# light weight nightmares



## deluc6519 (Sep 21, 2004)

after switching out richey wcs stems and finding that the newest generation has lost another 32 grams (106 actual vs 138 for the previous) i begin to wonder what would be considered too light for any component. i know there's no magic number when performance begins to suffer and as for the stem there's no noticeable difference between the two besides the weight and appearance but i did remember some light weight nighmares and some were heavier that other stuff i've used. here's my list what's yours? 

tires: hutchinson carbon comp air lights, 185 grams very fast, good ride, great traction, lasted about 700 miles with at least 1 flat every 100 miles. let's see didn't finish one race bc of them (so there goes using them as race tires) and had another going flat at the finish. 

tubes: anything latex

spokes: anything 15 gauge on a mtb

fork: the cannondale slice (made by time) on an 2001 R3000. around 400 grams such a wet noodle i swore off full carbon forks, until i got my S-works with it's C-4 315 grams and much stiffer

frame: sorry guys but a cannondale caad 5. wasn't super light, but was a little weak. a pedal went into my chain stay during a race and dented it up pretty bad with little impact, have seen frames break from crashes, and a lot of dents, (yes we're a cannondale dealer)


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## divve (May 3, 2002)

1) Hutchinson road tires have always been sketchy regardless of weight.
2) Nothing wrong with latex tubes. They're present in all high-end tubulars as well.
3) Nothing wrong with a spoke that has 15 gauge in it. DT Super Comp are specifically made for MTB disc duty.
4) The Cannondale fork has about the same stiffness as the current S-Works full carbon, both around 45N/mm deflection.

...thanks for playing; better luck next time.


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## deluc6519 (Sep 21, 2004)

just talking personal experences here on the forks, i don't know about the curent c-dale fork or any test data but the 2001 i had was very flexy and the C-4 isn't maybe i had a bad one it does happen. as for 15 gauge i'm talking straight gauge 15s used on a lot of factor mtb wheels i've had to replace in the shop i work give them about a year and they start going fast. 

that was my list and i was just wondering what others have had problems with.


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## weiwentg (Feb 3, 2004)

deluc6519 said:


> after switching out richey wcs stems and finding that the newest generation has lost another 32 grams (106 actual vs 138 for the previous) i begin to wonder what would be considered too light for any component. i know there's no magic number when performance begins to suffer and as for the stem there's no noticeable difference between the two besides the weight and appearance but i did remember some light weight nighmares and some were heavier that other stuff i've used. here's my list what's yours?
> 
> tires: hutchinson carbon comp air lights, 185 grams very fast, good ride, great traction, lasted about 700 miles with at least 1 flat every 100 miles. let's see didn't finish one race bc of them (so there goes using them as race tires) and had another going flat at the finish.
> 
> ...


the Syntace F99 weighs around what the new WCS does, and they are durable enough that the MTB version has a good reputation. ask on the MTBR board. the point being, apparently a 100g stem can be made safe with today's materials.
tires: Conti GP Supersonic. suitable for use on the track, but what's the point of running clinchers on the track?


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## CARBON110 (Apr 17, 2002)

*great question*

Things that ARE light and impressed me: Rolfs wheels getting clipped in races losing half their spokes at speed and staying upright for a good mile and hard braking. They don't have many spokes to begin with. 

My SRM got smacked by a car and runs perfectly 12,000 miles later. The durability of my 5900 after being in the same crash going 30 mph it didnt shatter but held up better than I did. Also the Bontrager fork only broke in 2 places but never completely came apart. Highly impressive. Frame was warped though. 

American classic sub 1100 tubular wheels feel like I don't even have wheels on my bike when I race them. They have taken many hard hits with no complaints but I have to true them before every race at least a little

Vredistein tires have impressed me over and over again with furability and longevity. After riding up Dogged Mtn in Western NC outside Asheville that is about 4 miles long and averages 16-20% my training partner told me the tube was coming through the side wall of my tire. I promptly took the tire off and palce some 1 dollar bills there and lowered teh psi to 90. They got me home the next 45 miles or so. Ridden them through glass many times and been lucky. I haven't got many flats on them but a friend of mine tried them on my recommendation and got 4 flats in less than 100 miles LOL

Magnesium makes me nervous in stems

Divve take a pill when trying to convey your information. He was asking for peoples experience.....thanks for playing; better luck next time AHAHAH thats pretty funny though


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## divve (May 3, 2002)

No problem. Just making sure I got my nipples in the right place


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## Coolhand (Jul 28, 2002)

Prima 199 handlebars were heavier then claimed, and flexed like crazy. 

The Hutchinson Carbon Comps were truly horrible tires. The Fusions were not too bad, but I wouldn't buy them over Conti's or Pro Races.

First generation Easton carbon seatposts were no prize either.

Most of Selle Italia's light saddles have been IMHO, overpriced, fragile, uncomfortable and without any real warranty or customer service.


