# DT Swiss RR1450 vs Fulcrum Racing 3



## Guest (Sep 10, 2008)

Has anyone ridden both wheels? I had an opportunity to ride the DT's, and I believe they have the best combination of ride quality, stiffness and light weight that I have ever experienced (however limited). I will not have the chance to ride the Fulcrum 3's, but they appear to be the best value in that line.


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## Rubber Lizard (May 10, 2007)

Here is why the DT swiss wheels are far superior to anything in the Fulcrum line- ease of service and repair. 
The Fulcrums use proprietary spokes, rims and nipples. You will break a spoke and if you ride enough eventually you'll need a new rim. These are very spendy items and could be hard to locate 5 years down the line. 
The DT 1450 is essentially a handbuilt wheel with a 1.1 rim and 240's hubs. If anything breaks any semi-competent bike shop, or yourself can easily reapair the wheel. You might have to wait a week or two to get a Fulcrum spoke which will cost around $20 for the steel spoke, $50ish for an aluminum spoke. 
The Fulcrum isn't any stiffer, more aerodynamic or whatever other marketing hoobajoo than a good set of traditional wheels such as the DT 1450.


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## wankski (Jul 24, 2005)

i'm not convinced.... anyone know??? the fulcrum/campy spokes look like a conventional staight pull spoke (flat)end.... anyone tried using a dt aero spoke to replace a broken spoke?? i think it could work...


of course there is little expereince w/ this b/c i know 3 guys now w/ these wheels and they have yet to experience breakage.. give it time i guess

that said... if weight is of concern, the dt is closest to the mark, i will be around 1.5kg.... don't believe the advertised weights of the other.... I measured a campy zonda.... 1695g, advertised 1610g... given the f r3 is advertised at 1635g, i can only expect it exceeds the 1.7kg mark...

not that i care a huge amount re: 100g, but i was surely dissappointed...


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## wankski (Jul 24, 2005)

Rubber Lizard said:


> The Fulcrum isn't any stiffer, more aerodynamic or whatever other marketing hoobajoo than a good set of traditional wheels such as the DT 1450.


that's where we differ my friend...

it actually has tested stiffer (the zonda/eurus) than traditional wheels.... in fact the rear g3 is one of the stiffest alu production wheels going....

as for aero, the 26mm rim, and 16 bladed spokes has produced one of the lowest Cd on the test.... in fact, it tested better than an ambrosio x-carbo w/ 28 spokes despite its 46mm rim.


now whether or not one could tell on the road is another story...

http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-15505311.html


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## shimano4 (Aug 21, 2008)

I can assure u RR1450 is way more superior than Fulcrum racing 3. It climb faster, accelerate better with very smooth hub to ensure high cruising speed. I try my friend one and its fantastic and I wish I could own one but way out of my budget. 

Look at RR1450 road wheel review. 5 out of 5 rating from 10 reviews.

No joke, its a superior wheel. I own a XC DT swiss wheelset and I go faster than my peer due to this unfair advantage that I have. Wonderful!


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## Wheel Right (Jun 5, 2008)

Handbuilt wheels using traditional lacing are not only lighter than the Campy/Fulcrum wheels at any given price point, but they are more repairable, more durable, and have a lower cost to maintain over time. 

I am not a big fan of DT Swiss 240s hubs or Aerolite spokes, so I do not like their prebuilt wheels. I have no experience with their rims. DT round spokes seem to be just fine. I would use a hub with a Ti freewheel carrier instead of the aluminum free hub body on the 240s for durability reasons. The good news is that if the DT free hub wears out, it is very easily replaced by any shop.

Point is that nice handbuilt wheels designed for your weight and riding style are much less expensive, more durable, and more serviceable over time. Find a good shop that loves to build good wheels and let them walk you through the process of building up a set of wheels that is perfectly suited for you.


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## wankski (Jul 24, 2005)

shimano4 said:


> I can assure u RR1450 is way more superior than Fulcrum racing 3. It climb faster, accelerate better with very smooth hub to ensure high cruising speed. I try my friend one and its fantastic and I wish I could own one but way out of my budget.
> 
> Look at RR1450 road wheel review. 5 out of 5 rating from 10 reviews.
> !


right... well, its great u love them so much - but do try to be critical... i can only guess u haven't ridden the r3s... the loose-ball record hub is hardly rubbish...

that, and the 1450 build exists on 1.1 rims, single eyelet... wanna talk about reviews? check out how many cracked 1.1 rims there are.... u hardly ever hear this of campy pre-builts...

that said, there is scarely anything wrong with the 1450... For my money tho, i'd build it with dt comp ds and revo everything else, prolly 32 double eyelet in the rear, 28 front... should be around 1550g actual... much lighter than the R3 in the real world...


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## shimano4 (Aug 21, 2008)

wankski said:


> right... well, its great u love them so much - but do try to be critical... i can only guess u haven't ridden the r3s... the loose-ball record hub is hardly rubbish...
> 
> that, and the 1450 build exists on 1.1 rims, single eyelet... wanna talk about reviews? check out how many cracked 1.1 rims there are.... u hardly ever hear this of campy pre-builts...
> 
> that said, there is scarely anything wrong with the 1450... For my money tho, i'd build it with dt comp ds and revo everything else, prolly 32 double eyelet in the rear, 28 front... should be around 1550g actual... much lighter than the R3 in the real world...


