# Zipp 300 crank or FSA Plasmas??



## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

now i got some $ 1k left on the table:2: and i was wondering which of two would you consider upgrading:

1. Zipp 300 ( crankset/BB ) 640 grams??:thumbsup: 
2. FSA Plasmas ( Handlebar/ stem intergrated ):thumbsup: 

both will be coming handy to my fine collections but which one?? your thoughts please.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

Well, since this forum is about saving weight, Plasmas are far from lightweight. Why don't you ask Jens Voight what he would do?


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> now i got some $ 1k left on the table:2: and i was wondering which of two would you consider upgrading:
> 
> 1. Zipp 300 ( crankset/BB ) 640 grams??:thumbsup:
> 2. FSA Plasmas ( Handlebar/ stem intergrated ):thumbsup:
> ...


First off like Forrest said, the Plasma is heavy. You are better off getting a custom one mad by Calfee or maybe Rue Sports. Send them a light bar and stem and they can intergrate it.

Now those Zipps are light, but you can go custom and lighter for cheaper.

Here is my 619g combo:

<table style="margin-left: 25px; margin-right: 25px;" align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="700"><tbody><tr height="17"><td width="135">Crankset: </td> <td width="362">05 FSA K-FORCE ISIS 53/39T - 170mm</td> <td align="left" width="61">0</td> <td width="53"> </td> </tr> <tr height="17"> <td width="135">--Arms: </td> <td width="362">05 FSA K-FORCE ISIS</td> <td align="left" width="61">354</td> <td width="53"> </td> </tr> <tr height="17"> <td width="135">--Crank Bolts: </td> <td width="362">Extralite ExtraBolt 5 M15</td> <td align="left" width="61">12</td> <td width="53"> </td> </tr> <tr height="17"> <td width="135">--Ring bolts: </td> <td width="362">Extralite ExtraBolt 1.1</td> <td align="left" width="61">8</td> <td width="53"> </td> </tr> <tr height="17"> <td width="135">--Outer Ring: </td> <td width="362">STRONGLIGHT CT2 50T</td> <td align="left" width="61">66</td> <td width="53"> </td> </tr> <tr height="17"> <td width="135">--Middle Ring: </td> <td width="362">STRONGLIGHT CT2 39T</td> <td align="left" width="61">36</td></tr></tbody></table> <table style="margin-left: 25px; margin-right: 25px;" align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="700"><tbody><tr height="17"><td width="135">Bottom Bracket: </td> <td width="362">06 TOKEN Ultra-Lite CF/Ti w/ Ceramic Ti bearing 68 x 108mm</td> <td align="left" width="61">143</td></tr></tbody></table>

You can find the K-Force ISIS cranks on eBay new for less than $200
The rings maybe $100 BB $145?

You will be lighter and much cheaper!


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

i know they're a much lighter stem/handle and crankset out there but they're not as attactive as Plasma or Zipp 300. IMHO. perhap is there a such as TOO LIGHT?? i mean i do want some stiffness since i'm an agressive rider ( Jens Voight is one of favorite ) anyway last night i placed an order for Plasma for $ 409 ( including shipping ) the lightest stem is probably cost $ 200?? and the lightest handlebar may be $ 300-400?? when put together they're not only a lame looking but also lack stiffness. i know this forum about weights but both Plasma and Zipp 300 should be light enough for a discussion.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> i know they're a much lighter stem/handle and crankset out there but they're not as attactive as Plasma or Zipp 300. IMHO. perhap is there a such as TOO LIGHT?? i mean i do want some stiffness since i'm an agressive rider ( Jens Voight is one of favorite ) anyway last night i placed an order for Plasma for $ 409 ( including shipping ) the lightest stem is probably cost $ 200?? and the lightest handlebar may be $ 300-400?? when put together they're not only a lame looking but also lack stiffness. i know this forum about weights but both Plasma and Zipp 300 should be light enough for a discussion.


Zipp yet, plasma no.

My cranks are PLENY stiff. As my bar and stem.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

Zipps are plenty stiff and plenty light. Plasmas are pigs, ugly pigs at that. Zipp B2 bars are 216g (real weight), and a Ritchey 4-axis, 110mm, is 120g (real weight), for a total of 336g which is well below the Plasma's *CLAIMED* weight. Given how bad FSA's weight claims are, I'd say the Plasmas weigh at least 400g.

The 4 axis/zipp combo would be at least as stiff and look loads better. If you wanted lighter, you could go with the Zipp SL bars at 160g(real weight). Juanmoretime uses them and has zero issues with them.

