011 Cannondale Synapse which was on the LBS website at a special end-of-year price, but someone else had beaten me to it. I ended up trying out a 2012 Scott Speedster S-20, and I was pretty impressed. This was a very good feeling and good fitting bike and I liked it right away. As someone informed me earlier (PJ, maybe...in another thread), the Scott warranty is not in line with the warranties of the others (Scott - 5 years vs. Felt, Giant, Trek, etc. - lifetime warranty). Is this a big issue? Are Scotts known to have more problems than the others?

This was a nice bike that fit me pretty well and was priced right. I am just wondering if it should be rejected based on the warranty.

Thanks.


----------



## easyridernyc

jeepsouth said:


> Another bike has entered the picture. I went to test-ride a 2011 Cannondale Synapse which was on the LBS website at a special end-of-year price, but someone else had beaten me to it. I ended up trying out a 2012 Scott Speedster S-20, and I was pretty impressed. This was a very good feeling and good fitting bike and I liked it right away. As someone informed me earlier (PJ, maybe...in another thread), the Scott warranty is not in line with the warranties of the others (Scott - 5 years vs. Felt, Giant, Trek, etc. - lifetime warranty). Is this a big issue? Are Scotts known to have more problems than the others?
> 
> This was a nice bike that fit me pretty well and was priced right. I am just wondering if it should be rejected based on the warranty.
> 
> Thanks.


if you like it, good. but compare the specs, i think the speedster is downspec'd a bit vs synapse. 

the new felt 75 is really really nice..


----------



## SolitaryRider

josephr said:


> +1000 --- why whenever does someone post on here about which bike to get, there's some (insert your own deragatory pronoun here) to suggest to a new buyer to buy a bike-in-a-box that no newbie has any business trying to put together???
> 
> Is there a moderator around here and if so, can we make take a vote for a rule to the effect of "no online purchase reccomendations for newbies."
> 
> Joe


That's utterly ridiculous. I'm a noob who bought a bike-in-a-box. Bikes are not complicate contraptions- they are about as simple as a machine can possibly be. I'm sure that just about everyone has fixed a flat on their coaster-brake bike when they were 8 or 9 years old. Most normal adults are capable of the minimal assembly and adjustment required of a bike in a box, and more so if they merely take the time to do a few minutes reading on the internet or watch a few Youtube vids. 

It's not rocket science- we're talking about very simple, basic machines, whose components are all easily accessible, and which don't require any specialized tools or skill s for basic assembly and adjustment. 

Some people may choose to not get their hands dirty and be tied to an LBS (with the associated costs)....but many of us would rather save hundreds or even thousands of dollars, and will gladly turn an allen-head screw or two. We're not talking some deep dark mystery here...just the most basic mechanical skills that most women and children even possess. 

And even for the more mechanically-inept; the learning process is fast and easy- and is a great opportunity to gain freedom from the LBS. 

If it were not for bikes-in-a-box, I would not be riding today, as I wanted a decent-quality bike, but wasn't willing to spend a lot, not knowing if I'd take to the sport; and I didn't want to be tied to an LBS, as my nearest one is quite far away, and it is not practical to bring my bike there every time it needs an adjustment. 

I recommend mail-order bikes to all noobs- as it is a way to get a bike of good quality for a lot less money, so that they can see if they'll stick with it, without spending a ton of money (And you can usually resell your mail-order bike a year or two down the road for what you paid for it- or close to it) and it lets them get some experience, and discover what they really need/want in a bike- without losing a lot of money. Not to mention that the experience of assembling and adjusting gives them the confidence to do all of their own repairs and maintenance, and frees them from the LBS and their often high prices.


----------



## jeepsouth

SolitaryRider said:


> That's utterly ridiculous. I'm a noob who bought a bike-in-a-box. Bikes are not complicate contraptions- they are about as simple as a machine can possibly be. I'm sure that just about everyone has fixed a flat on their coaster-brake bike when they were 8 or 9 years old. Most normal adults are capable of the minimal assembly and adjustment required of a bike in a box, and more so if they merely take the time to do a few minutes reading on the internet or watch a few Youtube vids.
> 
> It's not rocket science- we're talking about very simple, basic machines, whose components are all easily accessible, and which don't require any specialized tools or skill s for basic assembly and adjustment.
> 
> Some people may choose to not get their hands dirty and be tied to an LBS (with the associated costs)....but many of us would rather save hundreds or even thousands of dollars, and will gladly turn an allen-head screw or two. We're not talking some deep dark mystery here...just the most basic mechanical skills that most women and children even possess.
> 
> And even for the more mechanically-inept; the learning process is fast and easy- and is a great opportunity to gain freedom from the LBS.
> 
> If it were not for bikes-in-a-box, I would not be riding today, as I wanted a decent-quality bike, but wasn't willing to spend a lot, not knowing if I'd take to the sport; and I didn't want to be tied to an LBS, as my nearest one is quite far away, and it is not practical to bring my bike there every time it needs an adjustment.
> 
> I recommend mail-order bikes to all noobs- as it is a way to get a bike of good quality for a lot less money, so that they can see if they'll stick with it, without spending a ton of money (And you can usually resell your mail-order bike a year or two down the road for what you paid for it- or close to it) and it lets them get some experience, and discover what they really need/want in a bike- without losing a lot of money. Not to mention that the experience of assembling and adjusting gives them the confidence to do all of their own repairs and maintenance, and frees them from the LBS and their often high prices.




I get what you're saying. I just don't agree with it. I take no offense at what you have offered. I asked for advice from all aspects of purchasing a new bike, and I thank you (and everyone else) for the advice given.

I am the "noob", and I want the relationship with the LBS for more than just turning wrenches, even though that is a large part of it. 

One reason that I intend to deal with a LBS is that, from my understanding, once you start working on the bike yourself, the warranty is voided (like with anything else you work on yourself). Some of the online bikes actually require an initial set-up by a certified bike mechanic (see the Sette website, for one). I am a pretty handy guy, the one in my family everyone else calls for help with putting things together, installations, etc. I watched a YouTube video and went out and replaced the brakes on my wife's 2003 Jeep. So, I am not a complete novice to working on mechanical things. However, if a major problem comes up that the warranty would cover if I had not worked on the bike myself, I may be out some sizable cash. Don't want to risk that. I'm not rich. If I had $$$, I would have paid someone else to fix my wife's brakes.

Also, I intend to use the LBS as a launching pad to joining the biking community here in Greenville, SC. There is a large and active community of bikers here and I want to be part of it. I want to join the group rides almost every LBS offers, use their exercise facilities and indoor tracks, etc. So, it is more for me than just "turning an allen-head screw or two."

I do appreciate your offering advice. I am not saying you're entirely wrong, it is just that I do want the relationship with the LBS and all that comes with that relationship and all of the other doors that relationship may open.


----------



## M Ice

You can do both...buy on line and have a good relationship with your LBS....I did. Bought my bike on line (full carbon fiber, complete Ultegra group....$1700). Had it assembled and fit at LBS....Have purchased all clothing, shoes, acessories, etc from them since....I love my bike and my LBS and they love me...I get great service every time I visit.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Another bike has entered the picture. I went to test-ride a 2011 Cannondale Synapse which was on the LBS website at a special end-of-year price, but someone else had beaten me to it. *I ended up trying out a 2012 Scott Speedster S-20, and I was pretty impressed. This was a very good feeling and good fitting bike and I liked it right away.* As someone informed me earlier (PJ, maybe...in another thread), the Scott warranty is not in line with the warranties of the others (Scott - 5 years vs. Felt, Giant, Trek, etc. - lifetime warranty). Is this a big issue? Are Scotts known to have more problems than the others?
> 
> This was a nice bike that fit me pretty well and was priced right. * I am just wondering if it should be rejected based on the warranty.*
> 
> Thanks.


The first bold statement offers what IMO constitutes pretty sound reasons to consider the bike. The second, only you can answer.

Earlier Scott Speedsters suffered 'some' frame failures around the head tube/ top tube junction, but I'll temper that comment with the fact that my limited knowledge hardly represents a scientific sampling. If you opt for the bike, be aware that you'll need to have the authorized dealer perform annual maintenance service (and documents it), or the standard 5 year warranty drops to 3 years. 

Here's their warranty, and link:
The warranty of frames is 5 year, but shall only be granted in case once a year a maintenance service has been affected according to maintenance requirements as set forth in this manual by an authorized SCOTT dealer.
The authorized SCOTT dealer shall confirm the effected annual maintenance service by stamp and signature.
In case such an annual maintenance service has not been affected the warranty of 5 years for the frame shall be reduced to 3 years.
Costs for maintenance and service have to be borne by the owner of the SCOTT bike.

SCOTT


----------



## PJ352

SolitaryRider said:


> That's utterly ridiculous. I'm a noob who bought a bike-in-a-box. Bikes are not complicate contraptions- they are about as simple as a machine can possibly be. I'm sure that just about everyone has fixed a flat on their coaster-brake bike when they were 8 or 9 years old. Most normal adults are capable of the minimal assembly and adjustment required of a bike in a box, and more so if they merely take the time to do a few minutes reading on the internet or watch a few Youtube vids.
> 
> It's not rocket science- we're talking about very simple, basic machines, whose components are all easily accessible, and which don't require any specialized tools or skill s for basic assembly and adjustment.
> 
> Some people may choose to not get their hands dirty and be tied to an LBS (with the associated costs)....but many of us would rather save hundreds or even thousands of dollars, and will gladly turn an allen-head screw or two. We're not talking some deep dark mystery here...just the most basic mechanical skills that most women and children even possess.
> 
> And even for the more mechanically-inept; the learning process is fast and easy- and is a great opportunity to gain freedom from the LBS.
> 
> If it were not for bikes-in-a-box, I would not be riding today, as I wanted a decent-quality bike, but wasn't willing to spend a lot, not knowing if I'd take to the sport; and I didn't want to be tied to an LBS, as my nearest one is quite far away, and it is not practical to bring my bike there every time it needs an adjustment.
> 
> I recommend mail-order bikes to all noobs- as it is a way to get a bike of good quality for a lot less money, so that they can see if they'll stick with it, without spending a ton of money (And you can usually resell your mail-order bike a year or two down the road for what you paid for it- or close to it) and it lets them get some experience, and discover what they really need/want in a bike- without losing a lot of money. Not to mention that the experience of assembling and adjusting gives them the confidence to do all of their own repairs and maintenance, and frees them from the LBS and their often high prices.


Pretty strong opinions considering the length of time you've owned your BD bike and (presumed) saddle time you have in. IIRC you've already started a thread relating to that simple machine of yours, because you couldn't figure out the FD adjustments. Maybe you shoulda tracked down an 8 or 9 year old to help. 

To be frank, IMO you don't have enough time/ experience with your bike to_ reliably_ offer many of your opinions, and most don't reflect my ~28 years of adult riding or wrenching.

Bikes are both simple and complex. So is fit. When bikes work and fit well, they're simple, and when they don't (and the cause/ remedy eludes) they're quite complex. And while saying that anyone can assemble a bike may be true at face value, assembling it to operate safely and reliably might not be so true - or easy. So making a blanket statement in a noob forum is (again, IMO) irresponsible.

If someone goes into an online purchase with eyes wide open, that's fine. But the fact remains that there are a number of value added services a reliable LBS offers that the online dealers do not. After delivery of that bike in a box, for all intents and purposes, the purchaser is on their own for something as simple as a stem swap to drivetrain adjustments. You're lucky you haven't (yet) had many glitches with your purchase, because if/ when you do it probably won't be fun, quick, or easy dealing with them. But that (in part) is why you paid the price that you did.


----------



## beckham23

You might want to reconsider your budget...though I made sure you have gone through several rounds before arriving at this budget range...

I bought a Cannondale CAAD10 last year, and I'm still in love with this thing. It certainly fits into your price range...as I ride more and more, I do recall my riding friends asking me to step up and get a nicer bike...just when I thought the CAAD10 was nice enough


----------



## SolitaryRider

jeepsouth said:


> I get what you're saying. I just don't agree with it. I take no offense at what you have offered. I asked for advice from all aspects of purchasing a new bike, and I thank you (and everyone else) for the advice given.
> 
> I am the "noob", and I want the relationship with the LBS for more than just turning wrenches, even though that is a large part of it.
> 
> One reason that I intend to deal with a LBS is that, from my understanding, once you start working on the bike yourself, the warranty is voided (like with anything else you work on yourself). Some of the online bikes actually require an initial set-up by a certified bike mechanic (see the Sette website, for one). I am a pretty handy guy, the one in my family everyone else calls for help with putting things together, installations, etc. I watched a YouTube video and went out and replaced the brakes on my wife's 2003 Jeep. So, I am not a complete novice to working on mechanical things. However, if a major problem comes up that the warranty would cover if I had not worked on the bike myself, I may be out some sizable cash. Don't want to risk that. I'm not rich. If I had $$$, I would have paid someone else to fix my wife's brakes.
> 
> Also, I intend to use the LBS as a launching pad to joining the biking community here in Greenville, SC. There is a large and active community of bikers here and I want to be part of it. I want to join the group rides almost every LBS offers, use their exercise facilities and indoor tracks, etc. So, it is more for me than just "turning an allen-head screw or two."
> 
> I do appreciate your offering advice. I am not saying you're entirely wrong, it is just that I do want the relationship with the LBS and all that comes with that relationship and all of the other doors that relationship may open.


And there is absolutely nothing wrong with your position, either- if that's the way you choose to go. I just think that some on here try and scare all noobs off of mail-order and DIY, by making it sound harder than it is. I would try and present both sides of the picture to someone asking advice, and let them determine which road they want to take. 

I have a long-time friend who is mechanically inept- he literally can't tighten a screw [Actually, I kind of abandoned him...he's too pathetic]- I'd never recommend that he get a mail-order bike... (Actually though, he's done pretty well without patronizing an LBS for most things, though- as he can always con friends into doing repairs for him....).

Someone like myself though- I do EVERYTHING myself- from diesel mechanics to plumbing to medicine.......so I'd think it folly for someone to suggest that I couldn't assemble and adjust something as simple as a bicycle. It all depends where one is coming from and what they want. 

I didn't mean any criticism towards you. 

Now git out there and RIDE!


----------



## SolitaryRider

PJ352 said:


> Pretty strong opinions considering the length of time you've owned your BD bike and (presumed) saddle time you have in. IIRC you've already started a thread relating to that simple machine of yours, because you couldn't figure out the FD adjustments. Maybe you shoulda tracked down an 8 or 9 year old to help.
> 
> To be frank, IMO you don't have enough time/ experience with your bike to_ reliably_ offer many of your opinions, and most don't reflect my ~28 years of adult riding or wrenching.
> 
> Bikes are both simple and complex. So is fit. When bikes work and fit well, they're simple, and when they don't (and the cause/ remedy eludes) they're quite complex. And while saying that anyone can assemble a bike may be true at face value, assembling it to operate safely and reliably might not be so true - or easy. So making a blanket statement in a noob forum is (again, IMO) irresponsible.
> 
> If someone goes into an online purchase with eyes wide open, that's fine. But the fact remains that there are a number of value added services a reliable LBS offers that the online dealers do not. After delivery of that bike in a box, for all intents and purposes, the purchaser is on their own for something as simple as a stem swap to drivetrain adjustments. You're lucky you haven't (yet) had many glitches with your purchase, because if/ when you do it probably won't be fun, quick, or easy dealing with them. But that (in part) is why you paid the price that you did.


Ah, you make a good point, my friend- but I think the fact that I am a noob, and that I have not died, even though I have a mail-order bike and do all the mechanical stuff myself, is a testament to the fact that just about anyone can do it...if they choose to/want to/need to. 

Yes, I did ask for advice on that FD, and I'm sure I will need advice on other things in the future, as I am not an experienced bicycle mechanic- but the fact remains, I asked for advice and got the job done, right? 

I mean, C'mon...we're talking about things that any reasonably competent adult can handle. The only question is: Do they want to handle it, or is it worth it to them to pay someone else to do it? 

