# "Rolling coal" caught on video during yesterday's ride



## freighttraininguphill (Jun 7, 2011)

I'm sure most of you have heard of diesel trucks "rolling coal". For those who haven't, it's when the driver does something to cause the truck to belch out a thick cloud of black, carcinogenic smoke. The bullies who do this like to smoke out cyclists, pedestrians, and even other motorists. Yesterday it happened to me while on a group ride in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada.

We had just started our ride in downtown Colfax, so we were going pretty slow. After making the video from my helmet-mounted GoPro, I grabbed a screenshot off the raw file to try to get the license plate number. I am able to decipher all but the second digit. Here in California that digit is usually a letter. It is either an "X" or a "T".

Dodge Ram Cummins Turbo Diesel 'rolling coal' on road group ride 8-30-14 by freighttraininguphill, on Flickr

Here's the video.

Dodge Ram 'rolling coal' on our group road ride 8-30-14 Video - Pinkbike





I have noticed that the dbag behavior in the hills seems to happen most while on group rides. When I ride solo I have almost zero issues. I also "dress down", meaning that the only cycling-specific clothing I wear is the shorts. I wear regular clothing up top. I have found that motorists treat you better when they think you're using your bike for transportation instead of "playing" on "their" roads. Sad, but true. Other cyclists have reported the same thing.


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## 9W9W (Apr 5, 2012)

what a fkn inbred *******.


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## Bridgestone (Sep 6, 2007)

License plate number , phone call, assault charge.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

What difference does his licence plate make?

While annoying he did not do anything threatening, unsafe or illegal.


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## redondoaveb (Jan 16, 2011)

ewitz said:


> What difference does his licence plate make?
> 
> While annoying he did not do anything threatening, unsafe or illegal.


In California that's considered harassing a cyclist and the driver can be sued in civil court. If you modify your truck (which is what is required) in order to do this then it is illegal.


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## Bridgestone (Sep 6, 2007)

ewitz said:


> What difference does his licence plate make?
> 
> While annoying he did not do anything threatening, unsafe or illegal.


"jurisdictions have incorporated the definition of civil assault into the definition of the crime making it a criminal assault intentionally to cause another person to apprehend a harmful or offensive contact." I'm thinking it fits the description. It's illegal, harassment is illegal, it caused riders to veer , take eyes off road , obstructed their vision. It's definitely against the law to intentionally dump unburned and dirty exhaust mix into the path of a cyclist. Run it through a A/F analyzer and see if the EPA thinks it unhealthy to breathe.


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## burgrat (Nov 18, 2005)

I've seen a few of those d!cks here in Texas do that. Those guys are idiot a-holes. 
Knowing California with their environmental laws, how do these guys pass inspection? In the rural counties, does CA even require smog check? Those modifications seem ridiculous and without purpose, other than blowing huge amounts of smoke. 
A-1 D-bag behavior at its best.


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## Jwiffle (Mar 18, 2005)

redondoaveb said:


> In California that's considered harassing a cyclist and the driver can be sued in civil court. If you modify your truck (which is what is required) in order to do this then it is illegal.


It doesn't take modification to do that. My old rabbit was diesel, and I could lay out smoke if I wanted. Simple downshift and hit the gas. I reserved doing it only to tailgaters...backed 'em up to safe following distance pretty quick.


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## burgrat (Nov 18, 2005)

Jwiffle said:


> It doesn't take modification to do that. My old rabbit was diesel, and I could lay out smoke if I wanted. Simple downshift and hit the gas. I reserved doing it only to tailgaters...backed 'em up to safe following distance pretty quick.


I've only seen it with trucks that have those huge (6"+) diameter tail pipes. Some have them going straight up out of the bed of the truck, but those aren't the ones blowing smoke at the cyclists. Either way, classic douchebag behavior.


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## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

It's fairly common around here. Really pisses me off.

I was on a century ride earlier in the year, couple months ago or so, and some guy did this to me and the guy I was riding with. There was a huge crowd of folks behind us that saw it and were yelling. We were on a wide open and empty country road.

What was bad about this particular instance is that right after "rolling coal" on me, the truck cut me off so he could pull into his driveway that was right in front of me. The guy I was with went down but not hard avoiding him. Lucky for everyone it was a very long country driveway and nobody was going to chase up after him.

I do believe though that this is a classic case of bullying/harassment and the backwoods dorks that do it should be dragged out of their penis compensation devices and beat bloody. Just my personal opinion.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Jwiffle said:


> It doesn't take modification to do that. My old rabbit was diesel, and I could lay out smoke if I wanted. Simple downshift and hit the gas. I reserved doing it only to tailgaters...backed 'em up to safe following distance pretty quick.


Its a modification on any late model diesel. Not some old POS VW. 
It is actually a federal offence because it usually involves removing or defeating an emissions device. 
These trucks are equiped with a DPF that requires a "regen" to burn the collected soot to ash. These are often removed and the programing in the engine ECU changed to ignore the missing components. The drivers state fuel economy increases. 
This regeneration needes heat to work properly. If the vehicle is used to haul a load and is operated under a load at a steady speed, like driving down the road it will take care of its self. The heat comes from the engine load. No impact on operation and the driver dosent notice. This is called a "Passive" regen. 
If there is not enough heat due to low load, like driving around town the engine will need to preform an "active" regen. The heat comes from fuel that is injected on the exhaust stroke and travels to the DPF to create the heat needed. This impacts fuel economy. 
If this cant be completed the engine will need to preform a "parked" regen. The owners view this as an inconvenence and remove the devices that cause this to be needed. 
The reality is that people buy these trucks that need a load to operate properly and just drive them around town. This causes all sorts of problems. Like creating more motoring douschebags.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

burgrat said:


> I've seen a few of those d!cks here in Texas do that. Those guys are idiot a-holes.
> Knowing California with their environmental laws, how do these guys pass inspection? In the rural counties, does CA even require smog check? *Those modifications seem ridiculous and without purpose, other than blowing huge amounts of smoke. *
> A-1 D-bag behavior at its best.


They are, and yup.

People will pay $500 to modify their truck to be jagoffs. They look at it as thumbing their nose at the EPA and Prius owners.

America F#ck Yea!


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## JFR (Apr 18, 2003)

Please report the incident to the local PD and/or CHP. Anybody who experiences assault from a vehicle should, regardless if they have a full lic plate or video, or just a description of the car. Law enforcement need to know it's a problem. It is illegal.


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

ewitz said:


> he did not do anything threatening, unsafe or illegal.


Ya! Breathing clouds of diesel smoke never hurt anyone!

OP needs to light up a Marlboro and relax like a real man.


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## freighttraininguphill (Jun 7, 2011)

Cinelli 82220 said:


> Ya! Breathing clouds of diesel smoke never hurt anyone!
> 
> OP needs to light up a Marlboro and relax like a real *man*.


Woman 

I will report this jerkoff to CARB/CHP.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

freighttraininguphill said:


> Woman
> 
> I will report this jerkoff to CARB/CHP.


Be respectful though. Refer to him as "Mr. Jerkoff".


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

redondoaveb said:


> In California that's considered harassing a cyclist and the driver can be sued in civil court. If you modify your truck (which is what is required) in order to do this then it is illegal.


The only problem with a civil suit is in most places you can't simply collect just because a motorist or someone else is "wrong." You have to demonstrate injury and loss because a case is actionable. If, for instance, as a result of someone rolling coal you became disoriented, crashed, and injured yourself, then you could sue, and if there are real injuries, like broken bones, collect substantial money damages, not to mention punitive.

But if you were just smogged out by one of these douch*bags, there is no injury, I am pretty sure you can't collect anything. However, if you have it on your helmet cam AND you got the license plate, I am pretty sure you can at least have the cops pay the guy a visit. It is illegal to harrass cyclists, and not only that, but there really is a danger that a cyclist can be seriously injured if made visually disoriented like that.


