# My new Concorde project bike...



## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

I mentioned in a previous Concorde thread that I had been looking at a Concorde that was EL-OS.

I left it for a while, and then Santa (well actually teh wife) encouraged me to buy it. The CL seller was willing to bring it almost to my door, so it was pretty painless.

Oddly though, it has a fairly traditional looking front fork, not the flatter blade/unicrown style I have seen on the few other Concorde pictures I have found. The rear dropouts are also not what I expected--they are an almost vertical style (but still with adjusters) and I can make out '?_ _ tech' on them

Fillet brazed too.

I'll be building it up with parts from the parts bin--Campy 10, bars TBD--and probably black and red Splash (you either love or hate it!).

I does have a small set of dents & a crease on the TT--possibly from a crash, so I may try to see if I can roll those out some day, but for now Imma gonna ride it.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

Probably answered my own question--"Ultech" is the likely name for the dropouts.

Here's a similar model(but with an EL fork...) and lugs instead of fillet brazing.

The Catalogue page for 1993 is from Retrobike. The catalog lists an EL 35 that is fillet brazed that takes a larger seatpost (I believe this larger seat tube was optional for the EL-OS tube set), but mine definitely takes a 27.2 seatpost. The Columbus decal on mine is marked Concorde and EL with 'over sized" written out, and it looks to be original to the bike.


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## Dave Hickey (Jan 27, 2002)

Very cool.......Looking forward to see this one built


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

I may be mistaken here, but weren't Concordes made by Ciocc for the Dutch (Northern European) market?

Regardless, very nice. Guarantee it's going to be a very nice ride. Keep us posted on the build.


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## zmudshark (Jan 28, 2007)

Pretty sure the OP's, at least, is a Billato built bike. The Italian colors by the rear brake cable guide is a dead give away.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

The question about who built these is fraught--I have read that they switched from Ciocc to Bilato because of price so early Concordes were built by Ciocc and later ones by Billato, that Ciocc themselves were subcontracting to Billato who were making bikes for both companies etc. 

I think it would be hard to get to the bottom of it without access to the Concorde records.

I found this thread on the origin of the company:


> Towards the end of the 80s there was a move by three of the largest wholesalers in the Benelux and France to form a company with the aim of killing off the opposition. the triumvirate was Veltec of Belguim, Weltmeister of Holland, and Jose Alvarez, the Naploeon of the French lightweight industry from Auch near the Pyrenees. The first two went ahead with the venture and formed CONCORDE, while Alvarez declared himself bigger than the other two.. and went on his own very successful way.
> At the start of the 90s, I can't be exact the new alliance backed Sean Kelly with Concorde frames for the PDM team.These frames were sprayed by Van Tperzeele at Geraardsbergen near Ghent (the Flemish name) or Grammont (in Walloon) some 1km from the foot of the famous Mur de Grammont of Belgian Classics fame.


The same writer thought that Billato may have started making frames for Concorde in the late '80s when Ciocc was reorganizing. Another writer on the same thread says:


> Some were built by Nick Kostriken (and some painted by your's truly). I'm not sure which models/years. Early 90's?


--which seems to suggest a small builder in the Benelux built some of them.

As far as the Italian flag panel--I'll see if I can find the pictures I was looking at yesterday--it was a similar vintage Ciocc with virtually the identical paint and Italian flag panel, which would support the 'common origin' for both, although leave us none the wiser as to who the builder was.

Either way, it appears to be well made, although not in quite as good shape as I first thought--it looks as though the black panels were oversprayed at some point--which is why I was looking for pictures of a similar paint scheme (which I did not find).


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

For grins, here are a couple of pictures of a later Concorde Max frame, also fillet brazed according to the catalog posted above.

The second shot shows the "modern" flat crowned fork that appears to be on most of the new high-end Concordes.

The last picture is of the fork from mine--a more traditional looking fork--those tubes on mine look anemic compared to the Max--what would the outside diameters of EL-OS measure out at?


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## MShaw (Jun 7, 2003)

Hey, can y'all Concorde fans keep an eye out for a 54cm SLX for me? PDM replica is preferred. Sold mine in a fit of needing rent $$ and miss it.

M


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## FatTireFred (Jan 31, 2005)

zmudshark said:


> Pretty sure the OP's, at least, is a Billato built bike. The Italian colors by the rear brake cable guide is a dead give away.




old cioccs, battaglins, and prob others have the little flag as well


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Never can resist the urge to post a pic of my Concorde!


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

Model name and tubing please? Very nice BTW. 

(I'm wondering if the black was sprayed over accident damage on mine and it was originally all one color?--If I restore yours will be the precedent.

