# Colnago Super Restoration - need gruppo and way ahead



## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

I posted this in general as well, trying here too thanks:

OK I have a late 80's (early 90's?) 56cm Colnago Super that was originally built up with Shimano 600 Ultegra groupo, I bought it when it was 1 year old from a friend (he bought it new), so I know what it originally came with. Original Bottom Bracket spindle date codes to 1990 October, date codes "OJ". Shimano 600 BB 6400 are the spindle markings .

I have put 40,000 miles on this bike in about 14 years, stopped riding it about 5 years ago, all components have been worn out at least once, it is a combination of 105 and 600 components now, as parts became harder to find, (headset, BB, hubs , chainrings). Originally came with Shimano Biopace chainrings! Indexed downtube shifters, uniglide 7 speed cassette. Decals and paint are simply wearing away. I wish now I babied it a bit, but I rode it 30 miles a day for commuting to work, it took a beating but still is a wonderful ride. Time to restore.

What is the way ahead?

I want to repaint/redecal bike to be as orig (red, with chrome curved fork). Paint is worn thru in several places. This should be Fairly straightforward, there is a Colnago dealer in town who I think can help with that. Or any recommendations on a source to do this appreciated. I live in Ottawa, Ontario Canada, but have a sister in Colorado, I guess i could ship it somewhere.

My issue is components, I want to put new period-correct components back on, where do i find a complete groupo? Should I stick with Shimano as per orig build, or go to Campy, and if so which level? I know nothing about campy.

Any opinions, advice appreciated, i will try and post a few picks of the well-used beauty.

Thankyou for any advice,
Stephen


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## Reynolds531 (Nov 8, 2002)

supercolnago said:


> I posted this in general as well, trying here too thanks:
> 
> OK I have a late 80's (early 90's?) 56cm Colnago Super ....Originally came with Shimano Biopace chainrings!


Oh the humanity! This is an abomination! Please put a Campy groupo on this bike!

Are you willng to spend several hundred on a paint job and decals? There are several people who specialize in restoration of classic bikes, but they aren't cheap. If you search the retro-classic forum, several threads will come up where the various bike painters are discusssed.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Paint and Gruppo*



Reynolds531 said:


> Oh the humanity! This is an abomination! Please put a Campy groupo on this bike!
> 
> Are you willng to spend several hundred on a paint job and decals? There are several people who specialize in restoration of classic bikes, but they aren't cheap. If you search the retro-classic forum, several threads will come up where the various bike painters are discusssed.



I guess I am willing to take the plunge and get a good paint job with proper decals, seems like the right thing to do because I have ridden it so much I want to 'respect it' by making look the way it should/was. I will check the forums as you suggest. I would like to get away with 500 bucks incl decals if possible.

I agree, I always felt strange with Shimano on the Colnago, so Campy it is. Question is, what would be an appropriate Campy level to put on?

Thanks for the feedback/advice 531!


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## Mapei (Feb 3, 2004)

Shimano is fine on a Colnago. For many years, the Colnagos raced in the Tour de France featured more Shimano gruppos than Campy gruppos. 

And this coming from a Campy guy...


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

Mapei said:


> Shimano is fine on a Colnago. For many years, the Colnagos raced in the Tour de France featured more Shimano gruppos than Campy gruppos.
> 
> And this coming from a Campy guy...



+1...I agree.....Plenty of Colnago's around running Shimano.......

If it were a 70's frame, I'd agree with Campy but by the late 80's, it could be argued that Shimano is equally appropriate..

and BTW, there is an eBay seller from Australia that sells a ton of replacement frame decals..His name escapes me right now but if you search for "Colonago decals", he will show up.
I've bought from him a couple of times and he provided a great product and good service too...


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## Reynolds531 (Nov 8, 2002)

Dave Hickey said:


> +1...I agree.....Plenty of Colnago's around running Shimano.......
> 
> If it were a 70's frame, I'd agree with Campy but by the late 80's, it could be argued that Shimano is equally appropriate..
> 
> ...


