# BikesDirect Review: Good Deal or Ripoff? (Updated)



## bbrews123

Updated / Edited: Upon further discussion, BD agreed that the damage could have been caused by a loose chain pin being stuck in the derailleur -- though they point out (as many of you have) that this type of damage is most typically caused by a bent derailleur hanger. Given the fact that the damage could have been caused by a faulty chain (also, as many of you have speculated), BD has agreed to send me a replacement part free of charge. I'll be responsible for labor costs. 

Given the tenor of the replies to my post thus far, I expect a lot of negative responses no matter what I say. I wish it had been a smoother process, but in the end they gave me the benefit of the doubt that I was telling the truth and the bike had been damaged in the manner I described. 

Since I (and the guard who helped me) were the only people there to verify I'm not lying (and I'm not), BD giving me the benefit of the doubt was an act of faith on their part -- which I very much appreciate. 

Even if maladjustment wasn't the cause of the problem, I hope BD puts up more explicit notice that their bikes should be taken to a LBS for adjustment before *any *amount of biking takes place. Then again, maybe I'm just an idiot who did not fully comprehend their already existing warnings (as many of you have stated). 

I very much _wanted _to wholeheartedly enjoy and love this bike -- and I hope I still will. On one level it is a great deal: a 21 pound bike with what are supposed to be top of the line components for $800. On another, I have voiced my gripes about dealing with this problem, but in the end the issue has resolved itself in a satisfactory manner. 

I hope that in the years to come I will only write glowing praise about the bike and come to be accused of being a corporate shill by you all. 

In any case, thanks for the discussion be it positive or negative.

_____________________________________________________
A few weeks ago I was looking to purchase a road bike and came across BD. It _seemed_ like a fantastic deal at the time: good (not name brand) frame manufacture paired with outstanding components. I ended up getting their GravityPro bike with Shimano Ultegra components for just under $800 (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/gravity/pro20_blue.htm). They suggest this bike compares to a $2,000 Trek/Cannondale. 

My bike arrived promptly and assembly was easy -- attach handle bars/front tire/seat. 

In total, I rode my BD bike four (4) times for less than ten (10) miles before a major component failure. On my last ride (4/4) I was commuting home on a flat stretch of road (shifting down) when the bike bucked and ground to a halt. When I inspected the bike I immediately saw the chain was broken and the pulley on the rear derailleur had been broken apart (images attached). These components were brand new Shimano Ultegra -- which I have a hard time believing would be so thoroughly destroyed riding on flat ground. 

As requested by BD, I immediately emailed their service department with a description of the problem along with photos of the damage. Their response was that, "this is usually caused by misadjustment or a bent derailleur hanger and is not considered a warranty issue." I'd like to point out here that the bike was adjusted by BD, and if the derailleur hanger was bent, it was bent because that's how it was shipped to me a week prior. So, BD either sent me a "misadjusted" bike, or defective components.

They went on to say that they would not replace the part but would sell me a new derailleur for $100, with no reimbursement for labor costs. I replied that was unacceptable as their fault lies with their product, and am awaiting a reply (Update above). 

If I were to do it over again, I would consider paying the extra $200-300 and purchase from a local bike shop -- if I'm going to end up spending the money anyway on repairs after all.


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## Bocephus Jones II

Not really seeing your beef here. It's ultimately yout reponsibility to make sure your bike is properly adjusted before riding. I would think you'd have noticed a bent derailler hanger when you bought the bike so it was most likely a misadjustment and to cause that kind of damage it must have been WAY off.

Probably more reason to buy a bike from your LBS than an online retailer if you're not going to go through the bike with a fine tooth comb before riding. I don't expect most online shops include a bike setup in the deal while most LBSes do.


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## Lotophage

seems like you should be mad at Shimano.

_Your bike either road, mountain bike or cruiser or other type of bike comes appx. 90% assembled and then packed for shipment directly from the factory. Although re-assembly is quite simple, *we strongly suggest that you have your local bike shop do this for you since some final adjustments may be necessary due to being shipped directly from the factory.* (Most any dealer will offer this service for a minimal charge. It’s only a few minutes work.)_

looks like you missed this part.


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## nealric

You expect a bike that was shipped cross country to arrive in perfect adjustment? I don't care if you ordered from bikes direct or Pinarello- you have to carefully inspect and adjust any new bike.


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## bbrews123

Most likely, the failure occurred due to one of two causes: 1) the bent derailleur hanger or 2) component failure. My issue is that the blame for either case lies with bikesdirect.com. Either they sent me a bike that was so out of whack it broke before ten miles ridden, OR they sent me a bike with crappy (counterfeit?) components that blew up before ten miles ridden. 

I appreciate that bikesdirect.com issues a disclaimer that one "might" want to go to a LBS for set up / tune up (but it's not necessary). However, it is my opinion that if this is effectively required, it should be explicitly stated and accompanied by a price reduction. 

In the end, either I return it, get the part from bikesdirect.com, or I'm screwed and have to shell over a few hundred dollars more. Not the end of the world by any means. I'm just trying to keep others from making my mistake and buying from what is either a disreputable site, or at best a site/store that provides a shotty product along with poor customer service.


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## bbrews123

Lotophage: I did indeed read that disclaimer. Perhaps I'm being naive, but I'd expect if I purchased at a LBS, with a proper warranty, this wouldn't' be an issue. 

Had I purchased from a LBS, they could see that it was either faulty assembly (their responsibility) or a bad part -- in my mind also their responsibility as they are the ultimate point of sale for that bad part. 

Whereas bikesdirect.com takes no responsibility for anything. That is my issue.


