# Question to Superdave:



## stoutbeard (Apr 8, 2011)

Hey there SD, so I know you are the road bike manager there at Felt, but I actually have a MTB question. I thought it wouldn't be TOO out of line to ask you. 

SO, I recently bought a Cannondale RZ120 3 from my LBS about 2.5 months ago. It's nice. However, there are a few problems I have with it. 1. It's not my size (I got a L and need an XL). 2. It wasn't new (I got the 2010 model and it had some initial problems I kind of just tried to ignore). 3. I don't like the lefty fork (although it cuts down on weight, I was used to normal fork and can't get used to lefty). 4. It's not the color I wanted to begin with (I was really hasty with my decision and now I'm regretting it). And 5. most importantly to you: After looking at so many different Felt road bikes and people's experiences with them, etc. I realized that I really like Felt as a company. I want to support Felt more than I want to support the other brands and I've decided that I want to trade in my 2.5 month old Cannondale for a better, correct sized, new Felt Virtue series MTB. 

I have been looking at the Felt Virtue Expert and like everything about it. It's very similar to my Cannondale in terms of specs, but I would get the correct size/color/newness/etc. HOWEVER, I then looked at the Felt international site and saw it had a carbon series of Virtue bikes. I REALLY dig the Virtue Elite. It looks friggin awesome, I can order it in my size, its carbon, it's at the breach of my budget (which is okay) and best of all, it's Felt. So my question(s) to you is: Why is the 2011 Virtue Elite not available till September 2011? Isn't that when your 2012 line is supposed to be revealed/launched? Did you guys have problems with the Carbon frame at first and is that why your selling it later in the year? Is the Carbon frame strong enough for moderate/intermediate MTB all mountain riding? Would you say (as an insider) it would be better for me to get the 2012 Virtue Carbon series rather than wait for the 2011 in September (if it'll still be considered the 2011 models)? And lastly, assuming you've done MTB riding, in your opinion, do you consider carbon to be better vs aluminum? 

Sorry for making that a tad longer than maybe it needed to be, but I really am serious about buying and sticking from one company (Felt). So I appreciate your time reading this and finding out/telling me the answers to my questions! 

Thanks,
-Chris


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## zach.scofield (Apr 11, 2010)

I know I am not SD BUT, Carbon is IMO(as a rider) an absolutely wonderful material in mtb usage. Stiff, Light and super durable.


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## stoutbeard (Apr 8, 2011)

Awesome! Thanks for the input zach! I should have mentioned this in the orriginal post: ALL other opinion by anyone else is welcome of course! 

P.S. however I do apologize that this is about MTB and not Road..


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## bwalling (Apr 2, 2011)

stoutbeard said:


> And lastly, assuming you've done MTB riding, in your opinion, do you consider carbon to be better vs aluminum?


In my opinion, aluminum sucks for MTB. I have a nice steel hard tail. CF wasn't really affordable back when I bought it (1998).


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## zach.scofield (Apr 11, 2010)

stoutbeard said:


> Awesome! Thanks for the input zach! I should have mentioned this in the orriginal post: ALL other opinion by anyone else is welcome of course!
> 
> P.S. however I do apologize that this is about MTB and not Road..


 No issues with me as I am an avid Mtn Biker as well.


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## stoutbeard (Apr 8, 2011)

Fantastic Zach!!  What kind of MTB do you have, and what kind of riding do you do? And yea, bwalling, I'm not sure how I feel about aluminum. the CF I think would just be amazing, as long as it didn't crack/break.


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## zach.scofield (Apr 11, 2010)

stoutbeard said:


> Fantastic Zach!!  What kind of MTB do you have, and what kind of riding do you do? .


I ride a 2010 specialized pitch pro custom colorway bike w/ some upgrades. I ride anything from light xc to light DH but its all purely recreational.


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## stoutbeard (Apr 8, 2011)

Nice Zach! Just looked it up, looks like an awesome bike! I'm curious what colors you got . As for me, I too only do light XC/DH purely recreational too.


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## zach.scofield (Apr 11, 2010)

stoutbeard said:


> Nice Zach! Just looked it up, looks like an awesome bike! I'm curious what colors you got . As for me, I too only do light XC/DH purely recreational too.


Its black to grey w/ same faded rocker arm. Nothing fancy but it is unique. I've only seen 1 other the same color but the rocker on it was solid black. Maybe I'll get around to taking an updated photo but for now here is an old one. Upgrades (not all in picture) include: e13 lg1 chainguide, salsa 32t ring, 720 widebars from a bighit, odi grips, and a RS reverb seatpost.










