# Schleck Brothers the next to go ?



## Don Duende (Sep 13, 2007)

In view of the recent revelation of the secret financial relationship between Frank and Dr. Fuentes, will it be a surprise that Andy's remarkable performance at the 2007 Giro and the 2008 TdF probably was due to PEDs?

Under strict orders to ride for Sastre, Andy showed remarkable agility riding as a "super" domestique without any signs of physical strain in the 2008 TdF. The way he was riding, I could not understand why he didn't ride away and capture his first Grand Tour. Now that we know about Frank, it isn't much of a stretch of the imagination, seeing the brothers share Dr. Eufemio Fuentes (OB/GYN) " training secrets".


----------



## Old_school_nik (May 21, 2002)

*Share and Share alike..*

They do seem tight. It would seem odd if you were a pro rider along with your brother who you took into the sport and rode with on the same top pro team and you had a "training enhancement" that REALLY worked well you would think he would share it with his bro...


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

Old_school_nik said:


> They do seem tight. It would seem odd if you were a pro rider along with your brother who you took into the sport and rode with on the same top pro team and you had a "training enhancement" that REALLY worked well you would think he would share it with his bro...


Granted that he ever got to try it himself.


----------



## MG537 (Jul 25, 2006)

Don Duende said:


> In view of the recent revelation of the secret financial relationship between Frank and Dr. Fuentes, will it be a surprise that Andy's remarkable performance at the 2007 Giro and the 2008 TdF probably was due to PEDs?
> 
> Under strict orders to ride for Sastre, Andy showed remarkable agility riding as a "super" domestique without any signs of physical strain in the 2008 TdF. The way he was riding, I could not understand why he didn't ride away and capture his first Grand Tour. Now that we know about Frank, it isn't much of a stretch of the imagination, seeing the brothers share Dr. Eufemio Fuentes (OG/GYN) " training secrets".


All you people are paranoid.
I'm pretty sure that Frank sent 7000 euros to Fuentes in exchange for "interval-training". That's it. Besides there's a precedent.
A certain former champion was sending loads of money to a certain Italian doctor, whose name just happens to remind me of expensive cars, for "advanced training methods".
Now move along folks. Nothing here for you to see.


----------



## uzziefly (Jul 15, 2006)

Don Duende said:


> In view of the recent revelation of the secret financial relationship between Frank and Dr. Fuentes, will it be a surprise that Andy's remarkable performance at the 2007 Giro and the 2008 TdF probably was due to PEDs?
> 
> Under strict orders to ride for Sastre, Andy showed remarkable agility riding as a "super" domestique without any signs of physical strain in the 2008 TdF. The way he was riding, I could not understand why he didn't ride away and capture his first Grand Tour. Now that we know about Frank, it isn't much of a stretch of the imagination, seeing the brothers share Dr. Eufemio Fuentes (OG/GYN) " training secrets".


His TT ability kinda makes it hard for him unless he rides away by a huge amount in the mountains.

And, he looked to be spent as well after he attacked/covered a few attacks. You could see he couldn't really go at the end sometimes. Kinda.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

uzziefly said:


> His TT ability kinda makes it hard for him unless he rides away by a huge amount in the mountains.
> 
> And, he looked to be spent as well after he attacked/covered a few attacks. You could see he couldn't really go at the end sometimes. Kinda.


Yeah, the only time Fränk managed to gain real time on Evans was mountain stage two where he was seen as no threat.


----------



## Digger28 (Oct 9, 2008)

Frank Schleck 'not having a case to answer' is a disgrace. Is there any point in hoping for a drug free sport when this kind of blatant hypocrisy is STILL taking place?
They've made no effort to cross check DNA samples with the blood - just like Contador and Valverde. Waste of f***ing time. To hell with them all.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

Digger28 said:


> Frank Schleck 'not having a case to answer' is a disgrace. Is there any point in hoping for a drug free sport when this kind of blatant hypocrisy is STILL taking place?
> They've made no effort to cross check DNA samples with the blood - just like Contador and Valverde. Waste of f***ing time. To hell with them all.


There's the big difference that Fränk has granted full transparency to his bank accounts and allowed LADA to do the DNA test, neither of the riders you mentioned have been this cooperative.