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## bbrews123

nealric: A fair point. I did indeed carefully inspect the bike before riding it. I believe I would have noticed if the derailleur hanger was bent to such a degree where it would contact the spokes. In fact, all indications are that the derailleur hanger did not contact the spokes. There is no damage whatsoever to the spokes. Considering the bent/broken chain and the blown out metal on the derailleur itself, had the derailleur hanger contacted the spokes causing this problem, there would be indications of serious damage to the spokes. 

This leads me to believe it was component failure. It is my opinion that it is ultimately the responsibility of bikesdirect.com to monitor and police quality control of what is put on their bikes. Most businesses that sell a product are responsible to make sure that product functions properly and the component parts of the product are sound. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect bikesdirect.com to do the same. 

Think about if this "product" was a car. Toyota is responsible to make sure their break petals function properly and were held liable when they didn't (regardless of the fact that the break petals were manufactured by a third party).


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## tconrady

Dollar to donuts the low limit screw wasn't set properly and the shift threw the deraileur into the rear drive side spokes. Might've worked fine previously but you might've just shifted far enough that time for it to happen.

I agree it's frustrating but if you take the responsibility to do the final 10% of assembly yourself then you need to check everything, not just the bits and pieces you snapped together. It's absurd to say that you were only responsible for the parts you assembled. You knew it wasn't a total build yet you're trying to finger BD for a misconfigured third party (Shimano) component on a bike that everyone agrees wasn't a turnkey, finished product. 

There was a third option here. You could've taken your new BD bike to the LBS to have them go over it or do the final assembly. Most shops margins are made on service and not bikes and given the economy most would like to have the work. Going this route you would've paid a bit more than you did and bit less than at the LBS for a bike....and still had a properly configured ride.

FTR, I did it to my Giant TCR Advanced Carbon frame with a groupset that I assembled. It totally sucks but it wasn't Giant's fault that it happened. It was mine. It's a miserable and costly lesson to learn. A very costly lesson for me.


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## Bocephus Jones II

bbrews123 said:


> nealric: A fair point. I did indeed carefully inspect the bike before riding it. I believe I would have noticed if the derailleur hanger was bent to such a degree where it would contact the spokes. In fact, all indications are that the derailleur hanger did not contact the spokes. There is no damage whatsoever to the spokes. Considering the bent/broken chain and the blown out metal on the derailleur itself, had the derailleur hanger contacted the spokes causing this problem, there would be indications of serious damage to the spokes.
> 
> This leads me to believe it was component failure. It is my opinion that it is ultimately the responsibility of bikesdirect.com to monitor and police quality control of what is put on their bikes. Most businesses that sell a product are responsible to make sure that product functions properly and the component parts of the product are sound. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect bikesdirect.com to do the same.
> 
> Think about if this "product" was a car. Toyota is responsible to make sure their break petals function properly and were held liable when they didn't (regardless of the fact that the break petals were manufactured by a third party).


Any chance of getting a warranty through Shimano? Sometimes sh*t happens and you get a bum component though it really does sound like a misadjustment was responsible rather than a wholesale component failure as you say it happened right after a shift.


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## highendbikedeals

your issue. should learn how to adjust yourself or pay your local bike shop. buyer beware on the internet...


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## bbrews123

tconrady: As I replied to another poster, I don't think it was contact w/ the spokes that caused the problem. 

While I agree with you about responsibility for final assembly, I think we just have a different conception as to how far that responsibility extends. In the end, despite any disclaimers they may add, bikesdirect.com is still selling a product advertised as a bike one can assemble and use themselves without issue. In my case that was not true for whatever reason. 

As to your point about taking it to a LBS for a tune up / check up you're right. Unfortunately, I can say with 100% honesty that I had planned to do that this last weekend. I figured I could ride the bike for a minimum of a four times without a major blow up -- wrong.


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## bbrews123

If I can't get bikesdirect.com to honor their "100% satisfaction guarantee," I think there is little chance I'll be able to have much luck with Shimano directly. But it's definately a good idea. At least if I shipped them the broken part they could likely tell me the definitive cause of the problem.


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## bbrews123

highendbikedeals: I believe that was the thrust of my post / subsequent replies. Though you restated it in an impressively concise manner.


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## highendbikedeals

Bikes Direct gave you the parameters. You were either to impatient or cheap to follow their directions. An internet purchase is set up for someone who understands what they are getting into. Usually buyers who buy on a site like bikesdirect.com accept the conditions of buying cheap ****.


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## tconrady

bbrews123 said:


> tconrady: As I replied to another poster, I don't think it was contact w/ the spokes that caused the problem.


Ooops! I missed that part. That's what I get for working and RBRing at the same time. :blush2: 

If the rear wheel/spokes and frame are fine then you're only out a chain and rear deraileur...I wish that was all that happened to mine. BD has said their piece and while they're technically right, you'd at least hope they'd meet you in the somewhere in the middle with an olive branch. Perhaps their offer was along those line...I don't care to get into a he said/she said kind of thing. 

I think you're best coarse of action is to go to your LBS and order the parts, fix the busticated pieces and let them go over the rest of the bike.


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## Bocephus Jones II

highendbikedeals said:


> Bikes Direct gave you the parameters. You were either to impatient or cheap to follow their directions. An internet purchase is set up for someone who understands what they are getting into. Usually buyers who buy on a site like bikesdirect.com accept the conditions of buying cheap ****.


Guessing BD doesn't even look at the bikes before sending out as they say that it's packed for shipping directly from the factory. BD is pretty much just a middleman. This is why I'd never suggest a first timer buy a bike online as you really need the expertise of a good LBS to make sure you get fit and adjusted properly.


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## highendbikedeals

that's what you learn owning a bike shop and dealing with this kind of issue. It's really great when customers are pissed at us because of their issues. If it had happened from your lbs - you would have every right to jump up and down. It happened out of a box - live and learn


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## Bocephus Jones II

highendbikedeals said:


> that's what you learn owning a bike shop and dealing with this kind of issue. It's really great when customers are pissed at us because of their issues. If it had happened from your lbs - you would have every right to jump up and down. It happened out of a box - live and learn


Even there there are limits. What if the OP got a stick stuck in the chainstay and that took out the derailler?


