# So many wheels!



## Geoffersonspin (Feb 12, 2010)

Sigh... with cycling it's always something, isn't it? You always need to upgrade something. So here I am with a little money burning a hole in my pocket and, of course, the best thing I can do with that money is to buy some new wheels.

Currently, I'm riding a Orbea Onix with Ultegra SL Compact and Shimano RS20 wheels. I'm 6'4" and under 160lbs. so I'm not a heavy guy. I want a wheel that is a big improvement over the RS20s (worth the investment) and will be a durable, use everyday, and use for centuries kind of wheel. I don't race and don't plan on it, but I still want a high performing wheel. I'm probably looking for something in the $750-$1000 range. There is some room for budging on that depending on what is out there. So, any recommendations? I've done some searching and it's just hard to narrow it down with what will work good for me. Oh, and I live in Oklahoma so we generally have more wind than hills to contend with, but I consider myself a decent climber so I want a wheel that won't hold me back from hammering it on the hills. Last requirements: clinchers and prefer an aluminum braking surface I think.

Anyway, I've run the searches and don't the research and I have a list that includes the (I'm not specific on what all models will be best either):

Mavic Ksyriums
Easton EA90 Aero
Shimano Dura-Ace 7850-24 
Zipp 101s (although kinda out of my price range)

That's about all I've come up with so far. Here I am, throwing myself at the mercy of the RBR experts. Give me your sage advice.


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## tconrady (May 1, 2007)

I think you'd be well served with some customs built wheels. You should be able to get something on the low end of your budget that'd perform as well or better than those others.

Edit: Call and talk to a couple of custom builders. They'll help taylor something for your exacting needs and wants.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

There's nothing special about any of those wheels that can't be bettered by custom handbuilts in any area except hype and fancy decals.


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## cdhbrad (Feb 18, 2003)

I would agree with the other two responses. The factory wheels you listed are popular, but you can do better with a custom set. If you want something with an alloy braking surface and good aero characteristics in wind, etc., consider a custom set build around a Kinlin XR300. I have those types of wheels on two of my bikes and and a third set I had been using until I put some Zipp 303 tubulars on the bike they hade been on just to have something different to ride sometime. I'm in FL and ride these wheels on fast flat rides, what hills we have in state, and have taken them to ride in the mountains of CO and the 3State 3 Mountain ride I do in Chattanooga each year. 

The set I use in the mountains is about 1450gr and you could do better than that with choosing a little lighter hubs than the White Industries H1 set mine are built around. I didn't check the weights of all the wheelsets you listed, but expect that mine are as light or lighter than any of those factory wheels. A bonus is that they use standard j bend spokes you can find in almost any LBS if you need service.


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## valleycyclist (Nov 1, 2009)

The SRAM S30 AL Sprint looks similar and less expensive than the Zipp 101, and I know where you can get them...


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## penn_rider (Jul 11, 2009)

valleycyclist said:


> The SRAM S30 AL Sprint looks similar and less expensive than the Zipp 101, and I know where you can get them...


Even the Sram S30 AL Race is less expensive than the 101. But, I would still say that a custom built would be lighter in most cases and stronger... This is my opinion. I looked at both those wheels, but custom built was a better value..

I would like to see a good review of the SRAM wheels but they are being ignored. Not a good sign...


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## Gearhead65 (Jan 23, 2010)

May check out some of the SOUL options. There's a 3-4 week waiting list, but good prices and quality wheels.

http://www.bikesoul.com/2009/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=25&Itemid=36

I did alot of research and decided my average speed (18-20mph) and hills in my area didn't justify deep carbon wheels. Went with a S2.0 wheelset with ceramic bearings for a lightweight option. Using veloplugs, GP4000S, Lunarlights, SRAM Red cassette, and KCNC skewers to round out.


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## Gearhead65 (Jan 23, 2010)

Geoffersonspin said:


> Sigh... with cycling it's always something, isn't it? You always need to upgrade something.


