# Sora Annoying



## blankdrift (Jul 17, 2010)

Last year when I was buying my first road bike my main focus was on finding the proper fit and feel. When I finally did buy I settled on a Bianchi Brava, which was definitely not the lightest or fastest, but the most comfortable and smooth. I knew the components were bottom end but I liked the frame. 

Now that I have been riding a while I have started to use the drops sometimes, and of course the Sora shifters are useless, in addition to being generally clunky despite my best efforts to shift smoothly. 

So, the questions have become:

1. Are the Sora shifters really this lousy or do I need to learn to time my shifts differently? 

2. How important is it to ride in the drops if you are not racing, aside from being comfortable at speed?

3. If the Sora shifters really are that bad, and using the drops is that important, what is a noticeable upgrade? 

The bike is a 9sp Triple so it seems the only option if I just change shifters is to move to Tiagra, which gets me shifting in the drops, but will it shift more smoothly? Also, would this change be worth the money, or would I be better served to take a different approach with multiple components.

Thanks for any thoughts.


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## simonaway427 (Jul 12, 2010)

I have 2300 (which is below Sora) and I find they shift just fine. Perhaps you need a bit of a tune.

As for shifting from the drops, I have compact bars and can reach the thumbshifters with my thumbs from the drops.

Only you can answer the question of whether moving up to paddle shifters is worth the upgrade.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

blankdrift said:


> Last year when I was buying my first road bike my main focus was on finding the proper fit and feel. When I finally did buy I settled on a Bianchi Brava, which was definitely not the lightest or fastest, but the most comfortable and smooth. I knew the components were bottom end but I liked the frame.
> 
> Now that I have been riding a while I have started to use the drops sometimes, and of course the Sora shifters are useless, in addition to being generally clunky despite my best efforts to shift smoothly.
> 
> ...


Some of these answers depend on your goals and budget. IMO/E when Shimano drivetrains are set up/ adjusted properly they function and perform well. Not knowing your expectations it's hard to say whether an upgraded drivetrain would perform better for you, but it's possible that your LBS hasn't adjusted yours optimally.

I don't race, but ride in the drops at least 90% of the time. JMO's, but I find that I have better control of the bike, prefer the weight balance and a (minimal) side effect is a more aero position. There's no rule, so if you are riding in the drops because you see it as something 'better' riders do, I wouldn't fret over it. If OTOH you are feeling like it's a natural progression and you're comfortable riding in the drops, then by all means, do so. I think this should be the overriding concern on your decision to upgrade, rather than thinking shifting will be smoother, because (for whatever reason) you may not see much change and you'll be out a fair amount of money.

To answer your last question, a noticeable upgrade for a 9 spd drivetrain would be Tiagra shifters, and for 10 spd, 105.


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## dysfunction (Apr 2, 2010)

I could never reach the thumb-shifter from the drops on my sora equipped bike, both with the stock bars and some easton compacts. The paddle shifters were a huge improvement for me in that regard, but only because I like riding in the drops (just to change things up, because it's windy, it's a long downhill, etc).. if you're riding the hoods, it's not a huge deal at all IMO. I never noticed any slow shifts, except when things needed to be adjusted, and generally harsh shifts were my fault.. And yes, going to a 105 drivetrain was a noticeable difference. Although now I'd be tempted to look at the SRAM Apex line in lieu of the 105.


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## Opus51569 (Jul 21, 2009)

I had Sora shifters on my first road bike (now my commuter) and after 4 years it still shifts smooth. If yours isn't, it likely just needs to be adjusted properly.

As for the drops, that's a question only you can answer. If you want to ride there, then I would look into an "upgrade" to either Tiagra or 105. FWIW, my second bike has 105 all around, but I've only recently gotten to a point where I ride in the drops for any length of time. For the kind of riding I do, I find that the only time the drops are really beneficial is if I'm riding into a strong headwind. BTJM.

One thing I miss about the Sora on that bike, though, is how easy it is to adjust the reach of the levers. On the Sora, there is a screw you turn at the back of the hood that automatically changes the lever reach. On the 105 I have, you have to buy spacers to accomplish the same thing.


