# Flat repair / tubeless



## Cooper1960 (Oct 14, 2010)

From what I've been reading tubeless tires don't flat as often as tubed but I have to think sooner or later it will happen so.... 

For all you folks that run tubeless tires how do you repair a flat on the side of the road? What do you need to carry with you?

If you're running a wheel like Dura Ace 7850's can you just install a tube to finish the ride? Do you need any tools to pull the valve stem?

I also noticed there's not a lot of tire options for tubeless. Again using 7850's as an example if I decide to stay with a tube set up can I use any tire or do I still need to run a tubeless style tire?

Thanks


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## MerlinAma (Oct 11, 2005)

I have new Dura Ace tubeless wheels that I haven't ridden since the tires have not arrived.
It is my understanding that on the road, you would put in a tube to finish a ride. 
A friend has the Ultegra tubeless wheel but runs regular tires/tubes all the time as the tubeless tires are expensive.


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

It's really pretty easy, if you understand it. Practice at home when comfortable, and not out on the road. Learn how to do it first!

If your sealant doesn't catch it, the patch is easy. You unmount just the part of the bead where the hole is and fold it around while you work on it. You take your little bottle of acetone, wet your little cloth, and clean the area that you're patching.

Then you use the glue from the standard patch kit and rub that one. Let it dry. Then stick the patch on. You can leave the plastic on there.

Remount the bead, inflate with CO2, and go. No need for any follow-up, it's a permanent fix.

Road Tubeless is a little different than tubular or clincher, so you really have to understand it and practice the repair at home. Of course you could put a tube in, but that requires later followup- too much trouble for me.


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## dudigrinfeld (Aug 18, 2010)

you repair it by putting a new inner tube inside and basically turn your tubeless wheel set to regular clincher.


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## localcyclist (May 9, 2008)

my go to repair option on the mtb is to plug the whole. i use the genuine innovations tubeless repair tool and a rubber band coated in patch glue. the tool is used to push the rubber band part way through the whole from the outside. when you pull the tool out the rubber band unstretches and expands filling the whole while the glue seals it. onnce sealed trim the excess down flush with the surface of the tire using small nail clippers or something sharp. the tool does come with these rope things which work ok but are temporary while the rubberband makes a permanent plug.

this works well for mtb tires which are obviously much lower pressure. i havent tried it yet on the road bike because after three years i haven't had to, every small puncture was sealed by stans.

the potential upside is pluggin the whole from the outside meaning that you don't even have to unseat the bead. you can also load more rubber bands onto the tool for larger punctures. large sidewall cuts are stil going to need a boot and tube or a cellphone.


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## orange_julius (Jan 24, 2003)

dudigrinfeld said:


> you repair it by putting a new inner tube inside and basically turn your tubeless wheel set to regular clincher.


I had to do this a few weeks ago and it wasn't that painful. Just have to be extra careful to not get the inner tube pinched.


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## orange_julius (Jan 24, 2003)

localcyclist said:


> my go to repair option on the *mtb* is to plug the whole. i use the genuine innovations tubeless repair tool and a rubber band coated in patch glue. the tool is used to push the rubber band part way through the whole from the outside. when you pull the tool out the rubber band unstretches and expands filling the whole while the glue seals it. onnce sealed trim the excess down flush with the surface of the tire using small nail clippers or something sharp. the tool does come with these rope things which work ok but are temporary while the rubberband makes a permanent plug.
> 
> this works well for mtb tires which are obviously much lower pressure. i havent tried it yet on the road bike because after three years i haven't had to, every small puncture was sealed by stans.
> 
> the potential upside is pluggin the whole from the outside meaning that you don't even have to unseat the bead. you can also load more rubber bands onto the tool for larger punctures. large sidewall cuts are stil going to need a boot and tube or a cellphone.


Do you have repair experience on a road bike?


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## kombo (Aug 26, 2010)

Cooper1960 said:


> From what I've been reading tubeless tires don't flat as often as tubed but I have to think sooner or later it will happen so....
> 
> For all you folks that run tubeless tires how do you repair a flat on the side of the road? What do you need to carry with you?
> 
> ...


I have this wheelset mounted with Hutchinson Fusion Road Tubeless tires and filled with Stans sealant. Here are the two experiences I had with punctures. 

First puncture occurred on my rear tire when I was climbing. I could all of a sudden hear the leak. I saw the Stans leaking out, but it wouldn't seal the hole. I kept riding uphill, but the leak wouldn't stop. Before I got off the bike, I quickly turned around and headed downhill to see if the increased rpm's of the tire would help seal. About 30 seconds later my tire had sealed. I stopped and pumped a little air into it and finished my ride. I put at least another 1000 miles on those tires without any problems until they were worn out. (never even patched it, the Stans held strong).

