# saddle to bar drop on Look 565 and 585 ?



## gregdogg62 (Aug 9, 2004)

Hi, I am looking at the Look 565 and 585 as a possible replacement for my Specialized Tarmac. I got my current Tarmac as a team deal, and while it is a nice riding bike, the drop from the seat to the bar is too much for me. I have resorted to flipping my stem to get a a drop that is comfortable. Before flipping the stem the drop was +/- 9cm, which is too agressive for me and never felt comfortable climbing. I ride a 54 cm Tarmac, that has a 73.5 STA and a 73 HTA with a 13 cm headtube and a 54.8 TT. I have been using the 2cm FSA cone spacer, and an additional 2cm of spacers on top of that. I ride my saddle at 74.5 CM from center of BB to top of saddle. I am about 5'-9.5" and I think i would ride a 53 cm Look 585. Based on the Look having a slightly steeper seatube angle of 73.75 and a 54.5 toptube the cockpit length should be similar. My main concern is the handlebar drop, as I would like to have the saddle to handlebar drop around 6-7 cm with a -6 degree stem. What amount of spacers would be required to achieve this drop? Is it achievable with this frame? Thanks in advance.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*some answers...*

The 53cm frame has a 148mm head tube, plus a 15mm headset top section for a total of 163mm. LOOK recommends a maximum of 3cm of spacer. This would give you a maximum height of 193mm. That would be 23mm taller than your current setup and produce slightly less than 7cm of drop.

Personally, I think a big stack of spacers is just as ugly as a high rise stem, but that's your choice. If you can't hack the drop, then a 96 degree stem with 20mm less spacer makes more sense. Also be sure you're not over doing the stem length. A stem that's too long can force you to raise the bars. The large drop shouldn't bother your climbing, unless you don't grasp the top section of the bars.

FWIW, I'm 3.5 inches shorter, ride a 51cm with 9cm of drop. I use just enough stem length to keep my arms and knees from touching when I'm pedaling in the drops, my upper back is close to horizontal and my are in reach of the brakes. 

When you raise the bars, you'll have to bend the arms more to get into an aerodynamic position, creating more arm to knee interference.


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## gregdogg62 (Aug 9, 2004)

Thanks for the input

I guess my complaint with the drop on my current setup is with the –6 stem on my Tarmac is the out of the saddle climbing position, when I have my hands on the hoods. I feel like my arms are extended too much and I don’t have a lot of leverage. With less drop, I feel that I am in a more powerful position both seated (riding in the drops) and standing (climbing).

I would like to avoid a ton of spacers, preferably no more than 2 cm. Aren’t there other factors that affect the amount of saddle to bar drop (things like BB drop)? I am just trying to learn as much as possible before making a big purchase.


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## C-40 (Feb 4, 2004)

*BB drop...*

affects the required head tube length for a given bar height relative to the saddle. Serotta is about the only brand on the market using a lower than normal BB. 99% of the road bikes you'll see on the market are within a few millimeters of the standard 7cm BB drop.

I've never noticed the problem you describe with climbing out of the saddle. I'm not sure what you need the leverage for. Proper out of the saddle climbing does not involve pulling on the bars. If you're doing that, then you're way under geared. Consider that it's rare to see a pro rider using as little as a 9cm drop. Most appear to be quite a bit more. 

I've tried even more drop, like 10cm and not had a probem until I came to the descent. A long mountain descent makes my neck hurt to look up the road for very long.


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

*size 55cm*

FWIW

if you are ~half inch under 5 feet 10 inches and want to minimise the saddle to bar drop then my not look at size 55cm Look 5x5 frame? If you want no more than 20mm spacer that I think 55cm is your best bet.

what stem lengh do ride on 54cm Tarmac? BTW I think your problem is that 54cm Tarmac is one size too small for you. I am 5'8" 1/2 i.e. full 1 inch shorter, with 83cm inseam and I used to ride 54cm Specialized carbon with 100mm stem and modest 40-50mm saddle to bar drop. I currently ride 54cm Madone with 100mm stem so unless you are very flexible you need a bigger frame than 53/54cm or put up with lots of spacers and flipped up stem.


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## gregdogg62 (Aug 9, 2004)

I ride my Tarmac with a 110 stem. I think the 55 5x5 would be a bit too long, unless I went with a short stem and then I would run into problems with weight distribution. I had a fitting done last year, and my ideal sizing was determined to be a 73.5 STA, 73 HTA, 54 cm toptube and a 120 mm stem with a 7-8 cm seat to HB drop. So based on the calculation by C-40 I could get close to the 8 cm drop with the use of about 2 cm of spacers. I have a couple of shops in the area that are Look dealers that I need to contact to see if they have anything in stock to try out, doubtful though.


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

*what is your cycling inseam then?*



gregdogg62 said:


> I ride my Tarmac with a 110 stem. I think the 55 5x5 would be a bit too long, unless I went with a short stem and then I would run into problems with weight distribution. I had a fitting done last year, and my ideal sizing was determined to be a 73.5 STA, 73 HTA, 54 cm toptube and a 120 mm stem with a 7-8 cm seat to HB drop. So based on the calculation by C-40 I could get close to the 8 cm drop with the use of about 2 cm of spacers. I have a couple of shops in the area that are Look dealers that I need to contact to see if they have anything in stock to try out, doubtful though.


I also had three different shops fit me and unless you have short upper body and long legs (inseam of 86cm or longer?) I really doubt your 53cm 5x5 fitting. In my case of 173-174cm height, 83cm cycling inseam resulted in 54.5cm TT and 100mm stem with 73.5STA. You are ~3cm taller (?) so 120mm stem takes care of some of that difference but then you pay the price of a shorter head tube i.e more spacers. Before I spend the dollars in your shoes I would test ride a 55cm 5x5 with a 100mm stem (in -6 or -8 position) as more for your size and only ~20mm of spacers (max). Unless you think 100mm stem is too short. To me it looks fine on a 54cm Madone frame so it should still look well on a Look 55cm frame.


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