# Mexican DWI crash into group (scary photo) post ONLY here



## culdeus (May 5, 2005)

This just happened this morning, across the Texas-Mexico border.

https://www.hoytamaulipas.net/?v1=notas&v2=44203&tit=Carrera_ciclista_termina_en_tragedia_en_Matamoros

Babelfish helps for the Spanish-impaired.

An incredible photo, and worth noting that Mexican print/tv media show much more gore than they do here in the states if you click further in the links. Just a terrible accident and there are tons in the hospital. A mix of US and Mexico riders were involved. More details to come.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

That is so sad... How can you not see group of racers?


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## Leopold Porkstacker (Jul 15, 2005)

Was probably text messaging or something equally unimportant and lame.


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## Ken (Feb 7, 2004)

*Translation by Google*

Matamoros, Tamaulipas .- A cycling race ended this Sunday morning in tragedy when the driver of a vehicle winding to a quota that was finalized Beach Baghdad.

Early reports indicate that shortly after the eight o'clock, had launched a coexistence of cycling, from the city of Matamoros, Tamaulipas with the Beach Baghdad, involving approximately 500 participants, who led troops in 15 people.

The event was convened by the Club Ciclista "Chameleons", in its third edition.

Upon reaching the first contingent at kilometre 16 of that Rua, a vehicle lost control and hit squarely.

Until the moment it is unknown whether the driver was driving the drive under the influence of alcohol or drugs, since they do not detected signs of an element of the Federal Preventive Police Roads division that led the group of cyclists.

After the impact, fourteen people were injured and one more died in various fractures. Two more people were reported injured as serious in hospitals in Matamoros.

The now occiso was identified as Alejandro Alvarez 34 years and residing in the Country Club of texana city of Brownsville.

The responsible for the accident, was arrested at the scene, said John Fields called aged 28, residing at 233 San Eugenio from the same city texana.

After the accident, participants of the Third Tour "Matamoros Playa Bagdad-2008", attempted homicide to assault imprudencial, speaking an element of the PFP Roads.

The ministerial authorities assumed that the vehicle he was driving a 1988 Grand Marquis model gray, is owned by a relative because they found documentation on behalf of Jessy Fields.

After the tragedy, coexistence was suspended by the organizers. In this race cyclist involved mainly professionals from both sides of the border.


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## Paul1PA (Sep 16, 2006)

That is truly an horrific picture. Just an awful mess of bodies and bikes being strewn about. Pretty sure the black oval object high in the air is a helmet.

Clear day, straight road and a massive pack of riders yet this still happens. WTF?! Amazing there was only 1 fatality and hoping the injured have full recoveries.


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## abiciriderback (Jun 8, 2005)

Wow how sad. Seeing that horrific picture makes me sick to my stomach. How many life's have been changed permanently from the action of the driver.???
Makes you wonder why???

Ray Still


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## OldRoadGuy (Dec 21, 2007)

No words....:nonod: :sad:


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## uzziefly (Jul 15, 2006)

Really sad...

How in the hell did a guy just miss a pack of people? 

Unfortunate indeed.


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## JohnnyTooBad (Apr 5, 2004)

That's just brutal! By the looks of the picture, it looks like the cop car saw the guy coming on the wrong side of the road, and moved left, exposing all the riders to the car coming the other way.

tragic!


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## Sprocket - Matt (Sep 13, 2005)

Yeah. I noticed that too Johnny.... Maybe that cop car should have turned on the siren, lights, etc... and ran head first into that oncoming car. At least the cyclists would have been saved, and a cop car can always be replaced, it's just a car...

Sorry, this is really awful news.


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## dave2pvd (Oct 15, 2007)

Cop could have been ahead, or behind. You can't tell from what you see in the picture.

You can't blame the cop for swerving. That's just a natural instinctive reaction to someone heading straight for you, out of control.

Very, very sad.


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## robbyracer (May 30, 2007)

Wow............
I'm speechless


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## Sprocket - Matt (Sep 13, 2005)

dave2pvd said:


> You can't blame the cop for swerving. That's just a natural instinctive reaction to someone heading straight for you, out of control.


