# I have a date with Jenny at Hong-Fu tomorrow....



## cathyandrob

*I got that date with Jenny at Hong-Fu.....*

I'm in Hong Kong and a friend and I have a meeting set up for tomorrow with Jenny at Hong-Fu in Shenzhen.

I sent her an email and then called her, she said to come and have a look at their operation and so I'm going tomorrow.

I have a FM001 and it's a bit small so thinking of a 015 and some carbon wheels.

You got any questions for Jenny, I'm interested to see what's going on.

Will post my findings.

Rob


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## CdaleNut

ummm who is Jenny ??


FIRST !!


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## cathyandrob

Sorry, she is the contact person for probably the biggest cheap carbon frame maker in China.


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## azpeterb

In case you need her number it's 867-5309.


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## redmr2_man

nice, take pics! lol not blurry pics of the labor like their site either!


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## skyliner1004

and a pic of jenny =) i like to see who i'm talking to! say shes famous back in the US.

Does she offer any type of warranty for their carbon frames/wheels?


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## BernyMac

PIcs...lots of pics!


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## karlo

+1 on many GOOD pics


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## gnatman

I want to follow this thread, too. Get an explation of what kind of headsets and bottom brackets are compatable with which of their frames.


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## Shuke

Many many many many many many many pictures of their factory etc. Also, see if they are taking the sold-as-is-unbranded frames from the same lot as the frames-to-be-branded.


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## My Own Private Idaho

It would be very a-typical for a manufacturer to take a customer around their facility and allow picture-taking of everything. Try that anywhere I've worked, and you will be the proud ex-owner of a camera.


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## BernyMac

My Own Private Idaho said:


> It would be very a-typical for a manufacturer to take a customer around their facility and allow picture-taking of everything. Try that anywhere I've worked, and you will be the proud ex-owner of a camera.


You work at a factory in China?


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## skyliner1004

My Own Private Idaho said:


> It would be very a-typical for a manufacturer to take a customer around their facility and allow picture-taking of everything. Try that anywhere I've worked, and you will be the proud ex-owner of a camera.


a typical, but thats not always the case. did u see the pinarello subforum with the man and wife inside their factory in italy? did you also see the LOOK factory tour? there are many others in the archives of this website.


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## T K

Ask if they make framesets for any of the well known bike companies or do they just do their own thing?Also, how do they come up with their designs and geomitries?
Is there any field testing for performance or lab testing for durability?
What is their quality control?
Thanks.


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## krhea

My Own Private Idaho said:


> It would be very a-typical for a manufacturer to take a customer around their facility and allow picture-taking of everything. Try that anywhere I've worked, and you will be the proud ex-owner of a camera.



Having spent an enormous amount of my career in Asia including Taiwan, China, Korea etc working for both sporting goods and cycling companies I'd really be surprised if you are able to take photos of anything "earth shattering".
Anything in that factory that is or could be "proprietary" will be strictly off limits I can assure you.
Pics of "normal" daily factory life may be OK but I will tell that a camera is not usually an item Chinese factories like to see in the hands of "outsiders". Usually factories have a small "showroom" where they show examples of their capabilities and photos are sometimes allowed.

_If_ you're able to take pics "on the floor" it will be an eye opening experience for everyone who's ever wondered about these Chinese "carbon mills". It is quite amazing to see and even more so "live and in person".
Each time I visited a carbon factory I was like a kid in a candy store. Enjoy your visit and good luck getting us pics of the experience.

KRhea


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## PlatyPius

"Yes, won't you please come in and take pictures of our counterfeiting operation?"


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## FatTireFred

I bet "jenny" = several of the people that answer emails at hong whatever


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## nealric

> "Yes, won't you please come in and take pictures of our counterfeiting operation?"


I don't believe hoingfu counterfeits anything. They make generic knockoffs. They would be counterfeiting if they were marketing their frames as being made by major manufacturers- they aren't.


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## roscoe

FatTireFred said:


> I bet "jenny" = several of the people that answer emails at hong whatever


whoa, you're going pretty far out on a limb there

of course jenny isn't one person, and is probably not even a woman (and even if it is a woman her name ain't jenny)


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## chocy

I am curious how much inventory they carry. and why some times they have frames in stock and some times they don't. Tell us all the details!!


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## redmr2_man

if jenny is hot, grab some nudes

of the, uh, nude...carbon...


yea...


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## raymonda

azpeterb said:


> In case you need her number it's 867-5309.



Ry Cooder version?


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## Deus_Ex_Machina

redmr2_man said:


> if jenny is hot, grab some nudes
> 
> of the, uh, nude...carbon...
> 
> 
> yea...


I've heard that those unbranded carbon frames will love you long long time.