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## hfc (Jan 24, 2003)

This phenomenon is a variation on the saying "it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool rather than open your mouth and remove all doubt"


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## berserk87 (Jul 24, 2014)

I have had this done twice to me on rides this year. I guess the effort it takes to leave others alone and move on is beyond the ability of some folks. The idea that I am not so much a person, but entertainment for some idiot is comforting.


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## burgrat (Nov 18, 2005)

In my fantasy land, I would have a paintball gun on hand to tag the truck after getting smoked! In real life that would probably end up leading to a physical confrontation or worse. One can dream...


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## MMsRepBike (Apr 1, 2014)

Some people carry a small frame pump with them. Maybe I'll start to carry one of those telescoping beat down sticks... This may be an idea in the making.


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## SauronHimself (Nov 21, 2012)

burgrat said:


> In my fantasy land, I would have a paintball gun on hand to tag the truck after getting smoked! In real life that would probably end up leading to a physical confrontation or worse. One can dream...


That's why you carry more than one paintball, and it's also why you have the CO2 cranked to 400 feet per second.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

ChiroVette said:


> The only problem with a civil suit is in most places you can't simply collect just because a motorist or someone else is "wrong." You have to demonstrate injury and loss because a case is actionable. If, for instance, as a result of someone rolling coal you became disoriented, crashed, and injured yourself, then you could sue, and if there are real injuries, like broken bones, collect substantial money damages, not to mention punitive.
> 
> But if you were just smogged out by one of these douch*bags, there is no injury, I am pretty sure you can't collect anything. However, if you have it on your helmet cam AND you got the license plate, I am pretty sure you can at least have the cops pay the guy a visit. It is illegal to harrass cyclists, and not only that, but there really is a danger that a cyclist can be seriously injured if made visually disoriented like that.


Do you actually believe all this BS?

No one was visully disoriented. The police have better things to do especially when no one even had to even had to alter their line to avoid the incident. 

Civil actions? You would be laughed out of court.

Seriously, if you are going to ride your bike, especially in our near urban areas, then be prepared to ignore the actions of the others on the road who don't appeciate your presence on the road.


If I didn't learn to do this myself I would either be wasting my time trying to report every driver who I felt wronged me on the road or I would return from my rides with a great big chip on my shoulder and higher blood pressure than when I left.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

ewitz said:


> Do you actually believe all this BS?
> 
> No one was visully disoriented. The police have better things to do especially when no one even had to even had to alter their line to avoid the incident.
> 
> *Civil actions? You would be laughed out of court.*


Reading comprehension problems or did you just skim my post and decide to call it BS? The part in bold was precisely what I said. Where there is no injury or provable loss attributable to the defendant's actions, there is no civil case, period. 

By the way, you don't know if there is a potential for visual disorientation from actions like this. Maybe not in the OP's case, but that is a dangerous thing for a motorist to do, particularly with newer or less experienced cyclists.



ewitz said:


> Seriously, if you are going to ride your bike, especially in our near urban areas, then be prepared to ignore the actions of the others on the road who don't appeciate your presence on the road.


There are laws to protect cyclists from things like the OP posted, though. We are not talking about yelling, cursing out cyclists, or being mean lol. 



ewitz said:


> If I didn't learn to do this myself I would either be wasting my time trying to report every driver who I felt wronged me on the road or I would return from my rides with a great big chip on my shoulder and higher blood pressure than when I left.


If you went to the police stations in my area with that video and had a license plate clearly displayed on it, cops would more likely than not pay the person a visit. Yes, they have more pressing things to do, but if you have a motorist purposely spewing out black smoke into cyclists faces while they are innocently riding, that is something that you can make a stink about in your precinct. But if you don't think that it is potentially dangerous to bellow a noxious cloud of black smoke into a cyclists face, potentially (albeit temporarily) robbing said cyclist of his ability to see his or her surroundings, then I have to respectfully disagree. Distracting people who are vulnerable on cycles while they are trying to navigate their way through all sorts of on-road obstacles can be seen as an assault of sorts. I am sure there are some lazy cops that might blow you off, but not all cops would take such a lazy attitude toward an arguably toxic and potentially dangerous "assault," though I put the word in quotes because no cop would charge said motorist with assault.


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## redondoaveb (Jan 16, 2011)

ewitz said:


> Do you actually believe all this BS?
> 
> No one was visully disoriented. The police have better things to do especially when no one even had to even had to alter their line to avoid the incident.
> 
> ...


No, you wouldn't be laughed out of court. Los Angeles is taking this very serious. Cyclist's cannot be harassed verbally or physically. 

New Los Angeles law bans harassing bicyclists


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

redondoaveb said:


> New Los Angeles law bans harassing bicyclists


Great article, thanks for posting it!


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

ewitz said:


> What difference does his licence plate make?
> 
> While annoying he did not do anything threatening, unsafe or illegal.


You think that blinding and choking a cyclist with carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, nitric oxide, respirable carbon particulates, sulfur dioxide, benzene and hydrocarbons . . . 

. . . is SAFE?!

Duane Behrens


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

ewitz said:


> Do you actually believe all this BS? [snip]
> 
> Seriously, if you are going to ride your bike, especially in our near urban areas, then be prepared to ignore the actions of the others on the road who don't appeciate your presence on the road. [snip]


Actually, the only "BS" I can see here is the suggestion or implication that we should put up with it. 

GET his license plate.
FIND out where he lives.
CAMP in his yard, on his sidewalk and/or at his workplace with your friends. 
EMBARRASS him with the truth; tell him he's a coward, hurting people from inside the safety of his vehicle. 

Post his name and address and a picture of what he's done here. There. Everywhere.

Have fun with it. It is NOT a waste of time.


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## love4himies (Jun 12, 2012)

freighttraininguphill said:


> Woman
> 
> I will report this jerkoff to CARB/CHP.


Glad to hear it. Cyclists have a right to enjoy riding in peace without the harassment of idiots. If the driver has done it to you, then he/she has done it to others and it may cause an accident one day.


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## burgrat (Nov 18, 2005)

love4himies said:


> Glad to hear it. Cyclists have a right to enjoy riding in peace without the harassment of idiots. If the driver has done it to you, then he/she has done it to others and it may cause an accident one day.


I agree. This guy will continue to blow that crap on cyclists, runners, etc. Maybe a visit or a citation by the police, sheriff, or CHP will make him think twice.


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## freighttraininguphill (Jun 7, 2011)

Well, I might have to give up on this  A poster on another cycling forum suggested I run the plate with the "X" and "T" through the DMVs smog test database. Neither one came back to a Dodge. I tried a couple other letters, still no luck. Either I didn't get the other six digits of the plate right or the plate itself is stolen.


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## mfdemicco (Nov 8, 2002)

freighttraininguphill said:


> Well, I might have to give up on this  A poster on another cycling forum suggested I run the plate with the "X" and "T" through the DMVs smog test database. Neither one came back to a Dodge. I tried a couple other letters, still no luck. Either I didn't get the other six digits of the plate right or the plate itself is stolen.


Are diesels required to be smog tested?


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

If it happens to me - and it hasn't happened yet - I will stop and pull out my cell phone. I'll dial 911, I'll describe the vehicle and its heading to the dispatcher, and will assert that the driver is blinding cyclists repeatedly with exhaust from his vehicle in a way that leaves no doubt that he's doing it for cruel sport. I'll give them my name and address. They'll already have my cell no. And I'll offer to cooperate in any investigation and/or eventual hearing associated with the incident. That's it. That's all I'll do. 

Why wouldn't every one of you do exactly the same?

