# Suggestions on shorter stem?



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

I'm riding a 90 mm stem right now and, while it's comfortable and left me with no pain (other than sore pride from being slow from not-cycling for over a year), I noticed my hands were about 2 cm away from the bulges of the hoods, just out of reach of the brakes.

I think that, for now, this is just fine. When I get a job October 1st and pay my folks back for the bike, I'm considering getting a shorter stem to improve my fit.

70? 60? Is there a way to tell on my bike right now what stem I need? Do I have to try them out before I buy them?

I quickfired on amazon and found this: Amazon.com: FSA OS190 Stem - +/-6°, 70mm: Sports & Outdoors

Yes? No? Never?

I also want to get a bike computer, because I'm obsessed with statistics and numbers, I like keeping track of things. Can anyone recommend a good wireless one ? Is there such a thing as a good wireless bike computer?

I'm picking up a ski mask and a big obnoxious flashlight today, the flea is just not bright enough for 5 am on the bike path in Toronto. Yes I know I should be on the road, but they're a bit crappy near the path.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

My advice re: the stem swap and bike computer is to take that money, find a reputable LBS and go get a standard fitting. During the fitting, the LBS may even swap a comparable stem at no cost, with a likely result being a better _overall_ fit - not just a tweak to reach.

Re: bike computers, I always recommend units with cadence. If you're on a budget, I suggest staying with a wired version like the Cateye Astrale 8 - about $35 at Nashbar.

If you're set on wireless, the Cateye Strada Double Wireless would be my choice.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> My advice re: the stem swap and bike computer is to take that money, find a reputable LBS and go get a standard fitting. During the fitting, the LBS may even swap a comparable stem at no cost, with a likely result being a better _overall_ fit - not just a tweak to reach.
> 
> Re: bike computers, I always recommend units with cadence. If you're on a budget, I suggest staying with a wired version like the Cateye Astrale 8 - about $35 at Nashbar.
> 
> If you're set on wireless, the Cateye Strada Double Wireless would be my choice.


A standard fitting comes with my bike purchase, the guy who does the fittings is away this week so I was told to call Monday to set up an appointment. I am of course going to do the fitting first before jumping into a stem switchout, but...I just don't see these guys doing any part changing without charging me for the part. I figured I'd get the info from you guys and that way I'm ready if they decide not to switch for free.

I'm definitely going to get a unit with cadence, I feel that's most of the reason people get computers anyway. The rest of the work can be done with mapmyride and a wristwatch, but it's also easier to track stats if you need something to measure and fine tune cadence. The computer is a secondary thing, but yeah if I bought one it would have to be wireless. Thanks PJ.


----------



## 9W9W (Apr 5, 2012)

Hey OP,
If you're on a budget you may want to consider picking up these items slightly used on fleabay. Some good deals on Magiclights, bike computers and whatnot. It may be the difference between getting that inevitable first scuff in a wired unit and strapping a wireless one with an existing scuff.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> A standard fitting comes with my bike purchase, the guy who does the fittings is away this week so I was told to call Monday to set up an appointment. I am of course going to do the fitting first before jumping into a stem switchout, but...I just don't see these guys doing any part changing without charging me for the part. I figured I'd get the info from you guys and that way I'm ready if they decide not to switch for free.


I follow you. I'd take it one step at a time, because even if the LBS charges you for a stem swap it may be comparable to what you'd pay somewhere else. _And_ they'll install it, which (while it isn't difficult) does require pre-loading the headset bearings.


----------



## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

jfd986 said:


> Can anyone recommend a good wireless one ? Is there such a thing as a good wireless bike computer?


Of course. My three Sigma 1600 series computers have been faultless over the past 4 years or so.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I follow you. I'd take it one step at a time, because even if the LBS charges you for a stem swap it may be comparable to what you'd pay somewhere else. _And_ they'll install it, which (while it isn't difficult) does require pre-loading the headset bearings.


What is pre-loading the headset bearings? They told me everything was sealed. The only experience I have with headset bearings is taking them out of my old 80s bike, cleaning them off, cleaning the cup and putting fresh grease in.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> My advice re: the stem swap and bike computer is to take that money, find a reputable LBS and go get a standard fitting. During the fitting, the LBS may even swap a comparable stem at no cost, with a likely result being a better _overall_ fit - not just a tweak to reach.
> 
> Re: bike computers, I always recommend units with cadence. If you're on a budget, I suggest staying with a wired version like the Cateye Astrale 8 - about $35 at Nashbar.
> 
> If you're set on wireless, the Cateye Strada Double Wireless would be my choice.