The only evidence is a one time minor payment to a façade(not directly to the doctor) which just isn't enough to prosecute in a civilised court system.
And I feel sure that the investigators/prosecutor haven't laid idle the last couple of months, they've been digging for abnormalities in travelling schedules, bank transactions and the description of the façade company compared to Fränk's testimony.

Then again, there are certain people who can only be satisfied by seeing him hanged(almost said hung), guilty or not.
No I'm not saying he is innocent, just that we need proper evidence which actually makes holes in Fränk's defence.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> There's the big difference that Fränk has granted full transparency to his bank accounts and allowed LADA to do the DNA test, neither of the riders you mentioned have been this cooperative.
> 
> The only evidence is a one time minor payment to a façade(not directly to the doctor) which just isn't enough to prosecute in a civilised court system.
> And I feel sure that the investigators/prosecutor haven't laid idle the last couple of months, they've been digging for abnormalities in travelling schedules, bank transactions and the description of the façade company compared to Fränk's testimony.
> ...


Does anyone really believe that he sent $10,000 to a Gyno for a schedule of interval workouts?


----------



## Stasera (Mar 6, 2006)

bigpinkt said:


> Does anyone really believe that he sent $10,000 to a Gyno for a schedule of interval workouts?


Not me. 

Schleck's story is preposterous. It's pretty clear that he paid Fuentes 7000 euros to get started on a doping program, and then was saved from his own bad impulses when Fuentes was arrested two months later, perhaps before Schleck had even had a chance to bank any incriminating blood with the doctor. 

There may not be enough evidence to persuade the home-town authorities to go after a favorite son, but that doesn't mean that thinking people can't draw their own conclusions.


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

bigpinkt said:


> Does anyone really believe that he sent $10,000 to a Gyno for a schedule of interval workouts?


Sure people will believe it, think of all the goobers who think Armstrong was paying Ferrari 6 figures a year for the same services.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

bigpinkt said:


> Does anyone really believe that he sent $10,000 to a Gyno for a schedule of interval workouts?


Hey at least I bother to look at facts while you spin, why include the silly gyno comment when Fränk isn't proved to have had direct connection to Fuentes but only a front company? Made up evidence does not hold water in a civilised court.

And was it to be proved that Fränk made the payment with the sole intent to dope he still couldn't be nailed as there's no evidence of him actually doping. The intent to dope is no offence as long as the rider manage to change his mind before getting caught, and there only only one recorded payment even after the months long investigation.

So please do stop making those ignorant attacks on LADA.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> Hey at least I bother to look at facts while you spin, why include the silly gyno comment when Fränk isn't proved to have had direct connection to Fuentes but only a front company? Made up evidence does not hold water in a civilised court.
> 
> And was it to be proved that Fränk made the payment with the sole intent to dope he still couldn't be nailed as there's no evidence of him actually doping. The intent to dope is no offence as long as the rider manage to change his mind before getting caught, and there only only one recorded payment even after the months long investigation.
> 
> So please do stop making those ignorant attacks on LADA.


:idea: Does it make Frank look any less retarded if he sent the $10,000 to an "front Company" rather then the Gyno? 

If this was a "civilized court" and not the LADA Frank would be done.


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

OctaBech said:


> And was it to be proved that Fränk made the payment with the sole intent to dope he still couldn't be nailed as there's no evidence of him actually doping.


I don't believe that is accurate? Weren't both Frigo and Basso suspended for merely intending to dope?

This is clearly what Schleck was up to, it's preposterous that anybody would pay that kind of money for "training plans". He's a lucky boy that OP occurred when it did and not a few months later.


----------



## Digger28 (Oct 9, 2008)

Dwayne Barry said:


> I don't believe that is accurate? Weren't both Frigo and Basso suspended for merely intending to dope?
> 
> This is clearly what Schleck was up to, it's preposterous that anybody would pay that kind of money for "training plans". He's a lucky boy that OP occurred when it did and not a few months later.



You're absolutely spot on. Basso got done for his 'intention' to dope.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

bigpinkt said:


> :idea: Does it make Frank look any less retarded if he sent the $10,000 to an "front Company" rather then the Gyno?


Well a funny fact about front companies is that they do not advertise that they are facades for illegal activeties.