I agree that one size doesn't fit all- so I say, simply present both sides of the coin and let people make the decision that suits them best. 

I heard a lot of the same thing before I got my bike- "You really should go to an LBS to be fitted; You really should have the bike assembled at an LBS or buy it there...etc."- but luckily I'm the confident type, and did what I intended to do- while many a mere mortal might have been scared off :wink5:


----------



## Brazos

If it was my money I would get a Cannondale Synapse and be done with it. That being said if you get a good deal on-line, saving big $$, then go for it. I have found most LBS's couldn't adjust things any better than me so I just learned bow to do it. I was for the most part a newb when I bought my mountian bike. Speedgoat had a great deal on a bike I was interested in. I used their on-line fit program. They emailed me CAD drawings on me on my bike with all the measurements. The only measuement I needed off their drawing when I got the bike was the seatpost height. It took just a few mituntes to put it togather (just install the seat post, seat, handlebars) and I was off and running. Fit has been perfect since day one. You tube, forums, and books are quite plentiful. I now know how to build my own bike. It's actually quite fun. Point is you can do it. That being said the Synapse it a great bike.


----------



## SolitaryRider

Well-said, Brazos!

It's not rocket science.

Back before the internet, when I was still pretty young, I found a bike in the garbage. Took it home and took it completely apart...stripped the paint and repainted it (it was covered with old house paint!) and repacked all the bearings...fixed what needed fixing, put 'er back together, adjusted it and put many miles on that bike. Didn't really know what I was doing...and it took longer than it should have...but it wasn't anything that a kid in a basement with some very basic handtools couldn't figure out.

Today, with youtube and forums and all...it's a breeze!

I learned to fix cars and trucks the same way. One day, the first time I attempted to do brakes, I had to ask questiuons and consult books...shortly after that, I was doing waterpumps and even rebuilding engines. A lot of the time, just having the confidence to attempt something is half the battle...that, and having the sense to ask questions when you can't figure something out.......

Sheesh! We're talking about cables and chains and gears.....


----------



## jeepsouth

I thank everyone for their advice.

The advice on both sides of to buy or not to buy a bike online seems to be well thought out and reasoned. I appreciate everything said by all of you.

I've made my decision on this issue, at least. I will be buying from an LBS. Whether or not I can work on the bike myself at this point is not at all high on the list of reasons for this decision. As I said, I'm pretty handy and do indeed plan to learn to do most of the routine maintenance on any bike I buy (being careful no to cross the line that voids the warranty). And the more I learn, the more I'll do, of course. I am looking forward to that, in fact.

The number one reason for going the LBS route is that this is my first road bike and I want to make sure I get the proper size and fit...and, right now, I don't really know what that is. Of course maintenance issues, warranties, advice, relationship with the LBS...all of that certainly comes into the picture, but the size and fit issue is paramount at this point.

So, thanks again for all of the advice from both sides of this issue.

By the way, I kind of like the poster who said to buy the Synapse and be done with it. I am about to that point.


----------



## SolitaryRider

jeepsouth said:


> I thank everyone for their advice.
> 
> The advice on both sides of to buy or not to buy a bike online seems to be well thought out and reasoned. I appreciate everything said by all of you.
> 
> I've made my decision on this issue, at least. I will be buying from an LBS. Whether or not I can work on the bike myself at this point is not at all high on the list of reasons for this decision. As I said, I'm pretty handy and do indeed plan to learn to do most of the routine maintenance on any bike I buy (being careful no to cross the line that voids the warranty). And the more I learn, the more I'll do, of course. I am looking forward to that, in fact.
> 
> The number one reason for going the LBS route is that this is my first road bike and I want to make sure I get the proper size and fit...and, right now, I don't really know what that is. Of course maintenance issues, warranties, advice, relationship with the LBS...all of that certainly comes into the picture, but the size and fit issue is paramount at this point.
> 
> So, thanks again for all of the advice from both sides of this issue.
> 
> By the way, I kind of like the poster who said to buy the Synapse and be done with it. I am about to that point.


No matter how you slice it- you'll be getting a nice bike...and getting out there and riding....and that's the important thing. Where you buy it is more of a personal thing, and you have to do what is more convenient and comfortable for you- and you should have a great experience. 

Be sure and post pics when you get the bike! 

Enjoy!


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## easyridernyc

1500 bucks today, right now, i think i go for a new felt 75...very very nice bike with nifty new 105. buttery rocketship

Felt F75 Road Bike - 2012 Felt Bikes | Shop Now


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## PJ352

As I'm sure you've surmised, I agree with your going the LBS route, primarily for the reason(s) you mentioned.

As far as working on your own bike, if you're mechanically inclined/ have an aptitude for it, with the right tools and a learning curve I think you certainly can manage most tasks. That's how most of us started. But it's not for everyone, and that's one role a reputable LBS can fill.

Re: the bikes, I think your going back and forth on two or three brands/ models points up that there are a lot of nice bikes in your price range, in part, complicating the decision. But judging from your posts thus far, I'm sure you'll continue to use sound logic to sort it all out. 

As SR mentioned, the important thing is to get out and ride. As long as the bike suites our intended purposes and fits well, _what_ we ride is IMO/E of secondary importance.


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## jeepsouth

Pretty much settled on one of two bikes after a couple of additional (and longer test-rides).

Felt Z85
Cannondale Synapse 5 105

The LBS's for each brand are pretty equal, warranties are similar, I like the feel and ride of both bikes, I have no problems with the looks and appearance of the bikes....in other words, to my limited knowledge, all things are equal.

Bottom line is that I can get the Felt for about $90-100 less than the Cannondale. Not a huge deal over the life of a bike, but some real money nonetheless,

So, I am planning on buying the Felt unless you folks with more knowledge than me have some reasons that the Cannondale is worth the added $$. I have looked at the specs, but most of them are still Greek to me. So, if anyone sees something in the specs that would really put the Cannondale over the Felt, please let me know. I'll listen to anything anyone has to say. I plan to buy next week.

I have learned a lot from everyone's replies and I really do appreciate everyone's help with this decision.
Thank you all!!!!!!!


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## tipstall

Both look very nice. The Felt has a carbon seat post but that should not make your decision. I would say choose the bike you like and the shop you like, hopefully they match. Does one shop do anything that interests you like group rides?


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Pretty much settled on one of two bikes after a couple of additional (and longer test-rides).
> 
> Felt Z85
> Cannondale Synapse 5 105
> 
> The LBS's for each brand are pretty equal, warranties are similar, I like the feel and ride of both bikes, I have no problems with the looks and appearance of the bikes....in other words, to my limited knowledge, all things are equal.
> 
> Bottom line is that I can get the Felt for about $90-100 less than the Cannondale. Not a huge deal over the life of a bike, but some real money nonetheless,
> 
> So, I am planning on buying the Felt unless you folks with more knowledge than me have some reasons that the Cannondale is worth the added $$. I have looked at the specs, but most of them are still Greek to me. So, if anyone sees something in the specs that would really put the Cannondale over the Felt, please let me know. I'll listen to anything anyone has to say. I plan to buy next week.
> 
> I have learned a lot from everyone's replies and I really do appreciate everyone's help with this decision.
> Thank you all!!!!!!!


If I had to nit pick the specs, I think while the C'dale might be seen as having a potential edge with its BB30 bottom bracket, they haven't proven to be superior in performance (or even that reliable) when compared to 'older' designs. The Felt uses that 'older' square taper BB, but at some point in time the design allows you to upgrade to (as one example) a Shimano Tiagra crankset and BB. The C'dale would require an adapter to do the same, so that path is available with either design, albeit by differing methods.

Re: the wheelsets, I have the RS-10's that are on the C'dale and while they're 'OK', they're generally not highly regarded in the cycling community. With their lower spoke counts, depending on your weight, the Mavics on the Felt may hold an edge.

All that said, I think the bottom line is that if both bikes suite your intended purposes, fit well and ride/ handle the way you like, either is a fine choice.


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## SolitaryRider

I'm a noob, so take what I say with a grain of salt- but it seems to me that the Felts hold their value over time, better than the C'dales- which could be an indication of better quality...and could make a difference if you decide to sell it, down the road (Like say you decided to get a different bike). 

I like the older, proven BB of the Felt (Stick with stuff that works...let others be the guinea pigs for the latest & greatest)....and like PJ says....the Felt has better wheels....which, IMHO are one of the most important components...and also quite expensive to upgrade...so I'd want to go with the better ones from the git-go.

Me...I'd go with the Felt- it seems to be the better value.


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## Jett

Digger51 said:


> One last thought; with Trek you will get Bontranger components, with Specialized you will get Specialized components. With Giant, Cannondale and Felt your will get 3rd party components. I think it is better to get the 3rd party componants rather than "house" brand components, but if you choose the Trek or Specialized you will have a good solid bike.


Felt been using house brand components. They've been doing for as long as I can remember. 

Personally, I really don't see anything wrong with "house" brand, especially Bontrager and Specialized because they market and sell their stuff as components also.


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## Digger51

If you like to "fit" in the get the Cannondale. It is white and it is popular. If you want to be different get the Felt. It is Red and you might be the olny Felt owner on your group rides. Either waqy you will have a good bike and you will be happy.

Just get one and start riding. You can not have any fun if the bike is on the LBS floor!


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## jeepsouth

tipstall said:


> Both look very nice. The Felt has a carbon seat post but that should not make your decision. I would say choose the bike you like and the shop you like, hopefully they match. _Does one shop do anything that interests you like group rides?_



Both shops host group rides (that is something I looked for in an LBS). Both have a fitting process and free tune-ups, have nice people on staff, etc.

As I said, I'm going to be buying next week (going to the LBS next Saturday, to be exact), and the Felt is the choice right now. 

Thanks for the insight on the specs, resale values, spoke counts, wheel advantages, etc. From what I am gathering from you, each has maybe a slight advantage over the other in some aspect, but each bike, taken as a whole, is pretty much equal to the other, and either would be a fine choice for a first bike. Am I reading you right?

I have mentioned that my wife is also planning to buy a bike. She is still a few months away from doing so at this point, so I am forging ahead on my own. But, after test-riding with me the past few weeks, she is leaning toward the Felt also. Her second choice is the Giant Avail. Either way works for me.....the LBS I'll be dealing with carries both brands.:thumbsup:


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## jpaschal01

I have the 2011 Felt. A friend of mine haste the 2011 Cannondale. We both love our bikes. You can't go wrong either way if they both fit you.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for the insight on the specs, resale values, spoke counts, wheel advantages, etc. From what I am gathering from you, each has maybe a slight advantage over the other in some aspect, but each bike, taken as a whole, is pretty much equal to the other, and either would be a fine choice for a first bike. Am I reading you right?


I think that pretty much sums it up. Besides price, what I could see swaying you one way or the other might be your weight (RS-10's might not be the best choice for heavier riders, long term), preferring a state of the art BB (C'dales BB30) or, as SR noted, the tried and true square taper on the Felt.

JMO, but I think resale value will be about the same for any top brands like C'dale, Felt, Giant, Specialized, etc. compared to lesser known brands. Also, when you think about how long most cyclists have their bikes, the differences in price between these two is really a non-issue.


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## flyin

I have the felt z85 and i love it! I put around 1000 miles on this last summer with no real issues at all.


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## jeepsouth

Hello again everyone.

Sorry I've been away a while....family matters sidetracked my quest for a new (beginners) road bike (and everything else as well). To quote the Grateful Dead..."what a long, strange trip it's been" the past month or so. 

I hope everyone has been well. And, again, thanks for all of the great advice you all offered in the past.

Everything is back to normal now, except my original budget has been greatly reduced. As a result, I had to rethink some of my earlier positions on some matters related to the bike purchase. The biggest change of direction I made, and the decision that caused me the most headache was the decision to buy online to save some pretty substantial cash. I am still a huge proponent of the LBS route and the services they offer, but simple economics pretty much forced me to purchase elsewhere. I know this is contradictory to what I have posted thus far, but my desire and need to ride, along with the reduced budget, forced me to move on another bike.

During my extensive research, I rode a lot of bikes and got to know what size and geometry I needed, within limits....I still believe a good fitting session is essential.

Anyway, this weekend I ordered (from JensonUSA) a 2011 Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 road bike ($799.99, originally $1450).....(http://www.jensonusa.com/Complete-B...GEN_50.html?BIKE=953&CATID=2&SCATID=21&Y=2011). Both the bike and the seller seem to have good reviews all around. It is due to arrive late this week or early next week and I'll post some pics when it gets here.

I am very excited about it and cannot wait to get out on the road with it, although I feel I am a bit of a hypocrite by not buying locally. Wish me luck.


----------



## SolitaryRider

Jeep, that looks like an awesome bike, and a great deal for the money! I think you'll be very happy!!!! 

No way would you have gotten anything even close in an LBS for anywhere near that price!

(((Your link didn't go directly to the bike- so here it is for those playinjg along at home: Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 Bike '11 > Complete Bikes > Road Bikes | Jenson USA Online Bike Shop ))))

Can't wait till ya get it!


----------



## jeepsouth

SolitaryRider said:


> Jeep, that looks like an awesome bike, and a great deal for the money! I think you'll be very happy!!!!
> 
> No way would you have gotten anything even close in an LBS for anywhere near that price!
> 
> (((Your link didn't go directly to the bike- so here it is for those playinjg along at home: Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 Bike '11 > Complete Bikes > Road Bikes | Jenson USA Online Bike Shop ))))
> 
> Can't wait till ya get it!



Thanks, SolitaryRider.

I really do appreciate everyone's advice and help.

I can't wait to get out there and ride, and I'll let you all who have been so helpful know how it goes.


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## tipstall

That is a great looking bike. Are you going to assemble it? How much is there to do?


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## jeepsouth

tipstall said:


> That is a great looking bike. Are you going to assemble it? How much is there to do?



Jenson has some pretty impressive reviews and their website has a video on what you have to do when the bike arrives. They say that they assemble and tune the bike just as they would when you buy in a shop. They then remove the seat and seatpost, handlebars and front wheel. All you have to do is put those items back on, adjust the seat height and ride away. Of course, I plan to check it over more thoroughly, but it all seems pretty straightforward. I'll report on how it goes.

Of course things do go wrong sometimes. But all of the reviews I read said that Jenson was great to deal with when problems occurred. I'll report on that also in the event something isn't right.


----------



## 8toes

jeepsouth said:


> By the way, I kind of like the poster who said to buy the Synapse and be done with it. I am about to that point.


I agree. That is what I did and I do not regret it for a minute. I have had mine for a year now and have never had as much fun on a road bike. I needed something comfortable for my 50 year old carcass.










Cheers,

Brian J.


----------



## Eng4G3

Hi all, not to hijack the thread or anything but I am actually looking at these exact same bikes. I found this thread/forum as I am trying to get more information and this has been extremely helpful! 

I had a couple of questions specific to my situation that I'm hoping yall could shed some light on. It seems like some additional information beyond just the bikes is helpful, so I am 5' 7" 140lbs.. I usually do 2-3 20-30 mile rides a week, and I'd like to start doing longer rides as time/weather permits (last fall I did a 50, but thats the longest). So far I've just been using an old Schwinn, and so I'd like to upgrade to a newer/better fitting bike. I want to get shoes/pedals, and maybe a few other accessories (although I already have some basic shorts and a jersey). So I'd like to keep the total cost of everything closer to $1,000 rather than $2,000.

The bikes and prices are:
'11 54cm Specialized Secteur Elite Apex - $1,199
'12 54cm Cannondale Synapse Alloy 105s - $1,350
'12 54cm Felt z85 - $1,199

As I am a relatively new rider (and riding each bike for only 20 minutes, if that), they all feel relatively similar to me. The Cannondale dealer recommended the synapse over other bikes (not the other two specifically though), because the frame had more technology than other 'standard' frames. I think he was mainly referring to the SAVE technology so the seat stay functions more like a carbon seat stay, but also keeps the cost in the same range as other bikes that do not have a carbon seat stay. What do you all think of this?