Crack rims? Actually I don't know how they do their road riding that can causes so much damage to rim(usually road riding is not that harsh).

My friend never complain to me abt any crack after some 3000miles riding.


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## Rubber Lizard (May 10, 2007)

The DT rim eyelet issue was fixed over two years ago. It's a non issue.


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## wankski (Jul 24, 2005)

it was 'fixed' by going to a double eyelet model... @ 460g.... the single eyelet model (which remains in the DT1450 build) is around 425g real weight... so the issue is still present with dt prebuilts.


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## shimano4 (Aug 21, 2008)

wankski said:


> it was 'fixed' by going to a double eyelet model... @ 460g.... the single eyelet model (which remains in the DT1450 build) is around 425g real weight... so the issue is still present with dt prebuilts.


Maybe I am a perfomance type seeker. I look at what kind of performance a wheelset can gives me. Regarding durability, I am not so fussy as I always do road riding. Seriously, road riding will not do much harm on wheelset. Unless u are talking abt some cheap china wheelset.

I have not see a single review regarding RR1450 performance not up to standard by the user. Anyone who ride on it knows what it is capable of.

Besides, the crack issue? What is so bad abt R1450 wheelset.


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## Rubber Lizard (May 10, 2007)

As I said, the issue was addressed over 2 years ago. Yes, there is a double eyelet version available for the super fatties that need double eyelets, but the single eyelet version also got revised and has been pretty much problem free.


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## thedips (Mar 26, 2007)

Rubber Lizard said:


> Here is why the DT swiss wheels are far superior to anything in the Fulcrum line- ease of service and repair.
> The Fulcrums use proprietary spokes, rims and nipples. You will break a spoke and if you ride enough eventually you'll need a new rim. These are very spendy items and could be hard to locate 5 years down the line.
> The DT 1450 is essentially a handbuilt wheel with a 1.1 rim and 240's hubs. If anything breaks any semi-competent bike shop, or yourself can easily reapair the wheel. You might have to wait a week or two to get a Fulcrum spoke which will cost around $20 for the steel spoke, $50ish for an aluminum spoke.
> The Fulcrum isn't any stiffer, more aerodynamic or whatever other marketing hoobajoo than a good set of traditional wheels such as the DT 1450.


hahhaha hooobajoo... i love it.. ok.. well pretty much everything you said about the fulcrums is true.. as i do have that and other campy wheels... and as well as custom builts.... cheapos... shimano.... zippp.. etc.... 

if you dont have an extra set of wheels... then get the dts... they would make good al arounds.. kinda boring to look at imho.. but they get the job done...and thats why the fulcrums have the proprietary parts etc... to separate it from the pack.. i feel that the differences may have some performance advantages but not very much..... call me a sucker for all things shiny flashy and carbony...but the fulcrums are a blast to ride... they feel good.. spin up fast ...and actually fulcrums feel very stiff underneath... not flexy at all..


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## shimano4 (Aug 21, 2008)

thedips said:


> hahhaha hooobajoo... i love it.. ok.. well pretty much everything you said about the fulcrums is true.. as i do have that and other campy wheels... and as well as custom builts.... cheapos... shimano.... zippp.. etc....
> 
> if you dont have an extra set of wheels... then get the dts... they would make good al arounds.. kinda boring to look at imho.. but they get the job done...and thats why the fulcrums have the proprietary parts etc... to separate it from the pack.. i feel that the differences may have some performance advantages but not very much..... call me a sucker for all things shiny flashy and carbony...but the fulcrums are a blast to ride... they feel good.. spin up fast ...and actually fulcrums feel very stiff underneath... not flexy at all..


Nice looking red fulcrum racing zero. Kind of matching my bike but too bad it cost a bomb.


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## thedips (Mar 26, 2007)

thanks... i loved it too at first for the hey look at me.. but now i think its just a little too much HAYYYY IM OVER HERE LOOK AT ME... but i do love the red spokes.... i think the new black rim/red spoke color looks way better.... a black hoop takes the flashiness down a few notches... yea for its weight and price its expensive... thats why i got them when they were over 50% off... then i couldnt really pass them up...


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## awiner (Aug 28, 2007)

Rubber Lizard You might have to wait a week or two to get a Fulcrum spoke which will cost around $20 for the steel spoke said:


> I bought a replacement Fulcrum Zero aluminum spoke for $12.00 when I needed one (from internet retailer Airbomb). Granted it took about 3 weeks to get.


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## thedips (Mar 26, 2007)

not bad ive been quoted $20 on the spoke and $175 for a replacement freewheel


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## Rubber Lizard (May 10, 2007)

I probably overestimated the spoke cost, but it's still outrageous prices for a spoke, especially the aluminum ones. 
For drop dead badda-bling-boom sexy wow factor the Fulcrum racing zero is pretty hard to beat. Oddly enough the problem with those red wheels is that your bike has to coordinate color wise. 
I still stick with my original assertion that the DTs 1450 are better than the Racing 3.