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## cathyandrob

Ok, will take as many pics as I can, but I suspect that as someone said, I will just see a dingy showroom and a catalogue.

Will have get get back home to Australia before I can up load any pics so will be a week or so.

Rob


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## SBH1973

If you folks want to get a sense of what Chinese factory culture is like – and the women who work in them, including in management and administration, you must read Leslie Chang's excellent book "Factory Girls: From Village to City in a Changing China", probably the best work on workers' culture in the new China. I'm sure "Jenny" is much like the young women in Chang's book who started as wage workers on the factory floor and worked their way into middle management.

http://www.amazon.com/Factory-Girls-Village-Changing-China/dp/0385520182/ref=tmm_pap_title_0


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## adam_mac84

find out why they won't carry 60 cm frames!!!!! dengfu does, but jenny has all the rep!


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## yurl

eagerly awaiting pics. pics or it didn't happen


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## cathyandrob

*Well, that was interesting.....*

I did see Jenny at Hong-Fu today, and it was interesting and actually surrising.

Yes, she is real and she is only one person.

So to put this in context, we were just two guys who emailed and called and said we wanted to visit them. We aren't industry insiders or big shop owners. 

After an hour and twenty minutes in a taxi from the crossing point between Hong Kong and Shenzhen, my mate Daz and I were welcomed by Jenny and her husband and at the Hong-Fu factory. They appear to be the owners of the company.

So, we were treated to a full guided tour of the factory, from the cutting of carbon layers to forming moulds (or whatever you call them), joining tubes, forming the frame, baking, machinig, sanding, finishing, painting, stickers and clear coat. The whole shebang.

They were very welcoming, and despite their my non existent Chinese and their reasonable English, I got a reasonable idea of what was going on.

They allowed us to take photos of nearly everything, they just stopped us taking photos of their prototype frame and some external bike companies that they are making stuff for.

At the end, I said I wanted to post the photos to the net and they asked if they could approve which ones I post for business/confidentiality reasons. I will respect their wishes.

To answer a few Q's

Only saw frames with traditional BB' s. No BB 30 etc.

All appeared to have the same integrated headset I got with my FH 001. Don't know if it is Cane Creek or Campy spec.

Had a paint shop with lots of colours.

Didn't see any big name frames anywhere.

They said they design frames all their own frames. The employ designers and engineers that had previously worked at another long established carbon frame maker (I didn't recognize the name).

Also saw a carbon 29er frame in final stages of design.


The whole operation was not huge but was fairly clean, all rooms were isolated at least with doors. All the lay up and mould stages were mostly done by women and the dirtier sanding and painting jobs were done by men.

Also saw them testing frames for flex with dial gauges and weights. They said they test every frame??

They were very welcoming, but I can tell you it wasn't easy to find.

As I said won't be able to post pics till later but I'll try to answer other Q's if you have any.

Was a great couple of hours.

Rob


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## Coolhand

Neat- looking forward to the pictures!

:thumbsup:


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## BernyMac

Hongfu may see a significant increase in business soon. This is great publicity for them.


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## WaynefromOrlando

This makes me lean more towards buying a frame from Hongfu than anything I have read so far! Thanks for the information and like the others, photos please!


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## topflightpro

I've exchanged a few e-mails with Jenny. I'm curious to see what you think of their operation. I have not yet pulled the trigger on carbon rims.


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## AvantDale

SBH1973 said:


> If you folks want to get a sense of what Chinese factory culture is like – and the women who work in them, including in management and administration, you must read Leslie Chang's excellent book "Factory Girls: From Village to City in a Changing China", probably the best work on workers' culture in the new China. I'm sure "Jenny" is much like the young women in Chang's book who started as wage workers on the factory floor and worked their way into middle management.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Factory-Girls-Village-Changing-China/dp/0385520182/ref=tmm_pap_title_0



I've visited several shoe factories in China. To my surprise...most of them are female.

I asked my dad why there are mostly girls, he said that they get into less trouble than the men. The guys tend to drink alot...and end up getting beating each other up. 

He also said that they are losing alot of the girls to night clubs..."since they can make more money there."


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## GirchyGirchy

Neat, looking forward to pictures. If I had any interest in a carbon bike I'd probably think about theirs.


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## Peanya

AvantDale said:


> I've visited several shoe factories in China. To my surprise...most of them are female.
> 
> I asked my dad why there are mostly girls, he said that they get into less trouble than the men. The guys tend to drink alot...and end up getting beating each other up.
> 
> He also said that they are losing alot of the girls to night clubs..."since they can make more money there."


Computer motherboard manufacturers also use women because they usually pay more attention to detail in assembly. Lowers your failure rates.


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## dougydee

Any pictures to post yet cathandrob?