Duane Behrens


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Duane Behrens said:


> Why wouldn't every one of you do exactly the same?
> 
> Duane Behrens


Nope.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

I think I'd just keep riding... But then again, I'm in Jersey. That's just our regular air to us.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

PBL450 said:


> I think I'd just keep riding... But then again, I'm in Jersey. That's just our regular air to us.


Hahahaha Gotta love the garden state!



Duane Behrens said:


> If it happens to me - and it hasn't happened yet - I will stop and pull out my cell phone. I'll dial 911, I'll describe the vehicle and its heading to the dispatcher, and will assert that the driver is blinding cyclists repeatedly with exhaust from his vehicle in a way that leaves no doubt that he's doing it for cruel sport. I'll give them my name and address. They'll already have my cell no. And I'll offer to cooperate in any investigation and/or eventual hearing associated with the incident. That's it. That's all I'll do.
> 
> Why wouldn't every one of you do exactly the same?
> 
> Duane Behrens


Great question. Even better idea!


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

tihsepa said:


> Nope.


Why not? Your reply serves no use to anyone reading this thread.

Another lister suggested that HE (or SHE) wouldn't call it in, for fear that the dispatcher wouldn't consider it as a "life-threatening emergency." That supposition is false. If I see a drunk driver crossing lanes, slowly weaving in and out of traffic, I'll call it in - even though there is no clear "life-threatening emergency." In the same way, the A-hole in a diesel pickup who swerves close to cyclists- and then presses the accelerator to blind those cyclists in a plume of noxious gases - well, that A-hole is creating a serious physical risk to each cyclist he approaches. 

So call it in. Don't EVER be shy about this. Because here's how it works: If the LEOs ARE busy responding to an accident or a crime of greater importance, you'll be placed on the back burner or ignored. And that's fine, that's the way it should be. 

But there will be occasions when a motor or patrol is* in the area, is free, and is able to approach and observe* the A-hole's behaviour. 

Cue flashing red and blue lights.

Duane Behrens


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Duane Behrens said:


> Why not? Your reply serves no use to anyone reading this thread.
> 
> Another lister suggested that HE (or SHE) wouldn't call it in, for fear that the dispatcher wouldn't consider it as a "life-threatening emergency." That supposition is false. If I see a drunk driver crossing lanes, slowly weaving in and out of traffic, I'll call it in - even though there is no clear "life-threatening emergency." In the same way, the A-hole in a diesel pickup who swerves close to cyclists- and then presses the accelerator to blind those cyclists in a plume of noxious gases - well, that A-hole is creating a serious physical risk to each cyclist he approaches.
> 
> ...


I can almost imagine the response. 
We have people with heart attacks calling. People hiding from knife attackers. And you got smoke in your face?


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## skitorski (Dec 4, 2012)

It's a puff of smoke. Keep riding. For the love of Bengi.


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## Blackbeerthepirate (Apr 26, 2011)

911 Operator- "911, What is your emergency?"

Cyclist- "I was riding my bike and a truck came by and blew smoke at me."

911 Operator- "Okay, but what is your emergency?"

Cyclist- "That IS my emergency! It was a diesel truck and the exhaust smoke was very black and stinky."

911 Operator- "Were you injured? Do you require an ambulance?"

Cyclist- " No but I'm very annoyed. The guy in the truck DID IT ON PURPOSE."

911 Operator- "You do realize that 911 is for actual emergencies."

Cyclist- "THIS IS AN ACTUAL EMERGENCY! A guy in a truck drove by me and thick black smoke came out of his exhaust. HE DID THIS ON PURPOSE!

911 Operator- (click)


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## Cooper1960 (Oct 14, 2010)

Around here we call that crop dusting, not rolling coal. Regardless it happens from time to time, for me it's no big deal, I was farm raised and love the smell of diesel.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

den bakker said:


> I can almost imagine the response.
> We have people with heart attacks calling. People hiding from knife attackers. And you got smoke in your face?


exactly.

911 is for requesting emergency response, not for reporting that someone is a bone-headed loser.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

Half of you will die of cancer. And I'm sure that until the very end, you'll wonder why.


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## Marc (Jan 23, 2005)

Oxtox said:


> exactly.
> 
> 911 is for requesting emergency response, not for reporting that someone is a bone-headed loser.


You realize there's a non-emergency manner of contacting your local PD?


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Duane Behrens said:


> Half of you will die of cancer. And I'm sure that until the very end, you'll wonder why.


no I can think of many reasons. 
One have to be really dense to think it's due to one truck blowing some smoke.


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Marc said:


> You realize there's a non-emergency manner of contacting your local PD?


let me help you out here with where this came from. Given it's a few posts ago and you might have lost track: 
"If it happens to me - and it hasn't happened yet - I will stop and pull out my cell phone. I'll dial 911," bla bla.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

Oxtox said:


> exactly.
> 
> 911 is for requesting emergency response, not for reporting that someone is a bone-headed loser.


It depends. If the dispatcher gives you crap about the 911 system being for emergencies only, you can assert that with the sheer amount of billowing smoke this driver is spewing out, you were blinded, and so was your entire group and that your bikes got tangled up and you almost had a catastrophic crash.

I would never suggest anyone call and whine and say that "some mean driver is blowing smoke at me!" Of course, that would be categorically absurd and met with scorn by the operator. If you're smart, you call this in and embellish. Talk about how the driver of the vehicle is intentionally causing an incredibly dangerous situation. You almost got hit by a car! You fell off your bike. Hell, I'm sure you could show the dispatched cops some scratches and scuffs from another incident in the unlikely event you were asked to substantiate your claims of falling off your bike resulting from being blinded.

Yes, the hyperbole and poking fun at the ludicrousness of the complaints are funny and all and being presented by detractors in this thread as if there is no real danger. But how many of the people saying these things are very experienced riders, and perhaps used to this kind of stupidity?

A guy rolling coal on some inexperienced cyclists could potentially get someone killed. Blind a guy for two seconds, and he hits a pothole, parked car, or worse, gets disoriented and swerves into traffic. 

Make all the jokes you want. Some of them are even funny. 

But don't assume that everyone is as experienced as you and can simply roll with it (no pun intended) when someone pulls this. So, yeah, call 911. Make sure you sound absolutely terrified because of the horrible danger you were just put in. Exaggerate; make up a f*cking story about how you came this close to buying it; tell the operator you rode into a parked car or got thrown off your bike; make sh*t up. If not for you, then for the next guy who this may really put in danger.


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## SauronHimself (Nov 21, 2012)

This is how cyclists can be rolling "kål":


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## Blackbeerthepirate (Apr 26, 2011)

Duane Behrens said:


> Half of you will die of cancer. And I'm sure that until the very end, you'll wonder why.


Hey, I hear the world is full of nice people. Let me know when you find one.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

Marc said:


> You realize there's a non-emergency manner of contacting your local PD?


even tho the acting of 'coaling' cyclists is really a low-life move, personally, I wouldn't bother reporting it as an emergency or non-emergency.

in the single instance that it's happened to me, I simply held my breath until I pedaled past the smoke. 

wasn't really a huge deal...

I was far more perturbed by the trucktards that intentionally aimed a six-pack of empty beer bottles at me at 60 mph...


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

ChiroVette said:


> It depends. If the dispatcher gives you crap about the 911 system being for emergencies only, you can assert that with the sheer amount of billowing smoke this driver is spewing out, you were blinded, and so was your entire group and that your bikes got tangled up and you almost had a catastrophic crash.
> 
> I would never suggest anyone call and whine and say that "some mean driver is blowing smoke at me!" Of course, that would be categorically absurd and met with scorn by the operator. If you're smart, you call this in and embellish. Talk about how the driver of the vehicle is intentionally causing an incredibly dangerous situation. You almost got hit by a car! You fell off your bike. Hell, I'm sure you could show the dispatched cops some scratches and scuffs from another incident in the unlikely event you were asked to substantiate your claims of falling off your bike resulting from being blinded.
> 
> ...


you forgot. "think of the children".


