# Blackset Race /Dura Ace wheelset



## Rex Perry (Mar 14, 2002)

I've put about 300 miles on my new set of wheels from Bicycle Wheel Warehouse: Dura Ace hubs: New 7850 hub on rear wheel, 32 DT revolution spokes, radial front, 3x rear, blackset race rim, alloy nipples. 

They came in within a few grams of the advertised weight, which is rare these days. Front 669g, rear cassette = 803g; Set - 1472g w/o skewers. The front was actually 676 and the rear was exactly 803g. 

They arrived within a week quite true laterally. I did have to tweak a few spokes to get them near perfectly round. 

The Good
$449; enough said. 
This wheelset replaces a set of Bontrager Race Lite wheels on my Cannondale R5000 and they are a LOT more comfortable than the Race Lites. After a 65 mile ride today, my body is just a lot less beat up. I seem to be a tad faster up the hills, but I don't think 200 grams makes a huge difference for speed. The 27mm tall rims are more aero, but I can't tell much speed difference yet. The DA hubs are smooth as glass.

The Bad
I worry that the rims have no eyelets. The stated rim weight is a feathery 380 grams, but with 32 low-tension standard spokes, it probably won't be a problem. I think they should build the front with 28 spokes 2-cross. Radial looks cool, but 2-cross is more durable and more comfortable. I'm a little worried about Revolutions on the drive side, but if I have problems, I can replace them with butted 14-15 spokes for very little money. I have no idea who makes the rim. Anybody know? They ship with el cheapo rim tape. 

Overall
I think these wheels are a fantastic bargain at less than $500 with shipping. 
The rims are still true after 300 miles and a few potholes, and they should be. I'll know a lot more after 3,000 miles. The DT Revolution spokes have a nice soft feel, but the wheels aren't flexy, even after honking them up a 14-percent grade today. I'm actually impressed!


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## keppler (May 25, 2007)

Hi, I just spotted their webpage and I'm eyeing the Blackset Race / DT 240 w/ Revolution (Campy). How have yours held up so far?


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## Rex Perry (Mar 14, 2002)

I have almost 1000 miles on them at this point, including 2 century rides. No problems so far. You can tell the manufacturing standards on the rims is not up to someone like Mavic or DT. The finish isn't that great, but they're fast, light and super comfortable. I worry about them not having eyelets, but at 155 lbs, I don't worry much. I've had one minor truing for roundness since the first tweaking. Just a slight turn on 3 spokes. Great bargain for the under 180-pound. crowd. Ask them for heavier spokes and brass nipples if you're much over 180. The hubs and spokes rock; they're a huge improvement over my old Bontrager Race lights.


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## keppler (May 25, 2007)

I'm glad to hear they're working out for you.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Rex Perry said:


> .......my new set of wheels from Bicycle Wheel Warehouse: Dura Ace hubs: New 7850 hub on rear wheel, 32 DT revolution spokes, radial front, 3x rear, blackset race rim, alloy nipples. They came in within a few grams of the advertised weight, which is rare these days. Front 669g, rear cassette = 803g; Set - 1472g w/o skewers. The front was actually 676 and the rear was exactly 803g.
> They arrived within a week quite true laterally. I did have to tweak a few spokes to get them near perfectly round.
> I think these wheels are a fantastic bargain at less than $500 with shipping.


I just received, from BWW, a set of Open Pro/DuraAce/DT Comp/alum nipple wheels for my 'cross bike. What jewels those DA hubs are. I wasn't going to do this, but after reading your post I put the wheels on my wheel truing stand with a dial indicator. I couldn't believe what I found. They were both laterally true to 0.005". That folks is the thickness of a piece of newspaper that I measured. That's as true as I can get my wheels if I try really hard and truer than necessary. Checking even tensions with the very accurate pluck method proved that relative tensions were very acceptable.

Then I tested radial trueness. Good radial trueness is harder to get than lateral trueness. I found one wheel to have a very minimal hop of 0.010" (ten thou) and the other an exceptional 0.003". That folks, is the thickness of the thinnest paper you can find. I've built my own wheels for decades and I stop worrying about radial trueness long before either of these measurements.

I weighed them too and I was 2g away from their advertised weight.

Why did I get wheels from BWW when I usually build them myself? Well, to get the parts from my favorite mailorder place would have cost me $600. BWW can sell me the wheels built to such a fine tolerance for just $399.95. Heck if they had chucked all the loose parts in a box and charged me $100 more I would have *still* bought from them.

I haven't ridden the wheels yet as I'm waiting for new tires to arrive but I know they'll be ok as I've been pounding on a set of their OP/Ultegra wheels for five months with *no* issues.

