# Shortening cockpit?



## SS Gladiator (Oct 28, 2008)

hi guys. I recently purchased a roadbike, a size bigger than what I thought I'd be. before you come down on me for why not just buying the right size, just wanted to tell you that I'm on a budget, and got a good deal on the bike model I really like (leftover). it's a 56cm. and I think I should be on the 54 cm frame. my question is: would changing the stem from 110mm. to 80mm.(and possibly a riser), as well as changing the seatpost from a 20mm offset to a 0 offset, do the trick of shortening the reach? what effects on the ride can I expect? the geometry specs states that the top tube difference between a 54 and a 56 is only about 22-24mm., and what I'm thinking of actually decreases it by about 50mm. my background is MTB in which all my bikes have riser bars and stems, for comfort. I sat on the road bike while on the trainer and felt stretched out, either not used to it, being on an upright position with the mtb., or just too long a top tube? 

about myself: 5'9-5'10, wear a 30" inseam pants, average torso (shirts are 34/16), but somehow my reach feels on the shorter side. seatpost still shows a good amount with KOPS std., and have about .75-1.0 inch standover clearance.

should I do both stem and seatpost? stem alone? riser? comfort is a priorityI hope you guys can shed some light into this matter. thanks.


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## orbeamike (Nov 20, 2004)

What are the differences in effective top tube length and head tube length between the 54 and 56cm frames? Your height and inseam doesn't sound too bad for a traditional 56cm frame. Take a side picture of yourself on the 56cm frame and post it here.


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## austincrx (Oct 22, 2008)

I tried moving my seat back, and adding a riser stem to my road bike. BAD IDEA!!!!! It was sooo uncomfortable (see post 'Why is my bike so uncomfortable' in the coaching forum). The seat position has to do with legs, don't use it to adjust how you are reaching the handlebars. Use stem length, then use the spacers on the steerer tube to make the height adjustments to your handlebars. my stem started out as a 130mm w/ 5 degree of rise, then tried a 90mm stem w/ 60 degree of rise. Did way more bad than good!!!

I'd make very small adjustments and only one at a time, then ride the bike for a while, and then adjust something else.

I ended up putting the 130mm stem back on my bike, and moving my seat back to the 0 mark, just got a longer seat post, that did the trick!!! Now I LOOK FORWARD to riding everyday!


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2008)

I wouldn't change the relationship between the saddle and bottom bracket as a means of adjusting the reach. While the type of suspension (or not) that you were using on the MTB would affect this, generally your saddle should be in the same relative position.


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## cyclust (Sep 8, 2004)

You can also make quite a bit of reach adjustment via the handlebar position and brifter positioning. You may also want to consider a compact handlebar, which has less reach and drop. If you are new to road bikes, it will probably take you a while to dial in your fit.


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## Camilo (Jun 23, 2007)

position the seat to get your position correct to the pedals. Do not position the seat to adjust reach. Start with the "knee over pedal spindle" position and adjust from there for your own comfort.

After you get that approximately dialed in, then adjust the reach of the handle bars. Just as a rough guess, with your body size, my WAG would be that the 56 is a fine frame size for you and the stem length and rise will end up within the normal 90-110mm, 7-8 degree range. Just my opinion though ... but I wouldn't think a 56cm frame would require radical stem machinations for you.

Good luck.


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## SS Gladiator (Oct 28, 2008)

thanks for the responses guys. I guess I'm trying to get comfy on a bike that tends to lean a rider forward. as I mentioned before, I'm more of a mountainbiker, in which most of my rides are pretty upright (by choice and comfort), riser bars and stem, and zero offset seatpost. I guess I just got used to riding that way, that the new style seems to be uncomfortable.

anyway, the KOPS I got covered, but the seatpost offset kinda confuses me. will going from 20mm to 0 offset really make that much of a difference with pedaling power/force? when manufacturers design the bikes, did they have seatpost offset in mind?

I also have an 80mm stem I want to try to dial in my reach. also have a 75mm riser, but how would a riser affect handling, or will it?

maybe I'm just being a wuss about the positioning, being too comfy on mtb's. maybe I will post a pic of me on the bike (if I ever get over shyness).


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## Peanya (Jun 12, 2008)

I went from a 100mm stem to a 65mm to fix the same issue you are having. Don't change the seatpost.


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Back and forth*



SS Gladiator said:


> anyway, the KOPS I got covered, but the seatpost offset kinda confuses me. will going from 20mm to 0 offset really make that much of a difference with pedaling power/force? when manufacturers design the bikes, did they have seatpost offset in mind?
> 
> I also have an 80mm stem I want to try to dial in my reach. also have a 75mm riser, but how would a riser affect handling, or will it?


The only reason you need a different seat post is if your saddle is all the way forward or back and you need to move it farther forward or farther back to get in the right position relative to the pedals. 2 cm forward or back can indeed make a noticeable difference in both comfort and your ability to deliver power. However, there is a fair amount of time required to adapt to a new riding position, so that much change should be made slowly.

I guess that you could say that bike designers have a seat post in mind when they choose the frame angles and tube lengths, but they can't really know what a given rider might want because body proportions vary pretty widely.

A riser will affect handling by shifting your weight balance to the rear. Whether it improves or degrades the handling, only you can tell us. 

Here's a question for you to ponder: If you don't like the position on the bike that comes with a road bike, why not just put narrow slicks on your mountain bike? The body position that road bikes "require" has been evolved over 120 years for a combination of comfort and speed. You might want to consider whether it's better for you to adapt to the road bike. Just saying.


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## wmayes (Aug 8, 2007)

I actually did the same thing. I am 5-10 or so with a 32 inseam and felt too stretched out on my first 56cm madone. I shortened the stem, moved the seat up a tad in an effort to shorten the cockpit. Still felt wrong, so I sold it and bought a 54cm. It felt a little short, so I added a 110 stem in place of the 100 and that helped. Well, lo and behold, after riding a year, I am stretching out and now the 54 feels too small, so I am going back to a 56cm madone. The moral here is to change the easy parts, shorten the stem and move the seat a little forward, then as fitness improves, you'll probably settle in like I did, except you won't be losing your shirt like me on swapping out bikes!


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