# Stradalli Carbom frames



## jimlmackjr

Well like a lot of other people on this site i been looking to upgrade to a Full carbon frame. I have read all the Ebay carbon posti can but i found this just googling online 

has anyone hurd of this company and of their frames
what should i look for in a non race frame something that good for 25 to 30 mile rides that has a good geomontry

http://www.carbonroadbikebicyclecycling.com/catalog/2

thanks


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## Midgetman

If they are reputable, they should really get themselves another URL - that one looks awkward.


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## Dajianshan

They source OEM frames from China and brand them.


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## wim

Nice imitation of the Ferrari logo, though.  

Tom ("Crazy German") Steinbacher branching out from his motorcycle shop in Florida.


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## Midgetman

Dajianshan said:


> They source OEM frames from China and brand them.


Nothing wrong with that.


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## wim

Midgetman said:


> Nothing wrong with that.


Absolutely. Also nothing wrong with putting out an Italian brand image because people nowadays understand how bicycle frame marketing works.


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## Dajianshan

I have seen the same bikes under different names and even some without names for less. More than one of those frames can be found on Alibaba for around $400. The designs are old molds that have been tested and rejected by other companies. The Milano was tested by a close friend of mine and rejected by his company. You might as well look for deals on the ebay carbon frame sticky to find the right open-mold frames for the best price.


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## sokudo

there is always pedalforce.com if you really need a good frame at that price.


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## shuttersteve

I actually got one the Stradalli Frames, and haven't had any problems yet, and I really enjoy the ride. But what would I know? I'm not involved in frame design and engineering. And my background is mountain bike racing. (nuff said??)

For what reason's would a mold be rejected by another company? And should I worry about catastrophic failure at 45 mph (downhill obviously). 

Seems like a standard double triangle. It's extremely light. Actually seems well built and of high quality, to a novice like me. Miles better then my previous ride (although that's not saying much). And it was comparatively inexpensive. Also, I can finally ride centuries now and feel pretty decent when I'm finished (most importantly). 

So again, why would this frame be rejected? Am I sitting on a ticking time bomb, or is it just that this frame performs poorly in areas that I'm too inexperienced to grasp?


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## bginty

I just got a Red Pro from Stradalli. I am patiently waiting for the snow to melt here in Maine and get this on the road. The bike is pretty much exactly as promised. Patrick has been very helpful over the phone.


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## bikeracer2009

*Stradalli bikes*

I hope this post will help people in making a decision about buying a Stradalli bike. I too was searching the internet for information about this company and found very little about the them. I noticed they are located in Pompano Beach, Fl and since I live in Orlando I decided to send them an email and ask if they have a show room I could come by and see their bikes and if I liked what I saw, to actually go home with one.

I was able to talk to Patrick and he gave me directions to their warehouse. I drove down to Pompano and looked at each component for the bike and everyting seemed "on the up and up". The deal was too good to pass up so I purchased the bike. 

My first race using the bike was the Webster-Roubaix held on March 5, 2011 in Webster, FL. For those who do not know about this race, it is considered to be one of the most prestigious and toughest road races in the southeast. The course is 7 laps around a 9 mile loop with just over 2 miles being on a dirt. The dirt road has a lot of washboard, ruts, potholes, sand and rocks. The paved road sections are also full of potholes and broken asphalt. Most of the competition showed up on steel framed bikes and their toughest wheels. There were a lot of crashes, broken spokes and lost water bottles due to the bouncing on the washboard sections of the course. 

The bike I purchased was the Trebisacce Pro Red with the 50mm carbon fiber wheels. The bike held up perfectly. Even the wheels remained true. Because the bike held up and I was not involved in any crashes, I was able win the Category 3 race. I highly recommend the bike. It is extremely durable, stiff and is a great value. I wish I had known about this bike before purchasing my 2010 Trek Madone 6.9 Project One and my 2011 Trek Madone Livestrong Di2 bike. I could have bought ten of these bikes for what I paid for the two Treks. 

If you are looking for a road bike that is durable, stiff, has great components, and is at an unbeatable price, look no further. I am a 200 lb. sprinter and I put this bike through hell. What more could you ask for as far as quality and durability?


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## DiegoMontoya

This is our version of Roubaix, here in Utah, Sunshine.


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## rmayerik

bikeracer2009 said:


> I hope this post will help people in making a decision about buying a Stradalli bike. I too was searching the internet for information about this company and found very little about the them. I noticed they are located in Pompano Beach, Fl and since I live in Orlando I decided to send them an email and ask if they have a show room I could come by and see their bikes and if I liked what I saw, to actually go home with one.
> 
> I was able to talk to Patrick and he gave me directions to their warehouse. I drove down to Pompano and looked at each component for the bike and everyting seemed "on the up and up". The deal was too good to pass up so I purchased the bike.
> 
> My first race using the bike was the Webster-Roubaix held on March 5, 2011 in Webster, FL. For those who do not know about this race, it is considered to be one of the most prestigious and toughest road races in the southeast. The course is 7 laps around a 9 mile loop with just over 2 miles being on a dirt. The dirt road has a lot of washboard, ruts, potholes, sand and rocks. The paved road sections are also full of potholes and broken asphalt. Most of the competition showed up on steel framed bikes and their toughest wheels. There were a lot of crashes, broken spokes and lost water bottles due to the bouncing on the washboard sections of the course.
> 
> The bike I purchased was the Trebisacce Pro Red with the 50mm carbon fiber wheels. The bike held up perfectly. Even the wheels remained true. Because the bike held up and I was not involved in any crashes, I was able win the Category 3 race. I highly recommend the bike. It is extremely durable, stiff and is a great value. I wish I had known about this bike before purchasing my 2010 Trek Madone 6.9 Project One and my 2011 Trek Madone Livestrong Di2 bike. I could have bought ten of these bikes for what I paid for the two Treks.
> 
> If you are looking for a road bike that is durable, stiff, has great components, and is at an unbeatable price, look no further. I am a 200 lb. sprinter and I put this bike through hell. What more could you ask for as far as quality and durability?


bikeracer2009, I am thinking about this bike too. What are you impressions so far? Any additional comments since your last post? What is the complete weight of your bike? Thanks for your thoughts.


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## tsxi1

*My Stradalli Purchasing Adventure*

rmayerik,

Before you buy a Stradalli, allow me a moment to let you know what you might be getting into. It might sound a bit over the top, but I can back up what I say here 100% in emails and various documentation. I also have no problem being contacted personally to verify anything I write here. PM me and have at it, folks. Here are the facts:

I live in the Cayman Islands. I chose Stradalli for a couple of reasons -- they answered the phone on Saturday (7 Jan. 2012), are located within 30 miles of my freight forwarder, could ship the bike to them FedEx, and also had everything I wanted in stock. And not least, they were quite friendly and helpful, so I was delighted and confident to proceed. I've done a ton of research on the Chinese generic / Ebay frames, knew a bit about their sources and was totally comfortable with the quality, etc. It all looked so easy and simple. 

I pulled the trigger on the following Monday, Jan. 9. I purchased a 58cm Trebisacce with a full SRAM Force spec. *Patrick was the sales rep, and let me make it abundantly clear here and now that he has been simply great thru this whole process.* From what I've experienced to date, he's a stand-up guy. I very much doubt he's at the root of my issues with Stradalli.

Long story short, they sent me the wrong frame. Frustrating and irritating, but but mistakes happen. Living on an island you get used to it. So I sent the frame back on the spot. I paid all the return shipping costs out of my own pocket (about $200 in charges and various export duties, etc.) Everything else was OK so I kept the rest of the parts. I wasn't too worried about the return shipping money. I figured that we could come to some kind of agreement later. I just wanted (and still do!) a new bike. The correct one, though. I don't think that's too much to ask, seeing how I paid for it in full now is it?.

Here's how it panned out for me.The wrong frame I sent back is still at US Customs pending clearance by Stradalli. I can't clear it from 500 miles away, they must do that themselves. It's addressed to them, for G0d's sake!! But they won't because it's 30 miles away from them. The right frame is at their shop, but they absolutely will not send it to me until the wrong frame arrives safely back in their hands. 

Nevermind that there are companies out there who could clear this thing out of US Customs for about $50-$75. I even did the research to help them out and sent them an email summary of what to do. I spent a bunch of time and long distance $$ doing that. Which, as you will soon see, makes me feel like I'm wearing an extra large pair of donkey's ears right now.