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## blankdrift (Jul 17, 2010)

PJ352 said:


> Some of these answers depend on your goals and budget. IMO/E when Shimano drivetrains are set up/ adjusted properly they function and perform well. Not knowing your expectations it's hard to say whether an upgraded drivetrain would perform better for you, but it's possible that your LBS hasn't adjusted yours optimally.


At this point my immediate goals are pretty basic:
1. Build up to longer distances _- my long loop is only 20 miles, but I have never attempted more._
2. Increase my average speed _- the range seems pretty broad (11-17) but it totally depends on my route. There are a lot of hills, er, mountains, where I live and my climbing is akin to a big rig ascending the grapevine._
3. Improve bike handling skills _- I have no idea how good or bad my skills are, but I come from a motorcycling background. As I know how essential proper technique is in road racing I assume it is equally important in cycling._

Longer term goals include:
1. Learn pack riding skills _- I have been riding alone for the most part, but eventually I would like to participate in some form of organized club riding, assuming it is within my potential. _

Budget: 
This is entirely dependent on patience _- I am the kind of person who considers quality an investment, and while I generally do not spend beyond my needs, I am willing to spend what it will reasonably cost to meet my needs adequately, even if I have to save for a while._

Adjustment:
I recently had LBS check it out because I was having issues _- They said they made adjustments, but I have not noticed a big difference. If I should do some research online, or get a book and learn myself I am fine with that, and reasonably mechanically inclined._



PJ352 said:


> I don't race, but ride in the drops at least 90% of the time. JMO's, but I find that I have better control of the bike, prefer the weight balance and a (minimal) side effect is a more aero position. There's no rule, so if you are riding in the drops because you see it as something 'better' riders do, I wouldn't fret over it. If OTOH you are feeling like it's a natural progression and you're comfortable riding in the drops, then by all means, do so. I think this should be the overriding concern on your decision to upgrade, rather than thinking shifting will be smoother, because (for whatever reason) you may not see much change and you'll be out a fair amount of money.


For me, riding in the drops is basically about what is comfortable_ - I did not start riding in the drops until I began pushing myself on the flats. For me, pushing seems to begin at 17 mph, but by 19 mph I only last a mile or so before I have to ease off. I am not sure where this ranks, hopefully not too terrible, but it is what it is. With the speed, wind, and trying to breathe, it did feel like a natural progression that also provided, if not actual stability, at least the sensation of greater stability. That being said, how much time I spend in the drops is highly dependent on my route. _

Sorry for the novel, but that is basically everything. Well, everything I can think of for now.


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## RRRoubaix (Aug 27, 2008)

Riding in the drops is very much a personal preference thing.
If you're young and flexible, you might find it perfectly comfortable for long periods of time.
For me, being middle aged, I only ride in the drops when I'm really hammering (or riding into a stiff headwind). 
When I first started riding 2 years ago, riding in the drops would make my neck sore.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

blankdrift said:


> At this point my immediate goals are pretty basic:
> 1. Build up to longer distances _- my long loop is only 20 miles, but I have never attempted more._
> 2. Increase my average speed _- the range seems pretty broad (11-17) but it totally depends on my route. There are a lot of hills, er, mountains, where I live and my climbing is akin to a big rig ascending the grapevine._
> 3. Improve bike handling skills _- I have no idea how good or bad my skills are, but I come from a motorcycling background. As I know how essential proper technique is in road racing I assume it is equally important in cycling._
> ...


Your immediate and long term goals can all be met using the Sora group you now have. Increasing saddle time, doing intervals/ general fast training rides will build endurance/ fitness, thus increase your average speed. For the most part, the motor (as we say) gets you up those hills, not the groupset, but gearing should be well matched to the terrain and your current fitness level. And IME bike handling skills also improve with saddle time.