Okay, so I just found out how much the Strada Double Wireless costs.

I'm gonna put a few miles more on my bike, like a few hundred more, and then I'm gonna use the resulting body to ***** myself out.


----------



## gte105u (Aug 12, 2012)

If you do much riding at 5 am, keep in mind seeing the computer while you ride. I got a Blackburn Delphi 2.0 on my hybrid which was cheap and does cadence. It is wired, but I don't have a problem with that. The problem is that there is no backlight. I had to wear a little click light on my helmet strap that shined down to the computer to see at dark. This created some glare.

On my road bike I have a Garmin 310xt. This has a backlight which you can set to stay on continuously. I cannot say how nice it is at 5 am to be able to look down at any time and see my speed/cadence without pushing a button. Then you need to consider if you are a stat junkie if you want to be able to save and review the output. Some factors to consider are:

1) Wired vs. Wireless (I personally don't see a reason to pay more for wireless alone)
2) Backlight yes/no
3) Backlight stays on continuous (and the impact this has on the battery)
4) Upload data to computer
5) Heart Rate Monitor (good to go along with cadence in the absence of a power meter)
6) Expansion capabilities (Ant+ for instance, ability to add power meters and such)

While the above features may have an impact on the cost, you may save yourself buying one simply to not like it and getting another in the future.


----------



## JCavilia (Sep 12, 2005)

jfd986 said:


> I'm definitely going to get a unit with cadence, I feel that's most of the reason people get computers anyway. The rest of the work can be done with mapmyride and a wristwatch, but it's also easier to track stats if you need something to measure and fine tune cadence. The computer is a secondary thing, but yeah if I bought one it would have to be wireless. Thanks PJ.


You can do cadence with a watch, too, quite easily. Count pedal revs for 15 seconds, multiply by four. Do this a few times (on a quiet stretch of road), at different cadences. Learn what 70, 90, 100 feel like -- it's like learning a musical tempo; you probably know immediately when a familiar song is played even a little slower or faster than normal. In the same way, you can learn the tempo (within 4 or 5 rpm, which is plenty close enough) of various target cadences, and you'll then know without counting. 

I think a lot of riders get hung up on the precise numbers, when the goal is to find the cadences that work well for you in different circumstances.


----------



## djcastagna (Jul 29, 2012)

do shorter stems give less control on a bike?


----------



## MPov (Oct 22, 2010)

djcastagna said:


> do shorter stems give less control on a bike?


After a point, the steering will start to feel "twitchy" and the bike could become harder to control.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> What is pre-loading the headset bearings? They told me everything was sealed. The only experience I have with headset bearings is taking them out of my old 80s bike, cleaning them off, cleaning the cup and putting fresh grease in.


I believe you've had experience with non-integrated headsets. On integrated types, once you loosen the stem bolts the upper and lower bearings are no longer compressed, so when you swap stems out and install the top cap, before tightening the stem bolts you'll have to tighten the top cap, which pulls the compression plug (inside the steerer tube) pre-loading the bearings. 

As I posted earlier, it's not difficult, but is important to adjust it properly - meaning, not too tight, not too loose.

Doing this wrong can cause play or binding in the steering possibly damaging the headset, so when in doubt have the LBS do the work. But if you're game for doing it yourself, Park tools has some good info.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

djcastagna said:


> do shorter stems give less control on a bike?





MPov said:


> After a point, the steering will start to feel "twitchy" and the bike could become harder to control.


That's what a lot of people think, but I don't. Think about how we steer a bike - anything above ~5 MPH and you _lean into_ more than_ turn into_ a corner, momentarily countersteering.

Some interesting info here:
Bicycle and motorcycle dynamics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The reason short stems get a bad rep is because through necessity (to shorten reach) they're installed on frames too large for a given rider. In these instances, IMO/E the _real_ cause for the twitchy steering is that f/r rider weight distribution is incorrect, with less frontal weight over the front wheel than is optimal (something ~45%). 