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

ChiroVette said:


> Exaggerate; make up a f*cking story about how you came this close to buying it; tell the operator you rode into a parked car or got thrown off your bike; make sh*t up. If not for you, then for the next guy who this may really put in danger.


seriously...? sorry, guess I don't possess the drama queen gene.

if it wasn't a real emergency, I'm certainly not going to tie up the 911 operator with some whiny bs story.


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## STRANA (Oct 5, 2013)

Most police departments have driving complaint forms you can submit online. This is a normal practice in my area. The complaints are added to the PD database and used to flag vehicles and drivers as problems.

In addition when a vehicle is stopped and the officer is deciding whether a ticket maybe issued it usually goes as part of the consideration if they have any sort of history.

Same goes for in court. The driver appears saying they have no history of problems but these will be presented by the prosecution as history.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

den bakker said:


> you forgot. "think of the children".



Also, "If you don't come now, the terrorists win!!!!" :cryin:


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

Oxtox said:


> seriously...? sorry, guess I don't possess the drama queen gene.
> 
> if it wasn't a real emergency, I'm certainly not going to tie up the 911 operator with some whiny bs story.


Well, absent your alternative solution - and you don't seem to be able to provide one - I suggest that when it happens to YOU, you simply wave weakly, smile bravely and utter softly . . . 

"Please, sir, may I have another?"


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

ChiroVette said:


> It depends. If the dispatcher gives you crap about the 911 system being for emergencies only, you can assert that with the sheer amount of billowing smoke this driver is spewing out, you were blinded, and so was your entire group and that your bikes got tangled up and you almost had a catastrophic crash.
> 
> I would never suggest anyone call and whine and say that "some mean driver is blowing smoke at me!" Of course, that would be categorically absurd and met with scorn by the operator. If you're smart, you call this in and embellish. Talk about how the driver of the vehicle is intentionally causing an incredibly dangerous situation. You almost got hit by a car! You fell off your bike. Hell, I'm sure you could show the dispatched cops some scratches and scuffs from another incident in the unlikely event you were asked to substantiate your claims of falling off your bike resulting from being blinded.
> 
> ...


THIS. "This guy is purposely turning his wheel, trying to drive us off the shoulder! He's spewing smoke from his exhaust, BLINDING US! Two cyclists behind me are off the road, vomiting! PLEASE get out here as soon as you can! It's a brown Dodge Ram diesel, crew cab short box with a bumper sticker "Mind if I Smoke?" License D*J5613! "

Trust me, if you're on a group ride you'll have plenty of witnesses to corroborate your claims. Now and at the hearing, there is strength in numbers. 

Etc. These effers don't deserve to live, much less get away with this schit. They're small-minded cowards. Negative reinforcement becomes the only cure. Gimme an amen.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

Duane Behrens said:


> I suggest that when it happens to YOU..


already described my reaction to it. it was essentially an annoyance that did not require hysterics.

so, does this happen to you frequently? are there squadrons of knuckle-dragger coalers in your area that accost you often?

or do you just enjoy getting on a soap-box about every little injustice that occurs in your life...


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Oxtox said:


> already described my reaction to it. it was essentially an annoyance that did not require hysterics.
> 
> so, does this happen to you frequently? are there squadrons of knuckle-dragger coalers in your area that accost you often?
> 
> or do you just enjoy getting on a soap-box about every little injustice that occurs in your life...


While I have taken to adding Duane and his high horse to my ignore list. You hit the nail on the head. Some people act like every little thing is the end of the world. They need to get over it and move on. Too much time and money spent clogging up the courts with this petty BS.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

tihsepa said:


> While I have taken to adding Duane and his high horse to my ignore list. You hit the nail on the head. Some people act like every little thing is the end of the world. They need to get over it and move on. Too much time and money spent clogging up the courts with this petty BS.


Nope.


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## scottma (May 18, 2012)

I was on a century ride today and some idiot did that. It was a very hard ride and it was really hot out today. At that point I was so tired I really could care less. The other riders around me didnt seem to care too much either. Just heard a few people say what a jerk he was and that was it. Had some other ******* idiot in a truck yell out the window "Hey Boy! Dont you know what side of the road to ride on?!" No idea what he meant by that. Just a dumb ******* so who cares.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

scottma said:


> I was on a century ride today and some idiot did that. It was a very hard ride and it was really hot out today. At that point I was so tired I really could care less. The other riders around me didnt seem to care too much either. Just heard a few people say what a jerk he was and that was it. Had some other ******* idiot in a truck yell out the window "Hey Boy! Dont you know what side of the road to ride on?!" No idea what he meant by that. Just a dumb ******* so who cares.


Mmm. Well. Let me tell you. You and your friends took a dose today. And you took that dose deep into your tired, laboring lungs. Because of the short duration, your exposure probably didn't approach any 8-hour permissible exposure limit. Still, the best studies I've seen indicate that with many contaminants, cancer and other risks are increased and exacerbated with EVERY exposure, large or small. So it pays to limit such exposure as much as possible. You seem to disagree, and that's absolutely fine. 

You're a cyclist. So am I. We enjoy the same pastime. I care about you and about all who ride these things for pleasure, training and sport. And I personally think that tolerating retarded stunts from cowboy cowards is not appropriate.

I could be wrong. Sleep well.


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## scottma (May 18, 2012)

Duane Behrens said:


> Mmm. Well. Let me tell you. You and your friends took a dose today. And you took that dose deep into your tired, laboring lungs. Because of the short duration, your exposure probably didn't approach any 8-hour permissible exposure limit. Still, the best studies I've seen indicate that with many contaminants, cancer and other risks are increased and exacerbated with EVERY exposure, large or small. So it pays to limit such exposure as much as possible. You seem to disagree, and that's absolutely fine.
> 
> You're a cyclist. So am I. We enjoy the same pastime. I care about you and about all who ride these things for pleasure, training and sport. And I personally think that tolerating retarded stunts from cowboy cowards is not appropriate.
> 
> I could be wrong. Sleep well.


There was no dose. He did it as he took off from a stop and went around a left turn. We could see it but it was not like a cloud engulfed us or anything. The guy was a douche and there are lots of them. There was nothing any of us could have done about it, and no one was hurt. At that point, the heat and the climbs were peoples concern.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

Duane Behrens said:


> Mmm. Well. Let me tell you. You and your friends took a dose today. And you took that dose deep into your tired, laboring lungs. Because of the short duration, your exposure probably didn't approach any 8-hour permissible exposure limit. Still, the best studies I've seen indicate that with many contaminants, cancer and other risks are increased and exacerbated with EVERY exposure, large or small. So it pays to limit such exposure as much as possible. You seem to disagree, and that's absolutely fine.
> 
> You're a cyclist. So am I. We enjoy the same pastime. I care about you and about all who ride these things for pleasure, training and sport. And I personally think that tolerating retarded stunts from cowboy cowards is not appropriate.
> 
> I could be wrong. Sleep well.


I agree with your point on spec, but honestly, I don't even think the toxicity of the fumes is even the primary issue. I think that this is a potentially dangerous pass time that motorists are doing and not doing anything about it, could mean that it will proliferate.

I honestly don't quite understand why some are trivializing the potential danger of this Goober-stunt.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

Duane Behrens said:


> Etc. These effers don't deserve to live, much less get away with this schit. They're small-minded cowards. Negative reinforcement becomes the only cure. Gimme an amen.


Those effers, as you call them, feel the same way about cyclists; you have sunk to their level.