So in my case their position boils down to this: they make the first mistake, I pay to correct it, they refuse to follow thru in good faith. Now they have my all my money, the correct frame in their possession and at least the legal means to retrieve the wrong frame from Miami. Just hire someone to do the paperwork and get it out of Customs. To me, that warrants a bit of positive action on their end. A couple of days go by. I'm growing uncomfortable, so I called Patrick on Friday 20 Jan. 2012 to see what's up. I explain that, quite reluctantly, if Stradalli doesn't send out my frame I would have to issue a credit card chargeback for that amount and... 

Boom. That's where things go absolutely off the rails. Someone who was not Patrick (he had a German accent, I believe) butted into the conversation, and hung up on us. Disconnected a paying customer in mid sentence, mid resolution. I was not rude or unreasonable, I did not do or say anything aggressive. I was completely stunned and surprised. I emailed them a lengthy, firmly toned but still friendly note outlining my position. I called back about 3 hours later.

The same person with the German sounding accent answered. He called himself Dale (?) and claimed to be Patrick's boss. This is where things took a turn that I'm still at a loss of words to fully understand.

*HE CURSED ME OUT. *Called me a f*ggot. Suggested I go and fellate some one. Go and f*ck myself. A paying customer. Some Joe who just wanted to buy a bike. He treated me like some sort of mangy thief. And to think, I paid thousands to experience that.

If only...if only I could have been there to physically respond to his cowardly and vile little spiel. There's still plenty of time to make amends for that, however.

And not even an apology of any type today (Jan. 23, 2011). If I owned that business, I'd be on the phone in a flash, doing whatever it took to put the fire out. But not these guys, even in the age of the Internet and social media. What does that say about them to you??

Take all this with as much salt as you like. It's your money. But I can prove to one and all that doing business with Stradalli has been nothing but pain, aggravation and grievous insults. It's got me mad enough to make write all this down at midnight anyways! This whole fiasco is still ongoing as of today. so there's still plenty more of that to come, I'm afraid. You will DEFINITELY hear about it.

As a fellow cyclist, I advise you proceed with extreme caution, sir.

Regards,
Anthony R, Ebanks


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## rmayerik

TSXI1, Thanks for your input.


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## FluffyWhiteDogs

TSXi1 So what is going on today? Does this company not have other customers out of country? How do they deal with those returns then. More importantly if they get their frames from China how do they get them through customs if they do not have an agent? This Dale person sounds like he has some anger management problems. I would find out who is the CEO of the company and send a letter.


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## Dajianshan

Stradalli is probably just a handful of guys who can't afford to lock down their own frames. They slap paint and an Italian name on these Chinese frames and sell them with a significant mark up. If you check the Great Keen catalogue or Hong-fu, you will likely get the same bike or something similar for a fraction of the price.


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## ultraman6970

Stradalli looks like the same oem frames that pretty much everybody has, with a nice paint job, ferrari red and ferrari fonts used in the logo. Would not surprise me if the owner is argentinian, why? those kind of things to market the products are common in south america, the brand sound argentinian too. Not saying italian because unless you are born in Italy (no matter where your last name is from), you are not italian. Italian argentinian descendents still swear themself italians, ask to an italian about an argentinian too hehehe. 

Don't think are bad but IMO they should be charging less for their frames.


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## Wadl

Almost all of you are saying that they use chinese frame... I can find the equivalent of some of their frame with the chinese one but not the Napoli !!

Can you tell me which chinese frame is the Napoli ??? because it is a very very sexy bike !!!


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## Dajianshan

Something like this. 

Road bicycle frame - Product Picture From Guangzhou DNK Carbon Fiber Technology Co., Ltd.


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## CabDoctor

I wouldn't touch them either. I found some guys out of East Asia using their pictures in an Alibaba scam. I contacted Stradalli about it, and just got a "we'll look into it." Not even a thanks. This was a while ago so maybe the guy who handled it isn't with the company.........but that sealed it for me.


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## Dajianshan

I might guess the OEM had prepared some frames that Stradalli never paid for, not to spec, and never delivered, so they had to get rid of them on Alibaba.


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## Kontact

What motivates people to spend money on a new brand that is reselling someone else's stuff for a premium? You're not getting a new product. You aren't taking advantage of a fantastic buying experience or the backing of a company with a great reputation. 

It just seems like throwing money away for some stickers.

Can anyone explain why people decide to buy something like this?


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## frankdatank1337

I bough the Stradalli Milano Strada-Pro. My transaction went smoothly with them. The bike has a great paint job and its a little heavy but makes up for it in stiffness. I have about 500 miles on it now and am super happy with its performance. As for the company, If you read their website they have a sketchy return policy. I was short on money so I took the risk. Everything was fine but I think its a risk you run when you don't buy from a well established/reputable company.


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## CabDoctor

Dajianshan said:


> I might guess the OEM had prepared some frames that Stradalli never paid for, not to spec, and never delivered, so they had to get rid of them on Alibaba.


It was definitely a scam. They were also selling Sram Red groupos WAAAAYYYY below cost and few other things that made you go "If it's to good to be true........."


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## Kontact

frankdatank1337 said:


> I bough the Stradalli Milano Strada-Pro. My transaction went smoothly with them. The bike has a great paint job and its a little heavy but makes up for it in stiffness. I have about 500 miles on it now and am super happy with its performance. As for the company, If you read their website they have a sketchy return policy. I was short on money so I took the risk. Everything was fine but I think its a risk you run when you don't buy from a well established/reputable company.


If you were short on money, why did you buy a $1000 to $1400 heavyish frameset from a mystery company? That's what I'm not getting. You could have bought a similar frame for $500. Or bought an off brand from a US company for $600 - $1000. What was it about Stradalli that got you to spend that much?


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## frankdatank1337

The geo/sizing was what I wanted. Also, other comparable frames from well known companies were $1200 and up for just the frame. Their bike came with frame, fork, seatpost/collar, and headset. I also like the color/pattern (although the logo is ugly). I did do research on the company before I made my purchase and the reviews were not too bad. As for the weight. I just mean its a bit heavier, it isn't a total brick. My 52cm weighs about 17lbs fully equipped (not too bad).


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## Kontact

frankdatank1337 said:


> The geo/sizing was what I wanted. Also, other comparable frames from well known companies were $1200 and up for just the frame. Their bike came with frame, fork, seatpost/collar, and headset. I also like the color/pattern (although the logo is ugly). I did do research on the company before I made my purchase and the reviews were not too bad. As for the weight. I just mean its a bit heavier, it isn't a total brick. My 52cm weighs about 17lbs fully equipped (not too bad).


You were able to find a geometry chart? I wasn't able to find anything with angles, trail, BB height, etc.


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## frankdatank1337

Its hard to read but here it is for the Milano.


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## Dajianshan

From what I was able to see on the geometry chart, the thing that stood out was slightly more trail than other race bikes.

As far as design goes, it is a really fine example of how much certain trends play into design that can really date a bike. The Stradalli is taking cues from the oversized composite designs from a few years back. The "bowed look" was marketed as adding lateral stiffness and whatnot... About 5 years ago it seemed every company was trying to arch their top tubes. Specialized, Willier, Pinarello... all of 'em. Now the trend is for leaner, tubes with sharper, flatter angles. Flatter top tubes. Cervelo, Boardman, Canyon, Viner et al. This will probably be the immediate future. 

The Stradalli is cheap, though.


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## wim

Interesting company. Steinbacher apparently is still the CEO. Good to see they're riding and having fun.
stradalli


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## rmayerik

frankdatank1337 said:


> I bough the Stradalli Milano Strada-Pro. My transaction went smoothly with them. The bike has a great paint job and its a little heavy but makes up for it in stiffness. I have about 500 miles on it now and am super happy with its performance. As for the company, If you read their website they have a sketchy return policy. I was short on money so I took the risk. Everything was fine but I think its a risk you run when you don't buy from a well established/reputable company.


What's "a little heavy"? What is the weight? Opps. Sorry....missed the previous post.


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## orange_julius

Dajianshan said:


> From what I was able to see on the geometry chart, the thing that stood out was slightly more trail than other race bikes.
> 
> As far as design goes, it is a really fine example of how much certain trends play into design that can really date a bike. The Stradalli is taking cues from the oversized composite designs from a few years back. The "bowed look" was marketed as adding lateral stiffness and whatnot... About 5 years ago it seemed every company was trying to arch their top tubes. Specialized, Willier, Pinarello... all of 'em. Now the trend is for leaner, tubes with sharper, flatter angles. Flatter top tubes. Cervelo, Boardman, Canyon, Viner et al. *This will probably be the immediate future. *
> 
> The Stradalli is cheap, though.


OK Dajianshan, let's mark this and dreg up this thread again in 2 years. ;-)
I love how "trends" trickle-down, so to say, perhaps independent of whether the "trends" have any merit in terms of their intended functions.