That's what makes getting sizing right so important - it positions the rider correctly front-center and (coincidentally) means you'll run a moderate length stem, resulting in a bike that will steer/ handle as it was designed.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I believe you've had experience with non-integrated headsets. On integrated types, once you loosen the stem bolts the upper and lower bearings are no longer compressed, so when you swap stems out and install the top cap, before tightening the stem bolts you'll have to tighten the top cap, which pulls the compression plug (inside the steerer tube) pre-loading the bearings.
> 
> As I posted earlier, it's not difficult, but is important to adjust it properly - meaning, not too tight, not too loose.
> 
> Doing this wrong can cause play or binding in the steering possibly damaging the headset, so when in doubt have the LBS do the work. But if you're game for doing it yourself, Park tools has some good info.


Just read the section in the book. Interesting stuff. I agree that an LBS would be more experienced to judge "play" more accurately than I would, hopefully I get to watch them do it and pick up on it from observing. The rest of it seems straightforward enough in terms of ensuring the stem bolts are loosened before the top cap is tightened the 1/8 inch to adjust for play after the stem is replaced, and then ensuring that the steering column recesses 2-3 mm within the stem so that the top cap presses on the stem and not the column. Just trying to make sure we're talking about the same procedure here.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

JCavilia said:


> You can do cadence with a watch, too, quite easily. Count pedal revs for 15 seconds, multiply by four. Do this a few times (on a quiet stretch of road), at different cadences. Learn what 70, 90, 100 feel like -- it's like learning a musical tempo; you probably know immediately when a familiar song is played even a little slower or faster than normal. In the same way, you can learn the tempo (within 4 or 5 rpm, which is plenty close enough) of various target cadences, and you'll then know without counting.
> 
> I think a lot of riders get hung up on the precise numbers, when the goal is to find the cadences that work well for you in different circumstances.


This.....interests me....a lot...because I used to play piano, and still play the guitar, barely.

I'm going to try this on tomorrow morning's ride. Coincidentally, I just replaced my watch battery today, something which I previously always left to "The guy at the shop" . He's not getting another dollar from me.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

9W9W said:


> Hey OP,
> If you're on a budget you may want to consider picking up these items slightly used on fleabay. Some good deals on Magiclights, bike computers and whatnot. It may be the difference between getting that inevitable first scuff in a wired unit and strapping a wireless one with an existing scuff.


I looked on ebay, and then when I checked reviews of each product, I couldn't find one that everyone agrees allows you to "see the road clearly ahead of you" instead of just "lets other cars see you". I'm looking to see the road and not just be seen, and I bought a cateye EL520 from the sports store and saved the receipt and packaging, giving it a try on tomorrow morning's ride and if it does the job then I'll order it cheaper online and return as necessary. If it's no good, I'll return it and find something else. What light do you use, if any? Do you see anything worthwhile on eBay ? I am also skeptical about "battery packs" that you have to strap to your road bike and connect to the lamp to make it work, are those very cumbersome and obstructive when you're in the drops and spinning? And then some people are talking about mounting brackets that they needed to put on their bars to fit their light on, I'm not that mechanically inclined and don't want to drill any holes in my bike. Unless they implied some kind of clamp mount. Which again would take too much time and effort I think for someone Iike me to make.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> Just read the section in the book. Interesting stuff. I agree that an LBS would be more experienced to judge "play" more accurately than I would, hopefully I get to watch them do it and pick up on it from observing. The rest of it seems straightforward enough in terms of ensuring the stem bolts are loosened before the top cap is tightened the 1/8 inch to adjust for play after the stem is replaced, and then ensuring that the steering column recesses 2-3 mm within the stem so that the top cap presses on the stem and not the column. *Just trying to make sure we're talking about the same procedure here*.


Yes, you have it exactly right. I remember your posts from a few months back and think you're a competent wrencher, but agree that this first time looking over the mechanics shoulder is a good plan. After that, I think you'll be fine doing this yourself, when necessary.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> This.....interests me....a lot...because I used to play piano, and still play the guitar, barely.
> 
> I'm going to try this on tomorrow morning's ride. Coincidentally, I just replaced my watch battery today, something which I previously always left to "The guy at the shop" . He's not getting another dollar from me.