+1 - Good point.
I don't wanna lay blame on anyone.... Just a hindsight, thought that MAYBE the cop could have prevented it... But like you said "natural instinct" prevailed.

NO Matter, it's still horrible.


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## California L33 (Jan 20, 2006)

dave2pvd said:


> Cop could have been ahead, or behind. You can't tell from what you see in the picture.
> 
> You can't blame the cop for swerving. That's just a natural instinctive reaction to someone heading straight for you, out of control.
> 
> Very, very sad.


It's so sad that something like that could happen at all, let alone in an organized race. This is the nightmare that European road race organizers have been fearing will happen there with spotty last minute road closures. 

Speaking of odd things, did anyone notice the cyclist off the road with his foot down at the point of impact? It's like he saw, got off the road and stopped, and nobody else did. Is he a spectator who didn't see the car coming? He's looking down the road. 

I, too, would like to know how the cop ended up there with no lights on. Was he behind? Ahead? Was he escorting them by driving alongside on the wrong side of the road, or passing the group? The sign indicates that they're just past a divided road so maybe he pulled out to pass and the other car swerved to avoid him. Even with the photo you can't tell what's going on.


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## bauerb (Jan 18, 2006)

OMFingG.


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## bas (Jul 30, 2004)

Sprocket - Matt said:


> +1 - Good point.
> I don't wanna lay blame on anyone.... Just a hindsight, thought that MAYBE the cop could have prevented it... But like you said "natural instinct" prevailed.
> 
> NO Matter, it's still horrible.


was the one guy on the left on the curb finishing his pee break or did he get out of the way?

kind of quick to put a foot down.

I see a helment flying in the air.. UGH.. 


the other photos are access via here:

goto the article, click on Galeria Fotographica.


http://www.hoytamaulipas.net/?v1=subseccion&v2=42


Carrera ciclista termina en tragedia en Matamoros Por: Marco Esquivel Foto José Fidelino Vera Hdz 
Un vehículo impacta a un contingente de 15 cicilistas, uno de ellos murió en el lugar de los hechos y el resto terminó con lesiones 01/06/08 Galeria Fotográfica


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## culdeus (May 5, 2005)

California L33 said:


> Speaking of odd things, did anyone notice the cyclist off the road with his foot down at the point of impact? It's like he saw, got off the road and stopped, and nobody else did. Is he a spectator who didn't see the car coming? He's looking down the road.


Maybe a breakaway guy? Just a guess. He saw the guy weaving perhaps and made a move ahead of time to get to the shoulder. Again just a guess. Any US media pick up this story?


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## phoehn9111 (May 11, 2005)

Unimaginably graphic portrayal of the full extent of the raw physical impact and violence
of the collision. Every nuance is instinctively palpable. And that close up of the paramedic, kind of reminds me of those awful Signal 30 movies we were forced to watch in drivers ed.
You racers are a tougher breed than I am.


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## Len J (Jan 28, 2004)

From The Brownsville Herald in English

Brownsville man killed in Matamoros cycling accident
Comments 3 | Recommend 8
June 2, 2008 - 12:18PM
By Jose Borjon, The Brownsville Herald

A Brownsville man is dead and at least five people remain hospitalized at a number of Rio Grande Valley hospitals after being struck by a car as the group, along with other cyclists participated in the third annual Bike Tour Matamoros-Playa Bagdad Sunday morning.

At least two people have been confirmed dead. Alejandro Alvarez, 34, of Brownsville, and a second person both died, the Mexican news outlet Tamaulipas enlinea.com reported in its online edition Monday.

Edgar Omar Castro, 14, Miguel Gonzalez, Alejandro Martinez and Rolando Loriqute, along with another person remained listed in conditions ranging from good to critical at Valley Baptist Medical Centers in Brownsville and Harlingen, VBMC spokeswoman Teri Retana confirmed late Sunday night.

The group, along with others participants in the bike race shortly, were struck by Jesse Lopez, 29, who drove a 1989 Gran Marquis. Lopez was driving drunk and under the influence of drugs, Matamoros newspapers reported in their Monday editions.

For more on this story, see Tuesday's Brownsville Herald.

