# Was Phil Ligget serious?



## gonzaleziam (May 14, 2007)

Was he serious when he said that the sprinters can be catopaulted to 60 mph in the final sprint? He said it in yesterday's commentary during the stage.


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## Pwnt (Aug 24, 2006)

I think he meant KPM. Just a guess though.


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## stainofmind (Jul 28, 2006)

Maybe he meant kilometers.


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## ElvisMerckx (Oct 11, 2002)

gonzaleziam said:


> Was he serious when he said that the sprinters can be catopaulted to 60 mph in the final sprint? He said it in yesterday's commentary during the stage.


I heard that too. Phil does make a lot of mistakes these days, but I'm fairly certain Paul said it, not Phil. A few minutes later (after Phil shut his mouth), Paul said 60kph with a slightly stressed intonation, so he probably caught himself the first time.


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## gizzard (Oct 5, 2005)

It was actually Paul Sherwin who said that and you should know by now that he gets quite carried away to the point of incoherence when the racing hots up.


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## gizzard (Oct 5, 2005)

Paul's also quite erudite at times; he's pretty adept at mixing his metaphors, which can colour what otherwise might be somewhat dull commentary.


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## gonzaleziam (May 14, 2007)

Thanks for the clarification guys.


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## bas (Jul 30, 2004)

gonzaleziam said:


> Was he serious when he said that the sprinters can be catopaulted to 60 mph in the final sprint? He said it in yesterday's commentary during the stage.



Eurosport said the sprint today was nearly 80 kph.


80 kph = 49.7096954 mph


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## Barry Muzzin (Sep 18, 2006)

And slightly uphill!:eek6:


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## zeytin (May 15, 2004)

Yup, I heard Phil or Paul say a 50mph sprint.


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## weltyed (Feb 6, 2004)

i once did a 50mph uphill sprint.

in my car.


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## Guest (Jul 12, 2007)

Man, that's freaking fast on a bike - and insane considering they were pedalling (yeah, I know, IL Falco can beat that on the downhill...).


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## JohnnyTooBad (Apr 5, 2004)

bas said:


> Eurosport said the sprint today was nearly 80 kph.
> 
> 
> 80 kph = 49.7096954 mph


If Eurosport said it, then it must be true?

What is *nearly* 80kph? Is 60kph *nearly* 80? I doubt that even these guys are hitting 50 mph on a finish sprint after 100 miles of riding. They don't hit 50mph on the finish sprint in Paris. Much less on a slight uphill. Maybe 40 or low 40s on flats.

I'm not saying it's impossible, I'd just like to see some sort of confirmation of the speeds. I'm always curious about that anyway


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## Cannon Ball (Dec 29, 2005)

Do the math. What's the rpm of a 53x12 at 50mph. No way that's happening.


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## atpjunkie (Mar 23, 2002)

*Pro Keirin racers*

hit 50 plus all the time


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## harlond (May 30, 2005)

JohnnyTooBad said:


> If Eurosport said it, then it must be true?
> 
> What is *nearly* 80kph? Is 60kph *nearly* 80? I doubt that even these guys are hitting 50 mph on a finish sprint after 100 miles of riding. They don't hit 50mph on the finish sprint in Paris. Much less on a slight uphill. Maybe 40 or low 40s on flats.
> 
> I'm not saying it's impossible, I'd just like to see some sort of confirmation of the speeds. I'm always curious about that anyway


Actually they said 78.3 KPH--they were pretty exact. Does seem awfully swift. FWIW, Sheldon Brown's gear calculator shows 45.8 MPH for a 54/11, 700x20 tire, 175 crank, at 120 rpm.


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## bas (Jul 30, 2004)

Cannon Ball said:


> Do the math. What's the rpm of a 53x12 at 50mph. No way that's happening.



120 RPM, For 700 X 23 / 23-622 tire with 172.5 mm cranks 55x11	46.9 mph


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

Cannon Ball said:


> Do the math. What's the rpm of a 53x12 at 50mph. No way that's happening.


Cannon, I don't think the guys sprinting for stage wins in the tour are using 12 tooth cogs... FWIW...


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## Cannon Ball (Dec 29, 2005)

Kestreljr said:


> Cannon, I don't think the guys sprinting for stage wins in the tour are using 12 tooth cogs... FWIW...