I'm not dissuading you, because I think JC has a valid point, but (IMO) the problem with counting off is that at the precise time when cadence matters most (climbs) is the precise time the last thing you'll want to do is count. Also, in the same circumstance, by the time you're done counting, cadence changed.

I can be 'frugal' about a lot of things, but when it comes to spending ~$10 more for a computer with cadence, I see it as a minimal investment. Most (computers) last for years. But... you decide.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I'm not dissuading you, because I think JC has a valid point, but (IMO) the problem with counting off is that at the precise time when cadence matters most (climbs) is the precise time the last thing you'll want to do is count. Also, in the same circumstance, by the time you're done counting, cadence changed.
> 
> I can be 'frugal' about a lot of things, but when it comes to spending ~$10 more for a computer with cadence, I see it as a minimal investment. Most (computers) last for years. But... you decide.


Definitely if I got a computer it would have cadence, JC made it sound like I could avoid the whole thing entirely with my watch. I think I just need to be patient with this computer thing. I'll start at my interim position, pay off the bike, collect some money and then blow $90 on that Strada Double Wireless.

But hold on : Amazon.com: Sigma BC 1609 STS Wireless Bicycle Speedometer: Sports & Outdoors

The sigma wireless cadence option is 70 dollars. What about that one vs. the Strada?


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> But hold on : Amazon.com: Sigma BC 1609 STS Wireless Bicycle Speedometer: Sports & Outdoors
> 
> The sigma wireless cadence option is 70 dollars. What about that one vs. the Strada?


I have no firsthand experience with the Sigma, so I can't say. Mike T. posted re: the Sigma 1600 series, so he may have some thoughts.

Worth noting, the cadence function is optional and not included on the Sigma, so adding it may bring the price up to the Strada, so I'd find out before ordering.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I have no firsthand experience with the Sigma, so I can't say. Mike T. posted re: the Sigma 1600 series, so he may have some thoughts.
> 
> Worth noting, the cadence function is optional and not included on the Sigma, so adding it may bring the price up to the Strada, so I'd find out before ordering.


Yeah I only realized mike's post after posting myself, oops 

They don't phrase well in the description, oPtional means that the cyclist has the option of turning cadence on or off, seeing it or hiding it

Addendum: eBay is saying the cadence sensor is separate. Looking into this...


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> Yeah I only realized mike's post after posting myself, oops
> 
> They don't phrase well in the description, oPtional means that the cyclist has the option of turning cadence on or off, seeing it or hiding it
> 
> Addendum: eBay is saying the cadence sensor is separate. Looking into this...


I took that statement to mean the cadence feature was optional (at extra cost).


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I took that statement to mean the cadence feature was optional (at extra cost).



Just picked up the Louis Garneau Lexis 20 DC cadence computer off Creepslist for 30 bucks. I'm semi-proud of myself, will be moreso when I install it properly and have it run for a few miles without causing me heartache.


----------



## new-cyclist (Sep 21, 2012)

my bike is 2cm too big for me (56 when i shoudl be 54). i went from a 110mm stem to 90mm. the 20 mm difference was small, but noticeable. cant really tell about the turning sensitivity


----------



## Skinner222 (Aug 31, 2012)

*Short stem works for my body*

I'm 5'11 and proportioned with longer legs and a shorter torso. My bike fits me well as far as leg extension goes. However, when I get the saddle positioned around KOPS the 110mm stem that came with the bike was too far forward for my comfort. I switched to a 70mm stem and am much more comfortable riding the hoods. Everyone's body is different so a shorter stem may or may not be the answer for you.

Cheers!
K


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Skinner222 said:


> I'm 5'11 and proportioned with longer legs and a shorter torso. My bike fits me well as far as leg extension goes. However, when I get the saddle positioned around KOPS the 110mm stem that came with the bike was too far forward for my comfort. I switched to a 70mm stem and am much more comfortable riding the hoods. Everyone's body is different so a shorter stem may or may not be the answer for you.
> 
> Cheers!
> K


I'm glad you like your bike and it fits ok, but it's too large for you - specifically, the effective top tube.

Proportioned as you are, to get reach right using a moderate length stem, most knowledgeable fitters would size you down one frame size, then (after making saddle adjustments) tweak reach, then drop.

