# Thinking of a classic steel frame w/modern gruppo. do's - dont's?



## Donn12

I am thinking of a resto mod type of build. A classic style frame with modern touches. I am open to frame (a colonago master is what started this thought but I am open and masters seem to be everywhere). I am thinking of a white frame with campy 11 speed gruppo and black label shamal wheels. I am concerned about blacked out trim vs chrome. does anyone have a bike with both? I like the looks of a chrome fork but I will want my normal 3t carbon bars and roman eve saddle. I will want the modern pedals brakes and everything else. 

has anyone done a bike like this? pics? do's, dont's? will I hit any roadblocks i am not thinking of? I don't want down tube shifters...can I make this frames work? other brands? derosa cinelli ...what else?
this will not be my everyday bike or close so i don't want a $5000 custom made frame.


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## bikerjulio

This guy did it

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/general-cycling-discussion/there-anyone-doesnt-like-old-steel-bike%85-328659.html

My thoughts on this (and I have a '90's Coppi with '00's Campy Record), are:

1. Steel is not necessarily more comfortable. My Coppi is a hard riding race bike, and I get beaten up too much on it on the roads around here. It gets out about once a year now. Looks nice though.

2. Some of these old frames have extremely tight clearances and were designed for 20mm tires. I can only just fit a 23mm tire in the rear triangle of the Coppi. So I cannot improve the ride with a fatter tire.

3. Quill stems. I prefer them from the appearance POV but they can be a PITA. However, the use of a quill adapter just adds weight, and does nothing to eliminate potential creaking.

In conclusion, if I wanted a retro bike that I'd actually enjoy riding, I'd be looking at an older Ti Litespeed or similar, preferably from the threadless headset era. And I'd make sure it had clearance for at least 25mm tires, preferably 28mm to allow the use of the new wider rims.


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## Gregory Taylor

Mechanically, it is all very do-able. Folks fit modern Campagnolo components on older frames all the time. 

- One issue is whether you want to cold set the rear drop outs to 130mm if you pick a frame that is spaced 126mm out back. Some folks ignore the 4mm difference and just stuff the wheel in there.

- Another issue is the fork. Vintage bikes usually come with a 1" threaded fork. You can get an adapter that replaces the quill stem so you can use a modern stem/bar combo, if you want. Personally, I think that these adapters are ghastly, but I will admit that the guy with the Colnago in bikerjulio's post did a great job of making it work visually. 

- Brakes can be an issue. Depending on the vintage of the frame, some brake mounts are drilled to handle the old-style nutted brake calipers, both for the fork and in the rear. If you end up with one of these, you will have to futz around with it to make the modern calipers work. Again, it is do-able.

As far as the aesthetics...that's a personal call. For me, the more modern "blacked out" trim or carbon fiber components (like bars) look anachronistic on an older frame. Again, the Colnago in bikerjulio's post works well in my opinion because it uses modern components that stick with the theme. No carbon bars or cranks, no blacked out trim for me.


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## pmf

If I could figure out how to post a picture on here, I'd show you a picture of the Eddy Merckx bike I built up. 

I found a 1996 Corsa 01 on ebay for $800. It was one of the last steel Merckx bikes made. The tube set (deda zero-uno) is still used by some frame builders today. The frame itself is not much heavier than a titanium frame. The rear drop outs are 130, so no problem with modern wheels. The seller had recently repainted the frame and had a carbon fork painted to match. I'd have preferred a steel fork, but that's what it came with. When it arrived, the frame and fork looked brand new. Not a single scratch or chip. 

I didn't want to spend a lot of money on this project, so I originally figured I'd buy a Shimano Ultegra group. The more I looked that that group (especially the cranks), the less appealing it became. Campy had just come out with a new Athena group that year. It came in either black or polished aluminum. The polished components look perfect on a steel frame. The only drawback was that in the first year of the group, it was only offered with carbon shifters. The next year, they offered polished shifters, but downgraded the shifters from Ultra shift to Power shift. Basically, the first year the shifters were the same as Chorus, after that the same as Centaur. A couple years later, I did a Merckx bike for my wife and upgraded the shifters to Chorus. They're better, even if they have carbon levers on them. It's worth doing. 