I also was curious about how much the bike shop itself should play into the purchase decision. If I were to rank the bikes, I'd go Felt, C'Dale, Specialized at this point.. although they are all extremely close. It seems to be more trade-offs than anything else as they all have different pros/cons (especially after reading this thread). But based on bike shop, it'd be the opposite order. The Specialized shop I trust and have family friends that have all bought from them and have fantastic things to say about them over the years (they also have the most intensive fitting/technology, but its an additional $200). The C'Dale shop is also very reputable. The Felt dealer is ok.. not that they are bad, but they don't stand out as great either (as far as customer service goes when shopping, I have no idea about fitting, etc..). Any additional comments/advice would be much appreciated! Or if there are other things I should consider but haven't thought of.. thanks for the help!


----------



## jeepsouth

That is one nice-looking bike, Brian.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Hello again everyone.
> 
> Sorry I've been away a while....family matters sidetracked my quest for a new (beginners) road bike (and everything else as well). To quote the Grateful Dead..."what a long, strange trip it's been" the past month or so.
> 
> I hope everyone has been well. And, again, thanks for all of the great advice you all offered in the past.
> 
> Everything is back to normal now, except my original budget has been greatly reduced. As a result, I had to rethink some of my earlier positions on some matters related to the bike purchase. The biggest change of direction I made, and the decision that caused me the most headache was the decision to buy online to save some pretty substantial cash. I am still a huge proponent of the LBS route and the services they offer, but simple economics pretty much forced me to purchase elsewhere. I know this is contradictory to what I have posted thus far, but my desire and need to ride, along with the reduced budget, forced me to move on another bike.
> 
> During my extensive research, I rode a lot of bikes and got to know what size and geometry I needed, within limits....I still believe a good fitting session is essential.
> 
> Anyway, this weekend I ordered (from JensonUSA) a 2011 Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 road bike ($799.99, originally $1450).....(http://www.jensonusa.com/Complete-B...GEN_50.html?BIKE=953&CATID=2&SCATID=21&Y=2011). Both the bike and the seller seem to have good reviews all around. It is due to arrive late this week or early next week and I'll post some pics when it gets here.
> 
> I am very excited about it and cannot wait to get out on the road with it, although I feel I am a bit of a hypocrite by not buying locally. Wish me luck.


First off, I don't think you should beat yourself up over not buying from your LBS. Intend matters, and yours was that you'd buy from one of the LBS's. Stuff happens, and we all have to adjust our plans accordingly. 

JMO, but I would be upfront with your favored LBS and tap them as a resource to do final assembly, tuning, assist with fit (assumes correct sizing) and accessories. I think any good business owner with some foresight would see you as a good prospective customer. After all, besides the initial bike purchase, there's are lots of ways we part with our money at LBS's.  

Re: the Rocky Mtn, I think it's spec'd very well for the price. It's a solid package, and I think you'll be pleased with it. 

An admittedly biased opinion, but I'm glad you stuck with your plan to get a road bike.

Keep us updated on your progress.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> First off, I don't think you should beat yourself up over not buying from your LBS. Intend matters, and yours was that you'd buy from one of the LBS's. Stuff happens, and we all have to adjust our plans accordingly.
> 
> JMO, but I would be upfront with your favored LBS and tap them as a resource to do final assembly, tuning, assist with fit (assumes correct sizing) and accessories. I think any good business owner with some foresight would see you as a good prospective customer. After all, besides the initial bike purchase, there's are lots of ways we part with our money at LBS's.
> 
> Re: the Rocky Mtn, I think it's spec'd very well for the price. It's a solid package, and I think you'll be pleased with it.
> 
> An admittedly biased opinion, but I'm glad you stuck with your plan to get a road bike.
> 
> Keep us updated on your progress.



Thanks for the kind words. I always highly valued your opinion. Your responses were always well thought out and reasoned, plus you back up what you say with specs, experience, depth of knowledge, etc.

I do plan to drop by the LBS closest to my home fairly soon after I get the bike. I felt comfortable with those guys from the start (they sell Cannondales), and, like you said, I plan to just give them the straight facts and pledge to give them all of my business in the future. I believe they will understand and will be glad to simply have another road-biker in the fold.

I still feel a little bad over how things turned out, but if I had held out for the Felt or Cannondale from a LBS, I might have been Oct. or Nov. buying a bike after all that took place here. But, you're right....be honest with the LBS and ride as much as possible, and I plan to do both.

I'll post some pics when the bike arrives and keep you updated.

Thanks again for the great help you have been!!:thumbsup:


----------



## 8toes

jeepsouth said:


> That is one nice-looking bike, Brian.


Thank you. I thought so too, and so did my girlfriend....she got it for me as a birthday gift last year. I changed the bar tape to white from black and put on the bottle cages in Decemner. I think a white saddle would finish it up nicely....and it rides like a dream.

Cheers,

Brian J.


----------



## PJ352

Eng4G3 said:


> Hi all, not to hijack the thread or anything...


Then please don't. The OP and others have put a fair amount of effort into this thread and hijacking breaks the continuity and will serve neither you nor the OP in the long run.

I don't know what the post count requirements are for starting a thread, but just go tell a bunch of folks they have nice bikes, then author your own (dedicated) thread*. You'll be more apt to get some assistance that way.

* If you can cut and paste, you won't even have to rewrite it. :thumbsup:


----------



## Eng4G3

PJ352 said:


> Then please don't. The OP and others have put a fair amount of effort into this thread and hijacking breaks the continuity and will serve neither you nor the OP in the long run.
> 
> I don't know what the post count requirements are for starting a thread, but just go tell a bunch of folks they have nice bikes, then author your own (dedicated) thread*. You'll be more apt to get some assistance that way.
> 
> * If you can cut and paste, you won't even have to rewrite it. :thumbsup:


I guess I just thought it made sense to keep it in the same thread since its the exact same bikes.. With some forums if you post a new thread that has the same content as another people just yell at you to use the search and look at that thread rather than cluttering the forum up with another one on the same topic (which I have actually seen on this forum as well). Guess you can't win, but I'll try to start another thread. Sorry about that.


----------



## PJ352

Eng4G3 said:


> I guess I just thought it made sense to keep it in the same thread since its the exact same bikes..* With some forums if you post a new thread that has the same content as another people just yell at you to use the search* and look at that thread rather than cluttering the forum up with another one on the same topic (which I have actually seen on this forum as well). Guess you can't win, but I'll try to start another thread. Sorry about that.


I can't argue your point, because it's true. But keep the faith because you _can_ win, it'll just take a couple of more posts.


----------



## Eng4G3

PJ352 said:


> I can't argue your point, because it's true. But keep the faith because you _can_ win, it'll just take a couple of more posts.


No worries PJ352, the new thread is up and running!


----------



## jeepsouth

Good luck, Eng. I just went through what you are experiencing. I learned a lot and it was really fun riding all of those different bikes.

All (and I do mean ALL) of the folks on this site offered really valuable advice to me, as I am sure they will offer to you. Even when the posters had completely opposite views, the discussions were friendly and the arguments were well reasoned and thoughtfully expressed by both sides. My experience on this site was extremely helpful.

Good luck on your search and please post some pics when you get your bike. My bike is scheduled to arrive this weekend, so look for the pics.


----------



## jeepsouth

Update: Got an e-mail yesterday stating that the bike will arrive on Tuesday. That is a little later than I expected, but only by one day, so no big deal. Pedals and a few other smaller items should arrive today.

The good part is that I am off from work on Wed. and Thurs., so I plan to really put the bike to the test both of those days.

I'll post pics next week after the bike arrives.


----------



## jeepsouth

Bike is due Tuesday....I can't wait.

Meanwhile, I've got pretty much everything else I'll need (helmet, shoes, pedals, water bottle...), except a seat bag with tools. I've been looking at the ones with patches, CO2 cartridges, etc. Is there one in particular I would be better off with? Do I also need to throw in a multi-tool? 

The bottom-line question, I guess, is: In your experience, what are the essentials (aside from cell phone and cash) to take along if you're riding pretty long miles alone out in the countryside?


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Bike is due Tuesday....I can't wait.
> 
> Meanwhile, I've got pretty much everything else I'll need (helmet, shoes, pedals, water bottle...), except a seat bag with tools. I've been looking at the ones with patches, CO2 cartridges, etc. Is there one in particular I would be better off with? Do I also need to throw in a multi-tool?
> 
> The bottom-line question, I guess, is: In your experience, *what are the essentials (aside from cell phone and cash) to take along if you're riding pretty long miles alone out in the countryside?*


Given the riding environment you describe, my 'essentials' list would include:
Wedge saddle bag - medium (Topeak/ Specialized are two good brands)
Tire levers
Spare tube 
Patch kit
Innovations Ultraflate Plus CO2 inflator
2-3 12-16g unthreaded carts (I get the 12g's by the box at Walmart)
Multitool w/ chain breaker 
A recent thread with recommendations:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/beginners-corner/what-good-multi-tool-272392.html

Not essential, but nice to have:
Rag/ paper towels
Latex gloves
A second tube, if it'll fit

Optional:
Mini-pump
Lights

I would strongly recommend a Road ID bracelet. Their basic model (Wrist ID Sport) will do. Also, a floor pump, but keep that home. 

EDIT: And one more thing. A computer with cadence function. Wired or wireless, depending on preferences/ budget. FWIW, I like Cateyes.


----------



## jeepsouth

Thanks for the great info. That is a huge help.

As far as a computer goes, I was thinking about getting a mount for my smart-phone and using "Map My Ride." Any experience with that option?


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for the great info. That is a huge help.
> 
> As far as a computer goes, I was thinking about getting a mount for my smart-phone and using "Map My Ride." Any experience with that option?


I have no experience with them, but I'm sure others will assist. 

FWIW, my opinion is that anything that helps you monitor/ develop a good cadence range will also help you smooth the pedal stroke and save the knees. 

Here's a thread that may help answer your question:
http://forums.roadbikereview.com/beginners-corner/smartphones-vs-cycle-computer-272837.html


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## jeepsouth

When I got home this evening, this box was on the front porch.

After about 30 minutes of assembly, this is my new bike!!! 

I have a 25 miler scheduled for tomorrow. I'll let you know how it goes.

I really do appreciate all of the advice you all offered. I am looking forward to learning a lot more.

Thanks!!!


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## PJ352

Nice bike! Congrats, and good luck tomorrow.


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Nice bike! Congrats, and good luck tomorrow.


Thanks, PJ. You really were a great help, and I really mean that. THANKS!!!!

I'm pretty excited about finally being able to get out on it tomorrow. It has been a long trip getting to this point.

Although this is not exactly what I imagined when I set out, I am pleased with the results. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks again.


----------



## gevad

Man, that is a VERY nice bike! Even nicer than it looks on the Jensen website.

I've followed your thread from the beginning and I'm glad you ended up with such an excellent bike. Have fun riding the heck out of it.


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## jeepsouth

gevad said:


> Man, that is a VERY nice bike! Even nicer than it looks on the Jensen website.
> 
> I've followed your thread from the beginning and I'm glad you ended up with such an excellent bike. Have fun riding the heck out of it.




Thanks. And thanks again to everyone who offered advice.

One more pic taken during my 20+ mile ride today. The bike performed flawlessly, by the way. I couldn't be happier.


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## PJ352

Sounds like you and your new 'companion' are getting along pretty well together. Keep us updated...


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## DoubleD85

This is a great thread with a lot of really great info. Nice bike, btw!


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Sounds like you and your new 'companion' are getting along pretty well together. Keep us updated...



After riding 20+ miles today, being new to road biking, and having a relaxing evening to think things over, I do have a few observations. Please remember that this is all new to me and that I would like to hear your opinions on what I discovered today.

1) I test-rode a lot of bikes during my research. This bike "feels" (and I know this is very subjective) most like the Trek 2.1. I don't have anything specific on this, it is just a "feel" thing. Also, it is a pretty good thing - the 2.1 was an impressive bike.

2) I did not ride a hilly route today, but the 105 group was flawless.

3) As I expected (from all of the test-riding I did) I will need to go to a shorter stem in the near future.

4) I have read a lot of horror stories about people's first experience with clipping in and out, but this was no problem at all for me today. Don't know why.

5) No real soreness but I did feel some discomfort in a few areas during my ride. The pedals want to make me have much better posture and leg position than I did on my old "comfort" bike (Giant Sedona). For some reason, the outside bottoms of my feet were sore during the ride. I don't know if any of you have experienced this, but I'd like to hear it if you did. This was nothing major; just a little uncomfortable at times. Also, the muscles in the backs of my arms were a little sore. I think going to the shorter stem will remedy this.

6) The saddle was fine for about the first 15 miles, but got slightly uncomfortable during the last quarter of the ride. I do have road bike shorts with the padding. I think the saddle is something I will grow accustomed to. However, I know nothing about saddles. Mine is a San Marco Ponza Power. Don't know if that is a good one or not. I would appreciate any input anyone may have, or recommendations on a replacement.

7) After today, I know I need some short-fingered, padded gloves, a cycling jersey (I have two on order), the shorter stem mentioned earlier, and a lot more seat time to get accustomed to everything.

I loved every minute of today's ride and cannot wait to really put this bike through it's paces in the future.

As always, any input/advice is greatly appreciated and will be received in the manner it is intended and with gratitude.

All in all, extremely pleased and happy with the bike. It certainly exceeded my expectations today.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> After riding 20+ miles today, being new to road biking, and having a relaxing evening to think things over, I do have a few observations. Please remember that this is all new to me and that I would like to hear your opinions on what I discovered today.
> 
> 1) I test-rode a lot of bikes during my research. This bike "feels" (and I know this is very subjective) most like the Trek 2.1. I don't have anything specific on this, it is just a "feel" thing. Also, it is a pretty good thing - the 2.1 was an impressive bike.
> 
> 2) I did not ride a hilly route today, but the 105 group was flawless.
> 
> 3) As I expected (from all of the test-riding I did) I will need to go to a shorter stem in the near future.
> 
> 4) I have read a lot of horror stories about people's first experience with clipping in and out, but this was no problem at all for me today. Don't know why.
> 
> 5) No real soreness but I did feel some discomfort in a few areas during my ride. The pedals want to make me have much better posture and leg position than I did on my old "comfort" bike (Giant Sedona). For some reason, the outside bottoms of my feet were sore during the ride. I don't know if any of you have experienced this, but I'd like to hear it if you did. This was nothing major; just a little uncomfortable at times. Also, the muscles in the backs of my arms were a little sore. I think going to the shorter stem will remedy this.
> 
> 6) The saddle was fine for about the first 15 miles, but got slightly uncomfortable during the last quarter of the ride. I do have road bike shorts with the padding. I think the saddle is something I will grow accustomed to. However, I know nothing about saddles. Mine is a San Marco Ponza Power. Don't know if that is a good one or not. I would appreciate any input anyone may have, or recommendations on a replacement.
> 
> 7) After today, I know I need some short-fingered, padded gloves, a cycling jersey (I have two on order), the shorter stem mentioned earlier, and a lot more seat time to get accustomed to everything.
> 
> I loved every minute of today's ride and cannot wait to really put this bike through it's paces in the future.
> 
> As always, any input/advice is greatly appreciated and will be received in the manner it is intended and with gratitude.
> 
> All in all, extremely pleased and happy with the bike. It certainly exceeded my expectations today.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


I think most of what you're experiencing/ offering here can be attributed to acclimation to road riding and not yet being fitted to your bike. 

I can't tell for certain from the pic, but it looks like you're using clipless pedals. If so, cleat set up is an integral part of fit and critical to get right - or issues similar to what you describe can result. We can guide you to some adjustments, but I recommend scheduling a fitting at a reputable shop, detailing your areas of discomfort with the fitter.

At this point, because your fit will evolve as you build saddle time, it doesn't need to be anything beyond a standard fitting, but I think going this route trumps winging it trying to get fit right. 