Yeah...I feel your pain. :cryin:


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## lucer0 (Apr 13, 2007)

I think something from Williams or Rol would be better suited to you as far as a nice clincher - there's really no reason to spend $1000 on 101s or Ksyrium SLs when you can get very raceable clinchers in the same weight range for $600.


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## waterobert (Nov 24, 2009)

I got Shimano Dura-Ace 7850 carbon laminate from chain reaction cycles and paid for them $652. I love those wheels, my average speed went up by 1 mph (tested on 20 miles ride). I had to wait few weeks to get them from Ireland but those are great wheels at the great price!


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## valleycyclist (Nov 1, 2009)

I think SRAM aquired Zipp, so the 101 rims are probably the same as the S30 AL rims. But I don't know for sure.

The advantage of getting a handbuilt wheelset instead of this one is the freedom to choose all of the components, and most likely the build will be better quality since the builder will have more time to build the wheels than the people hand-building for mass production.



penn_rider said:


> Even the Sram S30 AL Race is less expensive than the 101. But, I would still say that a custom built would be lighter in most cases and stronger... This is my opinion. I looked at both those wheels, but custom built was a better value..
> 
> I would like to see a good review of the SRAM wheels but they are being ignored. Not a good sign...


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## morgan1819 (Nov 22, 2005)

Definitely worth putting in some effort and finding a local builder. If you don't have anything local, there are some great suggestions above, as well as some forum regulars.....

http://www.zencyclery.com/

http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/ (Blackset Race Ten)




Rim choice should be something like the Kinlin XR -270 or XR -300.

Spokes: DT Swiss comps.

Hubs: Novatec F482SB





If you want buy a name brand off of the shelf, the Easton EA90 SLX and Shimano Dura Ace 7850 are great choices.


Throw on some Vittoria Corsa Evo CX or Veloflex Black tires and some Michelin latex tubes, and you will have a nice, noticeable upgrade.


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## ghost6 (Sep 4, 2009)

I'd go custom. Zen Cyclery built a set for me and they're great. Kinlin 270 rims, sapim cxrays, Elf & White Industries hubs. Just under 1400 grams and super stiff / durable for me.


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## Zen Cyclery (Mar 10, 2009)

It makes me happy to see some positive feedback. Going with a custom builder is going to ensure that you get exactly what you want. If you were to purchase any of the wheels above you would be buying something that would work but is designed for the masses. You could get a set of XR270s with White Industries hubs for a very comparable price ($655). Where you would really see the difference is in durability, spoke uniformity, and most importantly great post-purchase service. If you have any issues with wheels from Zipp, Easton, etc you would have to hop in line for warranty/crash replacement claims. If you have issues with a custom build you could have your wheels serviced within a week so that you could be back out on the road ASAP. We know how much it sucks to be stuck on the couch because of long turnaround times. We will accommodate so that you have no excuses to not be riding your bike. The choice is obvious.


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## maximum7 (Apr 24, 2008)

Even though I am "anti" custom wheels, I am considering something from these guys. 
http://www.revolutionwheelworks.com/Wheels.html

That said, if you buy a set of "factory wheels" from a good shop. I'm sure they'll take care of you. They'll probably give you a loaner wheel so you don't wait weeks while you have to ship a wheel back and forth somewhere, and go to bat for you, if the need arose.


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## Weav (Jun 21, 2009)

I vote for the Dura Ace 7850 SL Tubeless/clincher or something custom from Zen.


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## been200mph (May 28, 2004)

waterobert said:


> I got Shimano Dura-Ace 7850 carbon laminate from chain reaction cycles and paid for them $652. I love those wheels, my average speed went up by 1 mph (tested on 20 miles ride). I had to wait few weeks to get them from Ireland but those are great wheels at the great price!


