# Fitment Question..I Think My Bike Is Too Big For Me



## jonshonda (Oct 23, 2011)

Hello all, 

This month I have been keeping up with my goal to ride for at least 1 hour every day (split between mtn and rd bike). I have been dailing in both bikes more and more as I go, but am having issues with the road bike fitment. I purchased a used 61cm Specialized Allez thinking that I could sit lower on the frame, thus gain a more upright riding position ( I am 6'1" with shorter legs long torso). I am fairly comfy on most rides, except for a few issues.

#1 Almost instantly, pedaling the road bike feels different on my legs (more sensation in my knees) than my mtn bike, which sometimes leads to my left knee not feeling good. I have moved the cleats back and forth, to and fro, and the only thing that has seemed to work is raising my seat to a max height. I don't get any goofy feeling on my mtn bike.

#2 (the reason I think my bike is too big/long) I have tried a number of different saddles, and on all of them I found myself sliding forward, or riding more towards the nose of the saddle. A lot of times I had to make an effort to push my sit bones to the correct part of the saddle. I have tried to combat this by moving my saddle forward, and tilting it up at an angle to force my ass back. Moving the seat forward has helped, but any angle other an parrallel make my taint go numb. Also when sprinting up hills, I find I am riding the nose of the saddle. 

Is my bike too long for me? That is the only thing I can think of as to why I keep finding myself riding towards the nose.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

You wouldn't be the first person to upsize for a more upright position, although bike frames have been proportional for many years, making this a more problematic proposition than it used to be.

Your body contacts the bike in three places: The saddle, pedals and handlebars. They bottom bracket is fixed in place, and I think of it as being the origin that everything else relates to.

To start with, try matching your saddle position - height and setback - to the position on your MTB. This article includes some tips for measurement and a chart to fill in. I used it to rough in a track bike a while ago and found it very helpful.
Park Tool Co. » ParkTool Blog » Road Positioning Chart

Next, have a look at reach between the two bikes. Since they're in different enough classes to effect the riding position, this is more of a way to gain some insight. But you might learn something useful. I'd be looking at the distance from the tip of the nose on the saddle to the handlebar clamp, and also the distances from the tip of the nose of the saddle to the grips on the MTB and the crux of the hoods on the road bike. I find that the reach to the bar clamp on my MTB is further than on my road bike, but it's not as far as the reach to the hoods. Basically, the riding position on my MTB is a little more upright than my hoods position, but not bolt upright like my flats position. I have pretty similar drop between the two bikes, but people vary on this too. If you're seeing any massive differences, it could be the source of your problem.

Are you wearing the same shoes and pedals between the two bikes?

Finally, have a look at your technique. Mountain biking can be pretty tolerant of riders with a slower pedaling style because one only gets to pedal in the saddle for a little while before needing to do something else with the pedals. Making a platform, lifting the front wheel, etc. While I pedal most of the time on both bikes and at a relatively similar cadence, when I ride my road bike, I pedal almost all of the time and there are many fewer breaks and changes in what I'm doing. I think that makes it less forgiving of setup or technique problems.

I think that 90 mm is the shortest stem that leads to a road bike that handles well. I actually think that the handling change is about weight distribution, but if a bike is on the margin of being too big, it has a big effect on where the rider's center of mass ends up, and how much weight is on each wheel. If your stem is longer than this, you have room to go shorter. Probably. I'm 5'8", and while I can't confirm it one way or the other, I do wonder if proportionality has something to do with stem length too.

Finally, consider paying for a fit. Ask your roadie friends who's good. It's easy to see from reading the boards that there are shops offering fits as another opportunity to sell overpriced crap to upper-middle-class people with more money than time or desire to learn, but there are also a lot of fitters out there who understand what they're doing and can really help a rider, even one who doesn't quite fit the averages (really, most of us in one way or another) to be more comfortable on the bike. I finally paid for one a while ago, and while nothing magically happened instantly after getting the fit, I do think it was a big part of getting back to riding high volume after suffering from knee problems for years, and it broke me out of a misconception that had been stopping me from setting up my bike right on my own.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

Not being critical here, but this is the problem with (sans experience) claiming ownership of fit. Oftentimes it's nothing more than winging it, making a series of unrelated changes that do little but 'deepen the hole', causing more (or different) fit issues.