I think the same applies to the saddle. Before swapping it out, get fitted and while building saddle time, work on developing proper form on the bike. Maintaining proper cadence, smoothing the pedal stroke and improving fitness can all change certain aspects of fit.

Re: the 'Trek feeling', I'm not surprised. Since a bikes geometry dictates handling and to some extent ride, if the Trek and Rocky Mtn geo are more similar than different, it stands to reason they'd have the same general 'feel' about them, especially if running the same tire size at similar pressures.

Last thoughts.... +1 on the gloves. They'll serve two purposes. One, they'll quell road vibrations and second, they offer a level of protection.

For the sore arms... could be reach (stem length), but a fitting will sort that out. Beyond that, keep your upper torso relaxed, arms slightly bent and a slightly loose grip on the bars. Using a 'vice grip' tends to send vibrations up a riders arms to the shoulders and neck. In general, be aware of maintaining good form on the bike.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> I think most of what you're experiencing/ offering here can be attributed to acclimation to road riding and not yet being fitted to your bike.
> 
> I can't tell for certain from the pic, but it looks like you're using clipless pedals. If so, cleat set up is an integral part of fit and critical to get right - or issues similar to what you describe can result. We can guide you to some adjustments, but I recommend scheduling a fitting at a reputable shop, detailing your areas of discomfort with the fitter.
> 
> At this point, because your fit will evolve as you build saddle time, it doesn't need to be anything beyond a standard fitting, but I think going this route trumps winging it trying to get fit right.
> 
> I think the same applies to the saddle. Before swapping it out, get fitted and while building saddle time, work on developing proper form on the bike. Maintaining proper cadence, smoothing the pedal stroke and improving fitness can all change certain aspects of fit.
> 
> Re: the 'Trek feeling', I'm not surprised. Since a bikes geometry dictates handling and to some extent ride, if the Trek and Rocky Mtn geo are more similar than different, it stands to reason they'd have the same general 'feel' about them, especially if running the same tire size at similar pressures.
> 
> Last thoughts.... +1 on the gloves. They'll serve two purposes. One, they'll quell road vibrations and second, they offer a level of protection.
> 
> For the sore arms... could be reach (stem length), but a fitting will sort that out. Beyond that, keep your upper torso relaxed, arms slightly bent and a slightly loose grip on the bars. Using a 'vice grip' tends to send vibrations up a riders arms to the shoulders and neck. In general, be aware of maintaining good form on the bike.




Thanks for the advice. I plan to go through a fitting process n the very near future.


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## jeepsouth

Something interesting happened today.

I took my new bike into a local shop to have it checked over. The tech asked if I bought it online. I said yes and briefly explained the situation to him and I told him I got it from JensonUSA He commented favorably on my bike (he had never seen this exact model before and said he was impressed with the frame shape, tubing shape, welds, etc.). Then he said something interesting, and quite without any prompting on my part. In a nutshell, he said my bike was obviously put together and tuned by someone who cared and also knew what he was doing (only very minor adjustments were required). He said (and this is nearly a word-for-word quote) "those Motobecanes and others from Bikes Direct and other places are just thrown together. The components are good, but they are put together very haphazardly. Takes a lot of work to straighten them out"

I'm not trying to nitpick BD, or start some big deal....just reporting what a bike tech said from out of the clear blue to me today. I have no experience with BD and have seen some favorable comments on this site about them. But, based on what happened today, I'm glad I went another route.

By the way, after tuning today (and it didn't require much), I plan to ride another 20-25 miles tomorrow. I'll report on that then.


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## D0rk

Nice to see a good outcome from a Jenson order. Very nice bike. I ordered a Look 566 from them a few weeks ago and it arrived with chipped paint on the fork from the front brake being put on wrong. Old fork shipped out, new one on the way. Other than that, everything seems fine and the drivetrain feels like it was tuned properly already. Really eager to get it on the road.


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## SoCalSean

JeepSouth - I picked up the same bike at Jenson in Corona, CA last Sunday. I share your positive comments after my first 22 mile ride. I found your post when I had the Oxygen 50 on hold, and the detail you put into your decisions gave me the confidence to go back the next day and pick it up. Thanks! 

D0rk - Sorry about your experience. The guys at Jenson were very nice and low pressure, but seemed a lot more hands off than I've heard from my friends who've bought from LBS. One cool thing about being local to them is they're giving a free tune up and lifetime brake/deraileur adjustments.


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## jeepsouth

SoCalSean said:


> JeepSouth - I picked up the same bike at Jenson in Corona, CA last Sunday. I share your positive comments after my first 22 mile ride. I found your post when I had the Oxygen 50 on hold, and the detail you put into your decisions gave me the confidence to go back the next day and pick it up. Thanks!
> 
> D0rk - Sorry about your experience. The guys at Jenson were very nice and low pressure, but seemed a lot more hands off than I've heard from my friends who've bought from LBS. One cool thing about being local to them is they're giving a free tune up and lifetime brake/deraileur adjustments.




Thanks. I hope you enjoy your Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 as much as I am enjoying mine.

I did not get out on Friday due to the weather, but got in another 20+ miler today. I didn't really push it today since I was with my wife (she was on a Diamondback Mtn. bike) and we were on the local rail trail (Swamp Rabbit Trail from Greenville to Travelers Rest, SC). We just had a nice ride to Travelers Rest, had lunch and rode back to Greenville. Just a nice relaxing day on the bike.

The bike performed great. I still have not had the fitting session, but will follow through on that very soon. I still feel like I am reaching a bit, but the fitting will cure that.

All in all, I could not be happier. The bike is solid, the components are all performing perfectly, and I am getting more comfortable on it. I feel like I made a good choice and got a great value in this bike.

I plan to really put it to the test on Monday. There is a closed air force base near here where a lot of people ride the old perimeter road. It is rolling and runs about 7.5 miles. I plan to do at least 4 laps on Monday to try to figure out where I am shape-wise, speed-wise, etc. I'll report on that later. Can't wait! :thumbsup:


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> I plan to really put it to the test on Monday. There is a closed air force base near here where a lot of people ride the old perimeter road. It is rolling and runs about 7.5 miles. I plan to do at least 4 laps on Monday to try to figure out where I am shape-wise, speed-wise, etc. I'll report on that later. Can't wait! :thumbsup:


Glad you're enjoying your bike!

This ride you're mentioning would be a good pre-fitting 'test' ride, to assess your current fit and discuss any issues with the fitter. With any luck they'll be minor and easily remedied, but time will tell.

Let us know how that ride goes...


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Glad you're enjoying your bike!
> 
> This ride you're mentioning would be a good pre-fitting 'test' ride, to assess your current fit and discuss any issues with the fitter. With any luck they'll be minor and easily remedied, but time will tell.
> 
> Let us know how that ride goes...



The ride was great, although I did make a few "rookie mistakes".

First, I went out way too hard and fast on the first lap, almost wearing myself out before I could learn much. I did 2 more laps at a more reasonable pace, paying more attention to cadence, how the bike felt, my position on the bike, etc. The total distance was about 22 miles. I don't have any real soreness today, and did not feel greatly "out of position" on the bike at any time. I am still going to have the fitting done, but I think only minor tweaks will be in order. The saddle is still pretty uncomfortable later in the ride, so I want to pay special attention to that during the fitting.

Second, I don't have any data to share. The "Map My Ride" app worked great on the rides over the weekend and started up just fine at the beginning of the ride yesterday. But, at the end of the first lap I tried to check the data and the app had shut down the phone. Nothing would work and the phone would not even turn on again. I finally had to take the battery out and put it back in to get the phone to work at all. I am now looking at bike computers. Any suggestions on a reasonably priced one?

The bike shifted quickly and without a hitch (at least it seemed so to me - I have no experience for comparison). It accelerated pretty quickly and was easy to handle. I felt the road more through the forks than I did coming up through the seatpost, but this may be normal (again, I'm new to this). There are some challenging hills on the loop, so I finally found out what a real hill feels like on a road bike. Although the hills were tough, the gearing made them manageable, at least.

When I got home, I wiped down the bike (including the hard-to-get-to areas) and cleaned and lubed the chain. Is there any other post-ride or routine maintenance I should be doing? Any other areas I should lube?

All in all, a fun ride and I learned some things about shifting, positioning myself on the bike, etc. My biggest mistake was almost wearing myself out in the first 7 miles or so, but even that taught me something.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> The ride was great, although I did make a few "rookie mistakes".
> 
> First, I went out way too hard and fast on the first lap, almost wearing myself out before I could learn much. I did 2 more laps at a more reasonable pace, paying more attention to cadence, how the bike felt, my position on the bike, etc. The total distance was about 22 miles. I don't have any real soreness today, and did not feel greatly "out of position" on the bike at any time. I am still going to have the fitting done, but I think only minor tweaks will be in order. The saddle is still pretty uncomfortable later in the ride, so I want to pay special attention to that during the fitting.
> 
> Second, I don't have any data to share. The "Map My Ride" app worked great on the rides over the weekend and started up just fine at the beginning of the ride yesterday. But, at the end of the first lap I tried to check the data and the app had shut down the phone. Nothing would work and the phone would not even turn on again. I finally had to take the battery out and put it back in to get the phone to work at all. I am now looking at bike computers. Any suggestions on a reasonably priced one?
> 
> The bike shifted quickly and without a hitch (at least it seemed so to me - I have no experience for comparison). It accelerated pretty quickly and was easy to handle. I felt the road more through the forks than I did coming up through the seatpost, but this may be normal (again, I'm new to this). There are some challenging hills on the loop, so I finally found out what a real hill feels like on a road bike. Although the hills were tough, the gearing made them manageable, at least.
> 
> When I got home, I wiped down the bike (including the hard-to-get-to areas) and cleaned and lubed the chain. Is there any other post-ride or routine maintenance I should be doing? Any other areas I should lube?
> 
> All in all, a fun ride and I learned some things about shifting, positioning myself on the bike, etc. My biggest mistake was almost wearing myself out in the first 7 miles or so, but even that taught me something.


All in all I think your ride went pretty well. Even recognizing (then learning from) mistakes is noteworthy, so you're well on your way....

Some thoughts on what you've offered...

The saddle soreness could be due to a number of things. Acclimation to road riding, position/ fit or it's just not right for you. I think your plan to communicate this to the fitter is a good idea, but I'd give it some more time before swapping it out.

Re: too much (effort), too soon, I use the bell curve as a comparison for my ride intensity. Starting out serves as a warm up, after about 10-15 minutes (depending on temp/ conditions, how I feel..) I up my intensity to basically my cruising speed. A couple of miles from the end of my rides, I start easing up a bit. A cool down mode. Obviously that description is a generalization, but gives you some idea of what variation might work for you.

re: bike computers, I'm a fan of Cateyes. I use both the wired Astrale 8 and Strada double wireless, so depending on your preferences/ budget, those are what I recommend. Both have cadence, which I think is very important for someone new to road riding. 

Amazon.com: Cateye CC-RD400DW Strada Double Wireless Cycling Computer: Sports & Outdoors

CatEye Astrale 8 Bike Computer - Cyclocomputers

Re: shifting performance and gearing, I think you'd know if the bike wasn't shifting correctly. You'd hear drivetrain noises and/ or experience skips. If you're so inclined, you could have your LBS check it over, but my philosophy is, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. 

If you were able to navigate the climbs with the OE gearing, I'd say (at least for now) it's a good match with your fitness and terrain, so... same philosophy. 

Re: maintenance, wiping down the bike and cleaning the drivetrain/ lubing the chain are good ideas, but unless you've ridden in dusty/ wet conditions, it's not necessary to lube the chain that often. I log about 150+ miles weekly and lube my chain once in that time. 

Generally speaking, after experimenting with tire pressures, keep them properly inflated, periodically checking for cuts/ cracks. Wipe the rim braking surfaces down (I use denatured alcohol - on the pads as well) and if either get really grungy use a no-scratch pad and the alcohol to remove the grit and brake residue, then wipe clean with a cloth or paper towels. Annually I check bearing assemblies (hubs, headset, BB), but cartridges are replacing the loose ball types and they're designed to be used, then replaced at the end of their life cycle. 

Everything else (steering, shifting, braking performance) I view as adjust/ replace as needed. Because of the wearable items, it's a good idea to learn about/ keep an eye on the drivetrain (chain, cassette, chain rings) for signs of wear, because not replacing one will lead to premature wear of another. Just as a guide for how often this may be the case, my chains last about 4k miles. Cassettes three times that. As always, YMMV.

Park Tools and Sheldon Brown are both good resources for more maintenance/ repair info.


----------



## jeepsouth

Thanks for your detailed reply, PJ. I will follow up on those bike computers you suggested, as well as the routine maintenance issues. As for the saddle, I do plan on giving it a while longer. It is not unbearable by any means; I'm just trying to get used to it.

A bit of news....my wife has finally settled on her bike. We are going to a local LBS tomorrow where she will be fitted for a new Cannondale Synapse 6 (alloy with Tiagra), a really nice bike. Last week she did some additional test-rides, focusing on 3 bikes: the C'dale, a Felt ZW75 and a Giant Avail 2. She felt that the ride and feel on the C'dale was far, far ahead of the other two. In fact, she said there was really no comparison and that the C'dale was in another league. Just one woman's opinion; the others are fine bikes.

By the way, it turns out that the Cannondale shop is the closest one to our home, which is pretty convenient. When we are done with her purchase, I plan to have my fitting session done there sometime in the next few weeks. They also host group rides and are very active in the local biking community here in our area. I think it will be a great shop to deal with over the long-haul.


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## St8kout

This is my first post here. Not trying to hijack this thread or anything but the rules won't let me start my own thread just yet. I'm in the same boat looking for an entry road bike and it looks like the best way to go is to spend more up front instead of constantly upgrading as soon as I get a bike.

I'm probably going to go with Bikesdirect as I usually buy everything online anyway and it's the best bang for the buck. I work on everything myself (cars, motorbikes, etc) so I have no problem with the thought of assembling and setting up my own bike. The used bike market is somewhat bleak for a city the size of Vegas. I found many used road bikes but for some reason they are mostly women's. They bought nice expensive bikes and don't want to use them anymore. The few men's bikes I've seen want almost full retail price, maybe $100 off for a 5 yr old $1500 bike. Forget that. I'm aware of the all important fit size so I did the online size calculations and it looks like 53-54 cm is my size range.

Now for my question. Is there any real downside to starting off with some of these tri bikes on BD? Although the forums here convinced me not to go with a hybrid, the tri handlebars looks like it could be a good fit for the kind of long distance riding I want to do, and most of them seem to have upgraded equipment already in place. I used to have a nice Raleigh some 15 years ago and very seldom used the 'drops' as it was way too uncomfortable for long rides (I gave it to some gal and never saw it again), so now I'm trying to get back into biking. I'm actually about 25 miles outside of Vegas and very few of the streets here are level, I kid you not. You are always going either uphill or downhill (not too extreme but still...) so that is the kind of riding I will be doing.

So is a road bike still the best way for me to go for the area I'm in? I'm not looking to make biking my life or anything but I still want a nice setup for everyday use and long distance runs.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for your detailed reply, PJ. I will follow up on those bike computers you suggested, as well as the routine maintenance issues. As for the saddle, I do plan on giving it a while longer. It is not unbearable by any means; I'm just trying to get used to it.
> 
> A bit of news....my wife has finally settled on her bike. We are going to a local LBS tomorrow where she will be fitted for a new Cannondale Synapse 6 (alloy with Tiagra), a really nice bike. Last week she did some additional test-rides, focusing on 3 bikes: the C'dale, a Felt ZW75 and a Giant Avail 2. She felt that the ride and feel on the C'dale was far, far ahead of the other two. In fact, she said there was really no comparison and that the C'dale was in another league. Just one woman's opinion; the others are fine bikes.
> 
> By the way, it turns out that the Cannondale shop is the closest one to our home, which is pretty convenient. When we are done with her purchase, I plan to have my fitting session done there sometime in the next few weeks. They also host group rides and are very active in the local biking community here in our area. I think it will be a great shop to deal with over the long-haul.


