# CXP33 or Open Pro?



## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

Hello wheel guru's....

Lots of searching & reading old threads has brought me up to speed on what will work for me, so I figured I'd ask one last pointed question before ordering up a new set of wheels.

*What, if anything, will the CXP33 get me over the Open Pro rims?*

I'm going to be ordering from BWW, Ultegra Hubs, Black spokes & red alloy nipples.

No, I won't spend the extra $$ for Dura Ace. I'm an amateur hack with no visions of racing on the road.

The stats:

6'2", 215 lbs, Masher, Ability to destroy inexpensive MTB cranks.

2001 C'dale CAAD4, 105 9 Speed Group (Ultegra later this year?)
Size 58

Riding style - Slow & steady. Training for charity rides, fitness, fun, basically JRA. 

Weekly mileage - 100 ish, will ramp up to around 150 prior to this years MS150 then taper back down to about 75.

Location - Houston, TX (mostly lat, plenty of wind). Sometimes ride in the DFW or Austin area which has more in the way of hills.

Roads - Chip seal, light gravel spots.

Racing - No. Maybe some cyclocross or MTB if I ever get my knee fixed (not for this bike or wheelset though).


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## David Loving (Jun 13, 2008)

A little more heft, and strength. Either will work for you. If you want a little more strength, although they're both strong rims, get the cxp33. I have Open Pro, and I would not get anything else but one of the mavic rims. You can't go wrong; get the one you like the best.


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## Mashmaniac (Jun 21, 2004)

I have two sets of CXP-33 wheels. Stronger more durable rim than OP. Some weight disadvantage.


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## NealH (May 2, 2004)

Another vote for CXP-33. A great trouble free wheel, and it doesn't what you weight.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

NUTT said:


> I'm going to be ordering from BWW, Ultegra Hubs, Black spokes & red alloy nipples. No, I won't spend the extra $$ for Dura Ace. I'm an amateur hack with no visions of racing on the road.


I've got both DA and Ultegras from BWW and the DA hubs are much nicer both inside and outside. I don't race either. It comes down to their cost for you I guess.

Chris at BWW could advise you on the rim decision.


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## smartyiak (Sep 28, 2005)

*Cxp-33*

I have two sets of CXPs. One is about 7yrs old and laced to Campy Veloce (36Fx2, 36R x3) and the other is a 3yr old Record (28Fx2, 32Rx3). Both are BOMBPROOF. I am 225#. Other than trueing them 1x a year and routine maintenance, I've had no problems.

Never owned OPs though.

-Smarty


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## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

Mike T. said:


> I've got both DA and Ultegras from BWW and the DA hubs are much nicer both inside and outside. I don't race either. It comes down to their cost for you I guess.
> 
> Chris at BWW could advise you on the rim decision.


I did email Chris & he said they were basically the same in strength but that the CXP was a little heavier. He said both were great choices and suggested the Open Pros based on the weight savings.

However, I've had so many people recommend the CXP's for my weight & riding style that I'm going to go with them over the OP's.

I'm going with the Ultegra hubs over the DA's purely based on the cost.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

NUTT said:


> I did email Chris & he said they were basically the same in strength but that the CXP was a little heavier. He said both were great choices and suggested the Open Pros based on the weight savings.
> 
> However, I've had so many people recommend the CXP's for my weight & riding style that I'm going to go with them over the OP's.
> 
> I'm going with the Ultegra hubs over the DA's purely based on the cost.


I've ridden both and the CXPs are stiffer all things considered equal IMO. Maybe not stronger per-se, but definitely stiffer.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

With eyes wide open, having all the info we make our best decision. Chris @ BWW is great to deal with, makes a good wheel and the price is right. I've got four sets from him around here.


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

since you mentioned spokes and nipples.....

i was recommended to get *brass* spoke nipples, as the alloy nipples tend to corrode and last a lot less than brass. also go with plain unpainted stainless steel spokes, my riding buddy says black spokes often make sounds (I dont know why and how, just passing his experiences).


