# Dura Ace 7900 chain noise



## jtsk (Mar 6, 2002)

Apologies if this has been discussed. I searched but couldn't find anything.

I have DA7900 on a Madone with about 900 miles on it. I love everything about it except the chain noise. The chain seems to be unusually loud to the point where my fellow riders comment on how they can hear it over their own drive train. It's not clatter of the chain rubbing the FD or RD misalignment. I'm not a great wrench, but I've checked and fine tuned it to the best of my abilities to no avail.

I was just wondering if anybody else has experienced this? If so, have you found a way to quite it down?

Thanks


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## Uncle Grumpy (Jul 25, 2005)

Is it happening in all, most, or just a couple of gear combinations?

Put the bike in a workstand (or hang it up, or even (gasp!) flip it over and turn the cranks, watching for anywhere the chain might be rubbing on a rear gear, or just not meshing properly. Same with the jockey wheels on the rear derailleur.

Spin the wheel back so it freewheels, check if the cassette is wobbling violently.

With narrow chains and gaps between gears it doesn't take a lot of maladjustment to get a bit of noise.

Check for any bent or stiff links too.

Otherwise, wipe the chain over with a light solvent and relube. Or grab another chain just to try. That way you isolate whether it's the actual chain or something else at the root of the problem.

And now the mandatory stupid response: upgrade to 8 speed.

Good luck, keep us posted with your findings.

Grumps


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## neil0502 (Feb 11, 2005)

How's the shifting??


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## jtsk (Mar 6, 2002)

It shifts great! It's quick, responsive and accurate. My old bike was DA7700 9spd and the move up to DA7900 10spd was very significant. The only issue I have is the noise.

It does it in all gear combinations, but it's obviously worse on big-big gear combos....as it should be.

I'll take it to my LBS wrench and see if he can figure it out.

Thanks for the responses.


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## drewmcg (Sep 19, 2005)

Bent derailleur or hanger?


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## jtsk (Mar 6, 2002)

drewmcg said:


> Bent derailleur or hanger?



Nothing that my untrained eye can see.

The bike was new in March and has never been wrecked or even touched anything that could have caused it to be bent. The entire bike has been handled very gently since new.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

*Another thought.*

Wouldn't think this to be true of a Dura-Ace rear derailleur, but some of the lower-priced Shimano derailleurs come with rough-edged, noisy pulleys. After a few thousand miles, the chain will have chamfered these pulleys and the noise goes away, or at least diminishes a lot. Keep in mind that the large-large combination creates the most chain tension and thus, chain link pressure on the pulley teeth.


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## bdaghisallo1 (Sep 25, 2007)

When I first got my 7900 drivetrain I did perceive a noticeable increase in chain noise between that and the 7800 setup I was using. I have since reverted back to 7800 chains and cogs and they are definitely quieter, not to mention, much cheaper!


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## 007david (Dec 24, 2007)

Given that the 7900 chain is asymmetric could it be on backward? I haven't seen the chain in person to know how obvious that is.


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## jtsk (Mar 6, 2002)

007david said:


> Given that the 7900 chain is asymmetric could it be on backward? I haven't seen the chain in person to know how obvious that is.


(At the risk of waking the Trek haters and giving them an opportunity to shots at Trek)
If it's on backwards, it came that way from the Trek assembly plant. The chain has never been off the bike. They certainly could have made a mistake and I'll check it out but I think it's unlikely.

Since the bike was new at the beginning of March, I've cleaned and lubed the chain once using the Park chain cleaner tool. Other than riding the bike for a total of about 900 miles, the only other thing that's been done to it is cleaning the whole bike. But the noise has been there since it was new.


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## darkest_fugue (Mar 14, 2009)

im riding a 105 set up and have a similar problem except my chain is quiet in the small ring of my crank, shift up to the big ring though and it chatters away in any cog on the cassette, its not rubbing on the front mech and the shifting is good but it is a nuisance


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*New eyes*



jtsk said:


> I have DA7900 on a Madone with about 900 miles on it. I love everything about it except the chain noise. The chain seems to be unusually loud to the point where my fellow riders comment on how they can hear it over their own drive train.


Next time you go for a group ride, have one of those "noise aware" folks help you to diagnose the problem. Usually, people who notice and comment on such things have some skills they can bring to the party for problem solving.