A car collides into cyclists participating in a race in Mexico's northern border city of Matamoros, Sunday June 1, 2008. At least one person was killed and 14 injured when a driver slammed into a bicycle race. (AP Photo/Jose Fidelino Vera Hernandez)<!-- / message --><!-- attachments -->
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->


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## avatar78 (Sep 12, 2005)

El presunto homicida Juan Campos de 28 años, es detenido por un elemento de la Policía Federal Preventiva división Caminos, tras atropellar a un contingente de ciclistas, donde uno de ellos falleció.

The alleged murderer Juan Campos...

I like the plain language. It would be nice if US newspapers described drivers who hit cyclists like that.


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## bikerboy337 (Jan 28, 2004)

so sad.. agree with the post above... people get off way too easy with driving in the us... had two people pull out in front of me (at stop signs) on my commute home today, had to swerve to avoid them... and two other drivers passed wihtin a foot of me, didn't move over in the least bit to give me a little space.. just hope this never happens especially with my first baby on the way in two weeks..... really sad story


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## Dajianshan (Jul 15, 2007)

My daily fear. 
I put up with these kind of reckless drivers every day... approaching from sides streets at full speed and crossing my lane, wrong way drivers, impulsive right hand turns.... shudder. 

I feel real bad for those guys and their families.


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## velodog (Sep 26, 2007)

There isn't anything sad about this!
The son of a ***** that did this needs to be hung and his body left to rot.
Anger is my response, not sadness.


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## Pablo (Jul 7, 2004)

I am sick to my stomach. 

How did a picture get taken?


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## Mr. Bill (Oct 3, 2007)

And here's poor little me, losing sleep the last few nights because I'm temporarily unemployed. I guess we all need to be reminded sometimes of what a real nightmare is.


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## Paul1PA (Sep 16, 2006)

Seeing Len's enhanced image really exposes the severity of the impact. Frightening how many riders are being tossed around like rag dolls. Also shows how lucky some of the participants were in narrowly avoiding disaster. 

So sad to hear another rider has perished. Hopefully the death toll will stop at two.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

Your response shouldn't be just anger.

I am sad for the victims' families and I am angry at the driver, who I think should have been pulled out of his car and shot on the spot or at least put on a bicycle and run over at high speed with the police car.


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## Len J (Jan 28, 2004)

Pablo said:


> I am sick to my stomach.
> 
> How did a picture get taken?


I don't know...but I suspect that someone was taking pictures of the peleton coming toward them & just kept shooting.

Notice the riders beyond the car still coming towards it.

len


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## normalnorm (Jan 16, 2006)

Thats crazy. How could you not see them....

Like a someone said earlier....makes me angry(and sad for the cyclists family). This should never happen.


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## Hand/of/Midas (Apr 15, 2008)

im glad a police officer was right there, that idiot probally would have kept going too. amazing. hope he gets everything he deserves.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

It will be interesting to see what Mexican justice is like in an alleged DUI case,,,My gut is telling me their laws will be more strict than the US..I hope so in this case

a sad, sad story


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## gonzaleziam (May 14, 2007)

Im from the area. And it is simply horrifying. We are all in state of shock and disbelief. It appeared the guy driving was under the influence of COCAINE who also happens to be a US resident from Brownsville. Our local team is now organizing some sort of donation to be given to the family of this unfortunate cyclist. 

Down here we have the benefit of seeing Mexican News and it's always this graphic. But to see something like this hits home.


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## croscoe (Aug 8, 2007)

That's a very powerful photograph. My prayers are with the victims and respective families.


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## DRLski (Apr 26, 2003)

I'm a little surprised that the cop car didn't try to block it somehow, he must have seen it coming since it looks like he had enough time to miss it.


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## phoehn9111 (May 11, 2005)

This was on the Today Show this am.


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## ZoSoSwiM (Mar 7, 2008)

I'm sick.. I feel numb that this actually happened.. The driver of that car should never see light again..


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## James30Florida (Apr 14, 2004)

so terrifying.


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

fabsroman said:


> Your response shouldn't be just anger.
> 
> I am sad for the victims' families and I am angry at the driver, who I think should have been pulled out of his car and shot on the spot or at least put on a bicycle and run over at high speed with the police car.


huh???