Congrats to your wife on a fine purchase. I think the Synapse is a very nice first bike and IMO the new Tiagra group performs on a par with the previous generation 105. All in all, a good choice.

Not everyone agrees, but for me test rides serve the purpose of shaking out all the contenders and clarifying my preferred bike. Sometimes it's hard to pinpoint just _why_ it's 'the one', but I suspect more times than not it's that 'fits like a glove' feeling where the bike is an extension of the rider. Given the process she followed, I'm confident your wife will be pleased with her choice.

Since you're comfortable with the C'dale shop, it's makes sense to tap it as a resource for your fitting, join in group rides and generally use them as the valuable resource reputable LBS's are. The purchase of your and your wife's bikes is just the beginning.... :thumbsup:


----------



## PJ352

St8kout said:


> Not trying to hijack this thread or anything...


But you are. Please take a minute or two out and post some 'nice bike!' comments in the appropriate threads to build your post count, then start your own.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Congrats to your wife on a fine purchase. I think the Synapse is a very nice first bike and IMO the new Tiagra group performs on a par with the previous generation 105. All in all, a good choice.
> 
> Not everyone agrees, but for me test rides serve the purpose of shaking out all the contenders and clarifying my preferred bike. Sometimes it's hard to pinpoint just _why_ it's 'the one', but I suspect more times than not it's that 'fits like a glove' feeling where the bike is an extension of the rider. Given the process she followed, I'm confident your wife will be pleased with her choice.
> 
> Since you're comfortable with the C'dale shop, it's makes sense to tap it as a resource for your fitting, join in group rides and generally use them as the valuable resource reputable LBS's are. The purchase of your and your wife's bikes is just the beginning.... :thumbsup:




Thanks, PJ. My wife was very thorough in her research. I'll let you know how it goes for us tomorrow. I was with her on her last visit to the LBS and I think they will have to order her size.....unless they have gotten some more on during the past week.


----------



## jeepsouth

The folks at the LBS (Gusto Cycles) were very thorough in helping my wife choose the right bike on Saturday. They did what I would call a "preliminary fitting" for her to determine the correct size. They put her on a number of bikes with various set-ups and took some measurements. Turns out she needs a size 51 in the Cannondale Women's Synapse 6. That bike fits her very well right out of the box. It looks like only minor tweaking will be in order later when the LBS does the full fitting on the bike she is actually going to own.

The shop did not have the exact size and color on Saturday, but they have ordered one for her. It should be here by the first week in May. My wife is very excited and is really looking forward to getting out and putting in some miles.

I also discussed my bike and needs with the folks at the LBS. They were very helpful and we will schedule a fitting session soon. Looks like they will be a great group to deal with, as I suspected they would be.


----------



## jeepsouth

jeepsouth said:


> The folks at the LBS (Gusto Cycles) were very thorough in helping my wife choose the right bike on Saturday. They did what I would call a "preliminary fitting" for her to determine the correct size. They put her on a number of bikes with various set-ups and took some measurements. Turns out she needs a size 51 in the Cannondale Women's Synapse 6. That bike fits her very well right out of the box. It looks like only minor tweaking will be in order later when the LBS does the full fitting on the bike she is actually going to own.
> 
> The shop did not have the exact size and color on Saturday, but they have ordered one for her. It should be here by the first week in May. My wife is very excited and is really looking forward to getting out and putting in some miles.
> 
> I also discussed my bike and needs with the folks at the LBS. They were very helpful and we will schedule a fitting session soon. Looks like they will be a great group to deal with, as I suspected they would be.




Sorry...I meant to add the stock photo of the bike my wife ordered. Here it is..........


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## DoubleD85

Great looking bike!


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> The folks at the LBS (Gusto Cycles) were very thorough in helping my wife choose the right bike on Saturday. They did what I would call a "preliminary fitting" for her to determine the correct size. They put her on a number of bikes with various set-ups and took some measurements. Turns out she needs a size 51 in the Cannondale Women's Synapse 6. That bike fits her very well right out of the box. It looks like only minor tweaking will be in order later when the LBS does the full fitting on the bike she is actually going to own.
> 
> The shop did not have the exact size and color on Saturday, but they have ordered one for her. It should be here by the first week in May. My wife is very excited and is really looking forward to getting out and putting in some miles.
> 
> I also discussed my bike and needs with the folks at the LBS. They were very helpful and we will schedule a fitting session soon. Looks like they will be a great group to deal with, as I suspected they would be.


From your (fit) description thus far, I'd say you and your wife have chosen a reputable shop that's demonstrating better than average care in their fittings.

The 'fits well out of the box' comment indicates that the fitting will likely be straightforward, amounting to (as you say) minor tweaking. It also indicates that (overall) Synapse geo is a good match for your wife's anatomy.

That's a beautiful bike, BTW. Great 'starter' bike. 

Keep us posted on your progress.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> From your (fit) description thus far, I'd say you and your wife have chosen a reputable shop that's demonstrating better than average care in their fittings.
> 
> The 'fits well out of the box' comment indicates that the fitting will likely be straightforward, amounting to (as you say) minor tweaking. It also indicates that (overall) Synapse geo is a good match for your wife's anatomy.
> 
> That's a beautiful bike, BTW. Great 'starter' bike.
> 
> Keep us posted on your progress.



Thanks, PJ. 

I agree that the shop appears to be doing a little more than I expected to make sure she got the right bike. This was our fourth visit to that particular shop and we were always honest and up-front with them during the research phase. When we first arrived on Saturday, we told them that my wife had tested a lot of bikes and had settled on the Synapse, and that we were there to buy/order one. From our previous visits, we knew that they did not have the exact bike she wanted (Synapse 6 Tiagra) in the size (at that time we were guessing 51 or 54) or color she wanted. They did have a couple of 105-equipped Synapses and 3 Sora equipped ones in various sizes, so she had plenty of bikes to try out. She also tried out a men's Synapse Tiagra in size 48. That one fit pretty well also. We were there about 1.5 hours and they were pretty attentive and thorough. All-in-all a very nice experience.

I'll add more later as I gain experience on my bike and when her's arrives.....if she can stand the wait.


----------



## SolitaryRider

St8kout said:


> This is my first post here. Not trying to hijack this thread or anything but the rules won't let me start my own thread just yet. I'm in the same boat looking for an entry road bike and it looks like the best way to go is to spend more up front instead of constantly upgrading as soon as I get a bike.
> 
> I'm probably going to go with Bikesdirect as I usually buy everything online anyway and it's the best bang for the buck. I work on everything myself (cars, motorbikes, etc) so I have no problem with the thought of assembling and setting up my own bike. The used bike market is somewhat bleak for a city the size of Vegas. I found many used road bikes but for some reason they are mostly women's. They bought nice expensive bikes and don't want to use them anymore. The few men's bikes I've seen want almost full retail price, maybe $100 off for a 5 yr old $1500 bike. Forget that. I'm aware of the all important fit size so I did the online size calculations and it looks like 53-54 cm is my size range.
> 
> Now for my question. Is there any real downside to starting off with some of these tri bikes on BD? Although the forums here convinced me not to go with a hybrid, the tri handlebars looks like it could be a good fit for the kind of long distance riding I want to do, and most of them seem to have upgraded equipment already in place. I used to have a nice Raleigh some 15 years ago and very seldom used the 'drops' as it was way too uncomfortable for long rides (I gave it to some gal and never saw it again), so now I'm trying to get back into biking. I'm actually about 25 miles outside of Vegas and very few of the streets here are level, I kid you not. You are always going either uphill or downhill (not too extreme but still...) so that is the kind of riding I will be doing.
> 
> So is a road bike still the best way for me to go for the area I'm in? I'm not looking to make biking my life or anything but I still want a nice setup for everyday use and long distance runs.


Sounds like you're in the same exact postion I was in, back a few months ago when I was in the market for a bike.

Only I went with one of the cheaper BD bikes, because i didn't know if I'd like cycling on the rural roads here where I now live (It's far scarier riding on a narrow rural highway with no shoulders and the occasional car or truck whizzing by at 60MPH than it is in Mid-town Manhattan traffic!)

Same here with the hills- it's always either up...or down. I went with a road bike, and I am very happy. It is very comfortable having three different hand positions to choose from- i.e. top of bars; hoods or drops. I seem to do the majority of my riding on the hoods and never use the drops. 

I also had my first real ride on a decent road bike on a Raleigh! 

IMO, for riding on the roads and covering good distances, and at a good speed, there is no substitute for a road bike- and you are wise to know that [as long as youi know you'll be sticking with it] starting out with a good bike makes far more sense than upgrading. Upgrading is the most expensive way to get a better bike. You get the best deal when the components you want come with the bike...buy 'em seperately, and they cost a LOT more- plus the upgraded bike will not be worth anywhere near what you end up putting into it- so yes...a good road bike would suit you just fine- and IMO, BD is a great way to go- I have one of their cheapest bikes and love it- and it is extremely comfortable- so I can just imagine their better biks!

Pay attention to the gearing though, being you have hills. The only complaint i have with my bike, is that low gear isn't low enough...and the highest gear isn't high enough. Personally, when I get my next BD bike(Most likely a LeChamp or Immortal) I'll opt for wider gear spacing, but with a better range.


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## jeepsouth

To have a day like today....that is what I hoped for when I took the plunge a bought a road bike. I had a great ride today.

I finally got MapMyRide to work, so here are my stats. I am brand new at this, so I don't know if these figures indicate good things, average, or not too good.....so please help me out with your comments and advice....good and bad. Ride was 41.6 km in just under 1:58. MapMyRide says the average speed was 21.16 km/hr and that I burned 1226 calories.

The ride was in the area around where I live (just east of GSP airport between Greenville and Spartanburg, SC). There were quite a few substantial hills which took some effort to climb, but speeding down into the next valley more than made up for that. I got totally turned around and lost, but just kept going until I recognized something and made my way back home.

The Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 did great! Handled nicely and shifted with no problems at all. The bike felt pretty light to me (remember, I have no experience with this) and I never got the sense that it was holding me back...quite the opposite: it had more to give, which maybe I can get out of it when my biking conditioning improves.

Just a great ride. My wife's Cannondale Synapse is scheduled to arrive around the end of the first week in May and we can't wait to do rides like this together. We also are planning to join the group rides sponsored by the LBS where she is buying her bike, and expand our riding activities from there.

Buying this road bike was a great move!! Very happy with it.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> *To have a day like today*....that is what I hoped for when I took the plunge a bought a road bike. * I had a great ride today*.
> 
> I finally got MapMyRide to work, so here are my stats. I am brand new at this, so I don't know if these figures indicate good things, average, or not too good.....so please help me out with your comments and advice....good and bad. Ride was 41.6 km in just under 1:58. MapMyRide says the average speed was 21.16 km/hr and that I burned 1226 calories.
> 
> The ride was in the area around where I live (just east of GSP airport between Greenville and Spartanburg, SC). There were quite a few substantial hills which took some effort to climb, but speeding down into the next valley more than made up for that. I got totally turned around and lost, but just kept going until I recognized something and made my way back home.
> 
> The Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 did great! Handled nicely and shifted with no problems at all. The bike felt pretty light to me (remember, I have no experience with this) and I never got the sense that it was holding me back...quite the opposite: it had more to give, which maybe I can get out of it when my biking conditioning improves.
> 
> *Just a great ride*. My wife's Cannondale Synapse is scheduled to arrive around the end of the first week in May and we can't wait to do rides like this together. We also are planning to join the group rides sponsored by the LBS where she is buying her bike, and expand our riding activities from there.
> 
> Buying this road bike was a great move!! Very happy with it.


Not to belittle the numbers, because IMO they're indicative of a fine effort, but what really matters are the bold statements. You're building saddle time, improving your (cycling) fitness while enjoying the ride/ enjoying being out on the bike. That's what counts. And as long as you continue, your numbers will improve, but let that 'just happen'. Try not to fixate.  

From here, my advice is to focus on good form (upper torso relaxed, arms slightly bent, slightly loose grip on the bars), keeping cadence up and smoothing your pedal stroke. Notch up your efforts _incrementally_, staying in tune with your body to avoid overuse injuries. Better to be consistent than overdue and have to recuperate. Maybe do that same route adding a simulated interval ('racing' to that sign up ahead), or pick one of the climbs and do a hill repeat. After a few more rides, add a couple of miles to the ride. Mix it up a little. 

One thing that's telling by your _not_ mentioning it, is fit. You aren't saying anything about pain/ discomfort, so indications are that you've got fit dialed in pretty well. I can't recall if you've sprung for clipless pedals. If not, that'll likely require some tweaks to saddle adjustments.

Glad you're enjoying your bike. Stay safe out there, and let us know when your wife gets set up on her C'dale.


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## SolitaryRider

I can really identify with the "day like today" thing, too!

Since I started "seriously" riding my bike just last week, the weather has been superb! I've lived here in the sticks for 10 years now...but it wasn't until I started putting some mileage on this bike, that I really got to see/feel/experience the beauty around me! I've seen my cycling improve markedly in that short time.....and to top it all off, I'm losing weight/getting fit/building strength!

It's almost hard to believe that there exists such a pursuit that would give one all of those positives at the same time!

It's really amazing!

I only wish I had gotten a bike sooner! Having not really ridden since I was a kid 35 years ago, I can now say that cycling as a middle-aged man on a decent bike has surpassed my expectatioins/past experiences.

Very glad to hear that Jeep and others seem to experiencing the same thing!

I look forward to my daily (on weekdays) rides. I've only been doing around 10 miles per ride...but I will be increasing that next week! (I was going to shoot for a longer ride today, but i forgot to bring my water, so I only went 9.5 miles....)


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## jeepsouth

Thanks to you both, PJ and SolitaryRider. You were both a great help while I was searching for the right bike.

PJ, I have not had the fitting session yet, but have made some adjustments based on what I've learned so far (seat position, different stem, etc). As you observed from my post, I must be pretty close because, as you said, I had no discomfort at all today, except for some in the saddle area (which I did not mention in my post). As I've said in some earlier post, I'm not sure at this point if it is more me or the saddle, but there is definitely an issue there. I will give the saddle a while longer, and I will also discuss this with the fitter. I'll let you know what the outcome is. Possibly, with additional saddle-time, this issue will resolve itself. I am using clipless pedals, and have been since I bought this bike. So far, I have had no problems with them.

SolitaryRider, I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiments. Like you, I only wish I'd gotten into biking earlier in life. But, I plan to ride as much as I can for as long as I can from now on. I'm looking forward to many, many more miles on my new bike.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> PJ, I have not had the fitting session yet, but have made some adjustments based on what I've learned so far (seat position, different stem, etc). As you observed from my post, I must be pretty close because, as you said, *I had no discomfort at all today, except for some in the saddle area (which I did not mention in my post). As I've said in some earlier post, I'm not sure at this point if it is more me or the saddle, but there is definitely an issue there.* I will give the saddle a while longer, and I will also discuss this with the fitter. I'll let you know what the outcome is. Possibly, with additional saddle-time, this issue will resolve itself. I am using clipless pedals, and have been since I bought this bike. So far, I have had no problems with them.


Because of variables/ contributing factors (saddle, saddle position, rider form, shorts/ bibs...) saddle soreness is sometimes tough to diagnose, especially when all are new.

Coincidentally, I had some soreness today on my ride, but know my bike set up and have had my saddle for long enough that I know it was my bike shorts - they're new. 

Good idea discussing this with the fitter. The more detailed/ precise you are (area of discomfort/ when it occurs), the better. And yes, I'd definitely be interested to read the feedback on your fitting.


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## jeepsouth

This is probably my last post on this thread and I just wanted to wrap a few things up.

First, thank you all very much for your input and advice. All of it, and I do mean all of it - even when some of you had opposing opinions, was more helpful than you will ever know. It was and is greatly appreciated. This was exactly what I hoped for when I started this thread.