The second puncture was not so pleasant. I had a slightly larger puncture on the rear tire this time around. (this was a fairly new set of Fusion 3 road tubeless). This time the Stans would not fill the hole. I stopped and spun the crank to get the wheel spinning fast, but no luck. Tried pumping some air into it, and it felt like it was holding, so I kept riding, but I could feel the tire getting soft again after a mile. I stopped and a buddy used the CO2 inflator to give my tire some air. The pressure from this pushed out the Stans that had started to dry and seal, and my tire was leaking air bad again. It was time to attempt to put in a tube. If you've ever mounted the Hutchinson Fusion Road Tubeless tire on this rim, you will know that it is the most intense bead ever; a truly frustrating experience that never really gets any easier. I've snapped many levers mounting these tires to these wheels in the past, so I really didn't feel like putting a tube in, but it was my only option. I was extra careful putting the tube in since I knew that it would be a tight squeeze with that stiff bead. The Stans liquid was getting everywhere and making a mess. This is nothing like replacing a tube on a clincher. I can do that in under 5 minutes no problems. I finally managed to get the tube in and wrestle the bead back on the rim. When I went to pump up the tube, it wouldn't hold any air. I had somehow punctured it in the process. Now I was screwed. I ended up calling someone for a ride home. Later I cleaned the inside of the tire out and patched it. It has been like new ever since.

I've always loved the tubeless setup and thought it was bombproof, but that last experience has slightly changed my attitude. I've had two punctures in two years; one fixed itself, and the other left me stranded. Being stranded once in two years is ok with me. 

I would recommend carrying the following in your bag:
-spare tube
-mini pump (or CO2, but the CO2, might break the Stans seal)
-a paper towel or two (the Stans gets messy if you have to unmount the tire plus you can wipe the inside of the tire dry if you decide to patch on the road)
-a patch kit (Hutchinson makes one specific for their road tubeless called Rep'Air)
-pair of good quality levers
-some patience


You can run any clincher tire on the 7850SL with a tube, otherwise you're forced to use Hutchinson Road Tubeless tires.

You don't need a special tool to remove the valve stem from the rim. It just screws off with your fingers.


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## localcyclist (May 9, 2008)

orange_julius said:


> I had to do this a few weeks ago and it wasn't that painful. Just have to be extra careful to not get the inner tube pinched.


i have been riding road tubeless for three years now without having to repair a flat (knock on wood). i have had small punctures that the stans sealed and was good to go after adding a little air. i just offered up the plugging method from my mtb experience, where i've plugged multiple tires (tucson has a lot of sharp pointy rocks). maybe the next time i'm ready to replace a worn tire i might punch some wholes in it and test the plug method.


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## MerlinAma (Oct 11, 2005)

Why wouldn't you just use a tube for on the road fix and the Hutchison repair kit when you get home?
That's my plan if/when I have a flat.
I don't intend to ever use the sealant crap in my tires. I'm looking for comfort and performance. Flats aren't much of an issue thank goodness.


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## localcyclist (May 9, 2008)

question:


MerlinAma said:


> Why wouldn't you just use a tube for on the road fix and the Hutchison repair kit when you get home?
> That's my plan if/when I have a flat.
> I don't intend to ever use the sealant crap in my tires. I'm looking for comfort and performance. Flats aren't much of an issue thank goodness.


answer: because 1985 called and wanted their tubes back

serious answer: because most small punctures will seal fine no problem without the headache of putting in a tube and then getting home and patching the tire. its just the once every couple years occasion that you need to find a way to limp home, which is well worth the otherwise tube free blissful life.


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## edscueth (Jul 12, 2008)

I have run the 7850's all summer and have had 2 flats already (however its less then what I had last year). One was simple, the sealant worked and I was able to finish my ride. Maybe I am too lazy but instead of patching it and taking the risk of it flating again I trashed it and bought a new one. Since the cut went all the way through I just felt it was too risky. 
My other flat was in the rain and way to big for the sealant to hold. As others said I tried to speed up but it was flat fast. I mounted the tires myself, but in the rain it sucked trying to get the bead back over after putting a tube in it. I eventually gave up and relunctently called for a ride. Of course, once my ride showed up I had just got the bead over (I won't say how long it took). Again, since it was gashed so bad I just trashed the tire. 
The flats did sour my experience at first and to say the least tires aren't cheap. However (knock on wood), I haven't flatted for a while and the ride is awesome so I am back on the tubeless bandwagon!


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## worthcycle (Apr 13, 2011)

This was the only flat I have had with tubeless in 2 years - needless to say it required a phone call to get me home! If I had standard tubed clinchers I would have had the same problem as this cut is bead to bead and a has a really large flap that I don't think would have been bootable. 