From what you've offered under 'budget', I'm not sure Sora _doesn't_ meet your needs, except for the use of the thumb shifters while in the drops. As far as you doing your own wrenching, I see that as a big plus. You'll learn about your bike, how the components work and with some experience will be better able to diagnose any problems encountered. Zinn and the Art of Road Bike Maintenance, some basic tools and a repair stand will get you started.

Under 'adjustment', without firsthand knowledge of how your drivetrain is operating it's hard to judge how well your LBS tuned it. As I intially posted, Shimano groups perform well when properly set up/ adjusted, so if you're experiencing noisy/ sloppy shifts, I suspect an unresolved issue. Just keep in mind that if the 'issue' is not directly related to the groupset (as in a bent RD hanger, or similar), upgrading won't solve anything. 

Lastly, I think it's ultimately up to you if upgrading to either Tiagra or 105 is worth the money. Before doing so, I would suggst riding some bikes that are running the upgraded drivetrains, then decide from there if it's something worth pursuing.


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## blankdrift (Jul 17, 2010)

Thanks so much for all the thoughtful responses. 

I am definitely going to form a training plan - I am a planner, but I want to do it properly. 

Any suggestions for resources on beginner training are welcome - I have looked online, but most of what I have found is either really serious training for colleges / teams or really basic for general safety. 

If the Sora is solid, but just needs adjusting, I will take your advice on the Zinn and try to sort it out for now. I am in no hurry, and while I am really starting to enjoy riding, and like using the drops, it does make sense to just focus on saddle time and training. 

As for the adjustment, sometimes when I try to drop or pick up a gear on the rear cassette it will not shift; the lever moves, nothing happens. Then when I attempt to shift again the chain will jump two gears to where it technically should be on the rear cassette. Generally, it is only smooth shifting if I am hyper-conscious of my timing. I am not sure if the terminology I am using is correct, so please correct me if this sounds wrong, or if the shifting issue is me and not the bike.

In response to the last, I test rode a Fuji with a Tiagra / 105 mix, if I remember correctly, before I bought my bike and I did notice a difference. Then again, the difference could have been just that it was well adjusted, or one of a million other things.

Anyway, thanks again for all the help.


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## Hooben (Aug 22, 2004)

Answers:

1. Sora shifters are a less quality product and once you start riding more miles, you will be uncomfortable with their lack of performance and missed shifts. It appears like you are already at this point. 

2. If you are comfortable at speed in the drops, then that is most important. It doesn't matter if you race or ride for fun.

3. To you, riding in the drops is comfortable and you like shifting from the drops. The best upgrade would be to Sram, since the floating shift mechanism allows you to shift up or down from the drops with one lever.

You will not shift more smoothly with Tiagra. Your best approach would be 105 which is a very good smooth shifting system. It's not a good idea to use multiple components, unless you have someone you trust telling you what to mix.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Riding in the drops most of the time is a bit of a faux pas. Which is to say that whether or not you should be bothered about it, at least outside of racing and speed work, is entirely dependent on how much you care about fashion.

I try to set up my road bikes so that the most comfortable position is on the brake hoods. This allows me to sit up and use the flats for climbing, or if I'm really tired and just cruising, or to get into a lower position in the drops for descending or sprinting. So if I wanted to fit a bike to me and found I was most comfortable in the drops, I might lower my handlebars so that the hoods position was more similar to the drops position.

But as everyone else has said, it's a preference thing. Unless the group rides you plan on attending incorporate interval training, there should be no side effects, other than dentists making fun of you perhaps, to using the drops instead of the hoods.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

blankdrift said:


> Thanks so much for all the thoughtful responses.
> 
> I am definitely going to form a training plan - I am a planner, but I want to do it properly.
> 
> ...


Barring some sort of defect (which is unlikely) what you've described has nothing to do with the groupset. I've had the same happen to my Ultegra 6600 drivetrain.

It sounds like the cable is hanging up somewhere between the shifter and the derailleur. A decent mechanic would check every section of housing/ cable until they narrowed down where the problem was. One area that's a pretty common problem and easily checked is the bottom bracket cable guide. Dirt/ grit build up there and many times cause rough shifting. 