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## neil0502 (Feb 11, 2005)

Kerry's is a good idea.

This is a perfect example of one that I'd like to see in video with clean audio.

OP? Can you put the bike on a stand and duplicate the problem? If so, in theory, you could get a really well lit, clean vid of the rear end of the drivetrain while you/somebody else pedals and runs it up and down the cogs.

If the audio's clear, too, somebody around here is bound to come up with something.

I THINK you can link to a YouTube vid here, right?


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## Teletori (Mar 6, 2009)

I had the same noise problem! checked everything... but to no avail. Changed over to KMC 10SL and now its silence!


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## pgk (Jun 30, 2008)

Teletori said:


> I had the same noise problem! checked everything... but to no avail. Changed over to KMC 10SL and now its silence!


Did you use a quick link "Missing Link" or pins?? Just wondering, as I purchased a 7900 group but have yet to install it. I noticed that Shimano did away with their quick link and went back to providing pins with the chains for this group..


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## Teletori (Mar 6, 2009)

Did use the missing link, but that was not the source for the noise since it was a constant rattling. Pin worked ok, but like the KMC quick link better.


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## cpark (Oct 13, 2004)

My 7900 set up is noisier than 7800 as well but after about 200 miles it has gotten better. It's only noisy on 39/23-25 combo. I put a 7800 cassette that has1500 miles on it and it was much quieter.
I'm guessing the noise will go away as the miles pile on......


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## thegreatdelcamo (Aug 20, 2008)

My 7900 is as silent as could be. Wonderful. And I love listening to the Di2 front make its little noise when it automatically trims!


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## drewmcg (Sep 19, 2005)

bdaghisallo1 said:


> When I first got my 7900 drivetrain I did perceive a noticeable increase in chain noise between that and the 7800 setup I was using. I have since reverted back to 7800 chains and cogs and they are definitely quieter, not to mention, much cheaper!


How well do 7800 chains & cogs work on an otherwise 7900 drivetrain?


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## Zebt (Jul 19, 2009)

*Same Problem!!*

Just got a new full carbon with 7900. Very noisy, set up seems good, all shifting is precise. But there is a constant noise, sounds like simply chain on cogs, also a very slight vibration at a high frequency which increases with cadence. Noise usually equals friction so I am not happy. I am old school and getting back into road after many years, always hated a noisy bike. So will try and figure this out. How do you check if the chain is the correct way around? Sorry if it's a stupid question.


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## simplyhankk (Jan 30, 2008)

I don't know, I slapped 7900 on my 7800 drivetrain and it really made riding a lot more fun-there's really minimal chain noise, and that's what they tried to do with the 7900 chain-reduce friction, weight and noise. The chain is asymmetrical, so make sure you put on the chain with the proper side facing out. The quick link shouldn't be a problem, I've had SRAM's link on it and it worked just fine. Putting on the chain with the wrong side would be the only thing I can think of regarding your noisy problem-let us know how it turns out.


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

Zebt said:


> How do you check if the chain is the correct way around?


Facing the driveside, you want to see the side plate markings.


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## mpcbike (May 12, 2009)

*7900 chains make noise*

I'm using a 7900 chain with RED cranks & 7800 cassette. The chain makes noise, especially in the 23-25. I've also installed a ton of 7900 chains in the past few months and noticed this same noise on most of the drivetrains(all 10 speed shimano/sram/ or a mix). Not sure why it's happening, but the shift quality is enough to make me overlook it as anoying as it is.


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## cpark (Oct 13, 2004)

My 7900 ran very quietly with 7800 cassette. I'm guessing the noise is due the new chain design. I'd like to try the 7800 chain with my 7900 but according to Shimano it's not compatible.

Has anyone try this set up?


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## Tonis_t (Jul 29, 2007)

of course it's compatible. If the pitch is the same as 7800 and width too, then it's compatible no matter what Shimano says


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## Zebt (Jul 19, 2009)

On closer inspection rotating the wheel very slowly the chain seems to move onto the tooth then move sideways slightly as if it is adjusting, this moves it very close the the lower cog. It looks like it is the shape of the teeth or angle of the whole cassette, not sure.


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## jtsk (Mar 6, 2002)

FOLLOW UP - Problem solved!! 