Cheers,
Dean


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## MerlinDS (May 21, 2004)

paredown said:


> For grins, here are a couple of pictures of a later Concorde Max frame, also fillet brazed according to the catalog posted above.
> 
> The second shot shows the "modern" flat crowned fork that appears to be on most of the new high-end Concordes.
> 
> The last picture is of the fork from mine--a more traditional looking fork--those tubes on mine look anemic compared to the Max--what would the outside diameters of EL-OS measure out at?


What do you put on to shine up that crome?


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

paredown said:


> Model name and tubing please? Very nice BTW.
> 
> (I'm wondering if the black was sprayed over accident damage on mine and it was originally all one color?--If I restore yours will be the precedent.
> 
> ...


Dean, you talking about mine?


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

frpax said:


> Dean, you talking about mine?


Sorry, yes--asking about yours since I am squinting at my laptop screen through dirty glasses...

(I was also musing about mine--sorry for the confusion...)


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Early/mid-'80s Concorde Gavina. Columbus SL tubing. VERY nice riding machine. 
All done up w/ SRAM Rival 10 spd. (when Rival was made in the silver finish) with Mavic Aksium wheels. I like the silver rims & components, because it makes it look more vintage-ish.


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## Unica (Sep 24, 2004)

I've got a lugged Max Concorde with the flag on it - I don't think I've ever seen one without it, apart from the re-badged TVT frames. Happy to be proved wrong!


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## Raleigh Reliant (Jan 8, 2012)

nice bike


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Raleigh Reliant said:


> nice bike


Thanks! I really like it. One of the nicest bikes I've ever owned.


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## nayr497 (Nov 8, 2008)

Wow, that purple & white one is awesome! Love that color scheme.

And, some other pretty slick bikes in here!


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## Richard (Feb 17, 2006)

frpax said:


> Early/mid-'80s Concorde Gavina. Columbus SL tubing. VERY nice riding machine.
> All done up w/ SRAM Rival 10 spd. (when Rival was made in the silver finish) with Mavic Aksium wheels. I like the silver rims & components, because it makes it look more vintage-ish.


Very nice. Skinny tubed steel bikes (lugged or fillet brazed) need shiny silver components. Black is fine on plastic wonder bikes (I have one) but it's shiny Campy on my lugged steel. It's too bad Sram discontinued the polished group.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Richard said:


> Very nice. Skinny tubed steel bikes (lugged or fillet brazed) need shiny silver components. Black is fine on plastic wonder bikes (I have one) but it's shiny Campy on my lugged steel. *It's too bad Sram discontinued the polished group.*


I quite agree!


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

Saw this one on ebay this morning

Squadra TSX--and it does have the older style fork like mine does.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

If I'm not mistaken, the Squadra was the top of the line.


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## quikrick1 (Sep 28, 2011)

*Very nice!!*

paredown, That's a very nice base for another project. Have fun! I'm sure that I don't have to remind you to post pics when you get done.


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## bikerjulio (Jan 19, 2010)

I'm looking at this










no info other than seller says Aelle tubing (?)

opinions?


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## zmudshark (Jan 28, 2007)

Aelle is mid range tubing, NTTAWWT.

Frpax, still waiting for the promised 12 pack of IPA for giving away the best bice you ever had 

TMB is coming to town in 2 weeks.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

*Rough Build*

Finally squeezed out some time on the rainy weekend to put the rest of this together. I had been messing around with different bars and stems--I ended up getting a new Motus off FleaBay(same as on my Simonetti) and using some Deda 215 Anatomics I had laying around--would have liked a polished stem but couldn't argue with the price for the smoked/gray.

Powershift Veloces are the only other new pieces--pretty much everything else was in my parts closet.

Tape TBD--but I have some black and red splash that I think will look awesome!

(Will add pictures when the servers are cooperating.)


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## davcruz (Oct 9, 2007)

Looks great Paredown! Hard to see the dents you referred to on the top tube. Have you ridden it yet?

I just got this PDM replica off eBay. Any idea what company would have made this one? I plan on a Campag Veloce/Centuar build for this frame but having a hard time deciding on wheels (tight budget) and cockpit (go with a quill or use an adapter).

I have a set of Ultegra 6500 hubs on Open Pro CD's with nice Wheelsmith spokes. Can I buy a Campag body for the rear hub? I don't really want to run a Shift mate.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

davcruz said:


> Looks great Paredown! Hard to see the dents you referred to on the top tube. Have you ridden it yet?
> 
> I just got this PDM replica off eBay. Any idea what company would have made this one? I plan on a Campag Veloce/Centuar build for this frame but having a hard time deciding on wheels (tight budget) and cockpit (go with a quill or use an adapter).
> 
> I have a set of Ultegra 6500 hubs on Open Pro CD's with nice Wheelsmith spokes. Can I buy a Campag body for the rear hub? I don't really want to run a Shift mate.