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## bbrews123

highendbikedeals: I took another look at bikesdirect.com for the parameters that state we're selling you a maladjusted bike or crappy components. I couldn't seem to find that passage or the one about required expertise before purchase. I'll keep looking.

I did find this little bit though on their "satisfaction guarantee": "We know you will be happy with your bike. If for any reason you are not*, let us know and we'll make it right or you may return it." 

To yours & everyone's general point, I should have been more skeptical about the purchase and done a greater check on the bike: you're right. The purpose of my post on here is to warn other potential purchasers so they don't make the same costly mistake.


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## bbrews123

Bocephus Jones II: I couldn't agree more. Perhaps the site is more appropriate for a buyer with more expertise. But I'd hazard a guess that most purchasers from bikesdirect.com are first time buyers. From my own experience, I was definitely put off by the $1000 / $2000 price tag of buying from a local shop. That's why BD seemed like such a great alternative -- a first time buyer could get a bike w/ great components for relatively little money.


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## Sablotny

*Sorry to see that*

I recently had a similar incident, possibly. I installed a new chain on my Colnago Dream HX and on the second ride, during a steep climb, the chain ass-ploded and yanked my RD into the spokes. Destroyed the RD, the derailleur hanger, and put my Dream out of commission for the 2+ months its taken to get a new hanger from Colnago (still waiting).

I've assembled three BD bikes, the all were set up well except for the disc brake calipers on the last MTB, which either weren't installed or weren't aligned (can't remember). If this wasn't an RD limit issue, it may have been a bad chain, or stiff link. I wish BD would have shown you more sympathy and better customer service, but I'm not sure I can lay the blame on them entirely. They offer great prices, and do it by shipping you the bike to build. And sometimes, unfortunately, *&%$! just happens.


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## matanza

12345


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## bbrews123

Sablotny: It's interesting you say that because my chain looks similarly exploded (and bent for good measure). The only thing that give me pause is the bike was less than a week old and I was riding on a flat stretch of road commuting home. This makes me think it was a defect rather than stress being the cause of the problem. 

In fact, my blowout happened on the flat stretch right in front of the White House / Treasury. The only positive aspect of this whole experience is that the guards came over and helped me disentangle the broken chain from the gears and hold up the bike. They were very helpful nice guys.


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## Camilo

bbrews123 said:


> highendbikedeals: I took another look at bikesdirect.com for the parameters that state we're selling you a maladjusted bike or crappy components. I couldn't seem to find that passage or the one about required expertise before purchase. I'll keep looking.
> 
> I did find this little bit though on their "satisfaction guarantee": "We know you will be happy with your bike. If for any reason you are not*, let us know and we'll make it right or you may return it."
> 
> To yours & everyone's general point, I should have been more skeptical about the purchase and done a greater check on the bike: you're right. The purpose of my post on here is to warn other potential purchasers so they don't make the same costly mistake.


I'm really sorry to hear that you learned a lesson that will cost you some money. The reality is that when you buy a bike like this online you get the benefit of the cheaper price, but at the cost of responsibility on your part to assemble, adjust and inspect to make sure it's ready to go. If you'd found the mal adjustment the problem wouldn't have happened.

The trade off is cheaper price for the responsibility and / or risk of making sure it's ready to go when it's assembled. They can't possibly do that with their business model and the way they ship things.

Your LBS can - and that's why they charge more.

It's good you brought this up because it is a fact of these sort of online purchases and indicates at least some of the value that the LBS provides for the higher prices.


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## desurfer

bbrews123 said:


> I figured I could ride the bike for a minimum of a four times without a major blow up -- wrong.


If something isn't adjusted correctly, it doesn't then magically work if you only use it briefly. It's either set up properly, or it isn't.


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## Bocephus Jones II

Camilo said:


> I'm very sorry this is not what you want to hear, but arguing won't change the facts, so get over it.


And really if it only costs you $100 to fix then you're probably still ahead of the game. Be thankful it didn't do more damage and chalk it up to a lesson learned.


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## bbrews123

Camilo: It's not that I don't want to hear what you guys are saying. I guess I just have a different perspective on what was sold / the expectation of bike expertise being explicitly required (it's not). 

As for your "facts," I don't concede that the problem was improper adjustment or a bent derailleur hanger. Perhaps those could be true, but I'd add faulty components to the list. 

To your assertion that it is completely the buyers responsibility to adjust everything, I'd slightly disagree with that. I've copied the instructions / from my receipt of purchase email that describes the level of expertise / assembly required:

"Be sure to tighten all parts and check adjustments prior to riding.
Even parts that arrive pre-installed should be tightened and adjusted.
Most bikes are shipped knocked down with pedals (if included), handlebars, seat, and front wheel off.
The brakes and derailleurs will need some minor adjustment, sometimes wheels need minor truing.
It takes most about 25 minutes to setup a factory direct bike.
It is very easy to do; but most customers like to take their time and spend about an hour on setup.

I DID tighten all parts and check to make sure nothing was grossly out of whack before I rode it. And if you think a complete blow up of the rear derailleur would have been prevented by "some minor adjustment," that's your opinion but I'd disagree. 

In any case, read those directions / warning and tell me if it suggests to you complex bike assembly expertise is required. I (to my determent) did not read it that way.


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## Lotophage

bbrews123 said:


> Lotophage: I did indeed read that disclaimer. Perhaps I'm being naive, but I'd expect if I purchased at a LBS, with a proper warranty, this wouldn't' be an issue.
> 
> Had I purchased from a LBS, they could see that it was either faulty assembly (their responsibility) or a bad part -- in my mind also their responsibility as they are the ultimate point of sale for that bad part.
> 
> Whereas bikesdirect.com takes no responsibility for anything. That is my issue.