Second, my wife's Cannondale Synapse arrived late last week. I was not able to go with her to pick it up, but she described a very thorough fitting session of about 1 hour with the bike on a trainer and on the road. Plus tape measures, laser levels, many adjustments, views and measurements from multiple angles, and on and on. When they were done, she was very satisfied with everything. They advised her to ride a few days and come back with any problems she may have experienced, all included in the purchase price. So far, no problems for her. As for my bike, it gets more comfortable every time I go out. In the next week or so, I plan to take it in for it's "break-in" tune-up and will discuss fitting with the shop staff at that time. As it stands now, I'm not sure I need anything done, but I will still look into it. We are very pleased with the LBS.

We rode both Saturday and Sunday. Saturday was a pretty hilly area and she could only do about 10 miles. But, she loved every minute of it. While she rested and stretched, I did another hard and fast 8.5 miles. Sunday, we went about 21 miles, but this was on a rail trail with very few inclines. Not a tough ride; just a nice Sunday spin. However, while on the trail we passed George Hincape going in the opposite direction, a nice little surprise. He lives in the area and apparently was on a training ride. He was all decked out in his BMC kit and there were a couple of other BMC riders with him. I don't know who they were.

Anyway, thanks again for everything. I plan to visit this site often as I seem to learn something important every time.....plus, the folks are nice!!


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## PJ352

Nice. I think that's a fitting 'end' to your thread. Hard to believe that it's been over 4 months now since you first posted, but you took a thorough, thoughtful approach to the bike buying process and I think the results reflected that. I'm genuinely happy things worked out for both you and your wife.

Very cool seeing George Hincape. He always impressed me as a very 'earthy' kind of guy. 

You asked for no advice and I'll offer none, other than to say ride often, ride safe and enjoy your bikes. Hope you're not a stranger here.


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Nice. I think that's a fitting 'end' to your thread. Hard to believe that it's been over 4 months now since you first posted, but you took a thorough, thoughtful approach to the bike buying process and I think the results reflected that. I'm genuinely happy things worked out for both you and your wife.
> 
> Very cool seeing George Hincape. He always impressed me as a very 'earthy' kind of guy.
> 
> You asked for no advice and I'll offer none, other than to say ride often, ride safe and enjoy your bikes. Hope you're not a stranger here.




Thanks, PJ. I definitely will not be a stranger to this site.

For whatever reason, and certainly not to belittle anyone else who offered advice (I sincerely thank everyone!!!!), but I found myself in agreement with you in most everything you said. Maybe we just think along similar lines or something.....I don't know. But, I do appreciate all you offered.

Yep, it was cool seeing Hincape. Maybe a good omen for my wife's riding adventures to come.

See you around on the site.:thumbsup:


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## tooomey

Cannondale Synapse


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## jeepsouth

One last update....and, I promise this is the last one on this thread. I really thought I was done with this a few weeks back......but, here goes.

First, my wife and I have had a blast since we both got bikes. Early on someone said something like: "I plan to ride with my wife....good luck with that!", or words to that effect. Well, it has worked out great. We are both into it big time now, and enjoy it together. Our longest ride to date has been 28.6 miles, but we plan to do about 35 miles on Saturday. True, she does go a bit slower than I like, but my work schedule allows me to get in some hard rides while she is at work. I let her lead when we ride together, so she sets the pace. In any event, it all works out OK. BTW, on the 14th of next month we celebrate our 32nd anniversary, so we must be doing something right. 

Soon, when my wife gains a bit more confidence, we plan to join the LBS folks on their weekly 40+ mile, Saturday morning group ride.

As for me, I am up to over 120 miles a week now, and aiming at 150+ per week. I could not be happier with the bike (Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50). It has performed absolutely flawlessly and I am extremely happy with it. I do routine maintenance on it myself, but did take it in for a tune-up at the LBS where my wife bought her Cannondale, at about 450 miles. The LBS folks were great (as I expected), and welcomed our business. They really did not have to do much with the bike and only charged me half price for the service. I feel like I "stole" this bike at just under $800. 

I have not had the fitting I discussed earlier since I am now really comfortable on the bike, after some initial saddle-soreness. This may be due to the fact that I have just grown accustomed to the fit of the bike, or that I (luckily) have hit on a good fit to begin with. Whatever the case, I feel really comfortable on the bike now and it is fitness, not soreness or improper fit that limits my mileage. However, my weekly mileage (and effort on every ride) is steadily increasing. All of this has not changed my view that a good fitting is essential. I think I just got lucky and happened upon a good fit pretty much right out of the box. I also still feel that a good relationship with a LBS is something you need to have. True, I bought my bike online, but we bought my wife's bike at a LBS. They have welcomed me and my online bike with open arms (as I suspected they would) and have been very helpful, encouraging and fair the entire time. The LBS is Gusto Cycles near Greer, SC. I would recommend them to anyone in this area.

As for riding, the hills in this area can be brutal. There are a few I have found that I do not take my wife to, but that I use on my solitary rides for a real workout. There is one about 7 miles out on one of my routes that, when I go up it, it is all I can do to keep some forward momentum going. But, it is a great workout and it is getting more manageable every ascent.

Once again, I thank everyone who helped me in my search. Even if I did not follow your advice, I learned something from it, and I genuinely appreciate it.


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## PJ352

Interesting post. I'm glad you opted to update the thread again and think you should consider doing so in the future. Your choice, of course, but I think you show insight and sometimes posting first hand experiences means more than someone posting 'best practices', maybe because experiences are easier to relate to.

I'm glad you and your wife are enjoying this new found activity together. I think a 32nd anniversary is an accomplishment (Happy Anniversary, BTW), but won't go into just why. 

At ~120 miles/ weekly, you're starting to log some serious miles. FWIW, at 150+, you'll be closing in on my weekly rides. 

Re: fit, you know how you feel on the bike, so if you're comfortable and feel efficient, there's little reason to schedule a fitting... just yet. I say 'just yet', because most riders find that as they acclimate to road riding and their fitness/ flexibility improve, their fit evolves. Given your fairly serious efforts, I think you'll fall into this category.

I doubt you'll be looking at a pro fit, but some tweaks will eventually be necessary (mostly, saddle to bar drop and_ maybe_ extending reach). It may even be something you decide to try yourself. If so, either update here beforehand or take care to mark/ note your baselines so that you have a reference point. Not meaning to inject an unsolicited opinion here, but some things to be aware of in the event you go this alone, which I suspect you might. 

Still, I agree that reputable LBS's are valuable resources for a number of reasons. Yours sounds like one of the better ones, so I'm sure both you an your wife will continue to utilize their services.

I'll leave you with... ride often and ride safe!! :thumbsup:


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## Mergetrio

Enjoy the thread as I'm about to venture into biking and am in the OP's shoes when he started this thread. Keep us up to date, and continue to post!


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Interesting post. I'm glad you opted to update the thread again and think you should consider doing so in the future. Your choice, of course, but I think you show insight and sometimes posting first hand experiences means more than someone posting 'best practices', maybe because experiences are easier to relate to.
> 
> I'm glad you and your wife are enjoying this new found activity together. I think a 32nd anniversary is an accomplishment (Happy Anniversary, BTW), but won't go into just why.
> 
> At ~120 miles/ weekly, you're starting to log some serious miles. FWIW, at 150+, you'll be closing in on my weekly rides.
> 
> Re: fit, you know how you feel on the bike, so if you're comfortable and feel efficient, there's little reason to schedule a fitting... just yet. I say 'just yet', because most riders find that as they acclimate to road riding and their fitness/ flexibility improve, their fit evolves. Given your fairly serious efforts, I think you'll fall into this category.
> 
> I doubt you'll be looking at a pro fit, but some tweaks will eventually be necessary (mostly, saddle to bar drop and_ maybe_ extending reach). It may even be something you decide to try yourself. If so, either update here beforehand or take care to mark/ note your baselines so that you have a reference point. Not meaning to inject an unsolicited opinion here, but some things to be aware of in the event you go this alone, which I suspect you might.
> 
> Still, I agree that reputable LBS's are valuable resources for a number of reasons. Yours sounds like one of the better ones, so I'm sure both you an your wife will continue to utilize their services.
> 
> I'll leave you with... ride often and ride safe!! :thumbsup:



Thanks for the reply. 

I welcome all advice and opinions. The solicitation of such should be understood in the nature of the thread. :thumbsup: The solicitation is in the form of a standing invitation to anyone, at any time, to offer anything at all. I am still the newest of the new at this and I want to learn all that I can. I have learned a great deal, but I know I still have far to go. All advice and opinions are welcomed (by me, at least). I defer to the greater knowledge and experience you all possess, and thank you for your input.

PJ, I will take your advice and update the thread from time to time...you make a great case to do so.

I will offer one other bit of advice I chanced upon through (sometimes painful) experience. Buy the best pair of riding shorts (or bibs) you can possibly afford. If you have to, save a while to get a quality pair. For me, when I finally purchased a really good pair of shorts, my riding really took off since they made such a immense difference in my comfort on the bike. I have learned through experience that this is not an area in which to cut corners.

Ride safe, everyone!!


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## jeepsouth

Well, I've upgraded.

I am on good terms now with the LBS where we bought my wife's Cannondale Synapse, and they were extremely supportive.

I went with JensonUSA again since I had such a great experience dealing with them on my original purchase. This time I bought a Rocky Mountain Prestige CR 30. It is full carbon with a decent spec for what I paid (less than $1500). I spoke with the folks at JensonUSA and they could not have been more helpful. And, as I said, the folks at the LBS were pretty supportive also. They even helped me determine the proper size to get based on the published geometry of the CR30. Turns out that the Rocky Mountain bikes run on the large side and I ended up getting a 51 cm this time (the LBS folks said that it is roughly equal to a 56 Synapse, or just a smidge smaller). A good experience all around.

It has rained almost constantly since the bike arrived day before yesterday, so I only have about 5 miles on it thus far. It rides lighter and the steering is much, much quicker (due to the shorter wheelbase?......maybe one of you more experienced riders could shed some light on that). It is finally clear this morning and I am going out on a 30+ mile ride, so I can elaborate more later.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> *Well, I've upgraded*.
> 
> I am on good terms now with the LBS where we bought my wife's Cannondale Synapse, and they were extremely supportive.
> 
> I went with JensonUSA again since I had such a great experience dealing with them on my original purchase. This time I bought a Rocky Mountain Prestige CR 30. It is full carbon with a decent spec for what I paid (less than $1500). I spoke with the folks at JensonUSA and they could not have been more helpful. And, as I said, the folks at the LBS were pretty supportive also. They even helped me determine the proper size to get based on the published geometry of the CR30. Turns out that the Rocky Mountain bikes run on the large side and I ended up getting a 51 cm this time (the LBS folks said that it is roughly equal to a 56 Synapse, or just a smidge smaller). A good experience all around.
> 
> It has rained almost constantly since the bike arrived day before yesterday, so I only have about 5 miles on it thus far. It rides lighter and the steering is much, much quicker (due to the shorter wheelbase?......maybe one of you more experienced riders could shed some light on that). It is finally clear this morning and I am going out on a 30+ mile ride, so I can elaborate more later.


What took you so long to upgrade? 

j/k, nice bike!

Agree with your LBS on some of the Rocky Mtn's running large. They seem to base their frame sizes on seat tube length, which is a good example of how someone using frame size alone to determine sizing requirements can be misled. Good that your LBS helped you sort that out.

Re: the steering response, the textbook answer is that it's primarily influenced by trail, which is the result of head tube angle, fork rake and tire size (minimally). The lower the trail, the quicker the steering, with slower steering resulting with a higher trail. 

I don't recall what size Oxygen you purchased, but I'd have to compare that geo with the Prestige 51cm to have better idea. I mentioned it being a 'textbook answer', because a lot of what we experience on a bike is perceived, so a lighter bike might feel more responsive, thus the feeling of quicker steering/ handling. As an example, some cyclists say the same after buying a lighter wheelset. 

That said, it's nice to see you're staying with this and spending money to help stimulate our economy. 

BTW, if that's your lawn in the pics, it looks about like mine. More riding and less yard work = a preponderance of weeds (but they're green).


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## Porschefan

jeepsouth said:


> Well, I've upgraded.{/QUOTE]
> 
> Hi Jeep,
> 
> I'm in a similar situation as you were when this thread started. I've read through the entire thread and profited from the discussion. (I have my own thread in Beginner's Corner recounting my struggles to get my wits wrapped around sizing, fitting, bike geo, etc.!)
> 
> At this point I'd like to hear your thoughts on what motivated you to move on to a better bike. What, if anything, you were trying to improve by moving up? Anything in particular that you grew to dislike on the first bike?
> 
> Maybe most importantly, to me, would be your answer to the question of IF you had it do all over again (and funds and other of life's vagaries) weren't involved, do you think buying the better bike right off the bat would have been a wiser move?
> 
> Having started on the Oxygen and then moved up you have kind of a unique perspective on the process and I'd like to hear what you have to say about that.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> What took you so long to upgrade?
> 
> j/k, nice bike!
> 
> Agree with your LBS on some of the Rocky Mtn's running large. They seem to base their frame sizes on seat tube length, which is a good example of how someone using frame size alone to determine sizing requirements can be misled. Good that your LBS helped you sort that out.
> 
> Re: the steering response, the textbook answer is that it's primarily influenced by trail, which is the result of head tube angle, fork rake and tire size (minimally). The lower the trail, the quicker the steering, with slower steering resulting with a higher trail.
> 
> I don't recall what size Oxygen you purchased, but I'd have to compare that geo with the Prestige 51cm to have better idea. I mentioned it being a 'textbook answer', because a lot of what we experience on a bike is perceived, so a lighter bike might feel more responsive, thus the feeling of quicker steering/ handling. As an example, some cyclists say the same after buying a lighter wheelset.
> 
> That said, it's nice to see you're staying with this and spending money to help stimulate our economy.
> 
> BTW, if that's your lawn in the pics, it looks about like mine. More riding and less yard work = a preponderance of weeds (but they're green).




First of all, nice catch on the lawn. Yep, I let riding take precedence over yard-work, but, in my defense, we have been going through a very rainy spell and I haven't had much time to work in the yard anyway. Save your snide remarks; I've heard it all from the wife already. 

My original Oxygen was a size 57. Even though I felt pretty comfortable on it, after speaking with the LBS folks (more on them below), I now know that it was just a bit on the large side for me. As you know, I'm learning on the fly here.

As for the LBS, getting to know those folks has been a real blessing. They have become more like friends than just someone we do business with. They were really thorough with my wife during and after her purchase, and have been super-supportive of me also. We are in their shop at least once a week and we have them do all of our service and we also get all of our supplies/accessories there. Just a great relationship. 

You may be right about the perceived responsiveness in the steering on this new bike. It does feel lighter and has a shorter wheelbase, but I'm not sure if it is the bike or just me.

One thing I am sure of is that this bike has a much smoother ride quality than the aluminum Oxygen 50. I went 22 miles on Friday (rain shortened my planned 32-mile ride) over the same route I took on the Oxygen and the difference over the rougher patches was like night and day. It didn't exactly "float" over the rougher patches, but much, much less of the chatter and vibration got through to my hands and backside. Also, for some reason I averaged about 2.5 mph faster for the ride. Could have been just the excitement of my new ride, but time will tell.

So far, I am very happy with the upgrade.