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## ashpelham (Jan 19, 2006)

So, I hope no one doubts the need for tougher DUI laws here in the US now. I imagine that on any given weekend in my small suburban town south of Birmingham, AL, when I see cars pulled over on a Saturday night, how many of them must be DUI? Another sad fact is that these DUI's are often purportrated by young immigrants from Mexico or Central America. 

To think that so much devastation can be wrought by one person with no future on a bad drug trip, or after one too many Cervezas.....The laws should be more strict, and announced to the populace of drivers around the nation/world/wherever.


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## culdeus (May 5, 2005)

How can I change the topic title?


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## Rob P (Apr 29, 2007)

This incredibly sad. I too wonder about the cops ability to stop the driver before hitting the cyclist - but I guess it's hard to know what the officer was thinking at that moment.


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## dave2pvd (Oct 15, 2007)

Rob P said:


> I too wonder about the cops ability to stop the driver before hitting the cyclist


Indeed, he ought to have inflated his hood-mounted bouncing castle. After rounding up as many CO2 cartridges as he possibly could from the group of riders. But not before fashioning a valve adapter from a piece of roadside debris using his teeth.

Seriously folks, let's think a bit here: If the oncoming driver was doing say, 55mph and the pack 25mph, you have a combined speed of 80mph. Let's just conjecture (since we're in the mood) that the driver swerved into the oncoming lane 200ft in front of the pack. The cop had 0.028 seconds to process then react. And I mean _react_, not figure out a plan of action and execute it.

My point is, even speculating that the cop could have 'stopped' the driver is ridiculous. 

(Nothing personal Rob P).


edit: math corrected


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## Rob P (Apr 29, 2007)

dave2pvd said:


> Indeed, he ought to have inflated his hood-mounted bouncing castle. After rounding up as many CO2 cartridges as he possibly could from the group of riders. But not before fashioning a valve adapter from a piece of roadside debris using his teeth.
> 
> Seriously folks, let's think a bit here: If the oncoming driver was doing say, 55mph and the pack 25mph, you have a combined speed of 80mph. Let's just conjecture (since we're in the mood) that the driver swerved into the oncoming lane 200ft in front of the pack. The cop had 1.7 seconds to process then react. And I mean _react_, not figure out a plan of action and execute it.
> 
> ...


None taken, that was rather my point with 'but I guess it's hard to know what the officer was thinking at that moment.' It all likely happened so fast. But I guess I didn't make the point very well.


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## il sogno (Jul 15, 2002)

Horrible....


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

Rob P said:


> None taken, that was rather my point with 'but I guess it's hard to know what the officer was thinking at that moment.' It all likely happened so fast. But I guess I didn't make the point very well.


Well, the first human instinct is self-preservation, and when you have 2 tons of vehicle bearing down upon you, you get out of the way. Sickeningly, the cyclists weren't as fast as the cop.


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## mtymxdh (Dec 21, 2007)

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,362147,00.html


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## mtymxdh (Dec 21, 2007)

blatido posted this picture in mtbr forums ... the federal police car was behind the bikers...


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## CoLiKe20 (Jan 30, 2006)

US Citizen or not. When you're in Mexico you abide by their laws. I hope US Consulate doesn't interfere and ask for leniency for this waste of oxygen.


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## mohair_chair (Oct 3, 2002)

In the crash picture, that police car is the car on the right.


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## BikeLV702 (Apr 19, 2008)

First off my thoughts go out to families and those effected by this horrible tragedy. 

Second I would be curious to know who is going to try this guy? I know there is discussion of whether or not there are US citizens involved but either way this guy needs to get what was coming to him. 

Third that cop, whether he could have swerved or not, is thinking the same exact thing you all are saying. "Should I have saved them?" "Could I have swerved in front?" "If I was in front would they still be alive?" So I think this guy is his own worst enemy at this point. Luckily he was there and was able to arrest the d-bag on the spot.

-Chad


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## FatTireFred (Jan 31, 2005)

this is sick, esp the blown up version. people are dying in those shots


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## Joelio34 (Jul 28, 2007)

fabsroman said:


> Your response shouldn't be just anger.
> 
> I am sad for the victims' families and I am angry at the driver, who I think should have been pulled out of his car and shot on the spot or at least put on a bicycle and run over at high speed with the police car.