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## poshscot (Dec 14, 2004)

i had some vittoria ultraspeed 20mm (140g each!!) on my TT wheels that when pumped up to 160psi were frighteningly fast and cornered like nothing else but after 400 miles (and only one puncture) they looked almost like a sieve they had so many cuts in them. great for supersmooth tarmac or the track but anything else and they dont last long at all.


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## zero85ZEN (Oct 11, 2002)

Coolhand said:


> Prima 199 handlebars were heavier then claimed, and flexed like crazy.
> 
> The Hutchinson Carbon Comps were truly horrible tires. The Fusions were not too bad, but I wouldn't buy them over Conti's or Pro Races.
> 
> ...


Catagorically dissagree with just about every point made.

Two pair of Prima 199's I've had came in right about 200 grams give or take a few grams. I didn't find them overly flexy...what do you expect them to be at that weight?

Hutchinson Carbon Comps have been great tires for me and I have had zero flats. Armstrong and the Postal/Discovery team ride Hutchinson and have had very good luck in the past as far as flats go. (As a side note, I ride my tires at about 85 to 90 psi for the front and 90 to 95 for the rear and have a very nice ride, great cornering, wet weather handling, negligable gain in rolling resistance and ZERO flats. For the record I'm pretty light at 140 to 45 pounds.)

Don't know about early Easton posts.

I find the Sella Italia Flite Evolution 2 to be the most comfortable saddle I've ever ridden. It fits my butt well. Sure it was expensive but cripes, it weighs about 100 grams! And how much warranty support can you expect with such a lightweight part that can be so easily comproised with the most superficial fall?


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## spookyload (Jan 30, 2004)

zero85ZEN said:


> Hutchinson Carbon Comps have been great tires for me and I have had zero flats. Armstrong and the Postal/Discovery team ride Hutchinson and have had very good luck in the past as far as flats go. (As a side note, I ride my tires at about 85 to 90 psi for the front and 90 to 95 for the rear and have a very nice ride, great cornering, wet weather handling, negligable gain in rolling resistance and ZERO flats. For the record I'm pretty light at 140 to 45 pounds.)


Don't fool yourself into thinking Discovery rides the same tires Hutchinson sells to the public. First off, they ride tubulars and not the Fusion or Carbon Comps being talked about here. Next, I recently saw a close up of one of lances tires and you could clearly tell it had the real label removed hiding the real brand. I would venture to say Discovery rides Dugast or Veloflex tubulars. True I have seen them ride the Discovery Fusioin tires, but it is usually in the parade lap around the champs elyses after the race is over.


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## AlexCad5 (Jan 2, 2005)

zero85ZEN said:


> Hutchinson Carbon Comps have been great tires for me and I have had zero flats. Armstrong and the Postal/Discovery team ride Hutchinson and have had very good luck in the past as far as flats go.


 I love riding on Carbon Comps, they have great road feel, and a nice grip. But in terms of longevity, they slice up so easily that 7-800 miles is all I expect from them (with some luck!) On the flip side, they're really cheap through Performance bike.

Basically anything really light is not going to have a long life. But if you're chasing low weight/latest tech, you won't care because by the time the item is about to break, you're already onto the next latest greatest thing.

Light weight that doesn't work that well?: Cane Creek 200sl brakes. They will stop the bike, but not with any kind of authority.


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## Cevan (Jul 19, 2004)

*I respectfully disagree.*



deluc6519 said:


> after switching out richey wcs stems and finding that the newest generation has lost another 32 grams (106 actual vs 138 for the previous) i begin to wonder what would be considered too light for any component. i know there's no magic number when performance begins to suffer and as for the stem there's no noticeable difference between the two besides the weight and appearance but i did remember some light weight nighmares and some were heavier that other stuff i've used. here's my list what's yours?
> 
> tires: hutchinson carbon comp air lights, 185 grams very fast, good ride, great traction, lasted about 700 miles with at least 1 flat every 100 miles. let's see didn't finish one race bc of them (so there goes using them as race tires) and had another going flat at the finish.
> 
> ...



I've had 15 gauge spokes on at least two sets of mtn bike wheelsets that I've built and raced with no issues.

My Slice fork on my 2000 C-dale R3000 isn't the least bit wobbly.

I agree with the Latex tubes.


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## pedalAZ (Jan 1, 1970)

*Agree on Cane Creek brakes*



AlexCad5 said:


> ILight weight that doesn't work that well?: Cane Creek 200sl brakes. They will stop the bike, but not with any kind of authority.


Yeah, they are light but suck for stopping power. Eveery time I get back on my MTB I am shocked at the difference, and practically go OTB until I get used to real brakes again.

Light stuff that does work well include Speedplay Ti X1's with after market tuning parts, down to 134 grams. Also, I have a 99 gram AX Lightness saddle that is very comfortable due to shape and flex. I've been surprised that my aluminum 111 gram 12-25 cassette has held up over 3,000 miles. Control Tech's bolt on skewers are only 66 grams and work great. Finally, BTP carbon bottle cages that are only 14 grams each, including the screws, which (surprisingly) have not broken in 18 months of use.


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