Yes, Fränk was a clown, idiot, fool,.. and so on, but he has already admitted that and(luckily for many of us) it's not illegal.



bigpinkt said:


> If this was a "civilized court" and not the LADA Frank would be done.


Perhaps in China.


----------



## Dwayne Barry (Feb 16, 2003)

"Well a funny fact about front companies is that they do not advertise that they are facades for illegal activeties."

This may well be true, but Schleck's explanation is not believable. There are no training plans of any kind worth 10K dollars. It is not believable that he would pay that kind of money to the "front" company for the reason he stated.

"Yes, Fränk was a clown, idiot, fool,.. and so on, but he has already admitted that and(luckily for many of us) it's not illegal."

It's not a question of "legality", only if he violated the WADA code by trying to dope. I think in all probablilty he did, especially as I haven't seen a coherent explanation as to what exactly he was paying the money for and who he thought it was going to. Have you?


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> Well a funny fact about front companies is that they do not advertise that they are facades for illegal activeties.
> 
> Yes, Fränk was a clown, idiot, fool,.. and so on, but he has already admitted that and(luckily for many of us) it's not illegal.
> 
> ...


It doesn't matter if you pay the pimp or the hooker. 

Either Frank is a retard for sending $10,000 to some unknown person for "training advice" or he thinks we are retards and will believe that is all he wanted. 

Frank's new nickname is Forest Gump


----------



## Digger28 (Oct 9, 2008)

OctaBech said:


> There's the big difference that Fränk has granted full transparency to his bank accounts and allowed LADA to do the DNA test, neither of the riders you mentioned have been this cooperative.


He granted this access knowing full well that no DNA test was going to take place. No test was going to be initiated by the Luxembourg federation. When your father is as well placed in that Federation as the Schecks', then it becomes pretty clear what is going on here.


----------



## iliveonnitro (Feb 19, 2006)

Although I believe he did (and does) dope, I am happy that it isn't the Salem Witch Trials. He deserves due process and there just wasn't solid evidence against him. Even for the intent to dope.

Few will know the truth (and definitely not the authorities) as to whether he "intended to dope" or not. But his excuse of, "I thought it was only for training plans, and when I found out who it was I stopped contact immediately," is perfectly acceptable and indisputable as far as anyone can conclude.

For a pro making 600k+ Euros/yr, what is 7k euro if it means the supposedly best coach in the world (according to his friends) will give you a training plan? Sounds plausible and a strong defense in court. Hell, Friel charges more 2.5x that!


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

Fuentes has a long history in the cycling world. He was very well known as a doping doc prior to OP. When the cops raided his office they found blood bags, PED's and doping schedules..........they found NO training plans and there is ZERO evidence that Fuentes ever coached athletes. 

It is clear the the LADA had no interest in "due process" as they did not pursue the case. If they were interested in the truth they would have taken Frank up on his offer of a DNA test, they instead did nothing.

DeLucca, Frigo, and Basso served suspensions for similar "attempted" doping, yet Schelck gets off.........and invents perhaps the stupidest dope excuse since "It was for my dog"

In any court of law he would be in trouble. Saying that you only paid the Pimip, Front man, street represenitive, gets you no where.......ask Marion Berry.


----------



## iliveonnitro (Feb 19, 2006)

bigpinkt said:


> Fuentes has a long history in the cycling world. He was very well known as a doping doc prior to OP. When the cops raided his office they found blood bags, PED's and doping schedules..........they found NO training plans and there is ZERO evidence that Fuentes ever coached athletes.
> 
> It is clear the the LADA had no interest in "due process" as they did not pursue the case. If they were interested in the truth they would have taken Frank up on his offer of a DNA test, they instead did nothing.
> 
> ...


He also said that he didn't know it was to Fuentes at the time of the transaction.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

iliveonnitro said:


> He also said that he didn't know it was to Fuentes at the time of the transaction.


If he did not know who his "training plan" would be coming from why would he put up $10,000? His story is absurd.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

Dwayne Barry said:


> "Well a funny fact about front companies is that they do not advertise that they are facades for illegal activeties."
> 
> This may well be true, but Schleck's explanation is not believable. There are no training plans of any kind worth 10K dollars. It is not believable that he would pay that kind of money to the "front" company for the reason he stated.
> 
> ...


