# Vuelta a Espana discussion



## ogre (Dec 16, 2005)

Not a single Vuelta thread, but I've been watching most of it since I WFH  I really don't think Roglic will be able to defend to the end even though he won the last two editions. I would love to see Kuss win a stage. Today was a spectacular stage, and my heart goes out to Alejandro. That was a scary crash, he was visibly rattled and shook his head when a new bike was offered to him. This is going to be a good tour. Comments and predictions anyone?


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

It’s always a great tour! I was so upset about Valverde... This may be it for him? 


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## Princeton_Tiger (Dec 5, 2009)

PBL450 said:


> It’s always a great tour! I was so upset about Valverde... This may be it for him?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


That's what I was thinking. It would be a shame to end such a long and illustrious career with a crash. Valverde has been one of my favorite pros for a long time. Lets me believe that us old guys can still compete.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

PBL450 said:


> It’s always a great tour! I was so upset about Valverde... This may be it for him?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Yeah, it's too bad it had to end like that for him.


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## majbuzz (Nov 30, 2012)

It was upsetting to see him go out like that. Lucky he didn't hit that guard rail badly. He is a fighter and I anticipate he will come back and finish on his terms when he is ready. I hope.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

majbuzz said:


> It was upsetting to see him go out like that. Lucky he didn't hit that guard rail badly. He is a fighter and I anticipate he will come back and finish on his terms when he is ready. I hope.


Funny how you say it, yeah, agree 100%, I found myself rather upset by this crash and the implications for Valverde. Just seems a little unfair... 


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## majbuzz (Nov 30, 2012)

What do you mean by unfair? It was an accident that took him out of a grand tour that happens unfortunately. Just curious. I still think and hope we will see him again.


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## KoroninK (Aug 9, 2010)

Alejandro has a broken collarbone which was operated on. The Doctor who did the operation said everything went well and no complications. He and the staff expect Alejandro to have a full recovery from that injury.
Adriano Malori expects Alejandro to return next season as long as he can recover from his injuries.
There is a video some local amateur cyclists took today of where Alejandro crashed. They filmed the crack in the road that caused the crash and how lucky he is that he only has a broken collarbone from it.

As for my thoughts on the rest of la Vuelta. I hope Mas finishes on the podium, but otherwise I don't care.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

majbuzz said:


> What do you mean by unfair? It was an accident that took him out of a grand tour that happens unfortunately. Just curious. I still think and hope we will see him again.


I guess unfair is the wrong word... It is road racing... Sad maybe. Crappy. 


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

KoroninK said:


> Alejandro has a broken collarbone which was operated on. The Doctor who did the operation said everything went well and no complications. He and the staff expect Alejandro to have a full recovery from that injury.
> Adriano Malori expects Alejandro to return next season as long as he can recover from his injuries.
> There is a video some local amateur cyclists took today of where Alejandro crashed. They filmed the crack in the road that caused the crash and how lucky he is that he only has a broken collarbone from it.
> 
> As for my thoughts on the rest of la Vuelta. I hope Mas finishes on the podium, but otherwise I don't care.


I thought this was going to be his last season? He certainly can still compete at his level! 


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## KoroninK (Aug 9, 2010)

PBL450 said:


> I thought this was going to be his last season? He certainly can still compete at his level!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


He'd been talking about racing next year. That talk had started a few months ago.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

KoroninK said:


> He'd been talking about racing next year. That talk had started a few months ago.


That’s great! Great news! I’m hoping he does race next year and I’m wishing him good results! 


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## majbuzz (Nov 30, 2012)

PBL450 said:


> I guess unfair is the wrong word... It is road racing... Sad maybe. Crappy.
> 
> Gotcha, wasn't being critical. We all see things through different lenses, so I thought maybe I missed something. I'm happy to hear his unfortunate surgery seems to have gone well and hoping for a speedy recovery.


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## aclinjury (Sep 12, 2011)

Roglic will sweep the floor with the Colombians, Ecuadorians, and Spanish. That's one against 3 nations.
Watching Vuelta highlights will be enough.


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## KoroninK (Aug 9, 2010)

For an update on Valverde. He had surgery on the broken collarbone on Saturday. The doctor said it went well and he expects a full recovery. The doctors at the hospital will be over seeing his recovery. The doctor also said he expects Valverde to race next year. He said something about Alejandro doesn't want the bike or injury to tell him he has to stop that he wants to retire on his own terms and not be forced to retire. This is a link to the article, however, the article is in Spanish.









Doctor Esparza: "Alejandro Valverde tiene claro que la bicicleta no le va a bajar del pelotón"


Los doctores Esparza y Hernández intervinieron el pasado sábado al ciclista murciano de una fractura de clavícula tras su caída en la Vuelta a España




www.cope.es


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

I'm starting to think Roglic is too aggressive a descender. As a ski jumper, I'm sure he loves to go downhill fast. Problem is he doesn't have the bike skills to do it safely.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

il sogno said:


> I'm starting to think Roglic is too aggressive a descender. As a ski jumper, I'm sure he loves to go downhill fast. Problem is he doesn't have the bike skills to do it safely.