When I heard how quickly it happened I told everyone on the ride "see you later - nothing will fix this tire" before I even stopped! I don't know if I hit a razor blade or something else sharp. I had lots of time to look for the offending part, but only found a busted up and flattened combination lock in the road - I guess it could have been part of that...


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## aaric (Mar 10, 2011)

I run Stans in mine. Works really well for 90%+ of punctures. I carry a spare tube and a nice set of levers, and a boot for the time when the tire won't hold air. I've had a couple punctures at speed on a downhill that just resulted in a 5-10 psi pressure loss...that alone is worth the hassle/weight of stans IMO.

I did get a couple nasty cuts into the rear tire recently, and the stans would only hold to 40PSI...but that was enough to get me home.


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## dekindy (Jul 7, 2006)

I really don't know why anyone would have difficulty installing Hutchinson Road Tubeless tires. I have small, weak hands and used to dread installing tires. Now that I have the proper technique installing any tire is no longer a chore, just something that I have to deal with occasionally.

If you are installing new tires get them warm and supple by letting them sit in the Sun or put them in the dryer on low heat. Start at the valve stem and keep the tire centered in the middle channel to give minimize the stretch on the tire and it should go on easy enough. In the Summer they will be plenty easy enough to change on the road. Winter time might be another story but I have no experience so don't know for certain.

I have always used Stan's sealant but have yet to have a hole sealed but it is always a mess on the road. If you have road tubeless wheels I would seriously consider skipping sealant. I may try CaffeLatex but Stan's has not sealed any of my holes and since I do not have valve stems with removable cores it is messy to install. Caffelatex can be installed through a regular valve.

If you have a flat install a tube and take care to keep all the tubeless valve stem parts intact. The Hutchinson patch kit works flawlessly as I have had sidewall patches last for thousands of miles.


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## glance2 (Jan 2, 2011)

I use Stan's sealant and carry a tube. If I flat, I'll put in a tube and wait until I get home to patch it with Hutchinson's. I was thinking of carrying some small container of sealant and the patch kit on the road. But, due to my lack of skill, it still takes me a long time to add sealant, find leak, install tire, etc that I don't want to mess around with it on the road. It's faster for me to add the tube and deal with it later.


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## GreenBoy (Aug 10, 2011)

This is going to sound crazy but I've done this and it worked. I blew out a tubular hitting a hole in the road. My mom of all people suggested this. She had a product called UGlu - it's like a gel type tape adhesive. I put it over the hole in the tire and cut a small piece of bar tape and put it over the UGlu. It was ugly and a little bumpy. But it got me back to my apartment just fine - about 7 or 8 miles. It held air pressure all the way. 

I haven't perfected this yet - the first time I used it was just in a pinch so I could get home and haven't had to deal with another flat since. But, I'm carrying some of the stuff w/me because its tiny and easier to carry on me than a second tire. 

Again, I don't have a good system yet but I think this might be a good way to be able to finish a ride/race without having to put on new tires or even carry them with you.


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## nayr497 (Nov 8, 2008)

I have been running tubeless on my cross bike for around 6 months. No flats, yet, knock on wood.

Just to clarify...
1) If you get a small puncture HOPEFULLY the sealant will just fill it. You might have to add some air, but it should fix on its own, right? (I'm riding Hutchinson Bulldog tires with Stans No Tubes kit/latex/sealant on Ksyrium wheels).

2) If the puncture can't be fixed, something like the Hutchinson Fast Air should work. Are there any other "road side" fix products?

3) As an alternative to the Fast Air you can dump out/peel out the latex and put in a tube.

I'm asking because I accidentally dropped my Fast Air can yesterday, it hit a pebble just right and...POOF! There goes $15.

In looking around to replace it I'm trying to figure out what other similar products there are out there.

Thanks!


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## pmt (Aug 4, 2009)

nayr497 said:


> 2) If the puncture can't be fixed, something like the Hutchinson Fast Air should work. Are there any other "road side" fix products?


Sure, just patch it right there on the side of the road. There are several Road Tubeless threads that detail it, but the short of it is to just unmount part of the bead where the puncture is, clean with acetone or equivalent, and slap a regular patch on. Remount and hit with CO2, no followup needed.


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## Newnan3 (Jul 8, 2011)

Be sure that you dont over tighten the valve stem nut. I recently had a sidewall cut on my mtn bike that the sealant couldnt fix so i had to attempt to install a tube. The problem was I had tightened the valve stem nut so tight with pliers i couldnt loosen it with my fingers. And of course nobody carries pliers in their repair kit. 

The solution: Walk out of the woods a couple of miles......


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