Please do tell me how much do training plans cost, especially those based on medical examinations.
I know the ones for athletes do not come cheap, especially not the new one's with 3D videos of how the person move(Fränk's knees sure could use this).

You may think he doped, but LADA has to actually prove it with solid evidence.



bigpinkt said:


> It doesn't matter if you pay the pimp or the hooker.
> 
> Either Frank is a retard for sending $10,000 to some unknown person for "training advice" or he thinks we are retards and will believe that is all he wanted.
> 
> Frank's new nickname is Forest Gump


How about a mix like Fränk being dumb enough to get entangled because he listened to people around him, but smart enough to quit when he saw which way the wind was blowing?



Dwayne Barry said:


> I don't believe that is accurate? Weren't both Frigo and Basso suspended for merely intending to dope?
> 
> This is clearly what Schleck was up to, it's preposterous that anybody would pay that kind of money for "training plans". He's a lucky boy that OP occurred when it did and not a few months later.


They were caught while still intending to dope, the case with Fränk is different because there's no(identified) blood bag nor is there a pattern of financial transactions contradicting his story, plus the case is old with no signs of him trying to dope afterwards.
Heck there aren't even changes in his performance.

Yes Fränk was very lucky and let's hope that he actually learnt from this experience.



Digger28 said:


> You're absolutely spot on. Basso got done for his 'intention' to dope.


Basso was caught for his unchanged intention to dope, had he sent a letter to Fuentes saying he had changed his mind there wouldn't have been a case.



Digger28 said:


> He granted this access knowing full well that no DNA test was going to take place. No test was going to be initiated by the Luxembourg federation. When your father is as well placed in that Federation as the Schecks', then it becomes pretty clear what is going on here.


Fränk agreed to do the DNA test before the Spanish court dismissed the OP case.



bigpinkt said:


> Fuentes has a long history in the cycling world. He was very well known as a doping doc prior to OP. When the cops raided his office they found blood bags, PED's and doping schedules..........they found NO training plans and there is ZERO evidence that Fuentes ever coached athletes.
> 
> It is clear the the LADA had no interest in "due process" as they did not pursue the case. If they were interested in the truth they would have taken Frank up on his offer of a DNA test, they instead did nothing.
> 
> ...


No, I am pretty sure that you had never heard about Fuentes before OP and Basso's case is as already explained very different.



iliveonnitro said:


> He also said that he didn't know it was to Fuentes at the time of the transaction.


Indeed, he claims only to have had contact to the front. LADA needs evidence of direct contact between Fränk and Fuentes, something like exchanged phone numbers, a phone conversation,.a picture, or a testimony.



bigpinkt said:


> If he did not know who his "training plan" would be coming from why would he put up $10,000? His story is absurd.


Here's the thing, front companies do have descriptions and Fuentes had made several training consultant companies.
One of these companies/fronts was recommended by a rider who Fränk at the time trusted.

You can twist and overlook details as much as you want, but LADA has to disprove Fränk's story with facts.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> Please do tell me how much do training plans cost, especially those based on medical examinations.
> I know the ones for athletes do not come cheap, especially not the new one's with 3D videos of how the person move(Fränk's knees sure could use this).


What training plans? There is no evidence that Fuentes ever wrote a training plan. He gives doping schedules, not training schedules. The idea that a rider would spend $10,000 on training plans from a coach he has never met and does not have contact with......This is absurd. Please find some evidence of a training plan for professional athletes that costs $10,000 where the coach never meets or talks to the rider?



OctaBech said:


> How about a mix like Fränk being dumb enough to get entangled because he listened to people around him, but smart enough to quit when he saw which way the wind was blowing?


Of course he was listening to people around him. His DS is a doper and many of his current and former teamates were dopers.




OctaBech said:


> Fränk agreed to do the DNA test before the Spanish court dismissed the OP case.


The GC ran DNA tests on all the blood bags years ago and have already said that they are willing to share this info with any national federation. Germany was able to get an answer on Ulrich in 3 days and Luxumborg could have done the same, but it is clear they are not interested in getting the truth.