There are those who would say that they won.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

ChiroVette said:


> I agree with your point on spec, but honestly, I don't even think the toxicity of the fumes is even the primary issue. I think that this is a potentially dangerous pass time that motorists are doing and not doing anything about it, could mean that it will proliferate.
> 
> I honestly don't quite understand why some are trivializing the potential danger of this Goober-stunt.


Until it becomes a hate crime it ain't nothing but a show of ignorance.


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Duane Behrens said:


> Mmm. Well. Let me tell you. You and your friends took a dose today. And you took that dose deep into your tired, laboring lungs. Because of the short duration, your exposure probably didn't approach any 8-hour permissible exposure limit. Still, the best studies I've seen indicate that with many contaminants, cancer and other risks are increased and exacerbated with EVERY exposure, large or small. So it pays to limit such exposure as much as possible. You seem to disagree, and that's absolutely fine.
> 
> You're a cyclist. So am I. We enjoy the same pastime. I care about you and about all who ride these things for pleasure, training and sport. And I personally think that tolerating retarded stunts from cowboy cowards is not appropriate.
> 
> I could be wrong. Sleep well.


following your own logic, in lack of a better word, you should not ride at all around cars due to the exposure. You'll suck in more sh!t from the regular traffic than what one bonehead makes smoking you. 
So maybe you should follow your own advise and not go riding?


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

Duane Behrens said:


> Well, absent your alternative solution - and you don't seem to be able to provide one - I suggest that when it happens to YOU, you simply wave weakly, smile bravely and utter softly . . .
> 
> "Please, sir, may I have another?"


Take a second to actually read the thread; plenty of ways have been suggested to report it instead of calling 911.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

velodog said:


> Those effers, as you call them, feel the same way about cyclists; you have sunk to their level.
> 
> There are those who would say that they won.


If you do nothing about it, they have. End of argument.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

den bakker said:


> Take a second to actually read the thread; plenty of ways have been suggested to report it instead of calling 911.


Actually, the more I think about this, I have to I agree with you. I believe that these things should definitely be reported, but maybe sparing the 911 operators the extra work is probably a good thing. There are precincts, cops walking beats, cops in cars, cops doing a myriad of things, all of whom we can avail ourselves of without calling 911.



velodog said:


> Until it becomes a hate crime it ain't nothing but a show of ignorance.


I'm not willing to wait for it to escalate to that level. I see it as not only maliciously and mischievously invasive, but a possible danger on the road because of the potential to randomly interrupt your visual acuity as you're riding.



den bakker said:


> following your own logic, in lack of a better word, you should not ride at all around cars due to the exposure. You'll suck in more sh!t from the regular traffic than what one bonehead makes smoking you.
> So maybe you should follow your own advise and not go riding?


No, because one is a byproduct of internal combustion that is unavoidable and every cyclist chooses to endure because it is not an intentional thing or attack levied purposefully against cyclists, and the other is an intentional attack on your senses and a possibly dangerous one at that, particularly for inexperienced riders.


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## scottma (May 18, 2012)

Duane Behrens said:


> If you do nothing about it, they have. End of argument.


In the case of yesterdays ride, what exactly should have been done about it? There was no video, no license plate was recorded. They was no injury to anyone. Just because someone is being a jerk, you have to report it? In an ideal world everyone is nice and polite. Unfortunately, thats not where we live. There are many idiots out there. Out riding on the public roads, I get yelled at, buzzed, cut off, whatever. Fortunately, I've never had anything thrown at me. Its a hazard that comes with the territory. In a case where some dude is just being a jerk, no one was harmed in any way, there is no need for overreaction.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

Duane Behrens said:


> If you do nothing about it, they have. End of argument.


I thought that when you said that "those effers don't deserve to live" you were speaking of ending the argument.

Strong talk over some rudeness.


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

ChiroVette said:


> No, because one is a byproduct of internal combustion that is unavoidable and every cyclist chooses to endure because it is not an intentional thing or attack levied purposefully against cyclists, and the other is an intentional attack on your senses and a possibly dangerous one at that, particularly for inexperienced riders.


given my lungs cannot distinguish under which circumstances the particles were emitted it is the same from a health point of view. If what tips the scale for your health is that amount of smoke you truly live in a privileged place. Radon from your house will have a larger impact.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

velodog said:


> I thought that when you said that "those effers don't deserve to live" you were speaking of ending the argument.
> 
> Strong talk over some rudeness.


Looks like the high and mighty go nuts when they dont get their way. I replied a simple "nope" to that guys rant about calling the cops. He proceeded to troll more than a few one of my posts all over the board with the same reply. Comes across like a child who is mad he dosent get his way. 
He is on my ignore list now and received a well deserved red dot. He's really not fooling anyone with his upfront "nice guy" attitude then deciding that someone that offended him dosent deserve to live. Thats pretty low. I am done with this thread and playing into some peoples psycho rants.


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

Duane Behrens said:


> You and your friends took a dose today.


you seem sadly oblivious to the fact that every single ICE-powered vehicle that passes you is emitting particulates, SOx, NOx, etc...the coalers' smoke clouds are more visually obvious, but you're getting 'dosed' every time you ride in traffic of any type.

it's a cold, cruel world out there...you might want to save some energy for truly important issues.


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## crossracer (Jun 21, 2004)

I think the most important part of this is that todays video is getting better and better. I now ride with a gopro. From seeing other rolling coal incidents this one was very mild. Yes these people are asses, hopefully the video and the cameras keep them from escalating. 

Bill


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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

GoPro has a 4K camera out now that will catch everything. 

Must take a lot of memory but those cards are cheap now.


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## SauronHimself (Nov 21, 2012)

Cinelli 82220 said:


> GoPro has a 4K camera out now that will catch everything.
> 
> Must take a lot of memory but those cards are cheap now.


If you're referring to the Hero 3+, 4k only runs at 15 fps. That's no good for dynamic capture.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

tihsepa said:


> Looks like the high and mighty go nuts when they dont get their way. I replied a simple "nope" to that guys rant about calling the cops. He proceeded to troll more than a few one of my posts all over the board with the same reply. Comes across like a child who is mad he dosent get his way.
> He is on my ignore list now and received a well deserved red dot. He's really not fooling anyone with his upfront "nice guy" attitude then deciding that someone that offended him dosent deserve to live. Thats pretty low. I am done with this thread and playing into some peoples psycho rants.


How can I miss you if you won't go away?

EDIT: Sorry, that was rude and condescending. Apologies if I offended you, but I in turn found your one word answer to my post - "Nope" - to be much the same. Perhaps I misunderstood.

We're all doing the best we can out there. Cowboys pressing the accelerator on diesel engines, cars crowding us, ramming us from behind while adjusting their iTunes playlists . . . we're all forced to put up with it often. I won't stop riding because of it and I would never suggest that anyone do that. I DO think there should be a limit beyond which, upon which, we should begin to push back. If you don't agree, that's fine. But I'd like to know why you feel that way. Thanks.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

den bakker said:


> given my lungs cannot distinguish under which circumstances the particles were emitted it is the same from a health point of view. If what tips the scale for your health is that amount of smoke you truly live in a privileged place. Radon from your house will have a larger impact.


Still not the point, though. One is the byproduct of a society with an overwhelming reliance on fossil fuels and the other is an intentional assault meant to mess with riders and which could possibly cause bodily harm, even without the extra inhalants.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

Oxtox said:


> you seem sadly oblivious . . . [snip]
> it's a cold, cruel world out there...you might want to save some energy for truly important issues.


Sorry you feel that way.  

I rode hills this morning with friends. Traffic was light, motorists were polite. THAT is the near-sum-total of my daily experience on a bike. And I appreciate the 95% of motorists who share the road with cyclists, politely. My and my friends' job is to share that responsibility in kind, even as we do what we can to make our own rides safer and therefore more enjoyable. Thanks.