----------



## jeepsouth

Porschefan said:


> jeepsouth said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I've upgraded.{/QUOTE]
> 
> Hi Jeep,
> 
> I'm in a similar situation as you were when this thread started. I've read through the entire thread and profited from the discussion. (I have my own thread in Beginner's Corner recounting my struggles to get my wits wrapped around sizing, fitting, bike geo, etc.!)
> 
> At this point I'd like to hear your thoughts on what motivated you to move on to a better bike. What, if anything, you were trying to improve by moving up? Anything in particular that you grew to dislike on the first bike?
> 
> Maybe most importantly, to me, would be your answer to the question of IF you had it do all over again (and funds and other of life's vagaries) weren't involved, do you think buying the better bike right off the bat would have been a wiser move?
> 
> Having started on the Oxygen and then moved up you have kind of a unique perspective on the process and I'd like to hear what you have to say about that.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for playing along at home!! :thumbsup:
> 
> I will try to answer some of your questions and offer some advice, but please remember that I am very new to this and still have a lot to learn. One thing I can say is that the advice I got on this site was absolutely invaluable to me right from the start. I sincerely believe that the folks on this site saved me a good bit of money and heartache on my bike purchase.
> 
> From the beginning, I wanted the best bike I could get for the money I had to spend. Without going into detail, we had a rough stretch (financially speaking) just as I was beginning my research on a bike purchase. So, the bottom line is that money was always an issue, and my original $1500 budget was reduced early on.
> 
> So, I bought the original Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50 primarily because it was the best bike (by far, and I mean REALLY far!) that I could get for the money. Also, research revealed that JensonUSA (the online retailer from which I purchased the bike) had an excellent reputation, and the months since have certainly cemented that reputation in my mind. I would not hesitate to do business with them again (as I did on this most recent purchase) and would recommend them to anyone without hesitation.
> 
> There was no problem with the first bike at all. I really enjoyed riding it and it always performed flawlessly. I was introduced to the world of road-biking on the Oxygen 50 and have no regrets at all. However, if money had not been the major issue, I would have originally bought a carbon road bike from a LBS. I had pretty much settled on a carbon Cannondale Synapse with the SRAM Apex group (but, if money really hadn't mattered, I would have moved up a few steps on the spec food chain).
> 
> In a recent issue of Road Bike Action, they reviewed the Rocky Mountain Prestige CR50 (the next step up from my new bike). It received excellent reviews. You may be able to find that review on their website. Anyway, on a whim, and with an eye on the CR50, I placed my Oxygen 50 on Craigslist at a price a few hundred dollars over what I paid, just to see what would happen. After a few weeks, a really large guy (I estimate 6'4", 265 lbs) just getting into road biking bought my bike based on the advice he got from a friend who was an experienced road biker and who liked the specs. I got a couple of hundred dollars more for the bike than I originally paid. By adding in a few hundred more, I was able to buy the CR30, which is the same frame as the CR50, but is a rung lower on the spec ladder.
> 
> There are a few reasons I moved to a new bike. First, after the sale of my old bike, I had the money to make the move. Also, I did a good bit of test-riding originally and always liked the feel of the carbon bikes I rode. So, I wanted to move to a carbon bike, though I admit this may have been based more on perception rather than any real performance gain I may have gotten, especially at my level. Then, there was the excellent review the bike received, the great price offered by JensonUSA, as well as their reputation. Plus, in the intervening months, my wife and I have developed an excellent relationship with the LBS, and I had their support as well.
> 
> To sum up: I would have bought a carbon bike with higher spec right from the start if money had been no concern. But, money was THE main concern, so I bought the best bike I could find for the money I had, and I have no regrets over the purchase. I did some very thorough research and feel that I got a really great deal. Money was also an issue on this purchase and I feel that I got an outstanding value this time around also.
> 
> Sorry for being so long-winded, but I am just trying to answer some of your questions. Feel free to ask more, and please, you more experienced guys chime in as you see fit.
Click to expand...


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> First of all, nice catch on the lawn. Yep, I let riding take precedence over yard-work, but, in my defense, we have been going through a very rainy spell and I haven't had much time to work in the yard anyway. Save your snide remarks; I've heard it all from the wife already.


lol.. far be it from me to offer any snide remarks re: your lawn. If I posted pics of mine, you'd know why. Fortunately for me, my SO understands that I can get just a tad 'crabby' when I don't exercise, so more times that not, her advice to me is "go ride". :wink5: 



jeepsouth said:


> My original Oxygen was a size 57. Even though I felt pretty comfortable on it, after speaking with the LBS folks (more on them below), I now know that it was just a bit on the large side for me. As you know, I'm learning on the fly here.


I didn't calculate the geo differences between the 57cm Oxygen and 51cm Prestige, but even a cursory glance at the charts tells me that in the key areas of reach and drop, they're 'substantial' . 

That said, you may be one of those lucky cyclists that can ride bikes less than optimally sized without problems. We're all different, and FWIW, I'm comfortable in a very narrow range of reach/ drop parameters, but change trail and I hardly notice. 



jeepsouth said:


> As for the LBS, getting to know those folks has been a real blessing. They have become more like friends than just someone we do business with. They were really thorough with my wife during and after her purchase, and have been super-supportive of me also. We are in their shop at least once a week and we have them do all of our service and we also get all of our supplies/accessories there. Just a great relationship.


Not much to add to this firsthand experience. As I (and others) have often said, a reputable LBS is an invaluable resource - especially to noobs. 



jeepsouth said:


> You may be right about the perceived responsiveness in the steering on this new bike. It does feel lighter and has a shorter wheelbase, but I'm not sure if it is the bike or just me.
> 
> One thing I am sure of is that this bike has a much smoother ride quality than the aluminum Oxygen 50. I went 22 miles on Friday (rain shortened my planned 32-mile ride) over the same route I took on the Oxygen and the difference over the rougher patches was like night and day. It didn't exactly "float" over the rougher patches, but much, much less of the chatter and vibration got through to my hands and backside. Also, *for some reason I averaged about 2.5 mph faster for the ride. Could have been just the excitement of my new ride, but time will tell.*


The performance gain might be attributed to adrenalin or possibly that this bike does fit you better. As I mentioned above, you could be one of those riders that doesn't experience discomfort from a less than optimally fitting bike, but that doesn't necessarily mean your performance didn't suffer. As you say, time will tell which is the case. 



jeepsouth said:


> So far, I am very happy with the upgrade.


Glad to see you're staying with this. As I mentioned a few weeks back, I think it would be good to keep us updated and know there are others following your experiences.


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> lol.. far be it from me to offer any snide remarks re: your lawn. If I posted pics of mine, you'd know why. Fortunately for me, my SO understands that I can get just a tad 'crabby' when I don't exercise, so more times that not, her advice to me is "go ride". :wink5:
> 
> 
> I didn't calculate the geo differences between the 57cm Oxygen and 51cm Prestige, but even a cursory glance at the charts tells me that in the key areas of reach and drop, they're 'substantial' .
> 
> That said, you may be one of those lucky cyclists that can ride bikes less than optimally sized without problems. We're all different, and FWIW, I'm comfortable in a very narrow range of reach/ drop parameters, but change trail and I hardly notice.
> 
> 
> Not much to add to this firsthand experience. As I (and others) have often said, a reputable LBS is an invaluable resource - especially to noobs.
> 
> 
> The performance gain might be attributed to adrenalin or possibly that this bike does fit you better. As I mentioned above, you could be one of those riders that doesn't experience discomfort from a less than optimally fitting bike, but that doesn't necessarily mean your performance didn't suffer. As you say, time will tell which is the case.
> 
> 
> Glad to see you're staying with this. As I mentioned a few weeks back, I think it would be good to keep us updated and know there are others following your experiences.




Thanks for the reply, PJ. I always look forward to reading your advise/opinion/etc., and I value your input.

What you have to say about my possibly being able to ride a wider range of sizes and set-ups than most other folks is interesting and is something that had never occurred to me. It may be that I do indeed have a larger "sweet spot" than most, or it could just be that I am too inexperienced to know what a really good fit feels like. I do know that, with the LBS input, the RM Prestige CR30 is a better fit for me than the Oxygen 50 was. And, I agree, that may have something to do with the increase in average mph over 20+ miles. Could a couple of pounds less weight in the bike itself account for a portion of that increase also? My intuition says that that may also be a factor. Also, it occurs to me that the better ride quality I experienced may be, in part, due to better positioning on the bike. Make any sense to you?

By the way, you will be glad to hear that I did not ride today....I stayed home and mowed/weeded the lawn. :mad2:.....lol


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for the reply, PJ. I always look forward to reading your advise/opinion/etc., and I value your input.
> 
> What you have to say about my possibly being able to ride a wider range of sizes and set-ups than most other folks is interesting and is something that had never occurred to me. It may be that I do indeed have a larger "sweet spot" than most, or it could just be that I am too inexperienced to know what a really good fit feels like. I do know that, with the LBS input, the RM Prestige CR30 is a better fit for me than the Oxygen 50 was. And, I agree, that may have something to do with the increase in average mph over 20+ miles. Could a couple of pounds less weight in the bike itself account for a portion of that increase also? My intuition says that that may also be a factor. Also, it occurs to me that the better ride quality I experienced may be, in part, due to better positioning on the bike. Make any sense to you?
> 
> By the way, you will be glad to hear that I did not ride today....I stayed home and mowed/weeded the lawn. :mad2:.....lol


Re: the 'fit theories', while I agree that being somewhat inexperienced you may be unaware of what a really good fit feels like, you would be aware of pain/ discomfort. So if your anatomy weren't able to tolerate the deviations in sizing and fit that we've discussed, you'd most certainly be in pain at some point in your ride. Maybe if you had gone longer you would have, but that's supposition. 

Re: lower bike weight translating into higher performance, all I can say is, not IME. I have one road bike that weighs about 18.5 lbs. and another that weights about 16.5 lbs. My performance is essentially the same on both and geo (thus fit) are the same as well. 

In your case, I think it comes down to either an improved fit or that new bike rush (or both) that's getting you that increase in performance. I'd say if you're a consistent rider you'll know the answer in ~2-4 weeks, so it should prove interesting.

Re; the improved ride quality, that's generally attributed to higher quality tires, tailoring pressures to total rider weight, longer chainstays, slacker seat tube angles and more fork rake. It's also possible that the CF layup used provides more compliance than your alu framed Oxygen did. As far as better positioning (fit) on the bike, that usually results in improved steering/ handling response. That's why getting sizing right is important.

Broadening this conversation a bit, IMO/E rider impressions of a bikes ride quality/ handling are highly subjective topics, influenced by a number of factors including, previous cycling experiences, personal preferences, road conditions, along with the aforementioned aspects. That's why while it's good to garner others opinions on forums such as this, the bottom line is that the test ride is what helps us form our own opinion and ultimately decide on the 'best' bike (for us).


----------



## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> Re: the 'fit theories', while I agree that being somewhat inexperienced you may be unaware of what a really good fit feels like, you would be aware of pain/ discomfort. So if your anatomy weren't able to tolerate the deviations in sizing and fit that we've discussed, you'd most certainly be in pain at some point in your ride. Maybe if you had gone longer you would have, but that's supposition.
> 
> Re: lower bike weight translating into higher performance, all I can say is, not IME. I have one road bike that weighs about 18.5 lbs. and another that weights about 16.5 lbs. My performance is essentially the same on both and geo (thus fit) are the same as well.
> 
> In your case, I think it comes down to either an improved fit or that new bike rush (or both) that's getting you that increase in performance. I'd say if you're a consistent rider you'll know the answer in ~2-4 weeks, so it should prove interesting.
> 
> Re; the improved ride quality, that's generally attributed to higher quality tires, tailoring pressures to total rider weight, longer chainstays, slacker seat tube angles and more fork rake. It's also possible that the CF layup used provides more compliance than your alu framed Oxygen did. As far as better positioning (fit) on the bike, that usually results in improved steering/ handling response. That's why getting sizing right is important.
> 
> Broadening this conversation a bit, IMO/E rider impressions of a bikes ride quality/ handling are highly subjective topics, influenced by a number of factors including, previous cycling experiences, personal preferences, road conditions, along with the aforementioned aspects. That's why while it's good to garner others opinions on forums such as this, the bottom line is that the test ride is what helps us form our own opinion and ultimately decide on the 'best' bike (for us).




As always, thanks for your input, PJ.

I went for a 31.2 mile ride (1,640 elevation gain) yesterday over one of my usual routes and I have a couple of observations.

First, I rode this route numerous times on my old bike and the new CR 30 has a much more plush ride over the rough spots than the Oxygen 50. I do not know if it is the carbon frame, the geo, or whatever, but the ride is a good bit more comfortable, which is nice at my age. 

Second, the increased performance is still there. It isn't much (about 2.7 mph faster average speed over 31+ miles), but it is there, at least for now. I'm giving this a couple of more weeks to see if this is a permanent thing or not.

Third, though this bike is a bit different in size from my previous bike, I don't have any sore areas today, nor did I experience any painful areas yesterday. Maybe I am just lucky in this respect, but I never had any real pain associated with either bike fit, though I am admittedly unschooled in that area. After some initial saddle-soreness when I first got the Oxygen 50 in March/April, I've been fine.

I am happy with the Prestige CR 30 and am looking forward to many more miles on it.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> As always, thanks for your input, PJ.
> 
> I went for a 31.2 mile ride (1,640 elevation gain) yesterday over one of my usual routes and I have a couple of observations.
> 
> First, I rode this route numerous times on my old bike and the new CR 30 has a much more plush ride over the rough spots than the Oxygen 50. I do not know if it is the carbon frame, the geo, or whatever, but the ride is a good bit more comfortable, which is nice at my age.


Well, we could philosophize/ theorize the reasons forever, but the bottom line is you're experiencing a plusher ride and like it. That's all that really matters. And it could be that the engineers designed/ tuned the CF layup to be more compliant. 



jeepsouth said:


> *Second, the increased performance is still there. It isn't much (about 2.7 mph faster average speed over 31+ miles)*, but it is there, at least for now. I'm giving this a couple of more weeks to see if this is a permanent thing or not.


Actually, in terms of performance, that's a sizable gain. If you're like most recreational riders, you average around 18+/- MPH. If I'm close, a 2.7 MPH gain represents ~15% increase. Pretty healthy, IMHO. 



jeepsouth said:


> Third, though this bike is a bit different in size from my previous bike, I don't have any sore areas today, nor did I experience any painful areas yesterday. *Maybe I am just lucky in this respect*, but I never had any real pain associated with either bike fit, though I am admittedly unschooled in that area. After some initial saddle-soreness when I first got the Oxygen 50 in March/April, I've been fine.


I think so. Don't fight success! :thumbsup:



jeepsouth said:


> I am happy with the Prestige CR 30 and am looking forward to many more miles on it.


Glad you're enjoying your new bike. Keep us updated - I know there are others here that are following along.


----------



## jeepsouth

Latest update.........

I continue to be amazed at the ride quality of this bike (Rocky Mountain Prestige 30 CR). Roads which would have had my teeth chattering on the aluminum bike, I now take with scant respect to my line, whether there are rough stretches are not. I just ride without scouting out the least sketchy areas. The ride is just amazing. I have no other word for it. It is fun!!!

Rode 52.2 miles today, and the bike performed amazingly well. Some of you may know the "Tour de Paws" route near Spartanburg, SC. That was part of my route today. Those rough patches on Old Spartanburg Road were not as bad on this bike. I added in some additional mileage and came up with a good 52 mile route with a few very challenging hills. Very nice ride, overall.

As far as the bike goes, I know the wheelset and tires are on the heavy side, and I can tell it on the rides. Those two items are at the top of the possible upgrade list I have going. However, even though I realize there is a weight cost associated with the 105 component group, I can't imagine anything performing any better. I know I am a raw NOOB, and many of you may be able to point out my lack of knowledge/experience, but I am extremely happy with the 105 components. I don't plan to race; just go on long rides as often as I can for fitness sake, so please put that into your consideration when setting me straight on the 105's. I feel that, for the money, the 105's are an outstanding value.

Also, someone pointed out early on that the riding with my wife deal may prove out to be less than satisfactory. While it is true that she rides slower than I would like, and she has a real aversion to hills, I enjoy our times together on our bikes. At least we are out riding and not sitting at home staring at the TV. We did a 40+ mile easy ride together on the Swamp Rabbit Trail near Greenville, SC, on Sat. We stopped for lunch at Travelers Rest, SC, and I can't recall a day better spent on a bike. My work schedule allows me to get in some faster and more challenging rides while she is at work, so everything seems to work out OK. She is really happy with her Cannondale Synapse and our riding arrangement allows for a good bit of time riding together as well as on our own to work on our own personal goals. Bike riding has proven to be the perfect exercise for both of us as we advance through our mid-50's.

