# Blinking Tail lights? yea or ne



## hdave_CO (Jun 26, 2005)

I ride primarily during the afternoon commute hours. Usually the attempts to run me over are infrequent. BUT yesterday a cell phone dialing woman about ended it for me. She barely missed me before going over the bike lane and almost off the rode. If i was 10 yards further doen the road she would have pancaked me.

SO - Do you think blinking tail light would have helped? I have never used one, but on the way home it struck me that there may be something to it.

I was looking at the Cateye Cat Eye TL-LD1000 - looks like the brightest one out.

Share your thoughts?


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## vol245 (Jan 20, 2002)

hdave_CO said:


> I ride primarily during the afternoon commute hours. Usually the attempts to run me over are infrequent. BUT yesterday a cell phone dialing woman about ended it for me. She barely missed me before going over the bike lane and almost off the rode. If i was 10 yards further doen the road she would have pancaked me.
> 
> SO - Do you think blinking tail light would have helped? I have never used one, but on the way home it struck me that there may be something to it.
> 
> ...


If you are riding in the dusk or dark it will help. How dark was it when this happened. I'm glad you lived. She should be beat to death.


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## Bryan (Sep 19, 2004)

I've never used one, but from seeing them on other bikes while driving they seem to draw your attention. I doubt a search light would have saved you from the phone lady. In my opinion the worst time to be riding on the road is around 3pm when the High Schools empty out. School buses are everywhere and the teenage moreons like to drive Mama's Ford Expedition at 75mph in 35mph zones.


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## KendleFox (Sep 5, 2005)

*Bright clothes*

Being a motercycle rifer too, I'd have to say that during the day, bright colored clothing makes the biggest difference. But of course the cell phone lady would have ran you over anyways...Glad to know your alright though...


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## firstrax (Nov 13, 2001)

Tail lights are always a good idea. Out on the darkest back roads you want it on constant mode. Drunks tend to aim for flashing stuff. The goal is to be obvious without being interesting. My SOP is flashing when among other light sources (street lights, etc) and steady mode in the absence of other light sources.


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## achiral (Feb 24, 2005)

firstrax said:


> Tail lights are always a good idea. Out on the darkest back roads you want it on constant mode. Drunks tend to aim for flashing stuff. The goal is to be obvious without being interesting. My SOP is flashing when among other light sources (street lights, etc) and steady mode in the absence of other light sources.


I also remember reading a study on drunks fixating on (and driving towards) blinking lights. I'm curious where the original data came from? (i.e. drunks may fixate on blinking things, but is there data that supports the hypothesis that drunks are more likely to swerve into cop cars / cars with emergency blinkers than cars merely sporting brake lights? Rethinking this, I would guess there is, since many police departments have switched to constant-on lights for traffic stops in the last 5 years.)

In any case, I don't think I would be using rear blinking lights in Alaska or significant parts of the southwest at night (studies show an incredibly high percent of drivers are inebriated in these regions).

During daylight, the best thing to do is wear bright clothing, give yourself plenty of space, and be very aware of who or what is around you. The chances are that anything except a very bright headlight will merely get washed out during sunlight hours. On an overcast day, on the other hand, blinking lights would probably be much more effective.


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## Andy M-S (Feb 3, 2004)

*colors/lights*

During daylight, hi-viz green is a good color to be wearing; once it gets dark, I have at least three rear lights on my bike -- my preference is one on the fender, steady; one on the bag, fast blinking, and one on my helmet, chase pattern. So far, so good.

One thing--fast vs. slow blink. This morning, I was passed by a road bike (something Ti, I think) running no headlight that I could see and a single SLOW blinky. He was moving fast, and the blink rate wasn't good enough to allow my eyes to follow him closely.

Vista's Total Eclipse, at least the ones I have, have a very fast blink rate (like 20/second, at a guess, looking at the one on my pack right now). This is enough for the circuit to really pump the LEDs (I wonder if they're overdriven somehow?) and yet conserve battery power.

Side note--even though it was cold (35F +/-) dark and foggy, I saw 5 other bike commuters on my route this morning. Most of them had some kind of light...


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## firstrax (Nov 13, 2001)

achiral said:


> I'm curious where the original data came from?


IACP & AAA


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## The Walrus (Apr 2, 2000)

I never seem to find myself on pitch dark roads around here, so I go for at least one flashing light, the more obnoxious the better. The Vistalite Total Eclipse is good, but I haven't seen anything commercially available that's more impressive than the NiteRider--it truly is easily visible during the day, and at night it verges on overkill.

I also like the NiteRider because the Digital Evolution headlight it's piggybacked on has the assortment of flashing modes, which are great on heavily overcast/rainy days or in late afternoon when the sun's behind me. A lot of motorists actually seem to be intimidated by it.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

The Walrus said:


> I never seem to find myself on pitch dark roads around here, so I go for at least one flashing light, the more obnoxious the better. The Vistalite Total Eclipse is good, but I haven't seen anything commercially available that's more impressive than the NiteRider--it truly is easily visible during the day, and at night it verges on overkill.
> 
> I also like the NiteRider because the Digital Evolution headlight it's piggybacked on has the assortment of flashing modes, which are great on heavily overcast/rainy days or in late afternoon when the sun's behind me. A lot of motorists actually seem to be intimidated by it.


I have the same setup except with a HID headlight. I was burning both on my rainy commute home yesterday. The niterider tail light has 16 LEDs, you would have a hard time finding something better. I did see a 4X4" tail light once at a century that the guy had made with parts from Radio Shack. It had 36 LEDs and looking at it made your brain itch.