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## Winn (Feb 15, 2013)

Just a thought it is a tiny bit possible that what happens on some of these assaults is that the truck slows to pass the cyclists then after he is mostly past he steps on the accelerator and poof cloud of smoke. No harm meant just the way older diesel trucks work. I'm sure sometimes its intentional and malicious but quite often its just the way things work.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

Winn said:


> Just a thought it is a tiny bit possible that what happens on some of these assaults is that the truck slows to pass the cyclists then after he is mostly past he steps on the accelerator and poof cloud of smoke. No harm meant just the way older diesel trucks work. I'm sure sometimes its intentional and malicious but quite often its just the way things work.


If that's the case, then you are absolutely correct. Look, I know nothing about "rolling coal" other than what I have read in this thread, and the general sentiment seems to be that it is purposeful, malicious, and meant as some ******* practical joke since (if I understand this correctly) people are putting intentional mods on their trucks in order to do this.

So, yeah, if some Gomer is driving a truck that is just barely road worthy and blows smoke at cyclists accidentally, then I would agree with you.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

scottma said:


> Had some other ******* idiot in a truck yell out the window "Hey Boy! Dont you know what side of the road to ride on?!" No idea what he meant by that. Just a dumb ******* so who cares.


He was probably a salmon fisherman.


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Duane Behrens said:


> How can I miss you if you won't go away?
> 
> EDIT: Sorry, that was rude and condescending. Apologies if I offended you, but I in turn found your one word answer to my post - "Nope" - to be much the same. Perhaps I misunderstood.
> 
> We're all doing the best we can out there. Cowboys pressing the accelerator on diesel engines, cars crowding us, ramming us from behind while adjusting their iTunes playlists . . . we're all forced to put up with it often. I won't stop riding because of it and I would never suggest that anyone do that. I DO think there should be a limit beyond which, upon which, we should begin to push back. If you don't agree, that's fine. But I'd like to know why you feel that way. Thanks.


Because life is too short to get worked up over some random guy on the road. It is also too short to bet worked up over some random guy on the internet. Who cares? I will bet that you could have forgotten about your brush with cancer and enjoyed your ride if you wanted to. Who cares? Let it go. I have had run ins with motorists, tractors, ********, lawnmower jockeys in rusty chevys ect... My life is too short to give a **** about them. They only effect me for a second, they have to live with their dumbass selves their whole life. They wasted 8 years in high school just to become a loser with a truck. Who cares? I sure as hell dont, I am out doing for me and my family. I am riding my bike, soon to be home with my family. They are still losers. 
Move on.


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## skitorski (Dec 4, 2012)

I am grateful the mods let this work itself out. Too often in my opinion they worry about testy ness and rudeness. _He wasn't nice._ It's part of life. We all ride, we get rolled and coaled at some point. I fear puncture vine more than any smoke, on the road or on the web.


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

ChiroVette said:


> Look, I know nothing about "rolling coal" other than what I have read in this thread.... .


nice to know in the future for other topics.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

-------------------


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

den bakker said:


> nice to know in the future for other topics.


Give it a break. His honesty trumps your cynicism. Hands down.


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## Duane Behrens (Nov 8, 2013)

den bakker said:


> given my lungs cannot distinguish under which circumstances the particles were emitted it is the same from a health point of view. If what tips the scale for your health is that amount of smoke you truly live in a privileged place. Radon from your house will have a larger impact.


Reading all these anonymous quotes of yours, I can't help but begin to believe you drive a diesel truck , , , with a special switch. You certainly seem to condone the practice. What'd you say your name was?


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

Duane Behrens said:


> Reading all these anonymous quotes of yours, I can't help but begin to believe you drive a diesel truck , , , with a special switch. You certainly seem to condone the practice. What'd you say your name was?


So the man signs his posts with what looks like a real name, just as you do, and you call him out on it, all but calling him a liar.

You just lost more credibility with me.


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## Perzuki (Apr 9, 2014)

Duane Behrens said:


> Reading all these anonymous quotes of yours, I can't help but begin to believe you drive a diesel truck , , , with a special switch. You certainly seem to condone the practice. What'd you say your name was?


These guys hiding out behind an anonymous, made up persona creep me out. By using your real name your posts have a greater value. It doesn't matter how stupid they are. 


Perzuki



By the way Duane, quit pretending to be me.


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

Duane Behrens said:


> Give it a break. His honesty trumps your cynicism. Hands down.


Thanks!



Perzuki said:


> These guys hiding out behind an anonymous, made up persona creep me out. By using your real name your posts have a greater value. It doesn't matter how stupid they are.
> 
> 
> Perzuki
> ...


One forum I frequent is a musician's forum and they insist on you posting with a first and last name because they believe that when people aren't hiding behind a nickname, posts tend to be friendlier and more civil.


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## MercRidnMike (Dec 19, 2006)

ChiroVette said:


> But if you don't think that it is potentially dangerous to bellow a noxious cloud of black smoke into a cyclists face, potentially (albeit temporarily) robbing said cyclist of his ability to see his or her surroundings, then I have to respectfully disagree. ... I am sure there are some lazy cops that might blow you off, but not all cops would take such a lazy attitude toward an arguably toxic and potentially dangerous "assault," though I put the word in quotes because no cop would charge said motorist with assault.


No "arguably toxic" about it...the WHO has classified diesel exhaust as carcinogenic. Although the exposure is relatively mild, this douche is still intentionally exposing folks to a known carcinogen.

I doubt much would happen other than a polite visit from a cycling sympathetic cop...but if they have a record of it, at least when the douche causes a crash or runs someone off the road next time, there is a record of past events of this type....having a documented history will make it a little harder for a court to pooh-pooh it in the future.


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## den bakker (Nov 13, 2004)

velodog said:


> So the man signs his posts with what looks like a real name, just as you do, and you call him out on it, all but calling him a liar.
> 
> You just lost more credibility with me.


It's a play on a previous professional cyclist name, not my own.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

den bakker said:


> It's a play on a previous professional cyclist name, not my own.


I'll be, I didn't realize that. 

If I'm not being nosey, what led you to choose that moniker, something he did special, or didn't do?


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

velodog said:


> So the man signs his posts with what looks like a real name, just as you do, and you call him out on it, all but calling him a liar.
> 
> You just lost more credibility with me.





den bakker said:


> It's a play on a previous professional cyclist name, not my own.


Well, I guess I owe Duane Behrens an apology. 

Excuse me.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Perzuki said:


> These guys hiding out behind an anonymous, made up persona creep me out. By using your real name your posts have a greater value. It doesn't matter how stupid they are.
> 
> 
> Perzuki
> ...


PBL450 IS my real name.


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## OldZaskar (Jul 1, 2009)

Let's end on a happy note... a video of a coal roller coming apart on a dyno. That's probably $20,000 up in smoke: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpQ6XcNZjFk


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

PBL450 said:


> PBL450 IS my real name.


:thumbsup:

Best post in thread!


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## saf-t (Sep 24, 2008)

ewitz said:


> Do you actually believe all this BS?
> 
> No one was visully disoriented. The police have better things to do especially when no one even had to even had to alter their line to avoid the incident.
> 
> ...


Diesel exhaust is a carcinogen. How would you feel about riding along and having someone driving past dump a bucket of asbestos fibers over you? No immediate adverse health effects, so no foul?


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## Winn (Feb 15, 2013)

saf-t said:


> Diesel exhaust is a carcinogen. How would you feel about riding along and having someone driving past dump a bucket of asbestos fibers over you? No immediate adverse health effects, so no foul?


Not quite equivalent levels of danger there and beyond that every one who passes you is dumping a similar "bucket" (the actual amount is far less than a teaspoon but call it what you want) of toxins you just cant see them.



PBL450 said:


> PBL450 IS my real name.


What is the proper pronunciation of that, is it Dutch?