And I didn't even look around for other other combos. This combo was just off the top of my head.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

Forrest Root said:


> Zipps are plenty stiff and plenty light. Plasmas are pigs, ugly pigs at that. Zipp B2 bars are 216g (real weight), and a Ritchey 4-axis, 110mm, is 120g (real weight), for a total of 336g which is well below the Plasma's *CLAIMED* weight. Given how bad FSA's weight claims are, I'd say the Plasmas weigh at least 400g.
> 
> The 4 axis/zipp combo would be at least as stiff and look loads better. If you wanted lighter, you could go with the Zipp SL bars at 160g(real weight). Juanmoretime uses them and has zero issues with them.
> 
> And I didn't even look around for other other combos. This combo was just off the top of my head.


My Extralite RoadStem OC is 84g and the Bars are Syntace Racelite Carbon 31.8 that weight 181g.
*Total: 265g*

Just as stiff as the combo you mentioned.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

if my memeory served me right i saw the Chicken ( Michael Rasmussen used Plasma in the 05 tour and this year he's using a new white intergrated stem/handle bar call " Stealthevo?? ". it look really nice ) and i also know the chicken was/is a weight weenie fanatic. given that info. i think he's one the very few peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar. hmm make me wonder how come not more peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar??


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## estone2 (Sep 25, 2005)

z ken said:


> if my memeory served me right i saw the Chicken ( Michael Rasmussen used Plasma in the 05 tour and this year he's using a new white intergrated stem/handle bar call " Stealthevo?? ". it look really nice ) and i also know the chicken was/is a weight weenie fanatic. given that info. i think he's one the very few peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar. hmm make me wonder how come not more peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar??


_because they're heavy_, dude. Plus, if you crash one, you get to replace the handlebar AND stem. The most probable reason Rasmussen used it was because his bike would have been under 6.8kg otherwise. Most other riders didn't have such a light build elsewhere on the bike, and could go with a lightweight stem/handlebars without accidentally going under 6.8kg.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

what?? last time i checked all the peloton use pretty light frames/wheels when mountain roam ahead. i guess intergrated stem/handle bar truely for some " unique " riders only.


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## Argentius (Aug 26, 2004)

Rabobank's bar / stem combo from the tour this year is a sponsor prototype.

Protour riders need to ADD WEIGHT to their bikes to meet the 6.8kg (15 lb) regulation.

Since most protour-level frames, with light wheels and full record / dura-ace / force, come in at or under that mark, they need to add something...


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

ok i understnd that. how about other riders ( the ones that don't use intergrated )?? where do they add the weights?? saddle?? for sure not the frame/wheels. i just watched 04 tour and i think Gilberto Simoni also use Plasma. hmm both the chicken and Gibo use it and both are great climbers. always make me wonder why don't more peloton use intergrat stuffs.


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## Argentius (Aug 26, 2004)

because it is impossible to adjust, and relatively fragile. Most riders in the pro peloton won't even use carbon bars for the durability reason --- they want to be able to continue if they crash. 1 piece bar / stem combos simply offer no advantages, and carry disadvantages.

Also, most pros don't like "ergo" shaped drops, and most integrated bar / stem combos aren't offered in traditional drop-style.

Adding weight: some riders use aluminum cranks instead of carbon ones. It has literally been the case on occasion that techs have affixed a ballast weight to a bottle cage.


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## bikemanMD (Mar 20, 2006)

or the mechanics will drop a chain or other weight down the seat tube.....

the point remains, the Plasma is fugly and fragile and not worth it, IMHO (perhaps you could say the same about the Chicken :blush2: )


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

first i've to say i'm a die-hard disco. fan and i'm thrilled that AC and LL won the tour and finished on the podium, respectively, but i got to give the chicken alot alot of credits. he's ONLY one who has gave disco trouble no matter how hard AC tried to drop him in the heat of mountains. yes having talent is one thing but it cetainly helps to have " quality " components and i believe Plasma is definitely one of them. Simoni and Rasmussen both use it so it CAN'T be that bad. you've to give the credit where its due.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

z ken said:


> first i've to say i'm a die-hard disco. fan and i'm thrilled that AC and LL won the tour and finished on the podium, respectively, but i got to give the chicken alot alot of credits. he's ONLY one who has gave disco trouble no matter how hard AC tried to drop him in the heat of mountains. yes having talent is one thing but it cetainly helps to have " quality " components and i believe Plasma is definitely one of them. Simoni and Rasmussen both use it so it CAN'T be that bad. you've to give the credit where its due.


