# Best current mini-V?



## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Looking to swap out my Paul Neo Retro front for something with more power for some the steep gravel descents I have been doing. Something with a QR built in would be great. Fork is an Edge Carbon CX if it matters. Sram Red shifting currently.

Thoughts? 

Rear is set-up Paul specific so probably stuck with that.


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## LC (Jan 28, 2004)

You could spend alot more for bling on the TRP CX8.4 but the Tektro 926AL functionally works just as well if you add an adjustable noodle.


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## danl1 (Jul 23, 2005)

Coolhand said:


> Looking to swap out my Paul Neo Retro front for something with more power for some the steep gravel descents I have been doing. Something with a QR built in would be great. Fork is an Edge Carbon CX if it matters. Sram Red shifting currently.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> Rear is set-up Paul specific so probably stuck with that.


I don't have the answer, but hoping someone can chime in with info on the Paul Minimoto.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

I run the TRP CX9 andlove them. Awesome brake.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

Another vote for CX 9's. They work very well and their finish makes them look at home with nicer road groups. If I didn't know better, I'd think they were calipers.


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## LC (Jan 28, 2004)

CX9 is for new Shimano brake pull, 90mm length arms
CX8.4 for SRAM/Campy and older Shimano is 84mm
926AL is 85mm so basically the same as CX8.4


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## limba (Mar 10, 2004)

Yeah, you might want to check out the new Paul Mini. No idea if it's any good. You'll probably be the first to try it.


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## krisdrum (Oct 29, 2007)

LC said:


> CX9 is for new Shimano brake pull, 90mm length arms
> CX8.4 for SRAM/Campy and older Shimano is 84mm
> 926AL is 85mm so basically the same as CX8.4


926 is an 80mm arm, so shorter than the cx8.4, giving more pad clearance, but a bit less power.


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## SByota (Nov 8, 2011)

Another CX9 user here. My TRP Euro X's were ok, but the CX9's are on another level. No regrets on switching to them.


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## acg (Feb 13, 2011)

Ditto on the CX8.4. Stops as well as the Record brakes on my road bike.... maybe even better!


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## rearviewmirror (Aug 20, 2008)

The TRP's are great! They may be more expensive, but it's not like their a wear item, buy once and enjoy!


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Thanks all, I ordered the TRP CX8.4 as that's what TRP is recommending for SRAM users.


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## pretender (Sep 18, 2007)

My buddy runs 8.4's and loves them. They look really sharp, too.


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## myko (Oct 26, 2010)

I have both 8.4 and 9's...you will love them.


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## batman1425 (Nov 29, 2005)

Slightly off topic, but is there clearance for fenders with the 8.4's?


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## GRAVELBIKE (Sep 16, 2011)

batman1425 said:


> Slightly off topic, but is there clearance for fenders with the 8.4's?


It depends on the size of the tires, brake boss placement, etc. I tried 8.4s with 650x38B tires, and there was barely enough clearance for just the tire.


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## Agnmph (Oct 25, 2011)

The Paul mini moto is a great brake, at least on my bike, which I use for road riding, commuting, and occasional "gravel grinding"..

I replaced a Tektro R6 mini-V on the front of my Lynskey ProCross (Alpha Q CX 10 fork; Shimano Ultegra 6700 levers; Mavic CXP33 and, sometimes, A719 rims; Continental 28mm GP 4-seasons tyres and, sometimes, Schwalbe Marathon 28mm tyres; Shimano cables & housing) with a mini-moto. 

The Tektro has, I think, 90mm arms, and is similar to the TRP 9.0 (its arms appear to be almost identical; I suspect springs & accoutrements are of lesser quality--I've only been able to glance at the TRP brakes on someone else's bike). The Tektro is not a bad brake, it's reasonably powerful. It's certainly *much* more powerful and useful than the Avid Ultimate cantilever brake (set up in narrow stance)I used it to replace. At least with my setup. 

The Avid's stopping power, both with its original pads and with salmon Kool-Stop pads, was only notional when braking from the tops, and just okay from the drops. And before anyone writes to me about cable lengths and cantilever adjustment, please know that I've worked on bikes with cantilevers of all types, brands, and models for nearly 40 years. After I had done my best with them, I had their setup checked and tweaked by a highly experienced and well-regarded racing mechanic--with the same result. The Avid's are well made, easy to adjust, and have smooth modulation. However, on *my* bike, with *my* components, they were less powerful than the Tektro CX720 cantilevers I have on another bike (with a different type of lever) and for my purposes almost dangerously useless in the wet. They were *almost* acceptable when I added Cane Creek CX levers to the bars, but I don't like braking from a position so close to the centre of the bars. I add that as I have incipient arthritis in my hands, my hand strength from the tops is sometimes weaker than I'd like. I suspect the type and pull of lever is crucial to these brakes.