+1!!!!!


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## cking17 (Mar 8, 2002)

*Unfortunate Scene - Cyclingnews has complete story*

Not a good scene to see. Ridiculous. 

There have been conflicting reports that the driver was either drunk, or, doing cocaine. Also, this wasn't a race - it was a family tour... which makes matters worse because at least one child rider got injured and is in critical condition. Cyclingnews seems to have the accurate info:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2008/jun08/jun03news

"Rider killed in horrifying Mexican crash:

One rider has died and five others remain in a critical condition following a horrifying accident in Mexico. A vehicle driven by 29 year-old Jesse Campos ploughed into the rear of a bunch of riders during the third Matamoros-Bagdad Cycling Tour, a family ride in Matamoros, Mexico.

United States of America cyclist Alejandro Alvarez was killed as a result of the accident. The 30 year-old is believed to have died at the scene while five others, including a 14 year-old, were rushed to hospital where their condition is listed as critical.

Images taken as the accident happened relive the horrifying accident, however are too graphic to publish.

Mexican media has reported authorities claim that Campos admitted to using cocaine prior to the accident."


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## bmxhacksaw (Mar 26, 2008)

I've been trying to figure out where the head of the guy below the airborne helmet is?


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## ToF (Jan 18, 2008)

So its made mainstream US news now-

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,362147,00.html


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## aliensporebomb (Jul 2, 2002)

Now I'm hearing the guy was not only drunk but on cocaine and had fallen asleep at
the wheel? What a terrible place for that to happen. 

My heart goes out to the families and riders. And I feel terrible that yet again 
stupid driving behavior makes international news - they need to make sure he's 
never behind the wheel of a car again.


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## Infini (Apr 21, 2003)

aliensporebomb said:


> Now I'm hearing the guy was not only drunk but on cocaine and



[Jim Carry voice] OKAYY, KILL HIM!!


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## livin4lax09 (Mar 15, 2008)

it made mainstream news in New Zealand last night. I was absolutely appalled.

EDIT: at the act, not the fact that it made NZ news.


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## fabsroman (Jul 14, 2006)

I was going to write something else, but it just isn't worth it. Continue to "huh" and ponder over my post if you must.


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## CFrancisco (Jun 4, 2008)

This is terrible. I have no words, my thoughts go out to the families.


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## edhchoe (Jun 3, 2007)

Not a safe race organizing there. There should have been a leading police car also.


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## DrRoebuck (May 10, 2004)

That might be one of the worst things I've ever seen.

I CANNOT BELIEVE only two people were killed. Wow ...

That driver should be charged with two counts of homicide.


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## treebound (Oct 16, 2003)

tferris said:


> So its made mainstream US news now-
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,362147,00.html


From the foxnews link:


> and men trying to lynch Campos before police arrived to arrest him.


Going to be interesting to see if Campos has any priors.
Bad situation all around.


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## treebound (Oct 16, 2003)

......


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## j__h (Jun 16, 2006)

treebound said:


> From the foxnews link:
> 
> 
> Going to be interesting to see if Campos has any priors.
> Bad situation all around.


 I'm guessing he does.


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## mtymxdh (Dec 21, 2007)

I "heard" (read it) but im not sure, I wasnt there , that this ride had support from federal and local police cars.. but that a group of 10 riders got away, so 4 of the federal police cars covered the head of the pack and left the police car in the picture behind the pack... when the first federals saw the drunk driver doing zig-zag they protected the first group and called the back police car to put ahead of the mass (the guys in the picture) the federal tried to get to the head but thats when the drunk driver swerved to the left ,away from the police car, since he was going to crash with a sign outside the road he swerved again to the right crashing with the riders....

the group that was ahead of the pack returned and tried to lynch the drunk as*hole but the feds stoped it....


excuse my poor translation 











-*/


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## KeeponTrekkin (Aug 29, 2002)

Let's hope this photo documents the last time that drunk coke head sees the light of day. Spending time in a Mexican prison - not an appealing prospect....


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

treebound said:


> Going to be interesting to see if Campos has any priors.
> Bad situation all around.