Rasmussen is not using a Plasma. He's using a bar/stem combo from Pro.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

i know he was using it in 05 and last year, not this year.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

my FSA Plasma finally came i today and it's OBSOLUTELY breath-taking beauty. it's pretty light and aero too??


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> my FSA Plasma finally came i today and it's OBSOLUTELY breath-taking beauty. it's pretty light and aero too??


 Not light though...


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

not light?? may be but for sure lighter than my old Bontrager X light handle bar and stem. oh yeah this's the first time i've both handle bar and stem in carbon ( used to have carbon handlebar but NOT stem ) about Plasma: today i went for a " test ride-30 miles with mixed hills " and see how it feel. WHEW!! the smoothest and most comfortable handle bar i've ever land my hands on. i actually " felt " stronger on the cimbs and great for sprinting ( granted my old Bontragers were heavy and alum. ) oh yeah did i mention it's a great looking and the riding on the hoods is just amazing. 2 thumbs WAY up!! i still wonder why didn't the more pros use intergrated handle bar/stem.


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## Mdeth1313 (Nov 1, 2001)

FWIW, I just switched from a kcnc/isis setup to the fsa k-force light. The weight savings is only around 20-30g (will be over 50 when I switch out my large chainring), but the stiffness/performance is 2nd to none. Also solved some spacing/shifting issues w/ my frame.
Cost is less than the zipps, as the rings and bb are included.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> not light?? may be but for sure lighter than my old Bontrager X light handle bar and stem. oh yeah this's the first time i've both handle bar and stem in carbon ( used to have carbon handlebar but NOT stem ) about Plasma: today i went for a " test ride-30 miles with mixed hills " and see how it feel. WHEW!! the smoothest and most comfortable handle bar i've ever land my hands on. i actually " felt " stronger on the cimbs and great for sprinting ( granted my old Bontragers were heavy and alum. ) oh yeah did i mention it's a great looking and the riding on the hoods is just amazing. 2 thumbs WAY up!! i still wonder why didn't the more pros use intergrated handle bar/stem.


I am really gald you like them. I think they look pretty neat and I know a few guys around here that ride them and they like them as well. THe whole look of being intergrated is very cool looking.

The full CF stem and bars does give the bars a very nice feel on the road. Very little road buzz as well.

BUT, you posted this in thr WW section. So a 400g Bar/Stem in not that light iin WW terms. Regular parts and for thier stifness yes.

My Syntace Racelite 46cm bars and Extralite RoadStem OC 100mm combo is 265g. So Even with a heavier Syntace F119 it's 296g or Ritchey 4-Axis 294g. So that's a 100g less!

A 100g+ on a bar/stem combo is heavy in WW terms. That's all!


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

yup i understand and just want to share my story about my new precious. hehe about K-Force light: i'm also thinking about buying it but it doesn't look as good as Zipp 300 ( IMHO ) and Zipp 300 would match my Zipp 404. how much K-Force light weight ( including BB ) 640 grams?? same as Zipp 300??


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> yup i understand and just want to share my story about my new precious. hehe about K-Force light: i'm also thinking about buying it but it doesn't look as good as Zipp 300 ( IMHO ) and Zipp 300 would match my Zipp 404. how much K-Force light weight ( including BB ) 640 grams?? same as Zipp 300??




If you posted this inthe Components/Wrenching section, I would have said nice choice of a pretty light combo. But on the SW/WW board that's heavy. 

I wanted one, but they don't make a 44w x 100 or 110mm.

I would go with the FSA K-Force LIGHT Mega Exo over the ZIPP ISIS Combo.

The FSA weights around 642g for the 175mm! IMO, a better crankset.

I also ran ZIPP bars with FSA cranks. 

Now it's Syntace with FSA cr4anks and a Reynolds post! 

Pick the best of the groups and go with the best. Unless FSA or ZIPP is paying you!


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

there's a good chance i might go with K-Force Light. isn't team CSC use them over Zipp 300 eventhough Zipp sponsor CSC?? or Zipp just supply the wheels while FSA supply the rest of components ( stem, Handlbar and crankset )?? i can't think of any CSC using Plasma given it's made by FSA. hard to figure!!


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## estone2 (Sep 25, 2005)

z ken said:


> there's a good chance i might go with K-Force Light. isn't team CSC use them over Zipp 300 eventhough Zipp sponsor CSC?? or Zipp just supply the wheels while FSA supply the rest of components ( stem, Handlbar and crankset )?? i can't think of any CSC using Plasma given it's made by FSA. hard to figure!!