Waiting for the release of a sweet Felt AM bike that would have similar geometry numbers.


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## Superdave3T (May 11, 2009)

stoutbeard said:


> Hey there SD, so I know you are the road bike manager there at Felt, but I actually have a MTB question. I thought it wouldn't be TOO out of line to ask you.
> 
> SO, I recently bought a Cannondale RZ120 3 from my LBS about 2.5 months ago. It's nice. However, there are a few problems I have with it. 1. It's not my size (I got a L and need an XL). 2. It wasn't new (I got the 2010 model and it had some initial problems I kind of just tried to ignore). 3. I don't like the lefty fork (although it cuts down on weight, I was used to normal fork and can't get used to lefty). 4. It's not the color I wanted to begin with (I was really hasty with my decision and now I'm regretting it). And 5. most importantly to you: After looking at so many different Felt road bikes and people's experiences with them, etc. I realized that I really like Felt as a company. I want to support Felt more than I want to support the other brands and I've decided that I want to trade in my 2.5 month old Cannondale for a better, correct sized, new Felt Virtue series MTB.
> 
> ...


Chris,
Thanks for your message. No problem shooting me an MTB question. I can get a little dirty now and then. Cannondale make great bikes, but as you've discovered, fit trumps all other features.

The development of the Virtue has not followed the typical "model year" plan as some of our other lines because it is an all new product. The requirements of the Virtue were different than those placed on the Edict, and different yet than our carbon fiber hardtails - the Six and Nine. 

We have the full carbon Virtues here in the office. They've been undergoing ride testing now that the machine testing for impact and fatigue is complete. Our designers are careful about getting the rear suspension dialed in exactly as they expect. This often means testing a variety of custom valved rear shocks. The Equilink design does not require a exceedingly high "blow-off" platform. It can remain active and supple without robbing efficiency. Many suspension designs today require the initial "lock out" to overcome the chain torque affecting the performance. 

Now, as for the carbon vs. the aluminum frame delivery date difference, the fact is the changes that are made during development can happen much faster in aluminum. Adding material or shape changes to the design are quick. With carbon, it requires modification of the solid steel molds (not plastic molds) or simply scrapping version 1 or version 2 of the design and cutting new molds. 

The bike must be strong enough for moderate/intermediate MTB all mountain riding. That is a requirement. We wouldn't release the frame for sale if it was not capable and ready for the punishment a ~6" bike should be able to endure.

You aren't going to find a "2011" version of the bike. We'll introduce the bike with the all new 2012 components the moment they are available. This will allow our dealers to buy the bikes this fall and have them current for an entire model year. There are a few changes coming from SRAM and Shimano that would date the bikes if we produced them in September with 2011 parts. A few short weeks later they'd appear out-of-date as the new components introduced at Eurobike and Interbike would supercede the old specification.

I rode an alloy/carbon Virtue for 3 years and had zero problems with the carbon fiber rear triangle. It put up with errant chainsuck, a few tumbles, and hundreds of miles of rocky SoCal trails. I just got a NINE LTD frame built up this winter and will be using it for some of the local cross country races but I've already discovered that I miss my Virtue for the "fun" rides and exploring some of the remote trails we have here. A full carbon Virtue might allow me to get a bike that is light enough to contest a few of those cross country events I do a year and also provide the suspension I need to stay comfortable for the logner 3-4 hour rides and keep me on the trail with my less-than-precise handling and descending skills.

Thanks for your interest, please let me know if you have additional questions.

-SD


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## stoutbeard (Apr 8, 2011)

Thank you for the detailed reply SD! It's good to know you guys make sure everything is perfect before shipping a product. That's a sign of a good company!  

I definitely plan on trading in my alloy bike for a full carbon in September then. Glad to see that multiple people dig the carbon over aluminum business for MTBs.

Are the colors/pictures going to be an accurate depiction of what to expect the 2012 carbon virtue's to look like? Just curious


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## Superdave3T (May 11, 2009)

stoutbeard said:


> Thank you for the detailed reply SD! It's good to know you guys make sure everything is perfect before shipping a product. That's a sign of a good company!
> 
> I definitely plan on trading in my alloy bike for a full carbon in September then. Glad to see that multiple people dig the carbon over aluminum business for MTBs.
> 
> Are the colors/pictures going to be an accurate depiction of what to expect the 2012 carbon virtue's to look like? Just curious


We'll have something new for '12. The photos of the 2011 Virtue carbon bikes you've seen will not be sold. Look for a launch around Eurobike/Interbike time.

-SD


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