On the flat stages true. Still with an 11 it would be tough. These guys don't use a 55 up front do they? I can see 46-47mph, but there is a big difference in that 3 mph at top end. More power to them if they are. I would want my tension as tight as possible as to not come flying out of my pedals.


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

Cannon Ball said:


> I can see 46-47mph, but there is a big difference in that 3 mph at top end. More power to them if they are. I would want my tension as tight as possible as to not come flying out of my pedals.


It looks like it was 48.5mph based on harlond/eurosport (I heard it reported too). You might want your tension as tight as possible, but if I was in a bunch sprint at the end of todays tour, I would want a change of pants waiting for me at the finish line. (As I would have crapped all over myself  )


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## Art853 (May 30, 2003)

Zabel's computer recorded almost 79 kph.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tour07/index.php?id=/photos/2007/tour07/tour075/fs005


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## zosocane (Aug 29, 2004)

Art853 said:


> Zabel's computer recorded almost 79 kph.
> 
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tour07/index.php?id=/photos/2007/tour07/tour075/fs005


That's 49 mph for 38-year-old Zabel. Damn. I group ride with local racers and we have a sprint finish, depending on wind we're hitting 34 mph to 36 mph in the sprint finish. Nowhere close to what the big boys in Europe clock. Then again, their trains are rolling into the 400 meters-to-go-mark so 'friggin fast -- maybe high 30s/low 40s or so that when these sprinters take off they cranking out another 5 mph to 10 mph in speed in the final 400 meters to get themselves across the line in the mid-40s/high-40s.


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## mrbull (Jun 14, 2005)

Boonen stated after one of the stages that he was in 53-11.


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## Vandizzy (Jul 11, 2007)

they are hiding motors in the new bigger bottom brackets!


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## rogger (Aug 19, 2005)

mrbull said:


> Boonen stated after one of the stages that he was in 53-11.


These guys are powerhouses, Tom Boonen has a max output of around 1,700 Watts and Steegmans tops even higher at 2,000.


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## JohnHenry (Aug 9, 2006)

*note:*

Mario Cipollinin once received a speeding ticket in Italy for 90kph while out training.

So, I believe it. Remember, they aren't holding 60 mph for 5 or 10 miles.


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## gizzard (Oct 5, 2005)

teh moreon said:


> Mario Cipollinin once received a speeding ticket in Italy for 90kph while out training.
> 
> So, I believe it. Remember, they aren't holding 60 mph for 5 or 10 miles.


No cyclist in the world rides 96 km/h (60 mph) on the flat with no slip stream. Not even for a second. I believe Mario was behind a scooter (derny) at the time, although even a derny doing 60mph is difficult to believe.


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## Guest (Jul 16, 2007)

What sort of cadance in 53x11 is that?!


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## DonDenver (May 30, 2007)

the_rydster said:


> What sort of cadance in 53x11 is that?!


Addressed earlier by some folks posting rpm/gear inch examples. Nevertheless; 120 plus with luck the components don’t stress fail just prior to your heart exploding with the added stress of 100 mile fatigue [compounded over x days] now entering a final battle at the line…certainly puts me in my place when I compare my max spin rate, power output and limited ability to hold it before I puke out on just a trainer. “Who are those guys?”

Regardless of skills and given genetics, I find it hard to imagine another sport that participants so greatly overwhelm my physical capacity.


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## harlond (May 30, 2005)

DonDenver said:


> Addressed earlier by some folks posting rpm/gear inch examples. Nevertheless; 120 plus with luck the components don’t stress fail just prior to your heart exploding with the added stress of 100 mile fatigue [compounded over x days] now entering a final battle at the line…certainly puts me in my place when I compare my max spin rate, power output and limited ability to hold it before I puke out on just a trainer. “Who are those guys?”
> 
> Regardless of skills and given genetics, I find it hard to imagine another sport that participants so greatly overwhelm my physical capacity.


Really? I can't imagine even surviving three plays in the NFL unless I was racing for the sideline before the play even started.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

stainofmind said:


> Maybe he meant kilometers.


Sherwen constantly drives me nuts by only referring to things in metric. Earth to Paul...you're commenting for the American audience here! We need the translation! When you say some riders is heavy at 80 kilos I have no idea what that is in pounds off the top of my head and I'm not gonna get my calculator out.


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

harlond said:


> Really? I can't imagine even surviving three plays in the NFL unless I was racing for the sideline before the play even started.