Cyclomondo is the decal supplier. I just ordered some for my Gitane TdF.

I was being tongue-in-cheek about Shimano. But bipoace chainrings on a Colnago is going to far.


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## OperaLover (Jan 20, 2002)

*Go retro modern!*

Since you are getting new paint get the rear spread to 130mm and put an alloy Cenatur 11 speed group on it with Open Pros, a new Rolls saddle ,keep the original stem, new Nitto silver bar and post . It will look awesome! All shiny and new and ready to rock in the 21st century. 

my $.02!


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Colnago Biopace*



Reynolds531 said:


> Cyclomondo is the decal supplier. I just ordered some for my Gitane TdF.
> 
> I was being tongue-in-cheek about Shimano. But bipoace chainrings on a Colnago is going to far.


Yes a week after bought the bike I replaced the biopace rings I agree.

Retro modern is a thought too, although I kind of like the downtube shifters as I am used to them. Afraid to try the fancy stuff in case I like it. 

Interesting comments about the Shimano on late 80's/90s Colnagos, the shop the bike came from built a lot of them that way in 1990 as I recall.

So whether Campy or Shimano, do I have to piece a gruppo together from ebay, or are there any sources for complete gruppos 'off the shelf' NOS.?

Thanks very much for all your comments, very useful !

Steve:thumbsup:


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*decal guy*



Dave Hickey said:


> +1...I agree.....Plenty of Colnago's around running Shimano.......
> 
> If it were a 70's frame, I'd agree with Campy but by the late 80's, it could be argued that Shimano is equally appropriate..
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice makes me feel better about shimano, and I'll check the decal guy out.

Stephen


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## blakcloud (Apr 13, 2006)

Since you live in Ottawa you could try two places that are closer to you to have the bike painted. I worked at Pecco's for many years and at the time we sent all the repaints to Marinoni. At one point he would only paint his own frames but maybe now he does repaints. You could talk to to Greg Christie in Chelsea as I think he still deals with Marinoni. I had my Brodie repainted by him and it was good. 

The second place you could look at is Velo Colour here in Toronto. He was Mike Barry's painter (Mariposa Frames) but now is on his own.

It would be cheaper at least to ship the bike within Canada than off to the States and then have to worry about customs etc. 

The nicest paint job that I have ever saw was a restoration paint job on a Mercier and it was done by CycleArt. I have yet to see a paint job that even came close to this one. 

So those are a few choices that you can look at.


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## MShaw (Jun 7, 2003)

Another option if you wanna be different is Superbe Pro. Not too many guys seem to sing that gruppo's praises around here. :nah I happen to really like it!

My dream Colnago is a Master Olympic with Superbe Pro in the Blue Decor paint job. Very pretty.

M


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

Dave Hickey said:


> +1...I agree.....Plenty of Colnago's around running Shimano.......
> 
> If it were a 70's frame, I'd agree with Campy but by the late 80's, it could be argued that Shimano is equally appropriate..
> 
> ...


Gotta go with Hickey here. In the late '80's our club had De Rosa's, Colnago's, Ciocc's, Bottecchia's, and even my Battaglin with DuraAce 7400. Campy had been resting on their laurels with Nuovo and Super Record and then flubbed it completely with the first generation of Synchro.

Ditto for Cyclomondo from the land of Oz.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

blakcloud said:


> Since you live in Ottawa you could try two places that are closer to you to have the bike painted. I worked at Pecco's for many years and at the time we sent all the repaints to Marinoni. At one point he would only paint his own frames but maybe now he does repaints. You could talk to to Greg Christie in Chelsea as I think he still deals with Marinoni. I had my Brodie repainted by him and it was good.
> 
> The second place you could look at is Velo Colour here in Toronto. He was Mike Barry's painter (Mariposa Frames) but now is on his own.
> 
> ...