I’m a big fan in part for this reason. He loves to race. He isn’t looking down at his power meter and making best calculated decisions in all instances, sucking the life out of a bike race. He’s going for it with gusto. Love it!!


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## upstateSC-rider (Aug 21, 2004)

PBL450 said:


> I’m a big fan in part for this reason. He loves to race. He isn’t looking down at his power meter and making best calculated decisions in all instances, sucking the life out of a bike race. He’s going for it with gusto. Love it!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Agreed.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

upstateSC-rider said:


> Agreed.


Today was the perfect example!! Day after a nasty crash... Did the stage win really matter toward the GC? Nope. Not at all. Zero. Sprinting against Mas on a 25% grade? Stupid, given the tour goal. Sit back, watch the power meter... But the guy loves racing bicycles. Instead of sucking the life from a tour he breathes life into it. Love the guy! Big hugs with Mas, there is a boat load of class in this peloton 

Love this race!!!! 


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

I enjoy watching Roglic as well. The cynic in me questions how two guys from Slovenia can be this dominant at once, but I try to ignore it and just enjoy their riding styles. Both are fun and well rounded. My guess is he will win in the end. The two guys in front of him have limited skill sets and weaker in comparison. They will probably crack at some point. We’ll see though.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Rashadabd said:


> I enjoy watching Roglic as well. The cynic in me questions how two guys from Slovenia can be this dominant at once, but I try to ignore it and just enjoy their riding styles. Both are fun and well rounded. My guess is he will win in the end. The two guys in front of him have limited skill sets and weaker in comparison. They will probably crack at some point. We’ll see though.


2 guys? Look deeper... It’s a tiny country chuck full of world class athletes. But I’m not cynical. 

Rough stage today with another crash for Roglic. I’m telling you.... best of the world tours. 

Unrelated? Anyone know why Spaniards erect big bad azz walls around their houses? 


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## KoroninK (Aug 9, 2010)

PBL450 said:


> Unrelated? Anyone know why Spaniards erect big bad azz walls around their houses?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Possibly added privacy. Otherwise and more likely some sort of safety rules for pools and most homes in Spain have pools.


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## ogre (Dec 16, 2005)

What a stage today. I was expecting Roglic to choke, but he rode like a true champ. 

That lake at the mountaintop was gorgeous. And tomorrow should be fantastic as well.


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## upstateSC-rider (Aug 21, 2004)

Yep, great stage. I knew Bernal would try something but Roglic hasn't shown any signs of weakness. Oh yeah, tomorrow should be another good one.


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## ogre (Dec 16, 2005)

I'm really digging the Orbea paint jobs for Euskaltel-Euskadi. This is rumored to be their new aero bike, and I don't think they're riding them every stage.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

ogre said:


> I'm really digging the Orbea paint jobs for Euskaltel-Euskadi. This is rumored to be their new aero bike, and I don't think they're riding them every stage.
> View attachment 480659


That is pretty slick. I bet it’s one of those camouflage jobs in an attempt to hide features of the new design though and won’t be a paint scheme you can actually buy. Orbea makes good bikes, so it will be interesting to see what they release.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

That was a fun finish. Angel Lopes, Roglic, Bernal, Mas, De La Cruz, Storer and company put on quite the show. I enjoyed that last 10 or so KM as much as I have enjoyed any racing this year.


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## upstateSC-rider (Aug 21, 2004)

Wow, I haven't heard of a rage-quit like that since, I don't know, Rohan Dennis? David Millar?
Props to todays winner, gutsy move.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

upstateSC-rider said:


> Wow, I haven't heard of a rage-quit like that since, I don't know, Rohan Dennis? David Millar?
> Props to todays winner, gutsy move.


Welcome to Movistar Mr Lopez, where you race your teammates. 


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## JSR (Feb 27, 2006)

upstateSC-rider said:


> Wow, I haven't heard of a rage-quit like that since, I don't know, Rohan Dennis? David Millar?
> Props to todays winner, gutsy move.


It’s definitely in the same league as Dennis for enigmatic weirdness. But nobody could throw a bike like Millar.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Only thing that makes sense, I mean he had a teammate... Maybe they decided to race for Mas who made the split and let Lopez go rather than risk bringing Bernal (et al) back into the leading group? Maybe they just couldn’t manage that task? 

I don’t recall Lopez having tantrums before? Maybe I’m wrong... 


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## KoroninK (Aug 9, 2010)

PBL450 said:


> Welcome to Movistar Mr Lopez, where you race your teammates.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


The helpers were all well back. Remember 3 of Movistar's riders had crashed out of la Vuelta and they only brought 2 mountain helpers to begin with. Valverde crashed out in week 1 and Verona crashed out about 4 days ago. The helpers left were roulers. Erviti, Rojas and Oliveria. Enric Mas was not going to be asked to help Lopez. When the group Rojas was in caught the group Lopez was in Rojas did attempt to help, but the time gap was too big at that point.