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## MisJG (Feb 27, 2004)

I have a Cat Eye TL-LD600 on my seat post. Had another bike rider come up behind ma as i was stopped at a light. It was a really sunny day and he said he was amazed at how far away he could see my light. If the 1000 is like the 600, then I would definately recommend it. I also have the TL-LD500 (red) on the back of my rear rack. It has a reflector built in, but I don't think it's as visable in the day. I run them both flashing all the time anyway.


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## Chase15.5 (Feb 17, 2005)

On the commuter trails in DC, I find the flashing red light attracts my attention more easily than a steady red. I use flashing primarily for that reason.


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## hdave_CO (Jun 26, 2005)

Great feedback! Thanks. I am going shoping here soon. That lst close call really bothered me and riding primarily during rush hours - everyone is on the phone - ready to run a guy over.

Thanks again! Smooth Roads.


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## northcoast (Jul 11, 2003)

Chase15.5 said:


> On the commuter trails in DC, I find the flashing red light attracts my attention more easily than a steady red. I use flashing primarily for that reason.


I use flashing lights too. Also, for the young boys on my commute route, the guy with the blinking lights that looks like a moving Christmas tree is great for target practice with rocks.


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## CNY rider (Feb 9, 2005)

I've got that model Cateye, plus the little blinkies that go in the handlebar ends. You wil be seen from quite a distance with that combo flashing away. The bar end flashers are only ten bucks or so. you should get a set when you buy your tail light.


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## jd3 (Oct 8, 2004)

*Get One !*

If you ride at dusk or later you really need one. I was riding a group ride at dusk and watching two bikes ahead of me with blinkies. As they topped a hill, there were two more bikes with them that I could not see until they topped a hill and were silhouetted against the horizon. That convinced me of the need for at least rear lights. I run two, one on the bike and one on my helmet. The one on the bike is a Blackburn Mars 3.0. I really like this light, 5 leds red to the rear and one yellow on each side. I do a night group ride with lots of different lights and these are the brightest. I can see red light shining on the ground behind the bikes with them. They do not cost near as much as the Cateye and are equal or better imho.


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## MikeBiker (Mar 9, 2003)

Make sure that the read LED lights are properly aligned. I came upon a cyclist who I thought had no rear light. When I got close, I saw the light. It was on his backpack and when he was riding, the light was visible for aircraft landings only.


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## PJay (May 28, 2004)

*steady not flashing-*

this has come up before.
months ago, someone mentioned that it is harder to tell what you are looknig at when you look at a blinking red versus steady red tail light.
So I started paying attn.

I think it is much easier to tell where a bike is and how fast it is moving when the light is steady. When this is combined with reflective tape, it is even better.

I think your brain has to make a summary gestalt out of all the available pieces of information. when the light is blinking, your mind can't establish where it is - think of a firefly - they seem to disappear then reappear almost like magic.

BTW: the drunks are heading for the blinking light because it looks like a honkytonk.


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## Art853 (May 30, 2003)

*reflective triangle*

Works well in the day and night to make a biker more visible. I bought it at the LBS.

Past sunset I add blinking front and rear lights.


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## unclemimo (Aug 24, 2005)

I'll second the new Mars lights from Blackburn. The 2.0 is perfect for a rack mount also.

I'm a two light proponent, bike blinks, bag is steady. 

A customer told me once "I'd rather be called a x-mas tree and live to tell about!" His bike, bag and outfit was one blinking mass, you couldn't help but giggle at the whole setup.


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## simoriah (Jul 21, 2005)

PJay said:


> this has come up before.
> months ago, someone mentioned that it is harder to tell what you are looknig at when you look at a blinking red versus steady red tail light.
> So I started paying attn.
> 
> ...



I ride with two red lights. One's flashing. One's steady. ALWAYS. Doesn't matter if it's 5am or noon.


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## skinnydipp (Sep 9, 2005)

*aircraft*

I don't have a source offhand, but in a neurophysiology course we were talking about different aspects of vision. One tidbit was that airplanes switched to blinking lights and the number of collisions dropped since the brain could interpret the data better. Apparantly there is a name, which escapes me sorry, for the effect of a single constant light source against a dark background, which then appears to be moving in a direction it's not.


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## KenS (Jan 28, 2004)

*that would be the "autokinetic effect"*



skinnydipp said:


> I don't have a source offhand, but in a neurophysiology course we were talking about different aspects of vision. One tidbit was that airplanes switched to blinking lights and the number of collisions dropped since the brain could interpret the data better. Apparantly there is a name, which escapes me sorry, for the effect of a single constant light source against a dark background, which then appears to be moving in a direction it's not.


From a perceptual standpoint, it would be best to be running at least a couple of lights. The visual system is very good at integrating patterns of points in some kind of coherent motion. There are many examples of this effect, which are often subsumed under the general term "structure from motion." 

Ken


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## haiku d'etat (Apr 28, 2001)

it was overcast today and when i got dropped i could see that one of the riders in our group (1/2 mile up the road, LOL) was very visible with a flashing tail light.

however, as a rider, i find them distracting/irritating. constant mode is preferred.

but yes, lights, reflective gear, and bright or white jerseys help.

i've done extensive dark riding training for and on brevets and double centuries, you want to be lit up like an xmas tree.


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## bigdeal (Jul 24, 2002)

*nite rider*

i have a nite rider tail light, you can see the thing ANYTIME. On the commute home i will look back, at least once a week, and see people either catchin' up or drafting, then they are quick to say 'nice light, do you mind if I latch on?'. Once in a while a group will catch me and tell me to jump on and stay at the back.


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