Hey blakcloud, thanks for the outstanding advice, I want to Gregchristies yesterday, I'm going to bring the bike in for him to have a look. Great local advice. If he is going to use Marinoni I think that would be ok, but I will also contact velocolour for comparison. Gregchristies did not want to deal with colnago decals though, I was surprised as I was hoping as a Colnago dealer he could get them. Will keep you posted.:thumbsup: 

Still looking for a gruppo too, anyone who has one let me know thanks!

"better people thru bikes"
Stephen


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## blakcloud (Apr 13, 2006)

SuperColnago,

When I had Marinoni paint my Brodie, he used paint instead of decals and this to me was far superior to applying decals then applying clear coat. It looked top notch and I would never go decals again on a repaint. It saved the hassle of finding and buying the decals for me, but for you there will not be as big a problem because you can find Colnago decals on the Internet.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

blakcloud said:


> SuperColnago,
> 
> When I had Marinoni paint my Brodie, he used paint instead of decals and this to me was far superior to applying decals then applying clear coat. It looked top notch and I would never go decals again on a repaint. It saved the hassle of finding and buying the decals for me, but for you there will not be as big a problem because you can find Colnago decals on the Internet.


Thks bcloud, I'm going to see about decals a bit first, taking the bike to GregChristies this week for an estimate and to find out where he gets them painted, will report back.

supercolnago:thumbsup:


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## 1974Mariposa (Feb 3, 2009)

*Try Velocolour*



supercolnago said:


> Thks bcloud, I'm going to see about decals a bit first, taking the bike to GregChristies this week for an estimate and to find out where he gets them painted, will report back.
> 
> supercolnago:thumbsup:


Talk to Noah at Velocolour...he has access to all the original decals, paint numbers and has the equipment and skill to restore any bike to original specs. He's doing an early 1950s Cinelli Paris-Roubaix for Mike Barry right now (see it at Velocipede Salon).
He did my mid-seventies Mariposa and it's spectacular.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Looks Like Velocolour*



1974Mariposa said:


> Talk to Noah at Velocolour...he has access to all the original decals, paint numbers and has the equipment and skill to restore any bike to original specs. He's doing an early 1950s Cinelli Paris-Roubaix for Mike Barry right now (see it at Velocipede Salon).
> He did my mid-seventies Mariposa and it's spectacular.


Thanks Mariposa and Blackcloud.

Seems most local Ottawa shops basically use Marinoni (Peccos, Christies), the problem is they will lay a decent paint job but they basically stick your frame in the Marinoni paint assembly line, not agreat choice in colors, you basically get 'red' when they are spraying red...

So it looks like Velocolour, I've left a message or two, we keep missing each other. Will probably deliver my bike frame down there in a week or so. Peccos here in Ottawa had a look and suggested just redecal for now, and spot the paint, as it is not too bad. I'm leaning that way before a total repaint, so i will bring to Velocolour and get his opinion. Have been speaking with cyclomondo, the ebay aussie who can supply decals very close to mine if Velocolour can't.

Thanks again, I'll tell Velocolour that I was sent by you guys.

Klunker
Stephen:thumbsup:


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Velocolour - WOW !!!*

Hi Mariposa and Blackcloud

Just wanted to tell you I took your advice, went to Velocolour on Saturday, drove my frame up to see Noah there. WOW ! What a great place, brought my wife, even she was impressed at such a great old-school place that pays great respect to craftsmanship and service.

Spent a good 2 hours there going over every detail for my frame repaint. One of the most enjoyable days of my life!

Finally decided to go non-original colour, changing from the saronni red or whatever that Colnago metallic red is .

Turnaround time is 7-8 weeks, which is ok for me, I NEED PARTS!