Accourding to the TX dept. of corrections there is a Juan Campos, age 40, who was sentenced on Feburary 14th of 2008 to 2 years in prison for a DWI. It will be interesting to see if this is the same guy, and if he was either in Mexico avoiding his sentencing, or already out on good behavior. 

If any of you can do more research, its El Paso, TX case# 20070D04777. The DWI was on 2007-09-29.

Edit: FWIW, this is all public information, and I am not saying its the same Juan Campos.


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## _velodoc_ (Dec 26, 2007)

I hope he's tried in a Mexican court b/c they are much harder on drunk drivers than the US


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

mtymxdh said:


> I "heard" (read it) but im not sure, I wasnt there , that this ride had support from federal and local police cars.. but that a group of 10 riders got away, so 4 of the federal police cars covered the head of the pack and left the police car in the picture behind the pack... when the first federals saw the drunk driver doing zig-zag they protected the first group and called the back police car to put ahead of the mass (the guys in the picture) the federal tried to get to the head but thats when the drunk driver swerved to the left ,away from the police car, since he was going to crash with a sign outside the road he swerved again to the right crashing with the riders....
> 
> the group that was ahead of the pack returned and tried to lynch the drunk as*hole but the feds stoped it....
> 
> ...


Interesting, so the police cruiser kind of caused the idiot to turn into the pack by driving head on into his lane...


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## James30Florida (Apr 14, 2004)

wipeout said:


> Interesting, so the police cruiser kind of caused the idiot to turn into the pack by driving head on into his lane...


no, i believe he was behind the pack and was told to move up and get in front of them to protect them but never made it that far. the guy was swerving all over the road and was headed for a sign and swerved back in to the road and hit the pack. :mad2:


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

James30Florida said:


> no, i believe he was behind the pack and was told to move up and get in front of them to protect them but never made it that far. the guy was swerving all over the road and was headed for a sign and swerved back in to the road and hit the pack. :mad2:


Look at the photograph again. The police car is in the wrong lane, the drunk driver swerved left to miss the cop and plowed head-on into the cyclists.


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## handsomerob (Oct 5, 2005)

wipeout said:


> Look at the photograph again. The police car is in the wrong lane, the drunk driver swerved left to miss the cop and plowed head-on into the cyclists.


not to take the blame away from Campos, especially since we are only getting bits of this story... but a (likely accelerating) police car coming head on in the wrong lane would make a lot of drivers panic and do something stupid. Who knows if the Federal officer just swerved from behind the pack as Campo was coming on them in his own lane?


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

wipeout said:


> Look at the photograph again. The police car is in the wrong lane, the drunk driver swerved left to miss the cop and plowed head-on into the cyclists.


Yes that's it. Because even in the story you concocted from one photo and some second hand rumors, any rational person would swerve towards a bunch of cyclist and plow them over, versus swering towards the shoulder on his side of the road. 

Campos should be given a medal, all cops are horrible, and this cop is responsible for the accident, not the coke-ed out drunk guy who was partying all night in Tijuana.


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

Kestreljr said:


> Yes that's it. Because even in the story you concocted from one photo and some second hand rumors, any rational person would swerve towards a bunch of cyclist and plow them over, versus swering towards the shoulder on his side of the road.
> 
> Campos should be given a medal, all cops are horrible, and this cop is responsible for the accident, not the coke-ed out drunk guy who was partying all night in Tijuana.


Yes, cops NEVER cause accidents or run over cyclists, do they Kestrel? 

http://www.velonews.com/article/73139


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## Kestreljr (Jan 10, 2007)

wipeout said:


> Yes, cops NEVER cause accidents or run over cyclists, do they Kestrel?
> 
> http://www.velonews.com/article/73139


(To stay on topic) In this story, I would say with the evidence on hand I would blame the the coked-ed out, drunk guy over the cop running support for a local bike race.

Believe what you will. If your preconceived notions is that cops are dirty bike hating a-holes, then I doubt anyone on a forum will convience you otherwise. ride on.


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## culdeus (May 5, 2005)

It's been documented in news story that the cop that's pictured in the wrong lane was well behind the accident when it happened. I don't know why people insist on discussing the matter.