OctaBech said:


> No, I am pretty sure that you had never heard about Fuentes before OP and Basso's case is as already explained very different.


here is an article about Fuentes from 1985. 
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/depo...esultados/elpepidep/19850214elpepidep_11/Tes/
I was living and racing in Spain then. My roomates and friends were all into Athletics and they all knew who Fuentes was. The public, and the GC, became aware of Fuentes when Manzano fingered him as the Kelme doping doctor. Riders have known Fuentes name and what he does for many years. 




OctaBech said:


> Indeed, he claims only to have had contact to the front. LADA needs evidence of direct contact between Fränk and Fuentes, something like exchanged phone numbers, a phone conversation,.a picture, or a testimony.


If you try to buy coke from a front for the largest coke dealer in the country what happens when you go to trial? If you tell the jury that you were just trying to buy vitamins for $10,000 and not coke do you think the jury would laugh at you while they sent you to jail? In a court of law you are allowed to take into account a wide range of evidence. Many juries would be concerned if your boss, your co-workers, and many in your industry had bought coke for years....but you were only buying vitamins?

Frigo was suspended for buying saline off the internet. 



OctaBech said:


> You can twist and overlook details as much as you want, but LADA has to disprove Fränk's story with facts.


LADA made no effort to disprove Franks silly story. If they were interested in the truth they would have done a DNA test.....which they did not do.


----------



## fuzz-tone (Sep 29, 2008)

bigpinkt said:


> Of course he was listening to people around him. His DS is a doper and many of his current and former teamates were dopers.


Do you think you could name a person or team in professional cycling that hasn't worked for or with dopers?


----------



## philippec (Jun 16, 2002)

I do -- and I want a piece of that action.

Frank Schleck, you don't know me but can I ask that you send me 7000 euros. In return, I will send you a detailed training plan involving exclusive training methods such as "periodisation" and "rest". Oh, hell .... just send me 5000 euros and I'll tell you how to eat healthily!


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

fuzz-tone said:


> Do you think you could name a person or team in professional cycling that hasn't worked for or with dopers?


Johann Bruyneel?


----------



## iliveonnitro (Feb 19, 2006)

bigpinkt said:


> If he did not know who his "training plan" would be coming from why would he put up $10,000? His story is absurd.


A front company?

If you are an elite, damn good rider with the potential to win the Tour de France with the right (real) coach and training program, would you not spend $9300 to get there? That's not expensive at all.

If Carlos Sastre tells you that he likes his coach and that he feels stronger than ever with his progress. He gives you an email address, which leads to the Fuentes clinic. But, to cover his own ass, Sastre gives you an email address of the front company instead. Some emails are exchanged and you like what you hear. A consultation meeting is planned, where everything will be determined. It requires pre-payment of $9300. Remember, your good friend swears by this method and he has consistently placed top 5 in in GC of grand tours for years.

Would you not do it if it means reaching a new level? I sure as hell would. You can't prove that the only scenario is that he KNEW it was for doping purposes.

I'm not denying that doping was the ultimate reason. But I'd rather let a doper go than convict someone who _just might_ be telling the truth.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

iliveonnitro said:


> A front company?
> 
> If you are an elite, damn good rider with the potential to win the Tour de France with the right (real) coach and training program, would you not spend $9300 to get there? That's not expensive at all.
> 
> ...


There is ZERO evidence that Fuentes ever wrote a training plan for any of his athletes. He was a doping doctor, not a coach. Prior to sending $10,000 any rational person would inquire about the services that would be provided. If you are an elite rider whose is well paid to ride the bike you do a little research. He just sent $10,000 to an Swiss Bank Account?

Forest's goal was to reach a new level, but not through an unknown coach that he had never met or spoken to. The unknown level would be reached the same way Fuentes helped his other athletes, thru bags of blood.


----------



## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

iliveonnitro said:


> A front company?
> 
> If you are an elite, damn good rider with the potential to win the Tour de France with the right (real) coach and training program, would you not spend $9300 to get there? That's not expensive at all.
> .


The only problem is the dear guy already ad a training program. In fact he is sending his power readings in to BR on a regular basis. How do you intend to build in a second training program on top of what your team is already having you do?


----------



## Stasera (Mar 6, 2006)

*There were changes in Scheck's performance.*



OctaBech said:


> They were caught while still intending to dope, the case with Fränk is different because there's no(identified) blood bag nor is there a pattern of financial transactions contradicting his story, plus the case is old with no signs of him trying to dope afterwards.
> Heck there aren't even changes in his performance.