I say 'tweak' because once the correct frame size is determined, that should be all that's required when the right geo (for a given rider) is chosen.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> I'm glad you like your bike and it fits ok, but it's too large for you - specifically, the effective top tube.
> 
> Proportioned as you are, to get reach right using a moderate length stem, most knowledgeable fitters would size you down one frame size, then (after making saddle adjustments) tweak reach, then drop.
> 
> I say 'tweak' because once the correct frame size is determined, that should be all that's required when the right geo (for a given rider) is chosen.


So you know that the bike is too big for him because of the 110 to 70 difference? My stem is a 90 right now, what would be an acceptable switch for me ? The bike is 51 cm where my old one was a 50, I understand that sizing varies but it seemed to fit well on the test ride, just this brake hood issue which came up after taking it out longer.

Also, what do you think about adding spacers and raising the handlebars ? Not rotating them up, vertically raising them. Am I inviting handling issues at that point?


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> So you know that the bike is too big for him because of the 110 to 70 difference? My stem is a 90 right now, what would be an acceptable switch for me ? The bike is 51 cm where my old one was a 50, I understand that sizing varies but it seemed to fit well on the test ride, just this brake hood issue which came up after taking it out longer.
> 
> Also, what do you think about adding spacers and raising the handlebars ? Not rotating them up, vertically raising them. Am I inviting handling issues at that point?


In and of itself, someone going from a 110mm stem to a 70mm stem doesn't tell me enough to say for certain the bike is sized too large, but in assessing all of Skinner's info, I can be fairly certain of it.

Because your bike is proportionally smaller, running a 90mm stem isn't unusual, but not knowing the "brake hood issue" you're referring to, I can't offer advice beyond keeping fit changes small - either going from the 90mm to a 100mm or 80mm, depending on whether you want more or less reach. 

Also, before adjusting for reach, make sure your saddle adjustments are set first, otherwise when you do the stem swap, subsequent saddle adjustments could change reach.

Re: raising the bars, since your steerer tube is already cut to size, I doubt adding spacers is an option. If you want to raise the bars, you'll need to either flip your current stem (and possibly remove a spacer or two) or get a different angled stem. Keep in mind that raising your bars shortens reach, so along with getting saddle adjustments set first, consider tweaking drop before addressing reach - or along with. 

As far as inviting handling issues, because that's primarily influenced by a riders f/r weight distribution, you're less likely to adversely affect handling raising the bars, but be careful of going too long or short on the stem _length_, because that has the potential to adversely affect handling.

EDIT: Just read your OP mentioning the reach (to hoods) issue. You obviously are looking to _shorten_ reach, but my advice applies.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> In and of itself, someone going from a 110mm stem to a 70mm stem doesn't tell me enough to say for certain the bike is sized too large, but in assessing all of Skinner's info, I can be fairly certain of it.
> 
> Because your bike is proportionally smaller, running a 90mm stem isn't unusual, but not knowing the "brake hood issue" you're referring to, I can't offer advice beyond keeping fit changes small - either going from the 90mm to a 100mm or 80mm, depending on whether you want more or less reach.
> 
> ...


Just called them. Appointment is Thursday afternoon, and Despite the $220 discount on the bike, they'd still be willing to free roll me a 35-40 dollar replacement stem. I can't believe these guys. The same guy who wasn't willing to move on the clearance price now quickly agreed to the stem change-out, and they'd have to order it too. Are LBSs this nice to everybody or does it depen on how much money you drop on a bike?


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> Just called them. Appointment is Thursday afternoon, and Despite the $220 discount on the bike, they'd still be willing to free roll me a 35-40 dollar replacement stem. I can't believe these guys. The same guy who wasn't willing to move on the clearance price now quickly agreed to the stem change-out, and they'd have to order it too. Are LBSs this nice to everybody or does it depen on how much money you drop on a bike?


Just guessing, but there may not have been any more room to move on the clearance price. 

Re: the stem swap, most shops have a number of spares for just such a purpose, so your LBS may figure the price of the stem on order is part of the price you paid for the bike purchase. In other words, they cover cost incurred during the included fitting.


