# "I hope someone breaks a baseball bat over your head"



## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...e_voicemails_now_part_of_armstrong_probe.html

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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

This just might HELP Lance. This is the same girl in the recording with LeMond as far as I know. IF so, then she sounds loony....maybe now not the best "witness".

+1 for the LA defense.

So, she is Lance's "pal". Hmm....I thought that we were supposed to think that she was out to "get" Lance. Come on MEDIA....which one is it?


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## erj549 (Jul 26, 2008)

Also, if she eventually testifies truthfully, she'll be perjuring herself in the Texas case, which presumably further damages her credibility. It doesn't really matter, though, because Andreu's testimony will speak to the exact same event.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> This just might HELP Lance. This is the same girl in the recording with LeMond as far as I know. IF so, then she sounds loony....maybe now not the best "witness".
> 
> +1 for the LA defense.
> 
> So, she is Lance's "pal". Hmm....I thought that we were supposed to think that she was out to "get" Lance. Come on MEDIA....which one is it?


How is this going to help Lance? She's threatening Betsy Andreu because of the SCA trial where she lied.


What are you thinking about? Rumor has it she was involved with LA the same way Haven Hamilton was.

BTW, lance has no defense. The mountain of evidence is now an avalanche all around him. He ain't getting out of this.

http://www.exposay.com/stephanie-mc...Ackerman,+Jenny+McCarthy+and+Patrick+MCIlvain


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

What we have here folks, is a person caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

I would think any decent lawyer would advise her to fess up this time. I doubt they would revisit the SCA trial for perjury.


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## ArkRider (Jul 27, 2007)

I don't know if there is any truth to it, but I heard a story once that she was going to resign from Oakley in order to be able to devote more time to caring for her special needs son, but Lance used his influence to let her stay on the Oakley payroll with drastically reduced responsibilities -- serving only as a liaison between Lance and Oakley.

If true, that could be seen as Lance helping out a family in need (as was the angle from which I originally heard it) or alleged to be Lance trying to buy her silence.

Anyone know if there is anything to corroborate the truth of the story?


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## Alaska Mike (Sep 28, 2008)

Dwaynebarry said:


> What we have here folks, is a person caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place.


This, I agree with. Stephanie feels like her livelihood and the person directly responsible for it was being threatened. I wasn't in the room, and I have no idea if she was there to hear Lance admit he doped, so I have no idea if she's lying or not.

I'm not exactly sure what these recordings are supposed to prove. To me, it sounds more like a stupid drunk rant than an organized campaign of intimidation orchestrated by Lance. Betsy was flogging them like they were some sort of direct evidence that Lance was ruining her life or that Stephanie was admitting lying. I just don't see it.

As for Betsy, she pretty much summed up my opinion herself in this inteview:
_VN: What is your perspective on how this affected the LeMonds over the years?

BA: Well, it’s been tough. His bike company was destroyed and he is painted as a nutcase. Greg is ‘the nutjob’ and I am painted as a ‘fat, homely, jealous b*tch." The sad thing is that it was never questioned – it was the case of, ‘well, Lance said it, so…’ And so what if I’m fat, homely and *****y? Am I telling the truth? That’s what’s important. Not how fat or ugly I am. I’ll leave the b*tchy part alone. [laughs]​_FWIW, I think she's pretty cute, although her personality isn't my cup of tea. However, that's Frankie's cross to bear, not mine.

I think this case is about douchebags and their douchebag friends vs another set of douchebags. I see as much actual good coming out of it as a given episode of Jersey Shore.


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## Dwaynebarry (Mar 16, 2004)

ArkRider said:


> Anyone know if there is anything to corroborate the truth of the story?


Isn't she married to one of the top guys at Oakley? Seems like she wouldn't really need to keep working if she didn't want to, unless they have some sort of crazy expensive lifestyle.


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## MWT (Nov 12, 2002)

Is Stephanie McIlvain related or married to Jim McIlvain from Mountain Bike Action?


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## HikenBike (Apr 3, 2007)

Dwaynebarry said:


> Isn't she married to one of the top guys at Oakley? Seems like she wouldn't really need to keep working if she didn't want to, unless they have some sort of crazy expensive lifestyle.


