# Veloflex Corsa, Vittoria Diamante Pro, GP4000s



## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

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## locustfist (Feb 21, 2009)

Tubular or Clincher?

From what I know I wouldn't classify any of those three as high mileage tires...they are mid level performance tire....great tires to be sure. I would call those three...racing tires that are an OK value for training.

It sounds like you want something more in the vane of a training tire (high mileage, puncture resistance)

Vittoria has the Zaffiro (which I have been using lately) and Conti has the Gator Skins which a lot of riders have good things to say about.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

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## locustfist (Feb 21, 2009)

kmarriner said:


> I have looked at the gatorskins and rubino pros, and probably should have included them in my question, but I have heard that gatorskins ride like bricks from a few people.


I haven't riden the Gator Skins but I imagine they ride pretty stiff as they sound like one of the most stout tires available. I'd check out the Rubino for sure, that might be in your wheelhouse


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

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## jpdigital (Dec 1, 2006)

I've ridden Veloflex Masters and Corsas, as well as Conti GP4000's. As far as feel, I can't figure out why, but the Veloflex Masters (natural sidewalls) have a more supple ride than the Corsa (black sidewall). I've reached what I consider the useful life of the Masters, It's right around 1000 miles for my set. I've sinced replaced them with another set of Masters, I like how they ride that much. I have yet to reach the end of my Corsas, but there's not many miles on them, anyway. As far as the Contis go, they'll last a lot longer than the Veloflex tires, and have a decent ride compared to the Veloflex tires, and _a lot more_ puncture protection.


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## kbwh (May 28, 2010)

Conti GP 4 Seasons seem to hold their promise of sturdiness without rolling too bad. I have been riding my 25 mm on asphalt and gravel for the last months with success.
I'm 73 kg.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

I would definitely rule out Veloflex Corsas, or any Veloflex, if I were you.

They are great tires but the biggest made is 22mm and that's just no good for a 205 pounder on bad roads.

You might want to throw Vittoria Paves into the mix if you want a fairly durable but high performance tire. Those are 24mm. They are fairly heavy by race tires standards but to me that doesn't seem to matter because they ride great.


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## bent steel (Dec 28, 2007)

I've ridden the Diamantes for a few years, am on GP4k's now and have a few friends that ride Paves in the winter.

I loved the Diamantes, I was probably between 190 and 200 when I rode 23s and they were very smooth, but had great grip. I rotated front to back and usually got about 1500 miles, but got a little over 2000 on one set before I could see air. However, I sold a set of wheels with a used set of Diamantes to a friend, who's probably 160, and he promptly destroyed them with ham fisted braking.

I am now a little lighter, 180-185, but riding GP4k's in 25c and love the overall comfort of the bigger tire, but dislike the slightly stiffer ride. However, I have about 1k miles on this set and they barely show signs of wear. The rear Vittoria tire would square off in a few hundred miles, and the Conti at over a thousand is still nice and round.

If you need a little more flat protection, the 4k is better than the Diamante, and the GP 4 Season and the Pave are a little better than those. I strongly recommend trying 25s at your weight, and prefer a true 25 to the Pave 24 or the Veloflex 22.


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## pmf (Feb 23, 2004)

I like the Michelin Pro Race 3 and the Conti GP4000. I think you'll be lucky to get 2000 miles out of any light racing type tire. Frankly, I've never noticed much difference in tires. Go to one of those UK websites (e.g., Ribble.com). They have tires for half what you pay here; the shipping is reasonable and they deliver pretty quick.


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## cdhbrad (Feb 18, 2003)

A friend of mine is about the same size, or a little bigger than, the OP and he recently put the Veloflex Corsa clinchers on a new set of handbuilts he purchased. While he raves about the feel of the tires, he also complains about the numerous flats he's had since getting them. We ride on the same group rides and similar roads when riding solo and, by comparison, I haven't had any flats riding either Conti 4000s or Michelin Pro 3 clinchers. Could be luck on my part, but I think the tires have something to do with it. So I'd agree to steer away from the Veloflex for everyday riders. 