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## Dave Hickey

cathyandrob said:


> I did see Jenny at Hong-Fu today, and it was interesting and actually surrising.
> 
> Yes, she is real and she is only one person.
> 
> So to put this in context, we were just two guys who emailed and called and said we wanted to visit them. We aren't industry insiders or big shop owners.
> 
> After an hour and twenty minutes in a taxi from the crossing point between Hong Kong and Shenzhen, my mate Daz and I were welcomed by Jenny and her husband and at the Hong-Fu factory. They appear to be the owners of the company.
> 
> So, we were treated to a full guided tour of the factory, from the cutting of carbon layers to forming moulds (or whatever you call them), joining tubes, forming the frame, baking, machinig, sanding, finishing, painting, stickers and clear coat. The whole shebang.
> 
> They were very welcoming, and despite their my non existent Chinese and their reasonable English, I got a reasonable idea of what was going on.
> 
> They allowed us to take photos of nearly everything, they just stopped us taking photos of their prototype frame and some external bike companies that they are making stuff for.
> 
> At the end, I said I wanted to post the photos to the net and they asked if they could approve which ones I post for business/confidentiality reasons. I will respect their wishes.
> 
> To answer a few Q's
> 
> Only saw frames with traditional BB' s. No BB 30 etc.
> 
> All appeared to have the same integrated headset I got with my FH 001. Don't know if it is Cane Creek or Campy spec.
> 
> Had a paint shop with lots of colours.
> 
> Didn't see any big name frames anywhere.
> 
> They said they design frames all their own frames. The employ designers and engineers that had previously worked at another long established carbon frame maker (I didn't recognize the name).
> 
> Also saw a carbon 29er frame in final stages of design.
> 
> 
> The whole operation was not huge but was fairly clean, all rooms were isolated at least with doors. All the lay up and mould stages were mostly done by women and the dirtier sanding and painting jobs were done by men.
> 
> Also saw them testing frames for flex with dial gauges and weights. They said they test every frame??
> 
> They were very welcoming, but I can tell you it wasn't easy to find.
> 
> As I said won't be able to post pics till later but I'll try to answer other Q's if you have any.
> 
> Was a great couple of hours.
> 
> Rob



Great review......thanks


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## IRMB

Dave Hickey said:


> Great review......thanks


subscribe


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## karlo

waiting on pics...come on i've been checking everyday to see if you posted them


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## jermso




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## NotZeroSix




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## IRMB

NotZeroSix said:


>


Waiting on hongfu to approve them, is my guess.


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## cathyandrob

*I'm desperate too*

I have got to get the photos off my mate and then send them to Hong-Fu and then I'll post them.

I might just start a new threads when I get them, would that be easier?

I guess it will be another week or so.

I'll get them as soon as I can.

Rob


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## IRMB

cathyandrob said:


> I have got to get the photos off my mate and then send them to Hong-Fu and then I'll post them.
> 
> I might just start a new threads when I get them, would that be easier?
> 
> I guess it will be another week or so.
> 
> I'll get them as soon as I can.
> 
> Rob


No, keep it in this thread as that will notify us and make it easier to find a week from now.

Thanks,


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## BryanSayer

cathyandrob said:


> I have got to get the photos off my mate and then send them to Hong-Fu and then I'll post them.
> 
> I'll get them as soon as I can.
> 
> Rob


Somewhat off topic, but there is a sporting goods distributor with pretty good Campy prices, 

KEAN Trading
Century Industrial Center
33-35 AU PUI WAN St
fo tan hotin, n.t.

Do you know anything about them? I trying to see if they are legit.


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## PlatyPius

BryanSayer said:


> Somewhat off topic, but there is a sporting goods distributor with pretty good Campy prices,
> 
> KEAN Trading
> Century Industrial Center
> 33-35 AU PUI WAN St
> fo tan hotin, n.t.
> 
> Do you know anything about them? I trying to see if they are legit.


You're kidding, right?


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## roscoe

PlatyPius said:


> You're kidding, right?


+100, c'mon man!


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## cathyandrob

*Sorry for the wait*

here are the photos we took, I think we took more than this but this gives you an idea of what it's like. Will try to find the other ones.

yes thats Jenny, I'm the ugly one with the "huge" thighs

second pic is the raw carbon in the box, from Korea. Other are the cutting laying etc.


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## cathyandrob

lost a few, I'll do them again


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## cathyandrob

and more


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## aikendrum

Thanks Rob for the photos - it good to get an insight into the place where my bike was sourced - however not knowing the entire process it makes me feel a little nervous. Having said that my FM015 has travelled over 2500km in the past 4 months and is still as strong and responsive as ever. It makes me curious as to how all of these companies are making the same models with no variance - Is HongFu the main factory or is it DengFu or GreatKeen - or do they just manufacture identical models from the same blueprint?