If you decide to tackle this yourself, post and we can walk you through the steps required to clean/ relube the area.


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## blankdrift (Jul 17, 2010)

PJ352 said:


> Barring some sort of defect (which is unlikely) what you've described has nothing to do with the groupset. I've had the same happen to my Ultegra 6600 drivetrain.
> 
> It sounds like the cable is hanging up somewhere between the shifter and the derailleur. A decent mechanic would check every section of housing/ cable until they narrowed down where the problem was. One area that's a pretty common problem and easily checked is the bottom bracket cable guide. Dirt/ grit build up there and many times cause rough shifting.
> 
> If you decide to tackle this yourself, post and we can walk you through the steps required to clean/ relube the area.


After checking out the cables and bottom bracket there was a fair bit of grime at the bracket, which I just cleaned off, but I also found a strand of very fine thread, maybe 2-3 in., wound up in the rear derailleur near the cable adjustment. It was pretty well hidden in there but I think I removed the whole strand, as best as I can tell without having to take anything apart, since it seems to have fixed the main problem.

I still have the feeling that I should clean and go over the area. It is no longer failing to shift, but I think it could be a bit smoother. Also, whatever type of grease my LBS used when I took it in for this issue a few weeks ago has picked up a mass of dust and crap over my last few rides. I am not sure what works best, but I'm tempted to use the chain lube I used on my motorcycle, since it did not pick up this much gunk. Thoughts?


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## blankdrift (Jul 17, 2010)

Hooben said:


> Answers:
> 
> 1. Sora shifters are a less quality product and once you start riding more miles, you will be uncomfortable with their lack of performance and missed shifts. It appears like you are already at this point.
> 
> ...


I was wondering what the general consensus was on SRAM versus Shimano. I am sure a lot of this is personal preference, but in perusing the SRAM site I could not help but drool a bit over the Rival groupset, though it could just be my lust for carbon fiber.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

blankdrift said:


> After checking out the cables and bottom bracket there was a fair bit of grime at the bracket, which I just cleaned off, but I also found a strand of very fine thread, maybe 2-3 in., wound up in the rear derailleur near the cable adjustment. It was pretty well hidden in there but I think I removed the whole strand, as best as I can tell without having to take anything apart, since it seems to have fixed the main problem.
> 
> I still have the feeling that I should clean and go over the area. It is no longer failing to shift, but I think it could be a bit smoother. Also, whatever type of grease my LBS used when I took it in for this issue a few weeks ago has picked up a mass of dust and crap over my last few rides. I am not sure what works best, but I'm tempted to use the chain lube I used on my motorcycle, since it did not pick up this much gunk. Thoughts?


Based on my experiences what you did at the bottom bracket probably went a long way in minimizing the shifting problems. If you (or the LBS wrench) were so inclined, following up with checking (and cleaning/ lubing) the full cable paths by section may help - or at least check to make sure the cable isn't hanging up anywhere.

Also, assuming the cables/ housings and remaining drivetrain components are in decent shape, the more you clean and lube, all that's left are minor adjustments to fine tune the drivetrain. As I said, you've probably gone a long way in fixing the issues, now the payback for further efforts will be a little less, so it depends on how picky you are. 

You can do a little more cleaning at the BB and use a light lube on the cables, wiping off the excess. Some have posted that they use a toothbrush (or similar) to clean where the cables run through the guide, so that might be worth a try. I use chain lube in that area (ProGold ProLink). You can use the same at all the pivot points on the RD.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

blankdrift said:


> I was wondering what the general consensus was on SRAM versus Shimano. I am sure a lot of this is personal preference, but in perusing the SRAM site I could not help but drool a bit over the Rival groupset, though it could just be my lust for carbon fiber.


JMO, but Shimano is the Microsoft of the biking world. Some love to hate them. I agree that it ultimately comes down to personal preference, but as with most things, making an educated decision beats making an emotional one, so I suggest putting both Rival and 105 through their paces before deciding.. or buying in to the hype.


