# First Touring Bike



## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

First Touring Bike
I am an experienced cyclist with both mountain and road cycling but want to get into touring. My main goal would to west to east coast tour in a few years when the kids are older but short term maybe a week long tour couple times a year.

I am looking for suggestions on bikes and components.

I am fairly familiar with road and mountain bike comps and I know touring bikes use a mixture of both.

I was wondering if I should buy a frame and built slowly with quality parts or buy a stock bike.

I would like opinions on buying used through ebay or cycling website?


Looking to save a little money and keep wife happy.

I would like a bike with a little pep to it but also dependable. I will have both front and rear panniers for touring purposes.


any advise appreciated


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## MB1 (Jan 27, 2004)

Get a BOB trailer and use whatever bike you already have.

Seriously.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

The trailer bit does make sense. Sort of like owning a Porsche as your only car, but still being able to go to Lowe's every so often to pick up some two-by-fours.  

But if you can't see yourself pulling a trailer, here's what I posted earlier in the "Bikes, Frames and Forks" forum:

Touring-specific cycling websites like the ones linked are the best way to get informed nowadays before you buy. Ebay sellers of "touring bikes" often have no idea what a real touring bike is. Most bike shops are not far behind on the touring bike ignorance scale. Not suggesting you buy from these linked sites, but read what they have to say before making your purchase.
http://www.bgcycles.com/ 
http://www.rivbike.com/


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## Reynolds531 (Nov 8, 2002)

As a baseline look at the $1200 Surley Long Haul Trucker. Compare your alternatives to this bike.


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## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

I see what most touring bike frames are make of chromoly, would aluminum frame be strong enough to carrier front and rear panniers?


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## tarwheel2 (Jul 7, 2005)

Personally, I like the Soma Saga for a loaded touring frame. It costs a little more than the Surly Long Haul Trucker but has more favorable geometry for touring, IMHO. 

If you don't mind ordering from overseas, the Bob Jackson World Tour can be bought for about $600, direct from the factory "off the peg" -- that is, non-custom geometry. That's what I've got. BJ is a little bit of a pain to deal with (eg, they don't publish geometry charts on their web site and give out info very sparingly), but they are nice frames and they will paint them in any color for the price.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

lucky13 said:


> I see what most touring bike frames are make of chromoly, would aluminum frame be strong enough to carrier front and rear panniers?


Sure. It's not a matter of strength, it's all about marketing and profits. The industry doesn't believe touring cyclists are interested in aluminum frames and probably has the sales figures to back that up. Technically, any kind of bicycle tubing could be made into a good touring frame. Cannondale used to make a good aluminum touring bike (T-something), perhaps they still do. Too lazy to look it up for you.

Keep in mind that by the time you add all the touring stuff to a bike plus yourself, the supposed weight savings of aluminum are in the single-digit percentage range, if that. In other words, zero performance gain.


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## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

I ride a 54cm road bike. Are Touring frames around the same sizing? I am a little under 5'10.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

lucky13 said:


> I ride a 54cm road bike. Are Touring frames around the same sizing? I am a little under 5'10.


IMO, it's impossible to give nominal frame size recommendations over the internet. With the current mix of classic horizontal top tube frames, semi-sloping frames, compact frames, extended seat tubes, extended head tubes and manufacturers using different ways of measuring, there's no way to assign a good-for-all frame size to someone. My suggestion is to find the bike you want, then figure out that builder's sizing scheme.


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## My Own Private Idaho (Aug 14, 2007)

Check out the adventure cyclists website. They have a great checklist of things to look for, and recommendations of places to get bikes. That is, if you don't just get the BOB. 

Actually, you should get the BOB anyway.


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## Art853 (May 30, 2003)

You can tour on anything and people do. I think the LHT is a good base bike for comparing and finding one used can save money. The Trek 520 and Fuji touring are also fine and may be cheaper. If you tour on an inexpensive bike with old components think of it as adding to the adventure. Having a triple with 23f 32r gearing is nice along with ability to take 28 to 38 mm tires. Having toured heavy Im a fan of going light when possible. 

I like the Surly Travelers Check due to the ability to travel as luggage not as a bike. There is a price premium however.


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## PomPilot (May 17, 2006)

If you look at the (pre-built) Surly Long Haul Trucker, and you anticipate climbing anything steeper than a 3% grade, while heavily loaded, set up your gears so that your granny is 20 gear-inches or less. I did not enjoy pushing my loaded bike for almost 2 miles up an 8% grade.


