# Le Champion CF Sizing Question



## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

I am trying to figure out what size frame to order and am having a tough time deciding. I have compiled a spread sheet with the geometry of 12 different branded 54cm bikes in in an effort to make sure I understand the sizing of the Le Champion before I order.

So far it has only confused me more. Compared to all other bike manufacturers, the 54cm Le Champion has geometry more like a 52cm bike give its Top Tube mesurement of 53.5cm. My 52 cm Mercier had a (top tube of 53cm) It also has the lowest standover hieght of any as well at 75cm and again my Mercier was 75.4cm 

The 56 cm Le Champion has the geometry which is more like a 54 cm bike. In fact, the same top tube length of 55cm which is the same as my wife's 54cm Windsor.

My last bike from BD was 52cm Mercier Serpens.. but after riding my wife's 54 Windsor Trent for the last 3 weeks, I now believe it was actually too small since I like the Windsor fit more.

I am 5'7" and am having a mental block thinking that I should be ordering a 56 cm bike. Can anyone chime who has taken delivery of a Le Champion CF and provide opinion on how they feel the bike sizes versus others?


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## tone22 (Jan 5, 2010)

Most of if not all bikes especially compact frames from what i found are 2cm's smaller than advertized, just like the info that you found out. Just like most of the bikes listed on BD show same size as trek or specialized


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## unboringuy (Jul 27, 2010)

Sorry, I can't help you there. I do know that the Titanium frames run large though.


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

tone22 said:


> Most of if not all bikes especially compact frames from what i found are 2cm's smaller than advertized, just like the info that you found out. Just like most of the bikes listed on BD show same size as trek or specialized



Exactly. Seems so weird that I will be ordering a 56cm....I just wonder, how many Moto owners are improperly sized bikes.

Anyone have a reach and stack measurement for me with their 56cm? 

Also, from what I found out, the Bottecchia CF67 carbon frames are the same exact geometry as the Le Champions. However, with Bottecchia CF67 a 53cm=54cm LC and a 55cm=56cm LC.

For what it's worth... if anyone is looking at the Le Champion Ultegra 6700 bikes like me, the Bottecchia CF is actually $150 cheaper. Look at the components. Pretty much the same except the CF67 has Cane Creek C6 brakes and Vuelta XRP Pro wheels and the LC has Cane Creek C3 with Aksium Race wheels plus a carbon seat post.


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## Local Hero (Jul 8, 2010)

*nice find!*



tonkabaydog said:


> For what it's worth... if anyone is looking at the Le Champion Ultegra 6700 bikes like me, the Bottecchia CF is actually $150 cheaper. Look at the components. Pretty much the same except the CF67 has Cane Creek C6 brakes and Vuelta XRP Pro wheels and the LC has Cane Creek C3 with Aksium Race wheels plus a carbon seat post.


Very interesting. Does Bottecchia charge for shipping? OK, I found it, $45. 

(It also looks like they are selling the Le Champ CF frame with a Dura Ace setup)


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

Bottecchia bikes are sold at Cycle Spectrum Retail stores and EBAY "only". Not sure, but there is an affiliation with BD and Cycle Spectrum and BD bikes are all shipped out of TX where Cycle Spectums are located. The Botecchia Frame, although having the same dimensions as the Le Champion, has a shorter seat tube. However it is the "exact" same frame as the BD Century. 

The Bottecchia Dura Ace Set up at $1799 is a tough act to follow. It has an FSA Carbon Crank and Cane Creek brakes. If you were really bent on having almost all Dura Ace, you could pick up a pair of brakes on ebay for $225, Slap on Ksyrium Elite wheels for around $420. Your bike would be nearly a pound lighter and still be into a Dura Ace bike for around $2400!!

That is about the best deal going for a Dura Ace set up and what Giant charges for a Defy with 105!


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## Local Hero (Jul 8, 2010)

You're right. That DA build looks good. I just convinced a friend to go with Bikes Direct and she picked up an Immortal Spirit for a couple hundred more. Although the frame specs are slightly different, the builds are very close. I probably wont tell her about the Bottechia. :devil: 

Bike Island sells both Bottechia and Motobecane frames: http://bikeisland.com/cgi-bin/BKTK_STOR20.cgi?Action=List&SubCategory=Parts: Framesets-Road


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## StrongPerf (Aug 18, 2010)

My first post here. I can't help you but I'm going through the same thing. I'll be ordering the LC Fire (sram force) in the next day or two. I'm 5'6" and I think I need the 51cm frame. I have a 31" inseam, shorter arms and not flexible at all. I've ridden fuji sl comp with similar size and decided it was right for me. 

I saw in a note somewhere that they measure to the top of the seatpost clamp. This might make the frame size look bigger on paper than it really is compared to some...


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## unboringuy (Jul 27, 2010)

I think that the effective top tube measurement is longer than typical in each size.


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

unboringuy said:


> I think that the effective top tube measurement is longer than typical in each size.


Just the opposite. The effective top tube length of the LC CF, according to my research, is one size, (i.e. 2 cm) smaller than every other bike I have input into my spreadsheet. 