I had a wheel builder make me a set of wheels with Kinlin 270 rims, cxray spokes and White Industries hubs. All in polished finish. They kind of look like Shamals did 20 years ago. 

The head tube is 1". The fork required a threadless headset. I bought modern size stem (1+1/8) and used a spacer. This gives you a lot more options for handlebars. I found a set of Zipp SL bars on sale that have worked perfectly. Yeah, they're carbon, but so what, they're covered in tape. 

The bike doesn't weigh much more than my titanium bike. It has an awesome ride. I've ridden it to work everyday this week. It was fun getting all the parts together. I must have spend six months finding stuff on sale. I think it ran me around $2500, which is pretty cheap for a bike these days.


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## Oxtox

have a '98 Serotta-made Ti Paramount.

wanted DA 9-speed to be more period correct, but was impatient and didn't want to wait to find a nice set, so went with Ultegra 6600 (which was fairly new at the time I bought it). 

added DA C-24 wheels, a carbon saddle, but used a DA quill stem...I love their elegance of design.

it looks pretty sweet and rides very nicely.


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## BikeLayne

Lighthousecycles.com will build you a frame exactly the way you want it. I wanted a classic styled frame but fully modern for today's components. I love my bike. I think about $2000 but check out the website. I went with a lugged frame and the bike is razor sharp. Fillet brazed if you prefer but I wanted the lugged frame for the classic look. Columbus steel.


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## Donn12

This guy did it

Is there anyone that doesn't like an old steel bike….



that is what is pushing me from thought to figuring out which one to get....gorgeous bike


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## wgscott

Donn12 said:


> i don't want a $5000 custom made frame.


I got a custom steel frame (and the rest of the bike). The frame was about $1500 I think. It has decent wheels, Ultegra Di2, hydraulic discs, etc. so it came to a fair chunk of change in the end, but a custom steel frame built to my specifications wound up being better than I could possibly have hoped for.

The bike (the black one with light blue trim and red hubs) is pics 2, 3 and 4 on this gallery.


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## SantaCruz

Here's the thread you need.

retro roadies- old frames with STI's or Ergos


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## MadGadget

I just finished my Master with Shimano 11 speed.


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## bikerjulio

Here's the pretty one










and here's the one to ride


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## Donn12

I like them both - but the yellow bike is stunning


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## american psycho

Do it.

Don't wait.

My 73 Bianchi Specialissima Pro with Alloy Chorus 10.

I kept the old seatpost and front derailleur for asthetics, and am still working on the brake caliper problem.


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## Camilo

This is a ~1986 Sannino frame.








There was zero issues outfitting it with modern components. I did spread and align the rear triangle from 126 to 130, but it really wasn't hard (contact me for some easy, home made tools I used). On the other hand, it wasn't that hard to simply insert the modern wheel into the 126 mm rear spacing, just a minor hassle.

Almost all parts on this bike are "modern" Velo Orange seat post and headset, Nitto stem, Soma Hwy 1 handlebars, Velocity wheels, Cane Creek levers. I decided to stick with downtube shifters, although they are 9 speed SIS (indexed) so they are as modern as any "brifter" type set ups. I'm using Shimano Dura Ace all around because I have Shimano wheels in the house, but might switch to modern Campy some day.

I really like riding the bike, and actually enjoy the change of pace using the downtube indexed shifters. I tried friction shifters but they were too fussy in trimming for 9 speed.... and I'm not a neophyte shifter - used friction shifters for many, many years, but only 5 and 6 gears in back. The fun of riding with a perfectly functioning indexed DT shifters has kind of de-motivated me to look into a Campy Ergo drivetrain.

I also like the way it looks with silver parts, except I'm about to experiment de-anodizing and polishing the chain rings to make them silver instead of gray. I think black all around might look great too, especially if the derailleurs could be black as well.