I've been building my own wheels for five decades but at their prices and quality, I'm out of business!


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## wmayes (Aug 8, 2007)

*Which front lacing, etc?*

I am almost ready to jump in and buy a set of DA/OP from BWW myself. My questions are:

1. Which front wheel spoke lacing pattern?

2. Which Spokes and Nipples?

FYI, I am 190 pounds, and ride for fitness mostly. I do 2 centuries per season and ride 50-75 miles per week, slightly hilly in my area.

Thanks,

Bill


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

wmayes said:


> I am almost ready to jump in and buy a set of DA/OP from BWW myself.


Mine are now on the bike and ready to go. I might venture out in the snow this afternoon.

My questions are:
*1. Which front wheel spoke lacing pattern?*

My opinion - cross 3. I can't think of any good reasons to go radial other than to save a few grams - maybe about 5.

*2. Which Spokes and Nipples?*

DT Competitions in 2.0/1.8/2.0 gauge. This time I went with black spokes as I've never had any before and I love 'em! I didn't think I would. The Revolution spokes are much thinner in the middle and save a bit of weight but unless you're a light racer dude, it's just not worth it.
I have aluminum nipples on all my wheels (5 bikes) and in a decade and a half I've not had a problem with them. Brass are stronger (and cheaper) but, for me, the extra strength hasn't been needed. You won't notice the weight saving (20g per wheel) but you will notice the color! If you choose red that is.

*FYI, I am 190 pounds, and ride for fitness mostly. I do 2 centuries per season and ride 50-75 miles per week, slightly hilly in my area.*

You're much like me and I'm 10lbs heavier and these are going on my dirt road 'cross bike.

They'll be great wheels for you. The DA hubs are a bit overkill compared to Ultegra but I now have both and the DA are like little jewels. The DA wheels at BWW are about $160 more than the Ultegs but if that doesn't bother you then go DA. I would. They're MUCH nicer inside (and outside too) and yes I've had mine apart before I ride them. They have a titanium cassette carrier.


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## wmayes (Aug 8, 2007)

*Ordered 'em*

Mike T.,

Thanks for the input and I ordered the wheels as per your suggestions. Black/Black/Silver Nipples for a little contrast. I'll post some pix as soon as I get them. 

Good luck with yours and watch out for that yellow snow!

--Bill M.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

wmayes said:


> Mike T.,
> Thanks for the input and I ordered the wheels as per your suggestions. Black/Black/Silver Nipples for a little contrast. I'll post some pix as soon as I get them.
> Good luck with yours and watch out for that yellow snow!
> --Bill M.


Cool! Yeah I'm a yellow snow expert. You'll like those wheels. Here's a teaser with the wheels on the bike. I just took a spin up the street. The wheels didn't fall apart. Maaaan it's f-freezin' out there!


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## matthewtucker (Aug 7, 2007)

Question for the group...I'm 165...thinking of the DA/Blackset Race with 3x 32 front and rear with revos front and non DS and comps DS. Training/crit wheel. Should I be OK given weight? I'm not terribly hard on equipment, though I did fold a mavic ksyrium in half last year (front wheel over a bump...JRA)...only wheel failure I've had ever...in 15 years.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

matthewtucker said:


> Question for the group...I'm 165...thinking of the DA/Blackset Race with 3x 32 front and rear with revos front and non DS and comps DS. Training/crit wheel. Should I be OK given weight? I'm not terribly hard on equipment, though I did fold a mavic ksyrium in half last year (front wheel over a bump...JRA)...only wheel failure I've had ever...in 15 years.


What I would do is contact BWW's Chris and ask his opinion. I see he has a great wheel customizing program now. He mentioned that he's getting a shipment of DT Supercomps soon - 2.0/1.7/1.8mm.

I've got samples of all DT spokes and the single spoke weights are -

Revs - 4g
Supercomps - 5g
Comps - 6g (2.0/1.8/2.0mm version)

I know weighing 32 spokes is more accurate than weighing just one but I think you get the drift. Supercomps could save you a gram per spoke on the DS and you still have the 2mm hub flange end for strength.


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## cmg (Oct 27, 2004)

Do it matt, i have this set up and i'm heavier. you should be good. or if you really want a strong wheel build with DB14's both sides of the rear.


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## matthewtucker (Aug 7, 2007)

OK - just emailed BWW. I tried the phone # listed on the site, but it didn't work. Anybody know the phone number? I like talking with humans....


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Try -

Within the US: 800-979-0028
From outside the US: 714-754-1716


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