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

acid_rider said:


> i was recommended to get *brass* spoke nipples, as the alloy nipples tend to corrode and last a lot less than brass.


My 10-15 years of experience with aluminum nipples doesn't agree.



> also go with plain unpainted stainless steel spokes, my riding buddy says black spokes often make sounds (I dont know why and how, just passing his experiences).


Your buddy might be right but I can't imagine why.


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

I'm a little lighter than you, and I've had good luck with Open Pros, but the rear will eventually crack between the eyelets. I don't track mileage, but I'd guess you might start seeing cracks in 6-10k miles. At that point, you can just swap in a new rim without changing the spokes (I never break DT spokes, unless I've thrown a chain into them). I usually end up bending them in a crash or by hitting a rock or something before that, anyway. The Open Pros aren't real stiff, you'll need a tight build. 

I just decided to try something stronger, and would've gone with the CXPs, but I found a good deal on some Velocity Deep V rims (plus I liked the color). No experience riding them, yet, but the eyeletted Open Pros were easier to build. I would've tried the lighter Velocity Fusions, but couldn't get them.

I'm using DT Revolutions (2.0/1.5) with aluminum nipples up front, and Competitions (2.0/1.8) with brass nipples in the rear. To save a little more weight, you could also use the Revolutions and aluminum nipples on the left rear, but I'd stick with brass on the right rear.


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

Mike T. said:


> My 10-15 years of experience with aluminum nipples doesn't agree.


Are you heavy and ride poor roads, so eventually you have to tweak your rear wheel? Do you ride where they salt the roads? If so, I think brass is the way to go.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

fallzboater said:


> I'm a little lighter than you, and I've had good luck with Open Pros, but the rear will eventually crack between the eyelets.


So will the CXP33.


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## QQUIKM3 (Apr 20, 2008)

*Wheels I've built. . .*



fallzboater said:


> Are you heavy and ride poor roads, so eventually you have to tweak your rear wheel? Do you ride where they salt the roads? If so, I think brass is the way to go.


I always use brass nips on the rear drive side wheel, and aluminum non-drive rear and all around up front.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

QQUIKM3 said:


> I always use brass nips on the rear drive side wheel, and aluminum non-drive rear and all around up front.


Have you had drive side aluminum nipples break?


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## QQUIKM3 (Apr 20, 2008)

*Yes. .*



Mike T. said:


> Have you had drive side aluminum nipples break?


I've had them split. Yes, I use a tensiometer. Using aluminum on drive-side rear is stupid wight savings, for there is too much to lose for so little gain.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

QQUIKM3 said:


> I've had them split. Yes, I use a tensiometer. Using aluminum on drive-side rear is stupid wight savings, for there is too much to lose for so little gain.


Really? 12-15 years here on nothing *but* alum nipples (including DS) on about 6-8 sets of wheels on my mtb, road, cx and track bikes. All home built wheels. No tensiometer. One busted nipple years ago - head popped off, my fault, spoke was a bit too short. I weigh 200lbs and ride weekly on the world's steepest/shortest track (most g-force) - 50 degrees, 135 metres. Sorry for being stupid. :blush2:


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## Tequila Joe (May 30, 2004)

Based on your size and cycling asperations, I'd go CXP 33.


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

*my experience is the opposite*



Mike T. said:


> My 10-15 years of experience with aluminum nipples doesn't agree.
> 
> 
> Your buddy might be right but I can't imagine why.


my alloy nipple on rear wheel snapped off after ~18,000km. I ride 95% in dry conditions and weigh 69-70kg. the wheel rim is dt swiss rr 1.1, 32 spokes. when we opened up the rim we saw many spoke nippled badly corroded, on verge of braking off. this is why for training and commuting i would much prefer brass nipples.