In terms of raw stopping power, the Tektro brakes were strong from the tops and excellent from the drops. They worked well with Kool-Stop salmon pads. But I had to run the pads extremely close to the rims and use high spring tension on one side of the brake in order to keep the arms centered. Their modulation was a *little* on-off, but more than acceptable. I had to keep a close eye on their adjustment. They had more power than the Tektro CX720 cantilevers and lots more than the Avids. Eventually, one of the spring-tension screws threaded (paradoxically, not the side that was highly tensioned) on the front brake. I think they're very good brakes for the price.

In comparison, using the same bike, fork, levers, and rims, the mini-moto is well made, powerful, and well modulated in both dry and wet conditions from the tops or the drops. The brakes have a sharply defined sculptural, CNCish shape and are well finished. In the dry, they are powerful enough to throw me over the handlebars from the tops. In the wet, they stop quickly and surely. They have a light feel at the lever, and are easy to modulate. The pads run much wider than on either the Tektro or the Avids. The noodle and barrel adjuster are easy to use. The quick release is simple, effective, and efficient. I'm using the supplied salmon Kool-Stop one-piece long pads.These brakes are a pleasure; I also think they look good, but that's irrelevant. I'd been contemplating getting a disc brake for my front brake; I'm now reconsidering since these are so good. 

Using the aforementioned rims & tyres, the distance from the tyre to the horizontal cable is 26mm.


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## Erik_A (Sep 14, 2008)

great info, thanks


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## Agnmph (Oct 25, 2011)

Erik, you're welcome. Please note my caveats about it being *my* experience with *my* particular set-up. I can't speak for anyone else. What I find 'well-modulated' with the lengths of cable & housing on *my* bike, someone else may either not be able to exactly replicate or, if they can, think it hopeless anyway! Many reviews fail to take account of context, conditions, and subjectivities; there're so many variables it's often difficult to get meaningful 'data'. I try to offer as much information as I can so people can compare like with like (or unlike) and make up their own minds. Best.


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## nhluhr (Sep 9, 2010)

LC said:


> CX9 is for new Shimano brake pull, 90mm length arms
> CX8.4 for SRAM/Campy and older Shimano is 84mm
> 926AL is 85mm so basically the same as CX8.4


I just put CX9's on my JakeTheSnake (which has 5700 "new" shimano levers) and I would absolutely recommend doing the 8.4s instead. Currently, they have too much power and I wouldn't mind a little more pad clearance.

I am also running Shimano housings/cables (as opposed to the stock low-end Jagwire stuff which was pretty mushy).

When I say "too much power" I mean that it is significantly more powerful than my Dura-Ace caliper'd road bike. Whereas the stock Avid Shorty 6 cantilevers were pitifully weak, these are just too strong. I would like them to more closely match the power of my road bike so I think the CX8.4 are the ticket, even with "new" Shimano levers.


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## nhluhr (Sep 9, 2010)

batman1425 said:


> Slightly off topic, but is there clearance for fenders with the 8.4's?


Here is the clearance on my '12 JakeTheSnake with the CX9 (which should have 6mm MORE clearance than the CX8.4)


















Keep in mind, I'm running 700x28 road tires with SKS P35 fenders in this photo. To run 700x35 CX tires and requisite wider (P45?) fenders, I seriously doubt if there would be enough space under the CX8.4 but I think I could pull it off with the CX9 as installed.


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## cruzer75 (Mar 10, 2006)

I have the 926a on my CAAD8 cx bike. No problems stopping, but I would hope the springs and setup is better on the TRP versions. Running 3 compound koolstop with no problems. On thing I do have issues with is getting my A23s and PDX tide out of the front if it is inflated...this is more an issue of fork width and pad clearance.

One thing I like no matter is that I can stop with no problems. Pull the levers and I stop. Modulation is ok 

I will probably get the TRP brakes at some point....


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## urbiksux (Apr 7, 2010)

I have Shimano 5700 105 SLR levers. I am using TRP 8.4s with Jagwire compressionless housing. It still feels a little mushy. I have read that the 5700/8.4 will have a very firm feel when squeezing the lever, which does not seem to ring true. Can anyone compare mushiness at the lever with 5700 levers and 8.4 v. 9.0 TRP mini Vs? Should I go 9.0 TRP or Paul Mini-Moto for a nice firm lever feel when the pads contact the rims? Thanks.


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## Erik_A (Sep 14, 2008)

Can you run the pads closer to the rim?



urbiksux said:


> I have Shimano 5700 105 SLR levers. I am using TRP 8.4s with Jagwire compressionless housing. It still feels a little mushy. I have read that the 5700/8.4 will have a very firm feel when squeezing the lever, which does not seem to ring true. Can anyone compare mushiness at the lever with 5700 levers and 8.4 v. 9.0 TRP mini Vs? Should I go 9.0 TRP or Paul Mini-Moto for a nice firm lever feel when the pads contact the rims? Thanks.