Rob - It would be nice if you could describe a bit more in detail what you saw and your impressions - Cheers :thumbsup:


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## ewitz

Now you know why they are so cheap.

Contrast that with a modern carbon bicycle manufaturing facility and the difference is readily apparent.


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## philippec

ewitz said:


> Contrast that with a modern carbon bicycle manufaturing facility and the difference is readily apparent.


.... no it is not apparent.

Pictures from LOOK's French (not Tunisian) manufacturing plant below...If Cervelo and Specialized would allow pictures of their *Chinese* factories, I bet you would see much the same thing but on a larger scale.


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## fazzman

nice pictures. looks like your standard manufacturing process for carbon. there was a show with how guru bikes are made and it looks the same to me. bunch of plastic tubes glued together. any pics of there wheels being built?


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## jermso

nah you won't see anything like this in those sweat-shops though

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66ffKebNPbs&feature=related


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## ClarkinHawaii

This is so interesting--thanks for posting--It's so hard to visualize something like this just from limited contact of email

And thanks to Jenny for allowing it--many people in her position would play it safe and not allow pictures (or personal visits) just to avoid snarky comments. Clearly they have a good thing going and are justifiably proud of it--My hat is off to them!


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## Jetmugg

Good stuff there. Just because the Chinese frame manufacturers don't have a fancy building does not mean that their products are inferior to those built anywhere else (including the USA).

I work for a company that has manufacturing plants in the USA, Germany, Brazil, and China. The finished products we make meet the same quality standards regardless of where they are manufactured. The biggest differences in the way our plants are run are due in large part to cultural differences. In the USA, our workers are paid well, and they work very quickly. In Germany, they are paid even more highly and have higher benefits, but they work more slowly. In China, the culture is that individual workers do not work very quickly or get paid very well, but that it takes more workers to do the same job as might be performed in another part of the world. Brazil has a "manana" type attitude similar to many Latin American countries. They work steadily, but appreciate a slower pace and more time away from work.

In any regard, the pics are appreciated, and I am very much looking forward to having a Hong Fu or Deng Fu frame under myself very soon.

SteveM.


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## BryanSayer

PlatyPius said:


> You're kidding, right?


Nope, not kidding. Gotta put components on these frames. I'm having someone I know who travels to Hong Kong to manufacture stuff look them up. But I wouldn't be surprised to find out they are fake.


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## FTR

BryanSayer said:


> Nope, not kidding. Gotta put components on these frames. I'm having someone I know who travels to Hong Kong to manufacture stuff look them up. But I wouldn't be surprised to find out they are fake.


I think Platypius meant "you are kidding" as in that cathyandrob (who is an Australian on a trip to Hong Kong) would somehow know some obscure company in Hong Kong that you mentioned in a thread.

It is a bit similar to you asking me (who is also Australian) if I happened to run into Fred Blogs while I was walking around LA on my holiday.


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## PlatyPius

FTR said:


> I think Platypius meant "you are kidding" as in that cathyandrob (who is an Australian on a trip to Hong Kong) would somehow know some obscure company in Hong Kong that you mentioned in a thread.
> 
> It is a bit similar to you asking me (who is also Australian) if I happened to run into Fred Blogs while I was walking around LA on my holiday.


Close, but it was actually a sarcastic "you're kidding" as in "you really want to throw your money at Company X that no one has ever heard of?"


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## FTR

PlatyPius said:


> Close, but it was actually a sarcastic "you're kidding" as in "you really want to throw your money at Company X that no one has ever heard of?"


That too.


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## Kuma601

Thanks for the pics!
That Time video was also good.


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## nealric

jermso said:


> nah you won't see anything like this in those sweat-shops though
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66ffKebNPbs&feature=related


Other than the weaving machine shown at the beginning, I don't see anything drastically different. 


Overall, it's exactly what I expected Hong-fu to look like.


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## aikendrum

Just checked the HF website - they now have pictures of their production line......

http://www.hongfu-bikes.com/about.asp


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## cathyandrob

Glad you have found the pics interesting.

aikendrum: you asked about my impressions. The problem for me is that I have no idea how carbon frames are made and the difference between good and bad. I walked around the Hong-Fu factory and I was impressed, probably because I really didn't know what to expect. Seemed clean and nice. But what I think I/we really want to know is how they are designed, how do they ride and how do we know that the fork isn't going to snap at 50 km/hr down a big hill. 

The answer to that is probably that lots of them are sold, not as many as Trek and Specialized admittedly, but reports of failure or other disasters are few and far between.

You also bring up an interesting point. Why do all the factories seem to build the same frame and they even name them the same eg: FM001.