Back in March, I had not ridden a road bike in over 30 years. Now I'm doing over 100 miles a week. My wife and I both now are completely hooked and look forward to our next chance to ride, together or separately. I just wish I had gotten into this years ago.


----------



## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Latest update.........
> 
> I continue to be amazed at the ride quality of this bike (Rocky Mountain Prestige 30 CR). Roads which would have had my teeth chattering on the aluminum bike, I now take with scant respect to my line, whether there are rough stretches are not. I just ride without scouting out the least sketchy areas. The ride is just amazing. I have no other word for it. It is fun!!!
> 
> Rode 52.2 miles today, and the bike performed amazingly well. Some of you may know the "Tour de Paws" route near Spartanburg, SC. That was part of my route today. Those rough patches on Old Spartanburg Road were not as bad on this bike. I added in some additional mileage and came up with a good 52 mile route with a few very challenging hills. Very nice ride, overall.
> 
> As far as the bike goes, I know the wheelset and tires are on the heavy side, and I can tell it on the rides. Those two items are at the top of the possible upgrade list I have going. However, even though I realize there is a weight cost associated with the 105 component group, I can't imagine anything performing any better. I know I am a raw NOOB, and many of you may be able to point out my lack of knowledge/experience, but I am extremely happy with the 105 components. I don't plan to race; just go on long rides as often as I can for fitness sake, so please put that into your consideration when setting me straight on the 105's. I feel that, for the money, the 105's are an outstanding value.
> 
> Also, someone pointed out early on that the riding with my wife deal may prove out to be less than satisfactory. While it is true that she rides slower than I would like, and she has a real aversion to hills, I enjoy our times together on our bikes. At least we are out riding and not sitting at home staring at the TV. We did a 40+ mile easy ride together on the Swamp Rabbit Trail near Greenville, SC, on Sat. We stopped for lunch at Travelers Rest, SC, and I can't recall a day better spent on a bike. My work schedule allows me to get in some faster and more challenging rides while she is at work, so everything seems to work out OK. She is really happy with her Cannondale Synapse and our riding arrangement allows for a good bit of time riding together as well as on our own to work on our own personal goals. Bike riding has proven to be the perfect exercise for both of us as we advance through our mid-50's.
> 
> Back in March, I had not ridden a road bike in over 30 years. Now I'm doing over 100 miles a week. My wife and I both now are completely hooked and look forward to our next chance to ride, together or separately. I just wish I had gotten into this years ago.


Thanks for taking the time to update us. As always, an interesting read.

Glad you're enjoying your bike. That planned wheelset upgrade puts you in the majority in that most cyclists make that the first order of priority. Fact is, no matter the price range on most complete bikes, the wheelsets are seldom on a par with the other specs. When the time comes to upgrade, post and we'll be more than happy to help you spend you money. 

Re: tires, since they're a wearable item and (relatively) inexpensive, consider Continental GP 4000's or 4000s's. There are other comparable makes/ models that other members may suggest, but (FWIW) I've had good experiences with these.

Re: the 105 groupset, if I'm not mistaken, you have a newer version than I do (5700 versus 5600). I log about 6k miles annually and find 105 to be up to the task, durable and well performing, so you'll get no argument from me on that score. As far as any weight penalty, IIRC it's about 1/2 lb. max over some higher end groupsets, so hardly a consideration to most recreational riders. At least not a valid one, IMO.

Glad you're enjoying riding with your spouse. For a variety of reasons it seems to work better for some than others. While my SO does share the activity, we don't ride together - mainly due to the disparity in average speeds. But I won't deny that I appreciate the solitude of a solo ride, at times.

As far as wishing you had gotten into this years ago, I think we always do. I started in my early 30's and wish I had started 10 years earlier. But (I think) more importantly, we appreciate every day we _can_ ride and look forward to many more enjoyable, rewarding rides.


----------



## crbeals

Excellent thread for newbies. Please update it when you can. I can also say it has been great to see someone else that get's riding solo and riding with their wife. I also have to add in riding with my kids. Any seat time is good times.


----------



## easyridernyc

PJ352 said:


> Thanks for taking the time to update us. As always, an interesting read.
> 
> Glad you're enjoying your bike. That planned wheelset upgrade puts you in the majority in that most cyclists make that the first order of priority. Fact is, no matter the price range on most complete bikes, the wheelsets are seldom on a par with the other specs. When the time comes to upgrade, post and we'll be more than happy to help you spend you money.
> 
> Re: tires, since they're a wearable item and (relatively) inexpensive, consider Continental GP 4000's or 4000s's. There are other comparable makes/ models that other members may suggest, but (FWIW) I've had good experiences with these.
> 
> Re: the 105 groupset, if I'm not mistaken, you have a newer version than I do (5700 versus 5600). I log about 6k miles annually and find 105 to be up to the task, durable and well performing, so you'll get no argument from me on that score. As far as any weight penalty, IIRC it's about 1/2 lb. max over some higher end groupsets, so hardly a consideration to most recreational riders. At least not a valid one, IMO.
> 
> Glad you're enjoying riding with your spouse. For a variety of reasons it seems to work better for some than others. While my SO does share the activity, we don't ride together - mainly due to the disparity in average speeds. But I won't deny that I appreciate the solitude of a solo ride, at times.
> 
> As far as wishing you had gotten into this years ago, I think we always do. I started in my early 30's and wish I had started 10 years earlier. But (I think) more importantly, we appreciate every day we _can_ ride and look forward to many more enjoyable, rewarding rides.



nothing wrong wit a 105, mon, not much heavier than ultegra, i agree with pj the wheels are the thing. lots of solid choices, i would look easton and williams for good quality and value...


----------



## ParadigmDawg

jeepsouth said:


> Latest update.........
> 
> 
> Also, someone pointed out early on that the riding with my wife deal may prove out to be less than satisfactory. While it is true that she rides slower than I would like, and she has a real aversion to hills, I enjoy our times together on our bikes. At least we are out riding and not sitting at home staring at the TV. We did a 40+ mile easy ride together on the Swamp Rabbit Trail near Greenville, SC, on Sat. We stopped for lunch at Travelers Rest, SC, and I can't recall a day better spent on a bike. My work schedule allows me to get in some faster and more challenging rides while she is at work, so everything seems to work out OK. She is really happy with her Cannondale Synapse and our riding arrangement allows for a good bit of time riding together as well as on our own to work on our own personal goals. Bike riding has proven to be the perfect exercise for both of us as we advance through our mid-50's.
> 
> Back in March, I had not ridden a road bike in over 30 years. Now I'm doing over 100 miles a week. My wife and I both now are completely hooked and look forward to our next chance to ride, together or separately. I just wish I had gotten into this years ago.


^ This...

My wife and I started riding road together a few months ago. She has always mountain biked with me and usually goes on about every other MTB trip and lets me go hammer with the guys the rest of the time.

When we first purchased the road bikes she seemed painfully slow and it was annoying to me at first. I learned that my time with her was so much more important than how fast I was going and what my HR was. Now, by far, I prefer my rides with her more then solo or even with the guys. Great bonding time.


----------



## flatsix911

Another BD TGIF Secret Sale :thumbsup:
EXCLUSIVE SECRET BIKE DEALS

*2012 Carbon Kestrel RT1000 with Shimano 105 $1,649*
Kestrel US - RT 1000- Shimano 105


----------



## jeepsouth

Thanks for all of the positive feedback. I do appreciate your suggestions, comments and advice. :thumbsup:

I do plan to go through with the wheel upgrade, but probably not for a few months or so. My only hesitation is this: Is the Rocky Mountain Prestige frame worthy of an upgrade? IMO, it is, for a number of reasons. It fits me well, the ride is fantastic, the frame seems sturdy and well made, I am impressed with the other components, and (again, IMO, and very subjective) it is a good-looking bike. My one concern is that the frame warranty is only 5 years. What do you all think about an upgrade on this frame? Later, if I go the upgrade route, we can discuss specific wheelsets and other upgrade items.

As always, thanks in advance for your input.


----------



## jpaschal01

jeepsouth said:


> I do plan to go through with the wheel upgrade, but probably not for a few months or so. My only hesitation is this: Is the Rocky Mountain Prestige frame worthy of an upgrade? IMO, it is, for a number of reasons. It fits me well, the ride is fantastic, the frame seems sturdy and well made, I am impressed with the other components, and (again, IMO, and very subjective) it is a good-looking bike. My one concern is that the frame warranty is only 5 years. What do you all think about an upgrade on this frame? Later, if I go the upgrade route, we can discuss specific wheelsets and other upgrade items.


The nice thing about a wheel upgrade is that it can go with you to your next bike. My first bike (purchased last July) got a wheel upgrade in December. When I upgraded bikes this May, the wheels came to my new bike and I sold the wheels that came on the new bike.


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## PJ352

jeepsouth said:


> Thanks for all of the positive feedback. I do appreciate your suggestions, comments and advice. :thumbsup:
> 
> I do plan to go through with the wheel upgrade, but probably not for a few months or so. My only hesitation is this: Is the Rocky Mountain Prestige frame worthy of an upgrade? IMO, it is, for a number of reasons. It fits me well, the ride is fantastic, the frame seems sturdy and well made, I am impressed with the other components, and (again, IMO, and very subjective) it is a good-looking bike. My one concern is that the frame warranty is only 5 years. What do you all think about an upgrade on this frame? Later, if I go the upgrade route, we can discuss specific wheelsets and other upgrade items.
> 
> As always, thanks in advance for your input.


From all that you're offering re: your experience with the Prestige, I can't think of a reason why you _wouldn't_ want to keep the frameset and upgrade. It really doesn't get much better than liking the fit, ride, handling _and_ looks of a bike, so you essentially 'have it all'. 

As was stated, the nice thing about the wheel upgrade is that it can go to your next bike. Just hang on to your OE wheelset for backup/ trainer purposes, then reuse them if/ when you decide to sell the Prestige. But unless you needed the money to put towards that 'next' bike, I'd suggest keeping it as a backup.

Little is more subjective that wheelset upgrades, so I'll look forward to those future discussions. :thumbsup:


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## jeepsouth

PJ352 said:


> From all that you're offering re: your experience with the Prestige, I can't think of a reason why you _wouldn't_ want to keep the frameset and upgrade. It really doesn't get much better than liking the fit, ride, handling _and_ looks of a bike, so you essentially 'have it all'.
> 
> As was stated, the nice thing about the wheel upgrade is that it can go to your next bike. Just hang on to your OE wheelset for backup/ trainer purposes, then reuse them if/ when you decide to sell the Prestige. But unless you needed the money to put towards that 'next' bike, I'd suggest keeping it as a backup.
> 
> Little is more subjective that wheelset upgrades, so I'll look forward to those future discussions. :thumbsup:



All great points. I knew I could count on you guys for some perspective. :thumbsup:

Too early yet to talk specifics, but I look forward to discussing wheelsets with you in the future.

BTW, my wife and I volunteered for the Gran Fondo Hindcapie near Greenville, SC, this past weekend. We decided not to ride this year since the course was pretty brutal (there is a thread about the ride elsewhere on this site). Ended up having a fantastic time. I am throwing in a couple of pics of my wife with some guys you may be familiar with: George and Cadel.


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## PJ352

Wow, great pics of two men I admire in the cycling world (and your wife looks nice as well). Thanks for posting!


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## mrkartoom

Great thread with lots of good info . . . for aspiring noobs such as myself.


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## Fred 853

I would consider the Charge Filter Apex. 
See:
chargebikes.com/products/filter-apex/
bicycling.com/news/featured-stories/charge-filter-apex
performancebike.com/bikes/Product_10052_10551_1123213_-1___
(Performance Bicycle has a large number of shops in the U.S. as well as an online ordering department.)


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## codex57

This thread inspired me to register. I'm not ready to buy yet. Still enjoying my hybrid. But I am starting to eye a road bike as a secondary bike (for solo rides rather than riding around with the kids).


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## jeepsouth

OK. Here I go with the latest update.

I started this thread about a year ago, on Jan. 9, 2012. At that time I was a complete newbie looking for a road bike. I had not ridden a road bike since my college days. That was an old 10-speed Ross with stem shifters. (By the way, after college, I gave that bike to my brother-in-law who rode it with the original equipment for almost 20 years before it gave out...a quality bike for it's time, I think). I did not ride that Ross much; just to class and back, and I really regret that now. Since that time I had owned an old Trek mountain bike (300 series, I think....this was the late 80's) that I had only ridden on city streets, and a Giant Sedona I bought in mid-2012 to ride on the Swamp Rabbit Trail here in Greenville, SC. While it was a pretty basic, heavy hybrid bike, that Sedona launched me on my current trajectory.

In March, I bought my first real road bike, a Rocky Mountain Oxygen 50, with 105 components and Fulcrum Wheels. It took a lot of research and advice from you fine folks to get to the point of purchase, and I have no regrets; only gratitude for your help and advice. It was INVALUABLE!!!

If you've followed this post ("It's been a year!!! Who are you Kidding?"...I know), you will recall that at one point during my research and test-riding, I was placed on a $2,500-3,000 Specialized bike that was just perfect. The only experience I can compare that to was back in my "serious" golf playing days. I was looking for a new set of clubs and was demo-ing a lot of different clubs. At one point, a club pro placed a Mizuno forged 6-iron in my hands. This set was way out of my price range, but the club pro just wanted me to "feel what a real golf club" felt like...very similar to what the LBS salesman said to me about the Specialized, now that I think back on it. Anyway, on my first swing with the Mizuno forged, I "pured" one...you golfers know what I mean. I have never had that feeling in my hands on any golf shot before or since. To get to the point, that is what that Specialized felt like to me that day on that test-ride. But, at the same time (as with the Mizunos), I knew it was something I would really ENJOY, but could never completely APPRECIATE, based on my talent level, age, experience, etc. Plus, I could afford neither the Mizunos nor the Specialized. They were what I could aspire to, and, maybe, someday grow to utilize and appreciate, but not something I needed or could fully reap the benefits of presently.

All this brings me to my present bike, the Rocky Mountain Prestige 30CR. I am in love with this bike. The racers and weight-weenies will scoff, but I could not be happier.

Stiffness....I'm not entirely sure what that is (I have an idea), but when I want the 30CR to go, it goes. It is not the lightest bike out there by a wide margin, but I defy you to find a more comfortable bike for a 55 year old newbie to take a 50+ mile ride on for fitness and enjoyment. Smoothest ride I have ever experienced.

I love just going. Just this past Monday, I was riding in a semi-familiar area when I went through a cross-roads that I have passed through dozens of times. That day I said, "Hell! I'm taking the right-hand turn today and see where it goes". Not a great adventure to some, but a big adventure for me. I wasn't sure where the road led, or if there would be a hill too big for me to climb down that road, or vicious dogs, but I went that way all the same. That is what confidence in my bike has given me. No, it is no great thrill or chance for many of you, but for an overweight, near-sighted, 55 year old it is a measure of freedom and adventure that only a bike can yield. And this bike yields it in spades. Extremely comfortable. I have great faith in the components, especially the 105's. I cannot imagine anything better or more reliable. But, I know they are out there. Just, "do I need them?" I'm never going to race. My highest goal is to ride the George Hincapie Gran Fondo here in Greenville. And, I think I have the bike to do it on. A tad heavy, perhaps, but I'm thinking of a wheel upgrade, which will yield me a pound and a half, or thereabouts. By the way, my wife gave me some lighter, narrower tires for Christmas which are working out splendidly.

I've never been happier with any type of exercise than I am with biking (doesn't really feel like exercise). I feel like I have the perfect bike...FOR ME. And, I thank you folks for helping to make it all happen.


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