I'm waiting now for mine to arrive. Grabbed them for just over $700. Current wheelset is 1323g and is a custom-built AC CR-350 wheelset. Like them but after tons of reading and trying out a pair I went for the DA carbon clinchers. Should have even better ride quality and not much more weight. If I stick with them I'll just end up keeping the AC's for a backup pair unless I sell them.


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## fazzman (Mar 12, 2008)

101s are a nice wheel. One of the guys in the ride i attend rides them, better then his S60 so he claims. Mavics have a junk freehub body. I dont see how people still buy those things. For me it will be dura ace or the soul 3.0sl


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## veloci1 (Nov 29, 2005)

I have had Bora, Fulcrum Speed light, 404 zipps and other boutique wheels and i will tell you that i wish i had saved all the $ i spent realizing that Custom wheels are the only way to go. read my signature and you will see what i have in the way of wheels. those and any of the custom builders in this forum will be the best money you will ever invest.


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## SROC3 (Jul 20, 2009)

Custom wheelset would be the way to go. Just be sure to pick a good builder who has a solid reputation. You'll get good value and good support.


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## HazemBata (May 20, 2004)

Get a pair of used carbon tubulars off ebay. Best bang for the buck.


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## tsutaoka (Mar 4, 2005)

Geoffersonspin said:


> Sigh... with cycling it's always something, isn't it? You always need to upgrade something. So here I am with a little money burning a hole in my pocket and, of course, the best thing I can do with that money is to buy some new wheels.
> 
> Currently, I'm riding a Orbea Onix with Ultegra SL Compact and Shimano RS20 wheels. I'm 6'4" and under 160lbs. so I'm not a heavy guy. I want a wheel that is a big improvement over the RS20s (worth the investment) and will be a durable, use everyday, and use for centuries kind of wheel. I don't race and don't plan on it, but I still want a high performing wheel. I'm probably looking for something in the $750-$1000 range. There is some room for budging on that depending on what is out there. So, any recommendations? I've done some searching and it's just hard to narrow it down with what will work good for me. Oh, and I live in Oklahoma so we generally have more wind than hills to contend with, but I consider myself a decent climber so I want a wheel that won't hold me back from hammering it on the hills. Last requirements: clinchers and prefer an aluminum braking surface I think.
> 
> ...


I recently went through this analysis for new daily trainers/bad weather racing wheels...

For sub, $1000 wheels there are many great choices. I looked at: 

•	kinlin/white with cx-ray spokes (http://www.zencyclery.com/products/custom-wheelsets/katmandu/), 

•	ligero model 1 (http://www.ligerowheels.com/wheels/wheels.html)

•	soul s3 sl (http://www.bikesoul.com/2009/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3&Itemid=11)

•	williams system 30 (http://www.williamscycling.com/sys30/sys30.html) 


My criteria were simple: alloy mid profile rims, durable & maintainable hubs, lightweight, and stiff (in that order)

disclosure: I already own edge 45 clinchers + alchemy elf/orc hubs (http://www.zencyclery.com/products/custom-wheelsets/nirvana/) and love them. Austin is a good builder and nice guy.

With all that said, I actually contacted soul about the s3 sl. for $470, you get 1400 gm mid-profile (31mm) with bladed spokes and high flanged hubs shipped to your door...it sounded great + reviews on this forum and others were positive. I emailed as instructed...but the wait list was too long for my taste. 

I ended up flip/flopping my decision by purchasing local. I purchased a set of custom built kinlin/white/cx-rays from a local bay area builder. I almost went with kinlin/alchemy/cx-rays from Austin at Zen (because I really love the alchemy hubs) but I thought I should support my local shop this round.

Anyways...that's my analysis/decision. I hope it helps!


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

*Advise required on purchase of cervelo r3 2011 closeout or 2012 team or look 595*

Hi its the case of over research I am a little jittery about the BB issue of cracks that dont if it is solved in the 2011 model onwards and also the fact the bbright support by other manufacturers other than rotor will they be always available in years to come if cervelo discontinues the asymmetrical BB design then getting replacements for current ones is dicy ...any better suggestion in the same price bracket $3500 have a s1 and just love it.