Dude, Zipp is the *wheel* sponsor. FSA has been sponsoring them crankwise since at least 2003.


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## Forrest Root (Dec 22, 2006)

estone2 said:


> Dude, Zipp is the *wheel* sponsor. FSA has been sponsoring them crankwise since at least 2003.



Hey, now. Don't be mean. Everyone knows that if CSC uses it, the product must be the mac daddy of products of that sort. Jeez. Don't you know anything?


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

ok i GOT it then in the first place. now how come none of CSC use Plasma since it's made by FSA?? just found out that Giro winner Di Luca also using Plasma ( pink Plasma just plain wrong. you can see the pic. in Full Speed Ahead.com under gallery section ) hmm Rasmussen, Gibo and now Luca ( all great winners in GT and easily some of the best climbers in the world are using " heavier " stem/handle bar ) so may be there's some kind of " secret " behind it. as i've mentioned earlier i actually ' felt " stronger on the climbs during my test ride. i guess everyone is different and all i want to say i'm real thrill to own a piece of art and so far nothing but praises from my riding buddies.


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## estone2 (Sep 25, 2005)

z ken said:


> ok i GOT it then in the first place. now how come none of CSC use Plasma since it's made by FSA?? just found out that Giro winner Di Luca also using Plasma ( pink Plasma just plain wrong. you can see the pic. in Full Speed Ahead.com under gallery section ) hmm Rasmussen, Gibo and now Luca ( all great winners in GT and easily some of the best climbers in the world are using " heavier " stem/handle bar ) so may be there's some kind of " secret " behind it. as i've mentioned earlier i actually ' felt " stronger on the climbs during my test ride. i guess everyone is different and all i want to say i'm real thrill to own a piece of art and so far nothing but praises from my riding buddies.


Because when you crash, it takes out both the stem and handlebars.

Because the Plasma weighs more than most anything else.

Because they want a classic bend or a different drop than the Plasma offers.

Because they don't want a flat on top but rather a flat bar.

Because FSA is marketing their other handlebars.

You outfit the bikes with what you think people will buy. It's much better for FSA to put on a 150 dollar handlebar and 150 dollar stem than a 450 dollar handlebar/stem combo.

It's advertising. Not as many people will consider purchasing the Plasma as will consider a traditional, cheaper, and lighter non integrated combination. As such, you don't advertise the Plasma, you advertise the thing people might buy.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> ok i GOT it then in the first place. now how come none of CSC use Plasma since it's made by FSA?? just found out that Giro winner Di Luca also using Plasma ( pink Plasma just plain wrong. you can see the pic. in Full Speed Ahead.com under gallery section ) hmm Rasmussen, Gibo and now Luca ( all great winners in GT and easily some of the best climbers in the world are using " heavier " stem/handle bar ) so may be there's some kind of " secret " behind it. as i've mentioned earlier i actually ' felt " stronger on the climbs during my test ride. i guess everyone is different and all i want to say i'm real thrill to own a piece of art and so far nothing but praises from my riding buddies.


estone2 pretty much nailed! It what FSA want's to sell and market.

Also maybe a lot of these guys don't like/fit the Plasma bars. FSA is NOT going to make custom ones either. The cost would no be worth it.
Also most roadies are traditionalists and prefer the regular combo.

Sponsored riders use what they are given or told to ride. Sometimes thier personal preference for certain things will overide this on a case by case and part by part basis.
Then the part can be rebaged to look like thier sponsors item or they just agree to let it be. Pedals, wheels, bars and saddles come to mind first. 
Even tires and frame can be re-baged.

US POSTAL/Discovery rode Hutchinson Tubulars. Well, Hutchinson does not make tubs. But you just just see the label and assume this.

What riders use is ALL about marketing. Look I am very much the same way. Most parts/items I ride on/use is because I am marketing them to sell, I get Pro-deals or Industry pricing or given to me for free.

Now if I don't like something or care for it, I will not use it and then choose what I prefer even if that means paying full retail.

So when somone notices my bike, hopefully the ask about an item that I am selling or promoting.

Example: I love my Schwalbe tires but I now ride on tubulars. The Ultermo tub is not out yet and I don't care for the other ones they have. So I ride Vittoira tubs full-time (becuase of deals). Now on century/charity or large group rides were there are stop and what not, I will ride my clinchers with the Ultermos. 
Why?