From what you've offered, I think there's a real possibility your bike is sized too large for you. If that's the case, you have two options. Sell it or 'make it fit'. First step (IMO) is to definitively determine the sizing question, and to do that I suggest opting for a fitting - or at least visit a reputable LBS and ask that their fitter provide an assessment. 

I could go on to theorize all the issues you're describing, but 1) I think most will relate back to the sizing issue and 2) I'd just enable you to keep fumbling around with your fit - likely to no avail.

Make this easy on yourself, addressing the fundamental question of sizing first, and assessing your options from there.


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## usn.mustanger (May 30, 2012)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Are you wearing the same shoes and pedals between the two bikes?


Maybe a silly question, but is this not ok? I'm about to buy my first road bike, and was thinking of saving some money by using my Specialized MTB shoes. They're comfortable enough for mtb'ing, but knowing nothing about road biking, I don't know if this will work...


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

usn.mustanger said:


> Maybe a silly question, but is this not ok? I'm about to buy my first road bike, and was thinking of saving some money by using my Specialized MTB shoes. They're comfortable enough for mtb'ing, but knowing nothing about road biking, *I don't know if this will work*...


It'll work fine. Lots of folks use MTB shoes/ pedals for road/ MTB'ing.


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## jonshonda (Oct 23, 2011)

I ditched my mtb shoes in favor of spd sl's for their wider platform as I was/am having issues with my feet going numb.


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## EHietpas (Feb 9, 2012)

Could be a fit issue. I am 6'1" as well and ride an old Specilized Sirrus ('91) with a 60cm frame. 

If your sliding forward you need to raise up your handle bars. Is your seat level, turned up or down. If it's turned down you will slide down. 

Without seeing you on the bike and comparing your MTB to your Road Bike it's really hard of any of us to help you. If you don't want to tweek everything, go to your LBS and have them help you out. JUST DON'T BUY *ANYTHING* until you try out the components. Your LBS will try to sell you different stems, saddles, etc.. Ask to try the things out before you buy, otherwise you'll find yourself with a couple hundred dollars in parts that are USELESS.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

EHietpas said:


> Could be a fit issue. I am 6'1" as well and ride an old Specilized Sirrus ('91) with a 60cm frame.
> 
> *If your sliding forward you need to raise up your handle bars.* Is your seat level, turned up or down. If it's turned down you will slide down.
> 
> Without seeing you on the bike and comparing your MTB to your Road Bike it's really hard of any of us to help you. If you don't want to tweek everything, go to your LBS and have them help you out. JUST DON'T BUY *ANYTHING* until you try out the components. Your LBS will try to sell you different stems, saddles, etc.. Ask to try the things out before you buy, otherwise you'll find yourself with a couple hundred dollars in parts that are USELESS.


IME, not likely. Sliding forward is generally a result of excessive reach (too long ETT and/ or stem) and/ or incorrect saddle tilt (down). Could be the bike's too large or he needs a fitting. Hmm..... 

Also, comparing the OP's MTB set up to his road bike is going to teach us (or him) next to nothing. He needs to get sizing assessed and (_if it proves 'workable'_) opt for a standard fitting. 

If he chooses a reputable shop, they won't try to sell him useless stuff.


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## jonshonda (Oct 23, 2011)

I am leaning more and more towards a fitting, but need to do some research for a place to get it done.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

without knowing the whole situation.. what's on the road bike, etc... of course paying a fitter to fit you plus buying ancillary parts needed (ie new stem)...would be best. Though have you considered flipping the stem, so that it angles up? This will also mean removing the handle bars to reposition them again.

This is always a risk area of buying used the first time... which is why many of the RBR folks, including myself, emphasize the importance of FIT and spending extra money as a noob at a LBS.

I agree with PJ. MTB fit vs. road...is apples to oranges.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jonshonda said:


> I am leaning more and more towards a fitting, but need to do some research for a place to get it done.


Ask other cyclists in your area - group rides are a good resource. 

Just as a FYI, make your concerns known to the fitter. Any that are reputable will assess sizing _before_ trying to fit you.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

usn.mustanger said:


> Maybe a silly question, but is this not ok? I'm about to buy my first road bike, and was thinking of saving some money by using my Specialized MTB shoes. They're comfortable enough for mtb'ing, but knowing nothing about road biking, I don't know if this will work...