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## Dcmkx2000 (Mar 18, 2010)

Soul s3.0 xperts.....super light, less than 1500 grams I think, mid profile, stiff enough for me (160lbs and six foot), Sean had some built and I only waited about a week....less I think.....and they were $520 with plugs instead of rim tape...and they don't use any proprietary parts so any good lbs should have spokes and stuff....plus I am pretty sure Sean has a guy in the U.S. for warranty work or problems


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

RAFIUDEEN, I would think regardless if Cervelo continue or discontinue BBright in their future models, they would still back and service any previous model of R3 with BB. With that said, I seriously don't think Cervelo would stop making future bikes with BBright. They have invested a lot of research, time and marketing to just pull the plug on it. They might refine it for future models

DCmkx2000, coincident you brought up the Soul S3. I was just looking at it earlier tonight. I am considering the SL version vs Boyd Rouleur. Thoughts? 

Btw, what are plugs? I use rim tape on my current wheelset.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

sorry Road runner Iam new and wanted to create a separate thread but mixed it up with this one goofed up anyways th good news is I have put in at leat 5 to 6 hours research in he last 5 days on wheels conclusion is buy the boyd period their is very close difference between the two but during my reading the extensive posts of both owners found byod owners swearing more about the hubs than the soul owners at this given moment i am exchanging mails with them and soul to figure out where to put my money soul is closer to my country so...boyd vitesse should be your choice since its rim depth is 28 mm and other than their own hubs the best materials in the market is used where as hubs r concerned current owners love it.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

Ok just to give u some more depth williams system 30 is also equally good wheels could consider either boyd or williams could not go wrong they use hybrid ceramic bearings CYCLE News web site found them to be one of the fastest alloy wheels around when tested ....another things which i wonder is why dont these guys invite cycling magazines to come and road test their wheels and give a opinion 
Ok i am also pretty close in choosing ROL race sl wheels but have learnt that their spokes r propritory and if any thing goes wrong ur local lbs cannot help u got to go to them for supplies etc that is a handicap ....what if my spokes break in the middle of a 1000 kms ride in the middle of no where so that's the only reason keeping brands at bay .....hope i have made it easier for you to zero inn also please could u show me how to create a separate thread


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

last but not the least soul wheels get compromised if it subjected to rain and other wet conditions have yet to deliberate and understand that ..have requested boyd on clear instructions on that awaiting reply my current mavic wheels r fine even in the rains donno what is the fusss about ....


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

and one more stuff guys the boyd clincher is 23 mm width where as soul is 19 mm i guess one has to buy a border width which could be used with low psi on bad road for better riding 
reasons for leaning towards boyds 
1> using spaim cx ray spokes which r also used in zipp wheels
2>the width 23 mm being good for bad roads
3>velocity rims against kinkin rims both r equally good 
but one has to consider even shipping souls r very reasonable in price and r incl shipping so its a personal call really


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

RAFIUDEEN, first thing) I'm looking at the Rouleur, which is 30mm rim height, not Vitesse since I want a more aero rim. Second thing) Click on the forum front page to start a new thread.


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

RAFIUDEEN said:


> and one more stuff guys the boyd clincher is 23 mm width where as soul is 19 mm i guess one has to buy a border width which could be used with low psi on bad road for better riding
> reasons for leaning towards boyds
> 1> using spaim cx ray spokes which r also used in zipp wheels
> 2>the width 23 mm being good for bad roads
> ...


The price difference is one of the reason why I'm considering it, along with weight. S3.0SL is 1400grams at $500.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

during my reading of the posts one of the owners of the wheel set regretted replacing his soul xpert with sl even though its lighter the expert had very good feel unlike the sl so please consider that ..i guess u have helped me to take a call will go with soul 3.0 xpert place the order by Wednesday do keep me informed what u choose


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

Will do as I'm still considering the Boyd Rouleur, Sram A30SL, Fulcrum Racing 3 and Soul Expert. As this thread said, 'So Many Wheels.'


