# Ultegra front derailleur/ shifter trim?



## spokenwald (Mar 10, 2012)

My Ultegra 10 spd left/front shifter seemed to have a middle click trimming action which after overhaul(cleaning)-adjusting seems to have disappeared. Now I have only ability to shift from chain wheel to chain wheel with no in-between stop for more finite adjustments.
It shifts well but there is some very close tolerance with chain and derailleur cage, with some chain rub at more extreme chain angles. Any experience or help with this appreciated. thanks


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## savagemann (Dec 17, 2011)

Did you happen to disconnect the cable from the derailleur when you cleaned the shifter out?

If you did, make sure the cable is routed properly around the pinch bolt.
It needs to go over the tab then through the top.
Also, if it is routed properly, you may just have a little too much tension on the cable.

Also, if you played with the high limit screw, it could cause you to lose trim if it is set too tight.

It's a fine balance between cable tension and limit screws.

What exactly did you adjust?


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## OES (Jan 23, 2002)

spokenwald said:


> My Ultegra 10 spd left/front shifter seemed to have a middle click trimming action which after overhaul(cleaning)-adjusting seems to have disappeared. Now I have only ability to shift from chain wheel to chain wheel with no in-between stop for more finite adjustments.
> It shifts well but there is some very close tolerance with chain and derailleur cage, with some chain rub at more extreme chain angles. Any experience or help with this appreciated. thanks


If anyone REALLY understands the proper setup and supposed 'trim' of Ultegra nine- and-ten-speed front shifters, they deserve a Rockefeller Foundation Genius Award. I finally just gave the damn things up in a stuttering rage and switched to Dura Ace, which makes complete sense, setup wise.

I'd say if it's shifting properly and there's no real bothersome chainrub, leave well enough alone. The 'fix' is probably to release the cable and reset it and the limit screws, but you'll deeply regret opening that can of worms. Ultegra left shifters are one of those Shimano mysteries that only go away as new stuff comes along.


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## OES (Jan 23, 2002)

'Seemed to have' or 'seems to have,' and you say here twice, describes Ultegra 9-10 speed left shifters perfectly.



spokenwald said:


> My Ultegra 10 spd left/front shifter seemed to have a middle click trimming action which after overhaul(cleaning)-adjusting seems to have disappeared. Now I have only ability to shift from chain wheel to chain wheel with no in-between stop for more finite adjustments.
> It shifts well but there is some very close tolerance with chain and derailleur cage, with some chain rub at more extreme chain angles. Any experience or help with this appreciated. thanks


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

OES said:


> If anyone REALLY understands the proper setup and supposed 'trim' of Ultegra nine- and-ten-speed front shifters, they deserve a Rockefeller Foundation Genius Award. I finally just gave the damn things up in a stuttering rage and switched to Dura Ace, which makes complete sense, setup wise.
> 
> I'd say if it's shifting properly and there's no real bothersome chainrub, leave well enough alone. The 'fix' is probably to release the cable and reset it and the limit screws, but you'll deeply regret opening that can of worms. Ultegra left shifters are one of those Shimano mysteries that only go away as new stuff comes along.


It's a simple tension adjustment. If it isn't for you, it is probably because you don't have the cage set parallel to the chainrings. It really isn't a big deal getting the excellent Ultegra front shifting to work as designed.

Consider taking yours to an experienced mechanic next time. Front derailleurs seem to mystify lots of people, but if they are set up just like the directions they work pretty well.


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## spokenwald (Mar 10, 2012)

Yo savagmann, You nailed it with the idea that the cable was too tight. I loosened the anchor bolt a bit and let the cable slip a hair and after a short test ride, it seems that did the trick. thanks a lot.


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## spokenwald (Mar 10, 2012)

OES,
Check out savagmann's and Kontact's replies to my post. I have heard that Dura Ace has a more positive front shifting but I have never had a problem with Ultegra until the cable was set too tight. Besides, it just should work properly as do zillions of Ultegra gorups in service.
It was really easy to set it right with their suggestions. As with all mechanical stuff, it just comes down to knowing how it actually works. Winging it with STI is not a solution. It's not old school friction shifting which is a no brainer. Some of this STI stuff is counter-intuitive if you don't know the actual way it works.


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## brucew (Jun 3, 2006)

OES said:


> If anyone REALLY understands the proper setup and supposed 'trim' of Ultegra nine- and-ten-speed front shifters, they deserve a Rockefeller Foundation Genius Award


Then sign me up. 

Both my 6500 and 6700 bikes trim flawlessly. I do all my own work--built-up both bikes from boxes of parts. And I'm a librarian for heaven's sake, not some sort of trained bike technician.

Then again, I tend to read and slavishly follow the instruction sheets: Shimano Techdocs

There's an old saying: It's a poor mechanic who blames his tools (or the parts).

PS: Both my Sora and 105 triples also trim flawlessly.


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## savagemann (Dec 17, 2011)

spokenwald said:


> Yo savagmann, You nailed it with the idea that the cable was too tight. I loosened the anchor bolt a bit and let the cable slip a hair and after a short test ride, it seems that did the trick. thanks a lot.