I have a friend inside the bike industry, and he says with the FM001 example, which appears to be a Kuota (?Kredo) copy, is that Martec in Taiwan owned the moulds for the Kredo and when the Kuota contract finished, I suspect Martec sold them to the Chinese and they use them to make the FM001. That's my suspicion.

As I said earlier I saw no BB30 BB's, but some people have FM001's with a BB30 so I suspect the other companies make them.



Clarkinhawaii: I agree that it was good of Jenny to allow me to photograph nearly everything, except their contracted customers. And we were just two guys who turned up and asked to see around. Furthermore, after we took all these photos, I said I wanted to put them on the internet and then they asked to vet them.

Of the photos I have posted, they only asked me not to post one photo, and that was not a big name company, was one I had never heard of them.

I'll try to get the other photos up soon.

Rob


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## erol/frost

Good job, interesting to see


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## jermso

aikendrum said:


> Just checked the HF website - they now have pictures of their production line......
> 
> http://www.hongfu-bikes.com/about.asp


dodgy site.

cathyandrob got much better pix.


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## BryanSayer

FTR said:


> I think Platypius meant "you are kidding" as in that cathyandrob (who is an Australian on a trip to Hong Kong) would somehow know some obscure company in Hong Kong that you mentioned in a thread.
> 
> It is a bit similar to you asking me (who is also Australian) if I happened to run into Fred Blogs while I was walking around LA on my holiday.


Well, someone touring a bicycle frame factory in Hong Kong (and presumably buying a frame from them) would be looking for components for the frame, presumably. And I have no idea how obscure this company is.

But I figured it was a long shot. Like I said, I have contacts looking into them.

U.S. prices on Campy are absurd.


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## Bacana

cathyandrob said:


> Glad you have found the pics interesting.
> 
> I'll try to get the other photos up soon.
> 
> Rob


Rob, thanks a million for taking the time to post and keep answering questions. This is one of the most interesting threads I've read here in a while, as this is something fairly rare to see.

Those conditions hardly look like sweatshop conditions, and Shenzen is hardly a far-flung, rural area; people flock there to make their fortune.

In this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nVbmcnsXXs I see a American workers building Madones by stuffing carbon layers into a mold; in Rob's pics, I see Chinese workers doing pretty much the same.

I'm really curious to try one of these frames myself, and these photos may sway me to order from Hong Fu.

Thanks again, Rob.


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## ClarkinHawaii

BryanSayer said:


> Well, someone touring a bicycle frame factory in Hong Kong (and presumably buying a frame from them) would be looking for components for the frame, presumably. And I have no idea how obscure this company is.
> 
> But I figured it was a long shot. Like I said, I have contacts looking into them.
> 
> U.S. prices on Campy are absurd.


If this is the Kean Trading that offers the groupsets on Alibaba at very low costs, I believe they have been exposed as a real scam--like one of the worst. I sent them in inquiry email asking some questions and of course got no answer.


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## SBH1973

Wow, when you watch this Trek video you can see why they really do have to charge as much as they do for their frames. Those skilled American workers don't come cheap. I have to admit that the Trek video inspires more confidence than the pictures at the Hong Fu factory, although I'd have no qualms about riding a Hong Fu frame.

I imagine that the Taiwanese factories come a little closer to Trek's factory, which is really impressive.

In this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nVbmcnsXXs I see a American workers building Madones by stuffing carbon layers into a mold; in Rob's pics, I see Chinese workers doing pretty much the same.

I'm really curious to try one of these frames myself, and these photos may sway me to order from Hong Fu.

Thanks again, Rob.[/QUOTE]


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## LouisVuitton

Very interesting


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## cathyandrob

*more photos from the Hong-Fu factory*

here you go


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## cathyandrob

*and more*

and more


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## karlo

Thanks for all these pics :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


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## cfred84

Interesting pics!! Thanks


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## ClarkinHawaii

Is each individual frame subjected to stress tests after it is made, or just random frames?

(referring to the 4th pic in post 73)


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## cathyandrob

I asked them and they said they do check every frame, but I think that would be difficult and time consuming. We may have lost something in the translation, don't know.


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## skyliner1004

does spec and trek and look and every other brand name frame manf stress test every single frame/house branded handlebar,saddle, seatpost, wheel they sell? For how long?


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## basman1

cathyandrob, 
Hong Fu Return Address anyone?

can you (or anyone else who has returned an item to hong-fu) confirm hong-fu's address with the one I have. I am returning a fork to them for exchange. Their website does not list it and when I contacted Jenny I did not get a Street Name or Number. Here is the info I have: Keng Zi Street, Long Gang Town, ShenZhen City, Guang Dong Province, China Postal Code 518000? or 518122?