So for example, every LBS that I have visited has recommended a 54cm bike for me. The effective top tubes of 8 bikes which I have researched range from 54.2cm to 55 cm. ( Giant, Cannondale, Jamis, Trek, Scott, Stork, Look) The LC CF top tube in a 54cm si 53.5. This length is more in line with a "typical" 52cm bike and .5cm longer than my compact Mercier 52 cm frame. Was too small for me. 

The 56 cm LC has a top tube of 55cm, which is more in line with the typical 54cm bike.

Still waiting for somebody with one to chime in.


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## ricz (Jul 26, 2010)

Tonkabyadog:

This might easy your dilemma. I bought the Le Champion CF Ultegra version last summer and have clocked 2600 wonderful miles. At 5' 7-3/4" the 54 is just right. Before buying the bike, I too struggled with the sizing. The sizing as posted on BD is about right, with the exception of the stand over. The actual measured stand over for the 54 is 770 rather than 750, as posted on the BD geometry chart. I don't know where BD gets the stand over measurement, but I just took a tape to the bike again and get anywhere from 30.25" to 30.5" clear stand over. My measured inseam is 31". When you match up the measured stand over with the effective top tub dimension, the equivalent size in Cannondale & Specialized is 52.

Another key measurement for the Le Champion 54:
Center-to-Center seat tub = 48.7cm (Cannnondale size 52 has an C-C of 49cm)


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## ricz (Jul 26, 2010)

This might easy your dilemma. I bought the Le Champion CF Ultegra version last summer and have clocked 2600 wonderful miles. At 5' 7-3/4" the 54 is just right. Before buying the bike, I too struggled with the sizing. The sizing as posted on BD is about right, with the exception of the stand over. The actual measured stand over for the 54 is 770 rather than 750, as posted on the BD geometry chart. I don't know where BD gets the stand over measurement, but I just took a tape to the bike again and get anywhere from 30.25" to 30.5" clear stand over. My measured inseam is 31". When you match up the measured stand over with the effective top tub dimension, the equivalent size in Cannondale & Specialized is 52.

Another key measurement for the Le Champion 54:
Center-to-Center seat tub = 48.7cm (Cannnondale size 52 has an C-C of 49cm)


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

ricz said:


> This might easy your dilemma. I bought the Le Champion CF Ultegra version last summer and have clocked 2600 wonderful miles. At 5' 7-3/4" the 54 is just right. Before buying the bike, I too struggled with the sizing. The sizing as posted on BD is about right, with the exception of the stand over. The actual measured stand over for the 54 is 770 rather than 750, as posted on the BD geometry chart. I don't know where BD gets the stand over measurement, but I just took a tape to the bike again and get anywhere from 30.25" to 30.5" clear stand over. My measured inseam is 31". When you match up the measured stand over with the effective top tub dimension, the equivalent size in Cannondale & Specialized is 52.
> 
> Another key measurement for the Le Champion 54:
> Center-to-Center seat tub = 48.7cm (Cannnondale size 52 has an C-C of 49cm)


After a few more emails to BD, I ordered the 54cm INFERNO........, but that was after I tried a few bikes with similar geometry.

BD's Le Champion CF and Ti measurements are entirely different from all other bike mfgs. The CF is sized one size smaller then everyone so the 54cm is like other mfg's 52cm. Conversely, with the Ti, is one size bigger and the 51cm is like everyone else's 53cm.

One big measurement you can't get from BD or the Motobecane Website is the headtube length. I was able to approximate b/c I located the a 55cm "Moto Century" which has identical "stated" geometry as the Le Champion CF 56cm. Head tube is 16cm... so I figured the 54cm LC CF must be around 14cm. Ricz, can you confirm this on your bike? 

Longer head tube explains more relaxed compact geometry.

BTW, my gut tells me that the LC CF frame is made in the same factory as the Fuji SL-1... same exact seat stay, albeit different dimensions.

That said.... can't wait to get my 54cm Inferno Sept 12th!!!!!!!


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## ricz (Jul 26, 2010)

Congrats on the Inferno, unbelievable deal for the full RED equip. I'll check the head tub and get back to you - likely tomorrow.


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## minhtin (Oct 10, 2009)

I'd love to get the inferno. Unfortunately, the inferno comes with standard crank and that is a killer for me in the bay area.


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

Order the Inferno, pull the crank, sell on ebay and buy a new one. If you desire RED, you may not get another chance until next year...once they sell out of the 54 and 56's.

Seriously, the only thing that comes close to the price is the Douglas Matrix at $600 more, with lesser wheels albeit better handlebars.

Everything else is 2X.


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## tonkabaydog (Jul 22, 2010)

Order the Inferno, pull the crank, sell on ebay and buy a new one. If you desire RED, you may not get another chance until next year...once they sell out of the 54 and 56's.

Seriously, the only thing that comes close to the price is the Douglas Matrix at $600 more, with lesser wheels albeit better handlebars.

Everything else costs 2X as much.


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## ricz (Jul 26, 2010)

tonkabaydog

The measured head tube dimension on the 54 Le Champion CF is 5-1/8" or 13cm.


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