In David Walsh's "From Lance to Landis" he says that she had a special needs (autism) child and Lance orchestrated a deal with Oakley that allowed her to work from home. After her SCA testimony the Andreu's suspected that Lance put the screws to Oakley to have her keep quiet. 

I haven't seen anything about her marital life circa 2005. 

If she was married to a big wig in Oakley, then how would that affect her decision to testify against one of their biggest athletes?

In either scenario, Lance would have had a lot of leverage over her, and we know LA's reputation for bullying.


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

blackjack said:


> How is this going to help Lance? She's threatening Betsy Andreu because of the SCA trial where she lied.
> 
> 
> What are you thinking about? Rumor has it she was involved with LA the same way Haven Hamilton was.
> ...


I agree. This part of the equation is a bit trivial at this point. I did listen to the LeMond/McIlvain telephone conversation where she clearly showed her distaste with Mr. LA. Now, we find that she was drunk and making threats as LA's "pal". She is no longer credible. Her testimony was going to be used against LA at one point I believe. Now, she just looks like a drunk fool who plays both sides. THIS is what I was referring to.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

Alaska Mike said:


> I think this case is about douchebags and their douchebag friends vs another set of douchebags. I see as much actual good coming out of it as a given episode of Jersey Shore.


Really? Who are the other set besides the people being accused?

This story came about because Walsh heard the rumor of the story and called Betsy to confirm it, which she did.

The hospital room incident was a big open secret before Walsh ever wrote about it.

James Startt from Bicycling Mag also testified at the SCA trial about McIlvain.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5508863


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## Alaska Mike (Sep 28, 2008)

Of course, this is just my opinion:
Lance = douchebag
Floyd = douchebag

...and anyone that's lining up on either side yelling "I told you so!" = douchebags

I'm sorry, no matter how this goes I can see no positive outcome.

I'm going to ride my bike.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

Alaska Mike said:


> Of course, this is just my opinion:
> Lance = douchebag
> Floyd = douchebag
> 
> ...


You know that it takes the truth a while to catch up with a lie.

Anyway, I'm glad you're so above it all.


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## Alaska Mike (Sep 28, 2008)

blackjack said:


> You know that it takes the truth a while to catch up with a lie.
> 
> Anyway, I'm glad you're so above it all.


Not above it, just _over it_.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

Alaska Mike said:


> Not above it, just _over it_.


Well, there are people who ARE affected by the fraud who are not over it.


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

blackjack said:


> Well, there are people who ARE affected by the fraud who are not over it.



Details?


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> Details?


If you're into the sport, you'd know who they are.

I'd start with the people who are dead because of the drug saturated condition of the sport and many sports in general.

You really need to look no further than all of the former E German athletes whose lives were irreparably damaged.

Marco Pantani who was a particpant and a victim in his own downfall.

VDB

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/oct/13/frank-vandenbroucke-death-cycling

In light of all that's gone on, remember LA's speech from the podium in 2005.

The cover up is always worse than the original crime. That's about to be proven correct again.


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

blackjack said:


> If you're into the sport, you'd know who they are.
> 
> I'd start with the people who are dead because of the drug saturated condition of the sport and many sports in general.
> 
> ...



Anyone on the podium is a doper IMO. They would all cover it up. That is the state of the sport. It sucks! Is he just supposed to admit doping after winning the TdF? Nobody would do that. There are guys who didn't even finish the TdF that were most likely doped to the gills even IMO.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> Anyone on the podium is a doper IMO. They would all cover it up. That is the state of the sport. It sucks! *Is he just supposed to admit doping after winning the TdF? Nobody would do that.* There are guys who didn't even finish the TdF that were most likely doped to the gills even IMO.


He was supposed to take his trophy, shake hands with Basso and Ullrich, and settle into a nice retirement, running his cancer charity.

Did that happen?

Has any TdF champion, prior to Armstrong, given a speech from the podium attacking the skeptics, feeling sorry for the non believers?

You ever watch golf? Ken Venturi, formerly of CBS, had a great quote about humility.

After escaping a tough hole with par, you "take your par, and go quietly."

Did Armstrong do this?

If he had, would he be in the hot water he finds himself in now?