I am looking to build this repainted mid-80s Colnago Super up with Ultegra or Dura-Ace Gruppo NOS or mint. I have half of each right now so I could go either way.
Would really like Dura Ace 7400 series (early 90s) Front rear derailleurs and downtube indexed shifters, and 8sp hyperglide cassette, if anyone has some stuff to sell let me know.

Thanks again guys, outstanding advice, to anyone else don't waste your time, go to Velocolour for your repaints.

Stephen:thumbsup: 








supercolnago said:


> Thanks Mariposa and Blackcloud.
> 
> Seems most local Ottawa shops basically use Marinoni (Peccos, Christies), the problem is they will lay a decent paint job but they basically stick your frame in the Marinoni paint assembly line, not agreat choice in colors, you basically get 'red' when they are spraying red...
> 
> ...


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Colnago Super Resto Update - Single or Dual Pivot Brakes?*

OK the Colnago Super frame is at Velocolour in Toronto being painted by Noah Rosen, (he just won "Best Paint" at the 2009 NA Hand Made Bike Show ! Highly recommend!)

I have almost everything for an 8sp Dura Ace Gruppo, all NOS. I have NOS hubs/rims, cassette 8sp, crankarms, BB, headset, rear derailleur, chain.

Still need:
NOS 42 and 52 DA or SG chainrings
Complete Dura Ace 7402 or 7403 Brakeset, (Levers and Calipers), NOS.
740_ Dura Ace Front Derailleur NOS


I have a line on a 7402 (single pivot) NOS, or a 7403 (dual pivot) NOS, both Dura Ace. Dual Pivot is $50 bucks more.


My question is, can anyone recommend or provide any actual experience of single vs dual pivot Dura Ace brakesets? I'm leaning towards the Dual Pivot, but don't really know the difference in performance or maintenance. I rode 600 Ultegra single pivot brakes on this bike for 14 years/40k miles, seemed ok, no problems but never outstanding performance, (especially when wet), to me.

Also anyone who has anything I still need let me know thankyou!

Great forum, I have had some great help here many thanks!

Steve:thumbsup: 





supercolnago said:


> Hi Mariposa and Blackcloud
> 
> Just wanted to tell you I took your advice, went to Velocolour on Saturday, drove my frame up to see Noah there. WOW ! What a great place, brought my wife, even she was impressed at such a great old-school place that pays great respect to craftsmanship and service.
> 
> ...


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## moschika (Feb 1, 2004)

supercolnago said:


> OK the Colnago Super frame is at Velocolour in Toronto being painted by Noah Rosen, (he just won "Best Paint" at the 2009 NA Hand Made Bike Show ! Highly recommend!)
> 
> I have almost everything for an 8sp Dura Ace Gruppo, all NOS. I have NOS hubs/rims, cassette 8sp, crankarms, BB, headset, rear derailleur, chain.
> 
> ...


you'll have to post pics when you get the frame back. i'm about to send noah my waterford cross bike for a respray. i'm totally excited to get it done by him after seeing some of the pics from the NAHBS. i just need to take my frame to the post office - hope it doesn't cost too much to send from the states. =/


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Yah I will send pics - due back Mid - April 09*

Yes I will post pics, you are not making a mistake by sending it to him. I drove 5 hours, and would drive double just to see the place, it is amazing, about 30+ VINTAGE masterpieces, Rene Herse, Mariposas, Olma, Cinelli, Bianchi, Colnago etc....just wild.

Noah is just an outstanding guy, spent about 90 minutes with us going over colors, etc. Very patient, polite, professional but friendly +++ Makes you feel special to leave your frame in his hands. TOTALLY attentive to every detail.

I started off going for a stock repaint, and in the end I/we decided to get creative and do something a little different....which is totally not me but I decided to have the bike a little different than the orig saronni red in the end. More of a conversation piece.