The NFL is a good example.

One hit from a professional boxer would knock out your average layperson. One hit from a heavy weight could _easily_ kill you.

I don't think your average Club Tennis player could return even one serve in an entire match from a player ranked in the men's top 25.


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## rogger (Aug 19, 2005)

the_rydster said:


> What sort of cadance in 53x11 is that?!


160ish. It would also require legs that can push out nearly 3,000 Watts.


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

rogger said:


> 160ish. It would also require legs that can push out nearly 3,000 Watts.


I could probably put out that kind of wattage- it would have to be a good day though.


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## mpk1996 (May 11, 2007)

ya, everyone keeps saying 120 on the rpm, but it more like 150-60. i know i like to be at 150 rpm, too bad i can't spin the 53/12 at that rpm (or i would be in france, not on the web). but those boys can.


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## spyro (Aug 3, 2004)

gizzard said:


> No cyclist in the world rides 96 km/h (60 mph) on the flat with no slip stream. Not even for a second. I believe Mario was behind a scooter (derny) at the time, although even a derny doing 60mph is difficult to believe.


It doesnt say if it was on the flat or not.(when he got his ticket) I could see someone going 60 downhill. I can do 50


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## JohnnyTooBad (Apr 5, 2004)

back on topic.....well, the topic of Paul & Phil.

Have you noticed that Phil doesn't know the difference between a chain stay and seat sstay? I have heard, no less than 3-4 times, he refers to the yellow transponder being on the seat stay. Sorry Phil, that's a chain stay. Unless they have different terminology for bike parts across the pond.

Yeah, the metric thing annoys me too. This is VS. Home of 'Merkun bull ridin', huntin' and fishin'. I think, one year, he actually refered to someone's weight in Stone. WTF?!


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## Fredke (Dec 10, 2004)

Barry Muzzin said:


> And slightly uphill!:eek6:


In the small ring


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## fleck (Mar 25, 2005)

now correct me if i'm wrong but don't a lot of sprinters these days run a 54 up front?
Pretty sure they all have an 11t in the rear.

as for cadence... wish I trained with a monitor more but doing sprint excersizes (not after a race mind you) i'm sure my cadence was 125+ and i'm not a great spinner either.
I wouldn't fine it hard to beleive these guys can whip them over above 150.

now one thing to remember is no two sprinter is the same. Those that have the highest cadence in the sprint might not be using the same gear as the guy next to him. so one guy running 53-11 is turning them over a little slower then the guy with 54-12 but both going the same speed.


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## DonDenver (May 30, 2007)

Bocephus Jones II said:


> Sherwen constantly drives me nuts by only referring to things in metric. Earth to Paul...you're commenting for the American audience here!...


Something as simple as knowing your audience has had me wondering over the few years watching the tour on OLN err…VS; is anyone in charge? As frustrating as it is that I [US market] must watch the French control room wizard showing me the countryside I _must_ visit at the very moment an important chase is underway---is it to much to ask that I hear in non metric terms, just how many gallons of water that damn dam near Tignes holds. 

And while I’m thinking about it…I recall the camera work of last years tour showing more close shots of the riders bikes with such clarity that you could easily determine the specific f/r gear combination during a climb for example. It’s appearing to me the control room now prefers hoods up wide views spying a heart a rate monitor when the team jersey is open. Unfortunately, I find chainrings and cassettes responding to a tap and crank much sexier...but that's me


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## harlond (May 30, 2005)

Bocephus Jones II said:


> Sherwen constantly drives me nuts by only referring to things in metric. Earth to Paul...you're commenting for the American audience here! We need the translation! When you say some riders is heavy at 80 kilos I have no idea what that is in pounds off the top of my head and I'm not gonna get my calculator out.


Well, c'mon now, it's a European-based sport and you're plenty smart enough to translate the kms and the kgs. Paul and Phil are English, and thanks for that. Jeebus, man, you're wishing more Trautwig on us, and who would ever forgive you for that?


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## CaseLawZ28 (Jul 14, 2005)

I've heard Robbie say he can sprint 70-75 km/h.


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## 514Climber (Oct 19, 2005)

In his post-race interview (after he won the stage), Boonen mentioned that he was in 53x11. 

Robbie tends to use the 53 as far as I know.

I think for some courses, certain sprinters use 54 or possibly 55.

Regardless, I'm curious just how long and steep the uphill finish was.


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