# 07 Record Crank UT vs 06



## JAG MN (Jan 10, 2006)

I have a 34/50 2006 Record crank and it works well enough, that's for sure. However, recently I have been smitten by the 07 crank and want to get it. I like the looks and the design better and I believe it is stiffer (but not sure if I (a lowly Cat 4 rider) could tell the difference). Some folks I have recently spoke to have been raving about the new design and they swear they can tell the difference.

Any thoughts from riders who have experienced both?

Thanks, JG


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## rfrancisco (Feb 2, 2004)

*Centaur '06 CT and Centaur '07 UT CT*

I just install my Centaur ' 07 UT-CT cranks it's replacing the Centaur ' 06 CT cranks. Will be riding them tomorrow, will give some feedback after riding them for a week. Good luck!


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## mpk1996 (May 11, 2007)

i didn't ride an 06, but i do have the 07 record UT, and its great. its all about the money. i don't think you will go from a cat 4 to a 3 or 2 by changing the crank. it sure looks cool though


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## capt_phun (Jun 14, 2004)

I went from 06 alloy Record cranks to 07 Ultra-torque Chorus. I can't "feel" a difference. They are both good cranks. What I do notice is:
1. One bolt to take off the cranks if need be.
2. The cranks spin surprising smooth. All the talk about excess drag of the external BB, the UT design definitely spins with less drag than the Truvativ Rouleurs I have on another bike. The UT does not spin as freely as the record with square taper BB, but I was pleased with the UT.
3. Front chainring shifting has been phenomenal, as was with alloy cranks.
4. Most importantly, they look nice.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

This whole "difference" thing is insane. Can most people really feel their cranks flex? I have a bike with 1985 Super Record cranks on it, and those cranks aren't any more solid than the 2007 Record UT cranks I have on my current bikes, and they aren't any less solid either. Then again, I am not some 250 lb bruiser either. I weigh 150 lbs., and while I used to be a Cat 3 racer a while ago, I am just getting back into racing so I probably don't have the power that I used to.

All this talk about "flex" is killing me. Frame flex, crank flex, wheel flex. I was at a race about a month ago and some guy was thinking about switching from his Zipp 404 clinchers to some other type of wheel, the name of which I cannot remember, because the Zipp 404's "flexed" too much. This guy was a Cat 4 racer, if that helps. I told him that he must be out of his mind if he thought the Zipp's flexed too much, but I didn't use those exact words.

While I love the design of the 2007 UT cranks and I am glad that I held out for them instead of buying the 2006 stuff, you can bet that if I already had a 2006 Campy crank and BB on my bike I wouldn't be swapping it out until it was broke or the BB needed to be maintained or fixed. So much in cycling is just marketing hype, which I succumb to way more than I should or like to.


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## BeeCharmer (Apr 30, 2003)

Flex matters sometimes. When I'm sprinting and my otherwise true wheel rubs both brake pads, the rim is flexing way too much and some wheelsets have a reputation for doing that.

That said, I just switched to a UT crank from a 2006 Record crank and I don't notice any less flex, but I'm hoping to notice no grinding ball bearings. I've wasted three Chorus/Record bottom brackets over the last five years, the outer bearing just grind up and make awful noises after 5000 miles. I think the outboard bearing will be a better design for me, but I'm 99kg and put out a lot of watts in sprints.


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## RoyIII (Feb 24, 2007)

So is there a "looks" justification for going to the 2007 crankset? I have a centaur triple with a phil wood bottom bracket that will never wear out. I was thinking about going back to a double 2007 but I think I'll hold 'em.


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## Barry Muzzin (Sep 18, 2006)

*Just replaced my 06 Chorus cranks last week...*

and went with the 07 Chorus UT. I didn't need them, but I just wanted them because I dug the looks. I do notice that I don't get any FD rub when standing in the big ring (or maybe I'm just rationalizing the purchase). 

I have done 4 UT installations this year on various builds and will never go back to the old bottom brackets for all of the reasons Capt. Phun laid out.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

The UT's are the easiest cranks/BB's I have ever installed, and that is one thing I love about them.