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## Kontact

Dajianshan said:


> From what I was able to see on the geometry chart, the thing that stood out was slightly more trail than other race bikes.
> 
> As far as design goes, it is a really fine example of how much certain trends play into design that can really date a bike. The Stradalli is taking cues from the oversized composite designs from a few years back. The "bowed look" was marketed as adding lateral stiffness and whatnot... About 5 years ago it seemed every company was trying to arch their top tubes. Specialized, Willier, Pinarello... all of 'em. Now the trend is for leaner, tubes with sharper, flatter angles. Flatter top tubes. Cervelo, Boardman, Canyon, Viner et al. This will probably be the immediate future.
> 
> The Stradalli is cheap, though.


How is a rebadged $1400 Hong Fu (or whatever) frame "cheap"?

This is cheap, with a clear 2 year warranty:
Carbon Road Bike

I can't find the geometry chart posted above on their site. I can't find any Stradalli frame warranty information. I see a 19% restocking fee in their policy section. Can someone post some links - I can't understand the comparisons you guys are making to other brands.


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## ultraman6970

Their frames are too expensive for what they are offering IMO. Not saying are bad but since everybody is using the same molds and clearly u can get the same stuff somewhere else for way less, yes too expensive.

For the island guy who had a bad experience. Sincerely you should have keep the bike as it was or maybe had is sent to somebody else's house, i guess u know somebody in miami and have used regular mail, not a Currier that has to pass and follow all the imports laws and [email protected], now u need a customs agent/office or whatever the name is to get your stuff out off US customs, makes sense to me, basically you exported the thing instead of sent it by regular mail (if possible). If not possible that's the reason many times u have to keep what they sent you because is a waste of time and money to send it back. Sure some sucker might have love to buy the bike form you up there. Then get something else. Yes, complain with the CC company and get your money back.

Stracraplli won't go and spend time and money to get the frame off customs, that is not going to happen, why? maybe because they are asking themselves the same questions I do, "how in the world did u send that???," so pretty much that frame will end up in a customs office end of the year warehouse cleaning BID or maybe the cuban Jose will be riding it a few more weeks to go the beach. Next time get your stuff from CC or other guys that clearly will stand behind them.

In miami you have scrappalli and another brand that I can't remember, the two guys have the same issues with costumer service, they send the wrong stuff, then fights and who knows what else so pretty much doesnt surprise me, is the miami way to do stuff if you ask me. U can't tell I don't like miami right? it feels like everybody is waiting for the tourist to screw him up.


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## andresmuro

jimlmackjr said:


> Well like a lot of other people on this site i been looking to upgrade to a Full carbon frame. I have read all the Ebay carbon posti can but i found this just googling online
> 
> has anyone hurd of this company and of their frames
> what should i look for in a non race frame something that good for 25 to 30 mile rides that has a good geomontry
> 
> Carbon Road Bike Frames, Mountain Bike Frames, Road Bicycle Frame
> 
> thanks


same as all the chinese frames on ebay but with an italian name and a coat of paint. you'll be better served by buying one of the $300 frames from any of the chinese ebay sites. you have a much greater selection of frame sizes and geometries. The chinese distributors have established a very good reputation and very friendly, easy to deal with and will reply to messages right away.


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## andresmuro

andresmuro said:


> same as all the chinese frames on ebay but with an italian name and a coat of paint. you'll be better served by buying one of the $300 frames from any of the chinese ebay sites. you have a much greater selection of frame sizes and geometries. The chinese distributors have established a very good reputation and very friendly, easy to deal with and will reply to messages right away.


note that many people claim that a well established, branded frame will have a better warranty, better backing, etc. If you bust a trek, cannondale, colnago, pinarello, etc., and try to get a replacement. you'll have to go through hell. First, you will have to strip the frame and take it to the bike shop. They will ship it to the company which will review the damage and decide if it was your fault or a manufacturer's defect. Most likely they'll blame you. You will have to get millions of pics, get in a huge argument with them, post a million messages here and report them to the BBB, to get them to send you a replacement probably at half price. So, you will be out by an additional absurd amount. If for any reason, your $300 frame dies, you can get another one for chump change.


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## Kontact

andresmuro said:


> note that many people claim that a well established, branded frame will have a better warranty, better backing, etc. If you bust a trek, cannondale, colnago, pinarello, etc., and try to get a replacement. you'll have to go through hell. First, you will have to strip the frame and take it to the bike shop. They will ship it to the company which will review the damage and decide if it was your fault or a manufacturer's defect. Most likely they'll blame you. You will have to get millions of pics, get in a huge argument with them, post a million messages here and report them to the BBB, to get them to send you a replacement probably at half price. So, you will be out by an additional absurd amount. If for any reason, your $300 frame dies, you can get another one for chump change.


This simply isn't true. Most reputable companies make warranty processing easy. You may be charged for rebuilding the bike, but that is up to the bike shop, and you can do it yourself if you like.

If you want a frame that was designed with certain characteristics, you are going to have to pay more than what a generic costs. In return you get the frame you desired and often a lifetime of warranty protection on your investment.

If you don't care what you're riding very much, generic frames are fine, too. And cheap. Sora is also cheap.


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## cyclesport45

Kontact said:


> If you don't care what you're riding very much, generic frames are fine, too. And cheap. Sora is also cheap.


Agreed, completely. I ride a Motobecane because it's cheap, even with the Ultegra components. It ain't pretty, but sometimes it goes fast. :thumbsup:


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## andresmuro

Kontact said:


> This simply isn't true. Most reputable companies make warranty processing easy. You may be charged for rebuilding the bike, but that is up to the bike shop, and you can do it yourself if you like.
> 
> If you want a frame that was designed with certain characteristics, you are going to have to pay more than what a generic costs. In return you get the frame you desired and often a lifetime of warranty protection on your investment.
> 
> If you don't care what you're riding very much, generic frames are fine, too. And cheap. Sora is also cheap.


All frames, branded or not have a geometry with limited choices. If you want a geometry that is specific for you, you'll to get lucky that the manufacturer that you like will have that geometry. I can't ride most frames because they have a short tube that is too short for my body. American made frames, are slightly more rideable than european ones. Racing frames are mostly made tofit the geometry of 25 year old pro-racers. Most people cannot use those frame to their full advantages. 

The great thing about the chinese ebay frames is that one company will sell you five different frames models all with different geometries. So, you are much more likely to get a frame with the characteristics that you need, than getting a Trek and paying big bucks. 

For me, for example, there is a frame with a 53 cm seatube, a 56.5 cms top tube and a 74 degree seat angle. this frame has virtually the perfect geometry for me. If I wanted to have something like that I would need to get it custom made. The same company sells other models with shorter toptubes and everything in between. You may find that one of the bigger chinese sites will have an incredible assortment of frame sizes, from the average to the odd. 

So, if you know your measurements and you need a specific geometry, you are waaaaay more likely to find the ideal geometry by visiting one of the chinese ebay sites. If you go to the three larger us companies, they will all sell frames with approximately the same geometry, unless you pay $4000 for a custom build. If you go with Italian, you'll get approximately the same geometry with a shorter toptube. 

Finally, you can get an excellent titanium custom build from a chinese manufacturer for about $600. Habanero Cycles will get it for you for $1200.


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## Kontact

andresmuro said:


> All frames, branded or not have a geometry with limited choices. If you want a geometry that is specific for you, you'll to get lucky that the manufacturer that you like will have that geometry. I can't ride most frames because they have a short tube that is too short for my body. American made frames, are slightly more rideable than european ones. Racing frames are mostly made tofit the geometry of 25 year old pro-racers. Most people cannot use those frame to their full advantages.
> 
> The great thing about the chinese ebay frames is that one company will sell you five different frames models all with different geometries. So, you are much more likely to get a frame with the characteristics that you need, than getting a Trek and paying big bucks.
> 
> For me, for example, there is a frame with a 53 cm seatube, a 56.5 cms top tube and a 74 degree seat angle. this frame has virtually the perfect geometry for me. If I wanted to have something like that I would need to get it custom made. The same company sells other models with shorter toptubes and everything in between. You may find that one of the bigger chinese sites will have an incredible assortment of frame sizes, from the average to the odd.
> 
> So, if you know your measurements and you need a specific geometry, you are waaaaay more likely to find the ideal geometry by visiting one of the chinese ebay sites. If you go to the three larger us companies, they will all sell frames with approximately the same geometry, unless you pay $4000 for a custom build. If you go with Italian, you'll get approximately the same geometry with a shorter toptube.
> 
> Finally, you can get an excellent titanium custom build from a chinese manufacturer for about $600. Habanero Cycles will get it for you for $1200.