MO, these are the best clinchers I have used for speed, grip and comfort.So if I am going to ride clinchers these are it.
To promote and sell more!
If somone what's another opionion on another tire that I don't sell/promote, I will tell them. It's Vittoria, Conti then Michelin.

Again their are certain parts I sell I don't use because I flat out prefer another brand for personal reason or simply because the other one is better!

I think this goes for a lot of us in the indusrty.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> ok i GOT it then in the first place. now how come none of CSC use Plasma since it's made by FSA?? just found out that Giro winner Di Luca also using Plasma ( pink Plasma just plain wrong. you can see the pic. in Full Speed Ahead.com under gallery section ) hmm Rasmussen, Gibo and now Luca ( all great winners in GT and easily some of the best climbers in the world are using " heavier " stem/handle bar ) so may be there's some kind of " secret " behind it. as i've mentioned earlier i actually ' felt " stronger on the climbs during my test ride. i guess everyone is different and all i want to say i'm real thrill to own a piece of art and so far nothing but praises from my riding buddies.


You should have got the Zipp B2/Stem combo. Much lighter and stronger! Plus it would have matched your wheels right? The lighter the combo the faster you will go.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

i think i saw Jan and Kloeden was riding Lighweight wheelsets while the rest of his T-Mobile on D/A wheels, right?? super star treatment?? about Zipp handle bar being lighter, yes but stronger?? i don't know. no wonder FSA will always behind Campy and Shimano b/c they always want to sale their " medium " price range stuffs while Campy and shimano always go for their top of the shell b/c they " know " people will go out and buy regardless it's $ 2K or $10K ( think Scott's Addicted ). look at AT&T, they promoted their I-PHone and every time you switch a channel, you always see their commercial and last time i check people are lining up to buy I-Phone, not AT&T's " medium " price phones. so i think FSA should think BIG and try to sell many of their " top " products instead of their $ 100-$ 200. then again what do i know i'm just a chef who just enjoy riding bike and buy expensive components.


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## DIRT BOY (Aug 22, 2002)

z ken said:


> i think i saw Jan and Kloeden was riding Lighweight wheelsets while the rest of his T-Mobile on D/A wheels, right?? super star treatment?? about Zipp handle bar being lighter, yes but stronger?? i don't know. no wonder FSA will always behind Campy and Shimano b/c they always want to sale their " medium " price range stuffs while Campy and shimano always go for their top of the shell b/c they " know " people will go out and buy regardless it's $ 2K or $10K ( think Scott's Addicted ). look at AT&T, they promoted their I-PHone and every time you switch a channel, you always see their commercial and last time i check people are lining up to buy I-Phone, not AT&T's " medium " price phones. so i think FSA should think BIG and try to sell many of their " top " products instead of their $ 100-$ 200. then again what do i know i'm just a chef who just enjoy riding bike and buy expensive components.


Yes they were.

The Zipp SL bar is probaly the strongest/stiff bars for their weight to strength ratio. Look, I like FSA bars alot. Thier stuff in top nocth. I have the Wing Pro Aluminum bars on my rain bike and a FSA seatpost. Both bikes have FSA cranks as well.

FSA does not promote the plama because it's NOT bar for everyone. Also their profit margin may not be as high as well. Good be that NO pro riders want to use them so they can't!

Different companies use different marketing stratagies. Some prfere to to market thier "bread and Butter" over champange parts. I bet FSA does NOT sell alot of those Plasma sets. Wait till they debut thier Raod and MTB drivetrains for 2008!

FSA had CSC on their TOP K-Force LIGHT cranks with Ceramic bearings!

But hey, if you love them then keep riding them and enjoy. It's our bike. That's what it' all about right?

Just don't call them light on a WW board. 

Also, what happens when your fitness improves and your need a longer stem? FleaBay those and get new ones?  :mad2: :cryin:

See my point?


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

improve my fitness /need longer stem?? right now i'm alright in my " prime " and i don't think i can improve any more unless Chris C. ( Lance's coach. forgot his last name ) would become my personal trainer ( i can't afford him anyway if i want to ) i don't know why you keep mentioning Zipp bars. i know they're ultra light but i'll be scare to use them ( carbon with noodle-like thin ) also i've never mention that Plasma is feather-like light handle bar/stem. i just know they're real great looking and amazing comfort on the hoods/drops. everyone is different but hard to believe only few pro riders use them and surprisingly it's the climbers?? truely hard to believe. i also heard today that Shimano is finally coming out with full carbon D/A come early 08. more choices/headache for us consummers. that's a good thing.