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

boyd rouler realistic option but the other two please consider 1> the price point and secondly their replacements system or warranty procedure and their proprietary wheel parts if any if yes then thats a pain to get those part serviced under warranty


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

I think the Sram and Fulcrum spokes are common spokes, not like Mavic's. Prices are very close to one another depending on which website I use to purchase the Sram and Fulcrum.


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## coachboyd (Jan 13, 2008)

RoadrunnerLXXI said:


> I'm looking at the Rouleur, which is 30mm rim height, not Vitesse since I want a more aero rim.


Even though the Vitesse is 2mm shallower than the Rouleur it will be a more aerodynamic rim due to the wider 23mm rim profile on the Vitesse. There is a better airflow over the tire onto the rim which will help with the aerodynamics. The Sapim CX Ray spokes also help with aerodynamics compared to the double butted spokes on the Rouleur.


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

Rafidotheyuseperiodswhereyouarefrom?


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

From where i come i definitely know we use at least spaces in between letters !!!! hahaha thanks got your point MR.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

OK !!!! I got an answer from Boyd and Soul yesterday.
Detailed explanation to the questions i had requested answers for, In the case of Soul the rims r sourced from taiwan and the hubs r their own brand at present they have only 19 mm wide wheels as 23 mm would be actually good for aerodynamics .

The Boyd do provide with 23 mm rims but unknown origin from taiwan, the spokes r CX rays that's fine me with me and their hubs are Enduro sealed bearing one ..... rave reviews about the hubs by users,no long time say 3 years plus feedback by actual users.

So for me the ideal set up with my kinda knowledge would be cx rays spokes with WI OR Cris king OR Alchemy hubs with 23 mm width rims ,along with Stan's NoTubes ZTR Alpha 340 Rim or kinlin 300 mm or velocity a 23 clincher or Velocity Deep V Clincher Rim with 2 x lacing and 20 fr ,24 bk spokes brass nipples only.

(alchemy hubs with kinlin 300 mm and cx rays spokes)-leaning towards

so both the mentioned brands above r cutting conners hubs and one is with rims and the other with spokes ,cant stress with more emphasis that what they are using might be with the best components, still they r not widely tested.

your opinions ?


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## coachboyd (Jan 13, 2008)

We actually do have the ability to use an Alchemy hub set on any of our build. It and the power tap are the upgrade options we have available.


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## mimason (Oct 7, 2006)

RAFIUDEEN said:


> OK !!!! I got an answer from Boyd and Soul yesterday.
> Detailed explanation to the questions i had requested answers for, In the case of Soul the rims r sourced from taiwan and the hubs r their own brand at present they have only 19 mm wide wheels as 23 mm would be actually good for aerodynamics .
> 
> The Boyd do provide with 23 mm rims but unknown origin from taiwan, the spokes r CX rays that's fine me with me and their hubs are Enduro sealed bearing one ..... rave reviews about the hubs by users,no long time say 3 years plus feedback by actual users.
> ...


I think you will end up with a nice wheelset. I'll wager a guess and say that the new 23 wide 28 tall rims are more aero than everything else you mentioned...even the Kinlin 300s. They are purported to be Kinlin made, and I actually have a set with the Alchemy hubs. I can't think of another rim I would prefer at this time unless you also consider the seamless HED C2.


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## coachboyd (Jan 13, 2008)

It's an extra 500 for the set with the Alchemy hubs.


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## RoadrunnerLXXI (Jun 3, 2012)

Sounds like inconclusive. I am skeptical about custom hubs(Boyd and Soul) vs proven brand names(Sram, Shimano, King, etc) Do Boyd build wheels with your own hubs you provide to them?