----------



## arnie2166 (Sep 16, 2012)

HI,
Just want to throw this to anyone who has any info about compression plugs for carbon fiber fork. I got a scott cr1 fork and I need to install new compression plug. Do you have any suggestions which plug is good for scott CF fork?but I will be using a chris king inset1.please share your opinion and thank you.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

arnie2166 said:


> HI,
> Just want to throw this to anyone who has any info about compression plugs for carbon fiber fork. I got a scott cr1 fork and I need to install new compression plug. Do you have any suggestions which plug is good for scott CF fork?but I will be using a chris king inset1.please share your opinion and thank you.


Based on the forks design, compression systems vary among some manufacturers, so your question is best answered by Scott's tech support department or your LBS (assuming they're a Scott dealer). 

That said, I don't think you can go wrong with the newer style expansion plug. IMO/E a better reinforcer and more secure than the older style plugs. If you decide to go this route, be aware that it's generally not recommended to place spacers above the stem. 
View attachment 265368


----------



## arnie2166 (Sep 16, 2012)

First, thank you PJ352 for the info. As I research online regarding Scott CR1, I found that ritchey equipment is there standard accessories like stem,seatpost and headset. So it's not advisable to use or install spacers over the stem, I saw various builds that installed spacers over the stem but I got your point on this PJ352. Again thank you for the info and I'm going to call Scott tech support and get their recommendations. May you guys have a safe ride, God Bless..Peace...


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> Just guessing, but there may not have been any more room to move on the clearance price.
> 
> Re: the stem swap, most shops have a number of spares for just such a purpose, so your LBS may figure the price of the stem on order is part of the price you paid for the bike purchase. In other words, they cover cost incurred during the included fitting.



Got my bike fitted today by the dude at the LBS store. Wow. What a difference.

He moved the seat up a few more cm and moved it forward as well, then he actually rotated the handlebars up as well. I was very cautious of this, but I checked to make sure that they were at least parallel to the ground, I would not have accepted any more up-rotation.

As soon as I left the store I could notice the difference. I can now ride in the hoods and, while I can still see the front hub from my relaxed position and the handlebars do not obscure it completely, I don't think it will make a difference to me. 

I took my bike out for 8 miles this evening, and I was FLYING through the bike path. I still had to push on the hills and I still need a lot more power etc. but I was in the drops for more than half the ride this time.

In my honest opinion, if anyone is going to buy a new bike from an LBS, they have to subtract whatever a standard fitting costs from the price tag on the bike, because that fitting will save lots of grief. I fitted my old Fuji to me over 2 years ago, totally forgot how much of a difference it made to my ride. Totally worth it.

On the way back, something punctured the rear tire and it flatted. I'm gonna go into the LBS and get a gatorskin put on the back. I'd do it myself, but I have free labour in the first year so I figure why not. The way this is going, I get the feeling I'll have plenty of opportunity to practice changing a tire myself.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Some thoughts below...



jfd986 said:


> Got my bike fitted today by the dude at the LBS store. Wow. What a difference.
> 
> He moved the seat up a few more cm and moved it forward as well, then he actually rotated the handlebars up as well. I was very cautious of this, but I checked to make sure that they were at least parallel to the ground, I would not have accepted any more up-rotation.


I'm glad you got this fitting when you did, because if saddle height really was off by 'a few cm's' that's huge in terms of bike fit. 

Variations in handlebar shapes being almost endless, I wouldn't fixate on the drops being parallel to the ground. It's fine if it works out this way, but comfort/ efficiency being the goal of a bike fit, 'some' latitude is acceptable. Also, if need be, there's the option of relocating the shifters on the bar and repositioning _it_, but for now if it's comfortable, I'd stay with it. 



jfd986 said:


> As soon as I left the store I could notice the difference. I can now ride in the hoods and, while *I can still see the front hub* from my relaxed position and the handlebars do not obscure it completely, I don't think it will make a difference to me.


Similar applies here as with bar angle - some latitude is acceptable. That 'hub' reference is more or less a holdover from the days when people sized bikes by stand over and the front hub being obscured. Using it as 'ball park' or a general reference point works ok, but (again) comfort/ efficiency being the goal of a good fit, there's no need to fixate on it. 



jfd986 said:


> I took my bike out for 8 miles this evening, and I was FLYING through the bike path. *I still had to push on the hills and I still need a lot more power *etc. but I was in the drops for more than half the ride this time.