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## thedips (Mar 26, 2007)

z ken said:


> if my memeory served me right i saw the Chicken ( Michael Rasmussen used Plasma in the 05 tour and this year he's using a new white intergrated stem/handle bar call " Stealthevo?? ". it look really nice ) and i also know the chicken was/is a weight weenie fanatic. given that info. i think he's one the very few peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar. hmm make me wonder how come not more peloton use intergrated stem/handle bar??


not to go off topic but here is a closer shot of the stealthevos...


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## CippoForLife (Oct 10, 2006)

I think those are super sweet. if only they were lighter.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

cippo: yes they're indeed gorgeous but you can' have everything in life. you've to choose which " one " is more important-the look or the weights. i can't say enough about Plasma: got alot of compliment.  and of course it's a show stopper mostly b/cof my Trek Madone/Zipp404 tubulars but i've to give Plasma some props.


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## uzziefly (Jul 15, 2006)

z ken said:


> not light?? may be but for sure lighter than my old Bontrager X light handle bar and stem. oh yeah this's the first time i've both handle bar and stem in carbon ( used to have carbon handlebar but NOT stem ) about Plasma: today i went for a " test ride-30 miles with mixed hills " and see how it feel. WHEW!! the smoothest and most comfortable handle bar i've ever land my hands on. i actually " felt " stronger on the cimbs and great for sprinting ( granted my old Bontragers were heavy and alum. ) oh yeah did i mention it's a great looking and the riding on the hoods is just amazing. 2 thumbs WAY up!! *i still wonder why didn't the more pros use intergrated handle bar/stem.*


Seriously, they break apart in a crash and you can't ride with them. If you use conventional parts, and you crash, it's easier to replace. Granted, they change bikes yes but a one piece system like that is much more fragile than a 2 piece aluminum system which most riders use.

Disco doesn't even use the XXX lite bars/stem coz they're carbon fibre and might very well break in a crash vs. the aluminum versions of Bontrager stems/bars. 

I much prefer using an aluminum combination of bars and stem coz yes, I don't wanna ever crash but if ever, I won't need to worry bout breakin em as much. FWIW, my old XXX lite stem/bars broke in a crash when the bike landed on the bars. My left drop bar was like a gear shifter in a car. 

Lance Armstrong and the other Disco riders had metal plates screwed onto the underside of their bikes I think just so the bikes meet the minimum weight.


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## uzziefly (Jul 15, 2006)

Yes the plasmas look cool.

Maybe Rass and the others who use them like the shape of the bars better. Maybe they like the shape as well as feel they are sturdy enough. So they use them. That's all.

Why did Lance and Jan use Lightweight wheels? Coz they're really light and stiff and they bought their own wheels and prefer them during those races. 

Why doesn't a pro use the lightest saddle sponsored? Coz his @$$ likes what he already is usin, no matter the weight.


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## Mr. Scary (Dec 7, 2005)

z ken said:


> i know he was using it in 05 and last year, not this year.


He used the Cinelli RAM. Rabobank has never used FSA components.


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## Mr. Scary (Dec 7, 2005)

z ken said:


> ok i GOT it then in the first place. now how come none of CSC use Plasma since it's made by FSA?? just found out that Giro winner Di Luca also using Plasma ( pink Plasma just plain wrong. you can see the pic. in Full Speed Ahead.com under gallery section ) hmm Rasmussen, Gibo and now Luca ( all great winners in GT and easily some of the best climbers in the world are using " heavier " stem/handle bar ) so may be there's some kind of " secret " behind it. as i've mentioned earlier i actually ' felt " stronger on the climbs during my test ride. i guess everyone is different and all i want to say i'm real thrill to own a piece of art and so far nothing but praises from my riding buddies.


DiLuca used that on the final stage into Milan at FSA's request. Otherwise he uses an aluminum FSA stem and faceplate AND the aluminum Wing Pro (classic bend bar).


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## Kenacycle (May 28, 2006)

I recently got the Zipp 300 crankset and I am very pleased with it. I was looking at getting FSA but saw alot of bad reviews on it. They tend to come loose on rides etc.


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## cocoboots (Apr 13, 2006)

Zipp 300 are very nice. I rode one on a steel frame and it was very responsive.


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## alexedge (Jul 13, 2007)

OT, sort of, but I was in Nytro bikes (Cali guys know) a couple days ago and they had a couple sets of the new Zipp Vuma cranks.

:drool:

Too bad they're going for $1k...

Ahh,I can only dream....


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