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## charlox5

here's my 83 Nuovo Alloro



It started out like this:


The process was pretty straightforward. I completely repainted it: Stripped, sanded the tubing; electrolysis-treated the rusty spots; paint matched that original old school version of Celeste in an Acrylic Enamel, primed, painted, and cleared. In retrospect, I should have gone with a single stage urethane, but I'll remember for next time. I then fitted it with Centaur 10sp, built the wheels, and reused the stem, bars, seatpost. Since these pics were taken, I've changed the saddle to a Brooks B17. The wheels took a bit of work--given my weight and hub compatibility, running old school shamals like I wanted to wasn't going to work. So I bought a set of black ano'd Kinlin XR380's, stripped the anodizing, then polished the bare aluminum and built them up 24/28. 

Some points:

1. I absolutely think that silver components look better on older steel bikes. To this day the carbon-look brake levers on my bike give me a few sads when I see them. Threaded stem adapters are evil, based solely on looks. Especially when there are so many options for beautiful pantographed stems out there to use.

2. I cold spread my frame at home, and while it took a few iterations, I eventually got it to where I needed it to be. I think it's worth while just to make life easier on the road working on flats. Some shops cold spread.

3. Old school rear drop outs don't work very well with the softer teeth on most modern hubsets. They don't work with modern aluminum skewers either. The reason this is bad is the wheel will pull forward in the rear drop outs under power, then bind up the rear against the chainstays, and it could be fairly dangerous. The solution is to run a steel skewer that you can crank the hell out of. Roughen up the drop outs to increase the friction. I think you can also run a chain tensioner that would help eliminate the problem: Chain Tensioners, Chain Tensioners @ eBikeStop.com - The online supplier for all your cycling needs...

4. Removing old square taper cranks can be tough if the bike you get is in rough shape. I know I had to try more than a few tricks (blowtorch, massively long lever arms, creative repurposing of my bench vise, lots of pb blaster) to get the bearing race/shell/whatevers out of my BB. 

5. Modern brakes can be fitted to old frames, but usually, they need to be flipped around front to back. The threaded length on front brakes is about the right length to mount to the rear of a steel frame. Mounting the front brake requires the selection of the right length brake nut (longer than usual).


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## armstrong

I'm building up a modern/vintage Bianchi. It's been a project for a few months now, now just waiting to find an appropriate length quill stem.

This recent thread I started a while back has a lot of tangentially related discussion on this topic.

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/retro-classic/can-vintage-steel-ride-match-modern-ride-325765.html


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## pete2528ca

Here is mine. I love riding it. Surprisingly the wheels and gruppo fit without any real tinkering. I thought I would have to spread out the rear triangle, but nope wheels went in easy.


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## quikrick1

You could *do* this... 
Mid 90's Tommasini steel frame with early 2000's Campy Record. The wheels are Campy Neutron and the stem is a chrome Cinelli Pinocchio (Columbus steel).


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## mike67

I just finished this one recently-
1986ish Schwinn Tempo








Components:
Dura Ace 10 speed shifters
Ultegra crank & bb
Ultegra cassette
105 derailleurs
105 brakes & levers
Wheelset: Wiel 50m carbon (ebay find, light, fast and affordable)
Continetal Grand Prix 23c
Ultegra carbon SPD-SL 
Selle Italia SLR


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## BLUE BOY

quikrick1 said:


> You could *do* this...
> Mid 90's Tommasini steel frame with early 2000's Campy Record. The wheels are Campy Neutron and the stem is a chrome Cinelli Pinocchio (Columbus steel).


Nice,nice,nice. Beautiful bike and I love the "turn of century Record groupo". 
I have the Chorus group of that era on my Spectrum and I love it. I've got spare chainrings, cassette, G springs, G spring carrier, & lever hoods. I'm going to get 25 years out of this groupo.


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## velodog

mid 80"s DeRosa









2013 Della Santa


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