BeeCharmer,

Are you sure the wheel flex isn't a result of improper spoke tension? Sometimes, that can be a factor.

As far as wearing out bottom brackets is concerned, I cannot believe that you are experiencing grinding noises from your BB's after 5,000 miles. Are you over torquing them when you install them? Is water or dirt getting into the bearings?

Yes, flex matters, but you would think that with today's engineering and materials they would be able to get rid of almost all of the flex that wastes energy.


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## poshscot (Dec 14, 2004)

have gone from chorus alloy cranks to fsa isis carbon cranks to UT cranks and i think there is definatly a difference in stiffness. i wasnt expecting it but noticed it straight away.
always nice to see shimano come up with the great idea and then campag execute it with great superiority. sorry, not trying to troll...


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## Fignon's Barber (Mar 2, 2004)

fabsroman said:


> This whole "difference" thing is insane.......
> 
> All this talk about "flex" is killing me. Frame flex, crank flex, wheel flex......
> 
> ..... So much in cycling is just marketing hype, which I succumb to way more than I should or like to.



fabs, aren't you the guy developing a colnago fleet for every condition and lamenting the need for the extreme -power, in oder to optimize stiffness over your aluminium colnago? 
Just had to throw that in. How's your racing/training renaissance going?


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

FB,

I am looking at a Colnago fleet just in case things break and because I love the paint jobs. I have the Arte as my main racing bike with the Cristallo for any road racing with good climbs in the race and my daily trainer. I also have an Oval Krono for time trials which I will be using this weekend for the first time in a race condition.

As far as my racing is concerned, it is getting better. In April I failed to finish my first 2 races, a Cat 5 and a Cat 4/5. For the next 2 Cat 5 races I struggled to hang on to the pack, but finished with the pack right in the back. On the next Cat 5 race, I was able to ride near the front most of the time and I covered at least 3 moves by other riders, but still had nothing at the sprint. Yesterday, I raced a Masters 35+ race where the pace on some of the 2km laps was around 30.5 mph. We had guys in this race that could win Pro 1/2/3 races and have done so in the past. Anyway, I stuck with that group the entire race, rarely saw better than 10th position during the race and again blew up in the sprint. Today, I raced another Cat 5 race and felt really good. I was in the 5th position or better for most of the race, covered at least 7 moves by other racers, but got worn down by 6 teammates that kept countering every time I covered one of their attempted breaks. On the final turn, I was in the middle of the road behind the lead guy and three of these teammates came charging up the right side about 400 meters from the finish. I tried to catch one of their wheels but couldn't, so I tried to sprint it out from there. Cracked at 200m, tried to push it again at 150m but completely blew up at 100m. I ended up like 13th or 14th place and was completely pissed at myself. I could have let the other racers do more of the chasing/covering. What really pissed me off was when I bridged a gap to 8 riders on a break and as soon as I bridged the gap they stopped working and the pack caught up. To add insult to injury, the team with 6 teammates got first and second, but on the warm down lap one of their teammates that got dropped on the last lap rode up to me and asked me if I had won. According to him, they thought I was the man to beat in the race and they kept attacking to wear me out. Like an idiot, I played into their hand. I should have left them dangling out there in the wind for a while and let the pack do most of the work or just bridged a gap when they had a 30+ second lead. Oh well, live and learn. Oh yeah, I just found out that in yesterday's race a racer that crashed in front of me ended up dying. So, I raced really strong and felt really good over this weekend and the past couple of weeks. Figured out that I really need to work on my sprinting which used to be a natural thing for me 20 years ago. And overall, I had a pretty crappy weekend.

Since you asked how the racing was going, figured I would add some vented steam in there. If my wife or mother finds out that somebody died in yesterday's race, and right in front of me to boot, something tells me that I will be limited to time trials if I am lucky.


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## ETWN Stu (Feb 15, 2007)

My new bike is coming with the 07 record cranks and the one that got totaled had the 06 so when it comes I will be able to give you some input. anyway from the web site:

ULTRA-TORQUE™ CRANKSETS

With its 2007 range Campagnolo® is introducing the new Ultra-Torque™ crankset with integrated bottom bracket.