I found a new chain lube that took all the noise away. Chain-L ( http://www.chain-l.com/index.html ). After seeing my post, this guy emailed me and asked if I'd give this stuff a try, I did and now I'm a big-time believer. I don't know what he puts in this stuff, but it works. I was able to thoroughly enjoy a quiet ride for the first time on my Madone w/DA7900 since it was new in March! I know it was probably my imagination because I was enjoying the quiet so much, but I think I even felt less friction/resistance.

What a difference it makes when your bike isn't making noise all the freakin' time. Assuming chain wear will be at least as good as I've gotten before (and I have no reason to think that it won't)........I now have a new chain lube.

I didn't have to change cassettes, no new chain, no different brand of chain....I just had to use the right lube.


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## thegreatdelcamo (Aug 20, 2008)

Read the info on the Chain-L site and the guy makes sense. Ordered a bottle.


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## ChainReactionBicycles (Dec 31, 2010)

jtsk said:


> FOLLOW UP - Problem solved!!
> 
> I found a new chain lube that took all the noise away. Chain-L ( http://www.chain-l.com/index.html ). After seeing my post, this guy emailed me and asked if I'd give this stuff a try, I did and now I'm a big-time believer. I don't know what he puts in this stuff, but it works. I was able to thoroughly enjoy a quiet ride for the first time on my Madone w/DA7900 since it was new in March! I know it was probably my imagination because I was enjoying the quiet so much, but I think I even felt less friction/resistance.
> 
> ...


The issue isn't so much with an exact type of lube as it is the super-heavy stuff Shimano is packing chains with (again). Back in the day this was standard practice, which Shimano finally got away from some years ago, but for some reason, with 7900 and 6700, they're back to the super-thick stuff that creates a lot of noise & rumbling. Using _any_ thinner lube will quiet things down. My favorite lube is rock n roll gold, but almost anything thinner than grease will do the job.


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## kiroskka (Mar 9, 2008)

cpark said:


> My 7900 ran very quietly with 7800 cassette. I'm guessing the noise is due the new chain design. I'd like to try the 7800 chain with my 7900 but according to Shimano it's not compatible.
> 
> Has anyone try this set up?


One should never take Shimano at face value on what is not compatible.


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## qatarbhoy (Aug 17, 2009)

Hmm, CRB's first and only post is on a thread that was dormant for 18 months! :shocked:


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## ChainReactionBicycles (Dec 31, 2010)

*It's still relevant*



qatarbhoy said:


> Hmm, CRB's first and only post is on a thread that was dormant for 18 months! :shocked:


Yep! Came up because I was doing a search for something else, and noticed this thread because it's been such a big recent issue at the shop. Just one of those things where the universe lined up a certain way. I may even have an ancient log-in here that I forgot about ages ago; I normally post in rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc, ba.bicycles and, for abuse, rec.bicycles.racing.

But seriously, thinning out the stock chain lube can do wonders. I've had mechanics replace drivetrain components trying to get rid of "rumble" and other issues, no fix, then I grab some thin lube and voila. They hate it when I do that (once a mechanic, always a mechanic; I think all bike shop owners should have begun their lives as bike mechanics :thumbsup: ).

Anyway, I normally don't resurrect dead threads but this one remains 100% relevant to something people are still facing every day. Thanks-

--Mike--


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## wim (Feb 28, 2005)

qatarbhoy said:


> Hmm, CRB's first and only post is on a thread that was dormant for 18 months! :shocked:


Careful here. CRB has done battle with all the heavy hitters for years. I've seen him skewer, get this, Jobst Brandt!


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## pyattbl (Jun 28, 2010)

I am accumulating components for a auxillary bike build this spring, and in doing so found a great deal on a new Dura-Ace 7900 chain. I had a relative new Ultegra chain on my main bike (a 2010 Tarmac), and I decided to swap. I cleaned the new chain, lubed with some wax-based product, and then rode the trainer a couple of days. That new Dura-Ace 7900 chain is markedly louder than the Ultegra. Like most of the posters here, I have monitored and adjusted to no avail. It is just plain noisy. Glad to know that there is hope in Chain-L. I gotta get me some! Thanks!