Welcome to the club. 



jfd986 said:


> In my honest opinion, if anyone is going to buy a new bike from an LBS, they have to subtract whatever a standard fitting costs from the price tag on the bike, because that fitting will save lots of grief. I fitted my old Fuji to me over 2 years ago, totally forgot how much of a difference it made to my ride. Totally worth it.


As a proponent of getting a good fit, I completely agree. Good for others to read firsthand experiences/ opinions, though. I would add that allocating funds for a fitting even when NOT buying from an LBS is equally important. As is getting sizing assistance from them beforehand. 



jfd986 said:


> On the way back, something punctured the rear tire and it flatted. I'm gonna go into the LBS and get a gatorskin put on the back. I'd do it myself, but I have free labour in the first year so I figure why not. The way this is going, I get the feeling I'll have plenty of opportunity to practice changing a tire myself.


Your call and free services are fine, but I'd take this opportunity to repair the flat. It's something every cyclist needs to do, so may as well learn sooner rather than later, IMO.

Now that you've got fit dialed in (at least, initially), I suggest focusing on improving form. I can't recall now if you have or are getting a bike computer, but if so, I suggest a model offering cadence. Wired versions run ~$35.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> Some thoughts below...
> 
> 
> I'm glad you got this fitting when you did, because if saddle height really was off by 'a few cm's' that's huge in terms of bike fit.
> ...


I called ahead and the LBS didn't have the Gators. So I bought one somewhere else, and I put it in myself. Which brings me to my NEXT question;

When inserting the rear wheel back into the dropouts with the new tire and tube secured, is the bike supposed to be lying on its side, upside down, in the air on a repair stand (which is impossible on the roadside) or is it just a balancing act holding the wheel in one hand and the bike in the other hand, something that I have to get used to ?


Also, I just read something that was totally and completely counter-intuitive in the components forum and I wanted to clarify here. When something punctures your tire and tube, and leaves a cut that goes from the outside of the tire to the inside of the tire, but it's not a full-on gaping hole, and you can't see it unless you spread the tire a bit...do you need to replace the tire? Or did I just waste money buying this new tire when I could have used something they called "shoe goo" to repair my stock tire ?


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> I called ahead and the LBS didn't have the Gators. So I bought one somewhere else, and I put it in myself. Which brings me to my NEXT question;
> 
> When inserting the rear wheel back into the dropouts with the new tire and tube secured, is the bike supposed to be lying on its side, upside down, in the air on a repair stand (which is impossible on the roadside) or is it just a balancing act holding the wheel in one hand and the bike in the other hand, something that I have to get used to ?


Ideally, the bike is in the work stand, but on the road it's the balancing act you mentioned (held upright). Not difficult with a little practice and the link below may offer some pointers.

While the wheel is off the bike (during a roadside tube/ tire repair), I gently lay the bike on the softest surface available, non-driveside down. 

How to Remove the Back Wheel on a Road Bike - YouTube



jfd986 said:


> Also, I just read something that was totally and completely counter-intuitive in the components forum and I wanted to clarify here. When something punctures your tire and tube, and leaves a cut that goes from the outside of the tire to the inside of the tire, but it's not a full-on gaping hole, and you can't see it unless you spread the tire a bit...do you need to replace the tire? Or did I just waste money buying this new tire when I could have used something they called "shoe goo" to repair my stock tire ?


Without seeing the tire, I can't say for certain if I'd continue using it, but probably not. Once an object damages the fabric/ casing/ belt 'to any extent', I replace the tire, so I think you made the right choice.

Another FYI, from your description this probably wasn't necessary, but in the future carry a dollar bill and use it to boot a tire with similar damage. Then replace the tire ASAP. 

JMO, but I wouldn't recommend using shoe goo for this type of repair. Slits in the rubber/ tread, yes, but not the casing.


----------



## jfd986 (Jul 17, 2011)

PJ352 said:


> Some thoughts below...
> 
> 
> I'm glad you got this fitting when you did, because if saddle height really was off by 'a few cm's' that's huge in terms of bike fit.
> ...


Oh also I got the Louis garneau dc 20 , it's wireless and it has cadence. $30 on Craigslist.


----------



## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jfd986 said:


> Oh also I got the Louis garneau dc 20 , it's wireless and it has cadence. $30 on Craigslist.


:thumbsup:


----------