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## |3iker (Jan 12, 2010)

Bad shifting has to do with the state of tune of your derailleurs. From experience, the Sora shifters are solid and works well. The only issue some folks take is the thumb shifter as opposed as the other ones in Shimano line. However know this.... Campy brifters are thumb shift too.
Folks that ride on the hood most of the time like this set up more.

My suggestion is for you to at least tune and test your drivetrain. Alot of time a few twirl of the barrel adjuster would quickly address shift quality.
Tiagra brifters are the next step up from Sora. However there is an often forgotten Sora-class brifter with the flick type shifter called the ST-R500 from Shimano. It offers Tiagra/105 shifter set up but priced lower than Sora brifters.


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## rgojr2001 (Dec 8, 2006)

My first road bike was equipped with ultegra. I have not regretted it. 

My suggestions would be to make sure that you are shifting efficiently, and that the drivetrain is properly tuned.

In the mean time, start saving for your next bike with better components in mind. Upgrading the drivetrain on a Brava doesn't make since considering you can get a nicely equipped full carbon road bike for less than $2000. Local shop in our area has 105/ ultegra equipped Defy Advanced at that price point.

Keep riding and having fun.:thumbsup:


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

|3iker said:


> *Bad shifting has to do with the state of tune of your derailleurs*. From experience, the Sora shifters are solid and works well. The only issue some folks take is the thumb shifter as opposed as the other ones in Shimano line. However know this.... Campy brifters are thumb shift too.
> Folks that ride on the hood most of the time like this set up more.
> 
> My suggestion is for you to at least tune and test your drivetrain. Alot of time a few twirl of the barrel adjuster would quickly address shift quality.
> Tiagra brifters are the next step up from Sora. However there is an often forgotten Sora-class brifter with the flick type shifter called the ST-R500 from Shimano. It offers Tiagra/105 shifter set up but priced lower than Sora brifters.


Not necessarily. The OP's description of the shifting problems points to the RD cable hanging up somewhere. If it were a tuning issue, the symptoms would likely be more consistent, but the OP states _sometimes when I try to drop or pick up a gear on the rear cassette it will not shift; the lever moves, nothing happens. Then when I attempt to shift again the chain will jump two gears to where it technically should be on the rear cassette_. The RD is in the same state of tune in both instances, yet the shift doesn't execute the first time, but does the second. Tuning could be a step in the corrective process, but it's not the fundamental problem here.

Lastly, from the prices I've seen ST-R500 shifters are not cheaper than Sora. I do agree that if the OP were thinking of upgrading, they would be a viable option.


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## |3iker (Jan 12, 2010)

Not sure what you're getting at because, without OP discovered there were cable strands and dirt that were causing the issue.

Anyhoo, Amazon.com shows the ST-R500 for $174.99 while a Sora brifter for $185.39.  You're welcome.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

|3iker said:


> Not sure what you're getting at because, without OP discovered there were cable strands and dirt that were causing the issue.
> 
> Anyhoo, Amazon.com shows the ST-R500 for $174.99 while a Sora brifter for $185.39.  You're welcome.


Not getting at anything other than to say that your statement re: the cause of shifting problems doesn't always hold true - and it doesn't. As far as the actual cause (or remedy), from what's been posted I don't think that's been determined with certainty. YMMV. 

Re: pricing on shifters, no need for a "You're welcome" because I'm not in the market for shifters, but of the two of us, you get the nod as the bargain hunter. :thumbsup:


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## hxcadam (Apr 28, 2010)

I have Sora on my Scott S50. Shifts fine. I had to learn though that its pretty easy to double shift. Gotta get the gist of the shifter.


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## skyphix (Jul 26, 2007)

Sora should be fine.

That being said, I run 105 RD with Tiagra shifters and love the performance.


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## LMWEL (Jan 5, 2010)

My Defy 2 has Sora shifters and I spend a good bit of time in the drops . As you mentioned, it is a good idea to pay some attention to anticipating your shifts regardless of what groupset you ride . I don't have a problem with momentarily removing my right hand from the drops for a quick upshift . Ride like you live, Hard and Fast !


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