Thanks


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## cs1

This has been one the most informative threads I've seen. Maybe it's THE most informative thread. Very few companies would allow an outsider in the plant with a camera. Good job.


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## ClarkinHawaii

skyliner1004 said:


> does spec and trek and look and every other brand name frame manf stress test every single frame/house branded handlebar,saddle, seatpost, wheel they sell? For how long?


I don't know--do they?

It would only take a few seconds to test each item--when you weigh that against the effects of a catastrophic failure, it sounds like something I would do. Can you imagine what's going to happen the first time somebody has a bad failure on one of these frames?

When I was waiting for Jenny to ship my frame, I received this email. At the time I kinda thought she was blowing smoke, but after seeing the picture of the tester, I believe it:

"Hi,Clark
thanks for your email!
I'm so sorry ,your order will be delay 4 days more.
really sorry about this,because our test mashine have a little problem last week,so delay about 1 week to test.
hope you can give understanding.

best regards!
Jenny "

By the way, she included a free seatpost with the order to assuage my pain about the delay,


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## johng723

Nice pics! I've been on the fence about ordering a frame from them, but now I just might give it a shot....


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## teoteoteo

Is this a head tube?

https://www.hongfu-bikes.com/Upload/Pic/200971821526665.jpg


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## Kaleo

Really excellent thread, I'm amazed at the level of handwork involved in making the forks alone. I'm not sure that it inspires a lot of trust in understanding how they are manufactured in terms of strength versus steel or other material. But I guess the proof is in the shear number of frames out there and the riders using them.


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## Kaleo

Really excellent thread, I'm amazed at the level of handwork involved in making the forks alone. I'm not sure that it inspires a lot of trust in understanding how they are manufactured in terms of strength versus steel or other material. But I guess the proof is in the shear number of frames out there and the riders using them.

Pretty kewl that they let you just come in there and welcome you shoot pictures and see there manufacturing process.


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## cathyandrob

teoteoteo said:


> Is this a head tube?
> 
> https://www.hongfu-bikes.com/Upload/Pic/200971821526665.jpg


Yeah, I saw that pic too, not the best photo to put on your web site.

The head tubes aren't that bad, well mine isn't.


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## FTR

cathyandrob said:


> The head tubes aren't that bad, well mine isn't.


Pics or it never happened.


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## jermso

teoteoteo said:


> Is this a head tube?
> 
> https://www.hongfu-bikes.com/Upload/Pic/200971821526665.jpg


work of art


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## foofighter

how come their site doesnt show the integrated stem/bar? they only show 2 bars anyone have a link for the integrated one as pictured in this thread


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## nyvram

foofighter said:


> how come their site doesnt show the integrated stem/bar? they only show 2 bars anyone have a link for the integrated one as pictured in this thread


this. i'd be interested as well.


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## ericjacobsen3

*Hongfu Crank Logo*

OK, while we are asking questions, why does Honfu have a crank for a logo but they do not make a carbon crank?

Of course if you have a legitimate question worthy of her time you can just ping Jenny. Her Messenger address is on the Hongfu site and she usually is online in the US night. I haven't bothered to bother her with this one.


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## ClarkinHawaii

ericjacobsen3 said:


> OK, while we are asking questions, why does Honfu have a crank for a logo but they do not make a carbon crank?
> 
> Of course if you have a legitimate question worthy of her time you can just ping Jenny. Her Messenger address is on the Hongfu site and she usually is online in the US night. I haven't bothered to bother her with this one.


It's just an easily recognizable symbol universally associated with bicycles. Look at these Naval Aviator wings: The big anchor makes you immediately think of Ships/Navy, but aircraft don't use anchors


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## mattoid

Hi there.
Been following these threads for a few weeks now, and just about decided on what I want based on a ratio of quality - lightweight - cost. 
Can anyone confirm for me that this is an FM001, size 50cm? It's the only image I can find of one this small. This was posted previously, but having problems with the forum.



Sorry if this is the wrong thread for this, but I am getting some PHP error on all the others. 
Thanks in advance.


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## chrisgrah

Awesome picts.
I am quite curious to order one of these.
Is their "e store" e-hongfu-bikes.com the best way to order or is there an ebay store that carries these?
C


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## slabber

thanks *cathyandrob*, just found this thread. 

Been riding my HF FM015 for over a year now quite happily


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## thalo

basman1 said:


> cathyandrob,
> Hong Fu Return Address anyone?
> 
> Here is the info I have: Keng Zi Street, Long Gang Town, ShenZhen City, Guang Dong Province, China Postal Code 518000? or 518122?
> 
> Thanks


it is quite possible that is the complete address. they dont always have numbers. the factories are regularly out in areas that are rural. as long as you have the factory name, it will most likely make it to them okay. i recently received a package from a factory in another part of guandong province that doesnt have a street number, just the factory name and street name.