But, and this bears repeating, you didn't buy from your LBS. 

You bought from someone online because they had the lowest price possible. 

Then, when it broke, you expected them to give you the same level of service as your LBS, who would have tacked $3-400 onto the pricetag.

You can't have it both ways. You want individual, hand-holding service, you have to pay the extra and get it from your LBS. 

And, I gotta tell you, with what you said in your original post, Trek or Cannondale would have said the same thing. They'd have just told the LBS instead of telling you directly.


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## AJL

BD should have sent you a new derailleur and chain - simply because the cost of shipping you new components will be less than the sales they'll lose from this post..


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## Bocephus Jones II

AJL said:


> BD should have sent you a new derailleur and chain - simply because the cost of shipping you new components will be less than the sales they'll lose from this post..


True...you can't buy an ad for less than $100 and going above and beyond could have gotten them more sales than that assuming the OP would have posted about it here which isn't as likely as posting when something goes wrong. On the other hand, the OP might then expect free parts whenever anything else breaks or wears out.


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## highendbikedeals

AJL said:


> BD should have sent you a new derailleur and chain - simply because the cost of shipping you new components will be less than the sales they'll lose from this post..


They shouldn't worry about it. Most people will understand that it's pilot error no matter what the original posters statements are


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## mness

bbrews123 said:


> I appreciate that bikesdirect.com issues a disclaimer that one "might" want to go to a LBS for set up / tune up (but it's not necessary). However, it is my opinion that if this is effectively required, it should be explicitly stated and accompanied by a price reduction.


From the BD website:
Your bike either road, mountain bike or cruiser or other type of bike comes appx. 90% assembled and then packed for shipment directly from the factory *[Ed: BD never opens the box, thus never sees, sets up, adjusts, or does quality inspection of the bike you get]*. Although re-assembly is quite simple, we *strongly suggest that you have your local bike shop do this for you* since some final adjustments may be necessary due to being shipped directly from the factory. (Most any dealer will offer this service for a minimal charge. It’s only a few minutes work.)

As for the price reduction? As you said, you got a bike for $899 that's allegedly comparable to a $2000 Trek. There's your price reduction for buying over the internet and being responsible to assemble it yourself (or pay for a professional to). If you wanted someone to personally review the assembly and guarantee that it was ready to ride, you should have bought at an LBS.


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## AJL

highendbikedeals said:


> They shouldn't worry about it. Most people will understand that it's pilot error no matter what the original posters statements are


I'm not so sure. Does BD's warranty policy state that they are not responsible for component failures? It looks like a component failure to me, not simple an 'adjustment' problem. Look at the RD, the metal around the jockey wheel is torn apart. It looks like a material defect - there is no way for this to happen just down shifting on the flat. If anything, the RD might have been bent - but not blown to pieces.


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## dr4cats

Bought my Tarmac Comp at LBS. Within 1500 miles (6 weeks) the chain was so stretched it had to be replaced at MY expense. After 5000 miles (less than 6 months), head bearings were shot...had to replace them at MY expense = labor......so much for LBS and manufacturer's "warranty".

This bicycling stuff is only a "hobby"; so you're gonna pay...no matter what.


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## highendbikedeals

AJL said:


> I'm not so sure. Does BD's warranty policy state that they are not responsible for component failures? It looks like a component failure to me, not simple an 'adjustment' problem. Look at the RD, the metal around the jockey wheel is torn apart. It looks like a material defect - there is no way for this to happen just down shifting on the flat. If anything, the RD might have been bent - but not blown to pieces.


Very rare for Shimano to fall apart JRA. Usually when customers come in the store with a catastrophic component failure, they were Just Riding Along and... When you get to the bottom of it, there is always more to the story. I would guess that the story here is a misadjusted bike that didn't fare so well. Nobody wants to pay. But hey - lesson learned. If I made the decision at bikesdirect.com, I would tell this guy the EXACT same thing. If he brought it into the shop I would tell him the EXACT same thing. PILOT ERROR


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## johnny dollar

THIS



desurfer said:


> If something isn't adjusted correctly, it doesn't then magically work if you only use it briefly. It's either set up properly, or it isn't.


everything else is just sour grapes.

/thread.


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## PlatyPius

dr4cats said:


> Bought my Tarmac Comp at LBS. Within 1500 miles (6 weeks) the chain was so stretched it had to be replaced at MY expense. After 5000 miles (less than 6 months), head bearings were shot...had to replace them at MY expense = labor......so much for LBS and manufacturer's "warranty".
> 
> This bicycling stuff is only a "hobby"; so you're gonna pay...no matter what.


Wear items aren't covered by warranty.

That would like going into an auto dealership and *****ing that your brake pads had worn out after "only" 20,000 miles (in 9 months) and you wanted them replaced under warranty.

Otherwise known as the Eternal Cake theory. You eat the cake, but the cake never diminishes.

Bike chains are a wear item. Bearings are a wear item. So are grips, tape, saddles, derailleur pulleys, cables, brake pads, etc.


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## Local Hero

bbrews123 said:


> assembly was easy -- attach handle bars/front tire/seat.


That's the assembly required for a single speed. You bought a bike with gears. 

I'm sorry that this isn't what you wanted to hear. But it sounds like this problem could have been avoided if you let someone tune the bike for you. I've bought bikes online and always asked a friend--a professional who manages the service department at the LBS--to tune them for me. I do the grunt work (attach bars/front tire/seat) and let him do the finishing touches on the components. Then a few weeks later I get another once over, as cables tend to stretch. 