Lopez is known for being very hot headed and having tantrums. This isn't the first time. He's punched fans (which well deserve it), he's said things several times in which he's had to apologize later.

As Mas was a designated leader and 2nd overall with a decent to good time trial they were never going to ask him to help Lopez at that point. They weren't going to risk Mas' podium spot because Lopez got caught out. As I said the other 3 riders left in the race for the team had been dropped a long time before that as they aren't climbers.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

KoroninK said:


> The helpers were all well back. Remember 3 of Movistar's riders had crashed out of la Vuelta and they only brought 2 mountain helpers to begin with. Valverde crashed out in week 1 and Verona crashed out about 4 days ago. The helpers left were roulers. Erviti, Rojas and Oliveria. Enric Mas was not going to be asked to help Lopez. When the group Rojas was in caught the group Lopez was in Rojas did attempt to help, but the time gap was too big at that point.
> 
> Lopez is known for being very hot headed and having tantrums. This isn't the first time. He's punched fans (which well deserve it), he's said things several times in which he's had to apologize later.
> 
> As Mas was a designated leader and 2nd overall with a decent to good time trial they were never going to ask him to help Lopez at that point. They weren't going to risk Mas' podium spot because Lopez got caught out. As I said the other 3 riders left in the race for the team had been dropped a long time before that as they aren't climbers.


Great explanation! 


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## ogre (Dec 16, 2005)

JSR said:


> It’s definitely in the same league as Dennis for enigmatic weirdness. But nobody could throw a bike like Millar.


I had to check your statement for accuracy, and it appears you are correct. I remember Bjarne Riis's toss as well, which only went about ten feet. Robert's toss went at least twelve feet.




Bjarne's toss comes at 0:50, nd actually I think it only went about six feet.


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## JSR (Feb 27, 2006)

LOL! It must be a weekend. 



ogre said:


> I had to check your statement for accuracy, and it appears you are correct. I remember Bjarne Riis's toss as well, which only went about ten feet. Robert's toss went at least twelve feet.


Of course winner of the award for Bike Throw With The Most Panache goes to Bradley Wiggins.


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

This was a nice race and dominant win in the end. My question for you all now is this: is Roglic a hall of fame type rider at this point? He has a Palmares that includes 3 straight grand tour wins, multiple one week grand tour wins, multiple grand tour and stage race wins, multiple national champ jerseys, a TdF podium (and near win), etc. If he makes the list where does he rank among the greats and/or modern standouts?


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## Rashadabd (Sep 17, 2011)

Question #2: Are Landa and Barnet still legitimate grand tour leaders to build teams around?


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Rashadabd said:


> Question #2: Are Landa and Barnet still legitimate grand tour leaders to build teams around?


No, I don’t think so. Of course it depends on your goals as a team... some teams could find acceptable success with one of these riders at their core. But realistically, a world tour team with ambitions, no, I don’t think so. Close. But no. 


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Rashadabd said:


> This was a nice race and dominant win in the end. My question for you all now is this: is Roglic a hall of fame type rider at this point? He has a Palmares that includes 3 straight grand tour wins, multiple one week grand tour wins, multiple grand tour and stage race wins, multiple national champ jerseys, a TdF podium (and near win), etc. If he makes the list where does he rank among the greats and/or modern standouts?


Wonderful race!! Vuelta is always like a pleasant surprise, it’s not as stodgy or predictable as the other two. I love this race more and more every year. 

Roglic has incredible accomplishments for someone who came to the sport rather late. He has a few more prime years in him too, I think. If not now, than certainly in a year... I’m biased, I’m a definite fan... He is there now, but if it’s debatable, I suspect he will put that debate to bed in another season or two... 


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## upstateSC-rider (Aug 21, 2004)

I'm a fan of his and definitely think he's a Hall of Fame rider, I just hope he can have this fitness next July.


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## ogre (Dec 16, 2005)

PBL450 said:


> It’s always a great tour! I was so upset about Valverde... This may be it for him?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk





Princeton_Tiger said:


> That's what I was thinking. It would be a shame to end such a long and illustrious career with a crash. Valverde has been one of my favorite pros for a long time. Lets me believe that us old guys can still compete.





il sogno said:


> Yeah, it's too bad it had to end like that for him.





majbuzz said:


> It was upsetting to see him go out like that. Lucky he didn't hit that guard rail badly. He is a fighter and I anticipate he will come back and finish on his terms when he is ready. I hope.


This was two weeks ago in Mexico, the Volta a la Comunitat Valenciana. Valverde is very active, attacking with less than 5k to go. This clip is the the last 10k of stage 3, and they hit a nasty gravel section at less than 3k to go with 10% grade. This is a great race, a nice stiff finish, the leader's jersey changes hands, and good to see Valverde a factor late in the stage at age 42. He got fifth on the stage finished the race fifth on GC. 

A great racing vid to watch, especially the last 5k.


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