A. My response was about warranties.

B. I have read through many of the geometry tables offered by the Chinese - they are largely copies of US geometries. With the range of head tube lengths currently available (Trek H1, H2, H3, for instance) it is not hard to fit people to stock frames. I'm willing to bet that any fit problem you have I could solve with a frame from Trek, Cervelo or Specialized in a few minutes. I sincerely doubt that you are fully understanding the charts. I don't say that to be dismissive, it's just what I do for a living.

C. The "characteristics" of a frame aren't just how they locate the contact points. A frame is a dynamic machine, not a fit armature. People pay more for certain bikes because those bikes do something a generic hasn't been designed to do, because the generics have barely been designed. A Chinese Ti frame isn't a Seven just because the tubes appear to be the same diameter and are welded together.


I am not bagging on the Chinese no names - for the most part they are competently executed and ride quite decently. They exceed any expectations by price. 

I also think that most stock frames are overpriced. But a Cervelo R3 does ride in a distinctly different and arguably superior way to many other machines - and that's worth something to people. And if that frame brakes, they'll get the newest equivalent as a replacement - which is always an upgrade for a company like that.


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## andresmuro

Kontact said:


> A. My response was about warranties.
> 
> B. I have read through many of the geometry tables offered by the Chinese - they are largely copies of US geometries. With the range of head tube lengths currently available (Trek H1, H2, H3, for instance) it is not hard to fit people to stock frames. I'm willing to bet that any fit problem you have I could solve with a frame from Trek, Cervelo or Specialized in a few minutes. I sincerely doubt that you are fully understanding the charts. I don't say that to be dismissive, it's just what I do for a living.
> 
> C. The "characteristics" of a frame aren't just how they locate the contact points. A frame is a dynamic machine, not a fit armature. People pay more for certain bikes because those bikes do something a generic hasn't been designed to do, because the generics have barely been designed. A Chinese Ti frame isn't a Seven just because the tubes appear to be the same diameter and are welded together.
> 
> 
> I am not bagging on the Chinese no names - for the most part they are competently executed and ride quite decently. They exceed any expectations by price.
> 
> I also think that most stock frames are overpriced. But a Cervelo R3 does ride in a distinctly different and arguably superior way to many other machines - and that's worth something to people. And if that frame brakes, they'll get the newest equivalent as a replacement - which is always an upgrade for a company like that.


I've been riding for over 25 years. I have studied bicycle positions all my life. I have ridden a bunch of bike brands and models from fancy and expensive to very inexpensive. 

Regarding, my cycling position, the average frame will not work for me. I have a very long torso and short inseam and short arms. So I need a small frame with a very long top tube. Plus, I like to seat low and aero. After doing a lot of research I figured out that I needed a much steeper seat angle than the average bike had. Right now, at almost 50, I can ride for hours on aerobars and not get any back pain. 

I've seen people coming out of bike shops having been fitted by "so called" experts. They have positions set similar to Lance Armstrong, Cadel Evans, or the latest riding sensation. They can only ride in one position, because their arms can't reach the drops and they are always having back problems after a couple of hours on the saddle. But, their bikes look awesome. Lots of seatpost showing, the handlebars at least 3 inches below the saddle, etc, etc. 

People don't realize that most pros have very long limbs and short torsos. So, they can have their handlebars set very low and can reach no problem with their arms. They also don't realize that pros spend hours on their bikes and have very flexible backs. So, a 73 degree angle with the saddle set back pretty far, will work for Indurain, but not for Joe Average. 

There are very few bike shops that will take the time to do what is necessary to set someone on the bike properly and that usually takes several rides. And, of all the experts that I talked to, they usually recite stuff, straight out of the latest fitting manual as if the same approach will work for everyone. Unless you are different from all the other experts, or have a degree in sports medicine, I would be skeptical of your knowledge.


----------



## andresmuro

andresmuro said:


> I've been riding for over 25 years. I have studied bicycle positions all my life. I have ridden a bunch of bike brands and models from fancy and expensive to very inexpensive.
> 
> Regarding, my cycling position, the average frame will not work for me. I have a very long torso and short inseam and short arms. So I need a small frame with a very long top tube. Plus, I like to seat low and aero. After doing a lot of research I figured out that I needed a much steeper seat angle than the average bike had. Right now, at almost 50, I can ride for hours on aerobars and not get any back pain.
> 
> I've seen people coming out of bike shops having been fitted by "so called" experts. They have positions set similar to Lance Armstrong, Cadel Evans, or the latest riding sensation. They can only ride in one position, because their arms can't reach the drops and they are always having back problems after a couple of hours on the saddle. But, their bikes look awesome. Lots of seatpost showing, the handlebars at least 3 inches below the saddle, etc, etc.
> 
> People don't realize that most pros have very long limbs and short torsos. So, they can have their handlebars set very low and can reach no problem with their arms. They also don't realize that pros spend hours on their bikes and have very flexible backs. So, a 73 degree angle with the saddle set back pretty far, will work for Indurain, but not for Joe Average.
> 
> There are very few bike shops that will take the time to do what is necessary to set someone on the bike properly and that usually takes several rides. And, of all the experts that I talked to, they usually recite stuff, straight out of the latest fitting manual as if the same approach will work for everyone. Unless you are different from all the other experts, or have a degree in sports medicine, I would be skeptical of your knowledge.


Almost forgot, the saddle that you guys sell for $110 used to be sold by performance for $30. I was an excellent saddle, particularly for triathletes. Not sure why it never caught.


----------



## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> This simply isn't true. Most reputable companies make warranty processing easy.
> 
> If you want a frame that was designed with certain characteristics, you are going to have to pay more than what a generic costs. In return you get the frame you desired and often a lifetime of warranty protection on your investment.


1. No, not really. Ever tried to deal with Gita on a Pinarello warranty for a high-end bike. The stories are...well...unpleasant. I'm sure some have had a good experience, but the horror stories are there.

2. Lifetime? Let's see. BMC: 3 years...or 5 if you register online. Pinarello...2 years. Colnago...2 years. Specialized...5 years (IF you have the frame regularly maintained by a Specialized dealer). This stuff is comical.

Take a look at what lifetime means for brands like Cannondale. Normal "wear and tear" are not included. Not sure who decides what that is. I suppose they do. (For the record, I own a Cannondale, lest you think I am "bashing" the brand).

Ultimately, and I hate to say this, the generics provide a better "warranty" since you can just purchase another one for just as cheap.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> 1. No, not really. Ever tried to deal with Gita on a Pinarello warranty for a high-end bike. The stories are...well...unpleasant. I'm sure some have had a good experience, but the horror stories are there.
> 
> 2. Lifetime? Let's see. BMC: 3 years...or 5 if you register online. Pinarello...2 years. Colnago...2 years. Specialized...5 years (IF you have the frame regularly maintained by a Specialized dealer). This stuff is comical.
> 
> Take a look at what lifetime means for brands like Cannondale. Normal "wear and tear" are not included. Not sure who decides what that is. I suppose they do. (For the record, I own a Cannondale, lest you think I am "bashing" the brand).
> 
> Ultimately, and I hate to say this, the generics provide a better "warranty" since you can just purchase another one for just as cheap.


Trek, Cervelo, Seven, Parlee and lots of others have 100% lifetime warranties. Trek and Cervelo sell many, many more bikes then Pinarello, and you aren't dealing with an importer.

The blanket statement "warranties aren't worth anything" is false, because so many bikes do get this actual protection and it is exercised all the time. Yes, some companies are difficult, but that doesn't mean that all companies are - especially when the ones sited are actually somewhat rare in the US.

All warranties have a damage and use clause. It's what prevents people from getting their bikes repainted every two years for free. All bike warranties are "material and workmanship defects" types, and there is usually a pretty clear difference.


----------



## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> Trek, Cervelo, Seven, Parlee and lots of others have 100% lifetime warranties. Trek and Cervelo sell many, many more bikes then Pinarello, and you aren't dealing with an importer.
> 
> The blanket statement "warranties aren't worth anything" is false, because so many bikes do get this actual protection and it is exercised all the time. Yes, some companies are difficult, but that doesn't mean that all companies are - especially when the ones sited are actually somewhat rare in the US.
> 
> All warranties have a damage and use clause. It's what prevents people from getting their bikes repainted every two years for free. All bike warranties are "material and workmanship defects" types, and there is usually a pretty clear difference.


My issue was with your statement that most "reputable" companies have lifetime warranties. That is simply not true.

I am not sure who you are quoting when you refer to "warranties aren't worth anything", because I said nothing of the sort. I don't see anyone else saying that either.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> My issue was with your statement that most "reputable" companies have lifetime warranties. That is simply not true.
> 
> I am not sure who you are quoting when you refer to "warranties aren't worth anything", because I said nothing of the sort. I don't see anyone else saying that either.