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## urbiksux (Apr 7, 2010)

I might can put em back on and get that clearance tiiiight. Thanks for the suggestion.


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## Gilarider (Jan 11, 2011)

urbiksux said:


> I have Shimano 5700 105 SLR levers. I am using TRP 8.4s with Jagwire compressionless housing. It still feels a little mushy. I have read that the 5700/8.4 will have a very firm feel when squeezing the lever, which does not seem to ring true. Can anyone compare mushiness at the lever with 5700 levers and 8.4 v. 9.0 TRP mini Vs? Should I go 9.0 TRP or Paul Mini-Moto for a nice firm lever feel when the pads contact the rims? Thanks.


I think "a little mushy" is actually pretty firm for v brakes and road levers, so what you read could just be meaning that relative to some other brakes they are firmer. Unless your pads aren't contacting the rim flat, or just a little toed in, that mushiness is probably just leverage, which is good.

9.0 have longer arms so will be mushier and I don't know the length of the Paul's but I bet they aren't shorter than what you have and probably will feel pretty similar. Shorter brake arms will feel firmer, like some 80mm armed bmx brakes. 

If the washers holding your brake pads on the arms are like all other v brakes there is a thick conical female washer on one side and a thin washer on the other side of the brake arm slot-make sure the thick one is installed closest to the rim/brake pad. The point of this is to make the arms a little farther apart and they will feel a little firmer. Putting on thicker brake pads, and harder brake pads will help too. All of these things give you less braking power, though, so maybe you could get used to the feel.


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## krisdrum (Oct 29, 2007)

Gilarider said:


> I think "a little mushy" is actually pretty firm for v brakes and road levers, so what you read could just be meaning that relative to some other brakes they are firmer. Unless your pads aren't contacting the rim flat, or just a little toed in, that mushiness is probably just leverage, which is good.
> 
> 9.0 have longer arms so will be mushier and I don't know the length of the Paul's but I bet they aren't shorter than what you have and probably will feel pretty similar. Shorter brake arms will feel firmer, like some 80mm armed bmx brakes.
> 
> If the washers holding your brake pads on the arms are like all other v brakes there is a thick conical female washer on one side and a thin washer on the other side of the brake arm slot-make sure the thick one is installed closest to the rim/brake pad. The point of this is to make the arms a little farther apart and they will feel a little firmer. Putting on thicker brake pads, and harder brake pads will help too. All of these things give you less braking power, though, so maybe you could get used to the feel.


Interesting. Not to derail the conversation, but this is good information on the distance of the pad from the arm. I went with the shortest armed v's I could find (The Tektro 926, at I think 75mm). I also swapped the washers so the thinnest one was between the pad and arm, as I was looking to maximize mud clearance and give myself a bit more space to avoid brake rub, etc.

I never even thought through the leverage implications of such a switch. So if I switch the washers back, I'll reduce my pad to rim clearance and power, but hopefully get a firmer lever feel? Might have to give that a try, although I have been trying to get used to the more vague lever feel.


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## Gilarider (Jan 11, 2011)

krisdrum said:


> Interesting. Not to derail the conversation, but this is good information on the distance of the pad from the arm. I went with the shortest armed v's I could find (The Tektro 926, at I think 75mm). I also swapped the washers so the thinnest one was between the pad and arm, as I was looking to maximize mud clearance and give myself a bit more space to avoid brake rub, etc.
> 
> I never even thought through the leverage implications of such a switch. So if I switch the washers back, I'll reduce my pad to rim clearance and power, but hopefully get a firmer lever feel? Might have to give that a try, although I have been trying to get used to the more vague lever feel.


If you switch the washers back you will reduce your pad to rim clearance until you let out a little cable to make up for it, which you should do, but that is kind of not the point. What you are really doing is setting the brakes arms up wider which makes them slightly less "tall" in the vertical plane and more like vertically "short" cantilevers, which feel firm, but have no power. 

Think of switching the washers around like switching the avid shorty ultimate brakes from the narrow setting with more power to the wide position with more mud clearance and firmer feel. But, the washers only make a couple mm difference so the feel won't change much at all, but it is free, so why not. With old canti's and post mount pads you can really mess around with the leverage and change the feel.

The washers set the way you have them actually decreases mud clearance because it means your lever pulls less cable because it has more leverage and you have to set your pads up closer to the rim to get them to contact the rim at the lever reach you like.


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## simonaway427 (Jul 12, 2010)

I'm running CX9's on with Apex - the stopping power is ridiculous compared to my old Shorty Ultimate setup.


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