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## rmsmith (Feb 15, 2007)

I always have my DT Swiss wheelsets custom built mainly because I don't like radial lacing, which exerts tension stress on the hubs in the worst possible direction. For me it's 2x front, and 3x rear; too many wheelsets use radial lacing simply for "looks" rather than proven engineering. I also prefer a fully-sealed high quality bearing assembly, not a covered ball bearing. Sure, you can find even lighter wheels than the (dt-240s / rr-1.1), but not in the $600-$700 range, and they won't be as durable.


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## wankski (Jul 24, 2005)

shimano4 said:


> Besides, the crack issue? What is so bad abt R1450 wheelset.


oh, absolutely nothing - In fact i'm a fan of those as far as traditional build-ups go. I'm just suggesting that one should take all options on its merits instead of an extreme position and discounting the data...

everything that rubber lizard said is true of most custom wheel options, rims and spokes are generally easier and cheaper to replace; but as for 'performance' - the 1.1 rim is not aero, and probably has too many spokes on the front wheel. Also, the 425g rim on those narrow hubs (rear) is not going to be as stiff as the fulcrum/campy design.... - the other problem with the build is that it has only 28 light-guage spokes on the rear, which may not be enough for some powerful/heavy riders. 

Please also see my post earlier with a fact-based test. The g3 or 2:1 lacing, stiff rims and higher tensions on a wider hub produces a wheel stiffer and more aero than anything else aluminium on the test...

That may mean very little to you, as it mostly does to me; but to dismiss them as marketing with no substance is a little premature... Also the price is right - compare the cost of R3s to the build up cost of all DT parts....

sure to some, rebuildability is key - as the dips said - especially if you will have only one set - but that is the criterion for a good wheel for just some of the buying public out there...

performance wise, the campy/fulcrum design runs on record-class loose ball bearings compared to cartirdge - it is also most aero in class, and stiffest in class.... a 28h traditional shallow rim build doesn't compete with that.... on paper at least.


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## sneakyracer (Dec 1, 2007)

I just got a set of Fulcrum 3 wheels for my Cannondale Synapse. Yesterday I put them on and went for a quick 20k ride. WOW. Granted. I had Shimano wheels before but the difference was just insane. did not expect it to be so significant. The ride was noticeably smoother no question also the wheels accelerate faster and roll/hold speed much easier. Also the steering was more precise, definately a touch sharper. The wheels transformed the bike.


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## jadis3 (Apr 14, 2008)

There are two type of DT RR1450: normal with aerolite spokes and Mon Chasseral with revolution spokes. DT intends the second set as a comfortable touring wheelset. Mon Chasseral shows one of the worst stiffnes into that test. Aerolite spokes are more strong, are they not?
I have RR1450 set with aerolites. It carries double eyelets on the rear rim. As I know, mon Chasseral carries both single eyelets rim.


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## Wheel Right (Jun 5, 2008)

jadis3 said:


> There are two type of DT RR1450: normal with aerolite spokes and Mon Chasseral with revolution spokes. DT intends the second set as a comfortable touring wheelset. Mon Chasseral shows one of the worst stiffnes into that test. Aerolite spokes are more strong, are they not?
> I have RR1450 set with aerolites. It carries double eyelets on the rear rim. As I know, mon Chasseral carries both single eyelets rim.


If you are pleased with your wheels great. To answer your question about Aerolites, no in my experience they are not any stronger than the revolution spokes. It may be that you are confusing the Sapim processes and aero spokes versus round DT spokes, and not Aerolite processes versus DT round spokes. It is the case that Sapim CX Rays are "stronger" than their round counterparts of the same weight due to Sapim finishing techniques that DT does not do with the Aerolites. Aerolites tend to "go plastic" at much lower tensions than the CX Rays. Eyelets are just a manufacturing convention to hide the spoke hole punch out from view, instead of doing a cleanly drilled (more expensive) hole in the rim. "double eyelets" do not actually add strength to the rim like you might think, because the variance in eyelets versus distance between rim surfaces is too great. Double eyelets simply make it quicker and easier to lace a wheel without losing a nipple down into the hollow of the rim. Think about it, if eyelets or double eyelets were structurally significant, we would see them in carbon rims . . . we don't . . . that's because they are just production line artifacts and have nothing to do with performance other than the psychological lift "marketing hype" might give. Given the fact that eyeleted rims have larger holes in the aluminum structure of the rim, it is no wonder that eyeleted rims are less stiff than drilled rims like Velocity. 

By combining low spoke count, a flexy aluminum axle, flexy spokes, and a flexy rim, it is no wonder that you end up with a wheel that scores in the most flexy of all wheels, despite the fact that it may be masterfully hand crafted. 

If you want a truly great set of wheels, go to a wheel builder who really knows their stuff, and have them build you a custom set of wheels to fit your riding style, weight, road conditions, etc. You will be very pleased and satisfied.


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