I've only had it up and down the street a few times--still have to sort the gear adjustment a little, and the fit--I tried to get it as close to my other bike, but it feels a little tight so I'll probably move the saddle back a smidge, and the bars down a little as well. 

It does feel fantastic--I'm amazed at the road feel--very connected, but not buzzy or harsh.

(The dents are are hard to see--they are really more like ripples and I mused above in this thread that some of the black paint may have been applied to disguise them...)

The makers of these frames is a matter of dispute--at least three firms get mentioned--Torpado, Billato and Ciocc. The explanation I'm leaning towards is that Ciocc subcontracted to Billato, which explains the family resemblance on the frames--Billato built for Ciocc as well as Concorde. (Early ones may have been Torpado.) But Billato built good bikes--they did the Lemond Team Z era Lemonds among others.

I'm old school, so I like quill stems, but I also like the new versions that have the two bolts so you can set the bars easy. This 3T Motus is one. The eBay seller was velo-motion-lindau (Switzerland) and he had a few over the past few weeks and they were selling for $35-40--a lot less than the BIN ones. Shipping was only a week.

Campy on Shimano--two companies made adapter cassettes American Classics and Wheels Manufacturing, with the consensus in this thread that the latter was a better bet. Something I've never done, so I would read a little and post in Components if you have questions.

BTW, the levers are slightly older (2009-2010?) UltraShift Veloces from Total Cycling--the market for the older Centaur seems to have dried up, and most of what is out there is the QuickShift iteration (2007-8 I think) that many folks hate, although I have not owned any. Velomine on eBay also seems to have some of the Ultrashifts...

Post pictures when you are up and running. I'll post a ride report hopefully later today!


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## davcruz (Oct 9, 2007)

Thanks for the info on the cassettes. I just looked up the Wheels Manufacturing version and it is.....$160 bucks!!! Daayuuuuum! Might as well just buy a set of Campag hubs and lace them to Open Pro's.

I see in that thread that the mention of using a Shimano cassette with a Campag setup does work, anyone here have experience as such. Maybe I should just buy a Shift Mate. I really like my Ultegra/Open Pro combo wheels and they really have the right look for this build.


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## High Gear (Mar 9, 2002)

paredown said:


> Finally squeezed out some time on the rainy weekend to put the rest of this together. I had been messing around with different bars and stems--I ended up getting a new Motus off FleaBay(same as on my Simonetti) and using some Deda 215 Anatomics I had laying around--would have liked a polished stem but couldn't argue with the price for the smoked/gray.
> 
> Powershift Veloces are the only other new pieces--pretty much everything else was in my parts closet.
> 
> ...


Supernice frame. Just what I like, chrome and EL tubing. Let us know how she rides. One thing, be careful of that stem. I had two Motus stems crack on me at the bolt holes years ago.


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## Unica (Sep 24, 2004)

paredown said:


> I'm old school, so I like quill stems, but I also like the new versions that have the two bolts so you can set the bars easy. This 3T Motus is one.


Be careful with the Motus stem. I had one that cracked around both the bolt holes on the faceplate, even when torque'd to the correct specs. From a little research it seemed this was quite common with them.

I'm not saying this will happen to yours, just a word of caution 

It's a shame as they are great looking and it was useful being able to just remove the faceplate to do anything with the bars. I'm using Record 84 and Status stems now.


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## frpax (Feb 13, 2010)

Looks great, Paredown!

Just need a 2nd bottle cage!


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## zmudshark (Jan 28, 2007)

I'm running a Wheels MFG conversion cassette with no issues at all.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

frpax said:


> Looks great, Paredown!
> 
> Just need a 2nd bottle cage!


Thanks frpax. Cages I got--I have so many I think they multiply in the parts bin.

I was trying out the single look--and thinking about a vertical pump (old skool) since it does not have a peg on the TT.

Think I'll do a waterbottle mount instead, and put the second cage on.


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## paredown (Oct 18, 2006)

*Ride Report*

This bike is a delight (helped by the fact I have my best wheels on it). Not as stiff as the Tecnos was, but it feels pretty lively.

Great road feel--I swear I can feel individual bits of gravel through the front end (partly because I have yet to put the tape on), but also surprisingly well-dampened. Does not feel buzzy.

It's a keeper. 

Little fine tuning in the cockpit before I put on the tape.


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