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## MDGColorado (Nov 9, 2004)

tarwheel2 said:


> Personally, I like the Soma Saga for a loaded touring frame. It costs a little more than the Surly Long Haul Trucker but has more favorable geometry for touring, IMHO.


What's the geometry difference? At 5'8" I'd be on a 54 most likely.


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## hepcatbent (Aug 19, 2009)

Any bike can be ridden to tour. That said, touring-specific frames have essentially four things in common: a longer wheelbase, 45cm+ chainstays, braze-ons for racks and bottle cages, and they're built strong enough build to carry 80 lbs of 'stuff' in panniers plus the rider. Most are equipped with some combination of LX/XT (primarily mountain-bike components for their strength and reliability), and have a and geometry that is closer to a road bike than a mountain bike. Past that, most of they hype is just hype. Most of the "off the shelf" touring bikes have some compromises in components to keep the price competative. At the far end of the spectrum are the bikes like Koga Miyata who are all XT equipped off the shelf, and have hand built frames. The price tag reflects that at $3500 and up. Strength, durability, and reliability are prized over light weight in a touring bike.

The Surly LHT is a great bike, either sold as a frameset or buit. But they have some less expensive components on them as-built. The Trek 520 is a respected purpose-built touring bike, with similar issues. Both are around $1200 off the shelf, but need another $300 worth of accessories for touring. They're both steel frames. The debate rages about the "harshness" of aluminum, and about how a broken steel frame can be repaired by a Yak-powered welding machine in Timbuktu, but honestly I don't find either argument compelling. 

I built a Nashbar touring frame (aluminum) that has all XT, and is the functional equivalent of the Koga Miyata Traveller (their 700c aluminum frame) for about $1500 equipped with rack, panniers, lights, and ready-to-roll. A full XT package will run you about $1800 new, but if you piece it out from NOS and new take offs, you can do it for about $500 and get exactly what you want that way. The one place I skimped was on the wheelset. I got 36 spoke Alex rims laced to Deore hubs for $100 built from BicycleWheelWarehouse, but so far, they've been trouble-free and seem to be plenty strong.

So... if you have the time and the desire to piece together a custom touring bike, it's a lot of fun to do, you get exactly what you want, and you can save a TON of cash doing it. I've done a LOT of swapping out and upgrading of accessories on my bike since I built it, but I haven't tweaked with the mechanicals at all. I'm very pleased with it. Make sure you do your homework the accessories too. Fenders, racks, bags, panniers... they all contribute to successful touring. 

Have a ball!


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## tarwheel2 (Jul 7, 2005)

MDGColorado said:


> What's the geometry difference? At 5'8" I'd be on a 54 most likely.


The Soma Saga has a taller head tube and shorter top tube than the LHT, at least in size.


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## hepcatbent (Aug 19, 2009)

Here's what you can build with a little time, the desire to do it, and about $1500:

<a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/4898663514/" title="P8166949 by chief1120, on Flickr"><img src="https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4099/4898663514_b572bf1658.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="P8166949" /></a>

The build info and more detail photos are here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_h/sets/72157622376726238/


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## dahut (May 13, 2010)

Reynolds531 said:


> As a baseline look at the $1200 Surley Long Haul Trucker. Compare your alternatives to this bike.


This is excellent advice. There are a lot of touring bikes out there - the LHT is a great place to start.


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## PomPilot (May 17, 2006)

Did somebody say 'Surly Long Haul Trucker' ?


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## hepcatbent (Aug 19, 2009)

PomPilot said:


> Did somebody say 'Surly Long Haul Trucker' ?


Nice! :thumbsup:


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## lucky13 (Apr 12, 2008)

tarwheel2 said:


> Personally, I like the Soma Saga for a loaded touring frame. It costs a little more than the Surly Long Haul Trucker but has more favorable geometry for touring, IMHO.
> 
> If you don't mind ordering from overseas, the Bob Jackson World Tour can be bought for about $600, direct from the factory "off the peg" -- that is, non-custom geometry. That's what I've got. BJ is a little bit of a pain to deal with (eg, they don't publish geometry charts on their web site and give out info very sparingly), but they are nice frames and they will paint them in any color for the price.


I was looking at the Soma Saga online and noticed that a 54 cm only allows for 26 inch wheels but a 56cm allows 700c. 

I am not too familiar with the 26 in wheels on a road bike. Is there a big different in the ride? Is one faster/slower, etc?