If I were you I would send that rear der to shimano with a very nice letter saying that you were "Just riding along and blammo" and ask if they can repair or replace it at cost. Leave your contact info so they can call you if needed. They may just mail you a new one. 

Good luck.


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## tconrady

PlatyPius said:


> Wear items aren't covered by warranty.
> 
> That would like going into an auto dealership and *****ing that your brake pads had worn out after "only" 20,000 miles (in 9 months) and you wanted them replaced under warranty.
> 
> Otherwise known as the Eternal Cake theory. You eat the cake, but the cake never diminishes.
> 
> Bike chains are a wear item. Bearings are a wear item. So are grips, tape, saddles, derailleur pulleys, cables, brake pads, etc.


Where are my warranty replacement tires [email protected]!


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## redondoaveb

bbrews123 said:


> highendbikedeals: I took another look at bikesdirect.com for the parameters that state we're selling you a maladjusted bike or crappy components. I couldn't seem to find that passage or the one about required expertise before purchase. I'll keep looking.
> 
> I did find this little bit though on their "satisfaction guarantee": "We know you will be happy with your bike. If for any reason you are not*, let us know and we'll make it right or you may return it."
> 
> To yours & everyone's general point, I should have been more skeptical about the purchase and done a greater check on the bike: you're right. The purpose of my post on here is to warn other potential purchasers so they don't make the same costly mistake.


 I wonder what would happen if you sent it back and said "here is your broken bike back, I'm not happy"?


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## Richard

Bikesdirect gets the bike in the box from Asia and ships it directly to the purchaser. They don't even look in the box.

We get bikes from our suppliers the same way. And we see more than a few that need some major attention, and this is from reputable manufacturers/importers. Having to align rear derailleur hangers is hardly uncommon. Front and rear derailleurs are NEVER right out of the box, whether it's the stops or adjustment. Wheels often need truing. Headsets are frequently loose.

And prior to the industry going to "toolless" chain connectors, we saw more than a few new chains a$$plode.

Looking at the damage, I'd say that chain separation was the precipitating cause.


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## Local Hero

AJL said:


> BD should have sent you a new derailleur and chain - simply because the cost of shipping you new components will be less than the sales they'll lose from this post..


I understand what you're saying but I don't know if I completely agree with it. 

BD's policies keep prices low for everyone; no need to kowtow to the loudmouths and reward internet bully behavior.


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## fab4

I'm thinking the chain was installed improperly in the factory causing it to snap and break the rear derailleur.


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## desurfer

PlatyPius said:


> Wear items aren't covered by warranty.
> 
> That would like going into an auto dealership and *****ing that your brake pads had worn out after "only" 20,000 miles (in 9 months) and you wanted them replaced under warranty.
> 
> Otherwise known as the Eternal Cake theory. You eat the cake, but the cake never diminishes.
> 
> Bike chains are a wear item. Bearings are a wear item. So are grips, tape, saddles, derailleur pulleys, cables, brake pads, etc.


You had me at Eternal Cake. Nom nom nom...


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## 41ants

Wow, are you serious... Do you really think that is the case? That is a very bold and presumptuous statement



bbrews123 said:


> *OR they sent me a bike with crappy (counterfeit?) components that blew up before ten miles ridden*.


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## highendbikedeals

fab4 said:


> I'm thinking the chain was installed improperly in the factory causing it to snap and break the rear derailleur.


Maybee... 

His local BS could have looked at that during setup.


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## hrumpole

bbrews123 said:


> Bocephus Jones II: I couldn't agree more. Perhaps the site is more appropriate for a buyer with more expertise. But I'd hazard a guess that most purchasers from bikesdirect.com are first time buyers. From my own experience, I was definitely put off by the $1000 / $2000 price tag of buying from a local shop. That's why BD seemed like such a great alternative -- a first time buyer could get a bike w/ great components for relatively little money.


This. 

But it isn't. Caveat emptor.


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## bbrews123

A general response to the many replies:

As I said on an earlier thread, I appreciate this isn't the end of the world. It's a few hundred dollars either way. My purpose in posting was to inform potential buyers that it isn't as easy as BD suggests and that one should consider things other than price when purchasing -- like the service from a LBS. 

To the skepticism I was "just riding along" Believe it or not, it's true. I was commuting home from work, in a suit -- so all and all a pretty relaxed ride on a flat road. 

Many have suggested it was a bent / maladjusted hanger that was the problem and I am responsible for that. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the thinking behind that explanation is that the bent RD contacted the spokes causing the problem. That categorically did not happen. There is NO damage to any of the rear spokes. Have pictures, I'd be happy to sure. 

To the suggestion I'm an "internet bully" (really?) unfairly beating up on BD in order to fulfill my master plan of free tires and parts for life (insert diabolical laugh). That is ridiculous and stupid. I'm not asking for the world, I simply expect bikesdirect.com to comport themselves with the same standards as any normal business.

Again, this is my motivation for posting, I don't think it's unreasonable or irresponsible: "My purpose in posting was to inform potential buyers that it isn't as easy as BD suggests and that one should consider things other than price when purchasing -- like the service from a LBS."


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## bbrews123

41ants:

Quote: 
Wow, are you serious... Do you really think that is the case? That is a very bold and presumptuous statement

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbrews123
OR they sent me a bike with crappy (counterfeit?) components that blew up before ten miles ridden.

No, that was me being overly provocative. Realistically there's an infinitesimal chance the components were fraudulent. But as some other poster mentioned, it is very strange that brand new Shimano components blew up in such a manner with basically no wear. Just thinking outside the box for an explanation.


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## PlatyPius

I think we need to see the chain before we can even begin to figure out why his derailleur exploded.


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## AJL

PlatyPius said:


> I think we need to see the chain before we can even begin to figure out why his derailleur exploded.