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

blackjack said:


> He was supposed to take his trophy, shake hands with Basso and Ullrich, and settle into a nice retirement, running his cancer charity.
> 
> Did that happen?
> 
> ...


I guess that I would have to "peddle" a mile in his shoes to know. I am not going to analyze his motives. I doubt that he enjoys the possible dishonesty. Maybe this all just got out of hand too fast and he is stuck now. I am sure that the pressure is enormous considering his Livestrong fans. Not an excuse, but understandable reason perhaps..

If LA has been lying all along, then in no way should he get a free pass. I do feel like there are tons of pros that will slip under the radar who also doped, but have not been as successful as LA, and therefore not too many people will even care. Odd.


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## blackjack (Sep 7, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> I guess that I would have to "*peddle"* a mile in his shoes to know. I am not going to analyze his motives. I doubt that he enjoys the possible dishonesty. Maybe this all just got out of hand too fast and he is stuck now. I am sure that the pressure is enormous considering his Livestrong fans. Not an excuse, but understandable reason perhaps..
> 
> If LA has been lying all along, then in no way should he get a free pass. I do feel like there are tons of pros that will slip under the radar who also doped, but have not been as successful as LA, and therefore not too many people will even care. Odd.



The Fed's are very interested in what he's been "peddling" and they, like most informed observers have decided, enough is enough.

Armstrong should have gotten out when the getting was good. He's had many, many warnings and many close escapes.

He successfully silenced LeMond, Kimmage, Walsh, avoided all the fallout from his many cheating teammates, and athletes in other sports. There are allegations that he bribed UCI officials more than once to cover up positives. 

He taunts his accusers from the podium. I mean, how many lives do you want to give this guy?

Then he watches the 2008 Tour when it's widely suspected the Tour is cleaning up its act and decides that Sastre et al. are riding slowly and he can come back and dominate?

He sabotages the, consensus, best rider in the world,(who happens to be his teammate) every chance he gets. How much is too much?

Then to gild the lilly, he's a serial philanderer while he promotes his wholesome, All american image.


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## rydbyk (Feb 17, 2010)

blackjack said:


> The Fed's are very interested in what he's been "peddling" and they, like most informed observers have decided, enough is enough.
> 
> Armstrong should have gotten out when the getting was good. He's had many, many warnings and many close escapes.
> 
> ...



Yes. "Peddle". That was a joke. I am happy that you noticed This is a pointless debate at this point. This, I am sure of.


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## Doctor Falsetti (Sep 24, 2010)

rydbyk said:


> Anyone on the podium is a doper IMO. They would all cover it up. That is the state of the sport. It sucks! Is he just supposed to admit doping after winning the TdF? Nobody would do that. There are guys who didn't even finish the TdF that were most likely doped to the gills even IMO.



"Whoever still can't put one and one together about what happened in cycling is beyond my help." 
Jan Ullrich


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## worst_shot_ever (Jul 27, 2009)

That tape is ridiculous as evidence of anything. Plus, it's unlikely the tape would be admissible either as corroboration of the witness's current testimony, were she called in a trial to testify, or for the truth of the matter asserted, as the Rules of Evidence would preclude either. The best I could see is allowing her to hear them, but not the jury, to refresh her recollection if she can't remember what she said on the stand (assuming anything she said on the tapes were even considered relevant to any fact at issue, which I'm doubtful of as well).


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## ghost6 (Sep 4, 2009)

Contador is a doper.


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## Doctor Falsetti (Sep 24, 2010)

worst_shot_ever said:


> That tape is ridiculous as evidence of anything. Plus, it's unlikely the tape would be admissible either as corroboration of the witness's current testimony, were she called in a trial to testify, or for the truth of the matter asserted, as the Rules of Evidence would preclude either. The best I could see is allowing her to hear them, but not the jury, to refresh her recollection if she can't remember what she said on the stand (assuming anything she said on the tapes were even considered relevant to any fact at issue, which I'm doubtful of as well).


Yes, they can use them......and other tapes as well


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## Ventruck (Mar 9, 2009)

McIIvain said:


> I am on so much drug medication right now at this point for my nerves


Not to take that far out of context, but of all things to put out there...


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