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## tarwheel2 (Jul 7, 2005)

lucky13 said:


> I was looking at the Soma Saga online and noticed that a 54 cm only allows for 26 inch wheels but a 56cm allows 700c.
> 
> I am not too familiar with the 26 in wheels on a road bike. Is there a big different in the ride? Is one faster/slower, etc?


I am pretty sure that the smaller LHT frames also come with 26" wheels. A lot of tourers prefer 26" wheels because their tires are more widely available and also can handle extra large loads better in wider widths. A bike with 26" wheels would probably ride smoother if you used wider tires but also would probably be slower because generally speaking 26" tires are not as light as 700c. It's a trade-off.


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## My Own Private Idaho (Aug 14, 2007)

Glitch in the Matrix. Double post.


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## hepcatbent (Aug 19, 2009)

tarwheel2 said:


> I am pretty sure that the smaller LHT frames also come with 26" wheels. A lot of tourers prefer 26" wheels because their tires are more widely available and also can handle extra large loads better in wider widths.


Surly introduced the 26" wheel across their line last year because of demand... about a month after I bought my 700c frameset... 26" tires are a standard across the world; 700c is catching up, but there aren't as many 700c bikes in less developed countries.

I had been holding out because I _had _a really nice 26" wheelset. The reason the 700c wheel size isn't offered on most smaller framesets (usually 54 cm and below) is because of toe overlap on the small frames... and that th 700c wheels aren't as stable on a small frame (or so I've heard).


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## My Own Private Idaho (Aug 14, 2007)

I don't think the wheel size makes much difference. A bike built for 26" wheels could be built with 650c rims to use standard road tires if one wanted. I know Gatorskins are available for 650c's.

I just built a Co-Motion for my son, and built it with 26" wheels. I found some great tires for it, rated for 100 PSI. Kenda tires of some sort, with kevlar. Very nice tires, and they are available in 1 1/4 or 1 1/8 inch widths. The tires were less than $30 each. Time will tell how well they hold up.


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## brucew (Jun 3, 2006)

Throwing in a ringer here,,,

I have a friend, author of the Cyclotour Guidebooks, who tours extensively. Over the past several years he has toured exclusively on his Bike Friday folder. He travels fully-loaded with front and rear panniers. There's no load-carrying difference between his "touring bike" and his Bike Friday.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Actually if you really want to save money you could go to E-bay or search Graigslist for either a Trek 720 (top of the line), or the 620 (top mid level), or the Koga Miyata World Traveller (top of the line), or the Miyata 1000 (top mid level), all were made between 1981 and 87 I think.

But if you want new, the best bike I believe for the money is the Rocky Mountain Sherpa 10 Touring, in 2010 model it cost $1,200, but see this site for more info: http://www.bikyle.com/RockyMtnRd.asp


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## Pscyclepath (May 22, 2008)

One of the better discussions I've seen in awhile... not only what you ought to look for in a touring bike, but why each little feature could be important...

http://www.adventurecycling.org/resources/201004_TouringBikeBuyers'Guide_Schubert.pdf

Me, I went with the Surly LHT with 700C wheels, Delta racks, and a set of Ortlieb panniers. Haven't had a reason to regret any of it. In fact, the more I ride that Trucker, and the more stuff I get into with it, the more I realize just what a nice machine it is.


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## froze (Sep 15, 2002)

Personally I went with a Mercian Vincitore because I was in Derby England and had the bike custom fitted for me, and custom built with options including spear (long) point lugs which I really like the looks of. But this ride is a tad more expensive then what the OP wanted, but I wanted an artsy fartsy lugged steel bike with stuff that Rivendell couldn't do at all and was cheaper then a Rivendell. The Sherpa 10 or even the 30 touring bike is a well thought out touring bike with all the options one would need for touring at a low cost, like mainly the higher quality Reynolds 720 vs Taiwan Reynolds licensed heavier 520 or the heavier 4130 (which is basically the same as 520), 3 sets of water bottle bosses, spoke carrier, double set of eyelets front and rear for fenders and racks, and lighter weight then the Trek 520 that cost the same money. The Sherpa 30 for only $400 more ups the frame to 853 tubeset and better components.


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## Gus Riley (Feb 18, 2004)

PomPilot said:


> Did somebody say 'Surly Long Haul Trucker' ?


I cut the legs on my kickstand to lower my LHT to less of a kickstanded height, it was much more stable that way. After a while I removed it and used a clickstand. Nice looking bike!


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