Good idea. In the absence of any other damage to the bike, it's tough to explain this:










The force required to break the aluminum, as show in this pic, would be pretty dang high - unless there was a defect.


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## PlatyPius

AJL said:


> Good idea. In the absence of any other damage to the bike, it's tough to explain this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The force required to break the aluminum, as show in this pic, would be pretty dang high - unless there was a defect.


I'm sure that, sometimes, to save money and make the low prices possible BD (Ideal/Fuji/Kinesis/or whomever builds this one) uses older components. I'm wondering if the factory used one of the Shimano "death chains" that were exploding from a bad supply of steel.


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## bbrews123

I've uploaded an image of the broken section of chain (along with a partial image of the derailleur hanger break). Sorry about the picture quality, the size limit wouldn't accept my original picture. 

Also, just so everyone who is still reading is aware, I've updated and slightly edited the original post. I heard back from BD and they are willing to accept it may have been a chain malfunction -- leading the the derailleur break. 

As such, they are going to ship me a replacement for free and I'll take care of everything else. I edited the post slightly to tamp down some of my overly negative language (in that original post) that was a result of frustration. Since they did right by me, it no longer seemed appropriate to criticize the customer service to the extend I previously had.


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## PlatyPius

The chain came apart at the super-special Shimano joining pin. The pin either failed, or was installed improperly. The other plate bent and caught the derailleur, causing it to explode.


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## Bocephus Jones II

PlatyPius said:


> The other plate bent and caught the derailleur, causing it to explode.


I bet it was crabon fibre. :smilewinkgrin:


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## Camilo

bbrews123 said:


> ...
> Again, this is my motivation for posting, I don't think it's unreasonable or irresponsible: "My purpose in posting was to inform potential buyers that it isn't as easy as BD suggests and that one should consider things other than price when purchasing -- like the service from a LBS."


Actually it is irresponsible since your original post heading used the word *rip off*, when in reality, you simply did not understand what you were being sold, although it's very clear from their product information and business model.

I probably should just keep my mouth shut, but this is just not true. As someone else posted earlier, how could this be more clear? 

_Although re-assembly is quite simple, we strongly suggest that you have your local bike shop do this for you since some final adjustments may be necessary due to being shipped directly from the factory. _

Just because you didn't understand it doesn't mean they are suggesting it's easy. 

By the way, I am not a Bikes Direct customer, but it just rubs me the wrong way when any company is criticized publicly, unfairly.


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## AJL

PlatyPius said:


> The chain came apart at the super-special Shimano joining pin. The pin either failed, or was installed improperly. The other plate bent and caught the derailleur, causing it to explode.


Good eye Platy. This explains a lot. I can't imagine a mis-adjusted RD breaking a chain in 40 miles unless it was nearly impossible to shift.



bbrews123 said:


> Also, just so everyone who is still reading is aware, I've updated and slightly edited the original post. I heard back from BD and they are willing to accept it may have been a chain malfunction -- leading the the derailleur break.
> 
> As such, they are going to ship me a replacement for free and I'll take care of everything else. I edited the post slightly to tamp down some of my overly negative language (in that original post) that was a result of frustration. Since they did right by me, it no longer seemed appropriate to criticize the customer service to the extend I previously had.


Well this is really good news. Nice to see BD step up to the plate - a willingness to accept that it's a possible material/labor defect goes along way in terms of providing an appropriate level of confidence in potential customers. And good for you bbrews for being persistent.

To happy endings :thumbsup:


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## tconrady

Camilo said:


> Actually it is irresponsible since your original post heading used the word *rip off*, when in reality, you simply did not understand what you were being sold, although it's very clear from their product information and business model.
> 
> I probably should just keep my mouth shut, but this is just not true. As someone else posted earlier, how could this be more clear?
> 
> _Although re-assembly is quite simple, we strongly suggest that you have your local bike shop do this for you since some final adjustments may be necessary due to being shipped directly from the factory. _
> 
> Just because you didn't understand it doesn't mean they are suggesting it's easy.
> 
> By the way, I am not a Bikes Direct customer, but it just rubs me the wrong way when any company is criticized publicly, unfairly.


And this thread will be stuck in Interwebs for some time and viewable whenever somebody googles BikesDirect and ripoff.


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## bbrews123

Camilo / tconrady: Camilo, as you may have seen from the remainder of the conversation, the damage was not because, I "simply did not understand what you were being sold." Instead, it was (almost certainly) due to a faulty chain.

To yours and tconrady's point about this thread being alive on the internet even after the problem was resolved: I'm sorry. I amended my initial post, and tried to change the title (click on my very first post now, it will read differently). While being frustrated with the situation, I wrote an overly harsh post. As the situation as now changed, I've taken what steps I can so that the conclusion of what happened accurately reflects a much more positive outcome. Internet lessons learned this week: buyer beware / the internet is forever. 

I took steps to write about BD when I was unhappy with their product. I will hopefully have many occasions to write positively about BD as I enjoy my bike for years to come.


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## AJL

Too bad RBR doesn't have shop reviews like mntbikereview does. Or have I just missed it?


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## jswilson64

As a former LBS mechanic whose primary duty was to do new-bike buildups, I think most people don't understand what a *good* bike shop will do when they open the box.

What we used to do included (maybe not in this order):
Open box, unpack, inspect for damage and anything missing.
Install everything that's not installed.
Pull both wheels, adjust bearings, unwind spokes, and re-true wheels. 
Adjust bb and headset bearings. 
Tighten cranks.
Reinstall wheels, adjust brakes. 
Clean the shipping grease off the chain and properly lube it. Check for tight links.
Adjust front and rear derailleurs.
Trim excess cable, re-cap cut ends.
Test ride, re-adjust anything that's out of whack.
Probably some more stuff I'm forgetting now. 
Once all that was done, *then* put on the shop sticker.  