What are the advantages of this new generation of Ultra-Torque™ cranksets with integrated bottom bracket?

Lightness
Thanks to the lightness of the oversize axle 

Rigidity
Thanks to the external caps and greater diameter of the oversize axle.

Ergonomics
The greatest advantage, however, derives from the fact that there is more space left for the ankles and shoes of the athlete who will not be obliged to shift the cleats to broaden the position of the feet and therefore of the pedal stroke.
The Q factor also remains unchanged from the already excellent values previously offered by Campagnolo®.

Maintenance/Functionality
Standard wrenches are used to tighten the light allow caps, while a normal 10mm socket wrench is used for the central screw that unites the axle.

So it appears clear that the Ultra-Torque™ system is a fundamental evolutionary step, which hits the bull's-eye of the target Campagnolo® set itself: a new system which improves the existing ones from every point of view.


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## cavedave (Jan 30, 2007)

*Record bottom bracket*

I love the campy stuff except there Record bottom brackets after only 1000 miles took it apart and found metal shavings after hearing the infamous grinding noise only once in a while. Was instaled correctly just turned to junk went to Phil Wood Ti what a diffrence.Really like the Campy stuff and this is coming from a guy who always rode Dura Ace. I would not have sold the Dura Ace to get the Campy Record but it came one the bike and I like it.From wnat I have read and seen for my self I would junk the bottom bracket and get one that works Phil Wood.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Dave,

Are you talking about the old axle type bottom bracket, or are you talking about the new Ultra Torque ("UT") bottom bracket? There is a huge difference. Mine UT BB cups have been working just fine and I have over 1,000 miles on a set of them on one of my bikes. Of course, just because mine work well doesn't mean that everybody else's do.


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## cavedave (Jan 30, 2007)

*Bottom Bracket*

No I am not talking about the new UT cranks.The bottom bracket I am talking about is the Record one with the carbon fiber shell and the square taper ends.I would never buy another and would advise others to do so also.If you are going to stay with square taper buy a phil wood. Now someone out there is going to tell me a story about a phil wood that failed save it I have already read a bunch on the Record bottom brackets and first hand have seen it. The reviewes on the Phil Wood are the best on the net so I expect mine to last a long time surley more then a 1000 miles.


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## bigbill (Feb 15, 2005)

cavedave said:


> No I am not talking about the new UT cranks.The bottom bracket I am talking about is the Record one with the carbon fiber shell and the square taper ends.I would never buy another and would advise others to do so also.If you are going to stay with square taper buy a phil wood. Now someone out there is going to tell me a story about a phil wood that failed save it I have already read a bunch on the Record bottom brackets and first hand have seen it. The reviewes on the Phil Wood are the best on the net so I expect mine to last a long time surley more then a 1000 miles.


I completely agree with the PW bottom brackets. I always liked the look of my alloy record crankset, but was always disappointed with the life of the bottom brackets. I run a centaur UT crankset now on my road bike because I prefer the look over carbon. I commuted in Hawaii (rain) for two years on a Soma then a Gunnar using a PW bottom bracket with a dura ace 7410 crankset. It failed once but that was after 43 straight days of rain and riding on a muddy MUT. I put it through way more than it was ever intended for. I mailed it back to PW and for $35 it was rebuilt with new bearings. Well worth the money. My next winter bike will have the alloy crankset and a 102 PW bottom bracket.


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## Climbing_Clyde (Jun 16, 2007)

Isn't sexy enough of a reason to upgrade?










Compred to the 12 year old Shimano 600 that was on my old 200SCi there is a difference, it feels stiffer and spins easier/smoother, it also lightened the bike up by about a pound. 
I needed a compact crank so decided to go with my first ever campy part, I only have a couple of hundred miles on it but love this thing, keeps my fat ass in the saddle and in the hills again.


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## BeeCharmer (Apr 30, 2003)

BeeCharmer,

Are you sure the wheel flex isn't a result of improper spoke tension? Sometimes, that can be a factor.