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## ChiroVette (Jun 7, 2014)

Winn said:


> Not quite equivalent levels of danger there and beyond that every one who passes you is dumping a similar "bucket" (the actual amount is far less than a teaspoon but call it what you want) of toxins you just cant see them.


Fair enough.

But you don't think that the person who intentionally hits a button or pulls a lever on his modded truck in order to dump a dozen times the normal dose of exhaust in your face is guilty of some form of traffic infraction, even if there is no direct law against rolling coal? Not to mention the possible loss of vision and the potential for catastrophic results from potholes, other bikes, and cars rendered virtually invisible for a moment or two?

There are laws in place in most municipalities that cover things like malicious mischief.


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## JFR (Apr 18, 2003)

Winn said:


> ...every one who passes you is dumping a similar "bucket" (the actual amount is far less than a teaspoon but call it what you want) of toxins you just cant see them.


The thing is, that black cloud is not the same as other cars passing. It's far more condensed and caustic. Rolling coal is not just adding a benign color to the exhaust.

Continuing the analogy above, one might say the other cars do represent a teaspoon of asbestos thrown into the wind at me, while the rolling coal vehicle is dumping a bucket of it. I may choose to expose myself to the teaspoons diluted in the air around me when a smog certified vehicle passes me or even getting nailed by a soda, but not the bucket bath of rolling coal which could have long term affects if inhaled deeply into ones lungs.


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## spdntrxi (Jul 25, 2013)

Oops..


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## Winn (Feb 15, 2013)

JFR said:


> The thing is, that black cloud is not the same as other cars passing. It's far more condensed and caustic. Rolling coal is not just adding a benign color to the exhaust.
> 
> Continuing the analogy above, one might say the other cars do represent a teaspoon of asbestos thrown into the wind at me, while the rolling coal vehicle is dumping a bucket of it. I may choose to expose myself to the teaspoons diluted in the air around me when a smog certified vehicle passes me or even getting nailed by a soda, but not the bucket bath of rolling coal which could have long term affects if inhaled deeply into ones lungs.


I don't think you understand how dangerous asbestos is. Everyone exposed to asbestos the way you say will develop cancer, everyone. Everyone is exposed to diesel exhaust but yet not everyone gets cancer. Do you see how the too aren't equal? I haven't seen any studies showing that the black soot caused by the excessively rich mixture caused by a full depression of the accelerator pedal is more dangerous than the nearly invisible exhaust of a semi traveling at 60 mph have you? If so can you provide a link? I reiterate, when you accelerate briskly with most diesel trucks black smoke is produced. No malicious intent is required for this to happen, no switch is pressed, or lever pulled, it is just how these vehicles work. Do some people use this effect for evil? Maybe, can we know for certain what people are thinking? Are we really so petty we would conspire to slander someone with out knowing their intent?


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## BacDoc (Aug 1, 2011)

Winn said:


> I don't think you understand how dangerous asbestos is. Everyone exposed to asbestos the way you say will develop cancer, everyone. Everyone is exposed to diesel exhaust but yet not everyone gets cancer. Do you see how the too aren't equal? I haven't seen any studies showing that the black soot caused by the excessively rich mixture caused by a full depression of the accelerator pedal is more dangerous than the nearly invisible exhaust of a semi traveling at 60 mph have you? If so can you provide a link? I reiterate, when you accelerate briskly with most diesel trucks black smoke is produced. No malicious intent is required for this to happen, no switch is pressed, or lever pulled, it is just how these vehicles work. Do some people use this effect for evil? Maybe, can we know for certain what people are thinking? Are we really so petty we would conspire to slander someone with out knowing their intent?


Coal miners lung. Both petrochemical soot and asbestos are carcinogenic and both have history of cancer caused by exposure. Which is worse? getting punched in the face by Mike Tyson once or 10 times by Purito? 

OK forget that last analogy


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## tihsepa (Nov 27, 2008)

Listen, every diesel truck, big or little built since 2007 was sold with a DPF. If is was removed, and it probably was the truck will smoke on acceleration. With a functioning system the black soot is at near zero levels. 
With a SCR system in place (2010 and newer) even the CO and NOX emissions are near zero. 
A EPA13 engine is cleaner yet due to a reduction is ammonia emissions caused by overdosing the Urea during the SCR process. A new diesel is cleaner than a new gasoline car. 
If it is not, it has been modified and that is illegal. 

http://cumminsengines.com/uploads/docs/4971351.pdf
This is for the 2007 YM engines.


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## JFR (Apr 18, 2003)

Winn said:


> I don't think you understand how dangerous asbestos is. Everyone exposed to asbestos the way you say will develop cancer, everyone. Everyone is exposed to diesel exhaust but yet not everyone gets cancer. Do you see how the too aren't equal? I haven't seen any studies showing that the black soot caused by the excessively rich mixture caused by a full depression of the accelerator pedal is more dangerous than the nearly invisible exhaust of a semi traveling at 60 mph have you? If so can you provide a link? I reiterate, when you accelerate briskly with most diesel trucks black smoke is produced. No malicious intent is required for this to happen, no switch is pressed, or lever pulled, it is just how these vehicles work. Do some people use this effect for evil? Maybe, can we know for certain what people are thinking? Are we really so petty we would conspire to slander someone with out knowing their intent?


C'mon now, we're talking about a known modification that people are doing to purposefully produce vast amounts of noxious exhaust. Most modern diesels do not bellow black smoke like this under normal acceleration, not even brisk acceleration. Floored at low RPM, maybe. But it's doubtful to be a coincidence when that happens at the exact moment of passing a cyclist. "Petty" "Conspire" "Slander" _Whatever_

You want to nit pick the analogy also. Fair enough.

But I'm not combing the internet for scientific stats on the exposure levels of diesel exhaust (or even more accurately, the exhaust produced by a rolling coal modification) to prove the ratio of exposure to health risk.

The fact remains the black cloud produced by rolling coal is not something that any sane person would want to take a deep hit off of, including you I'm sure. I do not need tested proof to understand there is more crap in that black cloud than what a smog certified vehicle produces and there is surely a greater health risk associated with deeply breathing it in. Maybe it's just a health "risk" and not a guarantee like asbestos. Either way, it is unacceptable to have some jackass smoke us out and expose us to a health risk, for his and his buddies hateful entertainment. 

Prove to me there is no health risk.


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## Dan333sp (Aug 17, 2010)

I'm late to the party here, but have any of you guys ever dealt with the train horns on pickups? The whole smoking thing is annoying and not good for your lungs, but I've had at least a couple pickups sneak up behind me on 2 lane roads, pull out to pass, and give me the full on air horn blast that sounds as if they stole it from the CSX stockyard. That, to me, is more dangerous than smoke because it's incredibly startling. The first time it happened I actually went offroad into a ditch and lost my grip on the bars, but somehow managed to end back on the pavement without going down. I had to stop for a few minutes to regain my composure, though. Total d!ck move.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

Dan333sp said:


> I'm late to the party here, but have any of you guys ever dealt with the train horns on pickups? The whole smoking thing is annoying and not good for your lungs, but I've had at least a couple pickups sneak up behind me on 2 lane roads, pull out to pass, and give me the full on air horn blast that sounds as if they stole it from the CSX stockyard. That, to me, is more dangerous than smoke because it's incredibly startling. The first time it happened I actually went offroad into a ditch and lost my grip on the bars, but somehow managed to end back on the pavement without going down. I had to stop for a few minutes to regain my composure, though. Total d!ck move.


The guy that does this deserves to be dragged out of his vehicle and harshly dealt with.


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## Winn (Feb 15, 2013)

JFR said:


> C'mon now, we're talking about a known modification that people are doing to purposefully produce vast amounts of noxious exhaust. Most modern diesels do not bellow black smoke like this under normal acceleration, not even brisk acceleration. Floored at low RPM, maybe. But it's doubtful to be a coincidence when that happens at the exact moment of passing a cyclist. "Petty" "Conspire" "Slander" _Whatever_
> 
> You want to nit pick the analogy also. Fair enough.
> 
> ...