Some of the bearing adjustments aren't as finicky now, but there's still a lot to do to get an out-of-the-box bike really ready for someone to ride it.


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## Bocephus Jones II

jswilson64 said:


> As a former LBS mechanic whose primary duty was to do new-bike buildups, I think most people don't understand what a *good* bike shop will do when they open the box.
> 
> What we used to do included (maybe not in this order):
> Open box, unpack, inspect for damage and anything missing.
> Install everything that's not installed.
> Pull both wheels, adjust bearings, unwind spokes, and re-true wheels.
> Adjust bb and headset bearings.
> Tighten cranks.
> Reinstall wheels, adjust brakes.
> Clean the shipping grease off the chain and properly lube it. Check for tight links.
> Adjust front and rear derailleurs.
> Trim excess cable, re-cap cut ends.
> Test ride, re-adjust anything that's out of whack.
> Probably some more stuff I'm forgetting now.
> Once all that was done, *then* put on the shop sticker.
> 
> Some of the bearing adjustments aren't as finicky now, but there's still a lot to do to get an out-of-the-box bike really ready for someone to ride it.


No chase and face the BB?


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## jswilson64

Bocephus Jones II said:


> No chase and face the BB?


Only on a bare-frame build-up.


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## BizzaBoy

AJL said:


> Good idea. In the absence of any other damage to the bike, it's tough to explain this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The force required to break the aluminum, as show in this pic, would be pretty dang high - unless there was a defect.


I've been looking at this image for quite a while now. Got a Pro 30 (actually my daughter). This looks scary. 

I had a chain explode on me on a older 6500. No damage to the rear derailer, just to my leg where the chain hit ;-) And yes, it was my own fault because I played with the special pin while shortening the chain .... I'd buy that the derailer hits the spokes and goes foul. But this kind of damage would imply a few slightly bend spokes to say at least, or at least a substantially bend hanger (which should be more bendable to begin with). 

Is there a chance that you hit something with the rear derailor earlier on (maybe not on the same day) that might have cause the fracture in the derailor ? If it happened during shipping, there should have been visible damage on the box.

Guess I am blabbeling along here, because I am concerned for the safety of my daugther. Will not help me ... riding blue slicks on rainy days ;-)


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## bbrews123

BizzaBoy said:


> I've been looking at this image for quite a while now. Got a Pro 30 (actually my daughter). This looks scary.
> 
> I had a chain explode on me on a older 6500. No damage to the rear derailer, just to my leg where the chain hit ;-) And yes, it was my own fault because I played with the special pin while shortening the chain .... I'd buy that the derailer hits the spokes and goes foul. But this kind of damage would imply a few slightly bend spokes to say at least, or at least a substantially bend hanger (which should be more bendable to begin with).
> 
> Is there a chance that you hit something with the rear derailor earlier on (maybe not on the same day) that might have cause the fracture in the derailor ? If it happened during shipping, there should have been visible damage on the box.
> 
> Guess I am blabbeling along here, because I am concerned for the safety of my daugther. Will not help me ... riding blue slicks on rainy days ;-)


I can not think of an instance where there was contact with the RD. The only possibility is if someone knocked into it when the bike was locked up while I was at work. (The box with the bike arrived in excellent condition). That said, after my initial post on here where so many suggested the damage was caused by a misaligned RD I went home and meticulously inspected the real wheel spokes -- finding no damage what so ever. 

As to your concern about your daughters safety, when the damage occurred -- presumably because of the chain break -- I was not hurt in the slightest. My very-non-expert opinion is that since it happened with so little wear it was just a bad part and an isolated incident. 

As for the resolution, as I hope you saw, things worked out well in the end and I am happy to report I got the confirmation UPS shipping notification that the replacement parts are on the way.

Hope your daughter enjoys her bike and you (or me) don't have any more chain malfunctions!


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## drutah

Has anyone had similar problems with single speed/fixed gear bikes from BD (a quick gloss of this thread suggests many of the problems, though not all, were with derailleurs)? Headsets needing tightening, checking BB, and wheels seem to be things you should check given that the bike was shipped. Again, still new to all of this.


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## PlatyPius

drutah said:


> Has anyone had similar problems with single speed/fixed gear bikes from BD (a quick gloss of this thread suggests many of the problems, though not all, were with derailleurs)? Headsets needing tightening, checking BB, and wheels seem to be things you should check given that the bike was shipped. Again, still new to all of this.


BD bikes arrive just like any bike that shows up at a bike shop. Assume NOTHING is assembled properly. This is one of the reasons bike shops deserve to make money either selling their own bikes or assembling yours - it isn't just "remove from box, install handlebar, and ride."

At the shop, I pull the fork and grease the hell out of the headset bearings (unless they're sealed). I pull the BB and grease that to reduce creaks later. Stem bolts are removed and greased. Wheels are trued and often tensioned properly. If the hubs aren't cartridge bearing hubs, the bearings are greased.

These aren't "problems", they're just the way all bikes arrive. It's the price for having bikes assembled by mostly unskilled labourers in Asia.


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## AJL

PlatyPius said:


> BD bikes arrive just like any bike that shows up at a bike shop. Assume NOTHING is assembled properly. This is one of the reasons bike shops deserve to make money either selling their own bikes or assembling yours - it isn't just "remove from box, install handlebar, and ride."
> 
> At the shop, I pull the fork and grease the hell out of the headset bearings (unless they're sealed). I pull the BB and grease that to reduce creaks later. Stem bolts are removed and greased. Wheels are trued and often tensioned properly. If the hubs aren't cartridge bearing hubs, the bearings are greased.
> 
> These aren't "problems", they're just the way all bikes arrive. It's the price for having bikes assembled by mostly unskilled labourers in Asia.