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## Maximus_XXIV (Nov 10, 2008)

fallzboater said:


> Are you heavy and ride poor roads, so eventually you have to tweak your rear wheel? Do you ride where they salt the roads? If so, I think brass is the way to go.


I ride in SoCal. I have had alloy nipples corrode as well as break at the rim. I also have had every OP rim I have owned crack between the spoke holes. I stay away from Mavic now. Of the 2, I would go with the 33s with brass all around. A few ounces is no big deal when JRA.


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## TLud (Mar 19, 2008)

Bocephus Jones II said:


> I've ridden both and the CXPs are stiffer all things considered equal IMO. Maybe not stronger per-se, but definitely stiffer.


Well said. I'm the same height and weight. The OP's are certainly durable enough, but the CXP33's give you noticeably better stiffness.


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

QQUIKM3 said:


> I always use brass nips on the rear drive side wheel, and aluminum non-drive rear and all around up front.


Not a bad plan. I use aluminum up front, since with a tight wheel I should never have to touch them. I use brass on both sides in the rear, since there's a good chance I'll eventually have to fiddle with it due to pothole/rock damage, even with a good build. The left rear spokes are looser than the front spokes, though, so you shouldn't have a problem with aluminum, there. I also think using Revolutions or other real thin spokes on the left rear is a good idea, since more stretch means they're less likely to loosen. I like 2.0/1.8 Champions on the drive side, more likely to resist damage due to a thrown chain. 

It's especially important to lube the threads with aluminum nipples or with Revolutions (to reduce wind-up). 

-David


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## acid_rider (Nov 23, 2004)

re alloy/brass nipple, IMO, IME 

the alloy nipples will corrode the same way in front or rear wheel and on drive and non-drive side so playing games with alternating bass with alloy on drive/non-drive side is just fooling yourself, IMO. and all the weight you are saving is perhaps 30 grams.


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## fallzboater (Feb 16, 2003)

acid_rider said:


> re alloy/brass nipple, IMO, IME
> 
> the alloy nipples will corrode the same way in front or rear wheel and on drive and non-drive side so playing games with alternating bass with alloy on drive/non-drive side is just fooling yourself, IMO. and all the weight you are saving is perhaps 30 grams.


True, but if you're going to try to shave some weight, out at the rim is a good place to do it. Front wheels shouldn't need any tweaking after the first ride or two (in case a couple of spokes unwind), unless the rim is bent in a crash badly enough that it'll probably need replacing anyway. The non drive rear spokes are the loosest in the wheelset, so you're less likely to round those nipples off, even if there is some corrosion or lack of lube on the threads.


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## Peanya (Jun 12, 2008)

What part of Houston? And got a link to BWW? I think I plan on doing similar in the future myself.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

Peanya said:


> got a link to BWW?


Click Partner Stores up top o' this page.


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## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

Thanks for all the input.

Wheels ordered from Bicycle Wheel Warehouse 2/3/09.

Mavic CXP 33
Ultegra Hub, 32 hole
DT Swiss Competition 2.0/1.8/2.0 spokes, laced 3 cross
DT Swiss Brass Nipples

Now I just need to figure out which 9-speed cassette to toss on them & maybe get a new chain.



Peanya said:


> What part of Houston? And got a link to BWW? I think I plan on doing similar in the future myself.


Galleria area. I ride the Memorial Park loop for an hour or 2 a half dozen nights a month.


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## baker921 (Jul 20, 2007)

Good choice BUT you must get a new chain with a new cassette. An old chain will work fine for a short while but will eat your expensive new cassette very quickly.


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

NUTT said:


> Wheels ordered from Bicycle Wheel Warehouse 2/3/09.
> Mavic CXP 33
> Ultegra Hub, 32 hole
> DT Swiss Competition 2.0/1.8/2.0 spokes, laced 3 cross
> DT Swiss Brass Nipples


Great choice. You won't be sorry.



> Now I just need to figure out which 9-speed cassette to toss on them & maybe get a new chain.