And you'd be right, if I made that statement.

I did say that "reputable companies make warranty processing easy". Is that what is confusing you?


Andresmuro implied that warranties have no value in his second post.


----------



## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> And you'd be right, if I made that statement.
> 
> I did say that "reputable companies make warranty processing easy". Is that what is confusing you?
> 
> 
> Andresmuro implied that warranties have no value in his second post.


If someone implied something, that's not a quote. A quote is something somebody says. Hope that clears it up.

And I appear to have misunderstood what you said with regard to the lifetime warranty. Apologies. You said manufacturers give you"often a lifetime of warranty protection on your investment." My point is that "lifetime" warranties are both relatively rare and fraught with loopholes. It's essentially the life of the frame, not the life of the owner.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> If someone implied something, that's not a quote. A quote is something somebody says. Hope that clears it up.
> 
> And I appear to have misunderstood what you said with regard to the lifetime warranty. Apologies. You said manufacturers give you"often a lifetime of warranty protection on your investment." My point is that "lifetime" warranties are both relatively rare and fraught with loopholes. It's essentially the life of the frame, not the life of the owner.


If someone implies something it is usually acceptable to paraphrase it with different language. If I quote, I use the quote button or these things: " "

And you seem to be saying exactly the same thing as the other guy:

Lifetime warranties are applied to the bicycle frame for the lifetime of the original purchaser. They aren't rare, they are exercised and honored. Work in a bike shop sometime and you'll have more perspective than reading internet forums where only the worst things are posted. If a 1970s Trek had a silvered soldered lug pull out, and it wasn't from corrosion, and you had proof of purchase, Trek would offer you a replacement frame.

If you are observing that you can't warranty a bike to a company that doesn't exist any more - sure, that's tough. It's also why no one should bother spending a grand with a fly by night company like Stradalli.


----------



## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> The blanket statement "warranties aren't worth anything" is false, because so many bikes do get this actual protection and it is exercised all the time.


Your quote of something nobody said. 

I agree that warranties are honored many times. There are companies that stand by their product and some that don't. Trek has had a pretty good reputation of honoring their warranties. Others...not so much. Those tend to be the ones with 2 year warranties.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> Your quote of something nobody said.
> 
> I agree that warranties are honored many times. There are companies that stand by their product and some that don't. Trek has had a pretty good reputation of honoring their warranties. Others...not so much. Those tend to be the ones with 2 year warranties.


The use of quotation marks has other uses in English than to quote an individual. Quotes are also used to separate a phrase to use it as the subject or object of a sentence. As I was doing there.

The companies with 2 year warranties also honor their warranties - for a full 2 years. Are you saying that a 2 year warranty should be honored for 5 years or a lifetime? Or are you saying that during that 2 year period they don't honor them? I am confused by what you wrote.


----------



## Hiro11

IMO, if you're paying top dollar for high-end carbon (anything over about $2K), there should be a no questions asked, 3 year warranty. No matter what, they should give you a free frame if one gets destroyed. The margins on these frames are stratospheric these days and the failure rate is really low, even if you count crashes. These companies can afford to be generous. Also, I think increasingly the Chinese manufactureres are going to put stronger and stronger downward pressure on prices while continually improving their quality (which already is pretty damned good). If Colnago, Pinarello, Cervelo and the like don't start offering complete peace of mind in frame replacement, their value proposition is going to look more and more silly.


----------



## zigmeister

Well, while everybody else is bickering about stuff....

I needed a relatively inexpensive set of 50mm carbon clinchers as spares/backup wheels for racing.

Anyway, bought some wheels from them though eBay. Price was reasonable and since I live in FL, I got them in short order.

When they arrived, box was nice, well packed. 

So I take them out, put them on my bike, adjust the brakes and see how true they are, without even putting tires on them.

Well, both wheels were out of whack and not true. One was out of round also. Right there, judging by the box/packing, it wasn't a shipping issue. So now I'm already thinking, WTF kind of company did I just buy these from? Didn't even check tensioning and trueness before sending these to the customer?!?!? Arrrggh.

So I contact them and ask what is up with new wheels being out of true and round right out of the box?

They said, and I quote "All machine built wheels need truing." Mmmkay. Well no SH&T!!! Did you have a human being true these before you send them out and test proper tension?!?! During the same phone conversation the guy says: "There should have been a piece of paper/documents in the box that said you should have the wheels checked out and tensioned/trued before mounting and riding them as a precaution."

Okey dokey. So I end up having to spend $75 and have a local shop re-tension both wheels, and get them trued and in round. I may have only spent $800 shipped to my house. Now I'm into these things for over $900+ when you figure my time/travel, having to drop them off at the shop etc. By the way, the mechanic that trued and tensioned them said they were horribly out of whack and it took a long time to get it sorted, hence the higher costs than normal.

They never once offered to compensate me, send a stupid jersey or anything for the troubles and added costs.

They are just having this stuff branded in China, marking it up 300% and sending it to you with zero QC being performed from what I can tell. At least with their wheels, they admitted it to me on the phone. They are boxed/shipped from their source, then re-shipped to your door without any QC and checking done to them.

Lesson learned. Once I got the wheels properly tensioned and set, they have been nice wheels. They use a descent Chosen hub and descent aero spokes. The rim itself was well built and quality is nice. I've ridden several hundred miles and they have been descent. Of course, they weigh about 100gms heavier than advertised. Surprise. 

I would recommend you spend your money elsewhere. If you just want a Taiwanese/Chinese carbon frame, there are other companies based out of the US that will give you good customer service and actually QC their stuff and ensure it is "right". Same as wheels. There are many US companies using Taiwanese wheels/hubs and building them in the US with NO QC issues whatsoever, and they actually care when a customer calls with an issue. Stradalli doesn't give a rip from my experience.

Oh, and I sanded the decals off the wheels and went stealth. Much better than that stupid Stradalli fake Italian crap they are trying to market.


----------



## ryocalavera

zigmeister said:


> I would recommend you spend your money elsewhere. If you just want a Taiwanese/Chinese carbon frame, there are other companies based out of the US that will give you good customer service and actually QC their stuff and ensure it is "right". Same as wheels. There are many US companies using Taiwanese wheels/hubs and building them in the US with NO QC issues whatsoever, and they actually care when a customer calls with an issue. Stradalli doesn't give a rip from my experience.
> 
> Oh, and I sanded the decals off the wheels and went stealth. Much better than that stupid Stradalli fake Italian crap they are trying to market.


Quality control issues are important as many US companies are having items built in Taiwan/China then shipping directly to customers (QBP's Foundry, Whisky parts, Ritte, November cycles, Neuvation) Stradelli is no different.

But one has to expect when they're paying dramatically less, they won't recieve the same thing no? I think its part of the fun from ordering from china. Having worked at many bike shops, I also think if you're able to tinker/work on wheels, gear, etc. Then its probably a very good idea to stay away from Rebranded direct from taiwanese merchandise.


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## Kontact

ryocalavera said:


> Quality control issues are important as many US companies are having items built in Taiwan/China then shipping directly to customers (QBP's Foundry, Whisky parts, Ritte, November cycles, Neuvation) Stradelli is no different.
> 
> But one has to expect when they're paying dramatically less, they won't recieve the same thing no? I think its part of the fun from ordering from china. Having worked at many bike shops, I also think if you're able to tinker/work on wheels, gear, etc. Then its probably a very good idea to stay away from Rebranded direct from taiwanese merchandise.


Stradalli isn't "dramatically less". It seems to be much more than the China direct prices for what they are selling. Their products are only dramatically less than name brands, and only if you decide to believe a Chinese generic rim is the equivalent to a Zipp or Enve, or an FM015 is the equivalent of a Cervelo or Felt.

But the rest of the world does not feel a Kia is a BMW or a Timex is an Omega, and valuates their purchases based on something else than overall shape and intended function.


----------



## zigmeister

ryocalavera said:


> Quality control issues are important as many US companies are having items built in Taiwan/China then shipping directly to customers (QBP's Foundry, Whisky parts, Ritte, November cycles, Neuvation) Stradelli is no different.
> 
> But one has to expect when they're paying dramatically less, they won't recieve the same thing no? I think its part of the fun from ordering from china. Having worked at many bike shops, I also think if you're able to tinker/work on wheels, gear, etc. Then its probably a very good idea to stay away from Rebranded direct from taiwanese merchandise.