Lots of my teammates use the same system between both bikes and it works fine for them.

I do use a road shoe. My attitude is that unless someone has a specific reason to use a particular road system, MTB systems are really more user-friendly. Get a racy shoe (I think my BG Comp shoes, and probably the Sport model too, are already racy enough) and go ride.

OP - feet going numb can be a shoe thing. I don't think it's usually a pedal thing. It can also have to do with a bad saddle or bad saddle position. If your feet are better with the new system, fine, be happy. Otherwise, try not to throw more money at it until you have an idea of the cause and good reason to believe the solution will work.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Lots of my teammates use the same system between both bikes and it works fine for them.
> 
> I do use a road shoe. My attitude is that unless someone has a specific reason to use a particular road system, MTB systems are really more user-friendly. Get a racy shoe (I think my BG Comp shoes, and probably the Sport model too, are already racy enough) and go ride.
> 
> OP - feet going numb can be a shoe thing. I don't think it's usually a pedal thing. It can also have to do with a bad saddle or bad saddle position. If your feet are better with the new system, fine, be happy. Otherwise, try not to throw more money at it until you have an idea of the cause and good reason to believe the solution will work.


If speedplays after a year don't become second nature to me..... I'll be ditching them, and use my MTB pedals instead (crank brothers candy)... and maybe get a stiffer road soled road shoe...


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

Speedplays are my road shoe. Go figure. I like them a lot, and find getting in and out to be very easy.


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## tednugent (Apr 26, 2010)

AndrwSwitch said:


> Speedplays are my road shoe. Go figure. I like them a lot, and find getting in and out to be very easy.


I do get into my speedplays faster than Look Keo Classic

however, I get into my MTB pedals faster than speedplays.

4-side vs. 2-side vs. 1-side entry....


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## jonshonda (Oct 23, 2011)

Well, the engineer in my keeps picking away at fitment and getting things sorted out. 

I started out with a longer stem that had a steep angle upwards (bars almost level with saddle)....as I wanted more of an upright seating position. Well, I went to the extreme opposite and found a cheap short steam to with slight upright angle. Well, I must say I am amazed to find my hands/arms/back is more comfy in a more racey position. Also, knee pain is gone. 

Now my only issue is my taint going numb ( I had this issue with my Brooks saddle too). I had adjusted the saddle to be level w/ the ground ( in an effort to prevent me from sliding forward) but think I will have to adjust it to angle down more to figure out the taint issue. 

Question, do you find your sack getting pintched between your taint and saddle? I am constantly having to pull it out from under me.....also, a numb taint is weird.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

jonshonda said:


> Well, the engineer in my keeps picking away at fitment and getting things sorted out.
> 
> I started out with a longer stem that had a steep angle upwards (bars almost level with saddle)....as I wanted more of an upright seating position. Well, I went to the extreme opposite and found a cheap short steam to with slight upright angle. Well, I must say I am amazed to find my hands/arms/back is more comfy in a more racey position. Also, knee pain is gone.
> 
> ...


I'm not surprised that the shorter stem angled down has helped with both reach and hand/ arm/ back comfort. If the bike is too large for you (and ETT too long) the shorter stem would (to a degree) help with reach and the increased drop would take some pressure off your lower back. 

I suspect the arm/ hand comfort is due more to your moving rearward 'some', so I'd be curious what your before/ after stem lengths were. FWIW, that's really not the correct way to get f/r weight distribution in a good range (saddle fore/ aft adjustments are), but that's what you did - albeit, inadvertently. 

Can't comment on the knee issue because you didn't offer specifically where the pain was. 

Re: the perineum discomfort/ numbness, this indicates that rearward weight isn't being borne by the sit bones, but rather, ahead of them. Could be your saddle, could be saddle position, could be your form (position on the saddle - also may be related to fit). 

Before tipping your saddle down, I would suggest that you double check that it's level. Reason being, tipping the saddle down may increase frontal weight causing you to slide forward and putting more pressure on hands/ arms. But whether you take stabs at resolving it or you resort to a fitters services, this is one fit issue that needs to be resolved sooner rather than later. So take care to do so.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

jonshonda said:


> Question, do you find your sack getting pintched between your taint and saddle? I am constantly having to pull it out from under me.....also, a numb taint is weird.


No.

Are you wearing cycling shorts?


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