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## Dankbeme

*This entire thread is in error*



cathyandrob said:


> and more


These photos are of Fly Bike the factory that supplies most of the agent/brokers such as HongFu, DengFu, Miracle Trade, ICAN, Flyxii and many more.

All the photos have been cropped to hide the FlyBike logo on all the blue shirts of the employees and the main sign in front of the building (see below).
About Flybike-Company-FLYBIKE 

This does not mean you won't get a great frame at a great price - just beware, be smart and be careful... and read all the threads here!


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## BlackDoggystyle

Interresting pictures. 

I've been told that some DengFu frames are made by HongFu and didn't believe it at first, but I see them building the DengFu FM018 TT frame that HongFu does not sell for themselves.

Thanks 4 the heads up!


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## FTR

Dankbeme said:


> T
> "CathyandRob" is more than likely posted by Jenny and a friend at HongFu.
> 
> BAD FORM! but that is par for the course with the Chinese manufacturing culture (help your closest friends, but trick everyone else if possible). This does not mean you won't get a great frame at a great price - just beware, be smart and be careful... and read all the threads here!


CathyandRob is a guy from Sydney, Australia.

Nice conspiracy theory though.


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## iheartbenben

Yeah, I went there too. They wouldn't let me in the gates though, so all I have is this one picture.










THE MOST INFORMATIVE THREAD IS OF THOSE CHINESE FRAMES BEING BUILT AND RIDDEN.


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## Tri Slow Poke

FatTireFred said:


> I bet "jenny" = several of the people that answer emails at hong whatever


Nope. Jenny is an actual person. There was a thread on here a few years ago where someone visited her and took pictures.


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## cathyandrob

*Well this is interesting.*

Well as FTR says, I'm just a guy from Sydney.

The photos aren't cropped, there were no obscuring of logos or whatever you think happened.

I don't really care if you don't believe the story or not, I sold my Hong Fu bike and have no intention of getting another carbon frame as I like steel bikes.There was nothing wrong with it, just not my thing.

I saw the FlyBike logo on the front gate, I didn't think much of it at the time.

If you take the time to read what I wrote, you will see I didn't say the frames were good or bad, just reported what I saw and took photos to prove it. I said I had no idea what a carbon bike factory should look like, or how to make a good or bad frame.

FlyBike may make all the frames for those different companies, doesn't really matter does it? Maybe FlyBike is the wholesale side where they manufacture for other brand names, whatever.

The only thing that Jenny didn't want me to photograph were other name branded frames, one of which I looked up later, was a bike shop in Melbourne that Hong Fu were making frames for. 

I joined RBR in 2006, nice forward planning for a hoax ,eh!

Have a nice day.










Dankbeme said:


> These photos are of Fly Bike the factory that supplies most of the agent/brokers such as HongFu, DengFu, Miracle Trade, ICAN, Flyxii and many more.
> 
> All the photos have been deceptively cropped to hide the FlyBike logo on all the blue shirts of the employees and the main sign in front of the building (see below).
> About Flybike-Company-FLYBIKE
> 
> "CathyandRob" is more than likely posted by Jenny and a friend at HongFu.
> 
> BAD FORM! but that is par for the course with the Chinese manufacturing culture (help your closest friends, but trick everyone else if possible). This does not mean you won't get a great frame at a great price - just beware, be smart and be careful... and read all the threads here!


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## config

cathyandrob said:


> Well as FTR says, I'm just a guy from Sydney.
> 
> The photos aren't cropped, there were no obscuring of logos or whatever you think happened.
> 
> I don't really care if you don't believe the story or not, I sold my Hong Fu bike and have no intention of getting another carbon frame as I like steel bikes.There was nothing wrong with it, just not my thing.
> 
> I saw the FlyBike logo on the front gate, I didn't think much of it at the time.
> 
> If you take the time to read what I wrote, you will see I didn't say the frames were good or bad, just reported what I saw and took photos to prove it. I said I had no idea what a carbon bike factory should look like, or how to make a good or bad frame.
> 
> FlyBike may make all the frames for those different companies, doesn't really matter does it? Maybe FlyBike is the wholesale side where they manufacture for other brand names, whatever.
> 
> The only thing that Jenny didn't want me to photograph were other name branded frames, one of which I looked up later, was a bike shop in Melbourne that Hong Fu were making frames for.
> 
> I joined RBR in 2006, nice forward planning for a hoax ,eh!
> 
> Have a nice day.


This thread was pretty informative when cathyandrob posted this last year. A new member w/ all the answers and a conspiracy theory to resurrect it. How funny?


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## deviousalex

How come they say they don't do BB30? 2011 aero road frame
They say you can get BB30 on that frame.