At least with November, Neuvation etc...they are going to work out the issues and have some conscious to make things "right" if there are issues. The pre-shipping QC and standards they try to implement go a long wasy to annoying issues like I had out of the box. Stradalli, at least with their wheels, is not like November for example, or Boyd. The latter source the parts and string them up in-house, or have one of their contract wheel builders in the States do the work and ship them out. You know they are true/straight and of quality. They are not machine built wheels. And apparently, Stradalli aren't checking them before sending them off to the customer. They told me on the phone they are built/boxed and shipped to them, then they turn around and ship the box to the customer. No QC checking after the factory does their work. Then they tried to play the issue off to shipping. 

Also, putting a piece in the box stating you should have them properly tensioned/trued before putting them on your bike right out of the box is a bit odd. I can understand after awhile of riding them to see if they've loosed up some is sensible. 

I just wanted to share my experience with Stradalli as it related to wheels so people can decide themselves. Having owned a set of Boyd 50mm tubulars and now Zipp 303 FC tubulars, they were "right" out of the box from day 1.

Looking back. I should have just bought some $400 eBay Chinese carbon wheels, had them checked locally and tensioned/trued, and still paid nearly half that what I paid for the Stradalli. You live and learn.


----------



## ryocalavera

Kontact said:


> Stradalli isn't "dramatically less". It seems to be much more than the China direct prices for what they are selling. Their products are only dramatically less than name brands, and only if you decide to believe a Chinese generic rim is the equivalent to a Zipp or Enve, or an FM015 is the equivalent of a Cervelo or Felt.
> 
> But the rest of the world does not feel a Kia is a BMW or a Timex is an Omega, and valuates their purchases based on something else than overall shape and intended function.



You're right. I was comparing them to prices of name brands like Enve, Zipp, etc. Personally I would have gone with Neuvation, or Planet X in this scenario.

As for your car analogy, I don't disagree with you? I said ordering things that you know are just stuff from china is adventurous in the fact that it could be great or crap or anywhere in the middle. Stradelli sucks for their lack of QC, which we have already established..


----------



## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> But the rest of the world does not feel a Kia is a BMW or a Timex is an Omega, and valuates their purchases based on something else than overall shape and intended function.


The world may feel differently if Kias were often built in the same factory as BMWs or Mercedes. 

The fact is, a lot of these companies decided to outsource their manufacturing to the Far East and bet on quantity over quality and workmanship. They've focused their efforts on marketing, not innovation. The cutting edge innovation has been left to the few boutique firms and niche market players.

The rest just look for the next cool-looking bike that sells. They don't care if they're making frames or toasters as long as the dough keeps rolling in. These Chinese manufacturers of fake copies don't care about cycling. They don't care about quality control. They care about selling a product and getting the cash.


----------



## B05

> I paid all the return shipping costs out of my own pocket (about $200 in charges and various export duties, etc.)


 you SHOULD be able to get a refund on the duties you paid upon importing the bike. I don't know what the rules are in your state but you should look into it.


----------



## terbennett

andresmuro said:


> note that many people claim that a well established, branded frame will have a better warranty, better backing, etc. If you bust a trek, cannondale, colnago, pinarello, etc., and try to get a replacement. you'll have to go through hell. First, you will have to strip the frame and take it to the bike shop. They will ship it to the company which will review the damage and decide if it was your fault or a manufacturer's defect. Most likely they'll blame you. You will have to get millions of pics, get in a huge argument with them, post a million messages here and report them to the BBB, to get them to send you a replacement probably at half price. So, you will be out by an additional absurd amount. If for any reason, your $300 frame dies, you can get another one for chump change.


I busted a Felt frame a couple of years ago. The bike was two years old. My LBS called felt and they replaced the frame within a few days. I went into he shop to pick up my bike an didn't have to pay a dime. Whether or not I had to pay for the build, Felt replaced the frame quickly. I hope that other companies are a high level of service like Felt when dealing with warranty claims. My experience with Felt has made me choose them for two other bikes. My next bike will also be a Felt.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> The world may feel differently if Kias were often built in the same factory as BMWs or Mercedes.
> 
> The fact is, a lot of these companies decided to outsource their manufacturing to the Far East and bet on quantity over quality and workmanship. They've focused their efforts on marketing, not innovation. The cutting edge innovation has been left to the few boutique firms and niche market players.
> 
> The rest just look for the next cool-looking bike that sells. They don't care if they're making frames or toasters as long as the dough keeps rolling in. These Chinese manufacturers of fake copies don't care about cycling. They don't care about quality control. They care about selling a product and getting the cash.


"China" is not a factory. It is the world's most populous country. You are attempting to imply that any carbon bike made there is automatically equivalent. Which is tiresome and misleading. It is the equivalent of saying that all Toyotas, Chryslers, GMs, Fords and Hondas made in the US are just the same car with different chrome bits.

I know for a fact that there is an awful lot of honest to God engineering that goes into a Cervelo before the plans are taken the China for production. I'm sure there are some brands that receive less attention. I would be surprised if any generic brand received a fraction as much design work.


----------



## mtor

Dajianshan said:


> Stradalli is probably just a handful of guys who can't afford to lock down their own frames. They slap paint and an Italian name on these Chinese frames and sell them with a significant mark up. If you check the Great Keen catalogue or Hong-fu, you will likely get the same bike or something similar for a fraction of the price.


Love the color on the bike


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## PaxRomana

Kontact said:


> The use of quotation marks has other uses in English than to quote an individual. Quotes are also used to separate a phrase to use it as the subject or object of a sentence. As I was doing there.
> 
> The companies with 2 year warranties also honor their warranties - for a full 2 years. Are you saying that a 2 year warranty should be honored for 5 years or a lifetime? Or are you saying that during that 2 year period they don't honor them? I am confused by what you wrote.


I'm not sure what you were doing other than quoting something nobody said. 

No, there are plenty of companies with 2 year warranties who often refuse to warranty their frames for that period or make it excessively difficult. The stories about Gita and others are all over the place.

As for the idea that you should hang around the shop to get real feedback, seriously, that's just silly. There's a reason why sites like this exist. It's called ROAD BIKE REVIEW. It's by definition a place where people review road-bike related stuff, including warranties. You get a much better picture of a brand than by hanging around one bike shop.


----------



## Kontact

PaxRomana said:


> I'm not sure what you were doing other than quoting something nobody said.
> 
> No, there are plenty of companies with 2 year warranties who often refuse to warranty their frames for that period or make it excessively difficult. The stories about Gita and others are all over the place.
> 
> As for the idea that you should hang around the shop to get real feedback, seriously, that's just silly. There's a reason why sites like this exist. It's called ROAD BIKE REVIEW. It's by definition a place where people review road-bike related stuff, including warranties. You get a much better picture of a brand than by hanging around one bike shop.


What's silly is for a bunch of people who's only connection is bikes and an internet connection to feel like their shared virtual experience is a close resemblance to reality. Forums take isolated and statistically unimportant incidents and make them 400 response threads. Consider how many people register just to post their warranty problem - forums are not a general cross section of cyclists or professionals.

On this forum you have maybe 10 active people that are or have recently been professionals in the bike industry out of the thousands who post. We are the people who deal with the warranties, build the bikes, repair the parts and true the wheels. We're the ones who provide relatively consistent advice about how to diagnose a problem and deal with a failure. We are consistent because when you see all different bikes from different people all the time, you learn and see things that you can't from just reading often incompetent people's rants.

Yes, certain companies and importers have terrible customer service. Most of them are Italian, because the Italians have never been too great at taking criticism, and also like to take shortcuts.

If you hear of a company that predominantly fails to service warranties, don't buy from them! Gita represents much less than 1% of all bike shop bikes sold. That's hardly a useful number when making sweeping statements about the bike industry in general.

If we had access to Trek, Specialized, Cervelo, Giant, Cannondale and Raleigh's warranty statistics, I'm certain you would be shocked by how few bikes actually fail, how many of them are replaced without incident and the full story when they aren't warrantied. But no company is going to be that transparent, so you can either decide that forum posting statistics are representative of real statistics, or that the couple guys who are pros and know what they're talking about _maybe_ have a little more perspective than you do.

I think one of the main reason there are so very few professional bike people on these forums is because of how exhausting it is to be told that your experience and knowledge are unappreciated by people who spend half their time asking if a 9 speed derailleur will shift 10.


----------



## intence

I think the difficulty is knowing which companies are reputable and which are not. I saw the Stradalli wheels on eBay and considered them as well. 

I've purchased from Neuvation in the past, and over the holiday season they accidentally sent me a MTB wheel instead of the road wheel I purchased. I emailed them, and the next business day they informed me that my new wheel was on its way with a return shipping label in the box to return the incorrect product. Needless to say, I was very impressed.

I suppose the difficulty becomes how one sorts out reputable firms such as Neuvation, Boyd, etc. and fly-by-night operators like Stradalli. To a newbie, it can't be easy unless you hang out on the forums or get feedback from others who bought from the same outfit.