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## Kerry Irons (Feb 25, 2002)

*Wax off*



pyattbl said:


> I cleaned the new chain, lubed with some wax-based product, and then rode the trainer a couple of days. That new Dura-Ace 7900 chain is markedly louder than the Ultegra. Like most of the posters here, I have monitored and adjusted to no avail. It is just plain noisy. Glad to know that there is hope in Chain-L.


Wax lubes are NOT the answer for road bikes unless you live in a very dusty area. Pretty much any wet lube will quiet your chain. Try mixing motor oil or gear lube 1:4 with odorless mineral spirits, apply liberally, spin the chain for a minute, and then wipe thoroughly to remove the outside lube. Let the chain dry before riding (solvent evaporates) and you'll be just fine.


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## frdfandc (Nov 27, 2007)

Chain-L is good stuff. But so is Pro-Link. As a mechanic at a LBS, that is all I use for customer bikes. It has quieted down noisy 6700/7900 chains. The newer 7901 chains use a lighter lubricant than the first 7900 chains, so they are a tad quieter. But using a wet lube, as Kerry Irons suggested, or a nice lube like Pro-Link can do wonders for a noisy chain.


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## pyattbl (Jun 28, 2010)

Thanks for the experience-based advice, guys. I'll give wet lube a shot today. The Dura-Ace chain is certainly louder than the Ultegra was under identical conditions (i.e. wax lube).


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## dteuscher (May 1, 2008)

I just installed a 7900 chain on 2 bikes and have the same issue on both. On one of the bikes, the whole drivetrain is new (DA crank, cassette, chain and rear derailleur). I wouldn't really call it 'noise' but more of a vibration. If you pedal and put your finger on the rear derailleur, you can really feel it. It is worse in the smaller cogs. Is this what everyone else is experiencing?

I can't feel or hear it while riding, but it is really noticeable in the stand. It shifts perfectly though. Hopefully, it will get better as things break in a bit.


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## FBinNY (Jan 24, 2009)

The vibration you describe is very common with new chains on a used cassette. Or you can try your luck with a different chain lube, as the OP did, which should make it quieter.


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## civdic (May 13, 2009)

I run a 7900 drive train and I never really noticed it being noisy until I put my bike on the trainer a couple weeks ago. I use the home brew lube. I usually mix it 3 parts mineral oil and 1 part motor oil (can't remember viscosity). I'm thinking of experimenting and mixing it a bit thicker to see if that quiets things down.


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## dteuscher (May 1, 2008)

I got tired of the noise with my 7900 chain/7800 cassette combo, so I bought a new 7801 chain to see if I could get a quiet things up. I put it side by side on my workbench with the 7900 chain to see where I needed to break it. The 7800 chain is actually longer than the 7900 for the same number of links. I think that would explain the noise! The compatibility matrix says that they aren't compatible, so I guess now I know why.


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## FBinNY (Jan 24, 2009)

Half inch pitch means just that. I see the difference in the photo, but I doubt that there's an intentional difference, because it would create all sorts of nightmares.

I suspect that possibly differences in lubrication filling the space surrounding the pin are affecting the amount of slack pulled out. I'd venture that when loaded with a bit of tension they'll match just about dead on.


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## dteuscher (May 1, 2008)

The 7900 chain in the photo probably has less than 200 miles on it. I have a hard time believing that differences in the lubrication would make that much difference in the length. The 7801 I installed tonight runs a lot quieter.


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## ziscwg (Apr 19, 2010)

Hummm,
My new SRAM 1050 chain, new 1070 cassette and new Rival mid cage RD, are kind of loud too. 

I changes as the tension changes on the chain depending on the gear, but is always there.

I was going to post, but I think I will get my ProLink out and see if that does it.


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## AvantDale (Dec 26, 2008)

mpcbike said:


> I'm using a 7900 chain with RED cranks & 7800 cassette. The chain makes noise, especially in the 23-25. I've also installed a ton of 7900 chains in the past few months and noticed this same noise on most of the drivetrains(all 10 speed shimano/sram/ or a mix). Not sure why it's happening, but the shift quality is enough to make me overlook it as anoying as it is.


This is happening to me now with my 7900 chain. I have a PG1070 cassette. It makes noise only when I'm in the big ring and any of the three larger cogs. It was quiet when I first got the chain, but after a few hundred miles...its making noise. I've wiped down the chain and relubed...it stays quiet for only a couple rides.

Its quieter than the 7801 chain I had before.


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