Will upload some pics from the shop visit as well.

thanks

Stephen





moschika said:


> you'll have to post pics when you get the frame back. i'm about to send noah my waterford cross bike for a respray. i'm totally excited to get it done by him after seeing some of the pics from the NAHBS. i just need to take my frame to the post office - hope it doesn't cost too much to send from the states. =/


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## buck-50 (Sep 20, 2005)

supercolnago said:


> My question is, can anyone recommend or provide any actual experience of single vs dual pivot Dura Ace brakesets? I'm leaning towards the Dual Pivot, but don't really know the difference in performance or maintenance. I rode 600 Ultegra single pivot brakes on this bike for 14 years/40k miles, seemed ok, no problems but never outstanding performance, (especially when wet), to me.
> 
> Also anyone who has anything I still need let me know thankyou!
> 
> ...


I've got single pivot DA on my serotta. The work great and they've got clearance for 28s, which isn't a bad thing. Personally, I think the single pivots look better, and if they'll stop my bulk, they should work for anyone. I've never used them and thought "man, I could use some more brake right about now..."


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

buck-50 said:


> I've got single pivot DA on my serotta. The work great and they've got clearance for 28s, which isn't a bad thing. Personally, I think the single pivots look better, and if they'll stop my bulk, they should work for anyone. I've never used them and thought "man, I could use some more brake right about now..."


Thanks, the single pivots are what i am used to as well, I never really had any complaints in ove 40,000 miles.

Leaning to singles at this moment, but expensive as NOS!

Stephen


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Colnago Super Resto Update - Single or Double Pivot Brakes?*

Just to bump up I still need these parts, and any advice on whether to go Dura Ace Single or Double Pivot Brake setup, I have found both NOS just have to decide:

Colnago Super Resto Update - Single or Dual Pivot Brakes? 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OK the Colnago Super frame is at Velocolour in Toronto being painted by Noah Rosen, (he just won "Best Paint" at the 2009 NA Hand Made Bike Show ! Highly recommend!)

I have almost everything for an 8sp Dura Ace Gruppo, all NOS. I have NOS hubs/rims, cassette 8sp, crankarms, BB, headset, rear derailleur, chain.

Still need:
NOS 42 and 52 DA or SG chainrings
Complete Dura Ace 7402 or 7403 Brakeset, (Levers and Calipers), NOS.
740_ Dura Ace Front Derailleur NOS


I have a line on a 7402 (single pivot) NOS, or a 7403 (dual pivot) NOS, both Dura Ace. Dual Pivot is $50 bucks more.


My question is, can anyone recommend or provide any actual experience of single vs dual pivot Dura Ace brakesets? I'm leaning towards the Dual Pivot, but don't really know the difference in performance or maintenance. I rode 600 Ultegra single pivot brakes on this bike for 14 years/40k miles, seemed ok, no problems but never outstanding performance, (especially when wet), to me.

Also anyone who has anything I still need let me know thankyou!

Great forum, I have had some great help here many thanks!














supercolnago said:


> Thanks, the single pivots are what i am used to as well, I never really had any complaints in ove 40,000 miles.
> 
> Leaning to singles at this moment, but expensive as NOS!
> 
> Stephen


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## BikeRider (Aug 5, 2003)

> Just to bump up I still need these parts, and any advice on whether to go Dura Ace Single or Double Pivot Brake setup, I have found both NOS just have to decide:


I haven't used Shimano brakes but I have both single pivot Campy brakes from the late 80's and newer dual pivot Campy brakes as well. The dual pivot brakes work better than the older single pivot ones, although the single pivot brakes aren't bad just not as good as the double's.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Thanks for Double pivot experience*

Thanks very much BikeRider, I just took the plunge on the double pivots, they were $45 more than single pivots in the end, so over my lifetime I have left it should work out to 1 dollar per year! (I'm 48!). Thats one way to justify it!

Thanks again for your advice, it helped with the decision

SuperColnago:thumbsup: 






BikeRider said:


> I haven't used Shimano brakes but I have both single pivot Campy brakes from the late 80's and newer dual pivot Campy brakes as well. The dual pivot brakes work better than the older single pivot ones, although the single pivot brakes aren't bad just not as good as the double's.