In any case, based on the two incidents on this thread, I will not be purchasing anything from Stradalli in the near future.


----------



## AvantDale




----------



## Chadwick890

AvantDale said:


> https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-vom5Z6SRqRM/Tr66XxGzeTI/AAAAAAAAAMI/YURC3lAvrM4/s1600/stradalli_tshirt_back_real_love_1.jpg


Amazing ive seen that image before without the Stradalli brand. It amazes me that they are now making money off someone elses design/base picture.
I was going to buy from Stradalli for a TT bike, but then after sending them a email, there response was less then ideal summed up. "Your in Australia so we are going to charge you $150 odd for shipping"

Not a fan of Stradalli and following there facebook updates they are shameless about them selves as well let alone there tacky designs are stupid. Just sayin.


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## greenspeed

I pulled the trigger on a stradalli frame. Total rip off. Frame cracked 4 months into riding it. Now they won't back it up. Worst company. The bikes/frame also ride like crap! Top it all off thanks for your service and defending our country, but your out of a frame have a nice day! I've never been treated with such disrespect.


----------



## Kontact

greenspeed said:


> I pulled the trigger on a stradalli frame. Total rip off. Frame cracked 4 months into riding it. Now they won't back it up. Worst company. The bikes/frame also ride like crap! Top it all off thanks for your service and defending our country, but your out of a frame have a nice day! I've never been treated with such disrespect.


May I recommend the Better Business Bureau and Yelp? You can at least prevent other people from having the same experience.


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## mobilesleepy

Guido bikes for Jersey Shore roadies.
barf.


----------



## f3rg

Dajianshan said:


> They source OEM frames from China and brand them.


Rebrand them, and then add about $300 to the bottom line. You're better off just buying straight from Hongfu or Dengfu.


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## 49steel

greenspeed said:


> I pulled the trigger on a stradalli frame. Total rip off. Frame cracked 4 months into riding it. Now they won't back it up. Worst company. The bikes/frame also ride like crap! Top it all off thanks for your service and defending our country, but your out of a frame have a nice day! I've never been treated with such disrespect.


greenspeed - thanks for your post.
i’ve been looking real hard at their trebisacce/sram force bike and almost pulled the trigger when they lowered the price on that model few days ago on ebay. i hesitated as the feedbacks on their reputations were kinda 50/50. But now you, zigmeister, and others on this and other posts have convinced me to take my business somewhere else.


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## greenspeed

Kontact,
I appreciate the recommendation, I really do because I don't have much time to deal with this problem I'm still active duty. 
Thank you


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## greenspeed

49steel said:


> greenspeed - thanks for your post.
> i’ve been looking real hard at their trebisacce/sram force bike and almost pulled the trigger when they lowered the price on that model few days ago on ebay. i hesitated as the feedbacks on their reputations were kinda 50/50. But now you, zigmeister, and others on this and other posts have convinced me to take my business somewhere else.


No problem, I would hate anyone else to experience this. Plus the cracks on the frame are truly structural. I had it x-rayed, guess what flaws in the carbon!! I kid you not! This isn't just cosmetic this could be someone's life. Please pass the word on here.


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## elviento2

Sounds kinda fishy. Probably a fake Italian name?


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## zigmeister

elviento2 said:


> Sounds kinda fishy. Probably a fake Italian name?


Yes, we all know it is a fake Italian name. They are based out of Florida, have their stuff sourced in China/Taiwan (who knows), and have their name put on all the items. This is completely normal by the way, many companies do this.

What the thread really focuses on is their customer service/support regarding issues. At least my post was with their wheels.

Once I had my wheels entirely retensioned and trued, costing me $75 of course, they have ridden fine/smooth and I haven't had any issues.

Also, I sanded off the decals on the wheels (pain in the arse by the way), then resprayed with satin clear coat, they look stealth and pretty cool now. Only the hubs have the name one time printed on each. Can't notice them. So I did mostly away with the logo. Also, I had bought some carbon bottle cages from them. Did the same thing, sanded the logos off, just resprayed with satin clear coat for that stealth flat black look.


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## tsxi1

*Stradalli results*

Just a quick note to update anyone still interested.

I eventually got a credit card refund for the Sorrento frame they sent me. However, from what I can determine, even though I backed everything up with paperwork proof Stradalli still clearly tried to say it was somehow my fault. Apparently they're still trying - and succeeding from what I've read others saying above - to do the wrong thing. Not surprising, really...

Bottom line for me is that Stradalli was by far the worst buying experience ever. Take it my experience for what it's worth to you. Do your homework on this outfit and apend wisely, fellow cyclists.


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## Cyclingfan1960

Stradalli bikes look great to me!


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## wim

Cyclingfan1960 said:


> Stradalli bikes look great to me!


So does CEO of Stradalli, Mr. Steinbacher (below). But when you google 'Stradalli' and click on "Images," the company doesn't exactly come across as an enterprise focused on technology and engineering .


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## aclinjury

wim said:


> So does CEO of Stradalli, Mr. Steinbacher (below). But when you google 'Stradalli' and click on "Images," the company doesn't exactly come across as an enterprise focused on technology and engineering .


lol is that really the CEO?? That tit pierce gotta hurt!


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## wim

aclinjury said:


> lol is that really the CEO??


Yes, it is. Guy in the white t-shirt, top of the page at this link:
http://stradallicycle.tumblr.com/


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## Seneb

wim said:


> Yes, it is. Guy in the white t-shirt, top of the page at this link:
> Stradalli Cycle Blog


That dude thinks he's still 24 years old. Pathetic.


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## tsxi1

Another Stradalli update for anyone thinking of parting with their cash.

I thought the issue was well and truly in the rear view mirror, but no. It appears the esteemed Mr. Steinbacher has decided to contest my credit card refund, even some days after the time limit has expired, 

I'm happy to provide all the gory details on request, but suffice it to say here that there has been a cheap and effective remedy on the table from day one. However it appears that Stradalli / Steinbacher would rather continue doing the wrong thing and maintain their laughable position than take the easy (and correct, btw) way out.

Stradalli's customers would be better served if Mr. Steinbacher paid more attention to his business and less on his appearance, posting to Facebook, setting up the lighting in his photo shoots and cursing out paying customers.

What an absolute gong-show of an operation.


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## carbon1

Hi, I am new in this forum and just what to know if thay really do come in with sram red or shimano Dura-Ace 7900 comp. Been looking in to it for a while now. All i here is talk about bike fram, Thanks.


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## carbon1

Do anyone know if Stradalli bike do come with sram red comp. as they clam.


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## Kontact

carbon1 said:


> Do anyone know if Stradalli bike do come with sram red comp. as they clam.


You actually read this thread and still want a Stradalli? Seriously?


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## pumaking

Just to give you an idea of the quality and attention to detail from Stradalli. This is a brand new bike that was brought in to our shop because of shifting issues, clicking etc etc. 

It came with a bent derailleur hanger, improperly setup rear derailleur and........ this beauty.











Continue purchasing these bikes and this is what you get.


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## trailrunner68

pumaking said:


> Just to give you an idea of the quality and attention to detail from Stradalli. This is a brand new bike that was brought in to our shop because of shifting issues, clicking etc etc.
> 
> It came with a bent derailleur hanger, improperly setup rear derailleur and........ this beauty.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Continue purchasing these bikes and this is what you get.


What are we supposed to be looking at? Other than the shameless rip-off of the Ferrari font.


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## ms6073

trailrunner68 said:


> What are we supposed to be looking at?


Look at the chain, yes it is seriously cross-chained but still seems to have several extra links.


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## pumaking

Correct, the chain was never sized from Stradalli. They literally just took the chain out of the box and threw it on.


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## trailrunner68

ms6073 said:


> Look at the chain, yes it is seriously cross-chained but still seems to have several extra links.


Ah. That is pathetic.

Just googled them. Aside from the hilarity of the company's domain name being carbonroadbikebicyclecycling.com, I found this "subdued" bit of style:










Show me someone who rides with that and I'll show you a stash of pot hidden in the ends of the bar..


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## charlox5

trailrunner68 said:


> Ah. That is pathetic.
> 
> Just googled them. Aside from the hilarity of the company's domain name being carbonroadbikebicyclecycling.com, I found this "subdued" bit of style:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Show me someone who rides with that and I'll show you a stash of pot hidden in the ends of the bar..


as a pot smoker i am offended by this comment 

i was thinking "show me someone who rides with that and i'll show you a tribal arm band tatoo and backne"


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## trailrunner68

charlox5 said:


> i was thinking "show me someone who rides with that and i'll show you a tribal arm band tatoo and backne"


Nailed it better than me.