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## pedalruns (Dec 18, 2002)

culdeus said:


> It's been documented in news story that the cop that's pictured in the wrong lane was well behind the accident when it happened. I don't know why people insist on discussing the matter.



Well first I blame the drunk driver totally, if he hadn't been there none of the other would matter as the cops were reacting to a drunk driver.... 

I think the reason why people are discussing is in the photo, the cop car is even or slighly ahead of the riders at the point of impact or a few seconds after... not well behind..... at least so it seems to me by looking at the photo? Maybe just an optical illusion? 

So I wonder if the cop car was trying to get ahead of the riders, but just didn't have time? 

Regardless.... what a horrible tradedy, it just about brings me to tears looking at the photo... and anyone caught driving under the influence should be jailed for a very, very long time.....


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## culdeus (May 5, 2005)

pedalruns said:


> Well first I blame the drunk driver totally, if he hadn't been there none of the other would matter as the cops were reacting to a drunk driver....
> 
> I think the reason why people are discussing is in the photo, the cop car is even or slighly ahead of the riders at the point of impact or a few seconds after... not well behind..... at least so it seems to me by looking at the photo? Maybe just an optical illusion?
> 
> ...


Yes, this was the case. Read all the press and the partial quotes of it here. 

The basic summary was you had

Back (some 180+ mixed age riders and family on a rally of sorts) ->>> cop car leading them ->>> Group of faster riders of 20 which was hit ->>> Group of mostly pros well out front of this group some you can see have pulled to the side and are looking back at the accident.

Order of operations as is understood.

1. Pro peleton sees the guy swerving around and moves to the side and (maybe) signals to the group behind them. Some stop and watch.

2. Cop behind the second group of mixed skill riders tries to pull forward to take on the motorist at a high speed. 

3. Drunk guy swerves and hits the bikes in the middle of the road.

note: The grey area seems that perhaps the action of the cop could have been a cause here as the drunk driver saw the cop in oncoming traffic and (perhaps, though not proven) swerves to miss the cop coming his way though this is not known and perhaps never will be.

5. Pro peleton reverses course and confronts the driver of the car. Guy arrested. 1 dies at scene 1 later.


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## pedalruns (Dec 18, 2002)

culdeus said:


> note: The grey area seems that perhaps the action of the cop could have been a cause here as the drunk driver saw the cop in oncoming traffic and (perhaps, though not proven) swerves to miss the cop coming his way though this is not known and perhaps never will be.



All the "what if's" following something like this... 

What I wonder is whoever was taking "the impact photo"...looks to be well off to the side... and the one rider in the photo has pulled off to the side... 

Why then were the rest of the riders still in the lane?? 

And could the person taking the photo have done something and if the photo was taken from a car could that car not have shielded the riders??

Answers we'll probably never know... I just really hope the drunk driver is left in jail the rest of his life.... please all ride safe and beaware of what is going on around you...... Of course even then we never know what might happen at any given time and place... and what reactions others will have.. 

Why do I love such a dangerous activity.....


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

Kestreljr said:


> I would say with the evidence on hand


The ONLY evidence on hand is the photograph. Again, take a good look at it and tell me what you think happened.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

wipeout said:


> The ONLY evidence on hand is the photograph. Again, take a good look at it and tell me what you think happened.


I think a drunk driver plowed into a group of cyclists.

What the cop is doing at that exact moment is irrelevant. Would it have been any less tragic if the officer made a split second judgement and drove head-long into the drunk driver, killing himself? And what's to say that those colliding cars didn't hit someone else anyway? Life is life, and loss of it is tragic regardless of who the victim is (with certain exceptions.)

The point I'm making is this: it doesn't matter the circumstances now. What's done is done, and you can't find fault in anyone except the drunk driver that killed two people.

Your daemonizing this officer for not hitting this guy head on is ridiculous.


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## wipeout (Jun 6, 2005)

robdamanii said:


> I think a drunk driver plowed into a group of cyclists.
> 
> Your daemonizing this officer for not hitting this guy head on is ridiculous.


What evidence do you have that shows the driver was drunk?

I'm not "daemonizing" the officer, I'm just looking at that photo and wonder what the hell happened, same as everyone else. Sheesh.