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## stelvio1925 (Oct 29, 2008)

Keep us posted. I can feel the anticipation as well. Hope your having fun with the project. Don't forget the pics when she's done.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Colnago Super Resto ...FINISHED!*



stelvio1925 said:


> Keep us posted. I can feel the anticipation as well. Hope your having fun with the project. Don't forget the pics when she's done.


OK I'm done, here it is! :thumbsup: 

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?p=2430276#post2430276


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Colnago Super Rest Finished!*

Forgot to add, many thanks for all your help via this forum, it got me going in the right direction.

Took me 18 mos to get the gruppo together via ebay and local foraging.

For example, Chelsea Bikes in New York City had the 7403 NOS Dura Ace brake calipers sitting on a shelf, I just happened to be there on a visit and checked out the local bike shops....

Many thanks again, trying to muster the courage to ride it again, my local Bike Shop is begging me not to ride it before they take some pics!

It was fun, a little expensive, but there is now even more emotional investment than just $. I highly recommend.

Cheers


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

Boy that build looks fabulous completed. Sorry I missed it until now, but I've been busy...

Would you be willing to divulge what that paint job cost?--it is absolutely amazing...


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## blakcloud (Apr 13, 2006)

SuperColnago,

I am up in your neck of the woods today, my brother has a house in the Gatineau's and I wish I had my bike to ride the parkway. But I have to say your bike looks fantastic, glad you chose VeloColour to paint your bike. If I ever get my Marinoni painted, Noah will be the one to do it. 

My question to you is, did you keep the original chrome or was it re done?


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## stelvio1925 (Oct 29, 2008)

Very nicely done supercolnago! I understood the anticipation since you 1st posted your plans this spring and now the extreme satisfaction of owning a beautiful bicycle. Now we need a ride report so get cracking and get the miles in. Though I see you left the Record headset.(j/k)


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Original Chrome*



blakcloud said:


> SuperColnago,
> 
> I am up in your neck of the woods today, my brother has a house in the Gatineau's and I wish I had my bike to ride the parkway. But I have to say your bike looks fantastic, glad you chose VeloColour to paint your bike. If I ever get my Marinoni painted, Noah will be the one to do it.
> 
> My question to you is, did you keep the original chrome or was it re done?


After much debate, the original chromed forks were painted, the fork crown and chainstay chrome is original. Noah said the chrome on the forks was passable but would look out of place once the new paint was done. It was cheaper to paint than rechrome the forks so I went for that.


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Record Headset*



stelvio1925 said:


> Very nicely done supercolnago! I understood the anticipation since you 1st posted your plans this spring and now the extreme satisfaction of owning a beautiful bicycle. Now we need a ride report so get cracking and get the miles in. Though I see you left the Record headset.(j/k)


I had trouble finding a Dura Ace Headset NOS, and so I opted for a Record headset instead. Seeing as the orig seatpost is campy I thought it would be ok.

The ride is JUST as I remembered it, smooth as silk! Snappy shifts with the downtube shifters, I don't know any difference as I have never ridden ergo shifters for any length of time!

Cheers


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## supercolnago (Jun 11, 2008)

*Waterford Painted?*



supercolnago said:


> Yes I will post pics, you are not making a mistake by sending it to him. I drove 5 hours, and would drive double just to see the place, it is amazing, about 30+ VINTAGE masterpieces, Rene Herse, Mariposas, Olma, Cinelli, Bianchi, Colnago etc....just wild.
> 
> Noah is just an outstanding guy, spent about 90 minutes with us going over colors, etc. Very patient, polite, professional but friendly +++ Makes you feel special to leave your frame in his hands. TOTALLY attentive to every detail.
> 
> ...


How did your Waterford turn out, my pics are up on this post now.


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