The Stradalli brand just screams white trash.


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## pumaking

Glad you brought up those bars, another big piece of ****. See that mount at the front, snaps off like a twig, very little effort. Also the internal cable routing is so crappy, It litterally creates a 70* bend to the shifter causing A LOT of drag.


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## tsxi1

A final update on my Stradalli purchasing saga.

After repeatedly contesting my credit card refund for their mistakes - and it has come to light that they were not entirely truthful with their bank - the financial powers that be have finally drawn this matter to a close. Mr. Steinbacher loses, my refund is secure, case closed.

It now appears that the market is responding appropriately to Mr. Steinbacher's innovative methods of demonstrating his honesty, brand-building skills and stellar customer service record. I find that quite satisfying.

It gives me additional closure seeing other fellow riders becoming informed before parting with their hard earned money, and taking appropriate action if they didn't receive what they thought they were getting.


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## svard75

tsxi1 said:


> A final update on my Stradalli purchasing saga.
> 
> After repeatedly contesting my credit card refund for their mistakes - and it has come to light that they were not entirely truthful with their bank - the financial powers that be have finally drawn this matter to a close. Mr. Steinbacher loses, my refund is secure, case closed.
> 
> It now appears that the market is responding appropriately to Mr. Steinbacher's innovative methods of demonstrating his honesty, brand-building skills and stellar customer service record. I find that quite satisfying.
> 
> It gives me additional closure seeing other fellow riders becoming informed before parting with their hard earned money, and taking appropriate action if they didn't receive what they thought they were getting.


Glad to hear it. I have a pair of his Wheels and handlebars. Both are just fine and work well. Are you suggesting they may not be in business much longer? Next time I'll buy either Boyds or Planet X but for now will run these into the earth.


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## bmwk100

I'm in South Florida and see many of these bikes on our group rides. (I occasionally ride with Blain Reeves who is listed in the blog) The bikes look real nice and I have not heard anyone bashing them. I will ask around and post comments made by the owners.


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## tsxi1

svard75,

I'm not suggesting they may soon no longer be in business. I would not have any way of knowing that. But I do think it's fair to say that if over 14,000 people viewed this thread, a good bit of them might consider Stradalli in a less than favourable light. Not good for business, I would estimate.

To be clear though, I really don't care one way or the other at this juncture. I got my refund, I'm riding a nice bike and I've moved on.

bmwk100: My problem with them was customer service, not equipment. They sent me the wrong frame, I sent it back, and they effectively tried to blame me for it. I kept what worked for me, which was a SRAM Force groupset and FSA wheels, etc. Bought a Sette Forza Elite frameset and I'm thrilled with the bike I have.

Their branded stuff might be as good as gold, I wouldn't know for sure. Never did ride any of it. But judging from what I've read here, it appears that I'm not the only one out there that's had a problem with Stradalli or their equipment.

I'm just thankful that my issues were limited to just money, not that AND their equipment too!


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## svard75

tsxi1 said:


> svard75,
> 
> I'm not suggesting they may soon no longer be in business. I would not have any way of knowing that. But I do think it's fair to say that if over 14,000 people viewed this thread, a good bit of them might consider Stradalli in a less than favourable light. Not good for business, I would estimate.
> 
> To be clear though, I really don't care one way or the other at this juncture. I got my refund, I'm riding a nice bike and I've moved on.
> 
> bmwk100: My problem with them was customer service, not equipment. They sent me the wrong frame, I sent it back, and they effectively tried to blame me for it. I kept what worked for me, which was a SRAM Force groupset and FSA wheels, etc. Bought a Sette Forza Elite frameset and I'm thrilled with the bike I have.
> 
> Their branded stuff might be as good as gold, I wouldn't know for sure. Never did ride any of it. But judging from what I've read here, it appears that I'm not the only one out there that's had a problem with Stradalli or their equipment.
> 
> I'm just thankful that my issues were limited to just money, not that AND their equipment too!


Hey, nothing wrong with sharing your experiences! You have to admit buying a nice looking (IMO) full carbon roadie with DA or RED for $3500 is a steal isn't it? I mean the chain issue listed above is not a big deal. Just break out that chain tool and break where needed.


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## svard75

trailrunner68 said:


> Ah. That is pathetic.
> 
> Just googled them. Aside from the hilarity of the company's domain name being carbonroadbikebicyclecycling.com, I found this "subdued" bit of style:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Show me someone who rides with that and I'll show you a stash of pot hidden in the ends of the bar..


That is one FUGLY bar/stem paint job. I would never buy a combo myself. Heard they aren't as stiff as they should be.


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## tsxi1

svard75,

Price, perceived value for money and their location is in fact what attracted me to Stradalli. They were my 2nd choice after Neuvation, who were out of stock in my size for several weeks. 

Frameset wise, to me there isn't a whole lot of difference between most of the Asian bike rebranders and importers; what was more important was geometry, consistent hi quality component packaging across the board and a good wheelset. Stradalli 'ticked all the boxes' for my needs and after researching them I pulled the trigger. Proper setup wasn't an expectation as I live overseas.

I did, however, have an expectation of getting precisely what I paid for. The right parts in a couple of boxes. 

And make no mistake, sir - _except for taking the money_ - Stradalli failed miserably at every level of the transaction. Especially that whole customer-service and behaving-honourably bit. Oh, and the cursing me out part was a little left of the mark too, I might say. 

But yeah, it sounded pretty good at first.


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## svard75

tsxi1 said:


> svard75,
> 
> Price, perceived value for money and their location is in fact what attracted me to Stradalli. They were my 2nd choice after Neuvation, who were out of stock in my size for several weeks.
> 
> Frameset wise, to me there isn't a whole lot of difference between most of the Asian bike rebranders and importers; what was more important was geometry, consistent hi quality component packaging across the board and a good wheelset. Stradalli 'ticked all the boxes' for my needs and after researching them I pulled the trigger. Proper setup wasn't an expectation as I live overseas.
> 
> I did, however, have an expectation of getting precisely what I paid for. The right parts in a couple of boxes.
> 
> And make no mistake, sir - _except for taking the money_ - Stradalli failed miserably at every level of the transaction. Especially that whole customer-service and behaving-honourably bit. Oh, and the cursing me out part was a little left of the mark too, I might say.
> 
> But yeah, it sounded pretty good at first.


Sending the wrong or broken item just pisses me off regardless of cost. Playing ignorant and childishly cursing customers out is unacceptable and i would feel obligated to post my experience on every possible bicycle forum i find. I just didn't experience it myself. My experience with the wheels was handled quite nicely. I even found that one of the bearings in the front hub were not pressed in exactly right. My point in this is if i know a brand name bicycle part cost $7000 and i found someone selling something similarly nice without the company behind it i lower my expectations down a few notches and if an issue comes up I'm prepared with realistic expectations of customer service, warranty, etc.

It sounds like no effort customer service is important to you. I would just keep that in mind next time you shop for a bike. That extra $2000 is paying the customer service persons salary.


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## tsxi1

svard75,

I live on an island in the middle of the Caribbean Sea. There are stores that sell bicycle-like devices here, and some things in those stores that look like real bike parts. But there are literally NO bike shops here in the traditional sense.

However, if there were proper shops with knowledgeable staff and brand dealerships, I would have almost certainly have paid the premium to use them. Living overseas teaches you to respect that local relationship and service factor even more than usual. It's totally worth the price as you'll need that solid link to parts and warranty some day...!

But all that is not in the equation this time, svard75. Hindsight, 20-20, etc. I acknowledge some risk is inevitable with this stuff. I've ordered tonnes of goods over the last 30 years, and occasionally a Stradalli-like experience pops up. Ducking the occasional hurricane and enduring the egregiously incapable goofballs and flat-out dishonest vendors is all part of the price I have to pay for Christmases on the beach and great diving.

I don't believe I require any special customer service treatment. Ordinary, civil treatment and honourable behaviour is quite enough for me, thanks. All this is pretty simple as far as I see it. They caused the problem, and despite my efforts to help them, continued to make it worse and then did their best to keep it going that way. 

And whatever happened or didn't, said or wasn't, it's all in my rear view mirror now. The issue was resolved financially in my favour and the mop-up / fallout is their problem.

All I can say is I'm happy to close the book on these guys and hopefully somebody else can derive some value from my experiences.


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## Bill Bikie

Go through a local bike shop. I wouldn't buy on-line. And what's wrong with a racing frame? Anyway, any good road bike can be raced on if you've got the legs. If you like the looks and the ride, call it what you want.


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## Bozin1

I've got a Stradalli road bike and it's excellent! For the price and components, I feel I have a really good bike considering the price point.


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