# Average speed in mountain stages



## dikai_yang (May 13, 2007)

After each mountain stage, the average speed is still about 40km/hr. Aside from the downhills, does it mean that they can actually climb at about 30km/hr on 10% grade?? They really don't look all that fast on the video when they're not attacking... The average speed for a mountain stage is so Godly unreal!! I wonder what kind of HR they're at...


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## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

Well ... you been watching, right? They have constant HR updates. Average speed updates.

And yes, they climb way faster than us mortals. That's why they're pros


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## dikai_yang (May 13, 2007)

Hmm... I know that CSC posts their HR data on Biometrische Livedaten. But apparently they only display data "while" live... I'm on EST timezone... so never got to actually see it. Do you have any website that has their HR data either history or current??


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## JohnniO (Jan 11, 2003)

dikai_yang said:


> After each mountain stage, the average speed is still about 40km/hr. Aside from the downhills, does it mean that they can actually climb at about 30km/hr on 10% grade?? They really don't look all that fast on the video when they're not attacking... The average speed for a mountain stage is so Godly unreal!! I wonder what kind of HR they're at...


No they don't climb 10% at 30 kph. I'm not sure exactly how fast but it's not 30. 

The 60 MPH downhills are what keeps the average up, also they usually have a good stretch of flats prior to the climbs.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

i know lance climbed L'Alpe d'Huez at 15 MPH back on 04 tour ITT ( i know the " Pirate " climb faster than that and still hold the record ) so i guess the rest of peloton are probably climbing 12-13 MPH. the sprinters are probably around 10 MPH. i bet still faster than most of us.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

to climb a 10% grade at 30km/hr would require a power output of about 800watts. They aren't doing that. 400 watts assuming 75kg for rider and bike gives you about 11 mph. 350 or so watts gives about 10 mph--that is still hauling ass.


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## cratz2 (Aug 3, 2006)

Yeah, those downhills during the stages are what I assume keeps the average up. I would have guessed 10mph average for the steeper hills... Maybe 15 to 20 for the lesser, but still steeps such as 7%.


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## stevesbike (Jun 3, 2002)

alpe d'huez has an average grade of 7.9%. Only the first half or so is really hard. The second half isn't as steep and the last bit is a big ring climb, so Armstrong's speed is a mixture of speeds. He is not doing that speed over the first steep part. The really impressive thing is how damn long these climbs are and how many vertical feet are in a single stage.


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## z ken (Dec 30, 2006)

that mean Lance was probably going about 10 MPH on the first " half " and then kicked in another gear to may be 18-20 MPH in the second half for an average speed of 15 MPH. i think i would probably go like 5 mph in the first half and kick it in to " hyper " gear " 7 MPH. dammitt!! heheh


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## innergel (Jun 14, 2002)

It's so demoralizing to see single digit speeds when I am climbing. And I don't climb worth a crap, so I can only imagine what it would be like on some of those super long TDF climbs if the pro's are averaging 10-12 mph.


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## huez (Mar 15, 2002)

you combine all those top guys and their unhuman power outputs and you get a synergistically increased ave. speed.


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## gray8110 (Dec 11, 2001)

There's a lot going on. Most REAL mountain stages don’t have a 40kph average. A 180+ kilometer stage with 3-4+ big climbs and a summit finish will see the winners speeds closer to 33-35kph – plenty fast. 

The speed on climbs is going to be variable depending on so many factors. Armstrong and Basso averaged just under 14mph (22kph) on the Pla d’Adet climb in 2005 which averages 8% for about 10km – this was at the end of a stage with 5 very big climbs. This is the pace with some attacks at the bottom by Basso et al which usually slow the average. As others have said, Armstrong averaged nearly 15mph up Alpe d’Huez in the TT – a longer climb at about the same grade as Pla d’Adet – but that was with fresh legs. When you see a really punchy rider like Contador attack on a climb, as he did on the Galibier, you’re looking at a short burst of speed – 2-5 minutes probably – where the pace will be 30-40kph. Contador attacked on the steepest part of the climb and was going at least that fast when he got away.

It’s remarkable how much a big descent in a group will increase your average speed though. Even in the measly cat3 race at Mt Bachelor RR in the Cascade Classic last weekend, the average speed to the top of the first climb was about 15mph. That’s a pretty easy pace on a reasonably easy climb that averaged roughly 4%. Once we had reached the bottom of the descent, our average was up to 25 and we didn’t push the descent.


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## EndoMadness (Jul 14, 2005)

I've been watching the speed on climbs a bunch the last 2-3 years (when they really started showing it). This year on the some of the major climbs the leaders were at 9MPH for their lowest, multiple times. Those are probably sections we'd be doing 6-7 mph after 6-9 miles of climbing.


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## gray8110 (Dec 11, 2001)

EndoMadness said:


> I've been watching the speed on climbs a bunch the last 2-3 years (when they really started showing it). This year on the some of the major climbs the leaders were at 9MPH for their lowest, multiple times. Those are probably sections we'd be doing 6-7 mph after 6-9 miles of climbing.


The speed data you see Versus display on screen is usually completely bogus - even when they are pulling speed from a riders SRM power meter or Polar computer, there is a significant delay. There was a point this morning where it showed a speed of 10-12kph for one of the leaders, but the rider was in the big ring doing 100+rpm.


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## rensho (Aug 5, 2003)

The more telling thing for me when watching TV is to see the fans run alongside. For a normal bloke to run even at 10MPH is quite a feat(that'd be 6 minute miles). Yes it can be commonly done by a runner on flat, but a drunk TdF fan on a 6-10% grade, it really isn't going to happen.

I'd say 7-10mph on a 10% hill. Which is like 2-4mph faster than I could do.


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## Gripped (Nov 27, 2002)

gray8110 said:


> It’s remarkable how much a big descent in a group will increase your average speed though. Even in the measly cat3 race at Mt Bachelor RR in the Cascade Classic last weekend, the average speed to the top of the first climb was about 15mph. That’s a pretty easy pace on a reasonably easy climb that averaged roughly 4%. Once we had reached the bottom of the descent, our average was up to 25 and we didn’t push the descent.


Really, the converse is true. It's amazing how a hill can kill your average speed. Here's the quiz:

A 10 mile course is made up of a 5 mile ascent followed by a 5 mile descent. It takes you 30 minutes to climb the hill. How fast do you have to descend the other side to average 20 mph over the course? Even Il Falco isn't that fast.




















A: It is impossible to average 20 mph. You would have to cover the 10 mile course in 30 minutes to average 20 mph. Since you took 30 minutes to ascend the hill, you would have to descend it in zero minutes.


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