# 2010 Specialized S-Works SL3 rear wheel skewer wobble; frame tweak? HELP!



## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

I recently purchased a used Tarmac SL3 frameset. It was built this week and looks to be in pretty good shape and has about 2K on it. 

I own some lightweight 39gram Token skewers that are currently on my Zipp 303 wheels. All my parts are coming off my old bike and none ever had issues; SRAM red group. The only new thing I added were some Zero G brakes.

Issue #1 - When I clamp down the rear Token skewer and wiggle the rear 303 clincher wheels left to right it moves as if it is not clamped down all the way. I tighten and retighten the rear skewer down even harder and the rear wheel hub/axle still wiggles. On the left inner rear chain stay area where the left axle bolts down you can clearly see and feel some play and it moves although it is clamped down tight. 

*No issues with the Token front wheel skewer; bolts down fine.

I have a set of normal generic rear skewers and it bolts down fine and there is no more play. So I don't know if it is the skewer or if the frame is tweaked because if either skewer is clamped down I still have the following issue (see #2) or is it an issue at all?

Issue #2 - When brake lever is applied and brake caliper is fully clamped down; the brake pushes the wheel a bit to the left. I would think that when braking going fast that would cause some stability issues. Does anyone experience that with their rear brakes doing that to the rear wheel? I never paid attention until now but is that normal? That's what makes me think that the rear chain stay might be uneven or tweaked because I would think that when applying a rear brake that the brake engages the brake surface evenly and should not push the wheel in any direction.

I went for a ride this weekend using the heavier skewer set and there was no rear wheel wobble or issues when braking. I only maxed 35mph on a downhill though. The ride seemed nice and the bike feels more stable than the old bike. I don't know if rider weight plays a part in it (140 lb rider) but when mounted on workstand that's when I notice the said issues

Anyway, thanks for your input. :thumbsup:


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

The first problem may not be with the skewers themselves, but with the rear hub axles. If they extend out beyond the outside of the rear dropouts, no amount of tightening will correct the play, because you're tightening the skewer against the axle, rather than the frame. That's just one possibility. The other is that it's the combination of skewer/ frame and wheel design. That leaves you the option of attempting to narrowing down the cause (and if possible, correcting) or just going with a different skewer. FWIW, IME the internal cam'd skewers are far better than the designs with external cams.

If I'm following your correctly, your second problem is simply that the rear brake pads aren't centered. I'm not familiar with SRAM Red's, but many brakes have a centering screw. In lieu of that, you could either return the bike to the LBS for adjustment or gently prod the brake assembly in the direction that pushes the pad furthest from the rim towards it until centered. If this doesn't correct the problem, the brakes themselves may need maintenance/ adjustment.


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## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

I'll take the bike back to the lbs. They should have a tool to check the rear alignment.

The Token skewers are open cam skewer design. They worked fine on my old frame. I have not tried a second set of wheels in order to rule out the hubs/axles as being a problem but again the wheelset is new and worked fine on the old frame

Also, I noticed that when clamping down the skewer, the rear derailleur and hangar move slightly. If the rear dropouts are the issue, is it possible to have them straightened? 

Does anyone else with a current model SL3 have similar clamping issues with lightweight 40 gram open-skewers; KCNC, Zipp, Token are some brands?

Thanks again.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

rcjunkie3000 said:


> I'll take the bike back to the lbs. They should have a tool to check the rear alignment.
> 
> The Token skewers are open cam skewer design. They worked fine on my old frame. I have not tried a second set of wheels in order to rule out the hubs/axles as being a problem but again the wheelset is new and worked fine on the old frame
> 
> ...


This being a CF frame, I don't see alignment as being the issue. As far as what works fine on one bike and not another, that happens. The axle issue is very easy to diagnose by removing the skewer (keeping the wheel in place) and checking to see if the axle protrudes beyond the outside of the rear dropouts. If it does, clamping force is applied to IT rather than the rear dropout.

Your rear dropouts are bonded in place, so any issues with them would require removing and rebonding them. Anything's possible, but I don't see this as probable. And since other skewers work, I see this as more of a skewer/ frame combo problem.