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## Hiro11

I am working under the assumption that basically every "brand" of frame that we talk about here in this forum from Hong-Fu to Dengfu to Miracle Trade to ICAN to Gotobike etc are all made in the same two or three factories to the same spec. If a small 3K meters squared factory can produce 6,000 frames a year, you don't need too many factories to produce serious volume. This is also almost certainly true of wheels too. I think all of these "brands" are just middle men.

I could definitely be wrong, though.


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## leach.r.83

wow, do you have any photos of them making the frames?


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## kgs499

*Answer a few questions.*

mattoid:
I don't believe that is FM001, the FM001 is a pinarello dogma replica I think. It may just not have the signature pinarello fork (Fm001 fork). 


deviousalex:
Ask jenny personally in an email. I emailed her just last night and had a response this morning. She said the FM028 could come with BB30 but it would take 70 days to build..
(can't input her email address because this is my first post..)
Try contacting her.


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## PaxRomana

Hiro11 said:


> I am working under the assumption that basically every "brand" of frame that we talk about here in this forum from Hong-Fu to Dengfu to Miracle Trade to ICAN to Gotobike etc are all made in the same two or three factories to the same spec. If a small 3K meters squared factory can produce 6,000 frames a year, you don't need too many factories to produce serious volume. This is also almost certainly true of wheels too. I think all of these "brands" are just middle men.
> 
> I could definitely be wrong, though.


You are correct. They are made by Flybike. This has been verified on other boards, such as weightweenies, etc.


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## andyhopey

Great pics


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## roadtriaus

Just curious about what you saw there, was there much use of the uni-directional fibre that is used by other manufacturers? All the frames have the woven surface layer, wondering if thats just a top layer or the entire structure. Thanks for a great look inside the factory, makes me more likely to get one (which is clearly what Jenny was hoping)


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## FTR

roadtriaus said:


> Just curious about what you saw there, was there much use of the uni-directional fibre that is used by other manufacturers? All the frames have the woven surface layer, wondering if thats just a top layer or the entire structure. Thanks for a great look inside the factory, makes me more likely to get one (which is clearly what Jenny was hoping)


Not sure this is true.
I am currently in the process of ordering a UD frame via Hong-fu.


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## cda 455

So that's how a $15,000 CF frame is made, eh  ?!!


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## ToffieBoi

Is it possible to upload the photos again, since all of them deleted.

I have a "frame" from them on the post now and I am curious about the factory photos


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## nirVELOvana

ToffieBoi said:


> Is it possible to upload the photos again, since all of them deleted.
> 
> _*I have a from them on the post*_ now and I am curious about the factory photos


You have a _what_ on the _what_? 

Anyway...

I was interested in seeing those pictures too. I managed to unearth them through google:


img_3954.jpg
img_3957.jpg
img_3958.jpg
img_3959.jpg
img_3960.jpg
img_3961.jpg
img_3962.jpg
img_3963.jpg (_money shot!_)
img_3964.jpg
img_3965.jpg
img_3966.jpg
img_3968.jpg
img_3969.jpg
img_3972.jpg
img_3974.jpg

Here's a totally unrelated shop meticulously preparing a frame from painting.

That shop is owned by another Asian lady (_from the sound of her blog, I think she's an engineer_)

Coincidentally, I'm currently having a white frame - _from an unrelated factory in China_ - going through a similar "_R-Film_" process. I hope they're even half as meticulous as the ladies in the shop pictured above.


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## ToffieBoi

nirVELOvana said:


> You have a _what_ on the _what_?
> 
> Anyway...
> 
> I was interested in seeing those pictures too. I managed to unearth them through google:
> 
> 
> img_3954.jpg
> img_3957.jpg
> img_3958.jpg
> img_3959.jpg
> img_3960.jpg
> img_3961.jpg
> img_3962.jpg
> img_3963.jpg (_money shot!_)
> img_3964.jpg
> img_3965.jpg
> img_3966.jpg
> img_3968.jpg
> img_3969.jpg
> img_3972.jpg
> img_3974.jpg
> 
> Here's a totally unrelated shop meticulously preparing a frame from painting.
> 
> That shop is owned by another Asian lady (_from the sound of her blog, I think she's an engineer_)
> 
> Coincidentally, I'm currently having a white frame - _from an unrelated factory in China_ - going through a similar "_R-Film_" process. I hope they're even half as meticulous as the ladies in the shop pictured above.


Hello

Thanks for the photos.
Sorry I was on mobile, in a crowded bus while I was checking the topic so I forgot to write "frame" there.

I, last week ordered a frameset from them (FM066SL) with bottle cages. So I wanted to see, where my frame really came from 

Thanks again.


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