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## robdamanii (Feb 13, 2006)

wipeout said:


> What evidence do you have that shows the driver was drunk?
> 
> I'm not "daemonizing" the officer, I'm just looking at that photo and wonder what the hell happened, same as everyone else. Sheesh.


Well, I tend to believe the reports stating that the driver was intoxicated (alcohol or cocaine or what have you) since, although I have a dim view of humanity, I expect that people are good enough to not plow through a peloton.

Yes, it's heresay, but it's heresay to blame the officer for anything.

Honestly, what's the issue here? Is it the two dead cyclists or what the cop was doing? I doubt we'll know what happened with any certainty any time soon, if ever, since you rarely get an unbiased story from any involved party.

Like I said, what more is there to "what happened" besides two dead riders?


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## Jason1500 (Apr 1, 2008)

Too bad some cyclists didn't block the police from getting to the POS while they were lynching him. I'm really failing to understand why some people in this thread refuse to put full blame on this drunk....IMO he should be dead, he made the choice to drink and get behind a 4000lbs vehicle and killed 2 people (so far) his life should be forfeit and his organs harvested to save lives of people who don't kill other people.


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## hendrick81 (Jun 8, 2008)

Very sad, i hope the driver of that car gets the book thrown at him.


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## Armonhammer (May 25, 2008)

Next to the World Trade Center buildings demolished by terrorists, that is the worst thing I've ever seen.


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## SwiftSolo (Jun 7, 2008)

wipeout said:


> What evidence do you have that shows the driver was drunk?
> 
> I'm not "daemonizing" the officer, I'm just looking at that photo and wonder what the hell happened, same as everyone else. Sheesh.


Looks to me that the cop was following the cyclists and, after seeing the inevitiable impending crash, swerved out from behind to miss the cyclists. I'm sure the whole story will come out since there are a lot of witnesses.

Bram


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## Einstruzende (Jun 1, 2004)

Armonhammer said:


> Next to the World Trade Center buildings demolished by terrorists, that is the worst thing I've ever seen.


Sad thing is that there is stuff on equal level that happens everyday and most people never know or care about it. Humans are nasty, vicious creatures, especially when "empowered" by religion.


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

Jason1500 said:


> Too bad some cyclists didn't block the police from getting to the POS while they were lynching him. I'm really failing to understand why some people in this thread refuse to put full blame on this drunk....IMO he should be dead, he made the choice to drink and get behind a 4000lbs vehicle and killed 2 people (so far) his life should be forfeit and his organs harvested to save lives of people who don't kill other people.


Did the racers on scene lynch the drunk driver? There was a similar incident a few years back... drunk/idiot driver crashed into some racers, other racers surrounded the car and proceeded to beat the living s*** out of the guy.

Can't say I feel too sorry for him if that happened here... if it were me, I'd do the same thing. A beating and jail time doesn't even begin to make up for what he did.



...


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## Doggity (Mar 10, 2006)

Hate to say it, but wrong way, high speed DWI crashes happen all da time, here in New Mexico. There was a drunk douchburger last year who wiped out _a whole family,_ driving thusly. It was along my usual ride route; I came upon what was left of the extended family placing a wreath at the scene a few days later. There were still...parts on the road. This case was highly publicized, but it has _not _made a dent in the statistics. I no longer ride a road bike; I was starting to feel like _my_ number was coming up. I was putting thousands of miles on I-25 a year. With my luck, I wouldn't be killed, I'd be a high quad, _or_ somebody's favorite vegetable, my two worst fears.God!...I wonder if even summary road side execution would put a dent in this behavior!


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## SystemShock (Jun 14, 2008)

Doggity said:


> God!...I wonder if even summary road side execution would put a dent in this behavior!


Couldn't hurt. 



.


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## James30Florida (Apr 14, 2004)

has anyone heard an update to this story?


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## jgar477 (Mar 4, 2008)

James30Florida said:


> has anyone heard an update to this story?


yes, the local bike club in brownsville is hosting a benefit fundraiser for the victims of the cycling tour. 

www.riverrockets.com

i do know of a cycling club in Missouri, in which one of our local members is currently residing will be donating to the fundraiser as well. a very kind gesture. :thumbsup:


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