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## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

Thanks PJ352 for the input. I will check to see if the axles protrude beyond the rear dropouts. That could explain the wobble. I will check tonight when I get back.


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## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

*double post - cached


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## purdyd (Jun 18, 2010)

rcjunkie3000 said:


> Thanks PJ352 for the input. I will check to see if the axles protrude beyond the rear dropouts. That could explain the wobble. I will check tonight when I get back.


I agree with PJ352, definitely check that out as the non drive size dropout is pretty thin

i had the same problem, my dura ace skewers worked fine but i could never get the KNC skewers tight 

i finally figured out what the problem was, as PJ352 mentioned, the axelewas sticking slightly out and dura ace skewers have more concave on the locking knot and was fine 

you might try removing the spring, that might be enough to allow it to clamp down properly


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## rcjunkie3000 (Sep 5, 2009)

:thumbsup: Confirmed! The rear axle of the Zipp303 does protrude past the non-driveside dropout. It is noticeable when the skewer is removed. 

Thanks PJ352 for pointing it out and purdyd for confirming the issue. That rear non-drive dropout IS thin. 

I removed the spring and now there is enough room in the non-drive part of the Token skewer to cover that little bit of axle. It's clamped down pretty good and there no more wobble.

I'll work on centering my rear brake caliper now.  

THANK YOU again! :thumbsup: Now to ride the heck out of this bike!


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## -dustin (Jan 11, 2009)

hm...going to have to re-check this. I've gone back to D/A skewers on my SL3 Sworks after the Zipp aero skewers (2 pair) started allowing the rear wheel to slip in hard turns. Unnerving feeling. With both sets of skewers, they'd work when new, but after a couple months, slipping would occur.


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## PJ352 (Dec 5, 2007)

You're welcome - and happy riding!! :thumbsup:


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## purdyd (Jun 18, 2010)

-dustin said:


> hm...going to have to re-check this. I've gone back to D/A skewers on my SL3 Sworks after the Zipp aero skewers (2 pair) started allowing the rear wheel to slip in hard turns. Unnerving feeling. With both sets of skewers, they'd work when new, but after a couple months, slipping would occur.


i have the zipp aero skewers too and until i removed the spring on the non drive side, they would not clamp down properly on the rear wheel, again because the axle slightly protrudes

at least with my dura ace hubs, the front has not been a problem but you had better check the length of the front axles and see if they protrude

the D/A skewers seem more tolerant in this regard as they have a thicker edge


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## roadie01 (Apr 13, 2010)

I'm having a hard time with the "remove the spring" method to correct a bigger issue. 

If the axle protrudes beyond the dropout there are two potential problems: a) The axle is too long and needs to be shortened. b) The axle is not centered in the hub. 
As a ex LBS mechanic I used to see axles come in all the time where someone rebuilt their hub but failed to measure the distance the axle protruded from the lock nut insuring both the right and left sides where equal. 

If we assume that your axle is the correct length compare the amount of axle that is exposed and how much axle fits in the dropout on both sides. If one side has more axle in the drop out than the other your axle is not centered properly. 

The issue with the rear brake "pushing" the wheel from one side or the other could be two separate issues. It is possible that the wheel is not centered in the frame. Have the LBS check the dish of the wheel then the alignment of the wheel in the frame. If your wheel dish is spot on but the wheel sits in the frame to one side or the other there maybe a slight frame alignment issue. Not to panic though if the frame tracks straight down the road simply re-dish the wheel for that frame so that the distance is equal between the seat stays and the brake track. 
As previously stated the brake "pushing" the rim to one side could be a simple brake that is not centered. It is important that the brake be centered and pull equally from both sides. Pull the brake until one side or the other touches the rim but does not apply pressure. If one side touches before the other your brake is not centered. 
To center the brake first make sure the fixing bolt is torqued to the correct spec. then use a flat wrench to center the pads. Repeat the brake squeeze test to see if one side or the other touches the rim before the other, if it does tighten or loosen the centering spring adjuster accordingly.


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