I use Conti Gatorskins on my training bike and I really don't notice any difference in the feel of those compared to a 4000s. I ride both tires on wheels built with the same rim and spoke combinations.


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## tiflow_21 (Nov 21, 2005)

Only have experience with the GP4000s in that list. While riding the set I've weighed between 175-200 and have had nothing but great luck. They feel great, have great traction, and seem to have great puncture resistance for a light tire. I considered going to gatorskins, but with such great luck on the GP4000s I recently picked up another pair. However, I haven't bothered to swap them out yet as I seem to have another 500+ miles of life left in the old 4000s. Their mileage is ~2k right now. I have a cross bike that mainly gets used on rough roads though, so my road tires don't take as much abuse as others may.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

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## Cinelli 82220 (Dec 2, 2010)

Hank Stamper said:


> I would definitely rule out Veloflex Corsas, or any Veloflex, if I were you.
> 
> They are great tires but the biggest made is 22mm and that's just no good for a 205 pounder on bad roads.


I'm around 190 and definitely found them fragile and short-lived. Great ride though. It is too bad they don't make a bigger tire, even their Paris Roubaix is only about 24mm.


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## Hank Stamper (Sep 9, 2009)

kmarriner said:


> Thank you for the replies everyone, this is helping me a lot.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have any firsthand experience with the paves? I was looking at them and curious what sort of mileage they return.


yes I do. I'm not sure of the milage but I'd guess I get about 1700 out of the rear. Milage varies greatly from person to person and I think I wear tires faster than the average person. I know for sure I get more miles from paves than other 'performance' tires I've used. These are definitely not what I'd call a 'high milage tire' on an absolute basis but on the basis of comparing them to other high performance tires they wear pretty well.
I never get flats with them or had one cut so bad I couldn't use it like I have had happen with other performance tires.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

Hank Stamper said:


> yes I do. I'm not sure of the milage but I'd guess I get about 1700 out of the rear. Milage varies greatly from person to person and I think I wear tires faster than the average person. I know for sure I get more miles from paves than other 'performance' tires I've used. These are definitely not what I'd call a 'high milage tire' on an absolute basis but on the basis of comparing them to other high performance tires they wear pretty well.
> I never get flats with them or had one cut so bad I couldn't use it like I have had happen with other performance tires.


I will keep those in mind then.


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## dhtucker4 (Jul 7, 2004)

I use Veloflex Pave (all-black - the sidewall is thicker) but only on my front wheel - it seems like when mounted on the rear wheel, at least every three weeks a flat would occur. I can't stand GP 4000's - they're not that good on damp roads, and skittish as all get-out on wet roads. I have a couple of road rashes that scarred up because of those tires. Personally, the GP 4000 has a "U" shape, whereas other high-quality clincher tires have a "O" shape. Veloflex is the company that a bunch of ex-Vittoria Italian employees started up when Vittoria moved its factory to Thailand - Veloflex uses the molds that the Open Corsa and Corsa tread pattern. It's identical. But the Record (the lightest clincher tire made) has a tpi count of 350, and it only weighs 130 grams. 

I had good results with the Diamante Pro on both wheels - I got 2500 miles on my rear tire, and 3500 miles on my front tire, that's good enough for me - they handled great on wet and damp pavement, gravel, dirt, and grass.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

dhtucker4 said:


> I use Veloflex Pave (all-black - the sidewall is thicker) but only on my front wheel - it seems like when mounted on the rear wheel, at least every three weeks a flat would occur. I can't stand GP 4000's - they're not that good on damp roads, and skittish as all get-out on wet roads. I have a couple of road rashes that scarred up because of those tires. Personally, the GP 4000 has a "U" shape, whereas other high-quality clincher tires have a "O" shape. Veloflex is the company that a bunch of ex-Vittoria Italian employees started up when Vittoria moved its factory to Thailand - Veloflex uses the molds that the Open Corsa and Corsa tread pattern. It's identical. But the Record (the lightest clincher tire made) has a tpi count of 350, and it only weighs 130 grams.
> 
> I had good results with the Diamante Pro on both wheels - I got 2500 miles on my rear tire, and 3500 miles on my front tire, that's good enough for me - they handled great on wet and damp pavement, gravel, dirt, and grass.