Definitely true. Sometimes I hang out for a while with the mechanics at my LBS, especially if I've hit something hard and need a wheel true (I only adjust small out-of-true problems). They put allot of work into setting up new bikes properly. As Platy alludes to, an LBS is more likely to have repeat business if the customer has a good experience. The starts with have a bike that shifts and handles well during the test ride. And not having to come back in 90 days because of squeaks, brake rub, etc.

The LBS I originally bought my bike from lost my business because: a) they screwed up my 30 day tune of (mainly for cable stretch) and my shifting went to hell and b) returning the wrong pedals to me after I had them installed clipless pedals on my bike - I was going to put the old pedals on another bike. They've probably lost out on $1k in upgrade parts, accessories and repairs.


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## Local Hero

drutah said:


> Has anyone had similar problems with single speed/fixed gear bikes from BD (a quick gloss of this thread suggests many of the problems, though not all, were with derailleurs)? Headsets needing tightening, checking BB, and wheels seem to be things you should check given that the bike was shipped. Again, still new to all of this.


The saddle/seatpost combo on my team track was bad (the Thompson bolt made contact with the bottom of the saddle).

Aside from that everything works perfectly. I race my team track at the velodrome at least once a week.

Here's a link to my review of the Team Track: http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=228157


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## robpar

bbrews123 said:


> Camilo: It's not that I don't want to hear what you guys are saying. I guess I just have a different perspective on what was sold / the expectation of bike expertise being explicitly required (it's not).
> 
> As for your "facts," I don't concede that the problem was improper adjustment or a bent derailleur hanger. Perhaps those could be true, but I'd add faulty components to the list.
> 
> To your assertion that it is completely the buyers responsibility to adjust everything, I'd slightly disagree with that. I've copied the instructions / from my receipt of purchase email that describes the level of expertise / assembly required:
> 
> "Be sure to tighten all parts and check adjustments prior to riding.
> Even parts that arrive pre-installed should be tightened and adjusted.
> Most bikes are shipped knocked down with pedals (if included), handlebars, seat, and front wheel off.
> The brakes and derailleurs will need some minor adjustment, sometimes wheels need minor truing.
> It takes most about 25 minutes to setup a factory direct bike.
> It is very easy to do; but most customers like to take their time and spend about an hour on setup.
> 
> I DID tighten all parts and check to make sure nothing was grossly out of whack before I rode it. And if you think a complete blow up of the rear derailleur would have been prevented by "some minor adjustment," that's your opinion but I'd disagree.
> 
> In any case, read those directions / warning and tell me if it suggests to you complex bike assembly expertise is required. I (to my determent) did not read it that way.


I've been lurking around and observing all the varied responses...

"Be sure to tighten all parts and CHECK ADJUSTMENTS prior to riding".

Did you check the bike by running through all the gears FD and RD?
Did you adjust the RD and re-test?
Did you adjust the FD and re-test?
Did you make adjustments until everything was shifting correctly?


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## jgrabowmst

Having gotten my Motobecane from BD and also having put 100 miles on it, I have to say, I don't think they are a bad dealer. I'm not sure I would call them reputable, and I don't know if I would suggest all my friends buy from there, but I have to agree with a lot of people on here.

If you aren't 100% sure you did all the work right, get it double checked. I had to do lots of tweaking to get my FD shifting right, and I also had to tighten the cable on the rear just a hair. I don't feel like I know bikes as well as a LBS, but I'm more than capable of working on my old Prince, and my new Motobecane is no different. Once it's together, that means it's time to flip it over and start testing the FD/RD until they hit all the gears as they're supposed to. Not once it twice, but over and over and over.

Adjusting the breaks is do different. Cleaning the chain and greasing it is no different.

I bought a car, and it made a sound, and I didn't take it back within the warranty period. The dealer's not at fault, they gave me a warranty period, and I ignored it. Bikes Direct doesn't have a warranty, but if you have a problem right away, or something isn't working right, you let them know, and they help you out. You put the handlebars and wheels on, and jump on for a 10 mile ride, and you skipped 95% of the assembly process.


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## mopartodd

Really it is a good idea to double check any new bike for proper tightening and adjustment, if you know how to...I can't trust anyone.


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## GoodSpeed

*Warranty from Bikes Direct*

If I buy a Motobecane and its assembled by my LBS does the warranty from Motobecane's web site apply?


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## Brian_D

Glad to hear you/they resolved the issue satisfactorily. I'm quite certain you'll enjoy the heck out of it, and we'll all be calling you a shill.


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## SNOWBOARD9

*Cheap-Giant-Bikes.com*

Cheap-Giant-Bikes.com.... Does anyone have any experience purchasing from this site? I think it is a scam with 30% off pricing, no warranties, and English typo's throughput the site. No address info or phone either. Sounds like SCAM to me..:mad2:


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## votoms888

jswilson64 said:


> As a former LBS mechanic whose primary duty was to do new-bike buildups, I think most people don't understand what a *good* bike shop will do when they open the box.
> 
> What we used to do included (maybe not in this order):
> Open box, unpack, inspect for damage and anything missing.
> Install everything that's not installed.
> Pull both wheels, adjust bearings, unwind spokes, and re-true wheels.
> Adjust bb and headset bearings.
> Tighten cranks.
> Reinstall wheels, adjust brakes.
> Clean the shipping grease off the chain and properly lube it. Check for tight links.
> Adjust front and rear derailleurs.
> Trim excess cable, re-cap cut ends.
> Test ride, re-adjust anything that's out of whack.
> Probably some more stuff I'm forgetting now.
> Once all that was done, *then* put on the shop sticker.
> 
> Some of the bearing adjustments aren't as finicky now, but there's still a lot to do to get an out-of-the-box bike really ready for someone to ride it.


In automotive terms, this is what gets charged as PDI or dealer prep. =D


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