As far as wearing out bottom brackets is concerned, I cannot believe that you are experiencing grinding noises from your BB's after 5,000 miles. Are you over torquing them when you install them? Is water or dirt getting into the bearings?

Nope, three bb's properly torqued with the torque wrench, stripped down occasionally to be cleaned with lots of grease. I think the problem is the small bearings. The last set crapped out while we were on sabbatical in France last winter. Very frustrating. So, what I love best about the new UT setup is the much larger bearings. After 500 miles, pleased with the Chorus UT, but still can't discern a difference between it and my 2006 Record.


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## Hillen (May 13, 2005)

*No Diff*



JAG MN said:


> Any thoughts from riders who have experienced both?


I have 06 Record (carbon) on one bike, and 07 record on another. I ride and race both bikes. From a feel, performance, function point of view, there isn't a damn bit of difference.


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## Kemmelberg (Dec 27, 2005)

Interesting race report. Don't worry too much about the tactics. Once you get fitter and faster, you'll be able to get yourself into position to win or place highly.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

This Sunday I bridged a gap to a 6 man break. After chasing for a lap, two guys caught up to me from behind and we worked together to bridge the gap. Took us about 3 laps. Then, one rider went off the front and tried to solo from the 8 of us. Helped chase him down too. Ended up getting second in the sprint. Lost the race by half a bike length. That was the first race my wife and daughter watched. I'm looking forward to the next race.


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## Kemmelberg (Dec 27, 2005)

Good job. That was my point. Aren't you a lawyer? I am too -- in Minneapolis. Where are you located?


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Yep, I'm an attorney too, but I am located in Maryland just outside of Washington, DC. I live just far enough from the city to make riding enjoyable. I have my own practice which makes finding time to ride a little easier.


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## ghostzapper2007 (May 22, 2007)

Chippo, Zabel, McEwen and a host of others had no problems with a lack of stiffness with those old "outdated" square taper Record cranks. You gotta love it when CAT 4's and 5's start babbling about how they can feel stiffness differences in their cranks or how Zipp 404's are no longer good enough for a CAT 4??? Oh the power of the human imagination. The new Ultra cranks do look awful sexy though and installation is a breeze which is why I'll be buying them for my next ride.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

I don't know if I said it in this thread, but I know I said it somewhere on this board. This whole stiffness thing is nuts. I guess some people can feel flex in their frame, but in cranks and wheels it is utterly nuts. On a slight 1% grade this past weekend I was able to crank out a 40.3 mph sprint with the help of a lead out, and I can assure you that I didn't feel any flex in my cranks, my frame, or my wheels. Granted, I am a Cat V rider. Heck, I doubt many Cat anythings can really feel flex in their frames or components.


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## Lookbiker (Sep 2, 2006)

If I feel flex in my crank its because I just hit a tree. I use the 06 Record crank and BB and they don't flex at all. Didn't Landis use the same BB in the Tour last year?


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## cycle21 (Jul 1, 2002)

*Bent Spider on Record UT Crank*

I backed over my bike after being too lazy to put it up properly after a Saturday ride . I bent the spider on the 07 Record UT Carbon crank. I understand that the spider has an aluminum insert wrapped in carbon. Can the spider be repaired/trued? If so, where?


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## yanksphan (May 18, 2005)

cycle21 said:


> I backed over my bike after being too lazy to put it up properly after a Saturday ride . I bent the spider on the 07 Record UT Carbon crank. I understand that the spider has an aluminum insert wrapped in carbon. Can the spider be repaired/trued? If so, where?


The Record crank has no aluminum insert - in fact, the Record crank is 100% hollow.

http://www.campagnolo.com/groupsets.php?gid=1&cid=7



> Not only is the main crank arm hollow, but also the small arms supporting the chainrings of the RH crank.


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## ti-triodes (Aug 14, 2006)

All Record BB's are junk? Please. Either it was installed incorrectly or something got inside. I have 2 square taper that have thousands of miles on them with no problems. They are, of course, maintained properly. I even have a 20 year old loose bearing Croce BB that spins like butter.

Face it, you got a dud.


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