Awesome!
Glad you got it sorted in quick fashion.
Cheers.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

OES said:


> If anyone REALLY understands the proper setup and supposed 'trim' of Ultegra nine- and-ten-speed front shifters, they deserve a Rockefeller Foundation Genius Award.


Where do I pick up my Genius Award?



> I finally just gave the damn things up in a stuttering rage and switched to Dura Ace, which makes complete sense, setup wise.


What exactly is different setup wise from a Dura Ace FD an and Ultegra FD?


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

tlg said:


> Where do I pick up my Genius Award?
> 
> What exactly is different setup wise from a Dura Ace FD an and Ultegra FD?


No trim on the DA shifter, and different pull ratio. But you set the FDs up identically.


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## tlg (May 11, 2011)

Kontact said:


> But you set the FDs up identically.


I know. I was just curious as to why he thought they were different.


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## OES (Jan 23, 2002)

Nothing better than old sayings.

Not blaming anything, nor claiming to be a master mechanic, nor denying I'm a poor one. Just a 40-year cyclist who keeps a fleet of friend-and-family bikes going and built his own RS-22. 

In that fleet, Sora, Tiagra, 105, and Dura Ace (which DOES trim, BTW) are all completely logical, and easy to make flawless. Ultegra 9-10 is not. I can make it work as a yes-no binary shifter just fine, but trim is a gossamer vision that may or may not materialize. I admit I've come across it, but finding it seems random.

I tip my hat to the several geniuses here who've never had the problem. Kudos to you, and honest respect.



brucew said:


> Then sign me up.
> 
> Both my 6500 and 6700 bikes trim flawlessly. I do all my own work--built-up both bikes from boxes of parts. And I'm a librarian for heaven's sake, not some sort of trained bike technician.
> 
> ...


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## brucew (Jun 3, 2006)

OES said:


> Nothing better than old sayings.


I'm glad you took that in the spirit intended. After I got to work I thought it could be taken as snarky, which wasn't what I meant at all.


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

OES said:


> Nothing better than old sayings.
> 
> Not blaming anything, nor claiming to be a master mechanic, nor denying I'm a poor one. Just a 40-year cyclist who keeps a fleet of friend-and-family bikes going and built his own RS-22.
> 
> ...


No, it doesn't. 7800 and older versions DID have trim, current DA 7900 does not.

If you don't state what version you have of something when you start offering opinions, the assumption is that you are speaking of the version that has been out for the last couple of years, not an arbitrary model from the past.


The tech docs link already posted has all this information, should you wish to find out about derailleurs and such.


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## OES (Jan 23, 2002)

brucew said:


> I'm glad you took that in the spirit intended. After I got to work I thought it could be taken as snarky, which wasn't what I meant at all.


Hey, I mostly post in PO. You've not experienced snark till you experienced PO snark. 

No sweat. I've just honestly been perplexed by Ultegra left shifters for years, and if you go back to the old 9-speed days on RBR (maybe before there was a separate wrenching forum), you'll find long, long threads where people argued whether there was even trim on that shifter at all, since that soft middle click didn't seem to have obvious effect on many bikes here (but did on others). And even Shimano's literature at the time was vague on what was what.


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## OES (Jan 23, 2002)

Hey, thanks, man. I sure do appreciate your kind words, your insight, your constructive criticism, and the rod up your butt. This board is blessed to have you. 



Kontact said:


> No, it doesn't. 7800 and older versions DID have trim, current DA 7900 does not.
> 
> If you don't state what version you have of something when you start offering opinions, the assumption is that you are speaking of the version that has been out for the last couple of years, not an arbitrary model from the past.
> 
> ...


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## Kontact (Apr 1, 2011)

OES said:


> Hey, thanks, man. I sure do appreciate your kind words, your insight, your constructive criticism, and the rod up your butt. This board is blessed to have you.


Are you actually peeved at me, or just peeved in general about people correcting you twice in one thread? Or do you just not like getting your correction corrected? :thumbsup:


_"which DOES trim, BTW"_ Stay classy, baby.


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## Lister Farrar (Sep 10, 2009)

savagemann said:


> Did you happen to disconnect the cable from the derailleur when you cleaned the shifter out?
> 
> If you did, make sure the cable is routed properly around the pinch bolt.
> It needs to go over the tab then through the top.
> ...


Thanks for your post. Google found it and i fixed my non-trimming front derailleur by letting the cable tension off a hair. (Yes, i need to install an inline barrel adjuster.) But made my ride way nicer and less noisy. Thx


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## Lister Farrar (Sep 10, 2009)

Worked for me too. Thanks for posting. (Yes, i need to install a barrel adjuster.)


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

Lister Farrar said:


> Thanks for your post. Google found it and i fixed my non-trimming front derailleur by letting the cable tension off a hair. (Yes, i need to install an inline barrel adjuster.) But made my ride way nicer and less noisy. Thx


It's just possible that since he posted 8 years ago, he's not tracking this thread today.


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## Lister Farrar (Sep 10, 2009)

*Saying thanks*



Kerry Irons said:


> It's just possible that since he posted 8 years ago, he's not tracking this thread today.


Yes, I guessed that was a possibility. Still wanted to say thanks, to publicly acknowledge forum contributors. Is there a better way to reach one, more directly?


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