I'm not saying there is no health risk just that it isn't the same as asbestos. The truck in the video looks like an older pick-up and actually could be a pre-07. I am just saying he may or may not have done this on purpose, that's all. No one does a $1000 mod on their truck just to piss off cyclists, if it is modded it wasn't with the intention of rolling coal on the skinny guys. People in previous pages were planning on calling 911 and saying they almost died because of the "assault" I'm saying that's ridiculous, that's all. Anyway sucking exhaust sucks no matter what the flavor and in a perfect world everyone would bike every where they go. I would like to officially welcome everyone to this one, reality here sucks and black smoke pours from many pipes.

If someone actually finds some one stupid enough to play the asbestos fairy, sprinkling the stuff willy nilly on unsuspecting folks I want to know about it. That would be a fight worth fighting.

Oh and I surrender, you win


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## BikeRVA (Jul 24, 2014)

Winn said:


> Oh and I surrender, you win


No, you Winn. I BikeRVA.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

Winn said:


> What is the proper pronunciation of that, is it Dutch?


Hahaha! Swedish. I was born before they illegalized numerical names.


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## PBL450 (Apr 12, 2014)

BikeRVA said:


> No, you Winn. I BikeRVA.


Hahaha! 

Young Frankenstein ( junior ) - Werewolf! ...There! - YouTube


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## bmwjoe (Jul 15, 2012)

I had a guy Roll Coal on me today during a pleasure ride. What an annoyance. Good thing the Diesel is low sulfur now. The smell was minimal. Riding throught he black cloud was no fun.

Ride Safe,

Joe


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

I'm amazed that no one has mentioned asthma. Many cyclists (including me) suffer from asthma, and it so happens that diesel exhaust (or the irritant chemicals in it) are one of the major triggers for my asthma attacks. So, at least in my case, someone "rolling coal" is directly, and immediately threatening me and endangering my life. Not a whole lot different from someone coming up behind me and putting a plastic bag over my head. Would you call 911 for that?


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## Oxtox (Aug 16, 2006)

OldChipper said:


> I'm amazed that no one has mentioned asthma. Many cyclists (including me) suffer from asthma, and it so happens that diesel exhaust (or the irritant chemicals in it) are one of the major triggers for my asthma attacks. So, at least in my case, someone "rolling coal" is directly, and immediately threatening me and endangering my life. Not a whole lot different from someone coming up behind me and putting a plastic bag over my head. Would you call 911 for that?


nope, I wouldn't.

I'm asthmatic...I don't call 911 when I have an episode, regardless of what prompts it. the most common trigger is inhaling cigarette smoke, I can imagine the response I'd get for phoning that in...

I just hit the rescue inhaler and carry on.

don't get me wrong, I'd like to shoot douchebags that roll coal in the face, but I don't involve 911 over their juvenile antics.


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## OldChipper (May 15, 2011)

I was referring to someone putting a plastic bag over your head, and I suspect you would call 911 for that. 

Please distinguish the elements of intent and physical harm between the two cases (rolling coal and plastic bag). 

Seems to me that both fit the legal definition of assault and perhaps even battery (no physical contact but neither does shooting someone with a gun require physical contact and that qualifies as battery).


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## Z'mer (Oct 28, 2013)

This same thing happened to me last summer. Southeast of Saratoga lake in NY. 
It was a group of 5 trucks, and the 2nd one turned on the smoke as it passed me. 
Really p!ssed me off, like WTF did I do to deserve that? The first truck had a bunch of folks, including KIDS, pointing at me and laughing as it passed. Huh? Do I have a big hole in my shorts? Then came the smoke. 
Dumbest thing was the 3 trucks behind also had to endure the black diesel fumes.
I had no idea what this was about, then did some net poking around, and read articles like this http://www.newsweek.com/coal-roller-257884
and this
Conservatives Purposely Making Cars Spew Black Smoke - Business Insider
It was quickly apparent someone thinks I'm an environmentalist, or liberal, because I ride a bike. And this is their way of "giving the finger" because of that assumption. Or they are just getting some amusement at our expense. 
And as you may expect, doing this mod is both illegal for the mechanics and the trucks owners. Also, it can greatly shorten the life of that expensive diesel engine - see post 4 here - most the truck guys on the ford truck forum think it's a dumb idea too 
how to roll coal - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums
Yep, the people doing it are pretty much lacking any brains. Wasting expensive diesel fuel, risking tickets and fines, and shortening the life of the engine.


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## SauronHimself (Nov 21, 2012)

Z'mer said:


> This same thing happened to me last summer. Southeast of Saratoga lake in NY.
> It was a group of 5 trucks, and the 2nd one turned on the smoke as it passed me.
> Really p!ssed me off, like WTF did I do to deserve that? The first truck had a bunch of folks, including KIDS, pointing at me and laughing as it passed. Huh? Do I have a big hole in my shorts? Then came the smoke.
> Dumbest thing was the 3 trucks behind also had to endure the black diesel fumes.


Did you try reporting them to the Saratoga County Sheriff's Office? Those guys are normally good about things like that.


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## ssdirt29 (Sep 29, 2014)

It's pretty common here in Arizona. Tea-Billies in their jacked up pieces of shiit buzzing by as close as they can and accelerating away. Too dumb to form a thought so they rail against society with their trucks. I usually just wave and laugh.


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## ewitz (Sep 11, 2002)

A bus passed me yesterday.

Does that count?


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## jlandry (Jan 12, 2007)

ewitz said:


> A bus passed me yesterday.
> 
> Does that count?


Did they wave?


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## bmwjoe (Jul 15, 2012)

Its funny, all city buses have the exhaust up by the roof. The exhaust is generally out of the way and not a problem. On the other hand, school buses have the exhaust exit about 3' up on the right rear. This is almost perfectly aimed at our face.


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## Z'mer (Oct 28, 2013)

SauronHimself said:


> Did you try reporting them to the Saratoga County Sheriff's Office? Those guys are normally good about things like that.


No, as I had no plate, or even vehicle make/model. And also, don't really want to be on record for having reported an incident *like that*. Not 100% convinced that data won't somehow get into the hands of some of these nuts. Staying completely anonymous on a bike has some advantages.


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## Tschai (Jun 19, 2003)

ssdirt29 said:


> It's pretty common here in Arizona. Tea-Billies in their jacked up pieces of shiit buzzing by as close as they can and accelerating away. Too dumb to form a thought so they rail against society with their trucks. I usually just wave and laugh.


I'm in Phoenix. It's not a city. It's the biggest Tea-Billy-*******-Jacked-Up-Pickup-Doofus-Gun-Carrying-In-Grocery-Store-Yahoo town in the world.


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## ssdirt29 (Sep 29, 2014)

Tschai said:


> I'm in Phoenix. It's not a city. It's the biggest Tea-Billy-*******-Jacked-Up-Pickup-Doofus-Gun-Carrying-In-Grocery-Store-Yahoo town in the world.


You know it well I see : )


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## 41ants (Jul 24, 2007)

This is common place down in the dirty south. Some of it is accidental and other times is much more obvious that it was very intentional. At least the driver didn't roll past you at WOT. The surprising thing is that I can't believe that the pass had more than 3' of room. I need to double check that video and then I will take a look outside for pigs in the air.


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## thalo (Jul 17, 2011)

Tschai said:


> I'm in Phoenix. It's not a city. It's the biggest Tea-Billy-*******-Jacked-Up-Pickup-Doofus-Gun-Carrying-In-Grocery-Store-Yahoo town in the world.


and this is a bad thing? lol


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