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## xtekian (May 17, 2012)

coachboyd said:


> We actually do have the ability to use an Alchemy hub set on any of our build. It and the power tap are the upgrade options we have available.


Interesting! How much more are the Vitesses with the Alchemy Hubs? Thanks


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

they just answered me saying(on this tread itself) can use alchemy hubs and the best part is their rim depth is 28mm,which means u might actually get a better aerodynamics with 28 depth mm and 23 mm width wheels....then again the rim quality is un-known.
With a hawk eye analyses Boyds has a better set up and expensive compared to soul's set up that is good and reasonable with shipping.
All wheel manufactures must stress the importance of getting very competitive rates for shipping since commercial contracts work up to 3.5 dollars per kg or even lesser (or volumetrically converted into kgs).
Got to keep chipping at the rates of shipping ,one of the bike store in the USA offered to ship me the entire cycle in about 120 dollars amazing compared wheel shipping charges of 80 dollars. Since the buyer has then again also pay customs for the same.


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## coachboyd (Jan 13, 2008)

I believe you have been emailing Nicole, shoot us an email and we can go over all the options with the different hubs. It's easier than on here and I don't want this to seem like we're advertising on the forums.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

Ok Byod thanks for being flexible and give me a price in fact all readers of this tread the price for your rims and the following 
Alchemy Elf Red hub l 20f/RadialX using CXRay-Black spokes and SAPIM-12mm-Brass black nipples
Rear=Alchemy ORC Red hub with Shimano freehub body rim 24r/2X using CXRay-Black spokes on the Drive Side and laced 2X using CXRay-Black spokes on the Non-Drive Side and SAPIM -12mm-Brass-black nipples (ideally green nipples but brass does not have color options and alloy nipples are not that strong)


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

too complicated don't have time for all this parts shopping ???
Buy a ROL Race sl wheel set for 625 plus shipping and forget the rest


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

Byod/sSoul/Williams best bet for me after interacting with all of them really feel Boyd works.
Forgot to mention that they have their name engraved onto the wheels how cool is that compared to pealing decals.

Psimet after shooting the same mails for three consecutive days got an answer which is quiet compelling but a little doubtful about response time.

Over analysis done by me since I am going to get next week a nice shinning Cervelo R5 with lousy fulcrum 7 wheels......retailer does not want to swap it shows have bad the wheels are lol

Thanks to a member from this very site for giving me a connect with a Cervelo store who's offer was too tempting I love you bloggers for give free access to any one who seeks and I will do the same .

Man getting the best bang for your buck is so time consuming !!!


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## Psimet (Nov 6, 2008)

RAFIUDEEN said:


> Psimet after shooting the same mails for three consecutive days got an answer which is quiet compelling but a little doubtful about response time.


I'm not a "2 day" kind of builder. Everything I build is full custom. I offer a lot so I have to custom order a lot specifically for each order. It takes time to get parts.

The difference is a quality set made by hand to specifically to fit you.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

Right agreed u r indeed well respected in the custom built circuit i respect that .......i am so inclined to get get a wheel set built by you once i can solve the courier issue.but SIR respectfully the mail reply should be a little faster


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## Psimet (Nov 6, 2008)

Now - see...we had a thread about this over on another forum. You sent inquiries on the 9th while I was out of town. I replied initially on the 11th. You replied back on the 13th. I replied back on the 14th.

I then got 5 emails from you today on the 15th - to which I have replied twice - today.

I am a 1 man shop. I build every wheel, order every spoke, do every quote, etc. I don't have a team or employees to answer emails - as none of them would be able to answer the questions that need to be answered.

I am a full custom builder. Not a catalog pre-built shop. We don't dial up our options, put it in a cart, and check out online with immediate shipping. There are plenty of places that do that. That isn't my thing...yet.

Patience, therefore, is a virtue.


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## RAFIUDEEN (Apr 6, 2012)

agreed good to know and sorry to be pushy was too excited !!!


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