I just ordered two 9-spd Ultegra cassettes from Chain Reaction Cycles in the UK (Northern Ireland actually) and with the UK pound being very low (compared to the dollar) their prices are incredible. You can change their price calculator to your own currency. Top right.

I'm going to combine two cassettes to form one (more perfect) custom one. I should have gone 10spd with my most recent bike!!

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Default.aspx


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## Peanya (Jun 12, 2008)

NUTT said:


> Galleria area. I ride the Memorial Park loop for an hour or 2 a half dozen nights a month.


I know a few who ride that area, but I've never done it. Since I live in Alvin, I've got a nice 29 mile loop that starts out at hwy6 & 35, down to 1764, to 2004, back to why 6, then back. Excellent workout, because once you hit the high winds of Hitchcock, it's like riding up a steep hill!


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## NUTT (Apr 15, 2008)

The wheels were delivered quickly; I had them within a week of ordering them!

I wrapped them with some of the Forte (Velox made?) 17mm rim tape from Performance (closest bike shop to me) & then swapped the tubes, tires & cassette off of my old wheelset onto them last weekend.

I had my first ride on them last night and all I have to say is...... WOW! What a difference!

I'm coming from an 8 year old set of CXP22's / Cannondale factory wheels. The new wheelset rolls much smoother & quieter than the old. The difference in feel is great.

The biggest improvement is in comfort. My old wheels sent shocks through the entire bike when I hit a small bump in the pavement. The new wheelset has eliminated much of this. 

Needless to say, I'm very happy with my purchase!


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## brewster (Jun 15, 2004)

Good to hear you made the right choice. I've had both CXP-33 and Open Pro. The biggest difference that hasn't been mentioned, The OPs could develop the infamous, incurable "click" on each revolution. Your CXP-33s will not. That's enough reason to sway a decision.

brewster


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## mmbuckwa (Dec 27, 2008)

In regards to the open pro vs. cxp 33, does the rim or spoke number determine the strength of the wheel? I have a 32 spoke open pro rear wheel that goes out of true on a regular basis. Should I look into a 36 spoke build or 32 with the cxp 33? I am 6' 2" 185 lb and am looking for a training/racing wheel that will take the abuse. Thanks.


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## Bocephus Jones II (Oct 7, 2004)

mmbuckwa said:


> In regards to the open pro vs. cxp 33, does the rim or spoke number determine the strength of the wheel? I have a 32 spoke open pro rear wheel that goes out of true on a regular basis. Should I look into a 36 spoke build or 32 with the cxp 33? I am 6' 2" 185 lb and am looking for a training/racing wheel that will take the abuse. Thanks.


Look for a better builder.


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## mmbuckwa (Dec 27, 2008)

If I took the wheel to a reputable bike shop and had all the spokes retensioned, would that likely cure the problem of it goin out of true?


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## Mike T. (Feb 3, 2004)

mmbuckwa said:


> If I took the wheel to a reputable bike shop and had all the spokes retensioned, would that likely cure the problem of it goin out of true?


I've got three sets of OP wheels on the go and none of them ever go out of true - and I'm 15lbs heavier than you (but I'm working on that). You're not a candidate for 36 spoke wheels. If you were 100lbs heavier you might be.

If you're not breaking spokes then probably the wheel doesn't need rebuilding but a new re-tension (from ground zero) would be ideal. Read my web page on that and you'll know what's needed for a properly tensioned, equalized and stress-relieved wheel. Get it all right and you'll never have to touch that wheel again. Of course when you read what it takes, you (hopefully) might decide to do it yourself.


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## cyclust (Sep 8, 2004)

While the 33's may be a bit heavier than the opens, I'd rather have a 28 spoke 33 than a 32 spoke open. I"m a big guy [275lbs] and I had a 36 spoke open rear rim develop cracks after about 2K last year. All good roads, easy riding. Now I stick to aero rims, as they are stiffer and stronger.


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