There _were_ changes in Schleck's performance. In the four months following his March 2006 payment to Fuentes, Schleck had the two greatest victories of his career: the 2006 Amstel Gold, and the Alpe d'Huez stage of the 2006 Tour de France. He hadn't had any remotely comparable results before he signed on with Fuentes, nor has he had any comparable victories since Fuentes went out of business.


----------



## T-Dog (Mar 21, 2008)

Frank is a cheat!


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

Looks like Frank may be the next on Torri's list.

_" list these sources say, include Frank Schleck of Luxembourg, which believe, quite a percentage of probability that was hiding under the name of the Friend of Birillo lists Eufemiano Fuentes."_

http://www.elpais.com/articulo/depo...fondo/trama/elpepudep/20090212elpepidep_6/Tes


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

Stasera said:


> There _were_ changes in Schleck's performance. In the four months following his March 2006 payment to Fuentes, Schleck had the two greatest victories of his career: the 2006 Amstel Gold, and the Alpe d'Huez stage of the 2006 Tour de France. He hadn't had any remotely comparable results before he signed on with Fuentes, nor has he had any comparable victories since Fuentes went out of business.


How can you write that bull on the Internet where everyone can look up your claim on Wikipedia? :|

Palmares

2005
13th - 2005 UCI ProTour individual standings
7th Overall, Paris-Nice
4th Overall, Tour de Suisse
2nd, Stage 9
Luxembourg National Road Race Championship
2nd, Züri-Metzgete
3rd, Giro di Lombardia
2006
3rd - 2006 UCI ProTour individual standings
1st, Amstel Gold Race
10th Overall, Tour de France
1st, Stage 15: Gap - L'Alpe-d'Huez
2007
1st, Stage 4, Tour de Suisse
1st, Giro dell'Emilia
2nd, Coppa Sabatini
3rd, Liège-Bastogne-Liège
2008
2nd, Amstel Gold Race
3rd, Liège-Bastogne-Liège
Luxembourg National Road Race Championship
6th Overall, Tour de France
7th, Stage 1
4th, Stage 6
3rd, Stage 10
9th, Stage 15
5th, Stage 17
1st, General Classification after Stages 15-16


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> How can you write that bull on the Internet where everyone can look up your claim on Wikipedia? :|
> 
> Palmares
> 
> ...


I think you just proved Stasera's point for him 2006 is still his best year....although he may have found a new Gynecologist this year.


----------



## OctaBech (Aug 12, 2008)

bigpinkt said:


> I think you just proved Stasera's point for him 2006 is still his best year....although he may have found a new Gynecologist this year.


Do not get me started on how I hate self proclaimed thinking. Thinking =/= as wanting/hoping/wishing/wet dreaming.  

The results clearly show that Fränk did not come out of the blue(no one end up as no. 13 in UCI's ProTour individual standings by coincedence) and he did by no means dissapear. Sure '07 didn't spawn any big wins in one day spring claissics but he was always in top ten. And as every one ought to know before even considering to enter this debate, Fränk can not sprint and his 'great '06 results were due to him taking the competition by surprise.

The only real difference is his '07 Tour performance but we all know how that race was turned inside out when Michael Rasmussen and Alberto Contador decided to skip 30 steps on the ladder and began competing for the yellow jersey.

It's legit and healthy to have Fränk under spuspicion, but let's stay away from biased spin or else we are hurting the sport just as much as the dopers.


----------



## bigpinkt (Jul 20, 2006)

OctaBech said:


> Do not get me started on how I hate self proclaimed thinking. Thinking =/= as wanting/hoping/wishing/wet dreaming.
> 
> The results clearly show that Fränk did not come out of the blue(no one end up as no. 13 in UCI's ProTour individual standings by coincedence) and he did by no means dissapear. Sure '07 didn't spawn any big wins in one day spring claissics but he was always in top ten. And as every one ought to know before even considering to enter this debate, Fränk can not sprint and his 'great '06 results were due to him taking the competition by surprise.
> 
> ...


It could be debated for weeks, but it doesn't really matter.

The bigger question is will Frank have ANY results for the next two years. The Italians are saying that the $10,000 may have been for more then training plans and he might have a suspension in his future.


----------