As of now, I am between the Diamantes and Rubinos, the price difference is $18. I will try the others when I have the chance to, but right now I need to pick up something that'll give me some miles.


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## AndrwSwitch (May 28, 2009)

I rode a Vredestein Fortezza Tri Comp for a while. I don't keep particularly detailed records, but it didn't seem to have a great service life. It rolled and handled well, though.

I'm pretty content with GP4000s. They're reliable for me, and while I can skid them on wet roads if I grab a lot of brake, they're still better than what's on my commuter. You may be happiest with the larger 25mm size - it'll let you run a little lower pressure without pinch flatting the tires. There are wars about tire size of course. So, do a search and form your own opinion, or give them a shot.


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## keppler (May 25, 2007)

tiflow_21 said:


> Only have experience with the GP4000s in that list. While riding the set I've weighed between 175-200 and have had nothing but great luck. They feel great, have great traction, and seem to have great puncture resistance for a light tire. I considered going to gatorskins, but with such great luck on the GP4000s I recently picked up another pair. However, I haven't bothered to swap them out yet as I seem to have another 500+ miles of life left in the old 4000s. Their mileage is ~2k right now. I have a cross bike that mainly gets used on rough roads though, so my road tires don't take as much abuse as others may.


Same experience for me. I've run GP 4000's for a few seasons now. Comfortable to ride on, good in the rain (when it happens), and very tough. They do wear quickly as stated, and I rotate front to back when I feel it's time, but they've been very good tires for me.


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## mtnroadie (Jul 6, 2010)

Go for the Diamnate Pros. I ride them on two of my my bikes, they can handle anything gravel dirt roads etc... I wont ride anything else.

super supple, I have a yellow set and a black set the black feels nicer but then again its on a totaly different bike.


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## DG62 (Jan 18, 2009)

I currently ride Vredestein Fortezza Tri Comps and have about 1400 miles on the set. The rear does seem to be showing some wear, but so far so good. No flats. Seem to roll and grip fine. I think I should get 1600-2000 miles out of the rear. The front is good.

I have used GP4000, Vittorias and Michelins in the past. The GP's do last longer and roll and grip reasonably well. I have a set of them and Veloflex's in the batter's box. 

My typical training rides are not techincal, so hard cornering is not an issue. I must not be nuanced enough, but I can't notice a "significant" differance between any of them with the exception of the generally longer life of the GPs and generally more cuts, flats on the Vittorias and Michelins. I think I've raced on all of them as well, although I haven't lined up for a crit in a number of years.

For reference, I'm about 180 and have always ridden 23mm tires filled to 115-120psi.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

mtnroadie said:


> Go for the Diamnate Pros. I ride them on two of my my bikes, they can handle anything gravel dirt roads etc... I wont ride anything else.
> 
> super supple, I have a yellow set and a black set the black feels nicer but then again its on a totaly different bike.


I picked up a set of Rubino Pros last night, but the Diamantes are on my list to try for sure.




DG62 said:


> My typical training rides are not techincal, so hard cornering is not an issue. I must not be nuanced enough, but I can't notice a "significant" differance between any of them with the exception of the generally longer life of the GPs and generally more cuts, flats on the Vittorias and Michelins. I think I've raced on all of them as well, although I haven't lined up for a crit in a number of years.


I don't really ride uber hard, and I don't race (yet, starting next spring probably), But I am able to feel differences in tires, I believe that comes from both having track experience in cars (where being able to feel grip could mean life or death, or at the very least avoiding a lot of damage to your wallet, at some points); and also because I have a partially metal shoulder from a motorcycle accident, and some of the more insane roads can transmit a lot of feel right into that arm.


Once again, thank you everyone for the suggestions.


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## nhluhr (Sep 9, 2010)

kmarriner said:


> I am looking for a new set of tires for my bike, and I think I have it narrowed down to these three but I can't seem to find the information I am looking for; For the record, I have searched and have been searching for a week to find exactly what I am looking for.
> 
> Heres the background: I weigh 205 pounds, and I ride anywhere from 90-200 miles a week. I am looking for something that feels decent, feels stable in the corners, has a decent rolling resistance, and that will last about 2000 miles per set. The roads I ride range from rural to cityish, decent to absolute crap.
> I am going to be riding the MS100 from Philly to OCNJ in september, a short weekend ride down to Assateague Island in October, and hopefully doing Bike and Build next summer.
> ...


At your mileage, you get new tires every 3 months. Shouldn't be that big of a decision. Cheap and durable should be your choice.


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## kmarriner (Aug 16, 2011)

nhluhr said:


> At your mileage, you get new tires every 3 months. Shouldn't be that big of a decision. Cheap and durable should be your choice.


Very true, I am just one to do a lot of research on everything I buy.


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## gun2head (Sep 3, 2006)

My experience is the same as digital above. I'm 180 lb rider. I've gotten more miles out of the Conti's which do provide a very good riide to value. However, for me the veloflex rides better, but do not last as long. I do get more miles than 1000 though as I rotate front to rear. And since the tire plays an important part in preventing me from hitting the deck, i choose the better gripping tire eventhough it won't last as long.


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## jpdigital (Dec 1, 2006)

*Rubino & Fortezza*



kmarriner said:


> Thats exactly the type of info I was hoping to get, not exactly what I wanted to hear. But helpful nonetheless.
> Have you happened to have tried Rubino pros?
> 
> 
> ...



When I first started to seriously get into road biking, I got a set of Fortezzas on sale at Performance Bike (at the time I think it was still called Supergo). In hindsight the ride was rather wooden, the compound was noticably hard. Probably having the air pressure up way too high didn't help, but I distinctly remember the rubber being quite hard.

More recently I've tried Rubino pros. They rode okay, I suppose they could've been a bit more supple. But again, nothing compared to the Veloflex tires I run now.


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## tacoracer (Sep 6, 2009)

I have the Robino Pros on my training wheels and the Veloflex on my back up racing wheels. Initially I was leery of the Robino's since I flatted twice in less then a month but since then got well over 3000 miles out of a set. They are a good training tire. The Veloflex are very sticky and handle awesome but have flatted once in about 2000 miles on them and have cut another tire. I would not used them as a pure training tire but rather a special event/racing tire. I am 180 lbs for what it is worth. Have not used the Conti's so can't comment.


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## EvilGilligan (May 16, 2004)

jpdigital said:


> I've ridden Veloflex Masters and Corsas, as well as Conti GP4000's. As far as feel, I can't figure out why, but the Veloflex Masters (natural sidewalls) have a more supple ride than the Corsa (black sidewall). I've reached what I consider the useful life of the Masters, It's right around 1000 miles for my set. I've sinced replaced them with another set of Masters, I like how they ride that much. I have yet to reach the end of my Corsas, but there's not many miles on them, anyway. As far as the Contis go, they'll last a lot longer than the Veloflex tires, and have a decent ride compared to the Veloflex tires, and _a lot more_ puncture protection.



x2 on this one ... but I have taken my Masters to almost 2k mi until I got a slash from glass. Really wish VeloFlex made the Masters in 25 ... that'd be awesome!


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## fazzman (Mar 12, 2008)

I have been riding veloflex pave (master22) tires for some time now. Wont ride anything else. They ride so smooth and corner great. Just watch where you ride, dont ride in the shoulder where all the garbage collects. I flat no more on these as a did with anyother tire i have used. Always use a aircomp latex tube in them with plent of talc. I got close to 2k out of my last set. Got a good size cut in one. They still had some life left in them. Im 170 lbs+- run them at 110psi.


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